20 Episode results for "David Brian"

The Rack Extra: Total Bellas Season 4 Episode 8

The Rack Radio Show

15:28 min | 2 years ago

The Rack Extra: Total Bellas Season 4 Episode 8

"The. And welcome to the wreck extra views right here on wall, talk radio dot com. He's rock. I'm Lindsay, and we are back with episode eight of total Bellas and this. This was this was not the most exciting episode. I have to say just read out of the gate. No. It was not. This was again. This was I feel like another filler episode. This is on the road to ever Lucien. And we're seeing really the final say the final count to it. Merthyr choices were made to the citizens were brought up and we learned different things about different people. We learn things about Nikki, Bella how she's a perfectionist throughout this episode. She showed off her perfectionist side. Whether it was the axe throwing where she took the final lesson before throwing act. So she could be the first one hit the Bower haven't stick. And then her training and everything that she had to have everything. Perfect. And then. What we've always known Brie Bella and hurt in the slice of nece, which you would think because she's all or you wouldn't think as she's always. So sure of herself if she wouldn't be as indecisiveness, she wasn't this ups owed though, but you see throughout the numbering all offense, and they talked about, you know, the all the different homes. They lived in the have a home in Washington where they've lived two months total. They've have in Phoenix with they got rid of they running in San Diego. And now they want to leave San Diego 'cause that reasons. Well, they pointed out that, you know, they only moved back to San Diego to be with Nikki right that Nikki broke up with the X and she needed a place to sort of heal and rejuvenator self and that was San Diego, so free and Brian birdie all packed up the car, and they through the dogs in with them. And they drove up Arizona having sold their house to move in essentially with Nikki like this house. They rented. Did was designed so Nikki could live with them. I mean that that was the whole intent. And this is they bring it up again. This is not the first time the brim Bryan have dropped everything for Nikki. She to go live with her. Yeah. The original premise of the show was the Brian embrago to live with Seila, Nikki that was the regional thing the show, and they bring up how breeze like I'm so happy. We didn't buy that house in Florida. I had to laugh at that. It's horrible to laugh at it. But I had to laugh at it. Because it's true. It's true. One thing of note on the build up to Evelyn one person who was very influential for them was Paul Heyman poly in the house. That was cool. That was very cool of cool. We had sushi sushi making class 'cause reasons and again Nikki's perfectionism came out she to have the perfect sushi roll. And this where we learned the the thing about Brian in this episode. He's a bit of a slow driver. He's slow is a so try raise a slow talker. Slow slow thinker everything he does is slow all we know is slow at something else to cookies or not his. Thank you, total bills for teaching that about any Brian. Yes. The man likes his foreplay. What can I say? There's nothing wrong with that more men should like foreplay anyway. Yes. So you we have a cute moment between bream Brian where they're like going back and forth and Brian's purposely drying, very slow. He's moving very slow and breach. Like God, David Brian. You're gonna get us it, and he's like what me. No, no, never. And she just like get out of the car. I'm driving. And that he she asked him for for her purse, and he's like hold on here here. Here took forever to give it to her. Then on the opposite end, they go go karting later in Rhode and he's the fastest. And she spite of spy, and she was the slowest and JJ thought it was goat carting. Yeah. Not go. Karting? Goat curbing. It's like, okay. All right. But they were all pissed at Nikki at that point because Nikki had decided, well, I'm gonna go double train forever Lucien. They let the boys going. Shame. Shame. Shame. Which was funny. It's funny. But I mean, it's like I can see see here's the thing. I can see both sides of it because Nikki this is very important to her. This matter is being in the main event, and she's taking it very very very seriously. She's training incredibly hard to be ready for it. And she wants to be ready for it. So it's too. I can see that side of it her doing extra work outs. And sacrificing time with her family doing all that. That's I can respect that on a lot of levels. But at the same time at some point. Point you have to take breather. You have to stop for just a second and go, you know, what? Hey, I'm gonna go. Go karting with my family, or I'm gonna go do this or I'm just gonna chill or I'm gonna take a moment to myself, and relax and sort of get you know, let my batteries recharged. Because part of what happens is when you push yourself that hard. If you don't take that breather. We kinda see what happens later in the episode which is Mickey sitting there, and she's physically mentally just exhausted from all the work that she's put in all the work all the work. So it's you do have to take those moments of, you know. Yeah, I need to go train. But you know, what? Maybe I just take a breather. Maybe I don't go for that. Second trading section, and I just you know, meditate or do yoga or do something else to recharge my body. Recharge my brain just rest, and relax, and and do what I need to do to take care of myself because what's the point of doing all that work and doing the thing if you can't enjoy it? Other things that happen on the show. We learned that at super showdown free were her gear backwards looked weird. And then she wore two different way on TV. The moms like you wearing your your your boat on your front. She's like, no, no. I'm actually wearing it. Right. This time while they do things backwards in Australia, even wearing gear. So that seeks some we're sticking to it. Yeah. All right. But one of the big themes was of the show was there was talk of their storyline on rawal continuing past I've Aleutian to survivors, and maybe beyond because the crowds eating it up. And they're doing it. We got the whole he'll bell thing. We got the bedroom joke and everything like that. They cut the word seem out of it, by the way. Yeah. Yeah. Those were clear. Yeah. Oh, but they left John in there. But you had to. Yeah. Do because otherwise it doesn't make sense. But yeah, they some very clever editing there, but it was breeze really indecisive about what she wants to do whether she wants to even continue. And that was the theme. The show she the trying to figure out whether she wants to continue and where they have to live Brian. He was dealing with an internal struggle because she's never she mentioned. She never they never had a home that was a home when she was growing up. They were always going place to place to place to place. They were never found it, but she never felt settled. And that's what she has right now. She doesn't feel settled with the home she has chosen because she's never had it and Brian the opposite. And you really got a good insight into how things are with them. You see what different worlds they really do. Come from incense, it Brian grip in a very stable sorta family environment that his mom always made sure that they lived in the same house. They were supported their loved him saying that Brian Nikki's mom didn't. But their mom, you know, because you know, because of what she was doing in her life. They were moving around a lot. So they didn't live in anyone place, particularly long. So they weren't able to settle down roots? That's why breeze. Capable really doing what she's doing for Nikki and just picking up moving at a moment's notice. Because that's what she's done her whole life. She's used to it. Brian hasn't done that. So for him. It's a little bit more of a struggle in with them having birdie he wants to settle down and have roots. So that way birdie has roots. And she has that family house as she grew up in and she's known all her life, and he wants to give that to his daughter. And I think ultimately breed us as well. I think she's just struggling with letting go of other things, including a wrestling career recyc- all we've heard about his his comeback in how it's been a failure for her. And she's just really struggled with it emotionally and physically because it wasn't as easy to has been in the past. She just she hasn't been able to just come back and everything snaps into place in it's perfect. She struggled and with that has brought a certain clarity in terms of. Well, what do I really wanna get out of this? Am I getting what I want? And should I really go on because we find out that, you know, they've been told hey, you want to carry this well past I've Lucian we wanna go saviour series. With this. We wanna do this. We want to do that and breeze just like. Right. Maybe. And so ultimately, she Umbrians down, and they have a talk about what they want, and you know, 'cause they're talking about buying houses. And if they wanna buy house in San Diego, they wanna buy a house in Arizona, and he's like, essentially, you have to figure out you you have to figure out what you want in this issue that you're having this identity crisis, which is what she's really having is coming from way deeper than just buying a house or your wrestling career or this or that or something inside of you that you're internally struggling with and you have to get right with that before you can move on ROY. And the ended up later in the episode. They will house up in Phoenix because that's where her brother lives, and Vivian and birdie along and they want that to be a bond, and that's where they're going. They're gonna move the Phoenix back the Phoenix's they were there in sold their house. And so that was one of their decisions that made in the cities they're going to stain the go, which is good Phoenix. They're going to go go to. The felix. Yeah. Because Brian brought up the point we bought that house in Washington or we built that house in Washington. We've may be spent three months in it were never for. We're never there. We rented this house. Now, you're talking about breaking the lease at this house and moving to another place and buying a place here. He's like, you know, we just we really need to straighten out our priorities and we needed relief figure this out. And that's what the Embry makes the other decision of you know, what I'm done with wrestling. She caught caught me off guard that caught Nikki usually off guard because breeze like, you know, what this comeback wasn't what I wanted and this come in. It's very clear to me now that I need to focus on other things. I want to do other things and wrestling is not gonna lower me to do that. She's decided she's ready to have baby number two Brian you'll because the deal was that they would post-poned having the baby for her to do the comeback for her to go to Evelyn. And then once she was done with Volusia. She was done, and she was gonna come home, and they were gonna. Bang bang, bang bang on I long, so that's kind of where they're at at this point that breeze consciously making that choice. Okay. No. I'm not gonna continue on even though I have the opportunity even though they want me. I wanna go home and be a wife, and the mother and do all the things that matter to me at this point in my life, which is not wrestling anymore. And so she she and Brian announce she's they're going to have baby number two. Breeze retiring, and they're moving back to Aaron Jona which Nikki's lay Debbie f- when she doesn't even know how to take it. And she makes the comment of why thought when we were gonna talk about retirement, we were going to talk about retirement together, and that may very well been, but they left ones another back Nikki's now finally her success again. But she's finding it on her own even breeze there, it's Nikki Bella, she if Nikki trying to find herself again because she doesn't want to be known as John's ex she wants, Nikki, Bella again and her us. This comeback is probably way for her to get the spotlight back for herself rather than being with John. Yeah. I mean, that's a huge part of it is she lost her identity. She lost who she was. She said that several times a season in the fact that she was trying to become MRs Johnson ah. What did we hear for years? What did we preach at for years? God damn John portering on it. God damnit, John Mary her, you know, she wants to be MRs Johnson ah. She wants to do do this. She wants to do that. But ultimately, it's I want to be MRs Johnson, and that some point in the five six years seven years. Our lonely were together her priorities shifted and her priorities shifted from being MRs Johnson ah to being Nikki Bella to being successful for her wanting to be asked successful for him. I think we actually did see that happen on total divas as I recall, but her priorities change, and she she changes herself. She's like, you know, what being away. In a mother while it's cool, and I do want it it almost I don't wanna say because this is the wrong way to say it. But it wasn't good enough for her. She wanted at all she wants to be the career woman. She wants to be all tra- successful. She wants the big house fancy car. Beautiful. Handsome, husband, beautiful children. She wants everything. And she she feels she deserves it. And I said go get it. You won't go get it. And so when she I think part of it was was been she realized she was forever going to be John shadow. No matter what she did in that marriage. What she brought to the table. She would always be MRs Johnson a- was like, Nope. I can't do that anymore. Niece years ago. Yeah. Totally onboard for that me now. No being MRs somebody's not enough for me. I want to be myself. I wanna undermine name not yours. And that's where she's at. And so it's it's not even the Bella twins anymore. She doesn't want it to be about the bell. Twins. It's Nikki Bella with breathe Ella or is just Nikki Bella. And that's where she's at in her career in her life and so- Bree making the decision to leave. It's like a wait a minute hold on a second. We didn't talk about this. We didn't discuss this. And I think it's all to what impact is have on me because it's the come as a set. They always come as a set so is WWE going to want Nikki Bella without free. So that was that's how episode went. That's how this up sewed went. And we got a teaser. So I think Nikki's going to try to stop break from retiring, but we'll have to see, but you got such plugs applicable news rack rougeau on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram Twitter, Facebook dot com as well. Tough radio network fell subscribed to use us to meet your credit code four night on most social media's Atlanta born Elliot's diversity so for I'm Lindsay ward. You've been listening the wreck extra views, total Bellas addition right here, multi radio dot com, and we will be back next week with episode nine till then.

Brian Nikki David Brian Nikki Bella San Diego Phoenix MRs Johnson Brie Bella axe throwing Lindsay ward Washington Arizona John Lucien Merthyr Bower Karting Brian embrago JJ Rhode
379. News: Is Goldman Sachs going mass market?

FinTech Insider

1:03:45 hr | 1 year ago

379. News: Is Goldman Sachs going mass market?

"From eleven of us. I'm Simon Taylor and this fintech inside news. Today we bring you plot to European expansion WESTPAC chief quits amid money laundering scandal. And and I'LL BE S.'s. Bo into the market. All this much in today's show before we start Teela FINTECH attack. Yeah we know you do you. Listen to the FANTASIA Are you struggling to keep up to date with everything that's going on well. Yeah you're listening to the show so you must be interested right. Great News we L. Relaunching the eleven of US newsletter people. We want to give you the financial services community and disruptors and curious as a snack sized roundup of the biggest stories stories that week every Friday. You receive a summary In our own eleven style along with interesting blogs and so much more straight to your inbox so if you're a newsletter junkie I'm Ki. Please please do hit us up today. eleven dot com forward slash newsletter. Already let's get on with today's show. Welcome to episode three thirty seven nine of fintech insider today joined by my colleague and co-host Mr David Brian. How you doing today? David Sipowicz the weekends evaporated. I'm not really sure where it's Suddenly Thursday afternoon. It's it's a very sort of yes. Evaporate he kind of just about over jetlag from las week like we definitely need to like scholten. The New York trips just like three days. I'm just GONNA keep dying. We don't want that we wouldn't keep living no deaths that would be inundated as always we're not alone. We're joined by some incredible guests making their fintech incited sighted news debuted sued debuted debuts debuted run Burgundy We have Ali. You Bet who's Co founder and CEO at open works How you doing great? Thanks for having me my first time gentle. We'll try we can put thanks so much And regulars on blockchain insider which is available on itunes or your favorite podcast now but making that fintech inside a debut it's We have among Kelly whose chief chief technology officer for banking and capital markets. Dixie how you doing. I'm good. Thanks for having me on. No no thanks for thanks for joining and getting both and of course is about Woodford. WHO's a fintech picked journalist at Sifted Hayden as well thank you? Thank you for joining us. All right let's get started The first story this was about plot expanding further across the European that rolling at services in Ireland France and Spain after launching in the UK The company will allow third parties to integrate with account data from Sunday Banca Violent BNP powerball firebaugh among others and since coming to the U. K.. Plots worked with Fintech such as Cleo unbundled it also claims to serve several challenge banks hasn't disclosed names The the company secured Unicorn stages back in December with investors volume the firm. I'm older two point. Six billion so before the panel. Get into this one which is going to Go to a customer way. We spoke to Keith Gross. WHO's head of UK plot to tell US Mall? So let's hear from him now. They applaud our mission is to make money easier for everyone where financial technology platform that powers many of the innovators ecosystem today. By providing the infrastructure in tools needed to build financial absence services for those unfamiliar we cover more than fifteen thousand banks across North America Europe and power more than eighty percent of the largest attacks including companies like Mo Transfer Wise in coin base when we launch UK. We introduced our vision to build a fully inclusive financial system in Europe and now now announcing our Beta expansion to France Spain in Ireland is further proof of our ambitions secrete a global platform that serves as a catalyst for growth than these new markets and makes it easier for businesses to serve a global customer base. So we're really excited to bring our services to France. Spain in Ireland to spark the next stage of fintech growth these countries have been our are most demanded by customers and have vibrant ecosystem already for local banks and other financial institutions plag- can help provide the reliability and uptown promise in open banking an end help expand to the UK us and Canada for Developers Fintech APPS flab brings a proven platform to deliver better customer experiences at any scale Ale and allow them to easily launch today Geos so we look forward to helping developers France Spain and Ireland built great services and make money easier for more people. Okay so that was. Keith's outline the NFL that was excellent and nice and to the point is produce lower said but Isabelle. What did you think when you saw the story? Yeah I mean. It's quite difficult to make bank in sexy. They have supplied aerobicy really helping in that respect and leading the MARCH CIGNA I think is interesting and just generally about open Bankin is is what that might mean for the consumer. I don't think that's necessarily that clear yet Oversee we know that it could make potentially in the future future. I'm certainly not yet but mortgages easy payments Portal's different if not better. We still don't know something that had had an interesting arcing conversation this week. Where someone who was saying that perhaps the likes of plaid could help with the concept of open finance which is an analogy? Is The music industry. Okay so we have old music stools so that would be the incumbent banks then we had I tune so that would be the challenge of banks and then we had spotify and on the idea. Is that this open. Finance mechanism could make banks the spotify or provide a spotify like service to customers which would mean everything integration into one. I've heard that somewhere before David. Yeah I've said that a few times I mean I think the difficulty with I mean. I'm sure it's not. It's called before for. I mentioned it Do I have that power. I don't think I would be nice. Am I a Kadarshian. I mean I think the the difficulty with that analogy to set in particular when it comes to somebody like plant coming into to banking. Is the fundamental difference between June. spotify wasn't really APP outs outs the streaming capability. It was about the fundamental change in the business model. That happened between those two points. Banks are just not ready for that stuff you know it is End of back to the future that that just note that yet the kids will love it but they're just not ready So I kinda feel if they could stall engaging with the technology and make the benefit of the technology. That's a good thing And I think a lot of the a lot of the benefit of planned coming here is Europe is doing open banking you know in banking in the US this is is still a an actually more. Globally is still a kind of a hope. Rather than a you know a regulatory mandated thing you know. PTSD to in Europe is is spearing that so so much further forward than the rest of the world is but I still think. This is a A staunch but it's not really the place that we need to get to the open bank absolutely among what did you think so I've been watching Plod when they first kind of announced what they're doing because I was working for US Bank at the time. And what's really good about their proposition. Is they take some of the difficulty away for these institutions right so a lot of them just the thought of. API enablement is scary. It's a scary sleeping. Someone stabbing you in your sleep. It's that little scary visceral. Yeah didn't see that coming. Yeah well and They've helped take that away right. Given the investment. That's in them. Given the number of banks that they have under their belts. And what's interesting is the Marcus they've gone. After in Europe that they've announced aren't the most Ford Fintech. Markets generally is applied way of saying something. But you know A lot of the banks there have legacy systems their heart open up the heart and degrade with their heart open up as an API integration platform on the next phase of API. Hi Banking is moving over and above kind of account services and into more product lines product services and plaid gives a good enablement of that interesting stuff. How `Bout Yourself Yeah I think it's really interesting plots kind of by strategy and timing come into the UK. you can make an argument that are a bit late kind of open banking's been here for a couple of years is I don't think they ought to. I think they'll benefit from a local local or more expert. UK aggregate as the quality of a hard work with the banks. I think what we find. We are one of those parties. What we found is taken a couple of years of hard work with a bang? KPI's to get them performance unable to deliver value at SCO Jio unto the point of How is this going to deliver value to end users real people? You need the not just to be there. So it's one thing for banks to declare sometimes with some fanfare that they've got an API available very big difference between not working being The time that was mentioned by Keith is vital hundred setup up time all the time with millions of customers hitting every day is what you need so I think the timing is interesting. I think the PLOTTO benefit from other people's hard work. I think the probably advantage they have and it kind of slightly goes to save is. They've got two hundred fifty million dollars so the war chest is interesting around. Actually you can solve complexity with Resource of money. I think. Probably what's more interesting to me is will they. Uh spend that money on the hard work of the technical integration or will will they acquire and partner. So it's really fascinating to me that there's two notable A big companies in their cocktail mastercard and visa and actually plot a somewhat competing with them especially in Europe when you look kind of Moss. COTTAM visas market share in the continent and how they potentially move to more of a partnership with those two parties to really connect especially when we talk about payments. Sorry hand to account payments. Yeah I was about to say that. Yes tired. Because the move mastercard and visa's entirely Arlington Account to account right now. This is a great advantage for them. Interesting stuff and do you think that this will help. US Fin Tech's come to Europe a little bit about About Robin Hood coming to market. There's been a lot of talk about a lot of us fintech looking at the UK Plot is often a part of their offering. So is that an An how do you reflect on the other comment. Yeah I mean I saw this set vehicles for example for the price of Robin Hedge. Oversee expanded into Europe is is a is a difficult challenge for food for anyone particularly at least they have like you said the war chest and robinhood similarly So is a big venture as it is for the the Europeans guarded Eh the US. I wanted to ask about actually. I'm curious about how open banking payment portal might affect mastercard and Visa Lisa. I understand how it's in direct competition with Moscow visa. It it isn't. It isn't so mastercard right now are being very aggressive passive in supporting it Because if you kind of look at the rails of how payments going to happen in open banking is going to happen to requires so. A lot of those acquires are are supporting open. Banking and then mastercard is quite bullish around count to account happening through those flows The probably pushing more for business to business flows not so much for consumer to business But it's a small step in a small leap and there's been extensions announced to open backing. API's to allow for example pre authorization the reservation. So we're kind of going that way what that means for traditional car drills is going to be interesting But you know it. There's going to be plurality clarity out their cards still GONNA increase. But it'll be known as much as it would have been without open banking. Guess I'd say. PTSD to is much more. If a direct push against the networks I'd say open banking is is more friendly in the way in which is being implemented it's a it's an interesting nuance between the two of them. I think if Moscow visa small which I mean I think they probably all given what are they should be pushing up to more and more and more of this stuff. It's like wait you wait. You continually move to add value basically uh-huh and and what we see a lot more from open finance rather than open banking in the future. I think that's going to be an interesting area of development. Listen to this run and run but I gotta move as the next door. Open everything thing. Let's do A. and it's open everything Dole's does everything I mean. If you'RE GONNA go to a bunch of domains PO- open in front of everything. Absolutely next story I just uh-huh some business insider and this is about Goldman Sachs may be acquiring e-trade Ole merging with US banks a lot of uncertainty in that headline Apparently there are no formal discussions that amount to Mojo talks senior executives of reportedly discussed the deals internally scoop here This also so comes the same week. That Charles Schwab announced it will acquire. Td Ameritrade and the deal that could be with up to twenty six billion which we covered last week on insider If Goldman a quiet e-trade it would gain three hundred forty six billion dollars in assets under management whilst US buying cope who boasts eighteen point seven million customers. I'm assuming the And three thousand branches so the rumors come after Goldman spent three hundred million dollars on apple called. I'm I'm lost one hundred and fifty fifty million in half on twenty nine hundred eleven on Marcus so big money going around here people. I mean it sort of sounds like we don't actually not know anything about this and it's vague groomer to somebody might have sneezed at some point. We think they might have flu. It's like Oh okay I mean it super interesting I I think the US bank won't particularly if they like this. Is I mean we have to Goldman Sachs rank you like first or second in size of bank out there. So it's like those little second ball he's fifth or sixth isn't it. That would be a huge thing. I mean the the the sort of You know gaining assets the management saying Goldman Sachs. Did they need you to make their balance sheet even bigger than they do so quickly googled. they've go round about nine hundred and twenty five billion assets under management which makes them faith after JP Morgan and Bank of America Citigroup and Wells Fargo but importantly well they'll be going after here is deposits rather than just growing that balance sheet because deposits allows them to fund their Balance Sheet and and fund further lending which cost Goldman famously. Didn't have before and both of these moves luck like that so both of them seem logical so then fifths the biggest. US Bank Bali six biggest Banco something near that yet with the US. Bank has much more of a retail presence doesn't intensive the GOI- accident really known for that still but I mean this would be fascinating if it happened it was What did you think we should? I was really fascinated by whether the rumors are true or not Just from Goldman's generally sort of Really all the bank for rich people or they bank for the people and I think they might be Spending a lot of money on a very expensive experiment about whether they are which one of those they are. I think the retails really interesting. Things that stand out like the Investment in Apple Cart. You guys think lost time talked a lot about The potential fallout almost from the algorithms. They using their and it to me kind out of those things look like a investment bank trying to be retail bank and the mistakes you may think one of the bits in the report was how much money that lost you to not even having having a debt collection department in place for their lending proposition. I this sort of feels like it's Almost co challenge at the top that two different things to try. And what do if you're trying to serve a make people wealthy. That's entirely different to serve people from a- core banking and retail different. DNA's and Isabel. And I I wonder though do you what what do you think about. These moves because Sarah Chomsky on slack said they feel very different. And why would you pick one versus the other. We wouldn't be the first time that big bank has a quiet kind of retail facing bankruptcy. All BS not west And like you said I mean maybe that is the move. Maybe they'll reach into the masses. It would seem wise. I think the apple called the fluid algorithm looks like a fantastic innovation considering where US Banking is um they have this spend management feature which is still very nascent there and I think you guys had the Marcus. CEO on a couple of weeks ago which already enjoyed listening to colorful gave me Sense of a renewed confidence in the offering And I Lead as let's not rule them out and they could very well do fantastic retail bank offering. I mean we had So Sam did an interview with Hartman. Recently he was the CTO of Of Marcus and is now now moved up to be group level. CTO across Goldman Sachs. Sorry it was so yeah so I think if he if he's in a view of how the so you kind of go and he's been the driving force behind basically moving. Co Point Antione organization from a You know trading ninety three type vibe. Even you know there's a there's a batch that deals with everything else you know to twenty four seven organization that deals with retail than actually. This might be a really interesting space that U. S. Bank operates in. Is it off of the states in the states. The states in the states. Yeah that makes sense then actually. Maybe it's a very good way of the matchy he doing this. Is this like massive tree all atrocity of like somebody's already don't all the processes. Somebody's already got these. You know the back office working and regulatory working and now we can start. Don't moving these things forward if it is coupled with getting all of these deposits from his savings perspective than maybe it's just this insanely large balance-sheet balancing that would just seeing the of a multi multibillion company. I'm on you've got to cut markets backgrounds. What did you think we should so I think we look at the Metro? What's happening here Large Investment Banks Are Finding it hard to make money for a couple of reasons. regulation is going against them and products are drying up and flows. are going other places so you you know when we talk about start ups if you look. At the way they're funded right now. Traditionally that would have come through. Investment banks brokering that funding. That's happening less and less still happening later. Series series but earlier on that's going and then also the more exotic products where you can really make money are going away so golden is good at surviving and what they WanNa do is figure out. What does it mean to be a effectively? An Investment Bank in this heavily regulated world. And one thing they're doing. Is there experimenting with retail through Marcus. What US Bank gives them his team to your point about our balance sheet allows them to lend more which means generate more prophets? And what will those products are they going to feed the Investment Bank and you tied into an e. trade or another sort of customer facing investment vehicle you can now offer kind of leverage products or more exotic sort of things. So it's awesome speculation is just GonNa Follow e-trade point Among CAS with post host Robin Hood the US Advisory Market feels very hot as well. Generally Charles Schwab in the TD Ameritrade Is there something there as well about putting the pieces of the puzzle together. That could be vaguely strategic. Yeah I think if you look at what. Marcus has introduced an apple cart to a certain degree it's bringing automation to consumer decisions which which normally would be brokered by very nice people in suits having nice conversations with you And now he's kind of I don't WanNa say democratizing because that's not quite right but it's it to the mass affluent and the segment below that is making available these other sorts of products so you can get investment great advice. Or what looks like investment-grade advice earlier on your wealth profile. So you don't have to be you know daddy warbucks. You can just beat remarkably cuff comfortable and the per second to champagne metaphor eh right. It's a what a metaphor is this. Is this in that in that point. Is this basically Goldman Sachs pudding new asset onto their balance and she and it's eighteen point seven million people you know essentially are they investing in having these people on balance sheet because ultimately that's where the growth is going to come in a inevitable downturn for the next a couple of years perhaps I I think you need to look at what the demographic profile of US bank is and if it matches each rates for example or something like it and then you tied tied into the card proposition and Marcus and then you suddenly have a potentially very large beast again coming out. And that's the business number two because at first business investment banking and if you look at the the the biggest Bank in the book. And Cody. Just go back to Google with J. P. Morgan Bigger Than Bank of America building just J. P. Morgan is all the the most complete buying covering out there and has been able to deliver pretty decent results because it had thought diversity on an in its portfolio. But I mean I mean they boot chase right. Anything even J. P. Morgan Chase had a couple of cracks at you know there's a removed project going on in the the UK to build a retail challenge. Bank is Faden that they sort of spun up. Shut down so I mean it's interesting. People are people with very big balance sheets. It turns out you can an experiment and you can do things and figure out what happens. You know what I mean. Money to we Somebody had mentioned I think about mentioned that we we spoke to both you weeks ago a couple of weeks. We'll be speaking to designate who's the UK MD of Mockus. So we will follow up on this one and the next story is from the BBC. Apparently the WESTPAC chief chief quits amid money laundering scandals. The Chief Executive Brian Hot saw on Chairman Lindsay Mac. That resigned after the company has been embroiled in a money. Laundering scandal handle with possible links to child exploitation. Australian regulated sued the nation's oldest bank last week for an alleged twenty three million breaches of counter terrorist financing hang on money laundering laws resulting in transactions involving around eleven billion Usually I like the number. Eleven put don't know WESTPAC allegedly allegedly failed to monitor the accounts of convicted child sex offender who regularly send money to the Philippines. Each of the bank's alleged breaches carries a maximum penalty of of twenty one million Australian dollars and WESTPAC competitor paid a seven hundred million Australian dollar fine for similar breaches last year Folks when we saw this one damn appalling and this is one area where in kind of money remittance. It's the correspondent like like which is being attacked right now and Swift has done some work around this to try and tighten it up a little bit but like all types of flows use of Beit Laundering or Security risks you attack the weakest vector and clearly the correspondence side of it is is the weakest vector and it just goes down to you know we need proper identity coming through this and Scott. Come quickly when I mean. This is a massive miss. Casey is so broken. And you see this so often and I'm banks procedures for doing that themselves can be You know they're they're in control of that but at the other side that not necessarily in control of where it goes in who she she that person and so there's so much room for things that can go wrong when I saw. It's obviously pretty shocking. I think the thing that really worried me was kind of how this felt like a cultural kind of challenge gain of kind of I think. There's something in the article which was profits more important than people came from the kind of commission. which is I think kind of interesting the more interesting to me was WESTPAC? Share price increased almost two percent off to the news. which is I think kind of this kind of systemic comic challenge around how you How we meet the doll on Kinda thinking about people more than the Prophet I think? KYC Belt tighter degree with. It's really interesting. I'm a product person so kind of how you frame the problem. You're trying to solve where think traditionally in banking it's been. How do we identify by Where money's going after it's been sent to your point? How do we identify? Were going before it gets sent It's a fundamental change. Stop and if you're going to stop this. Yeah I mean accountability in this one is really interesting. Isn't IT I. I think it's super interesting in this life. You look a catastrophic systems problems you know simple past is to get the boot from. TSB will go to help was six months ago now because of a sort of catastrophic thing that really he probably wasn't the only he knew what was going on he was being advised by the people. Like does the guy at the top of this company quitting almost immediately when this come out point to a JACCI Achy knows a lot more about it. I should say nothing about this. But he's reaction to me kind of admits a lot more guilt than I would have thought it would do. If somebody who would have stayed in gone this is is a systems thing. There's been like major problems in our you know frauds mechanisms and we should do a lot more to kind of counterbalance this because basically just going oop. Yep I'll Algo. That just seems a little bit old to me. This is a risk broadly isn't it. There was some UN figures From two thousand fourteen fifteen. I think it was what they they estimated around two trillion dollars loan that every O of which we detect to two percent of which we then go in further investigate two cents to two percent of the two percent. The scale of this is massive. And on the back of that you have done so by about a year ago Through the Estonian brunch. There was about one hundred and thirty seven billion. The scale of this is genuinely terrifying I'm is what it is whether it's it's whether it's passive or whether it's the people are active in it. Examples of people the Organization banks folks who have been very aware of very naughty things happening in Mexico naming names in La things happening and frauds being undetected the if he knew about this given in the connotations of actually where the money was going and where What it was being used for? Then the will be legal ramification. Surely she he could face. Jail time for sophistication absolutely that hasn't been ruled out. And the general responsibility is at the top for any major failure and for wait really Jack. You're not regulated okay And and given the given the breaches both from a kind of regulation point twenty but also given the severity of the human side of this. It was the bare minimum. That could have been done. And you know the setting up the commission the setting up of the investigation it is An important step but you know what are the steps that are going to be done to have the right level of oversight internally because unfortunately what happens when regulators react they don't react in a way to enable the problem to be solved so you know am L. Regulation has been around for fifteen twenty years. It really is fit for purpose. Yeah it is poorly done a and there are ways to do it better and and the reaction here is like what happened post esp the industry just went. We're not going to change anything whereas the actual reaction has to be. We need to be better at changing faster and better and more control and I think that's a super interesting point on because I'm a post a lot of the fines that have been coming out into the space for while people hired a compliance team to do the same thing having more people doing the thing that doesn't work doesn't help you need to people doing different things. Yeah I mean. He's this is a monetary fine enough to detect people doing these things or is it enough to make people care. I think if you know people are being fined for PPI and all sorts of bad things but billions of pounds have been found and nobody's stopping and who was fine CEO. The bank was fined. The fraudsters weren't caught the fraudsters roadsters weren't put in prison right And with each of these things. It's one that's a corporate responsibility and corporate governance. You have to you. You have to do that properly but is that follow through action of WHO. Who's going to be you know if you're culpable was was the punishment I think on the Financial Action Task Force? which is the global body? That works with policymakers to set these rules at the national level has flipped in the last couple of years. From focusing on do you have. Rules was in place to do those rules work. How effective all day? So hopefully that starts to believe. I mean if I was Dave Birch right now I'd be saying the winter shit when people took away personal liability. Not even the CEO's and he down the day butch already. We'll be back very shortly. Let's take a quick break while she hit from our sponsors yeah today. Customers are demanding greater value from financial services they expect more agility innovation and security than ever before most financial institutions are held back by the shackles of close legacy systems that limit transparency block innovation and ignore customers demands. CANASTA has a bold vision to unlock the potential of people and business. They've created a platform for open innovation in the well to financial services with fusion some fabric dot com their solution span retail transaction ending treasury and capital markets on premise and in the cloud start your transformation transformation journey today with fister. Welcome back to inside from Lebanon. It's just a few days till extra special Christmas edition Oft Doc. It's already sold out but we look forward to seeing all if you look lucky. Ticketholders Zeph some festive fund. A very special theme a Fintech Christmas cow and despair spirit of giving going. I love this. We're basically telling them Ha- you've already missed out on something. Just listen to her. Yeah we give them something and we might slip something into the podcast It it is Christmas time after all and in the spirit of giving we'll be hosting a raffle with some extra awesome and very unique prices. This is raising money for Save the children who are working to pad the eleven schools that were destroyed by the devastating cyclone in Mozambique in fact WOMP sycophantic has donated donated a branded skateboard deck as a price for the night who could not be Waiting to see whoo. That's yeah there's a good Russell coming We hope you bring your credit cards and Christmas Berry and give generously for this great goals for those the company. The of course will be bringing the Christmas Carol to the podcast very soon all right. Let's get on with the show. The next story comes from tech crunch on this is about India's pay TM Raising a billion. US stolas The Kommersant payments firm now valued at sixteen billion dollars and is currently expanding into insurance earns lending stockbroking and investments the company's best known for its mobile wallet which allows us to pay bills transfer money insecure small loans amongst other features the PTA founder and Chief Executive Vj Shikha. Sharma says. The company will use the money to Colt. Small and medium. Businesses funding comes as pay. ATM faces increased competition from international competitors. Like Google and facebook on today. Google pay and colts phone. p. led the peer to peer payments industry according to industry estimates India's Fintech pay. Tm just absolutely kicking us is phenomenal. Right and there's a lot to be said for how India has built the India stack. They've dealt with standardized. API's they've solved identity. They've increased inclusion and and they've allowed a competitive marketplace to develop so pay. Tm have relatively a strong customer base. Not because they were I. It helped hoped but because they continually adapted and innovated You know WHATSAPP launched An offering I think it was last year to sit on top of the rails just just to see what it was like And that fed into their overall project as well I think so. It's great to see The valuation I think we need to express in units of we work. I think that's a far more valuable way of understanding these things he dated. Well we work when when work is interesting Alibaba has two percent pay. Tm Do you think there is something playing out here in The big tech moves around payments. There's something really interesting the winning business model so When I was looking at this kind of what's happened? Their code of market share of communication. You've got facebook monetize. Through gods you go google pay. Google can monetize threats as well say beatty thinks interesting on this strategy declared of the investments really going towards the peer to merchant cut a development that relationship and actually being there for merchants in store and being the payment method in stores really interesting. Because that's where it feels. Feels like they do have a competitive advantage in the business model where I think it's really smart because they they can't Google and facebook throughout revenue so Every thought about how they can monetize and the interesting thing with both of those social media platforms is they've been focused and small medium businesses. And if you look at a lot of say Google's latest peyton patents or patents. Whatever they they are focused on encouraging small businesses to use their network? So you know they have Peyton that allows you to figure out how effective you've our google searches and Google maps directions of driving footfall to your store in an weirdly enough it's anonymous and they can figure this out I'd so it's all about that small medium business and capturing them because that's the engine of Conway's I'd be quite interested to see how this could be replicated because I think the key differentiation. I didn't the very much by Indian. E commerce is the levels of trust that uses may have relative to the trust that we may have in Google's in the face because of the world of the world here in the West so so if if this has a unique stand in among Indian customers a unique level of trust and the answer is probably a copy reputation. Same Way because I I mean. It's it's just an insane how quickly it's been spreads though it's like demonetisation what like three years ago in a major way overnight spurred digital payments to be the only way you could really move it forward so UPI and yeah. I mean that that and I mean payments is like Oh Gee Fintech anticrime it's like it's it's the maturity to them. Okay if you kind of look at stripe and everybody else kind of glibly as well. Those guys are now a scale weather able to expand into insurance or lending or whatever because they've just got such a fantastic foothold in the market. But I mean in India's a it say India's a unique market because of the sort would've reasonably overnight changes but equally I mean it's similar to the story really is there was a market conditions that made it so successful that hasn't been replicated elsewhere But every big Gio seems to have the story. It's like you get out there. You require a massive amount of customers you use that money and pivot into the community for other things and it just makes sense. Doesn't it really. Yeah and you know what drives the trust here. It's built on top of a safe interface. UPI right it's it's a standardized interface but the other thing that's missed over and above demonisation is there's an active drive by the government to create bank accounts for those who are not banked. She sixty five five percent increase in inclusion and that was done because a lot of farmers for example when they were getting their money from the government east to be mediated by by middleman. And I'm very little money when add up in the farmers pockets so this was driving a lot of that and it's it's starting a phase to allow a social to be developed in India And this is you know one two three four steps and I think in other countries and other geographies for this to happen you need to be thinking a lot more strategically and and there there is a role for government or policy on one side not to clinical coming up to our election right but And there is a role for private sector So you see what's happening in p twenty eighty seven and the God knows what's going to happen with the terrible Pepsi acronym in payments around Europe bees and PSD to this just drives inclusion and drives digitization uh-huh is Asian but we have to make sure the nets as wide interesting and axes maintained. Isabelle's point feels like privacy is a luxury of the wealthy especially the way apple is selling at the moment but the android fa ade but it but these massive social problems you we saw it with China was seeing it now with grabbed go jack the emergence of the the super trying to soulful The merchant side I is this. Why do you think that the big text from the western side haven't been as effective at doing The quiz way. Yeah I think so like if you look at how long it took Google to go back back to that example to get Google paid right or jeep as it does now. It took what four iterations which is fine. It goes to show how you work your alert. Continue but it's done in a very non uniform way and again it. It's hard to drive standardisation in financial services but when it is is there when it is present it drives the right level to use. UK terms of end user outcomes who not I'm GonNa make this the next story in this comes from Nationwide opening an API sun box. Full the mortgage industry Building Society will help third party develops pilot APPS APPS that need to speed up the mortgage processing for brokers This box. Api Asia offer third-party officer third party systems can connect with nationwide credit it risk on back office systems. The goal is to reduce the overhead allowing brokers to input information once and shared between systems and Andrew Who's direct off. Ah Intermediary relationships nationwide building society says brokers generate a significant proportion of our mortgage lending It's so so it's important that we also so invest in all services We Isabel early talks about open finance. Do you think this is. This is part of that trend. Yeah she saw to Mo Jo mortgages just this week. I don't know if you guys have come across them. They're kind of a digital burqa if you like And they've said eighty percent of mortgages in the UK are done through broker so that makes sense for NatWest at nationwide. Sorry Not West on the mind but yeah I mean if this if this is helpful for nationwide than fantastic but I do think that the wider new digital cise digitalization of the brokerage system in the UK is much more exciting and merger trussell. Salaam HABITO Maybe this is nationwide trying to catch up with them. I mean it's the the buying of property is such a broken process right. There's so many we'd wonderful wonderful. Bits in in the mix and done at disclaim up very cool to back. Welcome to nineteen eighty-three whether as many bits of paper that you shall film uh-huh like literally stem bits of paper. Move things forward whether it's conveyancing also to wait and wonderful stuff. valuations of properties and also dissuade. Things I mean. He's more next week. David's mortgage tips like older. They seem to end is just not great. So the way you go and find out how much money the bank allows she to borrow to go and buy the thing. That's yours is interesting and I so if they can you know daisy chain these things together with interesting different services and API's then great but we'd we're just not with broker actually mo most of this for me. I mean the reason why I like Heavy towing those types of guys. He's like I don't have to talk hoped to people and like they take over the problem away from me but so talking to a broker seems like the antithesis of that I wonder is it then. There's a new type. Broker emerging like heavy tow. Like those are the guys and this is to them rather than should the traditional brokers brand image thing because when you say program like a man in a shop Yep Yep I have to go on the streets do they exist. I think key could be interesting again. I think she threw up to open. Finance level gets interested if throat outset open open everything level feel good mortgages again. David said. Actually that's this this sort of can I get a mortgage thing. How much can I borrow is an interesting part of the process person? Experience kind of alert Actually the more painful parts of the processor. Then I've been offered some money. I now want to buy the house. If there's so much more that could happen. This could be the stall twelve in terms of the conveyancing process valuations She's all kinds of things like that. I think the nationwide. It's a good use of an emerging Pattern all stretch g where you open up your eyes get the people who blacks are experts in solving problems and innovating to benefit from those. And we've done a lot with nationwide through open banking for good which is a similar model. which is hey Well that they've done really WanNa say we've got some problems we need to solve. We admit when the best place people to solve it. Here's the piece that you're missing. which is a data access says to our systems? Kind of go figure solve it I think it's worked well for them in other areas that I've been involved with I could see it being quite a ultimately for them cost cost effective way of solving a problem that go. Well I mean that that's good I mean. Hopefully they're using this as a way s experiment one because the way it's positioned right now. It's to help them with. Niggle is not to help a broader marketplace which is the way how a lot of incumbents deal with problems right What's interesting I was doing some work with a the Big National Bank Last year then we're looking at the mortgage process and they printed out the whole process and put it on a wall three and a half meters long from talked. Finish name then name offline right but the thing is. They wanted to solve the problem the way they wanted to address the problem was to deal deal with the whole owning a home experience. And you know there's so many things you can fix things you can't fix but if you can make the whole journey better because buying a house is actually one part. It's probably seventy percent of the stress but then and the next bit his couch exactly and this is Is really interesting. Fintech and I forget the name but the very unjust for the rain gonNA on a Leads a jobs to be done in research practicing consulting often. Talks about Thinking in terms of I don't WanNa have a mortgage. I want to buy a house and you. You know people have been saying not in in banking for many when he goes. That's not new but what's interesting about this Fintech is. It's actually a savings APP on what it does. Is it shows you so based on your monthly savings which areas can I live in. I'm what what how could I have if I keep saving at that rate so it's it's kind of. Oh if I say this I can live in these nice aries. But if I don't save that much I will never live in those areas because I won't save enough and I think thinking about those different parts of the journey becomes really really Kate Hedge. You just bought a nice car. You've gotta live in Norwich. Yeah I feel like that happened. I mean what kids do to you. I mean it's it's interesting for fire. Nation wants expensive though being in a situation somewhere. I mean that the heritage is mortgages right. It was how they were founded. It was the you know. Pounds in a pound Clo- gloss certain communities mortgage. That's up so the idea that those guys are sort of going back to the heritage a little bit and trying to be more innovative in that space kind of makes sense in any bills. Do stuff like this. I like the idea of launching doing something. That's ahead of regulators pushing them to do it and testing it with people and is part of the thing how nationwide is just bound to its regulatory slap last last year. They're embracing opens a lot more than bracing digitization lot better. But there's an interesting story today on an extra where co op is partnering with Freedom. Finance to open up lending and loans marketplace so. It'll be interesting how that works out the future finances open here we go all right. I'm nick story comes from furniture as well REVOLU is is launching a GP direct debits So the features available to customers in the European economic area with a local UK account details customers will be able to make payments direct from their Revolu counts for things like gym memberships utility bills. All subscriptions customers will be protected from fraud by the Direct debit guarantee and the new functionality will use modulars direct debit Monday revolu has used modules. API's since two thousand seventeen on the revenue CEO Knicks Sharansky said we are providing customers with an alternative digital payments infrastructure unshackled by reliance on traditional slow legacy see banking or. Your thoughts Michel this Ali. I was I was interested in. Beverly Customer I it's a feature of waiting for wall. I think a few people have sort of said. Why is this exciting because everyone else has been offering direct debits forever? I think it's kind of. It's interesting with Reveille Monzo and others are doing a great job of About towards jobs to be done kind of incremental feature releases I think my as a customer revved up reveille experiences been are used at I for forex. It saved me money happy. And then I kind of incrementally that they're up selling me to use it for more so this move is interesting because now I could actually potentially. The US is getting close to a primary account. You compare it to Morton's as they kind of needed debit day one because they were wanting to be a checking account so I think it's interesting. Not Revolutionary why. Do you think it took them longer to go. Do you think it was a strategy if anything I mean. Probably a bit of Inside knowledge warning cut of no modular. Fairly well I think the dam as well as the underlying infrastructure they focused on Really far ost dynamic payment methods. I because that's where the future's going and it's almost now a sort of by Exercise of well. Hey for certain things right debit. It's still a good methods. It gives some control to the consumer about repeatable ongoing payment. So let's make sure we have that in the soccer in the sweet I think it's more to do with that There's a level of complexity in there as well though again to kind of tie. I mean it's interesting. Seeing these guys fell in more and more gaps. Right as you say it's like the the reason for and not being able to use people whether it's stalling onto a reveille. Whoever as like your primary to your point kind of this sort of Ebola Wade? Isn't it so it we'll be interesting on A. OC Monzo pushed pretty hard to get people to to move over with Will pay you a day. Elliott thing you know. Various different places are trying different tactics. But I mean Does anybody around the table use of intact player is like your arm your bank account. That's of people shaking their heads. No shout to my wife Haley. Who did did go full Monzo? I'm on how I would go into full Monzo and that was largely from trying to change your name from Dixon to Taylor you loving skirt having such frustration with incoming bank doing it now is that means is like I've got married icon except troy the Trojan horse model of sort of ad. So I I really like as a strategy for challenges because you've got the incumbent monitoring switching rights and you get this secret switcher Gotcha so you know that secret switch off. Actually I started using it for just my expenses to Trotman better now salaries there now. I'm borrowing money from them and all of a sudden there's no switch metro warning incumbent on the customer's gone fraud intensive. Yeah I think We sorta referred to that. It's like Zombie accounts because the problem that you go there is like the incumbent organization can still carries a little cost to that account that that I mean in my example. I'd go ammonia count Louis Account Loyd's of got my where my salary gets paid into and we'll the bills paid need but I'm not transacting on it in any way before molding onto internet banking and it's like the carrying will cost with like none of the benefit like please take alone and I'm like shoo. You they just don't get eighty is going to be interesting at some point weather and it's GonNa be so hard for them because I'll be going to have to go. Look we're not seeing any transactions ends which is carrying all the cost. We're GONNA have to start shutting down some of these accounts because they're just not profitable for his in anyway. Yeah so I I think a couple things so one thing Revolu it's quite interesting is subtracting away bank accounts so its focus has been. Look you have this thing scholar Revolu thing right and you can do your payments you can do direct debits. He can manage your life without thinking about got it which is a wonderful conceit? And that's probably part of the reason why there are waiting for the modular. API's to get right in the system to get better than I think with incumbents. They don't really care about current accounts because they don't make money from them. So if you look in particular and I have a half a block post on this right. It's called equivalents right isn't God knows. Only be done but it's looking at. Where's the energy of products and product portfolio? Coming in. If you look at Lloyd's it's actually all around lending mortgages. He's like there's like thirty different types of mortgages you can get from. Lloyds between Lloyds and Halifax and it's all very focused tailored always speak about fintech right. They know their the customers. They know what they need and speaking to the market accounting holding direct deposit account. Well it was always a loss leader. I wonder if there's is a risk of them seeing it only as a loss leader a not the customer service leader the the thing that keeps you loyal to me a few. See it as that does it. Ah they seeing deposit flight to the point of like your David signs having from you like it's not maybe not everything and it's drips and drabs. But you're seeing the deposit flight so that they mccown Linda's much as they used to and then eventually do get the secret switches. I don't necessarily just lose the revenue. I think you lose the mind you mean like actually it's briand affiliation in any way shape or form and I think that ultimately I think that's the biggest race because at some point you wake helping realize nobody cares about you as a brand indeed all right. I'm we could go on this one forever. I'm sure but We've got media team to have lives. I'M GONNA keep is moving So the next story comes invoices via fintech futures on shots. Got It to those guys and it says a presenting Fintech says it's the first world's LGBT Plus Bank So part buying because launch in a big Besa base to support the gay community by without discrimination the Company offers a digital prepaid credit card. And we'll give five percents of his income to the Pride Institute a US organization station that supports LGBT. Plus charities and shelters customers will be able to include the chosen name on my codes as an important benefit of course for transpeople. I've tried bank launches attacks on the LGBT plus community from Brazilian president. Yeah Bone saw last year. He threatened to excise excise mention of homosexuality from school textbooks and said that the country must not become quote a gay tourism paradise Interesting this launches Kind of can coming into Brazil which has been a very hot fintech market definitely undeserved on quite probably overcharged community. That said wait one isn't it. I mean I was like wait. Do we need this and then reading feather into I was like Oh my God. We need this a barely late. I mean it's pretty Pretty Sands actually in two thousand nineteen were stage where actually people in any geography anywhere needs this type of thing to be thing But at Saint Thomas actually given there is so much you know seemingly sort of post acution from that perspective having a called that you use in a public place with these things might actually be pretty negative experience for people to kind of have so. I don't know I'm undecided whether I think this is a I mean it's a good thing because of it's inclusion but it's a it's a very precarious situation ineffectually. It carries a a target of people in a way that actually is probably unnecessary. I I think you're addressing a community. This underserved no matter. What is It's good because clearly there's something around financial services and being part of the LGBT plus community that you're being excluded from so perhaps getting a mortgage perhaps getting known perhaps opening an account right you. I I haven't been to Brazil I don't know where it whereas following in the the kind of day to day for people But if if something is a serious as you're having a a prime minister going around and censoring textbooks. That's pretty weird weird. I think it's a Q.. We talked about KYC earlier. I think is kind of interesting example. Potentially where in probably unintentionally finally caught if some banking processes don't serve son parts of population. So you mentioned your wife which Inter Monzo and doing that because that was the easiest easiest place to change her name. Imagine for people where it's really important to them. They can either change their name will be identified under a certain name. And how about uh-huh potentially today actually doesn't line up with how you do know your customer is. This is the thing that stood out to me and I was caught a game product. Hats on thinking. How would I solve the of compliance and conduct on one side to the story? We talked about earlier about being taught into customers. And then I've got being able to deliver the right service to valuable customer invaluable person. It's it's a bit of a head scratching on how to do. I mean your point I was gonNA say discretion will be up see key and not just thought data protection you know just in the street but we'll have those people enlisted in this bank in that. Might police intrusion. Whatever might be our data security obsolete key here in terms of sustainability? I'm Jesus but perhaps like you say this could teach the incumbent something and as a potential partnership white labeling acquisitions yeah hopeful already are on finally story. This week is a change of pace on this is rb S.'s. Bo moving into the market story comes from Royces and I'll be two through Monzo installing is now live on the APP store and Google play Apparently it's already been targeted by fraudsters. Prompting the bank to ask for help The APPS Selfie taking aching processes also unique eight. Ask us to take a photo of their face with our eyes closed on their tongue out Out into the fact that Bo As a brand name with Fatah with the fodder over the Oh means cow in Gaelic. You can understand why the response has been somewhat mixed. I'm David I think this is weird. does ever want to go first or should I just go over this one thing which is There's been a few things about the complexity of all the challenge of bio two words. Let's and spellcheck more small check problem. Brainwa- I mean that has been the problem that I it doesn't do you want to change. Doesn't it so when actually it's in any way isn't it. What does it say so? It's literally changed. Every time boasts and as a headline of anything it gets updated to be Ample Sans Hashtag. Something something something doesn't it. Yeah that's that's the lesson code personally. Does the unit coat it. It just seems like this has been so badly thought through and delivered from my perception. You know again so saying it seems like I think if you look at a low of organizations that sort of face into these types of things it just starts feeling so solis. Jimmy has ruled of the purposive. Like what Nikolai Colli will ambush. Tom Field standing up to try and do is bring him out. Postal banking fixing Jobs to be done there fixing sort of niches that are underserved or overcharge in the market And this just feels to me like it's just like very very seles banking. You know I think the anyway that really the culprit challenges can work if that based on a fundamental You Know Cultural Talents. Operational transformation this roots intents and purposes just looks like the the whim of like a very senior banker in a bunch of consultants. He's spending a hell of a lot of money because if you look closely at what they've done they've took nearly early two years and probably more than stalling Monzo in revenue did together to get to where there aren't The other thing I'd say is Oh my God. Have you looked to the reviews on the APP store like early. Somebody was paid to go in. Drop a bunch of reviews samples of for you if you'd like go ahead This is from Abby ups obs- And they say five styles simple. KYC and easy to use regular consumer language I said I downloaded the APP. My KYC was done in minutes unusual for my experience with another big bank earlier. Because you sign up for lots of banks every day Now I'm able to move my money into savings Paul on set targets for my spending. I was also surprised to see how much money is spent on. Coffee and food is helping me consciously avoid certain spending gray APP yellow makes me feel brighter as well. Wow what customer knows what. KYC is no no customers and then what is this bullshit faked review a hundred percent. There might be genuine reviews right but the thing is two thousand three thousand five hundred our staff that are using it and This is very much to your point right David. which is it's taken two years to build something that even starling Monzo revolution weren't at two years ago and so not only are they behind the curve there behind an old curve? Um I think As probably a I'm going to defend them slightly I think when you speak to the team behind this and the individuals involved audit I did. It was about six months ago. But they're the mission. They articulated to me was they were targeting wanting to help the seventeen million people in the UK who have less than one hundred pounds and savings savings so they did have that cool mission. which I think's really needed a really genuine? This feels to me like a poorly executed excuted brand the marketing exercise. Which I wouldn't underestimate the impact of that and how much set-back when you meet the people involved they genuinely want to solve a problem? I think it just. It's a really interesting in years to come out and could be an interesting case study of repulsive ten badly executed marketing. When I mean there's a lot of those if you look at I mean Finn and was shut down for a very similar? Reason was actually what they did. And actually if you look at many the banks that spun out of big banks before Tesco Bank really great intentions. You built a small version of obvious you know furlough intents and purposes between you know all be asked and the you know the various kind of supplies you're in there and we should say they're all There there is nothing wrong with corporate challenges. This is a good thing to do if you can fundamentally change what your cost. Structure is in your organization. Deliver much better experiences And but for everything you kind of look at it and it's not that you should say some really good people that like all he put. Do you know formerly of you know. There's a bunch of people over there are great the people but there's a lot of people And I'm like if you were a startup at stage you'd be about fifty people Those about four hundred now This is being run like a bank project north in text and and just kind of RBM had great launch last year with till till as the complete opposite in terms of how it was launched how came to market Howard understood his customers So hopefully this is just a marketing misstep but you know as I said on twitter this week you know Fata off so there's something interesting about how much press mainstream press has been around this and it makes you question the most is to come back to to your point earlier which is The the really interesting one. which is there are probably people in the really really wanted to do this for genuine reasons over real problem for customers is don't take that away because that problem mm Israel and I think not intense there but the The execution of achieving that I look at a look at lake goes like chip and plum and on all those folks that have done something different. At how you solve that problem might not be trying to quote unquote copy. Monzo installing. Were two three years ago and and so feels like their desires to do that and say look what cool to raw the van and that may not be the case. I think the genuine desire may have been to to financially including solve the problem but it was something in the execution. It feels like this might be cold trigger and that sort of you give a certain cultural set up and set of an incentive structure a challenge and and also in a completely different way to to people who really care about something whose livelihood depends on the case of that which is I think the pace thing and the change curves really interesting on their already behind. What chance do they stand a kind of catching up? Now it's going to be showing how corporate start to feel like a corporate and give themselves those constraints How do they how do they create? Feel because I think Isabelle you probably see a lot of this stuff and you see a lot of startups. What do you think the differences? I mean I. It surprised prizes for for bank. Like obvious not to get something like Brandon. Right you know riding on them I would say in interest piggyback on football. He said this might not be Intended as a mother s Karna count the reason. Perhaps at those withdrew fees is that they are incentivizing people to save and like you said said in this kind of turns if where they might have a cheap overdraft a already exist with one but for example facility instead of a high Interest Learn. You're I mean who cares about a dodgy name if that gives you a cheap alert right so then absolutely this. That might be something to explain this paps we're looking at a different The wrong angle. Different framework might make this look like a more attractive Offering for Barry Sutton demographic. That's that's the instinct and I think to kind of the point earlier on. which is it's how they adapt so the Fintech banks are releasing doing something? You have a few months so okay this version one. What's I one one point? Two one point three out of their response with real well. Let's say I'm sure this will run run One last point from David before we go my prediction within eighteen months. They'll get older this. They'll get bored of it and I think within the six months one exist prediction addiction. Made come back to the show to find out more than six months Already that wraps up this week's new show thank you so much I guess. What can people find out more about you as well? So I'm at sifted dot. Edu those don't know us where Financial Times backed startup new startup. We have a European startups And I come a Fintech Tech. I'm at I underscore with on twitter hobbies awfully Only bets with Wi- on Lynton and open works dot com for the business. Brilliant and Dan Yourself. I'm on DNC Technology for my corporate me at a Collie on twitter. And don't speak anything. Corporate there and I'm on. Lincoln are more grown. Yep so which flavor of would you like. Take your pick David Over on twitter at me at S. Y. Taylor on twitter What did you think of today's stories? Let us know twitter. And so I just email podcasts. At Eleven Fest Dot Com and don't forget to vote prison pretty banking already. Thanks you're listening to a boy.

US UK US Banking Europe Google Fintech CEO Goldman Sachs US Bank apple Mr David Brian Marcus India Keith Gross J. P. Morgan
Aaron Urist - You Gon' Get Bit

Dumb People Town

25:05 min | 2 years ago

Aaron Urist - You Gon' Get Bit

"Hey, guys to listen to this show. People town a day early. Here's what you knew you. Download hit the Himalayas app and follow for exclusive. I access damn. What is him Olympia is a brand new podcast app where you can find every single podcast that you love and some that you're probably gonna love in the future. Whether you're a podcast or a fan Himalayas has got your back you discover personally curated playlists and show your favorite podcast or some love. This is a cool option. They have with Himalayas tip jar. So if there's a show you really like on there, you can just say, hey, here's a couple of bucks. I like what you guys are doing other than that though. It's completely free and the easy easiest thing to us. And guess what they're adding cool new features every single day where do you go to your apps store? Download Himalayas that's H I M A L A Y and don't forget to follow dump people town once you're in there. Get shows a day early. It's free. It's super cool were excited that we're partnering with these guys and they're supporting us get Himalayas in the app store. Dan. Jay was fair. Over lacked. My breaking down failed. There's half-price on this day. Podcast with Dan. Body. Stick around. Town. Hey down. He's working to a Friday episode of dumb people town population, you've population Eurest, Aaron Eurest, the Leon Uris of comedy people have said that about you haven't they specifically U2. because Mimos. When you're doing stand up. There's an exodus from the room. Air nearest is one of our favorite people to tour around with and work with we were paired up with him in Denver. Actually, I we checked in with our buddy Adam Cayton Holland in Denver. And we said, hey, man, we need a good feature act for these shows that we're doing out I think it was the one we were out in the landmark on land, Martha hug club. And he said, I got the guy fest. He suggested you, and we always inherently trust that dude you were fantastic. And then we had you come with us to Austin, which was fantastic as well. Love it love it. And you're here you're in LA. I'm so happy you're doing some shows so excited to be here. How how you came and it just immediately started raining. Yeah. Yep. That's what happens. I found negative effect on the weather. You know, the phrase bringing the pain you bring the rain bring the rain, he literally made her and you also bring the funk. Not the noise. No never. I'm very quiet quietly. You're you're quietly fucking. This started out as a joke. But it's actually that is pretty accurate pretty damn person. Well, dude, I'm so happy. You're here. We've got stories. There's dumb stuff out as Laurie got a story. There is dumb stuff happening in the world. And we we need to break it down in the best possible understand it. So that we can try to fight fight it, right? We see it. You you Trevor on your comedian. You see a lot of it everywhere. An incredible amount of the Dennis. And we are aware of it. That's what we do is comedians is try to sort of harness. Instructed try to. Yeah. Turn it into Cologne. Create a serum to fight it. Daniel. What are we got? Let's jump into it and sent in by big Jay mills with a Z. Oh, I wanna party with this guy. Big j mills litter. He's litter dumbness connoisseur big j mills dot gov. Big, Jane, you know, that's everywhere. What a big J J BJ up in the house dog. Else I'm healthy mills. -i north Salt Lake Utah are north Salt Lake Utah. We've been to Salt Lake a California man was arrested in Davis county Utah. So how how did he get their crossing state lines traveled to get there? Yes, he traveled to commit crimes. Really? I won't story. So I don't know why to even product we can do this all day sidestep. Just because I this hit me when I said, you talked twice have you guys watched -ducted in plain sight knows at the Elizabeth smart story know, what it is a documentary about I can't even as am. I because. Out beyond belief, dude, you will want I want. I'm not I wanted. I can't this person down. I'd kill them. I more than one person. There you guys. This is what I wrote. Okay. And I sat on this. This is so important you to put out I sat on this until peak Twitter. Our so I'm like, I'm not burning. Midnight. This is like a noon tweets. Yes. That's so hard to do. And I know I can't control. You can't bad at Twitter. How? A now don't you also have some we were like, oh, this'll be good around one AM. I tweeted out Twitter after door. If you want to keep saying the words this shit can't get any crazier and be wrong. Go watch -ducted in plain sight. I okay, then you will call me up. I'm not sure will especially for anybody listening. I love all you townies. Go watch this documentary tweet at me at the twenty two minute Martineau because that is when that is when everything is going to change am I going to want to go to when we go to Utah to do our shows there find these people and kill them, not angle them in plain sight. We're gonna be so mad rate enraged. And also in disbelief guys, I'm telling the fact, I love that you haven't seen it. And I can't wait for the tax that I know I'm going to get you are you're going to get them. You're going to get you to I want to know what you think I will definitely check it out. Okay. Errands already watching it. I'm during this episode. Stop stop put. Shut up fan. Not lying about that. That was a little out. Okay. A California, man. The sentence. And you guys are gonna love this county. Yes, was was arrested in Davis county, Utah Tuesday after police said he bit another man during an argument about conspiracy theories while they were both in a hot tub. So power you love your story. Aaron you've been given a gift beautiful man while arguing about conspiracy theories in a hot tub is this apres ski ski. Tub. We're sired a conspiracy theorist ski retreat on somebody says conspiracy theories spa wants somebody says I'll tell you what they don't want you to know walkaway. Get out of the hot or if someone starts a sentence with. Well, you know about oh, I know, right? It's be like, I'm sorry. I I'm getting a little in. You know, this isn't really water, right? Get out get out get out. If you said, I know nine eleven was an inside job. And now, here's another inside job you pull down your pants and all right? I'll let you I'll give you that fair bite. Right. That's a bite on the shoulder to get away. Government doesn't want you to know what this rashes. I don't know I'm afraid to the government. According to an affidavit of probable cause released in Utah second district court detectives received a call Tuesday saying a man had been assaulted by Brian David Boyer back here. He debate baby. Brian David Bowie deal. A C K. Check out my Hummel clicks, you know, online. Brian David boy, Boyack, they okay. A man had been assaulted by Brian David boy, I want to know what his conspiracy. What were they arguing over? Do. They even get India's David and a quote large chunk of his ear had been bitten on. Why did we go for the year because he's like I'm your whisper this conspiracy? Microphones in this tub. Is seen in the firm. Music. Still ball still for. Some conspiracies. I. It's like there's microphones everywhere. I mean, like, they're probably was almost like in a burglary. That isn't inside job. I'm not getting conspiracy theory. There is probably no forced entry. So the guy got bit was like, dude, you can whisper it stop grabbing my arm when you talk to let go just let go. Just talk to people to kids fighting in the back of a car on a long car, right? Ready to hear it Brian. Dave boy. Now, you tell him boy. Com slash angel. Fire. My my space. There's nothing there. And that's where the three Mexican band shows left. We're both gonna play fortnight at the same time. We have a good chance of being randomly put into a group. Then I will write the answers in ammo. I will shoot the answers onto a wall. We'll both go to lake we'll both get Jason stop stop. You do know what all these don't. None of us do. Detectives made contact with the victim at the emergency room. The F is David set. She's bleeding and wh and we're told that boy had bitten the victim's ear following a conversation about big corporations and conspiracy theories while the two were in the hot tub this offense greed at one point there were six to seven people in that hot. All cleared out and left this guy with David boy Eck, Brian David boy at this guy was laying down with his eyes close. He must really. Head back head back. And he's like, I don't see what's so bad about Bank of America. Oh boy. You got boy, obviously, you haven't listened to the Wells Fargo episode of the Dow. Jacket. He. Yeah. Came up from under the water like a navy seal. So this is alone. This came up bobbed up took a chunk down. Here. Listen to the Joe Rogan podcast. That's not jet fuel look at that. Reason should've. I seen Kim trails at night black mart. Boy, ACTA sound like a buoyant kayak. Makes sense that this would. Tub in a Cayenne. Oh boy. Oh boy. I is a kayak sized for little boys. Son in a boy, tone, come along. It's only class to rapid. We're gonna take a quick break. When we do. We'll get into more of how these conspiracy stories started. And what happened in the hot tub with the victim and Brian David? Can't wait to dump people down Friday. Around. chop up the Soviet Jay and lineup the blow you gotta date with the devil. I love it already in profiles in eccentricity new star podcast livers debauched biographies of infamous super freaks. You won't believe are real. I love stuff like so as like a demon examining rocket scientists, then how about a trash wording, millionaire brothers. I mean, hey trash starting millionaire. Brother is another's trash shorty millionaire. Rather blind teenage phone hacker who lawyers say a porno samurai killer. I love that as cross dressing nuns on the run a major league baseball team strung out on coke and more. Every other words. Team profiles NS interest is a show about real life. Weirdos hosted by John Fahey, Aaron pita, and Matt Brousseau what an amazing group of dudes. What makes these characters eccentric could be perversion superhuman skill bravery or anything else that sets them apart from the crowd profiles and eccentricity is like scumbag this American life me find it wherever you get your podcasts. This is Ron burgundy telling you to listen to my podcast. Here's a little something to wet your appetite right now, I'm a little terrified because I don't know what a podcast is. Let's take some calls. Caller, number one. You're on with Ron burgundy what's on your mind? No callers. No. Because people aren't listening in realtime Schick got it. If you are listening to this and have downloaded by mistake. Please turn it off. Now, turn it off. No, we have we have some the will cruise here. Okay. All right. Okay. You're Taurus, your horoscope is come on pull you together. You defecate was reduced to my basic angle. Rumba? Vailable wherever podcasts are found. Hey, guys were back. We're our guest is Aaron Eurest before we get back into the story and the conspiracy theory that follow on the old Twitter's and the old Instagram's you are tell them what the. At Aaron guess, you don't really need to say at part is everyone has the era nearest you. Are I S U R? I S T A R O N U R. Oh, I need it. Should we get back into it? Okay. Okay. So guy bit conspiracy theory hot are they gonna David Boya? And it's about corporate corporate victim eating is such an intimate crime. The most intimate the NASDAQ too because it's pushing away maybe a hand might end up near the mouth. But you're in there. I think I head but his intimate. Sure fighting is like. Fires today. Madness kiss the kiss of assault. It's it's literally you saying I wanna put some of you inside. The victim said he worked for big banking business, which I think three people in the hot tub who deaf who knew Brian David Boyack immediately out of here. Get out of here. Saw the end. Questions baby. He just told Brian that he works for big banks. We're we're go three zero three people looked at their arms like they had watches on late. It's getting late. Wow. This hot tubs dirty. The victim said he worked for big banking business, which is too vague. Not a thing big banking business next this guy. I bite his ear say that shit and the conversation became heated to the point where boy act began to pack up his and his family's belongings family that they brought him. They're all relatives staying in this house together. Yeah. They're like it's like some sort of family and Frank d I don't house will there. Yeah. They're outside the house at the hot tub figure. This was in like a. Motel. Six has a functioning. I know we were we've been over this playing ping Lynn. We were talking ping pong in a kind of sweaty steamed up windows, it's great hope in about how much I hate ping pong guy. The victim said he worked for big banking business conversation became heated, the point began to pack up his and his family's belongings and put them in a vehicle, which means it is the middle of the night. This guy is we're in a swim Trump. Yeah. He's dripping every get your. We're going he. He works for big Bank. He got out of the hot tub went to vehicle and came back to the hot to vita via. Yeah. Yeah. You will home owner. That's who's also the victim. I think lot Brian David boy act out of the house because he was acting crazy and didn't want Eck driving, which is also kind of nice at this point. Don't drive crazy guys at this point. So now, let's picture it. Everybody else's gone inside. It's the middle of the night to men are presumed still they didn't take time to dry off. So they're still wet in their swimsuits. One of them is loading shit into his mini van in the middle of the night. Yelling at his family that they're leaving the guy who owns the house also and in his swimming Soo locks the door locks the door to keep him out. And also keep him from his keys. Yes. Chirp at this point boy picked up patio furniture and started throwing it at the front of the house. Why patio furniture in the furniture on it? He was packing up. Etc. All these cutoff shorts and the patio furniture. And the brow on the key is threat to you it right now, the victim stated he went out of the home. Never go out. There. Don't go don't wanna blame a victim here. But you're giving. Three numbers. The second. The first chair hits the front of the house nine you shouldn't better you you work for big Bank business. That's why should know watch game of thrones people if you're in the castle don't open the doors, walls, you that's your position. Don't. Castles, right? Don't open the shit is four five. Yeah. Keep the gates closed. So at this point he starts throwing pattern furniture the house. The victim stated he went out of the home to tell boy act to stop damaging the home. And that's when he was attacked. Yeah. During the attack -tective stated, Brian David boy act held held the victim to the ground and bit off a chunk of his ear. Wow. So it didn't really happen in the hot tub. But okay after the victim was bitten the affidavit stated that Brian David boy got into his truck and drove off without his family his fan. I'm gonna get bit. You gong. Investigators. That to me would be great name for a blue collar comedy album. Brian David voyage own TV show. Game show where it's like, can you? It's all about consoling. Boy boy actors lurking behind the contestants if they say trigger for him. Investigators were unable to locate boy act but were later contacted by him, and he was taken into custody after turning himself in boy X coming in. Says he's coming down to bite us this kind of bit him in the ass deport. Here's what he told officers, quote, I've done something horrible. But I don't want to answer questions that kind of sums up his whole life. He was talking about the biting. Hasn't been nothing to do. Something else boy booked and Davis county jail for one kind of mayhem a second-degree felony. Yeah. He's allstate. Yeah. Three counts of domestic violence and the in the presence of child all third degree felonies one count of criminal mischief class class b misdemeanor and one count of intoxication. They'll get in Utah, John is really bothering classy, Mr.. Oh, you spit. You spit that out on the ground. But boy, don't waste boy. Ready for the buffalo? The boy, it's right us every part of the we're not wasting anything. This isn't big banking, Brian David Boyer back looks exactly. Like how? Yes, you're like. Oh, wait, don't show me. Tell you what I think here buzz cut. Okay. Goatee little bit overweight. Aaron what do you think he looks like but works out he has emollient most of a mullet, but it's a messed up. It's not a well done shirtless. One tattoo on the harm that he did himself. He did it himself. With the bottom of an umbrella patio furniture of of a hot tub. Rather be here rather? You get bit get I think he's got a beard full beard. Crazy curly hair. That is unkempt. And he kinda looks a little like, Mick Foley. Okay. That's that's good. I'm gonna tell you this all three of you are a bit right? Exactly. Exactly, right. This picture will be on the Facebook page, if you're listening to this podcast, and you aren't member of the Facebook page. What are you doing become a member? You get all this great stuff on there. And we let you know when things are happening. Do it right now to become a member you gotta do is? Like it for crisis. Follow it is probably the closest, but you guys all had elephants as soon as I show it to you get me, your guests on how old you think he is. The. Okay. Ready? Oh my God. Let's like the best care to that Colin Farrell's never played. Right. One hundred thirty seven. He. Or close. Well to good, okay? You want to I twenty one ago, David Brian David Boyack, how old and we'll get outta here on that. I'd like to go first ok. Brian, David Boyack. We know him now of the hip podcast you get bit. Don't get bit. Forty one years. Okay. Okay. All right, J, J ran thirty six thirty six from Jason score. That's good. Guess I think he's thirty four thirty four hundred forty one thirty six thirty four. All right nearest goes. When he does live stuff. Don't get your answers in opening for comedians. Like the squad brother, amazing, really talented and a great. Did I go to close dot com? Go to Daniel van Kirk dot com. I ready Brian David Boyle third man, the hates big banks and loves the tastes throws patio. Furniture leaves in the middle of the night. Has a messy mullet. It is it is a stringy mullet. Strand to Carney, Molin car. Sure. He is. Forty three years. Feel so your man. From. Oh, I got the bite Mark. What a great story. Thank you here in yours. Oh shit. We gotta get back to work. Thank you so much. Dumb dumb. Stick around. Strivings? Podcast network.

Brian David David Brian David Boyack Jay mills Utah David boy Eck Twitter Aaron Brian David Boyack Brian David Boyer Himalayas Brian David Bowie Aaron Eurest big Bank Davis county Daniel van Kirk Jason Brian David Boyle Dave boy California
The Pandemic, the President and the 25th Amendment

We The People

51:10 min | 7 months ago

The Pandemic, the President and the 25th Amendment

"I'm Jeffrey Rosen President and CEO of the National Constitution Center and welcome to we the people weekly show of constitutional debate. National Constitution Center is a nonpartisan nonprofit chartered by Congress to increase awareness and understanding of the constitution among the American people. In light of the Kovin diagnosis of president trump and other I ranking government officials. This week's episode explores the Twenty Fifth, amendment which outlines the procedures for presidential succession and disability. Will explore presidential succession throughout history as well as contemporary gaps and issues in the middle of the pandemic and the forthcoming election I'm joined by the two authors of the National Constitution Centers Interactive Constitution Essay on the Twenty Fifth Amendment two of America's leading experts on the amendment and on presidential succession, and we're so honored to have both of them. Brian called is professor of law and the Herald Norris. Faculty scholar at Michigan State University Law School. He's the author of several books including unable the law politics and limits of section four of the twenty fifth, amendment? And David Posen is Vice Dean for intellectual life and Charles Keller Beekman professor of law at Columbia Law School from two thousand, ten to two thousand twelve professor posing served a special advisor to Harold Co legal adviser at the US Department of State Brian David, it is wonderful to have you on the show. Thanks, for having US glad to be. Here. Well let's begin with the Twenty Fifth Amendment itself listeners can check out your common statement on the amendment on the interactive constitution. What problem was the amendment designed to solve and why was drafted? So the Constitution itself does provide very clearly that the vice president is supposed to step in if the president is gone if he's dead if he's removed if he resigned or if he is unable if there's an inability to exercise powers and duties. The problem is that the original constitution didn't provide any standards or processes for saying when the president had such an inability. And in addition, it didn't make it clear whether the president would retake his powers if he were disabled and then recovered and the result was that vice presidents were very unwilling to step in when President Garfield was shot Vice President Arthur didn't ever assume power even when Garfield was completely incapacitated when President Wilson had his stroke and his doctor said, he can't do his job right now members of Congress prevailed upon the vice president to step in. It just it didn't happen and. after a power became president and Had some health issues and realize that this setup was unacceptable that there needed to be standards and procedures. He started the process that led to the twenty Fifth Amendment being passed. And section. Sections. One clarifies that the vice president becomes president when the president is gone if he dies resigns or is removed. Section two allows vice presidential vacancies to be filled, but the the core of it is sections three and four. Second three allows presidents to do what Eisenhower did, which is to say I am unable right now, I'm transferring power to the vice president and then to take power back when he says that he's recovered. So we clarify that the president can retake power and then section four makes it so that if the president can't or won't declare that he's disabled, we have another mechanism for that the vice president and majority of the cabinet can declare the president unable and transfer power to the vice president and again the president. we want the president to be able to come back the drafters aired very heavily on the side of the president coming back. So if the President says, he's okay. Then he eventually takes power back unless the vice president and the cabinet and two thirds of the house and two thirds of the Senate say that he's not any and even then he's still in office he can try again to come back. So it really does solve that problem plugs that whole the constitution left of standards and procedures for a disabled. Incapacitated. President. David in you were joint statement about the twenty Fifth Amendment you and Brian Note that the amendment was designed to answer a series of questions i. what happens if a presidential vacancy arises second? What should happen if a vice presidential vacancy arises third? What happens if the president is unable to discharge the power and duties of the office? And finally the dramatic case of a president WHO's unable to fulfil his role but can't or won't step aside? What else should our listeners know about the answers to those questions and how they were unsettled before the passage of the Twenty Fifth Amendment? Well I'm guessing that readers will be most interested in section three and section sections three and four. Of. The twenty. Fifth Amendment. Because those are the ones potentially relevant to president trump's situation as Brian suggested section three. Creates a procedure by which the president can temporarily transfer power to the vice president and then be ticket when he or she again becomes able to serve and section four is the most controversial provision the longest provisions of the amendment about presidential inability. What's notable here I would say is section three has not been invoked. By president trump notwithstanding that he seems to have been taking some serious medication. Prior presidents have. Invoked section three when undergoing. Routine surgical procedures and then within a period of eight hours or so resumed being president. I'm not sure I haven't seen any reports about whether president trump even considered invoking section three but given at least some of the. News reports about his condition that seems like something that should have been part of the conversation. And Section Four. Addresses the more dramatic situation when the president. Just not. Voluntarily relinquished power for a period of time by the vice president and a majority of the officers of the executive departments. What that means is somewhat unclear. Decide that that the president is unable to serve and initiated this proceeding that WHO's rules we can get into in a moment but. I haven't heard reports of that either vice president, pence and various. Cabinet secretaries thinking about. Whether President Trump is unable and they should initiate section four proceedings. So right now section three and section four lay dormant but they do address the situation when the president is medically are otherwise unable to serve and pending on what is actually the president's health condition right now and who you believe. They, they would seem potentially Germain. Delve into the tough issues raised by the COVID crisis. Brian you wrote a piece for the Atlantic National Constitution, center battle for the Constitution site. The very real problem of both trump and pence getting covid nineteen at the same time. And you note that. If both, the president and vice president were incapacitated by code simultaneously, the result could be a full-scale constitutional meltdown. Tell us why that's the case and what Congress can do about it. Well. The good news before I say how horrible the situation with the good news is that Congress could if it wants of this situation rather easily but the problem is the fact that the twenty Fifth Amendment provides great procedures for transferring power from incapacitated president, the vice president, but it makes no provision for transfers of power past the vice president further down the line succession so If. The vice president is incapacitated to the constitution says, okay. We can have a line of succession for the hat and we do the succession act of nineteen, forty seven. But there are no standards or procedures. So the situation we were in before the twenty Fifth Amendment where no one was quite sure what to do and we aired on the side of having no one in charge. Would potentially recur. So imagine vice president. Pence is also incapacitated at a time when the president has transferred powered him. Nancy Pelosi as speaker of the house is next in line. And if she says A pence's incapacitated I'm in charge and he disagrees we don't have anything in place to resolve that dispute. There's a the additional issue that it's highly. Questionable whether the speaker of the House and the president pro tem of the Senate can be in the line of succession and in a in a sensitive moment where the speakers of the other party can easily imagine members of the president's cabinet who are the next in line after those congressional officials objecting to the speaker. Taking power and that would be A. A failure of the most basic requirement of a succession framework that is we should know exactly and immediately who is in charge at any given moment. A Congress could fix both of these problems very easily. The first one not having any standards or procedures. For Transfers Pass vice-president could be dealt with by adding to the succession statute under the necessary and proper clause Congress could say the line of succession is thus in so and here are the standards and procedures for determining when the vice president or whomever is acting as president is incapacitated and they could use something like section three or section for allow a voluntary transfer allow the cabinet to weigh in allow the Congress to act as a body to resolve any dispute over that, they could pass a statue just like that. And then the problem of the constitutionality of the speaker being next in line could be solved by Congress revisiting these successional I wish probably should be done for a lot of other reasons we could talk about anyway, but but to remove both the speaker and the president. Pro. Tem. And just have the cabinet as the first line first people in line of succession as was the case before nineteen, forty seven. So David, Brian has helped us understand that the biggest legal problem with the current succession law is that it's unconstitutional for legislatures to be in line of succession because he argues in his Atlantic article article to restrict the line of succession to officers. But elsewhere, the constitution distinguishes between members of Congress and officers of the United States. Those constitutional doubts he says led Congress to take the president pro tem and speaker out of the line of succession in eighteen, eighty six but they were put back in in nineteen forty seven Harry Truman's insistence when Congress ignored the constitutional question. Tell us more about this debate about whether or not members of Congress can be. Officers of the United States in the line of succession, and whether it's conceivable that they might be taken out in future succession Axon and also whether the Supreme Court whatever way on this question. Sure. I. Don't think it's clear at all that the current succession statute is unconstitutional. The best. Constitutional evidence that it might be a is the use of the word officer as you say, which at points in the original constitution seems pretty clearly to prefer to executive branch officials and not to someone like the speaker of the House who comes third in line after the president, the vice president. Under the current nineteen, forty, seven statute however. It's only really cleared in the original constitution that officers refers only to executive branch officials when joined with the phrase of the United States and in the presidential succession language that actually doesn't use that further phrase of the United States, just the plain officers and at least two other places in the original constitution. Pretty clearly doesn't compass. Legislative officials. Also state officials actually, and so textually it's just not obvious that officers cannot refer to someone like the speaker of the House. I. Therefore, in addition, Congress's consider judgment in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, seven that it would make sense to have the speaker of the House SP- be next in line. I deserved some weight in the constitutional analysis. Wasn't a decision Congress lightly actually pushed upon Congress, by the then president. So depending on your view of how much difference Congress gets that could cut in favor of the current jeep to that. All said I. think There are there are plausible textual structual arguments that That it is. Unconstitutional. The way we've designed it. Viewing The constantly should be somewhat of a wash as I do or at least very hard. I'm content to fall back on policy considerations and just note that it seems like a bad idea to least to me to have the speaker of the house come after vice president in a hyper polarized h when the parties are so neatly divided on. Ideological grounds. It strikes many Americans I think is very odd that the speaker of the house it could be from another party would take over after the vice president rather than someone more in line with adminstration's. Policy Program so Bracketing the constitutional issues it seems to me Congress ought to reconsider. The current, the current statute, just the just on policy grounds and part of it is the oddity of who would take over as part of it is what Brian suggested about. teeing up potentially nasty and. Unproductive fights about about WHO's next to mind you're less likely to have that kind of conflict. If it's say the secretary of state who would come after the vice president I, think precisely because it would be. An executive branch official from the same pardon so So. I find a policy. It's more powerful than a constitutional arguments. In. Favor of some kind of perform. Brian you also flag the policy arguments, your Atlantic peace, and you know that a sudden transfer of presidential power from one party to the other would be jarring. The new acting president was struggled for legitimacy. Imagine power suddenly shifting from trump to Pelosi where President Obama to Speaker Paul. Ryan which would. Produce perverse incentives for the White House to cover up or sugarcoat the president or vice president's medical conditions. Tell us about the history of congressional decisions to put members of Congress in the line of succession beginning with the first presidential. Succession. Act which included the president pro tempore of the Senate followed by the speaker with no provision to replace. Vice. President. The Second Presidential Succession Act in eighteen eighty six which turn the presidency over two cabinet members in the order the creation of their respective departments and then the forty-seven act which put members of Congress back in unpack this history and then speculate about whether you can imagine congress ever taking their own members out of succession and putting it back to the cabinet. So the seventeen ninety to act. Is Very important because many of the members of the constitutional convention were part of the Congress drafting that law. And and many of them objected many of them voted against it and one of the sticking points was that the. Congressional officials were in line The problem was the logical choice other than that. The secretary. Of State was Thomas Jefferson who a lot of the. Federalist didn't like and so it was partly on those political grounds that they did not have the secretary of state in the line at all. It was just the president pro tem just the speaker they considered the constitutional. They thought it was okay and as David mentioned, it does say in the Constitution that the house can choose the speaker and other officers. The Senate chooses president time other officers. The interesting thing about that is though that the speaker and the President Pro Tem, the only officers who are members the other officers are people like the door keeper and the sergeant at Arms. So it would be odd if the sergeant at arms could be in line of succession, but the Senate majority leader couldn't because he's he's not an officer. So, there were two problems with the seventeen ninety to act one this constitutional issue and to it only had two people in it, and when President Garfield died and Chester became president at that moment there was no. President Pro Tem of the Senate the Senate had deadlocked and not. been able to choose one and the house hadn't convenient. So hadn't chosen a speaker. So on Chester Arthur was president there was no one else in line if he had died than this would have been very problematic. So not long after that the eighteen eighty six act passed took the congressional officials outlined succession because in part because of the constitutional concerns and added the cabinet. nine, hundred and forty seven while actually nineteen forty-five immediately President Truman said, this is a problem. He didn't like his Secretary of State all that much He also didn't like the idea that an unelected official like the secretary of state would be next in line someone chosen by the president rather than someone elected like the speaker of the House. SO he convinced Congress to change it. Of course they switched it. So the speaker was first done the president from him and then they had the cabinet in there too. So we at least have more backup. But that concern about having someone elected next in line sort of Fades away when the Twenty Fifth Amendment is passed in nineteen, sixty, seven because section. Two of the twenty-fifth amendment allows the president to fill a vice presidential vacancy. By Appointment Now unlike a cabinet officials only confirmed by the Senate a vice presidential nominee has to be confirmed by the House and Senate. But the fact remains that the constitution chose by adding that provision to make the next in line someone who is appointed and not elected, and of course, when Gerald Ford became vice president under that provision, he was not elected and then he became president under Section One of the twenty Fifth Amendment when Nixon resigned. So the the idea that the people in life succession have to be elected doesn't make as much sense anymore but congress has been very sensitive about the idea of taking its leaders speaker in particular out of the line of succession. Any suggestion of doing that is usually treated not as a sober policy recommendation but as an attack on the speaker. Him Or herself and and they jealously guard that prerogative. It's hard to have a neutral principles conversation about it. But I think that if we're in a situation where the president and Speaker of the same party, which most of the time since nineteen, forty seven, they haven't been but but often they are and we have some impetus towards good government reforms in in Congress. There's a thirst for for that sort of thing if. It's on the agenda is I think it might be after the current crisis. There I think there is a possibility that they could rethink that. And I'm hopeful that they would. David on the policy question what stars would have to align for Congress to reform the succession. Presumably, you need a president and Congress of the same political party that wanted to avoid the possibility that in the future of the presidency might pass to the speaker of the opposite Party Can you imagine the succession law in fact being amended and how should be amended? Strategists. Definitely. Don't have a crystal ball, but but I. I could I could surmise that one scenario in which Congress might be moved to revise. The statute is just what you say that There's there were there were intimations of fight brewing over a succession when the parties were divided across the house in the presidency. Parties become unified in a future period and A. Change of statue perhaps with some kind of. Closet at has it take effect only five years into the future at which point it won't be clear what the party configuration will be in the house in the executive branch. So that's good governance mode of reform a second in more grim. Vision frankly is. One objection to the current. Statutory scheme some have raised is at partisan zealots could be motivated to try to kill the president and vice president. In a situation where they want the speaker of the House who's from their party to take over. If anything like that horrible situation were to. Arise thus illustrating dramatically the some of the perversities of the of the current scheme. I could also see that catalyzing reform Brian. Now, let's turn to another. What happens if a candidate for president dies before the election? After. The election but before the electoral college votes or after the electoral, college votes in the South Load decision where the Supreme Court unanimously held that states could prevent electors from voting for candidates over than those they're pledged to for justice. Kagan out of footnote saying nothing in this opinion should be taken to permit the states to bind electors to a deceased candidate. What is the significance of that footnote and take us through the various scenarios of the President Dying Before the election after the election. But before the electors meet and after the electric me Justice Kagan's footnote turn. Our attention immediately to the one time that something like this happen which was eighteen seventy two horace. Greeley. The Democratic candidate had lost the election but before the electoral college met Greeley died and so the members of the Electoral College didn't know what to do on the party didn't really coordinate anything. So they scattered their votes, most of them voted for. A variety of candidates including his running mate, but mostly for others. Three electors voted for Greeley, even though he was already dead. And when Congress assembled count those votes, the standard they had at the time was that if either house objected to votes being counted electoral votes been counted, they wouldn't be counted. The Senate voted overwhelmingly to count votes for Greeley. The the House voted by very slim margin not to count them. The result was a precedent but very weak precedent was set not to count votes cast for someone WHO's already dead Sometime later, the Electoral Count Act of eighteen, Eighty, seven change these procedures, and now it's required that if if the state sends in votes and all proper inform. Untimely then they are counted unless both houses agreed to not count them. So under that standard, the Greeley President would have happened further weakening that standard. So what would happen if a candidate died? Early, on the party would replace that candidate both parties have rules for replacing candidates. The DNC says the members of the DNC choose a new candidate. The RNC has something similar. So the party leadership would. Hunt, hundreds of people, but but would convene in and choose a replacement candidate if the ballots could be changed in time than the ballots would be changed if the balanced if the ballots can't be changed in time, then we have people voting for someone whose dad with the understanding the Parties WanNa get the message out clearly and quickly with the understanding that the electors if the if the dead candidates ticket wins in a state that lectures in that state would vote for some other particular person It would be the running mate who after all is selected to be the understudy but the party rules don't limit them to that and they could conceivably choose someone else but there is the issue of the electors being bound to cast their votes for whoever won and so someone could argue. President presidential candidate a was on the ballot he won. You can't cast your ballots ear electoral votes for presidential candidate be the. Justice Kagan's footnote suggests that states might easily be able to sort of step back and say, oh obviously, this situation is different. This isn't someone just going rogue both randomly for someone else. But the states would would probably need to do something they do something in advance to make it clear that this would be okay. But the there would be that potential bump in the road. Now. If the electors cast their votes and then someone dies that we we have clearly provided for in the constitution the. Twentieth Amendment Section three says if the president elect DIS the Vice president-elect swears in on January twentieth as as president and if both the. President elect and vice president elect die or if the head if they haven't been chosen right that that matters as well. Then Congress can have a line of succession for that, and Congress has chosen used the same line of succession. So the speaker would act as president. For the term if they were both dead or until for a couple of weeks until the election was settled, if that's the issue. And interestingly, there is not a constitutional issue because in the twentieth amendment, it says Congress can say what person would act as president not what officer so it could be anyone. So that at least although it's still problematic to have the speaker as next in line for other reasons, the constitutional objection would fall away in the situation would be handled. I think fairly straightforwardly David how do you the significance of justice, Kagan's footnote in casting light on whether or not electors can vote for a candidate who's deceased, and then let's turn to the central question of this podcast. Namely issues arising about presidential disability under section four of the twenty Fifth Amana. Great. Justice cakes footnote. In that opinion court is unanimously affirming the power of States to buy their electors to vote in certain ways. But I view the footnote as a kind of green light both to states and to individual electors in the unusual and unfortunate situation where the candidate who wins the majority vote in the state becomes incapacitated not to feel bound to vote for someone who may even be deceased. So it's kind of common sense carve out to the general principle that states can bind their electors. So that if If an elector finds herself in that situation she can have confidence that sanctions for example, aren't going to be imposed on her sanctions tend to be mild in any event in those states where they exist at all sports seems to be signaling here not to not to worry or also to encourage states to reform the house accordingly on the big issue. About what is, what does it mean for President? Unable, under the twenty Fifth Amendment. The first thing I'd say is it striking that the twenty Fifth Amendment doesn't try to define that term it is a very detailed procedural scheme that it sets out in section four whereby the vice president with a majority of what's basically the cabinet if they agreed to the presence unable. They they can force the issue of the President acquiesces than vice president takes over as acting president if the president opposes it goes to Congress. Two thirds vote in both both chambers of Congress pursuant to a certain time line very detailed on the procedural side at a very high bar, but the term inability is never defined. And my reading of the Legislative History of the twentieth amendment is that the framers of it made a conscious decision not to try to find that term, they wanted to leave it open for future professional and in some cases, medical judgment and political judgment I. Think it's Useful, therefore, to contrast the twenty fifth section for two two things that it is not. I it's not impeachment. So we have a separate procedure in the constitution for officials including the president who have committed high crimes and misdemeanors. And on that basis, they can be removed. So it's not it's not a judgement about those kinds of. A misdeeds. Second it is not a lot of other countries us, which is a no-confidence mechanism. So in the UK or Canada or South, Africa many other countries. Parliament can decide that they have no confidence anymore in the head of state. Because performing badly say and It also seems clear from the history, the twentieth amendment that it wasn't meant to be a vehicle to let. Other. Political officials just express of you that the president's doing poorly. Botched a trade agreement or gave a terrible speech or what have you? Down in the polls. So it somewhere in between that space of of. Wrongdoing and bad performance. The paradigm cases are President who's in A. Coma. Or kidnap that came up in the history clearly unable to give directions as president but in a situation where the president might be somewhat impaired because of medical treatment they're receiving. It the framers of the twenty Fifth Amendment really punted at issue to to the future and it didn't guided today thought that people would just responsibly assess in an all things considered fashion, how the president's doing and enact accordingly in practice it seems vice presidents are very reluctant to to use section for. Less, they seem like usurpers. But. We are. Left Adrift. In interpreting this language because there was a decision not to decide what it means at the time it was written. Brian. What have we learned about the limits of section four twenty, fifth amendment in light of situations where vice presidents are reluctant as David says to usurp and in your book unable the law politics and limit subsection four of the twenty-fifth amendment. Can you cast any additional light about situation where the president is seriously impaired by illness, but refuses to certify that he's disabled and the vice president also refuses to certify. If If we have a situation like that I think David is right. It's a gray area in the framers of the amendment definitely wanted us to air on the president's side. There's a strong presumption that once your president, your president unless something really extreme happens. and by not choosing a standard and instead choosing a procedure and and designating certain decision makers I think the answer is there two thirds in the house and two thirds in the Senate means substantial numbers of the president's own party would need to lack confidence in his capacity. And that's that's setting the bar very high. So what would have to happen? In those situations where the president is impaired enough for it to be a big problem. But not impaired so much that he wouldn't contest the action so that it would go to Congress. Is that members of the president's own party would have to step up the vice president and the Cabinet are reluctant to overthrow even if only provisionally the president in part because if if the president objects they're in big trouble, the cabinet could all be fired the vice president's. Career could be over. If you shoot at the king. You, you must hit him to paraphrase Emerson. and. So I I think that there there would need to be some sort of. Communication either public were through private channels from key. Members of the President's Party in Congress encouraging the vice president cabinet and saying look, this is the situation is not okay. We know you'd be sticking your neck out. If you did this we we will support the action if you do this and only then would would a the vice president and cabinet be I. Think Comfortable taking that step knowing that if Congress backs the mop including members of their party. Then it would be okay. The alternative is so not okay that I don't think they would proceed without an assurance of that sort. So I think I think that's the key and It would be very hard for that kind of communication to happen the president gets wind of that. He can. He can fire the cabinet which could cause all sorts of problems besides just. The Twenty Fifth Amendment Problems, David Brian says. Two thirds of both houses of Congress gave the vice president and the cabinet covered they might be inclined to transmit a declaration of inability over the president's objections. There's another part of the section four of the twenty Fifth Amendment that says whenever the vice president and a majority of either the principal officers of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may provide transmit to the president pro tempore of the Senate and so forth, the declaration of inability. Should Congress create a body of disability to avoid the situation where the cabinets reluctant to side with the vice president or we need an entirely different mechanism for disability that excludes the vice president and cabinet and puts the decision entirely in the hands of two thirds of both houses of Congress great. I tend to favor a different mechanism. So it's true under section four Congress could by statute create another body other than the vice president and the cabinet that would make these inability terminations. There was some notion when the twenty Fifth Amendment was drafted that there would be medical professionals involved in that determination though not not exclusively on that body, but they'd have perhaps some real informing. Political judgment that would be made a congress has never used that authority and it would be extremely. Difficult to compose such body. If it were done in the heat of the moment with a particular president being thought to be potentially unable you can also imagine how. Divisive that could be I. Bryant says the the main mechanism set out in section for which in which vice president is the indispensable actor and the first mover but has to overcome this serious coordination problem where if you're vice president is crazy to initiate section four proceedings unless you've already have some confidence that a majority of the cabinet and Super Majorities of both houses of Congress are going to agree with you about the president being unable should the present contest you know it's it's a, it's a very difficult burden. On the vice president to overcome that coordination problem and it's an extremely difficult voting threshold in both houses of Congress higher than the impeachment threshold needed to get two-thirds in the house not just in the Senate. So what we're finding I think is at section four a is quickly becoming useless except in situations that having arisen yet thankfully, where the president is in no position to contest the judgement perhaps you see a coma again was the paradigm case that the framers the twenty Fifth Amendment, some of them had in mind so. I I favor a going the Commonwealth route in the no confidence vote where we take some pressure off the determination of medical physiological or other inability. This term that's proven extremely difficult to define. And carries a kind of taint arguably. and. That presidents are going to be motivated to contest and vice-principal have difficulty mustering coalitions around. I think we can learn from other countries who have said you know we don't need to find that the president is. Unable to perform the job pursuant to some quasi medical notion, you know we can just ask the president doing a terrible job according to ordinary political and policy considerations. Brought in the inquiry lower, the voting threshold and introduced a no-confidence mechanism of some sort into into our system I. think that would be healthy performed quite separate from these issues about health that we're talking about now with with occurred presidency. And in pursuant to that inquiry. We can imagine. A lot more action around this issue and and Not necessarily being stuck with the president who hasn't necessarily committed impeachable offenses and isn't necessarily completely unable to perform the job but is just Doing a terrible job I think that it'd be a democratic reform that would also respond to what we're learning about section four and how it's. How it's so limited in practice Brian what do you believe we've learned about the limits of section four, take us through any additional limits that we haven't covered. Some have suggested that if members of the cabinet are not Senate confirmed and they can't be part of this disability body is that right or not, and in light of what we've discovered do agree with David Alternative of a no confidence vote mechanism or would you prefer other reforms I think that? What people are learning about the the limits of section for have always been there that is. The framers intended for it to be only very extreme situations that it that it'd be used. Whether that decision still holds up whether we should have a lower threshold as David suggest I'm not sure the Commonwealth model is a little different because our system is premised on fixed four year terms. vote of no-confidence would topple presumably in parliamentary system not necessarily just the leader but also the the government we might have to have an election at that point. I, don't know if that works here although you know we could translate it into our system and say, we don't have confidence in the president So handed over to the vice president and we can fight about who the new vice president would be and and it would go through that. I do think that there are some reasons to think that we might want to clarify some things about section four, and the one you mentioned about acting secretaries is is important so. the section four doesn't mentioned the cabinet by name, it talks about the principal officers of the executive departments. And another place executive department. There's a Typo some copies of the constitution of a footnote they're explain that it's a Typo but up the executive departments are. Defined by statute the framers understood this this this. Currently. Five USC Section One one lists the fifteen departments stayed treasury. Defense and so on down to homeland security. So it's the heads of those fifteen departments, not cabinet level folks like the trade representative or the chief of staff. So it's just those fifteen people and then who are the principal officers of these executive departments what if they're not Senate confirmed what if they are acting? A couple of things about that one out this question arose during the debates about the amendment, and there's a house committee report that says clearly that acting secretaries would be able to participate. They are the principal officers of the department there running the department. However, they got there they are in charge. but on the Senate side during the floor debate senator by Birch by who was basically the father of the twenty Fifth Amendment said that he didn't think acting secretaries would participate. So it it really is. Unclear In practical terms, it doesn't really matter that much though first of all acting secretary is usually are Senate confirmed for whatever lower level post they hold. That allows them to be acting sectors they don't have to be but typically they are, and currently we only have one acting cabinet member, Chad Wolf at Homeland Security. There's some question as to whether he is the legitimate acting secretary or not. But he is Senate confirmed but here's why it doesn't matter. If he can vote than okay. He can vote if he can't vote then he'd also be taken out of the denominator. So it's not that you need eight votes it's you need a majority of. The principal officers and if there are only fourteen of them, then you need eight of that fourteen. If there's only nine of them, then you'd only need five. You wouldn't need eight out of nine you'd need just a majority. And practically speaking, you would almost never have that close vote. On certain because it turns on with eight, two seven and the eighth vote is an acting secretary that's not likely to happen if the president is in a coma then you're not gonNa have an eight to seven vote. It'll be probably fourteen or fifteen to nothing. And if the president is in a more ambiguous situation than as as we've already said that the vice president cabinet aren't going to go forward unless they're confident that the congressional vote would go their way to and an ambiguous eight two seven vote if if that's the. Facts on the ground that they're facing. They probably wouldn't go forward with that. They would probably need unanimity or near unanimity in more ambiguous case too. So It would be helpful if we had some clarification on. That it's the core fifteen members of the cabinet and that acting account or that acting, don't count or whatever to figure that out an advanced so that we're not deciding while the vote is taking place who count who doesn't but Other than that, I think the section four is working the way it was intended with whether that's Whether that limited scope is is good or not is I think a separate question I'm not sure. It's it's hard to amend the constitution. I'm not sure that we could change it that easily. David. Will. The last word in this really illuminating conversation is to you the Constitution Centre hosted a podcast in February twenty seventeen in honor of the anniversary of the twenty fifth amendment and Norm Ornstein Akilah. Mar focused on problems relating to the line of succession imagining. Speaker and the president and the vice president all being killed in catastrophic attacks on America in light of Covid crisis have we learned about additional laws in the amendment arising from disability of the President Vice President leading up to the election and what thoughts would you like to leave our listeners with about potential areas of reform? Thanks well, I guess I'll return. The focus to the twenty fifth amendment just because they're many reforms that might be made. We talked about the presidential succession F act of nineteen forty seven. What states might do with their laws binding their electors when candidate who wins the vote becomes incapacitated subsequently. I think a lot of practical reforms that might be useful but on the twenty Fifth Amendment side. I tend to agree with Brian that for the purpose for which it was designed. It sets a very high bar makes it extremely difficult to remove the president and that makes sense I. Already said I favor a broader no-confidence mechanism that would allow us to judge the President's whole performance and not just focused on this issue of inability But within the framework of the Twenty Fifth Amendment, it seems to me. The bigger issues are not these technical debates. Brian noted like do acting secretaries count as principal officers for purposes of the body. Vice President needs to get a majority vote from the bigger issues. I think are are more cultural. Outside of the text of the amendment. So what I'm thinking of here is in all of the pop culture depictions of which I'm aware where section four is used in TV shows like House of cards and twenty four in movies like the enemy within. It's part of a Machiavelli plot by the vice president to essentially steal the presidency from a president really probably could go on performing the role and. Therefore the section for has kind of become tainted in pop culture these to those who are following those Those TV shows movies as a potential vehicle for This kind of bad behavior by vice presidents and cabinet secretaries, and in reality I think the issue is actually the inverse vice presidents are terrified to section for because, they would have to assemble such a broad coalition to possibly use it successfully against resisting president and. Turn out very for them if they if they can't get there. So. I I I. I hope that culturally people will come to appreciate that given the procedural constraints on section for. The risk is probably under-use not overuse quite the opposite of what the TV show in Second Section three, which we haven't talked about much allows the president voluntarily to temporarily transfer power to the vice president when he feels he's unable to discharge the duties. Including for medical reasons. That has also rarely been used and in this case. I am not clear why president trump didn't consider doing that. When he was going to be taking some serious medication to deal with a covert. And they're see I I assume it's because it's inconsistent with the kind of strong leader image he wanted to project but I view that as a kind of democratic failure as well. It's not weakness I think to admit that you're temporarily incapacitated because of medical issue you're. Gonna Retake power soon as you're able. That that wasn't even part of the conversation as far as I'm aware. Seems to me to to. Be. Speaking another pathology here, which is the kind of association of East and President Trump's mind was of section three with weakness. I think that's that's quite wrong. As well, so I I'm more worried about the kind of cultural and political dynamics around the non use of the twenty Fifth Amendment than around its procedural design which quibbles aside seems to me. Pretty well done for what it's intended to do. Thank you so much Brian called and David posing for a rigorous thoughtful and eliminating discussion of the strengths and weaknesses of the twenty-fifth amendment. Brian David, thank you so much for joining. Thank you. Thank you. Today show was engineered by David Stotts and produced by Jackie McDermott research was provided by Mac Taylor Ashley Kemper on Lana Laura. Please rate review and subscribe to we the people on Apple podcasts and recommend the show to friends, colleagues or anyone who is hungry for constitutional debate. Thanks so much dear reader people, friends to those of you who have taken the time to post reviews. And always remember that the National Constitution Center is private nonprofit. We rely on the generosity engagements and passion and emails and hunger for constitutional learning of people like you from across the country were inspired by our nonpartisan mission, the constitutional education, and debate we the people friends your emails are so meaningful. Please continue to write in and tell me what you think about particular constitutional points raise on the show. This civil dialogue that we're engaged him is as we all know more important than ever, you can support our mission becoming a member of the Constitution Centre dot org forward, slash membership, or give a donation of any amount our work to this podcast, it constitution center dot org forward slash dunning. On behalf of the National Constitution Center I'm Jeffrey.

vice president president Congress President Trump Brian David vice president and cabinet cabinet President Vice President President Garfield President Truman Senate David Brian President and CEO President Wilson president and Speaker acting president President Pro Tem President Pro Tem President
Steelers Preview: How the Steelers' 2020 offseason game plan is changing

Behind the Steel Curtain

53:53 min | 1 year ago

Steelers Preview: How the Steelers' 2020 offseason game plan is changing

"Pittsburgh steeler fans welcome back to another episode of the steelers preview. I am Jeff Harmon editor of behind the steel curtain dot com and with me. Just one person right now. That's Mr David Goofy. Deputy editor David Deputy Dave. Deputy that kind of sounds? I like that deputy Dave. What's also deputy dog got an? I'm doing good. Hey have you been have you turn tuned into NFL network to watch one second of the combat? Yeah neither now I've been getting kids to bed. I've been trying to prepare for the show. I have not I had I did see university online. Sukkur dot com the the open thread. is has a lot of comments. That's great. I'm glad that people were tuning into both the combine and behind the curtain dot com to talk about it amongst the community members. That's really cool and we'll do it open threat for every day of the combine said tomorrow night Saturday night. Check it out behind. The Steel Curtain Dot. Com should be your one stop shop for all your Pittsburgh Suzanne. You might be wondering what? O'brien Anthony Davis is he tubing something he might he? He's opposed to join US late We'll see when he gets here but we are going to press on. The schedule is not GonNa Change. We will have an after party. We will still do our steelers preview today. We're going to preview the wide receiver position. We're going to do that last week. Because of the free agent talk got a little out of hand. We pushed it back to this week. So we're going to start off with though we're not going to start off with the wide receivers. We want to start off with the steelers offseason plan and I think that if you ask most steeler fans heading into this offseason. What's the plan and they would give you the well. There's not a lot of cap room you know. What are you GONNA do? But depre- who knows about Ben Rothlisberger? I think you would say the majority of fans would say that right. Dave yeah okay. The plans changing the changing. It's evolving in front of our very eyes for a lot of reasons that we WANNA talk about. First Being Ben Rothlisberger Elise from the peanut gallery and peanut gallery meeting the fan base seeing whether privy to which is one pass of football. It looks like he's back. Kevin Colbert at the combine. Says that he thinks that he's going to be back in eighty better than ever. That might be some smoke being blown but still that's what he said And so that changes things to end. How in your opinion? How does that change? The steelers aussies plans drastically. Because I still don't think that the steelers were going to be in the market. Some people wanted them to get a more reliable backup quarterback. I'm like they're spending too much money on that position. Already with Ben Rothlisberger. They've got to roll with what they have. And you just hope hope that it's banned and if not then it's another year of what we had but I still want to keep his defense intact because I don't think it's going to change too much what they're doing as much as it is. Excitement of how far they can go with what they have if you know what I mean. Does that make sense from a defense standpoint? I agree from an office standpoint. I think it changes a lot because let's be honest. If you're looking at the draft in in Ben Rothlisberger has not been cleared even throw yet or he's only able to throw a tennis ball. Light tennis ball like barely. Just getting that motion down. The steelers might have some might be hesitant in terms of who they draft in how they draft in my opinion. Mrs My opinion. Everyone's entitled to their own. I can say you mean offensively. Yeah because I think right now you gotta be jacked up. They gotTA think we. We need some playmakers now. Well let's just say this. I think whether Ben was healthy or ben wasn't ofensive line was going to be an important there. You know 'cause somebody else you need a better off. It's of line even if you want to. You know it's they need to recycle. Need to get more guys coming in and doing their thing with offensive line. I think where it makes. The biggest difference is tied Enin Receiver. And how you want to address that. I think it's GonNa make a difference. I mean he's technically still counting on the salary cap. Everything Vance McDonalds a big question because they have to decide here in the next couple of weeks. Are they going to exercise their club option for him for this year? I think Ben Rothlisberger. I don't know which way they're going to go with it. But that definitely comes into play with what they're thinking than what they're going to do in the draft at that position. I mean to me with young wide receivers. They have if they're if it looked like they didn't know if they were going to have been. I almost think it would have been a waste to go wide receiver in the draft but now with band. You're like well if we can. If the right weapons there at the right spot then pull the trigger on it and you know get them everything you can't yeah exactly. And so does not. Also forget advancement. Donald is really good friends of Ben Rothlisberger. They're very tight. There's to Bible study. They hang out there wiser friends. We say it all the time. Ben Controls a lot about the roster when we saw the West Virginia basketball game with Ryan Switzer. What did I say Ryan Switzer? Am next year? Just because that's I guess that's the way it goes but I think offensive line is obviously going to be paramount. No matter what but now with Dan looking like he could be back. The steelers are saying all the right things not that we would ever expect them to not say the right things like you said tight end wide receiver. Had they address? That do they trust themselves to get a an offensive lineman like a bj. Finney like mad. Filer like a Kelvin Beecham. Someone that they think has a ton of upside in the back end of the draft. I'm not so sure because those guys although they drafted a lot of them and I didn't name all of them that they've had play for them. Even a guy like Chris Hubbard or one hundred Illinois. Ueva there's been some that haven't panned out to. Let's not forget that and in let's also not forget that nothing is a guarantee in the draft and regardless of whether it's first and third or seventh unit look at Gaddum's Ground Traffic. That didn't pan out so we all can sit here and wax poetic about what position they should or shouldn't draft or specific prospects in and things like that and and that's the hot button. Take right now because the the scouting combines going on and everyone just falls in love with these numbers whether it's a bench press number forty are dash number Everyone is is enamored with it. And there's a reason why the NFL put it in prime time but at the same time. There's so much more to it. But we'll talk about the combine in a second. There's another factor that could change this dealers aussies plans and it's actually a very large factor in. There's a lot of facets to this and a lot of mainstream media are not focusing on all of that and that would be the collective bargaining agreement between the NFL in the NFL pa. Which in case you haven't been paying attention has now gone to vote by the players. All they need is majority vote. That's it just a majority vote. It's gone through all the facets every the player reps all that stuff just a majority now players don't have to vote. They should exercise their right to vote but they don't have to so the lawyers everything I heard on the radio today was the NFL lawyers and the NFL. Pa LAWYERS ARE GONNA fast track this over the weekend. Get it out to the players. Hopefully by the end of the weekend so that next week we should know one way or the other. But this can impact a lot. Dave and explain that a little bit. Yeah what is it impacts a lot right now. Is that today's started the the period for what is it. It's a two week period. I'm pretty sure Of designated the franchise or transition tags on players. Now I didn't hear any. I wasn't looking at other teams but I haven't heard anything of teams using the tag yet. Remember just rumors. Yeah there's nothing official Jesus are GONNA use it but nothing official. Yeah and the reason that teams especially teams like the steelers are GonNa wait is if they can they're still operating under the final year the CBA the lawyers met to see if they could change anything before. This started because the players are voting. But I think if they got a field that it was definitely going to get past they might have done some stuff but they're still kind of up in the air. It's not as as cut and dry. It could be so right now. Teams can use both franchise and transition tag. That's one thing. The other thing is kind of like the boat that the steelers are in right now pretty much because of the thirty percent rule with restructuring contracts or any new contracts teams only option to save cap. Money is to release now. You look like steelers. If they wanted to use a franchise tag on either buddy pre or hargrave that. They don't have the room to do it so they would have to cut players but if there's a new CBA and they could say. Oh we can maybe restructure something then they might not have to release someone that they are not sure what they want to do this so it a lot of that comes comes into play and how they have to figure stuff out so getting a new. Cba what allow the steelers franchise to conduct business as usual much more than what they have to do right now. Right in the dentist in the life. That no one's fretting over the AIDS business as usual. Yes it is but in terms of making these key decisions which can have a ripple effect on your roster. It does matter. It does matter well. I shouldn't you know. Sometimes I try to stay off the comments on social media whether it be facebook or twitter whatnot but I would just say things that aren't really informed for like all the steelers they just push money down the road and restructure a few contracts. You can't do it this year. You can't do it. The only person you could really restructure to get any kind of money is Ben Rothlisberger and I was. I did the math and and confirmed it with a couple of other sources. I got a number three point. Two million out Ben's thirty three and a half million the only thing they can push around to save this year of that would be three point. Two million that's really all that's available in restructures right now under the under the current deal came. Hey we're going into the last year his deal it would be great to get him another deal especially one. That's most of the time when guy signed a new deal. The first year is very low on the cat because most of its signing bonus. He's he's t needs new deal. They can't get rid of Camp Cam. Yeah but they but right now. They're so handcuffed with this thirty percent. Roll getting him deal now. Isn't going to help anything. So that's the thing there's just there's a lot of business. The steelers usually do stuff that they can't do and Dennis responded to my kinds of what matters? Jeff is that we ain't got no money. No not right now. But they could. Could they could bring up money. Yeah because a buddy and the steelers have done that for years right. Now they're handcuffs. We'll see we'll see what happens with the collective bargaining agreement and I don't WanNa get well we might as well. I think it was snowman earlier in the latch. Yes he said the players saving complaining about the CPA. Let's rephrase that can I? Can I go hold on? Let me rephrase with not all players the the players that are the upper echelon have been complaining. You're talking about your top couple of percents right. Your vast majority of players in the National Football League. I guarantee you are not complaining. They're seeing this as seventeen games. Another game check a bump up from the veteran minimum. That's more money. They're seeing better benefits. They like it everything they will even even goes down to in again unless you've read some of these documents which we've posted on behind his so curtain dot com it even goes down to the NFL's including tuition reimbursement. If you want to go back to school and get your degree. They're going to pay for classes. That's not being discussed. But that's part of this collective bargaining agreement and no one's talking about it all they're hearing or JJ Watt Russell Wilson. Richard Sherman Marquees. Pouncey of all people just spouting off endlessly about hated. James Harrison's chiming in James Harrison. You're retired. Why do you care help you James Harrison the entire stuff for for retired players? All right go okay. First of all. I'm going to try to stay calm. If any of you out there really WanNa know there are two members of the Pittsburgh steelers. You need to be paying attention to and what they say. And those members are Ramon Foster and Cam Hayward Ramon foster is the player Rep for the Steelers Cam. Hayward is the alternate player ramp. So some people like. Oh what happens? If the steelers cut foster it's came hayward okay both of these guys and I have an article coming out tomorrow. Thank you told me to schedule it. For eight forty five. Am about it's very interesting. They didn't say how the steelers voted. But if you WANNA look at how both of those players have reacted to other things because obviously i. I'm I'm sure they communicated with what they needed to do you. Could you could draw the conclusion that it's pretty obvious that they voted for this proposal. And for example the thing that's frustrating about all these players and some of the media people and even some of the Pittsburgh media people one in particular keep saying stuff on twitter about about this awful terrible. I'm like please explain what's terrible about it. You can sit back and say it's awful. Tell me why. And that's what's happened with. All these players to their saint like pouncey all heard was F. bombs and s bombs and everything else but still nothing about why it's so terrible especially not respecting the negotiating process. And that's the biggest thing that fosters about respect the process that we've gone through the only person that really offered anything as to. Why was Aaron Rodgers? Who said that? He felt that that there wasn't a enough reduction of offseason voluntary workouts. And you know who stepped up? He didn't address him directly but made tweets about it was cam hayward he's like yeah. Why your people complaining about about having too many ball and Terry workouts? If it's bad for body guess what it's voluntary don't do it. Yeah you know. Don't complain. About how many voluntary workouts there are when they're voluntary. I mean if he took the voluntary off I'd understand. They went back where they fought with the owners. I don't know how far out should say where they met with the owners this week earlier this week on Tuesday. They took out the cap of the number that they had for how much players would be paid for seventeenth game once they implemented. They were working on a contract that was signed before this. Cba They took it out so now everyone no matter how much you make. They add a seventeenth game. You get a seventeenth paycheck based on what your salary is so if you look at both sides the owners want three things from what I understand. Now there's probably a lot more into this but the NFL PA is releasing this other stuff and of course the NFL is going to release all the stuff that makes them look. Good if you WANNA go back at an article this afternoon. Fifty six bullet points of what the players are getting fifty-six this players this is former players. Everything all these things in for the players the main three things that the that the that the owners want is they want the seventeenth game. They want an extra team in the playoffs from each conference. And they want the deal this year. Those are the three things they want and they want it this year because they want to Redo their TV deals even though they're not up yet and but people don't understand is why they want to Redo the TV deals now or not going to get a big discussion about this but right now the economy is good. But there's an election in November and they want it done now with the TV stuff. The locket their deals with them that's why they WANNA now. Those are the three things they want. The players are getting fifty six other things in return. If you take away one of those three take away a third of what? You're getting for the players if if the players don't want to do it this year they're to they're going to get a deal. It's nowhere close to this next year. Nowhere close to this next year to start off. They don't want the seventeenth game. You're basically taken what the owners want and it's not I don't even think the owners want to sound game the TV companies want the seventeenth game and the owners. Want work out the best deal with that. I'm a season ticket holder. One seventeenth game. I don't but I understand that. That's where the money comes from and I know I'm sitting here ranting injustice waiting to say something but you're you catch up with the live chat and let me know how bad people are are. Busting me on this so but not too bad. But so that's what's really going on and I mean they've been working on this deal for ten months and the personally I think I couldn't believe the owners were given the players this much and there are some people that really on the fifty percent fifty percent to up to up that revenue as much as they are it's almost like a steppingstone to where they're going to get to fifty percent. Probably the next deal after this one show. That's the issue but the reason I think this deal's going to pass is is almost sixty percent of the League. Plays playing on either a rookie contract or League or League minimum contract and those are both being raised by twenty percent next year not even adding a seventeenth game. Just imagine just imagine if you worked. Jeff is a teacher. Just imagine that they went out and they got a twenty percent raise for the teachers but people were against it because the principles are screaming who are already making a bunch more money than the teachers that it's not good enough for them. That's kind of what's going on here because it's the guys that are. That are making the big money. They're not going to see a big step in in in in their not seeing big step in salary but all these other guys that that really go out and don't have much time in in the league. They're the ones that are going out. And they're going to benefit from this and and unless the vocal majority or sorry. The vocal minority is drowning them out. It's an convincing them. Otherwise I'm afraid that like Markey's pouncey says this is a bad deal for everybody else coming out here. You got to trust us this. He's talking to guys are going to be on his path. How many guys are in the NFL? And they don't see a second contract. Hello this is David Fox. I'm a senior editor at vulture and I host the podcast. Good one day podcasts about jokes. It's a podcast about well jokes. Every week I sit down with a comedian. Comedy Writer Director Willis to one of their jokes and figure out how it all came together. I don't sit down with a pin in the head and physically write down. Everything has not my style turns out. Comedians take jokes pretty seriously. I like all joes okay. That's what I do. That's what I live. There's really nothing else I care about. It's all very revealing. What did you learn from this? What was your takeaway? I nothing guy and I'm not I'm not a should mark curse good one from vulture and the box media podcast network. Subscribe for free on Apple podcasts. Or on your favorite podcast APP. Do not use the PUCK. This effort a letter. Great Question Just David Fox a lot. The majority of them more guys don't see a second contract than what do so. Don't say that you need to listen to me. 'cause you need to walk out for what's going to happen when you get to my shoes because most of them are never going to get there so why not. Look out for those guys for the time here. Well look the one thing too is that this has been negotiated for ten months. This is not new. And if Markey's Pouncey so adamant about his hatred for it for it. Did he speak up to Ramon Foster? Did he talk to Kim Hayward and really voice his displeasure with what was going on? Or is this all breaking news? Because it seems like for a lot of players. This isn't new now. The one thing and honestly I'm not siding with either because I just want football just like probably not only nine percent of people in the live chat right now may just one football because honestly this is a business for us behind the steel curtain dot com is a business. It's our business is poss- cat podcast. Platform is our business. And if we don't have football is not the off-season lockout is a lockout and I've been through one of those already in. It sucks you can't talk about anything because there's nothing ahead at least in the foreseeable future but there's a lot of things that are minute show in this deal. That aren't talked about that. I Love I love the fact that they're going to expand rosters that they're gonNa have a third person that can come into reserve that the practice was going to gain two more players. These are all really good things that a lot of us have said for years that they should be doing. Oh my gosh expand the game day roster. Yes do it. And they're doing it so yes. Seventeen Games will be weird. I'm sure they said the same thing when they went to sixteen would it? Would it be nice to have well for one? It wouldn't have mattered for Fred Johnson. Would it be nice if the steelers still had Patrick Morse right now? They moved up when Pouncey was suspended and then lost him to waivers to the broncos. Guess what now a player can be moved up from the practice squad to the to the active roster two times and not be exposed waivers. Yeah I mean there's a lot of good things but I don't know how much you know that. She's better for the game but I don't know how much they're people here. Only with the mainstream media says what are they saying? Seventeen games seventeen game recap and all that stuff and three games. That's all they're here but with that. We Bring Anthony Davis. Who's back from the East lobes? He's running back. Uh maybe how's a gallon there? Brian how are you I do and great fellas doing awesome? Thanks for waiting on me and Your patients but I'm here and I'm sure that the lots of Nice things were said about being my absence. So good we said you were shredding the mountain after Shredding Announ actually tubing but guys. This is after party stuff but I don't go on skis. Ski Instructor looked at me. And Said for God's sakes man just get down so we've all been there pointer lies I think so. Let's go into the car. Wraps up our headline which was the steelers. Off-season plan is changing and is going to change. But it's not just the steelers really any team the steelers specifically because of Ben Rothlisberger coming back because of the confidence in him coming back. It's GonNa Change and things so stay tuned Ben Rothlisberger. Still some stuff going on he stores. I think he's he's probably back in Pittsburgh by now. He had a couple of other sessions out in California. The news coming back spurred he's not going to be clear until probably around. Ota'S WE'RE TALKING May June. Then he'll be good to go by the end of July Island airport training camp so exciting stuff for the steelers exciting stuff. Let's get into. I just can't address one thing that was brought in the live chat. I'm going to bring it up here. Yeah that it said that all fifty three or if they get fifty five players should be active on Sundays Games. I'm adamant against that. And that is because they have that in there for competitive balance one because a team who has a lot of injuries versus a team that has no injuries the team or no injuries automatically just has more personnel. Now once you get more than seven injuries that you're dealing with that sorry that you're just GonNa have to do that but I think that's bad for the players because let's say you have a rookie contract or you know who was an undrafted free agent or six pick or something like that but trying to stick around. That isn't one hundred percent you. If you're going to address all these guys then he's going to dress and maybe go out there and hurt his career but he's a guy that you know you're not a hundred percent. We got arrests seven. We gotta sit seven guys anyway. So we're going to give you this this week off. That's better for that player so it makes it more balanced competitively. Brian disagrees on this one. If I if I recall the his thinking on it I might be off there. But that's something that I feel now if they want to change the number I understand but that's the whole reason it's in there so one team who's dealing with with injuries and and it keeps them from having to put guys on. I R that they wouldn't have to otherwise because they could just have them enact on their inactive list for a few weeks you know Dave the only thing that that I would like to see them doing that. I get what you're saying. I'm not really GonNa pooh-poohed that at all I mean I don't think what you're saying is off base. The only thing that I wanna see them do is just say. Look you have an extra slot? You have fifty. You have an extra slot for third quarterback and just everybody because they used to do the emergency quarterback. I remember that. But you know it. Just look. We're not gonNA penalize you. Everybody has if you WanNa take advantage of that extra spot and put a quarterback in there. You're allowed to knock penalized because I mean really we? We saw a couple of guys go down in the same game and wasn't the rule with that back in the day that quarterback if he came in before the fourth quarter he had to be the only quarterback that played the other two. Couldn't come back in. I remember that. Yeah yeah there were exact roles. I can't even remember the time period. I know is late nineties. Maybe what you really? You can't go with just two quarterbacks on Game Day roster it's just I mean it's disastrous like the NHL's emergency goalie driver and now which has been in place forever and if you follow hockey you seen situation the first time it happened It's rare but it's part of the game and I know I listened to some sports talk radio this week and they said that in the NFL they should have emergency kickers that if kicker goes down they have someone that maybe as soccer experience. Maybe a d. one kicker but never got drafted or isn't in the xfl name. You know they can go out and kick your team. I don't know I think it's our easy. It's crazy wasn't Jean. Claude van Damme. That made the an amazing say that game seven of the Stanley Cup finals. Who would famous playing in that Brian? As Dave you know and that navy. He's actually a recreation of an action of final. Yeah because it was. I thought it was the Los Angeles kings kings because it was shoot lives at the Minor League hockey team that I grew up watching. The wheeling thunderbirds actually played the opposite team of the Penguins in the movie sudden death. They did. They had to wear their jerseys. It was Because it was it was filmed in Pittsburgh the blackhawks or the sides tonight ninety two. His paintings Blackhawks Cup. Final and Jean Claude. Van Damme comes in and saves the day. I know it's not the after party but if I could say something real quick about an emergency goalie back in the in the late. Eighties nineties the Johnstown chiefs had to bring in their trainer to be the emergency goalie and that emergency goalie was a A Johnston who played for Westmont high school a Johnstown Kid. The got to come in and got the win. His name's Dana Hines. And the reason you know that an the equipment manager his his mom and Dad were a teacher of mine just a wonderful family and I remember him coming in and like hometown boy gets to play a minor league hockey game. As the emergency goal Lakers. They were just out of people and the coach at the time was one of the Hanson. Brothers Steve Carl. Very quick to give people a taste of the the after party. I'd like to do this because our after party. Numbers are not the same the equivalent of the preview. Since give you guys. Is there any better John Club ending? Maybe the blood sport I don't think so. Plus was the best time Lionheart Lionheart. I thought Alad. Oh it's a lot like what sport well I I like to. What was the one where he was the Cajun Guy and they were in the Mardi Gras warehouse hard target? I liked that one now. We're we're getting after party stuff. Because I'm about to say all right you're jean-clude clam dam or call them that include or Steven seagal sisal Stevens ago. Good Lord Okay. All right. Let's get this party. Yes that's just a taste of the after parties and actually check us out after this. Now let's get to our wide receivers. This is something we typically do in the off season here on the preview preview one position. And we're GONNA go to the wide receivers today and we're going to break down the players that are on the roster in we'RE GONNA. Kinda GIVE A GENERAL SYNOPSIS. Of what might happen. This off season. Who might stay whom I go? Who might step up? Who might take a step backwards? So Dave. Do you have the depth chart there. You said you were going to get the depth chart. I said I was pulling up to the. I think I got it my brain though. Because we've got we've got juju Smith Schuster we've got. We've got my favorite player of all time data. Johnson we've got we've got James Washington. Yep We've got Dion Cain we've got Ryan Switzer Bingo. We've we've got Johnny Houghton. Oh He's the best. Yes and we've got let's Dharma how was it? Arvo Armagh Dr Darbeau mixed up our data USA. Dharma and Greg or something. We are already have department. You're leaving out estes that one. Oh is the futures guys are Jamal custom and Quadri Henderson. Anthony Johnson that must have been assigned. That wasn't one of the original signings but that sounds familiar. So I'm going to say you probably correct. All Right said to expedite the process a little bit. Are we assuming that any of the players that we can't pronounce their names or on reserves contracts are not GonNa make the twenty twenty roster? You mean are you talking about the dash guys. Well Yeah. Is there anyone that you see on that list that you're like yeah? I could see maybe making the team in some way shape or form. Anyone Quadri Henderson as a return man. I don't know that's the only thing of I liked. I mean but I kind of like the Anti Johnson back there for now but like you say the second pro and that as she gets as he gets to be a better receiver. You won't WANNA put him back there. And when it came the kickoffs white around I thought he did find and has the speed burst for the kickoffs. So I don't know about someone committing just as returner the answer. Can I think canes go so yeah Kane should well no? He's not a futures guy I know he's I would even say Dasha people know Kane in Pittsburgh now. So let's get into the Brian. Was anyone that you is out of the guys. That are a little more irrelevant. Yeah I'm thinking more Adobo. What attracts you better model. What is it Marla Amara? Dark Blood Amara. He was on the active roster at the end of last year. He just was never active. So sorry who was on the actress using the fifty three man roster he would just never active on Game Day there. Okay all right. So let's get to the top top six and say because they typically keep six wide receivers. Dave you do that yes. All right ziggys unlock deontay. Johnson's Lachin's Washington is the Loch Nan. Nothing after that in my opinion is certain Johnny Houghton is a lock. Oh Gosh I don't know I know. I mean they've the Jones for these they loved the HP they love Darius Haywar Bay. They loved this little. Johnny Holton they want that specific guy to be an emergency wide receiver in your governor and your your special teams guy. They love him so I think he's a look. Okay Day Diego. The only way that changes because honestly he does not give you anything to receiver a mean and they put him out there on the field on a play that they knew they were running. And I'm like it didn't even. That's what made you a hundred percent. It was going to seventy two eligible johnny holding with the only receiver. Come on. They're going to. They're going to run the ball. So Oh let's try to throw them off. We'll go see James Washes out there. And then we'll throw it well Duh. Of course you're going to throw it when you put someone else out there you gotta put him out there all the time anyway. Let's get away from that. The only way that happens is if you have another player that is a great gunner because they have another one now. They have another one because he beat out already burned lane match. Justin Lane if you get another gunner that let's say just comes out of nowhere and training camp then you don't have to use wide receiver for that. So I would. I wouldn't say he's a lock but I would say until someone else emerges as a gun or at not a wide receiver. Then keep it okay. Citizen that's four. There's chief spots left. The question now is who claims the last two spots but before we get to that is do they address wide receiver in the draft. Brian will start with you. I think they do. It's probably a fourth round draft pick. It's something like that. The they'll probably look at that but not early. They're they've too much stuff to do early. You have an edge rusher no matter what happens with with Bud Dupree. You have a Lineman you have to get and you. You're probably looking at getting a tight end. Regardless of what happens as well. They want to get a running back. They might even get a running back relatively early So you know. I think it's down the line but maybe possibly afford at the earliest but maybe a sixth or seventh. The probably address it but I. I don't think it's going to be a big prospect. Dave what are your thoughts on? It all comes down to Ben Rothlisberger and how bad he wants Ryan Switzer because if Ben Rothlisberger once Switzer. I think they're going to keep Dion Kane and therefore their best bet would be not draft the wide receiver until fifth or later and then hope that they can have them on the practice squad for a year because some people are still thinking that prolific guy in the second round. And he's he falls. Do you take them. Then you're GonNa then you're going to be making Ben Mad. They have kept seven wide receivers of it. You know in the past that they have but that's kind of pushing it. You WanNa know my theory. Here's what I think's going to happen. They're going to take a wide receiver in the second round. If not the second the third they're looking for one of the dynamic. This is a deep wide receiver class. Summer saying this is one of the best wide receiver classes in the last decade in terms of depth in quality of player. They won another playmaker because they think they will just really help round the offense especially Vince healthy. So then you're saying okay. Who'S GONNA go? I think the Dion Cain if he can prove that he's a gunner. We'll make Johnny Houghton expendable. They can get rid of it. I could see Justin Lane like you. Said is the proven goner. I could see Dionne Kane saying look. I'll do whatever it takes to make this team. It means rundown on special teams tackle. I'll do it. And if he's I think he's just as fast probably and he no he offers more as a receiver. Then you can cut Johnny Holden and you can live with it so I could live with that option in. Bryant's which is probably going to be. Yeah I mean Ben wants what he gets. He gets what he wants here. I am in there you go. I mean there comes to a point where it's like. Yeah I know he's your guy but you know we're thinking about more than that more than what you want their pal. I think the the quarterback should have some say in the. He's throwing the football too but he shouldn't have the ultimate say you know he shouldn't he then again we also don't know if he does have the ultimate say well it it should be because he's it should be because he's a good player and can help the steelers. Not because he's a guy that you like to go hang out of basketball games with you know what I'm saying you can tether Dave Scofield and Brian Anthony Davis together and we would have more yards after catch than Ryan. Switzer will be Yak machines. Usually Yak machine did together so he comes down to sit players. I think that's the assumption is that they're gonNA keep six and in a position to watch throughout the offseason especially throughout free agency and the draft. There's nothing to say that they won't go and look for a veteran wide receiver although I think Dante Moncrieff might have soured them on that Brian would know more than anyone. I think you're starting to work on your wide receiver article in terms of. Who's out there if there's anyone that's attracted might fit their price range which is basically nothing. Brian's ready for tomorrow actually. It will be debut in tomorrow. It's in the queue so it's coming so you know the top five that you're looking at number one. I mean not a chance. It's a Amari Cooper. Of course you guys in the top five the one guy that I thought would have been a great option and he signed with the Lions back with the Lions on. Monday was Danny Amendola. Would've actually been a really good option for what he's done last year and what he's done in the last few years but he went back to. Detroit. That was the guy that I was really looking at the other ones you're looking at are like Robbie Anderson led a character issues. They're in the top five. I mean there's there's more guys down the road a little bit that that haven't had that aren't big names but you probably bring a cheap option like that in I league. What Ali says in the live chat he said if Dante Moncrieff can make a roster after this year David Brian Ken. I agree with that. And then I also agree with Sean Manahan. He says Dave your kicker now teen not sure not sure if we want that but hey if days did a game in their in a pinch I mean he's already wearing Cam Hayward's Jersey to say. Hey give him camps helmet. Just throw else no. No one will now are extra points. Yeah good good well. The extended extra point. That's means you need to do this again. Soapy hit the thirty five yarder. It wasn't on film. I don't know I kind of lost track. I mean I don't know I it. Everytime years ago he he hid it. He hid it on just jogging. Let's get isn't trivia time for me to put on my dunce cap and look like an idiot compared to Brian days. So David the Oracle as Lance Williams are. Sorry Sir Lancelot calls you. Why don't you go ahead and give gifts which got okay? Well I've got some interesting stuff. I was looking at wide receiver. Stuff of course seen here and just thought I'd look at stuff. I Know Jeff. Let's talk about you. Know maybe some that were where they were drafted or anything else. I decided I was going to look at catch percentage new meaning. Now this has been this only like if you're using a pro football reference. This has only been a statistic. They use since nineteen ninety-two. Because it's basically receptions divided by targets off. The player was targeted Audi receptions they had off of but so I went in and I said okay. Well let's look at how the steelers have done since one thousand nine hundred and who has a new as the best and I said well. You can't just do it. Cause some guys who could be it would be Zach. Gentry who caught one pass yards or target in his his stats. By the way I looked at that you're I went with. I went with fifty. If they've had fifty catches what fifty targets and I said who has the highest catch percentage since did tiny to for the steelers and it was fifty targets? Moore? And I'll be honest with you. Drop way down to ten targets and it was still the same player they have an eight. Don't look it up Ryan the K. Eighty percent steelers as as a wide receiver though it could be a wide receiver or tight end. I did both of them. I didn't do running backs. Running backs didn't count that I'm GonNa go with Heath Miller. Good percentage he. When I think he's Miller I don't think of him dropping a lot of passes. Well you also have to remember because this also includes what if the quarterback is the ball away and throwing it at your feet. You know what I'm saying to where you couldn't really catch it or anything. Miami's reminding I get I get it all right. Brian which I guess we were Charles Johnson. Are you ready? Because it is with an eighty percent catch rates. Eighty percent forty four receptions on fifty five targets from pretty shirts. Two hundred and eighty five yards are around there and one career touchdown your best catching wide receiver in steelers. History is one Ryan Switzer. Oh my gosh. Here's a question I'm not done. All right what's crazy is what you're doing. Get fifty targets or more he has. He has the highest catch percentage but he has the second lowest yards per target. The only person is lower yards per target was would be Mark Bruener. Nice all right. So he's only targeted for five point zero nine. He only has five point nine yards per target. So that was kind of that. But you guys WanNa know out of fifty out of fifty targets or more who has the lowest pat catch percentage since? You didn't get fifty targets linus weed. Did he ever did even get fifty targets because he was for three seasons Jamie Coats. There's your answer. It's because same coach. And so they know. Highest is catch percentage of the steelers. He said he said Switzer's has one touchdown. Right one touchdown score against I remember. It was a it was they. Were on the one. Was it the one or two yard line. And it was a little out and he was barely in the end zone because throw the ball down the field. I'm Brian Genet this. The three twitter Switzer's only touchdowns against I was GONNA say the Jacksonville Jaguars I was GONNA say. The Cincinnati Bengals was it. I've not he was knocked. Knocked around and interfered with against Jacksonville. That's what I was thinking of Gosh I don't remember Ryan Kelvin's got it Tampa. Is the Monday night game? I was that that Monday night game. Yeah Okay was animal game and it was where he caught a going out of bounds. N- is actually a good good. Play out Brian. Anthony Davis his son is alive. Jad Welcome Connor. Thank you for peace in. Hello Dad other Ohi bad. He's the I was looking at the the youtube comments the other day because Jeff always don't like youtube comments so it was after my show so I looked and the first thing I see is like that Brian guys. My Dad and I looked at least my son's case who you listen to show you know BRIANCON. My mom has been in the live chat. Lances mom has been in the live chat Dave Day as a show with his brother. It's a fail and his sons in the live chat. My other nephew sometimes is in the live chat. Had My daughter on the show as true. It's a family affair. All right we're segman ever for my trivia I just looked up some stats as well and I was just stunned by some of the names Career Statistics and I looked at receiving yards per game. I think most of you will be at a guest who leads that category for the Pittsburgh steelers right probably should be per game. I would say receiving yards per game. Yes rather be Antonio Brown at eighty six point two in that was from two thousand ten to two thousand eighteen hundred and thirty games. The questions unit. Who second game is an reception receiving yards per game? This is an old time player. Played in sixty six games. Mario Lemieux from one thousand nine hundred fifty nine to nineteen sixty three. He averaged seventy one point six receiving yards per game. Ob Nickel no buddy. Dial you got it buddy. Dial seventy one point six receiving yards. Sixty six games this crazy. No No. You're fine. He the biggest thing was I was surprised with issues. Third in receiving yards per game. Sixty eight point nine yards per game only played in forty two games in his player on the ultrasound. Juju has got to be there because of the long correct Juju Smith Easter with sixty eight point nine. Now here's another interesting stat and this and the last one for me. I looked at receptions per game clearly Antonio Brown would be I at six point four. There's a tie for second is too. They're both modern era players. Now this Sandra Steve Tytler -ception well. This would be well. I don't want to give it away. But they they might be another position. Okay so it could be like a running back receptions per game. I'm GonNa say that that Mr Naked Rob might be up there with comedy Seventies. He is one of the two the S era at five receptions per game five and the other one bright already got one. I was GonNa let you. We know it's five because they're tied for second. I mean heath comes to mind but I'm sure it's not that I know. He had too many games early reception. Mike Wallace Jiji's misuse juju. Kaz Eugene Levy on Bell tied at five receptions per game on average. I just was stunned. That lady on bell had five per game average. I mean we didn't play as long as Antonio Brown but still but but look at the number of games where he had like ten receptions because they were just constantly just flaring it out to which is basically like a run play. Because they're throwing by scrimmage get old but the dial seventy one point six yards per game and then my next guest was Gary Bauman because those are the three old guys that I could think of. Ray Mathews Gary Baldwin all right. That's it for me bad. Go ahead all right so I hope there's not any holes in this question but who was the last single season receiving leader wide receiver to not be drafted by the Pittsburgh. Steelers okay so you said he's the last person wide receiver we're just in general wide receiver wide receiver for the steelers wasn't recipe to lead the team in receiving yards receptions and he was not drafted steelers. I Know Khatri led the team in touchdown. Lead in in receiving yards. Back is Was He i? Don't think the anti pig pen not unless they were. The San Diego chargers tape ends. It is great guy favorite player job. Jeff thank you I just did. I kept on thinking about all the time. I mean the steelers draft wide receivers. Well they always have. And that's a good question is a good one great middle name by the way but is it. Unc Dirk Big Ben dirt how to get against the dirt. Burke I throw it. What board to you guys shares? Nineteen ninety-two. There's only one. This is wide receivers and like I said I didn't. I didn't include running backs one player on the steelers that has an a a two-thirds catch percentage meeting sixty six point seven percent and nine yards per target. Can you say that again? But he has he has at least nine yards per target and cat has catched a catch caught at least two thirds of his of his targets. I don't know Brian and he says in Nineteen ninety-two since Nineteen ninety-two. Only one steeler has that. They've caught more than sixty six point. Seven percent of their targets and as at least nine yards per target. So they need to catch the ball. Well and get a lot of Argu- Rosie Nix. Now I would probably think Let's just go with Mark Bruener that we're going with jude you G. I can't believe all these of cause. Yeah he's I mean he's really got. He's got nine one nine yards per per target not per reception target. But that goes up when you catch a lot more of your targets. 'cause you got someone like Mike Wallace's over ten. He had he crazy but the problem was his catch. Percentage was under sixty so but but he would like. He's the answer any anytime. You're doing sealers Trivia. And you want to know about like yards per catch or yard for. It's going to be Mike Wallace. That's gotta be because he you know. How many times did he have? Oh a one hundred thirty six yards on three completions touchdowns you know what I mean. That's the kind of quick ten more. Juju facts come on W J J you Ju Ju all right all right. So that wraps up the steelers preview. We hope that you if you're watching live on Youtube. Join us for the after party. Which would be happening within five minutes of the ending of this show but if you're listening audio platform when this show publicist which will be tonight or tomorrow morning. The after Party will not publish until about one PM. Eastern time gives you something to listen to on your way home on Friday. It'll be lighthearted fun. Join US there guys. Thanks for your time. We'll see you at the after party. Check it out.

Pittsburgh steelers David Deputy Dave David Brian Ken Pittsburgh Jeff Harmon National Football League Ben Rothlisberger steeler Ben Ryan Switzer football Anthony Davis Pouncey Johnny Houghton US Antonio Brown Ben Rothlisberger Elise Mark Bruener Ramon Foster
Emergency Podcast: Iowa Meltdown Edition | The Press Box

Channel 33

39:56 min | 1 year ago

Emergency Podcast: Iowa Meltdown Edition | The Press Box

"Hey Kelly welcome to the ringer podcast network. Patrick Mahomes. Kansas City chiefs are Super Bowl champions so for coverage of the game and everything that happened in Miami Eh. Check out the ringer. NFL Show for their game. Recap and on the site. You can read Danny Hyphen on Andy. Reid Roger Sherman on Patrick Mahomes and Robert Mays on Kyle Shanahan Super Voltaire. Sharpeville on the ringers YouTube channel. Make sure to check out. Slow News Day with Kevin. Clark live from Miami with a bunch of special guests like miles teller and Glen Powell you you can watch and subscribe at youtube dot com slash the ringer. Hello media consumers. You Got Bryan. Curtis and David shoemaker of the ringer. Here he's happier. He's already laughing David. This was supposed to be an emergency. podcast about the Iowa caucuses using the term emergency in the figurative sense. Not The real sense like Oh my God. Our democracy is doomed. Because if you're just tuning in it's midnight on the East Coast. The Iowa caucuses happened this evening. Starting at eight PM but there are no results. None Zero Steve Kornacki and John King of just just been pointing at empty boards all night And what we've had is four hours of cable. News hosts trying to fill time. The more things change the more things say Brian. You know especially with Bernie Sanders. There's no with Warren kind of like leading this cast of characters. The Democratic Party's is definitely making the claim to be the party of the people in this election cycle and I think think that they're really succeeded tonight because if there's one thing that all Americans can agree on it said we're always trying to get apps to work and they never worked the way wanted to so that's the earliest story tonight that it all over Iowa the people reporting these results attempted to use an APP. It was designed for this purpose. The APP did not work then. They went to the backup system which was a phone number number a hotline where they could call in the results they were placed on hold for an hour or more and man and can we just go ahead and play this clip. There was this guy named Shawn Sebastian. Who is as far as we know an official Iowa caucus person? He was complaining complaining on twitter that he was on hold. They put him on CNN. And then this happen Offering this is a real coincidence wolf. I just got off hold just now so I've got to get off the phone to report the results. Go ahead and report you. Can we listen to Sean. Yep Okay Hi Hello. They hung up on these sh Day Hung up on me okay. I've got to get back in line on hold. They just hung up so frustrating. Indeed Sean. We're GONNA stay in close touch with you new Sean Sebastian. From Story County a precinct secretary just wanted to report the result of the shots. Like you know what we'll please do not stay in touch with with me tonight. That is screwed up my shot at this moment of television by the way earlier in the clip. When they were talking him? You could actually hear the hold music. The Democratic Party of Iowa's hold music unbelievable dude so now that there were no results and by the way. We're just recording this. Because we're just GONNA lean into the meltdown at this point the story of the meltdown meltdown. The candidates have already spoke tonight. It doesn't really matter who wins. I award certainly matters less than I did. A couple of hours ago So we're just GonNa talk about the meltdown. Here's here's the first part of it and the most obvious point we could possibly make. It's not like a foreign power is looking to interfere in the twenty twenty election and his watching this tonight and saying my God. This is GonNa be easier than we thought but Putin can just go take a horse but another horseback ride. We didn't have to worry about this. One what a freaking mess and what an incredible way to undermine democratic trust in the process the individual campaign's trust in the process and not to mention every American's trust in the process The New York Times reported on this The the APP errors. I think the the dateline honor. That's it was time to eight last update at eight forty eight tonight. East Coast Time So visit was already in the offing. Like we you know. We could've foreseen these problems If we're paying attention to the New York Times but I just want every every sentence every paragraph in the story is comical. I mean it's like you know it. It's tried to say it sounds like an onion article but like we're verging on onset satirical territory the whole way through but I but there's there's a paragraph about halfway down that I wanna read that says. The new APP was designed to improve the speed efficiency of reporting election results and was tested by law enforcement. forcement security officials but details of the APP including the type of security uses its basic structure and even its name or a closely held secret by democratic credit officials leading to rumors and confusion over. How exactly the APP function I mean? The piece goes into a lot of like twitter for in otherwise online speculation of conspiracies. And I mean I think that's I don't know if that's overstated but I think you made the point that you know if anyone's actually trying if the conspiracies here's these are real this you know there's there's a door wide open for someone to drive a tank through but but I mean I I think that like I said that it's going to be a conspiracy to par for the course at this point. The big issue is not someone trying to influence the election. We can't influence our own elections by casting votes. You know I mean it's been this is this this is the there is no amount of overstatement. There's no there's no statement. That can overstate how much of a catastrophe. This is not just for I era. I think that we can talk about Iowa. The pretense of the Iowa caucuses. I think we probably we're probably through. The last one of our being essential as it is to the nomination process after this fiasco This is a terrible look for the Democratic Party because I not in so much I mean it's not the candidates vaults it's not necessarily the campaigns fault but coming off of off of the last election cycle where everything seem to be like. You know you can try in the bag for Hillary the whole way through at least that was the perception. This was the election is supposed to fix all that whether or not this is actually a reflection of that inadequacy cuisine department. It still feels that way and like and go at the very base of it. I mean this is. This is the first contest of a presidential election of the most significant nick of the the election that we're supposed to be most concerned about getting the right results and this might be. We might be getting the results tomorrow at noon or something but this just it just feels terrible. It feels like we just failed. And that's not. That's that's precisely what we didn't want coming out of tonight absolutely absolutely I. Oh it let's take those points in order. I always toast. I completely agree. It was already probably toast given all the stuff we've heard about demographics. And why are we letting Iowa do this again and again and again. There's just no way in twenty twenty four. That Iowa gets to pick. That gets to go first. No chance no chance you blew it you had as I said on CNN tonight you had one job Nan. You cannot cannot count the votes. You don't get to go first. You're out and I say something before separate from the well. I mean before we get holy into the fiasco that is tonight right. I mean did the little little preamble to that. I noticed that I noticed that the end of Iowa was bubbling up Or the possibility that this was the end of the Iowa Carcass as being the first the first big vote it's been a long standing bugaboo amongst various parts of the various squadrons of Democratic Democratic voters. Right I mean it always seemed to be this like Iowa versus the rest of the party. head to head sort of combat bad situation. Yes and all of these early caucuses have the same way I mean they. They basically have like you know or exacting ransom saying that if they don't get to devote exactly when they have in years past then all hell's going to break whatever but people have long had a problem with Iowa being in the position that it's in particularly in recent years. Ah there been people who have taken taken issue with the Whiteness of the O of the I. Electorate the sort of over saturation of college and like retired voters because of just the the time requirements that are at stake in. But I mean it's so so in some ways it's sort of like a far left issue that we need you to do away with Iowa today or in in the past couple of days but too damn ridiculous when I woke up this morning and turn on the TV suddenly started hearing the voices of the Democratic Establishment who I think were were suddenly spooked by the specter of Bernie Sanders coming out ahead and all these polls suddenly had like Chris Matthews on the air saying we need to do away with Iowa caucuses which is like the last person you'd ever expect to say that right I mean it's just like there's Al- suddenly this the moderate the institutional democratic voices Moore Against Iowa Caucus and now now. I sing on the cake as if I was hanging on by a thread. They can't get their shit together to count a bunch of votes and that's n the craziest thing about it is I I mean. I don't think that I have ever been subject to this much scrutiny. We were talking just before we got on the air but like there are cameras from every new station in every high school gym in the State State of Iowa filming people playing this game of musical chairs. It's nuts the degree to which people are just like willing to get on the mic and just explained and try to explain the nonsense that's happening opening. I mean there's not nonsense. I understand the process here. And and there's a reason for it and there's history and Blah Blah Blah. But it has the. It's just seems the amount of the scrutiny that it's getting I mean it's like it's like if if they twenty camera crews suddenly descent descended on a Sunday Bingo Hall and everybody there is like very excited to explain to you how Bingo works like of course against so such nonsense but all this is to say with all the scrutiny is being placed on Iowa. There's one thing that you can understand at this is your first time watching the Iowa Caucus. The one thing you understand is people are moving around the room and sitting in chairs or standing in circles to to show who. They're voting for all of this his own camera like the votes are right there on CNN and MSNBC and Fox cameras and somehow we can't count them. There's no secret ballots here here. There's no hanging chads. These are people who are being filmed and we can't count the votes. Yes they have all everything he he does that his right. I will fucked up to hook out so great and I think it's a combination of scrutiny for Iowa as you were saying because of the demographics and all all that stuff and then also last but certainly not least the cable networks need for content right tonight at the beginning of all there shows which started more or less around eight o'clock. They were going to correspondence in these random precincts and saying hey look CLO- bazaars campaign gene is not viable. Oh my goodness look. There's a lot of Bernie Sanders people in this corner. All of that was completely out of context to December watching at home. That doesn't mean mean anything that'd be like just going to random polls on a normal election and going out I just met a guy voted for trump very interesting very very interesting. It was so stupid but I think that's part of it to your second. Point was about the Democrats as absolutely screws the Democrats. That's absolutely it screws the party as a whole because it makes them look like a clown car it screws. The individual candidates is because people have pointed out on on TV. Somebody was going to declare victory tonight. They were already getting get stepped on by trump state of the Union speech on Tuesday. Now there's there's really no time to declare victory and New Hampshire and New Hampshire becomes the kind of defacto I contest of this primary. Your third point was about conspiracy theories Brad. Pascale of the trump campaign has already used the word rigged on twitter tonight. Now he's he's a bad actor but Joe Biden's people wrote would. CNN is calling a scathing letter to the Democratic Party saying they WANNA see they they want to hear about these irregularities before the results are announced and you see what everybody's doing here if you lose whatever. The the Iowa caucuses turned out to be. If we ever learn the results. You can look at it and go on. I don't know I don't know if we should count this. Maybe this is all one big batch of tainted had meat you know. Let's just to the side and will start this campaign in New Hampshire. especially if you lose right right and you don't even you don't even have to get into rigged all that kind of stuff you just say. Look this was a fiasco. Let's go to New Hampshire. That's exactly what's going to happen but I think it already happened. I think it's already started to happen tonight. I think that's right I I find it. I mean I think the big the big loser you're right is going to be who ever won. I mean ironically now you know Bernie. Sanders wins in a landslide. That's going to be. That's going in a matter tomorrow as well right is gonNA matter whenever we get the votes But you know it's just it's just really hard to see anybody. Anybody looking good coming out of this. I mean it's just it's I I. Well we we can. We can talk about the winners and the losers and you mentioned by the way that Biden statement it. It's important thing to point out that that statement came from Biden's top attorney on his campaign and I don't think doc I mean Biden for one thing was the second Candidate to give a speech tonight. which was now everybody's giving a speech before the results came out But included jar was smartly. I got ahead of everybody else. Biden's definitely seemed a little bit conciliatory. He he knew he had to find New Hampshire to keep his campaign moving but also so the fact that he was the first one to go with the two to go to his attorneys. I don't think was a good look for that campaign right. I mean the I mean I it had to be done. And they're all in everyone's GonNa Everyone's GonNa be brawling over this to some degree but for the first for the second statement after the after the Biden speech from that campaign to be from the attorney. Saying you better check with US before you release any results. That seems a little bit petty considering the fiasco that we're in right now. Maybe it's not maybe the immediate feel you lost the Iowa caucuses and no I think he did lose the Iowa. I mean I think that's the one thing that we know for sure is that is that Biden. Came out is GONNA come out not looking great in this but I but I don't I think that he I think that the best thing he could have done was to give a speech and move on to New Hampshire. I don't know the I don't know that he needs to get in the getting the trenches in Iowa and seem like you know it just make it pronounced to the world that he's got a team of lawyers ready to work on his behalf like every corrupt campaign before Graham. Gano may May. Maybe I'm just over thinking as we sit here at twelve eighteen. We're in this amazing half state of an American election where nobody lost and nobody one so as you mentioned. Cable News is sitting there filling time and Amy Klobuchar gets the idea that since no results ulcer coming anytime soon she just gonNA walk out to the podium and start talking and the thing is she has nothing to say about tonight because one. She didn't know anything to what's her best possible result that she kinda came in a sneaky fourth or something so she goes out and gives her entire stump speech speech and the cable networks. Just take the whole thing. It turns into a free ad for Amy Klobuchar and says she's immersed were all kind of paying attention because we're like. Oh you're finally we're hearing from a candidate and then it just turns out to be global. Please vote for me message. Yeah and and beyond all that all the other candidates immediately followed her so it looks like she's a leader. It looks like she she was the first one with a good idea. The writer in America Amy Klobuchar of free content. I'm sorry go ahead. Yeah I mean to me I mean from where I'm sitting and I just have like I thank MSNBC playing in a tiny pop up window and my screen. The loser in the seems to be Elizabeth. Warren who is speaking at the same time as Joe Biden. I can't wait to hear that. Re Talk Arkansas's most offended by this The by this incredible. Faux Pas of giving your non-victory non concession speeches at the same time But Elizabeth Warren Orange speech is now being played on tape delay because she was going at the same time as soon. NBA Finals used to be in the early eighties. You know we don't we don't carry this live. We showed on tape delay delay by the way. Did you notice watching these speeches tonight. This revealed how empty election-night speeches are how ninety eight percent of it is just the same speech no matter whether you won or lost or in this case neither one nor lost yes. She's the same just rickles speech It was only. It's only exciting. If you have just some result too attached to it. I thought that was really funny. So closure went first then Biden as you say warne was speaking came out while Biden was already on the stage apparently then Bernie came out did his bid. I think we're still waiting on up people to judge now on TV. I'm spotting my TV here. Here I gotta say this too about tonight David. This was one of the most glorious nights in the history of Cable News. I realize that's a big statement. I really do. It was an absolute mess. An absolute mess I turn on. CNBC before eight o'clock there was this weird. Heard handover from Brian Williams or Rachel maddow which felt like handover the White House from Obama to trump. You know you know. We're all smiles here. But they feels like like. There's a lot of tension beneath the surface. There's this handover. They're doing as I say they. They're going to Katie terror and all their big correspondents or anchors anchors. Who are just in these random caucuses and just throwing just information at the audience? It doesn't make any sense at all then and it's useless it's useless it's like it's like this one. One group forty five people did a thing that thing one way does that have any bearing on the rest of the state and they came out later and said they're almost seventeen hundred caucuses happening in Iowa so of course some little snapshot doesn't make any difference at all. So they do that but they're just waiting and they keep saying we think we're going to have election results almost immediately any moment you know how Wolf Blitzer Wolf Blitzer is like the greatest hype man in television history any moment now folks stay with me stay with with me why we expect to be giving you some information very shortly also. I noticed Rachel Maddow on our into RIMAS. NBC Show said. This is the part of the show. Joe You'RE GONNA be watching. You didn't tell me that an hour ago this is you didn't say that at eight o'clock nine o'clock eastern and wait a minute and what were we. Were just fill in for an hour. Then the results don't come in and all my gosh. How much did you enjoy ways? That cable news hosts Fill time I turn on. CNN and David Axelrod and Terry McAuliffe were just were just trade war stories about campaigns means it felt like kind of a sleepy night at the ninety second street Y it was just absolutely credible anything to say. Tell me a story about when Obama. Beat Hillary in Iowa USA. We should we should have sent out fifteen more correspondence to random polling places. That would really help. Fill up the time Area Ryan Funny Person On twitter says Please I oh for the love of God. Release your results. The pundits would like to put on their matching jammies getting into their monogram. Dwarf style pundit beds and the big big tree house where they all live together I would I would give anything for the CNN panel to have monogrammed monogrammed pajamas. Like tell the river whose name was what this whole thing is just like. It's I mean. CNN is like the Cliche of the the football halftime show where they have like five thousand people that are just sitting at an ever-growing desk MSNBC's you mentioned was just like a rotating cast like they were bringing in like the starter artor. They had like the starters out and then like the bench mob came and they were just like just like ready to to keep things rolling. It was but going back and forth. The whole thing was presentation was very bizarre. What little I watched Fox News tonight was just like seem to be a regular episode of Hannity where he was just like going to a correspondent? Who is who is at a caucus in showing like a highlight highlight package of of Democratic voters seeming stupid And I mean the the present-day everybody's presentation was just fantastic And they turned it in this world or something like the coverage of the caucus waters is moved on so we have some who's world it is now but But yeah it was very. I was just so so bizarre. Fox's playing mayor Pete's speech right now so I don't know if we can grasp anything or anything from that but but who knows Mike Francesa talking about funny people on twitter as chimed in to say the two big winners tonight. Where president trump and Bloomberg K Her this Berg ads tonight yet and I think on the other channel on an MSNBC and and CNN making this case to that Bloomberg I guess is like well for one thing he's out he's he's above the fray and this madness. That's going on tonight but also there's a little bit of like like You know it's a good look for the technocrat out there to say I could Fi- I fixed a lot of things in this in New York City I could. I could certainly have done run better election than this. I guess I don't really know what the I'm not quite sure. He certainly if anything has got has had successive getting under trump's skin and leading to trump the tweeting incessantly about him today Endeavouring Hand Promise. I can fix how Iowa votes I mean not not not in healthcare or something like that did I by the way demain. My Eyes deceive me that Henry Louis Gates junior kind of endorsed Bloomberg today. You see that I saw the yeah. I saw that that gates was in the New York Times magazine. I didn't realize there was like an endorsement in in this part of Media Push. I don't really know what's going on. Among all the candidates. It's a person who I believe. Could stand toe to toe. Strongest and longest with Donald Trump. Is Mike Bloomberg Henry. Louis Gates Junior. Okay but I I I have a feeling right by the way and I think that is the next day story which is because people were starting to believe in Bloomberg. They've just seen so many ads he's got under trump's skin they've seen the super bowl thing. It would be the most exciting story to right at this point which is as we know is a great driver of journalism and this whole thing of maybe. It's GonNa be a big muddle starting with tonight through three more primaries and then we get to Super Tuesday and Mike Bloomberg Somehow magically wins the election. I don't know if you want your. We're going to talk about that if I were going to be conspiratorial I think that the I mean I think I would just draw a line. Directly to the withholding of these results is is a deliberate attempt him to sandbag the sanders campaign. Right I mean to make to to to deprive him of the of the victory speech Anticipated by the way coming up with a conspiracy spiracy theory. Yes he had money. This is not David saying this. No end up bringing her anti anti deliberately muddy the waters for one for Bloomberg or or someone of his ilk to sort of be able to to ride in You know in his on his white horse or whatever but but I mean. I don't believe that to be true. I'm just making up conspiracy theories here but I do think that that's I do think that we're that because of the because of what happened in Iowa tonight. We're we are for whatever reason going to hear the name Bloomberg Lot in the coming days and I don't I don't it's just sort of maddening if that's if that turns out to be the case piece I guess now it'd be I mean if we're talking about if we're talking about Bloomberg I guess now's the time to also mention at least in passing passing the specter of the John Kerry Write in candidacy or whatever. He was apparently caught in the buffet. Line talking too loudly on the phone about about having to run for president to keep Bernie Sanders from destroying the party I assume he wasn't being serious. Maybe was but it. It seems sort of a necessary to pass judgement. I I do think that the the I am sort of stunned you you you mentioned last week or mentioned more than once about this idea that that you know the the mistake that the Institutional Democrats made was going after Elizabeth Warren and then like opening up the door for Bernie Sanders to bulldoze on through I don't think that like we've actually heard enough about just like the institutional democratic parties distaste for Bernie Sanders outside of the halls of like you know the Bernie Bro sub read. I mean I think that this is a real thing that that the party's GonNa should be wrestling with out in public lick and not in back rooms. I mean this is exactly what the people were concerned about in the last primary. Yes well we're GONNA Bernie is the winner at some one point over the next week of the Iowa Caucus will hear a lot about it because I mean I was all prepared tonight to talk about burning winning Iowa and the democratic establishment. Just getting in line to try to stop him before he won. New Hampshire may be effectively sealed the Democratic nomination by winning the first two either thousands of story tonight honestly. Yeah but but this may have and can you imagine if this is what results this just total fiasco. Oh the late reporting of results is what results. In burning not winning the nomination you thought twenty sixteen was a little weird with with Bernie Versus Hillary Online. Oh my God that is going to be awful. It is going to be a huge huge mess. Yeah By the way Rick Santorum is one of those nine hundred people on CNN. He reminded everybody that Rick Torre Won. The Republican caucuses in Iowa in two thousand twelve. Here's the problem. Romney was declared the winner on election election. Night and Rick Santorum wanted a day later in his he said and I thought he was actually deeper. here from tonight. He says all that matters is tonight because ck tomorrow. It's already about Hampshire. And he said even though I one I never won an Romney won and he won New Hampshire and he sealed any sealed the nomination and I thought that was a great point and I do think whoever whoever wins tonight and by the way there was enough anecdotal evidence basically a to pick everybody except Biden On twitter it is Arizona. Go evidence to predict Biden on twitter. I mean that's that that was around. The twitter feed has had people that were people that were tweeting out. You know just photos of every every voting block from every caucus room and if you saw saw one you you know you would see six photos and it would be very compelling anecdotal evidence right. I mean but but you're right I think that in all it does seem like right like you know Biden. Didn't win and that is enough to sort of pencil. In where what. We're going to be thinking of his campaign tomorrow and the next day we didn't mention John Kerry by by the way tweeted a kind of denial or at least affirmation of his support. For Joe Biden that included the f-bomb then deleted the tweet and tweet it a cleaner version of it. This is this is this is. We've said this before this pod. This is the old talk twenty twenty as the ultimate why not be election. Michael Bloomberg actually wind on me. John Carey is walking around Iowa on Joe Biden's behalf thinking that all the time obviously all kinds of people wish to develop Patrick dot that remember all patrick is still is currently running for president just a reminder now he thought why not me these these guys. Don't look so tough I could win this. I don't WanNa get away from cable news without fully appreciate Janet Tonight David a couple more highlights one was. We talked about that Sean. Sebastian Guy Van Jones read his anecdotal. tweet on the air before Sebastian went on with Wolf. Blitzer in that clip we paid read the tweet and then he said I don't know if it's true or not just on the Air I'm just we're I'm just reading twitter tonight on Cable News. What is this the press box? Speaking of which our old friend Lindsay's leads leads a hundred bucks as somebody broke the whole caucus at by trying to write in these nuts. I think she could be right. Another favourite highlight from twitter tonight. Wolf Blitzer. I had said nine forty six called the IRA results. A cliffhanger is going to be a cliff it's a cliffhanger by the way it is currently only twelve thirty four. Am So we hear. My boy are my arms tired. Yeah I'm I'm hanging on the cliff David. It credit to David Graham on twitter for that joke the We talked about Amy Klobuchar. Basically getting to do her stump speech the whole thing. I mean it. It really reminded me. Obviously it's not quite as as pervasive but the cable networks when they used to just air the whole trump's speech because they just wanted something to show they're doing tonight mayor. Pete is still television because it. Hey why not yeah. Well maybe he made the right move to go unless we could just talk as long as you you wanna I mean it's it isn't you're right that he some speeches the same thing over and over again and the real one of the real subtle geniuses the trump campaign was that he never said the same thing where he rely on some of the same catchphrases and win the same riffs and whatever else but it seemed like knew you never knew what he was going to say and so it was always must see tv rights they always aired it and he was very very particular sort of magnetic candidate But you know I mean I thought Bernie Sanders. Who gave a speech that I mean? That was just a bullet point list list of of you know all of his his big ideas and it's the species giving many times before although probably an abbreviated one. I thought he was really impressive tonight and I think that because see sitting I mean the that we sit in the most voters are sitting in. You see you most of your exposure. These candidates is in will commercials if you're in a voting state but our primary Maria Caucus state but for the most part these debates and you and it's easy to forget how good or bad someone can be on the stump right. I mean in Bernie Sanders. I think was really it was really really good Elizabeth. Warren I would say again. I only caught part of her part of her speech. Because of the of of airing issues but She's she's fairly fairly consistent. I would say I mean. She's she's good on. You know about the same quality on both both halves and you can kind of go down go down the row into sort of great people but burning I thought was really impressive. This is the night and I think a lot of a lot of people are watching this because of the because of the lunacy of what's going on you know maybe his speech maybe some of these speeches will actually the effect people's opinion you know of in effect their votes going forward It's just a pity that that it happened. The way they did. The other big highlight for burning tonight by the way and again all the tweets. All the notes that we've both made I'm sure are completely outmoded. Because they're just because they they didn't everything happened before we realize has. The story of the night was that the votes are not going to be having have not been tallied yet but Bernie's other Bernie's other big. There's a scene I saw. Where Bernie voters in one of the polling places were were doing organized? Loud cheers to distract the other voters from from moving from from voting. The way they were they were intending to vote. Because during these big gyms in it's just like oh the whatever the Biden voters are trying to say where they're going to and the Bernie literature yelling really loudly like a soccer crowds and they can't tell what they're supposed to do it but it's like this is I mean if there's any good if there's any upshot for I mean upside for for the Iowa caucus process. It's like all of the jokes that we were going to tell about. How just inane? This process is now completely out the window. Now we're just complaining that their APP is broken but I I I guess we'll see. Where do we go from here? What happens what happens next? Let's just say we. Let's say we wake up tomorrow and have an have results. What's the what's the next step? I think you get a weird belated victory speech speech but I think what I think what we said. A minute ago is GonNa Happen is that you have. You'RE GONNA have a lot of people just kind of looking askance at the results. All the losing campaign saying look. It was weird. Maybe we need to do more research on this. Maybe we need to do something and kind of again. Not going full trump. The election was rigged but just kind of introducing enough skepticism. That officially makes or semi semi-officially makes New Hampshire the first primary. I think that's exactly what's going to happen. Who Probably Right? It's not great eight and that's not great by the way. Save a spot in your heart tonight. David for data guy. You don't every Cable News Network has data guy who gets to stand ended for that screen tonight for Steve Kornacki. The screen was just blank and he kept pushing. The buttons is like when I used to take the batteries out of one of my kids toys. Because I didn't like the noise anymore and the kid would just push the button for a while you know and wonder what was wrong. That's a Steve. McKee looked like today. Four Steve Kornacki John. John King left the big board and went and sat at the desk. I'm done with this. Awesome thing doesn't work anymore. That's like that's like Christopher Robin walking away from Winnie the Pooh. That's that's a terrible state of affairs. Oh Man I mean I i. Yeah Yeah I mean. I think that one really effective when we were one of the most effective lines of argument that trump you used for years ago was saying that the primaries were rigged in Hillary's favor and that so and that Bernie got screwed food and that managed to probably depress turnout and flip some voters and Bernie voters over to his side at the same time and that obviously whether I mean that's something worked out really well for him. I think that was a real big part of it. This might just be the perfect storm for Donald Trump because Bernie Sanders is gonNA come out and win and this is the only Democrat that that he's been giving any sort of like positive rub too for the for if at all throughout the campaign and especially for the pet for years ago and Bernie Sanders is GonNa win and and it's and he's still getting. Trump is still going to be able to tell the story about how corrupt the democratic voting process is just the perfect storm for trump. Yeah I think I think we're I. Just maybe I've been in Florida for a week and that's why I think that we I think we just. It's yeah who what an election we got here by the way Shawn Fantasy. Send us a note to. I don't want to forget this. The the cable news panel was melting down about how this would impact the morning newspapers tomorrow. The fact that this decision was laying. Yes we're print guys and we were not worried about the fact that the morning paper would not have the headline. Oh brother brother and all right. Oh Man David it's it's twelve forty. We got nothing we just got a meltdown let's put away our notes about Biden's rural strategy and how Hillary may have swung the election of Bernie. I'm looking read enough. My paper here about about first alignment and second alignment all that other crap. They were GONNA report tonight. We got nothing this is this is a this is a caucus with no results. That's one of my one of my loss notes. One of the notes. I was going to read before everything went to Shit was that I was just entranced by this concept of the viability threshold as we were doing as in every caucus room it was like if you didn't get X.. Number of votes. You didn't meet the viability threshold in this. This phrase kept getting repeated over and over again and it just it just made it seem so unnecessary unnecessarily serious and also sort of like a science fiction movie from the eighties but I think at the end of the day. What we've proven is the Iowa caucus has not passed the viability threshold? And now were just all left adrift and probably going to be doing another other emergency podcasts. Within the next thirty six to forty eight hours American democracy is not viable but dammit this podcast is he is David Shoemaker. I'm Brian Curtis Research by Eric. Eric Von doesn't Chris Almeida production magic by Jim Cunningham. I guess we're back later this week with a winner. What the hell more lukewarm takes about? The media's even David Brian Mayor Pete is still talking

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High Bench Marks

The Hoop Collective

50:05 min | 1 year ago

High Bench Marks

"Slam Jam Ben. Dick what are you doing warming up to the game. I will all the Games I watch even when I can't get tickets. It helps bring stadium atmosphere to where everyone watching all the diaper. Daddy doesn't again come on Dick. Save it for the air. We've got a game and checkout vivid seats. It's the easiest way to get all the tickets to the Games. You want to go to visit seats for the windy you. You would say as long as Lebron's going to be this guy that we saw through the first eight games then. Obviously Lebron there and Anthony Davis has been spending hold on hold on a second hold on a second. I WANNA start over. I don't want to start with the lake. I WANNA start with waiters. I'm sorry no offense. No offense sorry all I shake it off Hello and welcome to the new collective five cats we talked about the NBA joining. Yes from Naples. Florida where it's the best time of year to be in Florida bobby because The snowbirds haven't got there yet and the weather is gorgeous. Is Bobby Marks. Hello Bobby Hey Brian elder here. The most dangerous place in Naples is the public's parking lot so they've arrive. Don't worry about it. The Canadians come. I'm first Canadians first. This is my experience from a living on the east coast of Florida. I the Quebecers Quebecers Quebec French Canadians. Come first and then other Canadians joining us from the opposite side of the country in Los Angeles. Where he's he's getting ready to cover the Lakers game tonight? Fill where taping this on Sunday afternoon so we wish we could do it live but that would defeat the purpose of a podcast. Dave mcmanamon mcmanamon. Hello David Brian Bobby Dave so all right in my career I have covered the story of the Andrew. Bynum him hurting his knee. Bowling and I have covered the story with Dave of JR Smith getting suspended for throwing soup and now oh I've covered the story of Dion waiters having a bad reaction to an edible on a flight and having what has been called a panic attack And that's what I had to do. That's why my Saturday night doing Bobby you've seen a lot of stuff in the NBA. I assume this is a new one for you But I'm not GonNa make any assumptions actually This is new. I mean I don't think you know I've I've never never seen it. I guess nowadays with where marijuana is as far as the legalization of it and you know how it is in the forefront it wasn't wasn't like ten fifteen years ago maybe it would be a little bit different but yeah I haven't seen I haven't seen a case like this with. I think a lot of Brian has to do with kind of like the back. History here to you. Write the suspension to start the year. has been cleared to play has not been active and not on the bench. which right I mean I was in? I was in Miami for the Atlanta game a couple of weeks ago. And he's in the building but not on the bench so he's not even in there And now we have this incident here so yeah this is. This is something new especially for a guy. That's what twenty five million dollars for the next for this year next next year. Yeah so the way. The story was told to me. And you know the late the heat of declined to comment on this and I don't think the ends give a new interview all year in this. I'm mistaken again not all year. But I'll I'll regular season. I could be wrong but I don't think he has. Dave was that he was. He was not feeling well in Phoenix he was listed. Did as being out for that game because of a stomach ache now. Even if he wasn't sick he wasn't going to play because he hasn't played yet and he was was really in savvy some discomfort. He was looking for some relief and took an edible that he had never taken before that he got from somebody somebody and he had a reaction to it that he was not expecting and had an episode and and was met by the plane it was my let biased emergency personnel. When he arrived these FIS? Okay I understand. You flew back to Miami with team on on Saturday when I heard about this day. What what were you thinking will come with one? It reminded me even though it it was the Syracuse Orange or what the college a lot of green on campus. And I had a friend to appoint a friend friends in in Department report took a little too much in In what the Greens that. They're they're offer. They're literally felt like he was at a party that I was and and said he thought he swallowed his Adam's apple and was losing his mind. And you know we had to calm them down and sequester from the Party and you know until he came to basically and obviously not being on the plane there with the And not knowing anything about the particulars of how strong the the Gumbi's were that he took. I've seen firsthand What an overdose on marijuana can can do person just really really get them out of sorts and it also reminded me of Joe Greene incident? which you know I didn't cover and I wasn't on the list of what you cover Brian but just a bizarre? Does our incident involving a Miami Heat player where Joe Greene was found shouting in the in the lobby of his condo and had to be taken to a hospital hospital on a stretcher. Ever quite you know fully confirmed exactly what had happened to him but it was. You know theories at the time that it was that marijuana Oughta I remember when I covered the bynum story I remember buying them gave an interview. This is you know he was very close to coming back. Doc and then all of a sudden it was the late scratch and I remember. It's almost one of the saddest things I've ever heard by anybody. Say but I but I appreciate he was telling the truth That he had actually actually gone bowling and and really hurt his knee and had a setback and he said well if I did this bowling can you imagine what would happen if I actually tried to Dunkin land. And he's right. I don't think he was like fighting around the The lanes on his knees. I just think it was a reminder that he had a fragile situation situation so bobby let me ask you this. What if you're the heat if you're in the heat front office what do you do in a situation like like this? He hasn't played he's his he's really. I mean no one is untradable but pretty toxic trade trade asset. You've already had them away from the team. And now he's back. What what do you do? Well I mean I think I from his from his is contract. You're right Brian. I think nobody's untradable. But he's probably in the category of of of toxic contract story now who would say probably himself itself Nicholas a tomb. You know guys like that. Remember a lot of these. A lot of these contracts signed in two thousand sixteen when the great spike came came in are now about the come off the cap so waiters as part of this. What two thousand seventeen class here so And the other thing too. Is that as we mentioned. He's zero twenty five million dollars but they've played. You know I know. They've lost to Denver in the Lakers. They played really well. And they've got this young back court of Kendrick non and Tyler Hero. And now you've got Jimmy Butler gorn dragged coming off the bench. So it's not like you need waiters but at the other end you know his his as you know he. He can't be traded he. He's now he's kind of been brought back to the team side. But as I told an agent is I I would be stunned. stunned if we ever see dion waiters back on the court again. You know in in Miami. I would be really surprised just by I guess we always talk about culture down there as far I him with With the heat culture there so you kind of just wait it out. I wouldn't do anything would have of course because he's owed so much money. But you just kinda played out and you try to. You know I guess kind of give your distance to him as far as him being part of this group here not unlike yeah. Go ahead Dave. All the question I have is the chicken and egg thing like was this a one time. Thing was his suspension somehow related to to you know similar behavior. This was his behavior prompted by Miami kind of going out and recruiting cruising above him in going after guys like Euro none or did here on none shine so well and early going because Dion hadn't taken care of himself. I just said a lot of questions about Kinda wear. He was physically and mentally coming into the season. Well from what I understand you know. He had a foot injury that he played through for for a while and ultimately could play through it. No more had surgery and was just out an enormous amount of time with that surgery. It's not got my foot. I don't know if he had setbacks or whatever but it was just had a longtime when he came back he was not in good shape and basically kind of lost his leverage with the organization because zone out with injury but then he came back he was in bad shape from my understanding he actually came into this training camp in pretty good shape and really had spent. The offseason working can pretty hard but he arrives a training camp. And as you mentioned Dave and bobby finds a loaded back court and And there's no place for him to play and I think he was pretty much told you know in training camp. Hey you're you're not going to be a part of our rotation and I don't think he liked that and I don't think he responded to it and the best way that led to the suspension but just another ultimately. It's not going to probably define the season. It's not going to define this era of the heat but it's just an interesting moment in the annals of the NBA as we go through this scenario. You know it's a it's a kind of a they. They flew from Phoenix. La It's kind of a short flight. It's not it's not a flight. You expect to have a lot of drama on but you know the heat went out. I think they had a four game trip. And they lost three of the four day of three game trip tripping lost two of the three and the sixers just went out and took quite a few on the Chin and Ben And beat got suspended. Ben Simmons got got hurt and they and they they lost quite a few. I think they'll have three or four on that trip. We're going to see a lot of teams going west. I think from the east this year here who have rough rough road trips one way or another but both heat and the sixers spent last week on the West Coast. West side of the League not did not have great runs thing regarding wait. Let me just tell you you in woes wrote about it to you guys. What is bonuses? He he's got that bonus in his contract and we we know he's not gonNa hit it right. If he played in seventy seventy or more games he gets one point two few million dollars here and and because he's got that bonus in there and you're not going to be unlikely that's a big reason. Why the Miami's not able to go out and get a sign of fifteen player because it hard cap right? We've talked about the heart. There are eight hundred fifty four million dollars eight hundred fifty four thousand dollars below alot. The hard cap and that waiters bonus which is at one point two is kind of holding them back a little bit and I've talked to people around the League in got confirmation on a and even when he doesn't re- when it's deemed unlikely and he does not reach it if it's next week the League is not going to view that Removed at one point two million dollar number towards the hard cap until after the season. So that's kind of A. They put it in the contract when he signed in in two thousand seventeen. But now it's kind of now it's kind of a hindrance right now but why. Why wouldn't they remove it? Well they look almost like a salary. Cap HAP- loophole. Where if does Miami is Miami holding him back on purpose of not playing to gain additional cap half hard cap flexibility? Here and of course waiters can you know the could file a grievance with the players sociation and because of that. I think there's a lot of different ways as but from what I've got pretty good conformation. Is that there is no relief going to be as far as with that. Bonus regarding regarding the hard gap here all right so just to recap that real quick. I'm glad you brought this up. So the reason that the heat are hard capsules they did a signing trade for Jimmy Butler so though them in the In the warriors this year don't have a lot of space there's an actual number. They can't exceed spending no matter what and the the warriors warriors are within thirty thousand of it right at the moment there about no there about three seventy three like yeah. They're like right there though. There right pat so waiters has a thing this contract that he signed years ago three three years ago now if he played I think he's guaranteed not twelve million this year. And if he if he plays over seventy games he would get twelve million inclusive of that bonus bobby or is it a bonuses in the bonuses not factored in so okay. So if he if he if he got that The played seventy games which already missed nine and my guess is. He's he's like a play for a while so You know and I don't know how big of a you know I don't know how big a factor that is. I see guys wave trae kickers and don't worry about bonuses all the time I also see guys who are who have stepped stat bonuses refuse to shoot threes for the last week of the season so it varies as I don't know how much him not. His frustration with the team is not getting that one point two million shirts somewhat well but So you're saying that even when he no longer can get that one point two million no matter what once. He's missed more than once he's missed thirteen games basically That they will not removed moved from their expected books. The that is correct. 'cause bonuses count towards the Tax Apron and league does not calculate until after the season even though we know he's not going to hit it but they will not calculate it until June. Who who what's more likely to happen this year him to play more than ten? Thanks for the heat or native play. More than ten games for the rockets Dave. I mean what is what is the contract. Bobby name gets how much if he doesn't play ten games at how much if he plays more than ten games well he signed for his base. COMP is is two point five million right so but it can go up to Go Up to ten. He's got a seven point five million dollars in bonuses in his in his in his contract as far as in its tiered based on games played. So it's like it's it's ten games played. He gets two point. Two point five five it keeps on going up and you know when when Houston originally did of course it was because of they were under the impression that they were going to be able to use the whole ten million dollars is because the bonuses were deemed likely while the kind of stepped in and said No. And it's funny that this is the applying the same rule. Two different ways because in waiters in waiters case. They're saying you gotTA count that one point two million against your hard cap even whether he can't get it and but on the rockets doc. It's they're saying you can't count it for ten million Trade Ronge with Dalla because we think it's a deal that's what they're saying correct correct so but if the rockets were hard cap the this would go towards the the bonus would go towards it but for set for trade purposes for for his contract he only counts at that that two point whatever five six a number of things that I don't think either screaming me about league being unfair and making up rules as go along but I actually reporting Brian of the body. You'll contract. This is the first time where you know. Everybody had the correct information but it was just how it was framed whether you found those bonuses to be likely or unlikely and it was just interesting to see that reporting come out. It was the first kind of high profile sonning that I could remember where the reporting varied so wildly in the numbers even though there was all correct information just based on what part of the incentives did you choose to include in the total package. I've never seen anything like that. That contract and League neither and funny thing is Brian to is that when I've talked to budget teams about this when we when we do contracts we always send them to the league like the rough-draft have them. I kind of rubber stamp just because the one thing. You don't want to ever do that for for a contract to calm like not approved. And then you've got to go into your general manager's office and asked for another signature and be like well. What happened anybody while I forgot to add something in here and they never Houston never sent the contract for for approval so they basically did it had the guy sign it and then said and then send it till the for for approval? And that's it went into a a holding pattern from two weeks. They're available to take your call. I'm not jinxing anything. Okay but a we need to get tickets for the College Football playoff the way things are going with my house. State Buckeyes may need to do that or you know maybe before that maybe the big ten championship game against Penn State coming up in a couple of weeks and of course if you need tickets any of those big gains only one of your college football favorite teams big games. What are you GONNA do? You GonNa go there with like cash in your pocket and try to buy from the scalper now. It's two thousand ninety. You're not going to do that. You're going to try to use some sort of shady third party. You know APP. Now you're not GonNa do that. You're going to go to vivid seats because vivid vivid seats is the the online ticket marketplace dedicated to providing fans of live entertainment with experiences. 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ESPN TWENTY-FIVE ESPN two. Five and get ten percent off your next order John Walker. Take your call Dave how many years you covered the NBA season. Fifteen eleven eleven as beat writer but fifteen total total. Okay eleven seasons a beer. In those eleven seasons you have covered four three championship teams and seven then teams reached the finals between the Lakers. And cavs all right. So you've seen you've seen good teams. We are ten games into the season for most teams Lakers was number one defensive teams in the League still relatively small sample ample size but nonetheless when I watch them play even with even with their schedule not being that great so far I am extremely impressed by them on defense defense. I have no idea whether the last but I'm very impressed. Is this sustainable. What they're doing is this is what they're doing going to be the way they're gonNA play and if so are they going to stay up there at the top of the western conference standings as we go along the things? You've point to that. Make sense that you think okay this will put them in a great spot. Come April through. June is top level talents there especially if Lebron continues to play at this level which is you know. Quite frankly an uptick from what we've seen in the last several seasons especially defensively you mean at some point through their first seven games. Lebron was right to the top opt-in defense efficiency for individual players which is unheard of based on where those seven or eight years. I'll tell you the ship and committing at seven or eight. Maybe five right five. That's basically the day to day basis. I've covered that. Hasn't been the case on a consistent basis in the regular season and then you go beyond that and you say the defensive schemes defense numbers like if they finished anywhere near the top five in defense that that puts them historically in a really good group with championship. Aspirations the thing that I point to is that you know things are Kinda razor thin here though. I asked for a Western Conference executive last night Saturday night. And we were talking about the Lakers. And you know obviously we're not we're talking about defense is fishing rather than the record but even when you look at their record seven one looks good but then you say they were down Nineteen Chicago so one looks good but Dallas should've fouled the the Lakers to not allow day green. Get that shot off on the corner because they had a foul to give a horrific missed a moving screen but absolutely food. Dwight Howard Helm Seth Curry so they and several one looks good but Lebron James. How can this be sustainable through eighty two games at some point? He told me he has no plan to load. Manage is something but at some point you figure he sits and also also at some point you know for him to be really this amped up in November and he's going to do it for seven more months in a row a AH that possible and so there's a lot to feel encouraged about so far with this team but I don't think it's an open and shut case at all in terms terms of them being a championship favor. Bobby I thought Rob Pelinka. I've criticized Palinka pretty pretty heavily. I thought the way the team together last year. I mean I guess you could attribute some of that. The Magic Lebron. But you know he's the head of the basketball operations so he's he has attached to him about the way put the team together. Last year was highly flawed about. He gave up way too much. Anthony Davis and it sort of puts a weight around their ankle improving going forward. Those things I stand by that said I. I think the way they put this team together. There was a clear cohesive vision the types of players that they wanted to put on this roster this year once they had Anthony Davidson Lebron the full once they knew what they had and he did it without having the full array of talent available because while there was a deep frigid class. A lot of. It'd come I'm off the board. By the time the Lakers got going because they had to wait uncle I which I don't blame them for I give him credit for putting this team together specifically we've got defensive players and they got players who fit with Lebron and they got some players who most of them have been paid. They don't have to worry about you. You know some of them maybe not fitting with Lebron. Because they're worried about getting taken care of what they did a pretty good output in this roster together. I didn't think it was a championship roster but I'm watching them play defense and I'm wondering wondering what are you seeing as you've watched them play why I think a lot of it that we kind of overlooked a little bit. Who is coaching staff? And you know when you Frank Vogel got hired you know we we. We talked about him being kind of like the. You know the third choice here you know it was either Monty Williams or tied Lou or you know he was kind of a kind of a guy who had been in Orlando had had failed success but also aside really good success in Indiana with those teams there and had a defensive mindset and then when they added Jason Kidd who was about he was kind of the coach in waiting. But we forget how great of a defensive player that kid was back in his day when when he played in New Jersey in in Dallas there. And then you know and then you get outline homes who from the Memphis days that you mentioned minded so a lot of that has to contribute to their some of their success right there also and Phil Handy too. Yeah you're right but yeah your last two years. I believe correct I know he no. He didn't the last five years. Yeah he did he he. I'm sorry brain fired on that but go ahead sorry about it. No but I think going back to the you know. We talked about the coach but the personnel is that yeah I mean I thought it was not. I don't WanNa say easy but when you do. Anthony Davis type deal. And when you're basically giving everything right except for Kaku Sma I my big critique or my question regarding the front office was all right now now what are you going to do with with the rest of the roster right now now comes. The hard part is sparsely. When you don't have when you don't get quiet and I thought you saw July Eighth July ninth pretty pretty well executed plan with Danny Green and for for the two years thirty million? You got fortunate with every Bradley as far as at the room level because of his bio in Memphis here. And then you just saw certainly all the other pieces Ron. Rondo certainly been out to whites been kind of Rian. Reinvented here right in coming off the bench here so that the and of course Lebron in healthy. I mean we haven't seen any injuries is yet to these guys here so so for at least for the first. Three weeks record isn't indicative of kind of the pieces working and I think we still have a little bit of way to go l. but as you guys know is that all you need to do just string along games win three three four. Don't go on losing streak and all of a sudden you're going to get some separation here. Yes so dave the clippers. It's pretty clear that they are going to be sitting. Kawhi out of back back to backs wouldn't surprise me if they sit. Paul George Addison back. toback says well they're willing to take some losses Bryan made it pretty clear to you. You had a conversation precision with them and then wrote a story about it. He actually referred to himself in the third person on that story. One of my favorite quotes for Lebron recent recently. But he. He said he doesn't want to send Southie. Lebron play. I'm only talking about Lebron. which is he's saying? I'm not making judgment on Kawhi. I'm just talking about myself. Well it's reminding me Leeann like I'll add on the part that I spoke to someone with the clippers and they think that he's still pays two or three weeks away if not a month away from being in shape and so they are entering this season. You know obviously there so much attention for them in the off season opening night. They beat the Lakers. and Oh my gosh. They look unstoppable. The the first couple of games but they're taking their sweet old time and that means dropping some games while allies being low advantage on back to backs. That's fine if it means giving Paul George an extra runway before he takes off. That's fine if it means that quite Leonard. They know he won't beat even in shape basketball shape until say December when you think he's a shame by the way I'm just telling you this is some within the I know I know I I know I know I'm just saying he's he's in pretty good shape. He may not be at the top of his own individual spectrum. But yeah that's right. I think I think he's playing to the best of the best. Have a higher one percent. That's the rest and so I just remember Lebron basically in a varying series like eventually. I just decided me personally. I would stop asking him about three years ago because he would just shut you down. He would be basically like you. Don't know how feel you're not going to count my minutes. It's all worry about my minutes and he would always talk about how the amount of minutes he would play in a game wasn't as is important as is how many days he had to play in the season. You know other words Don't worry about my minute average because to me the whole act of getting ready and recovering from game is no different whether I played thirty four forty one but then a couple years later he played eighty two games so you know he's always moving the target. Forget he just you know at the end of the day. He doesn't WanNa hear it. He doesn't want to talk about he doesn't want to. I don't know if it's thing he doesn't want to show weakness or I don't know why but it's just It's never been a topic that he wants to embrace Well he's also framed when I spoke to him after the game the other night he said you. Member mean not Lugano into the Terai Logan into in Cleveland about him wanting me to rest and not. I didn't want to rest and you know quite clearly if the if the does come to with this this season where he sat out a lot of when he's relatively healthy. It's going to be something that Frank Vogel and Rob Pelinka have to own versus Lebron. You know using as part of his own personal regimen to get ready for the playoffs. Because he's made it clear that you know. Hey it's up to me on other on the court so I remember it was a game I think his second year in Cleveland. They're now maybe there's third year in Cleveland. After they won the championship they were GonNa play. They were playing in. Oklahoma City was a national TV game. It was the second night of a back to back and tie. Lou had announced the night before are that Kevin Love Lebron and Kyrie. We're going to sit that night. Your close friends. It was in Memphis. Isn't it this but the the game that they were going to sit with an Oklahoma City no knows memphis. This may have been happy to Memphis to but I promise you this. The game was Oklahoma City because I was at the game and I think Lebron basically pushed back when I was like no we want to play this game and I remember maybe about an hour hour or an hour an hour and fifteen minutes before tip off A number say why. I know that it happened Oklahoma City but I remember walking out on the court to do some TV and there were these kids. They're the cavs fans and they were like. Oh they you know they they said we're so bummed that the bronze not gonNA play. We drove down from which Itar wherever and I was like. Oh actually is gonNA play and the like one one of the best things I've ever had opportunity to do was to give that family. You know the news that he was gonNA play you know but the once it was announced they were going to play it triggered a massive Switching the line in the lines and it like caused the like the betting the the betting markets will shut down because of how vastly quickly the lines changed and they suspected foul play. And that's how I remember. It was Oklahoma City Eighty. But we're we're both right and I jumped the gun on you so I apologize. There was a game the season they won the championship. Where tight told Kevin Lebron and Kyrie tonight even bother coming to Memphis on the second back to back and they all they all stayed rested for management and? Didn't even get on the plane to go from Cleveland. which if Mary would be a fine today unless the league decides that they're injured and then it wouldn't be a fine and but then if the cavs would say that they aren't injured than it would be fine? That's what we learned this last week. I'll get a call about that. So speaking of top defensive teams. Bobby Lobby If you take a look at the rating so far and again ten games and not significant but not nothing a couple of teams that have very highly ranked offense aunts and defense which is one of the things that you look at for a high level team one of the teams that ranks up there in the top seven in both walkie bucks. They were top defensive of team last year they had the MVP They've played relatively well early in the going this year. so not a surprise but guess who else is up there as top I think seven offense and defense in the early going the defending nding champion Toronto Raptors who you know all due respect to their championship not a whole lot of people gave them much of a chance to do anything this year and they have played extraordinarily well out of the gates and Pascal got his Max contract and has been absolutely spectacular dropped forty I think on Friday night. Forty four. Something like that on Friday night Just like I raising start to their season. Fred Van Vliet has had a couple of spectacular games and then they get walloped upped where they lose Kyle lowry and Serge Ibaka on the same night bobby like the raptors. What do you think? Their outlook is having seen them now. For the first three four weeks of the season well the two injuries are killers. Because if you watch this team there's really no depth to it right they basically Nick nurse plays eight guys Van -vely in Larry minutes rank in the top six overall. I think Larry's at thirty six and Fred is at thirty seven and now you get a box out with this with the ankle. And he's averaged twenty three minutes so now you're you're basically relying on norm Powell castle. Og Who's been really good Siachen as you said is played out an all the NBA level in fleet. mccaw Patrick mccaw is out to with an injury and the as I call them the band of second chance players the Stanley Johnson Rhonda Halls Jefferson. That crew has basically been nonexistent here. I mean toz. Jeffersons played one game in Stanley. Johnson's played three games. Averaging three four minutes a night so It's it's it's IT'S A. It's a thin bench here. Brian and I mean maybe you'll get something out of terrence Davis undrafted player. Played a little bit here Matt. Thomas was playing overseas but yeah it's it's a thin benched where you have seen a lot of Kyle lowry and Vanfleet here so we we always say next man up here. But I don't know who I don't know who the next man up is when we look at the back end here. Yeah I'm I'm really enjoying the nick nurse. Give No bleeps a media man early in the season In in training camp he basically just openly ripped Stanley Johnson around Dallas Jefferson. He's like yeah. They're not defending anywhere near the way want them to. You know they're not gonNA play. It's it's preposterous. It was it was like this innocuous question like how's your new guys doing not good not good and then last week Siaka I think fouled out of the first two games. He played this year and he's just been in foul trouble all along and somebody asks snake about the fouls and he's like well he's committing stupid fouls it's gotTa stop it and I just love it because you know he's speaking the truth and look I mean he's a championship coach and Siaka aside. He doesn't he's got to have a good relationship with them to a certain extent and by the way CEAC I'm totally back them up like he came out and said I'm coming stupid fouls and he by the way since that has happened. He's he's he's knocked spouse way down but I love nurse basically saying like this is this is really bittersweet Dave because they were. I've been so impressive way playing and I think in real time. Both injuries happened in like less than fifteen minutes. Or twenty minutes and Bacha. I didn't see an announcement today. They're spoke to expect it to make announcement after an MRI. I but they're basically saying it's a bad ankle sprain like weeks and weeks possibly for a bacchus so you know considering the East is you know still somewhat unsure that was a pretty significant turn of events want a team. That is better than I thought. Yeah and it's it's tough because of the players and bobby rightfully so gave a shout-out to nobody you miss their championship run with a appendicitis last ear and the EPA in obviously Pascal has been so good but those players they're not necessarily make up for what surgeon surge in. Kyle give you you know you don't have the playmaking ability. A Pascal is around forces per game which is better than a Lotta people thought it would be at a when I entered it in this league but who makes up for that playmaking and then you know neither of those guys are giving you the protection action the steady screen setting in rebounding. And so on some lovey like it. It gives a chance for these other guys to take even more of the pie that they didn't have before but I think it does leave their team. You know kind of soft at those positions and original Nichols reported that will get an update on Larry in two weeks and it's you know it's the displaced fracture in the left thumb. And perhaps that's something he can heavily wrapped and he's headed player. We'll see but he played it for fun injury all last year all last year and then most most of the seats and then it had to have surgery I think it was on that thumb that same thought. I think it was After the season. So that's worrisome some thumbs or something that you know that they they take a while to heal and the need them pretty bad and this speaking of Eastern conference teams who are doing really well. No now had injury setbacks devastating news on Saturday for the Celtics. They're in San Antonio had a nice win and lost Gordon Hayward to a broken hand it sounds like he might have surgery on Monday. I wasn't clear they're going to send them to a specialist but it sounds like something surgeries possibility. So you're looking at weeks there Bobby that's You know they'd been off to a great start. The top of the East standings They they had been without Jalen Brown for awhile and Kemba Walker started it off the season really shaky. He's been coming on what I'm saying is they hadn't even been at their best yet. And we're we're we're getting to the top happinesses a yet another setback for them. So how do you think this affects them. Well you're probably going to see a lot of devante green. Who was Kinda Eh? You Know Boston's got an a knack of finding these American or even you know international guys over in Germany and green played over there. He's you know he's twenty thirty. Six years old undrafted he wants Hayward went out in the San Antonio game he came in and played thirteen minutes. And give you six or seven point. So you'll probably see Marcus smart. Go to to the starting lineup. And you'll see a lot of devante green and you're right. I mean hayward before he got hurt I mean he was you know twenty any points. Eight rebounds forty four percent from three. I mean we were. We saw the Utah version of Gordon Hayward here and you not mets won seven in a row and got a little bit of a you know. I don't want to say soft schedule. He's Got Dallas at home. That's certainly would be formidable. But you've got Washington and then you had west for Golden MM STATE SACK PHOENIX CLIPS and in Denver here. So they've they've they've given themselves in especially in east when you when you can get off to a good start like this and you look at the back end right the back end of the standings here when you've got teams that are four and five at seven eight. They've given himself a little bit of separation. And right now they try to withhold hayward coming out but hey you still have Kemba you still have as you said Jaylen Brown Jason Tatum here. We'll see if cancer can get back unhealthy. You still have Marcus Smart. So they're they're still some some good pieces there feel like it's a different different injury Brian for for Hayward then considering what's going on Toronto I I think that they have more depth there and they should be of continued to stack. But obviously you fairly mentioned their schedule. Hasn't been all that difficult. They've played you know that that that big win against Milwaukee and they put some other tougher opponents. But they've also had some gimmes seems to me like a lot of people just sort of have affiliate Milwaukee as the two teams are going to have to have the battle royale to win the east this year and because of Kyri departure that there's an assumption that Boston will take a step back. I don't know where I see Boston long term. I think I think I think Kemba is a spectacular ocular player to have on your on your team I really got to know him well in his game well over the summer when I was when I was covering team USA. I'd never watched that a closely in person for that long. But I you know my viewpoint on it is and I think the results in Charlotte bear this out. I think he's spectacular player to have on your team. I think he'll win you individual games here and there but I don't think he can be your best player. Chips are down. Just think his size limits what he can do. That's that's why I thought this season was going to be a lot about tatum. But you know assuming that hayward recovers from this bobby should we. Should we be after what you should we be including Boston as a real contender. Monks amongst those these teams. Our record speaks to at this point yeah. I don't know if I'm ready to put them. I guess we tear them right. We have to deteriorate with Philly in Milwaukee in Boston certainly Toronto. Maybe even Miami go go into that next group here. I don't I don't know if I'm ready to put them up there with a with those two teams because you said there. The schedule's been you know he had opened up with Philly and certainly good winning a Toronto. But you had New York twice. You'VE CLEVELAND YOU'VE HAD CHARLOTTE. You went down to San Antonio won by twenty so I think you had a little bit of a light schedule but I think what Boston what you're finding out is sometimes less is less is better right when you have. I always say it's the one is less mouths house to feed. When you've got guys I kinda know their roles a little bit different than last year when maybe you had maybe too much talent? That sounds funny to say. But you've we've got you know Jaylen Brown the play thirty plus minutes and Jason Tatum and naive Kemba here and you don't you can shorten your bench a little bit here. I think that's probably a little bit that year for Brat to work with Dave. Do you see them. You've been impressed with them at all. You see them as a real contender. There I've been impressed. I I can't put them at the same level as Philly. 'cause I just I I believe there's so much to beat in a playoff series being. It's so tough kanner. And the time Lord really going to be that people stain work and contain him. My my guess is they're going to have a different center by the playoffs. But we'll see okay. Well perhaps that'd be their solution. There and I- Milwaukee honest is still so dynamic more so than the players that I see on on Boston. LS TATUM GOES BACK TO ROOKIE PLAYOFF TATUM. who was a revelation? But I I. They should feel good about what they've done. So far. You mentioned them losing to have them. Losing out. Horford been such a staple of their team with the era Baynes who gave them valuable minutes and so I applaud them for their star I got to see continued development particularly out of Brown down and tatum throughout the next sixty game or seventy games. I guess Before I feel really strongly about their postseason chances. No Boston love here. Wow now so another disappointment for hayward he's had like a black cloud over his head since he got the Boston and I mean the one thing I think people forget Ah Hayward Sterling doesn't forget but you know he. These mentioned all the time but he had to have a follow up procedure. You know that that that ankle we had surgery on after the break. It wasn't quite right. He had to have a follow up procedure which I assume was resulted in some bad too. So now he does he have the the horrible the injury itself but then it doesn't heal quickly follow procedure which is one of the reasons why he wasn't at his best last year because he had been set back recovery and now he's finally back with the full year because not just off the surgery again. The second surgery is what you had to kind of look at and he's finally back then this you you know unfortunate kind of freak injury happens. Think he'd be building up. Some Positive Karma at some point. But I'M GONNA say this ten games in. He looked pretty. Damn good Bobby he's Hayward's gotTA option his contract for next year knowing what we know about the free agent market being pretty thin assuming he recovers continues to play that way. Uh I won't be surprised if he opts out of that deal would you I. I wouldn't and it's funny. You know I wrote about the free agents of two thousand twenty. I think during the summer and how Lena group who is going to be in and I think I had like hayward cranked like fourth or fifth on like the small forward and his agent more Bartlestein called me and gave me bat. You know like in a fun way but instead like hey. You're underestimating Gordon. He's going to have a great year this year. We're going to see like the Utah version of Gordon Hayward we've seen it we saw it in the first eater. Eight Games here and it. It's interesting thing that say when you say opt out maybe not look for a bigger contract or for as far as that number but you know we've seen guys certainly opt out. We saw Harrison Barnes do and maybe take a little bit less but get some security on the on the on the back end here. So so you know the guys like Hayward Hayward Andre Drummond I would say probably unlikely Mike Conley in Utah with that that big number there but yeah I mean maybe even who knows what happens in Chicago without a quarter guys that do have those you know twenty five thirty million dollar player options. I'm sure we'll think about it as far as what to do. That's some watch for sure but yeah so off to a great start unfortunately all right well thank you very much guys. Thank you bobby. Thank thank you Dave for spending some time with us. Thanks for listening. Have a good week and we'll talk to you. I'm pretty sure a new house might be haunt. What makes you say that the furniture is levitating taking on the ghost? Welcome home yeah. That's that's book you know what's really scaring missing out on Geico for help with homeowners and renters insurance durance GEICO makes it easy to see bunch. Great you're not sticking around is just getting started. Ah Call today and see how easy homeowners and renters insurance can be.

David Brian Bobby Dave Anthony Davidson Lebron League Lakers Miami NBA Gordon Hayward Anthony Davis Dion Lebron James Boston Kemba Walker marijuana Phoenix Jimmy Butler Bynum cavs Naples basketball Cleveland
Part 2: Quarantine Rotten Tomatoes and News (ACS Mar 23)

The Adam Carolla Show

53:11 min | 1 year ago

Part 2: Quarantine Rotten Tomatoes and News (ACS Mar 23)

"Thanks for listening to the Adam Corolla show on podcast one all right. We play a home bound rotten tomatoes game and also latest list of celebrities with In the news. Obviously with the corona virus. I I'll tell you about Geico do you own your Sherry to one or the other you WanNa Bundle? Good deal with your insurance. I know those policies with GEICO GEICO DOT COM. Make it easy to bundle your homeowners and renters insurance along with your auto policy. It's a good thing too because you already have so much to do around your home. Just go to GEICO DOT COM. Get a quote G. See just how much you could be saving at Geiko. It makes it easy at GEIKO DOT com. It's time to check Adams voicemail just wondering with all this virus stuff going around and people attracted your their homes. How's that affected you and specifically your whacking off. Are you spending more time in one particular piece of porn or are you just sticking to regularise next you can leave a message at eight? Eight eight six three four one seven four four actually down say output. You know the the promises. I'm scared of technology and I knew it was going to have to use the computer for the next week for all this stuff and I'm scared of something horrific and embarrassing just going to pop up so I've slowed my rawal that's right. I thought he's a thought mom and then he's talking about porn. I was so confused. All right let's play the game. Dawson fingers crossed links did spotted. No all right. Well if you're stuck at your house alone you're not alone. Everyone's quarantined right now. And in honor of this very strange time. We're doing movies that take place almost exclusively in one location. Only our first film is not for the faint of heart. Ninety eight minutes of Ryan Reynolds buried alive in a casket with only a cell phone and a lighter. Two Thousand Ten's buried yeah. Brian Likes US on cable a couple of weeks ago. I think I like this. This is a solid movie. I recommend it sharing a moment of the critics. Like I don't know talking about this movie. The entire. You're looking at almost the entire movie on this post. Or why Reynolds wakes up buried in the Middle Eastern Desert contractor right and he makes up has been buried and there's a cellphone in there and he tacked but it's like Yeah can you get out in time to find him? He doesn't worry is. This is like a claustrophobic nightmare. Two hours of this Nelson short movies. All right I I've heard from Brian. It was before this and The eight minutes I saw the other day was kind of entertaining I'M GONNA say critics liked it at seventy one on a little higher. I liked this movie. I said eighty-three this could be a personal thing. I Never WanNa be putting this situation and I don't want to watch it. I said fifty seven buried is certified fresh at eighty six percent. I'm shocked and the people have it at sixty four. That's weird that at bigger. You see this with like a remember the Jaylo stripper movie. I'd like people see like Oh Ryan Reynolds movie in big round mouse waiting. Just friends or yells wacky comedies. Van Wilder has been just like. Yeah this very claustrophobic drama. And like what the Hell's this all right here. We go in our next film. Jodie foster and her young daughter played by a pre twilight Kristen Stewart or forced into hidden room of their newly acquired house while forest whittaker and his cronies. Try to break inside. It's two thousand. Two's panic room movie. This is going to be more upsetting than it was. Yeah it because the the theme seemed like it was a perfect. Like we'd set the table for being really upset or jostle their jarred or whatever. It wasn't as intense as I remember. I didn't know that was kristen. Stewart Zor daughter too great performances. This movie one from Jared Leto. One Dwight Yoakam right over. All right people liked it. They didn't love it. It's fresh at. I saw it in the theater. What Year Resist Austin two thousand to two thousand two? I think with theater all right. I say fresh at seventy four seventy six sixty five or you guys just dancing around it. Panic Room is certified fresh at seventy five. Oh good game. So far and ensemble cast assembled in a gothic mansion when the host of the party is mysteriously murdered. Who did it in what room and with what weapon based on the Popular Board Game? It's nine thousand. Nine hundred eighty five clue. Yeah was this a star studded affair. Lesley Ann Warren Tim Curry Martin Mall Soft Head. Michael mckeon God there's a few more to Madeline Kahn Yeah. Lots of great. Great candidate Daniel I don't remember seeing this theater. I don't remember thinking it was that good or hearing that it was that good. I had a all star cast for the time. I'm going to say Christopher Lloyd. It was not beloved badly. An icee forty six to fifty one. Well someone's got to break the ice and it might as well be me. I mean I'm used to being the host as part of my husband's working. I'm always difficult with a group of new friends. We'd together for the first time to get acquainted so I'm perfectly prepared to start the ball rolling. I mean I've absolutely no idea what we're doing what I'm doing here what this is about. But I've determined to enjoy myself berry tree. Doodo mind. The soups delicious isn't it? I said fifty five. Wow Okay guy doesn't matter stay. Locked up for another believes will be here by then and dead bodies study. I've seen this movie. Maybe a thousand times Wow please have taboo to be one of the next break so I can sing. The theme had clue is fresh. One and Gina Grad is the closest sixty one percent. Wow just fresh audience likes it. Yeah Eighty six. It's fun m night Shyamalan produced but did not direct. This low budget thriller about a group of strangers trapped in the elevator. The twist one of them is actually the devil. It's two thousand ten's devil never heard of it like this was where from the minded them nutshell lost to be more harm than the the game is fairly close and this is going to be a change. Because I don't think we think this is fresh but it could be fifty one and it could be eleven and The the world did start to turn on him night and I wasn't this film where they did it. I say yes. I go bold it nineteen percent. I want a little higher. I remember hearing. This wasn't atrocious. But not good said forty four percent. I said thirty nine devil is rotten at fifty one percent. Oh Damn Muslim one of my example. Amit poster at the down button for the upside down cross. Our last film breaks the rules a little bit and does bounce around to a other locations but most of it takes place at the bottom of an isolated Canyon in Utah based on a true story. James Franco plays a mountain climber trapped under a Fallen Boulder for one hundred twenty seven hours in two thousand. Ten's one hundred twenty seven hours. The greatest is a tough watch. I heard it was good but I never wanted to watch it because that one scene that we know. We don't want to watch dion. I'm almost Chris can look this up. I think it won the Oscar for either sound designer. Sound mixing because of that. One scene braces on arm odds brutal. A flashback. To all right I'm way off the pace year. I'M GONNA have to hit this wall on dead nuts on and I am going for eighty seven right there with good movie. Eighty eight eighty eight one hundred twenty. Seven hours is certified rush at ninety three percent. Moving it for me do the math. I I do standing by. Oh Yeah. That's right. Calcuta Drummer Brian. This I think I'm out but I I know him out gene. Brian seems pretty closely. We'll Adam congratulations. You made the podium coming in with a score of sixty nine Gina Grad bested Adam Gina Grad. Your score is lower than Adams. And it's fantastic. That in this game that means you came in first or second place Bald Bryan. Your score is twenty six. Oh ooh Gina Grad with your score. You are in second place. Sixty two the had what was genus score. Sixty two to beat. You know you're well. The Person Buried really got me twenty six. That's a dams or a good thing. I've got rotten tomatoes right here. All right let me hit Ziprecruiter hiring used to be hard multiple job sites. Stacks Resumes Confusing Review Process today. A hiring is easy. Just go to one place. Good is recruiter dot com slash. Adam ziprecruiter sends your job to over one hundred. The Web's leading job boards plus ziprecruiter scans thousands of resumes to find people with the right experience and invites them to apply to your job as applications come rolling in ziprecruiter analyzes. Each one spotlights top candidates. So you never miss a great match. Four out of five employers who post on Ziprecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. It is the best. It's Ziprecruiter. Right Dawson right now. Our listeners can ziprecruiter for free at this exclusive web address ziprecruiter dot com slash item. That's ziprecruiter dot com slash eighty ziprecruiter dot com slash Adams ziprecruiter. The smartest way to hire all right. We'll take a quick break. We'll come back with the home news right after this draft news. Gino breaks all those crazy truck to get Gino throbbing gene gene. The news with Gene Grad. Well Adam you wanted names and I continue to have names with corona virus People testing positive and today's almost seems like fake news. But I it's it's up on a couple of sources. Harvey Weinstein has corona virus now in solitary confinement over at Wendy Correctional Facility in western New York That was first reported by Niagara Gazette. I think a bunch of people picked it up since Prince. Prison officials said. He's one of two inmates who have tested positive. And we serving twenty. Three years for rape was recently transferred to the state prison from rikers. He also had two stints in Bellevue Hospital where he underwent a heart procedure and they said he's he already had cope in nineteen when he entered Wendy next on the list not related to each other. I WOULD IMAGINE PLACIDO. Domingo tested positive racist lungs. Man We got him. That's exactly right. And he was just recently in the news for a couple of metoo issues so I figured that's why his name was back Was back trending. But no seventy nine years old. He says his family all in good health experience fever coughing and got tested. And he's positive. Andy O n Mister Watch what happens live a host. He was going to start doing the show from his house. He is just incomplete arrested in recovery mode. He said a Friday on his instagram page. Here has it. Does anyone know anybody yet? At of our crew who has contracted this to people. I know personally but anyone we now you you have frank where would you call them friends or their a one x co worker and one girl. I saw for briefly became friends with So Yeah Oh no. Not couple with the tickle in their throat that these new separate people her is like a news personalities. Amos seth down. He's on I think he's either sixty minutes or CBS. Or something like that and he was reporting in Italy somewhere. He's somewhere and you got it. Yeah there's really no one's kind of a special circumstance but you know to people that have contracted I I don't haven't I don't think I know anybody who I talked to My Nanny Olga. Who knows somebody who knows somebody kind of thing? But I haven't found anybody yet that the that I know. Yeah me either The list continues by the way rand. Paul Senator Rand Paul He became the first senator to test positive to congressman also positive former football player and bachelor star Colton Underwood. He tested positive actress. Debbie Masar David Brian the Bon Jovi keyboardist. He tested positive. Of course we knew. Tom Wilson are. We going to be surprised when celebrities start making it up because I said what a verify. It's just like hey everyone of you know. Trust the positive way to get get their name just to get their name in the news or be relevant again like. Hey I'm Scott bail and I've got got when when Bonnici about it. You should be a little dubious so okay good. Now we got a bunch of people we've heard of Not good for them but right good for me in my mind. I WANNA see happens. I heard Rita Wilson was like wrapping today or something or yesterday about it. I don't know if you guys heard that she was Max Pat might be able to find it but she did a ramp. She did like a you know stuck at home wrap. I thought okay. That's good so I wanNA start hearing about these people coming out coming out the other side of it right and like we're talking to Young Matt and my my thought was never that no one was going to get it. My thought was people. Were going to get it. And they were going to pass through it but they couldn't get it at the same time because that might clog up the system But so far I think I think it's cycling through people. We'll know in the next week because now we have all these people and if they all come out like the hang side did then we should all feel a little better that if we do at yet it's not going to be a death sentence but that wrap Max Patas is that I feel like that We by while some time. It's not just not a death sentence but it's enough social. Distancing hospitals will have capacity to handle that people who do get sick. The I forget the guy's name the Matt who was on earlier. You know at an ancient hospital right right but I'm I'm I'm happy to hear that he didn't need to go to hospital even though we went to a hospital and and got tested but he could just go home and convalesce. But here's Rita wrapping like sitting and reading a book. She's wearing a lot of eyeliner doing naughty by nature a moment but you couldn't make McCain working in Ulan but you never looked my way and looking down you dominated a single on the way the got to do shampoo so much ahead and shoulder brother old enough to fold your told you a rate afraid of what I Made. Him played it with some tips and tricks with that music. Can Your funky frigates from the town. Council feels now. The deals that were real so was still round. Donate the Phantom in. Trying to be handsome shrinking. What you're thinking because I live in data hip hop discipline today. Great Rita Wilson is now b-actor. I love wrapping so I feel I feel good about that. And if I'm stricken with this and a couple of weeks might be backed lucrative ramping. So there's a kind of an offshoot story of standing by your man because we know. Idris Elba tested positive guests. Who ELSE DID HIS WIFE. You know why. Because when he tested positive she wouldn't leave his side and she knew that she was probably going to get it and get she said. I don't WanNa be away from my man. I don't WanNa be Corentin away from my man. We'll get it together but I'll if he has it I want it. Is She twenty years younger than him? Or is this a great case? Were black not cracking. I think she might a little younger. I want to say mouth it could be both. I mean. I don't know if she looks. She looks to be thirty two. And he's forty eight or something like that but if she just looks thirty two and she's forty one or she looks pretty darn young or addresses. And you know it's a second marriage or any of that you're GONNA get look if your partner has this. You either have it not going to have it or have it in. It doesn't really affect you so any outcomes possible you're there you're there you have to have the notion of you while. I gotta go leave. Which is like you've been very intimate if not intimate with this person while they've had and we're talking to Matt from West Hollywood at thirty two his girlfriend's just living with him and she doesn't appear to be affected by it. So maybe that's that's it. How old is she? She's by the way she's twenty nine ish twenty nine thirty. He's forty seven forty eight. Sorry drew there you go. Yeah and let's see here just a couple a couple of things to add to the news roundup on this. When Prince Harry called off the INVICTUS Games? That's basically like the Olympics Olympic competition among wounded service people all us and Mexico to close the border. Or any I know it's a little It's not Special Olympics but it's it's Paralympic style. Might be a must be as we'll be. Paul you know. Some of these people are blind right. They should make them feel like it's going on. You know what I mean. There's still there's the forty yard dash. We got a full stadium. Yeah that's what I'm saying. We're in Dover already yes we are Us Mexico agreeing to close the border. New York's Governor Andrew Cuomo follow California's lead out here ordered the Near complete shutdown of the state. It's essentially Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin announced that we keep following up on this because it keeps getting tweaked a little bit tax deadline has been moved completely from April fifteenth to July fifteen. At first it was. You have to file. But you don't have to pay all these little things. No no no completely moved a number of deaths worldwide surpassed ten thousand two hundred forty thousand cases. It seems like Let's see Governor Gavin Newsom here in California Thursday ordered all residents. Stay at home and they I believe they call it a safer at home measure Dr Drew about this. So curious is show a shortly before we began this He said that we will know in the next few days where this thing is going so if it said sixty thousand cases either the US or worldwide camera when he said probably worldwide or maybe us he said look. It's either going to be a hundred or or to go the other direction. We'll we'll know in the next few days what direction things are going and I. I tend to believe him. He also was talking about the Anti Malaria stuff. That's pretty pretty effective. Since we working for people also said people may want to start taking this prophylactically like just take it so you don't get sick. They'll take it after you get sick and that kind of stuff. But he seemed like he thought it was moving in the right direction. And I and I think we're GONNA know fast I don't I don't know that's going to take six weeks to figure out where we're going where we're at like. I feel like by the end of this week. We're in a pretty good idea of whether it's full cluster. Fuck Shit hit the fan or are right. We're sort of coming down the other side flattening. The by the way we talked about something on the Conway show the other night. That made me think of you. I think in some ways it flies in the face of everything you're about but on the other hand it's innovative and interesting and thought it might. Pique your interest. Have you heard of something and I? I wonder if Dr has something called. Mono foil no NFO. I L. Chris. I don't know if you can pull up the website. But that's costner ship from waterworld. Yes mind if you knew what. It was No it's this you you buy it by the gallon. It's like almost four hundred bucks a gallon. And it's the sort of disinfectant that last when you put it on one surface apparently it lasts disinfecting for thirty days actively disinfecting thirty days and ahead a little side tip to give to people as I was reaching for the box. I have a box. That has the eyeglass cleaners a little foil container with the Moisten Palette. And that's just alcohol. I think in that so would after research it but in a world where everything's at a premium the pure al and the wipes and everything If if if the place is all out of that stuff order a box of those alcoholic wipes or something so in research at first but you know made might help an appeal and Shark. Sure well and also. I don't think I have the story in front of me. But at least three distilleries in southern California are switching over to making hand sanitizer instead of you know whiskey so yeah until we run low on whiskey and then obviously. I don't know how you guys are feeling but I I've I've never panicked about this but the more I hear about people getting and not dying the better I feel about. It's definitely good. News people try to return all their shit. They hoarded a costco and cost in general. We'll take back anything. They took back hot dogs from me that I had sitting out all day. I don't think they were available for resale but they they take back anything. They will not take back things that people were. Panicking ratings book will now Many people realizing that they don't need toilet paper and paper towels for the next fourteen years They said high demand items like toilet paper bottled water sanitizing wipes rice Lysol. These are all things that Costco. At least certain Costco's you check your local costco. Give it to you early neighbor in quality assurance you bought it. You didn't need it. I'm glad you had it for a while. Now give it's A. It's a good idea. Pot that is IRV like hoarding something. And then turning the ball balls. Christ that is pathetic. Fighting people for it and elbowing people out of the way the car and all of a sudden. I think to Shiloh paper. So sorry figure out what to do that Oh and speaking of that. Speaking of toilet paper many people sent me this august Senate to be lynched senator. We gotta get to it. There is a toilet paper website So his households continue to stock up on this stuff emptying shelves. Everywhere you go. A new website is attempting to really show you how long your toilet paper is GonNa last. It's called how much toilet paper Dot Com. And this is. This is an example of it. So it's a website created by a software student developer Ben Sasson and artists Sam Harris. They're both based in London in response to this pandemic is according to CNN. It's a tool that calculates. Just how much? Just how long your stash of toilet paper will last you Anna Coren Dean so the basic algorithm is you. Tell them how many roles you have. And how important is it to the toilet per day? There's an advanced one that'll tell you you can put in. How many squares you use and all this type of thing but I put in mine and we only have two two bags of toilet paper and it's just because that's what we always have and apparently we have four hundred eighteen percent of the supply that we need. So I think we're all probably going to be okay And Ceylan. Somebody's doing it right now here. So if you have twelve roles and you go four times a day you should be good for forty eight days so it'll give you if this is something that apparently is on a lot of people's mind go to how much toilet paper. Dot Com and hopefully that information will help ease your mind dairy in sad revelation this obsession with toilet paper that I'm sort of unaware of my entire adult life that somebody is. It's a regression to me like it feels like everyone's turned into a nine year old nurse or something. It's like the tile. Yeah it's a weird sad state and I also would love to know like country to country and culture to culture cool would go for the toilet paper. I don't believe they'd be doing this in Finland or maybe even Japan they wanNA have toilet paper but it wouldn't be go to hoard ride them then. Also how much of this begat toilet paper hoarding like? Maybe it's just Mama June from that's stupid reality show us like maybe somebody saw her morning. Honey Boo boo. They saw her hoarding. It just trickled down. Yeah Animals yes. It's like one trendsetter with this hoarding. I remember you know the tip of the Spear Mike August after we play Arizona and we stayed in his credit me. The duffel Bill Sharman probably curve. Yeah that was nine years ago but is it people seeing other people like we do have a thing anyone who's off the freeway and there's two lanes to turn left and see one lane completely backed up and the other one is wide open. And you think yourself why doesn't ruin this slide into the open because they pull behind the person that's already in line did that cause it or have some secret obsession with toilet paper. I think it's probably both. I think it's the me me me. What about me. I don't get that job and also when you're at the grocery store I was just there yesterday. And they like Emmy describe. The other day was a one in one out so once we got in there was probably fifteen shoppers and the whole store and everything was orderly. It was like vacation and there is beautiful quiet fully stocked except for paper products and there were still a few things that were a little low and when one or two people would go toward an item. You can't help it to go. What are they looking over there? Is that something I need so I think I think it's just part of who we are buying herd mentality the Just for Everyone's Information I was walking around yesterday. I passed a trader. Joe's that had this sort of thing going on leading people let them out Blah Blah and I said what is the system and they said five people in at a time after five people leave made sense and then I said how many people in the store like at any given time approximately this a good sized trader. Joe's sick I said about forty or fifty. I sorta peeked in and it looked sparse but there were people in there so that seems to be let some number and and then let five out put five and it felt like vacation if you experienced any of the long lines and the screaming and the pushing and shoving the craziness just to have ten of US walking around at our leisure and picking up our items and and you know rolling through checkout pretty quickly. It was a delightful experience. I hope what's stays forever as long as people keep behaving themselves At this point I'm sure you guys have seen the CELEB- mash up of everyone. Gal Gadot knows singing. Imagine yes you know was well meaning and she got you know a bunch of celebrities together and they saying this very lovely song and of course you know after a couple of days of everyone enjoying it. Everybody has to shit on it but some people still haven't heard it and here's a clip. Call your own out. This is a minute of maybe the four minutes that it was now known has been honest. Easiest SH Bill hell loves shades of Gray. Imagine oh up people to own sean. Why it is and how do nothing they kill or die for other to show her face. Yup Home. I don't know if you guys I I don't know what's wrong with me but I got one of those things for my agent saying like one of those social distancing things and I was like feels weird. Everyone thought they asked you to. Oh look everyone does they. Don't need me fucking do a story on spring breaks. Does everyone know out the people who will listen now and the people of won't I'm not going to get through to the spring break? Everyone does know but whether or not everyone. It's like who who the guest who is talking about electric trucks and it's like I made the point. I think he's been like a philosophical resistance from a certain group people like good luck. Convincing the truck nuts guided yeah Andrea. It's just certain people that good luck convincing. You know certain people just not. They're not gonNA listen. This is click it or ticket. The people that are wearing their seatbelts wearing their seatbelts. The ones who've chosen not do. It's not that they haven't heard of a seatbelt are unaware seatbelt. They've chosen not to the nineteen year old that Daytona beach is aware of choice. They WANNA do fucking funnel and kicks in. That's out that's that's my video not going to change that. That's the video. That's right so as Brian mentioned about the beaches spring break is finally over in Florida due to the threat of the virus Governor Rhonda Santa's made the announcement Thursday on Fox and friends after images of spring breakers. Just Par T. A. On that beach kept showing up everywhere despite warnings from authorities to employ social distance to Santa's said the message I think for spring breakers is that the party's over in Florida. You're not going to be able to congregate on the beach in any state. Many of the hot spots that people like to go to whether it's Miami Beach Fort Lauderdale clearwater. Beach are closed entirely for the time being and I wonder how quickly this is going to happen in Malibu Newport Because the traffic was not heavy. The last couple of days over the weekend ended the people going to be yeah I don't know I'd like to go the beach but not like getting a crowd and frolic on the beach physically. Look just look at the ocean. I was thinking about this. I keep thinking okay. What what can we get out of this and I thought because trying to kind of put that happy spin on things? I hope that we bring a lot of manufacturing including drug manufacturing back to the United States like I hope this sparks a made in the USA IDA thing and not farm it out to China kind of thing and I also hope that we're able to do a lot more tele doctoring that instead of fucking in your car especially especially when you feel like hell and driving over to the doctor's office and then polluting. The doctor's office with whatever's coming off. Whatever your ship adding like if you you took Dr drew you put them on the teleconference saying he could see. If you're laboring in your breathing. He could see what you look. I mean he could ask you anything. Why does he need to be standing directly in of you? Why do you have to be sitting in a waiting room with other sick people? Look there severally those who need to go in and need to see. But then there's the other eighty percent who really don't it's sort of a sort of looking at it you know trips to the emergency room consultation with the doctor. It's Kinda like nine one one call. It's like some of. It's an actual urgency. But most of it is just somebody saying. There's a cat and tree or my neighbors stereos. Being played too loud or whatever it is if we could streamline a lot of this stuff or even the work from home thing like just thin out the freeways a little have the doctors through the teleconferencing all the stuff. You could take care of without getting in your car and filling the parking lot filling up the waiting room. We could just start moving that direction. That would be a plus came from this. Well your dreams are coming true because I know you don't have a doctor doctor but I got an email from my doctor saying no more in office appointments for the time being. If there's something that you need or you CA- prescription you have to come in for that class you're scheduled to or whatever it will all be done through. Teluk for until further notice so I think I think we're here to your point like it is pretty antiquated. If you think about like big picture like that people in office jobs need to go in five days a week eight hours a day like we're finding now through all of this thing that you can be at home and be effective every day every hour. Maybe two days a week or a week you can very easily work from home. Well it's funny. It's now Harkin me back taking this sentimental walk down memory lane with Kevin and bean when being left the studio when bean said. I'm moving to the Seattle area. That was Max Pad. You can look it up. Oh one I mean isn't it was before my time. So what have been pre a one or before. Yeah of maybe was ninety eight like he went to Seattle and they said you're a heretic. Missile never work. This is impossible. Never in the annals of radio as a morning team physically not been in the same room together the same studio together. How could this were and I would argue that. They have a more viable argument than your doctor. Diagnosing you over the computer because you need to look at each other and sort of establish your rhythm and all that at and they. They did bean up on a monitor. If you went into the K rock studio being would be up on the Monitor. Yes Chris and I'm seeing ninety nine ninety nine. Okay so perfect. They made it twenty years with him teleconferencing. Every single show every morning for four hours and basically didn't miss a beat and they said it was impossible. It'll it'll never happen. It can never work and yet four months after they began or four days after began. It just did for. Marquette work to it works it. That's just what we do mark and Brian. That was the situation toward the end of their partnership and mark in the morning. Mark did the show from his studio in North Carolina and most people didn't notice we were in studio. He was at home right. So all I'm saying is is all those things where you go. How's this GonNa work can't be done? Well how's this GONNA work? You're just saying it because it wasn't formerly done that way but it doesn't mean it's not going to be that way. I don't like gay marriage or something day. Marriage what to fellas getting married. What I was GonNa work can work and now works so think that way and let's just agree that tell. Why should everyone just go? Fill up the cubicles. They're making phone calls on their computer to do whatever they go. Well if you're at home. You're just goofing off but ever since in their cubicle looking at fantasy football scores. So you're goofing off while your work if you have access to your emails in your information and everything so I have a job do that job and do it from comfort safety your own home and you would think the offices would be all for it. Why are you using my power and my plumbing in my electricity to fritter away all the time? Go home you your own will go back and think of Kevin and bean's last studio which was my old Studi our our old studio your old studio from the first thing you notice when you pull up in. There's an eight story. Parking structure just eight stories of nothing but concrete. Like I mean that whole thing gone I mean think about the notion of just building you have to build those sky scrapers and then for every one hundred fifty square feet. You need a parking space in a giant building. It has the same or print now. It has a bigger footprint than the actual skyscraper building itself as a shoulder footprint than the actual parking structure. Just this notion of polling and going and winding up going to the fifth floor and parking and parking passes and stuff and all these parking structures which are gonNA have to be demolished a because they serve no other purpose. You can't convert them into low income housing or anything. It's boom this is going to be one of the things we look at and we're GONNA look at us like we were insane. In a few years I bet harting ledgers like yes stacked on top of each other all right what else. Well you know right now in California and a lot of cities where people are listening. It's really about staying home unless you run an essential business or unless you're going to an essential business and of course by essential. I mean grocery stores. I mean pharmacies. I mean we'd shops. Cnn reports that with this virus was big. Ask stay home. Only essential businesses and dispensaries made the cut their listed under essential infrastructure or healthcare operations that are exempt from having to close. Pass the weed shop and it was open and that's right because people gotta get the medicine but right next to it was an ice cream shop and it was open to guy. Yeah I don't I don't know like I was like going well. There's only one guy behind the counter the ice cream shop. I don't know what's that might be a trickle down like. No one's told them yet like they're not gonna be able to get away with that for very long staying open because a lot of been confused about whether or not. They're allowed to be open. All the restaurants I went by just went. Don't come in will hand the food out to which is basically what we did. And that's what I'm what I'm saying. Oh for sure sorry. Go ahead no speaking of that. Somebody posted this and I don't know how many people this is. GonNa fact but I just thought it was a nice message to pass along if obviously McDonalds and all these places. Dining rooms are closed. So if you're going through A drive through. And you're sitting there you know in the parking lot eaten Burger or whatever and you see a truck pull up. They a lot of those can't make clearance in drive and drive throughs so if you WanNa be a nice guy. You're going to see them. Go Up to the window. You'RE GONNA to see that. They're they can't get an ask anyone doing a long haul if you can just go through the drive thru for them. Because they can't do it. You can't walk through it. Their truck won't make it so. Just be a nice guy and help them out. Gina the history of the existence of females and the existence of the aforementioned McDonald's as any one female ever pulled out Piece Canadian Bacon from their egg. Mcmuffin said I shall discard this because I'm a vegetarian and then had another female in the room. Say don't throw it away. Let's put a thumb tacks right but it up on the wall in our office and put a posted under with the date and then one year from now I shall consume it. Has that ever happened? In the history of females. And McDonald's I will my guess is and I my girlfriends are pretty gross and I say that with all the love in the world and even they have never attempted it. It's never come up. I don't think any woman has ever done that. This is a difference between men and women. This is the reason this is the reason you make seventy seven cents to Jimmy Stoller. It's thing called literally intestinal fortitude. Look you understand what that man is a viking? Sal Anthony of patient set thank you. Did he have any because nobody alluded to him? Having any stomach heroes. Here's what I've learned in McDonalds here. Here's what I've learned in. Life is the car accidents in racing. That looks spectacular. The person usually walks away. And then there's the Dale earnhardt ones. That don't look like much and that's when they kill you. It's this stuff you think about when you get food poisoning. It's usually because you just went to a Sushi place that you loved and had a great meal and now you're on the toilet next day when you do the overtly gross stuff like me with the throwing the almond on that on the Jetway Burbank. Airport have the pigeon or Jimmy with this a Canadian Bacon on the wall. I never get sick from that stuff. It's the stuff you never see coming. That gets you sick. That's right thank you for pointing that out yes. There was a tie once once. Jimmy and I were eating at the man show and everyone was eating at the manage. Joe We got hold of some. Really bad clam chowder. Oh yeah right saying Jimmy. I think something's wrong with this chatter in and he said that he said that voice of the clams are smoke. That's what you're tasting and I kept saying I think something else and he said nope. It's that their smoke and then. I ate my bowl and everyone ate their ball and went to a Bachelor party that night us to the spearmint. Rhino in the city of industry and on the way home. Everyone destroyed the boss at the exact same time. It was literally twenty-eight guys on a huge charter party bus and if it was a movie it'd be everyone climbing back into the bus. Everyone ate lunch at the exact same time Israel at the man show. We all ate at two o'clock. Yup and everyone got back in her all dudes that were thirty five and weighed one hundred and eighty five pounds and we all got the bus and coming home from the city of industry. It all hit everyone with a nine minute period and reject sitting there sweating and Ariza was total. Insanity was thirty guys all blowing up from the same poisoning and of course bridesmaids it s processed. Every everyone exact same way because all came from the same source. We all ate it exactly the same time. And we all engage in the same activity. Lap Dances and beer and whatever else and everyone was white male between the age of thirty one and thirty seven hundred eighty five pounds to two hundred and twenty pounds like was exact same demo and well blew up at the exact same time. Y'All weighed less by the end of that. Oh my God I remember when that door opened in front of the man show at three in the morning everyone just went piling out like just blowing up into potted plants and everything else all right gene. Should we bring it home? Yes let's do it. I'm Gina Grad and. That's the news. That was the news with gene. It people let's get some quality sleep long to we have a little downtime and then a throughout the rest of the year as well. How'd you sleep last night? Well can you tell me the exact amount of Ram sleep you had? Of course you can't I can tell you I can tell you because or ring. Ram Is key when your mind and body recover helping. Us stay sharpen. Energize or ring is changing the game. 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Wartimes: David Byrne vs. The Other Talking Heads

Rivals: Music's Greatest Feuds

55:55 min | 9 months ago

Wartimes: David Byrne vs. The Other Talking Heads

"Rivals is a production of iheartradio. However one this is rivals show about music beefs and feuds and long simmering resentments between visions. I'm Steve and I'm Jordan and they're going to be talking about David Byrne versus the other talking heads specifically Chris Branson's. Since excellent slash got back together and have to say I think talking heads may be sitting at the top of the. We're never ever ever ever getting back together. Wouldn't you say Oh, no doubt no doubt in the world definitely the top of my like personal wishlist though it's like definitely the band that I really WanNa to get back together most even though it'll never happen it's the feud always reminded me in a lot of ways of the few that split up the band where you have this like genial laidback southern drummer starting a group only to be. Usurped by this loan songwriter who absorbed the drummer's essence in grooves but I don't know I like David Byrne, a help a lot more than like Robbie Robertson though yeah. I mean I. Love David Byrne to and I love the talking heads and I agree I mean, this is a band that I wish I could've seen live and I have no faith at all that they will ever get back together even in this age of like ever present reunion tour is it seems pretty safe to assume the talking heads will not be reuniting and I I suspect that. became even less likely this year when former talking heads Drummer Chris France published a memoir called remain in love Did you read that book by the way I read pieces of it I? Yes it is pretty damning. Basically in the book Chris France argues I think pretty convincingly that David Byrne stole songwriting credits that he took credit for other ideas that weren't his and that he's essentially like a huge glory hog. While I don't think everything that France says in his book should be taken at face value and we'll get into that in this episode. The fact that so much of the talking heads conversation has been about burned and not about the band is something that really ought to be addressed and I think probably corrected. So I think we're going to do that in this episode and get into everything else about the talking heads. So without further ado, let's get into this. Between the Three Co founders David Byrne Chris. Braden Tina Weymouth who were classmates said wristy Rela Rhode Island school design, and the whole premise of starting the band was France idea he had this dream of starting a ban that would basically be like a dancy art rock band that that used arm be rhythms and he spent a year trying to find the right basis but eventually convinced girlfriend Tina to pick up the instrument and give it a shot and then when Chris suggested to to friend David that he joined their little rhythm section. David Muttered A. Without looking Franz the. When you read the book, The way he describes David Byrne in this era is is pretty funny like he kind of sounds like the kid that I think lives on every floor and a college dorm the kid that keeps to himself who wears weird clothes and like I think at that time like David Byrne had like really unkempt. So he was just this kind of socially awkward person and. Like pretty plain in a way that David Burns on a persona like isn't just an adaptation that point away that this is like a pre genuine expression of who he is and it seems like it made it really hard to be around him in a weird way. Can it makes them seem more authentic because? They key wasn't just this dude pretending to be like a sweaty oddball I like it a really big suit like he really really was that guy that you know made him like one of the most unique frontman and history. Oh Yeah. He really was aloof and shy, and he had a hard time looking people in the eye and he was definitely socially distance before it was cool. I. Know a lot of friends at risk the thought that like wait you're starting a band with this guy is your front man. I think the the phrase that that Chris used was a thin read to lean on because you ever see. Their. First Band appearance on American bandstand and nineteen seventy nine. Yeah I mean I think Dick Clark asked David Byrne like one question. It's clear that this isn't GonNa go anywhere. So then he like instantly changes course and just talks to Tina weymouth right but it's like it's sort of just amazing. It's almost breaking the fourth wall of a show like bandstand and that early to it's just weird to see something goes sort of awry on such glitzy slick show at that era so. A lot of ways kind of like one of the things I love about David Byrne to the e He's so much. His own person has any said subsequently that he's basically on the spectrum that like he either is like mildly autistic or my have like borderline asperger's I mean I think he has said that I, it puts his behavior in a different light when that he says that he thinks he. He may have had that went in his younger days than he may have grew he grew out of it, which I'm not a doctor I don't know if that's how that works. But whatever the case it's fair to say that for all of David's musical gifts and his very unique slant on the world, he found it really hard to sort of meet the social demands of working with other people but. It's also really interesting which is also in his book is that he had this kind of ruthless determination and ambition that Kinda seems at odds with his really shy personality in the book, there's a story where there was a Art Gallery Show and David's work was in it and I gets he snuck in the night before the the show opened and David put his own work to the very front of the gallery. So it looked like. He was like the headliner of Art Gallery show which. Is Very telling after sake. Yeah. I in the book. That's definitely like what they would call a foreshadowing episode of what's going to happen like later on in the book and it's also a foreshadowing I guess of what's going to happen in this episode. But yeah, like from very early on I. Think Chris France asserts this idea that David Byrne a way of pushing himself to the front. Even. If he seemed ill at ease at times in the spotlight he also admits in the book that as Awkward as David, Byrne could be just a conversation that he was undeniably a charismatic front man that like when he was on stage even when he had quite found his voice yet as vocalist that you couldn't really take your eyes off of him. We're GONNA get into this in the episode I. Think There's lots of things that explain the talking heads success but like a big part of what makes that band unique is the fact that David. Byrne especially, for that time was like the last person you'd expect to be singing in a rock band. He was not Roger Daltry. He was not Robert Plant or Mick Jagger he was like a whole other archetype for like a rock star could be right. I mean just getting up there moving away move in like his what was it like Lacoste shirt like he looked like he was out of like a honor society program right on stage at CBGB's or something I could definitely didn't didn't compute. So the early days of the band as the existed in New York you know 'cause they ended up moving to New York City after graduating from art school really it's like one of my favorite parts of the book. Chris France really badly about like the life that they had these sort of young. Bohemians living in nineteen seventies, New York when New York was like really this dangerous place where you know if you were living in like the Soho area, there were like literally dead bodies laying on the sidewalk and no, one would come around to pick it up at least that's how Chris France writes about it. From Chris's perspective he really looks at Tina as being like the caretaker of the band like she was the one that was booking their gigs like she would make sure that they got paid at the end of the. Night. So she was playing this really big role in the band and yet sickly. She was the least experienced out of anyone in the band and this ended up being a real point of contention with you between David Byrne and Tina. WEYMOUTH. Well into the existence of talking heads where David Byrne constantly felt that Tina Weymouth wasn't up to snuff. Musically it seems like because their stories about this in the book that he considered like firing her from the band for the longest time well into like the recording of their first record right Oh. Yeah. When they got signed on on sire records, he made Tina auditioned. For her own role in the band three times, which is a I mean. It's kind of amazing that she likes stuck it out and by the time number two wasn't like, no go to hell like I don't I don't need this but which is weird because I love her bass playing actually think I'd like our earlier base playing best because it reminds me of Mo- Tucker is kind of like grade school style at primitive playing that that does sound. So rock and roll and punk just think that's something that was so integral to the band's early sound it's interesting to me, David. Hated it so much. Yeah it's. It's strange to me that he'd just focused on her so much because I, agree with you I think she's a great bass player and I don't know enough about bass playing to know like what technical proficiency is I mean this is something you should comment because you're a bass player yourself but like I just know as a listener like what I respond to and like her baselines were always like. Really unique it was this combination of again like really funky grooves that was coming at it from like a slightly different direction like she wasn't playing a conventional sort of aren beer funk basis and yet she could be just as Funky as those people it was like this again, like fractured art rock version of what they were doing and to me like when. You think about the sound of the talking heads, her bass playing is like a huge part of that and to replace her with more conventional bass player I think would have just defeated the purpose of this band. You know like the point of the talking heads isn't that they were just like a straightforward funk band they would have been the Ohio players that. That was what they were doing in the all players are great. You know but like the Ohio players can play circles around the talking heads. If you're just doing like a straight ahead funk type thing talking heads were by taking this music and giving you a perspective on it that was different at the time and would make you look at in a totally unique way and again I think Tina, weymouth was such a huge part of that. But yeah, it just seems like generally David Byrne just did not respect what she brought to the band and of course that ends up being a big theme of Chris Francis Book and of Course Tina is Chris's wife. So he's even more protective of her in that regard but Y- from the beginning of this band. It just seems like there were these two different camps in the band Dat we're going to be fighting for control she gave. Interview in the in the documentary girls in bands were she. She claimed that David told her he felt a woman's role really shouldn't be in the big world because it was a dangerous place for women. So according to her that was the kind of mentality she was up against in the band and I'm sure at the culture at large in the mid seventies and to your point when you're inexperienced young bass player, you're so anxious to just. Hit the right notes and into get make sure your fingers in the right place. You're not as focused on groove and flow and just kind of like being a little bit more more liquid I. Guess you're just you just want hit it and it gives it. This funny rigid lockstep sound that I think is is really integral to early pumpkin definitely early talking heads I think a lot of that sound where it's kind of herky-jerky and and. Sort of where that came from. It came from her and this is going to be something that we're going to explore a bit in this episode about like what made talking heads great because I think there's two different perspectives on that depending on what camp in I think David Byrne had an idea of what the band was what made them unique and I think France weymouth had their own idea and ultimately I think it's what they brought together. That is what makes the talking heads like. One of the great American bands I think there was definitely like a war going on about like who's going to be in control and what the direction the band was going to be, and it seems like in the early days that when it was just burn France weymouth that they were basically a democracy and. It makes me think about the writing of the song warning sign for instance, which is a song on their second record more songs about buildings and food. But was actually among the first songs they have a road and it's also like one of the first big conflicts in the span. Yeah. I think Chris said that he wrote it during during college you wrote it almost completely on his own years before. David is even the picture I think, and so the record for the second album and then David made some to it and just credited the song to himself and Chris said that he didn't really realize that until he got the finished record and saw the credits on the on the sleeve and said, well, wait a minute you I I did that and David to his credit. Promised that it would be fixed on future pressings in it was but it's something that kind of kept recurring and again, it reminds me of the band to where there's something that was creative. So collectively that then when the record is released, they look at it and see this just credited to one person and apologies are made, but it keeps happening again and again and again well, yeah. Happens again for the song life during wartime, which was on the next talking heads record nineteen, seventy-nine sphere of music, and that's like one of their most famous songs. It's the song where they say this ain't no party this ain't no disco this ain't no fooling around like that's. On one of those quotable lines in any talking heads song and according to France that's a song that came out of a jam session between him and Tina he says, the team actually wrote the vocal melody of that song and of course, when the record comes out, it's credited solely to David Byrne and it's interesting to me this whole idea about songwriting versus like the sound a band because obviously when we talk about what makes money in the band like songwriting is huge like publishing is one of the most reliable ways for physician to make a lot of money like once they start making records and often to like in terms of like how we talk about music. Fans, critics we fixate on songwriting being the hallmark of like the height of creativity. Are you a great songwriter that means that you are like the tour the band like if you're writing the songs But I feel like song writing and I don't know how you feel about. This I take songwriting can be a little overrated that a lot of times with a band you need great songs but it's also about this sort of intangible chemistry that exists between musicians that ends up creating this unique. Sound, and that is just as important for band being great. It's just like that's hard to quantify like you can point to a song on paper and say, this is what a song is and we know what it is. But that elusive chemistry thing like you can't really put that on paper it's something that exists in you know it when you hear it, it'd be does that make sense? Yeah. Makes me think a lot of the documentaries you see on like the wrecking crew or the other brother is where I think Carol Kaye another incredible female bassist. was talking about playing the beat goes on the Sonny and Cher song and it was just kinda straight ahead bland pop song and she came up with the Bom bum-bum-bum-bum-bum-bum-ba which makes the song I? Mean that's the hook of the song and don't got anything for that other than the standard session rate. So yeah, it's interesting about what actually makes a song successful you can. You can write all the notes of the melody and right the cord sheets and Everything down but they're these little magic moments when the band gets together that really actually make it take off and I think talking is a great example of that where it is such a collective sound and yeah, his words are unbelievable but but yeah, the rhythm especially I mean you really Jerry Harrison when when he joined, he was he was on the first one to right? Yeah. He was on seventy seven after the at sign the side yeah. He brought a lot but especially, Chris and Tina in the early club days before they were signed I mean so much of it was about their rhythm and groove. Yeah. I think I. Mean there's two things I would say about songwriting and talking heads and like one could be a defensive burn in one could be a defensive Franson weymouth like on one hand like when you read Chris Francis, book remained in love. You know he talks about warning signs. He talks about life during wartime he talks about the song psycho killer like how All the members of the band were throwing out lyrics how they basically wrote that together, and there's also the example of remain in light that album. GonNa talk about that in a minute, the collaborative aspects of that. But for the most part in that book, like there's not a ton of information about how songs written or like how are made like instead, there's a lot of. Material about like going on the road including like a really long chapter that is almost like a blow by blow account of their first European tour. It's almost like too long like I had to skip some parts of that. Chapter I have to say when I read rock memoirs I rarely read the cover to cover because I don't care about the part before they got famous. I don't really care about the part I after they stopped making great records like I only want the meat in there. That's true of Chris Francis Book to that was how that book too. Yeah and I just feel like. Maybe didn't include some of that material about the making of say fear of music or you know speaking in tongues. But if you like if they had been in on more songwriting sessions like he would have written about that, you know I 'cause it just seems like that bolstered his case for. Them being these vital contributors to the songwriting of the band, and there's a lot of stories in there about like. Chris being backstage and partying and doing blow with like other people and having a great time and David Byrne is nowhere to be found. And I'm just wondering those moments was David writing songs at that time. He's probably like chilling out you know I don't know. To me like if you read between the lines in that book, there's a case to be made that maybe David Byrne was doing a lot of work while Chris was having some good times. On the other hand, I do think kind of going back to my point before that with talking heads I, think they have great songs but to me, their music is just about the sound or just as much about the sound as it is about the songs like the way that they play together and to me, that's especially true of to me. Their greatest album like one of the greatest albums ever made remain in light I think remain laid has great songs but it's about how those songs come together and just the crazy grooves and like all the ideas that exist in that music it's that's about the band more than anyone person which is weird when you consider how it actually all came together. I it actually it seemed like the ban was about the break up after their nineteen seventy-nine European tour yet heard that story I mean basically like burn any tell journalists that he was. About to quit the band. Yeah. Then the journalists goes and finds Tina in Christmas it will what do you have to say about this David just told me he's quitting and they essentially said, well, that's news to us, and this is the point when David Brian Eno been working more and more closely together He's David when the kind of go often do more of stuff like my life in the in Bush of ghosts and albums like that. So Tina Krizan Jerry. Booked their own sessions with Brian just sorta instrumental sessions to jam in a way that I always kinda took to sort of make David Jealous in the kind of bring them back into the fold like. That and just say, okay, well, they're all hanging out own maybe joined to and and those early sessions were what evolved in the remain in light which she said I I definitely think it's the most collaborative album. I've ever made they really brought so many different elements to it. Yeah and I think it started out with that idea too I. think it was very much of an intentional thing like I think even burn agreed at the beginning that this was going to be a collaborative record like we're all going to be working together. We're all going to be coming up with ideas and the music about that record is that it it sounds like they're working with loops you know or You know that they're sort of piecing this together maybe just like in a studio somewhere and it was obviously like a Lotta. On that album but a lot of the amazing music on that record was just it just came out of them playing together in a room and It really does represent a pretty high level of creativity for a band. Could David Byrne have done that record of us working with session musicians you know that at this put together you know possibly you know but I I really feel like that record was. The combination of those people working together bringing other collaborators and just having that certain special chemistry that create an album Matt. Amazing. Elements of FUNKY got electric. You got these like African poly-rhythms that sounds like something like Fela Kuti would have done or something like that and like you said I I, don't think that it probably would have ended up selling almost like steely Dan type album. If if he just got a bunch of guys in there I feel like, yeah. So they're working. On this record and like you said I think initially the idea of them jammed together just to get. David Byrne back into the band because you know he was working on my life in the Bush goes with Brian Eno, which is an amazing record by the way and is I think somewhat similar to what they were doing on remain in late. But I think remain ultimately you know a greater record but of course, when it comes down to putting this record out, there's another disagreement about credits. And I do you know the story I mean initially I think Brian Eno like wanted to be credited like in the top line of the record that he wanted to be like talking heads and Brian, Eno course talking heads scuttled that idea. But then there was another weird thing with the songwriting credits. Oh. Yeah. Weren't they all it was going to be all alphabetical and then David probably knows help went and switch it around somehow what did he do? Yeah. Well, it's going to be all the band members listen. Like like you said so it'd been like David Byrne Brian Eno Chris France Jerry Harrison Tina Weymouth, and then when the record came out, it was David Byrne Brian talking heads that. So everyone else in the band was put in to the talking heads camp, and again, it was this idea of like David Byrne separating himself from the rest of the band when in reality again, I mean look no one is going to sort of overlooked David Byrne contributions to that record. Vocally, he sounds amazing on that record and I love his lyrics but to me, that's like the epitome of like a collaborative effort and to say that like David Burns contributions or Brian Nina's contributions were any more than the people in the band. It just seems like kind of a cheesy move by burned. Just doesn't see more. Yeah I mean just other himself like that from his own ban really weird move. Yeah. Mine's Gilligan's island undoing the theme, and then they just do the end the rest part no one likes. Good Gilligan's island Raphael. So it's good to bring Gilligan's island an episode. Our hand we'll be right back with more rivals. Hi there I'm Jordan from rivals are recent three part episode on Crosby Stills Nash and young helped me rediscover the many sounds and styles of Neil young and you know the best way to listen using a pair of premium wireless ear buds especially if you can get them in less than half the price of the other guys that's why I recommend wireless ear buds from RECON I was blown away by the comforting clarity of my ray cons. If you're gonNA hear all the of Neal's six hour solo on down by the river ray cons or the way to go break newest model the everyday e twenty five year Bud's best ones yet with six hours of playtime seamless Bluetooth pairing more, base. A more compact design and the noise isolating fit plus Rakhine ear buds are stylish indiscreet with no dangling wires. 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Crazy thing those happening around this time of course was Tom Tom Club with with Christina because you have David Byrne establishing his own solo thing he's got my life in the Bush goes he's GonNa do another album called the Catherine wheel and of course I think David Byrne got like a pretty big solo deal around this time. So He's getting a lot of money the proud these records. Whereas Christina, they start putting together Tom Tom Club and there's not a ton of interest from labels but then they end up having a huge success and I know you're a big Tom Tom Club Fan. Oh. Yeah. That's because it reminds me of sort of like the British beat boom in the early sixties when you got a bunch of white students trying to play the blues I, screw it up, and they kind of make their own thing. That's how I feel about. Tom Tom Club in regards to hearing emerging hip hop sounds out in the Bronx and the kind of do their own thing with the and create. Something by accident that fuses a little more electro and hip hop and some late seventies funk influences and it's fascinating. Mean anyone who doubts Christina's contributions to the talking heads should definitely get more than that record because it's it's so just so distinct and you see so clearly what they brought to those to stuff like remain in light an incredible album and did very well and I think David hated it. Yeah. It's like they need to say it was like. Commercial. Merely popular I think it was very cold it right? Yeah. He's definitely like putting it down but I think it was pretty clear that he was jealous. I think like like they could tell that it bothered him so on some level. Have gone some enjoyment. Out of you know how pissed off he was 'cause you know again, the records that he made at that time I think are really well regarded especially my life in the Bush ghost but. Clearly that. Wasn't a hit at all I mean it was more of like a critical favourite and then Tom Tom Club I ended up going gold. beat talking heads the growing goal I think that I don't think any of their albums going gold up to that point. So yeah, that and it was doing catherine wheel with like. WAS IT Twyla Tharp? I think aiming for fine art credibility and so you can see where he's coming from with as merely popular comments like well, okay. Anyone can get a number three song or whatever it was but like I'm I'm actually trying to make genuine real fine art here. So that's creating a lot of tension obviously. Between David Chris and Tina and you know it, it's interesting looking at this in retrospect. I. Feel like David would talk about this in subsequent years that I think from his perspective he was almost like a guy that wants to get out of a bad relationship, but he doesn't have the guts to break up with the girl. So he just starts acting like a jerk hoping that. Show break up with him like that seems to be the dynamic at this time because I think David would say later on, he was like you know why did they want to be in a band with me I? Mean they were unhappy. You know it seemed like those a lot attention. They would complain about David Byrne. But like they also wanted to keep working with him and it seemed like as they would go on in their career. That there was just you know I guess starting with remain in light where they had to sort of like trick him to get into the studio that. Every project that they would work on after that including, you know music that we all love. The album speaking in tongues, which which was the first platinum record that talking heads ever put out and then of course stopped making sense. That concert film comes out of that tour, which just seems like David Byrne is taking more control and doing what he can do to alienate Tina but like Christina. They're upset about it, but they won't actually split up the band. Yeah. You would say later you is Tina with send David these letters that would just open up with paragraphs calling him every name under the sun what a Jerky was litany of all the things done to he'd done to wrong them and then at the ambulance, why don't you want to be with us anymore wanted to play with us and he would get confused and said, well, you kind of answered your question you know, why would I want to be around these people that clearly hate me as much as I do and also what you? So why do you to be around me? This isn't good for anybody. It's fascinating to me because you know when you think about the talking heads like in the early eighties. I think a lot of us think about the film not making sense which is for my money. It's like the greatest concert film ever made I. Mean You could maybe say the last waltz would be in the conversation but You know stop making sense. It's such a blast of joy. You know when you watch it and it's one of those movies like I've seen it a couple times in movie theaters and. People get up out of their seats and dance in the aisles like during that movie I mean that's how infectious it is, and you just think like, oh, well, like this is such a happy band and yet like they were going through such misery behind the scenes and like you know as as much as we associate like that tour with the film. That was also their last tour. Wasn't it? Yeah that was the tour where David Sorta stormed off on stage. They were playing I think the last show of the tour down in new? Zealand and he started the show by letting some protesters come up and share I. think it was a indigenous peoples wanted to to to share their. What they had to say and David let them up and it did not go down well with the crowd who started booing them and the band. So the VIBE was already really bad when they started to play and they get a few songs in and David walks off the state figures like after five songs or something, and the others are just kind of playing weight from the come back I think Chris goes and chases them literally drags him back on Davidson what I want to. What are we gonNA. Play with these audiences. We just have their feet stuck in the mud which is a weird thing to say when it wasn't raining. And it was just a miserable show and he kind of begrudgingly finished it, and then after the show there was an after party i. don't think Dave showed up and it was just pretty clear by that point that he was done and he didn't want to go on the road anymore and every time the rest of the band would mention it. He would just say you know, Oh, you want is the money you don't want to go out there actually in the Road Oh, you all you want. Is Money so that would kind of mood any any touring discussions, and then there was this weird thing which I when I read this, I couldn't really believe that this was even on the what I. Think Chris and Tina like approached Adrian Belew who like this brilliant guitar player he was a he was a touring member the talking heads in the early eighties he'd also like played with I think he played with deeply with the David Bowie like King Crimson like he has great Marin Rock. Like pedigree and They approached Adrian blue about becoming the new front man of talking heads. There's been some debate and ladies as the whether or not. That was what they were actually offering or or inviting him to actually just joined the band as another guitarist. But yeah, what wisely he was kind of like, no, no thank you. I don't really the ship seems to be going down at this point because it was pretty clear that that they were not happy group by this point. Yeah. So you know they play this terrible show in New Zealand new burn star storms offstage says he doesn't want to or anymore and you would think that like maybe at that point, the writing should have been on the wall. You know that like okay. Like on a tour anymore he's less and less interested in our input and then you get into those last couple talking heads records have like a little creatures comes out in nineteen, eighty five and then you have. True stories comes out eighty six. It's a soundtrack to a film that David Byrne directed and I mean those albums you know as much as remain in light feels like a very collaborative album like those albums feel like David Byrne Solo records where the band is backing him up I mean is that fair to say, I, mean because I know that for little creatures for instance, David Byrne just like came into the studio with like finish songs I think for the. First Time ever, and it seemed like more than ever like at that point he was presenting his songs to the band. Yeah. He was pretty explicit about saying you know. All right. You WanNa make a rare with me. I'm going to handle the songs and he would come in with like tapes on his boombox and play to the ban say, okay. This is what we're GonNa do but I think that there was still lot of of group arrangement going onto which which. Book. The band really get credit for and and they were almost sort of used to it. By that point, they were just like, okay this is what he's like. This is how he is if we're going to make music with him, that's the deal we're just gonNA keep on making good music and we'll keep on going to ban because I think at that point again, you use the abusive relationship analogy and they were kind of like. Well, I'm being treated really poorly but this band is the most important thing. It's more important than me it's more important than. Him more important than all of us. It's all about the ban if we WANNA stay together I'm just GonNa take whatever dishes out. So he said they were really reduced aside by that point you know this is such an issue I, don't know what your take on this but like you know when I read Chris Francis Book, there were a lot of things I was sympathetic about and we've talked about some of those things already. You know again like the warning sign example lettering wartime remain in light you know the weird things that happened with the songwriting credits there. I. Think that's all legitimate. I have to say that at this moment in time this idea that like I'm just going to be a doormat for David Byrne I have a hard time accepting this because Chris and Tina de head Tom, Tom Club. You know they'd had success with that. It's like, why are you still in the situation where you feel so poorly treated I, just don't understand what the motivation would have been unless it was economic. I mean, really I mean that that seems like the only explanation that like we're in this very successful band and you. Know as much as we don't like David Byrne baby on some level we recognize that we will be much better off financially for with him. Is that the only explanation for them still being banned at this point like in the mid eighties I mean the book you get the impression that Chris in the book is very naive is the right word but sort of like wide-eyed and you get the idea that he is overblown just completely bowled over by David's talent to. So if you're gonNA take the less cynical and say, maybe it wasn't just purely were in this. Huge ban that could nets a ton of money with albums and tours maybe they just wanted to work with him because they thought he was such a genius artist. That's that's my my more optimistic approach to it. Yeah I mean I think there's that's true on some level, but I have to go back to like the reading between the lines aspect who with a lot of rock memoirs you have to do you have to like read what they're saying, but then you also have. To look at what they're leaving out and to me what's left out of this story is maybe an acknowledgement that they were not going to be as successful without David. Byrne as they were with him and David. Byrne it. By this time had enough celebrity where right or wrong he could assume the mantle of talking heads on his own, which has proved to be true after the band broke up like as much as David Byrne has like not want to reunite with the band he. Also hasn't been shy about exploiting the legacy of talking heads for his own benefit and I think he learned at some point that like I can play these songs on my own and I can reap the benefits of it without having to deal with these other people that are sick of being around You know there must have been maybe some realization on the part of Chris and perhaps Tina like I. Think there's probably some powerlessness that they were experiencing at that time it. was like it sucks for them that that ended up being true. But like that seems to be how things unfolded because if you look at their break-up, you know I think the breakup was announced in nineteen ninety one and it was after David Byrne did this interview? I. Think he was talking to the Los Angeles. Times and by the way, this was like three years after the last talking heads record, which was naked came out in nineteen eighty-eight no tour for that album, of course. David Byrne an already gotten his solo career going by that point, and if you look at that, it'd be like David. Byrne. Just basically snaps at this reporter. Reporters asking about talking heads and he's like dude, we broke up aright or we broke up or whatever I think is the quote isn't it something like that? Yeah he's promoting o solo album and the all the interview wants to do is ask about one of the next talking heads record is coming in he finally, you could say we broken up, call it whatever you like stops that line of questioning dead and of course Tina Krizan Jerry knew nothing about this and they found out when Kennedy was published just cold. I mean, I love this story even though it's Kinda Sad. I. Mean they ended up having one final band meeting and David has a pretty amazing quote like a parting shot like do do do you know what he said I love this I really want to hear you say. Well. He said you know again it's kind of going back to this thing. I. Was talking about before about how I think in David Byrne's mine he was acting in a way that like should have made medical marijuana dump him. Yeah. It's like I don't want to break up with you but I'm making it clear that you should break up with me and. At one point he just like yells at the other people in the band David Bernie says you should be calling me an asshole. Snaps, it's almost like he lost respect for them because they didn't stand up to him. And that seemed to be dynamic at the end of the band and then they would say later years Christina would say you know we thought that if we just kind of like smiled and took it and just like way out like he would come back like he did remain in light and everything, and finally it was clear at this point you know how many years twelve years After that that the rest of the band weren't getting the memo Dave didn't want to be there. So then he screams you you calling me in us all which again, like you said, incredible parting shot. So one of the weirdest things for me like after that break-up that occurs in Nineteen ninety-one was the story of the heads that sort of reunion record you remember that record i. Couldn't get into it even though they had some great names on it I mean they had Debbie Harry any partridge the guy from in excess do from happy Mondays like but yeah, I didn't find it very listenable. Yeah. Like the idea was that the three band members of the talking heads. Christina Jerry Harrison poor jerry, Harrison by the way who we have not really talked about it seemed like he was just sort of on the sidelines of all this and of course, he ended up joining the band after they got their record deal for talking heads seventy seven and seem like he was sort of like outside of a lot of this psycho drama going on between David Chris and Tina. But anyway like on the heads record brooch by the way was called. No talking just head. which is the best part of that record is the title like there's all downhill from there. But yeah, like was they would play and they'd have different singers perform on each song and I feel like all that album did was underscore how the talking heads are not as interesting if David Byrne is not the lead singer. Great as the band is that if you have Michael Hutchence singing. It's just not the same thing as great as Michael Hutchence's Michael Hutchence should be inaccessible, shouldn't be in talking heads you know all those other people they should be doing their own thing they shouldn't be in the talking head. So that's like a tribute album move have a different singer on every song to like that just confused me to like I couldn't. I couldn't get comfortable with what I was hearing because I felt like every time I every new song was just totally different thing another thing I feel like we should talk about and I feel a little weird about this because. This book I think is kind of problematic. It's a talking heads biography that came out in two thousand and two written. By David, Bowman, it's called. This must be the place the adventures of talking heads in the twentieth century and I feel like the most memorable part of this book has to deal with Tina and David's relationship and I mean is going too far to suggest that that book is like a hatchet job against Tina weymouth I mean it's pretty brutal Edward. Her. Oh Yeah. I mean he characterizes Tina as a little brittle with the vibe of a Catholic saint or maybe a tragically lame Prima Ballerina or maybe Valerie Solanas who shot Andy Warhol. So, yeah, and that's just describing her. That's not even the stuff that alleges that she did. Yeah I mean, can you tell the baby penis story? Blows me away I ever asked. The Baby Penis Aspect of this book I I don't I don't know whether to take a base value or not. I do think we should preface this by saying that like a lot of these stories are based on like unnamed sources who are maybe I'm guessing our good friends at David Byrne and I don't know if David put them up to this or they just felt the need to defend him. But yeah, the BB, story is definitely the weirdest. Well, in Bowman's book, he claims that Tina. Several of David's old friends in the middle of the night to tell them that he had a now I'm quoting a penis, which is I think unprecedented in the post band break-up fallout like revenge moves I've never heard of that that is. If. You have baby penis on your rivals Bingo card. Congratulations I know you didn't expect to mark that but Yeah. We we have our first baby penis and. Arrivals episode and then she also apparently allegedly claimed that David Kill the boy at a party in Brazil using Voodoo she said. There was a an article that Bowman road I think for Salon, and this is she's quoted as saying David is a vampire in a way. It might be something more complex psychics have seen him and they say, he just has a firewall around him. That's a scary quote. Bowman's sort of the. He thinks that this is born out of Tinos actually secretly in Love David that they'd had some relationship back risk and it didn't work out and now she's just trying to destroy him. That's I think where he's coming from what this which is like. I'd you know? That's a that's distasteful to me I. Guess I'll put it that way. There's something very in. There's something very stereotypical about ending teen away move as like some sort of scorned woman especially since her husband is also in the band I, didn't know that. That I have a hard time sort of wrapping my head around I. Mean One thing is that I think does make sense to me in in the book there's David Byrne is basically. Entering this idea that like Chris and I guess you know I guess especially, Tina like really came to eight him by the end of the band is a coordinator read say they'd say what a fucking dumb jerk and asshole piece of Shit I was He's referring to like letters that Tina would send him supposedly need said it would go into detail about how badly behaved personnel was hard. It was to work with how unfair it was it was thing meant to make me feel real terrible how much? I hate you I hate you I, hate you. And then in the end she'd go why don't you WanNa work with us and he says, you've answered the question there's some kind of weird to now going on and I have to say you know and again not knowing what's true or what's exaggerated the core of that argument. This idea that like Chris Antena have both talked about how much they hate David Byrne, all the terrible things that he's done in the band. If you take all that face value, it's like, why do you want to keep working with this guy? This guy you say has taken credit from you who hogs the spotlight who you feel like is not a good friend or collaborator, and yet there's always this continued desire. To get back together. That's the strange thing about this story that doesn't make sense. You could just say like I don't WanNa. Be Around this guy which I kind of do. That is the ultimate message of Chris Francis Book at the end to be maybe they are at that point now but yeah, like it's a strange this cycle of abuse baby this relationships like just stay broken up as much as we want to see them get back together in a way like for the emotional and psychological health of the people involved it's it's probably best that they don't right I mean I can almost see wanting to sort of make peace but the situation and not end on such such bad terms because. Ornamented David Byrne tried to sue. Teen Chris when they put the heads together tried to sue them for for for using the heads name. He thought it was a pretty blatant attempt to cash in on the talking heads brand that that David was part of and I think they ended up settling in exchange for letting David have total control over over putting out future catalogue reissues and stuff like that which is. Kind of a big concession letting him have control over the the musical legacy of the band going forward to but So there is a lot of bad blood between them. So maybe you could argue that they just WANNA be okay. One more time for Old Times Sake let's make it good. Go our separate ways forever which they kinda did at the rock and Roll Hall of fame. Yeah but even there there. was. Weirdness like in France Book, he tells the story about how you know they were together hall of fame. They ended up playing a bunch of songs together. It seems like their rehearsals like went pretty smooth and then at the party that night like after the ceremony David Byrne. ghosted his wife at the time left her alone at the Party and then later told Chris that that was the night that he. decided that he was going to divorce his wife of several decades. Yeah exactly. Like so he essentially left his wife after the rock and Roll Hall of fame ceremony I mean look like David Byrne is a Weirdo I. Think we can say that that he's a weird guy emotionally I'm sure that he was very frustrating to deal with and like I my heart goes out to the other people and talking heads who. Had to put up with that but. To expect him to act differently I mean that is the definition of insanity you know to expect a different result would decade of evidence of a person acting a certain way? You know it's a point you got to cash in your chips and walk away and I feel like would you see this guy that you've known forever to be an odd ball to be emotionally difficult and you see that like right after receiving this honor the rock and Roll Hall of fame that's when he decided to leave his wife and like he doesn't just by ghosting her at the party, you're not going to reconcile with this guy is your neck and to get the emotional closure that. You need I mean it's seems like it's impossible with a person like that. There is a lot to impact there and to your point earlier about like maybe we trying to send the band the message by acting horribly and trying to get them to leave him maybe by getting back together with Obama and that he realized Oh that approach doesn't work with in this case my wife but I want to leave some maybe after being on stage with these people he said, you know what passive aggressive doesn't work when you're under relationship honey done some maybe that was when he got out of it who knows. So in reality it was a happy ending he learned a lesson. Yeah Passive, aggressive behavior I'll just leave harassed jet and that's how break up with my wife. So you know that the more you know. Life, lessons right there. We're going to take a quick break he the word from our sponsor for we get to more rivals. I we've now reached the part of the episode where we talk about the pro side of each part of the rivalry, and let's start with David Byrne. You know we've gone through some of the sins that he committed when he was talking heads stealing songwriting credits. Being glory hog just being like a general Weirdo I guess in terms of like interpersonal relationships it also must be said that he is like one of the greatest and most unique frontman and rock history and I really think that he's like a pretty wonderful singer definitely an original. Singer and I don't think there's a real dispute aside from the examples that we mentioned specifically that he was like the main. Driving, force behind the songwriting of the band and I don't doubt that he like took more credit than he deserved. I think that's true of like of lead singers a lot of so-called tours bands. You know the people that we look at as being the people in charge. Often if you talk to the other people in that person's band, they'll they'll be upset that they feel like they're not getting the. Proper credit you know. I. Think that's like a well established story that we've talked about in many other episodes of the show. But again, at the end of the day, there's a reason why David Byrne is the star of the band. He's the most charismatic person and I think he's probably the most unique part of the band. Oh. Yeah. Absolutely and my favorite thing about having and you could say these incredible musician. An. Incredible. Sort of like elder statesman of rock or whatever. But I think that his his lyrics are my favorite part of what he does and I love his books as well for the same reason because it just sort of it's not poetic in inner flowery in any way just slices through. And just gets to like the very weirdness of being alive I always thought of him as like being more of an anthropologist in a way to and make. Comments on things that we all do with the sense of like isn't that weird I mean you've got just absurdity with things like making flippy floppy or just slightly remember he had a song on his latest album called bullet where he just tells the story of a murder from the point of view of a bullet and I just thought that was. So it's almost like a Yoko Ono said a lyric something I always thought his lyrics were like conceptual art where there is no real poetry around it was I'm presenting with this item with this object you figure out why I'm showing you this you figure out why this has. For me and that's something nine was really appreciated about his work. So we go to the pro Chris and Tina side I'm just going to go back to an argument. I made earlier in this episode, which is that I think talking heads, there's a lot of great songs in their catalogue you know and songs that had been covered by other artists and. And and they can really stand alone as songs. However, I, do feel like the greatest music of the spans career and I'll I'll start with remain in light being at the top of that list are as much to do with the sound of the band as it has to do with Songwriting, and if David Byrne had taken his songs and just perform them. With a studio band, it would be he would not come up with something like remained in light that was the result of this, very hard to quantify but extremely crucial chemistry that existed between these musicians and when you think about talking heads songs, what makes them go a lot of time as the rhythm section you know there's great roofs and their grooves. That like not only are really funky and danceable but like they're not played in sort of a conventional Funk R&B Type Way, there's something a little different about it a little off kilter that's just totally unique to disband and it's what to this day I think makes those records hold up so well, I mean those first five records that talking heads put out. For me that's like some of the greatest music ever made and Chris and Tina I think along with Jerry Harrison deserve a lot of credit for those record sound and as much as you want to say that David Byrne as I said before I think he's totally unique front man i. think he's Charismatic I. Think he wrote some great lyrics the sound of talking heads to me is what pulls me back into those records time and again and Christine have a lot to do with that. I'm trying to think now I can't think of a single talking heads cover that I've ever heard that has stuck with me. I am really trying to think for all of their. SONIC SONGS I I'm coming up short of thinking any was actually cover them in a way that the I I remember right now I can't even think of any I think that as you said, speaks to the power of the band dynamic as a whole as opposed to. David. Byrne writing great songs I don't know how those songs with work if somebody else rearrange them performing the different way I I, think I'm sure there's a way to do it in a way that's that's interesting and would. Show a different side of it but yeah, it's it's the sound of all those records that that makes them. So special to me, and that sound was something that I think Chris, at least that's what he says in his book for set out to do at the very beginning was kind of like a a a dancy art rock band of course, could be self-serving to say that in retrospect, but it seems like getting the rhythm section together I and having sort of a mission to do this. was such an important. Keystone for the band. So I I agree and also like I said earlier I think Tina is a beast of a bass player. She's the pulse of the ban I mean bringing funk down to that that CBGB's scene but a blast of like the famous flames and parliament I just think she's the Best I love her her minimalism mixed but funk is so unique to her. David Byrne making her try it all this times. Dude. You should have been kissing her feet man that she was in your band I think when we think about the talking heads together, you know this is an argument I think you could make for a lot of the sort of inner band rivalries that we talked about in the show, which is that it's really like two halves of the same hole that the band as it worked would not be as successful or as great if you didn't have these people coming together and I think that's speaks to you know like. When you look at the careers that these musicians have had outside of talking heads, you know as beloved as David Bernez and like you know you mentioned American Utopia that was a big hit on Broadway that is drawing a lot on his talking heads material and like he's put out like good solo records but I know when I saw him live by ten years ago. You'd play a solo song and it was like very nice and people would enjoy it. Then he played talking heads song and it was like someone let. The theater on fire. You know it was the contras could not be anymore telling and these musicians just did not achieve separately what they were able to do together and I think that really says it all. Yeah. I mean at the risk of sounding reductive. I. Think About Nineteen eighty-one When Christina did Tom Tom Club, which was you know in quotes merely popular and David was doing the sort of high Falutin fine art of of Catherine Wheel think putting that together the sort of fine art and genius. Level of of his songcraft with these elements, these dance elements that did make it popular. I think that was was the alchemy there, right? Exactly. Yeah. Just put it together put genius of love with some cool like you know cut and paste lyrics you know from David Byrne that would have been amazing. Well, you know Jordan tell you that I feel really lucky to be hosted the show sometimes I have a breakdown and I wonder this is not my beautiful show. This is not my beautiful co host. How did I get here? How did you hear but this this being on the show and talking about these things with you it's truly a once in a lifetime experience for me. So thank you for talking about this with me and thank you for listening to this episode of rivals. We will be back with more beef and feuds and long simmering resentments next week. Rivals is a production of iheartradio. The executive producers are Sean. Title and Brown the supervising producers, Taylor Chicane, and trysted McNeil. The producers Joe hats that I'm Jordan run talk I'm Steven Hyden. If you like what you heard, please subscribe and leave us a review for more podcasts from iheartradio visit the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or ever use in your favorite shows.

David Byrne David David Chris Tina Krizan Jerry Chris Francis David Byrne Brian Braden Tina Weymouth David Burns Chris France David Brian Eno France Christina Jerry Harrison Tina Weymouth David Sorta David Byrne. David Jealous Tom Tom Club Byrne
Episode 190 - Jon Bon Jovi

Sodajerker On Songwriting

51:46 min | Last month

Episode 190 - Jon Bon Jovi

"Hello and welcome to this very special edition of so the jagran songwriting. I'm brian o'connor accompanied by my co host. Sama barbara and we hope you're all keeping safe from well. Joining us for episode one hundred nine hundred is a legendary american singer and songwriter not to mention philanthropist and sometimes at that is best known as the founder and from one of the most successful beloved and enduring rock bands on the planet. Not only responsible for more fist pumping rock anthems and you can shake a stick at. He's also a grammy winner. Member songwriters and rock and roll hall of fame. His bond the sold over one hundred and thirty million albums worldwide. Also notching up seven number one singles and innumerable. Top ten hits. We are beyond giddy to welcome the one and only jon. Bon jovi to the show in october twenty twenty. Bon jovi released their fifteenth studio album titled aptly enough twenty twenty. It was originally jew in may but was pushed back due to the pandemic and instead of sitting on his hands john. Use the postponement to continue work on. the album. Writes a new song for it to address the current social and political situation in the us. What a thrill is to john. The site are now. We've said it many times before but it never get any less exciting to speak to these people. We grew up listening to on the radio when watching on mtv teenagers. Yeah actually my first. Memory of bon jovi is here and my big sister playing the monarch cassette player in our shared bedroom. When i was about seven or eight she was nine years older than me and still is and they're very much into a rock and heavy metal. At the time i seem to remember we also at the new jersey video collection on vhs. The best format for best form is full. Stop guess was born impair tomboy new jersey in thousand sixty two the son of two former marines and raised in sayerville he. I picked up the guitar at thirteen and inspired by the thriving. Gysi you'll see later. Played the local clubs in the series of bands such as raise atlantic city expressway and jump on jovi on the wild ones. John began writing his own songs around the age of eighteen by the ten of the informed the rest with which he opened for new jersey. Luminaries like southside. Johnny on the asprey jukes. He also worked as a gofer is causing tony. Bon jovi studio the legendary power station in manhattan in one thousand nine hundred three a local radio station. Wap include this song runaway on compilation album of local talents which gone nationwide airplay on the back of the song generated. John wasted no time assembling. Bon jovi recruiting. David brian on keys. Tico torres on drums and alex jones search base with lead guitarist. Richie sambora joining soon. After the band. Science in nine hundred three releasing laid upon them stay while the following year. The first couple of records did okay but it was with their third long player in one thousand nine hundred sixties. Slippery when wet. The bon jovi went stratospheric. Eighty by rising contributions from new collaborator and future. So jackie guests desmond child. The record spent eight weeks at the top of the billboard charts and yielded the indelible singles living on a prayer. You give love a bad name and wanted dead or alive. Nine ninety eight's new jersey consolidated that success topping the charts around the world. Sporting five hit singles including bob medicine. And lay your hands on. May john released his first solo album blaze of glory in nineteen ninety before reuniting with his band made for nine thousand nine hundred to keep the faith alec. Joe switch left in ninety four to be replaced by studio bassist. Hugh mcdonald the pants or the studio albums. Today include these days. The grammy nominated crush. The nashville influenced lost highway. What about now. They lost album. Richie sambora who left in two thousand fourteen and twenty six things. This house is not for sale. Which debuted at number one on the billboard chart in two thousand nine. John was inducted. Along with sam bora into the songwriters hall of fame. While bon jovi were inducted into the rock and roll hall of fame in two thousand eighteen. There's also done a fair bit of acting in this time appearing in movies. Like moonlights valentino. Pay it forward the leading man and you five seven one as well as tv shows sex in the city. Thirty rock the west wing and ally mcbeal in two thousand and six. I guess founded the john bon jovi soul foundation a nonprofit organization focused on issues of hunger and homelessness in the us. He could find out more about its work at j. b. j. sf dot org more recently with his wife dorothea. He's established several soul kitchen restaurants in new jersey with the purpose of providing meals for patrons on pay what you can basis more info about that at bj soul. Kitchen dot org. It's safe to say this man is what we brits described a good egg is good people or to hear songs from two thousand and twenty selections from the whole bon. Jovi discography checkouts playlist for this episode. We're linked to from johns page at so dejected. Dot com slash podcast find them online at bon jovi dot com facebook dot com slash. Jon bon jovi and jon bon jovi on twitter and instagram. We can be found that. So the jake dot com facebook dot com slash. So jessica and so jake or on twitter and instagram. If you're a newcomer to the show. We hope you'll stick around and check out our extensive back. Catalog of songwriter interviews. And don't forget to follow rates and review where you get your podcasts. If you'd like to contribute towards the running costs of this independent advisory show give whatever you can spare at so dejected. Dot com slash. Donate before we continue. Many thanks to susannah for her help. Set up the incident now without further ado please enjoy our chats with the one and only john. Bugs jobe ever. Since i was a young boy before out of new my father said he got a wall. The volume round stand really been enjoying twenty twenty of lights. Thank you it. Very clearly captures way currently at as a songwriter. Obviously the bon jovi kind of blueprint of the strong tunes and that choruses is there were lyrically. It's super honest and direct. Isn't it and it's really kind of vivid chronicle of crazy time in history. Oh yeah oh yeah with this record. I founded interesting to write about topics in the world in which we were living instead of just writing a rock song or a boy girl song. That didn't really have any appeal to me this time. We've spoken to a number of authors sewer albums postponed juice to the pandemic. You're probably the first person we've come across. You actually wrote new songs. So we'll stay record in period. So i can take you back a little bit in march of nineteen which is coming up on two years. Now we went into the studio in nashville to record. What i thought was the album. But in retrospect was really just the first batch of songs and i had had the title twenty twenty one because it also you know is about clear vision and and i thought to myself the insider will know that what i was thinking with this album title was i have clear vision of the future and of course there was the election year that was pending and jokingly i'd realize you know it'd be a great camp poster there for could sell a lot of t-shirts but told the ban the title and we were recording the songs and it was coming together and ultimately even finished i kept writing because of the pandemic and then the record really started to take a different shape. Now it had a much deeper meaning and because it was topical and didn't wanna take sides which could be very scary. You know if you sit here and go bad trump add trump add trump here you're gonna alienate half the audience and it's a terrible assumption to think that because i have the microphone. I'm right the conclusion i came to is that i would bear witness to history and not take just be the narrator. And that's when the whole thing took focus to me. And that's when. I got really excited about the title and the album cover. And even the sequencing everything about it on came with american reckoning you particularly rigorous about that one win. Yeah i think even sews went to the extreme of planets of family and friends and even fellow songwriters to see what they thought. Yeah even more than do what you can. Which was okay. We're all in this pandemic together. When you're taking on the topic of black lives matter and the death of george floyd and in a world where the confusion with the statement and how people would defend their position by saying but all lives matter will. The truth is all lives. Can't matter and less black lives matter and then you know. They became this whole heated debate and blue lives matter. That's not the point. Can we agree that black lives. Matter is the point head. So i knew that i was gonna go down a road that was going to be difficult at best and yet i couldn't help but right the song and there were several iterations during the course of the couple of weeks. Because you know you're you're right. It's stream of consciousness. And i played it for my wife susan honest and harsh critic and she said the verse is fantastic but the chorus is lacking a kept would shedding the course got it to a place where i really thought it was right and then played it for African american members of the record company to like i said esteemed songwriters or politicians or the band. And i really wanted to make sure i got it right because it was a daunting task and ultimately i think i did get it right. I think paul mccartney was one of the people you play to nato beetle poll. I should say beautiful. All bruce springsteen yeah you don't they were a couple of the people yeah. I'm fortunate enough to know both of them. And you know that kind of fan in had to be put aside just as another songwriter. And say i want your opinions be brutally honest and so they were two of the people. I played it for more than them as songwriters about the african american member of the record company. Who is can. I tell them the truce or the minister from down the street. Who was like you know. Is he going to be mad at me if i tell them the truth and is the last thing pete mad. If i am told the truth that'd be mad at you if you didn't tell me that you so you know that song. This wasn't like oh. Here's you give love a bad name to you like it or not. This was a real daunting task and it was. It was something that i wanted to get right. Yeah on a typical parts of your writing process to play a kind of song in process to other people to get defeat by not necessarily here because at the end of the day a record has the move you as an artist. If you're truly going to get to the place where you're at nearly forty years down the road when you're not trying to appease the market or the record company or whatever you know the audience that you figured needs an uptempo also then you really sit down and you create a record for yourself and i'm at that point in my career where that's all that matters and so i can play the radio game anymore. I'm too old or you've got your opinions of me. Or or i have no interest in writing that so all i can do is create the record that i want to create which is an interesting part of the dynamic as you guys can relate as songwriters you do. Get to a place when you're a writer and an artist to you can't do something that doesn't ring true because the worst thing that could happen is a major hit and you gotta sing it for there. S year but you know in the big picture to do something that would be compromising. Would just at this point in my career. Would it make any sense own man. Our american rigging it must have been wildly beneficial to have that extra chunk of time kind of revise songs. Yes and. I'm so grateful that i did because come to think of it. It was this time last year. When i had come over to the uk right at the end of february and played unbroken with prince harry and the soldiers of for the invictus games choir and i gave them the song broken and went to abbey wrote and recorded it with them. I started to do some press for the record and the reaction was fine. It was like okay. Great another record cool. I left there thinking. Well i've made the record. I wanna make. But when i went home and had the benefit of pulling the plug writing those two new songs taken a couple of them off changing lyrics on several others remixing and putting it out. That's when it was complete. I don't know about other artists but in my case it takes me a year after the release of record to come to terms with what we've just done here because up until that point it's the best record you've ever made i'm a genius and then you put it out and then you go and you play a couple of the songs and go. Well that didn't work. You know that was bullshit. Eight on your look back on the record and you'd think i'd know why i got talked into doing that one or why that one made it in. This one didn't in. That happens to me with every album but with this one i had that benefit of these extra months and it'll be part of the experiment in october. I'll look back on this record and say do i like it or not right. We'll low the flag is no the standout for us on the record. I think with that one really do strike that balance of sorts of conveying strong message and express where you stand on in this instance the gun control issue. And you make it clear you want to open dialogue. Rather than kind of provocative provocative doesn't scare me as much as my assumption. Because i have the pen that i know the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth so i find it that my position should be to narrate as it happens. That's all i think. It's evident that my position is that we need sensible gun control in legislation. And i'd like to sell you a gun but bullish. It cost ten thousand dollars around you. No problem here's all the guns you on but a bullets ten grand apiece. So i don't think that we need automatic weapons in in our living room and all that kind of stuff. But i did. That's not the place on that song. My position on that song was to say. Here's a list of all the school shootings. This is what happens. Put myself in that character of being a state worker being told to lower the flag again and it just makes you them I just wanted to pose the question. How would you feel if this was your family. 'cause i got so tired of hearing the politician's on the news of sending out my thoughts and prayers to the family. How about go. Fuck yourself you know. Thoughts and prayers really a six-year-old. My baby was killed in school. And you don't want me to take guns out of swap meets thoughts and prayers. You know it's horrifying. Fortunately you're countries much more sensible than ours and not sense. Yes in that sense. We've got our own problems. Here's one where. I could bash my countrymen die die all the deed glib pulled no live lab on be the di di all the g. Did we the bead between. I guess there are probably some lessons. Who am might be slightly. Put off by you tackle in those kinds of issues in that kind of direct way but ultimately it wouldn't be the first time that you did something like thought. I went all the way back to run away today and that felt like it kind of socially aware sung even that it really was. Yeah i mean if you think about it. I was lucky enough to have had a roof over my head. And had this opportunity to go to manhattan and work in a recording studio as a gopher. But i would have a place to go in and i got to get back on the bus and go back home. A lot of those kids that were on that bus in in that bus station were working the streets. And i'd see it every day that was new york in nineteen eighty eighty one eighty two. That was it you know they were working. The streets. there was commonplace to see girls and boys work in the streets and it affected me. I was aware of it. I certainly wasn't bob dylan woody guthrie but even at twenty one. I was aware and in defense of my naivety and single minded focus on trying to become a rock and roll star. I was twenty one. You know and from where we came in the background that i had you should be writing. Rock and roll song sets what life was about playing guitar and meeting girls. There wasn't much else that we had to worry about. You know there was food on the table and shoes on her feet and to go back to the new recco dimension. Then do what you can believe that one screwing from an off the cuff comment. You made your wife while you're working in the kitchen. Yeah when the pandemic happened and we pull the record and cancelled the tour outright. The soul kitchen still needed to serve that in need population. The basis of the restaurant is volunteerism and the inability for us to have volunteers washing dishes. Bussing tables meant that. I was going back behind the sink to do what i did when we first opened the place that something that gave me something to do while we were doing good and unbeknownst to me she had taken that picture and then wanted to put it on our social media site to tell the public the restaurants closed. But we're he. Takeout meals will be available and so what she posted that picture. She was asking me for the hours of the day in the days of the week. And then. I said if you can't do it you do you do what you can. It was the next day that i went with a chorus in ran in here and wrote the song and again citing just what was happening shutting down the border. The canadian border boarding up to schools. Yep kids are all going home to last paycheck in a world. Where you know. Most people i know are from where i come from. You know. they've got two weeks savings they didn't know if it was the apocalypse people were running the pie toilet paper and paper towels so a wrote the song and initially performed it for local television telethon to benefit charities here in new jersey and played it just an acoustic version until we could record this sir sand sand fill. You went closely with john shanks outcome for some time now. Is he a good sounding board for these songs when they call. Yeah i mean. John's very talented guy for sure. I've worked with the now for fifteen years so we do have a good relationship. He's also able to convey my thoughts in short hand. He's not technologically challenge and that is a great asset. He's a really great collaborator. When we go write a song together he could contribute both lyrically and musically as an equal and then when i wrote american record and he was definitely one of the people that was like. I'm afraid for you you know. Why do you need to do this. I says because that's what songwriters should do you know if they choose to. They should use their voice to say something and he was aware of the cancel culture. And i says i don't care. Fear is not a motivator but we had open and honest conversations about it and it was he and tico but ultimately tico who convinced me that it was disclose using the words. I can't breathe as the title and maybe three or four more times in the song than it needed to be. And that's when. I took the line from the third verse and put it as the title in american reckoning was a much better title but it took that conversation and i wasn't afraid to have there's no ego involved in songwriting and if there is you're being shortsighted so there's no ego involved. I just wanted to get it right and think you co wrote the song limitless with john. Well yeah jonah billy falcon. Billy's that old collaborator buddy. Someone who i love. I was a fan of in late seventies when he put out records is older than i am. But he he made records in the late seventies so the three of us wrote that when together to songs on the record of the three of us wrote together. I like to call to action in the open. Line the wake up everybody wake up and yeah because it's a bit like groundhog day is in it. Who knew day. It was where we're out what we're doing and everybody linked to fuck up. It's time to you know. Get back out into the world and tried to utilize some of that good old. Bon jovi optimism pie wake the buzzing. The scrubby obeys implicit out the door into the street and my sleep a million different phases from different. Please swimming in the sea. Keep your head above to keep you on us. Ask will typically chime in with kind of suggestions criticisms when you present them with a batch of new songs. Generally speaking david tico hugh all contribute greatly in the studio absolutely positively. But i don't think it's necessarily critical as much as they'll try to help me get to the vision of a song and whether or not it makes it as another conversation but during the process i don't think they're ever critical which is wonderful because it gives the song a chance to live or die but they don't come in and go off a hate this which could be right of any. You'd see body language in a band member if he just hated the idea but they're not they're not like that they will bring the song as far as we possibly can allow me to rewrite it five times and not lose patients and then if it sucks it doesn't make director so no but they're not critical right. I was amused to learn that you had to spend quite a bit of time just to find your sinatra line on. It's my life because that always seemed like such natural line to me and it's things so well. I was really surprised that there was resistance to not wanna a random on that one. Yeah he didn't understand it which is fine because to be asked to defend a line and if you can all the more power to you and you know ultimately the argument was i had just come home for making a movie called you. Five seven one. And i'd suspend like five months in malta and rome and i come home and frank had just passed and i was always a big fan. Because he's like new jersey's you know god and he made movies helped get john kennedy elected. He made records. He was still the chairman. The board until the day died. And so i had a real admiration for him. My very very short list of regrets. That's the biggest one is that i never met him. But i brought that home from that film really saying to myself. I'm going to do what i wanna do. I'm gonna make records when. I want movies when i want if it takes a couple of years between things i've earned it and so like frankie said i did it my way and then richie said well. You're the one that's got sing it. And it was an honest reaction to it because at the end of the day who knew. I didn't know that people were going to say. Oh frankie is there buddy. Or it's their brother arts them you know to me. It was frank sinatra to them. It's something else. And that's what makes a great song work often fast people would say that's one of the memorable lines in the catalog if you know yet to just suddenly produce a few bon jovi lines. I'd probably lot one iraq and everyone likes to sing along with that. Don't they in said that they did it their way. Oh yeah it was a big empowering song. Oh yeah for sure. Smile son typically starts a song with some sorts of story oracle concept in mind and then kinda shape the music around the generally speak game. I like to think that you start with title. Because i think that the title used to dictate the feel of the song and so you know you give love a bad name wouldn't feel right is a ballad was meant to be that kind of rock song fun upbeat tongue in cheek and better. Roses didn't feel like a rock song. You know so it just depends on where you're at. I can say that. In the latter years there was a song called. We don't run on Burning bridges that. I wrote with john and the truth was he was sitting around waiting for me in the studio basically come up with the roughest of rough kind of a track which is rare that i would write to attract an especially something that someone else started did. I didn't pick up the guitar and come in with something. But that i was like. Oh i get this. You know in the lyrics just flowed out and and then. I sang it that day in the studio and boom. We had a song but it was gone on burning bridges so at the time. I was like who cares. I'm burning the house down anyhow. So this is the end of my years at universal records. Oh man my life's over. And i'm burning the place in my way out so you know. That song came but that was an exception. That's not the rule. It does seem to me that when you hear a tight light wanted dead or alive or blaze of glory or something like that you know you can probably take on some kind of character or you've got some kind of narrative in mind for some like the and they both did and although songs just sound like a big d you tune in down the low eastern. And you're gonna you know that's where it's going to live. And whether it was a wanted i had the idea went to richie's house that morning and woke him up and he came up with that lick on the spot and we wrote the song and another song in the same day the other song didn't live and we blaze glory had The young script. And so i read the script and put my voice inside of billy. The kid and wrote them the song. Suppose something like living on a takes kind of fed pissing view of the story. Does not edit took three persons to write that song and god knows none of us knew what the fuck we had and you know. That baseline was developed in the demo. You know so at a later date and we were just pounding on the root chord changing the courtroom evener cd writing the verses and everybody's contribution was equal and different and i wanted storyline. Richie came up with the wo- you know. I mean everybody had something and of course desmond. Everything was equal equal equal and we all walked out of there. And i wasn't sure that it was worth anything because it was so different than anything that was on the radio and it didn't sound like anything else and united sort of. Well it's okay. And richard was like your fool this one special but i didn't know you know none of us knew anyone says that they knew didn't know and then we went to in my hometown. There was this crap demos studio and we created the demo there including that silly keychains. It just kills me son of a bitch you know the twenty five year old was of course i can do that. The fifty nine year olds going you foolish kid. But that's when it came to be in my hometown sarava when we were all back in that room with the ban and worked it up. Bruce fairbairn was there. You know huey was there. We developed at baseline you know and it all came to be. We spoke to desmond child. A little while ago actually was terrific and he shared his memories of i meeting you in ritchie and think. He said he descended into a basement of the house in new jersey and weapon. You guys kind of sat around the table. we wounded. What you remember that that encounter there was no table. There was no table and it was next to the washing machine. I can remember like it was. Yesterday was the basement. Bottom of ritchie's mother's house and yeah we'd met as at that time i remember ritchie and i you know the first two records dental okay. You know we had a couple of top forty hits but not number. One and fahrenheit did better than the of a first album and then we watched bryan adams writing songs for people and he having hits and it was getting him more notoriety and i was like. Maybe we have to do that. But we didn't even know how and someone told us about desmond. And i said i remember a poster of his band hanging outside the dressing room. A club that i played a lot and That guy had long blonde curly hair packs and three girls on in you know and it was right. Outside of the jackson. Cut seven years six years later. This guy walks in. He's got black hair it's a crew cut. He's got a beard. He certainly built fucker. You you ain't that guy poster but we really hit it off and the idea was that we intended to write a song or two for somebody else. We weren't even telling him that but the concept was that well. This guy's got a publishing deal. That's what he does always not an artist any longer. So that's how we met him but then we hit it off and then our relationship went to ten layers deeper and personal and as friends in the godfather of his children. You know life built around us in change all of our lives at three of us but some of the great memories were like that sitting in richie's mother's basement and magically writing bad name in prayer there. Yeah you give about names not about way to stop on. Chip is it. I mean it wasn't the first song but it was a there was a song called edge of a broken heart that we ended up using on a sound check. That was one of the ones where i said. It's okay and a bad name in prayer was written in new york at someone's apartment but the relationship of course built from there and so many great memories those choruses it just bulletproof only. They're pretty good but some of the album tracks to you. Bad name prayer. Yes number one songs we did it and yeah and i can tell you great stories and they work and they still work and i love singing but go and sing blood on blood and you go. That song works. You know like it's not a single put. We knew what were doing when we sat down to write it and we did and it's cool. It's still holds up so there's good memories like that. There's good memories like that. I think that was the result of discipline as well. Though wasn't it. Because i read that you were willing to sort of lucky selves away for eight hours a day. If that's what it took. I don't know if he was disciplined. Or desire. What i did when i was a teenage boy by myself. And then when richie came and joined the band then when we met a desmond or a billy along the way or i was still riding by myself. It didn't this is just what you did. You would shed. You're right and you're right. You're right one thing that we used to do that. I don't do as much of now. Who's we would write batches of ten then call the bandon and demo then bright ten more to try to beat those ten and write ten more to beat those ten said typically out of thirty. You'd get the ten if that's called disciplined than yeah we had you've had them productive partnerships with quite a few right bartlett's down the years. I was read them. Dave stewart biography quite recently and he mentioned sandwich phony handwriting midnight in chelsea with you. How did you find the experience of working with davies. Is quite a character. Dave stewart. Boy i wanna say this well enough he is and i mean this would also serta. He is a saint in an angel because he is so in love with music but unattached to the nonsense. That is behind any of it. All he cares about is the beautiful collaborative effort of being in a room with somebody and getting them to do something that makes. You're both happy. And i met him. I think this is where i met him. I was in. I don't know how. I got there. But i hope this is right. I came to england. Do a movie. It was called the leading man in one thousand nine hundred ninety six. I'm gonna guess and Somehow i ended up at a rented. Home of bruce willis and demi moore and dave stewart was there and we had a wonderful night. I don't remember what. Got me there. But i was there and then i hit it off with dave and he says saudi doing. I says i'm here to make a movie. you know. he's we should get together and write. You know just play music. And i said of course i'd love to and so on the days off in the film i went over to his place and it's all like purple sparkles on the wall and there was a bedspread made of the union jack and it said suburbia on it and to this day. Twenty one twenty five years ago. The name of my little side project is the kings of suburbia because of that bedspread and he then told me a story of his getting bob dylan to go and busk and i think there's film footage of him convincing bob dylan going busk. But that's the connick guy. Dave was so when he's gotten a cab with mr going somewhere. He takes out a little video camera and start interviewing me in the back of a cab. You can't help for your heart out to this guy because he's that guy that gets you to do stuff that you would never think of doing but it's not trite and it's not. It's not there to market a record in. It's not a trick. It's just the wonderful collaborative effort so when he then said to me. Because i've written both that record by myself to. He said where you live in. What are you doing there. Tell me you know what your story is. And that's the lyrics to midnight in chelsea. i'd have to look them up right now. But it's literally i need to get out of my own skin and it's midnight in chelsea. No one knows who. I am and veterans and the lyric was just so you know who and what i was at the time so i loved making that record there with him and the guy named steve looney just getting out of my own skin and making a completely different art record. You know if you will but lyrically was very personal. And i'll give you one piece of trivia that no one on the planet knows so we stayed friendly. But i don't get to see. Oh dave often. But dave got married to newspaper And we are invited to the wedding. We went to the wedding at a wonderful time as dave as you can imagine. Jesus and all of the disciples were there and they were all drinking wine and having a wonderful time and so then you know the weekend is over and we all fly back to whence we came and we talked a year later and i know that he had had a baby and he knew that we had had a baby. And we said what's the baby's name india. Okay jake. what's the first date may the seventh. No shakers made the seventh. You're kidding what time of the day was it. And i'm going to say the time i guess. It was four o'clock in the afternoon. I said oh too bad. Because jake was nine o'clock in the morning and then we went time change. These two kids were born on the same hour of the same day of the same year. Nine months after dave's wedding. I guarantee you jake. And his daughter were the byproduct of a beautiful wedding weekend time by all usually has that first story and shrew and so the two of the kids met once and it was beautiful. Wow incredible dave's the greatest man with the whiskey. Is that his name phone game off his own midnight and chills. No one's asking me for pay us looking for them to do. So what you're writing routine like these days. Do you maintain any kind of regular schedule for the now one thing. I realized a long long time ago was when the creative stream is running. I'm there to catch everything that did falls out. And then when it's not and you turn off the faucet. I'm cool enough with myself to say it's okay. It'll come back. I don't have to write every day. I see a little spark happen in. You know when. I'm sleeping or i'll write a couple lines down or i'll write a chorus of something n if it doesn't come. It doesn't come so where i'm at today. Is i know i'm changing channels again. Like i couldn't really write a topical record again now. It's time to change the channel. I'm aware of that with the riots at the capitol. I sat down. And i wrote a chorus of the song and just truly couldn't lock the lyric to the verse in because there was just too many pushes impose in what is the verse about. What is the point of view with these people. And then i let it go so it sat there for a week ten days and i was about to send the chorus to billy falcon and so you want to write the verses with me because the chorus is great and David bryant said to me enough with the topical songs. But instead of me taking it the wrong way. I sort of went Good point here. I think that youthfully this one needn't be written. I think out today a month into it is. I'm gonna let that one go. It's time to change channels in my mind. I don't know where the next one's going but enough for the topical stuff for now. Yeah always taking the guitarist. Elliot primary right in tula. We sometimes which subpoena no to mixed thing. Oh this one over here this guitar. I'm in my jersey home and in my little office here so this. I don't know how superstition guys are. But sometimes i say you know this one talks to this. One doesn't with this whole martin was talking really good for american reckoning. And do what you can see if i could show you. Could you see what it said. Oh wow amazing. Keep living on a prayer. Bob dylan tells the right. So came from bob. And so i call this guitar bob. Habob regard anything today and in the one. I've had it another house when i was writing this one. The last two weeks as looking at it and basically giving it to finger. It's like you don't wanna talk to me. And what i don't want to talk to you either. Go fuck yourself and this black communities got to say to me. So i'm like all right. I'm go back and see bob. We wanted this when it comes to those classic balance like always better roses. They sound to me like they started life on the piano with be right there. It just got. You're sitting on the top of it right now. But yeah absolutely and i'm a hack for i can sit down and pound by way through those songs and the writing is always different piano guitar. This question a different melody. Oh come on piano guitar fisher even though you say you're a hack. the piano. sounds like something like always it's so solidly crafted isn't it. I mean every section of that song is memorable. the bridge is as good as the verse. It's you know. I got that one right. I think he wrote that one on your own. Didn't you have written a lot of our biggest hits by myself. you know. Blazing glory better roses always so. Yeah yeah yeah. I have no issue writing hit songs by myself. That's on the back for that both. I'll take it gosh. That was only presence on the tv when we were growing up. The video for always was a monster. But here is a song that i had written on the road for a film film wasn't great. It was gary oldman movie. Called romeo is bleeding again. I had the script. I find it really easy for me to write music to movies. And i enjoy it immensely. 'cause they're handing you the story line You know there's so many pictures in a one hundred ten page script head. So romeo is bleeding the name of the movie so this romeo is bleeding. But you can't say about writing the song at so we did it. We recorded it. It was a much different version really synth driven and it was a and the movie was so it never got off the shelf and there was a guy by the name of john codner. Who had come down to a recording studio as we were writing and recording these days and He was just going through bats on the shelf. Put him in was into you know things that never made our records and he says this one special you should rethink this and so we put it on what was to become the greatest hits record along with. Someday i'll be saturday night. Had we known. Someday i'll be saturday nights should have stayed on these days and probably been the first single because always was so big saturday night. Never got shot always was a monster. Well john this has been such thrill getting to talk to you with just so pleased to see where you're with twenty twenty two just the great record. Thank simon yeah. I really appreciate your time. And i love talking about songwriting. Thank you for giving songwriters platform because we love it. It's a pleasure know we've been admires your song and since we were not seen so it really does mean a lot that you came on the show my pleasure guys well continued success and all the best and i hope to see when we get through this mess. Thanks so much. All right fantastic. Thanks guys juice sean. Just just two plays. That was a whole lot of magic. Assist sisters are going to be so jealous bri. What a guy that was jon. Bon jovi talk to us from his home in new jersey. Probably the first interview our guest the stood up for the whole interviews. Well yeah i think. He had this laptop patched on his piano so roaming around bit wasn't he he was maybe things better any moves around. I never thought we'd be on zoom with jon. Bon jovi shown. Us martin. Acoustic signed by. Bob dylan well when you put it like that as opposed this one has to go down in the annals of so the jacob law but yeah there's a reason why this guy is who he is. I guess she just had why y- there's a lot of blood sweat and sees that goes into making that many hits and you know he's he's obviously still pushing himself isn't he said about back. In the day they would write batches of ten and then try and write ten better songs kind of outdo those. yeah and a guest. When you're pushing. Hard denise surrounded by town of musicians richie and the rest of the guys you going to come up with good shit you know how. He's a bunch that practice since the presence as well was interesting with this really direct so no bullshit approach to twenty twenty yet really speaks to write great songs. I guess the first time. I head to remind me of a neil diamond album twelve songs. Oh yes one he did with rick rubin from two thousand five Not that neil was being political was janis on this record book. There's a sort of gravitas you know when a veteran songwriter sits down with an acoustic guitar and share some wisdom. He asked them for very pure about. Isn't it yeah. It's great lapierre about partnership with. John shanks as well as gary barlow said this someone you just want to write with as soon as he starts playing guitar and it looks like he's been an excellent collaborates for jon. Bon as well we call john boehner all the friends. They've well let's folks. Another legend comes through the doors of soda jay towers and is now left the building deepest. Thanks to john for his time and cheers the and loofah for their help. Twenty twenty available everywhere so go see what bunge of europe to check out the work. John's been doing for a long time now with j. j. soul kitchen and his foundation disfluent traffic efforts are really something to behold absolutely so. That's been another pinch yourself episode for us to tease apart frosted pans and get out of here. We'll see you next time bye-bye.

Bon jovi new jersey john Richie sambora desmond Jon bon jovi brian o'connor Sama barbara bon jovi Gysi asprey jukes David brian Tico torres bob medicine Joe switch Hugh mcdonald sam bora john bon jovi soul foundation John instagram
Panel: civilization dialogue

World News Analysis

54:55 min | 2 years ago

Panel: civilization dialogue

"News. I'm showing you. Today provide you with indepth news and expert analysis, ten of the who story bigger picture. For you. The news you want to know only on today. You're listening to world today. I'm the conference on dialogue of Asian civilizations. Is now being held here in Beijing political and business leaders youth resentatives and media are taking this opportunity to brainstorm and communicate Chinese president Xi Jinping is opening speech promoted, a cultural equality and diversity. Well, denounced a clash of civilizations scenario. Let's hear what he had to say at the conference with our reporter while known representatives from forty seven Asian countries and non regime donations were in Beijing. Full the opening ceremony of the conference on dialogue of Asian civilizations. Which is focused on the theme of exchanges and mutual learning among Asians of allies, Asians, and beauty a community was a shared future for mankind. As part of his keynote speech seeming said that it was very important for all countries to work. Towards maintaining a balanced, and a harmonious global environment. What you ching, teach. Henschel the world today is moving towards greater mount, you polarity economic globalization and cultural diversity and is becoming increasingly inflammation oriented all this points to promising prospects for the future. Meanwhile, instability, and uncertainties amounting and the global challenges faced by humanity on becoming even more daunting holding for joint responses of all the countries presidency expressed his hope that Asian countries when the unite to join to promote a form of economic globalization. That is open inclusive, balanced and beneficial to all he also encouraged the countries across the region to work together to eliminate poverty. He noted it was important for countries to create conditions in which other civilizations could develop while also fostering vitality. In their own cultures will home cow. My main hobby to meet our common challenges and create a better future for all we look to culture and civilization to play the ro which is important as the role played on the colony science and technology conference on down all Asian. Seven is Asians was convened, for just this purpose, and it creates new platform for civilizations in Asia and beyond to engage in Donald and exchange on an equal footing in order to facilitate mutual learning presidency permits to that China will embrace the world with a more open posture, and that will contribute more than namic achievements to the world's civilizations. He ended the speech by encouraging an exchange of ideas among the attendees for cri. This is wall known yin. So what would discuss communications among civilizations in today's world? And other broader topics like the Asian identity, the clash of civilizations theory and modernization. Our panel is a helmet con a research fellow with the belt and road Strategy Institute at seeing while university from Germany, Dr David O'Brien assistant professor of Chinese studies with the university of noting him Ningbo China and join us from Shanghai, professor Lucon director of China research program with Duke University to listen to this episode again where catch up on previous episodes. You can download our podcast by searching for world today. So let's begin with misconduct. How important do you think this kind of dialogues on these civilization level? When it comes to solving the problems, the world is facing today, like climate change, maybe protectionism, or maybe a racism. I think I fall, it's an honor for me to be here on the program, and this week has been about about a lot of issues and a lot of ideas that we've wanted to discuss that China has taken the initiative in number one being that we don't have to think about conflict. When we talk about modernisation, we can respect tradition if we want to modernize what we're essentially looking at today is that China's promoting an idea, which which is against the conceived notion of a clash of civilization and us versus them, a zero sum game, mentality and saying that actually we can take from ancient wisdom from ideas that for generations and centuries helped us coexistent thrive together. And let's go back to that part of history where we were happy and learning from each other, and that is an idea that can be implemented today in today's. As foreign policy today's domestic policies coming, specifically to ideas of globalization, the time it change. I feel like the, the dialogue on Asian civilizations opens the door to thinking about humanity as one. And then if we say that we want to address issues of climate change issues apart from climate change of population of, of maybe possibly conflict of globalization. If we think of humanity as one then we see fewer hurdles in our journey together, and in that way, I feel like this is this is a needed 'initiative, and one that can change the perspective of many nations in the region. So Dr Brian, what's your hope that this kind of global dialogues on a cultural civilization, religious exchanges should prioritize? Well, thank you. Also for having me on the show today, I would agree with much of what the previous speaker has just said. And I think it's very encouraging when we listen to what presidents DJ thing is that in his speech and, and, and the very fact that this conference is taking place, but I'm also concerned that at any time when we talk about civilization, we can move quite quickly from the us brations. The humanity is one idea that the previous speaker just mentioned, but we very quickly moved into divisive territory as defining who we are versus who they are. And I think a lot of the conversation around civilization is about division about who who we are, who we are not who they are who, who, who have the others. And I think when it comes to an issue like climate change, you know, it really doesn't matter. Civilization is essential. Really irrelevant? When it comes to questions of climate change, because we're all going to basically be wiped out if the projection for what's going to happen in the future and civilization will be entirely irrelevant in some ways these discussions can hold us back because there's a tendency to say, well, you know, we are doing this, but they are not doing us, and that's division and those discussions, which very, very quickly can happen when we're talking with filtration, you know, are, are one of the one of the fundamental challenges that we humans face today, professor Liu about this general question, could this kind of talk spec- and meaningful of turn to solve the world's problems today. Thank you for having me on the panel. Yeah, I agree with the two previous speakers. Great point. I think the, the cost of Asians division is quite interesting. And meaningful within the context of constructing a common a shared community of or mankind are coming wealth of humanity in the Chinese works. It's Cogez inconsiderate the coming of humanity or the shared community of mankind. So this Asian civilization dialogue, I think it's quite closely connected to that broader rubrics on a rich China is more than willing to collaborate with other countries in Asia, and rest of the world, the, the climate chance is part of the issues that we face right now. But it's not really. The most prominent one even though it was mentioned in this. Current conference. I take in order to understand in order to understand the significance of these coversation. Civilizational colonization one thing we want to say is that we've been looking forward to the future. Other than taking back. I heard the two previous speakers concerns and also the mention about the idea of cash AP's division, the players not. Going back to history of the civilization of device or civilizational divisions, rhesus division, rather, we are trying to look forward. So not says, I would agree. This is a sort of maternity Blee of looking beyond looking forward. Now in this kind of any police and also any response. And what are you a major takeaways from this speech by president? She. Okay. So I think I I would like to maybe discuss some of the ideas that were mentioned by both the both Dr Liu and Dr David, I feel like the concept of the nation state is fundamentally different from the concept of civilization. While of course, any identity can serve to divide us the fact that the Asian civilizations conference was introduced was to impart in us, the idea that we must coexist, and respect each other. We are not so strictly defined differently from one another. I feel like when maybe at least the exposure that I had to some western media or western academics that were discussing this conference, it seemed as there's a bit of a cultural difference as well as of now that as if you know Asian. Want to define themselves as powerful and sort of question the existing status, cool. Whereas that's really not how a lot of people who are part of this who are part of this shared heritage field. All all we are proposing is that we should revisit a time when we were not moralistic moralism is so different from ours being moralistic. We don't need to impose our systems. Our cultures are definitions on each other. I will also go back to the to the inspiration of the Belton road initiative, which was the sacred the, the original Silkroad was about learning from each other identities. Installations were farm fluid, and open to change open to learning and imparting to each other as well. So maybe it seems like a very big idea. Maybe it seems as if we are again defining ourselves strictly against someone else. But for me personally, I feel that this is important because I see identities as much more fluid if we talk about. Realizations and as much more we have much more in common specifically speaking of presidencies, which are very quick. I think these are the ideas that he has discussed not only in the speech on Wednesday, but otherwise for a few years, he's been talking about coexistence, and he also doesn't use the word tolerance that much because tolerance means you have to tolerate something that bothers you what it, what he talks more about is. Embracing each other coexistent hominy mutual respect to not impose on each other, and I feel like these principles fundamentally important given the kind of conflict we have experienced for the previous decades where mations will being democratized on issues of being told what systems to impose without really understanding their structures. So we are moving towards a time when openness of acceptance is, maybe encouraged now that's coming back to professor. Lou about the speech of Chinese president argues, quote is foolish to believe that once raisin civilization are superior to others and disastrous to willfully reshape, or even replace other civilizations. I think that's related to miss conscious talk about so how do you see this remark? Yeah, this. Remark has at least for me means to things. One is a. Professor presidency is trying to alert us to the, you know, the resurgence of racing around the world. So he says, you know, there's as ratio superiority should be really rejected. The second thing is about the kind of division that taking place in the world. Then atrocity, she wants through suggest that we don't really want have this kind of division. No matter. It's a civilizational racial or otherwise behind the those, we can find a pretty strong desire for a, you know, again, like the president, she talks about this over and over again, this kind of desire to build or construct, they shared coming to keep for humanity for mankind. I think that's the core of his arguments. And that's what I get from his speech Sadako Ryan, what's your observation about the speech by president? She. Well, you know there's a lot of very fine things in, in the speech. There's a lot of very impressive ideas. And there are lots of very you know, things that we should listen to carefully. But, you know, when we talk about these futures in, which we, you know, look beyond our differences, or as, as miss concert in her in her earlier remarks, when we took also looking backwards to history, a time of when we were learning from each other, an kind of a happier time, I think both forward and backward, views, there are somewhat utopian. You know, the fact is that humanity has always organized into groups, which are for whatever reason, economically, socially politically opposed to one another. And I think while it is very impressive. And indeed, when we contrast presentation things. Speech to other discourses taking place in other parts of the world today, which are really emphasizing division and exceptionalism, and the need to push, you know, certain countries, make them, grace again and put them before other countries. And so on and so forth. You know, it's impressive but I think we also need to, to be realistic about this ski no conflict, racism division. They are part of the human condition, and I don't know how we can necessarily avoid that. It's part of who we are. It's not a good part. We are not advocating, but I'm saying it's part of who we are. And I think generally, when we talk about civilization we, we are essentially talking about as much as what divides us as, as, as about what unites us and I think, you know, even when it's impressive to, to, to, to listen to a speech like this and conference like this is a very admirable thing. I'm not sure how it can necessarily address. Many of these things some gotten. I think a lot of Dr David says is important because we should take whatever reality, we're living in and a reduced the idealism with pinch of salt. But I think there's a far more important issue address, which this conference addresses, I personally, come from a region that was third world. I was in a in a country. I was studying convent, and I always knew that I'm from the third world, which can always be nothing. More than in the waiting room of history. What we are is fundamentally inferior to what westerners are once a woman who was this is I'm trying to explain the psyche as well. One of the women who was working in my house. She asked me oh my God. Do the poor in America to speak English. You know, as if the language the western the western. Everything western the culture was superior. So this is a mindset actually, which most nations that were part of the third world. And now, we call it the emerging world or the developing world are are basically going through. And when the, the important thing is, of course, maybe any identity can result in a clash and we can say that. Let's not go towards racism. Let's, let's talk about ideas that divide us an identity in itself is divisive. I don't agree. And I think what we are actually looking at is to embrace our history, so that we can determine our own destiny as well. And it does not have to be opposed to any other identity, but this is very important, because a lot of people in the developing countries today, still feel like they are inferior and this needs to stop factual what we expand more on, like density issue. And also the modernization process in history later party in the show of that's. The first shift gears and talk more about some basic theoretical theoretical questions. So, Dr Brian more about what you say, how would you define the concept of civilization life, hell to differentiate, the concept with other concepts like coacher idiocy? Well, I think you know civilizations is an extremely difficult one to define. And I think sometimes we can get we can get lost in theoretical discussion of important, but I think for me, one of the things that I would look at first who is doing the defining. And I think going to misconduct point, which I would absolutely agree with when you think about the context of the third world of the emerging world on how people react to the definitions, which are imposed upon them, then that's something that, you know, I think is, is fundamentally important in this question. So if, if, if one people described themselves as being civilization and explicitly, or, or implicitly say that they are more civilized are less civilized, then, you know, we have a hierarchy of civilization and I think the hierarchy of civilization is very problematic. The idea that one group of. People are more or less civilized than another is, I think, you know, one of the one of the major challenges that we're facing as, as, as a common humanity for me personally, I think, you know, in my own sort of research, and writings, I do have to focus on, on boundary as a way of defining who we are not. And that's the kind of theoretical discussion that we can get into more detail. But I think when it comes to this term, civilization, it is a politically, older term. Right. And and, and implies a certain degree of, of hierarchy who gets to define as being the civilization, the old civilization, the more advanced civilization, more prosperous civilization, the first world third world. These are all terms which have hierarchy to them, and I think, you know, we would need to fundamentally reevaluate. How we approach these question if we are actually ever going to move beyond that, and I and I don't necessarily see how in the world today when we organize ourselves into nation and religion and to varying groups in particular ways that we can necessarily move beyond that I'm somewhat pessimistic. I'm afraid when it comes to question which is this professor Lee will, what's your take is the Cossack of civilization? I mean padded with Iraqi naturally like civil versus uncivil. Yeah. I think professional Brian has a very interesting point that the definition of civilization pretty much depends on the, the kind of perspectives. You look at issue, if it taking of from a more kind of European perspective, especially in, in the period of the renaissance or in license. The civilization really implies kind of civilized, more urban centers, kind of a higher hierarchy that the as pharma, superior than other, quote unquote, more traffic cultures addition. So there is a hierarchy implied, but I would like to say when China is involved, the question is getting a very, interesting tryst says that China has been always spilled from either western perspective, or from the Chinese intrinsic perspective, China being a unique or exceptional as a civilization, the ancient of this. So there's a issue of modern I of civilization in two zero R served. Versus the versus the kind of a classical or more insurance. I of civilization being a more insurance world Incheon culture as into that is, so the premodern political entity and cultural entity when the when we talk about China, I think some of the more modern thinkers of scholars, for example, the for example, the American political scientists Aleutian pie. Sometimes arguing that China China has being civilization pretending to be a modern nation. So in that sense, his referring China to more innocent state rather than the modern modern culture modern entity. So I, I guess we somehow when we come to the, the definition of understand. Addition, we have to pay attention to all the different nuances perspectives, and the context from those notions ideas are being tat much. Fortunately, we're running out of time. Our first half in the second half, who pay more in expand more our discussion or discussing a communication among civilization in today's world and other broad, topics alike identity and clash of civilization theory. And also modernisation our panel is zoom, Hamid Khan research fellow without road Strategy Institute at seeing how university from Germany, where joined by Dr David O'Brien assistant professor of Chinese studies with the university of noting him Ningbo, China and join us from Shanghai. Professor Lee count director of China research program with Duke University. If you wanna listen to this episode. Again, we're catch up on previous episodes. You can download our podcast by searching for world today. I'm so we stay with us. I am on Koch idea. I teach at the university in DEA today has organized its programs and it says, on bringing in a lot of us from all over, it is an extremely good platform for information and analysis and I wish it all success in the future. China plus dot cri. Dot CNN is your home for everything you want to know about China. The latest news in China and everything China related from around the world, everything can focus all in one place, bringing you vital information, feel business and travel Chinese culture, language learning and mall, shine plus dot CO arrived dot C, N, China, plus dot cri dot C, N your portal into today's middle kingdom. Online on air and on your phone. Take today wherever you go, and stay head of what's changing our world from politics and the economy to business and technology today, covers regional and international issues that affect China and the world Jeep uptodate with today. We'll come back. You're listening to world today. I'm Swe representatives from forty seven countries are here in Beijing for the conference on dialogue of Asian civilizations. Chinese president Xi Jinping in his opening speech, promoted, cultural equality, and diversity, and at the same time denounce to clash of civilizations scenario as a where talking about a communication among solicitations in Asia, and beyond in today's world and other more theoretical questions. Like, I the clash of civilizations theory and modernisation. Our panel is Zuniga mccown research fellow with about two road Strategy Institute at sink. Wow. University from Germany, Dr David O'Brien assistant professor of Chinese studies with the university of noting him Ningbo China and join us from Shanghai, professor Lucon director of China research program with Duke University. The listen to this episode again we're catch on previous episodes. You can down. Download our podcast by searching for world today. So now, let's pick up from what we left in the first half miscount talk about this different discourse. When we talk about civilization and actually, to better describe Asian traditions at Duke historian, prison g Dora. He promotes a circulatory and transnational histories as an alternative to nationalist history, particularly to describe the history and also the situation in Asia. So how would you can't rice the way, Asian seven is Asians communicated with each other in history. Compare with the western civilizations? You know, I also I mean I try to address the question you asked. But also, I'll take from what, what our other panelists talking about before the break, I feel like there is absolutely no need to ask who is superior of who civilization is more civilized civilization is completely different. From civilized, it's or to civilize one is active as if we have to we have to convert people, which is not too different from the modernization theory either, and it is not an old concept is primarily, a western concept. And if you also compare China's in China's interaction with smaller states, back in the day, it was the tributary system, which was very different from colonialism, one is more imposing and the other is relatively less imposing. If I may say, not imposing role in terms of interfering in the domestic circumstances, so the question of who is superior. And if we get into a discussion of identity, we necessarily after determine who was better who was smarter who'll contributed more a feel like this is this is also cultural different and in some academic settings. We are told re read history in a way that we think. It is inevitable that people will get into this question and quarrel about who's better. But that is not necessarily the case if you look at our ancient Arab historians and scholars even doing Ignace sina. They will contribute into western political philosophy western taught. Muslim scholars and Chinese. Scholars will learn from each other south Asians the way each civilization or whatever group, it was contributed to each other's it shows that we we grew improved because we had each other to learn from. So we don't have to get into a conversation necessarily about who is more civilized, who contributed more, and as far as the question of a clash is concerned, or maybe like you mentioned the research. So talking about look I'm special way of communication among Asian civilizations. Well, I think that the first thing we need to do is study our histories from young age, which we don't really do. I really like the point that one of this is about teaching history, not accord, not national history not, not confining identity in the nation state. Because that is the, the worst to divide each other to think in necessarily a heart goes. Zero-sum game metality, but full, we should learn about Asian history African history, just the way we learn about European and American history. And we should incorporate each perspective, because it adds to our understanding of what really the journey of mankind has been, and that is something that we're not doing to a reasonable degree. Even now in schools in previously colonized countries. They study about the news in the books are Jack and Jill. Whereas they don't know any Jack and Jill in real life, you know. So it's quite education systems need to be revisited on many levels. So personally before you mentioned the specific case of Chinese civilization. If we talk about the history, pray modernisations could you give us a little background knowledge about this? Like, how do you describe a cultural communication of Chinese civilization in history? What can tell from this specific case? Lucky I've said I just mentioned, the way China China or Chinese state Chinese history has been in the west what American scholar Lucien pie. Trying to define China as civilization pretending to be amazing state what he says is China's not part of that is, yeah. This is. I'm just quoting his word China's not just another nascent state in the family of nation China. The civilization pretending to your state this for me, it's looking China backward, China, reading China to the antiquity to the engine world, still willing, China, as a engine unpire not trying. Not quite modernize. So that's. The kind of something that I believe that the president. She's a speech, try to quite implicitly because not kind of sumptuous as why knee, accept it on the other hand, if we want to take the perspective of the more recent ideas of conflict, or clashes of described by people like Samuel Huntington. We should be very careful nuts, ascribing China as a kind of unique civilization or civilizational state in cross the in the kind of civilizational classes and conferences, rather. I think you know, if he wants to really talk about China in, in the in the current conditions in the current state of globalization. We should go back to the ideas of China. This is a part of the family of nations is part of the modern world, regardless of differences, cultural religious, language linguistic. And what have you it is essential for us to again? You know from the very beginning said, we should look forward. Rather than looking backwards. I'm not really sure if you want to stay looking forward as simply ideally, this is a pretty realistic. So, I would I would think if we simply understand the idea that the, you know, promoting conversations promoting dialogue and promoting the shared community, four main kind Chinese presidencies. Very famous call for building a Commonwealth manage is not simply idealistic is not simply you told him, it's pretty realistic. It's pretty tactical. It will give us some guidelines in this very much divided world. If you wanna talk about conversations sort of, and those are the starting point premises for from each, we can start a real meaningful conference. So Dr Brian, how do you see this? Do we need outturn of a narrative? Of beyond like a classic western theories to describe Asian civilizations. Well, I'm in Germany, as you've mentioned, I'm actually in, in Westphalia where the tree she of Westphalia was signed, forty eight, which, you know, brought in Manny way into, you know, the nation states. Right. Our understanding what the nation states sensually comes from this period. And the Tracy or peace of Westfalia is regarded as as, as, as the main thing that brought about the end of the, the religious wars in Europe. But these narrative, I think are often a little bit on the simplistic, because if we say that the treaty was fairly brought about the end of the religious wars in Europe. Well from airland and, you know, you could argue that the religious wars that took place in Europe for much of the for much of the of that, Peter artistic degree still taking place in Northern Ireland. Thankfully violence is less, but there is still significant religious conflict there. And so I think, you know, sometime. When we talk about western and Asian. And when we used these, these categories, we have a tendency to maybe over-simplified, or to generally, and I think the generalizing for me is significant problem when we talk about western civilization, I'm not entirely sure. I know what western civilization is, maybe thinking as an Irish person having grown up and being educated in a country, which was a colony of Britain, certainly as, as, as we were thought school, and as we understood ourselves to be our own self knowledge, the former colony does that make me a member of western civilization in the same way that a British person. I think that's you know, that's a difficult question to answer when it comes to Asian civilization. You know what are we defining Asian? Where do we draw these lines, where do we draw west failure lines and can we draw, he's kind of Westphalian borders in that particular way? And just on a final point, you know, when it comes to. Generalization if we are to speak of a people if we are to speak of that Chinese people are the Indian people are the Japanese people, you know what about those who don't necessarily disagree. Because if one of one point three billion, people think something different kind. We refer to the Chinese people are thinking, in particular way. I would just continue that I agree so much with this point. Dr Brian just made because it's so hard to of course, I also saying western eastern, and it is very simplified because we in the end on know exactly who identifies with an eastern identity. What was western the other point of the west failure nation? State concept. If I say that now, if that was that was a means to end the was in Europe, and he just pointed out that not entirely for his experience, and let's say still that it did. It was a successful strategy to end the wars in Europe. Then we just took that model and copy and pasted it onto Asia and onto Africa Andrew borders, where maybe they did not even make sense. And now you have so many nations states in these parts of the world, that say. However your nation state. Why do we, what is the common identity that we share and they struggle with defining themselves identifying something unique about them? So. Because they want to be a nation state in the same sense that western European countries are. But you just aren't that. So then there's, there's so many questions about what is an Asian state? Even what is a democracy? This is an ideal democracy. Oh, that's not an ideal democracy, should we democratize countries? There's so many things that maybe just did not, and cannot apply in certain parts of the world. And because of that, I feel that, of course saying Asians is Asians. European civilize, -ation cetera may be very simplistic and may also result in stereotyping, which is not right. But I will say that the fact that we are having a certain conference, which at least attempts to celebrate a time when we were coexisting and respecting one another, maybe I would never be able to define what exactly is Asians. But at least we can instep, it's look at a period, when we were trying, and we're not looking at who is superior to whom and we are able to at least say that for us the systems the political systems, the show social systems, etc. That will work need to be identified by us, and they cannot be implemented or imported from supposedly more developed societies. We have to identify what our needs, and that's the starting point if we want to prosper, I feel like this is the most important takeaway, in some sense, some more about that. Let's go beyond Asia, because a modern history, Asian countries more or less were influenced by the west in recent hundreds of years, a professor Lee will. How do you see the impact of western civilizations were cultures in? I mean maybe reshaping Asian cultures in modern history. Beck. You'll the it's not simply a reshaping. I say. The very idea of Asia shaped by I would say the post kind of a mess Fadia expansion, the area of what we would call the era on incurable and era of clone which somehow defined the divide actually divided the whole world in two. Oftentimes Ciardi into Asia, Africa, Latin America, and so on, so forth. So to answer your question more directly, I would think it's not a matter of thinking about everything ratio ping, or shaping the Asian or the re we think about influence of the western. The west on the Asia or on China. It's a matter of generally revisiting the overall rubric overall, conceptual fever, or called modernity in which, you know, vestavia cheese are parts of the construction of the international current international order or were system. And also the fun basins for modern nation thing. And we have those think in terms of the fundamental changes that have taken place over the last hundred years, especially over the last sixty fifty years. When we think about China, there's no question China is, again, I would say as an essential part of the world. So I would. Strongly disputes. China is not part of the modern world is not part of modern will China is only an insurance civilization or innocent empire, and also dispute, the Huntington, semi Huntington's concept of clashes of civilizations, which he pointedly, say, suggest that, that the Chinese cultural confusion, cultural and Slama culture are going to run into a fundamental confidence was they do the Christian cultures additions. I would think both ideas promoted by China's engine empire and semi hunting than are pretty dangerous, again come back to the idea that we all live in the part of the world as we are now and what? We want to beyond the divisions of west versus east Europe, worsest China or Asia is to think, in terms of the, the modern world in which we want to be part regardless of our race and religion in cultural linguistic differences. So again, I think to come back to my point because our point, I think our conversation, the starting point is the conference on the Asian civilizational dialogue. I would I would say president. She's speech is not talking about civilizational exchanges. He's main point is being argument as compute a Commonwealth of humanity in Asia or in the whole world, he. The Chinese translation, usually they shared come in for mankind. So I guess that's, that's I guess that's the point for from, which we can really thinking four and looking for it. You know, I if I can just make a short comment, I think what China is doing right now is questioning the centre, and the periphery concept the concept of the Occident, and the orient the concept of how some nations like Asian Africa. They were really none of the above Asia. Even as a continent could have been five different continents. If you look at the cultural diversity, it was just at the end of the world, and even the terms like far east near east Middle East. They all seem that there's a center, and this is these are the supporting elements of their support their, the supporting functions of the club. So what today when China steps up in a way and says that, you know, we can lead we don't we don't question. We're not we're not confronting but we can lead that is that is the worst. I mean, this is the. The point where the clash of civilizations argument sort of fields or the end of history, argument fails, because that fundamentally means that we don't need this democratic peace theory, it doesn't hold. We don't need countries to become westernized in order to modernize in order to Bahamona 's. So this is I feel like a big question. And, and people should read a concept cycle rentals, assume and other such books and other such literature, which is against which is sort of a response to the clash of civilizations argument, which are so much more popular. It's, it's unfortunate that we prefer to read of conflict rather than ideas that talk about how many so lastly, let's move on to this clash of civilizations theory is quite popular. These days on the mass media in China, partly because of the dialogue and partly because a senior US official recently in charge of policy making entered a state apartment reintroduced. The idea. But under the context of China US relations as so a doctor, Brian, I, although could you give us a little background like what's background wind? The theory of professor Huntington was proposed in first place. And also how relevant is the theory today. Well, I think when we look. You know, the influence of Huntington the influence of these ideas clash of civilizations. So on if we go back twenty years ago to in America following the, the attack of nine eleven and, you know, the rise of Neo conservatism. We see that, that argument being made a lot now of the we have a different American president. We moved you know, true number of different administration, but we also see Neo conservatives of, again playing a particular role in in the American discourse in and the strong Neo conservative elements within the US administration and high ranking figures in the US administration. But then if we look at just a few years ago, and we look as administration of Barrack Obama, you know, he was talking about being the first civic leader and focusing on Asia, and. Talking about his upbringing as the son of a of a man from Africa to, you know, living in Hawaii growing up in Indonesia. It was somebody who very much argued the opposite of a clash of civilization. And the emphasis was on multiculturalism. So I think, you know, these things have been flow and they swing back and think forward, and there's a pendulum element to it. But going back to miss cancer, I would definitely agree people prefer to read this stuff. You know, we prefer to read about conflict and cash illustration, so on and so forth. But and and, you know, coming back to our original idea. I definitely welcome a conversation like this on a conference like this taking place. And I don't want to say that I, I think, you know, it it it if you pick or to idealized I think the very fact that a conversation like this is taking places is a very good thing. But, you know, when we talk about terms like western. You know, oriental nearest very well China use a similar terms to. Let's not let's not forget, China course refers to, to middle country. And so will, you know, perceive of the world in some of these geographical, centrist refree debates as well. So, you know, these are not entirely, you know, born out of out of so called western civilization concepts. I think that most countries do this to some extent, but how important is Huntington? Well, I've been privileged to spend significant part of my adult life in China. And if it's a wonderful privilege of my life, and I've been fortunate enough to get to know, a lot of very good Chinese friend. And when it comes down to it at the end of the date, what do we really care about to care about caches relations that we care about our family, and we care about, you know, putting food on the table to care about, you know, so many of these things. Which which days today United. But when it comes to politics, of course, it much more about a much more defining ourselves to division professionally who specifically about the professor, Huntington's theory. But these days we heard US official put the theory in the context of China US relations. So what's needed to stop? I mean, the, the current rhetoric affront being a real thing I mean between China and the US. No look. Samuel Huntington is a great scholar. No question about it. Prophetic scholar, a great vision. When he talks about the third world as development model he set up a sort of paradigm for development studies, and then ask you need in the minute after mass of the collapse office over empire something in semi hundred promoted the idea of a clash of civilization in new of the ideological. Are that dominated the Cold War? So some in Huntington. Responding to the kind of academic, or, you know, philosophical vacuum left out by and of the Cold War, and he's again, very prophetic, I would think they're visionary in suggesting that probably next round of the major, conflicts and clashes will be pitching different religions different races different ethnic groups, which to a large extent have been very, very day. But what happened over the last twenty thirty years, however, when the, the tic- maker, encompass ministries, and this lady, MS Skinner talking about China. The US conflict was China, as civilizational conflict, something like the first time that we will have. Great power competitor about his cO, caisson, specifically referring China, as a non white Caucasian read. This is not a reputation is not invocation. The Huntington for this is the pure platens racism. I wouldn't I wouldn't be surprised that the being part of the Trump administration reason especially much on the rise. So, I think there's enough reason my most most of my call expecting the US feel really Aldridge by, you know, comments, and I think we should not take the likely we should be very careful fighting any kinds of reasons any kind of s Nic as no census them pretending to be, you know, in a MU forms of ideological people confrontation. Reason is something we need to fight. Thank you. Professor. We have to wrap up there. I wanna thank our, our panelists made con David Brian and blue count. I'm sweet. Thanks very much.

China David Brian Asia president professor us China China Dr David professor Lucon director of Ch Samuel Huntington Ningbo China Germany Beijing Professor Lee Xi Jinping assistant professor of Chinese Europe cri
Top 5 Handshakes: Border//Extraction//The Proposition//The Apollo

The Film Vault

1:46:40 hr | 1 year ago

Top 5 Handshakes: Border//Extraction//The Proposition//The Apollo

"Welcome everyone to the film vault. That is Emmerson. I'm Brian Bishop. Your hosts for today. Ooh Goodwin today Anderson Top five shakes maybe never do again with each other will or celebrate the tough handshakes and I think we're still going to do them. Probably right at least with people that we We really know and like I mean we're still going to bang each other now you and I but I mean I humans are so I imagine that if we can bang. We're probably going to do the handshake and thing but not with absolute strangers. Difference the key difference there being you. You typically shake someone's hand upon meeting them you don't I mean I guess it does happen sometimes in certain transactional affairs but usually don't banks upon meetings drew. I would say the majority of the the handshakes that occur are upon meeting and then they quickly become hugs right. I want you to know someone like getting here do I have to do. I have to get in there for not to get in there. I'm hogger I hug. I'm sorry I apologize. No no apology. Our hand hugs. We'll be talking about today and Yeah it is you know is already becoming a little bit antiquated over the last ten fifteen years and I got a lot of heat for it on the oil after his Astra talking about how The fist-bump kind of Came up with in the last decade or two Tyler Insane. Tyler is pretty young though. He was born in eighty six so as far as his little young Minos the fist-bump spin around forever. But I remember a time where no one really fist-bump and then all of a sudden the fist bump was all the rage. The fist-bump was was still felt a little bit of felt like cultural appropriation. Like I don't feel like I started with Mendoza White did I think he's really popularize. It and then I got a Lotta Shit for this too but You know he's. He's a Germaphobe. He's popularized the kind of getting shit again but like on who wants to be not on the briefcase With is that is a very narrow. I mean okay. You know what I'll meet you halfway and say that I believe he brought the fist-bump to a very different than than we that were watching the NBA. And I think that's where we saw it a lot but that whatever nine important non-point I know I don't know why the only I would would honor that when I was getting so much shit about probably two three years ago and it was just a tweet store my way and then I would. I would bring it back. It'd be like yeah I got a bunch of for then and I'm going to get about shit for now. Why would bring that back? Okay let's get to the business as as an Oakland A.'s. Fan Late Nineteen Eighty S. I am thrilled to the the forearm bash and may may come back to the greeting. That'd be great. You get too close to close. I gotTa Tell You I. I get very very upset when people were invaded my personal space before all this and now all the inner rage Bryant the inner age All right let's get to it. Let's get right to it. A couple orders of business at the top that pertain directly to the show instagram thanks Jordan Wolf forgetting our INSTAGRAM OFF. The ground and running We did a little giveaway. We gave away a digital code for groupers. I guess last week and went over so big We're going to do it again this coming week. We're going to give away not one not two three and four but five digital links to that old movie called groupers that I made five of them. Yeah and all I ask is if you are one of those five lucky winners Please just give it a rating whether it be on Amazon or or IMDB or even rotten tomatoes audience score the more ratings the better for a little movies like this it just helps. Elevate them and Yeah so he also Jordan is doing polls. I believe every single Monday and he asked So for instance this week he act in pertaining to what we were talking about last week. Brian he asked the listeners if they prefer the nineteen ninety nine home rental versus the theater experience for new releases and sixteen percent said they prefer the nine hundred ninety nine home rental versus eighty four percent that Said no way. Give me the theater every time some standard responses to why people voted that way were from at Pizza. Shark nine. Sixteen. The theaters immersive. It has no distractions. It is a licensed to ignore the outside world for ninety minutes. That is true pizza. Shark Nine sixteen from at Wiley Jackson most rent unless mostly rent and less. It looks like a significant film. You know one that checks all the boxes and then from at H. M. Mill one eighty two. I don't feel like I'm getting enough of an experience. Spending that kind of money at home agreed and at wool. Oh five unless it's a big action movie. I prefer to watch a home movie because I watch a movie at home because of other people being rude talking in the theater. That's why you go on a Monday at ten o'clock if you can afford to do so as far as sleep goes right right. Yeah that's not to say I thankfully have not been to a Friday night or Saturday movie and I don't know how long but generally I find the audience to be pretty respectful to target. I find talkie audiences are like the old people and again. Maybe that's the theaters. And the screenings I go to but is lot of. Brian lives in like at posh Ash. Part of town west. La and there was a lot of old lotto money now. My neighbors are gardeners. I'm looking at their fucking looking at the window at their at their law. Nor we're working on that house. You don't have gardeners that live in your neighborhood. They own I know your name very well. There's you don't have gardeners that live in your neighbor Anderson. I'm going to embarrass you because Looking at all well I'll I'll mitigated by saying they own the landscaping company. They are the go go on and they probably have a team of of landscapers at work for them. No they don't they do the work. We're getting nowhere. Nowhere really nowhere. Why are you? You don't have gardeners that living your neighbors. I know your neighbor I. It's it's just a lot of times especially out here in A. A lot of people don't know this they live outside of southern California. But like you'll drive through a neighborhood and it's like all shitty old houses but it's money these these houses go for seven hundred. Fifty thousand location location location. And you you have to do. Is You have to get a cutting and you have to notice the cars in the driveway. That's what gives away the What these houses are worth and I can tell you. Brian's Brian's neighborhood is all like landrovers. Bmw's Jaguars it absolutely is Mercedes. That's our house. I'm not going to tell you which neighbors are. Which but some did report to me that there is a scheduling outside my house smoke. He lives in one of those neighborhoods and they probably talk in theaters. I mean that's what we're getting so let's get to the fan nick. Owns this is what the listeners have been watching over the last Week since we talked Bryan and thank Mitch Burns for Keeping that alive and talking to to listeners in compiling interesting stuff for engagement over that on the fan on the online the on the FBI and the twitter machine mark sit home on facebook. He saw vfw. Sweet Sassy Malagasy. He writes The Stephen Lane joint was awesome. Classic B movie with Excessive Gore and action. Highly recommend to people who are into that kind of thing Knicks Been Roszke Spin Spin Areski. There is an Panofsky on facebook. He saw a good woman is hard to find all hail the new Queen Town. Sarah Bolger the best twenty twenty. I think so says Nick Or very close to the top. I was pursuing Voodoo Yeah I was perusing Voodoo for something new to watch and came across an interesting premise. With a good woman is hard to find all right and then he writes continues. Very Brisk Ninety. Six minutes feels like twenty a rollercoaster ride from beginning to end. I fucking loved it. He writes watch it tonight. I promise you won't be disappointed. I most certainly wasn't Sarah. Bolger is beautiful and effing bad ass in the film. Don't know why it is myself there after I just said the fuck were twice and then contributor to the program Louis Louis Locale spaceship Earth. He watched Spaceship Earth thanks. To Greg's of I don't know who that is and streaming on Hulu this. Oh it is. I didn't know that that is I. Wait it is I just wait. I just looked this up. It wasn't a streaming. That's what he writes he writes streaming on. Hulu and I got A. I got a rainy link for a few weeks ago and I've been meaning to get to it but I couldn't watch it on my TV. I would've had to watch it on my. You Know My my portable galaxy view thing which the wife doesn't really like to watch things and I'm not GonNa Watch this by myself. This is a a movie I could slip in and watch with the wife at which is always a gem in my house. I I love watching a movie that I find interesting that she also might find and I didn't WanNa Watch it on the Galaxy View. So this is great news. Thank you Lewis. This is this is new because I looked up spatial birth as a matter of I'm telling you five days ago or something like that. A lot of business anywhere now does available turned on bill for rent across many different four different formats and is a streaming on. Hulu I. I'm not going to confirm this. It's coming from the listener. But this is what I'm I'm telling you right now. I'm looking at it right now on. Just watch confirmed so just to let you know what spaceship complication is. It's a Dhaka this back to Louis. This documentary covers the biosphere two skandal and the interest in creation of the group behind the curtain certainly and interesting documentary and compelling. Especially if you aren't aware of the events that unfolded I recommend it to any- documentary fan. Hey that's me. Hey that's the wife. Hey that's us and then finally at David David on twitter. That is quite the name. David David David Brian. You should appreciate that because you come from the city right. That is true. I never call myself a the Bryant funny. I hadn't thought about this for ten years but you just jog my memory on on on on someone created a wikipedia page for me back in the radio show days. They says you know whatever you know. There's a category for nicknames and it says nicknames the Bitch and I'm like I've never been known his no one that's ever other those two words to watch reading. I telling you I did not was I was like there's someone knows something I don't know and I was like I made it up and it was extremely light at well. This is important. I got to go back to David on twitter at David Di David. That's pretty good. I mean if you're name's David which you know every other dude on the planet's name is David Wright. Why Not David David on twitter? I like I like this day. But you'll see why in a second wind a second. David rights finally saw groupers. I was nervous like carrying a friend's band and hoping they don't suck. I couldn't believe how good it was so funny kept getting better as it went along and added characters. Absurd tone reminded me of murder. Party can't wait for Anderson's Blue Ruin. I fucking love this flicks and it might be my favorite of all time and I totally get what you're saying. I can't believe it's still listening. I can't believe but there's there's still listeners that are afraid to dip the toe into the mind of me and when my movie and I think they're just they're they're ready to be embarrassed for me especially with that fucking rotten tomatoes score those goddamn critics that just. They really didn't get what I was putting down. They didn't have the luxury of hearing me talk about it for three years either. So and they don't know my sensibilities so that's on me as a filmmaker. I accept that I own that that they didn't understand what I was driving and they thought I was just telling Dick Jokes which is absolutely not the case. But for those of you not taken. Well he did. It wasn't one long Dick Joke. I thought about making that tagline one long Dick one long big Joe but for those of you who are not who were nervous for the reasons that David was and thought it was homework. Maybe or didn't WANNA be embarrassed or look at me differently. I have confidence and I'm calling and I. It takes a lot for me to be confident in anything I do in case. That hasn't come across in all my jabbering about this fucking movie i. I'm not ashamed of his movie at all and I stand by it and I think that it's not a perfect movie and even if it doesn't really hit all the right notes for you. I know that I made the movie that I set out to making the kind of movie that if I saw it in a vacuum. I'm pretty sure I'd be singing. Its praises here on on the show which feels weird to say. But it's true so if you WanNa see it streaming on a number of platforms you can rent it If if you're afraid of or you're a little strapped for cash as many of us are these days it's streaming With a few ads here and there on to be right now or you can rent on Voodoo or Amazon. So give it a shot and if you like maybe can you can buy it on one of those or even buy a DVD. Blu Ray from me. Which is I only have on ten or fifteen of those left so you can find all that stuff over Anderson Cowan Dot Com. Which is a very antiquated old website. Brian which I'm working on on on rehabilitating fixing my website looks very mid early two thousand ten's so I don't want to all preview. I'll just give a little foreshadowing to the The Amazon read most people. Listen to the zone. Read on the show. Bash avair gambling. How many people listen to the? Yeah I think a number of I will say there was there was there was a ton of movies. Click through people are starting to sink thirteenth into the quarantine. I guess by Red Movies and leading the way few copies of. That's great. I I guess that me continuing to my least favorite thing to do on this. Show Brian and I know you know me so you know it's true is plugging but I I've got this far. You plugged for right. Hate it but you know much like God hated killing his son. Jesus I hate plugging something that needed to be done. Very very apt analogy. I thought so. So you want to get into some movies. You and I saw enough about the listeners. Enough of that. Let's do it. Yeah Man let's talk about movies that we've seen let's confess the flex we've seen in the past week in a little segment we call flick fashions Anderson. You were in boy was obviously going to be a high not seen either so you you had not. You had not seen border at noon of of snow now. Border is a move came out a couple of years ago. I was aware of it because I read about every movie The comes out so I have an idea of what every movie. That's been distributed. At least I read the blurb a lot of time. I don't remember it but I remember this one for sure because the poster was so Unique and within the Andrew. Tall on the on the cover and also border is The name of Brian Border. He's one of my favorite people in the world. And that's I thought this was a bio pic of your friend. Brian border imagine mice. Not Anything about Brian border. No this is a Swedish film and not seen it. It's been on my list for awhile movies that I need to get to and I'm going to start assigning you movies because I like it when this happens movies. I have that I have flagged for myself that I'm meaning to catch up with and then I'm gonNA catch up with them at the same same week as you and we can flick fast them together and wow was. I just delighted as I watched this movie thinking of you trying to stomach this movie because this is not a Brian Movie. Holy Shih at I'd go down. Smooth does though we kind of I was compelled. One seemed to grow horrifying. But it wasn't like I was bored or looking at my watch or like going. Okay what are they getting at here? You know it was. I was rarely word. Border is a two thousand eighteen film directed by Ali. Abbasi himself not a Swedish. I started eve. Yeah he Eve Melon Melon. Very different plays Tina. She looked the yes more on that later boy had delivered. Someone dropped off. So maybe we're not pausing. We're we're exposed to this point the listeners get to hear what I deal with weak and weak This is what I deal with. We're not. We're not gonNa out on the good starring Eve Mellon Dare Tina and Eero Mironov as very okay. And that was a movie pass. Political was cutting you off with that and The first disturbing thing Casey. This is right up where it says movie pass. There are one of the the names behind the making of this movie which was kind of sad and five. I had actually forgotten about movie. Pass a little bit with everything. That's happened since its staff. It's like when when you know the the Gandolfini movie comes out after he dies or Phillips who often you posthumously like oh I miss. I miss that this year. So Ninety seven percent on rotten tomatoes this streaming on Hulu. This swept Sweden's awards. I assume that's Apron as it won best picture at a bunch of other awards submitted as Sweden's entry for best foreign language. Make not nominated but it was nominated strangely enough. This leads into best makeup. Well I can see that because I was looking for the chinks in the armor with that makeup All throughout and I. I really could not find it. I mean like these these creatures. Whatever they were. There's two of them looked so realistic. Should we gotta be careful with what we say about this movie? We really do because this movie really unfolds like it sets. Let's let's set the premise. The Rubio one of those movies went. I told us to the wife. Actually after it was over and I I really enjoyed telling her all about a movie and I said honey. I was watching this late last night and it was one of those movies. Where like I had ever do this Brian? Maybe not so much I. I'll watch movies on not unlike border where they're just very independent and they're very Swedish and they have a lot of really tough to look at imagery and I get concerned that the wife is GonNa come out like you know to get a drink of water at you know midnight and see that. I'm watching this and just be like judgmental and we like Typical Anderson watching this fucking foreign language. Indie you know high Falutin Shit almost like the same like like I would feel if I was watching porn. I'm worried every little noise like Oh God please don't be joining coming out so I quite a bit while I was watching so funny. You should mention that. So I'm washing border. Yes please tell me. She came out during the second. I'm watching juvenile thankfully washing it on my laptop with headphones earbud and criminal way to watch them on the L. shape couch next to me on the other side of the couch. Doing work on her computer. You know obviously not with phones in and yes Anderson. The love making in fact started the sounds and the sounds. They blood through a headphones so severely. I wrote it down. Chris Christie stopped. Or She's doing and posit and said quote. Is that an alien. Having sexual the Horse Response to her Anderson was your yes. There was maybe the most grotesque sex scene. I have ever seen and we're not being fair to this movie because the movie is not a comedy in the movie has a lot to say. And it's a very well my movie and it's one of those. I I love movies. That will live with me forever. There's there's nothing better even if I didn't really enjoy the movie. The the the experience of of Sin Throw it and then knowing that those images of those images of characters and some of those ideas are going to live on with me forever. This is the definition of what that what that is like. You spend just under two hours with this movie for a Lifetime of Memories of this movie both good and bad and it had a lot to say about sexuality at a lot to say about discrimination judging books by covers and where we all come from and and She so just give a little back. We'll give a little background little. Thumbnail here Tino she looks hideous because she looks like in the and all the movie opens on Tina who is a customs agent and like Swedish border. Yeah because it's an island or they're not allowed she's if she sits there and she She's she's got this incredible sense of smell so she can smell guilt and shame on people as well as booze in their bags. But you you need to describe the opening image of Tina now you go ahead because I don't even know what you're getting at no role we open on. What appears to be subhuman like she? She's she's got the big. She looks like Croghan right. She got the. I think one point someone refers to her as like a monk. None of Mongoloid mongoloid like chrome magnet or something. But like she has the big pronounced brow. Oversize knows Very Strong Chin and you know squinty eyes like she looks like AK nominal makeup. It really was like shaking if we saw her walking on the street and we like Holy Shit. They still exist. That's the missing link right there right. So yeah so and she stands there with other humans. She has a human job as far as she's concerned and as far as anyone's concern is I didn't know where it was going. I thought that it was going to suggest that Crow Magnum still exists within our gene pool. And we still have some of them amongst us and I thought that it was commentary. Maybe like on on people with Down Syndrome or I didn't know where it was going. Oh yes she does. She does allude The fact that she was either told or believes that she has an extra chromosome like she does have some sort of goes or some sort of twenty thirty minutes into the film. She goes to visit her. Dad Lives in nursing home. And he's you know he's an old human dude in expecting her to go. See Your Girl Magnum Dad. So there's constantly questions like how. How does this and I really did love where it went and we. We can't talk about it. We really can't because I want people to endure this movie with us. I want people to you know and a couple of listeners had suggested that I watch it Over the last eighteen months or so so I know some of our listeners have seen this but I think a lot would appreciate it and it's it's done. I love the tone and I love Tina's pesos. And I really did enjoy this movie. And then Four is the guy that she meets and That that guy should have been academy award. My God was he good. He was very good. So yeah there's other. The plot kicks off when she meets someone who looks very similar to her. Only much more confidence. She's very withdrawn like visits her. Dad Lives with a roommate. She's a lives a weird shameful life and then she meets Voor who is very much the opposite. Yes it's a love story. It's a coming of age story. It's a story of it is it really is when you think when. I kept thinking this is I can ultimate coming of age story. It really is everything that she goes through. Her Art is a Communist. It could have been teenage curl right with like Laura is her learning to accept yourself and We learned early on she lives. She has a house but and she's got like a lodger who she just. Let's live there and he can totally takes advantage. He's not a bad guy but just to leach any he does dog shows for a living so is houses dogs than hater. Cheetahs deals with it. Ed Hall the dogs hater but like wild animals. Love her. Like she's out in the forest and Oh we get to see a full on naked to with their Harry Buck in the scar. That's that's an image you want. Forget all we get to see. Wait to see a lot more than but there's a great scene where she's dating. I in in the forest outside of her own home because he's not comfortable in her own home. She has to go outside in the nature. And like there's a giant. Moose that just kind of comes up and stands right next door. It's a great scene and she's like pending moves. There's another great scene with Little Fox. That she's Bonding with a pane of glass. I really enjoy border If if it was at twenty twenty movie it would be one of my favorite movies. I've seen this year. It is one of my favorite movies. I've seen this year it just not from this year. I really really enjoy border. Oh it'll be on your top five non new movies and I don't know if it makes the cutoff. Because it's gotta be at least a couple years old I think but yes. Alley Elliott Bassey. I am not familiar with his work But this makes me very very interested in anything he does. He's an Iranian citizen. Who He's not even allowed in the United States with the current the current customs Immigration Laws that we have gone. I guess he was. I read that he was given a A pass to go to telluride to for the screening of this movie a couple years ago but he's not allowed country but he made another movie called Shelly which I'm not familiar with at all but Very I love the tone. And he's he. I think he nailed the tone. Apparently this has been. I think this is based on something that Swedish people more familiar with a folk tale or something. This is not a great date however I will say moments. Anders is. You're right Anderson. It's very independent but it's also not. It doesn't have that sort of shown no. I don't think we really see you. Tuck over here. We don't see much of that in independent AIDS independent in the sense that there was no studio notes on this movie. Obviously they did what they wanted. But it didn't look like a B. Movie I now with the digital age and with the The skill that so many filmmakers bring to a set because they've had in house training with all the movies they've had access to their entire lives. We don't really see those just really cheesy bad be. I'm sure they still exist. I don't I don't see them because they're pretty easy to avoid so it's not one of those. It's not like An independent cinema in the eighties and nineties looked much different than independent cinema today. Right sure sure. Yeah absolutely so a border I give it a Yes do check it out I. It's a solid four-star. Movie For me. Um Interesting. Yeah I like to do quite not quite as much as you definitely memorable will certain moments and we'll stick have stuck with me for a week or so and I'm sure I'll think about them forever so all right what else you got buddy. I only got one of the films. So if you got I got two more than go. get through here and I don't want to spend too much time on on okay. I'll do extraction real quick Extraction I kind of watched out of curiosity and I kept hearing people kept. Let me know. Let me ask you this. Bryant has nothing to do with extraction. I spent a lot of time in the time seems to be going up maybe because of quarantine maybe just because. I don't know but I do a lot of corresponding email with listeners in people I've never met and I like it and I get to know these people's through email but I'm wondering if with what I WANNA do and everything if I'm kind of I like the privacy of email I like the intimacy of email and I like people. Don't try and get smart and clever and cute by bashing because it's not public right and we have honest conversations however. I was thinking I don't know if I really liked the relationships that I that I make on email but I don't. I'm spending probably an hour at least an hour a day just going back and forth and in correspondence and answering emails in questions wondering if I should be doing that just on twitter just say fuck it and just doing it on twitter and at least it would be. I don't know might help like my fucking. I'm I mean I don't know it depends on what you want out of twitter like we're just there to look at people funny tweets and whatever then don't waste your time but like if you wanNA build like some sort of presence I guess then Yeah you interact with people and a frequent poster but the also doesn't seem very authentic for you. You know what I mean like. You don't seem to like or want to do that. I like to be able to quickly correspond back and forth and I got to tell you what I when I open an email and it's like five paragraphs long because usually I'm rushed and I'm always behind on something and I'm thinking twitter might be an easier way to. Maybe maybe I could talk to even more people. I don't know certainly yeah. You certainly more more efficient. Talk to more people quickly. People have shorter questions like. Hey what's your favorite documentary from six months or Gimme? GimMe a recommendation so you can certainly interact more quickly. I always say you should tweet mortgage. You're you're you're a clever guy. No I don't WanNa get into that. If I think of something clever I read it down on my phone for me to talk about on the show. I'm not I don't WANNA I don't WanNa give it away on twitter a very I'm very I'm real clever. I can't even think of what I am. I meant more and more replying. We're applying extraction. So I was hearing from back to the emails. I've I've been hearing from people ever since extraction came out A couple of weeks ago on Netflix. It's a new Netflix original movie starring Thor directed by another one another one whose movie directed by stunt man who only made shorts before so he. But he's a stuntman with tons and tons of stunt credit so he knows how to make action scenes right so extraction. Twenty twenty Sam Hargrave is the name of the Director Writers Joe Russo. Who's responsible for community? Tv Show community. He is he and his brother community. fantastic television program as well as Benjamin. It's something avengers. He made some avenger movies or something. I'll look it up Animated Film Pro Life. Mainly this is just a A one banana movie as you got your star. You don't really have to worry about all the characters because it's just all about Chris Hemsworth kicking ass and he's an ass kicker and he's in Bangladesh would know whereas says Bangladesh she is a Bengal. She's in okay. Does it say Bangladesh on the Wikipedia page? It says must rescue kidnapped. Sign not here. But I didn't WANNA speak editor. So yes he's in Bangladesh. It opens up with him taking bullets to the back out. In the streets of Bangladesh's like on roads and a lot of carnage and A lot of bullets flying and then. flashback That's a that's a flash forward and then we get into the the media one drug lord very powerful ruthless drug Lord kidnapped another drug lord kid for ransom and Then the third party gets Authority and he has to go pick this kid up and get this kid out of The bad situation that he's in and in doing so he has to do his best. Rambo impersonation this is not a movie that I would normally have even given a second too but a lot of our listeners have been watching it and or emailing me about this one. Take there's one or that's in there that Apparently was incredible. And let me tell you. It is fucking unbelievable. It's incredible it's getting crazy. What people can do with cameras now in stunts and action and The movies not doesn't really matter what the I don't care about the story. It's absurd he's going to get a kid in pull them out of this very dangerous situation where there's literally probably if. I did a body count on more than one hundred people have to die along his route to get this kid to safety and then of course. There's I know exactly where it's going. It's very predictable but the stunts. It's it's I guess there has to be a story but it's almost like you know. Remember that movie between two ferns or like a Borat. It's almost like Borat in the sense. That Borat Sasha Baron. Cohen was doing these really dangerous fun. Stunts essentially in public with candid cameras. And then he builds his ridiculous plot around it. You know what I saw trailer for an Eric. Andre Film looks like very similar to they're basically pulling pranks on people but like they're incorporating into the story of randy which I know doesn't really help anyone but that's yeah I gotta find out what that is. Yeah I know about that movie. Because apparently he's got a couple fellas that are Stuck in a Chinese finger in that movie. That's one of the sketches John. And they're they're they're they're connected and they're running down the street trying to separate themselves. Apparently I don't make that sounds fill your that. Sounds familiar all right. So it's the the the one her which is right up there with the children of man and true detective episode to season one episode. Four I mean it's it's one of the most this movie redemption but not not as memorable not as great as railroad. I'm Ray redemption is its own fucking thing. It's but it's doing very. It's it's very impressive. What they're doing with the camera. I just don't really give a fuck about the action because I know who's GonNa win. He's GONNA lose. It's it's better than that. It's above average for an action movie However it's all about the actual stunts and how they're pulling them off and all of the very hard movie to make very very hard movie to make and I don't really have any more Thors about as mercenary DACA. He's in Dhaka. Drug lower. Kids kidnaps a kid for ransom beating the fuck out. Oh yeah there's a scene where he beats the hell out of a bunch of kids and now is a whole lot of fun. That was enjoyable when kids. They're teenagers and they're they're trying to make a name for themselves by bagging him and he's just like annoy that going. Little ships trying to kill me really and he can't kill them so he's annoyed so all we can do is punch them a lot and and kind of hurt them and name them but he he's not you know he's a good guy you can't you can't kill the kids because there's cameras on them and it's a movie that so he can only like flick there right nats and that was a that was a very well unseen as well. The one that the one that comes in about twenty minutes in I'd never say just watch the water and be done with it. There's a lot of cheats within that one or two. Don't don't get me wrong but I should also mention nineteen eight thousand nine hundred seventeen that movie that people seem there are small craft about crashing your pool. I don't hear anything was outside my house. I thought I heard a little aircraft here. Nothing maybe your wind chimes stupid. I don't hear anything Lewis all right so there. You are extraction. That's I'm not. I'm not going to say a whole lot. More about extraction extraction. Hey one more piece of business. We've got to come happy birthday and a couple of days ago but thanks buddy thank you. Yeah but this is the close as episode behalf to it. So congratulations on on another year. Does you do anything remotely reluctant to. Hello I was in the House all day I fasted I so I didn't eat anything all that entire day and I took advocates to a park and we walked around for two hours looking at dead dead things. So that's how I spent. My birthday was fine. You like an anti. You had like an anti thing. It was good. It was fine. I Look I. It's my patience runs thin sometimes. When I got a ton of Shit that I would to be doing that I know. I need to be doing careerwise and You know what just what the show like a research for the show. Watch movies taking notes. Do my scripts. There's so many things that I need to be doing but all of a sudden I'm stay at Home Dad Guy fulltime again and preschool teacher. But I fucking I'M NOT GONNA COMPLAIN. Because I fucking love it. I love hanging out with the little dude and I know that it's only gonNA be. I know how fortunate I am. I think you probably realize it's too that we are dads. Get to spend this much quality time with kids this age because usually you know we're off at a job and we don't really see them much at all when they're in this age so I'm I'm not taking it for granted and I'm not bitching about it. They're yeah no you're right there's a there's a real glass half full all right but BUBBA. I came across documentary on. Hbo That I saw. And I was like instantly have to see this because I love when a documentary sheds light on something. I know a little bit about but I can really sink my teeth into and learn more about interesting. How much do you know about the Apollo the Apollo mission but the Apollo Theater the legendary Apollo? I'm very little same. I knew about like when you were growing up is shown that the YUP. That's that's all. I knew resume legendary. I guess I kind of figure it out. But New Yorkers so important we know the palladium we know the big big Venues out here but we're not and New York always does thing where like you know because it's in New York. It's the greatest in the fucking world and all that Shit so. I just I kind of asked like it's just another venue. But there's a bunch of New Yorkers go there and then they go tell everyone that is the greatest in the world so probably not fair. It was also yes it was it was it was also at a time when Newark really was the hub of of of America. If not the entire world overstating it certainly in terms of cultural. What's this up now? I'm saying you could make the argument New Yorker. La Like L. A. puts out like entertainment and TV and movies but like back in the twenties and thirties. Hollywood wasn't the Juggernaut that it is now more so then go ahead no absolutely not. I mean it was more it was more centered in Hollywood than than it is today. Now it's more spread out around the world pretty much. No you're you're you're you're missing my point though. Hollywood have the reason there was no television. Had been invented yet. There's no TV the movies they showed up in your theater. If you happen to have the during your town or theatre close by and then they went away forever so it didn't have the omnipresence like I say that it does tonight right right all right. Apollo talked to me anyway. There's a documentary on. Hbo called the Apollo. The Apollo was near the orange strike. Any Roger known as almost nothing to do with the Space Missions Roger Ross Williams. The name suffer million. Here's the Oscar. Winning director of life animated and documentary right about the kid who had the mental abilities was who drew like dissoloved up. Yeah we both love that movie. And this guy's got to movies came out this year. Actually already really. We'll see other on the phone. Come on okay. I'll I'll keep going on this on the ninety five percent around tomatoes this streaming on HBO. As I said this focuses on the legendary Apollo Theater in Harlem It is a theatre. Where many many many many greats have played notably a very friendly to block performers where they could not get booked at other venues? A larger venues more notable venues Radio City Music Hall such disasters such Madison Square Garden. They could get booked at the Apollo and it became a haven for the holidays of the world. Ever I mean not just musicians. They spent a lot of time talking about Richard. Pryor and Chris Rock I mean it goes to the generations eh MOMS Mabley. That goes way back to the right down what year but I got the impression of the late nineteen twenties. Do you have that information Anderson and Roger Ross Williams a half right the innocence files which I did enjoy quite a bit Dry for our audience. I think but it's a made for Netflix stock you miniseries about the innocence project and he was the showrunner on that need directed. Three of the six episodes so He he is. We liked what he does. We like his work. Yes indeed. I liked this documentary. I it's so the problem interest as a fundamental flaw right so the problem is that it can only be so good because as you can imagine in the Nineteen Thirties and forties and fifties and so on. There isn't a lot of actual footage from that era of the Apollo back. There's almost none and so you get a lot of a lot of stories which are really entertaining and really interesting. Apparently the owner had this remember. Remember the Joan rivers documentary or she had like the joke filing cabinet and she got broke down. Jokes kept every joke. There's just yeah he. The owner of the Apollo kept detailed notes on everyone who performed there so it could remember like. Oh this person drew crowd or this person had a great performance or this person Blah Blah Blah. So he had like notes on this kind of amazing to go back and look like handwritten notes on Billie holiday Louis Armstrong or something like that but again it can only be so you get great stores. I Paul McCartney when he came to the. Us came to New York the Beatles he wanted to go to the Apollo. He's like the first place I want to go. The Apollo and not a bad part of town don't go blah blah race so stories like that they also they also do a really. They stretched to tie it to the civil rights era like the Harlem riots and stuff. They don't do a great job of tying those two histories together they just sort of exist concurrently then of course. The seventies decline coincided with new. York's declined the taxi driver era rotting apple place balance disrepair. A cold yeah exactly. Though the closed for a number of years very sad and then in the eighties they had this rebirth. Someone Rich Guy bought it. We have fixed it back up all the all your smokey Robinson came and played on then and Diana. Ross point is. It's a heartwarming. Sort of Rebirth Union. It's a good documentary. I'm very glad I saw. I don't know that I can demand that people see it but it is good as on. Hbo Check out the Apollo. If you have some time in your schedule which we all do these days. You know. It's one of those types of documentaries. That's an informational documentary. Where like you probably could have learned about a as much reading a small book about it or a An a lengthy article about it. You know it's it's almost equivalent of listening to the book on tape with visual AIDS It's it's not really doesn't sound like it lends itself to cinema so much. It's just you know there's a lot of doctors out there like that. I I would say that almost half are almost got some Ken Burns. Dna you learn a shit ton and it's easy to learn. I'm visual guy so I appreciate those. But they're not really zeroing in on like an interesting Human subject it's just a historical document almost. Yeah it's it's a very well constructed. I don't know that it transcends the medium to become something inspiring or memorable or like other things. You said you the advantage of watching the documentary. Listen to some nice music. But it's not performed. It's not like its archives footage of the Apollo. It's just like Oh here's some stock footage of Billie holiday or Etta James or whoever. It is as good as it can be this documentary. I just made a quick judgment call. I was going to just wrap it up because we're forty five minutes in here or so and I was gonNA just say no. That's that's that's a pretty solid fluke. Fashion let's move on because I'm a little stacked up with movies I I've been getting ahead of myself banking some so that I could have more time to work All that being said there bribery. Fuck it I'm going to do it because I don't know how much time we're GONNA Yellow Brian. No I don't have time to spend on handshakes anyways so I'm going to I I Pre flicked fast to movies. Last week sanded. I'll get to them this week and I'm going to get to one of those two. I said that a proposition. Which is Jonathan Hill coat? Movie from Few years ago as well as Never surrender which is a documentary about galaxy the making of galaxy quest and what is galaxy. Quest I will do the galaxy quest movie next week in the meantime right now. I'm GONNA be the proposition which is a fantastic movie and it's streaming on Amazon prime. I believe I think streaming somewhere is either netflix prime. So I highly recommend this movie if you like. Good Quality Films Westerns. I mean it's got the DNA of a Western so Nikei wrote it. Nick CAVE THE MUSICIAN BRIAN. He also scored it. You don't see that very often. You don't see Musician write a script and then score his own script. John Hill coat directed it and The reason why I do not see this. When it came out is a looked a looked a little dry. I guess I think mainly because of Guy Pearce his involvement. I am not a Guy Pearce guy. I don't appreciate Guy Paris. I don't really find him then. Gauging of seen a lot of movies in but he's never selling point for me in fact I didn't realize it but I was already movies. He was in. And this is one of them's because John Ray Winston. I mean that should be enough to get me right there at the door so emily Emily Watson as well she's also in this. It runs in an hour and forty four minutes. And let me tell you a little bit about the propositions Proposition is it opens up with the disclaimer for offensive imagery that this is the language of the proposition. I'd says there's offensive imagery of deceased people in this. That aboriginals might find offensive. I don't think aboriginals is a Is a word that's used anymore. This movies fifteen years old. I do believe it's frowned. Believe Aboriginals is frowned upon you now. It's just indigenous people across the board. I think you're supposed to say so but it's you know fifteen years ago so it was. It was a different time Brian Emily Watson has already mentioned Ray Winston Noel Taylor who is always fantastic is in this. John Hurt doing crazy overacting but it works. Because he's John Hurt and Sure Danny Houston. Who is almost recognizable? At first I did not know that Danny Houston was the offspring of John Huston until semi recently really did not know that that was his son and it got me thinking we should do. Top Five. Worthy nepotism something like that nepotism. Meaning one episode that. But it's worthy that guy I'm GonNa Watch David Cronenberg's sons new film soon and hearing really good things. Nepotism sometimes worked sometimes nepotism like. I'm glad that it happened. Because they they deserve to be working because they're great. You know what I mean. But sometimes like rarely. Yeah so I think that nepotism in Hollywood. Where it's I don't know we'll figure out wording for it but I think that's not a bad topic to cover so opens with a bloody shootout. And you really. You know Johnny Hill Cod so You you you get the The realism right off the Bat. It's like they're tin shack. Essentially in this gang is being shot at and you can ev- every bullet that hits that Tin Shack and pure is the tin shack. Like you here at the High Tinny Ping sounds of bullets and One of the brothers. It's a it's a team of brothers three brothers and a couple of other outlaws with them and they're being they're being an they're being shot at one of the brothers. A younger brother is very very concerned. And then there's some a couple of them get taken and Ray winstone is in charge. It's the English versus the Irish. This is a group of Irish Hooligans Guy Perez and then Houston are the two main brothers and they're accused of a horrific crime involving rape and murder and are outlaws. Essentially this is like I think the turn of the century. It's Kinda hard to tell because it's The middle of Australia where there's just just oppressive heat everywhere and and and flies. There's some shots that he'll Khadka where there's actually people are at a hanging. I believe and they're shots behind a backs of the people that are watching the hanging where there's probably I don't know. Sixty seventy is just on their jackets. Just crawling around on the filthy. It's horrible it's awful. It's it's Christmas time. It's a Christmas movie. It literally Christmas movie. But you'd you'd never really know it other than a couple of scenes where there's like a dinner scene and It's all leading up to Christmas. Khazei the got one of the brothers the premises they got one of the brothers. The DIM witted young. One and Ray Winston does something. That's not really that believable. But I guess the main brother Danny Houston is in the in the hills and even the the blacks in the aboriginals indigenous people. They're afraid of him. They think he's turned into a wolf or something and he's just he can't be apprehended. He's real real slippery so Winston who is part of the English colonization of that part of Australia? He's in charge. He's almost like the constant he's he's like he's like the cop essentially the little town the sheriff and he keeps the one brother and tells. Guy Pearce Hey I'm going to hang your brother on Christmas Day unless you go out and get your other and bring them back and then I'll let this go right. So that's the premise. Which is a little loose. I wasn't really buying that right off the bat but So then the brothers paid it against his own brother and he has to go out and get them And like I said it's about the Irish English and the blacks and how they're all you know mistreated mainly the English just trickling down there abuse Through everybody and it's it's it's just it's a quality movie It's a western but not black and white hats. They're all grey dark gray they're all kinds of shady and their own and once again like much like border. This is movie that will always stick with me. It's one of those really well-done quality movies that I shouldn't have taken fifteen years to see Buddy ran has been you know I I said last week giving me a lot of shit for not having seen this gets as one of his all time favorite pleased. He's not happy. Know at the end of the day. This isn't like you know one of my favorite movies of all time but I'm glad I saw it and it feels like a Sam peckinpah movie. I've Sam Peckinpah was still making movies and in this new millennium can make a movie like this. It's got a lot of sense Sam Peckinpah in there so the proposition can this be viewed or accessed. I like I said. I think it's on Netflix. I believe Netflix. But I can't be maybe we can just look it up on Just I guess and let everybody know to give me a second here. I'll do that just watch. You can hear me type it in just watch one. A ton of won a bunch of awards at the Australian Oscars. Is that what this is? Yeah Yeah you have trillion Academy Awards. Yeah one best cinematography best original score production designing Kashem designs. The well-made film nominated for a bunch of awards including best film best director. It is Amazon prime stream it their prime so that wraps up the old flag visuals once Amazon. Read the handshakes coming up next. We will talk about the top five handshakes in film down again week after mentioning last week on Amazon. Read on the film bought here. I mentioned that someone stocking up on gentlest baby formula. Someone went back and Double Dan. Maybe the same person. Maybe maybe not six twenty four packs of infantile gentlest baby formula purchase. I personally that would give me so much. Fucking agenda like just worried about. Can I get my formula? We would have to go where Amazon's GONNA deliver it but we're lucky on the newborn right now because that would be I told you my story about target and the girl works at target talking about how women were coming in crying saying I did the because they were out of stock. And there's I have nothing to fear. There's no formula anywhere in this entire city. And she's like I'm sorry to tell you and I said at the target. Let's give it would give me heartburn? I can't what would you? What do you do them like? Two percent milk. What are you tough cough? I want you know what honestly I would do. Is I'd probably I'd probably mention it to Either grandma one or both Christie's in my mind start they're so in love with. Tessa scour the earth so they found so I feel like I put my grand. Grandma like their empathy would kick in and start lactating right there. That's not a you know what? That's a good alternative. But that's not where my head but other things purchased on Amazon banner on Anderson and Brian Dot Com include big purchase of the week Anderson Nikon Z six murrelets digital camera with FTC. Mount Adapter Bundle. That was a pricey I and we very much click through. That cost you nothing and helped us out to cost them a lot but not enough extra. And that's very nice. Pack of cost him. Nothing to the camera definitely cost Sonos Move Smart Speaker during Mont Organic Office Chair with Lumbar support. Tcl forty-three inch four K. L. T. you hd roku smart piece Sennheiser Momentum True Wireless Bluetooth Ear Buds Camp Chef. Big Gas Grill says souter. How harborview cred Enza ratio? Oh God I love the someone got this thing that I have the radio. Smart of maybe ratio. It's ratio smart eight zone sprinkler controller. I love my radio. Thing is fucking great. I use it all the time. It's such an improvement over normal. Like you know. Sprinkler Control Systems because those are archaic and they're hard to work and I hated my old one. I love this when it works. I like Horatio Sanz. I love it. I liked the ratio. Smart three rather toner cartridges. Jv are automatic chicken coop door opener pretty fancy six Amazon gift cards and the amount of one hundred fifty five on this Pacific off Ma industrial latter shelter. Those picked up thirty six rolls of grade. Blue Painter's Tape Brooklyn Lux core sheet set by twelve inch. Gel Memory Foam mattress to Barack and poofs leather luxury. Ottomans Apple Air positive charging case net gear. Nighthawk Cable Modem Porter Cable Twenty Volt Max. Impact wrench was picked up a. Shehadeh jeep wrangler sun shade and finally Anderson. Someone picked up a twelve pack. I don't know how stickier balls are a twelve pack of fresh balls ends up first. Lotion malic. Can you not hear the music at all? I'm a gear while it's still continuing. I mentioned the Puerta Cable. Twenty Twenty Volt Maxim back to take care their balls as well number. I think everybody for clicking through and here are the movies are collectors last time Too busy talking shit to you that I Miss Myanmar here. The movies blue blue now one but two people Rented groupers. Thank you very much and not one but two people. Boc Group is on the Amazon Prime. I just talked to my distributor actually about The first five weeks of business and Do we we both. I don't know what he's like. You know it's not really a more on that too coming. I talk all about it on. I've got a movie to make which I do. Weekly Cocaine cowboys was to the. Is The music. Man Hangover the hangover dog tooth Crimson. Tide extremely loud and incredibly close one for the money the postman kick ass replacement. It's pleasantville blade. Inception mortal combat Percy Jackson. The Olympians lightning thief. I'M GONNA have to restart this music. So many movies midnight man is Lord of the Rings. The Fellowship of the Rings dodgeball true. Underdog STORE THE FACULTY. Much Ado about nothing. Cujo all is lost to the ghost in the shell kingsman. The secret service enemy of the state drive just drive earlier today brings bear your name when the funk is your name what is your name can tell us. Your name must look. This up immediately was with his read. Free Solo Readier. Not Talk to the doctor. Sleep this knives out guns Akimbo. The Hunt I don't care. They're both great. Vs John Wick Rampage April Fools Day. Birds of Prey Fox's by very still got bad boys bad boys two bad boys for life. Thanks for the bad boys marathon and things clicking through I guess you can I guess you can pre-order that now you know what I like that bad boys from Michael Bay. That's that's that's top tier Michael Bay work right there. That really is. I liked that bad boys through with the products as well as the movies and now it's time to get back to the welcome back to the countdown. Some hand shakes Anderson. Do you do you remember the last. Probably don't because it's one of those things where you know. Think about it until it's gone. Do you remember the last handshake or received? No No. I don't really think about them. You like like you said. When's the last time you sneeze? I don't really remember because there are just so called. Think about it in the moment until it's delegates built three and a half months ago by your like every second day was handed a while. Honestly I'll be happy if they are kind of a thing of the past. It'd be kind of cool to tell our kids. That's something that we used to do right. I just saw the movie from old movie. That's something we used to do. Plus I didn't like guessing. I didn't like the guessing game of how firm it was supposed to be. You Know I. I always assumed that. Who's who ever hand. I was shaking and they were like sightsee me up. I like you know the the the grip and I I. I didn't like the guessing game of at all. I didn't like when I was touching hands. I don't like there was a real sweet spot to like. If some dude like ripped your hand real hard like overcompensating this guys like one of the Alpha male but like if if it was ending less than half half strength. You're like this kid 'cause Pussy Yeah. Will you're one of those guys then? I guess I'd always be assuming that they're trying to re to your one of those guys. That was reading into the The handshake I I was talking about my own self worrying that they were trying to read in about. My handshake meant to them. I wasn't even thinking about as I was just always glad when it was dry. I just didn't and nothing against people that have wet. Clammy hands not your fault. I always think of Who's IT NED? Beatty got fired in the toy for having clammy hands. Hey Ma drinking an IP called fantasy fantasy land fantasy land. I've tasted yet. But I like to thank Stephen. Schreiber for Senate in over. He's He's one of our continuing contributed contributors to program Stevens. A Great Guy Supporter tell me. And he said he sent it with a note. I just picked it up from a Po box last night. I was appreciate it when Listeners fuel us Me With Beer. And he said they won't once we're allowed to get back together. Brian. He'll send something that You can enjoy as well but it's the time being. I'm sucking down very fantasy land. Ip let me tell you how. It is very thoughtful. Is this your first sip? It's pretty good. It's pretty pretty good. Fruity MID west coast. I like ours get drunk. Do this speaking of which Brian we gotta do. We gotTA pick a date. We got to pick a date for a Red Dawn. Let's do it. Maybe a week from Saturday if you're cool with that no. I think that's Memorial Day weekend. Is this all better? I big out of town plans big out of town plan. You can't really can't do a memorial day weekend. I I don't think I have a Christie and I are debating all the get your input. This is something you would normally talk about off the air. But every year since I've known Christie and every year many years before me her family is gone out to the palm springs. Area specifically teamed up for Memorial Day. Weekend big tradition to theirs and I enjoy very much but this year is very very very tenuous at best Anderson would would would. Should I go? Should we go to Lakisha for the weekend? And where would you say? They have a property out there that they normally rent. But they don't rent it for Memorial Day weekend they stay in it and they've been pretty much staying at home and being good good good boys and girls not as much as you'd like honestly and they've actually been renter is in the property. Yeah but I think if they've been out vacated for two three days I mean at first I reports was crazy. It can live on card cardboard for up to twelve days. I mean that's that's when you got problems but since those initial false reports. I'm hearing like three days at the most. So if a property is stagnant for three or four days or if an airplane sitting on a tarmac without any people and it three or four days or you know. You're you're safe so I wouldn't worry about that and let somebody had just vacated but you'd imagine the cleaning crew would use more than normal. I Dunno Brian. It's stuff to say because of your pre existing shit. I mean me I honestly and I don't want to have this. You know haunt me but I just WANNA fuck and get it and just be done with it. I want my whole family. Just get it. You know what happened when I asked for thirty nine. Oh I know I know but I've been saying that for a long time I I'd I'd rather just I don't know I just I just don't imagine I shouldn't be saying any of this is how the universe works and I know better so I'm not gonna I'm GonNa stop or I'm going to stop. Plus you know what the Real Shady side of having it and having the antibodies and then not as far as we know not being able to get it even though there are reports coming out of China that people are getting infected for a second time which I mean if that is the case word just you know done like our were done as we know it but if if I did have antibodies and I knew that I couldn't get her. My family couldn't get it. I all these restrictions would just be that much more frustrating. Because you know I'd be I'd be like well not me I can do it. I can go. You know what I mean true and I don't want to have that so I would not go just if you do get it. I don't want you to just in. The event is my corona available to co host. He doesn't really know much moving. The move we all know. That's not true brand. I would have been a good zinger handshakes number on five. You WanNa start to start egghead. I like my minds mine. Memorandum little anti-climactic. Then you go revive this actually Top Five I'll give that to you in a second but number five for me. Is Jack Napier? The joker played by. Jack Nicholson Antoine Roy. Telly played bowed Edwin. Craig in Batman of Nineteen Ninety nine. The Tim Burton Batman so this Kerr's semi early in the movie. You know beginning of the Second Act. When Jack Napier has having just killed Goffin's biggest crime boss Jack Pallets Jack Attempts to consolidate power amongst the Crime Lords and win Antoine Retali- objects Jackson. No hard feelings. Here let's have a handshake and of course being the joker. He has sleep almost literally. It's a trick buzzer. But instead of buzzing him and actually electrocute them sets on fire in terms into a charred corpse letting everyone else know that he really means business. Do you remember the scene from Batman? I don't I I saw it but I do not remember seeing? It didn't come up in any of my research. Tough tough wheat to research to aid. I was just trying to just about say hard. Tough tough to recess was I mean. A couple came up because of their implication. What happens and you know? There is such a pivotal point in the movie because of the nature of the end shake but for the most part Three of my five picks I did not come up with just out of the Blue I had to be reminded of them via research video clips. No I don't remember yeah. Well the joker joker he's shaking his hand. Some gangster Fawn Retali- calls them Tony He's just some random crime lord and he's like a Antoine's like what if we don't want to go along with their plan and Jack Jack Napier jokers like no big deal. Let's put her there. Let's just shake on it. He ops up. And He fucking electrocute them in front of all the other crime lords showing the effect means business. It's kind of a violent scene for actually stuck out in my mind. So that's the other the other thing that I thought of thought of this Batman nineteen eighty nine was a seminal moment and young balding. Brian's life I was ten years old thought and think I don't know how to phrase this much like your previous work on the phrasing. Basically top five movie events of your lifetime like me like yours would be like. I'll leave fear loathing Las Vegas like you were fucking hiked amp for that event like you had to see it. It was a big deal. Let me down. Let me thinking about all right from childhood to now. Dr Number Five for me. Bribery Johnny Smith and Greg Still Sins handshake in the dead zone. Greg Olsen He was he was candidate. Stilton running for president Played by A Martin Sheen and Johnny Smith of course played by Christopher Walken in the dead zone. Nineteen eighty-three the zone and Pivotal Point in the movie. It is towards the end of the movie not GonNa spend a Lotta time discussing what happens but Johnny Smith played by For walking he's got this ability to Touch you and and see into your mind which has been trumped up quite a bit. We've seen quite a bit of that in other movies since but I don't remember ever seen it before. Nineteen ninety. Three's the dead zone or you know you can touch someone see like every day you get all that. Shit and He saw the the nature of the the true nature of this presidential candidates Yearnings and desires to drop large atomic bombs on people and it was it was quite the moment and it was quite the handshake. That kind of brought it all together. You ever see that dead zone. Funny I to have. I have to solar scenes one that turns out to be sort of touch guys. Hand predictive or you can see a future or whatever and the other thoughts. The other is one involving a politician. But we'll save those real little all right. That's my number five. What's your number four number four? I want to try to little lightly. But it's not a spoiler. It's actually one of my Anderson with longtime so we talked about Dynamo. It's fantastic dinner mall. In fact one of the Best Denmark. We should do five. Dan Moles talking about the ends of movie. Your but but the the definition of the very idea of dental or a CODA. If you will is is that this is after the action has happened. This is this is robbing everything up or putting some satisfying. Yes yes little button on. It has nothing to do with the action. No but still right. I mean shows where the characters end up after the climax. So it's still going to give a fuck on away we choose. Okay go however. This is a unique one because it goes back to. The beginning of the story tells how we all got here Beth. Half played by Gwyneth. Paltrow shakes the hand of Kim Jong. Wong who is simply credited as CHEF IN CONTAGION. Do you remember the very the very last shot of contain? I do and it's funny. 'cause contagion is on my also rans for handshakes for sure but not this handshake. Lawrence. We'll get to that in a second those those another good handshakes the one that sticks out in my mind and Anderson. I'll just go ahead. I don't think I really thought about this and other give too much away because the movie has already happened at this point and this is going back to the beginning where we see Beth. Half who is patient zero the first person to bring this virus over to the US. We we've seen her journey already. In the movie we go back and see where the virus started and actually started. Interestingly enough with a bat in China in this movie and the bat you know drops a piece of the bat is actually extra. That's home by default to foresters and it goes to the Bat flies to like a barn right where those pigs and the bats eating a banana and the ban of falls and the piggies. The banana pegues brought to slaughter and then the pig is sold market. And then next thing you know. The pig being dissected by a chef and someone comes up taps on the shoulder like hey so wants to say no. That's a chef wants to hire you. And he goes out wipes his hands on his smock and bloody smog and he shakes hands with Beth. Played like Paul Tro. And then it says day one startup. Yes I remember that very well because I saw the movie maybe six weeks ago or less and You know really wraps everything up. And there's at there the the other handshake in the movie. I don't know if you're going to talk more about it later. But I it's more impactful because it really makes you. And he in an Larry Fishburne learning and Laurence Fishburne gives the full. He explains where the handshake came from to show that you're not armed and how important it is our culture. I did not include that on my list. So let's go and talk about and You know it's it's quite a moment work. Everyone was afraid to touch each other. It'd be in the same room each other and then once they got the vaccine He gets to the point where he's able to do the handshake. And it gives you that that it's a nice pen in Eh not painting and it's a it's a nice capper and I I really did like that. Contagion is so similar to so many things that are going on right now. I don't want to say I was a fun watch but it was a very engaging watch when I did watch it. Just remember that jude law while you DECI Jude Law character in his life. Yeah snake oil. It's it's it's crazy. How Pro Prophetic. The movie was I. It's almost like a documentary about what's going on now just a much more intense version of what's going on now but I think I would imagine that movies making quite a bit of money out of the blue right right now. A big streaming on strategies. Peo- now actually know what you've just seen it. I don't remember this part. But we're there people in contagion who were like demanding that they be let out of corn. Dean was part of our come out. No I don't recall. I mean there were riots. There was unrest but it was mostly looting and then that kind of thing because of so there was a couple of things that didn't reflect perfectly. What's going on right now but I mean Sanjay. Gupta is in the movie plane himself. It's bizarre it's bizarre. But the difference is he wasn't on a news station he was on the CDC Station where we're actually getting the news from the source and from CDC and they were you know it was it was. He didn't have the the vision of the insanity that politics was going to be right now. He didn't have that foresight in making a very good movie. Though really I liked it so much. I loved it at the time. And obviously now it's it's almost like a playbook Number three for me. No number four for me is Four four for me is a good one and I'll be shocked if not on your list and I won't talk too much about it if it is but I'm talking to my topper and Kent in a movie called hot shots which I know you love Brian. I do love. I don't remember this handshake though. So there's no way this is one of the grabbing each other super hard and your hands start to steam or something yes there is steam and then there is Charlie Sheen's hand. Ill look at that. I didn't even realize it until right. Now my number five number four Martin Sheen and Charlie Sheen Holy Shit. Wow but nineteen ninety-one hotshots which was not one of my favorite movies and hotshots part the entirety. I remember all my stupid teenage friends were like. Let's go see it. It's so funny Zani Zani and funny wacky humor. It's like no dude. It's not it's not my style now mice. I'm too cool for which is understand but I did like that Martin. Sheen's hands completing decimated in crush. A Fun seem very very manly. Man Scene and Charlie Sheen's topper seeing the bad end of it so it's been number four number four the upper Washington right now. There are quivering steam. I should also say Brian watching the clip. I will have clips. All my clips will be linked to my picks that are in the list for the the patron lists that I put in the Patriot post Patriot feed week in week out. Which you get your own little feed so if you're a Patriot member you know this all too. Well you get the The classy version of Film ball delivered to your inbox every Wednesday night. Right after we recorded and it has links either to the movie. Imdb page Amazon. Page or in this case The clips of the actual antics number three is that clip ready. Anderson is the aforementioned politician alosha. Remember the scene. I think it's the first into the movie and I think it's a great character introduction. This Governor Jack Stanton. Who's running for president played by John Travolta in primary colors from nineteen ninety eight truck by Mike Nichols. This is a great character introduction. So here we're going to hear the voice of Howard Ferguson. Played by Paul Guilfoil. He's describing to Henry Burton Adrian. Lester who is the Star of the film? The Magic Candidate Jack. Stanton has with his hand shake and keep in mind. This is sort of proxy for Bill Clinton who had a very unique ability to connect to people. Despite as many many personality flaws here is Howard describing the Magic Jack. -hension you know. I've seen him do it a million times now but I can't tell you. How does the right handed far can tell you a whole lot about what he does with his left hand? He's a genius with it. You might put that left hand on your elbow or opinion seven. I still now very basic move. He's interested in you. He's honored to meet you. Ever gets any higher gets new shoulder like that. It's not as into it. Means if share with your secret alight secret not a real one but very flattering. If he doesn't know you that well wants to share something emotional with you locking with a two hander. Will you'll see when he shakes hands with the governor. Got It there. That says his trusted right. Hand man no pun intended explaining just that special something. The Governor Jackass is good ball bright. This also didn't come. I was one of the first ones I thought I was like. Oh yeah that hand. I've always I've always thought about that because I'm not a reach. Nothing reach the other hand in like touch the other person right like re touch the forearm. It depends on on. How will I know them? I at a lot of my camp friends very huggy and the Wada hugs happen and camping. I do the The hand on the back of the head thing with the hugs quite a bit i. I didn't know that I did that until it was pointed out to me. And somebody let me know thankfully that they. They really like that kind of embraced from me and they they look forward to it every year when they got it from me and I. That's what made me realize that I'd do it. Thankfully it was it was it was was smiled upon by the person that pointed out. It'd be a me too. I know I know but there's none of that up at least it didn't. It wasn't coming up when I was last at Camp as far as the me. Too and and physical touchy anyone. Not because yeah I mean it. It gets real touchy feely not in a sexy way a camp but you know. We're big night famished emotion. Yeah sure but I could see I could definitely see things being misinterpreted and maybe things are a little bit stranger a camp now. I've not been there since atticus three summers. Now I've missed Maybe I maybe there's more handshaking and maybe it's going to be a lot of four am forum bashing at the old camp and that'd be sweet would not be be swayed all right Number three for me Well this is a good one and it's a gross one and it's not one that I would ever want to do but it's one stuck out. This is one of the ones that I remembered Actually you know what three? There's three of my five. I was wrong. Three of my five and four ones that I came up with an research this one. I remembered when I was thankful that I found the clip from a nineteen ninety-three movie Brian by an award. Winning filmmaker called dazed and confused dazed and confused. Characters are dawn. I know no one does dawn and Waterson have a very special little handshake. Of course Waterson is the I keep getting older but they stay the same age matthew mcconaughey his character and one of his other. Sleazy friends They they shake hands. They kind of rub each other's hands as they pull away and then sniff each other's fingers and it's disgusting and gross and it is memorable from dazed and confused dawn and Waterson Sen's handshake or secret handshake. I guess smelly Stinky handshake number three. I don't want that I mean I would never do it But it really worked for the movie. It was very disturbing you have I do not. Do you have Mall Rats Mega Tour? Because that's another gross one that I wanted. Nothing to do with movie in general is just do not like a is those characters and I'll never forgive him very. Yeah Very George. Lukin of him to do He took characters that I love mainly his own character and silent Bob and then of course Jay who I loved and clerks and then he just made them goofy caricatures of themselves almost pg thirteen versions of themselves at times. I just fucking hate it so excited from all because my love for clerks and I was like this is where they went top five minutes movie events. This is what they've become this So disappointed right all right. Let's get out of here going up next. We will conclude our list of handshakes after this Madison University. Yes he's university ultimate. Dc member of you're into the DC universe. This is fantastic. And Wash DC series and films read. Nearly this has to be misprint. Twenty three thousand DC COMICS. And there's a community we're actually their fans that's the same twenty three thousand DC comic. I mean you can spend the rest of Corentin the rest of your life just reading these economics on this platform. Check out the new. Dc UNIVERSE WORLD TO WORK. Nope I'm reading. Dc COMICS NEW DC universe rewards program earn Tokens to receive exclusive DC SWAG and more original series content. You Can Watch Harley Quinn adult animated series two now streaming their newest series star girl. Premieres this Saturday. Brian that their Lineup is that there are there are lineup of other. Original series is action packed. You can binge doom patrol titans swamp thing and young justice outsiders get the latest news by watching DC daily or just by tuning into their podcast. Check this out guys join. Dc UNIVERSE. Today you get a free seven-day trial plus fifteen percent off your first three months if you visit. Dc UNIVERSE DOT COM SLASH. Hello POD and enter code film vault at checkout wasn't more time DC UNIVERSE DOT com slash. Hello Pod all spelled out enter code film vault shock. Valid for monthly subscription only expire. Six thirty of this year speaking of old favorites Anderson. Bet Online's back. This is very interesting. I enjoy the fact that we still can gamble on things. Despite everything else we can still have some nice fun. Wager and Brian. Tell me about it the one I love it because that online is getting creative with their wagering saying who's going to win this game or the over under its very created for example. The Mandal Orient odds are up Anderson. You can bet on the mantle Orien- the season to average on the rotten tomatoes tomato over under ninety two percent. That's pretty that's pretty potato season. One episode one of season two. Will it be over under ninety one percent of that Usually they start off with a getting creative. Take the over on that because usually these series start off with a bang right. They usually start with a bang and with a bang. And there's usually a couple Couple of DOOZY'S IN THE MIDDLE THERE. You know with any series like you know you. GotTa have a couple you know. Bob Laws in the middle but they always start with a bang and then with the bank. I love it. There's a really good point. Actually they're probably GONNA come out of the gate strong because they're going to be hyping it manned laureate back Blah Blah Blah. You want it. You want to catch those new viewers interesting. If you believe Anderson Hunt which sounds very promising chuck on over to bet online just where we do all our age go to and look looking any like big series like whether it's breaking bad or any of the big game of thrones and you'll see like the first episode of a new season is always off the charts and say it's usually like nine six nine seven and same with the with the season finale also. Nfl and no NFL. No Problem Ben. Online has live daily Madden. Nfl Simulations you can wager on which is insane. But now we live in the future. We live in the future. You can bet on live video games right so visit bet online dot A. G. and don't forget that Promo Code podcast one all the way spelled out podcast any for your sign up bonus about online. Your online sportsbook experts. Welcome back time for some more handshakes right into it. Engine my turn number two the so this is this is a spoiler however the mid a sequel to this movie that that everyone knows about so. I don't know how much of this is. Actually spoiling unbreakable at this point from two thousand and re underrated movie. I like unbreakable lot. This is David. Dunn played by Bruce Willis at the end of the movie saying thanks to his new friend to quote UNQUOTE ELISA. Price played by Savvy Jackson. Like thanks for helping me find. That family are discovering my powers or whatever and he goes to shake his hand. I don't I mean. Am I allowed to say what happens next? It's a great reveal. And it's a huge spoiler however the sequel to this movie that pretty much is all about. That spoiler isn't necessary. I mean those who've seen it no you're talking yeah I remember talking for sure those who have seen it no like me and those who have not why I mean. There's still we still got some younger listeners. Some newer listeners. That are still trying to catch up on some of the movies. That they have been told are good like unbreakable. No probably made the mistake of watching that movie when day. And they don't need you to ruin. Breakable no no no. No unbreakable is a good movie. However I was doing some looking back to my old list I am information. On a breakable. It turns out we did a topic. way back in two thousand fourteen movies. That need a sequel. It was number three on my list. Turns out I was wrong because the sequel is currently sitting at thirty seven percent. I never bothered seeing it so I don't know if it is in fact that bad I have to imagine. It's probably more. Did you ever see glass? No no first of all first of all it should call glass. Been called breakable. I mean they they fucked right off the bat right. Very breakable. All right Leave breakable fragile number. Two for me. This is This is one that I really really enjoy touches. warms the cockles Brian. It's movie I saw not that long ago because I watched it again with the boy and it's a movie called big hero six and I can tell you you don't need to see big hero one to bigger or three or four or even big hero five to really appreciate big hero six. Not since you joke about letter part sex in this manner have. I laughed so hard. I've never made the Leonard Part. Six joke have you ever do you? Have you seen that movie Lennon? Part Sixty I saw when I was a kid and I was just confused by it. Yeah I mean like. I don't think when you're a kid you don't know what's really good or bad I remember. He's on an who is good news. Yeah glass is streaming on. Hbo Watching last soon at all. Bill Cosby is what Leonard Part. Six I remember the opening titles was I didn't see much beyond that but I guess the first joke was a visual one where everything was credited to bill cosby was just every single name when caution designer bill cosby. I'm sure that the actual costume designer appreciated that Written by direct produced by all. I use it bill. Cosby's name over and over again in the opening title sequence that was the initial anyway. No talking about talking about Baymax and here news Anderson Leonard Part Six is not streaming for free anyway news and streaming. He's he's he's reenacting it in prison as we speak. Bay Baymax and hero in big hero. Six they have a great a great secret handshake that we come to the secret handshake. And they they do it time and time again throughout throughout the movie and Baymax is not perfect with eighty. Doesn't quite get it. It starts off with a with a almost like a a medium five not a high five or low five. I pat so it's close enough to a shake. And then they do the back side of their hand and then they do the fist. Bump and then Hero does the hero. Hi and Bay. Mexico's goes and he doesn't. He doesn't have the vocal capabilities and he just does the and it's every time I was going to put this Zombie. Thought you'd yell at me for not having an actual handshake well. I wasn't going to put it on and then I watched the clip a couple times. You guys can decide for yourselves. It starts off with hand to hand. It's like you can sixty ninety. They do it for a handshake There was not the actual grip. I guess but it is. It's it's the future right. It's IT'S A. It's a fake San Francisco Tokyo Hybrid. And that's what that's what a handshake is in the future. It's it's a hint. You have you. Have you shown this to the Boy Teza? Quite enjoys big hero began and she does. She does the fist-bump has yeah. I began this whole. My my numeral Dole's With a explanation of how I saw just recently with the boy so yes I have seen it to answer the question place. I go ahead. What's your number one buddy? What's your name always obvious. I see how how on Earth Can Dutch and Dylan not have the number one handshake Arnold Schwarzenegger Carl weathers in Predator psychotic as the first one the jumped to mind. This is of course The one where you know in your son of a bitch and he gives them a big old. You know the arm wrestle grip in it. And they're they're they're holding their you know Dylan Carl. Weathers is clearly having a little trouble with the fucking professional. Mr Olympia Bodybuilder. Arnold Schwarzenegger the CIA. Got You're pushing pencils so good. The eighties may have peaked with this handshake. There may have been the moment when it all happened. there's an entry Anderson on know your meme under epoch handshake. This has been memed. Many times Yeah I found a ten minute clip where it's just on Youtube. It's just ten minutes of that embrace over and over like for ten minutes. Listen to me you know what I forgot to talk about at the very top of the program is we recently kind of updated top. Five movie masks We did reach our own list a little bit differently. Branded movie mask characters masks characters. Were I I transitioned good. Good good I guess. I didn't realize that at the time but I I realized after we hung up after we finish that neither one of US had Michael. Mike Myers Jason Voorhees on our list. And it just gets one of those things where they're so obvious we didn't even and I got chided for it by One Giovanni he's an email saying you should have at least mentioned omits absurd that you do not and I I agree. It's that's that's fair but did you know what to be honest. I'll I'll I'll give a little confession here. I have never seen a full Halloween or Friday thirteenth movie. I've never seen anything beyond the first Jason Movie First Friday the thirteenth. I have seen a number of the Halloween movies. So I could've put Mike Myers on my list and it is a great mask and it's got a great story behind it that it's actually a captain. Kirk mass great and we should have been leased mentioned it. It was so obvious that we obviously overt. I just mentioned it. So that's something I meant to mention. And that's That's the case with me anyways. I'm not having Predator on my list. I mean anytime you type handshake movie or anything in the Internet. That's all you're GONNA get so. I'm glad that it's your number one. I believe it's the listeners number. One as well not my number one and number one yeah. I go. I got that that that the street cred Brian of being the the grumpy angry. One the one that laughs about the newborn porn from the From Serbian film. And you know Gabe four senior reversible down your throat eat. I get that but I'm not an evil person I you know that And this pick does seem evil because that's the handshake does end death However it it's the most moving handshake. It's got the most reaction out of me of any handshake in any movie ever and there was a lot of tenderness to it even though eight involved. A A straight razor and a A southbound dragged down Oh Yeah I don't WanNa say too much movies drive and There is a handshake in it. That it's startling. It's jarring and it's it's done because it had to be done by one character to the other character. As far as business goes he didn't really necessarily want to do it but it's business and he and he did it in kind way and if you were called the the words are that the line is it's over now it's done it's over no pain and it's as much as you can expect from a cold blooded. Yes yes and You know without giving anything away which I'm careful not to do here God I hope I remember to cut this. But it is the most startling and memorable handshake. I've ever seen in a movie and I remember bracing myself for it because I was like a is but I didn't think it was gonna be like that and it's like butter. It's like butter the sharpest scalp or straight razor in the history of Sriresearch. My God that cut through cloth tendons skin everything. It did the job but I'm not even saying the characters name so you got figure it out for yourself and most most people drive. Come on most people right. What percentage of audience this Indra Not bad? That might be at this week. You know the Amazon thing. I'm Kinda curious balance you know what's depressing super breath but like capone capone's out now you can watch capone and there's just really no fanfare not be spots. I almost missed it. It came out yesterday. We record this starring Tom Hardy plane. Al Capone may directed by the guy that made chronicle the directed chronicle. And there's this movie that I would have seen maybe Thursday night you know and it's available for rent right now like nineteen ninety nine bucks nine ninety nine and I am I do. I watch it for the program. I really don't have any interest in watching fucking Tom. Hardy play Al Capone in my Lynn. Right now it's well I if it's going to Sweden or sour the baht it's sitting at thirty percent rotten tomato so it's a movie. I'd like to see eventually and I would see it in theaters for the show if it wasn't theaters but I don't WanNa see this thing in my living room and that's like a prime example of movie that if it's not an event and it's not playing in a special black box that's large on a large screen with big sound. I'm not going to go out of my way or out of my pocket book to see it. You know what I mean. I think you're GONNA. She should wait till this. This is going to be streaming at some point on some service. I mean it looks a little bit like Like the John Travolta movie as much as I look. I was just thinking I was just thinking about that all right so I just wanted to slip that in there before we wrap up here Listener list that makes that makes a fist. The listener list Goes like this number. I'd like to thank Jordan for doing this for us Week in week out. Thank you very much Big Help to to the program Number five is bigger and shakes. Roy's prosthetic in kingpin surprises. Not on your making the less such a great scene Close to four percent of the overall volume Walking and Sheen shake in the dead zone fucked the s close to five percent. Alluvial Bernie Mac and car salesmen come in three oceans eleven. That is a great n shake Bernie Mac. In Ocean's eleven was on another list of mine not too long ago. So that's a great character. I number two is stink. Palm in mallrats negative negative close to eleven percent of. You found that to be one of your favorites if not favorite Handshake and number one is the old Dutch and Dylan and Predator with forty percent of the overall vote. Sixty one percent of the time. That's that's about as high as I've ever seen I think is ever seen for number one already forking also rans for you bribery. Let's see what did not mention the surprised the handshake and road trip to not a great movie but notable he gives the block fraternity members of very elaborate a handshake but burn. Oh Black Panther has like. Don't they have a special London like handshake thing they do? Of course yes I mean. I don't remember I didn't couldn't find a seat of Andy Circus doing is I didn't put on my list. Eight miles got a shit ton. Peanut Butter Falcons got Acute one and of course. Happy Gilmore. Those are my also rents ready to get the gambling from last week and gambling for this week was debt or gambling last week. Was the question. Had you ever heard of Operation Odessa? Before we covered it on the program. I said six percent. Brian's at eighteen percent the actual actually I put down a percentage but I didn't put down the number of votes. Hold ON HOLD ON CAMERA DRUM. Roll please. Have you ever seen you and I do this. Poll every week. We do a now to figure for the gambling portion of the show and I make it. I linked through Patriot because they've got a pretty nice little poll section there. You don't have to pay money to be a part of it You can go see. You can look at it and you can vote if you like. I think you just have to. Maybe put in a couple. Maybe your email or something but I'm opening for everybody instead of doing it on facebook or twitter though. I'm just doing it through our patron. Just because it's clean and it's nice and it's opposed there that I can refer back to Of the two hundred forty seven people said May and only eighteen people total said. That's very unseen is so it's six percent or thereabouts close to so I almost I almost dead nuts nailed it. But it's not. We're not doing the same rules as we did before. Where like if I if either one of US hits it. We get to do something extra. I just get to assign you a movie. I'm not going not going overboard. I'm going crazy. You're not going hand in a number of an I should say number but at least a few of the eighteen people who had heard of it They emailed me or they put it in the comments section that It was kind of a technicality because they heard it about it Earlier that week on a program called the after disaster where also talked about Operation Odessa. Every now and again a movie will will come up on that On that show before I I have to do this and so that it was a technicality. Right so really. It was even lower than sex present. Yeah it's it's fucking it's it's a crime it's a crime against movie goers and movie lovers that movies like that. Don't get a fair shake. It's IT'S AWFUL. So what are you gonNA signing? I'm going to be really kind to you and assign you a movie that I really did like because it's a movie that I really did like and It's called never surrender all about the galaxy quest and how that came together and all the it's by no means no means memory the origins of alien which is a phenomenal five-star documentary. As far as I'm concerned I absolutely loved that thing. It's not that but it has the same tone as galaxy quest as memory has the same tone as alien so they're apples and oranges very very different. This when you will enjoy and there's a lot of interesting little factoid and they pretty much have entire cast in they're talking about the making of it and It's just a celebration of movie. That really shouldn't have been nearly as good as it is. It opens up with a quote from David. Mamat saying something along the lines of. There's only one perfect movie that was ever made and it's called Galaxy quest which is into s a really good movie and you're right is so much better than it should have been. I remember of winning it for years. Being like I know it does is and it wasn't. It was quite delightful. I saw in theatres. I'm not sure why I mean I. I see a lot of movies that I shouldn't see in theaters but I saw that one in theaters and boy am. I Glad I did. I thought two or three times in theaters. By the time everything was said and done a fucking glorious movie. There is a lot of 'cause play in this movie. That's Kinda causes some cringing at times. But you know maybe not you did me. It's on Amazon prime. You can wash it along with us for next week. So what are we doing Who How many people saw drives that were doing? Whatever Bro Yeah. Let's to how many people drive. Read the credits. Let's go and too much less. Do you really want to do how to drive out? You don't care about the Amazon. Do you listen Amazon? All right if you sounds a little self serving. But I'm asking you. I don't I don't have a strong actually kind of depressing. If there's like forty percents maybe should drive. I don't like it seems. Kind of Bush League. Dos No our commercial. It's an inch a very interesting read and said something came up with which I really like. I think drew actually tried to steal it for somebody was doing. Dr Drew's like I love to do that. But it it's really interesting and unique that you actually read products that that our listeners click through but let's not let's listen would you listen? Mo-? Let's not do this all gross. I wonder are there. Must be other podcast that do that. I mean there's there's only I last I checked. I think one point seven million podcasts different feeds I would imagine one of them okay. So was unlikely to very saying yes all right. Let's go all right percents. Assume okay all right. I got number one two three seven hundred fifty five seventy eight. Yeah a little lower. I mean you talk about it a lot so I could see. Our audience loves them. Yeah I I'd be surprised. If it's anything. Lower than seventy seventy might be a little high but I think fifty five very low. I read the out of you. Oh let's Who is who. Is this like so much Josh Butler? That who it is fine work. Look at that brain salting. Thank you Josh. It is actually really good. It's not flattering to me but actually maybe it is in a weird way Brian. Can we do a poll? Is the slaughtering to Brian and Brian? Dot Com is where he go to see Josh's artwork. Thanks Josh. We appreciate it man. Send US your work by the way everyone we. I'm constantly consistently amazed at the quality of the artwork. So thank you. Keep it up future artists this week. Fm Pilots and see you home wolf on. We got a whole bunch of stuff coming up. Top Five movie masks updated as well Anderson As Anderson pointed out twenty six news slash old episodes from two thousand seven. Eight and nine. That is the pre orange couch era. Free TO HD. I don't think we should be promoting those that much. Only because I didn't prepare for those episodes. Had probably come off as very even less knowledgeable that I am not even sure quite right now with research background you just use pretty much gone through film school Since then it's been a number of years but you have essentially gone through at least viewing film school. You know what I mean fair enough. Also the long lost two thousand eight summer preview which some very much like y'all and listen to thank you for clicking through the Amazon Banner. Very much appreciated Whether you're buying super expensive camera or baby formula or anything in between we appreciate it helps a little bit. Anderson and Brian Dot Com. That can be found. The film vaults on facebook and twitter innocent please stop. Please start putting the Instagram on here Anderson and Brian. Yes yes Anderson and Brian. Absolutely yes thanks to go Jordan Wolf. Mitch Burns might call for all your help. We couldn't do the show without you got well because that it would be miserable. Slog we would want to thank you for making this a much more pleasurable experience until next time for Van Gogh oldest by.

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Episode 62: Kate Elliott

The Worldshapers

1:12:59 hr | 9 months ago

Episode 62: Kate Elliott

"Welcome to the world shapers, conversations with science fiction and fantasy authors about the versus. I'm your host, Ted Williams, and this episode's guest. Elliot's. To another episode of the world shapers. The podcast right talk to other science fiction and fantasy authors about the creative process. I am myself an author of science fiction and fantasy my name. Edward. will let your genial are genealogies toast. and. I normally start off by telling you about my latest books, but I would tell you about something else this week because it's very exciting Earlier this year I successfully kick started an anthology called shapers of world which features stories by some of the authors who were guests on this podcast during its first year that anthology is just about ready to come out, and you can now pre-order it from any of the major e book retailers. Amazon Com dot. CA. Kobo. Barnes and noble Apple Books Google play wherever you like to get it. You can also it from the publisher website shadow pop press that's a shadow cress dot com or from my. Online shop the fantastic worlds of Edward Willett, which is Edward Willett shop dot com to tease on Willett W. I l. l. e. t. t. where you can also, of course, order autograph copies of most of my other books as well. Download some other books. That, I have rights to that are on there as well. shapers of worlds I'm very excited about this. Let me just. Tell you who's in it has new stories from Sean, Maguire Tanya huff David Weber. Elliott modest junior DJ Butler. Christopher Rubio. John C right shoved Edina and me plus reprints from John Sculley. Joe Haldeman David Brian. Julie Eastern Ada Fog Delhi. Gareth l Powell Derek Kukushkin doctor Charles e Gannon Thoraya Dire. So among those, you have several bestsellers and winners and nominees for the Hugo. Nebula World Fantasy Aurora's Sunbird Story Alice Dittmar. British. Science Fiction Association and Dragon Awards This is the little description on the back a teenage girl finds something strange in the middle of the Canadian. Prairie senior biologists tries to debris giant alien enslaved by humans on its own home world. The music of the sears becomes literal an earth ship far from Home League of superheroes interviews for new members. Stranger Shera drink on a world where giant star ships fall two boys when aware wolf one image get more than they bargained for when they volunteer to fight an evil empire, a man with them Nesia except some most unusual offer, a young woman fights. Allies as she tries to win a flying machine race in steam punk London ranging from boisterous bleak from humorous to harrowing from action filled to quiet and meditative taking place in alternate pass the present day the far far future and times that never were set on earth in the far reaches of space and fantasy worlds, and in metaphysical realms. Each of these stories is as unique as its creator and yet they. All showcase, the innate irrepressible need of human beings to create to imagine to tell stories to shape worlds. So that's shapers of worlds the and policy from shadow pop press. You can get the you can preorder the e book now on all of those major retailers that I mentioned and it will come out on September twenty second, the kickstarter version of the book is going out to backers before that and the. A commercial print release is currently set for November fourteenth I'm working with a distributor to hopefully get that out into bookstores than Than I might otherwise, if I were doing my usual print on demand approach but this time it's going out through proper distributor because of the the authors that are involved in it and I hope that there will be a volume two. If this is successful, I would hope to maybe kick-start volume two again in the new year and that would feature guest from these second year of the podcast. I'll just briefly mentioned that I do have two books out myself coming up. the Moon World, which is book three in my World Shaper series from Dr. Books is coming out September fifteenth and Trade Paperback and e Book a Master of the world, which was the previous book book to adjust a came out in mass market paperback earlier in August and of course, is also available in any book and trade paperback and the other new release I have is from the street. To the stars and Interstellar Rockstar Book One this is a young adult science fiction novel that was originally published by Roussin here in Canada back in one, thousand, nine, hundred, nine, they're long gone. So the rights have come back to me and I'm just putting out a brand new edition through shadow PA, press available and imprinted e book, and you can find it again on any of your favorite retailers. It had some some nice reviews. My favorite was a young. Author. WHO said it was like Star Wars in rock and roll and drugs all mixed together into unexciting story. So that pretty much sums it up. All right. That's enough of the introductory material except to mention that the world shapers podcast is part of the statute podcast network. Now, let's get onto this episode's guest. Kate Elliott. Kate Elliott has been writing stories and she was nine years old, which has led her to believe that writing like reading keeps your life as a child in rural Oregon she made up stories because she long to escape to a world of lurid adventure fiction her most recent novel which will be talking about is. Unconquerable Sun. Gender. Swapped Alexander the Great in space she is also known for her crown of stars epic fantasy series the deep breath Afro Celtic Post. Roman. History fantasy with lawyer dinosaurs, cold magic and sequels the science fiction novels of the Jaren and why fantasy qualifies and the epic fantasy crossroads trilogy with giant. Justice Eagles. Her particular focus is immersive World Building and censoring women epic stories of adventure and transformative cultural change. She lives in Hawaii where she paddles outrigger canoes and spoils her schnauzer. Kate. Welcome to the world shapers. Thank you so much. I WanNa say that at the moment the usual. Club outrigger canoe practice has been canceled or suspended I'll say. Due to the pandemic. That's the one thing that. I'm not paddling my usual six-man, succeed canoe. Three to four times a week well here in the middle of the continent we don't have a lot of that anyway. So I hadn't really noticed that that was one of the things that have been canceled. Well, a week we have met at because we both been published by and we met at one of the. He'd lovely. Dinners for your books is Sheila your editor, she the governor and she she's mine as well. So we share that. Antastic editor yes, he certainly is. So I'm GonNa Start as I always do by taking you This has become a cliche on the program back into the mists of time and I'm going to put river on it. One of these days I'm going to do that back into the time to find out Well, I know from your bio that you've been writing since you were very young. So. How did you get interested in in writing and reading and writing and all that kind of stuff out what what led you down the garden path to being a writer. You know this is the big question isn't it and I think there's an even deeper question before that goes even below that, which is like why do human beings created all? What is the let's say, the evolutionary advantage of the way our minds work, which is sometimes in amazing ways and sometimes in really debilitating ways I think they're all kind of linked I. Why I? Guess I would say. Is that I i. believe that human beings in that part of what makes us who we are is pattern making and creativity, and there would be survival mechanism and that in like seeing that we could eat this food right or seeing that if these seeds dropped here in the next season when I came back, there was stuff here I could eat. So that then develops to language and to all the other ways that we think about not just art but about science at about. Religion all the ways that we understand the world so. Really the question I would ask is why do some people not feel their creative? which to me is. A tragedy and something I think that is imposed on people from the outside not part of who people are really at a kind of at route. But then the other question is, why did I decide to write? Why did I want to tell stories? As opposed to designing clothes or playing music or you know woodworking and building furniture. And I don't know. I could I could say maybe why I didn't do some of the other things. So, it's easier to define that negatively in a way. But I just know from a very early age I like to draw maps and I'd like to draw a large underground. domiciles where you know who are thousands of people were living in I was doing that at like age ten eleven. I don't know why it just intrigued me. I would take pieces of paper together and then draw these draw these just huge. Architectural things that had nothing to do with how anything would really be built, but I enjoyed it, and that went to maps and then. I guess partly because I grew up in rural Oregon and. I love being outdoors, but it was also kind of boring. So when I started reading. Science fiction and fantasy than of course, as a teenager I was like I wanna live science fiction and fantasy and. I couldn't figure out a portal I couldn't figure out where the portal was to that other world that I really wanted to be in. The Best I had was to write stories. Kitchen stories are always stumbling over these things and I was never able to find one either it seemed totally unfair. I know right my wardrobe. I wouldn't have a wardrobe but my closet didn't lead anywhere and you know there wasn't any hole in the backyard that led to the world of off or whatever. Now, very unfair tornadoes tornadoes hell. Terrible means of transportation. I haven't. Experienced Tornado yet. Who knows but I would like when like if I would go out hiking my family camped a lot when I was a kid we would go on camping trips and I would always look for those two trees growing close together that WHO's branches intertwined and I would say, maybe this is the one I'll step through the portal into that other world. So Yeah, what were some of the books that kind of woke you up to science fiction and fantasy when you started reading them The earliest chapter books I remember reading are. Ones, they were these additions of books that my father had read as a child that we still had. and they were by Thornton Burgess the mother West wind stories and. Most people my age aren't aware of them and I only knew them because they were in the house. And I think today he's probably mostly forgotten. But back in the day when my dad was young, these were stories written set in the. I can't even remember the wildwoods anyway they were in the woods and everything was anthropomorphized. Mother West was. she had thought since she had the merry little breezes and then all the animals and they all had these little adventures. And I read those obsessively when I was very, very young. And I always feel like they were my gateway into this idea that there could be this fantastic other world of things that I wasn't aware of, and from there I would say I read a Scholastic Book Fair Books that had fantasy in them. Or science fiction I couldn't give you any particular titles. Now, the big one for me was reading. Lord. Of The rings thirteen nine kind of kicked me onto the path that I then never left also ray Bradbury's Martian chronicles. That was those were two in. What was then called junior high school now would be called middle school, and then you know in high school I began to read league win and. just yeah I. Think we're almost exactly the same agenda. Very, familiar set of books and pathway. It's almost the same age as it, which I was reading those things as well. but you started writing stories as well very early to do share those stories with other people or was it just kind of a solitary thing you did to entertain yourself? when I was in nine, th grade I think it was a best friend and I wrote kind of shared set of stories. We drew a map and the we wrote a shared set of stories and interestingly. That set of stories that were there were the. Two main characters. One was hers one was mine. and they were both men and that's like. because. When I was fourteen that's who was in those stories. So you're gonNA write a fantasy story it. Had to be about men. But by the next year, I had switched over and started writing. Stories about women and I wrote a lot in high school. And I'm not sure that anybody read it. I was asked that question because I wrote in high school three novels in high school and I did share them with my classmates in it. It was one of the things that actually told me maybe I could tell stories. So I was like to ask that question and I get different answers from from different authors. Some people said, we've never have shared anything at that level. You. Well, okay. Here's another question. Have you shared it? As anybody read that Juban. Not a chance. Not, a chance although I have recently, I am actually really intrigued that you. Shared the books with your friends which I think is fantastic. They read them all and they asked for more and wanted to read the next one yet. Well, they were two series but I had a teacher who had more than one teacher but I had one particular teacher who we were required to keep a writing books. You had to write a page of something every day and most kids were copying stuffer. Not, doing much with it but I started writing the Golden Sword when I was fourteen years old. and. It was only for one semester that we had that class and it's all dated in the in the book I was writing it in. So you get to December and the dates at the top stop, but the story just keeps going because I was way ahead. Going onto and I learned to type that great tin and as soon as I learned to type I was just dying to learn to type and as soon as I learned how to type would type these things up and I'm bound them up and the I handed them out to my classmates and people really seem to enjoy them. So it was kind of a thing for me to. That kind of helped point me in the direction of being a writer. That's I. think that's fantastic. I also remember learning to type in high school and how great it was because I could type so fast. I will in no, it's interesting. I didn't share as much. I wouldn't have shared I I think a lot of it was too personal to me. I did find some years ago I hunted down and found the journal I kept when I was sixteen which was not A. Normal Journal because it was me. Pretending to be a person going I had drawn this map. And it was like my special map might like the the map that the portal would take me to write, and then this journal was me going to different places on the map describing them and describing the journey, and then whatever else a sixteen year old would put in there and before I wrote. Court of five or maybe in the early stages of writing court fives, which of course is a young adult novel and I thought Oh you know what I'm GonNa go back and see if I can gain some inspiration and insight into my sixteen year old self I could not get through two pages of it not because it was badly written but be. 'cause I was sixteen when I wrote it and it wasn't bad I bet I'm not saying that in any way to criticize myself but I was just like Whoa. WHOA man that mindset was like so much for me it was so intense. And it was it was interesting. To, realize how intense being a teenager is. As, I say the past is a different country. It's true of your own past as well as. The world's past I. Think. Well, I could see me I mean it was me I recognize me. and. I recognize things that are very much still me in it. But Wow. Yeah, it was it was enlightening and then another thing that happened recently as my first full novel I wrote in High School. I was talking to my editor about it and she said, Oh, you should put that up on what pad. So I again, the down down deep deep and I found it and I've been looking at it and thinking I wonder if this would be worth cleaning up a little and putting on what pad just for the fun of it, and it's funny. You should say that because I've been looking at my magnum opus from high school which I wrote when I was sixteen, which is called slavers of Thuc. Wow, a big fantasy novel. It has a map because of course, says you know very well, maps are essential to true fantasy novel. With really terrible place names. And I typed it. So I was able to do an optical character recognition. Kind of ribbon was a lot of places. And I have been thinking the same thing. I might just throw it up somewhere and see who's see what comes of it. It's not. It's not horrible in some places. It's a pretty good story actually so we'll see I think we're probably. Better I didn't actually start reading mine I just found it and there was a lot of it single-spaced on legal sized paper, a lot of it both sides. So but yeah, I. I think we're better. And also inexperienced. As. As. Teenage Writers. Better, than we perhaps think we are. And not as good as we think we are so have had it goes hand in hand right I. Think those describes exactly. So. you. We're going to go to university in California I believe at I have to ask sorry it's Oregon. So what am I saying? Oregon Oh. Sorry. No no I I hate to be pedantic. It's hilarious because I live in Saskatchewan and nobody could pronounce sketch. Schedule Did you get people say Scotch one just like I'm saying Oregon and. Oregon Thurgau. House Oregon. Perfect. It's just Kinda like, yeah, and the other one is Newfoundland. New. Newfoundland have to emphasize the loud. So? Yeah. There's a lot of things like that. Okay Oregon. So you left Oregon and went to California what what did you study in college? Study writing or something completely different. Well, college was strange for me. I went to Mills College in Oakland California I only actually went there two years I my senior year in high school I took enough college. Class credit classes at the local community college that came in with a full year already. and. Then I went one year to mills I didn't love it. So the next shearer is did my what was by then my junior year abroad at University of Wales in Wales at Bangor Wales then I worked for a year at the BBC. In the Radio Division on a work, a student work visa, and then I came back and finish my degree at mill. So I had kind of an ECLECTIC. I did some history I answer apology and I ended up majoring English mostly because that was what I had enough credits to do. So and I did get Like a a minor or A. They didn't call it a minor, but a minor in creative writing. Which frankly was kind of a waste of time percents. That was my next question. Well they they were. So full of you know, why are you? These were literally the people saying to me why are you writing science fiction and fantasy? You should be writing real literature. Felt it wasn't. You know it's just not useful to take courses from people like that have asked that question of a lot of the writers I've interviewed in those who have taken formal writing classes. I would say there are more that say that than say that they really helpful to them which I always find. Interesting. Well I think it could have been helpful if people hadn't been so dismissive of science fiction and fantasy. Now House wanted to Mitch because I've seen on things I've read about you that you were active in society for creative anachronism. And I dabbled in that but they're not very active Ryan here now. And that's where you met your husband isn't it? Well, I'm no longer married but yeah. Yeah. But I what I loved about the CIA I wasn't that interested in two in the In the recreation aspects I'm an athlete. So I was really what they what they call the sea in those days. They called a stick jock I just went there to fight to put on armor and so that's I did that and actually that was pretty great. And it was useful as a fantasy writer not because we were actually you know all I did I did get a broken arm. But But it was useful because it gives gave me a sense of how it feels to have people around you how it feels to be lying. Wounded on a battlefield not that I was really wounded but but how you? House space worked that the physical function of space people nearby people far away what you could hear what the sun might feel you know. How skirmishes might act how they would run. So that was useful information for me to have especially when I wrote Crown of stars, which is set in, which is a seven volume epic fantasy series set in A. Well, it's really inspired by early medieval Germany. So smaller units, he didn't have big armies. And I really got a lot of use out of that in that series at that experience of fighting in the sea. So I'm glad I did it just the history anthropology you studied also come in useful in writing. I suspect they would. Well I I still read a lot of I mean history is my main. Reading. It's the thing I read most is history My Dad was a history teacher. And So I'm very much still reading history. Now apology I, consider myself still a student of it I guess I would say. And does that figures into your? Absolutely everything Oh. Absolutely. Well. That's a talk about how you broke in then attitude go from being. Writing. But then writing professionally, what was the head of that over crew? So I you know when I broke in back in the day things were very different. Social media didn't exist. At. The Internet was it's even in its early days If we could get together, I got online bulletin boards. Like genie. Back in the late eighties. And It was very much a query culture you would write to. Agents and hope someone would wanna represent you and then they would send. Your work to editors. Some publishers still had slush piles. But I. so I did what a lot of people did I fi- erode around until I finally got an agent who is willing to represent me, and then they eventually sold something of mine and Bennett just proceeded from there. I later switched agents. So it. Does that does that explain enough? I don't know that it's a particularly. Relevance story in terms of what people can know today just you just have to be persistent. Arab I didn't break in his early as you did, but I was going through that whole process as well. So he outs. Yeah. I didn't I also wanted to say that I didn't come up come in through the science fiction fantasy community I know a fair number of people who were. Fans I, which is another way I mean there's no like there is no one right way or better way to do it. So I know people who came in through Phantom and they were in fandom and then they got published. And that's another way to do it. I I never attended a science fiction fantasy convention until after I was published. So they weren't anything. I really knew about an until then we didn't have a lot of them around weighbridge scotch when I was growing up suffer. I what I was. That was when WorldCom's in Winnipeg was the first major convention I was at. Yeah. Yeah. So I didn't I wasn't aware of things like that and I was probably a little too reserved to ever have gone. Up just on my own anyway. Well. Let's talk about your making of books, which is what this podcast is about, and also you know you already mentioned that everybody does it differently and that's one thing I've certainly found out in talking to I. Think you'll be like my sixtieth author or something like that view everybody everybody does it differently but let's find out how you do. It will focus on unconquerable sun which is. The new one and I've I've delved into it. I haven't finished it, which is fine because I'm going to get you to give a synopsis of it. Without giving any spoilers. Well I just say what the? Hitches which is it is gender bent Alexander the Great in space it's pretty much a perfect elevator pitch I it is and I don't even I'm not even good at elevator pitches, but that is literally what it is. So the first book is what I would call young Alexander. Though it takes place in a set period of time it takes place. There's a there's an opening sequence of things and then a time skip, and then the rest of the book takes place in about two weeks. Our based on our understanding of a week not on there is right confessed. Yeah for a big space upper type story. Yeah. But yeah. So it's a but. I. Yeah I'm not good at describing Klotz. That's why I like. The. I think the pitch does a good job of presenting an intriguing. Setup. That's for sure. I have enjoyed what I, what I read of it in delving into it and how many well is it? It's obviously more than one book. How many books do you envision in this? Well I do want to say that the first book. is a complete story. It doesn't end on a cliffhanger. It's a complete story. Which I did on purpose. Be because I think if one is going to use I I've written. Let me just backtrack a moment to say that I have a course written trilogies that had cliffhangers at the end of every volume, and with this one I wanted to try to give people a chance to read a book. Feel really satisfied the end. That they had read a complete story things had been resolved but that there were other threads now that they would want to follow and that was my intention all along with book one, and that's why I call it young Alexander. Because it. It takes place at the what would have been the the court of massive on more or less. Yeah. So where we going with how many books do you envision if? Eventually I trilogy custody. Right so We have our elevator pitch here but. which sounds like the idea that came to you to start this process. But what was the genesis of this and the the kernel that this grew from? Is that typical of the way that that to you start growing stories where do I where do your ideas come from my notes a Cliche, but it's still a legitimate question. It it isn't because actually. It did kind of come from the what if I did gender Ben Alexander, the great in space, and normally my stories start with. A like an image or a moment as if almost as if seen. In a motion picture sent. So for example A. Crown of stars, which is seven volumes the the seat at the idea for that was me in my head seeing a young man who's walking between the village where he was born and grew up. As far as he knows. Walking over his it's on the on the ocean he's walking up and over a Ridge pathway that leads on the other side of the Ridge to a monastery where he's taking something for the monks that his aunt is sending him with. And as he's walking up over them, he sees this massive storm coming in way to fast off the sea and on the as it overtakes him on the Ridge. A woman. A middle aged woman wearing battered armor with a sword rides out of the storm toward him. That's the beginning of that book. That's the seed image of that book. Everything else grows out of that or Cold Magic Spirit Walker trilogy, the Press Book called Cold Magic. This is the Celtic poster on. Lawyer Dinosaur Book so with that one, it's similar in the sense that in my mind I saw these two young women sitting in a pain paint P. A. N. E. D. like window pane window seat looking out over a courtyard as a carriage arrives. And they know that something unpleasant. Or. Something that means something bad for them. They have a bad feeling about that carriage what's what or who is coming in or with that carriage so that again and that's the whole seat of that story and in both. Cases. What you see is you have a person with something about to meet them. There's conflict, right? And then, but also in my mind's eye, what I see also tells me something about the kind of general historical era is going to be in. So in the one hand armor she's wearing is chain mail it's not plate. So now we're going earlier and it's there's a medieval sense because there's a monastery. So, now, I know that I'm in a more early medieval period. In the other one, there's a carriage and the way they're dressed and I could see that it was kind of a late eighteenth early nineteenth century setting. But with gender Ben Alexander the Great. Space That's the very concept driven idea and I'm not in that sense concept driven I'm more like. Emotional moment. Meeting a landscape meeting, a conflict driven. That's where most of my stories come out of. So for me with that concept than there is in a way more to it than that but I won't. You know I had just written court. Well, first of all, I have a son named Alexander. You know so I've been interested in the story and he is named after Alexander the Great and so I've been interested in the story of Alexander, the great you know for a long time just in general. But. Then when I wrote the young adult fantasy trilogy of fives that I do a lot of inspiration from the Hellenistic Era Egypt in which people from. Macedonians came. And establish themselves as the rulers of Egypt over this large indigenous population and I, and the last. The last Ptolemaic last of those rulers was Cleopatra who we the while she was actually the seventh Cleopatra of that lineage but she's the Cleopatra we all know, right so. Writing that and I did so much reading about the Hellenistic era which. Which is that period it? It's the period basically from. Zander and to Cleopatra, nets called the Hellenistic period when the Hellenic the Greek culture was spread throughout the Mediterranean and it was kind of A. It was kind of the multinational American pop Hollywood culture of its day. That's terrible. Terrible simplification but there's a similar sense. So and I think that kind of. rolled. Toward Gender Ben Alexander the Great in space if you see what I bean. But conceptually, what I had to do was to say, okay, I'm going to do it like this I i WanNa do this concept. But now what do I want it to mean? What are we going to do with that concept and that's for be a different direction to build a universe from than what I'm used to because in the other cases, it's more like, Oh, I, see I'm in this place already now I need to discover it by writing it in deciding what aspects I wanna see where does this road goto right but in this case, I, could have done anything. Because I didn't have that visual seed image already in it. So what was your approach to planning it out and how does that match up to usual approach to do a lot of outlining or how does that work for you? Well, I'm not really a I'm not I outlined and I don't outline. So I gotTa do Bo. But But I can actually so what I had to do. was to ask myself specific questions and there's two main questions I had to ask. The first one is to if I'M GONNA. Make the Alexander Character, a woman. The first question I have to ask myself is, how does this princess? Real, well, actually let me step back to a third question. So the first thing I have to do is I have to say, okay Alexander. The great as a story only works if I have a kind of a monarchy. And I have a lot of war. So. Either you're to want to write that story or not right And you know I get tired of writing about monarchy's I've written stories that weren't about monarchy's 'cause I was like I'm done with writing about monarchy. So that was partly an issue for me it was like do I really want to go back to you know do I really WanNa do this again but I really wanted to do it. I really loved the concept. So that was my first thing was to accept that it's not that story if you don't have those things so You see what I'm saying is like it's like I wanna read Sherlock Holmes Story, but he doesn't figure he doesn't solve any of the. He doesn't solve any the mysteries. Of Home Story exactly or if he's super well-adjusted about everything well, then it's not really extra comb story. You know and he doesn't have his sidekick. Watson will mean part of that that that story is based also on their relationship. So when you're taking something, a concept has a relationship to things that reader snow but that you know. There's a for me and I'm not saying everybody has to do this for me. There is I have to decide what essential things are absolutely necessary to make it still that story or to be A. Sherlock Holmes retelling right what do I have to have for that? So what did I have to have for it to be an Alexander the great retailing? So that was that was stage one stage two was. What am I going to do with the Princess? Is She gonNa be the the because mastodon like the ancient Greece of its time was a patriarchal society where men ruled now women had more scope. In massillon especially, women had more scope in the Hellenistic era. It's it's quite interesting and for those who are interested in this issue, please read Elizabeth Carney C. A. R. N. E. Y. Highly Recommend her book women and Monarchy. Macedonia than easy reads, she really knows her stuff or. The the transcript when I do this yeah. Yeah. Do because because there's a lot more interesting stuff going on than. One is generally taught in school, and then you know the stereotype of what it was like but nevertheless, it was a patriarchal society so. So that's question too is, is she the scrappy princess who proves that she's worth ruling even though she has to fight against? Misogyny and sexism. Or? What are the most important things about the story of Alexander? Is. That, he was raised as air in a society where it was absolutely assumed. That he was worthy of being air. Right he ought he had to prove his competency to lead troops in battle because it is a Macedonia that time was very focused on war. The reason that Alexander's Father Philip. became king was because his older brother died with a like a three year old son and a three year old son can't lead an army. So, fill up became king, and this is actually common in this is true it like Anglo Saxon England. As well as Alfred the great who many of us have heard of became king because he was like the fifth of. Fifth or sixth of six brothers. and. The other ones all died one by one. Killed in wars with a vikings and any children they left were too young to lead armies, and so it passed down the brother line not fathered a son line and that's a that's an important difference in how rulership is seen. So and that's where the history comes in useful right This to know that that exists said, he doesn't have to go father to infant son. It can go father to brother or it can go adult to adult. But anyway one of the things about Alexander. Sorry I'm so Geeky of accused. But. One of the things about Alexandra is he was made for the moment. Everything about his life who he was his capabilities. made him for that moment he didn't make that moment. He was there the right person at the right time. And When I looked at the story I thought you know if the scrappy princess fights against sexism to prove her worth it's not that story anymore is it So that was the first thing. The first decision, the first world building thing that fell into place. It's absolutely. Commonplace. They don't care in this society gender doesn't matter in that sense. So and in fact, I. Swap a lot of I spent a lot of gender. So the Philip character is. So Alexander characters named Sun S. U.. N. Like the sun in the sky. And her mother Irenei. Which means piece by the way than ironic name? Is Phillip Analog. So. And that, but I reading in the book has three older brothers. And in fact, Philip had two older brothers and they had a sister, these three brothers so that that's Kinda borrowed from history as well And they were all. They'll rule before her but were children war and it came to her down that line. So. So deciding that that aspect of it was. Rulership wasn't based on gender. It wasn't that only women ruled are only men ruled it was. The most competent. person. Ruled, if they were part of the Royal House. So that made that decision for me. And then the third question I asked myself was. Am I. GonNa Create a setting a space opera setting. That is completely unattached to Earth. Star. Wars right. There's nothing in star. I mean except for the fact that it's written by US and. We see it. It's not there's no references to earth that I know of in the Star Wars Universe. So I could either do that or I could do that thing where there is connections to Earth. And for my own purposes mostly because. In large part because I thought it would be more fun because I really like Easter eggs in stories. I decided to go four a connection with Earth, and then I had to decide how I wanted that connection to be did I want it to be a close connection or a very, very distant connection and? My decision was to make. To set this in the far far future very far away. You know unfathomable distance away. that. People that. That humans had settled it. Via generation ships. And at the separation between this place where they have spread out now into a rich network of world's. Their relationship to earth is that the them earth is the mythic celestial empire and their understand, and because the archives that came on the ships, this is really a spoiler it's referenced. It's people reference it kind of in the. In the story, but it's never explained because they wouldn't think to explain it. So the all the archives that came with the ships were contaminated and broken down. So it's basically. When we look at ancient Sumeria or when we look they harrap and civilizations of. The Indus Valley of. Four or five, six, thousand years ago we have fragments and we try to build understanding fair passed by looking at these fragments and by filtering them through our understanding. And that was the core world building principal I chose to use, which is they have fragments of the past. But. They don't even know earth this they wouldn't even call earth. They call it the celestial empire. You know the word. So they have fragments of it and how they put that together into their own society. Is. The Way Is is the world is the foundation on which built the world? And I did it. I did it partly for Easter eggs partly so I could fuse familiar names. And not have to. Use made up names And then it just allows me to play a lot with both with expectations it allows me to. Make references that the reader will get but that the people in the world don't know is a reference to that thing. It just allows me it allowed me a lot of leeway. To to make commentary and also to have fun and I think space opera. Should be fun I agree. Did you then doing all this world building at what point does the actual plotting come in or do you do you work out a detailed plotted you right and then use revision to? Pull everything together. Well again, this story is a little different because. It comes with a plot and not that I used that plot exactly. But I drew heavily heavily from the actual history of Alexander, the great and I change things up and moved stuff around, and that's ongoing work on subsequent books. Right. But for example, and again isn't really a spoiler. A. The. Clock kind of works outward like the first scene I specifically had in mind that I knew I wanted to use is a famous incident. From the life of Alexander when he was would have been. I guess at this point twenty. His Father Philip Philip had like I don't know six seven wives not and in those days, the king would marry for alliances alliance purposes. And so you could. You would have more than one wife at once. It just did it wasn't. It just wasn't the same concept of what marriage was four. But his father having. Phillip was actually amazing character Who Accomplished an incredible amount which I won't go into here. But he. He kind of had a festival celebrating himself. He was not a small. He was not a man of small ego festival celebrating himself at which he also married Alexander's full sister. So Alexander had one full sister. Cleopatra. He married Cleopatra to their mother. So Alexander Cleopatra's mother was the famous Olympias. She had two children by Philip. Her brother was king of Epi rose, which was a neighbouring kingdom, and that's you know us alliances to link those things so. Philip had a festival celebrate himself and to marry his daughter Cleopatra to her uncle. because that's what you did in those days and. At the elway wrong never mind. Tuesday. Okay. Sorry. That's a different episode. Like fat let me step back a moment. I'm still with the banquet. No, it's because what I'm writing right now is is, has me in that head space? This is see this is the difficulty of writing history. Okay. When I was eighteen. Move back two years. I knew I was on the right road when I talked about the six, the six wives anyway Philip had married all these women for alliance purposes and now he's in his mid forties or late forties. He marries a young Macedonian Oh and all the wives he married were not Macedonian. and. They were Epi wrote like Olympia. They were there I think there was one from philosophy. I don't know anyway. So but they were alliance marriages right and. Now, he's now with all their and he decides to ever deadly. He actually fell in love with this young probably eighteen seventeen, eighteen year old young Macedonian woman. who was high born and whose uncle was one of Philip's companions one of his intimate friends who were his supporters and the people he trusted most. So this man was her guardian and he Philip decided to marry her. To to marry Cleopatra. which. Angered Alexander's mother because. You know there's always more rivals right especially if there's someone in court who can be pushing for this woman and Philip is still young at this point forty mid forty still he wasn't an old man he was still young reason to. Think he could live easily another twenty years as long as he didn't die in battle or whatever. Right. So at the banquet which Olympia did not attend. Because of the insult to her even though she was. The fourth of six wives. At the bank, what everyone got drunk and there were no women at the banquet I should add besides besides the fact Olympia wasn't at the palace. There were no women at these banquets. Everyone gets drunk and then uncle of the new bride stands up. So remember Alexander's mother is EPI wrote. So she's not Macedonian. She's EPI wrote from the neighboring kingdom. The uncle of the Barat the young brides stands up and toasts her and says Mallet last week and have a true Macedonian air. Right, while Alexander was. Quick. To take offense to this. He was drunk was eighteen. He jumps up and he he threw a cup. At. At this man right and hit him in the head, which of course, is a horrible horrible insult and guests terms since was hosting the party. So Philip with also drunk shops up. And he's like. I won't use bad words. Anyway he uses the equivalent of f you to his own son right grabs a spear and makes to throw the spirit, his own son who has already proven himself in battle at this point by the way as competent war-leader. But. He trips and falls and it's all goes and then Alexander says something like well look there's the man who says he's going to conquer Asia. He can't even stand up right you know because he's so drunk. So, then Alexander leafs court for a while while things cool off you know but of course, and then. The new wife gives birth to a girl baby. So Alexander comes back. Right. So we're all good like anyway that scene is so great on so many levels. That's the. That's the scene like that I built the book out from. But. What does your actual writing process look like care you a net I think you've said some of the to think you're fairly slow writer. Tube. Did, you write with parchment under under A. Tree somewhere or do you write your own office? How'd you like to work? Oh I right. In my own office I'm fortunate Ed and back. I know this happened on. This was like a thousand years ago I also would sometimes go to like the library or the coffee shop to work. For. A change of. Change of scene working coffee shop while not right now, but I work up some. Myself. So sometimes, I, just want the change. To. Kinda shake things up a bit. I have a book that I mostly wrote at the library because I found. If I was at home I would wasn't working on it but if I went to the library and this was back when the library. It was hard. It was so hard to get on the Internet at the library or maybe there were only two limited slots that goes before Wifi that it was really great or before this library had. Yeah. So I was like I had nothing to do but right there. But Yeah I work at home. Do you work sequentially, just start at the beginning and the end of the story or do you do it scenes and then stitch them together later? How does that work for you? I. Am I'm clincial writer. I know people who stitch which I find fascinating is not something I can do. Either so I always ask no, it's but I know people who do it who will like will right out of order. Catherine Care. For example, who wrote the debris series she writes scenes, Wellington ask her but. She just had a book out in February called sort of fire of a standalone Deborah novel in fact but. I. Guess I should definitely reach she would she would be should be a great gusts But Yeah, I tend to I outlined don't outline. So I'm kind of a major points out liner. I, need to know where my point is I know some of the major scenes along the way. And then but then I discover. It's Kinda like islands, the Hawaiian Islands, for example. So I can see the point I want to get to, but I've got to go underwater to get there an underwater is the stuff I don't quite know. But I'm also I've I've said before that I'm an athlete. One of the interesting things to me about writing is I. I've heard of people who can plot everything in their head. Before they start writing. But I have to like literally physically for me I swear the act of going from my head through my arms through my hands onto that motion. I think that's part of the process for me. Yeah I'm not. Much of an athlete. But I feel that myself as well. There's something about the actual process of typing that makes it happen. Yeah that there's a kinesthetic thing there and I feel like a dozen go through my hands I'm losing a step. And I have talked to well David Weber for example, because of an accident. Dictates most of his work and I have done that once for a nonfiction book and it wasn't too bad for nonfiction. But I, I'm not sure I don't know what would come out if I tried to to dictate a story so I may try it sometimes just to see what happens. Can Anderson dictates his first drafts I believe. It's to me it seems like it's such a completely different way of translating what's in your head into words than the typing process. So anyway yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Everybody does it different as we said, and that brings us around to the revision process. Once you have that draft and I know you've written extensively about this on your website so I should point people to that that you have a a three-part. The revision process in three parts on your website, which goes I think it's about eleven pages. When I printed it out but it brief what your revision process looked like. Well one of the things that happens to me is when when I say I read sequentially I do but I don't often I will write forward to a certain point and then I'll say a wait now I've moved myself off onto this other path I need to go back and fix some of the things that were pointing me to a different path because I somehow just can't I can't keep going till. The end if stuff is pointing the wrong direction so I revise, it's not that I try to I try to right straight through to get a complete draft because I can't really understand the book until I have a complete draft but at the same time all often there's a couple of pause points where all often stop and go back and revise forward and then go on but my revision process is. Has a lot to do a structure. I need my books to be structured like have the framework needs to be right. So the first thing I always do is look do these scenes lead to each other have set up the not the mystery, but I have set up like the character journey or the plot way that I'm presenting like I might be presenting ideas that. Court shadowing and setup so that you know at three quarters of the way through the book, the reader suddenly go. Oh my gosh. These people are GonNa meet aren't they right and so that's kind of my first thing is to see are these things set up the right way or the ending I want? Once I've done that and and sometimes revising. The structural aspects can be a major major task, my novel Black Wolves. I must have restructured it three times before I settled on a the structure that I wanted. Then then I'll go back. And I would call that a structural revision than I would go back and do large seen revisions where I have to ask myself does this seem even need to be here. What do I need this seem to do is it helping? It helping the larger story is it? Pointed the right way. Are they saying the things they need to say to get me and and does it lead into the next scene? Maybe maybe I need to flip two chapters because they make more sense. So that's that's kind of that level. So is kind of like the big level the you know the the broad camera level, the wide screen level, and then the kind of. Medium screen level and then. After I've done that revision then I'll go in and kind of fine tune the scenes pheno, can I cut out any of this dialogue? Can I? Collapse these two sentences into one. Can I cut out some details that I don't need what's the one detail I need for the scene to pop out you know and then the last Revision stage for me would be what I would call the the line where I would just go through and close read it to. Cut what I can and to make sure that the language is good in the sentences makes sense and. You know our most felicitous to read. I think you've said something that I read that you do use Beta beater have where do you? Where do you find those people? What do they do for you? Well. The Beta readers I use are just their religious other writers I know. So. I don't. I don't like go looking for them. I just billed as I have built community. I have people who will Beta read for me. That that make. I. And Another. Thing that happens is that you may go through a phase where like all how? I. Might Have One series that one person Beta read a lot of it. But then you know the next series they were doing stuff and couldn't read it, and so they haven't read anything of some other series. So sometimes, it's just I go through phases where one person might do a lot of Beta reading for me for a couple year period and then maybe none after that. Or you know so it comes and goes what people have time for this same I, Beta read for people as well and. You know. Like right now, there's a couple of people who I've done A. Fair bit of Reading for. In ten years maybe I won't have you know. I just don't know it's just kind of cyclical. What What do you find is benefit of having paid readers Oh, a benefit of. Just different is They're looking at it in a way I'm not and one of the important things about Beta readers. There's it's useful to have what I call Alpha readers and those are people just pat you on the back. Sometimes you just need someone to say, Hey, this is great. Hey can I have something more? Hey, I love this. Hey, keep writing if you may be are struggling or aren't sure. But. A Beta reader is supposed to be there to say, Hey, I didn't understand this. I. Just read a Science Fiction. Novel. Beta red and I said I don't understand how this spaceship is laid out and a lot of the story. The story has kind of a mystery thriller aspect than they would say well, I went down to the accident I'm like I have no idea where the is. So they ended up just dropping in early in their fists like three cents description and it's done in a way that the main character is talking about or thinking about it where it just lays out how the ship. Works how the ship is laid out physically in very clear terms because to the writer, he knew it in his head he could see it and he thought that his. Two words using had accused cylinder and Torres. Well, that should be enough right and I'm like I don't understand why am. That's actually something I often mentioned when I work with. New Writers. Yes. You understand everything that's going on. It's all very clear on your head, but you have to put enough on the page for the reader to be able to make that jump to get some sense. Yeah it's it's a common, but I still struggle with that all the time. I mean I is. Do we ever? Get this fully right and this is something we're getting up to the editors stage. Now where you send it in the editor takes a look at it. That's often something that I found that the editor will come back and say, you didn't explain enough of this or there's there's a connection here that's missing or something. Do you get that same kind of feedback? Well that's what a good editor does right? So there's there's for be a I'M GONNA say bad editor. I using that word bad bad editor wants you to write the story that they think it should be. A good editor says. What's the story you WanNa, tell here, and how can we make sure that you've told that in the clearest? Most engaging and most accessible way. Possible. Accessible. Based on what your goal is I mean if your goal is to write a very dense inaccessible thome, that's fine I mean seriously that's fine but you want it to be that. So a good editor will look at what you're doing and bell. They they'll be able to get what you're doing and they'll be able to dig into you. And say, is this what you want what are you trying to get here? How can you get us out mccrory? We mentioned that we both worked with the Sheila Gobert at Dodge Sheila's and what the things I'd like to point out about editors and she looks great example is they have seen so much. So many stories in so many ways of telling stories and they've seen all the mistakes and. Yeah and I. I always really appreciate the feedback I get from from Sheila for that reason. Well, and the other thing about an experience editors experienced editors patient for that reason because they love books, they wouldn't be doing this. They didn't love books. And they're patient with your flaws. So. Sometimes I. Some people will go over and over and over a book could they WanNa turn in something that could be? Immediately typeset and sometimes it's because they don't want other people other hands in it, which is fine. I mean we all get process how we do that others. It's I. Think it's because they're uncomfortable with people reading something flawed but I'm a youngest child I do not care I wanna I wanNA ultimately right. I will ultimately want published the best book I can, and so I'm happy for my editor to see it at a little earlier stage. Excuse me if that means that she can. Help me. With. Some of the places that I might not be seeing. And then that allows me to to get my fingers in there at an earlier stage when the when the narratives more elastic because I find for me that as I as I do each stage of revision. Down to by the time. I. Get to the line at if I'm at the line at that stage. Things are things are less elastic. Now, I can't make big changes without having to rip apart the whole book, but I can make larger changes earlier on. It's not solidified yet. So I, you know I would rather I like getting feedback at that earlier stage and then in the other stages as well. We're kind of fifty time here. So I do want to ask you kind of touched on part of what I usually ask at this point wipe people create and right and we you mentioned that right off the top. But to bring it down to you and your this is sort of the bio breathing and writing right Why do you right? Why do you do this? What? What do you get out of it and what do you hope that your readers get out of what you present to them? It. It's a particularly interesting question because. What I I still get out of it, what I got out when I was young, which is just the joy of telling stories and kind of the amazement of telling stories about people who don't exist. You know doing things that never happened and that why do we enjoy these things? It's kind of a kind of bizarre when you think about it, but it's also really cool. So I still have that. But but then as you spend decades doing it as I happen has you have right. That other things happen I mean partly for me, it's like I have no other skill at this point. You know it's like this is my marketable skill. This is what I know. How to do. I have habit I'm used to doing this. But. The other reason is I just Wanna I WANNA do I wanNA keep getting better. So, part is it for me is that I want to write I WANNA do better with my next book I want to do something that I couldn't do. Ten books ago but now I can do it. Now I know because for me, the process is just this the excitement of. Challenging Myself. So I can continually challenge myself at something that I like to think I have gained skill at that. I. Am no longer an apprentice a master at at doing and I just love that sense. Of Challenge. And of getting closer to you know. Having that product that not product story the end where I say yes yes this was it. This was what I wanted to write. This matches more closely than ever before that thing I had in my head. I sometimes use the metaphor of writing is when I have the idea the concept it's like this beautiful Christmas tree ornament in it's shining and it's perfect and then you smash it, you try to glue back together with words. That's that's great. And what are you working on the other part of that was what you hope you readers are get from your writing. Well. You know I, hope that they. Feel immersed in the world. And that it gives them that I hope it while they're reading it. They really feel that they are in that other place. You know living with these people through whatever they're going through. That's really my goal is a writer. So is that immersion? You're offering portal that you never found what you were a kid? That's right. That's right at what are you working on now I mean obviously the next book in this is Yeah Yeah. I am does it have a title? Yes. Book to his called Furious Heaven. Anything else. In the works. Yes. But nothing I can talk about at the moment. And where can people find you online? I am on twitter at Kate. F F that Sam. Frank. Frank I'll on twitter I did I say that twitter already and? I do have a website called I, make up world switch I haven't been posting on recently. So mostly it's twitter these for me I've backed off on other things just it's just too much. Often social media seems like too much. And I Yeah and I'll I'll be backing off online quite a bit as I for the rest of the year to focus on writing. All right. Well, thank you so much for being a guest on the wheelchair. I really enjoyed the Chattanooga Puteh too. I did it and I'm sorry I went. So History Geeky I just can't I just love history and I want to say one last thing about world shaping and about world building and that how much I recommend to people that they read widely. About human culture. And Human Experience I. think that is really the best foundation. Any of US can have as writers an excellent recommendation. Thanks so much uncle. Thanks again to Kate Elliott for that great conversation I hope you enjoyed that as much as I did and I hope that you will continue to come back to the world shapers continue to talk to more great authors in the future I've got so many lined up I can't even remember them all off the top of my head but I know I have James Morrow coming up cat, Rambo already talked to she'll be coming up very shortly Let's see Corey. Doctors. Up there in the future so yeah. Some really great authors said coming up and continue to do this weekly for the month of September. I think to support three of have I mentioned the release of my new book the Mood World, which is book three in the World Shaper series book. One was world shaper book to his Master of the world. It just came out and mass market paperback in August and the movement world comes out and trade paperback and E. Book. On September fifteenth. But again, the other big thing I want to urge you to check out is the following shapers of world's successfully kick started earlier this year and featuring international bestsellers and award nominees and winners who were guests of the first year of the world shapers podcast I. Believe there are eighteen stories all. So do check that out. You can now preorder the book from. A major retailer Stewart search for shapers of world's. Throw. My Name Willett if you want since I'm the editor and that's usually pins it down. Pretty good. Also, wanted to remind you again that the world shapers is online at the world shapers, Dot Com. There are actually full transcripts of most not all but most interviews including this one. So if you'd like to follow along and see where I edited it just a little bit that he can do that or if you prefer to read and you know but if you prefer to read, you probably haven't this podcast. It's on there anyway and complete archive of all past episodes on their. The world shapers is also on twitter at the world shapers it's on facebook APP the world shapers also a world-shapers facebook group. You can find me online at Edward Willett dot com again to tease on. Willett I'm on twitter at e Willett. I'm on Instagram at Edward Willett author. I'm on Facebook Edward Don Willett, and again my online shop is Edward will at shop dot com if you'd like to. shapers of world are other of my books directly for me and maybe autographed. That's it for this episode of the World Shapers again I. Hope that you will continue to come back week after week episode after episode as I continue to talk to the great science fiction and fantasy authors who created the world's and the characters in those worlds that we have enjoyed reading about so much over the years. That's it for this time.

Ben Alexander writer Oregon Philip Philip High School Alexander Cleopatra editor David Weber Kate Elliott California London Jaren Science Fiction Association Home League of superheroes Epi Sherlock Holmes John Sculley Joe Haldeman David Brian Ted Williams Elliot
61 The Iroquois Nationals Team | The History of Lacrosse

Iroquois History and Legends

51:53 min | 10 months ago

61 The Iroquois Nationals Team | The History of Lacrosse

"Hello welcome to Iroquois history and legends. Today we're GONNA be talking about the history of Lacrosse and current status of the Iroquois national team. Today. We don't have just one guest we have multiple group. I'm just going to let them introduce themselves one by one if you gentlemen could just give me a brief background on who you are just a little synopsis on how you're associated with the Iroquois national team. REX LINES MONOLOGUE NATION I've been a Lacrosse player has this as long as I can remember as I could walk at sticking my hand going up on Doug a nation it's been. A big part of my my life, my lifestyle the and I was on the First Leroy national team in eighty three and. Been in three tournaments and. The program at percents. I'm Leon Nolan multiple on Gatien. My mother's Aquasonichowie Mohawks enroll visit. Mohawk will clan. Lamb. I've been involved with your co-nationals across in about early two thousands and then k back. But you're a half ago and serve as the executive, director and board member. and. Tissue late at SMU and while the across like wreck, all my life and Real honor to be a part of the organization again to help with the many challenges facing us. So, we're very pleased to have this opportunity to give him a good historical perspective in a future perspective on warmer. Had IT. For us. And David Brian from the Seneca nation and the wolf clan I grew up playing cross started off with a new toll across went off to college played at Cornell University on a couple of national championship teams. I was also on the I Iroquois national team. And I've been a lifelong participant with your coin nationals as either as a player. Executive, director or board member and I'm still in like brexit it's kind of A. Lifelong journey to have our people be represented in Lacrosse whether it's at the college level professional level or international level. I'm Randy Scott some from six nations on -Tario A maternal clan. Mohawk like these guys are saying, I've started across when. You know I gotta stick when I was born. I've been playing ever since it's a big part of my life I played professional across for. The Georgia. Swarm. the Boston cannons and at the world stage with Uruguay nationals I've been playing with Uruguay national since. Two Thousand Eight Also. Went to Syracuse University got my degree there and. You know. Like these guys are saying, Lacrosse, has been a big part of my life in it's It's awesome. Thank you very much gentlemen. That's a lot of talent and a lot of experience for me growing up in Western. New York every. Year, has a Lacrosse program. Every College in university has lacrosse program, but there might be some people in the country that really might not know what it is or what the history of it is. So which one of you mind giving me a a synopsis of Old, this game is where it came from what the basic just of the rules are by I'll take that question. Well, it's part of our creation story so. know your guess is good as ours. You know it came from the spire creation story came from the Sky World. So in in our cosmology re talk about. Across in all being played in creators land. And before it came down to Turtle Island here. So it's as old as we are as Randy said, you know your mail you're one of three things you're born. You're you're a a speaker which measure speaker of ceremonies language or a singer, the singer of the ceremony or your across Blair. That's how significant across is to our culture. And you always have the exception to the rule where somebody's all And we have real lot of examples of that but let's how important it is to are. inherently. It's part of four yards culture. It's site in part of that responsibility to share the scheme. With others which we've been very successful at. Now, I believe sixty six countries have. Lacrosse organizations within her order states. Within our borders and it's been really I. Think we've done a great job of showing the green game with the many many around the world and or looking forward to continuing that and. One of the. Mainstays who are Bruh given this responsibility directly by the. Sedition confederacy in one, thousand, nine, hundred, three. And we were given that responsibility to golden compete internationally represent the initially in that regard play fair play hard and spread this game around the world. We as you know, we have our own passports when you've treated the Dutch the French the English and the United States of Jewish only do. It's really important about how we. Conduct ourselves internationally as a nation state. we have a government to government relationship with United States now based upon race. In Five, hundred, seventy, six better recognize American Alaskan native Indian nations in the United States, and one of them. We really take seriously our sovereignty is really something we respected will hold to the nth degree. Maria conscious of that many of our players. GROPE RECOGNIZING THAT ORLEANS? Great Great responsibility for us to carry that forward. We have had a lot of. Support from around the world. With this petition that you've seen from the shown for stations player up Nova Scotia of WHO said out a challenge to the world the. Over Forty Nine, thousand folks signed onto that supporting our entry into the Games and twenty, twenty two and eventually you know the Olympics in twenty twenty eight right now lacrosse on provisional status. With the. and. It's like it's a three or provisional status. Once set lift we Democrats will become a part of the Olympics team sports is always a bit of a challenge for the Olympics, the number of athletes who show up per country or team sports. A lot to maneuver in with a De Los Angeles. Again, the capability do just epoch were looking forward to being a full fledged as we should be, as you mentioned, I think of or the third ranked in the world's in-depth Field Gospel men under nineteen voice and second enrolled in indoor. Box We've won eleven medals of recent time really think improving our our steady further worth looking forward to Gold medalist India looks twenty twenty. Thank you so much Leo I. Don't know which it is I don't know if it's just amazing and incredible or if it's just of course, you are the fact that the national team is so successful I, mean, it is your game. But when you look at the pool of people that you draw from, I mean granted you all were born with sticks in your hands before you could walk but one hundred and twenty thousand people versus three hundred and thirty million people to pull from his every. It really is remarkable just the sheer determination and skill net men and women have when it comes to the game. We literally have just a few hundred jobs players you know playing the game United. States. has hosted five hundred thousand that play and so it's you know it's it is a daunting task but were certainly up to and I think we. Can showcase our talent. We have I believe two or three years the world with while Thompson Ready Stats Cody Jamieson folks like that that you've heard about in the are I know a young our young folks really revered else those guys I'm still of hero worship for shipping is okay you know. We all going to have role models have a good role model that does really a fantastic for our communities and we're really proud of these guys and guys that went before them like David, myself and other who you know we all say role models and we really try to live the correct way of living peace justice and unity and equity in such, and so we're really conscious of what that needs to our communities in these folks like Randy and others are the next generation to take over the leadership role and help continue move this move forward. It is our game in. The part of the support were getting that many many countries recognize it unfortunately, the United States and I think in Canada there's not enough about the true history of Jewish owning or the Oklahoma the native people. Of this country Canada and that's part of our response. We also do really represent the digits communities around the World Amal Race of New Zealand where I met with him the ask about Lacrosse it really enthralled with it. there. To hear about how we have managed to move this game from, you know a few countries now to sixty six, the aboriginal folks in Australia the same way. So I think we're really young indebted to their support, but also standing up for their indigenous rights almost exclusively. Unfortunately, that's going on were much about being inclusive as you can see on our flay. When you get a chance to look at it. There's two bars hang out on both ends with the Mohawks Senecas are, and that's our symbolic. A open arms to other communities join us in our quest to foster peace equity and injustice. So it's a great. Set of principles I think we live behind and we really pleased with how it's going. You know how after Games now, everyone shakes hands after the game show both Professional College High School Elementary School, and it really started with us and when I played back. Box Across the warriors I mean that was I. Think you did when you left when you're about to leave the field play game was over, you should pants. With your opponents and you. Friendship Chad before the game while rekindle our friendship after the shaky everyone's adopted that. So there's a lot more that we. Could teach. Can certainly show other folks on how to conduct themselves in A. Way. When it comes to across the spinoff in life in general ready to anything or I think for me you know like when we talk about not district representing the hundreds of people as a player you know growing up growing up on the. Reservation. Till now I still live here in getting to go to Finland, getting to go to British Columbia, go to Israel and all these different countries in interacting with all these different people. And feeling the support we have to win from not only. The hunting to showing people but other. Indigenous tribes from around the world. For example, when we were NBC last year we went and visited the cat see nation, it's probably like a five hundred people banned you know and they welcomed us with open arms. They Fed us they did a ceremony for us and and we exchanged kind of a spiritual spiritual welcoming bond. and a thank you. You know. So for me as a player, I'm getting goosebumps talking about it because the. I'll never forget as a player and you know. To know that we have outreach more than just our people is incredible to me. You know when we put on that Jersey, it's not just us. It's all these indigenous communities and It's amazing to see and it's an honor to represent. Represent them. Lacrosse is an ancient game for us you know as part of our social cultural and spiritual heritage. We. Use It as a medicine at times in our community. It's somewhat social. in that, you know every summer. a lot of where people gather for games growing up back and remembers. Our Arenas. Being all. Full with with spectators in the community just come together. I was a big game was against Onondaga. Against UVA in the dialogue that goes on. As the game goes on you know I'm playing but at the same time I know other they're sharing very stories updating on I'm Berry's family member so it's always been a very. Integral part of our community Could have these games going on I know this year because the the virus going on, you know we don't have lacrosse in it's really put a lot different Fuel in our community that were lacking a lot of us As as part of our social fabric. So you know I know the underdogs every springtime have medicine game for the game itself and for our people. So it's kind of a an old. Old Game For us but at the same time when we began to your co-nationals back in. The one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, three were sanctioned by the grand. Council. To represent. The haudenosaunee, an international across competition You know we really had to think about you know where we're taking this game. And eventually became and I think is nine, hundred, eighty, six, eighty, seven accepted into the Federation of. International across or What it became a now is called world across. So, we were now. Part of the world community playing our game again, even though back in the nineteen, an eighteen eighties were playing against Canada and you'll see throughout history we played against many universities. Native People Senecas playing against Cornell Syracuse Harvard Army. You'll see Iroquois Onondaga Playing against these various college teams whether it's military on communities. So we evolved Full Circle in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, six, eighty, seven into international world. With our passports, we had passports going since nineteen, seventy seven when we first went to the United Nations. So it's kind of an extension and logical extension going with what's called call. Now, the nationals nationals being you know we represent the Iroquois people. In, and as a result you know we had to. Have a flag. We had have a national anthem. It has at national anthem played at the first. International game. That I in snow now were participating in. It was quite an hundred to see other nations the United States Canada Australia. England. I'll stand to hear you know. At least in my lifetime for the first time standing up and respecting us as a as a as a nation state just as they we. The ERC white people. So. It was kind of a big honor for us. Now you know we do have hurdles were still continuing these hurdles as we go into the international? World Games, You know we've got a hurdle in front of us that we're trying to. Get by, but eventually you know we would like to make Ted Olympics in thousand twenty, eight which will be held in. LA, which will also be you know. Being from North America is part of our homelands and to have indigenous people Being represented at. The highest level of of sports I think you know we're doing the best we can With support from various people Throughout the world individuals as well as professional leagues as well as. Various countries United States Canada. China Hong Kong. Various countries have sent US letters of support. So we're we're kind of standing in good stead as we move forward. With this and you know where? You know under leadership with. Leo He's He's been doing a. Heck of a job, you know trying to address all these concerns and and. You know as a board member, I fully support. You know what's taking place and going forward representing the. Your confederacy. Thank you so much. Already answered a bunch of questions that I already had lined up and one of my next things was, and maybe you can elaborate on it more roadblocks to the nationals have they had to deal with and overcome to compete on the international stage I. I WanNa know ones that you have overcome in once that you are still dealing with and and why is it that way? I remember when I had a friend who this is a decade or so ago a friend who's a Tusk Aurora and he mentioned to me that he could get a passport and you can and it was just a at the time to me. It was just a totally foreign concept. Yeah. They should. I did I didn't know you you had your own passports and it was just a a unique revelation to me the solidified more of how the hood schone really are an autonomous confederacy. How do you guys raise awareness to people that are just maybe just ignorant just don't understand where you're coming from. That is part of the challenge I think as much lack of education knowledge, appreciation, understanding of our special status not only night states again but around the world and that's part of our our efforts like Some of these guys who said that we attend a world international competition. We typically are asked to come up come a week earlier or stay week extra to do workshops and clinics for youth of that. Particular nation. Where always the I believe. The most biggest fan base following not just the people. But now native folks also, we typically are the first game against the host country I became in every competition we've ended. Our merchandise or a Jersey such as off the shelves typically sell out we have a lot of. Popularity unpopularity. Already, used to these, and we got really take advantage of it. I think holding those clinics with young people in diverse countries really will help us. Get. Out that. Sense of who we are, what we're about sensible across. We've a lot of other think principles that we can follow. Certainly, we've had challenges with our passport. But Rex can talk a little bit about that but we are working on. Fixing that problem. We, we've As you've probably heard of twenty ten. We didn't get to Manchester to play unfortunately and. Again. It was a political issue, the United States Hillary Clinton was secretary of state time. Agreed that you know our passports be welcome. We left the country welcome back but. England still blocked from attending or a lot of different reasons but. We continue overturned overcome those. Issues. Were going to Israel and our team got held up in Toronto I think they're flying out caffeine was played and half was we miss the first play because he wouldn't let us on but with the Political Division that I think we were able to garner. Prime Minister Justin Trudeau Joe sign others made those kind of calls for him. And he basically. Made the call to let us. Go usual by Canadian. Border and come back. Over you work on those issues. Is a challenge I mean it's not just us where those issues sometimes with these passports many countries have recognized ours passports as legitimate travel documents. So it's a matter of. A. So working out the. Nuances and details for insuring that we have. The right documents to travel like any other national community has and there's no tweet about it. Like any country we don't want. The furriers people at our communities you. Else does you re conscious of that so far we get visas. Why was folks? No head WHO's coming? into their country. We always. Expected letter welcome from that particular country. We will travel that way. We can then go get the proper documentation if there's additional things like visas and things that we have. Rex might on. Her passport challenges sure you know one of the one of the major challenges that we don't have a bar code you know and as you know, you don't ask for permission to be solved. In. That's just your Saban as you're. So when we issued our passports, we said this is going to be documentation of travel on it. In all. tigger leave it. You know we're not going to change who we are because we've been offered dual citizenship by the US and we said thanks. But no thanks because we know that we're still operating under the treaties that we have, you can't have a treaty with yourself. And also we we stand by. And we still get treaty cloth every year in Oh and we're still operating. We still have the original walkabouts. Still have haven't they're in safe keeping the now under you know at where we We refer to them when necessary one of the challenges that our territory spread out to US In Canada makes it very a little more complicated three entities to agree on the. Terms and conditions that everybody's comfortable with and as you know there are a lot of ongoing. Conversations issues in all that can be quite sensitive. So, we know it. It becomes extremely difficult to navigate and try not to address every issue as we try to. Implement our sovereignty. You know that we hopefully will develop has forward so that we can have healthy discussions and maybe a solve some of these disagreements and disputes. But for the time being we've always been Hoya Innocence European brothers you know came came over here and and There's been a lot of contributions that is taken from us and I think it's you know I always say it's really important today. That, they stop pretending. That, they don't know us. In all this is something that's done out of convenience and on a political agenda, you know even with the World Games, you know these are. If you take the temperature of society, people are really looking for change of diversity of inclusion and starts to right the wrongs that have been done in history, and also that we could get to a healthier place and everyone can prosper in participate in all not just the select few in the fortunate few. You know you could see that there. By illustration of that petition having forty nine thousand signatures is in and there's an it's an it's a wide range of big demographic. There are some lacrosse players Lacrosse community showed up and just fans and just public in general one of the misconceptions that US being such an established part of the world. Community and be Meta waiters they they had no idea that we're still dealing is issue they thought I'll can they still you know having trouble in traveling around the world either winning medals at every at every championship you know We asked the same thing. In all one of the challenges that we have is that as you know, the administration can change every four years. So they can be progress made and you'll have a whole new cabinet come in and you have to start from zero again. It becomes very, very taxing and. Sometimes. You won't have very friendly administration so it wouldn't bring certain issues to the table because it wouldn't be in our interest to do so. And I don't have to go into great detail kind of the situation we're sitting in. Now you know you we wanna make progress and resolve this once and for all because. As you know with with some of the research you've done the tree of peace is a It's a spiritual symbol that we that we operate under which represents the universal laws. That are in control of everything and that we understand intimately and that we respect and that we have intimate knowledge of and we have real context and understanding instructions out operate within the natural world and the Cross believe it or not is one of the ways we do that and just by the woods stick. Our stick makers when they when they go out into into the woods and they they look for a tree to make stick there's a relationship right from right out of the gate where. There are certain characteristics a tree needs to to make the best stick. So the tree kind of offers itself in relationship between the stick maker, the tree where there's a give and take. Is there's an understanding a conversation as stick maker is also planting trees as he thanks for giving his life so that he could be carbon, make these sticks and play the creators game. Now that Hickory in mate from the Hickory that's where the medicine is as we also make our water drum from the hickory from the Hickory tree. So there's a there's a heartbeat to our ceremonies. In Oh this is all encompassing where Now that you have the Hickory tree representing all the things that grow from the earth, and now you have the we've in the web. Of the traditional web there, you have the scene of the deer. Now, the dearest leader of all the animals because he's on every continent. So now you have the animal world represented in the Lacrosse, and then you have the traditional itself and those interlocking loops. Those are the clans that's the family in. Oh, coming together. United interlock interest wind cradling the medicine, which is the ball I said extraordinarily example of encompassing everything in all, and that's how we do most of our and that's how we are values. Nothing is separate. There is no compartmentalizing anything everything's relative and one of the reasons we have plans. As that, we have real kinship with nature. Those are relatives and that was pointed out to us as part of our instruction. We would never clear-cut hickory trees and mass produce them for profit. That's not how our values were. In, oh. That's not how we are and that's one of the fundamental difference between our society and some other societies should know the. The Western world that is very progressive. In their INARA idea progressiveness is a little bit. Lacking in the context of where the human being is in the big picture. 'cause they don't have the instruction that we have you know, and we are given responsibility not authority because of our intellect and the capabilities that our species hats is great responsibility and stewardship seven generation coming. Now, we have this lacrosse stick that we teach our young right away respect and a kinship, and we we have the connection with the natural world. How many how many cultures societies have that were? That's that's fundamental. When you start when you're taught that at such an early age, you understand how important is. You you're probably going to be less likely to make an unhealthy decision to jeopardize that relationship. So these are things that are instilled in us, and that's the game in Oh helps facilitate. And one of the best ways to facilitate instruct subjects of the young. He got to enjoy it. It's fun to play Lacrosse in all and I have this instruction. Ask You got you got this vitality attached to it. It's it's very strong reinforcement. So I guess I I like I understand this I want to be part of, and you know if you talked to any non native across player, they feel the spiritual with spirituality connected to Lacrosse but they don't understand. I've talked to a lot of them because they have the same obsession. It's like a lifestyle it consumes you. And anybody WHO's played Lacrosse. That's what they feel that. They don't understand the relationship between the natural world and it's spiritual connection to the create an all of life. Streets even further Andrew in two thousand sixteen where everybody to the White House to repulsed the chain between the United States in the. Confederacy and We had we had taught there. We had both elected traditional leadership there There was exchange a treaty cloth between US officials and and thus. You walk home with them Norther Group. You don't do this with individual people. You do this with other nation states and that's what they're really represent. That's just how significant. Treat is to our our existence and our our locking arms with united. States government you part of the US government is based upon our way of governing ourselves very democratic. Wait you're the one thing I. Tried My. non-native ties about the fact that wanting that Ben Franklin and the others who were putting this together forgot about was women. Right women in this country native woman has just salary hundred anniversary of the right to vote. We can't even imagine leaving up more than you know half of your population in any wish before from helping governor and helping steer the ship in the right direction but we've always had the reverence for women. Are Who are follow like I. Said we follow her mother's nation and clan. But. A lot of there's a lot of A. Thanks that should be given to us from the United States and other countries. What we've done I think in January net kind of democracy like that. You can really important for all of US staff. Some bad from what rex was saying you know from my standpoint. I get asked you know is the reservation is, is it gated? Is there like trinity? You guys have you guys TV's? In Housing and It's to this happened in the last five years, and that's crazy to me that people are that uneducated on how we live in. It's Kinda like a shock that we're still here. And you know Lacrosse. gives us a vehicle to bring awareness to that and I think. You know. The. Your co-nationals is being on the world stage is the best way to to do that. letting people know I don't know if it's you know ignorance I guess a little bit of it is or uneducated. But I think by us being there and sharing our word like. What rex were just talking about? You know people have to have open open mind to that because a lot of people aren't going to understand what that means you know. Because I think a lot of people are ignorant or ignore the fact that. That doesn't make sense to them the spiritual world or that connection it's not real to them. So I think if people listened a little bit better and had an open mind to to how we live and and what we believe in I, think you know they would walk away with a better understanding of of who we are and what this game actually is for us. Hey Randi Aikido same questions back in one, thousand, nine, hundred, seventy. Crazy. And I used I used to. Do the still right around in covered wagons. Flooring in your house it's nuts. Yeah Andrew Andrew I'd be remiss if I didn't. Touch upon some of the. Know I've been very fortunate to travel around Turtle Island. And Being out in a gym boy country Watching the one stick version of a Lacrosse. or in Muskogee. in seeing this to stick version with Jerky that that creek and other civilized tribes down near. Lacrosse has been across to rely on for many many years and you know the version that we played along sick version eventually became what is commonly see today. Lacrosse is long stick version. Fed Down but universally, across turtle island, there was any double ball. Men and women play dull walk across the island and You know. So when sometimes I get asked to go to two camps and sometimes I'll have the kids. Make a double ball I'll explain to them you know the game a concept and and no, they'll go out and just grab a stick. And tied to balls together could be tennis balls could be in all anything you WANNA put inside of a sock and make. A double ball just to take time and and and see where the roots of the game came from. Thank you so much data that that really a double, my knowledge and actually the a good segue into another question that I had how has the game changed and maybe it hasn't because I know that there's still a traditional way to play versus a modern day. But how is the game changed from pre European contact to now when? People have colonial stent have gotten involved become playing in the rules become much more internationally CODA fide I know that there were rules and everything like that beforehand. But how is it so much different today and I know that there's Ocsta- Cross and outdoor Lacrosse, an indoor lacrosse and We just talk about all the different variations but. What, what is different between now versus a thousand years ago? Well, I think it's a it comes with any kind of anything that evolves evolution materials change. You, know making it. Maybe a little bit easier more convenient to in all things like that will change and you've all any kind of game that you're playing. Is for the better. The worst that's always up for discussion. In All The plastic stick is one of those things where that always comes to compensate because I know an international games they they want to expunge the wooden sticks not understanding its importance. I remember playing what I was playing this kind of dating back with Dave, played it all. You you really had to make your mind up go through the middle of his everybody used the wooden stick. And here's a big difference between would stick and a plastic stick. Let me tell you. So. You earned it. You went in the middle and you got to show you gotta go. You know you went through the middle. So you know I, think. A little bit of that is is part of this discussion but having the convenience of the plastic stick if you break is thank you can have three others just like it. One of the things about a wooden stick is they're all different and they're all personal to you. You get to understand it how it feels and how it balances and how it can connect us a real connection there. There's no other stick like it. There becomes a real relationship between you and the wooden stick. So that's a that's a that's a fundamental difference that happens between the contemporary and more traditional aspects of the. But I think as as time marches on everything kind of revolves it gets. A little a little adjustment to. Whatever whatever it might be the trends in other areas. I mean. When you can play you. Make the field smaller. They make the plainfield less less players participating in our becomes more of a I guess. Organized situation where before you know I played medicine game, there can be as many as one hundred players at once you might never touch the ball. He just wanted up down the feel opened Blake. Now hoping to touch the ball, and if you touch the ball, it doesn't stay in your stick very long you hard way in that's. You know that's part of the COMP as part of the contest and is about. Gifts. We talk about every gifts that the creator. Does about the Lacrosse player in the communities take real real reverence in those gifts that we have special across players or gift they can play the game exceptionally well, because it created was very generous with their abilities and on a given day somebody's gift prevail and they're the they win the game and you celebrate their gifts is because it's a celebratory just because of the spirit and the nature of the game. And I still think you find that in all aspects of wherever the Amos Plate. Yeah, you always WANNA win hope to win. But even if you're just playing a game, you know you could still enjoy the game and you might be in you might not be victorious but I think. You know when you look back if you've ever held one of those sticks there was real engineering to though sticks because they played great distances that ball had to run in the the webbing was a lot longer. So they could throw the ball hundred yards. No problem. Real engineering to that and and as the as things change that could have more control. So there was more passing I guess not as much stickhandling depending on your gifts and as things develop like anything it because like if you look at football out the pads became you know more instrumental or now you actually have a battering ram on your head before not so much. Any of those things those evolutions will will happen as things you know progress in the materials change and you know the I, guess the instant gratification that comes along with progress and. which kind of is there's another thing that we're always trying to navigate and trying to find some balance because I think. That's one of the things that. Is Ferry. To us that there's a huge imbalance between the natural world. And the contemporary world, and we're all wearing masks because of that imbalance that's a that's a as a direct. A direct direct. Consequence of human actions on this earth and not knowing and not having instruction of how they're supposed to interact with the natural world and what happens when there's imbalanced natual will fix it. And is in process right now she's balancing herself and we were extracted. Don't ever challenge those laws then I'll because you will not prevail. We, we've been we've been destructed. There's we have. We have prophecies telling us that this hard times are coming. In and they're not not pleasant and on and the more that you see we look around. Back, when I was a kid I can remember somebody's instruction and they were so the seemed to be such wild prophecies. Wow. That just sounds so far out and and some of them have already come to be when when back when just that's not very long ago. So it kind of gives you an indication of where we are. In the because these are these are hundreds of years old is it structures some thousand as we had three different instructions then all and and it's really Curious to be and where we are in this in this timeline. But you know what are the attributes of having hundreds and hundreds of players on a team when we played back. Thousand years ago is that everyone can contribute To the game every won't contribute to their team. So we don't want weed people out even the slowest player maybe debater he could contribute. SMART Lacrosse with but. You GotTa think about about about that it's really community. It's a community endeavor. Some of us are better than others in certain aspects of the game and some of our veterans, certain aspects of life, and I think that's a real attribute that we don't leave anyone else. Off You, WanNa, come out and try out for our teams. Great. We have other if you don't make the first team, there's other teams you play on, but the contribution everyone can make to this game, both men and women I mean now we have well over probably at least two dozen at least I know of a division one college players right now who players Playing Division One College. In the United States, we have a couple of kids in candidate at McGill University of Toronto. We have women not playing in college level nets opened up the doors for a lot of us like David, myself, and ready to go on to get our college degrees and move on to be a real contributor to our communities in a way that we could. So it's. It's a changing. Atmosphere for all of us now, just for the non native, I feel the need. To the to the to the wooden stick thing you know I, my dad kind of made me. You wouldn't stick up until I was like twelve or thirteen So I've always had I had one one stick for a really long time that was my baby, but you know after that. I. Think the biggest thing he stressed to me was you know get used to this. It's a part. It's kind of a part of me like Rex's talking about and you know he he stressed out on me and then you know I was laughing a little bit because when I when I switched to the plastic, stick him in my uncle, all my uncles played and What are you doing with this tupperware? You know they kinda. Kinda chirpy that a little bit. They, call it tupperware instead of plastic sticks they don't think. Think, it hurts as much as the would does, but you know I find it crazy. Now in the Pro Leagues, they won't let goal these wooden sticks. They won't let players what sticks and I find that kind of a little bit shocking I. Know Some people may use it in the wrong way which you know some people are tend to do Our history but I, think you know there's always a place for for the wooden stick and I. Think it's a powerful thing for us as a with our people I think it's very important. I also think to win REX's talking about. Winning and losing you know some of my my best games were in the backyard with my family you know playing against cousins plan against like my uncle's we three on three or something you know and that's Kinda the best time, and there's no mistakes out there and I think the way we play Lacrosse as Free flowing in kind of mistake free careless a little a little bit at times. And I think that all stems from generation to generation of impasse down to how creative. Individuals are I. Think the last thing I wanted to touch on Dave talked about this earlier it's a community thing and people. Of all ages old young come to our arenas still to this day. And watch US play I play senior Lacrosse for the six nations chiefs and you know I see I see Alzheimer's wheelchairs sick people strong people You know week people all these different kinds of people and and we say it's a medicine game. We're taught to play with a clear mind and that means you know have no negative thoughts and keeping things positive. The game can bring up a lot of emotions frustration, anger happiness joy sadness. You know it has all that stuff and and the thing for me that I see watching like a junior game, you see these old people watching the game and they're excited they're hopping out of their wheelchair you know other swing in their canine around. And that's the medicine right there. You know other things in life might not give them that joy but watching that game or that goal or that play or that hit you know that gives them the joy to make their day or the week, and they can't wait for the next game and then the next game or the next season. So it's Kinda cool to see that happen you know because. If you go to a game on there s you know you see these people screaming yelling and they're invested in the game as it being a part of us and our people I think that allows them to be more emotional in the game for wanting us to win. so I, think it's pretty cool to see. You know the the different emotions that can happen to to to people who don't even play the game. You know they feel sad if there's a loss feel angry if there's a miscall or hit feel happy if there's a goal or it's so cool to see the and it's it's cool that this game has that much power to bring happiness to to our people. Thanks so much Randi to questions put together as or anything else you gentlemen would like to add, and also how can listeners practically peak advocate for the Eric nationals to be recognized more in the international community That's a good question. I, don't think they can do is. is to follow us in and join our. On our twitter feed to stay active and stay a gate it really going to take some real. It's going to be some real change on on the political level. And we just need more support like we have. Now I feel like there's a lot of support that we didn't have at one time. You're always seemed to be standing there pretty much by ourselves is because people were unaware. On we didn't have social media, but now that you could, you can communicate so fast. It really helps to get to get. Issues out there and have everybody weigh in hopefully in a good way to have some change because what we bring to the table as. In all is. Is is peace friendship and healing. That's what that's how we how we conduct ourselves. And this is something that's very valuable and something that the world needs more. And I don't think there's any better ambassadors for the game of Lacrosse and shown. You know. Folks into commute in our communities and other skid. Really show their support by raising their voice. Supporting, our efforts to be in the road. Games. In Two, thousand, twenty, two and the Olympics. It's really important for me were share the concerns you know if it's Faux Pas. Hopefully, very positive statements about us being there. We're trying to conduct yourselves in hurry diplomatic. Respectful. Amicable way to ensure that we are at in Birmingham Alabama at the role games, and in the Olympics we're doing everything we can to ensure that we do all the appropriate protocols and processes that need to ensure that we are there as originators of the game. That alone can. Really. Help across world in general that the expectation is that we will be there for those troops are the future genucel truths as it recognized nation states real sovereign powers over our own entity. Well Thank Andrew, and in his podcast for you know interviewing us and spreading the word. It's very important for that work get out to. Various Communities In everything we do whether we're traveling with the team insurance in others expenses related to you know promoting our sovereignty. Alert are arm expenses that we have to cover it. Certainly, donations are are needed to help us in this struggle. Certainly. The support is is there, but you know financially sometimes we you know it is it is a difficult road. And So donations are certainly welcome in one last no WanNa give her thanks to stick makers that have helped build a game without those thick makers. Way Back. In Historic Times that you know I don't think the game would-be where it's at I know back in my younger day. So it wasn't for stick maker I probably would have been in the game you know. So it was just an important element to our community because a stick makers. I. Think what he's seeing is potential leadership in our youth to move forward often look to stick makers and just think that you know without those without those people I. Know I have traveled his journey is when a gun little shell for the for the stick makers, I just like to say gentlemen. Thank you so much for your ancestors for their contributions that they've made not only through the cross but through so many other contributions. There was one quote I wanted to get in and it's from the the Great Jim Brown who everyone knows, of course played with REX's father. He said I'd rather play Lacrosse six days a week and play football on Sunday and the man is in my opinion, one of the greatest athletes of all time in the NFL Hall of fame and the Lacrosse Hall of fame it just really is remarkable. How far this game has come to spread across the rule than in such a short time, and so I'm just so honored that you all could join today and I hope that this educates thousands and thousands more people on this wonderful sport. So thank you gentlemen I would ask everyone to please check out the Iroquois nationals website. You can also follow them on twitter please look up and please sign their petition and if you've not done so yet please subscribe on whatever podcast platform you used to this podcast and have a great day.

Lacrosse United States Rex Canada David Brian Olympics Randy Scott Turtle Island Cornell University Leo He England Syracuse University New York Australia Confederacy Andrew Andrew WanNa Sky World Israel Boston
Steelers Roster Cut Down Special: Diving into the players who made it, and who didn't

Behind the Steel Curtain

55:54 min | 1 year ago

Steelers Roster Cut Down Special: Diving into the players who made it, and who didn't

"This episode is brought to you by cox with contour t._v. From cox you can find all your favorites all in one place it does it have the youtube you bet and what about that netflix thing net flicks too and although superhero movies contour has all the latest titles on demand. Oh my grandkids love that big in green guy. I prefer the one with the hammer myself okay. I think we're done now. Get all your favorite apps shows and movies right on contour contour t._v. From cox pittsburgh steeler fans that's going on. This is jeff harmon editor of behind steel curtain dot com with another episode of well. It's not another episode. It's actually a behind the steel curtain podcast special. It's the cut down day. Special we decided as a collective group that at the saturday that the the steelers cut their roster from ninety one players down to fifty three he would do show right after it happened so we did our editorial jobs myself. Dave scofield good job dave today the kathy and <hes> a lot to talk about but not a lot to talk about right. Let's introduce whoever's with us brian. Go ahead and introduce yourself because you haven't yet and what's going on how you doing. My name is brian anthony davis i'm a sagittarius and i'm just glad to be on the show today. My friends do you pinnacle walks in the rain. I get on a rant about that song but we've got. We've got more things to talk about and hey. It's cut down day. We know what our team looks like right for now for now for now daves go field entries yourself. How's it going. I'm dave scofield and i'm going the reason is the introduce yourself off. Our channel has grown a lot on youtube in our podcast platform as a lot and so there is a high likelihood that we might it actually have people that are just tuning in for the first time just watching the podcast for the first time and sit there for a little bit of introduction there. I'm jeff hardman as i said editor of behind the steel curtain dot com and before we get started. I want to say something. Isaac is a huge supporter of our podcast. He is in the live chat right now. Can i say how tired i heard i am a seeing these types of comments in the comments section on behind the steel curtain and now on our podcast flat for isaac saying saying that the patriots are going to pick up johnny holden and tournament to a pro bowl player and people were saying that about anthony tikolo who made the team. I mean maybe you you are. I'm just so sick and tired of it that my gosh did. The patriots are not gods gift football. Have they won a lot in the last ten years absolutely absolutely but can we please pump the brakes on them being the perfect organization and they do everything right. Please guys you can say what you want brian. You can say whatever you want about that. That's just a little soapbox for me as saw that pop up on the life. You don't like oh my gosh the patriots or not that special. They just have a really good quarterback in a pretty good coach. You agree brian. That's that's what it is because without those two guys were looking at five eleven year in year out and a whole range of coaches so really you know once this brady belichick air is gone. That's it you know they've made magic before but yeah i mean i. I like johnny houghton but he's dairies. Hayward bay is what he yes yeah dave thoughts on hold named or the patriots and that whole stupid are around them <hes> would they really claimed him off of waivers. I don't know he's still eligible for the practice squad. I actually have him on the practice squad. I even had him on there before. The cut downs sounds and i'm going to keep him on there because he has one more year now actually if he has two more years actually so he's a guy that would be great to be on the practice squad. Obviously you let rogers's uses is not available anymore and those were the two receivers that were cut that we thought well along with spencer the three that were cut that we thought had a chance to make it. They've spencer's spencer's already said that they'd steelers won him on the practice squad. That was the report that was out earlier today so i think i think eli rogers is is out the gone but johnny hilton could be on that practice squad and could be pulled up onto the team if if if injury happens and they want that six receiver okay so let's talk about the roster cuts today. I'm sorry that i got off on a little tangent there <hes> they were really not many surprises in news was kind of trickling in throughout the day and you know all this was happening for instance. Gerald hawkins was traded. That happened prior to the four pm deadline <hes> guys. Let's talk about the draft have class. I okay the steelers do not like to cut draft picks they did they cut my correct and just saying to derwin gray seventh around here from maryland got cut sudden smith six round pick from northern illinois guy cut. Am i missing anyone else. Dave not yet because i do believe that if the steelers pick up a tight end <hes> from from someone else's cuts that that could also mean that zach gentry could be cut and moved to the practice squad squad if he cleared so too so far okay so brian. Were there any surprises there but there's you guys have during gray looked pretty bad in the preseason southern smith i mean he just didn't in play you know what he started to make strides in game four but it was just not enough of a sample size but that's not a bad thing when you're talking about the pittsburgh steelers this perspective of this. This is an opportunity to stash guy on the practice squad and like if you like them give them another shot next year because because he didn't have enough to show off for other teams so when the patriots go ahead and make him a superstar just like they did with the markus orcas remember demarcus really good so <hes> you know and i'm joking but <hes> but you know what so there's a guy you could protect without without losing him because there wasn't enough sample size 'cause if they like them enough. He's not gone right so i mean he could decide to go to another team but you know i think that's <hes>. That's something that you could keep around for a while down on the p._s. And if something happens the various okay questions are coming in and we have a live chat here super chat feature. That's two dollars captain underpants. He's a regular listener of the show. Just you know the the super chat features there for you to use on the right side where you can comment on the video and the livestream. There's little dollar signing any amount of money to the show because to the show directly to we appreciate all the money that you don't you don't have to but you can if it does it highlights question and we'll put it up on the screen here as i did he ask. Are there any tight ends that you think right. I think he's referring to tight ends. That were released. There have been a lot of tight ends at have been released veteran tight ends but i guess the question i have because i don't know any specific names. Maybe you all do but for me. I'm looking at where what are the steelers looking for if they are going to bring in a tight end for instance someone said the other day that they looking for a quote unquote matt spaeth type tight end. It's a blocker. He can catch the ball but that's not his forte dave. If you know names go ed ed thrown out there if you don't what are they looking for in terms of the type of titan that they wanna target at a key as for the type of tight end. I think that is spot on. I liked the whole notion. Combat space type of tight end someone that you can come in that will be that run blocker but you could put them out there and they can't catch you still have to account for them. When it comes to names i know there were some names that are floating around but my focus so far this off season has been completely on the pittsburgh steelers so i don't know with any of those guys out. There are guys that fit that mold or someone who could they could realistically sign for the amount of money that they have available to fit data so i like the idea i know what i would like but i can't give you a name of someone out there right now david brian this is normally your forte of anyone cavaliers today to you said hey this could be a good one james kelly. I like the look wilson thing if his you know what if this guy's brother owen wilson is available that'd be just as good but luke wilson has got a lotta run because he was a writer on hard knocks but he played a lot as a blocking tight. It end up for many a year in seattle. That's not a bad option plus. He's cool long hair and everybody likes the the guy with long hair but but you know this is a guy who could go ahead and do the job come in as that matt spaeth type blocker because really the only other blocker that you've got right now is szucs szucs as a tight end but he's not a pass catching option and they liked space four. Maybe five six surprise balls every year so i mean if you bring in a guy like luke wilson that's not the worst idea at all in the live chat someone asked dave head into that underneath vic the sheet and i it was called but my what's it's not in my wife's office right now and it's her. It's her book bookshelf of shame so she says in order to do it. I'm trying to be being here so i could keep the craziness down it is my kids normally do podcasts when their sleep. I told her that i would i would i would cover up to the the untied okay. It's actually it's actually where now i'm not gonna say what i was gonna. Say i'll tell you i was gonna say brian. Anthony davis asked me to stashes. We'll say various adult novelty around <hes> okay okay so here we go. Let's let's face it back on travel steelers tight ending something sure someone said well. They're not going to keep tight end to the practice squad because they have a christian scott williamson. That's not true they did last year they kept him and another one because they they keep him for free but it doesn't mean that he would be someone who could they could call up to the squad to the actual roster they you might not feel that he's ready for that. They definitely didn't feel it last year so i would say not only <hes> they could. They keep a second time on the practice squad. I think they will so it. It all depends on if they find someone else and can get gentry down there a witch which him you know if it'd be gentry kevin reiter someone like that that would end up down there again. Ah do want to talk about roger is not making the team but before we get there guys. This is an honest to goodness <hes> question and i don't know the answer. I figured between dave and brian. Why do you know who is the last player that you can think of that did not make the fifty three man roster spent at least one year on the practice squad and then became legitimate player for the steelers not another team the steelers a bunch okay. We'll see who's the most recent the b._j. Any okay he spent a year but he's he's. He's not a starter. He's a death he's good death and i think he's not that would be a starter on probably headed the twenty eight other teams. Try to think about a starter. Let me put that christ. Pardon pardon go ahead brian. Why i'm blanking. <hes> don't helton never really spend time on the practice squad that i know twelve the that's. That's pretty tough did ramon foster. He went right to the first year. Okay <hes> <hes>. I don't know that when you say that had to be a starter. There's plenty guys that were there. Were depth. Well think about it. While i listen okay. Well think about it while i talk about why that question because i'm not a guy that gets enamored with the practice squad. There are some fans out there that are just i hope my gosh who signed the practice squad or they're gonna clear waivers. We're gonna get him on the prize squad and i keep on saying myself. My gosh these guys were if they're that good. They would have made the fifty three man roster. You're in that's why for me when i saw our skipper and ulysses gilbert the third make the team. I'm like okay. These guys are good enough. What we saw in the free the season was what the steelers organization saw. They obviously reading. They put him on the roster. I just don't i don't have that fascination with the practice squad because you got guys like a decent he said dangerfield. I mean rod jordan dangerfield been with the steelers. It seems like for the last twenty years and maybe played in two regular season games <hes>. It's just one of those situations where i've always just felt. It's it's good if you can keep them in the system but i was just honestly thinking who was the last player that has actually come out in done anything from the practice squad. You have somebody all a honda villanueva. He spent a year on the practice squad right did then that's a good sign him after he wasn't even with the steelers philadelphia eagles and they come with them yeah yeah and they brought under the practice squad to move onto the offensive tackle for year and then he made the team. I'm pretty sure it was the very next year but i mean they brought him in. I mean that was a project but that wasn't even their grown guys so that doesn't i don't know if that really counseling part of your criteria someone that spend time on that. The dealer said we're gonna put you on the practice squad and then after development. They actually came to fruition brian to anybody. No and i think your point is made. I think it's a perfect point. It's look if these guys are are showing up the season whatsoever in means that they're really not gonna get ahead on sundays. They're going to be <hes>. They're going to be scratched anyways there. It's really hard to think that this is a really significant extra guys to have their. It's you're kind of. It's kind of your farm system but <hes> it's rare that they they work out and dave correct me. If i'm wrong. Christians gotten williamson although did not make the fifty three does remain on the practice squad regardless correct. I guess technically he could claim to the active roster of another team but i thought it was us. You're saying okay here's another team warning but if not fifty three sorry if not a steelers and on the price as an extra guy that's what i was referring to. I didn't know i'm pretty sure that it was tomlin said at some point that they do have that or it could have been in colbert said that they do have that another that exemption for at least another year to keep them with the team and that you knew he wasn't going to make the roster even if he played fantastic in the preseason and he was obviously even the number two guy because why if you got him for free to carry an extra guy why not take advantage of it right okay so let's talk a little bit about <hes> until you i rogers u._i. Rogers was well. This happens every year in the five plus years that i've done this article in this stuff for the website you try to find that one player who i feel like is the biggest named it gets cut and you put them in the headline the article the cuts are highlighted by its as as you i rogers last year is landry jen's <hes> i do want to mention that <hes> joe rutter of the pittsburgh tribune read this verbatim from his twitter feed. He brings up a good point join dave. You've mentioned this before. He's at the rogers. Cuts doesn't necessarily mean he's done with the steelers they could always bring him back. If they make an injured reserve move for instance justin lane which we don't know what his injury was in week four the preseason but he left the game early or aladdin yay if the knee is not responding to the surgery that he had again with that reported tournament discus he's last year they cut my favorite player nat bear he and then resigned after putting ola on the reserve so that could happen guys not only. Do you think that will happen. But what was your reaction. When it did happen brian. We'll start with you. My first reaction was thank goodness because as you don't need you don't need this guy and if you wanted to keep our skipper you wanted to keep up illicit gilbert the third you had to make some cuts here and there and they really didn't need to have six wide receivers if one of them was not going to be a specialist like holding or spencer really the the only reason to keep that sixth when they did in the past was to have darius hayward bay hayward bay so that's exactly what they would have been doing with that six. It's not necessarily he's almost a clone of what you have. In ryan switzerland ryan switzerland the guy that <hes> ben rothlisberger has poor with and keep in mind rogers rogers had a lot of drops before in two thousand seventeen. He was absolutely dreadful. He was coming on before he got got hurt at the end but this this is a guy that that really didn't need at this point for everything you have you if he would have made the team. Why would have you been giving him a hat hat on sundays. He would have been a guy that would have been scratched in on dave's article about the seven that are sitting football is finally back and nothing adds to the excitement of watching that first game like having a shot at a million dollars draft kings the leader in one day fantasy football is celebrating the start of the season. He's in with an extra special week. One contest new users can sign up today and get a free shot at the one million dollar grand prize just by using code espy nation nation. Here's what you do download the draftkings app use that code s._p. Nation draft six players from the opening thursday night showdown between chicago and green bay. Hey and then dir draft kings single-game showdown contests with two and a half million dollars in total prizes already draftkings user. You can get in on the action action to for a limited time. Both new and existing users can get a deposit bonus up to five hundred dollars. Don't forget download the draftkings app and use code s._p. Nation for your free shot at one million dollars. Only draftkings make it rain minimum five dollar deposit required deposit bonus requires a twenty five times playthrough through eligibility restrictions apply see draftkings dot com for details <music> debut thoughts when eli rogers was not on the team. That was something i did text to you and brian is we are trying to figure out when we were gonna go on the show. Which you mentioned is that he would be the guy that would that would be the easiest to bring back if they had someone that needed to go on the i are designated to say disney return but they don't have to designate them anymore. The only thing you have to do is just keep on the roster for one day and then you know back back in the day you had to say which was when he went on the i. r. They don't make do that anymore. You could have three guys all their available and then decide god. I think they're allowed to now. I'm pretty sure but you don't have to designate them ahead of time but they still call it designated to return because they haven't come up with a better way to describe it but if there was someone like that that the steelers haven't been talking about a lot of people were saying oh la. I don't know that he's out that long but actually he could they think about it because they carry the ten linebackers it could be him because if they if it was if it was a linebacker that bring in a wide receiver they're right back to their typical numbers numbers of you know ten linebackers -fensive backs or sorry nine linebackers tend to fence back sixty offensive lineman blah blah blah straight up down what has been for a couple of years so that's the biggest thing with rogers but that's just someone who could be that player but it doesn't mean that he's going to be that player because i still don't know that he's their best option at wide side receiver to bring back if they wanna bring somebody back yeah. It's it's interesting to see what will happen. A lot of people like this is the end for duck duck duck dynasty devlin. Hodges is no longer there <hes> i'll tell you what let's go through some questions and we can sit here and talk about specific players gerald hawkins. I just wanna say quick statement about him. If you didn't hear the offense to tackle was traded to tampa bay buccaneers and it was for twenty twenty one six round draft pick whereas the buccaneers get the steelers seventh round pick and hawkins and i was really ticked off when i saw that ed bouchette now the athletic on twitter road it's in twenty owning twenty one why even bother because in twenty twenty one twenty twenty twenty twenty one sits round pick is the sixth round pick in that round. Pick a turn into trey bait in a trade for someone someone else dave does this better than anybody 'cause. He goes back and figures out this from this trade it turned into this and that and the other you can acquire picks that you take this guy. I was gonna get cut getting anything for a player that was going to get cut and get. Nothing is a bonus for me so even if it's two years down the road. It's a good trade. The steelers elizabeth smart kudos for them. Now here's a question for with the super chat feature dollar ninety nine from colton. He said is shady. Talking about leshan mccoy and option in the answer is no his contract which unless the he's released that he i believe so that's that's a hefty number. I think he's getting paid. That's why he's not with the bills anymore. I don't think they need him either guys. Do you agree or disagree. I i really don't see a reason to bring him in <hes> if he clears waivers and it's a veteran minimum thing and you think that it <hes> he can give you some better action than benny snow junior <hes> if if you really hate the upside with bs j then you know maybe but i i really <hes> they stay away from guys like that. At this point eight yen not enough upside for the cost let alone if they even had the room to do it so it's just they don't really need that. I'd sandals a show that he is a viable able backup. I mean i know we're not all all impressed with benny snell junior yet but he'll be there on special teams and i just i think it's going to be the conor. Samuel show shock well. You gotta think benny's now has to get a helmet right. You're not going to roll into a game which is running. They always go with three. They always go three okay. So if you have questions fire away in the live chat you can obviously use the super chat feature if you wanna mention that earlier <hes> but let's here we've got. That's a question is coming and how impactful this is. Mike d guys think <hes> receiving core will be good question to go with brian. I well we know oh how good juju smith schuster could be and i really feel that he is now wha- wide receiver as he meters that's just me now. I can't hear a d._v._d. Sorry muted myself you <music>. Though i think he earned try it is not brian. I don't think it's an internet connection. I think it might be a wired connection with his advance because he was kind of cutting in and out he might want to check for that okay. I don't know if you can hear we can hear you. I can hear you. I'm sorry i didn't know i was cutting out. Am i okay good all right back to do apologize well. Here's here's the thing washington we know what schuster can do as a wide receiver one and then you go ahead and have james washington who did not just catch passes from his college quarterback. He passes from dobbs. I'm not sure if he cut anything from hodges but as far ars everything goes. I was really excited about what james washington washington can do moncrieff. We haven't seen much of it yet but we're going to see it in the regular season. The johnsons going to do you some stuff too so the guys on the back end number five with ryan switzer or whoever may be johnson doesn't get a hat every week but oh you do have a pretty good core there so i'm happy dave in terms of wide receiver core going into two thousand nineteen all right well. It's going to be real interesting and i'm going to. I have an article out about breaking down some stuff with with with with who they kept and everything. I think the biggest thing is it's so surprising that they're going with five. If that didn't clink deontay johnson would be ready to be active the first week and if they're going with five. They've got to have them all active so that's why i'm wondering we could be doing this whole big discussion right now and there might be that there's that person that's going on the i. R. to bring the other receiver because going either they're sure deontay johnson alright to guy 'cause 'cause they five for when i go five wide for the most part i mean it's been very rare that they haven't done that and that's just because of the injury but if one guy gets injured or anything like that then they're really going to have to that's where they're going to be thin right now. Maybe fin- very versatile with this group. I like versatility. Juju can line up in the slot. Several guys can play outside. Do you think about deontay johnson right right now. Everyone kind of has there. They're worried on the season starts and they start rolling. It's gonna be fine. Here's a two dollar tip from snowman's. You surprised about dirty red. He's talking about tower medicare <unk> making the team brian. What do you think i wasn't surprised personally belieber. You not surprised at all. He's one of the best special teams in the league and they valued him dave. I'm not surprised either even though i was i was desperately doing everything that i could to get skipper for in grants again gilbert on the roster and i was trying to find a cut somewhere was it receiver with an offensive line with defensive line with safety and audibly said let's just cut into the linebacker and i said they'll do something crazy like cut dirty read that no one you know. Some people wanted but didn't think what people expect it. I'm not surprised that's not what they did. I'm not surprised at all that it was somewhere else because they value but the question is. I'm pretty sure with these young young guys. He's going to obviously be out there for special. Teams early on the questions going to be by the end of the season to these guys show so much upside that he's the guy not getting a helmet on game hyundai as possible. It's really possible i. I knew it was gonna make the team news going to make the team. They like him for of bunch of different reasons so the team. Here's a question between now and the start of the season. If you were to say ten very likely one one not likely at all. What's your number for the steelers making a trade or picking up another player off waivers. Dave will start with you so ten. It's navon one not going to happen. Where are you following on that trail. I'll go eight and a half okay. Are you likely i think it'll be tight tight end. Some people thought it would be safety. I don't think it would be safety because they basically have their choice between dangerfield or someone who wasn't really we haven't talked about yet that was cut of marcus allen yeah that they they had their choice between the two of them and unless he gets picked up i see marcus allen on the practice squad and i think i don't think they'll be picked up. I think that's where he'll be so i think tight end is the biggest need. The question is if they can find the right fit for the right price. That's the only reason it's not a ten okay bryan. I'd say about a two. I really don't know i mean i'd love to see a guy like cameron. Break come into here. I mean look he. He's a pass catching tight end too so i really don't see them giving up way too much. I think they have some ideas with samuel's with <hes> with szucs even though like like we said he's not a pass catching tight end but i think they're they're going to use versatility of the roster now and not give up way too much. They've given up three next year even if they get the three back from the lady on bell levy levy libya on bell leaving still a third round pick. I don't think they want to give up too much more the question we always have to remember. How are they going to pay him whoever they bring in whether it's a safety tight end three-point whatever or four million dollars cap spaces not gonna get you much and so you you can talk about all these players that are being released not only if they're waved and you put in a claim for them or you're not guaranteed to get them that at the same time you have to pay their salary when you pick them up and so unless they get a deal joe haden which is still a possibility. We talked about this on the post game show but we talked about it in the preview thursday night other. It's still the possibility. I still don't think that doesn't happen. I don't think they can afford to make any moves to keep that in the back of your mind as well now. We have a few questions here. I wanna get gets you before we get to that. The dave decastro autograph football that we are giving away for free <hes> dave you lift give live the you can get this football for free but dave there's only four th league now so we could have upwards of four hundred people vying for this one autographed football that we are giving away for free. Ed mentioned that it's free you have to do nothing. There's only what how many twenty spots left he said no. I wanted to go in and double check again. We said we were going to cut it offer four o'clock. We're gonna fill that league. There's ten spots left holy moly. That's it. There's ninety people in the league. There's ten spots so if the last ten people to grab problem. That's your spot. I don't even know if there's a way i could close it out. I mean i think i i could figure it out but i don't really i don't really care it would be great really great to fill that out so this is a point where it's not guaranteed to be a spot left anymore. Once we hit that four o'clock if we'd have followed it up before four o'clock we started the next one and then cut it off not now we will fill up this one. That'll be it that will make it officially three hundred ninety seven contestants because i'm in there four times which just because i set them up and that's that'll be worth three eighty seven right now so then spots get in there and spots the the they're still article on the page zhou publish it yesterday. I had to slow down a little bit yeah so i'm in yeah. I'm in the second league yeah. Which one are you in brian. I'm in number three number. Three sedan and i know dave is going to go ahead and give the football away when he wins it but he's not going to win. It and i'm keeping it because i'm not gonna win it. I'm going out week one. I would say what my pick is now. I don't know if you guys really want me a tour not steelers the steelers new england yeah no. You're close new england over pittsburgh. I'm going to england because you know align knocked out of the league. I don't care because the steelers just vanished from the get out of you know that it. It's a it's a it's a trying to take some sort of joy out of a bad situation moment that i could say at least i'm still in the survivor but <hes> i just want to watch it. I wanna watch survivor lake so please please please please let me get knocked out week one. That's what i want to see it. <hes> roth in the live chat said how do we join. There is a blink but you'd go to the website behind the curtain dot com. You have to scroll down about halfway down the page. You'll see an article that says sign up in. There's all the details and all the links you need to do that. There's a link it's right there. You just as long as you have you click on it. It has all the information and password there used to be signed in and you join comment real quick sure brian. This is awesome what we do. I'm going to toot our own horns because here. I don't see people giving away stuff. We've given up a given a jew jew jersey away. We've given up tickets for a game. This is something that you know. We talk about with a tip jar. This helps go towards that and that's exactly what it does. It's not for the three of us to go to arby's party together together. It's for us to go ahead and add extra value to you so this is one thing it's fun. We get to do all this bragging rights. I can't wait to see people well <hes> yo bust on people for their pick being gone but i just love the fact that we have a community here and we're giving stuff back to what what is it arby's. Veasley would be worth a party. That's what i want to know. When you beef instead or your partying all night long. My friend arby's got its name for connecticut bees. Really the arby's arby's was three was founded by the raffle brothers r. r._e._i. F._m. It is through our b. r. b. It's like wait for rosebed okay but it is for her. It's for the raffle awful brothers. Yes i like better. I like the fact that i'm right. Here's a good question here from ron. He's guys is this. It's the deaths linebacker offense of line depth. We've had an ears day bryant. Let's go to brian. I mean let's say since two thousand ten yeah probably really dave offensive line depth. I'm gonna say yes because i think you're going to have guys. That aren't getting a helmet. I'm at that could possibly be quality enough to start on other teams. When it comes to linebacker i'm going to say potentially because of i mean look between between gilbert between skipper between ola. You have a combined nine defensive offensive snaps in the n._f._l. So out of three of your seven guys in a linebacker. I mean regular seasons naps. That's what you have so there it. They're very unproven. They're very young but man you gotta. You gotta love what they've chunk of our okay. We had a question. I'm not sure who that was. It asked the dave you would know the answer to this and that is <hes>. What is the give everyone the rundown for the practice squad. It is sunday at noon. Fed the teams. You can start to sign players to the practice. Yes even players that were released early like yesterday. They just compile them altogether. I think from basically after the game thursday night three or four o'clock today they put them on the same level so people wouldn't be coming off at different times. They clear wait. They have until noon on sunday for teams to make a waiver claim claim on those on those players. I don't know if there's any lag in there that the that the players have to be notified that they could be signed on the practice squad but but i do know that teens have until noon tomorrow to make the claim so it'll be sometime after that that you'll see players have already announced that that <hes> that they're projected to go onto the practice squad if they're not claimed i can lift off a couple of them. <hes> it was spencer and mondo madhu mom and i'm pretty sure one of the offensive lineman i was surprised when i saw who it was half a half hour or so it was one it was one of those guys that that was a potential practice squad guy that they had said something about but i was surprised but that came out right before each sprayer hoskins yeah that was that was before the whole gerald hawkins thing so i don't know that one that one i'm not a hundred percent sure about if he was actually one of those but but the other guys yeah they've already talked about. They have to not be claimed. I right okay. I saw it in the live chat. I wanna put it up on the screen and i think this is a good way to end. The show. Michael says it sunday night football ball yet. I'm getting impatient. Yes this is the time it's after sunday. The practice squad is done. The roster is if you might have a couple of moving pieces still but really this is the team. This is a team. That's going to be going into foxborough on sunday night football in just about a week weeks time to see what they're really made of and this is ashley get to talk about game really counts so let me quickly run down. What's gonna happen here. In the next few days <hes> in terms of content so first and foremost tomorrow tomorrow there will be a show. It might just be myself but i'm probably going to do a show. <hes> that's kinda q. natio- maybe it'll be after probably maybe after they've announced their their practice squads will probably talk about that monday. The hangover will be on with brian. Tony <hes> tuesday will be the stack wednesday it will be the standard is a standard thursday will be the preview friday will probably be. I said it saturday will be probably myself or someone else doing q rene show and then sunday will be post game show after the steelers and the patriots go head to head on primetime so we have a live coming <hes> but before we go steal fifty it gives us twenty bucks. We appreciate that he says do we feel comfortable with our secondary this year. That's a really good question. What do you think dave yes. I mean i i like. I feel better about art burns this year than last year and i just was how he's playing and i feel even better knowing that he's not going out there to start week one that that he's in a much better place for that so i like the depth there i also like the depth of of these guys like mike hilton. I'm at a camp sudden that could also go back and play safety. I like that as long as everything's fine with sean davis cam kelly is a nice addition. He's he's got a lot of work in this this preseason through training camp and everything that that he's going to be quality there but i like that he doesn't have to start so that's that's one thing i really like and i will say this. I'm gonna go on record unless something crazy happens if he's not if there wasn't a problem with him injury wise and he's actually they're a practicing. You're looking at just lane as you're not getting a helmet secondary guy every week. Okay what about you brian. He liked the secondary very cautiously optimistic. You know injuries could derail everything in a heartbeat. If that happens then you're scratching your head. You're back to already burns but the wildcard he'd never really a wild card the guy that i'm really excited about that really changes everything steven nelson. I think that is going to prove to be a fantastic pickup. I like like the safeties. I love at men's jumped from year one to year two so far. I think he's still working progress but i really think he is going to be a solid ten year player for this team. Actually i'm not seeing superstore but i think he's going to be very solid back there. I like what they have but but in this league on any given sunday it could turn on a dime so right now. I'm optimistic and just remember week. One is week one and we could go back and rattled off the last week. One games at the steelers have had in the past two years which are not typically against the team of the caliber of the patriots and it's been a mixed bag of goods in regards words to the outcome last year was the tie we all remember the game or the steelers were over the beating the browns by a ridiculous marginally to have them storm back in the second half and almost when the game just understand that we as the steelers if they were to go to new england and tom brady would have success against the secondary it does not doom the secondary secondary for the entire season. They can still improve. They can still get better they can. They can still gels a team think about it. Joe haden hasn't even played yet. This preseason steven steven nelson has only played a handful of snaps in every single preseason game though he didn't even play in the first one. I don't think and you have other guys like sean. Davis who's been banged up periodically torrellas. I'm not creating excuses for them. I'm just stating that is a fan base. Let's not go over to the clementi bridge. If tom brady has success in week one it prepared a thrust yourself off it. It's just don't because the team that's in week. One is not going to be a team. That's playing week seventeen. We know this. That's fat act so understand that it's a long season. Will it be a tough loss if the steelers lose absolutely there's a lot of lingering effects in this game in terms of the a._f._c. a._f._c. positioning and the head to head win and all that stuff we'll talk about that ad nauseam this week but i just want everyone to make sure that the secondary the defense is a whole or even the offense it might take some time other teams stumbled too so let's not forget about that when you start losing your hair. There's no magical cure but there is a way to stop hair loss from happening happening. In the first place. It's called keeps answer treatment. 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One last darren ass <hes> jeff debrecen with your sunday night football plans for the game barbecue friends and family are what for me it depends on whether as goofy you can make a forty five yard field goal on friday. They had that update of course going to bring that up <hes> for me guys. I just be honest. Dame's for me are sitting in front of the t._v. With my laptop up feverishly typing for the majority joy the game and i know that brian because he does knee-jerk reaction. He's they're typing as well. Dave probably has his laptop up just in case he's ready to do work work. It's a job interrupted jeff dave. What's one spot left of the contest holy cow. We're at ninety nine. Better hurry l. How would you be tempted to start another one's. We're past the deadline tomorrow on aac we're. You're the boss jeff. We can his five hundred fans. You know what we've got. We've got one week to do it right. We can get one hundred more people it five hundred every every podcast pumps is up throughout the week. We would get out before the semi and we'll we'll get it. I haven't even talked to my my vast amount of friends in my fifty two followers so <hes> you know actually i'm up to sixty seven on. I'm really excited about now now. Here's the deal why not why not not especially with. I mean with you pull in a hammy on friday. We're going to give so much so much exposure that and every touchdown zone t you should come out. We're gonna have exposure from that. Oh t-shirt update. I forgot. I've got connected with the company. I was trying to reach out with the touchdowns in insurance happening and also if someone i've had a lot of people especially everyone here if you're on this show right now meaning dave scofield brian anthony davis as writing paid writing contributors to brian so curtain. You're going to get a free be t._s._e. Logo t shirt this year by jeff climb really disappointed. Why three x well no i don't i don't i don't know i just i just out that. All the paid paid writing contributors. They're gonna get free logo t shirts this year from the fans robert. If you're someone that's like man. I just want a behind the curtain estimation logo right there on the heart the chest you can go to the fans shop score behind the curtain dot com. You'll see is really big there. Click on it. It's got stuff from <hes>. We'll have our t. shirts up there as well so make sure the the touchdown zone shirts are happening folks. They are happening. My goal is to by the week four by week four to get their shirts in publication getting his own touchdowns ashdown's at hey. You know what we'll have to have a <hes>. We'll have to have a contest. That could be our next contest. Somebody gets the touchdown zone shirt autographed by me there. You go up the article. Okay okay so guys. <hes> go ahead. The question from darren hasn't been answered yet. I said fine dave what do you do for games anything crazy for sunday football. I i sit in my down in my steeler viewing area with the largest tv and and check the game out with with my laptop and if i get a chance it's too i sit back in my millennium falcon beanbag chair and and just just enjoy it and i dress up with the exception of the mask i wear everything but the mask ask that i that i wear to the game when even watching at home well. Here's a here's a question. Are you both superstitious in regards to jerseys. There's he's worn clothing. Warn seat see where you said. <hes> brian a superstitious. I know you're superstitious. I don't know how there's leveling. There's different degrees degrees of it. You know what i used to sit in the same spot but since i lost my <hes> steeler basement for because of a flood on the opener like when cleveland pittsburgh tying everything was going bad the my house started flooding so <hes> i don't have the i don't have the official beady touchdown zone back yet we we used to go to steelers central but i'm changing it but what i do is i typically wear the jersey. I have a lot of jerseys because that's kind kind of something i do. I get more every year. In fact my rosy mixtures he is on its way my ramon foster jerseys on its way so i'm pretty excited for that. But what i do is i if they're wearing colorized. I have to wear color rush. If they're wearing home white black i have to wear the same that they're wearing. That's pretty much which the extent of what i do now okay. What about you dave superstitious. Maybe sometimes just a mess with people. I mean i mean i. I've i've mentioned before that we that <hes> through the with the steelers touchdown run beat the sea hawks that that was thanks to the people that i watched the games games with because we were we have figured out who was holding the football at the proper time and like we said we had to throw it during kickoffs and punts and had to be in the air at the right time and because we figured it out the steelers won but honestly i really. I really don't i if someone changes a jersey during the game. The steelers start to do bad. We'll give them a hard time and say you can't change. During is your jersey during a game. It's your fault and stuff like that but i mean it's fun and i do it but at the same time i know me sitting at my house estate away. It has nothing to do with what the steelers doing on the field but it's fun to think that this is it gives ten bucks in the tip. Jerry says i'll be sitting fifty feet high on a drilling rig listening to the game might i'd be tempted to jump if john don't does down week one and for those that might be in the live chat for the first time when we talked about isaac with his comment at the beginning you gotta you gotta understand that we love isaac. Isaac is donated the juju smith schuster jersey that we gave away so when we said that the isaac like come on good man it wasn't a problem we trust me. We don't have brown with isaac is explained. Thank you isaac. Please don't jump now. This is a family. We <hes> we you bust ask we bust on you. Trust me bust on each other. That's why there's a forty five year old anyways. That's what i was gonna say hanwha wealth and risk injury in order to try to kick off field goal for me in terms of superstition nine o'brien noses says i always wear whatever jersey like. He said that they they wear saved. Colorado drive put on the color russia's brian suv graciously gave me <hes> although although i had to change it at one point and it was year whereas those a year where i was actually selling my house it's i was living my mother-in-law's house and i didn't have my jerseys accessible astle to me side where a steelers t-shirt turns out. I couldn't wear a black steelers t-shirt because they would always lose. It had to be a yellow one or a grey one jerseys dag. My brother got me a pair of steelers zuber's talking zuma's. I'm really thinking about because my wife hates them. I won't even want me to wear them around the house <hes> so i'm thinking about wearing those things every game and to the grocery store everywhere shohei but a for go yeah. You already talked about so for me. That's probably what i'll end. I don't know what i'll do. I just have a jersey guy anyone that is me. I have one jersey ben rothlisberger all my jerseys jerseys away home throwback color rush. They're all number seven. That is david our talking about this earlier so that number two he said. What do we have to wait for his mason rudolph when the backup job. What are we waiting for and i said he's got to play in a regular season game and he's got to play well. I'm not talking allow. Josh dobbs throwing one pass baltimore for a first down and coming off the field. I'm talking about ben gets dinged up. He's got an ankle injury. Macy's the guy if he goes out wednesday hey brian. I'm calling you saying that gives dave would you would you pull the trigger earlier than that. I don't know it's a little bit because i think i don't know i mean honestly if you were saying let's do it. I'd be like yes. We're we're both going to do it and we would both debut them at the same time on the same podcast so if you said yes i'd be in but i also understand your get your hesitation because i have a couple more jerseys than you do not i. I probably only have ten percent of what brian does but <hes> yeah. I think i have five so it would it. I'm i'm really picky with as well. It's tough and i get that. I know that i have not unveiled yet and if i'm waiting for the the right time but i bought a pair of you from the steelers a used pair of b._j. Fini's i have a picture of them big picture. I'm thinking this is a three hundred twenty pound man. This is a big guy and he's huge. I'm thinking me though the fitness that was thirty pounds go. I dropped thirty pounds cents so i'm hoping to get them out and start wearing them and the noth- looking lewd because i've guests over as long as you're going to wait for the games. Oh that's why i bought them. I wanna wear. I am not going to your house for games. I wanna see anywhere near this. It's amazing amazing. I mean smaller than what i mean. I weigh a lot less than b._j. Finney does even when i was bigger and here's the thing i don't know how they like fit into them. I mean like women that went out in the nineties on on friday night to go to the singles bars the these are tighter than what they wore loose fitting clothes. You know so i mean but i maybe we'll put the picture up one of these days on the site no ryan it's wearing the b._j. Vinnie pants to to the field goal kick off in order to make this happen if i've got a kick i've got kicked a field goal live on live. Streaming brian's got to be there in the pants and jenner's. Here's the jeff to be advance. I'll wear my youtube if i find them and that's just because everything's still pack. We're still going through through stuff. I will diligently look for him. I'll be glad to wear the fini's income my gosh this friday could be legendary or absolutely crap. Test is eddie your break the blog site that could make or break dave. That's that's that's. My wife says she's like you're going to be so broken. They might be living in one of our one of our basement so thinking all right so we. We've gone a lot longer than i thought we would for this show but it's been a roster again yeah where does because there are a lot of people that are just trying into the show and they're like oh. I you know i don't know what he was doing under a rock. He's asking all these questions about who's made the team for crying out loud though look online so here's the thing <hes> eroticas out ryan switzer. Sir in twos are skipper ulysses gilbert in al marcus allen and <hes>. I'm trying to think who else on on the defense would be the out that we were expecting to possibly make it sutton smith smith derwin gray out of the usual cassock urges. I think i told david other day. There's five people that you really looking for to see if they make the team or not. Everyone else was expected. <hes> it was early traded gerald hawkins treated to the buccaneers for a ham sandwich and a sixth round draft pick in twenty twenty one draft still yeah yeah so the help help <hes> so good show guys everyone that didn't alive chevy had upwards of two hundred fifty people at one point then we started talking about other stuff and <hes> so you look you guys have content. I love this. I love this space. I should say no. It's only you guys doing the show together because it's awesome but i love the space as the live chad like we talked about isaac and bow. These guys are regulars severe just now first time ever tuning in every single time that we go live. If you are subscribed a two hour channel you will get a notification that we're going live so you don't miss a show and that's the best thing i can tell you to go to dot com search b._t. S._e. steelers radio. You'll find all our videos. They're subscribe. If you'd like our videos. It sounds so dumb it helps us with our exposure helps the site grow and helps our channel grow and and if you're wanting to listen on audio platform whether it's you know you're on the treadmill. You're on your commute to work. You can find anywhere you find podcast search steelers. There's or behind the steel curtain subscribed there and you won't ever miss a show. That's it. We appreciate it so as brian. Anthony davis arnesen m._s._a. Variety there's looking at bryant has lance. Williams always says remember tune-in. Tell a friend and subscribe go ahead. Ryan said you just countless down. I'm just <hes> that's that's what i've adding to one two and get the third one out area from wayne of radio in three why did you why did you hear what all right thanks for watching. We'll see everyone next week for one of our shows. This is a special so sia.

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123 - The Most Important American You've Never Heard Of, What is a Colour Revolution, and what is Sedition

Republic Keeper - with Brian O'Kelly

56:08 min | 8 months ago

123 - The Most Important American You've Never Heard Of, What is a Colour Revolution, and what is Sedition

"And Welcome very public uber broadcast. My name is Brian Kelly I will be your host for today's program. Broadcasting from the forest here in Cottage Lake Washington. Wow. This podcast number. Twenty three On twitter parlor facebook Brian Your Bro and at the Republican Dot Com website. For All, the social media connections and more, and let's see if I can figure out why the. I guess it's working fine. It just looks weird on my screen I don't know what's going on here. That's really A. Very strange kind of experienced the way this is displaying all of a sudden I thought a everything set up right hopefully, it's going out on the Stream and you can hear me let's open the broadcast like we always do by thanking God for good health. And the ability be here sharing with you and thanks again for your time. And attention today. Today's broadcast is going to be I hope not boring and I'm actually have been fascinated researching this topic. This is the most important man. In America that you've never heard of. As or we're going to talk about today and. We Are I. Believe in the midst of an attempt to overthrow government as I've you know explained and you know whether or not that attempt is large and serious and or it's a Just a right wing fever. Thing that we shouldn't worry about I guess we'll wait to see but I'm going to share some information with you today that May. Help you perspective around that. Okay. So that's what the what the topic is. Today who the most American you've never heard of, and what it means in terms of the protests were on our streets, what it's meant around the world and I hope that you are is interested in this. As I have been in researching it so. Let. Me Introduce our. Main character today. He was born in one, thousand, nine, hundred, twenty, eight. Died in two thousand? Eighteen. he was the founder of the Albert Einstein Institution a nonprofit organization dedicated to advancing the study of nonviolent action. was professor of Political Science at the University of Massachusetts Dartmouth. And he was at. Harvard for thirty years as a political scientist. So. This man was nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize in two thousand fifteen. He'd been nominated a three times prior in two, thousand, nine, two, thousand, twelve, and two, thousand, thirteen, and really. Apparently, he was considered the favourite for the two thousand and twelve award. which he didn't receive. Hagan born in Nineteen Twenty eight received his Bachelor of Arts in Social Sciences in nineteen, forty, nine from Ohio states are twenty one. And he received his master's in sociology two years later also from Ohio state. came. Sky was jailed for nine months after protested the. KOREAN WAR DRAFT Okay he? went to jail for nine months and he discussed his decision to go to prison. In his letters to Albert Einstein. and. Then he later wrote a forward Are wrote a book on Gandhi. An Einstein wrote the foreword for this Guy's book. So who is right? He worked as a factory. Labor. He was a guide to a blind social worker. And he was a secretary to Aj musty, the America's leading pacifist at the time. So, let's kick gone. CVS can think of it between nine, hundred, fifty, five and fifty eight. He was the editor of Peace News in London. Weekly Pacifists newspaper where he helped organize the nineteen, fifty, eight Aldermaston March. So. This guy's name is gene sharp. He's the most important, American you've never heard of. You studied then in Oslo. With a couple of guys and they drew extensively from what was called the Saatchi I'm probably don't pronounce this right such in such Agra such ig Gras something. Garages norms. which are these writings and they were the nonviolent norms of action. Okay in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty got his doctorate from Oxford. His funding, this is where it starts to get. Really interesting. Guess who has started paying for this guy right around this time as he was researching all this stuff. You and I if you're a US taxpayer because his funding came from Darpa. The Defense Advanced Research Projects Association. Or advances research projects administration or wherever the agency. It's part of the Dod so our Defense Department. Was Funding this guy's research into non-violent action? Came So he got his doctorate right and that means we need to do a doctorate, you write a thesis and the thesis then turned into a book called the politics of nonviolent action. Based on his thesis through volume are classic. and. The theme is of his work is basically this, and this is why this is so important the theme of. Sharp's work is that power is. Not Monolithic. The theme of Sharp's work is that power derives. From doesn't drive from some intrinsic quality of those in power in other words. If you're the strongman dictator in some countries, it's because you're actually stronger than all the men. Not some intrinsic quality in you shirt believed and I think rightly that political power, the power of any state regardless of its particular structure organization ultimately derives from the subjects of the state. His fundamental belief is that any power structure relies upon the subject's obedience to the orders of the rulers if subjects don't obey. Rulers have no power. Okay Zana's sound familiar. If you remember the declaration of Independence, right we hold these truths to be self evident. That all men are endowed certain inalienable rights, right and the that the governments are by the consent of the govern. And when in such times. As, those governments cease to serve the interest. Then those governments should be destroyed, right? That's basically what the the. Decoration. Independent says. So, sharp identified is this idea that. This was a hidden structure. That really the whole power structure of authoritarian governments was a house of cards that if the people just wanted to, they could take it out in a minute. They just had to know that they could and be empowered to do that. Okay and he basically sites the insight of this guy who was a French philosopher and again, I'm not so great at the French pronunciations but I think it's Ettienne de la boy boy ta Ta I duNNo. Both E. B. O. E. TI at Ta I, think I don't know you guys can speak French. Julian. Maybe if you're out there, you can call me up and tell me if I've got it right. But Anyway, this guy, he was a French of social philosopher and he said and I think he very interesting. He said in a work he did called a discourse on voluntary servitude. He said that the great mystery of politics was obedience to rulers. Why in the world do people agree to be looted and otherwise oppressed? By government older overlords. Is What this guy wanted to know. He said it's not just fear. For our consent. Is Required. And that consent he said can be non violently withdrawn. Well. That makes all kinds of sense. Right. So this guy gene sharp has gone on they've called him the Machiavelli of nonviolence. And the Clough Switz- of nonviolent warfare will clausewitz. What's who is Clausewitz? Bond Clausewitz was an Austrian oppression general and I believe is still if you go to Virginia Military Academy or any of the or. I believe at West Point they hand you a copy of von Clausewitz on war. He still considered be one of the premier. Generals. And between his strategy and son, you really have most of what you would need. From a strategic standpoint but anyway, so he's been called the Clausewitz of nonviolent or. It's been claimed my some that sharp scholarship has influenced resistance organizations around the world and of course, That's true although I don't think that was his intention he from what I've seen of him and I'm going to have some video from him here a minute. Seemed to be guy who has a bent on overturning dictatorships So his Handbook he wrote nine hundred, ninety, three year and a handbook called from dictatorship to democracy. and. This thing has been translated into thirty one languages. and has been the basis for. Outpour. Campaign. And Serbia and we're going to see. Exactly this is about here in a few minutes years see the connection to what's happening in the US today. Although I don't think that would been sharps intention. So let's jump right into my first piece of content from gene sharp and. Here. Is Him talking about the idea of non violence not necessarily meaning? Passivity. But first let's China conversation I had recently with gene shop president of the Albert Einstein Institution. He's also program director of the program on nonviolent sanctions at the center of International Affairs at Harvard University. Gene let me ask you a very simple question the beginning what is the The Tumb what does it nonviolent really mean Well it means a lot of different things to different people. And that's one reason I tried not to use the term non violence which. is so commonly used because it may mean to somebody passivity and submission. It may mean religious or ethical pacifism does someone else It may mean militant struggled with somebody else. So I, usually talk about non violent action or nonviolent struggle particularly nonviolent struggle to indicate. that. This is a way of conducting conflicts. Accu- conflicts. Precisely those where people might otherwise violence. And so the idea that he's putting forward is that. You're not passive. You're definitely on an aggressive posture and your. Using, what power you have and of course, he studied Gandhi right and so the idea here is that. It's true. The studies have shown that these non violent things like sit INS and so on. Are Tremendously effective and they don't. Come under the guise of. Violence, but they're not passive either. So I understand why he doesn't want to call them pacifism or pacifism because even though they're peaceful, they're not a passive in any way here is the next. Thing from him and he talks about the idea that it's about us being stubborn and I like this a lot. So it's Like negotiations are conciliation tall. It's another way of fighting. It's a conscious non violent action it may be conscious and increasingly it is. But it may not be consciously choose and all the time Over violence. It derives I I think from Will not turn turning the other cheek and the sermon on the Mount Mentor from. Ghandi's ethic. So forth I think it derives basically from a much more common human capacity, the capacity to be stubborn and custard. So What he's basically saying is if you really are committed to an idea. No one can make you change what you're doing. You know, for example. You know the people who get burned at the stake. Or got burned at the stake or or thrown to the lions back in the day. For their. Faith. Those are people who there was no amount of external pressure that was going to change what they did and they didn't have to be violent in keeping to their convictions and what he's saying is that if enough people just resist it just don't do anything that that will be. Sufficient to bring about the kind of pressure needed to make those changes that are being requested if that makes sense. So. Here, he says talks about exerting control and taking action not in terms of nonviolent struggle but not struggled really is the social political economic application of human cussedness and stubbornness. In other words I have the courage the sticky heels in and say, no further. That's that's right or that we're going to take charge of around lives or we're going to try to exert control and we're trying to take action. Right and taking action is where this thing has started to go off the rails and so we'll have one more last. Tomorrow from him one these by the way, these interviews from nineteen eighty-seven and so This is kind of the foundation of what has been laid in the resistance movement and this overthrow of government movement around the world. I'm going to share some more of that with you what the result of this has been, and Y it looks like well, that's what they're trying to do here So this is foundational and hopefully it's not. Super. Boring. Here's. One more from gene sharp. Is that coming from a greater realization now that. We as individuals can have more of a say in our own lives. That's not a generalized realization I. think There are a lot of people. In our society and many other parts of the world thinks they have very little or no say. So, if they're going to realize, they have a say in their own lives, there must be an origin of that feeling. they really are learning experience the capacity to do so. And nonviolent struggle is one of the ways that people have learned that they can wield power. They can shape their lives and futures. So nonviolent struggle you know meaning things like sit INS and so on and even these street demonstrations that we're having here would be I think Probably legit under that headline of nonviolent struggle as long as people don't our. And loot and but there's a tactic shift that happened beyond the good doctor here and so one more from Dr Sharp he his. Most famous and probably most important book was this one dictatorship to democracy in one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, three, and it made its way into Russia where it was, of course, denounced by the regime and the actually book burnings of it and a bookshop, and he's talking about that here. This is when he is I don't know when this interview was, but he was quite old. He died at ninety years old two years ago in two, thousand eighteen. He rest in peace and here is. Gene Sharp. We had no. Comdex in. Some our other from ship. To Democracy. In. This new translation. grinned. Shop. In Moscow. Being, printed while the prisoners were. Operating. The FSB raided the print shop. Be a new version of the KGB. And he looks at this point. On the press. You ordered the purses to stop. And denounced the publication he says. Book is a bomb. Not Book is a bomb and There was a Polish lawmaker who In two thousand four who was giving a radio interview and they asked him what the if he wanted to overthrow a state. WHAT WEAPON WOULD HE CHOOSE And he said that he would choose that book dictatorship to democracy he would rather have that than a nuclear weapon. Every is going to overthrow state. So that has now been used in that way to overthrow several states. And believe that they're trying to use the same tactics here, I. Don't think they're going to succeed because if I can it out I, think other people can to and certainly the trump administration has smarter people than me. Around on their team I at least I hope so so. I'm GonNa take a quick break and when I come back, we'll show you some of the places where these tactics have been employed and what the results of those have been. So thanks again for your time and attention I will be back shortly and. We'll talk a little bit more about this kind of stuff. Back. Home I'll something to be proud of home safe. Or the protection family home. I was appointed Afghanstan. I. Was on patrol March Twenty, six, two, thousand, ten during a dismounted patrol I happen to step in the wrong spot and took a sniper round into the chest. This is the date opposite. I lost my legs almost immediately lost my. Colleagues. My arm was gone. So I closed my eyes thinking to myself. If I just keep breathing I will make it home to my wife. I just wanted to serve my country every day I'm still adapting to this new life. It was hard having everybody change your lifestyle take remain it's a book home doesn't feel like home to me. They have to carry my chair of the stairs harnessing my life is to have to call my Children to help pick off the bathroom floor. Where do you go with whom the home anymore? They're a one thousand families that need our help talented Tau sonning those heroes that risked their lives by providing them with more these free. Yes. On the waiting list to have bill, it's going to be amazing to smart home technology. It makes life a whole lot easier. Hundred. percent. Accessible Built fit my news for me to gain independence anyone. Just amazing able to just take care of myself as an individual this home. Allowing to be self-sufficient that'll hold me live my life. It gives me back some of my dignity. who used to be there is a waiting list for houses. The waiting list. There are a lot of people. There are a lot of guys like me out there maybe too many gives you back your dignity, your pride yourself perseverance. Thanks to office hours I'm going to have. All these McNamee Safety Dignity. Family. Independence Conference USA American dream isn't it. Like actually contribute eleven, dollars mark support their efforts pleased as the towel of Donald. and. Walk back to Republican podcast. My name is Brian. Kelly. Thanks for joining. If you're new to the show somebody shared it with you on facebook. Whatever and YouTube twitter wherever you're seeing it and. or The podcast new the show just to let you know how it works. This is listener supported only. Kind of the only game in town here in terms of the staff looking at all of it if you're. On the livestream and? in terms of the funding for the show either comes out of my wallet or out of Listener Donations and. Doesn't cost a lot to do, but it costs a little bit and Of course, we had more we would do more with it and. There is a need for that. So I, I just WANNA throw it out there. I asked listeners to do three things for me. Basically First one is pray for me and that's a free to you but valuable to me. And you know we need wisdom I need inside any balance I need energy need all the things you need to do this well, and keep the rest of life humming along and. It's not easy, but it's worth it. I believe and the second thing is share this content of you if you're finding it useful and valuable and educational. Text it to somebody you know the device you're listening on right now probably has a share button couldn't share the content whatever it is you know an and also reviews matter. So throw that out there, and then the last thing of course is the financial support visit the Patriot link and On the website or you just go to Patriot Dot com slash republic keeper and you'll find the info there so. That's g sharp and gene sharp is kind of the guy who became the father of what has been known as color revolutions. Okay and you guys may have heard of color revolutions and what these have been is things like There was a the first one and let's just get the first one. We'll talk about more of them and I'll show you what the first one was and I remember this vividly for those us guys weren't even born this was one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, six this was the year that I was married and Ferdinand Marcos. Was the dictator. And I guess elected dictator for life in the Philippines and they were having an election and the world had been the attention have been called the fact that there weren't fair elections and they were committed to the first real fair elections ever and the color was yellow. Ferdinand Marcos the incumbent directing his drive for reelection from Malaysian Young Palace the Philippine version of the white. House at rallies. He rarely comes in direct contact with his supporters desiring instead to rely on his oratorical skills which are quite adequate. Corazon Aquino on the other hand is a people's candidate seemingly comfortable working the crowds she certainly not an electrifying speaker, but her sincerity is openly evident. Her motorcades were familiar side as they crossed this nation. Mrs. Aquino or Korea she is called seems rather unlikely person for this sort of thing she has however continued to pound away on one point throughout the campaign. Is, Mr.. Marcus himself and twenty years of Marcos. Misrule. And the people. On positive right there the issue is Mr. Marcos himself. I just want you to hear this as a theme that goes through these things and then you hear it today is the issue as Mr Trump himself. So let continues to have a chance for a change and I suppose this is what? I appear. To offer them hope. Because I really cannot offer more than that. Great she can't offer more than that because that's all she has is hope. And in the end I, think it turned out okay. I. Don't think I. Don't remember. If she governed well or not I know that the. Thirty year anniversary of it was kind of a big deal and In the end they ended up with a democratic government there, and so that was a win right and so these color revolutions that came from gene sharp The first one that was important was the yellow revolution. That's the one in the Philippines and the next one that was significant was three years later and it was the velvet. Revolution. In the Czech Republic and so here is what that wasn't somebody re probably heard of Vaclav hovel or Vaslav Huddle. I is how they pronounced there but a lot of people look at as Cobb Hobbles Howie. Pronounce it here he was a poet. Who rose to prominence and ended up as their prime minister president he's in this video, take a look and take a listen. Prague November Seventeenth Nineteen, thousand, nine, eight after the fall of the Berlin Wall check students take to the streets. Didn't ski bottom left of the picture is among them. Twenty years later, the student has turned film director but hasn't forgotten any of it. I remember when I heard the speeches, it was very powerful feeling because I never heard people speaking. So freely in front of thousands of people you know and I could see how people were reacting and this was like totally unusual. I just remember this this this power of the crowd of the power of the crowd can be very dangerous. But. It was very liberating dissident who kept April. For years finally feel like the population is behind them fats lever fell the most famous of them. All remembers this turning point. To ME. I suddenly sense that it wasn't just any of these numerous events that preceded our revolution. mushy rather the. Snowball. frigging avalanche. Abu Lobby. No. It's the end of the day riot police tap-in and starts beating demonstrators up a move that chuck's the population and speeds up the general mobilization in the eyes of the most population dissidents. were. Is But the most was organized by students. Students were their kids you know most people I mean a lot of people have children, students I also students it sounds so innocent and this fact also brought a lot of people to station. On November twentieth an estimated half million people are in the street with the Communist. Party. is forced to relinquish power. And by the end of December that slaver villa's elected president. and. So this is basically what the plan is is they get a half a million people in the street and this wasn't the plan in this revolution in the revolution the Czech Republic. They learn something and the the learning was the Czech. Republic you have to recognize there was. Part of it was an old Soviet bloc. country. and. I remember her shoes somebody's just about Imelda. Marcos on the chat. Yeah her shoes too so So anyway. The the the Czech Republic had been an old Soviet bloc country. And under Soviet influence, there was an eastern bloc country, and so the police there had been trained in you know pretty brutal tactics. There was no, there's no bill rights. You don't get an attorney any of that kind of stuff right? It was a communist government understand. So this was before the fall of the Berlin Wall. and. So there's agitating there the you know velvet revolution as it was called was You know with the world's consent and the US's endorsement and participation. We saw this as a good thing we were toppling the communist government there and Putting in a democratically elected popular Guy Vaclav Hovel, right so this was considered to be good. And by the way where we are going to take calls later in the program I. Think there's going to be time for that today. It looks like so just be thinking about that if you want to contribute or react to you or talking about today so. The. Check Revolution was the first kind of. Step in this, but the police were brutal as you saw the video and what happened is that the people reacted to the police brutality. And as they said, it's sped up the process. They learned from that. Okay and then that tactic was employed in Serbia. With the fall of slow and Milosevic when he was taken out of power, the same thing happened there in what they called the bulldozer revolution were. was taken out through the use the same tactics crowd pressure. The government reacts because the look I don't care how. Judicious. You want to be in the use of force. If there's a thousand cops in their ten thousand people you're going to have to use. Some of your, you know crowd control measures and that means force and that may mean billy clubs and things like that, and sometimes it has meant in some of these places live fire. And not saying, it's right I'm just saying it's what it, what it has meant. And so after Milosevic was taken out. In the bulldozer, revolution. In two, thousand and three. There were people in Georgia. In Belarus and other places that wanted to learn about. This idea of how do you overthrow the government through this? Mostly nonviolent, but just enough to provoke the government violent means. And so. Guess what there's an entire school that teaches this and we've helped pay for it. On the outskirts of new Belgrade among communist era towerblocks lies the anonymous looking office of Canvas inside Sergio. Popovich. Runs. School of Revolution our original idea was to help groups from Zimbabwe and Belarus in two thousand three because they're inspired by the Serbian revolution and it started as a hobby twelve hundred full time job, and then throw the time we more requests for coming the more groups were inspired. The curriculum became more serious. Popovich was the leader of the student group AUT poor. It played a key role in the two thousand and revolt that ousted president Milosevic. The tactics learned at that time a now being taught to opposition groups around the world. Film has been made of the struggle bringing down a dictator now forms part of the canvas curriculum. Normally, Kansas workshops are seven days. I you need to understand that you need a vision of tomorrow. Then you teach people the braves basic principles of success in nonviolent struggle. Unity Planning on Vol discipline especially stressful stressing the importance of staying on violence. Canvas held workshops with Egyptian opposition groups in two thousand nine including the April the six movements that played a key role in the overthrow of the Mubarak regime two years later, Popovich admires the discipline the protesters showed in facing down the government. They would invite people to come on the square from five different places, and then the military will the police will go and hold on his places. But in the meantime they organize the communications. So they will smuggle themselves through the Lever Industries and appeared behind the Another important thing is they were so good and building up the unity they give up the individual symbols, their own groups and came out only with the flag of Egypt since the uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt traffic to the canvas website has sued with tens of thousands of downloads. The organizations free guide on staging protests. Canvas books have been translated into seven languages the Fosse and the versions are particularly popular. The clenched fist. The symbol of the Serbian protests has been adopted by protesters from Kenya to Belarus. So, does this look familiar me jump in here and you know I'm watching with you I just came off camera for a second but let me jump up back up here sitting see. I'm here with you and does this look familiar? This fist here. Okay and so this became the symbol from Serbia. and. Then it became part of this revolution school and it's part of what they. You've probably seen this. In the George Floyd protests. For Popovich workshops make for a hectic schedule with anywhere from Asia to south. America south. Pacific Also I mean, we were working with places like cut West Papua Fiji stuff like that. So I mean, it's it's really exotic when it comes to probably Canary but in practice you know you sometimes working out in hotel sometimes work on the classroom sometimes you walk the beaches. Beaches with Moldavians as well so I mean it can be really really bts a long way from the protests that filled. Belgrade's Revolution Square a decade on the barricades have been replaced with pavement cafes the protest. With the Tinkling of fountains bouts, not everyone believes that the Serbian model should be exported overseas million co data is one of a non-governmental organisation civic initiatives needs was loosen. First of all it was a chain of one percent. And very naively I myself Romantically, we changing one person changes the system. The system is still present and they're still fighting for the change of the system Sergio Popovich. That bringing down. Removing the bad guys sometimes easier than really building the Democratic Institution. He's a Nessin Popovich says not protesters across the Arab world will soon learn Henry ritual viewing. US. Belgrade. and. So this has been employed now in the Arab spring was all pretty much done with these same tactics, the The Rose Revolution was. I think the Rose Revolution was in Georgia right. There then there was of course the Orange Revolution in Ukraine, which opened the door for. Our Buddy Joe Biden to. Get involved in the corruption over there. But the Orange Revolution was basically paid for and engineered by the US through our new CIA, an organization called US ID the US. Agency for International Development, and the capture of the thing was we sent a sitting US senator over there to talk to the protesters. People of. Ukraine. This is your moment. Not Agree in scared say wash movement. This is about you know what else? To say. This is about the future you want for your country. This is about the future you deserve. Pro version my for my. Zipper yet. Now you give us. A future in Europe my board Europen in. My. All of your neighbors. My Clashes you. A free world is with you. America is with you I am with you. The destiny you see lies in your old. Russia Doda Yuck man. Called it's out. Of. Ukraine, we'll make girls better at Europe. Ukraine. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you John McCain for helping US overthrow are government. So the equivalent of this is during our protests here. Okay we have. A senator from. A legislator from Russia who comes out and stands up in front of the crowd and encourages the crowd. That's what they. That's the equivalent of. Okay, well, we have a sitting US senator standing in front of the crowd encouraging them to overthrow their government. This is the exact same tactic that's being used here now. There's apparently This is very unpopular. Say what I'm going to say next and so I'm going to wait 'til after the break to say it and WANNA, share some video with you. You can't you're not gonNA believe and a little bit audio with the US going to blow your mind and so I'll I'll hold it till after the break I'm GonNa take just a quick minute out and cute a couple things up and if you WANNA call in this would be a great time 'cause I can screen the call and make sure you're not. Insane. Nicely right. Anyway be right back. So, welcome back. Thanks for giving me a minute out to. Take a drink of cool refreshing water there and. Sons coming up on the West. Coast I can. Get a light a little bit finally here almost seven o'clock quarter till. Whatever it is. Seventeen before the hour you're supposed to say because people don't know times and but it's a podcast anyway most listeners are not going to be listening live so. Always keep to the idea that you know this is Not a live show all the time. Most people are listening. Crew court deal, right. So anyway, welcome back. had told you I had something for you that you weren't going to believe, and apparently this is not popular to say, but I'm going to say it because you know that's I guess what I do now. So. There's a lot of talk about George Soros being involved in. What's going on here? And I've listened to that talk with some interest and. Some lack of interest right some. Skepticism because some of the people saying it are not the people that I know surly or like wow that's really something I think is smart and I look up to right. And so but at the same time, a lot of the people that some of the people saying it are smart and they're people that I look up to and I know this is not like I'm not making this up and I didn't this is speculation I've done the homework on this part that the open society. Foundation, which is us. Legal Charity Right or legal foundation it's. Five Oh, one C. Three and they fund so-called democracy projects and so-called diversity projects at Cetera and what ends up happening is that they fund candidates. For Office who fit those criterion that defined around but for example, if they say they were funding. Latino candidates. For, Office that's that's true but they're only going to fund the most left wing Latino candidates they're not going to fund any right wing Latino candidates So it's there Anyway it's not true the way they behave. So Mr Newt of all people was on Fox News yesterday and brought up George Soros, and the reaction of the host is mind boggling and So that's why you're going to see it. Here we go. You you. This is one that the visual really does help if you can. Catch. The livestream but the audio. I'll. I'll tell you what's happening here when the. Dead for a second whose lives have been destroyed by this violence. They represent every. Right Speaker Gingrich on. So. Just for context for those, you're listening on the PODCAST. This is. Melissa Francis I believe is her name blonde haired Lady I. Hope It's not wrong and Harris Faulkner. WHO's the African American host and who I have tremendous respect for her she's I. Know a military family person and everything I've seen about her I like and our work is stellar same with. Believable as France Iowa pulp however name wrong But anyway, that's WHO's here and they're interviewing. The former speaker of the House Newt Gingrich a final thought for us. Yeah. Look the number one problem in almost all these cities is George Soros elected left wing anti police pro criminal district attorneys who refused to keep people locked up. Just yesterday they put somebody back on the street who is wanted for two different murders in New York City. You cannot solve this problem and both powers and by. Have talked very proudly about what they call progressive. The District Attorney's Progressive District Attorney's are anti police pro criminal. George sources money, and they're a major cause of the violence we're seeing who's they keep putting the violent criminals back on street. I'm not sure we need to bring us listen to this. I was going to get the last word he. Even, he he paid for it. Why Kellie discussed the fact that millions of dollars. Doesn't need to be a part of this conversation. Okay. And then that's Marie HARF. Who Jumps in and says no he didn't. And I'm not sure if that's where I think it is who jumps in and says, no, you're, GonNa move on. Historic Day at the White House we covering it from stem to stem to stern so. Yeah we're going to move on and so she gets the Harris gets the word in here. Yeah. We're not discussing that. Yeah. We're not going there. We're not talking about this. This is you know as they used to say back in the battle days, you know a of the of the Nazis Strang verboten. Apparently we can't discuss. George Soros. And his involvement in. In. These things that was shut down. Wholesale. By the Nice folks there at Fox. And so I. Guess Everybody's got something that they don't WanNa, talk about. And that's super interesting to me and I don't know what it means except maybe that those hosts were unprepared to deal with that or. Or that they think that that's all conspiracy stuff and this is one of the things that I've think that we really need to take a serious look at the you know it's illegal to use foreign money in campaigns, but it's not illegal to take foreign money in a nonprofit right and we're glad about that because then the Red Cross and other things can in. Other charities and churches can receive money for overseas and you can send money overseas and so on and so forth and But many of these nonprofits are really political action committees, masquerading nonprofits, and the more innocuous-sounding and nonpartisan. Their name is the more likely it. Is there a left wing activist group? So you know if it's you know the democracy, education, Institute. For sure. They're teaching people how to not be democratic or it more accurately be democratic and just gives us a chance to address the the name of the program. Here is republic keeper I mean the idea is democracy is dangerous. Democracy is mob rule, and for those who understand the American system part of the genius of it is that it is intended to frustrate democracy. That everything you want to do by mob rule or everything that you could do by mob rule is often overturned by a nine person mob on the court. And you know or by the executive you know who's required to carry it out and so if you don't have all three branches involved, you don't have anything in the US and the one branch. The Supreme Court is intentionally not elected. It's not democratic. It's it's the growth of a democratic process. The democratic. We elected representatives in the Senate who confirm and in his executive branch who appoint and the house isn't even involved. They're totally cut out the most democratic institution we have in the entire. Shooting match is the House of Representatives right it's elected most frequently every two years. It's every seat every two years unlike the. Senate. where it should you know only third every every election cycle. And six year terms the presidency is you know Not as democratically responsive, it's not democratically even elected at all the only thing that's democratically elected are the senators and the House members and the House members, the most frequent elections, and they're entirely cut out of the process of creating the Supreme Court. So the Supreme Court is intended frustrate democracy. and. So if the you know the reason that the Democrat Party. Is appropriately named is because they do believe in moderate mob rule. And we've seen that everywhere they try it. And so the the pro, the party is aptly named now there is. There is there are some legal preventions against mob rule. And one of them is the law against sedition. And sedition were probably GonNa talk about. More tomorrow. Maybe. We'll get into it more tomorrow. Maybe, we'll just do some of it right now seven minutes left. So Sedition is a law was signed in seventeen, ninety eight, the the sedition act was signed by John Adams. And it's setup punishments of two years of imprisonment for quote opposing or resisting any law, the United States or. Writing or publishing, false, scandalous, and malicious. About the president or the Congress. Okay. So that was the idea of the sedition act. Okay. Then in nineteen forty Well, let's see nine hundred, seventeen They made it a crime to willfully spread false news. Of the American Army or navy with an intent to disrupt its operations that was in the middle of World War One. In one thousand, nine, hundred, forty, the Smith Act was passed. Now. The Smith Act is. Still on the books. and. It made it a federal crime to advocate or teach the desirability of overthrowing the United States government. Or? To be a member of any organisation which does the same. That sounds like maybe a reasonable law I don't know but the Smith Act was. Used against Communist. Party members during the the old battled McCarthy days. And so it fell out of. Out of favor and it was It was used in the Socialist Workers Party case in Minneapolis in nineteen forty one. And Twenty three people were convicted and then in nineteen forty four, what was called the great sedition trial number pro-nazi figures were indicted but then the prosecution mistrial. There were one hundred and forty leaders of the Communist Party USA. That were prosecuted under it. Beginning in nineteen, forty, seven, and Indian, or nine, hundred, forty, nine, inning fifty-seven. Okay. So the Smith Act has been used and it was used a little bit during the Vietnam War. against US somebody who's doing a sit in. And but apparently was charged a with sedition and. ended up, not the the prosecutor changed the charge the Marshall picked him up for sedition and the prosecutor changed the charge to trespassing and that created kind of an impasse and the prosecutor said Hey we decide what to charge you arrest. Them will decide what to charge him with in nineteen eighty, a guy named Oscar Lopez Rivera. Was a Puerto Rican nationalist wants Puerto Rico to become country. A Vietnam vet. And he was sentenced to seventy years four Doing that kind of being A. Not, a terrorist, but he had been involved in dog conspiracy to commit acts of terror to overthrow the US occupation as they called it of Puerto Rico So he was given an offer of. Clemency by Bill. Clinton. In one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, nine, and. But he had to renounce violence. And he said now. I'm not doing it and but the main reason he said he. Wasn't GonNa do is because there are other Puerto Rican nationals that were. Still in prison, and so he finally got out in two thousand ten. nine, hundred, eighty, seven, fourteen white supremacists were indicted by a grand jury on seditious conspiracy charges. So US there, and that was the this group called the order. which had operations on a place called Whitby island not far from here. And not far from Seattle and Richard Butler out in Idaho. There was. This guy. Here this Guy Oh bar Omar Abdel Rahman. I think he's the blind shake. Maybe I got that wrong but he was one of the. I. Think he was one of the conspirators on the first world. Trade Center bombings anyway, he and nine others charge of seditious conspiracy that's going to be the charge that we use on terrorists most the time is the charge of overthrowing the government. Now, the reason I'm bringing it up and talking about it is because. Bill Bar our attorney general asked his team to look into. The possibility of charges of sedition against Jenny Durkan. the mayor of Seattle and against other Democrat politicians or not Democrat. But it's been Democrats. I don't think his purpose was to go after Democrats against any politicians who have worked with or heard or Given climate to people who want to actively overthrow the government. And so I. Think that's probably a good thing that That bill bars asking the the DOJ to look at that. Now I, don't know whether those people are guilty of crimes and whether or not they should be prosecuted or not but Jenny Durkan understand how to response last night and to that that report, and I'll probably dig into that. Maybe we'll have a little bit at tomorrow that's more male the local issue for me here in Seattle although. I think the idea of the federal government charging somebody under sedition for what's been going on around here and around these other cities, it may be important, and so the the set up today and what I want you to understand is that these color revolutions as they're called the Purple Revolution which was in Iraq That's when the what they called it when the Iraqis dipped their finger in ink. After we through it. The Cedar Revolution was the overthrow of Lebanon. There's The Saffron Revolution is an attempt to overcome throw me Mar.. which hasn't worked green revolution has been not what you would think in terms of green power and stuff it's the. Attempt. To overthrow the government in Iran and I wonder what they will call. There's a second velvet revolution thing called the velvet revolution. Armenia. So I wonder what they will call the. Overthrow of America. If they were successful achieving it and they won't be successful in achieving, but they probably be successful in achieving some things that they want to achieve, and they'll end up giving it a name because of that. So Thanks for your time and attention time for me to run and remember if you. Have the opportunity visit the website and sponsor the show our patron dot com slash republic keeper way link that really does help appreciate it and I will be back. God Willing tomorrow with more. Thanks again.

US gene sharp president America Russia Serbia senator Dr Sharp Ferdinand Marcos Czech Republic George Soros Albert Einstein Institution Brian Kelly Gandhi Harvard University Sergio Popovich Belgrade twitter
Psychics and Law Enforement

True Mysteries of the Pacific Northwest

05:16 min | 1 year ago

Psychics and Law Enforement

"Welcome to hidden history. I'm your host could crumb today psychics and law enforcement. There was a television show a few years ago called all media where the Star would have dreams that help police solve crimes. Sometimes they would show her mug shots or evidence and that would help her vision or envision. Something that helps solve the crime today. I'll take a look at the success and failures where psychics attempted to solve crimes. James there are documented cases where psychics have assisted the police in solving a crime but for every success story. There's a skeptic two thousand four self off proclaimed psychic Sylvia. Browne told a mother of a kidnapping victim. Amanda Berry sorry but a mand is dead. Two years later Berry's mother guide believing that her daughter was dead. However in two thousand thirteen berry was found alive then again on the Montel Williams show Brown gave a detailed l. description of the abductor? In the case of Shawn Hornbeck when Hornbeck was found four years later it was revealed that few details provided by I brown war correct may two thousand one psychics from around the world provided tips for the location of the body of Washington. DC Intern Chandra. Rolette county every single tip was wrong one year later a man walking his dog accidentally found the interns body in another case involving the long long island. Serial killer a psychic said the body being sought would be found in a shallow grave near water and sign with the letter G. in it would be nearby why it turned out that the body was not in a shallow grave and of course in Long Island waters everywhere. And there's no sign with a G. nearby during my research about psychics helping the police the failures mounted and for the most part police departments across the country stated that psychic assistance was. I never saw it out. It's not too common for law enforcement to turn to clairvoyance however for help on their cases it just seems that they don't want to admit it more often than not it's a psychic. Though who reaches out to law enforcement offering tips and assistance. That was the case fourteen year. Old Elizabeth Smart went missing gene from Salt Lake City. In two thousand two after smart's kidnapping Salt Lake. Police were inundated with tips from psychics. Telling them where due to find her body and who might have killed her. Of course we all know now that smart was not dead and she was still in Salt Lake City. She was found in nine months Spotted by two couples suspected. Seen her not one psychic guessed that she had been kidnapped by David. Brian Mitchell who had been holding smart captive his second wife for months. Right under everyone snows. It seems pretty cut and dried that the psychics didn't saul any of these crimes but there have been some strange occurrences in Australia. One Psychic led the family of missing person directly to his body. Another psychic predicted within a mile where the body of a missing woman would be found and put about yet another psychic that dreamed of the location of missing child's body. But when I got there they found something entirely different but equally shocking a different body but a day find well. They've found that the psychic was is able to pinpoint where that other body was and are the police not giving psychics enough do well that seems quite apparent but troy griffin is a self proclaimed psychic detective shining crystal ball. Tarot cards and tea leaves of his fellow intuitive. He says he uses his psychic powers to solve crimes I've worked worked on about a hundred cases Griffin said. He says he's built a business out of bringing the paranormal into police. Work charging up to two hundred and fifty dollars an hour for investigative work work. In the six years he's been in the business out of one hundred cases Griffin claims. He has an eighteen to twenty percents success. Rate in the research for this podcast podcast. I reviewed over fifty cases where a psychic claim. They were involved in solving the crime but when I contacted the police either. They didn't know of the psychics involvement or their involvement was ineffective and slow. The investigative process are psychics. reeler fate this is a question that has been asked throughout the centuries. He's but a better question would be are psychic abilities. Real because are definitely fake psychics out there but there are also experienced gifted psychics with real abilities. As far as proof of psychics are real. There are thousands of people who reported having accurate readings but beyond there are millions of individuals. who have a psychic moment? The some describes a long drawn out deja Vu providing personal insights psychics and law enforcement was produced here at night owl sound studio and brought to you by the Rogue Valley Metaphysical Library and I'll cabinet getaway out Creek Kevin DOT DOT COM. Check it out. I'm kid crumb. Thanks for listening.

troy griffin Amanda Berry Salt Lake City kidnapping Long Island Rolette county Shawn Hornbeck Elizabeth Smart Montel Williams Salt Lake saul David DC Browne Intern Chandra James Rogue Valley Metaphysical Libr Washington Australia
How New Conspiracy Theorists Undermine Democracy

The Tel Aviv Review

39:16 min | 11 months ago

How New Conspiracy Theorists Undermine Democracy

"This is. One? The Tel Aviv review. Hello to the Tel Aviv review I am happen, Dalia Shenlin every week. We bring you conversations with authors about the books and research and other things that we like. If you like us, please consider becoming a patron supporter by going to a website. Let's Tell V. One dollars. M Smash Tel. Aviv Review Scroll down to the bottom and click the big red buttons has Patriot and support us. We are counting on you. Yes, you! This episode is part of a series generously sponsored by the Israel Office of the Konrad. Adenauer Foundation focused on democracy, populism, authoritarianism, and all of its causes symptoms, manifestations We are very pleased this week to welcome Nancy Rosenbloom speaking to us today from Cape, cod. She is the Senator Joseph Clark Research Professor of ethics in politics and government at Harvard University. She has published five books. We won't be able to list all of them, but we'll be talking today about her. Most Recent Book Co authored with Russell Moorhead of Dartmouth University and a lot of people are saying that it's a great book. Book. It's called. A lot of people are saying the new conspiracy and the assault democracy published by Princeton University press in two thousand, nineteen Professor Nancy Rosenbloom welcome to the show. I'm happy to be here. We're happy to have you to I. Want to start out with the most important word in your title which I consider to be the word new. What is new about the kind of conspiracy Sim that you and your colleagues have nd in book? Can you kind of enumerate the main ways that the new conspiracy differs from regular normal conspiracy theories that are out there and we'll break them down. That's a terrific starting point. conspiracy theory is as old as politics, and it's very come place. Most people by some estimates leaving in some conspiracy theory or another and we'll conspiracy theory. Is it you? It's an explanation of an event. At says if things are not as seen that this really covert plot going on by powerful actors and the reasoning in conspiracy theory is the same as reasoning in any spirit you accumulate evidence. The DOTS add up to a pattern and the pattern of US intent, and so on and the example that I like to give of a conspiracy theory because it resonates with Americans. Americans is the declaration of Independence that is the united. States began to conspiracy theory. It says that all these truths are self evident that are created equal, but the conspiracy that the British were leveling against the county's was not self-evident until the declaration of independence consists in fact of a long list of grievances against the crown and the ministers, and the this evidence added up. To a evidence of a plot, a pattern and intention to enslave the colonies, and that's why there had to be a war of independence, and not just a V dressing grievances the reconciliation with the crown. So that's conspiracy theory thinking the way we ordinarily think and some conspiracy theories are tree. Some are warranted. Implicated factors such a complicating factor of this whole thing. Yes. Yes, and and you know there are plenty of progressives. Conspiracy theories like dark money in American politics and fossil fuel company promoting misinformation about climate change. Now what's new is that today we have conspiracy without the theory. That is we have people making bear search? Without any evidence, and without any argument, for example, the election was rigged. What the Climate Change at the Chinese folks or that this or that action with the work of the deep state? Conspiracy them, today dispenses with evidence an argument. It's an aggressive assertion or it's an Innuendo like I'm just asking questions, and this is very important, and we're not just creating a typology. or or stating something has changed. This changes significant. If you ask how this conspiracy without the theory validated, it simply validated by my repetition by liking and tweeting and repeating it and. Sharing it, and so on, and that explains our title. A lot of people are saying, but because that's the EH. that. A lot of people are saying this thing you have a sent. You have repetition you has. And in doing this people buying into this this claim and identify with others who affirm it. Up Forty seven percent of Republicans example believe the president trump won the popular vote, and then what's interesting is why is it that people buy into this? And the explanation that we give is that they are creating this political identity this week. This is sent an affirmation and I'm we make the claim that for many people a? The question of whether they believe this conspiracy claims are not. It's nothing like question. Because, the truth is not an issue. The phrase we use is it's true enough, and I can give you some examples of that. What do you think what what are? The root causes of what really instigated this change from old conspiracies into the new one. Of the CON- The factors are turn student. And their number of sociological explanations for why conspiracy claimed the rise and positive psychology and political psychology talk about it as well, but I think that there are a couple of proximate causes that explained this new conspiracies, this conspiracy without the theory one, and it's significant I. think that the Internet plays an important part, and it's not just because it's so easy. To you know share and and circulate these kinds of conspiracy claims, but also because you have other factors involved. You have conspiracy entre. Entrepreneur who make money by both are creating and propelling these theories, and because the the way you validate conspiracy without the theory, not evidence and arguments, but just a lot of people are saying the Internet is important, because you can in a sense measure how many tweets or likes shares, and so on there are so it? It makes a lot of people. A lot of people are saying true enough. Some part of it is the engine it, but I think that and this would be going on regardless I think the current political scene in the united. States especially But what making this dangerous and what's making it so effective this conspiracy without the theory is that it's coming from the highest levels of government, and that spreads it and we have someone who. In president. Trump wants to the phrase I use his own reality. He wants to on reality and he this reality by making these assertions and claims, and making them constantly and having the. Repeated, he has a compromised sense of reality and he has the capacity the. Capacity in the political support to impose his compromise sense of reality on the nation and I think that's the answer to the question. Why Now? So, so the thing is I think. Going to try and maybe challenges. It's not so much an epistemological change, but it's really the fact that this spirit of conspiracies is coupled with a tremendous amount of political power that in a way also feeds back into its visibility ride, because the president of the United States is a conspiracy theorist therefore his. By virtue of his own. Standing and and role he can spread it a lot more effectively than all the conspiracy theorists put together could have done before him. I think the police are true I. Don't think we have to choose between them. Clearly the political impact and we can talk about that and the minute. The political impact of conspiracies would not be what it is if it hadn't been for the fact that the President and a compliant sometimes cynical sometimes go along Republican. Party supports in, and doesn't speak truth to conspiracies, and all of that's important, but I would never wanNA underestimate the epistemological divide, and maybe I can say a word about that because I think it's one of the most important. Strangely political consequences of this new conspiracies. That is what what's at stake in whether you was sent to a conspiracy claim or not. is nothing less than what it means to know something? And when you have a country that's divided over what it means to those something what it needs to know that Hillary Clinton is running a child sex trafficking of Ping Pong Pizza in Washington D. C.. Is An extraordinary kind of divide I think it makes for kind of polarization that deeper and more important, even than partisan polarization, and it's more destructive politics, because when you have this disjuncture about what it means to know, something whether you dispense with evidence and argument or not. it makes really politics impossible. I I want to second that I want to support your explanation, because I think what it comes down to in your explanation is that the new conspiracy has no theory and no evidence, which essentially is an undermining of what we think of as enlightenment values. Does this kind of? Has, this introduced a new way of thinking in the entire sort of post enlightenment world that is on some level at the heart of American identity I mean you have a great quote in there? by David Brian Davis, who says that the American revolution conditioned Americans to think about tearing off the veil of dark plots against people as part of a national identity. We see the truth. We are transparent. We all all about evidence and transparency that's considered fundamental to democracy, so is this introducing sort of a new political force and what's the relationship I know this is long, but what's the relationship with that too ideology because you have a point that you make about? How this thing is related to ideology or not let me be in saying that The the David Brian Dave is closed. On the lighten inter. Anti lighting question really turn them later. We're talking about conspiracy theory, which is consistent with enlightenment. In fact, there's a wonderful quote that I've used says that social science just is conspiracy theory. With those. Do to view. Their hidden currents of how power flows, who actually hold it and how they're reeling it, but it amounts to conspiracy theory and we talking about. The. Progressive Era in American politics very programmatic GonNa Democratic made all sorts of permanent institutional democratic reform, and it was based on a conspiracy theory about smoke lose the chose candidates and closed the boardrooms of monopoly industry so. conspiracy theory I. Think is consistent with what you're calling. Enlightened sneering and a conspiracy without the theory coulee is not in the question. Is You know what people who sent to these? Conspiracies claims without the theory were part of of this. Divide that I'm describing. What why are they doing it? And what does it mean to them? And it's not so much a wholesale rejection of the difference between truth and. Falsity or evidence on lack of evidence is the fact that in regard to certain claims, these spirit conspiracy claims what matters is whether they are true enough. And the standard of whether they're true enough whether they are. Correlated to. Support, a certain view of the political world, political enemies can extend to which political enemies with could do. Let me give you an example of what shoe enough sounds like. Congressman for example says. I'm not saying that The Democrat created the clash and Shout Racist Pash. I'm saying I'm saying true I'm saying it's plausible. That is to say on a certain new of politics whether or not in no that the Democrats is business areas. Thing it's it's plausible. Would they did my my best example of this? Is trump's press secretary Sarah Huckabee. Sanders. They communicated video. Full video turned out of a Muslim attack on American. And, and when confronted with the with the claim that this video was adopted video the press secretary replied whether it's a real video. Threat is real. That is to say these things are true enough. Hillary Clinton is running a child sex trafficking out the basement of pizza parlor is true enough? If you think that Hillary Clinton is so evil that she could very well be doing fellas sting for the example that I particularly appreciated which is Do we have any evidence that Supreme Court justice now deceased Antonin Antonin Scalia was not poisoned. Can we prove it and that's sort of strange counter intuitive counterfactual. Maybe you can explain that one, too. Right well I. There is the general argument which I think is, it tends to be true that conspiracy. Thinking of all kinds is a closed loop. That is any evidence against those conspiracy theories actually evidence for it. Because who concocting evidence? Against the claim right the enemies concocting the evidence against clan so I think that there are two very critical consequences of this you know I'm not interested in creating typology conspiracy play. Without the so on what's interesting to me is what of the political consequences of this and I think they've been. They've been drastic one. Has To. Do What we've been talking about. That is the. The disorientation the comes from hearing on more and did were unsupported conspiracy claims, and knowing that so many people are supporting them. It often seems as those people who are moderate trump's planes, and I'll give an example in the second are either cynical or really see. They're engaged in the act of submission to what it means. To know something So that's one and we've begun to talk about that but I think the other. Obvious and incense more important. consequence of conspiracy without the theory. These unsupported claims is the way de-legitimize. Crucial Democratic Institution. It has clearly undermine legitimated. All kinds of knowledge producing institutions of inside government and out from the intelligence agencies to be Environmental Protection Agency to the Justice Department. And it has de legitimated, and perhaps this is the most important point. It's diligent and aided the notion of partisan opposition. You can't have democracy unless you have confidence in this idea of a loyal action. And what this conspiracy! Claim playing. Pounded on for years now has done is to save that. The opposition is a political entity and should be mended impotent Nazario. Focusing the idea of on the danger, it poses to democracy but more if there's really no evidence and no foundation, and really no theory or any legs to stand on I'm I wonder how. Dangerous it is because as a write in the book, the way to confronted or to address these issues to confront the conspiracy theorists with with reality. And since you wrote the book, the have been two major. Issues Confronting the American people with you know the doing of the conspiracy theorists. I mean one is the breeding incompetent handling of the covid nineteen. Pandemic in America by the administration and the other one is the the civil unrest that we've seen and also are causing some confrontation to the way the reality is posed. Do think that there's any moment of reckoning either underway right now or just around the corner. Saying you know, maybe you know. The new conspiracy is good on paper when it actually comes to running the country, and you know taking care of our lives. There's a limited. That's a terrific question and. A let me start by saying. that. I don't think that I. Don't think that reality bites is low certain stances, and they're just speaking truth. To, these unwarranted conspiracy claims is a way of defeating them, and that's because. Of? where I'd again, which is that the devastating consequences are coming from the fact that we have a president with a compromise sense of reality wants to own reality, and who has with a passerby to impose it on the nation, and that he's done that by the legitimating basic democratic institutions, and when when I say they de legitimated I mean more than that, his trusted I mean that they lose their meaning and their value, and there were already I mean if there is a deep state, then the the products of these institutions have on. No claim on your consent or your compliance. And he's also able to. Not Just de legitimate institution, but structurally all them to rail them sending the army to the southern border to protect the. Illegal immigrants or hijacking them using the Justice Department to investigate people or in benching new institution, all kinds of commission and so on. And so, what the danger that's coming is not simply some the unreality of these claims or the attempt to own reality, but the capacity to alter institution. in order to impose that reality. On, the nation and that's especially true as I say about rejection of legitimate political opposition. Just polarization and the opposition to the enemy, and so that brings us to your your question about. Whether some. Some things that happened in the world that are unavoidably happening and and you would think could not be wished away or claim to evaporate home. Test. The power of this conspiracies amid this attempt to own reality and. My answer is yes one now. In fact, we just Buddha. Column to the paper about the coded. A covert virus Question and It's clear that. When stays with disease and mortality? People. Will Not accept and don't accept trump's original claim. It was virus that it was a hoax. The Democrats cooking it up and Tony, so for even he had backed down his original unwarranted claims, but it just means that the conspiracy claims have shifted from whether the virus or the origins of the virus can weather this virus. is in imposing a real health hazard on-off. And here he has an enormous number of people in government. His whole Party and people in the population who go along with the claim that. To to keep on imposing restrictions on people for the purposes of avoiding too many deaths. Is I hurt the economy to hurt him in his reelection and deficiently contained in. So the things can be opened up and so on and so forth so yes, it's shifted from. This belief in the claim that this thing is unreal. To conspiracy accounts of. Responses to it. One of the things I think is particularly interesting about your your approach. Is that what you're describing the disorientation the? Of Institutions and the fact that trump is leveraging this in this way seems to lay the classic famine authoritarianism because people can't know anything they. They believe they can't really know what's going on, so the state can come in and just do it once, but on the other hand you argue that this new conspiracy conspiracy them is not really about using political ideology of anyone sort. How do you? Reconcile those two. Ideas With the ideology cartoon your question. I don't think. I think. That the Republican Party as it stands today. The United States has certain. It's not an ideological party, but it has certain policies that it absolutely wants to Inflict is my view on the country, and one has to do with tax, policies and and maintaining. The. The the status and the income of Corporate America and the other has do conservative claims and and Moving the court. With people who will go along with certain kinds of us. So the Republican Party has objectives and trump has by-in-large. extended to. Accede to these I don't think he particularly cares about either one, certainly not religion, but he has exceeded to them and the results is that we have this real alliance between a conservative? And trump, but that's not to say that there's an ideology here. That is I don't think that. Any of the. That that trump in the conspiracies or aiming it anything but. Being into the opposition now if you count as over -Tarian isn't as a an ideology. Then there's no question that the president and the people. He surrounded himself with and that he puts into office in these agencies have. Authority authoritarian bias. You can have an authoritarian bias without having any particular ideology right any particular said of of things so there isn't a seller. -Tarian tendency and it has been. acted on and successful. Of. More than I would have thought when I started out on this project I I like many people thought that they were institutional and political guardrails that would. cabin this authoritarianism and to some extent. It has so you have these authoritarian tendencies I. I think that. that. To Go back to your earlier question, we've seen it. More spectacularly than ever in this business of calling out the military. And the National Guard. To face up in a protesters against. Racial injustice. And that's been really quite extraordinary, and it's that that has led generals and others to To publicly for the first time, come out and criticize trump and say that he's dangerous. But that's the most dramatic and. Active star terrorism and the one that has. As I, say turned. Portent factors of the government like the military against. You do focus a lot on on trump and the Republican Party of in an interview and also in the Book and In, you say that the new conspiracy is mainly the mainstay of the right, and not so much of the left. What? Why do you think that is? And and how do you count antitax earth? Partisan composition of anti back there, certainly all kinds of conspiracy theories. Claim that events can only be explained by conspiracy that are both riding last and some on. Their conjoined and I expect the factors of anti vaccine one of them, but if you look at the conspiracy claims about nine eleven, for example, there are all kinds of them, and sometimes right in the left or combined and saying that the government was actually involved whether they're saying if for different reasons and so and so on. But I think that as a rule. No mast is certainly not without conspiracy thinking, but the last seem to. Stick pretty much to conspiracy theories not to. Mon books written about dark money. In the United States and half rations camouflaging are seizing democracy. Or as the example I used before whole books and movies have been made about the fossil fuel, industry and other corporate interests. Leading the nation to believe that there is a dispute about climate change and its origins, and so on so there's plenty of conspiracy theory coming from the left. But by and large I haven't seen the left doing kind of. unsupported. non-theoretical. Their claims. That the light has done and that. Much manufacturing and don't forget I began by saying that we have out. There is conspiracy entrepreneurs who say that vast murders like the sandy hook school massacre or staged will even now. They're saying that the The murder of George. Voiceless staged right the kind of thing. Don't get from the left. Yeah, I one of the interesting distinctions you make I just want to point out for our listeners. One of the interesting distinctions I think you make is is between conspiracy theories that are out there to explain something that people think the evidence hasn't explained sufficiently and theories about things that don't need to be explained or don't exist yet like you know original storylines like the Pizza Gate I think that was an interesting distinction that you make. I thank you for bringing that up in fact. We've gone past. What we wrote about in the book where there we said that. Sometimes both conspiracy theories and conspiracy claims speak about real events. Sometimes conspiracy claims these conspiracies after theory are inventing events like the murder of Justice Scalia or but now we have something new coming from trump himself and that is that there's no event at all and bizarre claim about it. I'm know if you will have heard about Obama, gate. This conspiracy claim about against President Obama and was ordinary about it, is it? Did no accusation. One go back a minute and say that I I got interested in this question might. After trump was inaugurated, he had claimed that his. crowded. His inauguration was the biggest crowd in American history bigger than Obama's and selling itself looks in his usual grandiosity and the next day the national parks. This has the this discharge lease photographs. Of the inaugural crowd in it was a modest crowd, it was an awkward. He clan, and his immediate reaction supported by people in his administration was the National Park Service had doctored the photograph. DOT This Hanmi dog. He doctored the photographs he didn't say who didn't say until. And so forth so I say this because we've now not even past that kind of Clinton with Obama Gate. If you ask trump and he was asked by a reporter. What was it that he was choosing Obama of doing? and. I'm quoting here. It's been going on for a very long time. You know what the Klein is. The crime is very obvious to everybody. And a few days later he says it's the greatest political scandal in the history of the United States, and we don't know what the accusation. Is Not just that there's militant is no play I know we were trying to follow it from here, but it's. It's hard for reporters to report on the issue I know I mean. Let me ask you. A lot of this book really does have to do with trump and so the question is I know you said you're not creating a typology here, but do you see evidence of this kind of thinking outside of trump land? I mean outside of America other parts of the world, or can you identify it anywhere else? I have no confidence in answering that question. Really haven't done a comparative study I. Think There's no question that what kinds of regimes. US conspiracy theory if for political purposes and I would imagine that what we're calling conspiracy without the theory or conspiracies, and is also useful because the same. The same sort of a dynamic that operates the use of the Internet and the fact that it's true enough that you couldn't say. A lot of people are saying, and you can spread quickly, and so on goes on so I I I. It's not a unique. To the United States however me, and I think that it to the extent that these conspiracy claims has proved useful. It's going to be a political weapon that other people use. It's not gonNA disappear. And the expansiveness nece an explosion of conspiracy them in social networking, and so on I think is here to stay and in part because. Politics always is always interesting in this is the new political weapon. And in part because it's fun, you know we shouldn't. When we shouldn't forget. That there's an excitement to this kind of conspiracies and on social networks on the Internet, and some of it is invented injustice for fun. Just it's just you know my favorite one of these. Months that the entrepreneur's created and the people circulate is that there are no birds in more with the birds in the UCLA really drone. John Kennedy tried to stop the murdering with the birds, and that's why he was assessed. Favorite right now is my favorite right now is Cunanan because I tried to to do ethnographic research and get into the Cunanan world mindset, instead of just reading about it, but I found it very hard because. It's not so easy to find I. Mean I think the Algorithm doesn't doesn't help people like me. I mean this is partly technology who drives us towards? It gives Pete that drives people towards certain echo chambers. Clearly there, it is, but it's also the fact that tune. Hundreds of good example is actually that there's a kind of as I say. Excitement there's a kind of aggressive fun in assertion in all of this, and on is a terrific example, because on the one hand chewing on is like a game that say who is is an honest person. Spreading information about win. The storm is going to come and trump is going to. Overtake all the enemies and mockup George, Soros and lodge lockup all the Democrats and so on, and so forth is a fun to, and it's actually like a collective creation that is people right in their their opinions about it in the novel expands, be sensitive collective writing it, you know. It it has it's. It's sort of cultural engagement of a certain interesting kind. On the other hand Junan series thing. Because the Cunanan, unlike an awful lot of these is out there in public spaces, they go to rallies. They intimidate people and they have an apocalyptic vision and I'm always very worried. When conspiracies or anybody has an apocalyptic vision, because it leaves the expectation, and possibly to the enactment of. Certain kinds of cataclysmic. Violence And the belief set. Out of this cataclysm out of chewing on in the storm will come a better work. This is a very very attractive idea to people, and it has a quasi religious overtones. You've probably heard that for some evangelical and for two and on. Trump is the chosen one. and So the fact that they're out there in public next week. Things that it's not implausible. You will have violence coming out of. Nancy maybe another I Dunno missiles are article question. Where do you see the overlap between new conspiracies zoom in populism as we understand it and theory. Thank you, you write that they share a sort of anti pluralism. How does that work well just is conspiracy today? de legitimises political opposition. populism. And this is a and gross generalization. Populism claims that there's one true people. And those who are are in the way of this month through people have no claim in democracy. So, there is a kind of totalism. To both conspiracies. And populism. But I think that that there's no necessary connection between I mean I think the populist. have no particular reason. To engage in. Engage in disinformation or to engage in. Concoctions conspiracy kind. There's no reason to think the populists, our in table of a reject. Political argumentation of understandable form. Perform, There's no. Sense so I'll just leave it there i. don't think that there's any necessary connection and I. Don't see particularly today I mean. I don't know whether we WANNA to trump's supporters populist knock. disinclined to. Answer your question. I mean we need to end? We were just hoping Maybe if you can give us. One word of you know is there. Is there any hopeful way to end this? Is there any good strategy I mean? Gila discussed it before? You know speaking truth to the conspiracy? What is the the route towards a more? Let me, let me ask it differently. If trump loses the the November elections. Do you think anything will change? That's better question absolutely will. Because as I've said, let's making this. politically dangerous. Beyond just the the obvious dangers to come from this kind of thinking. is the capacity of people in high power. To reorganize institutions and to impose these conspiracies claims on the nation and to use it. In political ways that are D- legitimating disorienting. That's not to say the conspiracies and will disappear there. You know the culture or on the internet or even politics. But once you have a change of President and party. We will have a dramatic change. That's not to say that it won't take a long time to reconstruct the institutions that have been disturbed by this hijacked and. Degraded and so on I. Think there's a lot that. Will, take a long time. But Narrative the carrier here. There is a person carrying this in a supine political party that has allowed this to continue and if And if they are strict. Film of their. Power? Conspiracies will disappear as well. Right Nancy Rosenbloom, a professor of ethics in politics and government at Harvard University and the author of the new book. A lot of people are saying the new conspiracies in the assault on democracy. Thank you very much for joining us today. Thank you for having. And thank you to a shell them and Georgia Foscarini our producers once again to the Israel Office of the Konrad. Adenauer Foundation for sponsoring this series. Now request many or most of you listen to us on the apple PODCASTS APP and we'd like to ask you to please consider writing us a review. You can support us by going to our website. T L V. ONE DOT FM Slash Tel, Aviv review and subscribing on our Patriot campaign. Check out our archive. We have over five hundred interviews like us on facebook. Follow both me and Gilad on twitter. Join US again next week for another edition of the Tel, Aviv review, and until then goodbye.

trump US president Hillary Clinton Nancy Rosenbloom Harvard University Republican Party Adenauer Foundation assault Tel Aviv Antonin Antonin Scalia Israel Office Konrad President Obama America Senator Joseph Clark Research professor
Eurovision Showcase on Forest FM (26th May 2019)

OC Talk Radio

1:02:15 hr | 2 years ago

Eurovision Showcase on Forest FM (26th May 2019)

"Right now you can get both sprints unlimited plan and the all new Samsung Galaxy S. included for just thirty five dollars per month per line for five lines. All you need is approved. Credit ended eighteen month lease no trade in required visit sprint stores or sprint dot com or call eight hundred sprint one fifty dollars a month after sixteen twenty five credit applied within two bills cancelled early remain balanced one Nevada rancher six thirty twenty eight thirty two dollars per month per line with all the data virtualization during congestions vaccines. Usual restrictions apply very warm welcome to Forest F._M.. It's just going five o'clock and it's time for the Eurovision showcase with me. Kirin Hurry Tussey today is Sunday the twenty sixth of May two thousand nineteen eighteen with still celebrating the world's greatest singing competition. This is genius from Amazon. Hey this is Allah and gosh bid from Slovenia Hi. This is a heart from San Marino. You are listening to your we shall case on Forest F._M.. The thing is dried saying some that'll be no several when you think tomorrow and you walk along with being big it has gone things do Sunday gusty in the world sunny and everyone is funny when they sing Sunday gusting power. Maybe maybe uh-huh when everything is Dr Singha Sunday the that'll be no sorrow when you seem to a lonely thing being gone gone teach in with Ding Dong the Netherlands nineteen seventy five until this year that was the last a Dutch Eurovision win in nineteen seventy five in Stockholm Sweden the year after Abba one with a worsley now as I think about that too is that Hank Marvin and the shadows were in the ninety seventy five contest representing the United Kingdom and they missed out to that on apparently Hank Marvin from shadows was not very happy <hes> I can imagine with those lyrics in that previous on we just had <hes> that testing they have of making any sense what so ever but the the November never mind is just your vision I guess <hes> expect the unexpected and speaking of the unexpected. Oh my goodness me the the European Broadcasting Union earlier this week admitted that there was a failure wave that auditors when it comes to the voting and particularly the jury votes from Belarus Larussa E._S. US why he was random. Israel twelve points from Belarus. I okay something's going on here. <hes> yeah we'll explain it all as it's a sugar zone abuts. We have a very special treat for you a very good friend David Mann from Eurovision Radio International which you can hear every Wednesday from seven to ten here in the United Kingdom than eight to eleven in central European time is going to give us a treat in a run down off the top ten of the Eurovision Song Contest Two Thousand Nineteen <music> music lovers with the top ten count John of Eurovision two thousand ninety up thirty three places from two thousand eighteen. It's Iceland add hatchard Moon Seagram from Atari at nine the rise of eleven places for Kate Miller hide key and gravity for Australia debris. It's up twenty places Azerbaijan Chingiz with truth is highs new tribe with a rise rise of a massive thirty five places topping the audience vote. It's North Macedonia and tomorrow Todesca who's proud at number seven and it's six. It's a rise of died places for the spirit of the sky with Kato from Norway. Now this is nervous in top five at five up the two places John Ludovic with too late for love from Sweden up twenty eight places to this year's number four Switzerland Luca Haney and she got me <music> arise of thirty three places brings Russia's Sergei Lazarev and scream to number three Italy move up free polices with Mahmoud and sold e to number two this year's eurovision number one up seventeen places. It's a first win for forty four years for the Netherlands at Arcade from Duncan Lawrence not off it <music> who God move miniver aw dot it is not because the steel instead Oh man uh-huh Kiala emperor sling mud. Eh Eh y'all grow. I see he yeah his E.. One of my most favorite Dutch Eurovision entries of all time that's The Netherlands nineteen ninety ninety four unbelievably came second last in nineteen ninety four unbelievable Velika Alberti with vardis disown. Where is the some <hes> there was one of the pre contests favorites vert sorrow member and everybody was quite shocked at the results in the end and <hes> more certainly may whenever we watched it because in Nineteen ninety-four <hes> <hes> I was seven <hes> yeah I went over Asli the most amazing about one thousand nine hundred four contests oversee the amazing river dance coming out of it is just obviously it's absolutely stunning? Isn't it that piece of music so why Y nos we can play it right here on the Eurovision showcase on Forest F._M.. Sir here is Bill Leland's river dance from the nineteen ninety-four Eurovision Song contest <music> This uh-huh <music> <music> <music> US <music> uh-huh uh mm-hmm hi this is urea frontal Lithuania. I'm going to be this year's representative for the European Song Contest. You're listening to Eurovision showed case on Forest F._M.. My Song is called run with the Lions. You just open your eyes. If you want to read those girls he'll look to this kingdom <music> shoo shoo <music> 'cause we got along the P._k.. We gotta love the capital nine. Go figure just try just try <music>. We <music> be you uh-huh <music> Yuri from Lithuania two thousand nineteen a run with with the lions and he was only a couple of points from qualifying to the grand final from semifinal to Lithuania just very well <hes> when it comes to the television saying they got managed to get twelve points from Ireland Norway and the United Kingdom yes so in the Tele verse we gave one point to Romania and then to to Russia three to Arlanda which was that only three points in the televising thankfully they they gave us three points in the ground phone day <HES> and then we move on to four points from two Sweden five points to the Netherlands the eventual winners six points to Switzerland Gay seven points to Azerbaijan Imagine eight points to Malta ten points to no way and the twelve went to Alicia rain here so yeah <hes> different different different different <hes> but <hes> the EPA it just wow stumped comes on right okay <hes>. It's now time to do one of my favorite bits. It's time for raw random. Yes it's a part of the Eurovision showcase each week which my husband wrote gets the two thousand and one of the hats is little bits of paper with years and the other hat has bits of paper with countries in he takes one out of each we glue it together and we play that song oversee completely random air on the Eurovision showcase now we have guests over this week this weekend. Excuse me and <HES> RUBS had to go and take a lumpy friends Keeley from San Francisco. I'm Michael From Charleston South Carolina to and to go and take them back to the to Heathrow Airport so he did withdraw before recording so we have the country of Moldova and edits the year two thousand eight works two thousand and eleven. Yes we're going to docile Dole Germany and the two thousand eleven eurovision song contacts <hes> of which was my controversy that was the news fine and the the Moldovan entry was from Szott dissolve with Song so lucky which ended up coming <hes> a rather bizarrely <hes> twelfth place with ninety seven points just behind the United Kingdom's blue with I can now this song. I'm is not one of my favorites. I'm afraid he did make it to the U._K.. Charts in two thousand eleven two hundred fifty three. I had to love so semi fallen became tense or only just great for get into the grandfather goes eight more roy onto it to him but they are <hes> Sir so that's Moldova for you so moreover in two thousand eleven they actually had a national final and obviously is op dissolved one the Talia Bob came second and she represented Moldova in two thousand eleven <hes> with Kaci quite good song called fights and she ended up coming ten. I'm sure she came tenth and one of the two yeah mature she came tenth through knowing something type slight at so she did pretty well but this off were the original debut of Moldova when Moldova debuted in two thousand and five in Kiev. We have Ukraine serve just one of those things I guess so like in twenty ten they had a pre-selection ran which concluded with two steps first singers songwriters were able to submit their entries online the T._r._M.. Websites and then an expert jury listen to songs invent selected sixteen for the second stage which each of the sixty bridge ously selected performance had three minutes demonstrate the vocal abilities of the live auditions from the two thousand eighteen January the Moldovan as well as the Belorussian auditions. You can watch them generally live online and <hes> it's the most horrific thing you'd have this sorry funny rights so when it came to the Grand Final Moldova minutes get twelve points for Romania trump don't you I'm then in the final they go eight points from the United Kingdom Italy city and Orland seven points in Azerbaijan better reuss Russia and Ukraine five points from Austria Georgia Portugal and Slovakia four points to from France Germany and Lithuania. I'm one point from Belgium respectively but at the grandfather Moldova gave it's eight points to Ukraine which is making Newton with the sand office the original Santo performance that Okay and then <hes> ten points went to as a by Sean which was at a Nikki the eventual winners running scared and twelve points went to Romania remains in two thousand eleven was sung by Oy a group Hotel F. M. With Song Change but one of my favorite bits about it is that one of the members of Hotel F._M.. Is Actually <hes> British ex PATs David Brian and and it's one of my favorite Romanian entries among saying so what does that have to those twelve points so let's vital tongues and listen to Australia Australia Moldova two thousand thousand eleven so I don't know how managed to say Australia hair is absorb dissolved with so lucky Moldova two thousand eleven robes random requests and it's random indeed <music> symbols. I thought on the ship take your show and now I uh-huh the taken the size and now slide yeah the service realm search jason that cheese right. You don't allow okay aw that's. They don't yeah it it. The the winner of Eurovision Nineteen eighty-eight Switzerland Celine Dion way the water from the moon that was from her second English studio album in nineteen ninety two just simply code Celine Dion. Yes it was commercially released in March of nineteen ninety three as the faith a single the song <hes> in the United States and Canada was a radio single owning a water from the Moon was written by Diane Warren Who Produce and produced by Guy Roach with additional production from Water Ota Anna Steph and Warren did also the backing vocals making us. I Di Amorin. She covered the U._k.. Enter in two thousand nine for Jade Union it's my time but it got to number number one in the queue beckon music as stations and in the United States it got to eleven in the adult contemporary billboard charts and a top singles in the in Canada it came seventh and then the Canadian adult contemporary it got to number three <hes> but what an amazing churn and or Sir Celine Dion was on the late show on a in the United States with James Corden ed with another edition of Carpool Karaoke and you can check out the link on Youtube. It's just brilliant and I'm sure I've saved a shed on our facebook page. Which of course you can like an interactive right and look at all the various updates news about the eurovision song contest on our facebook page facebook dot com slash E._S._e.? Showcase or if you've got facebook just search for the Eurovision showcase you can look at our page even if you don't do facebook so don't worry about that <hes> you cannot follow us in twitter if you're over there twitter dot com slash e._S._e.. Showcase of course our twitter handle is at E._S._e.. Showcase on twitter and you can email us four request if you'd like E._S._e.. E._S._e.. Showcase at g mail DOT COM now. It's time for me to let you know what's going on in the world of the Eurovision Song Contest and modernise me. It's been a very busy week since last weekend end yes. It's Tom Fuel Eurovision showcase news today on Sunday the twenty sixth of May two thousand nineteen now part of days ago all good friends at e._S._e.. Extra Nathan from Wahl and all of the Lewis. I'm look at the difficulty. The British media has in its communication about the Eurovision Song contest because basically the U._k.. Media Say Europeans have no taste in Eurovision four <unk> out in particular the coverage on ITV's Lorraine show to stop the Good Morning Britain where Lorraine Kelly and Dan Watson from the sun originally born in New Zealand what basically saying Europeans have no taste and that the U._k.. Should absolutely completely stupid ideas and my personal opinion bizarre bizarre now earlier this week the Epi you have responded to the era of the Belorussian jury voting at the Eurovision two thousand nineteen. They've now Kyra fide the mistaken in D- take him play that team taking place and that the results have now been updated and the update now sees North Macedonia. He asked the jury Winna the you have clarified that the era has now classified as human error and then they give out the following statements on Eurovision Dot T._v.. Better Russian jury was dismissed following the reveal that results for the first before we just come straight to your visions Eurovision Song contest rules so the U.. K. Have got less points eleven place at Lemon points Germany down to twenty fifth just above bus and beverage stand up to twenty pole and the move was Sweden and Norway changing places with fifth and sixth perspective but that Rainy Eurovision showcased their sorry amount so I'll cook friends at e._S._e.. Extra in Europe it wa Dot Com do that as your urine. Showcasing is time Karen House yet and I just want to mention before we head on into some more music the sad thing about the U._k.. Media just not looking at the bigger picture when it comes to the Eurovision song contests. I hope you all being agreement with me. That's as much as we love day. Michael Roy C has has a fantastic voice. His talents and his personality is extremely attractive and he is just such a lovely going so there's no doubt about that but the song I believe even the performance was so average that's. Why would anybody want to pick up the phone? If you're in Latvia your a housewife in Pearland your your farmer in Greece you know just I why why is there because when you've got twenty five other songs which are a little bit more compelling that a little bit more in-your-face sort of science come all of those countries most they've taken a chance and they they took a you know a daring response to go out there and Yana supports they managed to get I mean look at the Netherlands are sewn that was written by himself dunk from Lawrence. The Song Arcades to himself. He's obviously gonNA convict it much more through the camera. The promotion of the song of throughout the announcement back in March has just gone from strength to strength for the Netherlands hence why they were top of the betting odds the whole time but even that came second and third all fifty six Cetera they done what they dumped Chris compelling and interesting interesting song awesome sadly was outdated by probably about ten years or sorry so you have to look at it Bravo then politics because politics does have that S- minute minute inflate on the voting but as many Brits don't seem to understand when it comes to the Eurovision Song contest all music industry only his English music music but you go to Belgium go to the Netherlands eager to France Spain and you go to has a by John or you go to Turkey and Estonia Sweden they listen to different music in different languages in the music industry is into greatest particularly you know Greece and Cyprus Macedonia Serbia Croatia Slovenia <hes> an Albanian and Greece Romeny remote Dover you know they hate each other's music and so many people have don't think understand that just think it's politics and it's all about the horrible brexit but it's item. It's wait anyways. That's off my high horse. I hope you understand where I'm coming from. If you're not going to get out of my system I appreciate that really stick around here the fishing <hes> live and kicking this week and some more music. Take care on Forest F._M.. Happy Eurovision to all the Eurovision fans out there why don't Joint J. P. and the team of Radio International for a weekly trip through the world of the Eurovision Song Contest. There'll be lots of music features including the cover spas and the night market now on your browser or even better subscribe to the podcast W._W._w.. Dot Radio DOT TV at you'll never have to miss your favorites. euro-asian in radio shows hi this monsalve from Sweden. You're listening to your vision showcase on Steph APP. Take into your eyes you Kathy is if a lion feel the power vein Li- little little time in no the power silence. Keep it keep it on salons. Yeah you really and I could fly coming down. Eh Cooling Down Negu. Take me take a bra a no hidden agenda. What you see is what I was looking really and I could fly <music> down? I the by brick while you feeling I can fly AH in Guy Zell Miller with frago his cover of Cyprus's entry in two thousand eighteen coming second from Laney Harada yeah what a great cheering there for months he can do anything coney that man literally right now. It's time for us to go to the nineteen eighty-three contest in Munich and then West Germany yes yes yes and we're going to hear the song that came third for Sweden yes E._S.. And it's the English version it's love isn't love or from Makarov Huckabee. You came in <music> uh-huh Yeah Uh unreal mm-hmm <music> how musee that mad to the beep we want be talk to you and me sponges life growing flower caring for the saw. The One lady spent her days making wine the wine tasting to the uh-huh vein one strong. He's some down playing rock and roll sauce the not yet and do the wrong the man yeah legendary circling cliff rich <hes> with power off friends coming third for the United Kingdom in nineteen seventy three yes sir cliff was pipped to the post for the second place by Mama Darras from Spain the Spanish. Don't like clarify Ni- ages adjacent cliff looms Spanish and maybe urgent but it doesn't seem to manage to beat them so funny <hes> so on honestly Manara is with Aris to such a beautiful song and legendary Eurovision Song anyways and then of course the winner of ninety seventy three's and merry heat with two iconic haw and on going to be very very cheeky and GonNa play a little bit a bit from her latest sort of desk that was always very lucky enough to pick up at the Eurovision <hes> London Eurovision Party and the Catholic Topalian. Let's the square and <hes> this is awesome. I'm this is a beautiful rendition of that many David's to become the Twat the Luxembourg Eurovision winner for nineteen seventy three and then we'll have live and kicking air on Forest F._M.. <music> you don't talk to Don Jones Siddiqui who go against the long long it <music> <music> you want to know who her knee <music> awesome the eight <music> <music> <music> <music> two and this week's live and kicking is the winner of two thousand nine teen. Yes is is the Netherlands Duncan Lawrence with arcade from the grandfather of Eurovision two thousand nineteen so that is also for me here for another week of the Eurovision show case on Forest F._M.. Join me next Sunday today. At Five PM. We'll have more classic Eurovision music as well as some of the updates stock to so take care and we're happy to see you next Sunday vihear on Forest F._M.. Also you can listen to our previous shows by mixed cloud sponsor Sephora and any podcast just search for the Eurovision showcase. I live eat dechy. ofwat Covey's saying V. slack to W._G._N.. Yeah see you soon it is oh it's still the CRIBS lost pieces. A Carey eighty eighty carried mm-hmm. Please carry me on K.. Two AH <MUSIC> <MUSIC> the game. Uh can you <music> the nine nineteen point three F._M.. Vase as forest you'll do it right to spend less than the things you need to update and organize your home. Lows is here to help you save every day. Plus bonus savings this week upgrade to a newer more stylish ceiling fan and save up to twenty percent off select harbory ceiling fans reclaim claim your space with eighteen gallon totes now just four dollars ninety eight cents each and available in four colors Coral Turquoise Green and grey whatever's on your to do list today and every day do it right for less start with Lowe's offers valid through seven twenty four U._S.. 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Eurovision Showcase on Forest FM (26th May 2019)

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1:02:16 hr | 2 years ago

Eurovision Showcase on Forest FM (26th May 2019)

"Is wingstop the best thing ever happen to delivery or is delivery. The best thing that ever happened to wingstop is a tasty mystery but with eleven mouth-watering flavors delivered right to your door. You can't go wrong. It's game on with us zesty St Lemon pepper or the sweet slow bird mango heaven Arrow topped off with our hand cut perfectly seasoned fries orderonline wingstop dot com and find out how tangy and delicious delivery can be ring. Stop where flavor gets its wings very warm. Welcome to Forest F._M.. It's just going five o'clock and it's time for the Eurovision showcase with me. Kieran Hurry Tussey today you Sunday the twenty six of May two thousand nineteen eighteen and we're still celebrating the world's greatest singing competition this is genius from thereby John. Hey this is Allah gosh bid from Slovenia Hi. This is a hot from San Marino. You are listening to Eurovision showcase on Forest F._M.. Okay all right thing is dried saying some day that'll be several when you think tomorrow and you walk along with being big all right do Sunday gusty in the World Sandy and everyone is funny when they sing song that gusting our maybe uh-huh when everything is Dr singer Sunday the battle no sorrow when you seem to think being don. Let's teach in we the Ding Dong The Netherlands nineteen seventy five until this year that was the last a Dutch Eurovision win in nineteen seventy five in Stockholm Sweden the year after Abba one with a water now a sad thing about that too is that Hank Marvin and the shadows were in the nineteen seventy five contests representing the United Kingdom in their missed out to that on apparently hanging off from shadows was not very happy <hes> I can imagine with those lyrics in the previous on we just had <hes> that testing they have of making any sense what so ever but the that never never mind is just your vision I guess <hes> expect the unexpected and speaking of the unexpected. Oh my goodness me the a European Broadcasting Union earlier. This week admitted that there was a failure wave that auditors when it comes to the voting and particularly the jury votes from Belarus Larousse. E._S. says so us why he was random. Israel twelve points from Belarus O._K.. Something's going on here are <hes> yeah will explain it all as Burgers on a butts. We have a very special treat full you a very good friend David Mann from Eurovision Radio International which you can hear every Wednesday from seven to to ten here in the United Kingdom than eight to eleven in central European time is going to give us a treat in a rundown off the top ten of the Eurovision Song Contest Two Thousand Nineteen you we give music lovers with the top ten cal job of Eurovision two thousand ninety up thirty thirty three places from two thousand eighteen. It's Iceland add hatchard Buzi grow from Atari at nine the rise of eleven places for Kate Mila Hide Key and gravity gravity for Australia debris. It's up twenty-two plays. His Azerbaijan Chingiz with truth is highs new trouble with the rise is a massive thirty-five places topping the audience vote is North Macedonia and tomorrow Tedesca who's proud number seven and at six it's a rise of died places for the spirit of the sky with Kato from Norway. Now this is nervous in top five at five up two places John Ludovic with too late for love from Sweden up twenty eight places to this year's number four Switzerland Lucchini and she got me in arise of thirty three places brings Russia's Sergei Lazarev and scream to number three Italy move up free polices with Mahmoodn Mahmoud and sold e to number two this year's eurovision number one up seventeen places. It's a first win for forty four years for the Netherlands at Arcade from Dunkin Lawrence on off it <music>. ooh God move this Denver Woah dot it is fatigue not because the still do it instead D._d.. Man By aw Gal who brought sling mud Eh y'all grow the he yeah this one of my favorite Dutch Eurovision entries of all time that's The Netherlands nineteen ninety ninety four unbelievably came second last in nineteen ninety four unbelievable Velika Alberti. We've evolved as disown. Where is the son? <hes> there was one of the pre-contest favorites it's all remember and everybody was quite shocks. The results in the end and <hes> more certainly may when ovary watched it. I'm because in nineteen ninety four <hes> <hes> I was seven <hes> yeah I went over Asli the most amazing about one thousand nine hundred four contests oversee the amazing river dance coming out of it. It's just obviously it's absolutely stunning. Isn't it that piece of music so why line noticed we can play it right here on the Eurovision showcase on forests F._M.. So here is Bill Whelan's river dance from the nineteen ninety-four Eurovision Song contest <music> This uh-huh <music> <music> <music> us uh-huh uh-huh Yeah Uh. uh-huh Hi this is Urea Frontal Athena. I'm going to be this year's representative for the European Song Contest. You're listening to your vision showed case on Forest F._M.. My Song is called run with the lions it just if you want to let go deal saying this Kim News Ass Shoo Shoo <music> 'cause we got along the P._k.. We gotta love the Cap the case and a an open with figure <music>. We love the county <music> the U._k.. uh-huh <music> Yuri from Lithuania two thousand nineteen a run with the lions and he was only a couple of points from qualifying to the grandfather from semifinal to Lithuania just very well <hes> when it comes to the televising they got managed to get twelve points from Ireland Norway and the United Kingdom yes so in the Tele Verts we gave one point to Romania and then to to Russia three to Arslan which was that only three points in the televising thankfully the the gave us three points in the ground for a day <hes> a member move onto four points from to Sweden five points to the Netherlands the eventual winners six points to Switzerland Gay seven points to Azerbaijan Hi gene eight points to Malta ten points to no way and the twelve went to list uranium so yeah <hes> different I different different different <hes> but <hes> the EPA it just wow stomach comes on right okay <hes>. It's now time to do one of my favorite bits. It's time for raw random. Yes it's a part of the Eurovision showcase each week which my husband rope gets the to hunt sounds and one of the hats little bits of paper the years and the other hat has bits of paper with countries and he takes one out of each we glue it together and we play that song oversee completely random air on the Eurovision showcase now we have guests over this week this weekend. Excuse me and <HES> RUBS had to go and take a lefay friends keenly from San Francisco. I'm Mike Ho- from Charleston South Carolina <hes> to to go and take them back to the to Heathrow Airport so he did withdraw before recording so we have the country of Moldova and it's the year two thousand eight work two thousand eleven. Yes we're going to docile Dole Germany and the two thousand eleven eurovision song contacts <hes> which was my controversy that was the newest fine and the the Moldovan entry was from Szott dissolve with the song so lucky which ended up coming <hes> rather bizarrely twelfth place with ninety seven points just behind the United Kingdom's blue with I can now this song. I'm is not one of my favorites. I'm afraid did make it to the U._K.. Charts in two thousand eleven two hundred hundred fifty three. I had to law for that so semi fallen became tents or only just great for get into the grandfather goes the Maurois always onto it. I don't think it's so that's Moldova for you. So Moldova in two thousand eleven they actually had a national final and obviously is up to one the Talia Bob came second. She represented Modo from two thousand eleven <hes> with cut she quite good song called fights and she ended up coming ten show. She came tenth one of the two yeah I'm sure she came tenth through something coach light at so she did pretty well but this off where the original debut of Moldova when Moldova debuted in two thousand and five in Kiev we have Ukraine serve just one of those things I guess so like in twenty ten they had a pre-selection ravage conclusions with two steps. I sing as songwriters were able to submit their entries online the T._R._M.. Wiped sowings and then an expert jury listened to songs invents elected sixteen for the second stage which each of the sixty bridge ously selected performance had three minutes demonstrate the vocal abilities of the live food dish in from the two thousand eighteen January the Moldovan as well as the better Russian auditions you can watch them generally live online and <hes> it's the most horrific thing you've ever sorry funny right <hes> so when it came to the grandfather Mo- David minutes get points for our mania trump don't you I'm then in the final they got eight points from the United Kingdom Italy City and Orland seven points Azerbaijan better reuss Russia and Ukraine five points from Australia Georgia Portugal and Slovakia four points to from France Germany Lithuanian at one point from Belgium respectively but at the grandfather Mordova gave it's eight points to Ukraine which is making Newton with the sand offsets the original Santa performance that okay and then <hes> ten points went to as a by Sean which was editor Nikki the eventual winners running scared and twelve points went to Romania remains in two thousand eleven was sung by Oy a group hotel F. M. with song change but one of my favorite bits about is that one of the members of Hotel F._M.. Is Actually <hes> versus <hes> ex-pats David Brian and I love it and it's one of my favorite Romanian entries I must say so well deserved to those twelve points so let's vital tongues and listen to Australia Australia Moldova two thousand thousand eleven so I don't know how managed to say Australia hair is absorbed dissolve with so lucky Moldova two thousand eleven robes random requests and it's random indeed <music> the I thought in his own show and now I ooh yeah take the size and now uh-huh <music> <music> they get service Ram as such as choose. You don't allow yeah in the wit aw that's. You don't they it sir. Ah <music> it then in the winner of Eurovision Nineteen eighty-eight Switzerland Celine Dion way the water from the moon that was from her second English studio album in nineteen ninety two just simply code Celine Dion. Yes it was commercially released in the march of nineteen ninety three as the faith single a single the song <hes> in the United States and in Canada was a radio single owning a water from the Moon was written by Damn Warren who produce and produced by Guy Roach with additional production from water data on a Steph and Warren did also the backing vocals making us. I die or more. She covered the U._k.. Enter in two thousand nine for Jade U._N.. It's might time but it got to number. The one indicate beckon music as stations and in the United States he got to eleven in the adult contemporary billboard charts and the top singles in the in Canada came seventh and in the Canadian adult contemporary contemporary eight got to number three <hes> but what an amazing churn and or Sir Celine Dion was on the late show on a in the United States with James Corden ed with another edition of Carpool Karaoke and you can check out the Lincoln Youtube. It's just brilliant and I'm sure I've saved a shed on our facebook page. Which of course you can like an interactive? Look at all. The various updates news about the eurovision song contest on our facebook page facebook dot com slash E._S._e.. Showcase or if you've got facebook just search for the Eurovision showcase you can look at our page even if you don't do facebook so don't worry about that <hes> you cannot follow us on twitter. You're over their twitter dot com slash E._S._e.. Showcase of course our twitter handle is at E._S._e.. Showcase on twitter and you can aim last four request if you'd like E._S._e.. A._S._C. Showcase at g mail DOT COM now. It's time for me to let you know what's going on in the world of the Eurovision Song contest and Marcus me. It's been a very busy week since last weekend and yes. It's Tom Fuel Eurovision showcase news today on Sunday the twenty six of May two thousand nineteen now part of days ago all good friends at e._S._e.. Extra Nathan Tom Wodel and all of the Lewis. I'm look at the difficulty. The British media has in its communication about the new visions song contest because basically the U._k.. Media Say Europeans have no taste in Eurovision four house in particular the coverage on ITV's Lorraine show to stop the Good Morning Britain where Lorraine Kelly and Dan Watson from the sun originally born in New Zealand what basically sang Europeans have no taste and the U._k.. Should absolutely completely stupid days and my personal opinion bizarre bizarre now earlier this week the Epi you have responded to the era of the Belorussian jury voting at Eurovision two thousand nineteen. They've now clarified the mistaken in D.. Take him play that Dean taking place and that the results have now been updated and the update now sees North Macedonia <music>. Ask the jury Winna the E._v.. You have clarified that the era has now classified as human error and then they give out the following statements on Eurovision Dot T._v.. Better Russian jury was dismissed following the reveal that results in the first semi fawn which is concentrate to Eurovision Eurovision song contest rules so the U._k.. Have got less points eleven place at eleven points Germany down to twenty fifth just above Boston Belarus stood up to twenty coal and <hes> the move was Sweden Norway changing places with fifth and sixth perspective but that really is you your vision showcase news. There are sorry about show friends at E._S._P._N.. Extra in Europe it wa Dot Com do that as your urine. Showcasing is time care R._A.. Sushi and they'll just want to mention before we had on into some more music the sad thing about the U._k.. Media just not looking at the bigger picture when it comes to the Eurovision Song Tastes. I hope you all being agreement with me. That's as much as we love day Michael Roy. He hasn't is in a fantastic voice talents and his personality is extremely attractive and he is just such a lovely going so there's no doubt about the but the song I believe the performance cooperage that's why would anybody want to pick up the phone. If you're in Latvia your a housewife in Pearland your your farmer in Greece you know just I why why is there because when you've got twenty five other songs which are a little bit more compelling that a little bit more in-your-face sort of stance on all of those countries most they've taken a chance and they they took a you know a daring response to go out there and Yana supports. They managed the get. I mean look at the Netherlands I sown that was written by himself. Dunk from Lawrence. The Song Arcades to himself obviously going to convict it much more over through the camera. The promotion of the song of throughout the announcement back in March has just gone from strength strength strength for the Netherlands hence why they were top of the betting odds the whole time but even that came second and third all fifty six execture they done what they dump it Chris Compelling Interesting Interesting Song Awesome sadly was outdated by probably about ten years or sorry so you have to look as it rather than politics politics does have that S- minute minute inflate on the voting but as many Brits don't seem to understand when it comes to the Eurovision Song contest all music industry only his English music music but you go to Belgium go to the Netherlands eager to France Spain and you guards who has a by John or you go to Turkey on Estonia or Sweden they listen to different music can different languages. The in the music industry is into greatest particularly you know Greece and Cyprus <hes> Macedonia Serbia Croatia Slovenia <hes> an Albanian and Greece Romania remote Dover you know they hate each other's music and so many people have don't think understand that just think it's politics and it's all about the horrible brexit but I I creates waves anyways. That's my high horse. I hope you understand wherein coming from if you're not going to get out of my system appreciate that stick around him the proficient <hes> live and kicking this week and some music take care on Forest F._M.. Happy Eurovision into all the Eurovision fans out there why don't join J._p.. And the team of Radio International for a weekly trip through the world of the Eurovision Song contest they'll be lots of music oxygen to cover spas and the market now on your browser or even better subscribe to the Podcast Riot W._w._w.. Dot Radio National DOT TV at you'll never have to miss your favorite euro-asian in radio shows hi. This is monsalve from Sweden. You're listening to your vision showcase on for his death at a ticket into your you. Kathy is if alliance view the power thing Ain Line a little little time in no the power silence Kita keep it on salon the you clearly and I could fly coming down you. Could they go take a no hidden agenda. What you see is what I was looking to comply and I gum and feeling I consi- ah in Guy Zell Miller with frago his cover of Cypresses entry in two thousand eighteen coming second from Laney Harare yeah what a great cheering there for months he can do anything coney that man literally right now it's time for us to go to the nineteen eighty-three contest in Munich and then West Germany yes yes yes and we're going to hear the song that came third for Sweden? Yes yes and it's the English version. It's love isn't love from Makarov Huckabee when you came into this <music> aw. Eh <hes> arena uh-huh. How do you musee that man to be? We want bitty. The baby sponges life growing flowery caring fall. Uh One lady spent a days may one day stick to the <music> okay one strong using some down rock and roll the not yet a man <music> the legendary sutcliffe early for it with power to off friends coming third for the United Kingdom in nineteen seventy three yes sir cliff was pipped at the post for the second place by Mama Darras from Spain. The Spanish don't like clarify not your time ages auto think cliff from Spanish and maybe urgent but it doesn't seem to manage to beat them so funny <hes> so on honestly Mama Dada is with heiress to such beautiful song and in a legendary Eurovision Song anyways and then of course the winner of ninety seventy three's and merry heat with two iconic haw and honor to be very very cheeky and GonNa play a little bit eight from her lightest sort of desk that <hes> was always very lucky enough to pick up at the Eurovision <hes> London Eurovision Party and the Catholic Pallini unless the square and <hes> this is awesome and this is a beautiful rendition of that in many David's to become the Twat the Luxembourg nineteen seventy-three and then we'll have live and kicking air farce F._M.. <music> you could make talk to Johnston Wiki Wiki go against all wrong it <music> <music> Woah Cou q her knee <music>. Excuse the yeah <music> <music> <music> <music> two and this week live and kicking is the winner of two thousand nine teen. Yes it's The Netherlands Duncan Lawrence with arcade from the grandfather and or of Eurovision two thousand nineteen so that is also for me here for another week of the Eurovision show case on Forest F._M.. Join me next Sunday at five PM. We'll have more classic Eurovision music as well as some of the update to so take care from a happy to see you next Sunday by here on Forest F._M.. Also you can listen to operate these shows why mixed cloud sponsor the phone and then he just search for the Eurovision showcase. I let me Dechy Ofwat Covey's Saying v slack to w tenure of see you soon too. It's still the CRIBS lost. Piece is a Kerry eighty eighty carried mm-hmm. Please carry me on K.. Two Yeah <music> <music> the game uh-huh. Can You <music> the nine nineteen point three F._M.. 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