20 Episode results for "Covington Burling"

OA285: Tulsi Gabbard & Michael Flynn

Opening Arguments

1:10:47 hr | 1 year ago

OA285: Tulsi Gabbard & Michael Flynn

"So I hold myself in contempt. If you try to pull me up here to court without attorney. The questions caught Jacka Willie objection. I'm gonna lowered Gerke Rogers that offenders carjacker. You didn't kill Thompson, but you did Mr. Welsh. Karen. Water. Paul is out of order of water. Welcome to opening arguments the podcast, that pairs inquisitive interviewer with the real life lawyer. This podcast is sponsored by the law offices of p Andrew Torres LLC for entertainment purposes, is not intended as legal advice, does not form attorney client relationship. Don't take legal advice from podcast. Hello. And welcome to opening arguments. This is up two hundred eighty five common at you not lot while we're live. We're live. Yeah. I rely I'm alive. But it'll be edited, hopefully, they may need that, because you never know what's going to happen. We are on location, San Francisco. That's where all the Legal News is happening. I'm sure how's it going? Andrew any of these going fantastically. Well, very, very excited to do another live in person, you and I are, are in the same lovely studio together. Oh, yeah. That's true. Because the QNA in case you missed it go. Check that out. That's available for patrons on patriots or with some high quality audio or you can hop onto YouTube and find it as well. But that was fun. We were we were together at last together you'll Soka, and we are together again. But we are this is businesses norm. L. A O A waits for no man. Yeah. So we have to continue the show. And I think we got pretty good setup here. I think we, we nailed it. We'll see. We'll see Brian tells me when I sent him these files, but we have so much to talk about. We've got the tariff news. That's definitely going well in his well-thought out. And I'm sure we'll just smooth sailing. I've been version Andrews against Al smooth sailing. You know, stay on stay on target. Trump's got it. Okay. And then some yodel mountain. Oh, yeah. This is always good news. Andrew quick preview question for iota mountain. Is it a good sign? Multiple. Choice. Good sign or bad, sign when you fire your million billion gillians, zillion dollar turns a critical time. Right. When you need them been convicted. And while you are pending sentencing while it pled guilty. Okay. While you are pending sentencing in a criminal case is it a good sign to fire? One of the best law firms. Tonight. That's what I'm reading from the bar. Booklet right here. Yeah. Very we're gonna have to. Let's, let's open. And then we're talking about the DNC, there could be some critical, little rules that come into play because there are nine hundred seventy three candidates and I think the first debate is nine hundred seventy two yeah. So, you know, have to argue about what exactly will disqualify that, that last person, I think, we're in there somewhere. There's so many I hope that there is an away representation that stage I will point out if you know, we have twenty candidates on stage and we're limited to ninety minutes per question that they better hope that I don't get ninety. Question. Nine ninety minutes ninety minutes for the whole thing. Yeah. There's yeah. That'd be that's an away lightning ground. Yeah. That would they would need a zookeeper with a dart guy just ready to go when Andrew starts going to that. All right. Let's do. Oh, you have some teasing though, for Tuesday's episode. Yes. Lots of people have asked about the revelations in the department of commerce versus Ross case. The citizenship question, and there have been explosive new allegations that have come out, I say, explosive they're things that are totally unsurprising in any kind of way. And so the question is, how is this going to impact that pending decision there was an order handed down today, but let's put all that together. Nothing is going to change in that they're going to be no developments between now in Tuesday. So we're going to cover that on a super deep dive on Tuesday answer all of your questions about the citizenship question case. But, but we just don't have time to do that, and everything that's breaking to you've heard of a deep dive, but have you heard of a super-duper depot that'll be all right? Well, look forward to that on Tuesday, banal, I believe it's time to talk about the tariff wars. Mexico is out there, the threat is that but we haven't really started. Great clone tariffs. Yes. So this seems like it's going well Trump, I think issued some demands, but not, but it's not Mexico's not even sure what to do. And it was like do the vague stuff that I want you to do or we'll start tariffing ourselves because that's how it works. You know. Go through that, right? Because I think this'll be super instructive secure your southern border. I will stab myself with this pen right now. So you and I know how this, but what are you explain, like how tariffs work from somebody with, with your, I'll start with what Trump seems to think which is? So you've got some some trading going on, right? I guess it's just importing expert at crossing the border, right? It's all I think it's just if it crosses the border likes not even if you're selling it or anything because I've read a lot about how some of these auto parts are just shipping across multiple times. And it has to be it has to formerly be imported toward it. Okay. But it's so I wasn't sure slightly different than like selling, it Corozzo. Okay. But anyway, if it's imported or vice versa, guest, depending on who's terrifying whom. Yeah. I think he think Trump thinks when we buy things sort of, like when you buy stuff from the grocery store, for example, I've used before by stuff from Safeway. I buy groceries from Safeway now I've spent in my life. What tundras of thousands of dollars on groceries? I don't know how idea over the course of my entire life, and they've never they've never paid me for anything. So I need revenge on because I all I've done is pay hundred thousand dollars. They haven't paid any money now. Yes, I was able to eat and live for that time. But that doesn't they haven't paid me any dollars. So therefore, I'm gonna terrif- them. And then magic is I think is the next I think he thinks that with we do tariff, then Mexico gives us money and then step five profit. I think but really what it is. We do the terrify people who are importing the goods that person. So somebody with a business in. Where has whoever Pennsylvania, something who's like, oh, I can get these have the workers in Mexico may make these parts. Do some stuff too. And I move it across the border to finish up, or whatever that, that's the guy who pays the, the money now it still affects the pricing and all that because obviously, if he can no longer, what a sexist thing if he or she if they whoever is running the factory, I since I had Trump in mind, I'm just thinking about, you know, evil white businessman. That's my typical like in my head, but whoever it is whoever's doing the importing if it costs them way too much, which it probably will after all this said and done then obviously that will kill the demand that will eventually does have some effect. But that's what I think, is going on. Where did I get that, right? Or wrong. No, I think I think you got that exactly right. And the critical aspect here is that the terrif- is paid on the US consumer imports goods from. Mexico. So in other words, your auto part costs one hundred dollars when you buy it from a Mexican supplier that now costs one hundred and five dollars, and as a result, your fixed costs for building, your car, or building, whatever it is that you're doing with, that part have now gone up by five percent, right? And many, many industry. Right. So if if you were if the price on your raw materials goes up, right? Not everything is going to be imported. But let's say you manufacture stuff in this country you use part sourced from all over the world. Some of that comes from Mexico. You're now paying three percent more for your raw materials will that's three percent less in profits. And if your profit margin is four or five percent on average. You know, now, all of a sudden, you know, you've have or worse you were potential profits. So this could really be imposing tariffs. It's on the importation of foreign goods has the potential to drastically effect at the margins businesses that require on the importation of. Materials that are that are produced elsewhere. Yeah. And like there's obviously, there's what happens every time when Trump does something stupid is, there's a higher level conversation of, like, well, there are problems with this, and obviously, he has no information on that. And or just doesn't care doesn't read so he doesn't he's not doing anything that would address that. But there it's not like so there, there's some obnoxious sides, the arguments and people who could ultimately agree like, well, something needs to be done for good reasons and therefore mister capital, T tariff men doing all this stuff might have some effect. What's the history of if brief? I mean people this hasn't been done really like since for a long time. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So to two things, but before we kinda talk about all of the ways in which deviates from even standard protectionist tariffs. Right. So, for example, we talked about Trump's tariffs on China back in one sixty two and I'm gonna talk about the ways in which. This is very, very different from that invocation of authority. But so, so the argument that the steel manning of the argument, we're gonna steal man, Donald Trump. How about that? Yeah. We must if we must the stealing the argument is there's gonna be a five percent tariff on that steel. We will. It's going to cost us more, but we're doing it for you. If, if you have a supplier that you believe is artificially reducing what it costs produce that right? Slave labor, for example right now. You import that, and that widget that you are importing is being produced at a sub market rate, right? Make sense. Like, if you're trying to protect certain businesses in the US and country, ax is like oh, we can make that because they have children do it or don't pay him. Oh, we can make that way cheaper. It might make sense to say. While we, that's a that's awful, like we don't wanna profit, and that's hasn't happened. But that might happen, we don't wanna profit on the backs of child labor and some country and be that we don't want that to kill the business that there would be in the US. So kind of offset that Kereta match. It isn't exactly right. So, so that is the steel. An argument for that, that doesn't apply here. Right. Because as you as you're going to see from the language here, it is utterly unconnected to the production of US-based widgets, right? Like there's, there's not even any predicate finding in, in the Trump statement, which by the way, he wrote himself rightly it's not like there was an infant wreck. So there's not even any claimed connection between protected. Is his stupid idea is definitely not true that if he does enough of this, then they'll bring all the factories. No, no. And I'm going to get to. It's even dumber than that, right? But point to we've described how will unilateral tariff on Mexican goods that are exported from Mexico imported into the United States would be bad for US business that assumes Mexico just shuts up and takes it. Right. Because what always happens in these situations is the other country says, oh, you're imposing tariffs on our goods. We're gonna do the same in reverse. Right. That's what we mean by trade war. Right. That is the escalate right of, of raising the cost to your end consumers on goods from other countries like you'd want some sort of like a North American. I don't know free truck like it a like a range, now a free trade like a grain Schmidt, a dream at navy. I think the way you want people to leave re on North America would be key. Yeah. No, that makes sense. I mean, obviously and again, acknowledging there good arguments against certain ways you could go here there on this. This isn't the way to having a, a bunch of thumb wars. One two, three four of tear for, and then spiraling out of control. And by the way, tariffs being on illogical things like just a cut like the original round of tariffs. It was like, well, this is going to have this thing isn't. And like, you know, there's no logic to it. So here's the statement and I'm going to link it in the show notes. But here's here's the crucial aspect of the statement, and you'll see instantly the, the way in which this is different from everything in literally, I've never seen anything like this. Okay. So Trump says to address the. Emergency at the southern border. I'm invoking the authorities granted to me by the international emergency economic Powers Act. But opinion that accordingly starting on June tenth twenty nineteen that is Monday, the US will impose a five percent tariff on all goods on all goods imported from Mexico. If the illegal migration crisis is alleviated, the reflective actions taken by Mexico to be determined in our sole, discretion and judgment. The tariffs be removed. Pause there I think it is entirely possible. Donald Trump wrote this sentence. Right. I cannot he's it's tasted it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think he said I should say like it. True, one of his personal lawyers chase secular who is, is maybe a lawyer dumb enough to have written this, but, but outside of that it is. It is mind. Boggling, to me, that would be like, No MR Trump, you cannot use imperfect to itty throughout the universe here. It's like sending a ransom note and being like Andrew. I have your dog. I have your dog until such time, and I send you this note, unlike until such time as you have done things that I will figure out, then I still have your like why wait to send that way to kidnap the ducks, have you don't have my, my. I know I send you a demand letter that has no tangible demands. Why bother why? Save on postage to this is, I think a window into the demented mind of, of Donald Trump, who thinks like what you do is right. You, you maximize your leverage or like I'm gonna come out strong, and I'm going to demand this, and this, and then Mexico's gonna come to the table and capitulate, and like an and as you point out, right. This is a five day deadline to do a thing that we don't tell you what it is in our sole discretion judgment. Otherwise, we will pay more taxes. Otherwise we're gonna continue to hurt ourselves. Yeah. Then continues if the crisis persists Kama, however, comma, which. Anyway, if the crisis persists, however, the tariffs, will be raised to ten percent on July one. And then it keeps it escalates up to twenty five percent right? Every month it's like up, what that's another five percent. That's another five percent until October one twenty nineteen tariff of twenty five percent terrorists will permanently remain at the twenty five percent level unless and until Mexico substantially stops, the illegal inflow of aliens coming through its territory. So again, more evidence. I think that Trump wrote this, and not even a terribly stupid lawyer write like a lawyer, even J secular would like define what the thing is right. Would be like we need to solve this crisis here in after blah, blah, blah. And then you wouldn't say like until the crisis is alleviated for paragraph one for sentenced one and then in sentence three go. And we're going to keep those until it's substantially stops the illegal. Which one is it? There's no way if you were I'm thinking about this as like if Mexico, were my client, right? And there's no way. Amdo. Know-how. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Now, what makes the strange if you went back and listen to one sixty two. And by the way, that's a, that's a good idea. It's episode. I'm gonna do it right now. While you're no okay? So when Donald Trump announced the steel tariffs he did. So pursuant to nineteen seventy four law. Right. And that those steel tariffs are an aspect of where congress delegated certain authority to the president. Right. To promulgate regulations and take actions recommendations security, one that he no, no. That's the that's the distinction here. Right. So those previous every time the president has that I know of imposed tariffs on another country, pursuant number one. It must be pursuant to congressional delegation of authority that power rests with congress. But like look like. We understand there's the need for flexibility, right? Like you can't just say okay, we're gonna make all the findings congress move, slowly. So we're going to delegate certain authority to the president to make findings in connections with developments the change. And that's part of law. The authorities cited here is the I e e PA, the inter the international emergency economic Powers Act that is fifty USC section seventeen to this is the section that Trump cited in his emergency declaration over the building the wall writing, and we talked about, how that was going to be the subject of lawsuits and Trump who always wins and wins until you're tired of winning lost on that completely gave up, right? Like, I'm gonna use this, and I'm going to divert funds to build the border wall. And you know what, like that didn't happen at all because the legality of that was was beyond questionable here. There is nothing. Thing in the I e EPA that grants. The president the power to impose a tariff. Really? Yeah. Here's what it says. It says at the time into the extent specified in previous section, the president may under such regulations as he may prescribe by means of instructions licenses or otherwise, investigate regulate or prohibit a does is now a one, a one any transactions in foreign exchange a to transfers of credit or payment between by through or to any banking institution. Right. And we've talked about like freezing. Freezing aspirin. Yeah. Okay. To the extent, again, that's not unlimited to the extent that such transfers payments involved, any interest of any foreign country, our national thereof, not a huge limitation, but and three the importing or exporting of currency or securities by any person with respect to any property subject to the jurisdiction of. The United States. Now I didn't hear tariff. Yeah. There's no look, so to make the argument you have to say this is part of my power to otherwise right. Right. And it has to be with respect to someone subject to the jurisdiction of the United States. I'm gonna use this on the bar, by the way, how answer e I have the power to other one other otherwise clause. So this. Time to make a quick prediction and move on from the segment. This is going to develop. I believe the tariff will go into place, and it will be announced, we'll go into place on a Monday, the tenth and will then immediately be the subject of lawsuits, and we're going to be embroiled in lawsuits. And I think a court has really, really good again. I've been through all of the law, the steel manning on the other side, is that courts interpreting, the I E, P A, have given it, an expansive definition. Right. So, but I have never seen the IEP A used to impose tariffs. I believe that it has not. And I think the argument of no, you don't have the power to do this under this law. It's a really, really strong, so it could get enjoined. Yes. Yes. That's exactly what I think will happen. If I had only invested in injunction futures. This would be a billionaire. Yeah. Injunction this you would. Well, yeah. Well, this is only the. Segment. I know we could go on at length about this. But I think we, we need to leave it there yet much. That will initially. I think I think it's going to be announced on Monday. And I think probably before it can be implemented. A court will issue an emergency injunction blocking it from going into effect because the word isn't there. And, and look, the reasons we're going to go it's way too much in the weeds. We're gonna see what happens with the filing. But the reason is that the nineteen seventy-four law that, that Trump used with respect to China. Requires you to make certain predicate administrative findings right now again it's not hard. It's your administrative agency, but it just takes time, and I think Trump was Noah disciplined, they don't have. So we'll go into over under on how many times you think somebody in the administration has set tried to say president. Terrif-. They don't would not how an inorder you know, like. Thousand how many times I think any estimate you have anyone trying to correct Trump? Like if you haven't read, volume two of the Muller report like every other page is like, and then Trump instructed his subordinates to do that. And then we're like no, we're not gonna do that. It's not works. Any of this work over under on? That's not. All right. Well time to move on to some yodeling. Hey listeners opening arguments is brought to you by light stream, if you're looking for a way to save some extra money this summer start by paying less interest on your credit card balances you can refinance those bounces with credit card consolidation loan from light stream. 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Because people have got to know whether or not their president's across you're not aware of any contacts during the course of the election. How many times have to this question? Can you just rooms? I know you have to get up and ask a question. So and put Russia is a ruse. Okay. Well, the answer to the question, the, the absolute cliffhanger of a question posed in the pre show does firing your high-powered attorneys as you're still awaiting sentencing. Does that bode well or poorly poorly? Again, full disclaimer, Michael Flynn's lawyers at Covington Burling, not just I used to work for Covington, Berlin. But rob counter was in my class. It's we are I, I know him. Well Steve, Anthony is a long standing that's the number two there. He's a long standing of counsel someone for whom I have done work. Right. So, so I know these folks really, really, well, you didn't get comment or anything. Did you reach out text for common? I. I can start doing that. But I have a pretty good idea. What the answer is going to be, she just put in every show notes OA reached out for comment. But yeah, are for everybody just this that is assume that unless I say, otherwise, because I have reached out anyway. All right. All right. So this relates to this is volume two of the Muller report beginning at page one twenty one and and what happened in in. So that's the obstruction section Covington and Burling Michael Flynn's lawyers began cooperating with the Muller investigation in November of twenty seventeen. And as a result, Michael Flynn withdrew from a joint defense agreement that he had with the president. Yeah. Right. Joint defense agreement says, hey the lawyers for both sides can share documents and it's all covered by common privilege. And so, when said you know what I'm not sure I wanna be a part of that thing anymore because I am talking to prosecutors, and prosecutors are telling me as, as happening I've committed crimes. And now there is we no longer have a joint interest. We have interests that are adverse to one another, so. Told the president haywar withdrawing from this joint defense agreement, and then the president's personal lawyer, John Dowd called rob Kellner Covington and Burling and left a voicemail. And said let's play it. Yeah. No, I, I wish we and said, no. No, no, I'm not gonna try and do John Dowd's voice because don't you could do anything? I'd be like oh yeah. That's a dead ringer. Yeah. So, hey, rob this John again. Maybe I'm sympathetic I understand your situation. But let me see if I can't, I can't state it in starker terms. By the way, these bums are in the trans. I'm trying to do if you have and it wouldn't surprise me if you've gone to make a deal with and work with the government. I understand you can't join in the joint defense. That's one thing if on the other end, we have there's information that implicates the president, then we've got a national security issue, or maybe a national security issue. I, I don't know some issue we've got to, we, we've got to deal with not only for the president, but for the country so, you know, then then, you know, we need some, we need some kind of heads up. Just for the sake of protecting all of our interests, if we can without you having to give up any commit cronk. Forget that static crimes. No. Well. And this is the sentence that Alan Dershowitz, and, and people who are not arguing in good faith of seized on. So I, I do wanna pause, absent the joke here. He says, so so, you know, then the, you know we need some kind of heads up. Just for the sake of protecting Oliver interest. If we can, you know, without you having to give up any confidential information. So, and if it's the former than than, you know, remem, remember what we've always said about the president and his feeling toward Flynn. And, and you know that still remains but. In any event. Let me know. And, and I appreciate listening and taking the time. Thanks, pal. So you're reading that word for word is word for word. I'm for 'em. And thanks, pal with the spell. I am. I'm not a lawyer. I this strikes me as the demand you start reading this strikes me as him someone like you give an improv actor like, okay, you need to convince someone to commit crimes with you without saying, hey, let's do some crime. Schism crimes by like. That is why wanna read the entire Email in its with no reductions no changes. No nothing because that Email was summarized in the Miller report. The reason for it being summarized. Was again, out of an abundance of caution for not revealing potentially privileged information. Right. And, and it was quoted right? So there are ellipses, and it is quoted unlike the bar letter, for example, with, like, thirteen different ellipses in there. Right. And the reason you do that is because you're treading super carefully. When you have the president's personal lawyer talking to Michael Flynn's personal lawyer, right like you. So the argument being made in the far right circles, is that Muller's excerpt ING of that Email was misleading and that always male voice right? And that, and that now that this is it's obviously, you know, total exoneration of the president obscure issue right now. Did you get the full one? That's the full with that was. That was the one. I'm not gonna read the re the excerpted one because it's exactly say that can go home when page one Twenty-one evolved to go. Check it out. But I remember there is argument about, like, well, he said, no without revealing our. Hey, I'm thinking is there a way because, you know, banks have lots of money, right? And I'm just thinking, like if you and I if we could convince the Bank to give the money crimes. Yeah, without comedian, do we make it clear, the half to give it to us of their own will? But they're gonna give it to without no crimes. No, no, no crimes. No crimes. Yeah. It, it clearly sounds that way. And remember, this is a lawyer leaving of voicemail. Yes that to somebody who was cooperating with prosecutors. Right. So John would have to be and he's not, he's a smart guy have talked about, you know, the, the work he did in, in the Pete Rose investigation. Right. Like he's a super smart guy who's been lawyering for three times as long as I've been alive. And so he he's not gonna do the like. We're in, you know, in I'm craze on the no he's not gonna do that, and the Muller report. Let's go back to it. The surrounding testimony after that voicemail was left is what's really, really damning here, and it didn't change. So this is now. What Flynn through his council told Muller. Right. They got the voicemail and again, the voicemail is allied in one two, three four five six places right? Then it says the next day Flims attorneys, Ken, my, my buddy rub Kellner return, the call from the president's personal counsel to acknowledge receipt of the voicemail, Lindh's attorneys reiterated that they were no longer in a position to share information under any sort of privilege, according to Flynn's attorneys, the president's personal council was indignant and vocal in his disagreement. The president's personal counsel counsel, said that he interpreted what they said to him as a reflection of Flynn's hostility towards the president, and that he planned to inform. His client, that is the president of the United States. Donald J Trump of that interpretation Lindh's attorneys understood that statement to be an attempt to make them reconsider their position because the president's personal council believe that Flynn would be disturbed to know that such a message would be conveyed to the president. That was very convoluted. Could you give us the Andrew yell? So the Andrew is. Covington. Burling gets this voicemail. They talked to Michael Flynn, they say holy clown horn. The president's lawyer just called me and said, can we commit some crimes here? Right. I've gotta look, I'm sorry. I've got to call back and say, no look, we're withdrawing from the joint defense agreement. We're talking to ask, you know, I can't talk to you about any of this. Even if you've done the like, oh, it's patriotic for, you know, there could be a national security issue or other issue. I gotta do this. And then rub Kelner says I talked to John Dowd and John Dowd was angry. He said, I was indignant and vocal. That Dowd was indignant and vocal in his disagreement with our interpretation, and even further said, I'm going to tell the president, I'm going to tell Donald Trump that your being hostile to the president that. It's a reflection of Flynn's hostility to the president, and then Kelner says, and I rob Kellner interpreted that as an attempt to make me reconsider my position on withdrawing from the joint defense agreement, so obstruction. Yes, if course it is obstruction. So let's go to then the terminal finding it's ten pages later, by the way, there's nine other patient right away. Saints ten pages later before we get to the terminal finding that's because there's nine more pages of how Trump just in this section. Yeah. Tried to obstruct Justice in connection with Michael Flynn. Here's what ultimately Robert Muller's team concludes with regard to Flynn, the president's had private and public messages to Flynn encouraging him to stay strong and conveying that the president still cared about him before he began to cooperate with the government when Flynn's attorney's withdrew from joint defense agreement, signaling that Flynn was potentially cooperating with the government. The president's personal council initially reminded Flint's count. All of the president's warm feelings towards Flynn and said that still remains. But when Flynn's council reiterated that Flynn could no longer share information under a joint defense agreement. The president's personal council stated that the decision would be interpreted as reflecting Flynn's hostility to the president. The sequence of events could have had the potential to a flight effect Flint's decision to cooperate, right? That's all you need to obstruct Justice timid, ating witness. You are you one hundred percent. It doesn't have to be intimidation inducing, a witness in any way to give testimony right to refuse to cooperate as well as the extent of that cooperation, okay? Yeah, talk to, but, you know, if there's a thing that could involve as an pray and national security. And then Muller continues because of privilege issues. However, we could not determine whether the president was personally involved or knew about the specific message that the council delivered to Flint council and this morning. Michael Flynn fired. Those lawyers. We do not yet know who he has hired. I wou I would have done that the reason to do that again. Now stepping criminal yonder now now where we are is outside of the, the mullahs report. And now I'm speculating okay. I think Flynn has seen. I think he's done a Thomas Negga. Tron right. He's looked at the last eighteen months and said, great. My lawyers were telling me I needed to cooperate. I need a treat live this like an ordinary criminal case that there are consequences that would be going to jail all of that. But. Why should why should I be the one playing by the marquees of Queensberry rules here? When the president everybody around him doesn't seem to care. And so if I fire CNB right now at the time that this meant that this voicemail becomes public that is my way of signaling back to the president. Hey, look. I stayed strong. That's what that is. The only way that I can interpret is, this is Flynn go. Yeah. Oh, yeah. You're right. This came out and I didn't know and now right? You know, screw those guys. Here's my question. This is not entirely may be on the topic of what you're talking about. But. You mentioned that this lawyer, who left, this voice mail. This is not a crank. This is not. This is an experienced yet old old guard guy. But, but what I wanna know is what kind of desperation does that signal to you. Right. I mean to leave voicemail like that. And then what was he protecting? I mean, this is I guess, one of the many reasons that people thought there'd be so much in the mall report in there was, but, like, what is that is that something we know about, like, what, how what would make them so nervous as to try to commit a crime or to, to stay abreast of you know what you know? Right. So the answer to that is remember that what Michael Flynn is being sentenced for. Here is lying to the Muller investigation about his contacts with Russian ambassador, Sergei Kislyak. Right. So the only way to interpret this is. Oh, gosh. Somebody with extensive contacts between us. And Russia is now talking to Robert Muller and the, the, the tone and substance of this of new. No could be all right to, to general right to somebody who you know is, whether you agree with them or not. And obviously we disagree with them on virtually everything. Right. It I don't think you can be a high ranking member of the army and not be patriotic about the country, right? And not be and not feel like okay. All you're working with Red Eye. I get it. It look but, but you see the, the tug on the efforts to appeal not just to his. Yeah. Right. Oh, you're in this, too. But also the like they look this, this could be a national security or other thing, right? Like it's it's hard to steal man. My saying is if yeah. If I'm if I'm you know, Trump guy over here. I'm trying to to give. That side. What possible reason? I mean, if this is all a big hoax, if rusher is a ruse, what possible reason could there, be for this voice mail, you know, like what I cannot begin to. I mean, again, I, I will Lincoln, the show notes, the Alan Dershowitz, daily caller peace, yet, point now you're right. Actually won't do that. Give them clicks. It's it's it is one hundred percent if you, if you had any thought left of we'll, maybe there are alternative explanations, and not like Dershowitz, one hundred percent in the tank for Trump reading Alan Dershowitz attempting to explain how like this is just terrible news for Robert Muller. Now that the full voicemail is out when you look at how misleading the summary in the report was, it's it is. It is laugh, you have to live in an in an in a in the world of alternative facts, and in a world in. Which, you know, Kellyanne Conway, is the only person telling the truth cook to parse what Dershowitz, so this terrible. Yeah. Dershowitz nightmare. I countdown to us finding out more about why why he's so in. Yeah. This so to conclude the firing is all about sending a message yet I think I think that is sending a message of Flynn go and hey look like I didn't give him them much, and I and I'm standing trumping or their Flynn is hoping that Trump sees that and. Wow. Yeah. And so what that tells you is. It's entirely possible that. Lind had were stuff that he is not yet given. Yeah, good point. So I know the, the question with pardons, and all that is always, you know, state crimes remind me on Flynn, do we have him on any state anything. We do not have him on any state anything because Flynn was the, the person. And if you look at volume one of the Muller report, the there is extensive documentation about Flynn's contacts with Kislyak context with Russia. Ultimately the conduct for which he was indicted, and then to which he pled guilty was lying to the Muller investigation. So, you know, that's not that does not implicate a, a state investment shoot this, this took a depressing. Turn. I wasn't prepared for that. How well jeez. The bad guys always win. Wow. Should we leave it on that? Let's leave it on that awful note. And we'll see what, what transpires before next week policy genius is the easy way to shop for insurance online in just two minutes, you can compare quotes from top insurers to find your best price. Once you apply the policy genius team will handle the paperwork and the red tape. No sales pressured, no hidden fees, just financial protection and peace of mind. And that peace of mind is the important thing. I, I know said it before, but I did recently get life insurance. Well, because it's not so recently, but somewhat recently with the birth of my kids, because you don't wanna leave someone on the hook. You know, if you are the main breadwinner, or if you are a bread winner in your family, and that's really common. Now that everybody needs seven jobs to make a living these days separate topic anyway, you, you don't wanna leave your partner on the hook. You know, you don't wanna leave them something might have. And you just never know and having that comfort of knowing that they will be protected, and your kids will be protect. That is really crucial. And it, it makes me feel better all the time to be honest, and policy genius doesn't just make life insurance easy. They also help you find the right home insurance auto insurance and disability insurance. So if you need life insurance, but you've been busy doing literally anything else, checkout policy genius. It's the easy way to compare all the top insurers and find the best value for you policy genius dot com. Nobody wants to shop for life insurance. That's why they make it easy. All right. And finally, let's talk about the DNC said, we've got twenty canned there's like twenty one that are close to the debate. They're trying. They're arguing about kind of how to how to narrow that down. What are your thoughts? Yeah. So the DNC published rules earlier this year on how candidates would qualify for the debates. The first one is June twenty six this is an NBC MSNBC Telemann debate. And everyone should watch and pay attention. To that, as you are not being facetious. The DNC said, we're gonna limit this to twenty candidates on stage twenty one debate. Yeah. Is is still a nightmare. That's a nightmare. I thought they were doing like a JV like you know, it's it or not so that so the debate is, is scheduled over two days, right com. Yeah. But the way in which you qualify for that are the criteria that the DNC prompted right? And those have two different criteria. Right. One is Poland. You have to be at one percent or higher in three qualifying polls. Right. Or and or I should say you have to qualify on the basis of fundraising right? And the fundraising is meant to demonstrate grassroots support say and or it's either and or. Well to do both or it. Here's why I said, no, no. It's good to seize on my language. But the reason I said it that way is because the way in which this shakes out is the initial selection criterion was either or but if more than twenty qualify than those who meet both get priority. So yet, the second criterion is a an attempt to measure grassroots support and the ideas, if you receive donations from sixty five thousand individuals with two hundred of those that must be from at least twenty different states, right? So thirteen candidates have hit both criteria. Right. They are definitely on the stage. There's some weird ones in that list. Yeah. Yeah. So Andrew Yang is, is one of the unexpected once and I wanna talk more about him in an upcoming up. Episode because injury Yang is a as of right now. He is a one issue candidate. That issue is you be I yeah. Yeah. University skin come, and that's a super interesting topic. We can't begin to talk about that in the second the other one, I did not even know declared is someone named Marianne Williamson. Oh, I believe I heard an interview with her. She actually sounds really impressive. I didn't know really who she was but yeah, I, I don't know anything about her. Yes, she hit both so which is really on thinking for the right the right person. I believe she endorsed, Bernie and sixteen because some of the questions were like, well, now you're running, you know, like in. Yeah. But she had a great answer like she, if, if I have the right person see I, she actually did an interview on pod. Save America probably because she hit both these things. And they're trying to interview all the series candidates, you know. And I was I didn't know she was seems like she's an author a motivational speaker. There's a lot of Gil set for president. I guess. Yeah. I mean look, you know there there's some there's a lot of woo in that area. But, but I want to say that listening to that interview she did sound extremely intelligent. It wasn't like a BS like all right. We all need to just grab our energy. Be the inner Bart Simpson that you can be everybody. Hold hands. Right. So she's guaranteed a spot on the stage. Yeah, the other folks. So that was like I said Andrew Yang, and I'm glad to see I want him part of the discussion, and then the other eleven who were guaranteed locks on the stage are the people that you think of right yet, I don't know if I can think of eleven Biden, Biden is Harris's to gillibrand or gillibrand is not she's the one club charts who I met. I, I don't know why. Yeah. Clo- char three. Yeah. Because gillibrand is not even like. But yeah club chart Warren, Warren for right Buddha. Judge Buddha judge five five is, is better on that, that. Oh, oh, I don't think I said Bernie, you did not burn seven two seven. There's like so Yang does yard does. We're just going to eleven you've got four more names to get or more name. And you had one strike already with Jill LeBron. I meant I meant. Oh, okay. All right. All right. Come on. Allow friendly amendment. Yeah. Thank you, who there's going to be somebody major who I missing isn't there? I guess I'm I, I don't know. I'm forgetting the forgotten seven. Very respectable. So the four you're missing the, the big one, you missed his Looper. Is that one show realize that name? No, but we're gonna get to that in a minute. Okay. The four who, who are also had met both criteria are Cory Booker book should have come up with that. Yeah. Washington governor, Jay Inslee. Had both. So he had both Tulsi Gabbard. She met both criteria why it's one percent, sixty five thousand dollars. These are not huge. I, I mean huge. Standard. And the final one kind of more were fringy is Julia Castro. Oh. Okay. So that leaves folks who have qualified under one of the other mechanisms right as potentially not being on the stage and the polling includes collar polling, but not fundraising includes Colorado, Senator Michael Bennet. Colorado governor John Hickenlooper. One of your strikes. New York Senator Kirsten gillibrand. One of your strikes now folks that I didn't know were running California rep, Eric swale. Well know him at all. X maryland. Representative John Delaney, who zero I don't know why he's running. Yeah. Ohio, congressman Tim Ryan. Oh, yeah. Tim Raines pretty cool Bill de Blasio. So the, the big one that this leaves off, and I use that, you know, is Montana governor Steve Bullock and the reason is because Bullock was initially reported unofficially. As having met the polling threshold, and the DNC than said, oh, this was not. We're not going to authorize a particular Washington Post poll because the poll person Twenty-one like this. Yeah, right. And, and the reason for that is because the DNC said, we're not going to include a to Washington Post ABC news polls, even though their initial statement said that's a reputable polling organization because they didn't like the methodology in particular. They didn't like the methodology that gave you an open ended. Right. Rather than list of candidate said, oh, who do you support? And then I, I would point out getting one percent in an open ended pills harder is much harder and more. Impressive. So the question is can Bullock can anybody who's excluded? Can they sue the DNC and say you change the? The rules on me right? That the Bullock already saying you change the rules on me on the answer to that sort of hearkens back wheat, we talked about the Bernie Sanders, right wing fund. There were lawsuit so lawsuit against the DNC. So the, the answer to that is, is, is certainly a very, very strong may be right. And, and. Well, I mean, the answer is you can sue, right. Right. That's not a hard bar to count. But the link in the show notes, the, the Bernie Sanders lawsuit again. I want go back and listen to that episode of the show that was one hundred percent bankrolled by right wing sources relying on Gucci for two point, oh and known Russian intelligence asset. So if you still think the like Bernie Sanders got a raw deal any brought a lawsuit because of it, you should know that those people were hijacked in any event, the, the way in which you bring a lawsuit against the DNC is a private organization. Right. Not a governmental entity is, as either a democratic voter or primary voter or as a donor to any of the candidates to say, hey, look, I gave money to the DNC, because the DNC promise to be neutral about the candidates. Right. So you need a per someone who's giving money to the DNC to the DMC candidate or someone. You need to you need a democratic activist who supports one of these candidates. That's going to be excluded from the stage. And then you bring allegations of fraud. You say look, they promised us that they were going to be the parenting street for under false pretense. That's exactly that's, that's the interest. The framework out there. There's no way that, that can can one of these cans or somebody, you know, their wife donates to the DNC tomorrow and again, absolutely. They would have standing one hundred percent. So if you know if you're listening, Montana, governor Bullock, like, you know, have a have a friend donate money to the DMZ, and that will give you your standing for your suit. Then have to you know you'd have to identify that they engaged in fraudulent conduct that they that they deliberately changed the rules on the Washington Post poll too 'cause you injury. And, you know, look, I, I don't if I ran the DNC, I would not have twenty candidates on stage. Yeah, that's insane. But, but it is I mean you know, in a nightmare. I'm kind of looking forward to the debates because I think that could be really cool and positive way. But also, yes. Twenty and look like it, I'm sympathetic to if you say, hey, I'm a small person here, right? It's going to be hard for me to gain attention. But the counter arguments are Pete Buddha, judge and to a lesser extent. India, Yang, right. Andrew Yang met both criteria. They found a way yet there they found a way to cut through only a few people who should be on the state. You know, it's we don't get to do it. Fortunately me in for your, we'll see. We'll see how the podcast coast. So there you go. There you have it. Very interesting stuff. And what would great timing? I think it's perfect timing. To think our top patrons are hall of famers, all time greats at patriotair dot com slash law, who we had such a fun time, with in our QNA the other day. Oh, NFL. I just wanna give a little plug. Also, if you didn't catch Andrew on sl on series inquiries, only my podcast search that out because we did talk about Buddha, judge and other DNC stuff. We try to keep it more factual here, a little more political and punditry over there a little bit. But that was a lot of fun. So thanks for coming on catch that, if you haven't already listeners, and now to thank our top patrons who are do a lot awful movies in around a week. We'll, we'll make that happen. Don't worry starting with juggle, chugging chug. Boutros. Boutros-ghali. It's legal advice. It's not legal advice. Nice ask your podcast. If legal advice is right for you. That's good. My bad sense of humor is now your problem. So sit pro tip the earth is hurtling through space. So speeding is. Nice Bosnich Torres twenty twenty. Okay. We'll see. I mean, we'll see you gets the polling who give gets sixty five thousand sign up Patriot Act on. Yeah. Nate Rex Valerie, Galloway Dragonfly dot EKO books about nature in the environment, reviews and interviews, stuff and polls Betsy DeVos is the anti Christ. Darth, Mandy, pants will deserve patron, number two thirty nine level three. 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Do kuebler. He li- Bosnich Mitchell. So what do we get the twenty five dollar patrons? Don't I, I don't know twenty five dollars patrons should get more than that. President trump. Bo is my new favorite typo. Thanks new trying to unseat. Conrad Michael since twenty fourteen in the days. And Conrad Michael's ho that's some. Yet he sits atop the legal thrown. He was the winner of got a game of thrones. He was the one. The iron the Conrad Michael's iron throne hall, right? Well, those lovely patriots brought you the show and bring you TT. Here we go. No social. This firm has ever failed the bar exam. No kidding. Thomas, a four year old child sustained serious injuries. When a playmate pushed him from behind to parked cars into the street where he was then struck by car the child by his Representative sued the driver of the car, the playmates parents and his own parents at trial. The child's total damages were determined to be a hundred thousand dollars. The playmates parents were determined to be twenty percent at fault because they had failed to adequately supervisor the driver was found to be fifty percent full and the child's own parents were determined to be thirty percent at fault for failure to adequately supervise him. The court has adopted the pure comparative negligence doctrine with joint and several liability in place of the common law rules, relating to plaintiffs fault. In addition, the common law doctrines, relating to intra family liability have been abrogated. What is the maximum amount if anything that the child's Representative can recover from the driver of the car, a thirty thousand b fifty thousand see a hundred thousand were de nothing? I love this question. This is a really difficult question. It is it is. But I'm not gay. I'm not giving sanctity of the game. Okay. My first two thoughts, by the way are wise. It kid doing his own parents for this. And Secondly why is the driver fifty percent fault? I mean, as a driver now worried like if somebody pushes somebody behind a parked car and I hit them, I'm, I'm half to blame for that. It's not right. Am I crazy, no response from Indra sanctity of the gal k fair? Okay. So I think that it seems like the key is going to be the last few cents. The court has adopted the pure comparative negligence doctrine with joint. And several liability in place of the common law rules. In addition, common law, doctrines Rilling to intra family liability have been aggregated doctrines, relating to intra family, liability. Have been abrogated. I don't I have that lasts killing me. I think what's happening here is that because of this comparative negligence pure comparative negligence doctrine that we can we don't do the? Oh, you're twenty percent. I'm thirty percent. He's whatever I think we do whoever is more at fault. Could be liable for the whole thing. That's what I think is happening. And I think the key is the parents will count as you, you know, like, that'll, I think that'll count together. So the question so here's what I think I believe it's either going to be. All or nothing. But then the drivers fifty percent of fault. At blows that analysis houses gonna work. Okay. So the basic thing would be the dry if if the drivers found to be fifty percent fault than fifty thousand. That's the basic answer. The other answer I could see would be. How'd you get thirty thousand? I don't I mean thirty percent of their own parents thirty percent fault. I don't know how you'd get that it seems like it's gotta be fifty one hundred or nothing. Two percent. I this. I don't get it. I thought I almost could've had it, but the fifty percents killing how'd they sixty percent I might have been compelled to answer one hundred thousand dollars. But if it's fifty it's exactly fifty percent. I don't I don't I don't know how that would those is impossible. So I think I can eliminate a thirty thousand I don't I don't see how you would get to the driver getting to that. Is this going to be? Or is it a weird Matheny where in a contest between? So just talking about the driver versus the child. And maybe the maybe the child and the child's parents count together because of that. Intra family liability thing. But then I'm not seeing any number that would add thirty plus. This is I this is hard. I'm going to do I go with be the obvious answer fifty thousand dollars which is fifty percent corresponding to the driver. Or do I go with nothing from some weird thing or a hundred thousand dollars from some other word thing? Like that's really do I try to take the easy route. This is the tricky question that I've ever felt like I could analyze if I thought about it enough. Like normally if it super tricky, I'm just like this is too hard, but it feels like it's within reach even though it's probably not. All right. Here's what I think I'm gonna do. I'm going to eliminate nothing because I don't think that's going to be. I'm eliminate a and d so not thirty thousand dollars. Not nothing. So we have the obvious answer fifty thousand but I think the comparative negligence thing, image, IG will somehow factor into this, so that it since the driver was more at fault, then the child and the child's parents, the therefore he could be liable as he whatever the driver could be liable for the full hundred. And since it says, what's the maximum amount if anything, I'm gonna go see one hundred? Thousand. That's my final answer that was really difficult. One I don't know. All right. And if you wanna play along with Thomas on TB had to do that, just share out, the Sepah sewed on social media include your answer, include the hashtag TB include your reasons, therefore, we will pick a winner and shower that person with never ending fame, and fortune fame and fortune not guaranteed. Right. Thanks so much for listening. It was nice to be here with you, Andrew recording. Live in persons, fun until the bar. Question was really hard buds? Okay. I'm excited in the answer. That one all right, everybody. We will see you on Tuesday. Thanks so much for listening can't wait for Tuesday's episode going to be fun. It's gonna be fun. We'll see then. This has been opening arguments with Andrew and Thomas, if you love the show and want to support future episodes, please visit our patriarch page at patriot dot com slash off. If you can't support a Spanish -ly it'd be a big help. If you could leave us a five star review on itunes, Stitcher, or whatever, podcasts delivery, vehicle, you use, and be sure to tell all your friends about it for questions, suggestions and complaints. Email us at open arguments at gmaiLcom the show notes and links on our website at WWW dot open. Argh dot com. Be sure to like our page on Facebook and on Twitter at open arcs until next. 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Donald J Trump president Burling Michael Flynn Robert Muller United States Andrew DNC Mexico Alan Dershowitz Trump Russia Bernie Sanders Andrews attorney Andrew Yang YouTube Steve Bullock Andrew Torres Jacka Willie
CAFE Insider 5/5: The Return of Flynn & McGahn

Stay Tuned with Preet

21:29 min | 3 months ago

CAFE Insider 5/5: The Return of Flynn & McGahn

"Hey folks we're entering a new phase of pandemic response. Some dozen states begin to reopen six weeks after the country came to a standstill as protests and debate rages over stay at home orders and listening other restrictions. We had some big news last week. Documents related to the FBI investigation of former trump national security adviser. Michael Flynn were unsealed raising new questions about the propriety and fairness of FBI practices and the DC Circuit Court of appeals oral arguments. In a case involving a subpoena perform White House counsel Don mcgann. Who's been blocked from testifying before the house? Judiciary Committee was Michael. Flynn and trapped as his defenders claim. And what are the implications of the mcgann litigation for the future of Congressional oversight? I talk about all this and more with an milligram. Cafe insider podcast each week. We breakdown politically charged. Legal issues making the headlines. Today we're sharing clip from this week's episode. You can listen to our full conversation and access all other. Kathy insider content with a free two week trial of the membership head to cafe dot com slash insider to join that's cafe dot com slash insider and college students with a valid. Edu Email can get a special rate at cafe dot com slash student. How are you in a pre happy? Cinco de Mayo. Happy Cinco de Mayo and happy May the fourth be with you for yesterday. You know what my son's School. It's a big deal there last year. It's a it's a big deal. Last year the annual school gala. This was before my son had even started kindergarten and so all the parents went and we thought it was like you know you gotta go. Maybe it's going to be a little fancy we walk in everyone is in jeans and star. Wars T. shirts or in costumes is amazing. That's pretty wonderful before we get to the news Can I make a public service announcement? Yeah of course always so the other podcast that I do on what you've been guest. Many many times stay tuned with preet is up for an award. A Webbie's People's Voice Award for best politics in news podcast. We are currently and in second place. Well I thank thank you. I know that the nomination that you'd like to be in first place. I know I'm just happy as they say. I'm just happy to be nominated. I feel that way. It's it's an amazing accomplishment. Congratulations to you and the whole team a cafe so so I do have a request of our listeners. And that is when you have a moment go to vote dot Webby awards dot com. You can find that voting page by just typing pre or stay tuned in the search bar. That's will you send me one of those stickers that says I voted voted? I'm with you? Vote Dot Webby Awards Dot Com. And it's good practice for remote voting for all right. Congratulations again. It's wonderful. Thank you so two big things going on. Michael Flynn former national security advisor. To president trump. Briefly is back in the news. Why is that yes? He's back. There have been a number of documents that have been released. And we'll talk a little bit about how they came out with their internal. Fbi documents that relate to this discussion that they had about how to approach. Michael Flynn when they were first going to interview him and so this has brought it back for his lawyer to basically say oh no Michael. Flynn was entrapped. The government is terrible the FBI is terrible and the president of course has said the same thing we want the ability to withdraw our plea. We want the case dismissed and so all of this has happened. Those documents were released last week. And so it's really brought the Flynn conversation back to the beginning of Flynn want out of his plea deal so this case has been pending for very long time the conduct in question for which he was charged goes back to the first week of the trump administration and an interview he gave to the FBI on January. Twenty four th of two thousand seventeen. Now we're more than three years on and we still have this pending case it's worth maybe reminding folks and we had to remind ourselves of some of the underlying facts of the case right. So you'll recall that Michael. Flynn used to be in the military and left under Barack Obama and then became a very outspoken. Spokesperson and campaigner for Donald Trump went to some rallies notably. I think presided over a chant of locker up in reference to the Democratic nominee. Hillary Clinton we do not need a reckless president who believes she is above the law. Mock as right yeah. That's right her up. I think there are reports that various people including Chris Christie suggested that he not be appointed to a high position in the trump administration and yet he was and what the charges surround just remind folks are essentially three sets of lies that he told to an FBI agent on January twenty. Four th two thousand seventeen to give some context to this during the transition period. When Barack Obama was still the president of the United States there was an active investigation of various issues relating to Russia and with respect to the Russian interference in the election the Obama administration at some point in December of two thousand sixteen imposed significant sanctions on Russia now in almost every circumstance when the United States imposes sanctions on a country like Russia. There is almost immediate retaliation. That's happened before. That's the reason why I'm banned from going to Russia. It was retaliation for sanctions that we put on various Russians. Russians did the same to various Americans including me and some other people from the and the judge in a particular case it turns out that Michael Flynn among other things had a direct conversation with the Russian ambassador to the US Gay Kislyak in which he told Kislyak not to retaliate against the United States and said some other things he also told Russia apparently during that time period to vote against a particular UN resolution relating to Israel so that's the backdrop then fast forward to January twenty four th of twenty seven to just interrupt for a second so folks can remember that the American intelligence agencies were up on the phones of the Russian ambassador who is believed to have also been an intelligence asset for the Russian government Sergei Kislyak and so they had access to that phone. Those phone calls every time that Michael Flynn called. Those calls were being overheard by American intelligence officers. And this will come into play later. There's also evidence that was coming into the possession of the intelligence authorities and law enforcement authorities. The Michael Flynn was doing substantial work at the behest of the government of Turkey including writing an op-ed about various things something that the files referred to as a Turkey project. And so you have this interesting scenario with someone who's about to become the national security advisor to the president of the United States kind of behind people's backs and in a way that's undermining to the still in place administration having private conversations with the Russian ambassador about what should or should not happen kind of conducting his own foreign policy. There's also an old American law which you and I talked about when when this was all unfolding in. Flynn was being charged and pleading guilty. There's something called the Logan. Act which prohibits anyone from acting on behalf of the US government that's not the US government and so at this point in time. In December of twenty. Sixteen Barack Obama was president. President trump had not been sworn in yet to office that was later in January and so there was some question and that has not been charged for decades. I think over fifty years it's not frequently used statute but just so people understand on its face. This is specifically prohibited by Law. You can't be the incoming administration undercut the Carter Administration. You can't have two governments at once and it's not. It's not the way we operate. And so is this significant government issue that Flynn was making those calls and basically sort of back dealing with the Russians so then fast forward to January twenty fourth and we'll get into what some of the discussions were that reflected in these notes about whether or not Michael Flynn should be approached whether or not he should be warned that lying a crime whether or not he should have been allowed to have a lawyer and all of that. Because that's part of what? The current controversy is about but just to put this in perspective. You have you have an FBI agent and what makes it more complicated is the FBI agent. Is Someone in Peter. Struck who as we all know later was engaging in inappropriate and unfortunate text messages about his feelings about Donald trump with an F. B. I. Lawyer NAMED LISA PAGE. Who is one of the people which also complicates this? At least optically was one of the lawyers who is providing guidance on what the warnings should be to. Michael Flynn and what the nature of the interview should be etc etc. So it's kind of a complicated little web but the basics are that Michael Flynn even though he's fisted person even though he had served in the Defense Intelligence Agency even though he has a lot of experience in intelligence collection and law enforcement presumably an even though he had to have assumed as you pointed out and that his conversations with Kislyak might have been intercepted and might be known to the community officials in FBI officials when given the opportunity to speak about whether or not he had said these things to Kislyak chose to lie about it and chose to lie about whether or not he told Russians to against the UN resolution. And we're GONNA come back to this again and again but I think it's important to say at the outset because if thing is ultimately desposited of all this controversy he basically had three choices when he's interviewed by the FBI and we can have a discussion about whether or not it was heavy handed or whether or not. He was admonished properly. And all sorts of other things but the bottom line. Is You have a sophisticated person. Who understands how life works who asked direct and specific concrete questions about his conversations with Russians? He had three choices. Tell the truth lie or shut up and he chose to lie and by the way nothing all this documentation controversy and motion practice. That I've seen and maybe I've missed it. Does he. In any way make the case that his statements to the FBI agent were in fact true. It's all this other sort of argument about fair treatment and being set up and they're not being a proper case to begin with which may or may not be arguable but he does not dispute. His stuff was not true right and also just remember that he publicly apologized as well ed. He also stood in court and basically said in front of a judge. Yes I lied what he pled guilty. And so it's really important understand. He's not walking back that he lied to the FBI. He raised his right hand swore under oath that he had lied and he then also went out and publicly apologized and said you know it was wrong. And I'm sorry and I'm working to make amends. And so all of that is the backdrop of he's never denied the actual crime. He's arguing that he was tricked by the FBI that he was entrapped. That conduct toward him basically compelled him to tell that lie a couple of other facts to remember he was eventually fired by Donald Trump and what was the basis for his being fired. Not only did a lot of the FBI. He lied to the vice president. Mike Pence went on Sunday. Talk shows right and this is based on Michael Flynn. I was disappointed to learn that the facts that have been conveyed to me by General. Flynn were inaccurate. So the trump administration itself understood that he lied and fired him. Because of those lies. Yes and you know at this point. The Washington Post was writing news articles about it flint folk to pence assured that it hadn't happened that he hadn't had these conversations and then pence went out based on Flynn's representations and told the American public. This never happened and so it's really important to remember that that that's how this all went down. So what's happened since January? Twenty four th interview and his firing by the president of the United States. He was charged as we mentioned with multiple counts of making false statements. He pled guilty in open court which means that he voluntarily admitted the facts. He put out a statement of apology. Essentially admitting the facts he had certain lawyers sophisticated lawyers Covington burling representing him. There was a sentencing schedule for more than once. There's been a sentencing scheduled and at one point the government was saying that probation would be appropriate because of his long service and because of his cooperation with the government then at some point later oddly when the sentencing was adjourned and rescheduled. The government took the position that some prison sentence of up to six months would be appropriate and then for recently after bill bar maybe got involved. The government changed sentencing recommendation. Again back to probation. So you have these twists and turns. He's changed lawyers. He's got a new lawyer. Who's arguing that the first lawyers didn't do a good job and they have a conflict of interest so there's been a lot of fighting as opposed to how Michael Flynn dealt with the case in the beginning with contrition and an apology and guilty plea and so now. There have been some documents that have been disclosed and we can maybe describe how that happened. That Flynn's new lawyers argue show. He was entrapped he was set up. There was exculpatory material. Provided that they want use to show that he's innocent that the government acted outrageously and that he should be able to withdraw his guilty plea and in fact have his case dismissed. So how do we? How do we get to this point? What is happening here is beyond unusual in my view. And so just put this all against the backdrop of the of the United States. Donald trump has been arguing for executive privilege for the past three years right every time someone wants piece of information from here his administration. He will argue. It's executive privilege basically saying I'm the chief executive I need to be able to have conversations behind closed doors that are private and I have to be able to debate things. Yes or no and nobody should get access to that. Now flipped to what Bill Bar has. Basically done is he has released and we'll talk about the mechanics of this but he has released the contents of notes and emails of Internal F. B. I. Conversations about how to approach the Flynn investigation and this is incredibly unusual in my experience. I was trying to think of another time that I'd seen something like this happen. It just doesn't happen and again. I really want to stress that this is intentional. Framing I think by the president and by bar to basically be able to set up to be pardoned by the president or for the CASE TO BE DISMISSED BY BILL. Bill Bar to say we're not going to go forward. So what bill bar does is he. Does this thing. You mentioned the Connecticut. Us Attorney recently. John Durham was appointed to look at the Russia. Investigation and Carter pages the initial FIS award of Carter page. What is something similar here? On Flynn's case he asked a sitting. Us Attorney to look into the flint matter and as a result of that that sitting us attorney basically pulled these internal F. B. I. Documents. They are not documents that would normally be disclosed in my experience because again they go to process and deliberation they don't go. They're not records of a witness statement. There they don't fall under the criminal procedure rules of what has to be disclosed during the prosecution of a case so they really are. Bow Giving an internal law enforcement agency the ability to have this argument. This conversation you know. Should WE GIVE FLYNN? Should we tell him that if he lies? It's a crime. Do we need to legally tell him? And what's important will get to the substance of those arguments in a minute. But what is really really important for people to understand that bar appoints the US attorney the US attorney then gets access to these documents and he gives them to the defense lawyer Sydney POWs so that Powell can now walk in and say my client was entrapped. This was a setup by the government. I don't think there's anything about that argument. That's true and as you said. A plane had three choices and he chose to lie and we can again break that down. But I think it's really important for people to understand the framing that we are here because Bill Bar has released internal documents. That in my experience are not released in law enforcement investigations. And he's done it in my view intentionally to undercut the Flynn prosecution and again just to go back to executive privilege like the exact argument. The president's making that he needs and you and I have argued there exceptions to executive privilege. Of course there are exceptions to when internal documents should be turned over. I just want to point out the hypocrisy that the same administration that has basically said no one gets to see anything from us is the same administration that is pushing out documents that are never ever disclosed in cases and that go directly to the heart of the exact kind of debate the F. B. I. Should be having when they're approaching an interview. They're trying to figure out. How should we do it? What's the best way to do it? What's the fairest way what's legal? What's not so some of the things that are released include batch of documents some type some handwritten. There's a back and forth. I think that you refer to between Lisa page agents of the FBI. About the rule requiring warning the witness in this case. Michael Flynn that lying to an FBI. Agent is a crime by the way everyone in America now probably knows that from the cases that have flowed from the Russia investigation is a statute title eighteen United States Code. One thousand one that everybody now is familiar with this is the back and forth about whether or not you're supposed to warn somebody about lying to the FBI in a material way and then there's this note that's gotten a lot of attention. It's unclear WHO's handwriting. It is reasonably speculate. That's Bill pre-snap. Who is the head of counterintelligence at the FBI at the time who writes what's our goal referring to the approach an interview of witness truth slash admission or to get him to lie so we can prosecute him or get him fired and those notes that notation standing alone? His caused a lot of people to claim. This is a setup. This is inappropriate. I saw Kailua mcenaney from the podium in the briefing room at the White House. Basically say there was an unfair targets on the back of general. Michael Flynn on concern every American anytime. There's a partisan pursuit of individual and that's certainly at least. Those questions are raised with regard to general. Michael Flynn honorable man. Who served his country? Is this a crazy thing to be thinking about? An prior to the interview of a witness. Who you believe is engaged in misconduct. One of the things I think that is worth spending a little time on is that We've both been in these rooms where you have very serious conversations about. Where's the investigation going? How do you approach a witness? And what's the best way to do it? And it's worth reminding ourselves and everyone upfront that there are few rules of prosecution and investigation including you know. Ideally it's better to talk to somebody when they don't have a lawyer present right and this happens all the time with police officers and lawyers if someone's actually in custody that means that they're not free to leave that you have to give them Miranda warnings. Which is you have the right to remain silent but if they are not in custody you don't hear Flynn was not in custody and just to remind everyone Andy McCabe who is then the acting director of the FBI January twenty fourth of two thousand Seventeen McCabe Calls Flynn and basically says hey. We want to ask you some questions. We're going to have some agents follow up and come over. Flynn says yeah okay. I think there's a conversation so you know. He wasn't given questions in advance but also wouldn't surprise at his office. In the moment he was called. Bhai basically the second highest person at the FBI told agents. We're GONNA come over and interviewed so we had to have some under getting that. He knew what he had. Burn back you.

Michael Flynn FBI Donald Trump president United States Russia Barack Obama Bill Bar White House Cinco de Mayo US government Sergei Kislyak Don mcgann executive advisor Judiciary Committee LISA PAGE Hillary Clinton DC Circuit Court of appeals
You Buttigieged Yourself (feat. Glenn Kirschner)

The Daily Beans

1:25:28 hr | 3 months ago

You Buttigieged Yourself (feat. Glenn Kirschner)

"Attention all star Burns audio listeners. This is cliff Dorfman from stuck at home with cliff and Jason and the cliff. Dorfman show you know when I was growing up back home in Merrick? Long Island trying to plot my career for world domination in Hollywood. I would've killed for any kind of road map. Something to lay out the path that had been blazed by all these other artists before me but there wasn't and I had a wing it so when I finally got to a position to ask my favorite artists. How the hell they did it. I thought it's my duty to share this with whoever I could. So that's just what my co host? Jason Smith helped me to do every week. Jason I put the record. The journey of some amazing prolific and talented actor artists comedian creators writers and directors to discover the critical and more often than not similar ingredients their story that got them to where they are today to deep dive that uncovers events in moments that surprise even our guests. We'RE NOT ONLY DRAW. Solid blueprint success from each artist that can be applied to your own personal journey. We structure the narrative of the artist's own. Hollywood legend check out the cliff. Dorfman show wherever you get your podcast. Join US live daily at three thirty. Pm Pacific for stuck at home with clipping Jason on the star Burns Audio Youtube Age. If you don't like it I will personally send you all of my overdue library books from high school along with a thank you. Note for the lovely blender sin sounds hello and welcome to the daily beans for Monday. Eighteenth Twenty twenty today. A new batch of memos released by Buzzfeed as part of their foia suit another Friday night inspector general firing the FDA stops Bill Gates Back Corona virus research proof. The cupboards weren't bear when trump took office a prominent medical journal issues. A rare call to vote trump out of office trump pressures the postal service to raise rates law floor hands documents over to the Department of Justice regarding her stock activity prior to the crash. Why trump hates tests the house demands bar testified? June ninth and the and Fruman show is pushed to after the election. I'm your host Jian with me. Today is Jordan Coburn Alot. I forgot about partisan firm and I know we haven't been doing the fantasy indictment league since bar took over and so we haven't really been keeping up on them but Basically I'll go over this a little bit later in the show but both sides asked to push this back to the end of next year to amid corona virus concerns so the partisan firm and trial when I say the par partisan Freeman show. That's that's what I mean. That's going to be at the end of next year. It looks like crazy well looking forward to it. Yeah Something to do When we have a better president we We do have a very beefy. Show today I Jordan going to grow over the muller memos that were released over the weekend I'm then I'm going to do an entire block of headlines that Sort of flew under the radar under the corona virus radar. We've got an interview with Glenn Kirschner later on. We're going to talk a little bit more about the Flynn case. And the new amicus curious A cure a cure. I I guess would be the plural. I it's been twenty years since I took Latin. Twenty five twenty seven years. It's been a long time. And it's been a dead language for thousands of years so there we go so yeah we have all of that to squeeze and plus huge good news block and a lot of quarantine confessions so we might as well jump in with the with the hot notes. Hot notes all right Jordan. So what did what did we find from the Buzzfeed foil lawsuit? Muller memo's dump that we're probably going to be getting three. Oh Two's from for the next ten years. Yeah there's there's so much stuff In in this. It's like very juicy so I'm just GonNa Start Right into it. Go through much of it as I can but definitely look it up on buzzfeed they have like summaries of the highlights and it's super easy to understand how they pay write it out and everything but in each highlight. There's there's like so many different examples of the behavior for example That these people are talking about occurred. So it's very juicy definitely. Check it out but I'll start off with Some of the highlights so first highlights that buzzfeed talks about the talk about Jared Kushner When he talks to them in these three twos he explained the back channel. Meetings that happened with Sergei Kislyak. He told investigators. The eight out of the interview is eight hours long. By the way which is fucking incredibly he told investigators that former HBO chair. Richard invited him to a time where luncheon with Henry Kissinger in Dimitri Simes. Who He's the guy that ran a pro-kremlin think-tank in Washington. Dc Kushner told the FBI that he was pursuing symes when the trump campaign was quote having a hard time getting people to support them and quote. Symes apparently tried to give Kushner compromising Info on Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton's connections to Russia but Kushner told the investigators that he never got from signs information. That could be operationalized in quote. So I guess that's enough to make you not liable because it wasn't enticing enough to commit the crime so you reserved yourself am near not a criminal. Even though like the to me that reads is it was better information. I definitely would have taken the bait in in gone forward. But but he didn't so my memory of the laws that you know you just have to even have the intention to do so or you know. It's just it's so weird that nobody was ever charged with anything like that. Yeah definitely he also went on to talk about Sergei Kislyak. He said that Ca Kislyak said to Kushner. We like what your candidate is saying. It's refreshing and Kushner said that they discussed Syria and having the Russian generals brief national security adviser. Michael Flynn and so apparently Flynn said that there wasn't a secure line of communication so Kushner asked if they could communicate using the Russian embassy and then Kislyak apparently said very quickly. No that won't work of Kushner told Kislyak that he wanted to make sure he was speaking with people quote who can make decisions in quote. Yeah and signs had that Issue too and it's of note that the reason I'm sure Kislyak didn't WANNA use the Russian embassy was because of those calls are intercepted and listened to right. He's like trust me. I know how to crime. This is not it. We're not GONNA go there. So there's there's a bunch were just on that topic alone. I'M GONNA GONNA move onto the next thing Jay Dee Gordon. He's a former foreign policy adviser. He gave a bunch of testimony. I guess in the three twos to to the FBI. About how shady eighty the trump campaign was and how shady trump himself was so this is particularly satisfying to read but he was a campaign adviser during during the election. Who Never got paid? Apparently he said they said they were going to pay for stuff and then they destroyed never did and I think that fact alone probably gives you know trump his classic line of a disgruntled employee. Or whatever he's GonNa if he ever even comments on. It would probably just fire back with something like that about Gordon but he told Molars team that he was glad. The interviewing agents were speaking with him as he believed. There were a lot of shenanigans happening at the highest levels. Gosh yes goings on. Yes Gordon. He's he's a navy vet Former Pentagon spokesperson. He was uncharacteristically detailed. I guess in in calling out the campaign he said. The trump campaign was disorganized and chaotic at times and he said it was important for the agents to understand that concept when conducting this investigation that was based on did he say. Shenanigan E. Yeah that's in quotes Shenanigans happening at the highest levels. That's so great. Like well with this Tomfoolery in Baltimore passed through how the trump campaign. It's just a big piece of bedlam. Who GRAB ASS exactly Shenanigans and those kinds of words are the words you describe. You know you give to a group of people that don't know what the fuck they're doing but are still stirring shit can goofy ass words for clown car of new politicians. Just not not knowing what's happening but trying to do self serving things it's complete shenanigans. He said he said one of his complaints was that hope. Hicks lied about the contacts between the campaign and Russians Gordon said he hoped. Yeah this is. This is a quote from the summary. Gordon said he hoped the Russian investigation was very thorough. Gordon thinks trump must be guilty of something. He is constantly ripping people off. Trump lies all the time and surrounds himself with people. Don't tell the truth. Gordon explained Hicks had lied about contact with Russians. Gordon thinks she probably lied to protect trump whether she knew anything or not and quote so he fucking really laid into the campaign he quit on August. Ten Twenty sixteen because of not getting paid apparently And and then one last thing for Gordon. He described the foreign policy team as being run like a sixth grade student council with no real authority or power. He also said that the last person is speak to. Trump has the most influence on his decisions. And that jared Kushner had a lot of say with trump so we've heard that from so many sources to That the last person who spoke to trump is usually what you know the position he take yes just the mark of one zero attention span and zero ability to actually store information and wait appropriately edge. Just who yeah? Whoever's right there whoever the the the squeaky the squeaky g guild the squeaky wheel at the present time apparently as a what. He listens to moving on from that again. There's there's a lot more juicy stuff in there that I encourage you to read up on it's GonNa be this is like why for the Mueller investigation fans. It's just circling back. Many of these things that we were talking about in didn't have complete looks at in and now we're starting to see that and yet really juicy is the best word I can use to describe it Another thing we learned Matthew Miller he was a drip campaign aide. He said that. Flynn's set up a transition period between trump and Afghan president using his contacts from his past work over in Afghanistan. So that's that's he apparently yeah uses connections to set up that phone call and a summary of Miller's interview with the FBI from October two thousand seventeen shows that he said the call in December two thousand sixteen utilizing ambassador. Contact that he had to. That's just something of note. I was wondering it doesn't go. I don't know the legality of that. Like during transition periods stuff. Do you know about exactly like what the rules are there or or like. If you're supposed to technically go through separate channels to do that you know that technically violates the Logan Act but that's just not something that people go after especially during transition I mean you know. For example Flynn Calling Kislyak and talking about sanctions. You know. Is that the bad part. Not as bad as lying to the FBI and having the Russians know you lied to the FBI and being compromised so you. There's no way you can be a national security adviser so it's people sort of it's like an incoming You Know Administration. It's lame duck session for Congress etc so it is technically illegal Also one could consider. Would that be lobbying on behalf of foreign government right without registering? I don't know But I don't know what the technicality is for considered for something to be considered lobbying right But you know we'll so that would just have to be investigated yes especially when we think of of Flynn's history of you know kind of stirring of deals with say Turkey for example so who knows what the hell he was advising trump even talk to the Afghan President about throw we know could have been some sketchy off the record shit. He's like perfect. I'M GONNA get a head start on on my shenanigans. Set up this call for you on my way. Tom Foolery yes exactly Okay next another highlights. Stone met with a Russian national named Henry Oak Ski I think this is listening. I have no idea but he was also known as Henry Greenberg. He's yeah Russian national yes Russia number this guy the Weirdo guy. Though I don't remember his name I don't have to be honest. What he's did he dress weird he was just an odd guy and yeah. I mean like I I know there were a couple people who with them and and we're like Because he was like I have dirt. I've heard you come get dirt. And then he didn't have anything and everyone's like Oh fuck that guy. Just a weird guy yes so. He apparently wanted to sell stone. That dirt on Clinton for two million dollars was the amount. Yeah stone was like trump's not paying two million dollars for anything So yes yes yes. I totally remember that that that the room. They asked the trow not be willing to spend that much money for anything. I remember that very very yes of a month. After that was offered Muller's team that with Greenberg at the special counsel's office He told investigators he met with stone. And Michael Caputo in two thousand sixteen and May and he was joined at the meeting with his associates from Ukraine Alexi Razan is as name R A S I n Who offered stone damaging information on Hillary Clinton and then the summary States Razan formerly worked for Clinton and was allegedly in possession of financial statements which demonstrated her involvement in money laundering activities with resins companies. Stone inquired about the amount of financial misappropriations related Clinton and asked if it was in the amount of millions Razan relayed that it was rather somewhere in the amount of hundreds of thousands stone ultimately refuted the offer and said in stated that he did not believe Donald Trump. We go duff until I posted. That didn't even read this quote before would pay opposition research if formation. He did believe trump would pay at. The meeting concluded shortly thereafter. There we go. There's the whole thing so classic And then I I know yeah and he was just a really just a really weird dude you know. Yeah I know we went over in the middle report. It's in The Muller Report Episode for Muller she wrote called Part Three of the Miller report that we went over there memory saying and there was I think there was one other place that we talked about him in episode sixty eight. Maybe I'll see if I can find it And then next up In advisor said that he told Popadopoulos to shut up and not engage with Russia. That adviser was SAM. Clovis who we've talked about a lot and I just like having this in there because it's funny to me But he apparently told told the FBI agents at he ordered. Puppet Papa up to shut up into not engage with Russia during the two thousand sixteen campaign. So that's that's particularly satisfying to hear just based on you know Papa adopts whole crying out of how he's been framed in it's like really because people within your own group or tell you to stop so probably you're doing the wrong thing you were probably Hell bent on a bad look for for a long time. So and just like I just like any time. Papa doc gets slammed he such a fucking idiot the worst. Yeah I remember I. I actually tweeted at Popadopoulos. One time where you know. He was just bitching about something on twitter and I just I replied to him. I said I could go for a cup of coffee. And because trump called him just a coffee boy and he actually replied to me with a picture of himself drinking a cup of coffee saying like me too. What a troll I know. Psychopaths DO KINDA GIVE THEM A. Yeah I kind of want to give them a hug right then like yours. Oh cute yeah I feel like there's like a there's a sort of nonchalant nature that psychopaths reacted to accusations with like very stone like energy. You know it's like an antagonistically non-combative if that paradox can exist it's like does a aggressively not caring but obviously he cares so much because yeah he responded to you his wife I remember. I got into twitter tiff with his wife. Wants just went when frantic news was coming out with all of this evidence about her identity changing over time and her not be who she says she is and she was firing back at everyone on twitter. Like I have so who I say. Fuck in fighting with everybody like how do you? How do you do have the time to even do this? That's not a good look. If you're running for office just trolling people on the Internet. I Guess Matt Gaetz has found success with that. So maybe he's going after the gates model but there's so much other. Yeah we were already through the black but there's so much other stuff seven here about Manafort About you know associates. That testified there is no doubt Manafort had met with Russian intelligence their stuff about manafort turning down offers to be like the official liaison of Kovic in just stuff that nails stuff. That's very akin to regain testimony. Basically just stuff that bolsters that he was saying about Manafort and the extent of his ties and history with Ukraine It's great yes. It's there's still a lot of redacted stuff a lot of her detected stuff but I think that's just continue. I notice that too. Yeah There's there's also some stuff about Hannity Tayloring. His shows to the agenda Manafort suggested. That's in here You so that's that's purity big Do you remember when we got the we called him. The Manatee Tag Command Hannity totally being poor me. I'm such a victim and they're like yeah. It's the fucking your hero man and all that Shit Yup totally their best ease. That's that's when they were doing that. Definitely well yeah. I would recommend if anybody gets a chance to look at these that you should do that. it's it's pretty much or you know. I mean if you've listened to Miller she wrote since the beginning. We've we've covered it all on our other podcast so that is really great reporting. Thank you Jordan for all that you have any final thoughts on it before before we get out here Not Really I mean. I think that was the sixth installment right ever ever since they started they won that foia case. So it's just like amazing that were able to get this stuff now I it would be nice if it was less redacted. I guess but still really cool so definitely if you're molar NEAR TO MERGE JUNKIE WHICH. I'm sure you are else probably wouldn't be here definitely check it out. Yep Juicy good way to put it all right. Everybody will be right back after this with more headlines that have flown under the radar so stick around through these messages will be. 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Sun Basket is offering thirty five dollars off your order when you go to sun basket dot com slash daily beans and enter. Promo Code daily beans at checkout. That's sun basket dot com slash daily means enter Promo Code daily beans at checkout for thirty five dollars off your order sun basket dot com slash beans and enter. Promo code daily beans or everybody. Welcome back so. President trump has fired the state department. Inspector General General Steve Nick Friday night notifying Congress the decision in a letter to the House Speaker Nancy. Pelosi trump told Congress. He no longer had full. Confidence in Olympic did not provide an explanation as to why a White House official said trump fired lineker on Palm Pao's recommendation and of course. Linac is the Inspector General for the State Department. So we would be looking into things that pumped up to a democratic aide told NBC that Linden was scrutinizing. Pompeii has alleged misuse of a political appointee to perform personal tasks for himself and his wife. Susan Democratic lawmakers have an investigation into links removal You know These inspectors general. Don't serve at. The pleasure of the president are part of the executive branch but in order to fire them. You do need to discuss it with Congress you do need to inform Congress and and and give a reason why even Chuck Grassley was like Donald. Trump will need to tell us what I wonder fire God and he was pretty upset about it but also what was interesting on Friday night he also ousted the inspector general of the Department of Transportation. And as we know Elaine Chao runs that department and that's Mitch McConnell's wife and she's got herself in some hot water with some personal business dealings as well so now we have slow walking Friday night. Massacre of inspectors general occurs every Friday. It seems this past Friday and Department of Transportation Lyric from the State Department and the Department of Transportation Inspector General May I was Christie Grim The health and Human Services Inspector General was ousted April seventh. That was Glenn. Fine and the Department of Defense Inspector General I'm sorry was Glenn. Fine that gun fine with the Department of Defense Inspector General on April third of course Atkinson. That's the inspector general from the intelligence community handed the Ukraine whistleblower complaint to Congress We know Linda was investigating pompeo's myth misconduct grim Christie grim who was ousted released a report about widespread and severe shortages of PPE. She was from health and Human Services. Glenn Find Department of Defense was tasked to provide oversight of who gets corona virus stimulus money and of course we know it. Atkinson did to to make trump mad. He's the ICY inspector. General involved in the impeachment and trump is forever impeached because of it and now of course. The House is investigating the firing of lyric. I will speak to Glenn Kirschner later on about why that matters and from the New York Times over the weekend and Innovative Corona virus testing program in the Seattle Area. That was piggybacking on their flu program. There MOVES PROMOTED BY BILLIONAIRE BILL GATES and local public health officials as it was a way of conducting wider surveillance on the invisible spread of the virus that has been ordered by the federal government to stop. Its work pending additional reviews. The program involved sending home test kits both healthy and sick people in the hopes of conducting the kind of widespread monitoring that could help communities safely reopened from lockdowns researchers and public health authorities already tested thousands of samples finding dozens of previously undetected cases and their Goes THE. That's the reason trump wants this to end There is no proof that trump ordered the FDA to order the end of this program. We know how trump feels about? Bill Gates a lot of these protesters that he you know that trump stokes Out there who don't WanNa wear masks and want to get their haircut real bad they are chanted you know Bill Gates lock lock him up and etc but this program had been operating under the authorization from the state of Washington but was notified this week. Now it needs approval directly from the federal government and officials with the Food and Drug Administration told the partnership to cease. Its testing and reporting until the agency grants further approval. Trump doesn't want those numbers he doesn't want to add to the cases Of infection and death and meanwhile private companies have also rushed to promote at home test kits and the FDA approved the first one available for purchase April first so we have a combination of privatization and prophet and wanting to keep the numbers low and being you know being able to control the results of this testing which trump can't do if bill gates is funding it then it's operated by a state and not him and speaking of privatization of government agencies for profit from the Washington Post as we feared quote weeks before Republican donor and top White House ally becomes postmaster general the US Postal Service has begun a review of its package delivery contracts and It and lost its second highest executive which will leave its board of governors without any officials that predate the trump administration the move confirmed by six people with knowledge of the postal services. Inner workings but not authorized to speak publicly underscore. How trump moving closer to reshaping an independent agency. He has dubbed as a joke. The Po- The postal service in recent weeks has sought bids from consulting firms to reassess what charges companies such as Amazon ups and Fedex to deliver products on their behalf often in the last mile between the post office and the customers home and a Lotta rural areas as well that ups and Fedex doesn't deliver to hire package rates would cost shippers and online retailers billions of dollars that cost would be definitely passed onto the consumer and that is spurring them to invest in their own distribution networks instead of relying on the postal service trump has recently threatened to withhold a ten billion dollar line of credit by Congress in a corona virus stimulus package unless the postal service quadruples what charges to deliver packages independent analysts warned that such a change would devastate the agency which has increasingly relied on such deliveries for fast. You know fast growing portion of its business this is also has the added benefit of punishing Bazo. Who Owns Amazon? The Washington Post that. I'm reading this article. From and by the end of next month. Remember the agency's bipartisan governing. Board will be a trump appointee at the USPS democratic vice chairman. David Williams resigned April thirtieth that up with trump's approach to the agency and that's according to people familiar with his thinking and deputy Postmaster General. Ronald Stroman submitted. His resignation on the eighth of May Stroman had years of experience working with Congressional Democrats and had become the agency pointman on vote by mail initiatives by the November election. There's another added benefit of privatization of the postal service control over the election trump and treasury secretary. Steve Mnuchin of sought to attach terms to that ten billion dollar emergency loan to the postal service. Those terms will allow the administration to dictate packaging. Prices review an ultra bulk discount contracts known as negotiated service agreements or NSA's. That's kind of the Discount Amazon. Gets for shipping so much shit and they want the soul of forty to appoint the next postmaster general and direct negotiations with labor unions and Here's something interesting we've heard it a thousand times. The cupboards were bear. The cupboards were Bayer. When I took office there was nothing. There well I came across an article from. Npr dated June twenty seventh twenty sixteen seven months before trump took office that says otherwise and it has the pictures to prove it as heard on morning edition back in the day. Quote inside a secret. Government warehouse prepped for health catastrophes from Nell Greenfieldboyce quote. When Greg Burell tells people he's in charge of some secret government warehouse he often gets asked if they're like the ones at the end of Raiders of the lost Ark where the Ark of the covenant gets packed away in a crate hidden forever. Well no not really says Burell. Who is the director of pro of a program called the strategic national stockpile S S at the Centers for Disease Control and prevention and thousands of lives might someday depend on this stockpile says Nell Greenfieldboyce back in the day She says which holds all kinds of medical supplies that officials would need in the wake of a terrorist attack with chemical biological or nuclear weapons. The location of these warehouses is secret. How many there are is secret. Although former government officials recently said at a public meeting there are six of these warehouses. And exactly what's in them is a secret From this from the NPR report. What he will reveal is how much of the stockpile is worth or how much the stockpile is worth currently value the inventory at a little over seven billion dollars and NPR got visit one of the warehouses that bureau described as this. He said quote. If you envision say a Super Walmart stick to those side-by-side take out the drop ceiling. That's about the same kind of space. We occupy in just one of these storage locations and there are rows upon rows of ventilators. That could keep sick or injured. People breathing may be explains That they're kept in a constant state of readiness quote. If you look down to the side you'll see there's electrical outlets so they can be charged once a month. Not only that the ventilators get sent out for yearly maintenance. In fact everything here has to be inventoried once a year. An expiration dates have to be checked. Just tending to this vast stash cost a bundle. The stockpile programs budget is more than half a billion dollars a year. That went By the wayside when trump took office as we've reported Those trump let does maintenance contracts expire was caught. Sending broken ventilators two states way past their expiration dates. We also know mid earlier this year trump sent eighteen tons of our strategic national stockpile to China who then sold some of that Russia who then sold some of it back to us. So they're laundering press secretary. Mcenaney said she'd never lied to the American people but her assertion that the cupboard's bare when trump took office is not the truth and two days ago the British Medical Journal called The Lancet says Americans should oust president trump from the White House and Electro leader who will support rather than undermine public health experts. Who are battling the cove nineteen pandemic. I. I have a doctorate and I've been elbow deep in medical journals for the last twelve years and I've never seen one of them write an OP. Ed about a world leader like this. This is truly incredible. The unsigned editorial sharply criticizes the trump administration saying marginalized the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to a degree that is dangerous for the United States and the world quote. Americans must put a president in the White House. Come January twenty twenty one. Who will understand that public health should not be guided by partisan politics? The administration is obsessed with Magic Bullets. Vaccines New medicines or a hope that the virus will simply disappear but only steadfast reliance on basic public health principles like test and isolate. We'll see emergency brought to an end and this requires an effective National Public Health Strategy. The land also asks what Rachel Motto has been asking on her show over the past week. Hey CDC are you okay? The editorial is entitled reviving the US CDC calling it a federal agency that was once a quote of the gold standard for global disease detection control but it has devolved into an ineffective and nominal advisor on the US response to a disease that poses a public health threat of historic proportions. I highly recommend you. Check out this editorial. It's in the Lancet is it. Is scathing a couple more notes. Here Senator Kelly. Laughlin has handed over documents to the Department of Justice regarding her stock trades prior to the cash or prior to the crash but of course after she received those top secret briefings on Corona virus from the intelligence community that the rest of us weren't privy to Lots of folks are saying that the FBI and trump were targeting burr. Only Berger because he was set to release the Senate and counter the Senate Intel counterintelligence report on Russia in the coming months but it appears that lawful and even Dianne Feinstein we're also paid visits by the FBI. I don't think there were search. Warrants executed like there war against Burr. And when asked if she had been contacted by the F. B. I. Loftier refused to answer which means yes but yes. You're all right in that. Trump hires criminals and blackmails them when they aren't loyal that's that's what he does so nobody can come out and defend. Richard burs actions. He did it to Avi Nadi. Did it to Burger. He'll continue to do it. These are people. He's doing it to China right now. You're they're they're the bad guys and if you defended at all then you're on China side. If you defend Bert all your you must be a Republican. He does this. This is by design so I have to vote in numbers too big to manipulate and finally the Parnassus and fruman show has been pushed back until after the election. The judge presiding here approved a motion from both parties to push the entire Shebang to next year amid growing virus concerns. Take that as you will but it looks like the end of next year year and a half from now is when that trial will take place. we'll be right back with former Federal Prosecutor. Glenn Kirschner to discuss more about the Flynn. Case and the inspector's general so stick around. We'LL BE RIGHT BACK. That's ag in this helping daily beans brought to you by. Helix SLEEP BEST MATTRESS HANDS DOWN IN THE UNIVERSE. Like many people have had difficulty. Getting a good night's sleep from time to time a lot of time to stress. Anxiety politics guilty conscience now not for me for trump global pandemics. 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Happy to be wicked. Awesome so First of all On Joy Reid this morning excellent work. I appreciate you so thank you for that. Thank you appreciate it and now you and I have spoken a few times in the past month. Or so regarding the Flynn case and bars motion to dismiss the charges against him. And there's always been this recurring theme with you in these discussions. It's been your response to the assertion that you know. No judge has ever not dismissed charges when the Department of Justice. Ask Them To. But as you point out. Someone has to be the first. And since we've talked we now have the call for amicus briefs by Judge Sullivan and the naming of Covington burling and judge John. Gleeson as Amicus Curiae court is Sullivan. Poised do you think to be the first judge to deny a motion to dismiss from the Department of Justice? At least under these kinds of circumstances I realized there are other situations in which they asked to dismiss charges. But not not like this and you know. Let me first say that there might be times where we would take guilty plea. I was a prosecutor for Thirty Years. And then new information came to our attention that just so dramatically undermined the wisdom or the ethics of continuing to support that guilty plea that we might think about dismissing. I cannot think of an instance in my thirty years where that has happened but it could happen. Of course is not that case. So what Judge Sullivan has done is. It's not exactly unprecedented reaching out to an independent lawyer in Availabil- sense an independent prosecutor to come in and advise the court of you know what the prosecution's position would be if the prosecutors were actually doing their job of representing the interests of the people And so he has appointed John gleason. Who you know is is really well regarded. He was the prosecutor of John. Godley when he was a when when gleason was a federal prosecutor and Assistant. Us Attorney for the Eastern District of New York. Then he became a judge for more than twenty years. A Federal District Court judge in New York. I mean demands. Credentials are as impressive as they are impeccable. So and here's the example that I've been using recently to try to explain what in the world is going on with Bill Bar and Mike Flynn so every criminal case has two parties. Not just the defendant need to be protected absolutely but you have the defendant represented by his defense attorneys in his defense team. Then you have the other party. It's the prosecutor representing the interests of the people of the United States. What happens when the People's representative the prosecutor rates over to the defense team? Well now we. The people are unrepresented. In this case. That's what Judge Sullivan has recognized. And he said for Gosh Sakes if Gilbard bar the prosecutor is going to on Mike Flynn scheme. Then the other party to be protected their interests need to be represented in this case. That's why the appointed John Grayson. And it's the exact right thing to do now. Judge Emmet Sullivan has done something like this before. More than ten years ago in the Senator Ted Stevens Prosecution Stevens was charged with some ethical violations and accepting gifts that he shouldn't have it Cetera and he was convicted and judge Sullivan was the presiding judge. And he got wind that the Department of Justice had engaged in unethical conduct by what's called hidings the radio by failing to turn over to Senator. Stevens Defense Attorneys. The helpful exculpatory evidence that they are entitled to under our Constitution. And you know what happened? Judge Sullivan said not on my watch. Now in the Stevens case Sullivan was representing the interests of the defendant in doing this in the Flynn case. He's doing the exact same thing. But he's representing the interests of the American people because we don't have a a prosecutor to represent us in the Flynn case. And here's the other thing that I'll say When he appointed a Hank Shaw key in the Ted Stevens case was a well regarded lawyer in. Dc criminal justice circles to dig into the Department of Justice wrongdoing in the in the senator Stevens case that case got dismissed but Hank Schulkin continue to investigate for a year after which in issued a scathing report so even if Donald Trump tries to move this thing out by pardoning Flynn guess what Judge Sullivan might say. I don't care what you do. We are going to continue to dig into the corruption of bill bars. Department of Justice Soaks. You know what Bill Bar may have bit off more than he can chew with these Shenanigans and well. I hope so because it's Flynn v Bar. V Flynn and it should be the United States V. Flynn and so This I think is An interesting time line. Also on May eleventh gleason wrote an OP ED URGING SULLIVAN NOT TO DISMISS. Ask for amicus briefs. The next day Sullivan issued his order. His minute order where he went over the rules for for submitting to be amicus curiae and said don't know Shenanigans Mo- foes like this isn't a free for all and then the day after that Sullivan ordered gleason as an Amicus curiae and then shortly thereafter followed by Covington. Burling which are Flynn's original lawyers who wants who drafted the plea agreement. So do you think that timeline suggests that gleason and Sullivan may have been talking about this? Outside separately. I don't know if they have or they weren't and I do know. Of course the trump and bar loyalists will yell and scream that. Oh my goodness fixes in because Greece and already expressed an opinion. But here's the thing greasing inked a judge in this capacity gleason is a partisan he's a prosecutor he's the one who's GonNa inch represent the interests of the American people in this case so he doesn't have to be neutral and detached the way a judge would have to be or the way juror would have to be if they were coming in. They would need to have no. They would need to have expressed no real opinion or interest in the case. Prosecutors what we do we have an interesting case and the interest is following the facts following the law acting honorably an ethically and winning a conviction on behalf of the people by holding the right person accountable for the crime. So you know what the critics will yell and and Moan but all of that Hopefully will not resonate So you know I have. Confidence gleason will do a good job. We'll do an aggressive job. I mean the man went after John Gotti and what a conviction. I'm convinced that he will be a good person to represent the interests of the people because as you just said this is not this. This case became United States verses. Mike Flynn plus bill bar and that that can't be every day. I stood up in court. I said Glen Kirshner for the United States. It was my job to represent the interests of the People. Not The interests of the defendant. Yeah are in this case. The interests of the president Now you know. And you're right they're gonNA scream. The trump are gonNA scream. That gleason was Clinton judge. He's a Clinton judge That'll happen. I know that waters is that his name. Jeremy waters or something like that was on Fox. News Calling Sullivan and Obama judge. Clinton judge a liberal judge. But you know we had to point that out to him that that Sullivan was nominated. I by Reagan and then into his current position by George H.W. So it's it'll be an interesting. I'm glad Sullivan's the lawyer in this case And we're also getting stories that Sullivan could be looking or he signaling that he might bring charges of perjury or contempt. In this case. Can you explain what that means in this context? Yeah that gets a little tricky. So basically the order by Judge Sullivan said. Please do two things. John gleason one. I want you to see whether there's any earthly reason that the prosecutors should dismiss a knowing voluntary an intelligent guilty plea by Mike Flam because Lord knows we can't find any legitimate reason but then the second thing he asked Cia John Greeson to do is looking to whether Mike Flynn should be held in contempt of court for lying at the time of his guilty plea now if we unpack that a little bit. I actually don't think that one is GonNa get a lot of traction. Here's why Mike. Flynn did not lie at the time of his guilty plea Mike. Flynn swear to tell the truth and said I am guilty of lying to the FBI. Your honor that's the truth. That's not a lie. What but but you know what? This is judge Sullivan trying to cram it down. Like Flynn's throw a little bit legitimately because if Mike Flynn is now going to stand up in court and say not guilty and so when I said I was guilty before judge I was lying to you. I was kind of playing games. Well if you really want to maintain that position both things can't be true so you either lied to the court then or you're lying to the court now. I happen to believe he's lying to the court now when he says he's innocent because when he told the court he was guilty under oath he was he was telling the truth he is guilty. Yeah but wasn't he lying then when he came back and told the court that he didn't live or the FBI that he wanted to withdraw his guilty plea. I mean if you say one thing to the court and in another thing to the court one of those things has to be true and one of them has to be ally could not be the perjury. Well you know. The here's the thing and I don't WanNa get down in way down until the legal each but here's how he can navigate that terrain and God forbid them giving him a blueprint company. He's got lawyers. Who have already told him this. You can go into court and say yeah on guilty of One thousand one violation. That's the Federal Code. Section of the charge was brought against him. I'm I'm guilty of of lying to the FBI and then later but part of being guilty to line to the FBI involved that what you told them that was untrue was material to what they were investigating. So actually a defendant could say I lied to the FBI but then later evidence could be developed that because his life wasn't material he may have thought he committed the crime of lying to the FBI but the government really couldn't prove it because they couldn't prove all the elements that couldn't prove materiality so there is a cute legal way not not an honest way or a truthful or unethical. But there's a cute legal way for Mike Flynn to be able to play both sides of that that argument and I suspect that's what their lawyers will ultimately settle on. I don't think it's going to be a winning argument right. That's the crux of the argument in the motion to dismiss And so he didn't lie about lying he didn't know about materiality or said that new evidence came to light that puts that in question. So and I think that the you know making Covington burling A friend of the court is going to be to establish the legitimacy of the guilty plea. Exactly which is at the core of this. Do you have any guesses as who might also be named run to the quarter was the specifically to get gleason and Covington burling onboard. I because I know Ben. Tae and Jensen had some arguments with the Flynn case behind the scenes. Bentayga being the Legal Counsel for the FBI Etc So is the FBI. I think it's the F. B. I. during the Bene. I'm just wondering if you think that they'll be anybody else maybe Maybe van graphic or Kravis. I don't know. Did you have any thoughts on that? Yeah so van brackets still with the federal government. So it's not going to be him in my opinion Kravis unfortunately for Kravis. I know well he was one of a homicide prosecutors that that I worked with when I was on the side. Guy In DC. Now gone over to the DC city government And I I. I'm thrilled for the D. City government but I really Couldn't be more angry. Quite frankly that the United States lost him because he was one of the Premier Public Corruption. Prosecutors that we had not only in. Washington. Dc but in the country So but I don't think it's going to be Kravis either. Because he's still a government employee just now with another government But I do think Judge Sullivan. I think I think amicus is wide open. I think lots of people will submit briefs and I think it's simply which ones does the court wants to accept. I have a feeling the court will except I don't WanNa say all comers but quite a few because in the absence of assigned prosecutor in this case because Bill Bar is not legitimate prosecutor and Tim Shea. For God's sake you'll bars acolyte Y- not a legitimate prosecutor a political appointee as well. There is literally and figuratively a career prosecutor. On this case there are two political hacks and no prosecutors and those two political hacks have migrated over to the defense camp. So I think I think Sullivan will be pretty generous in the amicus. Briefs he accepts. I'm half expecting Tim us to find out. Tim Show owns and profits off of some trump property. Somewhere like this real quick tim. Shays appointment is up on June second. Yeah I and I love this because if you look at the American Oversight Organization they sent a letter to the chief judge of the Federal District Court in DC barrel. Hal saying Judge Howell. You know once Tim. Shays interim appointment as US attorney in DC expires. Guess what you judge to Howell and members of the Federal Court in DC get to appoint the next intra US attorney for the District of Columbia so stay tuned on that front because unless trump nominates and the senate confirms a new US Attorney for the District of Columbia the Federal District Court judges and that means Sullivan and how Jackson and Richard Walton and check burke and all the rest of them. We'll get to name the next intrigued. Us Attorney in DC. June second is the deadline. June shaking hold on tight All right that's awesome and finally what about the other charges that were not brought against Flynn because he was cooperating? Once upon a time nothing can be done about that right that has that involved a grand jury and that would just be a bar situation but this is the silver lining. Because I think Flynn is. You know. He's in trouble. One way or another if judge Sullivan hold hearings and ultimately decides that. She has dismissed the case against Mike. Flynn you know what happens? All of those other crimes that Mike Flynn committed that he admitted to committing in his plea paperwork in this case including false filings with the Department of Justice trying to hide his lobbying work on behalf of the Republic of Turkey that he has admitted to that in his plea paperwork. All of those crimes can and should be brought against him in January. When we have law-abiding president in the law enforcing Attorney General? That will be available to the next administration. If Judge Emmet Sullivan dismisses this case if he refuses to dismiss the case and he sentences Flynn in accordance with this plea agreement then all than the agreement that also includes. Hey if you plead guilty. We won't bring all these other charges against you all these other crimes you committed then. Unfortunately those crimes are probably lost to the next administration. Your statue of limitations. What starts the clock on that when he guilty to those crimes or when he failed to file as a foreign agent or when he committed the lobbying which was mid twenty sixteen. I mean that that's not a very long time for the new administration to to act agreed. I think we will have until at least twenty twenty two a five year statute of limitation. So I actually think all of those charges if if Judge Sullivan dismisses the case all of those charges can still make it under the statute of limitations. Wire actually think it's worse for. Flynn gets sentenced to a few months in prison today. Then if this case gets dismissed and tons of criminal charges are brought against him in January. All of which are very easily proven. I guess what guess who's in charge of the new department overseeing Farah violations at the Department of Justice. It's van back at the moment a moment but yeah he's there for now hanging on by a probably why he won't be an. Amicus CURIAE in this case so he can hold that position and you know even if not this department was designed after you know because of trump thanks trump and and I think that whoever you know Joe Biden is elected in November When he takes office in January he will put van grant or someone of Van Grass. Ilk in charge back again in charge of the Farah Department Unit in within the Department of Justice. So I hope I'm brings a lot of these heroes quite frankly back. I have a youtube channel now last night. I felt compelled to post video about today's heroes. The heroes up the trump era you know and whether it's the Yvonna bitches or the been bins the Dr Fiona Hills or the doctor rip rights or the Bill Taylor's or the prosecution scenes. Both of them that walked off the stone case walked off the Flynn case. There are so many heroes out there and I hoped they all come stampeding back to public circus in January. Because you know needed them now but we'll need them again in the future. Yeah Yeah An- and no one last question for the Doom Lords here in Congress now wants to investigate the firings the inspector general to the State Department that was looking into Pompeo. What do you say to those who might be saying so what? I'm tired of the Democrats in the House. Quote Unquote investigating anything. It never goes anywhere because many have lost faith in this system of checks and balances are we do. We just hang on waited till after the election or go forward with these investigations as part of congressional duty. I don't think Congress should be doing anything but fighting the coronavirus whatever legislation they can and conducting oversight hearings into every crime trump every trump crime and abuse. Because that's all we got. We don't have a department of justice any more willing to hold the executive branch accountable for its crime. So Congress all we had and you know what if somebody keeps robbing your house over and over again you don't just say don't WanNa Kinda tired of fighting to hold the robber accountable. Just wait until we move and he can have whatever he wants to. You know it it. It needs to be investigated because trump keeps saying. I'm losing confidence in every inspector general. Well he's losing confidence in them because they're gonNA explosives corruption and he doesn't want that to happen so he was confidence number one slack in place. He's losing his confidence that they won't leave him alone. That's what it is losing confidence that they will cover up crimes. We're I think we're all at this point waiting on November but these these investigations are important. Should go forward all right. Thanks so much everybody Former federal prosecutor. Gosh twenty five plus years most of them at the DC. Us Attorney's office former Jag. Army lawyer and MSNBC legal analyst. Tell tell everyone where they can find you please. I have borne of frustration because you know the the Cable News and I love NBC AND MSNBC with all my heart always will and I remain there analysts as long as they'll have me but you know the coverage has been twenty four seven on corona virus so the legal analysis work is Kinda slipping under the radar screen at as a result. The public is not really getting a full appreciation of the crimes that trump is continues to perpetrate supportive frustration. I started my own Youtube Channel so I would love for people go on You Might. Youtube is just my name. Glenn Kirschner and I basically posted video crime at day. And we're GONNA need a bigger week to fit them all in but a crime it day and they can Watch the videos and Hopefully that they they will resonate. I talk and talk because I'M GONNA kick through Jersey and I don't try not to talk like a lawyer if I can help it And they can also follow me on twitter. Which is Glenn Kirschner too? But Youtube is just name. Glenn Kirschner Yep Awesome. Thank you going Kirshner and we appreciate your time today. And please take take care of yourself have a great week. Thank you appreciate it all right coming up next. We have the good news block with men in D. readers so stay with us. Hey everybody it's in the segment. Daily beans is brought to you by Vizi. Bre Dot Com look are driving. Habits have changed since corona virus since the pandemic. We aren't driving nearly as much time to reassess your auto insurance needs. Everyone's trying to be more frugal and conserve resources. And even before this happened Americans were overpaying on car insurance by like an estimated twenty one billion dollars per year and oftentimes searching for a better deal takes hours. You have to call sales people. They're all pushy. Then you get a bunch of unwanted spam calls and emails but not anymore thanks to the Zebra Dot Com. They make comparing rates safer and easier. 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Not everyone who uses uber finds a lower rate but those who do save an average of three hundred sixty eight dollars per year and the best part is it's completely free with no spam. There's no risk I know we could all use the extra cash right now to check it out. Go TO ZEBRA DOT COM. Find out how much you can save on car and home insurance go to and start saving the zebra dot com slash daily beans. Zebra DOT com slash. Daily beans spelled T. H. E. Z. E. B. R. A. dot com slash daily beans. All all. Right everybody welcome back. It is time for the good news all right so today to start it off to kick it off before we get to our listener. Good news on Corn Confessions I do have a little bit of good news. Jerry Nadler Up made an appearance this over the weekend. I think Friday and He did on. I think CNN or MSNBC and one of the two and he said that they are going to demand that our bill bar testify on June knife. He was supposed to testify March thirty first but as we know because of Cova concerns the courts closed so he didn't testify. I'm sorry not the courts The House because he testified in front. How does your committee So they're GONNA do it. June ninth and ninth is the first day that They're back opened up unless it's postponed again. And Adler said that they are willing to use their full powers of contempt and subpoena powers if he refuses to show up and also they he said that you know they have power of the purse in Congress and he'll defend the AG's office if he doesn't show up Holy Shit I know and yet and yet all of that all of that all of that and I still don't think that he'll show up you know and that's that's the sad part is like they can say whatever they want and they can. They can be as firm as they want. But these people don't care no exactly and unless they use inherent contempt. And and send the sergeant at arms out to fucking grab the motherfucker. They have to go through the Department of Justice. Anyway to enforce a contempt order so that would be bar. Who wouldn't do that to himself. So it'll be interesting to see what happens if they if they use the power of the purse though I'm interested and we'll know sooner rather than later that's only you know what see what we got fifteen plus nine twenty four days from now so we'll see what happens. Yeah that's in less than a month so at least we'll know soon exactly especially I love it especially if it's later in the summer All right so what? Sort of good news stories do we have from our listeners. We have some thank you guys so much for sending them in Really appreciate it The first one I love Timms born. I miss this story. But it's a link to articles back from a bow mid April when Spain was in the harshest part of their lockdown European countries had lockdowns. Where you know. It's like they monitor. You can leave your house one today for exercise or sometimes not even that but apparently Some citizens in Spain during the during the strictest part of the lockdown were allowed to walk their pets so a Guy Walked. His goldfish took is goldfish bowl out on a walk as an exemption to the rule. And there's a picture of it. We'll have to send that out in the newsletter this week. God it's so funny I mean. That's that's fucking hilarious. Um Congratulations Sir. Very Creative yes nice. Well done well done. This is my pet invisible friend. I'm walking today. All right the next one a little bit more serious than taking your goldfish for a walk. This is from anonymous in this one for obvious. Reasons touched my heart and anonymous says my sixteen year old daughter who came out a few years ago is a lesbian has been doing research to educate ourselves on gay rights and has come to me. Many times completely shocked at the lack of basic rights. And the legal discrimination policies that are in place for gay people. We have been having many political discussions as of late and she wanted to know what she can do to make things better. I told her since she is old enough to vote yet. She can volunteer to make phone calls. Knock on doors for candidates who will fight for the rights of minorities. She's now looking into all local city state and Biden campaign offices that she could possibly help with her enthusiasm to help to help and to do her part. Make these important changes incredible. Sorry Allie Redo that what her enthusiasm to help. Do her part to make these important. Changes is incredible and makes me so proud to be her mom? I have hope for the future because I know she isn't the only person in her generation that is motivated to make this country better for everyone. Well that sort of reminds me of the commencement speech. Obama gave on Saturday for Hashtag graduate together. Where he said you know. Y'All are turning eighteen. Now you vote. You're going to shape this This world and you're going to be our future leaders and That was a very hopeful message. He also said this right after Trump was elected. He appeared on Pod. Save America Obama did and said look. We're going to have this wave of young people just washing over the country. And that's what that's what the ambassador of hope means to him and so two to just hear. That story is just so wonderful and you know big ups to going out there and getting it done. You know you can't vote yet but you will soon and so we really. We really appreciate your hard work. Yeah and I've taken down your email by the way anonymous and I'm going to send you an email because I wanna share a story with you about the exact same experience. I had when I was younger when I was coming out and I was like. Oh Holy Shit. I am illegal in so many places. I am so discriminated against and you know to to to be to be fair. It's it's a very white privileged experience I know a lot of people who who grew up with other disadvantages in society face discrimination the younger age but for me you know coming out for me was the first time I realized the level of legal discrimination that exists. And Yeah it's a wakes you up to a lot of stuff in it puts a lot of fight into you. Think sharing that the next one is from. Sarah and Sarah says Mike good news is that I began my PhD in Marine Geochemistry. Okay Smarty Pants last fall and I had an expedition to sample water and study off the coast of West Africa in April that I was really looking forward to. It was obviously canceled and I was really bummed this week though I learned that our trip had been successfully resubmitted and we will be doing our science later this year by the way climate and environmental science so important right now thank you It will be a shorter time shorter trip. And there's new restrictions like enforced to have a single cabin out not my own room but I do get to do the work and collect samples. My project has been on a bit of a hiatus so this really helped me focus again and feel like it's moving forward and feel positive. Thank you so much for all you guys do. Awesome congrats Sarah. All right. This is from Also anonymous non. Ima says I just wanted to give you some hope with my city of Lansing Michigan being shown in the news for protests. I don't know where these people are. Driving from the only people I see in lansing are out in the stores wearing masks and staying six feet from other. I was laughing to myself when it was thundering and pouring rain and those protesters outside on Thursday. Thank you for everything you do to make us laugh and keeping forums like. What are you have against staying at home in the rain like stick like? I can't remember who I can't remember. Who tweeted it? But they said you know people who say go big or go home. Really underestimate my desire to go home. God right right now with my energy levels go bigger go home go home because it's pretty much all. I think about on a constant basis is. When do I get to all right? This is the Knicks went from Jan. Jan Says my son. Co owns a mom and pop restaurant this week. They announced that when they reopen and going forward they will be paying all of their waitstaff. Fifteen bucks an hour This'll be partially passed onto the consumer in the form of a hospitality fee instead of requesting tips. The community has really rallied around. This idea and people are posting on the facebook page that they will be prayed. Patronizing the restaurant with much frequency due to this decision. Also yes Trieste as well and yes it will follow. And don't underestimate the the giving power of the public either. Your I bet you're going to see that fifteen dollars an hour plus tips that everyone gave anyway. At least I know that that's how I would treat it so I I I'm always amazed at at the public's willingness to rise to the occasion and support you know our our our frontline workers are middle class or working class. So congratulations on that. That's really great. Yeah I love that that's awesome. This is the last one for good news today. Very relevant to us. Ag from Scotty in animal crossing my turn. Us finally hit a high sell price spike. Fuck Yeah my girlfriend. I sold our turnips for collective three million bells of profit and are now building those expensive bridges at inclines. All over the island. We also had a bunch of our friends. Visit Our island so they're turnips too so now we're all happy billionaires billionaires. Oh I love it. I hadn't heard the term billionaires yet. That's amazing and it's you know it's good to to be able to be a billionaire somewhere So animal crossing allows us to be you know the elite and by the way we have just started a daily beans dischord for those of our listeners who also play animal crossing and we share turn up prices and we invite people over islands to help water flowers for hybrids We give away free extra. Diy's and I've already. Somebody made me a crown that was adorable and I went and I picked that up yesterday and it's just been so much fun. It's a great resource for stuff that you don't have stuff that you want and So check it out. What how do they find it? Mandy so I have posted it. I posted it on Patriot. If you're a patriot and you'll see it there It's been posted on Muller. She wrote twitter on the daily beans twitter on the facebook pages in the facebook group. If for some reason you cannot find the link you can either email Amanda Muller she rotary can DMS on twitter. And we will send you the link but It's been posted all over the place it on instagram post in our instagram as well. So you can't find a let us know Ange. And here's the under normal circumstances. This would be a patron perk but because of Cove Nineteen. We understand that not everybody can afford to be a patron. We see you and You're just please join our discord it open to the public. And if you're able to become a patriots littlest three bucks a month. You get these episodes early ad free you get. Thank you gifts. You get bonus content access to the discord the newsletter. I mean you get so much our discovered I should point out is a politics free zone. We like to keep it cute in peaceful and our animal crossing discord. If you would like to discuss politics you can do so in our patron facebook group where we have a politics zone in there yet. So we're keeping the politics out of it unless it's animal crossing politics. You know Tom Nook can can be a bit of a slum Lord so you know I mean. How much does he charging for those house extensions? I'm still paying off a a two point. Four nine million dollar million bell loan for my basement but yeah I I wanted to open this up to be free for everyone because I know that a lot of folks just can't afford to to subscribe to a premium feed right now so please join us on that. Discord Fun And now it is time for quarantine. Confessions Dan a so this week. On Quarantine Confessions The first one is from anonymous. Love Your name anonymous bad joke but I enjoyed it. My job is super dull and super evil about as evil could be in the current climate. I take people's homes from them that does suck but you gotta make a buck. I guess so I am slow so I'm slow rolling my employer on everything silly criticisms of the work product and making the server run really slowly all the while. I am working from home to fill the time I should be working each day. I'm watching a different genre of porn and writing. Nice things so the people who made it it might not be my personal taste in porn but if I see something that someone has put a lot of effort or talent love. I want them to know that their work has value. Unlike my my work has no value. My employer is now paying me to make adult performers have a better day also reminder pay for your porn it is a valuable industry. Yes that's awesome like. Hey I'm not into Water sports but a for effort your passion P P FOR PASSION GET IT. P P passionate surname. Maybe yeah I agree with you. It does have value especially working from home right now watching more important pay. Pay Your sex workers next confession by the way some. This theme for this week's was was bad haircuts. I guess where it's about reach that time so the next few about here this is from Keila Keila says after weeks of quarantine. My husband gave himself a haircut me having no filter exclaimed you Buddha judge yourself. My husband doesn't follow so do I. Do you remember that Haircut? The and game. Oh my God you just use up. My husband doesn't follow politics like ID and had no idea what I was talking about. Needless to say he was miffed explained. His haircut. Looked like the cut that chassis gave Pete. That was awkwardly short later that night after having some wine and watching comedy I laughed. Extra hard will look again at my husband's haircut. He had no idea why you should have to mask it by watching comedies. All the time. No honey I'm laughing at the movie. It's funny movie. Oh God your hair. You've been Buddha judge. That's another great episode title. You Buddha judged yourself you yourself that live on. That's so great. And of course big love to to be Mayor Pete and his wonderful husband but that was really really funny and then he made a TV appearance right after. I'm like no no no no. Yeah I'm wanting my hair get really feral. During quarantine do not trust myself. I was I was young in angsty and artsy and I gave myself so many bad. Diy haircuts at. I'm scarred forever. I can't I can't go there again. Well as you as you age you know. Once you're once you approach fifty one year of your life seems a lot shorter than when it does when you're thirty so. I think you can go a lot longer before you cut your hair again so I fortunately right before quarantined. I started growing up my grades and my bangs and so I'm already at the point where I can talk. Bang behind my ears. I don't have to clip them back anymore. And I'm letting the gray grow out so here. We are perfect timing. You know anything serendipitous about that. It's IT'S A it's a bonus it's you know it's not a whole reason to start a pandemic but you know it's it's working out well dude. Eventually at some point in the future hair salons and nail salons and beauty sort of venues various places. They're going to be. They're going to be thirty to be getting some work. I'm Cheryl please help me. Okay Sarah Sarah says my confession I cut my own hair and for some reason thought it would be a great idea to also give myself thanks. It was not I now. Like frizzy Dee Ramone. Amanda do you know who D- Ramon is? I do I do okay okay. All right I thought I was going to have to give an an explanation of Dee Dee Ramone but no I do know who that is. I do know who that is. You underestimate. You underestimate me. In terms of music I have live with Joel for a while. Now she has given me an education and to be fair. Your parents or my age. So that's the thing the funny thing about our relationship is like I'm I'm dating dating married to a Gen xer but my parents are also Gen xers because they had me young. So there's this of thing Jogos you really know what that is because you're younger than me but I'm like yeah but my parents are your age so I bet she loves when you say that she does her favorite thing the world by the way. Hi Mom listened to the show at. Hi Mom Hi Mom. Thanks for the work that you do by the way. Thank you know your line. Healthcare workers so thank you All Right Sarah says in penance. I have increased my Patriot amount to your show. Thank you Sarah. We Accept Your Penance. So wait so when people. Buddha judge themselves. They have to give us more money. I mean that's fine to me. I like it. I like it okay. We'll call it. We'll call it the chest in tax. God this speaking of Chechen he first of all he seems the kind of guy you'd see at big Gabriel. Jonah Sunday morning this morning. I I missed gay brunch so badly that I was like dancing around the living room to George Michael's freedom while eating my Bagel Abbas. Like this is how bad escape branch just to give you a visual nice. We have I think we have time for one more confession. What do we? What do we have? So let's see. Oh here's one look back to the other ones. We have more hair cutting for next week. Folks this is the last one from anonymous. This is both good news and confession confession. I've been a longtime listener of both your shows. But I haven't actually read the Muller report I know. Oh I know we didn't have to. You didn't have to because he listened to the shows. Well then they say good news. I just bought a paperback copy. And I'm planning on re listening to all of your podcast while I read. It even have colored pens and pretty sticky notes. It seems like a lot of Shit is GonNa hit the fan in the next few months and I want to be prepared. Thank you so much for this fabulous resource for all of your good humor kind vibes and swears well not no to then producers. Note back last about a year ago last When when the Muller report came out in April we did a nineteen part series in the Muller. She wrote rece- show a where we went through the report. Line by line so I would just go there. It's all in one thousand nine part series Yes if you come back to the episodes and you're looking for specific Zip specifically where we dig into it. Line by line you can just. They're labeled like Mullah report part one report part two and yeah. That'll that should help you out. But that's so cool. It's really Rad. This is that you've created this resource G. for people to like know like you said last year you were like. I hope that in the future people can use this to when they're trying to learn more about it and it is already happening very cool. Yeah some amazing things happen. You know over time. I know that there is a professor at University of California. San Francisco who uses are nineteen part. Muller reports series to teach class and I also know that Somebody had sent us an anonymous Piece of good news that that they got into the daily beans because their therapist recommended it to them because it was a a way to consume the news. That didn't make you want to have massive anxiety attacks so I feel so humbled and proud that you know we're we've become part of the lexicon and we're you know we're known for reporting the news in a way that doesn't freak you out. People Fall Asleep to us. Yeah very very cool. It's it's it's been an honor to to get to know all of the fans and I'm so glad that it's meaningful to people in that way. It was so funny the other day discussing on on twitter people who are like I fall asleep to it to like no rain. Well whatever works. Thanks everybody for submitting. Your Confessions Mandy. Where can they do that? You can submit your confessions? We are actually adding the link to the contact page on mullet short com slash contact later today. But if it's not there when you if it's not up yet you can find it our. It's our pins. Tweet at daily beans pod you can find it there and I've shared it on on Patriots Times and other facebook group. If you can't find us a can't find let us know but the two places you can find it are the pinch tweet at daily means pod and soon to be on the contact page website. All right well thank you very much Amanda it's been wonderful talking to you everybody out there. Please take care of yourselves. Take care of each other. Take care of your mental health and take care of the planet. I've been ag been mandy reader and them's the beans. The daily beans is executive produced and directed by AG Jordan Coburn and engineered edited by Mackenzie Mozelle and stubborn. Industries Are Marketing Manager Executive Assistant Production and social media direction as Amanda Reader Fact Checking Research by AG Jordan Coburn and Amanda Reader. Our music is written and performed by. They might be giants. Are Web design and branding or by Joel reader with moxy design studios and our website is daily beans pod dot com.

Donald Trump FBI US Flynn Judge Emmet Sullivan president Russia prosecutor Department of Justice Mike Flynn Jared Kushner Michael Flynn Sergei Kislyak Muller Hillary Clinton Jordan Coburn Glenn Kirschner Congress John gleason
Mon. 06/15  People Are Actually MORE Honest On Their Cellphones

Techmeme Ride Home

18:22 min | 2 months ago

Mon. 06/15 People Are Actually MORE Honest On Their Cellphones

"Welcome to the ride home for Monday June Fifteenth Twenty Twenty I'm Brian McCullough today the zero interest Mac financing is finally here shop and Walmart team up as they probably should. His Mr Bazo about to go to Washington, interesting check in with Caribbean and Softbank and why researchers think people are more honest when responding on their smartphones than on their PC's. Here's what you missed today in the world of Tech. And here you go as we speculated on last week apple this morning did indeed launch zero interest financing on the Apple Card for purchases of ipods MACs air pods, and most of its other products, even the Apple Pencil. Depending on what you buy, you can stretch out the payments for six to twelve months again. Interest free quoting nine to five Mac in December. Apple launched a new iphone zero percent financing option for apple card users, and during apple's most recent earnings call with investors, Tim Cook teas that similar promotions would soon be available for other apple products and recent reports indicated the route. Route was imminent. These new options are available starting today. The financing options vary by product for example higher priced items like the Mac in ipad pro offer twelve months financing with zero percent interest cheaper Adams like air pods and air pods, pro offer six month financing with zero percent interest Apple Watch is excluded from these financing options for unknown reasons for example you can finance air pods pro with percents interest for six months, which equates to forty one dollars and fifty cents per month. Air Pods with wireless charging case can be financed for thirty three dollars sixteen cents per month. You can finance. Inch Mac, book, Pro, starting at one hundred ninety nine dollars, ninety one cents for twelve months and apple just added a more powerful graphics option as well. The MAC pro and pro display FDR, are also eligible for these financing options. The PRO display FDR starts at four hundred sixteen dollars fifty eight cents per month while the Mac pro starts at four hundred ninety nine dollars ninety nine cents per month, Apple. Apple is also encouraging users to finance ipad hardware purchases alongside accessories. For example you can find the IPAD, pro magic keyboard and Apple Pencil for twelve months with zero percent interest, even though the Apple Pencil is a lower cost item. Notably, you still receive three percent daily cashback with these finance purchases through applecart. Apple explains that you simply select Apple Card monthly installments at checkout and complete your purchase and quote. Something something interesting strategic partnerships. Walmart has announced that it has partnered with shop affi- to expand its party marketplace, planning to add around twelve hundred shop affi- sellers this year alone quoting Bloomberg the company's marketplace site, which already offers more than seventy five million products grew at a faster pace than Walmart's overall web business in the first quarter and third party sales are typically more profitable as the sellers pay a fee to list items and often shoulder the delivery costs. The collaboration is Walmart's latest attempt to expand the scale and profitability of its twenty one and a half. Billion dollar US E. Commerce. Commerce business, which is gaining ground on market leader Amazon but continues to lose money. In recent years, Walmart has rolled out a fulfillment service for third party. Sellers allowed customers to return marketplace items in its physical stores and jettisoned millions of third party items that didn't meet quality standards for shop, a Fi, the deal expected to be announced as early as Monday provides its network of millions of merchants access to Walmart's covers and follows a may link up with facebook that allowed retailers to import shop product catalogs to the social media giant's new shops, service and quote. Walmart now has around forty five thousand merchants in its marketplace, but at the same time I don't think I mentioned it about a month ago. Walmart announced that it would be discontinuing its jet DOT com site, which was a standalone ecommerce site acquired for three point three billion dollars in two thousand sixteen. Even as Walmart's overall Q. One e commerce sales at all of Walmart's sites were overall seventy four percent, so I duNNo. Continues to be a muddled effort in e commerce for Walmart, but maybe things are moving in the right direction maybe. Something else that slip through the cracks this from late last week though. Late Friday a letter leaked revealing that the House Judiciary Committee wrote to Apple Alphabet Amazon and facebook to have those companies say by Sunday whether or not their CEO's were willing to testify in antitrust hearings to take place next month July and this morning. A lawyer for Amazon says that Jeff bezos is willing to testify which would be a marked shift on as part quoting the New York Times. Amazon had earlier resisted making him available to the House Judiciary Committee the group overseeing the antitrust investigation, prompting lawmakers to threaten to legally compel Mr. Bezos to testify. Testify in the letter sent on Sunday which was reviewed by the New York Times Robert K. Kellner of the law firm Covington burling which is representing Amazon, before the investigation said the company was quote committed to cooperating with your inquiry, and we'll make the appropriate executive available to testify quote he added. This includes making Jeff bezos available to testify at a hearing with the other CEO's this summer and quote Mr Kellner, said that Mr Basil availability was dependent on first resolving several issues, including timing format and questions about the committee's request for internal documents and quote. Here's a little news that you could maybe use, but also it's just interesting whether or not you plan to take advantage of this knowledge or not. Multiple Studies seem to show that people are more honest and convey more personal thoughts when they're writing on their smartphones than when they're writing on. PC's quoting the Wall Street Journal in research published in March in the Journal of Marketing Dr Sherri. Me Mad an assistant professor of marketing at the School of the University of Pennsylvania conducted three field studies and to controlled experiments. One study looked at nearly three hundred thousand twitter posts created in a twelve hour span tweets written on phones contained forty seven percent, more first person pronouns and fifty two percent more references to family than those written. Written on P. C.'s, she found quote. Consumers tend to convey feelings or thoughts that are more private or intimate on their smartphones, which is captured by the use of I or we, mentioning family and friends Dr Meltzer MoD, said a second study employed thirteen hundred and eighty judges as well as natural language processing software to analyze a random sample of more than ten thousand trip advisor restaurant reviews. The software scan revealed that reviews written on smartphones contained more first person pronouns and more references to friends, and crucially for marketers. They were judged to be more self disclosing an intern more persuasive. Quote smartphone generated content seems to be more diagnostic of how people truly feel Dr me. Mad says these reviews heightened readers interests in visiting the restaurants and quote the final field study found that people were more likely to disclose personal information in response to an ad when targeted on their smartphone than on their PC, the controlled experiments meanwhile demonstrated that the small screen of a smartphone forces people to focus. Focus more on what they're writing than they do on a PC. A phenomenon known as attention narrowing attentional narrowing is found across online contexts. When we use our phone to tweet right review answer survey questions even when we're asked to reveal incriminating activity document, says the experiments also further established smartphones do indeed act as an adult pacifier, psychologically comforting users, and thus driving them toward greater self, disclosure and quote. Double Up is an agency that helps content. Creators create digital businesses with real reliable revenue over the past year, double up has helped companies, influencers and podcasters built millions of dollars value double up will dig into your audience data and identify opportunities to grow Your Business and better serve your most passionate fans double up will shape a digital product strategy to capitalize on high leverage opportunities and maximize return on your time and creative energy double up will launch grow optimized digital and subscription products to help you realize predictable and recurring revenue double up has helped the likes of Sam. Peter, Attia and Rhonda Harris create solid businesses with reliable subscription revenue all by serving their fans and communities. Let Double Up. Take a look at your content and your audience and create some solutions to make a real lasting business. Check them out. AT DOUBLE UP DOT agency. That's double up dot agency and when you get in touch, tell them Brian thank you. I got my cell phone with one of those big wireless providers Geez twenty years ago I think exactly actually. I think I've honestly hated my monthly bill ever since then, but then I discovered. There's another option that could give me the premium service I'm used to at a fraction of the cost I. Cut my wireless bill down to just fifteen bucks a month and save hundreds of dollars by switching to mint mobile for anyone out there. WHO's looking to save without sacrificing service? Switching mobile is a no brainer. Every plan comes with unlimited nationwide talk and text plus crazy fast four forgery Lt. use your own phone. Phone with any mobile plan, and keep your same phone number along with all your existing contacts, and if you're not one hundred percent satisfied mid level, has you covered with their seven day money back, guarantee to get your new wireless plan for just fifteen bucks a month and get the plan shipped to your door for free go to mid mobile dot com slash ride. That's meant mobile dot com slash ride. Cut Your wireless bill down to fifteen bucks a month at MIT mobile dot com slash ride. The rest of the segments in the show today are all going to be follow ups to a bunch of our favorite long running stories. For example, it wasn't that long ago that I was all excited that apple and Google had joined forces to create covid nineteen contact tracing API's that the hope was will help us all beat the pandemic. That of course assumed anyone wanted to actually beat the pandemic, or at least had the fortitude to do what was necessary to defeat it, but. I digress. Anyway NBC News has a look at the efforts to create contact tracing APPs using those API's and found that the efforts seem to have stalled out. As most states are basically retreating from any previous interest and doing anything about the virus, and those few who are or have developed apps struggle with adoption among their populous quote, most states are giving the cold shoulder to smartphone APPS. A survey of state health officials from business insider this week. Show that only three states Alabama. Alabama north, Dakota, and South Carolina said they are going to use the suffer provided by apple and Google. The number hasn't grown since the same three states reported interest last month, and none has launched an APP with Google Apple. Software the factual analytical assessment is it's not a high upside, said Andy Sabat in Obama. Administration healthcare official who is chair of the nonprofit United States of care quote the bulk of the investment you need to make is in manpower and quote. It's not the enthusiastic welcome that some technologists we're hoping for. When they began planning months ago. For the launch of smartphone APPs that would help respond to the pandemic and contribute to a return to something like normal life. Even the World Health Organization has piled on quote. Digital tools do not replace the human capacity needed to do contact tracing W. H. O. Director General said at a briefing this week, adding that more evidence was needed, and that the WHO would convene experts to share information and while there. There are early reports of successful mobile tracing technology in some countries such as South, Korea and Taiwan the effort so far have fallen flat in the US quote. It is something that launched, and then sort of fell away, said Ryan callow a University of Washington law, Professor and expert in Tech, policy and privacy, who was an early skeptic that the APPs could be effective, he said it makes sense for states to focus on human contact tracers who quote have been effective since the bhubaneshwar plague and quote. And, I can't resist a follow up on the whole. Situation of course. Ben, Mullin, in the Wall Street Journal over the weekend had an in depth. Look at how things are going over in Queensland Land, and among the other details, qube is apparently on track to sign up fewer than two million paying subscribers by the end of its first year in business, which would be significantly below the original target of seven point four million. Here are some more fine grain numbers quote at its current pace will sign up fewer than two million paying subscribers by the end of the APPS first year, a person familiar with its operation, said well under its original target of seven point four million inquiries. APP Download numbers been falling in recent weeks according to analytics firm Sensor. Sensor. Tower daily downloads peaked at three, hundred, seventy, nine, thousand on its April six launch day, but didn't exceed twenty thousand on any day in the first week of June according to censor tower as of June seventh quickies, APP had been downloaded about three point eight million times according to censor tower, Qube, said, it's internal figures show. The APP has been downloaded five million times. Not all downloads result in customer sign ups, though by the end of May more than one and a half. MILLION USERS had signed up for Qube. Many of whom we're on a free trial. The company is pacing behind its internal projections for user sign ups according to a person familiar with the matter and quote. Also qube apparently did not even hit its own internal APPS. Trial targets for that first month's and things might be heading for a reckoning sooner rather than later as those free ninety day trials that early signs were offered. Begin to end next month by that point, Q. Three estimates are that qube will already have burned through one billion dollars and might need to raise at least an additional two hundred million dollars by the second half of two thousand twenty one. But what is also interesting is how much of this piece seems to be. From Meg Whitman point of view, which is what tends to happen when one executive attempts to get ahead of bad news to try salvage their reputation. Here is the lead of the peace. Make this which will quote near the beginning of a run as chief executive of be a new enter into the streaming video awards. Meg, Whitman threatened to quit. The silicon. Valley veteran worried her working relationship with founder and Hollywood bigwig. Jeffrey Katzenberg had worsened to the point that it put the company's future in jeopardy, according to people familiar with our concerns so in May, two thousand eighteen. She laid out a list of problems to Mr Katzenberg. He had been dictatorial, treating her like one of his underlings. He interrupted employees including her in meetings. His interactions at the company had often been belittling and demeaning. He had a tendency to micromanage letting her. Be True. CEO Mr Katzenberg took our concerns seriously, and the two struck a deal that gave Ms Whitman more independence at the company. The people said quote. In other words, someone and somebody's camp wants to make it clear that whatever happens with qube in the Court of Conventional. Wisdom Jeffrey Katzenberg will be the one to own it. And finally today can't resist this one either Softbank has apparently invested more than five hundred million dollars in Credit Suisse supply chain, finance funds, and those funds then turned around and bought up the debt of struggling Softbank backed startups. So! Have you ever heard of the phrase robbing Peter to Pay Paul? Yeah well. This is sort of like funding Peter to buy up Paul's distressed debt, quoting the Financial Times the arrangement has allowed Softbank affectively to provide financial assistance to other vision fund companies by paying their suppliers Upfront, but through fund co mingled with other investors and financing other companies, this means external investors also bear the risk of those companies failing to pay their debts, which one person familiar with the arrangement said could prove problematic if they were unaware of soft bank's substantial interest quote, you thought you were an arm's length arrangement where all your fellow investors had a pure financial interests, he said imagine you then found that. In fact, some of your investors were funding themselves and quote. Soft Bank Credit Suisse and Greenville capital declined to comment and quote. As Peter Tall Larson tweeted quote. Soft Bank's record of investing in tech startups maybe mixed, but when it comes to financial innovation, it's in a League of its own. And as SAR. tweeted quote, remember how we used to make fun of crypto startups, raising money with Tokens and investing in Tokens of other crypto startups using their tokens. Here's the Softbank version and quote. Matt Levine I know you're on hiatus for personal reasons, but if we ever needed an emergency newsletter from you well. Thrown up the bat signal. That is offered today as always. You can follow me on twitter at Brian MCC be. Is Our slash ride home? If you're so inclined to do, so, you can consume this podcast on youtube at YouTube dot com slash tech name podcasts word if you do go to you to follow us, follow the channel there, and if you'd like to support the show directly and get a version of the show with zero ads in the bargain. Check out the very last link in today's show notes.

apple Walmart qube Soft Bank Amazon Jeffrey Katzenberg Wall Street Journal Peter Tall Larson Mac facebook Meg Whitman Caribbean Twenty Twenty Mr Bazo Jeff bezos Tim Cook twitter executive New York Times youtube
White House Down (feat. Andrew Torrez)

The Daily Beans

1:15:04 hr | 3 months ago

White House Down (feat. Andrew Torrez)

"Hello and welcome to the daily beans for Monday. May Eleventh Twenty Twenty today. The White House is a corona virus hotspot health and Human Services Whistleblower. Dr Bright speaks out in a sixty minutes interview documents. Show the trump administration buried detailed plans from the CDC more administration watchdogs depart at least forty seven states partially reopened over. The weekend is cases. Pile up. Cuomo and Hakim Jeffries put churches to work in New York and an update on the Flynn case. I'm your host. Ag Hey everybody's AG. I am doing show remotely today. Jordan's GonNa be sending in her Abe lock clips for you and she's going to give you some updates on some really important stories going on in the pandemic and surrounding issues. We had a wonderful time on Saturday with our Pizza Party. We needed a pizza sort of cuny a cocktail hour. Happy Hour thing though so much fun. Thank you for everybody. Who joined us on that? We'll be doing it again this Saturday. We'll have to come up with a theme. I think we came up with the theme. What was it going to be the eighties? Figure it out. We'll figure it out and we'll let you know Patrons you can join that. If you're not a patron you can become one at Patriot dot com slash the daily beans Muller she wrote either one. You'll be patron of both shows and We do have a lot of news to get to this week but I definitely wanted to thank everybody for joining us and we have an amazing Jordan will be joining me later for the good news. Block and Quarantine Confessions. I've already recorded them with her. Their incredible we're doing little time flip here so You definitely WANNA stick around for that. And I've got an interview with Andrew Torres. Real life lawyer cost of the opening arguments. Podcast WE'RE GONNA talk about the filing error in the Flynn motion to dismiss the Department of Justice is motion to dismiss the Flynn case. And IT'S INTERESTING. It's more interesting than just a clerical error. There seems to be a little bit of cover up going on so you definitely want to stick around for that but right now. Let's hit the news with the hot notes hot notes alone. Jordan's corn beans for kitchen so as it sounds like I say corn and beans which is very fair actually but it is not cord. It is cool beans today. I have a Story pretty much just on steady probably been hearing in the news covered nineteen just rearing its head closer and closer to the trump inner circle and at this point. There's a decent cases now that are all happening Kind of all around him. In the way that they're responding versus the way that other officials in the task force are responding is pretty different. So we're going to go over some of that today when I say we I mean me myself night So we I heard news at the valley getting sick. That's at person that's essentially like in you know kind of personal assistant like tape To trump like a like a a butler like surprised trump. Just didn't call him a Butler a he got sick and that was the first piece of news that we heard then. We are getting more news about people that had gotten sick to AIDS tested positive for cove in and there were a lot of people that potentially were exposed to that In senior members of the Pandemic Task Force were included in that and some of them stopped said that they were they went into self quarantine basically three of them. Did those three people were Steven Hahn. Fda FDA commissioner and CDC an prevention director Robert Redfield in the fallacy. We got word that FAO she was going into a modified cell quarantine as well. So they're gonNA telework Some combination of self quarantining and teleworking for two weeks after that exposure to cove in nineteen. And so that's what that's what they're doing and then we have on the other side. What trump in penser doing and what? They're encouraging others to do in in memo's essentially Which is making the argument that virtually everybody on the task. Force is essential ass. Such you know they're gonNA keep expecting people to like come into work and with that being said. There's the caveat of them saying they're going to engage in excessive daily cleaning of the areas. And they're saying don't worry. Trump and pence are getting tested every day. And we're doing everything we can to keep them safe and everybody that's around but there is no mentions of wearing masks for example in one of the memos and the stark difference. Here really is what this is about between how people are handling it that our scientists and how people are handling it that are. I can't even say politicians because it's trump and he's not a fucking politician. He's just an idiot. So how how? They're handling that Pen spokeswoman Katie Miller also tested positive too. I forgot to mention that at the top So so there's just more and more people that are kind of getting closer to the circle. It's like this FIB NACI spiral that they're just The the viruses just go and down just trending closer and closer to the epicenter of the inadequate leadership of this country. And no like I mean the reason why this is news isn't because people want them are like sitting there hoping that they get sicker anything. It's that there's a huge example to be set and how you handle this and they're not setting that example and they haven't been setting that example really this whole time they're talking about social distancing in cleaning and we're talking about a lot of the things that are good. I obviously you know you have to give. I guess you don't have to. I'm GonNa give credit where credit is due. They're not blatantly saying foot. The virus like some of the people in my friend circle are Just saying whatever I'm not I'm not scare do anything. They're not saying that they are saying they're gonNA take increase precautions in a lot of areas but the ones that are you know mainly recommended by the CDC and by scientists all over the world that two weeks self quarantining period. They're just not going to do. And it's weird because teleworking you know I really don't see why that's like like the whole world is shifting the teleworking in many ways right. Now if you're a task force meets so meeting online for a few days. I really don't understand why that is such an issue which makes me wonder if it's more obstinate. Move to perpetuate the messaging that you don't need to do something like that because when we do something like that or require that things that are done in the greater society you know that that does lend itself to things that put more strain on the economy and I feel like that's what this all kind of comes down to. It's particularly frustrating. Because it's denying you know the advice of scientists Pretty blatantly actually especially with that whole night even including the face mask thing. Pair that with pence not wearing his face mask when he went to visit that clinic. And you just get a whole Schwartzberg Schwartz Sh- mortgage that word was meant to be mispronounced for the twitter follower. That tweeted at me saying it causes them pain when I say words wrong. I hope you enjoyed that. One right in the gut a kick in the gut of Schwartz White House spokesman Judd Dear. Can you think of a more American name? Judd with two DS deer like the tractor. Holy Shit Judd. Dear says the president's physician and White House operations continue to work closely to ensure every precaution is taken keep the President I family in the entire White House complex safe and healthy at all times. In addition to social distancing daily temperature checks and symptom histories hand sanitizer and regular deep cleaning of all workspaces every staff member in proximity to the president and vice president is being tested daily for Cove in nineteen as well as any guests so again. No mention of like masks or quarantine periods in there. But why deary that the first thing? I do Kinda think maybe it's just because I'm a hater is just like oh how convenient for you. You're protecting that very select group of people. What about the AIDS? What about the pandemic task force that that you're not encouraging to maintain You know safety in the ways that I was just talking about. It's kind of know I read that and I'm like cool I don't really care. That's that's kind of brutal of me. Sir The White House will receive heightened levels of daily cleaning according to that memo as for the quarantine of fourteen days though it did say that all employees must quarantine for fourteen days if they leave the Washington region and must report all their travel. The memo did not suggest their employees wear masks like I said And so I guess. This is a bit confusing to me. Correct me if I'm misunderstanding here. Please you're saying that employees must quarantine for fourteen days if they leave. The Washington region wouldn't the presumption of that reasoning be that if they travelled they may have picked it up and because they may have picked it up and might have it. You need to quarantine yourself so then when you look at someone. Multiple people many people honestly at this point who have been confirmed to have covered nineteen. But then you don't want to implement fourteen day quarantines and that scenario obviously. I guess the only argument that they would probably make against that is yeah. Were saying you should quarantine the people that get it or could have gotten it versus the people that may be exposed to it but we do. We just know this to be such a highly contagious contagious disease. It's just it just seems like such a fucking dumb thing. I hate to even spent so much time reporting on it kind of just because I don't hate that's a strong word. I I hate that. They're getting a rise and conflict out of obstinately refusing to do something that is very simple. That's how feel you're going through all these other measures to keep everything clean and test. Everybody daily you'RE GONNA daily test people but say it's like ridiculous and unnecessary to have telework from home for two weeks. I just don't understand that. It's nonsensical just have fucking quarantine. But again I think it's a bit I think it's a bit more than In innocent reason it just seems antagonistic. Towards the scientific community I guess not in the sense that they're talking about all the sanitizing and social distancing and stuff but it's like just fucking you're intentionally tripping at the finish line of responding to this and they're responsible way just fucking Korte that's it just set a good example and that's it that's all we ask until it is established across the country that you know we're going to start easing up on these kinds of restrictions and precautions and I don't even know how long it's GonNa be till we start easing up on precautions like when we go back to hanging out in small groups or whatever that looks like whatever steps to the reopening like. I don't know what the I imagine the two week. Quarantine will stay in place as well. So that's just that's just something that's here to stay. I imagine issue probably continued to be well established in the brains of Americans a bummer. That they're not doing that. Basically T. L. D. R. of this hot note. Bummer so easy tabby a bummer. Just don't be above cover. You have the technology said getting sample. Please I believe in you. I'm trying to insert positivie where I'd like I want. I want so badly for things to be good. Sometimes I feel like I talk about so much bad news with such tone of hatred and disgust towards trump and his administration that I feel like I need to acknowledge the way better alternative would be for them to not fuck up. That's what I'm really rooting for a really rooting for them. To not fuck up and to not keep fucking up. I care more about that than care shitting on them so come on do. The right thing is a conservative listening to this podcast. That has an ear in trump's McDonald's ear I was GONNA say Harry Man Ear and I'm GonNa get shift or saying he has hairy ears. What's something else I can give him? Shit for MC Donald's everyone could shoot up. Mcdonald's there's nothing to do with ears. I digress you can do it. Trump do the right thing but I still hate you all right. That's been my heart note. Everybody thank you I hope you all are holding up O. K. I know I say that every time but I mean every time we love you Thank you for the birthday wishes everybody. That was so sweet. I got I was flooded with birthday tweets and messages and I tried very hard to respond to them. I will still go through and respond to as many as I can but I really really really appreciate them and I saw them and the best. Thank you birthdays. Are I have a childlike happiness surrounded on my bird surrounding me on my birthday sale you for placating that okay all right good bye? Everybody all right George so much for that. Update stick around. We've got a lot more headlines and that interview with Andrew Coming Up. We'll be right back these missing everybody's a G in this episode. A daily beans is brought to you by beach on demand right now. We're all stuck at home. 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They had access to hundreds of effective workouts for all fitness levels. There's a lot of moderation if you need to and modifications if you if you need those as well. I use those quite a bit especially with pushups. But they have weight training Yoga Meditation. Dance workouts. Exercise on your schedule with workouts a shortest ten minutes. They don't require any extra equipment so in the time. It takes you to Dr Parker the gym which we can't do anyway. You'd be finished working out. You can access it from anywhere any time on any device computer tablet smartphone and more. It's the best deal. In fitness and listeners of the daily beans can try it absolutely free. I want you to check out beach body right now so our listeners can special free trial membership when you text daily beans. All one word. To thirty thirty thirty you will get full access to the entire platform for free. All the workouts nutrition information and support totally free for your trial again. Just text the word daily beans all one word to thirty thirty thirty all right. Everybody welcome back one of the big stories to come out over the weekend about corona virus in the mishandling of the pandemic by this administration came from the associated. Press quote the decision to shelve detailed advice. From the nation's top disease control experts for reopening communities during the pandemic came from the highest levels of the White House according to the internal government emails obtained by the Associated Press Unquote so after the Associated Press reported Thursday that there was a seventeen page guidance document that was buried by the trump administration. Trump ordered key parts of it to be fast tracked for approval. He got caught basically in these emails. Show the nation's top officials at the CDC spent weeks working on this guidance but it was quashed by political appointees with little to no explanation as to why the document entitled Guidance for implementing the opening up a America again framework was written to help Faith leaders business owners educators state and local officials Schools began to you. Know the process of figuring out how to reopen and it included decision trees and flow charts to help navigate the decisions to reopen or remain closed. Like do you have this. Do this do you have this? Don't do this Simple flow charts but Friday Kaley mcnugget. Mcenaney mcenaney Frau Bluecher. That's told reporters. The documents had not been approved by Redfield at the CDC but these new emails show that he did clear the guidance. So there's a big lie from a lady who promised to never lie to us but despite being approved by the. Cdc trump shelved the document on April thirtieth and went with his gut. We now know as early as April tenth. In fact redfield shared via email the guidance with trump's inner circle including Kush Kellyanne Conway. A guy named Joe Grogan not Joe Rogan Joe Rogan along with Dr Burks Dr Fao Cheam and other Taskforce Members because early April tenth. Redfield did three days later. The CDC sent a sixty page report with the guidance to the White House. They send it to the White House Office of Management and Budget for approval. That's generally how you do it. But the seventeen page document that was released earlier was only part of that sixty page document. Friday Associated Press got the entire thing and that version is more universal series of phase guidelines geared to advise communities on testing contact tracing and other infection control measures. Not just getting criteria and redfield weighed in on Friday contradicting his own emails and siding with trump like the sycophant that is despite being in quarantine saying the thing was just a draft but on April twenty. Four redfield emailed the document. Doctor Doctors burks and Grogan. I don't know if GROGAN DR SCARF lady in and Grogan the Gorgon Medusa Anyway. He emailed that April twenty four then asked for their review and attached where the decision trees including one for meat packing plants. That was left out In the eventual release and after two days because we know trump put an executive order that meat packing plans to stay open despite being hot spot and after two days Redfield hadn't heard anything and send an email to the office management budget saying. Hey we need this soon as possible so we can get him posted but the office of Management and Budget said they were awaiting White House review and for days the CDC kept sending inquiries. Hey Hey we need this. We want to publish it by May first. Because that's when trump plans to open businesses but on April Thirtieth. The documents were killed for good according to the AP a White House staffer emailed the CDC saying the guidance should be more cross cutting in it should say when they should reopen dates and how to keep people safe and fundamentally the task force cleared this for further development but not release not for release and trump had already released his plan by then and then hours later on April thirtieth the CDC Chief-of-staff McGowan told CDC staff. None of it would ever see the light of day. You've been working since April tenth with flow charts for meat packing plants and contact tracing and testing and how to reopen safely. Not GonNa see today the CDC stood down and it was shelved until may seventh and that morning the press reported that trump buried the guidance and after that story ran within hours the White House called an order the CDC to refile the decision trees except the one that targeted churches also in news. Dr Bright Dr Rick. Bright the whistleblower that outed corruption in the contract awards. The mishandling of the Corona virus pandemic by this administration is and the Task Force. Of course is is speaking out apart from his official complaint filed last week which we went over which is astounding and again. If you haven't read that I highly recommend picking it up. Dr Bright says he believes he was removed in retaliation. For wanting to put science ahead of politics refusing to back the hydroxy chloroquine bullshit and calling them out for ignoring the need for p. and since then the office of special counsel which is a watchdog in in the Federal Government Executive Branch has said it sees that this could have been retaliated retaliatory and they are fully investigating it now the fact that he was you know giving a shit job moved out of his position at the head of Barda at the health and Human Services Department and put into a shit job at the NIH trump said you know. He dismissed Bright Over the weekend. I think it was on Thursday as being a disgruntled employee but bright said in a in an upcoming interview with sixty minutes that will air on May seventeenth. It's not out yet. He said I'm not disgruntled. I'm frustrated at the lack of urgency to get a head start on developing life-saving tools for Americans. I'm frustrated our ability to be heard a scientists. Those things frustrate me we see too many doctors and nurses now dying and I was thinking we could have done more to get those masks and supplies to them sooner in if we had would they still be alive today. It's a horrible thought to think about the time that passed where we could have done something and we didn't and health and Human Services Has said they strongly disagree with the characterization that moving bright to the H. was retaliatory? They disagree but you better believe this will be investigated it is now And I'll be turning. Ib Tuning into sixty minutes on May seventeenth fo show Also just a quick update maziarz in Deutsche Bank cases headed to Spring Court. They're going to be heard tomorrow over the phone. Live Ten am eastern. I'll be listening. You're going to hear Clinton v Jones. I think referenced Allot Soobee be prepared for that and it should be an interesting oral argument. I have no idea how they're going to come down on this for a long time. I was like this is so cut and dried. This is so clear I know George Conway Kellyanne husband wrote an OP. Ed in Washington. Post saying here's the eighty six reasons I I don't know if it was eighty six. Here's all the reasons that trump should lose and Clinton v Jones. That's precedent here This isn't even you know. The the president is not above the law especially in his personal life. Impeachment is the remedy for You know the office of President. The law is the remedy for a private citizen. This is private citizen Shit. This isn't got anything to do with the office of the president and it's even more open and shut than than the Clinton v Jones case because it's not even against trump it's subpoenas to third parties. Deutchebanks czars. So it'll be interesting to see how this how these arguments play out. I don't know that we'll be able to get a read on what the court is thinking. But we'll be listening in you know we'll we'll give you updates and Don't freak out. But Chief Justice Roberts has granted temporary administrative stay in the Muller Grand Jury Materials Case. We knew he would We knew they would do this. this is not the full stay. This isn't the major stay this isn't you? Know the real the in real life stay. This is a temporary Ten a day administrative temporary. Hold while they you know while the house can file its opposition to the Department of Justice's request for a stay while they seek appeal so that they don't have to hand over the Mulberry Materials Information in one should ask you know on the larger scale the grand scheme of things. Why does the G. O? J. Not want the Miller grand jury materials handed over to Congress if the Molar report and Muller was corrupt and if the mole report found noth- no wrongdoing and this should totally exonerate the president and it should totally implicate the deep state. Why don't you want those documents handed over in any case They've asked for an appeal. They've asked that they don't have to be handed over. They've requested a full stay and now they have until may eighteenth. I believe to the house does to file their opposition to stay request. Then the supreme court will weigh whether or not they're going to allow a stay pending appeal They could come out and say we're not going to hear this on the merits. No stay no nothing Bam that would be over. They could come out and say we're going to grant the stay. You can appeal. The case will decide on the merits. we'll find out but it's it's happening so stay tuned for that. We'll keep you posted. And Speaking Muller cases there have been some developments over the weekend in the Flynn case and I have brought on an expert to help us with joining us today to discuss the updates on the flame case Israel life lawyer and host of opening arguments. The podcast greatest podcast ever in the History Universe Andrew Torres. Second second graders. Oh we're we're we're close. You're right Greg Greg. Proops podcast is a little better now but Well I'm a much better now after that Four to kind introduction. How are you doing you know? This is I'm okay shits fucked up but I'm okay. That's that's the way to play I. We were just saying before the before the record like that. I don't often fail the the two of US but We're we're rapidly heading into that territory. So I know today's episode was either going to be called White House down or shits fucked up and I can't. I can't decide Probably for search engine optimization reasons we might go with White House down but it's slightly snappier and also I feel like shits fucked up is kind of evergreen at this point so I know like people are GonNa go really now. Let's check that out so things I'm wanting to know because we've spoken since this flinch it went down But there's two things I want to know. I we know last week. Bill bars personal lackey that he installed in the US Attorney's office in DC which intercepted most of Muller's cases by the way when Muller work ended quote Unquote And that's Timothy Shay. He's took over for Jesse Liu right and that happened when trump promised her job at the Treasury and while she was walking over to the treasury. He pulled the job out from under her. So Tim Shea signed appearance Medically Jesse Liu I mean Jesse Lewis. Sally Yates rightly this is. This was not somebody who's particularly anti trump to begin with anyway. I'm sorry no but you know she did. I think she did stand her. Ground on. Not Indicting Andrew McCabe and that that put her in some bad light But Tim Shea signed his name all by his lonesome to emotion asking the court to dismiss the case against. Flynn is the TAME. Same Tim Shea. Who put in the request to go easy on Roger Stone during his sentencing He was also alone on that one. Because in both the stone and flint cases career prosecutor would sign onto that bullshit. Well two questions. I can trump pardon crimes that have been dismissed. Meaning if Judge Sullivan dismisses this case without prejudice which means it can be picked up and prosecuted later on. Can Trump pardoned flynn for his crime. If there's no crime being charged anymore and the answer to that is yes right it s is really yeah so part of what is unbelievably devious about this. Recently filed rule forty eight motion Is that it it really ties. Judge Sullivan's hands right like it. Either you know there are three potential outcomes. Judge Sullivan Can Declined to grant the motion. At which point Amina we can sort of get into the legal standards on this. Although we're you know sort of sort of in uncharted territory As as we'll discuss He can dismiss without prejudice. Right which is typically what you do in a forty eight a case right like it you you say The government isn't prosecuting at this time. But you hold open the opportunity in order to continue to have leverage over defendant or He can dismiss with prejudice. Which is of course what the DOJ has now asked for right because usually the Department of Justice wants the case dismissed without prejudice in case something else comes up and they WANNA move forward with it. That's not what's going on here though. No and and as right in the second half of that is if if Judge Sullivan does anything. Other than dismiss with prejudice than a pardon for Flynn will come the very next day and I think even if he does dismiss with prejudice. Now it's pardon for everything including the forest stuff you might be right It's it's gross but I mean at least that would force trump to do his own political dirty work as I as I said earlier in the show you know because I feel like trump. I mean you know why not just allow the sentencing to go forward and pardoned the guy and I think it's because he knows it's not politically expedient for him to do that I don't. I don't know that I even agree with that at this point. I think Right Pardoning Flynn the the folks who are going to be correctly outraged rightly I. If you're outraged by pardoning Flynn you have one hundred items already on your checklist of things. That outraged you. If you're excited about him pardoning Flynn and you know you were trump blackie. That requires your weekly dose of Cunanan nonsense to to keep being fed And I I viewed this. I thought about this a lot and I give you. Can I give you my alternate view before you give me your view? Yeah please do the other view on. This is that by. Having the Department of Justice file a motion to dismiss the case. It muddies the water about the appropriateness or legitimacy of the entire investigation which could allow trump to lift sanctions placed on Russia by Obama for interference in the two thousand sixteen election which is his top goal. And so you know sort of like how with the with the with Ukraine. He was like I just need you to announce that you're investigating by. You don't actually have to do it in this case it's like I just need the Department of Justice to put in question the legitimacy of the Mueller probe Or the Russia investigation. So that I can so that I can get Mitch you know. Give the give the Republicans in the Senate and excused. Lift the sanctions Before before the election before he loses. Yeah I I think that is highly plausible. I also think that the the personal motivations are a really clear rightly. Donald trump wants to rewrite history. Such that he was never impeached. Such that the Mueller investigation never took place and and on top of that his technically. I mean we have seen. We saw this firsthand In in the recorded Ukraine conversation. Right of the man. I would like to help you but you gotta do us a favor. I and and this strikes me as the kind of unnecessary wearing kissing right like because as we both said right trump could very easily pardoned. Flynn that has been teed up for months And forcing bill bar to force Tim Shea to sign a pleading that he's not entitled to sign Is is the kind of Capo tactics of I want you to prove your absolute and complete loyalty to meet to sign a pleading that is unprecedented nonsense from top to bottom aisle at which has already been at Sullivan's already thumbed his nose at. I mean there's nothing new in that document at. This isn't the first time you know. Sorry Tim Shea. This isn't the first time somebody's tried to file a motion. To get this case your. You're you're retake fuck a number and all of this was included in the original motions you know motion to dismiss materiality of the lie. The investigation was already over. Bullshit that You know that that that we know to be true Through public reporting. So it's it's it's GonNa be interesting to see what Sullivan does in this case. It's going to be really interesting. I think that Sullivan will grant the motion and dismissed with prejudice That's what I leaned toward as well but who knows who knows he's he's pretty pissed off at Flynn and not you know not in a bias way in A. You're a fucking criminal way as a judge would be pissed off at any criminal so so. Can we talk about how unbelievably unprecedented this is? You are listening to the daily beans interview with Andrew Torres. And we'LL BE RIGHT BACK TO DISCUSS. How rare this is along with. The filing error made by the Department of Justice and whether it was accidental. Stay WITH US. Hey friends it's G in helping. Daily beans is brought to you by Zebra Dot Com in these crazy cova times. We're all trying to save as much money as we can. 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There's anything weird about that because as you know as we know Tim Shea signed under Jesse lose bar number which is this a cut and paste error or is this a document that Jesse Liu was initially supposed to sign and she refused and was then offered a job at the treasury. I don't know do you know I don't know so I don't know the second half of that. I I do know the first half of that which is really really important because this is a court in which. I routinely practiced right in which I have One case right now right so I'm I'm acutely aware of of how the procedure works. And if you look at the motion right you'll see at the top. The caption contains The case number and then the document number because all of these are filed electronically right and in order to file them electronically you have to log into CNBC CF And you then have to sign onto the system right When when you do that and look like back in the day when I worked for a big like I had my paralegal or sometimes even my assistant Log On and do this for me. Yeah of course this the tim she didn't write this thing. Yeah and there's nothing inappropriate about delegating that to someone else but it is to say that you don't you don't that that the the being admitted to the DC bar is a prerequisite to being able to file this electronically on the CNBC F. system right so you you can't just. It's not like in the olden days where you can say. Wow you know we just cut and paste this in here and we left that look like that sort of stuff does indeed happen all the time to lawyers right like I've because I practice in both Maryland and DC. Like you know sometimes you know you transportation. Maryland doesn't have the same bar numbers at the state level right like all sorts of things like that can happen. That's not in and of itself suspicious but as always the case with this administration. It's not the initial act. That was so weird. It's the cover up afterwards. It's the explanation afterwards. And the the idea that you would file this and not know that you were using Someone else's bar number. It's that is not plausible. What was the cover up? That happened afterwards. Well the the the explanation of this was just a typo because it was prepared By and I think I forget who they said. prepared initially prepared The document But then when when you go through the The Meta data included You see that this document was prepared by Shays Chief of Staff And and not elsewhere right so in other words right like the initial explanation was Well you know it was the other prosecutors were working on this document and they must have just left the old bar number on there except that the version history and Meta data shows that it was in fact chase chief of staff who was working on this document so you know yeah and is it less likely for him to fuck that up than some other lawyer so I again there is. The screen is GONNA Flash Ready. Right like when you go to sign in right because among other things right the CNBC CF system is how you track how they get how the court gets paid for things that have filing costs right so you have to type in the client number and then you have to type in your barn number to log it. And if they don't match you'll get a flag and if they don't if they don't match it pops up and says you're not authorized to file documents in the stirs diction So it it's it's not possible. What do you think is happening? I just Tim Shea. Maybe not have a bar number. Well Tim show is not admitted in DC he is not admitted to the DC bar. As far as I can tell I went to look that up. So then what? Do you have to have a sponsor to file a motion out? How did he get to stone thing through and and again all because if you have anybody else in the caption who is admitted in DC? Then that's fine right. Oh but nobody else would sign on with him and nobody else would on to this piece of crap. Because Dan Grech withdrew. Everybody was at the same time and and same thing happened right in the stone case so as long as you have one person admitted in DC proper procedure would have would have been to. Have you know whoever that person is sign off on the document and then have and then have Shay sign it with share you know Pro Hawk Vichai Appendix? Right and and again. That's not an issue. Okay so then. How did if if you know if everybody pulled off of the Roger Stone thing to how did shake it. How did they get that document filed with Shay? Yeah fantastic question and one that I asked at the time that it came up to one of my prosecutor friends. Because if you look at the case caption the stone document says respectfully submitted. Timothy J. US attorney and then it says by John Crab Junior Assistant. Us Attorney Acting Chief Criminal Division And then has both his New York number and his His DC office below that and so it's criminal division. Isn't that headed up by bench cow? Ski that Douchebag and what I did was I asked whose crap right and what I got was crab is just you know A. He's just a guy right and he's a guy in the DC bar though exactly right and and so if you look at I mean remember because you and I talked about the supplemental stone member and that it was it was bad and it was it in many ways indefensible but it wasn't facially preposterous right like it wasn't the kind of thing that you know if you just gave it to. Somebody might like. Oh Hey man. Well we're we're prosecutors around. Can you take a look at this and like sign on behalf of you might look at it and go? Okay yeah fine. This looks fun right because there is a legit. They're not well not that it's a legitimate argument but there is an argument to me made to go from seven to nine years which was recommended for stone by the Probation Officer. Whoever The original prosecutors. Those were points added for threats right and so two it. It's going to be easier to say. Hey sign this Mr Crab. Because we're you know seven to nine. I think adding those points at the Max. Just a little too much we're recommending lesson. Somebody's more willing to sign off on it. Then the Flynn document. Yeah and the Flynn document is such that. The moment the news broke I had to separate prosecutor friends one a current and X. Email and message man. I was recording the show at the time. And say you know various versions of what the Hell is this Since then I I called four others right who are either current or former federal prosecutors and I asked them. Have you ever seen have you because I I'm a civil lawyer right so I I don't I don't know I suspected what the answer was but I said have you ever seen the government file a forty eight emotion ranked to to dismiss the prosecution after somebody had pleaded guilty unite? You and I did the exact same thing. I called up Glen. Kirshner worked at DC. Us Attorney's Office for twenty five years. And I said what the fuck what the ever loving. Fuck if this ever happened. If you ever seen this happened. He's like Hell No. I've never seen that happen. And and look he goes. He said you see the nobody else. Put their name on this piece of garbage and so it's quite interesting that they filed it using Jesse lose. Dc Bar number. When Shay dozen have one and I think what that means at least you know I'm just GonNa put some beans on. This is that they went around and shopped. It and nobody in the fucking DOJ would sign it and the only way to get it out there in in in time was to just use Jesse lose number. I I don't want to say I think that that's right in the sense that I think it's more right than I wanNA say. I wanted on those. How about that? Yeah because it it it truly is when you So we all came to the same result. Which is this doesn't happen. And so then I looked to the th already that is cited in the memoranda and the authority that cited in the memoranda. Well I write the case. That is cited for the proposition that it is well established that the government may move to dismiss Even after a complaint has turned into a conviction because of a guilty plea is a ninth circuit case rank and the ninth circuit sits over California and the West Coast not DC and that involved subsequent dismissal of a case because of a a change in the law after the plea was right so the hector case involves somebody who pled guilty to both Receiving Child Pornography and possession of child pornography and prior to sentencing the The ninth circuit came down with the decision. That said you can't send somebody for both receipt and possession of pornography that it violates double jeopardy because the elements of those two crimes are so similar that you're essentially prosecuting somebody twice for the same benefits and so So then the judge went back and said Hey you you've got to pick here and And the prosecutor said no no no. We're we're not going to pick You know you you judge set out whatever kind of sentence you one and then and then you know. We'll decide will elect how to proceed and the judge is like well. Look if you're not going to dismiss one of these counts than going to sentence him to the lesser offense and then the prosecutor trump the lesser right so like that's the procedural history in terms of how you wind up with subsequent motions to dismiss when somebody has been convicted of a crime post conviction right. It's when other fundamental rights are at stake here share or we have the concord man case Which could be argued that that was shady dismissal or not but you know we we had the American lawyers hired by Russians to troll the courts to get documents to get to get sources and methods for tradecraft going back to World War. Two and finally the prosecutors are like. You're never going to come into court. Fuck off dismissed. We're wasting the taxpayers money But even then we didn't we didn't have a plea agreement yeah. He didn't plead guilty right. Or the entity didn't the conqueror but it and obviously you've been through the facts but I think it's worth reiterating that literally every point that is raised in in this Motion to dismiss has been conclusively rejected in December of Twenty nine thousand. Nine hundred right as as you alluded to it the introduction and I it's just the what I think is crucial to know is that the arguments are being made with respect to the statement that is contained in the information right to to which flint pleaded guilty but every prosecutor knows. Everybody who listens to your show knows that the plea deal was a subset of all of the information that was otherwise available to the DOJ. At the time right the idea that you would go back and Flyspeck and then say oh well you know. Thus there was no basis for investigating. Michael Flynn is just nonsense. And and the reference that they make to the three o' twos are references to well. You know we could. We were thinking about shuttering this but of course like closing an investigation is not could be reopened at any time right. That's not the same as dismissing a crime to which someone has pled guilty After the fact it's it's yeah. Yeah I well. I think I think what's going to happen is unacceptable calling evidence. You're hearing he might WanNa Talk to some folks at Covington. Burling which is it Covington Burlington Covington burling or Burlington coat. Factory COVINGTON and burling and I should have said at the outset of this right I used to work for COVINGTON and Burling I. I Know Flynn's former lawyers said this the last time we talked about that. So you know in in full disclosure. I you know that's my conflict. Okay we're because we're all real weird about on this fucking. I don't think you need to be an ex OVINGTON. Burling attorney to know that it's downgrade to go from COVINGTON and burling to Sydney fucking Powell probably safe in that assumption. But in any case I think call an evidentiary hearing I'M I. I am less concerned with the dismissal or not dismissal because I think it will end up being pardoned anyway in either of those cases I'm more concerned with what could come out in an evidentiary hearing with Sullivan. He could ask bar to come and tell them. What the Fuck Bro. He could upbring Tim Shea and say what's your DC bar number. Buddy he could he could I mean and he's he's a get to the bottom of it hates government corruption and doesn't like to give breaks to people just because they're army generals in fact it's quite the opposite so I'm just I'm really interested to see what happens but I appreciate you answering my questions today. Yeah well thanks as always for having me on I. I hope that that's the case. I I fear that Judge Sullivan Major. Sort of throw up his hands you know and and at the point in which you know that That above your pay grade. Everything is raining down I wouldn't I wouldn't blame him for feeling discouraged that Let's let's keep our let's I love. I love the optimism. Well we'll know soon he doesn't strike me as the kind of guy to not follow through on a ruling situation so we will know soon everybody. Thank you Andrew Torres. You check out. His podcast is called opening arguments. You get anywhere you find your podcasts and follow him on twitter and Thank you very much anything else you want to add before I let you go now. Ag just thanks for having me on love Love coming here to chat with you. Yeah of course one hundred percent and everybody stick around because right after this we have the good news block to counter everything that that Andrew and I just spoke about and we have quarantine confessions. And it's all with Jordan Coburn. Stay with US everybody. This helping daily beans is brought to you by ancestry. Dna there many paths to finding your family story. Whichever way you choose tracing your family generations back with family tree. Or uncovering your ethnicity with ancestry. Dna It's easy to get started with ancestry ancestry. Dna. The test tells you where your ancestors are from ancestry billions of records and millions of family trees that you discover their personal stories you can find a famous relative or perhaps a photo of great grandma as a little girl. Whatever you find it should change the whole look at your family history and yourself and your future after all. This story of family is the story of you When I got my results back I learned. I'm related to Rosencrantz and killed in Stern. Not the ones from the fake. There's actually just two people rose and Golden Stern and one of my ancestors was a famous comedy musician. Who played the Banjo in the twenties named Harry Reaser? So funny the stores you learn about your family shared past can bring you closer together. Make understand more about yourself ancestry. Dna can trace passive your ancestors and given geographic details about your family history. No other DNA tests Deliver such unique interactive experiences. And it's easy to START MAKING DISCOVERIES WITH ANCESTRY. Grab an ancestry. Dna Kit started retrial to amplifier discoveries with ancestries billions of records. Start Exploring Your family story today. Head to my URL AT ANCESTRY DOT com slash daily beans to get your ancestry DNA kit and start your free trial. That's ancestry dot com slash daily beans. Hey everybody welcome back. It is time for the good news and joining me today for the good news. And courting is none other than twenty-seven year old Jordan covering hello twenty-seven-year-old. Hello Happy Birthday. Thank you so much. I know it was Friday but still yes. I appreciate it very much. Thank you everybody was so kind. I was talking about it. I forget if it was in the beans or or my an msw hot note but just appreciation for the on twitter. The birthday love and facebook and stuff. Yes wonderful and we had a good time. I'm glad you were able to pop in on the meet and greet Or the Quarantine Party Pizza Happy Hour. Whatever whatever we call it still didn't have a name for it. Yeah totally me too very fun how are you? I'm good. I'm good so we have some good news today. Yes we have lots of good news and Corentin confessions but we start here with the good news here. You are first piece of good news comes from. Stacey says I recently got a hardcore trumper to switch parties with some very tough love for awhile seriously. I was a big bitch to him. Surprised he's still speaks to me and then just pointing out facts. This friend is unable to work because of his health and received government benefits due to it. I have no problem with so in receiving benefits. Who need them but when he said he just liked the guy meaning trump? I asked him why. What is trump fulfill for you that you are missing in your life? Why do you approve of the cruelty? Etcetera he would shoot back with Obama or Hillary Fox News drudge report propaganda which was easily disproven or. Just ignore me completely which was fine eventually pointing out that has benefits were being targeted. Started to soften them up but trump's incompetent handling the virus pushed him over the edge. He recently informed me that he switching will vote for Biden and thanked me for helping him say the light. I wasn't the one who pushed him over the edge trump's incompetence did but the challenging but challenging him there whoo Nice. That's amazing stacey well done that's fucking amazing. I love hearing that Shit. Because that's one of those things that seems damn near impossible so love to hear that the yes Next up from anonymous this week I got a newsletter for my representative to California Four. Tom McClintock he wanted to make sure all his constituents knew about Bill Fahim bars memo about preserving our civil liberties to go out and act like morons in this public crisis. I was appalled so the first thing I did was go to Bryn. Kennedy's campaign is Saturday B. R. Y. N. E. That's a beautiful name. It is pretty. Yeah Brin Kennedy's campaign website and made a twenty five dollars donation. I also filled out the contact form on Tom's newsletter telling him that I made that donation to his opponent in the hopes that he will get to understand firsthand. Come January what. It's like to stand in the unemployment line. Go Brin Nice. Cool yes Next up from Diana on this mother's Day I need Brag a little about my son. He moved home with US six months ago to try to change his career from cooking to tech through hard work. And a bit of Prescience He just landed a job his new Newfield in DC. He did all of his new education online colonel viruses adding some delays for background checks. But he'll be moving there soon. Hurry I'm so so proud of him. That's crazy holy crap changing vocal. Like I was gonNA say vocations careers. Whatever Na name is best for that? Whatever like in the middle of this. That's insane that's amazing. Yeah Holy Crap. Yup Hell Helje. Good job goes on from Debbie in Colorado. I've been volunteering. With an ad hoc group set up through Next door in facebook called the no co mask making team among our donors fabric cutters in sewers. We've made more than eight thousand cloth masks six weeks that have been given to local first responders and medical groups. That's a huge number eight thousand. God we've about covered that area of need and it started donating to others on the cove frontlines. Recently we set five hundred mass to agricultural workers. That's really cool. I'm so encouraged that in our very red quarter of Colorado. We've come up with the dynamic outlets for trying to make a difference amazing. That's so great. That is I think. That's probably more masks than the. Cdc Has Santa Out so job. That has a lot of masks. That is really cool next up for Molly Molly says. I had to resign from my job this week. Don't worry still good news story. They knew I thought it was too early to return to work safely but still asked me to come back this week so I was forced to choose between my health or my bills like millions of others. Fortunately I'll be okay financially at least for a month or so until I can figure out. What's next as if anyone knows these days? It's good news because it was a seriously toxic environment and in the long run. This is the best thing I could have done for my mental health. Thanks for not letting me forget to take care of myself heart. I appreciate you all your forgetting out of a job that makes you feel like shit. I know that it's complicated. But yeah it's tough but it's wonderful. I just went through it myself. So I I have much empathy for what you're going through I seriously do so I'm I'm glad you're able to see the silver lining and and I'm glad that you're staying positive it's a it's an inspiration yes is so cool Next up from Wendy. Hi My love these. You don't know me but I know you. You are with me every morning to help me start my day. Well informed and I appreciate it so much I had to share my good news that my husband for the first time in his life has stood of trump of mother was praising the Michigan protests and whining that she can't buy her can of paint. And how terrible that. Their golf courses aren't being maintained. He told her to stop watching Fox News and go ahead and buy that can of paint if it's so important but he hopes she does die from doing so. Maybe if we can take the courage to stand up to these people we can really spark change. We have to. I love you guys in keep on keeping on. That is a really hard thing. Do that takes a lot of courage that is a lot of adrenaline flowing through your body in that moment very true standing up to trump family member. That's a big theme sorry to starting. That's a big theme in our community. of listeners and patrons and and that you know so many people just have family members that are trump supporters. It's just it's it's a tough. It's a tough thing to navigate. It's just really really hard. So Yeah Yeah. Definitely power to to your husband Finally from Annemarie. Emory says three year old was very straight laced. When I was growing up she never swore except for damaged so of course I love wearing. I never use whereas around her until I was in my thirties. And certainly not the F. Word but lately I swear a lot. Morrison STREP is occupied. The White House. My mother hates that he is president as much as I do and recently when we talk about the latest awful thing he's done she has begun to drop a well-placed f Bob Now and then. I can't express how happy to speak to me. The really good news is that she now has started to listen to. Msw daily beans as well. She always did get her news from multiple sources but she said she likes daily beans because you report an update on her on thing. She didn't know about. She likes to Huber too. I'm so happy I get to share you with. Thank you for being comprehensive in reporting what's happening in the political realm. I love you all day. Welcome new Listener Mama. Great and happy. Mother's Day yes. My mom ill later on in life started dropping in an occasional f-bomb here and there too but in a very proper manner I remember. She looked at me the other day and said Alley. What the focus. With who just very very as a matter of fact It was very It's adorable it's like when it's it. I just absolutely love it so happy. Mother's Day to all the MOMS out there and happy mother's Day to you and Keep it up totally. And you'll find a lot of fucks on this podcast so you're really in it now. Gosh well those are good news black today. Everybody you can always tweet us those at daily beans pod or email them to us and we will do our best to get as many on the air as you can. Thank you so much. And now it's time for the second part of our de-block Corentin confessions first. One comes for anonymous anonymous. Sometimes the bad news really gets down so I stand in my kitchen and scream at the very top of my lungs release is great. I feel that Do you live in an apartment. Acidity wrote outs. So I'd probably think something horribly wrong happens every night at six PM. That's funny Screaming yes screaming is amazing. There's also these rooms. I know you can't do it now but I've heard that there are rooms that have furniture that's meant to be distracted and then easily put back together so you can go into a room and just like Rockstar thrashed the shit out of it like break the chairs and the tables like all of this stuff. Yeah yeah or they'll give you like dish. Wear to break glasses to throw against the wall. Yeah you just walk out and some like puppet strings lift up and everything goes back in. Its place or something. Yeah I remember when I was remodeling a house and men. When we did the demolition I probably took a good twenty years of angst out on the totally on those walls. It's it's I totally feel baton Cathartic Okay next up from anonymous. Thank you everyone at here at slash daily beans slash stubborn. Saadia for keeping me informed and entertained while I try to balance the competing demands of motherhood and career during Cova confinement. My Confession is that the balancing act is actually often unsuccessful. I needed fifteen to twenty uninterrupted minutes for a video call so I put the two three to five year olds in the bath and three and a half year olds that might make more sense And hold it they would entertain themselves long enough. They had a great time squealing with delight. When I finished the call and went to the bathroom I discovered the head unrolled to entire rolls of toilet paper and the top they were frolicking and dissolve slur dissolve slurry of toilet paper laughing merrily on the outside. I could have cried all that precious toilet paper Ghana. Waste Oh my God had not even think about that. That's so true a few days later. Another call undeterred. By my previous experience I decided to deploy the bath again. I thought ahead and removed all the toilet paper from the bathroom again. Much delighted squealing. Imagine my happiness when I found a trail of kitty litter the litterbox and the past up and two boys playing in water with three pounds of clumping kitty litter extent. I'm finding my quest to combine parenting and work quite draining. Oh my God. I can't think of too worse household objects to put in a bath. Tough maybe got her other other than a pre filled cat litter box. It doesn't get much worse. It's like did you say glitter. Yea Oh my God yeah. I was just thinking of Of that viral video of a lady who had a bath bomb with glitter in it? And it just left like a coat of Shimmery glitter on her tub. Her cat went and around in it and then her countless Shimmery for local and so funny. Oh this is a funny story. First off that's hilarious and you're killing it as a working parent that's Very very funny for us as listeners that genetically ended up at least But my my older sister. She has a hairless cat and they just like they super get into mischief. They have these insane personalities and apparently my sister. She has like a few different animals. And it's a situation where like when one tries to eat the other tricyclic eat their food. She has a tiny dog and then she also has doberman and then she has his hairless cat so whenever whenever starry the Chihuahua. She closes the door and puts the food in the bathroom. So Saint can't come in saints. Doberman eat food but then that also locked Sebastian out which is where the cat litter boxes. Normally it's in the bathroom so she said she found out. That fashions been improvising using the Washer. Like worst the worst thing ever. Oh my Gosh Tiffany Okay next up from anonymous. My husband and I are both avid podcast listeners. But we listened to very different types of podcasts. His are pretty useless a so. We are often in the house doing our worker chores. Each wearing our own air pods listening to our own podcasts. Who said Romances debt but honestly sometimes I use it as an excuse. Because I just can't be at I can't because I just can't be arced talking so I'll wear my air pods just to avoid talking. No podcast playing totally get that occasionally going to the links to talk loudly. Can't hear you. I'm just in the interesting bit. I'll come to find you to avoid talking reminds me of. I can't remember what comic it was but it was a local San Diego comic who remember when everybody was wearing that fucking blue to yes in their ear and he said it might have been mateen and he's on brand that is so he wears it when he's having sex with his girlfriend's suicide if he asks for something grow like too much that she doesn't want to do and she's like no. I don't WanNa do that. He'll point to the Bluetooth and be like I wasn't that so funny and I think I still see him walking around with the Bluetooth I know. Oh Gosh that's so funny Anonymous FINISHES MESSAGE SAYING I know. Worst wife ever. You're not the worst wife ever sometimes. We just need some freaking airspace. You Know Hey. It's air podge today. It's hearing aids tomorrow tomorrow. It'll be like I can't. The hearing AIDS turned down. I can't hear you can't hear you. It's broken it's on the Fritz. Exactly okay. We got a couple more from Melissa. I live alone and I've always thought of myself as a strong independent woman. I have been talking with my friends and family a lot during quarantine but this week has been really really hard. It's been two months since I've spoken with a loved one person. It's hard for me to be vulnerable but I've reached out and told my family how I'm struggling this week last night. My brother surprised me with delivery for my favorite restaurant and we had dinner together over facetime. It really helped me feel less alone and now I'm not as afraid to ask for more emotional support when I need it well Let's so sweet. Good brother Nice family. That's cool good for you for reaching out. It is funny. How surprising I'm jealous. My therapist told me Once like you have to like give people the chance to react. Well basically till like what? You're saying like what you're asking like so many times we just assume it's you know may not gonna be fruitful or something and and if you give people that chance yeah then it's cool. Oh Yeah we always expect the worst right and it's never the case it's never the case and we never learn totally and so many things that we don't do just like being afraid it's going to be pointless and I'm really glad you did it and you saw that. It wasn't Okay next up from anonymous. My husband doesn't know how much money spent to buy. Nintendo switch on Ebay. My Co workers don't know how often I'm playing animal crossing during Teluk offers. I don't care. How much are those on Ebay right now? Let me see. I'm curious? They're like new. They're like three or yeah. I've seen on Ebay. Four hundred forty bucks hopefully. Hopefully your husband doesn't listen to this. Podcast yeah but seriously. How much are most people therapy sessions though and I mean really right exactly? Very True. Pays for itself like solar panels very quickly. I finally from Chris Today. My High School age son shaved off his eyebrows. Experiencing nearly idiot regret at no point. Did I discourage this behavior better than TV? So this was on purpose. Yeah it sounds like it was going for the Whoopi Goldberg and immediately regretted his decision. Yeah I feel like part of the decision to do. It is like almost seeking after they regret. That's how inevitable it is like. How how could you expect any different of an outcome? Then so funny. Maybe he's like maybe he's like going blue man group or something that's I'm trying to think of Maybe just curiosity just to see what it would look like. And then you're like. Oh Yeah I look like Voldemort Well they grow back is madness all right. Let's warranty confessions. Everybody just like our good news. You can tweet. Us those daily beans pod or email them to us and them coming everybody absolutely so great. I love the segment. It's the air pods of. I can't hear you. This is the good part. It's just getting into. It's the good part and my pause. Button is broken part and I have no fingers. Oh man well thank you thank you. Thank you and keep sending those in Like Jordan said. We love getting them. And I don't mean final thoughts Jordan before we before we let let you go. No not for me. Make some talk to you all. I'll be broadcasting from my own little one bedroom apartment So exciting yes but There's probably going to be a change in audio quality by the way Suzanne his fate that I don't know how skinny sound but It'll probably just sound different. Just a change. Yeah just different. Acoustics and whatnot is it. Did you get a one bedroom two bedroom? It's a one bedroom. Yeah rat on. It's like a one bedroom. Little standalone house thing. I love standalone houses. 'cause I don't know I feel I feel more like how I feel safer or yeah like you can't hear other people as easily so that's very cool. I've come check it out. Well when when we're allowed I'll have to come do a ten feet away hanging out with masks Housewarming yes absolutely used to be an AIRBNB too. So there's all these like label maker instructions all over the house. Everything's labeled does the toilet say toilet? It's more so instructions on how to use the toilet like there's like a label that will say over the flusher gentle hold down until everything's flushed feminine hygiene products. Please yes totally. It's beautiful though. I'm super stoked. I can't wait to see it. I'm so happy. Thank you all right. Well thank you and I'm glad you had a good birthday weekend and I'm glad you're getting a new environment. I know that's always exciting and I love setting everything up so I'm looking forward to you having those good feelings and Appreciate you thank you I appreciate you. Thanks everybody else. I appreciate you as well. Thanks to our patriots thanks to our listeners. Who can't be patrons right now. We just appreciate everyone for exactly what you're doing and who you are so please take care of yourself. Take care of each other. Take care of the planet and take your mental health. I've been AG. Asthma Jordan Coburn and the beans the daily beans executive produced and directed by AG and Jordan Coburn and engineered edited by Mackenzie Mozelle and starbucks industries are marketing manager executive assistant production and social media. Directions Amanda Reader Fact Checking Research by AG Jordan Coburn and Amanda Reader or music is written and performed by they might be giants are web design and branding or by Joel reader with moxy design studios and our website is daily beans pod dot com.

Donald trump Michael Flynn trump Tim Shea CDC prosecutor White House Andrew Torres Department of Justice Judge Sullivan US DC Muller Robert Redfield AIDS Jordan Coburn president Pandemic Task Force White House
Space Buns

The Daily Beans

1:05:20 hr | 6 months ago

Space Buns

"Hello and welcome to the daily beans for Tuesday February. Eleven twenty twenty today. Prosecutors seek another delay in the Flynn case election. Disinformation a Pentagon update about traumatic brain injury. Trump's budget includes cuts to entitlements bill. Oh barg knowledgeable. Giuliani has been giving him information on the Biden's a new Quinnipiac poll for Democrats and a bunch of good news. I'm your host Jian with me. Today are Jordan Coburn. Hello and Amanda Reader. Hello four panel today. Yup How's everyone grid join this swanky new studio setup. Yeah we have headphones now we we can hear ourselves. We haven't been able to this whole time. Yes so you now. Can you hear all my mouth noises. Yup so now we can adjust and so now it's going to be by by the way if there's any issues if you have any weird sound issues now we've got sort of everything set up. There's no room for improvement. I mean there's room for improvement but there's nothing else we can upgrade so if you hear anything weird like if you don't like the The issue that we have on the microphone. Something's odd just you know. Let us know hit us up. Hello at Moeller. She she wrote and we'll see what we can do about it. I know there's a lot we have a lot of super files. Yeah audio really amazing audio files. Who listened to us and have all sorts of great suggestions Russian? So now's the time sent him in because now we got the headphones so we can hear it. Aren't we have a lot of news to get to today. Tons of news doesn't stop but my essay that every time I should just go ahead and not say that anymore just like I used to introduce myself as a mere anonymous host. JAG You all know me now now. I'm still adjust ag but in corrections being your favorite segment your new favorite segment. We drop that. Now it's time for corrections uh-huh yes long going. Yeah it is and there are times though remember like every time we go through show somebody who's like hey explain beans to me or hey hey I don't know what you mean by this. or where'd you get that one clip and if we assume that everything every show that would take up the whole show and then maybe we need a glossary on the website. Yeah there is an Faq thank you and some of the some of the questions are answered in there but not all of them. Maybe we'll take a look at that. An update put it on our list. Because right now right now our focus is to get the video in here up and running so that patrons can watch us you know if you want Some Glory Space Bend and Onesie actioning happening right now space based on your your little piece Ben pigtails kind of okay. What makes them space? Well Zenon girl the twenty first century or like space beans but it just with bonds space being bent space being. I don't know that's just what people have been calling the little side. Ben ponies lately all really yes space Benz. Oh awesome okay. Didn't yeah no that yeah. I learned something today. Correction Base Burns really able to make a lot of fashion comments when we once as we get video. You're going to ask people for Vibe you wearing your third love broad. Usually when you're helix last my totally wearing my Beta brand dress pat yoga pants every day. I heard they can take me seriously with all the shirts were. Hey in nature landscape shirts. Take Your Wolf Shirt collection is the envy of the world I was. I think I've got you. It wasn't a wolf but it was a beautiful like deer a buck in the Moonlight S. Yes it was beautiful. They went to a really cheesy gift shop in big bear over the weekend and it was all just like extremely tacky major keys. He's in Lake full moon and I almost. I almost bought this for you but I couldn't justify the cost they wanted to get you a wolf howling at the moon clock. God I wish I would have regretted not getting go. That's so nice. If you didn't think about it I would go up there and I didn't get you this one thing that you would really want is okay. Got A gift card at the big bear when I go up there and then I will probably by half the store. You're also felt like the owner was very much a trump supporter. Oh no that's the weird intersection between the nature and attack life and then trump supporters like when we go to mountain towns. Yes younger like this is so rad. I love the snow. I love the wolves the moon the bucks and moonlight trump support. All of them. No but kind of there's a cross section of trump's supporters stoned hippie guys in big bear. Yeah totally yeah. My friends had to follow locksmith to deal with some lost keys and the guy showed up and they were like out of like a pineapple express movie. We need some help with your locked car. Got You and they give a little trump keys. Well they're everywhere they they don't open anything but lies. Okay let's get to the news with a heart notes. Indeed all right. Here's some notes hot notes. Yeah so the big news for me. Today that seemed to get glossed over. Is that Chuck Schumer Senate Majority Senate Minority Leader. Excuse me Democrat is asking. Every every agency's Inspector General to investigate retaliation against whistleblowers who report presidential misconduct in the wake of trump. Firing Lieutenant Colonel Vitamin and his brother and ambassador Gordon Sunlen so Schumer sent letters to seventy four inspectors general and in one example in his letter to the the Acting Department of Defense. General Glenn Fine Schumer said the National Security Council filings or. Excuse me firings are quote part of a dangerous growing pattern of retaliation against those who report wrongdoing only to find themselves targeted by the president and subject to his wrath and vindictiveness. I I had a really great interview with the former Secretary of the Department of Veterans Affairs about this because he's the one who put together the department for the whistle blowers at the Va Eh. And while I can't tell you too much about why I know all about that or how. I am familiar with trump's vindictiveness. When it comes to whistleblowers let Allow me to just say very real Abbott. But it happens at all levels of the government to not just those was like in the National Security Council who you know who are blowing the whistle on specifically things that trump is doing. The sentiment is leaked down to all levels. Yes Shit Rolls Downhill Yeah. We'll they're super huge trump sympathizers at every level of government. Right now yeah there are and then of course. What for secretary? Schulkin was saying about the department. Veterans Affairs is and the Inspector General for the. Va put out a report When I interviewed him at the very end of last year that inspector general just finished or report on their missile blower offer saying they found a lot of retaliation against Whistleblowers they were either ignored or fired or relocated Or for you know. Their jobs moved cross country Or something like that and it was pervasive and so it's not just happening at the very tippy top. Either it's like you said it's trickled down into into the frontline as well and in addition to asking this fine guy to investigate gate all acts of retaliation against whistleblowers Schumer asked when the last time personnel were informed of whistleblower rights. I know the answer to that. It's annually in Web. Based training certification fortification programs. Department of Defense has won. I mean everyone has one of these online learning systems and you have to go in log in annually early and take your training and you have to be certified and you have to do it on time and it happens at a specific time of year for us and it changes for each individual that time. Would you have to do and just based on when you were hired and so that it does happen but I think likely what Schumer meant was he wants the reports reports of the number of personnel. That did not take the training as required Those reports are very easy to generate through multiple different tracking systems through those online. Did they complete a thing or not web based training exactly he also asked fine to write a letter to Congress assuring that the Pentagon's general counsel would not allow for retaliation. But that's weak sauce. Because the secretary of defense himself wrote a letter to Congress assuring no one would be retaliated against In this case and here we are so Sure read a letter. Shoo shoe also wrote I mean what else can you do. Schumer also wrote in his letter quote without the courage of whistleblowers and the role of inspectors general. The American people may may never have known. And how the president abused his power in Ukraine scandal. It's incumbent upon you. That whistle blowers are protected for doing what we hope and expect those who serve our country will do when called. Tell the truth nice and this is a huge. Because as we've said in over the weekend episodes it's not so much about what is it against the law and can trump be punished for this. It's it's it's more of a chilling effect on future whistleblower whistleblowers and. That's very scary and very dangerous. That that nobody's GonNa WanNa come out and blow the whistle and get ready for another. Flynn Delay Federal. Prosecutors made a new filing this Sunday rare Sunday. Filing in the Michael Flynn case We knew his sentencing was coming up at the end of February. And it's been delayed several times because Flynn changed lawyers and then became a co-conspirator instead of a cooperating witness and then he wants to withdraw his guilty pleas sentenced kept getting pushed back and push back the first time it was pushed back is because the judge recommended it be pushed back because he was going to sentence the shit out of him if he didn't cooperate. Great more so. This new filing indicates the prosecutors want more time to use Flynn's lawyers against him to oppose his attempts to get out of his guilty plea plea for lying to the FBI back in two thousand seventeen according to Kaitlin Poland's of CNN quote court filing from prosecutors Sunday could bring a new and consequential twist in the Flynn case aligning the Justice Department and a major force in DC's legal establishment against trump's first national security adviser that major force are his previous lawyers years from Covington burling The big news here is that the prosecutor seemed to hint that they might charge. Flynn with perjury. Or take Take him to trial if if Sullivan allows him to withdraw guilty plea so today. So Eleven cancelled Flynn's February twenty seven sentencing to allow at least two more weeks for both parties to file arguments events and for Flynn's new lawyer and the Department of Justice to negotiate over the use of Flynn's former lawyers in future court proceedings. That's so interesting it's really interesting. Flynn has claimed his. Why put him on my fantasy indictment this week? Flynn is claimed. His former attorneys screwed him over and forced him into taking a plea deal and made him lie and he's actually innocent of lying to the FBI about speaking to the Russians abroad speaking to Kislyak which is dumb because we have transcripts of the calls. Ause we haven't seen those transcripts but we know they exist. And in the Sunday filing prosecutors asked Sullivan to give Flynn's former lawyers from COVINGTON and burling permission to argue against Flynn's claims James and wave attorney client privilege If Sullivan agrees The lawyers could be called to testify against Flynn in future proceedings. Wow basically quickly giving the lawyers like Hey Flynn here saying you guys are a bunch of assholes who tricked him into lying about lying You want to stand up for yourself. Just wave wave waive attorney-client privilege privileges and we might be calling you in future court proceedings. Yeah how else would they get down to the bottom of that really right if he's trying to make that accusation because earlier Covington burling. We don't want to be part of this but now that Flynn is making these open into it. They're they're like well if Sullivan actually allows him to withdraw his guilty plea which I'm kind of hoping he does. Yeah go ahead motherfucker. Make my day Then these lawyers. There's could might come in and say he's the drug pusher not me no they might come in and you know and and testify in front of the judge and everyone publicly. Because that's what they're asking for that this is not the case that Flynn lie to the FBI. THEY HAVE THE THREE O. Two's they have. The you know the sealed conversations with Kislyak. So do you think that this is because trump is feeling more emboldened. And he thinks that he if he thinks that by withdrawing his plea deal and his guilty plea trump's pardon him now hundred percent. Yeah Yeah but if he doesn't withdraw his guilty plea in sentences he gets zero to six months if he does withdraws guilty plea they charge urgent with perjury and perhaps not filing for Farah which they did not mention in this filing or other things he could get more jail more prison time In which case you know six or one half dozen the other you pardon zero to six months sentence you paro you. You pardon a three or sentence but if he doesn't pardon him he's got a longer sentence so he's gambling with the hope of pardon but really could end up in prison for longer. Yep Yep which means. He seems pretty sure that he's going to get a pardon but let's ask Cohen Owen. How how that turns out going for you? But Cohen didn't turn back withdraws guilty plea. So if Sullivan allows as Flynn to withdraw his plea. We could see trial. We could see additional charges if not like. I said he'd likely sentenced him for the original crime which carries a zero to six month sentence from sentencing guidelines Joe Joe that's what's going on with Flynn Neat Interesting I'm really kind of life that go to trial but yeah I. I mean rooting for Sullivan to be like okay. You want to withdraw your guilty plea on a roll the dice. Good luck and I'm still your judge. Enjoy your time you know have fun. Yeah by the way gag order you think so. I would put one on him and Sydney Powell. Yeah definitely new Powell. Yeah that's belly very interesting and keep up with out happens all right. Well everybody if you want these episodes ad free just head to Patriot dot com slash the daily beans all your wildest dreams will come true. We'll be right back with trump's twenty twenty one budget and you'll never guess what he's getting so stay with us through these messages will be everybody. 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Knowing about their health with the help of embark I love. How easy embark makes the process? I sent in one simple cheek. Swab Robin they did. The rest embark is the only dog. DNA testing performs research grade DNA testing and this allows veterinarian research teams to conduct groundbreaking research to extend the lives of all dogs. Every reembarked dog brings us closer to the goal of ending. Preventable Diseases in dogs. Embark has an exclusive offer. You can't get anywhere else. Go to embark vet dot com now and use Promo Code daily beans to save fifteen percent off your dog. DNA Test Kit visit embark vet dot com and use Promo Code daily beans to save all right. Everybody welcome back. It's time for Jordan's block of news got what I got the Atlantic They have they have a really good piece. That's out right now and it's it's pretty much. It's a lengthy piece of you'd maybe want to set decide a couple more minutes in a regular article to finish it but I highly recommend reading it and it goes over. How exactly social media is being weaponized to re-elect trump And it also provides a lot of really good background information on sort of what got us to this point in terms of this political cyberwarfare and just found it to be really illuminating. And like I said it's a longer P so I'll just go over some of the highlights. they ellen what. They observed the the author so they did. They made a fake facebook account and they liked it donald trump's page and then they liked from there every single page. That got suggested to them and it was things like Ann Coulter Fox News and then it got more and more conservative even way to the right and they just kept pressing like essentially as like a thought experiment. You sounds like like disease but they you did this as an experiment to sort of see what corners of the Internet it would take them to and this is a really powerful quote. They say What I was seeing was a strategy that it has been deployed by illiberal political leaders around the world rather than shutting down dissenting voices? These leaders have learned to harness the democratizing power of social media for their own purposes jamming. The signals sowing confusion. They no longer need to silence the dissident shouting in the streets they can use a megaphone to drown him out. Scholars have a name for this censorship. Through noise I thought that was right. It's really creepy. And they explained it so well there. It's terrifying it's really terrifying in in by going down this path of this trump facebook profile that they made they can see exactly how it happens. In how these different accounts just start throwing in chaos and shit constantly to the point where they remark. I'm obviously you know a pretty strongly. Vetting MM person when it comes to media sources but even iphone myself questioning. What's real when you get so many different things thrown at you? While reminds me of that scene and guardians of the galaxy. You know when the blue guys like Bobby Bobby debatable. Bad but like every time. He tried to talk debate bed. Hugs actually it just drowned out by added complete nonsense and yeah. It's really hard to sift through all that stuff when you're maybe already leaning towards Republican Nigeria's or something and then our if the ideas are specifically designed to cause you yes personally rage or sadness or happiness. Yes something something that you're really passionate about like pro choice or anti gun or blacks live black lives matter or whatever it is that it is specifically designed for you to poke right at Ya. Yep exactly what you're talking about is called a micro targeting and that's something that the trump campaign plans to spend and a lot of their money on this year and what they spent doing last year while our last election as well accept this year. They're planning to drop more than a billion in dollars on disinformation campaigns. Just like this and it's really really scary. That's a lot of a lot of money to go into that but micro targeting is probably going to be one of their major focuses This is this is described as the process of slicing up the electorate into distinct niches and then appealing appealing to them with precisely tailored digital messages. So exactly what you were just saying Apparently this article says Obama and Clinton used the same tactic take but obviously trump takes to an entirely new fearmongering just blatant lies level. It's a whole new targeted voter suppression. Especially when you have giant giant factories of people in Russia and Iran probably or Iraq or China or North Korea. That are helping you out. Yeah pumping complete complete conspiracy theories like Obama and Clinton may be used definitely use micro targeting to the Senate to the degree where you could pretty much easily. Just explain it away as being advanced campaign tactics right like hey do care about healthcare. I've healthcare message for you. And micro targeting you because you have health concerns or a family like versus complete sewing of chaos. I mean it's not just Obama and Clinton every politician every political party uses micro targeting. I mean I've I've done. Work for political campaigns were done micro targeting pretty. You know I understand how that works And so you think it's only going to be used to like educate and to amplify and to reach people on specific issues. That's what it was designed for. But they weren't expecting someone like him to come in exploit the tool. We expect these tools to be used for good right for example ad targeting. Okay if I'm walking around and I'm near My starbucks or I'm nearer. You're not my starbucks own starbucks near near starbucks or CVS or something a little ad POPs up and says hey the perfume that you like is on sale over here okay. That's like for a good cause right now. They can listen to me and record all of my conversations stations and then use this sort of information for this exact kind of psycho graphic my targeting ferry personalized data. Ah Yes yes. Very Gross. And we all know the company that really pioneered this Cambridge Angelica and they worked for trump a lot. Yep huge contract with him Brad. Pascale and One of the craziest things they did as you'll remember is the facebook survey. That's where a lot of this. This shit started where they took A. They took a huge sample size of people but again very specific people and they ask them questions that talk number one meant to get a full psychological profile these people but also to stir up whatever sort of you know extremist views they already had for example example. I didn't know this but I guess one of the questions they would ask is they would say. Would you approve of your daughter marrying a Mexican immigrant. Those who said yes were then asked a follow. Followup question designed to sort of stir shit up in the question was did you feel like you had to say that so then they tried to go after political correctness and and they see like who sort of what kind of person you know is going to answer. Are you easily pressured into political correctness right that or like are you bothered by political correctness but at genuinely not like immigration issues. I don't I don't know it's just. Yeah whatever sick just just the fact that the quiz alone is enough to incite. Bigotry is like really disgusting. But it's GonNa continue just because Cambridge analytica dissolved. It doesn't mean that it's not happening anymore or other companies are already doing it about. The tools aren't more advanced or sophisticated. Exactly yeah no in Cambridge says now called Emmer data Yup and and already Republicans have gathered so many data points on the electorate. That's also really scary. They have this kind of talking about all campaigns sort of doing that micro targeting tactic the Republicans have so much more information right now on everybody to start with because they're really sketchy things that were able to do. Because the regulations don't exist yet basically and then you think of all those private dinners and lunches with Zuckerberg and trump and right in. There could definitely be more nefarious ends up. There is a trump person who's on the board of have directors that facebook and all those funds stories and the facebook refuses or they'll like we allow lives. We don't police that So it's all very very scary very scary because I go ahead I was just GonNa say another thing that. They're spending their money on is they're investing this texting platform where you can send anonymous mass texts to just huge groups of people without their permission and that's one of the tools that they're gonNA start. Utilizing is wild sounds. So just that's where they're spending their money. Really is sketchy communication tactics. And they're making a lot of money to trump pulled in twenty five million dollars in one day this past month We talked about The American I pack and the America One Pack Victory Fund. And they have they've made fifty million dollars So far this year they're paying out Brad. Par Scales privately owned firms For online media information or at advising and just a but you know totally separate from the campaign and even though he's the chair scary. Yeah I don't want to I. I'm sure there's a exists to some extent already somewhere but I'm wondering what. Education campaigns are out there there to help people with perhaps perhaps less tech literate vernacular or less knowledge of what's going on You know so. Essentially like helping boomers sort reality from fact social media. I remember a couple years ago. I don't know maybe four. Five years ago I did do a workshop. Educating Skating Senior citizens on how social media to to for the things that they wanted leading to research topics that they like or to to keep up with local local services. Or whatever I I did like a prone workshop for this nonprofit. It's cool but I'm wondering if like there are education projects out there to help this disinformation campaign and teach people how to sort fact from reality. Yeah we should. We should reach out to a Caro- who had the show who put together impeachment one. Oh one maybe we could. Do you a disinformation one. Yeah it's like trying to extract some sort of like hope and do something about this feeling some little breakdown of what all this means and I. I do WANNA Though I mean you said you know basically to help boomers recognize this kind of language. I also just want acknowledged that there are. People of all ages Because it can be with your rural versus urban or if you just don't have the education level that some other folks have. I don't think it's secluded just to boomers you're totally right and so I just wanted to make make sure that I I addressed that real quick but it's it's widespread and it's scary and it's really scary and I really love your idea. Amanda about putting together. There's some sort of well education package. I'm GonNa call me when you're seeing something on social media how do you. How can you confirm the sources that comes from? How do you how how how? How do you sort fact from reality? When you're looking at social media You know I wish that there is some more sharable resources that could give to my grandma I think I have. You know some stuff floating running around on twitter before and I'll have to go back and look at it but nothing. That's like a nice packaged story. Land because I say or a youtube video I would say it's easy to watch. Yeah I would say like watched the what was it. The great heck the great hack on Netflix. Is that what it's called the great hacker the big heck. I can't remember the great heck I think. Whatever is about Bernie Kaiser? It's came and Brittany Kaiser Netflix attack. Okay yes the big heck. That's just what is getting so quickly trying to right right right. I'm saying that people one guy steals Carlos Mencia. That would have been way better Jenner's now I can retract that statement because I fucking Love Ellen Degeneres honestly probably the reason I do. Stand up comedy. She's just very commercial. So I very confusing establishment comic and I won't uh-huh yes no. She's the best here now that special that. Hbo Special My favorites of all time really had that memorized front back as a child. Does that one of the pickle climate yes. uh-huh so good. I'm getting scissors. And I love the Piccolo. And she's running. Also that's let's know Ellen did do I mean I think a lot of like younger people now are like Ellen dot radical enough. But she wasn't a very very gay movie movie two thousand and he was the most radical person she lost work and so did by the way Laura Dern who won an Oscar last night anything for being the the love interest on the Ellen's coming out episode. They lost work for a long time decade. At least and I know that you know. Maybe she doesn't seem as progressive or whatever our but a lot of shit wouldn't be possible that what she did. Yes just if I wanted to clarify one thing. I think what I should have said rather than boomers you know not being tech literate is basically we just saying creating content for people who aren't as tech or political literates. Because I'm better those April I'm politically literate tech litter I put. I put a picture of a camera camera online today. Asking friends for help. I took a photo of a camera with my phone and put it on the facebook and said help. So that's why I said like maybe because instagram stories. Okay I think I can probably figuring run out but it's just not my cup of tea and boomer by any means so I just sort of what I like. I wanted to yeah. So thanks for that clarification always yes I'll stop using boomer as a blanket. People who aren't as tech literate. It's hard it's hard. I understand. Republicans and some veterans. You know what I I mean. Who the fuck mytalk Maroon away? More computers than I do. Yeah I can't do an instagram story. Shit honestly like I could do a very basic version of it but I can't stand awesome boomers. Who can do that? Shit Hell. Yeah I can't think of any would need to do that anymore but I literally don't know what what I'm talking about okay. So perfect time. All right let's talk about speaking boomers because this will affect you and not because of anything you know Other than Holy Shit. Yeah Yeah it's trump's new proposed budget at two new four point eight trillion dollar budgets. It skin it proposes proposes immense social safety net program cuts in a huge increase. Will guess it's point three percent but an increase of military spending Point three percent of our current military budget is pretty huge. Yeah Yeah I mean point. Three percent of that large of a number is a large number. Totally yes Yeah yeah any in the stuff that it's going towards to is just like he wants to your two billion dollars to go to the border wall for example. No the money's not going to go probably the two places where even people in the military would want it to go. Well he has to create an entire bureaucratic Layer of space force because we we have a space for us. It's called the Air Force. They're doing everything. The Space Force is GONNA do. And the Air Force has one surgeon general. They have one military health system. They have have one Defense Health System. They have the you know. And there's so it's there already now he wants to pull it apart into two things and create another another silo of all of those bureaucratic levels Which is going to cost billions of dollars to do the same job? Just calling it space force. I'M GONNA say he made it so. These kinds of things are included in not point three point. Three increase. But the cuts to Medicare Medicare Medicaid yet. Four point four trillion dollar cuts in government spending over a decade is what his target is in. That's largely centered around cutting those programs MHM and this all came to be because this is with a huge tax cut he made were. All of the revenue came out and went to the top. You know to the rich people and corporations corporations and farming All of that money comes out into corporate welfare and tax cuts and then that gives them a reason to say look at our huge deficit. We have to cut somewhere. And that's how and this was predicted. we've been saying this right. Yeah it's one hundred and thirty billion dollars I mean huge asked slash to Medicare. It's like two hundred ninety. Two billion for Medicaid and food stamps and seventy billion Limp in limits to disability benefits is just literally all of the programs that help people who need help and if you look it up. Hijacked most empowering empowering language to say that so please don't reach into that but you know what I mean. Yeah I mean if you look at a pie chart of where the money goes. That's a tiny little sliver of write these entitlement programs rams. He wants to cut the budget by twenty six percent in Department of Housing and Urban Development Budget by fifteen percent all know Ben Carson won't be able able to buy a new door And and then get this center for Disease Control and prevention cut by nine percent during during the Corona Virus Yup and future global pandemics about to have because of our antibiotic Resistant Bodies Cool and love that anti vaxxers yes. Yes because information and micro targeting E. L.. Don't at me about the things that you said it's a The only the only silver lining in this is that this is basically just a look into what he would want if he could get his way which he won't because Congress has to meet Democrats. What's in it for that plan to get pushed through so that won't happen but yeah? It is negotiation tactic and always has been like super high super crazy and then they bring it down and we're we're like all right. We talked him down but now these are still huge slashes. That's his way. That's his art of the deal. He also just revealed that he's breaking a campaign promise he made though Oh Rolling Stone article so they they said that he he promised in two thousand sixteen. He wasn't going to cut Medicare and Medicaid or social security. Wasn't gonNA touch. Actually I mean I was just going to say it's not just Democrats who don't want to cut Medicare and Medicaid. There are a lot of Republicans who don't do this either. And in fact there are a lot of republican controlled states where they are where Republican politicians are pushing to protect these things and expand upon them because even people who are perhaps vary so very socially conservative. -servative still want healthcare. You know a lot of Republican governors use the did the Medicaid expansion under you know that would be cut wouldn't especially if the affordable well care act one away wouldn't cuts to Medicaid and Medicare actually hurt trump's chances reelection air just thought arrogant. I don't know it depends on. I mean if you're getting donors from RN's air donors and donations. And Stephanie are in seeing people that want to see those cuts people who don't have a vested interest in re election like if the re election is ultimately determined determined by these massive amounts of money through PACs. You have to please those people more so than you really need to worry about. Pleasing the electorate. As long you're popular vote can be within like you know a certain margin. Yeah I'm really if he just gets on the road and goes to his hate rallies and says Democrats are going to cut social security and Medicaid. I won't the Democrats are going to get rid of your healthcare protections. I will not And just repeats thousand averages over and over again people will believe it and people think the Democrats are the ones who want to cut social security people. I think that the Democrats are the one who wants you. WanNa get rid of Protections for pre existing conditions when. We're actually literally the ones who created them and he is literally the one who's fighting against it's those things in court like right now. Yeah and then also one last thing that I just was thinking of too. Is this whole concept of politicians. Don't just stop after daily Congress right. There's Ted Cruz and oh AFC talking about coming together on some bill that would prevent people from being able to come back and keep lobbing and profiting off of this whole whole sort of corporate money. Right yeah they want to limit the ban politicians for becoming lobbyists Am I I've thought is at a certain point as long as you get reelected really you just WanNa Gang. Keep those rich people happy and giving money to continuing the have that sort of sketchy relationship ship with them. It's the only reason. The Republicans oppose trump firing Gordon. Sunlen was because he was a big donor to them. Yeah exactly so if they wanna cut that stuff into them they just want to be able to say they're throwing money I don't know I don't know how those evil people fucking work. It's hard to even imagine yes. Imagine that's ultimately the goal is to keep those people happy. Yes a hundred percent me right. That's gotTa keep the money. Happy all right. We'll be right back with the Department of injustice and the latest democratic results stick around. Hey everybody this. Portion of daily beans is is brought to you by ship station. When you're selling online getting your orders out can be a real pain? How do you keep track of who gets what which shipping carriers should use or you're getting the best rates and that's why you need ship station? 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Welcome back so. Yesterday we reported that Rudy had a new direct line to bill bar sent him. His Ukraine Biden disinformation and today. Bill Bar verified that to be the case in a press conference Bar said the Department of Justice is reviewing documents about Biden provided by Rudy. But here's the RUB. You may have heard mainstream media saying this is all cool because bar offered a bit of skepticism but listen to bars quote carefully bar said quote. The Department of Justice has the obligation to have an open door or to anybody who wishes to provide us information they think is relevant but we have to be careful with respect to any information coming from the Ukraine unquote that does not sound like skepticism. Just system of Rudy. That sounds like skepticism of Ukraine. And I'm a little pissed at the media for insinuating. Baras skeptical like it's a good thing here. His skepticism here is only Lee. Meant to bolster trump's bullshit claim that he cares about corruption in Ukraine and that Ukraine sucks at stuff like we can't take anything from them at face. Value have to be skeptical of whatever comes. In from Ukraine. Not Rudy Rudy is totally on the up and up but Ukraine. Who End? Can you even like. You're really rope in the people that are talking about Juliani with Ukraine as a whole no. They're kind of like their Gremlin funded right. They're not in the spirit of Ukrainian. They're not in the spirit. That's exactly right. That's like saying Yana Kovic. We can't trust Ukraine because of Yanukovych. You know that he was Putin backed separatist From the opposition bloc party so I think it was called that if it's not sorry we'll do a correction you'll let me know And the Pentagon today is reporting that one hundred nine servicemembers have been diagnosed with traumatic brain injury now up to one hundred nine following the Iranian missile attack on our Iraq airbases in in retaliation for trump's airstrike against Qassam Sola money the Pentagon added about seventy percent have returned to duty trump said. There were no injuries and then when these TI cases to start being reported he downplayed. The injuries saying they were just headaches. That sparked a bunch of backlash from veterans and Social Media and military and veteran service organizations. They ridiculed the administration and the Veterans of foreign war. Veterans of Foreign Wars. Even demanded an apology. which hasn't happened in is likely not to? Could you imagine no. I would never can't even apologize in his voice. I want to apologize. It just doesn't work I I can't imagine him saying something sincere. You're about a fuck up. He made. I'm really they're not headaches. I Take I can't I can't and won't come out in his voice so there's quick information on traumatic brain injury the most common form of TB. I in the military is mild. Tb I which is what these one hundred and nine Active duty military members have suffered from according to the defense and Veterans Brain Injury Center the Centers for Disease Control Control which will be defended by nine percent of trump's budget goes through defines. TV is a disruption in the normal function of the brain typically caused by a bump. Blow jolt to the head and most of these soldiers I or active duty servicemembers that Suffered from a mild traumatic brain injury. The shock waves from the rockets they were there bunkers that they were didn't protect them from it One of the most common forms of. Ti's concussion that's a mile so everyone's like Oh. You have a concussion you can. That's mild traumatic brain injury. That's it's just mostly what they have and they can recover from it hopefully and unfortunately symptoms take a long time to manifest so there could be more cases coming yeah away from the military. They're typically seen in car accidents accidents. When a person's head hits the windshield they're also frequently occurring in sports After football player tackles an opposing player. Perhaps leading with the helmet for example In two thousand fourteen alone. Almost three three-million TB. I related emergency room visits happened hospitalizations and deaths were reported in the US according to the CDC more than eight hundred and thirty thousand occurred among children the total number increased fifty three percent from two thousand six the CDC said indicating brain injuries are on the rise quite significantly. That's interesting that's already taking into account the rising population and stuff. Yeah I would assume so they can also be caused by severe shaking which moves the brain inside the skull that can happen when using the car accident. Example bullhead jolts from impact. But they don't actually collide with anything. These types of injuries can range from. Mild to severe symptoms include headaches dizziness and confusion for the mild Moderate brain injuries can include severe headaches lack of coordination slurred speech seizures and very severe cases can result in death. Fifty six thousand eight hundred TB. I related deaths in the United States in two thousand fourteen according to the CDC speaking of the CDC the death toll globally for the corona viruses topped one thousand which is more than the SARS outbreak break killed in two thousand and three. We've surpass ours however please note that tens of thousands of people die every year from the flu and you need to get vaccinated. No vaccine won't make you sick. Look if you get sick after the flu vaccine. It's a coincidence. It's science you especially vaccinate yourself. If you're around folks who can't get vaccinated like babies the elderly and folks with immune deficiencies. This has been a public service announcement brought to you by me In other news a new Quinnipiac poll puts Bernie in the top spot. Nationwide twenty five percent Biden Biden at seventeen in second place quite elite Bloomberg's at fifteen. What the Hell and Warren is fourteen Buddha judges at ten cliches at four Bloomberg Bloomberg? No other candidate broke two percent. Why is Bloomberg at fifteen? He's abandoning off. One hundred and fifty million billion. A lot of Matt's million Dan Million in head to head matchups in the Quinnipiac poll against trump Bloomberg is the top of the list. Wow okay sorry. I need to amend something based on when I said yesterday I don't mean to make disgusting sound Bloomberg's name. I'm just very surprised. Yes thank you know and you know hey if you you WANNA go. Hey we have our opinion. I'm trying to not be too negatively opinionated. I think a little is warranted here and there thank you head to head matchups against trump. You're welcome you now Bloomberg tops fifty one to forty two sanders Number two he comes in at fifty two forty three so apparently trump will get a little bit more vote if sanders is running Biden beats trump fifty to forty. Three KLOBUCHAR defeats him. Forty nine to forty three. Warren wins narrowly over trump forty eight to forty four interesting. Buddha judge also slightly ahead forty seven to forty three. I don't know if I would use narrowly for forty eight to forty four unless there's three percent Martial there. That's surprising to me well. Here's here's here's the explanation that I'm seeing. It appears Bloomberg is eating into Biden's numbers and I will say he's running some pretty amazing ads right now if you've seen him on social media against trump How he has spent one hundred fifty million dollars in advertising? That's twice what style has spent like thirty times. What Biden has spent some Bloomberg Bloomberg is picking off Biden? Supporters was particularly black voters. Check this out. Biden went from forty nine to twenty seven percent support among black voters while Bloomberg went from seven percent support report to twenty two percent in this last poll. The next debate is February nineteenth in Nevada. Nevada somebody I if I say Nevada I'll get corrections for Nevada by saying Nevada correct for Nevada. So Las Vegas. I grew up there and everyone said Nevada but who knows maybe all of us living ally the State of Las Vegas. We're all living. They all say about also about and Bloomberg is closer to qualifying that debate stage based on this poll. This this Quinnipiac poll so far. The only qualifiers are Biden. Buddha Judge Sanders Warren enclosure style has not yet qualified. The debate is just nine days away and but a judge sanders are formally calling for at least a partial re canvass in Iowa a precincts they think were calculated incorrectly as. We are just hours away from New Hampshire starting into cast their votes. Yeah it'll happen today if you're listening on Tuesday and a new emerson. College poll is out for New Hampshire. Putting Bernie ahead that thirty percent Buddha judge in second place with twenty three Kloba Shar jumps into third place with fourteen and Warren has eleven and Biden is in fifth place with ten percent. Meanwhile the Suffolk poll for New Hampshire Bernie. Isn't I with twenty seven. Buddha Judge Nineteen Kluber sharing third again with fourteen and worn Biden. They're tied at twelve damn him. Yeah it's pretty crazy closure is she. Yeah Yeah they're going to number one with a bullet. I will say this people are talking a lot about You know pge support with people of Color and who are people of Color GonNA support if Biden is not the nominee but like Bernie's number two with Back people at number knbr one with Latino people so just as a symposium. I've seen this week But Clovis really well and her really rising which is impressive. I'm curious to see what what happens. After New Hampshire we get to more diverse states. Yeah I would never think that closure was GONNA pass Warren surprise. She did well in Iowa and then she had a great night. I think at the debate on Friday And she's a more moderate candidates which I think is what Iowa New Hampshire after. And so that's why I think she. You jumped into third in the I in the New Hampshire polls but in the In the national polls. She's still number four. She's still only four percent Bernie Biden Bloomberg Buddha judge closure. She number five yeah. She's very impressive. I mean she she has her campaign. Pain is impressive is what I'm trying to say. It surprised me and she has done better than I expected. And she's very well loved as the the moderate wing of the Party Taming Mizzou. Yeah good for. She's lovable We'll be right back with the good news. We have some really awesome. Good news stick around everybody. That's helping daily beans is brought to you by Laurel Springs. Parents always want to encourage their children to pursue their dreams and provide opportunities that. Give them the best chance to succeed. Sometimes that means optimizing their routine making it more flexible more more dynamic so they have more time to focus on the things they love. That's why there's Laurel Springs. Aurel springs is an accredited online private school for students in kindergarten through twelfth grade or else springs recognizes ignites. Each child is unique individual with their own personal interest special talents and unique learning style. Flexible learning programs offer challenging diverse elective courses and laurel springs is accredited by by the Western Association of schools and colleges and advance ed which means their transcripts are recognized by colleges and universities worldwide. I love the flexibility of Laurel Springs and love other. Online program is designed for students who wish to grow and excel academically and personally while maintaining a flexible schedule. Their personalized approach is competency. Based in a synchronous meaning students have the the opportunity to progress through the material at a pace that honors their individual skills and knowledge is approach also allows students to adapt their schedules to accommodate outside interests. They also offer rolling enrollment it which allows students to begin work at any time of the year. I think we're all springs improves. The academic experience of the modern student with this flexible approach to find the best way to prepare them for success register. Your child at Laurel Springs Dot com slash daily beans today and receive a waived registration fee. That's laurel springs dot com slash daily beans for your waived registration fee laurel springs dot com slash daily beans. All right welcome back. It is time for good news from the Washington Post for the first time. Ever the editors in chief of the top sixteen sixteen law schools journals are all women Ruth Bader Ginsburg addressed the current slate of editors during a gathering to mark the one hundred anniversary of the ratification of the nineteen amendments saying quote. It's such a contrast to the ancient days when I was in law school in fact a woman didn't become an editor of a law review until she was ten years until ten years after Ruth Bader GINSBURG. GINSBURG was in law. School she says there really is no better time for women to enter the legal profession that includes so this this list of sixteen Law Reviews Law journals includes Harvard. Harvard Yale Stanford Georgetown Columbia and Duke and then eleven others of the top law schools. All Sixteen women. The editors in chief collaborated for the first time to publish Russia women and Law Journal with a series of essays from prominent female lawyers in recent years a number of women enrolling in law school has exceeded the number of men but women make up less than a quarter of law firm equity partners a quarter of tenured and tenure track law professors and about a third of all active federal district and appeals. Court judges only four women have ever served on the Supreme Court and three of them are sitting now at the same time. Well I love it. Yeah that's really cool. Rundown Sixteen all sixteen of the top sixteen law law reviews and journals. Wow smarter than chief are women. Chicks are smart choices. How many times have I told you never call broads? Chicks that's awesome. UHF It is. I love that and I I love to other how women were featured well not featured but celebrated at the Oscars last night too. Yeah that was great. It was awesome except for not getting nominated. That's what I mean. Yeah I will say this though I love Natalie Portman Cape with all of the yeah that was great however she's only two female directors and her thirty year career so walk the walk definitely businesses. Does she have a choice. Though now. I know oh fair enough. Yeah it's like like I was having a discussion online the other day too because a lot of people were given a friend of ours hard time because they got a book published with with the same publisher that published Roger Stone's book and I'm like look if somebody offered me a TV show and one of the executive producers Gave Save money to Matt Gaetz in nine days. Am I gonNA turn down the TV show because or a better example because this this actually happened to me in real life I was offered a show on the main stage. The comedy store which is a big deal if you're a comedian in Hollywood that's a big show and it's it was a Saturday night. Ten thirty show sold out show but Jeremy Piven was the headliner. He's been me too and people were like you're going to do a show with him. How can you support him? And I'm like no no no no. I'm going to do a show despite him. I'm not going to allow allow him being on the show to steal this opportunity away from me because he did what he did. And so. I kinda like to think of it that way sometimes but slight light-handed also I. I wasn't here yesterday. Did you guys talk about Elizabeth. Warren being talked over at the debates no time round she Had One of the lower amount of talking working times over a lot this last to be like to the point where I noticed it more than other debates and I was like just because she's not like necessarily a front runner at this moment doesn't mean she's in deserve a chance to God say shit absolutely. I'm very frustrated. Surprised to see that. She's not considered a front runner right now. I was not expecting this. Yeah me neither. And I think the problem is the moderators knew this for ratings purposes purposes. That she's not she's staying above the fray with all the attacks right now that sort of thing and when they found out she wasn't really going to attack anybody else on stage. They gave more talking time to people who were more prone to attack other people and that makes me sad. Yeah me too in other good news. The OBAMAS Production Company won an Oscar last night for their documentary American factory very cool note. Trump does not have an Oscar or a grammy more Nobel Peace Prize. The OBAMAS have all three. Yes it's going to keep adding to this award list. Also a parasite Talia. They did so well so many awards tackle takeaway. Td's the first indigenous person to win an Oscar. Yeah isn't that awesome. He's Maury Maury Ed Murray. Someone's going to correct me. On that pronunciation of he had such a Funny Post Oscars interview. They have like if you look on Youtube. They do a press conference sort of with all these people in tyco Itt. TT's such a fucking Weirdo. Yeah it's so good. Have you talked about Joe Rabbit. Have you seen it. I've Seen No. It's so oh good yeah I saw nineteen seventeen. Yeah and I thought at one what it should have won cinematography and sound editing and mixing. I thought they were all beautiful. And then I'm glad that the woman who composed the music for the joker one She's in a incredible incredible composer so that was nice to see her win. That yeah the first ever woman can orchestra conductor in the pit. Ab Status Hollywood. I Guess Yeah Yeah. Didn't they. Hardly nominated any real people. Yeah yeah and that's like something because people knock on the Oscar sometimes because they think that they sort of give society like what society wants or something as a bad thing. That's really just like a weird way of saying inclusivity kind of but it seems like this year that elements. They were not focused on that element. which is interesting in a Yeah it's interesting. I don't know enough about that nomination process and how that all works. But that's how parasite though yeah winnings amazing because that was like in no way. Would that normally ever happen. Yeah like hands hands down so agreed upon by every single person. That was great. Yeah my favorite dressed Sandra. Oh Oh my God and Janelle Monae Oh my God yes I completely the agree with you totally agree they will look amazing. I know goddesses gotTa Watch killing Eve speaking of Sandro. If you haven't yeah I've been meaning to God it's so good it's really good Highly recommend okay and if yeah I'll just because maybe I did a podcast about it I would. I'd have time to Like I'll get right on that. I have no free time I really want to go. I need to start carving out more flavor for things that are not politically cassatt asphalt content. You know what I mean. Yeah Yeah I've heard it's amazing God and Jodi comber. The actress who plays Sandra Oh's The other main actress in the show. She's fucking amazing. Yeah anyway. Do you need to see that I need to. I need to start carbon timeout for nice stuff like that and in Arizona polling shows that retired astronaut and husband who Gabby giffords Democrat mark. Kelly is overtaking Martha mcsally in the polls. Cool Let's turn Arizona blue this year. I met him goodbye. I met him At Lesbians Lesbians who tech in San Francisco in two thousand eighteen. I was there for Tech Conference. And they were giving a whole talk on some keynote speakers and he's just awesome. Yeah he's he's really amazing person so warm and so an honestly what an amazing husband super genuine. Yeah yeah he he's. He's been through thick and thin writing seriously. and Are you ready for a little shot and Freud. Yes I saved the best for last this just in prosecutors have filed their sentencing recommendations uh-huh for Roger Stone ahead of his February twentieth sentencing hearing they're recommending seven to nine years in the filing prosecutors asked for four to five years with an eight point upward word variants because he's a giant piece of shit his physical threats to others and people's dogs when he you know he was eventually convicted for obstructing justice. hostas the new bar lackey Tim Shea signed off on this. Though sources inside main justice say there was some quibbling some differences of opinion But it appears at the Muller prosecutors got their way and stone could get up to nine years in federal prison. That'd be beautiful fuck. Yeah that's like the most. Just that's the closest to justice we've gotten from any of these Miller convictions. Yeah I'M GONNA say like six months you get six months. I don't know I don't see him going to jail for more than like a a year. Let's Amy Berman Jackson. He's read all the redacted parts She knows what stones done she can take that into account when she sentencing insinger. Yeah it just seems like they're going so easy on these people. Yeah I We'll see though right But they're recommending seventy nine. Yeah so thanks. Dan Grech MHM. I appreciate you. That is our show And I just wanted to do a quick apology to a man because I got some feedback from some folks folks. That aren't you who said that. Maybe I was rude when I asked you for a source For the Peter. Judge Debra Judge Com. Yeah and I wanted to you know if that was at all rude or anything. I just wanted to apologize. Say I did not mean for it to be rude. I'd simply meant like site. Your sources totally Kinda like professor would do. Yeah quite frankly. I Lake myself found myself thinking. I wish I had come more prepared before. I made that comment. So so it's it's still and I learned that there was a very credible source behind now and that we needed to do more research on it and I thought we ended that discussion pretty well but somebody seemed pretty upset. That was the very came to your defense. So if there's anything wrong with that sorry Got Strong opinions up in here. We do and I don't I still. I don't want to discourage anybody for asking for sources especially in the wake of Jordan's disinformation reporting from the Atlantic I think it's good that we can have those discussions so I just wanted to make sure that I said that. So that's my final thought. Do you guys have any friends. uh-huh yeah I will say this. It's it's funny I I as we're getting further down the road with this primary. I've seen my own personal social media. You get like Nastier. I just like I really want everyone to like take a moment. Take a breath heavily Okuma moment and just remember to vote blue no matter who just just you know everybody and good general lesson. You'll catch more flies with honey if you really are a supporter of a specific candidate and you want other people particularly Democrats Kratz ilk mostly to come onto your train whatever. It is If you're nice yeah if you don't try to publicly humiliate them or call them names and You're going to change more hearts and minds with kindness. I have a new mantra in my head. Now and I and I I'm not by any means perfect at this but this is going to be my new thing in my head is what I'm about to say something. Michelle Obama would say uh-huh fair. WW It's almost impossible standard but a good way to shoot for big if she's tough she's gritty but she has ratings you know she's got great everything everything and kindness and I and I actually United States. She's skipping Miss Congeniality. Yes do I love that April twenty fifth think real fatigued and exhausted. And we all want what we want to strongly enroll really emotional and yeah obviously experienced like a couple of interactions actions of people recently. When what what I thought were really like conversations turning you know somewhat nasty really quickly or people thinking that I felt a certain way but a certain candidate because I put my support behind them or like that I support negative things or whatever and I'm just like y'all know we all want when we want but we should try to you know he'll and go towards is the general like I posted that thing about what Andrew Yang said during the debates? All I said is Andrew. Yang said He doesn't want to go go. After trump. He wants the country to move forward. He doesn't think Americans care. I just posted that And I got a lot of like People who were like how. How come you didn't mention any of the female candidates it was like? There are literally like sixteen other tweets about all the other candidates through the debate. I couldn't put can't mention every single candidate in every single tweet You know and I just get a lot of you know and it's not like if somebody was really truly trying to help you. I feel like they would send you a private message and say hey I just notice what is the you know. You didn't mention this or you didn't mention that they wouldn't publicly come out and say you know whatever it is like. Hey you know what it is. Where assuming the worst of each other it like we we? We are in our own corners. And it's not just like Republican versus Democrat. It's various wings of you know Democrats in leftist people. There's like nine factions of Democrat. Yeah there's there's like nine and everyone in love you now and it's getting stressful and I and I feel like what we have to do going forward as we start to figure out who the nominee might be and as things get cat ears just not assume the worst of each other benefit of the doubt. Right you'll find out the truth. You just asked some nice questions. Don't assume the worst of each other that easy I. It's time to get to. We have to hit back and I'm not talking about trump supporters. You can fuck with them all day all day. I'm talking about us. Yeah exactly. I'm just trying to inject a little energy into the university that I do appreciate that because it's getting hard to exist on social on the Internet. Yeah I don't like it everyone it'd be nice to each other twitter scrolling now as I read like one word and make a call and if I want to finish the Tweeden it just keeps not uh-huh because I don't want to flood my brain frigging bitching. It's a lot and I understand. You're passionate about your candidates. Everybody like You know we all are to It but yeah like I also say that facetiously. I know it's more than an argue on policy. Don't assume the IT's five. Yeah when I say Beijing. I'm talking about stuff. That's outside. Yeah arguing policy but don't assume the worst of the person that you are talking to or if you don't like my candidate don't call me names right right. Tell me why. I shouldn't like that candidate me. Why should over your candidate? Yeah yeah it'd be even better do that. Whatever it is likely make a constructive MHM? It's clear when you're out to publicly humiliate somebody or be a dick or get a singer in or have a mic drop or whatever the fuck now time for that Shit I will block you even even quite frankly. I'm saying this even as people who also support my candidate and like get it together. y'All don't fucking do that shit you know so I mm-hmm there's people on both sides anyway all right. Thank you. Thank you for that kindness kindness and I'm actually working on shirts What is it kindness? I sent it to kindness is punk AF hell. Yeah that's going to be our new shirt up a little beans beans lady on it or something to make cheese like kindnesses punk Adolf. She has a Mohawk saving. Go Anna all right. Well everyone please please please take care of yourself take care of each other. Take care of the planet. Take Care Mental Health. I promised to try to do the same. I've been I've enjoyed and government amended reader and the beans. The daily beans is executive produced and directed by AG Jordan Coburn and engineered edited by Mackenzie Mozelle and starve. Industries Are Marketing Manager Executive Assistant Assistant Production and social media direction as Amanda Reader Fact Checking Research by AG Jordan Coburn and Amanda Reader. Our music is written and performed by. They might be giants. Are Web design and branding or by Joel reader with moxy design studios and our website is daily beans pod dot com.

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OA325: Putin's Puppet? The Open Skies Treaty

Opening Arguments

1:13:44 hr | 10 months ago

OA325: Putin's Puppet? The Open Skies Treaty

"The twist like twist any great trial legal advice from a podcast bellone welcomed opening arguments some more of the live show from La This will be in particular a nice medium to deep dive on the Open Skies Treaty really fun and then a new show intro so that'll be next episode then so teaser alert. I'm pretty sure you've already put up the patron thread right Andrew indeed all right hatred to get on that Patriot thread that's where you can choose the new quotes for the intro of course we're not going to use the blackmail intro that the you've to two realities the norm pill you're going to hear the a quick segment on the census this podcast is sponsored by the law offices of the Andrew Tour's LLC for entertainment purposes is not intended as legal advice does not form an attorney client relationship don't who is going to record a little bonus segment for the patrons and but you also get that sense a segment so that's the that's the agenda anything to add Andrew so that's what you're going to hear if you are a patron if you've taken that patron pill then that means you've already heard the live show so we didn't want to repeat it for you we're going to get to hear a little Thomas's bar exam revenge which is a fun and popular segment I get to have a little fun at Andrews expense but I think how you doing Andrew Torres Fantastic our Utah I am great way to signposts that new intro we can we can say so this is kind of your last warning patrons got here though that was on Patriot dot com did that but today we had a very interesting episode we we have sort of and Covington and burling both both pills will will hear that segment so that means it takes the pills a minute to work and then if you've taken the pill the which is the blue pill I think right you know it was written by a couple of trans people anyway so they don't get to mres don't get to take that from us all right so if you take the the bill then we're going to have you listened to loyd welcome to opening arguments a podcast that pairs inquisitive interviewer with the real life lawyer Aubrac what's our census Covington burling update yeah I I love this for a lot of reasons yeah all right well I'm excited let's get to it way not ready yet don't change I can't I don't know this is to the as ruined this used to be fun matrix reference let's take let's reclaim it you know because the mayor this is Covington and burling just entered into a settlement with the US government for just a bit two and a half million dollars in legal fees interesting and the reason for that is that seen be so so we've talked about this before and you know comparable firms are ideologically very very diverse right so when I worked at CNBC like I said and I thought it was worth a little bit of a a rabbit trail here large law firms like Covington and burling and I worked for some of the most conservative people there my mentor was Was An antitrust lawyer named deb Garza who'd been in Ronald Reagan's antitrust ah find listeners that in the end Andrew had the last laugh possibly we'll see you all you wanna you WanNa hear it was it was fun and so that looks so that has continued and Covington and burling has placed folks into the trump administration and has placed folks onto the Fifth Circuit goofball non story about Comma Harris and you know taking like having criticizing a settlement people I worked for Bobby Burchfield was associated with the George W Bush reelection campaign I've told the story on the air of having the opportunity oh taken the lead in arguing on behalf of some of the pro bono groups that have challenged and into federal judgeships. These are not folks that I would think of as friends of the show at the same time Covington and burling has also some of the worst of the administration's policies and so part of that little rabbit trail is I don't know if you remember there was some like this rush the judge your honor not by honor I don't you don nothing all day right like but what I wouldn't kill for Reagan's antitrust department right now in any event I worked for some very conservative Lynch to the Commerce Department citizenship question and as we know they prevailed and what did COVINGTON and burling do they represented a group of plaintiffs in connection with the challenge that one like Big Covington and burling style firm had had entered into and then she had appeared at a fundraiser with other lawyers lawsuit against the US government there are two different ways in which you can get your attorney's fees paid for right now so one of the things that happened they Covington actually represented the plaintiffs in the Maryland case before Judge Hazel the a spokesman about one of the things that the US code provides for is that win you prevail in a law we know the typical rule in the American legal system is not loser pays right is both sides pay their own freight but ready to Declining the opportunity to go down to participate on the a winning but wrong side in court yeah but this is designed to say like because lawsuits against the United States have to be specifically authorized right like the government has to waive the provision of the Sovereign Immunity Act our two provisions twenty-eight USC Twenty Four Twelve sub-section d. is what the court quote shallow and so the idea there is we think it's probably a social good that when people sue the federal government and win and so that justified and that means under the case law justified to a degree that could satisfy a reasonable person or having a reasonable basis both in law and it meant to come out here cutting the blood slugged episode three hundred and twenty-five I son is round number like multiples of five that's that's good feels meaner we do for a for yeah yeah it was nonsense attack right like because firms aren't monoliths and and this is a really really good example so from that firm and like you know it was trying to be spun as a big like oh well you know she's a hypocrite and talking at one side of her mouth and well in that case the law says okay then plaintiffs do not get their attorney's fees right this was really close the government was substantially justified award to a prevailing party in litigation against the United States and those conditions shall meaning that they have to they shall award statutory are reasonable attorney's fees at market rates if there is an independent reason that in any other litigation you would also attorney's fees I'm GonNa talk about that in a second if a unless the United States' position that it took in the litigation was quote substantially in but are not substantially justified right and in that area you get your you get Statutory Attorney Department I mean I used to joke with her cat for those for those days again of like Oh so you know it wasn't like big Reagan's antitrust department you must negation on your attorney's fees if you can prove that the other side litigated the case in bad faith right and that takes us to Covington and get attorney's fees right that is so if the underlying claim is authorized by statute if so if you could get your attorney's fees by prevailing against me you can also get you the legal fees here are oh well maybe help folks who are my clients appreciate what they're the the lead attorneys build out old at eight hundred ninety five dollars an hour the all the way down to the let's see this is a loss at eleven hundred and twenty dollars an hour one thousand one hundred twenty dollars per hour the You know senior associates the recent graduates one was a twenty eighteen law school graduate and that Person Wolf returning fees by prevailing against the US government makes and yeah and in this case the standard is you can always prevail in so you know so it's just the ordinary American rule but there are lots of things that are a reasonable position that together the application that CNBC filed under subsection b right that's the bad faith was seven point two five million dollars this is somebody who graduated in Twenty fifteen build out at six hundred twenty five dollars an hour and then when we get down to is fees and we'll talk about what they are in a second move on up the statute twenty four twelve sub-section B is what the court May Award and what what they may award act okay so unpack that a little bit what that means is if you sue the government but you know the government's position was substantially justified right was reasonable the plaintiffs in the commerce litigation right these were ordinary Americans you know Latino Latina Americans that they were set by Law Nineteen ninety-six at one hundred twenty five dollars an hour with a cost of living adjustment and I'm not going to get into the complication on the cost of living adjustment but basically that makes it around two hundred ten dollars today which again giving they also then filed under subsection d under which you get statutory rates statutory rates are not quite so generous and in fact well it was a super duper close call or maybe it was a question of first impression and the judge is like hey look this is really really close but I'm going with the plaintiffs here I don't know why I keep feeling the need to defend Khama Harris who isn't remotely my candidate and is now sunk to about five percent in the polls and you know but but I feel like she's the most interest of fairness and there is some internal incentive not to pad those hours right because if you're associates are if you're giving them some so you're saying this is what the rates the government is setting for when you can get paid your attorney's fees when you've prevailed against the government directly out of law school twenty eighteen bills out at four hundred ninety five dollars an hour once once the calendar year rolled over five hundred if that happens here and this is what Covington Burlington what lots of big law firms do is when there is a case of public interest against the United States they'll take the case in legal fees for litigating the the Commerce Litigation case that's nine thousand a little over nine thousand hours of attorneys so like you're saying like Oh that's a lot of money but like if they don't if the rate is wrong you're out that money because you already paid your attorneys more in twenty five dollars an hour so those are the those are the associate rates the paralegal rates by the way there's no specific requirement to be a paralegal we're just average citizens who had no ability to pay you know two and a half or seven and a half or any amount of you know any amount of legal fees so the the dynamic is that the statute says that the legal fees must be reasonable and the hours must be reasonable and must be documented by affidavit so you know but here's an example of where the expense and cost of bringing in a firm is actually an incentive for that firm to do good because the law says if you prevail and the government's position was either not substantially justified somewhere ten shot so so I'm not surprised Covington took the two and a half million they would also have had the opportunity to dispute hours and that sort of thing in DC law like it's just a lawyer yeah you could be absolutely and the paralegal rates were two hundred sixty five dollars an hour so I'll take her there's there's there's at least some check on driving around with the meter running we could talk about big firm legal in another episode but carlings application part of why would to put this in here is you know we've talked about what Covington and burling legal rates are like yeah that's that's a that's a barking opening arguments paralegal officially right now just there you go so when you put all the so basically this is the government conceding that its position was not substantially justified in the commerce but but then at the end you just write it off if you lose and so and that's exactly what happened and you do have to do that because you you have to legal fees in connection with the citizenship question because there were multiple cases right so the ACO you got two point seven million along with the Arnold and Probo yeah bill or they win like here's what we charge you you build the whole time and then minimum rates that represents some discount that the court might say no well the the government's position was substantially justified. Now I wouldn't assign a highly so you know if this one litigation matter has cost tax payers somewhere between seven and nine million dollars you can negation the federal tiny deal but like it's yet another cost to being just a total clown horn and government right there baby but then the government's giving you back this amount is that do I have that alright you do one dynamic on there which is think about who the plaintiffs were the individual half million dollars now that's lower than the be right then then the excuse me that's lower than than the than the Subsection d the only imagine the litigation costs that the trump administration has passed on to all of us this is an argument that people raise particularly gets like slacking off and not doing paying work so you know I it it it there is there is some internal corrective mechanism and again notice which is a Covington and burling style firm for the New York case and that doesn't even count the the California census case those motions are pending. Submit an affidavit with the court that these are contemporaneous records right because you know otherwise you win and you're like I spent a million billion years and in between not substantially justified and in bad faith then you know have a fair amount of leverage over the government and so the government settled with CNBC for Vullo of likelihood to that and in fact they did they assigned about a ten percent likelihood to that which you know that strikes me as right right in any case at the local level right like we talked about this before but you know when when the Dover Area School district when their school board enacted a blatantly uncut a lot of money yep yep that is exactly right so brief discussion on on attorney's fees I thought it was I thought it was fun all right well ah but rather less so that the low end then was two point eight million dollars and and just to make sure this is running qualified applicants so we switched to Ziprecruiter ziprecruiter doesn't depend on candidates finding you it finds them for you it's technology identifies people hiring can be a slow process cafe alturas. Coo Dylan misquotes needed to hire a director of coffee for his organic coffee company but he was having trouble L. D. candidate within the first day see why Ziprecruiter is effective for businesses of all sizes try Ziprecruiter for free at our web address zip recruiter dot com slash that's ziprecruiter dot com slash oa one more time ziprecruiter dot com slash ziprecruiter and that is how Dylan found his new director of coffee in just a few days with results like that it's no wonder four out of five employers who post on Ziprecruiter get a quote the right experience and invites them to apply to your job so you get qualified candidates Fast Dylan posted his job on Ziprecruiter and said he was impressed by how quickly ten percent is about as low as I would ever go of you know well obviously the judge would never do outright like especially in age yeah I did I wanted now that those those pills are starting to take effect if you're if you're matrix fan that means the mirror for patrons is like the Mir is going to start eating you or whatever so yeah right yeah yeah the bret the Hitman Hart High School those are real so you know we had great candidates apply he also used Ziprecruiter's candidate rating feature to filter his applicants so he could focus on the most relevant ones I'm kind of credit and most firms say they at least some sort of credit for pro bono right I see yeah yeah so if you get some kind of credit you know you don't want you know what the ASSOC- well you know at the local level like you say when when a tiny high school like mine does some stupid religious thing it's going to cost the town or whoever it is a this is one case of the hundreds of lawsuits that that Donald Trump has spawned a presidential salary so it's yes that's fine yeah yeah the federal government has has overall paid out six and a half six point six five million in w Bush I would I would there is no limit of things that I would do to bring back President George H Man Okay David you're saying even worse when it's like a smaller whatever you know obviously at the federal level we we don't really it's hard to be that mad about seven end so hint hint Congress for important legal proceedings before the US Senate the army decided that ten million dollars but it's it's more like a the idea that conservatives don't care that that his positions are causing all this money they don't care a party of fiscal it's not something that only a Russian stooge would do but it's definitely something that a Russian stooge would do the smartest way to hire here we dive open skies and Hours okay what do you have for us today Mr Medium dive yeah so we learned earlier this week that Donald Trump is McCarthy I guess we'll have to say he's the second most evil nation's history though we're going to hire a lawyer to present their case on national television instead of you know five minute chunks of congressman grandstanding for no good reason just the open skies treaty is of course a Republican initiative right it was passed in nineteen ninety two under President George H D Oh has ads anyway so the man that the army hired was Joseph Welch he was a lawyer from Boston and I ended up these stupid arguments cost more tax payer dollars in legal fees on both sides now yeah and and look again doesn't prove that trump is a Kremlin asset but the kind of thing that Russia would reward one of its asset so okay what is this keep that one in mind sure so anyway so look we learned about that this week turns out that this has been in the works for over a year I think we might get a quick little impromptu live performance where we think yeah down down Rabat's slide that might help with that hold on this is sorta that's what I think maybe you might mean all the graphics here were Loving Yeah Prepared by Thomas so acidifying seriously considering abrogating the Open Skies Treaty I'm Gonna I'm GonNa tell you what that means obviously but here's the summary The quick take down that is a load off my mind that's the only way Congress can get the hymns ads though between nevermind patrons idea right let's see I will not have you the Smerch the name of the Matrix best does so good we can no yeah same with all the golf trips that I think I saw was what what was the two hundred and fifty years of presidential salary was even more they don't care but but it's a big deal at the lower level he he has this he had alleged that Communists had infiltrated the US government including the army nine thousand nine hundred fifty four McCarthy continued the one play that he has in his playbook that is alleging that yeah all right so for for normies we're GonNa have more of that live show and for patrons while a little little bonus Andrew opening arguments is brought to you by Ziprecruiter eh but but the background begins in nineteen fifty four right at the height of the red scare we had nineteen fifty four Joseph suggests that give me ten years eleven and twelve I think five and pending worldwide the people are communists and have infiltrated various organizations and he alleged that one of welches own staffers was a secret communist one of the junior lawyers on the staff Welsh looked into the camera and delivered one of the most famous lines in American history where I'm going with us right here's what he said might look like here Senator Frank Sparta said that the open skies treaty permits each state party to conduct short-notice unarmed reconnaissance flights over the other territories the entire territory the treaty shockingly the Soviets did not go for this treaty but the Post McCarthy a broken and defeated man so good things used to happen yeah Yoda mountain does have a peak oh you're spying on us you know we're spying on you let's do it out in the open I found a copy separate the warmongers from the Peacemakers at a time when the American people yearn for Peace Now Lyndon Johnson was planning to challenge for the presidency to begin with the ultimate politician than Senate majority leader Lyndon B Johnson publicly praised the initiative and said quote this will and and today we think about that as being the turning point for Joseph McCarthy right so as if to prove that Yodel mountain was alive and well back in the owns Welsh said let us not assassinate this lead further senator you've done enough at long last have you no sense of decency Sir the Senate was debating whether to censure McCarthy thirteen thousand souls gathered together and Oh yeah we can swear in the live shows nineteen fifties it didn't quite happen that way right this was in July June excuse me as late as November nineteen fifty four when the American public really loved the idea Eisenhower's offer brought him some of the highest approval ratings of his presidency for somebody who was a pretty popular craft to make unlimited surveillance flights over the United States if they would allow us to do the same and the idea is we have open skies we to so that's another benefit so thirteen thousand fulls got together at Madison Square Garden to hold a rally in support of tailgate are Joe to try and pressure the Senate not to expel or censure him turns out that wasn't enough he was censured by said I have an artist's rendering of what he he he was ostracized by his fellow Republicans treated as a laughing stock in the media after that and died three years later at age forty eight specifically designed to enable observation of military and now you should know this Terry Treaty was signed in one thousand nine hundred to the observation technology oh for it and it took four decades for a version of this to come back into the public is and signed on March Twenty Fourth Nineteen Ninety two so what the hell does this have to do with the Open Skies Treaty in the shadow of this kind of post McCarthyism moment July of nineteen fifty five if President Eisenhower came up with a plan to try and lower our fears at the height of the Cold War of surprise attacks and he came up with a plan to allow Soviet air troop movements won't be able to see if you are bringing military equipment into a threatening position right the observation aircraft have sensors that enable that ways to collect data on military forces and activities and again remember this is that nineteen fifties ideal of hey if we're flying over your territory will be able to observe it was obsolete even for nineteen ninety-two right the idea is not to allow super high resolution scanning all the way in but to be able to distinguish particularly the eastern former eastern bloc nations of the old Soviet Union The way it works is you as a party to the attack from a truck which we could do even in one thousand nine hundred thirty four signatory nations it's most of Europe and has twenty four hours to acknowledge that request and they can choose they can say you can use your own plane or you can use one of our planes right and then in nineteen sixty so complementing. A sitting president means that that was unbelievably popular across the political spectrum at the time notwithstanding that the Soviets and then there's a bunch of other logistical stuff it's not really important you get the idea but it sounds like okay the idea is let's try to maybe not kill each other twenty four hours before the flight you have to give them the flight plan and say all right we're GONNA fly over X Y and Z. Okay so I'm going to I'm going to skip over the technology we talked about that a little bit ultimately it's helped reduce the tensions between nations that were formerly at each other's throats during the Cold War the second is actual gathering of intelligence in addition to its reducing tensions and and so what I what with nukes so yeah let's let's find a way it's all these tensions we're really high it's all these ways to be like is there something we can do that like obviously is not going to work if Russia's just like no we're fine this has been a good thing for two reasons the first is the principles that that Thomas that you talked about the vision that Eisenhower had overflow in the United States seventy times right so we've used it three times as often it's unquestionably bene- benefit to us in terms of not doing anything we both nobody trust each other so we need to be able to actually see what's happening but it's a weird kind of counterintuitive thing I never thought honestly I didn't know about the streets well the Russians treat cheating on the treaty and they allege we're cheating on the treaty and so we can't hold them to that why should we the US to give seventy two days seventy two seventy two hours notice that you're going to overfly the country so three days and then the host country yeah I can dig up right is there is an argument that the current satellite technology right because again remember and across democratic and Republican administrations the United States has agreed to continue the treaty and the Russians want the truth I need to know what those are and why they're nonsense right there are basically two arguments that they are going to make number one they're going to say trolled per per year it's forty two per nation since one thousand nine hundred ninety two the United States has overflown Russia two hundred ten times and Russia Hold ourselves to this treaty right that's their that's their first argument this argument has been made rather consistently for the last twenty years we've all been like gasoline over the idea that there's there's he was never a Russian stooge that was absurd Rachel maddow has been making up stuff all day looking right now who has said this treaty is bad for the United States I have found some that have said it's maybe not that useful mind you on a wedge shape when you own a piece of land you own a wedge shape from that land out into space right and so we movements right so you don't need to zoom in from a satellite right but but also like really want to get to is the arguments because if trump does this republicans are going to make a whole bunch of pretextual arguments so it's more than just symbolic right like the open skies treaty provides us with actual useful intelligence we have the same number of flights that are worried that he was maybe doing things in Russia's interest not in the United States interest rate I mean is there any other explanation for that so the only other explanation eighty blown up so I'll just let you draw your own conclusions from that that was back to that one yeah I thought that we had agreed like okay we can each look at everybody's stuff just so maybe we don't kill each other that the idea that's exactly right and so trump wants to get rid of that correct for to be able to zoom in on Russia and as it turns out it takes longer to reposition the satellites than it does to give twenty it's nonsense but then you see this and like thirty other examples of this exact thing where it's like we were pretty reasonable to be four hour flight plan notice on the right so if you think they're secretly moving troops you can say all right we're doing a flight and we're going to the defensive argument right like it's not an argument that says the treaty has bad for the United States right like I cannot find a we can't have satellites in permanent orbit over Russian airspace to get out there the satellites have to reposition themselves in the not that useful argument is not that good argument right for a lot of reasons right number one because remember that the Intel that you're gathering are things like tree and if you miss something an airplane can turn around and double back and take another picture of it and all of that is permitted within the when I saw the satellite thing I was like okay well that makes sense and then I looked at like how spy satellites work the way in which you were airspace works is you own report coming out and then Glenn Greenwald's of the world and everybody else saying Oh you idiot liberals you lip heart you stupid lift whatever Andrew said in the intro deep the treaty in space and in place and and and that is the pictures that you take week to get there so I didn't know that planes also have more flexibility in their flight paths right so you can divert off right go over here and give you the flight plan and we can discover that and they only have twenty four hours to move their stuff if they've got secret stuff in the way whereas if we're moving a satellite that takes told you the the cameras that are authorized by the treaty were at I envisioned these has like the camcorders that your mom had like when you were growing or constructing weapons of mass destruction that turned out to be like baby food factories and the like and I'm serious the United States intelligence I took these pictures just like you did in two thousand and two right the idea that these are publicly validated and shared across all the member nations he's so the difference between gathering proprietary. US pictures that everyone's going to be like Oh yeah right yeah oh yeah the CIA took a reputation for the veracity of our intelligence took a huge hit with that debacle from which we really haven't fully recovered right eighteen to keep popping in and out of it right and and notice by the way that that argument is only around our age may remember a little debacle of Colin Powell going to the UN and saying we have proof of Iraqi sites well my record predictions is doing great right bill bars orange jumpsuit testifies to that side right and so all of that are like the technical reasons but there's one really really comprehensive reason to want to keep sophisticated satellites now so we don't need the crappy cameras that are on the open skies and they just have one vh tape that tape that says Christmas as part of the Open Skies Treaty are shared among all the signatory member nations and some of you who may be credibility with international cooperation which I think I'm starting to see why trump doesn't want to do this so but do you think this'll be the kind of thing virgin strength in the form of tweets about being kind of troubled about stuff and no action so you would you put it in that category do you think Republicans will bother trying to jump on board with US really really important when you want to try and build a coalition to say hey hey look like there are serious troop problems here so we bolster I mean I don't interrupt but I do want to ask the big question of like what possible reason because we feel like we've all been gas lit a lot what would the muller I don't know how much further how much you know how willing I am to go beyond that but but look it is and as part of the ongoing narrative of the Russian she okay yeah and so as as it turns out in in his administration back on the the the incidence with the Kurds and Syria and all that do you think this would be maybe more in that category where we'll get some amazing shows collapse of the trump administration you could see that causing which now as for what can happen we actually covered this back in episode two fourteen originalist position because article six section two of the constitution is super duper clear right like I get I get when we this was our old friend none just disability right the supreme court was like you know there are lots of cases we're not going to think about and one of them is foreign policy right he's probably wrong it probably does violate the constitution but your remedy there is impeachment or whatever your remedy is not coming to us really really clear president can unilaterally abrogate treaties this shouldn't be the case it makes no sense from an are you can't unilaterally abrogate the supreme law of the land and the Supreme Court said maybe can we don't really know gene with trump's threat to unilaterally pull out of NAFTA and as it turns out residents like the Supreme Court mccarter unilaterally withdrew from the salt two treaty to Strategic Arms Limitation Talks Treaty and members of Congress sued too up if you're going to like this huge thing with VHS or whatever that they're bad resolution cameras right and so there's an argument that says look we have these super the buildings all across the country with Carter and and look this case is called goldwater versus Carter Barry Goldwater pursue fourteen like I had a bunch of people tweeted me and they were like a dumb ass the constitution specifically says that treaties shall be the Supreme Law of the land thing gift to get for your loved one for a family member maybe even just for you if you want to have a really nice beautiful painting and I picked out trump is doing whatever he's doing we'll see if we can put an end to that someday but opening arguments is brought to you by paint your life folks I will never forget when I showed my wife and it's one of these super fractured procuring opinions but but again basically what it amounts to is if the president and judges in every state shall be bound thereby and anything in the Constitution or laws of any state contrary notwithstanding so you're wrong and I'm right and and I wrote back in an absolute right like national security is an should be a core Republican area that they ought to care about is whether a president we're not going to allow a sitting congress to sue a sitting president for how he's carrying out Richard on deep dive that was would you say I would say that was a deep dive actually so you got more than you bargained for all right well thank you for that I'm terrified as always done by hand by a world class artists created from your favorite photo it makes a perfect gift for birthdays anniversaries and you choose the artists whose work most being a so I want to know what the process is like having and then be our no it feels like for now anyway that Republicans are kind of pushing back I just saved it Senate over the folks at paint your life and I had no idea what to expect I didn't know what it was gonna be I thought it sounded cool I was thirty percent off your painting that's right thirty percent off and free shipping to get this special offer text the word away two four eight four eight four eight that's does it there's nothing you can do about it so there you go yeah that was that was not how I plan to end this segment but that was a medium dive that I think blown away I really was when it arrived it is so beautiful is something I'm going to treasure for ever truly I mean that's going to hang in the in the kids room liar and work with them throughout the process until every detail is perfect and there's no risk if you don't love the final painting your money is refunded it see who knows I'll have it for years and years so it may change locations but we planned always have that thing hung up because it's beautiful it really is just such an amazing percents to say hey look treaties were salt too was ratified by Congress and it says it's the supreme law of the land and whatever you are Jimmy like the price for the peanuts them was like double triple the price made so much money on that peanut farm that's why so good check it out everybody brought to you by much Ed Okay so you know in times past when I've a frame I really liked it lets you customize it it's amazing so if you want to give a truly meaningful gift you've gotta try paint Your Life Dot Com two four eight four eight four eight one more time texts OA two four eight four eight four eight message and data rates may apply the Supreme Court to to make him abide by the treaty guys remember that time when Jimmy Carter charged foreign leaders to state as peanut farm and he charged them You have an original painting of yourself your children your family a special place or chairs pet at a price you can afford from paint your life dot com this is a true painting law and see if Andrew could could could guess well you know I was thinking though lately Republicans are bowed as bad as sovereign citizens anyway the Painting I had done by paint your life it is of Lydia and phoebe on the beach in Hawaii it was already a beautiful photo grabbed it off of instagram which Republican responded by saying quote I doubt the China comment was serious he loves to beat the press. Here's your options ready Lindsey Graham Missouri he's he's a guy and then I mean the Bar Exam Commission makes a truly special gift for someone you love or I guess that for you maybe you want done for you or your for your pet either way and here's the offer right now as limited time offer orgasm becomes president it's entirely possible he doesn't even know or care that such a thing as possible once his wife made a commendable attempt at faking an orgasm but then really was so much fun you know the fact that I just so brilliantly got that right does a little bit ruined my next our next bit here which is now a tradition of life shows immediately ruling out Lindsey Graham because Lindsey Graham would have said just repeated the exact question back sought revenge on you in a public way I mean I have gone we've gone to the sovereign citizen well to find out what those Kooks think about that be Marco Rubio see Roy Blunt or D Donald Trump junior all right let's see which is Thomas's bar exam revenge how many people get that reference anybody the picture yet one that is from a fish called Wanda is one of my favorite movies it's the bar they like to mess with you I'm issue spotting issues about exactly anyway this man said the following on national TV quote China should start an investigation into the I so I'm torn I was I was I was tempted I D is an attractive distracter I think I'm torn between Rubio and blunt until this moment senator I think I'd never really gauged your cruelty or your recklessness and then McCarthy tried to interrupt with his usual bluster and even asleep the nation's highest priority is investigating what Joe Biden didn't China so I'm I'm eliminating Lindsey Graham Marco Rubio is tempting but I'm Gonna I'm GonNa go with Blunt Okay the answer you've gone with blunt let's find out if you got it right you got wow here's the thing that's reporter was completely irrelevant to anything he was doing so from that point on she usually just lay motionless and wait for him to be done anyway this I put in those Russian you think thinks you haven't even done the that like they think you're just talking from nothing here let me show you the Constitution oh there's a constant just because of the defense he loves to beat the Press but Yeah Talk Donald Trump junior I don't I don't think he knows what the word Bait means so it it does indeed say that but as it turns out since one thousand nine hundred ninety nine grammy the confidence of some dude quote in the country they don't they assume you know and that sounds like well no yeah I was really tempted for Donald trump junior because what joe what Joe Biden did in China by the way did you do anything in China anyway nobody knows but Graham would have said well an wins because what happened in China just about as bad as what happened with Ukraine quote fact pattern now you get answers bar questions based on that fact pattern so Rubio Rubio was the attractive distracter but I hate you embarrass you actually know enough to know that happens with me in the bar sometimes I don't know so I've got some questions for you here's a fact pattern you know the bar exam loves to do this as long fact pattern a man who's lived seventy three years without ever giving a woman would've had to have shown up so there's twitter though John Roy Blunt is he still the governor GonNa put Rubio back in because you because you gave me there that he could do this on twitter so he could actually be where wherever the hell it is Marco Rubio spends his days that's not on the floor of the Senate a guy drew a knife on me and he's like give me your wallet Oh my God wait is this a real burglary or are you trying to trying to rid me this is a range like you got me I think you did it to provoke you to ask me and others to get outraged by it he plays a violin and everybody falls right in request so I started a legal question for you Andrew the other day he actually had a very similar quote is trying to mess you up here because his quote was quote this was Rubio I don't think that's a real request I think he did Gig you guys reporters I would I would need to know is he and androgynous person that's a that's a call back to the New York live show if you didn't get that Oughta give me your wallet but not really like I give him the wallet but was that a crime or so some measure of well wishes from his opponents Mitch McConnell something that something that could only be said if four is D- I think four is is Romney Kevin McCarthy is a lying sack of so lawyer so you gotTa do it statement one quote I'm pretty sympathetic with what the president has gone through I have never seen in my lifetime a president after being elected not having that he likes to use before you know sending a sternly worded crunch rap over to the White House but I think I think all right we can go one at a time if you aren't like we can do one you can tell me who you think it is yeah I think four is Mitt Romney lifetime started in two thousand and not before two thousand eight when Barack Obama had absolutely no measure of well wishes from any of his so can you match the statement the Republican of Republican to who made it so I'm GonNa give you some sorry let me give you a statement no since there are not really one out of four one out of two thousand I can go with in an any other foreign nation with which he may have engaged in inappropriate conduct so here your choices so you get to mix and match representative Butler Senator Johnson quote what the President has done is incredibly serious and it would be an abdication of my constitutional duty an insult to the office I hold to not support a full investigation into his conduct regarding Ukraine senator blevins Senator Blevins I'm GonNa go with with it's anyway second quote here quote you watch what the president said he's not saying China should be investigated and then the bar helps out here because it reminds you of the fact pattern of all righty ready for question to bring it on okay can you this is this is tough because this is actually like multiple multiple thing the defense of what he didn't really commit the crime he said he was doing he's just joking is that a good does that work can you do that nope okay so now is I think the worst of those guys up there so I e let's see I know it's a tough one I gave you a lot that should also tell me how many combination this is my first I'm seeing this now I'm just kidding I'm GonNa give you four statements and then you have to try to match who said that it's going to be kind of tough but bar exams it's hard to be at B. D. Okay let's find out how you did be so number one is Senator Johnson Another statement three quote I feel that my loyalty to the Republican Party does not relieve me of the obligation which I have who and final statement so the only thing is represented Butler happens to be m Caldwell Butler who wrote this in a letter to his mother about standing up to Nixon during Watergate so fact pattern reminder direct quote China should start an investigation into the Biden's so just that's why also trump stills never sexually says buy it also remind you that Senator Blevins Senator Romney Representative McCarthy so give me one extra to try to what do you think it's Kinda hard but what do you got about it so not only did back then a Republican stand up to the president of the United States the most powerful member of their party he also wanted against his own mom in the process learn for a for one and Johnson for three finally order is a d there is any meaningful Republican response to trump so I think I should get half credit for the I mean sorry doesn't apply to trump just FYI his mom didn't want him to stand up to Nixon like she was I'm pretty sympathetic with the president's through I've never seen in my lifetime of president after being elected not have some measure of well-wishers from his opponents that's an incredible quote like stupidity can meet him up and I made the quote up so while it's totally what senator blevins would say center blevins also isn't real well and that was that was that was good I those first two I think we're tough they could have really been either or let's find out what three is threes threes representative Butler it's not the question but okay so so I'm GonNa say to is easy to to the worst and McCarthy removed from office on impeachment etc etc unless the vice president is a Christian Weirdo who calls his wife mother in which case it's best to just oh mama we back now we are now in the now times we have dignity so the future they might not but now we got actually stand up the rule of law and he did throw college votes in his next election so that that's that's possible could be that based on what we've seen lately see quote the president shall be or just yeah because then try and work backwards Romney could also be three because that's the kind of weasel words most of time travel to the future and verified that the Senate will actually convict otherwise the president by rule will gain an automatic ten point approval bump in every poll and be granted an extra two hundred it from office etcetera etcetera unless those high crimes are done in full view of the public on something called TV so that could be that that that's very ten or the final answer where are we go there we another fact pattern owner one owned a lot on a hilltop owner to the neighboring lot in the valley below in the spring knowing that senator blevins was made up I know I I was going to help you morano sorry I helped you more harder by saying representative blevins because it could be that let's see what's what's the next one the president shall be removed from office on impeachment four and conviction of treason bribery and other high crimes and misdemeanors but the how should only vote to impeach if and get it right but I I appreciate your reasoning that was a good that wasn't either or let's see what to is to is easy so that's McCarthy you got that one right right okay so that's that's that one let's find out what's what's four yes that senator blevins lung and it's so blevins you know it sounds exactly like what he would say the only problem is like water from the melting snow on owner one's lot flowed downhill where owner one captured it and used it to water his crops recently owner one dug a trench on his land captured the water from the melting snow all right and I and I WANNA point out that Thomas and I never coordinate on these questions never so right okay all right it's D- We all know is the okay what else we got a couple more here we only that okay let's see jurisdiction may owner to recover the cost of the alternate water source from owner one your answers a yes because only one may not alter the natural flow of surface water be apply to something like melting snow because that's not a river or an aquifer so I am going to go with option on May alter the natural flow of surface water to use in connection with his own land how do you like it. The President shall be removed from office on impeachment and conviction of treason bribery or other high crimes and misdemeanors period emphasis mine used to water his own crops owner to purchase an alternate source of water for his crops because the water no longer flows to land the lots are located in riparian thank God I got that right I would've looked like yes Mr lawyer you got the lawyer question exactly where we're both big winners today you nailed it I nailed it we're the best of the waited out also slavery is awesome reminders the seventeen hundreds and founding fathers are almost all giant pieces of so is that the correct that is super tempting yeah harian waterways have to do with slow hardest real property that's one of the dodgers relievers maybe it was in my mind Noah was devastated crack Jerry blevins reliever for all right here you go this is Tuck the constitutional law question so this might be right in your wheelhouse what's the correct text of article two section four of the constitution and we got nowhere we've got options quote the president should there's probably twelve of them but I'm GonNa go Senator Blevins give them give them a chance and I googled it there's never been the center there's like state Senator Levin all right because owner to suffered damages from the alteration of natural flow surface-water see no because owner one make captured diffuse surface water on his own land for any reason and Dino because owner he's all right so what are your top two choices will I was I was born in Springfield Illinois so that's not it relevant Jason Compass how much for that fame and fortune in the window Michael Blevins I'm donating Senator Blevins I'm donating hey I survived typhoon haggas and what that's a name I didn't catch that one and my apartment did too good for you I'm actually an amicus but what prevents you from doing is like when a stream runs through your backyard you can't damn up that stream and then 'cause see and the reason that so no women no and the reason that I prefer C to d is because in a right Perry and jurisdiction you may not alter the natural flow much to you as my wife does to Church Hot Speier DOT COM keep your valuables in your safe yourself safe the beach maybe you're safe safe at the beach too allege rob TJ's Delaware Law to L. Circle Alex Jones can't lose an appeal he never had after all that we've been through the I want to help you out with a Freebie do you know it do you actually know which one it is you remember from law school which is surface water in connection with your own land that would that would allow you to dam up the river so I think it's I feel pretty confident on that party Pooper Paulie okay resolve the United States should adopt a policy to deport Rudy Giuliani Impeach just as Beer Bong weenie waiver time for top patron Tuesday thinking are hall of famers are all time greats over on patriots dot com slash law and we start with mark delillo injury to the downs literally the downstream property owners but I don't believe that right Perrin rights eighties vibe Hav the US Constitution is the Ouija board of originalists wanting to something quarks is Murray Gregson Hillary twenty twenty number one supporter Miranda Devine the very hungry personal injury plaintiff lawyer Jennifer rallied deserves the next live show elbow of justice from the sky any second now and emily rainbows bents what do we want time travel when do we want it that's the yeah that's a reference to something that's some of you have heard concurrence concurrence rally deserves a live show also respectfulness fee nats nats that's that's woo yeah all right well that still applies nightmare on Pennsylvania Avenue Portland patrons for a Michelle cloud the trump school gas lighting and Presidential Library at Liberty University ad Astra per ASPERA Nick Drake's stuff and polls the best fictional bar ten forward is a close second the Oxford Comma is necessary comment and analysis has only three dots dot dot like that one this is my favorite podcasts though is a close second what can we do how do we know it's fine it's fine that's fine we'll the Cherokee get a representative in the House and Electoral Call Briefs Guy Alec Alec Key it's legal it's advice it's not legal advice dragonfly Eko books about nature and the environment reviews and interviews doc trying to slap Thomas Arthur to sheds Jackson James call the civil war will be live tweeted. What is your favorite Halloween Candy I know mine Dr Let's face it Chris clubbed wow I thought I thought I even typed out the explanation thinking like Oh hill forget what repairing is or whatever don't need tree names yeah dance the night away at the carbolic smoke ball Jennifer crash we're not lawyers but you can't take our advice some it's shuffleboard dot com the bit Yup join your labor union together we bargain alone we beg patron names about friendly atheists are so meta the time traveller who almost caused Napoleon Chemo Valley experts Australian red meat and craft beer trump stumped rudy moody and Bar Tarde let me be totally clear I like being totally clear the Heller honky theory of legal interpretation is pretextual Milo meed song representing you in Fruit Based Litigation Right Susan Oh dot Com Fridays at seven pm Eastern Valley Radio Live shown Seattle I've shown Seattle I've shown Seattle or Dakota Registry Matters podcast certainly worded tamales John Builder back the hundred houses will give you that yeah yeah those are those are amazing Jonathan Steele is a great dad fund anonymous Sam Buck Butter Cups Legal Services Eight three decide exactly what it says so exactly right Yeah I thought you might go for well you've won the Game Sir great thank you to Eric Hoffman Paints Trumpet America's Pastime

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RD - Impeachment Update, Flynn's Plea Change & Warren Snubs Bernie

Reasonable Doubt

1:02:43 hr | 7 months ago

RD - Impeachment Update, Flynn's Plea Change & Warren Snubs Bernie

"Thanks for listening to reasonable doubt on podcast one well. A JAM packed chock a block show filled with information and insights with me and the great one mark era. Go over there. Oh we get into do the impeachment stuff we get into How he arrived did his five million dollar CNN settlement gas? And what would that was based on in many other things. So you're gonNA enjoy this reasonable doubt. I I'll tell you about oracle the problem. Well Oracle net sweet. They're not the problem. The promise grown business got a hodgepodge of business systems. One for counting one for another for sales and other for inventory. It's a mass net suite by Oracle its management software. That handles all aspects of Your Business and easy to use cloud platform save time and money and headaches by managing sales finance accounting orders and HR instantly right from your desktop or phone. The world's number one cloud business system. That's Oracle net sweet and and you can schedule a free demo right now and receive a free guide. Seven key strategies to grow your profit that net sweet dot com slash slash down. Check it out and check it out for free. Set Up Your Free Demo and get your free guide today at net sweet dot com slash doubt doubt net sweet dot com slash doubt. ACS fans get it on on the NFL. Playoffs are here and you know what that means. We're getting closer and closer that finals Sunday of the season you've heard Adam rant about pass interference ball spotting field goalposts on the podcast. But now's your chance to experience. It live when you sign up for the newsletter Corolla newsletter DOT COM. You'll be automatically entered for a chance to win an all expense paid trip to Los Angeles to watch the last game of the season in the car. Museum with Adam and friends that's wings barbecue plenty of endless rant and hey it's Hollywood. So who knows. He'll be there so get the Corolla newsletter DOT COM. Today you and a friend may be flying out of the city of homeless angels to Hear Adam rant live about the spread sal made him bad on guerrilla newsletter DOT COM. Twenty five dollars. You get one take product from ever seen going month you get the drink you choose. It's odd to you. Heard Dick Twenty twenty is here and another year of atoms. Monthly nut is about to bust this ship and includes a Mr Burcham tape tape. Measure Z. You can remember the horrors of the jungle while marking not to buy four a wallet. Ninja credit card multi tool. There will come the time so you will save the day with a sack of aussies famous. Flank steak seasoning. You can make your meat taste just like Ozzy's and as always a bottle of your choosing the sixty dollar value is yours for only twenty five dollars. Sign up for one month or keep shipments coming so prep year males box awesome. Get ready for Adams monthly nut this Corolla digital this is reasonable doubt with your hosts Mark Garris and Adam. Yeah get it on got to get it on a judgment on a mandate get it on welcome to the best hour or so in the universe. It's reasonable doubt amount of curls Garriga our that Adam came up with a new. You know got a history of UH dementia or Alzheimer's in the family and apparently I've got early onset. The the Test Adam is giving is. Is you start to have trouble with your headphones. which and and I got a pair of Bose for Christmas and I do have trouble with those that I did this morning? Have trouble with these so well to country by ancestry. Oh you're twenty three and me which says I don't have the gene variant. Apparently I do well. We've had many a guest and it again. It doesn't didn't affect the twenty-three-year-old guys but the sixty three year old guys come in and they start putting their headphones on and one folds up like a dog's ear and so you're actually actually the back of the headphone your hand and then the other ones down but you're okay. You struggled a little bit the got it on. I'm back I'm here. I'll real but I'll tell you when when it's time for the cat scan. Yeah Wayne now. You're not there yet but you're GONNA get. I'm getting everybody. God Willing we all get to this place where we've had enough enough years on this earth where you climb into your son's car or younger person's car as a passenger and you start reaching for the the seat belt from the left side you know what I mean where you're like. My Dad would get in the car. I've got seatbelt. He'd get this finally get the seat balch. Then what's he had. He tried to plug it into the head visor. The dashboard like the next phase of this. Where to seat belt? Go like you lose so it has stepped up the seat belt. So the same thing with this headphone. That's that's that's your experience. Your lane early sixties as we you get into the late seventies early eighties then the seat belt struggle comes well th on this special. What is this our second episode of Twenty Twenty and as has were recording this so that people understand for not as freshmen? You're listening they've they're voting to send the articles over to the Senate And they've named seven house managers including Jerry Nadler and I Adam Schiff Who are the others Gary? Do you know off the top of your head because I think that the selection is interesting and at the same time. What's playing out there? There's I documents that are being released and the documents that are being released. One of my favorites was yesterday. There's a guy named Hyde. Have you seen this guy hide. He's running for Congress and apparently he's texting somebody. They're talking about Whether or not that. The ambassador is being surveilled over in Ukraine. Yes okay but email right the female and The WHO testified and so the immediate reaction of some was that this is horrific which it would be if it were true if her telling her but then I decided sighted to do a little what I would do if this guy was a juror. Just guy was adjourned fact somebody had asked me. The other guys are tied Joyce's position. He's running for Congress. Now I I think he runs a Gary gardening outfit or something. Let me look. We're just to go back to your last question. The members the managers are going to be Shift Nadler Hakeem Jeffries. Jason Crowe Val demings Zoe lofgren and Sylvia Garcia interesting. So lofgren is California. But that's that's an interesting I think. So that's an interesting choice. I mean Nadler Schiff I understood I think I would have picked. There are other people who were I. Think more worthy or has shown more surveillance. You gotta see this hype Guy. I mean Gary you can pull this up because one of the things I do with. Prospective jurors do a quick kind of social media Search because there's a good way to determine who you're dealing with. I mean you can look at somebody's twitter account. I'm not on instagram. Very is right there so one look. What are you thinking so far? Okay so you see this this guy. He's a jerk when we're looking at the guy he's it's it's it's it's tainted a little bit because he's standing next to trump holding a thumbs up. Obviously if you've standing next Obama holding a thumbs up you'd have different thoughts about it. But I don't know this guy this guy I'm cowboy weinstock ripping of Republican partisanship. And it's very true. I've I've when someone writes me tweet. That says a Douche bag a hack and I don't WanNa talk about it I just click on their picture and then it should says Dolphin love her million pussy march on it and I go I. I have some perspective I if I click on it when they when they're hater Ho I then and see that it. Somebody who was a well thought fought of intellectual. I'll take it to heart right right absolutely so okay so looks like. He's a poster child for Republican correct. And I believe he's running for Congress Now to her credit. You ever watch Claire mccaskill. Yes Okay Claire. mccaskill who lost in. She was a senator lost in Missouri. The commentator I don't even know what network I think it's MSNBC NBC. And I was watching her the other day there. She's okay she did. I think a pretty good analysis of exactly what I was thinking. And that's why things are GonNa Nelson. She said okay. Well first of all I don't know this guy but and I think she had done the same thing that you and I do. She kind of looked at twitter page. He he could. She said this could. Just be one of the crazies who wants a picture taken with the president. He's not running he's in the he's a hair on you know. I always worry sorry about that. You don't want to give the guy too much credibility because what if what if I don't know but when I went and looked took a look it had all the earmarks six of crazy and untrue. I what's his yeah. So what's his assertion his assertion actually now coming around to at first it was that he was texting and I think Gary was at that they were text with left par correct act. Okay so love. Partners is the client of Rudy Giuliani who was indicted in the southern district. Who's now apparently cooperating? With the house was US Komo operating with the House and there are texts between this guy hide and partners which seemed to suggest that they've got the ambassador under surveillance surveillance. There's love so who's WHO's has them under surveillance that that's that's the the issue because if if you turn on Cable News you'll never get to that point all you'll get is dreadful is reporting about. Oh my God what are we doing to protect attack the ambassadors. You know. They're under the under surveillance. SAY HOLD ON I. Can we just kind of check and do a little source analysis of where we're getting this information nation from and that's where I got the information from but this guy is in the the wheelhouse and world of left parties who also Levin. What's the other guy's name as eager? Something like cartoon characters the cartoon characters Mafia type Ukraine Russia or Furman. Yeah I the the cast of characters see I would think you as a comedian because I just it's hard for me to believe because having a history in representing what the government used to refer to was the Armenian organized crime people on Lob Lod had for years on the most. Your neighbors are both Glock. Glendale I used to be entertained by this. You know there is a type who due at the breakup of the Soviet Union who immigrated and who for lack of a better term. They almost fit the Boris and Natasha. Pasha Cartoon Character Runs Rocky Bowl. wiggles I guys are straight out of central Caswell that this is a very good question that you're are uniquely qualified to answer. I have said for a long time that we as human beings unfairly judged people bowl on an aesthetic so when you see the fat guy with the Triple Chin and you say nine year old who do you want flying your airplane that guy or the guy it looks like George Clooney they go the guy looks like he's got to be a much better pilot because he's too busy getting laid in high school and probably can't fly playing as good as the fat fat guy but we do that and I was thinking about it as it pertains on I brought it up on my show I brought up Richard Jewell jewell. You see Richard. You'll go look at it you know. He's up to some tax guy sexual fasting for the Olympic Park bomber by the away last week. Somebody tweeted once again that me well. Now you've perpetuate it Richard Jewel to me. I use for shorthand for falsely accused by the government right Richard Jewell represents and by the way I was well aware of every time Adam mentions Duke Lacrosse. I automatically and have for years thought Richard Joe. That's where I first came into contact with Lynnwood and and new Lynn before Gary Condit or anything else so and you may want to pick up a pencil. Don't get ready to break it but Michael F Nadi benefited as that guy. Sharp guy looks like he knows with look he knows what he's doing that guy knows what he's doing eh. That guy look at him and you know he's up to something then you look at that kind of what he's doing now. Neither one of them know that jewel didn't do anything. Hang on. Ati doesn't know what he's still but we just decide based on an aesthetic and there when you say he was too busy gate late nights will there is something. I you've probably used a variation on this. I don't know that we've ever talked about it. I always say you can kind of determine because for for prosecutors I always say prosecutors. There is a there is a strain of people who become prosecutors. who were not the guys who were getting late night? School right and there is a element of kind of wreaking vengeance on the guys who are getting laid in high school. It's always you kind of I know it's very very facile my prosecutorial buddies You know okay accept it but there there you can you. Can you tend to look at a lot of life through high school. Look at every agent at William Morris Endeavor every agent of ever dealt with pretty much much in. This town is a guy who didn't get laid in high school and now he's got an axe to grind like every twenty four year old blonde. That comes into the office. They're now they're all there for the hacking they're overcompensating. Of course look anyone look. I grew up poor four. I grew up in a disorganized household. I grew up in chaos and clutter. I now. Don't like you know Mike organized closet get the stuff why we need to stuff where it goes. It's an in overcompensation for that. I have I have two hundred million tools because I had no tools growing up. It's Shit Shit at our age that you had no tools growing up because the the red toolbox the craftsman. Yeah that was like in high school. I starting junior equitas that it was not only ubiquitous you. If you didn't get that for Christmas you were a loser. I mean if you didn't have I was a loser but they're you know what I mean. It was a it was a big deal. In fact I always felt like the loser out out of the three boys in the family because Mike and Matt got the these wonderful abner box. Yeah my brothers. I didn't get it and I said how come they get it. I don't mind it goes you're it's just not you know it's weird later on. I bought one for myself but I used it in my bedroom as a chet like a chest of drawers drawers. I can see that because it's very it's very nice. 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No credit card required goto fresh books dot com slash doubt. Enter reasonable doubt. Do that right now in the how did you hear about US section fresh books so hello now back to this so now. They're speaking of the house managers. Adam Schiff is you know always declare my My biased biased towards Adam. Except my consternation when when and if drew runs against him I may have to kind of navigate. Says he's not running. Yeah well I said last week. There's no way Susan is going to let drew no way. Can I ask a broad question. Yes is there any so the Democrats are we got this evidence. We got that evidence. And we'RE GONNA HAVE WE'RE GONNA look at this document and we're GonNa talk to that person. Is there any amount of damning evidence that could ever get a percentage of Republicans to just swing-over in this. This is what I think if you were to do. I- hypothetical situation and the way that Mitch McConnell and by the way in the before I was very complimentary I thought Pelosi was be you know had strategically kind of game the Senate but obviously the Senate reacted in their pivot. I think is Taken back the narrative that you know if it was so urgent why didn't you send this thing over. And the is we've done before I always I always compare this to a criminal proceeding where there's a pop probable cause proceeding whether it's a preliminary hearing grand jury indictment and now it's time to go to the the court the trial court so to speak. Which is the Senate in this case? And the what the Senate has said is Mitch. McConnell has done a very kind of savvy thing he said I'm going to institute institute the same rules we had twenty years ago that were adopted unanimously by the Senate and the clinic. Clinton which is we will hear the opening statements. The the the house managers are akin to the prosecution. Whoever trump's defenders are going to be whoever they ended up naming whether that's J. Sokolow and PAT chip Leoni? The White House counsel then will take a vote at that point as to whether we hear witnesses well if there are four Republicans that's basically what you need. Four Republicans to sign on for witnesses. And who would the witness be the. I think the one and that. If you're honest you would have to say you. Want to hear from his John Bolton because all of these at least two of the seventeen witnesses were dirt. He was a direct report report. And they have indicated that he said Indicia a were statements of. I don't WanNa be part of this drug deal. I don't know what Rudy's cooking up in this drug drug deals. Something like that having been in a similar situation I think you would want to hear from Bolton now. Is that going going to move the needle. I don't know until we see him what he's got to say. But it's obvious to me at least that either. He's got a book deal and so he wants to remain relevant and so therefore he's going to do something but for those who make our that bias argument the same time he said that real time. If you believe the the people who testified under oath that he identified it didn't want anything to do with it and got the heck out of dodge was either fired or quit bolted. I think would be the key witness long answer to that. But that's who might move the needle having said that there's the political calculation. What senator unless it's somebody who's either retiring or not up for re election for the next six years or four years is going to take on trump other than Mitt Romney who's in Utah and where Utah has got a peculiar uniquely a situation. I mean Mike Lee the other. US Senator Who's the one who came out of the briefing room and said it was the worst briefing. He'd ever seen by Pompeo when it had to do with Sola money in the killing. How long do you think this will go on for? I think they want to get this done before February fourth. I think it's the fourth which would be the state of the Union so that he can stand in the well of the house and shove it right back up the house and say I was acquitted. Do you guys were scammed this. It was all a hoax. I think that's what the Senate would like to do All right so let's shift gears. What are you working on? What can you talk about? I think we sort of teased. He's last week that there was some stuff that was brewing. That you couldn't really get to but you might be able to get to it This week I can't remember. It was a small at case. Yeah Yeah Well I. We had the The knowledge that there were search warrants executed excuted Unfortunately I got some. I got an email right before I came here. So I can't talk about the one thing I wanted to talk about but I will move for two One of the things that I think is interesting it. We've talked about before which is happening. We've talked a lot about general general. Flynn and we've talked about the fact that For those of you who are in the weeds. General Flynn for about a month. Was the national security advisor in the White House famously. your handsome A woman sally. Yates came ever worn them next thing you know the FBI was in their next thing. You know he's Terminated supposedly the public statement was for Lying the Mike Pence enters a plea league does cooperation at one. Point gets in front of Judge Sullivan. Who says you better cooperate some more because from what I've seen I think you've betrayed your country and I'm not about to go along along with a no time plea deal or no time recommendation from the US government? He then and he was his lawyers were from Covington and burling which which is a very well respected Big Firm in Washington. DC and we oppose them. We meaning Garretson arrogance when they represented the NFL fell and They have very fine lawyer on the opposite side On on that case and I was always impressed with them but Covington burling Roland was then substitute out by Sydney Powell. Sydney Powell for those of you who watch Fox News as a commentator who takes kind of anti a law enforcement stands. She's not afraid to challenge law enforcement which if you're in the trenches and criminal defense you have to be willing willing to do. She's taken a more combative role now and just filed this week a motion for him. Meaning Flynn Lynn. After he's cooperated to withdraw his plea says that the government by the governments change their position now wants him to do jail time and she's saying they breached the plea agreement and she's withdrawn the in the weeds. The grounds for that are that he tried to cooperate with the government government but when his business partner went on trial the government wanted. This is his position. Meeting Flynn's government wanted him to sing from a script upped. That was not true. He wouldn't do it. That guy was convicted but then the judge on the motion for new trial said there wasn't enough evidence. There kicked out the conviction. It's up on appeal appeal. I mean with lanre with anybody you could go. Flynn on one side. Hunter Biden on the other. It just feels like the second you start scratching and poking around you just find enough now. The question is what do you do with that enough. And that's where the system seems was unfair because some people everyone has something or so it seems it. It's sort of like I always say the chief. The EX chief judge judge Alex Kozinski famously said. There isn't any adult walking around. Who if the government wanted? They couldn't find three federal violations right right so now it's this were in a weird area. Where if the government wants to set its sights on you then they will find enough because we're all there's all enough I mean everyone? There's just enough if you have more than three and a half employees. If you're older than fifty years old I will your taxes taxes quarterly if you own more than one property. There's always going to be enough right. And that's one of the reasons. I love following to particular People on twitter one is bad legal. Takes the other is a federal crime day or crime the crime day and in fact the guy wrote a book Senate to me and I you know I live in that world and have lived in that world for almost forty years and their stuff in there I had never never even knew was a was a crime. Never I mean you just can't keep a handle on. They tell me what you think of this. There's a story. Gary confined it out of Canada. Canada recently Canada's. You know it's kind of weird because here we are the United States. Canada is way more progressive than we are a via long shot. And then Mexico's full anarchy so weird kind of position weird neighbors to be inbetween you know. Oh one of them's like crazy narco-state where like everyone is on everyone on the grass. My father used to say with. I'd say why can't we go to Mexico since they don't have rid of abused Corpus. Take the take the silver or take the lead. That's how it works over there and then there's Canada which is ruber woke. Judge just came down on I. It was a fifteen year old kid who was transitioning or whatever and the dad didn't want the kid to take the hormone shots and all the usual rigmarole and the judge said that if a a an officer I heard the father refer to The now her as a ham like me if he called them in Sun if somebody Overheard that he could be arrested. I think I saw the picture but I think what's his name. Our our guest. We had sat. Oh Yeah Got John. That's right yeah. This has been one of his. You know one of his caused braves and And I can see where I understand what the judge is saying. Judge thing if this is a protected class Low expert Canadian law. But I'll give it a through the prism America if this is a protected class and if you are denigrating grading that a wildly expensive view of either child abuse or something else would would that would fall under it. I don't know whether the judge as as you described it was being sarcastic was pushing back or was trying to you know a lot of times judges will say. Is this what you're telling me I was as you know. We had a case last week in Utah where the judge repeatedly asked the government that the government was owning some ridiculous positions and that is a a kind of a technique that a lot of judges do so I would wanna know going back to one of your little views of statutory construction. When you you hear a story? That sounds absurd. You always WANNA do dig a little deeper because it there generally is a explanation for Gary Can Yeah I've got I've got it here. It's a time in February twenty nineteen. It's a fourteen year old named maxine at that time and the decision was handed down by the British Columbia Supreme Court saying that the father do not have the right to stop this and that if he was to address her with female pronouns or birth name he would be considered a family violence. He gave an interview that night to a website the federalist which might also be a publication and they did in fact find him guilty the of family violence at the time. And you're right that going further. The judge issued an order authorizing Clark's arrest without warrant any police officer who might catch him referring to his daughter as a girl roll or with female pronouns. All right reminds me of the judge breaks some point at some point everyone. Not Everything is progress. I was going to say I post traumatic because remember that case I tried a couple of years ago. Or Gloria allred represented the the complaining witness. Who would would just knife one of my guys and I kept referring to the front of the shakey's on Santa Monica exactly? The judge kept ordering metoo to call the the the Male a female. Even though when the doctor got up to testified the injuries the doctor said it was a male Genitalia Blah Blah Blah and referred referred to it as a he said how come you're not lambasting the doctor but the royals gotta play along it. It's it's it's scary uncharted. We're in an uncharted world. Where the government is going to arrest the dad for calling his son a he? I am not a she that is beyond Orwellian. That would be. You would have a difficult time explaining that to people not not a hundred years ago and not fifty years ago. Thirteen years ago or nine years ago like literally the last time the rams won the Super Super Bowl. If you went back just to two thousand you'd have a very difficult time explaining what that was you can say well doesn't this person deserves that that doesn't this person deserves that yes they do. But you're talking about arresting apparent for how they address their son or daughter. I wonder if I could. You know my father's passed on but I always tell the joke that for the first thirteen years of my life. I thought my first name was dumb in my middle name was shit when he was at the. I wonder if if that is a If that's something that we could criminalize retroactively all right. Let me hit Put your box high quality audie meet sent right to your home. No antibiotics no hormones. Each box comes with between nine and eleven pounds of meat enough for twenty four individual. Oh meals plus wild sustainable harvested salmon source from fishermen in Bristol Bay Alaska as a butcher box here and do did did the the the team scarf it. It's always it's every man for himself. Yes there's two things meet and I the handed off your wife okay. I never thought shipping anywhere in the US Save Alaska and Hawaii And we have an offer twenty bucks off your first box. Plus two pounds of wild caught Alaskan salmon. You can tell by the color. It's very pink and orangey looking. It's so fresh rush. I have all this all the time. But your box dot com slash doubt. Enter the Promo code doubt at checkout favorite out of a wild Alaskan Salmon and you get to twenty bucks off butcher box dot com slash. Now I you know the whole thing about butcher boxes they give you the Sam and that gives you the steaks chicken they they give you the pork and then you rotate You know what I mean except they rotate it. Right out of my kitchen I never they rotate it so that I never see. That's the problem problem i. I'm I'm going to start Doing Quarantine for my butcher box. So we were talking last week about about Nicholas Sandman and Lynnwood. And you know you were yeah I wrote. Visa about five million right so now. There's somebody pose. That's the question I thought this was interesting and a very well. thought-out question how come it wouldn't mean a hundred or one hundred and fifty thousand Rosen dollars. Why wasn't that the number okay? So they filed for two hundred and eighty million dollars which is meaningless. Unless because you can ask for anything in fact let me. Let me drill down a second. I hate when people say drill down. Lynnwood why would I use it to Lynnwood is no hack. Mark is almost never hack almost over. I want to leave a window exactly. Just crackdown not why. But here's here's the thing. Would you ask for an absurd amount or do you think it's better more accurate or clear. It gives more merit to the case to try to get to a reasonable amount. Ya I th th. This is a discussion. We actually have in the office. All the time ban Ban Boring Cup is a great proponent of asking for a number he likes asking for big number he likes asking for a big number doesn't wanNA tastes taste unless it's a big number in and has an does calculations he normally will go through. I'll say you'll have you come up with that. Neil Komo I admit Mitt and very old school when it comes to that because you normally do not have to do. It's according to proof and I don't necessarily want to say I like to keep my cards the close by the vest. There's there's two there's two ways you can approach is one. Is You you kind of you smell a number career like on. I go to a car auction. I look at a car. That's eight hundred grand like Kinda start smelling and you usually right. Because that's what experience experience dictates. So you get some case like your Lynnwood. You're going to sue CNN and you start thinking about how old's the guy. What kind of damages are we talking? About how good a student is what are the long term implications of this and bub-bubba. Now you can do that with the poor guy. WHO's the maintenance man at ARCO building who gets shot by the POPO on his long because he left his keys and trying to go in the window and you go three hundred and eighty thousand bucks? That was that guy's whatever that's a fair price for what what just transpired here. You obviously can do that to some degree with your sixteen or now seventeen year growth client or whatever it is so when you get to two eighty. That's not a number you would arrive at if you were just kind of going on. What's his earning potential show houses negatively affecting him? What kind of what can you put on? What's a punitive thing? What's a pain and suffering? You know you went arrive at two eighty you would arrive at probably a lesser number and in my opinion is the lesser number gives you a little more validity credibility that yeah one of the reasons ability and one of the reasons that I hesitate to demand a number in most cases and most filings. I think if I were to take a percentage of the cases that we filed civil cases. Obviously you don't ask for this a criminal context but in a civil case I would say it's a small percentage where you actually ask. I would say it's a case where there we know that it's people are going to ask that question. How much what is this case? What as a worth and they're also is the contemplation of what is if it's a corporation? They generally have a stack way tower of insurance insurance whether the insurance companies going to reserve and how high up the stack are the insurance companies. Going to get involved if you're asking for Camilion Bucks and this corporations got a five million dollar policy then they're not going to need the The coverage of the reinsurance so the question. Then Dan is. How do you know one hundred and fifty grand? Your guesstimate was five million explaining this to a legal financing buddy of mine who does litigation funding which is a huge area of the law now litigation funding are a lot of the hedge funds have started up financing where they'll go to lawyers. They'll tell the lawyers look you're going up against some very wealthy corporation. You generally doing this on a contingency the F.. You WanNa go toe to toe. You're going to need some kind of funding and I was telling the litigation there. I I usually can tell you. Within a fairly retitled ban what cases worth given who the lawyers are on the other side represent the corporation given what the corporation is like ed given what the claim is worth we oh How much is this worth you? Can you can do that math. That's why when somebody is asking why is CNN and Saint Man why would you say five million. That just seems to me given what I think probably occurred which was there was some kind of smoking. Gun Gun document given the fact that they lend was willing to focus kind of the rest of his career on it. I don't think he would have walked away at one. I'm fifty I don't think Sam man would've taken one a one fifty. I think they wanted to set the The bar at a certain point so that other defendants would know. You're not going to get out of the season well when we used to Bad Contractors on the catch a contractor show I would do he was always the same aim stories like the guy came in. He said he could do the kitchen with stainless steel appliances and the Entry Hall Bathroom for Twenty One hundred dollars. Go Twenty Twenty one hundred dozen by you the fridge and the dishwasher. How's it going to do the counters two floors that they and so I would walk in and I didn't know all the surfaces and all the materials cereals and whether you were going with the Corey on the grand or whatever? I'm just kind of sniff. You know like you know the kitchens between thirty five and forty forty two and the entry had there. That's a six to eight or you know this against my. It was my experience. So when when five million comes into Mark Geragos his head. It isn't because he has a war board with pieces. He's moving around and take measurements sir. Anything that smells like five million vast amount of experience and I will tell you one of the things I tell clients when they walk in. Dan Is. There's a different timeline. To of a case each case is like a movie so to speak or a a life if that unfolds with a client just walks in and something untoward has happened to them. I don't have enough to to make a prediction. I can't tell you what it's worth the right off the top of my head but once I see what judge we get we may get assigned to once I see who the lawyers are in the other side once I see what whether the clients clients actually recovered. This client is permanently impaired. Somehow you need all that stuff because otherwise you can't make an estimate and God knows the one Anthony Client will remember. They'll never remember anything else. You tell them any caveat anything but if you mentioned a number that number is going to be they'll tattoo that number on their forehead right. Yeah well you can and you can. And when you're in your position or an agent or whatever you have to manage expectations this asleep. Shout out Pie in the sky and then have them say later on. You promised me for four million dollars for this case though. I didn't promise you four million it in your with your wealth of experience it smells and based on insurance and things of that nature. Yeah about five smells. Sounds like a five million dollars settlement to me and I think the given where Lynn was coming off of the previous case he just tried everything else else does it just has kind of the all of the the pot roast drippings of five million bucks so he'll see see if he can get to thirty thirty five million bucks because I guess there's eight or ten other entities that there's a there's see there's a number of defendants who have exposure and the pendulum is swinging as you. We talked about last week. There is kind of a A movement I guess towards that especially when it comes to media outlets the media Lawyers politicians were the least well thought of and now. It's clearly the media that's as well speaking of that Any any hunter Biden updates. There was a love child. There was some declaration to see his financial records netscape. It's getting no traction whatsoever. In the context of the paternity case because the paternity cases are generally presumptively confidential and and so and the most judges the last thing they want is to turn something into a circus if they can help it and so that I think is not going to is not going to get as much traction as one would expect. It'll be interesting to see if it heats up you know. The Iowa caucuses are coming up in Although you know you watch watch any of the democratic. I was at the comedy store that night So I did not. I heard heard snippets and bits and pieces. It was not you know Biden. The previous debate had a thought for him. had a very good Debate his highlight actually of the debate bait. This week was when he was asked about. You know the Senate trial and the accusations against him and he had a forceful answer but he also idol. I don't think Came off. There's he's you know he's seventy seven and you can tell I mean he's fit. He's very thin but the brain operate as quick and there were times when you could see as it was a struggle are there. Is there any footage and him trying to put headphones on. I'm Gary Berry was very similar to me at the start of the show. The you know the yesterday Klobuchar who is a former prosecutor is very nimble on her feet and I thought was. I thought did well the I thought Elizabeth Warren are in. You know I watched this. I watched it with With a very conservative Republican watch the debate and I found myself Saying at a certain point. Okay that's just pandering for a couple of things that Bernie and Elizabeth Warren said but I thought club. Hr and Mayor Pete Were very were. Were persuasive on certain issues because they were more realistic. Tom Steyer as much money as he spent. And as much as I would like maybe you know agree with most of his policies and things. He's just can't can't seem to buy traction. You know the thing that's funny. I think it's maybe Bloomberg but it's or styro- Bergen as meatball. Did you see the Bloomberg people now. Oh I didn't see it but I did there. It's funny when you see the ad on the NFL weekend game and you realize they paid. Have you know arm and a leg for this. I think either I think it's Bloomberg and then at the end you hear the voices come over and they go. My name is Mike Bloomberg and and I approve this message. And it's like you can't even bring it for this video like come on man you gotta step it up a little bit like there is an element to this. It's not all policy policy. That's why look Ronald Reagan. Kind of redefined. The the office and a lot of ways and And Obama gave him credit for that and it was one of the reasons that Obama I think was the darling of the Democratic Party. Look good the Ah yes we talked about this. In the shows. Richard Jewel and Michael Avenue Obama was so likable so charismatic. What we you know we look for comfort vert in your own skin? That guy looked so comfortable in this own skin. I don't think many of his policies were great but he seemed so charisma and and that and that trump's pardon the panel almost everything else because people don't WanNa get into the weeds on the policies. I saw I woke up this morning. I just saw Elizabeth Warren Giver a Closing Statement About Ninety seconds about fighting for fixing everything time. I worry about the people that are just GonNa fix wchs everything for everyone joked now is. I've got a plan for that. I bought plan for that. She's always saying it's got to plant hall. Says she was trying to hit Bernie Yup well at the end I wanNA. I'll tease it right after the because I thought was a great moment. Maybe Gary confided but I ain't another new responser fire you heard of this. Mike was prevented from discussing marijuana legalization at his college. Naomi couldn't start an animal rights club. Kevin School wouldn't let him hand out the constitution. I would love to see the principal of the school that will let you hand out the constitution. Their free speech rights were violated related. But they all got help from fire. The foundation for Individual Rights in Education Nonpartisan nonprofit organization. That defends defends the rights of students and Faculty Kevin the student banned from handing out the constitution took his case to court in one. I would hope so. I would hope that if you go in front of a federal judge and say that. I'm trying to pass out the constitution in my schools preventing you. I would hope you'd win that learn about defending free speech on campus texts. Fire to fifty two dash eight eight six again texts fire to fifty two eight eight six or visit it. The fire dot org fire experienced nonpartisan defending your rights. I you know I won't tell the old Gary I'm GonNa Testudo. Did you hear who famously said. You can't the free speech beans. You can't yell fire in a crowded crowded theater. I don't know but I know that I know that line. I don't know why but fire should use Clarence Darrow. Thomas Paine did so wait wait. So what's the answer. I don't know maybe he you would know. Do you have any all of her. Wendell halls juniors opinion odd greenacres. The Oliver when I guess I would have said Louis Brandeis so I'm glad you looked at. He was Oliver Wendell. Douglas Yeah Ah I probably named after all window. So if you were in Elizabeth Warren where Bernie goes to shake her hand and and then Tom stiers between them and he looks like he couldn't be more uncomfortable. I mean there's a burn. Well no Tom looks like he. Can't Elizabeth and Bernie we are exchanging words and so millions of lip. Readers around the world have been trying to figure out what they said. Well she was kind of trying to meet them a little bit. Yes yes yeah. She said a woman couldn't win and he has a great response. Oh really wouldn't woman couldn't win it. twenty-six Hillary won three million more votes in the popular Buehler vote while sadly for Elizabeth Elizabeth reminds me of criminals that rob seven elevens and are unaware of surveillance wranglings cameras. You know what I mean. What Elizabeth does is she makes these comments and then somebody digs up on interview with Bernie Sanders from nineteen eighty eight? Where he goes a woman could win could be the president of the United States or she says I was fired by my principal because I was pregnant and then we dig up an interview? Her going I. I stayed home just posted on the handshake. She goes on the handshake. And she's going to settle his hash. But what Elizabeth doesn't understand stand is these things are these these things can be checked out. We can go back and look at these so if you explain that you were fired fired because you're pregnant and then you do an interview where he said I had to get a second credential. Also I had my kids so I just stayed home that that's going to surface. Yeah and it's it's and you know what he could have said And it would be true is Elizabeth. Warren can't win in the Midwestern Midwestern states that she will need to win the electoral college being asked. She's not going to get in in my humble opinion you're not gonNA see her Beat trump in Pennsylvania Ohio or or even uh-huh potentially even Wisconsin. I mean I don't even see how they're just not going to get traction. And by the way you know she had that great line about the only people on this stage who have never lost an election or the two women okay but then somebody said. I don't know who and it's true well. You beat a Republican Republican in Massachusetts. So I get that but you know. That's Europe's not exactly the heaviest of lifting. I'm starting to wonder if there's such thing on the democratic side of anybody running who has any paper trail rail of being alive before this election because we you know whatever you WanNa start bust in trump's chops on this says Bhai then we go well by voted for the invasion of or you're against gay marriage but we have you voted against gay marriage. We voted for funding funding of whatever. It is if you have a history that history will be used against you and so it's just a matter of the part of the EH The people call it a cult but part of the reason that trump trump is formidable as an opponent is that his people don't care I mean when he says says I could shoot somebody on Fifth Avenue and get away with it. They even argued that in the Second Circuit Court of Appeal. His lawyers did say though that very statement and They they don't care so if you show up evidence of him doing a video saying I'm Bama's going to attack Iran in order to get reelected that they don't care so I saw what doesn't matter which by the way leads us to maybe the last topic before we wrap? Because I wanted to get your take on this MHM So when Qassam Soleimani gets killed. Then there is a unifying reaction to that in Iran apparently which then evaporates almost as quickly when it comes out that Iran's military are the ones who shot down the airliner right with all the speaking of Canadians well sixty that seems to then and kind of undo the unintended consequence of unifying Iran and have the opposite effect? How do you how do you explain that? What is the Dynamic I? They they had a couple of Iranian. Newscasters quit saying look. I'm sorry I've lied to view for the last thirteen years on the air. Like it says to me that maybe they're willing to join us in the modern era like it's it's a little. There's little flashes of hope where they painted the Israeli flag in the American flag on the ground and people are sort of walking around it And the fact that they're holding their own government responsible for something that their government is clearly responsible for and in the past probably could have lied and gotten away with probably more difficult with today's world and twitter forms of communication. I think I I think you've gotta give some credit to social media. Remember when they're in two thousand sixteen when they were trying to depose Turkey aired on one of the first things thinks he did was shut down the government shutdown twitter and others and social media because that would tend to I think give too much community. Ready or Collective consciousness at a certain point. This is my wish you know. I'm an atheist and then people go. Oh well then what's to stop you from killing somebody and I go because it's wrong and they were. Yeah but without the Ten Commandments. I it because it's wrong and they go what's to stop op from stealing. Your you know your coveting your neighbour's oxen or something because it's wrong because it's wrong it's just wrong. And at a certain point nature has asked to kick in in in in transcends religion community ethnicity. It just certain things are wrong and certain things are right right and having a government that's not corrupt having a government that you know. Look I don't care what the tenants of your religion are. Women knock not being able to read drive cars or gays being thrown up. Billy it's wrong. It's just wrong because it's wrong and certain point that will win the day. At a certain point it is certain point they will join us in western Europe and Canada Hanukkah and other nations in the right department. And there's this sort of thing was like well you think you're better than there. No but we are more correct and then makes us better right. You don't cut people's hands off that are caught dealing from you know. Throw acid women who are caught reading or driving having already just. It's wrong and certain point that nations that are wrong because of technology and just because of sort of evolution because we used to be wrong to right. There's been we had sleigh horrible things to native Americans we used to be everyone was wrong and and then certain nations grew out of that. Just like you're an asshole when you're thirteen right because you're thirteen then you grow. You grow out out of it so when I see this kind of thing happening it makes me. It gives me a little hope that some of the wrong is moving toward the light because because your average nineteen year old wants to live in a society. That doesn't have all of this stuff and it is certain point when there's more Vam Damn and you know we talked about it or I talked about on an acs you know. A Republican dies every ten minutes and five five Democrats are born. There's a sloughing off. That happens one of the old guard old school. Hey I liked it. How it was in the sixties and the seventies guys is one of those guys dies every ten minutes and there's three newborns who wanna live in a world with an iphone fifteen and the Internet and women men are engaged in everybody living in harmony and unity? So I think we march toward that. Now these societies have been taken one step forward and two steps back and three step four and a half step sideways but at some point in here we are in two thousand twenty. They're just GONNA and a half to join US and Canada and Western Europe and many other parts of the world in Australia and everywhere else. That is doing it right. They're just it's gotTa have to join us. I I looked the I had this discussion because we were over at Huntington Hospital for a do whatever and I was talking to somebody who had been there since the since nineteen sixty four and he was commenting that in nineteen sixty four. That may have been the most wasp in institution ever in the guy that was There had watched from nineteen sixty four up through two thousand and four. It just changed dramatically. Go from nothing but all the white guys who kind of ran the place to a completely diverse place and we said at the end of it now as somebody who kind of lived through it all that was remarkably refreshing how it had changed and change for the better. So Oh that's your microcosm of the macrocosm is your lecture that you just gave. I do hope that the media again the fact that you can realize that your own government shutdown a civilian airplane and there was a hundred and eighty something souls that had passed because of it and that you can hold hold them. Accountable is a good thing. It's good impulse. And there's a technology in a weird way SORTA like blockbuster movie movie rentals they. Just it's not gonNa work in a day of digital downloading claiming government version of Netflix or the next streaming. Right all right all right. You can This Friday I'll be in Milwaukee PABST theater doing stand up and then Head into Chicago Park West the following following day. That'll be the twenty fifth. Still some tickets. They'll Milwaukee Chicago's probably sold out but you can give it a try AMC role dot com for all the live stuff and go to Chassis C.. Cha S S. Y.. For the twenty four hour war and the shelby American Daca now uppity which mark enjoy. I enjoy a lot and I'm playing. Get for somebody who I think is going to enjoy it even more. Oh really yeah. Well I know you're connected to that world so I know I was is literally having this conversation last night with the Matt the Andrea I said. You know Chris Morgan one of our neighbors who does all the fast and furious stuff. Hit Him in the rock are rents. I'm Chris Morgan. Get it to the Rock right eleven. And then I'll take my other neighbor guarantees. I'll tell them give ever sir ice cube or cap. Let's get it done. Let's get it done so Thank you in advance for that. But you guys can stream it at CHASSIS DOT COM. What do you got? I've got the V. Palm Springs. This weekend is the place to be Get down there palm springs and Casa Tropicana and Saint Clementi anyone Gary's favorite places on Earth Provo pizzeria both in Times Square Grand Central Terminal Engine Company twenty downtown. Lax and Tennessee's Mediterranean the terrain Ian. Top US downtown. La and you can check out PD stories from The creators of cold case files on any check that out on podcast one one until next time out of Crawford organizaion a holiday. Thanks for listening to reasonable doubt tune in next Saturday for an all a new episode. 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115: Mueller Takes Your Question

The 45th

53:33 min | 1 year ago

115: Mueller Takes Your Question

"In this means Donald Trump up. We'll be the forty fifth president of the United States. This is your life now. This is our election now. This is us. This is our country. It's real hi and welcome back to the forty fifth rob here and I'm here with my colleague and co-host Susan Simpson Hasten. Hey Robby. You've been watching T._v.. All Day I mean that's a not a great way of phrasing. I was preparing cast all day. You are working hard to our listeners. Hopefully y'all are listening right now. On Wednesday evening we delayed recording so we could cover the Muller testimony today on the Hill Yeah Yeah we thought this is probably going to be. We didn't have to wait till next week to cover this. Since it's pretty timely but I did watch it on and off. I just heard kind of the same recurring themes over and over. I'm sure you picked out things that a little more like detailed drew your attention so we'll get to that in a minute but I wanted to talk about a couple of other stories before you get into the big news of the day by the way is four P._M.. Right now on the east coast is that testimony still going on the House Intelligence Committee still grilling grilling him we timed it well. He finished up about half an hour ago fantastic fantastic. We timed it exactly right all right before we get into this so i WanNa talk about something that's kind of important to me but not important to everybody but it's kind of important as it relates to our national security the United States and that is that this week the president welcomed the official bucks on a Prime Minister the official delegation of the bucks any prime minister to the White House and I'm talking about Imron Han now relationships between Washington Washington and box on have been really really bad last couple of years so bad in fact that trump cancelled hundreds of millions of dollars with aid the bucks have been getting for many years as partners in the war on terror ongoing ongoing stuffing awareness on and all that stuff so he just got up and cancelled it. This prime minister came into power. What a year ago and he he's an ex cricket star and I know that doesn't mean a lot got to Americans but pretty much of the rest of the world is kind of a big deal? He this guy was a big broncos president kind of SORTA. Yeah I think that's I think that's a fair analogy. Guy Was a big deal. I'm talking about thirty years ago. He was also at this hotshot. So Jordan is President Michael. Jordan becomes president there you go <hes>. He's been involved in politics for a while. He was a minister in his region and that he's been trying to he found a new party and he's been campaigning on anti-corruption for many many years now bucks on what had happened for decades now was it was just a couple two families back and forth back and forth these two except for that little military coup that happened or too little military coups otherwise the government has ended up between like these two families and Iran was like I'm going to break the cycle <hes> and he won but critics now say about him that he is using the guise of anti corruption shen and anti-terrorism to clamp down on his opponents and stuff like that but anyhow he had to make up make up the trump make good with him but interestingly enough one thing he did which I don't think so ever been done before in the United States he was coming coming to D._C.. For three or four days and he decides to hold his party's decides to hold what's called a judge saw which is a political rally very very trumpian in that way like you know how trump loves Israelis. They rented out the capital Arena here in D._C.. I had actually registered to go like you can just got a couple of bright tickets. It was free and then I just got lazy. I said you know why I'll just watch it online or whatever you know it's and I kind of I kind of regret it because it was packed to the Gills and apparently it was really really well done and he spoke for an hour <hes> towards the end of it it was like twenty five thousand bucks on his packed into and these are all people from this area packed into the center but a number of my friends who went and said that there was at one point they played this very long video jio that was just like an Ode to Iran was very much like just propaganda very uncomfortable. It's like clips of him like making runs in cricket and and exhausted in a rally back home and this doing all these heroic things and just people praying for Oh yeah he slipped and hurt his leg playing crickets. They showed him in the hospital and a woman praying for his leg. It was so the next day he does meet with trump. I didn't follow a lot of what happened. You know what I know. Is that basically the here's the funny thing this weekend I was travelling. I went to New York just for overnight. I was on the train back and this guy was sitting across the aisle from me and he leans over his middle-age Brown guy and he's like are you from bacchus on. I said yes I am and so we started talking saying he had flown in for this because he is like one of the prime minister's right hand man he is the head of the party in one of the regions and one of the big cities Karachi so that was really weird but he was telling me look. This is just happening because we gotta begged that money back so there was that money the Mo the aid that trump cut from buck assan hundreds of millions of dollars trump. I don't know two years ago at some point. He cut the money cut. This aid bucks have been getting about twenty eight. I mean they need the aid <hes> so they're trying to reset these relationships but during this conversation did you see that clip about trump what trump said about Afghanistan yeah well. There's two things I would ask you about what the one was the gas. I want which is terrifying. Sorry okay. Let let me explain what trump is talking about. How I mean Baucus on strategic important that alliance is really based on what they can do to combat terrorism and manage like the shit show that is now avant Tucson and has been for many decades because of one war after another on its land and so trump goes you know what if I wanted I could finish this? I could finish this war in a week. Ten days are finished week but they're really ten nine people dead and I don't want that but I could do it which seems to imply he's is he saying he would just nuke it he he did say he said I could wipe it off the map. He's white commit genocide yeah with nuclear weapons basically exactly. He's like that could do that but I'm a good guy so I'm not GonNa do that. I can't imagine when ron was thinking at the moment so we know what a guest thinking 'cause they immediately sought clarification on the president's statements about annihilating their country. Yeah was there a response from the White House not publicly that I've seen yet but <hes> I mean hopefully he has some not incompetent aides to try and what one fixed immediate crisis and to convince him never ever ever ever say that again which then also maybe that we're actually not at war against the country itself. That's not even a thing so what was the other thing that stood out to he's comments about what mody Indian Prime Minister had asked him <hes> about mediating a peace between India box on over the Kashmir question which is like seventy years old yeah. It's like it's like trump to foreign relations crises in the presser with the Pakistani Prime Minister in other words with Paxton. He just makes it up off the cuff literally the very next day India's like that never happened mode. He didn't ask them do that. Nobody seemed really angry about it. Though they were extremely like this was not something they could let trump say and it'd be like okay. That's you know we'll we'll just not make a thing out of it. They're like making a thing out of this right now. They have to because mode as the strong man in Kashmir is a big point in Kashmir is that was show weakness on the part of India towards that issue if India was leaning in and saying hey can you help us resolve this that means India showing some some weakness here means. You don't need to see what I'm saying. It's like they don't have the upper hand any so yeah. That was just you know but I'm show. I don't even know where that came from. I wonder if it's something that because trump must've asked and he's like trying to pretend that he that he was asked to do it. I'm sure trump is the one who asked them can help you do this. We can fix the Middle East and Kashmir good luck with that the other occupation anyway so that was that mostly you know yeah those were to really alarming things but. As far as bacchus almost concerned there were no gas part of the prime minister so that went well well Pakistan is that we started new problems with yeah. Let's see what happens though I mean I think Imam Haunted Kowtow to his has encountered to trump so I mean but he also came across pretty well and let's see a fun fact is run Hans Ex wife who actually produced the H._B._O.. Documentary but a non so I have all kinds of weird connection so this whole thing <music> so you know what about a month ago I cleaned out my editor full of bottles of vitamins and many of them haven't touched in a long time but I actually just cleaned it out and I have two bottles titles in there and they are both the same thing they are ritual vitamins. I swear but don't leave them in the same place. That doesn't help when I do. I have one my suitcase because I always forget it and then I have one upstairs downstairs so that way I never forget take ritual. That's smart. That's smart but I I do. I keep them in a drawer right next to the stove because there's not a single day in moms you know what I'm talking about. There's not a single day. 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This is trump's all business partner in trump transition team official I. I don't know it's getting some attention in the news but it definitely has not gotten the attention that I guess these days trump official getting convicted of a crime of conspiring my working for foreign government really isn't that much of the missile line of them it just it just yeah so in that sense it kind of is just a Tuesday but like still again. Another trump official convicted of being an agent of a foreign power now so bijon Rafiki in is a business partner of Flynn he worked doc with the intelligence group which was a consulting business and this all goes back to the one of the big things that Michael terminating yeah got in trouble with but never actually indicted on now. He got indicted on the Russia stuff but he probably had an even bigger problem or well. I won't say bigger but he had just as big of a problem with his Turkey stuff and he was not charging it because he was cooperating witness and they needed Flynn and the thing was what was him offering the Turkish. I government to get the Golan extradited right. He was a gun for hire <hes> for Turkey to help them primarily help them with their guy yeah to help them kidnap and extradite a a U._S.. Permanent resident who is considered like a coup starter glennon meter yeah all those things and again flynn not charged in that case because he will flip early early and cooperated supposedly and got a really really nice deal out of it that I wished mother had been asked about today given how that seems without me in but the second anyway we've had some dramas lately when Flynn Flynn fired his counsel from Covington burling his council since since the start of this really and he got these new like trump sick of councils who may actually wind up Steering Flynn at prison over their advice to him but their dice was essentially to tell Glenda stop cooperating. Here's what basically what happened is you had government of Turkey says Hey Flynn. We're going to pay you through this Turkish business developer guide out Tekken as as a cover for US coming straight from the Turkish government bank accounts and then you can lobby for extradition of Glen and help us with this plan to actually not kidding extradite plan to kidnap him but because because we're hiring you are paying you through this guy this business guy. You'RE NOT GONNA have to disclose that. You're a foreign agent now. If you are an agent for a foreign government you have to file a statement with under Fara for any demonstration act and and flint him up do that at first until he was caught because he was so boneheaded that he wrote an op Ed are published under his name on election day like saying how great the Turkey U._S. alliances and how much we need to extract Yulin right at that point people were like that's a little bit odd Turkey paying you and that's when the field yeah that's when in the middle of all his other problems with lying about Russia Flynn Files Afar statement on behalf half of <unk> Flynn and tells group little problem there is that that statement in the far filing was a bunch of lies which which Flynn admitted when he pled guilty statement offense which he agreed to under oath in court says that he made false statements in that far filing which would have helped the government when they're bringing their casing. It's offensive partner Bijon Rafiki and for these same issues because they're going to be planted having Flynn there to test find him half like yeah we well. Here's how he broke it. Here's how Bijon was involved Yep. We totally did that. Shit then in July he gets new council new council. Make a new statement. Starring Judi got new council and the Council go to the government mm-hmm and say Oh we're Flynn said under oath that he broke the law did like false information in those Fara filings yeah. He just got confused. He didn't really mean that he was just kind of going along in front of Camden think about it too hard but he never made any false names the firefighter he never review them before they had no idea what his attorneys wrote in that filing. Isn't it like a little too late for that. It is way too late for that also also like this is national security advisor. I'm supposed to believe he's so stupid that like he won right didn't read his own filings fine. Maybe just business guide stuff to do but to he pled guilty to a defense and pled the fancy pled to you but in the statement of events he he agreed he stipulated that he had broken the law in this way and he did that because he was just confused. Yeah he was no way as lawyers are not going over all these things with him. I mean like before the pleading of course we'll do definitely should have been national security advisor. If that's the case why shouldn't have been anywhere for ten reasons so this happened all very recently at the eve of trial and there was some speculation that there is some concern that it was going to undermine the federal government's case against be Sean and it did it made a definitely trickier. Luckily I felt pretty good chances there and it turns out they didn't need flynn after all because they got their conviction on the strength of their Documentary Evans Alone Flynn did not testify the documentary was pretty overwhelming in this kind of goes back to in part the clear evidence from the far filings that there was a kickback pay top tech in the Turkish businessman. Who was the Middle Guy so what happened is there is this whole deal? Flynn in Turkey was for six hundred thousand dollars. I think it was number and and that money came from bank accounts supposedly controlled by up tech in two FIG Flynn until group and then mysteriously like twenty percent of that total was sent backed up Tekken which is a kickback find mysterious. It's very clearly out tech agree to be the middleman for this exchange right as part of his feet being the middleman risking criminal exposure and eventually criminal was to have twenty percent kick back to him so there's a lot of documentary evidence and it was. He's never a great position to begin is the government. When you're only witness with direct knowledge? She was going to Mottola stuff suddenly turns on you but they want anyway. He was convicted and it's going to be at best at best a minor new story from the week if anyone even that it happened and which is unfortunate because yeah again this is another example of just how many people and trump world were compromised for working for foreign governments into Flynn got the sweet amazing incredible deal despite clear cut like ironclad DUDES GONNA lose in court full stop evidence against him multiple criminal violations many of them very like not just the forest also the backs also the lying the government also like the F._B._i.. So how come he pleads guilty to like one offensive line to the government which is now also claims he didn't really do and was at one point had a good chance of getting no jail time out of the deal I mean is it because he expecting a pardon so for me. That's the only answer but at the same time Cohen got a ton of talent time time gates won't get time but he actually is for real cooperating so why did Flynn get such amazing deal just offering but that's the thing like Okay Flynn was giving something maybe that makes sense again ongoing investigations. I maybe there's something we don't know yet. Is that possible that he's not he. Maybe except for the fact that he's clearly not cooperating more and also if he had good stuff to give her the by now and there's something that important worth that much of a deal we would have heard of it and we didn't well if I'm honest to cooperate and get this deal and then he reneges on that isn't the deal you'll be like well. That's the thing is plan has not been sentenced yet and the thing was put off and it was extended to be after this trial so that he could show his cooperation in his use to the government so let's show all that stuff yes now <hes> Yeah Flynn is looking down the barrel of jail time however he stolen pled guilty to the one minor ish like length deputies minor but relatively minor charge so the extent of the shit he then is limited to that so yeah. I really really don't have any answers there. I wish even today we had some more light shed on how this deal came to be and why Muller Flynn was that valuable but I guess I mean it's not good news but at least Flynn is not going to get through the scot-free. There seemed to be a couple of you just mentioned like some teams where it's like so many people surrounding trump. Are you know have some kind of ties to foreign governments really close ties but another ongoing theme seems to be like this world of a child sex trafficking and pornography and all kinds of so I don't know do we cover the nature stuff last week we did not oh yeah. There's another connection but indictment bail issues going on as well for that case for another Republican. An adviser who yeah was indicted for raping children right I mean along with Epstein stuff and I think the judge is going to unseal an obscene cases like two thousand pages worth of documents that could Thailand of other people like into his whole sex trafficking world right so when that's going to happen but in this week too you just reminded me that this week this week we had a frigging video come out of Epstein hanging together at a party with all those girls and women. I think they're all women and trump getting all Hansie with them. They were cheerleaders. Yeah and that's been like totally I run just like okay cool. I mean they were over age. So what more to expect you know why because we knew that we knew the thing is like all the stuff about trump. I mean it's disgusting. Thing is all of us who are like horrified at him running and getting the candidacy and then actually winning I mean we were because we knew all these things about him like these are all things we knew how he was about women. We knew how discussing he was as we know inappropriately. Wasn't we already knew a lot of it. I mean a lot of the allegations against him. Existed already the you know the rape charge so much Laurie there right and it was kind of like so it's almost like what you know. Even before the election all these women came out and it was like well aw it did nothing so that's why I now oh. There's another video of him. Whatever I mean? It's you know we've got pictures of the first lady posing new none of nothing beyond the Pale for this family <hes> and that's why we just it's not news. It's not news will be news. If there's evidence I see I don't even think it will matter if if witnesses lineup women lined up and say yeah we were traffic through Epstein and we were underage and we were solicited the two trump it's still a matter already have one woman who said that under her real name which matters I mean at this point I well short of Epstein actually holding rolling onto some black material against trump. I don't see anything happening yeah he might there might be another a whole bunch of people coming down but I've seen has blackmail and some people so we'll find out well. Maybe we'll find out who they were rents. All over the hell. They are speaking of things that probably won't matter much communist the neck but let's get to the Miller testimony <music> so Susan I am kind of known in the podcast face as being somebody who's very concerned about how they smell and trying to smell as good as they can and by that you mean Patrick Justice telling you I mean Patrick but also yes look. I mean like it's kind of spread slowly. You know every so often I get tweets and do you really small so good I do because I layer a lot but I get questions about that the last time we ought to get a convention so catch me it's like why does everyone talk about how Robbie is smells like well well Patrick Hynes but also Sean but look I couldn't smoke great unless I started with a great deodorant and I'm so excited about the sponsor. I'll be honest I really am because I have over the years gone through dozens of deodorants and hated so many of them and I love native it is a fantastic go rent. 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My brain was starting fry because all I car it was basically every Democrat was asking questions related to obstruction and every Republican was coming was talking about collusion and just pointing to there's no and it was this like two separate. They were just completely talking impasse each other. I don't even think they give crop about the answers that Muller had to give for the most part because it was just about when he gave answers right and can I say I I think he has a hearing problem or something but there were times he just seemed completely confused me. I don't know if it was this heated questions. Were coming from or didn't that's there were times when questions were repeated a number time and he seemed like he didn't understand what was being Aso. It could have been a hearing thing or I don't know what was happening. It's a stalling tactic too. They all do that and those hearing L. is that right maybe. It was the master of that. How can you repeat that thing become a bumbling okay? That's what it is now. I'll say overall there. Were probably no no huge welshing center for the most part. It was nothing too surprising this needed to happen. It should happen much sooner and by the way going into this yesterday right. He doesn't reported yesterday the D._O._J.. Has had instructed him specifically to stay inside the bounds of the report which what was that Britain mother had written and asked for guidance so he could basically similar could have that to fall back on more than one answer questions and it was all comes down to all of this over the past two years two plus years of investigation till now it all goes back to how fucked we are due to the Elsie opinion that says the sitting president cannot be indicted that one elsie opinion has up into the future of America because of its repercussions for <hes> how trump is handle or not handled orange vest <unk> for a sitting president but he clearly say that once a president leaves office he can be but the problem though is like Muller's <unk> his task all along wasn't possible his task all along was internally contradictory then there's an I don't agree with his his way of throwing that needle necessarily but I can't say I have another solution for him. <hes> which is the trap he was in and that one he was tasked with investigating trump but to could never make a conclusion or could never indict dight trump for any activity found. Some other solution was to say okay. I can't investigate because there's other reasons beyond dining him right now but also if I do find he committed criminal activity I cannot state it out loud or is he puts it. I must constantly constantly say we declined to reach a conclusion about his criminal conduct as if that's like a thing where you can just like mentally not make a conclusion right even when you go through all the steps and have all the evidence in front of you but you just say well. You know what we couldn't do it so I never considered in the first place that's like when somebody says something court and then like strike from the record. Jury's already heard it's too late it just it's an impossible situation and the result is that now trump is going to be essential. I mean the president once concern office is free to crime up as much as they want. They have a risk of if they get out of office before the sedimentation front out they have a risk of being indicted thin but given the concern about indicting political enemies that hopefully still exist in our country and the concern against incoming politicians trying to seek prosecutorial attacks against their opponents. It's about look it's the optics or bad yeah so yeah. Even after you're out when you look at Kobe charged there's going to be Canada and concerns that might mean won't be even if you totally totally deserve it even worse that like even aside from this whole thing about like whether he should be indited right now for me the damages in that it hinders investigation and reaches this ridiculous situation where Muller can come out and today day he he it is abundantly clear that he fully believes that trump committed obstruction justice that he'd lots of it and that he should have been indicted or what have been indicted had it not been there with Elsie opinion. We had a former F._B._i.. Director a upstanding long-term public servant credibly get up there and described facts about the presidents crimes and the president can walk away. Let's say like all the victory for me. Just had a special counsel declare all these Crimes Times I did. It's proof that I was right all along but there was I mean so this. This question came up a couple of times and at one point Muller said Yes what a president leaves office. When the president's office he can be charged but then later he was the question was posed him again in a different way and he said No? I'm not saying that if but for the opinion he would have been charged he it seemed like he kind of backtrack that a bit so there's a couple of weird linguistic dodges he's making making he didn't back what he says the president he he was. I was an interesting exchange where he straight up said can with asking the President H._R.. Through his office and he says yes now that it's not completely clear whether he was being hypothetical article and saying Oh if the president able to enter this charge or if you're saying this president could be charged which I think was likely intentional because mother lording he can be careful with his words when he wants to be <hes> so oh I think he meant or at least was okay. Leaving open interpretation that he meant trump personally now. There's another change you had with a Republican Congress woman less cow that was kind of executive for her in one of the more enlightening exchanges because she he kept going after <hes> Muller based on the bar letter what bar had written in like a public statement about how mother isn't saying that but for the Kenyan he would charge trump now that it's technically true and how it was written because Butler is not saying are was not saying that but for the Aussie opinion he would've charged trump <hes> but also he's not saying you wouldn't have no. He's like basically he's not using his answer that that's not the answer the mother saying but also it's true mother would have indicted trump but he was not president also opinions and stop it so when she started asking him like isn't it true that the reason you didn't die trump is not because they'll see Pinon and he wouldn't agree to that. He was like very pointedly. Well Well No. I'm not GonNa say that because obviously he would have indicted trump so there were some weird and also there's the whole thing with I think ripped blue asked him about the opinion and he later corrected it but not in a way that really changed his answer. Just made it a little bit more theoretically wishy washy. He was also asked about specifically about statute of limitations. What if a president is has two terms and in that time statue of limitations on these crimes expires but molars answer was? I don't know how to handle. He's not GONNA get ended. I mean like also it depends on which crime so like is it a five year such limitations and theoretically he could be still open to being indicted for it but there's lots of once but I mean the question was if it's a crime for which the statue of limitations does expire like getting his ass awesome you know does does the statute toll he's like. I don't know it was a dodge. I mean the thing is a canto for other reasons like so. When then we could happen is that there is a sealed indictment that could toll it however he's also said before that they're I'm not GonNa do a sealed indictment either so that presumably nappy the case yeah? I mean muller he he no one can say he didn't want anyone that he was not going to try and answer. He's GonNa try to answer as little as possible during this hearing which she had I mean the Democrats gotten got a chance to basically. I almost felt like well everybody who didn't read the report which seems like a lot of G._O._P.. Didn't read the report and you know certainly a lot of trump didn't report the Democrats got to really lay out like obstruction charged by obstruction charge the all of the different times you know one by one. I'm sure they had organized it that way and Muller Everytime Yup Yup Yup. That's exactly you needed to be done is absolutely needed to happen sooner. Even though Muller's always going to be this way because has I mean look at trump. He's been the yelling the report says no obstruction for the past four months and I'm not saying he's not GonNa get any more after this but also the media can now say well muller very clearly said that that is not the case and said had not there's no exoneration and then matters because a lot of news articles are going to do the same bullshit every time where trump will say something. That's clearly not correct based on the Miller. report are the stuff and they were looking to call out his lives. They don't have but easy quote. They can pull on be like actually this is totally wrong now. They have that so hopefully they'll use them. Yeah well another thing that was very clear and so they're Republicans folks all their energy on the underlying crime which is the collusion thing thing and whether or not he had enough to try to say well all inclusion thing it seems pretty clear that he did not have enough to charge on the collusion but the real issue was the obstruction and they wanna touch the obstruction but one thing that he probably I did want to go. I mean we should be thankful that somehow will listen to this semester now. The Republicans went full Q. and on because they went full nonsense and I try and follow a lot of the Republican conspiracy stuff just so I can know what they're talking about so I can follow a lot of it but there were some stuff they were going on about. I'm like what what dark recess of fortune to the Schick. I'm from. Oh God what did I miss. I miss that all the tax steele dossier that conspiracies about Oh Carter our page and just add popadopoulos and like their tax Alexander Downer what shocking and he was repeatedly asked. Did you investigate the origins of the investigation. As what are you talking about. It's like I told. Hold you cannot answer. That's what else is doing that already not my purview. I was even throw government when this happened so since when since when is an investigation in and of itself the point of an investigation to figure if something's going on right if our their crimes being committed since one is an investigation in and of itself illegal so their basic framework is that this was all a left wing political conspiracy to stop trump became president by laying the ground ones illegal in that conspiracy never even came to light to after the election season. You know what honestly if they could. They would charge them between them. Hang all these. They don't want to get co hair Erica's more clear at the gets the harder it gets to stick to it keeping it vague does help them to some degree right well. It's a distraction right because one thing that was very important that came out in this hearing was muller very clearly and repeatedly saying that Russia is like not just like interfered continues to interfere and this is a really important thing this is going to shape the future to our country and he got laid that out there and then he was given an opportunity and I can't remember which one of the congressmens that you know you have a minute half. What would you like the public to get from this report like what would and it just sounded like he issued a dire warning and there were only two things that muller had any sort of emotional visible emotional reaction to well? He had a couple of roles at dumber questions he would do that but the only know one one time I rolled he was asked <hes> like now which which candidate the Russians intend to help with their interference and he's like trump and he almost herald and then I think it was not gates it was Gohmert asked a question I swear to God he did a full on Iro <hes> but the things that got him emotionally engaged or one tax on his staff not him people could attack long and he was like a freaking wet blanket stick in the mud like okay you wanna say like someone's like saying like seven loans around the corner and he's like being attacked a vicious partisan deep state going to destroy America and he's like okay. I'm he's a Republican first of all but but they when they attacked the Daf he did. He like a good boss he goes to bat for them. The other time is when I can't the whole issue came up and he got super like urgent and emotional and like actually we're all going to die. He'll fix this swiftly. He didn't sit as worse but that was about the given the his the general tone he might as well said that I mean I think that was his way of saying yeah. All this is important but something bigger is happening here one of his like at one point he was asked about like I interference around in the future and he's like well. Why and it's not going to just Russia but also yeah it wasn't a single by Russia? They're doing <unk> as we sit here and they expect to do it. During the twenty twenty campaign so in the last week there's been a couple of reports just just so people understand where we are and how we're responding as the most powerful country in the world so there was a reporting by A._p.. In the past week that the majority of the ten thousand election jurisdictions nationwide are going to be using windows seven or older operating system. That's not what am I for. Voting the twenty twenty windows seven reaches the end of life on January fourteenth means a systems that are vulnerable hacking and that includes states in impacted our Pennsylvania Wisconsin Florida Iowa kind of important ones and then the whole face. What was that what the what's called face APP thing happened last week and apparently early the people in the Democratic National Committee? All these people are using face APP which is like this weird at that age. Is You and it suddenly I. I don't know it was reported that the APP was it's actually a Russian APP and they're like Oh my God they can use this app to like infiltrate your phone or whatever <hes> or could be someone was so annoyed but that's stupid APP and every post and stuff from it that they're like sent this out like hey I heard the Russians did that just to make a stop and that's what happened. I'm cool with it. That's fine the D._N._C.. told the G._N._C. and others were like <unk> getting rid of the APP immediately but around the same time Microsoft and this is last week announced it detected seven hundred forty infiltration attempts of us-based political parties by nation state actors foreign actor so this is happening like right now and the question is what if anything is being done to stop it. I think very little very little and trump is definitely gonNA stop it. It's I mean I I hope at the new shows tonight. That's what they're they're leaning coverage with is the exchanges from volume one report in the second half of the day where Muller was very clear that this is a huge threat to ARC's like he's like. I've seen a lot of threats to the U._S.. I mean he's F._B._I.. Director so presumably he's seen the worksheet of the worship Shit and he's like this is this ranks pretty high up there in terms of like Oh this is existential threat to our existence what we like. He was pretty clear sports and he didn't try and dodge questions as much rush at all. He wouldn't answer stuff about the steele dossier. He wouldn't stuff about like future indictments but he got really internal stuff yeah yeah he that's what he was asked did well. The trump like the trump campaign they welcome this efforts by Russia to subvert democracy and he's like yes. Did they later lie to cover up this they did this. I think the answer is like <hes> generally. Yes I think at one point there was a slide that was shown on with trump tweeting support over and over and over for wikileaks and you know clearly basically encouraging you know like this kind of foreign interference in the release of of information and all this stuff and <hes> Molly Muller was asked. Is that troubling he's like yeah. This is very troubling and should be under is uninvestigated should be under investigation. Problematic is an understatement right right so that is also about the time he made an extremely interesting statement. I didn't expect he was asked about you know the national security applications of all these trump officials who worked with foreign powers and enlight about it and he said in his exact words or something like he can't talk about it because the F._B._i.. is currently looking into it and then he clarified yet currently right now all those like the ability of foreign states like blackmail people and the executive branch right now that's being currently look into which I think that was news just about everyone. I'm sure that's something that's going to keep. A lot of people really worried. Get rewarded there. I have no idea that's going on but I think that was. Maybe that was his way a of appeasing some of the you know what I mean like I mean he wouldn't lie about yeah he could be. There is a currently ongoing F._B._I.. And he didn't say much enjoy the counterintelligence investigation he described how they had people. Oh that were outside of the special counsel's office that were there to sort of go through their stuff and make sure that the counterintelligence as opposed to the criminal investigation aspects what they found was taken into account but he personally was not involved in that and he can't answer questions about it. Wouldn't that's questions about it but he didn't critter was a whole separate nash security instigation going on and it's still going on. Can I ask you. This is taking a step back from this. What do you think it was a point of this other than I think it was valuable in in getting out the sound bites and important formation from the report and the conclusions that are clearly there but trump says are not there <hes> but do you think this was a way for House Democrats to kind of lay out like a case from peach mint that in part <hes> and also just to actually get him on the record and get me he wouldn't give clear open concise statements obviously but with a presence in going around saying the report says there was no obstruction like which is a blatant lie and he was unchecked by that the oldest stop that that stop that narrative was to try and stop it was to come in and be like actually yeah no that that's not what happened now? The impeachment parts also was part of it of course Muller seem biologically incapable saying the impeachment word conferred to it indirectly a couple times I mean it's very I'm sure in his head. He's thinking like y'all motherfucker. I mean as clear as possible. This do obstructed justice. This is all kinds of crimes and I left it to other mechanisms. Organisms for redress. I was talking about impeachment. I'd do your do your jobs right. It's like I'm sure she looks like I did all my. I did my thing I hate ship. I kept I kept the integrity investigation top notch and with it that's on your yeah. He was asked speaking the integrity grilled a few times different folks about the leaks. There was a leak from his office sweat. What was that legally not not not that was all bullshit? That's the whole point of that question. I think that there was a leak there was not there's no evidence of that Africans his name he has binders twenty-five those leaks from your office and Muller's like there were no mouse and representative is like well I had detailed right here like this one in Muller just like stony-faced like they in my office and like there's one they assure up and it's like he ran a tight ship so no but there were no leaks that are proven and it seems unlikely that the League's he was talking about come from Muller's office and yet that is not my impression that was left with is that Muller's office was leaking despite the fact that they they are like a even for like any. It's impressive. How little leaking came out of that office right but that's now going to be a talking point that is at the happened just refused to answer another interesting thing muller brought up not once but twice actually which to he's just a dark darker deeper probably darker story is he was asked about? What should we do to stop this from happening again? And most time you demerge. He's like well. I'm not in government anymore. That's not for me as for Y'all good luck with that but twice he broke that answer and he's like at one time he referenced quote the ability of our agencies to work together as an important way of fighting against Russian or other countries interfering in our democracy talked me into doing point how like when different agencies a fragment moment of peace and their ability to come together and share that like to me. He was very clear he was saying like part of the problem was in two thousand sixteen different agencies had a piece of the Pie and none them all together until it was too late and that's not uncommon the happens a lot all different kinds of matters but on something like this you know I mean and the but the only way to counter that going forward is like for some kind of task force to be crater some kind of inter agency. You know like entity be created. Make sure it doesn't happen and there's no way this administration's allow that to happen. They want it to be as fragmented as possible and Congress has shown like nobility actually get their act together and do that themselves so yeah. There's definitely I mean that was to me of ACR- takeaways that we are vulnerable. The threat is ongoing and there's almost nothing being done adequately. Stop It. I I mean look at this point. I feel like won't be impeachment proceedings. Whatever political call Nancy Pelosi is making trump is going to get another four years because interferences ongoing then he's going to get out and when he gets out he will not be charged with anything because of what you said earlier and then that's that I like you're out but I I will say this? I now given today's hearing I actually would look to Congress. I'm more anchin Congress moving on the four interference than I am on the impeachment. That's a greater priority at this point. I don't know I mean if he should have been the thing is Democrats didn't want impeach him. They think he is a weak candidate. He'll be easier to beat if he's still in office and twenty twenty which which I think is a grave miscalculation but between that in the inability of D._O._J.. Our special counsel to actually lay out the crimes trump has done. I don't know how you can impeachment if if Muller could be like here all the crimes he did that might force Democrats in action even they don't want to do it but the combining the two the opinion and this belief among Democratic leadership that trump is the best person can run against the twenty because they're saying they're not saying that just following scripts that I don't understand why they think like the guy already beat you once. It's because he gingerly weekly he is unpopular. He's disorganized. He has a huge word now. They're not worried about enough and they seem to think that he's actually going to like roll over and quit if he loses in the vote which he's not going to well trump. No He's not going to this hearing if nothing else did distract him from his ongoing racist attacks against the four women you don't like calling the squad but it's easier to call but having said that his since those racist attacks his approval ratings have gone even up higher in his base I mean Republicans love them even more. That's why thank you that's what they voted for. Anything he has to appeal is his nativist blazes sensibilities like that that is why they wanted their they feel they don't care what policies he has. Having the president up there saying what they think for a lot of his base is all the policy they want him in the first place and by the way speaking of blonde bloated racists the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom now. It's going to go head to head with our <hes>. Boris Johnson is now the prime minister of I mean it's shocking but I have to say at some point that guy who was at the hearing were just part look someone's like I was walking out of the room and walk back in real quick and someone was like and he goes Republican was like is Boris Johnson compromise too and I'm like what the heck did. I miss here what oh no. I totally that might have been when I was like I need Annapolis told you it was my brain starting to fry. I don't know but let's see I mean I will say this troubles this guy so let's see how Boris Johnson's like Oh brexit it is happening. Come hell or high water so so much the U._k.. is going to go into recession and then Germany's already going recession so it's a and then you'll follow and well the good news that happens trump well lose election his goal right now is has to try in a juicy commie out of every ounce of going power and has hoping hoping it some third what next fourteen fifteen months through November twenty twenty <hes> by of course he's finally getting his way because it into our next week the Fed will be meeting and basically is a certainty this point. They're going to cut raise just like trump wanted and the only question is how much you're gonna cut it which will help the Commie limp along a bit longer until it inevitably blows up only questions before before or after the twenty twenty election deduction well speaking of next week next week is also around two of the eight thousand Democratic candidates debates <hes> right. There's like two days of debates happening. I believe next week correct so I don't know if that happened before or after we schedule this follow that too. I'm looking forward to seeing Marianne again caught. I'm not laugh at this kind of candidates. It's we've learned the lesson I will say though of course if Marien beats trump I just God that's not theirs they would be. It's not gonna be any better all right okay. We'll all get crystals yet. Well I imagine crystals and we'll all I'll be like oh vaccination should be a personal choice between a baby doctor and just hug the illness away but those crystals I get I'm GonNa Reconsider Given how she looks sixty seven that is and maybe maybe there's something to them or something to if she eats them. I don't know all right. That's what she does. I will say the final on the testimony today for historians people who doubt the importance of individuals wolf and world altering events just imagine if Komi had muller's job and Muller had combs job oh it would have been a different world yeah if Komi had had what Muller Muller approached stick with roles not say a word beyond the bounds of what a public prosecutor should Hillary Clinton be president and in a world where trump does win but Komi special counsel trumpeted impeached a year ago right right right <hes> that's profound include thought all right. Thanks so much and thank you guys for tuning in and we'll be back in one week catching a big thanks to all our listeners for tuning into the forty fifth podcasts week after week and if you'd like to give us further support you can do that by becoming a patron at Patriotair dot com slash forty fifth pod by doing so you can become a supporter and patron for as little as five bucks a month to do so again go to Patriot dot dot com slash forty fifth pod a shout and thank you to our sponsors they make this program possible and I urge our listeners. Please check out our sponsors and user products and thank you them for helping us produce week after week. Thank you to our audio producers. Hannah McCarthy our executive producer meet the foul hand and you can find us on social media. We are on twitter facebook instagram. Our handle is at forty fifth pod. Our website is W._W._w.. Dot Forty Fifth POD DOT COM. Thanks again for tuning in.

trump Donald Trump Muller Flynn president Molly Muller prime minister Russia official United States special counsel Turkey Congress Iran D._C robby robby Prime Minister House Intelligence Committee President Michael Council broncos
RD - Dowd Audio, Manafort Goes To Rikers & Harvey Weinstein Update

Reasonable Doubt

00:00 sec | 1 year ago

RD - Dowd Audio, Manafort Goes To Rikers & Harvey Weinstein Update

"Thanks for listening to reasonable doubt on podcast one. Well, a great reasonable doubt plan for you guys today. Well as a matter of fact, I really heard it, it was excellent took a deep dive into the kospi case, and many others as well. I ate sleep dot com, chronic sleep deprivation leads to depression, diabetes, obesity, cardiovascular disease. We need our sleep and nice eight hours. Feels great one of sleeps biggest problems temperature my whole life growing up in the San Fernando Valley. No air to sweating through. I was gonna say the mattress and the box spring, but we didn't have a box with a mattress tossing and turning jumping into the neighbor's pool in the middle of the night, hosing myself down. God when it's hot it is so bad for sleep, the pod by eight sleep high tech. 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Cannot be combined with any other offer combo meal, single item at regular price TV, leaving free streaming television service, by the way. What over one hundred TV channels thousands of movies on demand. All guess what completely free, they never ask you for a credit card? You don't even need to sign up. Just watch for free Keitel TV is easy, and take it for me. Completely legal way to watch your favorite TV shows in hit movies for free. What are you waiting for? Never pay for TV again. Download date TV and checkout chassis on channel five one. You can download poodle TV for free on. All of your favorites vices, including guess what? Your phone Roku, Amazon fire TV apple TV smart TVs PlayStation, and anywhere else who spree. This is Corolla digital. This is reasonable doubt with your hosts, Mark Garriga's and Adam. Get it on. Got to get it on no choice. Get on mandate. Get it on. And welcome to the best hour or so in the universe. It's reasonable doubt. I'm Adam Karol. That's Mark gara- guests in Manhattan. I am in Manhattan feeling. Good feeling. Very good. Actually how about you? I am in Glendale, and feeling very good myself. So there's much to talk about. I don't know if you want to start or talk about. Yeah. Gary, you know what I want to start with, because it's fascinated me the whole week. I sent to Gary today. Do you have the John while set it up? This week. The judge we've talked about before in the Michael Flynn case Emmet Sullivan ordered the government to not only supply the transcript and Gary can probably read that and I don't know how we wanna set it up. But also ordered the government to post the audio recording of John Dowd, who was then President Trump's lawyer calling Kellner at Covington. And Burling who was Michael Flynn's lawyer, and leaving them a boy Smale. You have Gary I do here we go. Hold on. Hold on one second, Jerry. Let's just set the table for second Flynn is decorated serviceman, who was he was he was he the very high up in the in the Trump cabinet got pulled in interviewed by the FBI and or. Actual use the national security adviser was a. I forget his level, but he was a general or a variation of general during Obama. Either resigned. Matana kenro. Yeah. And wasn't. He perp walked out the door by the bomber administration. I guess we'll, we'll figure it out. I also we you and I talked about, I think the Hanson, then handsome, deputy G. So, yeah, it's went to the White House to warn them about him. Then shortly after that. There was a conversation and this is why it's topical. They ended up firing him presumably because he was not truthful with Mike tents. Then Trump supposedly told Komi go easy on in and then Colmey was fired. And then he was supposed to be Flynn was prosecuted by the special counsel was supposed to be sentenced and judge Emmet Sullivan. Said at the sentencing when he was still represented by calendar at Covington Burling that, that he was basically, not gonna go along with these two six month recommendation that arguably Flynn had sold out his country or something to that effect. All right. So now, we'll listen to the conversation of the recording. It's a voicemail from John Dowd to Michael Flynn's lawyer, whose name is Robert Kelner. All right. And dowd. It's Trump's attorney dad was Trump's was transact learning. Exactly. This is John again. Maybe I sympathetic. I understand your situation. Let me see. The stated in star parents. If you have. Will surprise me if you've got onto the deal and where. I understand that. You can't you join such. If on the other hand. Relation that. The president. We've got a national security issue. Maybe national security, right a mall. Some issue we've got to deal with of cousin country. So. You know the. Only need sometime heads up just for the sake of. Protecting all on his can. Without you having to give up any helping. So. And if it's a former. Remember what we always said about. Depression through Flint. No, that's, that's. Anyway, living oh and. I appreciate your listening and taking lifestyle. So what do you make of that? Well, so there's all kinds of this is a great example of. Okay. We've now heard in real time, what it is the transcript was related or it was parts of it were excerpted in the Miller report. Jon dad was very upset about the way it was excerpted in the Miller report and said he had been smeared since this has been released people are claiming he obstructed Justice now. You listen to that as the layperson before I break it down. I'm very curious. I'm always curious to hear your take on it before I've kind of. Dovan do what's your take on this? I didn't have a, a lot of context to it. So I was having difficulty figuring out. Mike compass was spinning around a little, I did hear him say, like, don't give us anything that's confidential or has to do with something. And then he said something about the president likes him or something. But I couldn't really. You know what I was thinking the whole time? One of the things I was thinking the whole time is, why would an attorney leave a it's like in those movies where they find the guy the murders list shopping list duct tape, I news zip ties, ether rag and you think why would someone make that and then leave it behind, you know? So why would a season to turn record a bunch of stuff that was illegal or showed whatever, treason or collusion or something? Why would he leave that as a message? So this is what's infuriating to me, but is also kind of at the heart of our partisan divide. So I saw the original portion in the Muller report, and I tended to air on the side of loose doesn't look good. Then I heard John Dowd. Say you know what the hell? And then the audio gets posted by judge Sullivan, who I have I can't tell you. And I've said this before almost a year ago show insomuch respect for I, I have not appeared in front of him. But I've done a all with him. And he's just to my mind he's exactly what judge should be. So I listen to this. And people are I've seen people on Twitter saying, oh my God. This is obstruction ran this is what I now know why said obstruction and blah, blah, blah. Okay. First of all, just break them, first thing he said was if you're pulling out. Basically the joint defense. Let me explain what that is. If they're coming after Flynn, who's represented by guy from Covington, Berlin, the president and a number of other people, whether it's charity, Don jR you, what you enter into so that the lawyers can defend against this, because obviously, the government always has the ability charge a conspiracy. You have to be very careful you six amendment right to have a lawyer, and the lawyer wants to talk to the other lawyers. But the targets themselves Flynn Trump, Jared Kirschner Don jR, if they talk to each other that new government's going to use that and say these marking the ongoing conspiracy. So as lawyers, you enter into a joint defense agreement, which means we could talk about ourselves the privilege or work product extends to the discussions were having so we can talk together. And what he's saying is in generally, what happens in this isn't anything there is, if you enter into plea Goshi Haitians with the government. And in this case, it would have been Flynn or you're going to plead you have to withdraw because the government doesn't want to intrude on the attorney, client privilege, and you don't want some guy, you know, rolling on you or on your can't thrall. So, so there's, there's me you and Gary. Gear we're in a room, and we have an agreement that we can share all the information. That's germane our situation in a conspiracy to take down. Mayor, Eric Garcetti. All right. Or his criminal attempt to have the homeless takeover. Los angeles. Right. But at some point I announce that I'm now been selected as district selectmen by America are SETI, and I'm gonna go work for Garcetti aren't going to strike a deal with Garcetti. And then you see more importantly, said he gets the city attorney to say, I'm gonna prosecute atom for aiding and abetting. The homeless on the streets. Right. And you say okay, I'll plead to that, right. And now I'm out of the circle of trust. Exactly. That's a perfect way to put it. So do you tell do you do the honorable thing? And tell me, join Gary or are you like a little snake? Right. Which is I'm cutting a deal but I'm not saying anything in the circle. And so that's where Dowd starts off. Basically saying, hey Kellner, you've got ready? You've gone radio silent. I understand if you, you know, doing a plea and you're withdrawing from the joint defense, but and then he gets to level number two. Which is now so level number ten years, and this is where the they're the fundamental, and it's, it's strikes at the issue about report, the bar interpretation everything else, their argument is and the argument about Flynn, is, is that Flynn jump started foreign policy discussions with foreign powers before Trump was sworn it makes sense. So November, he gets elected December calls are being made and then gets Trump gets sworn in January, February is one all hell breaks loose, and they start going back and looking at the December calls post-election free inauguration. If I laid it out. Yep. Okay. So they're saying that somehow and judge Sullivan, who knows more than anybody about this. I've said. He thinks there's a sewing out your country. So I don't know what he's referring to. But what he's asked to be posted, which is John doubts call. I agree with John Dowd that, when you hear it in context, okay? Yes, he says the president likes here this or that okay is that obstruction is not saying, don't lie. He's not saying don't go operate. He's just saying, basically, we're not rolling anew right, right? Yeah, we've kind of gone at this for a while. And there's just depends the beauties in the ear of the beholder justices in the ear of the beholder, I guess, because that's where rat. Now, one side of that is going to hear it as one way, the other side aisles going to, here's another way. But we can't have that much interpretation for the lar in the law, like at some point, which is. Is going to need to set a Mark. And if you cross it, you cross it, and if you come right up to it, then you come right up to it. But there needs to be a line call the law because otherwise this is Sodom and Gomorrah. Like if there's no law, if there's a line in the law, I mean just like we have to have it for a salt. I mean like bad vibes, or bad words, or whatever, can't be assault if the sort of put your hands on somebody to be have an aggravated assault thing if there's no hands, but we know what was in your heart or we know what you're thinking, or the person felt like you assaulted, then we're getting into a blurry murky world, where it's up to everyone's feelings versus a clear cut definition of the law to right? I mean, you pinned it down it is, this is literally insanity. The people who say, and this is where I take a little issue, and I've said before because. Because when we were analyzing the mullahs report, I was I've been very complimentary. I remain very complimentary on the legal analysis. But part of the thing you have to do when you were analyzing anything that's done by a prosecutor prosecutorial agency has you have to hear or see the raw data, because prosecutors, like everybody filter it through their prison. So when they presented in a report, you say to yourself, they take excerpts of it. You say, wow, that sounds really fucked that, but you then hear it does doubt south threatened. You know, and again, this sounds like maybe a spurious argument, but I don't think seasoned legal professionals leave voice messages of nefarious acts that are illegal. I just. You're almost in a weird way. And look, you call this retarded logic. But in a weird way, the fact that he just left a message suggests to me with his experience, that he wasn't in, at least in his head colluding or threatening or, or whatever is doing because she's in law professional would not leave that on tape. And by the way, John, John Dowd, could not have a more sterling reputation. I mean he is for whatever you say about the guy has existed in the swamp and the, you know, the complete cesspool that is washing for forty some odd years. And while I might not agree on everything that he's dining career. Any obviously would probably push back on mine. He is nothing but a true advocate. What so the idea that you're just gonna trash him? I mean I can only imagine what doubts thinking downs, probably thinking, oh, you wanna Muller's do this to me. Let me try to do some excerpts about Muller and his team, I can imagine. Well, so just in an a nutshell that recording. We just heard, they took excerpts of it, they put it in black and white, and it looked a little more damning or quite a bit more damning in black and white with experts of it now hearing, it, it didn't sound nearly is damning who released the audio tape. Good judge judge Sullivan ordered that it be posted which the government did. And that's the judge in the Flynn case that you respect the judges presiding over the Flynn case who also can t I'm like I've always said nothing but good things about judge Sullivan. He obviously saw something in what's being supplied to him that troubled in greatly. So whatever we're talking about now. We're not being able to see all right? So we'll get to that in a second or will put a pin in that for a second. I have questions about Manafort, got sent to Rikers and put in solitary, so they say, I'm interested, I always think about you. When I hear about this kind of stuff. Which I which I wanna talk about. But you've got something you wanna tell us about? When I I'll let you pour your shelf caq down. I'll tell you about that teen counseling dot com. Connect your thirteen and nineteen year old with a licensed professional counselor and do it where they spend all their time on their phone on their smartphone. I don't have to go into an office or wait wait out in a parking lot or do any of that starts with a short questionnaire to help them understand your teen and their needs. Then you're matched with an available therapist start communicating with in twenty four hours. You can review their credentials and directly communicate with the counselor to make sure it's a good fit easy and free to change counselors if that's needed more forcible than traditional counseling and financial aid is available. So kids are out there. They're exposed a lot of stuff on the internet all violent video games. And all that. Junk on YouTube, they need to get their heads straight. And for that there's teen counseling dot com slash doubt. So visit teen counseling dot com slash doubt. Help your team take charge of the mental health and get a ten percent discount when you use hashtag, or I should say when you do slashed out at teen counseling. So. What's going on? Why why I was listening to. Dershowitz trying to think of as Allender I'm trying to think of. Yeah. Listening to him talk about man for moving or being transferred to reicher's and why they would do that. Do you have thoughts on that? Okay. This is the most amazing kind of parallel that I've talked about, you know, better than anybody. Everytime. We talk about the Muller investigation Russia, I always default to whitewater, and sees McDougal, and I'm fixated on it because the parallels are unbelievable. So when Susan was convicted before I represented her she was on trial with the then governor of Arkansas Jim Guy Tucker, enter husband. She gets convicted sometime in the nineties, and that's federally then when she wouldn't testify in front of the. Jury just like Manafort won't to cooperate or is cooperating is deemed ineffective. You know what they did was Susan. They took her and I learned this afterwards when I heard the tapes, they, they had put her at the cars, well, Texas federal medical facility, and she was intercepted talk to other going momma. It's so great here. I love it here. And they heard that Ken Starr heard that the independent counsel that and they had her dragged to Sybil brand in LA, which was a woman's county jail state facility, just like writers is at New York for soli Rikers is notorious civil brand back then was that Torius. Rikers will probably be shut down. Civil brand was shut down. And they put Susan into murders to get her to cooperate to get her to force her to rollover. So the parallels to me, our unity. Well, I don't know how you know what I'm curious about when I talked to you with all your legal expertise, is I get what they want everyone has what they want. But certain point you have to justify what you want, and you can say, well, if we're going to do a trial for him in the state of New York than we would transfer him to a local facility like Rikers, right? But you would do it days before the event, not a year before the event, or, or however long if that's even on the calendar or not. So what would they say as to when you go to Rikers, then you have to go to solitary? Rikers 'cause you're not gonna last in general pop it Rikers. I'm reading about it, though. The solitary aspect means according to this New York Times article that he would be kept in, like an eight unit setup. So he during the day they have they're not kept in their cells. So they get to go into a big room of the TVs doesn't sound that bad. It's him and seven other dudes two TV's common room. Okay. But what they used to say about McDougal, they'd say, oh, when I would say, she's on murder, Israel. No, no, no, no. She's at their protective custody. She's got her own. So she's got a toilet. This is this is like the four seasons of women's jails, and you go over there and you look at it and say, oh, I mean, you would literally not put your worst enemy in this facility, and Rikers is the same way. And, you know, the only reason must be honest that Manafort, is being prosecuted by the. The state is because they're deathly afraid that Trump will pardon him, right? Because if he pardons in for the federal then what do they do? So this is the way to do it. They prosecutor moves thing, right? And Trump can't pardon the state in cannot partners and call. No. Who's the governor is not gonna part Manafort, right? Why? What is their reason for the trance transport? I know they do. Xactly what they did with McDougal. They couldn't core. They couldn't co worse for lack of a better term cooperation federally so they said, okay, we'll send you this state, and we'll see over new with the state the exactly what they did was Susan McDougal about prosecutor her that convicted her. They had her sentenced. Federally she wouldn't cooperate in so they shipped her to the state of kind point. Eight here, the state New York, I completely great. What I'm saying is the way our legal system works is you go down the grapevine, and you're driving to Pebble Beach, and there's cops with radar or lie. Dr all over the dash of their car, and they're coming the other way on the grapevine year going north. They're going south. They pass you, you're going eighty one miles an hour. They hook a u-turn turn go through the median fish tale kick a bunch of gravel up complying behind it one hundred and five miles an hour. And then they charge you with speeding give you three hundred dollar ticket and explain it was dangerous what you were doing with dangerous, and that's why we have to do it. Now. We know it's a ticket writing party, and we know that's how they raise money. We know it's a money grab. But when you say to them, what's going on with all the chicken shit tickets. They don't go. It's. Money. Grab they go. It's a safety issue, so they're full of shit. I mean, the governments will shit all the time with everything, but they least have a some semblance of an answer. And it's never a we're out. We're trying to get money from taxpayers. We're trying to this is a safety issue, which isn't a safety issue. So I'll take it one step more, I had a case once which I think, is more nowadays, the in this probably goes back twenty years, the feds head of wire tap, the wire tap showed or caught my client on the wiretap, but the wiretap had expired and the fed should've shut it down. But they caught that my client supposedly was driving contraband on a particular freeway that I think went through Victor Ville. So instead of admitting that what they did was the cop who was the. Illegally surveilling, the wiretap the federal wiretap gave a bullshit tip quote unquote anonymously to see HP officer, CHP officer, pulls over my client get this for illegally crossing over the gore point. You know what the gore point is now gore point jewelry. Is that kind of triangular painted thing? When you go to the left, my guide crossed over those two or point painted lines. And so it was just a pretext stop. Right. They pulled over they find the contraband. They prosecute him became apparent once we started doing discovery something else was going on. And we determined that. In fact, it was illegal tip off off of an illegal wiretap case gets thrown out. That's basically what's happening here. I mean that's. Hill. I'm still wanna know they're transferring him to Rikers. They have to give a reason they can't say they want to sweat him. So he'll composer, saying the have to say it's four his safety, or it's four Loma anything friends transferring him to the state court jurisdiction. Right. Because they're arraigning him on sixteen felony counts for mortgage fraud and stuff. So what they're saying is he has to be in New York to attend his trial. Right. But as a trial going to begin now, that's no. But what they're doing. There's something that's called when you wanna prosecute you have to distinguish between the federal and the state when you're in federal custody, the state in order to get you after you've been sentenced if they wanna cost to you after you what's called a writ at prosecute window, and they have to get the feds to bring you over. And so that's what they're doing. They're saying that the feds, okay, you've sentenced him. He's. His sentence now, we want to successively prosecute. I get it. But don't you have to have something on the calendar? Like, don't you have to say, we need the defendant? Five Wayne, or they'll want to rein him. Don't do all that's easy. They can always do that. Yeah. I'm just I still keep doubling and tripling back to. So he his trial is now there's a date for his trial. There will be they want jurisdiction. But the fact of transferring him is that suspicious, the fact of charging him with the state court act after that's where he's got a real issue. I mean, I think manafort's gone issued a challenge. Sorry guide. Carry day currently scheduled. All right. I'm just saying like shouldn't I as somebody who somebody like you went through this with Susan McDougal and stuff like that? Wouldn't you think that there should be a law that says we must have a court date on the calendar? And then we transfer the guilty party or the or the defendant gets transferred five working days before the trial begins. It seems just what sixty seconds. I'll tell you why. Because that's exactly how long this commercial last. Nobody else you can do it about a minute offer for your car with truecar by the way, I just did it two weeks ago. That's right in the amount of time. It takes the floss your teeth. Cut your dog. Do few sit-ups? Listen to my voice laughed with Adam, you can get a true cash offer. Best of all, you can do it from a smartphone or your house. Just go to truecar and your license plate. Number watch your car's details, pop-up answer, a couple of questions, get an accurate true cash offer from a local truecar certified dealer that fricken easy. After that, just bring your car in. They'll check it out. I did this with them. They'll do it with you together. They walk around. They look at the mileage make sure you didn't roll a back like you're some arm. Oh, you ask ques-? Get the answers you need. There's no surprises. Ren leave with just a check no hammered at the Bank or trade in your car for new ride. So when you're ready to experience a better way to sell or trade in your car, guess what checkout truecar today are so we'll put Manafort to bed. He, he didn't write her stores, prison Rikers, these being put the bed. But look, this is the problem with this stuff. There are all kinds of laws about if you've been prosecuted for behavior. California used to have this. In fact. Backward. I represented the Japanese OJ that's a whole different case this came into full relief in California, about fifteen years ago, but there used to be a protection under double jeopardy where if the feds prosecuted you for something, and you resolved it you were found guilty or found that Kilty you entered a plea. You couldn't be prosecuted again, by the state, that's kind of a concept of double jeopardy, and also double punishment. Well, that was always long, California used to be the one New York. But then when this stuff came up, everybody was worried that, you know, democratically controlled state, that Trump was going to pardon people and pardon his way out of this. So they started to change. The law say this couldn't happen. Same thing, California. Did with Japanese OJ. Saying you couldn't you couldn't either pardon or double jeopardy, or double punisher way out. I think it's bullshit because I don't think the government should get a do over so to speak, and it doesn't matter on whose ox, oxes getting court. It's just it is fundamentally absurd. If you're going to stand trial or deal with a case and enter a new a plea that should be the end of it. You shouldn't be successively prosecuted. That is the one of the fundamental things the constitution is based upon. I thought that two things one is, I'm curious, if you give us an update or know what's going on with Weinstein are some talk about. I don't know. He might not see the inside of a prison, sow. And then also on a on a happy impersonal note. I was walking my dog couple days back. I saw shadowy figure coming the other way on the street. It turns out, it was Paulette Garriga's. She was walking as she always does. And this time she had something in her hands. I looked down to notice there were garbage in her hands, and I inquired about the garbage, and she said, I hate it when people litter and I picked it up. Now, your wife. She's better than all of us because I was just gonna say 'cause that's not us. She walks the neighborhood, like like a catfish wins the bottom of the lake. She goes around. She's like one of those things, remember those swimming pools were called polarises. They had the weird hose on it, and they just keep rolling around. And once in a while water go shooting in the air and they got what's that thing doing? It's cleaning the pool as you sleep. It's just circling as you sleep. She walks the badlands of locking Yata and picks up garbage she wasn't wearing gloves. She didn't have a sack. She was holding one thing look like a greasy filter, she's holding a foam thing. There was all and I said, what are you doing? She said, I'm cleaning it drives me nuts and there's trash can incite either meant she was walking for miles with that Jenner hand all as a Saint in that respect. She will walk. So pick up garbage venture see the horses shallow pedal horrors, she'll take picture she'll send me the picture and tell me the send it to my client, mugs horses show ven might reach out to drew and tell drew that Shandor stances, typhus rates or send something else to me and tell me son this the're client, who has the issues with mental illness. I mean it's unbelievable. I know she's, she's a certain breed. I tell you, I one of those things where look anyone can be good when you're watching them, this is just her randomly picking up garbage. Walking for like two hours a day around locking Jato, like our meter, maid, so Weinstein, there's some luckily with Harvey, so you know, run Sullivan, who was the Harvard professors slash game who Harvard decided to, you know. Kind of cage in to the whining little kids, who felt unsafe because he was exercising the constitution in the six amendment. He went south Jose, who is his last remaining lawyer, I think, probably is finding about exiting, but interestingly. Enquiring minds suspect, that he's putting together a new team in could be quite a formidable team. Well, if you are betting man, would you suspect he's going to prison for these alleged crimes? I if I'm a betting man, I'm going to say. That it will be a I'm hoping experience the quality of the evidence that is being used against him. I based on what I know I know you know, a lot is this thing is not what people think it is. And it you know, it's whether he gets a fair jury in a fair shape. I think it's going to surprise quite a few people. Well, you're right on with the Cosby trial, you did you did call that one by the ways Cosby is he going to die in prison unless he gets to an appellate court fairly soon. And I don't know what the state of his health is. But, you know, he's got some issues. He's got issues, meaning here are some substantial appellate issues. I always thought he never should've let, Brian Monaghan, whatever the guy's name was who was his first local lawyer, because that guy was I thought a quality Moyer new the environment. New the state court and did a hell of a job the first time around he should've done, whatever it could take to get him to be the lawyer the second time around, because I, I never thought that the second trial was tried the same way the first ones. But it would not surprise me to see his case reverse. It's just what is the eighty years old? He's eighty one. Gary says, how long has he been in Gerry's at been over a year now? And then Mark, if you're Bill Cosby's attorney what are you doing right now? Probably. I won't come because I was thinking about fee are betray Shen. I'd probably trying to find any way possible to expedite the appeal based on his age found an hour, based on his medical condition and say, look, you know, we, we need to expedite this. We don't want to continue it. We don't want to get further time to do briefing. We wanna get to argument. We want your honors to hear the case what facility is he is. He in a club fed type thing or prison. Present doesn't sound like it. I'm reading an article where it says that his friends in prison are former drug Lord and a member of the pagans biker game. He went in September. Twenty eighteen September twenty fifth to be exact and his earliest possible release date per his Wikipedia pages, September twenty fifth twenty twenty one. Yeah. And he's in state court. That was a state court case almost uniformly, a state court prison or holding facility is exponentially worse than a federal facility. Right. Such when you get to supermax or eleven worth supermax in Colorado is on like that the federal system has legitimate kinds of levels, or tiers that, treat the offender by what they were convicted of what the sentence was. They take that into account. The state court, the state correctional facilities are just more draconian on the for the most part, generally. So he's in right now. What's Weinstein doing? Is he just laying low somewhere? Yeah. He's laying low is in bounces back and forth between Manhattan wherever I, I actually talked to him with some frequency and break bread with Amman occasion. And, you know, I've known I've known him for number of years. I've known him when he was in a captain of the universe or, you know, the head of the universe. I know him now. I mean, it's, it's kind of an interesting dichotomy to see what happens for people and how they hold up when their, their life is turned upside down. What is the me how I don't mean to laugh? I just mean like I have no, it's, it's a funny thing if you if you hang around long enough, you see people at the height of their power to see people on the way down. You see people on the way. Up as his demeanor different now. You know, I would say observing Harvey that whatever therapy, he's gone through was affected. I'd love to talk to drew in the abstract about that. But Harvey is humbled, Harvey Asli can't go through something like this not be unbel-. We can't go through a divorce without, you know, taking kind of stock of whatever he's a different. He's a different guy. You're still clever witty and sharp. And but clearly it's taken a toll on him. That's that goes without saying is, is this, a safe statement, where they're talking about Weinstein or Bill Cosby that fifty years ago, there's no such thing as he's guys being an any kind of legal jeopardy that fifty years ago with years, ten years ago, Harvey RV, wouldn't be ten years ago? Turn. Ten years ago and have soon in Bailey because, you know, the kospi, I'm not so sure because concert being is is more complicated just from a legal standpoint. I'll never understand that deposition are all never understood. Why answered the way did that deposition was his death knell? And when I talk about the deposition, it's where he admitted to giving quail leads to somebody end. She was basically not. He basically confessed in that deposition. Now you can make arguments, you know, whichever way you want in. I don't know Bill. I think we've met twice. I didn't have anything to do with his defense. So I'm obviously speculating, but and I don't know the ins and outs why they gave it. I mean, I think the lawyers at the time had a good faith belief, and this is one of his issues on appeal that the, the. Leeann signed off, on give the deposition, we will use it against you to me. That's transactional, immunity. And transactional, immunity means we're giving you a pass you, you know, you could talk and it can't be against you then ten years later that use it against them. Is that unfair? I it's going to be up to an appellate court to decide how in terms of give us a deposition, we won't use it against you. What do they need the deposition for it was? So the woman, the accuser could proceed with her civil case for money. She did proceed civil case for money. And she did get a check so right? That would be your appeal. If you're Cosby's to me, that's my feels like what the hell you let me down the pros path. You told me you weren't going to use it. I decided to proceed along a civil track money track a now. You're prosecuting me ten years later after in a heated political election. I've been there's just something fundamentally wrong with that. You can say whatever you want about him. They get predator. I get that. I'm not disputing what anybody was take that position. What I'm saying is, if I rely on somebody's promise, who is law enforcement, that says we're not going to prosecute you, if you give a deposition, and then ten years later, you prosecute me when there's a different prosecutor. I don't think that's fair. Well, the part of the whole Cosmi thing that rubbed me the wrong way, maybe it's a sort of the thing. For today's reasonable doubt is the prosecutor, the DA or whomever announcing as part of their campaign that if elected they would retry Bill Cosby. Exactly. That's what I'd say. That's really at camping crown this if elected prosecutor sky, how many times have we talked about Bill bar. And I thought, you know, if, if it's true that he says you shouldn't use the criminal Justice system. To recognize political sites. Well, is there a better example? I don't know. But it seems to be going on more and more. Or maybe we're just awake to it. A woke to it now or woken. I we made me woke that it seems like every time I turn on the news. Everyone's just trying to use the system to take somebody down to either gain favor with the populace and get votes to gain favor with their party. I mean you turn on the news. Trump wants to investigate the investigators Pelosi doesn't want Trump. She wants to go to jail. Go to jail that Hannity gets upset because Pelosi wants to put him in jail, even though Trump used to do rallies, that said lock her up. I mean it's really it's just it's almost a comedy if you just try to just that back and look at the, the ojectives facts, the guy did rallies lock her up now. Hannity is appalled that Nancy Pelosi says, I want him in Jeff does anybody think that's funny? It's certainly ironic. And it does make you question everybody all the time. Because. I see who what are we talking about who you know, just try to be consistent, don't even I mean at least wink with me when you're saying this last topic then sort of on that, topic that we always bring up once a week, which is Trump is now going after whoever went after him and he's trying to figure out this deal dossier, and he's trying to figure out combing and Brennan, and all the all the folks that are inside who are now out and do all the do all the news, all the news channels what where we at with that. What, what's the latest are? What do you know there really hasn't been since last week? There hasn't been anything that I seen that has developed significantly since the appointment of the US attorney in Connecticut. Who by all accounts is, is, you know, very aggressive take no prisoners, type my when I said before you were always early money, I always pooh-poohed it, shocks me that they're going this direction. But they if they're going to legitimately go in this direction, then they've got to they've got the answer this question. How do you justify going after that? And at the same time being Bill bar and saying, I'm not going to weaponize, the criminal Justice system for political purposes. Right. Because that's what he's that's what he's doing. Well, that would I mean, that's imagine if there's somebody, he's gonna go after if he's say, it's combing saints. Brennan, whoever it is, what's the first thing that their defense lawyers going to send they're going to say, seriously, you're gonna come? After me. Now after you testified in front of congress and said, I'm not going to weaponize, the criminal Justice system. I'm just BS. The I I, I concur, but I think I think we're there are we're, we're getting. I think we. And by the way, I as a Senator number of times in the last couple of months, you know, the Republican party is become the party criminal defense, which I love, but the criminal defense mantra is, you know, the investigators need be investigated for precisely the reasons that dober- as the attorney general said. If there was no underlying crime. There can be no obstruction, which is what I argued twenty years ago on McDougal, which is great. I love it. But at the same time, don't start. And by the way, I the first witness I called him, Dougal was Hickman Ewing. Who was the independent counsel in charge of the Arkansas office of the independent counsel because I wanted to prove that the investigation was that legitimate. So I get that. But then don't Sam not going to weaponize, the criminal Justice system, and then do precisely that. But that was really interesting. That Susan McDougal was transferred to civil brand the same way Manafort goes to Rikers idea about that. Yeah. In civil grain, by the way was closed down because it was such a complete peace, a crap facility for women. And she was put on murderers row. I mean it's. Absolutely identical. In this case, this investigation of the Muller investigation is played out exactly the way whitewater. Well in a weird way, can it go any other way? I mean you'll call a million years ago, it just we're all humans we were humans in the nineties, and we're humans and the two thousands, and it's always going to go the same. It's always going to just go one direction. That's there's no other way to explain it. Hey Gary, simple brand who was civil brand, and then let me ask you this hypothetical. Mark arrogance would you want a prison named after you? Because on one hand it's turning kick out of this. Simple brand was philanthropists. Yeah. Philanthropists and activists best known locally for her work improving jail conditions for women in Los Angeles. All right. But now all we AOL the worst, the worst women's jail of all time was civil brand before they close out. Well, I'm going to bring this full circle because there was a movie called concrete jungle from the eighties, which depicted Deb's behind bars was women. And one of the stars Sybil deigning a busty blonde from the eighties. So symbol brand is not good. But when you put Sybil deigning inside of civil brand, you got a hell of an eighties, chick prison movie with Sybil, deigning, and concrete jungle. Gary, she's deigning in chain. Hey, civil civil deigning. Wave been chained heat, which is another great prison move. Thirty of the of the eighties. They don't need that, that John rouse. Not serviced anymore, Mark. You wanna know why something called pornography on everyone's phone? So you can't Hoke seventeen year olds, the C B and C lists celebrities get topless anymore in bad, prison movies. Because we have you porn on our telephone. Also tender. That's, that's right. Chain heat is what the civil deigning was in correct. I wonder Sybil deigning ever went inside of simple. Punchy now you remember civil banning. Simple dating. I remember chained heat. I remember civil brand, and I never saw anything remotely resembling civil dancing, accessible brand. When I was there a very good point. All right. I will tell you not Taco Bell material. My stand up specials available at chassis, C H. A S, S Y. And I an Amazon as well. And coming up this weekend or this next weekend, June fourteenth and fifteenth that Denver comedy works doing stand up there. Denver comedy works south, I should say go to curl that confortable the dates, Mark. What do you got? I got by the way, Palm Springs, the PS right now is the hottest place. You could be right next to Capri in the Hamptons with the pop up clinch Schophaus Concentra common Saint Clementi. The really isn't Provo pizza bar. In central terminal, and in the moxie hotel Times Square, and as always Tenny Mediterranean, tapas found town engine company twenty eight downtown, and LAX term light, and check out twenty two hours American nightmare, new hor, or sort of true crime podcast on podcast, one until next time and curl from our arrogance saying, Mahala. Thanks for listening to reasonable doubt. Tune in next Saturday for an all new episode. This is Corolla digital. Hi, it's Jamie, progressive's employee of the month two months in a row. Leave a message at the hi Jamie. It's me, Jamie. I just had a new idea for our song about the name your price tool. So when it's like, tell us what you want to pay. Trombone goes, blah, blah, blah. And you say, we'll help you find coverage options to fit your budget. Then we just all do finger snaps while a choir goes, savings coming at ya. Savings coming at ya. Yes. No. Maybe. Anyway, see you practice tonight. I got new lyrics for the rap break. Progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law. Trump puts off tariffs. I'm Tim Maguire, the AP newsmen that President Trump indefinitely suspended tariffs. He was planning to impose on Mexico on Monday, Trump twitting the evening, Mexico, as agreed to take strong measures to stem the flow of American Central American migrants into the US Mexico's ambassador to the United States, Martha bar, Coqui, reads a section of the joint agreement, in which company, her country agreed to house migrants, seeking asylum in the US crossing the US out and border to seek of. We'd be rapidly returned to Mexico were day may await their to the case of their asylum planes. The agreement comes after three days of intensive negotiations in Washington. A formal diplomatic complaint has been lodged after a Russian destroyer came within one hundred and sixty five feet of a US guided missile cruiser in the Philippine sea, navy got missile cruiser and the Russian destroyer the US, fleet says the Russian destroyer put the safety of the ship and its crew at risk. I'm Tim Maguire.

Flynn Trump Michael Flynn government Susan McDougal Gary Emmet Sullivan John Dowd president John Manafort attorney prosecutor Bill Cosby Muller fed New York Sybil deigning Adam Karol Amazon
20200508 Nicole Sandler Show - Broken Justice with Lisa Graves and Quarantine Calling Kazakhstan

The Nicole Sandler Show

1:07:22 hr | 3 months ago

20200508 Nicole Sandler Show - Broken Justice with Lisa Graves and Quarantine Calling Kazakhstan

"Following program contains graphic material including offensive language. Viewer discretion is advised. Kohl's Hanley Joe Questioning Authority daily. That could be the very reason why. Youtube is upset. They do the music. Venue here. Beneath my boys is from a broadcast. Sound Library that I paid for an ham the receipt so I bet you're happy right violation right here and now here's Nicole all right. We made it to another Friday. Welcome to it. Oh my goodness so I. I was trying to do the math. And today is either of the seventh or eighth Friday since we've been hunkering down here at home since I've been I use the royal. We allot make no mistake. This is a one woman show although I gotTa give credit to Paul leary. Paul has been helping me out trying to expand the reach of the program. So he's the reason we're now on facebook. Live we're on periscope You'll see some segments of the show exempted and posted on youtube or facebook or wherever and That's thanks to the hard work of and You know Of Paul leary. That I really appreciate so. Thank you Paul Because I you know there's only so much one person can do in a day and I am the chief per procrastinator. There's so much stuff I need to be doing and still find a way not to have enough hours in any given day to do everything I need to do. So it is what it is although I I know I hate that term. Because the idiot and the Oval Office has been using it a lot all right so we have a busy show for you today. There was big breaking news yesterday. That didn't have anything to do with the corona virus instead it shows how fucked up and tenuous this democracy or that we're living under Is and make no mistake. Under Donald Trump. The rule of law is a thing of the past The Justice Department is a joke and I. I hate to use his terminology. It's a hoax. It's a joke. It's okay but he's destroyed. Everything every norm every a rule of law in this country and so in a few minutes we'll chat with Lisa graves Lease has been on the show many times over the years she's awesome. She's one of the smartest people I know. Also the The person that I know who has risen to the highest levels within the Justice Department. In fact it was under the Clinton administration. That Lisa rose to Oh I don't want to screw up her. Her title. The Deputy Assistant Attorney General. I believe under Janet Reno and then under Ashcroft as well before she finally left anyway. I called on Lisa this morning to help explain what happened yesterday. So we'll chat with her in a few minutes and then it's Friday. It's the end of the week and I thought you know as we head into the weekend. It's time to you spin the globe and Land on another place. I've been doing a feature that I call. Quarantine calling where I call places around the planet and a meeting. These people throw a facebook group of all places called view from my window where people all over the world or posting photos of the view as the name would suggest from out their windows as we're shut in in every country or around the planet to you know try to slow the spread of covert nineteen. So today it's actually a call that I connected with on Sunday but we're going to reach out to Kazakhstan and the reason it was so special to connect with this woman in Kazakhstan on Sunday was because that was my daughter's birthday and QC don't know. I adopted my daughter from Khazakstan about twenty years ago. So we'll get to all that but before we get to any of that I I WANNA start with a song has been our recent practice over here And again I'M GONNA go back to South Africa for this election and this artist. Who I I hate to say. I discovered obviously. The kipness has been making great music for some time now. He's an accomplished musician in South Africa. And during the quarantine. He's been doing these song parodies. That are not only musically wonderful but you know are funny to now. Today's isn't necessarily funny. But I'm playing this one because For a few reasons one on huge Cat Stevens fan and t for the Tiller men was one of my favorite albums. Growing up to this. Sunday is mother's Day and although this isn't a mother's Day Song I think my mom often. On Mother's Day I lost her when I was nineteen. So my dad had to you know Become Mom and dad for me. My older sister my younger sister who was only fifteen at the time and well the kipness did one of his wonderful song. Parodies for the lockdown parody. He calls it and Well he he involves his father in it for this parody of this wonderful Cat Stevens Song so before we go any further. A musical pallet cleanser of swords. Take it away the kipness. His real name is David Scott and he's in Cape Town South Africa House. Can you hear me very well? How Things Davy? Lockton sexually told me like. Our Time's pretty strange just lex. Take it easy stike at home following. There's no place we have to go your girl several down what some TV dead me. And I was once like you on now and I know that it's Nutty to be calm when the world is going wrong. Take your time. He job anonymous before their or you will still be here tomorrow if you lose. How can I try to explain? Another day lockdown. I'll say I've spent one whole month in the same territory from the mall away to go away. You're next son. You're being strange. Sit Down Take it slowly your new strung. That's your phone. There's not much you have to go through. Allow your girl to calm you down. Relax what some T. V? Me My areas code and. I'm happy all the Times I tried to obtain the lawns side. It's hard to your rights and I agree if Mafias once but there's away way all king non king a good year for me dad likewise debut keep. Well y'all will chat soon lots of love. Thanks to my dad for doing this. Long rose The the end screen on the video said bid big. Thanks to my dad for doing the song with me. I will post the video for that. Brilliant rendition of father and son on the blog at Nicole Sandler dot com slash. Five Dash Eight Dash Twenty I again. I usually use these videos for fun for laughter and boy today. This is gave me goosebumps and I see. We've we've got some tears falling in the chat room. Yeah you know. And I'm bombed because I have written to David Scott Kipness. I've sent him for my Nicole. Sandler DOT COM email address. I've sent him from G. L. E. Mail address. I've tried to get him on twitter and on skype and and he hasn't responded to any of my requests. I'd love to have him on the show Regardless we can enjoy his music and I'll give them all the credit in the world. The kipness is the name he goes by his real name. Is David Scott? And how great was that? Sorry I didn't mean to make everyone cry but you know happy. Mother's Day and if you're lucky enough to still have your mom tell her I much appreciate her. And if you're like me and you spent many years with only a father doing double duty you can list your father a happy mother's Day to and then there are those of us who as parents are gone Anyway that's wrong is special to me and and yeah all right so we have a busy show for you today. Lots of territory to cover the four. We get started. There's a lot of news. Let me just share with you. A couple of breaking news stories things that have happened since this morning when I first recorded. What's News Well this one. I've got it sal. Yesterday we learned that one of trump's personal valets had tested positive for corona virus. Right well today. It's Mike Pence's press secretary has tested positive. Her name is Katie. And we trump say something about Katya Katya such a nice person while Katie is Katie. Miller Vice President Mike. Pence's press secretary. Who happens to be married to Stephen Miller? Sorry I don't wish on anyone but my God if some family add to get it. It works for me There was something else I wanted to share with you. let's see okay so the New York Times just broke this story. A federal investigation a federal investigative office found reasonable grounds to believe that the trump administration was retaliating against the whistle blower. Dr Bright. He was the guy who headed up the vaccine office when he was ousted from that government research agency and said he should be reinstated for forty five days while they continue this investigation. The office of Special Counsel which protects whistle blowers had quote made a threshold determination that the Department of Health and Human Services quote violated Whistleblower Protection Act by removing Dr Bright from his position because he made protected disclosures in the best interest of the American public. Unfortunately this decision is not binding. It's more or less a suggestion. That they reinstate Dr Bright for forty five days it will now be up to the secretary of Health and Human Services. Alex Agr to decide whether to let the special counsel investigate and send Dr Bright Back to Barda. So there's that Oh yes. Nothing is easy with this administration. Of course the big news yesterday which broke right before we went on the air was about the Department of Justice dropping. The charges against Michael. Flynn well you know when something like this happens. I want to reach out to an expert and so we did when I heard the news yesterday. That the Department of Justice was Dropping its case against Michael. Flynn the first person I thought of to talk to about. This was Lisa Graves. Lisa of course is an old friend and an old friend of the show and her background is just impeccable. Lisa worked for all three branches of government. She rose to deputy assistant attorney. General and the Clinton Justice Department that was under a Janet Reno. As Attorney General Yes Lisa. Yes it was definitely general win. Miss Reno was the attorney general and then also during the transition when Mr Ashcroft was the trade oh boy oh boy that's A. That's a big from one extreme to the other I think But now I think William bars put them all to shame. Can you explain to us what happened? I can it really is Amish. Ing and it it underscores just how political and partisan Bar William Bar has been In the role of Attorney General What happened yesterday? Was that the Justice Department dismissed. The charges against Michael Flynn who had pleaded guilty to Making false statements to the United States government About About a number of things but Basically you have a situation in which you have a person who has pleaded guilty He then cooperated with the prosecutors with the investigation Into others And he was You know Awaiting sentencing and then he changed lawyers and decided to try to withdraw his guilty plea There was a lot of speculation about whether Donald Trump would harm him anyway since he has pardoned other friends and allies who engaged in criminal conduct like like plan has or at least has pleaded guilty to But here you have the Defense Department You know acting in an extraordinary way to Set aside evidence and Guilty pleas by someone I. I don't know whether they're much precedent for this. There certainly isn't any precedent for it in this type case where you have someone who Was clearly engaged in wrongdoing. And you look at the interview if you have given you know opportunity Obviously to tell the truth the idea that he was entrapped. The Not telling the truth is pretty absurd. One of the most basic Parts the criminal code in fact the very first Charge in the United States. Federal Code is eighteen. Usc One thousand one which is about line to federal officers and Michael. Flynn certainly would have understood those rules. He had previously held positions in the United States. Government held positions involving a security clearance. So he knows full well that he cannot lie to federal officers who are interviewing them and he did. He plainly did He lied Them and he ultimately pled guilty fat and now he wants to get out of those charges and And trump is wanted to get out of those charges and now bill bar has again use the Justice Department to aid the political agenda of this president and attempted to exonerate. Someone like Michael Flynn. Who is who is most certainly Aligarh it's astounding and so did did bill bar basically say that a now it's okay to lie to the FBI. It's okay for a government official for the National Security Advisor to lie to the F. B. I. Certainly seems that he's indicated that it's okay for a friend of Donald Trump to light of the FBI You know I don't think that any any other to the thing I would say would get away with that and and as you point out this isn't just any person Doing the lying. This is the person who at the time had been tapped by trump to the leader on national security issues for our nation and he lied to the Federal Bureau of Investigation and so it's particularly egregious because is The position that he was Provided or or you know that trump was putting him into whether the position of the highest amount of trust in our country and he displayed the lowest level of ability to follow that press. Lying are To the Federal Law Enforcement Agency the FBI in this case and so I don't think it's a general rule for anyone to hit license and go and live the FBI but certainly bill bar has shown his willingness to be nothing little more than just Half who is willing to Do the bidding of Donald Trump in trying to save from friends from the criminal consequences of their of their Komo behavior in this case. Colonel Behavior that That Michael Flynn a confessed to in court. Right it's it's just it's this I've got I've I gotta think this is unprecedented. Well you know the claimed being by The claims made by Flynn's attorney Are Pretty astonishing? One of the claims is that he didn't have adequate representation when he was previously represented by Covington burling one of the biggest most widely respected firms handling those sorts of cases in the country Dow Pretty Astonishing claim on its face And then They have some notes from one of the investigators talking about whether You know in this case whether they should pursue One one charge or another charge or let him lie if he was going to lie and they credit claim. That that's entrapment. That's not entrapment The fact is is that Is that Michael? Flynn was a specific and direct questions and he intentionally chose to lie those direct questions. That's not entrapment. In any sense of the word. But that's the sort of spin being put out there by Trump's allies try to justify the other claim That that has been made. Is that the whole credit for this reputation Was part of what bill bars trying to do is to try to In Nfl after the fact exonerate Donald Trump and the people around him for their criminal or allegedly criminal misconduct Because he's a servant to this this political agenda Donald Trump and not at all in my view servant to The law of the land fill bar should never been confirmed be trained on the United States previously demonstrated when he was attorney general the last time around that he was willing to help with whitewashing a criminal conduct. He's done it again that precisely why he hired He already had done his little addition for Donald Trump and his memo attacking the Muller Investigation. And he's been rewarded with with this position at the top of the farm and he brought nothing but dishonor and disrepute the department that I previously worked for. It's got to be really disturbing to you. As it is for other members former members of the Department of Justice other You know officials. I've seen some on. Tv All with displaying Different levels of of shock and dismay I mean this is like the end of the the rule of law it seems and then bill bar that for an interview with someone at CBS. I'm just going to play a bit of it but he I don't know again. I'm not I'm not a lawyer. I've never been in the legal profession but even I know that this stuff is just wrong so here. Here's some of what he said. Our duty we think is to dismiss the case. A crime cannot be established. Here they did not have a basis for a counterintelligence investigation against Flynn at that stage does. The fact remained that he lied well. People sometimes plead to things That turn out not to be crimes. What should Americans take away from your actions in the Flynn case today? I WanNa make sure that we restore confidence in the system. There's only one standard. Are you doing? Okay that's enough. I mean he wants to its opposite world. Did he say anything there that made sense? I mean it really is a farce capacity. Just been it's not unparalleled but he really You know is is very accustomed to making such fall face. You know bald-faced wrong statements Quite common we've seen it from him before this idea that this is an action to restore confidence in the Justice Department is actually Really designed to restore confidence by one person in the department and that one person is donald trump who has been the person that that filled bar has has made clear. He served That he really served versus the rule of law blonde country. This is a slap in the face to the prosecutors. The investigators for involved in this case idea that The idea that someone can be built just something. That isn't a crime in this case it. If it certainly was a crime was a crime for Glenn to lie those investigators and as I said you know if you read the transcript. It's very plain what he lied about. And he knew that he was lying about it at the time on. He admitted lying about at the time. And so this is really after the fact and after the fact effort to rationalize that the other part of that interview Nicole is. I'm sure you saw was When they when the reporter asked him about you know how history would get him. He responded history is written by the winners cavalier about the tree ordinary. It is extraordinary. And then there's Donald Trump who we expect to spew lies every time he opens his mouth but his statement. Yesterday was a again blame. Obama Obama the Obama administration had a vendetta against Michael. Flynn this all happened. There was no Obama Administration when this happened. Donald Trump was in office. What the Hell is he talking about? Yeah I mean you know you know I mean. That is just a note from ring sometimes. It's Obama sometimes. It's Hillary I whatever from says. It's never it's never him. Ever his people always blame someone else. That is one of the cards. He plays on a regular basis to misdirect. The fact is is that you know. Flynn was interviewed by the FBI As he was In the midst of this You know this administration. The trump administration You know and and the reality here is that for someone like bill far to be going to these extraordinary efforts to undo the Mueller investigation to try to try to take away The convictions that were You know Convictions that were made in open for it. In with the advice of counsel you know it really is an assault on the rule of law and the thing that you know is one of the things that really appalling is that when you hear Republicans Life Bill. Talk a when you hear them because pizzas on the hill Or in committee hearings. They always try to wrap themselves in the idea that they're the The keepers the rule of law. Third voted the rule of law. That in the lies eyes. Tell about the type of judges. They're putting on the bench who don't have histories of being excellent fair-minded judges being packed or cases unqualified or barely qualified for the roles. They're given because they're not being put on those jobs because they're fair-minded necessarily they're being they're being handpicked with the hope that they won't be like Bill Maher with with the hope that he wouldn't be a fair and in a fair attorney general That he wouldn't do. What even jeff sessions did recused himself when he should have recused himself. He was chosen precisely to be Endure the unfair things B The person who who who defends trump at any cost. Continue the things like. He's done this week. To basically try to protect the president protects the men around the president even when they violate the law it's astounding so at least great. So what happens now? Just because the Department of Justice said we'RE GONNA WE'RE GONNA stop. We're going to drop the charges or however they put it. It's still the final word lies with the judge right and this. The judge in this case has federal judge Emmet Sullivan who has a reputation for being independent and intolerant of government. Nonsense like this. Is there any hope? Is there any a possibility that he'll say Oh hell no? He pleaded guilty and he's going to serve his sentence while it part. It's hard to know what will happen In this case in part because earlier this year in January Plan filed papers to withdraw his previous Guilty guilty And so even though the decision are rest with the judge You know to decide a case like this in terms of what to do under this exceptional circumstances When you have the department that originally brought the charges withdrawing the charges that it would put the judge in a difficult position to to ignore that that effort to withdraw these charges But here you have a situation which this giant You know knows that. This defendant pleaded guilty and admitted under oath in court that he committed those crimes That he that he lied to the FBI. And so. I think it's hard you know it's GonNa be hard for any judge who Who believes in his role in the justice system to ignore which he himself heard. That defendant confessed right. He did right Ignore it just because this new political leadership at the just for wanted to all go away help to help trump And his and his buddies so I don't know what the judge will do there. There certainly has been so speculation that he could reject this effort to withdraw the charges or that he could require more information from the Justice Department before he allows them to withdraw the charges because it does have the effect of seeming to try to manipulate the US Court System. Behaving this way different. Those lawyers themselves are engaged in misconduct. I'm just saying that. The appearance an ordinary person and probably to a judge is that this is highly irregular. Yeah and there have been done merely because of a change in leadership political leadership department not because of any change in the actual underlying back. This department is GonNa be trying to use those notes about this question of whether to let let swim lie or not As some sort of weapon to clean it was entrapment. I don't think any reasonable judge would would would believe that those those notes those notes indicate that but that's really going to spend from the Justice Department. It's amazing at least graves one one aspect of the story. That's not getting a lot of media. Attention is the fact that I don't have the person's name here in front of me but I guess it was one of the lead prosecutors on this case about fifteen minutes before the news broke suddenly said pulling. I'm resigning from the case. He didn't resign from the DOJ but he pulled out of this case in a very terse one sentence statement and then this other shoe dropped Do you think we're gonNA see more of that more career prosecutors more career. Department of Justice Employees say Hell No. I'm not I'm not lending my name to this. That certainly doesn't happen before this happened last year as well where career prosecutors resigned rather than Be Used By this attorney general and his political hands to Change Course in a case that they spent months if not years Investigating and pursuing So I did join a letter. Gosh. I didn't it was this year. It's such a blurred now but within the last six months long You know over a thousand I think over two thousand other former Justice Department leaders And attorneys calling for Barda resigned because of his intervention in his actions of previously. So there may be renewed. Call for bar to resign as a result of it. But the fact is is that we have had Prosecutors in this administration resigned before because of the you know because of the Hearing on the outside of appearance of sort of intervention or the political machinations being peddled By this department which is held by Bill Bar so Lisa graves as a former deputy assistant attorney general of the United States. Your reaction to the story overall am I. Am I overreacting to it? Or is this as cataclysmic as it seems. Well I think the greed and I was very honored and proud to work with the US. Attorney's Office The The overall the overall team helping to manage the US Attorney's office with the FBI was a general counsel's office You know with law enforcement officials on criminal policy in Trying to have a more just Legal System when I was at the FCC Department working with those career prosecutors and career analysts I have developed tremendous respect for their for their integrity and their devotion to the rule of law and to be the way this administration has treated so many of these former prophets of these prosecutors including some former prosecutors like Mr Muller himself You know is really appalling. In this instance you have just the sort of normalization of the politicisation of the Justice Department. with someone like bill bar at the helm You know I'm not surprised in a sense because we seem him Intervene in ways can hit the moment. He stepped into that role And we've also seen make really other outlandish claims claiming we're in some sort of cultural war over religion he really regressive guy You know he made a lot of money working for big telecom. After he left the Justice Department when he was working for George Walker Bush He's a he's a he's a super rich guy who is a super partisan guy and he's using his post in my opinion to help donald trump in ways that are totally inappropriate under. Donald trump buddies. Like Michael Flynn in ways. That are totally inappropriate hopefully. Someday we'll have a reckoning for that and we'll have an effort to really restore companies and department but this I think To have the department intervene in this way and aid Flynn in getting out of his guilty plea. His Confession of guilt for lying officers given especially the important role that he trusted he was Holding or with seeking to hold administration to be our top now security advisor. It's astonishing and outrageous outlandish. It's absurd at the front and it really isn't a front of the rule of law it's just astounding. I'm glad I I did see it for what it is. And then it looks like next. He's got his sights set on the the current Director of the FBI. Christopher wray he's already making noises at he blames Rod Rosenstein for Ray Coming in. But we'll see what happens with that. That's his favorite tagline. This is a man who is is is trying to undo everything. Not only that Obama did but they were the results of the Muller Investigation and the Muller report. He's trying to overturn all of that too. I think you know this is going to be a really scary six months leading up to the election because he sees the writing on the wall and knows when he leaves the White House after he's been voted out of office. I'm knocking on wood. Laminate here. Hopefully they're going to be to federal agents. Waiting in the car for him with handcuffs is that is that feasible one. Well I don't know but one of the things that one of the things other things that is worth keeping an eye on obviously as you said. There's an effort by some of these right wing. Republicans you've heard line fringe of Republicans to attack drafter of the FBI. Chris if he's supposed to be doing their bidding that position to be the head of the FBI is a is typically tenure post To be nonpartisan supposed to be driven by having someone at the helm of the FBI like Like J. Edgar Hoover use his his power there to attack An investigate people who were merely engaged in In in You know concerned expressing concerns that the Vietnam War for example or trying to investigate Reverend Martin Luther King so the idea that the FBI director is not supposed to be A partisan engaged in political activities. They're directing investigations and a political is part of our sort of Watergate. Post Jaeger reforms in this country. But you see some members of the right willing to disregard that sound policy and go after Kris Who Republican along Republicans? Because he's just not apparently doing enough of Of they want to try to undo the hard work of line investigators career investigators at the at the at the bureau. I'm meanwhile you have bill bar signaling that he's willing to use the office of the Attorney General Spectacular Power of these governors in these date to issue public health order that are in line with the guidance from the best scientists epidemiologists About trying to reduce the number of deaths in this pandemic I think there's a lot of essential that could occur her by bill bars. Mac nations to try to use the weight and and power of the Roman to limit the power of governors in our state to do the right thing tried to protect people and keep people safe from this deadly disease. I often don't trust him. I don't have confidence in him to do the right thing in terms of any issues involving voting rights in this country and we know the people's vote so we are in a very difficult position coming into the six months before this election where you have key positions In the government including at the Justice Department held by men and women who seem to think that their job is to get donald trump rear reelected not necessarily to do the job that they were pointed to be happy American people. Well in my view yes and I agree. It's the these are going to be very important months going forward and we all need to remain vigilant Lisa Graves. I'm so glad to have you as an expert that I can turn to. I don't understand what's going on and frankly this is all just just mind blowing. I know you've been really really busy. you're you're getting true. North research up and running the website is there to North Research Dot Org. It's your newest venture Lisa Graves. I so appreciate your time and expertise on this. Thank you so much for helping to helping US understand the the the the non understandable. I mean it's just doesn't make sense. It is opposite world and hopefully we emerge from this nightmare. You know come November. Thank you so much. Thank you for those kind words and thank you for your listeners. For paying attention to the news and trying to do their best to To you know keep themselves safe. And we try to defend and protect democracy You know we are. Democracy is being stress tested in the words of my friend Dunking Hamble And you know the rule of law is actually pretty slender. Read in the sense that it really depends on having people of good moral conscience and devotion to the public interest to be stewards of our You know the the Poussin's of our government to protect them for future generations that we will have a democracy that's intact and it certainly been challenged in intensively by the actions of this president and by the accident of the people he chosen in the key positions. Unfortunately people like bill bar. That's just amazing. Lisa great thank you so much. I know you're really busy. Thank you for taking the time out to talk with us today. Thank you thank the Coal Lisa Graves. She's just brilliant and and her insight is so so appreciated all right. It is a Friday. We're going to run a long today. So just giving you fair warning. I'll have to Russian edit to to get down to an hour to air on progressive voices network at five on a quick for the we. We have a lot of listeners. I guess who are usually over with randy at this time because she's on live on progressive network. While I'm doing the show live at three and then I turn it around to progressive boys at five. We're working on moving my live show to five. Pm where all follow Randy. So hopefully you all can come back when that happens we just heard Randy Randy's producer Brett. I think his name is tested. Negative for Kovic and they plan on being back on the air on Monday. So there's that all right so if you're not a regular viewer or listener to the show then you may not know about this Segment that I started doing. I don't five six seven weeks ago. Now when the shut in started I call it a quarantine calling so it is a small world. After all and again I happened upon this this Facebook page called view from my window. Where people all over the world who are staying at home to spread stop. The spread of the virus have posted pictures of the view from their window. And it's people all over the world and I started contacting some of them. We've spoken to people from Germany. Italy Denmark Finland Australia New Zealand. And when I saw somebody posts from all many Catholics down I got very excited For reasons that will become apparent. Now just so you know we try to connect for about. I WANNA say two to three weeks. It's a ten hour time difference so when it's daytime here the middle of the night over there but we finally got it together. This past Sunday was Sunday morning. Here at nine. Am was Sunday evening at seven pm there and causes so Well to the magic of the videotape. Here we go my latest quarantine calling segment to Kazahkstan and joining us on the Line Chopin Prim Tova Print Petrova. Am I saying correctly rheumatoid and you are an Almighty Khazakstan which I got to tell? You is so special to me right now. First of all. Thank you so much for joining us today. I've been doing a feature on my radio show where I'm calling people all over the world to see how they're dealing with the pandemic with staying at home and shelter in place so I definitely want to talk to you about that. But before we get into that she'll chopin. Is that how you pronounce it? It's frightening escrow pan. You are in all Mika's extent and I was there. Twenty years ago to adopt my daughter who at the time was about eighteen months old and now today is her twenty first birthday so thank you so much and I will tell her and on my mind. Today is a woman in Kazakhstan in Almaty. Who left this month old baby girl on the doorstep of a private home obviously because she couldn't take care of her and this little baby was then taken to a baby home. Eventually the one in Caracas stack where I went and met her and adopted her In October it'll be twenty years but today is her well. We re days or twenty first birthday sometime this week. We don't know for sure the exact date but so my thoughts today are with that woman who vary unselfishly gave her up knowing that she could find a better home so It's so special that I'm connecting with you today. So tell me how is what is happening in Kazakhstan with the the corona virus with covert nineteen. Is it very widespread there and what? What precautions have they taken there? So in comparison with European contracts in the United States real more or less better because we use Bay Asia inexperience of immediate lockdown and phenomenal. Now they have thrown three to five hundred cases and less risk a one percentage of cases. Simone it's twenty five people who died so aid relatively much much breads have been. Your grace are doing in the states lot better. Yeah so the Minister of Health Day took immediate measures to walk down. I bic CDs and then the whole country so resident at home absent from March fifteen. And we. Yeah we tried to do not any social distancing rare in Moscow mouse ankle grocery which to go grow subtle s not make every day we used to go and rice fraiche shop so we tried to plan accordingly and gold wants to be. So it's it's it's very turned in because role Ingress Stein. You've thousands. You're like hawks degree. You'll like to socialize drinking sequel. Care there and they have bigger families. Grandchildren children grandparents. Expensive Generation Oprah social lives in. It's all these people are more struggling. Ryan Yeah Been. It's it's raining it's cold. It's fine to sit at home. But then it's like sunshine in screening blasts amine fruits wonderful area and it's really colour usable side and they have told me you have they you know when the the lockdown might be nine might let up yes so preliminary we have planned for. May Eleven soon so people. Yeah very hopeful that it's very late. It's come in and some businesses will be open but it won't be like immediate open for everything so we review. Vip schools will continue to be doing online schools and universities and colleges. So I guess they will finish this spring semester online and there is there against the agencies wherever we have to take responsibility of if they have to be in the office people rebel. Why people think if we still can be can work from home so it's when you live in. We speaking that in some ways will be better by what forecast states may be in default. It's within your break. So people are thinking how they can it prepared to the low down in the red. Yes we're having the same discussion. Now now let me ask you. This APP is testing available. Widely in Kasichs. If you feel like you're getting sick are you able to easily obtain a test? For Covert Nineteen. Yes some for free. If you saw on the group risk if you have money oil your elder all you have really lake symptoms. Gave it for free. Full Emergency David tape here but if you are feeling cable you wanted to double check yourself if you're suspicious if you're having if someone full heavy in and so then you have to pay crisis year. It's available now. What happens if you get sick? What is the healthcare system like in in Kazakhstan over here? We're we we have a very primitive system where we have to pay for private for profit health insurance from a big insurance company I it's it's it's a very flawed system what it what kind of healthcare system is in Kazakhstan. It's a for free so if you'll I get fast at any are positive though they'll Utah currently in full two leaks and we'll do bizarre double checking with facing and then it's euro bold treatments. The they tried to choose the best purple they were. They will get the Chinese protocols European ripples and they concern them may Schnur Protocol. So you'd get crease fishermen treatment free treatment and now now what about on forget the forget cove? Forget the corona virus. Not that it's easy to do but let's try for a moment on a just say that was a year ago and you. God forbid came down with cancer. What what happens then? Do you just go to the doctor. And you're taking care of yes. Four dyal misses you can get tested for free And then off for the juries up and like a least that they have so. If you wanted to get surgery for free you have to be signed and from from. Sometimes you have to wait. But it's still possible to get a free juries. Okay if you go like them ational protocols and you have mining or gaping for using the goal to South Korea Germany Some people traveled to Russia is not available in local street of. That's all part. It's paid for basically out of your taxes. Yes yeah see. We don't have that here. It's kind of nuts. Have you heard about the the American healthcare system? It's a for profit venture so that you need insurance and it costs a lot of money like hundreds and hundreds of dollars a month to be covered and then when you go to the doctor the hundreds of dollars you pay each month doesn't cover you. You still have to pay what they call co pays so in addition to what you pay the insurance company. You also pay the doctor. And that's after you meet what's called a deductible so the thousands of dollars you may pay over. The course of a year still isn't enough in some cases like in my case I have to pay two thousand six hundred dollars out of my pocket before the insurance begins paying and so for people who get really sick a lot of people go bankrupt because they just don't have the insurance coverage or even people with insurance the Co pays and deductibles are so high that they still lose everything just because they got sick. It's kind of crazy. We are going to introduce this biggest way. We have a volunteer insurance. Like my on employee. Employer getting me. It's like a social package. But what are they trying to introduce? Here is mandatory insurance. Well is what I'm sorry. What kind of insurance like Mondadori mandatory mandatory insurance. Cut It out of those hall working. It's magically will be deducted from salaries well yet to become very Yeah it sounds like the amount of money is not make everything right but still it sounds like American. Capitalism is creeping into things over. There sounds better without the system. So I'm a chopin a permanent ova. Your your English is great. Can I ask what you do for a living? I worked for their Columbia University Global Health Research Center Central Asia. I what my my students Mortgage the Columbia University School of social work in the to your diploma. Two thousand nine and I drained the Global Health Research Center of Central Asia which is based in all my regional office in Muncie Osei Gregory files nine and since dance. I worked here dip into Juneau director. One eight studied in Columbia Columbia. Social work with here in my bread. Grounds in pharmacy in medicine will be combined this knowledge and the worthy long honorable capable nations core vulnerable h. e. t be transmitted infections. Your Work People Buffet. Chevy people are using a drugs and be you need. See a commercial sex work of so they have four hundred. Wow well that sounds like a very important job. So good for you A lot of people you know when I adopted my daughter and I would say my daughter from Khazakstan it. Isn't she adorable? She is and I can't believe she's twenty one today a couple of questions on a Kazahkstan. Shutdown international adoptions or at least adoptions to the United States after you know I adopted allison. Do you know what the status is now. Do you have any idea the adoption programs they are and the baby homes the orphanages like the one in. Caracas tack where she was. If it's still even there so what? I know it's a showdown wins. Remainder of auction brought. It's open for a while ago now. It's morning throwing van. Probably you up to take Ellison twenty years ago it was all paperwork and Communication Bradfo on for some agencies. She is much more electronic it would Iran can will online in. Its life will some day to line so every child who's laughs. It's a maternity house or would to them Home Office held a baby home. The baby home. Yeah Each baby home in ever seats available online. The registered this baby and everyone is like available immediately online outlets Corrupted now like you cannot finish Bats we know they have business people who are very social social responsible and they feed that some young ladies who would pregnant and they think that it's bad to have children out the Fed love not to be married for the community for children in order for them to leave China. They gave them the second chance and they called it. Houses mom walls of Rome. It's absolutely convert by business. People on on time you can leave. You can come to this home for mom's issue a child yet. -rageous they leave their literal. They leave for at least one. Yeah they take care psychologists nor says Dr just adjustable stay here get free leaving three treatments and free food and people will take care of your child so for this year women can raise could child trying to get the educated. All get Joe Ryan on to Market that's a great program and I look. My heart hurts because I wonder if a program like that had been available for Allison's birth mother if things might have been different now You know my daughter in every sense of the word. She couldn't be any more my daughter if I had given birth to her. She is my kid but I my heart hurts for her birth mother especially today dead like I said. I'm thinking about her from the moment I woke up and wonder if a program like that was available. Twenty one years ago. If things would have been different it's chance for young ladies. That's great again. We don't have programs like that over here. I think it's a shame. Oh God I'm like crying and I'm sorry and it's just it's an emotional day for me. Obviously and Allison's inside sleeping or I would bring her in year to meet you So my mind is just spinning in a million different directions. So back then again. It was twenty years ago when I adopted her. It was a October twenty third and twenty fourth of of two thousand and the the the culture was sort of like it was here back in the fifties where people didn't really adopt babies. It was not very common. And that's why there were so. Many international adoptions and as I said Alison was a foundling. She was left on. Someone's doorstep in the translation is described as a household bag with She was wrapped in a blanket. She had a little hat on. She had a bottle there. Were some things in there with her. And obviously mother left her on the doorstep of a private home hoping these people would take care of her. I have the address of the house where she was left. They called the police she was brought to the hospital and then the baby home but I was told by our adoption coordinator. A wonderful amazing woman named Goliath. That when somebody in 'cause extent does decide to adopt they will often feign pregnancy for nine months or they'll adopt a baby and move to a new town where people don't know. The baby was adopted here. Unlike the nineteen fifties that was the attitude and people didn't there were kids growing up. Who didn't even know they were adopted. Our her adoption is part of our story that we told since she was very very little. You know. It's it's our story how we came together. Have ATTITUDES CHANGED? Their on the last twenty years or twenty one years or is adoption more feasible to people who live from Khazakstan business huge difference. Yeah I guess. This is what's Different Cultures in Yob -solutely agree beds. Here it's used to Enin many special area and even a normal area. It's very high secrets with tell the child in anyone else that the child is adopted but in almost one hundred percent child is getting all someone friends or relatives. They'll tell the Kyle he or she was active and it's so painful surgery allies than your old enough that your parents like until a mild winter co parents. Brian and it's a huge barrier. So it's still in big child is logged on the one year or maybe like around one. Two years parents tried to hide. Did the child is adopted because we are not raised Means it's like a special program to teach parents that it's fine to tell you your child your biological mom learn how to be. A MOM doesn't matter for a whole Via is wonderful to four zero abidance in some cases says those families who wanted to adopt children from two houses in all the church child allies in maybe five older child been bathed. They know no. Yeah right right. Bill Sun Symbol MOMS or ladies score in their forties that educated. They have a job but somehow they didn't meet someone they didn't fall in love and they wouldn't give him. Rubber sill was very productive. Shall maybe they'd get your didn't five nights Donna. They tried to doctor tried to right well. That and that was my case I was. I was approaching forty twenty years ago when I adopted Alison. I was a single successful radio person back. Then things have changed and I'm a lot older now but that was exactly my story and actually my heritage is Russia and so I was originally going to go to Russia right when I started. The process was right when Vladimir Putin was first elected and one of the first things he did was closed. Down International adoptions and so the agency I was working with kept sending me things and nothing was right and then one day they said. There's this little girl in Kazakhstan that you need to take a look at and they sat me her information and a video and I it was immediate. I just like Oh my God. That's her so I knew so. Your country has given me the greatest gift in my life. So Nice to meet you especially today. Nave visit Ukraine. Just let you know what comes. Oh thank you and we may take you up on that one of these days when the virus clears and my finances are in better shape but absolutely chopin. Tova to meet you. You know look. I'm not a fan of facebook. There's a lot of bad stuff but but it opens the world to us. And that's how we connected in this room view from my window facebook or that's so incredible At such a pleasure to talk to you I thank you so much and I hope we can stay in touch and one of these days. Connect you with allison when she's awake and and you can meet her. I'm sure she would love to know somebody in her birth country. Hey she she's got. She's got dual citizenship. So you never know one last question for you. How are things over there politically? I mean you extent as I said when I adopted her. There were people who would say. Where's Kazahkstan they had no idea. It is such a huge nation that obviously split off from from Russia when the Soviet Union broke up. How are things politically? What caused extensive relationship with Russia? Like these days we are neighbors by are politico siblings so we are trying to be in between jobs like Russia and China Russia is Allen North Neighbor China. Our East neighbor trying to dance between that. Say Our territory. Yeah so are very and we have our whole trade union Kazakhstan and Russia members so the actual friends because Round basile I have a legacy of Speak Russian languages Russian Facet Right Gossip Monger Sunken Russian language of console. If you travel to perfect star you can easily use Russian language which I did the Bolshoi's bus CBA. I remember a few things does on you. But yeah amazing because we mix of our Central Asian for big have caused says Big is like silkroad legacy Illo the Russian food and because urine sample Soviets War gration of Korean People Korean people forced to only fresh parts of eastern Fresher by stallion incubus forceful I the the Stein and they have of Korean school so full busy its rowdy eight. Need time tree followed one hundred school if here different religion so it's very easy to win socialize driven nature veto again US hiking. Hide Wolf Hiking INVINCI- this winter Fouls in and slow Borgen. Just forty minutes authorizing from Here oh I think I visited it. When when Alison during our waiting period there was a fifteen day waiting period after court till we could get her papers and leave so we did that. We did a little bit of sightseeing. We did go to the beautiful ski resort very very steep mountains Yeah and we were there in in November and December. So it was. It was pretty cold and I live in Florida where at the time I lived in California so I'm used to the side but I would love to come back and visit one day. I'm so happy to connect with you and I know Alison will be overjoyed so I will share this with her and and stay in. Touch Chopin. Tova thank you. Thank you so much. What a pleasure. This has been safety car. Thank you alison guys. They save in investment will have a wonderful day. Thank you you too and you to stay safe by buying. Yeah oh how did just that debt? Obviously you can tell moved me again that we've recorded that Sunday morning both Sunday morning here in the US. It was Sunday night in Qasr extent. We had been playing tag for a couple of weeks because we were ten hours apart. And we we leave messages for one another and we. We'd set up ten times to talk and it didn't work and so you know. I woke up Sunday morning. Not really thinking we were going to connect and sure enough we did. And how special was that so another addition of quarantine calling to end our week as we said hi to Kazakhstan. And maybe we'll get back there one of these days and allison so with that we're done for the week wonderful weekend. Do something good for yourself. I know it's hard sometimes when we're all stuck inside but try to do something good for yourself all right. I know I keep having to tell myself to do those things too But this is all we've got. It's our help so take care of yourself and I'll see next week right now. Not Planning on doing the show Monday but anything can change. You never know so. Check on facebook and twitter because we do it all post something there and not. I'll I'll see you Monday or Tuesday. Have a wonderful mother's Day and if your mom you're lucky enough to still have your mother in your life be sure to reach out and you know. Send our love as well all right. Have a great weekend. Everyone until next time stay safe.

Donald Trump Justice Department United States Michael Flynn FBI Kazakhstan attorney Department of Justice facebook Lisa Nicole Sandler Lisa Graves Khazakstan president Russia Obama Obama Janet Reno Paul leary Mike Pence
Unmasking Obamagate (feat. Frank Figlizzui and Mimi Rocah)

Mueller, She Wrote

47:59 min | 3 months ago

Unmasking Obamagate (feat. Frank Figlizzui and Mimi Rocah)

"Hey all this is Glenn Kirschner and you're listening to muller she wrote be clear. Mr Trump has no financial relationships with any Russian oligarchs shooting. That's that's obviously with our position is. I'm not aware all any of those activities are have been called a surrogate at a time and that campaign and I didn't have not have communications with the Russians on have to get involved with food if I have nothing to do with Putin I've never spoken to him. I don't know anything about a mother than he will. Respect me Russia. If you're listening I hope you're able to find thirty thousand emails. That are missing. Sow It is political. Your Communist know Mr Green. Communism is just a red herring like all members of the oldest profession. I'm a capitalist. Hello and welcome to muller she wrote I'm your host AG and today we're GONNA play for you. Some incredible interviews. We had this past week for our sister. Show the daily beans. That's worth listen. Really really incredible interview so For the Muller Memos this week that came out for the Flynn News. Check out Monday may daily beans. We're GONNA cover it all there so I can bring you these two interviews so today we're bringing you these two interviews one with former assistant director of the FBI for Counterintelligence Frank Caluzzi and the other with former federal prosecutor currently running for District Attorney in Westchester County. New York Mimi Roca so first up is Frankford Caluzzi. So let's have a listen all right everybody. Welcome back Joining me today to discuss the potentially dangerous next steps for the Department of Justice is former assistant director of the FBI for Counter Intelligence and MSNBC analyst. Frank Caluzzi Thank you for speaking with me today. Thank say Gee yesterday. U. Penn to piece for NBC about trump's Obama Gate comments. He just tweeted out. Obama GATE IN ALL CAPS. And you talked about a troubling new pivot at the Department of Justice. In you know we've recently seen unprecedented meddling by bill bar to go easy on trump's friends but where do you think this is leading next so I wanna just share with you a little background on this? Nbc think piece. I did because when I started writing it. I was into what you'll see in the first paragraph. Which is the concept of predictive analysis? Studying someone's behavior in the Intel. You have to predict where their conduct beheaded and I submitted the piece to a number of major platforms and publications all of which came back to me and said Frank. This is a great piece. But it's it's out there. I mean you're you're actually trying to say that the president the president of the United States is going to accuse the former president and vice president of conspiracy. Frank do you remember when we were out there for thinking that Russia was meddling in the election? And then so okay. Look I'm I have a contract with NBC television. I'll submit this to them and have them tell me on crazy. Well in in the course of the twenty four to forty eight hours that transpired while I was getting rejection complex. Of course Lo lo and behold the president of the United States started tweeting and re tweeting the very conspiracy theory. I'm talking about including re tweeting an article from the federalist that claims that Obama and Biden. And you name it. Colmey Brennan Rice. Whoever sent all sit in a room clapper all set in a room? I'm trying to gin up the Russia case For the express purpose of taken trump out. And then he starts tweeting Fox News hosts who are seeing the exact same thing and then we see you know. Dna acting deny Richard Grenell show up with great fanfare with a Satchel in his hand at the front door of the Department of Justice. Because you know. He's going to unmask the terrible people who found. Flynn was the guy on the wiretap talking to Kislyak and then we have a Rose Garden press conference where Phil Rooker Asks Trump. The question what. What kind of crime are you? Are you accusing former president Obama of and trump responds Obama Gate crime? So then we then we then he tells reporters I had call with Putin. This is by the way on the very same day that that DOJ filed the motion to dismiss the Flynn charges. I had a call with Putin. We talked about this. We talked about the Russia hoax and quote a lot of things might happen unquote next few weeks. So my my my point is not just that I'm recovering from my rejection complex. But rather that. What seemed unbelievable. Two or three days ago has actually come to pass bar hinted at that earlier didn't he? I mean when he went on I can't remember it was Fox or ABC and made the comments. You know. Well we're looking into it and if there's crimes you know we're going to hold people accountable. I mean he sort of We call it looming the truth here on this show where you sort of like smoke out. What do they call it? Smoking the jury or something where you know you. You drop what you're about to do so when it hits. It doesn't hit US hard. But he he was. He was sort of laying the groundwork for for this even before trump went on his crazy one hundred and twenty-five tweet every seven minutes mother's Day come the thing so trump has an accomplice in this and that happens to be the Attorney General United States. Who's riding shotgun on this? This travesty train ride that that we're on. And he's the Attorney General. In many ways over the past couple years signalled his willingness to and complicity to help trump out of this mess and two more importantly twist the truth. So and we're talking about everything from that four page summary of the the Muller inquiry in calling a press conference to shape the public perception of it and now appointing John Durham the US Attorney Connecticut to get to the bottom of the vast Russia conspiracy. And and so we're we're going to see and then of course we fast forward to the Flynn filing. And so we're going to see over the next few weeks and months and very conveniently right up to the election this this kind of sort of Damocles hanging over the head of anyone including former President Obama who touched the Russia case and the right wing is eating it up hook line and sinker. Fox News is every night is hitting this hard and I think it's important to the facts on this. I don't WanNa be that guy that that does podcasts and TV appearances and just says Oh this is all bunch I want it. Dig Deeply into the facts of this. What we know. And more importantly what we don't know right because that's how we combat it is to discuss the facts and the details and you know and you're just bringing up all this other stuff with Durham and appointing. Us Attorneys to look into Flynn and look into stone 'cause you say trump is still very sensitive about twenty sixteen. We know from Bob Woodward's book that he kept an electoral map. Maybe still he does on display outside of the Oval Office. So he's still very very you know about trying to unwind this entire Russia investigation. He's been doing it his entire presidency. It goes directly to the heart of how he sees the validity of his own election. So it's much like a baseball season when there's been a strike rate in the record books. There's an asterisk next to that entire season and in parentheses it says you know strike occurred during the season so basically don't pay attention to the stats to him. Not only it's a double whammy. Not only did he not win the popular vote. But now there's this perception that since it's been proven that Russia interfered in the election. Then quote that then Comma. They must have actually got him the win. The reality is a G. There's never been proof that Russia got him the win that that's hard to quantify and qualify. There's been proven evidence including confirmed by the Senate Intelligence Committee controlled by Republicans. That indeed they went all out to do this. And we indicted twenty six Russians for doing it so he in his mind the way you become more valid in terms of the presidency. Is You get rid of this taint. How do you get rid of the tent? You have to get rid of those indictments or at least at least cause a perception that those indictments were tainted and part of a vast conspiracy bar has signed up for that cost. And we're going to see some people absolutely ruined and destroyed in the process. I would not be surprised if you see the attorney. General United States take whatever John comes up with twisted contorted and and issue statements that make people think Yup Obama and more importantly Biden. Who's opposing the President They came up with all of this. And so if you dig deeply into this. Here's the condensed version. What we know so far. Is that the intelligence community came to President Obama during the transition period when when trump had had one and here comes the transition team. The transition team is about to receive very sensitive briefings right. It's that it's crucial time between November and January when you start really informing the incoming team of the world picture and sensitive intelligence and so they come to the White House and they go. Hey serious problems with Flynn. We got him on tape. We we we we we. He's he's he's been paid by Russia for speaking engagements. He's an unregistered foreign agent of Turkey. We've got photos of him and Putin in Russia and by the way you know we've got these greater concerns about Russia now proven Russian assistance to the campaign. What what say you? President Obama and what appears to have happened is by all accounts Obama said Hey I got to know what we can brief brief to the transition team and particularly an incoming national security adviser like flint. Let's get to the bottom of it so that's being turned into this. Smoking gone bombshell proof that Somehow Obama fabricated the Russia evidence. Yeah an unraveling. The Russia investigation has the added benefit of giving a pretext for trump to lift sanctions. The you know the Obama Sanctions for metal for attacking us in the two thousand sixteen election. And I appreciate your Major League Baseball analogy because I am a Cleveland Indians. Fan and the strike in one thousand nine hundred five. We would have won the series. I know but I don't believe have you been. Have you been to the new field at progressive field? I have it's beautiful it's gorgeous. I don't have their season stance standings hanging on my desk outside of my office. You know. That's the point. I'm not that hurt by it. My greatest concern as you just mentioned since I come from the counterintelligence world and see everything through a national security lens is that those twenty-six indictments are Russians. I mean bad ass rushes. Twelve of them are GRU intelligence officers. Yeah if we make people think that those indictments are invalid or that. Nah that never happened. Or even trump just pretends like hey see. The whole thing's tainted fruit of the poisonous tree. Therefore I'm going to. I'm going to overturn the sanctions against Russia for Messing with our democracy that empowers the Russia and Putin and all bets are off in terms of what adversaries will feel like they can do to us. Yeah that's the scary part and I want to ask you about playing the this kind of thing out to its logical conclusion. Let's say we do end up seeing charges against clapper against Brennan Komi etc. The likely won't make it past the first round of the court particularly in the DC circuit. I mean I I imagine that the awesome lawyers that these folks would hire would file motions to dismiss it would likely these cases would be dismissed. So what's the endgame here? Is he just pushing it out to get the charges and then have the election and then they go away like what's the goal? Yeah you don't even need to actually get a grand jury to indict you. Theoretically don't even need to get to the grand jury. What I think is going to happen. Ag is we're going to see some attempts at criminal charges probably at a very low level. The easy one and by the way I can get into this. It's not that easy but the most logical candidate a low level would be the FBI attorney who allegedly fabricated. And I'll get into this in the second allegedly fabricated a an e. Mail in support of the FEIS affidavit against Carter page. That's that's that's the first one you're going to see. That's what I thought too because I mean you know. They say that He was they were trying to determine whether Carter page was an asset to the CIA and it was classified. He was misnamed. It was a misnomer and they've added something to an email. After the fact allegedly we may have even had this discussion before a G I. I've talked about the so much I can't remember who with but look at in the course of my career I can't tell you how many times I've had go around with the CIA properly characterized one of their sources is operatives. Informants context associates Unpaid on contacted and they'll go in circles and look that's the world they live in and you can get three different answers from three different people on three different days about how to characterize someone that they're talking to and so it's what. I'm hearing an by the way I can. I'll stand corrected on this it. This was an outright fabrication. By if I attorney right but my what I'm hearing is that he was trying to get this right. As to how the agency was characterizing Carter page and make it explainable easily to the Pfizer court. And so on. The language was being played with and manipulated to try and figure out what the agency was saying on any given day and portray it correctly. I if that's what happened here. Then there's no way a grand juries going to indict and by the way it's going to see that would require the CIA to come forward and release classified information to a grand jury about what they were doing with with Carter page so even that might not happen but to answer the question of where this is going. You don't have to get to criminality right. I mean even even trump said when asked what the crime was Obama well there's nothing entitled Eighteen. Us Code called Obama Gate so what you have is Bar Through the next six months start to attack folks start to lay seeds of things and then you hear him watch carefully. Listen carefully when reporters asked bar is they're going to be a report from Durham. You get. I don't know maybe we'll see so so wait a minute. Oh you know you know. We'll see yeah so you got a US attorney and an entire team. Tearing apart a case against A campaign president and you might not issue report. Why might you not well because this allows me to spin and insinuate and destroy people so you know just plant the seed? People's mind we're headed to a grand jury. We're thinking about it. We're fixing to get ready or we present it you know. It's like the question. When did you stop beating your wife? What's what's those words are out of somebody's mouth? There's nothing you can do to to deny or dissuade them so once he says grand jury. We're GONNA try. We're GONNA go. We we went and they said No. That's all that matters in certain people's months that he and you're talking about counterintelligence previous patterns behaviors that's what he did with Ukraine just the mere announcement of an investigation without even having to do one Would have an impact so I need to squeeze in a quick break but I do have another question for you. You stick around. Sure okay. Great we'll be right back We are talking to former assistant director of the FBI for Counterintelligence Frank Figliuzzi stick with us. Hey everybody it's ag from the daily beans due to the global pandemic of Kobe. Nineteen the job market has been uncertain for the past couple months. And we don't really know what the future will hold. None of us can predict it. We're all uncharted waters. And as a small business ourselves we understand what employees and employers are going through right now. Employees are worried about their jobs. Still being there when this is over or having to find a new one while employers are concerned about their business surviving and hoping that both customers and employees can come back in the effort to dissuade fears and provide some assistance and comfort in these times. We'd like to relate the following message from our sponsors ziprecruiter. They say can not be overwhelmed. We have to work to keep our loved one safe and protect our communities. We have to work to stay strong to stay connected to stay focused. We have to work to inspire to innovate to build new solutions. But for all this to work we have to work. Together that's Ziprecruiter. We connect employers and people every day but today is different. We're partnering with First Responders Government officials and the medical community the innovators and manufacturing transportation and food distribution industries to make sure we're finding the right people for the jobs right now so let's work together. Ziprecruiter DOT com slash work together. All right everybody. Welcome back. Frank thanks for sticking with me here. I just had a couple more questions for you. What do you think of the notion that by well first of all? Tell me explain to me what this whole thing is with Rick. Grenell and the unmasking Fox News. I believe. Just put out a report that Biden Komi and the Intel chiefs were among those who wanted to unmask. Flynn what does that mean unmask? Flynn Yup. This is really important because again. We're going to get a steady drumbeat of this on Fox News every night. Okay so we saw Grenell with great fanfare. Walking into with a Satchel to Department of Justice Headquarters that was all staged and it was like the Nunez running at midnight or the or the parchment envelope with calligraphy sent to By by Guiliani. They're just so funny with their really lame like staging shows you got you. GotTa give them credit. So here's here's here's some important background on what unmasking means when a certain three letter agency that we shall not mention Intercepts conversations. Let's say you know. And these are by the way all court authorized intercepts almost always a foreign national targets occasionally more than occasionally. Marican citizen will be intercepted and captured. Speaking to. This person could be that this target is ordering pizza from Domino's and the pizza delivery guys saying hey. I'm outside your door that gets intercepted as part of the wiretap on the foreign person right. Well that happened with Mr Michael Flynn who was talking with Russian Ambassador to the United States Kislyak so the way that report shows up on your desk and many of them showed up on my desk when I was a d. A counterintelligence is unnamed. Us person or unnamed US per or unknown person. You then have to go back to that agency with three letters and say I have a valid. I have a valid reason for knowing who that was right and if it's a pizza order you don't have a valid reason for knowing and that agency believe me will tell you take a hike. That's a pizza order but instead what they'll usually come back is they'll currier to you because it's top secret Literally a human will hand you the unmasked name. And because you it's determined you have an intelligence reason and of course if you are. Oh say a president or vice president trying to figure out if you can trust and income transition or who. The hell is undermining my policy by talking to sanctions with the Russian ambassador. Because that's I I need that missing name. Who the hell is doing this to me? And if you're the FBI or CIA or Susan Rice at National Security Advisor or the UN ambassador Susan power to the United Nate tonight American United Nations and someone's talking about undermining sanctions and telling the the ambassador to Russia. Don't don't pay attention to these sanctions. We'll take care of it. You want to know that name so you ask for it to be unmasked. So you're going to see people all the Obama Administration who are saying. I had a valid reason to know and that three letter agency said Yeah. I think you do because they're messing with you and here comes the name. Yeah I mean there's a whole lot about that it's called the Logan Act. I know he never charge anybody with it. But you're not you're not supposed to act as an agent of the federal government. If you're not one by the way I get Logan Act is a crime. That's almost never charged. I get that but I'm saying understand the bigger picture. It's an intelligence counter intelligence threat picture. Of course. Of course I don't think I don't think Susan Powers Susan. Rice is sitting there going I want to charge the Logan Act. Going who the hell is telling the Russian ambassador not to pay attention to our sanctions and the President Obama likely saying I need to figure out if I can trust to brief at the tes level to the incoming trump team. Who is doing this? And that's a valid purpose. Now what do you think of the notion that by investigating and possibly trying to charge folks but even just investigating folks like Brennan Biden? Maybe even Obama that Trump could knowingly or inadvertently bad taste for going after a preceding administration as he faces losing the election in November. I thought about Somebody mentioned that on twitter like I don't know that's probably just a a benefit aside benefit a be careful what you ask for. You might get it so you want you. WanNa previous administration investigated for for for little or nothing. Then you better be prepared that it's going to happen to you There's there's a lot of iron here. Don't forget we have a president and his lawyers as recently as this week in Supreme Court claiming that the president has vast powers to do whatever the hell he wants. Yeah now what's the president saying? Obama should not have had had briefings from the intelligence community on on the Russia case which which is. Think a lot like me. My very next question was given the arguments that Scotus yesterday. How does this square? With trump? In the Department of Justice arguing the presidents are immune from investigation and prosecution down down his up. This isn't the only dissonance by the administration. They fight for pre existing conditions while litigating against obamacare. They say they're trying to save social security while cutting it in their budget. That's why you know I I believe Matto always says you know. Watch what they do. Not what they say but yeah. I really appreciate you explaining that to us because I know you're counterintelligence expert and I just wasn't sure what the unmasking thing meant so now it's clear It's much more clear to me that There were senior officials within the Obama Administration. Who wanted to know the name of the person talking to Kislyak in an intercepted Call from three letter agency talking about. Don't freak out over the sanctions. We'll take care of. It makes total sense because then we had you know what it Sally Yates Do. And what the two things. Obama warned the incoming President about Flynn and North Korea. Well you and that Flynn is compromisable. The moment the moment the White House came out and said Hey. Flynn never talked about sanctions with the Russians. The Russians own you now they own flint and that's what's Elliott's was trying to tell them. Hey wait a minute. We have when on tape saying this so they own him because they know he's lying to you and now you said it publicly. They can screw him over at any time and that's what she was trying to say. He poses a threat. And that's with those FBI agents. Were trying to get to the bottom of when they showed up at the White House to interview fling and just real quick before. I let you go explain what that would look like a compromised. Flynn Russians know. He lied. How could the Russians screw him? I don't I don't know if there is a lot like I feel like there's some people out there who don't quite understand how that makes someone compromised. Well if you so the bottom line is when someone if you're in a position of trust top secret clearance close to the president doesn't matter you could be anywhere in the intelligence community quite frankly And if the bad guys have something on you that you're keeping secret and keeping secret is defined by you. Lie to your boss about it and that boss embarrassingly has gone public with what you've told him which is a lie. They come back at you and go. Hey General Flynn You know we need you to side with us on this issue. We need you to convince the president of Xyz and you know what if you don't give us this piece of information this Position Paper this classified until We're GonNa tell folks that you did commit a violation of the Logan. Act THAT YOU DID. Tell us to stand down on anything regarding sanctions and oh by the way when you got paid thirty thousand dollars to show up at dinner in Russia and sit with Putin and you claim you don't know how that was paid and all of that will expose that to straight up blackmail. Why wouldn't a general a Patriot quote unquote? Just call it out. Just go public with being blackmailed by the Russians. Or or I mean I don't understand I is it just desire for power and money that over. Take somebody's duty. I don't know how you make it that far in that kind of position and and sell out the country which is what Sullivan was saying when he said in his courtroom December Eighteenth and twenty thousand eighteen when he was about to sentence him any talked. Flynn out of it. Saying you need to go forth and cooperate more because I hate your face right now and pointed the flag behind him. You and I've talked about this and said you've betrayed everything that stands for asked the prosecutors if they'd looked into treason that is sort of the crux. It isn't it. Yeah the the Behavioral Studies of folks. Who actually do these really stupid things Is Fascinating to me. But it requires you to understand the history of Flynn and where he's coming from. Let's not forget He was the head of the Defense Intelligence Agency. It's it sounds like a really cool position and it is. If you're one of the until nerds like me. I remember visiting the Pentagon walking past that their office and I was like ooh. It's a very important institution but in the in the scheme of things in the US military. It's not the cool kids department. It's not you're not. You're not leading battle. You're not in combat theater. And he even worse. He develops a reputation as a rogue cowboy that Causes Obama to feel. He's insubordinate answer recommend that he not get anywhere near an important position. Even Chris Christie was recommending against the hiring of General Flynn because of his cowboy reputation and the fact that people didn't like him or care for an Obama removed him from the dia position so he has a huge chip on his shoulder. His his career is essentially ended. He's not going to get where he wants to be and so in retirement. He's looking to get some posture and some cash. And where does that come from? Well I can give speeches for thirty thousand dollars a pop even if they're in Russia really bad judgment but I've seen it before well as a veteran it. I'm disgusted by it and you know I mean I. I was a support position In the military I was navy nuke under Clinton so it wasn't you know I wasn't one of the cool kids either but You know it's it's just and and then to take the position of being the Patriot is just it's disgusting. It's gas lighting and we'RE GONNA WE'RE GONNA see a lot of this just like you said in your piece we're going to see His base falling for these charges. If there are any or at least the attempt to make them fall for it hook line and sinker and they'll all come after US and gaslight for being part of the deep state. We are going to get worse where we're going to see. Flynn rolled out at campaign rallies. We're going to see Navy seal former navy SEAL CHIEF. Gallagher accused of war crimes but for Trump's meddling in that rolled out as campaign surrogates. And it's going to be disgusting. Well let's all prepare for it because it's going to happen and thank you very much for joining us today everybody former assistant director of the FBI FOR COUNTERINTELLIGENCE MSNBC analyst Frank Figliuzzi. Thank you again so much for speaking with me today. I appreciate it. Stay EDGY BY THIS IS AG. And you're listening to me. She wrote and now. Let's hear the interview with me. Rocca all right everybody. Welcome back Joining me today is former federal prosecutor from the Southern District of New York law professor. Msnbc legal analyst and candidate for District Attorney for Westchester County. New York Mimi Rocca Mimi. Thanks for speaking with me today. Thanks they did so good to be back with you. It's been a long time. We've we had a little bit of a i. Guess Hiatus doing all all this stuff that we're trying to accomplish right now but I'm really really glad to speak to you again and I'm glad to be here. There's certainly a lot to discuss right now on the legal front. Yes and I want to just give you a heads up. Our listeners are pretty. Well caught up on. What's going on with? Flynn all the way up to the minute. Order asking for amicus Curie But I wanted to speak with you today about first of all. Here's a brief time line with this order. So the Department of Justice we know filed a week sauce motion to dismiss the case against the case against Flynn and then may eleventh retired judge. John Gleeson I believe is a John penned an op Ed he pendant op. Ed in Washington Post saying evidentiary hearings. An amicus curiae were needed. In this case since neither side was opposing the motion to dismiss like it's now it's bar versus. Flynn and their friends. You know Eh But then Judge Sullivan issued a minute order asking for amicus briefs and then yesterday he issued an order that Judge Gleeson retired. Judge would be assisting the court Under amicus curiae. He's got you know things that he can information he can provide the court that the party's representatives aren't providing And he want. He's GonNa assist in weighing the motion for the depart from the Department of Justice. So first of all I put out a tweet there and you. You've had responded and that's why I wanted to talk to any. Have you ever seen anything like this? Have you ever seen anything like this? Yeah no and I I jumped right in there because to me the the answer seems so Kind of obvious but also important which is no. I can't I mean doesn't mean it's never ever happened but in in my experience sixteen years as federal prosecutor And a watcher you know for the past couple of years very closely you know I. It is unusual to see a judge in a criminal proceeding invite amicus briefs And even more unusual I think to sort of say That they're appointing one one person in particular to do that. But we've never seen anything like what has happened here with Bill Bar and the Department of Justice dismissing a perfectly legitimate and even important criminal prosecution after the person's plead guilty twice. Oh You know it is it is. The answer is haven't really seen anything like this but have never seen anything like this attorney general. I think what the judge is doing is recognizing that the interests of the Department of Justice as an independent institution with a political motivations is not being represented by bill bar. And and so you know you. You bring in People for you invite amicus briefs You you allow briefs when Friends of court when when all the interests are not being represented and and you know I I know that the Trumpian disagree with this but any objective observer bar over the past couple of years cannot say that he is representing the Interest Department of Justice he is representing the interests of Donald Trump And not what his job is supposed to be. And I think this is the first time. Missus someone empower mainly judge. Said you know what there's something I can do about that. Yeah and you know. I think you're exactly right. An unprecedented motion to dismiss calls for an unprecedented reaction right. And so in. And just I mean I guess I would say one other thing while I think what the judge is on here is highly unusual. It's there are similar Procedures in other cases that are now against so. It's not like he just made this up. I mean we have amicus briefs in as you know well and you know Supreme Court cases dealing with all sorts of issues. I mean it it it. It's not foreign to It's not unusual to have these kinds of briefs filed is somewhat unusual an individual criminal cases. But not but not where there are bigger legal principles at stake. Which I think is really what's going on here. This isn't just about Flynn anymore. It's about the principle of an independent department of Justice making lawless decisions. Yeah and the beauty of it is. We have seen like you said in the past few years we've seen the Department of Justice under bill bar weigh in with amicus briefs in Supreme Court cases on multiple occasions. And so it's not an argument. It's it's nothing that bill bar can stop and we'll get into that in a in a second but I wanted you to tell us who is judge. Gleeson because I feel like our listeners. Have a little bit of an indication. They know some of the cases. He's prosecuted some of the people he's brought down In his in or you know presided over. I shouldn't say brought down in his years as a judge. Who can you just who give us a picture of who he is so judge? Gleeson on was a federal judge for many years. I actually Clerked for him meaning. I was one of his law clerks back in one thousand nine hundred ninety seven right when I was fresh out of law school and he had been on the bench. I think for two years or so so it was a very young judge. He was a judge in Brooklyn. I'm United States Eastern District Court for the Eastern District of New York and he had been a federal prosecutor for many years before that in the Eastern District Us Attorney's office and You know did kind of cases federal prosecutors like like him like me you know do but his claim to fame. I think the thing that he's most well known for is that he successfully prosecuted John Gotti senior who was known as the top lawn. Because you so many times had been prosecuted and was not convicted but then a judge Gleeson Very well tried case Was able to successfully prosecute him and and that one man crime spree with the Gambino family And so He after that I think he was acting. Us Attorney for a little bit of time but then he was appointed I believe by President Clinton to be a federal judge. He was a pretty young for his You not to be appointed a federal judge and I will tell you though Both from my experience working with him for a year which means I was with him every single day. Every minute of the day in court outside of court eating lunch with him talking with him and he has remained a friend and a mentor onto the stay He is one of the most brilliant people not just lawyers but but also a brilliant lawyer that I know I mean truly has a brilliant mind. is Really not sort of a cookie cutter Person in other words I I. It's hard to fit him into one mold or another. So he was a prosecutor for many years I think him to the bench without experience but pretty quickly as a federal judge became very defense oriented and actually became very involved with The Criminal Defense Organizations Federal Defenders in particular and really kind of before criminal justice reform was a of popular thing or even a term that people you know talked about in the way that they do. Now he he was really at the forefront of that and and Really tried to Help reform sentencing federal sentencing guidelines. When she thought were too high he really was a judge who looked out for Sort of the the most vulnerable people in the criminal justice system and and tried to work on early reforms To you know thought our laws and sentences were were too harsh too high at the federal level amongst others. So he's kind of a a really independent thinker. He doesn't fit neatly and sort of one box or the other. I think he really knows the Department of Justice inside and out in news what it is supposed to be at its best But also knows the dangers of it and and overreach and how that can work in not been afraid to stand up to that even in the in the past as as A judge and now he's a practicing I would call on sort of a white collar criminal defense lawyer at a law firm in New York. He did step down from the brunch recently But he's he's a well-known voice in terms of You know speaking out for what. He believes When he was a judge he did several Political redistricting cases that that made a lot of headlines He's just a very kind of smart and independent banker. Who Does what I think he thinks is right. What whatever box it's into or doesn't fit into and so I think that's part of why he's the perfect choice for this. Yeah seems like his. Experience? advocating for the everyman Seems to be relevant in in his OP. Ed In glazes op ED. That came out before Sullivan asked him to join the case he was urging Sullivan. Seems to to you. Know think twice. About just dismissing this case and talked about having evidentiary hearings. Perhaps listening questioning calling into question you know bringing the guys from Covington burling which is Flynn's original lawyers reponsible bringing in former prosecutors. Who worked on the case? Who have since left like Kravis. I would assume So it was it ban. It was Kravis Van van bracket was. Yeah but who? But he still works for Department of Justice as far as I know van crack does So it I think and this is what I was personally hoping for. When when Flynn filed his motion to dismiss we were all sitting around me and Kirschner and we were sitting around saying. Gosh I hope he has evidentiary hearings. I hope he just doesn't dismiss this case and so now I think we're we're kind of see what where gleason stands what his background is in. I think we can sort of see where this is going. And it's is it fair to say that the Justice Department trump can't do anything about this? This isn't something they can ask for a stay for or oppose or Filo. I mean they can file a motion to disagree with it. Yeah and I think if I'm keeping up on this fast moving news. I think that he has. I think Flynn has filed something saying basically. You can't do this you can't you invite Amicus briefs in A criminal case You know that's that's not gonna go very far. Well no and it explains why Sullivan put in his minute order. I was like why is he putting k? Citing case law about amicus curiae in his minute order. Oh it's because he knows he say hey I have sole discretion Mo- foes and so come at me. It's not a free for all though quoting judger Jesse Jackson. I'm like what is he getting out. What does he getting at now? We Know Yeah. Yeah exactly no. He's he's I mean this John Jay. It's it's very smart and very independent himself and And which is not unusual. I mean most federal churches. A lot of them are and they don't like being told what they can and can't do. They have a lot of discussion for a reason and how to run their cases in their courtroom. And I think here You know I I don't I mean I know Fox News is going to be screaming about how the judge should be shouldn't do this but I don't know what basis they have to say that And if you look at the history of of federal judges having discretion in sentencing in motion practice I mean the dots their job And of course he shouldn't just rubber stamp us so halls Rod Rosenstein. Frankly I mean yes you can call from other people but you know rose I mean Rosenstein was the member of this administration that signed off on this prosecution. I know he wasn't there at the beginning but he absolutely approved it and he's completely I'm at now. You know as as they say that this was all a big political conspiracy by quote the Obama Administration. Yeah and it's going to be interesting too because by now normally we would've heard tweeting a biased Obama judge Blah Blah Blah. But here judge Sullivan was appointed by H. W and so yes. Yes exactly and so but I. I don't know that that necessarily has stopped trump from going after people before and calling them bias so I. I'm assuming that we're going to start getting some misinformation propaganda about gleason and Sullivan being biased judges and badges. I'm assuming we'll start seeing that sort of thing come to light. I'm surprised it hasn't already happened. We'll tell us before I let you go. Tell us a little bit about your campaign where people can find you where people can donate to you. I don't work for the government anymore so I don't have to go down the Hatch Act I can ask for donations for your campaign They give thanks for asking. Yeah so I'm running for Westchester District. Attorney. Westchester is right outside of New York City So you know Important and big District Attorney's office that has cases that can affect the you know even far beyond Westchester County And my campaign is going really. Well I'm running on a platform of Bringing ethics reform and integrity to. Da's office. Something that I think. Your listeners will appreciate wherever they are and Really the need for building institutions at the local level that are counterweights to what's going on in Washington to the trump administration and particularly when it comes to the Criminal Dotson system keeping the politics out of our justice system. That's something I'm really been talking about in. The people really respond to and also pursuing public corruption cases conviction integrity. Making sure that we are not prosecuting. The wrong people and that we are having Not having wrongful convictions and I have platforms about that about human trafficking. That's a big priority for me gun safety and all this people can find on my website. You know all of my issue papers. I'm kind of listed out. It's Mimi Rocca. Rotc eight H for a DA dot. Com You me Rocca four DOT COM and You know hopefully people can look it up and happy to have people help. Make a phone baking. Can you anywhere in the country and make donations and you got on our mailing list. We do weekly updates where I interview people On Zoom about important issues so Yeah that's that's pretty much a summary but I hope people check it out. Thank you thank you so much because these these are the steps. These are the crucial steps. That we're going to need to start taking to rebuild Integrity in in our institution equal justice under the law ethical guidelines. Giving some teeth to these things and in moving forward to to put back what? Trump is taken away in being able to trust our our legal system. So thank you so much for joining me today. You lose two of credits is too long but law professor. Msnbc legal analyst former prosecutor from Southern District of New York and candidate for Westchester Da. Thank you so much Mimi. I appreciate you coming on today. Thanks great to talk to. Y'All that's our show for today. Thank you so much for listening. If you haven't already please. Subscribe to our sister podcast. The daily beans follow us on twitter at daily beans pod for us on twitter also at muller she wrote and please take care of yourself and take care of each other. I May G and this is muller she wrote Muller. She wrote executive produced and directed by. Ag George Coburn with engineering editing by Mackenzie Mozelle and stubborn. Industries are marketing manager production and social media direction is by Amanda Reader Fact Checking Research by AG Jordan Coburn and Amanda Reader and our knowledgeable listeners. Are Web design and branding or by Joel reader with moxy design studios and our website is militia dot com.

Mr Michael Flynn President Obama Donald Trump Russia president FBI United States Department of Justice US attorney Judge Sullivan Fox News Putin attorney New York Obama Administration muller Westchester County assistant director Brennan Biden
OA291: Wildcard, Clownhorns! (Non-Compete Clauses & More)

Opening Arguments

1:04:37 hr | 1 year ago

OA291: Wildcard, Clownhorns! (Non-Compete Clauses & More)

"So I hold myself in contempt. If you try to pull me up here to court without attorney. Ask the questions caught Jacka Willie objection. I'm going to alert at Gerke Rogers that under the guard Acker. You didn't kill Thomson, but you did Mr. wells. Gathering. Water board up Paul is out of order. Water. Welcome to opening arguments the podcast, that pairs an inquisitive interviewer with the real life lawyer. This podcast is sponsored by the law offices of p Andrew Torres LLC for entertainment purposes, is not intended as legal advice, does not form attorney client relationship. Don't take legal advice from a podcast. Low and welcomed opening arguments. This is what's check your dot don't change that dial check, I don't know what the proper phrases this a bonus episode coming at you at a weird time and place. Not the norm. But there's just too much. There's just too much. I'm Thomas with that over those Andrew Torres. How're you doing Andrew? I am fantastic. I'm really, really excited. They're bunch of things I wanted to cover and the world blew up on Thursday on a record day. And so rather than lose these down the, the whiteboard memory hole may be forever. I'm excited about getting him out to the people me too. There's just too much. There's, you know, the one way recurring theme is how to deal with how negative the news is all the time. And I think maybe one positive way to deal with it is for more opening arguments. That's really let's face it. I mean that's the best shine on. All this. So there you go. There you go in that spirit. Let's see what are we gonna talk about ROY Moore announcing. Absolutely talking about that for a little bit about Biden wining, and apology for saying that segregationists were nice from Booker who said, maybe they weren't nice there's talking about that. What a great presidential candidate. He is now okay? I'm just going over all the other stuff that blew up today that does not even on your list of stuff, you're gonna talk about, and we're not gonna talk about going to war with Iran, which sure eventually, there will be a lot of segments on that. No, no. It's other stuff, it's stuff we didn't get you. It's cheery stuff like whether or not their detainment centers or concentration camps or something like that. So let's let's get into it. What happy news? Have you for us today? Andrew. Well, this, this first segment is not what I would call happy news in the ongoing discussion of the concentration camps being run by our government to hold miners who are separated from their family at the border. We are learning more and more information about the truly deplorable conditions inside these facilities. So the government is using military bases, including without a trace of irony, former military bases that were used as concentration internment camps in this country to hold Japanese Americans during World War, Two, I mean it, it, it military facilities to hold young children. And that is the subject of. Ongoing litigation and in, in particular the legation. So, so we I covered the president's executive order, separating families at the border in episode one eighty four literally one year ago as of this record as a result that, that order, as we told you was idiot quickly disingenuous in terms of arguing that it was actually designed, you know, more expeditiously to get families back together again. No one believed that at the time and, and in the year sense, then that, that has obviously proven not to be the case. This is this is a disaster. And it is it is horrifying. I mean, I, I remember, you know, under George W Bush. When we learned that the United States was going to operate, a secret offshore prison at Guantanamo Bay for the purpose of torturing suspected terrorists, and that was that was a moment that I would I really felt like. That fundamentally violates the I you know, that, that was, it was shocking to see something that, that I thought in a bipartisan way, you know, really crossed party lines of, hey, you know, we're the US, we don't torture, people that turned out to be the case. Right. You know, one of the things I coach I school debate again, because my son is now involved and, and Costa for very, very long time. And, you know, one of the things that is often a high level questions is the philosophers in space rift, so feel free to, you know, but, but one of the sort of recurring questions in high school debate at, at what we call like the standard right? The question of how do you evaluate the round are questions of our moral obligations, determined, you know, in a utilitarian fashion? Yeah. By adding. Up the benefits subtract cost versus benefit analysis, or are they governed by some kind of deonte logical principle? Right. I don't know where you come out on that. Right. I've heard you. I've heard you make arguments to sort of fall into both camps. Well, that's fair. I think everybody does. I think that's that's really how goes, I think that you can't ultimately everything wants to get it consequences. That's why consequentialist a little better than utilitarian everything. There's no store, you tell about morality moral, choices that doesn't bear out in consequences. In fact, the arguments against utilitarianism and may be consequential ISM are themselves argued informs of consequences, why, which is why I think ultimately, that's what you're going for. But I do think that sometimes there are rules that might shortcut that or might be good rules of thumb in order to bring about consequences. Even if in the if in the short term, it might seem like, you know, it's counterintuitive so it's a complex thing. But the but I think that I definitely lean more towards consequential ISM. But just that are limited knowledge can make difficult to know all the consequences. Are going to be borne out forever, and to how many people and all that so that that's kind of where I stand on. That was this having to do with anything. How did we ever get I? And I'm gonna and I'm going to go. There are a little bit of a rabbit trail when you are kind of taking the position in a debate, right? You have to take sort of the strong, deonte logical position. Right. That part of what you have to do part of what the challenge of that is right. Crafting a rule that, like provoke, you know, that, that seems to meet with the conditions of something like cops categorical imperative that like is always true. No matter what. And we always had to sort of ready to answers, right? And one is totally disingenuous as you will. See, right? Which is you shouldn't violate the rights of an innocent person. Unlike that statement is universally true. But you know, as you point out when you unpack the adjectives in their, the adjectives have ends based consequences built into the adjective, right? The, the other statement that will only think of millions of times every day that we don't hold that to be sacred -ly true above anything. If if the consequences are gonna be rough enough. You know, then we violate that like if you know. We did all the time. I mean like what well for one thing. I mean you could almost say to bring it to a law concept. You could almost say imminent domain is kind of, like, it's there are times when we think the greater good would necessitate that we kinda violate some rights here and there we're going to do our best to compensate you for it. But that's how it goes. I mean, certainly there are times when innocent people's rights are trampled because there's a there's a greater benefit that needs to be enacted. I think that right. I mean that Star Trek. One-to-one interest- interesting, I would I would argue eminent domain. Right. You win when you compensate the person you've compensated them for the rights violation. But, but I don't give them a choice in, you know, you. Yeah. You. I anyway. No. I I I like that. My the whole point. Of this. I think you taking this bonus episode license a little too. I have I'm going to stretch out my legs and podcast legs. I say, whatever I want, that's the Andrew with no, here's what you're going to do. You're you're going to run into a time. Limit. Yeah. My point is my point is that the other example, that was our Goto was, you shouldn't torture bright. Right. That is, as close to an absolute side, constraint that everybody agreed with absentee will. Yeah. All of a sudden it was two thousand and one, and we didn't agree with it anymore because it was made partisan and now you know forty plus percent of when you do polls. Right. Forty plus percent of the country's okay? Well, you know enhanced interrogation that's fine. That's that normalization of something that is an app that I would argue fits into the conditions of absolute side constraints is, is, is truly terrifying. And I don't want to see that happening with respect to the construction of concentration and use of concentration camps in this country for for children. I mean it that's unthinkable. And, and yet we're in the middle of a debate in which the. The, the, the question is the semantics of how children who are being kept in woefully inadequate conditions. The semantics of what we call those. Yeah. So anyway, litigation is currently pending, in the ninth circuit challenging the ice is holding detaining of, of minors. The, the operative legal standard here is actually not a law, but is a settlement of a class action from nineteen ninety seven. It is called the Florus settlement and yeah, it was a class action lawsuit brought by Jenny Lewis, set Florus on on behalf of others. Similarly situated against generating. Oh, gainst a Bill Clinton's era. What was then referred to as I n s the immigration. In Naturalization Service, pre nine eleven version of ice and in nineteen Ninety-seven the litigation had been pending for nine years. So again, how we treat children at the border has been a problem for decades. But, you know, we've, we've reached new lows as a part of that settlement that settlement contains an exhibit, it contains multiple exhibits, but exhibit one is the minimum standards for licensed programs that is places where you can on a an again, florist anticipates a fairy very short turnaround, very temporal a temporary placement of kids nothing like what we have today and it requires that licensed programs shall comply with all applicable child. State welfare. Laws and regulations and all state and local building fire health and safety codes and shall provide a range for the following services for each minor in its care. And, and I'm just gonna go. This is really I'm not I I'm gonna link it in the show notes. It it's extensive okay, the, the things that you must do their fourteen separate paragraphs. Right paragraph. One says, you must provide proper physical care and maintenance, including suitable living accommodations food, appropriate clothing, and personal grooming items and paragraph. Two says you must provide appropriate and routine medical and dental care, family planning services, which we already know is being violated, and emergency healthcare services, including complete medical examination, including screening for infectious disease within forty eight hours of admission, excluding weekends holidays, baba. So that's the operative law at oral argument to. Decide whether what the US government is doing is complying with the Flora's settlement. The Trump administration argued that it was not required to give soap or toothbrushes to children apprehended at the US Mexico border that it is not required to give them a bed that it can require them to sleep on concrete floors. That it does not have to maintain a certain population density, that they can require them to sleep in overcrowded, and, again, these are military facilities so prison cells, and that they do not have to maintain again, you know, it's summer now, but, but the evidence dates back to the to the winter that, that. It. Some of these cases, the blankets. They had were made out of a luminous foil. And the Trump administration said, yeah, we think that is consistent with our obligations under the Flora's settlement. Fortunately, the ninth circuit appeared very, very skeptical of these claims I'm gonna linka a the courthouse news service is a pretty reliable lawyers write it. And it's exactly what it sounds. I mean, it's not, you know, I, I think only lawyers read it except you know now opening arguments listeners, some of the questions asked from the panel. And remember this, a three judge panel at the night circuit US Circuit Judge, Marcia Bersani says you're really going to stand up and tell us that being able to sleep isn't a question of safe, and sanitary conditions and then Circuit Judge William Fletcher got in on the got it on the action. Are you arguing seriously that you do not read the agreement as requiring to do anything, other than what I just described cold all night, long lights on all night, long sleeping on concrete floors? And you've got an aluminum foil blanket. I find it inconceivable that the government would say that, that is safe and sanitary. So the, the government responded that this that the night circuit should reverse the findings at the district at the district court level, because the district court required them to give detainees soap and toothbrushes that, and they said, look, Flores doesn't say we have to give them soap. And this is an I'm going to quote directly from the government's lawyer. When asked him, assume, I was left that way, and not enumerated, by the parties because of the party's couldn't reach agreement on how to numerate it, or it was left to the agencies to determine to, to which the ninth Circuit Judge Fletcher says or it was relatively obvious. At least I'll be enough. So that if you're putting people in a crowded room to sleep on a concrete floor with an aluminum foil blanket on top of them that it doesn't comply with the agreement wasn't perfumed, soap, it was so p-. That's part of safe and sanitary. Are you disagreeing with that? And so this is horrifying. Some of the story has been picked up by by other news sources. And, you know, sometimes we tell you that, that things are alarmist, or this is quoting directly from the oral argument the conditions inside these detention centers are horrific and, and I look forward hopefully, by the time this special episode comes out the ninth circuit will avoid an injunction putting a stop to this practice. Yeah. Couple of questions. I mean first off I this is just outrageous. I absolutely outrageous. I mean on so many levels, you know, it's one thing to be doing what they're doing. But what, what, what are we talking about if we're talking about soap like a few dollars to their budget. Like, is it? It's one of those the cruelty is the point thing I guess, you know. Even if you even if you were hard liner wanting to eliminate as much immigration is possible. I guess, why can't you at least while you're detaining these people and keeping them out of the country or whatever you're doing? You don't have to be abusive toward that leg is just they wanna make sure that it's there so horrible, as people that they wanna make sure nobody even tries to come here is that the goal is that must be it must be the goal. And I invite I don't know that we have too many Trump supporting listeners, but I you know, you and I wanna steal me in the other side of the argument. I can't the I think the steel man version of the argument is, we want to disincentivize illegal border crossings, right? Yeah. I think the casual version of where does that is. I mean that justifies anything apparently. I think the actual reading of the argument is our base wants us to be cruel, and we're going to deliver it to them. Yeah. I can't you know, I wanna know look, we talk a lot about what your obligations is a lawyer are. And we know there's times when you have to defend somebody has to defend horrible, criminals that can thing. Is this the kind of thing where even Mr. lawyer pants Andrew Torres? If you are, you know, in a different life, you were just a gun for hire, whatever, is this, the kind of is there a line, where you need to be like, I'm not going to sit here, and with a straight face argue that not that denying soap and toothbrushes and blankets is, is is in any way. Permissible like what's the line of ethics for lawyers? I mean is God. There's gotta be a bar that's slightly higher than this. Right. Yeah. I wanna I'm gonna tell a slightly related story from when I signed up day one at Covington and Burlington coat factory and. And there are there kind of problems with all this. But, but Covington Burling was was well known at the time for representing among other things the Tobacco Institute, right. Which it's now called like you know, the council on air quality, or whatever we've moved into we're all of these lobbying groups that used to be like, yeah, we're the council for more lead in your water are now. You know, they, they have some, some sort of the heavier water. Yeah. Water. Plus. But it used to be called TI that did the Tobacco Institute and, and, and, and it was kind of pitched to us this way. It was like, hey, we do work for a pro tobacco lobbying and there were at our old offices there were lawyers who did that were who were right chain smokers, right? And the tobacco lobby. And we get it. They do some shady stuff. So nobody has to do any work for TI, if you don't want to now, keep in mind, this was at again, this was said to me, explicitly keep in mind sense. Lots of young associates, refused to do work for TI at peace. A real good way. You know, to get experience, you know, get more substantive work because not everybody wants to do it. I declined to work for TI. I've been very honest, though. I've done you know, I did work for Pakarti and for a group called the century council, which I think used to be called the alcohol, you know, good. And again. Right. That's because people set their moral right? To me the conduct of the alcohol industry. Does not mere the conduct of the tobacco industry. I your your mileage may vary on that. This is just one of those times where I feel like there's a lot of ways in which the norms, we need the norms of norms are great. And it's sad that a lot of norms of, here's one where I would like the justices to just say you are being evil. I'm not even going to listen to this argument. I'm not even going to order an injunction you're going to enjoin yourself like just you need to stop it. You know this is this is evil. You're arguing for something evil, I shouldn't even be here, this should have what are we doing here? I mean, come on. So. So Chuck Burs on actually kind of funny. These, I wasn't gonna quote for this, but judge on actually asked the government's lawyer, have you considered whether you might go back and consider what he really wanna continue this appeal. So which is the lawyer version, that's as close as you get to what I just said as close as you kept to what you just. So. Yeah. As part of the canon of judicial ethics you have you have a requirement to zealously advocate for your client. I, I cannot imagine any, right? Like, if I if you worked, they're good people. Lots of most of DOJ right now. Right. Are are good people their career? Prosecutors trying to do their jobs. You know. And we saw that, right? Like that is. You know, analogously like the, the rights demonizing of Peter Struck and Lisa page, notwithstanding, though, those were again, FBI at different circumstance. But, but those were good career public civil servants still trying to do their jobs. You know, knowing that your boss is now a monster and, and lots of people know you know, nobody. You know. You have options when you're when you're a prosecutor, but lots of people just want to be a prosecutor, you know, so all of that is my way of saying, I cannot imagine having somebody like that, that you would go forward and, and conscripts somebody into making this argument right, that you've got you've got a wanna make this argument and somebody that to go right into every campaign ad for the next thing, you know, this administration is really arguing that it's a bridge too far to give soap and toothbrushes to children that's to enter to accommodate and blankets. Yeah. Blankets. Yep. Yep. These people God. Okay. Anyway, so that's how what's the we we looking for their? So you think there's hopefully, there will be an injunction soon. And I think there will be fully supreme court isn't e that evil that level people totally right. Hopefully, I, I don't know. Okay. Well, we'll see. All right. What's, what's our next wildcard topic? It's the wild card topic. Hopefully this is this is more fun. This is this is a topic. I have wanted to revisit for a very, very long time. We last covered it in episode seventy five, and that is the question of non compete clauses. So we I'm going to read a little bit. This is a question we received at our Email open arguments Email dot com from Aaron McCullough, who says, I can't get into specifics. But let's pose hypothetical that an ice cream parlor had a longtime employee general manager. Let's say leave the company and form her own gelato shop while it's not technically ice cream. There'd be a reasonable expectation that our new July shop would be in direct competition with their former employers. Ice cream parlor, let's say that wing. No competition. Jilava wins hands down L. Yeah. And let's say that when she first started working for previous employer. She signed a non compete agreement that specifies that any employee is not allowed to enter into direct competition with that employer. For two years in a twenty five mile radius of the ice cream parlor with the agreement be legally enforceable. So I love the question and, and let me I make this super super clear because kissing that pathetically may map into reality in some ways, number one, don't take legal advice from podcast. And number two, look, this is super critical in this case, because as, as we're about to complain different states have different rules regarding all they enforce Nanka also regarding Jolanta regarding how the enforce non competes. So, for example, Thomas, the state you live in California has a statute as was then interpreted by the state supreme court. I used to say recently, but I guess it's now about ten years old that they, they won't enforce. Sit at all. With with certain very, very extreme exceptions. And that's really, really interesting. In other words, you can sign a contract in California. Again, don't take advice from spot. Guests that says, you know, you will not work for ex employer. You know, after after your the term of your you will not work for anybody else, or start a business that is in competition, you know, within a twenty mile radius for two years. And in many, many cases you can go out tomorrow and being competition. Right. Even if you've signed an agreement to the contrary, and the reason has to do with Silicon Valley, right? Has to do with the tech industry in California, because the way in which tech startups operate now is they go. Find go getter middle managers at Google at apple whatever and say, hey, how'd you like to come join this new startup and we'll give you tons of. Of equity and you know, maybe you'll become a millionaire someday. Right. And so they hire them away by offering them more money on the promise of way more money. And, and so what makes that super interesting is that now you have a robust body of economic literature suggesting that non competes are bad for business. Right. And that changes the dynamic of the argument. Right. Because for a hundred years in this country, the idea was non competes are good for the business and bad for the individual. Right. And so to the extent that it, it, you could predict kind of on political ground, you'd be like, okay, so liberal states, liberal supreme court, you know, more pro individual supreme court are going to be anti non competes. More pro. Oh, business states are going to be pro non compete, and the California model really kind of throws that on Ted and says, look, there are pro business reasons to be skeptical of non compete agreements and as a result states following the California model, either through legislation and a bunch of states have tried to curb non compete agreements through legislation or through state supreme court, opinions reinterpreting, how non competes are enforced are considering, and weighing in on these kinds of arguments. Right. So you know gonna talk about kind of the standard law in, in, in just a minute. But like there have been opinions in Idaho, Missouri and Florida. Right. Like, you know, pretty red states that are pretty. He skeptical of, of non competes. So keep that in mind in, general the way in which you approach in which forty five states approach whether to enforce a non compete agreement is a balancing test. It is called the legitimate business interest test, or LB. And, and it basically goes like this. I you have to establish that there is a legitimate business purpose in restricting the employees from working, right? And I don't want to be in competition with you is not a legitimate business interest, right? We right again, libertarian paradise we live in a capitalist economy. You know, you make better widgets. What good Ranko out start your on which factory? Now, let's go back to the ice cream example. What, what might be a legitimate business interest? Well, you've learned how to make ice. Cream by working for me. And now you're stealing my proprietary business stuff, and you're using it against me. And so I need as an employer to know that my proprietary stuff is safe. So I want to restrain you from going into competition against me where there might be an inference that you are taking something that we want to incentivize people doing in the first place. Right. And, and they're like, I think the ice cream versus gelato shop probably does pass the sniff test on that. I could see a court go again, the look like you're gonna learn. Maybe gelato is different than ice cream. You probably learn recipes flavor. Combinations you learn how to market. Right. And we want that first ice cream shop to go into business. And so if they wouldn't go into business if everybody who comes along is gonna steal the model and replicate. Right. So to incentivize them to go into business in the first place. We're gonna give. Reema say that they do have a legitimate business interest in something that's, that's kind of step one and let me point out, lots and lots of people again, don't take legal advice from podcast. There was a report that one of the big box stores. I'm going to say target. I don't know if it was target pleased target, if you're listening, don't sue me, but, but one of the big box stores had its baggers and cashiers sign non compete agreements. Right. And say it we're not gonna go I promise. I'm not gonna work valuable bagging technique that can't be replicated and stolen from us yet, and that's garbage. Right. That is obviously, not a legitimate business interest and remember other stores, try to put the bag and top of the stuff. But, you know, the secret foot the stuff in the bag. Don't eat the bag like that. That would not. Pass the straight face test. There is no legitimate business interest in protecting against someone who, you know, isn't learning valuable skills, or client conta, or whatever. Right. And and, and remember the flip side. And again, you don't have to be crazy lefty state to, to, to see this. The flip side is a non compete prevent somebody from being a valuable part of the economy, right? Like it says we are, you know, preventing you from earning your livelihood. So that's a real cost. So once you so the step one is, is there a legitimate business interest, and then step two, if there if there isn't you're out right, the clauses, just gone. But if there is step two, then the court has been there. There's more tests after that. Yeah. Cast a balance all of the respective interests that are at stake here. And typically there are five criteria that a state will use. In figuring out if a non compete clause is reasonable once there's a once it's stab at that, that there is a legitimate business interest, and those criteria are number one the duration of the clause. Number two, the geographical scope of the clause number three, the degree to which the clauses necessary to protect the employer number four the degree to which the clause is a restraint on the employee's right to pursue work and number five, the interference in the public interest. And those are pretty straightforward. Right. The, the two biggest are obviously one into right? So, you know, you work for my eyes cream parlor, and then I say for five years, you can't work for any ice cream parlor anywhere in the United States. Right. That's ridiculous. You know what if I move from, you know, Connecticut, Idaho, like you know, I could steal your business one hundred percent and who cares, right? Like that, that Idaho business is not competing with the neighborhood ice-cream parlor, in, you know, Waterbury, Connecticut. Right. And same thing for duration so so presumptively things like you will see in, in Nunca clauses, you will see a geographical scope, it will be like within a twenty mile radius of businesses headquarters in Waterbury, Connecticut. And and same thing for duration. Right. Excessively long time periods. You know, it's sort of like businesses change in adapting. You know, if you can't deal with it after a certain period than, you know, maybe you're just not a good business person. Different states differ on this. But generally every state, I know of what will hold that. At least six months is a is a reasonable duration for the average non compete clause. Many states will allow up to two years. So sometime somewhere in that six month to two years, probably presumptively good. Anything less than six months is definitely good. Anything over two years is almost certainly bad, right? Almost certainly chip. And, and we'll talk about what no good means in a minute. And then and then the rest of it is, you know, sort of looking at at specific stuff. Right. So, you know, think about let's go back to the target Bagger case. If I say something that might otherwise be a totally fair geographic scope. Right. You can't within twenty miles of any of our stores. Right. And let's say I've got three crab restaurants, right? Or three ice cream parlors. You know, you can't you can't open ice cream parlor within twenty miles of any of our stores. Okay. Well, that's fair. Well, what? If I say, you can't be in competition with target within twenty miles of any target store. They're thousands of target stores in the country that would that. So that's why you have the, the additional criteria of, you know how much does this project employer? How much does it restrict the employee, does it serve the public interest? It's ways of. Looking at the specifics and going, okay. This might otherwise be reasonable. But, you know, in this circumstance, you know it's not reasonable. And then, you know, the public interest is supposed to run a blood Bank. You know, you're right. It's you could imagine situations where we would go. No, we want. We want more that, that's yeah. Big blood taking over of. Right. Right. So now and then, you know, bring the segment to a close but, but just because if so, so you're not gonna be could be found valid could be found invalid to bring kind of the segment to a close. If a non compete is found invalid. There are a essentially three different things that a court can do in response to an invalid provisions in a contract. And this again, this vary state by state. Right. So the first thing that, that they can do is they can just strike out the entire covenant. Not to write this is you that several -bility Claus thing. Always talking about where you're like any part of this can be stricken from the whatever. Yeah. Without. No. That's right. And so this is this is lawyers called this red pencilling right from the days where you actually used a pencil, but the could just be like, yeah. Same contract. Everything's gonna be enforced. But we're just striking this whole thing out alternatively the so that's one option. And it just means you didn't comply with the, the, the balance of interests made it, you know, was it was for too long. You said for, for three years, and within fifty miles, and it's it's that's just too far. So we're going to strike the whole thing out. So the second thing is, is called blue pencilling. And so what the court can do is cross out only the provisions of the con of the clause that render it unenforceable. Right. So now let's let's change our clothes a little bit. And let's say suppose that a, a, a non copy clause in, in a jurisdiction that, you know, otherwise follows the test says you may not take a job with our competitors that, that competes or otherwise within, you know, twenty miles and for two years. Right. And let's say that the court determined that the legitimate business interest that you were working in a in a tech capacity for employer a for the first employer and then you went off to go be in a sales capacity for employer. Be an employer. Be is a competitor of employer. A but you're not gonna use any of the tech stuff that you learned with employer be right? The court might say, look this, this, this covenant, not to compete is too broad because you're saying somebody who worked for you and a tech capacity is now prohibited from working in any capacity with your. Your competitors. Right. It says, whether competing or otherwise. So when we're gonna do is we're going to blue pencil out, weather, and, or otherwise. Right. So now what it's left with is you may not work for a competitor in a competing in competing right in the same job. But we're gonna scratch out the or otherwise. And so the covenant remains in effect. So this guy, you know, if he leaves it still running for, you know, another year and a half. So if he leaves employer be and goes to employers. See and tries to take tech job with another competitor. Right. He still bound by that, but we're not we're going to relieve him of the of the unenforceable obligation in the covenant not to compete. So, in other words, instead of red pencilling the whole covenant and going, guess what your free agent you can work for whoever you want doing whatever you want, because you're implore roll the dice, tried to ask for too much failed? The blue pencil doctrine is a bit more employer-friendly it says if it if it can be. Salvaged than by by crossing out the offending provisions. Then we will salvage it in that way. But it wouldn't solve right? If suppose the problem is you try the non compete says you can't compete within a hundred mile radius for five years. Right. And the and the court says that the geographic scope is too far and the time period is too long. Then you can't save that through blue pencilling either. Right. Because there's no there are no words that you can cross out that will leave that clause in effect unless you get to the third set of states, which allow for what we call equitable reformation of the contract. And that is where the court can say, look, you as an employee were willing to sign onto a contract that says you can't work for five years, and you can't work within fifty miles, that's too, far as a matter of law, that contract is unconscionable and void as a matter of public policy, but when I let you off the hook we're just going to rewrite that down to the maximum standards that are law. Allows, you know, so. Was like early on. I was thinking if you just cross out like the time threshold than it makes a kind of meaningless you'd need to like review. You'd have to, you know, like parameter missing, you know, like you can't within blank time. Like what does that mean? So there is an option to actually revise to it down to an acceptable parameter of any of these things. Yeah. That, that that's right. And that equitable reformation, right? Where you scratch out five years, and you write in six months. Again, under, you know, under the theory that look if you agreed to five year, you definitely agreed to six months is, is the law in about thirty different jurisdictions. So most states that permit non compete clauses will sort of bend over backwards and enforce the contract to the extent of the law, even if it's overly generous on, on the part of the employer, only three states are red pencil doctrines that I know. And weirdly enough. So. Right. So the red pencil doctrine is the, the one that is the most employees favorable. Right. That, that says. Nope, employer. Tried to grab too much. So we're going strike up the whole clause. You wanna take guess what? Those three states are you will never guess but, but I will. Yeah. Hawaii Alabama and the territory of Puerto Rican night. You said I'd never guess is just going wild. I actually like reasonably close. And I mean that alphabet weekly those three jurisdictions are Arkansas. Nebraska and Virginia. And, and again, I think this illustrates kind of the weird state of non compete law. Right. Like those those right? You have a, you have a blue, you know, a newly blue state with, with significant worl- areas. In Virginia you have the utterly unpopulated state of Nebraska, and you have the formerly blue now, deep red. We wanna do non compete. Yeah. Who doesn't wasn't matter turning businesses and depressed bitcoin. Yeah. Either not, we'll be either way on this. It doesn't eat. It doesn't matter. Doesn't matter just either way pick. A and that's the story of Nebraska. So, so I love being able to do this this deep dive. I litigate these kinds of cases. So it is. I just want to end. As as we're answering your question that. I do not think, again there's self interest involved here. I don't think you can reasonably answer a question by Google talked to talk to a lawyer. It shouldn't be overly expensive to get an opinion about the enforceability of your contract. I go through the segment to show you that there so many considerations. Right. It does your state enforce it at all. If it does doesn't apply the I'll be I test if it does, is there any, you know, is there any guidance as to whether there's a legitimate business interests? But does right. What counts as geographic scope? What counts as time live in Nebraska? So are there even people where you are? Exactly. But, but I thought it was pretty fascinating. I know what you're saying is go to legalzoom dot com and then kill yourself. Don't take don't do either of you want to ask you, though you reference that Silicon Valley is something to do this. I was thinking like so much of this is like, a, a place you know, distance based thing like the internet, obviously would throw all that away. You know what? How do you how do you write a clause or enforce a clause or whatever in a in a euro, where so much businesses online in? There's no distance doesn't matter. Yeah. And the answer is non compete law is not remotely caught up to business on the internet. And, and in a way that that fails to protect legitimate business interests over the internet, the an and so what most what I advise my clients to do. And what I think most smart lawyers are doing is figuring out ways to protect those legitimate business interest by calling them stuff, other than blunderbuss kind of broad covenants, not to compete right. So if you identify things as confidential information, right, and you specifically designated every state will enforce being able to get an injunction on nationwide injunction against somebody. That uses your confidential information. Right. If you have customer lists and again, don't try to protect the individual Ella. Events that you're trying to protect rather than trying to like, you know, have this sort of totalitarian control over the, the human that you're saying can't work somewhere else. Exactly. Right. And it is my prediction as a result that within ten years. Most states will disfavor, kind of these broad, non competes. Just that that yeah. I think I think that's where the law is going. And I think that it's going to get there because of the practices that I've described. Right. It's just an and look, I think that's going to be a good thing, right? Like it's going to force employers to say. This is what we care about right? We have a proprietary mechanism for doing X, and we don't want you to steal ex and those losses where to me. Yeah. Seems fair to me, too. So that's where I think we're headed. All right. Well, good old deep down and old timey deep dive. Everybody'll takes us to the days of your back before Trump, when we could just deep dive into these legal issues. I love this. This is I can't wait for president Warren. When we can do this, you know all the time. Yeah, I think I think, with we may need to buy first of all, I've said this to you. I can't remember if I said this on the show, I if, if, if Elizabeth Warren is elected president. I'm going to make an episodes worth of Andrew was right. Like I'll put in the way it's worth it. To me, this is one of those hedging my bets in a way that just, yes, I'm setting myself up for having to do a bunch of work that, you know, I really don't need to do, but it's so worth it to me. We need to make a super cut of Andrew saying, I may have to crowdsource it's a little bit because we have a billion episodes. But like I've just all the time you sell presidency to- prison. Yeah. Future future president, you know, Elizabeth Warren and just make the alternate. Andrew was right episode because. Because it'll be the best genders, right? But also in addition to that, if we get president warn we may need to turn. I mean yodel mountain is forever because who knows how long it's gonna take to, you know, unravel all that and to keep up with who was and wasn't punished for all the stuff. I did all that stuff. And also, you'll mountain can send in for government corruption in general doesn't, you know, doesn't have to be Trump necessarily, but we may need another segment of, like fixing the damage. I don't know what prices right game show, this would be. But, like just all all the ways in which we need to undo or fix or reverse or whatever it is a thing that I'm guaranteeing will be under the radar because there's just too much even keep track of. So, in addition, it won't what I'm saying is, it's not going to be all historical deep dives. Like there's gonna be lots of stuff. We still need to talk about in the here now but different would look like there will be. Bad rule except the state, right? I mean, there's the court will still be horrible. The supreme court will still be horrible. So, you know, we've, we've got job security, don't don't worry about that. But, but yeah, I the I really do look forward to that. The, the days in which this show can be dedicated to, like, here's how we fix stuff. Here's why the law means stuff again. Yeah. You know, optimistic pry y'all to say the ultimate rise of Optimus prime there, he's he was sure he was frozen under the sea for a while or was that the other one either way, we'll say that was the other one that's fine. But but, but dalits Optimus turned to be frozen, and see for for exactly for years. And then and then when a warrant is elected, then Optimus prime can unfreeze and go go be prime again. All right. Let's talk about the last thing. You want to talk about. We're going to get through it all because we've specifically. Yeah. Let's do an Andrew was right. Andrew was wrong on the hatch act off, can you if you know the difference between right on wrong? Maybe maybe not. Yeah. I'm gonna read most of this comment. This is from Adam Kerrigan who says great episode commentary regarding the hatch act. So compliment sandwich coming. I'm always a good way to make sure you, Michelle. He says, I have some common, it's some of the information you put out to the extent to which federal employees can participate in partisan. Elections was potentially misleading. You're absolutely correct. That the interpretation of the hatchback has become considerably looser over the past thirty years, but it doesn't get quite as loose as it sounded like you were describing. True. We can participate in partisan political campaigns. We can be members of partisan political clubs. We can even on our own time. Be officers of those partisan political clubs. However, we cannot run for any form of partisan political office. That's that's true. And that air came about because I was describing the basis for one of the plaintiffs in one of the earlier Haczek suits was. Labor organizers, who wanted to to run for office. And it, it I went back and listen to the episode. Definitely sounds like I say, I didn't mean to it sounds like I said that, that the amendments to the hatchback that got rid of some of the other stuff also got got rid of that. And that's not the case. So I appreciate that clarification. It was misleading. And it's part of I wanted to do this. Back to Adam, nor can we in any way allow our status federal employees to give our perspective or comments any kind of additional standing and this here, he goes through and talks about during uncompensated versus compensated time. I totally agree. This is what I think I would say, so, yeah, this would be like the example. I gave on the episode of, you know, the, the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff appears in his military uniform while giving a briefing and says, if you elect, Elizabeth Warren than North Korea will nuke us, right? Like that. That, that would very plainly be compensated on the job time lending unwarranted credibility to a personal opinion. Otherwise, right. Perfectly protect that general could believe it. That general could be pro Trump in his spare time, but it is being on the clock in compensated time and invoking his status as a federal employees that, that, that triggers, the hatch act violation couple more things that I think really, really important super glad that decided to, to raise this as as clarification. There's not necessarily things that I was right or wrong about, but, you know, worth going into more depth the hatch act only applies to executive branch employees. Right. So, for example, there is a, a Maryland, delegate from C so county named Kevin Hornberger. He is elected to public office. He says, Republican stuff he works for the library of congress library of congress is not an executive branch agency. So check doesn't apply to him. We, we mentioned this at the start of the segment, but it is worth pointing that out that you work for let's say the clerk of courts, right? Like there are lots of government employees who are not executive branch employees. Most of them are, but, but there are some that, that are not and the hatch act does not apply to them. It does not apply to congressional staffers, for example. So, so that is that is really good other points that Adam mix that I think are, are really useful. The, you know, verifies our. Pessimism that this is really going very far. He says, if the president chooses, not to follow the office of special counsel's recommendation, the next step would be for a to make a choice. It's up to them to decide whether or not to formerly bring a charge before the, the board. The must be then oppress the issue, it's over Kellyanne Conway stays doesn't even get a citation. But if the chooses to pursue a charge then the functions as the prosecutor before the board, if the board, here's the case, it would have the authority to issue a decision on the merits, the board would have the thority to direct the president to terminate. But the MS is an executive branch agency. The president is the head of the executive branch and it's unlikely that, that he would act in accordance with any board decision. He didn't like factors to consider OS's, currently run by Trump appointed as as Adam points out. I did point that out episode. The MSPB has an ad sufficient members to constitute a qu-. Him in forever. So they can't make any rulings. There's a huge backlog of cases, that would likely need to be heard before Conway's case could even be put on the docket, and the most likely outcome here, folks, you press the issue calmly case wouldn't see the light of day until sometime in late twenty twenty or early twenty twenty one after the election. So everybody wins again. Everybody sternly worded letters, sternly worded letters. That's what we have in this day and age. Yep. And, and that's an that's where out of comes out. He says most likely course events Conway stays every other federal employee on his staff learns that they can get away with these kinds of violation. They ramp up as the election approaches once again, we know this is legal, but there's nothing you can do about it becomes the status quo. I kind of find a take all the time to like no Andrew precisely the ways. The hatch act works is this and also it's none of this is enforced and it doesn't matter in anyway. I think it's kinda funny. I. I get it. I welcome the information. It's good to know what should be happening, but isn't, I guess, well, kind funny, it'd be like, nitpicking description of a thing that doesn't matter because it doesn't well, but here's here's why it, it, it does matter. Get ready. Everybody forever doesn't matter for Kellyanne Conway. No, you're right. When we have Democrats in there, we should make sure that we follow the rules and in and as Adam points out. This is an area where I said, kind of cavalierly hatchback prosecutions are rare and he says, yeah, prosecutions are rare but that doesn't tell the whole story you have to consider why there where it's not common for SP to hear the cases because supervisors generally listen, when the C tells after fire it employees for Chac violation, prosecution only comes into play when a supervisor refuses to do with the is recommended or when an employee tries to craft an appeal of a hatchback violation in the latter case SP doesn't have to take the appeal if the argument is strong, usually it just shuts down the appeal in the early stages, almost nobody fights turbans. He says, I love this phrase. I'm going to start using this the squeeze isn't worth that use. Takes years to argue case before the board most folks just find another job and Chuck it up to experience odds. Are they hated working for the government anyway? So Adam includes, I don't know that any of this constitutes. Andrew was wrong, but considering and briefly explaining when I'm offered may may help people better understand. I, I totally agree. You've you put the other slice of bread on the compliment sandwich. So I will medicine on what's in between, but no, I thought I was super useful, and I really appreciate it, and I'm glad we get a chance to me cheese. But I do also pre sheet. It's good to be armed with the facts hypothetical, though. They may be sometimes. All right. Well, we've done it. We've done awhile card episode. We got to catch up on some stuff. We've got to get to some stuff that was both is depressing as it was newsworthy in the ninth. Circuit thing, I, I'm horrified by that. We need all stay outrage permanently really until this is resolved, which will be maybe never, so permanently we need to do our best to keep our eye on all these things and keep it in perspective. This really is that bad, you know. Administration. Is that bad? So let's, let's keep at it. I know I can't be negative. But because there's so much to be negative about some and sorry I will continue to be out. There is so much more, you know, worth the word over an hour on the bonus and I could go another hour on bad stuff about Justin Walker. There's a lot of bad. That's right. And, and, and, and let's stay vigilant on that. Don't, don't forget, you know, hashtag opposed. Justin walkers. So. All right. Well, thank you so much for listening. Thanks to our patrons for making this happen. This they are the reason the show happen. So if you'd like to join patriot dot com slash law. They of course, got access to this episode early quite early. So that's another reason to join, but thanks so much patriots. Thanks listeners and share this out. If you can't be a patron, we understand that lots of people can't make sure you share the show. That's the next best thing to do to support us. So thank. You so much. We'll see you on rapid response Friday. This has been opening arguments with Andrew and Thomas, if you love the show and want to support trips oats, please visit our patriarch page at patriot dot com slash off. If you can't support a Spanish -ly it'd be a big help. If you leave us a five star review on itunes, Stitcher, or whatever, podcasts delivery, vehicle, use, and be sure to tell all your friends about us for questions suggestions and complaints. Email us at open arguments at gmaiLcom the show notes and links are on our website at WWW dot ahrq dot com. Be sure to like our page on Facebook and post on Twitter at open arts until next. This podcast is production of opening arguments media LLC all rights reserved. Opening arguments is produced with the assistance of our editor, Brian, c-can higgin, our production, assistant. Ashley Smith and our researcher, Deborah Smith special thanks to Theresa Gomez in the entire OA Wicky team. 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The Impeachment Non-Trial with Elie Honig

Words Matter

51:17 min | 6 months ago

The Impeachment Non-Trial with Elie Honig

"Welcome to words matter with Katie. Barlow and Joe Lockhart welcome to words matter. I'm Katie Barlow. Our goal is to promote objective reality as a wise man once said had everyone is entitled to their own opinion not their own facts. Words have power and words have consequences. Our guest is a former state and federal prosecutor with extensive experience leading and managing criminal trials and appeals us as a state prosecutor New Jersey and a federal prosecutor in the Southern District of New York l. e. haunting directed major criminal cases against street gangs drug trafficking organizations illegal firearm traffickers corrupt public officials child predators and white collar. Criminals Elliott also serves who says a rutgers university. Scholar is a CNN legal analyst as featured on cross exam a staple at CNN on the weekend Elian welcome looking back towards matter. Glad to be here. We have much to discuss. Yes so it's all over now in the sense of the trial. I don't know that it's all over. Intense of the political fallout. How do you think the house managers did in their case? What did they? Where did they score? And where did they miss. So overall I have to say I'm not just impressed but really in awe of the job that the house managers to date this back to the beginning of the House investigation first of all to pull together the case that they pulled together on such short timeframe a complex case with they had subpoena power but it was largely elite defied with very limited subpoena power and to still put together a case that I think was understandable and compelling the way they did it was remarkable and with respect to the performance during the trial and to some extent this goes for the trump's lawyers as well to some extent and carve out some exceptions but I thought the quality of the lawyering wearing an advocacy especially over the. Qa portion was remarkable the thoughtfulness the precision of the responses the preparedness. Nobody got caught off guard the level of rhetoric. I thought it was really persuasive. Now Look Adam. Schiff is obviously gifted attorneys gifted at this this is a perfect perfect setting for him. I thought came Jeffries and And Representative Crow. Were really good. I thought vow demings. She's the only one who's not a lawyer. But I thought that she was effective as well and Sylvia Garcia was good Nadler. I don't think is very good just in terms of the presentation on the other side. Let's put aside for a second these shading of truth and that kind of thing but I thought Philbin got once he got. His bearings was really effective impressive as well and simple loan to a lesser extensible and was a little bit looser with the truth. And then you have your whole other category for the sideshows which I'm sure we'll get to that. They're Schuetzen. Ken Starr's worked disasters. We'll get to that. This is very different than a trial. That's in any court state federal appellate where there are definitive rules. Rules of evidence of what's Germain and telling the truth. It was my sense that if there was a judge in the room. Several of the White House defense lawyers would be held in contempt. Talk about that. Yeah one of the things that was so different about this his trial from a normal criminal trial. It's just the flow in the rhythm because when you're doing a criminal trial there is a very natural back and forth. You almost never get an uninterrupted interrupted platform Generally speaking you'll have openings. One side goes then. It'll go an hour. Then the other side goes then. Call your witnesses. Its examination cross examination and warrior even doing your examinations or or your jury addresses. You're getting objected to so there's a constant check on you as a real trial case as a lawyer. If you say something that's a little bit outside the record if you say something that's not been properly admitted in evidence even if you don't sometimes other side just wants to throw you off. There's a constant I guess I would say natural check on everything that's being said in a criminal trial here. It was three days uninterrupted for each side. I mean that boggled my mind is is a trial lawyer. There was no objection. There was no objection. Your honor that's not in the record of objection. misstates the testimony so Yeah I think I think by and large. It's hard to think of anything to me off the top of my head that the house managers said or did that was out of bounds or or really pushed the boundaries of truth Bruce but there were some examples coming from the defense team. For example. I mean early onset Malone said well. Republicans weren't allowed in the skiff. Obvious Sustainment and I think that hurt his credibility but even some of the ways that the facts are argued later the can for example the continued insistence Ukraine. Didn't know there's tons of evidence yet. They knew so they stepped a little bit farther over line and there was no way to check them. Yeah I mean I think the best examples how they treated Victor Shokhin the corrupt prosecutor later they they continued to say that he was investigating Burris MMA right in fact the opposite was true right so this is where and it will be the crux of our conversation station here politics and legal theory and legal practice merge but LEMme throw one more at you Monday morning quarterbacking order backing Is there something. The house managers could have done differently in constructing the articles and making the argument in holding ending them. Not Holding them all of those things. That would have made a difference to things that I can think of. First of all I think the number one thing that they'll be second guessed on. This is what we do now. It's a little hard for me to second. Guess because there's a little bit of an ethic with prosecutors of they're the ones who are in the battlefield but look the the big one is should they have charged crimes alleged crimes in in the articles of impeachment. They could have done so with two little or no cost they they still should have led with abuse of power as they did constitutionally usually you can impeach for abuse of power but they could have either had subsections within abuse of power saying we alleged abuse of power including but not limited to the following a bribery. Be The extortion. See for an election or they could have gone for separate articles of impeachment for each of those crimes or one of those crimes and I think the reason they did not do that is early on in this whole process. People were really having a hard time with the concept of quid pro quo and I think the calculation was. Let's not get get pulled into the weeds of arguing over legal concepts elements of crimes like quid pro quo corrupt exchange. We don't want this to look like a jury instruction instruction where the order to find Article One. You must find the following three elements I think they wanted to keep it high level. In general the problem though is is a couple of things one it opened up this whole argument to what Donald trump aptly called impeachment light. I don't mean it's an APP phrase but I mean sometimes he has a good turn of phrase that I think resonates with people and I think the idea of impeachment light and then look a lot of the debate that we saw at the trial was about the fact that there's no crime here and we know that's not really the law but does it resonate resonate with people and it opened the door to this Dershowitz. The defense of the abuse of power as alleged is not impeachable which we saw a lot of Republicans then take shelter Tur- under including in their vote for no witness so I think that's one big tactical decision that was made the other one is in an ideal world where time wasn't a factor after the house could have gone to court to enforce it subpoenas and this goes to article to the obstruction of Congress. One of the main objections from Republicans. And I think with with some with some heft to it. was you serve subpoenas. We didn't we believe they were effective legally defective but you never took us the cord on it and and so you just jumped right to impeachment and I would have taken away that argument be maybe they would have gotten some of this evidence. Maybe if they fought for Bolton we would have heard from Bolton under oath and same with Mulvaney lenience in with pumping oil. I think they would have won in the courts but the practical the practical problem is they just didn't have time and we saw Jerry now. They're get strung out for months on this and I think that shift didn't WANNA go down the same path so because Katie Wasn't able to join us this weekend. Because we've seen sort of the back and forth house managers manager's time and White House time we're GonNa do something a little bit different here today which I'm going to yield the floor. Now you're now the The prosecutor like yield to the gentleman yield. What's I just healed for? The Guy does yield to the guy across from me and I will have to answer your questions. Okay number number one. Was this whole incident. A plus or minus for Joe Biden in terms of twenty twenty prospects. Let me answer that two ways. Is it going to be yes. And No No I think the answer is Will certainly no better once people caucus in Iowa. And because of the way podcasts work. Some people download this the day after but my my view is it's a net plus us for a couple of reasons one is we live in a tribal society whether it's your political party your religion your ethnicity and it's Democrats are And this goes for Republicans to Democrats are okay with other Democrats criticizing them but they're not okay with Republican rate getting being into their business and I think this all started and came out at a time where Biden was floundering and there was some prospect of Kinda falling off the map. And I think there's been a little bit of a rallying around the second and more important thing is Democrats are enraged and they're enraged enraged by the fact that Donald Trump has not been held accountable and that raises the stakes in this election and it moves away from do I idealogical. We believe in candidate a versus candidate B to the point of the only thing that matters is feeding Donald Trump right and I think that helps Joe Biden widen. I don't know that that helps Joe Biden in Iowa which is a unique place. And maybe even New Hampshire but it will definitely I think over the long run boost his candidacy so so net plus the second way I look at this is is I look at it. From Trump's point of view in some ways trump got exactly exactly what he wanted. He wanted to smear Joe Biden. He wanted the crane needs to do it form. They wouldn't they were willing to do it. He just happened to get caught. Then any got The United States Senate to do it and he he got what he wanted but he's painted enormous price for the idea. That impeachment will rally people people around him. I don't think he'll say this. The people who support have always supported them. They didn't go anywhere but I don't see independence and conservative. Have Democrats looking at the entire process. Particularly with the way the cover up was engineered as saying. Yeah I'M GONNA rally round my president right now so idly like in the real estate business. He got the building that he wanted but he's so overpaid for it and make collapses entire Empire uh-huh well that leads perfectly into my next question. What do you see for the Republicans in the future like? Let's let's think post trump whether it's twenty twenty or twenty four. And how do you see that party going. And who you see. Sort of emerging as the leader of that party. I have for some time thought that the Republican Party was the equivalent dead man. Walking it had major challenges facing demographic point of view the people under thirty five I think very differently than people over thirty five in this country. And that's really bad. News for the Republicans given their ideological base. And I hate to say EH. The people over thirty five Are Going to get older and die and the people under thirty five. We're GONNA get older and be alive and that's that's bad news for both. Yeah we're worse news for me but there you go so I think that was already a challenge. In the Republican Party felt that and they were faced with the choice a moderating their point of views modernizing the party particularly on social issues. Things like gay marriage things like climate. Where young young people have very very strong views it is a tolerant generation and a future oriented generation or they could hang on for dear life to some of the things that sustain them and that's were trump comes in? There was an interesting explanation. I heard the other day that if you think of Republicans Republicans like an endangered species. What happens as a species? Begets appointment. Danger is they either evolve and survive. who talk or they cling so hard to the things that have gotten them where they are they become extinct and I think that's what's going on with the Republican Party so post trump? The really interesting thing to look at is not what's going on in this election. It's what's going on in the next election and you already. We have Nikki. Haley and Mike Pompeo who particularly Nikki Haley. We could have gone the more moderate modern road. She's a young woman who may differences with trump known when she was at the UN and both her in POMPEII. Oh have gone all Liane on. I'm more trumpy than trump. And that tells you that the instincts of survival have taken hold within the Republican Party and and this evolutionary theory applies to politics. It will lead them to be an endangered species. I think if you will twenty years out you're going to have to political critical parties because we're set up as a two and one of them is going to look like what I'd call. The Joe Biden Democratic Party. That will be the Conservative Party and one of them will look quake the Bernie Sanders. AFC party which will be akin to Democratic Socialism. That's where the country's going it's not there now by And I I don't believe Bernie Sanders can get elected because of that because we're not there yet but we will go from being a center right country to a centre-left country and and if you WanNa look for some good news in what's happened over the last three. That's good news because a progressive agenda is much better for average Americans than a conservative agenda. I was GONNA ask you if you were retained by the RNC as a consultant. What would your prescription be? But I think you I think you kind of answered it right there in terms of moving the party ahead for you know for next phases. There were there was a time in which the Democratic Party could not win a national election. Shen Jimmy Carter won a national election because of the Nixon pardon. The Nixon fallout Democrats didn't win again again. It's all nine hundred ninety two and that was because Bill Clinton as a charismatic figure pulled the Democratic Party back towards the middle and made the Democratic Party electable Republicans. Need that kind of person. The problem is is we were just talking about is the charismatic figures in the Party. And I think Nikki Haley is one one and I think as much as Mike pompeo makes me WANNA pull my hair out has real skills as a politician. They're going in the other direction they're going in the direction you know of the the Dodo bird that could have survived but took the wrong path. And now it's tanked. I just compared my compared with Doto. I like it works. What do you see as the impact of this impeachment process? We just went through on some of the down ballot races including the Senate races coming up. Who Do you see as endangered? What do you see happening to the balance of power in the Senate in particular? Yeah that's a really good question. I think if I'd make one prediction out of what happened last last week is I still don't know whether Donald Trump can get reelected or not. It's an open question in my mind. I think as of today the Democrats will retake the Senate. Well I think Susan Collins will lose news. I think Cory Gardner will lose. I think Martha mcsally who I will lose and one other. I don't know who it is I will lose and I think the Democrats will hold their. It's Doug Jones being probably the most vulnerable but Republicans are deciding between the damage. Jeff sessions down there and a pedophile. So let me let me just build off of that answer one of the questions. I get a lot if the Democrats turned the Senate in two thousand twenty could they re impeach Donald Trump and the the short answer to me is legally sure but politically no way and by the way that was a common answer. I think that that I gave to a lot of questions that came up in this impeachment. Legally sure but politically and practically. It'll never fly the one thing that you can say about Donald Trump is. You never know what's going to be the cliffhanger hangar at the end of his reality season. What's the episode one of season? Four or five. I wouldn't rule anything out. He is broken so many malls and if he went I obviously. I don't think there'll be an impeachment. another impeachment before Election Day but if more information and comes out and there are other more serious violations of his oath of office I wouldn't rule it out really. Could you see Pelosi. Green lighting another impeachment of him. It depends what he does. Some of this is there will be a lot of pundits who'll say policy. We'll have his putting her tail between her wag sort of drifting off and this was a failure. I don't think she thinks she failed. I think she's sick. She believes she succeeded and I agree with her. This is about a very simple concept politically. which is our leaders accountable? Our leaders above the law does absolute power absolutely corrupt. She's she's on the right side of all of those questions so I wouldn't. I wouldn't put back. Let me turn it back on you the way can I just has one Pelosi thing because you and I had a lot of discussions about Pelosi and the pattern has always been I say. Why is she doing? This makes no sense and you say she knows what she's doing it turns out it works for but has she really been pushed by that sort of greater good because one thing that is hard for me to get my mind around us. How she she wanted to kill the muller impeachment right? I think we agree on. She did not believe that it was the right move either politically critically or in terms of her constitutional duty or otherwise to impeach based on the Muller reports. She was obviously trying to slowly. Take it away from Nadler and let it go away until this transcript came out. So what changed. Did it just become that. She had no choice. That something else changed. No I think there was a fundamental change in this for better or worse my evolution on all these issues happens to have been documented in the New York Times Over and over again. But I think and again I have not talked to her about this so but I think our thinking is very similar because of the way. Bill Bar mischaracterized the Muller report and because of Bob mowers unwillingness to take a position on almost anything beyond this happened. This happened this kind of there. There wasn't a sense among a lot of Democrats including Nancy Pelosi. I'm not trying to put us on the same level but we agreed. That impeachment wasn't the right political move. What changed is is very simple thing and that Friday night when atom shift came out and did that late night press conference it changed instantly in my mind once I knew what he was talking about more was about something that had already happened? It was two thousand sixteen as much as I believe particularly the wikileaks stuff could have turned the election. You could just as easily argue that James Comey turned the election or you could just disease. You can't win. That argument in the legal slash political world Ukraine was about the next election. This was about the president. Has It took shift a little while to get to this. But when he finally did you heard it over again is about the prisoner cheating right. This is about the president trying trying to rig the next election in his own favor and using our government and our taxpayer dollars to do it. That left Democrats. I believe with no choice to stand there and say. Hey don't worry about it. We'll just wait to. The election was not an option. My guess is she decided it as quickly as most. Oh so that people in the caucus did because remember a good section of the caucus didn't WanNa do it with just more and it was an avalanche once this came out of of members in her caucus. That wanted to do this so it is as simple as not really getting the past which politically I think. Would've I've been neutral at bass negative at worst to debating where we are going as a country so I think she was in the right place before Ukraine and in the right place after Ukraine so let me put my prosecutor hat back on God talk about the legal implications going forward. Our president's going forward going to take the view article two now supersedes Article One and that congressional oversight is neutered and a whether it's trump or its president haley or president cory booker or whomever it is. They've just decided that what happened last week. With the vote settled the separation of powers debate in this country I think one of the long lasting impacts of what we just went through who is that. The balance of power has shifted. I think the executive branch is stronger now than it was and probably will remain stronger for the next the generation and I think Congress has been weakened and we can sort of run through the ways but a lot of the checks on the presidency. I think have been compromised or lower first of all impeachment itself. Now Look We. We know prior patriots are not necessarily binding precedent. But just boil it down. If this is an impeachable what is we can all think of. Worse scenario is worse outrageous scenarios taking a bag of cash from Ukrainians to influence policy or something but as realistic realistic scenarios. Go it's hard to think of a more. Obviously impeachable and removable conduct than this so that that is one important thing but yes. The subpoena battle is really important here. And we don't have all the answers yet because Congress served a whole slew of subpoenas over on the the executive branch the executive branch said you can pound sand on all of them across the board. That's unprecedented no present including Richard. Nixon has ever just said no to everything everything. Nixon said you get some of it. You don't get others and he still got impeached for obstruction of Congress and a weird wrinkle here is we're not going to get resolution the only case it's actually Lee wending. Its way through the courts right now is Don mcgann. And that's that's not even executive privilege at this weird absolute immunity argument which I believe is it failed and disaccord. I think it's GONNA to fail all the way but that was always a fringy extremist theory that presidents had never really actually exerted in court anyway. But if you're put try to put yourself in the shoes of the next president whatever party and let's say Congress Senate or House controlled by the other party digs into you. Why would you comply with any subpoena and and there's no ultimately where this will be corrected is in the courts but we're not gonNA get anything or not? We're not going to get much in the courts because the Democrats never did go to the court really on the bulk of these cases now I will say one thing. The Republican attorneys did well or may have just been fortuitous. Is Leveraged the political political timeline versus the legal time line. If you didn't have political considerations if you didn't have to worry about twenty twenty election and primary and you're running the show for Democrats you go so we're going to take six months more to investigate this. We're going to go to court. We're GONNA FIGHT FOR BOLTON WE'RE GONNA fight for Mulvaney. We're going to fight for those documents. I you would take a year more. You're but you can't as a practical matter because you've got the twenty twenty election looming and I think as a result. We have some bad loans bad precedent. Now it's GonNa take years and years to undo. Yeah the irony of all of the Republican complaints. About how rush they were in the houses. They did the trial ten days. Let's put that aside talk about what I thought was. How's jaw-dropping mind boggling? Crazy wego theory. Alan Dershowitz Hobo. So first of all I have to say. I used to put into get into Professor Dershowitz his class every semester. They had a lottery system for it and I never got in. I was Oh for six semesters of getting into his class and and boy do I regret that now He was an embarrassment and he was. I think really made a fool of himself both in the way he contradicts terms himself. Sure from nineteen ninety eight to now. He's contradicted himself while the he used to say you don't need a crime turned around. I'm trying to keep up with the many turns of Alan Dershowitz and and now he says there has to be a crime but he was turning himself around day by day throughout this process at one point he said well. I've studied my opposition and I realized I more right now than I was. Then I mean what. It's almost like like a stand up. Comedian came up with that line but his his last salvo was this idea that ah it can't be an impeachable quid. Pro Quo an impeachable exchange as long as the president has some intent. Some good intent with good intent being. I need to win this election. Because I'm the best person for the job I mean that is a nutso standard. I'll tell you how you can tell he cites nothing. Nothing and nobody Alan. Dershowitz has been studying this stuff for his whole career for decades and decades. There's no end on the number of scholars and Practitioners Titian IRS. Who can be studied Dershowitz cites from the book of Durhush? And that's it that's chapter and verse and there's real hard what he did to. It's not just offensive to watch what he did. You don't just go. Oh He's wrong. The problem is he provided cover for for Republicans but a special kind of cover not just is cover to vote not guilty but covered vote. No on witnesses because his theory was perfectly tailored to allow the Republican senators to say well. The professor says even if the worst alleged is true even if John Bolton comes in and testifies to the worst of Donald Trump's imagination Asian. It's not impeachable. And all they needed was a thin little hook and they gotta he gave it to him. Yeah and he played a pretty cynical game just by being there he. He sold himself as someone who was not in trump's campaign he did not care about the facts and he was a constitutional scour our when in fact he's a defense attorney. I mean he said over and over. I don't represent Donald Trump. I represent the constitution. First of all get over yourself at dickey's second of all the guy wrote a book called the Case Against Against Impeaching Donald Trump in twenty eighteen before any Ukraine thing happened. That is a ridiculously Self aggrandize position to take think he alienated a Lotta people but look I think people in trump's can't seem as a hero he came in and did he lent his name and he let the weight of his own background reputation and even to an extent. Harvard law school to this theory that I think helped trump he was gonna get acquitted and in all likelihood either way but even dodge witnesses one of the things that struck me when President Clinton went through Impeachment was. He had two sets of wires. He had his own private lawyers. Who represented the president as a human being a person? And then he had his White House counsel who represented the presidency and they were very different and they often often at odds on strategy on how to make the argument so much so that Charles. Ruff the president's White House counsel refused the show President Clinton his opening statement. I in fact he called me into his office the night before. Said I want to show you this. The opening statement. I want you to look at it as a non lawyer and and see if there's anything that jumps out said I'm not gonNA show it to you unless you promise you won't tell the president and I promise that I saw it in this trial. There didn't seem to be any distinction action. It seemed like everybody there. No one was representing the presidency. They were just representing Donald Trump. The person it's a great point to make and so people understand pats at Bologna and Charles. Roth held the same position. They were White House. Counsel when you're White House counsel your client is not Donald John Trump or William Jefferson. Clinton your client is the presidency. The institution of the presidency and some people did not play simple is out there like an attack dog and there's no regard for the presidency itself. It's it's there's no distinction. There was no distinction in his function or performance or ethic as between Pat. Simple only White House counsel and Jaysekulow. Hello private counsel and I think in sadly I think that may be a relic. I mean I didn't know chuck rough but I I worked at the firm Covington burling where he was at started there right around around the time he died and he was revered and if you look back in history the way he handled that position I mean I almost wonder if that would even happen now in the post trump world somebody somebody could say yes. I'm the White House counsel. Yes I understand this act of taking might not be your individual best interest but I think it's necessary for the office I mean what what a what a Sort of noble view of the job but unfortunately also potentially extinct one. And do we do. We think going forward harking back on presidents who no longer feel subject to oversight or any accountability to Congress. Do you think future presidents will view the attorney general as their private attorney. Do you think they'll view the White House counsel was their private attorney and the US government as a reservoir for their own fortunes as opposed to you for the country's well if you're strictly following precedent and your mindset. Was I wanna get away with everything. I can possibly get away with then. Sure I guess the idealistic slash naive side of me thinks well the men and women who will become president after Donald trump whatever that may be from whatever party will be of a bit of higher higher moral bearing and have concerns beyond that but one of the one of the long lasting pieces of damage done by all this damage to DOJ and bill bar. It's hard to overstate state. Just how destructive bill bar has been to the institution of DOJ to the point where lifers doj vets like me who always give DOJ. The benefit of the Dow always presumed. The best intentions have lost that now with respect to bill by the way he's used the OJ. Throughout this has been entirely to protect heck donald trump every step of the way from the from the moment the whistleblower complaint came out and the law says if the whistle blower complaint is deemed credible. All an urgent it shall be forwarded the Congress bill bars DOJ came up with this cockamamie legal position that no it doesn't because it's the president he tried to keep that whistleblower complaint blink from ever seeing the light of day on through refusing to open up even take a look at an investigation on anything you by the way we all know. The president cannot be indicted. It'd Rudy Giuliani can be indicted mick. Mulvaney can be indicted for bribery for extortion. If the facts fit we don't have quite enough of the facts about them but the fact that the OJ wouldn't even take take a look. I mean we all take it for granted now that everything bill bar is going to do and has done is done in no different capacity than if the president's private attorney Randy OJ. And I really hope that changes I mean. I think it's going to be a long long time before we see another Janet Reno become attorney. General did things that were often contrary to the interests and bill. I remember I remember so one of my special projects over the last five or six months primarily in the Green Room at CNN is to work without determine him from being something of a political novice into a seasoned political cynic. We've weeds working we we. We've had quite a few conversations stations where I've had to come to La. After the argument a couple of days later and say see I was right you know. Don't don't argue with me about but usually really do it in a in a in a more biting way. Now that you are a seasoned political cynic go ahead. Ask Me some questions to just do the Horse race game. Because it's kind of fun. These impeachments have a way of being becoming career and legacy defining so. Who Do you think who's involved in this in any way uses this as a springboard who do you see emerging out of? This is a real future weather. It's contender for president or some enormous difference making position. Well I think there are two stars on. The Democratic side Died Adam Schiff who could be elected to anything of. Just Democrats voted right now. The question is what does he want. and I have the idea what the answer to that is. Does he want to run for President in two thousand twenty four two thousand twenty eight depending on how the this election plays out the other interesting character and all all this and I think his Rising Stars came Jeffrey. Such Akeem. Someone I've known for a long time so I'm a little biased. Because I have a lot of respect and affection for him but he's he's got a choice right now. He has to decide whether he's going to take the risk and stay in the house. Go through leadership and one day become the first I African American speaker of the House or if he looks at his old colleague Joe Crowley and says you know at any point this can blow up and Hi odds-on favourite to be the next mayor of New York. I if he decided he wanted to do that I think he could win. That Going away so he has some Choices to make but but I think they stood out. I think everybody on the house managers team I did well. But they're the two who have the widest political options and choices to make Adam. Schiff might decide that he'd like to be speaker. I mean Nancy policies. You know it's reasonable that within the next one or two cycle she she'll retire not because she's pushed out just because everybody's time comes eventually and right now. He has enormous power within that caucus. He may decide that. That's not the job. He wants that he would rather run a committee rather than to be the policy. And the enforcer of the caucus so I think those are on the democratic side of the big winners on the Republican side died. There's clearly some people who came out of this process that raise their profile us as an example. If she wins re-election she's on track to be a rising star within the Republican Party. She may not win reelection though. Democrats hurt district are energized. I look look more on the Republican side and find some losers and there is a thread that runs through all of them. And I'll list them in order rudy. Giuliani emme Alan Dershowitz and Ken Starr and all of them are losers because they were in this for the wrong reasons. They weren't in this for the national interest. They weren't born in this to support their president. They weren't in this to take body balls for the president they were in this to just be relevant. And there's there is a pathetic quality to not knowing when it's time to step aside and get off the stage and all three of them have I think terminally an elite damaged their reputations Particularly Guiliani But I would say the same for star Dershowitz because more than anything. They wanted people to pay attention. They wanted people to say you're the smartest person and I'm the one the president talks to and look at me. Look at me. Look at me and they are they I think are the big losers here. It's an open question and it's going to be what we debate for the next seven or eight months on trump in some ways he got something out of this he got to smear biden he got to solidify this whole base argument of. It's US against them. They're coming after you. I'm the only thing that can keep you protected from on them. Just powerful political argument but he's paid an enormous price and the Democrats opened a window onto his corrupt nature and it'll be malpractice of they can't drive a truck through so two more questions for you. Both relented cheers. You're SORTA past Ken Starr I know I know I wanted to set up a lockhart cam on the day when when Ken Starr was speaking why on earth do you think they brought him in. I get why he wanted to. Who Do this? Well I think you just talked about that. But whose interest was it in to bring him in was it. In trump's interest was in simple loan officers was just the ultimate troll troll move. What what do you think was behind that decision to bring him in? Before we had the Internet quit call it something like it was just the ultimate poke in the eye right now. It's troy that's really all it was it was the hero of the right was gonNA come out ride from the sunset for one last. Stand his argument him. It was unintelligible. I started with a sense about Ridge and by the end I had almost a little sympathy for him. Because he was pathetic he was a defeated small man on the giants had once stood and it was a ploy and it was a ploy that backfired on. That's it didn't change fed the result. It's it's not that important but it. It is indicative of politicians now who only care about up themselves and people only care about themselves and where they fit as opposed to the people again the giants in the Senate who used to put The country first. And that's the lesson of this you know and this is where I thought Adams the most memorable thing Adam Schiff said was in his wrap. Wrap up I WANNA say on Thursday night in there. They was the second to last night so it wasn't his final push but the most memorable and things that I the thing we'll stick with me forever was when he talked about. You can't trust Donald Trump. You can know you trust you know you can't and you can't trust trust him to put the country's interests ahead of his own because winning there's a choice he'll always choice and I don't think his message was about Donald Trump. His message was to the one hundred senators the room of are you like that. Are you like Donald Trump who will always put your party's interests ahead of your country who always always put your own personal interests ahead of your country and he challenged them to be better and they failed so one last question for you. Is it even possible to identify a sort of conventional wisdom on impeachment or does it just depend so much on who the person is and what the conduct is because the Mehtar how do you compare Donald Trump doing what. He's was impeached for with Bill. Clinton and what he was impeached for two completely separate but is there any common threat. The the threat may not flow cleanly. But you've you know this is what we do. We try to figure out. What have we learned what what about? How does this compare to the last time? And there's no doubt that on one level the Republicans approaching one thousand nine hundred eight backfired on them. They they lost a midterm election. That had one hundred and fifty years since they someone lost an election. In that way Clinton went to seventy three percent job approval they was the country rallied around him him on the other hand. Bush beat Gore In two thousand was that a hangover from was Gore was was the election you know. Oh stolen was Gord. Not The best candidate who knows and we could talk forever on that. So let's put that aside. I think there's there's no way to compare the two but let me focus on one difference as what I I'll be looking for from the Public Bill Clinton from the from some two days after he was deposed took a very distinct approach to any time he was asked about this. He'd say I did it. I'm sorry sorry I take full responsibility. And you'll remember the day that he was acquitted. He walked out and he he said. I'm sorry I take responsibly. They said something remarkable. I think he said and I'm sorry. I put the country through this and everybody in I think in the country thought yes you did. And I'm pissed and I. I really wish you hadn't but thank you for acknowledging that you've kind of screwed up everybody's lives for the last ear. Trump takes the opposite approach. Trump it's perfect. Everything I did. They're out to get me. It's all about me. Don't worry I I can. I know what's best for you. Just just stick with me. I think that's going to have a very big impact on the the political fallout here. And I think it's going to keep trump from expanding his base to getting the necessary boats to be reelected and therefore his entire campaign won't be about why people should vote for him. He'll be about why they shouldn't vote. For Joe Biden Naming Charlie Smith warned Bernie Sanders whoever Mike Bloomberg whoever whoever that is and it sets up a very ugly campaign Very bitter your campaign and campaign that trump only has one route to win. And I think it's going to be tough because there's no sense of humility. There's no sense of regret. There's no sense of responsibility and I think a lot of people who've been through this and Are Tired of this and tired of the show in the fatigue that goes with the trump drama would look at him differently. If he just wants said. Hey I get it i. This is not the way I wanted it to go and I take responsibility for some of this and that's where I think you can't compare them and I wouldn't expect just because Clinton got a political boost out of being a peach and then acquitted. I don't think you can expect the trump. We'll have the same thing because his reaction is so different. Can you imagine. Can you imagine if he if he showed some contrition. Well I mean I my reaction would be similar to watch and Ken Starr in the floor of the Senate rake the opposite argument that he made Twenty years ago. Yeah let's finish with One last a question. It's a broad question so you can take it any way you want and not being a lawyer. I look at the White House and the presidency. We now kind of this way. This is the argument they've made. They've made the argument very loudly and clearly that the president can't be indicted. They've gone into court and said the president can't be investigated they have then went into the The the House and the Senate and said that the president can't be impeached. Are there any guardrails left legal guardrails there are and I agree that this is closer to the imperial presidency so to speak than we've been in a long time maybe ever but to me their their two primary guardrails the more practical tangible on the courts themselves and I think a lot of these disputes that are winding their way through the courts will. We'll come out against the president and I think the courts will set things straight for example. This argument that the president cannot be investigated criminally. That's now going up to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Supreme Court has taken that case they have to reject that they have to and by the way footnote to all this. Let's see how do we constituted court handles it right there. Some concerned with now cavenaugh gorsuch. But I think that that I can't even be investigated. Argument will be firmly rejected. I think if and when the issue of congressional subpoenas gets it's fully litigated and we're seeing it to some extent with the Magangue case we could have seen others and we may see others. There's other reasons that congressional subpoenas may be issued I think the courts will restore some of the balance back over to Congress now because these again. These assertions of executive privilege is broad defines. Most that is never been litigated. The other big factor I think is is simply ably again. Maybe I'm slipping back into being naive or idealistic but just the idea the concept of norms. Just the idea of norms being respected. I mean Donald Trump is part of the reason people hate him. Part of the reason people love is a norm breaker and he has defied norms ranging from hiring having his daughter and son-in-law work in senior positions in the White House to not turning over his tax returns to little things like going to the White House correspondents dinner and I think whoever takes that job next I hope from from whatever party respect some of those and if not by the way the law can evolve as well we can pass laws. CLARIFYING ANTI NEPOTISM EPA dismal requiring someone to turn over their tax returns. So I think those are sort of the two big takeaways. I do think if you were a graph the power of the presidency and the executive branch. It's said a high point right now but I think the natural gravity built into our system will pull it down. It'll take years or decades but but I think it will come back L.. Thanks so much for joining us. I look forward to cultivating your political cynicism as years. Go go by. I know you'll be back soon. we really appreciate your time. Thank you John is always great to have Leon. Every time I talked to him which lately he's been every morning in the Green Room at CNN. An and I learned something about how the law works and what the Constitution means. It's not very often and I think people who listen every week. We'll get get this that I met. I lost for words but I am somewhat at a loss for words right now and. I don't want to sound outraged aged and alarmist but at the risk of doing that last week was a very very dark moment in the United States Senate and in our democracy the Republicans in the side with the the cheerleading of the president have removed important guardrails. And it's not hard to imagine looking forward for eight ten years and seeing the world's best experiment in democracy and governing move towards a more authoritarian dictatorship where the president is imperial and the president can do no wrong and I think for some people I get that that may sound like a bitter response to getting the results. You didn't want but I think it's very real when a president can and and one of the most so-called distinguish lawyers in the country can go on the floor on of the Senate and essentially said the president can do whatever he wants and when the president gets up and says I have article too. I can do whatever I want. And when you need two-thirds of majority to hold the President Accountable and the Republican Party says the president can do anything he wants the path that the slippery slope away from democracy it becomes very clear. And I think that's where we are and I think people like Doc Zander Mitch. McConnell had perverted the idea of public service. That Lamar was injured. Came into office and he. He was elected governor in Tennessee in nineteen seventy eight and he ran against corrupt governor and he had to be sworn in three days early. Because the corrupt Governor Ray Blanton was selling pardons and the legislator run by a great southern politician. And mcwhorter said. We've got to get with this new governor. And even though he's in the party opposite because the guy in there now is selling pardons and he came in as a corruption fighter and he's leaving as a lamb damn. He's leaving as a member of a political party that is subservient to a corrupt leader. A cult leader. AH IN DONALD TRUMP. And that's dangerous. So there's there's really two things we can do. As concerned citizens this one is decide. Screw IT systems raked. I'M NOT GONNA bother. I'm busy enough. Let the Crooks and criminals around the government government and we'll just hope for the best the second thing in what I would hope people do is throw the crooks out and we're only nine months away from election. It's very simple on election day. Donald trump either get a second term in rewarded for everything he's done or he'll be thrown out in a movement that's of the people on by the people and he will face the consequences of being an ex president who's also also someone who use the power of the office to enrich himself and to corrupt the entire process. We can't do that by saying screw it and going back to war wise. We've got nine months. We know we have to do. Thank you for listening listening. To words matter please. Rate and review words matter on apple podcasts and other podcast providers.

Donald John Trump president Party Senate President Clinton Joe Biden White House Republican Party White House Congress CNN Professor Dershowitz Ken Starr Adam Schiff prosecutor United States Ukraine John Bolton Katie Barlow
Amicus Curiae (feat. Mimi Rocah)

The Daily Beans

1:37:55 hr | 3 months ago

Amicus Curiae (feat. Mimi Rocah)

"Starlings thank you for listening to the Star Burns Audio podcast network. We have so many comedy shows to add to your playlist just last week on starnes audio on emotional support. Allesandra is joined by her guests arch. They talk all about mental health dealing with loneliness while moving to a different country and becoming Paris. Hilton's bff on dumb gay politics. Julian Brandy interview the high school senior. Who's viral tweet? To President? Obama led to his historic nationwide graduation. Commencement address in the season. One finale of musicals that never made it gave in the gang are joined by. Broadway's drew gambling for inspirational. Show about the magic of self worth in the great vaccine on that Black Ash. Show comedian and actor. Jejomar NEIGHBORS JOINS HOSTS DULCIE. Sloan and discussing the cultural impact of the movie. Friday audio on Apple podcasts spotify or any podcast platform or full list of our shows featuring hosts like Gilbert Godfrey Paula poundstone. 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The journey of some amazing prolific and talented actor artists comedian creators writers and directors to discover the critical and more often than not similar ingredients to their story that got them to where they are today to deep dive that uncovers events in moments that surprise even our guests. We're not only draw solid blueprint of success from each artist that can be applied to your own personal journey. We structure the narrative of the artist's own. Hollywood legend. Check out the cliff. Dorfman show wherever you get your podcast. Join US live daily at three thirty. Pm Pacific for stuck at home with Jason on the Star Burns Audio Youtube Age. If you don't like it I will personally send you all of my overdue library books from High School along with the thank you note for the lovely Englander Marine uh-huh Hello and welcome to the daily beans for Friday may Fifteenth Two Thousand Twenty Today Judge Sullivan appoints an Amicus curiae to the Flynn case. Trump loses his bid to toss out emoluments case potential cases in the flint. Unmasking right wing conspiracy Richard Burr steps down as chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee amidst an FBI investigation into alleged insider trading. Dr Bright testifies before Congress the Wisconsin Supreme Court overturns. The governor stay at home orders. Judge Jackson Orders Trump and the office of management and budget to hand over Ukraine scandal emails previously blocked all in a New York Times for your case and a key former F. B. I. Official casts doubt on the Justice Department's case for dropping the charges against Michael Flynn. I'm your host Ag. Hey everybody. I'm flying solo today. First of all I wanted to say thank you. So much to all the feedback. We received about yesterday's episode. We had a epic interview with Frank Figliuzzi about the unmasking scandal and I recorded the b-block own and I was pretty angry. But it seems as though Combination of Angry AG and good news and Cortin Confession AG Jordan is the perfect combination. A lot of people say that have told me that my interpretation of the news was emotional for them. And so I just wanted to Thank you for listening and tell you that I appreciate your feedback and your support and that despite me seeming angry and maybe angry is a strong word passionate about what I'm talking about the news that we're discussing I very much love doing what I'm doing. And bringing these stories to you in a way that I think is manageable and straightforward. And so I just wanted to say the mountains of feedback that we got on yesterday's show was just very I'm just I'm humbled and I have a lot of gratitude for everyone's comments so thank you for that also. Today's happy hour. It's going to be today Friday unless you're a patron and you're getting this Thursday night. If you are a patron of the show you get these shows ad free and you get them the night before they go public if you want to become a patron You can join our happy hour cocktail. Qna themed quarantine meet and Greet Extravaganza them. That is the official name happens every weekend. Usually on a Friday sometimes on a Saturday depending on. Who's doing what and this week. It does fall on a Friday Patrons invited for the first hour then. We put the link out to the public for the second hour because we know not. Everybody can afford to be a subscriber but it's as little as three bucks a month and so with that you get these episodes ad free. You get them early. You get my newsletter. You get my research notes. All my article cited during the entire week of news including muller she wrote and the daily beans plus our newsletter which has funny infographics and memes and all sorts of information on upcoming events are. Po Box just frequently asked questions all sorts of things and then we also have a ton of really interesting. Thank you gifts for for. Being a premium membership starts little three bucks a month and your support helps us continue to to provide health care coverage for our staff and 401K's and it's Really really really helpful during this time but again if you can't we totally understand we we tweet. Tweet this link out for today's happy hour to four. Pm Pacific Time to the theme is the eighties. This week So dress up as the eighties. Anything eighties and we will like. I said if you can't swing it will be tweeting that link out to the public for the second half the second hour which starts at five Pacific Time so look for that and join us. It's a lot of fun we've had weedays join US. We've had musical interludes and A Pizza Party and Pajama Party. Like it's just it's a lot of fun And we really enjoy putting those out so again four. Pm Pacific. Friday May Fifteenth Eighties themed and We look forward to it. So without further ADO You heard you could tell from the intro. Today is an absolutely bananas. Newsday and we have a lot to cover and I in the block. Here we're going to have Jordan. Go over Dr Bright. That's the whistle blower from Department of Health and Human Services Director of Barda his testimony to Congress today and and she'll have all that information for you and then of course later on in the show we'll be joined by Amanda reader this on this particular show to go over the good news block and our quarantine confessions. So it's going to be a great show. And we're interviewing former federal prosecutor law professor and candidate for District Attorney Westchester County. New York Mimi Roca and her and I are going to discuss well. I'll just let you listen to the interview. It's it's it's not something that you WanNa miss because there's just so much going on right now but it has to do with judge. Sullivan's new order in his he ordered. I'll tell you he ordered Judge retired judge. John Gleeson to be an amicus Curie. We remember I translated his minute order from yesterday. saying you know what he meant and basically he made a call for amicus curiae brief saying hey. I need I need these or I'm requesting them Do but it's not a free for all judge. Jackson said it's not a free for all so don't be an asshole. I have sole discretion which is sort of code for Bill Bar. You can't stop me and Judge Gleeson filed a heat. Will he put out an order for judge? Gleeson to be amicus Curiae and just last minute breaking which. I didn't get to speak to me Rocca earlier about He. Also which we put beans on in which I was hoping for has made Covington burling an amicus curiae and so they will be providing an amicus brief to the court in the Fillon case those are Flynn's original. Og lawyers the ones who set up the guilty plea and that you know were. They were his reasonable lawyers before Sydney Powell came along. So you want to be here for that interview with Mimi Rocca for right now. Let's get into the news. Let's hit the hot notes notes all right without further ado. I'm going to hand it over to Jordan for the testimony of Dr Bright. Hello everybody welcome to Jordan. This corn beans. That's quarantine beans. Take OUT THE TEEN PUT IN A BEAN. Jordan's cord beans not corn and beans. Which is what a lot of people thought I was saying this whole time. I couldn't possibly think. Oh maybe corn now I was GonNa say maybe you thought? Corn was like a like a really insensitive truncated version of corona virus. I just call it corn. Now cornyn beats. It is corn beans. And I'll probably just stop saying it this because who needs to think. I'm talking about corn and beans when really talking about the very serious things. I guess that goes for everything on this. Podcast but I'm coming to you for my living room today of a new apartment which is very exciting. Thank you everybody for the good wishes. He sat on my move Everything went very smoothly and of all settled here and I like the new space a lot. So thank you for reaching out and being concerned I appreciate you guys a today. I'm going to be covering rick. Bright's testimony to Congress. So rig bright he was the guy that got ousted from the health and human services departments. He was deputy assistant secretary. And essentially what he was doing was file filing a whistleblower complaints against HHS. And he's trying to stop the transfer his transfer to NIH and he's trying to get his old job back he spoke out and pretty was was pretty obviously like over his position because of speaking out he was speaking out against the administration's pushing of a drug of that didn't have really any sort of scientific backing at that point in time. And that was the hydrochloric win so when he spoke to Congress today he was asked a lot of questions obviously about the time. Line of the administration's response certain decisions that were made His his opinion on you know sort of where we're at where we need to be. What's IT GONNA look like in the future and it was long in really illuminating? And I WANNA open with the CLIP OF HIS OPENING STATEMENT. Because it's like a lot of these opening statements. Really powerful so. Let's hear that today. The world is confronting public health. Emergency unlike any we've seen in over a century we are facing a highly transmissible and deadly virus which not only claims lives but also disrupts the very foundations of our society. The American healthcare system is being taxed to the limit. Our economy is spiraling downward and our population is being paralyzed. By fear stemming from a lack of a coordinated response and the dearth of accurate clear communication about the path forward Americans urine to get back to work to open their businesses and to provide for their families. I got that however what we do must be done carefully with guidance from the best scientific minds our window of opportunity is closing if we fail to improve our response now based on science I fear the pandemic will get worse and prolonged. There will be likely a resurgence of Kobe. Nineteen this fall. It'll be greatly compounded by the challenges of seasonal influenza without better planning twenty twenty could be the darkest winter in modern history. First and foremost we need to be truthful. With the American people. Americans deserve the truth. The truth must be based on science. We have the world's greatest scientist lead US lead US speak without fear of retribution. We must listen. Each of us can and must do our part now on. Tuesday Dr Fouled. She delivered a message in voice. This clear and trustworthy as the encouraged us to act with caution as we return to our daily lives we should listen to him and other scientists sharing their expertise while waiting for a cure and the vaccine which I believe will come. There are things we must do immediately increase the public education about the basics washing hands social distancing appropriate face covering their simple but critical steps by valuable time until there's vaccine we need to ramp up production of essentially equipment and supplies including raw materials and critical components shortages of these increased the risk of our frontline healthcare workers and they deserve the best equipment to protect themselves. We need to facilitate equitable distribution of essential equipment and supplies and finally we need a national testing strategy. The virus is here is everywhere we need to be able to find it isolated and stop it. We need to have the right testing for everyone who needs it. We need to be able to trace contacts isolate. Quarantine inappropriately while striving to develop a cure. Initially our nation was not as prepared as we should have been as we could have been. Some scientists raised early warning signals that were overlooked and pages from our pandemic playbook. We're Nord by some in leadership there will be plenty of time to look back to assess what has happened so we can improve but right now we need to focus on getting things right going forward. We need a comprehensive plan that everyone knows. Everyone participates in. Congress has taken important steps to support the response. And there's much more we can do with your help. We can get through this crisis working cooperatively cooperatively with our global partners. We can and will succeed in finding a cure for cope at nineteen but that success depends on what we do. Today we will either be remembered for what we did for what we failed to do to address this crisis. I call on all of us to add to ensure the health safety and prosperity of all Americans. You can count on me to do my part. Thank you so incredibly powerful a lot of the stuff that he said today Was incredibly powerful. He went on to answer a bunch of questions. Say a lot more really revelatory and important things He said that the hope that a vaccine is going to be ready even between the twelve to eighteen months time range is one that only exists pretty much if everything goes perfectly he said if everything goes perfectly then that's when that twelve to eighteen timeline really becomes a reality and he goes on to say we've never seen anything we've never seen everything go perfectly So this in combination with trump going out there and saying that he thinks we're going to have a vaccine by the end of the year that seems to go against you know every model of vaccine development. We've heard referenced in her talked about I. Myself Am not an expert on vaccine development. I have no idea all I know. Is that what the facts that I have been hearing for? Scientists and doctors is that toys eighteen timeframe for anything to happen sooner than that You know we hear increasing about a commentary saying that that starts to increase the risk on the vaccine not being as effective as it to be or efficient or just it winds up being it could wind up being worse if they roll out a vaccine preemptively that hasn't gone through the correct amount of levels of quality assurance basically Bright also talks about how he he warned the trump administration about the shortages of PP and he pretty directly false trump and the people around him for minimizing the outbreak early on and how that contributed to that limited amount of p supplies and he said that he thinks that that happened possibly with deadly consequences. So I'm GonNa roll this clip for you guys talking about that with proper leadership and collaboration across government with the best science leading the way we can devise a comprehensive strategy. Time is running out because the virus is still spreading everywhere. People are getting restless to leave their homes. When you look at the first four months of this year would you describe the governments and the administration's response as a successor of failure? I believe we could have done better. I believe they're in critical steps that we did not take time and then around a similar topic just talking about He was he was basically asked like. When did you realize that things had things like really gone wrong? And he was asked to sort of describe what that revelation was like and he said something that you may have seen headlines already because he curses anytime a politician drops ship while they're testifying Congress. That's a pretty big deal. It's usually a chamber. That's held to decor standards. Like no other so for for him to use. That word was very intentional to convey the amount of Shit Shit Store Murray. That was brewing around and very quickly. And I'm going to throw that clip for you guys. 'cause I think it's going to prove to be pretty historical looking back on all of this. I am sure there are specific. Conversations e-mails moments in time that you remember like they happened yesterday the inflection points where if the response to your warnings have been heated. Things might have been different. And I'm sure they haunt you. Keep you up at night from January of this year. Tell me about just one specific moment when you had that sinking feeling in the pit of your stomach. Because you're not seeing the response that you knew needed to happen. I'll never forget the emails I received from Mike Boeing indicating that we are we are mask supplier in ninety five respirate supply was was completely decimated and he said we're in deep shit the world is and we need to act and I pushed that forward to the highest levels. I could in. Hhs and got no response. From that moment I knew that we were going to have a crisis for healthcare workers because we were not taking action. We're already behind the ball. That was our last window of opportunity to turn on that production to save the lives. Those healthcare workers and we didn't act at some point during the testimony. He wound up talking about the process of procuring. The supplies room from other countries in he pointed something out that I had actually seen pointed out by a friend who works in the medical industry and she sent me a video basically. The point is the way that they were forced to procure supplies from other countries. Made it so that. They're receiving these pieces of equipment. That didn't go through the same. Sorta or didn't just have the same manufacturing standards basically so they were to get he said. I'll just restrict quote Not only that. We are forced to procure the supplies from other countries without the right quality standards so even our doctors and nurses in the hospitals today are wearing ninety five marked masks from other countries that are not providing sufficient protection that a US standard and ninety five and ninety five mask would provide them in the example that I saw. If this was my friend had like yes and a video of her boss being a video taking a mask out of the box that had come from China and she puts it on and then she does the test where you know you like. Try to blow a lighter out with the with the mask and the mass from China she can easily blow it out and then she puts the mask on from the US. It's like the exact same product. Looks the exact same just wants made in China and one in the US and she couldn't blow the light out and so she was basically telling all employees. Make sure if you're going to procure these things or or just you know you wind up with one that was manufactured in another country or just just check anyway honestly but especially when they have they were forced to go to those other countries like bright was talking about. That's that's scary In his video she like doubles up on the masks but to make the ones that are less effective more effective. But even then it's like the whole point of this is that we have a shortage. So then what are you gonNA start like buying double of everything to make effective? I don't know maybe that's something. They should've dynasty. But the point that he's making is the level of unpreparedness that went with all of these first steps happened. You Know I. The level was unacceptable is the argument that he's making and it happened too late one of the things that Alex as our came out with against bright testimony today because him and trump in tandem basically just like shed on everything But HE ALEX was saying. Alex doesn't more disrespectful. And a first name basis of a high level official. Alex was telling me he was saying that everything. Dr Brides you know bitching about basically is stuff that was already. You know it's long gone. It's already resolved it's like old stuff. Essentially is what he said. And it's it's not. It's not old stuff if we still have people in hospitals right now using the only gear that they could have procured that's ineffective that's just one small example but it's such a bad argument that he's making but here's his quote. He says everything. He's complaining about was achieved. Everything he talked about was done every single thing. He told that to reporters on the White House. South Lawn Trump trumpet said that he watched them rights testimony and he said he looks like an angry disgruntled employee. Who frankly according to some people didn't do a very good job that's what he always fucking says he always says. According to some people like no. You're fucking staff dude. I don't know. Or maybe doug admits everybody that you don't know them. I feel like I would just as a citizen. Moving forward any future presidents out there. If you're going to pick people to like run the fucking country with you if you don't really know them or know if they're qualified or what. They're like in their jobs. I don't know tell me that I'm just GonNa keep I'm just GonNa believe that there's more quality control come in from the top down on that one. I off second off. Obviously this is an entirely different story. Dr Bright got fired or moved because he spoke out against something that trump wanted to push. That happens over and over and over again. I don't care what side of the political spectrum. You're on all of the facts show. If you speak out against him your likelihood fucking speaking out against trump is like the CO morbidity of the illness that is serving under this president if you do that. Shit. You're done. That's just how it works. You can look at it without. She found she walks on eggshells constantly as the only thing that you can do. So when he bright didn't do that he got ousted. That's no coincidence. Like please please try to you know. Have any of the people in your life that may be are saying? That's like a ridiculous conspiracy theory or something like give me give me any other reason. You know you can't so. Their response is predictable to what he said. But it doesn't change the power of what he told Congress today There's so much content in there I tried to give you all some clips if you WANNA look at more. There's really good coverage all over from all these different news agencies you know taking different clips and everything and making it more digest making it more digestible for you but check it out if not this can for now. Suffice for now suffice that sounds like something. Trump would pedal to the people without it being tested for now suffice. Take it for now okay. Everybody I hope everyone's doing okay as always and were always here. If you want to reach out I've been having a really good time interacting with some of you. Dm's and stuff. I'm again I try really hard to get back to everybody I promised eventually I will get back to you so me up at Jordan's confused on twitter if you WANNA chat or at daily beans or at Miller Shiro. Agee's right there and she also likes Responding to fans listeners. I should say fans presumptuous other than that heavy good day and take care of yourselves by everybody all right George. Thanks for that update We will be right back after this with more headlines. Stick with us through these MRIs will be asked. Hey everybody it's ag for the daily beans being stuck at home these days. You probably don't think much about Internet privacy. Because you're on your own home network and what's safer than that just fire up an incognito mode and no one can see what you're doing right wrong even in incognito mode your online activity can still be traced even if you clear your browsing history. Your Internet service provider can still see every single website you've ever visited and if you're down and understand what happened in the Senate today with that. Vote for Internet privacy. That is why now more than ever you need to get expressed vpn. I never go online without using express. Vpn Express VPN. Make sure your Internet service provider cannot see the sites that you visit instead you're an connection is rerouted through express. 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We'll see which one develops as I read what I've already written for myself. The Wisconsin Supreme Court has overturned that state's stay at home order issued by Governor Tony Evers calling it unlawful. And unenforceable in a high profile win for Republicans who I guess once everyone tonight This was a four to three decision along party lines or along ideological lines. It was Wednesday and it says the governor overstepped his authority when the State Department of Health Services extended these stay at home order through may twenty sixth. The ruling comes after legislatures. Republican leaders filed a lawsuit last month arguing. The order would cost Wisconsin residents their jobs and hurt many companies. Asserting that if it was left in place are steep would be in shambles. They said And of course it's the stay at home order not the virus. That is the cause of the state being in shambles. The suit was filed specifically against the State Department of Health Services Secretary Designate Andrea Palm and other health officials who made the decision in mid April to extend the state's safer at home. Emergency order not stay at home safer at home at the same time. As the extension the state loosened some restrictions on certain businesses including golf courses public libraries and arts and crafts stores but the justices wrote in their decision Wednesday that agency cannot confer itself the power to dictate the lives of law abiding individuals as comprehensively as the order does without reaching beyond the executive branches. Authority in a statement released separately Wednesday. Night Governor Governor Governor. Excuse me Governor Evans. Governor Evers encouraged people in his state to continue to stay safe at home practice. Social distancing limit travel because he says because folks deadly viruses don't wait around for politicians and bureaucrats to settle their differences or promulgate rules and he's very correct on that so much for states rights right. It's only when it benefits the Republicans. Do they argue for it? And the actual CDC guidelines to reopen the country have been released. These are the ones that were shelved. We've we've reported on this Trump put out a seventeen page thing. Cdc actually at sixty pages April thirtieth. They said this will never see the light of day and they put it in a wherever they put shit they never want to see again And the actual. Cdc guidelines are far more detailed than trump's plan however they are still really watered down as I read them and this is as compared with normal things from the CDC normal guidelines from the CDC are much more straightforward motto covered this extensively on on the Rachel maddow show asking she has. Cdc Are you okay? Because their reports after investigating outbreaks meat meat packing plants became as she said mealy mouth. She looked at a report from April Twentieth. Which was like the og CDC? There were like you must do this. You have to put hand sanitizing sanitation with the doors. Employees will socially distant. You must distance from each other. You must wear face masks employs. We'll stagger you will do this. You will do that. This should happen. This should happen but on April. Twenty second two days later in a report after an investigation for an outbreak. Inist another meat packing plant. The report was wimpy. It was it was the recommendations were. Hey if you feel like it. You should wear masks if it's feasible as long as you know. These aren't they even go as far as in their report to say these aren't required these guidelines. We just consider them. We appreciate it if you if you could if you if you wanted you could put hand. Sanitizing stations at the entrances Maybe you could take temperatures if you you know if it's feasible if it's feasible and matter was like what happened in those two days to the CDC to make them such wimps and what happened to change their language and now looking. I remember her reporting on this very well and now I'm looking at the. Cdc guidelines to reopen the country. The ones that were actually you know quashed by the trump administration and they're the same kind of quote unquote mealy mouth language soft recommendations. If it's feasible type language the whitewash shit that came in the April. Twenty second meat-packing investigation outbreak coup. Cdc report so the language isn't normal. it's a lot of soft language. It's a clear departure from how CDC usually talks well again these CDC reopened guidelines are are the same way as that meat-packing one. And I think it's of the utmost importance that we find out who the. Cdc is taking a pen to the language not just in these guidelines to reopen but in CDC outbreak investigation reports as well like the ones in the meatpacking plants brought to our attention by motto so who at CDC is whitewashing these reports was it done at the behest of the president. When was it done? When did it start? Was it done under a direct order from the president or out of fear of retribution? From him maybe a direct order from czar or somebody at health and Human Services or somebody. You know Dr Redfield and why when Wi who what where. How did this happen? This is sharply gate all over again but with words and he's endangering our lives. I mean Scharping. Eight also did but I don't know I spoke about this yesterday. I'm staying home. I think we all should. Unfortunately many of us have jobs that you can't stay at home from we but and that is why we need mortgage relief and Rent Relief. Why we need a universal basic income until this is over. The Republicans have abandoned the middle class. They go back to work and die or stay at home and starve. Wreck your credit. Ruin your future. That's your choice. Choice also gets a little bit better news here pivot out of this. Amy Berman Judge Jackson. If you're nasty is back in the news. She has ordered the White House to turn over those twenty emails from the Ukraine scandal. That trump blocked these are directly relating to president. Donald Trump's decision to withhold congressionally appropriated military aid from Ukraine the appropriate military aid the Gao determined was illegal to withhold violated. The compound control impoundment control. Act Excuse me. The administration has refused to produce those communications. Thus far as we reported way back in January January third I think trump claims. The documents are protected from public release because of did white privilege. I mean executive privilege and this all comes from a freedom of Information Act lawsuit filed by The New York Times which sought those communications between Michael Duffy. Principal Associate Director for national security programs at the OEM MVP and Robert Blair a senior advisor to then acting White House Chief of Staff Mick. Mulvaney and respond. That's the crux of communication right. Everyone was saying did trump himself order. This hold on Ukraine and that set of emails is where everybody thinks. The answer probably is because that's the connection trump to Mulvaney to Blair and then Blair over to the office of Management and budget who who we have seen the email where where they were told to put that aid on hold but they couldn't link trump to directly but in response to court order to produce the requested records trump withheld twenty documents contending. They were covered by presidential communications privilege. Wherefore exempted from public disclosure laws the Times challenged the exempt classification of documents claiming. The government failed to provide any evidence that the information in the emails fell within the privilege which requires quote. An actual advisory relationship between the president and the staffer asked to the specific document. So without knowing. What's in the emails? It doesn't you know you. Can you can contest the characterization that they are covered by presidential communication privilege. And that's what the New York Times is doing. They said we don't believe you. Leave your ass. So judge Jackson decided instead of relying on the government's assertion of the privilege. She needed to review the documents herself in her chambers ordering the government to deliver them within one week her order reads quote in order to assist the court and making responsible to Novo determinations in this case including any determination for purposes of the presidential communications privilege concerning the nature and extent of the relationship between any particular communication and presidential decision making and for purposes of the deliberative process privilege whether a particular communication is both predeceased and deliberative the defendant office of Management and budget directed to deliver copies of the documents that have been withheld pursuant to exemption five two chambers for in Camera Inspection Honor before May Twentieth Twenty Twenty. Now if you remember these emails were between Duffy and Blair. Duffy was installed as taking over this job for his subordinate mark. Sandy who was a lifer not not a political appointee mark. Zandi did testify during the impeachment and e mails. We have seen as I said. Indicate the between Duffy and Blair Malvinas chief-of-staff would indicate if it was trump that ordered to hold on the aid to Ukraine. And even though the DEM's called for Mulvaney Duffy and Blair to testify. None of them showed up under orders from the president will now judge. Jackson is going to review these emails and see if they fall under executive privilege or Presidential Communications Privilege. And as we know. There's something called the crime fraud exception. Which says you can't invoke privilege attorney client privilege. Presence communicate any kind of privilege if it covers up crime. The crime here would be ordering the office management and budget budget to withhold aid to Ukraine violating the impoundment control act which the GPO found he already or whoever ordered it violated if they can tie trump to it. That's not covered by privilege. And it's judging Berman Jackson. That's going to make that determination as a lot. Like Reggie Walton not trusting the reductions bar to the Muller reports so he ordered them to hand that Shit over by March Thirtieth. He could review the reductions for appropriateness. Doj complied with his order. They handed it over on March thirtieth and he's reviewing that report unredacted. Mullah report and he's got a hearing scheduled for June eighteenth. I assume since the DOJ complied with that order from Walton the O. M. B. will likely comply with this order from Judge Jackson's who put some beans on it. I think the NBA will hand these emails over by May twentieth unless the Department of Justice tries to file. I don't know some way to stop it. To order. And Senator Richard Burr stepping down Senate Intel Chair amidst the FBI investigation into insider trading day. But not so fast. We learned yesterday. The FBI confiscated his phone under a search warrant pursuant to him selling off shitload stock after receiving a confidential corona virus briefing from the intelligence community in January. And it wasn't just him his brother his brother in law sold a bunch of shit to burst says he's not going to resign from the Senate and he's totally innocent but he stepped down as the chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee because of the possible conflict of interest. Or would be a distraction or something so we know Burr has angered trump allies and trump. He was involved in helping issue subpoena. For Don Jr. Back in the day he's the one who has been releasing all these reports backing up. The intelligence community assessment of two thousand seventeen in January saying Russia helped trump win the presidency and interfered in our elections. And when Manu Raju asked if this was if he thought he was being retaliated against if this investigation was retaliation for his work on the Intel Committee he would not comment. We should watch who replaced with at head of the Intelligence Community Air Committee. It could be Tom Cotton. He's on the Intel Committee. He's a trump lackey. But you don't even have to be on the Intel Committee to be put in there as we know that Jim Jordan made that shuffle back during the impeachment could be Marsha Blackburn. Could Be Cornyn. He is on. The Intelligence Committee. Could be Ted Cruz. Could BE CRAPPO. Crepeau I come CRAPPO and what will become of the sissies report that is due out? That's the Senate Committee Intel Committees report that is due out on Russian counter-intelligence. We've been waiting on this as a nine hundred and fifty page report. It was in the editing stages. It was done. Is that GONNA come out or is that going to end up in purgatory? I don't know I don't know if I'm on board yet with the concept at this is targeted. A lot of people are saying Kelly Law for hasn't been you know they. They haven't executed a search warrant on her. 'cause she's a trump ally. They're only going after burr because he's the one who could release this report. Laughlin has refused to say whether the FBI has contacted her. So we don't know Dianne Feinstein says she was contacted by the FBI. So it seems. They're all being investigated and it wasn't until we learned that Burs brother-in-law also sold stock before the crash I don't think trump I don't think any of US thinks burger isn't a criminal It's just unfortunate. That trump hires only criminals so we can expose them if they go against him. That is why trump hires criminals it's very moby and from Josh Gerstein Politico the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals is allowing emoluments case against trump to go forward the Richmond based Fourth Circuit. Court of Appeals voted nine to six to reject trump bid to shut down the lawsuit the governments of Maryland and the District of Columbia have brought alleging violations of the constitution emoluments causes. I assumed trump will ask for a stay to Block discovery in this case while he appeals to the Supreme Court again. I mean at what point as a trump supporter. Do you have to look yourself in the mirror or don't if you if you can't but at what point do you say to yourself look at this multitude of Shit? Trump tries to block and say to yourself. Maybe he's the asshole maybe he's the asshole it's a fucking call all I. How many times do you have to get punched before you're realizing you're getting your ass kicked? I wish I could help you know I'm trying. How many how? Many Supreme Court cases are how many appeals? How many stays? How many times does he blocking testimony documents releases of thing as tax returns Finances House Ways and Means Committee Tax Returns Molar Report Muller Grand Jury Materials. It's clearly because he's innocent that he's blocking all these things and from the New York Times former. Fbi OFFICIAL BILL PRIEST UP is casting doubt on the justice. Department's case for dropping a criminal charges against president trump's former national security adviser. Michael Flynn during an interview with investigators last week and this is according to people familiar with the investigation. And this is a bombshell on. It's flown under the radar. I'm not sure why. But the Department of Justice Interviewed Priest. Step two days before filing their bullshit motion to dismiss the flint charge and they did not mention it and they did not tell Sullivan about Mister Priest. Apps interview a couple of days before their motion was filed Justice Department official said that they were in the. We were in the process of writing up a report on the interview we would. We would filed it. We would have. We wanted to get that motion to dismiss in their first before we gave you that little piece of Brady Information Brady Information exculpatory. Of course he is the accused so I don't know if that counts as a sculptor information. But it's certainly less than honest. Yeah everyone we talked to that. Said that Our our our assertions were bullshit. We'll write that report up later but for now everyone who agrees with us. Here's what they say. And please dismiss the department's motion referred to the notes that Mister Priest step wrote around the bureau's 2017 questioning of Mr Flynn Flynn's new insane lawyers said Mister Priest APPs note suggested the FBI was trying to entrap. Mr Flynn and frame him and that Bill Bar said the investigators were trying to lay a perjury trap psych. When I go to go to the grocery store I mean shoplifting trap love that joke was that Scott Anyway. Somebody on twitter said. That wasn't me Mister. Priest APP told the prosecutors reviewing the case that their interpretation was wrong. Their interpretation of his notes was wrong. He said this is from the interview two days before they filed the motion to dismiss he said the FBI officials were trying to do the right thing in questioning. Mr Flynn and they knew of no effort. To set them up me. Reports about his notes misconstrued them according to priest up. This is a lot like Mary. Mcchord coming forward with her up in the New York. Times saying the Department of Justice mischaracterized her notes about the Flint Interviews. Back in two thousand seventeen and everything to. Department of Justice conveniently leaving out the priest APP interview from a couple of days. Ago Isn't going to Piss off Judge Sullivan. You are sadly mistaken. Flynn's crackpot lawyer. Keep SAYING BRADY. Information exculpatory information. That Muller's team failed to hand over. Because they're all corrupt and it's a deep state and Blah Blah playing trying to play on Sullivan's long record of he's really all about Brady Information and getting skull information forward and here we have the Department of Justice leaving out information that goes totally against their argument. That Flynn's lies were immaterial. Which is the crux. Why they want this to be dismissed. So Watch for Sullivan to be really pissed about this. And as we know bill bar tasked the top federal prosecutor in Saint Louis Jeff Jensen earlier this year to scrub the Flynn case for any mistakes and Mr kristaps notes were among the documents. Mr Johnson found the prosecutors already on the case Mr Jensen's team and the FBI all disagreed about whether they were sculpt Tori and should be given to Mr Flynn's lawyer Sydney Pal. Mister Johnson prevailed and gave them to Miss Powell who declared they were they would exonerate her. Client people familiar with the events Are who have told The New York Times this so bar decided priest APPs notes from two thousand seventeen we're exculpatory for Flynn but left out. Mister Priest APPS recent interview got it Mr Johnson and officials. Tim Shays Office pushed to give. Mr Flynn's lawyers copies of the twenty seventeen notes and other documents they had recently found and Mr Van Grech and Dana Ben to the FBI. General Counsel argued against it so watch for Ben Tan to possibly be called into court to answer questions about this and definitely expect Sydney Pailin Tim Shea to be called to the carpet to ask why they left out. Pri steps recent interview in their motion to dismiss and other Flynn News. We have another amicus. Curiae ordered today. I think I brought this up at the top of the show and that's Covington burling so next. I think it's to be back. Maybe Dana Bent. It could be asking for the all the underlying evidence as judge. Gleeson has said and OP. Ed and I'm GonNa talk about that with in the interview with me Rocca next so everybody stick around. You don't WanNa miss this interview. Hey everybody it's ag in this helping daily beans brought to you by beach body on demand. We are all stuck at home and it's easy to become sedentary. I've been eating a lot of carbs planet on the couch but we need to keep moving and nothing makes that easier than beach body on demand you can work out and take classes in the comfort of your own home and it's the Beach Party Independent. Eu streaming service. It gives you instant access to over. Thirteen hundred super effective fun easy workouts. Some of them are really hard. But you know the time goes by pretty quick and they're suited for anybody at any time wide range of stuff. They have is incredible. It's the best dreaming workout platform. They're the ones behind p ninety x and insanity you can check out some of their newest programs like morning meltdown. One hundred and eighty of session. 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All the workouts attrition information all the support totally free again just text daily beans all one word thirty thirty thirty alright. Everybody welcome back joining me. Today is former federal prosecutor from the Southern District of New York law professor. Msnbc legal analyst and candidate for District Attorney for Westchester County. New York. Mimi Roca Mimi. Thanks for speaking with me today. Thanks they did so good to be back with you. It's been a long time. We've we had a little bit of a hiatus doing all all this stuff that we're trying to accomplish right now but I'm really really glad to speak to you again and I'm glad to be here. There's certainly a lot to discuss right now. And the Legal Front yes and I want you just give you a heads. Up are pretty well caught up on what's going on with. Flynn all the way up to the minute. Order asking for amicus Curie but I wanted to speak with you today about first of all. Here's a brief time line with this order. So the Department of Justice we know filed a week. Saas motion to dismiss the case against the case against Flynn and then may eleventh retired. Judge John Gleeson. I believe it's a John. Penned up ed he penned an op Ed in Washington posting evidentiary hearings and amicus curiae worded. In this case since neither side was opposing the motion to dismiss like. It's now it's it's bar versus. Flynn and their friends. You know Eh But then Judge Sullivan issued a minute order asking for amicus briefs and then yesterday he issued an order that Judge Gleeson retired judge. Gleeson would be assisting the court under amicus curiae meaning. He's got you know things that he can. Information could provide the court that the parties boot. Representatives aren't providing And he won't. He's GonNa assist in weighing the motion for the depart from the Department of Justice. So first of all I put out a tweet. Their new. You had responded and that's why I wanted to talk to any. Have you ever seen anything like this? Have you ever seen anything like this? Yeah no and I jumped right in there because to me. The answer seems so Kind of obvious but also important which is no I have not. I mean doesn't mean it's never ever happen but in in my experience sixteen years Federal Prosecutor And watcher you know for the past couple of years very closely you know I. It is unusual to see a judge in a criminal proceeding invite amicus briefs And even more unusual I think to sort of say That they're appointing one one person in particular to do that. But we've never seen anything like what has happened here with Bill Bar and the Department of Justice dismissing a perfectly legitimate and even important criminal prosecution after the person's guilty twice so You know it is it is. The answer is haven't really seen anything like this but have never seen anything like this attorney general. I think what the judge is doing is recognizing that the interest of the Department of Justice as an independent institution with a political motivations is not being represented by bill bar. And and so you know you Brady and People for you invite amicus briefs You you allow amicus briefs when friends of the court to Ruppert when when all the interests are not being represented and and you know I. I know that the Trumpian will disagree with this. But any objective observer. Who's watching bar over? The past couple of years cannot say that he is representing the interests of the Department of Justice he is representing the interests of Donald Trump And at NAT is not what his job is supposed to be. And I think this is the first time this you know where someone in power mainly a judge has said. You know what? There's something I can do about that. Yeah and you know. I think you're exactly right. An unprecedented motion to dismiss calls for an unprecedented reaction Right and so and just I guess I would say one other thing while I think what the judges on here is. Highly unusual to there are similar procedures in other cases that are now against so. It's not like he just made this up. I mean we have amicus briefs in as you know well in you know. Supreme Court case says dealing with all sorts of issues. I mean it. It's not foreign to It's not unusual to have these kinds of briefs Filed is just somewhat unusual in individual criminal cases. But not but not where there are bigger legal principles at stake. Which I think is really. What's going on here? This isn't just about Flynn anymore. It's about the principle of an independent department of Justice making lawless decisions. Yeah and the beauty of it is. We have seen like you said in the past few years we've seen the Department of Justice under bill bar weigh in with amicus briefs in Supreme Court cases on multiple occasions. And so it's not an argument. It's it's nothing that bill can stop and we'll get into that in in a second but I wanted you to tell us who is judge Gleeson because I feel like our listeners have a little bit of an indication they know some of the cases he's prosecuted some of the people he's brought down In his in or you know presided over and say brought down in his years as a as a judge who can you just who gives us a picture of who is yes. So Judge Gleeson was a federal judge For many years I actually Clerked for him meaning. I was one of his law clerks back in one thousand nine hundred ninety seven right when I was fresh out of school and he had been on the bench. I think for two years or so so it was a very young judge. He was a in Brooklyn. I'm United States Eastern District Court for the Eastern District of New York He had been a federal prosecutor for many years before that in the Eastern District Us Attorney's office and You know did kinda cases federal prosecutors like like him like me do But his sort of claim to fame. I think the the thing that he's most well known for is that he successfully prosecuted John Gotti senior Who was known as the top line dawn because he so many times had been prosecuted and was not convicted but then a judge Gleeson in a very well tried case Was able to successfully prosecute him in and and that one man crime spree With the Gambino family And so he after that I think he was acting. Us Attorney for a little bit of time but then he was appointed I believe by President Clinton to be a federal judge. She was pretty young for his. You know to to be appointed a federal judge. And I will tell you though both from my experience you know working with him for a year which means I was with him every single day. Every minute of the day you know in court outside of court eating lunch with him talking with him and he has remained a friend and a mentor. Onto this day. He is one of the most brilliant people not just lawyers but but also a brilliant lawyer that I know I mean truly has a brilliant mind. is Really not sort of a cookie cutter person in other words I. It's hard to fit him into one mold or another so he was a prosecutor for many years I think came to the bench without experience but pretty quickly. As a federal judge became very defense oriented and actually became very involved with The Criminal Defense Organizations Federal Defenders in particular and really kind of before criminal justice reform was sort of popular thing. GonNa term people you know talked about in the way that they do. Now he he was really at the forefront of that and and Really tried to help reform sentencing federal sentencing guidelines which he thought were too high he really was a judge who looked out for Sort of the most vulnerable people in the criminal justice system and and tried to work on early reforms to thought our laws and sentences were too harsh into high at the federal level amongst others. So he's kind of a really independent thinker. He doesn't fit neatly sort of one box or the other. I think he really knows the Department of Justice inside and out and knows what it is supposed to be at its best But also knows the dangers of it and and overreach and how that can work and has not been afraid to stand up to that even in the in the past as as A judge and now he's a practicing I would call a white collar criminal defense lawyer at a firm in New York. He did step down From the Bronx recently But he's he's a well known voice in terms of Speaking out for what? He believes When he was a judge he did several Political redistricting cases that that made a lot of headlines He's just a very kind of smart and independent banker. Who Does what I think he thinks is right. Whatever box it fits into or doesn't fit into and so I think that's part of. Why is the perfect choice with us? Yeah teams like his experience. advocating for the every man I it seems to be relevant in in his OP. Ed glazes op ED. That came out before Sullivan asked him to to join the case he was urging Sullivan. Seemed to to you. Know really think twice. About just dismissing this case and talked about having evidentiary hearings perhaps listening questioning calling into question you know bringing in the guys from Covington which Flynn's original lawyers re possibly bringing in former prosecutors who worked on the case who have since left like Kravis I would assume So or was it van. It was Kravis was van. Van was yeah but who but he still works for Department of Justice. As far as I know van crack does so I think and this is what I I was personally hoping for. When when you Flynn filed a motion to dismiss. We were all sitting around. You know me and Glenn Kirschner and we were just sitting around. Gosh I hope he has evidentiary hearings. I hope he just doesn't dismiss this case. And so now I think we're we kind of see what where gleason stands what his background is in. I think we can sort of see where this is going. And it's is it fair to say that the Justice Department and trump can't do anything about this. This isn't something they can ask for a stay for or oppose or file a I mean they can file a motion to I. Guess disagree with it. Yeah and and I think if I'm keeping up on this fast moving news. I think that he has. I think Flynn has filed something saying basically. You can't do this You can't you can't invite Amicus briefs in A criminal case You know that's that's not going to go very far. We'll know and it. It explains why Sullivan put in his minute order. I was like why is he? Putting case citing case law about amicus in his minute order. Oh it's because he knows we know he say hey I have sole discretion mo froze and so come at me. It's not a free for all though quoting Judge Jerk Jesse Jackson. I'm like what is he getting out. What is he getting at now? We know yeah yeah exactly. He's he's I mean this judge don't solve it is it's very smart and very independent himself you know and And which is not unusual. I mean federal churches. A lot of them are and they don't like being told what they can and can't do. They have a lot of discussion for a reason and how to run their cases in their courtroom. And I think here You know I I. Don't I mean I know Fox News is going to be screaming about how the judge should be shouldn't do this. But I. I don't know what basis they have to say that And if you look at the history of federal judges having discretion in sentencing in motion practice I mean the dots their job And of course he shouldn't just rubber stamp this so I'll be halls Rod Rosenstein. Frankly I mean yes you could call from other people but you know I mean Rosenstein was the member of this administration that signed off on this prosecution. I know he wasn't there at the beginning but he absolutely approved it and he's completely I'm at now. You know as as they say that this was all a big political conspiracy by quote the Obama Administration. Yeah and IT'S GONNA BE INTERESTING TOO. Because by now normally we would have heard trump tweeting Oh biased Obama. Judge Blah Blah Blah. But here a judge Sullivan was by H W and so yes. Exactly and so. But I don't know that necessarily has stopped trump from going after people before and calling him biased so I I'm assuming that we're going to start getting some misinformation and propaganda about gleason and Sullivan being biased judges and badges. I'm assuming we'll start seeing that sort of thing come to light. I'm surprised it hasn't already happened. We'll tell us before I let you go. Tell us a little bit about your campaign where people can find you where people can donate to you. I don't work for the government anymore so I don't have to go down the Hatch Act. I can ask for donations for your campaign Thank you thanks for asking. Yeah so I'm running for Westchester District. Attorney. Westchester is Right outside of New York City So important and big District Attorney's office that has cases that can affect you know even far beyond Westchester County and My campaign is going really well. I'm running on a prop warm Bringing ethics reform and integrity to the. Da's office something that. I think your listeners will appreciate wherever they are and You know really the need for building institutions at the local level That are counterweights to what's going on in Washington and to the trump administration and particularly when it comes to the Criminal Dotson system keeping the politics out of our justice system. That's something I've really been talking about in. The people really respond to and also pursuing public corruption cases conviction integrity. Making sure that we are not prosecuting. The wrong people and that we are having not having wrongful convictions and I have platforms about bad about human trafficking. That's a big priority for me gun safety and all this people can find on my website. All of my issue papers. I'm kind of listed out. It's Niimi Roca. Rotc eight H Four F. O. R. D. A. DOT COM. You Need Roca. Four D. DA DOT COM and You know hopefully people can look me up and happy to have people help. Make a do foam. Baking can do that anywhere in the country and make donations And you've got on our mailing list. We do weekly updates our interview. People on zoom about important issues. So Yeah that's that's pretty much a summary but I hope you check it out. Thank you thank you so much because these these are the steps. These are the crucial steps. That we're going to need to start taking to rebuild Integrity in in our institution equal justice under the law ethical guidelines. Giving some teeth to these things and moving forward to put back. What trump is taken away in being able to trust our our legal system? So thank you so much for joining me today. Your list of of of credits too. Long but law professor. Msnbc legal analyst former prosecutor from Southern District of New York and candidate for Westchester Da. Thank you so much mediocre. I appreciate you coming on today. They great to talk to you. Ate The alright. Everybody stick around right after this quick break. We're going to have the good news block and Quarantine Confessions. You don't WanNa miss it so stay with us? Everybody that's AG. This segment of the daily beans is brought to you by the Zebra Dot Com in these crazy quarantine times. We're all trying to save money and we're all driving a lot. Less but Americans are still overpaying on car insurance by about twenty twenty one billion dollars per year. That's bananas oftentimes searching for a better deal can take hours and usually results in having to deal with pressure sales Weirdos and a barrage of unwanted spam calls but not anymore thanks to the Zebra Dot Com. They make comparing prices and rates safer and easier. You can save up to six hundred seventy dollars a year using the zebra dot com. It's the nation's leading car insurance comparison site. 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We're all driving a lot less than we should reassess our car insurance anyway so why not check out the Zebra Dot Com? How much can you save on car and Home Insurance Home Insurance go today and start saving? It does Uber Dot com slash daily beans. That's the zebra dot com slash daily beans spelled H. E. Z. E. R. dot com slash. All right everybody happy Friday. It's time for the good news is off and joining me today for the good news. Segment is your friend and Mine Mandy Ridi. Hello how're you Mandy? Mung Manny Mung Bean. It's so funny. How many people still call Me Mandy? Dmz where like? Hey Andy Reid. I know everyone's like as say hi to Mandy. Reformulate Ya 'cause I messed it up one time now. You have to suffer forever and then one of our listeners. Eleven year olds did a little piece of digital art for us where it's our real heads photo shopped on different kinds of beans and Garbanzo. And and your Mandy Mung Bean. That's so funny. It's really funny. I feel like if I was like a children's show host and some sort of beans themed kid show. I don't know why my brain went in that direction. Then nine my name would be mandy among it is really kind of look like the kind of look like a little teletubby with their head stuck on this big round. Green Bean. You look like Green Momma until it. You know those guys. It's not a quarantine confession but just a general confession that I watch teletubbies until I was too old to be watching teletubbies. Okay but yes. Uh-huh bean picture is very funny. It was really good I do have. Let's see I do have route before we get going. I have a little bit of Schadenfreude all right so on Tuesday trump appointed Iowa trump appointed federal judge threatened to dismiss Devon Nunez's defamation lawsuit against hearst magazines the publisher of Esquire and journalist Ryan Lissa trump appointed. Us District Judge Cj Williams and. He said he'll throw out the lawsuit if the family doesn't specifically in precisely say how. This article in Esquire magazine. Inaccurately portrayed the congressman and his family. The lawsuit lawsuit involves the September thirtieth escort. Article called Devin. Nunez's family farm is hiding a politically explosive secret. And the article said Nunez's parents and their brother covered their tracks after quietly. Moving the family's dairy farm from California to Iowa Sh we don't want you to California farmers suggesting the family had tried to hide the farm's relocation the article also alleged that the farm had used undocumented laborers collectively. The Nunez family filed two lawsuits. Twenty five million and seventy seven million and they were combined into one lawsuit at at the end of April. But while the Nunez family suits cited sixteen statements that it alleged were defamatory. They didn't provide any facts or evidence. In order for something to be defamatory it has to be ally let the judge was like. Where's the lie? Bro You need to prove this is a lie. You who all moved your Farm California to Iowa and didn't tell anybody and hired undocumented workers God golic anyway. That's just brought me a little bit of joy. I thought I'd share that with all y'all because I feel like it might have moved you as well. You know what brought me join today was because I know I should admit this because I work on the show. I listened to the show most of the time but not every day and some days. I miss it but today when I was listening I listen to your full rant on Thursdays. Beams and then the interview with frank and I was like Yes yes. I'm so mad. I'm right there with you. You know I think which one you're Yesterday when you were when you when you had like a really good rant and then also you had the interview with Frank. It was prime angry. Ag and I was like Yes sitting in my office listening to being like. Yes yes bitch. Yes that is so interesting you brought that up because at the beginning of the show today. I mentioned in the discussion area of the show that I got such a huge response from my some people said rant. I call it a B. Block yesterday saying God I love angry. Ag or passionate ag or whatever and then followed up by the Frankfurt Caluzzi Feisty Flus floozy and then bring it home with the good news. It was like the perfect Combo. And you know I don't think it's fair to call your passion monologues angry because they don't think it's good to equate women's passion with anger so maybe not anger. Probably my fault. Passionate guy was the one who said that. That was a really great with frank though. We got a lot of really really great feedback on that. So so yeah thank you everyone for tweeting out us and thanks for coming on it was it was a it was a really great interview. Yeah and wait until you hear. Today's Mandy we got Mimi Roca on today to talk about Judge Gleeson being brought onto the Flynn case and who he is and what he's done in the past so we look forward to that but we are here to talk about good news we are at. I have some. What do you got a couple of things I just wanted to say? Thanks everyone for studying them in. If yours doesn't get beecher please. Don't try to take to personally am we're trying to keep them timely but also get as many good ones in as we can and I think I have sixty So that being said let's jump in this one is from an. I hope I'm saying your name right Francie. Franz he says I went to starbucks this morning for only the third time since March fifteenth that is. That's that's very strict view. Well well-done I splurged and got lachey and several baked goods when I got to the window. The car in front of me had paid for my order. Aw That's nice. I like when they do that. I knew Meteo but during this time it really just hit me in the fields. Luckily by the time I order was ready and other order was taken and I paid for that and I hope it continued for the rest of the day. That's nice pay it forward. What a cool thing. Because you're you're going through. You're getting coffee and you're given a money right but you're also at the same time paying it forward. I think that that's just absolutely wonderful. Only one person gets stiffed at the end of the day. Although imagine if that the person in front of you was like yeah I'll pay for your order that's nice. I'll pay it forward for the person behind. You get like a fifty dollar order and you're like Oh shit I'll pay for one of those appear for one of their coffees. Yeah all right. This one's term. Diane Diane says Good News Year Quarantine. Confessions of the other day on the episode. Shit show Lullaby had me laughing so hard red bull came spewing out of my nose and all over my computer when Jordan mentioned how funny it looks when dudes cover up their junk. Oh my God. Division Guy was. Some guy was out the he missed the recycling truck and so his wife was like honey the recycling and he's naked any jumps up and he grabs a tiny towel that has dogged bones on it and covers his dick and he's outside trying to drag drag. The can down the street after after the truck and he's trying to cover up his junk and it was just a really one of the best visuals. We've had really good. I have to admit that I've gone down and check the mail in like in like a state like I hear. I hear the mailman dropping off package and I go downstairs and like what can barely be classified as shorts to be honest and you know like no bra like tits flying everywhere as I run down the stairs. My neighbors are like who is this bitch. Put on a robe or something. But I don't care anyway. Nowhere should you. They have. They have allowed children. So you can have floppy tits true true floppy tits fly free. God damnit this country for trade just be like I'm an ex PAT. I'm earned it. Yeah exactly listen. This country doesn't have a lot of things but I can be free to anyway. Moving on Mr Frisk. This is for Ms Chris. Thank you Diane for that. One by the way and that was great. I hope your computer is okay for Miss Frisk. I have been suffering from gallstones just like our friend the notorious RPG but for the last over the last two months today. I got the notice that is scheduled. Operation is happening soon. The bladder will be long gone. Hooray Yeah it's tough to get elective surgeries right now. But that's a painful one so really glad that. That's I'm really glad that's taken that that's going to happen. I've never had a gallstone before but it sounds Shite so I'm happy for you all right cool from zero. My husband has a small guitar pedal business. I've always been on his case about how long it takes them to get orders shipped out. But since I've been at home these past few weeks I've started helping him out in the workshop. He's taught me how to soldier and I am now building pedals with him and damn. It's not easy now that I have a better understanding of his world. Now I have a better understanding of his world and I wouldn't have had the opportunity to get to know my husband more if it wasn't for Washington state. Stay home order so although these times are incredibly stressful for all of us I actually. I'm thankful for this time at home. Plus now we get to listen to the daily beans together every day we work. Thank you ladies for helping us through this. That's Nice Awesome Rad. Let us know if you're on twitter or a citizen email. Let us know what your what. Your husband's guitar pedal businesses. That's cool all right one last bit of good news but I think this is also a quarantine confession a little bit. But I'll let you guys decide. This is from Natalie. She says We purchased an older home a few years ago and are slowly but surely working on updates on the house. I love that I know that sounds like such a fun project. You know just like buying something good bones and then just like chipping away at it to make it your own. Bring it back to life leveled houses and very very east coast like that all right. The next big ticket project in the house will be to replace the sighting on an edition which contains my where. I've been working for a year now. The current citing is some old wood panel with lots of holes and opportunity for non human habitation. Which has been annoying to us. But not right now as I was sitting on my computer day in day out. During lockdown the constant tweeting of a family of birds nesting inches. Away from me in that wall is keeping my spirit's stuff. Nothing like this out of happy baby birds to keep you going so. I'm glad that you've made peace with the birds who live in your wall better better than not better than not survive this win. Our editor Mackenzie found a kitten living inside of her wall and she adopted it. Actually I wonder how that can do. And we need to check on that CAT O. The cat is great. They're best friends dude. She like she just goes everywhere with her on a little leash and everything. She goes to the beach. She goes on road trips. She's like a dog basically. But in a cat's body they are best friends so so. I'll have to tweet a picture. Mckenzie's cat to the daily beans pod twitter but she found it in her wall and live texted us as it was happening. That was cute. All right that has been good news. It's now time for quarantine. Confessions Kickoff the confessions here. This is from anonymous Anonymous says I'm one of six sisters brothers. One bathroom yes. It was crazy on my God. I feel you. I have many sisters also and had the same experience. Recently one of them moved into a newly built home after retiring from one of the intelligence agencies with her husband a West Point graduate and Vietnam veteran with COPD so my husband and I along with two other sisters technically violated. Virginia stay at home order and travel done to North Carolina and in about thirty six hours. We packed every box for them. Arranged their furniture organized their doors and closets painted a turntable pictures and and set up to she vs. We also broke down the boxes and under the cover of darkness. Toss them into a dumpster of a nearby construction site. I feel equally guilty and proud. My sister would have taken months to get settled in and would have gone completely bonkers with the amount of chaos but we wanted to help her out to be more comfortable during lockdown. We slipped back into town with only one guest stop. We've all been quarantined before. And after this and hope to have a close loop in order to protect the vulnerable whatever the penance is I will do it. That's that's that's really nice. That's that's something that you did to help out your sister who otherwise would have had like a miserable time. Being stuck in a chaotic house during lockdown so agreed agreed. Yeah that's Nice This is from metal girl in North Carolina. Good News I've been working from home since March thirteenth. I have not used a hairdryer since March ninth. Same I also have not made my toenails since taking off the politics of Polish. If weeks into lockdown my main confession is secretly trying to turn my whole family individuals and begins without getting permission from my family. Since I am the only one who goes to the grocery store so far all is going well. Good good job. Getting a lot of confessions from people who are like I'm only when he goes to the grocery store so I just lie. All right cool. This from Melissa Melissa says my parents and I were supposed to be on a Mexican beach vacation in the middle of May. The trip was postponed for obvious reasons. What whatever reasons so instead of getting slathered in Sunshine and Suntan Lotion? My Dad decided that we my parents and I by the way I'm staying with them should travel the world through various movies so far we have been to Paris bruised Vienna Budapest Greece. Tuscany England Rome and then back to Tuscany this week. We plan to go. Isn't it? This week we plan to go to Africa through three movies the English Patient Casablanca and out of Africa on the English patient I haven't seen that remember win. That won the Academy Award. I think it'd be the color purple and everyone freaked out. I'm going to check on that to me. Wards go ahead onto the next one while I look this fact up all right cool all right this winter anonymous and they say in the confession segment the other day. We heard about a family who plays fetch with their toddler. We don't play fetch but we did recently buy a laser pointer for our to foster kittens which we took on at the beginning of quarantine and our five year old. Human Child has been demanding that he returned to chase the red dot. He also climbs the shorter cat tree when we aren't looking and he wants eight a kibble before we could stop him and declared a delicious. This is a kid who refuses most people food unless it's chicken nuggets fish sticks. Were pretty sure he's actually part cat. What's the verdict on the English patient? I was wrong The English patient came after who won best picture in nineteen ninety five. Sorry I'm such a such a trivia person. I like what was it? Oh we should totally have a trivia themed happy hour sometime or we should host a trivia thing in the future. That sounds fun. Ooh I like that. That's a really good idea. Yeah political obviously and maybe some gen-x movies. It was Amadeus I. It was Amadeus. I haven't seen that either. I didn't to watch so many movies. All right. This is We have a couple more here. This is from Danielle. Danielle says the confessions. I fill them so much but I think I'm the opposite of the Non Mommy listeners. I actually really lose myself. My kid play. We have the best fantasy play the other day. My two babies their age. Ten and six setup. Pop-up showers in the driveway with convenience items and snacks. The currency was spearmint leaves. We had growing in the garden which they just eight one handed to them or rocks for the larger bills. Like five dollars ten dollars and while I'm outside working most days they play along and I was able to buy some refreshing water soda and snacks right in my driveway shop. Of course all this play means I'm lacking mealtimes and clothing choices. Like pajamas are outside pajamas. Outside okay now and the meals have sort of become healthy. Free range snack items. They can get themselves so traditional breakfast. Lunch and dinner has basically got out the window and at the end of the day when my youngest says things like I didn't have lunch. I have to explain that all together. The food he ate during the day made up lunch but still those words. I didn't get lunch a reminder that I'm not really in a routine that I've been desperately trying to attain. I'm jealous of all. You organized parents out there. Who INSTRUCTS HITS? They get shit done while. I'm over here spitting my tires because gestures the world anyways. Thank you ladies for your tireless work on getting us our beans. It's so helpful when I can't or refuse to chase down real news because it's exhausting. Our News is real. This is real. This is real news real news. I'm real real real news. Growing up news lady cool on me and I. I didn't put on a suit. I'm wearing Jimmy. I actually watched my face today. Put under yoder and a Bra. Because I was just. I looked in the mirror this morning every couple of days. I get sick of myself and I'm like get it together. Put on some clothes. I wear clothes for day or two and then I go back to wearing pajamas for a run. I went for a run this morning because I was like. I got up on him like you. GotTa you gotTa fucking run today. You have to you have to and then maybe. I'll take a shower. We'll see how it goes but I want to stop drying my hair too. I have that kind of hair. That's really like sort of thin and and so it only takes two minutes to dry so convenient so I don't walk around with a wet head I just dry it real fast because it takes but I'm like I bet. I Bet I could get real healthy if I stop. Blow drying it. I don't have to make any appearances anywhere. Except for our Friday. Quarantine happy hour meet and greet at four. Pm Pacific Time. Which is today if you're listening on Friday morning and it's at four PM today if you're listening on Friday the fifteenth and the theme Nineteen Eighties. And if you're not a patron become one and if you can't afford it findings on twitter and we will share the link with you awesome. I'm excited Yeah Michio. It's Super Fun every week. People seem to get a lot out of them so yeah. Thank you for joining us for them. Yeah and we're doing a thing from now on. We're making it so the first hours for patrons only but for for those of us who can't afford to be premium subscribers even at three bucks a month which is totally understandable. There's a lot of shitty times right now. A lot of terrible things going on we will tweet out for the second hour of the of the meet and greet to the public so that everyone can join in and that would be a five. Pm Pacific Time. Sweep love that also. I'm doing something similar to you where I'm just like letting my hair go crazy like I'm in desperate need of a cut and color. It's so wild but I'm basically just like deep conditioning and letting it airdropped until this until salons are open and I don't know we'll see if like a last that long but I'm just experimenting with getting it really healthy because no one has to look at it. Yeah that's sort of what I'm saying like. Oh I might as well not blow dry this shit if it's bad when I don't blow dry it's not even like a cool like super curly mass. It's just dumb. It's just you know like if I don't blow dry my hair. It's just SORTA HALF CURLY. Half FLAT. Frizzy weird like I get these weird cow licks and I. It's just it's it's it brings me back to what it was like in seventh grade. You know I actually like had healthy hair when I was younger. And now it's fried to shit so can't relate. It's my hair is awful. Now was Cuban. Okay shall we do? Let's do one more one more quarantine confession. You're going to like this one. It's to do with one of our advertisers clearly. We pick good advertisers. Not Anonymous says my husband healthcare workers. I'm critical care pharmacist. And he is a retail. Pharmacist You guys for working on frontlines so thankfully we're both still working but between working in managing home life with her two teenage sons. The dog and the cat. I'm feeling more stress than ever these days. So here is my confession. I am on level nine hundred and fourteen of best means. Oh my gosh. Wow I'm on like one seventy or something yeah. I shudder to think of how much time I have spent on that but my sanity is intact as far as I can tell so. That's good right. Thank you for making me laugh. I walked the dog. You ladies are fabulous and I love you nine hundred fourteen holy Shit. You know what that's with animal crossing so same. Same though totally. I have so many little projects that I need to get done. You know we may have to have. Maybe you enjoy all need to put out a bonus episode for patrons where you just talk about animal crossing. That might be fun. I thought I've thought about that that that could be a lot of fun talking about your villagers. Who who you like. Who you don't like and you know you're you're all of your favorite things about the game We've actually had a few people a few patrons who've been like I got the game because of you so and people who've shared a few of their favorite games with me that I'm going to check out. So thank you for doing that. And then you guys were submitting all of your quarantine. Confessions KEEP SUBMITTING THEM I. It's the pin tweet on the daily beans pod twitter and also updating all of our instant replies on on the Muller wrote facebook the daily beans facebook and the emails and stuff so that you should get if you ever email us trying to make good news. You should get a reply with linked to that form just to keep it streamlined. I'm trying to put it all in one place because in your faces. Yeah exactly. It's it's we have gotten such an overwhelming response for quarantine confessions. It started out as this Little Fun Cup. We got a couple of things at the end of the good news block and its own monster now and I absolutely love it. It's my favorite monster absolutely. And honestly we're getting probably like seventy percent confessions and only thirty percent good news so I would also which stands to reason given the current times we're in But I would really love also If people would send in good news that's related to political stuff if you think there's any good news stories where you are that you think we've missed or if there's anything you doesn't have to be related to you know. Corona by specifically just anything. You think that is good news. I love more of that as well. And Yeah if you're looking for the submission form for the good news and The confessions and you can't find it. Just let us know and we'll send it to you yet all right any final thoughts before we before. We are bail. Just if I if you are a patron or or even if you're not a patron anyone catch the second half. I look forward to seeing those of you who are available at four. Pm Today for happy. Hour I'm excited. I'm so excited I had. We've had some of our patrons say that they cast us up to their big screen. Tv's and it's like we're all hanging out in the in the room. What am I going to do for nineteen eighties theme you address as Baby? Because that's what you were. No you were born in the ninety s. I was conceived in the eighties dressed as a sperm. I always say that well because I was born in January of nineteen ninety so just at the start of the nineties but so I was. I was cooking. I was in the during the eighties. I experienced it on the inside and also nothing stopping you from dressing from the eighteen eighties. Just saying just throwing that out there. Yeah you know what? That's well you just throw in a whole other angle to this. Now you could do seventeen eighty s and have to consider that you could do twenty one eighty in a star trek uniform. It's just the eighties. I could try to find like a farmer farmer address and put my dog and a cow costume and be like a farmer from the eighteen eighties. I don't know we'll figure it out you could or you could be Victorian where a powdered wig. I could be Beethoven in the background. I might put on. Maybe it'll go for. Maybe I'll go for like for like an eighties club kid by they'll see what I can russell up in my burning man a little different. The nineties club kids stuff is a little different from the Eighties Club. Up punk is always good. Punks always a good way to go. That is true. Maybe I'll maybe I can just really like Gothi that's close. Here's what I say you have because you have the colorful hair you take and make little buns like little tiny buns all the way down the middle of your head like a Mojo. That's intense. I'll give it a go. I'll give it a go. See what I can do this. Because it's easier than putting product in your hair to make a Mohawk just make little buns little space bonds but in a in a Mohawk shape. I wish I still had my Christopher I do not but I wish I did I do. I have but I mean it's amazing and deep waiver. Oh my God you know what I will share though to the daily beans twitter or maybe our instagram page. There's a picture of me when I'm I think in the first grade and my aunt did my hair. But I'm from Rural Nova Scotia so even though it was the mid nineties it looked like the mid eighties and she teas the shit out of my hair for my school picture. So that's GONNA be my present to the patrons tomorrow. Oh that's very kind of you. Oh you're welcome. Yeah it's it's the worst picture ever taken So I would like you all to enjoy it all right. Well everybody look forward to the cocktail hour. Thank you for being patrons. If you can't thank you for listening just subscribe. It's free to do. We appreciate you so much. I'm so humble. It's everyone. Please take care of yourselves. Take care of each other. Take care of your mental health. Take CARE OF THE PLANET. I've been AG. I've been Amanda Reader and the beans. The daily beans is executive produced and directed by AG. And Jordan Coburn an engineered it by Mackenzie Mozelle and star Burns. Industries Are Marketing Manager Executive Assistant Production Social Media Direction as Amanda Reader Fact Checking Research By AG Jordan Colin and Amanda Reader. Our music is written and performed by. They might be giants. Are Web design and branding or by Joel reader with moxy design studios and our website is daily beans pod dot com.

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OA284: Drain the Swamp, Starring Gordon Hartogensis

Opening Arguments

1:02:40 hr | 1 year ago

OA284: Drain the Swamp, Starring Gordon Hartogensis

"I hold myself in contempt. If you try to pull me up here to court without attorney. The questions cardiac Willie objection. I'm going to lower Gerke Rogers that offenders guard Acker. You didn't kill Thompson, but you did Mr.. Well. County kerry. Horder award up. Out. Welcome to opening arguments the podcast, that pairs inquisitive interviewer with the real life lawyer. This podcast is sponsored by the law offices of p Andrew Torres LLC for entertainment purposes, is not intended as legal advice, does not form attorney client relationship. Don't take legal advice from a podcast. Hello. And welcome to opening arguments. This is two hundred eighty four. I'm Thomas Smith over. There is Andrew Torres Esquire. How you doing? Andrew. I am fantastic. Thomas. How're you doing great? I am ver you. You tease the heck out of this one last week. I've been waiting when baited breath. Yeah. We, we've got a nice good, old fashioned opening arguments deep dive. And we've, I I'm told even in the preview which was amazing good preview. We've even got like the sequel to Dzhizak to Willer you know, like, once you take out one super villian villain. Another one pops up, you know, like the doc, doc inspire man or whatever. You know, there's always another villain, every movie. And how, how do you think doc for a hydra railing? It's like you're cut off one of his arms, and two are the villain. Inspire me to I guess is what I'm saying. You know, you got the, the first game was the green goblin or something, the green, I was indeed, turn goblin. Green? There's too many the green hornet there's too many green. I don't know anyway, the jolly green giant, one of them, and then the second movie was doc. I'm just saying he's well, actually the second one is seventy villains. It was a mess. But what's not a mess? We'll be this episode. Let's diving in or we doing any announcements. I know let's get to it. We are diving in. Here we go. Zoe andrew. I mean you tease that this was Sears related. It was related to our deep dive that was shockingly five or six weeks ago by now. Where do we sit? Where do we start with our drain the swamp tragedy in three acts? So apt one takes us back to the halcyon days of nineteen seventy four. Right. Pants were flared at the bottom cars were dangerously unsafe at any speed and Republicans in office were proposing things like Orissa, which is the employee retirement income security act of nineteen seventy four and, and whatever say is, is, again, this is going to seem kind of odd coming out of a Republican administration at a generally conservative time in our nation's history. It's a set of regulations, right? This used to be like, what Republicans did. Right. So the idea was. To encourage companies to provide pensions for their employees. And so they came up with a risk and Orissa was not just a set of, you know, crazy liberal government. Handouts. No, no, no. It was a set of regulations with single payer insurance, and that single payer is a, a an entity called the pension benefit guarantee corporation. It's basically like a government run insurance company. Right. And as you might imagine the idea that was. So you're a smaller company. You don't really know. You wanna make sure that you can take care of your employees and provide them with pensions. And so you could buy insurance from PBGC, and I'm way over simplifying here. But basically, the bigger the company, the more money you had in reserves, the lower. Your premiums would be right. Because the premium you know that the insurance and only kick in, if you can't afford to pay your pension obligations. And if you've got a lot of money in reserves than need less insurance, you have lesson reserves you need more interest, totally mixed mixed total sense. There's only one problem with that system. And that is the company's lie. And so they lied to the PBGC over the course of about three decades and they lied in order to get lower premiums pay lesson in, in revenues. And by the way, this is this is really really important. The, the PBGC is not funded with taxpayer dollars. It does not other right. It's sources of revenue are the premiums from the insurance policies that sells to companies investment income on those premiums. Right. Doesn't just sit on it and then. Invested in the stock market and assets and recovery's from failed plans. Right. So in other words, the, the premiums are secured by loans from those editing. So when they fail they become a secured creditor, and they can get assets from accompanies bankrupt estate. And in fact that, that latter part is going to be really, really important put the first of many, many pins, this is going to be A Beautiful Mind level set of pins on on, on this week's episode. So that's PBGC, you know, good idea bipartisan support encourage companies to provide pensions provide a an insurance company that is private. But, you know, kind of government managed that as a federally chartered corporation to use the legal language there and Mets working. Okay. Except that companies are cheating the system. They're not paying enough in premiums that is that accurately core. Response to their true, financial health package, and so is underfunded. And because of that we then fast forward to two thousand six the second term of President George W Bush, again, not likely friend of the show, very conservative president in a very conservative organization. Nevertheless, got together and the Democrats in Cairo two thousand six was democratic wave year. Right. The Democrats in congress got together and passed the pension Protection Act of two thousand six I'm going to include the full analysis of this. I this is not relevant for today's show. There's a lot of bad stuff in that Bill. Right. We've talked about this before the way in which legislation used to get there. You know, you reach compromise. So I do not mean to defend everything that is in the, the, the. Pension Protection Act of two thousand and six but for purposes of this discussion, the PPA amended Orissa and required companies that have underfunded their pension plans to pay higher premiums to PBGC and fixed a couple of other regulations, designed to get more assets into the PBGC and, and, and fix that gap. Right. So it close some loopholes it, you know, provided additional incentives on amounts that employers could invest in their own plans. And, you know, all sorts of complicated stuff. But basically, the idea is, hey look, there's a problem. There's an imbalance in between PBGC assets and PBGC liabilities. Right. So they got together, and they fixed it system works. It's twelve years later, and it's still a problem. And here's the magnitude of the problem. This is. I wanna say I mean I don't know the, the top ten of problems that we're not talking about politically, right? Like, but, but almost nobody is talking about this as a problem. And it is looming on the near horizon, so PBGC overseas. Right now nearly a million potential retirees. Right. And PBGC has a hundred twelve billion dollars in assets. Right again. Those are the premiums and the return on investments, pay debt since these tablets -ment of Orissa in nineteen seventy four. So that's an awful lot of money hundred twelve billion dollars. The problem is that PBGC's liabilities under its insurance. Policies are one hundred sixty four billion dollars. Right. So that's a fifty two billion dollar shortfall now again, that's actually been getting better. It was worse than that prior to the, the two thousand six regulations that shortfall is a an immediate crisis as more and more baby boomers are retiring as more and more companies are going out of business with underfunded pension liabilities thus leaving PBGC holding the back, so PBGC protects the pension benefits of more than forty million Americans who are in private sector, pension plans, and their directly paying. One and a half million who are in failed pension plans, right? Yep. So super huge problem. Let me make a side prediction here. In fact, before I make the prediction. Let me tell you it. In addition to that fifty two billion dollar gap the, the problem with consolidation. Is that if is that there are a number of PBGC customers that are too? Big fail. Right. Mostly in rust belt industries. That is automotive plants, right? Steel factories where retirees outnumber employee's. And if, if one of the I mean, this is this is from PBGC's own website. If, if one of those plans, huge plans goes completely insolvent than that could collapse the entire PBGC infrastructure, brag, it would just be left with no, like right now even though there's a massive deficit. Because of the, the high level of assets, they can they can at least scramble and sort of keep it going and retirees are not. We'll, we'll be paid out like a good version of a Ponzi scheme. Yeah. Exactly. Right. That's I was, I was struggling with that analogy. But, but that's right. Like there is they can keep afloat right now by robbing Peter to pay Paul. But if if, if all of a sudden Evans, with Peter and Paul or retiring. There's no Mary left, right? So, so. Yeah. It's an unbelievably precarious position. And that's why my belief is that, despite Donald Trump despite Republican Congress Republican Senate in the very near term. There will be PBGC bailout, right, congress. How are you? Mentioned the fifty two billion dollar shortfall. But it must be more than that, right? Because that's I mean, in the scheme of things. That's not that much money you wouldn't think you would be that much money. But I mean, Trump's handing out, you know, the for the tariffs, he's just handing out like twelve billion dollars like it's nothing for for that. You know, like wouldn't it is it is the fifty two billion shortfall, guess where masking is that not the whole story, like, is that, you know, if there's a worst case scenario than it's gonna, you're gonna need a lot more than that, it depends on the status of regulations. So, yes. Right. Like it right now that's the gap an infusion will fix that gap. But the gap will will then start. Exacerbate is eighty two. Yeah. It's not like permanently fixing. It it's just kind of bandaging exactly rock. But so I think there will be a fifty plus billion dollar bailout of PG. So that's, that's kind of the end of, of act one here. That's the state of. Pension plans in the United States. Today. Lots of big companies in particular, big industries, that are on a twenty thirty forty fifty year sort of downward slide, lots of lots of of, of those industries that are insolvent. They rely upon private insurance through a government. Federally chartered corporation, PBGC and PBGC has a massive imbalance between its assets and liabilities. Opening arguments is brought to you by open fit getting fit and staying healthy. Always sounds easier said than done. Oh, that's definitely true. But open it is bringing you something new. That makes it even easier to never miss sweat session, lose the commute to the gym and let the workouts come to you. That is my favorite part about open fit. I am tired of trying to drive to a gym that I don't wanna go to and maybe see people that I just it's so much easier. Just do it at home and open fit takes all of the. Flexitime out of losing weight and getting fit. 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And right now during the open fit thirty day challenge, our listeners, get a special extended thirty day, free trial. Membership to open fit where you can lose up to fifteen pounds and thirty days. When you text. Oh, a two thirty thirty thirty. That's a two thirty thirty thirty you'll get full access to open fit all the workouts, and nutrition formation. Totally free. One more time, just texted letters, a to the number thirty thirty thirty standard. Message and data rates may apply. Go try open fit today. Excuse me. Do you know how to get to town? Yeah, it's back the way you carry came. Act, two, I would call this one who the hell is Gordon heart agendas, and that's gonna be the issue of skin condition. Yeah. Here. Let's try to pronounce the drugs that you would use your in heart agendas. Go if you have our Gordon Arte Johnson's for more than four hours so yeah, you might start off with. Okay. Who who runs the PBGC and, and the answer up until a month ago was a guy named w Thomas reader junior BBC serves the, the, the director serves five year terms. So it's meant to stagger across political appointees, w Thomas reader junior. No probably not a big donor to the Bernie Sanders campaign. Right. He's gone. Like the other, you know, like federal executive branch, people that Trump is put into play at somebody who, like hates retirees or something will be somebody like their policy platform is like there shouldn't be pensions. We should just make people into soil green is that but, but reader was appointed in twenty fifteen and his next person. Yeah. Was supposed to run until October of twenty twenty. So he was a bomb pointy, but again, not a crazy left district this guy with an MBA and a JD from the university of Texas. He then went to become a big firm. Lawyer, I with Aken Gump, then with Paul Hastings genus cane Walker. Those are Covington and Burling style. Right. Huge firms everybody knows them. And, and while he was there, he became an Orissa lawyer, and, and let me tell you read I have friends who do a risk, I would not like there's literally no amount of money, you could pay me to take a risk. Case right now. Right. Like I just it is a specialized area of the law, and I don't have that information. I mean, I'll take money. I mean there isn't amount. Pay thomas's. Second champs law firm to take look it's hard, right? Like it's super super complicated. And that's what he did. And he spent a decade as an Orissa lawyer, and then went to the government and spent fifteen years in the government, he worked in the department of the treasury's office of tax policy. I as an attorney advisor then became deputy benefits, tax counsel, and eventually benefits tax council for the treasury department, then he moved to the Senate finance committee to work as senior benefits counsel for the democratic staff in two thousand nine with back to treasury in twenty thirteen as healthcare council for the Internal Revenue Service. So here's a guy who's got good academic credentials. And then it has spent his entire professional life, either doing a law or working with retirees pensions benefits. Right. It's hard to imagine someone more competent and qualified to, to, to run the wait to meet his replacement. Yeah. And by the way, his turnpike you, if you do nothing and would just be there until October twenty twenty and even if all you wanted to do was, you're worried about, you know, getting some regulations in place. You could still wait for him to leave. Trump will still be president or Pence will be president. If Trump is impeach from till the end of twenty twenty right? You could sneak somebody in for a couple of months and do some damage. If what you wanted to do was put in some, some political regulations in place. You know, let let the guy who's competent manage one hundred twelve billion dollars in assets, but no three and a half weeks ago. He was replaced with Gordon Harto Genesis. And now going to the case of Gordon Arte jets O L is Gordon heart agendas. I described him last week as our mirror universe. Jeez. Acharya to Willer. He is someone. With no Wikipedia page. He is somebody who has no publicly available photo on Google image on to 'em D And you don't wanna look at. The, the they're literally only two photos, I could find him online at all. And one is him like it's, it's this terrible lighting. And he's in a tuxedo. It may well be like his wedding photo. Put a pin in that. No, I'm serious. That's a real pin. Put that in it, it pulled out in about five minutes. He used to have a Twitter account. It was it was he added for ten years. He's had it since two thousand nine he has not tweeted in ten years, and he deleted it once politico pointed out that he that the Twitter account followed Justin Bieber Lindsay. Lohan Donald Trump his his own. Hey, meet our new director page on the PBGC's website is less than half a page long. We're gonna talk about the bullet points. So, in other words, he is an international man of mystery. Yeah, now you might be saying okay, but maybe he some kind of pension savant, right? No. He's a he's computer software guy. He is a BS in computer science from Stanford by seems to be smart at computer software. An MS in technology management from Columbia University. He is described as an entrepreneur, that is a lot of clown Horning nonsense. There was. Here's here's what happened. Two guys David Gamboa and Bill Miller started a company called petrol soft in nineteen eighty nine. And as you might imagine from parsing out that language, it was designed to be software to gas companies, our antagonised here. Gordon, heart Genesis joined petrol soft in nineteen ninety three and he was a sales guy. Right. So he was not the idea guy. He was not the development guy he came in and sold and sold the software to Chevron, and a bunch of other big oil companies, and made a lot of money. And good. For that, right? Like seriously like I don't mean that in any way sarcastically, like they saw that, that, that there was a need for computerized software in a major industry. It wasn't there. They built the product. They sold it to a lot of big gas companies. And then they sold the company in two thousand to a giant software company called Aspen technologies for sixty million dollars. And that, by the way, is when Gordon retired. He's twenty nine right? We made. Mid a couple of million dollars by being a part of the software company and retired in his retirement. He screwed around for a little while. Right. Each he tried to, to, to start a to fund. Another technology company called Alrich, a U R. I C technology that company has no webpage competed. I can't find anything did was just new was it was a failure. Right. But, but basically he's done. Nothing since retiring in two thousand after the end of the dot com. Boom, having been part of successful technology startup. Oh, sorry to two things. He has done two things in the past twenty years. Number one, he's administered his family trust. Which you have to play by which means he's managed investments for his family. Right like that. Literally is not the kind of thing you would put on a resume except when you have nothing to put on a resume for the past twenty years. Yeah it I mean don't be fooled. When you look into this guy and see. Okay. He's administered family trust blah, which like that, just like that's just like, you know what you do when you know you open up, you know a retirement account right? Like he's just more about it. And the other thing he did was married. Elaine Chao sister. So he's Mitch McConnell's brother-in-law. Which led Ian grin reporter for politico to right to do some investigative journalism when this guy was nominated to head the PBGC and figure out who who Gordo is here. I'm going to link this article in the show notes because it's one of the only pieces of information out there about Gordon heart agendas, and it is delightful. It includes interviews with his family, and I'm going to read some of the money quotes. The fact that he's Mitch McConnell's brother-in-law, quote, maybe the reason they're appointing him as a family favor, quote, conceited, George heart agendas. His cousin the administration is not known for great people, but he has a lot of experience at business and he's smart. George added quote it's like if your family member is a made man in the mafia. I mean I'm proud of him at all, but they're still band of criminal on my. So Donald Trump tries on family. Yeah, that's, that's, that's the best to get. Pelosi or something that's his family. That's, that's George right this, Gordon. That's his cousin George. Donald Trump tried to appoint him in the fall of twenty eighteen but then because the Senate turned over that, that appointment was was required to, to be resubmitted in, in twenty nineteen. But as a result, heart agenda, says, confirmation hearing before the Senate finance committee was scheduled on the same day as the cavenaugh here it, right. So, by the way, that's why we missed it. And that's why quote most of the committee didn't attend and of quote, according to politico. Right. That was kind of a bigger thing going on that day. So, so this is the guy in charge of one hundred twelve plus billion dollars in assets. Oh, by the way, during his confirmation heart agendas, confirmed that he would not be divestiture. Assets from himself and from his family trust. So, you know, remember I remember I told you to put a pin in the wedding photo that that would have been why. So, okay. Now, you have another swamp creature in charge of hundred plus billion dollars assets is probably gonna fifty plus billion dollars in tax payer funded bailout money, right to redress that probably real soon now and somebody who is not pledged to anything to avoid conflicts of interest, because what you now that moves us to act three well, what do you say, we give act through the sell as they do? Take take a little break real quick. All right. Let's take a break. Opening arguments is brought to you by green, chef green chef is a USDA, certified organic company, that makes eating well, easy and affordable with plans to fit every kind of lifestyle. You've heard us advertise with hellofresh in the past. Well green chef is now owned by hellofresh. And they offer a wider array of meal plans to choose from there's something for everyone. And if you like hellofresh, if you're happy with that stick with that, but if you wanna switch, try something different. I love switching between the brands for when my tastes change. Or maybe when I wanna eat a little differently in a given month. Now, our listeners can enjoy both brands at a discount with us. Here's what makes green, chef so great and unique their meal plans include paleo plant, powered, vegan and vegetarian. Pesca -tarian Kito, gluten free an omnivore so that gives you so many more choices than you might typically see, now Lydia are currently on a special diet. So we. It would be omnivore package. And we made for example, the talian breaded pork chops with barley, CRA meaty, mushrooms, tomatoes, and parmesan cheese. Aw. It was so delicious that which I can have it again. Right now, it was so good as usual. My favorite part about green, chef is that ingredients come pre measured perfectly portioned, and they're actually mostly prep to they're all ready to go and everything is handpicked and delivered right to your door. There is something for everybody. You can switch up your meal plan when ever, you're ready to try new way, a new, maybe a new diet, a new way to eat and right now with our URL you can get a total of seventy five dollars off. That's twenty five dollars off each of your first three boxes and you need to do this, go to green chef dot US slash law. Pod, seventy five I'm gonna say that again green chef dot US slash law. Pod. Seventy five hop on right now on your phone, your computer popping that you are L and get seventy five dollars off. Do you wanna try this, it's delicious, and it is so exciting that you have all of these different choices now in terms of your diet. So go check out green shift today. There. You happy everybody. We took a break. Okay. Queuing and do it. All right. Didn't give hard sell though. I kind of blew that part. I don't know what to give the hearts now. Here's here's the hard sell go back to episode two seventy three right in that we talked about Eddie Lampert, and Steve Mnuchin, who were alleged to have acquired Sears knowing that it was bankrupt. And then what they did was strip the company of its most valuable assets looting it before the bankruptcy in order to distribute, the proceeds of those assets shareholders, who, by the way, we're Lampard and Mnuchin and deprive the creditors of assets in bankruptcy, by the way, Lampard and Mnuchin have responded to that complaint. And they deny that the sales were intended to strip Sears of its assets, and they were in fact Okla head. No, I was just saying unconvinced. They didn't. Okay. Well, that settles that, but, but it's what's important is the, the reason that they've done. They've. Oh, no. We were trying to keep the company operating over this timeframe. That's why we got rid of the only. That's why we got rid of the profitable asp state. Yeah. Exactly. It's a hard one to swallow, it's so hard to swallow as we pointed out show. Crushes Liz Warren and AFC have sent a letter as of may twenty third to Steve Mnuchin demanding information. And as we talked about in prior episodes. Look like that is the predicate to having the house finance committee issue, a subpoena that will be coming. There's Mnuchin is not going to give satisfactory answers here. But there's more to the story after allegedly looting Sears is assets. The Lampert controlled Sears did exactly what we said, which was declared bankruptcy in October of twenty eighteen and in bankruptcy. Then the committee for Sears had a choice, right? They could either liquidate the assets and come up with an orderly way of disposing those assets to the various creditors of Sears, or they could sell them as a package. Right. And. Here we had a dispute between what's Sears wanted to do which was sell the assets as a package, and what the creditors wanted, which was don't try just liquidate the assets and distribute about. Ultimately after litigation. There was a hearing. And the bankruptcy judge approved Sears request to sell the assets to a third party inex- change for just over five billion dollars. You wanna guess who Sears sold the assets to? Cheese. One of Gordon heart Genesis, failed companies. Or maybe one of his exist will come I dunno. They sold it to transform hold co LLC a which was a wholly-owned subsidiary of any Lampert hedge fund ESL investments, so, yes. So let let let's just bring that full circle. We have the allegations that Eddie Lampert, a quite acquired the assets of K mart, in bankruptcy, at a bargain price used Kamer. This is from two seventy three used K mart to acquire Sears instead of strengthening mart became the beneficial majority shareholders of Sears sold off all the goodies from Sears. Drove Sears into bankruptcy and then wall Sears was in bankruptcy divest themselves of their ownership in Sears formed transform hold co and. Bought back the assets of Sears, in bankruptcy for pennies on the dollar. The, the few remaining assets that Sears has were approved by bankruptcy court for sale to transform hold co a wholly owned subsidiary of. Yes, L investments that Eddie Lampert hedge fund, so yes, the guy who owned the company took it into bankruptcy. And then sold the assets to himself, this should be the most basic kind of time, he stepped down from the board. When you're. Declared bankruptcy. Wow. And that's why all of the creditors. All of the creditors said, late can't Tom. This is this is ridiculous, right? This is the this the sale is being orchestrated to benefit just one buyer to make only possible for one don't did sell them off in bankruptcy, right? And pay us that way because otherwise these insiders are going to loot all the assets. We're not gonna be left with anything I'm going, there was a contested hearing. I'm going to upload the transcript I wanna focus in on an issue because this issue is going to develop in the next couple of weeks. You will see stories about it, and remember you heard them first on opening arguments. So after the bankruptcy Sears laid up on people off, this is not surprising. In laying people off it incurred certain severance and pension obligations in. Incurred as you will, see in the transcript, sixty two million dollars in claims for severance pay. Okay. Now again, that is in, in the scope of this, not a lot of money, but those are long time Sears. Employee's that have pensions who were laid off, as a result of the bankruptcy as part of the court approved asset purchase agreement. This ESL subsidiary transform hold co company agreed that it would assume those liabilities k it is section two point three k of the contract. It is called capital letters, the severance reimbursement obligations. Those were reduced as consideration for this ESL entity to buy it to forty three million dollars. All right. So already pension ease are getting. Seventy five cents on the dollar. Right. But seventy five cents on the dollar. I guess is better than nothing. And as a result, the PBGC that is at the time, the Obama controlled PBGC signed off on the deal. Now they had previously objected, right? They an upload their objection as well. PBGC. We talked with this has one point seven billion dollars in claims against Sears. Right. That is for liabilities that PBGC will, incur, if Sears does not pay its pension fund, but they agreed to the sale subject to the condition that I'm on other things that PBGC assume those severance reimbursement obligations and pay off the people that were laid off during the bankruptcy, and they also agreed to an unsecured claim against the Sears estate against the, the money that comes in as a result of selling off the Sears assets that is part of what is called a plan of reorganization. It's now on the second amended plan of. Reorganization and that's where we are right now. And the way in which that works in a bankruptcy is when you're in chapter eleven you say, hey, look, we're gonna come up with a plan to come out of the bankruptcy, and that plan part of that plan in order for the company to get a fresh the new company to get a fresh start. We need to make the creditors. Not whole but to get rid of all the creditors. Right. So we're going to satisfy all of the obligations against the creditors clear off the books, and that's what the plan of reorganization is meant to do that is the fight that is that is going on right now. And two days ago transform hold co LLC. Filed a lawsuit a declaratory judgment seeking among other things. A statement this is this preemptive that it does not have to pay the settlement, reimbursement obligations because of failure of Sears to turnover certain levels of assets. And then their argument is that, that reduces it dollar for dollar. In other words, Eddie Lampert, controlled ESL controlled entity transform hold co LLC is now saying it reserves the right not to pay the pension obligations of Sears employee's who were laid off as a result of the bankruptcy. Now put all three of these pieces together. What's going to happen? That transform hold co. Lawsuit names, PBGC, the allegations surrounding Sears directly implicate, the secretary of the treasury, Steven Mnuchin, the person now in charge of how strongly to litigate the claims against Steven Mnuchin. Any Lampert is Gordon heart agendas. My predictions are as follows. I think transform hold co LLC is not going to pay it's obligations. I think PG see is not going to get paid. Anything? They're going to get pennies on the dollar. At best out. Ultimately out of the Sears reorganization on Inc. Lampert and Mnuchin are gonna walk away with billions of dollars in assets. By the way, he BG see is going to get. And that is going to be the trigger for PBGC to get a Bela and of billions, maybe more in taxpayer funded bailout dollars because they all look, we had these unanticipated losses. I observe you know, Sears went bankrupt and they didn't fund their pensions enough, and, you know, that's and that is now unacceptable liable, you don't want Sears retirees to all go without their pensions. Do you and the person who will be in charge of administering those tens of billions of dollars in bailout funds is somebody with zero knowledge experienced ability to administer pension funds is going to be a guy who made money in tech startup? And then retired for twenty years before Mary. Being Mitch McConnell's wife sister it. I cannot. I mean, it there is not a drain the swamp analogy. You know, swampy enough to describe this. It's coming credible. I mean, this is this is like, how much this just makes me think, how much has been broken in this past few years that we just won't even hear about. Like there's just so there's no end to the swamp. I mean, there's so much opportunity for, you know, these are these are these are on the smarter end of criminals. Yeah. These are sophisticated financial criminals to loot the American treasury essentially, how many opportunities are they getting that we don't even hear about? Yeah. We look we went through this, right. And in two seventy three Lampard scheme. Here is brilliant. I mean, again alleged right? We but, but. The allegations are very persuasive to me. I, I have never. It's part of why I mean, I was certainly gratified to see it was Warren. And Alexandra Cossio Cortez sees on the on the corruption elements, but the reason I wanted to do deep dive on it is because I, I had never seen this technique of coming in buying the distress shares of company and then liquidating the profitable assets to drive it into bankruptcy. And I knew I mean, I you know, we'd sort of left out there. I you know, this isn't a, a corporate fraud podcast, the second half of that, to have successfully driven the company into bankruptcy and then be the guys go back at by what's left again. Yeah. I mean it's just, you know it it you're you were squeezing at both ends, and Ted Cruz we don't need to be worried about space pirates. We need to be worried about. Corporate pirates like actual can we have a corporate force instead of space force? Corporate frauds force. That's so it will pay for. So there you go. Look we have. No, I, I want to be clear on this. We have no evidence right now that Gordon heart agendas is a criminal, right. We also have no evidence that he's qualified in any way. No, no. We, we have affirmative evidence that he is not qualified for the job. That, that he's I mean, he has never the, the, the executive experience that you need to administer a one hundred twelve billion dollars assets to. To more than one and a half million current pensioners with insurance that covers forty one million retirees in this country. I it's, it's just you know, he he, he doesn't know the industry doesn't know Orissa. He doesn't know the law he doesn't have the executive experience. He doesn't know the insurance industry. I mean look, I it is rare that I say that, right. Like I talked about how I wouldn't take an Orissa case, I would at least be a significantly better candidate to run the PBGC, because I've done insurance work for fifteen years. Right. And the work, I did for Equitas was was similar to this. Right. Was resolving liabilities so that the balance-sheet corrected that imbalance? Right. And, and, and I would be grotesquely unqualified for this job. But at least I know one component of it. I do not under. Stand there. There is no immediate need to have replaced reader as director of this agency. There was not. I mean there was no legitimate need to have done. So there were no right. This is not this not the case. I mean, then there were no political needs for right? Like this is not like putting Mick Mulvaney, into the CFP. We know why Trump did that. Right. Like he did. He did that because politically Trump and his party hate the cfpb, and they wanted to put somebody in who didn't intend to prosecute any actions against consumer fraud. Right. You, you don't have to assume any kind of corporate cheating or corrupt intent because political corrupt intensifies here, there isn't a sufficient political purpose here. It's either all a giant coincidence, or it is getting your political lackey and a position to be adverse to your other political lackey and. And, you know, we're going to continue to follow the lawsuit, we're going to continue to follow the Sears bankruptcy, but if and I really, really think that somebody on, either the AFC or Warren, staffs, or both listens to the show followed do plays, get us an interview with would be a really good interview. It'd be it'd be it would help the campaign while yo sees not running for anything right now but you know, couldn't hurt. She's running every two years, every two years. Yes, she's got sure it's already dash gonna come up sooner than she thinks come on the show and, and keep keep your eyes open, because I, I believe that the reason why sustained professionals at the PBGC signed off on the Sears deal was that they got certain assurances. And I think they got assurances that I mean, look, we know from the filing that now that it's been approved that. Lampard wants to back away from he doesn't wanna pay the current pensions. If he doesn't wanna pay forty three million dollars in current pension liabilities. Do you think he wants to pay one point seven billion dollars in outstanding pension liabilities? That strikes me is pretty unlikely. So we'll look, this is going to affect real people. And, and it it I think I think there is a there's a crisis. Incoming so there you go. That's the end of drain the swamp, the, the Gordon heart agenda story, we need peep when need people in there, we need Liz warn to this. There's so much damage to undo, you know, and maybe we need to see if PB but for this for whatever this, you know, if it'd be nice something. I, I mean, wow, there's going to be a lot of damage done do with the next time. I mean this is I just I just want to drive home. If, if, if you're one of. The six libertarians for oh a listener, south there. If if you are remotely tempted by the, you know, fiscally conservative line of let's eliminate regulations. I get that temptation, I am a small business owner multiple small business owner, an entrepreneur, I work with small businesses and entrepreneurs get that temptation. This is the positive side of regulation, Orissa is a bipartisan invention that is nearly fifty years old that was designed to do public private partnerships to reach across you know, not to, to, to bring together, you know, Democrats and Republicans to help ensure that old people don't starve and die in the streets. And as recently as a Republican a decade ago that was a bipartisan consensus that, you know, look, some regulations are worth keeping and, and. Now, we're at a point where, you know, the that Overton window is shifted so far that I am you know, wistful for the George W Bush administration. Yeah, but this look this is what regulations to right. Like you need regulations to ensure that you can appropriately have insurance to cover how companies path pensions without that they're just gonna lie to you, and we know that because we had the regulations and they lied, anyway. So, so there you go. All right. Well, this is frustrating. Do you think there's ever going to be any Justice for these people? I mean, are they just going to get away with having looted these assets and not paying the retirees all this? I, I it's, it's, it's a really, really good question. I think that the, the as you pointed out, I think that the, the, the corruption is so profound. You know, look, I uncovered this, you know, we uncovered this with some research and some court documents and connecting the dots. If we could figure this out, then you know. Then that strongly suggests that we didn't find the one act of corruption in the Trump administration. And, and I fear that it is so rampant. And there's just so much that, you know, the best that we can hope for is that, you know, a couple of these folks become kind of the signature, Paul Manafort. You know, somebody gets caught but, but I think for everybody who, who, who gets caught there will be tens or hundreds that, that got away with, like twenty twenty happens. We win say could there be like a special counsel on stuff like the there'd be like a molar for this except not Muller? Somebody who actually has going to go far as we need to Shur because there are underlying financial crimes. Really right now, there are no criminal investigations open regarding Sears right now. What we've talked about is behavior that defraud creditors in a case, where the insiders knew the company was bankrupt out of. Of assets of the company, but that the evidence that comes out in those civil suits and the, the horror d- legal legwork that is being done by Covington. Burling style firms absolutely is something that government investigators could and you would like to see them. Pick up on there. Are, you know, financial crimes reporting? Crimes failure to disclose. Right. Like like all of those are, are, you know what, what we would call white collar crimes and, and white collar crime. Illegal again has been the. Yup, logan. I don't know if again is proper, but, but neither was make America great again. So that's similarly make white collar crime illegal again. A what a mess. What a what a impressive job Andrew uncovering covering all this. And while vote everybody, maybe we can. That's what all we can do. All we can do is make sure we vote. There's so much steak is impossible even keep in your head at once all the reasons that we need to get out there and get these people out of office really is. But we need to so. All right. It is time to thank our new patrons over patriot dot com slash law, and welcome aboard. New patrons hope, you're enjoying Opie, enjoy the bonus stuff and all that. And Andrew, why don't you start us off? Yeah. Thank you to Travis the seaman can Kenny fryer. Ludwig d-w Brian. Leeman hippopotamus tros equip today, Lian, Ross Grinnell, a, that's just the lower case letter like that minimalist Earl h Shanteau Meyer that is a Fanta. I. Hope that's a real name. But if that is a if that's a, a suited pseudonym that is a, an a plus pseudonym on, on an on an episode where we've got a lot of toast. Earl h Shanteau Myer Wendell Ang and is don't take legal advice from podcast legal advice. No, it is not. So there's no no, no internal contradiction. There. Half. Give me some financial advice and I say, don't take financial advice for podcast. You do not really doing anything with it. That's not gonna help you meddle in. Thank you. Chris for Lovejoy. Thank you, Carl Ottesen Claire, stop calling them autism people. It's people with autism, tingle Perry. Winkle joke. Kim or bro nut. You're sorry characters were there. I guess I've mooched for long enough mooch is should give you moolah. Oh, thank you. We appreciate it. Yes, they should Ben Hanson auto Moses and eat the rich did I stutter? Right there. You have it. Okay. Now it is time for the thrilling inclusion of t t which I feel no confidence in. Let's see how did. Oh, no social this firm ever failed the bar. Exam kidding. Harry thomas. So this was a criminal law question. This was the great McDonald's drive through caper a woman pulls into the drive through says, hey, I got a sniper with his rifle trained on you and he's gonna shoot you dead. If you don't give me the contents the register by the time I get to the window and also large fries as she makes it better. We got some food with it, right. Yeah. Well, I think that's it's implied but not stated in of black market value of a crush supreme. Are we going to talk about together in San Francisco? I'm down for that. By the way. If you're that's why to come to the great Serio. Yeah. San Francisco burrito capital of the United States. Rena go now we had a nice authentic place. Anyway. Back to the question. So, so she pulls up to the drive through, and the cashier wasn't sure whether anyone was actually there. But puts five hundred dollars in a paper bag gives it to her. And then she drives off, she's caught because, of course, she issues, an idiot and turns out there was never a sniper. The whole thing was just made up what crimes can she be convicted and the answers were a embezzlement be obtaining property by false pretenses. See robbery and larceny were de robbery or larceny. And thomas. I wanna tell you analyze this question really perfectly. You eliminate it off the bat. Embed. Element. Bright, a crazy answer. Right. This was not the there was no, embezzlement, you also eliminated obtaining property by false pretenses. That's a good elimination. Because in order to obtain property by false pretenses? You have to actually obtain the property right right say, like, had she not been lying. There was night Bor. Then then it's fine because it's not. But, but if you think about it right like notwithstanding. The joke of possession is nine tenths of the law. Right. She never obtained the prop rightly Jamie property by false pretenses. When I tell you, like, hey, did your house over to me and I'll make sure I take care of your grandma. And then I never have any, but you actually did the house over to that. I have obtained the property. She never got titled to the money, right? She cheat stole the money. Right. So she, she didn't obtain the property, so she couldn't have obtained by false pretenses, even though she was lying so that narrows it down to either robbery and larceny or robbery or larceny listener question. What the hell is larceny? I don't know. So find out gra-. That's, that's what this question is testing larceny is a common law crime that has four elements, right. That is the food. Cruncher breeds. Yeah. Not cheese. So no. The four elements are number one. The unlawful taking number two of someone else's property K, number three without their consent and number four with the intent to permanently deprive, the owner of the property that sounds so robbery, though, like what's the difference robbery ads with it the threat of miles or something threat of violence? Maybe I did get this one. Right. So the only question is, could you be convicted of both bribery, and larceny? Or do you have to elect, and unfortunately after is robbery or Larson? Either is all of the elements of robbery are present in larceny. Right. So you can't convict somebody of both of it is you either determine that the threat of violence was there at which point, it's robbery, or that it wasn't because there was no sniper at which point one or the other. But not both. This was a lesser included offense question. And it was a tough one. I really I was closing his great job. Right there, right there. So there we go that sucks. Yeah. I, I didn't know that the technical definition of those, but okay robbery. And an implant we went through that because if larceny had any element that was outside that was not an element of robbery. Then you could convict on both. Yeah. When one criminal offense is entirely eventing them from, like adding up a bunch of, you know, exactly of charges. Okay. Yeah. All right. Well, I messed that one up I got. That's one of those tough breaks got most of the way there, but you couldn't close. That's how that's how it goes. But who the bar exam is an unforgiving mistress and failed? Okay. Who why don't you jump in your time machine and dust off the, the cruncher up dust, and all that? And tell us who won this week's t t t b because it was surely, not me. Okay. Thomas, this winter, I out of the box, and really solid, pithy explanation is jed sarokin open that is at jets a lawyer on Twitter kind of gives the game away a little bit, who says, see taking another's property with the intent to permanently deprive them of it in their presence and under threat of imminent, forces robbery, and larceny is a lesser included offense, aka all rectangles are squares, but not all squares rectangles wish I'd thought of that analogy anyway, that's dead on congratulations jet. And, and seriously jets, great follow on Twitter and everyone should do that at J. E. D. S. A. L. A. W. Y E, R Judd's, a lawyer. Good, good stuff. Long standing fan of the show. And congratulations on being this week's winner. All right. Thanks so much for listening. We love you. We love our patrons, most of all, and, but we love everybody, and we will see you on Friday for another rapid response. Law. This has been opening arguments with Andrew and Thomas, if you love the show and wanna support trips oats, please. Visit our patriarch page at patriot dot com slash law. If you can't support us finance -ly it'd be a big help. If you leave us a five star review on, I tunes Stitcher, or whatever podcasts delivery, vehicle, you use, and be sure to tell all your friends about us for questions, suggestions and complaints. Email us at open arguments at gmaiLcom the show notes and links on our website at WWW dot open dot com. Be sure to like our page on Facebook and falls on Twitter at open arts until next. This podcast is production of opening arguments media LLC all rights reserved. Arguments is produced with assistance of our editor, Brian Siegen. 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PBGC Sears Orissa Donald Trump Gordon Harry thomas Zoe andrew United States robbery Willer Liz Warren Lampard director Mitch McConnell Eddie Lampert Twitter President George W Bush attorney congress
OA212: Rod Rosenstein and... G. Zachary Terwilliger?

Opening Arguments

1:18:30 hr | 2 years ago

OA212: Rod Rosenstein and... G. Zachary Terwilliger?

"We have reached the verdict already. We all just kind of looked at each other. Not at we find the defendant guilty of charges. Wait one, five. In your broth, you're on our check. Your would task. Whether it's raising the cauda or starry diseases, there is no basis for imposing some Drik Coney in policy with regard to bail Noko Koto your honor. The defense is now just making worse. Trial. Like a judge everything, ensuring people ladies. Welcome to opening arguments. The podcast that pairs an inquisitive interviewer with the real life lawyer. This podcast is sponsored by the law offices of p Andrew Torres. LLC for entertainment purposes is not intended as legal advice does not form an attorney. Client relationship. Don't take legal advice from a podcast. Hello and welcome to opening arguments. This is episode, two hundred, twelve. I'm heroes. Thomas Smith that over there is Andrew tours, Esquire and this is it's a weird thing. Don't adjust that. Do not adjust that dial on your your phone dial that you have, but this is a rapid response, Tuesday, rapid response, Tuesday through sheer dumb luck of Andrew being having the plague last week. Oh, by the way, how you doing Andrew recover from the plague? I, I'm on the upswing from the plague. I still wouldn't. You know, tongue kiss you with this point in time. Well, that ruined all my plans for this recording. So I've got no idea. So hopefully them so well. Hopefully. Well, we're in luck because I think there's been some news. There's been yes. Two things going Rosenstein and ever now the how to route those seems like everybody does it differently, but Rosenstein news, big news, not not just the the news on. I think the story was on Friday about the leaking, all that in the wire and all that. But just this morning, we've got just a crazy sequence of events. We're going to go through it and that's that's what we have plan. We'll see. We might get to some bonus stuff later, but you know how Andrew is. He's got a lot to say, so the Rosenstein stuff may be as much as we get to. I do want to announce quick couple announcements first off the QNA. It's already that time of the month. I can't believe it would have thought we are going to do the QNA Monday about a week from when you're hearing this. So that's Tober I, the QNA for this is again patrons. Get to ask the questions, but everybody can come watch. Come enjoy. The show live pop it up on your YouTube, maybe listened while you're at work. Something like that. Who knows? Because it's going to be at three PM Pacific six PM eastern on Monday, October first. So that's our QNA coming up and then lot awful movies. We've got something good plan for you as well. We're gonna try to get that out more on time this month than last month. We've got it scheduled, so we'll get that to you. And as always you can go to patriot dot com slash law to enjoy those goodies. And by the way, get yourself that ad free feet at patriot dot com slash law. You never have to hear an ad if you are patriots, that is our our solemn pledge to you. All right. And another announcement, I'm gonna be q. e. d. that's coming up way faster than I could have possibly imagined. That's, of course, in Manchester which is I'm told as in somewhere in England, I don't know, but I'll be there and I'm excited. It says that it's sold out. You know, it's been sold out for a while, so I don't know why I'm telling you this other than if you already were going. You'll see there, but it also says that there may be additional tickets available at some point, so you can sign on to be notified or something. But Cutie is a really cool conference. I've never been, but ally and all those people, everybody raves about it. And of course, I love Marsh. He's the one I've been in contact with mainly I know there's other people involved, but he's fantastic. So it's gonna be a great conference. I'll see about maybe doing some sort of meat up. I'll have to gauge how it goes. Maybe if you if you if you're gonna be around the area and this is Friday, October twelfth, and it's kind of that that whole weekend. So if you're in the area, you can shoot me a message or something on Facebook and let me know to get an idea. Maybe we want to do a pug meet up or anything like that or if we wanted just hang out at the event, I don't know either way, so that's that. Let's see any other announcements now I am. I am super jealous because everything I have heard about q. e. d. is that it is fantastic and. I wish I could go. I have when you hear this, I will be in like eighty seven billion listeners have written into say, I need to pronounce it Louisville. I, that's one of the we talked about on comedy shine. Every time the NC double a. tournament comes up, it's always people have to say like Lule Aloom. They've reduced it to. It's like a thousand letters. It's like we're Chester Scheider sauce. They've reduced to just one disgusting throat sound like it's instead of Louisville. Louisville. Sounds that sounds like a great place instead of that, it's. That's, that's. Why would you do that voluntarily? I don't understand what you've done that to yourself. Sorry, it's Louisville for me. Yeah, me too, but apparently I am supposed to put on the affect of a southern Colonel. You know, maybe Alaw Fletch lives, but. And so a Louisville. But that's where I'm going to be on Thursday for my debate sponsored by the American constitution society ACO, you Americans United. On originalism and the separation of church and state. I am super excited about. I've been told all the all the tickets are gone. Wow, but but I'm what things can you and I advocate is that people your, hey, here's what you're missing out on. Everybody know. That's really cool. I'm glad that sold out because that debate is going to be incredible. Do you have any word on whether it's being recorded? Yeah, my understanding is that I'm going to be able to record it. I am taking down Mike wittment and hopefully we will be able to get that released as a patrons special. Maybe a regular show up. We'll figure it out. It'll be awesome. We will. We'll try and get it to. I'm very excited to hear that. It's going to be a thrilling debate. Can't wait to hear Andrew at his. That's kind of what you're born to do. I feel like your debate your masturbaters. They say. Let's all right. Let's get on with the show. Let's talk about what in the world is happening with rod Rosenstein. Someone who you know, right. This is somebody you've have some. Yeah, relationship. He's he's, he's a colleague of mine. I have also asked him personally on the Rosenstein Rosenstein. Oh, and and he's he is. He's told me that that he's comfortable both ways which I, I do that when whenever people ask me is at Torres or Tarez, so so I get that. Apparently just like in my family, like half of his family says Rosenstein and half of his family says Steve. Okay. I always heard Rosenstein. I've always used Rosenstein but, but sometimes on the show I think I've used Rosensteins so so either way both. Good. Okay. Well, thank you. Now you tell me so they're going. Right. To it. So let's first talk about kind of Niger going back chronologically. Let's talk about this initial story that dropped. What was over the weekend was a Friday. It's all blur of news, but it was about potentially rod Rosenstein. Joking, maybe not joking about wearing a wire about invoking the twenty fifth amendment what is going on with this mess? Yeah, this was this was a New York Times story that dropped after close of business hours on Friday, and it is an absolute. I'm going to say a clown horn of a story, so we don't. We don't make. So that we don't. That's what that's what our listeners have dubbed Brian's. Dag Nabet or something. I was like a clown. Is that like the nice way, saying cluster, f, let's right. It's it's my way of swearing without making Brian. I love that. Let's get that going. Real clown. Look. This is the story that leaked argued that among other things Rosenstein had volunteered to wear a wire for Muller, which is preposterous. You would never use a low, the person who issued the letter of appointment, right? You would never invoked involve them as a material witness because it would be crazy putting that person on the stand. Right. Okay. So that part of the story was was unbelievable, and then even more preposterously and and I'm really unhappy with the New York Times for for running with the story. It suggested that Rosenstein had suggested to White House staffers that he was going to solicit whether they were going to invoke the twenty fifth amendment to remove Donald Trump. The reason that that this is a clown horn store. Is because the twenty fifth amendment is this is a crass in Steen occupied Democrats level move, right? We talked about before that would be the obvious better way to go. Right, because it, yeah. I mean, let's I dismissed it, but, but because this is now come up and been associated with the nation's second highest law enforcement official. I mean, let me read a little bit of the text of the twenty th amendment. Right? So the first parts are dealing with actual succession, right? The vice president becoming president section four says whenever the vice president and a majority of the principal officers of the executive departments, right? So the cabinet heads transmit to the president pro tem of the Senate. That's Orrin Hatch and the speaker of the house of representatives that's profile in courage. Paul, Ryan, they're written declaration that the president is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his off. Office, the vice president, Shelly mmediately, assume the powers and duties of the office as acting president. Okay. But then the next paragraph says thereafter, and that can be contemporaneous there with right when the president transmit to the president pro tem of the Senate and the speaker of the house, his written declaration that no inability exists, he shall remove the, he shall resume the powers and duties of his office unless and then you can go back and forth. And if two thirds of both houses decide that the president is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office than the vice president shall continue the discharge as the acting president. So in other words, so long as let's let's do, it's impeachment plus you have to run a marathon and like you know, bench four hundred pounds and do all this additional stuff. It's like why? And you don't get to impeach the guy, right. That's exactly right. And so I mean, look at all of the all of the the, the additional criteria that are on that. I mean, it's kind of almost not worth continuing to go through right. Like in there about like the president pro time of the Senate has to drop all the rape apology that he's doing. Did they write that in or is that just assumed. Shockingly not present in the twenty fifth amendment. Look like this amendment is intended for the president is in a coma, right? This is intended and and so leave. Everything else aside. Okay. If I thought there was a special secret, constitutional provision that applied when the president was in a coma, but it was easier to get Donald Trump out of office than, yeah, like a great. We could talk about it, but that's not what this is. It would be harder you would have to get the cronies that Donald Trump has appointed to his cabinet to sign onto a letter, and then all you would have to do admittedly getting Donald Trump to write a letter and not a tweet is a hurdle. Can we make sure he writes it like we have to see him put ten to paper and actually write something because that that'd be you might just be like. No, it does. It does require a written declaration, but, but I mean leaving that joking aside like it to override the president's self determination that he's fine. You'd have to get two thirds of both houses of congress, which is harder than impeaching. So yeah, it's just a preposterous Rosenstein knows this. So there's zero chance right that the stories that have come out since then are alternatively either he didn't say it or if he said it, he was joking, and that is one hundred percent believable because nobody smart as rod Rosenstein is dumb enough to be seriously floating the twenty fifth amendment. Absolutely not. And I, and then I just want to say like, in addition to leaking this story, the the New York Times was the first on the seem to run with the story that Rosenstein was going to resign this morning. And I to me, this is just I have now I have no come full circle. We maybe we could have put in a Randall Eliason was right bumper at the beginning, but we had professor allies in on to discuss a whole bunch of things. And we made reference to the fact that he is probably I think the only voice on the left that has raised a consistent critique of confidential sources, right? He testified against the flow of information act. This is one hundred percent a validation of his position. And I just I went back to his two thousand eight American University law review article, and, and I'm gonna allied over a little bit, but but here's. This is near the end of the article. He says, privilege supporters, usually invoked the icon of a virtuous whistle blower motivated by noble desire to inform the public through the media. The reality of course, is that many sources are anything but noble in anything. But innocent, this is particularly true in Washington where anonymous sourcing exists, much more to protect government spinners than actual whistle blowers the Valerie plame case, which is live at the time is just the most famous recent example and and I say, I think he's one hundred percent dead on with respect to to to what's going on here. This is very clearly a Trump loyalist leaking, quote, unquote to the New York Times. These stories about Rosenstein in order to prime the pump to get Rosenstein fired and and the fact that the New York Times is allowing themselves to be manipulated this way is is disappoint strating. Yeah. What do you think about the kind of the model. Fide maybe a compromise between the two methodologies there where if a source is completely full of it and deceives you, you know, as a journalist than it's like, okay, game on. I'm going to reveal who it is. Yeah, I and give the proof that here's them on tape saying, yes, the Rosenstein definitely discuss the blah, blah, blah. I, I actually think there's there's less of a chance of that happening voluntarily because because clearly what's what's happening here and look like I'm beating up on the New York Times. It could have been another major paper because what happens is the confidential source calls you up and says, I demand, you keep my name confidential, and if not, I'm gonna go talk to the Washington Post and if not, I'm gonna talk to the LA times and and the the desire for the scoop coupled with. I mean, look, let's talk about, you know, you and I are capitalists when Judith Miller served eighty seven days in in prison. I believe I'm connection with. Valerie plame and and then she got a one point, two million dollar book deal out of it right. Then I, I'm not saying I would go to prison for eighty seven days for one point, two million dollars, nor am I saying that you know. I'm just saying that the journalists have a trade dole, send Thomas. There you go, we get, we get there. I will coach you in the best crime to commit so that you have the cushy est jail stay for for patriot. So you know, look like it. It's a situation where the professional and the financial incentives and you know, and let look, let's be fair to the journalist, right? Like the reason that this mythology exists is because that's, you know, that's what you get taught at at journalism, so so to go back and answer the question, I think if you said that to a confidential source, he that source would just say, okay, fine. I'm gonna call somebody else. And there's there's never a shortage of journalists who are willing to take that phone call and you're gonna find somebody who's willing to give it to you without conditions that that's my kinda sad take on it. Yeah, yeah. So it makes sense. I dunno still everybody, you know, unite, journalists unite and make maybe the new panel. We have a bunch of journalists who listened to the show, and I think everybody knows listening to this show how pro investigative journalism we are right, but this this is a case where it seems to me. And again, I'm open to being wrong if somebody works for the New York Times, listen to the show wants to write in and tell me, I've got it back. I would love to be wrong on this because I keep unanimous. Yeah, I subscribe to the New York Times. I love those, right. You know. So they're doing great work in this, but this seems just a clear cut example that they are being manipulated by somebody in the Trump White House to lay the seeds to fire. The last honest man in in Trump world, and that's, that's depressing. Yeah, wow, long. Glad you. Yeah, I wasn't quite sure what to make. Make of all that, but now that you put it that way, it makes sense. So Rosenstein vehemently denied all this, right? Yes, yes. And that does seem believable when you put it that way. All right. Well, so what about though, because things are getting heated and who knows if this will work like it sounds like potentially the scheme of giving Trump some excuse to fire Rosenstein could work. What happens, you know, who's up next will the will the investigation be safe. Take us through some of those questions. Yeah. So first who's up next as it turns out, there's a law. It's not just, you know, sort of custom and practice. There's a, there's a codified statute, Twenty-eight USC section five. Oh eight. And the duties of the attorney general devolve I to the deputy attorney general then to the associate attorney general followed by these. Solicitor general, and then followed by assistant attorneys, general as designated by the attorney general. We're going to get to that in a minute, so. Okay. Rosenstein gone. Who's who's the associate attorney general turns out nobody. That that and the reason that it's nobody is because that position requires confirmation by the Senate last officeholder. The last holder was Rachel brand. She was regarded very, very conservative federalist society type, but somebody who was regarded as independent. But she decided to resign in February of this year to go take a job as head of global corporate governance, whatever that means at WalMart. So brand is out. The position is vacant. It is currently being filled by an acting associate attorney general, who's a guy named Jesse Pacheco. He's thirty seven years old. He is a Rick Scott crony Ed, but it all that doesn't matter because he's going to get bypassed there is there's no requirement in the law, but long standing tradition. Bishen at the department of Justice is that win? You are only in the position because you are acting than when the mantle of succession comes to you. It skips over you. Right? And so that happened when acting attorney general, Sally Yates was fired than the next person up would have been again, the associate attorney general, but and then the solicitor general, there was no associated attorney general. There was no solicitor cheddar to time. There was only an acting solicitor general, and he was then skipped over to go for the US attorney for the eastern district of Virginia, a guy named Dana Puente so so the fact that this thirty seven year old Rick Scott loyalist is the acting associate attorney general, doesn't matter. It's gonna skip him. It's going to go to the solicitor general who is a guy named knoll Francisco. So this is another to be to be appointed. Solicitor general. You have to be confirmed by the Senate. He was confirmed fifty to forty seven in 2017 that is three, no shows that means every democrat was opposed except for Bob Menendez who is on trial for corruption at the time. Yeah, we, we got some winners on our team don't where he was acquitted. So, yeah. He's still appears to be a crook. Every Republican was in favour, except for Thad Cochran and a guy named Jerry Moran from Kansas. I actually had to look up his first name because I did not know who the junior Senator from Kansas was. I don't know why those dudes weren't there, but but they weren't there. It was a straight party line and the the worry in confirming Francisco as solicitor general was that the solicitor general represents the interests of the United States before the supreme court. And the concern was Francisco was too much of a Trump loyalist to really independently occupy the position Francisco is very, very smart. Arch conservative clerked for Antonin Scalia and for Michael Ludwig. Who is Ted Cruz favorite judge and favorite potential supreme court? Nominee. He did work on the Florida recount team that I was on behalf of George W Bush back in two thousand that I was invited to be part of. And then and then went to work for Jones day which we're gonna talk about in a minute. Prior to being named solicitor general, nor- Francisco had been to the supreme court on three specific occasions. He won the major nine victory. He represented corrupt Virginia, Republican, governor, Bob McDonnell, and we've talked about the precedent set by the McDonald case quite a lot on the show. That was the case that that in which the pharmaceutical executives had given McDonald's wife for coats and given Bob McDonnell like they rented him a Ferrari showered him with money. But because all McDonald did was you know, sort of introduced them around the supreme court. Like I said, nine, nothing endorsed the position that that was not a quote official act under the bribery statute, and it made it virtually impossible to to pursue. Bribery convictions. Look, if you can't convict Bob McDonnell, you can't convict anybody, and it was Francisco who argued on on that side and look like very clearly made a brilliant argument. He also argued an NL our case arguing successfully that the that the statute curtailed the scope of Obama's ability to make recess appointments. And he argued as as kind of a follow up on on one of the, the hobby lobby cases, he argued a Burwell case case was consolidated into the Burwell cases back when the supreme court only had eight justices on it, arguing for that religious nonprofits needed an exemption from the ACA for contraception purposes, right. Today's episode is brought to you by Harry's razor. They are incredible shave high-quality for an affordable price. You don't let me tell you a little stories. Kind of funny when I was in college, I was at a university that you know, I was barely affording to go to the bunch of loans and some scholarships and stuff. 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What you wanna know is you can be a hard line conservative but still have ethics, right? What's he? What's he done? Yeah. Well, you know. As solicitor general, the most prominent thing that Francisco has done in my estimation is he has argued successfully on behalf of Trump's Muslim ban. And as I went through those proceedings, this I, I wanna point out this got some commentary at the time, so I did not discover this, but but I went through and went back to both the documents and the oral arguments because this was really. Very, very shocking to me and highly irregular for anybody arguing before the supreme court. So here's what friends Cisco said in court. Remember that the argument being advanced before the supreme court on whether to continue to enjoin the president from being able to implement the executive order that euphemistically called the travel ban that that bans immigration from six majority Muslim nations. And Chad was was the city of highly arc right was was the question being developed from the record that this really was motivated by animus against Muslims. That was the key argument that Francisco needed to dispel at the supreme court level, and here's how he concluded his argument. He said, quote, my final point has. To do with the recognition that if the president were to say tomorrow that he was, sorry, all of this would go away and that and that was he uses the construction, my brother's recognition and what he means is opposing counsel. Right? So so a stencil ably. Right. The other side said, if the president were to say tomorrow that he was, sorry, all of this would go away right then there would be no animus. And then he says, well, the president made crystal clear on September twenty fifth that he had no intention of imposing the Muslim ban and quote. That's a weird thing to say. And it was noted at the time the next day after oral argument nor Francisco filed a letter folks need to cut into tell you about our sponsor vistaprint, not sure if you know this about me, but I have a podcast or two and also attend conferences, conventions, that kind of thing. And there are all kinds of people who I might want to network with. And I do try to maybe interview or form. Professional relationship with the way to help make those connections, and also let people know that you're someone to be taken seriously and someone who is professional is to have a nice business card to hand them, and vistaprint is a great way to make that happen. The difference between making that connection and not could be huge, but the price to be ready for all of that is ten dollars because vistaprint can give you that confidence to be ready to make an impression because you can get a custom card with the colors, the font and the designs and the images U2.'s all for ten bucks with vistaprint. 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Nine use code away at vistaprint dot com. That's code away at vistaprint dot com. One more time a at vistaprint dot com. Make it happen. I'm going to upload a copy of that letter which I downloaded from pacer in which he says, oh, I misspoke. It shouldn't have said September twenty. Fifth, it should have said January twenty. Fifth now January twenty. Fifth 2017 you. You might recognize as a being Donald Trump's first week in office be being before the issuance of even the. The first order, right? Which is very, very different coming out and saying, I have no intention of imposing it right win speaking contemporaneous -ly about e. Oh three, right. The one that they were actually there to debate. And then here's what Trump actually said on January twenty fifth, twenty seventeen. He was being talked up. He was he was being asked about a prospective Muslim ban and and Trump's answer was quote, the Muslim ban we're talking about, no, it's not the Muslim ban, but it's countries that have tremendous terror. It's countries that we're going to be spelling out in a little while in the same speech, and it's countries that people are going to come in and caused tremendous problems. I do not read that as a crystal-clear intention that he had no intention of imposing the Muslim ban. In fact, I view that as rather evidencing the city of highly argument that this is the best you can do to try and say that there is no animus. That strikes me look, is that a an impossible. I would not argue before the supreme court like this right that that that is playing fast and let let's be a hundred percent clear. If I argued before the supreme court like this, I would be at Monash by the supreme court for misrepresent to admonished. I mean all on what supreme court talking about, is it a bunch of. This is real in front of nine, Ruth baiter Ginsberg's the the what I guess Ginsberg's is the pleura I wanted to make it a, you know, like a Ginsburg I or what, but in front of our coterie of Ginsberg's they would as one. Speak speak from the bench, possibly put it in the opinion that says, we are troubled by the representations of council for the petitioners who characterized, you know this statement as quote, you know, a clear repudiation when the record indicates that it is anything, but that's what they would say. I know this because when I was a young lawyer, I org you'd before the Maryland court of appeals in a case, and I felt I still do feel like I had characterized the record fairly but shading it to my client side. And the Maryland court of appeals said something like that in their opinion. They said, when in ruling against me, they said, we think you went too far in how you characterize this piece of the record. Taught me Tommy a very, very important lesson that has stuck with me. You know ten fifteen years ago that says. Says, when you are speaking to the supreme court, the highest court in in either the state or the United States don't get no hue. Very, very closely absolutely admit where you are on the facts. So that's interesting because we think about we think of it and maybe it's because of, you know, defense attorneys or defense attorneys or something like that where it's like, oh, you anything you can say for your client, like just, you know, blah, every argument take it as far as you can. You know the other way. And it sounds like when you're arguing before the supreme court, you know, maybe you're a little more cautious because you're gonna get publicly skull. Well, that's right. And and and you immediately see two things. Right? So the the first is why I made the mistake as a young lawyer, right? I was thirty. I was Ellis for my client. I again, I don't think it was an unfair characterization. I don't think I I, it went nearly as far as as Francisco did here while the Maryland supreme court of appeals, whatever. There goes wrong and and and and yet great that that is, but the the other side of the issue is remember that on appeal, you are bound by the factual record below as an appellate court, and you can only overturn those facts if they are clearly aronie ass-. So how those facts get characterized does does matter. It matters greatly. And so the court is very, very attuned to are you characterizing this, this fact. And this is of course the material fact at issue. So that's not a great sign. I, yeah, I want to head off because I have seen already. I think politico is up with the story saying, oh, well, you know, Francisco has a conflict of interest. He's obviously going to recuse himself. I wouldn't explain what this conflict of interest is, and my belief that he absolutely will not recuse himself. Well, especially after all Trump does is go after by the way, if you're if you're an evil cartoon villain, as these people are Jeff Sessions is like the most productive in terms of carrying out your evil plan. And yet he's probably gonna lose his job after the midterms in my opinion, because Trump is so angry that he recused himself. So I'm sure that would be somewhere in the calculus of whether or not people want to recuse themselves fide. I completely. So here is the allege. Conflict of interest Francisco was a partner at Jones day Jones day is a Covington and Burling style firm, right? They they may even be bigger than Covington Burling. They're huge. I have friends over at Jones day, right that it's it's an enormous. They've thousands of lawyers across multiple countries, right? Another law partner is Don Mcgann. White House counsel and Jones day continues to get paid for advising the president. They were the law firm that represented the Trump campaign and they represent Trump with respect to the Muller investigation. However, so long as an attorney is walled off, it is virtually commonplace for you know, you've got one corner of the firm doing this work for Donald Trump and it it absolutely. In my view would not preclude franscisco from saying, I never did any work for the president's campaign. I have no ongoing contact with Jones day. And so there's no problem. There's no conflict and you don't have to bypass me. And in fact, Doug, this up Francisco signed an ethics agreement when he was appointed as solicitor general. And the ethics agreement specifies that basically he gets he gets a lump sum paid into his retirement account because he's a partner at the firm. He hasn't given up his partnership there, and the firm is being paid by Donald Trump. And then it says for seven years, the. Withhold a portion of his partnership shares a reserve for account reconciliations and tax payments that the firm makes on behalf of its partners until all of these payments are made. He will not. He Francisco will not participate personally and substantially. In any particular matter that to his knowledge has direct and predictable effect on the firm's ability or willingness to make these payments unless he first obtains a written waiver, pursuant to statute, and the reason that I predict that Francisco will say that this walling is sufficient is because he's already done this in February of this year for in Cisco, initially, recused himself from representing the US in the travel ban case because Jones day has provided legal advice to the president regarding the travel ban. And we're in fact representing an amicus. A petitioner in a group that filed an amicus brief on behalf of the travel ban. And then after about a week, he decided to unrig us himself in that matter. So I do not believe that knowl- Francisco is going to recuse himself. If he is the next man up, if Rosenstein is fired, he will then assume jurisdiction over the Muller investigation there. There's another bit going around that says, you can't be acting acting, which is true for succession, but the the fact that it was the acting attorney general that I issued the order appointing Muller in my view means that the acting attorney general then has ongoing supervisory authority as Francisco. I made calls this morning because I, I realize we're trying to sort of piece things together. I called French. I tried to find out everything I can about Francisco to see is this guy a hack is this guy, and I couldn't find anybody who knows him well enough to to to tell me that from the inside doesn't look good. But and again, you know, there is. I don't know. I mean, I just I had the good fortune of knowing rod Rosenstein, right? If it had been, I'm sure there are other rod Rosenstein out there. I don't offend. He recent to believe that no Francisco is one, but sure hope he is. Yeah. Now what if something happens to Francisco, right? He's he, he develops an acute conscience or is hit by a bus cute case of ethics bets. Look, I'm coughing that's going around these days. Right? I have seen this is this the weirdest thing to me. Everybody is saying that the next man up after Francisco and they're all men necessary. I'm not being sexist. They just they just are is, is Stephen Engle who is the assistant attorney general for the office of legal counsel? I don't think that's correct. I think the people who are saying that are looking at a twenty sixteen attorney general order. It's order three, seven, seven, seven dash twenty sixteen. It was issued by then attorney general Loretta Lynch that says, office of legal counsel comes up next in the order of succession. But I think that's been superseded. I think that has been superseded by an executive order that Trump issued on March thirty first of twenty seventeen, which says, after you get past the solicitor general, remember I said, the statute says that goes to the deputy attorney general followed by the associate attorney general followed by the solicitor general. That's Francisco, followed by quote. Assistant attorneys, general as designated by the attorney general. Well, this Trump e o designates who those attorneys general are need to pause for just a moment to tell you today show's brought to you by back blaze back blaze is unlimited cloud backup for max and PC's for just five dollars a month. You can use it to back up documents, music photos, videos, maybe podcasts, recordings projects. Everything you can think of get the peace of mind knowing that all your files are backed up securely in the cloud. Never lose a file. 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So that means if you've lost terabytes of files, rather than wait forever to try to download them all, they will just send it to you in a hard drive right away overnight. The FedEx, I think that is the coolest feature. So far back blaze has restored over six hundred PetO bites and thirty billion files. That's a lot of stuff that people thought they had lost that they didn't back blaze is gimmick free. There are no additional charges. It simply five dollars a month for unlimited storage unlimited storage and full backups. Try back blaze by getting a fully featured fifteen day free trial at back blaze dot com. Slash open back blaze dot com. Slash open as. In opening arguments, so go there play around with it and start protecting yourself from potential bad time. Start today. Make sure you visit back blaze dot com slash open, so they know we sent you and they can continue to support the show. So wait, he can just do stuff through executive order. What are the implications of that? Can he just like whip one up to get whoever wants in the possessory. We're going to speak to that in a minute, but because the president is the head of the department of Justice, he can issue an executive order specifying what that order is that is allowed to be delegated to the department of Justice via statute. And his e o says, after the solicitor general comes the US attorney for the eastern district of Virginia, followed by the US attorney for the eastern district of North Carolina, followed by the US attorney for the northern district of Texas. And those are just three prosecutors. I suspect that there were Trump loyalists in those positions at the time, the. Forementioned Dana uinta I think was a Trump loyalist and that guy was the US attorney for the eastern district of Virginia. When this e o was issued. But now it's a guy named Jesus Acharya Torella Ghur which is just a fantastic name. Yeah, that's another one of those euphemisms that we have. Jeez. It is. I like to picture him this sideshow Bob's brother. But had he just seems to be a guy just a prosecutor, right? He started off as an intern in nineteen ninety nine. He he was a summer law clerk there in two thousand and five. He he clerked in the southern district of Florida just for a regular district court. Judge just like a lot of law school grads do not a not a huge conservative, think tank kind of guy, just a just a guy, and then he was appointed special assistant US attorney in the eastern district of Virginia was on a safe neighborhood. Task force, worked for the major crimes unit. He was assigned to Chuck Grassley Senate Judiciary committee for for about a year, but but that's not even that is not a huge indication that he is a Grassley loyalist. I've had friends that have served stints on the on various Senate committees. They will often take lawyers to to do research and and one of the big issues that that. Attorneys-general have been working on is trying to revamp the sentencing guidelines trying to move to something to to fix the problem of of non violent drug offenders. And that's something that you know, yes, Republicans are Uber tough on crime, but even there's some movement, even among Republicans in kind of realizing the the craziness of having literally millions of men and they're almost all men. They're almost African American men in jail, serving mandatory minimums for possession of marijuana. That's that's a real problem. So anyway. Tertre Willett or would be the next guy up as far as I can tell. And and boy, I like to imagine that that are willing is another rod Rosenstein. I certainly don't have any. I don't have any even the is evidence that he isn't. He just seems to be somebody who likes being a prosecutor and it looks like a smart guy and and I'm, I'm watching. I obviously, I hope rod stays if it has Kurt position, that's that's the best possible outcome, but but keep your eye, keep your wilder. So there you go. Yeah. Keep your eyes on the tour. Willer everybody. All right. What else do we need to talk about in terms of this this mess? I mean, all this is just because Trump really wishes. He could fire more. And he somehow can't as much as he can do with everything else. Again, executive order all this stuff and fire different people, but he can't fire Mon and not only can he not fire Muller. So the the case that makes it clear that Trump cannot fire Muller is a case called x. partee Hennion and it is from eighteen thirty nine. Okay. And we've, we've discussed how the president is at the head of the department of Justice. The department of Justice is an executive branch. Therefore he can fire the attorney general. That's true, but because Muller was appointed pursuant to a statutory provision the the Hennion case, because it really clear that he can only be removed by the department head and not by the president, bypassing the department head in the department head. In this case is the attorney general that case, the Hennion case has been cited numerous. Times the pest nearly two hundred years since it was decided including recently in a case PCA OB versus the f. which is a case from twenty ten. I believe that is good law. I believe that that Trump cannot fire Muller directly. He will have to get his attorney general to do it as any general Jeff Sessions is recused. So his acting attorney general, that's why this is crucial. But the acting attorney general the the attorney general here can't just fire Muller on a whim. Either the the provisions of the CF are which is the regulations interpreting the relevant statute. It is twenty eight. CF are six hundred point. Seven. It says special counsel may be disciplined or removed from office only by the personal action of the attorney general, right? So that confirms the expert Hennion reading that I just gave you the attorney general may. Remove a special counsel for misconduct, dereliction of duty, incapacity conflict of interest or for other good cause including violation of departmental policies. The attorney general shall inform the special counsel in writing of the specific reason for his or her removal. So that's the next layer of protection, right? If they are going after Muller. Yeah, we'll be what kind of Bs reason or excuse can they find to fire Muller? And then and my next question would be, who enforces that? So let's say they get to that level and they make up some crap. Oh, we're firing Muller because of the rigged witch-hunt. He's gone off the rails and they just make up some nonsense who is there anybody that can say that's nonsense? Yeah. Well, that would go to the courts. Yep. That would be the supreme cabin rapists court. And then they would say that I okay. So that goes. Sorry, I, it's going to be really hard for me not after Kavanagh's confirmed to just refer to it as the supreme rapist court. I know that's unfair to six and a half to seven of the justices, but but yeah, so yeah. But remember before we get to the supreme court, we go to an ordinary US district court for the district of Columbia to issue a writ of mandate MOUs and or an injunction that says, no, you can't do that. And I think that will be front and center that this is if it is a pretextual reason, there will be at least a public lawsuit. So you know the the concerns I, I am very, very concerned. I do not want to downplay this in any way whatsoever. Okay. If Rosenstein is fired, we should riot in. The streets we should. Absolutely. It should be. I was going to call this when when I thought Rosenstein was going to be fired today, this episode was going to be called the Monday massacre we did an episode on the Saturday night massacre and and this should be treated no differently. It is transparently an effort by the president of the United States to get rid of the investigation. The legal investigation that has led to third more than thirty indictments that has led to guilty these criminal convictions, serious bad guys out there and and we should not stand for it. That being said, we have seen that this president is willing to do an awful lot and cares very little about the law. And if the news is tightening, you know, maybe h-have like a cornered animal and may undertake these these actions and and what I'm trying to do. We do this very infrequently on the show, but I always look for the options is to say it's it's not a foregone deal, right? If if Trump has Francisco or somebody else, and I'm going to speak to somebody else in in a minute fire Muller that does not mean that White House vans show up or Trump private security vans show up and start feeding stuff into shredders right. That does not mean them. All of this goes away. Muller has the ability to fight back at that point and and and he will. He will get a lawyer and we'll go to the courts seeking an order. That his dismissal is contrary to law and arbitrary, and and that will be a legitimate substantive fight. And and whenever we have the ability to undertake a legitimate substantive fight in the public, you know, there's, there's still hope there. Yes, ultimately that is going to get resolved by the supreme court? Yes. If cavenaugh makes it onto the supreme court, it will be a highly partisan supreme. There are lots of reasons to think that there there's bad stuff going on, but there's still reason to believe that there is still some hope. So that's that's an additional layer of protection that that's there. I hope it doesn't. I mean, hopefully, you know, hopefully we're doing this. We're working everybody up blade on a Monday early on a Tuesday and and everything blows over and Rosenstein goes into Trump's office and say, what when I first saw the? Oh, Rosenstein is going to resign. I thought I really, I mean, I don't know the guy, but I, that sounded really surprising to me. It seems like he would want to make Trump fire him. But then again, that's me thinking is a democrat. I don't know if he would, you know, because it would be it would make it. I think a lot easier on Trump if he just resigned because that's Trump is a coward and doesn't fire people, and they just hope they'll leave. But what is your read on that? Do you think there's ancients he would have just like lay down and just resigned, or do you think he's going to make Trump fire him? I don't know that I read it as Rosenstein seeing a difference between being forced out I resigning and and publicly making Trump fire him. There is an argument to be made that for purposes of the federal vacancies reform act, that there is a difference between whether that they can see arises. Naturally, that is because Rosenstein dies or resigns or unnaturally. That is because he's been fired by the president come. I wouldn't want to go through that argument super quickly because I'm not persuaded that it is not. I'm not entirely persuaded just mean publicly like it's it's easier PR perspective. I didn't mean like the technicality of. Yeah, will and I do want to. But I mean, you have to say, obviously, if Rosenstein, you know, take an extreme example tomorrow. He gets up and says, family reasons, I got to leave the post, you know, obviously that's going to be easier on Trump publicly than no. I agree with that. I think that if and so if if Rosenstein were to concoct a reason like suddenly developed a need to watch, you know, my daughter's softball like, yeah, yes, that would that would surprise me for all the reasons that we've described. And so I think the what it's called. Called right. Like in in the legal community, the, you know, I resigned slash. I was fired. Like I, I think, given his background that that he's likely to think, well, as long as I don't back up the you know story, it's it's really the same kind of public public perception, right? Everybody knows I'm getting forced out so yeah, but but what would be the advantage to him too? Right on, I don't think there would be one, and that's why I the first reports that went around. Yeah, yeah. So make him do it. I don't get it making fire you. I, I hope I hope that that was another one of these inaccurate. I think I think it was because we saw that out of the New York Times the morning. And then as the news developed over the course of the day, we didn't see that anymore. So you know, we're all speculating at this point, but, but but I do want it does kind of point the way to sort of the last legal issue which is we talked about the. Accession, but there is a way for Trump to leapfrog over the succession. We actually covered this way back in one twenty six when the former director cordray of the consumer financial protection bureau resigned. And then there was a power struggle between the person who is next in line Leandra English and the person that Trump wanted to appoint Mick Mulvaney and we know how that turned out because Mick Mulvaney is head of the CF PB and Leandra English is still a litigant in federal court who's lost. So how'd it? Mick Mulvaney get to leapfrog out of another governmental agency to head the CFP. And the answer is by virtue of the federal vacancies reform act which allows, here's here's the terms. It says, if there's an officer of an executive agency whose appointment office is required to be made by the president and with the advice and consent of the Senate. Right? So acting attorney general deputy attorney general would fit this category, right? Dies resigns or is otherwise unable to perform the functions and duties of the office. Then the president can appoint one of two classes of people. He can either appoint somebody who has already been appointed to a federal office by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, which is what covered moving right? Or he can appoint somebody who holds a GS fifteen or higher office who during the three hundred sixty five day period preceding the date of death, resignation or inability to serve the officer served in a position in such agency for not less than ninety days, right? So in other words, Trump can take a huge pool of people and appoint them as the temporary head of the executive agency. While he is finding a permanent. Nominee and he can appoint them for two hundred and ten days or if longer the period while his nomination is pending in the Senate. Right? So in other words, you can't Merrick garland around this, right? Like if somebody's at two hundred nine days, you can't continue to hold out the the, the Senate nomination. The acting nominee would would get to stay in that position to one hundred ten days, obviously long enough to get through the mid terms long enough to do whatever Trump's dirty work is. And the question here I read you, the statute you immediately sort of see there's a preliminary question of, can you does that statute let you leapfrog over the normal succession that's provided by other laws? And that answer, I think is really, really clearly, yes. We saw that with the CFP and the DOJ has issued a memorandum saying, yeah, if. If if there is a vacancy, the president can leapfrog around that with the federal vacancies reform act. The larger question is what if the vacancy is a vacancy that the president himself creates by firing somebody, right? And I want to say that this is not a, it's not a frivolous argument for the reasons that we're always talking about on this show, right? Which is you want to consider the practical consequences of how laws were together, right? So if the president could just start firing people and bypass the Senate confirmation process, right for two hundred and eighty days, two hundred ten days at a clip that would evade all of the procedures in a dozen other laws that say when you have these high level executive agencies, they've got to be confirmed by the Senate, right? And instead you can just get right. You just keep firing people and just putting new people who are not confirmed by the Senate, moving them up, letting him surfer too. Hundred ten days getting another guy right? And and the the it is really clear from the legislative history that the vacancies reform act was meant to give the president the flexibility to deal with. You know, somebody dropped dead on the job right? If if if you could create the vacancy in every executive branch office, then fill them with people who are never confirmed by the Senate at all, then you know that that really seems to be taking the law in a direction it was. It was never intended to go. And the Ressam evidence that in the abstract Trump would like not to have a court battle about this right in March of twenty eighteen Trump fired. The secretary of the veteran's affair of the veterans administration's David Schulkin and named the undersecretary at the Pentagon, Robert Wilkie to serve as acting secretary under the Yarra bypassing the VA succession by statute. Veterans groups brought a lawsuit to say, you can't do that you, you can't use the VR a when you fired somebody and then the White House immediately backtracked and said, no, no, we Schulkin wasn't fired. He resigned and they did that as a way to kind of insulate another layer in in the statute, and then Shokhin came out today. I resigned. And so it mooted the lawsuit. So you know, look, you can read that as saying the White House was concerned about litigating this issue, or you could just read it a saying, what's the path of least resistance, but but that does it does loom out there. A lot of people are saying it will make a difference, and I don't want to sign onto that. It's not a court decision, but but if Trump tries to put into crony and Rosenstein was fired, there will be a lawsuit and. And it will not be a frivolous lawsuit because of that core principle. But but I am not as confident as some sources that are saying there is an ironclad distinction between if Rosenstein is fired or if he resigns, but but to the extent that there would be a meaningful difference, it would be over Trump's ability to use the f. ERA to to leapfrog and put a total stooge in as as acting and deputy attorney general. So that's the significance. Okay. Well, again, I think the PR significant agree with you on that. I totally than that because the difference between stooge and was Francisco, like I don't even know how Cindy significant that difference would be, but all right. Yeah, as usual win. Andrew has a lot of bullet points under the segment for Rosenstein. We that fills up the whole episode so I don't think long time to get too much else. But cavenaugh, geez, they're going people are going. Testifying this week, and I'll be glued to the screen for sure. Is Anita hill two point. Oh, and and I guess we'll see if anybody's learned any lessons. Do you have any quick thoughts? And I'm sure we'll address that on. I, I would say, let's address on Friday. We probably still will not be able to react to the testimony because that's gonna come after we record on Thursday. Yeah, we'll see if we can figure something out. I don't know. I will say there looks to be some momentum towards the Feinstein position of, hey, look, we, we gotta slow this down. We've got to put this on hold. That's been the game all along. Right? We've said this from the beginning right McConnell wants to ram this through quickly as possible. There are outstanding documents on, I guess, on Friday, I will talk about the the legal status of the pending lawsuit, which we tease. There's there's a whole lot of reasons out there to to kinda wanna slow things down. And and I think that that's starting to break with the American public of, hey, look, we just, you know, maybe maybe we're ex, maybe we're why, but, but there seemed to be things that are worth finding out and that to me that does not seem like a hard argument to make. So if you want optimism on cavenaugh, that would be that would be my optimism as well, that that maybe there's some movement towards, let's not, you know. Let's let's turn off the rocket boosters on this thing. I don't know about that. All right. Well, we'll we'll have plenty more update on Friday, but for now we've got to thank our new patrons over on patriot dot com. Slash law, hope you enjoy that CUNY coming up a lot of movies, the ad free episodes each and every time. So let's think our new patrons Kevin and Tae Jess. You can stop offering me your patriotic feed. Oh, good. Yeah, that's thank you. Josh McDonald, sir. She Rory was great and lady bird. Yes. Was that sir? Seriously wrong or something? I forget pitched pitched boy k. eight. Rb Curtis, Crawford Zach, Fisher ca, Penske practice, Matt, Carbajal or carbohydrate. I dunno Nippon Gunda word Dana, Ryan treks ler registry matters toad. She crowed no owed ago for shadowed. That's exa one p one percent and and overworked coke dealer on Pennsylvania. Comes back. Remember. Thank you to Ryan McCormick, Lauren Briggs timber that is spelled with an RA. So the tone of voice not the tree-felling. Martin white came for away, signed up for lawful movies. Good work. Yeah, we got a new one coming out into the month. Judy de Tankred tied up in Kevin nuts. Alexa said volume to eleven. Cleaness Seth, Alan, Ferguson, John Halen, towed from Mario Kart. Aaron, McCullough and Rico law. I love our patrons. I love it. Good stuff. Thanks so much for the pledges. Keep them coming pitcher dot com. Slash law in now, this is the longest I've had to wait to find out whether or not I got a question right. This was seem like a tough one who, how do on t. Not this week. Oh, no, social, this firm has ever failed the bar exam. No kidding. Yeah. TT number ninety, four. This was a constitutional law question. This was congress passed a statute directing the US forest service to issue regulations regarding campfires. The forest service issued a regulation that was maybe arguably not entirely related, but says that the schedule of penalties would be doubled for any negligent or prohibited USA fire if the user is under the influence of alcohol or drugs. So kind of a potential Chevron angle here. But the question actually went with which the following arguments best supports a finding that the rule is constitutional and you went through so a was that the executive branch has inherent rulemaking authority. You ruled that one. Out which was good does does not have inherent rulemaking authority over public lands article. One section eight clause seventeen gives congress the power to provide for the regulation of activity on such Lance. So let that was that was dead wrong, good elimination on a skip be, which was your answer. We'll get to that in a minute. See you said the see said the rule is justified by compelling government interest in safeguarding forest resources that that is also incorrect, good elimination. That would be a good reason to four congress to issue a law, right? Because it is showing that is compelling government interest, presumably under the interstate commerce clause, but has nothing to do with executive rulemaking has to do with congress delegating rule rulemaking thority to the forest service Di was the rule relates directly to law enforcement, which is an executive rather than legislative function. And hence does not need specific congressional authorization. I think this was the best attractive distracter you ruled it out correctly. So I am happy to say the the executive branch is is, does indeed have authority over law enforcement. But this was not about law enforcement. This is about the forest service. So that left be your answer that the rule was issued pursuant to valid exercise of Congress's power to delegate rulemaking authority to federal agencies. Absolutely correct. You thought it was the most straightforward turned out to be the right one. Yeah, this means you are now fifty five of ninety four. That's fifty eight and a half percent. You got one more to give you need five right out of the next six. These are are, are playoff run right here? And this is I am super excited for Friday's episode. I know the question that's on deck and I can't wait to hear. Curia tackling. We do know I have one more real property in there somehow. One more could could be that could be something. It's not as though it's not as those hard. The rest of the bar standing on their head, right? Yeah, yeah, I really this one I didn't. I wasn't. Yeah, I wasn't sure, but I just really wasn't in love with any of the other. It's just didn't quite seem right. So I'm glad I just picked one that seemed true, and there you go. Got lucky. All right. Well, I've relieved tell us future Andrew, or should. Andrew, actually, because we're, yeah, current, Andrew, whoa. Step out of that time machine. I'm gonna go with not only a losing entry, but a repeat of former winner skeptical seven FU who that is at skeptical s. k. e. p. t. l. the number seven t h on Twitter, who's this this? The greatest thing. I think anyone has ever done for TV. She says as now well established that there's no loss. A dog can't be a lawyer. I decided to recruit my puppy this bar exam question. It is a door -able skeptical. Seventh put four treats on four pieces of paper labeled ABCD. The puppy makes a beeline for the sea incorrect answer, but I really want to see more animal related efforts to answer TV. So yeah, every give talk about in a time. I got. My cute puppy adorable dog. You know what happens when you put four treats on four guesses and and well, they eventually I was gonna say, quite a category pick? Yeah, the cat just looks at you and says, no, I don't think so. Mix? Yeah, right. The crap maybe all for the next. The Catholics clown horn noise. So a bunch of people. Yeah, the dog really fell for that. The rule is justified. All right. You're not a real law dog. If you for that answer, a bunch of people did get it right. They deserve some shout outs, but they didn't give an answer with a cute puppy in it. So you know, so they can't win. Sorry. Congratulations, great winner, great entry. That was fun. I bragged about the fact that someone had done that because it was just the fact that someone did that with our show. I love it. It's great, share it out. All right. Thank you so much for playing congratulations to our winner canine winner. And also thanks so much Andrew for a rapid response. Tuesday don't often get that, but we got that here and we'll see you for a rapid response Friday very soon. Law. This has been opening arguments with Andrew in Tom's if you love the show and want to support future episodes, please visit our patriarch page at patriot dot com. Slash off. If you can't support a spinally, it'd be a big help. If you could leave us a five star review on I tunes Stitcher or whatever podcast delivery via clean us and be sure to tell all your friends about it for questions, suggestions and complaints, Email us at open arguments at gmail.com. The show notes and links on our website at WWW dot open argh dot com. Be sure to like our page on Facebook and foes on Twitter at open arcs until next. This podcast is production of opening arguments, media, LLC, all rights reserved. Opening arguments is produced the help of our editor, Brian Egan, Hagan production assistant, Natalie new at our unofficial researcher magpie a special. Thanks to the moderators of the opening arguments, Facebook community, Natalie, Elisha cook, Eric brewer, and Emily waters, and also thanks to Thomas Smith who wrote and produced all of the amazing music you here which is used with his permission.

rod Rosenstein Donald Trump president supreme court Trump Francisco acting attorney general Muller attorney United States executive Rosenstein Rosenstein Andrew Torres Jones Rosenstein the New York Times Senate department of Justice Thomas Smith
Continue the March (w/Aimee Carrero, feat. Andrew Torrez)

The Daily Beans

1:28:26 hr | Last week

Continue the March (w/Aimee Carrero, feat. Andrew Torrez)

"This. Means? Hello and welcome to the daily beans. For Friday July thirty first two, thousand, twenty today, the Gross Domestic Product is down nine point, five percent and the second quarter economy takes the biggest hit on record is trump tries to distract us with a tweet calling for a delay in the two thousand twenty elections. Gun Maker, REMINGTON FILES FOR BANKRUPTCY Lane Maxwell's final attempt to block her deposition that the free case against her and Epstein is denied. Denied, though she is given to Monday to speak to an appeals court intelligence disputes among the gang of Eight Democrats against Republicans who refuse to release Election Interference Information Ruth Bader GINSBURG is back in the hospital for a noninvasive procedure. Herman Cain dies, of Corona, virus after attending trump's Tulsa rally and the DC Circuit Court of Appeals agrees to rehear. Judge Sullivan's efforts to scrutinize bars decision to drop its case against Flynn I'm your host Eiji. Everybody, we are drowning in news today, but we will not be dissuaded. We will persist today. I will be talking to Andrew Torres about the disposition of the case against Michael Flynn, and I just realized that I referred to Attorney General Bar as it I, used that for his Pronoun in the introduction I Apologize, Sure. If you know, I don't think bill bar has his pronouns listed on his twitter bio. I'm assuming it's not it. Because originally, it said the Department of Justice and I failed to change that. So my apologies. But I will be talking. About that case later on today and also today we have the happy hour livestream meet-and-greet where we will be joined by celebrity guests, Josh Guilt, Sir to answer all your Skoda's questions and today's guest host will be there who's joining me now for the headlines Aimee Carrero Amy, how are you? I'm the one that's like secretly chuckling in the back. Yard. But Oh, my gosh, there's so much news. Remember when we didn't have this much news back in lying God. Even I don't even know yesteryear you. Yeah. When all we had to worry about. Tan Suits and grey Papun. Exactly. Yeah. I. Can't wait for Sleepy Joe Biden to be president because it's GonNa be sleepy. AG. I'm going to get some sleep. And I'm really excited about it. So I don't I don't think that that nickname is a bad thing. Lane either listen I would kill the get hours of sleep. There was a there was an earthquake recently in Los Angeles. So I haven't slept since I saw that was trending on twitter when wasn't Good a little was this. No, I guess early, really early Thursday morning at four thirty in the morning. I woke up with my dog in my head in my arms. Meanwhile, I love my husband behind in bed. So I can fend for himself, but my dog, and I were going to be totally safe. So yeah, just weird. Really Weird native can. So it's always A. Might be getting divorced medicine. The priorities come out. I. Haven't looked it up. Do you know how strong it was four point five, which is think technically considered a minor earthquake but it. Felt like somebody picked up my house and punched it. Yeah. That's what it felt like bananas. The biggest earthquake I was in was the Easter quake here in California in San Diego it was a six point something. And we were all outside in the hot tub and we're at a hotel visiting my mom, right. So we're my mom's hotels hot tub, and all of these out of town people were there for some gymnastics tournament or something. Oh non-californians. Right. And this was a roller it went on for like a good ask and it was strong and people were freaking out. We felt it here I. Think we felt it here. Yeah, and like two thousand eleven or some tunes ten or something. Yeah. Something like that. Yeah, and everybody was freaking out and. Me and my mom, and my friends are like, what do you think? What are you give it a six, point? Four, six, point five. Yeah, I give it that. Pretty Oh. This is look the waters move and everyone's like flipping out. Knows how it goes, I would have been. Yeah. You you were. You're definitely prepared, but I would've been one of those freaked out gymnast, not just because of the earthquake by who knows. Why Because, you're also gymnast exact. I'm also a child gymnast. That's why. Well. I tried to be in gymnastics and then I was five foot seven and they're like time for you to go. So. Anyhow, we have. As you could tell by the headlines, we have a lot to get to. So let's hit the hot notes. Hot Notes. All right. The lead today despite what you might think I, think the lead story is today. The lead story today is actually the economy. Economic output fell at its fastest pace on record last spring. This past spring has grown virus pandemic force businesses across the US to close their doors and kept millions of Americans shut in their homes gross domestic product. The broadest measure of goods and services produced fell nine point five percent in the second quarter of the year, the Commerce Department said. Reported this on Thursday and on an annualized basis, the standard way of reporting quarterly economic data, the GDP fella rate thirty, two, point, nine percent. That is the biggest drop on record It's unprecedented speed and breathtaking in its severity according to the New York Times, the only possible comparison in modern American history came during the great, depression, and the demobilization after World War Two, both of which occurred before the advent of modern economic statistics. So we can't really compare those apples to apples. Unlike past recessions. Yeah. This one was a result of a conscious decision to suspend economic activity to slow the spread of the virus which has all been squandered. Because we're right back where we were. but Congress pumped trillions of dollars that have now been wasted into the economy to sustain households and businesses limit long-term damage allow for rapid rapid rebound. The plan worked, I don't want to say all over the money was. For Not because the the unemployment and the the rent moratorium and the stimulus money, which was not enough. But all of that was very important to to keep people fed and the lights on. And you know they're planned to dump billions and trillions into the economy worked at first. But because cases of surged in much of the country. Sort of. Square one data from public and private sources indicate a pullback and economic activity reflecting consumer unease and renewed shutdowns. Vote in another world, a sharp drop in activity would have been just a good necessary blip while we address the virus. This is Heather Boucher. President of the Washington Center for equitable growth and progress. Oh, there's this up like a progressive think tank. She said from where we sit in July, we know this wasn't just a short-term blip. So that is what's going on with the economy. Well, here's the thing you know. How do we just done this correctly, like so many other countries and shut down for the amount of time that was appropriate. We would have absolutely taken huge financial hits, economic kids. But now it's I. Think it's this is so much worse. This this kind of shutdown everybody's sacrificed those weeks and then we opened up way too early, and now it's like those sacrifices are necessary again and it just I mean I just can't help thing. This is a complete failure of leadership like this isn't just like who would have thunk it recession. It's actually like we were completely in control of this and we bungled it. Yeah. Exactly. Right. I. Mean we were calling for this back in February. Right. When I saw a McNeil Douglas McNeil on motto he's got shut everything down at six to eight weeks will be cool. But we have to shut everything down and we sort of half ass shut shit down in the president and we're a masks. There's a bunch of Mass Kohl's out there. My freedoms and you know a and so now think some states didn't even shut down I mean, I don't think some sheets states shut down completely either. No, it was just like this. Totally half, ass. One hundred percent had done nothing meanwhile like I've been in my house, March, it's getting pretty stuffy in here. You guys. Stay home if you can, and where you're damn mask, but I don't know what what's going to happen and from what I am seeing and you might have more updated information than I do. But I is another stimulus. Package coming I mean what's going on? Well, the Republicans, just put out their plan, which of course cuts. The unemployment to seventy percent of what you were making before the pandemic because, hey, you can make less than below living wages and get by they thought twelve hundred dollars was going to last. US. Ten weeks twelve weeks so. I. Mean, that is just insane insanity. Yeah, and and so they spent trillions of dollars to do that and and because we didn't shut down to completely. But you know now if they had just listened to what the Democrats proposed. Ten weeks ago, we wouldn't have to have a redoing of the stimulus package and had we down. We would be at the point now where we'd be overflowing with PP and test and and. All the all the shit that we need. But no. Trump wanted to politicize it. It reminds me of, okay. Do you remember the People's Court member when judge. Maryland million took over, hell. Yeah. WAS THAT ON UPN? Think so yeah, and she had a saying and she would say it in her native language. But the I don't know what it isn't her native language, but in in English it's the cheap comes out expensive. Yet. Yes. I yes. Totally. Now, we're working doubly suffering doubly because we did a half ass job the first time. We're going to have to spend six trillion dollars on something that should have cost or could have cost four trillion and I know people elect two, trillion dollars, smites couch change. But you know gots, that's how Republicans think. Right, and the number of new America, it's Thursday. So means the job numbers are out, which means the number of Americans. Filing new claims for state unemployment benefits is out and that total was one point four, three, million last week that's according to the Labor Department nineteenth nineteenth straight week that tally exceeded one million and unheard of figure before the pandemic and it. It was the second weekly increase in a row after nearly four months of declines. This is a sign of how the rebound in cases as undercut the economy's nascent recovery claims for the previous week told her one point, four, two, million. So it's on the way up for the past two weeks and it will continue to go up unless we get our shit together. Oh Man. I don't know I've just. Like if you really want to feel so bad about. The future I just sit, say go on twitter dot com and just read some of the things that people are right i. just you just can't even make it up. You really really can't. So I it breaks my heart that this is where we're at because it was so unnecessary and the worst part about it other than the people that are suffering and dying is that I don't even think people realize. Realize that it was unnecessary, I. Don't even know how history will remember this I mean you know hopefully, history will remember this as a total fucking failure response. But the people who are living at now I. don't even know if they see it. Yeah. You know I guess we can rest easy knowing that even when politicians get it wrong or when the media gets it, wrong history usually gets it. Yes. But it takes so long. But then of course, it's also whitewashed. So what the fuck are you gonNA do. Now. Here's another story for you, the gang of Eight. Is Engaged in an unusual and bitter partisan fight. Over how much information to share with the public about election interference, and this is why lawmakers and administration officials seek to prevent a sixteen style meddling from foreign countries, the public spat between the Democratic and Republican sides of the gang of Eight. And, you know this is like, but we only have ninety six days to the elections. This is highly unusual for the gang of eight. Usually their obligations rise above the political fray, they rarely descend publicly into partisan squabbles. the fundamental disagreement between the Democratic and Republican sides of the gang of eight centers on how much information about foreign threats should be made public and guess who wants to keep him a secret and guess who wants to be transparent. I'll give you two gases. I one doesn't count. So Democrats. Of course of urged for more transparency Republicans warned about the dangerous precedent that would set you know letting the American people know. Anyway. Dangerous to let us know what's happening. It's it's like someone's trying to break into your house. Let's not tell you who though or that they are right. Like, like somebody's monitoring the security cameras land guys trying to break into the house. Should we tell her? I don't know that could set a dangerous precedent. Let's not and we would have to tell other people, right? Oh. Man I. Wonder How truly what is the downside I mean Mike? Let's pretend that. Let's pretend that they have a good reason. But like what would be the downside of letting people know that it would just be too sensitive. The intelligence would be too sensitive for or that it would cause panic or what? Yeah. I probably I would assume and I'll though this is not what's being said, but this is sort of what happened with the Obama Administration they were concerned about. Helping. Putin. Give Americans a lack of faith in the electoral process. Right now, fuck you every. That's already happened. That's already have a lack of faith in everything right now. Can we just see it all exactly with the cards on the table and then just reset? And then have have somebody just fucked. Tell Kick Putin out. Come on. We just do this. I. Mean. It is safe to say that Americans have lapsed faith in pretty much any election moving forward until somebody figures out a way to tell us the truth about what is going on and and you know it just seems to be so tied up in this in politics and it shouldn't be i. mean like. Like truly this is like what the founding fathers, who had many problems, but the one thing they were so fucking scared of the one thing that they went through pains to ensure didn't happen was this exactly, and so it's just so ridiculous that on the one hand, the founding fathers and we hate the sixteen, thousand, nine, hundred and project our founding for great. But then are unwilling to see through the foundation. Of. Our constitution like don't let people get in here. Give give the right wing people a document and they'll cherry pick. It gives the Bible given the constitution s given the law. and. They'll pick the parts that serve their interests and fuck the rest. It's like when I talk about, you know, what are you going? Do Bill Clinton's involved in the Epstein. Case I'm like fucking send asked jail. What do you think? I'm one hundred. That's the difference between me and you you think I'm do. You, think I'm you know I'm over here. So No. No Democrats, go to jail for you know raping kids. No, I'm for it. Fuck you. I hate that all right now here's a speaking of Epstein. A federal judge has delayed the unsealing of depositions in Epstein, former girlfriend, an alleged accomplice. Jisr Lane Gasoline. Maxwell to allow her. They're allowing her time. To appeal, it's released so. Basically what happened was? She did a last minute like they're going to release everything today all the depositions, and all this is from the two thousand seventeen case. It was settled in two thousand seventeen with Jew free, and and so they were going to release her deposition, a bunch of other documents and a bunch of other depositions and she did last minute filing, please no and. And, the judge Said Fuck you doing it tomorrow and then she made another plea and the judge said okay, you can have to Monday to discuss your concerns with the appellate court. But all the other documents and depositions are going to come out. It's just hers. This is US district judge read a Preska she denied Gillian's request to block the release. Of of. Depositions from two thousand. Sixteen civil. Lawsuit. But like I said, delayed the unsealing until Monday. So Maxwell could ask that court to review the matter and that's according to court documents. The deposition Maxwell's legal team is fighting to keep sealed is connected to a twenty fifteen defamation case. by Jew, free like I said WHO claimed Epstein sexually abused her while she was a minor and that maxwell aided in near abuse The case was settled. In two, thousand, seventeen, we don't have any information on that, but our waiting today and I think they have until eleven fifty, nine, a tonight, boy release. Those things. Well, correct me if I'm wrong. But this is like it's a pretty small window, right like I mean, yes, she she. She did say, okay, you can take it to an appellate court, but that's a pretty small. Right. It's pretty small. Give on her partner and I'm judges. I'm a little confused too because I thought that was an appeal and it was denied and so I think she wants to give her time to maybe appeal it to a higher authority, give it to a higher court, but she's giving her 'til Monday two to discuss the matter with the appellate court which it's. It's confusing. The whole thing is just the whole thing. Just kind of reeks because it's like, all right. She gets the treatment and I'm not even seeing its preferential, but I'm saying like she gets time to discuss with her people like you know how they wanna go about keeping these documents that that may paint her in a bad light away from the people like it's just. Just I. Don't know if they would afford they afford. You know a black person, this kind of treatment or lat next person or any other kind of minority. I don't know. It's just really. So bizarre, no I in fact, you know that that question came up to bill bar when he was asked about his commutation of Roger Stone in his interference in Flint sentencing recommendation. And his backing up to get. Judge. Flynn's case dismiss, and they're like of all the cases you presided over. Can you tell me one other one? Any other case where the defendant pleaded guilty twice? And you. submitted a document, a briefing asking for the case to be dismissed. One. Just name one. Just one other thing even if it's a white dude, any other white dude nobody? No one. Okay. Crickets. Yeah. I. Mean that was like my favorite line of questioning the whole day because it really put him. You know he's got this weird I. Know we're not really talking about bar, but he's got this weird on. On ability to just kind of I, don't know make everything seem so normal like he. He himself looks like a perfectly logical person and but but then you realize he's doing these horrible things and you're like, oh wait maybe this is what maybe this is. How people like get you know confirmed wink until like falling for schemes because when when I was watching his Senate approval hearing way back when. I don't know I didn't buy it, but I was like Oh. Okay. We'll doesn't seem like this guy is going to be tampered with, and here we are. He's he's the one doing tampering. Yeah and of course, he's got this nonchalant was. So why should I meant like? Why should I literally said that I? Mean, I'm like, Oh, the Q. attitude towards the like his job, and and of course, there was just the way just his demeanor when he was being questioned. By Democrats specifically, women specifically people of Color especially women of color he was just like. A. Hand on the side of his face leanness. Chin. Like Yeah. uh-huh. Whatever like when Escobar was talking to him or John Paul and you're. Just like, why are you such a fucking, Dick? Like I talked to l. e. hone yesterday and he was like if I was his lawyer I'd be like look you can keep saying whatever you want to say. But could you not just look like a? fucking asshole. Literally, give give them like give these. Do the taste of their own medicine. Smile honey. It'll make you look a little more appealing, pat. I used to have to my boss used to have to tell me because in meetings. At work if was saying something dumb, I would have this look on my face like and my boss elbow me like straight face straight face. That is amazing. Yeah, it's it's rough. It's really hard when people are you know? This this sort of like What's the word? Is it brash? Brassy or Sassy, you're in front of like live cameras. He's to be seen by millions of people and you really don't give one single fuck. It's it would be a talent if it wasn't so evil. You're absolutely right. He's, but he is steeped in dripping with Evil One last evil story that just came across my desk. Here? Because I have a desk and stories that come across it because. Older. There's a Ken clipping. Stein got a couple of documents internal documents from the Department of Homeland Security internal. Legal Guidance and he's put this out in the nation, and at this apparently this and I'm looking at the legal is right now it. Tells officers from the Department of Homeland Security, they would not be held liable for teargassing journalists. As long as they weren't directly targeted, now, of course, Bill Bar has denied using tear-gas, right? Right. Isn't it illegal or like against you know the rules? Yeah. Geneva Convention, apparently, it's. Not that they give a shit about that. Yeah. Cool. With him yet says if a journalist or legal observer is incidentally exposed to crowd control devices after remaining in the area, you will not be held liable. incidentally means that the journalist legal observers while not the target of the crowd control devices still ended up being exposed to the crowd control devices because of where they are located, so you should tear gas canister. Is Only. The person that it landed closest to the one that you're liable for hurting like I don't even understand that fucking concept. Especially, wait hold on to get the member. One Bar said yesterday about the arrests of. Anonymous. Officer snatching people off the streets of Portland. said. Well, if you're in proximity to other wrongdoers, then that's probable cause. So it works for him on that. To violate people's fourth amendment rights but this. It's cool. We, need to get a up there asking these questions because you know. Honestly, this is just if you're writing. Okay. So I this is my only point of reference, an actor, what do I know, but if you're writing like the worst hallmark movie of all time right about this and you're like I, know the villains going to do this. He's GonNa put out a memo. That's you know what I mean that says like well, if those so and so just so happens to be caught in the in the tear gas like this was this idea wouldn't even be greenland like. Losing strict. No, I can't even imagine pitching it like a but yeah, but then. then. They do a close up on his face, the guy who issued a memo when you hear done done dumb commodity to. Be Great Yeah. You'd be laughed out of the Pitch Room. You truly would, and it's just it just keeps getting worse and worse than like a and I don't and I don't know, I, mean, at this point, you know we've got earthquakes. We've got murder Hornets, we go. We got. We got a pandemic I. Mean. Is this the end of times like I just need someone to read up on whatever literature we have on the end of times and let us know. Well we got a hold on property up because I, it's it's GonNa, get worse before it gets better always get starkest or the night or yes. Before the done. Did I just say it always gets darkest at the end of the night. I. Always. Listen. The night always gets the darcus before it's over. So just know that. I love that like, agee's news. Yeah. I'm going to hang it up next to like but first coffee in my kitchen. But. We we have an end goal. We only have. What would you say ninety seven days until election day? Ninety, six, ninety, six. Yeah. So it's GonNa be it's gotta be hard, but it's the last bit of the sprint and we are the last of the memo. Marissa I'm mixing metaphors, but we can do it. We'll get the baseball across the goal line. And have a good night sleep for the first time in five years A. Absolutely and I do have to warn you though after the election, those three months that he's still in office could be pretty gross too. So just hang on buckle up. We'll be here for you. Amy, thanks for joining me today for the headlines Thanks for having me, I, appreciate it. Everybody, stick around, we're going to take a quick break, but we have more headlines I know there's more I'm sorry but we do have more right after this so stay with us Through these messages will be. Daily beans, listeners, this is ag in this episode of daily beans is brought to you by Sun Basket. These days many of us are focusing on. Our health staying safe and boosting our immune system. 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With Tomato, cucumber salad and blueberry. Apricot. Pork chops with Sauteed Kale. You can order from any recipes across the menu. You can skip a week if you need to or double up on your favorite and sun basket facilities have the highest level. Of Food and employee safety, they reinforce strict adherence to operating procedures and increased standardisation frequency and their distribution centers to protect you. You're in their employees and right now, and basket is offering thirty five dollars off your order. When you go to Sun Basket, dot com slash daily beans and enter Promo Code daily beans at checkout. Go right now to Sun. BASKET DOT COM slash aliens and don't forget to enter Promo Code daily beans at checkout for thirty five dollars off your order again, that basket dot com slash daily beans and enter Promo Code daily means. Hey, everybody. Welcome back couple other headlines from today, Herman. CAIN one time Republican presidential candidate, former CEO of Godfather's pizza. You'll know him as that. He has died from coronavirus, and this is according to an obituary sent from his verified twitter account. And newsmax where he was launching a television show. CAIN seventy four, he's been hospitalized earlier this month and his twitter account said this week he was doing well being treated with oxygen in his lungs. It is unknown where Cain contracted the corona virus though he was present at Donald Trump's. Rally rally in Tulsa and has been an advocate for not wearing a mask. And also Supreme Court Justice Ruth. Bader. GINSBURG is resting comfortably in New York City hospital after undergoing a medical procedure to replace a bile duct stent will extent maintenance that stint was placed last year and that's according to the supreme. Court quote Justice Ginsburg underwent a minimally invasive non surgical procedure today at Memorial Sloan. Kettering, Cancer Center in New York City to revise a bile ducts don't was originally placed at Sloan Kettering August. Twenty. Nineteen. And that's from the statement from the court. Wednesday night according to her doctors. Revisions are common occurrences and the procedure performed using an endoscopy and medical imaging guidance was done to minimize the risk future infections, the justice resting comfortably and expects to be released from the hospital by the end of the week. And John. Lewis the conscience of the Congress was laid to rest today. Former presidents, Bush, Clinton and Obama all spoke at his memorial service and it was absolutely inspiring with all three along with the speaker of the House and many many others encouraging us to continue the march and to get into trouble. Let's hear clip from what Obama had to say. President Clinton. Didn't have to because. It was the law when he arrived. So instead he made law to make it easier people registered about. But. Once the Supreme Court weakened. The voting. Rights. act. Some state legislators unleashed a flood of laws designed specifically to make voting harder. Especially by the way state legislators where. There's a lot of minority turnout and population. Growth. That's not necessarily a mystery orange. Excellent. There was an attack on what John Four? It was an attack on our democratic freedoms. We should treat it as such. If politicians want honor John. And, I'm so grateful for. The legacy and work of. All the congressional leaders who are here. But there's a better way than statement calling them here. You want of John Let's. By revitalizing the law that he was willing to die for. Naming of the John Lewis Voting, rights that that is A. Fine tribute. But John wouldn't want us to stop. They're just. Trying to get back to where we already were. Once, we pass the John. Lewis voting rights that we should keep marching. To make it even better. By making sure every American is automatically registered to vote including former inmates who've earned their second chance. By adding polling places. And expanding early voting. and. Making. Election, day a national holiday. So if you're somebody WHO's working in a factory. Or you're? Single Mom who's got to go to her job. And done, get time off. You can still cast your ballot. By guaranteeing that every American citizen has equal representation in our government including the American citizens who live in Washington. DC, and in Puerto Rico. Americans. Lending some of the partisan gerrymandering. So that all motors have the power to choose their politicians, not the other way around. And if all this takes eliminating the filibuster. Another Jim Crow relic. In. Order to secure the God given rights of every American. Then that's what we should. Even if we do all this. Even. If every bogus. Voter, suppression laws struck off the books today. We've got to be honest with ourselves the too