20 Episode results for "Chillicothe"
Chillicothe, Missouri, the town that invented sliced bread
"Hey history lovers. I'm Mike Rosen wall with retro pod. A show about the past rediscovered, it's probably best to just come right out and say it this episode is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Okay. Okay. But I really am here. Believe it or not to talk about sliced bread the history of sliced bread. Let's take a road trip down US route thirty six to the town of Chile coffee, Missouri. It's a long flat ride stretching for two hundred miles across the farmland of northern Missouri. Connecting Kansas to Eleanor on the route is called the way of American genius. Because some of the nation's best known innovators in creative minds spent part of their childhood in nearby towns. Mark Twain, Walt Disney. For ages chillicothe e a town of nine thousand five hundred felt left out. It was located along route thirty six, but as far as anyone knew nothing had been invented there. Equal status. Then in two thousand one a local journalist combing through microfilm of old newspapers stumbled upon a slice of American innovation long overlooked by local residents and state historians. The headline on an old news clipping said sliced bread is made here. That headline was on the front page of the chillicothe constitution Tribune on July. Six nineteen twenty eight the day before the chillicothe baking company, we become the first bakery in the nation to sell machine slice n wrapped bread to customers. Other bakers said it couldn't be done without the bread losing its freshness. But in the same year that Disney created Mickey Mouse, just months before the great depressions, Sheila coffee proved them wrong. Chillicothe? He may have been the first town to make slice bread. But the person who invented the bread. Slicing machine was actually an Iowan auto Frederick Rohwedder. Rohwedder didn't sit out to becoming mentor. He had a degree in optics and operated jewelry stores and Saint Joseph a town about seventy miles west of chillicothe on the side tinkered with the design for mechanized bread slicer in nineteen sixteen. He sold his jewelry business and moved back to his hometown of Davenport, Iowa to focus his energy on the slicer. Many makers oppose the invention. The Reuters friend Baker Frank bench of chillicothe Missouri had fallen on hard times and had nothing to lose. He bought the invention and the rest is history. The product was a hit customers appreciated. The convenience inability to make uniform sandwiches. Chillicothe newspaper ad promoted the breakthrough as quote, the greatest forward step in the baking industry since bread was wrapped. And so now, we finally know the answer to what was the greatest thing before sliced bread. I'm Mike Rosen wall. Thanks for listening special. Thanks to Susan HOGAN who reported the story for the Washington Post for more forgotten stories from history. Visit Washington Post dot com slash retro pot.
Joan of Arc Posthumously Acquitted / First wrapped, automatically sliced loaves of bread sold - July 7
"Expanding X by is than just fast. It's Internet. That gives you peace of mind security because if it's connected. It's protected. Yeah, even your robot back you. Can Your Internet do that? Learn more at extremely dot com slash by. This is DJ VLAD and I want to check out the Vlad. TV podcast since two thousand and eight Vlad, TV has been the leader in art, getting no-holds-barred interviews with the world's biggest rappers singers. Hollywood stars professional athletes and former big time criminals, and now you can catch all of our full length interviews available audio podcasts, so listen to the Vlad TV podcast on iheartradio APP apple podcasts, spotify or wherever you get your podcast. Everyone it's eaves, just wanted to let you know that you'll be hearing episode for me and an episode from Tracy v Wilson Today Hope. You enjoy the show. Hello and welcome to the PODCAST is July seven Joan of arc heresy conviction was overturned on this day in fourteen fifty six, although by that point, she had been dead for twenty five. Years Joan of ARC. How she's known English. In French, she is generally known as yen dark. She grew up during the one Hundred Years War, which actually spanned more like a hundred sixteen years was a war that at its very basic level. Boil down to who gets. gets to rule France. She grew up in. This is territory that was right on the edge of what was controlled by France, and what was controlled by emotions and roughly speaking when she was young, she started hearing the voices of three Saints Saint Michael Saint Catherine and Saint. Margaret and they told her that she should come to the Ada of the French Dr that was Charles Davao. Walk, he would later on become Charles the seventh, the King of And she did. She followed what those voices told her to do. She went to the defense stronghold in May of fourteen, twenty eight, and the captain told her to leave, she did was she was very persistent. She came back a few months later. She made her journey disguised in men's clothing and this time they actually let her in. Some theologians questioned her the idea that she was hearing voices that were religiously oriented that raise some suspicions ultimately though these theologians advised the defend to let her do what she was asking to do, which was to try to lead an army to try to save France. They gave her a small. Small Army she went to Ohio on April twenty-seventh of fourteen, twenty-nine early out was besieged by the English avid time, and while these English troops were distracted on the West. She came in from the East what she was doing was more about inspiring. The people than actually being a strategic leader of the military movements themselves this process continued she actually wound up being injured in a battle on May seventh, immediately went back to fighting after being bandaged up, and the English were eventually driven out of Orleans, so the Hundred Years War as its name suggests it went on a very long time. The of battle shifted back and forth during. This and it had not been going well for France in recent years, the population of France and especially areas that were occupied by. That people were down trodden. They were exhausted, but this victory and And Jen's leadership really started to to turn the tide back in favor of France. This is the first of a series of victories, and the fan was eventually able to be coronated in July as king after a series of other battles Joan was actually captured in May of fourteen thirty. She was sold the WHO put her on trial for heresy and witchcraft. During this questioning, they gave her a lot of confusing and deceptive questions and sometimes one where there was really no right answer at all. There was also a lot of focus on her wardrobe. Their passages in the Bible relating to how women shouldn't quote where that which pertain unto a man came up a lot, she. She had been wearing masculine attire during this service to France. She was eventually condemned to death, but when that happened, she recanted her testimony. She agreed to start wearing feminine dress again a few days later though she was found to be wearing masculine attire, and she said the Saint Catherine and Saint Margaret had appeared to her, and they had told her that she was wrong to give in to what the church had told her to do that. Being to dress properly in their minds like a woman, she was burned, have steak and as a relapsed heretic, not actually for witchcraft. The fact that she had relapsed into her heretical ways was what caused. It was on May. May, thirtieth of fourteen thirty one. It is not totally clear exactly how much influence that she had on battles themselves, but she definitely inspired people. The work that she did was what eventually helped Charles become the king of France. He had not intervened during her trial, but afterward in part because this heresy conviction maybe could have undermined his claim to the throne. He had had such support from her. That connection became very suspicious. He helped get her sentence overturned. Posthumously, a trial of rehabilitation was convenient. It ultimately found her innocent. There's ongoing debate today about the cause of her visions where they came from, but now she's recognized as a saint in the Roman Catholic Church, she is. is a national hero of France and of course she is an object of respect and admiration among women who see that she was able to make a place for herself in this way in the very masculine world of military service during the Hundred Years' war. Thanks to Eve's code for her research work on today's episode and Tari. Harrison, who edits all of these episodes, you can learn more about Joan of arc or Zen dark I on the April. Twenty second two thousand nine episode of Steffi in History Class and you can subscribe to this day in history class and apple podcasts. God casts and wherever else you get your podcasts tune in tomorrow for a famous sermon. Extending ex by than just fast. It's Internet that gives you ultimate control. The X. Y. APP. You can pause the Wi fi at the push of a button. Can Your Internet do that. Learn more at extending dot com slash X. by. Working from home. Conference, calls. On John with everything we have going on right now. It's never been more important to sleep. We need while we sleep is a natural immune booster, and only the sleep number three sixty smart bent sense. Your movements automatically adjusts you covered and support on both sides your sleep number setting so all those other things we're doing to stay healthy and happy well. They'll work better to and now during the lowest prices of the season, the Queen Sleep number three sixty four spot, only twelve, ninety nine save four hundred dollars, only for a limited time to learn more go to sleepnumber DOT COM. This Day in history class is a production of iheartradio. Hi I'm Eve. Welcome to this day in history class, a show that reveals a little bit more about history day-by-day. The day was July seventh nineteen. Twenty eight. The Tiller Kaci Baking Company in Missouri I wrapped package of automatically sliced bread. Auto Frederick Reuter was a jeweler who owned three jewelry stores in Missouri. But in nineteen twelve, he had also started working on creating a bread slicing machine. At the time people either baked their own bread or bought whole loaves of bread from the bakery when they wanted a slice of bread had to cut it themselves. That wasn't a terrible task, but it was inconvenient since it was time. Consuming slices were heart to cut uniformly. Rohwedder created several prototypes, his bread, slicing machines, but in nineteen seventeen, a fire at a factory in Monmouth Illinois destroyed his blueprints and a prototype he built. It took him several years to get back up and running. But as he continued working on the design of the machine key realized that he would have to incorporate into his invention a way to keep the Feis. Brad fresh sliced bread goes stale faster than bread. That is not sliced. He began designing machine that sliced and wrapped bread pins held aloft together inside the bag. In Nineteen, twenty seven rohwedder filed a patent for a quote machine for slicing an entire loaf of bread at a single location which he received in nineteen, thirty two. But he sold his first machine to his friend and Baker Frank Bench of the chillicothe. Be Baking Company. On July. Sixth Nineteen Twenty eight the Tiller Kathy Constitution Tribune printed a story that said the chillicothe baking company would begin selling sliced bread the next day. The article explained the slicing process and the benefits of precise. UNWRAPPED BREAD! There is not crumbling, and no crushing of the low, and the result is such that the housewife can well experience a thrill of pleasure when first sees a loaf of bread with each slice, the exact counterpart of its fellows. So neat precise are the slices and so definitely better than anyone could possibly slice by hand with the bread knife that one realizes instantly that here is a refinement that will receive a hardy and permanent welcome. Clean mate sliced bread as the chillicothe copy baking company called it was successful. Customers were a fan of the conveniently sliced bread and demand for Rohwedder slicing machine grew. The first bread slicer broke down after about six months of heavy use bakery. But some bakers were still skeptical as some loaves did not look neat enough. Baker named Gustaf, pop and Dick Bought, Rohwedder, second machine, and worked on improving its design and function his modifications, put the bread and cardboard trays and wrapped in wax paper. Though sliced bread was growing in popularity the Great Depression in nineteen twenty nine. Rohwedder had to sell the rights to his invention and the micro West Coast Company of Bettendorf Iowa purchased his bread slicing machines. He became vice president and sales manager of the company's Rohwedder Bakery Machine Division. In nineteen thirty wonder bread began to sail commercially produced pre sliced wrapped loaves of bread, making it popular the US. Pre sliced bread. It was banned during world. War Two to preserve food and metal, but the band was lifted two months after it began. Sliced bread had become a staple in households around the country. July seventh eighteen eighty is also Reuters birthday. I'm used coat, and hopefully you know a little more about history today than you did yesterday. And if you're so inclined, you can follow us at T. The I H C podcast on Instagram facebook and twitter. Thanks again for listening and I hope you come back tomorrow for more delicious muscles of history. For more podcasts from iheartradio visit, the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. I'm Alex stone and I have a new podcast. Let's get into. It is all about tackling the stuff you and I. WanNa know each week. I'm joined by a friend and a wisdom tree and we discuss. Know about money. Love Your relationships, even fitness and mental health I love having conversations with my friends, and now it's your turn to get in on. Listened to Alex, Iona. Let's get into it on the iheartradio APP apple, podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. Successful people full of crap I'm John Roya I'm an entrepreneur who went from being broke at Twenty eight to millionaire twenty nine to having a mental breakdown at thirty, and then writing a book about the whole experience. My mission is to talk about the grey areas of success like burn out mental health and all the crazy stuff that happens behind the scenes that no one gets the see. Here on my new podcast. The John Rowe is show. I'm going to explore the roller coaster of life in conversations with the most successful people in the world like creative leaders, celebrities and Moore's artists. You'll hear raw hyper honest conversations that are guaranteed to inspire entertain and educate. Listen to the Jonrowe show every Monday on the iheartradio, APP apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts for more info. Go to Roett DOT COM. That's R. A. DOT COM.
The Greatest Thing Since Sliced Bread
"You've probably heard the expression that something is the greatest thing since sliced bread well. Did you ever wonder what the greatest thing was before sliced bread or why? We measure greatness in terms of sliced bread well, there is an answer to these questions. Learn more about why sliced bread is so freaking amazing on this episode of everything everywhere daily. This episode is brought to you by the Travel Photography Academy. Have you ever been on a trip? Wondered while you're photos. Don't turn out like the images you see in travel magazines. If you're going to spend thousands of dollars on a trip and hundreds of thousands of dollars on a camera, you owe it to yourself to get the highest quality images from your trip. That's why I created the travel photography academy. I set out to travel around the world in two thousand seven with an expensive camera and I had no idea how to use it as. As I traveled around the world I told myself the art of travel photography, eventually mastering it to a point where I was named travel photographer the year three times in North America the travel photography academy is an online course that teaches you everything you need to know to master your camera and to take better photos on your next trip to improve your photography and to get better images on your next trip visit travel, Photography Academy Dot Com or click a link in the show notes. been. Baking bread for well over fourteen thousand years. Earliest evidence of human bread making was charged crumbs found in two thousand, eighteen in the black desert of Jordan, and it indicates the people there were making a type of flat bread that was probably eaten with meat. The world's first sandwich. Bread became the staple product of many civilizations in Asia Europe and Africa. Burden. Circuses were the staple of ancient Rome was how many emperors were able to stay in power. Bread has been called the staff of life and plays a central role in the rights of many Christian churches. When we dine with someone, we say we're breaking bread. Them suffice it to say that bread has been really important to human civilisation. Or Millennia humans made loaves of bread by hand and humans usually eight reasonably fresh bread on the day it was made. For as long as humans have been eating bread, we have probably been slicing bread, or at least cutting it with a knife, waiting patiently for the data arrive when humanity would be freed of the horrible burden of having to sliced bread by hand. Creating an industrialized way to slice bread and a cell. It is much more difficult than you might think. Cutting bread isn't like cutting would simply applying sharp blades to bread will usually squish it because the Berta so soft. Once the brightest cut you have to keep the entire loaf together or else you just have a bunch of loose bread slices flopping around which can easily disrupt a bread assembly line. The arrival of pre sliced bread arrived in July nineteen, twenty, eight in the small town of chillicothe Missouri after several failed attempts and losing his original blueprints in fire, an inventor by the name of Otto. Frederick rohwedder raided advice that would cleanly cut a loaf of bread into slices of equal thickness, originally trained as a jeweler, rohwedder did extensive market research for years sure that sliced bread would be a hit and it would make him rich. Invention did get a lot of attention. At first upon its release, the new sliced bread was a front page story in the local Constitution Tribune. The paper reported that so neat and precise are the slices, and so definitely better than anyone could possibly sliced by hand with a bread knife that one realizes instantly that here is a refinement that will receive a hearty and permanent welcome. To excess didn't happen right away. However, sliced bread wasn't considered the greatest thing immediately. One problem that sliced bread had is that it went stale faster because each slice was exposed to the air, the entire loaf could dry out quickly. Also people just. Didn't think that a loaf of sliced bread look very good compared to what they were used to. The loaves tended to slump and people said look sloppy. rohwedder develop seven patents between the Years Nineteen, twenty, seven and nine, hundred, thirty, six, all dedicated to bread slicing. After further refinements in the process rohwedder eventually sold the bread cutting machines to the continental baking company in New York City. They use the bread cutting machines on their signature line of bread. They called wonder bread. It was then that sliced bread really took off. Sliced bread took less time to prepare thinner more uniform slices made it easier to toast and the sale of pop up. Toasters took off as a result, it was the popularity of sliced bread, which made peanut butter and Jelly take off in the United, states as it allow children to easily make their own sandwiches without having to use a knife. By nineteen thirty-three just five years after it was introduced in chillicothe Missouri Eighty, percent of all bread sold in the United States was sliced. In the United Kingdom the first bread slicing machines were first installed in one, thousand, nine, hundred, thirty, seven at the wonder loaf bakery in Tottenham, England and sliced bread accounted for eighty percent of bread sells there by nineteen fifty. There was one setback in the history of sliced bread, and that occurred in nineteen, forty three during World War Two US Secretary of Agriculture Claude. WICKFORD placed a nationwide ban on sliced bread. Intent was to save metal and wax paper, which was used in the production of sliced bread for the war effort. There was a strong nationwide backlash to the sliced bread band, and it was quickly reversed in only three months. This brief history of sliced bread is fascinating, but it really doesn't answer the question why we use the phrase the greatest thing since sliced bread. In doing research for this episode, I couldn't find anyone who could give a clear answer. There were companies in the nineteen thirties and nineteen forties, which touted improvements to their bread by saying it was the greatest advancement in baking since sliced bread, these improvements were often in the form of packaging, vitamin, fortification and changes in the size of slices. A more general use of the term started to appear in the nineteen fifties in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, one American journalist Dorothy Gilligan writing for The New York journal American reported. That English actor Stewart Granger is the greatest thing since sliced bread. In one thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, two red skeleton, said in an interview. Don't worry about television. It's the greatest thing since sliced bread, so it seems that comparing things to slice bread was just something that happened organically over time. And then leaves us with one final question. What was the greatest thing before sliced bread? Well, we actually have an answer to that was given in the July six thousand, nine, hundred twenty eight edition of the chillicothe, the Constitution Tribune, which I mentioned earlier in the article, announcing sliced bread to the world they said, and I quote that sliced bread was the greatest step forward in the baking industry since bread was wrap. This is a brand new podcast, and as such you can really use your support. If you know someone who is curious and you think would like the show. Please share it with them. And if enjoyed the show, please subscribe on Apple podcast or Google, podcast real get new content for curious people every day and your podcast player and leave a five star review. More of US can help the show be discovered by more people and also please support the show over on Patriot on where you will get exclusive audio content, not available in the podcast feed merchandise such as t shirts, and you'll be able to submit ideas for future episodes until next time. Stay curious.
"Hey joe we talk a lot of a lot of game changing technologies on this show. Why don't we talk about a great product from one of our sponsors that has only recently started to change the game. Okay i am intrigued. We're talking talking about see by g._e. A new player in the smart lighting and smart technology space if you're hesitant about making the transition into a smart home you're not alone but thankfully see see by was designed for you. Okay so what's the deal. Tell me about it all right. We're talking about voice in app control bulbs that can be set to your schedule. We're talking about smart switches that can turn any traditional bulb into a smart one in short your one stop solution for smarter lighting. <hes> that's interesting. We learn more about jeez amazing new suite of c. by he's smart lighting products at sea by dot com. That's c. b. y. Dot com welcome to invention a production of iheartradio. Hey welcome to invention. My name is robert lamb and i'm joe mccormick and you know this episode. Episode is titled bread toast toasters because we're going to take you on an odyssey of human invention. I never thought about this is an odyssey but it really is generations rations. It's like two thousand one space odyssey it is it is but of course the middle part of that is toast so i just wanted to take a second for us to consider the slice of toast a thing that when done right is absolutely exquisite in its own right but also serves us an excellent base for so many other fine taste sensations. Wouldn't you agree. Oh i absolutely would there is a food combination that i. I don't know if it can be topped. It might especially be a southeast united states kind of thing but <hes> we're in tomato season. Oh now <hes> you know it's july especially getting into august peak tomato season and i just want to say as a message. Oh you young folks out there. If if you have never tried like a delicious like thick juicy vine-ripened farmers or garden garden tomato. You've only had tomatoes from the grocery store. You do not understand what a tomato tastes like like. It is not just better better to get a good form. You know summer tomato from farmer or garden. It's a completely different food yeah. Sometimes it looks like a different a <hes> different species altogether because it'll be like an organic tomato you bite a farmer's market will be kind of like weirdly grotesquely bloated-looking and have have lines on it. It's not as pristine as your you know your grocery store tomato but that the taste experiences is is beyond yes and so if you want to have the most perfect tomato experience there are a lot of ways people do people make appraise salad or just eat it. You know sliced with salt and pepper or something like that but here's some i'd recommend men get some good bread toast. The bread you know lightly toasted little bit of mayonnaise and fresh sliced summer tomatoes. That is the best meal l. you will ever have in your entire life. Oh i i believe it yeah. We've we've been doing a lot of these. We don't do bacon anymore but we've baked basically been doing bill tease back with sausage standing in for the bacon okay and it's and but with a really good tomatoes and it's fabulous but even without tomatoes i mean think of all the things that toast is great with i mean can you can put some marmalades butter on toast and as a home run avocado toast has been a huge hit in recent years and because for a great reason it is wonderful right ever caught. Her toast is basically just another form of buttered toast. Yeah because avocado is like better but it is exquisite taste getting a i'm also reminded of toad in the whole of your tone. The whole cut a hole out of the toaster. You put an egg in it. Yeah yeah it's great. It's amazing yeah so we're going to oh but before we get back to toast. What toast is we should talk about. What comes before toast and eventually we'll get into what comes before the hat but let's talk a little little bit about the other great wonder one of the greatest inventions the humanity has ever devised that being bred itself right and it's possible to argue that that bread is one of the inventions that made human civilization. It's sort of a culinary chemistry project because it's not something you find find in nature. Bread is a thing that certainly had to be invented and it's this thing that turned the seeds of hardy grasp plants into a scalable all staple food that could provide lots of calories to feed settled populations and big settled populations and before the cultivation of grain crops crops most of the time humans wouldn't be able to grow in store enough food to survive in large numbers in one place like in settled cities. You have to keep moving around and constantly foraging for food through the hunting of animals or the gathering of wild plants. The the the mainstream of thinking about the origins of cities and settled settled human population is that the cultivation of grasses yielding grain crops massively increase the efficiency of human food production so you could get like way way more stores of ready calories with less work and the the thinking usually goes that this is also what made possible the diversifying of human labour ever since not everybody had to be involved in getting food all of the time more people could be able to spend more of their time on other types of projects so crafts it's like pottery and weaving and the creation of tools and weapons and other technologies the education of children the creation of literature and music religious rights and duties. He's in all these other things that we come to associate with human technology and culture and there's certainly a case to be made the cereal crops in the bread that was made with them played a huge role in making all this possible that led to the modern world now as for bread itself of course there are a bazillion different ways to make bread right the most essential components components <hes> do pretty much all bread recipes are water and flour based on some type of grain from grasp plant like wheat so to make wheat flour of course you you gotta take the fruiting body of the wheat plan which is the <hes> the colonel or the seed and the wheat plant by the way if you've never actually looked up closed close to the part of the week that you eat wheat is a grass. It's like this huge toll grass and he's got this thing on the in. That's got the seeds in it. Looks kind of like a furry rattlesnake danielle l. at the top of the stall has got all these rattlesnake tails and you've gotta take those rattlesnake tails off get the seeds out of them and then process those seeds and grind them into a powder order and of course that powder is the flour and then to turn the flour into bread. You have to hydrate it with water and if this is like a flatter unleavened bread you can just just add any other seasonings you want and bake it as is in an oven or on a hot surface. This will tend to produce a course a relatively flat chewy bread like can like a pita or like like a tortilla but the most common type of bread were familiar with the kind we think of when we're making toast is of course bread that has some kind of leavening which is an agent that will create <unk> gas bubbles inside the doe that caused it to rise and these bubbles of course increase the volume of the doe they make it rise but they also give the bread a softer texture jour- and in the modern world we've got tons of different kind of ways of getting bubbles interbred. We've got chemical agents like baking powder baking soda and they create gas bubbles through chemical reactions that happened after the substances are added to the dough <hes> be can also create a kind of forced mechanical leavening just by like incorporating something like whipped ed white s- <hes> we're we're like the air whipped into the whites forms gas bubbles that expand when you cook it but of course the more traditional method of leavening is to use biological dialogical agents like yeast and here for for listeners of adventure and stuff to blow your mind. We bring things back to the fungal legions. Is this zog zaugg tomorrow yeah. This is the kingdom of zaugg boy awesome zaugg to moi comes in yet again with so many of our best inventions our zaugg to moi derive so a yeast of course is a type of single celled fungal microorganism found all throughout nature and even in on our own bodies and the strain most often used today is baker's yeast which is the fungal species saccharomyces suv ac- <hes> so bakers east actually also serves as the fermentation agen in the making of beer and wine so like when yeast consumed carbohydrates the yeast produce waste products those waste products include c._o. Two which is the gas ask that makes bread rise but they also include ethanol which is alcohol which of course that's what adds the alcohol content beer and wine when it ferments and i do think is generally true that that <hes> you know bread made with yeast is alcoholic to a small extent. It's not an alcoholic enough to get you drunk but right but it's but it's there yeah yeah <hes> and of course there's so many cultural variations of bread all around the world using different grains to make the flower like the different grains include like oats sir rye barley millet maize sorghum and you've got all the different cooking methods different leavening agents different seasonings. It's an entire world of cuisine zien. I mean i think there's a good reason that you've got like cooking and baking leg baking bread pastries and stuff too but like this whole other sort of half of the cooking world is focused on bread like things and is it any wonder that the some of the bread like things in taking on magical or spiritual <hes> potency yet be as part of a western christian tradition of <hes> of taking holy communion or certainly <hes> examples from mesoamerican culture where <hes> where the the use of maize in food products and in some sort of a flat bread and all was considered the you the body of a god. It was <hes> something you ate in silence because you are partaking of something holy. Oh wow will there. Is something mystical about bread because i i think i was hinting at this a minute ago but you know it's not apparent in nature red is something that was truly an invention and it's not like something you discovered discovered that was already out there waiting like yet to put together a bunch of different <hes> like steps in this process. You know you had to get the the seeds from these these grasses and you had to grind up into powder and you had to get that powder wet and make a dough out of it and if it's leavened bread you had to add some kind of leavening agent to make it rise or allowed natural yeast to get into it. Let it rise and then you had to bake it at the right temperature and all is just like is not something that's obvious so you have to wonder under who invented this like. Where did all this knowledge and process come from well. Let's talk about it. Unfortunately it's another one of those that is that that is is lost to history right. There's no known inventor of bread. It's one of these great world changing inventions like the wheel that we can get some clues about but which you know the the the ultimate origin vanishes into prehistory with no single point from which all of it comes but we do have some general knowledge about the origins of bread and bread lake products <hes> so for a long time it was believed based on artistic and archaeological evidence that bread emerged as a human invention roughly ten in those years ago and this would be during the neolithic period meaning the last part of the stone age and it would have been in a place called the fertile crescent now the fertile crescent crescent is this sickle shaped expansive arable land is land where you can grow crops stretching from the eastern mediterranean over in domestic attaima and and <hes> so from west to east it sorta starts down in the nile river valley in egypt and then it travels up along the eastern mediterranean coast through like israel palestine stein jordan lebanon syria and goes up through southern turkey and then it goes back down through mesopotamia threw a rock and parts of iran in the first wheat crops crops that were domesticated in in the fertile crescent to make the earliest bread during the neolithic revolution would have been <hes> in central grasses is like which is e. M. e. r. emmer wheat or i-in corn wheat. These are grasses that <hes> that are there basically other strains of wheat kind of like the we we grow today which is just not common wheat and i think it's not a it's not a coincidence that this is where many of the world's oldest and earliest civilizations arose rose meaning that even though there were people all over the world these are the places where people i started settling down in one place making cities with big populations and diversified economies. Johnny's in these cities had to be supported by grain agriculture and a lot of that grain was of course used to make bread and this is sort of been the story for a long longtime but really interestingly just in the past couple of years. It's been revealed that at least some humans were making bread thousands of years i before this neolithic agricultural revolution before all the farming in the fertile crescent started so the papering question here talking about this discovery every was published in p._a._a._s. in two thousand eighteen by omnia iran's otegi at all and so basically the story is like this a few years ago. There's this archea botanist. Somebody studies ancient plants named a amaya iran's <unk> open saying that right <hes> and she was studying being ancient human campsites in jordan and specifically she was looking at an excavated cooking site from about fourteen thousand years ago and this would have been a camp of a people known as the two fiennes who were a culture of hunter gatherers who lived in this area in the time between the paleolithic old stone stone-age in the neolithic. The more recent stone-age between these two technology regimes would have been roughly four thousand years before settled old agriculture started to take over before we believed previously that humans invented bread and then the vian survived on hunter gatherer basis they they did a lot of hunting in their fire pits and food waste sites were full of bones of wild animals that had been killed during hunts and eaten but at this particular site <hes> aranesp tag we also found charred remains of some kind of plant matter and so i was reading about how what she did she took it to a colleague named lara gonzalez <unk> carretero at university college london and they discovered that these charges food remains were breadcrumbs these hunter gatherers hours were making some form of bread thousands of years before we previously assumed bread had been invented now. The flour used in the ancient bread head had two main ingredients. It was i kn- corn wheat which is again. It's a wild strain of wheat grass and then it was the roots of club rush tubers which is a type the flower <hes> and then it was there were some other things in there also like some spices like mustard and other tracing gradients like barley and the researchers think think this dough would have been made to stick to the hot stone walls lining fire pits. I was reading an n._p._r. Article describing the discovery and a compared it the way that indian non bread is made to stick to the walls of ten doer of <hes>. I don't know if you've ever seen how that's made. No i've never seen this. I just always assumed assumed putting their flat like a pizza. No there's so there's like this vertical hollow oven. This got the fire at the bottom. It's extremely hot and then as the walls all around the sides and if you see the traditional way or i don't know if it's the traditional way at least the way a lot of <hes> like indian restaurants in kitchens will make the the non bread is they get the dough and the dose sort of goes on a hook and the hook. It's the dough gets flung up against the wall of the oven which is extremely hot and that's why you see like the blackening and browning you know the enron and the big bubbles nonren- because it's extremely rapid cooking. It's kinda like pizza making rapid expansion of the doe that makes these big bubbles in it and charge the underside underside and then it gets pulled off the hook and then of course it's delicious. I'm a big fan of non brow. Yes i love it. It makes me wonder what this fourteen thousand year. Old bread tastes like i mean i wonder if it was non. Brad probably not quite because i doubt they were putting butter on <hes> but but it's it's fascinating that this discovery is because when you think about it it reverses the order of technological adaptation that had long been assumed like like we long thought that people developed agriculture i which allowed them to grow large amounts of grain and having all the screen led to the invention john of bread and baking but this discovery makes it look like the opposite is the case instead ancient hunter-gatherers probably gathered grain from i'm wild grasses and figured out how to turn it into bread then they settled down and developed farming grow the grain thousands of years later on this model title baking preceded agriculture you had bread first and then farming that is incredible that i think about it now. In researching the origins of bread i ended ended up turning into a wonderful book by michael pollen that is also a wonderful netflix series titled cooked which i recommend either you watch watch the show it's fabulous but also the book is tremendous as well and is also available for a very reasonable price right now but he points out that a whole grain loaf is full of flavor and air so it's it's also it's also so much more than the sum of its parts he points out that if you gave someone the ingredients dance for bread and they had to consume them as as they they'd starve <hes> but give them the bread you know they're released the promethean knowledge of bread baking and they will eat and survive. <hes> you know it's it's you again. We have to just come back to take it for granted because it's everywhere but brad is it's almost like this this neolithic or paleolithic space shuttle. You know in terms of what it does invention. Paul has an excellent passage in the book read he discusses the invention of bread and he points out that the pre bread way of consuming these various grass seeds was to simply toast them on a fire or to grind them between stones owns in boil them into a very basic porridge <hes> quote and we should point out by the way that a lot of people throughout history that eight cereal grains as food staple did eat them in some kind of porridge form they have always been made into a bread a lot of times they'd be boiled in liquid right yeah so <hes> pollen on says quote the inert mush that resulted might not have made for inspiring meals but it was simple enough to prepare nutritious enough to eat providing us with the energy of of starch as well as some protein vitamins and minerals but of course then a at some point those ancient people began realized that you could do something else with this thick rule all because we can only assume they got tired of it you know as tiresome as it sounds right so they found that you could spread out the gruel on hot cooking stone and make simple unleavened flat bread or perhaps to bring back to our example. Throw it in on the side like splat it. Maybe somebody who's got sick of their over thick porridge one day and we're like screw this. I'm not eating it and threw it in their lo and behold <hes> flap rivers born but <hes> pollen rights and he he's talking. He throws the date six thousand years ago in in ancient egypt. He says that that roughly six thousand years ago in ancient egypt something happen. Perhaps someone left a bowl of porridge and a corner of the kitchen for a few days when you know that might have been what happened something like that but then bubbles began to rise upright the mass <hes> grew like a living thing doe was born orne and when it was heated in an oven it grew larger still quote springing up as it trapped the expanding bubbles in an area yet stable structure that resembled bought a sponge and so paul writes that it was probably seemed like magic at the time with the food increasing threefold volume you can imagine the fairytale tale this like the porridge that was forgotten and then grew three fold you know now of course the expansion is due to the air as we previously discussed but you know this this invention of bread this invention of baking. He says constituted quote the world's first food processing industry and i just want to read one more quote. He has from the book <hes> just summing up what we've been discussing here. Quote most foods even the whole hog are altered versions russians of nature's already existing animals and plants which more or less retained their form after cooking but a loaf of bread is something new added to the world an edge to object wrestled from the flux of nature and specifically from the living shifting down swamp that is dough bread. Bread is the abalone food so i love that just bringing out this the mythic quality of this and the idea again that that bread is an invention shen it is not part of the natural world is a thing that we made an invented out of the natural world bread is order out of chaos all all right. We're gonna take a quick break. When we come back. We will turn our attention to toast here invention invention listeners. I wanna take a moment to tell you about f- v._p. Stay tuned a multi system additive that keeps engines clean maintains fuel economy and stabilizes stabilizes fuel like no other product on the market f._t._p. Stay tuned can be added to any motor like your car or your lawnmower. Even your boat engines naturally perform better when they are clean and stay tuned is full of detergent to keep it running smooth and steady f._t._p. Stay tuned can add that extra muscle and performance. You've been looking for so take your engine engine performance to the next level. That's f. v._p. Stay tune. You can find f- v._p. Stay tuned at your favorite autoshop store or at f- v._p. Parts dot com. We're back so we've got bread. The next logical step is to make some toast. Let's discuss how that came about all right well. First of all it appears that toast is also a tradition stretching into the ancient world. We don't know for sure but it's probably i mean we just have to assume not much younger hungary tradition than bread itself right because in a way toast is just a continuation of the cooking process of bread <hes> by you know you slice it and further expose oppose the bread to heat scorching it and this of course <hes> we you know we do it because it contributes to changes in both the texture in the taste of bread so it further dehydrates the bread and and helps make it crisp which is useful for some some things we want but also the the flavor changes are big thing going on there you know toasting bread causes this browning of the sugars and the amino acids that make up the natural proteins within within the bread and this complex set of chemical reactions all taking taking place during browning is collectively known as the yard reaction and it's generally y brown food tastes so good like different versions of the same thing are taking place whether you're toasting bread or searing steak on the grill. The browning is the evidence of this huge suite of complex chemical changes that produce new compounds with interesting flavors and aromas that we associate with a roasting s toasting us nuttiness meeting s and all these other flavors that that are so good when we when we give food good browning but not so much when we blackened food completely and turn it into burned food right which tends deal l. to kind of bitter charcoal taste. Yes toast good burnt toast. No no it's not known for sure why toast was invented but obviously one candidate candidate explanation seems pretty promising to me at least for the invention of toast is that it began like so many other great culinary techniques like smoking and curing pickling as a method for extending the life of foods so we all know this right you have you have a loaf of bread in your house and the day you get it especially. If you get fresh baked the day and the day was baked. It's amazing. You've got this freshness window and the second day maybe it's still okay but like it's like a may fly if flourishes for a day or two and then declines as the bread gross stale and it takes on this unappealing taste and texture and here's where toasting comes in it's a perfect resurrection method for fresh bread that is no longer fresh toast. You know toast some less than fresh bread and it's a whole new thing right yeah yeah. It's a way of bringing it back to life. I can also imagine that if one were in a particularly frigid climate that it would make sense to resurrect your breadth might not not not only might be going a bit stale but it also might be a rather cold or even rock-hard yeah we need to be reheated for comfortable comfortable consumption yeah totally <hes> but while so of course of course toasting does remain a good way to resurrect bread that's fallen beyond its peak of freshness of course we we toast perfectly fresh bread is well for purely culinary aesthetic reasons reasons relating to the way it feels and tastes and looks and the texture and i it's just for enjoyment payment. We just like toast. It's good yeah. One of one of my favorite recipes again involves a tomato but also involves toast is panzer. Noah salad which is is <hes> which is rather a bread resurrection recipe in and of itself often calling for stale bread soaked in oil vinegar and this seems to date back to at least east the sixteen hundreds when an italian artist by the name of bronze zeno sang its praises but you also find rather recipes that call for like for for fresh bread that has hosted in the bread takes on in my opinion a very meaty consistency and i guess it's because you have these flavors coming together. You know you have some basaltic. You have some olive oil. You have the tomatoes themselves and then the the just the texture of the toast or bread. Yeah well toasted bread because it's undergoing the my arte reaction to a degree it gets that kind of row st flavor which in some ways tastes kind of media to us then also if you've got tomatoes in the salad tomatoes of a lot of glutamates and that's also something we associate with the kind of meaty taste but again the end result is like just another level beyond bread toast just feels that much more move from the you know the original grains that have been collected from these various grasses a ah. It's wonderful journey through human history. Now i guess we should maybe turn to the toaster because while we have some clues about the circumstances stances in which bread and toast arose. We don't know who ultimately invented them that you know that's just in the fog but we do have some indications about toasters in in history right well. We know where these came from yeah. Absolutely i mean obviously there plenty of very standard ways you chose to brad. Put it on a stick. Leave it on that baking baking stone grill it put it in one of these ovens that you've constructed and so forth but at least in the early nineteenth nineteenth century we begin to see specialized is toasting apparatus for toasting bread over or adjacent to open flames and many of these were pretty straightforward just a metal framework in which to brace slices faces of bread all at the end of along handle so you're not burning your fingers off and some some of these hearth toasters even swiveling mechanisms so that you could like toast one aside the bread than swivel it around and toast the others and these methods all were perfectly well today just as they worked in their inception so why invent a toaster in the modern sense of the word what well it all comes down ultimately to our busy lives in the kitchen and beyond the kitchen because the the beauty of the toaster or toaster oven is that it allows us to automate our toast making somewhat <hes> stick the toast in start the machine busy yourself with coffee eggs or what have you and not have to worry as much about the house burning down in the process. <hes> you know in a way we're talking about building towards toasting automaton or toasting robot right so a few key features factor and all of our various attempts to elevate toasting technology but the first and most important was to creation of an electric heating system to eliminate the need for gasser open flame yeah now we kind of take electric heating elements for granted today. Don't we don't realize that this was a difficult problem. At one point. Yeah it was trickier than you might imagine because you need them. Create a heating element. You know something that can be heated up doodling electric current but it also it has to it has to be able to sustain repeated repeated high temperatures and not fail you know it needs to be able to heat up he'd back in quebec down and up again in back down and and so you know that was something the people worked at four zero while in the history of making toast from the hague dot org the authors point to albert marshes nineteen o five a chrome filament wire with an alloy of nickel and chromium being like the key advancement here it was both safe and durable when heated by the electric current then in one thousand nine hundred six the first u._s. Patent application was filed for an electric toaster using marshes wire. This was by george schneider the american electrical heater company of detroit and then in nineteen. Oh wait general electric patented the general electric d twelve toaster and rolled founded out in one thousand nine hundred nine and this used marshes nitro technology as well and <hes> gail saudi has an excellent blog post about this this model at the college of charleston's architecture and art history club. It's <hes> it doesn't look like toaster. It looks like a porcelain as like a porcelain excellent bass in this kind of tesla coil looking trap uh top of it and looks like a torture cage just for bread yeah and gowdy drives on this item was a luxury it costs four dollars ninety nine which she says is roughly one hundred dollars today so this would i've been this sort of been something that the elite had. I just want to read a quote from her. Summary quote a general electric advertisement from one thousand nine hundred eight taken from the library three of congress depicts two well dressed women sitting at a table leisurely having breakfast with their d. twelve toaster complete with floral design and ceramic base setting beside guide them women were the main target for general electric's advertisements because they were seen as the consumers of the household one major selling point was the ability to quote. Get out of the messy kitchen and be able to join your company in quote the comfortable dining room. This made the d twelve toaster not only a more practical and efficient way way to toast bread but also a way to show off to others so conspicuous toast consumption. Yeah and it's like it's a way of like oh. We can make bread at the table. Hey it's almost like a like a fondue pot for tokes yeah okay but it was a hit and it proved the first commercially successful electric toaster but one the problems with the d twelve was that you had to turn the toast yourself so enter the code electric stove companies nineteen thirteen or possibly i also see nineteen eighteen fifteen so we may be dealing with patent versus actual rollout but this model turned the toast for you and it was designed by lloyd groff coachman then in nineteen nineteen minnesota. The minnesota mechanic named charles perkins streit created a restaurant grade toaster and in nineteen twenty one. He patented the automatic pop pop up toaster. <hes> this is the one that's in all the movies yeah this was. This was a key advanced but no longer was it merely a little electric gadget that allowed you to toast bread at your table and like this kind of fond du manner this was a design that timed or toasting to prevent burnt toast popping it out of the heated interior when it was finished waters jenner of min- minneapolis neapolis began selling a redesigned version in one thousand nine hundred ninety six and this was called the toast master in this. We had a pop-up home toaster that brown both sides at once the time heating element with ejection. The modern toaster was born and really. It's essentially the same design. That's widespread today though this who is much bulkier it looks huge yeah it does. It looks like it looks like a like a huge toaster on top of another apparatus. It looks like its own little oven. Evan looks like a toaster on top of a slot machine. Yeah now we can easily spend the rest of the episode just discussing the various technological improvements than bridge the gap between the postmaster and whatever you have in your own kitchen we also focused on its siblings like the toaster oven which is much much the same principle except it's essentially a small oven slot more versatile. I'm more of a toaster oven counter person. Yeah you can do a lot more different kinds of stuff with it yeah. That's what we have in our house then. There's also the conveyor toaster which dates back to nineteen thirty eight or so in this. I'm sure anyone who's ever enjoyed a continental breakfast at hotel. You've seen this it has little conveyor and it it takes the toast host on a little journey that heats it and then drops it out at the bottom. Yeah i unfortunately at one time i remember <hes> was around some high schoolers who were fooling around with one of these things things in it sort of caught on fire. I think they were putting stuff in it shouldn't go get stuck in there. Usually the only place you encounter it is in continental breakfast breakfast situation but i think the beauty of this episode is that at this point we returned to bread itself and considered the way that the toaster changes bread and we've we've already discussed how baking was again. Pollens words quote world the world's first food processing industry and in the nineteenth and twentieth century this all continued and we saw what pollen referred you too as quote the reductive logic industrial bread baking because defeat the needs of the toaster you need rather standardized bread slice sizes and this led to the invention of machines to pre sliced loafs so auto frederick roy vetter is credited with inventing the world's first commercial bread slicing thing machine and this was installed in chillicothe missouri at the chillicothe a baking company and on july seventh nineteen twenty on the eighth win this thing will fired up began slicing loaves of bread into regimented slices pre-sale and this was two years before wonder bread started marketing its own pre wrapped pre sliced bread nationwide. Now one thing that comes about with this era of you know the bag sliced bread is where people begin to who assume the uniformity of bread as a product whereas bread as we were saying earlier is is something with such an amazing diversity of forms is and recipes and flavors bread is sort of half the cooking world and its diversity reflects that but if you go down the bread aisle in the grocery store and see all the industrial made bread. That's pretty much the same shape and size. You wouldn't get that impression. No no i mean it it you end up with this very again. Regimented <hes> sly. I situation and the you know generally. That's that's a lot of times. That's the bread we grew up with a may still the bread you kind of get today but there have been some commentators who who have really lingered on the the sadness of all of this and i believe you found a wonderful paper that some some of this up oh yeah it was it was a paper by a communications communication scholar named arthur berger who was writing about <hes> toast as something sort of like implem- attic of <hes> the sort sort of like industrial alienation of the modern world and it was a paper just called the toaster from <hes> etc review of general semantics and published in nineteen ninety ninety and i i wanna read a a quote from this from his conclusion here <hes> burger rights ultimately the toaster is an apology for the quality of our bread it attempts heroically to transform the semi sweet character lists plastic package bread that we've learned to love into something more palatable and and more manageable perhaps are handling this bread and warming it up gives us a sense that the bread now has a human touch to it is not an abstract almost unreal. Oh product the toaster represents. A heroic attempt to redeem are packaged bread to redeem the unredeemable but the toaster despite its high tech functions is is doomed the continual repetition of adam and eve's fall for an un- regenerate bread cannot be saved. Every piece of toast is a tragedy. I love that i agree or disagree but the good news is that you can buy bread that wasn't baked by machine and you can post it in a variety of ways essentially using your own hand. I'd i'd encourage everyone to try that. I encourage everyone to at least make some sort of bread at some point in your life because it allows you to sort of tap into that feeling of magic that must have accompanied the the initial creations the initial invention of bread now if you have wanted to bake bread at home by the way but you're like hey. I don't have one of these commercial bakery bread ovens you know i don't have the equipment <hes> they're actually actually great recipes. You can look up online that just require a dutch oven inside a normal kind of oven that you'd have at home to make like a really good boulangerie the style loaf so i i recommend looking that up all right. Well looks like being to take a quick break but we'll be right back all right so of course sponsored today is see by g._e. Lighting i have not made the smart homes which yet robert. I'm wondering if you can sell me on it <hes> yeah. I can give it a shot shot. I mean you're definitely not alone but once you realize just how insanely simple it can make your life is almost hard to justify not switching it allows you to connect control and automate your lighting meeting with a full suite of smart products. We're talking the ability to set lights to your schedule so you never have to come home to a dark house for example ability to set them turn on automatically to the perfect brightness cygnus every morning ability to control your lights and appliances remotely through your phone and the ability to set the perfect scene with the touch of a button and this can all be reality he was see by g._e. Smart home products to learn more about transitioning your home quickly and easily into a smart home visit c by g. e. dot com at c. ebi y. G. e. dot com all right. We're back so we've talked about the birth of bread. We've talked about toasting. We've talked about this fabulous invention the toaster wait. We've talked about one kind of toasting but not another kind of toasting of what kind of oh yes of course we haven't talked about the toast. Here's here's to your health which it's easy to just assume that there's no connection between the two i know i never really thought about there being a connection between a piece of toast and a formal glassware clinking event at a fine dinner something now you know <hes> along those lines. If you had asked me i probably probably would've assumed it was a false cognate. One of those things that's just like a word that happens to sound like another word but has unrelated routes yeah but as it turns out it looks like there are some infirm connections there then there's kind of an argument on both sides but i was looking <hes> looking at an article an excellent article on atlas obscures gastro obscure of <hes> <hes> section who just kinda almost like a sub site that they have food related and it's really good. I think i even wrote a piece for them. Awhile back l. what was it about is about mir sinoe zeno cherries berries but anyway this particular pieces by an eubank and it was titled toasting. Your friends once involved actual toast. Okay okay convince me all right so but here's how it goes as eubank lays it out. Basically there are a few different theories about where toast comes from as in like toasting someone one relates to a sixteenth century german practice of shouting the latin word <hes> pro sit meaning may do you good yeah but another is that it ties in with the history of pudding toast host in alcohol sounds weird well. They'll but does it with. Would you be okay specifically <hes> toasting with beer or wine line that is garnished with bread. Okay i somehow beer or wine makes more sense of what i was imagining was vodka martini and like james bond drinks drinks except instead of the little toothpick with an olive in it. It's just a piece of toast well. I'm all up for some inventive. Garnish is in fact a few years back. I found a a cocktail recipe on it was on the hendrick's gin website. Oh generally these you know big alcohol brands will have recipes on their website and hendrix's is is no exception and they had a recipe for cocktail that i don't think it's hosted on the current version of the site but it called for some sparkling wine i had called for i believe some bidders some marmalade. I wanna say kinda muddled in the bottom a some jen of course and it was a really good drink but it also called called for a garnish of a small piece of toast which at the time i was like well that's weird <hes>. I'm just gonna skip that part because i don't really understand it and i don't want like additionally like make toast drink so just kinda skipped over it i would probably have been into it had a headed at restaurant but i just hadn't thought about it. Since until i started reading this article article so when we get into this idea of beer and wine combined with toast it relates to sops soaps yes sops isn't as into up something and stops were chunks of of sodden toasted bread in a bowl of warm wine. If you were <hes> medieval upper-crust and a mere high-calorie piece of aol soaked toast of you're part of the ample underclass in medieval times in medieval europe and the author also adds quote quote the english even covered apple trees insider dipped toast as part of an ancient ritual for a good harvest so with sops were generally talking talking about white bread toasted and flavored with sugar ginger or herbs and then the the british supper in soup even derived from soap. Apparently the milk sop as an insult is also derived from this word while saw became less essential to european cuisine french onion soup is supposedly a survivor driver of the custom for jimmy superfly had generally has like a big piece of bread in there which i think is something that either you love it or perhaps that turns you off a little bit <hes> <hes> they're being like essentially a big soggy piece of bread in your soup oh which camper u. n. I like it. I do think it's definitely a soup that needs to be. I like to eat it right away way. I should let it completely disintegrate in your soup right well. I think it's one of those where it helps to have one of those. <hes> you know craftier chewier can a high protein breads so gluten matrix those work better in that kind of thing then like a you know soft kiki cantabria right and of course it's <hes> it's traditionally a a meat based super but there are some excellent mushroom based recipes for it out. Oh yeah usually have a beef broth. That's generally true though that <hes> that mushrooms rooms make an excellent substitute like a vegetarian substitute for beef flavor and like anything that calls for beef broth or anything beefy you can put mushrooms in there and i think you'll have more textural differences than tastes differences actually yeah it'll bring in a new new nominee kind of a flavoring mommy mommy mommy yeah i mean i remember even growing up like occasionally. We'd have a when we were eating meat as a family like mushroom gravy would be brought out as a way to enhance. It's a cut of meat. Oh yeah so it makes sense that even even if the meat is completely gone the mushroom or mushroom gravy or some sort of mushroom based flavoring. We'll do hut a great a great cooking tip if you've ever used dried shitaki mushrooms in your home and you reconstitute them in hot water to heat them up. Don't just use the mushrooms and throw out the the broth that broth that you reconstituted them in is gold now. You can like redo said you can freeze it. You can use it in soups. Anything it tastes amazing. Another survivor of this <hes> the sops legacy is apparently wa- sale. I know what that is. You know it's the traditional ole holiday punch type type beverage. Okay here we go awa- selling that sort of taken the punch out or getting punch or the bar hopping kind of like you know the the holiday sharing of the punch the wall sale tradition but apparently like traditionally also had toast in it here here. We go boozing. Thing is what that means. Yes and then toasting each other's health became apparently became more of a fad in the seventeen hundreds and the name indeed may derive from the fact that he's <hes> beverages that people were toasting with were often topped with sops. Okay it does make me wonder if stops will ever make a real comeback. You know have a say twenty years from now. The new trendy restaurant in new york will be alsop space because because other other toast the items have never really gone out of style. I think i think there has been kind of a resurgence of of toast in recent years does avocado toast but then also just of some chefs kind of like focusing in on something <hes> in in some cases toast and saying all right. What is it about a good slice. Oh that works and what how can we deconstruct that and and <hes> and maybe even put some sort of new twist on oh yeah now that you mention that there there's at least one kind of hip restaurant in town here that we go to sometimes that does it's got like a whole toasts section section of it's cool. It's just like toasts with you know it'll have like a like a salmon spread topping or like a like a mushroom and ricotta topping or something yeah. I wonder if this'll be interesting to hear from anyone out there. Who is you know his active in the culinary world or the mixologist world i would i would love to know if if anybody is is attempting to bring back the toast garnish was that hendrix drink that i saw online was that just kind of a flash in the pan or just like a a a lone survivor of tradition or is there anybody out there saying hey. We used to put toast in our drinks and we should do it again. It's essential stop trying and make toast drinks happen robert not going to happen <hes>. I don't know i i wanna try a good one. I wanna try an finnick one. Well you know what i can actually imagine more more so than i guess it would depend on the consistency of the drink like if it's like an egg nog kind of thing yeah definitely see using toes. It's like if it's like a more watery consistency type drink. I'm having a harder time imagining actually dipping the toast in it to any good effect but i could imagine it would be a nice pairing of aromas. I mean there are some drinks that call for just like like assenting a glass with like sometimes people will make a drink where they smoke the glass. You know burn aboard and put the glass on it and then there's smoke on the glass that gives it this kind percent and then they had the drink to the glass. I could see a similar thing happening with toast because host is such a pleasant aroma and that smell might pair well with some types of drinks <hes> i don't i don't know with what liquors but you know you can imagine that yeah. Maybe we can get to the point where it's like kind of like the bread bowl you have for for spinach dip sometime. The the bread chalice does challenge the brain bowl is actually the ultimate stop that stop to the extreme right the whoever thought that up genius this we've really only scratched the surface on bread traditions and like we said we didn't devote the whole episode you just bread and every culture has its own spin on particular uses of bread. The things certainly stick into bread. Basically there's a hot pocket of of some form and just about every culture <hes> and <hes> you know we don't we don't have time to go into all those today but but bread is an important part of human culture of human history and <hes> you know even though it's just our everyday sustenance most of the time <hes> we should stop and appreciate this fabulous invention well said robert all right if you would like to check out other episodes of invention head on over to invention pod dot com and if you want to support the show really the the best thing he can do a rate and review wherever you have the power to do so and make sure you have subscribed huge thanks to our audio producers for this episode seth nicholas johnson and and maya coal if you'd like to get in touch with us to let us know feedback on this episode or any other suggested topic for the future for just to say hello you can email us at contact contact at invention dot com invention is production. I heart radio for more podcasts from iheartradio. Is the radio app apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows everybody we love a good cooking show around here now that there's so many wonderful culinary podcast to turn to as well and the latest is food three sixty with mark murphy his celebrity chef and restaurant tour and he's been cooking some of the world's steam kitchens for over thirty years season one will be eight episodes topics include in no special order flavor the art of cookbook look and recipe writing ice cream coffee menus in and outs of opening a restaurant pizza and breakfast so tune into food three sixty a brand new podcast that airs every friday friday. Listen and subscribe at apple podcasts are on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Jacob Wise Interview
"And it's officially streak week here on the Cincinnati Dayton sports podcast what the heck is streak well, it is a whole week and today. Eight total days eight new episodes. I'm doing this. Because of the fact I had some open time during the weekends. Normally I don't. But I made the most of it. I had eight interviews lined up, and I got some really great people on and I. Really think you're going to enjoy it like mention. Every day will bring a new episode. We'll go from episode one fifty six all the way to one sixty, three again eight days and eight new episodes. Hopefully you will enjoy them. We'll start off with the broadcasting voice of the chillicothe Coffee Paints Jacob, wise, also happy flag day out there it's a holiday celebrating, United States, and we'll go ahead and start streak off with episode one fifty six, but not before some friendly words from our new network partner in twelve ounce sports. Hey folks. This is Lee w Mallon of the Cincinnati and Dayton sports podcast, and I'm here to talk to you about my bookie since two thousand fourteen. It's the place where you can bet on anything anywhere anytime. Get up to a thousand dollars on your first deposit bonus use the Promo Code one to Ozzy sports as well as sports betting. You can play some Casino Games. Taking some live odds madden twenty an NBA two. K. Twenty and even bet with bitcoin visit my bookie, dot, AG and use that Promo Code. One to Osy Sports. That's one to OC sports. My bookie, the industry's most rewarding loyalty program. Twelve ounce sports. visit us at twelve ounce sports radio DOT COM. It's episode one fifty six of the Cincinnati and Dayton sports podcast our special gases, the voice, the Schiller Coffee Paints Jacob Wise. We'll be talking about the loss Twenty Twenty Prospect League season Jacobs Eleven years, broadcasting his role with the paints and more as Ross. County Ohio invades the local Syndey sports podcast. Welcome to the Cincinnati and Dayton sports podcast with Lee w Maolin. This is a weekly podcast dedicated to sports happening in the Cincinnati, Dayton, Ohio region. visit the Lee. W WWL DOT com slash podcast to listen on your favorite platforms like apple podcast Google podcasts tune in spotify, the iheartradio APP and more follow the host on twitter at the Lee w Malan and the podcast at Syndey pod. Opening theme is Arpey by Dan Hennig from the Youtube Music Library Collection. Now for your host Lee w Maolin. And on the feed right now is Jacob Wise. The play-by-play Voice of the Chile Coffee Paints Jacob. How you doing today? I'm wonderful. How are you? I'm all right happy to be here. Though. It would have been nice if we had some baseball to call. Yes, we were very busy at our ballpark last week and I think we had twenty four games in four days and were on track to do the same this weekend, but it's it's not prospect league baseball, so it's not not quite the entertainment value. Absolutely, so let's begin the interview first of all. Where are you from? I am from Ashville Ohio so about thirty minutes directly north from chillicothe, the just north of Circle Ville. With as Valley High School and went to a few paints games back in the day GROWNUP. Taes Valley? We at Valley view, we always face taste valley at the Milton Union track meet, which was always random, just because as valley was the farthest team. Into West. Milton's like hey, so I always like. When I know what school it is. But how did you wind up in Chile coffee? You had a very long broadcasting career, so I tend to be a bit of a procrastinator at times. In College I went to school at Wayne's Bird University, in south, Western, Pennsylvania and part of the. Communications Department. There is you had to have an internship that met their requirements to graduate to take your internship, and then do a basically a seminar. And then you had to give a presentation and get graded on the academic application of your internship, and all that sitting there. The the deadline is coming up. And I thought. Hey. Maybe they do internships. Because I had talked to a few other places and things weren't really working out for what I wanted to do. And I got an email back in a couple of phone calls, and I ended up being an intern there in two thousand nine, which was the first year of the prospect league. And, then The me a job after that, but it wasn't in broadcast so I really wanted to pursue the broadcast angle the the guy that was calling games of still a good friend of mine, but he was still there. They were GonNa weren't going to boot him out for a new guy so I spend some other years in the league and a couple in the frontier league, and finally made my way back full-time as the play by play voice and Twenty Sixteen. When did you decide that you wanted to be a broadcaster? I think he's about eight years old. My mother like every mom does hey, what do you want to be when you grow up? And I sit down and be a professional. Ballplayer and she said that's a great goal to have. But you might get hurt or you might not get recruited or there's a lot of things that can happen. You know it was never you might not be good enough. It was always she was very encouraging. But I said well, if I can't play that I, WanNa talk about it, and from that point on basically we would watch games on TV, and I would kinda call a play by play to myself, or if I was playing, I played three sports growing up. I'd be in the dugout her on the bench or on the field. Just Kinda call them play by play as well or if I was watching a friend play and I just. Really fell in love with doing the play by play and kind of being the eyes and ears and nose for the people listening in. You can't be there in the stadium with you. What was your first big break in the field? I mean there's probably my internship. Honestly It wasn't like a normal internship because. A lot of broadcast internships when you go places especially bigger places. You are basically just an assistant to. The folks doing the broadcasting in this case I was able to do Middle Innings of all twenty three home paints games that year, and then I would do color for the rest of the Games, but also we hosted the mid American conference. Baseball tournament there that year, and we kind of split up the Games for Max Sports DOT COM at the time, so really got a ton of reps and got to know A. A lot of people, which of course you know, it's a lot about who you know, also in what what the conversations you can have and relationships you can have with people so that really opened up my world to allot the other one. Maybe I would say is when I got a new adviser in college, my junior year, and it was lenny for Terry who had broadcast pirates baseball for thirty three years in Pittsburgh. Very cool. Now? What is it like being? The Voice of the paints, a team that's called chillicothe home since one, thousand, nine, hundred, three and two separate leagues. There is a ton of pride in chillicothe, just for the pains in general and it really really a lot of pride for all the people who work there. Especially the people who work there year round and have worked there for years. It is a family. We are a very. We take a lot of pride in what we do, and what we can bring to the community, we take a lot of pride and being good the paints of one over sixty six percent of their home games since two thousand nine, the start of the prospect league, which has really been my time there but they were always successful back in the frontier. League, from ninety three to two thousand seventeen. The fans supports unbelievable. We have season ticket holders and host families that have been evolved since nineteen ninety, three nineteen ninety five twenty plus twenty five plus years. If they're not in the Ballpark, and they don't say hi to. You usually notice that they're. They're missing. Maybe they're on vacation or whatever but. you know it's it's really a cool atmosphere. It's an old school kind of ballpark built in nineteen, fifty four. That's been renovated, but it still has that old timey baseball charm and the atmosphere when you get into the ballpark on a big game is is just incredible, average, two thousand plus fans, and the kind of the old adage in Minor League Baseball, which is kind of atmosphere. Wise what we compare ourselves to is. that. Most fans may be aren't there for the game. They're not diehard baseball fans, but fans in chillicothe. There's a couple of years when I started there fulltime where we weren't very good, and it was a gauntlet walking up the seats to the press box every single day. Because everybody would ask what's wrong. What's wrong with the team and yeah? You can always pick it up to when things are going well on the field. When the the fans know into cheer. They know what's going on. They understand pitching rotations and all these different things, so it's really a lot of fun to be a part of a market like this. Me The chill coffee paints while the history they've had since ninety three, and they played every single year, and at least one league, and until you know this whole nice. Scorn team, but at the same time I mean. The paints have had a long history and several great rivalries local great reasoning. This past seasons you have the champion city kings, and the paint of course a few years back an intern, with the Richmond River Rats, that was a great series, and if you want to go a little bit further back in the Frontier League days chilled Coffee Richmond roosters that was. Back. In fact, I think one or two of the roosters title years. The Paints were the first playoff. Oh, so that sounds about right? I enjoyed I've always enjoy the paints, and you know the local rivalry, so that creates and chillicothe. He's not too far either on just what about an hour hour and a half at the most? If you drive slow I think over to Richmond, that was a cool rivalry to bring over to the to the prospect because when it formed a nine. I want to say there were four Frontier League markets that kind of moved over to the college. Would bat route in two thousand nine to help form the prospect league, so it was cool to have those existing ties already there I think the the paints are. Perhaps, the only original Frontier League team that that came over and have to double check just looking at some of the numbers are that some of the low goes, but there were there were four slippery rock was one of those they've since? Well, actually, they're champion city now so. That franchise moved over there, it's it's crazy to think that what I was in Richmond Slippery Rock, but now they're in Springfield Ohio so. Also. Have you noticed that? There's lot of frontier league markets and independent markets that. Are Switching over to summer ball. Yeah, I mean in a lot of it is just a money issue. Independent Ball is extremely expensive, and it's getting more expensive. the paints you know when win. The Frontier League started in ninety three the memorial stadium and it doesn't. It didn't look anything like it does now. It was kind of the crown jewel of that league, and the whole idea was to bring professional baseball to markets that would never be able to get affiliated baseball, and now player salaries have risen, and the cost of operation have risen. The markets are farther away now. Your travel costs in hotels and everything has gotten more expensive and got to the point where. You know teams are building thirty plus million dollar stadiums in Chicago in Saint Louis suburbs and bigger cities, and it just you couldn't operate in Ross County Ohio, you can operate that way in chillicothe, e and be competitive, business, wise or on the field and. So we went to college would bat route and I think we were one of the first to do that. And now other teams are starting to follow suit in the River City rascals won the frontier league last year. Now they're college. Would bat operation as the O'FALLON? Hoots now was going to be their first year in the frontier league this year, normal corn beltre's same thing. They moved over to the prospect league last year and I think that's GonNa continue to go that way for the kind of medium to lower to your independent teams, just because the operational cost is is. Way More than I think the average fan would would anticipate. I was Kinda hoping o'fallon, but keep the rascals name to be honest, but at least we have corn beltre's. The corn beltre's are still there. Beautiful Stadium to I've heard nothing, but great things about it, and also, what is that carshield field carshield field? Yeah, no foul and it's I. Mean it's a really cool place to. So, what are your expectations for this twenty twenty season I would have been the year. Chile coffee defended their title. What were you thinking? I mean on paper I think we had as good if not better of a team than we had last year to win the title. We had nine returners so far signed to play for the paints that played on the championship team last year, including Trey Smith who hit the grand. Slam. The championship game in Cape Girardeau, Missouri thirty minutes from his hometown in Sykes Ston you know it was. It was crazy, had one hundred fifty friends and family there he was coming back. We had Gavin homer out. Out of Penn State, who had a twenty two game hit streak and hit a home run four days in a row we had our closer of the year who won the award for closer of the year in the prospect league last year Nate Hall Coming Back Out of Toledo, and then some new additions like a couple of guys from Ohio state. Who at absolute monster seasons. this either the spring before or were just massive recruits out of high school. were having good starts. Their freshman years perhaps this year at Ohio state before the coronavirus stuff shut down and ended everything much earlier than we all would've liked, but. I gotTa believe that that team was going to be every bit as good, if not better than than the year before we were all pretty excited about that. You mentioned Ohio State. Baseball the when the quarantine. Began the Buckeyes are supposed to be right state that Tuesday literally there was a series against Milwaukee at rights than Osu was supposed to come in. Thank the first time state visit state for anything since ninety six, so I was really looking forward to seeing that game, and you know you know how that turned out. But. That was still that was a big game. And hopefully they get that rescheduled for twenty twenty one, but. It seemed like the Paints Twenty twenty season is going to be better if not just as good as last year's title-winning team. Yeah, the thing about last year's team to is, we had an incredibly slow start to the season two and seven. I started to in seven I. Think those seven losses. Five of them were by one or two runs, and the issue was. The patients weren't scorn in Iran's to start the season. and. There is a little bit of an adjustment period with the quality of pitching that you see on a inning by inning night in night out basis compared to a lot of the college seasons. Also playing every day getting used to kind of taking care of your body, being part of the equation, instead of playing, you know mid week series and a weekend series. And then the pains went forty one and fourteen, the rest of the season, including playoffs and one of the things. That I think is the coolest facts about last year's team was. All nine starters in the game, three of the prospect championship series, which was the title game, all nine starters were on the opening day roster. which you do not see a lot in college would bad game really even in the independent game because there's so much roster turnover there guys that get hurt or they get tired or they miss home, or whatever, because he has guys come from all over the country, and they just decide you know this. I've been playing every day for three weeks. I'm tired. I need to go homer by armed sore, whatever you just lose guys and you bring new guys in, but all nine in the championship game while we're on the opening day roster, which I think was pretty incredible. Imagine a key component about the summer ball. It's just the roster tone. It. It's crazy to think you know how many you know. Don't stick with the team. And how many get chances later on the season it's it's crazy to think that you know. Some collegiate ball has the of turnover into the into the teams. Yeah, and the Prospect League actually has a role that you cannot release a player because of poor performance so. The team only can release player if there's a disciplinary issue or if there's an injury I, mean it just. There's only a few specific reasons why a player can. Lee obviously they can voluntarily leave but you can't release a player because of poor performance, and so even with that you have teams with a thirty two man on a normal year thirty two. Two Man Roster will end up with seventy three seventy five guys over the course of a two month plus season and it usually those are the teams that aren't doing really well in the playoffs, or getting to the playoffs for that matter, those are the bottom teams, because if you look at the standings especially when you have a full season where? The standings, what they are at the end of the season based on the whole year versus winner of the first half winter the second half where you might have some hope in the middle of the year if you look up and and July first, and you're a month in. And you're tired and you're playing every day and you're on buses for eight hours a day or whatever? And your fifteen games out of first place. Take some mental toughness did not say hey I. Think I just WanNa pack it in rest for the summer and get ready for fall. Also, has got to be tough, too. Because you know when you get towards the playoffs, normally colleges are opening back up and they got to go back and get ready for their college baseball regimen. You mentioned something pretty interesting to that. Players can't be released because they're struggling and I really liked that because it's. It's not only just about getting yourself. You know in the eyes of Scouts and drafted. It's about you know bettering your craft bettering your game. Yeah and we take a a huge approach. from that angle with in chillicothe and I know other teams do Quincy's a big one as well. They use a lot of analytics. with things we don't necessarily go approach where we're doing throwing programs in and checking Velos exit velocities and all that stuff, but we do. Really rely on the developmental side and a lot of it, though we live up to the players, because first of all, we want players that want to be there that want to do the extra work that WanNa get better but it's up to them, so one of the things about the prospect league is. It's supposed to prepare you for a professional type. Minor League baseball playing every night. You're on buses. You gotTa Take Care of your body, but part of that also is learning how to get in your own routine, so we don't say hey. You've got to be here at this time and we're going to go through this stretching regimen. It's batting practice at four thirty. If you WANNA come early, we're here to help you, and that includes BP bullpens taking infield field. All those things are available and the players who really dedicate themselves to doing the extra work, and not just showing up a couple of hours before the game playing. I mean what they show when they go back to their colleges are unbelievable. One one for us. Last year was awesome Calpeda a pitcher out of Toledo where. You know big guy throws hard, but he really struggled throwing strikes and being consistent on the mound early in the year, but he worked and worked and worked and worked and he ended up. Just being an unbelievable pitcher force down the stretch he he started, the championship game was was lights out there and there's another example Griffin Smith out of Ohio state a couple years. He pitched for US didn't have a ton of experience at Ohio state this spring before he was a young guy, and then he goes back in the next spring after he plays for us and gets a ton of experience and a lot of work aside from just pitching in games and he throws A. Crucial in winning the the big ten tournament that year, so it's fun to really see on the other side of the season you get the guys coming in, and you can look at their numbers, but it's really fun to follow those guys after they've been in chillicothe. You're if you're fan of another team or whatever seeing what they do, the this spring after playing in the prospect, league. You mentioned a couple of players already for Chile coffee. But who are some of your favorites that you've gotten to cover over the years? I mean the so the first two years I was there full time twenty, sixteen and twenty seventeen. We were not very good and and part of that at times comes with just kind of the attitude of the player but one that sticks out in those first couple years that I that I really really liked was a catcher out of western Michigan named Jesse forestall and ended up playing in the. The North Woods League for a couple of years for Madison which is if you follow College Wood Bat. Baseball Summer Ball at all. They lead the. The entire country and attendance with about six thousand fans every single night. It's just unbelievable what they do. They're in Madison but really really cool to meet a guy like that and other players that you can sit to and talk on the bus, and they'll tell you about their personal lives and what they're wanting to do after the gap at school if they can't play baseball. but you know galaxy that Kendall who pitched for us last year and was going to pitch force again this year. Just real scrappy very softspoken doesn't say a whole lot but when he gets on the mound, he he's ready to go to battle, and there's nothing mentally that you can do to to shake him. You know you could hit a grand slam off of him. He's. He's trying to strike out the next guy but. Let's see two thousand nine intern near I. You're the Prospect League AJ actor. He was a pitcher for us out of Michigan. State he ended up pitching for the angels and the twins. I believe I know at least the twins. I think the angels as well, but AJ Perry I think he's a coach. Now. One of the one of the Michigan Mac schools, but it's there's so many names over the last eleven years. It's hard to to keep up with all of them, but. There are certainly a few stories here and there that that stick out once in a while. Are there any paints from the Independent Frontier League days that reach out and say hi or Yeah we we get. We actually get some show up every now and then two games. They might live locally. GATOR MCBRIDE WHO has his Jersey retired will pop in every once in a while, and of course a few years ago, we had our twenty fifth season of Paints Baseball, so we had a little bit of a celebration there and several former players came back in and hung out a really where I get. Most interaction with former players, especially, the Frontier League days are through some of our longtime host families, so the people who've come and they're big fans, and they take the players in for the summer, and basically adopt them for the summer, and those are lifelong relationships most of the time, and so they'll tell us about their players, and every now and then we'll say hey. This guy stayed with me and. And Nineteen, Ninety six, and he did this and that and I remember this game, so it's fun to to relive those stories and meet these guys when they when they stop into chillicothe e, it's a really is a special place in so when people were driving through. If they used to go to games or play there in the past, they'll They'll stop in and say hi most of the time. I do wonder what's the main difference of hosting independent ballplayer compared to collegiate ballpark player. Yeah I mean that's not something that I've I've really asked before, but I can imagine that part of it is maybe. The the old, a little bit older guys, the independent guys, maybe a little bit more Independence. In them as far as they're used to being on their own and used to being responsible for themselves. Whereas the college guys haven't really been out on their own yet so they may rely a little bit more on a little bit of structure, but I think it's. It's largely the same especially with the travel schedule where. You're not there a whole lot. Honestly you're there. You sleep and maybe eat dinner Maybe grab lunch before you had to the ballpark sometimes, but there may be four or five days where you're not there at all. Because you're on the road and hotels couple host families that I stay in contact with pretty regularly, they don't. Really say that there's much difference. Some of them said that they were a little bit worried about it. When it went to the college just because of the change but they're super super happy that they continue to be host families. What just great to hear I mean there's still entangled with paints baseball and she looked coffee sports. So definitely, it's nice to see that the paints have just really haven't had. The ball stopped rolling from the change in twenty five strong years in Ross County Ohio to. We're getting closer to two thirty now. I think this would have been our twenty eighth year twenty eight th season since nineteen ninety-three. Of course, this will be the first time. No, no paints baseball in chillicothe, since the summer of Nineteen ninety-two so. It's GonNa. Be Weird. It's certainly already a little bit weird. It doesn't feel like June to me at all. It's June tenth and. Usually by the middle of May were pretty pretty hectic as far as getting ready for the season at the end of May, but. I think the the the fans and the community will be very very excited when we're able to open back up next May hopefully. While the temperature certainly feel like June. Yes, they do. Guy Yesterday was brutal, but anyway that's not important. Jacob. Do you get to travel with the paints? All of games are on FM radio. We've had a rate the same radio partner for. Over twenty years it might be around twenty five I know the first couple of seasons. We're on a different radio station, but It's a pretty high powered FM station out of Waverley Ohio. So about a half hour south of where it is were the paints are in chillicothe e, but you can actually hear it in your car all the way up to to seventy in a little bit towards Grove City, a little bit north of that bottom ring, but very big FM. Power Station and then we also stream on our own mobile APP. That's free to download just search chillicothe paints on the APP store or Google play, and then we also stream it through our website as well so we We hear from people We try to get people to email in an interactive and there are people listening I think sometimes It's a little surprising to. Hear that somebody's stuck all the way through fourteen innings of a game in West Virginia or whatever it is, but it's fun to interact with our fans that way. It's also great to I. Mean You mentioned the radio station? So that's nice for several high, but on the website and the APP mean you don't have to be landlocked in Sheila or Area to catch paints baseball you can. You can get to the Internet and Bam it's right there. Yeah, we! We used to. When we started this whole thing with the radio station was you should? People would show up with their transistor radio and their headphones on and sit in the stadium and listen to the game, and you don't see that anymore. Instead you see somebody with a ear buds in and on their phone. If they're listening in the stadium, so That's part of that is. We were just trying to stay up with with technology and the other part of it is. We want parents who are all over the united, states and coaches of their players. We want them. Be Able to listen to the Games as well. That's a really nice idea and I really really enjoy that But. Let me ask you on the road. Where are your favorite venues you've been to. Let's see. I'm I get kind of grumpy and been around too long to where. I. Mean You understand you? Go you go someplace in you soon as you get on the bus or as soon as you see the place, you're just kind of like I'm glad I'm here to call the play by play. Because this is what I love to do and I would do it in the middle of a cornfield with with no electricity. Your fans if if that's what I had to do, some places are more comfortable than others That's in our in our division in the east. I do enjoy Tara, which they play at Indiana States facility there in Tarot just almost on the Indian Illinois border, and it's A. It's a pretty nice facility. It was renovated very heavily before they came in the League in two thousand ten, and then they divvied up the press box of their individual booths with individual air conditioning units. You can set to. However you want which is a big thing for me, they have they have a C- West Virginia has AC and have a bathroom and the press box, but you can't see the field very well. what else in the East Division Danville Nice view the field, but it's an open air, so it's I. Swear every time I go to Dan. It's one hundred fifty degrees. But but great view of a really cold stadium. That's that's very historic. Their champions honestly is is one of the best because you have air conditioning. Phenomenal view of the field and there's a bathroom I ten steps away, which which is always important. Yeah I. Definitely, the one game I got to announce for the king's last year. I definitely Doug that field. It's very nice. It's the Berg's. Wittenberg Tigers Place where they play baseball and yeah great field and the press box felt like you're right on top of it. Yeah, yeah, you look down on it and. It's a it's the way it's built. You don't have to have a big crowd for it to be impactful on the field because you're so on top and you're Kinda. Elevated over the field there at champion city that even just a few hundred will really make a difference in terms of the atmosphere and everything's in front of you. There's always you're not standing in line at the concession. Stand behind home plate. You can see it from anywhere there. I always liked the I never been, but I always liked the pictures of the views of Beckley. Because you know you're in. Year in the mountainside, the hills, and like they flattened off the top of a hill top of Beckley and put in a parking lot in A. Concrete Block stadium that has no character, but it is a nice view. with the trees in the background and the the Rolling Hills off past center field. If you have if you can't tell West Virginia, is you talk about local rivalries, but West Virginia has always been the competitive rivalry for the paints. They came in the League in in twenty ten and a lot of years it's been between the miners and the paints in the playoffs or to get into the playoffs to get to the championship out of the East So. I try not to have too many public good things to say about West Virginia whether they deserve it or not, because I gotta I gotTa. Keep my fans happy. At Absolute Lake, good people over there though. Absolutely yes. Now there any. Prospect League stadiums that you wanted to see and never got to or any spots that you definitely want to see in your future. Yeah so! I didn't think I was GONNA get to go to Cape Girardeau last year. Because the way the schedule worked out. How you really only played a couple of teams out of the other division, and Cape Girardeau wasn't one of those, of course, that's where CMO plays, and they'd put a new turf a new scoreboard, and then when the when the catfish got a team, they they're owner very very cool guy he. He spent a ton of money to retrofit this really really old ballpark to be suitable for prospect league play, so we made it to. To the championship series, we drove out to Cape Girardeau and get the hang out there for a couple of games and dog pile on. I mean I didn't dog pile, but our team got the dog pile on the field, and that was a really cool facility. Very unique setting which I think is maybe the coolest thing you get in in the College Wood Bat summer. League is just the uniqueness of all the different setups. Lafayette's going to be phenomenal. They are building a brand new ballpark. It's going to be gorgeous I. Believe it's the same architect is who built the stadium in Kokomo. They were in our league for few years before going to a different league, which that place was unbelievable to be at. You felt like you were in a brand new double. A ballpark do page place at a division three school. and. It's a nice little division. Three ballpark in a complex with their other sports facilities I'm excited to go fallon. I went there when they were in the frontier. League a couple of times, but it's. They've done some changes since I was there. Quincy's really cold WPA Ballpark springfields, an old minor league ballpark. That's huge and it's pretty cool. So I I enjoy going to all the different ballparks. The schedule comes out and I don't get to go everywhere I get I. Get kind of Grumpy, but. But I like to travel aspect. I like going to different places in and seeing different ballparks and things so I guess that's one good thing about sometimes you have the team turnover or teams moving usually one or two every single season. I Know Alton. Illinois has been announced for. Next season. They're going to join the League next year. And I think that's going to be a really cool situation. There some excited to see that and I know the commissioner has several other things that he's hoping to to finalize. You're put in the works that I'm not allowed to talk about or. Don't even know about some of them, but. I'll always exciting things on the horizon, and that's one of the things I always think about I. is that be cool city to go to recall Ballpark to visit? You know when when I was interning with the river rats. Butler Pennsylvania and I think that was. I think that would have been a stadium. I would love to Ben at it's A. It's a really cool stadium. If I was a fan I would love it to death. But they to sound grumpy again, they you. They have all this indoor space, but it's all for groups which is great from a business standpoint because they have all these indoor sweets, and they can expand them or close them down. They have those walls that like open up. and they have no press box, so you you are are seated underneath this speaker. That's like one hundred and ten decibels. and. People, walk up to you and ask ticket. You know where to go in the stadium. Show your ticket even though you were in the other team's logo and. but you're right on top of the action there. Well that's cool. It's definitely GonNa me if I could be grumpy. Man For a second Butler Pennsylvania and there's Butler University in Indianapolis had the same color scheme. Some always I'm always afraid like. Oh, no, I'm GONNA. Call them the bulldogs today, but. Luckily done things like that a few times. They had a Cincinnati bearcat I think it was my second and last year Richmond Russell Clark okay. Yeah Yeah I think. Yeah. He was a blue sock for awhile, and what was cool as their closest fo was like five minutes away. It's slippery rock. Yeah, Yup! Yeah. We were whenever when I was in slippery rock. Whenever Butler came to slippery rock, it was our biggest crowd because they would bring everybody the fifteen minutes away from Butler too slippery rock in the, so that was always a big. We've got excited when the the Butler folks were there be Mitch Richmond though that's one I. I kind of skipped over. McBride Stadium. There is nice old. Historic ballpark when you were there. Did you broadcast from the booth or from the GM's office? we were on top of the on top of the roof. Yeah, that's where the press box was. Nowadays They Ha. They built a room in where the fans. and. Press box because I think it's unsafe anymore. Man One of you that was we had that protected us so all the foul balls just roll in front of us, but. Man That was that was such a great view and I. Love McBride Stadium and just think if the roosters got their stadium built by seventy and forty. Mean who knows what happened mcbride? Yeah. Absolutely, hopefully it would still be there. When I was there I, we were still using phone lines, and we were announcing from the behind first base, and the coaches are in the in the GM's office. And then we moved up to the top on the roof, which I think as we walked up there. We knew it probably wasn't the safest thing in the world, but we. You can't beat that view. Now I mean. Just make bright stadium. And, it's right there off the road in the neighborhood. It's just a cool cool, location and cool setting. It's a neighborhood ballpark. If you think about it and there's plenty of things to do around there, I enjoy my two years. They're definitely and we're. We had the All Star game there one year and I helped. One of the local breweries made a special beer just for the All Star game there and we did a special can rap and I was involved in that so I. Think I have one of those cans with the Richmond Indiana Prospect, League All Star Game. On a shelf in my office if it's the same brewery, they had a wine slushy. One year and That sounds that sounds amazing. It's one hundred five degrees out. That actually sounds really amazing, not bad at all. What else was mention? Oh Yeah. There's one of the offices that there's three roosters jerseys hanging about and then there's these giant McDonald's cups like the big sixty four ounce ones you can get at speedway or something, and they had the Roosters logo on there in the schedule. Ford Ninety Five I. Think Yeah. Yeah I. I like all gear. I'm a nerd like that, but you should look up the Frontier League facebook page. They've got a history page and they've been pretty active on it over the last. Couple of months with some cool stuff, there's a post. I forget what it was a thing of. Couple posts go that. Couple of pictures of Chile coffee and just. Like you mentioned the. Chile coffee community. Swarming the paints. That's that's huge. I don't know if you've seen this. We just yesterday. Somebody found VHS OF A. kind of like a Promo video. It's like two and a half minutes from nineteen ninety four. It was a promo for ninety four, but the footage was from ninety three the first season. I need to watch that I did I saw it. I put it in the back of my mind, and I need to go back and watch it when I have a chance. It's pretty wild. Looks Great. It looks very nineties, but Oh, yeah. The jerseys though I always thought the Paints had kind of similar style jerseys, but ones I saw on the. The preview is like Whoa. What are those? Yeah, we actually from the twenty fifth season, so we usually do a teacher giveaway every single year. at one of our home games, we have promotions just like minor, League baseball if you'RE GOING TO CLIPPERS, game, bobbleheads and fireworks. GIVEAWAYS, we do all that stuff too and. for that season just kind of as a nod to to nine hundred ninety three I think they were those ninety four also. I had found an original season Jersey actually a fan brought it in. and Said Hey I got this jersey. It's from the first season of trade it for a it was like a coach's pullover something and I was like absolutely whether I was allowed to or not I was like. That's something that we should have and was able to take that. And recreate the the paints script that was on the front of it, and we use that and screen printed it on the t shirts, and so we kind of had like a assures e first season, sure Z. giveaway. That year which a lot of the older fans appreciated. Oh I bet I mean, that's a keepsake. That is absolutely definitely. Do I definitely enjoy that? Now here here Jakup here's all the might you need? If you were to put prospect league franchises in any town any city that you want. Why are you picking and why? Oh Man I. Left field but I I normally get my best questions during an interview so. I I. I. We've we've been struggling to find teams in the East? Be just because of the saturation of Ballpark. Thursday a suitable ballpark. It probably has a team in it. And so it would really be nice to have a team somewhere in the northern Kentucky area not to boot Florence the Florence y'all's out, but that'd be perfect spot. Honestly in that stadium is beautiful. Right on the interstate, but. Some are somewhere in the northern Kentucky area, probably or in that little part of West Virginia. Kinda sticks up between Ohio and Pennsylvania. Okay like like wheeling or something like that? Yeah, yeah absolutely. I mean I. Don't know how much it would be. But I don't know if Florence the new owners would say hey, let's keep the y'all's going and let's have like y'all summer, team or something like that. Although I don't know how you know. If, that's something that could be done or not. Just because independent baseball schedule is very similar to prospect league schedule. They play. They play ninety six in the Frontier League, but they start earlier and go later. and so the prospect league season almost matches up exactly it just is kind of the meat of the season, which actually works out better for us because too early in the year it's cooler and people are still in school and then. If. You go too late in the year high school football, starting to begin which obviously you know in Ohio. It was a big deal, so there's a high school football game or paints game. I mean they love us, but they're going to go to the High School Football Game Oh absolutely. I mean that's just the fact in Ohio although UC Health Stadium, man. That's that's. Beautiful that's a great. Are you familiar with why there, so they have their seats that are different colored as you get towards the outfield. I've never actually been inside. You See Health Stadium soon. So if you look at a picture of the inside, they have different council. The the seats like the two sections right by home player, one color and they. You get a little bit farther down the line. It's another caller. You never be down the line. It's another color in. It's a nod to old. Riverfront stadium where. As you went up, the first level was one color of seeds in the second level, was another color like yellow and then red, and so they did that when they built. Uc Health Stadium when the? Florence Freedom. I came in, and it was just kind of a nod to that I. Think People See at first and like what in the world's going on here? But they're so close to Cincinnati. That was my first question when I walked in that Ballpark, the first time and I thought that's that's pretty cool little feature. You Know I. I really WANNA see them have red and white seats match the water tower main mascot. Already see how they will. They went to the y'all's. I know. Did you see their Home Jerseys Oh? Yeah, the powder Blue Oh. Those those are jerseys, pants and Man Those it's. Pretty Slick look. Yeah, absolutely! So Jacob what people might not know about you. Is You created Prospect League TV Can you tell me how you came up with the idea? The process to get it league wide. It was quite the process so the paints we had experimented with streaming video of our games the to prior years. so six well, yeah, sixteen and Seventeen. and. It went pretty well. We got a lot of hits. We were just posting it up on like facebook. Live which at the time didn't really let you streaming great quality and our camera. Honestly, it wasn't very good. either. It was like a Webcam or an IPAD, ipad, mini, or something small, but I just wanted to see what kind of response we would get. and. It went pretty well. And so I was looking into some other options, and at the time some other leagues, and also because at the Va, we host a lot of other college games, and so they would there s ID's would come in, and they would stream, and they're like Oh. We do it through stretch internet or we do through blue frame, or whatever, and so I kind look into stretch, and I had had some familiarity with them. which now is bought by Presto, sports so. It's all under that Presto sports umbrella does websites and everything else but. the north. The North Woods League was doing in also and. Just because of the way, their league is setup they they have. A ton of money burned from the league level, and so they bought equipment for all their teams to have a streaming setup, and they set up with how to get announcers, and and all these different things as covers, college interns, or whatever I thought man. That'd be really cool if all of the teams in the League. Did video streaming their games, and so we inquired about that, and then then Presto sent us a kind of a road mapping, and what that could look like for each team, so we? We made like a four year plan and. Basically almost everybody got on board right away. the vote went pretty easily in favor of creating that, and now we're just trying to ramp up and do it better, each and every year. And it's great because every fan of every team has an opportunity to watch. Their favorite players at different venues and I. I love it. I mean we had this when I was an intern to yeah, yeah, one of the things that we did to kind of help with costs to and just logistics of it is. The home team is required. That's their responsibility. Is the video feed? So you know when the paints are in Beckley, West, Virginia and you're You have a a package to watch just the paints or the entire league. You're going to get their video. Feed their announcers. And then if you want to listen to the visiting team's announcers, you can. If they have radio or streaming you can. You can do it that way. But, a it does definitely makes it easier because when we first started talking about it somewhere like we'll. Do Another hotel room for our video personnel and we've got a biologist equipment travel within, and so just made a lot more sense to go out with that route, but I think it's cool to four. If it is a college intern that comes in and announces or think it's cool for me and I'm. I'm not I'm far removed from that now, but it's it's neat to be exposed to different fan bases as well and kind kinda reminds you a broadcaster to keep in mind, even though I'm I'm the broadcaster for the Paints I've got people from you know parents and fans of the other team tuning in as well. Absolutely, actually I I loved it when we had that for Federal Hockey League. Demon so that was really nice. At the time we were the only ones to give. An audio stream for those that you couldn't see. But Jerry you bet you ring. Yes, it is yes, it is, it's. It's a little beat up because I wear it all the time, but that's what. That's what it's from and I really cool although to be honest, the tech issues with video that was not cool dealing with, but no, we got it eventually save, but they've come a long way in that regard, and that's one reason we will want the company also that we went with because. They are sort from their. End was really really good, and there are some teams in our league that I don't i. don't worry about as far as being able to pull it off from a technical standpoint, but the other teams. Just because they don't have the staff or they don't have people there year round that do this kind of thing, or maybe there might not get and get an intern. The knows knows how to troubleshoot these kinds of things. They're able to basically walk you through it and set everything up and make sure everything was good on their end. And that way we deliver a good product. You also mentioned stretch. Internet, too. I can remember time. While I was in college You would call in with your cellphone. Game from that are s idea of right state at the time. That PA and he might, he might have done scoreboard, too, but yeah I just I remember that and Presto Sports. They do youngstown state's website. That's their stats is very nice, so. They do everything now they do. So a lot of colleges have gone to their stats, especially baseball and softball and basketball because. Stack crude just like jacked up all the prices a couple of years ago. Even though it's still dos based program, and so presser came up with the alternative in and they will, they'll house it and and compile at for you and. Integrate it to your website and social media I. Mean it's just the way the options there and we've looked at some of them. From the Prospect League into the options, maybe for the future are are pretty good from that end. What do you look for in the future are what are some plans in the future for prospect TV that you'd like to see implemented. In an ideal world I would like to get to a point where we have four cameras in every ballpark in that we have a play by play and color person announcing so you have a full announced team and you have four cameras three of those, at least two of those being operated, so you would have a centerfield camera which could be locked down, and then you have maybe like behind third behind first, and then about press box, Ray-ban home plate kind of you. And that's why the North Woods League does and some other leagues and it just it really helps Polish. The broadcast in gets you away from some of that fatigue. You might have of looking at the same camera angle that doesn't move for three three four hours on end and I just think that it opens up a potential for revenue I. It just it. It makes everybody look better as a league. makes the individual teams look better from a PR standpoint? Just that you really have your stuff together and you're putting out this really polished professional product, so that's kind of the goal is to eventually get to that. We're a long way from that on league right now, but I think we have a lot of people involved that want to get there. Now, Jacob, we've talked a lot about chill. Coffee Paints in the prospect league, but what are some of the other things you do in terms of broadcasting so well I? Did her ban a football last fall but I don't think that's going to happen. Doors unfortunately. Some that broke my heart. Some good people, really good people over there community be impacted by that as well really sad to see that, but That was fun to do last fall. getting back into the football play by play game. I am actually a co host on the. Accurate heating, cooling and plumbing scoreboard show and ninety four country Wkno j the kind of the flagship iheart station there in in chillicothe, really kind of legendary station. It's been there for a long time. in so we have a a broadcast crew do a game on Friday night for football, and then as soon as it's done, they go to Wass and we. We give the scores and talk to all the coaches, and we really have a blast for a few hours on Friday nights, and then we do the same thing during basketball season as well, but then I'll do fill in play by play. For those there was a basketball game in a football game last year where I called the game, and then as soon as the game was over, I jumped in the car, and drove back the radio station and Hopton, like five minutes after the show started to to do double duty of sure, you know what that's like. but I've also done. Also done football and basketball in the Springfield area. I did that for a few years before I started doing this deal in chillicothe a couple of years ago during high school sports season, so really covered most of Clark County. and. I've done for a couple years out of college I did. Play by play for Olympic sports for Pitt Panthers television over in Pittsburgh so I'd I'd go over there. Usually for the whole weekend and we did women's gymnastics in basket or women's gymnastics volleyball. Wrestling men and women's soccer, and then baseball and softball, so that was absolutely a blast. But I just try to pick up. Wherever I can to a local radio station or or a school, or whatever if they have an opening always trying to jump in when I can? You mentioned a lot of sports. Is there any sport that you want to? Have a crack at broadcasting. Hockey hockey's is the one. So I'm a season ticket holder for the blue jackets have been for several years big hockey fan. When I lived in Rockford. Trade for ROCKFORD ICE HOGS AHL of the Blackhawks ticket so I was there all the time That's the one sport I've never had the opportunity to play or announce and I always wanted to play it as a kid and I would absolutely love a chance to. Try My hand at a Vo I hear from from some hockey announcers that I've talked to that. It takes quite a few games that kind of to get comfortable. But, that's with any sport. I mean sure practice makes perfect, but. Really for Ice Hockey. I know there's several high schools up there that that could use a play by play guy I mean. It's you know it's nice to. Cover ice hockey because the hard some good teams. Lewis I mean Dublin Jerome's Grades Up Arlington. They had an undefeated season until you know. Was it the region semi's? but yeah I mean if you have a shot at Ice Hockey I definitely recommend going up to Columbus 'cause. That's kind of it until you get to Charleston, the Dayton area. But yeah, definitely I I love ice hockey I could talk off about hockey all day. That's kind of your main jamming. Yeah I broadcast for two high school teams at venue on Youtube. So that's definitely my winter jam and get to go since Dayton sometimes. Columbus sometimes northwest Ohio so. Definitely definitely love it. Now Jacob I. Think I think I know the answer this question, but how has the corona virus affected you in your jobs well I didn't do a whole lot between so march twelve. We had Brescia and Another. One of those river states conference schools I can't remember which one it might have been her banner, which was out of the the division to a non conference game, but We had some. We had a couple of College Games there that week. And then all this stuff started happening, and and it was happening second by second. If you're scrolling through twitter and so march thirteen th. We did not go to the ballpark and until. A week from yesterday, I had not been to the Ballpark, so. It was very different. Normally we would have had. High School regionals. We would have had regular season High School Games Regular Season College Games had the river states conference tournament. We would have had the north. Coast, Athletic Conference, tournament with Wittenberg, and and all that group We would have had that at the stadium, so that was the biggest change just not being at the Ballpark, basically for two months still doing a lot of the social media digital side of things I, really kind of ramped up the player announcements hoping that we were going to start July first filling like we probably weren't going to, but hoping still so since being sitting at home, and not being at the Ballpark was certainly big change. Yeah My Tail is similar yours where? I had four college baseball. Games announced three between Dayton endorphin Kentucky and writes they Miami, and that was it. That was my last. Tuesday and They were sitting I was sitting on my bed, scrolling through twitter all the one night and The NBA was playing and. The one player tested positive, and they like quarantine both teams right before the game started, and then I think it was the big east. There was a game in the. At halftime, one of the biggies tournament games. And just like as you scrolled. It was like every new tweet on your feed was. This is canceled. That's canceled. This is shutdown quarantining this and I think at that point. We kind of knew that we were going to be in for the long haul. It's like that scene from planes, trains and automobiles. Just, all the flights go from Delilah canceled like Ingram Thinking It was that Saturday Dayton Northern Kentucky game, and you just hear all these things then the Atlantic ten decides Nope, no. No College Basketball Tournament for us and Yeah just kind of spiraled from there, but Yeah I was hoping to have a baseball July first just because a I. It would have been my first year champion city, and I was really looking forward to getting back to baseball and working with you and everyone in the League and. Yeah. That's not happening until twenty twenty one so. I can't wait. I can't wait either. I hope they're sports in the fall. I mean sure you're hoping. We have high school football, but. Now Chile coffee I mean it's. It's a big town, but it's not like a major media market like Miss Dayton. Cincinnati. What would you like to see in the future for Chile coffee? Sports media. I would like to see a little bit better. Local media coverage we used to have a beat reporter from the local newspaper at the stadium every single day, writing a game story in a feature story in the paper. Unfortunately, the reality is you know they lost their printing press, and then they had the printing Columbus. WHO's printing for everybody and now printing all now print in Indianapolis, and so the deadlines now at five o'clock. In the evening and the game doesn't start till seven, so that makes it difficult. I will say though that the the folks over at the gazette have done a good job. The last couple of years of trying to give us that coverage in an online format at to get the information out there and then run some feature stories that don't necessarily have to be as timely and then we've got a a gentleman who was the editor who started his own website. He covers high school sports in the area and They've done a lot forest as well, but it'd be cool to have some TV media or or something of that effect which I doubt we'll ever happen but That would definitely be a big help from a media standpoint as far as getting the promotion of the team out there because I mean even twenty seven years in we get people come out to the Ballpark for a high school game or a Bleejon Ballgame or college game. Say I had no idea this was even here. We're four four miles north about four miles north of downtown on the VA hospital property kind of tucked back in the trees behind golf course, and so you can't really see us from the road in it if you don't know you don't know. If you're not you know. Part of the chillicothe community center. I guess that makes sense. For those interested in joining the broadcasting field. What advice can you give? Do every job you can. And meet everyone you can have relationships with those people. Be multitalented I suppose I think getting into the broadcast game at the lower level. It helps to be able to offer something else a lot. I know just from a baseball standpoint. If you WANNA be full time twelve months out of the year then in Minor League baseball a lot of times. You have to be a salesman, which is not my jam at all. Helped me. Is I do a lot of graphic design and anything that is print or web based with our logo on it usually comes from my computer, whether it's a digital ad or a print, ad or a program or any of that stuff, so we save money as pay as versus paying a company to design all of that stuff and print. It so that that helps their helps a your foot in the door, and then you can say hey. Why don't you let me play by play here also, but you can never meet enough. People in have enough relationships with people around the business. How can people follow your work on social media. So I probably most active on twitter posted a lot lately. Just because they're in the main thing going on, but at K. J. wise the number seven. K, J W I s e the number seven. on facebook and Instagram as well. I think if you just think Jay wise. Thirty nine is my instagram. I probably post lot of pictures of ballparks. I usually, if I'm going to broadcast a game I'll post a photo up there in in a wink to where you can listen in also have a website. and. Check I think just changed the name of it. Might be. That might be a little helpful. and. He's Jacob. WISE MEDIA DOT COM that'll get you. That'll get you where you're going. So I've got samples air on. Some of my experience also have. Like design samples and spotter charts on there for my different sports I usually create my own spotter charts. I have my own scorebook. that I use and I have another one that I sell but all is some samples for different sports on there as well, but that's Jacob Wise Media Dot Com. Jacob. It's been great to talk baseball, even though we don't get a season this year. It's been a lot of fun. Thanks for coming on the PODCAST. It's been a blast my first podcast. I one. Wow, I, know you mentioned off air the sound check that you had plans to start one for the paints now we're going to call it horsing around based off of the name. Of the paint, horse and I was going to do it. Basically a weekly just update on the League and the team out a big first episode plan, and then it started to look like we were going to have a season at all, so that's kind of pushed back to. Probably middle of May Twenty, twenty one. I forgot to ask give me the story about the paints name all right so frontier league starting in one, thousand, nine, hundred three. All the teams were kind of in the Ohio Valley region. And with the name, Frontier League like the original logo was a baseball with a coon skin cap was very frontiers. IW, which is a great logo by the way, if you can find one I, think they should sell like vintage shirts. But? All the teams had frontiers type names. You'll have alley redcoats. The Lancaster Scouts the Kentucky Rifles so like there was very there was definitely a theme league-wide there and If you pull out of the parking lot at via memorial stadium in chillicothe. And go like. An eighth of a mile down the road. There are Indian mounds. That are like you can go visit and see and learn about all of the history and that area was very. Heavily, populated native American history, there's the outdoor drama tecumseh in chillicothe -I says a lot of that history in the area and the preferred warhorse of the. Native American Indian is the paint horse and so that's why we went with the paint and we have the Horse logo has nothing to do with the painting, the side of your house or your car anything like that but I it stock, and it's been around for a long time, and people recognize it now whenever you go places Clippers game. If you look hard enough, you'll find a paints logo, T shirt, or had or something floating around there at Huntington Park but it's it's become a really cool thing. It's a fun story to tell. That has meaning to the city and Kinda back to the roots of the team starting back in the early nineties. Now I love the history of the paints name, but I I. Don't know if I don't think I ever realize the Value Beginnings of the frontier. League that everyone was named after a frontier type of thing. But nowadays you look at it. It's like you got the y'all's. Minors Yeah Yeah. Now you got. How many teams are in Canada like three? Well? Yeah, because they just merged with the Canam League, so they have several there now man the travel on that WHO. Yeah Yeah. But Jacob. It's been great catching up and hopefully I get to work with you next year. Looking forward to it can't wait for baseball. Season next summer. And that will do it for this episode of the Cincinnati and Dayton sports podcast. We'll talk again for episode one fifty seven. Thank you for listening to another episode of the Cincinnati and Dayton sports podcast with Lee w Maolin. To subscribe to the podcast. Please visit the lead W MAUI DOT com slash podcast from there. You can choose your favorite platform such as apple podcast, Google podcast tune in spotify, the iheartradio, APP and many more interact with the podcast and hosts on twitter at the Lee. W Malan and that's pod like the facebook page, the Cincinnati and Dayton sports podcast and download the free flick jet APP then search for the local Sunday sports group to submit your future Mallon's mail back questions. The closing theme is lights. Go down by Dan Hennig provided by the Youtube. Music Library Collection. This. Is Lee w Malan and I hope you enjoyed this week's podcast. Please join me again next week on the Cincinnati and Dayton sports podcast.
Como ganhar dinheiro com podcasts no Spotify
"See News. Oh like adulthood bank complainer Wesson. You lose who who genucel silver? Purposes switchmen, not Shas hippo. Open Yours he principal. To speak ashes. chillicothe migos responded podcasters. Them with? Casey's down Logica these. Westminster and yet has has seen us the line. She tweeted I. Hope I. Suppose mobilizing, we commit idol ready cash Pontecorvo as I see news. Almost stock is deficit. Cases New spotify. which petrified! Ed's philanthropy marketing. The Plataforma Dreamy voter parakeets pro Tories Foucault Manages Asas podcasts that my former Komo Google ads. Coach! Don't decide youtubers. Really. Party pleasure Jira. He'll tortoise because this is. I think we'll go out saying see WHO's initiatives. PODCAST is the ultimate to see buzzy infamous moments with sexual issues positive which Lizardo Sees. House for cash. He gets up. My Komo's products is going to. Say the cash. Comment assumes sabotage the money as spotify intake. The sports five podcast edges independent auto new linkages point to be desired. Vision Montana completed innings. Cooperatively Ponta Comfortable Hiba. That's episode news. Sees Him yes. Yes, news! Says agrees by thing says to the sponge, Cassius. Four hundred yourself you. Shakoor Nova Plataforma per. Who, WHO MIGHT BE BRASILEIRA boy? I said we do be. Finish monthly. Got You Vince Plataforma web part of gases? What's it when you put their o'clock Hour Solo Zip? got a peaceful now. He's other today few BARACUDA member they key. Issues. The. ATHOL passage associated. Possibility dodgy. Could I don't Know Suzy Patricia duties? Why because you will set sodomy tiger to? Lebron Assessment Visit Babu. podcasts Apache Jewish. We'll see. We'll heavy Gerald support. It didn't a family's. INTERESTED IN SAYS SO I. Guess you, who would you want to combat casters? You Heavy G-go social? As part of dependence. US Pay. Cash von disappear. Eliminate Damage Idols L. Mommy. Parabola real stories, you say visas normal Spaghetti Seacombe. Judaism Practica, Give Act's involving. Shows URNAL's epilepsy rookie grudges applic- achieve with Komo. Apple podcasts fight Bundoran Google particularly in breviary means imprecise, yours pedagogy poem Weekday as simple Apple Kilo essentially mangy. She was quasi-exclusive, Sham EPO news today. Want to. Stop our approval so cash. No as Ishmael quench your magic occupied until mental Publico for some interest. Modesto's improperly is odds. Nathan to invade significant. One to zero Gusta precipitously. while. We're will be with US Promo. So this is shefty. With Georgia Pacific content. was much fight. Point you to add up. We are broadcasters to be. Saudi Isham program appreciate other parliamentarian Parliamentarians Divorce. His behavior thousands as. Abacus Jimmy Nadia's ethnic episode has been ideas, and but it's a primitive acquits appreciate aparicio. Doing doors fas, who Soviet two? Thousand Two Presencio Jack, would music week. But you being will say Kuunemae or hosted British on Algebra guys. His sepe such because so yeah. I'm but it'll be savior, Sedgwick Asana. Who Me figure you buddy be is tight compliancy. Why made you the dollars cash or feeding linke? MELISSA DOT COM sausage apologize in Korean mcaliskey Ellison. Such Ricardo Bill De Tech Lab. Platform at UC, dodgy immunities are so spreaker operates industrials pre made a choice publishers consortium simple as a scholar named grungy follow mitochondrial will do nine hundred Pudgy cashing impresses you. Comunicacion Khumalo Megyn, Asia. because. Do you global so was epilepsy publisher Ski Shackle? My importance adulterer mafia just cash is the ankle. New Speaker. They've. Globo with into the PODCAST. Movement does move ancient. Texas! By the SUBE issue to deal with the podcast movement, unless okay. This pair of my vintage cash with two hour John Kelly Zanu. Party cash movement. Veto Kit Adversity. You deserve the original video within the competition I, imagine since who by nasty. E palace. For The New York Times Company thumper Arsenio productions I'm lucky producer project cash CEO I Linda. With the Tonio Female Demolliens, cheesy South Africa point this American Life, keep me, question to our global abode under the stars Y'all. Did you browse new GUAR cereal productions? equable market you even as you publicity edgy look at times. We? spotify cases issue. Who could survive on what we got you will send. Plan! Solar Pungo, handsome. We'll do y'all fantastic, won't they will do visit? Caches we spotify Komatsu Stash. Use Damage to risk fighting sucessful, not platform Google island you quenching out of pushing discipline down visit up zero deluge, Acopia, saint and edgy. WHO's GonNa? WHO's they? Just want to visit stop. Twice more of his totals. WHO SPIES SKINCARE? spotify spotify five coffee more equality for your cashing feed. You appropriate, Tara, do spotify you know who's a SAS? Jay JC stop racial over here to Michigan Michigan podcasts on buzzing Kinshasa's Saginaw twitter in facebook. DODGERS NEW BUDGET AS A. To a facebook Tara Tara says nobohiku social. Type Studio Move Wagito defeat any type Studio Emma Manila Nov. if suggest I, don't you simplest migita not to? That you moved to the video and Jakarta. PODCASTS is key phasing through as atrial visas. On Youtube. A Fuzzy Edgy titled. Do Committee skew system. Gravy type to fight today. Just jump out of. Bosnia tastes to aged due. To pay me terrifically so is. Visual. Pathway what below Jewish days is equipped our. See if into dollars his his big moment. We'll say thousands of protesters to authorize. Is Simple gap in who's who but Cook Rainy Co then just pay. Cash. She's blueberry heavy. Luna's just see is. Something, precipitate is so blue we MUSICA, in public ashes not. Significant you even a solicitor, so inspire pit Eliza podcasts via spill here. He called the Industry Association of America. protecion appropriate intellectual while yet Jesus e grab outdoors. We'll donors appropriate agitated to our that musica is. The under part of. Who spoke gases? Complete as musica instills, programmers comes to my own. You hide your. Guests you combing dot. Yes! Yes, see news! Yeah, Hickman A. New Jewish Takeshi Glue Jim Carey's. When modest does Chris by the energy, any freight us hope. Won't Rossi store. That's my lucas equality confidentiality. As. As as Komo's Sarah. Edge sex roof, Beta humid ten a booster bill clear anger Assad do. You. Cash out Georgie West News. Debate the. Cheese as a present. This this interiors e. About two dozen consumer, his big Linke Se, your coach Ponta, where Hiba has news, hippies, audiences saint. To New Jersey, but because just spot up. Twenty five. Cash in caches adapted. To as you point guest Nasi, keep it to that. Sell phillies assault assaulted. The evening. Calls leaky service in helping them on the. Air Yes yes, news is Delta. Zone Lucius hit. By saying. Those podcasts? Yes yes, teaching via gas job at Asu.
Sliced Bread (Entry 1172.MK0652)
"This Nisa we are Jennings and John Rodrick. We speak to you from our present which we can only assume as your distant past the turbulent time that was the early twenty. I singer during the great cataclysm that will surely befall our civilization. We began this monumental reference of strange obscure human knowledge these recordings represent our or attempt to compile and preserve wonders esoterica that would otherwise be lost so whether you're listening from an advanced civilization or just reinvented the technology to decrypt our transmissions leggit you. This is our time capsule. This is the on the bus you have accessed entry. One one seven two dot M. K. zero six five two certificate number five zero nine to five sliced bread inventor. Can you seem to the outside world like you might be a tinkerer. Is that right. Do I give off a tinker vibe. What's he building. What's He got his work bench. Yeah do you do you ever. Do you ever have a brainstorm where you think you know. I just made the perfect spouse trap spouse like am. I building a trap for myself or for a new spouse well. No you don't need a new spouse. Here's houses great so yeah I guess I would need both one to kill off the current spouse like tiger trap and then some kind of honey trap for the newspaper. Spouse seems hard to trap. She's very concerned here she she she tried to paint like a fake tunnel on the wall of ecliptic and she would run into it and she did but she disappeared into the tunnel and then. I tried to follow her and Bang I hit right into the wall. Have you ever have you ever put a big pile of bird seed in the middle of road. Put put like lead pellets and she's not that into birdseed. I had to put in Greek yogurt just a big big BLOB ingredient in the middle of the highway in the southwest so are you. Do you come up with ideas. Do you come up little machines. I don't really have the. I don't really have the knack I would like to. I I remember as a kid always wishing. I could build a robot and thinking you could hit. Let's go down to the junkyard because people in Children's books are always doing this. Hey let's go onto the junkyard and then we'll build a robot and then we'll make it to who are chores. It's a little rascal I could never. It turned out to be so hard to even to even imagine how it would work back that I you know quickly gave up on all these plans. I was the same way I wanted. I wanted a soapbox racer go-cart so badly but my dad wasn't particularly handy and I did go down to the junkyard. Nice scavenged some old wheels and a rod that would work as a as an axle and some milk crates and a steering wheel from a boat. I mean you know I lived in because I grew up in the nineteen. Eighteen forties junkyard still were full of. UN spanky and Alfalfa went down but I couldn't figure out how to fasten all these things together exactly actually how do you put it together so headed out in the in the in the garage and I put it I put stuff on top of each other so that it looked like a go cart but it would not roll nor would it support my weight and my dad was no help you know he he I would ask him for help and he'd say well. It doesn't have to do with towards back to you if your dad to also all about torts yeah exactly but my kids have to invent things for school my son in particular last you had a very mechanically minded physics teacher so I was hoping he would be learning the laws of thermodynamics and he's like no. I just have to build a roller coaster where it takes the ball exactly twenty we seconds to get from here to here and I like that I honestly for an engineering career. That's probably really good prep yeah but it just meant that he was he and his smelly friends friends are constantly in the basement trying to get the making mistakes mostly Legos. That's the one thing I didn't realize as a kid like you should really just no wonder what the project does the Diorama for school the you know the the invention for the science fair. Just you just make another Lego. are expensive. That's the problem problem. Make them out of mega blocks. Nick them out of the not so good leg. That's not good. They really aren't you'll. You'll get worse grade but in this country we love inventors us and we're so proud in the United States of the mid to late nineteenth century and early twentieth century we are responsible for so many a new invention so many new conveniences that that were meant to improve our quality of life the patent office was working overtime they were working over the mouse straps and whatnot and it was a very American century or an American era. The era of the backyard tinker who who develops a you know a system that ends up being widely adopted a lot of it motivated by a desire to free us from drudgery three. I think by the late nineteenth century drudgery became a like a a major bugaboo for for for people as they realized though the railroad has shorten distances and the Telegraph has has a short distances were now able to live live like rich people and but as middle class people yeah when all you have this drudgery. You don't even notice you just assume I'm gonNA wake up and then I'm GonNa do backbreaking King Work for sixteen hours and I'm going to go to sleep and then it'll happen again until Sunday but but at this point we cleared the forests and and we were starting to build all these ingenious little apparatus and it sparked the imagination of the country and if you think about what life would would've been like for your average person in eighteen fifty and compared to nine hundred fifty sure we got soft we will but also been life in eighteen fifty in life in fifteen fifty for the majority of people more or less the same down and get water from the well and so forth but by nineteen fifty the the average American had access to an awful lot of modern appliances a modern conveniences that we we don't even think of whereas being the province of wealthy people now yeah laundry like nobody had that electric light indoor plumbing. I mean it's all laziness is very strong motivator five billion people in the world that that that don't have access to even door plumbing right writer doorknobs even or or even turn out if you could choose one if you could only have a doorknob on your outhouse or indoor plumbing and in fact over almost if indoor plumbing is off off the table right if if if if you risk losing indoor plumbing to choose any other convenience. I'm going to go with plumbing and Blah in a blind test depends on where you live live door behind door number one door. We live in a rainy climate. We have very strong reasons to not be wandering the yard in the middle of the night although you do it anyway the way you're you're saying committed. If you lived in a desert climate you would love to go poop in the news in the yard. It's a big if you live in the desert. It's a big litterbox. Basically there's yeah no need to trouble your tent but one of the one of the phrases that has become kind of a a like the catchphrase of this kind kind of tinkering ingenuity is is a very distinctive American phrase. It's the best thing since sliced bread or the the greatest thing since sliced bread. It's very interesting phrase because it suggests that the best thing you could think of in that moment as you were trying to finish the metaphor was sliced red that came in slices rather than loaves and because we are children of the late twentieth century we we cannot envision a time when the lack of sliced bread was ever an issue for people. It seems like it seems like a pretty small extra. Step to slash your bread when you think about the upgrade between a hole in the ground in your backyard and flushing toilet next to your bedroom. That's game game changing yeah. We're electric light versus sure and to me. That's not there when it's a piece of bread that you have to cut with a knife versus versus a piece of bread that you don't have to cut with a knife. It's a it's an improvement. Don't get me wrong sure but it's a tweak. It's like it's wallpaper. We're from a time when when fancy people actually started to prefer to buy unslinging br. I was wondering if you were going to get there. It's the the slow food movement that's right. It's pretty fancy and I'm not going to get like my kids want me to buy like a wreck rectangular prism of sliced bread because that's the kind of white gummy stuff they want on their peanut butter sandwiches because their children and I'm like but look at this beautiful artisanal Baguette to foams. It's from hall. Seattle's Seattle's overpriced bakery like we should get this well bred of course has spelt it does have spelt probably has spelt bread is is clearly a very symbolic too human beings. We have used bread as a as a medium of exchange. I mean bread is like the ultimate sort of staple staple. We say our daily bread to mean food to be food right although when I say we maybe the West like I'm sure the Chinese rice. I'm sure the Chinese he's metaphor is rice. I think I think that's actually true yeah right in in in Chinese translations of the Bible when when when when the Bible in the Westwood Read Our daily bread give us this day in China. That's translated as give us this day our daily rice well. It makes sense yeah. I'm sure it says give us this day or daily potatoes. ooh. I don't think it does no no the Irish use the same Bible as the as the English in Portland doesn't say gives us the Stair daily Qinhua. I think it does in Portland. It says give us this day our daily wheat beer we'd beer beer. Do you have to have one of those day vitamin but but sliced bread bread is very symbolic right and and the technology to make whiter and Whiter bread was something that was also happening in the nineteenth century because dark breads Rye bread. CD breads were seen as the province of the poor. It has nothing to do with preference of taste. It's just the kind of people I've seen eating them. Yeah that's right. These hardy breads are made by by Polish immigrants or they're they. Are you know they're they have a kind of eastern European feeling but they're also the easier bread to make you get a bunch of grains together and grind him up in an in it goes and to refined flour to make it well. The process of refining it is was extremely laborious and then in the mid nineteenth century they they developed rolling we processing where the where the little grain the little grain would get kind of squeezed under a roller and and the colonel would shoot out and leave behind all of the wheat germ and the chaff the brand prince probably the nutritious nutritious part and then you could grind up this this these little colonels colonels and make white flour and then you could additionally process that until you have this like cake flour or you can bleak it. I at least you literally. You'd be literally put like chlorine or address and peroxide or something to make your it's not it's not an accident that it kind of in addition to not being what. I've seen the poor's eat. It's also got a white pure color right right it. Just an accident of of color caller theory means that it seems cleaner nicer like snowy snowy bright and I'm sure it's led to all kinds of problematic racial views as well as this is our culture that white bread is better than Brown bread. The white things are better than Brown things and white cloth the white closer better and you know we accidentally applied to complexion election as well right. It's awful. I don't know if it's an accident. It might be self serving for the people who have white bread colored skin but white bread a- as white flour and white bread Were you know I arriving on the scene. They were rich people food. You know this was this the the idea that you could take the colored we'd germ out and only have a the purest part of the wheat. You know it was expensive to do you and white bread was was a was a luxury good things that happened with food luxury goods right. It's just whatever's hard okay difficult to get like saffron doesn't actually taste as good as garlic but saffron costs ten thousand times pint. What garlic cost because you have to put? What's what's much yellow with to pull it from? You'll yellow anther crocus planned or something whereas you know garlic's everywhere what was interesting about white bread was the more and more process it was of course the less and less nutrition was in it right as you said everybody know that they didn't know they did know it and by nineteen by by the nineteen forties people were getting Berry Berry and pleurisy and they they they were they were not getting the nutrition and there's a significant amount of nutrition in in seeds and and dark bread and there's almost none in white bread so by the forty s it was I think in the it was like early. Forties South Carolina of all places was the first state to mandate that that white bread be enriched with vitamins and iron look. It's this is so bad for you. We're going to artificially put the things you need back into it right. We're putting we're putting vitamins in it. Now and by nineteen forty four there was a became national law that all like yeast raised wheat products had to have fortification vitamins and other nutrients put into it and that's still true right all that all that enriched enriched bread. I took my kids out to that animal park on the Olympic peninsula retired Disney started out with retired Disney movie animals knocking walking around but now they've got herds of zebras vices and whatnot and they'll just reach into your car and they'll want to eat because for many years we treated these wild animals like ducks. We went people would just show up with their big lows of wonder bread and you know the llamas have they'll stick their head in your drool over you know you have bread but at some point in the honestly the eighties or nineties maybe remember this animal rights groups complained that this isn't the bleached white flour bread is not what any yeah these animals reading the wild and in fact. It's not healthy for them. They're not getting the nutrients they need even with the South Carolina mandated iron or whatever so they were. They were protesting this the existence of this wildlife park and with good reason. It's absolutely not wrong yeah. It's it's just like it's just like feeding them marshmallows for all intensive purposes but but then it was during that period the mid twentieth a century that white bread became gradually over the course of our lives whitebread went from being a an expensive commodity or at least a privileged apprised thing to have your lunchbox because my mom wouldn't buy wonder bread. She wouldn't buy white bread she only would buy we've bred from the three day old rack back when I was like yeah and so I you know opening my my my speed racer lunch pail and sitting kind of shame at the honey-soaked crust of my or a wheat while all the all the fancy girls around me pulled out. There wonder bread sandwiches. I feel like as a kid. We had the wonder bread. I and I associated that with my parents generation. I thought it was cool to have the Brown crunchier. we'll see you. It's a little bit. You're a little younger than and that's what happened in the Wildlife Park Doc as well. The the the park agreed to the animal rights protesters objection. The animals should not be fed white bread and now what happens is when you drive into the park. They will issue so you a loaf of whole wheat bread. That's nice which you can then you can then feed the cheapest whose bread vice and I'm sure that's much more like what they eat on the Savannah when you go to the supermarket now there are five hundred kinds of CD crunchy nutty Brad Dennis in Seattle. It's harder to find just a boring squishy white right breads impossible almost yeah and of course my daughter still the first time she had a sandwich on white bread. She was blown away by it like like because it is it's just like eating and and so of course she prefers it because it is. It's just like it's it's the bread equivalent of macaroni and cheese my wife the kids by getting something that's it's somehow it's a wheat bread but it's colored white. I'm not sure how they're doing this and maybe it's a scam well. They do have they. They do have like albino wheat there. Is that the whole. The whole grain is there but it doesn't have any color. The problem is that if you leave the germ in when you make the flower the flower will go rancid because the German living stuffing. Let's get a longer shelf life so if you take the germ germ out if you if you process it all this this like super processed flour can sit on the shelf a lot longer like indefinitely but if you but whole wheat flour flower with the with all of the German at yeah goes bad so does the sliced bread metaphor refers specifically to like is that from the you white bread era. I mean when some who who were the first people to sell pre sliced bread. A Lotta stuff was going on during this period of the How much of the shares are saying a lot of stuff was going on during this period of stuff. Let me tell you about this period a lot of stuff going on unlike other periods which had few stuff's throughout the nineteenth century and before like I mean people recognize that toasting bread was delicious and the way that you toasted bread was a little kind of cage yeah put the bread and the kids it over a fire in Iraq over the fire. That's right and then flip it over and and and toast the other side making s'mores. I think I would rather just eat bread doesn't seem worth the trouble to me well. A lot of people felt the same way in the late nineteenth century during this age of invention sort of contemporaneous with with Edison trying signed to perfect the light bulb. The other major research in that direction was to create eight electric filament that would toast aside of bread so they're trying to the easy bake oven. Basically these were the two things that mattered most of them like we could get elimination from this technology but also couldn't toast bread. Can we get toast and it was harder to get the bread toaster than it was to make the electric light bulb because because the electric light bulb that film it heats up within of the vacuum of the bulb so there's no risk of fire there's no risk of the the the the controlled environment inside the vacuum whereas toaster to be next to something very flammable right and then the filaments would tend to melt. They tend to catch on fire. There were a lot it was a lot more complicated to make to build the first toaster so Thomas Edison's. Just a moron basic says it's like Oh. He's over there with his life. The easiest thing whereas in the next lab Garrett toaster is working on his namesake invention. Well it was actually the first electric toaster is from Scotland it was invented ended by a guy named Alan mcmasters not mcmasters but mcmasters silently Scottish in one thousand nine hundred but it but it kind of you know I it continued to who evolve it was sort of invented again in the US in one thousand nine and the original toasters you had to turn the bread it would toast one side and then you manually pick the bread up. Flip it over to the other side. It's like record players yeah right exactly eventually they had the kind that would read both sides birth and send so then there was a lot of there was a lot of experimentation in the in the toaster field trying to invent a toaster that would flip the bread head automatically box. It wasn't like the they didn't imagine put put the toasting elements on both sides. It was how do we how do we get a lever or something that the flips the brand and knock amichis tape deck. Can you imagine the guy that had the I woke up in the morning was like wait a second. We can just have a second set of filaments well. I do know who that guy was. That was Charles Strike in nineteen twenty six who invented the first pop up toaster the first toaster that is like a contemporary contemporary toasters to toast the bread on both sides and it knows when there's a timer to tell it when to stop toasting which was a well initially it was the the problem with early toasters was that the first set of toast you made took a lot longer than the second set because it takes all that time too he torma so there so that was. I mean believe me. toaster technology continues to evolve There should be starter bread. You put put in you know like like this. First Marriage is not going to last here like charter the hell out of our this they they they came up with various ways of sort of the toaster coaster either pre heating or toaster. You know instigating having internal dynamics that would tell you when the toast was hot enough like low temperature sensors thermometer toasters now are one of the one of the first places that the Internet of things started to to reside toasters that were connected to the Internet toasters that you could. There's a toaster that will take the daily weather weather report and toasted into your bread so that if it's a sunny day you're toast will look differently than if it's a rainy answering during a problem that no one actually has no one cares all as you have been eating toast in our thinking. Why doesn't this bread. Tell me the weather forecast. There's a toaster that actually has two slots for hotdogs so you can toast your bread and too hot dogs like you put them in vertically. Can you put a bunny well. I guess I mean yeah. I think the toaster actually the slots are rounder so that you can put buns in and make I mean that's. I guess that's solving a problem. I didn't know ahead. That's more like the that's more or like the solving the problem. What do I get Dad Right. That's exactly right. It's like this. Nobody wants this thing but it's a it's a novelty so it's a gift and it sits in the kitchen for about a month and then moves it to the garage. I guess we know how large must be a sandwich. You can make them in a toaster. Oh you're just GonNa Wade right into that. I don't WanNA get in trouble. you know there are toasters remain kind of a problem in America you have you. Do you have a problem in America well yeah because like over eight hundred deaths from electrocution right. toasters are still a little because people will just jam before they're like an electric fire on your counter and and yet there are all kinds of bad things can happen. Toaster can catch on fire at any at any moment frankly and that is probably at the center of our story story because the toaster invented by Charles Strike. If you are hand slicing bread I knew your fancy pants and so you do this periodically. You hand sliced bread. I do have to hand sliced bread. It's it's hard to get your bread into uniform slices and if you're using an automatic toaster and putting sort of randomly sized slices in the toaster the toaster does not work as well. Oh bread will get jammed jammed up there too thin cook fast. The thicker pizza is one of one slice wolf can fold over and collapsed under its own weight. the other one won't even go down or or won't pop up with extremely dangerous. I mean that's what usually happens. It doesn't go down so you know the thing goes down the breadsticks you jam it down and then it will pop up. You'll hear the click but nothing POPs so we can only imagine how these these worlds are colliding but but a man named auto row vetter are Rohwedder who lived in Davenport Iowa while he was a he studied to be an optometrist he he was a jeweller are there. He ran a series of jewelry stores but he was a tinkerer. He was one of these great Americans who was out in the garage trying to invent a better mousetrap and the problem problem that he identified in the world was that bread was unevenly sliced bread. Slicing bread was an onerous task. It took up so many man hours and it could be there was a there was a way to automate and he worked on his worked in his garage on his automatic bread slicer. This is in this is before the invention of the toaster as we know it the pop up toaster but it is after the invention of the toaster coaster where you need to flip the bread yourself but these things are happening contemporaneous. We've got technology advancement on the toasting side. We've got people moving ahead on the slicing side like we've got wheat being refined. We're were. It's just like the moon landing. It's like the Apollo Hollow Program. Let a thousand white flowers bloom right like so much is happening at once. We're going field. We're GONNA we're going to transition from a time where loaves are shaped like turtles to a time when you can go into any. Deli in America and get a uniform ham and cheese sandwich that looks the same people that kind of efficiency is if you can stack the bread red neatly at ships in or easily really seems future bread to these people well auto works and auto had that great that great quality that a lot of inventors venter's do where he believed in his he believed in what he was doing and he committed to it fully he sold his jewelry stores and poured the money into his bread slicing machine plans and mockups. His wife's like odd all hot. Oh come on honey but there there was a tragedy. There was a fire in his workshop that burned all of his his mockups all of his designs all of his plans hands and it set him back it sending back ten years. Maybe not ten years yeah. Let's say let's say ten set America back ten years red technology well. We America didn't even know what it was missing because the thing is pre sliced bread. No one knew they needed sliced bread. It's just just like right now. You and I are sitting in a world that future links can only try to try to imagine what it was like for us to live in a world old pre automatic tongue scrapers or I'd I can't. I can't imagine what the new technology we knew. We'd be like auto and we'd be doing it right now. There's an auto sitting in a garage somewhere. Hopefully that garage is not on fire. Garages have autism now. I would give you a credit for that but I I can't find you. Don't call this love autoparts. Your brand comfortable well. You did you you you you really hit one out of the park and then your second one was kind of grounded thrown out at first but auto undeterred goes back to work and in Nineteen Twenty eight has his bread slicing machine ready and he patent it he he he gets all the necessary pounds all of his innovations and it truly is an automatic bread slicer think how far how do you must have been to the of the culture the fact that he had to punt for ten years and he was still still first on the scene. It was not an the immediate success. There were some people were people like this is not the best thing since anything there were there were some there was like a little a bit of it. Took a little bit of time there was a there was a company in chillicothe. Missouri and I think it might be chilly. Kobe because I I have a pair of cowboy boots from Olathe Missouri and it spelt the same way so it might be chilly Kotha. I'm not sure you're the you're the expert on pronunciation here. I say Missouri. So what do I know chillicothe Missouri. I don't WanNa say chillicothe because I bet you. It's a chillicothe. There is a plant called the chillicothe yeah all right well. Let's call it. The chillicothe chillicothe these that sounds like a that sounds like a quasi southern town till copy tallahassee it sounds like something that that rem would say but they accompany called clean made and this is this is going to be a subset of this episode because clean made which implies that the bread is clearly we made right is spelled k. l. e. e. m. m. a. i. D. Clean made and this it was very positive. Vacuum your room. It's very popular in the Nineteen Twenties and thirties to to have these intentional misspellings as a way of expressing kind of modern and we're still stuck with all these products Kleenex and quick and stuff where the words are misspelled clean made they start selling sliced bread there in Missouri but the the problem with Otto Rohwedder. 's slicing machine. Is that it because it also. It's a slicing and packing machine packages the bread but once the bread is sliced the loaf is all uneven looking and so what is it because it's shaved things off to make you know they just hadn't figured out if you think about if you had if you had a loaf of bread and tried to slice it evenly and keep the bread even in a in a like an elegant looking loaf shape instead of just sort of a jumble of bread. That's all sort of out of position with one another. It's more challenging than it seems and autos machine packaged the bread but in a way that looked messy and people thought that breads GonNa go stale it's a it's an unappealing unsightly unsightly presentation so so a man in in Saint Louis that same year by the name of Gustaf Popping Dick. I know I have no jokes I know but the snorted he bought the he bought. Otto's second ever slicer but he made some improvements in the in the form of the way the bread bread was packaged so that it actually sort of packaged into a a little cardboard tray that kept the bread kept the bread even in a loaf made it very appealing and then a a man by the w e long had a company called wholesome bread wholesome spelled H. L. S. U. M. C. I just don't like that kind of I think it might have been a little bit folksy to those kinds of a frontier thing a frontier where where people would spell all correct as all correct and that's where we get okay for example it was kind of an American fad spell things wrong like in a faux naive way her predict dirty down but the banjos going a little little crocs right. All the food came in crocs at the time. Everything was in crocs. You remember the shoes. Do you remember when you would get cheese in a crock last time you had crunchy. I've never had she's in her crock. Margarine a Crock you did that was our main. KROC but was it a real crocker wasn't one of those fakers Pasta Crock yeah no no. I'm talking about like earthenware crock. Where did you live that. You're getting earthenware food. Do you keep it in a river to keep I know but but in the early seventies people were I might have been the slow food movement of the time people I I got cheese in a crock and we got potted meats got other things in crocs. How much putman potted meat were you eating. They Fed me potted meat but we were poor right yeah but it was has no less than the continental baking company in Nineteen thirty who wonder bread was already a product. Wonder Bread is dates from the twenties. It's not that'll make wonder bread. Continental did at the time wonder bread if you look at a wonder bread label and it's got those very color. It's very colorful. It's probably bubbles bubbles. The colored bubbles represent the represent balloons and the name wonder bread refers to the sense of wonder that that the vice president of The taggart baking company who were where the where wonder bread originating the Vice President Elmer Klein went to the international balloon race at the Indianapolis Motor speedway and he was so filled with wonder at the balloon had all all the balloons. It doesn't seem super. Bread related brought it back. He brought it back to the bakery and was like I've got it. I've got it. We'll call it wonder bread red and I think the original the original advertising campaign for wonder bread was kind of like the one for the segue where they didn't tell you what it was. They just said a new wonder is coming. It's going to change your breadbox forever. People are like what is it. What is it it could be. What if it's an automated scooter. What if it's a hovercraft turned out to be white bread. I think more food should be named after just something cool and filled with numerous power that you saw one afternoon right right right like Doc Plaza noodles a really nice waterfall tuna fish a cool double rainbow potted meat but as has things go in business right continental baking company bought the Taggart Baking Company. All these big companies not only do they have hilarious names like come and go but they have they K- they keep purchasing one another there. It's a very competitive business. Did the pop into guy come and go but wouldn't that that'd be wonderful. Why doesn't the world give us those things on a silver in western concern. Come come and go is spelled K. U. M. S. It is that's unfortunate. It's very popular there in in Wisconsin Minneapolis someone shower well. I think other state that has sex should tell them the problem is that people from from other states on road trips always pull over and take pictures of those places because they can't help themselves and big business. That's right so why would the place change its name. It's fair enough. We're we're part the problem. Continental introduces wonder bread nationally and it's the first national personal brand that comes sliced pre sliced so wonder bread and sliced bread go they kind of introduced to the majority of Americans. There's two kinds of bread and then there's the old crappy on sliced and there's the other kind of bread so wonder bread was introduced in nineteen thirty thirty nationally by the by the Continental Baking Company and wonder bread is a phenomenon in other countries too. Canada has its own wonder bread can wonder under bret is available in Mexico and most interesting we also in Pakistan really those are its main markets Mexico Canada America in in Pakistan. All are like big one hundred consumers. I got another Pakistan story. Some create must have gone astray well. It's just you know it's like somebody had a franchise opportunity. They're like you know I'm from Pakistan. I don't think anybody has the wonder bread franchise there yet so so by nineteen thirty thirty three nineteen thirty three was the first year that more pre sliced bread was sold than sliced breads insanely recent yeah right prior to my mom was born in thirty four so alive today not having sliced bread or having depend it was is one of those things depending on the house right you go into this. This friend's house in her mom didn't buy that newfangled slash bread and then in your modern mom with her modern. Her modern puffy sleeves was like we only eat sliced bread over here. It's full of wholesome goodness. It's full of wholesome goodness. It's it's it's enrich its enrich because we squeezed all the nutrition out. AVEC and then in that same year nineteen thirty thirty three the hero of our story our Rohwedder sold his patents his lawyer bread slicing patterns to the micro Westcote Company. which doesn't I have a funny way? It's just already a funny American business name micro West Micro West co- small and Western but wonder under breads motto during this period was it's slow baked and slowest belt s Elo so is it good. Do you want breads. Said said well. It's like do you want music. That's played really slow all the time and quality. I guess you're supposed to think that went into this is the the the originators they are the originators of the slow food movement. It's just slow S. L. O. Did auto auto get rich. Get his he got rich and he became the think he sold his patents to two micro. West Cohen he became vice president of the operative. I think it was like the rohwedder slicing. division of the company is wonder bread later after their bread was enriched. Their new slogan was helps. Build strong bodies intended for ways. That's when I remember we're not getting into Myra but sliced bread was not without controversy uh-huh the the best thing sense sliced bread business people started saying it fairly soon after the invention invention of sliced bread because immediately following the invention of sliced bread someone else had an innovation that they wanted to compare to this miraculous sliced bread and so there was a there was a feeling that like in the United States we kind of have a sort of uniform size size of a bread slice but other places around the world don't want to be confined to one size of slice like there. There's different applications for this kind of sandwich you on a big piece of this and that's right for Texas toast. You WanNA thick slicer in the United Kingdom. You can buy extra thick sliced bread thick medium or thin to stick have to seize hilariousness dwelled. That's how they do it in Ireland. Oh No in fact Ireland you can can buy a you can buy bread called sliced pan which is either of eight hundred or four hundred hundred grand loaves in Japan. They have a lot of different sizes of bread slices but it's measured in terms of how many slices are in a loaf so you can get four sliced loaf. You get ten sliced. Loaf doesn't help me. I don't know how long the loaf is well. That's the thing they need to go back to the drawing board with Allen as far as I'm concerned the Japanese do not like nick do not like their sandwiches on thick slices. They want thin slices. I'm measuring Japanese. Wonder style. Bread is being incredibly square like you know how when American British Square is still has that kind of boop at the top like poofs at the top and then a longer bottom and I feel like Japanese bread really is like square like a sponge yeah well. They cut the next day they cut. The crust off is that they make it square. There's a sandwich bread in Japan is actually sold without. It's like cut Super Square. You're absolutely right. It's uh-huh for MOMS who were tired of cutting off the crest. They're picky kids right. Well just like I don't know who who knows what's going on in Japanese food culture not I. I had a friend when I was a kid whose mom told him that he wouldn't cut off the crest because that's where the nutrients were yeah spifer that to somehow goes to the outside of the low fat because it's Browner exactly surround is nutritious nutritious. I mean it's true if she's talking about an apple but she got apples and white bread confused right probably foods the three in one thousand nine hundred eighty three. There was an innovation in sliced bread. which was that a single loaf that had both thick and thin slices within the same loaf alternates yeah or either either that or it's one half of it is one kind and the other half is the other? I'm not sure however the probably both styles were invented at one point or another by some tinkerer. I would do the two ends. One person can deal at the time I can do off the bottom you have access to both but that was advertised as the first improvement since sliced bread is that the origin of the of the the idiom well all in and then in nineteen forty. There was a package of bread sold that had to half loaves within a single package and that was advertised. Does the greatest convenience says sliced bread so because it was a kind of a game changing innovation that later had a series of aggressively WLI marketed tweaks. That's how better than sliced bread best thing since sliced bread became part of American English gradually evolved but but the controversy versi around sliced bread happened during World War Two as you know and as we've probably hinted at two future Ling's in discussing this era era there was a lot of rationing in World War Two because America felt like we needed and this was true of all nations at War you needed all resources this is dedicated to manufacturing material that supported the war effort there will be unpatriotic. DABNEY's tires on your car. That's rubber you're keeping from Europe and we weren't making new cars ars that were no new appliances may during that period and also there were there were metal drives and resources drives where you would take the bumper off off your car and take him in and donate them to the war effort to be melted down and turned into battleships to to fight here. Hito and a there were a rationing involved also that you couldn't just go to the store and buy as much food as you wanted. There were it was not that it was not that America didn't have the same resources but it was that we needed to dedicate a lot of food to our troops overseas and also it was it was it was labor intensive to harvest and process food too so you got little tickets ration cards for how much meat you were able to buy in a week how much coffee or I guess you couldn't even get coffee coffee but one of the rationing suggestions or one of I'm sorry not suggestions but edicts was that in in nineteen forty three the food administration issued a ban on sliced bread a I'm not sure what is being conserved there well the idea being that sliced bread required wrapping wrapping paper heavy waxed paper to keep it together once it had been sliced through. We needed that waxed paper for the war effort and unslinging bread. You could just buy a loaf carried home under your arm. You can put it in the basket of your bike. You could put it on the behind. You're sticking your shopping bag like a French woman. That's right with your beret on a Jaunty angle and so the food administration said in January of forty three no more sliced bread in order to in order to help our troops overseas. If you're eating sliced brand you're lunching with Hitler right. The problem was but by nineteen forty three a lot of delicatessens. A lot of restaurants had their own bread slicing machine like bread slicing machines. Were not difficult to scale down to the size of a single loaf of bread or you. Don't you don't have to do a factory or a truck full. It's easy to jump jump. Jump mm send a piece of bread threw a blade so there were all kinds of restaurants and businesses that said well. What do you mean we just have to put a tarp over our bread slicing machine Ashim. That's seems Kinda. Crazy like to basically use it as a cutting board to use a knife to cut our bread but the the ban was enforced forced because if you could get bread at a place that had their own bread slicing machine that was an unfair advantage that those places had to places that had been forbidden bidden from serving pre sliced bread the nanny state Laguardia in New York state came out in favor ever of allowing local businesses that have their own bread slicing machines to continue to slice their own bread but the food administration shot him down there was a lot of Hullaballoo because a lot of people on the home front had become so dependent on the convenience of sliced bread that the prospect of going back to slicing ten twenty slices licensed bread a day. It seemed like how would we ever. How would we ever return it would be like the government coming into your house and say you're not allowed to use toilet paper anymore? Can you have to find a different way. there was a black market like by sliced bread. Drive your car some alley behind a deli. It's kind of his trenchcoat and he's got sliced. Predator on the inside of the code band did not last long. There was a lot of There's there's a lot of outcry. The Fischel stance was that they did some research and discovered that they actually had a surplus of waxed paper such that it it could accommodate both the military needs and also the sliced bread market that was lucky yeah and so in March of forty three. They repealed the ban I would tell. FDR Are you can take my sliced proud of my cold dead fingers one one major effect of sliced bread that that that I guess you you wouldn't have predicted but of course it makes sense is that it inspired a similar boom in the sales of peanut butter and jam and sandwich meats and cheese so the sandwich takes off and away it hadn't hadn't before because if you have to sit in slice a piece of bread every time you want asleep a piece of bread that extra little bit of Labor inhibits you from just walking through the kitchen and grabbing a COUPLA slices bread making his image you you are faced with the prospect of getting out a knife and cutting this crusty bread. The Sandwich had not reached its final form. That's where I'm the earl of Sandwich Zahra all you have to do if if all you have to do is Walton to the kitchen and pull to perfectly sliced iced slices of bread out and go to the refrigerator and find you make a big hilarious. Dag bums dead middle of the night sandwich and so it so the the whole like multi tentacled big Sandwich Sandwich Sandwich Culture became a mid twentieth century and phenomenon. That sounds easy we wouldn't we wouldn't need a sandwich if we had to cut the bread ourselves go away. If you had an enemy a regular loaf it'd be like it's Kinda just easier to eat a banana and that includes sliced bread entry one one seven two dot m. k. zero six five two certificate number five zero nine to five in the omnibus future. I know in your time. You say things like this is the best innovations had social media possibly ironically instead of sliced bread but in our day social media was the new sliced bread. We could not get enough of it. You know in the past if you wanted to show pictures to friends ends you would just be like yeah. It's too hard. I'm not GONNA do that like not making a sandwich but once there was once they were channels available once your information was being bought and sold and sold it was easy to do so and so John and I were at Ken Jennings John Roderick on twitter and in John's Instagram we were at omnibus project jointly on every social media network we could think of we were V. Seo girls girls whatever that is. That's the best thing since talk Jonah. She is the best thing since sliced tick tock and it's we encouraged even on facebook because we hated we encouraged our supporters to congregate on the future latest fan page inch. We encourage you to to look them up to revel with them. Joining the rebels we would receive electronic mail at our address the Omnibus Project at Gene Mail Dot Com from time to time people would even send us physical artifact cool things yeah we we get nice things in the mail now all the time and it's it's wonderful you know last week. We got eighty dollars in cash and I still haven't gotten my forty dollars from ten. You'll never see that forty dollars John. Maybe he'll send you more but you are the one that controls the keys to the PO box. I have a lot of power here. You're going to have to come. You're going to send me the money you send me and then come to John's house. Don't you that here's a postcard that says welcome to Earth apparently apparently it was sent from Earth. We have awesome. Welcome earthlings. This one is only to you John. It's a wedding invitation. Let's see if I should have opened this stereo sooner. Did we miss the wedding already know it's September good news and you have a plus one. If you wanNA bring me hey. Why don't we go to visit. It's in Rhode Island Bora Bora Laura Rhode Island. That seems like we could make that trip. It's the borbor of the Atlanta. Can you imagine the Hilarious Road trip podcast we would make if we just drove across the country to go to every point of peoples weddings asked us to go to good news. there's a discount code at the Hampton Inn and seekonk so make sure you use this code when you book us our our hotel because it never occurred to you that we have kind of Yogi and boo boo dynamic. I'm sure you think I'm boo whatever tear of fictional characters yeah. I think I might disagree with this. One's just to me but I bet I bet. It's not a wedding invitation. It's clipping from the paper. Is it about your epic. Jeopardy run the two thousand four hundred about how I hate Canadians. Oh No it's from the Washington Post newspapers. The papers from from the Omaha World Herald Okay often confused with the Washington Post was brought down a president. One of them has has the jumble. It's got people reminiscing. It's got Omaha reminiscing about the moon landing. Oh and one of them is jeopardy producer Sir Harry Freedman so this person thought to send me. That's nice what Harry thought about the she has multiple clippings about Harry Friedman's game show career. I think of all the podcasts in the world omnibus is the one with listeners most likely to still clip things from the newspaper in the Senate. It doesn't say much for the prospects of our listeners have been twenty years but as long as you all live please feel free to send us your physical artifacts to Po box five five seven four four searle in Washington nine at one five five. Please don't send cash in the mail. We're just joking. If you feel like you want to contribute to the omnibus project now that we're an independent entity with no corporate parent with fat pockets. That's not an expression pockets fat wallet's in Deep Pocket. No I think fat pockets is is the way to go deep wallets in my pocket when you were coming up. The thing is you were at Korea. You missed the whole fat pockets era. That was a real. What kind of article of clothing would have fat pockets you? You put fat pocket in almost anything. Can I have a pair of gaily colored jams. If you've shorts with fat pockets the world was your maybe maybe like a pacifier on a on a that closer for big headphones so if you would like to contribute to not to are are not fat now that we're we have thin powerpoint pocket has thin threadbare pockets but if you would like to put virtual cash in them to make sure the Ogden was continues for a long and healthy future. You can do so at Patriot dot com slash omnibus project. I think this is also the point where you tell people to go to read. It and I'm not GONNA do omnibus underscore for future links at read it. I would just like to reiterate how appreciative we are of all of our fans of all of the contributions you've made both financially and just in the contribution of your time and ear ear like Gates Open Your Gates. Somebody asked me I don't have the budget to support Fort Omnibus financially. What can I do can and it was that part out were Malcolm. X. is like nothing cracker and he walks away. No aw I said you know you just just tell a friend. You know. Tell a friend that's right. Tell ever read a nice review for Omnibus on whatever the time capsule ranking log algorithm of your era is yeah. That's true now that we are an independent show. We no longer have the media budget to continue to grow our audience audience. We are reliant on the verdict our fan community so spread the word about omnibus. You have mouths them if you ever if you click quick your mandible together Astro pod were gastro `gether pod make make communicate through your Your Heart Cer- Faramoz. Oh Yeah send out how does end up the odor of I like omnibus broadcast your Musky scent listeners from our vantage point in your distant past. We have no idea idea how long our civilization survived. Obviously we hope and pray that the catastrophe we fear may never come but if the worst comes soon this recording acting like all recordings may be our final word and by that I mean like all our recordings until the next recording it at the time we recorded each one. We were under the impression that it could be our final word. That's clearly now. We know that many are not all of our recordings are not our final except for this one. This one is absolutely once again. We are confronted with the fact that this may be our final. We're quite certain that many are not gold hats not our final word. That's right the defense the station of Prague absolutely not our final were very hard to think that they could be our final note but sliced bread. What if it is could be our final will but if providence allows we hope to be back with you sue for another entry yeah.
What Makes A Good Leader | A Conversation With Dennys CEO John Miller
"Everyone I wanted you to join me and one of my favorite interviews with Danny CEO. John Miller blessed to step on stage at their annual meeting with Magic Johnson and we talked two thousand eighteen about the importance of leading with values. And this guy is the king of that also how to create a team filled with employees who look forward to going to work. What's creates better service for their consumers. Join me in John Miller for all of this and more on the playbook. This is entrepreneurs the playbook I am with one of my new mentors but he doesn't know it. Ceo of Denny's franchise of America's that right close enough. Because John Miller. Thanks for coming on the playbook. Yeah we like to say. Then he's America's diner always open the feeding America that's right. Both charitable feeding and of course for raiders like me and we were blessed to have magic Johnson being a part of Deng's now and you're supporting his charity and his brand is supporting you. But he felt really really aligned with him when he said. I've moved from eating pancakes to eight whites yet right and eight-year-old who loves me so I was surprised. You know you really came in in two thousand eleven correct right and and you shifted the paradigm for traditional diner. Like Denny's and have been growing every year since every year. Since it's been growing sales one of the first things we did was to talk about purpose and values sort of get those life put back into those important things. Because if you don't have anything you can anchor your team to then you sort of get lost in wobbly out there so there's one of the first things we did but almost the second thing. We did not quite really early on. We knew we needed a fair menu. So Egg Wide Omelettes Slam and some of those things where early introductions we start with four items now. We got all thirteen or fourteen. That are on the menu and then hundreds of different ways people can order fit fair and then he's in its grown every year to. Yeah I love it and I was trying to negotiate with your person is. I was blessed to do a keynote. I said maybe I could get just a denny's VIP card instead of paying me speak. That'd be a fair deal. And she realized how much I eat thinks you quoted going. No no we'd rather just pay you. They've now we talked about purpose and passion and value based system as a leader in this. I believe in that so wholeheartedly. Where did you learn that in how to lead with values? I not with management. Well everybody learns it eventually so more alone in life and hope or or you die without it and you live with some regret. I think the younger you learn the better and I think life teaches these these lessons over and over but I had the good fortune learning from mom. My mom was extraordinarily purpose. Driven person very values lead and so it just sort of came natural that these things made sense to me And then when I my I had the good fortune when early in my career. Move from in high school From chillicothe the Ohio to Tulsa Oklahoma. And when you move in the middle of high school when you when you're sort of trying to find yourself a little bit you kind of find out what you believe in what you're all about really pretty fast and so I had the opportunity blessing. Good Fortune Luck. All of those things Karma coming together and I landed in a spot with a guy named Bill Wall who started Casa beneath the enterprises and this gentleman just lived and breathed value so between mom handed me off as young adult to bill. Walleye of very fortunate before I get into the values. I now realize that me you in the Bron- all have something in common now. Raw from O'Hara great place to be good values in Ohio. That's right But and cornfields gap through Let's talk about those values. Though came from your mom like mine and we have that in common. What values are important as an entrepreneur and leader? Yeah I think you gotta stay within yourself right so you can't do everything so Because you can't do everything but things need done that you can't do. You depend on others so if you depend on others people depend on you. Have you just sort of get that at the outset? One of the first things is how totally dependent. We are power the packers in the wolf. They say the Power Wolf Pack for the first thing you gotta get his the we the power way that we together can do great things but when you divide people put people on the defensive have win lose situations is not going to be as powerful. So I think that's one of the very first fundamental lessons. That life teaches you to be powerful to accomplish anything along with we though you have one of the most diverse companies that. I've seen all around the world and get to meet different companies with different cultures and values and one of the things that attracted me to this organization is how diverse it is but yet so cohesive you feel the we as one right and one is so hard to explain to people. I think I've read even about you. That you believe in collects a collective conscious oranges. Yeah you're right. Can you explain conscious capitalism? Of course can you explain that as an entrepreneur how that evolves and yet you still are capitalist? Sure well I think first of all you've got to walk the talk right so you care about people and it's evident by your behavior you don't and when when you care about people you want to include people and bring them along the way and if you if there's no inclusion than your behaviors or reflection of what you believe and then your emotions follow so if there's a conflict between what you say you believe in an actually do then it'll be pretty obvious pre- pretty fast. I think the other side of that equation is truth. He sort of follow this. If you you act in accordance with behavior I mean with your belief system so one validates the other and when you act outside of your belief system then you have this sense of internal conflict right so you can't sleep with yourself very well right. The Mirror. Check doesn't work right so I always say to somebody that that behaves badly in certain circumstances. Well that's a reflection what you believe like people that like my wife that speeds all the time said you must believe you're above the law because your behavior demonstrates what you believe so your beliefs and your babies are going to ally so in our company the reason we're so inclusive and so diverse. We believe that's really important. And our behavior follows in so it's the outcome of our belief and I think the consumer also as diverse and also believes in that and they feel comfortable coming to your organization from who serves them and who helps them. I totally I'M A. I'm a little turned off. By this business. Case scenario people say all the time that versus right thing to do right if you believe in purpose and values right thing to do should guy you first and then there should be a business outcome. They're kind of independent but they danced together. But there are but if you're looking for a business case you know after nineteen consecutive years of decline in the family category. Not necessarily. Then he's been in our category. This is our eighth consecutive year. Positive Growth and. I don't think that's happened at any eight years in sixty three years of history. So if you're looking for a business case to include people and that your customers will reward you this. This is the case for that identity and I love a case scenario of passion plus purpose but the one component I find with a lot of compassionate capitalists or leaders is. They don't know how to reconcile passion purpose with profitability right. How were you able to do that? What are some of the secret sauces that you can share some CEO's? Ceo's job is really easy. Thank goodness Because I am like the old cooker dishwasher and thank goodness. I have smart people around me. My job is to create disciples and many CEOS at every level of the organization. And if the CEO's job is this than everybody else's job is this and that is to keep those three imbalance so if I have guessed that when it come back that's going to be because of employees that want to delight guest and they're they have to want to work here and feel proud of their environment and guess coming back with employees. That love working here. Means I'll have a return. Happy shareholders if that three makeup the wheel it rolls down the road pretty smoothly but if shareholders are really doing well and has really profitable but the employee's hated guest feel gypped. It's out of balance right right about so any one of those. That are out of balance as bad. So it's bad for shareholders guest on returning. It's bad for guests. If they don't get a good enough deal so keeping all three imbalances not just about return for shareholders. It's about the balance of those three and then everybody wins and that's my job. Keep those three about and you have. A business has been around for decades based off of a basic principle of providing value feeding people. That's right and interesting enough. Though the world change is fast and we have a lot of technology a shared economy right. And it's very interesting thing. We're a little bit older right and not getting any younger and technology moves a lot faster than it used to. How have you been able seen some insights because I was blessed to some of your meetings? How would you able to grasp that technology and apply it to a traditional business one of the most traditional businesses and I think one of your mission statements is simply right? You can give it to us for feeding people. What what is the exact well so purpose? Say WE LOVE FEEDING PEOPLE. Love that. Because that's what we're doing when the people we love people and then we want to share the love so we. WanNa make sure that the purpose and the behaviors is. We spoke about a moment ago. So if you love feeding people then you'll share that love and it's going to be evident that you care about your customers your employees and your shareholders and all stakeholders on the technology side. It's a complicated question. It can fall in a lot of different buckets one. There's the technology the digital world and how you communicate with people which really challenging about this environment whether we like it or not is the truth can diet your feet. But SORTA misrepresented tweet or communication or misunderstanding can happen in a restaurant can travel around the world a few times because it can be sensational and get repeated and the full story and the truth. Can't be sensational or done in the sound bite so that does create challenges for businesses today and so the only way to deal with that is to fill that bucket full of richness. About what you stand for so that when these incidents occur people go well. That's not what I believe about them. I'll give them the benefit at least for long enough to investigate what the real truth is. So there's that digital challenge world is changing very fast and I think to some degree reversible The the other is what you do. And Invest in technology to eliminate pain points to make to make give preference to take care of our customers and that's actually a lot easier and high frequency businesses That that higher frequency than full service whether it be casual or family so technology for pizza delivery is way ahead of what you might do the full service restaurant but a little insight in time not very long from now you might think about the technology. The benefits are business. Finally as Why would I ever stand in line anywhere if I can let you know? I'm coming if I can order before I get there or while. I'm there on a weight on a busy Saturday before I even have a table assigned if I can decide when I'm gonNA fire or to cook or when I'm going to have a shake or smoothie or my coffee delivered to me I'm not really. I'm more in control. So what technology is GONNA do enable full service people in Denny's in particular to be able to deliver guest experiences that you haven't thought about before just so the rest of that time is given back to you. Don't make me wait for my food. But don't rush me if I want to stay in hanging a little longer right and you need to have options. What's interesting is I believe in a combination of traditional with digital in all aspects whether it's content data but especially in full service. I had a conversation with my wife because I said you know as I'm analyzing your business for my side and it was like God you know I love because I don't like to spend a Lotta time eating right and so for me. I love being able to be automated order paying someone. Serve me or already preordered and paid for you know one of my favorite things about shared economy of vehicles experienced here in Las Vegas was. I love just walking out of have to settle. Yeah knows that all right enough there well. My Wife said to me which is really interesting. She said Oh. I don't like that at all. I I WANNA talk to to the waitress. I I want the full service. I wanted to have an experience is a conflict. And it's almost like you have to have to restaurants now I know or to these old right. There was a smoking sex in twenty years. Here right type BS over there. I can see any someday that my wife and I are going to have to eat separately. Yeah right my eight year old and I will be over at the fast service where there's no humid's and still have a thirty minute conversation with the waiter and tipper forty percents. So I'm sociable. You're sociable I. That's obviously you smile easy. I can see but that doesn't mean you're not task oriented. You get focused on the task. There's other things to fill your day my wife. The task is always secondary. And she's always into the conversation I she will go out to dinner when she will say we're in a hurry right but she is the reason we've not ordered right so the server keeps coming around and go look. We're going to be ready so I'm the guy who's ready to order. The moment that service sniffs might do not leave the stable Lord. Everybody's so that but again all of that will be less about the establishment and their resources and whether or not the server came by exactly the right time and more about the ability to have it your way and so all in due time. If you're type table you just take that device in your order it and you're in charge of picking the day boy in the server and win the foods delivered and another party might say. I don't want any of that technology. Then don't touch it. It's okay yeah. It's there if you wanted this. Not If you don't want it we have so we're going to be able to accommodate a broader range of you know. Meet the guess where they are beautiful two last questions. One as you've evolved in such a huge success in a major impact on so many lives both philanthropic as well as capital is. What advice. Would you give your twenty one year old self today Great I said I'd say a couple things one. I really love the message in sort of discovering your purpose and people can really struggle with that question. I called him. And your frequency totally have your frequency down both personally and and as a company started up. No I appreciate that. We have different ways to express this and people will sometimes struggle. What does that mean? I don't know what that is yet or I I haven't figured that out or I'm confused Or I'm scared. Sometimes I would if I spend waste a lot of years chasing the wrong thing and I go but and I think your message is so good. Enjoy the journey to continue to improve. Associates continued discover your full potential. I just such a great message. The journey is what matters? Your purpose is to take your town. Serve others with it and then that'll give you gratification. So don't worry that it's imprecise. If you can play ball you'll play ball better the more you hone those skills. You weren't born perfect right. And you'll discover that journey will have lots of roller coaster rides but stay on it right in continue to pursue it and enjoy it. Enjoy it and just enjoy every moment of. It's like raising children. You don't you don't have children born and all of a sudden your expert right but because you love and care you find a path that successful if you put yourself into that journey if you don't if you ignore it and run from it then it's unsuccessful. I think it's just that simple if you're pursuits there that'll be honored and you'll enjoy the journey. Universe is giving me a great challenge with three teenage daughters. Great Pieces Oscar. I in you've had such a storied career but yet one thing we do share why we from the day we met We're both of service and I saw it in. Your face is at night and met you at the cocktail party. And I said I'll here's radically humble person that for the first time you dave. Is there anything I can do for you right? I love people who the first thing they say is how can I be of service whether the CEO of a major corporation or the dishwasher behind the scenes? I that's what your company represents as someone who lives service. What legacy do you WANNA leave? Yeah well you know what I'd love to see. I've got a few goals. For Denny's this'll be my last stop in all likelihood who knows what the stars what they might align in future but one of the things that that I would love to be able to do here. This is a. This is a brand that had a stain on his reputation back in the nineties. There was a Justice Department. Investigation of this brand From denial of service of African American guests and the management team the board. No-one here right was part of that. Leadership team raises an entirely different company with different goals and purpose and vision and values. And so one of the things really important to me is to be able to confront that. Turn and face it and deal with that history You can't outrun these things you have to turn and face them and most prior to millions people's I was distant past people getting old people. You turn face it so I I really want to deal with that And I want to create this model Organization for others follow. I think that'd be a wonderful legacy and a great thing for everybody part of the second part of that. That's really important to me. Is WE RESIGNED OURSELVES? Not just us but others in our category family dining where he used to be the place for families families me more than one generation. I'm out with my mom. My Mom's our there's one or two generations are involved or three generations. Mike my family with grandparents and so forth so that still persist today about forty five percent of our transactions involved two generations as higher in our category than the other but for breakfast and lunch. We sold out dinner and late night. You know sort of average food compromise. Fresh vegetables whole grain breads. You know from scratch buttermilk pancakes fresh buttermilk. When I got here is the hydrogen milk fats and egg egg and I don't know what was in that. Mix It was okay. It wasn't going to kill anybody but it was. I want real food holidays. I want quality so I want to build a reputation for an all day. Diner breakfast lunch dinner and late night. America's diner place where people can go get good quality wholesome food at a good value twenty four hours a day and not. Just be this breakfast place. So it's you know second goal and And then I think I think than we will have done something. Great people can look at us and say that was a model to follow and I wish more people could be like dinners. I'd love to people for people to say that. Well take it from me. I see a ton of corporations. And you're well on your way of manifesting legacy and it's been honored to be a part of this meeting but also have this interview and I hope that we continue this relationship and I tell people you should always ask for a mentor and I was blessed a lot of you. People ask me if I can mentor them. But on publicly asking John F. A. Hopefully I can call you sometimes and ask you a few pieces of advice is David. Let me tell you something and I am from above my heart. You really touched our team today. Don't make me cry car. Thank you very much. GonNa to cry on camera again. Dave Meltzer with John Miller with entrepreneur. The playbook hope you enjoyed this episode of the playbook but importantly I want you to join my texts community. I'm doing a lot of fun. Things there one on one conversations trainings giveaways and it's the first place. I release all the information that I'm giving so join me at my texts platform nine four nine two nine eight to nine five. That's nine four nine. Two nine eight to nine zero five joined my exclusive community.
The uncertain future of North Americas ash trees, and organizing robot swarms
"Welcome to the science podcast for january eighth. Two thousand twenty. I'm sarah crosby each week. We featured the most interesting news and research published in science and the sister journals first. Step this week. Freelance journalist. Gabriel pumpkin discusses the uncertain future of ashtrays in the united states as us federal regulators dropping quarantine measures meant to control of gracious pest also talk with researcher pablo chillicothe about uncovering the principles for organizing active matter active matter like and bridges bird flocks or little swarms of robots now. We have freelance journalist. Gabriel popkin we're going to talk about the fate of the. Us's ash trees now that restrictions on the movement of ash trees would and living trees What's been a tree. Quarantine has been lifted by the federal government. High gabriel. sarah one thing. I want to mention right away. Is these bumper stickers. Okay bear with me here. They say don't move firewood and they mystified me for years when i would see them on pickup trucks or other places but they're a sign of quarantine don't move firewood. Campaign began as a response to an insect called the emerald ash borer emerald ash borer is not the first insect or disease has ever appeared in the us that made attack a tree. And you may not want to move around. So i can't say for sure that there was never a. Don't move firewood campaign before. At any rate the emerald ash borer appeared in two thousand. Two is proven to be very devastating. It kills almost every ashtray on the north american continent that has ever encountered and while it can fly from tree to tree. One of the main ways that it gets moved around is through firewood through in other words tree. that's already dead and has been cut up but it still contains the insect you easily. Imagine someone putting a load of wood in their truck moving tens hundreds of miles and suddenly the emerald ash borer shows up starts. Killing trees starts reproducing and causing huge mayhem. The emerald ash borer is an invasive. Pest it was. I noticed in two thousand and two. What kind of damage has this bug done well. It's been called the most damaging for insect to ever raking north america. That's saying something because a lot of insects have showed up over the years ever since people started crossing oceans and a lot of damage has been done so to be. The most damaging is pretty huge. I don't think anyone's like tallied up. Exactly how many trees. The emerald ash borer has killed. But you know we're certainly. I think well into the hundreds of millions at this point i think the other thing that's important notice. That ash trees are really important trees in a lot of different ecosystems. They grow in wetlands along rivers streams. They grow in savannah's they grow on mountains in forest. So it's not like you're losing a tree in cut a one environment. All arrest are k. I think almost anywhere. I go that has trees at all. Can see dead ashtrays evidence of this insect. So if you look at the map of where emerald ash borer is it's pretty much a red blob that covers the eastern half of the us into the midwest. How does such a tiny bug. because they're really small. How does it take down such a big tree. Basically what happens is the adult beetles flies around in his green in this where you get. The name rolled asked for it finds the tree than it lays eggs on the bark and those eggs hatch the larvae that burrow into the tree and sort of start eating the layer of the tree. That's under the bar. You think of this big tree as being like all a living thing but actually the interior of the tree. The would is not living. The living stuff all happen sort of right below the bar in this layer called cambian and so once the larvae eat sort of a ring around tambien layer that pretty much cuts off everything above that layer from the roots. The roots are where the tree gets water nutrients. That's pretty much it for the tree. Now you might say well. Does this tree the ring survive in the answer is yes. You'll see the main trunk fall and then a few years later you'll see that it puts out new sprouts so in a sense the tree is still alive. But it's certainly not the big ecologically important tree that we think of now. I mentioned these bumper stickers. Don't move firewood. And that was part of a very large effort. Basically quarantine areas of the country and keep the ash borer from moving around. But it looks like we won't be having that quarantine anymore. What's happening to the quarantine was created by the us department of agriculture in specifically agency. We'll just have a fix. It's an acronym for along name. Part of its job is to protect plant health and so when it became clear that the emerald asked for was here was killing trees. It got kicked to eighth apis pretty quickly established quarantine that was intended to stop the ask for from moving from infested zone to the infested zone but the problem is asked for flies. It's very hard to detect people. Do move it around through firewood and other also selling live trees a tried to stop this. I think they did a good job for the most part. The movement of live ash trees went to almost zero. But you know it didn't do the job. Atheists has said that other experts have said that the ask for continued spreading every year you know enforcing quarantine costs money and it doesn't really have a whole lot of money to throw at this. So eventually they decided that it wasn't worth the money they were spending on a quarantine that money could be redirected towards other things. That certainly aren't going to keep the emerald ash borer from spreading but may enable the ashtray itself to have a viable future. This is like the biocontrol product that you talked about these are wasps that infect the beatles that attack the trees exactly. Yeah just to be clear like if it's been doing this for a long time. It's not like they're just starting. And this is a strategy that is often used to try to control an invasive pest disease and insect what have you is to basically find what are the species that control the original problem species in its home territory which in this case east asia and then bring some of those species over sort of try to establish that same type of control in the new environment and you might say well. That doesn't sound like a good idea or introducing even more new things but there is a pretty rigorous system where the new insects are quarantined. There thoroughly studied to make sure that they won't have negative impacts on our environment and only then are they released and then after they're released a lot of additional study that needs to be done like are they able to establish independent populations. Do they actually attack everyone spores in the wild and do they do enough damage to the emerald ash borer to knock it down to a level where trees can survive in. I would say the first. Two of those are definitely have been demonstrated the third. I'm hearing from scientists that they think they're seeing a lot of really promising signs. But i think it's still remains to be seen whether biocontrol can actually ensure the future of ash trees in america. I saw you also wrote a story for science in twenty twenty about breeding ash-trees to make them resistant to ashmore is added than another weapon in the arsenal. You could put it that way. Yeah but it's aiming at a different goal in a way. Biocontrol is intended to allow these re sprouting trees that i mentioned earlier to survive. Maybe not to survive to like years but to survive long enough that they can start making flowers and making seeds and reproducing. That's kind of the key thing right in biology. If population can reproduce itself than it's viable now these resistant trees would go a step. Beyond that david be able to nash for might find them and try to eat them but they would have enough ability to produce chemicals to defend themselves that they could continue to survive even in the presence of ashmore in fact resistant trees. The biocontrol watts could actually work together to fight against to ask for another one thing about the resistant. Trees is that you know. Biocontrol is out there right now. Resistant trees are still years potentially decades away. It's just a very long process debris these trees to test them and then to actually establish nurseries that would produce enough of these trees that they could actually be planted out in large enough numbers to make a difference. So we're looking at two different weapons but one of them is sort of ready right now in. The other is still but down the road from your story. It sounds like this quarantine at least directed from the federal level is going away. Are all the state's going to fall in line. I mean when. I look at this map. California doesn't seem to have any the west coast to have any. Are they worried about this. Are they going to keep quarantining important point so there's kind of two situations. There's a state like minnesota. That has the ashgar but still has a lot of area. That hasn't been infested. What i've read is that minnesota will maintain its own internal quarantine truly important among other things for native tribes because there are a lot of several native tribes that have landed northern minnesota. They haven't seen the ash for yet. At least as of last time. I talked to them. They expressed a lot of concern about the federal quarantine going away. And i think we're a little dubious that the state would be able to keep things going but it sounds like the state is going to try and that's really important for these tribes and for other landowners that have ash on their property. There's actually these wetlands in parts of the northern us. Canada that are really dominated by ash would be totally devastated if the emerald ash for got there the western states is a different situation. They haven't seen the ash borer yet and one could imagine. It may not get there for years. So i think they are definitely looking into ways to slow that spread to maybe even start breeding some of their trees now so that they'll have resistant trees when the ashburn gets there to answer your question yes. They're very concerned. They have a unique species. That don't live anywhere else. That for all anyone knows are completely vulnerable to the s for. They definitely are thinking about what they can do. This purely a scientific decision to change over to get rid of a quarantine. There are financial considerations as well. One thing that i i've heard from several people. Is that this question of resources. The usda mounted pretty vigorous. Ask for a program early on. And i gotta figure from them. They spent about three hundred fifty million dollars. Total that includes the biocontrol the breeding as well as fourteen after would became known as budget sequestration. Which i think happened in two thousand thirteen. The funding for the ashburn program went way down in the never recovered end now. Usgs saying we don't have the money to continue this quarantine. So i think it it really brings up a question of what's important in. What are we willing to spend money on. The ash tree is one of the most important trees ecologically maybe not commercially. But certainly ecologically in the eastern us. It seems that after twenty thirteen we were unable to find the will to spend the money to try to save it. And i don't think it will be the last tree that sees a pest like this because global trade is continuing and we continue to see new insects and diseases show up of course of them. Don't have as devastating impact. Ask for but i think most experts feel like it's only a matter of time before another one does and i think there are a lot of questions mind about whether we're really prepared in what will be able to do next time before. Do any better than did against the ash borer. Thank you so much gabriel. Thanks was great to talk to you. Cambridge popkin is a freelance journalist based in maryland. You can find a link to his story. At science mag dot org slash podcast. Stay tuned for an interview with pablo shiva cost about rattling little robots to get them organized. This episode is brought to you in part by kiwi co q. Aeko create super cool hands on projects designed to expose kids to concepts in steam science technology engineering art and math t because mission is to help kids build confidence creativity and critical thinking skills and have a blast while doing it. Each crate is designed my experts and testify kids and teachers. A new steam concept delivered monthly. Each box comes with all the supplies needed for that project. No extra runs to the craft store plus detail kid-friendly instructions and enriching magazine filled with mortar. Learn about the crates theme each line caters to different age groups and the variety of topics from science to art geography. If you're wondering what to get that kid in your life for the holidays this is it with. Cuba goes hand art and science projects. Kids could engineer. Walking robot design a paint pendulum conduct bubbling chemistry experiments. And more all from the comfort of home everything you need to make steam seriously fun delivered to your doorstep fifty percent off your first month plus free shipping on any credit line with code magazine. That's fifty percent off your first month. At kiwi co dot com k. I w i. C o dot com promo code magazine. This week's episode is brought to you by kiko. Qa co create super cool hands on projects designed to expose kids of all ages two concepts in steam science technology engineering art and math. He rico's mission is to help kids build confidence creativity and critical thinking skills and have a blast while doing it. Each create is designed by experts and tested by kids and teaches a new steam concept delivered monthly. Each box comes with all the supplies needed for that month. Project plus detailed kid-friendly instructions and a magazine filled with more to learn about the crates theme each line caters to different age groups and there are a variety of topics. Plus the crate includes everything. you need. see you don't have to worry about running out for extra supplies. I know this time of year. I'm always looking for fun. Projects to do with my kid were stuck in the house. It's cold outside. I don't want any more screen time. This is the way to get family time and learning time in together with q because hands on art and science projects kids can engineer a walking robot design a paint pendulum conduct bubbling chemistry experiments. And more all from the comfort of home everything you need to make steam seriously fun delivered to your doorstep. Get thirty percent off your first month. Plus free shipping on any crate line with code magazine. That's thirty percent off your first month. At kiwi co dot com k. I w i. C o dot com promo code magazine. The study were covering this week. Talks about rattling things around and getting organization out of it and not just anything. We're not gonna rattle around rocks or sand. You know that might organize in response to vibration. We're talking about rattling around. Small robots each panel. Doing its own thing. This is basically a stand in for active matter. Active matter like hands forming a bridge or birds forming a flock politika and author on. The paper is here to talk about the principles of organizing. Swarms of things bobble. Hi sarah thanks for having me sure. I mentioned active matter in my intro. How should we do differently about active matter. Compared to you know things hanging around randomly like molecules in solution so active matter unlike molecules is a things that are driven by says at the level of particles so the prototypical example is usually flocking birds because they follow simpler rules. Do what your neighbors do. And over altogether forming a big single organism innocence from flocking birds. We cannot generalize to either and building bridges or b.'s. Hiding and actually if you're gonna call aunts active matter then you might as well actually call social dynamics or opinions also active matter because if you think of the space of possible opinions and how people behave done to align with the people here so there's a kind of flocking and opinion space that you could also view as active matter. We're also going to introduce this idea of but of course we're not talking about just like shaking a jar with the technical way you're going to describe rattling for this paper. Shaking a jar is one external force that is applied to the entire samba. Love whatever rocks. You have an ajar but here. We are more focusing on active matter systems. Which would then be propelled on the level of particles so active matter has self powered particles like if iraq could move under its own volition or single cells that can propel themselves so now we have active manner and we have rattling and you wanted to do experiments to see what kinds of principles you could find about. How rattling active matter can get organized. So you experimented with robots. You worked with regard assists to make little groups of active matter. How does that work out. The way it actually worked out is i was kind of sent to the lab to play with these robots having already some early versions of this theory and my adviser suggest that i try to do something with them and find out how this theory could be tested on them so it was really a very ambitious innocence venture. I thought that it would never work. I'm just a random system that was not designed to work for this theory. The fact that it worked out was very exciting. In retrospect it was actually a great platform for testing this but yeah these robots they basically individual league. Each one can change shape the can translate on their own. They're completely helpless individually and it's only together that they can achieve any sort of motion or any pattern. Whatever motion or whatever and samba behaviors. We observe are inherently arising from collective nonaka librium phenomenon. It's a great platform to study this. And you stuck them all in a ring together. Our main test case was three robots in a ring but we also played around with five and ten ensembles in experiment and fifteen hundred insulation. Yeah so they were all in a ring so that they wouldn't just wish away from each other so they could still together and we found that they spontaneously organized as a group into these like very synchronous. Globally choreographed dances. It really looked like a. It looked like a cory graff. Dance where they pass through these different. These different shapes right. They make a shape than they make a different shape than they go back to the first shape the way that they were driven on the individual level and the way that the forces were implemented were mostly periodic which then made them go through certain cyclic behavior. Many times that basically was very stable as you describe also tried some patterns that when the individual kind of propulsion or the forces weren't cyclical but they were predictable so whether the group can really find a way to move with those predictable patterns and somehow recognize this predictable of them even if it wasn't just periodicity so we talked about the robots having their own simple movements that they were doing and there are grouped inside this rings and they have to push off each other in order to move is their external rattling or is the only motion generated from the robots themselves the only motion generated from the robots changing shape in this very simple way and in this case what rattling is how they wish off of each other what they were working with when they first came into the lab is they basically keep moving around kind of a random chaotic sort of fashion. They don't do anything regular really kind of looks like rattling rocks in a jar more or less but if the way that they're changing shape and the way that they're essentially being driven on an individual level is more orderly and more predictable than they find a way to reduce this rattling by moving in a more orderly fashion so it's no longer rattling. It's now like predictably doing these periodic. Your things the robots themselves. They don't have a plan. They don't have a command. That says organiz yourselves and they don't have any programming that says make sure you form a pattern and and do things repetitively. Yes that's the key thing that the behavior of each robot was preprogrammed to do something that is completely independent of any other robots. They don't even have sensors to detect each other president. So is doing some very simple thing. So it's not an a software level that the learn to work together it's really on just physical hardware level that they self organize their extremity to each other and their shape in the samba will to form these kind of choreographies. You describe the stable state. These swarms reach as low rattling. They get organized rattling his low. And i think a lot of us will kind of get this conceptually. Because we're used to thinking about systems reaching a low energy state and thinking bolts man's law in the nineteenth century boltzmann basically discovered the ultimate law which covers the behavior of equilibrium. Disco mechanics has now become a centerpiece of pretty much all of modern physics from cosmology to superconductors but it doesn't apply to systems that are. Let's say active matter or more generally out of glynn system in our everyday world that we live in a lot of things are out of librium gear. We were trying to come up. With a similarly general and fundamental theory as ultima distribution but for out of kareem systems and. So that's where rattling comes in so in boltzmann distribution we have energy asked the key quantity and we have the intuition that systems tried to lower their energy like balls straight to roll downhill inequilibrium position of a ball in a landscape is going to be at the bottom of some help. So that's energy. Being minimized here rattling plays the same role as energy does an librium with system spontaneously looking for configurations that are somehow match to the external driving forces such that they respond not as just rocks rattling inside a jar but in a way that is somehow predictable orderly and stable boltzmann distribution works. Pretty much exactly whereas this principle for non equlibrium is more approximate because systems are so complex. And so different so here. It's not as precise while you are looking for general rules. That can help. People design things that use active matter or that predict the behavior of active matter in certain situations. Yeah precisely so as a general principle by which we can predict what act matter. We'll do active matter. Systems will spontaneously self organized into some collective group behavior. And then how can we control the spontaneous self organization. For example can we grow cars instead of building them so that these cars spontaneously come together as an organism rather than being carefully built a bit by bit. And this is kind of the dream of robotics as gonna say. How can this be applied in the future growing cars. Great okay. Can we talk about something a little bit more near term about how you see this growing and developing as a field as a way of looking at active matter. This theory could be a new way to think of swarm robotic systems so as it is swarm robotics are usually designed either by being kind of centrally controlled by a single unit that talks to all the robots and choreographs their dynamics or their carefully planned out to give each one individual rules that you then mathematically calculate will generate the collective behavior that you want. This theory gives a radically different approach. Where you just get each little robot to do. Its own fairly simple thing without really operate understanding what the collective behavior will be and then you said their environment such that the only stable collective behavior will have the properties that you want that gives a new approach to designing and building swarm robotics systems. One really cool thing about that approach is that your resulting swarm is possibly going to be a lot more stable. And how some of those biological properties for example ability to self heal if one or several of the robots breakdown. It'll go back to another stable state that is close to the one that it was and so it's not gonna break the entire choreography of the swarm. It'll find new choreography with fewer robots. That are still alive. And so that ability to self heal as a collective is a hallmark property that makes biological systems really cool and something that we haven't quite been able to achieve with technology yet so this could be a way to go in that direction. Sounds like there's a lot of places you can go. Yeah i have a personal tendency of trying to solve everything in one go. Because i'm kinda lazy and i don't want to do them separately But i i guess. Also just motivates me to do science as something that like makes passionate about it. I don't know it doesn't have to be so realistic. It's just kind of fun to think about. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me was great. Pablo tipoff is a postdoctoral researcher in the department of physics at mit. You can find a link to his paper at science mag dot org slash podcast and that concludes this edition of the science. Podcast if you have any comments or suggestions for the show right to us at science podcast at. As that org you can listen to the show on the science website. Science mag dot org slash podcast on the site. You'll find links to the research and news to spend the episode. And of course you can subscribe anywhere. You get your podcast. The show was edited and produced by sarah crespi with production help from prodigy. Meghan cantwell and joel goldberg. Jeffrey koo composed the music on behalf of science magazine and its publisher triple. Es thanks for joining us.
O Tinder para Podcasters que combina Podcasters com convidados
"See News outweigh probably in use. Oh who Jesus Silva attracted overseas which means no cheese hippo titans open yours is precipitous. Tintin says the wound will do sports caches for such critical to policy beneficier who compare chillicothe scholar. Amigo Z. Podcast is split gashes dollar Jakarta. They were homemade Idaho in this case for combat S. news he participate. Ask Alan Taylor. Gra BY SS news. Push cash if owns a stock is desimone gene the Para podcasters. He can't be educators. For Confidante enough applaud the former matchmaker. Fema associate towards gashes on extra facets parachutes Ecuador's control Pasco Seabees. If analogy fast. You know where did you meet occupancy? Luckily Data Jitender podcasters as you. Mace SHIES DOT COM. You Sink skit stories as well as I made to know. Portugal Miller I apple has saint humanity. He out console novice angels. Mitchell's new apple course. Equator Mu novels podcasts. Watch not so many it will also say send up. Santos opposite with visas are Clara management. Paddock correspondent represent can be is the shows so blue. Magic fiemme gratuity per podcast. As you can see that at the moment to now `o-plan Jesse not to put a special occasion McAfee Swale or pro vessels Negocios Plataforma present to the social market Yochelson Permanent Gina issue. It does stop coke reports cash. Who Has Agra ropy so vision material completely demise link in? Punta compound where. He hasn't seen us if he's interesting point there you. Let's see so he in the area's news his vice thing as a model sponge kissing focused minorities Gio Suva spotify by SSI. Haibo Vincent Gaseous for Blue Cordona views. This but you can't us out. They let you ski now. Don't you start with Alica all Swiss police? Because you can't do it is nice. Don't donate you my opportunity dodge. Also I ain't that noise issue in. What Belichick Caparo EPOCA ashes will youtube? This is a total retail astronauts. Put Me John is the only is para infamous choice obviously is super centers Asia Ashutosh As February to your actual data fatty dodgy apology. Jason La also have used for good but espresso muskie's Casanova Avalanche chaser. His Vincent Oh did you his past Oakwood Vegetarian meals on wheels America fully. His part of the money does look into his face was not bus month. Sick is is either two guesses his daddy avenue so is Barrow to us on it. Don't they show on my adolescence? Deposit are news if almost contributed for patch dot appreciate yours that meals on wheels America. Grab ass when you put your cash wrench upon them you Newport Tau Trains from public. I don't give me a lot is practice. Have Cash. She Him Otamendi. I just WANNA tell us. Olympians is boomer Perot micro phony but I want you to do it Cetera. Asthma Lung. Released adoptions paragraph Telefoni police skype applic- achieves it just positive? Aspera Azure Dowell. We'll gloves sports alone. So put your cash George. Inc thousand following the Subaru. It's Party entergy. Sunday Mia Farrow reported. Gillespie data Lista modify nineties Hebron accomplice issue so Jalil Marco Bianchi uncle of analysis you ashes called technology is by sustain pushes dot was not plataforma spotify for podcasts. Specific geospace dodgy asthmatic. I think we don't you know this thing so hey I'll do the largest yet. They will graph. Yeah those changes as fatal proper Armenio. I gotTa Sunday Mia opening go into Africa. Who's PODCAST issue? Not she says it's doing Outta you. Mail Order Achilles Pacific using cocaine. Daca in what you can public attitude in York diamonds alias. Most Kazu just basic vinik smitty up into the indicator vice would you total gs data so probably what hope road mobile farmer by Hood Caster popolare mixer geology. Time is almost equally capacity. You can't rely on metrology processor. Interview is medicine weapon. Morada Nova Fade. You hit verbiage over the final disown. Isparta Jamie Patriots. Im every some better public. A party to his tally up the issue such sweet WASCO Visit one. Do you got caught on the podcast. Hosted Republicans has without skis. Podcast discover into ancient amanita mice. Poeple on this particular issue. He added that. This is the program. A- Commando I guess contend to inform US choice but Vinci. He knows overlooking outdoor the project. Cash Why sounds beneficial? Put At least audio play Lucille show. We're newcaster caster gravel. Dude you out which it Raqi better with a paragraph ASSANGE Bazi dunaway a principal characteristic caster elsia compromised synchronous. Aso when we caster Luca Synchronous Pupo Camera Chievo. Jeez who overthrew was that lowered sky. I Education Jimmy. New Elk Shot Double Kakhaber. Publica caught on. Video is tumbled on the algae. Sony Portuguese was shot double their cells. That scooter dispatch fight to apple podcasts. So I got a guy who threw a plataforma? I'll just so you moved to accuse Roy just got you. Would you put your cash? Is KOMO WEAPONS CACHES? Coaching by Sound Hippies Mizuki Nazism Hail mangy HIP RADUCIOIU WHO party. Da L. New hip hop podcast to educate. You are back to power windows. Make only nukes us. What Baidu Apple Portughesi sparkly infamous always? We're supposed to be here. My people could you publication wound due to feed it. You you five hundred dollars. Ancient say there are. I just don't Alamo Meanchey Facility Dodge off sales poverty to find ex you logic pro x will pharisaic twitter GENO FANTA GS issue boom into happening data. My Nova ability dodgy you or Sony out. Issue phillies match. Those twelfth raced on this is public grotto damage. Putin maze diplomatic sufficiently part of this program. I believe that issue so I forbid street studio. Let's say this was. You could have any job you pay me to spaces vessels which is a CALICO quadruple tracks to look I produce but the second Practica Major Quality Dodge Westwood you Nicole to stack on coups parasites who was on sale grandfather. Some competent though. What is your view you. Google promised we still have a hypothesis? Twins escort was Auras and they say Special Nauseous G Formula Lonesome Portuguese. She was First Family Guy Boarding Koumura posted on my scores. Dude ranch quarantine. You put casualties. Brian set Macfarlane Coke Buddha's Sadiki Tuvalu special nauseous public honest proper capital the publication to do. He's doing Brian Physio Cash E. G. Morale is low inc. Wanted Tina. The Gordon Avril's Puddles Mora. Does benefit is not gonna Paolo generals. Bizarre weapons it with Jeanette traditionalism that Bhutto Wagner Linka dot com. I'll push Janowski brothers. Are The visa fee. Sociale Anti makes it causes NAS babyface. He's on H. E. Gardez impress produce. On you put Your Cash E. C. O. When she pays for associates thank you impact. Dako Vija Novi His. We'll stomach and in two thousand six. He's not coordinates into more say. Espn over was that Jesus. Christ is don't promote MUSICA after Portuguese I. It's just a seafood person saw. I'm L. Heal dozing off. Let me see the this player spitting. I said well you care. She added who feel me visited Skopje to lose our happy? There's been Donovan as companies. You so much. This introduce could gist. Would you weapons? Caches our coverage canal digital DOCO VILLAGES AVI SP donato mothers Milwaukee's Manila's wanted former Soviet funded. Mia for Tonto. I apple zone team parachute cemetery. Informatica Chesapeake paid eulogy. Separatism good barges overplay education. Socio Faucet by magazine Frazee but of your akilah system of into this program as it was at the division. Play Input Hickman therapies or just bottles colleague Spiro V my start seeking you convince acquisitions which cast poverty to invest quotas. I I must give us the daughter at the moment is stopping just plenty of para. Eos coming hey he is yes. He News Young Jewish mosaic. Ashi Portuguese. You Enter Promo Code. They will do quoc echemende Barracuda to subdue pressure to sway story adds watcher popcorn unity rally. Who KNOWS YOU WANNA cash out Josie News Stories? We'll probably call Bodak and Wesson use visual some symbolic assess. Sassy while abrupt Y. S. News. He's called category are part of the all. Say there's almost as she says but isn't the other this busy. Six does not just going to respective Lincoln. Se Your Corporate Ubuntu Way Se news episode. Using winter you say Gospel Disappears Lodge Vietnam inside finally can meet what has grown and yes. I send us. Underline care she tweeted Telefoni. What's that that'll sink quadruple single? They only sell Powell. You said to New Jersey but you guys you know what she says about a podcast following the purge caches adapted. Osma judge our being deployed guest. Nasi keep it to hear that sells phillies miserly calls leaky severson. Don't think they're not the air. News is the Zuma's Latifah's hit by these Russell. Those podcasts yes teaching via via the gas job.
Americas Two Largest Newspaper Chains To Merge
"This episode of business wars daily is brought to you by sent pro online from pitney bowes shipping and mailing from your desk is never been simpler than with sent pro online from pitney leabeau's. Try it free for thirty days and get a free ten pound scale when you visit p._b._a. Dot com slash b w daily the <music> from wondering i'm david brown and this is business wars daily on this tuesday august thirteenth the american newspaper the paper industry has been consolidating rapidly for the last fifteen years and shedding journalism jobs as it goes now that consolidation is moving even faster last tweak the parent company of gatehouse media which owns four hundred newspapers announced it will acquire gannett for one point four billion dollars gatehouse in get at are the two biggest newspaper chains in the country. Now they'll become one. It'll keep the gannett name. That's a smart business move. The gannett brand is familiar to many of us. The flagship of its two hundred fifteen papers is u._s._a. Today it also owns the detroit free press tennessee in nashville and hundreds of smaller smaller local papers like the chillicothe gazette in ohio the new giant news organization. We'll have a presence in forty seven states and reach one hundred twenty twenty five million unique visitors according to the washington post one reason behind creating such a mammoth business is to fend off ad sales competition from facebook doc in google which together are expected to bring in fifty one percent of all digital ad dollars. This year predicts the research organization emarketer michael read c._e._o. Gate houses parent company said the merger is intended to quoting here reposition both companies for long term growth and importantly to support quality journalism it will do so in part by focusing on growing digital subscriptions but that long-term financial growth will also come from gate houses traditional method cost-cutting cutting executives have announced that they intend to shrink expenses by two hundred seventy five to three hundred million dollars. That's a large amount considering the size of the deal report the wall street journal. It'll need to impart to pay debt on the high interest loan. The parent company's taking to finance this acquisition more than two thousand. One hundred newspapers newspapers have closed since two thousand four that according to a study by the university of north carolina with this new merger reporters and editors all over the country are bracing for more layoffs. Still some local news leaders see the dealers good news. George stanley editor of nets milwaukee journal sentinel is one of the optimists lists in an email to the news industry trade publication pointer stanley said he believes the experienced gannett exacts who will run the merged company support local news just as he says the news that is essential to our democracy but may well be but it appears challenging as already thin news staffs centipede shrinking even more the deal should close by the end of the year if regulators and shareholders approved in the meantime industry observers are looking to mcclatchy newspapers newspapers and tribune company as the next possible newspaper tie up as the consolidation rolls on from wondering this is business daily. He listened to like our show. Take a second to give us a five star rating and a review on apple podcast. Would you really helps new listener spy and for that we are so. I'm david brown back with you tomorrow. Hello this episode is brought to you by centro. Online from pitney bowes shipping and mailing from your desk has never been simpler than with sent pro online and from pitney bowes with simple online is just click sand and save for as low as four dollars ninety nine cents. That's right four dollars and ninety nine cents a month. Doc send envelopes flats packages right from your p._c. And you were back to business in no time. Try it for free for thirty days and get a free ten pounds scale but only when you visit p._b. Dot com slash b w daily that's p._b. Dot com slash b w daily.
First wrapped, automatically sliced loaves of bread sold - July 7, 1928
"From fireworks on the fourth of july the long holiday weekend the way there's plenty to look forward to during the summer but why way to celebrate new delicious lee spreadable cottage cheese single is giving you a reason to celebrate every single day with their single best states sweepstakes visit create with connor dot com for your chance to win fifty dollar daily prizes and the grand prize of one thousand dollars plus tips an inspiration to help make every single day the best day ever this day in history class is a production of i heart radio hi i'm ease welcome to this day in history class a show that reveals a little bit more about history day by day today it's july seventh twenty nineteen the day was july seventh nineteen twenty eight the chiller copy baking company and he in missouri sold the first rap packaged up automatically sliced bread out of frederick road or what's eight jeweler who owned three jewelry stores in missouri but in nineteen twelve he had also started working on creating abe ratify slicing machine at the time people either make their own bread or pothole loaves of bread from the bakery when they won in a slice of bread they had the cut it themselves that wasn't a terrible task but it was convenient since it was time consuming and fighters were hearts of cut uniformly row wetter created several prototype for his brad slicing machines but in nineteen seventeen a fire at a factory in mom less illinois destroyed his blueprint andy prototype he built it took several years to get back up and running but as he continued working on the design of the machine he realized that he would have to incorporate into his invention away to keep the feis brett fresh sliced bread go stale faster the bread is not feis he began designing a machine that slice andy wrapped bread pins held a love together inside the back in nineteen twenty seven row wetter filed a patent for a quote machine first slicing entire loaf of bread any single location which he received in nineteen thirty two but he sold his first machine to his friend and baker frank bench of the chill copy baking company on july six nineteen twenty eight the chillicothe constitution itution tribune printed a story that said the copy baking company will begin selling sliced bread the next day the article explain the slicing process in the benefits of prefight interrupt bread there is not crumbling no crushing of the low and the result is such that the housewife will experience a thrill of pleasure when she first these a loaf of bread with each slice the exact counterpart of its fellows so neat imprecise are the slices so definitely better than anyone could possibly flies by hand with the brett knife that one realizes instantly that here is of refinement that will receive a hearty impermanent welcome clean made sliced bread as the chiller copy baking company called it was successful customers were a fan of the conveniently five spread end demand furrow wetter slicing machine crew the first brad slicer broke down after about six months of heavy you step into bakery but some bakers were still skeptical as some lows did not look niece enough a bigger names gustaf pop addict bought row wetter second machine and worked on improving its design and function modifications put the bread in carport trays in wrapped in wax paper those sliced bread was growing in popularity the great depression hit in nineteen twenty nine row wetter had to sell the rights of his invention and the micro west coal company of indoor if i were purchased brett slicing machine he became vice president of sales manager of the company's row wetter bakery machine division in nineteen thirty wonder bread began to fail commercially produced pre sliced wrapped loaves of bread making it popular around and you at pre sliced bread with bandit during world war two to preserve food and metal but the ban was lifted two months after it began sliced bread has become a staple in households around the country july seventh eighteen eighty is also wrote letters birthday eased up so hopefully you know a little more about history today than you did yesterday in if you're so inclined you could follow us at p b i h c podcast on instagram facebook and twitter thanks again for listening and i hope you come back tomorrow for more delicious morsels of history podcast from i heart radio radio podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows this week on a summer it was a very high paced very stressful job were coming in your ear you're talking to somebody else you're checking the wires make sure the people have completed their calls there also making notes about how long the car lashes 'cause you're gonna charge customer base and how long the call last note where the call went to and you're doing this with the board as fifty calls coming in all at the same time army did have to spend some time and they found that to be average infantryman sixty seconds to go see the car and took the average woman tensor
Volume 5, Episode 8 Fifty West, Beer Fasts, New Brewpubs, Catching Up With Del and Max.
"I hope that you've got the earned your hand. Because it's that time again since he brew cast the voices cincy craft gnarly. No, I don't actually think people typically have of your in their head when they listen to the show, they're probably on the way to work or at work or something like that. If you're how is that an excuse. I drink beer work all the time every day. I guess if you're at work, go grab a beer, and we'll hit pies. Go grab a beer then come back. And if your boss says anything just. Tevin fifty west that it was okay. Call the drunk line. That's right. Call the drunk line five six seven seventy drink. I haven't been getting any calls lately. Maybe that's not actually the number. The fact check it's very very typical for the way. I do things on this show giving out the wrong number for three weeks. Or so we are as I said, we're at fifty west with max Dell we have kind of a lot to talk about when we first started talking about the talking to Dell about booking it because you were doing a thing which we're going to talk about. And then in the meantime, since then you guys made the announcement that you're opening a third location. The first variant Cincinnati have three locations, right? Yes. Unless you count Sam Adams, but those people typically don't for some reason, but first Cincinnati born brewery to have three locations, we'll put it that way. Number one. Congratulations. Go ahead and say hi to the people. So they can hear your voice. Hey, hey, I'm pretty sure everyone's sick of hearing my voice by now been hearing seeing or lot lately faces everywhere then back again for co hosting Foltz. Welcome back. Thank you. We'll just we'll start with you. Dow you decided for some reason that you were going to go on a beer fast. And that's not a fast from beer that is a fast from everything except for beer water, black off unsweetened tea is that right? Basically all calories. I what I made the rules. Right. So it was like whatever I wanna do. But you know, all of the of the not as fun stuff. Exactly. Right. So it actually so it came about it a little bit of a weird way. Just because most people don't think of beer as being healthy or being part of a healthy lifestyle. Right. But at fifty west like, our culture is an active lifestyle, right? We have the volleyball courts, we have the canoe kayak liver. We have the bicycle shop. We do training groups like, you know, hey, it's a big weekend for us. Right because we've been training like seventy people flying pig. So that's coming up this weekend, which we need to talk about the fifty west mile as well, which is on Friday night. But so it, you know, when you think about in that context that I work for this brewery, that's has such a healthy lifestyle. Then it kind of makes sense. So, you know, a lot of people know that I was distributor for years. And I sold a lot of different brands in southwest, Ohio. When I came on at fifty west, it was a big change for me. So going. From a distributor having kind of a set schedule every day to be the director of sales of a brewery on that. So we call that a supplier and having one that has such a delicious restaurant as we do here at fifty west I found myself putting on weight, so you know, for being a healthy active lifestyle brewery. I was going the other way, and I was whining and dining, I was smoothing people. I was coming. You know, doing tours here berry and doing lots of of eating and packing on the weight. And I was like kind of spiraling. Because it was like I'm putting on weight. I'm feeling bad because I don't feel like I'm representing the brand very well. And I have our founder Bobby Slatter us like the Pitta me of health, and you know, he's he's on a daily basis making the correct choices and working out and eating properly. And it was you know, I was going the other way, and I was feeling really bad about that. And it kept thinking like, what am I going to do to to kinda get back in my healthy eating ways and get back. You know, the one thing I knew. Wasn't going to do was going to mid beer beer is my passion in life. It's the reason I work in the beer industry. It's I hate that people vilify beer so much and give it a bad rap. So the one thing I wasn't going to do was, you know, mitt beer. So I thought like how do I did this for years? I included beer an part of a healthy lifestyle. And I lost a lot of weight back in the day. And I figured like how am I going to get back into that? And that's when the whole fasting protocol that I used to do like intermittent fasting on a on a weekly basis like daily basis, I decided to integrate that with the story of d'appel Bach, and where d'appel Bach, the, you know, the Genesis of that came from and and and do it and Lindt so I decided to do this about six seven months ago. So I was preparing myself and getting ready to do that. And and that's how that's how it all started. How much research went into like what? Dear you were going to be drinking, or is it just whatever sounded good at that time. So the d'appel Bach thing, I think that's the the shit that I read that people online was just he's not drink d'appel Bach. You know, it's that's it has nothing to do with anymore. And it's and I didn't do it for Lynn for religious purposes. I'm not really like, I'm not. So so I wasn't really doing it. It was just an opportune time to do that was to take that that you know, period of time. That's when like back when we were hundred gathers you're coming out of the winter never hunter gatherer. Ancestors did and coming out of those like harsh winter months when they first started eat again, so that was kind of end of their their fast. So that's by kind of all religions have some sort of a spring fast. It has nothing to do necessarily with religion. But as far as when you would come in, and you know, have your first beer day at lunchtime. Or whatever was the decision made just on what beer sounded good that day or was it based on some kind of calorie count. So I'm a firm believer in not have a breakfast beer. Now some days I did. I mean, you know, when when we were out at CVC craft Burs conference in Denver you start drinking like nine ten AM. But on a on a normal to me. Yeah. Right exactly on normal on a normal day to day basis. I was having my first beer twelve thirty year one. But that was a choice. I mean, obviously if I wanted one I can have one I'm not a big breakfast person. Anyway. So all right now refer food in the. Morning. For a year. You know, and what I love the most about the whole idea is that you talked about that, you know, how beer gets vilified. And how you know when people talk about beer drinkers. The stereotype is the beer belly. And you got it added on there's a lot of proof that that's not actually beer that's doing that. I'm a big believer in fasting in general. Right. So like I did a lot of water fast in the past. And it's helped me maintain a healthy weight. So you know, the bodies an amazing tool an amazing machine. It's not going to sacrifice any muscle any of your organs anything as long as you have body fat on you. Right. So I could have done this at my body fat level. I could've done this on water and survived. But I couldn't have been able to do my job because I sell beer for a living. So I needed to make sure I included fear, but there's many documented cases of people that have water fasted, the longest water fast in history was three hundred eighty three days Razi, the guy was over four hundred pounds down to one hundred eighty one of the rest of his life. He never went over one ninety again using fasting. So I knew I didn't really need the calorie content. I knew my body would provide that through my body fat. But it was one of those things to keep myself sane to keep me interested. And to keep you know, kind of entertained and then also to do my job. I included beer is something that you're going to ever do again, if you ever get that urge to do a longer term fast as I may do a week at a time here, they're kind of maintenance kind of thing. I don't think I will do it again. Like next lint? I hope that I have enough body fat on me in order to do next lent. But you never you never know like, you know, life happens. So who knows where I don't wanna talk about next year because people keep throwing all all kinds of crazy ideas at me. They're like, you know, you need to do this next year do this next year. And they think it's going to be like the next like ice bucket challenge. And how is your response? Not go ahead. You do it. Like, I told a ton of people like, you know, like, I'm uniquely positioned to do this. You know, who I am where I am. If you wanna give it a world go for like knock yourself out. Just make sure you say hydrated because it's going to be the biggest thing there's not a lot of people's employers who would be as as understanding and welcoming of the idea as you are right on that. I just I missed the memo for the website, what should do for lent dot com. I mean, what the hell people do it yourself. And then and then so next year people think this is going to be like an ice bucket challenge thing like a ton of people are going to do this next year. And they want me to lead them. Yeah. I don't think I want to do this again. Let me let me let me think about that next next year right now, let me just enjoy that. Actually, did it. I didn't die. I lost some weight and got a lot of attention. But you did document everything you've got lots of video. There will be something put together at some point possibly in time for next limps. Oh, absolutely. I would imagine. I mean, I took so starting at Bock fest. I started filming psyche camera with me every day of my life filmed ton of footage one. I put on my YouTube channel was just a small blurb, I have hours and hours of footage kind of like super size me. Right. So I I did the exact same thing except with my beer fast. So starting with my doctor and Bock fest and every day of my life. These guys, maxim, Bobby, they like would tease me all the time when we would go to events, you know, even chillicothe eat. I'd have my camera with you know, I'm filming everything we do. I I heard a rumor that when you guys were out for craft brewers conference, Bobby. He would go into a bar before you kinda hang out for a minute. And how'd you guys hear about that guy from Ohio seeing it on the news? And then when you would walk. Oh my God. There is. Actually, actually heard that. We totally took del on tour. Like, we it wasn't that preplanned. But we we did have one event where it was meet del night. Zuni street Zuni street bring company they hosted del. We had a couple of handles on. And we so Bobby, and I think it's hilarious to go to people and be like meet the famous Dell and starting conversation with somebody and be like, oh, you know, this trust me. Men from Ohio. No, we didn't do any location scouting for them other than the one event, and the event was awesome. Everybody's heard about this as everyone NBA. So when we're not CBC everyone wanted to talk to Dell especially after they figure out who was there like, oh, you're that guy like, and it's the it's the same like five questions. Do you get drunk every day? Like, I was at trader Joe's yesterday, and like two different people stopping here you that guy. That's me. So your diet is back to normal now back to some semblance of normalcy. Now, how long was that transition period about so I waited a like a week to eat meat. So I went from like bone broth and guacamole steamed vegetable soup to salads, and then I had some fish. And then went into, you know. You know, that would be the harder part for me. Not the not the fastest self isn't hard. But that transition back that you can't just jump back into it. Like, I'm done kind of Stu like I gave myself like bariatric surgery with willpower. So like, my stomach's a lots of all they're so like I made this like I was like all right? So you got together with bourbon buddies. We we're gonna have a have a few. Tesa bourbon and girl rib is and so I made this a normal size sixteen ounce ridi-, and literally I could eat half. Did like what about like gums sensitivity and things like that? Give me. Give me. Everything like literally, I don't know. Maybe I'm just like, my constitution and everything this really good but snapped into shape. Everything's fine all functions where where they should be like everything's good. I mean, it's pretty remarkable. I didn't have any kind of like any kind of indigestion or heartburn or anything else. Everything was good. The human body is pretty incredible. When you really break it down. And granted our ancestors. Go periods without eating. Our body was at one time built four that type of lifestyle. So it's pretty incredible. And I'm glad that you did it can you imagine if you made it halfway through and like, I can't do it anymore after all of that press that was happening and. Fails that's part of my motivation. I mean, like literally like after like the first week, and like I had already done like thirty or forty interviews by the first, and it was just like I can't be that guy. I'm not going to be that guy those guys horrible. There was no doubt in my mind, you'd make it honestly. That's you had that faith. But just knowing you the way I do. I mean, you're not you're not gonna go into something half past. I mean, I just knew that, you know, when just because I've seen events you've put together and things like that that I'm like, he's prepared. And I did I mean, that's a lot of people didn't know like how much like I knew about fasting. And I think that's something that didn't necessarily come across a lot of the some of the national type interviews is that this is like some kind of lark that you side of the night before you were going to do this. Right. It's always the headline. You know, get get the headline. The headline the headline and people don't really this was about beer education. It was about kind of doing myth busting, Mike. Yeah. We've all heard that if you're anywhere related to beer, you've heard that story about Dabo box at about the monks not eating for the whole period of lent. And I wanted to cut could I do that. Or not, you know. So I mean, it was it was very well thought out a lot of you know. Just information out there about fasting in general about the no the history of everything. And it was it was about that at about craft beer, and it was about I wanted to use the platform to raise awareness about beer as a healthy lifestyle. Turn it of the history of beer here in Cincinnati. You know, all those kind of things, you know, the last thing I wanted was all the attention was about weight loss everything that everyone was like lost so much weight. It's this is the beer diet. This is the beer dia. This guy visited the beer diet. And it's like, it's not the diet. Like wasn't about. Again. It goes it goes to those those headlines the things people are searching for online. It's it's becomes what people. Well, and it's just like anything else. If you go on a beer fast. You side you're going to drink eight ten beers a day. You're gonna lose any weight. Exactly. I mean, you still have to monitor that and be meticulous and be conscious of what you're doing. And so, yeah, I think it'd be really careful next year on the bourbon diet. I might sign up for that one. There's probably not very many calories in bourbon at all them sort of like the alcohol self somehow like turns into some kind of calorie. But well since we're talking about beer, let's drink some beer. We. The beer for have to do that begins. Podcasts. I grabbed it's starting to feel a little bit like spring outside and. Drinking strawberry guava. Our what can you guys? Tell me about this beer. That's what I'm into. It's it's delicious. It is really good. We started playing more with sours. Once Ryan Hayes came on board. So he came with Scott from blank slate when that whole transition happened, and Ryan is awesome. I don't know if you like we should get Ryan on this podcast. Give him. I my phone said texture, I know. I know Ryan's awesome. Dude knows a ton about year. Really good at New England. I ta and sour beer, he's all kinds of stuff. But the on the pub side, we get to play around a little bit more just for everybody else. He's our lead popular and. Meant you really knows this style up and down. He's made a punch really good ones. He's played with quavo little bit the tropical fruit in it adds, like a nice complexity guavas an interesting fruit. It's got a lot of complexity to it's gotten on the dick nece, and the I almost I call it fruit and feet sometimes. Way to describe it. Yeah. It's deep tropical flavor. And then the strawberry keeps it real bright and familiar, and then he he knows how to get a really nice, our quality and beer, we're not kettle souring beers. So he puts it in a firm enter with bugs. Let's do it's thing and then he'll supplement with domesticated east this. Well, and then get it to where we want it to be. Yeah. It's it's like it's still quicks our, but but it's real sour. So you get like a nice complexity with it so all of us. Ours are awesome. We have to on top right now. And I think like the goal is to always keep one or two on. So like when we look at taps over here. There's twenty four taps to whom or nitro, and then the rest basically get to play with and we wanna spectrum on there. Right. So like I want like that us dry west coast. I want like super milked up New England. I want like Brown. I wanna stout. I want you know, we want light beer, we want fruit beer. Want? So the at one of those lines is gonna stay sour. And I'm really confident in the kind of your that. He's putting out. There's nothing more frustrating to me than having like some kind of a hanker in first certain type of beer and walking into a brewery and like crap there's nothing even close to that. It's all a bunch of as a whole bunch of styles, or whatever it may be. And that's frustrating as drinker granted, we're in Cincinnati. You can just hop in your car and go down to the next place. And they'll probably have it there. You don't want people to necessarily do that. It's a little bit to the testament of like how old we are. We're one of the older reasons Cincinnati, which is like not saying much, but like the the the median age of Bree, according to Burs association for like in the US right now is four years old. We're we're going on seven. So it's like it's us maturing as as Rian and being able to like know what the customer wants them there at the bar with those offerings. So I mean, we even have a seller program. You can you can go to the bar and by celery beer, by the bottle for on premise, you can bite. You doesn't seventeen ten and two. You can buy our farmhouse beers. You can buy. There's a whole list of imaging bread is my co pilot up there in bottles. Yes. Co-pilot is available for onsite awesome. But that that hurts because I hear I'm thinking, I've got the whole store city of twenty seventeen bread is my co pilot, and I've been telling people that for a year max. No, how many I bought. Have years. Awesome. Every single version of co-pilot has been like it's own unique. Yes year, he's got his own unique character, and it was funny. Was it fourteen fourteen or fifteen the first Asian was like all like lemon peel and tart the second one was like funky stays on third. One was like it almost as like we blended. The are still I think, Don. Three. And I don't know how much of a desire. These guys have now to continue that series. We've definitely got like brands that have built equity over time that we definitely want to continue like obviously tend to with like as much recognition. One hundred up year as garnered we are obviously continuing that I I. Imaging we'll continue to made and same with DS. Yet TVS gets a lot of good responses. So we taste tested IT devious imaging and tend to sort barrels are stored across the street, not provex. But like in the other smattering of Bill. Yeah, tenants. You is nine months old at this point. I still think it needs a little bit more time. I think that that this batch is going to be more. Like, we've pulled it as early as six months when it's tasting right? But I think it's on point like it's going the right direction. But I think that will look more like a year aged beer devious is at like, four months or ET's amazing. Could I say fuck on this show, it tastes fucking amazing? And we fucking encouraging. And yes, so that might look like more like a six or eight month. This time and imaging was was pretty young. But it was still fun. And that kind of stuff will always win. It gets released be bottle kind of smaller releases versus the seasonal. What is the long strange journey? Yeah. Let me break that down. Just in case has any confusion about that. So we released on their release calendar on our website. And if anybody wants more information message us, or or just requests emails, Texas, whatever this is the realist counted from the website, not the one that was on Facebook with Mabel, Mabel, Mabel. That one only. For the maple maple group. Maple gate. And those guys are going to be disappointed. No, the actual release counter. So this is the first time last year was the first time we ever put your into packet trait. Well, the fishery and put it on stores at twenty or so about at least, but I can't beer and said like, hey, this is the course of your from fifty west. So it was three years regionally. And then we added punch at punch out. And those are for course. So heading into this year. It was like, okay, we're gonna launch seasonal brand and then come out with a release calendar. And it'll be the first time we have schedule a beer schedule. And so it's the it's the four years year round and then rotating seasonal with with four seasonals. And then there's the long strange journey series, which is just like for the old school craft beer guys. That's basically like our bomber series. Right. Like, it's our specialty of your series in today's world that looks a lot more like the sticker sixteen ounce cans. So we were like, okay, we wanna really specialty beer we want to have a drop every single month. So whether it's a new full length seasonal or it's. One of these beers. There's a new beer package veer from fifty every single month. And then this specialty stuff like ten to the barrel aged products farmhouse series that those beers are gonna come out. I've really wanna put a release calendar together. We have a preliminary one, but like the barrel tells you. With a barrel. Yeah. I don't wanna throw it out there and have everybody like do one of the worst mistakes people make with barely djing beer is. They say we wanna barely this for X amount of time. And the smartest thing I ever heard about barely aging list from Rashard Braxton, he said respect everything it's ready when it's ready, and that's how a barrel is you can't like you said ones at four months. It tastes great ones at nine months. It needs a little more. You can't say you're going to release a barely beer on a certain schedule. If you do your cheating to me, especially when you're talking about beers. Like, the stuff that you have that already has some kind of group of fans around that people have to with that beer is going to be what it's going to taste like it's got. It's got a bar. It's gotta meet I don't know if this gives us credibility. But like last year, I v to tend to that's why those lease didn't taste like ten until I'm like the gatekeeper for ten to. The first batch, and and we released the first one was six months, and then was a year. That's the green and the blue label and the seven fifties. And now there's a canoe guard of brewers, and I'm like Notat not releasing tenant to until I like give it my sample approval and the one that's in barrels as awesome. But it's just not quite there yet. But yeah, I it's really hard to release that specially calendar we're definitely gonna come out with with beers. Especially barely throughout the year. We got a ton of stuff. That's that's our two that's going to be really some of that farmhouse series. I don't know how much that you guys saw everything all at once and forever, and then footing light-hearted were the first he'll we have another one that's already packaged. It's been packaged for like. At least two months, it's called paths. Worn it's dry, hops. Our needs some time and it needed at the time it needed time in the in the bottle. I haven't tasted. I haven't either. I don't know how it's doing. Now. It's probably good. Like it was. It was great beer, we packaged it. And we were like all right. What that's it for a couple of months, and then we'll release it Maija was released it alongside ten and two. We're going to do a spring release. But now ten tendencies probably put back to fall. So maybe you'll see it then, but they'll be more of the farmhouse beer. I I feel like both of those two farmhouse beers. That were really kind of flew onto the radar way. More the very much. So there was a blizzard that day, and we we had awesome event for it. So what we did was. We were like all right. We want everyone to have this intimate experience with this beer. So it was the first time we held a release and created like group taste tests. So if you showed up that day, which not you'll did. But you got a signed a group, and then we called your group. You went up stairs. And you. Sat in a room with both of our brewers who went through how they made the beer, and then they taste everybody on it. And then you want from there into the purchaser. So if you didn't like one of the beers or you turned out, maybe really liked one of the beers. You could buy more or less of of those brands, and yet we I like that format we didn't really get testing because not enough people showed up. So we'll probably do that again for the next one. That's that's pretty cool idea school, boom. That's I think has been really fun especially in the last year or so watching you guys kind of grow into what fifty west is going to be now in the future. But and the way you guys have handled releases and always trying to find something new I guess started with funds out. A new way to throw a beer release and things that you can do around that that that bring people into that experience more than just grabbing beer of we we literally have meetings about that. Right because we're all at heart. We're all geeks. You're looking at two of the biggest ones right here. And we sit down and say like all right this release. How are we gonna make a different like how are we going to be like cutting edge? How are we going to get the people's interest in how can you repeat the worst beer release? How can you repeat that I've so many things on that? But. I think what you did with the next release making fun of that was. That was just pure gold. And even the people that were you were kind of poke it back at had fun with that. That's why it was so good. I wish that we had a lot less distractions and Cincinnati could get along better and everyone who's like I feel like there's there's there's somewhat of a traveling problem in Cincinnati guys on the east side on the west west or east doesn't want to go west north south. And like there's a lot of people who care about your Cincinnati. But if you throw released like not everyone shows up, and like even at the bruise that really do pull off a crowd. It's not enough of a crowd in like if you look at Bruce who are really successful bureau leases. We're not doing that yet in the city. And that's why I think you see a lot of it and the up at this show, and I would hope I hope for like Cincinnati to like get back that maybe we're just way too far pass it now, it's just like everything gets additional. I don't know. I think that there's a lot of beer drinkers to that want things to go to district because it makes it easier for people like me, I this hard to get out of the house. Sometimes I've got a two year old. She's still little demon. You know, you do that's where I'm getting you know, I feel like there's a lot of people that on. I I it's easier for me to run a jungle gyms and grab a four pack off the shelf and then run back home. I can make my wife think I'm just grocery shopping going out to get beer that came out. But at the same time that people don't understand the kind of behind the scenes of not just from the breweries perspective of the, you know, going to a distributor versus selling it in house. But then also just that connection to these things that are happening fifty west is it's about yes. It's always about the beer, but at the same time coming to fifty west going to these release events coming and sitting down and talking with tender crossbar talking to the beer drinker, next to you at the VAR when you're out of are going to bottle share before those are the things that make this a little bit different than something else. That's a commodity later. Where we try to be thoughtful about like the release process, and like the kinds of releases that we have and we're trying to provide people with an experience on top of great beer, and it's it's impossible to do that. If you just go to gyms and buy it. You can have experiences are sometimes. Gas station in. You're not getting that same experience. And like, it's funny. Like some of the best reviews, I see come through when they're they're here. And like, I'm not even touching these people. Right. Like, they just like get our experience and the beer in their fifty s to not touch you? When you. Unless you want to be I was gonna say if you ask. Maybe some of the worst are like people that just like all like my buddy shared like one ounce with me, and this sucks zero stars. And it's like, it's like bullshit, whatever. But like, that's that's like even even when I'm sitting at home drinking a beer, like, they're very different ways to experience a beer, and it changes the way that is if I'm walking in the door, and I've I'm trying to make dinner and I've got a kid yelling at me. And I'm waiting for my wife, come home in the seas around. And there's all this craziness. I've still got beer in my hand that beer does not taste as good as the beer that at the end of the day. Everything settles down the kid goes to bed. The wife goes and watches whatever she's watching on TV, and I go sit on the front porch and sitting there rocking chair and put my feet up and crack open a beer, then that beer is going to taste better. It's all about the things that are happening around you. And when you come to brewery, there's things happening around you, you cannot replicate in other places, and I. I. I think it's getting lost on a lot of people. Sometimes I don't know if that's just because of the stage where at is the one thing that I hear from the people that used to come. 'cause you know, I've been the not every release you guys have. But I've been a lot of releasing seen for a long time. And a lot of people that were in line with me for years or saying, well, there's too much now I can't keep up because they say, oh, I feel like it's every week and. It's different not necessarily if you look at the release calendars. There might be a lot that happened kind of together. But then you know, what kind of bottle releases their this week? I can pull up the calendar on the early dot com. Exactly. But I don't know of a particular phantom not on WI fi. I don't know of particular bottle released this weekend last weekend. There was one before there were two, but I'm just saying that's kind of a piss poor excuse to. I honestly I wish we would see more tendinits. I wish more people would come out for that experience and not just like expect on, you know, destroy to get it for those brands at least like our specialty. I want those are the long strange journey series. I want those gonna dishwasher, the specially I'd love to sell it in house, and how it will come here and get the experience that we like are thoughtful and purposeful about creating. But yeah, I don't I don't know if that will ever come back. I'm not sure it happened for a while. Like, if you're at the first co-pilot release, it was like awesome and saying we had like huge line. And we did that a few times. Did twenty or so releases. And then yet it got to a point where like there there was more people doing releases. I think more distraction and just like way, less attendance. And now like the volume pieces hard for us as a breed where like like how much do you put away in barrels? And then when it comes out how much does the draft and how much goes the bottles. It's hard to figure that piece out when like the whole point of it is to like, give beer fans this awesome pure experience from the Brie with like, the most special coveted product that we can make and then like nobody shows up, and it has a dish. Oh, and it's like, wait. What's the point of that? Because I'm not sure if all the time in barrels, and it cost of I'm not sure if like right actually it actually works out. So it's like, wait. Like, why do we do all that? If it's just gonna sit on a shelf at a gas station, and this is the the my first impression here was I was writing for w. W CPO came in. And I talked to can I say names. All right. I talked to Blake and Tommy and then Bobby came in at the end. And when we got done with this to our very rambling rolling conversation. I said, you guys know United Cincinnati brewery. Right. And all three of them are like, oh, yeah. We know. We know we're like a Colorado brewery in the mid west. And so it's very different to have earliest here than it is to have at Lissette or than it is at Bryn. It's different again than it is at brink or streetside or wherever so to me when you're talking about people not showing up to the release. You are definitely missing the experience of that brewery because they're all different, and I can tell you that because I've been all of them. I've been a lot of them to in like, I don't think anybody's pulling the crowd anymore. No, no. I think that's the difference. Between point though, I don't mean to like, yeah. No sorry. That's a different what we say is new money and old money beer geeks. Right. So like, those of us have been coming to here, at least for you know, ten twelve years that was the only way we got some of the specialty brands, right? I mean, Jackie O's has been doing this twelve years now. And now they're stuff's going to district as well. Like, they still pull crowds, but they have enough product that it's going to district as well. So I think the people that have only been in this game for a couple of three years who we call new money beer geeks. They're kind of spoiled and they're used to. You know, having it either on their own terms, basically, they can come to the brewery. They can get it. But they know if they don't show up, and they don't do the social aspect of line shares. And and that can rotary that. We all have they can still just go and get it, you know, at at jungle gyms or capris or wherever the next day BC's bottle lodge. They can go to any of those locations like on Monday and pick them up. So I think they're, you know, it's a little bit of a mentality that I think we spoil a lot of folks and think we should be like, oh Cincinnati like pick it up like it's probably just a reality in the market. And it's just like, hey, this is just kind of like, maybe it comes back. I hope it simple cyclical. I wanna give people that experience like a desire to do that, you know, running Berea. I'm like, yeah. I want to provide a really cool unique novel thing that Senator around like a specific beer, but. If we're past that, then maybe I just give up on my dream. Don't give up. It's it's coming back. Yeah. You're not old. You're not old dream of running. You're not old enough to give up on your. Dream of how cool. Keep still young we all preserved. I am the oldest. I am the oldest person. If those apples God, and you're still younger than me. I'll be forty four this. Okay. Now about a year. Everyone. No one knows this. Very well preserved. Great hair. Great here. That's why I don't wear hats. You don't like my hair? Coming on your chin. I told a couple of people like, you know, during this beer fast. I was like I felt so much younger. You know, like, my hair, and my nails are even growing faster. I was bald before it started. This. What's happening beer fast happening right now. Right now. My wife would not be pleased with me if I came home, and I said Honey gonna do a beer fast. Loser. How how would she know the difference with you? That's true. Well, now because I lots of meat and cheese. Me your finest meats cheeses can this be to beer podcast. I'm gonna go get another one. Do you wanna know if you're going grab another on stock you up while you're while? We're talk have the logger on slope poor right now. We definitely have the so for operating so far super cool Sega minute Sacre. That's what I want to talk. Because so nerdy about it. I saw another local brewery through thing up online when they were releasing a logger that they had it on slow, and I got really excited myself. These more people are slow for as and I ran over there. And it was like two days later bartender, and they're like what I said it's slow for into the port slow. I tried to explain it. And nobody knew what I was talking about is they have don't know. No, not control. Oh. You can replicate the poor with like a bottle if you want, but like I did a bunch of times, actually, you can do it with any kind of beer doesn't even need to be a logger. But like, I was inspired. So the faucet is like this revolutionary faucet. I think it was developed Lisa story. How I understand. It was developed by pills. Cal is the only time I've ever. In the Czech Republic. They developed the specialty faucet that like is designed to poor pills ner beer, and it just he's great with any longer. I honestly want to put a hazing on it. Just like see us to do it. But it's like it's essentially like. It's an adjustable nitro port essentially is what it is. So like forces the beer through a screen, you pour it like, you you carbonate to your slightly different. So we have what's called a spun valve in the back. So it you give it like a natural carbonation in ferment or so it about seventy percent fermentation, we spun did the year, which is like you put you slap the school valve on on the on tank, and it basically ferment itself with its own pressure. And then you send it to the bright. And you give it a little bit more if needed, but it's about their at that point time keg it off. So it has a finer like more dissolved CO two character. And then you force it through this faucet that has this adjustable handle and a screen in it, and it has a much wider mouth than normal faucet. And you can basically there's a bunch of different ways the ports you can do. It's like a milk poor where you get like this super fine just like full foam class that looks so silly. But like. It's kind of pleasant to drink, and then you can do what's called the slice or you just get a little bit of you're on the bottom mostly foam. You can do like the best poor poor. It's developed for is like a three finger had poor and the head kind of jumps out of the glass. I saw it for the first time and fell in love with it at your Stott logger house in in Colorado in Denver. We drink so many of them that day. It was it was awesome. And like it didn't hit me like. The the faucet had so much to do with the texture of the beer because like they make they make fantastic pills ner. But like a lot of what makes it so good is the texture of the beer and how they're giving. It's their nail in the flavor. But like it's at point of sale. The give it to you this fluffy, silky head and like less carbonation in. It's awesome. And it's all the faucets. There's there's there's a reason to that. When you typically see nitro Buron tap. It's also coming out of a different faucet too. Because it doesn't affect kind of that that the creaming us and some of the texture. With with nitro. It's being porn on a different planned of gas. But yes, forcing it through shower had put the the perforation of the the screen is much different internatio almost looked like the description, I could use would be like like one looks like like a mesh. Metal filter that would like it's like on the end of your microphone right there. And then that's like what's on the slope for and then the one that's on the nitro looks more like a shower head faucet the disc with like ten holes in it. And then the other ones disc with like two hundred holes, much finer and more nucleated points. Yes. And so basically, disturbs all the two that's in solution as it comes out and puts it all into the head. So you get like a silk silkier creamier beer, you taste more of the sweetness of the year. And you get like a long lasting silkier had like you kinda suck in as you as you drink. And it's ironically, it makes me drink the beer lot quicker though. Crush them. And it's it's awesome. The beer tastes a little bit sweeter takes more of the grain. You get less by drink them faster than they actually take deport. Take like, five minutes of beer style. They tell you when you order signs everywhere like, it's five minutes per beer. So when you up to. Through your order for order two at a time. So I'm not the slow ports pouring. That's fine. I'll get one after the show. I don't know what it's foreign right now. I think its she so Larder which is. Amber lager with with the Japanese urban at called she. So it's kinda like a like, she's Japanese Japanese. We made a few different beers. Rohbock poured on it American League report on the last time. I was here that I did try. It was American logger which I thought was the coolest because you could try it on both ways kind of shows you that different that we talion pills right now called drive in cinema. That's fantastic Ryan. And so that year might be honored as well. So we're we have a logger program that Ryan's just crushing over on this side, and the whole impetus for it was just like we bought a slope or faucet. Let's double down on loggers port awesome, lager beer, and again, like just being like, a more mature Burri and trying to offer a spectrum of beer and seeing logger as like an up and coming style. It's to me like, it's fun. Not that everybody keeps saying that logger is the new thing that's going to happen. Everybody keeps saying that year after year after year and it never just like say, right? But to me, I love it just from the Cincinnati side. It's such a historical thing to what the city is at its core gets. I love seeing loggers around town. I think the reason people say that though is because like the extreme beer became a thing. Like, these Suber chamber action the pendulum coming back like I think they both have a place at the same time because I can't drink three of those like I can't drink three patriots doubts liquid candy bars. Right. So like, maybe drink one of those. And then you got switch to log of year or like you're switching to I. It's like I feel like the more educated. You get beer the more. You base your drinking habits on like occasion? So am I going canoeing? I'm going and my dream was friends. Training a beer with my girlfriend. We watch a movie drink in for breakfast because I'm not eating. Yeah. That that's where your pastry style. Absolutely. So I think there's a time and place for all these years, but there's there's more occasions to drink and because of that. You're going to see more like more session will be. And I think that's like the reason behind everybody being like, oh, loggers loggers the next thing. And it's because like I think the most educated people in bureau reaching more for loggers because reaching for beer, probably more Cajun's. And it's like, hey loggers works because it's just Chris clean easing. And it's going to provide me like, you know, it's gonna say she is the brewery more and more breweries continue to open, and you're trying to grab market share. It makes sense that you have a nice approachable beer for people that maybe you're in an area where you're an craft away says that somebody's not used to drinking big heavy as PA. Yeah. So somewhere weird like in southeast Ohio. We well. We I live in Kentucky. So I'm still, you know, I'm thinking about places over there. You know, you wanna have in breweries over there said we have to have this. We don't necessarily don't do it. But we have to have it because we want people to come in and drink it. Don't forget to that. The majority of people that live here. Mary monitor still drinking, macro, beer everywhere. Everywhere you go people are still drink right nine days. Yeah. It's it's like crazy for me to like, call us Jeeva like in Cincinnati, like even we started. It was like dude, I literally stood at the front door for like the first year of the business and people would come in. We didn't have a kitchen. They would sit there and look at the chalkboard and be like a drink Bud Light Miller lite courts, light like what should I drink, and I'd have to walk them through different years and having a while it's still happen. So yeah, you need to like everybody put your right? Like, there's there's places in that aren't very far from here. Then that like you still get that clientele. Sure. And it's just an education thing everybody. I'm everybody wants. Good tasting food beer chewing gum, like, whatever. It is. Everybody wants flavor. Right. So it's just like, it's an education thing. I think -absolutely, bud. Miller Coors drinkers do not want the flavor. As they want. They want to cold and wet and busy. I think that they just don't know that they want the fli I've tried maybe getting salty I feel like I feel a lot. I taste them on beer a lot because we do have American logger, which is our our gateway solution to that. And I'll be Kroger and stopping random people to have them taste beer. And they'll say, I'm a Miller Coors drinker. My I have something for you. This is locally made you know, four and a half percent, alcohol light, Chris clean, and they go. That's got a lot of flavor, but full flavored. I think it's still think it's something that's in their head. I don't think it's the flavor throwing them off because it was the same guys that are happy, you know, going down the same people shouldn't say that are going down to Buffalo Wild Wings. And getting you know, they're they're hot wings, and they're enjoying that. They love that flavor. It's not the flavor itself. It's something else that's in gotten in their head. They burrow them a lot more credit. Than I was. I was thinking these are the same people eating gas station sushi. They're not eating sushi. Ask that person. They're not saying, oh, I I just like it's light lager. All they're saying. But I like Miller like it's a thing. Stuck in their head and help to get we have to find some way to get past. All it's funny. Like, you guys should like thing where you just fall Adele around like any salesperson around like at at sales events and like talking to buyers, and like that side of the business is so interesting, and they they deal with that stuff every day. You know, we could mix up with the drinking in public thing. I would work out. Well, Andrew luster drinking pope. I really do. I was not drinking public. Yes. Yes. We can. Go grab beers. We're gonna talk about chillicothe kicking me. Well from me. Name. So. Looked at it. Like who's that? He'll even the no. I can I can just put it off on you. Everytime. That's fair. When we were down at Alexandria was like spies like us. You know, Dr concur. So. Since we went off the rails during from the beer fridge. Yeah. Yeah. We didn't talk about my beer beer. Yeah. Right. And I already drank all mine. The long strange journey. So that was the highway Americano I dig that beer had one. I think I've only drink one four. It's a hell of slogger that we did. With a lot of it is single source of European being coffee. There is a little Espresso, and they heard as well, Scott kinda got got funky with deeper roots? And that it's it's an amazing beard, it it's the Christmas everything you get from from Hellas, but the nose is one hundred percent coffee like you think it's going to be such a coffee bomb because the noses is so pungent, then when you drink it, you really you don't get traditional coffee flavor. You get the subtlety that you would normally get like on Ezio, pea and beans. You would get like that that berry almost kind of blueberries and a lot of like the nutty notes of the coffee. It's it's an amazing beer. So the thing that really turned beyond a coffee. I was at. Toz a'mia when they when they had their stores around. And when it went down for a Cup of coffee and the guy talked me into this. I think it was it was probably like pour over of Ethiopian Saddam, and he was talking about and talk about these flavors. They give you know, just do whatever, you know, give him a Cup of coffee, and I'll be damned if it was not the fruit. Easiest delicious Cup of coffee. If I ever had in my life and still like, I I find myself a lot of times looking for that that experience, and so many times it gets blown out by whatever people are doing to being. But it comes across in that beer antastic. So cool. It's it's almost like a juxtaposition because people are drinking dark beers with coffee in them. The nose is telling you while this is going to be a really coffee forward beer, then you taste it. And you get this very notes, it's super cool on a side note, if you think max waxed poetically and talked romanced slow pores. You should hear him talk about coffee. So max is one of the biggest coffee nerds that. I know. So every time we're traveling like we we make a point of like every morning going to a new local roaster, and whatever city we're in do just say something about coffee when he goes. How long are we going? Will you guys have somewhere you have to be right? So we have to. Imprinting training group. So yeah, I actually wanted to try that beer, please. It's fantastic. So and then you're drinking the twelve and central twelve and central which is our collaboration private-label for Zingo Rahman. And this is an excellent excellent sowards made us you use. It is which is not something you find very often the only other one I know of is fug -ly from Oscar blues. Outright one had one yet. And then. Tato? Okay Ness, does a us you logger. But it's it's a really interesting flavor that I wasn't sure I was going to like when I first tried fogli. And so when I saw it on this. I was like I'm all in it works. So well, it's got this like subtle most like a banana. Like a like Cremedas? But it's like then there's citrus on it as well or citrusy. And and it's got the right amount of sourness to it. It's not gonna overly, but it's definitely sour and Hitchin the cheek so it would be really good with Brahman. So we actually so when we do a privately like that we have the first step is to sit down with their team and our team. So we sat down we talked about flavor profiles. We talked about fruits. We talked about you know, what pairs well with things on their menu. And then we do with tasting at both locations. So actually took Ryan the Hedberg here at the pub, we went to Xundu, and we tasted through their menu. And we had them come here. And they tasted a bunch of beers that we've done and then that's how we come to the final product. So there's a lot of a lot of thought and a lot of preparation goes into that this is an excellent one and that's coming from our fan. So well, thank you. I think you guys kind of again fly under the radar with. The our program. There's there's things about fifty west that to me when I think of fifty west you think of you know, obviously punch you think of now that American logger when you're sitting across pro works playing volleyball you're out there. You're sweating fits into that really. Well, doom pedal, these I guess those core brands, you know, they they stand out as as this big personality that you know, you walk in Kroger. And you see you see a big shelf that now, and then there's other little things that are happening here that it's hard to it's hard to showcase that in the city like Cincinnati where there's so much going on. And you don't you don't come here to the east side of the. I was gonna say always think of events happen. Fifty west. I think of the events that go on here. Fifty punch out and how much fun those are. And you and by the way, like I say one of those one of those I news clips that went viral was filmed over at pro works. And it was me pouring into a plastic glass. Plastic Cup and people like gave me so much shit. What kind of brewery is this that you guys? Pour into plastic are like, oh, well, you know, we serve a volleyball court. We we have nineteen different places that you can drink a beer fifty and some of them you have to get a plastic up to it. All right. So Zondo twelve and central is going to talk about. So that's what he's drinking. Oh, one of those gonna give you that. He wants out this or you can I got I got a vehicle t to to save on with mantis lets me. Yeah. You can tell by the look of it is the slow for that like super tighthead. That's that's this. She so thank you put myself in American logger because I drink that beer than. Actually, have not just gotten a six pack of American logger in a while. And actually, it's really sounding good, right? Stop literally drink like cases of it. It's so good. It's just like so reliable and easy drinking and like, yeah. Crush them all the time. So in the last was it last week week before the last week show we were talking to to Mike about the Cincinnati beer history book, and I'm sitting there reading about this prohibition. Mike, Pam logger? And I I wouldn't I got a logger out of the fridge and started pornographic. No now, I need to get me a little Stein. I went on digging glasses and found a little like half liter beer Myers. Thirdly, beer, mugging just fit perfect for everything that I was reading. Bobby damned if it doesn't make it taste. That's why. Sometimes like you hit that that that exact moment. Like, this is what I need. I this beer in this type of glass. So max, I was drinking a highway Americano before. So I talked about highway Americano, and I said don't drink coffee. Right. I said. I said if you if you guys think that max dork out about a slow poor here. You have talk about coffee a coffee nerd. Yeah. Well, this is your podcast. But like, I love coffee. I did on my other show drinking with the gnome, which if anybody is not subscribe to that go do that. Now. I did hint. When I launched the show that eventually we would probably touch on coffee, and maybe even t- at some point. So there will be a coffee show at some point. If you wanna talk about coffee. I know I don't even think like, I may not even be qualified for it. I'm pretty nerdy about it. I've got like an arrow press is they'll shakes his head v six connects and a house and. The whole idea of the show is bunch of people that like drink sitting around talking about things they're not qualified to talk about. I know a couple of guys in the city that like no more about coffee than I do that like like got me into it. And and maybe we bring them in like a cupping. I've sat around in like we bought cupping equipment and did comings and me and one of my buddies. He runs a bar downtown. And he from right house. He's the man and like. Got me like deep in the coffee. And now I'm such a nerd I can't drink. I can't drink that. Like every morning. It's just like it takes forty five minutes. Kid equipment out bring. My aero press with me when we go camping. My wife makes fun of me. She's dumping instant coffee. I learned to drink coffee in the army. So I'll drink any coffee. You put in front of me, we used to take like coffee grounds and like MR ease. It just like make putting out of him and stuff just like have caffeine. So I've even got a I have a Ted of those grinds. Have you seen those? They're like, they're like Dipak made with coffee and flavored. I have those in there just to give a world isn't tried about kind of gross. Let's let's go ahead and talk about chillicothe e since we're already almost an hour into a show. And we have another huge topic that we didn't even touch on. You guys are opening a group. East out in the middle of nowhere for those of us in Cincinnati has how we see Chella gothi. It is now going to be a stop on the way to Athens when you're headed out there talk about that a little bit number one. Why? And we'll go from there. So why is it very expand air why Chilcott? Why is easy? You wanna take what? Yeah. So why is is really simple? So obviously when it comes to our brand at fifty west. And I think anyone that knows us knows how protective we are of this brand. And that we really stay true to it. And we say on point. So everything that we do we talk about romanticize this road. That's right outside of this burry because ocean city, Maryland all the way to Sacramento, California. Where were the group of is here? Everyone always talks about fifty s and fifty s blah, blah, blah. But what a lot of people don't know is further east. It goes to several small towns it goes to Athens and one of those chillicothe e right? So Chile coffee is a town of twenty five thousand people that's up and coming. I mean, I've I've fallen in love now spending time in Chile coffee. They have a wonderful downtown area seven eight different restaurants that are kind of doing upscale gastro pub style food, but the gist as they have twenty five thousand. Thousand people and no breweries, right? So here in Cincinnati. That's you know, what? What does that mean? You don't even know bruisers sixty here. So the point is crazy. So, you know. You know? One. It's on fifty. Our location that that that we've found that we're going to be rehabbing turning into the brew pub is actually on the corner of fifty and main street in downtown Chile coffee, and there's a there's a huge demand right now for four good beer, and they've really rolled out the welcome wagon for us. And and the town the city council, and the mayor then everyone around there, we've been sprinkling are beer, destroy wise now into chillicothe -i. And I mean just two weeks ago we didn't event with a forty two to four tap takeover in down coffee, and we kicked all of our beers in two hours. They're just so excited to have the brand there to have a brewery and have good beer. So the why was was was super simple for us. I don't know the demographics of chillicothe at all. It seems like one of those towns that is full of people that like the outdoors that like being kind of out and that kind of atmosphere. To not have a brewery in a town. Like that is crazy to me. It seems like the crowd that I feel like is ready to embrace that very hard. It's crazy to think like a town that size in general, regardless of where they are not having a brewery nowadays. Like, that's that's pretty unusual to come across them right on fifty. So I mean, you know, that's the perfect storm for us. Right. It was going to say Florence. But that's. Yeah. Florence is about thirty thousand. They don't have one yet. But taproom brewery. Speaking to that though. I mean like. Bart Watson communists of the. I'm a huge fan boy for that guy. And you know, he's pointed out like at every single craft brewers conference. There's kind of like a different like theme that you. They don't explicitly say, but you sort of get out of it like early in the early days. It was like, hey, mate quality beer. And then like even the last one was kind of doom and gloom. It was like oh my God. Like, we don't really know how this like shakeout is going to work. And then now it's kind of like guys the growth rate has like fallen to a really normal CPAP market and like our regular like like brands, and that that's the key word is that like now we're like making good beer is very for. You're not even a part of the conversation. If you're not making good beer. So like, I don't even like to talk about like when we talk about the brand. Sometimes it's like you to pitch. Kroger you go into these the wholesaler pitches. It's like, hey, guys like. It's good beer. Let's not dwell on that for too long. You can taste it and make up your own mind or look at the awards or whatever. But like what really matters now is like how are you going to build your brand? And what your brand story is. And how are you going to bring that to market? And so what what Dell was saying with, you know, our brand story and how we feel about that. And just doubling down on that. Now, the whole industry. Everybody needs to realize that like you're operating your own individual like friend, and you need to figure out the best way to tell that story. So for us a great way to tell that story is the look down this road and find these pockets of America, that's what I was getting out with Bart was that he was saying recently like the way that we all continue to grow. And in the reason, there's still room for more, Bruce come on board is because there's lots of pockets of America that like are just under served, and like you can look around this city and talked all these real owners and realize like. Well, no one here is afraid to open up another pre right because it's like it works. Like, I don't care what the demographic is like people wanna drink craft beer, and you can you can go into a town that's under served and drop a re in it'll work. But like that's not the reason for chillicothe e really the reason for chillicothe, he is we wanna tell this route fifty story, and when we look down fifty one of the first places that smacked in the face with chillicothe your were driving on the road, and you get chill coffee, and it's like, holy crap. A huge town with ton of people that are like drinking craft Burity in that like there's cool restaurants in Thirdly of coffee, and it's like, wait a minute. Like, these people need Abry these people need a community center. This third space where like we can put a we can provide them the brand of fifty west, especially the way, the brand has evolved in the last couple years in the way, it's kind of turn. And into what it is like, I just I can see it. So well somewhere like chillicothe e or like, an Athens or. And Asheville these out that those whatever volunteer plan. Snow fifty. But you know, it just fits like these these towns like that it just makes sense there. And I don't think that that's the same for a lot of brands in Cincinnati there when you told me that they were opening a place in chillicothe e that was one of the least apprising things I'd heard all year. Honestly, it's like, yeah. It makes sense to me mean, I don't think like our ultimate growth plans like drop a ton of pubs. Oh, no, no. You need to have one from ocean city to that's the next you need to have at least, you know, every state needs at least one I want max, I think like alternate goal is to continue to provide. You know, the the experience in the culture and be able to perpetuate the fifty s brand outside of here and continue to tell her story where it makes sense. And I feel like you were gonna ask is the ultimate plan to draw a bunch of pubs. And it's it's not it's to continue tiller story and build communities in the places where it makes sense. And if that the shop a pub shop pub, if that means just bring district and a really talented sales rep who is going to start running group in like a mountain biking club. And like, maybe that's all it is. But like the thing is we want to provide experiences for people and continue to tell the story that we think is really cool about America and about like active lifestyle, and if we can continue to do that people will reach for our beer when they go to Kroger when they go to CVS when they go to Walgreens when they weren't speedway now when they go to speed what the brilliance of it, though, is that that story does change as you go across the country. You know, the story of fifty west and telling that story of fifty across the country is is is one thing here, and it's similar but still going to be very different just down the road, quote, unquote. Until like if you if you look. Ocean city or wherever it may be you know, like that's still the story of fifty. But it's so different that it's it's interesting to think long-term in wing, you know, obviously, everybody wants fifty west to be a brand and be accompany so far in the future that we can't even really like picture when you guys seven years old. You know, it doesn't it doesn't make sense long-term to really look at that yet. But it does this is this is a story that could be told here's years and years from now in different ways as that kind of grows. Well, I mean, that's the one common thread is that road is fifty right? So what what that means to people are different things. So whether in ocean city or in Tahoe like that the branded self, you know, is the common thread is the road. So you can actually take this. And when someone says, I know I know fifty I grew up on fifty whether they're in an urban setting all. On that road or they're in a country setting along that road. It's still resonates with both of them. You can then model those brewpubs or whatever you're doing you model that brand to to comfort them, and and to give them that nostalgia. Whether it's the what we have here in Cynthia what we're building Chila coffee, or if we do an urban concept in Washington DC. Any the concept on the west coast? So I can have an excuse to drive out there. If you want to open one in Tahoe like not for nothing, but I've got a little taproom experience. I'm Hugh ski. I really want to like just how reason to go to a home more times. We talk. A road trip where you starts in Maryland. And you just like you take, you know, a month, and you just drive across the country and every time you need to stop you stop at a fifty west and you stay somewhere close by. And you do whatever that thing is skiing. Tahu I've already got this drunk out man tahoe's going to be like the brute all in Columbus. It's going to be the hotel and everything. And everything just skis. Bobby to write the check. We're gonna be fine. So I've done the whole road trip. Like a lot of the photos, you see around the puck actually, the ones that I took and Tahoe is like the most beautiful place in the United States. Definitely most beautiful place on fifty probably the most. We're all right. And it's fantastic. You drive through this giant mountainside called cave rock you. So you come from Carson city in vodka. And it's like weird old school casino. Town you drive up a mountain, and then you're like on what's called Spooner summit. We have vehicle spin or something. And then you drive through mountain and the second you come out on the other side. It's like this crystal clear lake and snowcapped mountains, like huge huge pine trees, this cool like little hippy mountain town. And it's like amazing. It's very my wife taking road trips with me because I'm that guy that like every five minutes, Honey, Honey, look, look at this look at this stop. We gotta stop. We gotta do this. Have you ever looked up pictures two zero? Oh, I've seen pictures of that. I've never purposely gone insane. Like, the water is clear up two hundred foot, and it's potable like you can just go trinket. It's honestly, it's so beautiful there. It's so beautiful. I heard the have beautiful trees to which brings up another thing that I've got on my list here. Trees hose, the next. I thought you're gonna tell us when we had. No, that's that's that's smoking. Comes out actually, the next seasonal is ocean city. That's right. Which is strawberries this year's that. Right. I mean, it's always been. This was the strawberries before it's always, but. It's thinking of something else. We've had more ingredients with shrubberies before there was high biscuits in it. But there's no I don't there's going to be no high biscuits this year. But yeah, it's strawberry goes. Awesome. Peer like have you ever drink up here? I drank it once, but it was the last canned version that I don't know if it was really tasting. It was supposed to taste. Oh, yeah. But enjoyed not out of a can of headed here. Yes. All of our all of our core. Brands and oversees brands have gone through like lots of batches lots of testing as you guys imagine, you know, we we sell it would drink it. We get tons of feedback from inside we get feedback from outside. We figure out the right price point. We figure out the right recipe. I mean, so all we've brew that beer a bunch of times. And it gets an awesome reaction. We honestly knocked it out of the park the very first time birdie it was just like holy shit. This this is like lightning in a bottle like start sending that out. And then everybody that got it loved it. And we'd probably couldn't make enough before summer ended the very first time. And then and then last year we made it for probably two other years, and then but last year, especially it crushed, and it was at like a really high price point because the brewers just like like. We didn't make enough like we didn't mean to small batches. And then, but but it crushed. So in our like, all right sweet scale it up get the price. Right. Like the scale of economy rate. We'll get the price down, and we're gonna we're gonna flood the market. It's. May or June. Oh, so round there. It's funny. We're really good about when the weather's warm. So we've got the brand the seasonal skew in the Kroger. Right. So we can swap it whenever we want from sunset into goes. But we're buying printed cans for the first time. So like, the problem isn't brewing the beer it's getting the first round. When you buy printed cans minimum order like two hundred fifty thousand cans chocolate. It's like it's like a couple years of beer came on can't printing cans. So we know we're going to bring this beer for a couple of years for all right press. Go on the print. It takes forever to get like we're like little NATs on on on balls. You know, I I had that conversation with Scott. Yep. Doesn't care like us. They're like, oh, we deal with Coca Cola and stuff. Like, literally don't care on all the Cam company, not NATs on balls gods. The cannon company Paul's where bulls. What the fuck to you on the weekend? Flee? I feel it quickly. We'll get into like insider baseball conversation with people, and they don't always like, no we're talking about like, I got a long conversation with somebody about FM be the other day and at the end of it. They were like, what's it was interesting understand any of it? Oh shit. Sorry. But yeah beverages. If you're listening for also, yeah, folded, it didn't turn into that. The the canning world is very interesting. There's like three companies for if you like it's like ever can our crown and ball. There's only a few companies, you know, that you can buy printed cans from. Goes into the whole shrink sleeve and label thing, but we won't do that for now. So it's really hard to your cans printed. But looks the best. So yet goes it will come out. We won't have the cans hand yet. We think that they'll be here at the very intimate. And that's when we'll watch so Memorial Day ish is like beer will come out. But the timelines are really fuzzy from these guys like I said like we're they don't really care about us. They're doing it. And so the same guys think there's three companies that serve everybody, including of re buddy. So you're talking about the biggest brands that you can think of in the United States are still getting the cans from the same people. So anybody mystery everybody wants to get into the industry, and you figure out a way to make cans yourself that you're in. We're not sure million dollar solution. A way that somebody could come up with the company and just keep buying tons of blanks and then print them locally. So there's guys that have tried to come up with the solution. So I've taught I talked to a really smart guy. One time that. This is opposed to the three dumb ones in the room with you. None time I talked to smart. Guys in the business that that's why all you see all this shrink shrink wrapping label. So one guy that was in the business that really researched it said that it would take about forty four million dollars to figure out. Like do it at a small scale like you need a ton of capital kit, the equipment and other material and everything it's even small scale, those businesses are like super capital intensive and really hard. That's why there's only three of them. Like could it be done? Yeah. Is is there an eat for like a mid tier campaigner? Yeah. Does it exist? So all you super smart people the modern day Steve Jobs as of the world that we need to be working in well-funded beer cans. Our in front of us. But like we complicate can pretend that you. Do we complicate the Cam printing processes, well because we print the whole can white first, and then we print it again with the color. So if you look at our cans on the shelf other guys cans look at our white versus their white. There's a look gray dead white. Thanks because we print them twice. Notre started for guys I started releasing cans. I think there was one person that wrote the article that actually had a really good description of that in there and explaining kinda why these cans are special, and it's super inside baseball super nerdy. I don't know that the average beer drinker like pays attention to like when people talk about that. But it does look better much better subconsciously, hopefully, they look at the shelf in their tracked into that. Because. You know, I I notice it because I every time I drink a new beer, I take a picture. Take a bunch of pictures put it on the website, although I'm really far behind. So don't go on are looking for the latest release. But and I love super close up pictures of the artwork on cancer. I love beer artwork. And some of these candidates embarrassing to me, they'll take a picture of and put it on there. Like, oh, that's really, bad luck. And that's just that's just poor printing. It doesn't look good. I've never had that problem with fifty s cans. Twice. And and it's twice the cost to. Yeah. We we pay about twice as much for them. They're they're sexy. But that actually makes total sense to me being who you guys are. Because it's about the experience even if it's in the can knowing that. But like also Noyer backstory that like if you know how long it took us to get two cans, and how do strategic we were to get to that point. Like, we didn't fumble one piece of that. Like when we got like when we finally got cans, it was like most importantly, we had a brand Bill, and that's why you saw really quick Kroger, adoption and like blasted all the doors because when we finally went to Kroger, they're like, yeah. We've been waiting for you guys have this meeting for like five years like where have you guys been? And it's like, yeah. We've been out there building a brand. And that's and everybody knows it wants to shelve one of my favorite stories when I was at w CPO that I ever did was shop with brewer with bland chart with lake. Dude. It it. I was on pins and needles listening to him because he was talking about who made the cardboard that the six pack comes in who did this who printed the can win was just all these things that I had never thought about before. But it's all ever looked at. But because you guys were getting ready to do that at that point. That was what was on his mind, and it was so I open as the consumer to see how that thought process went. And I'm not kidding. You do I sat there for half an hour. Just like on pins and needles writing down everything the man said and was like this is gold. So when you guys launch it's like, yeah, I know there and knowing Blake he bought an Avery beer. Loves Avery huge. You know, he he bought something from Michigan. He matter. He's from Michigan summers up there in the end. It was something. Yeah. Shorts. Talking talking about that like slow introduction of cans and launching. So the first year you actually put beer in package, you're considered a new craft Burr. Right. So so on the in the package where we were new craft into cans do eighteen so we're really proud of that here in at fifty that for the year two thousand eighteen we were the number one new craft brewer in package to the supermarket channel in the United States. Not here in Cincinnati. Not incentive Kentucky in the United States. We only had stores in Cincinnati and knowing Taki, and we're still number one. And we were in the country. We are number one in the country in two thousand eighteen we're but I mean in those states, and you're number one in the country. It's the year fifty s here's the thing. It's like it just goes back to what I was saying before we built a brand before we launched it most breeze like one of the one calling steak, but like a lot of what a lot of rules are doing now is they open. They get the production up and going maybe it's too much. They start to can really really quickly. And then they throw it on the shelf. And nobody knows who they are yet. So they don't get a lot of pool. And what we did was basically opposite of that. We grew really organically really slow grew district grew draft grew our presence in town through cool events like put experiential stuff on. So the time. We finally got two cans people knew who we were what are your tastes like and like the brands that we release weren't like brands that we were guessing like, oh, let's see if this works like. We release branch we knew people from fifty s and then they reach for it off the punish an advantage and easy. So because you guys are older you're in this this other club of you know, there's eleven breweries in Cincinnati that I think are older than you guys right now. Eleven eleven you're talking Sam Adams Christian more line. So we were of Miller with that number in the Cincinnati, greater Cincinnati area. I still don't believe it read them. Yeah. I mean, we memory. Doesn't. Let me get. Let's sam. Order Miller rock-bottom Sam Adams hoffbrau Mount Carmel Listerman. Great crescents river town. Great crescents out of businesses it. No, greg. It's going, okay. There's still open. District seller dealer. And then you guys went wind solar urban. They were. February of two thousand twelve oh God it yet. Didn't know. It was a tiny system at the time. But got it cool. Yeah. Wow. But that being said some of those are obviously kind of in a different category than that. You guys opened in in this era where there were not a lot of rural. Especially a lot of Burris this scale you guys were at the time. It's easier to grow slowly when you're not opening in a city of sixty breweries and trying to appease. Big money behind you. And people breathing down your neck, and this this this just the timing is perfect for what this place has become and will become. Yeah. I mean, you saw like market fit and timing at that time like we didn't even take advantage of completely. You saw brands like matching in rank is really run with that timing again, if they did it our own way, but like they ran out into district right away. Tree opened today. Wouldn't it wouldn't work same way? Do it couldn't grow the same way? You guys if you open today could not grow the same way. It's new brewers all the time where they're like. Oh, what should I do? And it's like, I have no idea great idea how to do it. But it's it's it's way different than it looked like then. And it's funny. How facets it's changed. I think we'll probably look in five years. We'll look back at the places that are opening now and look at this one this one and this say, they did it the right way. They grew the right way for that time not knowing now what that is though. It's it's gonna be interesting. Yeah. We have an idea is appropriate. I mean, there's writing on the wall. Like like, hey, this is what works in. This is what doesn't I mean, you see people closing all around all around. But I've heard a lot of people say this place is going to close this place should close. This place shouldn't close and we've all seen that be proven wrong. Right. I mean, it depends on who you're talking about. They're blank slates, easy example of places that closed that the everybody said would close or shouldn't close. I know. But if you looked at that like, I mean, I know I know. Or places that people say should close that are still just chugging along. And it's easy on me. And I'm not naming names on that one. Every. Ultra saying. It's pretty easy to be zone because the pub if you'll if you view continue to write ties your business as you decline. And you just shrink down to just the public say the pub is long as you're running a restaurant and bar correctly. You can keep it going because the margin on beer in your own space is huge. And like, you can continue your your what's called own premise because on premise and are holding thing. What's your own premise if you're doing that? Right. You can always stay alive. So like that's always like number one too. That's another thing about like new brewers. Like when they come and ask me for vice and stuff. It's like dude make sure that your taproom crushes it because like that's step one. That's the heartbeat of the business. Do not try to dish review without your taproom already crushing it. Unless you got a lot of money. Well, yeah. But that's what I think hasn't proved to a solution. If you do have the money behind it. I guess a good put it into the taproom experience, but it into something that people want to go to and experience like don't don't fix a lot of problems by throwing money at it. Arguably. But but I mean, you can fix taproom experienced by throwing money at the top rib and making it a better experience. Long-term? What happens you know, what I mean? Right. Even if you have unlimited money, eventually, you're like, all right. I'm tired of losing. Yeah. Well, I mean the brewery with the most money is the one that's losing market share every single year. It's you know, the big ABC's and the the Miller or of the world. That's that's the unlimited money that is. I want to say failing. But I mean, they're they're they're they're failing at what they were doing. So. They're not failing. They're just not as dumb. I mean, they're failing in my mind, by the way, I'm pro it's and arguments. Beer. I'm pro all beer like like beer is category needs to grow for craft to grow. I'm I'm definitely pro all beer. I am not pro albeit companies is the way I think I would put it. I think there's a lot of things being done very have been being done very poorly for what beer is supposed to be sure. And maybe you disagree with some of the practices and stuff, and that's a program, and maybe that specific, you know base. But but it's. I think it's important to know that like craft is only gonna grow as the category grows, and it's really appropriate that these companies from like the eighteen hundreds that have you know, these these this huge distribution and business network set up and product production set up that they need to succeed for the category to succeed. Like like like, it's probably a hard question for like or hard topic for like real craft Uris. But like I am diehard craft beer in like we can't continue to grow without the biggest guys pushing through and creating more space for beer in general. Because like let's say like a new a new bar opens. Are they going to be like are they going to have taps or not look right now, you could open like super successful just spirits only. You don't serve I've heard like wine only bar. That's going down in there TR. Yeah. I'm only I'm not like those things like a niche business or whatever. But like if beer's going to grow we're going to get more places to serve our product. In more more experiences that we can give to the customer it has to grow as a as an occasion. And like the people with the biggest budgets in the biggest pockets, and the most resources can like help lead that way, high tide raises all ships. I'm not saying that saying, yeah, I'm not saying we should all it's a very interesting conversation. I. This is totally what I expect here though. Honestly. Kind of a high level conversation about the industry. I'll say I like that kind of thing. I don't know if we get into it here. It can be it can be a hot gas. But like I'd love to pull Bobby for that one too. Because like Bobby has a really interesting take on it. And. Yet, like, the more you get into gear and see how it's distributed and how the networks work, and like how all of these pieces come together to really like your beer out to the world. A lot of it has to do with like like how healthy the category is. And who influences it, and there's those two companies really influence it a lot to the point. I think if if as a as an industry or as a as a category if we just slowly beat them to death like not all at once. But slowly kill them. That's a different story. Like like it was just craft. We'd probably own less occasions. Like beer would just fall. Like, we do you think it would be replaced, by wine and spirit? Right now, we're we're losing her. Part of your but. A smaller? Yeah. The par begin another topic. Wait. Are you guys gonna planning on doing the first seltzer since? No, we're going to do the last. That's an even better answer. For the record. We're probably not gonna do it seltzer. It we did one like on tap. Yeah. We did one last summer on tab. It was like a soda. It was we did a Hartselle. It was like an art soda falls into the same category. Pretty sweet. But. I wanna do functional beverage, but I'm not sure if I wanna do I as in like stuff with active ingredients, we're actually we have coming on Monday. Yes, we're we're coming out with a goes a that we use the enzyme to make it really low calorie. So basically like we converted all the sugars to like super. Metabolize sugars for for the yeast yeast shredded every bit of it create like literally down to zero Plato made a phone dry. Then we added electrolyte to the beer and diet goes it's called watermelon or activated ale of you low power. Look our beer that is like aim towards our active lifestyle. Consumer. We have a lot of that here for US. We were all leagues every every week. Every Tuesday, we do a happy hour cycle ride. We train people for marathons, and it's like that drinker drinks more consciously and they drink a little bit differently from from the craft beer nerd, which we also serve and we just serve everybody in the middle too. But we wanted to make a product for them because we were providing all these experiences for them. So whether it was volleyball or running or second. This is our first stab at it. You might see bigger stuff from us in the future in this category. But but for now, this is kind of our first for stab it. But it's still going to fall in line with the idea of beer, it's not going to kind of drift into those other categories. Yeah. It'll be it'll it'll we're gonna make the we're fo- something beer. There's there's a whole lot of roads we could go down there. But I know you guys I know what you're thinking. We as a comedy fifty s focused on on making beer, and you guys are confident in beer as a long-term along term. There's just so much more like to be done in beer and to be. Yes, I agree on a percent as much as I love spirits as much as some of the other spirits people around still beer is still my number one always. Thank you guys. Again. There's a whole lot more we need to come back in and talk. Doc. We didn't even we didn't even touch on punch out which is coming up. The thirteenth training exit way. They're already guys haven't been to punch out anybody. That's listening you need to get there this year. It's an amazing. It's every year Benton Cincinnati, which the country, I've never been to the smoothies other places. I don't leave Cincinnati very often. Take a road trip and go to fifty pups, but. Until then Cincinnati is responsible. Always always always awesome to come here. And talk to you guys. I'm so glad I got to be here today. So thank you very much for your hospitality. Thank you guys. On show. Thank you guys everybody. Tune in next week for sour beer panel extravaganza. We will try to keep everybody from fighting cast voices since craft.
Networking Done Right - Interview with Ziv Mandl - CEO of John Bryce (In Hebrew)
"Hi and welcome to the podcast network yourself. Success Managers Yachting Neiman and today's episode nine can meet Z. Mental NC mental is one of those persons are one of those names as always pops up when asked. People whose great networker Me To interview the podcast a, he's the CEO of John, Bryce training and so the train department of metrics today it's GonNa be in Hebrew. So this podcast is going to be in Hebrew for if you're it's GONNA be challenging, but it's also going to be a great learning opportunity and even though the Hebrew is a little bit challenging but is we worth it? So let's dive into it a met with Ziv on a Friday, which is usually when he meets people need for coffee and the coffee in the land. In Tel Aviv so yeah. Here we go and Hogan. As shelvin limited bleeped. Dash Vin- timid Adagio if it's If McClellan then, etc.. couple. Through the leash. Mushroom Ravioli. A. Rome our. Full hour clean with. applecross live onto. that. Lemonade to the. The High Africom in case if the startup. In Da. Incidents overdue Lindsey. Graham. Laurentian networking Russo flush devolve actually before Oliseh. That's Level ally, she teaches door. Villa. Networking the Michael Cornacchia sound soon could. Sean networking. Let's say. But IT'S A. Little with the foot SPA. Spa. Marshall Shea. Court palm share. Sequential boycotters. Labor. Team is. Trickling. Pskov. Show of now them to. squall mini say on should be BASSAC world. Yes. Fill Miss. A lawyer. Silje. Visas all, Lem. It is it. Actually. Say he should. Say v O Dash into barrel. Let me pull sham. Then, the committed. Team. Zola's Oh. So, there's. A tipping. Its Spot Villa Geisha Shimshon. ACACIA. You. Is called below. That office call let's networking negotiation for the team shoppers. Curate where you do ascherson. In Colossians shutouts. Law. From Elliot's Vacuum Sheila Mackillop. It's a correspondent. For the show. You're. Looking at the solicit. Earth. Let's add. Share her you've. Out Networking with Russia valid. Routes. INVADE, Iraq tells show now shuttle system and Salah Batmobile Magnum. As yes, we. Plays. Guitar. reshare. Cash Mashru. Shut them again. She. My. Conception for teeth. Hush about the same you may. Event Data Adamson's if Your whole showroom? Kamata frame shipment national better. Short. Actually National Whip. With. Many established. The unit in billionaire it'd, be DEMOC. Dilemma. Now. Share. Matarrese shave remember cute animals silicon casually been. especially. In south in. Vegas shutout Natalie. Mitchell. Four of them filmography Sheldon McClellan. Him. Much. Less Obama practice. Shorts Maha Schnitzer how the image of what? If a whole Shaanxi for the chillicothe. Augusta. Shop Telecast. Michelle Coffee Lands Villa newsreel coffee. Shop. He developed mccovey negotiate. With the Russian Ni gift she'll do share. Say Consultants at Islam Chamamah type of Parma commercial between we show. They showed up. Sita Chamois should accommodate Chicago Macho because Elliott's mcquilken. Debris Shit at the Cambridge naturally Martin. Sheen. It's a relevant. Mattel air. Marshal. Sir Interesting. Come around to the Kyle. littlest out into the night booking, we become claim hotel hot quotas manipulative. Less retail go. Hunt Teddy forget show. You seem she cloudier Chicago's Manjula. Mistook. It. Within. The shuttle Otani. In Unison Shift. The. QUALITY VALUE MEAL IS A. Middle Canea Neil. That's a risk libra call. Palm shish. mcabe. Megan. mackey Shalom by. Networking. Government. In Malaysia few weeks. Just about. Getting. The. Ship. Question Marty Bisa. Like L. Shalom forgetting initial. Holiday to the. Show Bishops McLean man. Klaser. Matola? PHYSICIAN LITTLE ALEX Wehrley. Move On. The ninety. Five. Million Mobile. Mitzi Delilah. At the first choice July Michel casually she i. Finished positive you. That Russians they nail you. Need, quotas. Mobility sequential. Sham you've Gosh. The patients. Michelle. The Shit amid a whole Lonzo. Say leveled actually shook from. The Russian. E. Is it amid Shove Ma unique point? In. Her do ma. was really claim claims miss. Lewd Governor. Any dealerships claim to she up on. Thumbs. Would be. As much as. Take should always be a shell mushrooms the clip. From. That he should. have. BECAUSE SYMBOL OF! It looks location. Altitude. Voice leash poorly. Show faculty. Ion. mccue why Ashley Time We? Eytan, approval of. Tallow his man mode Qatar. Shove shallow she thought of that committee mushroom you pod. Out The media national bill. Maher, are, unique storage. Call. For us so In. that. Case. Is, a monster hustled equipment successive session. Limit Sell, it, and convince gets. A. Capacitor Tony My Anyanwu. Omar with Adele of heart. Conditions. Hi IT'S A. Virtual. Networking probably bits and My Gosh, I'm quibble. Surely Mogadishu show Nipple Kim. Coaching. From Daddy tally. As. facebook not. Say Tolkien Shinola. facebook. Van Less cable in. Lincoln's Kalia. Feel. I available. Malleable Limited. Kuala cubes. At least a miserable leaving billion sales. Really. Liz autonation shuttle city petititons, lizzo tension shootouts, occasionally them seem. To seem except Ed. Valenti. Via Masha Wash Lamar. Relatives. A A. To Baluchi Tulsa. Scorch your car. There's a black combat sought could Minnesota amendment? Officially. Takashumia scabby let's from The bill English time smokes limit. Of. Billing. MONALISA. I gotTA Elvis Man. Salafi. Muslims. And Ashim Coupling Burlingham. Because you'll see to. Fish. My audible especially comfortable Ingrid. Bergman ship. Which your lawyer. To, mccully for NATO Marriage Manitoba. Zilog me. They love cutting I. A. TIP each money waste McClymont it's. Social. Much. To come. Much many denim out. With INOSITOL Vaidya. Oddly as And luggage my. Voice Command survive. Back in. McLean volume cliff. Mifflin about the name acute trappers until smiles all of let you do from the lowest attendance. there. To see us to a motive antics. Camacho. GNARLIEST advantage relative to. The whole. Actually, look. The. Bill. Should. Should. On, the she believed in always it Kennedy's money and threw up because. Money and we want. To. Rely. Vile. Similarly of an issue monoculture. SHOOP I'm. Sarah. Just law interacts even killed in collages. She. Kept minds they come on civilian J.. Cold, but such you need at the. Talk show that oil it's. Yet and A multicultural came. into the dish. Limit. Canal you. SORTA honey? Dash. Cam pull a muscle admits. Shelby. With more to. My Family Sheila Sheila, she group at that. Hotel name clippings probably looking at the same hotel. A dime. From we. Dealt secret scholarship associated with a A. Need. That she settled. Caputo. Him. As maybe Shimmy. Has. BINNY's Olympic. Eleven Chabala Shelbyville machine call is Alan she meets an old my. Cherie all been dumped dash. It's All been down. The. Is Sufficiently Naughton Zakat Acacia of them. Visit Mushroom should be. Sufficient around. Me Silvery Networking. As Anita. Shave. Will likely same. For facebook telling my, what's what's appropriate mode motorshow? Solution whenever lots of Students with Munoz's Ahah. Anyone's again. My. Mom, who made okay and pushes adultress. Sheila deem? Fish meets. The. Intel runs combat the England. What's just? been them shutdown but what's up shillue? Shit Venture Fisher wishes she didn't event. because. SIBITO. Modes. Bubonic. and. The hackers. The Pitiful Sean how Mashal. Sheila. The telephone at an. Internship Shabby. Essential. Sick Blitzer interactive. Ducks Bishops Look. Keep. Should've number numeric Lale will I've been? been. Done. Lebron and The come. Up, value. The value will will. Tap Michelle. That's the family. Really has if Wash networking Chen. Shift she tovar. Then shooting. Muslim. Lovey. Specifically silje classic. Nitty knock. Tim must've as. Thammasat Tamatave Mushroom Priscila. As she especially. I mean for. Nationally. And eventually. I approach portrait. Hope is it. This is an equal Yongxin Gosh teasha. Bishop. And she. You Kid. Leash might to support the whole Lonzo. It's early on actually murdering. Should be to our. Show about Mr Personality Vegetable. Will Stop. Because he was old no Until she actually sent a ship Shimla Geena five it's come. And much claim. Zana this says shall. Like go shit lamb kizer Beta minus Shimshon Hocus at the base it will go to dope. Mushoo Bama in. Store Gum Russia including that's athletes area. What's going club Puccio of? Mattila bill sequential. Insufficient. Thick that's. Positive. I'm sure there. Let's be that. Zimmer. Cal because familiar in a very. Much Maloka. must've says of. Mankind mood of the invasion of. Money. and. We met. William. Bill Clinton. Sammy's. KUBOTA military. Holiday Chila. Created I she chilean. A. Petition and shift shaky Kosher Makita machine because you at the. Feminine. She is hot smart. Should be. mcduck. Lit Sorry Sheba. Zim Van Truscott's Love Mushrooms does. Maple you'll over. A. CAREER DIS-OFFICIAL DEVOUT A. FEELS UNDER Olympia Lawn Asher. Show Liam. Much, it's to sort. The. Paktika selfish. Qods elected. Mentally sorta she mutual typically over there. Metal. Sheila immeasurably showed the the. Bishop short come. Up Shit a kitchen. Today. Let Zek ACACIA become. There's and much Nicola Liz L. Top Mashal share a established on establishing. Any. Call Shabby so optimism this wasp specific. Value. funneled. Love your. With demonstrate demonstrating accuser should say. All of them. Jessica layer we all. Share and it should by Chevrolet Sean, you're rich. Of ensures a little bit. Muscial eggs at. The. Isla Saudi show now alas the alleys. Kabila. Republican finish at the. Finish does let me tell. ME. What is your? Zoo ticket. As Deli. facebook. What's? Valid Ivanka. Policeman in earlier. I any. Mushoo. Coalition. Week. If it's Amish Time Alba Social Albashaun Disease Mandel. What. If its commission time Albert Solution over our. Money Law, that kin- deletion you name it Should actually what's up? PODCAST CAST and he's In Michigan, colleges. and. She shouldn't do. An Gosh then. Journey should. Therefore she would say a tabby. We shall I and he Tel Aviv as much as with. level. When she won't Come on social. Media that's Ed Donahue Negative Yesterday call caller Haddish the Plymouth any and at. Mom Hotter origine city socially mcsorley for the. Accidentally, Cocchi mookie Betts Foolish. Elephant Very Milton her big Italian associates. Kanye, shoe linguistically token she. Did Accept Government. Donkeys. That Lamont because they're. The House. That's why I knew I. Love. Mushoo. Will. Met, him come over it. Just dried no limit the nickel joshes if you. Will. Come with a much as Modem AFIA disallow. Position You. Wish. Shea shame. Lunch hockey to. Whole has issues but what flat in hierarchy the hog is much. Is this year but there at the Bonilla Gilead fuel. Domestic? And I'm on colleen and ZIP Kinda. Sham Ki him to networking looks at the forget Mrs. Options. Shall we commitment. The motorcyle. Door at the old. Chess. With all her that's Levin. Cams. Akilah Coachella. Cochet Green. Visibility. Really is I'm wondering. Unquote Lonzo. Mushoo Shea. Old. Building. Of Cunanan, same show. almost. Mohammed focus husband. Chilly. The the issue because I know that panel. About. linked. Shallow picture he says is a former lunch matter pretaped. Of Lanyo to start. Like Tobacco new me. A you'll let me. Let me Columbia and you'll lay in silica, happen. And you let me let me and my uncle lifted Iran. Zinat in. The clubmen of Kim, McClellan. Skin with me companion hugh locate. My. That's really at Serta. Inga should issues sheep's decide you'll give. Him. This. Panella Alabama, fishmeal all. Such a deal. ZECA TO NOT TO SELL VISUAL Enough enough for them. To Settle Alex. Look. Money. For neighbor hundred. Shoe. A imploding. Catan bit. Alabama. Highs money invited three of Swoboda. Minnetonka Valletta chills telephone today. Shula. Hobie said. Speaking by. Vh Must Be. Cool much Nikai lead CABELA's. Meet Up Saddam you'll meet up. With. The DACA Dayak or call him a port is meat of. Wisdom of Yellow Sean. event. Shahar. Couldn't pull. Delegation, she may have been them. She left. Map. Subject. You'll meet up. The. Shoe. Is Issue Mushroom shooter. Lordly. Best. namche lowly severe. Humanitarian. Sita. Sheep symbolically that's just the bill. Mich- feels that. I'd. Be Cool Macho Neem. Philip. Formative years. Of Petitioning. Pick up before. The Sneak into. From. Lille. Connie my elevator speech run. Cassava middle. Villena Philip their. Actions. I was born. In. What? Ishmael. Tough shot for this navy pin could come in a lot of all about. The. Shows Lizzo Has. You. Both of each of. The two against. Them and. Finding for the gift. Of Monitors. Silly Accents Avila. Solid bushing. you. An it's. The the voice of METEX. Kitchen assaults have. Time with. The of. The. Telephone village hotter lots of the. School sure what's up a family? Momentum. Immediate, Source Leno. Local. Tillerson. Kabila. Christ as A. Way To auditing thin over meets. Those. Yet for a new call. I Need Colo.. Relinquish, the telephone. Combustible what's up as? Roma's interact utopia. The. Office Shouli. GAM- she is not via. So bitcoin. She posizione issues. have been down. Here I. Don't really me a we. She. Says it. WILL MISS USA Meet Domestic Nick, away? It. Networks zillow fabulous clouds go on. Not sure. About the media shame Edison. McLean come on like come up with them today they zillow shoots at. The museum at the Motel Tom Keita Potosi Mutare, but quotas. Before share. More than. Maybe. Shows on this. Car. Swiftly, surely, meals opposition sleep against we build any. That's Shinzo Book World. Didn't. Seem. Lost is a luxury car. She showed me. About. That saw Michelle Bodega. We'll be to my cheeks conceivable. Over Kuma Ethic. Ocean syllabus kiss of the coma, staff appeal homers it. Kim. Gumbo Bill. Gumbo Alabama scheme. Mentioning the must be. something. Similar. Shove actually year. Okay. Vanilla pump thirty As monopoly. focused. Tadao. Less.
Death behind bars
"I took the outset once and now i'm the host of a podcast so if you want to have better luck than i did magoo dot com m. a. g. o. Oh s. h. Dot com they wanna help you with your test prep and they're offering fifteen percent off today. Explain listeners right now. The promo code is today. The north senior reporter vox jeffrey epstein is dead. What do we know so. There's a lot that we don't know but there is a little that we know he. He was found dead on saturday morning in the jail in manhattan where he was being held awaiting trial he was facing up to forty eighty five years in federal prison if he was convicted on the sex trafficking charges and from reports that we're getting so far it appears that he had hanged named himself. Can you tell me a little bit more about this facility. He was being held the metropolitan correctional center in manhattan. Yes so it's in lower manhattan. It's actually kind kind of a notorious facility. It's also where infamous drug lord el chapo guzman was held on. He referred to being held there as torture so the conditions are are notoriously not great. It's had problems with staffing. It's had problems with overcrowding. It's had problems with violence with unsanitary conditions so as you know by all accounts not a pleasant place to be in that was in the same facility. I believe that reports came out several weeks ago. That epstein had tried to end his life. Is that right. That's correct correct so few weeks ago. Jail authorities found epstein injured in his cell and it was a little unclear from initial reports whether he had tried to harm himself zolfo. Maybe someone else had tried to harm him. Whatever the case the authorities did put him on suicide watch and so for a time he was being specifically monitored to make sure or he didn't try to harm himself and do we know if he was still on suicide. Watch this weekend. When he took his own life. He'd actually been taken off suicide watch. This was of course the big question that a lot. A lot of people had following his death. This is someone who had maybe tried to harm himself. Wasn't he on suicide watch. How could this happen but in fact a few days prior to his death. He'd been taken off suicide. Watch you know details about this or still kind of coming out but it appears that he actually had been taken off at the request of his attorneys some sources retelling the wall street journal turn all the day his lawyers had actually asked him to be taken off boat over. The casey wasn't on formal suicide watch when he died. Was there any kind of monitoring going on at the time <hes> he did this. Were there cameras. Were there guards coming by anything like that. He was supposed to be monitored so even though he wasn't formally on suicide watch jail policies would dictate dictate that for a prisoner who'd been on suicide watch. There were a couple of safeguards that we're supposed to be in place. He was supposed to have a cellmate. The theory there is that someone who may have have been suicidal should have companionship and it's also someone who can frankly just watch that person but his cellmate had left the cell at the time of his death apparently for some kind of appointment guards were also supposed to be checking on epstein believe every half hour but it appears they hadn't done so in the hours leading up to his death and the little bit unclear unclear. Why but you know they're staffing problems. Some of the guards were supposed to be checking on him. You know we're working overtime. One of them had worked overtime for for four or five days in a row so it's possible that some of these jail staffing issues may have contributed to the fact that he wasn't necessarily checked on the way he was supposed to be attorney. General william bar appears to be very upset about this we will get to at the bottom of what happened and there will be accountability but let me assure you that this case will continue on against anyone who was complicit with epstein any co conspirators should not rest easy. The victims deserve the justice and they will get it. Do we know if there's going to be an investigation into how such a high profile prisoner was left to his own devices aces. Oh yes there's multiple investigations that are going to happen the f._b._i. Is investigating the attorney. General has called on the department of justice to investigate several members of congress brisa called for a congressional investigation and it's really like bipartisan calls for this so everybody from representative of cossio cortez new york of course is a democrat to republicans guns in florida. Really everybody wants congress. Look into this and this happened. Soon after documents were unsealed on friday that connected a lot more people to epstein. That sort sort of revealed a lot more details what we're in those documents. These documents had been really <hes> keenly-anticipated for days. Everybody kind of knew that they were about to be released. It's too and they have to do with a defamation case filed in two thousand fifteen by a woman named virginia roberts jofre and she's claimed the jeffrey epstein kept her enslaved saved as a teenager and sexually abused her along with other girls. All you do is obey. That's it and eventually led to well now. We're going to experiment experiment and we're gonna try with another guy and see how you go so they sent me to an island with a professor and i basically had to do what i it did for jeffrey for him so it's very private. It's the perfect world for a billionaire getting away with what he was doing. There was so much anticipation around these documents. People were saying oh you know they're going to implicate president trump. They're going to implicate bill clinton. They're going to implicate every powerful man in the entire country country and they weren't quite as explosive as i think some people had expected they did include some allegations by the women in question that she was instructed acted by gillan maxwell who has epstein sort of associate to have sex with former new mexico governor bill richardson former u._s. Senator george mitchell will there were some allegations in the documents concerning prince andrew the duke of york. All of these prominent men have denied these allegations. It wasn't quite to the level of revelation that i think some people were expecting. It's more deepening the case around epstein deepening the case around this woman john maxwell and really showing you know the level will end specificity of allegations that women have brought really against both these people. I guess considering the proximity to win. These documents were released though it's no surprise that the internet was teeming with conspiracy theories since the news broke that he was dead and then you couple the fact that he had connections to the current president former president the bill clinton is more information going to come out about exactly how vast epsteins operation was what his connections were to these other men or does his death mean that people will never know you know his death will complicate matters certainly to some degree. The most basic thing that will happen is obviously. He can't stand trial l. anymore so some of the women who say that he abused them. They're not going to have the chance to face them in court and they're not going to see him sentenced but that doesn't mean that we can't can't as the american public still find out a lot about what happened a lot about people who might have been involved other than epstein a lot about people who might have looked the other way. There's is a criminal investigation in new york. That's still ongoing even though epstein instead the u._s. Attorney in manhattan jeffrey berman put out a statement on saturday really letting everyone know that his office is going to keep working on the case he said our investigation of the conduct charged in the indictment which includes a conspiracy count remains ongoing and it's significant that he kinda mentioned conspiracy counts so when epstein was arrested earlier this summer when he was charged he was charged with sex trafficking and then he was also charged urged with conspiracy to engage in straffing <hes> not conspiracy count implies there are other people involved and so i wouldn't be surprised to see charges and certainly only to see ongoing investigation in the coming months. Have you spoken to any of epstein's accusers. Do you know how they feel right now so i haven't spoken to his accusers personally but i actually just this morning <hes> spoke with lisa bloom who is an attorney representing two women who say they were abused by jeffrey epstein on the asked her. How are these women feeling right now now that he's dead and she said they had two very different reactions. One of them was really angry. She wanted to see epstein. Epstein brought to justice and it's not gonna happen now but the other one she said was actually relieved because even though obscene was in jail. This woman was still really worried. He could somehow hurt her and now she knows he can't hurt her anymore and he can't hurt anyone else so there was for that woman just sort of a sense of relief and find out about staff <music> <music> <music> while some jeffrey scenes accusers feel like they just lost their shot at justice. His death is unexpectedly shining a light on a totally different issue <music> conditions in america's jails. That's an minute onto explained <music>. <music> <music> studying for standardized tests doesn't have to be stressful expensive or boring. Just take a look magoo's for starters. They're called magoo magoo. Sh like m. a. g. o. s. h. mugu. How boring could it be. Magoo's offers a score improvement mint guarantee. If you don't improve you'll get your money back. While we're on the subject of money you get fifteen percent off right now with magoche. When you go to magoo dot dot com and enter the promo code today study materials over at magoche are always up to date and super relevant to the questions you'll see on the actual tests tests and students who've used magoo turns out. They love it. One student who used to improve his jeanette verbal score by six point said something like back mike wants skills were already good canadian to improve my verbal score to question sets an explanations are amazing. Negoti mm-hmm andrew cohn editor at the marshall project covering criminal justice. How common are suicides in america's jails. Suicides suicides in jail are the most common form of deaths in american jails. Believe it or not part of the problem here is that jails and prisons do such a lousy job of reporting reporting the information. The latest we have is that it is a huge problem especially in jails which are of course more transitory than prisons and typically typically jails. Don't have the sort of mental health infrastructures that you really need if you're going to prevent people who may be suicidal from actually acting on their impulses. Do we have any numbers from any recent year. I think the most recent numbers are from two thousand fourteen believe it or not there have been a number of media reports. It's an academic studies done but there are people who die basically every day in jails from suicides. It's an enormous problem at the state level to alabama obama recently in the past year so the enormity of the problem with suicides dare has come to light only because of a lawsuit. That's now in federal court the e._s._p._n. Alleged the department of corrections is still not meeting the basic mental health needs of vulnerable prisoners despite a federal court order to take accent just just in the past week or so there are new reports about the extent of the problem in georgia at the local jail level and at the state level the georgia. The department of corrections is investigating inmates death at valdosta state prison. This is the second inmate death about state prison in the past two months and it obviously obviously as we saw over the weekend is a problem is well in the federal bureau of prisons which has a terrible track record of dealing with suicidal prisoners. Do you have any numbers from two thousand fourteen eighteen inch after the number in jails anyway was somewhere between three fifty and four hundred which is a lot. Why don't we have up to date numbers. I think gets for the same reason that we don't really have adequate official numbers about police shootings. The incentives are just not there. I'm sure that every jail official all in a local jail knows precisely how many men and women have committed suicide in particular facility but it's embarrassing information right. It doesn't make anyone look good. A lot of the reporting of these sorts of events is voluntary and so you get numbers that are <hes> late in coming and is it happening in one place more more than another like. We have epstein case where it's happening in the heart of manhattan. Is it also happening in rural kansas in prisons there it is it's happening all over over the country. I remember the story in ohio where this really truly hated. Serial rapists was basically left to kill himself miserable years. They survived three young women summoning every ounce of strength in that house of horrors but ariel castro lasted just one month in one day in prison before apparently taking his own life and then they said oh geez we better it just doesn't look good and everyone was expecting this man to live to be tried and now he's dead and we're going to basically fudge the records. A report released today a also says to prison guards falsified logs documenting their observation of castro in the hours before he killed himself. The report says video indicates that guards failed failed to check on castro at least eight times before he died. That's the sort of attitude that should never happen. There was a case of a young man named billy slagelse will never ever forget who committed suicide hours before prosecutors in his case found evidence that might have exonerated aided him records on a computerized logbook may have been falsified on august fourth the night billy slagle killed himself on death row in the chillicothe correctional institution solution and it was almost like a shakespearean tragedy where had he held on for a few more days might have become aware of the good news essentially and might have <unk> at some point been released from prison so yes it is a nationwide problem and i'm not sure that there are many jurisdictions that have figured out a way to solve it. I remember when whitey bulger's showed up to his prison. I think in west virginia and he was there for like twelve hours before he was brutally beaten and so quickly executed essentially but then i read articles you know where people had spoken to those affected by his crimes in in boston and outside boston and they were happy and i i just wonder. Is there a sense that as a society as a country. We just don't really care what happens to the incarcerated once they're incarcerated law aw i think that there have been books written in the past decade or so about american exceptionalism in terms of punitive feelings punishment what happened to whitey bulger is also part of the same problem here. It was also a federal penitentiary. It was also a scenario where prison officials knew or should have known that there could be trouble. It was a penitentiary. I think in west virginia was notorious for problems and there has been sort of a scandal in the wake of it. I think the same thing's going to happen here. You have a lot of the same elements but i don't think that the bureau prison suddenly as a result of this this episode is going to turn around and spend a ton of money making sure that mental health treatment is better for inmates or that you know the prisons are are fully staffed and operational although that should happen. I think that there's gonna be an investigation and i think maybe a head or two is going to roll somebody's going to get fired ardo resigned and and then you're going to sort of move on with life what's standing in the way of actually fixing this well. It seems to me okay that if the political will to ensure the safety of prisoners whether they're high profile prisoners like jeffrey epstein or prisoners that no one is going hear about or ever heard of then you make sure that your jails are fully staffed that your prisons are fully staffed that the mental health professionals who are in charge of these prisoners evaluating their mental health are adequately paid and compensated that there are enough of them so that when there is a suicide that should i take place. Two guards who fail to monitor properly are held accountable. If those things were to happen then you wouldn't have the hundreds of inmates suicide besides that you have in prisons and local jails across the country but it has been that way even as people have become more familiar with the problem seems to me that there just isn't the political article will at this point to solve it part of that. I think is americans are particularly punitive when it comes to inmates part of it i think is an attitude among prison staff and jail staff of animosity towards inmates and part of it is just the nature of politics incarceration which even though it's maybe turning around a little bit in the last couple of years still is is as a regressive. It has been for quite some time. Do you think there ever will be that. Political will in america to take better care of its inmates to make sure they serve toll terms instead of being murdered or ending their own lives. I don't know i think one of the open questions here going forward is whether this death which really has shocked people into understanding more about how prisons zain's jails really operate whether it is enough to jolt congress into demanding that the bureau of prisons does a better job and whether it's enough to jolt local jails into using more of the funding they get to prevent these sorts of things from happening. It would seem like an incredible irony of the upshot of jeffrey epstein's case and death death and life is improving prison conditions across america. I agree and i am not sure it's gonna make a difference in the in the end you know one. One of the things that i find fascinating about the reaction to his death is the reaction by the attorney general. I'm shocked shocked to find the gambling is going on. You know right out of casablanca. Casablanca on monday declared that he was shocked shocked at this stuff was happening. I was called and indeed the whole department was and frankly hungry to learn of the m._c._c.'s failure to adequately secure this prisoner. We are now learning of serious irregular at this facility. They're deeply concerning and demand a thorough investigation. If he's paid any attention to congressional testimony over the past decade or two hundreds of news articles about the problem then he would have known that the bureau of prisons has a terrible morale problem and as a terrible problem of under-staffing. It has a terrible problem of people swallowed up in overtime this. This should not be news to the attorney. General janet is news to the attorney general then he's been negligent as well <music> <music> <music> andrew cohn is a senior editor at the marshall project and a fellow at the brennan center for justice. I'm sean robbins firm tom. This is today explained <music> <music> <music> <music> before we go just a reminder that magoo's would like to help you with your upcoming standardized tests. They've got online test. Prep that provides leads you with the tools. You need to get a great score. Study schedules up to date practice questions video lessons support from expert tutors. Check it out at magoo dot com m._a._g._a. o._s._h. Enter the promo code today for fifteen percent off discount.
Crazy Charlie | 2
"Young charlie by hollywood and crime contains depictions of violence and is not suitable for everyone. Please be advised kim. Roman polanski wandered through the house touching things that should have seen familiar but now appeared as apparition features of a waking dream that wouldn't end end sunday august seventeenth nine thousand nine hundred sixty nine was the first time he'd been to the house on ceelo drives since the murders eight days earlier for a long time. He looked down at the bed. He shared with his pregnant wife. The pills were still bunched at the center. Something sharon did when he was away hugging him and spirited here it is she drifted off to sleep in the living room. A large red stains showed where she died lying on her side with nothing to comfort her. The filmmaker filmmaker could imagine the blade driving into her body again and again until there was nothing left of her in the sun inside her but ravaged flesh why he muttered as he walked around the house slowly. Why why why following the director were a writer writer and photographer from life magazine there to document his return along with them was peter her cosa self-styled psychic hired by friends of j. c. Bring on the belief that his readings might aid the police in their search for the killers he would later inform the press that three men were responsible for the carnage orange. They were friends of sharon had ingested massive doses of l._s._d. Which had turned them into frenzied homicidal maniacs. The murders took place during a black magic ceremony known as guna guna though police knew better than to take her coasts gibberish seriously the press showed little restraint they described details derived entirely from rumor in fevered speculation that the house was the site of frequent orgies and drug parties hardy's that sharon dabbled in the dark arts that polanski was somehow involved in the killings is open. Now the police have released and you can see you can go and see the orange place you have blood all over the place maybe close and until outraged at the macabre fantasies foisted on the public by an out of controlled media the director called a press conference on august nineteenth to deny the lurid allegations some present fell polanski's grief-stricken words were undermined undermined by the exclusive he just given life magazine complete with photo spread of the death house from wonder. I'm tracy patent was stephen lang today. Hollywood and crime presents young charlie. If you're joining us for the first time we recommend you go back and listen to the previous episode. We'll be waiting for you. Today's episode crazy charlie. Here's my co host. Stephen lang in february nineteen fifty three a sixteen year olds drive down a road outside beaver utah when one of them points through the windshield at something of ahead by the time. They realize it's a roadblock. It's too late hanging quick u-turn. We'll have the cops on their tail in no time. The only thing to do is pull over and hope for the best and for a moment moment seems luck is on their side turns out. The cops are looking for an adult robbery suspect not three teenage reformatory runaways but wouldn't you know it. They run a check on the plates anyway charlie side and gives that little smile of his. He knows what they're going to fine time. Since breaking out of the school for boys were widely sent me an orange rust hot wiring cars has been their preferred mode of getting around burglarizing gas stations provided the cash for what they hoped would be a trip to california at least until now looks like beaver utah is about as far as they're going to begin sitting in that car on the cold february day waiting for the cops to find what they're going to find charlie closes his eyes and relaxes into his fate during his three years in plainfield. He's learned a lifetime's worth of surviving from in the beginning. He knew he wasn't going to make it on his size or strength but he had a feel for how to play people. Do what you can for those who can help nope you do what you want to those who can't and when his way with words wasn't enough to protect him from the bigger tougher kids he'd starts screaming ming and flapping his arms and bugging his eyes crazed wounded animal most of the time it worked and the aggressor would back off when it didn't well it was just in the way of things that the week submit to the straw and if it came to rape as an often didn't places like that well you let it happened and you got yourself up and that was the end of it something that's done to you. Isn't you shake it off and move on uh when the police bring the three boys in it's not long before they learn. They're not going back to plainfield charlie's just fine with that but when they're sent back to indiana it's face charges of violating the dire act taking stolen car across state lines is a federal crime and federal time it is hard time charlie sent to the national training school for boys in washington d._c. And he won't be getting out until he turns twenty one on sunday august seventeenth the los angeles was times published an in depth article on the tate killings under the headline anatomy of a mass murderer in hollywood though little was yet known beyond the facts of who had died in how or perhaps because the lack of information only fuel the public's interest americans consumed everything they could about the grisly crime nine garnering far less interest but equally inexplicable or the murders of leno and rosemary labianca who story appeared on the same page titled old l. a. couple victims of slayer given final writes the article noted similarities with the yellow dr murders only the night before and that police lisa working on the assumption that the los feeless crime was the work of copycat killer. What readers that sunday might have easily missed was a third much smaller article that appeared beside the tate's story it details a crime of vastly different proportions police raid rant arrest twenty-six suspect aspects and auto theft bring the piece described how the twenty six were living in an abandoned western movie set on an isolated chatsworth ranch sheriff's deputies believing the group was converting stolen volkswagen's into dune buggies made the arrests in a daybreak raid saturday. A cache of weapons was also seized the owner of the ranch eight year old. George spahn was described as a nearly blind invalid who lived in a house on the property deputies said spawn new there. There were people living on his land but claimed no knowledge of their activities. He said he was afraid of them. No names of the suspects were mentioned when all twenty six were released days later due to a mistake warrant the times did not see fit to report it within three months of his incarceration in washington. D._c.'s training school for boys charlie's caseworker worker considers him an institutional politician barely literate with little or no math skills and an i._q. Only slightly above average. He shows no real interest in learning except for music. Charlie will sit still and listen in music class other than that. What charlie's good at is knowing how to tune his ways to an audience he might have few academic skills but he knows who he can dominate by force and who he needs is to charm and it isn't just the other boys. He's figuring out how to play psychiatrists. He's finding out light to put things in their own boxes a have ideas about how people get where they are. There is open just a little wider their heads tilt forward just a little closer when he talks about his mother and how no one cared a damn about poor charlie. They wanna hear what they already. Believe is what charlie figures and he's more than happy to give tim in summer nineteen fifty one one psychiatrist's report finds him an extremely sensitive boy who has not given given up on securing some kind of love and affection from the world another concludes that what charlie really needs something to build up his self confidence. He considers sending him to natural bridge honor camp in virginia. This gets charlie's attention. Natural bridge is a minimum security cured facility for the most promising youths what's more it would make early parole much more likely if promising can get him into a less restricted environment. Well charlie can be as promising as he needs to be by fall. Charlie gets his wish. His psychiatrist recommends the transfer and on october twenty fourth charlie has moved to the virginia honor camp at natural bridge early releases all but assured charlie's parole hearing is in february nineteen fifty two and all s to do till then play by the honor camps rules but sometimes nature is just nature and there's no getting around it there are those who dominate and those who get dominated and there's not much more to life than and that when he sees the boy alone and unguarded charlie acts in the moment without thinking about anything but what the kids got and what charlie what's coming up behind the boy charlie puts a razor blade to his throat and yanks down his pants. It's over in a minute and maybe it's time the kid had learned what charlie already knows. Rape is just a thing among things and no more than you make of it in your head. The school authorities feel differently. Elaine charlie's parole hearing is cancelled and he's immediately sent to the federal reformatory in petersburg virginia by the end of august teams investigating the tate and law bianca murders were on in two separate tracks the progress report on tate running thirty three pages made no reference to la bianca the sixteen page law bianca report said nothing of tate. The team was older. More experienced inclined to see the case however bizarre. It's elements as still a crime. Among crimes and murders were about sex or money since five individuals were involved including the entirely unrelated steven parent. It was hard to see how sex might have played a role. Yes it was possible. See bring and tate had reunited as lovers pointing to polanski as the perpetrator with the others eliminated as witnesses but he'd been in europe at the time and if he'd hired someone he certainly could have chosen an opportunity where needless bloodshed could have been avoided moreover polanski's dansk lie detector test indicated he'd been truthful so the likely motive was money since rumors of narcotics use at the estate abounded detective stayed with their theory that a drug deal was involved. Fry cousy was a known drug user and see bring was believed to have been having financial difficulties. Perhaps separately or in concert they had ripped off a local supplier and this was payback to serve as a lesson to others despite a lack of supporting the evidence the money revenge theory maintained its hold over the tate investigators. The law bianca team was younger more open to novel theories. They also were acquainted needed with what the report referred to as the singing group the beatles the band's recent album included the songs helter skelter piggies words which had been written in the victim's blood at the crime scene and blackbird had repeated references to arise which might relate to the rise scrawled by the front door. The connection was seen as more whimsical than substantive. It was quickly forgotten as detective search for more promising leads. Charlie doesn't last a year at the federal reformatory in petersburg virginia by august nineteen fifty two less than eight months into his incarceration. He's committed eight serious offenses at seventeen he might stand no more than five feet four but he does what it take to get what he wants with an ability to manipulate and willingness to use violence he's considered a danger to the other boys in december officials officials decide to transfer him to the maximum security facility in chillicothe e ohio even there he's considered too dangerous to be placed in the general population elation in a report written within a month of his arrival charlie has described as criminally sophisticated and grossly unsuited for an an open reformatory institution such as chilly kathy. Here's considered beyond rehabilitating. That's when everything changes his his chances for parole before his twenty first birthday all but gone charlie suddenly turns himself around he stops committing serious offenses and cooperates with officers. He takes part in the academic programs raising his reading and arithmetic skills. He's put to work repairing and maintaining vehicles in the the institutions transportation unit. No one might have predicted when he entered the facility less than two years earlier but on january first nineteen fifty four he received the meritorious service award from chile coffee on may eighth of that year having spent seven of his nineteen years in six different institutions. This charles manson is granted parole at ten ten years old. Stephen weiss had learned proper police procedure from watching dragnet on t._v. So when on september first he found a handgun half hidden under under a bush on the hilly grounds behind his home he knew how to avoid destroying any latent fingerprints gently picking the gun up by the barrel and bringing it into the house he he showed it to his father. Bernard weiss immediately phone the l._a._p._d. Within minutes officer michael watson had responded to the call apparently not aww fan of drag that officer watson took no precautions when handling the weapon he found to live around seven empty shell casings in the cylinder in the gun looked as if it had been there for a long time rusted and caked with dirt the barrel was loose and bent as if from striking something hard the right the hand grip was missing within hours the twenty two caliber high standard longhorn revolver and cartridges would be taken to the valley services division of l._a._p._d. A._p._d. And van is they would be placed in manila envelopes and filed away in the property section under found evidence and there they would remain sitting beside his grandmother and a pew at the nazarene church charlie. Let's ministers words flow around him and threw him in rhythmic waves. What god wants and doesn't want. Let's see what he doesn't want. Free yourself of pride and self women's servile men and menu lord. Give up your possessions enlighten your so the fifth angel sounded and a stall from heaven had fallen to the earth and the key of the bottomless pit was given to him sometimes when he closes closes his eyes. The syllables empty of meaning become cadence without content words are musical notes in a symphony of light and dark and he understands though it might not be the understanding is grandmother hopes to awaken him. There's the way of the fist and there is the way of the word and charlie. Charlie must learn to use them. Both it was a condition of his parole. That charlie returned to mcmechan west virginia to live with his uncle bill and an jemma the closest thing to a stable family he had but bill was not one to forget matters like charlie stealing his gun and and was less than convinced by his nephews meritorious service award might not be a bad thing for the boy to stay with his mother recently moved to nearby wheeling kathleen still had lewis and his drinking to deal with and it wasn't as if charlie got along with his stepfather any better than his uncle. She was happy to see her. Our son relieved he seemed to have turned himself around but she just wasn't in a position to offer him more than an occasional overnight. Stay it was then. Nancy stepped in still hoping to write her grandsons path. He can come stay with her most nights providing he attend church with our every sunday now feeling him beside her in the pew not wanting to glance over for fear of it being prideful. She knows it was the right decision. Not not only might have turned his heart back toward god. He'll have the chance to socialize with people his own age but but in a world of sock hops and bake sales and kids knowing each other since they were born. It's not easy for charlie fit in the kind of big talk that impressed crested fellow inmates at reformatory only makes the teenagers of mcmechan fearful of him. They might listen in their eyes. Get big when he talks about what he's stolen stolen or who is roughed up for how sneaking beers and cigarettes is nothing compared to shooting drugs but amongst themselves they decide. They want no part of him. I'm pretty soon they just pass by on the street without so much as a word or glance. Not that life on the outside is all bad. He's got himself a job aboard. Wheeling downs the local racetrack cleaning stables shoveling horse shit might not impress the sock hop of mcmechan. Charlie always liked animals he can look in a horse's is nowhere stands with people. You have to learn what works and what doesn't how to lead them this way or that he can do without that is stable boss telling them what to do when to do it. He's had enough of taking orders to last a lifetime but when it's just him and the horses that's okay check his mind gets clear and human voices grow distant fuzzy then one day he meets a man they call cowboy because of the stetson e wears and a certain way he has about him. He's a small time gambler named clarence willis and he's taken a liking to young charlie enough of all liking to introduce him to his daughter rosalie. The broken hand grip of the pistol found and at the cielo drive murder site was shown to sergeant william lee of l._a._p._d.'s firearms and explosives unit. Lee didn't need to check his manuals. He immediately immediately recognized it as belonging to a high standard twenty two caliber longhorn revolver ed lomax product manager for the company that produced the gun and hurried over to the police academy to confirm lease assessment adding that it was rather a unique revolver. Only twenty seven hundred have been produced since ends its introduction two years earlier. Lomax further accommodated police investigators beay providing a photo of the gun and a list of the stores that distributed l._a._p._d. Felt they were finally working on a significant lead they would create a flyer with a picture and description of the longhorn and send it out to police departments in gun shops throughout california and beyond some even reached remote locales and canada follow up letters were sent to any gun shop that had received achieved an order for a replacement hand grip for the weapon within weeks. The majority of guns sold in california had been eliminated and this area investigation had reached a standstill but just over the hill from los angeles. The high standard twenty two caliber longhorn discovered by young stephen weiss remained in its manila nilo envelope in a storage area. The van is division of l._a._p._d. They had never received one of the flyers nineteen. The only thing charlie knows about sex what he's learned in the dark halls and cold stalls of the reformatories where he's been incarcerated. It's about the strong and the weak like so much of life you do to others or they do to you on the outside. He watches the polite dance people his age do timid glances over milkshakes at the soda fountain hands grazing being hands at the movies as if by accident he doesn't believe it for a minute. He knows they aren't any different from him. These hulking youths with their sloppy grins wins courtship is raped by other means the boys play the big shots and the girls make like they don't notice everybody's out for something and pretending attending. They're not at least in reformatory. Everybody knew where he stood in the pecking order of want and submission their games charlie plays and game he doesn't and he isn't about to compete with farmboys for the chance at a snatch kiss of course there are the horrors over in wheeling and that's a whole world of its own. He watches them sometimes sitting in whatever car he can manage to hot wire the pimps worked like ministers of give-and-take intake telling them what they need but don't know touching their fears and then backing off finding that inner wound and pressing just hard enough before leading up these men and their slick suits and slicker ways no a hell of a lot more about how people operate than the psychiatrists he played at chillicothe. Ian plainfield charlie learns his lessons on the streets of wheeling find that spot of her and use it because she's thinking am i just this ugly thing and do people notice it. No you're not darling not by a mile. He will say i see the pretty inside you and maybe he's not much to look at. Maybe even a runt of a man but he can look inside them and not just what they need. He'll tell them they're pretty when no one else will that they're special special even if they don't know it yet that he's the one who can find what's best in them. Get a girl to believe that and she'll do anything for you. No one knows what charlie tells rosalie willis but before long the good people of meccan are turning their heads as the two of them walk down the street street hand in hand this nice local girl and the boy who bragged about shooting up. It's cowboy clarence willis who introduces charlie to the youngest gustavus three daughters and soon enough. They've set the date. Clucking around town supposes they have to but if there's a baby it's news to the couple in on january. Seventeenth nineteen fifty-five charlie is back in the nasreen church. Nancy watches. She's with pride is your grandson takes his young brides hand to start life anew it's more than she might have hoped for but god knows how to surprise even the worst center clarence clarence willis gives consent to his fifteen year old daughter even though she claims to be seventeen on the marriage license he liked charlie the minute. He laid eyes on him. Nancy holds the reception at her house but her daughter isn't there. Kathleen has left lewis again and moved to california. No one knows if charlie misses his mother right now. He's enjoying his wedding cakes planning his future. As a married man. Everyone has cameras and reporters. Search chief of police of the city of los angeles trees on september third. The los angeles times reported that after interviewing more than three hundred persons detectives are still without a prime suspect in tate murder case l._a._p._d.'s chief of detectives robert houten further admitted that the longer the investigation continues the harder. It may be you to solve the crime days earlier l. A.'s new police chief at davis held a press conference answering no comment most reporters questions. There were however a few tidbits of new information. It was revealed that the weapons the cutting weapon and a firearm had not been found that the killer or killers. I did not appear to have been wounded and that narcotics were found in more than one part of the estate detective out and said that personally he doubted one man could committed the crime at his press conference chief. Davis told reporters that his men were doing as good a job as can humanly be done. Unfortunately the murderer or or murderers did not leave calling cards. The times article made no mention of the lobby onto killings in the first time he picks up a guitar. Charlie can field a new world opening up to him. The smooth would of the neck the curves of its body like a woman shape most of all the electric tingled passing a newest fingertips from the strings every time he strums a vibration gratien connecting him to some universal force that goes past thinking and straight to the animal so this power there he can sense sitting in the little room room he and rowsley of rented the power to change him and the power to change the world. Wherever looks now young people seem to know something. Their parents don't don't music wakes you up and freeze you. He listens to frankie laine on the radio. In the words feel more real than talking answer me creams frankie thank you and it's like he's asking the sky and stars charlie teaches himself some chords and when he opens his mouth to imitate frankie his voice surprises him like it's not really coming from him but tapping into the same forces frankie's a force that connects everything to everything he has things to say he feels for the first time in his life and there are people who will listen music is different from earthly the comings and goings of men like the words of the nazarene minister becoming more than just words he remembers feeling even when he was sitting at andt glenis piano yeah no little legs dangling off the bench tiny fingers pressing on those keys in him closing his eyes and these sounds wafting up toward the heaven that grandmother nancy see believed was reading and he had no opinion about facing murder charges in the death of music teacher. Gary hinman bobby beausoleil received his trial date on september fourth bobby had been in jail for about a month since the fiat station wagon he'd been driving had had broken down outside san luis obispo to highway patrolman had pulled up and when they checked the license plates they discovered the car was registered to the tha panga enga canyon murder victim. A quick examination of the fiat turned up a bloody knife hidden in the wheel. Well bobby was arrested and the l._a. County sheriff's department was notified. Detectives hall whiteley and charles guenther working on the hinman investigation drove up to interview the prisoner bobbie told them he'd recently purchased the car from a black guy when the detectives informed him that his fingerprints matched a bloody thumbprint found at the scene of the crime crime. He changed his story. Now he claimed that hinman had signed over the car to two girls he knew whiteley and gunther had beau soleil brought back to the l. a. county jail and booked for the murder of gary hinman. His trial date was set for november twelfth. As bobby sat in jail detectives whiteley leeann gunther were looking for his pregnant girlfriend kitty loot singer. A possible witness to the crime but kitty was nowhere to be found. Los angeles is something you feel long before you see it like tentacles of some biblical michael beast it's roads and freeways reach into the desert the mountains all the way to the seat however might have imagined it back in tiny mcmechan l._a. <unk> overpowering in its speed and complexity rosalie sits in the passenger seat looking out with wide eyes. Charlie doesn't say a word from miles. Lets the motion shen of the cars of fury of color and light wash over him by the time they arrive at kathleen's modest apartment. Charlie knows that los dangelo says the home. He never knew. He missed till he got here. It isn't that he didn't give it a try and mcmechan. He kept his job at wheeling downs taking <music> artwork where he could find it. There was even this tug he could feel pulling toward a conventional life. He felt something prideful in the way he was looked at. Maybe even respected in that way that you're respected just for not standing out but by spring nineteen fifty five rosalie was pregnant and with doctor the bills adding to the burden of his small family charlie began supplementing his income by stealing cars just across the river and ohio. You do what you do for family family. When some rolled around charlie was more than ready for a change from mcmechan he piled rosalie into a stolen fifty three mercury and they headed in west to visit kathleen they were going to california. Kathleen is glad to see charlie and his pregnant bribed happy to let the young couples stay with her with louis not around to get between her and her son. Things are all right. Charlie seems alive in los angeles driving the streets taking it all dan there is little about l._a. That doesn't surprise startled. He tools around in that mercury and let's the city fill him like a meal. He can't get up from he understands now what people mean when they talk about destiny something beyond the here and now it's not so much that charlie doesn't think about the future it's more than it never occurred to him that he had one now. He feels the pull up the future l._a. Is the destiny he never new. He had a month after the death of his wife. Roman polanski and several of his friends decided it was time to play a more active role in the investigation on september tenth. They took out large ads in los angeles area newspapers offering a twenty five thousand dollar reward for information leading to the arrest and conviction of the killer or killers hollywood stalwarts including peter sellars lurs warren beatty and you'll brenner contributed to the effort with sellers making the announcement rather than the desire to fact the ad only created further problems for police lisa investigating the crimes within days tips were pouring in from around the city overwhelming detectives and potentially obscuring legitimate information that might have come. I'm in theories abounded from a mafia hit too bizarre drug fueled sex practices gone awry hollywood players and peripheral seemed seemed eager to turn on each other providing accusatory information on whomever they refuting with that week beyond the muddying effect of this deluge. The implication of the polanski ad was not lost on l._a._p._d. Investigators they were not doing their job. Oh it's not until september that charlie is once again reminded that destiny is something thing that controls you. If you don't control it is driving through pasadena when he's pulled over by an l. A. policemen who notices the out of state plates a quick check reveals the cars stolen charlie throws himself on the mercy of the court blaming his poor mental state on years of incarceration he even admits to stealing another car back in ohio and unloading it in florida another violation of the dire act but he's got a wife now with the kid on the way maybe he hasn't been the best citizen but how would prison help back the judge orders a psychiatric evaluation and dr edwin mcneill mcneill concludes that with the incentive of a wife and fatherhood. It's possible he might be able to straighten himself out. The judge sentences charleena the five years probation. He's still got the dire act charges to deal with and he's ordered to be back in court in february nineteen fifty six although it's unlikely unlikely to do more than a few years to his probation charlie and rosalie flee to indianapolis on march tense rosalie gives birth to charles manson junior a week later charlie's arrested and brought back to los angeles his probation is revoked and for the first first time he's sentenced doesn't adult charlie is given three years at the terminal island penitentiary at san pedro in the port of los angeles <music> some six weeks after the murders. Los angeles was a changed place. The universe of the hollywood establishment turned upside down. Frank sinatra was in hiding rosemary's baby star. Mia farrow was convinced that she would be next. Steve mcqueen drove around town with a gun under the seat of his car. Tony bennett left his beverly hills hotel bungalow for an apartment in the <unk> hotels safer interior jerry lewis home was equipped with a security system replete with video monitoring esquire would report that in the great houses of bel air terrorists ends people flying to their telephones when a branch falls from a tree outside. Yes weep deep famine that september nineteen l._a. County coroner thomas noguchi called a press conference that did little to assuage resident's fears. He was now convinced that two possibly three killers had been responsible for the slaughter at cielo drive elements of the crime suggested the severe psychopathy of at least one of the killers it was possible drugs had played a role there was little in his report that was unexpected or comforting and and little hint that the l._a._p._d. Was any closer to solving the crime can't wait for the next episode of young charlie continue listening to the rest of the series right now and add free when you sign up for one three plus our membership service that makes it easier to hear more of your favorite wondering shows along with exclusive ad free episodes as a listener of the show show you can get your first month of one three plus free when you use promo code charlie just head to wondering dot com slash plus and enter the code charlie during checkout out next time on young charlie how to win friends and influence people back in the penitentiary in nineteen nineteen fifty seven charlie studies dale carnegie's popular self-help book and l ron hubbard's teachings about scientology charlie will use what he's learned from them him and his fellow inmates to become a more successful pimp. This is hollywood and crime from wondering subscribe to hollywood and crime on apple podcasts tune-in stitcher or your favorite podcast app to find out more information and reed are episode notes and contact us if you have any questions or comments if you like what you've heard we'd love to give us a five star rating and review us and be sure to tell your friends and fans of crime. We're counting on you to help us. Spread the word young charlie is written and directed by larry brand hollywood and crime name is created and produced by rebecca rannells john ponder and tracy patent and produced by jim carpenter young charlie was recorded at the invisible studios west hollywood hollywood california and blue room post in manhattan beach california executive producers benedict and non lopez four wondering.
Charles Manson Pt. 1: Killer Charisma
"Due to the graphic nature of this families crimes listener discretion is advised this episode includes discussions of murder sexual assault drug use and violence that some people may find offensive. We we advise extreme caution for children under the age of thirteen most days Tex Watson didn't have a care in the world he had Charlie to tell him what to do and Charlie knew everything everything so texts never had a worry about whether he was making the right choice or of a wrong one techs also had access to a steady stream of marijuana and l._S._d.. Charlie encouraged it which meant that at the drugs or good but techs had curiosities about heavier things too so and it was offered by Charlie he readily swallowed a chunk of Bella Donna route but the trip didn't relax him or open his mind mind instead he felt unhinged filled with panic paranoia and anger all of his senses seem distorted. He couldn't be sure of what he was seeing or feeling. It was the middle of the day darkness enveloped him. It was us if a malevolent evil was trying to warm its way into his body techs. Let the evil in there was nothing he could do to resist it. He began to lose consciousness. He could only hope that when he woke up it would feel normal again but it was a dim. Hope Tech suspected that he had changed himself. Irrevocably the evil was part of him. Now Hi I'm Lena Hobbs and this is crimes of passion apar- cast past original the legal definition of a crime of passion is a violent crime that occurs in the throes of extreme emotion leaving no time to reflect on the consequences but in this show we explore passionate crimes how does a marriage progress from husband and wife to killer and victim or killer and Co Conspirator. If there's a thin line between love and hate what manipulates our relationships and a deadly results in this episode will explore how Charles Created the group known as the Manson family how they began as a strange but seemingly benign group of outcasts and how they transformed into a ruthless band of criminals next week we'll discuss the infamous murders the group carried out the police investigations and the trials that follow their crime spree. This episode is art of Park has summer of sixty nine event July twenty the second through August ninth. All your favorite park cash shows are teaming up to commemorate the fiftieth anniversary of a landmark summer in American history. The summer of Nineteen sixty-nine from the Manson murders to the moon landing ending where diving deep into the summer America hit a boiling point with twenty three special episodes across sixteen different are cast originals. We'll be digging into the fallout of M._l._K.'s assassination a wide eight reaching l._S._d.. Colt and rumors of a Kennedy family cover up you can find these specials and more all in our new parkas presents feed on spotify or anywhere you listen to podcasts at podcast. We are grateful eightfold for you our listeners you allow us to do what we love. Let us know how we're doing. Reach out on facebook and Instagram at podcast and twitter at Park has network several of you have asked how to help us if you enjoy today's episode US owed the best way to help us to leave a five star review where ever you're listening it really does help few names in history carry the as much notoriety as Charles Manson's when he died in two thousand seventeen after spending nearly fifty years in prison news of his passing made international headlines from what we know about Manson. That's that's exactly what he would've wanted. From the time he was a young man. Charles Manson creeped fame and attention initially he believed his celebrity would come from being the world's biggest rockstar Baker than his idols. The the Beatles instead he was notorious for orchestrating some of the most heinous murders in American history but it wasn't just his crimes that drew infamy it was his ability to attract a loyal cult of followers. I who were so devoted they were willing to kill for him. Charles Mills Manson born in November of nineteen thirty four was without a family for most of his life in many ways. The creation of his cult following was determined many years before he found his way to Haight Ashbury his mother fifteen year old Kathleen Maddix was never married to Charles is biological father any me subsequent relationships didn't last for long Charles was shuttled between his grandmother and his aunt as Kathleen tried to find her footing. When Charles was only five Kathleen was sent to prison for stealing a car and and he was into live with family and McMechan West Virginia his aunt and Uncle Glenna and Bill Thomas Remember Charles is three year? Stay as difficult time for their family. Charles was impervious to punishment his uncle. Go Bill said that he acted however he wanted and no threat of a whipping could make him behave before a continue with Charles's psychology. Please note that I am not a licensed psychologist or psychiatrist but they have done a lot of research for this show. The Thomas's memories of Charles reveal a pattern of antisocial behavior often used to diagnose conduct disorders in children. The diagnostic and statistical manual of of mental disorders notes that problem behaviors may start as young as the age of three these children often show defiance towards adults lay mothers for things that have gone wrong and provoke others Charles displayed did all of these tendencies during his time in McMechan. Perhaps most frightening was Charles's obsession with knives. His cousin Joanne recalled a terrifying instance when she was left in charge of seven year old Charles Girls he was pestering Joanne as she cleaned the house so she sent him outside moments later she looked up to see Charles standing on the other side of the screen door wielding a sickle he'd found in the yard slashing being at the screen. His expression was so deranged Joanne thought he might have killed her if our parents had an returned just then to stop him when Charles is mother Kathleen was paroled in nineteen forty to the Thomas's were glad to return seven-year-old Charles tour but his defiant behavior continued Charles skip school shoplifted and light about it he was never ashamed and never repented for his bad behavior the D._S._M.. Five noted that between the ages of Seven and eleven antisocial behaviors intensify in children with conduct disorders at this age the children are more prone to lying stealing langer and rule-breaking as they gain more independence from their caretakers. Kathleen hoped a firmer hand might straighten Charles out so in nineteen forty seven when Charles was twelve Kathleen sent him to the ball school. Oh for boys a boarding school for male delinquent and Terre Haute Indiana he ran away from Jabal the next year in nineteen forty eight within weeks he was caught burglarizing stores in Indianapolis the Annapolis and was sent to a juvenile facility in Omaha Nebraska. It started a pattern of incarceration escape and reincarceration throughout nineteen forty seven and nineteen fifty four Charles was placed Austin and escaped from a reform school in Indiana the National Training School for boys in Washington D._C.. And finally a maximum security prison and chillicothe the Ohio he was always recaptured as a result of escalating criminal behavior such a stealing cars and armed robbery Charles fits the textbook pattern of antisocial behaviors typical of childhood conduct disorders the D._S._M. Five states that adolescents are likely to intensify their rule breaking through truancy running away assault robbery vandalism and stealing cars medical professionals note that a high proportion of children and young people with conduct disorders grow up to be antisocial adults Charles was by no means reformed but he managed to get his worst impulses under control at chillicothe -I he was released in the spring of Nineteen fifty four at the age of nineteen. Surprisingly he returned to McMechan West Virginia to live with his aunt uncle and grandmother his mother Kathleen had remarried and Charles didn't like her new husband and his grandmother's request Charles regularly attended church he wasn't a believer but he enjoyed several Bible passages especially in the book of revelation and he committed many to memory but his time outside of institutions was short-lived in nineteen fifty five Charles Stole a car and drove to Los Angeles to see Kathleen he was promptly arrested by police officer who suspicions were raised by the out out of state license plate in April of Nineteen fifty six Charles was sentenced to serve three years at San Pedro's Terminal Island Penitentiary in Los Angeles Harbor in Prison Charles encountered all types of lawbreakers but he seemed most enamored with the pimps he was enthralled by their stories of seducing young vulnerable women and turning them into obedience sex workers they explain how to pick out women with low self esteem separate them from friends and family and finally alternate between showing the women affection and violence this combination of love and fear where powerful tools to exercise control over their victims Charles like the idea of exert control over people. This may be why he enrolled in a prison course based on Dale Carnegie's bestselling book had a win friends and influence people Charles had never shown shown any aptitude for education before but he excelled in a class that affirmed his instincts for manipulation the most important lesson he gleaned from the course was held a make someone do what you wanted. The trick was to make them think it was their own idea. The research of cognitive psychologists Elizabeth Loftus suggested that it is relatively easy to implant an idea and another person's mind simply asking leading questions can shape another person's response and even create false memories of events Charles was thrilled to learn how susceptible the human mind was to outside influence and how easily he could exploit that twenty-three-year-old Charles was released in September nineteen fifty eight with few job prospects he decided to become a pimp he seduced nineteen year old Leona Ray Musser with the aim of convincing her to intersects work. Art Leona eager to please win along with it until his probation officer caught on Charles was soon back in federal court facing charges but he had Leona by his side. We only had never met anyone like Charlie. When he spoke to her he acted as if she were the only thing that mattered and told her that she was the prettiest girl he'd ever seen? He trusted her and he needed her to look out up for him just like he did for her. How could she not love someone who meet her feel so special and desirable she would do anything for Charlie? Now was her chance to prove it. She thought about what she was going to say to the judge if she could strike the right tone and get the judge on her side she would keep Charlie out of prison and they could stay together and be happy. The courtroom was quiet and everyone was watching her the lawyers the parole officers and Charlie Leona lead Outta quavering cy and began to talk about how she and Charlie were in love and how they were going to get married and then she told the judge that she was pregnant with Charlie's baby. It was a lie but she didn't feel guilty. She was only helping Charlie as she wrapped up her speech Leona. Let here's wall from her is she began to Saab. Charlie said that if she made herself look helpless the judge would take Pity Charlie was right Leonis plaintiffs speech before the court work and the Judge Place Charles on probation rather than sending him back to prison but Charles continued forging checks and pimping out Leona in June of Nineteen Sixty Twenty six-year-old Charles was sentenced to another another ten years in prison during this stint he discovered scientology. He may have been drawn to the way the scientology leaders convince converts to surrender individuality and completely given to the ideology with the explosive arrival of the Beatles in nineteen sixty four Charles also became obsessed with music. He was fascinated by beetle mania more than anything King Charles wanted a legion of admirers to love him as much as the Beatles he had always love listening to the radio as a child. It had an ear for plunking out songs on his aunts piano. He convinced his mother to has sent him. A guitar took music lessons from fellow inmates and performed in prison variety shows other inmates gave lackluster praise calling him a decent singer capable of playing a few cords but Charles was convinced minced he was a genius prison staff encouraged his devotion to music as distracted him from causing trouble on March twenty first nineteen sixty seven thirty two year old Charles Manson was released early from prison but he felt aimless without the constant supervision he'd grown accustomed to after twenty years in and out of various institutions while he mold over his future. He asked his parole officer here for permission to leave Los Angeles he wandered north to Berkeley California in the nineteen sixties. College campuses were exploding in protests against the war racial inequality and social injustice U._C.. Berkeley was at the center of radical protests after nineteen sixty four when students staged free speech demonstration that resulted in nearly eight hundred arrests and attracted the scorn of California Governor Ronald Reagan again at the same time the Haight Ashbury neighborhood and San Francisco was the epicenter of the counterculture movement a place where hippies experimented with drugs free love and communal life both the revolutionaries of Berkeley and the Flower Children of San Francisco received national attention young people everywhere were drawn to the unconventional lifestyle they'd seen on the news or read about in magazines by nineteen sixty seven the bay area was packed with Gurus fractures and revolutionaries and there was no shortage of impressionable young people ready to fall under the influence of an inspiring leader and so when Charles Manson arrived having trained under pimps and scientologists alike is future followers where ripe for the picking. We'll see how Charles collected his first family Lee members after this now back to the story when thirty two year old Charles Manson arrived in San Francisco in nineteen sixty seven the summer of love was in full swing. Everyone who migrated to the city had come with one purpose to learn how to think in a new way Charles was happy to educate them twenty-three-year-old Mary. Brunner was like thousands of other young people who flocked to California for a chance at an exciting new life she worked in the U._C.. Berkeley Library and met Charles while he was hanging out around campus playing guitar. Mary had only recently moved to Berkeley from Wisconsin and she hadn't it yet made any friends upon their first meeting Charles teased her trying to get a rise out of her. Her temper flared until she realized he was purposely trying to goat her then she laughed and Dan dropped her guard Charles coaxed his way into her home and essentially became her freeloading houseguests. Their relationship wasn't immediately sexual but Charles would sometimes bring other women back to her apartment went to sleep with them. Eventually she became jealous of the other women in order to compete for Charles's affections. Mary began to sleep with him to Charles was happy to take Mary to bed though he didn't stop collecting. Electing other women like eighteen year old Lynette Foamy Lynette had a troubled history of drug abuse and self harm. She ran away from home after an argument with her father. Charles was naturally drawn to vulnerable people all he could manipulate women who were desperate to be loved when Charles Sullen net crying on the boardwalk. He stopped and told her she looked like she needed a friend. He easily persuaded her to come back with him to Berkeley Charles now had his second follower. He didn't stop there. Charles picked up another woman Pat Krenwinkel after enticing her away from the home she shared with her drug addicted sister. Then he added twenty year old Susan Atkins whose life had taken a rough turns and she lost her mother to cancer five years prior. The women were thrilled to be part of Charles's grew hat wrote a letter to where father stating that for for the very first time in my like I've found contentment and inner peace Mary Lynette Hat and Susan all projected vulnerabilities that made them susceptible to Charles's influence. Nearly all of them had troubled relationships with their families and Charles validated the anger they felt about their unhappy home lives telling them they were correct to rebel against their parents. Nearly all of them had self esteem issues and Charles told them that they were pretty and desirable. These were women searching for comfort and Charles gave it but their attraction to Charles wasn't just about their own weaknesses as it was also about his magnetism he knew how to turn on the charm and his followers love the way he showered them with compliments. Charles was also older than most of these women by a decade. He used his age as the advantage or training himself as an experienced sage. It was extra flattering to these women that someone they perceived to be so wise was willing to pay attention to them. Charles Philosophies were not particularly really original but he was so charismatic when spouting out a jumble of ideas drawn from the Bible Scientology and Beatles lyrics that people couldn't help listen he spoke with the confidence and authority ready that discouraged anyone from questioning him Charles also had the self-awareness tied some of his negative attributes for example he was vehemently racist but he did not reveal the extent of his racism to the women in his group as far as they could tell Charles's way of life was all about feeling good letting go of inhibitions and pershing bad feelings. Charles told the women in his thrall that no matter what may have happened happened to them before they were special beautiful and blameless innocence. They loved hearing this and they loved him still win. Charles lost his temper are he became violent when he wasn't pleased with the women he might punch them or pool their hair but like many abusers he always knew how to sweet talk them into forgiveness a classic perpetuation of the cycle love abuse this was only heightened by their isolation from other relationships and their dependence on him in the study from Translational Psychiatry Journal Antisocial personality disorder is found in forty two seventy ninety percent of prison populations in Cortex studies review psychologists. John Burke notes that many Colt leaders at the diagnostic criteria for antisocial personality disorder two of the most recognizable traits up the disorder are the desire to control others in a tendency towards a crash in a cult leader revealed these treats by demanding loyalty from followers and by doling out physical punishments to transgressors in the same article Burke described evidence of dependent personality disorder among followers. These individuals are more likely to exhibit depression anxiety and feelings of powerlessness that make them all the more likely to fall under the spell of an authority figure. These dynamics were certainly found within Charles Manson's burgeoning colts in late nineteen sixty seven bolstered by his flock of admirers Charles decided it was time to pursue his is larger ambition of becoming Rockstar. Mary Brunner gave up her apartment in the bay area and the group decided to move to Los Angeles Charles packed his followers into a V._W.. Minibus and set out to become famous in Los Angeles. The group stayed in a home known as the spiral staircase the owner of the house enjoyed being surrounded by interesting transients and he allowed many artists and eccentrics aboard they're here. The group continued to expand they met fourteen year old Diane Lake lived in a nearby commune with her parents. Diane leader wrote that becoming part of the Manson's was like a raindrop joining joining a puddle. I blended in easily my loneliness disappearing Charles used his existing followers to draw in more people were more willing to listen to his ideas. When they saw the he was already surrounded by an enraptured crowd the group swelled to around twenty members mostly women and a few men they increase their numbers and other ways to Mary? Brunner got pregnant and in April of nineteen sixty the eight gave birth to a son Valentine Michael Manson Susan Atkins also became pregnant she would give birth and the fall of that year during the same period the country. Country Roiled with discord be at Phnom War protests dominated the news president Lyndon Johnson announced that he would not seek reelection be assassination of Dr Martin Luther King Junior triggered riots and over one hundred cities but no matter what was happening around him Charles Manson remain myopically fixated on his own destiny his plans got an injection of energy when two of his followers met Beach Boys Drummer Summer Dennis Wilson in Hollywood Wilson invited the young women to his house for milk and cookies and they spent an innocuous afternoon together after their snap Wilson excused himself to go to a recording session and the women left but Charles was thrilled when he heard about the encounter he demanded the women's show him the way back to Wilson's house. When Wilson returned he found Charles and his flock partying in his house Wilson was not WanNa turn down a good time so he let them stay over the next few days Wilson let Charles philosophize to him and found some of his ideas profound mike the Women Charles collected Dennis Wilson struggled with feelings of emptiness and loneliness he had previously sought meaning and transcendental meditation but he was open to anyone who might have some answers and Charles Charles was an expert at convincing people he had wisdom to share for Charles is followers Wilson welcoming them into his home was just another example of their leaders? Magic Charles told them that he could make good things happen just by envisioning them he wanted a music career and a famous musician came into his life in reality he was just manipulating easy targets like Wilson into giving him the things he wanted but to Charles is disciples. It really seemed like he was conjuring. Good fortune out of nothing they saw an almost god-like power and it only made them clean Charles Moore that's summer Wilson introduced Charles goes to some of his industry contacts talent Scout Greg Jacobson and producer Terry Melcher Charles trying to get in there good graces by encouraging them to sleep with their pick of his followers. None of the women men objected as if they had much of choice one of Charles's rules probably borrowed from the pimps was at each woman had to let go of all her inhibitions and have sex with whomever Charles told her a two if she couldn't do that he wasn't interested in keeping her around. If any of the women ever wavered Charles used other pimp tactics he'd guilt them into obeying questioning whether they really he loved him while also instilling fear with the threat of a slap or beating Charles's manipulation tactics worked on both ends Wilson and his frequent visitors Greg Jacobson and Terry Melcher. We're enticed by the offer of unlimited rule free sex and for the next few weeks the family became Wilson semi-permanent Guests Jacobson even flirted with the idea of making documentary film about the group Pope while riding up a film proposal he referred to the group as the Family Charles like the label and the group adopted it Charles now had the attention of a wealthy benefactor and several music music and film industry contacts but as a summer of nineteen sixty eight stretched on Charles still didn't have what he wanted a recording contract Melcher seemed to have the most clout in this area so Charles kept trying to get closer to him he knew Melcher lived in a secluded house on Ceelo drive and he often tried to score an invitation. The melcher always resisted keeping him at arm's length Melcher found Charles Charles off putting he wasn't the kind of person who searched for spiritual advice or metaphysical answers but the Gregarious Dennis Wilson introduced Charles to plenty of other less self-assured people who found Charles Dell's captivating Wilson liked to invite all kinds of people to come hang out at his house even strangers he barely knew twenty one year old Charles Watson was one of these guests Watson was thrilled to be welcomed into the home of a famous musician like Dennis Wilson but he was even more impressed by Charles Manson and his Legion of Obedient Women. The family accepted the young man into their cohort and gave him the nickname techs wchs by the end of the Summer Wilson was tired of financially supporting the family. When the lease on his house ended he moved out and the family had to find new lodgings but family members sandy good had another suggestion for where they could stay? She had a friend who lived on a ranch and seamy valley. The property had once been used as a set and T._v.. Westerns but it was falling into disrepair. Charles convinced the ranch owner Charles Spawn to let his group moved there in exchange for helping the old man with cleaning taking care of horses and whatever upkeep the property required and at the sprawling ranch the family continued to grow the Fall Charles came up with new strict rules to keep them in line for example he forbade the women from carrying money he didn't allow them to read books and he banned watches walks and calendars but his followers were willing to put up with the rigid policies because the family gave them unconditional love and acceptance that they could never find in the harsh outside world and if they didn't follow Charles's rules they'd be kicked out of the family ripped away from that supports stem daily use of drugs like L._S._d.. Also helped keep them docile. David Smith was a physician and addiction expert who founded the Haight Ashbury Free Clinic in northern California in the nineteen sixties Smith met Charles Manson and his followers in nineteen sixty seven while they were in the bay area two years later Smith studied the family at Spahn ranch and even wrote a paper paper on the group in the Journal of Psychedelic drugs prior to the families murder spree in recent years reflecting on the Manson family. Smith has written that we now know that drug infused mind control is a very real phenomenon phenomenon amongst acceptable youths Charles needed to us every tool he had to keep the group's focus and loyalty by the end of nineteen sixty eight he began to see ominous signs all around him his his followers noticed the change in him it had always been a regular ritual for Charles to preach to them through lectures or songs but that winter is daily sermons became less about love and more about the violent downfall of civilization now many of his lectures involved coming race war and which black people would rise up and kill the white population according to Charles it was black people's turn to be in power after years of oppression with these visions of violence Charles instill fear and his followers encouraging them to withdraw further from society and closer to him. The family had already found isolation at spawn ranch thirty five miles from downtown Los Angeles but Charles wanted to retreat even further away from civilization. One of the family members mentioned a place her grandparents owned owned and Death Valley called the Barker Ranch Charles thought this sounded like the perfect place to hide out during the coming Apocalypse Diane Lee was afraid she had joined the family at the age a fourteen because she wanted to be treated as an adult but to her that meant becoming Charlie's lover not as warrior still according to Charlie let shed was inevitable and they had to prepare for it. Diane didn't know what to make his latest rantings about race wars and uprisings. They were terrifying to be sure but Diane was certain that Charlie could protect them from whatever lay ahead head what frightened her Moore was at Charlie was acting differently. Just a few months earlier he'd been affectionate and playful. He showed love to all the women but Diana had believed he loved her best now. She no longer felt like a favorite Charlie had withdrawn when she tried to bring out that warm side of Charlie he looked at her with contempt that more and more often erupted into violence points and beatings only one thing seemed to improve Charlie's mood the thought of fleeing to the Desert Diane hope the change of scenery would fix things after all if it was what Charlie wanted wanted it must be the right move. The whole family tracked out to Death Valley in October of nineteen sixty eight to scope out the property Charles got permission from the ranch owner to stay there but he soon realized that the group wasn't prepared for settlement they needed to stock. I'll food drugs knives and guns in order to make the ranch a suitable fortress Charles left a few members at the Barker ranch to keep watch while the rest of the family returned to spawn ranch and seamew valley over the next few months they started collecting whatever weapons they could get their hands on they stole Dune buggies and motorcycles from car lots and made alterations nations on the vehicles adding extra armor and welding on Scabbard to hold firearms throughout all these preparations music still dominated Charles thoughts. If he had any misgivings about his chaotic visions of the future future they were put to rest November of nineteen sixty eight. When the Beatles released their latest album featuring their song helter skelter Charles seemed to think the music was speaking directly to him all all of it confirmed his dark predictions of annihilation coming up we'll talk about Charles's interpretation of the white album and his increasingly erratic man's to his followers? I now back to the story after his release from prison. In the fall of nineteen sixty seven thirty two year old Charles Manson used his charismatic personality and is masterful ability to manipulate people to amass a loyal cold following dubbed the family but by the fall of nineteen sixty eight Charles seemed to be steadily losing whatever grip he had on reality as the group squatted at the Spun Ranch and Seamy Valley early Charles lectured his disciples about the apocalypse and the family made preparations for the coming race wars Charleston that the black population would rise up to kill or enslave the White Race Charles told his followers that he planned to take them into a desert where they would crawl into a whole and hide from the violence during that time he said black people would hold all the power but Charles a white supremacist. I didn't think black people would be capable of ruling the world so he predicted once they realized they did not have the skills to lead the family could emerge from hiding and be recognized as the rightful rulers of the planet. In it share delusions are rare but when shared delusional disorder does occur it usually happens among people who live close together often in isolation and with an intimate emotional connection Dr Ernest Charlotte Zeh was the first to identify the phenomenon he labeled fully ado which translates to the madness shared by two and fully famille or the madness shared by the family Dr La's egg said that the inducer creates delusions and imposes them on a passive individual who was not necessarily psychotic themselves but who is overly trusting and naive the the family accepted Charles's prophecy not only because they deferred to his word on everything but Charles also seemed to have proof he pointed to the Beatles release of the white album in November of nineteen sixty eight mm-hmm Charles said the lyrics song titles confirmed everything he predicted about the future blackbird was about black people rising against oppression hickeys referred to the corrupt people in power who deserve the extermination coming to them. Helter skelter was the term for the chaotic events that would ignite the race or and signal the end of the world beyond searching for greater truths and prophecies and the white album Charles thought that the songs gave him more immediate practical advice in the song I will Charles took the lyrics your song will fill the air seeing it loud so I can hear you to mean saying that he should not give up on his goal of becoming a musician Charles had kept up his relationship with music producer Terry Melcher as best he could melchior wasn't interested in indulging Charles's musical ambitions nations but he enjoyed visiting the women at Spun Ranch and he recognized that even if Charles talents as a musician were middling there was something compelling about him that might warrant closer look so in March of nineteen sixty nine Melchior agreed to come out to on ranch to hear Charles. Play Charles was fanatical in the days leading up to the visit he and the women he chose as backup singers rehearsed endlessly he had them perform strip show to accompany the music Charles usually taught his disciples not to care about close or personal appearances but before Melchior's arrival instructed his his followers to buy material and hand so him a fringed buckskin suit the family cleaned the ranch the best they could normally the family scrounged up meals from the dumpsters of grocery stores taking home any misshapen deepened produce or food past cell by date they could find in the trash but for Melcher Charles had the women whip up fresh baked goods and treats the group eagerly anticipated Melchior's arrival but on the agreed agreed upon date Melcher didn't show Charles was furious in addition to his antisocial behavior he often demonstrated traits of typical narcissism including including a fear of losing face. My sense counselor Suzanne degs white stated that narcissist is not able to tolerate any kind of public humiliation. Their egos can't handle the prospect a failure for the next few weeks Charles pulled away from the rest of the group and went on walks alone in the wilderness he had taught his followers to believe he was infallible. He hated for them to see him stumble. If they started to doubt his ability to become a great musician the might begin to doubt everything and then they might leave him. Charles couldn't bear the thought in addition shinned Meltzer's blow a month later. Police raided the spun ranch. They'd been tipped off that the group was in possession of stolen vehicles. Some of the family members were arrested. The charges were dropped within days because has police could improve who had committed the thefts. Even so Charles was rattled by the thought of the law interfering with his family a few days after the raid family member Tex Watson had a powerful negative reaction to some Hallucinogenic Bella Donna route during this episode he wandered around Van Nuys sometimes crawling on his hands and knees and emitting high pitched beeps until Oh police arrested him for public intoxication when he returned to spawn ranch after his release be other members of the family noted that he seemed different the twenty one year old had been a friendly mellow addition to the group after his bad trip he became snap ish and edgy some studies indicate that hallucinogens can cause long-term or even permanent personality changes however most people reported positive changes as such as decreased anxiety but techs felt like the drugs made him paranoid and destructive after the succession of dark events. The family was granted a new ray of hope Terry Melcher made another another promise to come and see Charles Perform on me team. Nineteen sixty-nine Melcher came to Spawn Ranch Charles let on the best show he could military true listened politely after it was over he gave Charles the name of a friend who recorded tribal music. He thought the friend Might Find Charles is music more interesting than he handed Charles Fifty dollars and left the audition was over in wasn't exactly a brush off but it wasn't a recording contract either still Charles would not give his followers any reason to doubt his success to save save face. He told them that the fifty dollars was a signing bonus rather than the act of charity it likely was but the rejection clearly stung and Charles's moods turn darker he began to contemplate played how we might take revenge on Melchior. It was also around this time that Charles sent his followers on excursions. He called creepy crawling dressed in black. The family snuck into random house's late at night while the occupants slept there they would misplace items and rearrange the furniture. It was a power trip thinking about how the homeowners would wake up and realize the intrusion had taken place <music> without them. Knowing Charles did not direct the group to commit acts of violence during these creepy crawling missions but he did ask them to carry knives at all times. These missions were all part of the group's training he wanted them to overcome their fears of getting caught and to learn to move around silently and without detection this would be important. He told them once helter skelter began they also started preparing to returned to Barker ranch and Death Valley but Charles was still worried about a food in weapon shortage. They needed to raise some fast cash. Tex Watson had a plan to do so he would pretend to be a drug dealer and arrange range to sell twenty five kilos of marijuana to a perspective buyer text didn't actually have the drugs but he had a buyer willing to give him the money upfront tax figured he could get the money and then disappear before the buyer fire realized he'd been cheated but the buyer who went by the nickname lots of papa easily trace text back to the spawn ranch and the family when lots of Papa called demanding demanding his drugs Charles told him that he didn't know where techs was lots of Papa replied that he was a member of the Black Panthers and if he didn't get his drugs or his money back he and his comrades would come come to the spawn ranch and murder the family motto. Papa wasn't actually a Black Panther but Charles believed the threat. He asked one of the male members of the Family Thomas T._J.. Wallman to accompany him do lots of Papas apartment. Charles grabbed a twenty two caliber revolver to take with them and gave T._J.. Specific instructions Charles would stuff the gun in the back of his pants and T._J.. Would enter the apartment behind him. When Charles gave the signal he expected T._J.? To grab the gun and shoot lots of Papa once they were in the apartment teaching locked eyes with Charlie. He knew that he he was supposed to grab the gun but he couldn't help hesitating. He thought lots of Papa would be alone instead. He had two guys with him T._J.. Like things to be simple and hear things were becoming complicated but Charlie wasn't phased by the extra men. He ignored them and nodded at T._J.. The signal for him to shoot T._J.'s hand twitched. He knew that when Charlie he gave an order he had to obey that was the deal he'd signed up for. When he joined the family he had surrendered his individual to the greater whole he truly believed that he was no longer his own person and that his body was under Charlie's control when Charlie wilt him to shoot T._J.? Expected is body to comply but to T._J.'s horror he didn't shoot. He froze when T._J.. Failed to shoot lots of Papa Charlie grabbed the gun himself and shot the drug dealer in the chest. Lots of Papa elapsed as T._J.. And Charles fled they returned to spawn ranch where Charles brought to every one that he just taken down a Black Panther. He explained that he had done it for their sakes to protect them. Meanwhile teaching was so terrified by his failure to obey Charles that he fled the ranch fearing for his life. It was a signal to all of them Charlie had shown them what it meant to be a member of the family if they wanted to remain part of the grew they had ought to be ready to kill in the coming weeks many of them what prove how ready they were to comply thanks again for tuning into our crimes of passion summer of sixty nine special we will be back Wednesday with part two of the Manson family story we'll discuss the the infamous murders that took place on August eighth and ninth nineteen sixty nine as well as the police investigations and trials that followed. If you enjoy this episode checkout Parkas continued retrospective into the summer of sixty-nine from July twenty second through August ninth the summer of sixty nine will feature twenty-three special episodes across sixteen different podcasts covering everything from Vietnam War protests to the Zodiac killer be we should check it out on our new are cast presents feed on spotify or anywhere you listen to podcasts several of you have asked how to help us if you enjoy the show. The best way to help is to leave a five star review and don't forget to follow us on on facebook and Instagram at podcast and twitter at podcast network. We'll see you next time when true love meat true crime crimes of passion was created by Max Cutler as a production of cutler media.
#51 La Marvada!!!
"Quick my dad to Venus Miso quick up Bertha. The your Shakily Romy space in Queens pooja fellow. Ted is in Queens. The goes does that. Calamar Vodka occasion salvage thought to yours. You'RE NOT GONNA on this program whenever large Stephen Me Alive you might have somebody I mean. Don't security the price each be able to. I think a lot of shouldn't yeah jeeze against your flowers your fly through we soon. A Sore Jimmy Dodge middle part should do the DACA completes us. Some is Mario thing like judge Kasha Samuel L. off-field Soviet Okuda Marvel's measure. Then the worst thing. Really Key ille- Jeffery please vide pretend to be aired. Is this Army you? I don't pay more to boy at the DC loose three math. Quell Customer Base Program. Pass Ota Felony. Mine is I. Don't sit gift. Coupole breezy main shit occasion. She Jim new cohesion. Be Be the passing the mice Kerr. We'll do more. They won't be cut into muscle also smuggles Moscow moist res Q Deniau gala which was rumors. I-i've car I got almost at don't custom-made so yea Dainik makes it A secret theon. There I started chillicothe till the move confined Follow Somebody so book Mysore Food. I don't mind saying hey let you must from us. Meeting somebody. She'll be alkyl quiz O. Trish Parentis Aviv inside. Your body was as a sister. Blending Barkan worming Geology is cause me to Out to the center to events. Sociale Komo's universities 'cause I made to says he's Quantum Achievers and bring businesses in the Produce TO ALL COMING TO JIM Romanov won't be banned but until the Divided you publicly while you're theater. Keno saying kind of following program allowed so brave enough. You'LL DO NEWSON. We're GONNA feel no of your days. Phyllida festival. Today's rally in the letter speed Komis. I leave Abbott Shaffi Book with a few dressing this Toubon Jeff. Jeff Channel Goma quizzing Sawmill Gouda would surely beginning Astafei. I think you must thank you. Be Dangerous could then follow material that Fiji able to conduct same present quote Ganci Cheam Demise Me Da. Those coping survey ships in transform. Lsi Of itchy transform our elevate these in a bid persuadable camels rice KRISPIES source book. Those match grew moves through the. Is this Hasan Salt as CEO? Elon Young? I got out the hallway. Since you meant those those decrying doors that you could is a hippie meet that will stay on us. Avi Diversifies Bib quiz. Katya move as the casino fire. So He's been there Irish Cuchara for that shop were FIZZ FIZZ. Meta he set out evil say fussier billions of Besir have socked. The May refer to see this over so he does struggles Few Kenosha the pope. Who Does you could izing has helped me keep on top. Assab with us in a few days. I can't opened. A QUARTER IS OPERATIVES. Cut OFF A HELMET. Law was if you thought your dues. Boys each kept talk miserable theme. Lucia Newman for Tau Fuzzy. Shell born COMMU. Who made the industry source customize where FICA Mayes made was incredible? Say Speedy and good. Is You know as you might meet. Suck. Fake wound up overseas for came on. Ibm His client session will sit three math overseas canal sale. We'll be able to push. Who Does the Russian placebo guessing so vehicle to storm winter? Lady whose tone to Iraq Lopa chateau bone the mice keystone oil. If some our. She's the John Bussey spoken follow pool. All is so cute our watch multiple but I presume means keys. They'll go out full stop alot Acadia Cotija bu-but into if we still have some follow is will be able to put my money. People don't tap on you look under contract. We didn't have our guy we start the little. Could'VE IRENE team row learn to do with whom he tidy is? How do building dome of Your Day? This this is pretty soon. The world wants to start your Amedee because our civilised made surprising San Joaquin the children with this way to win win. Because thought wouldn't this seal the deal done over folic key takover cheap so god God Kara Melissa Cash Shasta. Those could transfer zoo secretive. Won't Lucas immediate is? She has cat except follow up by the idea. I see cutoff ESCADA. Bbc based on were built on. Kumasi D. I I says because you're vs strings because look at mccovey. Marlins CISCO's following their issues. Gs own bone wolves. Visual design has not you might be news have character descriptions. You'd be able to control advocate leaks. Go ahead advocate of another prophecy data song hockey illegal silk broad converse commerce annuity did in. Newman. Which was if. Because I've been to the Tech Guy Museum. I sold fish movie Harry. She got your boss setting 'cause Tom on the Karaj. Eastern Dinkum is obey but his you know the whole thing Illegible back chat with astor. I UNI CAL me a brass you. Kinda shore being really catch dodge. Former and somewhere. We saw to see why his people say with some kind of short. Oh he's able to see it. Live on Thai. Keep Him. We do in Kolkata. Tony Circle SHORTO SHORT OUT THEIR MOM H. O. Catecholamine OKADA SUDDEN INQUEST questioning. The says it will bring mitigate Chile muscle development of the cod fish out drink mental for courtesies through Kim. She'll just who data see fully remote simply duplicate early monseigneur voice for your whole life back. Everybody's back I can greet you to the bathroom. We could meet somewhere. Fu they're got azure middle will be able to be reached out the window. Provia me really be able to eighty to be able to shut on Sunday. He won't you. Would you be able make Thou- yearly follow suit with Quiz Mixie's futile bill in Chippucci g dude? You Touch John. Put Me Balance. the social media reports Converse crack. It will depend on the beach or so. You must be able to cope. Catching advocate showroom. Up Sing Moon. That's the main follow. Bitam MOM is which will be followed. That is the respite is Amir. V The Cuban be able to use his veto it. Okay Malar Guy. Believe it style if you will to babies who des. One must keep learn until do are you. You fucking Swab. Aleki saw me off problem on this. Tommy Follow Takata. Put THREE MACHINE MEANS NAUSEA CASSIA UTAH. Mice Polka need well in brand-new into said you'd be able to do. We stayed in a forty two to just inside quoting from ice. Tomo was commendable game four. The eloquent message does not if Obama. I opened his name places to identify Key West. Offset your body Lloyd. She gopro from officer will starve. Why don't I come at their base? You HELP IS I. Don't make you my burglar. Bill did you C V. You could get was the cinematic come societies and sister so pixel title town leave. It goes those suchy deals. Dhaka's I mean that's why didn't you say a Catholic Baden came on Bossou so key sign so Kim. When are you finally not safe for safety myself? This game though. She Louis teams first off the moment. Next articles kind of is by the way chagall. Shit Sonny yes Asia. There's a foreign policy can Lakeway Muslim issue beds. If that did not live at Moffat Sunday Omega three hundred an unavoidable Portabella will be badge. Committed the PFISTER. Let me down does Mayo. At a depoist Bob Notre Card Ready Better New Year's she the ball and from as fuzzy. So I if you will be able to discuss you age sequel to Cairo. Sorry for her I yeah either poise. Cvs Papaya they will be able to achieve cinema fest. People lost the shaky. Seo Geeta or through so-called Guy Human safe because Marshall Tau Nas. I'm on a new V lukasz. Walk John Mountains. Okay and you voted for. Somebody sent me but it keeps been Kiki I cannot French. People have spread for us. We will do report ninety seven from the public. Mer super does that inquiry means outside of a hold on with his dishes may provide a police. Division we stash cylinder Machina. Did enormous damage is a media that the city police give you the Sunnis let them call myself Saga Alameda who commits a literal. Maho with Komo Qatar at me and be able to do Kathy greet a festive. Derek. Properties of coffee allowed double. If everybody's from Boston they're gotta eat up won't be able to follow the quiz. Kara power to veto pronounce his BIB. That knows all of the video set of signal. No ceasefire his office of Civil Gos- joking. That will sit nobuko. Alex Zanardi was em. You know so Seville cynical. Bigger focus has people. It's been an close civil saying why do cows will probably more newly in Carolina Machida Iki Susan today as mayor the sympathy Cottam Movie Known Studies Program Keeping helios-ia Miller perky committing Khattab. You keep that it'll be by cutting US bitter that you buy Qatari lease so if e could be bandaging Santa Domingo Domingo doors the charge and all the fear that the immune earth shaking in the cage. Cool visuals is we do. This is character. Who WHO'S CUTTING MY Steve? Reggie don't case this Fuss mostly mad. They deploy zoo. Sarah who meet we mail your easier? I got a C. Statistic Catch Shop Building Norton Core. Shelly startled kill new. Kashogi gotTA perfectly recorded by. Bake civil vitalising vein to leave the judge by me. Would you can give give con Brio? We've been able to debate with died as you respond to operate the peach. No Cupertino difficult. New New beginner spirituality eligible to be gone canoeing estimating leaky Jim Weber normal. Mitch people to be actually Tom of Verge Cup versus no more skilled workers. Your fate mobile is books. Bestsellers C. E. MINIMUM ANCHOR CHAIN BRINGING IT UP. Utah Valley do not do not allow the meetings and also don't Mickey Yarmulke Fussy to the moon seen but I spoke with the Boston. Suburbs POOP. Protectionist pesos vision through the double other men and what? I love in Brazil in days no kind of dirge. Cobb is from my simone. Look begun can secure architecture. Hola it every motor cycle. Dodge dwis Qassam. Bigger do not. Jcp made illegal moves lose. They don't Guy Parapro ballot check dam Donald Dod Domingo Charge Been Sheena as Bose Hunky Agila is added losses vinyl. Not Powell other may WanNa go this way and say that the most frequent. Don't consider this issue star so you. Kinda gophers into Isaq had no fast ice again fast. Going seniority in the Jakarta. No Fuss what is your photo was able to score seeing. Who gave bill because bill to myself comiskey fuzzy took to consider sets per specials loan plaza quality that they can build canoes raw files today mile. You'll be able to go to court. You put the last Iverson's you're following. Notre Linguist Bieber got if Eileen List Lincoln Miller grace got funding. The poor be able to come it with the full of cash. Fukuda getting good news seafood teak without Gingrich as you mythic also Korean personae seeing. It was if you're able to pop star but you know scoop. Evil See Matrix Kara Lubricating Subcommittee that gives the. Tubby as Up You know God please starting to Linger Chabad. Maybe of course community fairly unique coma. Squalor clear I was deficient frequent tab of you physical at a mood. I- Office Quadri Justice Komo absorbed. The billing with in is your local mine. They'll but Mr do my research before the Cabeza Roy Moore before their biblical carrying the bull by Moss meniscus preschool noon Gorging. Karaoke going too fast and coach if I'll have the view but obeys new book in which Lee Houston Nassir Regime Houston Chronicle Muscles so Francis is owing trespassing. 'cause you can cut I. Usua- was curious freebie blooms Chinese Obama. Don't tell this vision. Equi certain Here the certain age you mulder. Gothic miss our live accu- racer that any nominee. That's passer meals kissel. Happy Equate League and the PICADO. Okay so now going to the body Polka POLKA GENETIC DVD loop. Would you be able zinc boys will be able to slick ice? Us build shots She called the police cookie. The tedious Kiliba catchable twice elk. Able to already seems to be able to be shown. Some people say Gee gut issue fi stuff. It always says chief scraping Gumi will also making Doodoo nauseam forming overseen funhouse you. It was stuck. Who was used as they see out the eighty s each moment open for Medicare Camille blue? You Cut Bush kicks in with bridge success. Okay we'll give you the push decent full get me for live the full Katie Cutter Conservative Vindication. Mccoy's sitting Fica Kathy soil operated contra remain giant to Peugeot gasoline and not forget oversee demise laying here in November. I E this sequence fly Formula Chief Legal Carnival COBB STUPID. You said example inch did was. He made sure ski Seattle Chipata. Put each Colegio Vida football seeing grind POLITICA. If I'll see parables pretty fast survey producer similiarities divaesque. You Mommy this family is. Abc got a couple of the words the poor rookie. Kara Gyrus Adviser Kellyanne reaching tier without casillas builds. Bassac without forgive said it. You say Asia's who will told you. This scene in a bid. Richard Petty was missed. Made Vyas raise you fight us. Some five is not for the wedding dinner Japan. Abbas Cockatoo to win. He spent much follows on Putin. Also questioning idiotic. Usa Cycle hand-and-foot. You need a McCarthy all complaining when she to decide what's the was it necessary boss said you want gene? You Pacific Pelinka was in now. Commissioner Sympathies Pukhov. Simone Scenario karsyk famous. Social happy was known. World drive crooked. Follow me go. Is this civilized exhibition picky pig. I say how much Komo Feis whereabouts in. Kosovo strom universal single loop north ills. This bones. They often does miles. But as Bibi appears in new moon as you use it was bones quickenloans. Scott Do Babe Duke Normal Curcumin meeting. Assad don't compare Jesus is not the nail swab from US quality Bateman carseat or not but this to holy Calcutta. Would you be able to key chemo already? Bedroom had caused the trauma. Ucar folic acid courtesy. Mashing SALVAGE COUPLE FOOD MOOD. Tabu bassist Taiji Sue perky rookie victimizing Saudi perky community victim of his close in Luke of US commuting was it follows dot rookie dish. Eighty million thirties better able to converse kings. He kills Affairs I'm you GIAMBI. Sit TABBIES INCH. Book is a little more out of college. Classic differences is you've got to change would chase economic abyss promises. Mears point key cheap. Would you be able to sit over? No clue bit of this knauss ear. Washer device or mortals live south of the moon. The at six are so forget everyone can choose from four G. Eating poking jokes newsprint yearly. Also excuse it quick when they do move. Viz Disobey Heavy Lasalle. Got Able to kick you via our tally to be able to avoid By sympathy lameta visuals in the mirror visit. Only Brazilian Bruno could achieve V. Nelson meters my zone key. Absolving E for being pro. Push for me to move further causing the humidity tab no purchasing things. Novosibirsk was allowed thrown back Coors Thou- tacos amused by beans or Kippur. Do Nowadays. Don't ourselves enough votes. So we saw the last few Marvin Kazu putting new guy. Komi community opponent is pool. Base is so they've each for Moseley Roku have been Jimmy Sabatoge ALLENDC stuff she gain. Qasem influence Paint a door at association. Dana Kunsi knowledge this Jesse giddy up but the move sauce quiz. Look boy cover. Nancy Kabeer of gooby economics last Kabila which most rockaway Prakash Kanna Work Passover Gwen Israeli Komaki goes to calculate. This only got half off. Mcgrath Coca Cola hairy. Tom Avoid Coca Cola. Who Seem Shit Divorce Coca Cola? There was poking he saw me liberties that were missing limbs. You come for doing commits another. You'll see shop. Fat Dust Windermere cubbies remove Denver. Stop Stop and go to whom you know you see. Each by being a Harris. They started reporters pictures younger. Bliss Genius has some of the key code all seen the eagles now who voiced around the for the quiz Colorado Ski Swab She was mad mad dictator. Kill each of Philosophy Bill on Boston. It will stay posse. Mollison on what famous got a posse mutual Maui? We'll see seemed shield. You saw the tail which Suffice Gatos Sea Kings seasons could be teacher ratio. Iot Mold Spinning as fifteen. Let's Cavalry Komo. Motomachi could choose drink. Who Don't Fortune Soak it? You'll so frachon ahead so fucked. We will be able to jump a couple of enough reach chant. My Property Cat Acasuso Z. W. Into Florida up despacito GonNa suck on his own joke Dovan Keven. What is happening here and I sure Kim Novak Item Volta I Review Block as important courtier kilo north of the starter who the bitter scorn omen film fest. A you want me to to to do not listen you seem to Norwich Zoom you. And you've bad initial conceive. Co-partner Casa Rosada as corporal is. We fit passer. Good seeds Miami of educate. My New Cari obstacle bustle if it took US little monkey. Jesse GANCI IT. Illegal pressure and change following juvenile. Sit Tight those to sail WORC- More Kinsey kilometers. Don Key orders causes seeking boost global inch follow ups Mutare Tovia pit shop days. Delong cousin go to Jean Claude Hill. You thought it was alive nor service long. Every not all say comedy feces DOT head got to walk via the past Saleh. Who got you up on that home with football sequel Bevy the Takao. Would you be able to go before while Sakata Pinky Service Eye Nisqually SPECIFC? What he follows Ya. Si Sa Kilo Kilo. Come come come. Don't begin to tell him. As Incheon Shown Copa America Killer Taboo Ke- precare parker down down short. Cut Short actually call you then follow? Asthma beat the Dahmer Vida and offer off the news his baseball as a Hoy's Zane theirselves bay what knowing Porta Cost Silky for mile trips to do is use a particular thing our us is you sign them is a starter towed diversity. I could turn a few follow More people suggest fully recover corporate each course hope refuge table view. Jackie WITH ANY PEOPLE. They almost seem winners fuzzy confidential. Naidoo Toco midday. We started context serious by the IT. Logical vice it domain. She on the warning Gamer Inchcape he says. Oh Vince go seek sees things. Toyota's Bosnia doesn't occasion she reviewer Kiesha Fisher war. You start at that meeting. Lago picked up. It was no cost loosen. Shoot Amine Legal Capri team. He's got you joking. Episodes FACIA OAKWOODS Public Kosheh. Most data use the shelter for new genetic. Jonas commit a catching some of this decision on Lynch's each day as this is day as they might avalos staying. Acura you can talk. Portsea passenger was say-say Giovine instagram dodger. Could you compare chilly inch postal NACIP program? Ag Quainton Shikwati quadrennial downloads. Zine that ages Dania. Me Key for the scenes. You deal seems the middle of the Spitfire especially mice in just Sabato for being NJ Grasso Blueberry Hoshi Kim it rises to the former Salinas's sinus pressure intricacy given tasty publication wide eat meal york-new row see Simeon caused. Fema is I will be gecas known fuzzy. Fuzzy Hygiene Manner Villiers Kevin Wherever Suzuki see. Forbidden Asia See Forbid. Biba constraints that Ebay. But the deal. Yes so then he was sesia would be about the Fisher. People to shop will be able move though. Says we'll be able to forgive people. Forget he sees that they want me to kill biblical say market ACURA Cup Pre K. As you've I recall my dairy Queen Dollars Double Damage Festival says mayes perimeter millions more. Got A Mizo Igwe Asian. She salvaged quasi Houma Gambling Yankee. Some new mayor simmer no major flooding. Dane in just intonation divisive prolonged guy. Don't toe the finish espy. Circular quicker but also VINCI GOES through Z. E. Sabena Quiche myzone. Age Question Dana. I don't think God cheeses lavas malls no fuss. Komo wounds quote lag as a keystone version. According Tena signed April cruciate spry homers English. Those benefits by aides awaiting was talking to myself rickie. Sakaba hit catching dads as soon as you Yuma is. Hbo Go Tajuddin Secured. Us Clinton is for me to Bay Equa- Quiz Schumer. Thousands can throw coming down with Bakun today famous but as you can change much quicker but none of your Todd Jau if it is mentioned program shattering. No massive was against Goodell Zota's programs Anton new. Google approach cashes. Everybody cashes knew. Jesus newest East towards these. We need to Kisii Fridge. The mind movies pulled me Halfaya severe.
Rent is due??? Again???
"Yeah or radio born ready. Man How long have we? Cried ready since. The pandemic started I guess I. Know Hi. It's Kim really items. Molly would welcome back to make me smart. The daily edition where Kai this week. Try to make sense of everything. Everything, it is. What do you want to know? Wednesday your questions, our answers. We start today with a follow up last week Melina took a question about eviction moratoriums or Moratoria I suppose if you want to be Latin, correct Latin about it I got. I got I got an F. in college line so anyway. specifically the question is a local moratorium when we. We already have a federal one some of erode in asking for more clarification, so we got actual expert advice from one of our listeners. His name is Michael Gibbons Campy as senior attorney at Southeastern Ohio Legal Services in chillicothe Ohio and we will say here. He is writing in his personal capacity, not for the agency. Here's what he says about eviction moratoriums. In my view. This is a critical issue. The real reason state needs a moratorium arises from. Federalism, Take Action Moratorium under the Cares Act. It applies only to homes with a federally backed mortgage or leases which are federally subsidized. I've had the misfortune. He says of having to explain to clients that no the news they heard about it fictions being banned during the shutdown was misleading. I worry that, too. Many people believed that evictions and foreclosures were addressed by the cares act which may have reduced popular pressure on our state government to act I. Think in addition to the six hundred dollars. Of extra unemployment benefits running out the next cliff in this thing is going to be evictions Picking Up I. Think That's absolutely going to have. Yeah in my not working time I work with the charity group that deals a lot with a homelessness, and they are very very worried about this coming up and I have a couple of friends who've been out of work, and not paying rent, and then working on you know their arrangements with their landlords, and they're freaking out. It's It's different in every state and community, though the national low income housing coalition has this big long list they've been maintaining of like what the different rules are in each places, but yeah, I agree with you were coming to that and it's good going to be. and. Magin. Having to work you know maybe some job that exposes you to the risk of getting this virus and you've got a couple of kids aren't in school and You have to plow through all the rules and regulations to try to figure this out at the same time. You're worried about making enough money to pay the rent to begin with. It's I. Mean it's it's Byzantine and. Anyway yeah, it's going to be an issue. Yeah, but you have to. Imagine slash hope that. You know sort of like the commercial real estate situation. Yes, they could you know kick out all these business small businesses for not paying rent, but who's going to fill those spaces, and so one could make the argument that. How effective is it for you as a landlord to push out all of these people who can't pay their rent when? You know what a third of the population is out of work right now. Johnny. Who are you going to get to fill that spot? On right so. My rejoinder would be like smaller. Landlords would be able to do that right they they'd carry the debt or whatever. My guess would be the big. Corporate landlords are going to be like no boom. The machine will kick into gear, and those notices will start going out and there won't be consideration given to actual. Humanity which sounds terrible God? Can we move on? Let's move on. That's terrible. Very quickly though. Yeah, of course. There is an economic consequence that that's a follow on of that. Because losing your housing is sort of the beginning of this, you know cascading effect that has other economic consequences, so just like apparently an economic argument gets people to wear masks more so than saving people's lives one could argue that maybe you shouldn't throw people out of homes because it will have ripple effects to damage the rest of the economy. There was historic day on my local public radio station here in Los Angeles KPCC. That pointed out that A lot of people think homelessness is the end of an economic. Klein is actually the beginning. Because there as you said things, go south in big better, yeah. All, right next question comes from listener Aaron. Hubbard. It's a new spin on an old question and Aaron Synthesis in via voice memo. High mcnew smart team. This is in new, Hampshire. I've been hearing kyw lament how it doesn't make any sense that the stock market keeps going up and I have been remarkably confused by it as well, but then I heard that it's probably happening, because the feds are buying up stocks and bonds from large corporations, including apple and others. Does that explain it? Is that actually happening? All right, kyle the lament her. What do you think? Well so they're buying bonds of companies, they're not buying stocks right. That would be a whole new Hullabaloo open up the Federal Reserve, act of nineteen thirteen thing before the Fed, but actually stocks in companies. But they are in various ways buying stocks from. big companies. Do, do I believe that that's the thing that's driving the market itself. No many other factions are I. Don't think that's the one that is I think the early injections of liquidity. Certainly are and that's my sense. Also also the stock market is an idiot, or as revenge shorts on marketplace six weeks or eight weeks ago. It's an alien. Right I mean it was up today. Because there was there was a positive report on a vaccine test of like eight people I mean they're. They're looking for the upside. They're just looking for the upside. That is, that is my take. But to errands point like there are many people out there arguing that the Fed and other global central banks. Intervening in the markets, the way that they are is is really shifting going on the point that like an investment banker, Ray, dallaglio is saying a couple of weeks ago that it's no longer a free market. It's being propped up by all these central banks and all their. Liquidity. But. I was curious about this to Erin. I was talking with the president of the Dallas Fed. Robert, Kaplan, earlier this week, and I asked him specifically about this, and he was saying no. It's still a free market and we're watching to see if there's any distortions that we're creating in the market result of our intervention all those things, but his about. Whether or not like this was making the market unrealistic, said look, the market is always looking a couple of years in advance like a year or two out, and so that's you're seeing. This is me extrapolating from what he's saying. That's why you're seeing these big swings every time there's announcement of a vaccine because it changes. What that one to two year outlook looks like you know depending on what happens with the virus, and that eventually what the market does, and what the rest of the economy does will converge. That's his argument. I mean I'm still in I. Not Economist non-market Trader. Person Perspective on the. People who are trading in the markets are not the people who are out of work, and so there's a little bit of disconnect there, but that's my take. And I mean who knows what the market right? Who knows I mean you can. Case at the Nasdaq soon, so what can make kiss the Nasdaq's doing so well because all the tech companies like facebook, and all those other companies are getting more business because people are home and. GAS COMPANIES AREN'T? I mean. There's a thousand ways you can slice this anyway, yeah. Okay! I don't know Kathy Torkan is Tarquin. Quinn Darwin. We're GONNA. Go talk when is one of several who s question came up Oso briefly on a previous episode, but it does a little more discussion because I just think. It's so cool that this is happening in a weird economy way. Here's what Kathy wants to know. What's up with National Queen Change shortage is there. Is this actually a true issue that we have right now? In America, I was dollar tree in my neighborhood, and I saw a sign that ask for paying customers to use exact change using cash and then. Then I went to another dollar tree on the total opposites out of town, and they said they had the same request with the same reason of a national coin shortage. This is so strange. She says and I was hoping you could shed some light on it. Yes, it's true and important fact, the woman whose name you'll hear at the end of the credits today was talking to me the other day about Ralph's our local grocery store, and she said the cashier had mentioned to her the coin shortage. It's a real thing because we're not getting out there and spending coins. It's kind while. Let's blame. All of our relations with the water jugs full of coins sitting in the Bachelorette's me I'm I I must have three hundred dollars upstairs on my dresser. It's the God's honest. Sometimes. Yeah. Sometimes I'll go to the pharmacy well in the before times, I would go to the pharmacy. Night the twenty four hour pharmacy with my little bag of leftover coins, so that I could pay at the self-checkout with my coins, but not bother anybody because there was nobody else there. But Yeah, I mean this. This gets to sort of how money moves to the economy and how these disruptions in how the very fundamental ways that we live our lives, and if you think about the laundromat example I mean. Not to be too much information. I'm not watching as much laundry us. We'll leave that out. There I imagine a lot of people. They're not going to the LAUNDROMAT as much. They're not going to places where they're vending machines as much and so all of these things kind of play into just like even just how money is moving to be cardiac this. Like literally moving the person who owns the laundromat goes in twice a week or whatever it is empties out the quarter jars right takes them to her local bank right, they take it. They deposited in larger banks up the chain until it gets a Federal Reserve and the Federal Reserve distributes that coinage out through the economy in the problem is. There's no in now because we're not doing that stuff. And so. The Fed is set up a US coin task force, and they're trying to figure out ways to get people to actually spend all this coinage. It's a big deal the big deal. Coin? Okay should we get in one more? Yeah. Yeah okay so dust in relative relative Ford Sorry Dustin doesn't Rela. Ford says my question is about inclusivity and diversity in the workplace specifically. How do you accomplish it? Industries where there is not a big pipeline of diverse workers so since this seems to be like my topic day month it. You Go. I think the pipeline problem has to be addressed in a very purposeful way, so for example we do not have a lot of black men for example in public media, we just do not, and so if you do not have a lot of black men, working in internships, and in member stations and feeding into that sort of track, a lot of people go into to create that pipeline. You have one of two choices to fix. Fix that problem you either try to make sure. A ton of black men get internships to begin the pipeline and hope they make it through the other end, or you fast track it and say wow, we recognize. There are no black men in public radio at the national level, so we are going to create this spot for that person and train them to that role with the fact. You know acknowledging that this is a problem. And so those are the two ideas that that I see kind of floating around. What do you think? No I think that's exactly right. I guess just to keep up the public radio thing and the and the serious lack of black men specifically in public radio. What do you do, look, and this is not your question, answer right, but but what do you do on? Those black men get fed up. And leave. Let me. Get Fed up. I mean you and I both know men who have said the heck with this. This is tear. I can't stick around for this. I think I mean well I. Think in that case you either. You try to fix the structures that creates an untenable environment. Where were these black men cannot feel safer succeed. And I'm not. GonNa say I'll say and you hope that you've done enough work on that front end of the pipeline to where if those black men have better opportunities that you know? Encourage them to go there. Someone to step in behind them and I mean this is pretty. Simplistic of a very complicated discussion and narrative but You can extrapolate this out to any other industry whether it be the underrepresentation of women in a particular sector well. You can either put them in, but. In that. That's just reminded me of something else. Because if you do that, then you end up with all of these women and people of color with no power at the front end trying to fix industry that's problematic, so it has to be really purposeful. It has to be about changing culture to make more welcoming and inclusive. I mean I can say that as a woman of color and journalists journalism early in my career, I'm talking when I was sixteen and when I was nineteen years old I. had these you know middle aged white men who just decided that they were going to make sure that I succeeded, and they were running interference all over the place for me. And, making sure that I got opportunities making sure that I got jobs, making sure people didn't mess with me because they just decided that that was what they were going to do. And that made all the difference, not all the difference. Lots of people helped, but it made a big difference, yeah. That's good. That's good. That's good. Okay! We're GONNA leave there on that hopeful note, because here's. By all of us, especially hopeful note for one I know that's right well. That's why I'm. Running for the exits here because we got to go out on an up, note gotta go. All right done back back tomorrow hollowed out shell Thursday. Is What we call it question. If you have it, send it to us. Make me smart at marketplace dot Org. Sign up for newsletters, please marketplace dot org slash newsletters. And hit the music. The Music make me smart is produced and directed by Sam Anderson. Digital. Producers Tony Wagner. Ben heff coat is the video producer and Ethan Parrots video intern and Eric. Phillips right with such flair. Our newsletter and Chosen Thorpe is on duty in downtown Los Angeles today. The to sixty one out to grow music was composed by mentality and Daniel Ramirez executive. Director of on demand this week. Star and yet has also senior producing this podcast I do believe Senior Vice President, general manager, and also the woman who told me the coin and it goes. All right I probably take all those coins. Run them through there. And I swear I. AM doing some laundry. It's just. Not A lot. Definitely longer intervals. Because social distance distancing in the laundry room is hard.
"A sullen statue stands in a grassy Square between the older artists all the Palace of justice and the line of sponsorships in our capital city of Pretoria Thursday. It's always covered in Pigeon droppings and washed occasionally by the red. The face of the statue is that of a man raised to believe that suffering was the way to heaven a man who's Stern glum expression betrays a life of adventure Pioneers battled and struggled his house lies within walking distance. It's now a museum and his body is only a stone's throw from that. He was the man they called wimpole. This is blind History season four and we're already on I can't believe it's episode 4 and we're talking about someone today is a lot closer to home here. We get lots of people saying you should cover this person. You should cover that person. Today. We're going to look at somebody who actually is buried just a couple of cars from where I live and his name is Paul Kruger. There's a very famous statue of him on Church Square in Pretoria, which summer has stayed there pigeons. Don't give it any respect and I've seen it once or twice but I haven't really given much thought to pull Kruger before this. I'm embarrassed to say, how about you? And yeah, I suppose I thought I left Kruger National Park and so I suppose that's where I've got it. Well, maybe the Kruger coins, but other than that, I haven't really looked too deep in it, except. You know, what we learned in history when we were younger. Well, it's time for us to find out more about Paul Kruger Anthony Medeiros cliff and blind history. So if you've lived in South Africa, you would have heard the name before but it probably doesn't mean that much to most of us. He lived between 18-25 wage. A 1904 so a little outside of living memory. They called him when Paul and he was the president chiefly of the zika free concert Republic the early South African public mostly in the transvaal at that stage. That's kind of the most important Top Line stuff about Paul Kruger. I must tell you I found his early life a lot more interesting than his political life Laden when he became president and he was descended from a woman called Cricket or who was a a slave girl who was brought from Malaysia and there were a lot of Malay slaves brought to the cape Colony Shack. He grew up somewhere in the in the karoo. Actually. It was like the the Northern Western Cape that area, you know Carlsberg area. That's right. And and he he seems to have come from a family of some repute. He also has descended from Peter Pan Meredith who is quite a well-known Dutch settler. The family had been in the country for some generations already by then in his father Casper and his mother had him in, Georgia. Like somewhere I think you're right Colesburg or something, but that's not where he started making history. Not at all. But he had to grab very fast cuz his mother died when he was very very young ages. Also his dad beige brought up him and his brothers or his siblings. And then his Dad decided to join the great trick who who was Edmund moving up from the south and from the southwest and when they moved through their joined on and basically across all River there's quite a cool story about that. So Hendrick putki third, one of the famous Trek leaders came through the town where the Krugers lived and he convinced Paul Kruger's dad that there was a possibility for independence from the English. They weren't particularly anti-british, but the idea of building their own country of pioneering their own land was really what pulled the crew goes in and and you know portrait was a young man at that stage very young age, but he learned to hunt very quickly. He learned to ride horses immaculately. He learned about life on the felt and you know, you think about the fact that in 1835 dead. This is a very young man. He went and took part in a battle called The Battle of fat club, which was in Hell brought in the Free State now listen to these numbers and just to give you an idea of how difficult it was wrong to be both a member of the much ability tribe and the King Chillicothe but also to be a four tracker on the 9th of October of that year and silicates resent 5,000 Metabolife Warriors to attack the food trackers. Now the ratio of matabele Warriors to put trackers was one to a hundred and fifty and somehow remarkably miraculously block. These foot traffic is managed to win. And Paul Kruger was a young man. He was in his teens as early teens and he was loading guns and the women were loading guns and they were only probably a handful of fighting men who could actually backfire the weapons and they still one. I mean, this is just if you think about that ratio, it's quite remarkable hundred percent and if you look at Mozilla causey's Warriors, they were notorious they were famous for purging Fearsome, you know a fighting Army. He also famous for being quite shitted battle if you ask me I suppose but I don't you know, you obviously the guns vs Spears that's always played a role as. Yeah. I mean actually there were there were some guns in the matter be contingent as well. But what happened was that out of those five thousand Warriors many of them were just sheep and cattle Roberts who joined in and then once they got their plunder they left so to Farmers and 184 matabele died the rest of History left and ran away but in spite of their choice, apparently the spoiled was great. So there might have been managed to plunder fifty thousand sheep and goats and five thousand cattle so they may have lost the battle but it seems they won economically. It sounds like a great tool. Yeah, it's this is what he knew cuz what's really hunting at a very young age as you mentioned earlier and often when he went hunting his rifle used to back fire or something. Went wrong with it and please Summers was blown off on one occasion. Yeah, so it's apparently he shot a lion at age. He said 14 but one of his friends who was there said he was only eleven at the time. I mean, he shot a life and the incident you're talking about was actually in elephant gun, which is a substantial piece of artillery and it blew off is left them. But the best part of the story, I don't know if you know this already but he went home the camp afterwards with like half of his thumb blown away and he put it in turpentine. That's how you that's how you made it better and then it wasn't healing and he felt that his arm off a gangrenous and the doctor said they're going to have to amputate the arm and he said not a chance that he took out his pocket knife and he cut off his own thumb with his pocket knife. That's correct. And when the incident happened actually in the bush off the off his Hunting Party of anybody had a pocket knife with him instead. No no, no, no. No, we haven't but and recklessly City winter time and cut it off. So he was known at this stage of his laughing. Fearless very brave Fearless in his Hunting Expeditions and also, you know when yours with the Commandos, well, he may have been Fearless but he's also really uneducated. I think he only had three months worth of Education in his entire life and that just proves to you know, we often give Jacob Zuma the gears for having only completed up to standard six but here's Paul Kruger had three months of formal education and he still became a president of the site after concert in public. They settled in potchefstroom and then obviously in rustenburg later on an area which is filled with natural art crops and and natural features that are named after the cruises but their family farm he actually got at sixteen which was the customer at the time. He got to choose a farm of his own at the foot of the Mechanicsburg. And that house is still a National Monument today that well the property is certainly and in fact, it's one of the places and we'll get to this later. It's one of the places they say that they may have lost or hidden or stashed the krugerrands the Kruger Millions. Yep. Vegetable married Anna Maria Asia duplicity. I mean these names are just fantastic and he went off to the Eastern transvaal with her and then they returned later on to rustenburg, but she had caught some illness and she and the infant child died in those days wasn't unusual to marry early. I think he's dead and were married when they were fifteen and eleven while because that normally didn't live very long the women were very scarce. Gino's day so yet to you have to go get his first bride from a very far distance and he wants a story a bit Legend and not that he had to cross the Volta River in full flood yet to actually swim across it to be able to to grow up his broad and We complain about Tinder exactly. So no problem. He got married a second time also to a duplicity. But this one's name take this down Cocina sewage Frederica Willamina duplicity sunny, sunny sunny sunny, and they had seven daughters and 9 sons and she lived all the way to 1901 dying off. Three years before him and his son. He obviously was particularly voluptuous. Awesome on this young round woman. And today we would call that fat-shaming exactly and yeah, but they said she was not a pretty girl but when he loved so I spent the rest of their lives together and they said the soft round woman that would like to be affectionately known as dents any he became a field cornet which is like a magistrate or an officer when he was very young. He joined the foxtrot also at a very young age and played a role in a quarrel between two of my ancestors, which I I really find interesting, you know, the minute history becomes personal it seems to me that much more. So I'm a direct descendant of stuff honest woman who's called the storm full funny new idea who is a month red bearded quite aggressive nasty, man. He didn't have a lot of friends, but he was a force of Nature and mustiness vessel pretorius who's also an ancestor of Main and I didn't know that Kruger had played this role in trying to bring them together a number of times. In fact, he did that with the end goal being that he wanted to unify the afrikaners into a new Republic. He took part in the famous palm sander of a convention with Andreas pretorius who was actually a major influence in his life. He developed quite a relationship with the older pretorius underneath the guy who'd one blood River and asked him pretorius made em, and he admired he said his resolve sophistication and piety and piety, especially with something important to Paul. He was a very religious man. He became a common Dunton at all in the Army then which is kind of like the most important officer in that army and eventually vice president in 1877. Very very young managed. All these different positions. It's quite a remarkable life and you think that he was out there, you know, hunting lions and and and taking part in battles in his teens and then going into politics and and living a really full life wage. Makes me feel like such an underachiever. He became vice president in 1877. And that was when Britain annexed the Zar into British territory, and that was mostly because they saw that goal was becoming the big thing in South Africa and they were greedy to make sure that their hands were all over it. The British played on this and educated thought they saw him as backward superstitious. Yeah. I'm an old man and then grotesquely ugly and often called him a literate peasants. So they were hardcore. Whereas the European continent loved him when he got to Europe. He would got a hero welcome, which is incredible. I mean when you got to my say they were significant amount of people there to receive him and the same as in in Holland well in in some ways they treated him much like we think of Nelson Mandela today is a freedom fighter because here he was this man who was standing up to the mighty British Empire and trying to get independence and sovereignty for his own people. So in some ways I suppose that contract Has been born out in history many times one man's Freedom Fighter is another man's terrorist and he did make a mess of difference. I think he was one of the first to rise up against and start the resistance against the British. That's absolutely right and wage. He sent deputations to London to plead for Independence and sovereignty for the Z they are and they were ignored and the first world war broke out just after that and it was really a fight for independence phone number but he'd gone over to England and number of times and gone to Europe and on the second occasion that he went to Europe. He actually met. So from Bismarck, you know, the famed month and he took a balloon ride over Paris, which was a massive highlight for him. Wow. That's tremendous. I mean you see again these lives intersecting all these famous people who kind of met each other but they were alive at the same time and they were important enough to be in the same room, correct? Well, he became president eventually and that was when he succeeded in going to London and pleading with Britain wage. For Independence and they actually recognized the South African Republic then as a separate independent state, but it became an issue that Brits were pouring in to the Zar or the s a r s shows at that point and they were coming in mostly because of gold on The Big Box restaurant and you know Cecil John Rhodes and and Maitland and people like that were very much in favor of of sending British Prospectors wage. They would Prospectors you were coming to try and find their their fortune and on the Bedford restaurant, but the media T that fork who started calling them eight Landers, you know foreigners. That's right and wrong treated them actually to be the folks who are treated them very very badly in that that's been massive taxes and it didn't get the same rights and it was quite an interesting story about the Jewish people and he was actually off he called in God's chosen people but there was an instance when you were surveying the city in this is of Johannesburg now. Yeah, each church was allotted a certain number of stands and just so happy. Do a double the amount of Christian churches to synagogues and then they asked why and you just basically said they could only receive half the amount of land and seems that you saw the humor in there because they only read off the Bible. Well, yeah, it's interesting that he was a religious man, but they were very old testament type Christians, you know that he had foreign dekat which he was a founding member of we call the dopers in South Africa. That church is. Well known for really being A Very Old Testament based Church. They don't allow music in church that quite joyless and very calvinistic but he was with the guys at the very beginning of that movement. And that's where a lot of the reputation that he has for being this deeply serious quite grumpy humorless and Bland human being comes from and how long is all of those things but just not to the degree that he was caricatured by the British. I'm definitely not. I mean it was one instance where he built a church and then he went on to the roof that just being built and stood on his head in front of everybody. So he did some strange things as well. Well, the egg lenders were a big problem and he was re-elected three times on the 8th landed question. The Jamison read the famous Jameson raid happened in eighteen ninety-five ninety-six and that was embarrassing to the British girl led to the second world war of this thing. And after that second world war Kruger left for Europe in Nineteen Hundred and he refused to return home. He died in Switzerland of old places. Overlooking Lake Geneva in a reasonably nice house at the age of 78 in 1904 and he was buried there but then they dug him up and they brought him back to South Africa and he's buried in Pretoria at the hell darker, which is about a stone's throw from his house. But Gareth is a bit of controversy behind the song Quite A Lot in that. He deserted his fellow countrymen wage. At the time that Lord Roberts is a load Roberts is basically just at the edge of Victoria about to take it over. So he basically got out of there and he stayed for quite a long time in the Eastern transvaal. He had a train that he stayed in and I believe that he was carrying his many bags or whatever. They might call it and they crossed into the Portuguese Frontier down to Lorenzo Marques as they called it and then his wife got very ill and when he gets it to Europe, she didn't join him. So yeah, that must have been a devastating time in his last seating the last of Africa and he would probably believe very much that have never see it again and leaves his wife of fifty odd years and part of the story is also that on his flight to maputo which is been known as Lorenzo marks. He was actually basically held hostage on a ship as a political prisoner for a month until Queen Philomena of the Netherlands intervened and gave him safe passage where he he obviously went first to France and then to to Holland wage. And spent quite a lot of time in Holland. He was very close to the Dutch royal family. I mean, he spoke Dutch, you know Afrikaans was still in nascent language at that point. He also spoke a little bit of English, but interestingly he could talk to Anna and sesotho almost fluently, correct? Yeah. I think that one of the things that struck me about this guy Paul Kruger is that again, there's an intersection between his life and the life of your choice, which we've paid some attention to in the previous episode of blind history because he actually appointed once met at a very tender age as State Attorney and upon meeting smarts for the first time he remarks to another man who ended up writing a Dom that he thought that this man had great prospects and would turn into someone quite formidable and that's interesting because of course, they were very different personalities and what they ended up in buddying was such very different things and deliberates, which we didn't have in disgust too much of but he was very much key in that actual. Now we Krueger went into Exile birth. And he was you know kitchen at came with a surrender document for them to sign interesting reading this Gareth on the surrender document that that was requested a representative not a military government that the birds allowed to retain their firearms Dutch language to be maintained the Dutch Church to remain unchanged and obviously the public trusts and often thought to be looked after the attacks on farmers and amnesty to all of the end of the war and actually they the British accepted that but then Larry Bird came back and said look, but the birds didn't accept that. So so then walk out on for another two years. He's well-known obviously for a number of things the Krugerrand which is a famous bit of gold currency. It's probably the only golden age you can legally own Krueger statue in church square, which I mentioned Krueger house switches in Pretoria, which is still a museum and of course the worm full pipe the pipe that he used to smoke his tobacco. It's a famous style of pipe which I say was especially developed for him. Sure. I wonder what what was the shape of his face or his nose? Well, I'll tell you something that when Paul was he was not much to look at and in almost any picture from his youth right through to his very old age in Switzerland. He was not a looker. I think Sonny had a tough time. There's one famous South African part that said the image human from the clips blow-by-blow is described him. So overall not a pretty picture a bit of a cantankerous personality mostly formidable human beings by any guys estimation and someone who just wasn't to be messed with at a time where the strong survive and the weak ones just conduct and I'm kind of proud that. I know a little bit more about him. I agree a hundred percent of what I'm very proud of is the fact that he was a hunter but you also like many Hunters groups of conserving for future Generations. The wild animals that maybe wouldn't we would have never seen if that carried on hands from the weather did absolutely and the Kruger National Park is widely acknowledged as one of the most far-sighted ideas at a time when no one was ready to clearing nature reserves and this guy decided to chop a huge piece of what could have been profitable Farmland right out and say I'm sorry. This is going to be for the animals and that's remarkable. I mean Paul Kruger was a real prototype South African Pioneer in every sense of the word. Line history is brought to you by Taylor blinds and shutters. All the episodes are available on the cliff central.com website and app as well as Apple podcast on Google podcasts Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Interestingly enough. He says he only ever read one book and that was the Bible but he apparently could recite whole chapters of the Bible from memory. So clearly this is the choice between education and basic intelligence right is if you are smart and you don't have a huge amount of software input in terms of Education, you can still make an enormous difference in the world and he clearly did page one book The Bible and he was also because of that one book a flat earther until the last day he claimed the Earth was flat, so I didn't know that that's crazy.