2 Episode results for "Carolyn Curry"
Time and Memory
"Welcome to call your girlfriend podcasts. For Long Distance besties everywhere. She's on me not to so and she's an Friedman. Wow you know the reverse intro has the benefit of prone clarity like I will say that also you got to switch things up every once in a while. I'm not upset about it. It felt kind of good like crossing crossing your legs the opposite direction. Relieving the pressured. How you doing over there? Oh you know I was going to say Happy Gregorian calendar new a year. But I guess it's also happy Gregorian do decade okay. Can I say something about about the Gregorian calendar the decade. According to the Gregorian Orien- calendar starts on the want. So like all these people who are like so freaking out and excited I was like you got three hundred and sixty five more days of this decade but not to be technical. I mean actually. I think that's the greatest gift we can give anyone who is like. Oh my God what what are all these like decade and review things saying about my personal decade and review being like you. You know what you got another year to assess you got another year to make your playlist of your like one thousand songs. You liked the stack head. You got another year to like. I don't know like put up twit your top nine on instagram for the decade. You could do whatever you want. I appreciate that especially because pushing it off one year makes the arbitrary Tori Gregorian decade align. Almost perfectly with like decades of my life like my twenties my thirties like you know what I mean like the little one year. And I'm like you. You know the only the only real the only real time markers being personal of course like I don't know how people who whose whole twenties weren't in the twenty th and whose whole thirties were in the two thousand teens. Things are processing this decade milestone. Because that's the only reason I'm on board is because it works for me works for me personally person born in early January and also at the beginning of of a decade on the Gregorian calendar. You know as someone born in a year that ends in a five. I have to say that I really appreciate being in the middle of it. All Santana this is started me doing like aside. Google as we're talking about Pope Gregory the thirteenth. I think what a Roman numerals who is the Gregorian calendar is namesake. Yeah I mean the Gregorian calendar is interesting and and not like you know. It's the business calendar it's the white people colander. But it's not even the calendar that most people follow other religions have other years personally personally. I'm fine with people who believe that. The New Year starts at the Spring Equinox for me personally of the year does not start until Q.. Four that's my Amina calendar operates right so you you are heading into the second quarter of your year right now right of my ear. I was just like my year my year just started. I'm so excited about it. And I think I think about this a lot because I I was technology person for a long time. But like this whole living like a quantified life kind kind of thing is both on some level I see the benefits of it but more than anything else all I see. How it stresses people out and so the the idea that you have to have something to show for the last ten years of your life as if just being alive if not enough if something that is just like really disturbing to me and I also like nostalgia as good? I guess but I'm the kind of person that I only look forward and that's like Part of YM in therapy. I'm not good at looking behind but in the front I can do that so living for today and for the future pretty much I know and I have to say like. We spent a lot of this year working on a book that looks backward. So it's like yeah tell me about it and it was very hard. I know I know I was going to say though is like honestly something that is. It's not my favorite thing to do either. Honestly like this is a way. We are very similar but one thing that got me through it is being like. Oh this is like setting me up to learn things and like change my behavior in the future or do things differently in the future and then I can kind of like find the value in it as opposed to just being like aren't I sowed that I handled out that way or is sad that this great moment has passed like any kind of like You know any of those feelings that creep in when you're often in like uh-huh my God ten years ago reflective mode right and I I mean you're so right about that not everyone gets that experience and I would not certainly not have chosen not for myself L. forgotten this experience at all if we had not worked on this project together. It's like on one hand. There is very much like wow look look how far you've come but also I think that for me me at least there is also a pain of just looking back at that time and being like. Oh here's how hard all of this was and having to revisit it even though today it's not that hard still like put some trauma into focus which knock great you know but at the same time things like the real gift that I've gotten from working on the book with you really is to see. Just how full my life has been for ten years because I think that I suffer a lot it from just. I'm so focused today and tomorrow that I you know it's like however I feel right now is how I think about. My life is all of the time. Yes the future extrapolation Sharon right and having the time and space to be like no like look at ten years of people who have loved me look at ten years people who've just been there look at ten years first of like really fun experiences of ten years of really hard experiences. Sometimes things that you like survived with people that was like very affirming for me right and I think that's something I feel very acutely the difference between working on this book. That's kind of like a personal decade versus a lot of the things that many magazines and newspapers I read regularly or publishing right now. That are sort of like an objective political cultural decade or like some kind of reckoning with what we have supposedly all gone through over over this past Gregorian ten years. I struggled with a lot of that too because a lot of it isn't about like Oh and how can we kind of like look forward forward and like what we WANNA take forward. And what are we WANNA leave behind. Because I think you're totally right like the the process of being a reflective mode about our friendship is something that like gave me this deeper definitely a deeper sense of gratitude for for you and for many people who have loved me during that time but it it also like I was saying earlier allowed me to kind of say like Oh wow when I lay it all out like this. I can really see that like these are the things these are the things. I'm focused on in the past. These are the things that like. I'm GonNa make a priority now as I moved to the future and when I read a lot of these like what were the two thousand ten reflections. There's not that same level of like on a on a at a cultural level there's not that same type of energy of like okay. And what do we want to keep from this time. What did we learn from this time? And how are we going to try to do things differently. It's all very much like as the twenty tens draw to a close like there is persistent fear in the world is burning. And but you know like you know what I mean like there there. Is this sense of like it's the end of something and not like time is like a thing that goes on. You know what I mean like. We are still in it. We are still making choices. There is still like you know. Oh lots of it in front of us if we're lucky right if we are lucky the key the key operating words there right so you know I mean like the these. These articles were not like literally the Earth ending tomorrow. But they have that kind of apocalyptic tone of like and I know that this is like because their book ending a decade. It's the end of of a decade. I'm air quoting but they also manage to have this tone of like okay. We all start a new thing but it's in a horrible situation. It's not just like I don't know there was There was a twitter threat. I read earlier this year among a lot of designers about like how different people see time like how they visualize time and how like you know there are people who are like like. Oh I've always seen the year as a circle and there are other people who are like I see the year as a straight line or there are other people who are like. What do you mean it just is? I don't see any kind of visual structure and I've been thinking about that a lot as I. I mean in this time when everyone seems to be talking about is it new is a restart is at a new decade and I don't really know what the answer is for me but I think the answer is it's personal time it's like years and decades of my life or phases of my life my a years time that's not a calendar thing my la years. That's time is not a calendar than you know. I kind of an interesting thought exercise people. We're making some extrapolations that like There are like if you are someone who tends to be like you know from XYZ kind of culture or live in a place that's ruled by seasons feel more like an ex visuals like everything. Some generalizations about WHO's likely to be linear and who is likely to be circular but I was most interested in the people who were like. Whoa time has no shape? Y'All like time is just time. Yeah I mean I very much feel that way. That time is just time and it's a very it kind of elastic time for me. At least it's different every single day it really is. It's just that I say this thing. That is so cheesy all the time. But it's so true for me. The days are long but the years religious zip by all the time and and I feel that I just feel like every day as slog I And then you you know and then you look like a blink of an eye are like. Oh It's been ten years or I've known this person for X. Y.. Amount of time where it was like this amount of time since I did this other thing but I also just don't I refuse to be a slave to time because I think that the thing that you said earlier about like why am I You know like how are we marking the time. Something that this year has been. It's been really top of mind for me. Just because when I was reading all of those decade roundups the Real Comfort Vert that I actually felt was oh the world has been ending for as long as the world has been here. Yes you've been like anxious about it you know like Oh great and I think that for me some some of that just has to do with the Internet and the sense where like at the end of the decade before this one we also had like enough mass communication that this inner like the same kind of sentiment was propagated widely. We and then it's happening now again and I'm like oh great. The world is always on fire. The Shit is always ending. The world is going to end tomorrow. Which obviously is the thing that like? Like religious charlatans have been like selling people forever but even people who are secular like tell themselves out we just do it in a very different kind of way the same doom and gloom in apocalypse and we excellent cotton but something clicked into place from everywhere it was you know. It's not like I personally feel in a great place in my place in the world. I'm like no I am interested. I'm terrified and I'm all all of the same things as everyone else but I think that I am really in a place where I'm deciding that you know the news and culture and all of these external polls are not the things. They're not the things that I want to send her my life around. I WanNa send her my life around like myself and the people who means something to me because those milestones are very different than minute that you make them very personal. It's been interesting kind of thought exercise for me and also the thing that I think all the time when I see these like the last ten years with whatever I I mentioned like spotify list or the top nine but really. I've been thinking a lot about how so much of my life as Ephemera and I don't like that that's the feeling I don't like and so really thinking about like what did I make this last decade. That made me proud. What do I wanna make the next decade? That will make me proud. And what is something that will last and I think that like once once I started not thinking about time hyman this elastic kind of way. It's it's been a different set of questions. I don't have answers to any of them but I know that I feel a little less anxious about and I've just like submitted to the the fact that the world is ending and I will die and that's okay because that's the plan from the beginning but everyone needs their own internal clock like you need to decide like what does time mean to you right And just to give proper credit. I went and looked in. The tweet was from the design writer. Alexandra laying and she's awesome. She has a great newsletter. Exactly so I was like all right like I knew it was somewhat knew it was someone I wanted to to site and source and we can link to the thread in the show notes because it's full of replies of just like how all these different people conceptualize time look at us. Being College. Student like philosophy students look at us like honestly like this is but this is like you know when we haven't podcast together like this in a while. I'm like it makes some sense we are. We've done a lot of processing separately in the last few you weeks off on our own reading we can come together and have the like salon conversation one hundred percent. I've been doing a lot of traveling traveling lately and there was something really nice about being during the holidays in a country that does not celebrate Christmas. Smith's but definitely celebrate New Year's that I think also made me feel so much less anxious about everything because it was just like okay the year is ending. Were you know like like everybody is having a big party or whatever which is fine but there was not that rush of like consumer capitalism. You have to get everyone a president like like that just didn't exist exist for the like when I was in Senegal for the last two weeks and it's not to say that like people don't do holidays. That's not what I'm saying. I'm just saying that is like the vibe is very different and one. It's because it's a majority Muslim country and also like African people don't do nonsense I think that just also and knowing that everybody nobody does this differently and it does not have to feel like a mad dash towards the end of the year is something like it. Felt amazing to me and I'm really glad that I have that this last month because I think that it did wonders for my mental. Yes and you know this kind of like everybody does it differently. I WANNA do a call back to previous years first episode of the Gregorian Calendar Year in which. Sabrina Horsa gave though the hot hot tip that she uses her birthday every month as a day for reflection assessment and and that is like her time her time is. This is how I'm checking in. This is how I'm checking in with with my own feelings of like. Am I on path. I want to be on a my making choices that are fulfilling to me. Am I kind of like incrementally working toward things things I want to be working toward. She had a shortlist of questions. She schedules all her appointments on that recurring calendar day but she also does stuff like ask yourself what she's been grateful. Oh for the past month. Ask yourself what she's learned in the past month ask yourself what's gone well. Or what didn't go so well or who. She does a phone call. Or what little things. So she let fall through the cracks that that she needs to be doing to support herself. And I just I wanted to shout that out again because it feels like the kind of perfect marriage between A beginning of the year practical advice episode of this podcast and also the more ephemeral. Do `time on your own conversation that we're having now because that's one reason I love it. It's like an adaptation of time to fit her own. Needs love to should we take a break. Let's take a break In in the beginning of a New Year is an opportunity to create new habits to be your happiest healthiest selves. 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Y. to get your free personalized paper sample. Then use the code save fifty. Save five zero to get fifty fifty percent off your save. The dates. That's Zola Dot com slash C. Y. G. and Promo Code Save Fifty As you know from working on her memoir with me I have the worst Recall call about my own life and mostly because I'm like oh I just don't want to look there so when I think about like oh where was I on January one twenty ten. I have no idea I could probably go on an email somewhere and find it or maybe like we already on instagram. Maybe that's there somewhere. We were at big bear coffee shop in Washington. DC which was closed for a dance party. What are you seeing in me? I was wearing a vintage lace dress. And you were wearing like a like a like a kind of like a wide bell in some kind of fitted situation and the fact that you know this has me shook and there's definitely a photo of us like at like midnight or just after or before clearly dancing. Clearly dancing okay. Okay well that's where I want to be at the start of the decade clearly dancing. So thank you for clarifying that for me. I'm sorry I went very shook by that. I remember that I'm I'm pretty sure it was only ten. I mean it has to be right because we met in two thousand nine right. That's what I'm saying and I still lived in DC that so. Why well good to have you because I would have remained a mental note to look in the never looked back? Where was I January? One twenty ten not bad moving living on definitely definitely dancing like I know but you know like what I'd like decade we've had I have lived in like I moved from. DC Due to New York to San Francisco back to New York and have done so much in that time like. That's so wild if you told me today so you were like. Hey I mean a- this next decade you're GONNA move like five times across the country or whatever I would give up the ghost like immediately like that seems not cool and not exciting fighting at all and just you know old lady now so I don't want to do any of those things like how wild that we set off but also we are like children of the great recession so we didn't have a choice in how we had to be mobile so when I think about the story of our decade I think a lot about how the the economy so much to do with it. Yes this is kind of what I mean about personal time like yes. Obviously the economy had a lot to do with it. There was about economy situation in two thousand eight. That was still going on as we rang in this decade but that for us also coincided with the earliest years of our careers and I think like I in particular the oldest millennial. TM had a lot better than like you. Gina who are a couple years younger than me and who were like basically trying to find jobs and get on a specific professional track like right when the economy tanked. I had kind of like a couple years of a head start before things got really really bad. Although in media economy to me it's always a recession. So but it's definitely like that like this. Broader economic thing was happening but it's also that like we we were in our twenties and were had not established ourselves as like professional humans with like other professional connections and a body of work and experience that we could could use to like convince people to give more work so I think that that is like you can't really separate those things right like for us. The decade is marked. Both by where we were for on our personal timelines. Also these like bigger factors. And you know and the fact that I've been thinking about that thing you said about how ephemeral a lot of this is is like where where did our friendship and where did our lives play out. I mean our our friendship and lives played out on G.. Chat like that was a huge where we were talking to each other. When we weren't physically together on Tumbler? Ll like things. We are totally abandoned. Like Rich Archives of power we spending the day to day like what what were the things we were like laughing at and finding like inspiring or like wanting to do with ourselves like what we're all these minor inputs and like when we were writing this book going going back to the archives and like to a lesser extent. The Tumbler archives are the occasional facebook. Post was like so surreal. Because I I can't really imagine like you know my journal is all mushy feelings. That like actually are not useful or scribble to to modern me. So it's like these are the things things these like the conversations we had about like. WHO's picking up? What food items? And what time are you coming over. And do you WanNa see that movie and like what photo did I find on Tumbler that I had to re blog like these are the things that feel much more like of capturing day of that time even though it's like I don't know somewhere between clean the feelings dump of the Journal and the kind of surface level day to day that you can see in the technology record lies maybe some kind of truth about what was going on for us. I don't know it was wild. Yeah I'm going back to the Journal. Archive has been like what a mess for me. Personally I was like I have to have like therapy just because because I'm like looking at old journals triggered but it's also just thing where it's so funny to see with the hindsight of just like like okay. I Like I've gotten over that or I have really overcome like you know just being a young person or whatever. It's so interesting to like. Go back doc into this younger self and the thing that I am trying to do is instead of cringing is to just have like a lot of compassion for that. I liked. I liked her so much. It was really like this girl you know like she's like she's fine. Like life is a mess. But she's actually like she's fine. She's doing at that person. Made me this person. So that worked out. But it's so. Yeah I have a practice in my journaling where I don't name people because of I don't like I just don't want a stranger to find my journal or to read it and then it's like and Friedman's last four of her social this today Xyz. But also. Because I'm like Oh what I'm really trying to process. This is how I feel and not like who it is and so it's interesting sometimes to go back and be like Oh sometimes their initials and I know who the person is. And other times I don't know and it's just like wow. Wow like some of the stuff matters so much and it doesn't matter today but I would also put in like all sorts of dumb stuff in there at the grocery store received or like a thing. I really liked that. I ate or like a thing that you know like just like a thing. So it's been like a very fun memento for me as well as just like Ooh like is there a way not to cringe who you were when you were younger. And I think it's really unfair to cringe at yourself because that person's like becomes a different person right and like counterpoint. Like if you're not cringing a little it means you're not changing. It just means as you are like a static person which like that is more way more terrifying to me than someone like you know. Reads in the book an anecdote about something. I did or said when I was like you know a lot younger like two weeks ago and it was like wow who is she like. This is so embarrassing like that to me like the feeling of like Oh God. I can't believe that happened is at least a sign that like. Maybe I'm not. Maybe I'm not replicating. Whatever it is is making me cringe about the past? I mean this is so embarrassing is my feeling about every version of myself. That has one second older than I am at any moment. The constant state of being. You're you're embarrassed about how we opened this podcast twenty minutes ago. I'm embarrassed about everything I'm like like being alive is so embarrassing. Are you kidding. It really is news now in the background. I'm like going to facebook to be like. Is this photo of you and me at on New Year's Eve available now on hunt for it I'm like where has not been deleted from because I also it's very funny thing about memories where the reason I could tell you right away where we were at the beginning of this decade is because there. Is this photo that that I can recall. Obviously I was there as a human and I wonder a lot about like going forward not so much questions about like. Oh is it good for us to document and post our lives on the Internet but like does that power. Go Away because that photo was from a much less documented era which is why I can remember it. It's not from an era when we had like photos twenty-five photos of everything we did in every meal. We ate. Yeah you know it's memories are so interesting I got. I had a good I had a good like shot with my therapist therapist on our last therapy session for the decade shout out to people who go to therapy on December thirty one we are. It's like some people go to the gym and some people go to the gym for the head emotional jam just in there. Either I think the thing that struck by for me is how like so much of my therapy. Work is just like a working working through past trauma and a lot of the not remembering that. It's like I don't want like everything was traumatizing. And so you bury the memory. And that's how you move on because because if you don't think about it it's like it never happened but that's not a way to live life so you have to work through it and a thing that was like really good and again. This is why I'm so bullish on just being alive if I was like. Oh yeah like you can have like an okay life if you survive and so I think that just like thinking about how in like moments moments where I was very depressed or very you know like just everything was very bad much worse than it feels now that a lot of that also was was just not having the tools to deal with it. So it's not like oh my life is like better and there's less trauma and there's like you know like whatever it's just like oh no like after we'll deal without now right A.. And so things are just not as painful and they're not just as hard and they're not as so many things and so the last ten years I think for me to. It's just been like such an awareness of mental health as an important like health indicator. And I'm really grateful that I at least like I'm a community where it's something that we can talk about more and it's so much more normalized and You know access is easier. It's socks for a lot of people and it's hard but I you know I feel but like who I was ten years ago. Trying to find. A therapist is You know it's a little bit easier today. I'm not saying it's amazing but there is just so much more of an openness openness and a willingness to talk about it and that has been you know just thinking a lot about like what are the tools that takes ten years. I was like yeah like mental health. If I put that in the toolbox like everything everything needs to click into place that and that's kind of what I mean about. What's the thing going forward like not just compassion for your younger self? But you're like like like what has changed what. Give me the tools to kind of feel like I am different from this past version of myself like that is a really amazing and positive thing that I wanna keep doing right like. It's not just like Oh when we wrote these early chapters of the book about the beginnings of our friendship. We did a lot of like who are these girls conversation. Asia who are these fools which way and some of some of the narrative we ultimately came up with it has has to do with like how were we kind of so suited to immediately become such good friends like which is belongs in the context of the book. And I'll leave it there for everyone who who is going to read it but I think that the other layer of that was like oh like you know what trying to answer that question a little more. Broadly in a way like I really. Maybe I have for high school a little bit. Because it's such a mythologised time I been like Oh like you know I was Xyz type in high school but really like your adulthood does not lend itself to such easy pronouncements about like. Oh yes like. We were the girls who did X.. In our twenties right. That's the kind of thing that you don't really do. If you're you're not forced to reflect on it and well. I don't think we have like clear answers. I do think that lake creating a narrative about that time in our lives like allowed me to kind of you've see some things about myself like for example you were saying earlier moving constantly because recession because our twenties it's like when I moved to DC. I had it was my third city in two years a year and a half off. Yeah and and I didn't WanNa live there. I didn't want to leave San Francisco. Which is where I was coming? I'm from and like the I don't know I think there were maybe two and a half three years in DC. Before I met you where I I was like honestly the grumpiest person like when I was like really reflecting on like how like that period of time I spent there like I was saying earlier my aspect. I loved about you and for the most lovable right but my narrative of self of my twenties was not lovable grump. That's like my teen narrative and now I'm like what if find out. What if I'm a lovable grumpy now? What if that's just who I am forever and I can only see it but yeah but I had like some new perspective on like I do? I moved to. DC with a bad attitude. I know I did but like having to kind of write it out and be like Oh and then of course. I wasn't happy when I got there like you know. And you can't you can't wave a wand and be like attitude adjustment. That's not how it works. That's not how it works but now I'm just like Oh right like there's a reason that move was harder than other moves. I made because I had really told myself that it was GONNA be bad like I was really like in a mindset. Where honestly like I feel like until I met you I was? It's like Oh a thing. The city has given me like something that has come out of this that is like so objectively good. I can't hate this experience anymore. Even so I had all already before that net people who I really loved and still love to this day there was something about like being able to reflect on my I own mental shift and also like what if I had just moved and been like you know what this is a city like lots of cities. There are good things and bad things about living. Here there are people. I'M GONNA WANNA be friends with and there's people I am not going to be compatible with like what if I had just had a more or less less like unless like day to day upbeat upbeat log. large-scale grumpy attitude like that's my secret is I'm like. ICM Happy in the moment to moment and then like when you peel below. You're like she is grumpy right like it's that do you are. You are definitely grumpy. But it's also way I don't know I like. I love grumpy women I like. It's truly it's one of the like it's one of the most attractive qualities to me and a lady friend which is like how. How like uncomfortably like unhappy are are you and then let's dive in you know? I think I think that some of that is so much of it is seeing your own kind of self reflected in someone else right. So like grumpy is not even the word that I would use. But I think that seeing someone who is just There's something very clarifying about meeting someone for the first time and you immediately understand that they are not in a circumstance they would like but you were both making the best out of it and maybe like together you can get out of it. That is how you communicate that to someone immediately or that it's like I don't know how that happens. I guess it's like Kismet. A friendship almost but there is just us something about like. Sometimes it really take seeing it in someone else to recognize that because I had a bad attitude and it was really grumpy and I was really. I just like you know when I was like. I'm not making any headway way. And I'm like nobody wants to be my friend. Just such an asshole and Blah Blah Blah and. Then you just like see someone else where you're like okay. This person has less of an asshole than me like this is what I want. So let's try that and it's fine. Oh my God. This person is less of an asshole than me. Such an amazing I hearing you say that it reminds me of the of the kind of principle that I have experienced firsthand. And when you're living in a multi roommate situation and you become very close to one roommate remade because you're a united against another remain who's like leaves the kitchen dirty or who is like difficult to deal with the principle of like we have a common enemy is sort of of like the foundation of I mean even though de was not are like enemy like recognizing that grumpiness. I feel like it's kind of like okay like we are bonded by a negative thing and you know Oh and I am obviously happy that we found a way to bond like thinking about like the future. I'm like wow wouldn't it be great if I like did not make any more friendships. That's founded it in like better founded in a mutual dislike of something like maybe wouldn't it be amazing if I was you know all about it. No I mean I don't I'm I'm for myself at least I don't agree with that. Roommate analogy But like your point stands I think. Have you ever had that experience. I've only had in all of my ears roommates. A two bad experiences one of them was living with just one person it was like in the dorm. She was awful but also like I'm sure that she is telling someone right. Now that I am awful and I think that we're both correct. Yeah that's fine. I'm like that one. I'm just going to chalk up to the game and in the other room mate situation that I was in it was a three person situation and I was definitely the person that they ganged up against. They were awful. I was medium awful so I'm sure that they're telling people that I was awful to and it's fine like you know what I mean. It's like if somebody confronted me about. I would would be like no you're correct. It was bad so yeah but I. I'm not just saying it's a powerful bonding tool. That's all powerful bonding tool but I like all of this. That's just fascinating thing is that I think that everyone has their own internal barometer. Basically for what they're looking for and what they want and it is truly the experience of like writing this book with you. All I can think about is like wow how in the world like beyond like kindergarten where they force you to do people just like decide that they're going to be friends. The entire process is is just wild to me. And I'm like it just happens. Some of circumstantial evidence choice some of his whatever but a lot of it too. I think felt like looking back on the like on the new. Do in the in the full the full scope of our friendship. A lot of it has obviously like in those Dan moments that you were talking about but so much of it is also just like looking back at the end of the year and be like okay. We're still oh here. You know what I mean. And you're like great like all of those small things out to a bigger moment and we're still here like I obviously like at the beginning of our friendship. If you're like let's refund for ten years I I would have said like yes immediately but I think that now that it's been ten years I'm like Oh yeah. Ten years is a long time. It's also not a longtime depending on how you're looking at your life but also and how long we'll both live which we don't have any info. Yeah right depending on how long you live depending on how you feel about time depending on so many things but also I was like some of it was like you know some of it went by really I like some of it was also like how long and like wow. We're still here And that I think You know again. I'm like this is the mystery of humans because I think that we both arrived to that place very differently. And that's what's like very exciting and terrifying about it. Yeah I mean I guess I don't know I mean I you know not to not to make everything you know about like a plug for the book where it ends up but I think there is a lease. Make everything a plug. Oh the book we need to sell a lot of. I can pay my rent. Thank you but I do think that this idea of like you. Don't you don't have to like you don't have to agree the on like weather. It's easier to make friends if you're united in a common enemy. You don't even have to agree on the narrative of what made your friendship. Click in the beginning. Like it's all you have have to do is be still there like you know really. It's sort of how I actually don't know who to quote it too but like there's a thing that like Mary people always say that's like the way to stay married is just not get divorced. Have you heard this. I mean yeah probably like some Christian person somewhere one hundred percent a hundred percent like that is anyway I think for being friends. I actually think I read it most recently in the New Yorker magazine like anyway. I'm just saying it's like not only Christians who say that but yes same principle for being friends is like you know you just you just have to still be there like even if you don't even if it's not amazing that what day even if it's you don't share the same version of events. The only way to stay friends is to just stay friends. I know that's like a sticker that we probably didn't have to write a whole book to say but I'm like that is that is the like ten year narrative that you that's the only part of our narrative that we really really have to one hundred percent agree to complicate and too complicated a little little bit right. It's not like Oh like stand toxic relationships or stay with people that you don't like or whatever it's like if it's bad it's bad like everyone agrees to that but I think that there is just I always had up the slack very intense Naive feeling that Every other kind of relationship is hard like it's hard with my family. It's hard with my romantic partners but with my friends it's always easy and the last ten years has been like very eye opening there. It's like oh no to like make a life with people is just hard right and and It doesn't matter how you are related to them. If you choose people and you save a barrier tribe and you want to stick it out with them Vasha is hard so Yes but also. I'm really glad that I learned that lesson in this decade. And because you don't want like if I like didn't learn this if I hadn't learned this this decade the next ten years would be incredibly painful and hard so now I'm like okay. I know it's going to be a tiny bit less hard because I know now I have the tools have some of the tools it's I don't know there is just. I'm like a you know me. I like love self help but I don't want to look like self help and You know and there's something like incredibly cheesy or whatever about it but at the same time like you know realizing things about yourself is very beautiful and learning something about yourself and being able to do things about patterns that you have or things that you're trying to break out of or just like generally the project self-improvement Can Be very beautiful thing for a person and I'm really happy that the right and also I mean that that very much speaks to the like what is what is the energy you want to carry forward right like. It's it's I was thinking about. How how a friend of mine? Who is an artist? Someone gave her an exercise to do that. was like about her all of her creative work and it was basically weekly just this like what do you want to turn the volume up on. What do you want to turn the volume down on like what do you WanNa do not like? Oh my God. I'm going to accomplish this list of things but like what do you want to do a little little bit more of the next year five years decade. However you're defining and what do you want to do less of and then it's relative and I really like I've been thinking about that? A Lot. both after this reflective process of thinking about the last ten years of our lives and like being realistic about like how much can a human being snap. Their fingers didn't change and like what does awareness really do the idea of like okay. Actually I want a little bit more understanding and a little bit more like day to day. Acceptance of the fact act like being in long term intimate family relationships be they chosen or biological or of origin or whatever. That is the thing that I'm going to have to turn the dial up on certain things and turn the dial down on certain things if I want to stay in them like basically like that. A relative marker yeah same heart same agree so yeah. I don't know I mean it's not. It's not quite as practical as Sabrina. 's like you know. Use your birthday as a personal inventory every three month but like dial up dial down is the only end of year reflection thing. I am doing the thing that I love about. Both of those things is that it's just also the truth of like. How can you be about our person is figure out what works for you? There's not like one size fits all advice for people which is why advice is given by charlatans on. I think that like you get a lot of input about what you should be doing. But again you have to like make it work and the thing that I have really. I've been really struck doc by in both like our writing this book and all the people that were talking to in all the conversations I'm having about friendship and all these things is just like realizing that like you and I've always known that so. This is not a realization but a very solid and knowing that there is nothing extraordinary about story we are the two most like ordinary kind of friend pair got you can have and a lot of people that we talked to you at least that. Listen to this show or that we interact with our work. A Lotta Times are younger than us. And I and I think that and it's something that we've said before but the thing that like I'm so is so fun of mine for me and I'm so struck by all the time is all we have on. You were a little bit older than you so like you have to go through all the motions you have to go through the motions of being alive and also there is nothing special about like all of the dynamics that we have are dynamics that other other people have oliver problems that we have our problems. Other people have all of their like laughs that we have are lots of other people. Have that makes me feel awesome. I was like thank you like. We are like we. We are only ordinary people like this is all of this is so pedestrian in a way that makes you feel really happy to be alive. I think that's true and but also to kind of like not to use the tenure in your modality again. But I've been thinking a lot about like the orientation. I have toured a lot of my friends who are like ten years older than me. I can't help but be a fan a little bit like you know what I mean. There is this sense of like you know you're totally right when you're like. Oh we've just been alive longer than certain people right like but also that that is worth something something and I think that like the kinds of people that I choose to surround myself with are often people who are trying to grow and change and get better and so therefore they have ten years on on me like I have no choice but to stand you know what I mean. I'm like working on this an extra decade and I really lately have found myself in my friendships with women in particular who for about ten years older than me give or take. I am just like Chin on my hands hanging on every word like. Tell me everything I have that same attitude that you were you were talking about. And it's not because I think that they are doing life uniquely well or that they are like some outliers. It's actually because I feel so that they are just like a little bit deeper into this thing and therefore have gained a little bit more knowledge and I want I want to soak it up as much as I can and so. I don't think you're totally right. Like we're average. We're average humans but like there is still something about like average humans as time passes. I mean this is why so many cultures venerate elders for example. Like not one hundred percent. Not like your perfect. Because you've been around a long time but like if you've been working for an extra ten years on me like I want to know what you've learned through that work a white woman talking about elder worship what a moment for me Ancestor officer worship. Bring it back to be clear. I did not use the word worship. That's a Catholic trigger for me. I don't do that but uh no I. I completely agree with you. I think that's true. Anything set like a lot of that. Also is just reframing right from a place where here like like this the person let's ten years older than me they have what I want as opposed to saying. Oh like how do I like. What are the steps that makes them get there and a lot of time? That step is time and instead of like looking at them as something that you need to have right away. It's really reframing and saying like okay when I have as much when I'm alive for as long as this person here's is where I would like to be and I think that that is an entirely different conversation. It's funny now to be the age where I think for a long time. I was always the younger friend and now I realize that I'm the older everywhere I go because I never asked people ages I. It's like the same way that I don't like to remember things. I think that everybody is exactly thirty. Four because they were born April eight nine thousand eight uh-huh and so everybody in my life is my same age and now everyone you know it's like every once in a while people will like carbon date themselves and I'm like wait. How old older you and I'm realizing that I you know like there are a lot of friends that are in the? I'm the friend that has ten years older and even like knowing that has been so. Oh clarifying I'm like Oh this is what is going on here like I did not realize that and now I know but it is both. It's awesome to be the younger friend and to be the older friend so I'm really. Are we happy. It's still have both of those experiences. But a shout out to the older friends because my old like my older friends like really put up with a Lotta Shit from me for being my friend that was going to say. That's how you know that a decade really is personal time like there is no collective decade because like you talk to someone who is outside of striking distance of your own age. Who's WHO's a lot younger or older and you're like what was your decade like and it's like Whoa? This is the only way to judge this as personally you know what I mean like you. What do you mean you don't know what may be? Can you know what are you talking about so I have this like awesome moment with a younger friend recently where we were talking about something about women in sports or whatever and Oh and there was like a meme and someone shared a picture of brand new trust saying the the soccer player who in the iconic like one of the most iconic Hanoch Nineties display of women strength when she likes scored and she's like took her shirt off and she was wearing A Sports Bra and it was like we've never seen this before but and and this person didn't know who that was and in this and in this moment everyone tried to shame them and it was like this is so stupid first of all like sports is also EPHEMERA. Relax but that was such a it. This is all unsecured us. Wherever you for me to tell you that I was like that was like a moment for me where I was like? Oh I am older. The person like we do not share the same memories and that was like such A. It's like I can't stop thinking about it and now realizing like all of the same all of the same people who have had to do that for me because I was the person who also like didn't know it was always embarrassed about asking so Time it's so weird because I remember that memory like it was yesterday but it was in fact not yesterday I was not even like fifteen when that happens. So it's a lot right. Everybody's everybody's time is different. We are almost out of time. But I'm just like remembering because we've been we've been talking about. The book is like I forget what moment of the writing process we were at but like you had the iconic observation that you know that Donald Glover gift when he shows up at the House with the pizzas and opens the door and like the whole room is on fire when he thinks thinks he's just GonNa sit and have a pizza and like Oh my God like everything is burning down. You Astutely observed that that is what adult life is. And so I just like I feel like I want to just inject jacked that energy a little bit in to talk of growth and change in plans. No you know actually. The house is always burning down. Like we're just doing the beginning wing of time just trying to protect the pizza pizza the pizza of adult way. Oh my gosh well I love love you a lot. I'm literally GonNa see you. Socio imminently eminently. I think it remains the first person I see in the New Year of my friends. I don't live in New York so I'm excited about thought what I'll see you for the next ten or see you for the next decade on different corners of the Internet. Probably let's be real. I'll see you on Al Gore's Internet I'll see beyond beyond saints Internet. I'll see you on the tick Tock Kid Internet. Everyone's Internet I got you. You can find us many places on the Internet several DOT DOT COM apple podcast spotify. Stitcher were all your favorite platforms subscribe rate review. You can call us back. You can leave a voicemail seven in one four six eight one nine four seven one four points Weijia move you can email us call why. Rg At our theme song by Robin Original Music. Close by Carolyn Curry our logo. So make sure we're on instagram. Twitter Hallway. Rg our associate producer. Ready Sir is Jordan. PODCAST is produced by
Rogue Talk Radio with guests Carl Johnson and James Annitto -Duo Daemonologie
"Long talk radio Everyone here at the rift radio network. We'd like to welcome you to tonight's special broadcast. This work is protected by creative commons license. And now a word from our sponsors Run start virginia. This fall to experience the creepiest place around. Take part and the ghost tours produced by marty cbo and the residents of ticket prices ranged from eight to thirteen dollars. Bribe group are available. Learn more and investigate details of mary baldwin from the mary baldwin college. The old western state mental asylum and much more for tour times ticket prices end dates visit their website at www dot ghost of stock dot com or call five zero four eight two seven four three available tour dates are limited at fast. Make sure to secure your reservations for this fall season. Get out of the house and become a part of history. The ghost of starting tours only in virginia's noah valley cdc guidelines are followed and for questions. Please visit www dot ghost of dot com or call five four zero four four eight two seven four three well getting the everybody and welcome to robe. Talk radio on the rift radio network. I'm sheila gay. And i'm here with my co host kirby debris hey curbs. What's going down. Yeah lolo oh whole lot. Just the usual stuff stuffed enjoying this finally winter day. Yes we we really did get a cool. Cool zone hit After thanksgiving thanksgiving was pretty. Nice i mean this year is all been not such a bad summer here in texas or paris anyway and pretty good pretty good winter so far probably gonna get real cold though the freezing nights already last night and tonight so interesting how you just never know how texas weather's going just saying I sent the message to our guest tonight. I have a carl johnson. And james neto. They're both amazing investigators and demon knowledge. Just and i've known james for many many years we've investigated together here. He came to texas He lives in rhode island. I do believe so. They're really nice people. And and then carl courses been in this such a long time He was at that My braids gonna shut off on the name of the house that ed and lorraine warren investigated and i will ask him when they come on. 'cause my memories hot mess of just getting all. That's the way it happens people. But i'm so excited to have them on tonight. They're always a great guests and they do a lot of speaking engagements and so that's totally totally cool next week. Of course we're gonna have on april ronin. She'll do a medium ship psychic readings for anyone as many as she can get in and the two hours that call in to the number. And i'll be posted out there for everybody Next week so she's amazing as well but we have some of the best guess on here and we already have somebody in the chat room. So i'm gonna say hello that's me. Hello typing typing. Just like that curbs. I could talk and by not very well. That's the same guy. Five really excited about these two coming on th they you know. It's hard because right when they started to make this niche for themselves of course cove it hit so speaking engagements are cancelled and things like that but there so interesting together. James started At such a young age and and karl A he he did as well. But karl's older than james so they one house of even more experience than the other and i'm really excited about that. I'm gonna go ahead and bring james on see what he's got the same james of nato my bro- son what's up. Hey i'm doing good. How about yourself doing good. I'm here with my kirby you know. He's he's the guy. Hey kirby hey. I also got karl malone. He's in the same room. Carl's here too seriously. You just like hang out together all the time. That's so amazing. Yeah yes we do we. Actually we have meals together. We traveled together. Confide i'm sorry. I know james cheesy carl. I just hang together. That's all part. We don't do those things. Well james in the new phase. So i i've left this new phase. Yes yes we had a great time together many. You just fun fun fun. Person a funny person a sincere. This is what i know about james anita That'd be in real. you are funny to. I'm just saying. I think you have great humor. Yeah you so. How are you do do in tonight. I'm so excited to have you on the show. Both of you get both together. That's have been pretty good car. Woke me up sleeping on the couch when you walked in we were going to have dinner together like keep together and my sister turned down. Her car wouldn't start yesterday so she called me up and she needed a ride. So i brought it into work. And i got here and Five of nine. And i said oh we got plenty. There's this good it's working. I mean i. I actually was inside the house and five of nine and james is being real quiet. And he's around. The james jesuit gonna show jake games are friends james. I couldn't wake him up I saw him breathing. I wasn't concerned. I could not wake him. And i and i forget i'll have to go for broken. I shook his leg. He didn't wake up. James graves and looked you know. But we're gonna now you're gonna. Oh yeah. I know lingering at delivering in this room. Yeah and terrific. Rain and windstorm. So i had to drive for that but it's finally letting up. The last few miles is better that that's pretty. That's i'm doing your wife's amazing though we are here together. You know i i was. I'm proud of you. I mean that's that's hard to do but we don't have a lot of rain going down here in texas right now. It's cold but not a lot of those gets older and regions. Yeah yeah this has been colder year. Carl it's been really unusual. Oh all right off and on here. It's now it's like it gets up to the mid to i mean Low to mid fifties it. Spend the last few days but we got the minute with sunny yesterday. The beautiful day cemetery exploring with a policy. But now you know it just. It was so windy. It's blown open doors if they're not shut all the way. Yeah and i hadn't turn around the windshield wipers. Like max yep and had to have to watch out for puddles which are like a foot deep and some places and so yeah here so there wasn't so treacherous af appreciate that i'm not talking to your spirit either although we have had served brick it every now and then we don't we don't even on your show Well we've got it. We weren't we're not. We know you can never be absolutely positive but there was some. We've had a couple of times when they're especially when psychics are on really strange stuff starts happening on here. We just never know so with the background. That you two had. Who knows what's going on Yeah if you if if you hear growling is it's not a kid could tell me not jamie about it now. Now you're alert. are you awake. Are you sleep talking. What's going down here kind of in the middle radio shows like you wanted to do radio. Do radio yeah. W. from wwl's here w. when sock in rhode island we read you the greatest paranormal stories of you have ever or perhaps whenever wants to find about that i understand that paranormal enthusiasts. Actually you're a deacon. None of those things mix. I mean man you are. The switchboard is lightning up. People wanna know how. How do you do. that's my radio. I always go good evening. Everybody this is the This is rogue talk radio from the rift radio network. And then i go into crazy sheila voice. Yeah well well. Somebody's got to jesse james already. Those numbers go see. How gotta like me. I'm just saying this crazy comedian. So aren't you have be both good people. I never liked her longview he. He's a quiet man we're making cryptic them. Yeah he's quiet he's been filmed and that's always blurry and grainy but he's been thrilling than most people. Most people believe they accept his existence Some people don't you know. But there's you know not incontrovertible but there is some suggestive evidence that there is scurvy seen in bush's very is see. He larry me a lot up and he knows that. I the humor kirby i do i. I don't even know i don't know ten minutes ago. James was fast asleep fairly true whether fifty minutes ago i was driving rain storm but like i said it. Yeah well you're both safe and in the same room so anything can happen now real awhile today with scheduling and all that and the weather at my desk so you have an informed that we are what the lay would call de manala. Just you do not. I do know that. I do well the way in a way. Although the way. James spells it Yeah throwing for the was like seventeen parlors you know. Yeah yeah my husband went. What is that word. That just makes me laugh. 'cause i'm like that's james word. It's a real word. But i mean he very thought deep lewis lexicon. There was a home lexicon this game. Yes you must learn it so i knew when i saw it i thought oh he changed it pretty much. Well i think james james did before security. Well i think example of james talk james game he said. Hey thanks james. James he said king james james before i did. You know that that's james there. Yeah it's only the dido he's giving credit where credit's due right. James sure did man. What are the guy in history. So yeah i can't i can't discredit him. You've that's awesome so so tell me what's going on. You guys are down in lockdown with all this All this going on with kobe or are you getting a live. What's going we still sit around is just as the lavar. Our stream of events have been postponed or canceled. We were going to have a busy december but not quite so much now and you know we still we still. We still do a lot of cases but not physically right now. We do a lotta concentration phone or through email so still busy in some form of fashion you know some of the events that had booked virtual so that was pretty interesting. yeah Well yeah we're still always busy. Tend to be. Yeah we get out sometime we have. We're considering all the restrictions. We're pretty active. And now you know. It's increased of course with the winter holidays. No no hibernation hibernate. we'll be. We'll stop shaving virtual well. I think that's really amazing. All the way around. I mean i hate that. Everything got canceled but that there are these new venues ways for you to help. People is great. Because i i would say we are team. Just had never dealt with a demon case and we wouldn't because we're not deeming all just so we would have to hand that over to someone else. I yeah what would you know. No consultation no. Of course you know. We're more to into being consulted. And it's it's tough to give advice to somebody and spiritual matters when you're not looking at under the looking into the i kind of feeling them out so we can go on what they tell us. Yeah but you know a lot of the stories you know aren't necessarily the same either but you know of course because every person is different you know so but sometimes very woven things within their story or characteristics of forms of how they interpreted that no can lead us towards dissecting what's going on but like karl said it's hard not physically being there but you know thankfully some people can be Their crisis can be diverted from By talking to them and if they're talking about demon sometimes our best thing we can do to say. It doesn't sound like a demon so we can always disqualify that subject and you know keep going from there interesting so with with the cases that you deal with. Do you know when you walk in. You know from what they told you or. Do you feel when you come to the location. I mean how how that work. What are those. What are the kind of criteria. Or what are you looking at mean. You're trained for this. And i'm being real. Our team is not trained for that. And we don't we choose not to be. I think that's silly to think you can do something like that. I mean i really think it's dangerous as well for our clients for several games. Yeah and yeah as far as creek here. There is a standard criteria. The things we look for. But we're also dealing with individuals and individual basis and it's You're only as good as your last case. So we really don't know that we always have that trepidation. That element of the unexpected. And we don't know what we're going to run into so that's kind of Hairy in theory you know. There's there's an apprehension we always feel and i. I don't think we'd be affected. But we didn't have that level of apprehension. 'cause you know you really have to be on guard but situations are fascinating as well as intimidating You you don't know a minute minute. That's not sure james. I know james has had this experience. 'cause i know what he's told me When you're up against somebody that's going under a fit Of what you say possession and you don't know what they're going to spring it you don't know if they're gonna jump out a window know you know what they're gonna come out with for you. Don't even know if you can help them. But you just have to proceed. And i find what's effective is. Of course there's preparation Some people incorporate fasting. I'm not as good as fast now but you know prayerful preparation and a self resolution that you're there for forthright purposing. You're not going to be driven out because you driven out there's not going to instill confidence in the people. You're trying to help Just decide whatever happens. You're going to stick with it. And you act without authority. What i did in my first demonic situation. I i on case providence rhode island a lot of years ago I was saying. I know why i'm here. I don't belong here. What are these people. Expect from the but and the subject was a fourteen year old boy and that was a really freaky situation. So what i did was. I acted i. Walk up to him and put these boy when he was under his possession which was genuine. I'm sure i put my hand on his shoulder. And i looked in the eye and i said stop stop. I don't know why what possessed me to do that. I don't know why. I thought about it the moment when i was painting that confidence. I didn't really feel because i hadn't had didn't have time to cogitate on it so that was effective So you know you you put yourself out there And then intellectualize later. Yeah yeah definitely take weeks For you to actually case to understand everything that's going on to determine but you know. I don't think carl i never really truly conclude for what we deal with. We have ninety or maybe an opinion or Or a group opinion What we could have dealt with. It's hard to like you say to put something in tastes the demonic when there's just so many things look at you know most cases that we've dealt with where people we're we can quantify that they had some form of possession through this demonic force. There was always trauma and always so. So there's so some some imbalanced you'd have to figure that out fine that out the dissect investigate There's so much to it. But the one thing i say to people and i don't you know you know go by title human manala just. I don't call myself. Declare sentient clear audience clairvoyant. I don't i'm not. I don't say i'm like museum. I don't i believe some pe- everybody has in some form of fashion intuition. Whatever you wanna call it but I think a lot of times that i've dealt with those cases and you know i can count them on one hand And fifteen years. And i believe carl same about the same for forty ratio having spread out. Yeah they're rare situations. What i've always told In all those cases there was a severe offsite fright or flight Situation at hand. Like as soon as i walked on that property even though i had a little corporation of or understanding what could possibly be going on in the south. I've always tried to be individual morsels later on in my life Even though. I'm still young doing this that i've always tried to find it. I always try to go in there with a perspective or an idea. His notion what's going on. But every time i've ever truly dealt with a true demonic case In my opinion and of course in some psychotherapy therapy therapeutic belief as well. Because you know heads some kind of therapists involved You know those those situations fight feifer like came into play in that over emotion on that dreadfulness of being their feelings getting punched in the soul place over and over again. Repeatedly like you're gonna be sick. Those same happened in most cases and only those cases. So i think that's Things lean towards as well for myself. Yeah so this what. We consider a human generated. Don't even make it scare. You know again apprehensive. Emotion giving you don't really feel like you're onto water you know and trust your own around you. Which is this decision. We experienced the demonic con- you know there is a difference. It's a sense. it's it's subjective. it's hard to put it into words but when you're into it you know just like you. Just this is not right. Something's up here. This feels fresher and sickening. You get nausea but not. It doesn't feel like you're coming down with a cold or any feels like i don't belong here and that's phone that case i was talking about. Although it was a jew judicata as being authentically demonic. And people would ask me. Boy was that is you had a demonic. I said well certainly seemed like it. Because you know then it's very difficult to quantify and you don't know it's more about origins than than manifestations other time same story to is like the always told me to deliver on that story a little bit is what other case that you've are part of that you felt like you wanted to jump out the window. You know the only time. I felt so sometimes i felt like i wanted to run out the door. Yeah yeah but It was a time that i was taken over. Kinda feel with. This boy wouldn't mailing Because we were pushing this entity out. We had to treat it like like a real dealer. That was the only approach we could say. The evaluations comes before and then afterwards But while we were in there with this expulsion procedure you know it was all hands on and at one point to my complete sobriety my astonishment i felt like i was being taken over and i'm not subject to suggestion that much. I'm afforded nonoc subject and Alderson i this and i do mean subtly felt this on russia. That was alien was fine. I felt frayed and anger like tendency. The violence i said what is this. It was like a drunk and Something was telling me and it was almost an irresistible impulse. I lived at the window. Come about jump off that window and well. I concentrated on my own sense of self. I'm carl you know. I'm not gonna be taken over by this probably great at the time. I just remember concert and concentrating on where i was. My state of being. And as i did that i was asserting marcel dating my ground and i felt this thing. Cloudy in the back of my head actually. It was like fingers vacuum effect. With and also i was over that on russia chaotic emotion but within that same split-second that creature entity seemed to go into a young lady in the next rumor was part of the team assisting this young lady twenty three years old i think She wasn't experience much for these things and she fell to the floor and started pulling out her hair and handful and screaming shrieking more the but that was the interest in it it went automate. Felt depart from me and it seems to go into her. She was a room away. And i went over to help. For all horrendous manifestations there it was a successful procedure we succeeded in drag. This thing out of the board and i didn't know they succeeded. I didn't expect it to wow so with that. That is mean that is just crazy. So do you think the average the paranormal investigator would realize something is different about a location. I know we do the questionnaire prior to no. We can't where we don't wanna get we. We want someone to get rid of it but we don't wait up going to affect the family like that. Try to take that on. That's out of our wheelhouse. But i feel like we would probably know it with all the investigations. We've done we've known some come across some negative energies. That wanted to present like that. But i got none of that like i didn't get sick. I didn't but they were really angry that we were even there. That's a whole nother situation. It's frightening as well but they don't attack us in any way of normal yeah demonic I think for a lot of teams that would unless they had played right but remember. It's rare so loud teams won't ever come across some places like they're voting mixed diagnose the case to be demonise not but I think that people to forget even know the sense of Urgency this the. The sense of fear comes on to you There are also very manipulative than you know. And they at times can Manage task you're perceived to be something different than what it is To us you know. So a lot of teams might not know what they're dealing with and Shrug it off but a lot of the times that if you if you really observe it Kind of mutual That you'll you'll see the little things that happened you know like the if there is a manifestation of an apparition there's always going to be some bigger with mac version there are certain things within Their disappearances phenomena that occur where you'll be able to try to steer that ship a little bit but too many people jump to that conclusion Within one investigation within two investigations because they got f you war some evil guttering laugh on p. You can't determine something be demonic with our. fortunately a lot of times misdiagnosed. Jump the gun. Now here with the man said he's talking about disfigurement. I believe he's talking about what it's an apparition of being. What actually appears rare does happen. In fact i was. He can do a lady She was consulted last evening about manifestations she saw a physical well it looks physical being and he says is they. Don't perfectly replicate the human form for some reason. They turn into something so they might have animal attributes or they might be distorted. Figured look like desiccated corpse there's always something wrong. It's not somebody you'd sit next to on the bus. You know even if he out his mascot normal looking. There's something it's it's a. There's some rule that they can't or an inability to perfectly replicate the human form like like an anthropomorphic person. They're always weird looking and that's why they got such a bad reputation these demons because when they're seeing you don't wanna going again and i have talked to. I don't know how many people perhaps it doesn't by. Now who have actually seen a demon. And i can't show you now probably could send it to I have a picture of what. I believe to be a demon demonic visit rare when there seemed even more just to get even more rare when they're photographed but they have been photographed in. I have one of those few photographs. And what would you. How would you describe you not to wholesome looking. It's definitely not you know it's Of course people wanna see that photo there is up to show that vote else We have podcast every well. We do our best to have every thursday. But this is the new shows Run her youtube. You can watch one spirit for talking and then another one but Yeah we display that and we can also of course display it in After this as well on her arm page so people can see. It's a very interesting. you know you. We had nick. Ross on actually showed. Nick rob us right nick. Ross on because after conjuring special and the first thing he thought about it as well you it is. She felt sickening feeling. I guess some people could get that but you definitely feel uneasy looking at day. there's there's something so serving about it. Distorted any evil looking at some it it seats into your soul making penetrates. I call it joke arrest. kinda looks like the batman joker. Yeah mouth like the mouth proportion you know how is so different. Compared to like a human make a python will get your jaws to swallow animals right. That's what it looks like a student as a distended jaw tongue t you can see some didn't visit the isles eiser. What's most disturbing. The nostrils or arched shriveled has reptilian is A nasty looking creature. Yeah i would definitely say the is something that is significant because one of the things that most people don't understand when it comes to somebody that is under for a possession No being afflicted by this demonic force. It's gone to the stage one of the things that always been. Even i guess in some trench channeling state people have gone into and cer- certain situations but we're still demonic realm when they're under this rage or this possession No there is yeah are are so penetrating. Like they're not looking at you but they're looking through you and that's why it's not looking at you. Slipping through their category. Yeah let's criteria for demonic on us. The answer is seen or the person is possessed. They're looking right for you. Oh yeah you know. You're like they know they know us through. Oh yeah it's a scary feeling because know there. There is don't necessarily stay transfixed on you like like you're definitely they've been seeping into your soul you know. Yeah that's totally creepy. James was creepy subject. Yes it is a creepy subject. And i am very happy that it's rare. Thank you what what do you feel how. How did they even make their choices to they're going to. Is there a of that person at that time or for that matter or they've opened something by you know we've got these people that ask was question you answered it. Brought some reason. They contend to trade Excuse chewing on. Chocolate's my brought trumpet nuggets over which is standard for our our our interviews talks. We always have to have these chocolates and drama for your dinner. Sorry level going. There has to be some invitation. Now that doesn't mean that somebody going into a spirit board or match ritual and says you know you will appear before me was That invitation with psychological weakness. Like if somebody has james was saying Seriously unresolved conflict or trauma some bugaboo and we all have some cobwebs. But somebody's got a real stress point trying to deal with the demon will take advantage of that at that time now. There should be rules against this. But apparently there are if there was emotional imbalance in mental illness dean construction and they get a foothold that where so many call forth the demon without even meaning to yeah and then some of our research you know and carl has been kind of line to is like was would the demotic exist without human psyche so in the same spectrum is you know are really the ones that beckon the call basically like Do our problems create this force. Come forth to us Because got to remember. These things are evil. Record these to the evil within these the odyssey's of good versus evil. And so you know if you are in a negative call set. Emotional stress inscrutable zaidi. You know especially if you're dabbling this field and you come across something. Maybe that was conjured or Or dunk ritual in your in your poking around at this place and somehow this entity is still lingering there who knows why it's still lingering there it's you know Control to be there but you know it could snap onto you and say okay. This person's of point mind you follow them but also interesting within crawls research and some of the research that i've done to is even beyond the spectrum like angels versus demons and are are these forces that the human mind have kind of career and some spectrum as well we're at follows all the characteristics and it follows the bilo what we think in in both war meant but they comes to fruition by the human psyche. We're just an interesting. You know i'm not saying that. You know it will follow the pattern of expected to be. Yeah but maybe originated somewhere in the murky recesses of our own minds that would explain why they seem to know a lot of us if the demon comes over and rose conscious. It's gonna have it's to know all our weak points to know what to call off. Do you mean everybody thinks the demon has more power than does the. Then they're strong they don't get rum's not like you should go play patty cake with a demon and expect it to be all right in the spectrum of things too is limited and like they can't tell the future they can't have practice prerequisite Creek united nations. Thank you and so pretty good with your free in your car. Yeah arthri right well. So but in that same form is that they're limited in what they can do. They're not all powerful. Like most people think people think invading the officer. You know there's all over can't do anything. Yeah what about the other side. The angel angel is also a celestial being. that's good yeah there's also created being and Never want humid forums to what we know. They have some power to People don't think of invoking the angel so much Adrian do angels appear to people differently if there was a time. When i was diagnosed with leukemia and i had been through open heart surgery and i just didn't want to even go on anymore. I just was laying in bed crying. I wasn't going to fight them with me. I was giving in and there was. It sounds really strange. Like i've lost my mind but there were three images that were glowing the end of my bed. There were speaking to me in my mind. Because i was in such a down place. I was just ready to give up. I mean it just didn't feel like i. I could fight another battle at what i heard them say was. This is not your time. This is just your journey. But they were glowing. I thought i was losing my ever loving mind. I'm like what that belief or these things but it was so peaceful. And you. And i got i was just that was it. I was fighting it. You know about. They just gave me the strength. I need. I've not giving up. And i'm i'm in remission today so i i don't know those were all i can explain. They felt like i was like pure love. I don't even know it was beautiful. It's truly and golic does not. Yeah they sound yelich. Yeah it's a question too is they. Do angels Inform your differently people. I have to say yes you know. I know people that supposedly talking angels. Who have had experiences until i had jelly experience Do i do think in some form. They do appear In what you perceive them to be. Just in the same way maybe a demonic would as well because i used pop culture for reference sometimes because it we could carl nyc get into the nitty gritty of the -nology And it could get very boring for some people because there's how indepth gets and there's so much research literature to it but yeah there was a movie that has something to deal with international being At name moved to call it and one thing that is does is with that movie is he. Plays upon their fears and manifest in ways. What they fear so in the same form as in jealous need the appearance you as the it could appear to like maybe stoic manly or More feminine is dependent on the person's perception The way that they can relate then jelly for off. It's just life or a loving embrace. But i think gets the same form with the demonic as well. You both standard is they might Manage something more A tune to what you fear or what could it could do. Assess you and sometimes. That's a loving embrace to sometimes i could be an appearance of a loved one and that's where of course that's where the disfigurements are in place. But yeah so Yeah the beans. Celestial beings condemning appear to you many different forms wanting that we can say definitively And that has changed since Angels and demons and other Dt's in inhuman entities have been documented is. Most of these beings never had a physical body. they're they're pure spiritual form pure spirit so of course how they pure to to an individual could be different in many forms fashion right. Yeah there was no facial features or anything. It was more like a light being in three three of them. But at the end of my bed and i didn't speak to me out loud that i i it sounds like it's i'm just lost my mind but like could hear him in my mind saying and there was so much saying it was like you were saying it was like being held by something with pure love or something like i was embraced so this new found like just to get up and fight this. You know crying. I think you're paying just comes. You've been recovered Well that happens to be the only time they've shown themselves to me. So i had no idea i i. There was a tiny bit of fear but the comfort level was unbelievable. Like pierre p. Were love like you never know from a human for was it was amazing. It was comforting healing. And it was exactly what i needed at the time. I needed it to buck up a karoo. So i've never really knew what that was. I never had anyone that could explain it or or talk to anyone else who had had any experience like that in my experience within djelic my one and only time to be honest with you is i had the same feeling You know all over motion like positive like reflection upon That sphere then of course all the lights were brighter. Like they'd say that hugh light got much brighter and Yeah it was definitely an interesting experience. So i guess you know. Of course there was something malevolent involved as well Pretty much prior to that. But you know there was a different feeling you could. You could definitely feel the ship that spirit change the no It was definitely eye opening experience. That's sure you know these Angels and demons Donnelly like dan brown now Then dettori just for not appearing in a way we can see you feel them century turtle and again subjective. You might see Furniture move or something when she could also be a poltergeist defined. Closer guy says a demon. Well diesel would be regarded with an attitude That's how they performance that that has a real loud to taste of on it. But if you isolate the frequency that a demon jenner unless they deem the angel to the demon generates they don't like i which is another thing They don't like to be seen they. They can't help but be photographed. Sometimes they want that they don't want to be revealed. Now if you've been isolate the unique frequency of what we consider a demon Take all the readings you can when when you're pretty much you can't be sure but when you were inclined to believe that it's a demonic on demonic manifestation if you could see what the lighting it's get a reading of the lighting that time the lighting in the room. 'cause the lighting changes. That's dark in the room then You know it starts dark then and you feel it's demonic okay. There's there's instrumentation the will read you know how much time there and we're luminance. And it's actually loose ferret the gauge light. You could isolate that. Then you have another demonic on and you get a similar reading now. you've isolated that people seek and what he has the frequency it's weights particles cons. You get that then. It is causal. Probably not practical. Maybe impossible but it's kind of flaws -able. Someone could develop a device that actually sees the demon. Now you know you may have to go through a lot of situations before you can actually succeed with it and you say you have a spectrum like you have a Light you can project or you have glasses special goggles and it sounds way out there. Just you know document that frequency and reproduce it then you might be able to see the demon like catch it. It might only be like for the millisecond which rain wouldn't register but it might be like thousands of a second and you just want something like food. I saw something. Yeah so something in motion and If you're lucky enough maybe it would manifest for a second that you that you could really see what you're looking at with. The demons are seen some time. So yeah i'm i'm very close to a person in indiana so she saw demonic form and didn't believe her and her twin sister saw and then her father who didn't want to accede to the belief in this their father so i brothers thought they also there's even it looked somewhat different to all uh-huh you know but i believe it was. Yeah and and they saw so that as the question. Can you make a device that enables you to see a demon You know that way. Where can you actually make it. Happen is children the same same forum to like. You know we're talking about taxes these things like you know i've never seen a demonic form like all amount obama like base and Like carl. I believe that time but like your in florida like oh yeah this is. Its first that this this entity common towards the camera. You know that that that's a point of captured be used. I've only had one case. I've never been art of where the monarchy itself was captured in some form. And that was cumberland rhode island. It was this series two episode. Two of my ghost story. It was called demon shadow and And they there was The are going on and the this was a case that was handled by johnson calls brother then myself and then i father bob balian When he was still active in this and it was a very it was very restrained case. They had some personal had been there. I was sitting at a table on and my rosaries were right when i was sitting down punching him. He's seen it. But in that. In that case you know the are fortunately able to capture this this demonic force but it was in the form of shadows but very over seven foot tall was able to encapsulate look looking go door to capture that much. Well it was interesting. This camera was pointing out for any course you can watch my story absolute to she's in too. But you know the dvr cameras looking out the doorway in this room because that's worse some nominal said to have happened. You know the they could. They could see shadows walking in the hall And fortunately thankfully you know they said that up team you see. Prt did and they captured that. This this shadow the shadow figure walk past the door and it notice the camera. That's thanks and they walked and they walked in the this. The shadows figure which. I would believe that the demonic entity walk back and peek into the room. And you could see this thing like peak right At the door it's very. It's very like crazy. Because out of all the times i've ever dealt with the case that would occur time something when every cat. It was in motion and emotion events. Cognizant that had a reaction direct directed. Yeah it's sort of the camera. The camera like peaked interference. Like oh i wonder i wonder if that old crap i got captured dog. You probably could have got rid of it. Yeah city they did something like that. They did on the gas chamber mass. Did they not with at least yeah. That was the medium and they put gashing john and that was helped to bring her to some level disability to see them of the device for vision. And it'll probably never be created. But it'd be interesting working premise. You know yeah. I that would be in really interesting now. And yeah maybe we'll marketed. I mean there could be. It could be simple process. There'd be a simple principle off. Were you just need to change the filter. Glenn see these things going that would that would be. I only know one person who invents things very smart though. I will message and see what he thinks about that. He's quite genius Well cook about with you too so i. I don't have anything to do with that. You can you see. Can you see a demon base as possible to see more The real person space you know they like if i was sitting across from this person who used to be on our team and i thought it was something was wrong with my eyes or my brain because she had she had hooked up with somebody very negative and she had a lot of negative things going on in her life. Her personality changed after we went to this really honda location. We did four our team just for fun at after that she she wasn't the same she was never the same tried getting help. We didn't know where to go. But we were sitting at a restaurant. And i thought i was having a stroke because i was seeing something like more from her face momentarily. It was so quick. And i'm looking at the lady next to me thinking. Is she sing it. And i'm looking into other people thinking in my my brain ing or have i. Am i having a stroke. You know because all these things. I'm trying to think physical for me and it was gone so quickly but it was there and she. Her whole personality changed. She didn't want to have anything to do with us We had to finally ask her to leave the team and she just was so hateful. Her voice even changed on the phone screaming at me. But i didn't know how to help her. She wouldn't allow us to help her. Even if i suggested. Could we talk to somebody. Just see if they would know what's going on with you know. There's nothing wrong with me. And i don't know but i've never seen anything like that before in my life and i did. I wasn't having a stroke. Thank you very much for that. But i spoil. She must be having problems. But i didn't know at the time it was so long ago i didn't know who to go to with something like that or would even believe it. Well i suppose the jewish in oklahoma. Paranormal has a case like that eleven years ago. Really i was. I was called in for that. Actually go on. And i didn't see the session. I saw the woman being taken over in their video. Playing when i could tell that was up antics but she had to remove ourselves from the case because of the hat interviewed about it. Yeah as far as far as the more the face. There's only believing relation one time. Yeah i've seen the trying leash is like i've been involved with three different Forms of possession of different individuals. And only one time i've ever seen the fish trying -ly and when we talk about triangle which cheekbones structure the point out and the starting to get our face becomes Alteration in the reality. It's just remarkable like you say. The patient comes drawn. Yeah it's almost like it's like plato. Poor sick yeah. It looks like a finnish fast. You know like one of the tribal mass. Yeah that's another about criteria. There's another indication that demolished when the triangulation occurs Interesting because i could. I could still see her. And that and the overlying if that makes sense casino harper put the other. It was like they were. I don't really would struggle between herself and whatever this was so it's not white taking her over and i don't know how how she now what she just cut us off after. I tried to get her help and done. Nothing was very very strange. Her whole personality changed and it could be just a medical issue. But i don't know what i saw there. I was doing a sideways. Look like a heck. Maybe she needed to retire from paranormal investigation. All the governor shoes susceptible Yeah definitely. I don't know she yeah she. She has retired from it altogether. I i hope that she's gotten how. But i don't know that because she won't talk to me every night every name in the book when i said we want to help you and we will find someone help you. Oh i've never seen anybody get so angry. Yeah people infected differently. You know depends you know. Some people aren't meant to be an influence situation like they're they're easily influenced their subjective like the. Carl said they're you know they're like hypnotherapist is a good example. Some people can't go under no therapy. Because they're not subjective right so there's some people that are easily a able to intrude into because of a lack of willpower. You know certain intrusion. The truth is a good way to put it So there's criteria. Listen people like it's it. Just it just dependable. You know some some people. Just get affected. These lear and when people are affected. There's certain things that the body reacts to you know when you think about it if there's something that jumps into its demonic gorka spirit through the former transient channeling You know you bobby reacts. You're you're adding an outside force into something that not meant to be there. So you body. Racks physically mentally spiritually all those aspects yet. So interesting question. You like Currently how many questions your children are. Keep you people calling. I have anybody call right now. They're someone in the chat room but they left the chat room so callers sometimes He's like well. Yeah i'll put it on spotify and it goes right onto spotify as well so they can listen back. 'cause a lot of people monday through to weird qualify as easy to use. Yeah yeah yeah. That we haven't hooked up sort of odd medically upload spotify where they can watch it back. Once it's uploaded here still it takes a few minutes walk talk. Yeah yeah. I would consider demon analogy to this for me and for so i would consider it to be perhaps the most fascinating aspects of paranormal exploration. Hey i don't know if you remember show was on eighteen years ago twenty twenty years ago. Quincy down in the nineteen nineties and the two thousand and quincy with the lake. Jack klugman yeah. i remember. it would start off with a cliff. Every episode the lead in sounded within He would hey his corpse on a table with a sheet over it. Thank you police officers. There is this gentleman. He's he's wearing his greens. Gentlemen you are about to enter the most fascinating as the mustache fascinating corridor of of police science the science of forensic forensic science and then you know the guys pass out and get sick and all that fascinating sphere. That's what he says. The most fascinating fear of detection work science license forensic science and so that's what would deem knowledge to us as it's just Because you're dealing with something disembodied. Something would personality something with attitude and probably an agenda something very elusive and you try to isolate it and you look for commonalities. Common packers blows. My mind can be something like that. Even though we don't we're pretty sure never thoroughly understand it unless somebody comes those goggle. Somebody comes out those that we'd letters what are the commonalities that are That that happened we how. How do the way you recognize that you're from what i'm hearing is mostly the feeling you get when you get on the property or that far off nearly one dealing drives. Yeah your church. Sonic of kinetic force it. can Can move armoire the setting the couch move. Move the chair with me in backwards which has happened to me twice god and do things like that when you when you say something that has finds offensive. Vote trying to scare you. That's when the blinds suddenly author reuters. And you know like an agassi. Yes religion. I will fly off the sea off the wall or off the table and In fact i had that happened. In that case i was citing There was a picture of jesus and that was next to that table. I looked at it again. Because i was hoping subject would look at the picture and i looked at it again and it was upside down very revealing to realize that while i was standing there and i didn't see it happen. It flipped itself Upside down must have done that. Yeah and you and you would hear Normally you would hear it if it came off the wall and turned. And you know you note here. But i didn't hear so subtle. Yeah is there was a camcorder going. Would've catcher that flipping around Yeah but it's feeling like james was to me. It feels like you're in a like either being compressed and and you're going to have the bench or something on the water is pushing on yours is a. Why do i feel this. That's just it you know. You don't know why you feel all this bad negative than station. Lavery hanson just wanna get out of there like something does not want me here and it's a physical pressure so here you do. They feel fear of you knowing. Do they know that when you come near them that you you out the the possibility hopefully to read read got rid of him so they fear you their their their best Best ploys because they do hear the knowledge that they do feel the priest. You don't wanna be shaken. They don't wanna be sent away. And this is somebody who specializes in an least gonna give it a good try to get rid of the demon. So of course appears on that level of is the The living person of course. And that's why it's so manipulated because you know even though there are strong and powerful to some degree that but they're big is their biggest strength is that they're unseal and once they have been figure it out and are able to start. That process of banishment You know there is some sort of fear because they don't want to detract from their target. They they wanna keep being manipulated parasitical then want and they wanna keep Molesting the person that they are dealing with. So you know. Of course when you know individuals like karl myself and you know other people that deal with this kind of work you know when we get involved. There's some sort of detracting that perhaps it happened. You know one of my biggest things and you know Still kinda sucks and talk about it. Because i opening of how things can can occur in home. Thoughts can be into intercede to your mind to trying to keep you away from this situation. But i usually talk about not usual. This question up but I had a nightmare. One time where. I was consulting with this case and in massachusetts in i was in the consultation consultation stages of no email and phone at that point in time i had never seriously in there to do a consultation or two sets physically had never seen house had never seen the family knowing that had never asked pitchers yet at that point And they were. They didn't have any pictures to give me like scratches glad that they were at this point. La felt something you know. The kids were seeing something they received. Something things moving around by location So you know. And there was some sense of fear of living in the house and then they would shadow figures dr but nothing that they could order audibly or physically collect through any kind of a device and so i'd never seen these people mind you for the listeners in I had this nightmare within that week of wa- going there to to physically do an assessment and there's nightmare cons- Consisted of me getting this location me. Seeing every single member of the family being the house walking in the house housing the of the dream and the nightmare walking in the house and killing every single member one stanley. I see it might every single one of them even the kids. This gets more. Yeah believe it or not and by what occurred is that day. Of course this is this nightmare on my mind like oh nice. You know what's going to happen like you. I try to go on like a neutral mindset like i said the same thing as carl goes in there with the neutral line fat but you still have this kind of daring on like this was pretty creepy man. You know like. I woke up out of fit. You know. basically a sweat creepy green oh And what makes it more. Carlson is when i made my eyes upon these people they were to physical t what might nightmare had conception of them to look like so not only was the family. The spinning imaging might nightmare member. I'm never seen people. That house came as well from decorations inside the house. From the exterior of the siding. The you know the windows and it hit me on my whole shoot and the only one only one thing that did not happen. Not killing family. Because if i do that would not be on his phone. Call right now Right what it was a victory. I was like yeah it was yeah. It was a detracting in new. I was there to come and help this family from being molested by this force and it was trying to detract me from going trying to track him deterrent. No maybe that's why games that dream you know because like we know you're gonna try and help these people i'm going plan division of what they look like. And you're gonna you know gonna scare the jesus when you see them. Yeah that's the only way. And i know i know many people I've done this to you. Know beyond on carlton then at the same thing. Where they're they're there. Been some sort of vision or some sort of feeling or some sort of like personal issues that came out of left field to detract these people to deter these people from going there and you know sometimes it did occur them did stop them from going and the family that would make me think twice or three times if i came and so i killed all your people. I don't wanna be rahm us. i never. I never told them that. No because if you had been really really shocked to see what you're seeing in your dream. I know you wouldn't kill anybody. I mean takeover possess you for you to do something about who you are but you. You had to be shocked to see what you saw. Being repeated. i came close. I came running down my way because oh really is really was. It was death defying. Just pro you ask well. Yeah that would stopped even more if i was fasting. We've been dry air bar liquid with no. I can't i can't i. It wasn't it was that is very scary. Yeah i've never had. A pre cog kata dreams. We have to win our team. That does she does have very frightening dreams and some of them have come close to true but like you said the really The part that would have been the most Physical didn't happen but where we were going. She was explaining. All you know all of it so so crazy minded more remote. I'm better if i'm at home and you give me a picture and remote view have been trained by your trains remote viewers. Yeah there's this tech six national production. Yeah i'm better with that. Because i pick up too much energy. If i'm trying to pick up what's going on at the house if they send me a picture of the house before we go. I can in my mind. I walk myself through it. It's sorta see things that are happening. yeah i don't do is i have something like i can't i can't turn it on and off. I've been to a place or ivdr drafted being there and then manifested comes really actually go to the place and here. You like this place a couple of minutes here. That's i think that's amazing. How are our minds work and how much of it we don't use because i think everyone has has the if they wanna call them now. There's so much that they're were frightened of in opening that part of their brain that they just don't use it just shut it all down. I think when we're children were like a big open house. When we know a lot of things that i like. I knew when my grandmother died but my parents got so angry. That i knew something. I couldn't have known a half hour before it happened. And we were in california and she was arkansas. But i knew it i came out. Just just you know because she was all peaceful and i didn't think it was anything negative and i didn't get to know them that well but i'm like grandma. Jones died in there. I saw it. She's okay they're like what so angry at me and so much and then they get a phone call. We didn't have cell phones. I'm back then. They had off. Yeah yeah before. They knew she was had passed so they thought it was so evil about me. I mean i. I really got in trouble for that so i shut down. When you're a child you're a big open house with no blowing a lot of things you don't know when you're a grown your own jokers after we get it. Yeah he's closed doors. Yep someone tells you you can't see that you can't know that you are not an on and kids kids know more than we think they do. They really pick up on. A lot of things intuitively and and all of that if we nurturance getting getting angry at yeah. My nephew is i like that. So to and is always gonna restorage been in the apartment complex and this Little sebastian news wasn't three at and he he's pointing down the carter and he's saying he's here he's here. Oh i said it was older brothers. Shaun what's your kids. Want him as my now. The other one's way taller than me. But i said that the older brother. I said once you talk about and sean said oh. He has an imaginary friend now. yeah he's pointing the voice pointing and then were leaving. He turns just where he was looking down the corridor. Anyway he's he's way his hand by girl his fingers imaginary friend which was pretty eerie looking at the same spot that then he was something that yeah i think there is. I think there's a lot that the children know. Unlike they don't tell us older brother he would end. You know what happens when people die and does everybody die. He went and where do we go. He would ask those questions but his older brother wouldn't ask those questions. So i i think that's why he was more interested in spiritual realm. That's maybe why is tight. He saw that you had that imaginary friends so to speak. Yeah there's also theory on opinion to have better rockville very long time you know. Of course we've got determined a little bit of what the glenn does releases melatonin which homes you go to sleep. Put you in a relaxed state. But meditative meditated. But other than that. We still don't know what that glen does To to its full potential and for long time as been preconceived to be the third eye and would make sense because the young age opinons not fully developed if result at all as a child learning about this now so if your child and your glands dot fully developed need that's why children have more out of the ability to the things that adults can't be because the gland something when the glenn wasn't develop i thought it just makes you short. You know what it is thought that maybe primitive man. We say primitive firearm respected primitive. Like the end at the Promoting the hormone. The end lenses now they were pretty pretty bitch and people you know three. They were survivors. They were specialized adapted to their environment and and they had brain capacity was higher than we have bigger brains than modern humans but their brains were formed differently their skulls football shape the swelling in the back of the head so we wonder if maybe they had some propensity to see things because certainly all had language but not as developing sophisticated as far as their concepts and they're able to the ability to enunciate couldn't have quite like ours so maybe they needed to survive. Maybe they needed to develop heightened senses extrasensory and the needles came out in that enabled them to see that they're behind them. Or you know invading tribe you know coming around the bend. There's also no theory to the human mind is capable of a lot of things and you know there's also no theory of course you. The theories is not something that call nine necessarily agree There's another theory about. Of course we did come in. African plains The human mind developed from Of course early humans consuming shrooms or Was that Who's an exposed. I don't like mushrooms. Yeah yes but man. no. I know shrooms but Yeah like second name. The actual tamila knowing that there's tlc tetra heidrick. Lory you know We gotta get it. We'll get it okay. Yeah i'll think of the the theory. Is that because if we came Centralized after complains that there is a lot of these if you go there now there's still a lot of The mushrooms that have this like dental properties and. They said that he early humor. It's not to you know For no i'm not But that early human. He's mushrooms and it actually helped develop the human. The human brain function like helped move develop it actually no prime example of Psychedelics being introduced Is the show evil Where where he actually. I love mushrooms. Yeah actually talked to god or awareness. How about this for a drug. Actually ribot mcclair. Cassie right. I see ryan nucleic acids like that. No we couldn't get around without our dna we would be Suicide and say allah. But i thought that aside and brought sorry. I know something won't agree about him. I wanna talk more about. He doesn't care about them. I liked it. They're cooler chocolate. Honey yeah yeah wanna talk about caved on thing for thirty five thousand right. Yeah wasn't in the end. You know our species homo sapiens sapiens. The chrome engines culturally. We could interbred with manda tells and that was speculation for a while. it was fantastic. But it's it's been supported by fossil evidence we could have offspring are time interbred with an and it's also we were closer than people originally thought you know. So james and i have to point something percent neanderthal in our make our dna. I probably have a little more of that. You're your longer than mine every no you got the same got. He looks like he could be good. Climbing bamboo shoot or three she in the thumbs has gone through you're short stubby thumbs. Whatever what really driver wrench. I can make it how he makes. It look like he doesn't have we go and you could just hold it down okay under More than most people could. Well actually i can do it too. We're not dissimilar james. He's just noticed this before. Mine and seniors are about six or seven inches long leaving out. The phones a strange hand it a- got wonderman hand. You know if you left the prince motor southern hardened do people. It'd be thinking that aliens among us. You know you are on a serious sugar high. I'm saying well we've. We've almost almost killed a home bag or she nugget but yeah so we're not we're this is offering this speculation. We're beginning rooms man interesting shoe of all we don't detroit gave away. I yeah i don't either i can't sleep but i've never done shrooms. Thanks anyway. I think that's a little out there. I've been offered all kinds of when i was younger. Everybody second keep me awake. James could fall asleep anywhere. And i can't sleep all hot mess people on the couch. Yeah i yeah. I i get an email you and ask the number or something you know when you do your policy comedy set. Oh no never mind. You're doing it beautiful you know. Yeah we do program. Every time earlier this year. And i i mean by earlier i mean february later. In february we appeared so in rochester new york as the the winter fast. Best man We we had this. Oh yeah we touched on the serious stuff but we also have like spontaneous human combustion laughing at the at the end of the lecture. I had the microphone. I said now you notice we. We are every lecture is different and the we present and we're funny funny guys. Next time we might not be funny. We we might be bad and you'll leave the auditorium saying those guys were sad. That was really sad. And i didn't know what a latin i would get wish that we might be this really sad. I don't know sad. There's nothing to be sad about. It's all we're gonna talk about. Yeah we're not all you on ever now. I'm really sad. I your trash you listening because you're polite. You'll be said to put connecticut. It's hard for by contagious. Actually this is actually a demon Tro tip or Investigators job there's one thing that always complain about after an investigation and that's You know getting tired. I forget what they call paranormal tiredness or someplace. Where are you get to withdraw royals after investigating you tell people and this is actually give the clients clients to as well especially if they're feel like they're physically being affected by this stuff but after gatien eat chocolate it helps you endorphin levels and you won't be but seriously like there's so many times i what i've given Like that a client were fellow. Team members would be Severely like in drought because of how exhausting investigation was or or a client will be exhausted from If they were being affected and give them chocolate actually Does create odd different in in your mentality the endorphin. Yeah so you get a chemical so parallel investigators spring chocolate with your not just uk to meter whatever chocolate. I i hate chocolate jane. Okay well white. Chocolate was four dollars and sixty nine cents before tax and we've pretty much demolished like little children on her sugar high it. It's a ho. Hey yeah definitely does well. Dame's up You're feeding him sweeping. They'll probably a about this. I doubt that. I am somehow doubt. I've seen you sleep in some very unusual places like like talking and i immediately. There's no response james asleep. I don't even know how you do that to me. I guess yeah was it called We were in gettysburg car. And i did get his. No we did as at the lookout house. Owned by pan. Steve barry yeah and We were. We were invited to stay the night thankful to them. 'cause there's a bed and breakfast as well and they have this supposed haunted doll the whole conversation but They had is supposed onto doll wonders. And you know. I don't i don't necessarily like like trump my chest out but i like to experiment. You know if you say you have often dow okay. Let's let's let's let's check it out. So of course james Not being me yeah. I slept with the haunted doll in the same bed. Huddled with it i call i saw instantaneously opening in the morning there would be a magical chain and there would be a real person next to you really must see even with the hunt. Supposed of dollar estimate passed out like no. Yeah like give me my haunted doll. I'm going nine. I raggi adult to though so do you believe okay. Do you believe that spirits can hot odds objects like that like dolls and we're gonna find out whatever sleep i i think The word is you in misunderstood so many forms of cash if you look at the etymology of the word on You know the possess because they usually. It's it's usually the individual haunted That's one thing happens haunting. Can't happen to us as a catalyst or dad re-involved so and item can have some influence on it like let's say if A little girl Perished and she was very attached to those doll and she put so much emotion so much love into it. Oh toy story for forty Four could've been a haunted object right But in the same token if a little girl perished and there was so much motion so much bigger involved in this item that there could be a possibility that this item could have some Resonance of that little girl navy people would experience a little girl's spirit of or some kind of Emotion certain things that could occur well with attach the item being connected to this person. And of course there's talks about things being Through ritual put into the to these items of course You know binding ritual but And some forms that ritual that have to be concurrently done over and over again. A binding is only as good as as done and of course as and handling the item. So i don't. I'm always on the sensible on tonight. I handled a bunch. I've handled a bunch of them. But i i've never i respect okay. There's something evil or something suppressive or trust in here. I've always not always. I should say but more now having a head on my shoulders and understanding now That there is a battery like There we're the battery and the item has the story. Sometimes that story can kind of man assess and it's possible so i don't really know like i to me items are very difficult. I know people that collect them. My you know. John young twenty spero's A great guy as well Currently runs the war museum 'cause he's the son-in-law lorraine warren but you know i've been i've been to the war museum you know i did a blessing over blessing over people for Warner brothers Animal comes home. I was part of their premier. And i was able to bless influencers. That were able becomes the the museum to museum before. But i've never ever been museum. It's felt like i was in danger. Were felt like. I had some sort of oppressive message demonic entity attached to it. So like i don't know i. I'm on the fence about it. Like i think it's a possibility. There could be some important points when it comes but as far as like Like an item being. That's not items only through recycle consistent us And manipulated living breathing. How about you car. Well this chapter in a book. Cold shirelles even allergy and books. It's parts one two of the chapter. Beware those vital cocker. Maybe i'd read the whole chapter here Well i should know. Because i wrote the book was rock. That's my book and lana wrong with me. And she wrote. I will be wear those. What chapter she was those dolls. Par to those buying every chapter and it talks about how these things on a physical physical images of people usually. That's dollar or all But but i talk about clown dolls people really by those. Some people are scared of clowns. People are scared of dolls. You combine the two four force And Yeah so i think it is association. Oh yeah i. I don't know if the spirit can actually But i know. Somebody's a gifted or experienced saitama three man. You know can sensitive to vibrations logic. They might pick on memories from that. Yeah definitely some principles. We don't understand that right so you're not. I mean if you to really like like dogs you cannot help in view that with with personality. You can't help but see it as something here with the mind and then in some form you know everybody's off. The dow is new age thing. But in reality you know actually. We're trying to talk about our podcast earlier as well as you know we have two dollars. That's so and one of the oldest forms where you don't even hurt you. This for us much is the word acid you you know after gene i idealogical has a long time in one of the most new. Jeez people don't realize is the food without you know so so i took a two. Yeah but yeah that's really imbuing personality infusing it with personality because it's gonna take on the presence of that it'd be busted and booted affected. They are not and so much you believe in them. I yeah. I think there's an is as close to right facts Go ahead you going to say. There's a big market out there where people are buying You know quite a bit of money. They're putting out for these haunted doll's everywhere. Yeah they're everywhere. There's a lot of people selling them. And there's a place that i've investigated many times mineral wells and Tech yeah that haunted hill house and she has haunted supposedly haunted doll's everywhere. I've never felt anything hunted for many of them that the place has some haunting but the dolls which i hated the child. I didn't really care for also. But i didn't. I didn't feel anything coming from any of the doll nights out and held it every one of them trying to because she spent a lot of money on these people are making a lot of money. Selling these haunted objects. I just basically telling stories. It's a story you know. There's there's item that you know this little girl died. Now she inhabits this doll because she was so attached to. It's an intriguing story that captivates people and people are willing to spend big bucks on that. Like like i said you can go on ebay. There's different boxes in haunted dogs. A oh my god. Like god but people love that stuff. People love to physical representation of a story. James annabel dough which is supposed to be haunted. How the war. I suppose some they got this this hype and hoopla about whereas you know do not open ended the day positive positively. Not on and yes. There's bed lorraine worley dollars. In lorraine holding the doll and silent. Because i guess you as impunity to think learning that and james how would you feel if some cloud your wars copies ian wright special permission to be there or something and somebody opens that cabinet over the glass case and tosses this harvest. Raggedy ann doll. How would you feel you say. Oh well i tried. I'd probably person catchy. 'cause i'm a moron and I think it has to come. I think has to come down to your intention. I would. I would not be disrespectful. And just throw the doll to the ground. Say like i would probably just be respectful. I probably wouldn't like start screaming. I i i'd go. I think it's how you respect these items. If there is a demonic for in inhibiting are inhabiting And adult that of course in the same retrospectively we deal with cage that if somebody's being influenced under you come in with the respect They're a dissertation of being negative provocative and provoke in this thing but Yeah definitely definitely respectful. But i wanted throw down. But she'll be like oh god. Why did this person just do. Yeah i wouldn't anywhere. Somebody talked me annabelle. You know. I come on. Don't be a quantum slept with a sports dog. Yeah a dog. She's now having his haunted trial. I'm just saying creepy. James still my next one is going to be called me. Not caleb damian. Yeah oh hunt. Hunting james doll. Somebody did me the nfl. I mean i. I wouldn't purposely removing just the challenges of your real silly but i would But suppose i back into a fire hydrant done. I'm gonna say it was a doll me But then again sports that fire hydrant comes ten years later. Yeah you know. The famous story sprained an ankle with the next ten years. You know like oh it on from that you know One of the big famous stories of was voices. It's more little. Oh sorry talk you hear us. Yes we all yours because what we're speaking of here. Yep can you hear us all right. Yeah so okay. What i was saying now is like. There's this famous story of motorcycle. Driver Basically provoking doll and Being more ballots museum and they get in a motorcycle crash and of course everybody says oh was because he is way he treated in. They'll but everybody forgets within the confines that story and eye-witnesses that scene is most likely driver was he was actually driving erratically and no accident. So was an animal hint driving erratically. Like a fool that made poorly knicks. I'll start horrible. You know he's he's probably gonna. You've probably other trip that night driving. Yeah he he's in y- know on an ego trip. Yeah oh wow. That's how that's how he's around stuff like that. Just go though you know any. I mean a little bit of bad luck that can be tied to them as to whether or not there's actual explanation for us Well that's what they say is every myth and folk has the truth to it. You know some basis in reality. Yeah which would bring it to the contrary talk about that. You know a lot of myths grow up around the country house in arizona that you know because of the rita's fire. Yep and carl's knows all about that 'cause you first investigator in their nineteen seventy with his brother keith. And on a case manager donal donnelly. Donna donna yeah. That's not what i saw in the movie though. Oh my sleeve. And all that his cat does. Joe did a jump up. But yeah the conjuring house here. My brother keep an with the first investigators with Were then members of a team basis rhode island college in providence and our team in a nutshell contacted by this is caroline parents and Our team brought in lorraine warrant and lowering war. We'll just call them to solve them and benefit from their vast experience and they volunteer to come. They ended up taking the case out from under us but They advise the parent family on the house. Farmhouse did they could help unless they solo investigators there because that's actually how that case started you know. The argued called pyro. Parapsychology investigatory and research organization rhode island college. And that's always the country house. Got his It was haunted. Yes and deal is but We were the ones who called in. Lorraine warren but it's not ours depicted in the movie of course but the movie is entertaining the germ of truth in it. The house is actually built in seventeen. Thirty six so that a lot of a lot of time to absorb memories through some principles know. I'm they're not infrequently. I'm friendly with the new owners. In fact there was an episode of ghost. Adventures was the halloween. Two thousand nineteen Halloween special ghost adventures. And i was invited to participate in. That night became much more than i expected. I would be so. That's that's available to watch and premise of that investigation. Wants the ghost. Adventures team was trying to replicate our original investigation of nineteen seventy three and they did get results and we all back then. This is warren she. She denied that there were any other. Paranormal investigators there. She said they were the only ones that that was the release of the movie And mrs warren also says that movie is as true to lie as any movie can be categorically deny any other investigators. They're back yet. There was a well circulated picture Myself with donna. And mrs warren lorraine warren next to us and in the front is caroline karen guiding the to their first tour of the conjuring house in harrisville top farmhouse. So certainly illustrates that. I was there at the time and that pitcher could actually be viewed. That's talked about our podcast again. But we just did a recent special with Carl myself. And ki ki my brother and his twin brother. Nfl human allergists as well and Absolute was for people that are interested in seeing that picture because it is part of it. it was called conjuring conjuring the truth. So if you're interested in seeing only your true. Yeah what occurred in august and september nineteen seventy-three accounts given by karl too far too. Because you know you can always talk about those experiences you know. There's a lot of myth and most of what you hear about. The country house is bit. But i'll qualified that by saying you a haunted house. And people do get manifestations that people get same kind of phenomena now that argument experience the ninety seventy three. Same kind of things happen. They're with different owners. Yeah i don't. I don't think it would be enough to drive somebody on house but no everyone. Accordion gen heinsohn. I acquired that house and moved in there. They they did feel like. I don't know if this is too much for their son. Their teenage tyler Had to say away from for two weeks because he saw this black shadowy thing move about the huddle room. And that's just what i saw on. Nineteen seventy my first time to august. Nineteen seventy three but again the moore's students being and Took the case away from us. Actually because i was on the phone with carola current daily. And then i didn't hear from her for a couple of weeks after the war did the had a meeting with the well. Either they resolve the case there. All right or Or is getting really intense but then carolyn curry Rogers white homeowners at the time she called me and she apologized for having dropped out of our communication. She told me that. The war's informed her and her husband is. They could be no help. They were the only parent there tend to be so investigators. We were just a bunch of college kids that we couldn't do any good Something we lost their kid but just you know we had already investigated there a few times. There's just as well You know really what's going to happen. What did it culminated in seance performed in the house with lorraine warren frozen and caroline parens lady. She was really totally taken over during that same. I thought it was an ill advised operation to do that. I wasn't there for it. But they have somebody film documented the crease present and a psychic media and rain the net so and carolyn force and roger. Came home from work the trucker. He came home from work. She's all these people in the southeast. Well we let it go to see what happens and during that sounds caroline parents started who's portrayed in the movie kondratiev roger art She starts muttering in Some kind of incomprehensible language and dialect and then her chair will. She was flung oliver chair. She was about twelve feet away into the next room and Bill thought she was dead on the floor and that was that was the say that it was conducted on october thirtieth nineteen seventy-three and that house in harris own island so they got results. It's not what they planned on and well. It didn't end well the associated with the parents and the lone house and orange serrano investigators unfortunately and went over to roger came to the aid of his wife. Ed tried to block his way and said you must never touch the possessed. So roger hold off and sophomores and order them all out of the house that was the end of their association with the current parents in the war so it didn't end like it did in the movie but still fascinating and roger didn't want anything to do with our normal teams after that pros for some time but that was actually what what transpired in the house and i think the truth is just as fascinating any fiction. They can feel that. I mean to have a grown woman flung out of her chair run into the next room during the sand and having end acrimoniously between the parents of the war. But i think that's. I think they should've kept the truth to that script. It was the thing that they couldn't because it didn't portrayal the warriors and the totally favorable life although they were trying to do some good there but the warriors were performing an intervention. Not scientific investigation as our team was me. I don't know how science we could achieve. We were trying to be methodical. And scientific documentary. All they trying to document case then it'll range over loss on that they would have been differently so they had nurse. We hadn't pulled them in. My call dropped that. What's interesting is it still shows me The rift radio network host called in but they dropped my call. And i had to call in on my own cell phone Oh do you want me to go again. The left so but oh. I've been here for a little bit. I would just say corky weird things that happen when we're on this show 'cause it's still lewd on on. What would it came back on you were talking about adding lorraine and i know that story and how it was pretty much falsified a lot of what they did. They were showing more than they were. Investigators for your answers to like the recognition. And i think it was right when they came to the house in nineteen seventy three. I think there were movie monday then. Yeah that makes sense warns we actually contacted was producer through the country. Yeah that's so far off of what really happened from. I've heard you know in read a lot about it and that was just so far off. It's an interesting movie as you said that. I'd like to have more of a documentary type when she said yeah. That would be awesome. Well people have done independent shows chronicling. Yeah after watch him. We're going down to about room users. Eleven minutes left. And i don't want to run out of time because i love talk. You know that already walked me to. Yeah i mean yeah. I want to make sure that you can. They can reach out to you. Just saw your shoutouts right here. You want to give him the address. Sure yes so we have. We have a very easy way of Except not so you don't have to understand the old way of so the we of course. Yeah we we. Ours is some what But our our website address is w. w. dot demon -nology doe or d. m. o. l. o. y. Just the old the old now all the pill which is still very fascinating. Even though we've had it for months now fascinating actually got allergies outgrew. I wouldn't even try. I would've thought it was paid. James over demon so that way to us or jodi -nology on facebook but if you go to our website demaj dot or it will link to carl's personal website my personal website. It will lead us to are doing facebook. If you're interested in purchasing carl's book Demon allergy handbook showroom human allergy to saddam. By that on the website as well. We've stam zahn so that is really the best way to you. There find us Seek consensus contribute an article looking at your story personal and of course Also book us for a radio show or a lecture Which we very useful be and being developed or website again that's you can put the. Www dot diva -nology or some sandra knowledge and then of cour- johnston facebook. And i'm not on facebook. Thank god and But you could also go to instagram matt damon and find out that way as well. We're we're on you to. We have our own podcast. We try to go on every thursday but we have been Do to prop personal busy live and force busy within constitutions and all that stuff so But you can also watch. Reruns are all that shows you the through our website or on youtube by buell them now e. m. and o. l. o. g. i. e. the tricky part starts off with a ends with donna. I sounds so sound. So good due date or knowledge even for trio's dollars at least which we do have It's not just carl. I part of knowledge you know we do have a historian. Slash manager her. Name's elise gio marco. Carlson she's the president of the johnston historical society She is a valuable member of says. Well and has the great work for our organization and of course calling her one panorama paranormal And they handle more of the other cases outside of the relative analogy script allergy. Are you following or some something Something really wax like even season starts fine line. Things that are on shouldn't be there you know mystery and history that's That's what we handle with duo dame. I mean alabama paranormal. You'll see a picture of at least in some great. That's great job but you'll both be in texas next year if everything goes away. It's plan right. Well we we we we were. There was some things but we Have some conversation. There is good chance. We'll be doused dallas This upcoming year probably yeah into shouldn't county on whether some nice back out there and of course he usually lloyd's and of course you kirby been mostly you're there as well but it's been so long since i've seen you guys. I know i know. I want i want to go to that is natalie is become. I've become closer with natalie. And she's the one. I think putting on the whole thing. So yeah she's an amazing investigator just came out of nowhere and burst onto the scene. And just take over everything. And i love that. That's what feel they come out of the woodworks. Yeah yeah oh there you know how that would be great. That would be dr. They're they're less than every i. I picked him up at the airport and then made him drive everywhere else. I i guess you just did i. I very greatly appreciate take me up in dallas and fort worth whatever places called I will i will have to. When you know as the same way. I've been i was texas three times before that and of course carlton thing is that i never been to texas. We're gonna. We're gonna have to do a bird introduction mr carl. How he wasn't waterberg. Or what the hell is there. I only go whatever her wherever. Yeah i don't eat. Meat is okay though law. French fries delicious. And they're not you know there's no there is no but there ryan but i'm kinda adam come on now was a free at a potatoes vegetable. You need your vegetables scorpius dream yeah and you and you could get those awesome bonds with the tomato almost making even though you know what would be called a veggie burger. I had that awesome bun with the tomato and lettuce and the onion. There was just known me. I'm okay with that listen. I don't. I don't judge people for what they eat. All right i'm gonna put this on the air Houses larson If she listened she likes to listen. I think she's out. You actually had the larsen other laws. Yes okay listening. But so i'm gonna say this and thought momma sheila mama sis Why haven't you mailed me out. What burger because heather larson mail out some tamales from texas and she sends them to me you. That'd be one. Can you imagine whatever would taste like by the time it gets you. Do you want to do take out with burger. Have you lost your mind. You crazy mad. You donate your organ donors. I'm not like has than i. You wanna whatever you come and see me. That's the way this bitch. that's what i'm talking about. I know what i'm saying. I'm not mailing you anything you gotta water one. Do you better have a burger buffet. Ready for me to pick you up at the airport gate. Because i'll do it if i have to. 'cause i'm coming you guys that alone i totally gonna have you picked up there. I'm carlene bull for us to come pick up up the phone day. We're signed back up and like on the drive us when the sport. Yeah i'll be. I'll be like i'm a little bit late. I had to go to water burgers. You yeah what did you say carl. He's sitting here so good so good. He's chanting fitting on. What in hall of what burger know. That's different ratio. My god he's doing it he's wanting her. You are a whatever hor that's what you are bluesy turned me. The name is aboard. A james would piss him out for freaking water burger. That's what i'm talking about. And i have one right here in town. Don't i'm never there me. Love me love you long time that you get you know whatever upbringing within the problem. I'll pick you up. Bring it with me. And then i'll hand over the driving to you. Well yeah. I think that sounds like a great time to me. I'll have a one not or i'll have another burger. I wish on the food is we're just doing a commercial burgers that's higher games to do. A whatever commerciality will we have to end about. However we can come on game while i use your phone. That's all i remember is mark set Before i think before. I went to that event And you pick me up. I think mark had created A banner saying bill. We're water for james unidos on his way clues. Now we're okay. We're gonna countdown to like forty seconds. I wanna thank you. Both you amazing Love the chatter between you. Both just like you're off air. We're talking to each other. It's so funny well. This is a common paranormal. Oh yes he does not need to be grivas. Just demon dollars grim. Then you need to be but we're not really know you were. You were perfect. And i'll be there for you if you need me to pick you up you. Just tell me. Because i'm going to that event anyway so i'll yeah no problem. Thank you both for being on the show. Your amazing always sakes kurds. I know you'll talk much. But you know i love you man. Good night here goodman number one. Have you good night game. 'cause i call no god what Burger the biggest stuff. Talk more talk. Hershey kisses or whatever that's more pumped up and wild and chaotic the show. It was like being drunk or something. I'm electric whole learn. What are you watching. We're watching something then either. Show work watching you under. Well p people what good you cable Whoa uh-huh List can't overlook. I tell them they did terrible. They were oh Hey uh-huh Senior you and Whoa Uh-huh uh-huh You do like that uh-huh eight You you you Y- takes off I'm sure should i uh-huh You know was Visit jews more Uh-huh eli your okay You uh-huh Cute me You Baby cheat either Today there players the building or not. Uh-huh you