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631: Mastin Kipp, How to dissolve your trauma and move forward
So the goal is not at not have exposure to paint the goal is to learn how to build resilience in the face of pain because emotional trauma is it in of itself that it's how we hold it. How respond to it? And you know, when you go to the gym and work out, and you rip your muscles apart. That's trump. Right. So what we wanna do is we want to build more motion resilience just like we have got resilient. So just give muscle resilience you need emotional resilience. And that is really the key because a world dead where Moshe trauma is was all isn't a world where there's no pain. There's just suffering. Welcome to the Ziegler show. I'm your host Kevin Miller. And I'm here to inspire your performance from the framework established by six one of the top motivators, personal development leaders our world has ever seen who believed we could all be more do more and have more. How improve ourselves beginning with how he think about ourselves. So let's breakdown some personal development. And this show. We're talking about a big premise that all our limits, all yours and mine all the handicaps of our mind, all our anchors and achilles heels and everything holding us back from our full potential. Come from a primary source sounds too much already, but just another claim to be the holy grail. And I feel that I'm always sensitive to that. But after this talk is pretty convicting that. If this is not the thing that it is a primary thing one of the top primary things I keep talking about it ever since I did this interview and the point is unresolved trauma in your life. And before you say, hey, I've never had any real trauma. I've never been abused or lack for much you could have come from a privilege Thome and loving parents and just try to live up to their high expectation, and that became somewhat of an anchor for you that you are imprisoned in or tired of. But the point you have a limiting factor belief rooted in your past programming and why? Wiring. And until you get it rewired, you'll be stuck or at least handicapped. So my guest is Masten Kip a number one bestselling author of claim your power, and that's really the focal point of our talk today. He also wrote daily love he's a speaker and creator of functional life coaching for people who are seeking rapid transformation there lies. He's been featured on the EMMY awards show super soul Sunday recognizes thought leader for the next generation that was the quote, by Oprah Winfrey. Massin has built a highly successful international personal development company that helps people create rapid change connect to who they really are. And how to live their lives with passion and purpose through his writing online courses in person seminars and international retreats mass and has worked with over two million people in over one hundred countries around the world. I'll just tell you this. I was really impacted and talked about this concept much since my time with mass than I'd highly encourage you to dig into this conversation with us you can find his book, which has the message that we focus on here. Again. Claim your power wherever you buy books and connect with mass than at Masson M S T, I N Kip K I P P dot com. So I'm gonna dive in with mass than after I share some help for resources. Okay, friends here, then as they significant conversation that I think you'll get much out of with mass than kit. All right mass than well. Gosh, we've just been sitting here Chit chat with each other and talking about zig, and there's nothing more that I love to talk to somebody who is a modern day, zig Ziglar and more in their own sense. So man, thank you for being here and doing what you do. Why can I so proud and excited honor to be here? And yeah, there's only one, and I definitely have a desire to help people, but he isn't a category league and class all his own. We all about zig he paved the way for a lot of us. No doubt. I wanna dig in as I always do my listeners know with some of your personal store. And I know that's a big part of your message story overall is your personal story, but you start right off in the book. And it's interesting to me, and you make mention that. You're six foot four white man from Kansas who came from an upper middle-class family. So what threads I wanna do? What? Threads from your upbringing. Do you recognize now helped pave or punish the way for where you are today? Either way. Great question, technically, by the way, I haven't inversion table. So now, I'm six foot five I just got my doctor last month. And I'm now six five along in my spine. So, but yes, the idea is still the same and one day. I will say I just for some context. Get started is we'll probably talk a little bit about emotional trauma. We will folks from a functional to that type of stuff and talking about emotional trauma. Without right, context cancer. It's a total bummer. It's like why do I need to talk about that? And while just say for context before I get into my personal story is that you know, if you want to have a great relationship or earn or quit a job. It's our business or just do great at your current job or lose weight, or whatever it is you want to long term, it all is about the inner trauma work, and we're at a place now where you know, a lot of our predecessors like zig and William James. Psychological feel before him pave the way for a lot of the incredible breakthroughs happy now as we go inside. And so if you're not doing the trauma work, then it's you're not gonna have sustainable fulfilment, sustainable income Saint joy, there'll be a lot of stressing Ziya, depression, etc. So I want to just like talk people into listening because I promise you it's going to be worth it. And in the context of of my upbringing, you look at me now six foot five white guy from Kansas. You think that guy is trauma, and we have to broaden our view of trauma is because most people think that it's some type of a violent act perpetrated on somebody and that certainly one hundred percent classified as trauma, but there's lots of other things that create trauma. You have a parent or both parents who are physically present with a child, but are not tuned into their emotional needs in that creates emotional elect, which isn't emotional trauma. That's called relational trauma. There can be generational trauma passed down through genetics where certain groups of people. Experienced certain traumatic events like the Jews in the holocaust, African Americans was slavery, and those traumas are passed down in the genome. And so is the resilience then there's a shock trauma, which most people think is what actual trauma is whether it's a violent act or your event where there's violence or something like that. And so trauma can be a soul-sucking job. It can be a divorce. It could be grade school. You know, like there's lots of things that produce emotional wounds, and what happens in advertently is that we get into this sort of coping process, and the thing that's about the functional proteins that we can kind of bigger way out of that and start to really not just cope better. But to actually get better. So for me, you know, financially. Everything was fine. My parents, you know, we had a nuclear family. However, my mom had a broken back. And when she was fourteen years old fell off a horse. And then when she had me her back to tears -nificant, she had three what are called heroic surgeries usually surgeon surgeons defined. Heroine surgery because they lost the patient, but she actually died all three times in each surgery and then came back to life and she's had like three or four hundred f- experiences. And then my father was a combat medic from three years in Vietnam on the forefront of very traumatic experiences. And so that was the condition that I grew up in. There was no conversation about this stuff. They were just coping the best they could with chronic pain and emotional pain. And so all the focus was on my mom taking care of her and not on me, which is not a poor me story. But really, I just learned that I have to take care of other people in my needs, essentially, don't matter, and that resulted addiction and things in life codependency that later in life, and and so when I talk about my trauma, it's not sort of this a cute agreed violent trauma that people think it is. It's just essentially version of motion unintentionally and that can manifest into ways of coping right COPA sugar. And that produces a pre diabetic issues later and could've pendant issues and relationship problems and scale busy. And you have those problems. You don't get too far, you know, so I've had really work allow that type of stuff out, and I work primarily with women. And I don't have college degrees or any certifications. But I just asked this question which show by parents nuts in the beginning. Which was why you know, every kid drives her pants nuts with that question. Right. Because I said so because I'm your parent and just persisted because people would set these goals, and then not Cheever forget about them or not get there. And then complain about it, and I just asked why for over a decade? And I kinda started piece together that everyone has something that they went through that was kind of painful that start to inform their nervous system and create their model of the world. And it didn't seem like a lot of development was discussing this issue. They're talking about reframing mindset. They were talking about, you know, limiting beliefs and all of these terms that we hear and if you think it you can achieve it. And all that stuff is true. But what I've done with functional coaching is not to change the conversation. But to deepen it to create more. Context because the mental models of the nineteen hundreds are accurate union models and forty and models and Eric Sonian models. But what we're learning? Now is that there's a lot more mostly going on below the neck than we ever thought possible. And so I've really dwelled in that realm, and there's a lot of research that's coming out about what happens below the neck. And and that's I've found really the stuff that holds people back and can determine whether you're stressed the press. Happy sad abundant or that. Not. And once you kind of get that work inter were kind of done it. You do something like zigzag work, right or Tony's worker. You know, people who are, you know, the sort of people who are great high performance in the strategies it like jet fuel for those strategies. But if you don't do the work, then like, no mindset reframe is really going to get you there. And so my goal is to not discredit or to be against anything. It's more say like, hey, there's this missing piece skies of the salad called the lettuce. And we gotta like include that to have a full salad. You know? As we do. Okay. Well, you mentioned context, and yeah, I wanna get into this issue of trauma because I don't know that I've ever talked about it at least to this death before. So I'm eager to get in there with what I want our audience to hear about because you've got me. I think it's significant and mist in the and I grew up in the personal development world. It's been my vocation always. But come back to context just on you. I actually posted the on Facebook. I shared the interview that Tom Bill you did with you on impact theory who I'm a fan of we interviewed him probably year ago. I think and in there, and I'm going to ask them questions on that here in a little bit. But in that I posted so I shared it. It's the folks looked at it, and I had one guy. So you know, what it's guy. No. And he says I got the book. I was really intrigued I got the book, and it was significant to me he says I studied these gurus, and I was leery of this guy and it made a difference. I was in a place and it helped me get out. So he gave testimony to you. But he. He said in the book, though, I was curious. The tells you talked about you tells the story of you know, you coming on child going into the drugs and the addiction in those things. And then he said it felt like really quickly. Then all of a sudden you've got your act together. You're on stage. You got this big audience. What happened in between their what's the story in there that got you from you didn't wake up on the couch drugged out and the next they have an audience what happened there? I'm curious. Great question. So actually one of the things that I did. And I don't know if this was strategic or maniacal, I'm not sure which but actually the first book ever wrote was called daily love growing into grace, which exactly documents that process because what happened for me was I'm happy to share it. What happened for me was that I would get into someone like, you know, zig or fill in the blank expert, and I would say the same thing like good for them easy for them. But like what was it like when they first got started. I had this sort of self-aware moment of hey, I'm just getting started. Maybe I should document this real quick. So that when I do this. I'm doing this. One hundred years people understand the full answer to that question. But what I would basically say is is that I got really clear on a couple of things I was in the music business. And there was a lot of coping with cocaine and drugs and alcohol and women and all the things that you would think someone's going through and this is the two thousand and one to almost eight issues that period of time and wave before the metoo movement, but I was front row and center for lot of seen a lot type of stuff. I'm a nineteen year old kid, and so I just got ingrained in the sort of toxic masculinity culture, and this drug culture him sergeants to culture and just kind of took that on not knowing really any better. But then getting out of it and kind of doing my own work and starting to realize that's not how it should be. And there's all kinds of pain, I'm experiencing the only way I really knew how to cope was to share. And eventually I kind of like two thousand six or so I kind of started sharing my story addiction and people were. Spotted and then I just started posting quotes in emails in the first Email that ever since. Daily. Love was have three people in the newsletter. Was me, my mom and my second Email address. You know, and I said that outlook, and we just you know, this is no infusion softer hub spot or CRM software automation that and I would just send these quotes out everyday. Basically the quotes that I needed to hear and then people would Senate around and hey put me on there, and it kinda grew. And then pretty soon, I couldn't story more contacts and outlook. I got a couple thousand and it was like freezing. I would send it out and stuff like that. So I thought maybe I should do something about that. And I got constant contact. Oh, yeah. Uploaded all that stuff in the constant contact. And I was like how does this work, and I started out, and I only smart thing I ever did in the early days in two thousand seven is I put up with now a landing page, and all it said was to give the daily love your Email address. And that's all it said, there was no blog content marketing video there's the Facebook live Instagram post. None of that this Email address. And I just published every day consistently. And it was like my little felt like my life counted on it like I had to do it. I can't describe it. It was urgent burning desire and after publishing that for a period of time, you know, four thousand people on here five thousand six thousand seven thousand and eventually in about two thousand nine or so ten I said, you know, what if you go back and get a job in the music business or go behind Reichheld door, number two. And number two is a scare your door a lot more uncertain. Don't really know what's going to happen. And I've sort of liked to take your number two. I was wondering what would have happened, you know. So whenever I'm in a situation where there's a hard decision to make what store one what store to and always go through door to door to was figure out what's up with his daily left thing. And so I left the music business moved in with my ex girlfriend's parents and a pool house that was eight by eight and it was so far away. From the house that there was no internet there. I was ashamed that I didn't go into the house too often the internet's I would go out on the street and find people who didn't have password otherwise published contact eventually figured out. Starbucks Coffee bean had y five cheap coffee, and then my clothes with my coffee all the time because I was there all day. And the most important thing was just always publishing on Email and always publishing on Twitter. That's now called content marketing consistency, and I didn't know about that. I had to put out every day and just felt like this desire and then through that process of putting myself out there. There was discovery, and the model is very well documented now, but you know, influencers discovered the content through organic word of mouth referrals, and it was people like, you know, Kim Kardashian, and eventually got to Oprah and Oprah sort of guy got into her circle and she invited me to a series of events with her life class, and which was a show that they had for time. And then go. Toward them and blog about it. And then eventually I was offered to be on Super Bowl Sunday. And at that point thing is kind of that was kind of the moment. I think they call that. The Oprah affect aren't we? Front row seats that. And the thing is like it's weird because I feel like I don't know about done extensive research. But I never really had a thing. Like most people who go on Oprah. They have a thing. Like, I I'm Dr or I'm a coach I speak about this. And for me, it was just like, I got this blog, and there was no thing. And so I feel like it was almost like I'm super grateful, but I didn't go on Oprah as like a psychologist or as a spiritual teacher. I just went on his Maston. And I don't know to me have done that. And and since I've been on there and started coaching and helping people have made this refinement around so a functional coaching and trauma. But I really feel like it's all about consistency. And I really believe in sense of organic self-discovery. You can't rush certain things even a social media world. There's a sense of it still takes time for people to get to know like and trust you, and I think consist consistency is most important and the other thing upon reflection is that you want to be consistent on the platforms that are relevant. Right. So like, you know, you probably going to be I mean, depending on the demographic direct mail may or may not be relevant for certain people emails becoming less and less, relevant and Instagram and podcasts and social networks and becoming more and more relevant. And I didn't realize that I too I was always like Email, and I realize oh, Instagram Facebook. I realized that there were these other platforms where people could find you. So now my goal is to be sort of omnipresent and consistent, essentially. But that's the goal is just. Distancing. I wish it was a sexier answer. But you know, stick Tunis in. Thanks these sponsors for bringing us today show. Getting access to capital credibly challenging time consuming for small business owners. 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But but in looking at that, and you you have a story like weight loss, you know, everybody who loses weight wants to tell everybody how they did it and show their old pant size and do that. And yet you only end up following a finite amount of those who wanna share. So here you are in this. I'm going to say the personal development arena in and you go out here, and you have a heart for whatever reason to share your story, and what you've figured out with folks, where do you look at trying to discount? The superhero affect that. You just fell out of the sky brilliant. You know, but what do you look at in your creators gifts talents abilities, he's given mast? And where do you look at it and go gosh, I just have a good knack for this. I have a gift for this. And that's what has helped me the influence on the platform idea. Why think I think it's a combination of a lot of things I think that you know, when you look at somebody like, for example, the concept of modeling, right? So like do find out what someone does reverse engineer. Do they do that is a very? Over-simplified idea. And here's why. My success is a combination of things that the environment that I had growing up was privileged for. Sure. Okay. So it wasn't like fighting for my life every single day and being discriminated against every single day. Okay. So I had a privilege upbringing. And I had this mother who still alive who I love tremendously who is into level eleven pain all day every day like in bed bedridden, and every time she will go see these doctors. She would come back and felt like less of her was there know, what was going on. This didn't like these doctors and these pills, and so became this person who just focused on her facial expressions or tone of voice or movements. What if I tried this? What about this? And my father's biologist and the researcher, but my parents are scientists so I had I grew up in a researcher environment. So I adopted this mindset of there's gotta be a solution. So I kept trying to find solutions to help essentially, and I became extremely acutely aware for physical state, emotional state facial expression. Tone of voice, so I was sort of like biological imperative to pay hyper attention to my mother's physiological states at all time tone of voice, I'm certain tone of voice means certain things, and you know, you combine that with a privilege environment. I'm not worried I'm not, you know in notice shooting guns into my house is though Dr highs there's no abuses happening. There's no that's happening. It's just there's this pain happening. And as I got out into the world. I started seeing more of it. And I was like oh my gosh. And I remember the first one of the first clients ever had talked about the visa they had had. And I thought whoa. I'm not prepared for that. Like that's not what I do. But they wanted my help. And I just did the best I could and and through this process of observation coached her and six months later. She was grateful for it. And I thought wow. Like, there's something there. So I just have been very much focused on experiential data and focusing on sort of helping people and it comes from this deep desire that maybe if. I learned enough. My mom will be paying five years ago, I interventions rehab and she's been paying for five years. So that that day came which is a mazing, but it's in my programming to this day. And it's also not I didn't get into the space to be like, some guru or whatever. Like, I got dragged into the space. I got if you will. It's not like I was. Yeah. I want to be that guy. You know, a couple of things that are really interesting to me is one, you know, zig has the study he talks about so often about how this high percentage of world leaders came from either poverty or their own or siblings. Handicap, and his Tomsic learn I have talked about that really come into the life was not about them. So here, you are even though you privileged. But one thing you've got that life is not about you. It's focused on your mom that's significant for your own development. But then the other thing is I'm sitting here right notes. And I'm thinking you got your to give Malcolm glad while his credit put in your ten thousand hours of emotional, intuition and insight. What a training ground. I mean, that's kind of like Bill Gates. You know, he just had access to the computer, and, you know, Michael Jordan had access to the court, and they utilize that, but they did have access that you had how significant here you talk about those those things you're tuned into your mom with. And now you're doing it on stage without the people out there fishing too is predominantly female subway. Interesting. I remember I never one time. I was with Tony Robbins is a buddy of mine, and I've gone to destiny which is a phenomenal seminar. And he asked me what I thought of it and talking to him. And I said, this is amazing. I realized I got you know, basically, I got really good taking care of a wounded woman, basically, and in typical fashion does. Yeah. Look at your career who who you work with. And I was like oh my gosh. And there was one of the first times when I put that together, you know, but yeah. And it's interesting timing because I work with him early women in the conversation on high-performance and Trump and entrepreneurship. In the metoo era as a six five white guy. Very strange if you really think about it. I love it. Will you talk about you know, you didn't look to go to go into being a a guru. But you know, you talk about your coach, we've got a huge amount of coaches and people who would like to be coaches they've been impacted by somebody that would like to do that for somebody else. And yet, we know somebody give you two part question here. A lot of them have a problem going out and coaching because they discount themselves because they're not perfect right, which none of us can be. But here you are on stage. Having a lot of insight a lot of brilliant, a lot of wisdom, and you get a lot of results, and yet people I know, and you know, that they get that perspective you've arrived, and you have figured it all out right Masten here. I'll just give you that question. Yeah. Okay. Great. So specifically for all say practitioners coaches all throat, therapists and mental health workers and there to healthcare providers. The best coaches are always giving coached the best therapists are in therapy themselves for couple reasons one because you're in proximity allowed people who are not always the best state. So you're sort of co regular people who were down regulated not happy. But people don't come to a coach with their because their lights on fire. Right. They come because there's a crisis or transition, and but the best coaches are always coached and they're investing themselves. And I'm a big believer that you got to be heavy client that you want to attract. And so I'm all ways doing my work and the hard part for me has been I can talk myself in and out of any scenario. So it's been very hard to find a coach who can see through my BS. And thank goodness I found that person. And you know, the person can just put the spotlight right on my BSN. I'm like, I know that this person is onto something when the words you're completely wrong. But I'm open to you being right? Come out of my mouth. But I think that I think that, you know, this this this comes from sort of this like nineteen eighties success sort of mindset, where it's like, there's this large delight character. Whether it's Wall Street, or whatever and all this stuff figured out almost like Jesus or some superheroes. Save me. And we deify them, and there's a message from the audiences be perfect. So they kind of portray that. And I thought that was way too much to keep up with personally, it's exhausting, and so I've always been very upfront about so things I'm going through. I don't usually share what I'm going through in the moment with people show what I've processed, but I really be myself as someone more like a sherpa who's like helping someone on the journey with them then sort of like this like coach who's like you show one day be like me or something. That's just not how things because I know everyone has their own stuff. Everybody has their stuff. I appreciate that's one of the things that made zig as popular as he was he led with that personal story, and so much humility, and I see that in you. And I've seen that in the testimonies of those who have heard your message and follow you. Okay. So I wanted dive into this. Well, we're gonna hit the big one purpose, and I'm gonna read I'm going to bear with me mass because verbiage I'm gonna read this is right off the back of the book. And you say there's only one difference between someone who never follows through on their intentions. Someone who wakes up with energy excited to meet the day, experiencing joy, freedom and abundance. What's that difference? The person who experiences true joy freedom in abundance knows their lives purpose and is living it so the word purpose the big holy grail. But as you say right off the bat to it's been overused. It's been so diluted. It's got so much. Baggage yet, it's still the beacon and you define it. As why am I here, and what was I made four. So my question, though, when you talk about purpose, actually, it's kinda. A concern as I look at the culture is are you finding that fewer and fewer people actually believe they do have a unique specific purpose as opposed to. They're just here to do life. Like everybody else does. What's happening? Well, I think a couple of things I mean, we do a lot of data mining and detention today too because I think data what's happening out there. So important to have a pulse on that. And there's a large majority of people who don't know that they have or don't believe that they have a purpose. And I think, you know, we live in a culture today of instant gratification at allies extreme polarization out there. So it's easy to kind of get caught up in sort of. Chronic? I guess you could say pessimism. If you will. And what I would say is is that purpose came into the personal valid space coming from a to parents who are researchers and my dad's PHD biology, I came from hardcore scientific modeling and the scientific method that was in grain in me as a child used to argue sometimes I went to a Christian school. And I would I would argue with people about scientific method versus genus type of Genesis chapter talk about I mean, I'll get into so much trouble as an eleven year old kit like where is talking about, you know, and I was always a trouble trouble maker sets. But but what I got to the personal space. I realize that people like for example, the where purpose is important, but there's no common definition scientists, and you know, Germany or US or China or anywhere the moon. We all agree on the Kelvin scale. You know, like, this is what the is all the same thing. What time is it? In Greenwich Greenwich. Meantime, we all agree that the day is the same day we all operate by that clock and times out. So we have these commonalities that create the ability to have conversation understand each other. But in the personal development space. There's just all these lexicon vocabulary words that different teachers use defined differently or would never define. And so I decided that everyone was asking about purpose. I'll write this book in the context of finding three or trauma, and but I had to define it. And so the textbook clinical definition of purpose is sort of this thing that stimulates a goal to be achieved and the gives you meaning that's basically what purposes usefulness. If you reason why. But I think even more simpler than that purpose is an emotional state that you learn to cultivate, with engine rate within yourself and then express to others in the form of service. What's cool about that definition? Is that it's on you? So you have to be proactive not. Passive in emotional awareness. Like, how do I wanna feel every goal? We set there's an emotional payoff that we're going for of freedom or joy like the money is about the money. It's about the freedom or the certainty of the relationship is about the connection and the romance or the weight loss is about self confidence. So we're all all the great leaders talk about culture and raving fans, like that's all emotional states that are translated into products and services in customer service, and all those things, and you know, Jj Abrams when the force awakens came out who he wrote and directed with Lawrence Kasdan who is the writer of Empire Strikes Back. You know, he he asked the question. The lowest has them. How do we want the audience to feel that was the question that Jj Abrams asked before they read a word? Right. And so starting with an emotional awareness is so important. How do I wanna feel that I need emotional intelligence, which is how do I feel that way? And then I need emotional, fitness, which is doing it. That's the hard part so purpose. My definition of purpose is basically just this emotion that you generate within yourself express to the world in the form of service to others. And that means that the outward expression of your purpose in a business or relationship or child can change. But you're always in control of generating your most states. No matter what's happening. Now, you might not have good practice at it. But you can't learn to control and influence your emotional states. And the most important piece of it is the expression because you think about all this depression, that's happening out there. What's the opposite of depression expression? You know? You know? So there's there's a lot that goes into the idea of cultivating emotions and then expressing to others, but not just for yourself. But in the form of service, and it's a very basic definition that win followed and implemented has drastic drastic drastic positive consequences. Okay. I've got questions on some of the things he said about emotion, but I don't want to jump off purpose just yet. 'cause you talked about purpose in a sense. I'm paraphrasing a little bit. But that you matter to somebody who have meaning and we have those in roles I think easily I'm a husband. I knew what my role is. I purpose there. I'm a father. I know my role is I'm a boss on a friend business partner yada, yada. And yet when we don't have those we can go after those as diction to fulfil purpose when you take those away. And this is why we have meditation is such a big thing right now. And we have to sit with ourselves buyers outside of those roles, then what's our purpose? And that's what you're hitting on in that is daunting. Yeah. Well, I can tell you in my own life, and with many clients that I've seen and I've worked with thousands of people. I have a pretty good experiential data set to pull from you know, when when when people when somebody loses a sense of purpose and utility, that's a very dark path. Okay. Can lude lead to at the at the most extreme case like suicide. Gatien and very dark thoughts. So it's really important to differentiate between a role and purpose because even as a father, even as a business owner, it's not just enough as I am your father, right 'cause some dads mess up their kids, pretty bad and space sagas. But you know, like, it's also the state that you're showing up in the emotional state because that's the most important thing. Because it's I mean, we all know it's about how you make people feel right? Whether that's children clients customers strangers you name it. So it's more about being aware of how you need to feel. And that sounds so simple. But the technical term in the mental health community is called self-regulation like in regulating, your motionless stately thermostat that is one of the single hardest things to do on the planet. It is easier to attain the highest political office become a billionaire than it is to self-regulate. Okay. So it is so hard to self regulate. And then. Maintain that as you're navigating the conflicts of relationship and building a business, and who am I now in all of the things the phases of life that we go through hormonal changes, despite in the gut microbiome brain health, like there's so many things that go into emotional regulation, and it's a it's a very very important thing. So it's not like just like choose to be happy. It's a it's it takes a master to be able to consistently generate and show up in authentic, emotional states. They're a productive in positive on purpose. One more question on it because we could spend the day on it. But what are some of the primary myths that you would say de rail, the concept and the healthy perception of purpose? So one is is that I have to find it. And then get busy doing things. I think the best way to find your purpose is to figure out the problems that you love to solve and the types. Of things that you like to do that come easily to you and merge. Those two things because I think if you have more like this whole sort of millennial mindset of my passion, my purpose is completely distracted people from where to find it. Because it doesn't really matter what you're passionate or your purposes, you wanna solve problems and do do the things that come naturally to you. And you'll find purpose in that process. You want to have more of a craftsman mindset than this sort of like, almost titled mindset, the other thing is is that I have to always have the same purpose, right? Like what like once? I might child leaves the nest I don't have a purpose or once I lose my job or get a different job. I purpose has gone purposes. Something that's always there and someone who's really living their life is going to be asking the question. What's purpose at least once at decade, if not more, especially if you're accelerated growth path? So if you don't know who you are that's the sign that you're growing. Okay. And the final thing is this idea that like I don't have of my trauma work, and I can tell. That because the the blisters the wounds are direct pathway your purposes. Well, and so the idea that I don't have trauma, or I don't need to do that type of work and yada yada is a big misconception to okay do on our listeners to know Gus a month ago somewhere in the last month. I think there's a show that Tom Ziglar. I did where we talked about. You just talked about problem solving in regard to purpose. And it was a really I think of paradigm shifting for a lot of people myself included that in a survey they found eighty percent of people are more problem, solving oriented mindset, then goal that was free for a lot of people said here, you put it in the context of purpose is a perfect marriage. So now, let's go into. I mean, you take aim at purpose and your focal point your muse in essence is trauma. I don't think I've ever had someone do that solely. If at all if at all. So let me take a quote this page. Three and your book your purpose transforms trauma into power and finally set, you free from any person or circumstance that caused you pain. So chief shared some of your own story. But where did you have that revelation of shared it a little bit of trauma? You kept looking around and seeing that's what you you honed in on. I'm gonna say that was your divine revelation of trauma because I feel like it's so that's why you're here. That's why I read the book I looked at the stuff and thought that is significant we have not hit on that. I've done you're my hundred something interview, we have talked about trauma. We talk about stumbling blocks talk about obstacles, but not trauma, and it just rang true mass and bottom, and that's why I wanted to do this. Well, tell us more. Yeah. I know so it's an emerging field. And and my one of my main goals is to normalize the conversation because like you mentioned meditation twenty years ago meditation is just like us find it in the cult. Now, it's like, wait. A good entrepreneur. If you're not doing your meditation mindfulness practice, that's not a competitive advantage and traumas the exact same way. And the thing is that there's very pesky non disgust side to entrepeneurship and business coaching, which is the entrepreneurial 'isolation. Maybe there's a successful launch. But what happened to the relationship deteriorating, and there's a whole mental health issue and component with entrepreneurship because a lot entrepeneurship myself included us business as a socially acceptable way to cope almost an addictive way with unresolved things, and it all stems back to some type of emotional mooning as a child we all have it. And it's just hasn't emerged as important because yet understand if you think about this the bible for a second. Okay. In the Old Testament. When Moses saw God all the burning Bush and came down the moment of the day was don't kill people. Okay. Like that was the big. Right. Like don't murder, we're still working on that one. Then we fast forward to Jesus when if you get the beatitudes in the sermon on the mount all personal development is basically in there where all started perfect and he says above all else. Love your neighbor as yourself will love your heart lot love God with all your heart and soul in Lebanon yourself, and that's pretty basic, but also very powerful. But the idea how do I love myself that has been emerging ever since and it starts to emerge? The idea of William James in eighteen nineties at Harvard. So the father of psychology. Understanding this for the first time we start to roll into Freud. We start to roll into Carl young. We start to roll into Milton Erickson in Virginia sat here in Fritz pearls and all the early thinkers, Milton Erickson, wasn't an Eric Sonian. The test. You just Milton, you know, having report people and making his own discoveries. And then you start to get into a lot of logical models that started to emerge and child development psychology. And you start to get into all the attachment theories and all the things have emerged ever since. And they're still these mental models based on observation data and in the last ten years since we'll human genome. That's when we started really getting into the inner world of, you know, genomics, epidemics, and what's happening on the inside. And William James wrote eighteen nineties psychology was a soft science because we can't measure the data yet. Well, that's not true anymore. And so when you start really getting into the inner world of people's states, you start to understand things like gut microbiome health ninety percent of our neurotransmitters, the feel good chemicals are produced in the gut microbiome. If you have league got despite ISIS, you're not gonna feel good no matter how many formations you do. Right. We understand things like vague. Vegas. Visit which is the pathway in the highway that sends the information from the body into the brain that the livers these neurotransmitters to the brain. If you're able tone is regulated. Well, they're not going to get there. Right. And we've been no this stuff like William James didn't know what the gut microbiome was no new that. You'll Hippocrates said let food medicine, but we didn't realize the personalized the diet individual person because everyone's unique microbiome is different. So we're getting smaller smaller, smaller and smaller. We get the more. We start to realize. Well, what's the cause of chronic disease inflammation, caused by what physical trauma, right? That's was the cause of chronic inflammation. So almost all this is Otis's that are out there caused by damaging the body physically why because we have emotional damage that we have not addressed. And so there's this symbiotic relationship between emotional trauma, physical trauma, and it starts with the emotional trauma. And what comes first the chicken or the the emotional? Trauma comes first, and it gets passed down generation Lii, and we're in the process. Started clean that up and you can talk to any functional medicine doctor any health care practitioner, any health coach anyone who's around people trying to get them to change their behavior, right, folks. Dr can say, yeah. Go on this might have contrary a diet and take these nutraceutical 's and call me a month. But then somehow they still default back to the cinnamon sticks. Domino's right? Like what is that about? Right. It's all in the emotional trauma work. So the people in the forefront of medicine, though, that the emotional work and the trauma where trumps any type of recommendations. And so that's really where we're living now. And so when you start to look entrepreneurs hitting upper limits or couples who are breaking up irreconcilable differences and divorce that really is irreconcilable trauma. If you think about it. And so this is a new conversation emerging conversation. I like to hang out with and focus on the new things because I don't want to be a derivative and all the latest data is pointing towards emotional trauma, emotional regulation. Attachment theory in combination with energy medicine and folks will medicine as like this epicenter for where things have to emerge. So things like meditation are great. But unless you do your trauma work, you're just coping better. And when you do your trauma work things like meditation can just really drive you feel fuel in bigger ways. Okay. I wanna to come back to you said, you made the statement of emotional bruising as a child let's about functional medicine that you mentioned, which of course, I'm heavily involved in we look at supplements, that's a big part fishing supplements. But then as much as we want to tout those they are supplemental. If we had a perfect diet and perfect digestion, we would not need supplements. Most of us will say all of us don't and so we all need to supplement with different things. So we look at our upbringing there. I'm going to say as a father of nine that it is impossible to have. I cannot give my kids a perfect upbringing. I can't be a perfect parent. I can't parent them perfectly according to their individual makeup and personality and trauma best. I can't keep them. From exposure from XYZ at school, teachers, kids, whatever so they are going to have emotional bruising even mentioned just school itself. It can be bruising got some kids being Bruce. Right. So based on that, I say that because I would have tended to be no I was in recent years, even one of those people, so I don't have any trauma. This would not have reached me X amount of years ago. Because I would I don't it is taken counseling to help me. See that. I do. And like you said not a poor me issue. But it's just the reality. I can't again just going back to new Tricia. We cannot be perfect physiologically nutrition in in here. I hear you saying we can't emotionally in. That's what you have found is the primary stumbling block inhibitor handicapped, whatever of our progresses viral and personal development trying to tout everything and yet we have a culture who doesn't seem to be getting better. Yes. End because emotional trauma, work is the root cause of all root causes. It's bottoms out there. It's like there's. Nothing else that we can now yet measure that is the cause of every other problem in the world. And the thing that's important understand is that let's talk. Let's take what you're saying about your kids, which is true heartbreaking. And also something that we can get through right because you want to be there, and I have children, but I have a lot of people I love and I want them to suffer. But here's the thing. When you think about somebody a polyphenyls, right, which is like something. That's usually pretty good for your body and pretty good got resilience. Why is it? Good for you. Right. What goes into your body, and your gut judge us track and actually causes a little bit of scarring that your body response to that produces resilience in the right? So think of gut health, right? If you have a leaky, gut then the food that you eat doesn't digest doesn't absorb ends up in your body and all kinds of problems stemmed from that issue and chronic illnesses. So are you gonna treat yourself every once in a while, you know, like one of my favorite treats have been all over the world, the fanciest places in the world. I still love me. Some domino cystic you need like doesn't that? You can take the kid out of the mid west. But you just can't have been been west out of the kit. You know, you just can't do it. So, but like, you know, like if I have leaky. And I have those that type of food on a treat meal it's going to ruin me for months, right? But if I have a resilient gut if I've done my probiotics prebiotics done, my polyphenyls, and I've done my Elga meeting. I've done the things I need to do to create that resilience. Then when I have the stuff it takes me out for an hour or two. So the goal is not and not have exposure to paint. The goal is to learn how to build resilience in the face of pain because emotional trauma isn't in of itself. Bad. It's how we hold it. How we respond to it? And you know, when you go to the gym, and you work out, and you rip your muscles apart. That's micro trauma. Right. So what we want to do is we want to build more motion resilience just like we have got resilience muscle resilience. We need emotional resilience. And that is really the key because a world that where most trauma is resolved isn't a world where there's no pain. There's just no suffering. Goodness. That's a big that is a big state. I actually got a time stamp on that I might use that as the intro here. So I'm going to take that and go back you just mentioned emotional resilience a little bit ago. You talked about I got it. Right. Emotional awareness, emotional intelligence, and emotional, fitness, which I would put I assume emotional resilience as a bullet point under emotional, fitness. But take us through a quick journey of the average us on the scale where we are with the motions Ernest intelligence, fitness, sir. So so the first thing to understand for context because for some reason when we start talking about this in the context of personal development. People's commonsense goes out the door and magical thinking takes over. So so if you were going to go get a hundred pounds more than you need to okay, you don't go to a four day fitness seminar and expect to lose one hundred pounds and keep it off the rest of your life. No matter what you do. Okay. Like suction? Maybe I don't know. But even then expect to keep. If it off if you don't change your lifestyle, like nobody has an expectation, but for some reason in personal development, they think I went to one therapy session. I went to one seminar, I read the book, and it didn't work, and it's like, well, did your workout twenty years ago work, you know, like I'll know it's about a lifestyle transition, not this quick fix three day four day thing. It's about a lifestyle transition because with a physical fitness people who are physically fit train, everyday right people who are mostly fit have emotional training, practices or habits every single day. So I wanna put that in the context it's a lifestyle transformation. It's not like a three day thing that worked or didn't work. You know, seminars in books and coaching are opportunities to have portals of awareness where you get outside of a pattern. That's been holding you back, and you can make a decision and hold on for dear life. They make that decision real. But no seminars going to fix you in three or four or five days. It's not going to have it, but they can shift the pro your emotional temporarily. So it's important thing that understand because in the context of trauma and personal development and emotional awareness. I would suggest and submit to you that most people have very little emotional awareness, even people who are in personal development because the focus for the majority not all there is definitely segments. But the focus for the majority of persons of element is on success in chievements. There's not a lot of people really talking about how to have stress free success stress, free, productivity stress and depression free relationships. They just want the Instagram photo. Okay. And, you know, look at me with my Lamborghini in my garage. Like, that's that is sort of a lot of what's popular the problem is, and I get to talk a lot of people behind the scenes is that you get the stuff and anybody who's on the quest to think that money will make them happy clearly has never had any. Okay. Because once you get it, you realize oh my goodness. Now what right because yes, your basic needs are taken care of. But doesn't make you happy and fulfilled so emotional where does this huge? How am I feeling most people don't wanna ask that question? Because when you ask that question, the first thing, you meet is all the stuff you haven't felt right, which is not fun or they think that one therapy session five years ago. I already worked on it. No. It's like it's like a motion. Trump virus? It can go dormant. They can flare up. And so it's about having daily practices to be able to create emotional weirdest. Emotional intelligence is learn practice that requires a lot is like education to figure out. What do I how do I wanna feel and what are the practices for me to feel that way consistently and that can be extremely difficult, especially for perfectionists because the perfectionist response is a response to trauma early childhood where our needs were not met by parents. And we think if I could just get it, right? And finally be love and safe. And there's no formula to keep that. And so you know, perfectionism is the enemy disa- financial success, but of emotional happiness and fulfillment. And so, and there's a whole inner critic coversation of all the things that you should have done wrong. All that all the ways we talk down to ourselves the purpose of the inner critic it actually has a purpose. It's not a bad thing. The purpose of data critic is say if you could just do this one thing then you would be safe. It's just misinformed. And so as we start to get into emotional awareness intelligence, we have to come face to face with our inner criticisms how we blame others. Do we blame ourselves have? Shame like how have we outsource our power? I don't like to use the word victim because I think in our society, there's too much blame the victim network is so loaded. So what I will say is is that most people have learned pests city, they have learned to be passive and to let things happen to them and in a motion intelligence and awareness. You start to realize that you can be proactive and the emotional fitness process is the act of being proactive in the middle of very uncomfortable feelings because if you're having Zaid depression, or any of these emotional responses, you've trained your body to how those responses over a period of time, and you have to untrained yourself that way and the way that you heal trauma. Is you have to relive it and she's differently. So it's not for the faint of heart. Right. You have to go back into those emotional states. And it's almost like every story ever seen where like Luke confronts, Darth Vader or in labyrinth, Sarah, confronts, David Bowie and says you have no power over me. We have to go in. That's the whole metaphor the hero's journey as you have to go into the cave. If the face Vader yet to face volume, which is this trauma this experience. And so you know, what not this time? And that is why these stories resonate with us so strongly is because that's what we have to do. But we can't watch it on Netflix. We can't see someone else Instagram account. It has to be onto logical experiential process that each individual goes through. Okay. So what does that daily emotional fit? And I love your perspective of that. If you're gonna work out and put on fifteen pounds of muscle or lose fifty pounds of weight. It's going to be every day for long period of time. When you talk about emotional working out in essence, fitness gives them ideas little tangible. Our next show is going to be the habit show. We'll talk about your personal habits. But what are some ways for somebody hearing this right now some initial st-? Steps of how can I start once and I gather if I'm you know, that comes after emotional wariness emotion. Yes. And now, how do I start working on this? And of course, folks will get the book. That's the whole point. Here is is getting into this stuff. And study it start walking down, but just some highlights on emotion or fitness daily. So so so so let me just put in context people to understand. So so I'm a believer in the emerging field of personalized nutrition where each individual person has a food. That's right for them. And what's good for? You may not be healthy for me a lot of work with a couple of called volume who's out front on microbiome science. And that's what the data is showing that there's just per there's food that might be healthy for one person. It's not healthy for somebody else. So I can't exactly give recommendations, but I can give broad principles because each individual person would essentially have a unique approach, but here's one very very, very, simple and. Please. If you're listening don't confuse some simple with valuable. Okay. So one of the things in our body that regulates how we feel is the Vegas nerve. Those two parts of the biggest I won't go into the anatomy and all the science behind it. But it regulates anxiety things like depression, if you have a lot of emotional feelings in your diaphragm in the right side of your neck. That's a lot of a lot of information for the biggest runs through. A lot of panic attacks. A lot of depression, a lot of things i-it-it's a lot of not good feelings are called neuro -ception, which is emotional data coming up for the body into the brain via the Vegas nerve. So one of the things you had to regulate the biggest nerve to calm down. And you want to activate what's called the Vega. L- break Vega. Break is just a way to think about the biggest calming down. And here's how you do is so simple when I first heard this. I thought you've got to be kidding me. Okay. You wanna make if you have a ten or twenty second breath eighty percent of your breath and ex HALE and twenty percent in hill. If eighty percent of your breath, isn't exile activate the Bruegel break. And so as a very practical example wake up in the morning, I have a little bit of caffeine, some amino acids, and I do a one hour steady state cardio where my heart rate is somewhere between eighty and one hundred twenty beats per minute. And I breathe. With eighty percent exhales over sixty minute period of time. My body the endorphins everything starts to wake up and my nervous system starts to call down. And I enter my day in a completely different state than if I'm hyperventilating during cardio, and that is it's so simple. But it is a game changer for how you can start to in engage with life. The other thing I would say is I wrote the book it came it came from about ten years of working with people and making relations and used to be like only fifteen thousand dollar retreat with this process be available. And I was like, no no we need to make this available to everybody because it super important. But in the book, I talk about how to really get down to some of the court traumas that you have based on some of the behaviors that you want to change. So once you get down there, and you realize, wow, I went through this thing, I've coped you didn't start to basically do the opposite. So give you a very specific example, one of the core things that I do when I get triggered when my. Traumas or flares up is to isolate. So they don't talk to me. I want to be alone. I wanna go by myself one of the worst things that I can do or anybody can do 'isolation is is a major driver of mental health decline. So I have to take contracting and admit to say my girlfriend or a friend of mine or fellowship. I am going through a fog. I'm going through a hard time right now. And do what we're doing right now, which is called co regulation. What's fascinating, the data is that the mental health space a lot of a lot of the personal space. The messages you have to self regulate your motionless date, you have to be in control of your motions. And if you can't be in control of your motions, and we're going to medicate, you, however, the data shows that we're actually social creatures the brain is a social organ, and that the markers and the qs for self-regulation are embedded in co regulation between people and Jesus said this in the bible where two or three are gathered there. I am in their midst. He's talking about coagulation, right? So. So we all for me. It's also about had a regular with the right people. Right. You don't want to regulate with a pessimist or someone who's gonna bring you down. You want to be with people who you trust who will nurture who care for you, very basic things, but they can be a complete game. Especially in today's digital age where there is so much 'isolation. Okay. I'm gonna give this. We could go on for days. Your folks really the book was the book was significant. I love how you wrote it in these snippets. You got a lot of chapters, and I want folks to to dig in but at face value with this with this book with this message claim your power, what is a not. I'm not talking about the critics. I'm talking about the people who truly care they want to engage. They wanted digest. But what for them what are some primary false perspective that people have come in to this that allows them to fall on the wayside that you would. I love to dispel help them. Get I say to the critics out there. I think that a critic or skeptic is optimised who has unhealed trauma about something. Okay. So they definitely need the work. But just come into it. Open minded that's beautiful is that a lot of people who are critics or whatever. You know, there's a justifiable reasons and went through something the personal element space is riddled with people who have not had the best intentions, and by the way, zig Ziglar is the opposite of that zig. Ziglar is one of the main reasons I said, if this guy can exist who's a cool, dude who's like legit who so hard centered. Maybe there's a place for me because I just didn't. It was nice cited to I get into the personal space. So there's a reason why people critical, and you know, what if you've dealing critical cool work under Challah. But when it comes everybody else, I would say that the biggest biggest misconceptions, I don't have trauma. That's the big if you have anxiety, if you have stress if you have just by if you're if you're overweight, if you're in arguments, if you're not achieving the results you want to be achieved in your life. You have trauma. You got it agai and every human being does. And that's probably the biggest misconception. The other biggest misconception which is not just for people who read the book. This is in general is that gonna limb here. And I'm gonna say something that is probably a little forward. But I'm gonna say it. If you are working with anybody who is not trauma informed. You've got to have a trauma informed person on your team change your life. Your you had to have it's like having an allopathic doctor having a functional medicine doctor. They're only going to treat the symptoms. If someone's going to have a medical problem, you've got to go see a functional medicine doctor to get to the root cause figure out why your thyroid offer wise your liver doing what it's doing. Our wise your lipid profile high. The same thing is to impersonal element. Not everyone who team has to be trauma informed. But you've got to have a trauma informed person on your team and the the place where a lot of problems stem is from what's called a VM and the DSM is diagnostic and statistic manual for mental health orders. It's published by the American psychiatric association, and it is where people Clinton's go to diagnose people, and they use a word in this book that is so causing so much pain, which is the word disorder. I'm going. Say and I said before I'll say it again one hundred percent of mental health problems are the body's response to coping with trauma. It's not a disorder. It's a response, and you've got to start to focus on the underlying pattern that has gone maladaptive and look at whatever the mental health disorder is or whatever the functional healthcare disorder as as not a disorder. But as at bodies appropriate response to underlying dysfunctional or maladaptive pattern just like infomercial medicine. Right. Diabetes is the appropriate response to a one c levels that are not optimal or high blood sugar right mental health disorders, multiple personality associated disorder, maybe instead of viewing as disorder. We start to realize that person has a complex trauma history. And look how creative they are at coping with it. Wow. And we should look at people who have stress, anxiety, depression or any mental disorder as a champion of. Survival and as nothing short of heroin. And so if you're going through stress, if you're going through a hard time, if you having Zaid if you have depression, your journey is horrific, and I will say that you can get to the root cause, and we know neural plasticity, Israel, you can start to change your nervous system, and how you response, and when you start to how you respond, and when you start to combine the functional coaching process with functional medicine process. Your life can change in ways that you never thought possible. And you've got to have someone on your team who has trauma informed and don't take a diagnosis as a prognosis for life. That's a great place to end. Like, I said we would. But I'm not going to have one. I have one more thing that you brought up, and it was actually in regards to the initial court about critics as people who have undiagnosed trauma or untreated trauma that is this and forgive me. If this is in the book, and I didn't get to it looking at trauma, our own or others as such a significant as the as you said the root of the root of their of their issues of their path. All Ogies, we could say does that not would that not for ourselves and others create a dramatic amount of grace. Oh well. Chills because. Here's the thing. That's important understand. What is what is the definition of grace, I defined Grace's unearned divine favor sort of gods? Yes. Your life into your purpose. Not your neurosis and your trauma to your purpose. And to the part of you that is hurt. That's that's perfect impure. And here's the thing when we start share prices at the beginning when we are talking about trauma. There's this idea to explaining it somehow justifies behavior, and there are people who are doing things racist things phobic things violent things and acknowledging they have trauma does not make it ok does not justify the values and certain values should be rid from your. So we talk about grace. We quote, Paul Paul says grace exists. So that sin may about hell knows what Paul says. Right. And this is coming from a former murderer who had a divine encounter. Right. So so so he knows what he was talking about in the Sindh department. Do we talk about trauma? So that people can perpetuate more things and justify it. Absolutely. Not how ever even though we can agree that violence, and misogyny, and racism, and all the crazy things that are happening today. There's certain values that you just be wiped off the earth have no purpose anymore. When we start to realize that there's no such thing as a bad response. There's only an adaptive response to trauma, grace enters the picture and that. It is what is so incredible about it, and that's both a spiritual and religious conversation and scientific conversation. So when Jesus said forgive them father. They know not what they do. He was literally accurate. You could be interpreted other way by saying forgive them father just trying to survive they don't realize threat because they're so scared, they're so traumatized. So this has huge correlations to any spiritual teaching space. I mean, I gotta cross on my arm. I I'm a Christian mystic, and I love my JC. But if you look at the teachings of Jesus through the conversation of trauma, what is since sin is an archery term means I missed the Mark. And I missed the Mark because I'm hurt. And that's his whole message at the first of you that was about cast stone. Like, it's all there. It's just settle a differently and now the data and the scientists starting to catch up with things that most of us have known to be true for a long time. But now we have the data to prove it, which I think is just so cool. So grace one hundred percent because if you think about from God's perspective created these creatures that are wounded hurt in the working through this process. And if you literally don't know it's possible, and you're just trying to survive, of course, grace has to exist. I am confident mass than that as as it has been for me during this time that the tens of thousands of folks listening to this podcast, you just opened up a world of paradigm shift and hope for them and the possibility of freedom from these issues, it just it's across the board. Again. That's why I was in Amer to begin with now, I am I am even more. So. Got about a list of fifteen things on talk to you further about. But we'll we'll save those. Thank you for doing. What you do to come out to give this message to give it from your heart to give it from your authentic and to open up a new world for us. I'm I'm incredibly grateful right here right now. Thank you. Well, it's been my pleasure. And I haven't been able to talk about this conversation. The context of a lot of my spiritual religious beliefs. So it's it's a really cool thing to be able to bring them into the conversation shoes. It's tremendous gift for me as well. Thank you so much mass than friends. I hope this message gave you cause for pause. I'm seriously. This message is stuck with me for the week since I've talked with Masten talked a lot of other people about it what trauma and again be broad on that scope of what trauma is don't think about just tragedies. Talk about him. But what trauma limited have you had in your life? Have you dealt with it? It'd be found peace and ask how it could acquit you for more to offer great things. A really encourage you to check out mass book claim your power again, you can find it where you buy books or connect with mass mass, then Kip dot com. Non com, please let mass Massin know what you got from this show my leaving review, and I tunes Ziglar show. Mention mass in this show in the value you specifically received from gift to him to us to everyone coming up next in show, six thirty two. We get a message from zig Ziglar on how everything in our life matters because everything affects everything I just posted on Facebook. This question, what is the one area of your life? You improved only defined positively affected improved other areas of your life and wrote out the seven spokes Ziglar wheel of life for people to reference, which of course, are physical nutrition number one to family three is mental for financial spiritual sixes career seven is personal. So I asked Michelle prince to join me and talk through your mazing comments, which she did reported the show about about an hour. Actually, really really rich such diverse sharing buddy is incredibly it a lot out of it until then dank you as always for letting me walk with you as we inspire are true performance together.
The Ziglar Show
Aired 1 year ago 39:15
LADS#91 - Will Rivard From Tottenham Hotspur World
Oh. No, no. No. This thing of our guys. Welcome in to allow American scuffing soccer podcast. Or lads podcast is podcast is brought to you by stadium. Zine dot TV the best place to find the best parking, restaurants and bars for your favorite sporting events. Today is Saturday special and I am joined and honored to be joined by will from Tottenham Hotspur world. We've done several other podcasts together. I believe two foot. Talk a bro. Socking soccer. We've I've never I've been trying to get will on the podcast. He is the arch enemy of me as a as the arsenal supporter of lads. But we're we're good friends at relief. So, you know, our put that aside I'm very excited to have you on will. So please tell the people at home where people can find you and talk a little bit about Tottenham Hotspur world. Awesome. Thanks, kevin. Nice words from arsenal supporters. That's always good especially after the day. We just had. But anyways, guys, you can find me on Twitter at world Hotspur You can also if you wanna check out my blog online, it's tough. Them Hotspur world dot com. And basically what I'm doing my sight is I'm trying to cover Spurs from every angle. So recently we've been doing articles on under eighteen team which is undefeated right now. The Spurs ladies richer undefeated on top of their league as well. And under twenty three team. They're struggling a little bit right now. I think they're in like fifth or six, and of course, you know, the first team, but basically with with my sight, you know, the name of it says it all Tottenham Hotspur world, whether you're in the United States, whether you're in Europe, whether you're in Africa wherever you are on the planet. We want to bring you in and makes you feel a part of Spurs. And that's no matter what club you support or what part of our club you support. Whether you're under eighteen hundred Twenty-three Spurs ladies fan or first team. So that's me. All right. Awesome. Well, will I'm not going to mince worries going to cut around the edges. I wanna get right into the action that occurred today in the Champions League Tottenham versus PSV, correct? Yes. That's correct. Okay. What the hell happened? What's going on is Tottenham falling out of the Champions League. Obviously. This was a rough draw. Correct. Yeah. I think this draw was actually worse than last year. If you look at last year was really tough draw, you know, had an adrit Dortmund apple well from Cyprus. But I think you know, if you watch them play I think I heard today they have outscored their opposition their league twenty something to one the season. I think only conceded one goal in every dizzy, so they're obviously a quality opponent. We had a tougher draw. That's not really excuse though. And what what I would say about our match today is a microcosm of our season. Okay. We had missed opportunities that came back to bite us just like dating wokv, erred and Inter Milan. We had costlier by Hugo Hugo lorries, you know, the red card late in the match. I don't know what's going through his mind. I played keeper. And I haven't had a moment. Obviously like that in a major game because I'm not that good. But you know, another mistake by him. And just our inability to close out games. I think has been really troubling. So far with some of these big time matches. Yeah. I think there's been a certain lack of edge with that be fair to say where like it seems like some teams like Liverpool right now man cities got his together where these games they'd usually draw or lose their now winning you've seen that recently Liverpool in the league. They're getting these one nil win such as like hundred field over the weekend and playing these gritty matches. What's what's going on? Is it a mentality thing is it? I don't I don't think it's a quality thing. I think you have quality over the pitch. What do you think it is? So I think it's a factor of so many things if you look at Spurs we beat a West Ham over the weekend. One nothing in London stadium. You know for for them. We are their biggest rival is their Cup final. It was not a pretty game. But we saw out one nil. So you take West Ham and no disrespect the PS v. We can beat west and one nil in West Ham hostile conditions. We should be able to see out a win against. PSV? So I think another culprit of this. And I think you're gonna see this a lot teams in the league is fatigue from the World Cup. You know, we had nine of our starting eleven play all the way into the semi finals and in the final. So you know, we played our base. Are starting eleven is basically played that many extra matches this year, and that's not a total excuse. But I think that plays a part in a lot of these clubs that had a lot of team had a lot of guys play heavy minutes in the World Cup. Deli alley is out. I think. I wanna say November December the hamstring injury for Tong in. He's out 'til November December, you know, Danny rose all these guys play major minutes in the World Cup. So I think that's affecting our squad in to your point some of it isn't entirely, you know, I feel like it Spurs we take baby steps every year. You know, the year Lester won the title that was your Mark for us to win the title. I know you guys came in second arsenal came in second. But I think this team that we have right now with one the tie. Will we came in second Chelsea the year after last year, beautiful Champions League run we get undone in ten minutes again against you. Venezuela. Just terrible marking and stuff. So I mean, that's I think it's combination all those things. Yeah. Which is. So it feels like other teams may have been taking more leaps and bounds. I've seen tremendous leaps as such as main city since the lesser city and Chelsea winning the Premier League. I've seen now Liverpool take some leaves. But like you're saying it seems like a very gradual incline from town the more I feel. There's a growth, but is not as exponential. As those teams. You know what I'm saying? Oh, I totally agree. And I think part of the issue with Spurs right now is you can look into the transfer market. And we didn't sign anybody enter that's a big story. But I think there's parts of our team we can upgrade like leftback, Danny rose. And he's on one of the best in the league. But when his fit, you know, been Davies played today. He's Welsh Sunday you like that. Oh, yeah. I just don't seem. He is the top. He's not a good enough leftback from Champions League standpoint. I mean, he's done great for his trip here. I think he's great with his free kicks and stuff. But you know, surge aria even call Walker. Peter's have a much higher potential than than cure in trickier. And again love love trickier to death that this this is he will never be better than he is this point right now rose those other two guys I think can be better than him in our midfield. You know, little of Mussa dim barely. But we have to start looking at. We have start spending some money at some point in upgrading our squad a little bit. If we wanna take the next step of DiBa leave it is lack of financial aid. I know you are dealing with a whole stadium move. You're like a team without a home stadium. Really right now. Do you think that weighs in some factors arsenal is still? I just got done talking James Copeland from Sunderland. He was speaking about how arsenal has just just paid off the Emirates. I mean, do you think that weighs in a bit like the lack of home stadium? I think it plays a part. I think I think our guys will come through at Wembley at this point though last season. I think you could see early in the season, we just it's so different because White Hart Lane. I think they got a special distant dispensation where that pitches a little bit smaller in. So if you're oppressing team like we were we were there, you could you could press people to death and get the ball off them and win. Really stadium. We don't have we did not have that. So I think we had to change the way we played last season, which might have hurt us a little bit. So to answer your question. I think that plays a part, I think the financial aspect, you know, Daniel Levi's, the chairman, and he's a lightning rod one way or another lots of Spurs fans love and lots of them hate him. I'm kind of in the middle. I think he's done a great job building our club financially responsible from financial standpoint. But last summer when our main target is Jack relig- from Aston Villa, and we can't get that over the line. I think that's worrisome, and I think it was just over like five or ten million hinder here there, and I agree with you know, he's he's been good in the championship. I think with the manager like potted Tina we've seen when he's done with talent. Like Delhi alley. Harry. Kane Danny rose, Carl Walker young English talent, I think he can take jet Grece to that next level. And if we had him right now, he would probably be hitting his stride either. Now or. January. So I think that not to say that jet greenish. That's our answer our season, but stuff like that. I think is what's holding us back. Okay. Yeah. I've kind of noticed that names that haven't been you know, in the past couple of seasons. It's been the dailies the Harry hurricanes Ericsson's, those are like, you know, there's been your bread and butter the past couple of seasons. I've kind of noticed some other names names that we were kind of familiar with. But some have stepped up such as Lamella. I've got that. Nice goal the header for West Ham this weekend. He's kind of stepped up. He's had some injuries over the past couple of seasons. Also, look Mora has been a face. That's been popping up a lot. What are your thoughts on that? Like what's going on with Harry Kane? He's kind of like Tottenham kind of been kind of like, you know, good. But not like just kind of like sneaky kind of good. You know, what I mean, not not like been kinda quiet. Yeah. I think I'll start with more and will Mel. Lamella? I think he missed almost two years. He had a couple of different hip surgeries and stuff. And I think he is. We're finally seeing the player we thought we bought from a Roma a few years ago think that supporters you have to be really patient with lamelo he did not start today. A lot of people were saying why can't we start him and all this which have to realize this guy. He's come back from injuries healthy you really have to manage these players minutes when you have all these fixtures. And so he can't start every game where he will get hurt again. So I think he's playing great to the supporters that wanted to play ninety minutes every day. I think he can get there. But I think we have to be real careful. Deli alley. The reason he's not playing right now he had a hamstring injury. He came back for the care about game against Wofford hurt it again now he's out an extended period of time. So we have to be really careful with these injuries. Lucas mora? I think I think that's the blueprint for what I think Spurs must be trying to do in the transfer market. Bottom last January. You know, we played a little bit last year. He finally kicked on you know, you look when he against United. You know today against PSV. He looks like a like a totally, you know, gist racehorse of a player can run his socks off. And all that. So I think as far as those players go that's kind of where we're at. In your Harry Kane question, I think a lot of that goes with Ericsson Ericsson missed two or three games. And if you if the match today here Kane has to have some service here, and there, I think he's a great player. He's great linka play. But when you're missing Christian Erickson deli alley in that midfield you unless you have Harry winks in there. You know, we don't really have a pure playmaker back there. You know dim Bailey bulldog beast. He's awesome dire. We know just about took out Sergio ram a couple of weeks ago. So I think. We're just missing someone to get came the ball. And I think the World Cup has a little bit infect on him to events us questions. Yeah. I think there is like you said before there is a lot of fatigue in that Tottenham squad because they both like Belgium England going so deep into the World Cup. You even see with players like most lot who only played three games. You know, he's still trying to get his own rhythm after going deep in the Champions League. And then followed up by the World Cup. He was also done by injury. So do you think there is no recovery from this PSV draw? Do you see yourselves somehow getting continuing your campaign in the Champions League? Or do you think it's like all right back to Europe elite? It's as our that's our home. That's gotta have gotta go back home. You know, I hate to say it, but I was going to bet on it. I just don't see how we get out of this group. You know in for us this Champions League season the Inter Milan game. We had a one one though league going into like I think we can see the equalizer in the eighth minute and gave up the game winner in the ninety third minute. And so you look if we somehow out that Milan match, we've got four points right now. You know, we're sitting pretty even if we pick a draw in that match that is absolutely huge. I don't see anyone taken points Barcelona. They have messy today, and they still be enter. You know for us to get out of this group. We're gonna have to take maximum maximum points and hope that PSV in Barcelona take points off enter, and I just I watched interplay this last week in and they, you know, it's funny. We played them in the Champions League. They were like, I think thirteenth in the table. They were just floundering terrible season. They beat us, and they have been unbelievable run ever since they beat us out. It's kind of the turning point from both of these teams as far as Champions League goes the season. No. I watched the Milan Darby myself and e- Cardi while he's just phenomenal. I would and the rumor is he might be heading over to Chelsea to replace Murata. They're going to bring in a real Halfa finally to play I think Murata salt. I think he's probably I'm not saying, he's not talented. The guy is salt is butter. It's like, I don't I don't care from her outta. I say they start to rude as much as a paint me. I have an arsenal. Drew jersey hanging in my class. At also have a Sanchez arsenal. Jersey hanging in my closet. You know, I got the jersey curse right now. But I would love to see Cardi weekend and week out on the Premier League. But I think you're right. I think it's going to be quite the uphill battle for Tottenham. But I'm just saying if you had into Europe league, and if you guys somehow poff or your leak wind, I think I'd be a successful season any type silverware like I don't want to be that asshole. I don't be that dick he talks about the lack of civil where. But I think your opaline. That would be phenomenal for you guys would and you and you know with Europe, you do get that automated Champions League spot. I'm sure we'll talk about this later. There are no guarantees in the Premier League in the top six will unite. It's not going to be there. Sorry, Martin whatever. But the but the other five, and there is no guarantee how that's going to play out. You know, you look at how tight everything is. So to your point yet winning rope leg this year that is huge because you get that spot for us. I wonder if we get into that how much we're going to prioritize that I think some of it will have to look at the fixtures. You know, we have counting the match today. We have six matches the next seventeen days. So that is an Abbiati. And back to your point on the stadium. So we were supposed to be in the new stadium. Will there's NFL game at Wembley. This weekend's we're supposed to play city on Saturday. We play city on Monday. We turn around play West Ham care about Cup on Wednesday. So no. So that you know, you're gonna have to rotate the squad fully, and I don't know what kind of squad West Ham's gonna bring. So the care about Cup. If we can get past them. I think we've got a shot there. But I think you have to prioritize prioritize the league between those two. So yet to your point. I think the rope league if we're there we do need to go into that strong. And and try to win that tournament and not just look at it. Like a Thursday night curse. You know? So let's move into your goals for the season. I think we brought in their Europa league. Let's move into the Premier League. You guys are sitting right now in fifth. Tied with arsenal. Correct. But his go differential believe you guys are goal differential. 'cause you're banging them in for fun at this point. Yeah. I mean, it just Bobby on just getting sitters, and it's amazing. It's making me so happy. But no, this is about Tottenham. I don't not going to talk about arsenal. I'm not I'm not going to talk about arsenal. Anyway, it's crazy because all the accurate right now have been about the top three massively Chelsea and Liverpool, obviously. And then arsenal is finally after their ten game winning streak. I'm not gonna talk about arsenal. But I'm just saying you're tied on points. And you're not far off one in two right now at all in the in the table. But like it feels like those four m mantis United because they're just a mess. But no one's really talking about Spurs. But you've been like low key like really good. So what do you think? What do you think that stems from like, I think you guys have been gritty you obviously had the loss to Liverpool. That was the big loss, right? Really the what losses they're really damning one. Because if you look at that, we had a one nothing lead. I think they equalised in the fifty or sixty minute and they win ahead. Four minutes later. And if we win that game, we're in first place right now, we're first place in the league Liverpool loss I can live with that one their their tremendous team. They're gonna be tough for anybody to beat. But if you want to win the league, you have to beat the teams you're supposed to beat what for this started off hot. If we see that game out. We're in first place right now if you look at the table so that to me is the biggest disappointment of the season thus far Champions League. And that's and that's Premier League champions league's a whole different animal. But I think I think for us our team is growing because we are seeing out these one no victories we did against West Ham. We'd be Cardiff one card. If can't score, you know. I mean, they just they just can't, you know, they'll be in the championship before we know it. But. The team is becoming more mature, I think from that standpoint. So again baby steps for us were right there. I don't know if we can contend for the league. But you know, if we city on Monday night, you know, look out. Hey, hey. I'm just I'm just it's just crazy because arsenal Tottenham are only two points. Off the top two and tied with Chelsea for like a three way tie essentially sides. Takeaway go differential, you know, what I mean? I just think it's crazy that no one is talking about right now. At least at least I'm looking at like social media. The big talk spin man city Liverpool. What is doing of Chelsea what doing with arsenal? So I don't count them out. I think it's going to be a really tough tough fight for the top four. And I had you guys hand to God. I had you guys at the beginning of the season. You people can go fact check me go actually, go give us a couple of more downloads on leads. But I had you guys in my top four at the beginning of the season. So I can easily see you guys getting back into the Champions League next year. I mean, not easily, but I see you in the Champions League next year. I think so and maybe what we need to do is we need to convince Paci. No, I am ready to just start tune on cigarettes because obviously starry that's working. I mean, I don't think the cigarettes would go to well-fed Hugo, Boss suit Paci. Nowhere is not think I don't think that's Emory style. Just start chewing on cigarettes, man. Hell. Probably probably Marlboro deal in there somewhere, you know shit. Sorry shipping over Copenhagen long cut and winter green. And you know, what is bring dip actually, we should start English coaches dipping. I mean, they banned smoking, but he lets you know, what's chewing cigarettes or not dipping. You know? That'd be actually I think the English media would lose its God damn mind. If like Emory are Paci no had like a fat lip in their mouth. I would just it would just be the weirdest thing. I remember what's it called my roommate's from BMI? Because the I went to military school dipping was the big thing. They actually sent me over dip to England because they don't sell it over there. They don't even know what it is. So I think people would just be like what the hell is going on is he just like sucking on cigarettes knows just you know, just just dip and thinking Sam Allardyce dipping. I mean that's perfect for me. Gum like a crazy person. Just putting the chew in their man. Yeah. I'm very Harry canes going to pop what's Ericsson's healthy. You think he's going to go like because I had him along with. I think I had a Bobby on which is kind of a long shot. And maybe I have most Salah I think I had them as like golden boot contenders canes going to get back into the swing things. I think he can I think, you know, Spurs in general if we can get through this tough fixture list of fixtures. I think we can get there. You know Kane is in phenomenal shape. And you know, I think he I think we can get there. We just have to put away our chances. You know, I don't know how many games the the one games we've won this year. We could have won every last one of those two three four to nothing. It's just putting away their chances. I don't you know. And I think I think he'll round into form. I don't know if win the golden boot made has our hate say, I mean, he is playing great. And then so I don't know has been. Unreal. But even when he went PFA player of the year. I think he only had like fourteen goals in like twelve it was like he had like almost as many goals as assess. It was like I see him more as having that kind of goal to assist ratio than being over twenty goals. A season kind of player. You know what I mean? Oh. So in terms of the top six who has impressed, you the most is a man cities way that like to blow out teams by like five goals or as been liver pools. Way of fixing up their back end and fixing the defense because reme- I it's almost a toss up. I know man city has a goal differential of twenty three goals right now compared to second place Liverpool at thirteen which is ridiculous. But anyway, who's impressed? You the most this Premier League season. I know we're only nine weeks into it. But who do you think's been your biggest like, wow? So I'm besides Spurs, which I love Spurs. I'm gonna go with three actually the two you mentioned an arsenal. And I'll give you the reasons for each Liverpool. I think kind of like a Spurs. They're figuring out ways to grind out games. And get get a result. You know this this past weekend. I think do they play was hundred field. Like, you said they won one nothing. They probably have scored more goals. But this is a game in the past that sometimes I might draw might fail to score. So I think from maturity standpoint, I think been diet plays huge role in that on that back line. Do love ring. He can. Be the best defender in the world in his own mind, but without Virgil Van Dyke back there. He's nobody, you know. I mean, I just don't think he's saying player will quick real quick. I just wanna say. In the James Coppola interview, which I just did which I know this uploading Saturday swear to God. I just talked to him two hours ago. He said the exact same thing that Virgil Van Dyke makes Lauren amazingly. I'm not even kidding. You could probably play those clips next to each other. That's that is 'cause I thought about now I have two people. So I bring on the experts. This is why you know. That's that's amazing. Like, it's crazy. How one player can just enhance another stock so much. Oh, yeah. I mean, I think he was worth every penny paid for him. And you look at having a top central defender look at United. I think the main one of the main reasons they're in shambles is because you've got Phil Jones kicking the ball back into his own net. Sorry again, Martin and you know, small eating. I mean, you know, you got lintel often, you know, what the hell he's doing. I mean, the best part of that backline this year's been Luke Shaw. But getting back to what we're talking about city. I think the big thing with the Premier League last few years as we haven't had a repeat winner repeat champion, and I think, you know, pep has got those guys, you know, it's it's fun to watch them play because they absolutely suffocate teams and just destroy them. In a to me the other really big surprises arsenal because you arsenal. Lost the first two matches. And I'll be you know, that's a that's a tough start for any manager in arsenal. Very easily could have beaten Chelsea I think they put away some chances in the first half that that game could have gone either way. But to turn around in win ten is at ten in a row is oh baby. So to turn around and win ten and a row with all that pressure on you. I think is impressive. And so I think Spurs arsenal really aren't being talked about as much because we're all in namrd with sorry. And all this into be honest. Chelsea I think when they start playing some the other big boys they're gonna fall down the table a little bit. He's gonna have to heart on the cigarettes. You know? But I don't know. Yeah. I feel like sorry has been a little bit exposed you think that's fair to say like this super possessive back and forth passing. You know what I mean? So I I'm still confident in Chelsea because they have so much talent. It's unreal. Yeah. I think we're finally getting it's been a while a close title race. And I really hope it is I've been talking to so many people were praying that it's going to come down to like the final weeks in like April may where it's going to be maybe something determined on the last day that'd be so exciting compared to like Chelsea running away with it man city last year running away that even Lester towards the end. Yeah. I mean, no sorry for your Tottenham. I know right there. But like I left her kinda ran away towards the end of the season. Yeah. I think I think these had three games left or something like that they clinched it pretty early yet. So I'm praying. I hope it comes down to Mansi Liverpool even them I'll say Tottenham that it comes down to a close title race. And I'm kind of hoping to Premier League has another resurgence in Europe as well. I hope the teams can do something in the Champions League either ripple man city. I'm hoping Todd them can make a strong comeback. So I. I have a couple more questions in terms of Todd who'd be your star signing four-tonne davita to pick one right now. If you were you had a blank check, and you can sign anyone who would be your star right now, you'd pick like reasonable signing that you'd really like, okay. I'll go with reasonable because blinked check we could go we go. I said that I went that's just say like Messier someone right? So reasonable signing you'd really love to have at your club. So who I'd really like in? We got linked to become a lot less or less thing. Anything happened. Give you two of them in one. You've heard of one you probably have obvious one is Anthony Marcio from United. And the reason all say Marcial is I you know, he's been he's on great. Former not uniting no scored both goals against Chelsea over the weekend. And he could till two roles for us. You know, the biggest role we have Spurs. We do not have a backup for his Harry Kane when he goes down we have to put sewn Lamella somebody else up front and it works for a while. But Arshi off can also play out on the wing, and he's young I'm posh teen could take him. I think to the total next level as far as being a star. He's the most obvious one the one I'm going to say that most people haven't heard of is a kid who plays for I XE. His name is. Matthew Matthias deliver? It's the Elijah GT. And what also about him this kid? We were in frame last summer. I didn't wanna sell him. You can see our track record with aks, you know, Toby out of your tongue in Sanchez Erickson, all from I XE everything I have seen in heard about this kid the lit eighteen. He's youngest captain. I ex history city. Everybody's in Barcelona. Everybody is in for this kid. They did not want to sell him last summer. And I think they can sell in this next summer for probably anywhere from fifty to a hundred million depending on who all's in for him. And he if you've seen him play he played through an Aldo when Netherlands play Portugal last year, and you probably going you to find some clips, but he was phenomenal against Rinaldi. He's big big centre-back ball playing center back similar to you know, plays with the lit actually on the Netherlands dreicer. Though what we have at Spurs. So either one of those two would take in heartbeat. I like that. I like, you know, kind of a big signing kind of a low key signing. I like that was good answer. We'll congrats. All right. Let me get into some Tottenham s questions. I'm just going to tell you Saint totting ham totters ham say is cantering him give this. Yeah. I'm canceling that as the chief arsenal Representative of the world. I don't want even if arsenal ever comes above Todd him again. I don't ever want anyone ever celebrating that again at is officially done. It's like, you know, how we used to have Christopher Columbus day. It's now indigenous people day like. Now, you better tell arsenal TV ex arsenal fan. I don't know. Guys. I don't even wanna bring up, you know, Robbie and whatever their names are can't I I don't even get in to arsenal fan. Tv is just like it was a joke when it started. And it's always been a joke. Like I used to watch it. And now, I just it's like the jersey shore or like the Cordech or what is that the keeping up with the Kardashians. It's just train wreck. It's junk TV, and I just watch it because I want his here the ridiculous ship. People say, I I think I heard someone say play Jacques as a left back the other day on their. Yeah. I do the shit. They spew an arsenal fan. Tv. It's it's almost like listening to the farthest left or the farthest right person this day and age. It's like what are you saying? Like, you're not like, you're you're not making any goddamn sense. I. Well, you got me all worked up. Okay. But but I do appreciate you cancelling Saint tottering hymns. That's that's that's beautiful. Yeah. If I anyone celebrating on Twitter Amelie blown them up. If I see anyone even mentioned it, I it's canceled. It's done. It's dead. It is a fishy dead. How how are you with bottling jokes? How's that going for you? I've heard all man. More out. But I I don't have any are you like immune just numb to them at this point? You know, being a Spurs supporter. You know, obviously everybody wants to win trophies. I mean, you know, that whether you're arsenal-spurs Lester Huddersfield, I mean, they're not gonna win leading hate to bring to you. But, but, you know, so I think with us, you know, I'm really proud of the way teams progressed Pocchettino, maybe win a trophy this year. May we won't if we can keep the core intact. I think only get things happened with this club. So I mean, I don't really pay attention to all the bottling stuff. And all that. I mean, that's just that's just as they say banter, you know, so we can roll with that. Yeah. I was almost it. I was one of those dick heads used to make bottling jokes. And I've matured I'll say it, I've matured, and I don't I don't make those jokes anymore because you know, all it's done is just I've gone hit right back with arsenal. And I think there's this long karma. I became an arsenal fan right after they won their last like league title back in the events. It's like the two thousand sixty thousand seven era. So I. I picked like the worst time become like an arsenal fan. So I I have no room to talk or make any of these jokes. Like, it makes me feel good for a second. But then like the harsh reality sets back in and I just fall Deepak into that depression. So. I have one more question. Now, probably have a few more will Pasha Tino. I love the guy phenomenal manager. He's brought the -bility to your club, and has created a sort of culture. Would you say an identity? Oh, yeah. Definitely. When you watch our team play. I think he's been there this year, and to watch them grow and mature in and just like take deli for instance. Okay. Like when he first broke on the scene at Tottenham. Great player, but you could wind up very easily. You know, he got a red card in back to the euro police. He got a red card in a knockout round Europa league game. I think just for ridiculous tackle. And you know, your guys were started last year. He's diving all over the place and all that. And to look at him the way he carries himself on and off the pitch and the way. His performances. I think that's a microcosm of what Pocchettino don't for our club. I was going to give an example. I might have your own pudgy new has on a phenomenal job. I I mean every year he's rumored to go to Madrid or somewhere else in the world. I mean my question to you is though let's say this year. No trophies. Let's even say next year. Notre fay's. Do you stick with Pacino? Do you have do you do you trust the process as Philadelphia fan myself, you hold on thinking that he's going to deliver you to glory, you know, at such a tough question. I think you have to take a look at if we're talking to seasons on the road powder this season progress, you know, because to me if we're in the champion if we're in the Champions League places both of those seasons. You know, what I think you have to seriously consider keeping him because if you watch this team like they loved playing together, it's like a band of brothers. You know, gray showed up ratio. But I think if you. If you look at them as long as we're making steps for now, if we let's say we finished like, hey in the league, and we crash out of the Champions League with no points like have a really bad season. I think you can start to think about it. But I think to your point if we were to get rid of punch, Tino who do you bring in? You know, I sure as hell don't want Josie Marino because that would totally destroy, you know, the way we played football and stuff. So I think you're kind of caught with that too. And you say, okay, if if it's not pot who can we bring into take this team to the next level because just like the club or the team? I think he's growing with this in as far as how he manages coaches and stuff, you know. So I think we're all growing together. And I think really we went one trophy. I think that will put everybody ease you know, whether that's the League Cup. The rope league FA Cup Champions League this show, obviously but Premier League. Stuff like that. So I mean, I I would wanna stick with him until it's not working if we if we turn into Manchester United. You know, he's gotta go as far as how they're playing this year, the turmoil and all that. Yeah. I think the Premier League kind of like the NFL has gone very trigger happy when it comes to pulling the trigger on coaches. I think it's like win. Now when Amelie I mean, I look at organizations like the Steelers or. The patriots, obviously or other organizations who hold on to managers and just let the process happen like Sarah's, Ferguson Arsene Wenger. I mean, there's obviously very long tenures. But I like seeing a familiar face a coach who can keep a team relevant team stable and I've seen progression. So and that's what I've seen Tino. So I think I, you know, you start acting managers left and right? You might get you know, what's going on Manchester United right now. Just a lot of chaos. So all right. Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. It's been a lot of fun. Please tell the people at home where they can find you one more time and about Tottenham Hotspur world. Okay, guys. So again, if you wanna find me on Twitter at world Hotspur, you can also find my side online. It's Tottenham Hotspur world dot com. And again, the name of my sight is kind of everything Tottenham Hotspur world, you know, whether you are in North America Europe Africa Asia anywhere in the world. You know in your Spurs fan. My writing is trying to speak to you. You know, no matter who you are whether you just started watching Spurs or even Spurs fan for decades, and what we try to do is cover every every aspect of Spurs. So I guess I've written articles under eighteen team under twenty three team the undefeated Spurs ladies team. And of course, our first team who's playing well this year. So that's that's what we're all about. Wow. That's awesome. I, you know, I'm not a Tottenham fan. But I love your work. I think anyone who can appreciate just good American footy talk. And I think you do an amazing job. So will thank you so much. I appreciate it. Kevin. Thanks. One.
Loud Americans Discussing Soccer
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Manafort, Stone, and Cohen, Oh My (feat. Katie Phang)
Thanks to third love for supporting Muller. She wrote third. Love knows. There's a perfect bra for everyone. So right now, they're offering our listeners fifteen percent off their first order, go to third love dot com slash AG to find yours today. And thanks to ritual for supporting Muller. She wrote better health doesn't happen overnight. Start your year with essential for women. A small step that helps create a healthy foundation for twenty nineteen and beyond. Visit ritual dot com slash AG to start your ritual today. Finally, thanks to Buffy for supporting Muller. She wrote for twenty dollars off your Buffy comforter, visit Buffy dot com and enter promo code AG at checkout. So to be clear, Mr. Trump has no financial relationships with any Russian oligarchs. That's what I said. That's obviously with our position is. I'm not aware all any of those activities. I have been called a surrogate at a time and that campaign, and I didn't have not have communications at the Russians on we'll have to get involved with Putin have nothing to do with Putin have never spoken to him. I don't know anything about a mother than he will respect me. Russia if you're listening. I hope you're able to find the thirty thousand emails that are missing. So it is political your communist know, Mr. green, communism is just a red herring. Like, all members of the oldest profession. I'm a capitalist. Hello and welcome to Muller. She wrote. I'm your host AG with me as always Julia Johnson, halloo, Jordan Coburn, isn't here this week. Good evening, San Diego. I've Veronica according stone tints mcgee's on vacation. Yup. Jordan's on a self care trip with some close friends who are soon to move away. So we will miss her. But she will be back for the mid week episode this Wednesday, Julius. How was your week? It was good productive. Yes. Go shit. None. Yeah. Lots of news to read. So that was oh my God. So much news. It was seemingly quiet week. And then it just blew up Friday. It was crazy. Always fire Friday. It's nuts. We have some corrections this week first of all I call Jeffrey Epstein a pederasts, but that means you're into young boys. So pedophile is more. Correct. I also lumped VIN Weber in with democratic lobbyists Tony Podesta and Greg Craig from scadden Arp slate Moore and Flom, but. Vin Weber is a Republican from Minnesota. So duly noted. Thank you Minnesotans tickets are now on sale for the miracle theatre in DC on March twenty ninth for MSW live, and we're also going to be at the bell house in Brooklyn March thirtieth and the Largo in Los Angeles on April eighteenth there are but a few remaining tickets, they are going fast only a few left so grab them while you can bell house, by the way is eighteen and up miracle theatre is all ages despite what rumors are out there. There's no formal meet and greet at Largo, but I'll be sending a message out to patrons on our patriotic page with the information about which bar will be headed to after the show where we can all hang out and have some cocktails. If you're not a patron, and you want to get these super secret messages, and you want to become a patron head to patriae dot com slash Muller. She wrote you'll get advocacy codes in the mid week update and a whole bunch of other stuff for just three bucks a month. And it's a steal best deal in the business. So check that out. Also, I'm going. To be on the open arguments podcast this Tuesday. So look for that wherever you get your podcast. And I was also recently on getting curious with Jonathan van Ness. So check that out what an amazingly smart, an honest person. Do you know, even if you're not listening to that? When just check out his podcast. It's really incredible. He's SU super smart does his research and he priority, just no shit. Anyway, doesn't even have to look it up. The guy is incredible. Also this week as I said has been somehow quiet yet insane. I think big things are about to go down. And we're joined today by special guest, Yale grad and trial lawyer, she's also an MSNBC legal contributor, Katie FANG. And we're gonna talk about all kinds of things including Tom barrack Jeliah has been reporting for a while now on the continued Russian election interference. And today. You have a hot note about Trump gutting the election protection task force election protection. That reminds me of that scene with Paul Rudd in wanderlust. You like my erection seduction, Paul Rudd. Is a national treasure Paul red. If you're listening. I hope you can make your way to the Largo on April eighteenth from militia wrote live it will be tremendous. We have a lot to cover this week. So we might as well jump in with just the facts. All right guys early in the week house until committee chairman, Adam Schiff was on meet the press. Mt. P where he said that snoop Dag Rosenstein may have killed the Deutsche Bank subpoenas to keep Muller from being fired. Which is why the house Intel committee is now going to be looking closely into that case in Juneau just on the off chance Muller did not because he you know, some Muller didn't want. Maybe he didn't want to cross the line that red line Trump drew in the sand. I make sense. Yeah. And keep his job. So if there's something Muller's not investigating. I think it's safe to say it's either being handed off to other federal prosecutors or US attorneys wore the house is now going to investigate it that whole big sweeping announcement of investigations that we covered last week. Pretty incredible. Nice. Yes. All right. Also, Monday, we learned that AM. I that's American media Inc. They're the American media Inc. Thir- the Enquirer Douches, they told the Daily Beast that the Enquirer obtained the Jeff. Visas texts from his mistresses, brother. So basically bays cheated on his wife with Lauren Sanchez. Lauren's brother Michael is buddies with Roger stone and Carter page, so obviously a giant piece of shit bazo said last week in a stunning medium article that he was being extorted blackmailed by AM I and the Enquirer saying they told him he had to say AM, I was not acting politically or they weren't politically motivated, otherwise they were going to release a bunch of his kinky texts bazo also alleged Saudi Arabia was part of the scandal. Because they hate the Washington Post as much as Trump does. And we know as us owns the Washington Post and Saudi Arabia hates the Washington Post because kashogi worked for exactly them. Well, now people from AM I are telling reporters that it was Michael Sanchez who we now will call Sanchez forever that and he's the one who still bays text from his sisters phone and gave them to the Enquirer. I personally think and these are being that he's the fall guy here. I don't think he did it. He says he. Didn't do it. Although you really can't believe anything dirty. Sanchez says I think the Saudis are more involved in this. Then Trump and AM I want us to know. And that's why am I went out of their way to lot to extort him. They wouldn't have shit all over their non prosecutorial agreement over this. If it weren't, you know, if they weren't covering up something super important, so but some beans on that and look for am I in Dylan Howard to be indicted as they've broken their non-prosecution and immunity agreements respectively. Oh, yeah. They're going down. Also, Monday Cohen has postponed his Senate Intel committee testimony, citing medical issues. He recently had shoulder surgery and says the meds. He's on make him to goofy to testify. That's probably true. I don't know how that's different from his regular testimony. But yeah, even though he was out partying. He was seen partying with friends and then his wife over the weekend last night. He already knew his house until testimony or we already knew his house until testimony was moved to February twenty eighth and nobody in the house minded. Probably because I think personally molar asked for the delay. Not Cohen, actually, I think it's been reported. It's been confirmed that Cohen didn't ask for that delay. That's right. I'm not sure why he's moving the Senate Intel testimony but cone reports to prison for three years in a couple of weeks, and they can take him out of jail to do his testimony. Right. So absolutely. Why he pushed it back for some reason? They're like, we'd rather do it before he goes to jail, but whatever and cutter appears to be distancing itself from Kushner. As Reuters reported this week that after cutter found out it unwittingly bailed out Kushner's devil, building sixty six Fifth Avenue. It revamped its investment strategy. So let me see if I can explain this to you with a straight face the cutter is want us to believe that one of their investment. Vehicles called Brookefield investments, which is funded in part by the cutter investment authority bailed out Kushner and his building to the tune of over a billion dollars for a property worth half that much probably it's a shitty investment. Nobody wanted it. And and the the is say they had no idea about this. Yeah. Just another Tuesday for them, you know, just two billion no biggie. And we have reported that you know, when I'm talking about QA possibly being the secret company from country A and the Muller subpoena dispute, we've talked about how cutter said that they want to thirty five billion dollars worth of business in the United States. Maybe a billion here and a billion. There's no big deal to them. But I I don't know despite the coincidental coincidental subsequent removal of the cutlery boycott by the Saudis and the ouster of traders to the Saudi Crown from Intel given to Mohammed bone saw by Jared Kushner to me, this is nothing more than the country's looming the truth for when we find out in a couple of weeks that maybe they are at the heart of that secret subpoena battle because they don't want to hand over their records to Robert Muller because they bribed Flynn Cohen. And Kushner, right. Those are super space beans, I'm only guessing could be somebody. We've never heard of. But I think it's QA. Why now? Yeah. But it sounds pretty logical. And we learned this Wednesday that the courts are going to make public more information about the secret company from country A, and to me, and these are just beings cutter wants you to know that when all is revealed, they really honestly had no idea they helped fund a billion dollar Kushner bail out in exchange for policy. That is crazy. That's pretty stupid. There was an incredible piece in the New Yorker this week by Ronan Farrow about psi group and black cube Jalil has been reporting on these Isreaeli massad for higher groups and their connections with the Trump campaign pretty extensively. And I I think that this reporting is coming up again because we might find out soon about that August third Trump Tower meeting with Joel Zamel that Seth Abramson referred to as the biggest news story of two thousand eighteen in our season finale episode, December thirty first Zamil is a guy by the way. He's the guy who proposed social media psi ops to the Trump campaign, and who Nater then paid two million dollars to shortly after Trump won and nature has immunity guys. So put some beans on this space. Ace and I highly recommend you check out the article from Ronan Farrow in the New Yorker, it's called private massad for higher or check out our mid week episode. You Lisa did a deep dive into into this because she's been following these stories for a while. Oh, yeah. It's crazy. Get article though, really long. It was it was really good read their own affairs and incredible writer Ronin, if you listening should come on Moeletsi wrote, please do Julie's also did a story in the mid week episode about Trump's quid pro crow with a Coleman named Murray in which Trump publicly by tweet urge the Tennessee valley authority to keep an keep open a forty nine year old coal plant despite its plans to convert more into wind and solar and hydro, right? Yeah. And that coal plant is owned by a huge Trump donor named Murray. Go figure, right. Yeah. Julia what weird story it's so strange, and the TV a that was the board that was going to vote on the closure of this plant. They were supposed to get together on Thursday to decide. So I I haven't seen an update yet. I wonder what they what they went with on that one because they said they were leaning towards closing it because it just wasn't viable it. Just made sense. They'll let it go. But Trump insisted it was so important to keep it open, so dummy then things started to go a little nuts. This. Week on Wednesday. We learned Roger stone fighting against a gag order told the judge that Muller should have to prove he didn't leak. The stone indictment to the press before he was arrested, and then his magical, lawyers who can't file paperwork properly presented evidence. That actually showed the indictment was released after stone was arrested as it turns out, though, it was released just moments before the arrest was carried out in the time was filled in a little bit later, but stone is beating this conspiracy drum that idiot right wingers, including Matthew fucking Whitaker, by the way in his congressional testimony are trying to push that CNN must have known about the arrest for Muller ahead of time. They're conspiring because there are outside of his house before the F B I knocked on his door or they listen to Muller Shiro, look is just because you're not smart enough to understand something doesn't mean it's a conspiracy theory. We knew stone was getting arrested that day, we're podcast was comedians. The grand jury met the day before stone himself said he was about to get arrested. There were. Indictment. There was a sealed indictment on the DC docket the night before we put two and two together. Guys. I know I've said this before, but that's what I think conspiracy theories are someone just isn't smart enough to understand something? So it has to be a conspiracy. Just because you can't wrap your head around the concept of a round earth. Doesn't mean the rest of us are fucking with you. Yeah. I saw a mean today that was just like the peer, MS. And it said worked so hard that people think the aliens did it get it makes me think of conspiracy. You totally just because you can't understand the concept of water vapor. Doesn't mean the government is using Chem trails to control your mind, right or just because you have the mental capacity or you don't have the mental capacity to grasp the Trump Russia investigation. Doesn't mean there's a deep state or you know, you can't see germs that doesn't mean you shouldn't vaccinate your kids. That was crazy. I thought that was like a made up. So I saw the clip actually said that can't see germs or just because you haven't experienced racism doesn't mean it's not a thing or because you haven't been raped or assaulted doesn't mean women are out to. Get you. You know, not all men all lives matter. The earth is flat globe heads are real follow the money nine eleven was an inside job. It's Adam and eve not Adam and Steve make America. Great again. Deep state pizza gate fucking shut up. These Q FOX are killing me with their stupidity and rant. I love it. Well, said thank you anyhow back to stone. Sorry, momentary rant. Judge Jackson in the stone case ruled to allow Jerome Corsi another conspiracy theorist and former stone associate to file an amicus brief that's a friend of the court brief supporting the gag order. He's also suing stone for defamation as we reported last week. And as it turns out judge Jackson did end up. Filing, a partial gag order. Saying stone is not allowed to run his mouth outside the courthouse. Just outside the courthouse. I feel like this is almost a trap like like she didn't give him a full gag order. Let them go ahead and try to say some shit because it can and we'll be used against him in a court of law. Oh, yeah. He will try. He can right like like how. Manafort wrote that op Ed with a Russian when he supposed to be gagged the out on bail. But probably the biggest stone news came from details. We got in a filing for Muller's team responding to stones objection that his case be related to the indictment of Russians. Right the Russians hacked and then stole documents from the DNC d triple c and Podesta. It turns out the reason he was contesting that link that relationship between his case and the Russian indictments is because all related cases are heard by the same judge. And I think he's scared shitless a judge Amy Berman Jackson. So Muller file documents supporting the link between those cases he said, here's why they're related an in. That response. We learned that stone had direct contact with some of the GRU defendants named in the Muller indictment of the Russians concerning the hacked materials, he had direct contact with these Russian intelligence officials Muller said that when they reviewed the evidence collected in the Russian hacking case, they found direct communications with. Roger stone. With links you up. New phone who it is. Quote as alleged in the Netease show. Sounds like a weird show indictment that the Russian indictment as alleged in the Russian diamond the defendant stole documents from the DNC of the d triple c and Podesta may then released many of them including through WikiLeaks. The government executed warrants on various accounts used to facilitate the transfer of stolen documents for release as well as to discuss the timing and promotion of their release several were executed on accounts that contain communications from Roger stone, including Guja for two point. Oh and WikiLeaks evidence shows that the Russian defendants hacked and stole the documents for release through WikiLeaks. And that Roger stone lied about it to the congressional committee guys. That's it right there. Stone participated in the weaponization materials, hacked, and stolen by the Kremlin to benefit Trump and hurt Hillary Clinton. And then lied about it to congress and Muller has documentary evidence to prove it, this is what we've been saying all along and and judge Jackson agreed and ruled against Roger stone's objection. Handing yet another wind Muller's team as he remains undefeated in federal court. So so when they ask you, where's your proof? Tell him molar has documented documentary evidence that stone communicated with Russian's hacked, the Democrats and conspired to release them in such a way as to do maximum damage to Clinton and to help Trump. Oh, yeah. And I feel like some people just may never believe it even when the report comes out, and we see the evidence. Some people are just probably never gonna like, you know, like, oh, where's your proof? It's like it's like flatter Thurs. I can't see it for myself. I didn't see it happen. It's not real Q. There's also evidence that stone lied about all this to congress to cover up the conspiracy. Why would you lie consciousness of guilt is what it's called? And we also have evidence that Trump and stone were in constant communication around that time late night chats on the phone. So I just like like land on their stomach with the feet kicked up. Like, hey, how're you know, you hang up? I right. So evidently done call with Putin pootie cau-. To him. So guys, don't miss. These. Filings Muller is telling us all about the crux of the conspiracy. And you don't wanna miss them. Okay. So this is the conspiracy. These are the facts in this this is the evidence. And of course, we've been saying this forever. It's in Seth Abramson book collision able are by. So just make sure you pay attention to these. Because the these little filings are where all the details are going to come out. If there's not some big grand sweeping indictment at the end of all this that scoops everybody up and conspiracy what you're using. But if there's not all the details, we need are gonna come out in these filings, so pay attention to him. All right. We'll be right back Taylor junkies. AG and Jill Lisa here to tell you how much we love our bras and undies from third. Love third love uses the magic of meta data by analyzing measurements of millions of real women to create the perfect fit. They have more than seventy sizes to fit any useful body. And they even have half-cup sizes because half of. Women fall between the traditional Cup sizes offered by mainstream. Brought peddlers myself included. I you take their fit finder quits, which is quick and user friendly, and it helps determine the right bra for you and clued you Cup shape. Which is something most manufacturers don't even consider then they recommend the perfect Brosseau. There's no spillage straps. Don't dig and there's no pinching or discomfort my personal favorite. Is there? Readable Pima, cotton collection. I wear mine all the time as a T shirt bra so comfortable, so soft. Julia. What's your favorite? I lift the front closure bride at that. One is just really easy. Just pop off like it's just so super convenient and really comfortable. I just I love it so much strapping in the front. It's really nice. Yeah. I like the front closure. Was it confuses the dudes? Oh, yes. You know, or whoever third love has a one hundred percent fit guarantee with easy and free returns three exchanges and their customer services. Truly amazing third. Love knows there's a perfect proffer everyone. So right now, they're offering you guys polar junkies. Fifteen percent off your first order, so go to third love dot com slash g now to find your perfect fitting bra and get fifteen percent off your first purchase. That's third. Love dot com slash AG. For fifteen percent off today. You'll be glad you did. All right. Welcome back guys. We left off somewhere in the middle of Wednesday help. That's when we all learned one of Carl Klein's subordinates Tricia Newbold is seeking whistle blower protection under the whistleblower act. Carl Klein is the guy Trump installed to supervise the security clearances for the White House. He's the guy that gave Kushner and junior their clearances, even though the CIA and the FBI objected and as we reported previously. He's lead over thirty clearances go that probably shouldn't have or that weren't recommended by the FBI or CIA Tricia Newbold one of his subordinates filed for whistle blower status less than two weeks after she was suspended without pay for defying Carl Kline saying he was granting unwarranted security clearances for officials, including Kushner, she alleges that Klein repeatedly mishandled security files and has approved unwarranted clearances giving preferential treatment to certain individuals by not making them come in to answer for questionable concerns when she raised these concerns specifically about Kushner Klein told her to watch herself and then. NBC news reached out to Klein. They got no comment other than a text reading. I don't care. He doesn't care about your national security. The house oversight committee is now investigating the matter. And we will keep you posted. I is so crazy. They really don't care though. And the no so blind about it. What do you do, you know? Yeah. I don't care gross. At least. They're honest. Also Wednesday to lawyers for bijon kion asked for more time to prepare their defence for trial because they have terabytes of data. If you remember bijon kion is the guy that was indicted the day before Flynn, we got went to did that crazy hearing, right? And he bijon kion was indicted for acting as a foreign agent or espionage light. You might have heard us. Call it in the Turkey matter. Right. He pleaded not guilty and his lawyers are asking to move the trial to this fall because his daughter's wedding is the first week of hogs, and he doesn't wanna get a jammed up for that. And coming this fall privilege. Come this fall to NBC? So the so this is the best part? The judge is like oh, you don't wanna get jammed up before the early August wedding. Okay. You're trials July fifteenth. Nice. I limit that you fucking criminals or sassy. I know I'll say judges and in the concord management case guys, the judge handed Muller a win saying the Russians can't have any of the discovery material. They want the concord management cases, the one where the those asshole lawyers. They're American lawyers representing the Russians. Yeah. Copper management is a Russian company run by I think promotion, Putin's chef. That's right. Concord management and catering or some shit like that. And so basically they came in. They got some American lawyers, and these are the ones who put cartoon and pop culture references and their court filing. Yeah. The ridiculous lawyers. Yeah. Right and drop the f bomb and the judge is like your stop it. Just stop it being an asset trolling in court. They are and what happened was is. They took some banal documents from for Muller and edited them four. Urged them put them online and then tweeted out from an anonymous Twitter account. Oh, we hacked Muller. Look at his reports are stupid, and they say nothing, right. So that's the concord management case. The judge found in favor of Muller saying, no, you can't have any of the discovery. It's too sensitive, and you're just gonna hand it over to progressions. Nice. He shouldn't die courts are so important, man. I know and they're doing such a good job on this. There about nine thousand for Justice as I said earlier, we also learned Wednesday that we will be getting more information made public about the secret subpoena case involving secret company owned by country, a my beans around the cutter investment authority. I've spelled that out quite a bit a couple episodes back and in a pretty extensive Twitter thread, if you want to check that out my second and third picks are e b and v TB respectively will soon know if beans come true. Oh, yeah. And Wednesday, Jerry Nadler, he's the chair of the House Judiciary committee in fucking bad ass. He wrote a love letter to Matthew fucking Whitaker for Valentine's Day, saying the committee doesn't. Believe your bullshit testimony. Specifically when you said, you didn't talk to the White House about molar, so come on back down to the hill and clarify your inconsistent story here to revise your statement, sir. What do you want to change your bullshit stories? The other thing Nadler wants to clear up with Whittaker is whether or not Trump or any other White House official expressed displeasure displeasure with him in the wake of Cohen's guilty plea last November. Now, they're says in his letter that somewhat Whitaker said is in conflict with evidence they possess. We're not done with you yet big dick toilet guy or as Molly Jong fast calls in hot tub crime machine. Oh, that's good. Also wednesday. We found out that Sam patents. Sentencing has been scheduled for April twelfth patent is the guy that Muller indicted for taking four and money into the Trump inaugural. He was the first public confirmation that Trump and his inaugural was taking foreign money, which patented using a cutout a straw donor to sell inaugural tickets and was reimbursed by Putin back to cranium emigrates. So keep your eyes out for the names, intruder vessel. Berg, lavar, Nick and kooks or Kuka's, these are all soft power US citizens that are Russian allies. The Kremlin uses them to get shit done in the United States because their citizens here or there on visas, and and they're likely to straw donors. Federal prosecutors will be looking into in the southern district of New York's investigation into the inaugural fund. Why the Sam patent case was held by Muller's team and not handed off probably has to do with patents association to Manafort gates and Kalinic as we know Muller loyal Molo, the little Muller lawyer, Weisman tough one. Has said that the meetings between Kalinic and Manafort specifically that August second meeting go directly to the heart of the molar probe. So I expect patent is wound up in that somehow. So put some beans on it. Yeah. You think in superseding for that for him or just go the course of his his current charge patent? No. I don't think he's going to face anymore charges. I think they're all you know, stuff with that Muller. Didn't want us to know about his redacted. But you know, it'll just come up again. Yeah. Or or in Flynn stuff, it might come up in clinic Manafort stuff. Oh, yeah. It might be redacted in Manafort filings. We've already seen right that we just can't read, and I would make sense though. So we will see you maybe. We got a ton of Manafort news. Speaking of Manafort, I'll go over that later in the show and hot notes, then Thursday, Andrew McCabe, pop back up in the news. Could. In your that? Is right. My boyfriend did an interview with sixty minutes ahead of his book tour, and he dropped some bombs during that chat. He said that there were actual serious discussions in the department of Justice about invoking the twenty fifth amendment to remove Trump from about eight days prior to the firing of James Comey until Robert Mueller was appointed. And he confirmed that snoop Dogg. Rod Rosenstein was serious when he suggested wearing a wire during meetings with the president if you'll remember the McCabe memo's corroborated that and we were like what? But I thought it was a joke. Now, he was serious to McCabe is being honest, if McCabe is being honest, McCabe, you're right, McCabe, also said that once Komi was fired he prompted the FBI team to start investigating the Trump Russia conspiracy and also to investigate obstruction as national security issue counterintelligence problem after Komi was fired. We've covered that that big New York Times piece that dropped and he opened that investigation to establish the case in in the event. He would were fired which he was for lack of candor the day before he was going to retire by Jeff session insanity who he was investigating. So as he did back, then a spokesperson for snoop Dag is kind of denying these statements. He said Thursday, quote, the deputy Torney general again rejects Mr. McCabe recitation of events as inaccurate and factually incorrect Dag has stated based on his personal dealings with the president. There is no basis to invoke the twenty fifth amendment. Nor was the Dag in a position to consider invoking the twenty fifth amendment end quote note that he doesn't say he didn't try to or didn't discuss the twenty fifth amendment. And she's saying you can't write or he or he. Yeah. He's just not in a position to do. So nor did he at all mention the wearing a wire thing. Oh, yeah. What I do. Here's what I think is going on personally McCabe. Was wrongfully terminated is what I think snoop Dogg were a wire, and they all talked about removing Trump under the twenty fifth amendment though. The next day McKay. Spokesman or spokesperson came out and made clear that McKay was not part of any ongoing discussions about the twenty fifth amendment. Okay. So there's that very interesting. Mccain's got a book coming out in a this week. I think I've ordered us a bunch of copies. See if we might do a book club on it. Yeah. Also Thursday, the results from Trump's annual physical were released which said he's six foot three and that he's two hundred forty three pounds. Yeah. In your bra, then later Thursday in your bra in Natasha Bertrand published a piece in the Atlantic asserting that the senate's probe into Russian interference is facing a reckoning so afternoon as screwed the pooch on the GOP led investigation in the house. You know, the house Intel committee we all kinda hedged our bets on the Senate intelligence committee. We hear Muller she wrote have said on multiple occasions that we thought the Senate investigation had more credibility. It was more legit than the cluster going on in the house, which is why we pushed so hard to take back the house and appoint. Chairs that would actually follow through with what I think, and I think what all of us think is the single most important investigation in our history. So although we put more faith in the Senate. It seems that they're bipartisanship is starting to waver the chair of the Senate until committee Burr and the vice chair democrat Mark Warner appear to be disagreeing over there being any direct evidence of conspiracy. But as Chuck Rosenberg told Natasha Bertrand, quote, I don't think I've ever had a case where I've had direct evidence of conspiracy. If there's snow on your front lawn, you can safely conclude that it snowed. Is it direct evidence? No, it's circumstantial someone could have driven up to your house in thrown snow on your lawn. But that's unlikely and then he says this really important thing he says the law treats circumstantial indirect evidence as being of equal weight. Wow. So FU Trump supporters who were living through consensual evidence and thinking about any blue collar crime that you know, about it in the way that has handled for most people, it's like circumstantial. Almost all the toll circumstance. And here's where Birla's all credibility with me Boura claimed recently that Christopher Steele of the Steele dossier had not responded to the committee's attempts to engage with him. But steel had actually submitted written answers to the panel last August, so that circumstantial evidence holds the same legal weight as direct evidence and Burr is now either a liar or incompetent, those things are indicative that the that his statement about there having been no direct evidence of collusion is just a pile of shit to me now and add to that the red flags that Burr took no steps to hire experts to aid in the investigation and he failed to use his subpoena power to obtain records from entities like Deutsche Bank. And you've got another complicit cover up in what we thought was a more credible investigative body could still be more credible. But like you're saying there's all these holes because Burs borough. I mean, you know, whether it's because he's a Republican or way, he clearly has an agenda. That's not the same as Justice. Maybe. Not just to see agenda. Now. I don't think so. But there are others that seemingly, you know. We're trying to keep it on the right track. So there were points where we thought that it was going the right way. But in the end, you know, he's in charge. Yeah. At all of these Republicans are like there's no smoking gun. There's no smoking gun. I just want to let you know that a smoking gun is circumstantial evidence. Oh, bam. There you go age. So fuck you pretty sure a bullet, which is shut off their smokes. You know, the gun just could be smoking smoking gun standing over a dead body. But you didn't see it happen with your own eyes. Flatter if. Finally thursday. William bar was confirmed and sworn as soon as the attorney general. This is interesting to me for several reasons least of which that he's not committed publicly to releasing the full Muller report. And if you remember bar is the guy that on Christmas Eve, nineteen Ninety-two pardoned all those Iran-Contra FOX back in the day match that up with Matthew fucking Whitaker's testimony that he's laid eyes on pardoning documents in the White House. And you've got a significant problem in the department of Justice. Oh, yeah. Then Friday came don't don't. And even though it wasn't a felony Friday. It was lit. I Trump shat on the rose garden by declaring a national emergency. And then saying I didn't need to do this. And then leaving for a weekend golf trip big emergency. Both of those things will undoubtedly be used against him in court as proof that there is no emergency and California. Governor Gavin Newsom has said we will see you in court since sued by so many, right? Somebody who's going after on the ACLU is going after him. There's no way that this is going to get anywhere. And if it does and he does steal money from the military because he cares about the military so much to build his stupid wall. We're just going to knock it down. When we went in two thousand twenty each it. We also learned Friday that Sarah Sanders was interviewed by special counsel. I would be especially excited to know how she answered for lying to the public about Don, jR, statement regarding the Trump Tower meeting, and how it was about adoptions a statement we now know was directed by the president and possibly written for him by. Putin because at the twenty summit right before they got on the plane. There was that little sidebar with Putin for about an hour that only Malania was there for exactly an amino in the translator who will never get probably translated translator not even ours and then trying to get Trump. So I mean, I wonder that'll be helpful. I don't know we'll see and finally Friday guys Elijah Cummings of the house oversight committee published nineteen pages of redacted notes from the office of government ethics and wrote two letters to two different Trump lawyers alleging that they to lied to government officials about the hush money payments cone is going to prison for and a couple of weeks. That means that now there are three Trump lawyers who could be implicated in the hush money payments, and we would do well to remember that both AM I- pecker. Oh and also Dylan Howard may have just blown up their non prosecutorial agreements and immunity deals by extorting Washington Post owner, Jeff Bezos. So everything they've told prosecutors they may now be criminally lie. Liable for so, but some beans on it. We'll be right back. Hey Miller junkies. Did you know that eighty percent of us Vail it sticking to our New Year's resolutions will fail? 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Dollar a day. And it's delivered right to your door says start your ritual today with essential for women a small an easy stuck to creating a healthy foundation. Visit ritual dot com slash AG to start your ritual today, that's ritual dot com slash Eiji. You'll be glad you did. All right. Welcome back. Hot notes. All right. I'm hot notes to Lisa. You have some news about how tough Trump is on Russian election interference. Oh, yes. The toughest how tough is I'm so tough. So according to the Daily Beast, Trump has dramatically decrease the size of two teams at the department of homeland security whose jobs, it is to prevent foreign countries from meddling in our elections, and apparently three D H S officials leaked information. And they also said they highly doubt the department will ever properly prepare to protect the twenty twenty election. Another DHS official who's familiar with the team said, quote, the clear Sussman from the intelligence community is that twenty twenty is going to be the perfect storm. And that's because we already know Russia's still meddling in our election with no real motive to stop. None. I think Putin is like, Freddie. Mercury singing don't stop me. Now like, he's just going at it. The other task force was shrunk after the twenty eighteen midterms. So basically after the Blue Wave happened and. Even though that's really fucked up. It would make a pretty funny title. I was thinking Honey, I shrunk the budget for the department of homeland security, instinct classes, anyways, one one DHI's officials said our key allies, shrunk the budget. And Honey, I blew up my plea agreement. Oh, yeah. I like it. I like the Segal. Yeah. He's at our key allies are wondering why the US is not more coordinated and not more proactive and dealing with this. And I'm pretty sure we own moisture reported on the one hundred and twenty million dollars or so that has been allotted to combat cyber terrorism and Trump has used none of it is still the case. Yeah, you've actually been following that and in a leading up to the midterms you talked about all the breaches that was were happening with gillibrand and other holy all raise yet. Absolutely. Like, the meddling is happening all the time. It's it's constant hacking. And we also learned from the article that people are beginning to be moved around in the task forces. And a lot of new people are coming in to handle election security for twenty twenty. And it sounds like it's a lot of Trump's people that are coming in. So former DHS deputy analyst Jon Cohen said if these reports are true regarding Russian interference in our elections than it's highly disturbing meant to department and the administration or not more focused on dealing with that threat and another former D H S official said it won't be 2016 all over again. The threat is changing. And a thinly staffed taskforce working on. That is not going to be able to keep up with the irazari. That's frightening. Yeah. That's why we say vote in numbers too. Big to manipulate exactly that's really are only like choice in this option is just like we did with the Blue Wave, and even then we were still being meddled with. But it clearly worked our age. Lisa. Thanks for that reporting. It's crazy mitt angers me. All right, guys. So Paul Manafort headed shit week and this pleases me, I he had a hearing Wednesday about his breach of plea, and we got the transcripts for it on Friday, as we know Manafort is facing sentencing this week in the eastern district of Virginia. That's just one of trials. He's also facing sentencing in the two county pleaded to in DC, but that's not until March. So the transcripts of Wednesday's hearing are pretty scathing. But the part that stood out to me was when the judge said, quote, we've now spent considerable time talking about multiple clusters of false or misleading or incomplete or needed to be prodded by council statements, all of which center around the defendants relationship or communications with Mr. column, Nick. This is the topic at the undisputed core of the office of special counsel's investigation into any links or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign that right there guys that's the conspiracy. That's the proof of collusion that they always keep asking you now. So ultimately, the judge ruled that Manafort intentionally lied to prosecutors after he'd agreed to cooperate. And he lied about three things. He lied about his meeting with Kalinic, particularly the August second meeting at the grand cigar room, which incidentally is in sixty six Fifth Avenue. And I wondering if this is the same meeting we've talked about this before you remember when he met with Kalinic and then right around that same time dare Pasquas private jet landed in Newark. Oh, yeah. And Kalymnos got on the jet with Pasqua. They went to pick up the prime minister of Russia. Right. Prime minister Russell skis me. And then they ended up on a yacht in in Norway. Yeah. Most expensive uberpool ever. Who's treason just here with with? What's your face Boho? Yeah. Yes. Why can't? I think go. Yeah. Yeah. And she recorded that and got the video. I think that's the whole thing that would make sense in. That was the one thing. He lied about. Another thing. He lied about one hundred twenty five thousand dollar payment. He got from one of his packs. He said it was alone. But it was actually to help pay his legal fees. And he lied about information material to another DOJ investigation department of Justice investigation, which they did not specify, but it could be the inaugural probe which Rick gates us, helping weather. Maybe it's the Trump Tower Moscow deal, we don't know yet. So the meaning the meaning the meeting of the heavens cigar club is the thing that Muller prosecutor. Weisman says goes directly to the heart of the Mueller probe and we talked about that last week. Right. And that meeting took place the day before the extremely important, August third meeting with Joel Zamel of the Israeli Mossad organization psi group, which we talked about earlier in the show gates was also at that meeting, and we all know his sentencing has been delayed likely. Because he's still cooperating in this ongoing investigation. The one hundred twenty five thousand dollar payment was the thing Manafort told three different stories about but the truth is it's money that came from a pack to help him pay his legal fees. The judge in the Manafort case determined Manafort intentionally lied, so that makes him a useless mouthpiece. Now. Meaning he can't speak on behalf of Trump or the Trump or anything like that or against the molar investigation because anything he says is just going to be touted as total bullshit. Exactly. So, but that's not all on Manafort this week. We also got Muller's sentencing memo, and though it's redacted. It has a lot of stuff in there indicative of conspiracy and aiding and abetting all the things. We've been saying for over a year. Now since we started this podcast, the sentencing memo is recommending nineteen and a half to twenty four and a half years in federal prison for which there is no parole, and he faces up to twenty four million dollars in fines twenty four million dollars in restitution and four point four million dollars in asset forfeiture. And the prosecutors have said there is nothing to mitigate that sentence or lighten it since metaphor. Intentionally lied to prosecutors breaching his plea agreement. In fact, the prosecutors argued there are circumstances that aggravate his sentencing aggravating circumstances. A warned the courts important imposing more time going for the higher end. Wow. First off, and I love this. They say is rich. He's educated. He successful yet. He still found it necessary to do crimes and steal from you American taxpayers. They also say like a privilege. I love that. They made that point. It's it's a really good point. And it's an important one. Yeah. And they also said because he was the ringleader of all the shit. He dragged gates and Kalinic into his criminal activity, and he reaped most of the benefits and that should be given a sentence at the higher end of the sentencing guidelines, so all these aggravating factors could make the judge. Give him more time, not less no breaks for this asshole. And this is the first judge to sentence him. There will be more sentencing drama in March for the DC district court and the only question then becomes whether he serves these prison terms. Concurrently or consecutively? Wow. Meaning, you know, if he gets twenty years here in twenty years here does he do twenty years or does he exactly either way that's toll for his age? That's not looking good. The only way he's getting out his feet. I yeah. So the final factor for consideration. About this whole story is why did he lie? Why did he knowingly risk life in prison to blow up his plea deal? To me, the answer is obvious. It's simple. He knows. He's only way out of prison is a pardon a Trump pardon. So he lied to please Trump and here comes bar, the the partner general and Whitaker saying he seemed pardoning documents, and if he's pardon he gets out of jail and remain safe from being targeted by Putin in the Kremlin because he didn't lie about committee will because he lied about communications at the heart of the Russian interference. Exactly. So I just want everyone to know that even if we don't get a major conspiracy indictment from Muller the conspiracy and aiding and abetting is coming out in these sentencing memos and all these filings and motions such as the document filed by Muller against stones request to have his case related or unrelated or unlinked from the Russian indictment case, which is eighteen CR two fifteen that was what it was. I was like nineteen thirty five eighteen CR two fifteen. Another example of a of a court filing outlandish conspiracy against you. United States perpetuated by stone, the Trump campaign WikiLeaks Guja for two point. Oh, and ultimately, the Kremlin that whole thing. So don't miss the proof of collusion right in front of us, while we're looking ahead to try to find this massive superseding indictment, boom, pow document at the end of the, you know, pot of gold at the end of the rain, right? We got enough right in front of our faces. Yeah. And we and we don't want to miss it. We don't want to miss the forest for the trees, right exactly about the journey, not the destination time. So so guys it's all coming out now. So stay tuned to Miller, she wrote we will keep you posted. We will keep you informed. And we'll try to make it easy to understand. We'll be right back. Hey, Miller junkies AG here to sing the praises of my new Buffy comforter for me, a comforter as always been just a necessity. But now, it's a luxury. I take my sleep very seriously and this is easily the softest and most versatile comforter. 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And if you aren't impressed just return it free of charge. No hassles. And right now Muller. She wrote listeners can get twenty dollars off by visiting Buffy dot com and using the promo code AG once again had to Buffy dot com and use the promo code AG at checkout to put the comfort back in your comfortable. You'll be glad you did. Julius ready for sabotage. We. All right guys this week, and sabotage Reuters put out a story that got no coverage that the Senate finance committee has launched an inquiry into meetings between Obama treasury officials a Russian central banker and Maria Bootma last July. Reuters had reported that there were previously unreported meetings in two thousand fifteen set up by the center for national interest. And if that group sounds familiar, we did a story on them in Rhode forty about how boot Anna had met with them in the CEO of a I g Hank Greenberg to get him to prop up a failing Russian Bank by investing eight million dollars, which he did. And we now know that Bhuttan in torsion met with Stanley Fisher, the vice chair, then the vice chair of the Federal Reserve and Nathan sheets, the treasury undersecretary for international affairs and this week. The Senate panel sent a letter to Mnuchin and fed reserve chair Jerome Powell and the center for national interest Russian-born CEO. Mitri Symes asking for more information on these meetings with top Russian government officials the senators want to know about the extent to which the Russian government engaged in efforts to undermine our political system. Quote. It is concerning that miss boot, Anna, and Mr. torsion were able to gain access to high level administration officials responsible for US economic and monetary policy to discuss US Russian economic relations, unquote, and guys when I read this article I remembered that in episode sixty almost two months ago, we had reported on BuzzFeed article seeing Russian agents sought secret US treasury records on Clinton backers during the two thousand sixteen campaign, and that there were secret back channel communications between our US treasury, employees and the Kremlin using private g mail and hotmail account. You remember that? And and we found this out from whistleblowers within the department, most notably. They were looking for records from Dirk Edward Ziff, which coincidentally are the records vessel at sky promised Trump junior during the thousand sixteen Trump Tower meeting that was. The dirt. They were promising on Hillary. Right. Are these two stories linked? I don't know. But I find it fascinating that button and torsion were meeting with US treasury officials under Obama in two thousand fifteen then shortly thereafter, the Kremlin had set up back channels with treasury employees using private g mail and hotmail accounts that were later used to try to get dirt on Hillary Clinton. So could vessel net sky and Bruton be linked is the common thread between the boot. And and our investigation and the vessel sky at Trump Tower meeting. Wow. But some beans on it. Already ready for the fantasy indictment league. Yeah. No, it is going to be a Honey, dick. Can't it's gonna be okay. Just calm down. All right, guys. Let's do the fantasy indictment league. Let's do this. I get too big first. Nice. So I'm gonna start with junior. Okay. I'm gonna do Zamel. Joel zamel. Okay. Nice. Yeah. Jelly, so zoom. All I'm gonna go with a Seder plea agreement. Okay. I'll take prints. Keys. I'm gonna go with Assange. Ooh. Superseding manafort. Okay. And I wanna make something super clear here. I talked to Joyce Vance. And apparently, if they're going to charge Manafort again, it's not gonna be superseding indictments. It's going to be new separate charges. Oh, we'll then. Yeah. Because superseding indictments can't happen after the cases done that makes sense. Yeah. He'll just get more indictments, right? So he'd just Manafort. Yeah. Man for it. All right. Maybe it saying superseding Manafort forever because we thought they might happen before he went to jail. Oh, guess not. Let's see. I'm gonna go with a I okay. Erickson. All right Erickson, well, he's already been indicted indictments yet. But not in the molar case. Okay. Yeah. I'm thinking the Muller case. All right. Yeah. Yeah. Paul Erickson the beast. And my last one is going to be Kushner, they're nice and who's your last one Trump org. All right. Got it. That's it. That's fancy indictment league this week. We didn't get any points last week. No. And I always try to figure out that the strategy. But there really is. You just got to go with the flow. Yeah. See how it is every week. You do so. Yeah. That's that's how we do it. So if you wanna play the fantasy indictment that you got to be a boy, you don't have to be a patron. But if you wanna do it officially on our closed Facebook group, Twitter's just as bad as Facebook is just as bad as Instagram. I know you hate it. But that's where we have it right now. That's where it lives, and you can do that by becoming a patron patriot dot com slash Miller. She wrote in you look for the announcements and look for the pinned post, and then just reply to that post with your five picks. And you can update it anytime in the week before an indictment drops you can't like add somebody after somebody's indicted. Yeah, we can see the time Timestamps. But like if there's hints like if the grand jury meets Friday and people are staked out at good junior's house or sater's house on Thursday night before he's indicted. You can slide them in. Oh, yeah. All right, guys. It's time for the interview. So joining us today for the interview as Yale. Ad trial lawyer and MSNBC legal contributor. Please. Welcome for the first time on the podcast, Katie FANG. Katie welcome to molar. She wrote the crowd goes wild. No joking. No. Thank you for having me completely an honor. Thank you so much for your kind words, we've been trying to we we've been wanting you on for a long time. So we really appreciate you coming by. And thanks for responding to us. So has at the time of this recording it Saturday, we have just gotten the the Manafort sentencing memo and all this news about Manafort this week. And I wanted to kick off this discussion about the man that helped Manafort get his job on the Trump campaign in the first place and his name is Tom barrack, Katie. What can you tell us about him? There's so much. I wanna talk about about Tom barrack when I talk about Tom barrack, everybody looks to me like a nuts because he's not the guy that you hear about he's still player, but he's the common denominator in. I was having a conversation with someone else last night who. Iden- to also be in the know. And she and I were discussing all things Muller. And she also was an agreement that Tom barrack is this man who is behind the scenes who I suspect has been the huge puppeteer for a lot of stuff that has gone down. And the reason why I say that is Tom barrack is some multi could Jillian air, but he's been friends with Donald Trump since the early nine Cree breakfast club way back. They were. Oh, I'm talking like dudes thought they were the original masters of the universe. Right. And they're they both were in real estate it cetera. But the distinction with a difference for for Tom barrack from Donald Trump is the following Tom barrack has always known what side his his breads being buttered. And he's always figured out. What's the next big angle? So other than playing somebody like Donald Trump, and I'll get into more specifics about that Barrick has ties to first cutter and now war strongly with Saudi Arabia, and the United Arab Emirates, and we all know this as we sit here today and have this conversation NBS from Saudi Arabia is the big bad wolf that we have to deal with in the Middle East, but Tom barrack, basically teed up Paul Manafort to head the Trump. Presidential campaign. He insisted that Donald Trump higher as you will recall for free like who the heck works for free. These hired Paul Manafort for free to run his presidential campaign. Tom barrack, actually also bought Jared Kushner's debt in that devil building that I call a New York six Fifth Avenue, he actually bought seventy million dollars of Jared Kushner's debt. And then when Kushner was failing did it. I'm sorry to interrupt, but didn't also Ross Nov done or not Rosneft skis me, the cutter investment authority didn't cut her have a big cut of that through Glencore. I yes, I think you're right. I think it was cut her that was involved in that. And so no big surprise there. Right. That Tom barrack would have connected people the country, you know, these governmental and even like private entities that wanted to have stakes in the United States. Why not have I'm sorry. I'm. I'm sorry to interrupt. You again. I misspoke. It wasn't Glencore. It was some other would lawn. I think was the name of the investment company anyway and cutter just recently came out and said, oh, we had no idea that we gave over a billion dollars to help bail out the devil building. So that was the devil building. Nobody's just kind of you know, it. It's amazing is just like, you know, and I could go on and on Barrick hired. Rick gates as a consultant for barracks company colony. It's just everybody's so incestuous tied together but barracks really important because he also was the chairman of the Trump inaugural committee. And so now the inaugural committee, which is now faced subpoenas in really hard core subpoenas for financial records and ties to foreign countries. And whether or not we sold the Trump administration, basically sold access to the inauguration and to the administration. Courtesy of Tom barrack on his watch. That's that's part of the subpoena. So it's just kind of wild. How Tom barrack seems to always be involved in something. And yet he has not been highlighted. He's not in the forefront of this and his answer to all of this is well, I've already been in team. Okay. And lot of people have. Doesn't mean that you're not gonna get indicted. But so it's just kind of disguise kind of keeps on popping up, and I keep on mentioning him. And sometimes people look at means scratch their head like why Katie talking about this? But I feel like Tom barracks. Going to have a very significant role alternately in the Muller investigation. Especially the spin off of that was my question for you. He's such a huge Middle East guy. Why Manafort was it? Do you think maybe it was about lifting Russian sanctions to get those Saudi nuclear reactors built like that whole Flynn Copson deal that they were working on. I mean, everybody you like you said, it's so incestuous. But like what why Manafort if he's if he's pumping up B S, an NBC so hard. Well, Manafort actually had his own ties to Saudi Arabia before from like a long time ago. And so it's not like Manafort was a complete stranger to the Saudis or to the UAE. But I think that more importantly, I think man p new. Do I think Tom barrack knew that Manafort being put in the campaign as a direct plan because Barrick himself has always had direct involvement with Trump in terms of he was the first guy who was a multi billionaire multimillionaire businessman to come forward, and basically stump for Donald Trump. He's the first one who put his credibility on the line for Donald Trump out of the whole kind of stable of Wall Street, and the the rich elite and people saw that, and it lent credibility, Donald Trump who otherwise didn't have any. And so I think Barrick could put a plant like somebody like Paul Manafort there who he knew we know that the Middle East and Russia inextricably linked through this nuclear deal if they want to build the reactors they need to live sanctions on Russia. So that they can do the gas part of it into the pipeline part of it. I've kinda were Eric prince fits into this whole weird thing. So it's it's really there's just so many like I feel like my murder board has a lot of threads between the Middle East and Russia and then Trump campaign. So it's it's pretty odd. Yeah. And the other kind of Wild Thing is this. So they're so recently. The there was this memo that got leaked that was supposed to remain confidential. And so this company that I just mentioned that was founded by Tom barrack, called colony. So there's this confidential secret memo from colony in basically what it says is here's the game plan hit. This is how we are strategically going to position ourselves to be able to gain access to the Trump administration. So we can basically, cultivate, relationships internationally, which will bottom line benefit our pockets, and so this memo, which by the way, no coincidence was written by drum roll, please. Rick gates. In who by the way, regains man that dude is shaving time off his sentence. Like a camp. He is behind the scenes like, oh, you wanna talk about Tom barrack. Here you go. You wanna talk about Paul Manafort, you go you wanna talk about the inaugural committee and all that money where did it go? Here you go. I mean, Rick gates is doing exceptional work my hat off to him behind the scenes with the Muller team. But anyway, so Rick gates wrote this memo because he was like I said he was hired by Barrick to be a consultant for this company. And of course, Ricky still cooperating with Muller. But Ricketts basically said look here's the game plan, we do this. And this is how all the countries and being in the White House not on the outside. But in the White House with Donald Trump and his whole band of merry thieving, felonious misfits and everybody will benefit financial. Yes. Yes. And you know, of course, we've got the Apollo group in there talking to was Kushner. Junior one of the two, and yeah, it's just it's an all the influence that came through Cohen slush fund that he was running like, for example, in trader vessel Bergh. And so that all links back to the inaugural. So there's something really really. You can't like you can't pull them apart the the Middle East the inaugural Trump and Russia, they're all just super link. And and so and then again, who's the person who's doing a lot of this, Tom barrack? I forgot to mention Tom barrack, also loaned Paul Manafort one point five million dollars because you know, that's what we do. Right 'cause O I'll bail you out for seventy million. Oh, do you need one point five? Ryan Paul here. You go about friends. Oh, of course, I'll call in that chip later. Right. That's the thing. It's like, you know, he's positioning these people he introduced Jared Kushner to the Saudi ambassador to the United States, he teed up these meetings for 'em Bs injured Kushner, and then of course, just last week because we had that insane boring. No, no week of news. Right. But a black just asked me Tom barrack in Dubai, and what is he saying? He says the United States sucks is what he's saying. And he says that we as in decent law. Abiding non murderous Americans that we just got them all wrong in Saudi Arabia in that. Because we don't understand the rule of law in Saudi Arabia that we should not be criticizing the fact that they murdered Jamal kashogi. Like, we should just ignore that. Because that's how they roll over there. Are you kidding me? This guy has like he's there shitting all over the United States because Donald Trump gives him carp long to do it. But he's basically saying it's completely kosher to be learning. You know American residents because I know he wasn't a US citizen, but shift the guy was, you know, a writer for the post, and he had legal status here in the United States, but come on you get learned into an embassy, and we're going, and then now we find these ties Kushtia g works for the Washington Post as you said and the post is owned by bazo. So now, we have this whole AM. I. Been. Yeah. And then Michael Sanchez, Lawrence Sandra's brother, and Lauren will friend of Jeff Bezos, Michael Sanchez is good friends with Roger stone Carter page all those, you know, disgusting people. And so you just it's like, you just can't extricate yourself. It's like the stickiness of the webs of like, a spiderweb it's sticky. Right. So it just keeps on sticking everything together in it takes a master perfectionist like Robert Muller to unwind an unspoiled v. Threads into basically, it reminds me of this. I have a four year old daughter, and she likes to get into everything. And I have a jewelry box that hangs necklaces. And if you if she goes in there, and she starts fiddling around with my necklaces, especially ones that are fine. What happens they get tangled together, and I get angry in you know, I give her a time out. And then after sit down, I'm not kidding you. I'll use tweezers to have to. Peel them apart. And it'll take me a long time. And I think of Robert Muller that way. Of course, I'm you know, I'm completely superficial izing just made up a word, Robert Muller. But it's that exact art of being able to unwind all of the stuff. That's tangled together is what Robert Mueller does. And if it takes that long to do to undo the shit that my four year old did. No, right. It's it's just too much. I mean, he is to be fair handing off a lot of this complex stuff the inaugural, which by the way, the scope of that subpoena is ridiculous. It's going to take months and months, but they're going to comply. They say, but it's just there's just so much left to unwind, and that's a really good analogy. With the necklaces I've been there. Right. Yeah. So you totally got it. So you can completely emphasize empathize. It's like you got to unwind it. But eventually, which do you have discreet, clasped necklaces leftover, and that's exactly what Muller's doing he's unwinding this. And he's presenting them when they're done. He saying here, you go, and sometimes they still have some interrelationship. But sometimes they don't. And so I believe certain things like the Roger stone prosecution. There's reason why it's being jointly. Brought so that if Muller winds up his investigation DC can continue to prosecute, you know. Roger stone. But, but there are certain things that are still going out. There's a reason why somebody like Rick gates. Did they just have a status update on his sentencing March fifteenth a status they don't have his sentencing March fifteen Flynn is still pending? I mean, everybody just keeps getting pushed back even boot Anna gets her. You know, sentencing pushed back in God knows what's going on with her. And so I just kind of young if you, but it up against other investigations, it's actually going really fast. So question for you. So we know Tom Barack brought in Manafort and Manafort brought in Pence, and I get asked a lot about Pence, and I just don't have any information on him because I feel like he's done a really good job distancing himself from this whole thing. Do you have any insights on how he fits into this whole web what what's his necklace? What's his deal? So Pence is a really interesting fellow because I agree with your immediate Sussman that he appears to have kept himself out of it. And I do think though that it's completely plausible incredible approach to think that Mike Pence really didn't have the type of criminal nefarious involvement that all the other players did in either in, you know, Russian interference and or obstruction. And the reason why I say that is I think you always to have somebody who can have plausible deniability someone. And if you look at an I'm talking more higher level, if you look at Pence, he still appeals to the Trump base right that evangelical very right conservative Trump base that base that helped get Trump Pence ticket elected input into the White House. So if ends up sullied in any way, you still have pens who can still have his hands clean plausibly. And I think oh, I will that Pence. Also, I can't speak to intellectual stamina. Prowess. He doesn't I well as in he doesn't impress me with either of those things at all. In fact, the do shows more passion being antiabortion, and I can't go sit in a room with you. Because you're a woman you have a vagina if you're by yourself like he says my passion for that. Then he does for, you know, world affairs, and international relations. But I just think that maybe he's just the Patsy but not like the fall guy. Patsy. Just like, oh, you know, do I'm lending some legitimacy to this administration because I clearly not involved in that and he can say credibly, but that's me like total far left field. You know, hypothesizing on how Pence is involved. But I do think that Pence just was put in introduced in. Yup. Kaiser says I don't think it was because Pence ends up being Kaiser was it KYW's. No. Yeah. I think I'm along the lines with you. He was picked as a clean guy. Basically we need. Clean, dude. Well, because it wasn't like Trump. It wasn't like Trump had his hands. Lean Trump couldn't keep it in his pants. You know, Trump was going to church. Trump wasn't maintaining. Long-term fidelity tr- Trump was all sorts of journey, and then some and I think you get Pence you're like look this man stands next to me and holds my hand. So I must not be such a bad guy. Wink, wink, right? And that's what Pence does. And I think that that's the reason why Pence remains which is kind of funny though, because if you think twenty fifth amendments tough, it's like, oh secession plan would be who it would be Michael Pence. But yeah, so so it's kind of interesting. But again, I don't think that Pence is the brilliant. Am by the way. I know Kevin Spacey was. No. I know Kevin Spacey as we're speaking strictly of the character. Right. Yeah. The character. So here's another Barrett. Question for you. And I want to know his connections to Flynn because besides the Middle East. Right. The whole cops in texting on the day. So the inauguration we're gonna rip up sanctions ha we're going to get those new reactors built in Saudi Arabia, and we're going to recolonize the Middle East. And maybe that's why colony was the name of his goddamn company. But I don't know. But besides the Middle East. There's that whole in in that Flynn. I don't remember if it was a sentencing memo, or if it was a here's why we're not gonna throw the book out a memo. But there was a third investigation that was completely redacted. It wouldn't even say if it was criminal and counterintelligence, and I'm wondering if that has something to do with the cutter investment authority, or maybe it's got something to do with Barrick. But I'm wondering how much additional. Assistance Flynn can provide since the judge in the last trial was like why didn't you charge these guys with treason, and you better not let me sentence. You today. Go go forth and cooperate more. And we'll talk later member when they asked him like six times. Like, are you sure you should really wait? I I'm really mad at you right now. So I'm wondering if what the connection is there, or if you have any insights on what you think that third investigation might be. I know it's speculation. But I I enjoy speculation. Well, you know, so we know that we'll we'll we can always look at kind of the building blocks that can lead to rank speculation on our part, but could be maybe well-founded. So we know that Michael Flynn was hired by the firm that lobbied for cutter, right? And so we know that Flynn was directly being involved. And so it really kind of makes you wonder whether or not Flynn's sentencing would actually show exactly how much the cutter royals. Had a direct involvement with Trump and the Russia connection because I think again people like to compartmentalize the way that this whole things gone down. And it's it always was focusing on Russia to begin with in the in the narrative and the dialogue has always been so heavily Russia driven. But now, we know that you can't look at them as being mutually exclusive. You can they're all interrelated. But the ultimate question that that merits and answer is, you know, how you know, is it just people were being driven by greed, and these are countries facilitated greed, and they just happened to be cutter or Saudi Arabia or Russia or the Ukraine, or are we really specifically dealing with the fact that maybe there's this whole thing about bribery, and, you know, the Steele dossier, and how accurate was the information in the Steele dossier that spoke to things, and so I don't really know. The Flynn direct the strength of the Flynn direct tie. I don't know. I think that will probably find out once Flynn is sentenced. But then again, also, even if he sentenced, and when he is sentenced there's so much that remains redacted because they're still open in pending investigations and because everything's so interconnected. I think what we could do is. If things remain redacted that that, and we know that Flynn's deputy was KT McFarland who was later offered a job as the embassador to Singapore ambassador previous ambassadors. Singapore had a presence at that Mayflower meeting. So it's like it's not has to do with the Saudi reactor plan. So it's just all this craziness. And I think bud McFarlane was her mentor, and it just seems like there were so many people installed almost in in in this administration. And I just have to wonder how much Trump new. Knew about and what he didn't know about and was being used for. You know, what I mean who will remember there's also that cutter who basically said that he was hanging out shooting the shit with Michael Cohen Michael Flynn at Trump Tower right in. Yeah. That's a Al remain. He. Yeah. Right. That was it. Yeah. I'll roommate he was like hanging out with them. And we were doing stuff together. Like, what were you guys doing? Like, why is it a Trump Tower of all places him? Yeah. He was interesting. I actually think that the I think we'll find out soon. But I think that the secret company from country A in the Muller subpoena battle that Muller is the one who wants to keep quiet. I personally think that that's the cutter investment authority. But I mean, it could be somebody. We've never heard of. But anyway, well that would fit with the idea that it's a governmental entity, right? Hello. It's exactly by definition. What it is. And normally it deals with you know, they're they're trying to they're trying to they've been fighting the. The subpoena that ostensibly are going to be for what financial records. Right. That's usually what it is. What else would you not want to turn over? So I think that that's a really educated exceptional guests. It's probably pretty dead on in. By the way, I will add a footnote to our conversation about people getting together in doing shade in a ferris things, Tom barrack, let while the company has company. He let their offices be used for transition team meetings that were deemed to be sensitive. It's like, oh, do you need a place for me? I'm used to people being like, dude, I need a place to crash. Here's my food Thanh. They that's what as comedians. We do we do this thing called couch surfing when we go on tour. It sounds like all the Russians are shell companies surfing. Meetings and crashing out at. Yes. Absolutely. And then apparently they're gonna go hang out at at Tom barracks. I go hang out at Tom Barrasso. I'm sure it's pretty fancy but member Michael Cohen. We've got a lot of sadly tainted as witnesses, but very knowledge rich cooperators in is investigation. Yeah, they're never gonna be. I mean in the traditional kind of mob prosecution sense, drug ring sense. I mean any time when I was a prosecutor, and I was dealing with it. It's you you start flipping people and they had their hands dirty. They all did. But who's better who's better suited to speak to the inner mechanisms and workings of and even if they aren't a good material witness as gates proved not to be to the jury in the Manafort trial. They just didn't listen to him at all you can get leads and information that will lead you to documentary evidence and other evidence that can be used. So it's. It's while they might not be the most reliable witness. They are you know, fount of knowledge. Yeah. And as long as there's independent corroborating objective evidence through the form of like, you said documentary photographic video, graphic whatever audio. I mean, just if there's something else there that will corroborate than you're, okay. I mean, you can base it on that you'd end even then you can use circumstantial evidence, and and we've seen this work because Manafort was convicted on eight counts, even if even though gates wasn't the most reliable witness the documentary evidence that he was able to lead Muller to or Muller found on his own and corroborating other evidence that that is what are, you know, got the gut the eight eight felony counts, convict us what he got and Manafort is leaving prison in a body bag is what's going to happen amount of for now. Easy. He will he will on that was his calculated gam-. Will he thought he could play the government? And we has we always say as lawyers. You know, the biggest the biggest law firm in the world. The most powerful law firm in the world is not Kirkland Ellis, by the way, because I don't know if you've noticed all these lawyers are now in DOJ and very high up the food chain. But no, it's the it's the United States government. Yeah. Well, before that cooperation agreement we we were of the ilk that he would never cooperate because he was angling for a pardon. A or b he was scared shitless or the Kremlin. Because we've seen people accidentally get hurt to death of who've crossed Putin. So they're they're accidentally their accidents murdered. Well, I know it's in some insurance policies, right accidental, death and dismemberment. So maybe, you know, hopefully, he was covered that's a crime. I'm not familiar, which is what a horrible what a horrible thing. And the fact that we do do not and did not immediately invoke the wrath of sanctions and any other thing that was within our arsenal for that conduct. Yeah. It's a scandal a day. And and we know Trump recently missed his deadline under the Magnitsky act to respond to congress about the murder of Kosho Jay, and nobody talks about that that came and win and it and it completely dovetail on the day when Saudi Arabia said sorry, we don't know where the body is. Really? Yeah. That I think that that was probably some sort of. Sulfuric acid dissolution situation or some didn't didn't somebody have a hot tub full of sulfuric acid in this thing. I can't remember who it was. Yeah. And then what got some weird was just like I was going to say it's like right around the corner was on voi- or the ambassador slake, the consul generals home was around the corner in they found stuff they found evidence there. So I think that there could have been man that cut out guy must've accidentally put on all of Kashoggi's close and walked out of the consulate to make sure everyone saw that happens to me all the time. Yes. Somebody accidentally wears my clothing. Lee and leaves me but naked somewhere, so. Yeah. No. Well, Katie it's been really insightful speaking to you. I'm so glad that you got a chance to come on. I hope that we can have you on the podcast again. So everybody trial lawyer MSNBC legal contributor. Thank you so much Katy thing. All right, guys. 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