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I'm Katie golden. I studied psychology and Evelyn Schnur biology at Harvard, and I pretend to be a bird on Twitter and my new podcast creature feature. We've you nature in man from a new perspective each episode asking comedian to get inside the minds of animals, so we can explore the startling connections to human psychology, you'll find blood bands and treachery that make game of thrones seemed like a dumb show for babies. Join us every Wednesday and subscribe on apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. This is Anne and you're listening to stuff. I'm never told to you. Lovely listeners. I just wanted to give a quick update on what's going on with podcast into. Thank you all for being patient and sticking with is due to the chaos that was the end of the year and a lot of shifting pieces and lots of traveling on both of our ends. I banged up a lot of episodes with guest host and a lot of classic episodes before Bridget announced that she was sadly going to be leaving the show. So when you're hearing these episodes with guest host and classics or the next coming weeks near like way, what's going on? It's the magic of podcasting. And scheduling it's not like those TV shows were caterers just gone, and everyone pretends, they never existed Bridget will be greatly greatly greatly greatly missed and she's gonna you're gonna hear from her. She's moving onto some cool projects and I'm really excited for her. And for you to check them out and you'll hear from her some more on this show stuff. I'm never told. You is going to go on and we have some really cool. Stuff in the work. So please, stay tuned. I truly 'em so thrilled to have y'all wonderful listeners and to be a part of this community and to continue to learn and grow with all of you for today's classic. I wanna replay this episode all about that wonderful relationship that is the work-life I've been so lucky to have a mazing work wives in my life. Haffey listening. Welcome to stuff. Mom, never told you from how stuff works not com. Hello. And welcome to the podcast. I'm kristen. And I'm Caroline and Carolina. I hope that this isn't a to forward of a question to ask you okay in a public forum. But gosh, I mean, do you think that we're each other's work wives? Yeah. I think so. Yeah, we work closely. Together, we see each other outside of work. If anything weird is happening at work. We're probably going to take a walk and talk about it. We go pick up coffee together we go downstairs and shop at J crew. Together, we have things to you matching angry liberal, feminist, killjoy, coffee, mugs. Yeah. I mean, I don't know if we can get much work wife fear than we are now. Now, I wear the wifey issed. So basically this podcast to just be able to work wives. Hey, everybody. Welcome back, not sister wives. No, no, no. We get a lot of confused listeners different. Women. So I was really interested to read about the whole work spouse relationship because there are so many ways that you can cut it. Whether it is like, a really close work friend or the work wife who or work has been who might make your actual wife or husband nervous. Yeah. Make your coworkers. Nervous. I love workplace relationship chats. Yeah. Yeah. And I I do think that there are some things, and we'll talk about this that can certainly complicate a work spouse relationship. Lot of this things do have to do with if your sexual orientations match each other's Carolina Hines do not don't know at my last job. Well, I mean aside from dude remain who is like my life work spouse. And he's your life wife. Has. I did have another work spouse who is a gay, man. And so that takes off any like potential conflict or jealousy with a partner. Although when all we want to spend time together, I guess there's a little bit of jealousy. But then you've got to worry about you do other co workers feel excluded. Do they feel like they're being left out is your work spouse, possibly casting you in a negative light by association? I know you're just going around spewing terrible things out of your mouth part. Let's gonna reflect badly on the person you spend all your time with. Yeah. Like when when Matt and I Iran around our old office, putting googly eyes on everything. I mean, well, we were doing that together. So we reflected poorly on each. Yeah. I'm just imagining if Billy Eichner from Billy on the street where your where your work wife because he's just so so loud, always Yellen. I was angry. I was one of my last job who got in trouble for being loud. I did have the the boss like the boss boss, come in to the break room. And tell me that my laugh carried. So I hope he responded actually doesn't carry it. Caroline's. Larry, I'll fire myself. No, thank you. So before we get to our our work spouse situation in our millennial. Workplaces why don't we talk a little bit about how it used to be. Because actually the whole works POWs thing, or at least like work best is less common than it was. Yeah. Which to me almost feels counterintuitive because I feel like we spend so much more time working the forty hour work week is something that I aspire to. And you know, when you when you work in those kind of nebulous, creative and digital fields your work is never done. And also, you can do it anytime at any place. And so there is that issue of twenty four seven connective ity as well. But yeah, we were looking at one study that showed. And this is something cited by Adam grant in the New York Times the other studies show that in nineteen eighty-five about half of Americans. So they had a close friend at work and by two thousand four this was true for only thirty per cent. And that's crazy with how much time we've been working. Why don't we have more work friends, and we even see that stat reflected in younger people's expectations of their work environment, and what their work friendships situation's going to be. So in that same study that grant cited in two thousand six just forty one percent of American high school seniors thought that it was very important to find a job where they could make friends that had been fifty four percent in one thousand. Seventy six because even though we're spending more time at work. We're I don't know. We're just like efficiency machines or something. I think it's the opposite. I think uh spending more time at work is less efficient. Yeah. But let's now refer people to our boss up. Toed with guests. Emily Aries for more on that. But to me, it does make sense that we have deprioritize work friendships because our entire approach to work in the workplace in general has changed so much for people in our generation, obviously will continue changing for younger folks as well. Because for one long-term employment is no longer the aspirational goal where you will work at X company for forty years. They'll give you your knock off Rolex say a Rolodex. I'll give you rolling wear that on your wrist. Yeah. It'd be like a neat. Little bracelet. Heavy look at my charm bracelet of despair. But of course, that's not reality anymore. I mean as soon as the recession hit I like, we millennials do not expect to be jobs typically more than like five years. Yeah. Well, you know, I mean, you've got the positive and negative side of that. Like, we as a generation want to do the thing that makes us happy. We want to chase down happiness. We're not we don't feel like we need to be loyal to accompany for fifty years. It's not one of our top priorities. Instead, it's us all the time happening into our passions. Caroline, right. Passion, jobs and. Yeah, I mean, we, you know, I was at my first job out of college for four years amid the recession, and I couldn't really leave while that was happening because I know would be able to get a job. But once I did catapulted right out of there. Yeah. I've been at how stuff works going on eight years. So you're almost at that gold Rolodex. Yeah. I've almost got a goal millennial gold Rolodex. And yeah, if my. Job were a child it would be in late elementary school and packing its own lunch. So that's good. Yeah. I mean, oh, mommy got time for that. At least it's a little less hands on. But in addition to the fact that we don't necessarily stick around in one place. We job hop in ways. Like never before. Teleworking also means less face to face communication. Although I do feel like while I interfaced with people all that often in my job because I do telework you and I both telework fairly often. But thanks to slack G chat. And text in texting I think that's what the texting. We are always still communicating. Yeah. Exactly. And one study did show that and this was a huge study that is long as you were in the office at least two and a half days a week and that applies to us. It won't have a negative effect on your work relationships. You know, you'll still have you can still be buddy buddy with people at work. Just maybe not have a work spouse per se. Yeah, I don't think that our work. Boston marriage has suffered from teleworking. No, no, not by any means. You've also got the issue of social media. Allowing us to remain connected with old friends, college, friends, whatever. So perhaps there is less of a drive, especially if you're outworked keeping your head down working for the weekend because you know, that when you get to that weekend, you'll probably be able to visit with friends that you've been able to keep up with on the internet. And I'm wondering with all of this keeping our heads down in working for the weekend. I wouldn't ever accuse the millennial generation of having a Protestant work ethic. Purse. Say, but I mean, we do have lingering aspects of that in order to make it to the vacation to make it to the long holiday weekend, or whatever. And of course, you know, if you're wondering what the Protestant work ethic is and you've been under a rock for hundreds of years at comes from Martin Luther preaching that hard work in any occupation was meaningful duty it was a calling from God. And then John Calvin of Calvinism Calvin Klein, not Calvin Klein. Yeah. John Calvin Klein, but you could argue the John Calvin underwear, we're the original Calvin see original sin. Oh, yes. Calvin argued that people needed to avoid socializing, well working because you've got to put all of your attention and effort into fulfilling God's will through your work. And so, you know, let's gloss overall whole bunch of history and condense a bunch of stuff into a. Simplistic statement, which is basically like white Protestant guys where the what have been the ones in power forever in this country. And they're the ones who are the CEO's of offices. Traditionally, and so you have this ingrained culture of put your head down and get your work done. But what more recent research is finding? I think what newer companies are facilitating is how jobs are more satisfying one. They provide social opportunities. I mean, just think about the Google plex and all of the amenities that it has for whether it is like free sushi. My mind is always goes to the sushi I want that Google sushi so badly, but they'll have like video game rooms where you and your, bro. Grammars can go chill axe and place them duck hunt. I've clearly have never. Been in that space before Christmas actually, never left the house before. Yeah, we're community. This is all the magic of of the internet that we're communicating. Yeah. But I mean, even that goes back to what you were saying about more time spent work isn't necessarily more efficient. I mean, I think giving people those perks at work to make them happier is important, and it creates a happier workspace, which logically civil goes should make them better workers. But if we are just working for the weekend with like our twisted millennial. So to speak Protestant work ethic. You know, if we're not taking the time to form those friendships and to enjoy duck hunt and sushi at work, then we won't be as happy as we could be. That's what researchers argue also those are my new like that is my work life balance goal. Some duck hunt and sushi. My job disarray, Tuesday afternoon fall has what is not my work life. Balance goal, nor anyone I don't I don't know that anyone actually likes. This is the toxic or confinement. Yeah. And so two further drive home, which is what we're going to be doing throughout this podcast to further drive home the importance of having that positive healthy work environment. We need to look at a study that came out in twenty fifteen from recruiting firm. Cornerstone OnDemand Northwestern University that looked into what being part of a toxic work environment does for us because as much as a happy work environment can contribute to our productivity toxic work environments as anyone who's ever had a job out. There can attest to that really takes away from our productivity. So the study found that three to five percent of all employees are fired for toxic behavior related reasons. I guess. Guess it's three to five percent of all places who are fired. Not just like Kristen today. It's you because you because you're toxic. And those reasons could be things like misconduct, even drug or alcohol abuse on the job sexual harassment, and to have a toxic co worker, and I have worked with someone at an old job who did a b. Substances at the office. And trust me amazed things a little tense that talks behavior does increase the likelihood that their colleagues will themselves then engage in toxic B S, basically because maybe they feel resentful or they feel threatened or something or they'll just quit. So that the way that your environment is shaped and feels at work absolutely affects everybody and having friends at work, even if they're not best friends, but for sure if you have a work spouse or two because again, we're getting into sister work spouses, oh, a little polygamy, whereas polygamy polygamy that can contribute to helping people want to stay. Yeah. Maybe providing a buffer from that talk city because as anyone who has worked in a toxic environment knows it spreads like a virus? It does. Yeah. So quickly. It doesn't take much. My first job out of college was at the newspaper. And you know, I came on staff with such, you know, a glimmer in my I like so excited totally naive. And one of the first people, I met was this woman who came off as very nice and funny and welcoming, and then it just our relationship, and I came to find out that it was her relationship with everyone became one of those toxic relationships because she loved to gossip she loved to pit people against each other. It was just really unhealthy. But it I watched and I especially see it now looking back watches it just infected everybody because it's hard to escape that negatively. Well, and that brings us back to the positive role of a work spouse or just a work best eve spouse feels like too much of a commitment to say. So this research is coming from twenty thirteen in the European business review because we are continental that like Crisanto. Yes. You're the croissants podcasters. So researchers have consistently found that employee's who are friendlier work well together. No big surprise. And a link has also been found between relationship factors like cooperation and social support and team productivity. So basically, like nice people work better together and more productively together. Exactly not to say that. There's anything wrong with like, the occasional like lunch, break vetting session. But when people who worked together genuinely like each other, I think it definitely adds to the environment. And plus people who say they have friends that work. According to this research are happier on the job. They report higher satisfaction. More cohesion more commitment to the company unless intention to leave even though as you were talking about earlier getting that gold watch or from liberals gold Rolodex is totally anti. Equated? But it does make it a little bit emotionally anyway, a little bit harder to leave when you are BFF's or in a work spouse type relationship with someone because because you don't want to let them down. You know? I remember when dude roommate was leaving his old job. You know, he was he was going to be making a better more positive step for himself career wise, but he did feel connected to so many of his work friends, and you don't want to leave them holding the bag. But I mean, eventually, you know, you've got to take the job. It's better for you. And hopefully, your work spouses supportive will. Yes, just so much time spent together to Nellie emotional ups and downs of the workplace who I know like who's bringing in lunch. Are you gonna get food poisoning from the work potluck? And if you work at Dundee Mifflin, for instance, it's always who's dating who this week, you know, the Dwight put gyms sandwich place is Pam still silently just staring at the back of Jim said because you can't tell. How she really feels Pam. Yeah. Pan jam. And here's the thing. If you're Michael Scott, though, it's a Michael Scott of your office. Your boss is not into co worker friendships and relationships is a little suspect or even hostile toward them. That's probably not a good sign about your boss. It's probably a sign that you might have a Michael. Yeah. Why a lot of the research. We read pointed out that okay on the surface level work friendships. They might signal a lack of productivity because if you're chatting to grabbing maybe along lunch if you're doing this or that your boss might look at that and say, well, why are you working, but according to Gallup back from nine hundred ninety nine when they did a deep dive into factors that make workers more productive. They found that employers who recognize the role that close friendships play in terms of fostering productivity, they're going to be on. On the better into things. They are going to basically, I don't know be rewarded for helping people foster those friendships because their workers will be happier. And therefore more productive versus your kind of stick in the mud boss. Maybe walks into the break room until you you're too loud. Because you're laughing at your work spouse because your laughter. Caroline's too far. The question then is whether there's a difference in having friendly casual acquaintances verses the work best or work spouse because with casual work friends. I mean, they require less maintenance and are less likely to be a distraction, and they can also be a sounding board foster. Teamwork and help get stuff done without the sense of obligation associated with off the clock. Best friends. But there's a wrinkle in this. Yeah. So the study by management professors at the university of Pennsylvania and the university of Minnesota found that win they had people complete a task either had acquaintances or they had worked friends works. Pows is basically friends outperformed acquaintances every time, and there's some critical factors in this. Like we said when it comes to leaving a company like quitting a company. Your work spouse is gonna make it harder because he feel that sense of loyalty. So those friends were more committed at the start of the project they showed better communication throughout the project. They offered their teammates positive encouragement every step along the way, but they also based on the strong foundation of their friendship didn't feel like they could not offer criticism. If they saw that one of their teammates was about to do something boneheaded. They could say, you know, I don't know if that's the right way to do it. What about? This. They could give each other that honest open feedback. Whereas when they looked at how the acquaintances who were paired up, we're working they were across the board held back by lack of communication. They appeared to prefer working alone. They were less comfortable seeking help. And they resisted pointing out when a co worker was about to make a mistake. So it sounds like that friendship helps volt Stor the work being done. Yeah. And this makes me think of a Myers Briggs tests, and I would be curious to see how people who have those strong workplace friendships might differ in personality traits versus acquaintance type people because there's like a little bit of an acquaintance in me like my my solo home schooler. You know as a kid has definitely like come along with me as I've aged. But I also know that I need like the collaboration. Yeah. And you know, matching feminist coffee mug. I know we collaborate. You know, we stop we collaborate. And we listen, oh, we do we do in all of this is backed up again by that nine ninety nine Gallup study that found that workers who said they had a best friend at work. We're way more likely to enjoy some pretty cool perks. They were way more likely to report having received praise or recognition for their work in the past week way more likely to say that someone at work encourages their development. They were thirty five percent more likely to report co-worker commitment to quality. Basically, the positivity and productivity is off the charts for people who say, yes, I have a work spouse slash BFF, slush, whatever because I don't think Alevis the term works. Well, and even to the point this jumped out the fact that they were also twenty seven percent more likely to report that their company's mission makes them feel their job is important because that kind of commitment. You know, in that belief in the company bottom line, you know, is a to me would be a hallmark of an outstanding outstandingly, positive company culture. Yeah. Well, I mean, hopefully with all the factors we've talked about. Hopefully, this means that you do have a boss who is open to letting these work relationships, flourish. And you do have opportunities for that open and honest collaboration where you can bounce ideas off of each other while you play dot com and eat your sushi. Because otherwise, I feel like a lot of creativity can be stifled. If you don't let people have those relationships I had a job where the boss, it was very small company and the boss was Rupe or not, okay. With people talking with each other. God help you if she found you out of your desk, she was just convinced that anyone who was having a conversation, even if it was to blow off steam or you were just literally on your way back from the bathroom or something. She's convinced he really plotting against the company and not working. Yeah. So you can imagine like creativity. Definitely it is ceiling that place. But anyway, we're gonna move on from just talking about my work history and dive a little bit more into work spouses when we come right back from a quick breaks. This podcast is brought to you by Showtime and the acclaimed comedy series Smith. Bridget bird is a twenty something single mom from south Boston doing her best to juggle life work and relationships all staying shooter self and creating a better life for her son. Larry starring Frankie Shaw, Rosie O'Donnell and Connie Britton. Don't miss the return of Smith, New episodes. Start streaming January twentieth. Only on Showtime. Let's talk about the qualities of a work spouse that differentiates them from just your average work pal acquaintance desk occupier who doesn't talk much Sophie Klieman over at Mike wrote about this in twenty fifteen noting that according to survey results from volt dot com. Thirty two percent of the respondents from variety of industries reported having a so-called office husband or office wife, and a separate survey of only white collar workers found that number was about double. Yeah. That's interesting. So white collar workers, I wonder if that is affected by the focus on more like creative work applied arts jobs. Maybe think office environments that are a little more loosey goosey. Yeah. I would think that in more traditional work. Places where there is more of a career ladder as opposed to service industry jobs, or obviously like freelance work those might facilitate more of those kinds of collaborative relationships because you need those networks in order to get ahead. Yeah. That's true. But your work spouse is, you know, you can be friends a lot of people at work, but your work spouses, your person, the one you click with without any romantic spark. And that's the key because hell as we'll talk about that is definitely the S. Pam, and Jim, that's right. You know, what I mean, dude roommate is a straight guy, I'm a straight girl, but because we had literally been friends so long, and we had met under circumstances where we were both dating other people like it. We never had a romantic spark between us a lot of people find that hard to believe. But you know, we really are. Early BFF's and so working together. It was like the perfect work spouse relationship, even know so many psychologists are like. So on a related note. Then this is interesting. So would you have you guys both gotten pressure from people from time to time of like, why are you all gather don't you like him? He like you. Not really because. Because most of the people who both of us know, we would never in a million years date because we are not each other's type at all. But at the job where we worked together there were a couple of women who did not know us, very, well, they just knew that we were roommates and that we literally spent so much time together. And they were like you guys are in love with each other. We see the way you react to each other. And it's like, no, I first of all stop it. Stop it. Second of all. I mean, how do you act with your best friend, right, sir? Really? Yeah. Not not very much there. There's never been any of that pressure. Really? Because we he and I are so similar, but so different. But that does become a challenge. Sometimes if you have like an opposite sex work spouse relationship where because people even still to this day have such a hard time believing that men and women can be friends should. More specifically like straight men can be legitimately friends with women of really any sexual orientation without having ulterior motives, which is just insulting on a bazillion levels. And I would imagine that that might be even more scrutinized in the workplace. Yeah. I mean, we've seen studies before where we'll talk about gender a little bit more in a second. But you know, we've seen studies that show that men in cross sex straight friendships men do interpret some signs and symptoms a little differently than women do and that can lead to a little bit of of getting but wrecked basically over a situation to put it politically put it super poetically. But I think that you you can't say it makes for nice headlines to say definitely one way or the other. But you obviously can't say anything definitively people are all different people people. They Bill faithful. So we've established then that your work spouse is just like your person. Do you know, you you do have chemistry Chris and Meredith Grey's anatomy, although they were also BFF's like viral. So, but that's the first thing I thought of was win Christina and Meredith or like bonding, and they establish that they are people on this just brought to mind the work spouse relationships on the Mindy project because Mindy played by Mindy Kaeling has an actual romantic relationship with one of the doctors. But Morgan one of the nurses is one hundred percent Mendis, work wife, although. He is not Mendis like work husband. I mean, like she's not that to she doesn't serve him in any reciprocal way. Which to the humor of it because Morgan wants to do anything he can to make Mendis life easier. When in fact, I would argue and looking forward to hearing for Mindy project fans on this. I would argue that she she has another work husband, Peter Prentice. Who's like the charming funnier like another doctor? So it's not like the. Yeah. Subordinate level that that Morgan is on. Well, I can't confirm or deny because I've never seen it. But I would argue that the sounds a lot like veep with Selina Meyer, and Gary. Yes, Terry without a doubt. And granted they had that moment in the closet where they let each other. Have it? Gary finally stood up for himself. That was last season two seasons ago. But yeah, absolutely Gary is devoted to. Julia. Louis Dreyfuss is Selina Meyer, and she just walks all over him. But they are both aware that like she would not be able to succeed at life without Gary whispering in her ear Kerry might be my all time favorite work wife. He's just the best. He is the best stuff. Because one thing one thing, Gary, Scott, you know, that other work spouses have is. Understanding the big picture. You know, Gary is always intimidating. What Selena is going to need. Yeah. And it also helps it he has his bag. Yeah. Man Bazargan back. An and so one of the key aspects to someone being a work spouse versus a casual acquaintance is understanding that big picture, you know, a lot obviously about your work spouses professional situation, their hopes their dreams their failures their successes, but you also know a lot about their personal life. And so, you know, when he or she walks in and seems upset or happy you have an idea of what's going on. Because you do you see the whole picture? There's also that because you know, so much about that person's life and their ups and downs and everything there's so much trust that has to happen there because you can't just be shooting your mouth off about the boss or another coworker that you don't like or if you have a crush. On someone at work, or if something's going wrong at home can't just be shooting your mouth off about all that stuff to just anybody. And so when you combine all the stuff, you get a pretty mega supportive, amazing friend and not surprisingly there are plenty of benefits associated to having a work spouse Ron Friedman over at the cut wrote about some research on this in December twenty fourteen which found that having a work spouse is correlated with getting sick less often. Suffering fewer accidents, changing jobs, less often and having more satisfied customers. And and again, you because you're committed to this person and your relationship with this person. Makes you happier. You don't wanna let them down. So there's more on the line. You're laziness or you're in confidence or your failure. Doesn't mean you've only let yourself down or your boss down. But it also means you're letting your work spouse down. And you don't wanna do that. Because you're so committed and Friedman also cited research that showed just how important to work spouses during those really stressful times at work people who believe that their coworkers will help them during times of stress and challenge are more likely to overcome that stress and challenge to succeed. No matter what's going on at work. They're more able to quickly integrate and adapt to things going on at work, and they report better stress management. So just knowing that you have that person. Who gets you your person at work, it reduces your stress a little bit because you can just exchange that look and be like, I know girl, I hear you loud and clear and there have been so many meetings. You have been in together large group meetings, where we might be sitting across the table from each other and just talking talking loud and clear without Santa words with us eyeball, and you'll know Carolina's very. Vibe rows. So. But this this next one though is so crucial. If you like if you are managing both a work spouse relationship and a romantic relationship on the site because one of the big benefits in terms of how your work spouse can make your personal life. Better is compartmentalizing your the minutia of your job angst. And all of the projects that you have to do all of that stress. If you can just compartmentalize it to your work spouse. You don't take it all home? Yeah. I've always taken a lot home. Anyway, I mean, like, you know, your your significant other is your significant other. So you're gonna talk to that person. But. It doesn't it kinda saves your your SO from having to sit across the table from you at dinner as you're like. No, okay. Well, let's see Betty sue is a jerk because she does this thing. And then, you know, Jim over here, he does this thing. And so, but then they, you know, like don't don't stress other people out with like the super intimate. Details of how everyone is connected at work like maybe hit the high points. Well, and to that point. I am. Real grateful that my husband did a very kind hearted job user gentle with me with this of just alerting me that I talk. I talk about work a lot Algo through phases. Where do I mean? It's. Yeah. Workers life shoot videos in my home. It is literally there all the time. And he's been so helpful and patient and kind with helping me can separate those two worlds as much as I can because I do want to be cognizant of what's going on with his work life. Does he have space to talk to me about stuff? That's annoying him. And even surprised me once when he's apprised me so many times, but one time. I was talking. About something at work making me upset, and I was like. Like, I mean, what's what are you mad about? Don't you have something? Terrible your job. And he was like. Yeah. But I I just don't I want to talk about that. I just don't I don't want to even think about that when I'm home. Yeah. Dog is the same like to that. Yeah. Just leave it at the office. Well, see the complicating factor with boyfriend August that he works at home. So I kind of witness firsthand when something is going south. But he tends to do the same thing. Like, I just wanna talk about it. Because it just gets my blood pressure up. That's not to say he never liked blows up, you know, with work stress or whatever. But he tends to just be like. Yeah. I'll I'll just now I'm focused on making dinner or now, I'm focused on watching TV. Or now, I'm focused on hanging out rather than work. I can't even he sees it all over my face. 'cause I can't I literally like getting ready to come into work today. I was blowing through the house like really fast and like trying to get ready cause doing a million different things. And he just saw my face. And he's like, this is your just in work land already are you? Yeah. Sorry. I can't help it. I mean, I could I need to. But. Yeah, I should have just come and put it all on you, Chris. That's what I'm here for Carolina. Odd cast is four. I'm not heavy. I'm your sister. But so so you have that personal life benefit for sure. Although yet, you should also you should be able to talk to your significant other. If something's going wrong at work, I shouldn't only have to speak of positive things. But then you also have the benefits of future plans and future success because as Adam grant noted forty percent of startups emerge through founders friendships, and where do we meet people? We know we like and no will work hard at the bar. Caroline, just kidding school and work. Yeah. TJ Maxx, teaching Mannix. Hey, girl, you look like you can find a deal. Are you a maximum style? Let's start a start up. But you know, we've painted a pretty rosy picture of how important work spouse is, but there are a couple downsides. If you're not being vigilant about your work relationships in general, and one thing we pointed out earlier in that if you are work spouses with someone who is known for something maybe for being super negative or super whole areas or super amazing like all of these things are going to reflect on you whether it's positive or negative. So watch out if your work spouse is known for being like the office negative, Nancy. Yeah. And I have no research to back this up and don't know whether there is any or not, but. Well, I wonder Caroline if that risk is greater for same sex work spouses because something that I have noticed and somewhat experienced in workplaces is that especially if you have a male, boss, but female bosses do this too. And your work wife is a fellow lady, you're like, mutual work wives. He got a work workplace Boston marriage going on that. It's almost as if the bus sees you as just one person. Yeah. And it doesn't help. Sometimes. I don't know. Maybe you both have dark hair. You're kind of on the pale end of the spectrum. I'm talking a little bit about us. Yes. Because it's and it hasn't been a negative us. 'cause I mean, we're charming, work wives. Hopefully, we get spicy. Sometimes as does everyone. But there are there have been those moments where it's like. To become one. Like, we know where we are still individual individual people. Yeah. Remember that? Yeah. I I don't know either. I did not come across anything that indicates. Whether that's true across the board. But I can definitely see I can definitely see what you're talking about you know, through personal research. There's also the idea of of missing out, you know, when your work best with someone. There's almost that feeling of like, well, why do I have to talk to anyone else? You know? It was definitely like that at my old job with my work. Spouses. Me a work bigamist revoke men. Anyway, you know, it's like, well, I don't I don't have to mess with like the people who really bug you. There was less incentive for me to try to cross that bridge build a bridge. Cross a bridge cinema flare break out of my silo because I had worked spouses, and they were super funny and supportive and Mike people. Yeah. Well, and I would bet that one's desire to branch out beyond their spouse silo directly correlates to how long they see themselves in that job. True. You know, and how much they respect in value the the company. So yes, if I decide I need to launch a career like infomercials like I'm gonna need to go like probably meet an infomercial, like wife, work wife or something that makes me sad and make sure it's the make up person. A little tiff. I learned from a little show we also hinted earlier at the complications that can come when your co workers are jealous of your relationship or just the complications that can come out of your work spouse being on a different level higher lower. Because is it really in a gala -tarian work spouse a to ship thing if someone's a manager in someone's a subordinate? Yeah. And speaking of co workers, they look at that and say, well, of course, Virginia just got a raise because she's friends with Lindy Lindy's the boss, by the way this area. Yeah. And you know, the the massive spouse. Whoa. It has to do with your real spouse. Yeah, I feel like this is the work spouse elephant in the room, which is the concern that your work spouse. Overshadows your spouse spouse. Yes. So there's this guy Willard f Harley junior who I swear to God is quoted in like every work spouse article on the internet, but he's a psychologist and marriage counselor. And he is a majorly concerned with the way that you are interacting with your sexual orientation matching work spouse. So he wouldn't be as worried about like Madden me like that's cool or you and me, but he'd be being gay Matt being a gay dude you being a straight lady. He gets really worried though, especially when it comes to like straight nudes and straight women hanging out because he has seen firsthand as a marriage counselor. The he says thousands. I don't know. But he he said he's seen thousands of people who've come to him after they've had this close work relationships. Evolve into an affair because as he points out like your work spouse, you call that person work spouse for reason, it's a relationship that meets a lot of needs. Like we've said it's built on trust you probably share a lot of interests. They get you there. You're person you click you share sense of humor, and you probably complain about the same things like little if you throw like work travel into the mix or like work cocktail parties or watch out. Harleys guidelines are all about like do not spill your marriage problems to your work your opposite or your sexual orientation matching were expose don't be spilling marriage was. Because that makes it sound like the doors open don't get drunk together. Don't travel alone together maintain those boundaries talk about your spouse in a positive way. Make sure that your spout your real life spouse is included in things. So that he or she does not feel excluded. Because you don't wanna make it seem like you have some sort of secret clandestine relationship going on well, and in terms of not spilling your marriage problems to someone you might potentially want to have sex with because that's basically what the whole like sexual orientation matching is. I think is is good advice all around whether you're in a a work situation or not because it's like just be careful if you are complaining about like if you hear yourself complaining about the person that you are with to someone who could by contrast start to look a little shinier in your eyes. That makes sense. Yeah. Is anybody out there watching man seeking woman? It's on FX X float like one of the sub FX channels. And there's literally a whole episode about that where there's like beautiful charming girl at work, and she is close friends with the lead guy, and he's just waiting. He's just waiting to slip in there. And she starts complaining about her boyfriend who turns out to literally be Jesus played by Fred Armagh, son, which is ironic and she complains about him, and he's like got a shot, and he goes for it and falls on his face the same thing like. Just don't don't leave the goal. Yeah. Unintended. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and that's that. Also requires you as the complainer, I think maybe checking yourself. Yeah. Checking your motivations. What's going on maybe considering whether there is someone who would be healthier if there to talk to. Yeah. Or even just like a friend who might not have any vested interest. Yeah. At all. I like this episode just became us giving like marriage advice. You're welcome. So expect you Bill in the mail anytime. Thanks to stamps dot com. All right. So we have to get into gender, right? I mean, we're smitty and we've kind of danced around the whole gender topic. This is coming from a couple of different sources, they called you today, the comparably organization European business review, but work friendships tend to have a couple different types of rewards. You've got the socio emotional rewards, which is basically you're sharing pleasure in experiences, and then instrumental rewards which have to do with exchanging favors. And again, we're going to talk in like pretty stereotypical broad brush terms. But for the most part women are more likely to enjoy the socio emotional rewards of forming work friendships while men are more likely to participate in those instrumental reward friendships and to break this down a little bit. A study done by comparably as users Intech specifically, whether they had a mentor, and whether they had a best friend at work and women were way more likely at all levels of the job. To say, yes, I have a mentor. I've formed a relationship with someone in that regard. And yes, I have a best friend at work. And that has a lot to do with the way that researchers say women form friendships with one another so Lisa brakeman, who's a psychotherapist told refinery twenty nine that women are more likely to share personal details at work, which equates to a whole load of lady intimacy, basically. And that is basically the foundation of friendship, right? You're sharing stuff about yourself. And that is definitely a quick way to form a work friendship, especially a work best friendship, and because women are more likely to do this than men are. Apparently that makes that study result makes sense that women are therefore for more likely to have a best you at work or a mentor that they formed a close relationship with well, and we're also likely to seek that kind of emotional support when we are stressed. At work and to both receive and provide more emotional social support than men in times of work related unhappiness or distressed in along those same lines women tend to invest more in maintaining those friendships calling friends regularly meeting more frequently always be g Chattan the gifts back and forth. Yeah. And it's the thing that you said about supporting each other being more likely to support each other in stressful times at work that ties back to the stuff we mentioned earlier about how those work spouse ships are based on a huge amount of trust. And how your works out his faction? And therefore, you work productivity is based on knowing that you have someone behind you who's going to support you, you know, you have someone to talk to someone who's gonna believe what you're saying. And support what you're doing? But when it comes to men at work again. Disclaimer, this is all very general. But when it comes to men at work, generally, their friendships can be described as those instrumental or transactional, friendships, they tend to be organized around those shared interests and activities or the exchange of tangible rewards and favors and be action oriented rather than person oriented, hence everybody's going out to play goal. Off or whatever or you go to the the the box of the football game. Yeah. Yeah. Or whatever the equivalent is. You guys are all playing together. That's just going to keep its the deck. Cut is the mascot of this episode. I'm fine with that or sushi. Just a slab sushi and one recent study that I'm like, okay, one recent study said that it's possible that male co workers go out drinking together more because it lowers all of their like pent-up masculine emotions, and I have to raise an eyebrow. At that. Because that's very like, I don't know. I went out drinking with coworkers quite a bit, and it was always mixed gender groups. Yeah. It's just jobs blow off steam. I'm curious what exact inhibitions they're referring to think they're referring to those like Cisco emotional of getting beyond the like getting beyond like those stat. Yeah. Should being like, you know, what I'm actually? Vulnerable and I enjoy art I enjoy art. And also scared about where my career is going, and I was really interested to in this this socio economic note about male work friendships. This one study cited was saying that working class or blue collar guys at work ten to express that transactional nature of friendship with material goods and services. Like, hey all exchange wrenches with you. They're exchanging wrenches. That's actually symbol of marriage in some societies while middle class or white-collar dudes. We're more likely to share those leisure activities like going golfing or going to baseball game. But I wanna go back to one thing before we start to wrap up in terms of the finding that were women's friendships tend to center around the socio. Emotional rewards, just having the pleasure in the shared experiences. Whereas men's work relationships are more favor based you kinda go out to get ahead. And I think that I've brought this exact same scenario up on previous podcast. But clearly is just stuck in my mind because it reminds me of a tweet that we received a while back from a young woman who wants to get ahead and socialize, but she can't go out for drinks because it's all guys at her office, and they never directly invite her. And she feels like she can't go because she would like kill the all guy vibe. So I wonder if it is so much a his and hers like, oh, we have this. You know, our socio emotional rewards, or is that the ceiling is that like all we can really access. Yeah. I mean, I've definitely heard of women like taking golf lessons so that they can participate in the upper management voice club. That is the Gulf outings were businesses discussed on on the green. But I that's a really good point. Yeah. I mean, it could be like, yeah. Could be that women genuinely are appreciating. These types of relationships and men are appreciating those types of relationships. But if you can't even get an invite to one or the other right because that kind of after hours networking is where a lot of promotions. Yeah. Come from. Yeah. And if you can't even get in the bar or. Do get in the bar. It's really awkward because you have to play the whole like oh my God. You guys are here. So weird. I'm here to alone. Not because I'm sad. Just wanted. Can I join you? Or sweating. So the glass slips out of your hand. And it's just a disaster. Others get your leg, and you've got to go to the hospital, and then you miss work. And and then they fire you see see what networking bringing exactly that's what networking felt like when I was unemployed. It's true. But all of that to say that I hope that. Workplaces become more just cognizant of those unnecessary hangups that we have and really prejudices toward men and women or people who match sexual orientations Dr Harvey put it of those people forming relationships going to one on one lunch together going out for drinks one on one if they need to because I think. Yeah. Like in group settings totally fine. Not a big deal. But as soon as you have after hours time with your work husband, and suddenly eyebrows raised. Yeah. Yeah. But hopefully, if you have formed if you are a straight lady in a straight guy. I mean, hopefully, you've you followed the God lines for work spouse ship, and you guys do have a very open, honest relationship in your significant others and your co workers are aware that like no nothing's going on. And that it doesn't become a situation where everything is blown out of proportion because people are gossiping about you. Right. Like look at look at them spending all of that time together. And if you are consistently hanging out outside of work hours with with that work spouse. When you also have a spouse might be a good idea to just make sure that all the stuff together. Just just ease. Everyone's minds. But how do you even get to that point? How do you do you get down on one to get to get a work spouse? Do I need to go. Get a ring the Donlon save up to months salary. Get a little twist tie. You put it on the pointer finger. That's that's the worst bus finger the point area. Well, researchers basically across the board are like, you know, there's certain ways that friendships no matter what the setting are formed. Here's a quick guide. I love it. Like, the works bows within forty five minutes less, and that's basically to be vulnerable. Because if you want to form close best, ship or friendship at work. You're not going to get there by just talking about the weather. So if you like somebody at work, and you think you guys could be good friends allies could trust each other and help each other. It's Wapping this personal stories. It's work spouse ships are formed on the basis of knowing so much about each other and still supporting each other. It's kinda like it all ties back to an Friedman's shine theory about supporting your powerful besties and not being intimidated by them. And Robert Epstein who's at the American Institute for behavioral research and technology says quote vulnerability is the key to emotional bonding without which relationship Sinfield superficial. And meaningless that doesn't mean you need to be talking about all your issues like at work in front of everyone. But when you do have this closer one on one relationships don't be afraid to be vulnerable. Yeah. Yeah. It'd be vulnerable without over sharing. Right. You know, maybe hold off on talking about your romantic relationships and also be mindful of personal space. Maybe you're hopeful works vows to. To be you know, doesn't need to know about your menstrual cycle yet yet. Yeah. East and then of course, avoid gossip at first when you start when you're embarking on a new work marriage because as we discussed about my earlier about my super awful co worker at my first job that negativity. Just breeds more negatively, and if people get the impression that they can't trust you too. Because all you're gonna do is talk smack about them behind their backs. Like, what's the point of having a work spouse? If everybody else hates you. Yeah. Yeah. You need to just find another job. I think about points. Yes. All you can do is literally say horrible things about each other or other people at work that probably just means you're unhappy in your job do something else. Yeah. Well, and that does get us to one thing that we haven't directly addressed which is the work spouse divorce because yeah, you can. Just like friendships can get toxic. And you got to let them go similar thing can happen. Especially in the workplace because I mean, you have you you've got a lot more on the line. Yeah. So I'm curious to hear from listeners who have worked spouses, and if anyone is willing to share with us going through kind of the work spouse divorce, did you finally have to call it. Or was it like a work spouse? Slow fade. Yeah. You get a new job and the friendship didn't continue. Yeah. All these relationships are. So like, they seem so sterile. Yeah. You know from the outside, but when you really start paying attention to them full of matching, feminist mugs. They are. They are and lots of games, duck hunt and platters of sushi so much sushi when they're at their best, right? So please share all your work wife work husband works POWs. And also do you have a preferred title for that? Do you do not call your person, your your work spouse? Let let us the deeds. Mom stuff at how stuff works at com is our Email address, you can also tweet us at mom stuff podcast or messages on Facebook. And we've got a couple of messages to share with you right now. Marcus hanna. Devante Abigail, Jeremiah and Sierra heart six beautiful black children ranging in age from twelve to nineteen. We're all adopted by Sarah and Jennifer heart both white on jen's Facebook page. It looked as if they were the perfect blended family, even earning the nickname heart tribe from friends then on March twenty six twenty eighteen the families GMC Yukon was found belly up on the rocks. Blue California's highway one could these lives have been saved broken hearts new podcast from glamour, and how stuff works investigates this question with more than thirty never before heard interviews authored by Jin heart field reporter, Lawrence smiley leaves. No stone turned even returning to the scene of the crime, six months after the crash and pressing all agencies involved in an incident that left six dead and two missing starting to simmer forth with new episodes dropping every Tuesday co host and glamour editors Justin Harman and Elizabeth Egan follow the family's journey from South Dakota through Minnesota, Oregon and Washington. And finally to that one hundred foot cliff in California, listen and subscribe to broken hearts, spelled H A R T S Conde nast. I ever narrative podcast at apple podcast are on the I heart radio app or wherever you listen to podcast. Got a message here from age real from our episode where we talked to Anne Marie slaughter about caregiving. She says this is an extremely important topic. And I'm so glad that it's finally being brought to the forefront up until recently, I never fully appreciated. How important having quality free? Childcare has been to my own success. I got pregnant myself more year college for the first year of my son's life. It was a struggle trying to figure out how to work go to school pay for daycare. I remember having to choose between staying home with a sick one year old and going to work. I also remember being fired because of choosing to stay home with my sick one year old. But my story does have a happy ending when my son was two. I took a job working at a daycare the pace sucked. But he could go to daycare for free. And that was a tremendous help. I was able to save my money and spend it on things like rent and food having childcare also allowed me to finish my undergraduate degree, and it also helped me to go on to complete my master's, as well, I own a lot of my success to having free childcare if it were not for that do not know where my son, and I would be no one should ever have to choose between something basically feeding their family or affording care yet. Sadly, this happens every day care is a basic human right that everyone should have access to I agree here here. Thanks for your letter. Well, I have a letter here from Amelia who right? I I love your work and fierce feminism, I've learned quite a few new things from your podcast and listening, always a treat. Well, thank you Amelia. Secondly, the recent episode with Anne Marie slow. Really hit home for me. I'm thirty two and stuck between having a baby and going to grad school. I've so many questions and self doubts about any avenue pursue do. I had to grad school knowing I'll be thirty six when I have my first baby. Do I put off grad school? So I can utilize my young ish eggs or do I strap on my Kate and do both at the same time. All my choices are daunting and most professional women ask don't have any answers either. I have asked several of my professors who have small children what they suggest and I've heard everything from just have a baby. Now, you're not getting any younger to there's really no good time to have kids. The worst most memorable piece of advice. I got was well, at least your fiancee's done with his degree. What the heck is a gal supposed to say to that. So while your interview with MS slaughter did not necessarily assuage any of my worries. I am relieved to know that there are strong women willing to have these conversations and fight for a level of equality. Which is long overdue while things may not change overnight. I'm hopeful that our generation maybe the last to know this inequality Emery slaughter is a bad ass. And so are you please keep up the great work? Well, you know, what you're about us as well. And those are such daunting questions that I have a feeling so many listeners can relate to you as a woman in my thirties. I think I think similar things as well. Honestly, it's just it's just weird having ovaries. Just knowing they're sitting in their the. Yeah. True. But yeah, I also am really excited that Anne Marie slaughter. I and other amazing people are working or that equality that we all need. So with that keeps sending your letters mom stuff at how stuff works dot com is our Email address and for links to all of our social media as well as all of our blogs, videos and podcasts with our sources. So you can learn more about work wives, head on over to stuff. Mom, never told you dot com. For more on this and thousands of other topics. Visit how stuff works. I'm Katie golden. I studied psychology and biology at Harvard, and I pretend to be a bird on Twitter and my new podcast creature feature. We've you nature in man from a new perspective each episode asking comedian to get inside the minds of animals, so we can explore the startling connections to human psychology, you'll find blood bands and treachery that make game of thrones seemed like a dumb show for babies. Join this every Wednesday and subscribe on apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Stuff Mom Never Told You
Aired Last month 5:44
How Did the 'Green Book' Change Life for Black Travelers?
Hey, brain stuff listeners instead of an ad today. I wanted to tell you about new podcast. I think you might dig for my friends, Robert lamb, and Joe McCormack, you might already know them from the weird science podcast stuff to blow your mind. Their new show is called invention each episode of invention examines different technological turning point and the people and cultures the provoked the change they consider the origins and impact of everything from the guillotine to the vending machine. Chopsticks to sunglasses. Braille to x-rays and lots more new episodes of invention come out every Monday, listen and subscribe to invention on apple podcasts the iheartradio app or wherever you happen to find your podcasts. Welcome to brain stuff from how stuff works. Hey, rain stuff. I'm Lauren Volvo bomb when author and playwright Calvin Alexander Ramsay was growing up in Baltimore in the nineteen fifties. He never really questioned why his family like all other black families. He knew would leave for vacation car trips at two or three in the morning, and he never thought twice about the fact that the family always slept at private homes instead of hotels used to the side of the road is a restroom and packed their own food with them for the length of the journey. Only years later did Ramsey realized that his parents avoided restaurants gas stations and hotels in order to protect him from the racist degradations and very real dangers of traveling while black in nineteen fifties America until the nineteen sixty four Civil Rights Act, formerly ended segregation and made it a crime to discriminate on the basis of skin color. The tradition of the great American road trip was very different for families of color, black motorists traveling outside of major city centres had no way of knowing. Whether the local service station would sell them gas, or if there were any restaurant serving customers within a hundred mile radius. In nineteen thirty six a black man living in Harlem, New York, decided to do something about it inspired by Jewish publications that listed safe places for Jewish travelers to eat and sleep on the road. Victor Hugo green published the first edition of the green book inside the pages of the green book black travelers could find state-by-state listings of hotels and private tourist homes to spend the night plus restaurants, barber shops service stations and stores where their business was welcome. Calvin Alexander Ramsey who wrote a popular children's book in two thousand ten called Ruth and the green book as well. As a play about the green book explains that green relied on a network of fellow blackmail men across the country to compile listings of businesses and private residents and then mailed addresses back to Green's wife in Harlem who would add them to the always expanding publication. A new edition of the green book was published every year from nineteen thirty six through nineteen sixty four and sold at black owned Esso service stations the green book was a lifeline for black travelers. Many of whom carried fresh memories of humiliation at the hands of white business owners and not only in the Jim crow south, plenty of northern and western towns and cities had sundown laws stating that no black person should be found within the city limits after nightfall conducting interviews for a forthcoming documentary on the green book. Ramsey's spoke to a woman who as a little girl on a family road trip to Florida in the early nineteen fifties suddenly became ill and needed a place to rest Ramsey said. Her father went to three or four different hotels and motels. And they turned him away. He said my daughter is really ill and needs a bed to rest peacefully for awhile. And they all said, no she remembers. It was the first time should ever seen her father cry. The green book was created to ensure that other black families didn't have to endorse such dehumanizing treatment at an age when many white business owners felt it was perfectly acceptable to refuse black patrons flipping through the nineteen. Forty addition. There are paid advertisements from black owned businesses. In addition to detailed listings for every major city in each state in some locales options were limited, South Dakota. For example, only had two listings a service station entity private tourist home of MRs j Moxley included in the forty eight page booklet is a letter from a grateful reader named William Smith from Hackensack New Jersey. Who wrote we earnestly believed the green book will mean as much if not more to us as the triple a means to the white race Ramsey explains that roadside assistance organizations like AAA often didn't accept black members, and that savvy black travelers would bring along extra fan, belts, spark plugs, for long journeys. The nineteen thirty seven edition of the green book starts with a section on automotive preparedness, and how to keep a car up and running. Victory greens publication, opened up America's roads and highways to millions of black families. He died in nineteen sixty four years shy of the passing of these Rights Act a moment hit long long-awaited. Green wrote in the introduction to the nineteen forty-nine edition. There will be a day sometime in the near future. When this guide will not have to be published that is when we as a race will have equal opportunities and privileges in the United States. It'll be a great day for us to suspend this publication for then we can go wherever we please and without embarrassment. But until that time comes she'll continue to publish this information for your convenience each year. Today's episode was written by Dave ruse and published by Tyler clang for more on this and lots of other topics. Visit our home planet. How stuff works dot com. I'm Katie golden. I studied psychology and evolutionary biology at Harvard, and I pretend to be a bird on Twitter and my new podcast creature feature. We've you nature in man from a new perspective each episode asking comedian to get inside the minds of animals, so we can explore the startling connections to human psychology, you'll find blood bands and treachery that make game of thrones seemed like a dumb show for babies. Join this every Wednesday and subscribe on apple podcasts for on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Aired 5 months ago 2:48
Playing With Science Checkdown Week 4
It's time for the plane with science check down where sciences sports collide for that. Let's say a little or good friends. Chuck. Nice. And Dr Eric Gulf, we're going to dissect this play coming up Matt, Ryan, connecting with Calvin Ridley for their second touchdown of the game today in Atlanta, Ridley has accounted for five touchdowns the last two weeks guys take us through that play. Hey, Brian, how are you good to be with you again this season. And of course, as you said, Ridley what a beast he has been in the last couple of games and Dr. Eric gov. Why don't you take us through exactly what happened. Sure, Chuck with first and ten at the Bengals thirty yard line. The falcons snap the ball from the right hash Calvin Ridley was lined up on the far right side of the line just inside the big thirty on the turf doctrines quarterback Matt, Ryan had perfect pocket protection and had the pleasure of watching his rookie ride receiver. Juke bingles quarterback Dray, Kirk, Patrick Ridley ran about three and a half yards and juked hard toward the right sideline. Kirk, Patrick then got schooled by Isaac Newton. When he bid on the juke, his momentum was toward the sideline. He needed a big force to stop that momentum and turn him back toward Ridley who was already running toward the end zone. I mean, was perfect, is Ryan fired the ball at about fifty miles an hour, nearly thirty degrees above the horizontal really was on the twenty yard line. When Ryan threw the ball and then caught the pass on the fly at the five yard line, Ryan new is receiver speed is the aim for a spot fifteen. Yards in front of Ridley really didn't have to sprint. He hit about eighteen miles per hour and getting to the ball. No, bingo was within six yards of him when he got caught it, Chuck Isaac, Newton helped us understand how Mars and Venus go around the sun. He also helped us understand how Ridley ran around Kurt Patrick on his way to the end zone. Absolutely embarrassed. You have momentum normally good thing in a game, unless you can't. Is it Newton smackdown by physics. Chuck, you love good moniker. Like I do. We're old school. Calvin rarely as a touchdown machine. Can we call him the Ridler now the falcons. Oh my God. Well, really meet this Brian. Why wouldn't we now you wanna go freight Gordon or Jim Carey who's a better Ridler. Come on briar you know, going Frank course, and you know it, the man of thousand voices fellows. You're the best. We'll talk to you next week. The playing with saints check down, make sure to check out the flame with saints podcast with new episodes premiering one week early. All free only on tune in.