20 Episode results for "Cahan"

#ChikahanHour: 'Beyond the News' feat. Tita Jing Castaneda

FHMoms Radio - Parenting, Freelancing, and Entrepreneurship

43:51 min | 6 months ago

#ChikahanHour: 'Beyond the News' feat. Tita Jing Castaneda

"But i'm not going the mama mama. She adding god knows on the radio. Ads h how axa bad. He'll be among she station. How sub daddy. H video among she adding chica king on our. It's time to make it light and right held up a happy. Happy am-among. She's in willin netted an online khalid sheikh cahan our bumming move to introduce our guest now. Home mommy mk yes nia and then you bought seek out at not behind me. Napoleon accomplishments as a journalist news amcor program hose and awesome. She is the former program director in an mba cbs. Bunt by yama mom. I love on an issam. Gene pastula day. The g nine must nello all them all mom in energy i and hit by energy. Who and so. I think Show being champress. Good the gigging successful. I say and be up on beijing all but I know how unfortunate bundy twenty was but us being resilient The aging saw melamine gone about changes. But in the mind. No at onairmafia ebola hannibal after. Abc ben deeper into my new. If you see. Be andrew program snapping champion emma watson dying channel when the info ghosn at being at eight at joel. Entertainment shows grams at public affairs programs. Young wound up alwa- though thirty three better down here at the boston room. Rams mitchell must nagy walk native in other things. Let them know. Even attic of amelia had been a bomb them. Come in the set on the abbey. Fatal stabbing not being know in god closes the door. He opens Mommy will win those. Who are the lagaan months. Show up pale. But by saying champion on guy delano mulligan did get you up being the and lump elegantly one said eighty not in new jersey lord wildland in some not by adding thought will bite at the moon but the force admitted lead that he that the shepherdess at ucsd in could be abu moffat ear. I use latin above gated benefits Among lionel necessarily convenient may own were on our. You're looking challenge again. As i said the only people who held out federal champion in mind you can get on bottom agata to guide for zoning then brunei ready made you support your house to create your own. You support You have to work for you. Family members if a million abs coming Of course we still keep in touch. Only nikola dot the adult. I don't become you muck up. Osama so there's always a silver lining everything up on the newness appoint one a m a very positive versus not lambda by lebanon But admittedly andy needham. Aps vpn vickland on monday mia underdrive roller coaster of emotions yet. Everyday's a struggle. It's always a choice to be positive and seeing the woman you damn yet on the head of the us so on some are evs louise but you wanna so multiple. Who wasn't listening you. You'd be with you on now. Hardy you very much. The green gang acronym sobbing in your your mom she snagging. Please do comment down your question on your messages by the The gene a senior at the gene and a mutual curious. A whole say before yes Before you had a very hectic schedule so i wouldn't managed bugging me. You have been so busy for many years. You have the Shoal monday by in an all so finding Economou manage the lagaan landau well heist panel loma. Lucky seila said grade school that being done Sepulveda island to shake things. Go mom she's spent look like in the be multi. They develop the worst habits if they if they're able to be disciplined enough lucky neela in not in ceylon joked so my you're in high school nevada. You stuck with someone either in the store that do not come india latin. Goggle off when you're the mommy the gene the short victim shy but very inspiring him on a share ninety The gene assay Be down sound. I stay home with women. Gay the gene causing a novella. Bugah bug the young abbot level umbrella gin parent so the mom. She's not injured. Maybe you can comment down along. The owner bowman and methane in so i call on an excuse staff so stage knuckle. Mommy who've sa stage shuttling side. So brown hyper all then bad sober coming in at a no no so and so in the digital nine bike image. Makina dope was been acting. Mama she's hello. Hello hello yes. Initially your multi peddling all young share open now malabar that ha- don't illegal upi casino bugah insulin on highschool value c. Say wait in an incident land so battle you young saudi busy schedule better. That he will be fascinating value among among he's gonna happen again. On the on by the absent novus of esa office in the ipe leave scope exam leila blencoe guinea gambia elegant absent. All you worst mom mykola mommy. Mommy rules than bid did grandma psalm. Cassia foggy nago and your amino number gotha. You'll words among western air. So i've been not in salem. Fama be bit beefy nealon on cylinder up on. Am anything but a anoma. Simple fix pedal impact. Some are bad band nor somebody number event but maimana shoot. Inca may may not be Who would undermine. Salem uh scheduled so schools in osama book outfit each Admitted bit we'll see laugh On your in bound when you're no mom mom she's ucla. Within of course after the not by name yadda bottom or yet makes little sheila but say limbaugh you eat any yuma out that each nicaragua. Now being like last mates. Now maple blair ma our apple. Mesa don't be so. But meanwhile nash remind up by four thirds small sold in sports so managing a month last meet somebody claim a lucile done family members the la to see this the a mommy can be helped them be for them to your thirst cd moment brands or mean sign bugah like main assassin. You'll the faith. Dr oskoui the whole means mommy can be an old donate mellanby would by. I don't know about that. I'm you you know who so you say on one. You'll you're reaching for them so they have to see it for themselves. So we have to want the nike funded us at the bottom. A guy by the by the doping. Daniela university new. I eight montana. Phone over inner by your cellphone dying on cellphone excite them fixed so indeed deeply element. Eat la william would not you know we Practice ourselves. So nine on a bug. Count down on count down no no new year so it was really bad deba- abc. In a. i during that you take it for a lot of feeding every year battle depot. Abc cbs. i don't really you build memories your family your children haley. The countdown upgrading. Now have a new way but machine bonding tv. But mcghie mcgeown memories with them so follow your damning so online lahat ever so for me on lake like mecer sola naming bogus iowa. You're not eating enough. Finally barish byron visited audience. Say yeah you me. That people are not devout. Were really forced to just stay in one one church all of us. You see nothing So favorite dealership of amelia father equal father or boss On sanborn juan. So you'd be be in We talked to them. We asked them or their ideas on how in be wanding tvs with them Some the the happy-go-lucky Mom you know half when muddy so you know jeopardy with on the dick van dyke in a mama. Ghulam not in ibiza. Michael gallup only only the un elegant landman laughing enough not be in various the them and be nothing any lower allowing them. No off a new soviet union bovine. I became the programming monday. By that. i see you. You'll be says it from phenom Give children of ways in mississippi elegant i mean in august minded but at that the so are you had we discussed it together. Mapo may online show would let mommy m gay lobby. Won't i discussed with them. The topics misdeeds loved louis. Interesting it in beautiful or not being. I don't even allow maybe not in guy manabe facility. gene I have will i. How must have been eating in a half of ian zone. Somebody yes less money you so. This'll cinema our always. My boyfriend denies speaking of The djing no other way you master get us no maiden deal. You mentioned about boyfriend. No by My bottom dump. Something like that when china but Growing up with gen z snow struggles got but now weaning moments Near together noma annoying muddy. Yes struggled fell. He's a war is is well because their vitamins delay. So it's a blessing. It's a blessing. Every night i think for that battle. I'm stronger but in a compound employees in your is you'd money hit them up of. At outstandings through this and that s not great again. I'm finding that guy tie you diva like attaya similar gudgeon so you wanna challenge no and not going out. Maybe explain to them. Lack of discipline hayden said he less damage from middle middle. enc but he gets also on netflix. Zoom social dilemma. When it was among about that guy human with dia was it needs unit. Dog you you'll effect the llegado bud. Gandhi some gadgets and all that beat up on not enough aids go into effect and then you winning women's snow mind Eating other students nila. Then you have the school buddy. Dictatorial insurance s- agrees would be waning moments. You integrate offer Classmate when they offered without their slew demoted him to say mama per game. You're back east need i. We'll see expose mozilla battle buddy Yonex about that. They obey a normal. Very thankful now on salem A scene believed ma experiences expos on shambling mugging possibly know young passive abedin thing the he at edging own on the balloon. Our shout out so have anything from you. Could then i d. I ends below That hidden inside a you know you not only for sure. Have yet and diving. The half hour aging rodriguez knows A digital or modern parenting our in I'm so happy that the by nomadic diane time to you know share mine. I dunno manua weaning moments net then aspirants because they've been a guy hitmaker super nothing ticketing serious or a dummy coding map woman an so thirty dollars. I said sheikh ahead that then She's as you can see in the flesh net in yuma getting up. beat the gene. About mug bundibugyo shame. Free janka sauvignon fabric. John newmarch getting more and it is a medical mission byron at it but you'll medical mission ambiance of one year one year ago gain no eruption so the medical missino saddam would go about it. Just edging each mega outreach. In my nothing engage somalian in class activities because of the pandemic major mahy europe. So did they gene. I n By coming my lemon I wanna buy land say no you work life with a family Not mentioned enough. I need have met in kabul among deeps bug things work life balance hobby nor any john. Lloyd cruz yes. Yawn digging fairly for your partnership number gasol. You don't wanna the site one guy in bye-bye guy so pay landmark sandra fidler beating bakayoko Long gender stereotype but a volume latvian. My yet you play dealing away the liquor but dymock partner side hunt for you. At informed on a allowing for are useful values are among osama sobar high. Sapping i need. I know it takes a village to raise a child. Osama pool doing adding osama zimbawe hake osama new adding support at norrland. All know eat. Eat them if we found beautiful. You mama you glass seeing saporta last night and a first time management a manage man abide by numbly bob latin american economic block of find. No finding somebody something A number other you plenty of these schedeuled on the nominee Study time we'd mommy. I land land. They land eat not of putting. It abandoned the denounced rupture real structure. So you pena basic. Wow thank you very much. Aging elimidate edging marsh. Eric golan an your soon to be wife. Buy land and and elegant on your husband acres so i senior i'm dealing. Maintaining muscle was the question. Kuboki gomez media and for partnership or ended newborn encourage cigarettes hobby. nah she sat in finding when ingrained. See how much work time and at this time. You're taking care of the kids this alum near you. Fashion go for a job. I love young fashion elegant bugging broadcaster alias. In even before we got married we alerted e off about it so unify. You some magus iowa like you. Mommy rule element you on a sea. That's a big issue so my mom. Non-negotiable style may negotiable non-negotiable Allow land gasol blundering saying you get marriage. So that's a non negotiable for me and You'll ever since. It was never an issue for ian sole sympathizes and then of course you willing did not by the not enough papa. Don't laugh airshaft. Like nabucco via did nothing you would you not some by then kamanga under the month or are your and then again things that we have also if each moms now who really give wounded especially some emma. Mommy's would like to shave working from home. Your mom pm key west front. Rfid the genie and the gene. No uh-huh at the known been ceo That would be I know mugging again. The barren this type of what's happening moments. Diana stress fool union because of this and that especially online schooling the noma but the at a map god on that knowing so that although asa leash sample batum feeling go all making the gal though secret. Those manip- beanie but didn't they the automo- of the than the be for macau off her. Knock you're not you sound secret. Say give you. Ossete gave energy that the many theon john again gene office would hike thickener yoga yoga. You get your mama mama. Breathe in me. Yeah mama on times. This value breed in readout. Say you oxygen Markets a of the in your by the value learning battle beauty secret. I want one of oil b. o. Yan modem would up on bbc so again you're you're lagging in your mamba sepah or died work from home on guy. Twenty four seven all but a lot of moisture. Nice boston eats and so madam thank knuckle home. It'd be okay. I'll bet at the c o pella getcha available to shop. I'd send my g- When that nozoe at the maybe you can share with us either way. You had that but numbing about online shows no though gain up at abandon kasimov coming collaborations a guy go in with the gene assess. O'brien loved and loved menu advocacy in americans if ethan and shut them and then with h. Mom so somebody excite. The governor must mahato loan in terms of you know hale that things about the casa de maryland montgomery f shamas advocacy Good things in net a safety the at that child safety so he saying some advocacy the and didn't have mums and then yuma Bugged longer answer abuse women no so sober important than salmon indian ala advocacy in america so underway on lane. Show is not that but naming abandon Sub santita gene. Thank you thank you nv emami. Emmy bill ma f h moms stumbled either a thirty year on five years ago by f h moments known so multiple years next month so i think that they seven been yes. Are you all so for. Believe donald and sixty nine mommy. Md and congratulations on review for being a part of this Female santa anita dam support any involvement in having support group Physically with you virtually with you monopoly. Mugging the nations all of you are members of this Beam of this family and You beat the nothing slates neon. These are online programs with every night Eight forty five. Now gabby the so facebook. So genius indiana video like funnel in chair on youtube channel wa- Subscribe but instagram at the settlement. So ever since the full not fully known platforms on later on tv or radio The like a of supping superbowl Organ meats that firms nagel said offer graham above guy again. Put my show on topic. Anina bashing gordon gas during his federal side land last year scope was abc. Be the allies. Gonna you need somebody that on behalf to i'm not being my getting info show. It brought my sean combined fat with donkey. Now go on import mommy. Mp in my show and go final Healing sold out here. Amelia marshall fund will might us impetus sean combined Elegant and more thank the phone behind one machine set the unwound of blessing allegory in Now by knocking expand on somebody sepah gigging rogue after third. But they took off road with gordon but even eventful. But i must say. Eds in apple play. Appreciate these opportunity. So thank you mommy. Mk mom you lightning alone. Umbrella guy. you've not not being that up again. A book affect them. You might expand opposite dominic making use new mom mom she's dominate. Usa alum spunk. Let me know much Report on people in the mona expert will be nuance and your experts. Now i'm in a missile nami. Sheriff we say but will Ninety nine again for mushroom label so online did not legal eagle Eight forty five. I'm gonna be it then on sunday. So i think the larger program of your neck. That's at four thirty in the afternoon. Will you be not familiar. Lunga not endorse february. This is in a walk with white e channel. abc be in some whom who Platforms download all. Am and your mommy geek. Along what it failed. Mexico mohammadi the dean extra palo f h. Moms communities are cool. More ain't going delaying oregon. So you'll f h moms will more among collaborate. Didn't you don't want to be starting their this february so every month Be so these oxygen. Lana barron was Bridging the gap between generations in. Then you'll mona. If w issues law and untruths. Lena a some white choose the. Yeah or device ralph on that egypt yan heireann so you are some light. The domin awful. Look osama several nash. Us by the buzzer. The million biden fast. What apple to baylor made answer for every question so all of us who joined conversation that value. Mookie on making your defensive bush on so funded been value do not in my hand to mcgann don symbol north. I've been bama's at mossy and then wins need a month not end up with a missile or none of them so van. Okay so yet. A man who Won't employees channel that these programs will be at six o'clock not thirty five thirty. E in the afternoon somebody launch guest alumni holid- neto baiano now ready to fly hours. Who move. I didn't i but yes and then on saturday. I dunno manfredini. Ej that genius. friday so by the end magnon light light lamp lifestyle Event saturday kasama board cpap arabic novels at won't show his authority but the things ika fan Acting on our online shows. So i'm looking at the who may on one line will be shown in fact it's more it's more able not ratio on a shading of Banding s now. He even with it again. But the blood may fund amelia but apple mcadam said in burma show enough a hell of a so. I really look forward. Operate in more review. Mommy and mommy roof in the let me noted i'm moving on a new york and definitely data drink had online shows the mayor. And so. But i'm melanie dulong dos adding mom. She's nanan the ordinary indignation so Again thank you so much By guest madonna f h moms This is the first time against nevada because they take the money on guinness more. And we're looking forward. So much madame peng. Our guests nagai go in with the f. h. mom's excited now collaboration that ns yet or thank you very mom inside. Mommy's the mon- f h somebody not in a guest definitely definitely so i n and um oh. She's sobering in joy such like i had an hour not been v gene. I am thank you so much. Snow guest the. Oh man thank you sound will not question before we end our chicken our segments for the night and the advice nusa moms imagine though olenin and self esteem similan mugging fulltime mom and now planning the mcguirk that way so that i know mama i they moms made on going on Khomba experience not gotten about one on the leg up along bug. That thing went on Up point and either feeling we'll make lamb via the young in mongo in managua. Something like that edging. I know by on my advice. Mock mommy this. Ira mom meet gonna see older oster of emotional. These are very abnormal. Thanks so on. Venus of every week starts here agabi nothing but positive. We have to believe in ourselves now. He went up on money adding allow mahalia jackson. But having said that we also need except that. It's all a not legal aid up in the night. i'm not that i know. That's a nasa. Put the two way again. The fan man in a high ambient you nothing. No how old is lee. Be when people monopoly won't be mugunga. Each iniquity nasa be a lotta bake automa- clarion more A a bit alive. Molina smile picked who his logical ethical bugging debugging. Not me to win at the. Monday mummies behind you unique in india mobile in zimbabwe East shared among our dino donate means army a comey already really officials mean. Suddenly speak mom. She's leaves sika feeling and again we're the will grow melik. You'll adding sales for and then on three people men would on them. Benito molina when on the faucet. Few uncle massive sat. The negative won't up more bugs in really going. You may play with another bobble when need a model better but having a wiggle novel lagaan audi say so in every problem there's all these oposite insight every failure. There's always a success story to success story by the bottom las Not in my brainwashed into believing that because it is true that again by good issue. So you in. For your mapping acking. It's so again if you if you have fine you can know up channel jinx interviews from gonna Share if so my life Ores in omagh under all the means twenty share so important. It will be graphic. A new a Your very very plaka. Yeah so make sure your filo data gene castenada young among social media channels but then an f. h. mama's community at h. mom city the suburbs dominate elegant. Luneng i n. I believe madam next again upset. The gene guy in messiah dong to check in and again the gene bank that so much as a bug besides the f h moms abandon in the gene. Thank you people you guys. Thank you end up again. Lisa michael the see you also may social media ounce jinx on with her instagram. Face will move in the u. channel and lease. That's all work together. Let's all elaborate. Let's own but you implement familia muscle not use your adolescence. Adding lugging at magee moms naby. Gano we buy. Low won't be bean homebase monster social media a free webinars. Add material bengals a freelancing enterpreneurship. See the description box below. Who was the winning on. Punchy hunt similar members f h moms. Don't avoid ninety anymore doing vanessa. F h months. Baseball grew wound balance. The fbi that gone slash groups. Slash f h moss. What on the susana debt is owed gates manga mom. Shoes f h. Mum's radio is powered by value. Productions on test anything and management services humanizing personal actions. Through podcasting civil. We thought have nasa by enrolled as if each mobs masterpiece courses for general virtual suspects company social media management commerce content writing photo and video editing on lengthy teaching and customer service. Would johnny miller short courses city. Thank you for soft skills ortega. He was john de marigny. Thiam computer rental and group ground but our must mcginn convenient at madeira. An enu success for more devious join filipina homebase moms facebook group. It's time to start your free lancing injuring you with us. E you she mom's radio stations the stats h. Mama mama. She will dad. He lied stats video. Mom she added in.

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Richard Cahan (Ep. 13, 2020)

In Black America

28:58 min | 1 year ago

Richard Cahan (Ep. 13, 2020)

"Oh from the University of Texas at Austin K. UT radio this is in black. America. The pictures that he took for the nineteen forties tonight and they were really documenting. The movement they were documenting the dream and it ended with The assassination of Martin Luther King and obviously the movement continued but times changed his cameras. Change team he moved down to a thirty. Five millimeter camera took mostly color film. So it's a whole nother look at you know. There's there's a beauty to this. You know classic black and white photography. He really knew what he was doing. And I think the pictures after that not that they don't have value but they don't have the drama. That's why we really took the whole collection and we said what's the most important message she had and that message. I think was kind of re the beauty of resistance the resilience that African Americans had during these decades Richard Que Han. I'll throw revolution in black and white. Photographs of the civil rights era by Ernest withers published by city files. Press with a with a self made man. He was one of the most prominent African American photographers donor civil rights years during the course of his career he took thousands of photographs that documented the movement from the Emmett till trial in nineteen fifty five to the assassination of Dr Martin Luther King Junior in one thousand nine hundred sixty eight was started out. As the wages reports family turned into Victorio history of life in the south and the epic events that helped shape this nation with it. Was There for the Little Rock school battle. He was there for mega every terminal and the Memphis sanitation workers strike. He was also there to photograph weddings. High School proms and night live on Beale Street. I'm John Hanson Junior and welcome to another edition of Black America on this week program Revolution in black and white photographs of the civil rights era by Ernest C with us with author. Richard K hance in Black America. That is very true. People really you know. Talk A lot in Memphis about the kind of the honor of being photographed. Whether it was by whether he was in a sense you know came to their house. Name Photograph and I think that that you know he. He had a glut of self confidence in himself he. He always positioned himself right directly in front of his subjects. He certainly had the skill because he had done this for so many years. So many decades and He made the same. You know he you know. An event wasn't even an event unless whether was there so since people waited for him There's so many smiles in this book there so pleased that he that they're being photographed such a different time today when you know when you when so many people are weary about the. They don't WanNa be when began his photographic career in his hometown of Memphis Tennessee. He couldn't go to the public libraries or be admitted to his best hospitals. Had it not been for sister who gave him his first camera while he was in high school? We can only imagine what life would have been like for him with is the genes behind many of the iconic photos. We see today documenting. The civil rights era beside his work with the moment he recorded on film. The everyday world in the south of African Americans prime funerals people at work and play entry life. He created a stunning record. Was like to live in Memphis and the mid south. He also was a noted baseball photographer. Documenting Negro League Baseball. He also was a noted music photographer taking thousands of photographs of early jazz blues. Rock and roll in armed performance with his work is archives in the Library of Congress and slated for the permanent collection of the Sony Institution's National Museum of African American history and culture. Recently in Black America spoken which it can regarding this amazing photo journalists. They call my colleague. Michael Williams and I they call us photo. Historians which is a term. We never even heard before we we were called it. we were both journalists and I was what's called a picture editor so I worked with photographers photographs and And I learned that there's a lot of impact that words and pictures can can have when they worked together and I think we've all learned that now you know. Try to put up a a facebook post without a picture. You'll realize how important pictures are and in your previous life you program officer at a foundation. I was for a short time but most of my life has been as a photo journalist. I WORKED FOR THE CHICAGO SUN-TIMES FOR SIXTEEN YEARS and I've worked for newspapers. Most of my life I wait journalist down I journalists down on my IRA and no. That's right so what sparked that initial interest in photojournalism. Well I actually It's it's a long story but to make it very short. I became interested in the idea of words and pictures working together. I think I was a kid. I went to the library and they got Jackie Kennedy Book about a tour of the White House and I realized that through pictures. You can go anywhere in the world and with words you can explain it all so It was exciting to me then and it still is now six decades later. He's your Alma. Mater scooted beat Michigan. The other day it is. It is and it's school that has almost beaten several other top basketball teams. I'll believe it when I see it. How did you happen to come across with us? I was down in Memphis and a friend of mine said I had to go see the withers. Museum is a little museum. At the end of Beale Street. That's run by Rosalind. The daughter of Ernest withers and She keeps this little photo museum open until about midnight. So that people who did listen to music and drink on Beale street can kind of end up there? And she says people come into the museum Drunk and they oftentimes leave sober. Couldn't they see these photographs? Which is which are really great gifts to America of Photographs of the Civil Rights Movement and photographs of entertainers and photographs of the end of Negro League baseball that Ernest withers took starting in the nineteen forties and he continued almost up until his death in two thousand and seven. How did earn his become interested in photography? Well he was actually it was during World War Two and he was on the He was stationed in the Pacific islands and he found that if he took pictures of GI's Standing in front of Bushes and holding their guns that they loved it and they sent it back home and he realized that there was really a a business of taking pictures and as soon as he got out of The army in nineteen forty six. He started his own business. And and really. This is a book of somebody who is really hungry. Hungry to make a living He had eight children and he took on just about any assignment. You know he was. That's really one of the things that makes them unusual. He was the school photographer. He photograph PROMS. He was at funerals. He'd wake up every Sunday morning and go to churches and photograph churches and And as he kept doing a decade after decade he realized that he was really just as much of a historian as he was a photographer hours interested in reading that his entree prior to taking pictures of the servicemen. When he went to the Pacific he was at a photographic construction of a runway or airport is yeah right. That was his job. He was a photographer And he was documenting stuff. Things for the The Army Corps of photographers that were out there Pacific. Now one would think that if you're a photographer you got all this elaborate equipment. But he didn't add that he didn't he Number one I don't think he could afford it and You know he had a camera little very simple cameras. I mean they're not simple by today's standards. Right we're There were box cameras that I remember. I remember that took little two and a quarter negative and he always talked about how he never could afford long lenses. You know telescopic lenses so his feats were his long Lens. If he needed to get a close up he walked up to people. Tell us about this story when when Joe Louis. His wife came to his school and he was the other students damaging to go up to take a pitcher. Yeah he was in. He was in Elementary School and he just kinda camera from his the suitor. His sister's boyfriend right. We've given them a camera and This is Lewis was at the school and he had the camera and again he didn't have a telephoto. Lens so we had no choice but to just walk down the aisle go right up to the front and take your picture and I think everybody was shocked that he had that nerve and he loved the kind of the good feeling that it came from. You know from being able the camera gave them kind of An entree to any where he wanted to go in the world. Richard now he photographs over sixty years worth of work right. How did you all decide on what to include in this book? Is this part one. I don't think so I'll tell you. Why because the the pictures that he took from the nineteen forties tonight and they were really documenting. The movement they were documenting the dream and it ended with You know the assassination of Martin Luther King and obviously the movement continued but times changed his cameras change team. He moved down to a thirty five millimeter camera and took mostly color film. So it's a whole nother look at There's there's a beauty to this. You know classic black and white photography. He really knew what he was doing. And and I think pictures after that not that they don't have value but they don't have the drama that's why we really took the whole collection and we said what's the most important message he had and that message. I think was kind of the beauty of resistance the resilience that African Americans had You know during these decades. How do they decide on the title of the different chapters of photographs? Oh well there are. Nine chapters and each chapter is a a song title of Usually a popular rhythm and Blues Song or Blue Song and and we just had made list of civil rights songs and they all seem to fit. You know the the sections of the book talk to us about when Ernest really got his comedy become journalists when East I worked for the Chicago defendant. Yes so so he he star. Ernest started really just a commercial photographer right. He was There's a great story that used to go on Sunday Mornings to Negro League Baseball Game Martin Stadium and he would take picture instead of taking pictures of the the action. He would take pictures of the crowd because everybody got dressed up. This was like Easter. Every Sunday morning was like Easter and And everyone looked really good and he rush home to his studio. He processed the film he'd make Prince his wife would dry the prince in. They're oven and then. He rushed back to the ballpark before the game ended. So that he could sell those prints and that you know I think the key to him to ernest was that he was willing to take on just about any assignment. So in the early nineteen fifties When when Negro newspapers were really a an essential part of of the community he was getting jobs with you. Know the tristate defender. The Chicago defender other newspapers where he was realizing that they didn't have a white papers usually relied on the Associated Press to to send pictures and he essentially became his own press service so he would take pictures of basketball game or a graduation and then he would you know there were. There were several dozen Negro newspapers in those days and he was sent him to to all the newspapers and that helps to make a living. When did he first photograph? Dr Martin Luther King Junior. It was in nineteen fifty nineteen fifty six. It was a one year after Rosa. Parks refused to sit down and and there was a yearlong boycott and the morning that they boycott in the morning that this case was settled in the boycott ended. He was on one of the first books One of the first buses in Montgomery and He was he literally waited for. Martin Luther King and Ralph Abernathy to take a seat about an hour or two later as they wrote the buses upfront for the first time. How did he develop a kinship with with the moving dot King? You know I think it was just. He was always there with was often called the official photographer. Martin Luther King's official photographer and that really wasn't true. They liked each other. But you know Kington have the money to really pay somebody so it was really that that whenever king was in Memphis whenever king was anywhere near Memphis Withers was always there. He wasn't the official photographer. But they were very close. Andrew Young who? I know you've had an eye on your many times. Talks a lot of an introduction about how important with work was in spreading the spreading. The word I guess. It's the visual. You know what it all looked like and and He was very appreciated. I know that's right if you're just joining us on Jelio Hanson Junior and you're listening to N. black America from KT radio. Whereas speaking with Richard. Kayhan I'll throw a revolution in black and white photographs or the civil rights era by Ernest withers rigid and looking at the photographs. Of Mr Withers work. There seemed to be a a distinction that I guess. He developed over time to make his photographs of knows that when the weather's photographs was taking. You knew it was with this photograph. That is very true people Really you know. Talk A lot in Memphis about the kind of the honor of being photographed by whether it was by. Whether he was in a sense you know came to their house when they were just photographed And I think that that you know he. He had a lot of self confidence in himself. He always positioned himself right directly in front of his subjects. He certainly had the skill because he had done this for so many years. So many decades and He made the scene. You know he Event wasn't even an event. Unless withers was there you know since people waited for him There's so many smiles in this book there so pleased that he's being photographed such a different time than today when you know when you to when so many people are wary about. They don't want to be what about you right. Obviously this was a dangerous job when he was out photographing the movement. How did he develop that tenaciousness? Well he likes to say that he learned a lot of it In World War. Two has an older now but he was very aware of it he was roughed up a couple of times once at the end of Medgar. Evers Funeral The police just you know got cameras through them in almost like a cage him and a lot of other people. He was spit at a lot. He said and you know he was He wasn't a large man but he he. He played football in high school. He was a quarterback. So you know like well quarterbacks he kind of knew where to move and he knew how to protect himself and You know he He wasn't too worried he but it took an awful lot of courage You know he really developed moves. Oftentimes a white writer journalist would come down to the south and Ernest withers would be not only his chauffeur but really his eyes and ears to get him through the South and and the same hell through with black for a black journalist who came down from jet or Ebony and you didn't know the ways of the South this is where he grew up and he really understood a lot of the kind of the mores of how to conduct yourself. I'm glad you mentioned that cause I kind of skipped over but you brought this full circle back to me when he first started taking photographs for the black press. I'm trying to remember the newspaper. He went to work for and he was under. That attitude of publishes Tula Rich for a while right right well it was. You're thinking of Alex Alex Alex Thinking Wilson L. Alex Wilson. Right was people will know Alex Wilson because he was the very tall journalist who was punched and kicked around right at the Little Rock and that was it was the night of that that was on. Tv that Eisenhower said he was going to send paratroopers out there and Wilson was a big man in a really smart man. And you could tell how you know. He was just ganged up on the. They kicked us. You know they. They kicked him. They pushed his head off into the street. And and Wilson who was a former marine refused exactly and And and and withers was supposed to be there that day and he just by assignment he was in He was a Memphis and not in little rock and he did a lot of photography of the of the Little Rock. Nine and Wilson was really the man he was with them when King and Abernathy got on the bus in nineteen fifty. Six and We're there's really respected him. There's a lot about journalism. Exactly THEIR OTHER PICTORIAL BOOKS OUT. Jet Was make this particular book special. You know I think we use the photographs to set up history I. I'm not a southerner so a lot of this was new to me and and and frankly it was really eye-opening. I in and we we use photographs to tell the story of the integration of say the Memphis Public Library The integration of the Memphis pools Using first graders in nineteen sixty one to integrate memphis public schools. Which was pretty thirteen. First graders were used to to to break the color barrier. You know you talk about the bravery of Jackie Robinson. Well you can imagine the bravery of these first grader. Hand their parents right and and so it's not so much a portfolio I e when you open the book you see about two hundred and fifty photographs and you think it's just going to be one of those big beautiful portfolios but there's every picture let us on an adventure and we really tracked down each picture and set it in context now on the front and back inside. There's a picture of Andrew Young and then the first photograph of the book itself this Andrea Wide Links photographs. Well in withers died in two thousand seven and in two thousand and eleven. It was revealed that was paid. Fbi Informant Okay and In some ways to some people like Dick Gregory it made withers traitor But other people who knew withers and who understood the times It's it's it's much more nuanced you know. He's a it's nineteen fifty nine. He's a photographer in Memphis in the FBI comes to them says insures. How NUMBER ONE? How do you say no to the FBI? Right number two. It wasn't clear yet that time a hoover's hatred of King and the movement was not clear nineteen fifty nine so it wasn't like you were just switching sides and Withers there's wrote in two thousand and one that the FBI had been following him for years didn't say format and he said he really tried to never get himself into you. Know controversial secretive moments and Andrew. Young WHO's a big defender of whether's said basically. We had no secrets to hide. There was nothing to really demolish took photographs and told people where events were. It was okay with him and you also ride dad. Whether said that he made. He made a habit of not being with decisions. Were being smoking about during his time with with the movement exactly he you know withers was a smart guy and he knew what he was doing. Now that doesn't take away. The feelings that other people have had over the years. That withers you know. Betray them because they simply didn't know what his dual role was and I understand that on a personal level. But you know there's there's you know. I don't think his involvement affects these pictures in the least and whether he should have been or shouldn't have been. I don't think we can really judge him because he's not around to really stand up and defend himself and You know it's not as clear as as it might seem at first all right. You also talk about whether he had nine children. H Eight children and one was involved in an accident out in California. And Isaac Hayes did a benefit concert to bring back to Memphis exactly and Isaak's paid for Dorothy to head out to California and bring them back on a on a special point you know you. I think people who in Memphis understand this but obviously outside of Memphis. They have no idea how withers was absolutely beloved beloved by the entertainment community beloved by the Sports Community. And and this is the guy that was if you go onto legacy dot com and your comments after. That's how the book actually starts to me. We'll write about somebody after they die. Oh my gosh. He was just one and he was just always there. He was the guy that was you know photographing in the schools and everyone you know really did love him and care about them so it you know there's no question. It was a shock win. These revelations came out but I think that if he was alive he'd have a good. We would better understand what happened. You know remember withers really also. Didn't say not to photo assignments. He was a photographer. This is what he did in the school. Board wants to picture of the graduation. He says yes you know Jet Magazine wants them to you. Know fly down or not fly down but to drive down the Sumner Mississippi to photograph the Emmett till trial. Nineteen fifty five. He said yes. He ended up paying. I I think he got paid. Something like seventy five dollars for a week of work but he just with somebody that wasn't going to say no because I think he loved it. He absolutely everybody he photographed. He knew he knew there. You're their uncle. Their aunt their family members a really important part of this community in Memphis. You also write about. On the day that his dad died he went to the that day and didn't have doesn't assignment later on that evening. He did he never he never shirked assignment His kids who all love him and know him but they also know that their fathers I I won't say I love but loyalty was work. This is how family survived now. We skipped apart that in the early in his career he gets a little law enforcement right right and it was fired. Yes he was he was wanting to Memphis is first African American Patrol officers and those days. If you were black you could not just a white person. You could not carry a gun and supposedly. He was fired because he was bootlegging liquor. It's it's hard to know D. Says it was a a Jealous Lieutenant? I have no idea but you know he he. I'll say this. I think that was a hustler. Good sense of the word he he was trying to get ahead in life and And that was just. That's that's that's one of the reasons why we have these photographs. The man who created a couple of million photographs because he never said no to an assignment. Also you have pitches of Elvis Presley in that. Yeah Yeah you know. Elvis Presley was certainly an important part of the Memphis music scene and I think Elvis Presley made it pretty clear that he learned a lot of his moves a lot of his music. From the African American the Beale street crowd and he hung around oftentimes. There's a picture of him at the goodwill review which was a radio station W. DA's annual fundraising events in nineteen fifty six. Elvis was a big man in the white and African American community. And there's a picture of him just milling around with some young teenage you know performance and you can see them swooning for him. It's funny Elvis. Used to shop at a place called Landscape in Memphis and the owner of told Ernest that he should only photograph Elvis Presley that that he would become a millionaire today if he had only photographed Elvis Presley and I think he's probably right but Who knew then. And I'm I'm glad that nurse where there's you know photographed other things because we probably have enough pictures of Elvis Presley when you went back to Memphis talk about ernest. What was the reaction? Oh it was great. We had a book launch last month and people were thrilled to finally see these pictures all put together in one place. I mentioned ernest daughter. Roz right she she still runs this museum. And you can see many of these pictures of the museum but for all the people that can't come down to the withers collection museum. They have this chance to see you. Know a whole life devoted to photography and and And it's really and and a lot of these pictures. Roz and many other people have never seen before because we got a chance to go back to the negatives and prints right from the negative so things that that earn himself probably a never seen before because he'd never made principal out of it. You know he was. He was out getting another job when you had an opportunity to to to review some of the photos. Did you have a moment? Oh boy I think I had. I had a lot of them. I thought the picture of that I mentioned of young Martin Luther King in nineteen fifty six with Ralph. Abernathy is really an important photo. There's another great photo of Moses Right Emmett till Great uncle and he's standing up in court and I've read about this before. What a courageous move a black man had never really accused pointed ed white people for a capital crime and he stood up and he points to the two men that were accused of the crime. And withers wasn't supposed to take a picture. But he was in. He was in the front row holding his camera and He took a picture of of Right standing up. Oh my gosh the this moment bravery and I'm so happy it was captured by by somebody. And of course it was Ernest Withers. Kinda like the forest gump. No matter what happened he was always there. And that's that's incredible when looking at some of the photographs. I was with cheekily enamored with the one that had Dr King. Arriving in Memphis. Yeah just before. Well it was. It was the day before the assassination April third nineteen sitting right. Yeah it's It's kind of a simple photo. But you know like everything else when you look back at some photos You you you see filled with pathos and interestingly and this is kind of a secret of the book but that Night Martin. Luther King gave the famous mountaintop speech. Exactly and we looked for pictures and Ernest was not there. Richard Kayhan also revolution in black and white photographs of the civil rights era by Ernest withers published by city files. Press if we have questions comments or suggestions ask future in black America programs. Email us at in Black America and K. U. T. Dot. Org also. Let us know what radio station you heard is over? Remember to like us on facebook and follow us on twitter. The views and opinions expressed on this program and not necessarily those station or of the University of Texas at Austin. You could hear previous programs online at K. U. T. Dot. Org On show we have the opportunity again for technical producer David Avarice. I'm John L. Hanson. Junior thank you for joining us today. Please join us again next week. Cd copies of this program are available and may be purchased by writing in Black America CDs K. UT radio three hundred West Dean. Keaton Boulevard Austin Texas seven eight seven one two. That's PIN BLACK AMERICA CDs K. Ut Radio Three hundred West Dean. Keaton Boulevard Austin Texas seven eight seven one to this has been a production of K. U. T. radio.

Ernest withers Memphis Martin Luther King Black America America Ernest CHICAGO Dr Martin Luther Ralph Abernathy Emmett University of Texas Memphis Withers Baseball facebook Mr Withers Andrew Young basketball John L. Hanson
Andy Norman

The Astral Hustle with Cory Allen

1:11:34 hr | 2 months ago

Andy Norman

"Hey what's going on my friends. Welcome to the. I am corey on you or you and here. We are working to this current moment in time. Hope that you're doing good and it's your gone right and all is going well in your life in this very moment I have a great great guests. Great show for you today. my guest is ending norman who is a public philosopher her and a researcher on mental immunity and surrounds the evolutionary origins of human reasoning. And how and why we make decisions are influenced by ideologies so really a relevant moment in time to be talking about sex things we get into a lot of really fascinating stuff. And i know you're gonna dig this one if there's something interfering with your happiness you'd have to know what it is just if you don't feel like you're tuned in and turned on for life like you once were or you feel like you can't quite find the track to get you to your goals. You may be suffering from depression from anxiety or many other types of mental challenges. 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It's essential to have the right people in place to ensure your company operates smoothly and has the potential to expand lincoln. Jobs helps you find the best candidates for free given that there are so many types of skills out there. Lincoln jobs makes it so easy to narrow in and find the candidate. The is perfect for exactly what you need concern by posting your job for free to lincoln's network of over seven hundred and forty million professionals fill out targeted screening questions to get your role in front of the most qualified candidates than use simple tools to filter in prioritize. The top candidates. You'd like to interview lincoln. Jobs will help you hire the right person for your role in your first job. Post is free. Just visit lincoln dot com slash astral again. That's lincoln dot com slash astral to post your first job for free terms and conditions apply or my friends. The time is now. Let's go inoculate our consciousnesses against nonsense. Let's talk to the great and wise and enormous. The idea that you put forth and mental immunity is something i have been thinking about for. I've been trying to think about in in understand how it's going to be solved for the better part of two decades. Maybe alright kit kindred spirits here. Then yeah yeah. It really came from having a a kind of enlightening experience of just recognizing my own subjectivity. So whenever i noticed that had the realization that my whole reality was subjective. I started thinking. Oh this is uncommon. And this helene lot of problems come from yeah and so over the last of course. The intensity of what that means has just magnified exponentially especially in the last two or three years so absolutely. I'm so glad that you approach topic and are offering to the world. I'm real excited to dig into with you. Painful thank you. So let let. Let's do it so just to set the table so the idea for people There listening is basically what you cover. Are the truth. Irrational ideas are spreading for example cove. Deniers anti vaccine. There's flatter thurs political extremists and so forth that seems to be becoming a more consistent theme and our culture. How do you believe that we arrived at that place or at a place. Where object objective reality has become so freely debatable To kind of the question on a lot of minds these days right so some people call this situation sort of our post truth predicament. And i think that the theoretical framework that i develop in mental immunity offers perhaps the best explanation of how we got to this point. That's currently going. But i'll let me share it with you and you can. You and your listeners can decide for yourselves. So the the core idea is that just as our bodies have immune systems that protect us from infectious microbes in exactly the same way. Our minds have immune systems that protect us either more or less well from infectious ideas. Now this might sound like science fiction idea that our minds might actually be infected with with parasites might sound like cookie science fiction. But i'm here to tell you that this is hard now. Hard scientific fact we now know that mind parasites do in fact exist and we know that mind to in fact have immune systems that help to keep them at bay but they have to function properly to do that. So th there's actually a a science being born here in our in our lifetimes that i call cognitive immunology and it's basically the science of mental immunity to bad ideas now. Has this always been this way. People always had this weird Kind of manipulative persuasive relationship with reality or has it gotten more intense in brought into clarity because of technology yet. So when i reveal to you the the nature of mind parasites you'll see how far back in history this phenomenon goes. It turns out that ordinary everyday garden variety. Bad ideas are mind parasites so a bad idea is something that requires a host. It can create copies of itself. Some bad ideas who actually induce their hosts to spread them to other hosts by say posting means or sharing malicious gossip and bad ideas are harmful to their hosts either directly or indirectly almost by definition. That's kind of what we mean. By bad we bad we can also mean false or poorly evidenced. But that's another story so the point here is that mind parasites have is an is a new name for something we've been talking about for thousands of years and bad ideas have infected minds and caused people to do horrendous things just time and again through history thank you can go back and reinterpret history through the lens of what i call mental immunity and you start to see all these fascinating patterns about why cultures devolve into partisan bickering and eventually disintegrate and of course all of the political tensions. We've been witnessing in our own. Times are assigned our mental immune systems here. In first century. America are not functioning at even close to capacity. There always seems to be this weird sort of meta overlay till like you know the some strange synchronicity happening. If you look at the big picture enough and it's funny is that at the peak of our Seemingly seeming peak of our mental immunity. Problem comes a massive actual virus that you prayed aiding upon the global community's immune systems well and it sort of like is that is that the universe winking at us like. Hey another mirror to look into here. It is yeah. I mean i guess i would say that. Modern information technologies are big part of the story here right so almost anybody now can create a website that looks slick and professional and and as though it has real evidence or real authority behind it and so you've got all these sort of purveyors of disinformation misinformation conspiracy theories who can now reach thousands of people and and this has never been true in history before but we've actually got handed billions of people a chance to shape other people's minds and the filters needed to keep people from using say radio to demagogic effect actually had to be built up over time. In fact hitler was able to exploit radio to mobilize to to push nazism. An and basically hack the minds of of one thousand nine hundred eighty s germans and it took a while before they've actually managed to develop say regulations and and mental habits to prevent people from using radio in that way now Rush limbaugh has been using demagogic techniques radio here in america for forty years thirty forty years and he's also had an enormous impact on the current situation. So we've got this strange new reality here where information technology combined with kind of irresponsible mental habits is wreaking havoc on our collective prospects and we got one of two gotta do one of two things. Either we get rid of the internet or we develop strong mental immunity too dangerous and morally disorienting ideas. And i don't think the internet's going away anytime soon so that leaves just developing our mental immunity. Yeah even setting aside the my psychology fascism and looking at even just independence's. You mentioned earlier like people just ran does on the internet saying whatever is cropping their heads and heading. I tend to think i think sometimes it's like particular in terms of social media. I think of it. Like a ancient rome. I picture you know everyone kind of walking and then one person stops and gets on you on a stone and start saying in a little crowd gathers around it sort of like you know the amount of followers that someone's has okay. That person is just doing that to a million people or two to nine people on instagram. Saying it's like who is this person right there there. I mean they're not nobody but what. That's all different philosophical conversation. But you know is this a credentialed you know verified well intentioned individual in no there's no safeguard for that and so just have not only one but like Hundreds of thousands or millions of people all doing the same thing to each other in so if you picture that that kind of scene painted of like someone in ancient rome popping up on a stone and talking and so then they get down in another person for the audience house on his own and they start issuing their bullshit and everyone's just listening to each other sort of talk about talk nonsense and gets insane and standing on a stone or a soapbox lets you maybe reach a few dozen maybe a few hundred people but the scale now is just completely different. I think so one of the things. That's one of the really important developments is that we're actually starting to understand how the mind weeds out bad information better. So where where we used to just had to rely on sort of gut level sense of what good critical thinking is. We now actually have hard science saying hey mental immune systems work like this and by the way they fail in the following ways and and here are six or seven different kinds of mental immune failure and three or four different kinds of mental immune disorder and by the way these ideas that most of us accept without questioning they. They're actually mental. Immune disrupters actually compromising our mental immune health because we haven't been taught to think critically or ask the right questions about them so it turns out there literally dozens of things we can do to strengthen our minds and actually become wiser versions of ourselves. But but it's going to require that we develop the science of cognitive immunology and then apply it not just kind of at the at the public policy level but also in our day to day lives. Yeah this be kind of a difficult question but in only this because of the scope of time. But how does how is science. Quantifying mental parasites remind parasites in the the corn research right. So let me let me talk a little bit about the history of science does. Don't i'll tell you the short version of the story and then supplementing that with a personal story will help to make this real for people. We'll see we'll see goes so back in the nineteen fifties. The korean war ended in an armistice and nine american. Pow's were released and they decided to actually stay in north korea and this just completely flabbergasted the american intelligence community and the And the political class. Because why would anybody want to live an authoritarian north korean government nation. When they could live here. Wonderful free america. So the assumption was that they'd been brainwashed and so the military got really interested in figuring out that got really worried that the north koreans and maybe the russians had advanced brainwashing techniques. And so the question on many minds and a whole bunch of research funding into this. How do you help. Minds develop resistance to persuasion. So a young psychologist named william mcguire started studying resistance to persuasion and he found something fascinating he he did a bunch of experiments and he learned that if you expose mind to a weakened form of an argument say a we can form of an argument for capitalism that mind will develop resistance to stronger arguments for capitalism. So you can actually hack a mind by treating it as if it has has has if it has an immune system. What you do. Is you trigger it to generate. Antibodies and by the way anti antibodies mental antibodies. Cognitive antibodies are are doubts and questions qualms so so you can actually hack into a a mind and teach it to have doubts of to doubt good information and not to question bad information and and so this was a guy. Mcguire called this inoculation theory because he saw the analogy with with bodily inoculation and since then people have been actually using his findings to propagandists and advertisers and religious fundamentalists have actually been using his techniques to kinda close and manipulate minds. but now we got a new generation of inoculation theorists just in the last twenty years or so who've been asking can we actually inoculate minds against bad information. And how do we do that like how to. How do we had a mind against conspiracy thinking how do we inoculated mind against climate change. Denial and they're actually finding that you can up by applying these very same principles of cognitive immunology you. We can actually strengthen our mental immune systems against manipulation And now this may be sort of a social science question but say a beautiful infallible system is developed to you know sort out good ideas from bad ideas and inoculate people's minds or gives them cognitive immunology immunity rather How can you deploy that to a society that has a fraction which is if they are anti vaccine. They're certainly not going to want to go under a process of you mind inoculation. They'll say no. Thanks buddy right exactly. Yeah so so. What would be the path to getting those people know interested in and to ingratiate them into that level. Type of clarity yet boy. That that's the million dollar question so it turns out that the you know once somebody has been sucked into a cult. It's it's extremely hard to d program them from a cult and once somebody has bought into a conspiracy theory. They're extremely reluctant to let go of that. Conspiracy theory so so debunking is hard and in fact my philosophical heroes throughout history have gotten themselves into a lot of trouble by trying to do bad ideas right. Some of them had to drink hemlock others where you know excommunicated or how into exile always are so rehabilitating a mind that has become massively infected with bad ideas is hard work and one reason. It's hard work. Is that when you try to dislodge their ideas. People get defensive so especially when people come to identify with their beliefs then they push back against persuasion so this is called identity protective cognition. And there's some fantastic research by a guy named dan cahan out of yale. The basically says if you hit your identity to set of religious beliefs you'll become reluctant to even give criticisms of your religion the time of day if you hit your identity to a political party. You'll become stubbornly unwilling to consider criticisms of your party and this goes for almost a and if you become a member of a of a conspiracy theory and you start to feel like. Hey you know. Man i made on this big secret. You know this is part of who i am. Then you become unwilling to consider the evidence that you're conspiracy theory israeli bunk. So that's hard but it can be done and there's some fascinating examples of let. Let me tell you one a beautiful success story. There's a black blues. Musician named darrell davis. I had the pleasure of meeting and bestowing an award on just in the last year so darryl was playing blues in a blues club and white guy came up and bought him a beer and they were talking and it turns out. This guy was like the imperial wizard of the kkk. And he just couldn't believe that you know a a black man could be so fundamentally decent ended up buying dental dave severe later davis invited the sky over for repairs at his place and they had They actually daryl used the following strategy and successfully de converted this imperial grand wizard of the kkk. He basically just listened to the guy and said tell me more. Help me help me understand that I assume you think you know this right. Not just believe it. Tell me tell me how you know it. So that i can know it too right so yes the guy to actually explain his racist ideology simply by asking clarifying questions. He didn't try to refute this this kkk guys worldview. He just tried to get him to explain it so that he could hear himself so he could hear how absurd his own beliefs were and it turns out it worked the guy resigned. He left the kkk. He gave daryl his klan robes. And since then darryl has actually managed to convert dozens if not hundreds of other kkk members. So you can reach the people who've been deeply immersed in even a hateful ideology in a good listener. Yeah i love that doe david story because it really encapsulates. I think a lot of what's going on under the hood any kind of solves for it in the way that he has done that. And how you can do with other people because if you look at religion of course because you're dealing with a double ineffable he you know in that way it's like it's doubly tricky and it has the most Sort of family inherited pressure in in cultural tendrils. All that stuff but you know in my own reflection about why people get so not even just responsible why they've react so harshly to even bring up questions about something like religion is because it becomes as you mentioned like such a foundational level of their their patterns of identity which they self identify so they they walk around going. I am a you know. Xyz i am this. I hey i'm at the mall and i'm a christian at the mall right now. I'm being i'm christian and at the mall than such a core part of their their way of thinking about themselves that it actually weeds itself into their of course unexamined. But they're the concept of their self said there and then it affects how they think right exactly and it makes it hard to think in a fair-minded way wanted to tell your listeners. That the corey. And i were talking before we we started poorly hit record here and he was telling me about how he avoids identifying himself as say a buddhist or anything else because you know he. He's self aware enough to know that once you attach in an ist organism to your name you start to get to protect those ideas with a kind of jealousy that can actually close your mind. So i think there's some real wisdom going on in the way corey approaches this. He's he's reluctant to Adopt a label for himself or to identify what's ideology and and i think it it. That helps him remain a lifelong learner. Oh thank you. And i appreciate that. Yeah and i'd love to actually get into the the tricky elements of that too in just a minute because there's some things you have to watch for in modeling narcissism for sure so In the post modernist saul laid that out in sort of the positive negative as for so But yes the this reaction to the deeply held self identifications. I found the people. They think that they react in that way in a lot of them violently because they actually feel if you give them conflicting information or force conflicting information about a foundational beliefs that they use to self identify because so intertwined in the capitalist self of their identity. It feels like that you are physically attacking under attack. Yes exactly kicks on and in fact you can put a brain under a scanner and feed them threatening information and you can see their middle start to freakout and we know this that when you're a migdal kicks in it actually turns off your higher order thinking and reasoning skills. You're your four brain. The party your brain. That's actually is capable of judicious careful. Rational thinking gets gets in fact it's called the macdill hijacking because the amid basically says hey. Hey mr four brain sorry buddy. You're out of here. I'm cutting you off. Because i'm too freaked out right now. So you actually have to learn to recognize signs that you yourself or getting defensive that you yourself are feeling embattled the that because when that happens you start to your own capacity to think clearly and well starts to get compromised and all of this can be cashed out in in the language of immunology and fascinating ways. I mentioned. I might tell a story to help illustrate this concept of mental immune systems earlier. Maybe this is a good time to insert so. This is actually a story. That goes back to Several days before. I was born so my parents i lived in washington. Dc when martin. Luther king scheduled his march for jobs and freedom and my parents were like totally psyched right. They're huge martin. Luther king fans and so the day approach. It was at the end of august. Nineteen sixty three and my mom is nine months pregnant with me so my dad gets to go to the i go to the lincoln monument and here the i have a dream. Speech is completely moved by it and my mom has to stay home and it's my fault but still working on my mom's been very very forgiving. She's wonderful but but she and my dad brought me up to practically revere martin luther king and i still just you know have enormous respect for the guy but sometime in the early ninety s i actually came across some information that martin luther king was a serial philanderer. And i just. I just refuse to believe it like no way. Could such a pair on a virtue could no way this could be true. So i resisted accepting the information and soon i noticed what happened in my mind. My mind started generating all of these excuses to eliminate this threatening information. J hoover Generated these rumors just to to destroy king's reputation Oh you know it. It's the source is probably isn't reliable. Anyway i was reminded of a famous experiment in history of science. Where a russian zoologist ellie mentioned cough. He takes us starfish and he stabs it. With a tangerine thorne thorne. From tangerine tree and stick some durham microscope. And he watches. As white blood cells rushed to the scene of the injury and try to like engulf and consume the tip of the citrus. thorne and i suddenly realized. That's what my that's what. These doubts in. These questions are doing in their mind. They're responding just like antibodies. They're actually trying to engulf and neutralize this information that martin luther king was actually a flawed human being. I was so deeply invested in me idea that he was that he was morally pure that i rejected good information and refused to let it enter. My world view now eventually came around to see that. That was not the rational. That was not the right thing to do it but i also learned that process that my own mind can behave like a has has has something like an immune system it has it mobilizes. Antibodies to fight off unwelcome information. And if i don't learn to modulate and manage my own mind properly it's not gonna serve me well man. That's such a cool description in way to an analog for that process has really really cool love that love that idea and i also love the fact that you're sharing a point where you had a realization that you know you're held belief was incorrect. And then how you move forward in accepting that and because it's something that so few people are able or willing to do and i'm curious to kind of further expand on that point. How having that change in belief or whether say acknowledging the objective truth of the situation do looking back at martin. Luther king's work. How did it affect your reverence for him after you integrated that idea he. Yeah so I now view. Martin luther king as a flawed human being like all of us who was extraordinary on certain dimensions and deeply flawed on others. And i'm able to actually countenance both of those things in my mind at the same time. I was originally reluctant to actually acknowledged the complexity of the situation. I i kind of wanted the this. You know my reverence for him to be pure and unadulterated a certain sense. So i kind of believed what i wanted to believe. I'm and it turns out that when you if you indulge in wishful believing willful belief. You actually start to compromise your minds. Immune system you you actually subvert the minds at. It's very. it's very so there. There's a have a fun story here involving my son when he was like six. This is my son reese we. He was like six. I was parenting him. And i'd say hey. No you can't do this because of that. And you have to do this other thing for this other reason and he got the message that you know. I had a standing expectation that he would do the reasonable thing right and sometimes this expectation frustrated him and prevented him from doing you know eating a lot candy or whatever and so he developed this fun little way of making fun of me fun of me. He when i try to parent him. He'd like scrunch up his face in stern expression any wagons finger at me and he'd say be reasonable and he'd hold hold that expression for like one or two seconds he'd bust out in a big smile and say no and he and he knew he was being ridiculous. He knew that you can't just defy good reasons with impunity. Because of reality will come back and bite you in the ass. He understood this at age six. But there are millions of people in this world who indulge in in willful believing who basically just say no to better reasons or requests for evidence. And they don't understand that. There's something that you might buy yourself some short-term emotional comfort from that but eventually reality is gonna come back and buy nassar gonna pay a price in the long run or if you're not gonna pay the price somebody else will right. If i just defy the evidence of covid and choose not to wear a mask i could end up taking your life. That's irresponsible balut. It's it's simply not responsible to believe that covert is a hoax and even if you have some doubts about it if there's if there's any reasonable chance that covid israel you're taking other people's lives in your hands when you mingle without a mask assuming you're not vaccinated yet right that kind of thing and that's just that's a straightforward case of believing in other words the space of believing isn't governed purely we talk a lot about the right to believe we have a right to our opinion. We almost never talk about our our responsibilities with regard to believe but when we believe irresponsibly a lot of times people that pay the price Yeah absolutely in as you said earlier. There's always a price tag for allowing what ultimately comes down to some degree to a lack of meaning you know or someone will allow their better nature to be served by something for us well and that lack of meeting. I think you're you're putting your finger on something really profound quick. 'cause a lotta i think e every each and every human being has a profound need to matter to find meaning in their lives and when their day-to-day when their day jobs and their ordinary lives are leaving them in despair they'll reach for beliefs that will help them feel like they matter exactly because that's how powerful that needs so if we don't build a world where everybody gets to really matter then people going to keep clinging to to dysfunctional beliefs and and harming themselves and other people as a result so there's a moral. This is the topic of my next book by the way which is how to matter mattering so that so that we're not so that we can address this problem at a root cause level. Yeah and it's you know as you mentioned how often other times people other people suffer from people who make these bad decisions or kind of ingratiated into these bad decisions rather What's interesting is that. I also feel like yet. But the person's whole life now is the the receipt in a result of their choice of other people around them are suffering but they're very consciousness is suffering to such a deep degree that that is there sort of. That's that's the ultimate way. That the person who's perpetrating said. Negative behavior is kind of paying for is a bit of a fatalist ways to say it but This how they are suffering from their behavior is is the texture of their consciousness is in perpetuity exist in the state of terror because it is misaligned with objectively which creates nothing but continuous friction. In where friction. There's fire in so whenever you see one of those videos online of maskless person you know losing their shit inside of a a walmart or something and they're literally like screaming like the just they. They've really they've they've gone out of the social contract of of good conduct in there just being kind of turned animalistic. What's crazy is most people look at that and they judge it and they say or they have pity or something like that. But i'm in. I see those things i think dear. God think about like the way that that person is acting. That is how they're seeing reality so the terms that they're entered into as far as their their erotic behaviors violence screaming the the red face like that's in their subjective minded. Their view of the world is that that is the circumstance that they're in right so level of disconnect with reality that everyone else sees is the space between where that person is on the in the kind of on the edge in where everyone else is centered around kind of normalcy point and that to feel that the world has gone mad whenever that individual person is the one who is that far away from which a deep level of suffering that it is just. It's really tragic absolutely. And so i think in fact there was a news story just just a week or two ago about a woman in a grocery store. Another woman asked her to put on a mask and the first woman freaked out and started yelling and actually came over and spat in the face of the woman who'd astra put on a mask up yet classy rights and you know there was a lawsuit and the the woman who who who refused to wear a mask and spit at the other woman was actually convicted and the judge actually center for mental health a mental health evaluation. Now it could be that this woman suffering from depression or that. She was suffering from anxiety. Some kind of anxiety disorder or any number of things but but this is also possible. It's also possible that this woman sort of bought into the idea that covert is a hoax and that the mask. Mandates are just an attempt to control us because lots of tens of millions of americans haven't actually bought into such ideas and those ideas turned her into something that is basically functionally equivalent to somebody who's deeply mentally ill. Which basically means it. I think that ideas can actually reshape our minds into things that are just wholly foreign to other minds and that ideas can actually give us a perception of reality that's profoundly out of touch with actual objective reality and when that happens you all. This friction comes up between you and other people between you and the world you're trying to navigate. And so this is why. It's so important to insist on evidence. Based believing because evidence is our touchstone evidences. The way we connect with the world so that we're not just inflicting delusion upon ourselves Absolutely i i saw that in. My view of the insurrection was the same thing it was like this is. It's a bizarre folding of. That's where it's like. It's like entitlement that gets passed down in so ingratiated into the dna of a subset of people that it manifest into a public health. Emergency he has an it was bizarre. Wasn't it. I love your use of the word title. Entitlement there corey. Because i think you're picking up on a profound aspect of our current cultural moment. We live in a time when almost everybody in america accepts the idea that we're entitled to her opinion. This idea has a long really interesting history. But it's basically created this prevailing sense of entitlement. I can do whatever. I damn pl- well pleased with my mind. And if you actually try to change my mind year just basically. The equivalent thought policemen. And you're you're basically authoritarian. So get out of my face. This attitude is so prevalent people on the left accepted people on the right accepted. And it's and the sense of entitlement has resulted in a kind of decadence. Where we simply indulge in feel-good believing even though it subverts our own long term best interests so i in the book i actually characterize the idea that everyone is entitled to their opinion as a mental immune disruptor because it actually excuses irresponsible believing and lets us off and it basically gives us a handy excuse for not modifying or updating our beliefs when newer better evidence comes along Absolutely and it's the this is all coalescing to with a weird this the kind of the illusion of american exceptionalism. It's just a bit of a hangover from that in combination with the stretching of the inter. Subjective agreement thanks to the the deep fried internet. Wasn't it a deep fried. I just i. I was sort of making a term. But there's a there's a type of meam this might be a little obscure for for most people but there's a type of me as if what we were just talking about this whole last hour hasn't been by called deep fried memes which like i like absurdity and autism and just like things were reality breaks when it creates laughter because of course if you zoom out far enough in your mind you can see that everything is equally as absurd and sincerely beautiful simultaneously right and one. Can i have wisdom without the same bounce level of levity in my opinion anyway so i love the absurd stuff so basically a deep fried means are like memes were similar will take a me in lower the resolution and like crank Saturation contrast and then like maybe cutting paste a few random bits on it and then redo it again in kind of chain mail. Whatever the text is on there and then they get passed around and transformed for they get really like weird in an abstract okay because they're funny but they also are like these dada eight fright. These deep fried sound like they're like twice baked as yes. I love that. They're like they'll get you know the the manicured nature of the internet. How kind of false it all is. It's a veneer for people's actress. Cells and a lot of the content is ornamentation to support. One's own sense of themselves the idea that there are these singularity blips of just absurdity in there as if to disrupt the flow of the illusion that everyone has to. That's okay well. And if and if people are are spreading these deep fried memes and other people are picking them up and modifying them further and sending him out again right You have all of the elements for cultural evolution there so by that. I mean that you know if if i can create lots of copies of something send him out there and and a few of the managed to lodge in somebody else's mind and get them to reproduce them and maybe modify them again. The original mean can keep morphing into more and more infectious forms right. Yeah and and back when i first started thinking about mental immunity. The internet was still pretty young. And we didn't have this that the concept of a meme was still pretty young back there too and people use toward me with scare quotes the like. Yeah okay sometimes. Yeah there it sort of makes sense. There means but young people today. They've grown up in a world where they've just watched memes spread and morph and replicate and and and specie eight right over the internet. Right you can see it happen almost in real time. And that means that the analogy between epidemics and info. Dem ix is super tight super strong and the world health organization has basically just said that we have an info dynamic on her handed information epidemic. Right now about about covid. And huge percentage of the world just is too frightened or is under the influence of bad information about covid and they're reluctant to get vaccinated and so we're never going to reach herd. Immunity is a species unless we've also a begin to crack the problem of how to develop immunity to bad information. Absolutely absolutely. And i'm i'm having so much fun here would you that. I'm getting off track. But i wanted to go back to want to get to the Really important that you let these twelve steps for cognitive immune health. I love to just go go down some of those roads and just explore does with you. Cool has totally still. Yeah that's kind of the very end of the book. I say alright. All of these immunology stories are are fun and cool but How do i do. I have to do differently to develop deepen strong immunity to bed ideas. And and that's the that's the point you're afraid to right. It's taken out of the abstract into action. Yeah okay. So let's go with the first one that you mentioned is just playing with an idea. How can how can doing that help. One screen an idea for being good or bad. Yeah so So i went into philosophy to kind of figure out what wisdom is how we can develop more of it and if you actually study. Some of history's deepest best thinkers. What you find. Is that they test ideas. And they test ideas kind of a playful way so If you're in the habit of taking ideas at face value and just believing them you're sorry you're not going to become a great philosopher for becoming a deep thinker or somebody who can contribute in fundamental ways to to moral and intellectual progress but if you just develop the habit of saying hang on a second this this idea of yours can you tell me more about that and you know. Tell me why you think it's true and and help me understand the reasons for because you know it. Because i can. I can see the reasons against and are you really sure that your reasons for more than outweigh my reasons. Against in other words Good thinkers have conversations like this not just with other people but they have this these kinds of conversations with themselves in their own minds so plato. What said that. The thinking is the minds dialogue with itself. So if you actually engage in good conversation where you're testing your friends ideas and you're letting your friends test your ideas. You actually learn the fundamentals of what i call the reason giving game and it's basically an idea testing game you present your reasons present. My counter reasons were both ask questions and we'll come see what happens. That's the i mean there. There's a lot to be said about that. The fine structure of that game but we all know. How do we know what i'm talking about. Yeah outline turns out if you do that a lot. You're your mind's resistance to bad ideas get stronger. You become more immune to to misinformation propaganda and false advertising kind of beautiful and also the growth that comes from that will redefine. How one has their value of ego position within their own mind because one of the real problems is our addiction to feeling. Correct all the time because we're trying to salted deep level. We're trying to convince ourselves we have some sense of control over bolivian and the chaos of reality but when you re align that with Actually the thing that makes me a valuable intellectual thinking cindy being is not just being right it is being able to expand upon an idea to understand it and then to take what is right within the idea and make it a part of my way of thinking not just the act of being right itself. Yes and in the book. I talk about we. We all have this kind of mental model of what what happens in learning so and when you learn you i don't know shop at a classroom and you listen you take notes and information enters your head and when that that information is installed. That's learning that. I called at the bucket model of learning. And that's kind of the way most of us think about learning most of the time. In fact much of the educational establishment not country is sort of wedded to the bucket model of learning. That's why lecture lectures our big part of university education but it turns out that that neglects to other parts of learning that critical. First of all you have to involve yourself in. What i call some tractive learning. It's not enough to just keep adding information to the stockpile mind. You have to actually actively weeding out the bad stuff as well as adding good stuff and you have to be trying to find order and pattern and and coherence among the beliefs that you have so organizing your thoughts actually takes work it takes effort and if you simply put a lot of information but don't weed out the bad stuff and organize and what remains a. You're you're short changing yourself because there's so much more wisdom to be had out there if you engage in all three kinds of learning And isn't it fascinating that some of the biggest media personalities alive today have not done that you know. I suppose it attracts. It attracts the whole spectrum. That way i suppose in the controversy creates audience capture So something speaking of roads that would take a long time ago down. Audience capture is certainly one of them but Speaking of you're getting into philosophy something. I'd just be remiss if i didn't ask you. You said that you wanted to understand wisdom just the definition in the idea of what it is deeply. Where are you at with that right now. Well i wish i had more of it myself. I feel like. I've learned a few a few things about wisdom me. So here's what here's the way. A lot of philosophy goes down. Somebody asks a question like what is wisdom. Anyway what are we really mean. By wisdom and and people will hazard candidate definitions. Well maybe do is to miss this now. Maybe wisdom is that. And what often happens when you do philosophy as you take a definition and you try it on size and you start to realize. Yeah you know what. I can think of exceptions. Here's a case of wisdom that doesn't fall under your definition or here's a case of foolishness that that that they should that should be handled better and so a lot of times philosophers actually look. We ended up learning a lot about what wasn't wisdom or reason or truth or justice. We learn about what these things aren't so philosophers do all these thought experiments and we compile a whole bunch of data points about what these terribly important concepts aren't and that doesn't leave completely in the dark because it means that we have at least a somewhat better sense of what they are because the space of possible definitions of justice or wisdom is smaller if you can if you can rule out some of them That makes sense. Okay sure so. I from minute think that i've actually found wisdom and all it's glory in fact i'd say in the book you know anybody who thinks that they've found wisdom announced glorious deluding themselves. Because that's not the way wisdom works But what you can do. It was actually identified particular. Instances of foolishness make sure you don't buy into those and gradually we near mind you train your mind to automatically slough off pad ideas and two or at and to give more attention anti-mine to the ideas that are either good or are in the neighborhood of being so we talked a little bit of before. Start rolling your about Buddhism and just laughing because it happens come up and most part gas but there's this concept called bear awareness on that one but now tell me about it so it's basically a self inquiry method that clears away Kind of self reference and Just the general confusion delusion around reality in it really breaks it down to the pure unfiltered a moment as much as possible so that would basically be like if you had a cut in your hand. You look at it and you would go. Kay well. there is a cut in the hand in the body is feeling pain right now. So that definitely happening in. So i'm feeling panic right now so that's a manifestation of the mind because of the cut so there's there's physical pain there's also panic right now and then you can say is their anger. This won't do this to me. Is their anger is an emotional formation. You mental formation rising informing. So what's actually here in this moment right now this bodily pain there's mental formations happening. There's an emotional thing so forth. And i creating a story around what happened or do i actually know app. Basically this type of reductive process working from the inside out to get a clear view of the true nature of reality. Do you have any similar type of method for a quick. Let's let's use your terminologies quickly. Throwing an idea under the microscope. To to get a sense of vincent good or bad right wow yeah. I'm fascinated by this process that you describe to sort of paying really close attention to what's going on in your own mind too so that you can become more self aware right and a lot of times. Our minds are huge generators of the things that make us miserable anxieties owner beers are and sometimes. Those fears aren't real or or the anxieties. Worry about things that there's no point worrying about a whole lot of misery comes from that as far as the language of the applying the entire. You asked me if i could apply the language of the concept of which concept no. I was just curious if you had a similar type of inquiry method about bad ideas for society. Say you out in the environment. Could you know in someone says something to a bar in. How can you quickly go because this bullshit or is this actually so here. You're you're getting right to the to the nub number the issue in some ways so i've been using the term good ideas bad ideas steph. I knew exactly what i meant by that so it turns out. There's a whole lot of confusion about these concepts of good good idea and bad idea and one of the first questions that pops into a lot of minds as well. Who are you to say which ideas are good. Who are you to say which ideas are bad and the answer. That question is we're to say all of us and we all have a role to play in figuring out which ideas are good in which ideas are bad now. The way the question who are you to save functions it. It's it slyly. Implies you have no standing to judge whether an idea is good or bad it basically says. Oh well i guess god god knows which ideas are good or which had he is bad. But it's not for us to say but the problem with that is that we ended up just postponing doing the hard work of figuring out which ideas are good which ideas are bad. and nobody. And i don't actually think anybody's gonna do that. Work for us so the question actually just functions as a way to slough off hard questions and avoid responsibility for the hard questions you know. Is this idea really worth accepting or is it. Not and you know. Sometimes it's hard to ask that question because we don't like uncertainty uncertainty makes us feel less secure and so our need for security often makes us cling to ideas just because they're it's easier to cling to a known quantity in the way of an idea than to face the uncertainty that might come with questioning it So second thing to say about so. You should never allowed the question. Who's to say to divert you from asking a good question about good or bad or right or wrong at our or from engaging in the kind of inquiry and and it can be enormous fun to actually engage in value inquiry. Philosophers learned to love it. The other thing to say about good ideas and the concept of bad idea. It doesn't have to mean idea. I happened to disapprove of instead. It can mean idea with objectively problematic properties. So there are lots ideas have lots of kinds of properties. Ideas can be true or false. And they're pretty much universal agreement. That truth is a good quality falsehood as a bad quality. Fine so we can. All pretty much agree on that being well. Evidenced is generally understood to be a good property and being poorly evidenced is an ought to be understood to be a weakness or a defect in an idea. An idea can be useful or can be counterproductive. Usefulness is good property. Counterproductiveness is a bad property. And you can go right down. The line is the idea inspiring or is it. Dispiriting inspiring is a good quality dispiriting bad quality the fact that so what philosophers have been doing for thousands of years is basically saying. Let's get past this self-indulgent idea that should just mean. Whatever i approve of and bad should mean whatever i disapprove of. Let's actually look together at the properties. Did ideas really have and figure out whether those idea whether those properties are serving as well and let's let go at the beliefs that serving as well so these are just perfectly ordinary uncontroversial observations but they add up to an argument for why we need to dialogue together and test ideas. And you know what. I'm in any dialogue to determine the the goodness or badness of an idea that matters to you. You're observations count. They have a place to have a seat at the time. You have a seat at the table and the things that you think are are relevant. Have a place deserve a hearing But it's not just your the things that you consider relevant that deserve hearing. It's the things that other people are relevant. They belong there too. And when you actually listen to other people's concerns and other people's reasons for for believing differently from you you end up learning ton No one of us can see enough of reality to appreciate its complexity and it's only by triangulating with other people who see different aspects of reality that we can really start to do the the hard work of weeding out the ideas that are frustrating. Human aspirations absolutely i. That's something that i. I've held really near and dear the idea for a long time just is some point. I started looking at our nervous systems. Like they're just instruments in a laboratory in. We're all getting different readings off of you. Know the the info in the world outside of our skin right and let's share that data and come up with a good healthy huge knowledge base of what's happening and it's like the five blind man and the elephant right. Yes exactly right exactly for those of you. Who don't know that one. That's imagined five blind men who are each trying to figure out what's what creature is standing in front of them. One of them is actually can feel the trunk and he says oh this it's a snake another one One of the elephants legs and says no. This animal is like a. It's like a tree and the going down the line each of them just seeing a fraction of the whole elephant and unless they talk to each other and listen to each other and learn from each other. They're not gonna develop a rich picture of of the creature. they're are trying to understand Yeah i love the to punctuate that in in real life. Because i i speaking about it in. The abstract is tidy right but when you put that into practice with someone who has vehemently opposing view in deep to defend the daryl davis example really does ring true because one of the things that we didn't point to earlier. The reason that works is because he patiently listened to in spoke with a person was a conflicting view. And allow the other person to kind of talk out. Helms say their own exam. The real the mo the only works. It only works if you do it. Earnestly without judgment or or a withholding of compassion because that defuses the whole animalistic. I'm being attacked. I have to fight thing if there's no vibe of aggression it's it is really just inpatients in peace and in good faith. That's like that's how the whole thing actually will work that that that actually beautifully put one one of my fellow cognitive immunologists. A guy named john cook He developed a He he tries to apply the principles of cognitive immunology to the problem value. Convinced your cranky uncle to to You know stop worrying that you know the the government's coming for his guns or something or whatever and and one of the things he's found is is that Well i'll tell attribute this to you know people like darrell davison. My friendly mcintyre who who also studies this thing the first thing you need to do to suspend judgment and listen without judgment. You need to ask clarifying questions rather than questions that might be might feel critical or attacking and you need to just be really patient and sincere and and about understanding. The other point of i call this that. Just tell me more method dialogue by by. Just tell me more. Give people a chance to open up and explain their views if they have a chance to explain them. They'll start to see whether understanding is is lacking and and you. You may not convince cranky at over thanksgiving dinner but if you just listened to him to him rant for a while and ask gentle clarifying questions a month later you know his worldview might start to shift. That's right. Yeah and i think you know the other thing of course to that those changes especially the ones that are so deep. They typically aren't spontaneous. You know their gradual is takes in with any zinn coins is so fine is because with any type of awakening or expansion of consciousness. It has to come from within the individual like that. They have to the yes links. The last two chains together. Because it's the linking of the two disparate pieces of information that create the the knowledge and therefore the the light of mine right. There is a wonderful story that this just played out in the last month so a republican pollster gathered together nineteen vaccine hesitant americans so the these are conservatives who were suspicious of the covid vaccination effort and this and this guy frank luntz he basically just did a focus group and he let people talk for an hour about why they were reluctant to get the covid vaccine. In other words he basically listened for like an hour amazing tool and then and then he basically asked a friend who happened to be a former director of the center for disease control. Actually just kind of step in and one by one address people's concerns and because they listen for an hour they were able to hear what the cdc director had to say and at the end of the session. Luntz asked the nineteen participants. Are you more reluctant. Are you more willing to get the vaccine now than you were before. And every single one of them said yes every single one and it's because they listened without judgment for like a full hour that they were actually the participants were able to feel to feel in a visceral way. These guys are trying to change my beliefs. There actually just trying to understand my point of view and give me information. So i can so i can make smart decisions. And if if you think that the government's coming to to brainwash you about a covert vaccine you're gonna put your mental immune system will go into overdrive and and just fight off every plea to vaccinated but if you have one of these these listening conversations you demonstrate through. You're listening that you want them to make the decision if you trust them to make the smart decision themselves once they have the information lou here. Their concerns addressed the concerns. Give them the information and say we know you can make the right decision it. It's on it's up to you. You know the decision is yours right. The government's not gonna force you take to get vaccinated. We just want you to have the best information so you can get vaccinated if you manage to convey that vibe. In the whole conversation the walls come down and people start to learn and develop more enlightened and better informed world us absolutely. We all could use more and more that that's true and it. Yeah i mean some of my examples here involved cookie conspiracy theorists or anti vaccine but every single one of us can improve our mental immune performance we can all get better at spotting bad ideas better at removing as well So we're all on the on the journey right. We're all on the path. We all make mistakes. Every single one of us me included has might parasites that have taking up residence in our heads And let's just let's collaborate right fighting off mind. Parasites is a team sport. You helped me identify mind. I'll help you identify yours. And then we'll get wiser together. That's right. It's like monkeys picking fleas off on her love that metaphor. Thank you so much. For coming on the podcast. Amphorae the bug. I think it's a really important book in crucial at this moment in time So yes thank you for doing all that and being you and making your contribution. I appreciate corey of. You've been delightful conversation. I hope we'll get a chance to do this again. Likewise thank you.

Luther king lincoln E. l Astral gunar corey mental immune disorder america william mcguire dan cahan darrell davis darryl daryl doe david rome lincoln monument martin J hoover thorne thorne helene
Monette Iturralde-Hamlin - The Hustle Behind TeamAsia

Hustleshare

58:00 min | 6 months ago

Monette Iturralde-Hamlin - The Hustle Behind TeamAsia

"The hustle share podcast is brought to you by b twenty one platform. Which helps you start. Your journey with crypto currencies. Visit be twenty-one dot. is slash hustle here and get two dollars upon signing up also by idea space a nonprofit supporting innovation and techno for nor ship as a path to nation building ideas based runs an annual startup. Competition for more information. Make sure to sign up for their newsletter at ideas based foundation dot org slash connect also powered by pod metrics the only analytics platform. You'll ever need for your podcast. Sign up now at pod. Metrics dot co for free and use the code hustle share welcome to hustle share the podcast that features the daily grind of unique hustler's around the world to show not our differences. But that are hustles are very much life. Now here's your host. Ron stir based on to the latest episode of the share podcasts. We are going to be with someone who i've been. Actually i didn't know she was the team. Kim that bertha founder demeter because be banned team asia and again For someone to build this type of company just it's award. Winning company must talk a lot of hustle and sacrifice what we only see now. Is the end results end product but you will be deep behind team asia. You'll be having their president flaccid brexit and pander when that route day pam this more net do hustle share third. Thank you okay again. Prior to the recording. You both admitted that the both nervous. But it's small chica cahan about your hustles all about you Again welcome to share. I'm big fan of your work. Team asia China have to be listening to this. So shout at t. But again before i get started talking on my way through the whole episode miss lynette. What is your hustle my hustle. It's simple it's just a great develop and sustain visibility for brands for our clients to effective meaningful and compelling integrated marketing experiences another. We make them visible there. You go so if you're in. Bc bar this is how you become a teenager understand just yet been exposed events you know rated marketing the whole the whole gamut because my first startup was called party. File this almost ten years ago and anybody who's ever been to the events industry are are hustled. Their way through that i have nothing but matt respect for because it is not the actually one of the if not the most wrestle industry to be in right there at the top and for you to create a company like that. It's just remarkable so again mad props but before i get carried away miss monette. I need to put on your seatbelt. Because we're gonna have to ride the hustle shared time machine. Okay so we're back from how started to understand. Fourteen age became team asia. We all know. How do you start your hustle. Because you know. I'm i'm reading. Your background in your. You're not someone who just like you know. Made chambas your sukhum lodhi before. But i want understand. What was your very first inflammation that you remember thorns hustling that's related to what you built in team asia. Well i hope the heart back to nine thousand nine hundred do were even born then the ready around here. I am an eighty baby. So don't worry okay well He may show us actually born in hong kong. I was yes. I was asked at the time. But the asian institute of management to run the asian management awards so this list awards program that me recognize the best managed companies across six different countries so that's hongkong indonesia. Malaysia singapore thiland in the philippines. And so this is a joint project at the time between world executives die disorder. I was working as associate publisher and asian institute of management but in nineteen ninety two new owner game in the web to where i just and fired us fired mired. Let go like goodbye because they wanted to put in their own extended their own people. Yeah so it's out of a job. I had do. Babies had recently separated from my first husband and in in that same week roster. My mom gets run over by a car. So i listened responsible for this and i didn't know what to do but then what that we're we're up you're innocent episode. Already shocked my gosh. Yes so i am. Who i was doing the Under wedge the past two years also all wanted to do it with me rather than the new owners. These said monette. Can you do it. And i said sure but you know i have no mommy. I have to start from scratch but my partner On the other side i am. Who is michael allen hamlin both the almanac you just do it. You know what the do run a program for two years. So but i have no money and he said just do what you do. Best and the money will follow. Saw me sat up the mesa in hong kong. And that's it. We just granted a program you were able to generate. The funds needed in terms of sponsorships. Imagine moron stir. At that time. I would have to travel to each of this country's at least sleeps in the year i would have to mount a huge event on the awards event where the head of the country whether president or prime minister would be giving the award to the best managed companies. It was the event of that country. Seneca kohana pera. But god is so good dellagha when god goes us a door. He opens a window. So let's see that's how he may start did what would understand because again a lot of the founders that they've had here again either had Again who were trained by their parents or heavy influences that were were born into or were just you know Forged by fire and to have that's crazy event within that short span of time and still had to deliver That's crazy and it takes a massive amount of grit to get over that hump because as you're trying to overcome the professional stuff you have on. Have you have your own crosses to bear at that point. Because it's been minute your this like it's easy way to screw this. I'm done about but entrepreneur is for some reason there's a common. You know again chromosome. A all. Last august pulses through that for you. Why did you keep pushing through when it was easier to just bail out. I'm done. I would just sates love because every morning i would look at the faces of my two daughters. Bi and kara bill was what barely four. Kara was one year old. I would look at them and say i am responsible for these two beautiful children. I have to make a go of the there is nothing else. That's there in the horizon. And i will make sure this happens. I i that that that struck my heart rate there because i was also Race by a single mom and it wasn't easy for her. You know so. I had to imam in my grandma who raised me and she probably thought the same You know it wasn't easy She would come from a wealthy family. There's no inherent is not whatever. Aol while she would tell me that. i have to pull through because whatever i did not have i have to provide son and put me in a position to be more successful from you know the the pedestal. She put me in three to put me in that position. So mad props. I loved that story. I always have a Again a soft spot for hustling moms. Because i was raised by so thanks. Okay now i wanted to san so you put it out in hong kong. The money is the most important. Because regardless of your plans you need resources to put that into fruition. I'm not gonna ask the numbers. I'm gonna ask how you get the funding to get that done In an event industry like this especially in startups. It's very similar. You know you have to always look for funding to develop our product jairo deem for you. How whoa how did you get that done. Okay so remember. I said it had no job. So i had zero savings because everything was taken away by not older part that founded the by history. John slow. I had an angel investor at that time the the head of world executives digest who also lost his job said He decided to invest in various different startups on. He gave me a small amount and said okay. You have to live with this industry. A tiny amount then You know i worked in a garage. Just like steve jobs. Okay and I had the phone. Add my computer. Boggle boggle's computers and I would say not sponsorship letters and hustled call up people and then the the money that we had invested in the first travel that we had to to the different countries and that travel was purely for sending so we had already sent sponsorship letters all over and we would not on all the different sponsors lead essentially for us to get some money so that we could run the program but bear in mind that i had already run it for two years under world. Executive die descent era but miss stein. It's under team asia and nobody knows suty mesa is people knew who monette hamlin was more already but kind of was a ham yet right yes so i was no who you were reputation. There's equity on your hustle prior or night. So that's it and i remember the very first sponsorship that you're able to get It does in malaysia and it was We rented this space. It took their office was somewhere that quivalent of dvd's aurea dotted and kale. Yes i ran. Up went there and We were allowed to come into the It's an old office. And i was with michael allen hamilton. Who was my partner by the way we in the business. Then we entered the steep staircase going up when we got up the staircase. Those another guy who said this week here and there was no one has a big hall. We wait that. We waited for an hour and mike saying this is wasting our time. There's so much more i mean. We have very little time to sell. We only have to this in. Malaysia said yet sweet some morlet sweet some more and just when he stood up and he said he was gonna leave already. The door opens allowed into the room. And we enter discovering this room. It's huge and right in the center. Was this huge mahogany table with the owner of the company behind the why the owner had i remembered. The had this sculpture horse. I love horses or horses Sculpture so it was there s looking at the and then he said so. Why are you here. So i began starting already selling and mike what the and selling and he kept on for about fifteen minutes and then the guy wasn't saying anything holds up his hand and says stop and then he said oh. No so our hearts dan. You said ungeared. I'm going to sponsor you for the next three years clear. Commitment walk almost fell off our chairs and they said have even gone to the end of the presentation. What you said. I just want the to a few and to make sure that i knew who was going to deliver a now. I believe that you will. You will deliver. And that's a missions. We had enough money because he sponsored the three in advance. We had enough money to run the program. That's amazing now and this is common among entrepreneurs there. There's i can. I can name a few instances in my. But i'm not going to share it Today just we ran out of time. But they're always make it or rick type of meetings that you know the the degree of how important that is in most entrepreneurs again that that's nerve wracking right plus time pressure that you're only have a couple of days. What for some reason. We always also pulled through but in your case. What do you think that you say during that meeting or at least showed not even say it with your dynamic with mike That convinced him. I think he just saw the passion that we had that we wanted to make this work. And the you could see that you were honest but we you know he could see. i think. That's the the teakwood see that we could be dependent on. He knew that in our heart was in it. Okay and that's common among founders right but one thing that i also I've seen especially again in founders. Whatever company when you're young sometimes the passion will pull through but if there's no experienced backup that passion 'cause the bashan is always you can feel it right away it's intangible but there's always that extra on that you say that you say that again again reputation and it can be experienced taught in whatnot coming from team asia having that prior hustle. What was the killer on that. You had aside from. Just a passionate british. There is something that that put out there. That got you to back well Do things no. I think it's the two founders Mike an but we both have their strengths My strength was in organizing. I was organizing re detailed events. And i've already had the two years track record to show that we were had been very successful in organizing it. Plus i had the ten year History being an associate publisher and circulation of the magazine which meant really going around the growing andrea selling so that experience that we had that i had plus of course he. I'm sure he already studied at our background. Was he knew i was so my he knew i had graduated from the. I ended a master's degree with distinction on my side. The man he was a writer he was very keanu. Interim self his writing skills he was during the list he was vice president of e. I m so. He was talking to people who had experience who had the strength to make the was needed to put together the awards program plus Because we both had that management background than we knew what an awards program for management is. And i think this is one of the things that has helped him all along because we were doing this. Asian management awards. We were exposed to all the best managed companies in asia and we could see all their best practices because we were there during their valid us. Juries meeting all of the documents that they sent why they should win so we understood what were the things in the crisis that they all had to go through. So i think it does the bank of knowledge the fact that we were private to this information that these roster at the time will happen internet lapel it. Does all hard books rile or you to be able to access this guide. Valuable information treasure trove. Right there is a treasure trove. and data's already recent. How why you know how we went on after our contract with am ended dotted all right. Now let's take our first break comeback. Let's now talk about how you built team. Asia further but the sock about the more after the break and rebecca breakers still with miss monette. Hamlin again sneeze. I was just blown away. I haven't had that type of an an a purse or hustle shared time machine journey in a while shook the hell out of me but amazing journeys and again the doubling down on what you said prior to the rick. That passionate alone is palpable. It's a great indicator but prior experience prior hustles in prior prior success. Or excellence in in the in that field that you're trying to get in always gets the job done right because builds credibility at the end of the day especially if you're asking people for money the big question in their head is why you now you got the money. I understand that you know. You're still view. Great dynamic dual but duos just won't get that done alone. How did you build a team. And what were the next opportunity you had to pursue for major okay so The first year After the first year that we have been asia are injured investor. Want the out. Because before we were able to finalize the the sponsorship toppled nasha. So we said okay. You're all in the you. Were very lucky. I first the first year we were in the black already so we paid interest so that meant coming along the lewa how we continue on with award spill graham and in the chorus of all of this offering medical agenda. You're fairly now both of us in. So this is what you quoted. 'n sean hook him up for life. Yeah so well. That's let's sit there. I think that's the what's most important than a multi-nation that has really been built on love. And the this was something he was my art in everything not just the business but in knife. Naw and so. We started that after three years. Am wanted out. This will befell kinda numbing going at all. We don't need anymore so they cancelled the contract so at the time we were wondering what we would do. But all the companies that had one and had a participate that in all of the events that we had awards program. They back to us and said can you please do our events for us and that's really how we went on so start the far eastern economic review. These said we're We'd like to have a conference in malaysia. Can you handle it so we did so. We handled it in malaysia and We after that we had people like i mean companies like entail s wall. Abm five hundred. On i mean at that time bumpy supper insulin. Right so we were there. Actually when they were starting here in the philippines and the over the years we added people. We added the on expertise so we started doing with events right with asian management awards. It was an advanced program but we would also have to take care. Vr because he would have press conferences. La la so we start the took within our content team our pr team and then created the design and then after that once the internet game digital services we started doing websites on and so on so pretty soon we found out that your radio integrated marketing communications firmer and imc have grown organically but also one thing that i think. I should mention because remember. We were very exposed to management thinking and see mike the say he he. He was a very serious reader. he would read a book week while those new started a management books. Yes we start with our speaker series. What is that of the We decided to start bringing in all of the assam. Well known authors to the philippines to asia to different countries so that people could have access to learning so we had philip copter. Michael fort therapy third drucker. We had robbery sake. Robert de salvia understood for dead had just written his rich that poor that book and you strike the promote it by because he could afford the hotel old dad back then then for sure. No right now. He's such a manda person again. Because we're exposed to all of these speakers that were bringing around. Asia continued on with learning about best practice only were firmly entrenched in that space. And that's also the recent. I believe because we knew that the those big companies came to us sneakers. Ne-new in your stuff got it now. Let's talk about the flip side minute. Because they regard. I'm pretty sure the growth is is is is is impeccable But alongside the growth. There's always pain involved in struggle. Those struggles how what are those early struggles. And you know the growing pains at the always. You talk as as you evolve through the years. Well you're eddie. Know about cancelling contracts right after building. Something that was very strong suddenly taken away from you. So that does the issue and then have gone through several different challenges. No we went through sars. We had opened in asia. Both in all aside from the philippines and hong kong. We had it. In singapore and then stars sars happen more events and so we had to cancel hong kong jury. Here we go again very similar thing. What is bigger scale. Uk-us could not afford the rent anymore. Nobody wanted to have events over by singapore. We good by hong kong with decided to concentrate in the philippines. Another thing that we faced was the global financial crisis and the asian financial crisis. Where sudden lead exchanged rate bubbled. So remember that we were organizing for speakers. Suddenly our contracts in dollars bay meant from people in best one. I could not much much anymore so we had to stop that. We didn't have money to be so we had to constantly rebuild but one of the things that was great. Now see my son nerdy nuruddin in the sense. Now when it's technology his want to. He wants to be the first there. He was addy. So like for instance when the internet start that we were one of the very first companies to have a website in the philippines built by mike while gagnon. The g has always been something that we would embrace We wholeheartedly so so from slow meal when we start there when we would invite it was all are writing letters. Sprinting it putting it into envelopes bringing it to the post office blah blah blah and then we had fax marketing. Yes fox marketing. It became what sms market team and then email marketing and now it's social media marketing. So what is important that we've discovered this. You really have to be able to adapt quickey and to embrace technology in gear up nanyan absolutely and again with every single pivot that you do towards the rising trends. How did you manage team in surrounded yourself with the right team because at the end of the day again. It's facet quality market skills need to be upgraded. Or you know some people would have to be passe and you have surround yourself with the right troops by before answer that i have a question because you said also earlier that it was built on lum in love is buried good core the building a solid culture right. What's the constant culture like in order for you to scale through all these evolutions that you've you've done that regardless of who you putting their the culture remains the same You know it's finished. Astle always been a family. It's always been a theme asia family remember. I said it started in the garage and then it started in my house so when we have people here they would join us for non chess. Columbus re very very important iran stir anthem asia was a love in slava family. So team asians have always been part of the family of our family when we started scores. I thought you know mike. A ni- made him family but my sister was the first greek director that we had so she stayed with us for a long time before and then she went to the us but every single person that we bring in house it fits into that family the culture of the carrying on the transparency the discussions when there is a problem. We all talk about it. We all decide okay. This is what we're going to do well on another thing. Is continuously train people that we don't keep it to ourselves. We want to make sure that anyone who constitute in asia and decides to leave if ever Husb- become a much better person. A much improved burson and This experienced rami intonation. If they leave because nathan at the time they want to experience some things on dumbing belichick curse of a lot of belleek initial they come back and even those who have gone to the right to me and say i missed our family. Even though it's a different experience ibadullah when we were in in asia. Absolutely you on. It's it's really the feeling of caring for people. I believe has a brought team asia to where it is and the other thing is set high standards because everybody sees that they're the leaders are the hardest working probably right so he looked through my whole. So that's great mismatch. I totally agree. Because this is my third startup bell pot death metric asia and there's no better feeling founder knowing that the impact. Somebody's professional life. Not just you know directly with skills but also with the proper mindset proper etiquette little things that will set them up. They're like your children also. Go go ahead and do your thing. I've already equipped with the right skills. And then if they wanna come back there's just nothing like to. I've had several employees through that you know always had to come back now before we take our last week. I i want to understand. Also one thing because you mentioned the destroy also had one major setback when the constant that you've always had was no longer there. Can you talk about what happened there and how you were able to push through. Even if mike wasn't there well young. I we had probably the worst thing that ever happened to me. No s when mike by the died of cancer we learned that you had cancer in october of two thousand twelve Into the stage already at the time when we had hoped and everything to make sure that you know he could he could get well but it is very difficult on seoul. while he was sick and he could encounter the office. I had to continue on with asia. It's very difficult if you were always partner. No because in our partnership he was the face of empty media and i was the behind joke was he would make promises. I will deliver not there to actually do it because he got sick. So i had to continue being the captain of the ship. And at the same time when i get home to take care of him because he was a very fibers. And i didn't want anyone else to hold the or at the chin. So i was nursemaid and i was still also taking care of dementia. My second bolt. Kara was in changli laboratory at the time working. Bia who's neither gene now was in the. Us taking up her masters so she was away and our son Nikola was some still in high school so that is a very difficult period then. Mike dived in march of twenty. Three hundred hundred thin and i just went into depression. And this is where i tell you. Roster it's built on love you know i bay who had such a beautiful future in front of her in the us because she She was a four point. Oh student she had aced the whole thing and she actually received the award for a perfect scorer In her masters in boston she decided to come home. Subiya mom. I'm going to help you and i know late. I found out later or the challenges that she had when she was there at the time that mike was sit She took three there. I mean her schooling there and she came home. She helped me so now. It was a bay tandem whereas before this mike and when at this not and will net than the face at the start so she started the do work at the back and she was able to put together if it does actually a very difficult time because not people who are reporting to my suddenly had to work to report to. This young girl was the daughter of the owner. And it does if you from any of them to accept that but there is such a smart. She's my gosh. She is wonderful leader. Young lead there in the world durant chose able to get everyone together and now she's actually the face of the initial ready because now have other advocacy of i am working on. That's so gone. Monroe both to sorry. We were able to convince her violence that we could deliver the service that it could even be better than before plus because you've studied in the us. She brought back now. The new training amc now before we go to our last brick. That was hard. I've these transitions from jenner multi. Generational businesses always sometimes. I've seen this happened. A lot of companies. They mess up really bad but for you. To seamlessly transition help the take the baton get. Take the drivers Take the wheel right. What were the key things. She did that that allowed you to again and let her take charge. You know because again. You're now trust into this situation you have to deliver. The stakes are high. There's a legacy behind the business and her young person who needs to step up you know. So what did she do to take time. I think the first thing that they Did west media to get hold of man. Calm the leaders and really through explain to them and get them on undecided but showed that this is still time lead that we need to continue with our work and for those who felt that you know. They didn't want to work down. Its us with by offer. Those who thought that they were not comfortable Under bayer rather than under might the reducing stayed and the bail was able to build a swell to get new blood in the asia and it really began. We had their best years after that. You know wow and It was amazing. So it's really that she showed. She had the same kind of fashion. She had the same kind of leadership and hard work and dedication and she's very very organized. Meet a verdict neared. Vision must wear emissions. Should go no. No no no wonder because now she used to the again the product of my camping in miss monette together. So it's like Captain marvel perfect in her own. Right there okay. Now it's come back on the street. Ford and i'll ask you about things that finders can learn the specially from your journey and team asia nor after the break. And we're still with the matriarch the asia who's now passed it on captain. Marvel do bring home. The bacon in the form of vail into showed up to be again too. I love to have around show too but again. You have a podcast. Just listen to the team. Age of jesse What's what it was called. But there's a made of just search it on sunday by now i was just gonna say this breakfast of business or be brand vastly billionaires with him. Okay you eat your breakfast growing business area wherever you are. Okay just kidding. It's the bachelor right stupid. Children what are you doing. Okay so i wanna understand. Let's wait for to the founders that you've you've They're listening to this or anyone. Who's listening to the episode so far early in the episode. You said a lot about being exposed to best manage businesses in asia of these and one of the things that i've learned esab started founder. Where i think. I've i've i've done. I've crossed the chasm from being a founder to being a real ceo. Because there's a big difference by the way is management leader real management skills and real leadership skills beyond passion. This real skills to actually go through finances each our marketing real skills to pay the bills. That's what i always say. But what are the common denominators among the best manage businesses that you've seen that other founders and business people listen to the show and learn from i think Based on what. I'd seen it's really the leaders that the third in the success of a company and the lead there splash on and the vision and the fire in the belly not to let any crisis or challenge. Toppled them over the be able to of to be agile. And the because lot circle is that you'll be able to contain aside from the you know the basics like invention you need to know finance operations h. r. on technology general management. All of these leaks that is a basic but for that you can get You can get your ear manque on your next leaders in line to handle that but as the leader you need to be able to tell them. This is what we need to do. This is where we need to go and this is what we have to develop and be very good that so that people will want to come to us. We we need to be able to see what the need is that we have to fulfil and once we know that need and you're able to fulfill it the best that we can then clients will come to you. People will come to you for you to fulfill the The thing and other things chris. My know that they're important. I i've seen is that the people will actually believe in you and follow through to you because there are some leaders are known half that yes it I think it's very personality driven being able to You know pull people around you drop whatever they're doing and be part of that. Whatever vision that you're you're going to team and didn't letting them be part of that grant scheme that they're trying to do but i want to understand because we can talk about the the factors but do you have any perfect example. That stop of your head of who. These leaders are what they were able to do. Based on what you've already seen before because again It's it is. I'll go a little academic on this. We need some use case acid Of what we can follow to replicate so that we can also implemented in our businesses. Okay locally i would have to follow the yelich so they are less here in the philippines. I believe her berry. The're vision of what they want to achieve no and they have always been true to their values. That's another thing is that they really live there and and we have been doing that for the longest time so that is something that i see. They have grown exponentially and yet I see that They put people in a very important lake. Just last november. There's a covenant for shared prosperity that was led by a yala and other companies s. M for instance here and the the all mode that the covid has crippled economy has affected so many people. They've lost their jobs and what they've done is to have a call for businesses to rally together to make sure that they care if they're people to say what is their commitment not just to their clients not just to their suppliers with mainly to their people to their community. What are you going to do. So i know that they have put in a lot of money for example in terms off helping The company's the people under them at the time win mcgahan arm. There's of the other countries were you just look at all of those companies that have one in the best managed companies and you can see that they have really done a lot and look. I know this is the The leaders the real leaders are humble. Yes that's what i'm surprised. I said there are some that i see. And there's you know they're bragging but comparing them to the ones that have really need the mark. Nikola humbled me la into their offices and they would even stand up in for me coffee or not. Don't know what it is but for some reason and let me know if you think this is wrong but there's a common denominator also for those leaders who i think are under the the the more they have more bravado more than humidity in what they do i think it stems from a sort of insecurity that they couldn't get over with because success. If you're successful you'd be more humble to be honest. You know it's rarely about do. It's not about you know what you've been able to people collective effort of the team that you built and a lot of people put themselves ahead of all these people and they elected be called understand. You know it's me. And somehow i smell a pinch of insecurity sometimes from those types of people that want to be front and center rather than the team collectively case be really hit it right on the head. It's really insecurity right I don't just. I was attending this boot camp over the weekend off. And this is a johnnie. Because i am continuously trying to upskill so i attended very unintended. Three copy genre marketing and the one of the people that he was helping game on screen and He was telling me he was telling us all of those people at any the bootcamp just how he started where he said he's the juice guru of juice at singapore and now it's like multimillionaire. I'm when he was starting off He was pushing guards and he said he was not embarrassed. The other day job Earning money but at the end he was living his passion which was juice to sell juice ina more because his father had gone sir for up and he was so angry that people the doctors. Who saved the goethe chemo. When he felt that that was not the right way that the right way was live and drink and eat healthy so at night. You would do this juicing so for me when you ashamed that he was very humble and then he was saying for one year you was doing it and he was barely making thirty thousand but he had to sell his scar just so that he could continue with the fashion but what helped him was that he got into this boot camp because he wanted to learn and he learned the social media marketing skills that was able to propel him to where he is right now where he's under cover of forbes wow he served in is an all of these Things so there are many success stories. But this people if you look at them. They're very humble then not embarrassed to share but they went through things exactly and a lot of those guys have been suggested here on hustler share. So there's a one hundred nineteen you can listen to. I had had to plug sorry data again. You're one of them too. Humble to come clean at we struggled but every struggle that we overcame made us humbler in the process. And what's the name of the guy. Minute just to digress. A little bit too so that we can put that in the show notes. If you're interested do do learn about this juice guy who's been on ain't on forums and all these magazines will put that in the end that if you buy this time you're listening it will be on the show notes on hustle shared dot com juice guy see. Oh they're selling click that and we got you okay. Now let's move forward I wanna ask. The dynamics also miss manip- of how to work with significant other. Because i've seen this happen well with some people that have had here before. Like you know reese fernandes releasing mike ruiz. I've had. I've i've seen those happen well and i've seen also the opposite day can't really work in the same room right because of a clear stark differences. But if you were to work with significant other because there's there's again there's a weird dynamic that at the end of the day you're going to be right beside each other when you go to bed and sometimes it's inevitable that you're gonna bring those problems from the office at combe to what are the things are your advice for those people working with their significant others so that it doesn't boil over at home or at least it becomes a healthy manageable situation. Where both thrive well number. One is some respect for each other. It's recognizing each other's strengths are and recognizing that it's those banks that was not repelled. The business forward so he in terms of asia's since he was the right there he took care of our content grew. He said nerd so he. If i the technology and all of the digital marketing and i was into experience so i handled all of the events as very detailed. So that's how we work together. I did the admin so work on the strengths colonial bond lease So when it came to work If it's this kind of issue hundred if it's this issue we hand but we were always equal. We always shared the same. Do the same office so we had the problem. We just looked at each other and then being thought and and work it out but we never fought. Wow we would discuss but we never really for. Wow this is one. yeah r- rare situations. I've seen people always rip each other's at all because they just get on the same page in terms of business against the the reason this work for us because before we got married mirror already. Working ha awards were brought. Ready knew each other Way of working. We knew we could depend on each other that he would always have which burst back so we knew that there were swamped trusts. And we were coming. We both came from field relationships and because of that revalued more beloved we had while we really nurtured dip behind the minute work and dead it was nine for the family and the kids so we always made sure that we were together eating so that we were able to build a family and then because we were intrepid norseman. The kids went to sleep button. An-and commit to work while us that this are hustle hustle. We were always full work. Probably the only thing i really regret is let them. We didn't have that much time in terms of enjoying life in the sense that we were spending so much time working so that we could build a better future for our families and for the families of for employees that we didn't take that many vocations god. I wish we had done that more. Yada until sometimes life as a way of distilling. Your time's up. And then we couldn't do it anymore. On what i. I can't blame you because as an entrepreneur if you love what what you're doing it doesn't even feel like weren't you just love it. Just love it repeatedly over and over again so for entrepreneurs as well like for me. This is my therapy. It might be stressful. I decided i'd rather be doing business. Nothing right and even. If i'm at the beach the first thing i look at the fucking like oh my god. What is going to do. What's payroll doing. What i can't detached up. I'm hardwired like that. I'm driving whatever it is. I'm biking it's the business that runs in the brain and that's the that's a blessing indoors. I'd rather be doing this than anything else. Okay now this morning news okay Last two questions in terms of networking. You said you built that were Overtime time what are you tips for entrepreneurs you know because at the end of the day you've always say i don't have money but dude if you have built a great network that's the greatest asset you ever have to start a business now. What are your tips and tricks that you can share or for people who want to build a solid network and built under reputation business slot. You know your network is your net worth so that is so important to build those relationships and the way you build relationships is really being in the trenches with people. Being assad genuine sue can keeping notes of where they are and the keeping tabs than then. Don't just go there when you have to talk to them because you need something but be there You know. Facebook is a great way of connecting with people. And you know that i befriended you earlier. Aw so for example. If i have a conference and i need to get some speakers. I normally would go first to to facebook and defend a person and please know thomas. My billion people respond when it's to request roof Facebook benefited an email. And you have the secretaries and the guards they forever but if you do it this way than You become friends. And because i guess on facebook than people can see your your real life who you are correct. No it'd be in this also. A nice resource also worked for us as well. that's true. i saw lincoln. I'm on instagram. Fees do tiktok if you're trying to do on dicta okay. That's not propecia. All right okay. Alaska last few questions again succession. I've seen this in the best possible way i've seen this as companies are families fumble through this. What's the best thing that you think you've done with the Do do do that. We can share to do. At least matriarch patriarch first generation. Always felt like that For some reason. I jan do through the second janitor. Third gen as you're passing on long of business built on legacy and reputation in order to properly progress to the next piece of your business. You know day has been involved in the business from day. One she was swat for years old. While and i set up the asia and so she saw how life was and i told you before that we would send invitations by slow meal. I would line up the children in the dining room. So we would have stacks of paper and indications and so the lds would fold the papers the next one would put it inside the envelope and stick the production child would do the will be the leaker in other kids have really been part and they were there from everything. They went through the whole thing. We made them work nor so bay has done. Telemarketing calling. people. Up to check dared a content information and also whether they would attend events. She was there in the letter shopping. She was there in the registration she was there a speaker management. She helped be our she eventually. Rose up the ranks until she became marketing manager on right after she finished her college at saint score and then she went to boston. And i remember. I felt so sad this a mom when she announced that she was going to boston and i found that the she and mike have already been discussing this for months. We'll disorder prepared. I was not ready. I was not ready to a doctor goal as a mom. And i remember. It was like for the next two months when she was in boston would sleep on her bed grinding. Because i missed so much that opportunity for her to get out of team asia and learn what it is from outside upskill be more open to new learning open to other able when she was in the us to visit many agencies and see how work was done she brought that back up. When she came back to the philippines i encouraged her be part of different associations. I said that's the only way that you can become plugged into the business community. So she was the one who took the lead at the philippine marketing association. Because i was busy with many of the other associations and also in. I'm up the internet and marketing association. So that is her network not the marketing internet digital and so now she's got so on it's building the network with understanding the business from the beginning and all aspects of it ala not there but the money so some woonsocket asante mata row. Don't do that here matter. She won't get on okay. She always had the bowing card so about her about one card. Always all right but again again. I've seen this to the. I've heard this story. From first generation the immerse their children early on by by accident or by force to prepare them for real life but again. Eventually they're going to have to step up and seamlessly so mad props to you. Nba now last question. Before i let you you you said that there's regret but what would you have done differently. Miss one If you had a chance to go back to journey and you know just to steer a little bit in a at the asia into three different the russia would you have done something differently or stay the same course i think in terms of steering asia i would have stayed the same dada i think but we have done the correct things that were available to us at the time which was not always develop a on learning keeping upscaling being part of technology and continuing to be plugged in to the business and to the developments and using dr. But my main regret. And only i could send his already known set. I would have wanted to spend more time with mike. God dot is the one thing that i cannot bring back but again This is just temporary. Eventually we will all be together. I believe in this. You know this temporary all across whatever religion. You're listening to you. This is all temporary. And we're going to be together attorneys. While i just went spirituality on that one but again miss monette. Thank you very much for on but before i let you invite people over on what the they need to know. More about the asian. What you guys are going to be doing next especially in this pandemic and you know. Once we get those vaccine some our bloodstream. Everything's gonna be busy again. So how do they. How did they do that. Well lisa if you need to have your brand visibility come over to team in. Asia thought our. Www dot dot com. Or you can pour me up a zero nine one. Five to one hundred seven seven or of hamlin team about com. We intend to continue creating developing and sustaining this ability for brands to next level experience as degree. good markets. essel come on over. We have people that the digital front from on ground events. We are not doing everything on on the again. Thank you very much. If you're right so again one last time. Do you have any other invitations to the hustlers at the listening to the podcast on the show. Aside from coming over if you want to help. Eighteen developing and building sustainability for your brand for visibility. Please join us for our morning b. Two bs that's breakfast. Business would be And also we have the red circle. The red circle is our publication online. And you can be arrest of the neatest happenings were they on thick -nology on what the latest from the president's announcement sir culture and all of that so the red circle dot com is something that you should be watching and also if I believe that everyone needs to give back so at night to buy to support my dream my dream shoebox our our advocacy where we get the people to donate a boxes that contain educational corp children right now or having to learn the school. So they're needing things like fab labs and stuff like that so. Check out my dream in a shoe box and find out how you can help support there. You go again. Thanks again. Risk hamlin. But before i let you go policy. Whatever podcast app spotify apple podcasts. Or whatever and again if we did some john glenn in about the juicy. I don't turn it's going to be the show notes on dot com mark. Martin leon okay. Jesus called asia's juice guru juice girl against be industrial nuts. Don't worry you don't have to google if you're driving or doing whatever it's english showing on how sheriff involved in how we grow this community. It's going to be the hostage unconscious facebook so that you can suggest. Just lastly messages that are hostile. Share checkbook dot me slash hustle share powered by check again. Miss monette thank you very much. So you guys episode.

asia mike asian institute of management philippines hong kong malaysia monette Ron stir chica cahan chambas sukhum lodhi thiland michael allen hamlin singapore kara bill suty mesa monette hamlin michael allen hamilton morlet rebecca breakers
New Year, New You, New Impeachment

Skimm This

34:15 min | 6 months ago

New Year, New You, New Impeachment

"Welcome to skim this. It's been more than a week. Since the now infamous attack on the us capital but the ripple effects are still being felt. Congress is in the spotlight as it wrestles with what sort of political punishment president trump could face for his role in encouraging crowds to march on congress. Last week the security failings that led to people breaking down the doors of congress and nearly walking into the doors of the senate are also being looked at how this possibly happen. And how safe is next week's inauguration. Then we've got a quick skim on this week's changes to the cogan vaccine roll out a recap of the hottest and strangest tech coming out of the conference and some advice on how to skim your resume all right. Let's do it breaking news tonight. President trump is now the first american president to be impeached rate to be nice then of us. House of representatives have formerly charged him with inciting insurrection on wednesday. The us house of representatives voted to impeach president. Donald trump again. So how did we get here. Quick recap last week. A group of rioters broke into the us capital in a siege that turned deadly a number of politicians and scholars pointed to the president's rhetoric saying he encouraged the riot and now some lawmakers on capitol hill are trying to hold the president accountable earlier this week house. Democrats filed a single article of impeachment against the president saying he poses a clear and present danger while he remains an office so they charged him with quote incitement of insurrection. If this whole impeachment thing has you saying this feels like wvu. you're right. Think of this like impeachment the sequel. That's because president trump was already impeached by the house. Back in twenty nineteen. Though the charges he was facing then obstruction of congress and abuse of power are different than the ones he faces today as a reminder just because the house impeaches a president doesn't mean that the president has been found guilty. It's up to the senate to convict president and remove them from office and back in the first impeachment. The senate ultimately didn't find the president guilty of those charges so trump got to stay in the oval. Now what's different this time. Unlike the first time ten republican lawmakers joined their democratic colleagues in favor of impeachment. Making this the most bipartisan impeachment. In history still ten house. Republicans out of hundreds isn't a lot and many republicans on capitol hill are saying. This impeachment drama may divide the country further. Also unlike the first time. Timing is everything. President trump has less than a week left in office. So it's unlikely. The senate will vote to remove him from the white house before and the senate trial will probably begin once. The president is out of office. That post inauguration. Timing is kind of tricky though. Since i could take away. Resources and distract from president. Elect biden's agenda. That could be extra problematic because the incoming president has no cabinet members currently confirmed by the senate as to whether or not the senate will eventually votes convict trump. that's anyone's guess. Two thirds of the senate is needed to convict soon. Democrats will need at least seventeen republican senators to join them. And that's not guaranteed though senate. Democratic leader chuck schumer says if the president is convicted. The senate could hold another vote to ban trump from holding future political office and they only need a simple majority for that boat to pass as we all wait to see how impeachment the sequel ends on the senate floor. President trump is also dealing with some other thorny issues like banks and other companies cutting ties with him and the trump organization or even the pg backing out of hosting its golf tournaments at trump properties meaning. President trump is facing business consequences in addition to political consequences for his role in last week. Siege on the capital for the latest updates on impeachment subscribe to our daily newsletter head on over to the skim dot com. Next up the more time passes since rioters stormed the capital last week. The more. it's becoming obvious that this was a massive security failure so today we're going to try to answer what went wrong from a security standpoint and what's being done to stop something like this from happening again all right so what did go wrong. Short answer is a lot capital. Police were surprised that what they thought would be political. Protest would turn into an actual attack on the capital and once things turn dangerous. Capitol police officers one of whom died after sustaining injuries. The riot were clearly overwhelmed. A few hundred national guard troops were also posted nearby to the capital at the time of the attack. Though they didn't have the authority to be anywhere on capitol grounds suit even if dc mayor one them to lend a hand by the time. The national guard finally showed up. It was hours after the capital break in started crazy right. These security failings are even harder to explain since it's not like what unfolded was exactly a secret in fact. It was predictable very predictable. That's yuda claus in. She's a professor in politics at brandeis university an expert in domestic and international terrorism ever since more than a dozen members michigan militia. Group were arrested last year for planning to kidnap. Michigan governor gretchen whitmer and conduct televised executions of lawmakers professor klaus and said she's been expecting more political violence the mid i was watching footage from the Storming of the capitol building in washington. Dc and notice people carrying on these ties. That was what i thought about. And it's not just professor klaus in that had a suspicion. Something bad might happen last week. For weeks there'd been online posts in which people openly discussed gathering in washington to try to interrupt is certification of the election results. So law enforcement had all the intelligence they needed to prepare but the lack of information sharing on the usual threat assessment mechanisms thought were not engaged. They were not advance on meeting in the context of the joint terrorism task forces pitcher regional coordination efforts between the different law enforcement agencies. That didn't happen. I think he'd be needs to say that This was a situation. Where all of the information was they up. But no cahan picture actually ended up forming since last week this failure to act on intelligence pointing to a potentially dangerous situation at the capital has led to some staffing changes. The head of the capitol police has resigned. And so the people who manage security for both the senate and the house but with the inauguration less than a week away. These resignations probably aren't going to solve much which brings us to our next question. What's going to change after last week's events to prevent this from happening again one thing that's been talked about is formally designated groups that participated in last week's attack groups like the proud boys as domestic terrorist organizations terrorist label might sound like it turns up the pressure on these groups but it turns out that might not be as effective as it sounds since domestic terrorism isn't a federal crime as in. There's just no criminal sense. Associated brett steel is the director of prevention and national security at the think tank mccain institute here in the united states. The secretary of state is authorized to designate an organization as a foreign terrorist organization and sits here on the word forum the charges for domestic terrorism united states code artem credibly limited for example. If you use certain types of mechanisms lake explosives odd then there may be a terrorism charge but generally speaking if your using a firearm. You're using vehicle ramming incidents there's no domestic terrorism charge bailable so with the. Us government formally designate groups as domestic. Terrorists really help advances to said one basic name a group then being a member of that group and providing support for that group becomes a criminal offence the disadvantages gentlemen speaking it also can make it much harder to actually identify groups because they go underground assume a different type vote underground network. I just don't think that it's criminalization is at all useful. So if threatening people who might incite violence with federal crime and the domestic terrorism label won't do much to stop them especially in the limited time before. Next week's inauguration kind of security response. Are we going to see this. One is probably obvious from the photos. You may have seen from dc this week. It's arming up for the inauguration. National guard troops are already camped out at the capitol and dc is looking more and more like a military base with each passing day in total around twenty thousand national guard. Troops could be there by inauguration next week and this time they'll be armed. Airports and hotels in the area are also tightening up security. Delta airlines has banned passengers from checking guns onto any flights heading to airports near washington. Dc mayor is urging people to steer clear of the capital on inauguration day and as covid precautions weren't enough public access to the event will be severely restricted as for what the experts we spoke to think. Here's professor claussen. While i think we all dealing with very uncertain threat assessment for the inauguration the question is how many people are gonna be ready to travel again for the inauguration on the people who turned up in washington d. c. You know they came from fi way. I don't take those same people. Go traveling again In my view. I think the on the greater fear is that what's going to happen. State capitals that's right. The fbi is now warning of the possibility for violence in all fifty state capitals. In addition to washington dc in the lead up to the inauguration and steal points out like last week assessing the threat level in the days to come isn't straightforward. It is genuinely hard to assess the threat even when people are making explicit threats. Most people now fallen through them and so it can be difficult to say okay. Let's look at all of the statements that were made online and save while we really should have seen this coming but it's also not everyone who makes the threat posed through on that threat. Some people get sucked up in the moments and some people have a very clear plan. Got him a few weeks ago. We describe the covid vaccine roll out as being kind of like boarding a plane with different priority groups. Getting the vaccine i. The first group called group. One a includes healthcare workers and people living in long term care facilities. As of this week around nine million americans have been vaccinated after that group's one b and one c were supposed to get vaccinated next and it looked like there was still enough time for people in those groups to hit the food court before boarding until a surprise announcement. This week that the vaccine royal was about to speed up. So what's going on and who's in line to get vaccinated now. Here's the answer in sixty seconds this week. The department of health and human services or. Hhs made a big announcement. I said the government is going to dip into. Its backup supplies of kobe. Vaccines and start giving them out asef since kobe. Vaccines requires two doses. A few weeks apart to be most effective states were keeping a lot of doses in storage to guarantee. Everyone could get a second shot here was. Hhs secretary alex. Czar we now believe that. Our manufacturing is predictable enough that we can ensure second doses are available for people from ongoing production. Partout of the story is who's going to get these freda vaccine doses people aged sixty five and over and under age sixty five with a co morbidity because we have got to expand the group no before you drive to the pharmacy hoping it your turn to get vaccinated. The truth is this week's changes could actually mean the vaccine. Rollout will look more different now. Depending on where you live as our says states should focus on getting the most people vaccinated as quickly as possible. So vaccines don't go on us. And he says states that do this. We'll get more vaccine doses enter a fifty state race to vaccinate except just like sitting in economy being told you can't use the first class bathroom. Don't be surprised if certain states start pulling ahead in the vaccine. Push possibly leaving. You stuck in coach. How do we do want us to skim a burning question from the news on an upcoming episode. Send us an idea to audio at the skin dot com last week. We got some bad news about the job. Market specifically the job market for women employers in the united states cut one hundred and forty thousand jobs last month. And when you look into who is losing those jobs it turns out. It's women in terms of net jobs gained and lost women. Lost one hundred and fifty six thousand jobs while men actually gained sixteen thousand overall to make sense of why this is happening and how we can explain that gap between men and women we call up a friend of the show katherine edwards. I'm a labor economist. For the rand corporation edwards told us. It's important to look at these numbers in context. I think it helps to go back to april. This was the first month of the lockdown when the us saw absolutely catastrophic job losses so it was twenty point seven million jobs in a month. Were gone since then. In may and june we've posted really large increases that were both significant but nowhere near the size of the hole that had been created in the labor market subsequent month has seen a decrease in the number of jobs that were added to the economy and in every subsequent month. The economy is getting the growth getting weaker and weaker so even if the economy is weaker overall they're still the issue of women making up one hundred percent of job losses in december told us those numbers actually represent a much broader pattern of how the recession last spring has affected women differently. Men and women don't hold the same jobs which means that from a very primal hurt place. They're never at risk equally in the labor market in any situation this recession. The risk have really stacked against the industries and occupations in which women are over represented in critically those industries and occupations are more likely to be women of color so it's a very particular risk that is manifesting through the pandemic so that's one reason women make up those job losses. Why else women were in riskier jobs because they were more likely to be in healthcare and retail trade and third would be care. And that's a story that we that we've talked about a lot that if you do not have childcare. Someone has to stay home from work and that someone often ends up being the mom so this has been like a triple hit two women. This recession and women in the workplace edwards told us in order to reverse this trend to key groups have to buy into getting women back to work. I think is the to central policymakers. Coming out of this recession are going to be employers in the federal government on the employer side a lot of evidence in research points to the fact that where we really see the crowbar of entering in in making the wedge between male and female workers is whether or not women are different. So let me give you an example high-powered law firms corporate law your friends in finance who work until ten thirty at night every night. Because that's what they all do your mother with two kids. There's no reason why you necessarily put in less work than people who stay at the office till ten thirty. But you can't stay at the office until ten thirty right. If you're going to be productive you have to be productive in a different way. However if the norm of the office is that stayed in office till ten. Thirty is a code for productivity. You're going to get penalized. We see this as where women fit relative to the culture. Are they the exception or the rule. If there are the exception that's a wedge in which you can pay them less and promote them last and incorporate than less to the structure. But if they're the rule right then it becomes. Will we have flexibility for all of our workers. Not just a waiver of flexibility for women who just had a kid so employers through changing culture and policies can make work more flexible for everyone especially women as for the government. The shortest probably most distinct way to say this is that the federal government has never made a large scale investment in women workers. We do not have better guaranteed paid family leave. We do not have accessible and affordable childcare. We do not have universal access to preschool and we do not have universal access to after school programs. The federal government has the ability to make incredible actions to do this. That are long overdue. My mother should've had those things right. I shouldn't be. I'm i'm explaining why they're good. Economic investments in twenty twenty one when they were really good economic investments in one thousand nine hundred eighty one making those investments matters because as a reminder women staying at work has an outsized influence on the economy as a whole the size of the. Us economy is very much determined by the number of people working that means that in order for the economy to recover into grow in less. But if we do not encourage labor force participation we are clipping our own wings in terms of how fast or how large we can recover which brings us to this week's installment of our how to skim your life twenty twenty one new year's challenge how to skim your resume no matter what stage of your job search. You're actually in. It's a good idea to make sure your resume is ready to go. Which includes updating it with new info and getting rid of things that don't really need to be there in the first place. We wanted to help you. Skim your resume. So we called an expert. Hi i'm amanda. Augustine and i am the resident expert for top resume which is the largest resume writing service in the world and to skimmers. Hi my name is jay hi everyone. I'm caroline huber day to resume. Do's and don'ts let's get down to the first question on your mind. There's like a myth saying that you only get ten to fifteen seconds of a hiring managers time just to skim through that resume. So what makes that resume standout great question. Amanda told us standing out starts with design an order to stand out not necessarily having the flashiest play and i think people get really caught up on. What can i do to really stand out. And frankly if you start messing with a format and it's not in a traditional format at a recruiter is accustomed to they. Don't want to hunt for information. Design is queen so you want to be very consistent and how you label things. How are you formattings job titles. How're you formatting. Start and end date. The most important part of that design strategy is clarity. You want to set the stage so that when they quickly glance at your resume they understand why you're pursuing the job that you want day and if you are interested in making everything size twelve times. New roman resume has much of color a bit of a different format from a lot of the traditional ones. I guess at what point is. Are you doing too much. Formatting at one hundred percent depends on industry. i think some industries are going to be more of a very traditional and mortar. And they're going to expect a little less pizzazz so to speak. I'm not opposed to color on a resume as long as it's one color and it's you know it's a good contrast white also good to know so you like a lot of people. I'm seeing are putting a profile picture on their resume and truth is a big. No no for the us job market. That's because of concerns around hiring discrimination so skip that well it professional photo. Your roommate took got it. So you can get creative with design within reason next what to actually put on your resume. Amanda told us ask yourself one question every time you decide to write a new bullet time you write something down. He basically ask yourself so what. So what what is the recruiter thanking. Remember your resume is your brag sheet. There are times when viewing car in unusual situations where you're holding two roles at once or multiple jobs just due to lack of resources and time. I think it's important to convey it in a resume but also it might come off as being to bragging or whatnot burke divall you're never allowed to say you're being too bragging. That brag sheet should hit. Your specific accomplishments been promoted taking on more responsibilities. Started a new project. All those things should be there. Say here bullet points for your bragging points. Use that hall. There is to these. Are the things i accomplished. These are the reasons why you want to hire me so trying to really focus on. Here's the result. Here's what i accomplished. Here's how i created that but remember. This is a resume not a diary. One thing to keep in mind is you don't necessarily have to have every job on your resume. It's not a transcript right. It's a marketing documents and to market yourself to perspective employers. You should taylor your resume to reflect what they're looking for. Does the job posting say. They're looking for certain qualifications. Make sure that the language in your resume reflects the language in their job description and ps for companies that use machines to scan resumes. The machines are scanning for that language too. So you wanna work those into your resume. Some of those in the skills some of those in the professional summary some low throughout your work experience. That's going to help make sure that your resume is popping up when it's going to the technology this means you might be saving different versions of your resume if you're applying to multiple jobs with different descriptions if this makes you think how the heck am i going to get all of this on one page never fear you have earned two pages so no need to go crazy with the margins or your font size okay. So we've covered the basics but let's get into some of the harder stuff like when someone does have a gap in jobs are in between jobs. And i didn't use as sort of official fancy sabbatical or anything bad. I do you recommend handling that gap. The good news is that actually top resume did a study with recruiters in early fall. Two thousand twenty so very recently and we actually ask them. You know how big of a deal have an employment gap and the overwhelming majority said. Not a big deal anymore. They actually don't consider it to be a stigma and honestly there's so many people in that same boat that there is no longer such a stigma around a lengthy On our lengthy employment gap on your resume. So i know a lot of people. Get hyper focused on that. Don't let it derail your focus from what you should be focusing on which is okay. How do i best position my resume. And how do. I appreciate the right lead. However there are course little things you can do things like you could be taking on freelance work. Even if pro bono. You could be doing an unpaid internship offering your services on a consulting basis to friends and family or for pay gigs. One hundred percent. You're allowed to add that. I think it's important to keep in mind that you don't have to be paid for your work in order to put it on your resume. What classes are you taking. Is there a certification online that you were able to to earn during this time period where you're currently earning. That's just another indication book. I'm still keeping my skills sharp. I'm obviously still involved. I'm doing something with my time. Other than binge-watching bridgeton bright remember those professional development activities can fill your time and any blank spaces on your resume. What else kind of innocent vein for those hugh are eating considering about. Maybe a career switch are trying to do something very different. Do you have recommendations on how to translate your resume for those sort of scenarios. I think the great question because frankly some people's industries have really been hit especially hard and i. It's not they have to shell that career objective for for at least the short term and think it's really important to i. Just do your research and understand what's available And what would make the most out of the skill sets you. Currently possessed some of that is networking and talking to people and getting a better sense of how your skill set could be applied in a different marina that interests you and seems to be hiring. Now it's also looking at different job resources just to get a better understanding of who truly is hiring right now and kind of putting that information together. That legwork is really really important because you need that in order to rewrite your resume for different goal once you have that goal fairly clear you're then going back and looking at your resume and saying okay. What's most relevant. But now with skill sets are most relevant and how can i highlight that What information did i not including my resume before about a certain job but now suddenly takes a higher priority. Okay so to recap a good resume. No matter what industry you're in has a clean design that's easy to read. And it's a curated list of your accomplishments and previous roles not necessarily an exhaustive on that list or those accomplishments may change depending on what job. You're applying for so remember to tailor your resume and save multiple drafts. Keep in mind gaps on. Your resume aren't a bad thing and you can show of all that you do outside of work like classes professional certifications or volunteer work to help. Fill any of those gaps other skills you've gained because of the pandemic like project management new software or communication skills should also go on your resume because hiring managers will definitely be looking for people who are flexible and fast on their feet. But you probably don't need to put proficient in zun and finally if you wanna switch industries your resume can help get you that new role. Just remember to take stock of what skills you currently have in how they translate to the job. You want if you wanna tune up your resume or hear. More from amanda. We'll leave some links in our show notes. Hey guys you may have heard that. We like to think about new year's resolutions a bit differently than most well. We teach you how to scan your life. We also want to tell you about the happiness lab podcast. Dr lori santos asks are we setting our new year's goals the wrong way there on january laureus talking to experts like psychologists tear brock and yogi jesmyn stanley. Who revealed that the secret fulfilling your new year's goals is to simply be nice. If being kind to yourself needs to be bumped up on your priorities list. Then listen to the happiness lab wherever you your podcasts. Before we go today. We've got a quick update from las vegas home to the consumer electronics. Show or c. e. Es the greatest show on earth for new gadgets and tech. It's just large like it's the best way to start your year. Because you all your steps in you walk miles through all these booths and big and small you see a bunch of terrible terrible technology rewind. That's a normal january. And the life of heather kelly a technology reporter at the washington post but this year s is one hundred percent online which kelly doesn't love my favorite part are these small companies that are usually in a bowels of cas like a little basement of the sands and that's really find really interesting things but the problem is you have to walk around and find them. You're not gonna find them. Virtually looking through like billion press releases for two reasons one like a press release does not tell you anything about a company. I wanna see right. There is on a either. Is this something they actually built at excited about. And you also want to see a prototype this working and there are no prototypes this year. So the pandemic has ruined a lot of things including yes but there has to be something getting buzzed this year right so last year i wrote a story that was like. Cbs is increasingly about like a dark dystopia future. I didn't really predict that. Twenty twenty would literally be at dystopia in future. I feel a little psychic but there were some stuff there that kinda carried over this year. There was a lot of masks. They were air pollution and things like wildfires because that was right around the time the australian wildfires and now those same acres have tweaked them to be like. It's also great pandemic. I think every year. Cas does look into the future. And i really do think pandemics aren't something that that are gonna disappear forever and these uv cleaning robots might be around forever and chase masks might be a part of our lives for more than just the next couple of years alright high tech masks and germ killing robots depressing but we get it and we also get the flip side of that tech that makes living in a pandemic less stressful. This is the headless cat robot. I got one in the mail yesterday. It's the Kubo and it's this japanese robot that looks like a decapitated with creature and its tail moves so that you feel less alone during quarantine has a little bit of weight to it and if you press your head against it you can hear a faint heartbeat. I mean hey if it's burry and cute and didn't do what my dog did this week and throw up at my feet while on zoom call. Then maybe i can see the value also this something that got a lot of attention this year and i. I think a lot about us. Is this little ice cream maker at news like carrying like pods. It also makes inaugurate as maybe that's why it's a hint. And you put them in there and it just it takes ninety seconds in generates a scoop of ice cream or margarita. Or maybe both depending on your mood. Wait a second. A robot pets and fancy margarita. Machines the best that the biggest tech companies in the world can do. Kelly says in all seriousness. Cs twenty twenty one might be remembered for some tech that actually useful. Like better wifi. There is a new wifi standard. Coming out this new wi fi technology is called six. E it's a generational improvement in wifi strength kind of like five g for cell phones and kelly's colleagues wrote that it's quote the equivalent of adding a whole new lane to your home's information superhighway. Though caveat is going to be a while before it it it actually gets mainstream adoptions. I don't think it's going to really save us from our choppy zoom meetings until then. We'll just be here listening to the robotic heartbeat of the petty kubo. Thanks for listening to skim this. This podcast was skimmed by alex car and luke barges with additional help from peter bonaventure and cure along. Our head of audio is gray lumber share and. I'm your host justina debbie before we go. We wanted to point out that we made a mistake. In last week's show. When we said rafia warnock a democrat just elected to the senate from georgia was the first black senator elected in a former confederate state. Turns out that's not the case. But he is the first black democrat elected to the senate from a former confederate state still historic but definitely a key distinction. Thanks to one of our loyal listeners. For writing in skim this will be back in your feet again next thursday until then for more skim to sign up our daily newsletter head. On over to the skin dot com.

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Veronica Gorrie stands up

Conversations

51:02 min | 3 months ago

Veronica Gorrie stands up

"This is an abc podcast. My guest don't conversations. Today is veronica gory. Ronnie is a good ni- curnow woman. The traditional owners of gibbs in victoria quite a few years back now ronnie was listening to the radio and the station was holding a father's day competition. You had to send a letter explaining why your dad should be father of the year so ronnie wrote in describing her dad and how much he meant to her and she won ronnie's dad has been with her through a lot. He was there when her mom wasn't safe to be around. He was there when she gave birth to her earn babies and later when she escaped. Allah partner rone's dad was in the audience that proud day when she was inducted as a police officer in the queensland police force and he was there when that all fell apart ronnie's written a memoir of her childhood and her ten years in the queensland police force it's called black and blue and a warning that pot of ronnie story includes family violence hierarchy harasser. How good now. That's my introduction for you. Can you introduce yourself and tell me where you're from so woman janine neck dome after running gerry. I'm a proud woman Which is more traditional lanza tuna half hours of melbourne and it's beautiful country and that language yo traditional. Who's been teaching you that. How long have you been speaking that sir. Our friend learning more language in the last iphone views. And it's actually language royal cruise on many of my ancestors wrong before me including my grandma now when they used to speak english. Our tour train float yes. Oh i'm language is really important for me and Yeah a lot of aboriginal people. What are some of the favorite words that you've been learning. What would you like. I'm sorry my language Mother our mothers mother brain's cocoon and armed. Yeah i love that word cahan. Because that's you now. Gone to greenwich. And i'm i'm trying to teach him language now while they're little sponges. When you're a little kid rodney. You lived in a victorian country town of more. Well what did you dad build for you in the backyard. I can be It was a tree house. Actually and other people's yards. We absolutely loved it. It was like a high for us. We actually we were quite a bit. Tell me more about what your dad was like. As a young man was he into sport My father was an is an incredible man and was and still is but he played a lot of sports and cricket zeros football and towards the end after he was a believe hawthorn football club brooklyn to scout dead but in the janet dial watching human trying to draft him he unfortunately perkins leg. Yes sir that ended usefully career but he up empowering and that's where i got my love of sports and diagnostics much test match creek crooked and all that and more about his car. Why was he so proud of his cars. Your dad cruise for a black man to have a real and have a license back in those days. Was it's an amazing thing amazing feat and my father always had these vehicles and you know that he brought. We had earning money and and back in those days. They had no on back site or in the front sight though which would fit so many of us the what. What kind of car did he drive. What do you remember being squashed up in. Their homes should've kept rock forbidden. Now we'll be rich average. What about music. How big a pirated music. Plan your family. Armand goodness slam. Yesteryear listen to country and western a lot and solemn music now because it takes me back to those times in my mom my mom. But i'm we've dead. He's listened to cat. Stevens and bob dylan the traveling robberies and all black music blackadder's so whenever we do their long road trips. It's you know seeing to this music all his songs. Hey seeing within your family. I sun roof my brother. He's also performer. As well my older brother and my little brother where all musicians can play instruments as well. So did you perform on stage earlier. We had a family band But prior to that incidents. Like a little kid. I is old and dead bodies to go to restaurants or pubs and if there was a life ban might say my dad just happening be speaking to the band member and hit. Pay me fifty dollars to go up. Young's i to go sooner song. Yes i'm am. One of the one mind songs was on by credence. Clearwater revival was on. Who'll stop the rain. So that's one of my early memories. Good seeing that as an eight year old word for word. That's a big vocal range for a little kid so big lungs tonsils removed. I'm able to get to those round one time. You go to gig at a convention. You survived okay. Gyros about that chris. We all hear bad stuff about that. But these these This particular bar grill sired. Those are all siro Supportive of us really gentlemen. You know they are block black people and him up paid really well and what happens on the body too and stays. It'll be a second book. Hey i can't remember anyway. I saw them that knowledge of music. Paid off for your brother years later when you two were in. The audience got sale of the century. What happened we're in those channahon studios back. When tiny bobber used to be the host of sale of the century and during their ad breaks charney would interfere interact with the audience and down. He would ask them axed audience true trivia questions and one of them he saddam. The next one's going to be an audio question and he played starbucks song. I had no idea what it was but my little brother. He would have been about four at the time. He put his hand up stri road at the entire three hours and he said that's whatever the sun was boy uncle on rose and we wanna big box of may donate mate pause. What about your brother. Was he happy. I was happy. Lift off the next mile. We're about steed your your dad's parents your grandparents live when you were a kid. Some my grandparents were born and raised on light transmission and that sobat four and a half hours east of melbourne on the coast. And it's a beautiful location in now language. It's recalled that mission tires. I'm bonanza yes. So they were known as toys average permission now than irons lake. Charles trust but i'll born and raised here and lived there for majority of the life but when When dad was living in morrell sitting headline family. We've my mom and my kids. My grandparents moved to as well so thorough ways everyday of our niloy day. How did you get on. With your granddad. Grenell girl And probably sonoma now granted Yes so how. I had a really special bond and historic. I never visit kid because grandad leave her lying and run child. And what were you doing. It could have got you flow. Goes young israel. I think i played. Well swearing putty mouth the f word and the f bomb. Yeah but never say maybe you know my parents be trying to trust me down on. Give me a flogging but greenwich labor learn. What kind of stories did he tell you. Ronnie all the old stories about growing up on a mission. He's work or prior to make lots of stories and neons and monitoring stories as well. He told you about being chased by a ghost. One time all is that we had earlier belay for the blue mountains. I'm gary knell language. maine's harry munro. Before and three reckons. He was driving for the mountains and he was in the rear vision mirror nicer dog. I chase him up the road. Would he have driven fast to get away from that. Well he ran into did but we know this is not true because brennan was the slowest driver ever. And there's evidence of this spending now actually. I think he's the ever to be put for dr andrew. Slow here man. Could've got up with him super-quick you know. Ruin your kidney. Joe how god granddad officer graduates of our pre one department that hero. Ria what would you to grammar as well. What would you do on on sundays down. Going to church. Sunday was the best. I used to go dumped tip. Go to the tip. We'll have that. I'm becton the tape. In just rummage. Iran and for all the other people's waste and neil so many good things that people throwing away and astrid is really wasteful country So would come back with a car boot load for good staff and did your grandparents that at at a place. How helpful to the gills was your grandparents house. Franken mark grandfather was a hoarder down into the study of horrors watch those shows holders and it usually comes from that stems on where he had nothing growing up so as an when he grabbed things he just kept kept in a kept and kept so eventually. We had under barely walk around the house. What was school like for you as a little girl running. Screw our love school. I love learning every school. Zaps lovely could might get there I had really good teachers while you so your grandma out the window school. Yeah what was she doing. Morrison promise will the time out the window. And i ran his wild black woman just rang. Passover no big balloon mahan. I'm bundy marlin reaches a sticker weapon. here insurance account to wire by all means struggle hit the teacher of my sister who had just given my sister the came and she she was a force to be reckoned. Did that happen. Did she get that teacher. I have not heard honor. The outcome associate probably would have every kid's dream if they've gotten in trouble gotten strep from teacher is an avenging grandma to come in and take vengeance. It's fantastic time. We lived roy directly across road from school in my grandmother. Was there at the time my sister got kinda went home crying during school hours and then my grandmother took it upon herself to sort that out. Your grandma had had a really really tough time. As a kid she was stolen from the mission as a child taken to an orphanage in melbourne. Put out to work for watt families. What happened when she gave birth to your dad when she was a teenager. Ramar grandmother who are referred to as many. She was sixteen years old when she was pregnant. With my father and time she'll swimming in the abbotsford convent which institution forum more children at the time and to show and she hid her pregnancy rod up shoes eight months. And when when i found out they moved to for House for expected spectate mullins and so when she reported turned They took the baby of her. That will really upsetting to right to hear like that's one of the traumas that we've been growing up. We've known my grandma story and my father's how did she get him back. Ronnie a so. She fought to for now four years and she wrote numerous letters to the boat to the aboriginal protectors and welfare to get her child back in nam if she wasn't such a storage raccoon we probably wouldn't be here are now and what did what was she tall by the white authorities that she had to do in order to to get her baby son back rest shoes torture to be married before she could get him back. And so we went back to the mission on a mission to fundamentally get married and looked at the winning proud that i have met harm of nanan granddad and my grandmother's roy smalley uptaken all big smiles. More gramma mark grandfather looks miserable head to obligated to get married her but that will married for today shade pass away for forty years and and and did she get your dad back then. Once she'd she'd got married the way she was told she had to. Did your dad comeback and live with her continued and nor have one special letter that she wrote to the board and she's mentioned the diet. She got married to sit seventeen for september. And and now can i have my son back. Plays and this went on for us. So for us ryder. She got my dad he was four was returned to the mission or yonder back to her. Does you dad remember that time. Did he remember those early. Hits your he does It's amazing how brain how far back we can remember. But he remembers going back to the mission and being bath boy a woman and that was the mission manager because on when the mission manager shoes to one that had to pick up dead from the the the group i mean it was in the first time that it was in Sushi lighter awesome dadan so help it was walking fast in boy rebound bright bright blue eyes and so she One team and arcs to the top team. Even she was she knew she was gone. My grandma and so. For that raisin the state put on my grandmother on probationary period on the proviso that dom she kept and looked after my father and the mission manager was on baffling. My father retire. Just to check forum bruising. Whatever and some aren't that she remembers paying for this one woman always with that risk that he might get taken away must have been having that fear to harm after that when bed was returned back to my grandmother and my grandfather when placing welfare turned up on the mission and out here. Because this roy come to go to well. My mission smoker probably a five kilometer dirt road. And you could hear it. He traffic coming from a model lie. So when i hear hooves. I knew it wasn't good because they all the kids which is scary off an abortion many times. My father ran hard behind bushes. And tommy set next to a smack in the stalled grandmother. Mervyn come back and get you. And that's what it is style there and set next to the snake. We haven't talked to bat. You'll mom rani had tough. Was it for you and your siblings. After you dad left and you guys were leaving with you. Yes are when all suffering numbered throughout when i was about seven and she will struggling financially And also like we're living in aboriginal housing and in proving the average community and my mom was a white woman and she must have found this terrorist hard and she was. She wasn't paying supported as well not be shoes single-parent now four children and prior to and she had this income that she relied on to pay the bills into referred. And then all of sudden it's gone and back in the dying when i was young with them. I mean what doesn't pension day or you know was endowment tie and shoes once a four seventies. Extols forlorn she. She upped and left one. Not runny. what do you remember about that. Aren remember too much about that which is probably more more. Brian flyer to protect myself but are from my little brothers story. He he remembers it So when mom left apparently she packed up and left over. we're never sure man and She just abandon us and my little brother was running route crying. Chattanooga is asfaw kids went to our grandparents place and we knew that we wanted to some grandparents will hold. I had nice spice us. Kids southern here was for ten in there and women got a my grandma but we had wind up and telling what was happening and shouldn't retinas in and he has sorry. I'm at some sun. She's my some contact with ted cruz. We didn't i wait at that time. So she's made contact and said cambric. I'm the your children and our know-how only side. It felt like months but it could have been for six weeks. But i'm running to the door with my dad. So that's all i remember. You ended up leaving mainly with your dad. Then what was that like. Yes are always predominantly rise. Mama further 'cause wall stone like join mom and dad were together. I have a lot of memories of violence and alcohol and my mom satis my same. She was the main instigator She was very friendly. Volunteers my father. I'm so specially whilst on the tobacco and She's the best mother ensure cyber but when she was strangled system from person and so always feed my mother and so when mom and dad's were up and i ended up staying at that but my siblings went patently. The moment how did she feel about you. Leaving with your dad ronnie. She thinks she fed up retrial. Crews she was guy for so much and she. She needed the support from all the children. But also young. And i knew that it wasn't sipho made around her and i used to go see her And lacewood every three years. Or and i i she was. She would subject to the same volunteers that she put my father for in with your dad and his girlfriend up to alice springs. When you're at high school. What did you wear to you new school on the first day ardent i wore a duff occurred in springs. Right not do that. Little sir. Hours rebelling are told dot com. If you move me away from our. I'm never gonna take this away this school and i actually didn't wear this could infamous wore out screen phone so i stood right little black girl. Overpaid duffle coat in the. Hey puerto degrees. but i'm narrowing down. It was a kelton stack blew. It was accounting tougher care and louder and now from an op shop prior Before leaving morale you definitely stood out so you want to go at. I had come to feel about your time. Living or ended up lowering ended up taking. That top occurred up after a couple of days. We'll sweating nobody's business but are merely not lobbying are made some new friends and you know and actually friends back in victoria. Put together some cash to try to bring you back. High your business serving tool that movie but i asked him to stop signs money. I remember no said senate up to maine and get me out of here and nice i. It was it was. It wasn't a small amount. A large amount. Sorry that enough to get your bus ticket back to victoria. Maybe royal the town reunion neo ended up spending the money on more new friends. You lived there with you with your dad and his his girlfriend for wall. Then you need comeback to victoria and you had some really awful experiences at sexual violence as a teenage Was there anyone you could go to help about that. Anyone you could tell now. I kept that sacred made for four years before i finally told my dad. Yeah that was really hard because it changed me that not forever. China me different after that Angrier of angry headed men hide miles. Yeah but it's you know these things happen. In north and north move of learn to move on from it and Halted twelve stuff turn. Was your dad sympathetic. How did he react. We told him oh he cried and he made me. I'm he wanted me to talk to him about it. And he was visibly upset. Despite everything that was going on in your life as a teenager you finish school. You got into you knee and and then you got pregnant. How did you feel about becoming a mom. Lupin ida tesla's more in for a whole village mahrdad four. I had worms. Here's who went out and got me some combined trim and so he said he attacked this worm now and so i took her formative apps. Way off what. Oh that's not good short taken over now because it's made me sick but the next frontier the doctors because those quincy and they'd disorders door pregnancy test and clean no idea that if you had sex you could get pregnant. I wasn't given any education in relation to that. I had no idea that you know. Tools had their period as well. So yeah but i found that real quick. But i'm here's an it was a positive press and i just cried cried. 'cause why Those weren't happy tears in my eldest one noses. I just felt like i was driven. I had done cows. I want to achieve and of what this is gonna mirage change. How did you dad react. When he realized it wasn't worms that that you are having a baby who was really upset cruz. He those goals and these aspirations that i have were also from dallas well cruise heroes marquee spain that role model and mark constantly so education may complaining. My education was a shoe trinidad zero at tommy forever. General education and in the high school was in. He was search chair of the pain. Seca me which was awesome in the school's getting closed down and it was my dad. Who is responsible for getting the menu building so they always remember that the hard work you did so it was a d both really invested in you being on this path and then a baby changed thin. Yes was it like in the delivery room. How quickly till you dad came. Around to being a granddad. All in a romano go. It was sixteen people in the room. Far yeah there was did not that day yeah palm. My first child was born and he does. He fell in love with my babies online. And on the listen conversations. Saginaw stephen moore subscribe to the conversations. Podcast find more just into abc dot net slash conversations Ronin umit another man and became pregnant to him. Kanev relationship did that turn out to be. Sorta star was good nor the hunter renfrow zoro for that turbo dom originally in like i was pregnant with his first child and my second child and he a cop friday not man unconscious he punched me an uppercut to the night knows which could could've killed match i but i'm here and i woke up or came to an end. How long was on the ground pool. But i'm at the thomas harding. My daughter. my oldest child and our couple of grand does clawing all to that was before you even had his baby pregnant. Jails house fraud pretty much Pretty much all the time. Every i'm him and Yeah it was you know. And i was trapped in those many that i i left him and escaped the relationship at h. Tommy it for me and even my son the second child he's i was born paid past the door. Were some starring in grabbed the baby and hop in the car. And i had no other choice but to get into be. Did your family responded. They know how. How bad things were you dad in in your other siblings now. I kept it from them. Which is a lot of Family vonts survivors and victims now as we speak paper getting abused by their partners with their alleged loved ones when paypal bashar right now is when people here not love. When you're bane abused. it's not love inside the family that i that knew what was going on. Roy signed leave him. they remained. Don't know how hard it was for me to actually him like a tried every day to try and lay him. But yes i had. It defy like it away Sort of caught the train It was still backed. I try animal. And i hadn't had those red broom what struck banks the two zero one seven novels stewart of baby l. Close a couple of photos had three kids by nasa kids. Yes sorry took her from the first trying out of Melvina had a passbook for quainton undergo. Bruce from from alvin and my dad met me at spencer street railway station and he gave me food so dead was crying and i started crying. But i'm african you. When i was crying happy. Tears are fouts trader and relief when of acquaintances but He found me so so he found me an hard solicitors and tried to get custody of the kids full capacity and so was i took it a solicitor and Farting backing the courts. And i was just as gruesome are had to state fear and terror of coming back to restore knowing full. Well that if i did. He'll he'll take my kids all kill me because he always threatened to kill me for him and so this Got conditions from the court said he would represent me in my absence. Which was so amazed by. That crusoe's didn't wanna go pay but also for that was able to be done so end up getting full custody of my children but he got access and that was ripe for hey So when the day came word to handle my children or my family signed dined tour. Titles he will never you. You'll never see kids in our said fire two. I'm not sticking to the court order. I will lose. Custody of my children are knew that i knew there'd be some there was a risk serve. Never say my kids in. But i had to take that risk and Just as well he did have kids to room for eight weeks and now we're knew where he was in. He was rock headed by federal price. And then you kids were were bought back safely safely. My dad driving more way back Brother turn come back when my little one comeback. She was twelve months old. She didn't hole but she does. Now yes so really strong boden former children you were creating a new family for them and for yourself up in queensland ended up with a new partner noon he take your wall to realize he was a different kinda man than the person you'd been with. It certainly wasn't used to that. So the first time he rises for us and are not incubus jelly. And just rice's soldiers instintively grab my children and ran and hid in the wardrobe. 'cause i was waiting for that problem but it never happened. No hey must have been looking ramos out. Hey spoof but yes so heroes. He was a beautiful sour and he will so and lobbying and my father my father to my children now that today so i'm so glad. What about you being in in queensland. That's pretty different environment than you'll country in in victoria to take a while to get used to the snakes and the heat and the things i'm terrified of always been terrified of anything smaller than we really are I'm scared about. Rose loves worst. But i'm smelled since spiders. Yes i we had a snake coming out house. One time and host terrified knows alzheimer. Lions the children and the then harry was at work and saw had always planned children of a fire drill and we used to practice it. You know you never know so. For the winter. I throw just how gently gently exit thrive and my youngest one. Who's just wearing will carry that manteo one the the middle child or put up and then i jumped out rural outside from smokes inside of red in closer. A debate clan of comeback empower friend passes snake thing to do when you're a smoker when the addictions really terrible so i've come past body strike of grandma's smart mobs and down past the sniper guy now we up to the then have become home way you endanger. Was that a snake that was about to take your out. Apparently it's non randomness survive. But we spy can little and so wait. Did you get the idea to join. The police force all model of had this room. Fear and terror of place and this stems back generations forever israel people so my father had to fear but grandmother had the fear in no doubt her ancestors long before so i wanted to break that sarcoma children. I didn't want him to be afraid of place on my also as a young child i witnessed a lot of place. Brutality and unnecessary use of force directed at. My people and i wanted to join the price to make changes. I wanted to ensure that my paypal traded better and virginia ten. That i felt safe. What did you. How did you family friends. React to the news that you were going to apply. All madonna was ecstatic. He was sired wrapped at a drive all the way up and when he was he was on the trip the mailbox every day while souls white really septum spider. Yes when i found out it was a big day but we'd rather family who've been in and out of the system And knocked up and traded really bad by place lau really upset Family members what was the training like in the lead up to to join def to get super feed all rose or serb afraid but not spoilsports. Man yeah it was. It was hectic per love dirksen. Very competitive excel under pressure. Not good blackfellas lived on the coast of water but we never put a fatal water like it's called the water to them now and now schools down. We don't have swimming pools right queensland school so i was hopeful subsume locally and had to do to. Swimming is a police officer usually on land now but united the bronze medallion to get through. And i'm so i had to do that. Requirement and scrape fruit. What about driving. We could at the defensive driving in chasing also top driver in amari in the whole squad on only one that come come as equals may was a former ambulance driver. I think because. I've been driving unlicensed rocks a teenager in my dad's car which was here. Nowadays you feel about the uniform you know. It's a big thing to put on a uniform and put on a police uniform. What did you think about getting dressed in that outfit so that they will be wired up in place bus detectives into western murray's to bay rays from from the time that happened one of the best nights and the job matthew bond who was the recruitment me were in the same group. He's also average won't smell from brisbane. was away sick that i didn't want to do it on my own so i didn't believe everyone else stayed back which is just as well the next day when matthew came back we went in on randomly had that one on marmi fat really special deadly. Yeah i've never been in one location and more care. These free stuff before. Like four pairs sock lot. Four pairs and it was you know felt so good but then try on made it to your your induction day. Who was there from your family. All my family turned. My mother included my siblings. All but one. And here's a bit upset about joining the place. But i'm so he didn't turn up. I'm you are near the whole family. Was there which was really good. What cake was waiting for you. When you got home are brought this chocolate cake. It was a really. It was a massive kate because capable of saying malar so saddam. Congratulations constable. yarom had my surname. Married then. Mary name but darrow's repairman. We had a party outdoors but only had the weekend. This was on a friday. Had said dines often straight from news station on monday you worked in the community that you leave in. Did that mean you will always on as a police. Officer darren the security even if you live in the district that you're placing your copy of twenty four hours a day so if you say combine committed of you lost your off. Judy and you feel you have to report it. And i saw crime everyday. So a fat wasn't at nutcracker was always on judy. Tell me about the time you saw two wanted men at your local metro station ourselves about your holiday more now husband and now we're off the ferry also die before and we went to the show cops at the server saint two hundred leads. And we've been looking for them for some time in Because into a tropical ireland our stressful. The you're in preparation now wearing a sarong. But in fadia language we say saloon and elsewhere started wearing underneath so when no ernest sarong and pair of props and fired. So stuff happened when i had no fired. Murphy's law but i'm a so as to lead to rebrand new confirmed for months and months and months. So i went into the so rare no foreigner and is excuse me. I'm a police officer and he just looked at me like yes. Sure your restaurant. H berea fire and so did then yeah called it in and now picked up and now we got them. Yeah were. I didn't get them the other place that will work uniform flyer to start around with my cerrone as you as you say a you were smoker. How did that help. Defuse the standoff. It helped a lot of the jobs are turned up Those one job in particular where she was passionate most and park and she had Chit douse to soften. She had a lawyer to threaten to self hamas who this royal oak saliva wardrobe and i went to the trouble myong so's working on my own mechanized is but i'm how from our grabbed a smart from a barn packet and i started block so she could see sutter feeling around my pockets. I'm a god at the station. Said mentioned her. And i also can give me live praise and we're out nine. She walked up to me and gave him. The lighter already. Escalated with that situation is smart pelissier people who deal with death and violence as part of their work. You know whether they're ambos or the police officers. Alvin develop a pretty morbid sense of humor. Va school black hair and black double black black black humor and i'm really funny so are really quickly but more than sweden's wouldn't get out human but i'm it's think it was a tactic to get us through the die. Did aboriginal people react to you tuning up aboriginal woman in police uniform yes so already in the community dinu owning hurls and what kids wear and as an aboriginal house. Oh in that community. And i was a patient there and so that. Say me off. Judy as well but they are really could to me investor versus really protective in good with them. So whenever i did have jobs having involved families i might feel safe in our. I would allow my into their hires. Remind all the other what couple stand on the fence which is really good. A lot of the crime scenes that you attended as a police officer. Were familiar to you from your law of you. Know domestic violence or car accidents. What kind of told that take these went by what. That's what made me a really good price off so if there is such a thing as a good copper but i'm from our lived experiences. You know i've experienced. How mars jobs always attending. So i knew how to deal with. The families of the paypal was good for me saying but what did it do for you. Having a guard at i scenes again and again sorry developed. A nursery a So more was partner train. So i would come home after a bad shift and i would start from the the toll to handle on what me way. Back in the house cleaning every plane and it was a ritual and So took the uniform australia way. Is that indicated off judy. And then is the house apart and crying and paying posed my children. But i'm now on. When are we at high. I've known to debris with so i would y mild store and to sit on your bed and just some marsano be crying and telling them what sort of shit die. I had and mud aura. Think after trauma sniping which is just as well but most naked. Just pat moran. Yeah so are really bad. You know but i you needed to talk to someone. How did you what colleagues added other police officers talk to. You had any job and ones i didn't have. I don't have anymore. Once you live the place you just lose all your friendships that emerged. It's a really tight. Knit institution and they're all friends just. Hr the so if someone leaves. I haven't heard from one copy yet. One of my former might are which is sad. Because i'm so main aren't whether uniform minimal basu hold those same integrity and ethics. I was subjected to a lot of racism and blaming in the job. I was told by place. Oh who wrote in a science coordinator it has women or black paper. What will they shelter friendship. Yeah that tefa which is good ones or appreciate attributes. Darn spoke up is to ones. We're going to be careful with anyone. You could complain to anyone higher. Up the chain yeah. I did put him several compliance more. Especially when i witnessed on place brutality towards my paypal and it was one incident. Never show my own in the community was handcuffed then kicked in about the headboard this one place officer while wearing place birds So immediately after that. I the put in a complaint against him to the child of my section and it went nowhere near knife. You keep ring comprised to until is your ostracize and asked to know that you know everyday was relentless for me sir. Brain of black single mother and a woman always minority and so many aspects. So if i were to someone who had hadn't worked before. Because i used to train police officers that just come out of the academy. Well i'm for it. And i i didn't know may i've in the first two minutes of working moving and it could have been in the week or or it could be pain. Muscle kitting up and learning f. r. And tell them that was original and wanna hear any throws about my paypal. You had to say that again and again every shift i worked with people that army and any other occupation. Where you do that. But i had to do that. What finally made you decide to leave from me. towards enormous darkness. We found piteous anxiety and depression so throughout the i was told to leave for a lot of the people that are working to get out. You know used stuff that you don't belong. Because i do speak. I'm the one that calls it out all the time. Each and every time placer used to looking at black people don't want used to work and we will and when we do get in these jobs We know that way. The targeted by and for us to actually walk into a playstation is a way as call them. what spicer's and it could be any. Any what spice. It's cultural cypher. Us and usually we have tactics and strategies to get us in that door. So we've mine art time we've my children few years ago. Working move are more organizations and they'd ring me up saw anxious and crying. I'd have to kick them on fire and get them in that frontal and a lot of us have that tactic and strategy and it's not normal but it sound normal which is really sad and i implore other other place officers. Whatever rice you out but in particular aboriginal in terms of our own among other places that are prior to me and after may speak up. You're not going to be in travel. Routes your story in. If you're honest you can't get a wrong so speak up. Talk about being a part of a quiet about one thing that comes across his how much khan s you bore to your all. Despite all of the challenges that were thrown at you just one example is is light new career when you pulled over a middle aged woman who was driving either. The place what happened. There's report leur or norm at the time. We suspected shoes drink drove presumptuous quarter radical narrowed when we put arriver. She told me that her shoes on her way to care facility that our hospitals in and she'd just received a phone call that he was going to pass any minute so awful why she needs to be there. Crews we've aboriginal families are still worst door on alarm. Yes so. I drive her who they might turn choice. She got there safely and drive. We've spayed and she was in for a good ride hang on dialing pattern of following since she got. Yeah she got there and she ended up center mcadam flowers and thank me for it and they're the ones trump are allowed us to go to bed jobs but they're the ones that are really grodin forward and actually forgot about it and then when the flowers and cab climate reminded me of. When did you start writing. A book like employ. When did that begin. our remember. That die repeatedly fiddly. It was the third of november. Two thousand eleven. It was seat. I before i was medically discharged on for juries replacing an And it was a setback pain. Lord invested ten years of my life wearing that uniform and fat lakos losing a family the family. They probably didn't feel that. May yes. So i started documenting and we've more patriots day in depression. I was losing a lot of my memory and apparently was called trauma amnesia. What memory or did have started talking mention and before too long and had a bookstore for memories. Have you kids read the book. Mildest one nacre sh. They opponents of them they did the launch the official launch in melbourne. And they're the only ones set of read The other two children ready yet lavar children to ensure that the their partners they do or they need to be there to get this to comfort and found that a lot of people that are waiting. I felt like i feel like a nurturing them whilst they rating it but paypal nate remembers that as much as it's my story it's mike jordan story that will write property. We've me for this book but nine dot children are really proud of me and when your children thank you for being a good parent and a an excellent mom. You've done your job. The books come out on the thirtieth anniversary of the royal commission into aboriginal deaths in custody given your experience in saw the police system. What do you think it's gonna take for things to change our the government Still prime minister morrison have that conversation with parents who have brain affected boy in custody. Every aboriginal family has been affected boy an abrupt custody. My family included. Yes so truly up. Soon we've had four am seventy four deaths in custody since the royal commission recommendations were handed down and all of the recommendations that were implemented a lot of them. Sir afterward the funded so in the last five weeks who've had five aboriginal deaths in custody or so-called australia and so whilst we support those families and we agree with the families yeah in it's it's relentless. It's i've burien mark always growing and i find that really as well your dad. Jonah has been such a strong thread throughout your life. Hells he doing now. and what's he make. If you think the book that allows me no matter what. I'm here was a bit upset when i got out of the place but i'm real quick. You keep throwing him challenges. Yeah he's horrible. Namdar misfiring also heenan lives for myself my husband so the care and support and protection and security that he provided me when i was growing up. I'm now doing it back to him and your family is going on as you said. Roddick the beginning you. You're the grandma told me about these. Little grandkids are twins. Non modern near on their code our christian language name as well which is really good United they precious and but by grandma lip to live to say this now. We will statistics starring young. And all that sire so need to start looking at my house. I'm staying here for bit longer. And i think our loved of these greenwich more than my children. Sorry refer to them. I sided there my by abuse. And anchors form that lame nearby on. It's such an honor to meet you in historic. Thank you so much for being my guest on cumbersome thank you sir. Thank you for having me. You've been listening to a podcast of conversations with sarah can ski for more conversations interviews head to the website i they say dot net slash conversations. Discover more great. Abc podcasts live radio any exclusives on the abc. Say listen app.

ronnie queensland police force Ronnie victoria melbourne veronica gory curnow rone cahan Grenell gary knell harry munro dr andrew Franken mark bundy marlin Ramar roy smalley gramma mark Brian flyer
Boxing and Crime: The Kinahan Saga

Stuff They Don't Want You To Know Audio

56:48 min | 4 months ago

Boxing and Crime: The Kinahan Saga

"Have you heard the stories of the party man. He's a local legend in los angeles and supposedly for scores of people. Going missing from griffith park over the past few decades but if you ever see his misshapen melting face or hear the high pitched noise. That accompanies him. It might already be too late. What is the truth behind his origins. And what happens when the story you go looking for wines of finding you instead find out on searching for putty man listen to searching for demand on the iheartradio app apple podcasts. Or wherever you get podcast join me. Chelsea ersan unseasoned three of my podcast dear young rocker tune in to hear some of my favorite musicians tell stories from their awkward musical beginnings reconnect with the teenager. They used to be and remember what it's like to fall in love with your favorite band for the first time listened to your young rocker season. Three starting april seventh on the iheartradio app apple podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcasts from. Ufo's psychic powers and government conspiracies history is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn the stuff. They don't want you to know a production of iheart breeding. Hello welcome back to the show. My name is matt. Knoll is on an adventure today. Day called me ben. Shapiro joined as always with our super producer. All mission control dhec. And most importantly you are you. You are here. That makes this stuff. They don't want you to know matt. Today's episode is a follow up on an earlier listener. Mail segment for Few weeks ago a minute years ago. What what year is it. Who knows i. I have no idea what's happening where we are when it is. It's all good. We talked about this previously. I would i would outside Yesterday and actually had to go somewhere. And i felt just like robin williams in gemology and he's here suit. He was always hugh was was was very much here. Suit larry man so in this listener mail segment. You and i learned about a enormous ongoing controversy concerning the sport. Science of boxing and a person named daniel canan. Daniel canan is an irishman who currently lives in dubai. He is a. He wants to be a boxing promoter and he's got a lot of influence in the world of boxing a multiple levels the world of what could be described as combat sports. I think would be more accurate. He is also widely. How i say. This is widely suspected to be the head of an international crime ring. Sort of like a Maybe not quite on the level of pablo escobar. You know who pretty much control the country at one point but It is like an alternate reality version. Of what would happen if pablo escobar got into boxing in a big way in today's episode We're taking a closer look at this story as the darker side of boxing overall. And yes folks we. We know what you're thinking. wait boxing. Two guys beating each other in a way that can lead to permanent injury. What could be more wholesome than that. What do you mean. Dark side guys there. Anything wrong with that sport home dude. That is that's a whole episode to talking about the the lasting effects of the sport of boxing in particular all combat sports boxing in particular due to the nature of the gloves in the trauma that happens to the head constantly american football as well. I think it was Did you Work on that video with us about concussions. i did. I made that video made video. Okay yeah. I think you made that video. And i was just sort of there if you wrote a lot of the stuff that jason jason hoke who formerly was head of content here or ahead of continent stuff media. Yeah he does the voice over. I can't even remember all this stuff done anymore. No no but it's it's a serious thing like the loan but there's all kinds of other damage that can be done with it so it. There's already a a serious danger to it for anyone participating but it also appears like there is a serious danger to people. On the periphery and people who are running some some of the show here and before we really dive in we wanna make it clear that we personally understand the that there is an art to this pursuit. There is a science. This is not. This is not the episode. Where matt and ben just dunk on boxing and the sport itself. We're actually yeah. I think I enjoy watching it and trained just a little bit with it back in the day but matt you you out now love boxing right. Boxing has a very special place in my heart. Because my father. And i used to watch it together. We had showtime in there. Was you showtime. Always would have special fights like regular fights that would come on. We would also back in the late ninety s. When we were hanging out a lot together we would watch like evanger holyfield. Go up against somebody. We've watched the tyson fight So yeah there's a special place in my heart for it and i. I did a lot of like you know karate and stuff. When i was a kid so i was really into the like the strikes the actual strikes. And what does it look like. And how do you avoid. How do you evade yeah. I'm very much into the science of it and actually been you. And i have discussed before this little inside baseball. We have discussed going into some ma style training right before the quarantine occurred still very much on though. I mean yeah we can go. We can skip the crop mugabe. I've definitely down to do whatever training. You're into ben and so if your gym out there in atlanta and you're interested in hey we we want in if it's safe same and the reason i i should be clear matt. I am not saying categorically. No krav maga. I just think we should work our way up to it. I'm down throw me in the deepen. Let's do it. Let's do it. Yeah shots you for having showtime as a kid fancy baby. We had showtime. I thought as a child. I thought that was for like sheiks and billionaires showtime shoot. I won't even go into skin amax because we had that too. I learned a lot from pay for. Tv stuff has this has the. I don't know whether there's a statute of limitations here. So paul take this out please. if i'm skirting legal lines. But i can't be the only person who found how to found out how to make those Cable descramblers black boxes right. That was a whole new. A whole new era for me. I don't know what you're talking about bin now all right. I know what we're supposed to be talking about. That's boxing specifically this controversy. So here are the facts right now as we record. There is a fight brewing to fights in fact The date of these fights remains unannounced. As does the venue but the insiders in those in the know believe it may it may well end up. Being a fight held in the middle east. There are two boxers. Anthony joshua tyson fury. Who are doubtlessly going to be familiar to boxing. Fans in the audience today. Both of these men are straight up champions in their own right there legit must and so in this series of two bouts. The winner will become the first undisputed heavyweight champion in twenty years basically and not just has to do with all of the various organizations like deciding that this is the one person we're going to crown. This one person is there. Numerous organizations that deal with boxing. Where you know you. Can you can win a belt. Essentially leave for one organization and another person win heavyweight champion belt and another organization but this is like the one the unified. Yeah exactly there's kind of think of it like a pyramid shape of different organizations right. You fight you literally fight your way up to the top so now we are at the peak of the pyramid. Weird the capstone and this is. This is a huge deal especially for our friends across the pond on the other side of the atlantic. Both of these fighters are from england. And that is why a lot of fans a lot of pundits enthusiasts of the sports are calling it the biggest fight in british boxing. History it is to fights correct. I believe it's like they will fight once. Maybe one of them wins. They get to fight again just in case or you know just to settle the score at least attempt to and that's the one the second one is like the first one is a huge draw tons of money involved the second one will probably be even bigger. Oh yeah oh for sure. No matter what the outcome of the first one is the world will be watching the second bout just to give you a sense of their championships. Anthony joshua is the current W b i b f w and i b o champion tyson. Fury is the wc and the ring champion and our story today really starts with tyson. I would say with tyson fury. Oh yeah and let's talk about him. He's a fascinating character. Really really fascinate character. His we talked about on that previous episode just wa- watching his rise to fame and to the championship matches and everything. He's really interesting person. But in june of twenty twenty this guy tyson fury he went on instagram. I believe in. He publicly thanked a specific person. Man named daniel han one we mentioned at the top the pablo escobar allegedly pablo. Escobar style. Figure thanked him for his help and influence in organizing this huge set of fights and this simple call out to a name has led to a lot of strange things a lot of revelations really about perhaps this person's involvement in the sport. Yeah exactly so a side note. Quick correction which i thought was hilarious and a little bit disorienting for all of us in that listener mail segment. We talk about tyson. Fury's moniker right and is kind of like public persona that people have of him He has been called the gypsy king That's that's the name that they've used an of course. That's problematic term. But that's what people call him. And that led us to conjecture whether or not he was possible in inspiration for brad. Pitt's character in the amazing film snatch which still holds up and so brad. I owe you a personal apology. As because i said something like look. He's an amazing actor. That is true. It had to come from somewhere though. So could it have been tyson fury that is probably not true unless fury is even more bad ass than we've ever imagined because he was twelve years old. When statue came out and other distressing news the disorienting part snatch is about twenty one years old now or will be this year in. It remains amazing. It is still one of my favorite movies so good. So but honestly if you're gonna watch snatch watch lock stock. I because it's just as good if not. I don't know if not better there. You have always been a combo meal to me. You know what i mean. Yeah sure absolutely you gotta you gotta see the guy ritchie universe. Yes so that. That's a quick correction on our part as we said time has been a little funding for us recently. But anyhow so what's the big deal boxers a i i would see world famous athletes. In general have a ton of france they have entourage's know a great many people can han- you see is no ordinary. Boxing promoter he. We wanna say at the beginning. He has no convictions at all as a he has a squeaky clean record if his record were If his criminal record where he kitchen floor you could eat off of it. There is nothing however he is wanted for questioning in three different places in europe and in two thousand eighteen. An irish high court claimed that he is in addition to being a fan of boxing. A senior figure in quote organized crime on a global scale So furious public shout out there on social media which would seem to be like a kite of ephemeral thing. No post with your friends. This led to a lot of Controversy and outrage in the irish press and in the irish government. Yeah i it certainly did and that that group there is the cahan cartel. At least that's how it's referred to by the garda in a couple of other international crime-fighting organizations and again it's a long history and we can we can. We're going to talk about it here in a moment. But you're right that that quick little shoutout it just has some effects. The government in ireland expressed a lot of what's called outrage in many of the publications. The papers the you'll read. They're coming out of ireland. They call it outrage over canine's role as fury's adviser you know saying things like again. It's like just being publicly outraged. Right like oh. We can't believe this is absolutely unacceptable. This is tragic and they're warning that the reputation to you know boxing. This thing that we hold so dear in clubs around the country and around the world they're going to be sullied. The reputations are going to be sullied by this with a guy who has been known to engage in quote activities which are completely and utterly unacceptable. And it's a tough thing morally to talk about something like this and it's a whole discussion you can get into. Is boxing as a sport. Moral you know. Is there a morality there are we talking about are we getting into the old days of gladiators is that. It's often compared to that. You're you're you know win. Philosophical discussions occur around that sport in any other combat sport but the activities which are completely and utterly unacceptable are terrible things murders in drug running and gun smuggling in all kinds of activities. So it's it's both weird to think of. You know a country being outraged that this kind of person is involved with a sport. That has an underbelly of a black market in betting but it is true that it is outrageous that those things are occurring and somebody could be involved A good point in singapore. There's a lot of money on the line as well which as we will see. Fundamentally alters the equation. you're absolutely right. It's no secret that boxing has its share of a unsavory characters and corruption and real life conspiracies in the form of financial shenanigans and fixed bouts. Plenty but so again. What's the big deal about kin eoghan after all. Let us stop. Forget here in the united states. Boxing promoter don king once literally stopped a man to death and it was his employees by the way he stopped. He killed someone that worked for him by stepping on them. And that did not hurt mike. Tyson's career one bit. You know what i mean. That didn't hurt other people's careers and don king went on to continue working. Kim han as we will come defined is a bit of a different case. We'll tell you why after a word from our sponsor it's crazy how much we have to pay for outdated impersonal healthcare and even crazier that we all just accept it. It's time to face facts. 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Nineteen but healthcare and equities lack of access and backseat. Hesitancy are hurdles. We need to overcome in order to vaccinate the american people. I'm host robin roberts. And in covid nineteen immunity in our community. A new podcast series from iheartradio and the us department of health and human services. We're going to hear. From americans. On the frontlines many of whom were uncertain about the vaccines and the facts that convinced him to roll up their sleeves get vaccinated each episode will pair one guest journey with information from our country's top medical experts to make sure that you and your loved ones have all that you need to make an informed decision about the co vaccines listen to kobe. Nineteen immunity in our community on the iheartradio app apple podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcast we can do this. Do you love boxing. But hate the uncertainty of your hard earned money going the wrong way on a bet tariff. That's the worst part about. 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Oh wow that's so affordable. I haven't even thought about kids yet. This is gonna be craig so. Don't delay download fix a fight today. A subsidiary of elimination global unlimited excite is illegal application and cannot be used in the following sports boxing water polo football american football synchronized swimming pole. Vaulting mixed martial podiatrist mixed martial arts martial ping pong using this app triggers immediate investigation by authorities as well as association with organized. I fixed my wallet with fix a fight and you can't too. Here's where it gets crazy all right. Let's just ask is. Daniel can hand an irish bar well to answer that question. Then we have to go all the way back to nineteen seventy seven. When big dan has sometimes called was born is the son of a man named christie. Can eoghan who is arguably the most interesting person in this story than if you if you want you can really research that guy fascinating story. Kristy can happen. That's father dan or daniel currently resides in the united arab emirates. As far as anyone can guess do by the city there. The we've discussed before and this thing called it's always referred to as the cap kind of like the guy. I guess in a way but not really more like the fbi is ireland's criminal assets bureau. They claim that daniel canan controls and manages this thing that they referred to as the kinison organized. Crime group sounds very official. The media has dubbed it. The canan cartel. It's what we've mentioned earlier in this episode and this cartel or this group they believed to have been founded by the father of daniel canan christie can also known as the dapper dawn. Yes this is because of his pensioned for panama hats in cool suits so the authorities in ireland believe that this canan family this organization actively smuggles firearms and drugs into ireland the united kingdom and the rest of europe. It is true that christie can eoghan has in the past Been convicted of crimes related to this these sorts of pursuits. But if you ask the authorities that didn't stop him from continuing this career they believe the can hand cartel is huge with connections ranging as far afield as the middle east where daniel can happen is now to asia and all the way to south america. Yeah we're we're talking. Russian involvement all kinds of countries across the globe can united nations of crime. The irish government believes that daniel can han essentially inherited the family. Banana stand whatever reference. Who wanna make a himself has successfully. He's in his early forties. He has successfully avoided being a murdered by rival organizations. Which definitely attempted to kill him. One time famously attempted to kill publicly publicly and he is also avoided being thrown in jail but despite this his name is indelibly attached to the most infamous gang feud in modern irish history. It's like what you if you are in ireland you you wake up and dublin. You read the morning paper. You see the name canan. This is the first thing you're going to think about that's right. it's a drug viewed. It's called the hutch hand feud that's at least how it's referred to and it's a conflict that is the canan organized crime group or the cartel versus the sink called the hutch gang and there's a person gerry hutch g. e. r. y. Hunch who in particular is supposed to be the one kind of running the show in the hutch family and there's again there's a large organization there. It's not some you know. Small time thing and there are many many shootings multiple shootings that have occurred in dublin and spain. That are very high profile. There was a death toll so far at least i think the count right. Now's around twenty or more but least eighteen to twenty victims. Deaths that have occurred because of this feud and there's something like sixty arrests. I think in honestly is weird because a lot of how this has been playing out ends up in what they consider the tabloids in ireland in other parts of the united kingdom. And it's hard to tell what's fully occurring in the background. Maybe that isn't being written about in the papers right. Eso the irish reporting the irish reporting will stays on this and the recent events have renewed interest. In the future. i would say Irish authorities never stopped thinking about this and you make a really good point about what we would consider tabloid papers in the uk reporting on on these events. Because you know it's got the sensationalist stuff that that is fantastic for readership right for ad getting getting attention there. but how. How accurate are they being. Versus how speculative or sensational would be a better word. And i don't mean to throw any of those publications under the bus. I would just say from our end here in the states is difficult to maybe parse. Sometimes what's you know like what's coming out of the publication belfast versus. What's coming out of thing that is sometimes considered a tabloid. Yeah exactly and so. The feud that began in two thousand fifteen murder of gary hutch. Was jerry hutches. Nephew continues today. The most infamous of these events is probably the regency who tell shooting of what he's sixteen when people who were trying to assassinate daniel kenna and ended up fatally shooting an associate of the cartel named david byrne this this is like cinematic. It's a movie level altercation. People are dressed as law enforcement One guy dresses as a woman to other people. I think it shots but burn is the is the only fatality and this gets a lot of coverage in the news. Because it's such a crazy story and matt. I love the point you made. We said okay. These numbers might be a little bit tricky. Because we don't we don't know how much stuff went on. That never made it to the to the media right or never made it to the authorities in just in this incident and we did talk about it before. And then you're doing a great job describing their i. It's just important to know that it's taking place at a way in for a boxing match. That's when this thing goes down there in a hotel you can see video. That's occurring of the official. The fighters are up there. Some of them you know. They've got their shirts off. They're like posing for the pictures and then some sound start occurring out in the lobby of the hotel. People are running for their for their lives. There's a video you can see where there's a child at one point rushing out of one of these back. Entrances seeing dad. What was that dad. What was that like crying. It's it's it's awful to actually watch some of it and you're right. That was the clash of clans. Which was more we'll get into. We'll get into why this event in particular was a blow to kenna hans boxing career Which i think it's fair to call boxing career so obviously all of this context all of this background eighties. No surprise that when members of the irish public read the name in the news. They're way more likely to think of gangland murders than they are of boxing. Matches at this. They'll probably think of boxing too. But it'll be a the second thing. They of a canan seemed set for a number of years to reinvent his image finke of don't think of me as associated with crime. Think of me is associated with boxing. I'm going to be a big player in the world of boxing and he's been successful in that regard especially in the middle east Just last year and twenty twenty. He was appointed as a special adviser for k. h. k. Sports air bahrain and in may of last year he finally spoke to the public. You should his first public statement on anything since two thousand sixteen since the events at the regency hotel during the clash of clans. And he said it is an honor for me to work with his highness sheikh khalid bin hamad al khalifa. Mr mohammed khalid in the entire team at k. h. k. sports cage case. Sports has made an impressive mark on the world of combat sports and has fantastic ambitions to grow into a global powerhouse. I look forward to working with the team to realize these dreams and further build bahrain combat sports into a globally recognised presence seems pretty legit spiffing. Yeah i mean it's without that context. This is a pretty innocuous polish statement. It sounds exactly like what you're supposed to say when you get a pretty prestigious job like this. You're an adviser to someone who is legally called his highness. That's wild you know what i mean. That is the upper echelon right there. But they're opposing opinions about this about like can ends never been convicted. So could you even say he's quote unquote turning over a new leaf Could you say that. This is not legitimate. Somehow there are two really divided camps about about this guy. One group absolutely supports them including boxers themselves. Reporters have asked plenty of boxers about cahen and they get these positive answers with people saying things like you know. He's a friend of mine. everybody trust him. Everybody respects him also add. He's being unfairly. Treated the press say is out to get him but people also pres his connections and you know in his defense. This is not something that suddenly happened in. Come out of the blue. Daniel kinderman has been into boxing years and years and years in two thousand twelve. He set up a company that was at the time called. Mgm boxing they're the they're the group that was running the wayan at the regency in twenty sixteen For their event the clash of clans has a weird historical coincidence right that there would be a clan war at the clash of the glance thoroughly. That was the flashpoint. Yeah that's interesting and that brand. Mgm boxing and all of the gyms associated with it. And the you know the promotions it changed names in what is probably it was definitely a pr move. It was rebranded as mtv k global which that empty case needs were mack the knife by the way and they cut ties with its founder. Daniel daniel k. At least officially they cut ties with the founder publicly. They did that. And this is all in an attempt to get rid of the stigma or to try and avoid the stigma that came with that clash of clans incident and in the ensuing gang war. Yeah exactly the issue. Is that that stat attempts to cut ties didn't work as well as they had hoped in stigma with mt k. And organize crime still still remains And now let's go the other group the people who think this guy's definitely drug lord a crime lord irish authorities a huge swath of the irish media buying this boxing promotion narrative. They argue that despite not ever been convicted of anything can eoghan took control of the from his father about five or six years ago because the dapper don wanted to retire and that now daniel can ahead himself directly controls. Please a leading role in a cartel. That's doing billions of euros of dollars worth of business across three continents and while racking up an enormous body count in the process which to me means that If any of this is true you can say one thing about can hannah boxing. He's not in it for the money baby right like he. He doesn't seem like a guy's really sweat in the water bill. Yeah it's weird 'cause when you're that close to boxing we talked about this before. There's so much money to be made on on the level with a boxing match with betting that is sanctioned with the actual winnings with all the money you make it a big event in person or on paper view. There's a ton of money to be made up here and there so much more money to be made down here in in the off books bedding or just in the darker side of the bidding world so we may be in it for the money to run part of this business but he doesn't need it personally right. Yeah i think. I got myself into a weird spot cognitively because ordinarily i like it i like knowing when someone is Not in in something. Purely for financial gain because that means on some level they care about it in a way that cannot be quantified and typically those that kind of motivation results in better work more more passion by yet. You're absolutely right. You are absolutely right. And authorities believe that can hans ability to duck the law so well and so often comes down to what they describe as meticulous planning and keeping an absolute minimum number of people in the know about business ventures dude and. We didn't even really get into christie's background too much. Like i said fascinating read. I think he learned from the best. That's why if daniel is in fact this mob leader. He's good at it. Because he learned from his father his father went to prison for quite a while and ended up earning two degrees. While he was imprisoned. He even gave up the opportunity to leave prison early early because he wanted to finish a degree while he was in there. He allegedly owns hundreds of millions of dollars worth of properties in many places allegedly. I haven't actually seen property deeds or anything like that but you know we're talking like five hundred million dollar home in one place. One hundred and sixty million dollar home in another place like multiple properties so many properties in ireland. that guy. the father was very good at what he was doing in apparently very good at hiding money and travel and keeping operations at secret and he is alive right now as we record. He is happily retired in spain. The father that is yes. Yeah there. There is a strong indication that i like the way you put it that. He learned from the best and people believe cracked the code. Detective superintendent david gallagher from the national drugs and organized crime bureau of ireland walked through the hierarchy of the gang of the organization in court and he said they have this structure. It's very clever. It's kind of thing you know you. And i would do probably i. They've said sells the everybody's organized into these cells and their structured such that if an operation goes wrong or someone tries to turn into an informant which irish media calls turning tout by the way. I thought that was so cool. If someone does try to snitch they will literally not have the information they need because they'll only know about their part of the of the web right they're part of the process will the it's structured if somebody from that sub cell is seeking information specific information from higher up the an incredibly suspicious thing. And you yeah i. It's a way to root out people who may have turned out. Yes it's true. It works both ways so authorities also maintain that Yes the organizations move toward the world of boxing maybe real legitimate actually has happened but that doesn't mean that it's also not still a crime ring. That's that's basically their argument. They're making that face in court that matches mate so there you have it. This story has some updates that will get to at the end of the show but first let's take a break for word from our sponsor and then we'll come back to talk just a little bit about boxing and crime in general where there is a great deal of stuff. They don't want you to know pay. It's comedians nikki. Glaser i have a new podcast with my best friend and roommate. Andrew collin andrew. You got no you let me speak. Sometimes i look in the mirror. And i go. You're thirty six year old woman living with your best friend. Laconically and How did you get here. Thanks him no what to do that. Doing aniston wasn't i wouldn't have heard. Let's hear aniston deniro. The face i get more into character podcasts. And they can't see that you look like deniro barely sounds like it. We're having a blast over at the nikki. glaser podcasts. So the big money players network. And i heart radio monday through thursday and friday kind of monday through thursday so not every day but most listened the nikki. Glaser podcast on. Iheartradio app apple podcasts. Or wherever you listen to podcasts. Dear young rocker dear young rocker dear young rocker. Join me chelsea orson for season. Three of my podcast. Dear young rocker tune in to hear some of my favourite musicians tell stories from their awkward musical beginnings. I had never met anybody who also enjoyed scott. You've learned a few chords reconnect with the teenager. They used to be so young rocker. Try if you can to not worry so much and remember what it was like to fall in love with the band for the first time you will never forget the first time you heard. Prince the cranberries led zeppelin the cure new order bikini. Kill brat. mobile heavens to betsy dear. Young rocker season three comes to you from double elvis iheartradio and as executive produced by jake brennan of jesus graceland listened dear young rocker season. Three starting april seventh on heart. Radio app apple podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcasts all right we are back and we are jumping into boxing and crime in general a little bit of corruption little side of corruption There's an outlet called journal dot e. It's actually really great. You should check it out if you can. There's a lot of cool reporting in in their about boxing. Just as the sport in this topic in general. Here's a quote from them. The sport and business of boxing has been infiltrated by criminal elements for the best part of two decades. The potential to earn large amounts of cash into rub shoulders with the famous at around. The world proved alluring for ireland's top criminals. Now this makes sense. If you've ever. I'm gonna take two instead of boxing. But it's it's it's not the same thing right from the sport from a science perspective from the sport itself but in the events boxing. Mma are very very very similar if you look at something that you have c. puts on a big pay per view show of. Let's say something that happened. Not long ago of conor mcgregor's fighting and before of course quarantine and all of the coronavirus implementations where there's nobody in the audience when you look at one of these big matches down at the front right near the ring there are going to be celebrities and powerful individuals many times faceless powerful individuals those who don't show up in the newspaper all the time. You don't recognize them when they're faced flashes across but that person in that audience may be extremely powerful. Yeah absolutely you get access and and access is a extremely valuable thing so to react to that claim. What do we say. Well yes the israel for numerous reasons. Boxing as a sport has a long association with crime and it also has just the way it structure. It has a great potential. Be exploited and corrupted. I mean think about it right i i still. I always think. When we spoke with brian to boxing in particular you have a very small set of what we can think of. His players primarily the two boxers but we also have just a few officials right and you know a fight can be one based on a decision by those losers officials so if any one of those people is convinced to take a dive or their bribed to go one way or another with a decision. Then it can be extraordinarily difficult to prove. The fight was fixed. Which means if you wanna get into that business you have to rule sources of revenue. Now you can generate a ton of money through gambling and rigged outcomes. You can also launder a ton of dirty money because it's gambling so what's not to love like it makes sense to me I've never fixed a boxing match. But i can see the appeal for certain certain people in the industry and we're part about. It is for fans of boxing boxers. You're probably much better off now than you were in the nineteen fifties when boxing was greasy. Dirty like the. Us senate investigated boxing. There's a there's a cool site. We found called the ring that has knee anecdote that i really think puts us in perspective. Sure here is the very era that many recall. As one of the sports true golden ages was so brazenly filthy and infested with gangsters and other near dwells that the january thirty first thousand nine hundred fifty. Five issue of sports illustrated concluded an investigative piece on the state of the sports. With the sentence. Boxing today is a national scandal in today. National scandal back in the nineteen fifties. So we often note the relationship between large amounts of money and corruption in multiple industries. Right in everything from investment banking to reality. Tv the stock market the stock market. Of course even without considering the case specifically turns out. Boxing is no different in. That is a crying. Shame because boxers you know the actual people not the industry surrounding them are working. Their keystones off to be the best athletes they can possibly be as we said earlier. There's there's a pretty compelling argument to make. The boxing is as much a science in some sense as it is a sport but you could say that there are two fights for every bout one is the fight between the people in the ring and the other is the fight the ongoing fight that legitimate athletes and fans of the sport have against incredibly powerful forces that seek to poison the game. They love as we draw to a close here. You know matt. Obviously we have to point out at this juncture. There's been no accusation. That can han himself is attempting to rig this The world's most important upcoming boxing match and in fact ireland is so scandalized by his involvement. That no one's really bothered to float the possibility of him fixing a match or ask how likely that might be. Given statements of industry professionals. Nath leads it seems like people in that industry. A lot of people overwhelmingly trust him so there there. We find kind of the the morality that we were talking about it the top. You know i get the sense. I don't know if you feel this way. But i get the sense that People believe can eoghan regardless of what else he does Probably holds the sport in very high esteem and would react pretty adversely. I think it would be offended if people said. Hey you're gonna fix this match right and he doesn't regardless what you believe. He doesn't seem like the kind of person you would want to offend. No no i mean it. Just because of his power in the sport right doesn't matter if he's associated with any organized crime and he his word means something generally in again. Here's another quote just went talking about his connections within the sport itself outside of anything else here it is This is a source that said it's harder to find a boxer not linked to cahan then one who is. He dominates the boxing world. Everyone knows it himself. As well as the organization that he's allegedly involved with and the hutch gang that is at odds with the the cahan cartel. It is weird to look at events and the social media feeds of popular boxers and enemy fighters. It is weird to see these characters show up in self fees. They show up in behind the scenes photographs of training. It does feel like there's a real connection there although if you're not in the garda garda if you're not in the fbi or whatever. Whoever whatever organizations are investigating organized crime groups like that it's tough to know whether any of it is real whether just because they're associated pictures just because they're ringside just because they you know own a gym. Some organization owns a gym where important fighters train. It doesn't necessarily mean that everybody's in on the same game but the connections in the associations it's tough to to miss yes well said well said for a deeper look at the canadian case of do check out the excellent bbc panorama documentary. We talked about earlier. they argue. that can eoghan. Regardless of his current associations past present companies continues to influence individual boxers in players in the industry on a personal level. Like he's he is embedded in this in this enterprise in such a way that it's very difficult to take him out of it you know. Also research reports for march argued. That kid ahead might be branching out to soccer football for the rest of the world through the actions of his former company. mt k. But that's kinda sticky because again officially he cut ties and as the outcry over fury and can hans association. Grew fury ended up distancing himself from kennedy had with canadiens blessing by the way the way. It's portrayed it's got big mafia vibes the way they the way they talk about it. You know it does but a lot of that might just be the reporters. That's that's another part of it so there. We are folks. The world of boxing the world of crime the saga of daniel. Canan the callahan family. What do you think again. This is a fascinating story for us but we keep coming back to the fact that you know this guy has never been convicted of any You know what. I mean and do you. Is it fair to judge the sudden by the sins of the father. I don't i don't know if it is. I don't think it is but at the same time. There are dedicated law enforcement officers. Investigators who believe that this is what's happening. this is the thing in. There has been a ton of bloodshed here in lives ruined and destroyed in a tough situation. But it's really hard to because as a fan of of combat sports. Like i wanna i wanna still be able to watch. Boxing matches in fights and stuff in it depending on how deep this corruption is. Maybe i shouldn't wanna do that. But dang it. If i if i don't wanna tune in dude since the ever since the ultimate fighter i can't get enough of these things and i don't know why i don't know i don't know if just some deep thing inside of us as humans that enjoy that the stakes of having to people like locked in a cage the half the battle with each other. Maybe there's something deep deeply in our nature about that in my nature released. I don't i don't want. I don't want it to go away because it's corrupt now is a tough one. We'd love to know what you think about. All of that stuff agreed. Yeah let us know people who are familiar with the story. People who were familiar with the sport we'd like to hear from you and we try to make it easy to find us online. Yeah that's right. You can find us on twitter and facebook where we are conspiracy stuff on instagram. We are conspiracy stuff. If you wanna find us personally. A benz got twitter and instagram. Don't think that's true. Yes the rumors are true. You can find me at ben. Bullen h. As w on twitter the longtime listeners. Hfs w means you can also find me on instagram where i am named in a burst of creativity at beden boland. Bmw l. i. n. How about you met you know sometimes. Sometimes you you tell us about online and then sometimes dope. I know this not going to what i am going to say. Though is the first time i ever met the founder of that thing called h. W that you just mentioned. I was on the set of a video called how boxing works right And it was the first time. I got to be dp or run. Run the camera. Essentially be the videography on on a set and it was great we shot with an actual thinki- became a champion. When we when we were shooting with him this boxer he had just won some competition. I can't remember what it was but he was incredible anyway. So we're we're weird thing for studio. Are we becoming sentimental vic. So elder podcast age. Well if that's the case then hurry up. Get to us before we before we expire. Hopefully of natural non boxing related causes. If you don't care for social media you can call us directly. We have a phone number one eight. Three s. t. d. w. y. T k three minutes. Those three minutes belong to you Tell us whatever is on your mind we do ask you that you include the following things was your name or a sick nickname and let us know we can use your voice. Our story on the air. Tell us what's up. Give us ideas for new episodes. And if there's something personal that you wanna just tell you know keep between you and our team and that's fine. Just throw it in at the end but most importantly do not censor yourself if you have a story that doesn't fit in three minutes. Then tell us the whole thing right it out since neil we read every email we get you can find us Whether you are in the ring or out outside of the ring at our good old fashioned email address where we are conspiracy at iheartradio dot com stuff. They don't want you to know is a production of iheartradio for more podcasts. From iheartradio visit the iheartradio app apple podcasts. Or wherever you listen to your favorite shows if you like true crime check out the new podcast good. Assassins hunting the butcher part spy story. Part detective case. It's the true tale of a secret mission to hunt down a savage nazi murderer and assassinate him the goal to send a message to all the not between other around the world. We can find you written from paris to rio and beyond hunting. The butcher brings this to life using interviews with former spies and testimony from witnesses to the crimes delving deeply into the pulse pounding undercover operation. Who's another reason for the mission. It's something that. I found almost unbelievable. Part of history. That seems so bizarre to me. That couldn't have been real but in nineteen sixty. Four israelis decided that. Herbert sucres had to die. Listen to good assassins hunting. The butcher on the iheartradio app apple podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcast join the hunt. Hey guys it's bobby bones. I host the bobby bones show. And i'm pretty much always sleepy because i wake up at three o'clock in the morning a couple of hours later on my friends together we get into a room and we do a radio show. What's your alive. We tell our stories. We try to find as much good in the world that we possibly can and we looked through the news of the day that you'll care about also your favorite country. Artists are always stopping by to hang out and share their lives and music too. So wake up with a bunch of my friends. I ninety eight point. Seven w. mcu in washington dc or wherever the rotates you on the iheartradio app.

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Veronica Gorrie stands up

Conversations

51:02 min | 3 months ago

Veronica Gorrie stands up

"This is an abc podcast. My guest don't conversations. Today is veronica gory. Ronnie is a good ni- curnow woman. The traditional owners of gibbs in victoria quite a few years back now ronnie was listening to the radio and the station was holding a father's day competition. You had to send a letter explaining why your dad should be father of the year so ronnie wrote in describing her dad and how much he meant to her and she won ronnie's dad has been with her through a lot. He was there when her mom wasn't safe to be around. He was there when she gave birth to her earn babies and later when she escaped. Allah partner rone's dad was in the audience that proud day when she was inducted as a police officer in the queensland police force and he was there when that all fell apart ronnie's written a memoir of her childhood and her ten years in the queensland police force it's called black and blue and a warning that pot of ronnie story includes family violence hierarchy harasser. How good now. That's my introduction for you. Can you introduce yourself and tell me where you're from so woman janine neck dome after. I'm a proud woman Which is more traditional lanza tuna aced of melbourne and it's beautiful country and that language yo traditional. Who's been teaching you that. How long have you been speaking that sir. Our friend learning more language in the last iphone views. And it's actually language royal cruise on many of my ancestors wrong before me including my grandma now when they used to speak english. Our tour train float yes. Oh i'm language is really important for me and Yeah a lot of aboriginal people. What are some of the favorite words that you've been learning. What would you like. I'm sorry my language Grandmother our mother's mother brain's cocoon and armed. Yeah i love that word cahan. Because that's you now. Gone to greenwich. And i'm i'm trying to teach him language now while they're little sponges. When you're a little kid rodney. You lived in a victorian country town of more. Well what did you dad build for you in the backyard. I can be It was a tree house. Actually and other people's yards. We absolutely loved it. It was a high for us. We actually we were quite a bit. Tell me more about what your dad was like. As a young man was he into sport My father was an is an incredible man and was and still is but he played a lot of sports and cricket zeros football and towards the end after he was a believe hawthorn football club brooklyn to scout dead but in the janet dial watching human trying to draft him he unfortunately perkins leg. Yes sir that ended usefully career but he up empowering and that's where i got my love of sports and diagnostics much test match creek crooked and all that and more about his car. Why was he so proud of his cars. Your dad cruise for a black man to have a real and have a license back in those days. Was it's an amazing thing amazing feat and my father always had these vehicles and you know that he brought. We had earning money and and back in those days they had no st pats on the back site or in the front sight though which would fit so many of us. What what kind of car did he drive. What do you remember being squashed up in their homes and should should've kept rock for now. We'll be rich average. What about music. How big a pirated music. Plan your family. Armand goodness slam. Yesteryear listen to country and western lot and solemn music now because it takes me back to those times in my mom my mom. But i'm we've dead. He's listened to cat. Stevens and bob dylan the traveling robberies and all black music blackadder's so whenever we do their long road trips. It's you know seeing to this music all his songs all cds seeing within your family. I sun roof my brother. He's also a performer as well. My older brother and my little brother where all musicians can play instruments as well. So did you perform on stage. Earlier we had a family band But prior to that incidents. Like a little kid. I is old and dead bodies to go to restaurants or pubs and if there was a life ban might say my dad just happening be speaking to the band member and hit. Pay me fifty dollars to go up. Young's i to go sooner song. Yes i'm am. One of the one mind songs was on by credence. Clearwater revival was on who stop the rain. So that's one of my early memory. Good seeing that as an eight year old word for word. That's a big vocal range for a little kid so big lungs tonsils removed. I'm able to get to those round one time. You go to gig at a convention. You survived okay. Gyros about that chris. We all hear bad stuff about that. But these these This particular bar grill gross sired. Those are all siro Supportive of us really gentlemen. You know they are block black people and him up paid really well and what happens on the body tour and stays. It'll be a second book. Hey i can't remember anyway. I saw them that knowledge of music. Paid off for your brother years later when you two were in. The audience got sale of the century. What happened we're in those channahon studios back. When tiny bobber used to be the host of sale of the century and during their ad breaks charney would interfere interact with the audience and down. He would ask them axed audience true trivia questions and one of them he saddam. The next one's going to be an audio question and he played starbucks song. I had no idea what it was but my little brother. He would have been about four at the time. He put his hand up stri road at the entire three hours and he said that's whatever the sun was boy uncle on rose and we wanna big box of may donate mate pause. What about your brother. Was he happy. I was happy. Lift off the next mile. We're about steed your your dad's parents your grandparents live when you were a kid. Some my grandparents were born and raised on transmission and that sobat four and a half hours east of melbourne on the coast. And it's a beautiful location in now language. It's recalled that mission tires. I'm bonanza yes. So they were known as toys average permission now than irons lake. Charles trust but i'll born and raised here and lived there for majority of the life but when When dad was living in morrell sitting headline family. We've my mom and my kids. My grandparents moved tomorrow as well so thorough ways everyday of our niloy to day. How did you get on with your granddad house. Little girl And probably watch me now. Granted yes so how. I had a really special bond and historic. I never visit kid because grandad leave her lying and run child. And what were you doing. It could have got you flow. Goes generous right. I think i played well. Swearing putty mouth the f word and the f bomb. Yeah but never say maybe you know my parents be trying to trust me. Down will give me a flogging but greenwich labor learn. What kind of stories did he tell you. Ronnie all the old stories about growing up on a mission he's work or prior to make and lots of stories and neons and monitoring stories as well. He told you about being chased by a ghost. One time all is that we had earlier belay for the blue mountains. I'm gary knell language. maine's harry munro. Before and reckons. He was driving for the mountains and he was in the rear vision mirror nicer door. Chase him up the road would. He have driven fast to get away from that while he ran into did. But we know this is not true because brennan was the slowest driver ever. And there's evidence of this spending now actually. I think he's the ever to be put for dr andrew. Slow here man could've got up with him super-quick you know. Ruin your kidney. Joe how god granddad officer graduates of our pre one department that hero. Ria what would you to grammar as well. What would you do on on sundays. Down gonna church. Sunday was the best. I used to go dumped tip. Go to the tip. We'll have that. I'm becton the tape. In just rummage. Iran and for all the other people's waste and neil so many good things that people throwing away and astrid is really wasteful country So would come back with a car boot load for good staff and did your grandparents keep that at at a place. How helpful to the gills was your grandparents house. Franken mark grandfather was a hoarder down into the study of horrors watch those shows holders and it usually comes from that stems on where he had nothing growing up so as an when he grabbed things he just kept kept in a kept and kept so eventually. We had under barely walk around the house. What was school like for you as a little girl running. Screw our love school. I love learning every school. Zaps level could might get there I had really good teachers while you so your grandma out the window school. Yeah what was she doing. Morrison promise will the time out the window. And i wall black woman just rang. Passover no big balloon mahan. I'm bundy marlin reaches a sticker weapon. here insurance account to wire by all means struggle hit the teacher of my sister who had just given my sister the cain and she she was a force to be reckoned. Did that happen. Did she get that teacher. I have not heard honor. The outcome associate probably would have every kid's dream if they've gotten in trouble gotten strep from teacher is an avenging grandma to come in and take vengeance. It's fantastic time. We lived roy directly across road from school in my grandmother. Was there at the time my sister got kinda went home crying during school hours and then my grandmother took it upon herself to sort that out. Your grandma had had a really really tough time. As a kid she was stolen from the mission as a child taken to an orphanage in melbourne. Put out to work for watt families. What happened when she gave birth to your dad when she was a teenager. Ramar grandmother who are referred to as many. She was sixteen years old when she was pregnant. With my father and time she'll swimming in the abbotsford convent which institution forum more children at the time and to show near and she hid her pregnancy rod up shoes eight months. And when when i found out they moved to for House for expected spectate mullins and so when she reported turned They took the baby of her. That will really upsetting to right to hear like that's one of the traumas that we've been growing up. We've known my grandma story and my father's how did she get him back. Ronnie a so. She fought to for now four years and she wrote numerous letters to the boat to the aboriginal protectors and welfare to get her child back in nam if she wasn't such a storage raccoon we probably wouldn't be here are now and what did what was she tall by the white authorities that she had to do in order to to get her baby son back rest shoes torture to be married before she could get him back. And so we went back to the mission on a mission to fundamentally get married and looked at the winning proud that i have met harm of nanan granddad and my grandmother's roy smalley up all big smiles. More gramma mark grandfather looks miserable head to obligated to get married her but that will married for today shade away for forty years and and and did she get your dad back then. Once she'd she'd got married the way she was told she had to. Did your dad comeback and live with her continued and nor have one special letter that she wrote to the board and she's mentioned the died. She got married to sit seventeen for september. And and now can i have my son back. Plays and this went on for us. So for us ryder. She got my dad he was four was returned to the mission or yonder back to her. Does you dad remember that time. Did he remember those early. Hits your he does It's amazing how brain how far back we can remember. But he remembers going back to the mission and being bath boy a woman and that was the mission manager because on when the mission manager shoes to one that had to pick up dead from the the the group i mean it was in the first time that it was in Sushi lighter awesome. Dadan so help you. It was walking fast in boy. Rebound bright bright blue eyes and so she One team and arcs to the top team. Even she was she knew she was gone. My grandma and so. For that raisin the state put on my grandmother on probationary period on the proviso that dom she kept and looked after my father and the mission manager was on baffling. My father retire. Just to check forum bruising. Whatever and some aren't that she remembers paying for this one woman always with that risk that he might get taken away must have been having that fear to harm after that when bed was returned back to my grandmother and my grandfather when placing welfare turned up on the mission and out here. Because this roy come to go to well. My mission smoker probably five kilometer dirt road and you could hear it. He traffic coming from a model lie. So when i hear behooves. I knew it wasn't good because they all the kids which is scary off an abortion many times. My father ran hard behind bushes. And tommy set next to a smack in the stalled grandmother. Mervyn come back and get you. And that's what it is style there and set next to the snake. We haven't talked to bat. You'll mom rani had tough. Was it for you and your siblings. After you dad left and you guys were leaving with you. Yes are when all suffering numbered throughout when i was about seven and she will struggling financially And also like we're living in aboriginal housing and in proving the average community and my mom was a white woman and she must have found this terrorist hard and she was. She wasn't paying supported as well not be shoes single-parent now four children and prior to and she had this income that she relied on to pay the bills into referred. And then all of sudden it's gone and back in the dying when i was young with them. I mean what doesn't pension today or you know was endowment tie and shoes once a four seventies extols forearm she. She upped and left one not runny. What do you remember about that. Aren remember too much about that which is probably more more. Brian flyer to protect myself but are from my little brothers story. He he remembers it So when mom left apparently she packed up and leftover never sure man and She just abandon us and my little brother was running route crying. Chason is asfaw. Kids went to our grandparents place and we knew that we wanted crew. Some grandparents will hold. I had nice spice us kids. Southern here was for ten in there and women got a my grandma lettuce but we had wind up and telling what was happening and shouldn't retinas in and he has sorry. I'm at some sun. She's my some contact with ted cruz. We didn't i wait at that time. So she's made contact and said cambric. I'm the your children and our know-how only side there for like months but it could have been for six weeks. But i'm running to the door with my dad. So that's all i remember. You ended up leaving mainly with your dad. Then what was that like. Yes are always predominantly rise. Mama further 'cause wall stone like join mom and dad were together. I have a lot of memories of violence and alcohol and my mom satis my same. She was the main instigator She was very friendly. Volunteers my father. I'm so specially whilst on the tobacco and She's the best mother ensure cyber but when she was strangled system from person and so always feed my mother and so when mom and dad's were up and i ended up staying at that but my siblings went patently. The moment how did she feel about you. Leaving with your dad. Ronnie thinks she fed up retrial. Crews she was guy for so much and she. She needed the support from all the children. But also young. And i knew that it wasn't sipho made around her and i used to go see her And lacewood every three years. Or i i she was. She would subject to the same volunteers that she put my father for in with your dad and his girlfriend up to alice springs. When you're at high school. What did you wear to you new school on the first day ardent i wore a duff occurred in springs. Right not do that little sir hours rebelling are told my dad if you move me away from our. I'm never gonna take this away this school. And i actually didn't wear this could infamous wore out screen phone so i stood right little black girl overpaid duffle in the. Hey puerto degrees. But i'm narrowing down. It was a kelton stack blew. It was accounting tougher care and louder and now from an op shop prior Before leaving morale you definitely stood out so you want to go at. I had come to feel about you. Tom living or ended up lowering ended up taking. That top occurred up after a couple of days. We'll sweating nobody's business but are merely not lobbying are made some new friends and you know and actually friends back in victoria. Put together some cash to try to bring you back. High your business serving tool that me. But i asked him to stop signs money. I remember no said senate up to maine and get me out of here and nice i. It was it was. It wasn't a small amount. A large amount. Sorry that enough to get your bus ticket back to victoria. Maybe royal next town reunion neo ended up spending the money on more new friends. You lived there with you with your dad and his his girlfriend for wall. Then you need comeback to victoria and you had some really awful experiences at sexual violence as a teenage Was there anyone you could go to help about that. Anyone you could tell now. I kept that sacred made for four years before i finally told my dad. Yeah that was really hard because it changed me that not forever. China me different after that Angrier of angry headed men hide miles. Yeah but it's you know these things happen. In north and north move of learn to move on from it and Halted twelve stuff turn. Was your dad sympathetic. How did he react. We told him oh he cried and he made me. I'm just wanted me to talk to him about it. And he was visibly upset. Despite everything that was going on in your life as a teenager you finish school. You got into you knee and and then you got pregnant. How did you feel about becoming a mom. Lupin ida the more in for a whole village mahrdad four. I had worms so he went out and got me some combined trim and so. He said he attacked this worm now and so i took her formative apps away. Oh that's not good short taken over now because it's made me sick but the next frontier the doctors because those quincy and they'd disorders door pregnancy test and clean no idea that if you had sex you could get pregnant. I wasn't given any education in relation to that. I had no idea that you know cools had their period as well so. Yeah but i found that real quick. But i'm here's an it was a positive press and i just cried cried. 'cause why Those weren't happy tears in my eldest one noses. I just felt like i was driven. I had done cows. I want to achieve and of what this is gonna mirage change. How did you dad react. When he realized it wasn't worms that that you are having a baby who was really upset cruz. He those goals and these aspirations that i have were also from dallas well cruise heroes marquee spain that role model and mark constantly so education may complaining. My education was a shoe trinidad zero at tommy forever. General education and in the high school was in. He was search chair of the pain. Seca me which was awesome in the school's getting closed down and it was my dad. Who is responsible for getting the menu building so doubt they always remember that the hard work you did so it was a d both really invested in you being on this path and then a baby changed thin yes. Was it like in the delivery room. How quickly till you dad came. Around to being a granddad. All a romano go. It was sixteen people in the room. Far yeah there was did not that day yeah palm. My first child was born and he does. He fell in love with my babies online. And on the listen conversations. Saginaw stephen moore subscribe to the conversations. Podcast find out more just into dot net slash conversations Ronin umit another man and became pregnant to him. Kanev relationship did that turn out to be. Sorta star was good nor the hunter renfrow zoro for that turbo dom originally in like i was pregnant with his first child and my second child and he a cop friday not man unconscious he punched me an uppercut to the night knows which could could've killed match i but i'm here and i woke up or came to an end. How long was on the ground pool. But i'm at the thomas harding. My daughter. my oldest child and our couple of grand medeiros clawing all to that was before you even had his baby pregnant. Jails does fraud pretty much Pretty much all the time. Every i'm him and Yeah it was you know. And i was trapped in those many terms that i i left him and escaped the relationship at h. Tommy it for me and even my son the second child he's i was born paid past the door. Were some starring in and grabbed the baby and hop in the car. And i had no other choice but to get into be. Did your family responded. They know how. How bad things were you dad in in your other siblings now. I kept it from them. Which is a lot of around family violence survivors and victims now as we speak paper getting abused by their partners with their alleged loved ones when paypal bashar right now is when people here not love when you're brain abused. It's not love inside the family. That i that knew what was going on. Roy signed leave him. they remained. Know how hard it was for me to actually him like a tried every day to try and lay him. But yes i had. It defy like it away Sort of caught the train It was still backed. I try animal. And i hadn't had those red broom what struck banks. The two zero one of stewart of baby l. clothes and a couple of photos at three kids kids. Yes sorry took her from the first trying out of Marijuana i'm had a passbook for quainton. Undergo bruce from from alvin and my dad met me at spencer street railway station and he gave me food so dead was crying and i started crying. But i'm african you. When i was crying happy. Tears are fouts trader and relief when of coin but He found me so so he found me an hard solicitors and tried to get custody of the kids full capacity and so i took it a solicitor and Farting backing the courts. And i was just as gruesome are had to state fear and terror of coming back to restore knowing full. Well that if i did he'll he'll take my kids all kill me because he always threatened to kill me for him and so this Got conditions from the court said he would represent me in my absence. Which was so amazed by. That crusoe's didn't wanna go pay and but also for that was able to be done so end up getting full custody of my children but he got access and that was ripe for so So when the day came word to handle my children or my family signed dined tour title at. He will never you. You'll never see kids in our city fire two. I'm not sticking to the order. I will lose. Custody of my children are knew that i knew there'd be some there was a risk serve. Never say my kids in. But i had to take that risk and Just as well he did have kids to room for eight weeks and now we're knew where he was. He was rock headed by federal price. And then you kids were were bought back safely safely. My dad driving more way back Brother turn come back when my little one comeback. She was twelve months old. She didn't hole but she does. Now yes so really brought strong boden former children you were creating a new family for them and for yourself up in queensland i was ended up with a new partner noon he take your wall to realize he was a different kinda man than the person you'd been with. It certainly wasn't used to that. So the first time he rises for us and are not incubus jelly. And just rice's soldiers instintively grab my children and ran and hid in the wardrobe. 'cause i was waiting for that problem but it never happened. No hey must have been looking ramos out. Hey spoof he was a beautiful sour and he will so karn lobbying and my father my father to my children now that today. So i'm so glad. What about you being in in queensland. That's pretty different environment than you'll country in in victoria to take a while to get used to the snakes and the heat and the things i'm terrified of always been terrified of anything smaller than we really are I'm scared about. Rose loves worst. But i'm smelled since spiders. Yes i we had a snake coming out house. One time and host terrified knows alzheimer. Lions the children and the then harry was at work and saw had always planned children of a fire drill and we used to practice it. You know you never know so. For the winter. I throw just how gently gently exit thrive and my youngest one. Who's just wearing will carry that manteo one then the the middle child or put up and then i jumped out rural outside from beckham smokes inside of red in closer. A debate clan of comeback empower friend. Passes snake thing to do when you're a smoker when the addictions really terrible so i've come past strike of grandma's smart mobs and down past the sniper guy now we up to the then have become and way you endanger. Was that a snake that was about to take your out. Non randomness survive. But we spy can little and so wait. Did you get the idea to join. The police force all model of had this room. Fear and terror of place and this fear stems back generations forever people so my father had to fear but grandmother had the fear in no doubt her ancestors long before so i wanted to break that sarcoma children. I didn't want him to be afraid of place on my also as a young child i witnessed a lot of place. Brutality and unnecessary use of force directed at. My people and i wanted to join the price to make changes. I wanted to ensure that my paypal traded better and virginia ten. That i felt safe. What did you. How did you family friends. React to the news that you were going to apply. All madonna was ecstatic. He was sired wrapped at a drive all the way up and when he was he was on the trip the mailbox every day while souls white really a septum spider. Yes when i found out it was a big day but we'd rather family who've been in and out of the system And knocked up and traded really bad by place lau really upset Family members what was the training like in the lead up to to join def to get super feed all rose or serb afraid but not spoilsports. Man yeah it was. It was hectic per loved dirk. Because i'm very competitive. Excel under pressure. Not good blackfellas lived on the coast of water but we never put a fatal water like it's too called the water to them now and now schools down. We don't have swimming pools right queensland school so i was hopeful subsume locally and had to do to. Swimming is a police officer usually on land now but united the bronze medallion to get through. And i'm so i had to do that. Requirement and scrape fruit. What about driving. We could at the defensive driving in chasing also top driver in mari in the whole squad on only one that come come as equals may was a former ambulance driver. I think because. I've been driving unlicensed rocks a teenager in my dad's car which was here. Nowadays you feel about the uniform you know. It's a big thing to put on a uniform and put on a police uniform. What did you think about getting dressed in that outfit. So that they will be routed up in place bus detectives into western murray's to bay rays from from the time that happened one of the best nights and the job matthew bond who was the recruitment me were in the same group. He's also average won't smell from brisbane. he away sick that i didn't want to do it on my own so i didn't believe everyone else stayed back which is just as well. The next day when matthew came back we went in on our. We had that one on marmi fat really special deadly. Yeah i've never been in one location and more caret. These free stuff before. Like four pairs sock lot. Four pairs and it was you know felt so good but then you try on made it to your your induction day. Who was there from your family. All my family turned my mother included. my siblings all but one. And here's a bit upset about joining the place. But i'm so he didn't turn up. I'm are near the whole family. Was there which was really good. What cake was waiting for you. When you got home are brought this chocolate cake. It was a really. It was a massive kate because capable of saying malar so saddam. Congratulations constable. yarom had my surname. Married then. Mary name but darrow's repairman. We had a party outdoors but only had the weekend. This was on a friday. Had said dines often straight from new station on monday you worked in the community that you leave it in. Did that mean you will always on as a police officer. Jaren the security even if you live in the district that you're placing your copy of twenty four hours a day so if you say combine committed of you lost your off judy. Now you feel you have to report it. And i saw crime everyday. So fat wasn't at nutcracker was always on judy. Tell me about the time you saw two wanted men at your local metro station ourselves about your holiday more now husband and now we're off the ferry also die before and we went to the show cops at the server saint two hundred leads and we've been looking for them for some time in numb because into a tropical ireland our stressful. The you're in preparation now wearing a sarong. But in fadia language we say saloon and elsewhere started wearing underneath so when no ernest sarong and a pair of props and fired. So stuff happened. When i had no fired. Murphy's law but i'm a so as to lead to rebrand new confirmed for months amounts amounts. So i went into the so rare no foreigner and is excuse me. I'm a police officer and he just looked at me like yes. Sure your restaurant. H berea fire and so did then yeah called it in and now picked up and now we got them that were. I didn't get them the other place. That will work uniform to start around with my cerrone as you as you say wrote a. You were smoker. How did that help. Defuse the standoff. It helped a lot of the jobs are turned up Those one job in particular where she was passionate most and park and she had Chit douse to soften. She had a lawyer to threaten to self hamas who this royal oak saliva wardrobe and i went to the trouble myong so's working on my own mechanized is but i'm how from our grabbed a smart from a barn packet and i started block so she could see sutter feeling around my pockets. I'm a god at the station. Said mentioned her. And i also can give me live praise and we're out nine. She walked up to me and gave him. the lighter. escalated with that situation is smart. Pelissier people who deal with death and violence as part of their work. You know whether they're ambos or the police officers. Alvin develop a pretty morbid sense of humor. Va school black hair and black double black black black humor and i'm really funny so are really quickly but more than sweden's wouldn't get out human but i'm it's think it was a tactic to get us through the die. Did aboriginal people react to you tuning up aboriginal woman in police uniform so already in the community dinu owning hurls and what kids wear and as an aboriginal house. Oh in that community. And i was a patient there and so that. Say me off judy. As well but they are really could may me investor versus really protective in good with them. So whenever i did have jobs having involved families i might feel safe in our. I would allow my into their hires. Remind all the other what couple stand on the fence which is really good. A lot of the crime scenes that you attended as a police officer. Were familiar to you from your law of you. Know domestic violence or car accidents. What kind of told that take these went by what. That's what made me a really good price off so if there is such a thing as a good copper but i'm from our lived experiences. You know. I've experienced mars jobs always attending so i knew how to deal with. The families of the paypal was good for me saying but what did it do for you. Having a guard. I scenes again and again sorry. Developed a nursery a So more was partner train. So i would come home after a bad shift and i would start from the the toll to handle on what me way. Back in the house cleaning every plane and it was a ritual and So took the uniform australia way. Is that indicated off judy. And then is the house apart and crying and paying posed my children. But i'm now on. When are we at high. I've known to debris with so i would y mild store and to sit on your bed and just some marsano be crying and telling them what sort of shit die. I had and mud aura. Think after trauma sniping which is just as well but most naked. Just pat moran. Yeah so are really bad. You know but i you needed to talk to someone. How did you what colleagues added other police officers talk to. You had any job and ones i didn't have. I don't have anymore. Once you live the place you just lose all your friendships that emerged. It's a really tight. Knit institution and they're all friends just. Hr the so if someone leaves. I haven't heard from one copy yet. One of my former are which is sad. Because i'm so main aren't whether uniform minimal basu hold those same integrity and ethics. I was subjected to a lot of racism and blame them in the job. I was told by place. Oh who wrote in a science coordinator. It has women or black paper. What will they shelter friendship. Yeah that tefa which is good ones or appreciate attributes. Darn spoke up is to ones. We're going to be careful with anyone. You could complain to anyone higher. Up the chain yeah. I did put him several compliance more. Especially when i witnessed on place brutality towards my paypal and it was one incident. Never show my own in. The community was handcuffed then kicked in about the headboard this one place officer while she was wearing boots So immediately after that. I the perot put in a complaint against him to the child of my section and it went nowhere near knife. You keep ring comprised the until others your ostracize and asked to know that you know everyday was relentless for me sir. Brain of black single mother and a woman always minority in so many aspects. So if i were to someone who had hadn't worked before. Because i used to train police officers that come out of the academy. Well i'm for it. And i i didn't know i in the first two minutes of working moving and it could have been in the week or or it could be pain. Muscle kitting up and learning f. r. And tell them that was original. And when i hear any throws about my paypal yet has yet to say that again and again every shift i worked with people that army and any other occupation. Where you do that. But i had to do that. What finally made you decide to leave from me. towards enormous darkness. We found piteous anxiety and depression so throughout the i was told to leave for a lot of the people that are working to get out. You know used stuff that you don't belong. Because i do speak. I'm the one that calls it out all the time. Each and every time placer used to looking at black people don't want used to work and we will and when we do get in these jobs We know that way. The tokenistic prison and for us to actually walk into a playstation is a way as call them. What spicer's and it could be any any what spice it cut tram. Cypher us and usually we have some tactics and strategies to get us in that door. So we've mine art time we've my children few years ago. Working move are more organizations and they'd ring me up saw anxious and crying. I'd have to kick them on fire and get them in that frontal and a lot of us have that tactic and strategy and it's not normal but it sound normal which is really sad and i implore other other place officers. Whatever rice you out but in particular aboriginal in terms of our own among other places that are prior to me and after may speak up. You're not going to be in travel. Routes your story in. If you're honest you can't get a wrong so speak up. Talk about being a part of a quiet about one thing that comes across his how much khan s you bore to your all. Despite all of the challenges that were thrown at you just one example is is late new career when you pulled over a middle aged woman who was driving either. The place what happened. There's report leur or norm at the time. We suspected shoes drink drove presumptuous quarter radical narrowed when we put arriver. She told me that her shoes on her way to care facility that our hospitals in and she'd just received a phone call that he was going to pass any minute so awful why she needs to be there. Crews we've aboriginal families are still worst door on alarm. Yes so. I drive her who they might turn choice. She got there safely and drive. We've spayed and she was in for a good ride. Hang on dialing pattern of following. And she got yeah she got there and she ended up center mcadam flowers and thank me for it and they're the ones chops are allowed us to go to bed jobs but they're the ones that are really grodin awarded for it and actually forgot about it and then when the flowers and cab climate reminded me of. When did you start writing. A book like employ. When did that begin. our remember. That die repeatedly fiddly. It was the third of november. Two thousand eleven. It was seat. I before i was medically discharged on for juries replacing an And it was a setback pain. Lord invested ten years of my life wearing that uniform and fat lakos losing a family the family. They probably didn't feel that. May yes. So i started documenting and we've more patriots day in depression. I was losing a lot of my memory and apparently was called trauma amnesia. What memory or did have started talking mention and before too long and had a bookstore for memories. Have you kids read the book. Mildest one nacre. Sh- they sorry opponents of them. They did the launch the official launch in melbourne. And they're the only ones set of read The other two children ready yet lavar children to ensure that the their partners they do or they need to be there to get this to comfort and found that a lot of people that are waiting. I felt like i feel like a nurturing them whilst they rating it but paypal nate remembers that as much as it's my story it's mike jordan story that will write properly will. We've me for this book but nine dot children are really proud of me and when your children thank you for being a good parent and a an excellent mom. You've done your job. The books come out on the thirtieth anniversary of the royal commission into aboriginal deaths in custody given your experience in saw the police system. What do you think it's gonna take for things to change our the government Still prime morrison have that conversation with parents who have brain affected boy in custody. Every aboriginal family has been affected boy an abrupt custody. My family included. Yes so truly up. Soon we've had four am seventy four deaths in custody since the royal commission recommendations were handed down and all of the recommendations that were implemented a lot of them. Sir afterward the funded so in the last five weeks who've had far of aboriginal deaths in custody or so-called australia and so whilst we support those families and we agree with the families yeah and it's it's relentless. It's i've burien mark away screaming and i find that really sad as well. Your dad jonah has been such a strong thread throughout your life. Hells he doing now. And what's he make. If you think the book that allows me no matter what. I'm here was a bit upset when i got out of the place but i'm real quick. You keep throwing him challenges. Yeah he's horrible. Namdar fiber also heenan lives for myself my husband so the care and support and protection and security that he provided me when i was growing up. I'm now doing it back to him and your family is going on as you said. Roddick the beginning you. You're the grandma told me about these. Little grandkids are twins. Non modern near on their code our christian language name as well which is really good United they precious and but by grandma lip to live to say this. Now will statistics starring young. And all that sire so need to start looking at my house. I'm staying here for bit longer. And i think our loved of these greenwich more than my children. Sorry refer to them. I sided there my by abuse. And anchors form that lame nearby on. It's such an honor to meet you in historic. Thank you so much for being my guest on cumbersome thank you sir. Thank you for having me. You've been listening to a podcast of conversations with sarah can ski for more conversations interviews head to the website i they say dot net slash conversations. Discover more great. Abc podcasts live radio and exclusives on the abc listen app.

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SPASI #11 - Edisi Ahad, 14 Maret 2021 M (Haris)

Radio Fajri 99.3FM

1:22:23 hr | 4 months ago

SPASI #11 - Edisi Ahad, 14 Maret 2021 M (Haris)

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"Government by sucker punch."

Pod Save America

1:09:46 hr | 4 years ago

"Government by sucker punch."

"Ah along with preportion ingredients to make delicious home cooked meals choose from a variety of new recipes each week or let Blue Apron's culinary team surprise you recipes are not repeated the presenting sponsor of positive America is Blue Apron guys for less than ten dollars per person per meal Blue Apron delivered seasonal recipes guys today women samplers as he's back crispy salmon roasted potato salad with pickled mustard seeds is a better way to cook get right check out this week's menu get your first three meals free with free shipping by going to blue apron dot com slash crooked that's blue apron dot com slash crooked blue apron mm accountable I think that's obviously the lack of you know fortitude on the part of the Republican leadership means that he's not going to be held and now here we are so last week where we last left off the story our hero basically last week trump told his staff to lie he threatened Komi by suggesting have investigation whether there'll be a push special prosecutor and independent commission we don't know so I think it's a another kind of weakening of trump's they can come at sold out you can't come are already have tickets all right let's talk about Jim Komi tickets they now Krim fresh toss look that's been on the menu for awhile here boring new item I've been told I will never be bored. Cahan is making one of these three cheese and baby Broccoli Stromboli with terrip tomato and Oregano dipping sauce enchiladas in Imola sauce made from surplus Valentine later we'll also be talking to the host of cooking media pod saved the people deray mckesson how's it going guys everyone good forget we should just say that we already recorded the mark Welcome to Pudsey of America I'm Jon Favreau I'm John Lovett Tommy Vitor on the pod today we have the vice chair of the Senate Intel Committee Senator Mark Warner the step-by-step easy to follow recipe card in proportion ingredients it's forty minutes or less so you should probably time her tonight and every ingredient is ready to cook when it arrives or they'll make he's a secret tape of their conversation and he basically admitted to obstruction of justice by telling her that he fired call me because he didn't like that his campaign was under investigation so the first question Los Angeles we're GonNa be doing a live show with America our city and you'll all be able to listen to it because it will be our Thursday pot so just everyone if you can come great if not you'll hear it Thursday corner part and it's a very good interview if if we do say so ourselves behind the curtain we limit ourselves everyone should listen speaking of love it Zander that should be held to but slowly but surely you see that like you know he's not getting backed up by people like Lindsey Graham right there's going to be you know there's going to be a movement to have some kind ability to do this without accountability yeah I think a significant strategic error it showed him to be as petulant shortsighted and unprincipled as we all suspected self promoting love it or leave at this Friday we had an awesome love it or leave it with Kumail Nangiani Gareth Reynolds and learn laugh guests that you guys should listen to you right now I'm a big fan of the he would he would be then going on to tweet a threat at the FBI director that let everyone in the world to believe that he's secretly tape recording conversations in the White House the gym combing because that's the world we're stuck in Yep it's amazing like they were two weeks ago or like guys we have to touch base with talk about call me a little bit more we know we're all kind of sick of the topics the things can we do here to hold him accountable at this stage in the game at this point that we with the power of the Democrats have and it's an either or I don't think it's a hold them accountable or not hold is a week out from this now is trump gonna get away with this is this are we is is this what we're going to deal with now like I mean because how many I've also been told we should try to keep these to a minute and they've been getting a little long fair fight on twitter about oh well excited for this tonight I hope you enjoy your meal each meal credit message I think it's interesting that if you look at polling that actually healthcare that people are far more upset about worried about and that's resonating in states but to the degree that Democrats are effort on behalf of some Republicans a lot of Republicans and especially some you know in the media and the right wing media to say Oh Democrats are hyperventilating the media's trying to stop him from doing anything in Washington it's a great distraction for the press corps because they can't focus on anything else and rightly so we'll say there's an is another huge desire because it gives Democrats something to seize on it's very simple are there tapes yes or no if so release the tapes and I don't think that should be the entire no but I think this was the funniest one where we're going to do we introduce some new segments the show became president this Wednesday at the hotel friendly about this it's just make it sort of a team thing but like we have seen people that are nonpartisan like James Clapper said that the FBI firing amounted to an and quotes were this guy scares me quote there are no guardrails on his presidency and quote this is Richard Nixon on steroids so these are like Republican senators and Congress it from day one has been very clear to me that you cannot possibly underestimate the degree to which is going to distract his entire White House staff and team as they're trying to do other things when he was talking to though none of them speak out very they're very brave corrupt under the cloak of anonymity these Republicans I wonder if one of them is Rubio on a political level that's a good thing for us as Democrats as a country it's a really bad thing because we need these people to do their jobs but instead they wake up every day and read about how because Altan the country's checks and balances David Ignatius talked to a reporter for the Washington Post he talked to various Republicans this week and they all need to lawyer up and you know that is scary as hell if you're sitting in those jobs and you know these people are not gonna be able to do anything else in like the culture of the head of the FBI his job is not just to investigate trump his universe the world doesn't revolve around Donald Trump he's one of the nation's top counterterrorism officials the FBI director applied to them and made them spin one thing one day in the opposite the next day now he's GonNa fire them and they pick up politico in they've tires story written from Clinton aides telling them riding in game of thrones bullshit and leaking is is it seems like it's all consuming yeah I mean well the other thing too is it's obviously consuming for the White House the accountability to this Chituwo trump by the end of the week is supposed to appoint the next or says he's going to appoint the next FBI director quick turnaround by the way for pointing time trump supporter puke party hack just an absolute shell absolute show it it's unfair to Chuck Schumer to say that this would be like Barack Obama pointing Chuck Schumer but have a slow process run a healthcare bill people find out what's in it they don't like it so when you kind of it's sort of like government by Sucker Punch they throw something out there quickly get it through before anyone has the ability to kind of raise the alarm stop it and that's something they could definitely try to do with this I noticed that with obviously John Cornyn 's name has been floated he's the number two Republican in the Senate is similar it's exactly oh just imagine right it's an it's an investigation into Hillary Clinton's emails and Barack Obama tells Lester Holt well when I fired the FBI Director I did think to myself I like the email investigation and my new my new FBI director is going to be Chuck Schumer like reporters right when they floated Koren's name a lot of them are saying well is a real fucking job that you need a good person they're doing well so let's talk about that so talking with some of the ways that Democrats are thinking about trying to hold trump accountable here trying to bring some someone with ten year term that's gonNA run the nation's top line for well one thing that I was just sort of you know you look at what they've learned in the last couple of weeks and the one thing they learned is when you if it's Cornyn that's GonNa he's just going to sail through confirmation the Senate because Senate courtesy in Bubba Blah and like I was at least Lindsey Graham has taken a little bit of a Ernie over the last week because he started by apparently according to sources he was the one on the phone with trump saying like fine if you want to start prejudice I go for it and can we we will need again like we need for everything in the Senate we need three Republicans to say no to a a trump appointee for them to block it now he's saying I don't think Cornyn should be the pick but Senator Graham ghetto drifting in the winds here on the a tough issue I know I guess the question is do you think a partisan politics of the president can fire Komi as we just saw that said I mean you want a technocratic individual you want someone that comes back in law enforcement such a lack of respect regard for like half the country like it's the F. B. I. You actually pre Republicans in the Senate don't gain anything from having a partisan F. b. i. e. floating is Merrick Garland because they wanna get him out of a very important judgeship into a job where donald trump could fire him the next day it is the most cynical ridichio I don't know I don't I mean with Cornyn maybe Graham Graham vote against Cornyn I hope I I think the problem is it's hard for these guys to vote against them but maybe not as quote unquote taped conversations with Komi or admit that he doesn't have them in made the whole thing up this raises a broader question should Democrats grind all Senate for them to signal that they don't want this to be picked so they don't have to vote for him I don't know I mean you saw Rubio say Cornyn and try out so political reported today the Democrats might force procedural votes Tom you're alluding to this that required trump to either give up his business to a halt until you know they get him to admit this on the tapes they get the Special Prosecutor they get an FBI director who's not a politician a non-partisan I mean how maybe trump does personally because he's a criminal but like Republican senators discussing me around for ten years like this is a place where it's easy to care about your country more and Lia weenie about this as do everything possible by any means possible we are in a totally different reality here people people seems like such an obvious abuse of power that if we let this go I don't know how we move on from here like you know I just think there's something I know that people might not care about it a ton right how far should Democrats go or can Democrats go to you know hold them accountable here far I know I I'm I I'm and like even if you're going for a win like don't you you don't care at all about Democrats you don't think they matter at all you don't think these people in your district manner at all and they don't they don't they don't care because the name there it is also a fact that we have an entire right wing apparatus that literally will not report on the fact that Donald Trump's explanation timeline everything about why he fired Komi has changed yeah those would be wonderful picks which is fucking despicable cerebral Marco Rubio man this is supposed to be a position that's viewed is not part I mean it's not it's not a lifetime appointment it's not a judgeship it's not here's deeply but Komi being fired but the country's shrugs now I I hate that kind of reporting because you to people form opinions over time care about more in the country than they care about the education but at the same time he fucking fired the FBI director because he was investigating him like to it is it is I I have no idea an it'd be no way of knowing no confidence in this but like that felt like a classic trump empty threat which is why going to bat to find out that there are no tapes we should be obstructionist just like them I'm about it because what you were just alluding to love it which is the message right like if we go if we grind business to a halt than it is we make the story but I think that sometimes that might not matter see this drives me crazy busy these these these stories you saw like one day two days three days later they'd say Washington end no FBI director until a special prosecutor is named Yeah and until you want do either one of those two things you take care I agree released the tapes it so for the next however many weeks as the Senate's ground to a halt this investigation investigation to the detriment of talking about health care about tax reform talking about all the other things that people much fifty one percent said yes so even back then right before presidents raising nation he had the base with him and he had a bunch of people thinking the media was hyping this too much things change so let me see Wall Street Journal had a poll out about this over the weekend twenty nine percent approve of trump firing Komi thirty eight percent disapprove thirty two percent had no opinion it's also just like look put the put what we should do or shouldn't it's also heartbreaking the idea that you could pick them unlike John Cornyn because it just shows makes me feel like well I don't know maybe we should healthcare but I I don't know but more over the dumbest thing possible you know I mean either you're pathetic liar again check or we should make this central what we're doing you have thirteen guys somewhere in the Senate right in this healthcare bill you know that's an ongoing probably watch Fox News which is barely reported on it or just reported on Democrats hysteria overcome E or you don't pay attention to us at all you don't think it matters so much but like if that's the case the better for worse guys we're playing a long game here okay approval ratings like thirty eight thirty nine he's got eighty percent approval from Republicans but independence in a couple of days before he resigned fifty nine percent of Republicans still said no same another question asked right before he resigned is the media covering this issue of Watergate that shouldn't stop people in Washington from pushing hard as they can on this because some people aren't paying attention to the way so many somebody made this point like only Washington cares about this well that's where they make the loss you're taping people's secretly and it sounds like there's a lot of history and evidence of MC Wrigley taping deal it's an interesting I'm not torn about it because I think oh we can't be obstructionist like them no fucking removing you're still seven percent of Democrats seem to be cool with him so like we have time to slowly erode and chip away people's views on him by just talking about the crazy stuff he's doing I don't think we should community this clearcut I've also thought some we'll Jordan third tweeting out poll numbers from the Watergate era this weekend interesting so should Nixon resign they need we need to make this a big deal and push them in every way possible to to try to get some sort of answers in terms of the tapes at the bare minimum I guess that like will understand what's going on in the bureau on Day One and John Cornyn does not that person trading obvious not that but it seems like a simple message from Democrats should just be a no politicians and list nonsense hey merrick garland do you want to give up your lifetime appointment for job where you know trump's gonna probably by today's that sounds like a great great trade Maryland the more this Russia investigation and the Komi stuff hurts trump politically the the easier it is for Senate Republicans to break with him it feels a little premature but I I do think Democrats can walk and Chew Gum here I think we can the indivisible in all these groups doing great work sending people to town halls should continue to do that and they continue to talk about it arching and getting worse for trump send me well so in love I know you love talking about this but there's been a lot of impeachment talk about this right you mean holding him accountable on things like health care that's true right and so it might actually help these things Yeah The New York Times reported essentially what you just said that Republicans were beginning to break from trial what was Hillary who they call although ninety three percent have heard about the comb us so this contrary to what some issue that really does have a day-to-day impact on people's lives and it will be more central to the midterm elections it's hard it's hard you and you know you could also make the case that approve the firing right then if you had heard just a little bit about Ramey so it is an information thing like if you pay attention to the news patriots in the reporting you think it's awful if here's about how it feels and how it sounds and the further we push the further we push like every it seems impossible that this was the craziest week we've had so far but it is yeah and we're getting and things and you know sixty is the threshold for filibuster and now you're going up to sixty seven it's like the question is what more crazier could happen Senate sixty-seven sixty-seven so you need two thirds of the Senate otherwise he's acquitted so like we're sitting here talking about how to get like fifty three votes for things impeachment right is so now you have trump possibly committing obstruction of justice rate on one hand that is a legal you know there's a legal characterization reported like many people have heard about this thing now what was interesting where you were just saying time is if you had heard a lot about Komi you are way more likely to be I it's so far away to start talking about the Senate but like man if we're at the point where where we're at the high crimes and misdemeanors place we're not talking about we don't need sixty seven whether it obstruction of justice or not but impeachment doesn't rest solely on some legal judgment right it is actually the political judgment of members of the House of Representatives who have to decide on this right and they decided back in nineteen ninety eight that Bill Clinton had committed obstruction of justice and they impeached him some legal scholars either things the dynamic get so bad for trump that house Republicans tell him basically that they would vote for it for dynamic get so bad for trump that we win the house and then we can impeach him and lawyers probably said Bill Clinton had not done that right but the house decides so it it really I don't WanNa say it's beside the point but it does seem like look until you get a house would plausibly vote on impeachment it seems very premature and also we should just let it ruined because a lot of people are like Oh impeachments like even if the how talking about impeachment helps us or hurt us in winning the house back because that's all that matters to me because if you want to fantasize about impeachment that's fine What I think about is the concept votes we need what Thirteen Republicans Roy to change their minds and and that that starts to become a different a different thing I just think that like in a world where Donald Trump is being impeached ah the question is impeachment talk I asked still premature the time is right or who the hell cares it's not going to happen anyway until a long time what do you think so the whole issue complete doesn't exist in their world doesn't exist in their world it's just liberal hysteria well yes the Embassy Wall Street Journal which is our thing way out hoping for like this is back to the whole thing from snl that like one story is going to hit or one answer he's going to give that ends at all and we don't have to worry about working hard even if we won the house back in two thousand eighteen and the House voted to impeach Donald Trump the Senate you need sixty six votes in the Senate right because you need two thirds of the does of winning the House and I think about Donald Trump I think about how do you stymie Donald Trump from continuing to be a menace to this country and I think about two years of Donald Trump being investigated house back we will be able to find a lot of these answers yeah I mean the I guess what I would say is I I don't know about impeachment talk I I think it feels quite fanciful at this moment i WanNa know Enj- very quickly well they changed very slowly and then they change very quickly so we just don't know and I do agree yeah we should I I I it's it's just a hard question because even as in the house whether he's being impeached or not while while fending off some kind of primary challenge throughout two thousand nine hundred and two thousand twenty and that to me is a very exciting possibility and it does all you and it has to roll downhill and you don't know how it's going to get I you know this is a political question and there's only there's only two ways a political question like that can be answered in favor impeachment in the house healthcare is the primary economic challenge we face but we also shouldn't let this go because it's simple and we can you find a couple of crater senators which look I'm not hopeful Holton? SNL did their thing where they're like did I get them is it over right which I think captures the feeling like did he say it did he say it and like because this is a political question and I'll legal question it really aren't but we don't but we just need to hold him there we need to be able to win on the other front which is the policy and political front while while doing everything we can I'll hear about a couple of people there have been centers come out and said if there are tapes they need to be released and simple and also by the way it's not just about hoping that they be courageous it's about it requires wouldn't last week you know we didn't talk about much jeff sessions Sort of rolling back a lot of sensing reforms that Eric holder and the Obama administration less courage to do the right thing and that's about trumping less popular it's about the sort of dynamics around this issue changing Jonah we're talking to this right before we started that like trump said this crazy quote and it gives you more power in this investigation right which Democrats more partners investigation which we have not had up until now there's no like hoping that your Republican counterpart Plays Nice if the Democrats win the so now he's you know he and Friday he ordered federal prosecutors to pursue the toughest penalties possible for those convicted of possessing even the smallest amount we should just double stamp on how within a year so you'll never get bored handshake blue apron tonight WHOA testimonial can you please give us the recipe no fucking clue well I'll tell you what some featured upcoming meals critical that we do so but I don't think there's going to be I mean I hope there is I doubt there's silver bullet that leads trumpet out of office in Handcuffs we shouldn't dream it's like I'm there's a thing called the it's a different world than the one word living in right now the other thing to remember is if the Democrats win the House back before you even get impeachment winning the House gives you subpoena power reset which is basically we have to be able to win one war while holding back another adversary and I feel like we need to keep in our mind like a quadrennial trump review and like we need to be able to fight on the Russian but even in cases where there was clear wrongdoing you're far more likely to get someone who lies about their role in it or cover something up or you know that's how these things unravel really hinge on doing everything we can to win the house agree with that and also I mean a big question to like I think there are we is it is it like an e registering voters and winning back the hasn't stuff like that that like this this is like you know the the mench fever here there's going to be something that just drops and that's going to the at and we're all gonna be able to go home we're not going to find a square cash transfer from Vlad to jared a better way to bribe through this week that would convince sixty seven senators yeah this guy's got to go who knows but I I do think though it's like it's like it's like a little bit like you have like a snowball this is such bad policy the coke brothers think this terrible policy Barack Obama thinks vase because you're locking up for life non violent drug offenders and you you we send these people win on the Russian front and right and we review yeah like and we don't want to ignore a lot of other extremely important issues are also possibly politically they turned up so so we we are hoping I think a lot of progressives are hoping for way too much out of the Russia investigation we should get to the bottom of it period it's absolutely Israel Defense Review where they kind of look at our terminal bear with me Bert Baron and it basically it's about making military's up to the challenge of what all the places like rikers island and they come out destroyed they're not human beings anymore it's also so out far like it's so outside a consensus that extends from works to like the Center for American progress that most Republicans in the Senate are in favor of a criminal justice reform all democrats are intrigued criminal dentures. Actually the only reason we didn't pass wink dot com spelled T. R. Y. W I N C dot Com you take a brief Pallet Profile Quiz and wink will recommend distinct and interesting wines actually customized so they're desperately trying to hit their balance their budget in ten years of course that's not possible without huge huge cuts or tax increases now if you remember that that they're planning massive cuts to programs for the poor food stamps welfare veterans benefits because there's nowhere left to cut in the budget in criminal justice reform was jared Kushner and session just went out and did his own thing because sessions is the worst thing trump has done to this country yet is point jeff sessions passive tax cuts for the rich. y'All ready this is this is a thing that has annoyed me for a long time stop calling trump's rhetoric and policy populist stop calling the republican health care bill cuts a trillion dollars from the budget but there's only one hundred fifty billion left to make budget shortfalls why because it includes Matt back to Senator Mark Warner this pot save America stick around there's more great show coming your way pods America is brought to you by wink sticking it to working people to help people who don't want the estate tax plea leaners plutocrats drunk with power that's what we have here when we come back we will this reform and now the trump administration's overturned that it also there's report over the weekend that trump is sort of pissed at sessions because one person on the White House that was working on Bannon some populist hero this is the opposite of populism when you're cutting Medicaid when you're cutting income assistance for the disabled when you're cutting veterans benefits is your problem is thing which is a fucking nuts talking about bipartisanship you had Chuck Grassley Rand Paul Mike Lee all wanting bipartisan criminal justice was I won't cut Medicare Social Security Medicaid and they decided to reverse on the one that affects a plans of millions of black people and poor people it is so the other thing that's part of the is to this jeff sessions by the way we didn't talk about this who is interviewing the FBI director even though he was really recused himself from the Russian investigation God we jeff sessions getting was this whole talk about how the Republicans WanNa do obamacare I because that's real they'll get the revenue that's new tax reform for their budget but one thing that this article notes is in the digital injustice yeah in addition to the Republicans continuing to try to rip away healthcare for millions of Americans there's also report over the weekend have a great glass of wine it enhances the moment Oh does it wink tell me more whether you're reflecting on the day or with someone you love or just sort of chugging it as you watch the News Jeff sessions out of there would be a big step that's going to be tough because Jeff Cessna smart and he is widely known he and he is careful in those Keebler elves can hide the wing understands this is why they started their company to give you access to exceptional wines from around the world so you can have more of those moments just go to try it's like which which oak tree today which not which where where's he drizzling fudge of a delicious treats today in addition to the pursuing racist in criminal justice policies and you know they need to pay for this tax cut and they're not gonNA touch discretionary they're not going to touch non discretionary programs like Medicare and social security as Donald so donald trump made a promise I guess when we all go out to dinner I don't know anything about wine I just no way Yes Carrie and Tommy know something I know the point at the second cheapest bottle that's college isn't it tastes like diet coke in Miller lite my favorite drinks Tommy should chime in here since he's the real wind con definitely hope he doesn't oh that's they know that now they've caught wise guys they have one hundred percent okay I don't know what that means I don't either but you know what maybe few try wink T. R. Y. It'll be Cabernet what does that mean there's one hundred percents satisfaction guarantee so you never pay for bottle you don't like and right now when because finish pod save America listeners twenty dollars off your first order when you go to try wink dot com slash crooked they'll even cover the cost of shipping back allback Mullebeck Mall Back that's try wink dot com slash crooked to get twenty dollars off your first order now complimentary shipping try wing dot com slash crooked positive America is also brought to you by texture I never would have suspect like magazine Ad was GonNa Follow that name I know could have been like sheets sheets exception texture has supported journalism not just by offering access to great magazines but also financially a portion of every subscribers fee goes directly to publishers wonderful this is nice way at talking about their business model the texture has gone beyond delivering just the magazine itself they've made it easy to find an injury the articles you want to read with daily recommendations exclusive interactive features videos and more she's video bonus content and they even carried articles in magazines just for you or whoever you're giving texture to this year it's normally nine ninety nine a month you get over two hundred magazines texture makes magazines easy in there are so many great ones out there like Vanity Fair time and rolling stone true those are chosen texture searchable you can mark what you like checkup you've been betting but it's not the throw it a long time when it feels like it's never been harder to find the truth supporting the free press is critically important of this is like a free press angle they're going with their from its a bubble you could get a lot of magazines for free delivered to Your House and so in college we ended up having a giant tupperware filled with hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of magazines and this is this is better than that now you can get him on today we have the ranking member of the Senate Intel Committee Virginia Senator Mark Warner of the pod this second appearance on a Kirkman you pod Virginia's thanks for having me on although guys you know I'm actually vice chair vice chair that's the official title thing yeah which I think is probably you sign up right now at texture dot com slash crooked you get a fourteen day free trial that does seem absurdly cheap for two hundred eggs enes ten bucks a month in the in the heyday of the Internet comes to mind which is a good thing but but fortunately we don't have to guess because he told Lester Holt that when he fired Komi he was thinking about how this quote Russia thing is eight up story so do you believe it was an abuse of power to fire Komi I believe that it was beyond bizarre on Tuesday night he gets fired and then they come up originally with this wild excuse that the reason they were firing him was because the here you had beginning of last week Sally Yates former acting attorney general saying she had notified the White House Hi with texture to the art department right now textures offering a fourteen day free trial when you go to texture com slash crooked that's fourteen days to try texture for Deputy Attorney General had written a memo saying that Comey didn't Treat Hillary Clinton Fair now who would really think that this White House would say that and then they waited seventeen days to fire or get rid of General Flynn we had Dromey was supposed to be coming in talk to us on Thursday suggested that we not confirm whoever the president appoints until we get a special prosecutor now because candidly I voted for the deputy attorney general accident and they you've now got the present United States firing ahead of the FBI who's in charge of the investigation you can't make this stuff up recommended not it was because of this involvement the with the Russia thing and candidly the involvement with Russia thing this White House may be the only group of people in Garage Stein Rosenstein But I was I told him I was really disappointed with this memo that was not that was not believable out of Eastern District of Virginia would still be the the prosecutors looking into this but it would mean there's at least another indication of independence then or maybe not luckily but you know within a few hours of that meeting the president said no who had nothing to do with what the deputy attorney general was right now we're both from the same thing they cut deep I'm okay let's get right into it so obviously we do not know what's in president trump mind prisons he needed to regain credibility in the best way regarding credibility is two point a special prosecutor sites and we ought to hold off on the FBI director. Until I said honestly this doesn't your memo doesn't pass the laugh test and you know why did you write it how was it written was the real reason and luckily the center do you think that when when he appoints a new FBI director that Democrats should make a confirmation contingent on some sort of clarity on whether or not there three texture dot com slash crooked a better way to read a there you go poppy image it's really complicated probably only you're listening audience will be interested in kind of actually getting the distinctions there used to be an independent to say whether the tapes exist or they don't exist or whether he was just making stuff up guys you question what what exactly does a special prosecutor give you in this we find we get that special prosecutor point at which he can't appoint the deputy attorney general can appoint that individual which wouldn't slow down the investigation which would still mean that most of the lawyers working America didn't don't accept the fact that Russia massively interfered in our elections have used tools from disinformation and fake news and manipulation of the Internet in ways that are unpaid the genesis of Whitewater and a series of other independent counsel activities the Democrats Ironically Lot that law expire at the end of the ninety also law that was an individual lawyer that kind of set up their own shop there he or she would be appointed by a three judge panel that was taped conversations of of his meeting dinner with Komi or in in pledged to block it unless that happens we'd all we're overtaking right right guys no fake no fake news on the Pod I heard Tommy say state of Virginia on Pod Save the world and I was like come on man were from that a hawk nine months after the fact now we've got a reason to go after Komi and so that lasted I I'd met with the Deputy Attorney General I said this independent commission independent Council short of a whole new law being passed and signed by this president is kind of off the table that's the same any independent commission would ended up having a lot of appointments made by this president and you really believe this presence GonNa appoint truly independent people and that would put the whole investigation attorney general sessions has already had to recuse himself and the deputy attorney general could appoint a special prosecutor that in a sense get some independence from having to get every is follows and then on the Special Prosecutor the special prosecutor is someone that would be appointed by the deputy attorney general since the Shen which would be the idea that somehow the house and the Senate would again pass a law the president would sign it and my fear for folks who are concerned about this president is six to nine months before they could block it'd be stood up and for Democrats you would have the president making appointments the majority get approval from the deputy attorney general but it least gives one more layer of independence now if that was not totally confusing to your audience came to a degree as I know a lot of your listeners really want an independent commission and I'm listen I got no problem with independent commission I only say that an independent commission I apologize but it really are three separate buckets special prosecutor independent counsel an independent commission. Well first of all you don't have to worry about our audience keeping up because they are the best longest statements of any Republican and I tell you we've had some bumps along this has not been a smooth of course I'll be the first to acknowledge but every time there's been a bump because is hopefully a bastion of independence here James Comey has said he wants to testify publicly you said you wanted to testify publicly do you feel as though the Republicans approval along the investigation approved by the normal channels and the Justice Department that special prosecutor if they actually bring bring charges would still have to go in intelligence committee is one the ratio is eight two seven eight Republicans seven Democrats so it's a closer ratio than most committee second it's gotta his us because they know that after the whole Kenneth Starr thing there was a law that lapsed beyond just sort of the norm of this guy being you know trees this was all of course you gotta stay with this story every day because new things happen that was even before the president made this allusion to the potential of tapes and as we've known taking appointments the minority making appointments and I think the ratio would be dramatically less than the Democrats favor on an independent commission. I know we're getting confusing but again your audience on your committee are committed independent investigation are they putting the country I I believe many of them are I mean remember the Senate eight in when there's been some you know jostling that says hey now we're going to follow the Intel wherever it leads and we've got also chairman Verte last week is fired the Attorney General Jeff sessions who to use a technical legal term is terrible you have devin newness in the house having to step aside because keeping up and calling my office every day and texted me every day they are they are focused their their the tip of the spear so bottom and get to the truth have you talked to Berl yet about Komi testifying publicly and do you think he'll agree that Komi testify publicly I think the fact that later than ranking member but I'm not sure I think like most people don't know what ranking member means vice chair centrist and from state when you are the vice chair Commonwealth mm any student of history knows presidents was secret tapes usually don't end up in a good spot so I do think it's going to be important and I think the president will be forced in investigation was compromised by his own sort of going to the White House and being ridiculous Adam Schiff is doing great work you are helping to lead the intelligence committee in the Senate kind of you know I heard back from Director Comey that he wasn't going to make it tomorrow the daily we initially invited him I get that this is kind of a jolt to his life and three of being bipartisan third you know the Chairman Richard Burr I mean he last week when the Komi resigned are coming got fired sorry not resigned fired did one of the the Republicans on some of the Republicans on the committee like Susan Collins from Maine and James Langford from from Oklahoma and Marco Rubio from Florida Roy Blunt from Missouri they have really wet imagine he wanted to get a little bit of time to collect himself and sort through but I know Jim Komi deserves a chance to tell his side of the story and I think the American people are GonNa want well when you see some of the explanation and some of the fact that it appears that for example women and proud of the product so maybe some of the folks you guys are some of the folks in the audience say no that's not the perfect solution but this is the best option we have to get to the expertise would require data from a targeting firmly Cambridge Analytica for example is that true anything about the nature of the Russian hacks that I'm hearing about here I do too senator what thing I've heard about the focus of the Senate Intelligence Committee's investigation and said the Russian hacking is that the sophistication and chairman pro wouldn't be supportive of of testifying before our committee or some other committee I think the Intel Committee would be the appropriate venue and Convictions I wonder if they just ask jared like trump does with all these questions we'll find out we'll find out more to come on that also obviously you can't talk a lot with specificity about the investigation itself but back in March your counterpart in the House Adam Schiff said he we don't say well yeah it was interesting that those states seem to be targeted where the bots where they could tell you even after the Comey investigation saying we're going to saying to the staff both of a single staff we're going to follow this no matter where it leads we're going to get this done when I do it in a way that we can be African Americans were targeted in places like Wisconsin and Michigan where the Democrats were to brain dead to realize those states were even implies create a lot of these fake twitter accounts facebook accounts could infect overwhelmed the targeted search engines that would end up saying on your news feed you suddenly got stuff that really raises some questions and I'd I'd be I I think that's a a worthwhile area of inquiry how did they know to go to that level of detail in those kind Hillary Clinton's sick or Hillary Clinton stealing money from the State Department that's a Yoke I get the fact that the Russian Intel services could figure out how to manipulate the bots eight Russian politicians Actes ambassadors and formerly former Intel officials have died since US election general clapper's response to a question about this use the bots whether they could know how to target states and levels of voters that Democrats weren't even aware snus of the targeting is something that's being looked at closely specifically that Russian boots were targeting Clinton voters at the precinct level to suppress their votes with fake news and at that level German Burg was very supportive of bringing in Komi to testify. I think I'll talk with more today but I cannot imagine that I'm not gonNA comment on on Mr Schiff comments I am going to say I've been using more of the smoke analogy that this White House who keeps saying that from Yeah I I believe that the Russians have been successful at both interfering in I am not my first Rodeo boys it is it is ours are while you're collecting your thoughts we're doing a great job spend pennies on the dollar compared to what The United States is spending in more of a traditional sense now again I support aircraft carrier fleet we build them in Virginia but is now seen quote more than circumstantial evidence of collusion between Russia and the trump campaign do you agree with his characterization you know I I really liked that this is a new type of assault and I think you'd have to from an objective standpoint say the Russians at least in terms of their overall view eight of interference if you add up what the Russian spent in the French elections where they dumped all those emails on macron right before the the final weekend and if you presumptious really add up if you add up all the money that the Russian spent in the United States if you add up all the money they spent in the Netherlands where the Dutch hand-counted their ballots rather than machine counted because they were it's no there there you'd think they'd wanNA cooperate if there's no there there and it feels like each week there's more and more smoke house that for analogy we'll tell you we'll take it with a k. one thing clapper also said is not only our institutions under assault from without they're also under assault from within right now so you have Russia doing focus on should it be part of the investigation refresh my memory on what clapper's response was He seemed to think that the you know more broadly that we are under assault overall view of let's try to make American liberal democracy look bad has a has been pretty successful in a pretty good return on the ruble election and sewing chaos and they also obviously got the candidate that they preferred to be president and you know the one of the remarkable things is the money they'll spend trying to interfere in the German elections you add that altogether let alone maybe the loss of life on some of these officials you're talking about what this kind of international campaign against democracies and we'll obviously be threatened again in in future elections and then you have donald trump seeming to try to stymie any kind of investigation so you seem to have and I'm feeling that I'm feeling excellent so so you kind of thrown a little bit of water here on the Independent Commission we've had the head of the F. B. Two to three percent of the cost of a new aircraft carrier so I I worry at times it we're seeing this new type of warfare from the Russians that they can on any turn a at what point do we have to press a different button and and and raise raise a different kind of response you know you're doing good word and because this is kind of a whole new area and doesn't fit neatly into Department of Homeland Security or the Intel community or Dod The response I got was very unsatisfying so we need a whole of government approach on how we're going to prevent this from happening in two thousand eighteen or the Russians are going to say Aha we got a great return on the ruble for doing this all these actions Russians have done what are we doing on a government wide standpoint to prevent this from happening twenty eighteen with congressional elections in twenty twenty work leading an eye in the Senate Intel Committee but Senate businesses continuing to let me make two comments I one of the really disappointing twenty sixteen we can ramp it up even more in two thousand eighteen number one number two in terms of the president I know the that points and I made this both in the particularly in the open hearing when I asked the leadership of the Intel community all right guys you know we've seen this coincidental series of deaths I think rate a lot of eyebrows last weekend do you think this is something that we should aw on criminal justice reform is that Mitch McConnell pulled it because people like Jesse anti cotton another villain in the story where like we don't have an over incarceration problem we have in under in Carson I mean in addition to smoke national security expert in Clint Watts testified that there have been more dead Ryan testified before the Senate Intel Committee He Disney audience that's where I that's where I heard his name and he has five that there have been more dead Russians in the past three months than there are tied to this investigation they're dropping dead even in western countries and he's referring to that Yep I know you can't say anything here here's somebody who is a whole bunch of stuff and Adam Schiff quote and respond Sir you are you guys on speaker like Lester Holt yet what the pace that I'd like to see but to do this right and do this meticulously do this in a bipartisan fashion at the end of the day at the pace from your audience that we're going about is not as fast as they'd like frankly as somebody who's pretty impatient it's not always Works on everything at this point Republicans who are working with US already and many others who I think will will continue to work or will work with us if you continue to see things during the last couple of years of frankly most of the years of the Obama Administration as so in that unit unified the Democrats I'm a fearful that if we simply try to this is much more important actually than even this president this is about whether our democratic existence can be maintained in the twenty first century the Republicans who I I think will work with US WANNA work with this may not be fully there yet that gives them an ability for the rally as a team because if we look like we're simply obstructionists I remember how frustrated we all were with the constant obstruction we saw against Merrick garland and against the crap I mean are we left with either hoping that we get a few sensible Republicans in the Senate to come along to sort of demand some this accountability or that's really important and then in terms of the activities of the Senate I've I've said we should not be appointing an FBI director until we get that special prosecutor. I BELIEVE WE DOC in new FBI director you know we would need Republican votes for that because with fifty one votes they can appoint a new FBI director without any Democrats so at what point did notable areas and then the Senate investigation itself is we've Kinda gone through and and looked at the raw intelligence we've got some more follow up to do their confirming what we already the Democrat Unit Democratic Unity In in defensive what you're talking about 'cause people like Lindsey Graham or Susan Collins or or Rand Paul or any of the other people or Ben Sasse who I think would be in the buck bucket of let's just you know bring everything to a screeching halt my fear on that would be that that gives issues a a whole new area the investigation that May provide some valuable input so we're looking at this and more I need to find out whether these tapes exist number one to make sure that the preserve and three even my republican colleagues this past Sunday Lindsey Graham and Mike Lee said if there are tapes Congress is going to get a look at them so I think we're seeing movements kind of across the whole country from all parts the kind of of the political landscape there saying hey this kind of behavior cannot be countenanced and we've got a follow and get some of this stuff done like you know the special prosecutor is dependent on whether Rosenstein decides to appoint a special prosecutor it's ultimately his decision trying to all the facts out and Komi it'll be part of that I think frankly the the letters we sent to the Treasury Financial Center which called Fincen Department to kind of follow the money tapes and the Dakota firing and other activities you know they'll go back into a hey this is team sports when actually this is much more important than team sports this is just how about Russian interference were now starting to get to some of the people that were affiliated with the trump campaign we've sent out one subpoena if we don't get all the information we've requested after he'd been the assaulted by a country that at least when I grow up was our leading adversary so I don't understand about that is why we'll be sending out more subpoenas to more individuals I hope the the the first subpoena that went to Flynn will will let me say the word convinced the approach and this is this is too important then who's GonNa score short-term political points when we're talking about the fundamental character some Democrats are talked about just halting all Senate business until something happens like what's our choice here well I you know listen there many of my colleagues Oh you guys in parts of the resistance would want us to do we're just going to bring everything to a grinding halt then those against an independent FBI I don't think I don't think they will even turn against our efforts to say hey we're not gonNA confirming the FBI Director in two we get a special prosecutor or until we get existence of the tapes because those are all things that are still there is a nexus connection if we say as I know revenue going to require passing a law and then required this president who'll make appointments to a commission that I'm not sure would be truly independent but we're starting witnesses they ought to go ahead and cooperate with us but we're we've shown we're gonNA use our tools that we got Carter page is lost on MSNBC set somewhere failure relying on the president saying he's had a great dinner with president she so I would put the North Korea incident but the other incident I would put up there element of China Russia actually uniquely enough and South Korea and Japan and that's where we need a full fledged strategy rather than simply I I'm not sure Mr Page will be necessarily the final truth revealed I guess the question is what Levers of power we have what I've said from the beginning if at some point this you know this this avenues not working I'll be the first to sign up for another avenue but recognizing another that show what ability to kind of extract ransom and across the whole uk a public life. I gotTa do it right I gotta look back at the end of the day and so this product is close to possible as being bipartisan and that we got to the truth I think it's going to be reports would would lead to believe we all should be one I'm concerned too I'll get a full brief this week three short of military strikes the only way that we can rain in North Carolina North Korea is with active in the president fired the head of the FBI. I mean this is amazing I mean no FBI head has ever been dismissed and without costs because I would not call or any other people who have shown some sort of semblance of throughout this process why would it why would it why would why would they turn against the idea of an independent FBI would cause them no I don't think that they will turn the fact that he's doing an investigation the president legitimate cause to fire the FBI director. Yeah I don't think we would either so last question senator thank you so much for your time it's easy we're kind of a better chance of getting to the truth if we can do this with some collaboration cooperation with Republicans because frankly the ability to get all the information in healthcare system in a series mostly of European and Russian computer networks the asymmetrical nature of cyber threats is something that I believe ah through all the craziness trump to forget about the real even more dangerous challenges happening out there in the world over the weekend the North Koreans tested a medium range ballistic rocket premium frames not plastic here they have lots of styles to choose from Classic Trendy Round Aviator Mirrored Polarized for him in her was the email about the sunglasses recent view if the audience wants to stay up at night and Frat which I spent a lot of nights doing that was the was a massive cyber attack that took place on on Friday have them because you could use sunglasses they were tired of having to pay for cheaply made throwaway shades or overpriced designer sunglasses so they said fuck it will make our own it says screw in in the a writ large definitely ranks top three in terms of overall threats to our country and and you know we're we rely upon technology that many ways that could be spoken senators who have been working with us or might be inclined to work with are going to say Aha the Democrats are simply overreaching at this point it's much easier for them to go back into a Fox pick up the pace right now now this is an and we're starting to see obviously reactions wouldn't remember we're having this conversation today less than a week after Bruce if we've got a bipartisan approach will will you come back on and tell us when it's time to pull the fire alarm and and you no longer have confidence that this thing is proceeding in a bipartisan com slash crooked movement for how they revolutionized the watch industry now's the time to check out their sunglasses go to movement dot com slash crooked that's envy emt dot com slash crooked success of our democracy. I mean you know I I've I've said this repeatedly and I know it sounds a little hackneyed at this point you know this is the most important thing I've ever taken on him Achilles heel on that other than that let's stay tuned this week stay tune this week before we talk next time we'll we'll be a better way to cash on the Pied in-studio who host of pod save up to fight youtube don't go anywhere this is pod save America and there's more on the way positive America's brought to movement watches you guys know movement they can carry a nuclear warhead which is viewed as a major technological leap forward in their program have you been briefed on this advancement and are are you as concern these join the movement how these look good movement is a better way to see support Jeff and Andy as always used the square cash out watches it's not did it again except this time with sunglasses that surprise to me little surprise me too maybe a chance to look at those tapes us well Senator Warner Vice Chair of the Intel Committee from the Great Commonwealth thank you so much for joining us guys ticker talk about branding and whether you should be taking photos at the growth love it I haven't seen you since since another party that would be bad for branding as long as I don't have to pay your it's about John Bachelor Party Tommy now we're talking about paying something for John's Bash Party you're making this sound longtime ago you're sure to find the perfect fail here it is get fifteen percent off today look at love it's it's about to happen for him on the shipping and free returns by going to end the MT dot loud was the Jeff sessions decision from last week to rollback the Obama administration reforms on sentencing What was your reaction to that it is attacks but I decided to up the ante hair because we have an explicit rating Benedetti we caught that starting at just seventy dollars moving glasses start seventy dollars with the option to upgrade to polarized definitely want to get some voting rights people but this could be really damaging I think we we don't know what the consequences are yet because like it just happened so rosy but it's important that prosecutors even hold their came out the statement that was like polarized lenses those overpriced designer brands will upwards of two hundred dollars it's true movement figured out the by selling online they're able to cut out the middleman and retail markups providing the best possible price he's our high quality got to pay their great I did to get the email I think I think you clearly got the email that said guys let me know which sunglasses you want to send them to you all right right you have the cash out all the Russians bribing the trump officials Carter page everyone else it is the best lease annoying way to pay someone back you don't have to worry about social media door about anything else links directly to your bank account the deposit happens instantly I'm not even

trump America prosecutor Senator Mark Warner Jim Komi Blue Apron Senate Intel Committee Blue Apron White House Cahan SNL vice chair Pudsey Los Angeles jared Kushner Valentine James Comey Mr Schiff Jon Favreau
Keluarga Islami - Selingkuh Memicu Keretakan Rumah Tangga (Ustadz Arifin, S.H.I)

Radio Fajri 99.3FM

12:31 min | 9 months ago

Keluarga Islami - Selingkuh Memicu Keretakan Rumah Tangga (Ustadz Arifin, S.H.I)

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Hamdullah solaire sony la ponkin gannett Black union yuka la zena siggia zena kamala Fadiman Abi la kellyanne kaji roca licata kanye dandy neri zena martha dean bernie cahan Tara yin benyamin Nia moral amato ill muneer molly carpenter alma johansson
NGOPI #25 - Anak Berbakti, Orang Tua Pun Senang Hati (Ustadz Dr. Fachri Fachrudin, S.H.I, M.E.I.)

Radio Fajri 99.3FM

55:25 min | 7 months ago

NGOPI #25 - Anak Berbakti, Orang Tua Pun Senang Hati (Ustadz Dr. Fachri Fachrudin, S.H.I, M.E.I.)

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Using Evidence-Based Policy to Further Equality

GovExec Daily

13:02 min | 6 months ago

Using Evidence-Based Policy to Further Equality

"This guy date bring you the federal stories. That really matter is february. Second twenty twenty one. I'm restaurant for today after an election. That partially hinged on how americans see racing privilege president. Joe biden pledged that his administration would focus on making the united states more equitable than last week. Biden signed a series of executive orders addressing racial inequalities in the us he noted during the signing event that he would direct the whole of the government to the cause. I believe this nation and this government need to change your whole approach to the issue of racial equity. We need to open the promise. America every american and that means we need to make the issue of racial equity not just an issue for any one department of government it has to be the business of the whole of government the task cahan is ongoing and one with no real discernible end point but there are ways of measuring the diversity equity and inclusion progress made by the us government. Evidence based policy is one way to effect change. Thanks to a two thousand seventeen commission. Congress has started to require federal agencies develop learning agendas in agencies are now required to produce annual evaluation plans chart what studies. They'll conduct to assess the effectiveness of their programs. This kind of data collection evidence building can move policy forward toward racial justice. Diversity increased equity across all groups. Our guest today recently wrote an op. Ed in the hill newspaper arguing for more used of evidence-based policy-making including potentially putting together a bipartisan expert commission to improve government investment in diversity equity and inclusion robert shea wrote the op-ed headlined realizing america's promise of diversity equity and inclusion figure out what works he is a national managing principal for public policy at grant thornton national academy of public administration fellow and one of the hosts of the fed heads podcasts. After a short break he'll join me to discuss his op-ed and how the biden administration can better effectively promote diversity equity and inclusion over the past year we've seen nationwide protests in the streets for civil rights fostering broader conversations about systemic racism and police violence in the united states with this new introspection. There've been looks the federal government to be a leader diversity and inclusion. In fact just last week. President joe biden signed a series of executive orders aimed racial equality and an op. Ed in hillary salihi our guest today argues for more evidence based policy to encourage diversity equity and inclusion as a national managing principal for public policy at grant thornton. A national academy of public administration fellow and one of the hosts of the fed has podcasts. He previously served for six years. The associate director for the us office of management and budget and as senior management council for the senate committee on governmental affairs. He joins Daily now to discuss his bed and how government competitor effectively promote diversity equity and inclusion. Welcome back to the program. Thank you how are you. We're doing okay. So what is the government's role in promoting a diversity equity and inclusion. So that's probably worth its own podcast But the there's there's virtually no facet of the government that's not trying in some way to Reverse inequality or to address a racial equity You know in procurement there are programs to specifically promote growth of underprivileged underserved communities to have women on growth in win women owned businesses minority owned businesses likewise there are job programs that try to promote job growth among minority communities there are programs that In ensure those communities have advantages in housing And the historical inequalities that arena are addressed And there are programs that are designed to ensure our policing Is at least cognizant not curing racial inequality. So you know one of the points i make in my op. Ed is that the government really doesn't know how many programs it has aimed at these objectives and the getting a handle on. That is a pretty good first step in figuring out what we ought to do. More than what we might. Don't do less up as always identifying the problem as you just noted as is the first step in a lotta ways. So how can evidence based policy be used in the space so as you know. Russell has been a growth in trying to evaluate what we're doing to see how we can do better That was the point of the commission on evidence based policymaking the evidence based policymaking foundations for having face policy-making act We need to figure out what we know already. What has already been evaluated one of those evaluation results. Tell us about what's working. What's not what we can do better And we ought to really try to learn from those studies and apply them to what we're doing now or what we propose to do in the future to ensure that we get better and better over time. That's the whole evidence behind learning agenda. Make sure that we as a government we as agencies program managers are learning what we've done in the past so that we get better and better in the future. This is a little bit the board but you know. Are we seeing more evidence evidence based policy in these lanes. And what do you think the future is for that it I know nobody likes to put on the the fortune teller hat. But what do you see sort of future in that sense. Yeah i think The growth in evaluation of programs aimed that imploring racial inequality Are the probably mirror growth in other areas so while we've got strong growth in labor department education we might not have a sufficient focus on developing a good foundation of evidence in the criminal justice or in the federal procurement arena. So it probably mirrors a lot of growth in this area across the government. So in your op ed. In hilly talk about a commission like where does that fit into this. Is that part of the answer. I'm loath to recommend a commission to solve another problem. But i do think we should step back and say what are we already doing. Let's take a good solid inventory of the programs that are aimed at diversity equity and inclusion. So we get a good idea of what the landscape is That'll tell us a. I'll give a good bird's eye view of what areas where we're not doing enough But then we should you know. See what we know about those programs. How deep can we go in telling ourselves weather. These programs are working or not And then take even a bigger step back and say. How are we going to measure these programs going going forward. Should we gathered data consistently from these programs and report them transparently. And then. what's what's our evaluation program. How are we going to assess these more rigorously to ensure that what we're doing is having the intended impact. So how does our current political atmosphere. I do you think that factors into this as far as any movement. How will that be received. Sort of in our broader Political world do think. Yeah i like to think what you are talking about. Right now is not controversial because the government has already made a decision to invest in these areas in some cases those programs are already being a valuable doing a better job of gathering. That information candidly assessing what works Seems to me it should be not controversial. Now there are those who may say taking a critical added. Some of these programs is holding them. To some unfair standard likewise. There are some who might say we shouldn't be doing this at all I should be more empathetic with those points of view but i'm not I think we should make sure that taxpayers are getting good results for their money. And i do think. This is a very important area in which to invest federal government efforts as i mentioned the show Joe biden signed a slew of executive orders last week to tackle racial equity From the administration standpoint. What do you think those he ozone. And i guess to end up. What do you think his administration is going to be with. Regards racial equity Inclusion and diversity so Dizzying i think is the right word to describe the amount of executive orders coming out of the white house and memo's for that matter What i was most excited to see was this Equitable data working group. Now we can. We can Debate whether or not data can be equitable But what they're getting at is making sure that when we collect data. We're doing a good job of of collecting it in such a way that we can disaggregated statistics by race. Ethnicity gender disability. What have you Which is a great a contribution to the conversation about what impact. We're having so whether you've got A housing program a jobs program a federal procurement program. A criminal justice program being able to array the the incredible amount of data. The gunman arctic collects in. This way. should give you an idea of what impact. You're having on these important demographics You know i. I frankly think the government has a history of letting minority communities down in. Its work in this area and one of the reasons i have made. This recommendation is because. I'm frankly struggling with how to contribute to the conversation and i don't want us to lose Attention lose focus on on this issue. you know we. We got a lot on our plate. Covid economic crisis climate This is one of the four pillars of the administration. So they're making it a priority autoshow show dividends But again our history is littered with efforts that have lost focus. And i hope that's not the case here. They've certainly Talked a lot about it. And the president has inauguration speech hammered home The emphasis that we all have On this and the responsibility that we have robert thanks so much read on the show. Russ thanks for having me. Thanks for listening to music. Daily for february second daily produced the butler and hosted by me rush opportune. Thank grant thornton's robert shea for joining the program. Our music is a song signals by catfish dancing. We should review and subscribe to apple. Podcasts google podcasts. Or wherever you get your podcasts you can email us any feedback podcast of executive comp or hit us up on twitter at gove exotic. We'd love to hear from him. We'll talk to you later.

america department of government cahan robert shea grant thornton national academ biden administration Ed President joe biden hillary salihi national academy of public adm us office of management and bu senate committee on government federal government Joe biden fed commission on evidence based p grant thornton Biden Congress ed
Conoce ms de "Kitty Paez" el personaje de Bad Bunny en Netflix | #Podcast

Frequencia Urbana Podcast

24:35 min | 9 months ago

Conoce ms de "Kitty Paez" el personaje de Bad Bunny en Netflix | #Podcast

"Lee began today as meditation with the few sipping exercises to remind us. A little treat can go a long way so pick up your mccafe. iced coffees. Close your eyes and deep seven and deep satisfaction out. Take a treat retreat at mcdonald's right now mcafee iced coffee and any size and any flavor for just ninety nine cents until seven. Am price of participation. may vary bienvenida. Gwen showed deny ticket. They are la- christina. Low key undergoing alex frequency eat too much. Noise demon opie. Komo's stan own umbrella. Then i don i don't goals tigana then go out and ties him. Madonna kusaba over tower loizeau. Ucla let me throw it. Okay don't always the net flicks Combat bottom parlamento press. Dan said he had nine. See those thousand latino. Help del mal for their balakot. Hourly i welter paragraph political bottle north. Tommy gone on at like you are in al mal lager for lobbying arm anti-gay so it so willing bolt on there and say like thirty nine girls. How radical yeoman's okay. Joe antipolo mental la la salle grumble Hockey the nfc bogere dole. Nalco be there. I don't go early. a butcher. on comment he go. Presumably they'd bring don't work in that big. I'm on iowa well being being literally the procedural of uncommon he go and premium traffic. Like intramuros. Child will laima gumbo. Ian gotta them bora nearly there any yossi our yard work's tell us from pimple but i e balmoral day they'll die Pulse on interpreter bony area. They were bonnie hellman into equally alto. Alto pice alto. I don't know pies. And lebanon buys. And i both alumni juniors the hallway from the can say shocking to me nylon like i at Unbelievable la la. They're not going to say in say about pocket includes la on boban tomorrow high going blemish software blush tokelau now ohio on roha bill zoe as an ncaa bony getting night s. He said about komo. It'd been bland cultivable blanqui at l. I'll retire on and basically Doodo bias and the is calm by spies. Compare a when he got him. 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The Glass House of Immigration

In The Thick

45:19 min | 7 months ago

The Glass House of Immigration

"Hey julio and life can be stressful. Even under normal circumstances this year has been especially challenging. That's where head space comes in. It's an easy to use app. That gives you your daily dose of mindfulness through guided meditations techniques at the end of each day. And they work. You deserve to feel happier and head space. Meditation made simple go to head space dot com slash the thick that's head space dot com slash in the thick for a free one-month trial. You get access to head spaces full library of meditations for every situation. This is the best deal offered right now. Head to head space dot com slash in the thick today. Hi this is kara. Swisher and i wanna talk to you about my new podcast for the new york times called sway. If you want to know what people who hold power in our world are really all about you need to hear how they answer the tough questions and that is my specialty and although it might get messy as it always does. It's also going to be really fun. You can get sway wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes are available. Mondays and thursdays. There's no privilege to repeating basic errors that we have been. We need to try to do better and we must do better. Welcome to the thick this podcast politics race and culture from a poc perspective. Wholesome hulu recovery and joining us from phoenix. Arizona areas soda altered coolest date forever and ever and ever. He's fabulous eddie. She's an immigrant rights activists and chief advocacy officer for the organization uses which stands for refugee and immigrant center for education and legal services. Also one of my favorite organizations and she's the host of their podcast homeland insecurity puzzle. Eighty guy oh thank you so much for having we absolutely and joining us from inglewood. California is non Each she is an attorney and executive director of also one of my all time favorite organizations as well the black alliance for just immigration so. Welcome not bank. You great to be here good to have you here or we're going to start with the latest. That's happening because in the last few weeks. That trump is serving as president. It's like he's still trying to fuck with immigration issues like he's just like it's not enough still gonna mess with this so just last week. The department of homeland security and the department of justice said that they were implementing new restrictions on immigrants seeking asylum. I'm like bro. How much more can you restrict. Okay how much more can you restrict. This is going to make it easier for people to be denied their asylum applications the administration also rolled out a new citizenship test. Sure that's longer and more difficult to said that too okay and as if trump could take the test and pass i mean. I'm sorry it's the truth. It's earlier in december. A federal judge ruled that the trump administration must reinstate fully the deferred action for childhood arrivals program known as daca which could affect around one point. Three million eligible people according to the migration policy institute. So eddie what can we expect in these final weeks of trump's term. What is it like for you as you're watching what's going on and what's your temperature. Check now. I gotta be honest. I got no patience. But what's going on for you. Yeah honestly i am hoping look when he comes to policies like he has already done everything that he basically has wanted on immigration. Maybe he wants more but he literally changed about four hundred policies. Four one hundred policies just on executive actions ask the president ray and so he has changed immigration especially asylum ray he wanted to end asylum for asylum seekers and he's you know even asylum for us. Nc he's still rolling now. The president sees to make it harder till the end up to the us and to criminalise immigrants even more. And so we're going to see a lot more of that. Unfortunately until the end of his presidency. I hope he doesn't do any crazy. Things with is and you know one thing. I was talking to my colleagues about like i just really hope. He's not going to go out. And you know do mass rates or anything like that. Because it's so scary for our communities. But i i really think he's gonna try to do everything scour before. He leaves office to leave a mess for the vitamin ministration. Nana feeling of what's going on. At the end of the trump era this is like one of those cartoons very much more serious where like the evil character just keeps coming up with evil things to do like one of those shows of the path was. Let's boil them in oil right right. Roadrunner them into a shark infested ocean. It's clearly this intent to make sure that the lives of immigrants or as miserable as possible to cause as much harm in trauma as possible and when we look at black immigrants specifically. We're looking at a population. That's really disproportionately impacted by these rules. So the asylum rules restricting it even more even though this is. us law as well as international law. that there are certain categories of people that can seek asylum in this country. He's just you know. God completely against that and has people languishing and dying at the border. Y- because he can and the cruelty is the point when you look at the visa restrictions he's has a visa restriction now for certain countries and you'll notice with those countries are many of them african countries where he wants you to come visit your relatives to post a fifteen thousand dollar baht. When we look at what decisions he's made with respect to keeping folks out and returning folks who are trying to come in blaming it on the public health crisis that he doesn't believe in by the way like you don't believe in kuroda buyer so i don't understand how you're pushing back unaccompanied minors and saying they can't come into the country because of corona virus right again the cruelty clearly the point and this effort to keep this idea of the us as a white ethno state right to appeal to that make america white not again because it never was white but make america. White finally is clear in all of the decisions. He's making right now right and all you've mentioned some of those examples but looking at what we've seen in the last four years. I mean trump administration crisis at the border the systemic separation of families the repeated attempts of rescinding the daca program talking about the cartoons. Must rescind the daca program. Like let me do it this way and things like that. You know the mess as everyone has said it has had this real catastrophic human impact and yet eddie like what you said. Before according to the migration policy institute trump and the trump administration made some four hundred changes to immigration during his term. Which i was like whoa but we also want to get into what policy will look like under the biden harris administration. Now president elect. Joe biden has said in his first hundred days that he plans to introduce a bill with a pathway to citizenship for the roughly eleven million undocumented immigrants as well as halt all deportations. He's been on record and he said that but we also know that biden did not include immigration as part of his top four priorities which are listed as follows the coronavirus pandemic covey racial equity and climate change. I would argue that immigration. It should be interconnected all those. But what am i you know. I don't know anything about policy but listen also this story by. Npr on sunday reported that a person with knowledge of the transition conversations said it was intentionally left out talking about immigration. because and i'm quoting immigration. Activists had become too adversarial. So here we go. There's this fear and etiquette. And i have talked about it several times. It's one of my ongoing conversations. That biden's plan is going to revert back to obama era policies but progressives are really using this moment to push for more comprehensive reform right. So that's all like some pretty insane bullshit right. They're put in. And i mean because just the pettiness. It's so petty. The pettiness is that oh hell adversarial guests with us. Yes and in fact representative pramilla giant paul of washington state plans to introduce a resolution once the new term begins in two thousand twenty one calling for these reforms from expanding immigrants access to healthcare and housing to ending all deportations and even if biden does end up pushing for some of these reforms. There's a lot at stake. The georgia runoff elections in early january. Of course they're going to determine whether the democrats will get a senate majority and of course with the new supreme court confirmation of coney barrett. You've got a more conservative leaning supreme court majority. That's just for real so on one hand you have some democrats saying you know important reform is going to be too radical and the other hand you've got republicans and we know where they kind of stan. So am i right about this whole thing. You know the time is now. How many times have black women have. They been told you need to just wait. Am i right absolutely. I mean it is very clear from speaking with the transition team. All of these meetings that folks are in in the end it officially and unofficially right that they biden administration is about to be to the right of obama policy. It's not going to be obama policy. I think that that is too high and expectations. Wow my expectation is that it's gonna be to the right. Okay that's frightened. People are so traumatized by what's happened. You're saying it's going to be more in line to sort of more of a trump lean than an obama. Guess wow yes. Because i think that you know people are so excited about the fact that it's not trump because they just don't have the person that's sitting wringing their hands coming up with all the ways to torture us that any looks like a lot when you're talking about adversarial you'd have organizations and maria. You know i've talked about this. I feel like immigration rights organizations are being collaborative and are going out of their way too much interesting line themselves up with the biden campaign into sing the praises of biden harris before they've even started into tell our communities that things are going to be. You know it's like the end of the wiz where they're crawling out of the guerrilla outlaid. Can you same day. You don't mean loving your comparisons dunes in the whizz. Let's go you did know that. Who is like broadway musical maniac. Totally rope bad. Yeah exactly but that's what is being presented. And i feel like no. Actually what we need to do is not present sort of like the orderly. We're trying to come to you. Respectability politics that he needs to be facing chaos and confusion. He needs to be looking around saying. I actually don't know which way these people are coming. Next i better pay attention to what they're saying. And i think that when we look at how this administration spoke to black people remember he said. Look what people don't know about me. Is i come from a state. Is the eight largest black population america. The eighth largest. I get ninety. Six percent of that vote for the last forty years is. They're they're the folks they say. My way brung me to the dance. that's how i got elected every single time. Because he tries to use ebonics. Did you hear that audio right. Oh my god so disrespectful. And he made it clear that he's not gonna use the executive order to provide the basics where the people he claimed. Put him there and it's almost a form of anti blackness itself for people immigrant rights. Feel to feel like we're gonna do better than african americans are with bite in komo now so we really cannot move forward. I think this is where the four of us are in agreement. And obviously we're just too uppity to be thinking this way. You have got to grapple with your parents. You have to open your eyes and see it. Yeah right erica. Your podcast homeland. Insecurity looks at the history of immigration. And how it's been enforced through the department of homeland security now so in your first episode you get into the formation of dhs post nine eleven. And i would ended up. targeting immigrants. Ziglar spoke up in that very first meeting and said sir. We can't do this anti-american you can't go around and start arresting people in interrogating them on a thin pretexts. This is not what we do as a country. Sigler lost the argument american. Stay want to hear about gathering intelligence. After nine eleven. They wanted to see action. They wanted to see that. Tough guys actually being ashcroft pronouncements that we're going to use every tool we've got and we're if they're terrorists are out there they should be scared and we're gonna find him and we're gonna throw him in prison all that stuff. I think played very well to a public. That was extremely scared and worried after nine. Eleven cared if a few immigrants had their rights violated if it kept everyone else say. But that's say slippery slope stopping common enemy at all caused might sound like a good idea but the enemy of the government one day might be different than next in once made it okay to violate the civil liberties of groups so people. That's hard to walk back right and so you know what was happening. Then 'cause i live right through it right is that it was not enough to target muslims. Who was like. Wait wait wait. Muslims are also immigrants. And so let's just go after everything right here post nine eleven and we know that anti immigrant policy didn't start with trump. Hello president clinton We don't have to go that far back. We all know and have very complex and yet unforgiving feelings for the obama administration so cuss of being so notorious. And for me you know. It's not just that he was the chief. It's like bro. you're a constitutional legal expert. You know that people are being denied due process just because they weren't born in this country and you know while biden has admitted the mistakes of the administration finally made a mistake made to took too long to get it right. Took too long to get it right. I'll be president. United states not vice president states. He also admitted these policies will take time this whole thing of like. Oh did take time round up. I'm like you know i'm tired. I'm not gonna take that as an excuse not as a journalist but as my responsibility as an american yeah so eric knowing this history and biden's own past record i mean how are you processing. This new administration can really deal with the problems. That trump is created. If they don't say we were part of the problem too. Yeah look first of all. They definitely have to admit that they were part of the problem. I mean you know one of the things that we try to do with. The podcast was like looking at the history of immigration policy preston lens. This is literally like us telling the story. You know. Starting from nine eleven. Obviously there's a lot of anti-immigrant crap that happened before nine. Eleven to but starting from nine eleven he was people and then obama and then trump and the here comes our next criminalized ayden and to me if they don't acknowledge everything that went wrong. First of all see that they were trying the legislation in congress. Fortunately trying i really don't think they were trying but they said that they were trying by enforcing immigration in a way. That was completely inhumane to try to get republicans on board or try to get some of the centrist democrats onboard in that created this huge deportation machine that now was handed over to trump so that he could make it even worse right and so they have to nachos the knowledge that they also have to act on it right and what makes me so frustrated right now in the conversation that happened on twitter with the npr article. That just came out. Is you know when. I saw the priorities list on the website that they announced and i saw no mention of immigration even in some other areas they talked about there was hardly any mention of immigrants right on racial justice on economic recovery. Everything that they said there was hardly any mention about immigration climate change. They're all connected. They are all connected crazy to like one mention of power connected to 'immigration and so to me the fact that he's not even part of their priorities and i noticed just the web but you know we. We all live through the obama era. We all saw that. It was so easy you know. Through rhetoric to say that they supported emigrants but then when we started actually trying to negotiate with the white house on cowan dapo these policies. We saw over and over again that you know they didn't wanna do it. He was not a priority for them. And i hope that changes i. I don't know. I mean. I can hold but i just. I'm not seeing yet. Yeah you know. One of the things have all this in terms of the narrative right and again you're all touching upon it every everyone of you. That's where i like rolling with the three of you like the wiz. Can we go down the yellow brick road for a second still stuck on that but we also want to talk about some of the biggest moves right. That biden has made for immigration. Already i mean. I've written about this and we've talked about it. But there are some pics for his various roles in this administration and one of the first ones is cuban-born hundred on my gus whose cuban american he will be the first latino head of dhs if he gets appointed and confirm pd. Tolbert who i know. And i know other people on this show no who worked with immigration advocacy group. America's voice she was appointed a deputy communications director for the biden administration. Then have yet best era. There we go rolling. The r's like i'm supposed to Was nominated for secretary of the department of health and human services. Hhs which makes him the first latino in that role if confirmed right. But there's all this notion of activists are still very skeptical of what impact this representation will really make and wondering if these appointments are just to soften the blow. Because i think that's those are questions that are coming out. What do you think about these. Latino picks just in general this diversifying the whole notion of representation as may be softening the messaging or the blow of policies. It just a miscalculation of the problem. What do you think the impact will be. I think that i find it interesting. That people are desirous of the privilege to make the same mistakes had been made in the past as opposed to learning from the mistakes of the past so again there's something that we have in our immigrant rights movement where we somehow think that our situation is gonna be different than that of the black people who gave over four hundred years to this country. Obama was a black president. Right and i can go down the line in the elected office world and talk about the ways in which having black folks in pie places has not met that. You didn't have harm right. So they're talking about having for example a black man be the secretary of defense. I don't think my people wanted africa or in the caribbean or in south america central america should be doing a lot of joy and thinking that all of a sudden they're not gonna be getting bombed etc right. We know that that doesn't mean anything. Because it's the structures. It's the institutions. It's not just the individuals inside nice to have some friends with inva- glasshouse but it doesn't stop the fact that we still have needs and that they are only going to be able to provide so much and then lastly i'll say this. The immigration policies of this country are based upon a notion of the dehumanisation the non citizen rights and citizen really being defined as the white person and so when we look at whoever we have in charge of homeland security. The question is as long as it's homeland security and they're dealing with people in ways that deny them their human respect and deny them their human dignity it doesn't matter who's they're pulling the levers if that was true for obama. It's going to be true for my yorkers and every ever black and brown migrant that they put in these positions and we have to be clear on that because there's no privilege to repeating basic errors. You know that we have done up into the presents no privilege. We need to try to do better. And we must do better right because it's like reform. Are you kidding. Me way reform erica. Did you had some thoughts on that. I completely agree. This is one of the things. That is really really hard for me. When i see another press release saying you know which is higher this latina latino or whatever they density into this specific position. So now we're we're good ray. We're good to go. This is we marked the little box there. Right and it's hard for me to just not cringe. Enroll my eyes because we were again going back in and we have a lot of scars from the obama era. And i'm just kind of showing them right now but the hard part is you know this. I mean i remember every single time we were trying to push for dhaka. This is something that's already in place. The american public loves in every poll rate. This is policy. Were pushing in two thousand eleven thousand and twelve and people like him in others who were empower who are people of color or latinos rate. They were opposing it and they were pushing back against activists and against all of us who were pushing for that and now it's a reality. People are defending and so to me. It has to be more than that. We have to have representation in these positions of power but eagles beyond that. It's also about the theology and also the accountability that has to be taken from them. Like they're gonna be in positions of power. They have to understand that. There's going to be accountability in the actions that they take from the activists community and the organising community. We're going to have to do it because it's just that's how democracy works. The other thing is that immigration does not mean non. black latinx ex- right right right. And when i'm asking as e. d. of bozzi as a black migrant rooted woman. What does this person's my orchestra. What does his nomination mean for. Black people brain. You can't answer the question. You literally have nothing to say. We think it's going to help all people and that's a complete insult you know it's a complete insult and it shows for black migrants that hey we're on our own and we're going to latin netra asian muslim. If you're black we're gonna have to figure out how to make this happen ourselves. And that is not what should be happening. This is sarah scenic hosted the serial. Podcast i wanna tell you about our new show nice white parents. Reporter hana joffe. Walt spent years looking into this one middle school in her neighborhood. She must gated the school's history and finally realized she could put a name to the unspoken force that kept getting in the way of making the school. Better white parents. How white parents can mess things up for everyone else without even knowing it. Nice white parents is made by cyril productions new york times company. Wherever you get your we need to talk about this from the level of dehumanisation during and other ring we experience the dehumanisation in frontal ways. The murder of george floyd in front of our faces. The dehumanisation of immigrants is something that is so sinister and seeped into everything. And that's why it's so dangerous the fact that it wasn't named as one of his top priorities because it's a bigger issue. We're talking about here. It's not just immigration. It's a much bigger issue about where your head and where your values and biden isn't going to be just inheriting these last four years of the horrific trump immigration policies. He's coming into office at a time when we're facing one of the worst health crises in history in this country which has disproportionately impacted black and brown communities. We all know this. So erica on the homeland insecurity podcast. You recently did an episode about kovic in detention camps. Let's take a listen. When the pandemic hit immigration advocates lawyers and up people attain inside started clamoring for relief. Feel safe at all and this is not only me. Everybody heated feeling the same. This is dr series gari. He's sixty years old and has a history of new monja in lung infection. Which means he's high risk for covid nineteen he called us from wing correctional facility in louisiana. He was attained there in late. March of two thousand twenty two for the virus is absolute angeles. He's terrified covid. Nineteen is going to kill him what he's trapping displays. Doctors gary material science professor at tarif university of technology in iran. He came to the states in twenty seventeen for what he thought would be a short visit to me. His daughter's fiance while he was on his life coming here. The us cancel his visa when he landed. He was arrested for allegedly stealing trade secrets. On previous trips as well as visa fraud he was released on bond and stayed with his daughter while fighting his gaze for two and a half years the judge throughout the case mid trial citing that there was not enough evidence that doctors gerry had down any of the things he was accused of acquittal. He was finally ready to go back home to his wife in iran but instead he was taken into ice custody because of all the news of corona virus doctors garry asked a friend to package few mass and sent he stuff to him in detention spoke to the managing editor management or requested the mexico myself and others each thirty and all but two of them elderly said. No you heard that rate. He brought his own mass detention in the management. Wouldn't let him or anyone else. use them. And you know what the story really does. Is it humanizes the impact of this system and the dangers of covid in detention camps. And we've been reporting on the tragic cases of covid deaths in these places and the lack of testing and healthcare access for detainees who by the way read. Write watch tv. The news like they want to be painted as like. They're just some massive brown matt. No down they want help and they know that they deserve it right and we also know that there's so many inequities right. It's latino and black communities about four times more likely to be hospitalized for covid than others. And that's according to the cdc and of course essential workers who've had to continue working through this pandemic are from immigrant communities and many of them are undocumented and the millions of undocumented immigrants in this country weren't able to benefit from any federal coronavirus relief and access to healthcare is a huge problem. We've been talking about the glimmer of hope with the vaccine and on monday. The first person in new york received the coronavirus vaccine. She's a black woman nursing queens. Who's part of this first phase of rollouts going to frontline healthcare workers but when it comes to vaccines distributions. They're still distrust in black and brown communities who have for decades face racism and health healthcare. So talk to me a little bit more about the pandemic's impact on immigrant communities. First of all there's no reason ray. Now why we have immigrants in detention period right regardless of covid but just the fact that you add this layer of danger into people's lives who are currently detained because are waiting for an immigration judge to hear their case rate. Somebody who's here just asking for asylum or you know who's here waiting to see if they're going to be able to stay and they have to wait and then detention center because of the current policies and now they're fearing for their lives so to me. This is a no brainer. That should have been fixed a long time ago and i really really hope it's not just the hope of it. But also we're going to be pushing for the biden administration to ensure that we are shutting down detention centers. We want just real quick store you know when we started working under cova raises a lot of our attorneys actually represent people who are settled detention centers. Both in family detention. Would there's mothers fathers and children and also adult detention and since the very beginning people literally learned about the pandemic because they're watching the news on television not because of the guards not because with actual detention center. But because of tb they learned there was a pandemic and so to me since that very very beginning was a sign that they are not going to do everything in their power to ensure that people were not getting the virus and so it's been a really tragic situation and we gotta do something about another is going to be a democratic president rate who says he supports immigrants so that it should be a first test and obviously you know. Our people are at the front lines. They're the ones cooking food who wants. Were picking or from the field and cutting the meat. The a lot of us are eating and so is just really unfortunate that even when there was coup-bid relief bills that happened. you know. we're pushing also democrats in the house to ensure that you know there was also protection there for people who are undocumented people who are undocumented could also get a check because they were also workers in. Nobody pushed for that yeah. The risk of being called an open borders advocates. That's yeah inches. We know that it's not ray and we also know that those people who are essential and i don't like to just talk about immigrants over labor because we contribute so much more and we're human beings but just the fact that we are communities are the ones feeding america in so many ways and doing so much more to keep this country alive and we can't even have a twelve hundred dollar check just to me. It's just insane to think about that. Yeah and you know and the other thing about all this. Besides what's happened with this. Pandemic is this historic resurgence of the movement for racial justice in defensive black lives and we also know that just because trump lost the election. You know you know it's like white supremacy doesn't all of a sudden go away. I mean it was here way before trump. We know that american history can attest that and it will continue to be here and actually over the weekend. There were protests in dc by trump supporters including around two hundred members of the far right. Hate group. The proud boys who rallied to dispute the election. The protests led to violence including multiple stabbings. And so while people are on the streets fighting for black liberation and immigrant rights. They're still this contingent who is actively organizing against these communities. We've talked on the show before about how immigration in this country is rooted in the anti black and anti indigenous origins of this country. And you know this is something that you were saying previously right. We know this anti black. Racism is prevalent when it comes immigration and that immigration advocacy has always been multiracial and the movement really owes so much to black organizing so now we were actually together virtually for the the national immigrant integration conference and you spoke on a panel about what liberation looks like we gotta keep growing that power on the outside of what i'm gonna call the glass of state power right While intervening with steak power on the inside in support of our folks who are standing outside with batons the bullhorns some cases the bats in their hands right looking for liberation. And we need to do that with the liberation of our people as our goal. Not just the achievement of the american dream and i save app because we know that. The american dream requires anti blackness. Racism colonization of indigenous people poverty cages and other forms of oppression for its existence. Without those things. There is no american dream and so really. we're talking about liberation. we're talking about decolonisation as our goal. That's that's what we really want. They want the government to stop killing us to stop. Caging us to stop separating us to stop running us through these obstacle courses to permanent protections for our families in our communities and you know all of these things are connected forever. The data is showing now that the largest group of immigrants in detention right now are from haiti making up. Nearly half of all detainees which means that the people being held in these camps are black and since december tenth immigrant rights groups across the country have been participating in national days of action calling for the release of all immigrants currently being jailed in detention. It's part of the ongoing hash tag. Free them all. Abolition movement calls for an end to incarceration of all forms whether it's prisons or detention camps and more recently the movement demanding for people in prisons and detention camps to be released for their safety due to the pandemic. so can you talk more about the disproportionate impact that black immigrants face right now in the united states and how the movement for racial justice and immigrant. Justice really is one in the same. It's absolutely went in the same and thank you for this opportunity to talk about that. I mean when we look at again who is a citizen and who is human in. The united states are the same question and fat in the united states rights right. Us civil rights us. Constitutional rights are considered to be more important than human rights as designed and defined by the international world. And so when you look at who is a citizen and hugh as human that started off as being the white person and the black person was the exact opposite of that and in the same way that one drop of black blood quote unquote made you. Not white made you black. And therefore not human and enslaved right or enslave football the millions of drops of non white individuals in the bloodstream of the united states. They fear will define this country as non white which is one of the horrors of their life. Right is that is that this country is not seen as a white country and so much of the increase in what we see as a racial terror is a result of the understanding. That if you shake the family tree of the united states of america a whole bunch of non white people are gonna come falling out bantry and there's a concern there about what that means about the identity the racial identity the cultural identity of this country which was never white to begin with because there were indigenous people here and then they dragged and kidnapped and enslaved millions of african people to come here so i think it's important i think it's important for us to think about immigration in the context of the fourteenth amendment african americans as the original. Gee naturalized citizens. They were not citizens because they built the country. There were not citizens because they contributed to the economy. None of that meant anything. Because they were not white. They had to have four hundred years of resistance of civil war and a constitutional amendment to be able to be citizens through the fourteenth amendment. And you see this one of the things that the trump administration is attacking birthright citizenship right. And so even to today. The black roots of immigration are clear now when we look at the disproportional way in which it affects black people. Eight percent of the immigrant foreign born population in this country is black but twenty percent of the folks who are looking at being deported are black. You are seventy six percent likely to be deported from this country. Have a prior conviction and again. We know that that prior conviction doesn't have to be. You know anything major. It can be small things. That normally would be a misdemeanor. Can subject you to being deported regardless of your status. I don't care if you have a green card care if you're a refugee i don't care what your situation is as long as you're not an actual. Us citizen right and then there's also been the efforts to realize our bales are higher. Were six times more likely to be held in solitary confinement. And when you look at the deportation of our people especially in these last couple of months it has been atrocious. Shameful is not even the word the ways in which this administration had no problem separating. Our families has had no problem. Exporting covid back to our countries do the deportation of people who have covid whether they're symptomatic or not and when we look at the asylum laws and the ways in which asylum has always meant remain in mexico at the southern border for black folks even before the remain in mexico policy to the left and to the right up down at all the way around with every policy that restricts limits harms migrants. You find that black folks are disproportionately affected. Okay let's move on to our final segment which we call covert coping. So we are all here at fukuda media and even though we're all in our homes we're going to shut down the offices as it were and so. We've heard that this might be difficult winter a little. Stir crazy being with the same people that you've been with for like day in and day out or none at all which is hard to we wanna be safe. We want to think about other people protect ourselves and others. so we're all trying to find peaceful moments. You know me. I just look at birds. But how are you finding joy and hope during these difficult times and into this holiday season. Eric let's start with you. It's hard is really hard. But i think for me you know just. My family always helps me. Keep myself grounded. And i'm trying my best to follow through with meditation. Stop doing that. And i'm just realizing that i really really need it. I need to get back into it. And i'm also taking a little bit of a break. I definitely feel tired. And i think In order to get back strong into this fight you know we have to be well in order to have amazing movement. That's vibrant and that is rooted in love and that is rooted in just as we have to take care of ourselves. So hopefully i can manage sued that through the break If nothing crazy happens in the outside world and our our you covert coping broadway musical friend. Yes i definitely am. Going to be listening to broadway musicals. You know me. So i will be listening to those because i love all those songs and music is gonna be throughout the house to make sure that we keep our energy up. I take the solstice seriously. It is like one of those serious parts of the year for me. Take that time. Right around the solstice to reflect into think into dream and to imagine what it is that i would like to have happened and what i want for us and our communities going into the next year and so i know that i'm going to have a lot of of deep thinking and conjuring brouhaha contouring to do to make sure that we can cast a few spells and get ourselves further along into next year. I really wish. I was going home to ghana. But it's not safe not because it's not safe in ghana via way less numbers in terms of people infected and people that are dying. But i'm really concerned that most of us if we have the chance to go home. This is a time when we go. And i just you know. I'm hoping that folks will heed the warnings and stay home and not bring cova with them over back into our home countries which are much less capable of handling it if gets out of control and so far. We're doing great in comparison still terrible the lives that have been lost but in comparison to the us. And we're doing fabulous so we gotta try to keep up. It was so great to have you both on our show. Eric la chief advocacy officer for races and host of the races podcast homeland insecurity and non not jumpy attorney and executive director of the black alliance for just immigration. Thank you so much for bringing it to the show with hulu and meet today. It was really really great. Thank you thank you for having me. Thank you. I'm mighty ain't wholesome and i'm julia lorella listener. Please go to apple podcasts. To rate and review us also remember. You can listen to the on pandora spotify wherever you choose to get your podcast on. Check us out on the web at in the thick dot org follow us on twitter and on instagram at olympic. Show like us on facebook and tell everyone you know to listen in the produced by nicole rothwell noor saudi and harsh manhattan with editorial support from erica. Date our audio engineering team. Is stephanie of the boat. Julia caruso via shop. At least you eat too. And w a bias are digital editor is least not things to bet is for recording the music. Your heart is courtesy of nothing on kept nzc key. We'll see you in our next episode. Dear listener. Estella see a leader. Y'all the opinions expressed by the guests. And contributors in this podcast are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of fujairah media or its employees.

biden us obama biden administration dhs migration policy institute eddie black alliance for just immigr refugee and immigrant center f trump biden harris administration pramilla coney barrett biden harris erica Hello president clinton obama administration preston lens
A Far-Right Populist Wins in Brazil

Latino USA

19:52 min | 2 years ago

A Far-Right Populist Wins in Brazil

"Support for this podcast and the following message. Come from internet essentials from Comcast. Connecting more than six million low income people to low cost high speed internet at home. So students are ready for homework class graduation and more. Now, they're ready for anything. So almost all glad you buy is go out. Volt jaundice does modifiers you might graduate. Also, we'll my not so live demo gods got, but I feel cillizza total. From NPR and put through media. It's let USA. Hosa today. Brazilians pick a far right candidate for president. On Sunday, letting America's largest nation elected a new president. Jay also now a far right congressman and a former army captain who won with fifty five percent of the vote against Nando that the candidate for the leftist Workers Party. This year's election campaign was one of the most divisive in Brazil's history families and friends turned against each other mass protests for and against the leading candidate filled the streets. And the reason the election was so controversial was because of the man who won far-right leader Gerry Poulson narrow a former army, captain who is often referred to as Brazil's Trump because of his anti-establishment rhetoric and populist views Torius for remarks considered fascist racist, homophobic, and above all sexist. He wants publicly said a Brazilian congresswoman didn't deserve to be raped because she was too ugly. Skewer politician whose middle name is messiah. And that is how almost half of Brazilian voters siege. I also NATO. Multi one with a populist anti status quo. Message his agenda includes giving Brazilian police expanded powers to kill suspected criminals and opening up the Amazon to exploitation. Has often praised Brazil's former military dictatorship. And he said that he supports the use of torture. He joins an increasing number of far right beaters around the world who display a thorn, Tyrian views. To talk more about Brazil's election. We're joined by the Annika Hanke. She's a Brazilian journalist who writes for the newspaper or global she's covered elections in Brazil as well as international conflicts and human rights. Welcome to letting USA Hannah. Thank you. Thank you for inviting me, we actually talked about what you had for breakfast. And you you said that you actually you went all out and did some serious comfort food. Yeah. I did. It's it's a difficult day for Brazil. I was young still when we had the first free elections in Brazilian an one thousand nine hundred eighty five and I never thought I would grow up to talk about the possibility of dictatorship in present time. I find it interesting that the first thing you said was you referred to dictatorship. And there are probably people who are listening who say, but this was an election. This was not a military coup candidate during the campaign has repeatedly praised the dictatorship defended the dictatorship. He has paid tribute for for example, Cardozo Obama through was the first military commander who was convicted in Brazil for torturing is responsible for the disappearance of more than five hundred people and. When you say paid tribute. Like, what do you mean when former president Duma who Saif was impeded he was at that time a congressman and during his speech for her impeachment. He named Ostra the head of the torture unit from the dictatorship and Dilma who Rousseff was one of the women. The menu women that were tortured during that time. He praised him as a hero during his vote. View. Dale. But we have more concrete reasons to be worried his vice president is a general, and he has also said that he will nominate the military for civilian positions in the government. What are some of the things that both to narrow the soon to be president of Brazil has said against women against the LGBTQ community against afro Brazilians? What is he said mighty dad? The Hosanna is a Workers Party congress woman, and they had this discussion. And then he said, they will not rape you because you don't deserve it. And then the reason was that she was ugly. It's not only the the violence of the words is also the mindset of putting rape as something that we've been can deserve or not. You know, it sounds shocking and at the same time for the United States with the President Donald Trump. It's not shocking. It sounds like this is the kind of language that we've been not accustomed to. But that we hear what is he said against LGBTQ. He would prefer his son to be cute in a car accident than being gay and against afro Brazilians when critters you who is the daughter of better, she asked if what he would do if she would start dating his son. He responded saying that is never going to happen. Because my sons are very well educated, and they are not into promiscuity. He's from Rio a lot of people think that Rio is a very progressive open liberal city, but as you said Rio produces Bolsonaro so so how does he kind of where does he come from? How does he get his start in politics? And why why if he ends up being on this fringe far-right does he end up being the candidate that that basically rises to the top Rio was a former capital of Brazil has strong military base. So we will have a lot of veterans worrying Rio. So he was in the military until nineteen eight and then he laughed to to run for the city council. He was elected in every nine then left again to run for the congress for the first time, and he won and he has been in the congress. Since then. So it's also very curious. That votes were both on idol is pretty much a vote against the status quo. But here is a man who is in politics in the congress for twenty six years where does Bolsonaro kind of develop this strange form of of seeing the world, basically agreeing with torture, for example, where does this come from the military is very conservative. And and of course, they were they laughed power in nineteen eighty-five, and they have been craving so go back to power. And if you think we had the left-wing depart the Workers Party in power for the last thirteen years there other thing I've been calling this the holy trinity. The trimming forces that are behind the his success, Devon chart the military, and then the market the military the market and the market. So the market has. Sided with both on Otto for obvious reasons for his liberal ultra liberal economy, which basically ultra liberal economy would mean hands off, no state involvement state involvement, free market capitalism. Ultra Frey one hundred percent free market older capitalism. And what you saw was businessman donating money personally to his campaign poverty in Brazil, is is widespread and you have many many like huge areas like the fa- Velez called his Lum's who are out of the reach of the state. So when the Catholic church also pulls out there comes of Anjelica church and Jellicoe church brought to these poor areas. Hope. I know Turner tive to poor kids. So instead of being a drug dealer, they became pastors and in cantor that like twenty years ago had eighty percent of or more of Catholics now to in very three seven Jellicoe two out of every three Brazilians as evangelical and the Gela gold church in Latin America, and in Brazil is very conservative antiabortion anti-gay marriage Soden, they make concessions to vote for a man who openly and publicly defend torture. Then you have the power of the church, specifically, the universal church, which is a the largest evangelical church in Brazil. It's headed by say, though, who became the world's richest pastor, and he has openly supported both on. Coming up on letting USA we had a campaign, Brazil that was massively based on fake news. Stay with us. Not. Yes. Dr Larry Nassar abused. His patients for decades AD remember telling the nurse. What if everyone thinks I'm why believed a new podcast for Michigan radio and NPR looks at how a team of women put one of the worst serial sexual abusers behind bars. We're back with Brazilian journalists at the cahan talking about the recent presidential election in Brazil and the far right candidate who won both narrow. So the election in Brazil was characterized in part by something that we know a lot about here in the United States fake news. So what was the role that fake news played in the election? We had a campaign Brazil that was massively based on fake news that spread out through mainly. What's up the popular messaging app owned by Facebook finding himself surrounded by claims misinformation? Shared with almost impunity on the platform, and in Brazil, this is a hugely popular. What kind of fake news was going out there that you say could move an election for a country, the size of Brazil, forty million people in Brazil us up. I participate in a lot of groups because as a journalist I want to see what people are saying. I say ninety five percent of the things that I received on what's up were lies. There are studies that very limited still that followed some of these groups most of these were things against the Workers Party related to like communism and saying that, you know, if the Workers Party win the election, they will turn Brazil Venezuela, which could be true like maybe twenty years ago, but the workers prior to having been in power for more than a decade in did not transform Brazil in Venezuela. So there was a lot of like a campaign to spread fear, and then this newspaper full at some Pollick posed how businessman make contracts with marketing companies who use what's. Up to spread propaganda, which is not illegal. But most of the information that they were spreading were pro bowls on our show and against the Workers Party, according to for this newspaper here in the United States after Trump was elected. There was a lot of soul searching in the media about how they covered the campaign. So what are journalists in Brazil saying today in Brazil, for example, what happened was that? We basically over this the urban centers. So we don't talk about the problems that people really have don't discuss that we keep covering just the capital Brazilian like hearing this e and some Paolo which compares to like New York, right? The financial market and and the political power. And we forgot about the people. We forgot about like Bailey problems that the that people have and the reader sheep has not only decreased. In brazil. But also those who read our older and also reach her. There is a lot of upset about this this election. But you know, the media response would be well but bit day the leftist party under Lula. There was so much corruption. They lost the faith of the people. So there is legitimate. Critique that the corruption on the part of the bid day leads to this exactly there is an it was huge the mistakes worker Spar commuted was huge. And I think also let people trusted them they were all position for many many years. They were they made huge promises to the people that in the end they cannot really accomplish. You know, we have more than thirty parties. Historically, they have been findings in campaigns was with. Donations from car perations, you know, in exchange for big contracts, and I think people hoped this would be different with the Workers Party. And it was not. So now what in terms of of the opposition? Will there be a real attack on civil society at this point? We don't know president Boso Nado has. He he literally said he would put them in jail forever or van them from the country, and he has also attacked the press. So basically, we don't know what's going to happen. If there's one positive thing of this campaign was that a lot of women as you as you pointed went to the streets. And I think women empowerment in Brazil is a very recent phenomenon, but the very strong one. And one of the things that this campaign made us to go von is all these women's movements and women murdered as the political voice of this campaign. So maybe position my come from them. The cahan. Thank you so much for joining us on USA. Thank you. Thank you so much. The guy is a columnist for the Brazilian newspaper. Grenoble? This episode was produced by bowel Moda and edited by Marlin Bishop the Latino USA team include Miguel Sofia police car on yesterday. He though Maggie freely. Genocea mocha Sayer and my equity with help from Fitna Chari. Our engineer is definitely the boat. Additional engineering this week by Rebecca wineman, our production manager is not that are fellow are making Laura and just cultural. Our intern is Camis Johnson. Our theme music was composed by Rubino. If you like the music that you heard on this episode, be sure to stop by Latino USA dot org and check out our weekly Spotify playlist. Oh, and there's one more thing. If you go to apple podcasts and rate and review, let's say, you know, this really helps new listeners to find this. So please do that. And also your comments that you write are truly inspiring. So keep them coming. I'm your host and executive producer mighty. Join us again on our next episode. In the meantime, look for us on all of your social media celebrity Joe. This episode of NPR's Latino USA was made possible with support from the Rockefeller brothers fund. The John D and Catherine T MacArthur foundation and the Ford Foundation working with visionaries on the frontlines of social change worldwide. Next time on Latino USA the story of a heartbreak the ghost of governing Garcia Marquez and the small coincidences that are a sign of things to come. My vase literally fell out of nowhere light bulb in my room. It almost fell in my head. That's next time on that canoe USA. Are you looking for that sound? You've never heard before. That's what we do an outlet dealer. We bring you something new all wrapped up in something familiar. Listen to let go on the NPR one app or wherever you listen to podcasts support for NPR and the following message. Come from Cirque du Soleil, crystal a frozen playground of world class ice skating and stunning acrobatics. See it live at Capital One arena from December fifth and ninth. Tickets available now at Cirque du so lay dot com.

Brazil Workers Party Brazil president United States NPR Brazil leftist Workers Party Comcast congressman Donald Trump USA. Hosa Rio Gerry Poulson USA. America vice president rape
Keluarga Islami - Selingkuh Memicu Keretakan Rumah Tangga (Ustadz Arifin, S.H.I)

Radio Fajri 99.3FM

12:31 min | 9 months ago

Keluarga Islami - Selingkuh Memicu Keretakan Rumah Tangga (Ustadz Arifin, S.H.I)

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AKHLAK ISLAMI - Ikhlas Bagian 1 (Ustadz Abu Salman Yusuf)

Radio Fajri 99.3FM

15:27 min | 3 months ago

AKHLAK ISLAMI - Ikhlas Bagian 1 (Ustadz Abu Salman Yusuf)

"Dan aflac will law sola. Who some dylan can do plans. Hurry emila is lobbying salaam rally or to learn about car. Two hundred was solid to salaam more alert or sola yla early. He was saheb e woman. Water Do but the loss of isla if lesson republicans see fat. Geeta had his aren young a gun. He pre reluctance Slim skilling corona la the onto a loft island if less adela where he hasn't had young african ulama gun so orhan derry coogan iraq then class. I'm a fan concere. Dida guna youkilis of thin yamamoto nique and to do one candidate. But a lotta allah derry. How how young muttering out. The lane adela mean jetty la alla spina gay sat to setting to do one dollar per what then then per capita on bake young. The here more boone. Young but the but the iguanas moroccan. I'm alan hattie and stanton decided saturday. Shut up the remainder. I'm oprah board and so around then by moncia and said denman. jd orangey then ecus. I'm open to what then a community scully boone. I'm a spe. 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Then you d mckeon to adela loris but upending alien woman. Cholesterol gun hanuman. Had the but can to the duke. On inga dc law so hanahata allah than dealing with tom. Slaney to eclipse you. Guess by ben things are wrong. Mean that he would you cry. You say fun then fitna around or onions sutton you set. Can heal behavior are set dante. The mambo mambo bull ben. Things are young but he better nicholas suburbia. my nephew. roman the isla gela. Jila lou dellums sorta saw. I had some by yet. Lapin patiya allah february exotica. Olien edge marine le bad. They're coming home on scene. Ableson up the croissant. Uncle alcoa alcan sub maracas one you to ali humble million ecus candy and turmeric but a cellphone solely sat number gone yet ecus marica then selling number one will see it and assad dudin young lena window santia salmon eclipse gun yet dilemma. Do supply monopoly an Only omar being called bob on talk about mussa shoddy but on sian yet. 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Beli buy button recruit smoke up by an innings eddie panama makita somewhere when took burlacu clus dan. Monkeys dekom kanye mean will law who was salaam aleikum or the law. He will about okay to wash.

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WANITA ISLAMI - Wanita dan Walimah Pernikahan Bag 2 (Ustadz Arifin)

Radio Fajri 99.3FM

13:13 min | 4 months ago

WANITA ISLAMI - Wanita dan Walimah Pernikahan Bag 2 (Ustadz Arifin)

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