20 Episode results for "BFI"

Docs & More

DocsAndMore

13:01 min | 1 year ago

Docs & More

"I'm here at Sheffield Doc. I und- I've just seen an incredibly powerful film about Grenville. I'm here with some of the filmmakers. Now Mendi Pinto dishing ski is. The director of the film and collaborators is a trion McKenzie. I Drew Mackenzie. Can you remind me of how it came out. Yes oh I've met about ten years ago at stowe used Santa or community she sends a and that unfortunately has been shut down now to to government cuts so we were filming post closure about the closure over the community mincy center and yet we just realized that a lot of people don't people in the community that we knew were affected by the fire and yeah just slowly but surely we just decided due to interview them just to get their opinions get views to see like the real roar emotion. And how did you stay the right so I think At the time we were a jam was volunteering filming. Everyone was falling tanks effect to the people making the film and we were coming back from funds hearing and the image using on the news. Was You know angry young people and of course they were angry young some people but they the thing was the and there was even some coverage of the volunteering. But the thing was it just wasn't what we were finding on the ground so to the point of making this film was to capture the atmosphere. You know how how different is from the news being on the ground And I think what the the young people and look residents in this film do so eloquently is the dignity and how they are and how let the honest ace and open they. All I think it just has disarmed. Everybody what did you find ups one of the more challenging. I think during this process trying to separate myself from the actual toss go filming I found that very halt because I felt uncomfortable. I kept questioning like. Should we be doing this but then no one else is doing almost way so I think that was the hardest Kamajors to actually make the decision because even when we were you know when he was editing at we kept coming back and forth with emails. Like should we put this in shall we know And in the end it's actually had a more positive reaction than we all expected. We didn't know what to expect to me. That was the most challenging thing just to take the emotion all of it To not you know if if I got to emotional outset because obviously it's devastating thing to see and to to be around. We didn't think we would've been able to stand together as a team to work together and also to actually support those that were in need when we were interviewing them you amuse measly what how China Gigolos. But of course you also using footage from Chris not from people's fines unless this kind of woven in that must sabine. I'm very difficult to to edit to us to place yes. I'd say that it's actually was really hard editing it because is it was. It's really upsetting watching videos back again and again. But but what's interesting is we spoke to the editor channel. Four news channel news did a piece on the film he said that even to quits. We had like this one of inside the building and they can't show that on the news. There was another one in the film. I if if you SORTA Shouting icon get out and he said that actual piece goes on for half an hour because of course they had their cameras are rolling so they captured all this stuff stuff that they wouldn't they don't WanNa retraumatize people. But as editors they sit through it and we will be talking about that process of trying to make this film is it was very very hard to edit. Basically what I really really love about this film is the we do. See another face. GRANDPA we see the young people that perfectly eloquent. That was obviously very important. I mean like you said in India's very important to show was Najia. Yeah because the images that I kept seeing of aggressive loud of young people and no not saying that that message was wrong. But the only thing that you're gonNA take from because of the packaging is the negative energy that you know that was portrayed So I think it was very important for us to speak to people to speak to people Face to face and organically people just kept saying Oh. All of the young people helped us out the young people with them on the ground. They will help them my family when we spoke to allow initially he said when you interview me as okay if I bring about five or six of of the people that helped out to the interview I said Yeah of course. He's really important that they get the message across. Because you know all of all of us were usually portrayed whether you're black or you're white oil from the Middle East you'll always a stereotype thus attached to that especially when it's the young person involved. So it's just good that we can try to break this boundaries by interviewing them. So let's do it. Yeah like obviously we were really happy about because zoster staples that we had for the film. What is the reaction being run while you've screened the film because you've screened at a few of it so we had a some of the reactions? I can tell you my phone. So we have had a lot of support from Naomi Klein the writer and she came to see the film and said it was an incredible film and she stood up and gave a talk about 'cause she she makes films as well. And so that was really nice here because initially when we approached the God audience they said it wasn't really it would need a lot of work to make it something that they could possibly use because it's quite roar and you see edits and you see wits. See less stroke frames now. The word for So we took it to parliament and and I think it was putting the National Archive as well and the BFI Put it in there while call and then I think the Channel News to sixteen minute feature on it so I think that that may feel a bit vindicated in and Approach basically because at first people say with the Gordon thing had been like well. It's not really. It's not really something we could use him saying. Even the you know the young people in nuanced is not something that would be new to aw redes- whereas I think that it's the little things things and the moments and how broken the people on how they're trying to cope that is that is what has you know if you just took a sound by wouldn't be as powerful USA screen in front of parliament to the labour. Party's all. Yeah so we. We initially had a screening at the Labour Party conference. So that was at one of the local embarkson About was the audience of a mixed crowd them. We had the six month anniversary screening which was And that policy. That was cross puzzles. Well yes so that was. That was the first time grenfell united actually actually spoke in parliament Publicly and that was the chance for four of them to actually tell the story and we have very massive massive response to that lots of MP's came We didn't give them the opportunities to ask questions that it was just literally for them to sit down and listen and watch the film and finished. We're getting kicked out of the building. They were still the. MP's state to actually have conversations one so a few months down the line Yeah we've had. Yeah we haven't yet. We just had another parliament event in May with hundred. MP's where then one of the things we noticed at the film MHM screening. Is that where the power was was in the conversations in the corridor that ability the MP's to speak directly to breathe in survivors and to hear what's been happening to them speak to them as just as people and it didn't matter what policies it was they won't from all parties and and so we had this event because we you have to campaigning to have extra panel members added and they have other things that campaigning for as well and it was just for the speaker to host that and to have so many kind of cabinet ministers and shadow cabinet to come to them. You people are crying because if he was speaking to someone who's lost the kids and their family unless you've a heart of stone that is going to affect you and and so I think that yes. I definitely don't think that the the government has done enough and I don't think that words have necessarily match their deeds but I also think you have to reach out and not just setting people to polarize into binary and and we need to reach out and say this community could have been your community that just like you. This could happen to you having had at that screen with the MP's and having had that reaction De USA the pumps at some some of them were perhaps not aware of the people or perhaps the type of people who live in these books. I think that's definitely helped to raise awareness From every single event that we've actually had what's even from the very first one that we had frontline club The reaction straight away. Everybody's because you don't know what to expect your urine see like I said before aw one sides From the media so I think it definitely has opened people's eyes It did bring a more human side to it not not to. The actual survivors survived by the whole incident. Sorry the whole who tragedy. That's happened is more human side to it where it's not just headlines. It's literally like common. Have a conversation with with me and the amount of MP's the actually came through the doors they didn't have to. They came through the goals. They didn't really They didn't have an EGO. They just came. Okay how many but I think that what we say is that you have to just I. You can be cynical and we're cynical but ended the day if you just kind of open your heart and you just so honest and you just cut through. All of that is so so bad. What has happened at so terrible that you know if people can speak to the people directly affected I certainly think it changes perceptions you know and the number of people who don't know anyone who lives in a tower block maybe for example? Many people lived in Grenfell. You know international lawyers you know investment bankers surge. And you know not. I'm not saying if one had to do that. No we want to live. There was high flying but the certainly were high flying business. Business Man Business Women living just because they You know first generation immigrants wherever or just because they live in a tower block doesn't mean I mean that we shouldn't be frightened of them or have these kind of preconceived ideas of who they are if those who are listening to this podcast and they want to do something to help. What can we do if people do feel kind of touched enough? I think a lot of people having touch by grenfell because it could be any city so national issue and sits in this country if they go to. WWW support grenfell united dot org and he. This is totally free. You just put your name and email and then the survivors and bereaved singer newsletters when campaign him when the events and we appreciate we shape support for that and also just say it's anyone that on the fourteenth of every month which is the day. GRANDPA happened fourteenth June There is a silent march where people come people in the kids people being the dogs we just all walked in silence Sort of very much around the tower and it is so moving just to be with people just support the bereaved people at the front with the Bina. And I've never the firefighters lineup on either side and hug them and thank them and I've never seen an offense moving in my life and I would just encourage people they if they're outside of London they could come down on on to one of the wolves on the fourteenth and there are other wolves taking place in Manchester Uh Southampton even they might want to start their own silent. Walk in solidarity soliderity with the the big one in London. Well thank you so much for your time and I really hope that the message that you're trying to get across.

MP grenfell Sheffield Doc Mendi Pinto Drew Mackenzie London Grenville director Middle East stowe Naomi Klein BFI India mincy center USA China Gigolos Santa Grenfell government
A Bigger Canvas with Martin Scorsese & Joanna Hogg

The A24 Podcast

48:00 min | 1 year ago

A Bigger Canvas with Martin Scorsese & Joanna Hogg

"Hey and welcome back today. Twenty four pockets if you don't know the name Joanna hawk she's the director of our new film the souvenir opening this weekend. She's also one of the few filmmakers lucky enough to call Martin Scorsese mentor and their executive producer last week. They sat down and talked about their shared obsession with Hollywood musicals the projects they're working on right now, the Irishman and the souvenir partout and the anxiety that comes with making on a bigger campus. It's an honor to share their conversation. And we hope you enjoy it. This is Martin Scorsese. This is Joanna Hogg, and what we talking about your films and give new film, the souvenir part one. That's opening and you made four features. Right. Yes. The souvenirs the full. Made a lot more. Around for a long time. I guess one thing I could talk about a little is how I I came upon your work. I was shooting Hugo Ugo cabaret in in London and twenty ten I think it was long time ago now, and it was in three d and it was taking very long time. And I was living there and on I would have DVD's people with semi things. I think the BFI sent archipelago is could that be what was it? One of your actors had had seen it. I'm not sure. Well, I received a letter saying please look at this. And and it was a weekend and loan. So I put on stone call archipelago, and I didn't know it didn't say who it said who you were direct about it and read that part. So I sound to be fine while I should look at it because very much appreciative English cinema British cinema. And so I put an archipelago. And I you know, I must say that you go. Was very complicated. Picture it was fun at times. But it was extremely complicated. In three d with trains and kids. Sasha baron. Cohen Ben Kingsley, and and dobermans and all kinds of things going on. So I was kind of distracted. So I put it on and this beautiful image comes up wide-screen color and helicopter lands in Nyland the north which lay right out a Skilley in the city and south west south accessed of of Cuomo, the group of islands just of KOMO really. Oh, see I imagined it often the up in the the western isle the edge of the world, you know? Pineau where I'm going. It's sort of the polar opposite of this minority session in any event. I was watching I fifteen minutes and his family is together. And they're apparently. Visiting brothers. Come to visit his family mother and his daughter his sister. I should say in a rented house and. I. Didn't affect I couldn't couldn't bring myself to really be connected to it. And so I said, I don't know what this is. I'd turned it off. That's okay. Watching this. Now got tomorrow there's going to be all these problems with. All these sorts of technical problems. But then that night, I thought about it for some reason. And I think the reason was when the brother Tom yes year. I didn't know any of the actors to sister says he she gives them the room. Should this is your room, and and he moves into the house, and he says, oh, that's fine because you being so cooperative. And and so why is she why is she like what is going on here between these people? I suddenly became very interested in the sub call it subtexts. I hate that. But the emotional underpinnings of it. And so the next night it was that possess addity. Next Sunday ran the whole thing. And that was the one is this is an extraordinary extrordinary film and telling everyone about it was so moved by it. It's interesting because the restraint, of course, created this extraordinary tension and emotional impact something very sweet. And also the look. At the picture. The the eye of the filmmaker compositions confidence in where to show us. And how to look is. So for me to interesting things about it in that elements of I don't I guess is pastoral painting. You know in England France in this film has that. And I think I really picked up when there's a scene where I think he's on a bicycle any comes call. This any puts the bicycle the exterior house of the bicycle I think on the left why forget E puts the bicycle against another bicycle there's there's there's no there's no sex. But that was sort of a really nice. So that I always saw that as as a as his sexual frustration. Maybe. There was alone. Yes. It's so beautiful. Shuttle goes and he's talking to cook. The woman who is a real cook. She'd never acted. And particularly the beaters. Yes. Yes. They were real beaten suddenly transported back a few thousand years watching it. And it reminds me wrestlemania in the the killing of the this case be in the strong believe the two devastating. Yeah. I saw that the age of seven my brother took me, and it was so vivid and that extrordinary moment of sequence with the with the tuna which only stop recent Renison recent. But what's incredible the wrestlemanias that when they make the catch? They all pray their respect. And it is the bounty of the earth. You know, something very primal. But in this film was probably was in my mind because I love Rossini. And yeah. Well this. That at the beaters, I suddenly begin to realize the landscape, the people are the landscape, you know, maybe come to that thought realization too late, but in the Mediterranean, it's different from Norway. I know that I'm being Mediterranean, but beautiful. Also, I must say I must say the tones the color the flavors of the color, quite quite beautiful and subtle. But you gave the film that time. I mean it concerns me that I do like subtlety. And so I'm not I tend not to do. I seems that sort of maybe grabbed the attention straight away. I don't know I find I have my own rhythm of things. I think I always think people just see my films in more than once more. Discover and you gave it you had. I mean, incredible revisited having not responded to the first time. But it statement I started to like it after turned it off. All right. Let's do it you that. Then then then I heard that you'd you'd seen it because I wasn't away. You were watching it at the time. And I think I was contacted by artificial life who would eating it. And then they put us in contact. And then you came over to get a an award from BAFTA. Yes. Fellowship a new to party, and we met met their rest of. Yeah. Yeah. Get after that. Then we I think I came to New York I sort of came to New York on and off and then made exhibition and then you yes. Yeah. Yeah. And then I showed you a context which. And then we remember clearly we had a conversation when I happened to be on the island from archipelago, Sicily, and I was in Nashik room. Not exactly the room that at the characterization, but another attic room in here with me. Spoke on the phone spoke on the phone signal was so bad. Yes. Yes. Yes. I think the the the first film, I saw reveals curious in a way because I don't think it's what you're most known for was New York, New York. And I think it came out of I remember exactly what took me to it. But but probably my love of Hollywood musicals, and that you were doing something version of that. But but I remember when I went to see it. I didn't know that it was going to be so much about relationships and relationship between two autistic people, and I think that had a really profound effect on me because I in some ways dented with that struggle, and that that was one of the things that inspired me when I made exhibition this idea of of a film about two artists and how people so hard to live together. Now, we were we made that film and seventy six rural trying to work it out China. See if it could be possible, and it doesn't work too. Well for characters in the picture. And also I thought at that time I'd be like a film director. Meaning the so obsessed with the Hollywood films, but also. Luckily, I had been exposed to Neo realism. It was five years old New York to television. And so the rest lenient to seek that sort of thing. So there was a. That seeped intimate. Yes. It really did. How could you do a serious serious attempt? Let's say beyond you anytime. Strange one of my favorite. Yeah. Exactly. With in Hollywood musical. It's. Left. People people say oh did the styles. Don't the styles clash. Yes. That's right. I said it was always interested in the Hollywood musicals because certain Hollywood musicals who skies, and my dream is yours they always hinted that there was some emotional psychological disturbance going on with these character. Specially in the relationships men and the women, and I was interested when it when the end came up and hit and it was beautiful technicolor that what happened after the end. Like what happens if these people? You get a star is born the Judy Garland, James Mason. But yes, quite the heart of it. No doesn't get to the heart of it. It would trying to tell us something in those musicals. You'd be surprised as lot of darkness in some of these Hollywood. Films of the time. I know I agree. I some reason number late in the came to mind cause lady in the dog. I was obsessed with. At film school and lady in the if you watch my graduation film caprice after watching eight in the dog, I took a lot from that firm into my little regulation film sequences because I watch lead in the dark again recently. I that that film. I mean, not fill my so many times they made me a beautiful thirty five millimeter print but ten fifteen years ago, and I was at universal gorgeous. Oh, yeah. It can't get you. Can't you can't get on DVD's? Okay. If I was gonna ask this is a killer in call in the color off. I mean, you know. Because I love it that the psychology of it that character that those those sessions she's having on the couch. Gordon extraordinary dream sequences big window and her for lined Astor. Should that's Michael? Sequins? And in technicolor my. Yeah. No. But that's a great. I'll share Michel our and all of them. Yeah. Of course at the end. She gets it all up to go with the man. Yeah. But it's it is a lot before that very dark. She's really questioning minds and showed it to my daughter when she was about ten she say feel like that that lady I said, oh my. You only ten have a we have a ways to go. But it's not very known is it. I mean, I found a Spanish dub Spanish version, which I bought recently. That's all I could find on dubs. So we have a copy of the DVD. I'm sure we have a copy the thing is that that that's a more long story of a tangent here, but those films we actually lady in the dark at believe we have lined up misdee- Spielberg, I trying to do restoration of universal and they own it. And so I think that's coming up soon. And we're going to try that. But there was long period of time where you really couldn't see the Paramount Pictures, they own pre forty-eight they own those those films in nineteen forty eight before nineteen forty eight paramount, and they just aren't to get they would just never very they didn't really have that much of a distribution up. And so now they're going back. We've done some we'd done Winchester seventy three my little chicken day. We've done number film. So it's I thank goodness you off because otherwise those films young disappear. I'm szeswith physical. Of. But I'm here, I'm curious because New York New York, I think I saw it in seventy nine. Did you make it came out in seventy seven right, right? I think I saw in seventy nine. But then there was also all that jazz, which I love and that and that I think I saw around the same time. I just wonder what you thought. Yes. Bob fosse. I mean, the editing dance. Yeah. Ordinary. Yeah. The angles. I was one of the I happened. I was lucky enough to see the original version of Chicago on stage. Not the version that's out. That's apparently is playing all around the world every day on stage somewhere, but it's kind of lighter in a way this ritual version that he had he put together is Elliott. I mean, my God, it was strong, Jerry Orbach. I mean, this thing was powerful in crazy. And that's what you have in all that jazz. You've got that. I never reading too much because we were lower working class. We never had the money to go to theater, but. Who had some way was able to get some tickets for something. And it was the first thing I saw was Damn Yankees back in the mid fifties. Or late fifties with Gwen Verdon dancing stage, it's stored and ease choreographed it, so no, I mean, his harbor fate. Well, and he's dancing. Yeah. I'm a little bit obsessed by moon. No, it is extremely film in the fact that it. Yeah. It's it's it's a musical. But it's all to fade. And it's called the it's the rhythm of it. That's Showtime incredible Showtime with the seltzer whatever was taking in the morning get going. I mean for me musicals were so important, particularly the yes as far as pure entertainment. Yeah. And never forget. It was ten years old seeing singing in the rain and then in a crowded theatre in Saturday afternoon, you know. And of course, the bandwagon was my favorite with with the goal hunt. Yes. Can you talk a little bit that it's a film within a film? It's a piece that's performed. And it's sid Sheri's and Fred Astaire. And it's goes, it's episodic. Isn't it goes the sort of gangster stories kind of smell line Mickey's? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And and it's it's I can't remember exactly relates to the bandwagon as a whole, but it's a stage production. Yes. E- from beginning to end. Exactly. And it's just so interesting that it's it's own thing. Reciting that earlier. It's it's universe. And it's incredibly starred is. I mean, I was. I was desperately inspired by that. But again when I was making caprice all these films like in the dark eating up like an thing. And and I'm looking at it again. And I was going to say that seeing the rain recent new because thing about filmmaking and the and the location we found for for the souvenir of my recent film was entirely the choice of location was entirely inspired by singing in the rain. And it's that scene with the big studio door that. Yes, exactly. I keep to mine. And I I wanted to find a studio or a warehouse or something that had the big that something about that big door into them into that space. Seduction I had to do aviator because of that there's something about. Yeah. That's right on the on on the verge of some wild adventure flying, dancing, or something extraordinaire, John Deutch thing. Yeah. Yeah. Things about those moments in those more more than moments the sections of those musicals where like for me the quintessential one two is born trunk in stars born. And when it to New York, New York, I wanted doom that yes would happy ending. Yeah. Exa-? Yeah. Happy endings is exactly that. It's it's it's it's own film. I mean, it's own peace inside film, and it it got released. Sometimes the there's a longer version with it. And didn't get released originally because it was a lot of lot of different problems in the cutting of the picture, and I don't. My own. Life at that time. And I thought to make sacrifice. To show that I wasn't being self-indulgent. I cut it out. That's terrible sacrifice. Yeah. I know. And then nineteen Eighty-one you way classics which just been formed put it back in. We did together and released it in people accepted it, but you see in seventy seven when it came out that same month two Star Wars the world changed as they say no-one go for it. So by eighty one it was it was reviewed again in a way in and I think what happened with the happy endings was that. The unhappy ending was was more palatable to an audience because this is film that had a lot of flash and color to two so with pretending in a sense to be entertainment. But they I think was very hard for them to accept the fact that the two characters don't wind up together at the end. But in happy endings in a sense, they do attack a happy ending. Yeah. And so that helped it and it was just a bad call, but it can. Exactly. And I'm I'm doing I'm not exactly happy endings. But doing a film within a film already haven't read that someone along the line. We'll say you gotta take out. Don't. Mike case a picture was two hours and forty minutes. It's a different thing. It was a crazy time. We don't want. It's going to be rich. Yeah. I'm very excited about the the new the souvenir partout. Yes sequel. Yes. Which makes the the the the first one the current one in a way, very hot talk about I feel like I've got to still stay in totally totally agree. Don't get too hung up with this. Go onto the next one right away. Shooting in four weeks. One. I'm here. I'm having to talk about the first one each hard. It's really hard. It's really hard because I feel I say things, and then I like what I say. But what I'm, but but it's connected to what I'm about to do. So I just I'm terrified onset or something. And you're working with actors and people are asking you questions what I'm trying to take inspiration from that into trying to trying to think as I'm in an interview situation. Try and think of it creatively. Get something out of it. Right. Exactly. But that's true. You that I yeah. I'm sort of thinking what I'm in this situation. I'm about to do this film. It's about filmmaking. I think one thing that is important. We have mentioned really is. That was always interested in the use of moving images. And that includes music words too. But. Storytelling narrative, and whether it stemmed bracket your biggest Hollywood epic. I'm fascinated by Tila story with pictures, and I I think one of the things that archipelago got within particularly souvenir is that it is a different language, especially in souvenir, you're hitting on something else. And I don't know where it's coming from. But it's real and you used to still photography, right? I did. I did I did. But it's interesting that you say that because I think I'm still not doing it enough or something it's like, I'm beating myself up. But I I'm thinking we'll with the second film. I'm just interested in. Yeah. Sort of sign it film in a way assignment film with the scientists, but not not not not based on dialogue. And he's as she quite Don organ the first one in a way, but maybe. Yes. Tons of it. But no go further. Yeah. I mean, yes, I'm really interested to an in fact, the the film within the film is a film that Julie the character makes film school that I'm thinking her film. Unlike caprice, which is my films school graduation film should have. No, no words at all. Should just being just be an actually have some dance and movement in it. So should be like musical piece, but not no dialogue. Not not even singing, so just signed music and movement. No, it's something to really pursue in. Don't don't get distracted from that. I mean, it's it's a way of that. You have a telling stories or I should say ninety story their emotional stories. I mean stories people to motion that is very unique such as some instinctive, and I suppose that's the worry. I have about when you talk to a China's asking questions somehow the instinct is gonna get rubbed away because you'll thinking too much doing doing it. I think it's good to talk about the. I agree. I agree. Philip Roth art article in the guardian some years ago where we're asking him about his new books describing them yourself going to civil use to do because that's before wised up. Yeah. And he was in his eighties. Well, well, well, I give protect it. Yeah. So I don't know how to how how in the world we live possible. The question. What I mean by that? It's like, I'm not saying, you know, your answer wisest guy blue. I'm talking about something that has to do creativity. That doesn't doesn't sort of somehow away. What you're? Bob de Niro, and I used to years ago people to what you new film. Oh, I don't wanna talk about it talk it away. Like a movie I made silence. For example, the years I talked and talked about twenty years to make because that s I think. Just the end of. But but I know I know what you mean. I know what you mean. I think I think that's what you taught yourself out of it. Yeah. You become too self conscious about what you do conscious. And also, you kinda chip away a little at the freshness of it. You got to go find it yourself. You know, you're there. And the motor that is making you want to make the work. That's it's it's a mysterious thing is it's not. That's right. I tried to explain but people don't get it. And maybe I was explaining over the years that much linked to talk a lot. So I realize don't explain what you said a nice conversation with the maybe one or two. Journalists are nice knows. Yes. But I don't think there's an understanding. It does. I think it does strip something away. If you're not careful. Yes. Yeah. It's learn to I think protect creative aspect what you're doing. Because you need to go out and talk about it. There's so much information. Now, it's all out. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. I mean, I was remember because I did a certain amount of therapy time. And I was in therapy sessions talking about it and saying I don't want to. I don't want to discover too much about why creates so I wanna know whether it's because you know, someone shots dot me. You know, whatever it is that thing in the past. Yeah. Uncover it. Yes. Interesting because you wanna pull from that you still want one that you don't. Yes. Yes. You don't want to solve you. Don't want to of yourself. Toby comes up, and that's it. What happens after the end and you'll healthy and happy and you're not making films anymore. I mean. Oh, no. But that's the how should I put it the? Strange state of being creative. You know? Always people say how you doing? What's happening? Don't ask me, you know, while have you when you finish work. I don't I never finished work. I don't you don't because you're always in it ends the relationship suffered things like that. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's protecting that instinct that is never completely satiated has never been done you. Yeah. Yeah. And you don't want it to know. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. They how do you? If you if you knew your. Europe. There's a basis of still photography film school. So how do you interpret how do you? At least communicate the interpretation but atmosphere, you create or a strange thing because I find I forget so easily from from film to film. How I how I did the previous one how you know how how it how it all worked. Because it's such an intense process. Isn't it? I mean, it's such it's such a commitment and so- sourcing. But in a satisfying way, I find that. I I sort of shed the past experience and then move onto the next one soil. Most don't remember what happened the way I I find I'm working now very much evolved over time, and it's been sort of shape through those positive experiences on not such positive ones. I had thirteen years and working in television. I was directing of jumping director. What's? So I was working on other people scripts on other people's TV series. So I was doing episodes of TV series. Maybe we never talked about what it's because I'm. Sam exactly shamed of it. But I don't feel it's. Teach. Yes. And you get paid Fred. And that's the past. Every now and again, do a TV thing. Unthank- read this is the worst. And and I have five minutes writing notes on something personal that I wanted to do. And then I'd be swept then I get the next an ago. Sorry to say. But it it's one of those things that people on your so responsible. But it is like having a job. Yeah. And I, you know. No, it was pointed out that I don't think I've ever worked in my life. I mean, I have meaning had to have jobs sometimes when I was a kid, it was different thing. But don't every everything has been like some sort of blessing in a way, you know, even if it's getting involved, I thought would be a commercial film, and I was gonna try something, you know, then I realized within thirty five minutes into into the first meeting. I'm in a lot of trouble. Really you really have to do this. Meaning your heart has to be there. So, but it's a challenge that way as I say now, but as to be careful, but if you get comfortable with with the paycheck, you're not gonna make. It's going to be up rooting when you finally do it. No. And I remember I can actually remember the thought that maybe not going to be able to get myself out of that not at she made the film set wanted to make that I wouldn't fulfill my my ambition of making feature films really thought that was wasn't going to happen. That's where religious materials and did it disrupt your life in that way. In terms of what you have to stand up you want to use it. But the point is. You had enough in the sense to carry yourself a Bill from that sense of you do this that point I had I had, but we had to beg borrow and steal to make the film. And we made the film on a sonny's at one which is not even a professional camera. Funny said one it's like a tiny video camera. But it looked great again. I saw not extreme. It's got. I mean, it's it's very very noisy in a way. Yeah. But but it funny way. It's so so noisy that it almost becomes like a digital sixteen. Well, not even sixty mill super eight digital right? And we made a film print of that too. Actually that maybe that's why that's why it looked pretty interesting to me. Yeah. Yeah. But it so we, and that was the other thing that was tripping me up about making a feature film was was I convinced. That it would have to be shot in thirty five minute meter does not and and it was my husband who very helpfully said for goodness sake. Just make the films anything use any excuse not to make the big. Yeah. I mean in a way oh thirty nine God. Especially now, the little canon cameras fantastic. You know, I mean, I look I loved thirty five even this new one I'm doing the Irishman or or the actual title should be. I heard you being houses we shot as much thirty five as possible. However, there's a great deal of CGI because we're doing these youth occasion of deniro peci, Al Pacino. And so they had to be camera with three lenses, and I was just crazy. Yeah. Concerned. We're all concerned that we're so used to watching them as the older faces when we put them all together. Narrating cuts back and forth and thing I talked about four New York. But now it's real now. I'm seeing it now certain shots need more work on the is need more work on. Why why these exactly the same is from the from the plate the plate? Shot by the wrinkles and things have changed. So as it change, the is at all. And if that's the case, what was in the is that I liked was an intensity was gravitas was threat was coming out. Yes. I don't know. Ages lots of kings. It isn't just a. Yeah. And it's a movement movement everyday. But the thirty five is still the best. It really is. But. I come from seventy six years old. It's different. But I always said. Thank nine thousand nine hundred fifty nine Minnesota shadows. John Kesse the shadows. I realize no more excuses. If he could do this. You can do anything because the camera be Queant was light. Yeah. The Claire sort of thing here. Now, the really is no excuse anybody can do anything. No bit. But in a way that makes it harder. I think those choice. Can pick up be a lot of people picking up their iphones. Do things won't be good might be one that comes out of it. You know, and it's new technology, and that sort of thing, but but I I hadn't so I made unrelated archipelago an exhibition little digitally having mind Bishen stem from film school where you have these grand ideas, why many of working thirty five and maybe seventy mil to. But none of that happened. Set my sights too high. But then when it came to the souvenir because the setting is one of the settings is film school. I felt what it's got to be sixteen millimeter. That's what I show up film school. So some of it sixteen millimeter, an I like my long takes and letting the camera run. So it was a real challenge for me. And it very exciting challenge that I loved actually having having finite amount of time in in a way for me. It's sort of almost more about the process than the end result. I find the process of shooting film, more energizing. Well, it's more tell you. It's more. There's more tension because we're gonna run out. Oh, dammit ran out. You know? He'll via system cameraman. How many times I tell you keep keep the film in the camera for God's sakes. Another magazine we just had one. But did you do? But that's the that's the excitement. Yes. It is. But you were saying the the time element you talking about how long how the role is. The role is gone forever. And that's really boring. It is. But I must say for me I found that every now, and then they say changing the card. I said what this digital go for two years. Old men here working. What do we talk? We've got to do this morning. That's okay. There's always a catch. There's no gency. I think everyone on the crew and the cost feed it when film is running through the country. It really do it. The tension of mazing thing the moment that you know, you got something an actor does something it's wonderful and sounds associated as well. It's it's really tactile sensual thing at the end of last intention of priced week. We were on shooting the crucifixion, midway shoot and click story. I don't wanna be distracting shooting film, of course, and Michael ball house m wrong some mountain, I don't in Morocco. And last shot is of the is Jesus saying is -ccomplish it is accomplished on the cross and he looks up. So it is accomplished. And I wanted this moment just head on shot, and we have been shooting like it was the worst experience in the best experience shooting this picture, and we got three takes and second take was the best. I thought just the best. He hit. Willem paid it and a medical to next shot the movie around and the assistant cameraman came up to me and said we had a problem. I said what you mean? He he's open the Zine should open the magazine. Yep. My accent kid did it by accident. And it's the shot that you feel fill for the guy because. Yeah. God. Got until nothing to do about it. Now. Let's let's move on. We can't reach you gotta go. And when I looked at it back in New York there was edge park and the edge fog became the resurrection. So cinema. I said that's the take. That's incredible. That's what we wouldn't have had that with digital. No. Would you would have had some pixel? The film Jamaica, the work you do has to commend your an experience. It has to be you. I mean. I don't see. How should I put it? It's extremely personal subjective. I think, you know, having said that it's it's also very difficult because. A hearing you say that I'm thinking. Oh, I think to myself how. Yeah. How much work can one. Do. That's that kind of. Can you can't it's? In in effect. You're you're you're suck. There. You have to do it that way, you know. I know I went through one phase. And then collapse actually thinking that never be able to get the love of wanting to say something again about people and myself. On a set. Why? I just collapsed. I Donald understanding. How'd you mean that you I was concerned like really after New York New York? I thought that I can never again make a film that I cared about. Wow. Why what do I want to go on a set and fight with the studio because that's what we did. But you have to fight with just one thing you get finance Sears, also them. There's a there's a budget. It's you can't just be. And we were young at the time is a little crazy. But you know, it's. Personal in in out big anymore. And I want to work for anybody actors coming up to do this for me do that for me. And there were big big time. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't you know, the one I did connect was Robert deniro because we knew each other when we're sixteen very very big difference. He also said he knew where I came from. Yes. Yes. Yes. 'cause you've got to work with people who understand. Yeah. I mean, even though I resisted him we had arguments with this that and then I all right? I'll do it. And then sure enough he knew me. But I did find that to pull it from yourself. I didn't know if I could ever do it again. And it's a what to films mean streets taxi European three. But that it and then what had to go to work. I think quite understand it, and I just couldn't face it and collapsed, and then it came out through worked itself out through raging bull, which I mean, it's so passionately taught me it's it may not be autobiography, but I mean, it's it's it's also personal very much. Yeah. So so so in what way we working that out just approaching it in a different way or that you of facing it was facing it. I couldn't face it conveys it and the reason why deniro one or two he was facing it too. But he also want to do it because he was in great shape. We're thirty six years old come on, man. I'm going to lose the sixty I'm gonna gain sixty pounds. I gotta go. And I know you could do it. All right. Let me get out of this hospital bed. And then I realized oh God. He's right. And then and then not of energize you not. Yeah. Say did you ever think? Again. Can I go to the next one? Oh, one more time one more time after that. And then I realized. King of comedy. And I realized that after that, I realized wait a minute got to be really careful, and I said, what are you doing here? The film is fine. But after that where am I going to go, and I want to go right to lessen tation of Christ. But it didn't work when you say, I must be careful what I mean. I'm this. I'm asking because I'm just jumped onto something from it for myself in terms of where where I go be on this, you you you read ising the this just to what is just too painful or it's too just too difficult to face that each time, it's difficult and painful, but that's what you have to do. Now. Can you get that? Despite how unpleasant it may be. And despite you might only reach it ultimately, a mediocre level. You still gotta doing and can you do that in this system because I'm American I'm here. That's where the financing was. That's big budget. Big budgets. Can't do it. Yeah. And working with people who saw the same way, you know, sort things the same way. And you do have obligation. I mean, it's a big budget. You have to get. So I it's it's idea care enough. Do you care for because you have to fight so much when you something personal the big budget, which I couldn't do. And I it's why well souvenirs a little bit more than usual. But it's miniscule school the big budget. But yes, but the key. There is always the personal issue. In other words, despite all the madness, all the craziness all the difficulties that thing, you relied back upon really is that spark and that personal intent that person need protect that you can fight them off until they pull the plug out. Man. You got as far as you got. You know? Yes. Yes. So the film. I've just done. Yes. Has a second part. And that she. I found evidence that I wanted to make this story this story that's based on something happened to me the ages that when I first started nosing ideas to make story film magic experience. I am. I noted down that it should be into pots. And there was something about the first part being just this relationship. So you're in the bubble of this relationship and the second part. Young filmmaker student filmmaker breaking beyond that and then starting to little bit. Like what I'm doing use her own experience in? But stood at film school. But just yeah. How how yes, so the experience becomes a sort of Mira? In the work that she makes. But I I mean, it's not I'm not interested in sequels exactly per se. But it, but it, but I think I always think remake feature films are very traditionally particular on the whole particular length, or you know, that one piece. Yeah. I like the idea of just thinking of cinemas not happy to be one exact one objects. It can be it can be different shapes. I know exactly exactly. I mean, first of all sequel may be the wrong word. Yeah. Sequel suggest something something else. I mean, this is not this is part two. Yes. Yes. Very different. Yes. Yes. This is one story to be told as fully as possible in one expression in and now the next part. Yeah. Yeah. Like like a piece of music. I see it like that. Yeah. That's that's a very good analogy is so a music comes in so many forms, and and and I just think it's limiting to think of cinema. This is one that people go and see, and that's it. Exactly. Exactly. But I do think that because of the the the work you do I mean because it doesn't really have anything to do with what? Conventional cinema is particularly now since it's very different from when I was growing up. But it's it's no reason why not to do part two part three. Part three. But I I guess there are set of constraints. I mean, rather have people see cinema commercially things released, but I am I have to say, but I'm your your some poser warning tail. But I I mean, I do I am sort of creeping out of myself a bit and kind of interested in slightly bigger scale. But I'm at the warning. In terms of what terms of the personal in on campus. Got. Got back. You can do it. I mean, it's always a struggle. But that's what makes it. That's why you go there in the set. That's why you go there in the location. That's why he worked with the actors. It's what you do. And you might get as far as possible with one go and you find another way. Yeah. But most found that the balance of personal, and they'll go commercial, I guess in a sense. Big problem. No. It's very interesting. But yes, yes, I still just continued to that thoughts. Yes. I yes. I am. I am. I am wary of the big budget because it's yeah. It's it's what you've done, and it's really break. But you know, when when when people I have to keep a certain scale of production and crew, and I sort of want to pretend that it's not a real film, but something, but when it when it becomes like, the seventy crew go, so many people you got sort of weight behind you. You could still you can still up like a lightning go in and stay in the heart of it. And try as best you can if it's beyond me to say too harsh. What do we really need that to we need this to try to get a smaller sense of how to make the picture? I remember back in the late sixty seven Artha Penn would done buddy, CLYDE and left hand gun and Mickey one and he was great grateful maker and director. One piece of advice. He gave me he said. Don't lose an amateur satis-. You know, now can you keep the amateur set status in the professional? I think you can guess it. Yeah. I did. I did I discovered you. No. I don't think she ultimately encouraged me. No. I think I've got to try and do it now. It's gonna be huge musical. Great. Okay. Well. Really great talking to you. Right here in Hollywood. West hollywood. Yes. Yeah. I really enjoyed the concession. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thanks for listening. The twenty four podcast is produced by us. Hey, twenty four special. Thanks to our editor, Tom Wyatt and robot repair who composed our theme.

New York director hollywood New York Hollywood Martin Scorsese Bob de Niro China Tom Wyatt Joanna Hogg Cohen Ben Kingsley Michael ball Fred Astaire deniro peci BFI Sasha baron Mediterranean Joanna hawk Hugo Ugo
Exams: Should A-levels and GCSEs be delayed next year? And why Tenet's the blockbuster cinemas are depending on to survive

The Leader

13:01 min | 3 months ago

Exams: Should A-levels and GCSEs be delayed next year? And why Tenet's the blockbuster cinemas are depending on to survive

"Hello it's David here. Thank you for listening to the leader and pleased to subscribe. It really does help us grow our audience because if you hit the button on your podcast provider that tells them, we're a show what listening to. So they tell us you can share us to use the Hashtag, that leader podcast on social media now from the evening. Standard. In London, this is the leader. Hi. I'm David Marlin after she is a mess should next year's exams be delayed these students coming up their son's next yet they've now missed a good formats school in many of them have been school since March that's a huge chunk of very year evening standard's Rachel buffered as a group of London had teachers calls for a six week postponement and. Crash a plane. The plane. Can Christopher Nolan's blockbuster tenant movie get people back into cinemas we speak to the. Ben Lectured. Taken from the Evening Standard editorial column this is the leader for the whole thing pick up the newspaper had two standard Okuda UK slash comment in a moment. The call for next is exams to be delayed. The summer holidays are already over for some pupils. Children were back at their desks, Amana High School in less than this morning, the disruption for teachers isn't over yet though there's the partial Utah on face masks by the government disruptions caused by social distancing and classrooms, and as the shadow of this year's exams fiasco no one wants a repeat of that and some head teachers thing next year should be delayed by up to six weeks high totally your call him thinks it's worth considering. Wise minds think ahead about problems on the horizon. So although it might seem early a call by some London head teachers for delay next summer's Jesus in levels make sense. The obvious reason is that although pupils of all ages have suffered immense disruption to their education, those who face potentially life to finding exams will have most to lose if the teaching they have. MISSED CAUSES A dip in their performance their right to point out that without delay, it will be disadvantaged pupils will find hardest to perform at their potential when next year's exams arrive faster marking and flexibility will, of course, be required to minimize any knock on effects on admissions to universities. But delaying next year's exams is a good idea that ministers should rapidly consider. Even extent. Rachel. Buffets covering the story and she joins me now Rachel, What are these head teachers concerned about? Well, I think the main concern is these students that coming up their son's next shit. They've now missed a good former school. You know many of them have been in school since March and that's a huge chunk of the very important, very important year. So even if they got the month held in July? Rotten's of major. I. Think Long Thinking that gives an extra month at least to. To go through the curriculum getting more ped-, but doesn't that cause. Problems for things like universities who have to check wall people's grades are before they can decide on their emissions won't cause a big rush in the summer for things like exam marking. Yes. That is one of the proper. So exam mocking and Obscene University and coach patients thing about universities they can be a little bit more flexible think people are going through clearing up until the stocks of university temp sometimes, and universities have the power to start later in the race over disparity between. LSD. Start some of late in the and others. So I think, what teaches we asking be like can invest the little bit more flexible in this one off. Period. Essentially, what about places outside of England has the rest of the united, Kingdom dealing with US yeah we'll. So there is a little bit spicy and something teach in England all Sundays at the about in Northern Ireland there sitting theory exams. The Welsh examples have streamlined twenty-seven level subjects. The hasn't quite happened in England yet so. Head teaches saying, well, it's a bit unfair on into students because they might get worse exam grades and You, know they they sat a harder example. They had to learn more things than students just over the border in Wales is there any likelihood of this actually happening has the government said anything about whether they're looking at it on? Yes. There was a was a consultation of cultivates the. In consultation they said there was a possibility be delayed the pump for education of said, they are considering possible delight the exam timetable but has confirmed and I think that's something had teaches worried about because they need curriculums ready they need to know what they're doing, and that's something that is lowering the middle the moments. Something's been worrying them for a while about a number of things, for example. Exams getting graded in the fast plays, and then there was the issue over facemasks how teachers feel about how things have gone for them during this pandemic I think it's a very mixed bag because they've had come in for las stick as well teachers and it is waiting pool in the therapy thing. It's children school. Not just for their education with the economy, the parents work and everything. So they sort of kind of stuck a little bit teaches and so much now about how schools are doing house graded. So you know if you have a badger for exams, I really affects your school and I think it's legitimate. Worry a lot of teachers and had teachers have at the moment. Next that was that feeling the to get back on track, it was going to be as simple as a foam coming out, and that's it back to roll back to normal but it's not the BFI's Ben Locks for does tenant need to be a success to revive cinema? Near We. Are. Back to the movies. Well we know Tom Cruise. Seen It. He posted a video of himself popping out to catch this year's must see movie tennis in London last night, and maybe that's an indication of how important this film is to the movie industry. Tom Cruise has nothing to do with Christopher Nolan's picture. He's not so much promoting the movie he wants people to go to cinemas. It's yet another industry trying to pick up the pieces after Colona virus and the BFI has been helping to do that I'm now joined by the head of UK audiences Ben Locks for Ben how much hinging on Tenet being Yet it probably is probably more important. Than it should be and that importance is kind of. in a to be fed to warner brothers distributors behind the film like actually bravery the showing to go I do that you know this industry needs no partners led them to do that. But beyond that as well by audiences nate, that isn't nate nate something a big big spectacle to Mbeki and so yeah, it's it's important for the industry I think it's gained important but it's certainly not make or break this point. You know it's it's it's going to be a long a long road to recovery. Do People feel safe going into cinemas should people feel safe going into cinemas? Yes and yes So we've done extensive says the last few. Months by thought, send industry partners led the film distributors, Association, and you know the one thing that hasn't changed 'cause people's actual appetite for certain in films and You know kinds of like sentiments change constantly with the wind, but the one thing that has remained throughout. Front Santa reason people absolutely have to feel safe in a know that they're going to be looked after and be safe. That's right. The top priority will cinemas at the moment. Quite rightly by voting season staff on a safe, how safe and how are you communicating that they're going to be safe as well. So. Yeah. Audiences want to know before they go that you know the precautions that taking place and equally they WANNA know that there's going to be staff actually policing the cinemas to make sure that everything's being hit to. The audiences coming back Ben. He seemed people in cinemas in the bfi cinemas in the cinemas you'll helping to support yet will be if I opens September pressed April comeback bookings good people coming but yeah, I mean cinemas helping allowed to reopen I'm which happened. Quite climate governor now in early July. Obviously not many did at that point a few stop to over the last few weeks I mean really we've got about four weeks now something resembling a market. Box Office and week on week I mean exponentially it's growing. So we've got about five hundred cinemas. I've been in the UK. Now, we've got about eight hundred total. So most cinemas reopening Mo- films being released boxoffice growing. Which means the audience growing everything's going in the right direction and some of these cinemas that were trying to save. A beautiful in their own. Now on the you walk with a lot of the independent cinema. and some of them. The there's an there's nothing quite like the experience of going into a really lovely cinema and watching a movie with an audience is the IT's worth rescuing. Yeah totally. Totally I mean it is seven. such loser I still make a little noise what I got into island guy into a new screen that haven't been before I think I'm still amazed manages for me a bit. A bit bemused by people at me when I sat up can I just have a look at screen full? Please can have a look at screens I WANNA see on my head around the door and seed. See what looked like A. squeals of excitement continue when the lights go down in the A staus running year long into the future because it really is you know. especially when it's so different than I think again. During this period in literally we've been. In Doc in rural. Fed Up and we. Felt the absence of cinema more. So in that you know in realizing just. While a special moment, that is what films in that way. And you Kinda need the movie industry to support it to an looks like they're keen for people to go. We've had ten Now we have a new James Bond movie coming think November Tom Cruise clearly attend fan he's got top gun to a thing coming out in December as well. So there's a big long list of big movies that have been held back. They're all suddenly going to come out again. Isn't that there's a reason to be excited yeah it's kind of like. It's it's starting to feel like things are going in the right direction, but just to fill appetite and it's all tied to seeing in cinemas. You know that's the important. That's that's what I'm ready taking a lot of. A lot of excitement from in love for this is that it's all about account. Wait to watch this in in cinemas distributors might WANNA brothers altitudes out she film distribution have been doing a great job of the last few weeks showing that confidence by releasing things like. The Russell Crowe unhinged movie like the most perfect popcorn multiplex film you could imagine you. Get people to test the water in start. Come back. It's GonNa take all of these things to actually get us back contract the seeing now films like say talk on Maverick they're not. You know these these these films that can change the industry films like rocks alongside Lashley's oscar-nominated Les Miserables, which is out next Friday as well. Good things coming like immediate. And that's the you can keep up with all the latest developments the evening standard's live blog, which you'll find at Standard Code UK, and we also have morning briefings available at seven am through your smart speaker just ask for the news from the Evening Standard Podcast is back tomorrow at four. PM.

Ben Locks UK Rachel Tom Cruise Christopher Nolan London London Evening Standard England David Marlin BFI Russell Crowe Amana High School Head tennis Wales warner brothers LSD Obscene University
Letter Never Sent (Mikhail Kalatozov; 1960)

Russophiles Unite! Movie Podcast

51:03 min | 1 year ago

Letter Never Sent (Mikhail Kalatozov; 1960)

"Hi My name's Allie haven't this is the reuss falls unite podcast where we watch Russian films and films with Russian connection as always. I'm joined by a guest and once again. I'm joined by old podcast regular limb so typically old. That's okay I feel out Armen. You'll waving waving older medium. Wavering is fine western capitalist then I can't your house and then you gave me cream in my coffee. Yes Oh well. I'm the best foot the guests who could actually physically physically make it well. It's ten minutes left together need because the right site but again he guess again thrilling podcast this yes yes sometimes sometimes in Britain. The roads don't work jury has because not enough of the capitalist profits are ploughed into making the state run efficiently. Yes we can watching a film. I only discuss sounds good. Yes I feel like we need to beat around the Bush. Before we introduce the film I a regular guest but yes as being reported has been a while. I think almost a year or something ridiculous which is insane considering how many episodes you actually been on. I know it's crazy. Still somewhere are in might place on the downside of people being nosy. Yes it silent here which as a as a listener longtime you will have noticed. I- expertly added to doubt Sarah Uh probably fine yeah so I seem that you'll places because the soundproofed quiet. Es Definitely uh-huh yeah so film wise. That'd be seen anything good time. You're on talk a minute. That's true. I went through a lot of them if L. needs recommendations subscribe to play you for a month for free which I just WanNa dance and then if you're the if you're in the UK as I know if you can scrag you might anyway right in Leszno last night he's. BFI available because see film film struck may rest in peace both as long as a great diplomat yeah I have. It's kind of like as soon as I can justify paying for this yes no TV series on right. Tom Watch do tie back. paid for the time but she implant Should you want to these dinner where you're gonNA. Watch yeah so I watched a lot of Curtin bug that was in my month off aw subscribing to that created by okay because I have not seen a ton. I mean we did cover eastern promises most in the book. Yes GonNa say you better listen to that. I've not seen the film I think it. It wasn't player right right yeah. I mean it's over ten years old. It's not classic film right. Isn't that how it works. Some I still remember it off. The ten years probably classic. I remember going to the park among movie yet so it was like almost twenty s makes in eighteen years yeah so clearly by that clearly superior. I didn't remember what happened. count until I see video dream. That was okay okay. Well say as early stuff I literally only seeing the missile babies. He's a brute the bruise yeah that was okay visitor great okay. It's like it's called good like eighteen vibe Gotcha. Did you see scanners because I've heard that yes also so scanners symbolized today dry. I felt like it made less sense. Somehow okay. I felt like a plot of any dream propelled the film along. Was this little combative okay. Who's WHO's is this now. I said it SPLURGY SPLURGY. Yeah I am as in people's heads could splurge but that's right near the stop. I made like within that. It's not like there's the rest of the film is like dealt with Eliane Gotcha so it's like it's like burns. It's like the first series is full of a lot more sex and violence than actually my awesome okay just kind of like either either to either to hook the people who are mainly for that and all get rid of all the people who like you just heard from that yet. Get a workout so early outs right. Let's try that again. Let's get walkouts out sound doc. It's working on my scripts for Galvin Royston respite when I was like twenty minutes street dead-ringers which had his great yes Jerry Jones right yeah. Yeah needs seem all can trying to think what else I saw okay I. I've not seen any of his. This has really documentaries more recently. Yes correct myself. Yes have seen grizzly man have halcion cave of forgotten dreams. Oh Hudson so right in the absolute non ideal circumstances all ye on a plane the rebel with otherwise feel guilty about wasting time watching on finds paycheck for instance with islands. That's another one of my I wanNA terrible films cinema for my shame spray tower wasn't as bad as paycheck makes you feel okay affirmative uh-huh one flag reckoning with Seifi you totally right the random suspension. What's not when you could be watching current bug Yeah Fuck Yeah. It's it's coin shop state of affairs but most of the good films that I saw all this year senior skip this year yet so I sold crazy rich Asians K which was that it was very fun some kind of lifted up to the recording this right at the start of January twenty so Jiang team retrospective sites. Yes you may not get until halfway through twenty nineteen. That's okay yeah where you may have supported. We're covering for the fact that we don't know anything about the film whereabouts. Yes have you have you seen the one about ski jumping the rupture of something like that. I think it might be gem but it's skins fat. Raina name plates yeah not speak confused with that Hugh Jackman with knowledge there was no he was starring in the legal movie from Samarra which survives from cold. I think this is just the vehicle yeah yeah. Why do you just maybe play well outside the you can't you because I assume that legal. I suspect no okay Ryan. I also a black KLANSMAN. You're it was very good. That was my first spike. Lee Film Sire Film. Yes sorry we're really burnishing sinophile credentials hair way way. Yes that's good makes me. WanNa seem all I really think I saw thor Ragnarok which made me slightly slightly disillusioned about with him of movies that I've just keeping up with. I started trying to keep up with them and then there's just care about anymore but still right around was great yeah may May. I actually like call of the soul movies. People say that stole to is like one of the weakest of all them has weightless. That's one of the strands that Hasselhoff Hasselhoff films which presumably have what we didn't shadows. Huntley will people great. I've seen very small bits and pieces is all was vampires that we yes recommendation. I think I'm saying Chris Mead. Okay okay true friend. Recommending yeah hopefully people's work. It's slow and whilst from the cinema last year lady bird the start of the year. How is that I wrote my parents. My mom loved it. Adopt bemused by looking I suspect but yeah I feel like really haven't been very much until this last year and that makes me sound. That's town doesn't have good cinema. Yeah I mean don't you run basic life. Yes yes live in a place where a good cinema yes easy to get to where we live in. Milton Keynes which has cinema Bob but yes. You have to have a garden. We don't have a car moment. Guess taken off to show you some interesting things. Sometimes it's like a we can you miss it constricting yeah. Oh well these naggus yes. This is my Dello vs you. Yes we'll see if Houma watching the film whale watching is lesson of assent is one of the English titles okay another English. Title is the latter which is actually more actor terms close. Et's yeah it is a bit like adapt. Take so yeah. The Russian cyclist Nia at the problem is more goods. I think it sounds quite as again because I looked up. The screen shows nine degree. Okay I didn't know what is this find out yet when has sixty the old enough to be directing. This film probably probably knocked. He's probably not even old enough that he would beat us. SCOPE is very old. Sorry heartache has to twitter. What's they then? Hertzog is old and yet still alive. Yes yes direct to this. Elim saves we're talking about. He didn't direct it okay while just narrow down people within. That's how we're GONNA get toys Harrison every team twinkie of should explain for Felicitas before we started recording We have eight hours worth of recording time on the recording device of joking about making this a out episode dowry when it tells you how big the rest econ you choose the right size State Council Elsa recording so this one big family also. I guess I'm going to be expelled. You'll you'll be missed. He had yeah will eventually be miss. Dr On either extent Mikhail Councils of second guessing my pronunciation I was so this is not his most famous movie his most famous movie is the cranes of flying think okay which I think I think one would it can about cranes cranes in it okay. I was just trying to interpret. How much would this is where you can have any lattice? Nelson them more. I'm pretty sure that is a matter that probably bore intrinsic toward other Ida time. I know very little about this other than it's in. Siberia has a disastrous fire at some point some kind of expedition but yeah the coins of flying is very good. See at some point do not but yes so. We should probably go in I'm looking forward to remember anything about since Oh a couple of cost notes in yes so the female lead is Tatyana some oil Uva who was the lead in Transvaal flying fine okay so she's also this and also this features. The Levana who longtime listeners might remember the name because he was Soviet show so I can see that I remember the episodes listen to these APPs. It's like making see what the district regime where you had to go round. My friends aisles tacitus. Are you listening to our podcast. Mommy's woman singular yet and it was more of a figurative midnight yeah. I was give yeah so we have. We have served shock I can but this is quite a long meantime like nearly twenty days before he took on that role before yeah. I'm wondering if you look is just used to like reactionary now. I don't know it just wasn't making it. Yeah how ranch new we shall look Orono. Very listener writes in her reaction is GonNa Trust English to history the best history school by their arm around to show comparisons. Yes Mr Trink yeah. I mean I feel like probably the criminals tables in each of the cases various different levels of the social spectrum so it's not like Batman where he's like mainly beating up like Paul Street criminals. Hey I'm a billionaire. I ain't gonNA yeah. I'd never been anything to now stupidly how regressive by on his yeah no I. I can't take credit for the insight I remember watching. Have I got news for you episodes and Reginald d hunter it was like Oh I hate Batman like why did you hit Batman so much and so he explained make sense. I didn't see her as a kind of fast at this is not this is. This is the premise of chairman. Chung coming from Europe sporting probably had a daily beloved movie and a movie. The first ten minutes wear champion. The insurance is really good. It's so long collar member. I just know that everyone hates it so I'm thinking but the credits in the credits right okay I will take you so long just the comfort before I had a friend who was I had a friend besides it was the store that there's there's heady days. Yoga have to be careful awesome also to break into live and let die her too. I remember any Dan Sam I think about when young and maybe that's a different thing everything Komo news tonight does have anything to do with the Song Barroom I can I mean potentially they might have come across the WHO mined coal and that's barring an addict matic sounding title. Let's write a song about that. Let's say yes. That's what happens at at singing into the bucket bucket. We are costs that lets you can subscribe reading costs. Running costs surely someone's taken. Tyler righty probably but yeah and he's he's listen tomorrow him. Yes so I look for that soon. In your regular pods Kacha of choice take it. That's a legally binding promise sadly binding promise unless you out this. I'm saying this appears on the Internet. That's legally binding promise right. That's how Internet works guess during Rem cast now right while servile twice. You're told me talk nonsense about it. Yep So do you remember we say at this point. Yes I say with unfounded confidence which is calling a bluff now Kelly excellent. Oh you do listen to the PODCAST podcasts. This is true okay. It's like a whole list of coq ousts excellent. I'M GONNA say Ryan if you'd like to Linz top three yeah yeah. I don't know remain notionally like about fourth of this array of I've given you more of a hard time should be bombed during the time anyway because that's what you're darn said. Tony blast off into space and this film came out a year before that happened. I did read a book about Kara allows guys last night last year the the rocket designer unit more about me. It was really interesting. Okay so five-gramme quite interesting towns out. Yes Tori also library usually library. Yes you do those things so three to yeah. Well I guess Tino Excellent and we're back. We've we've just watched. Mikhail catheters letter never sent onset lesser didn't go superiors to Yup life and the full we talk about what we thought of it over to Lynn for a quick summary of the Klotz but this is potentially where we might have some spoilers so if you don't WanNa know what happens post podcast why what's film. It's actually a youtube legally most film Hanley uploaded it so you can watch it enough ago about set for free indeed suspects the sometimes seen the country yeah okay. It's a film which not everyone dies surgery but almost everyone does what does it was going to be a quick so full of geologists. Well three of them definitely geologists. We'll see the one like a guy needs it wasn't clear in in Siberia in one thousand nine hundred in late fifties and does anomalies which means they must be diamonds in them that plains or the hills forests tiger. I think so. There's been the wholesome talk about anti find any. CBS They do find some at the end of the film or the the end of the season right to some geological season. GATT just off often the point where they kinda like. Should we call it a year. Yes I'm sedan. I have to get out but then there's leads the forest fires and almost voiced everyone dies yep yep shots the law by which we mean one out four survive swab. Mbeli Ellie yes yes. We were pretty convinced the law seen that he was gonNA he may well have been a gonNa show the credits roll yet who knows Yeah Nice Rookie Jeff's Qua- yes endless some interpersonal relationship intrigue. There's a little obey mainly said the two young joe just kind of dates and then the guide Sergei yet guides. He's lonely early and then kind of starts to make sinister pass at Tanya yes so the party is three three men one woman yes hence while head smells. Yup was writing elected and is the leader leads geologist went which which one survived hanger. WHO's the female geologist Alexi not quite on it? Andre Andre Who's the August. I'm sorry guys who guides yes and Andre he's kind of like the very nerdy scientist. Yes yes. That's his characterization is big. He's because I'm Mozart. Shell comes and the guy the play show in a different film. Yes yes. He isn't sure curbs this back to the lead to the same pleasing Fargo. Yes you see concentrate writing to his wife. Aris Paris points in the film yeah his very era yeah what else happens. It's basically like the first half is tense about what they're gonna find diamonds and whether it's going to be sexual assaults which does not know that's just said since Dennis yes briefly lots of creepy creepy staring staring at has one sister some regular resolve. Oh Yay it says the gay gets a little bit jealous so he decides to crack Andrei Jewel and then las wait a minute. This is just like a horror film mm-hmm well. There's a lot of like music and people are swamps in his fires and Das- snow and Yes yes light. Knowlton's live off base. That could have been some days but I wasn't splinter latte not yeah yeah yeah if you're looking for as long as this is an also yes but I see what you mean about Being horror film esque except the twist is that the monster is mother nature inside alone maybe but but but it's mostly it's mostly the elements taking them all on. I thought for a bit like is there going to be a thing where set a guy. Hi is crazy at Badger. Somebody Yeah pinching for about the last half hour can happen in the air. Doesn't that is the his likes hockey fight but like you say the salt yet. It's breakway yeah E. Crack Simone jewel but that both carrying shotguns will call he the what actually points a shotgun annual no which is weird yeah like a an all the time thing like an intentional yeah. I'll be willing to do this. We just hinting that. It's going to if yeah yeah that kind of film. That doesn't sounds interesting kind of choice. I guess allies. Lisette harbors really the surroundings. Not Other people say much. The cinematography is very Presi. Yeah it's very stock might income trustee and other than yeah. We should point out. It's a movie in black and white and yeah it's sumptuous its sumptuous when travelling. I love silhouettes of them and trees and a lot of backlash and yes. We're located where they filmed it up. They feel L. Debt. It's all God in Moscow. I think a full Morris for certainly on location and this is kowit point in shows. I haven't seen that many films in the grand scheme of things but haven't seen too many black and white films that are Sean this heavily on location in the in the wild like this because he knows a lot of the black and white movies. I've I've seen have been Hollywood. Movies are set mostly indoors you might yes safety shows on the sound stage yeah yeah absolutely absolutely so that was cool and he and if they did feel miss this age they pulled off while yeah because it will look very much like they didn't some cool angles lost touch like tangles. Sasa thing right but as sideways off off I guess I like right angles angles and yeah log quite menacing but again a lot in the first half way the software madness with nothing really happens yeah and then later on us just kind of like detention of okay. How are they going to get out of this. Yeah I like it was interesting as I thought he would. Comparisons Reverend which is not on tape was as now shorten the remnant as having favor even though sometimes it felt like what long lines US yeah. I haven't seen the revenue but from wife held of it. The idea resume isn't some yeah I've just been honest with with the with sprite Westwood Integral. Yes integral battery. He had no spinal annoy me yeah so I haven't seen I haven't seen that but yeah the survival against pretty long odds not survival in most people's cases in this this yeah we're talking about Hustle Gay. Could it wouldn't surprise today. It was a hug film and a sense. It's very bleak. Yes I'd like overwhelming power nature yeah. I'm pretty new to US Yeah Olo. It was kind of shot through with a slightly like mean. flag-waving is is way too strong description but still a certain amount of like the film opens for for example with a dedication to Soviet people. Oh Yeah I remember that Russian space race so Anna's quite like like. We're doing this for the country because we need to. We need to not just survive because it's Al personal survival so we can get the map to show whether these diamonds aw aw yes very important wasn't a target show why they needed the diamonds that maybe I don't understand that much industry was if a diamond souls it Kinda thing. He didn't really explain explain that it's going to be very in Poland for industry. Yeah I'll tell you what for it yet and they were going to build old. Mike Diamond City that the so Baras isn't right that Eh aspects of cultures possibly dime city kept appearing in the the subtitles is like a diamond bug but I guess how that that was the trying to creatively trump's light what they the dialogue is Almaza Almaza Gadot so I'll mas is diamond in Russian and that is just like a smaller timeout towns town name. Yes exactly exactly like for example let Kravis exactly and like Sabih spoke before resigning graduates petro yet you know because they encode subpoenas pages bug when you're fighting Germany. Will Jim sounding literally white. I changed anyway like the royal profoundly changed the name. Yes yes saxe. Coburg correct yeah anyway. Don't humans offer rever may believe but thinking about like seven allowance anyway. They have a higher graphite so I guess the head against able yeah. This is all deferred to your actual bovine scientific knowledge because that's the thing is was it goods. That's the thing I'm not sure that it was it. It wasn't bad like let the tension the south was goods. Yeah I dunno I feel I maybe I'll be spoilt. Maybe maybe in the sixties. It would have been exciting but it was a bit like the subs get. These people interesting like interesting conflicts then this kind of stops what was being trusting homes legs. Everyone just dies is yeah. Yeah I mean I fell like visually is fantastic. Thank yes a great. The something about the storytelling was lacking a bit and I'm really struggling to put my finger on what it was. I think for me just gotten to the point where I was like invested in these characters Annetta kind of one end but it has more interested in the relationship just between them and suddenly skips to the end of the season yeah. I think maybe it's just 'cause fifty minutes. You have set amount of expectation about what it Oh. The tensions between these people and this is all quit in this lying in late light. He's not dealing with that. Well these other ones can be a K. and all they're gonNA find diamonds and and is like three months later on the season they find diamonds and now that being picked off by nature by nature so maybe that's like at is like a twist. Maybe is a good twist. That's not really how it feels. What's going down but then at the same point point. Maybe it was less interesting yeah. It was strangely unsatisfying but yes. It's it's interesting what you say said about like being invested in the characters took me a long time to get invested in just starting to get invested yeah pointer which they stopped doing anything with the characters. I stopped being murdered. They just stopping by the dwell too trees weather. Oh as far as tension does do good job of like conveying inveighing just how hopeless being lost in Siberia would be that was because of the vastness. They handle this stuff about like the raid. It certainly only makes like praised pretty terrifying. Imagine that was terrifying. Unpopular thing is their release forest fires some like light light of fire so the plane Kazoo okay. None of that work is really good at like. I don't know if it's just a mood piece. I think it comes across a lot better 'cause it's good at conveying the moods which is pretty bleak or even a couple of other moods awards earlier on like the tension like even to an extent they like elation when they find diamonds and that kind of stuff like yeah but I found in terms of the mood sometimes that was slightly sabotage by the music. I feel like the music didn't actually we know I don't WanNa. Make a blanket statement about the music. Some of the music was really good. Ineffective on the bits of it was just like this is a kind of like Mike not like forties fifties early sixties film film of this time. It's dramatic Larry Music in imploringly Cincy yeah which you mentioned Iranian whether it could have been early early said Yeah Yeah I'm at at. This point certainly sounds electronic. He's and he's the kind of cool yeah. There's what kind of cool any other kind of music I didn't really get along with was made made it very very end when he kind of makes it over triumphant. Oh yes hardly it just seemed so unlikely that he was still alive. Your hobbies boycotted floated down them. They found that I'd found the map and you'll be like Oh. Someone's found that he's dead in the process. Yeah I think was joe easy easy still alive. This seems unlikely he added was definitely some kind of like suspension of disbelief kind of issues once the snow. Satay it was just like note note you would be dead and like one of them does die because of the snow but the Alva- person who survived the MDA MDA kind of like really really you would just be debt. Have you watched how I ended this. This book still haven't watched advocate piquet. I'm I'M GONNA. Try to exploiters. He had just as elements of this that reflected its and you know I in that kind of being out the wilderness alive. Was it like to spend your days like isolate- isolated for long periods yeah yeah away away from the usual kind of things that you're relying yeah and as a similar. I think in that film which that's fine I'll try and be sputtering tragedy Poku Lukasz or particularly things you mentioned in the very first episode I still haven't done without does assimilation assimilate like good job of kind of ratcheting up that kind of tension get in some ways it doesn't. I think it pays off Batson. Savan Leninism does but not necessarily in the ways that you'd expect scam but so keep listening eventually eventually yes yeah and I'm sure the Russian filmmakers grown up now like chemicals of is one of that time like go to this is somebody you need to know about yeah like just because he's one of that big names. I guess it is Kinda like I say my understanding is his place likes in world cinema no cost to buy the city's. Kinda like just below the level of like everyone's Tucholsky Eisenstein. He's Kinda like the next level down from that. He's like I've been I can see why in light suddenly seemed well. Kroft it yeah. I just wish the second half wasn't quite saying drawn out drawn out. That's the one yeah 'cause is it for a ninety minute film We would get to a point where I was kind of. Okay how long is left now. It's like the save under you yeah. I just WanNa talk last hour again like watching the previous two hours where I felt like you didn't really gets no any of the characters does. NFL tool. I mean to an extent motored phone. Yeah Yeah Yeah. I totally agree with you on Andrew reveals but yeah that kind of feels the way they feel about the amount of time that it is whereas this it feels like it's about two hours yeah. It just feels like it's yeah. It doesn't go vava. It typically does feel like it's below given it should be made us the point. I'm trying to give patout now. Yeah Yeah that absolutely you're right. If it's trying to convey horrible situation in some ways you do want to have I think because they're not ready to pay off missile pastoral staff. We just don't monitoring. We'll measuring but the powerful it could have been like a sixty minute like long days yeah yeah. It's Kinda like white ball the acting up those yeah yeah some TV series web as you know individual things like today like or something I guess there's other old ones but your whereas sixth yeah while they spend maybe time they sent. There's been a little bit time saying up. I know you still have to ever by nature that yeah yeah I mean I guess if you took out the count to development. It would feel very very flimsy. Maybe just cut down the maybe I won't contest is caused yeah. I think I did read somewhere somewhere prior to watching this. The it was kind of rushed to completion in wasn't tightly how he wanted it. I can believe that yeah I mean you could say in some ways. It's more realistic in the sense of like you know in in life not every like kind of relationship relationship gets like neat. Pale true but when you storytelling the conventions exist list for a reason I guess yeah it's not like runs had a happy ending necessarily be at this feels like it just felt like a waste. It's not the felt if it's true. They didn't have enough time to do why it's not felt unfinished threads within the foul on the dollar developed yet yeah yes definitely does this. Make you want to see more of his stuff Ohio. not sure I'd like it based on this yeah. I think that was enough the stuff that was interesting here. Any some like jobless psych set things up I'd like to see another one daily stuff gets PIGAFETTA. Perhaps Gotcha I would say that the cranes of flying is that film it has the same visual flat yeah but the characters it pays off more I would say a beautiful film to watch yes will yeah also great out just crow barring random stuff in sugarless propagandistic digging. Yes that was the most stereotypically Soviet Russian debt in my mind yes so well digging for diamonds diamonds. Yeah they have a good shutler shot from just above ground level yeah pointing upwards as Sergei. He's quite Baath swinging a pickaxe when you pick ax while topless in the sun and it is Kinda like this seems very much like it would be out of a older Soviet yeah propaganda film. You can just see the poster yeah have a father. Arrow something digging in the sunshine yeah tilling the soil is passing people date right and other kinds of pans out and then everyone's doing it by topless yeah and although there is that scene in the rain which was super bowl quit then ran up just like when just in a boat I might buy or stream certainly there was some extreme wet t-shirt `age. It looked Kohl's well. That's going to way to ah the human form was appreciated by the camera yes then wasn't very much of that but I was just five bye bye to your like sucrose as no and largely the camera scenes respectful of Tanya. Yes yes. It was just that one that one kind of seed singular in Congress but maybe we'll just prudish. Brits lately probably yeah we are digging. The buff digging is it fell slightly out of place. It did yeah like you said it felt like it came from older propagandistic nick time and the fire digging also fight yeah that was kind of a weird flat flourish so uh-huh made more sense later in the film on that Trap Bylaw Forest fires but Elian at various points like slaves in front of the camera led between the camera in the action doesn't actually appear to be fire going on e. S. Seen what is meant to indicate their intention. That might be a fire hot. I don't know yeah one mid. Some will Siberia attempts to be associated with cold but said bits of it 'cause it's very big and very continental in Sungai. Go Hawks it just yeah it seems like they were digging in some fire allegations and the fire claiming covering up this hill in some fire yeah. I probably not so I was overweight flourish. I suppose it made more sense dramatically when there is actually a fire. Yes Oh is for shadowy it. Yeah we have the Fire Bits Lips dangerous show that there was a lot health sector elements of life. I don't know kind goggles Barron. Some of those findings seem to quite deep into the budding treason logs and actually a again going the cinematography was a thing that I quite liked about the the having objects between the characters and the cameras done quite different. It felt like put in that situation well. You didn't feel that it was much distance between the camera at the actors of Yes surroundings yeah the even some bits which seem it must've been halved hellish astronauts to be really difficult back with the best of walking through the brush yet kind of guy in circles which was kind of did seem quite confines woke while the camera could still see them play out the same which again again was one of those little details made it kind of like yes get technical. Restriction could move the camera very flaw. Yeah I feel it would totally mean about this film but because I didn't want to. I'd like cycles everything about so it was lots of great right stuffing great shots than saying and they've just found any more space than that complete. I mean that is a story. There is a lot of stuff happens. There was a beginning middle end but public kind of baby didn't live up to the potential of its primates today but may go missing in point now. I think I think I feel very similar way but it was interesting to watch C. Peach addresses often valuable free you mean an hour and a half an hour and a half if you could all three times feeds is huffing yeah that would probably give it a slightly the like he can finish it as you can. Watch your guy. I remember the painting too much. Yes oh so. It is again random details. I'm just carrying barring in stereotype defying they talk about they set this up right at the beginning that negative like drink to that success or if they don't find diamonds that are going to drink to come is right. Yes I will be drinking which on the one hand very stereotypically what you'd think of when you associate with Russia alcoholism which is timing because you know Brenda's not exactly what you associate with Britain say some common yeah but is no vote. Ker Notes Cognac Jack. Yes at it's probably a median on Yak will Alabamian Brandy if you're being super pedantic but they quit cognacs is free a designate origin yes well. They still call it cognac because yeah not not likely to be anytime soon so yes so that's one of the old Kinda like cultural details is is something that was French just because yeah because I said Connor 'cause poorly in the sixties people too bothered about following the French drink yet. I know that's interesting trusting on yours is famous for at least in a Russia former Soviet Union for producing brandy supposedly Winston Churchill manage to get like a whole train carriage of median brandy shipped to Britain off the he'd had some during the Yalta Conference because you know obviously when you're having big high-ranking diplomatic people over you you give them the nice stuff so I'm so much like most of downstream for balls Winston Churchill blasting in about three weeks yet. No no no I think we should end the COGNAC and this site now that was failing my positive. We will get find some for you listeners. This is what we go. Drink responsibly responsibly during sponsor play. I'm driving swampy having any any contact until yeah well until we get sub had some because of living it was easier to get hold of and stuff. If I was good so good tonight anyway it these two versions. I'm sorry Prost Jevons today now idea yes oh right yeah in Russian like the stereotype is people think this is not via no actually says. Oh that's on the other hand what they do like to do is big elaborate long tests and it will always be to something so it's Okay Robin just generic yeah so sometimes like there's some simple ones. John's like to happiness zaccheus or to not finding diamond they fund guys costs yeah. I'm trying to got we found a diamond of a film that kind of undercuts the whole undercut spit fricking brilliant undercuts like with Kaz. Donnas donnas abused cutting thing yes that was entirely intentional breach response. Thanks thanks very much Linda being a guest well. Thank you for having me as always a pleasure. It's always something it'd be interesting next time. Cognac can't make any promises will do. I can't take our yeah. Donny folks hello again. I hope you enjoyed this episode of the roost. I felt not podcast. If you'd like to get in touch I'd love to hear from you. There's a couple of different ways you can do that. There's a reuss phones to facebook group. You can join where on twitter quitter at Russe fouls you and you can also email at Roussel night at g mail dot com. If you can spare a couple of minutes to rate us on on I tunes or wherever you get your put cost now old help other people hear about the show and will be very much appreciated. Thanks for listening and goodbye. Yeah

Siberia Britain geologist twitter US Ryan Mikhail Councils Tanya Mike Diamond City BFI UK Andre Andre Who Russia Tom Watch ski jumping Allie Armen Winston Churchill Sarah Uh Chris Mead
#48 Clay Tryan

X Factor Roping Podcast

1:45:00 hr | 8 months ago

#48 Clay Tryan

"I Clay Ready. Ready to roll and I'm ready everybody. Welcome to expect to reopen podcast with Klay Chine. Probably one of the better heading resumes of all time. I'm pretty excited to be here. Thank you thanks for having me. It's been a long time coming. Yeah man we've been trying to. I've been asking Probably about every week for the last. I don't know fifty two weeks or so ugly and we live About Twenty five minutes apart. So it's kind of sad but that's how I work. Usually I think just because the schedule that everyone's on it's pretty pretty wild but right now. We're we're being quarantined. So we're free young now not much going on. I will to to kind of get into things there. There was a few times these. These questions have been like in my mind for a very long time. We video with for like a smarter young produce a couple of years ago and so. There's a couple of kids at your house that were was a seven or eight healer another Muslim nine healer and they asked a question to you. If you could give any advice to a young roper and One thing you said to me and this is stayed with me forever is enjoy the winds more than the losses. Yeah because I think that's just from my experience. That's the one flaw I've loved hated losing so bad that I didn't enjoy the winds. And if I told my kids one thing because they wanna rope but I mean you gotta take it serious and it becomes job. I mean it's fun when you start as a kid you love every part of it and then the older you get it just becomes a job and sometimes the older if you have a long career like I've had I haven't asked the older guys that went before me but I'd have to say they'd say the same thing and then you Kinda quit and join it so You know enjoy the winds. Enjoy the enjoy the process and I think I didn't do that. Very good. This five change one thing about my roping. There's a lot of things that change but that would be the main thing as far as rope and just enjoy. Enjoy the victories more. Don't get so down on yourself. You know what the losses because the losses calm. I mean it's like baseball. You'RE NOT GONNA. No one's perfect in the sport. You're going to lose a lot and that's fine. You just got to win at the right times and we're GONNA win more than you lose right right so I 'cause I've heard that about you as you might win for example like the George Strait or something like that. A huge huge victory that ever. I've I win the George Strait. I'm happy for the next three or four years I can not. I don't care if I lose at that point but I've heard the very next day you might be Jackpot in and do not like that situation when it goes back. And that's and that's not a good thing it's kind of my personality. I've kind of always been that way of always said you know like you get titles. When you know best header best. He learned probably had that title for a few years. Or whatever. But it's telling me I was the best and I always said it doesn't really matter who the bet be. The title doesn't win you anything. Whoever ropes best that next day wins so what you want yesterday doesn't matter And that's kind of way I always looked at. It's what who does what today and the guy that wanted today was the best. Not The title doesn't when you nothing then not fun of people like to talk about it. And she's talked about but you know when you're living in the middle of it. I discount always looked at. You know what the next day you know like. I said whoever won that day is the best day. That's all that matters right right. So your boy. What's your what's your oldest boy. Which is Tyler Tyler Bray Lymphoma Mental? So that same day he was over there healing. Just kinda roping the donkey or something and you pulled the them two boys aside and said Hey. Will you go beat up my son? He's got that home school confidence he does. Anyone is better than anything I ju- I joked because my wife's family they were home schooled and I was kinda around when they were all kind of younger some of them because she's one of the older ones in some towns in your home school. You don't realise anybody out. There is better than you and so when you go to public school or something you any sport. There's other kids that are good stuff sauce. Kinda just messed with them all the time right but is that something you try to make. Sure your kids know. Hey there's there's people out there that are that are very very good at saying you gotta definitely will. I always tell my kids because they do love reopen. My oldest is just all in knows everything about it which is kind of always been that way even since he's been a little kid at any really meet telling me the stuffy nose. I. I don't think a dad could tell him all the stuff that he knows he just picks it up and the other one's hard to tell procedures follows in line but tyler so outgoing about it but yeah I'll tell them because if they wanNA wrote good they'll be like Oh. This kid wrote Rope skin this kid ropes. Good and I'm like hey you're going to have to go against cody snow. He's only twenty three years old. You're fourteen Five or six years. Get good enough. He's going to be in his prime sad. So you gotta get better than eight so much. The kid you're open against now you're going to have to go against those gas right right. Was that was that what it was like when you were growing up to. Is it pretty competitive environment for well? Me and my brother are not that far apart in age and my dad he he was pretty hard on us in a good way though but yeah I was competitive me and my brother were competitive We didn't really grow much money. So if we roped we needed to do good win. Alice in rather really competitive sports can get everything. Grown up in the United said wanted to win at. It wasn't quite the same because I think my dad made the NFL and stuff but he'd kind of been removed for for a while so we are almost naive to the process. Like nobody thinks if you make the NFL got made financially and all this. It's not true. I mean you gotTa keep winning. It's kind of an expensive sport. So if he leaves for few years you'll give it back everything that you ever want. So it's kind of a little naive to all that and I'm not as naive to it so with my kids and a little harder hunt him with a man you gotta get good real good and I realized that once I got into it and maybe growing up as a kid. We didn't really think of it that much you know but nowadays everybody so smart like you know when when I was growing up I'm old enough. There was no cell phones or no. You know if you WANNA watch. Good Roper is rope. It was you know you had to go to the billings Rodeo. You know the Nile. There'd be you know some guys some years like when I was younger. A lot of people went. It was a bigger audience. Like Jake Barnes and Klay Cooper. They'd go and stuff and then the older. I got it just got to where the guys just trying to make the Afar so basically you only get to watch guys. They're the BEF. I would have a tape out usually. You could watch that To back you know they call it to back then But it was still Tucson. They they had a tape by those every year. Watch those now's about it. Maybe a few inaudible with my dad circuit ready on staff. So are the fourth of July. We go you. Might you know how it is in a performance. Get to see a couple of good teams. That Cody Livingston. That's about it right so then the NF are coming on TV. Like in ninety four has started on. Espn two remember we'd we'd by USPNT just to watch the NFL that you'll five teams. That was Kinda how you know. Just getting her start looking back that kind of stuff. We did right right so that first year you made the NF are We're who who is your partner. I forget Caleb till someone Europe with Kayla for the first year. He made the finals and before that point Jackpot or otherwise there was only a few bigger opens is probably to back straight. Bfi But really. There wasn't a ton of big big open jackpots. Had had you had any success at any any of those pots. No not really. I never really been any honestly. I've been to the BFI I wrote the next day and ninety nine and I'd never been to the George Strait. It was kind of the George Strait back then was in July. Though and King's vill Texas is almost like it wasn't even talked about like it is I mean. Obviously the guys that were Rodeo and full-time knew about about like adding hardly know about it And so pretty much just remember. California like they had a rope opens out there in the spring. Just like they do now. They had like the The oakdale rope and Mike booth rope in the head that that was good. And then Bruce Big One I always see. Oh He's always had his and trying to think there might have been one other one but like when I first started like the dog wasn't around it was around in one realm and that was a good one from the start Your there wasn't just wasn't many Romans I had. I remember the first year road. I come back second. I didn't have good horse me and my brother run the same horse but the horse hours ride was basically just like a seven-year-old mirror that just randomly was he'll horse. I start heading on. We know money were riding Both Riding Wall at the Rodeos were doing good in the Rodeos. 'cause he was just that good horse he you know He. My brother is twenty. You know twenty years old. He my brother find story about him as everybody. He'd Never Rodeo before he'd only circuit rode his first out he made it. I mean he hadn't been out of the State of Montana and he made it so we were just. It was looking back on the fun times. We're all green. I'd read it a little bit so I kind of knew how to address and I'd paid attention. I didn't know anything when I started. So I kinda lead the group as far as my brother up to the Moon brother-in-law now the first year Matt Robertson We can all went together. I entered distanced and so but anyways long story I was at the wildfire broke. The barrier secondhand back broke the barrier there and then from there the wildfire. We drove straight to Tucson. Pretty much set up that year in a broke. The barrier again is fourth back at Tucson broke the barrier to probably win both Lopez on the last one and I wasn't even a break. I never wrote very More now than I did back down and burst back to back and say I need. The money would have been huge back. Then so those are two big ropunds by had hadn't won anything big in fact the first big open over one was the BFI in five but they didn't really have. They aren't like they are now like there's so many Europeans now back then was. Us Finals Wildfire wasn't even the wildfire yet it was. It wasn't big yet like I think it paid. Fifteen thousand maybe the year Broke the barrier and then like the Tucson rope on. I don't know how to hate to say what a Pai I'm GonNa Guess it was decent. I'M GONNA say pay ten thousand. I could be wrong. Which is big for back then but nothing like they are now right so it was just basically just kinda cracked out started early on and it just went. Good that well. No I wrote in ninety nine wrote the. Knicks are Sha- For like the first half of the year and I wrote with Klay Cooper second half and I did terrible. I didn't make the farfetched twentieth You know had the legend seven time world champ which I wasn't ready for at You know just like you know. I went to one hundred. I seen the you know how you keep We're you know cleaning her house out. Or whatever he final papers I went to a hundred and eight rodeos ninety nine and flew one time so my horse lasted basically one year right and I was just tired. I can't a tell you how tired I was in a war horse out. I didn't wrote very good for Clay Cooper because we should have primary. We won the first story. We enter deadwood. Want any team roper. Chime back then Sally we won. That wrote that. I'M GONNA be rich the rest of my life now and then it just went bad my head horse. Kinda got sore crippled Borrow brothers he had an okay one not as good as mine. Mine was just you know. We didn't know injections back then. I'm just beauty him so much to get Bhai Mani know what's wrong with him. I bet if I injected his front feet he'd been good to go but we didn't even do it back then so it's just like he's limping around one day next day is not and so they're just trying to get through the year but you know hundred and eight ahead a two horse trailer that. I won a single cab dodge with a camper that had another camper that I traded a guy for for a smaller one. And that's how we did it but I have a schedule. I don't even know if I could go through it but what we did one week. You want the schedule I can if I can remember it. I'll start it so I might add in so keep track to write this down and this is when I was like I wasn't ready for this like you're in shape for sometimes. You're older but this schedule. I tell people is like so. I'd never been in humidity like this dodge city. Matric Brooke didn't have air conditioning semi camp so even plugged in at a fan so dot said he can be hotter than young love in August while I just had a camper bacon so I basically just go to the movies all day long and back then we just dodged anyway. It's back to back now but back then. It seemed like we would. There was a bunch more run can still is but there was even more where we kind of based ourselves out of Dodge city. We'd go to Rodeo that night. Come back to dodge city seemed like all week as in Dodge city. I just a movie theater pay for one movie into sit there all day couldn't stand being camper but anyway so we made the Short Dodge city drove all night to loving ton CA slack. Was the next morning from loving drove to Colorado springs rope there from Colorado Springs. Not Going to give you the days in. That can't remember of them but some of them are two in a day from Colorado Springs drove at Torrington Wyoming drove to Colorado Yuma. We drove back to I want. We drove a lot in Oklahoma from Lawton Oklahoma. I don't know if he went back to Levingston in there too. We might have went to Levingston to Latin to Lamar Colorado decanes bird Colorado back to Colorado Springs to castle rock to Napa or to call all in one week in. I don't know I might have missed one there to And that's what I'm eating man wearing me out. That's how they used to do back then. It wasn't it wasn't fun and that's where when kids one hundred thousand. I say one hundred radio. Do you know who tells him? It was great because it wasn't read. I lived it and I did it for like maybe four years. I mean it was. Seven horse lasted one year and he was just basically one year all. It's pretty easy to even like last year. Sixty five rodeos and you'll see kids that are just starting to to get out there and by the After the fourth of July maybe even before the twenty four th Rodeos are like man. I'm tired yeah do what I did that week. I feel like I missed radio somewhere in there but it felt like I drove all night or all day for about eight or ten days straight I give us and I was twenty years old and I was out of shape for it was rough so around that time. Twenty years old. That's that's a year you wrote with Klay And weren't ready for it. I wasn't ready for now. What was that like going into it? Where were you did? You think you're ready or you're nervous or did you feel prepared. Or how did you think about it going into it and then at the end of it too will? I think it was just too dumb to know anything I headed good just off looking back nowadays. There's kids everywhere. The Dinner Bell Know Each Other back down. There is no kids it entered. I was like the only one I mean. There was no one hardly my age. It even hardly roped and So I had no cell phone have no no really learning. I'm just Kinda out there by myself trying to figure it out you know I was reading. The Knicks are Sha- in clay called me to wrote and so I did it on his seven time champ which I must have been looking back I must have been the kid that was heading. Pretty good and he'd been out for a while. He was headman Rodeo in. So maybe a Mom. Suri asked a bunch of guys but maybe weird time of year and You know maybe is supposed to be the next best thing or whatever. I don't know what people talk about back then. I wasn't talking knowing certainly know anyone else. I guess young dome and But I wasn't ready. I headed good for Nick. I felt like but I don't know just not even pressure just a little bit. You Know WanNa do good friend just trying too hard in a way. If I just did like I was doing before. I think I'd have been good to go and I don't know this didn't roped I get which honestly probably was the best thing ever for me in a weird way like that failing because I went with clay didn't do good like I said when the first show we went Didn't wrote good decent at the end of the year but it was almost too late. Rose don't pay like they do now like I mean back then. It was thousand nine hundred a time. You had to win a lot you know. They're hard to get reno paid good. There was a few big hits. A lot of it was just grinded out that it was probably the best thing for me Overall not doing good with Klay because he was you know when you get the legend the known as the best healer of all time when she was already known as that when I started out with him. And you don't do good with him. I go from him to No one wanted to rope with me in the next year. And so Kinda humbling I didn't do very good the next one a Rodeo and so basically then I just quit I I went to a few winter rodeos to Houston and all the you know all the big one rodeos. I got into it. Didn't do any good. And then I went home and just circuit Rodeo The rest of the year and That that's actually where I got good. I felt like started getting a practice to work on stuff. I needed to work on and got better because you know once you start Rodeo and he wrote a lot you don't really get to practice a whole lot and so I kind of got to go home got a circuit rodeos where they weren't as tough and kind of you know. Get to work on it during the week and then go try it out during the weekend. And that's where I felt like I got good enough to you know when I come back a new felt like I was good enough to make the NFL. It's funny about that though because we don't really WANNA get we don't WanNa lose ever but the losing sometimes the big big losses like for you. I'm sure it's been a long time now. But that was probably devastating. Heaven I mean the greatest healer of that time then to not be successful at the end of that summer it has to be really really rough to me and then you know to to take that and be able to go home and refine like hey. This is to to kind of push through like. Hey this is what I need to work on. This is why I need to improve really that. Do you think that's probably one of the moments? It may be set you up for the rest of your career. Yeah I think so At the time I mean you're just like your your devastated that you question if you're good enough and I mean until you start doing good you don't no one really knows you think you got it but you don't know but yeah. I guess sometimes it like you said you think you learn more from failures than success Because you Kinda dig deep and you know figure out. I think the one thing that helped me is just Maho life. I was always so competitive. Everything I don't know why I just to come out that way. I was sports. I mean basketball football baseball. Whether is good or not. I wanted to win at all costs and I just kind of you know. I guess that would carry it over rope and too so just you know. Lose sleep at night trying to figure it out. What do I need to work on how to ride a horse better? Why does this guy you know why he always get a good goal to steer? Why's this got never miss? And just you know why do I Miss Wise Ma Horse Duck and you know all the little stuff like that. How can I get better and you know when I was younger and Steven to this day still same same thing? You feel like you're a little smarter now. The older you get you kinda see stuff maybe a little quicker but but like that like I said back then was tough. There was no x-factor roping. There was no. You know like my kids. Were you know just random that I was coming today? That even though it was coming here today. And they're they watch your youtube videos all the time they were just shown on the big TV. You know because there's no sports on TV so basically it's not for me and we're watching. I don't know it was round one somewhere on Youtube. You know they're just so they're getting to see how it's done right versus when I was a kid. That's why kids I think are so much better now at such a young age I totally agree because I I mean I'll just watch little things. I remember right when I was Kinda getting going. I would pick up on little things. You'd watch a run so many times and then you're just trying to emulate that your mind and you did just a real clear picture of what you wanted to work on but hey the website we we got a new design with it. So it's like a Netflix. So for example with all these robens I'll get the boys hooked up so you need so now you can get in and watch like the full full R- open. Yeah so it's really cool so awesome right. Now we're Corentin. We'll make sure we'll make sure good time. Good time all right. I have this this theory about you're heading and I want you to tell me what you think you you road wall a lot right. Yeah at the beginning. I Two years I wrote I wrote him a lot. So that horse to me. What made him so special. It was the same trip every time. He really didn't duck he he. It was just whatever you did. He kind of was he was so true right. Yeah is that what made him so great. Yeah you know what I see. I had a decent horse when I first Monday was always pretty good. We didn't always. I didn't always have a good one when I was a kid when I was probably twelve years old. Thirteen years old He bought this bay mayor for us. Our Name was sugar and The Guy who wrote with a time supposed to come trier didn't show up. He just rides are stands like biser. Thank you give forty five hundred four. While in nineteen ninety one forty. Five hundred was a lot. Dad was a healer heathen head. This bottom for us me and my brother both wrote it and She was built good way. I mean so much better than we were ready for like too much horse for a little while and so then went from that horse to they wanna I heart radio and I bought a horse. It was decent everybody Ever you know the new kid with it get horse. Everybody thinks everybody's trying to buy off me when I first star and he was decent. But I'd already wrote her and she. I think she was just as good or better than this one. And I knew that. And then there's two horses and so I wrote a full year before Travis. It went so I'd ready maybe year and a half and then before Travis got that horse and there's two horses that come to mind the first time ever seen him go I was like. Oh my gosh. It was that horse that Matt Tyler ended up with Chat. Saunders had a CONACO. I don't know what he called him. They called him Eddie. Maybe I don't know what Chad called him. But that horse going and then we'll my brother road wall at an amateur Montana. I want to say the boxes. I could be wrong on the measurements but it's long like maybe twenty foot box. Twenty two foot score right. That's along its amateur. He not even appropriate long. And this horse run like I mean I was like damn I mean the horses just aren't like that and the other was like that too and so I knew he was going to be good. I remember Funny Story About Him. We he was green. Never been you know. He just been road by. A guy was good with horses but he rodeo on him or nothing and we wrote him at Denver and somebody said to me. What's that piece of crap you guys? Raton and I said man this might end up being this kind of a little smart house. I said this might end up being the best horse of all time and I was more right than wrong. Yeah and already knew because when you ride one that good you're like you know like that's like do the first time ever run steer on him the first year they the horses aren't like this. You know he was nine or ten years old and it was unbelievable how hard he tried in how good he worked. You just know in what was what was like that to be just a different level. Well to me I think this there's horses that can teach you how to win. And what a good one should feel like and the earlier you can get autumn at a younger age and understand how to keep them working like what you had to do. I think that when you get those horses like do it makes it where you can make them. I do I do think it set you up. It's kind of the way you learn to row now but I think that's been tough from me. The older I got because the Scotland so fast because back in the day I would be like when I started riding thumper he was low. The same way to thumper was a little odd because he was like my wife wrote him a bunch of kids. Rhodium her mom. The whole family had wrote him and he'll horse ahead horse and they just Kinda all used him he just didn't quite give it his all but he always worked good and then so he kinda got better just the more I wrote him but I think he had it in him so it was a little later process like I guess but yeah it shows you that if you are running a piece of junk that there's better out there and you need to go find it but nowadays guys win on pieces of Jack I think just they use a rope so good so it's chain but back then. If you had a good horse I never wrote the Barron Walton felt like I never missed hardly like I just turned every steer I wouldn't even have to reach nothing. Just let him do the work and it was good enough. All the time will to connect to go back to that that work ethic and develop and really work on Europen. There's a couple things jump out to me about your heading. Everyone has for a while whenever they want whenever they talk about. You're heading it's this rope on the gain head shot that you have basically develop throughout the years. When did that really start to come into play? Was that Walt. That was teaching that or do you think that was a little closer to win you. Maybe like had do or I'm not real sure I don't really know either. I felt like I was the only guy that could do it. Good for a while now. I feel like everybody does it. I mean I think that's what's changed with rope and I felt like for a while I was the only that was really good at it and I pry few others but I don't think there's anyone good at it. Well is. There's a lot of guys that are good at it now but there wasn't for a while. There was a spa. There you know or it seemed like when roping for a while there everybody run close so they reached and I was just kinda right in the middle ground turned a lot of them. It's still fast if you do it right And it was just good. You know for regular season Rodeo and you know doing good at the jackpots. But I don't know when I was pretty good on wall. I mean we were just young. I mean if if I'd have been a little older and had walter you know Travis had so many good years on you. I mean the first year I wrote him. I wrote him a lot the first year. I wrote him a lot where I wrote him. Well I wasn't in the NFL. Like third year. Now with Caleb. He was twenty years old. And I'm twenty two that that doesn't happen nowadays there. You won't have a twenty two and twenty healer hardly go into the NFL third nowadays and if they did is because they won fifty thousand one. Rodeo we just did it grind in doubt and that doesn't happen so have there's something there was a horse you know. Caleb road good I wrote good too. We had he had a good horse horse and honestly and goes ahead. Worse than any of it you know. I didn't rope near as good on anything else. And so yeah the horse back horses everything it seemed like you know for Charles or t woman had a good one or anybody. I mean it was just a lot the horse well and I think Heddon back even I think heading ten years ago or I. I don't know I think when I first bought that black horse of mine. That has so much around. It seemed like all the scores. When you dropped. You just blew and you could go kind of the won closed shot and and at one a lot and now it's like you don't want quite as much run and it's yeah yeah a little slower doesn't hurt sometimes being forced into reach in yet because the Horse I got now compared to all those. He's honestly prime my favorite radio or severe. Had 'cause you he's not. He's not as fast as Walter do was but yet you can reach and he's got enough to where it just seems like a winner like he'll catch up on runs and he let you win on the slow on. Kinda can reach from close. Just kind of is tough. I mean rattle will all right so going back to this heading on the game. When do you think that was so when win? Did you like? Hey this is my shot. This is when I have it down or when did you try to really work on that? And refined that in the practice pin man just felt like years honestly just going out there and you know just back in the day everybody wave it off doing it can keep it on the horns me. Included is keep trying and trying to try and figuring out getting your timing down felt like I don't really know if I ever got it But certain horses are easier to do it on than others but like I said nowadays. It's just changed like everything seemed like a slow process and then all the sudden I swear when things changed. Now it's like it's hard to tell back then because it's just more of a slow process than than just sitting out on your sixteen. It seems like all these kids start Rodeo and start reaching you know yes. I don't even know if it's good roper. Now it's just there's a lot of it. There's a lot of teams I don't even like watching some of it. I don't even want to sound like curmudgeon but I watch like Livingston Slack. One year there's eight teams maybe seven eight good. I mean it's seventy mrs in eight catches is what it feels like it. Just anyone good to watch to me. But that's the way reopen is now and if you're GONNA win year GONNA mess up. That's why I don't like about rope. Felt for while there. I could rope kind of getting off track but you could just make any mistakes. It feels like I mess up all the time now and it kind of feels like you have to take chances all the time. I totally agree so is going all of it. Didn't feel like that forever. Felt like you know for ten years if you just you know road your horse. Good didn't break. The barrier now. Feels like you need to be in the barrier and if you want to win the Jackpot you better make some good runs. Yeah and it it. It felt like you know when I was doing the best. It felt like if I got a lead back off catch still in the open now. There'll be somebody two seconds behind you and they'll just throw out the barrier next thing you know they're ahead of you. This win caught. And that's what's to me has changed the most right a couple like dustin squeeze and there's guys that are doing it pretty consistent guys trying to copy him. They're not good at it. You know he's good at it but just copycats make it to where I really don't even know how they afford to do it but they do it. And then they'll catch one out of erode you'll catch one out of six one out of five and you just hope it's not the day where you made a good run to you know that's the thing now. There's nobody wants to be the squeeze. There's only one that's doing that I think's good. You Know He. He's different he's somebody I there's lots of good but I'm saying he's the he's the best. I'm not his game. Yeah what He. He doesn't go with the Radios Union. Go Past Twenty feet out of the box no matter what just throws it every time. So there's guys that copy it there terrible at it. But they tried to copy him and he's not terrible at it but they're trying to copy him so they're just you get a Lotta copycats and that's why Rodeo and that's why Rodeo tough now is just a bunch of guys try and they're not good at it but they catch out of five and if you get enough guys trying it just makes it tough. Well Yeah I think that's what's gotten really interesting about the Rodeos over the last when we are video on a kind of showing the highlights on you know better than anyone you video at all. Yeah so I can tell you without a doubt. If ten teams went it was probably a thirty percent catch percentage that was head or like at a one one hundred sometimes and then sometimes like Livingston. It would be one out of ten and then still four four win last you know. Yeah at a ten money Rodeo because only one out of ten teams in one hundred teamer have to catch the road of just be nasty. So yeah it's yeah it's how you have to wrote it's just to me. It's terrible watching all. It's it's real boring and then real excited. Yeah you're right. You're like man. These team roper suck. And then you'll watch and then fifty teams awaiting four four one at fifth. Yeah and read the results when it's over you understand while every hundred teams all hundred teams tried. They tried yeah. Yeah and it's it'll definitely play the emotions when you're early. You missed one like Oh man. I think I just left a bunch of money in the related. Now all right so I heard that you would swing. You're out in front of the Mirror to work on your swing. Set Your Amir a little bit when I was younger when I was a kid They so you don't have a girlfriend or yet or a little older than my kids are now but so they had video cameras the over the shoulder. What I would do is I would set it up on a barrel and I wrote the head dummy and so I'd say make bounty remember now. Pride Twenty thirty loops than go. Watch it and then come back and do it again and basically watching to see if I looked like some of the guys that I'd seen rope on TV Jake Barnes or t woman or speed probably was. Just come along you know then. I don't even know if he'd been but just kind of whoever the best guys were. Dan Green I was trying to mimic some stuff. They did so. I think I mean you have the best heading swing. Would you agree of of all the headers? You got the best swing know. Who Know of right now. Maybe today someone swings a Hetero better but over the last twenty years swung ahead wrote better. Well I think I got a good swing but I think it was hard to talk. It just talks when like in timing. Like I'm always my brain's always think today in how many guys sure figured out heading back. Well let me let me because this is what I think when I watch you. Swing ahead rope. I thought Jay but I thought Jake had a good swing thought. T- woman had a good swing. Sure but Tyler had a pretty smooth swing. I think there's lots of those guys. All Swain row scraped great and Jake's probably the best example of I think he's probably one of the best headers all time but he could still reach into a lot of stuff but your swing has been able to. I think the reason you can head on the game is it. Such a a smooth swing has great timing with your horse and what it's allowed you to do is as the ropes have gotten faster just like this sorrel horse. You ride now You'll go to coils. Maybe more now than you did two or three years ago yeah at a Jackpot and and so I'm just. I'm kind of curious if you like. How many times you have worked on your swing are tied constantly to this. Still Change it. I think swing different allocated five or six years ago if you watch back which I'm trying to purpose Yeah that's I. Think the swing in anything heading or healing is a lot of it. I mean it's a lot of how you throw your swing kind of dictates if you are a richer guy that runs close ref. But what's hard nowadays about explainer openness? There's no variety anymore. Everybody's the same. Have you noticed that may not all squeezer but no-one no-one Harley runs close. I watched your video last night. There there it was around one of. I know what you're open it was. It looked like spur. Tuesday may be no. It was It was at Austin's it might have been as may reopen the aisle showdown up his shirt. I think it was because it was really bright out. Yeah and so then look like the wintertime but in we're watching it and I'm like what round is this. Your kids are like it's round one. I know I wouldn't mind pretty. Dang hard triggers through. He run to on their looked like he was going for the short. Go fast time. That was round. One guys were thrown Chase Thompson. For example I think he threw three calls on the first one on a decent deer. Like just that stuff never used to happen. So it's almost like you gotta talk. Generations are open because when I love to talk back because it's kind of fun to do just when you've had a long career you get to see a lot but everything's changing so fast and so much in the headers headers of taking it to a level that I did in the Mount of Gaza have done it. It's pretty impressive. I think the headers of their I know header good. Nowadays they really are any healers to I mean and that's what I think too you know we're talking about our opens getting tough woman. The headers get better. And and healers get better and and you can reach Heddon and handling bad and they still catch you keep trying new go faster reach a little farther. They still catch him back then known. Cottam if you handle them bad like that right and nowadays these guys figured out how to catch them and so. I think it's just sped because back in the day if you reach long ways. Hanley battery healers mess and go on nowadays. That's what will win I and there'll be a bunch of guys catch him. It's amazing how good these guys can heal too so it just speeds up the head and even more because you know. Hey they can handle this back there. Well I think that's a really good example like the the showdown that that time. I remember the rope and really well because I was just starting out this Bay Horse. It was one of his. I wrote in California and I come back and he worked really good and I. I remember the first year I drew moats and I went and I went to early and I got out and we were short. Six in Austin really fresh strong sneers and that's that's a good run and come back and we're six on. We were six on every steer mid to short six and then. I missed the barrier on one on a runner and I took him down and we were eight and we will not fourth on the rope. Oh and you're like anytime else or five years ago it would it would eventually it's I. Yeah and that's what's amazing now is like the guys are. There's there's enough headers that can get you back into the ropes. And then what what I think's kind of odd now is. It seemed like four or five years ago. There wasn't maybe even a little bit longer but there is a couple of guys that were really really heading. Well like there was but there's this top tier of headers. Well I think it was a a just a different style. You were trying to go for because you're not old enough probably know this but there's always been guys try like There's a guy. He passed away but richer trailer he tried to. I mean he wasn't as refined as a squeezer like swing his fast and do it is pretty but when he nodded he started swinging. Whether you're a lot in Oklahoma that George Strait. I never seen him very much. Because he didn't go he F- he threw it the barrier every single time. We have run. A stair. Couldn't catch enough. There's always been guys reach and they just never caught enough to make make it to the NFL you know. I don't think the bears have gotten shorter. I think it's easier to score now. Like the briefer shoots are been a huge Prefer shoot. It's about a foot shorter than if there's any other kinda shoot the Chute score true to me just easy to get a barrier prefer. Shoot now if there's an old ww or you go to the random you know go to file. Arado and they got their homemade shoot like scoring today. Yeah that'd be barriers tons barriers when they pull that out will when I first started. That's what there was a lot of flack gates everything evolves. I mean. I don't want to be one of those guys like it. You know in twenty years from now the headers will be like man. These guys are terrorists. That's the way roping is. That's way every sport is basketball football. I mean baseball. I mean every reliever can throw hundred back in the day. There was only a couple that did it. Yeah Starters Throw Ninety eight all game long. So that every sport evolves to where it's different but the how fast it's going now is unbelievable. How fast got good? You know over a few years so you when you change your swing. How'd he do that like? Let's say? Hey I want to tweak on my swing. What what's your game plan on changing that? I just wrote the dummy lot. I'm kind of a dummy guy. Wrote a lot in the summertime. Because don't get to practice and just. I'm old enough now like if I often feel like I need to change something. I'll just rope the dumb enough and I feel like I can just go right to the Rodeo and try When I was younger I couldn't do it now. I probably can you know. Is the reach farther back nowadays? Seems like you need to get your tip up more. Your you know your hand a little bit higher just the all the little stuff like that swing sooner You know just just all the little stuff how just just speed it up anyway to speed it up you? Just the dummy outfielder feels right until like you're like okay. This is how supposed to hit. You know how you want it to hit and wanted to feel it's off you know it's off. Yeah and then. There's sometimes that's tell somebody that our day you get in a groove to where he just wants Jerry. Just feel like. There's no way I'm missing and I don't even know I mean you've had happened to you. Everybody's had that happened to you. But you're just like Manna groove. I don't I can you give me the stair turning back. It only happens to me like once or twice a year where last year it was during a Ellensburg and I was just. I don't for some reason. I just got in a groove on a few stairs on my no matter what I'm turning him to win. Good money and you know some day and always like that and the next time. It'll be like man I. I hope this goes on. You know you're just not as confident as you were before but I like the dummy. Still do my rope in the whirlpool quite a bit. Honestly Right Probably more than I used to just do it is that what kind of changed over. The years is Maybe less you still round like thirty forty fifty day when you practice or how a lot Now I probably run more now really. Oh Yeah I don't know if it's helping me but Causality get you feel. You feel a little bit more the next day. Well when I was younger I didn't on my own place. I'll just go like well going way back. The rodeo season started in January in ended in November right. So when you're a kid that doesn't own a place yet. It just felt like I was Rodeo. Gone twelve months out of the year in a far one or the year ends in November and the NF are starts beginning in December. I mean you and then you spend that month maybe you know we used to go the Laughlin. Us reopen and then fells like your practice two three weeks on the NF are happened. Jeff Christmas you're back over there though DESA again and it just felt like it never ended that you just and so then when I moved to Texas Felt like when I started. I mean I practiced a lot. Don't get me wrong. I was able to get more horses and just get my own set up the way I wanted it but I was twenty six then too but it was harder back then like I said the season longer I mean everybody loves Rodion. You GotTa be careful what you wish for. I did both miserable back then. Like it really was like you just never stopped rat but is that did you. Have you always loved her? Open something like or if you just love competition and this is what like well. I don't know what drew me back up. Just grown up around it like my mom run barrels and me and my brother made the far. She made it four times so I grew up around at my dad made the far so now. I just play sports. I didn't even rope a lot till I was probably fifteen years old. I'm not not that I wasn't around it and swung wrote good. Just didn't do it very much and then I think what got me hooked is like I was really good at all. Sports was little and I just you know it was really good at baseball. So you know making all star teams and Then Japanese Senate team over to play in billings like took the best kids at billings. One hundred thousand people. It's not a little town will. I was one of the kids. You've got to go play so I was. I lived out of billings but so I had to been decent but I wasn't growing so new. Probably GonNa make it and I just always kind of always drawn back to rope and you know going to the Circuit Rodeos of my dad or mom and you know circuit finals or whatever just liked it and then start roping decent. Atta won a big check. One Fall Open just like that. I just basically quit sports than just won. Miss you know start going jackpots. Probably every other weekend up there in Montana in the wintertime and just start doing it that way and have you felt like you've always that's been how you made your living open like every year. Is that been the number one deal or was there a point in the roping like hey just doesn't pay for itself or you had to do other things to kind of make it work or is it always just kind of been able to pay for itself. Well since two thousand probably. I mean. I didn't have any money when I started everybody. Says you gotTA HAVE MONEY TO MAKE IT? Robin. I'd nothing so that's not true Yeah no it's been Ruben. For me I had some odd jobs when I was like a high school. Your parents are taking care of whatever you're not paying for and just rope enough around you know like a kid to have a little bit of money or enough to buy a thirty five hundred dollar horse or something like that and then amateur around and then I got while I was broke the after like I wrote I just basically broke even or I don't probably lost money the first year I when I finished I think finish twenty first in ninety nine so then I was pretty bro. Go onto the next winter. Didn't do any good flat broke so then I got a few jobs and then when I came back since pretty much end the two thousand two thousand one. I've been just roping roping for it right and the far every time but I didn't once and the other year I didn't go so I just Kinda don't for Libya. Yeah you've you've been pretty pretty fortunate was a qualifications. That's a lot or get rich off it. I didn't really start making a lot of money until I started these big ropunds when George Strait. You know the bfi eight paid seventy two thousand pay sixty now wrestle like actually one more money. I think the heyday of opens was like the middle of two thousand. Tell maybe because the US files paid fifty thousand Yep Wildfire paid fifty thousand. But they were really front end loaded. They were but I was winning. I yes so it was really good for you. It was good but it was still was good because it was frontloaded but second was twenty nowadays. We can't hardly get one to pay twenty right. You know what I mean or twenty five. I I don't know the. Us follows was good for a while or fears. Erawan a couple of years in a row when it was good and The prelims good like one year. I won first second. The preliminary goes the shootout one. Like sixty six thousand rap and it doesn't even seem like you can hardly win that now. So there's more rope that are better but there's too many opens out. I think nowadays just ruining it but that everybody figures out you can make a thousand bucks if you put it on. Just open guys. Just keep going but basically alls it is the same ten guys yeah there. There's a lot of money being traded also seems to me. That doesn't seem like the I don't like it as much and I I used to own the reason I say this 'cause like you said you can. You can only say the stuff when you've done a long time and you've seen both ways of it and I used to write down like oh seven. I quit doing it but I used to write down everything spent and everything on one. I don't even know I got thinking. I WanNa know why started doing it this year. Just curiosity why found digging up stuff found old paper no seven crap of. I've went to like twenty six jackpots. This year already rap. I didn't go to twenty six jackpots all year in two thousand seven. That's crazy. Yeah I've already been to that many and so but I think it's killing roping. 'cause there's there's just not as many what? I don't like about roping nowadays. Make Them Inter four times. Two hundred men. That's just for the producer to make money. It's not for the guys roping. Everybody says I love how people putting them on like. We're doing it for you guys. There's a few that we're doing for you guys the rest. They're doing it to make money and I get it. I just don't say you're doing it for us because it's not true. I think there's a balance because there's not enough open roper to to make producers money so they've either gotta figure out how to make the team count high enough where they can pay for. Because we're open receivers want better steers. They catch sisters a little bit more so they've got either get those for the low younger guys like whether he the rope down ready for him but let's kind of what they do. You can't start a stir out and put him in eight chair. I don't want my kids wrote in the stairs that we wrote in the opens. Yeah but there's a balance you when you make inner four times two hundred a man the Romans. Give me dirty tough. Yeah I'm not going you'RE GONNA wear head horse out if you're if you're smart headed. All the has a good horse. You're not taking him over there and the rope is going to pay three thousand and believe me it will be the toughest trump and you'll ever be a part of so you. Don't get the kid that is trying to learn. He knows better than them. Probably go and so you just get a bunch of guys that go to everything. Now that have eight hundred a rope in that. Pays three thousand if you win. I declare twenty two hundred. That doesn't and it'd be better to me. My theory is making twice two hundred. A man maybe get a few teams but maybe build the team count backup. Yeah Not as tough. Don't ruin your horse. But that's the producers. They just care about numbers and and that's enough to say it. I don't care what people think. That's just the truth and I know how they think in. So it's not even good deal for anyone involved in my opinion but it's good for the producer. He makes more money. Well I think for me as an opener over. I love once or twice to If you get three runs it's tough to everybody gets three runs and it's just you can mess up a lot mess up mess up mess up and still win it. Yeah I think that's the other thing that's kind of interesting when you go. Those opens that are in our once or twice When you don't have that second run in your back pocket you don't rope as fast. Yep Yep and so your mindset is has slowed a lot. Yeah you told me one time you when you're looking for your healers you want him to be a dog what you want them to have some dog in them. Yeah and when you're looking for partners what what does that mean? Well when you're looking for partner and he's a dog. What what does that mean? Will you just talk some people and you just know they got it? Some people just don't and I I get almost. It's hard when you're really young because you don't know your personality but I mean you you get around. People Are Older. You know they win. And no doubt and jade wants to win those out a win yet. You know T G. He wants to win. He's been doing it since he's been a kid. I mean there's a lot of these guys at junior. He looks like he has some fight. Any you know a lot of these young guys you know and some don't and you gotta I think you gotTa want to be better than the next guy and nowadays are generations are soft and they don't WanNa think that way but the good guys do I agree just got to want it some people. Some people don't personality matters a lot. I think you know into sometimes like like I say I have a little dog in. You means you WANNA battle through the tough times because everybody's GONNA rope terrible for awhile rat and just battle through it figure it out and get better and like I said it's tough to do. But that's that's what you gotta do kind of goes back to what you said right at the beginning The losing that the loosens really got a bother them to the point where they want to figure out how to win or does it does me but I do think there's a point worth bother me too much. I mean got to enjoy life some too and I've thought of things sometimes. I've just not enjoying my life just because I've been so focused you never let down. Never let down. I mean just grind it out you know. I don't WanNa change much about my rope in career. It's been good enough But I it'd be better to enjoy like I said I'd want my kids to enjoy it more right so if you're looking for a partner that has some dog too and I'm just thinking young kids like hey if you if you could give him some advice on how to how to be a hug. I don't know how to do that. I will 'cause it's funny when you get kids they all got different personalities and so they're my youngest is probably the most like how I was when I was younger. He's only five years old but if things don't go his way it will football. He's he's upset beside himself. It ruined his day. I was a little like that. My other two aren't really like that. So you just see differ. I don't know why he's like these five really. Hey knock it off. You know but he just these that way at every sport if it doesn't go his way he's but he will try hard. I mean that kid will go. You can't get him to take the garbage out but if it has to do with shooting a basketball a rope in the I mean all day long. We never stops Take the garbage out. Now I can't do it but he's got you know fees were playing football or baseball or football. He will go rope on the with the other. Ones just nonstop. So I don't know I think it's everybody's different than to have their different personalities you know so just Kinda that be able to sit there you gotta be who you are but I think if losing doesn't bother you a little bit it's GonNa be tough to get really good right just my opinion well and I think what it is. Is You gotta be able to go work. And I think that's what's probably I think it's the most interesting to me right now. I I think there's a lot of guys that had really really good right now. It's it's changed with how the guy's gonNA reach but he'll and it doesn't seem like there's as many healers as there were five or ten years ago that like we're just it just seemed like there was a group ahead as rope great and then there was a ton of healers like if you give them any of those headers and it doesn't seem like that to me now is does you might be right. We'll head and I'll just speak for heading heading if you don't try your hardest right now. You have no chance. And maybe he'll and just ain't that way right now. I don't know how he'll don't really know that there's some good guys but But heading right now for sure. If you're not giving your all looking for horses or try I mean you have no chance and Helen Healing. The horse deals the the the biggest advantage humans. The horses easier to find cheaper. Rat Don't need is get a horse Ahead and it's always going to be a problem always has been a problem and always going to be a problem. I'm not saying he doesn't need a great horse because they do. It's just way harder head if you could give advice to like a young header especially on keeping their horses Sir career longer and keeping them horses working that you've learned. What would you give? Don't enter four times for fifty a man stay away from that on your good one you know. Read if you put the good horse. If you're getting him out you want to be able to say forget stuff. Keep the cream on the top you know. Don't don't tread off the tires so I would say. Save him for the good stuff. I'm sure everybody has a different theory. That just what I think. Red China use the good ones when it really matters. So the Mike. Survey the other day Why is it that you know? That's what's so funny to me about your heading. I your absolute Gamer everywhere. But they say that reopened. Anyone has a chance its tail. What tale by the end? The gator is pretty long tail by the pants and seventeen foot box. So you've got to run them down maybe one or two in the first round. What what did you win at that rope? And the other day. What do you mean what place? Yeah Yeah when first and second but and then You and pets were had a chance for him. Yeah and like so. You mean really probably had a chance to win first through third at that rope I mean I was. I was good on three three guys. Yeah but I thought the wrote. I was up early with pets. Go and the rope was pretty tight and I mean they only pay what five money's probably six hundred eighteen is the sex money's. Yeah something like that. Kylie minor was good on a couple and he's got that horse. Yeah they get the best horse especially for stuff like that. He's got the best one. I had a couple of faster than pet scan. We're early and I figured if I just caught steers Congo and the riot pry. I was a little out of whack and I should've but I I felt like I needed to at the time as it turned out of pride didn't need to wrap but in the road and fell apart a little bit which they do sometimes. That's just strictly. Because everybody knows how fast everybody is in twenty twenty eight twenty nine was a cat or something on four thirty. Yeah yeah that's crazy. A seven and a half run and it's tough in that first round especially. Yeah the first round the sea and not drew good like some of these days like you Like me and chase we. We drew gun round one me and Jake. Long didn't draws good but we wrote good open. I was good enough for second. Probably by-catches it's more like a fourth place. What we because. I didn't feel like we had very short roast. Your loped and the other four tried just enough. You know being chased drew better so so my point with this. That's a reopened where clearly had a great great chance to win a lot of money and then and that's the toughest on horses right there that it's like the bfi it's tough. It is tough on Rena. Sandy it's a little bit deep. Yeah they try to keep it packed but it's tough. It's tough and You can go to a short scored inside building the next day. If you want on that horse why do you think it is that you can be so competitive at both of those setups as long scores? Short scores. What did what is it about ahead of that that you you know your game plan or what. What makes you a good horses like we're talking about? Riley's I think a good horses just good everywhere rat me. He's GonNa nod go if you go and he's going to see till around the end of the gate if you need to see Taylor on the end of the gate. And that's what makes it great horse and if you've got a horse it's mediocre doesn't really work that way you would need. You need opens in that. Oh if you're on a mediocre horse it doesn't score very good. You need the long score open. Before the short score open the short scope and I it's not as good for you so the IRA when you sat out that year I kinda got to experience it in watch. That was kind of think that was the first year. Like cody. Snow made the floor. And there's a few young headers and what I saw was tell you took away a few of the top headers that stayed home because of that and those guys just got confidence And they come back next from now on and they have stayed very very competitive. Do you think there's a lot to that like when you start winning it teaches you? How like you loans definitely learn how to well you said the survey one first second of the other day it will. San Antonio is going on there was about five good headers. Weren't there right and anybody that says that don't matter is dumb. I'm the one that won the rope in first and second and I'm telling you it's not that easy to do if everyone's there and that's why it's so anybody who say that the guys the IRA at the time you know. Just come off going in the lead three times in a row. Trevor was winning back then. BA gay was winning back then and I don't know who else was but for sure three. We're doing pretty good back then when you take those guys out every time. I mean that's who wins all the money during the year so yeah it does matter it it Sixteen to me doesn't even count 'cause they kicked us out. We didn't quit rescue. Got kicked out so yeah sixteens irrelevant to me. But I I'm glad I did. I liked it. It made it to where this doesn't even bother me sitting out. I mean we sat out. I did it for years ago. So little we're virus thing is just life move on rap That's what I think so funny about it though is what what happens when you give cody snow some confidence and you kind of let him put some money together and let let a guy that was essentially that has a really strong work ethic and because it's like now that he's a he's a. Mosser yeah no. He has really good. I like Snow Lot I like his style to Yeah I think he did it. Regardless shares got some. He has tried. He wants it and so there are some guys though. That probably helped along the way. I don't even know I didn't. I didn't even follow it. Seventy been no rap. Who did what. But yes no. Yeah it does help. I'm just saying not even that scenario but I'm just saying a rope in that like I said a huge open that a few guys are missing. It is matters. So what about the confidence side? You know we talked a little bit earlier. He said it feels like there's times where you not gonNA. It's it's going on the hundred hundred for money. There's been times where it's tough and you feel like you need to tweak something on your swing. Does that mess with your confidence or Oh Yeah Yeah I. I don't really know the answer to that one. I mean because I'm just your everybody's human the only thing I don't I don't really get that nervous. I heard people get nervous. I don't really ever you know it's just reopened in life. I mean when you really break it down. It's just just kind of what you do. Don't over think it but yeah confidence when you're feeling it or things. Are you know people call it being in zone? It's just pretty easy. I I don't know why things are happening slower for you. And then then maybe everyone else but when when it stuff's going fast and it's kind of a blur and you're trying to guess scorn that's just seems like when you mess up but we were just confident. You're to see everything perfectly and I don't. I don't know how to get there just fun when you do right. We try to focus on something different or in the box. Like for example. When you're in a feel like you kinda know like hey I want my swing to be here. D- Kinda keep it pretty clear to stay focused on the score and Yeah there certain times like a set of all that you just said But yeah usually get good star for me. That's kind of the key prize for everyone Researchers may be a little different there Score a little different won't leave early skull and slow. Which isn't really my style I. It's hard for me to do But yeah just yeah I mean I think about all of it a lot when we drive a lot and so I'm trying to think when I think about I think think a lot about it really probably. I don't know like I said those are good questions I mean I I said I think about all of it all the time so it's hard to say just WanNa back in there. What I'm what I'm thinking is different pry every time but scorns every time you know. Brat and One thing about you. You're confident. Probably you'd say you've always been a pretty confident person by things but do you do you kind of like is that something you try to do is like kind of talk yourself into that or how confidence comes from. I don't talk at Robins and I'm pretty witty so I like always been that way so somebody says some smart to me. I got an answer. People think that as cocky is just. This is fun for me to do me. Not Talking opens as just a straight like the other dabs like I talked to Tara Talkin Done Talkin and actually start head better dislike. I dislike to stay focused. Stay Mellow Zone. I don't WanNa talk all for the Look at talk after the opening before the open. This is not talk during it right and I need to get back to that. It's one thing I've kind of lost focus on little bit. Just kind of be too chatty at the rope and I don't really need much none of it's important anyways so just focus on rat try to. Yeah yes lock in for you know the two to five hours or however long the rope lasts and you know. I did that survey good. I need to start doing a lot more. I mean Serbia. I didn't even wash just roped and at one hundred eighteen so took ten hours of felt like to run it so I went back to my trailer. And Sal I hear the times and that's all I was listening to rat. Distract had to make sure your game plan was good and just kind of me personally. Some people like to talk Coleman. He talks nonstop but I think that's what he feels comfortable doing right. So he's talking in the box and talk and news healer. If I'm doing that I'm not paying attention. That's maybe how he pays attention so I think everyone's different. You GotTa do. What's comfortable for you know? Which Way's right or wrong. I don't think there is one. Just whatever you do best but I think confidence is gained from just getting good enough. Sure you know by says experience. You need experience this that experience for me. It's just being good enough right. What you're good enough. It doesn't experience is out the window. We're all you know you're just backed into a box no matter where you're gonNA see a start and make it run. It doesn't matter where you're at the same deal so I think it's just getting good enough speaking of experience I think this shows this was the one I was like. I couldn't believe you could even pull this off was last year the lone star shootout I think it was jade. You guys won the rope. And I'm pretty sure jade in the short round you do that. Steer that kind of loped it was just a little bit slower than everything else and you. I thought you left early And it was obvious the barrier to me and most headers I I break the barrier on him and I don't know exactly how you do it but you. Kinda pull your horse to the pin just a little bit more. Coast him to the Pan. Yeah blow it out spin him when the rope. Oh Yeah what how? Well I think that's just some of it's the horse like I've had a few that you could do that on had some you couldn't do that on The the the bay do that. I used to ride all time. He was in his prime. He you know. Do It as good anymore. But you could leave early in slow down and then go again and catch up and the SAR like Kinda like that. Now you can leave early and he slowed down some horses. I got you leave early on. It's over there blah. Just run right through it that when you kinda gas like you said. Maybe they're all running pretty good in that one didn't so I just read it wrong and then yeah just kind of went to the pen and just pulled. I thought it was gonNA break the Burger too so but you just try to me. It's more of the horse than anything but you are. I asked you what move was the other day. I don't even know where we're at. We're just kind of sitting there and Like man I don't know I think it's about this but I'll know when I get in there. Yeah is that. What do you mean by that? Well I I can't tell the start till I get in the box and feel like Oh Hayes closer than I thought he was going to be. Which means I gotTA see longer. I know some of the places. I've been a lot but say like steel kind of when you back in their esteem. Ville feels like the steers. Pretty close to you. They changed the the length of the box. Shoot sometimes a lot of times like boxes kind of narrow. Steer feels like he's pretty close to me. That feels like I'm going to have to see a little more than I planned on. Just watching it versus sometimes the other day I was wild wooded or open the boxes count longer and it just felt like I was going to happen faster than I thought like. I just kind of get a feel for my last decisions when I back in there like okay now now where I think. That's so cool just to see because I I totally agree with you is the deeper. The boxer like okay happens. It just seems like it happens faster. Yeah but Stimulus the same way for me when I got in the corner man. It's you ain't GonNa work unless steer runs you know you gotta it's just dead you kinda gotta see it before you go all right so if you could give any advice to two young headers or young guys wanting to get to really high level other than enjoy it but try to set themselves up to be to practice and get ready to go. What would that be? I think just working at it. And then you gotTa love it. If you don't love it there's no way kind of goes hand in hand love it and just you got to if you don't WanNa work at it. I don't think you'll be great. I mean you can be good. Tell people it's easy to get really good. It's hard to be great because you can't see the greatness like the good part you kinda see advancement like when you're fourteen year old kid rope you can just see you know. I can do see my kids getting better. You know once you reach a certain point you can't hardly see it just Just baby steps after that. And that's the hard part you gotTa push through that while I'm good. That was easy. You think it's going to be easy to get great and it's almost like the greatness comes so slow at feels like that. It's just hard to target keep working at stuff when you think that you should because you don't really have to work on stuff really a ton take it to a certain point and then. I feel like once you get to a certain point and you start to go against the best guys. That's when you got to really work at it to me. Well because everything matters every tenth matters every two tenths matters and that was like we'll like for example. I hadn't really been to. I've been the same number Roper for whatever years while my kid based guy started taking him open last March lot so in our world me and you we got an open reopen and you come back tenth. It's over. Yeah you are going for the short go where they don't push pay short go. You could go home because you're not winning. Anything was hard for me to tell him. How Your Comeback Tenth? You're able to win I now. The Russians are tougher than you think. You can make up some time or they'll get legs. You'RE NOT GONNA get Jay Junior Jake Long. The I recall Bax to all rope lakes. They're not they're not giving any money away. No and so. That's what's harder to you. Know figure out like so. What about when you're growing up the steps are like so tense? Don't matter as much it my kids level emmy and use level two tenths over four rounds. Eight tenths if if you back in there and you're eight tenths behind you know Clay Smith in the short go. You better have the trotter. And he'd better have the runner or else. You're not beat. He's going to have to mess up for you to beat him right in. That's where that's why at the top level so tough just because every single thing matters and that just comes from grinded on it every single inner lot. I really do. I think the reason I think jackpots have gotten so tough because I say there's too many but that's why they've got tough. There's so many people got good at it before people weren't used to doing it in roped at a certain way and it was almost like well. We're at the Jackpot. Now we'll just back off and go catch and that's just kinda how everybody roped well now. Everybody's done it so much that everybody's good at it and it's just sped everything up in my opinion. Well I think like Wesley. Thorpe's a great example. He paid for most of his youth growing up by Jackpot in Paid for his college heading at those slide. Romans when he's a nine or ten and I mean he can't have jackpot without him because he learned how to win at. He's a winner that guy I mean he's unreal. But that's what's so crazy is they. They have a team or fifty man deal and he'll head healing and he knows what it takes to wear and he's entered so many of those that now when you put them in a situation it's like I mean that year that him Zach went like the BFI. Those wins like that they were. It was just kind of crazy to see how gaming they really were put together and then as soon as that happened they he hadn't let up. Yeah that way though I I mean most of the great healers were. That's one thing differs between healing. Aheadon hadn't it can come later right. I'd only Keelan does much sure. It does for few guys but not very many young. I mean Caleb Anderson. I think is starting to heal. Yeah pretty phenomenal. And he's he is healing in. He might always feel like that was just now seeing. I'm just now seeing him but even hyun really good now. He's thirty years old. You know. Yeah yeah that's that's almost odd for healing Heddon. That can kind of happen like you don't have the right. Horror Story. Just takes a little while to click. I'm just saying this over time. I mean Klay Cooper was Alpbach when the world when he was twenty one. Nine thousand nine hundred you know. Everybody makes a big if you win at young. Now you're like now everybody did. My brother made the. Nf Army's twentieth first time out. Never left Montana RAC rally minor made. I mean everybody makes it like Jd. He you know shoot. Jade was the best healer in the world. News for twenty two years old. So yeah you know. There's without a doubt even if you want it or not. People knew junior was good so he len's different he'll and to me. This is all stuff I would say to my kids. Hey halen better have it fast. I think so. There's there's not as much to the learning healing is there's no score in your rely on your header and basically wrote to feed is men's you get from the time you start till you now. I'm not taking anything away from the guys. Because the way they do it nowadays is unbelievable. I agree but you don't have to learn what we just talked about the score. Is this a dead star here in ain't even about roping the Horns Stephenville? It's about known. Hey stimul- you need. You need to see a little more. You need to learn this box along. Hey you need to. You need to learn how to score healing. You don't score your horse head. You're like hey you gotta learn how there's a little bit more variable that goes into it. You learn how to handle them. Set Him up for certain guys making sure you can finish good like there's all that little stuff that to me. It's hard for a kid. You know some kids get it right away but some it just takes a little bit slower. Yeah process doing it. Well and I I agree. It's like a like a loop brown or someone like that he He didn't really make it till what was he. Thirty thirty one something like that. And he's probably later than that. Yeah I mean he might a an early thirty he wrote. Us been around forever. Yes I'm saying hadn't hadn't can come for you to heal and has for a few guys to it just doesn't it seems like some of the good healers are good right away. I mean Steve. North cows the far he was on teen or nineteen years old. I mean so and was good. You know sure and so. I don't know just different that way when you say work at it. What do you mean like? Take me through a typical worklessness. Say We got good weather and your your practicing and or one of the better headers going through a typical practice week. What's that like for you for me? Yep well for me. I'm GonNa just rope every day. Take Sunday's off if you know for busy you know. Try TO TAKE. Sunday's off but yeah just I got four. Three two four PRAC- sources couple good ones. I don't ride the good ones everyday rope on them. I usually exercise them But the practice sources I got one. That's really good. That's almost like a real horse that I did Jackpot on the east good practice. I got one reach on every time one that just okay. I don't care how many are run on just kind of try to go. Through every scenario I can read Just TO BE READY FOR ANYTHING. Almost every practice session so three or four practice horses would. That's gotTa be twenty five to forty. I RUN PROBABLY THIRTY TO FIFTY DAY. Thirty to fifty. I don't run less than thirty. Don't run less than thirty and you try to make every steer lack of either what you're working if you WANNA work on your region or if you're wanting to work on a set up that you're going to you kind of you try to put yourself in that situation Yeah I. I felt like I used to do that more than now. Because it felt like I feel like we Kinda wrote the same style no matter where we're at now right and it didn't used to be that way and so it seemed like before more like say getting ready for the BEF. I was like. Let them way out. You know run close snapping on him and nowadays fills like even with the. Bfi might need to be decently aggressive on. It wasn't that way before I mean they didn't have to make good runs just different style and now it feels like we wrote more of the same way all the time so I probably practice less scenarios now than I used to but yeah yeah I'd let some. Outta go out some just kind of do just do a mic. So whatever I need to do it better than even do it. do different prior to go faster more honestly just hard on your steers and all that but yeah. It gets a little expensive. Oh practices expensive. Yep It really. As deers pay to solve it goes into practice. Sources and all that stuff now. My kids are up now too. So we're out there quite a bit every day. Yeah every day except Sundays Sundays. Yeah don't try wrote Sunday especially if we've been rolling quite a bit. I don't gotta note go nowhere but yeah do it a lot. I think that's pretty impressive to hear especially and I. I think that's why you you've been able to be competitive for so. Yeah but I think Chad does it. To Luke does it too. I think I think what a squeeze chatrooms all the mouths he can't stop Lou groups so nowadays Snow Rosa. I might have been one of the first ones that come along that roped everyday quite a bit. I mean I'm sure there's guys ahead of me. Alpbach groped a lot always. So I don't know if headers is hard headed because it's expensive. You've got to have the horses to do it. You can't do it on your goodstuff. Will you gotTa have to to me? I think you can't just ride an average head horse like a kind of plug. No practice. Sources ain't plugs. I call them practice. Or because that's what I make my runs on now. That'd be good. That'd be good. I mean though my best practice Horse Dan Green wrote the BFI and he was just younger. Anyone fourth on him so and he just got word. I pry wrote him too much just what he is for me. You know my kids need. Everybody can ride him so we just keep him around but any needs road because he pulls back in CINCI everyday so he everytime you Salam up. You're like okay I get it now. I know why all right so diving into the mental game a little bit. Was there a time where you or something that really helps? You get mentally tough to kind of handle the ups and downs or was there a big influence in your life that way. I was raised right. I mean I have not always acted right but I think I was raised right. Sure and a the only thing I do is I get to mad but I don't the thing that I do that people don't know because they don't know me very well if I get behind closed I I've been around some people that don't talk for days share. I'm never like that. I'm going to get mad. Get OVER IT. Move on you. Let it out pretty quickly if you're not. Yeah and it's over. Yeah but some people. I think it's I'd rather than just not talk for a week. Some Sola or get mad or because deep down I really no. I'd love open tried as hard as I possibly could do. I wish I'd have done better than I did. Yeah I think that's probably everyone but at least I know a tried and I give it my all thought you know and then it's just it's just rope and it's not life you know there's bigger things than roping out there and I I understand that but you still gotta try harder. That's what you do but so I I try not to get too down on it as far as like like I don't enjoy the winds. I've never celebrated a win. I don't think hardly ever in my life like I. Just you know. WanNA BE SO TIRED. I just went to bed. It's like just exhausted. My head hurts so bad. I couldn't even you know if you're in the if you're in the heat of the BEF I e even like if you're you know like some women first and second at the survey it started. I started the program at nine or whenever they start it and the rope gets over it just before dark and you gotta pay attention for that long. That's your grinding all day boots off your horse twelve times because it's Kinda hot out. Drink a few folks along the way case you make sure you're you know wired a little bit and just by the end of the day you're like man. I'm done and that's but yeah but I mean these are good questions. I think everybody's different. It's just kind of how some of the stuff that I've read that I've done over the years like I said the kids enjoyed. I want mine to enjoy it. But I'm hard onto like A. They got one thing I can't do is I grew up my dad. I never got to screw off practicing really know my dad. No way not happening and I think I just was always because I was told when I when I was eighteen years old. My Dad knew Allenbach so I went and stayed with him and this one guy I never forget. He's like are. You always a serious like we'll practice on yeah. I didn't even know any other way to be like. That's just how up doing it like my dad would be one of those guys like heading. Sas split the horns twice. He would be like I am second. You splitting the horns. Miss some other way for me please. Or just put it on the shoot. He cannot not stand me splitting horns two times in a row. Just just do something miss some other way. And he's mad when he's telling me this but that's just how I kinda grew up so I always just bear down practicing. I don't think I've ever had practice sessions rise off now not talking not working at reaching on them. But I don't think I've ever just roped where I was just out there just going going through the motions or just playing around like I don't think ever. I don't know if I've ever had one practice session like that. Wow in my whole entire which I don't even know if that's good now I think about it but I mean not one of my son. I'm low that with my kids. It's like you guys can reach you. Guys can throw faster wherever you want but no just screwing all well. I can really relate to that 'cause heading there's Times I get so mad in the practice practice but I get so mad. I used to get mad. I don't anymore proximate well and used to know. I'll get frustrated like you're working at it. Oh yeah but I love healing so much because I have one hill horse. I don't very much healing so every time I go. He'll you can enjoy it like I might drink a beer and go. Yeah but heading. I'm usually pretty pretty intense now. There's been times I'd definitely have messed around but yeah I think everybody is probably a little that way ice. He'll much anymore. Seems like just let my kids do it but yeah I think just you don't care as much eland your life or vice versa. If you're a healer and you WANNA head right. Aerobic Jake long so he. He likes to that guy a rope man. He'll he'll he can wear me out but then studio heads some T. loves to head so yeah. He's just something fun to do well and I think that's just the difference is like I I WANNA head competitively. Yeah and when I'm in the practice pin. I'm getting better. Some healing I can go for ten is still I mean. I got that homeschool confidence. I think the greatest he'll ever. I have no intentions of going to Jackpot. Really need to make some t shirts that say we'll we'll get that one x factor to we'll give you the trademark to it. It's true though. Oh I home school you know I use it all the time now because I am. I was home schooled in it. It's it's not even a shot. My kids are home school too and I I actually think nowadays. I don't even think it's that bad to deal home. School will know but this is what happened to me. This is I could really relate is. I think I'm the best basketball player ever. I think I'm the Best Ping Pong. I think I could make the NFL healing. If I wanted to I could probably play in the League play basketball if I wanted well as long as you. Because your mom's telling you yeah and if we got me out there on the court right now I am not. I'm not going to do any it's GonNa be. I like it's a good saying it's true. It is true but I what happened to me. I'll use ping pong. For example I thought I was the greatest Ping Pong player. And what happened was I sucked And I learned how to play around a few people read their close and I got a kick their ASS I. They beat me up so bad and I've made sure what soon as I got good. I dominated them and let them know it and it ruined the game of ping-pong. Yeah but then what happened? Was I'd start playing other guys and I could beat most of them and the Frick and Cody Pearson. I played that guy unbelievable. He he beat me so bad. And then what I. I'm I'm really competitive. So started laying off on me and I'm like dude. I don't want that. Oh he backed up. Yeah I said here's a deal I won't. That's that's almost the biggest backhand so pass when he did it and I told him I'm like all right was. How many points do you need to spot me to twenty one so you gotta play your heart as he said ten and I and I think we played for money and he beat me like twenty one? I got him. I got two or three points on it and I was done I quit playing ping pong after that and a lot of that was because I didn't want to like I mean I went. I went up to the house and I watch videos on Youtube and stuff and like really worked on my my overhead. I realized how would it would take to get racket. Beat him and I decided it's not worth it. Storm is gonNA take too much. Yeah so I quit Ping Pong. But that's I think that goes back to that home school. I didn't realize I never put any work ethic behind a few of those things because I didn't think that's what it took to get great. Yeah and I think that that probably happened with my head and a little bit too as I was in Idaho and I could probably out head most of the area and I didn't really develop that but I think that's where like that home. School confidence is really good. Because I'm a very confident person but at the same time when you get punched in the mouth. I it's it's it's really easy for me to get down and think. I'm the worst because when you go to a public school I got in. You're playing basketball. Not only do you go. Get your kids in your school You'll get out and you'll go against you go to three on three tournament and you're like the suits from snow town. I've heard of them. Wow and he's Duncan on me. Look it's you get beat up. Yeah Yeah you just kinda learn. But I I'm with you on that stuff that Ping Pong Ping Pong. It's hard to get good at. You're going to have somebody that you gotTa have some good plate. You can't get good by yourself. I think the R- opens the same way. Though I think you gotTa have. You had your brother you gotta be. I think we made each other better for sure. Yes because when you're growing up everybody everybody lives in Texas now and I know I know not everybody but a lot of people do just everybody used to live in Arizona. It was a team open spot or California. It's Kinda moved a few different times but now it's Texas say everybody that most people ain't even from Texas that live here. They're from somewhere else now. They live in Texas. Because it is really the best spot if you wrote a live as far as Rodeos are close and he gets to spend most time home but so you are in your area. You're always the best. That's what got you out of their here right and so I do think me and my brother. You know kids growing up. Who are the best kids? Once we got a little bit older of the two best headers first age is. Is that something you'll do now like if you're wanting to will you get go ahead with someone now or would you a few years ago? I feel like you know yourself so well. It's kind of no man. I'm always constantly working on something that's one thing about me and not. I don't know that's good or bad but yeah I'm always trying to get better because I think you know forty now. I think once you try to not get better. I think it's over right. I think no matter what age I mean. Imagine Jake Barnes. If he's out there still trying to figure something out it just seems like that's the kind of guy is. I don't know if I'm right or wrong. But he kind of seems that way. Yeah Because he still doesn't really inter- no more but so in those are two of the legendary headers of all time but it just seems like soon as you quit trying or trying to tweak something that you just get past you know pass by. Was there an athlete or that? You really looked up to the Kinda help you with this this kind of not really but I love sports so I was Kobe guy no really orne Guy Jordan. Kobe Koby. Not that I don't. Rip Or whatever but not. They didn't like Kobe's game. 'cause I've watched Kobe plant person a lot randomly. I don't know why just And when he looked down on TV WATCH HIM PLAY IN PERSON. He looked like the best player in the four. That's why the TV lives. Tease sometimes about basketball. Nba Like you watch on TV and one guy looked good and then you go there in person you're like. Oh this guy's good or whatever Naza Jordan guy and that made me not a Kobe because I think Kobe just Jordan to so much almost annoyed me share the you know the had the you know the knee brace around the calf. Yeah every spent if you look at the early Kobe stuff he he copy Jordan his mannerisms everything to a T. He tried to just copy Jordan so I bugged me because my generation Jordan was it. I'm still that's that's my favorite player. Yeah well and well see. I'm old enough. They have leaked pass when I was growing up right but they had wgn all that's the Chicago Challenge. The showed all their games. Sure so back in the nineties you know the ninety six or whatever you could watch every single element high school and you can watch every single bulls game so you. Kinda got not only you got to watch him when seventy games or whatever they ever went in it was just like the warriors but I actually think even more famous than the word because they were a likeable team because they weren't put together they're like the warriors were when they started before they got durant like they were all the two guys were there Jordan and Pippen Yup and then they didn't add you know they didn't add a Barkley they added a Rodman so it makes them where they were likable. Yeah so Jordan Competitive. Yeah Razi competitive is what I mean the stories. I've read and stuff like that like this dude. Is that where you got some inspiration or just like I don't know about but because I was always naturally competitive to you. I think that is I mean. I was told story. My Dad they. When the we's I come out bowling or something and I was in Iran. He told me this story bowling or visa. He's he's he's serious. He's telling me that because I live up there nothing and for Christmas. And everybody's beating him the kind of making fun of him laugh and let them know he said. He said he stayed up all night. Figure it out. Well my dad at this time has to be in his late. Fifties mid fifty stayed up all night so they weren't going to run through again and so maybe it's just you know I I agree. I think there's somethin'. There's characteristics that people have that that's who they are. I truly believe that. And then there's habits that you can tell you in a plot. I don't say one way or the other. That's just my or what I did it right and I see it now with kids like I didn't I keep bringing him my kids but my dad was that way well. My kids are rope everyday. They think it's normal to rope every single day. Yeah they never. Because that's all they see me do they never say. I don't WanNa do it today. Not once either one of them. They both sat love. They'll settle or if I'm in town. Say Hey sell up everywhere they got. They don't question anyway they just they actually think it's part of that sweaters. Do that's the habit that everyday life we get up. We do this their home school so they do school. You know how many hours a day and then and they'll get your opened me or whatever but they see me do it. So it's not even a shock for him to go out there like if I wouldn't have thought it was normal to rope every single day. They'd just what they see and do it so I was probably around my dad and he was probably more competitive named thought. I just picked up on it like I said I was a little bit like that when I was young. Because my wife's question me she's like what. When did you get this way? Like kind of be half mad at me. When when did you become so? Yeah and I was like five. I mean say I mean since I can remember so I don't know any different so in my little ones to kind of see it in another kid you got. You're like man I duNNo. Do you wish you to understood more about yourself at a younger age in your career. Yeah I think that's everyone. That's the problem with life as you get smart and then the skills go away. Sure every sport. It's like Sports I. It doesn't go away and business but in sports that goes away when your brain catches a abilities gone or a little bit like golf open so we can go longer but like if you're in basketball when you finally understand the game then your body shot and you can't do it i. That's the tricky part with life. I it's sports anyways. Sports life the tricky part. I agree I think it's it's kind of odd to me. Because there's there's a few few of you guys like that really jumped out that I think you jaker pretty similar so far as I think you guys are really really competitive and her. We actually when I start with just like doing a few interviews and someone asked him Anything you would like to say to the younger generation of headers and he was like. Yeah if you're twenty years old and I'm still beating you. You should be embarrassed. Young guys give me crap my like when they talk crap to me. I really do. But that's what I tell them to like. Hey when are you going to quit and I was like when you gonNa beat me and so there's a little bit. Tricky woman said that to you one time they were giving crap because he's when I first started. I didn't I knew all those guys and my dad wrote against those guys. I actually didn't really give them crowded like the younger guys that would I mean I tried to get along. You know there'd be arguments or whatever disagreements but yeah they'd tell T- way when you quit old man he's like well it was viewed ever start beating me. I would but that ain't happening keep going so Yeah Jake. Jake is a competitive guy. I mean He. You know what's crazy about guys like when when I first started. We're talking rope. And whatever the goal card like the guys in the gold car their careers has been done forever. They couldn't wrote Jake. Barnes can throw is good ahead loop as anybody in the world still. He's gotta be sixty at least sixty years old. I mean what what are sixty three four years old or whatever still that. That did not happen when I first started. These guys Klay Cooper I mean still make the. Nf are there easily. It looks like he's gotTa be down there. Six years old. I watched Jake and clay there at the survey the other day and it's amazing. How well they they they? They could win if they have the right series. Yes any of us in there. They're not a team. That's entered that like all the good. It's fun to watch. They legitimately could win the rope in. And that's that's amazing is amazing. I had to be that competitive scares me about myself because I'm like I don't know if I want to do it right. I'm weirdly like I don't know if what's I quit rope and keep broken sure. 'cause it's like well. I've always just did it see good. I could get and it'd be hard for me to just go out there. Hey Will you run ten? I I just don't let's go have fun practicing kind of always been all in or not like. I don't know what it'd be like for me right all right. We'll get the PODCASTS wrapped up. I do get one question. We brought up Walt woodard and and I know that I when you guys first started reopen that I think it maybe the maybe didn't even make the finals. But it was like he was roping with Travis and Walt decided he was going to be done. Rodion that summer. I think this is how it went. That does ours. Roman with all European I wrote with Wall and Oh seven and OA. When did you guys start in the springtime of? Oh seven in the springtime. So I I heard when you guys had I started that you'd turn him a few at the Rodeos and he kinda he. Mac like might have missed the first one. Is this correct story. I don't know I haven't heard the story so I probably won't remember it even if it's true or not but I don't I don't know I just kind of curious and that's could be completely false. I I had heard it from someone. I don't even remember but it was like the first few radios like I. Three U turn back to win it when something he misses. Second one same type of deal might have missed three in a row for you at the first three Rodeos and after each run what will talk to you like. Hey you say don't worry about. It was probably bad handle and then after the third or fourth one it was like. Hey you're a world class healer. We need to figure it out. I don't know if I talk like that because I don't I don't know if that's true or not but I can't even remember how we did that so I wouldn't even know if that was true So he won the world. Though that you're the first year we wrote t rat no seven and this this could be completely false but what I what. I'm kind of would like to last kind of topic. I WANNA get on is communicating to your partners. Win Your as competitive as you are. Oh I'd honestly if you'd interview those guys they. They're shocked when they with me. I don't I don't say anything ever Tom. Really no no nothing I. I know that Jake told me that the other day he's like. Hey you are the most accountable. Yes I will say that like you own up to everything. Yeah I will not. That's what people that don't know me start wrote. Let me think I'm one way. And they like psych man. I thought you would be completely different than what I thought. I'm completely different than what he thought. Yeah I don't I have a theory if I have to coach on your healing. I'm not with you right because if you don't got it it ain't no good if you if you don't need to coach either. I got it right and we can. We can talk about for having but I already know like see. That's the thing once you've rope long enough. If I give you a bad go. I had a front row seat of it yet. I'm like it wasn't that good because he sometimes the video lies. You can watch a video back and be like. Oh you look feelable and in real life. You're like he wasn't catching that one. Sure when you got your you know fifteen feet away and stuff's happening faster like it wasn't happening and then watch me. I wasn't that bad hill. And you're like now. He was so I already know. And that's what I tell you know I don't really break runs down me and jade. We never even talked about runs. Really nothing we wrote for five years and we never had a game plan. Hardly going into one steer really. I mean there'd be a random time where I'd be like man the steers nowadays. You don't really want them haze that much laugh. Because you're too slow. Yeah Kinda straights good. It's better than you know. Right sometimes. Ain't no good but sometimes rights better than straight left. Let's straight lefts. To me is the worst unless you got arena everywhere. But it ain't the usually you're too slow. So there'd be the random occasion where the steers were just running and if haze them a little bit seemed like their way. Better we would. I'd say hey man maybe today I don't know they for some reason they're running off to the right. They're running harder way harder if they get as little but they're slow but even with Jake. I haven't really broke it down or even when I wrote to travel. I just didn't really do it. A whole lot. Never say anything about their England and so that because I think that's really important understand is when you're done like even if you guys are and you mess up you tell your partner that was on me and. Oh yeah like I'll tell them I. Yeah I never get onto something weird about me and I don't know why I'm like this. I when I'm thinking at a rope and a founding good I feel like they will never mess up like I never think in my mind. I'm like hey if I get through someone win I for some reason I never think healers ever GonNa mess up. I've always been that way. I don't know why I think about like Shirley they mess up all the time when I'm as small timing you like but some way I just in my head. I always think I do my job. Good they're catching Rhett. And I discount. I don't I don't know I don't I don't break down a lot. I hate talking team roping all day long. I don't mind doing it like this but this is so much fun. Well yeah but I mean you over over target and have this game plan and then the steered India what she thought. And just messed you up and it's just. I'm almost better if I mean I want to know if the stir Lopes and that's about it everything else I can if he's really slow sometimes it's good to know and that way. I think it's like you've got your practice. You've you know what your job is. Yeah you know the steer does or not and then you go to your jobs. Yeah and then you go to the next one well. How how much fun is it if you have a healer coaching on your? I've had some Komi and is the most miserable experience in my life rack and I didn't need it and it didn't make me better and probably honestly I probably coaching on them. Sure and I just never have done it. I don't know I'm we're talking way back in so no one really wants once you reach a certain level? There's no you know. Hey I know if I went to Fausto to slow you know I kind of know and I'll tell you hey on me and then If you see your guy struggling ever and he wants to talk about it. Is there a certain way you try to communicate? Yeah but I honestly these guys don't struggle at my overall you know Jay. Don't seem like you ever struggled right and Jake longs rope good for me. I haven't roped as good. Not Good enough for him. I feel like in Rhode Island's nowadays. It's all about one st at the end. It's not about leading up to it's about so it's a little bit different in the wintertime. It's all big money on one steer so as Dave sometimes not like that but the wintertime is but yeah I don't feel like I've roped as good as Avenida wrote. I'm always just focused on me. Really it's Kinda crazy your job yes. I it's hard enough. You know. Just stay in sharp yourself and you know not no need to worry about what they're doing. Two things people are worried about. Their healers are headers. Are just excuse guys just blaming just a blame game you know what I mean. I mean how many guys are told you they turn one for first and they're either missed. Well everyone and then you're like if you're the guy that's really himself and watch slack. You're like that guy that just said that's never turned one. I you know what I mean. I'm not saying it doesn't happen but well and then there's the Hilo that the only thing that bothers me jade never did. I know Jake Long hasn't done it is i. Don't like the healers. I feel bad because I don't know if I've ever had a guy do it. But you see the healers broke a leg and won't dally on purpose and then get it. Allie and then basically. We're going to be too slow which. I haven't had a Guy. 'cause there's a header. I think it's good to know. Hey where am I at two on that leg Dalyell Lake every once in a while he will step in at the last second weller. You know what I mean but the other thing is you know you can start measuring like. Hey I'm because there'll be times. We are two hundred team Rodeo. That you don't feel like you turn one for a lot of money and that's what you're like. Okay this is but you know you could probably press a little bit harder and take more risk so if you're right in in your dial in and turn them at that time it helps a lot. I think it does me good leg or not. Just you know it's hard to tell what you would have been sure I never thought about like. Uh Oh that's a good point I just watched I. I haven't really had that happen to me but I probably have. Had It happen to me but not on purpose probably and I see some guys do it all right. Well I think what I love and I think really important take away from. This is how much you own up to it. And that's something I've I've I've I've kind of got to know you more. I've really tried to to make sure that people know and I. I really try to pride myself for that with my openness. I make no excuses with my rope and I think that's because of a lot of guys that like like yourself that I walked it as soon as you stop making excuses like sponge for I will. How many did you spend for you if you didn't get where you WANNA go? Yeah it's because you didn't turn enough for yeah and if I have that mindset. I that you're a lot better off like For example I was reopened with Pearson a few years ago and I think that kid hills and someone was gonna rope within that next year and they called me and asked me about his rope and I said Man I think the only reason. He didn't make the finals. Last year was added rope. Good enough said and and I think that if you can have those like that mindset but not break yourself down yeah. I think that's where it's it gets. You know I don't. I don't think it needs to be like destructive criticism of yourself but if it's just kind of an honest assessment of what's going on. Yup then I think you're fine. I mean if you're just telling yourself the truth like Hey. I need to do this better. It's not you're not really knocking yourself. Your dislike we need to do better and you put it on yourself. Not on outside outside. Because I always here we'll have that steers to your took me out. What about the guy that had him? That didn't take him out. Yeah so I mean. There are very few steers uncatchable. There's some we don't want them we don't want and I think that's where you find greatness in guys like I think that's what greatness shows through is the ones those healers that catch that steer. That was really hard to Helix. Juniors healed a couple years at the NFL. Or that. I thought were very hard to heal and I think that's what's making him a great healer. Yeah but it's the difference on those one or two little steers. It they get by. They probably don't win anything on but if they get by them. It's like wow you know. Then that makes a big difference. They might though to cheer sometimes the right spots. Well that's what I mean like. He might not want anything at that round at the NFL. It might make carried over over the next one as far as what you want. In the average every yeah it's huge or the or the or even like the steered lone star shootout for your last year. You know the the the misread at the barrier. Because you know your horse well enough and how to score on forty thousand forty thousand dollars trailer and it was within inches or less inch good. String yeah good strength. All right clay. Well I've had you here for quite some time. I really appreciate it. Yeah thanks for having me man. Thank you very much appreciate it.

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The Ipcress File Part 1

Cracking the Code of Spy Movies!

32:28 min | 3 months ago

The Ipcress File Part 1

"Let's crack the code of the Chris file a classic spy film. It is on the British Film Institute's bfi One hundred list of one hundred of the Best British films of the Twentieth Century Coming in at number fifty nine. Let's go. Hi. This is Tom Casado in dance vestry of spy movie navigator, DOT COM join US seats episode as we're cracking the code spy movies, subscribe to our show, tell your friends about us and give us a great rating and your favorite podcast. APP. Thanks. The file is such an important entry into the spy movie genre that we're going to do this podcast in two parts. All right. We're going to focus on a few areas of the movie that hopefully will enhance your viewing the next time you take a look at the hip Chris File Yuccas file came out in nineteen, sixty five, and really there are a lot of bond connections here with the irs file as we know, Harry, Saltzman was the producer who. Was a CO producer of some of the bond films early on with Cubby Broccoli Peter. Hunt is the editor, Ken Adam who's the production Peter Hunt he actually directed on Her Majesty's Secret Service and did editing on the first few bond movies can't Adam Production Designer and Norman Want Stall Oh? Yeah. No He actually won an academy award the year before for the work he did on Goldfinger and in this movie the brainwashing that goofy sounded here is scary so. That's actually something he created. So it's Kinda cool that he was involved in this as well, and there are a bunch of other people from the crew I. Don't think we need to go into the list of the mall, but there were probably five or six others that were involved in this movie that we're also involved in bond movies. Yeah. So there's some connections there with the bond stuff Harry Palmer, the key spy here anything like on. A little maybe but not not much. All right. So we got bike designed him to be the Anti Bond. Yeah. kind of I don't know if he's really an anti, but he's definitely an anti glitz Kinda guy that's for sure and Michael Caines Harry Palmer Major Dahlby played by Nigel Green. Terrific. He was he was really good guy doleman plays Ross he's Colonel Ross made basically Harry Palmer's Boston. The beginning and of course, Guy Doleman will remember was count in thunderball which was the podcast we just did. Yeah and there's a bunch other great people in this movie Audrey Richards playing Radcliffe and frank GATT lift was terrific I think as Lou grant be and a number of others Gordon Jackson as Jock Carswell. Terrific. All right Oh he's everything he does you know Dan I just wanted to. Say this upfront about a scene where Harry Palmer's making some coffee in the title sequence. Yeah. On the director's commentary, which we'll talk about later Sidney J fury, the Director and Peter Hunt the editor they talk about that before this movie came out product placement wasn't really a thing. You didn't see that a lot of movies where there was product placement. I mean they had a perfect opportunity in. This movie with the supermarket seen to do, and they really didn't use didn't really know outplacement theory that during the title sequence Charlie Casher who was an executive producer for this film he wants their coffee scene where Harry was using that coffee press make the coffee, the meticulous part. Yeah and then he pours the coffee out of it. He wanted there because casher actually had an investment in that company. With a coffeemaker. Is Really one of the first examples of product placement where the executive producer was making money off of that thing selling. Okay. So they put it in the movie. The there are many things written about product placement in James Bond, Louise even even the early ones time for example, in Dr, no one articles says, bond opted for red stripe beer bread siber-. Was all over the place in Dr Not all the cases of it when he's fighting and Pan Am an American Airlines, which is no longer in doesn't they became pretty much along started a long stint with the bond films. Alway. Really through license to kill in one, thousand, nine, hundred, nine, from one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, two. So they were in there, and of course, smirnoff vodka made an appearance. So there are some product placements even early on, but anyway, it's an interesting story with coffee. Well speaking of Coffee Tom. You know I, just love coffee right? You love your coffee. Yeah and. oftentimes, I'm drinking some while we're recording our podcast. So I ran across this special coffee called Spike coffees effect. Yeah, really. So I was intrigued and I ordered some so I use a curry coffee machine with you. So you need the K. Cups, we the K pods, and they have a blend called double agent, medium roast. They have a whole bean and they've got ground coffees to like spy master dark rose agent blend light rose, and so on. So I have to say it was delicious it was light and smooth and had really nice aroma so I finished my first box which by the way he comes with twelve hundred bucks unlike a lot of the curry big pods that come with ten box. Oh. Yeah. Yeah. You get ten bucks like ninety six or something crazy like that. Yeah. Usually ten sometimes well, anyway spy coffees couric box comes with twelve and wow spike coffee's. Great sponsor for podcast show so I contacted the owner and he said sure. So now you could order some up and I'm drinking some right now as a matter of fact, he's got a great logo great coffee and is terrific. So you can order up now and tell them spy movie navigator Dot Com, sent you but wait sh tell him the secret code spy nerve. P. Y. N. A. V.. Movie Navigator Spine Have Pie Nath and you will get a twenty percent discount shit that keep us. So there you go. So then where can somebody go get some of this eight go to spy coffees dot com, and remember. The secret. Now. Yeah. Oh product placement. The great stuff spike coffees is for real. All right. Let's get back to the movie. So Harry Palmer is a little like Bot. He's he gets things done in unconventional ways and he's described by Colonel Ross, his boss as insubordinate insulin, a trickster perhaps with criminal tendencies. Now this is okay. There you go and years a womanizer like bond. You could see him throughout the film checking out women, Lake I think he's more of a womanizer than bond. Yeah, and there's a few lines in the movie where he's eat says I love birds He's women so well, that was the. Time, they were trying to be hip than at that time and. Unfortunately how they referred to women back then So Harry Palmer is is not this kind of guy which is loyalty to King Queen and country and so on but there's a little background on Harry power that's kind of different. Yeah. Well, what one of the things is were bond was they recruited and they said they like to recruit. Orphans. For 'em, I six in the bond series. For here, that's not what they went for. They went for more grady and hairy was in the military began trouble. And they told them either you can be a spy. Or, you can go to prison. Yeah now we don't know what the trouble is in the movie. Yeah. They never they never say it in this movie I didn't read the book by Len Deighton. Monday wrote it. But. In this movie, Harry's really a reluctant spot. Yeah. Yeah. Right. He he didn't. He didn't WanNa do this just go to prisoner do this. Yeah. And I read a really interesting book by Wesley Britton He's got a book called beyond bond talks about how spies in TV and film are portrayed in the different characters and he talks about Harry. Palmer's role here as a reluctant spy in how that really gave credence to the TV show it takes a thief. Okay. The movie La Femme Nikita? Where you had people who were coerced into becoming spies. I'd add this wasn't in the book, but I'd add that Nyah in mission impossible to she was a thief they pretty much just made her do the spy stuff for them. Again she was more of a reluctant spy. Signing up to become part of. Point mission impossible because the file actually came out in nineteen sixty, five a year before the mission impossible TV series so. Anyway we got code names in here to Sparrow in house Martin on. So you have a different kind of a movie though hear them we've seen with bad even we got Harry Saltzman who's producing this movie so you would take to do some bond kind of things here. It's a it's a tough movie to follow number one we followed it closely. I took notes on this movie be through many viewings and it's about it took a few because it's confusing I. Yeah. It's about British agents on the trail of someone or something that is causing a brain drain on their top scientists, and in the past two years too many government scientists have left their jobs at. The peak of their careers and they ceased to function as scientists, which is the weird part here one, hundred and twenty six of them left in the last two years one, hundred, seven, they say had good reasons to better facilities, better pay and so on. But three defected to the other side the other seventeen with this Guy Radcliffe who now has disappeared in the beginning of the movie from the train none of them had good reasons to leave. So now they're they're curious as to what the heck is going on and Radcliffe did not quit. As he says, he was lifted means he was kidnapped. So the key thing here is the words they ceased to function. Something is interfering with their normal brain operations as a scientists otherwise they're normal. That the scientific ability of there's seems to be drained for some reason or just on. Yeah we saw this in the movie when Radcliffe's supposed to give a speech on that pro proton scattering device. I love and you saw he became nonfunctional while he was doing that speech but he was talking fine when they were going into the room and they kinda just jumping away as they went. Yeah. Normal Day functions was fine. So the British agents are trying to get to the bottom of this brain drain and to find out what is happening. That's what movie's about try and find out. Do we stop this? They just lost Radcliffe to kidnapping and they WANNA get him back at all costs. They have a lead, a grant be guy who they want to track down. So Palmer. WHO's now working for Dali? is on the case as well as many other agents. He developed a relationship with a couple of these agents, this Guy Jacques Carswell, and Jean Courtney a woman. Yeah. Go figure he's. Just right down next door at the first briefing. Yeah. But. He's checking out her legs and everything else it's. He's behind like in some ways. Eventually carswell takes Palmer into his confidence and he shows them a manual that might be the key to what is happening here to the scientists. Palmer locks up this manual in his desk drawer and office, and while driving Palmer's car carswell is killed. They thought it was Palmer Palmer's now obviously very suspicious. He goes to retrieve the manual. It's gone someone on the inside knows what is happening perhaps a mole is we haven't seen that ever won a spy movie. No we'll see that in the future either Willie Oh, my God, I shouldn't impossible bond. Whatever Palmer continues the mission trying to get information about this grant be guy as other mysterious characters appear and are killed one way or another eventually palmer figures out who the bad guy really is and the world is safe. So you know things are going to work out. Okay. Well, it's a good thing because this was the first of three. Harry Palmer's that they did. Yeah. Yeah overall, it's an excellent movie. It's difficult to follow at times. In fact, I want to kind of comment on that the opening scene, the pre title sequence I to watch stat three times before I figured out who was who and there is a pre title sequence there is a pre title sequence. Of the characters aren't on screen for that long, but it's really important to know which each of the three characters main characters that are in that scene who they are, and they all dressed very similarly, and so like I said, I had to watch that three times before I figure it out. Oh, that's that guy that's that that's that guy yeah. So you might want to pay attention to this as you're watching the film and. Listen to this podcast, go re watch the film if you've seen it already or watch it for the first time at least you'll have a little more detail. Now as the kinds of things we're GONNA go over in this podcast. There's very dark overtones to this movie. This is more like real spicy stuff than other spy franchises like bond. It's darn interesting because this came out the same year that spy who came in from the cold. And it's we're going to do. That's great both those. that. One even has more realism to it than this one. Yeah. But it's not all the gadget stuff or anything it's just. Get a good feel for this being a real kind of what spies really do Kinda thing dark it's deep it secret it's ominous. It's foreboding the there's a lot of tension in I throughout the whole film. Really it's spicy stuff really at its best like I said, they were trying to make him be the antibody and there's a couple of things. He does that are kind of bond like, yeah now. Different sources quoted different things in different variations on this phrase the thinking man's Bond Yeah I love. Goldfinger something that was in Newsweek, at the nor a couple of other sources I think one of them attributed it to Harry Saltzman. Saying that he was the thinking man's bond but again, I saw a couple of different places slight variations on that. But Really trying to take the bond character with a twist. So Lend Dayton publishes the file in nineteen sixty two. This is the same year as the first Bonfield came out Dr No. So both date now, and actually the that dates important who are talk about it a little bit later but keep in mind this was sixty, two Fleming in sixty three released on her majesty's Secret Service. Come back around to that but pay attention to these dates as we're going through them in in this discussion. Yeah. So here you have a situation where both Dayton and Fleming were writing at the same time and true. Robert Ludlum Jason Bourne novels were not released until nineteen in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, nine, hundred, ninety. So Dayton may have had an influence on those novels and other movies as well and John Look away was around this time as well. Yeah. Now, the name of Harry Palmer was has an interesting origin and I've read a couple of different things on this, but generally the the story goes to Harry Saltzman said to them. What's the Dulles? We remember Fleming said when he picked the name James By From a similar premise, what's a very pedestrian boring name that I can use here? Now the funny thing is cain supposedly said Harry. Saltzman name it's most boring name you can come up with. And then they supposedly picked Palmer because Cain said the most boring boy in school was a kid named Tommy. Palmer. and. So again, I've read this in different sources, slightly different interpretations of it. Yeah and I. Think I pulled out a wikipedia Harry Saltzman. I think search eventually. So all my name's really Herschel so. I'm good with Harry's. All right. So there's several points. We're GONNA talk about here. The stage that the packers file plays on is the Cold War stage in one, thousand, nine, hundred, sixty, five, and the Soviet. Union, we're building up powerful nuclear arsenals and Britain was right there in the middle of it all and World War Two is still fresh in the mind and in the it because. File losing top scientists potentially to the other side is something Britain new as at the end of World War Two when top German scientist went to either the US or the Soviet Union this was a major major threat. So they didn't want this happening again now and Heck von Braun who came to the United. States was a rocket scientist by the way for Germany. He almost rocket scientist. Almost single handedly built the American space program. So in the Chris File. What was happening wasn't that good and also in the fifties and sixties there was a lot of experimentation going on for mind control especially using drugs many of these drug experiments were conducted by the US CIA? Yes. One was called Operation Midnight Climax. Cracks me up where people were given LSD. Then they were filmed from behind a mirror as they tried to make love in a room compilation. have to see what the drugs were do whatever yeah. There's a great little book on that to called the manual of trickery and deception. It's actually good. We're going to go over some of the things that ended up few other podcasts because it's a very good book anyway, and there was one more project M. K. ultra. Mind, control what drugs might be used interogations. Yeah. This stuff was really going on in World War Two as well. Yeah. So wow, there's some of that happens in this movie. And pulling it out of the real world. School. Now, when you watch a bond film, it's like to me it's like looking through it absolutely freshly cleaned window. Crisp. Bright and. All that's going on even though there are some ominous scenes in in the film of course, the file on the other hand is like to me like looking through slightly me dirty window. Not, the photography I which I love. But the overall feel of the film it is far closer to real spying than the bond franchise has portrayed in four films up to the point that this hip file comes out. It definitely has a grittier feel to it definitely grittier the DVD that I've got. There's a video of Sydney j fury, the director and Peter Hunt, talking a lot of we're going talk about today comes from that it's also available to watch on Youtube. A director's commentary. So it's the whole length of the movie. We'll cut it down for you here. So so the director loved all these camera angles and how the the movie was shot through windows, phone booths, armpits, and more. Yeah I. Loved it. Harry saltzman hated any hated fury. And so there was there was a lot of stuff that went on behind the scenes with Harry and fury but fury was winning out on how the film was being shot. But saltzman went to Peter Haunt editor to St- to confirm that Sydney's work was crap as his words but Peter Hunt said No. Stuff. So after that Harry didn't bother Sydney again. During the movie making however, there are some other other issues that happened with Harry and Sydney after all of this. Wasn't a symbiotic relationship I don't think now all of these camera angles and stuff I. I personally thought there was too much of it too much. The weird angle stuff some of it I'm fine with. But it was like there wasn't a straight on shot in the whole darn movie. It didn't seem. Yeah. So I liked it. So it's one of those people seem to really like or didn't like much at all and a lot of the comments you read online from the people who don't like it are about the way the film was shot. Yes. Not about the content, but about the way the film was shot. Yeah I know there's a lot of stuff about that and that's actually one of the things I loved about. The film and here's why I I loved it I. I was thinking throughout the movie that the camera angles many times like you said, looking through things like the windows symbols in boxes that one shot of the inbox of the curve and every lot of crazy angles stuff almost hitchcock like beyond hitchcock like and through side windows of a waiting car looking down through a hanging lamp of from above to a body below and so on. I loved it and fury never said this and I'm maybe I'm just making this up. But I I was thinking maybe that seeing through all of these things is like Palmer who can see through a lot of the people in the situations that he's in to get to the real truth and he does that relentlessly throughout the film just like relentlessly, there are these camera angles so I'm going with that. Well. Okay. You and I have a slightly different opinion on these cameras. But that's that's fine. That's the beautiful thing about watching something we can each have our own opinion. Now, one of the things that was interesting to me about these camera angles was in the podcast, the double o files. Were listen to those guys. Yeah. Good to talk to the director of Photography Film Mayhew of Golden Eye in Casino Royale. And he fills said that the hypocrites file and the the camera angles and stuff and how they shot it. Were direct influence on how they filmed the pre title sequence in the Daniel Craig Casino Royale. So it's some people love it. Some people don't they didn't use those angles for the whole movie, but they used it for the pre-title in. Casino. Royale, we talked to Roberto Schaefer the director of Photography Quantum of solace and in one of his movies monster's ball was a lot of the same kind of different angles and so on. So it did influence other movies I think and again I like it. So let me go to you just made a comment about seeing through things. Yeah. There's another thing that happens your Harry's got classes and Harry Saltzman didn't want him to have a glasses. Yeah. But Sydney wanted him to have the glasses. They're nice glasses. They're nice glass. French French style glasses. And so there are thick tortoiseshell or whatever. But there are some shots where Harry's got glasses off and he doesn't see through things everything's fuzzy and then he puts a mind and things become clear takes them off. Whatever. Yeah. Seeing through things so Supporting my Siri through. Their thank you. Say you now agree with me. I just think there's too much of I. Don't mind a few those shots I just think it's too much. There's one great shot with the glasses to that comes up in the in the film when he's with Jean, Courtney the agent and at Palmer's Blat and she asks him to always wear your glasses in Palmer says, yes except when I'm in bed. She takes off from room. In. Bed there you go. That's going to happen. Now I love that one the great one. All right. So when they were filming the movie, they were literally writing script every day. This is what was going on. So I think in fury in that's commentary you're talking about time says something like, yeah, it was pretty much film in the sequence. That the story unfolds because they were right this stuff every day didn't know what they were doing the next scene and so that's kind of interesting. Yeah. It absolutely is because that's not normal. Normally you've got the script and they don't film it in order. Now it did help that most of the scenes were filmed in the same two buildings. Yes they did they filmed a lot of. It in the same two buildings so that that made it easier to be able to do that. The Harry's flat was upstairs the officers were downstairs and so on. So it's Kinda cool that they did that and and that came out in that little commentary as well. One of the things I love about this story is how they deal with the tension and get you wrapped in Eric. Questioning, what's going on? You're trying to figure out WHO's on Harry side Yeah and who isn't and what's Harry up to really yeah. What's what's Harry doing? We don't we don't know with for. So who's Ross's allegiance to? Yeah who's seen Courtney's allegiance to yeah. What about Daulby and Jock Yeah so where, where are these people aligned and it isn't crystal clear throughout the movie? No, it's just the ending. So when you're watching the film, keep all of that in mind because you will have to keep in mind because it's obvious that it's like who are these people whose either they on. So the whole movie though Thomas Built around deception intrigue and there there are reasons suspect in perhaps not suspect many of the characters. So, for example, there are reasons to suspect Colonel Ross Palmer's bus. In the beginning he seems to be a company man I'm Palmer side and so on. But he reassigned Palmer to a new division and send them off to Major. Daulby. To his group why we wonder see trying to get rid of Palmer. Who He knows is a very good agent even though he is in subordinate insulin and all that we wonder they're. Not to suspect is new boss Major Daulby. Dhabi's been around a while Ross sent Palmer to him. So maybe he thinks Palmer can help him and so on. Also dolby does assign palm or to the case that they're working on, which is the case of the movie trying to find Ratcliffe the scientists and tracked down this grant be guy and at a rate at the warehouse he yells at his subordinates for starting the operation ten minutes late and so they missed the targets that they wanted at the warehouse but I think he was just trying to make look good for his team. His team. Hey, I'm behind you. Yeah. But we don't know remember Palmer called for this operation at this warehouse thing and he didn't really have thirty to do that and other. Thing I. This is what I think I should do. So I'm going to do it and Palmer finds a bit of recording tape at the warehouse that had been destroyed in this kind of stowe fire and it was still warm and all that and Dolby is the one who points out that says if Chris on it, that kind of surprise me he came up with that. It wasn't Palmer who said that so that's a reason saying, okay I'm not gonNA. Suspect Dhabi Jean Courtney she's great played by Sue Lloyd. We think she's on Palmer side but again, we're not sure if she works for Daulby or Ross or whatever. Regardless she seems to be on Harry Palmer side and this is one of those characters that kind of disappointed me a little in the movie because they really don't develop her at all. Yeah and She. was good and I would have loved to have seen more of the stuff she was doing. Yeah. As part of this movie because like I say they, they just didn't develop her character much at all and was I was disappointed by that? Yeah. Like Pala in Thunderball I think she could have had a bigger role same kind of thing same kind of thing. Yeah. Absolutely, and then we got a couple of other characters in this whole thing. They just cracked me up because this guy who had his glasses taped right here in the middle typical during the sixties. Absolutely, and we don't know who this guy is or what side he's on keeps appearance him lurking around a couple of different times and you're like, who is this guy? And the same thing a little bit later. You see there's a, there's a black actor that's got a pipe right and he's lurking around and you're like, who is this you find out some kind of agent. Who are they? We've actually do get there. Yeah. So we're just GONNA go through a few scenes here. There's a pre title sequence. Of course, there is one cause Harry Solomons involved and they just did three bond films with pre title sequences. So we get one two guys get into this car. One of them is reading this newspaper called the New Scientist they arrive at a train station looking for the compartment debt is reserved for. Mr Ratcliffe who is actually the scientists and he's one of the two guys. So he gets this compartment, the other guy lease but the other guy notices that Oh wow. Radically forgot his camera in the back seat of the car and he returns to the train and to his compartment and Radcliffe is Gone Yikes. Reading the new scientists and when he draws the paper down, it's now Ratcliffe it's this other guy and the train pulls out the camera pulls back to the station and you see a body and I'm thinking, wow the killed ratcliffe but it wasn't. Ratcliffe and that's why I said I had to Rewatch, a couple times. Yeah. Because it was actually this Guy Taylor who brought him the camera right? Right. You need to watch it. You'll hear Taylor's names referenced a couple times in the movie but he's killed here but. If you're not really paying attention to the faces. Yes. It's hard to tell that and. A lot of the faces can look similar. So you you you do have to pay attention. So yeah, you cut the Harry Palmer in his flat and the alarm is ringing alarm clock and there's immediate suspense that was the most annoying clock and it goes on for quite a while and now there's a title sequence and the title sequence is cool. He's making coffee as lend Dayton's the course file pops on the screen and Harry Palmer into the titles. Now look into title title sequence and Harry Palmer looks tired as he gets up and gets dressed and ready for ready for the day he's making his coffee. And it's a process grinding the bean steeping pouring and so on. It's easy not to pay attention to this but it shows I. Think how meticulous Palmer is about some things hand much like bond was with his food and drink and so on. You see Harry Palmer doing this with his coffee and you think well, this meticulousness is going spill over and carry over into his work just like. It did for bond. But one big difference is bonds. Apartment is a lot nicer looking Harry's Oh. Yeah. The Harry's carries on this grady feel a guy who doesn't have a lot of money and you get that you really get that feel out of that thing. Yeah there's no question. This is not bonds bonds flat. This is this is Harry sweat and he is a different kind of looking character. Look like bond with the classes and everything else and you didn't see a lot of lead actors in movies at that time we glasses. ABS-. Absolutely. This looks like a good spot to ramp up part. One of the Chris file will pick up part to where we learn more about Harry Palmer's character and some key scenes to focus on. Sounds good. Thanks for listening. This has been Tommaso vestry. Please subscribe to our show cracking the code spy movies right now have a movie in mind. We should cover tell us about it on twitter at spy navigator, and if you're listening now, send us a message on twitter and let us know where you're listening from.

Michael Caines Harry Palmer Ma Colonel Ross Palmer Harry Saltzman Harry Palmer Chris File Guy Radcliffe scientist director Colonel Ross palmer Dhabi Jean Courtney Guy Doleman James Bond Peter Hunt British Film Institute US Goldfinger Mr Ratcliffe Dayton grady
#46 Hunter Koch

X Factor Roping Podcast

1:28:54 hr | 9 months ago

#46 Hunter Koch

"For we get this podcast started. I wanted to let you know about x-factor opening dot com. If you want to improve your roping and take it to the next level I truly believe x-factor openness for you. We video some of the very best horse trainers and team roping in industry like Joseph Harrison. Charlie Crawford Hunter Cook Paid Bray and many more. I know a lot of us are visual learners. And that's why x-factor roping we let you watch the best in the world. Not only talk about it but we show it in slow motion as well. How many times have you watch a short video or slow motion running helped you out now? Imagine having access to thousands of videos like this. If you're serious about improving Europa become a member to ex factor roping DOT COM. Welcome the executive open podcasts. With Hunter Cook we've waited with hundred the other day and man it was. It was a very impressive video. Shoot Hunter is twenty two years old and two or three years ago. Your number eight healer correct correct and went from an eight to number ten healer. That's an NFL. Qualifier up with Matt Sherwood last year at the finals and men. It's pretty impressive. Because you just don't see young guys that can set it up Liz. Well as you do it. He'll so fast but At the at this level with your very consistent at his heel and fast man I was. It was amazing to watch that video. Shoot that day. So we'll thank space appreciate that so We're just talking a minute ago. I thought I'd hit record on the podcast. Okay I got I got the record hit now but now that day the video shoot. It's for everyone that watches it there. The weather is probably about forty forty five degrees and at least twenty mile an hour headwind straight up and There was some really good rope. Aman. I couldn't believe it like when I was going through the runs. Might he immediately every steer very very fast. If you've got twenty five or thirty heads spawn. The only one. I don't think he caught you. You didn't throw your thought he was going to miss. Doesn't even wrote okay. Well you don't think you're GONNA catch don't throw I like it. And then my favorite part about it is nicky. She's kind of getting some promo videos and pictures and stuff like that and Bryn Hall Chase China. There Britain happens to be healing and the very first video I look at. He's healing and does not he doesn't even get close and later. She's getting some pitchers and Man His head rope wrapped around. It was a brutal brutal. Yes Yeah Br. Brennan will have some some birthday pitcher. Yes for you so sure. We'll Manda Canada dive into it from Vernon Texas grew up in Vernon born and raised. And many you. Kinda talk a little bit earlier but you said you went from a number three to eight healer. Pretty quickly right. It felt like it was happened fast. How old were you when you're number eight? I think I was in eight from maybe the very beginning of two thousand seventeen and then I just got to think and I think the rope with Billy Bob Brown. I was two thousand eighteen actually and So a year year and a half there I was stuck at number eight and saint like I said it seemed like it went from a three to a super fast. Didn't really know what was going on. Honestly it just happened like that and then I was Kinda stuck for a little while and to be honest with you. That was right. One classic burn down. I'm pretty sure had to go to switch and ropes had to give it a because you know I wouldn't sponsor then or nothing so that kind of felt like it took a toll on on my progression And then Is kind of one of them deals. Where a lot of it was just needing some coach and I felt like from from somebody and everything during that year and a half. We're stuck at. That number was all just me self teaching myself and a little bit of confusion and slumps going on and then And then I started dating my girlfriend Taylor and she lived at Paul Eve's House and started rope on Paula. Bunch about as a pulse house three days a week and I think the after the first month or two after that started feeling like I started open like a little more advanced a little more advanced and just started getting some help and then after that it just the light bulb went off again and it felt like I started progressing. Like wanting to again right. Do you think I mean I? I feel like polly's might go down as one of the greatest healers of all time. Yup Absolutely and what I noticed about the sky and is I think. Paul has staying power with his healing. He rides a hill horse. Maybe I don't know if you said the best. But one of the best. He'll horse riders absolutely and then he has about I mean an unreal amount of Morse's and that's what he does all day long day. That was huge for me. As you know I didn't really ever get to practice with a guy like that ever until that point in my life so going over there and you know you get there at eight or nine in the morning and until dark you were reopened all day and it was also a lot different than anything. I'd been around practicing with other people because it was you know he Mi- road seven head of he'll horses and it was perfect practice every single run. There never was time during the day where he felt like were just roping. You know it was hundred percent focus. You know he might around hundred twenty steers that day and he had one hundred percent on every single ron of focus. How he was going to do it. Every horse had a plan who's going to execute that plan on every horse and just being around that in the that mentality was great for me. It was you know a total change my rope and as far as getting better and how to get better and what what again. He's dude advance and it was great. So do you think that's been the biggest differences watching how Paul structures practice? And then that's something you have just taken a duplicated. I feel like for me and Paul having two totally different styles as far as from the neck up what I learned from that guy was everything to it's a I feel like what's made me get better that fast and to feel like I can stay elite for as long as I wanNA rope. Rodeo is all credit all Paul for that because a guy he's an animal he's machine he. He knows how to grounded out you know. He's he's my kind of people I like to say. I like that about him and it was. It was huge for me. So what's been the biggest takeaway mentally from Paul that That you've applied to Europe. Just learning focus. You know some people when they work on their their mental gain to me. It's it's too complex. It's two broken down to where it almost makes it even harder. Paul's mental practices more of simplicity and efficient Blatko. You know it's not breaking down your swing your arm or your what your body's doing and this and that and breaking it down so much towards it's causing you to get worse. I guess it's more of just give yourself one hundred percent focus. Never just be roping you know. Just focus on every single cow. You know don't let yourself you know if you if you're having trouble in the third round at the rope and you know you're doing something wrong every open in the third round your open leg or something you know. Just think okay these next four steers. I'm going to have a forehead open. I'm going to focus just talk about the Jackpot at the rodeos. If you're having a problem with saying it feels blurry at the Rodeos and stuff happening too fast. We're going to work on. You know slow on our mind down. Watching steer may be go an extra few jumps and set it up just stuff like that to where this just been a a huge component and and me learning how to how to heal the elite guys and I think that's a big big thing is when we video day with you it was. I have a game plan for each of my horses and what I noticed about your healing right away. You throw fast. I think you said that really well really fast but none of your horses are Chidi and everything is it. Looks like in your like. Hey this is I wrote on them all like this quite often. I make sure that they've got this. Feel but you know your body posture and everything kind of fits in with with that run and and I think that's And you could tell me if I'm wrong. But probably from having those practice sessions where each day when you get on that horse. You're working on something and if you do that every day it mean it might take a week. It might take like you said a few. It might take years. But you'll get to that point where I now can ride these horses. Set it up how I want to set up and everything feels good because you've been each day focused on that horse what to do each run and you've got the most out of every steer that you can is is that is that what you think and that is do you think a lot of great healers is a firm believer in that and another thing. I learned in a Paul. Help me with this too. Is great great reopened makes great horses A lot of people think that it's a a hard process or only the advance horsemen can can make their horses greater whatever and I'm a firm believer in if if you if you wrote great on your horses or do a good job roping on your horses. They're going to be good like you said throw fast quite a bit. Even practicing but horses don't really seem to take anything away from me or get tight but I drive them to the same spot every time when I throw If if I go to that spot where I want to throw and throw every time. They're going to go to that spot before they think about stopping you know or if I ride down the reign of the same spot every time they're never gonNA move on me down the rain or try to get to a different spot because they've been put in that spot every single time you know it's when when you start throwing in different spots when you're gets tight or whatever like if if I started leaning over the front and throwing way out in front of me for five years in a row then if I tried to go to these spot they'd probably be a little tight you know what I mean. It's it's just doing the same thing that you want to do. The open or the Rodeos if you get them to that same spot every single time and that's where they're used to you throw in and that's where you WANNA throw at. I don't I don't feel like in their mind. Just thinking like a horse would they wouldn't have an have a reason to cheat you or a reason to to to do something to cause you to miss. Because you're doing what you. WanNa do every time in your throne where you're wanting to throw every time that's GonNa make them solid to make them better and and me that's how how all the great horses remain. You know Joseph Harrison's got some of the most amazing hill horses anybody's ever seen and that guy practicing y'all vauxhall x-factor videos a him. He just runs around their ghost where he throws every single time and he throws there and those horses of got it down to a science. You know just good rope and makes great horses right so I met. I gotTA agree. I think I think the other thing that's really sums. It up is the simplicity of Like you talked is being simple. You get to your spot. And then he'll the steering me to really put it that way but to be really really good and really really disciplined at getting your spot. That's that's essentially where there's the art and craft that the I think the great sin like you. You know where you're at with your it makes it really really special Mena had a few questions in here that I thought were Kinda Kinda interesting here especially from a younger guy like yourself. What is it if as far as being a healer? What is the greatest thing you do as a healer? The greatest thing to me as in my opinion is just getting live this this life. I mean I get to wake up every day and wrote for living from from where I come from my dad. He's a farmer and Rancher. My Mom's a schoolteacher. I mean it's the most normal family you can have and none of them have road roped nothin so I guess you could say a lot of the odds were against me When I figured out this is what I wanted to do. So just being able to live this right now and and be able to wrote for a living and you know going to Rodeos and opens every weekend. Pay My bills by doing this. The greatest thing. That's about being a healer for me is getting to do this. This is awesome man. I I really. I liked handsome. That's pretty cool. So when you talk about living this lifestyle and and being able to do it went. What age were you when you're like? Hey I I wanna try to route four living. Well I was real unsure about it for a while like I said I when I've rope since I was young but I was mainly just roping calves. Kaffir open and like I said My. None of my parents showed rope so everything I did was self taught and I was getting by. Okay Roken cavs but I just it was. It was a struggle. Just you know self teaching yourself how to rope. Cavs not knowing what you're doing. It's not a good combination and then there's a guy that lives in Vernon and red skelton when he went school at Vernon lived in this guy's basement His name's Gary Jacobs. At this time it was probably thousand and thirteen house. Probably a freshman in high school and He came up to me one day at a restaurant and he said hey when you can start coming in roping with me. I was like yeah. I'd love to 'cause I'd never had anybody. You know coach or whatever so house ready for for some help but he was a team roper. And I'd never really teen rope much. I would heal for somebody if you know a pickup partner needed something at a High School. Rodeo or something but I never actually like rope. Droped teamer open so My Freshman Year High School. I started going. He lived about a mile from the high school so I walked to his house every day after school. And I drove with him. And he said he was a quarter horse. Racehorse trainer Gallop Racehorses for me every day around the track rope with you till dark or whatever I'll teach you how to heal asset perfect so every day I'd walk over there from school not gal does race horses. He had three or four of them. And then we'd rope and I was Kinda liked it but I still unsure about you know I for sure it wasn't like this is what I'm GonNa do. I was just having fun at this point in time. And then there's another kid. There that was working farm was hidden. He was open all the time and always told him. I said I'm not not gonNA rope on the weekends. I'm going to you know. Go Hunt or whatever. Hang out with my family. He's alright so he took that guy that other kid to Wesley. Thorpe's house one weekend and they roped and I come back from school. That Monday went to his house. And he said He said that they went to Wesley. Thorpe's house and I was kind of bummed out. I wanted to go to Wesley. Thorpe's house and you know why don't you? Why didn't I get to go? He said Nope that kid wants it. And you don't he said You said you don't rope on weekends. So we want him going to bother and it just lit a fire under MAC under my but right there as well he's right. I'm I'm kind of being lazy and sorry and started working at a lot harder that year and started you know. Dedicate my life basically to to open Just from that moment. It was weird and Throat every day all day weekends Christmas it and matter we were we were open. If I wasn't doing something with my family or wasn't that school and started. Finally I learned how to I remember. I was in class. I was watching. Drew Stu videos with a gopro on on how to get time because I could never get in time and then finally figured that out and once once I started getting where I could like time up and he'll disappear and it was game on from there. I was stuck on reopen and so about two thousand the end of two thousand thirteen about my first car. Three healer start going to jackpots and stuff and from then on it was. My life was reopened. Everything I did. I never did anything I mean I. I didn't play football. No more didn't play basketball. I quit all that everything was just open. That's what you knew that I knew. So drew stu man a and and that's that's so funny to me because e East Shout out to drew. I think he's done a great job with with everything. But you know when we were seeking advice on learning timing you. You're telling me that you basically knew how to time up. Steer as a three healer is that is that okay. So that's why he went from a three to eight. So yeah because if you can see tie mean your going to go I mean it's you're almost instantly seven healer. I feel like I remember when I first started to see it. It was pretty rough because I would like start to float my luke knew I was going to throw and miss lay besides like thinker role. I mean I would just lay beside him but it was within months. That has an I. I started having those practice sessions where I caught seventy eighty percent of my steers up every day. what's been the biggest thing to help you read the Remember when startup to to get timing was it was it the gopro videos from drew stu. I started watching those go pro videos every day for about a week in class. Our classrooms were set up with computers in front of us and I was just watching those videos watching those videos and I was watching his hand when he would start his delivery. And you know in those videos you can see the swing come over the years back and I noticed you know when the head was coming up on the feet were coming up. His tip was over the stairs back. And that's kind of how his timing was and then I'll watch. His delivery was just a continuation of his swing. And that's how I looked at it. You know always started delivery with something different. It's it's I learned through watching those videos. It's just a continuation of your swaying. You're just letting go and I remember. I did that for about a week and didn't really focus on it and the practice pin that week for a while because I knew I didn't have it down yet and then I wrote a dummy for a few days and kind of played with it and then when I finally on the dummy fell one hundred percent the next day when I wrote steers it was like boom boom boom just two feet two feet and the guy that I was going to I was going to Waco. I think the next weekend after I figured that out and the guy was roping came to that old man's house to rope with me and he said Oh my gosh he said what you're you're three like I didn't really know we just got lined up your open like I think it was the nine point. Zero Eight Point Zero Open. I think I caught ten or twelve years behind him. A two feet in a row and We ended up being high called weekend at the at the open and I must in short round. But that's when it was just like a woman off when I figured that out that timing when to throw on how to throw and like you said at first when you're playing with it you wanna maybe sometimes floated or because you're Tocado watching the feet or whatever but I finally figured out to just keep it the same as my swing and let go. It was game on from there man a I gotta say like it didn't take me. I mean I. I've probably healed a few thousand steers like we were breaking in sears. My Dad was a roping producer so we would break a lot of stairs and I know for sure. I talked about ten thousand rule but I know I've missed ten thousand six a healing. I've probably missed more heady out. Definitely Miss Ten thousand series before I learned how to develop timing so man. You've got to be pretty. Naturally talented ride is that is that something that is like you have some very good skill that way. Just you can be really honest with us. I feel like it was a god given gift to to do this. It was just. It happened pretty natural for me. I really smart like I had to. I got to cut corners or anything I still had to work my butt off now but I was pretty decent athlete in school software. Like my hand I is is pretty damn good I just wasn't big enough to be that good at the sports. We were playing but Philip. My hand is really good and my hands are pretty fast and that helped helped a lot and but I mean like one of my best friends. Jeremy Bieler that guy is the furthest thing from like being naturally talented? That guys had to work his butt off to be. I wouldn't say mechanical. But he's had to teach myself everything in that aspect of like timing and how to. How like were where I feel like. I can just feel stuff about to happen. That guy's just trained his mind. What to do when that happens if that makes sense so I know from both ends that whether you're E fleck you're naturally talented to be able to do stuff or where whether you had to train your mind to see stuff. I think either way you can get to where you wanna be so just a little different process of what you gotTa do to get there like me. I feel like I learned it all from vision watching videos and stuff for some guys have to go through the trial and error aspect of you know I. I think that's that's something that it can be your best strength or your greatest weakness and there's a lot of you see it with a lot of kids and it's I'm kind of interested to see. What would you have to say about this but to me like I feel like I have? I can see things and then I can. Do it like if someone shoots a jump shot. A certain can start shooting jump shots like that and I can kind of emulate the same styles with healing but What I noticed is when things got real easy for me. I got pretty bored with it and you see that with a lot of kids. There's been a lot of young guys out there that were eights nines. Tens before they're at high school and they're nowhere to be found especially from the last ten years you know. I think that there's a lot of those guys they can't the CA hang and it's because of the work ethic and So would you say that's like your your greatest like we biggest weakness and and you kinda learn how to get through that like hey. This comes pretty easy. Yup But don't you don't take it for granted Yeah Yeah I feel like the biggest thing to me is i. Try Not to let myself feel satisfied because to me once I feel satisfied I feel like I would plateau and I feel like a lot of people do. I mean I can remember going to college and Stuff. There was probably ten fifteen guys could whip my butt every day. That were just amazing. You know all they had to do. Was You know? Snap their fingers and they were going to catch defeat on I jump. It felt like they were just so advanced compared to where I was at but I feel like they got so good so fast and like you said. Just get bored. They they feel like you know. I'm as good as I need to be to win. And at that time they were but there comes a point in time in your life for you gotta realize you know and it's hard especially at that age to realise this but that's not going to work forever. You know you go to the lone star shootout or the BFI and stuff like that later on you. Know all those guys jade corporal. Paul Leaves Jake. Long a junior. Those guys have been that way for ten years before they were and if still worked at it through those ten years you can't expect to beat those guys and you show up. So that's you know another deal that I try to keep myself. I don't know if you WANNA say humbled or whatnot. Is You know if if I missed too. Many rows can be hard to pay the bills for too long. You know I try to think about that to to keep me. You know going If if I just give satisfied plateau off you know. It won't be six months and my name will be erased from everything because there's so many guys that wrote good and they'll just forget about you and leave you in the dust so I try to keep keep thinking about that. Another thing that that old man taught me is he said you gotta rope even when you don't WanNA rope Because the days you ain't reopen somebody else's and they're getting better than you and me being competitive and Lichen sports and stuff is you know. I don't ever WanNa feel beat. I don't WanNa feel like oh on. It's a little cold day or it's Wendy. I'm going to sit inside and just relax today. You know and the thought of someone else getting better than me. Yeah pisses me off. I don't want that. I don't want anybody getting ahead of me. So those are just. Kinda the mental things I think about one feel like I'm getting you know I'd I'd really like to just take it easy today and go watch a movie you know. That's when I feel like that I try to think about those things to get me. It's twenty degrees out there and it's called well so we gotta we. GotTa we got Fort Worth coming up. We gotTA DESA COMING UP. You know I gotta I gotTa get ready. I gotTA BE PREPARED TO. Do My job. There's someone out there get out work and you you know when you run into. We're doing this broadcast. Someone's out there feeling series right now and and the you know when you see them. They'll beat you. I think that's a read a book. I think Tim Tebas along time ago. And that was something that the train. There's always someone out. There is at work in you and when you meet them they're going to beat you and I it's it's the truth I mean for every time I feel like everyone's like I work at a pretty hard and then there'll be a day where there's thirty mile an hour headwind and a lot of people will stay inside and then what you find is a lot of people out there. It's the same deal. They got seven eight nine. Eight eight horses I. I don't know the stock trailers filled up. And you know just like that you know. It was windy cold rough conditions. But I know y'all video the Wendy Ryan last year. How hard was that headwind? I mean I was using my stiff head ropes and they were blowing back at me and that was how people that rope in those conditions. You know or practice on days like that. They probably weren't even worried about it. You know what I mean. That's the way I look at it. And you know how during the summer we might be at a you. Know Cody Wyoming. You know ten thousand dollar. One header wind's blowing hard. I want to feel good about it. I don't WANNA BE WORRIED IN THE BACK OF MY MIND. Mana open and heartland. I don't know what I'm GonNa do you know? That's just the way I look at is. I think it's a it's a great way man. I remember living on thirty twenty five right here in Stephenville that arena Had the worst headwind and every day. It was Wendy. Just in that arena. I don't know why and one day we had a I had start using medium soft and And so after us about a month out of Logan will ensure not the wind is blowing really hard and I was like no big deal just grabbed everyday and I didn't even realize it at that point I look back. Oh man that was that thing. I roped in headwinds. Yeah Alright so man. You're you're twenty two years old. I think your belief system is very. It's delicate when you're younger. I mean at least it was for me. Is that something you've always been really good with as far as believing in yourself and what you can be. You know what you're capable of or how you know how. How do you go about managing your confidence or what you believe you can do so? I started my belief system. I felt like was pretty good. I- I neglected. I could figure stuff out because I'd already figured out some stuff that we're key components to healing and so I was like man I got this. You know I can do this and then there come a time you know like in college and stuff where where people that are more advanced than you beat new some- sometimes you can place a little bit. Then it got a little shaky as not to wear. I was like I'm not going to be able to do this. Not that bad but like Gosh. I'm behind you know. It was more of a worry feeling. Oh I I need to get better I'm not getting enough yet but saying that I feel like it helped me get better but in that point it helped me get through that stage where some people were plateauing that made me keep getting better and then now That's a big big part of healing Healing good in the in the pure. See as you have to think that way you have to not good enough you and and even if you're not at the time you got to think that way you know. I've been putting the work in. I've been putting the time in. I belong here. I can rope with these guys. That's kind of the thought that that I try to have. I mean like I said the other day as long as you're working hard as long as you got to a level head. You're you're doing things you need to do. You should be able to go anywhere you WANNA go. You should be able to make it work. Just keep ground and keep hustling and And you're you're going to be good enough so I mean we all have weaknesses. What's your biggest weakness? You think is a healer right now. My biggest weaknesses. A healer probably is a man. I think sometimes I'm a little too confident and stuff As far as shot selection. That's that's probably my main Colton. We're talking about the other day practicing at the at the lone star shootout on his first year wearing the last rotation easy rotation he turns the steer to be easy. Five second round. I throw looking back now. It's too fast. 'cause myself to to catch the steer at a bad time and my bottom strand got caught his claws right. Couldn't pull more up tight. Mr Steer had to be seventeen to make it back onto super bummed out at myself super frustrated. And we're talking about it. Colton said I don't feel like you're doing anything wrong. Necessarily I just think. Sometimes you're talented enough and confident enough that you take shot. See in your mind. You're telling yourself you know I can catch easy when in reality if you go. One more swing steer opens up. I heal them. You know. We're still five six instead of five two. That's my biggest biggest problem right. Now that I'm working on is you know and don't be. It's hard to explain because you need to be confident but sometimes a little too confident and oh I can catch that steer and when in reality it's a fifty fifty shot and my mind's telling me it's one hundred percent shot you know. I've I've got a really work on folks and do that. I jump if the steers not not good enough to heal yet. I need to go one more. Let him get good and then he'll on so that's what I'm having to work on constantly. Twenty four seven a at the house right now the last month. I've been practicing you know if Stephen stubs his toe. I'M GONNA go one more swing and make sure he's good before a helium so that's my main problem. Will the reason I ask that question and I think it's important for by basically? Everyone wants to get better to understand is knowing what your weaknesses are and how to not break yourself down. Yeah and and I think that's that's a big deal is like you said one month you have been working on and and so it's like Hey. I'm I'm not gonNA say oh I suck again like start adding hesitation to. You're you're just trying to be disciplined trying to see the the Ron clearly and and know your shot selection. Yep and I think that that's a big thing is like just being self aware and being able to talk to your partner and or someone that you ask Paul or something like that on saxes. Absolutely I'll talk to Paul Ladder and I'll talk to my partner a lot. You know the guys that I know of watched me rope a bunch and I know could could tell me you know if they see something the guys who will be with me and tell me what they think and just talking to your partners really good. Because you know you're runs based around them basically and and they colton seeing me he'll thousand steers you know. He's he's seen me. You Know How in my style developed through the years you know even when we weren't partners I've roped with him a bunch so I'll talk to him a bunch about it and stuff like what did you see right there. Look like right there. What what do you think right there and I'll go back and watch videos and stuff but like you said trying not to break it down too much Talk to a lot of lot of nines and stuff. You know that I've grown up with some buddies and when they start talking about problems are having i. It's it's almost so complex that I I get lost when they're talking about. You know my arm my swing this that you know my horse might left rain. You know it's it's so complex and harden and you can understand why they're struggling because I'm struggling trying to even keep up with the conversation you know so I was trying to keep it simple. Don't break it down so much point out the obvious and the run. If you get ten videos of steers you messed the same way. Every time you you caught the right leg every single time big loop on the right leg. That's simple you just didn't follow through all the way through the feet or your horse was a little too far behind them. So you're wrote couldn't get you know. Don't ever make it so complex to where you're working on stuff that's unnecessary If you talked to Paul about something This that's another thing. I learned from him His his ways of like he always tells me he says if I if I'm messing up or something I I know what I need to revert back to every time he says if I'll just sit up square keep my swing level on my horse. I'm usually fixed my problem every single time. So if he's in a slump and he's messing up a bunch. He has one thing that he goes back to that he can fix it with you. Know it's never a long drawn out process of of of something that you think you know. Albert Einstein has to try to figure out for you. It's never never needs to be that way. You know if. Lucky said like My problem that I've been working on here lately. It's one thing just work on folks and on the steer a little harder you know making sure he's right before he'll I'm not changing muscling. I'm not changing my delivery. You know I could very easily miss that. Steer the other at Lonestar open and started fixing my swing in fix my horse and fixing my delivering. I'd probably be going down three steps instead of progressing so just simplicity is is key to healing are high level. I think I agree. I think improving in general. It's a it's a big thing to be simple with what you're working on inconsistent. Yep Yep all right so you're healing position and is different than a lot of guys I mean. It's there's a few guys that he'll the way you do but it's you read a lot tighter position. Is that something that just felt natural to you and all the time? It's just been who you are. Yup I feel like it through throughout your your life of roping or whatever. Everybody finds their their SPA. You know you can take the top fifteen guys and majority of them are totally different in the way they do things you know you can go from Russell. Cordova style to police style. Totally different both of those guys. He'll great That's something that I've just Developed on my own through running a million steers of doing that and and developing my style around that. I'm a real jittery person. I like say like Oh always want in there want. I want to get there. I want to get there. I'm real on edge so that's kind of how my style is. I want to get there. I WANNA be a part of everything. I'm not really laid back so I don't want to hang back and and and ropes that way either but that's come with a lot of discipline that teach myself through that too you know not crashing the corner not getting too close for you rope your horses front leg. Just lots of stuff like that. But I I've done it enough and and learn how to discipline myself enough to where I can set it up to. Where it's consistent shot now instead of so kamikaze And I feel like everybody's got to go through that. They developed their own style. I hate when people I shouldn't say hate but I I really don't like it when people try to change people's style to the way they rope Like doing open schools. I've only done four or five now but I tried to tell the kids you know. I'm I don't WanNa change you because that's who you are. That's how you're gonNA make your name. I can give you some advice to help you. Perfect your style or help you or I can watch rope and see what's going to make you your style work better but I'm not going to change until you. Hey you need a ride like me. You need to swing Europe. Like me need a rope like me because you know. There's the best deals on world wrote different Joseph Harrison Paul And junior three The best healers they don't they don't rope nothing like They're all got different styles. They all ride different. Joe Son's different Paul Paul Swings Different Than Junior. But they've all disciplined. They're still to make their style. How high percentage and work and how to win doing that well and I think that's and I'm really glad you said that because you think headers is a little bit different The the healers. I'd I can't really name to healers with the same swing except for Trevor and Dakota singer Yup and the brothers but really I get it a lot of videos and look a lot of different swings and there's no Muss no one is yes. Same like Just like you're saying and I think that's there's similarities like or the force has got to get to in the in the how the run sets up and there's a lot of like how you can get your horse to that spot to your spot yup and there's a lot of ways you can work on that. I think you have to own your swing an own your style and then bring in these other things like polly's like I feel that you can see it a lot when you wrote. Is You ride pretty similar. All your body and everything's real correct. I that's one thing. A lot of healers have in common. That you're great is a really good about their cues. That they're giving their horse and riding the Horse Yup and get into that same spot every time you know everybody swings different rides a little different but you know the the great healers all get to that one spot throw and they all do that that same kind of smooth entry. Get there to where they want to get in. He'll the steer that's something that they all do. So perfect in your stoller trying to try to get to where you're healing at a high level or whatever you know go back and watch those videos of yourself and figure out okay. This is my style. But what am I going to do to get to that spot? Get to that entry to wherein he'll steer on the first jump if. I want to just little discipline things that you can perfect To do what all those guys do is key. I I really agree with you man. So rutland with cody. Snow a little bit last year. When did when did you go start second third parties at the Jackpot? How did that kind of work? That was crazy. We weren't even we hadn't even roped jackpots. Nothing hardly I think we might have accidentally. I might have drawn at a rope somewhere. Something but me. And Cody were always pretty good. Buds and I really wanted to go to California. And because I felt like my jab at that point in my career my jackpots style was was working good I'd placed at the West Texas open placed at the Odessa. Jackpot you know and I was doing get jackpots here at that time and I really really thought I was like man. I need to go to California As ROPLA BUBBA Buck loon BUBBA. A really didn't want to go to California. He wanted to just stay around here and go to Corpus Christi and all that stuff and he said but if you if you found a partner he said go ahead go to California and he put pets go to rope those radios and Wesley Toll. Cody he said. Hey I'm GonNa have a baby you know. I don't need to go out there this year. Random deal just cody called me out of the blue said Hey I was wondering if you wanted to rope. California new departure and yup absolutely. I told him for sure. I think that was maybe right around this time when he called me and once a week at calling we still we still going to California. Yup I was little little too excited but that was awesome and that was that was a huge huge part of last year Just confidence wise and and knowing that film film belong here anyways it was. It was great. Well I mean I gotTa Watch it just a little bit and man. I've watched you heal at this point and I knew knew he'll good me to get BUBBA? The rodeos is a big deal he had great and I remember. Just watching him hotter. He likes to cut it out pretty fast and in fact. There's two healers. These guys are their lights out. News you and Caleb Anderson at both of these healers they're hungry and they're not afraid and then I and right before California like watch you guys have maybe a few jackpots around here. I guess maybe you started rope and right around that just to get ready for California Yup and then we go out there and you are after the feeling like that. That was the one thing I was like. There was zero hesitation in your healing and and I mean a look back at that. Was your chance that was your chance. Hey you had I think. Cody snow's a top-five header. I agree and maybe a top two or three Jack Potter. Yep He's on and so you know you're going to get to turn in a lot and for a lot of money. It's just the way it is with cody and you. There was no hesitation. There was I mean. The first thing I saw was red bluff thing and it's a long score I mean typically. You're there might be a few seconds runs throughout the whole Rodeo but it's typically six and seven second round Kinda got bfi type of feel to it and you're cutting it Adam fast and you guys when pretty good right that right Really good win. Good right off the bat place at the broadcast. I think you had a leg and still some back and forth third or fourth third or fourth with a leg and it just was amazing. Was the confidence. I don't advocate. I don't know if it was growing. It was already. They're put in. How how was that like each steer? Did it just kind of builder? Well the the whole time before that way before that Even before I got bub ours was just like man if I if I just get opportunity if I just get the opportunity it'll be my chance you know and I knew that you know when I finally did get great headers or good headers. I didn't want to mess up. I wanted to be you know I wanted to show people who I was and a felt like I was good enough so I remember it like it was. Yesterday we went to Arizona route before Kelly just to kind of break the drive up and wrote out there with Colton and Baylor and the last practice we had tre before we went to get to Loganville. We're in the truck. Leaving the miners house we'd practice all day and Coltman Germany. Were talking about what they thought and like you know what what they were thinking like before. Like what kind of mental game they were. GonNa have out there and I remember calling asked me. What do you think you know what are you? What are you gonNa be thinking about out there? I remember as looking out the window and I said attack the feet. I told myself. I'm not backing down. I'm going to try to do is try to you know every time that stare turns. I WANNA heal them by feet and that's kind of the mode. I felt like I was out there. The whole time was attacked. Feet might get their nominee. I'm going to heal every single steers fast. I can and it. Uh Luckily for me you know it worked out that way. I I got a lot of great opportunities. Meaning Colton one two or three jackpots. At their meeting cody placed at couple of good ones. We placed money every single Rodeo from Logan Dale to Clovis so he played at Loganville Oakdale Red Bluff and one clovis whether it was just around check or average check and to me. That was huge for that was huge. Confidence Booster but I think it was just that mentality of you know. I didn't want myself to be nervous. You know I didn't want myself to be like Gosh. Dang hunter you got a great header. You can't mess up. I didn't WanNa be thinking like that. So like Gatto Colton. That day I was attacked. Defeat us the mode. I was in. Just try to be this big of a beast mode as I could. I guess and at the it's being true to himself right I mean I think that's the thing is you could say act. Got There with Kobe snow. And if you come home and don't want to check and you were just trying to catch up. I mean you probably feel terrible. You don't be someone you're not just like you said if if I was taking them all to the third third or fourth jump just trying to be safe or I just want to catch for cody snow. That probably with North South for me is good just because like you said that's not who you are just like you said being yourself. Yeah I mean I've only seen attack. Defeat is correct because it has I swear to you. It reminds me of Corey. Pets Jake Long. I mean those are the only two healers. I know that will be the big outdoor setups and ride completely around the corner. Just like they would if they had to before flat and then I watch you do it and that was the first year I watched you heal. It was just like that and I was. I was surprised I was surprised. You going down the arena. Moseley may he is. He's up there. Yeah he's upset with like He. It's fun to see because I think that was the month I think in your mind. It was the moment. You're like I can make it. This is what I'm doing for living. I I am now. I I hate to arrive is such a cliche but it was probably the hat. Yeah Okay and you can. I can beat the hell out of these guys. I felt like a big boy. And I'm like you know I had the confidence and the head ability at that time. I guess you could say you put the work and it was your top. He was my time to do good. I guess that's so so cool to see and then from there. Is that when you Kinda of got talking or how that worked is so at Tucson that year Mattingly partner BUBBA DIDN'T WANNA go to Tucson I was living at Colton House and Colton going so I was like heck I might as well right right out there and go and Colton called Matt for me and said Hey you need a partner Tucson said yeah sure do so because Matt was wrong with wordly at the time and Wurley wasn't going to go out there so I went out there and We Placed on in the second round over there and then we won the pre survey. I'm pretty sure roped good and overheard that Matt was wanting to go to Canada and I just told Matt said. Hey you know. My partner doesn't want to go to Canada. I really like to go to Canada and he was you know He. He said Yeah. I'd like to do that but I don't know if I WANNA Rodeo down south that much she's like. I just want to try and make Canadian finals. What that time that was after Houston had like twenty six thousand one or something And I felt like I really needed a Rodeo down here so I kinda talk mad into Rodion down here too which was luckily and And then yet then. Our first Rodeo together was after Tucson Reno didn't practice together nothing went out there and started to start at open man. That's pretty cool. So Roy of Matt. It's it's a little different deal than most your headers. I Matt's we're he's is the funniest header to make us. Think if you look at the numbers. He's taught five Hetero absolutely and feel like sometimes he doesn't get the respect he deserves for being a top five header all time. Yup but then. When money's up he wins every time and so what did you learn what was what was the biggest thing you learned about. Human for Matt Reopen. With Matt was the best thing that's ever happened to me as far as just being around a positive mentally winner every day all summer long there. He's by far month favourite partner. I've ever had just because you know. He walks like he talks. I guess just mentally strong. We're going to win. We're going to do good and then guys just machine. I mean we went to ninety rodeos probably account Canada. He broke two barriers all year long cheese. And that's impressive. But the most impressive part is how many times he was in the barrier. Not Missing it and I bet he missed. Probably seven years eight years all your long gone to that many Rodeos. That was awesome to me. The guy's a stud and even like when we weren't doing good Most of the time it was my fault. You know just being young. At that time. I'd never wrote all year before taking dumb shots. Sometimes maybe you know or or just not not healing professional. Sometimes he would just say you know plenty of chances left. We're GONNA do good. We're GONNA win. You know it never was casting. You know we needed that. One or You know I miss my dally to win the first round at Napa and then I messed my daddy to win the second round in Napa and you know at that time as a head or that's can be frustrating when you get out of the barrier and you do your job to win I and your messes up both times you know but just back to the trailer headed a Salinas. We got this one you know and that helped me a lot because I feel like last year could win either way from me. If I wouldn't for math I think it would went the other way. I don't think I'd have made the the finals and I hate to say that but it's just true a f. We warn probably ten or eleven thousand over the fourth of July. So I had you know close to nearly fifty at that time one and I bet I missed ten steers the next two or three weeks for good money starting to get down on myself. I mean I still knew I was good enough and felt like I was getting off but just honestly couldn't figure out why wouldn't work in. You know just struggling and every time you know Matt same thing. Don't worry about it. Plenty of chances left. We're going to do good. He called somebody's. We'd go rope somewhere you know or we'd go to somebody's house somewhere. It didn't matter where we were at Utah. Colorado Montana. We're going to get it figured out. And then when we go to practice during summer you know you only got your couple good horses with you. Can't run too. Many you know four. We'd rope he'd look at me. You know what are we need to do? What do we need do to get to get this figured out. Come up with a game plan try to execute it slowly but surely you know started slow getting a little better a little better start place a little bit and then I guess a struggle for two weeks and then the third week we won fourteen thousand in one week and it was all because of Matt's attitude our dedication to each other the teamwork trying to work it out together on how to get better. Even though it was my problem you know he was there every step of the way making sure whatever he needed to do for us to win he was. GonNa do it whatever I needed. Help wise mentally physically. You know whether I needed to change some things I was doing. He was he was there to help. And that's without that. I don't think he could win. You know how it is confidence out there starts going down. It's hard. It's Susie because I was thinking about the rugs nab I I forgot about it but I do remember both of them. I believe rains both times all times. Grab Marines Mess Up Madelli Times four. Nothing three eight maybe. Yeah and this is. What's tough about Rodeo? I think is from Reno till the twenty fourth of July. Everyone is portions are working good. Everyone is on point yet. There's eight teams. That are knocking heads with you. Ready to go so those chances to win are not as many Rhett in that time. The Windsor a lot bigger and so- NAMPA rounds or twenty seven hundred. Thirty five hundred dollars a day money. Something like that. Maybe four thousand. Yeah and then I mean that's seven eight thousand right there in twenty four hour. Yup and you're like and then on top of it. It's like when something like that happens. You could see all the sky's falling and to have a header be composed and and then you know you guys. I think we talked about this on the podcast survey with the with Stephen me like how is what two or three weeks without win but then to get through that and then just turn it right back on it just it just adds to that mental suing and that you know. Hey I can miss a steer my partner. Cammisa STEER BOOT. We can turn it around. Yup Yup and I think that's that's a big deal to know that you you can get out of the trap. Yup that like you said your mental strength goes up a hundred times if you get through something like that. It's just is hard the Rodeo and this is not easy it's not for everybody and it is the hardest thing on your mental game that you'll ever go through It's like playing in the world series for three months as what it feels like to me. You know it's a huge deal everywhere. He goes big money. You know people talk about how good the fourth of July and stuff moneywise but really the whole summer. Nearly that good. Three months out of the year you're going to Rodeos pay four five thousand and it's just just realizing that the you know something don't go your way or a lot of it's it's just getting through that and being able to to to keep the same confidence is the hardest part. But you have to. If you'RE GONNA you're gonNA just keep going fallen down worse and worse and worse but that was the best part about matters you know we got this no big deal. There's plenty of other chances. He wasn't panicking wasn't blaming anyone he wants. You know we're going to the next radio we're staying with it. Yeah and you know you not talking about going home and stuff like that. Because you know that that's hard on your partner's mind to if you know that stuff happens but even when you know in all reality he probably was you know because he didn't have that much one at that time because he didn't have his winner in California you know and I'm sure in the back of his mind he was thinking. Gosh Dang if we don't win nothing in the next couple of weeks we GONNA have a chance you know but just not bringing that up is and all that stuff do just mental strength and being a leader like he was. That was great. So what was the steer you heal? Where PONSA ticket? And you realized you've made the finals I don't for me. It was later on. But when people started congratulate me was like a. Kennel went before wall. I think so the week before can away before place placed in the first round of Kennewick and I kinda thought it might be good enough and then at Walla Walla days later Jade Corkwood came up to me and told me congratulations and said he was happy for me proud of me so that helped a little bit but I was still like you know. There's so much money in the heel and this year one I mean I think I was the thirteenth with eighty five thousand. You know there's only two more places to move that can get me out of there. I felt like but when I felt when I felt like you know it's a done deal to me was pl. We one second Pialat this year. Which is a really good Rodeo I felt like that was started. Getting Assad Relief and then we went to the California radios The I can't remember what Rodeo Sore you go to Mona Utah. And then you go to here. Yeah I forgot the ones that are California. It's the very last. Yeah it's going on the same time as like the last week of Omaha Kansas City. All that We placed at the Utah already. Only place to California Rodeo and that punch to take for Matt Because Matt was still on the bubble fourteenth thirteenth could get moved if some guys do good so I'm still nervous for him because I didn't want to go there without him. I WanNa make sure Matt was in and it didn't really hit me until I got home and then it like boom. I just made a far. This is this is crazy. So you know you gotta be. It's gotTa be excited files. I I mean I feel like that's gotta be this huge Siro Leaf or is this a huge amount of weight like stress or both it was. It was a combination of everything for me. When I got home it was just relaxed. Like thank goodness we did it and then I kinda got a little like emotional about it. Like oh my. Gosh. I've been working for this. You know I've dedicated my life to this and I just did it. And so that was that was crazy for me and then you know and then a little bit of stress comes in. Rep for you start getting ready for it. You know like I need be you know. I don't know what to expect. I don't really know what to get ready for how it's going to feel so you start stressing about that stuff. But I had enough friends like Paul those guys and you know what I need to get ready for and what I need to expect and you know they were get about same thing you've been doing all your he'll them steers fast. You can and do do your job. You'RE GONNA YOU'RE GONNA be great so and then when I went to practice for the finals went to Arizona to Matt's house away from everything can own the Lilan felt like so that was that was good practice over and get ready for that and I kind of got settled in once we did that. And then I remember I had two horses saddled. Today you break in steers over there and going down the tunnel the concrete towel. And you don't really know what to expect and walk in there and is just yellow everywhere you know and it's the huge seal in the buck and shoot you've watched on TV your whole life and added Lope off. I started crying. I didn't know how to handle it but I finally got control of myself and Matt Turn The I. I think we're up to eight steers when we broke men and everybody turned felt. Good make good runs and I was pretty calm after that. I never really got nerves or jittered up again. It felt once I realized that it was another Rodeo. It was it was fine so tons of emotion. Tommy Oh man I mean you're decided I'm sure pants down like this. All this got ten steers. I mean it's just a whole different to for an animal right. Yeah I've heard it a few times. I part of guys like hey if you if you break steers in here and it goes bad. Yeah you'RE GONNA. You're stressing all week. But that one's bad. Yeah and what do you do to bring it back in like mentally focused? You have something you kinda go to that kind of helps you when it's stressful or emotional or whatever you're going to like. I said the other day. We're video on you know. I tell myself you know. See Steer. See the feet rope defeat. When I'm in the box and I tried to just make sure I do that at every Rodeo. Make sure I do that at this Rodeo. That way it's kind of like my home base. I don't feel I could see anything different than what it really is. So you know when we when we broke in the steers. I just get in there and take a deep breath. I tell myself that and then we made that. I run just matt heading. I healed him as fast. I could. I felt like I was I felt like like I said just another Rodeo and it felt I felt at home I didn't feel nervous After that it was it. Was this game on from there. Then on how important is having a header that matches your style. Like I feel like you like to go fast. He up so you. It's almost like I feel like Matt. He knew He could he could try to catch more cattle yet. And take maybe less risk yup but turn you more steers. Because he'd know you're GONNA make up for it is that is that something that can come together with the strategy or that you look for with your partners. Yup As as a team I think I think you have to sit down and have that conversation and and practice that every every great team. Whether it's you know team roping or football or basketball they. The great teams know their weaknesses. In there they know what they're gonNA do to to make people overlook that weakness to conquer that weakness or whatever it is so I think that's a that's a huge deal just communication deal of you know whether it's like me. I feel like I really feel more confident. If I'm able to just kind of have my way with them go fast. Set it up fast. I feel better. If you know me and my header can be on the same page. Hey you know if you throw your whole rope and duck in the steer washes out and stuff. My style's a little bit harder that way. Not Saying I can't do it but it's just don't feel like home to me you know so like being Colton have this talk a lot Colton SLACK. You know this year. I'm GonNa try to just get outta barrier. Set it up as good as I can. High percentage wise. And let you do what you want and it feels you know if you can if you can do that with your partner or you can have that talk you know your chances of success to me is is way better rather than just trying to you know not talk about it and just do your own deal you know you can. You could prevent a Lotta struggles throughout the year that you could have. You know 'cause like we were talking earlier you know two or three bad weeks puts you behind a lot. There's so much money out there and stuff that if you can be on top of that and if you can be working on that and practice in that and that's that's probably the best way to go about that you know. Colton has done a great job this winter. He's he's just turned a lot of cows. He's not done nothing crazy. We've made every single short round this winter except for Fort Worth Our goal this winter. Was You know we're GonNa do our job not overdo anything? We're in tried to make every single shore around and that was pretty cool for us to be able to. You know we've made them all except for that one which would like to be in that one but that was that was something we worked on every day. Okay this is what I'm going to get out of the barrier and I'm GONNA turn them. I'm GonNa let you do what you want them. Go fast you know how you like to heal. And it seems to work work way right well. I think that's where it just where things can or the ship could take in water. Yeah but if there's a team that has the not on the same page I mean it can fall apart and it's just like the finals. I mean you probably don't quite know what to do. It's a long week and it's set up where you guys did pretty well and was in a good spot and went into it feeling good and I think that's the big thing is could be real easy to go into that thing and just had you know like oh my gosh it can. It can be very easily done that way panicked and not work. So what is the like if you call one of your old partners like if you called Matt and he said. What is the best thing about rope with you? What do you think you'd say I don't well? He's he's always you know team roping journals. Call them and stuff before. He's I feel like I feel like I was just because the way he was I felt like I was a fed off him being a great partner so it made me be a good partner as far as not throwing any fits not get mad. You know we got this. I feel like just me feeding off him. I felt like made me a better partner for him to just mentally in Just being a good guy basically just kind of happening back. Yeah Yeah I think that's. That's and that's something now you just try to make it a point. Yep and absolutely do you think that's one of the big keys to teams be successful one hundred percent good. Chemistry is as a lot with a Rodeo on to me I've seen I've seen it go the other way for some people in. I've seen you know me not do a good job. I could have not worked out you know so now I try base everything on you know being behind your partner you know and it. It's easy if you know they're working at and they're trying you know it's not like they're trying to mess up and it's not like you're trying to mess up. If is just trying to be the the best partner. He can mentally and helping them mentally. And that's that's very very important to me 'cause like I said it could win either way from last year. You know if I had an apartment that was dogging her dog ears. Like what the Heck's the deal man you gotTa do better. I'm already telling myself that anyways you know. I don't need you to tell me that too so I feel like what I'm saying like it could've win either way but having that mentally strong is going to be. Are you wrote good? I wrote good. We're GONNA win. Don't worry about it. There's plenty of chances that that's huge gift. Man I I gotTA agree The the mental side of exists. Something you study a little bit to the mental game. Yeah I like I like Looking at books and articles and stuff like that you know Michael Jordan stuff. Those guys and I like just observing other great people like to watch the great healers and be around him and Kinda quiz a little bit every now and then on what they think about things or how they not try to be not trying to do too much too where I know him or whatever but I very observant about that stuff. What's been the biggest from peace or thing that you've taken away from either like a great athlete or one of the greatest healers that you've really has maybe changed or apply to your life. I've learned quite a bit from like a Michael. Jordan's trainer wrote a book relentless last year through California while I was driving. I was reading that audio book Just learning that a lot of the stuff that you say that reflects on your competition is stuff. That doesn't even have anything to do with what you're doing. You know like discipline yourself in other areas other than just reopen. Make sure discipline better in rope. And you know like he was talking about how he puts those athletes on a certain diet. A No sugar diet any tells them if you cheat this diet. You're out of my out of my class or whatever you I'm I'm not trying to do and what I got out of. That is basically. He's just learning. They're disciplined seen if they're disciplined enough to actually go through with being great. You know he said there's the three classes of athletes. I can't remember the names of the three of them. There's the good ones the great ones and the monsters basically. Yeah he's got again now the car thing. He calls them cleaners. Yeah cleaners would have been like Kobe. Bryant Dwayne late Yup and the discipline. They had outside of of the gym or their basketball plan. That's what I took from that. You know. Try to discipline myself in other ways outside of open to make my rope and more disciplined. I don't know if that's hard under or from explaining that right or not but I think it totally makes sense so it's like easier to build young man if I get up early and I mean even if I'm tired and I know I will get up. Get up do what I need to take care of my horses. Ya whatever it is Mike. Clean your room care lays claim the whatever. It is like I'm I'M GONNA make it a point to every single day. Clean my stalls raking their pins. You know cleaning out the old hay out of the feeders. This stuff like that to make me a better person which is a building block to making better more disciplined rope and stuff like that easy stuff. The simple that can help you. That's what I took from that book. Just the little things that'll help you achieve great things in my opinion. What do you think about this? I notice it for me a little bit is. I've really tried to pay attention to little details. I I read. A deal was about a hour at their training like a cyclist team. And they're like we would just try to do everything one percent and I got thinking if I like. Make sure my ropes are taking care of one reset better. I know what they're gonNA feel like just every little thing like my time my horses all of it. Just just the little little things and what I noticed is I'll get it does opens like manner. Zona de hop and then when the sun goes down it gets pretty cold but I kind of I was already like I had my ropes. Ready for it. They all felt the same Had just kind of felt like I was prepared. And and those things like that like is that something that you notice it to like a job momentum and it makes it like you're like detail oriented Yup Yup that's like you said it's building blocks to to set up a great a great day or a great summer are great year. You know little things like that just building blocks of of you getting better and better and caring. You know you care if you do good so you took care your ropes. Europe's felt great. You know that that was just that much. Higher percentage of chance you win you know to me. That's the way I look at it but I can remember times when I started studying this kind of stuff and started working at you know to Jackpot not do good and you know. I didn't break my horses maynard and didn't brush him we'll hook you. Don't even care hunter. You know you didn't even take the time to breed your horses main. How'd you expect to win? You know you didn't even care. And that's when I started. You know I did everything you know. Put my saddle. Halawani had my rubber on orangish right Morose feel good. You know Took the time my horse all week. A PRAC- song land needed to to make them work. Good all those little biddy details coming together in one if you don't win then you know it's not because you didn't try no it's not because you didn't put in the effort it's not if it went through that same deal and my saddle horn. Rubber was messed up. My horse wasn't working right My ropes were left out in the sun all day. You know whatever it is and I didn't win then I am going to be mad at myself. I didn't try I didn't go. It's like a losing habit. Compared to winning habit so think about this is a great point. you talk about. Reverend the Saddle Horn. I remember just thinking that the other is working on fixed mine and as I try to make sure that that feels pretty good if you think about it if you heal your head of steering rope slides a few inches whatever and you lose one or two tenths or maybe more as a header. 'cause you bite handle that stereo differently. That's the difference between first and fourth and or it might be the difference between winning check dot and and it might be the difference between going to the next Jackpot and and having to stay home from work and I think when we look at those little details that adds up over over competing sixty five hundred times a year or I even told a guy this one time that man. I don't I don't think those boots do anything. He's ever each boots. I don't think those doing I'm like well. Here's the thing if I look like a. I'm taking care of my horse. That means something to me and if that BOOT is the difference one time throughout my whole life on ahead horse. It's worth one hundred. Fifty dollar pair boots episode him on every single time. I wrote absolutely and and it might be a deal where you don't even like that horse but is someone else that meant. He's taking care of that maintain boots on him because someone might fit that horse and you saw them get you to the next one and it's like those little little details. I think. Make the difference between being successful or wherever you're at to being great And I think that is really what we were. We missed some things especially its competitors as we can let little things slide in it. It adds up. That's like the you know the the gropers you watch them at any. You know whether they're at the Tuesday night jackpot or the NFL. Their horses looked the same. You know nice got them all working good they all look good nice gear on them. You know. They're they're setup win. They're not they're not setting theirselves up for failure. Everything they do. They're not be winners when they saddle their horses. They're going to be winners. When they warm their horses up is just that attitude of win everything you do everything you do in life you. WanNa win it. You know whether it's you know today I'm going to me yard. You know watching. Yeah when people are watching it. It's only natural for it to happen. I think when when it does matter on the fan bigger stages and some people are probably like you know what the heck you know. Just that little stuff like that. I don't matter when you know that's that matters a lot little things coming together. That are gonNA make you win. This is huge. I mean it's just like that like say you put a brand new pair legacy boots on your horse. The white boots and email he really sticks out Yup and then someone asks you you sell that Horse Yup and that might be the difference in finding the next great horse and it's just like those little things you know everything's chain event get happening. Yeah they all kind of feed each other. I agree Will MAN WE'VE BEEN? We've been at it for a while. I got one one last question. What's your biggest fear as roper? Is there something that just fear? You have one as a as a healer my biggest fear that also helps me as not becoming great. I hate that. I don't want that to happen. I don't WanNa become just a guy that made the finals a couple times or I don't want to be a guy that man. I got used to rope really good. That's my biggest fear I don't ever WANNA plateau. I don't ever WANNA fall off which. I know that there's going to be a time when when I'm going to be forgotten or whatever but I wanna be dominant for a long time and I. I want to get to where I'm the best one of the best in the world you know. I don't want to settle for just being a good roper. That's my biggest fear and like I said that's also what helps me to stay driven everyday to to try to be the best? I can be to work as hard as I can that. That's what a use that fear to to help. Drive me right so. I think that's like you look at yourself in the mirror and you know. Hey I'm giving it every day. I'm giving it all got. If there's days you feel like you're cheating cheating yourself. Yep that's all you're doing only cheating yourself through setting yourself up for that fear to become reality basically Did you know how? How many guys have you seen that rope super good and then like you said they just disappear? It's happening all the time So do you think that's something when you're fifty sixty seventy years old? You're open arms pretty much fallen off. Yep you're looking at yourself in the mirror if you can look at yourself in the mirror and say I gave everything I had and I think it to me. It means you can be exactly. Maybe never make the finals again. But if you work at like you are for you no longer want to the desire. You can be happy if I can do that. And get to where you know. I've done all the steps. I needed to do to become who I want to be in and be a great roper and be a great person And then like you said when I'm sixty years old seventy years old where I can't physically compete anymore with with the guys. That are winning. I'd like to help other kids get to that point. You know kids like myself that you don't have you know I wrote Mus atmosphere to begin in. Don't have the tools I necessarily need or whatever a to get kids like that. There's so many people out there that want to be great that that. Just need a little nudge or a little help or a little something to to get to where they need to be to be successful I'd love to help people out like that one when I can't do it no more if I can get someone else there. I'd be happy. How big was that when you were a kid? I didn't want to take you to Wesley. Thorpe's because I didn't want to take someone who didn't want. That was the changing port. That's brandon you know and so I think that's a that's a big thing to understand like I'm out YEP and to make the most out of it and to have that fear understanding that this is what i WanNa do and I want to be as great at it as as I possibly can. Yep 'cause I read something the other day there's it's like two percent of the population actually goes on to be professionals at their childhood dream or whatever and lot of that's just someone not hearing that you know like I heard it. You know I didn't take Moore's just some kind of something that sets a fire and believing in people that tell them. You know you can't do that. You can't be a professional basketball player. Your t shirt or whatever. Just helping people understand that. They don't have to listen to that. They don't have to settle for that. You know you can. You can do anything you want. You just got a bust your butt and you can't but then there's also the group of people that say they want it and then it's like the other way round like I read something of the day. Everybody wants to be a beast until it's time to at least do you know it's if I could help kids or anybody get to that point. That wants it like that. That would be awesome for me and I think that's that's pretty powerful stuff. Do you have any regrets to this? Point ended with your healing went about it. Your do you have any regrets? Starting late would be my biggest regret. Could've worked as hard as I have been last since two thousand thirteen or fourteen or whatever If I could have started when I was ten years old or something that would that would have been. I wish I mind would have been mature enough for that or if I had the the right stuff I knew. Start a wish. I could've started earlier but other than that. Just that's about the only regret. I think I have right now. I think that's what's funny about regrets. And I do think like I mean. I'm sure you've missed some steers money right now. Do you want any of them back or do you think? Do you think those actually help you. So you don't Miss Your again. Or How do you? How do you look at those hot? There's two steers this last year. That really stood out to me I wrote the leg to win. Probably first or second at cody and then the fifth round here at the Finals. A mess estier lost both feet. That one really could have been the difference in you know. Us having a chance to win the world or placing an average that steer was was a very very very important Just factors held my slack up little longer. We'd have been four or five instead of no time. You know just little paying attention to detail on little things that I I lost a little bit of focus right there. I rest it down to the horn caused us to get time. You know just little little paying attention to detail better could have could have been the difference in me. Have a chance at the world the last two nights or you know. That's something that I really wish I'd have done better. And then the spirit cody. I wrote a leg to one first or second you know. That's that's another ten thousand name you know that's goes back to the fifth round stair fat and extra ten thousand that's another better chance at winning the world or or stuff like that so just part of part of learning and getting better. I guess yeah. Do you do try to make sure that those fears that something you set it up to practice for you. Kinda get essentially from from losing. You make you make yourself better. Yep Yeah Bruce. Lee Talks about losing a lot. I've looked at a lot of that guy's quotes and stuff that he said and I I didn't really understand. He said you have to learn how to leave before you win. And I didn't really understand that but now it's when you do lose learning from losing you know like on that situation there you know we'd been roping good we've caught. I she steers. I lose a little bit of focus. Just kind of getting a rhythm caused me to mess him. You know so I learned from that right there you know. It doesn't matter if caught nine out of ten not the. Nf are on the first jump that tenth one. You better be paying attention just as good as you were on the first one. You still have your steps. Yeah don't get in that group of just Wham wham every night right there. That's what I'm doing you know. Pay attention the stairs going down the rain a little bit. I need to hold my slack. I'M GONNA keep both feet and one a check instead of just rope and so that's something I've really took from that man. That's COOL I. It's fun to watch where you're at and I'm proud of you. I think it's pretty cool appreciate that. Also the footage on x factor man. I was really excited about how come out that was by far like I said it was one of our better keeling video shoots just because of just how much you owned up to like this. Is your style. Set it up to see. See all that go into it like it was fun man. I appreciate and get a great outlook on. He'll and so it's appreciate your busy on that. That was fun. Yeah well thanks again thank you thanks again. For listening to this podcast. This is one of my favorite ones with hundred cook. The footage is going ought x-factor Dot Com. He is an amazing healer to watch. He sets things up so well one of the fastest guys in the industry. It would really mean a lot to me support. X. Factor Open DOT COM as well as give a rating and we love to hear feedback from you. So we're trying to give you the best content possible. I really appreciate it thank you.

Joseph Harrison Paul partner Gatto Colton High School Matt cody California Joseph Harrison Europe Vernon polly Canada Billy Bob Brown Hunter Cook Wendy Ryan Matt Sherwood Logan Dale Thorpe Wesley
Mostly Lit Live @ BFI: Get Out

Mostly Lit Podcast

1:14:28 hr | 2 years ago

Mostly Lit Live @ BFI: Get Out

"Derek? I'm ray. Baxter. Another episode all. Nobody. Wow. Wisdom was end j. All right. Let me just think you spice whether you still move on. It's the Michael missing it works. How you guys doing? We'll continue mostly Litz. Energy from you. Litz. So I'm Reid. I'm an I'm Derek I mostly is basically a coach apart cost which talks about books. I'm I'm coach, and obviously and everything else around it. The intersection in between. I'm saying anything else out on the description. No. That's it really rows gonna add something else. Bows Lightner is fine. But yeah, what we record says every week every Mondays make out. Let's start with the show. Cool usually start with a section cooed. What you read on the Hosur week? With a preamble house. You'll be all right. All right. Yeah. Been. Okay. Cool. Derek has been. You, you know. I mean do much home reading reading some great books. Great movies side what she useful. Lucifer? So you can watch Lucifer, but you don't want to watch the Sabrina show on Netflix because Sabrina looks rubbish. It doesn't do the Dimona can handle that stuff. Jews. Nothing to me. Into like, bang Jin end is nothing. So at end of the day to look at look boring. Three good guy should give it a God. I'm so used to like Sabrina the teenage witch which is like. Taking it out that direction as well. I recommend all of you guys. Go watch it. I'm not supposed to by net flicks. But maybe I could be one day. And. Yeah, Alex, okay, fine. I'll tell my weeks. Moist. Actually, what's been great. I've managed to go cinema to what venom. Finally, watched it. Here's the thing. I've been hearing a lot talk venom the plot. Okay. Yeah. So I don't know if you guys know, but there's like the Tom hardy confli as does. And then there's this like sim buyers, and they come together. It's a perfect match. And he's like, you know, he's supposed to be the bad guy in it. And as you guys go through change may be this something in them that might be redeemable. Well, yeah, he's presented as this thing that needs to be on here. Well, he's a bad guy. And then instead of utilize like to see closely, maybe how he tows good all the things that he thinks about things. Trouble him to reach this conclusion of oh, actually, maybe a want to destroy earth. He literally just says, I have changed my mind. And I was like I mean. I lit. I was like what you're you're asking too much of this. Listen, just bring the you've really taken in the marvel stuff. No, I will development is most solely dependable or you can only find cartons in mobile. There's little model that isn't. Universe of very good at doing that kind of. But. Other people can't take on a different kind of intimate. Just a fun. It's just fun. So yeah, that's what I'm saying is fun in Larry is one redeemable thing to any of the item at Novo, but you should stay at the end because it says it's in association with marvel and the end of a movie in mauve will you stay behind. But when it said in association of I was like, okay soul. Occurred. I just stayed Johnny casing links it to the cinematic. Yeah. Nothing anywhere. That's why watch that. I went to watch. I went to to watch the show called the hose. Okay. And it was very traumatic. I don't recommend. But if you do go just have your wits about you. And yeah, I had to go home and listen to Disney films because I was so traumatized. Don't give us any. So it's about things. It's good for what it does. Right. So it's about these three girls he go to Beata, and it's about their relationships and is about. How do you love how they view sex how they you affection and the past traumas, and how they basically do that as young millennial women, and there's a particular character in there who's very like he's going for law, and she basically wants has tried to take her life. And you see her struggle with how she deals with that like in your face. But. Is so much that they balanced off of this huma- that like you can't even process emotion. It just goes from hole and then oh. Let's have sex. And I'm just like I've never what it's so good. It's so powerful, and I really commend the writers for what they've done. But I've never watched something and me. I love towards shit makes cry. I makes me lose my mind. I've never watched something that made me want to leave because it was so uncomfortable. That means it's just powerful. That means it's good. I didn't know very good. No. There is good. But there must also I guess be an element of art. Like there is good. It's not good. You're basically now saying that has to have limits in these to be it needs to tell the truth much truth. Why why why must I watch something that makes me want to get you? Yeah. But that's what I'm saying. Like for me. Anyway, I you maybe would have liked it. Right. I did like it and people not to watch it. 'cause but that, but that I keep recommendations toll time. So I'll tell you Douglas this is rubbish. There's no recommendation. European somebody. What I'm saying? I recommend. No, I said I would recommend you not go to that restaurant because the food is rubbish. And that's what I would recommend you to go to this. Because if you must see cool is up if you go have your wits about you could just say. No. You don't go watch. It. Between don't recommend about Tony. What passed me I really feel free guys out of feeling will extend to the corner. And my friend was like just and I was like. Can street hall streets while I'm saying it was the law like anyway, Alex. We pretty much spent what you know about the Chilean eventually Sabrina on sorry. There's a bit in the whole Xs him, and it moves it moves completely crazy. I just I don't know. There's a whole appreciate ends in there. And God, I'm the underworld. And it just makes it moves. Crazy. I love the. Yeah. What is that keeps telling me? This is the devil moves rubbings. All right. So moving. Yeah. That's what I be basically doing this. We of just writing I'm just trying to keep up with fully reading this. My redon. I'm reading of. Things but Mitch albums new book. He wrote the five people you mean. Mitch books between that crappy premium. Give it to me. Good people you meet in heaven. He's sequel who've been mex- person aren't gonna tell one of the stories of girls like alchemists too. No, there's no. And yeah, any other the top of it. It's very comfortable read, very very interesting reading this book cooled the silent guides, but values oats, and it's basically. He's trying to get you to undo all of the things that. Like that you've kind of learned from childhood and trying to figure out the way that you think. You can kind of process adult, I guess also impart knowledge onto your children if your parents under such. But it's just up just literally memory watching that the devil. Yeah. But yeah, that's. Nice. I'm I saw reading liquidation collectibles that. We were doing today. Sons I smell the. The. And I loved writing I love how it goes from pros to play even the pro style, essentially loved that transition also issues a bleak. And you know, me I just don't like the shit because I'm like why I can just live life. I want to know peak stuff, right? I'd have to use a lot of lots of known the life of the bleak. That's why I'm not saying, I'm I'm in reading I'm reading something. I'm leaving something else. I can live my life and see beach Missa interact with it Mona I'm reading this is something I actively choose to do. So sometimes I'm not in the mood to read people's depression rubbish shit about how shit life is. Sometimes I want something to uplift me. And I think liquidation is it something that is uplifting it. No, okay. What else am I reading? I'm still carrying on with Alexis offices. Jamaican? I love Jamaican today. So I love you. Margarines lie. Top of my business, like mom. Everyone because my love doesn't happen to has no cap and stuff. We asked about those two things I'm reading how what are you reading Derek? I'm into a couple of weeks dipping into called the naked in the dead. One numale dot 'cause I I really I don't haven't really read any kind of postwar novels except for light zone. You haven't read anything something that I'm going to be some of the vote. Yeah. And also different into was accord Kerma ball Garin. Also is basically he's a film TC Swedish filmmaker Comrie rename, but he's in folks Basie about his family. Like a play of his novel is itself like Affleck by schism why reading Hungarian office because you know, I realized like, you know, I was get insulted for reading dead, white males. How you doing where my mind did white male means that what England American house, maybe Russian authors. Why was the difference between that and like a Hungarian offer was well known then it was widely read. So that you'll say reverse that means they should be included in that because they're not white bread divestment to you mean, it doesn't just mean blood. It means it means people who are not why means Ashland flex laxness. You're polite liquidation. It's not a loopholes. I stepped it's not a loophole things about have you ever read an author. He's from Los angels on possible. I have the track to book that's from crane from Ukraine. A catch my bad. Do you know what I mean? So. I reading diversely to me means reading outside of the numeral literary canon outside of the kings of post-war point. What are you guessing for my in terms of what other narratives that are pervaded from people? I get the owner use the seat of a cold fish counting by handled lex. He's actually right Jala laxness. So basically. The book is is trying to do is basically like he's telling the story about, you know, young boy about his keys causing become. Conversation, news Iceland, basically was import more wide liked by the book is the daily life where it was like in Iceland about the fish fish, the people in his house the characters the kind of people that they are the kind of rituals that go through this one guy who dresses in army uniform every single day of every day. But on a particular day is the contradictions in me realizing that I don't know anybody from Iceland. I I have anybody from from Hungary before I mean, so reading these stories to me is reading diversely is it's not just let's let's get some, you know, African American authors in the Umbrian, the I don't I don't think that's mostly about reading of the Australian, and I was reading that. And then I then I found an authoring a common name, but he wrote a book it wanna member pride is Austrian Zindel Oscar Sindhu the schools here. To carry this something when I read books in translation that I always read I'm missing like something about translated books. Our read it, and they'll always be this gap. And I feel like the gap is the things are lost in translation. So I find it really hard to connect. 'cause I'm like all others just something that how'd you know? I know how I'm somebody that has a different language. So I know visit that no, I know I tell you. I know. It's like there's some things that I'm reading and actually. I personally like us a snow bay. Smell by smell Vega donors to like, oh, you have to be done Tena in onion. That's no one saying I'm not saying that you have to read it in the language. I'm saying that I recognize that there is something there is a gap. And I'm not saying that it makes book bad. I'm saying that there is a gap there that I know could be filled with me knowing the language helps find no the language. I think they'll be a magic if turn to translate into English add something to providence of trucks. I always the case, do, you know, a different language. Okay. Well, I've never a. It's never been this something missing. This is something that needs to be added. It's always been this something missing. Even not me missing Bush, just like the breadth of something else. I'll say word in like Sahelian, I'll say I'll try and mimic the word in English. And it's either is too large to small doesn't quite make it past models on to translate the stuff. You do have to take of meeting and shift. Yeah, you have to sit all around should yourself with. I just always feel the gap. I mean, if you don't got imperil problem. But yes, so there's the books read in. So today raid talking about story written by Smith speech in the New Yorker, isn't it basically go to book feel free during his well yesterday's into feel free. She takes on the persona of holiday. I basically it's like an total model. So might be the other day. She goes from what people want for her. We'll take from her hip, Billie holiday's, right? Missile insult telling onto say. Yes. So African American single and she talked about string Fru, what's like form that kind of men she meets the she means and the kind of questions that people ask when they meet her. And I personally I the beginnings of it was kind of like, she news. She's she talks about different. She talked about different holidays to miss holiday. And then be holiday in a day. The I mean, I kind of while I started thinking that. Okay. 'cause when we also we interview that we always Austin the same banal questions. Probably because we think we can't get to person with them. You know? You know, but. Away over seas dismiss and she's really so well, I'm talking about is if the actually wrote this. Really well of reading. I was actually kind of like some about I need to keep remembering that holiday didn't. Write it is just an extract from year eight Smith this. How is this? Yeah. Research eaters like you do. Okay. I thought it was wonderful. And at the end, I was like, I want more. But I don't think so this is actually the best daily Smith bright mainly because I refuse to read Smith because there's always dislike refuse refuse your emotional. Cool. I don't think I am. Okay. It's not even most of there is an author. So well talked about so publicized, but not in a lighthearted way. So every time I he's dismiss I know the topic expand be quite heavy. It's gonna be. Yeah. And I'm not even it might not be. But last best what I seen. That's how it's publicized. She's very serious person. Right. And so every time I'm like, it's eighty Smith is like. And that option actually, usually active you teeth. And so funny is hilarious. I tried to read swing time. That's more serious than what I tried and before the cover so pretty and I'm like why? So geller. It was just too much. I'm as I put it down 'cause I need to get ten pages in and to there's always been this heaviness Davis Smith. So when I read this I went into it like it's gonna be some shit. You know, I just woke up I'm tired, our watch walkways next me cool. She's an action squad still deep as well. So I brought it and I liked the way she writes. It's very pace it has a rhythm. But right like normally she wrote like that to imitate beater on the days tuition. The is. I think I felt that. And I felt it was very contrived. And I don't know whether I like how as in. I'm sure she she'd be ready, and she she did this, and she tried to get in the mind of someone decided it's just right? I mean, and so because it will start contrived I found it very hot to be lost. Like those apart when she talks about she talks about in in the story. She's like all, you know, an I'm the type lady that children love, and I don't even try chiller. Just love me when I'm in the mood. I'm like, I mean, that's not what she said. Okay. Well, just and you know, she somebody that is able to sit down with child and bus Joe can share, you know, and nobody else does that will children aside festival. Have the hell did we get to the section because? Rhyme them, and you know, it was buying them. Tell me how that led to the dog. I said so you're breaking down sections of that. Then like owner, but it will start like, I know. I wasn't listening because she was like. Yeah. Man. Love me. And I don't even know why they do it. No, I'm on come on, our we that to Mason guys are guys. Okay. So you can have your time. But let me have mine. He like, you know, I'm not saying you're what for what? But she basically said, you know, I have like have this thing mentioned love me. I don't even know why. Which is to the point where lovers come in and out, and and then I have like male friends. You know, you're the chicks. I don't have girlfriends and I'm just like. Way would so fun about. So when I was reading this. When I was reading. She was like, yeah. I don't really have gall friends, which was like, I have enough male friends. So that when you know, this guy cheats on me and stuff stuffing. All I only have my cat in my adult in my life. Only dogs are loyal creatures. Got an hour. Firstly expediency hurry that whole section which took about guys thousand elements. It wasn't. She wasn't trying to exhort herself birthing. Secondly, when she's like, she doesn't have many women. She says because she's no longer in that world anymore. John, stan. So basically Hubble out the world where Odin every women she's now being hundred so she's in right for fake, and I still have girlfriend now for goodness sake. Anyway, I'm basically what she says. Okay. She has male friends were basically like and oversee what she's trying to say in to the Rodman. No, she based in my purse, be translate sheath around gaming. I think about that's what she's these men want to sleep with her. But they can't because she has this all wooden snow. She saying I think she's saying she's around game. Okay. Definitely Redick trying to Johnston. I don't be trying to say to them in around her translate. I definitely didn't ask for it was just moolah. She needed that she felt comfortable running. Just because based like if you Dino. Red red kind of experiences experiencing high growing on this intra she felt comfortable man rather than women because women surly time unless Wolfram growing she's a bus. He's bisexual all say why did feel about this was that? There was a series though, was dislike contradiction between how contrived and controlled the writing was. But the the character was not in control at all. It was more, sir. Like, she was talking about is right hazy in terms of your aldermen downstairs gonna they're gonna take me to go and perform bomb. I don't know. I always arrive on time by not ready better staff who I don't know who the guy is. That tells them to take me that all I. Somebody was trying to be missing a such important hall wishes to guys downstairs. Those guys have a stake in her finances the pending. I know that. Oh, she's of Mandela's waiting to meet. These men who are basically in control of her life, and she has absolutely no control of it. Like, the only thing that possibly loves Harris had all essentially time ritual thing. I'm just saying that they will that contradiction. I liked I liked the fiber language was circumscribes Madialata. She was no in control. But it was a good symbiosis bonuses. Yeah. And it was just a bit. I mean, it was okay. I caught that I loved it. Did you go into? But you went into this thinking celebrity bridge. Yeah. You only started on the doesn't do you? Go into every novel being like, this is pretty. That's really accurate description of what happens class. Like this like symbiosis that I quite likes. But it wasn't like incredible Mike, it was among those mentioned something. Combatant? Yes. Go ahead. That means in basically Emmys wherever you're going to say it was a lie or was it was. Why would you like to buy is when she started talking about shrimp fruit? And how when she's given a performance everybody froze our requests, I want you to sing sing Singa as if the person dose songs takes nothing out of her emotionally. I thought I could do books butts. I wrote these songs like nobody awesome me about what it was like when I wrote perform them, and suddenly you're a note that I did of never hit before. And I've son you're not. But you know, I mean those details so it really started making me think that you know, when you know, when we go to concerts stuff, I don't concert. I've never really seen thrown out. Request led that they usually just do what to do in June. I mean interesting that we rethought like we're entitled to it. He said I thought I could do we really do commodified artists musicians. You know, especially after bring this up the way the bay beyond say is so much. It's like you belong. To us you need to album. Now, you need to do this. Now. Forgiving husband. Now, they you can't be forgiven. Jay Z because we don't forgive him. If so that people think that they have comprised over these people, I think it's different in the context of can about India are going up to you and saying oh sing this song. Getting some ways taking the control away from her as not to. That's what I'm saying. Can I say? So you so let me just get this clear. What you're saying is the beehive. The beehive have a stake in bellsa is always saying the way toll is likely own her they own okay. Let me tell you about. Hi. Festival. Beyonce. You don't give a shit us. Okay. We don't see it doesn't care about us. Please. Let me Lund. I saw that you were going to talk down. And most of the times, which is straight because we want music, right? 'cause we like her stuff in music, but built say will do things in earn time. And we'll get an an vacation. But she's posted something on onto on Instagram. And the first thing we'll say is this bitch. Okay. And because we know that she does things in her own time. And we are not like the barbs all the carbs all the navy or whatever like some swifters. I don't know the crazy demonic evil. We do not demand of beyond say, I just want to tell you that. I'm not on. Yeah. We do. We never like. In case just a personal this locker public announcement. If you thought, you know, we do not amount beyond. He does whatever she wants don't say we are in a real like, you know, one sided relationship. You're you're a tame. So this people we are all the same. We are always. Manifesto, please. We have a manifesto. We rate is. Head of the segment was head of a man. Yeah. What I'm saying is the one we do nothing. We are just like you come for us. We come for you. But don't be mad because our energies more than yours. So like, but if you don't call for us, what peaceful people we just want to sit down and join our music. We don't wanna come from everything. That's why this whole barbs and carbs manashian Cardi would just say Coa Fave will never because we know. That's not what we're bell. Do you not feel? We earn PSA. Also does not own us. We are just. Another thing is right when when you read out when you say home. Oh, you said you'll say doesn't care, of course. She sees what people online private girl. Of course. She sees the stumps. People on Frank ocean. Frank with Frank with Frank, and I remember seeing a tweet homeless why do fund feel so entitled that they can beat the entitlement of posy pickers through switches want me, exactly. Because you think that jukebox, you know, that's what it is. It's not a jukebox, it's more. So you're very talented human being, and I would really love to you know, it's like it's like when my favorite author like hasn't released the book, I'm not mind. I'll be so excited if comes out, and if it comes out on the preorder that why don't you just wait for it? But why do I wide to why should I not talk? Because what you mean? I think you're telling me about the album, I have a choice if the thing is I can talk you'll say miss not just give shares. It doesn't. It's not. She can listen on what you've said. Whether she's listening on she's hunted, and it will affect her in a way, you may not even know. About you can listen on. It's like you're saying one. Anything you go through in life. I don't think it's an entitlement entitlement will be like. So if she doesn't release an album this I'm gonna do to her. That's not. That's not what I that's. So what about so how much do you think takes out from takes from your with regards to talking about we as done, obviously, the commanding she the money that she sings straight for. Yeah. Which is quite painful. So and let you know, she's just. Here. They just come into the ice to just make these honesty. Think how can we change us consumers? I think visit jazz is different who is racist. That was well, yeah, it was also jazz different. There's a lot of emotional labor that goes into constructed jazz rhythm judge reading, of course, the the closer. How how would you mean? Of course. So in terms of the raise -ment ways almost playing the sax phasing that just like a song. No, no, also different oval to offer nine just told me now, the differences one how to sing it why the it whether singing to this fighting that like every top AMIS was not because you can make bring puck zone can sing five times a week, but listening to strange fruit of Khushi causing that five is really a motive. What you're talking about is real life is political is emotionally draining. The singing in a way where people will relate to it Jonah. Stan that's. That's what that's what makes the difference between particular offices. They sing so sons in particular qualities conscious singers conscious win on your Westwood mammographies. Mom died completely different performance to win. He sang on why? Because the situation was different the motion put into it was completely different. So the song became different Johnson. Does everything's on cost. She did once when she was she was pregnant, so she would it. So she would enjoy it. I haven't had it actually kinda something maybe. Mushrooms number people get the money, and that she saw him on that because they don't the age where she's like in a restaurant performing club, and we're like be pleased. Superstardom? It made me think wonder what albums of listen to where the artists has put some albums are just the most of their own emotionally charged. But anything also wish sung is really kind of taken a lot out the artists, you know, for them to put us onto arranging instruments. Join being the lyrics, the everything I remember watching Germain depre- to about when he was doing when put together confessions, and it was like when you perform burn he stripped completely naked and go into and perform burn, and you lose swing serious accessible the preset. That's what we said. I mean, so it's kind of wild. So to to Rica. Burn burn. Oh, so powerful song rhythm on. And we ask you to read to literally have to re like, for example, if it's too much to route to relieve your trauma every single time you performed at Troon. He's is is separate murders. Ma. Do you know what I mean? It's like so you can kind of put the same to poets. Yes. You can. A lot. On the line is going to be different from what perjury is something. It's just very topsy Taibbi me. I don't think I could ever get used to play. 'cause just not. I don't know the coalition because it's usually people who are really into civil gunfire. All you Percy Shelley these kind of poets I don't like for poetry. All sounds the same to me. Yeah. No, it's more. So I guess I can hand embarrassment if they fuck up and so like the every time I'm watching spec. Unwed poaching? I'm thinking. Guys. Like they're gonna forget there wasn't like. Oh, sorry Olin. I still forget to remember. And I love second hand embarrassment. Yeah. And so every time I'm watching it. I'm thinking, please don't mess up. One just think take time up fast. Visually support the ice because embarrassing and they have to. Got. And I'm just like. Now inside I'm like, yeah. You've got this. But really, I would I would I would hate to be you in this time. Did I mean? So that's the one thing that I'm like apprentice apps Beckham, wet part. I'm just it's this law man, if you mess up is peak for unit. So. Yeah, no snow, of course, not hundred Artis. You guys read that it's on the New York. Okay. Okay. Freese ago. Audio versions wasn't on the New Yorkers autobuilders bills plates in labor of audio two as you read while you, do you. Tasks that get some other my my favorite time now guy also most guys got mostly flakes. It's not just a noble nicely. Excited about Lance notes. He ain't broke. My is different. Okay. So mostly flex this episode guys. We are discussing get out hands out who seen it. If you haven't. Wow. You're gonna see clips over now. So we all what stats and I watched again this morning, but just before we kind of die dissect just a general like, how did you find the film, Derrick? Okay. Listers quick quick. I fought a film over it. I've race it was over. I saw people were really imposing on things that is just kind of good commonly. This is this is so obvious, and you're going on like you have to be some Ricca movie fans, they act like there's so many hidden messages in the cartoonists feeling you know, what I mean? Feeling you know, what I mean? So yeah, I really really enjoy it. I mean, I enjoyed it. I am to experience of what a lot of people in the cinema. That's what enrich the experience for me. One thing if I was watching a hold on myself. Respite all over. Okay. Colton alex. How did you find out? Get out was. A trip come on edge. Call for three days after which net. I guess the best the best onto which is when you immigrant. Cinema in. I mean, do you think it was William? Yeah. There was some reenact is in that does bring together a lot of serious points about race in America. Yeah. Like four today. He has in twenty eight teen. Interesting relationships liberal liberalism for cats, at least retargeting or different things. I think there was a lot. There is a lot of dissect in the throw there were too many. I think he put those in-intentionally like he was trying to be over there. Like if it's explicit. Yeah. It was scary. As. I quite enjoy day. And there was definite scary moments. I loved watching integrate because obviously the racial tension in the film can be really seen in the in the cinema. So like when they're like, some funny parts, and you see maybe a white person laughing in your life. Or like something happened and was at the end there is that police scene and man's just you know, stabbed this woman. And then and then you just hear the police in the host cinema just grown that will. And if just something as simple as that will make you really every industries just they will while to the film in some way or another. There's no way to clears American accent wasn't too bad. Actually. Yeah. I was very convinced and that goal rose. She's a monster. So what I did we are going to play guys a few clips that we will discuss. And please feel free to talk about it during be shy. And otherwise, we will pick on you guys. So case like offer yourselves up get involved. It's going to be fun discussions. Can we please have the fast clip? Please. Good, brother. Yes. Course it is. Something. Until amita. And and you are. Chris rose boyfriend. Just to lovely couple. Where are my manners? Logan, Logan, kin. Chris was just telling me much more comfortable with my being. That's nice. To turn away. Win ask him about. Well, it was nice to meet you Chris. Hey, thank you. Recognize that. Crazy. I wanna I wanna ask the audience question about kind of like black expectation for when you go to go to work or something. And they'll think another black person that you expect them to be to be down. And then the down. Very pets. Yeah. Yes. I wanted to ask anybody experienced. And if you have how did you kind of work around it? We have a. We have a very Mike as well. So even though you here it's going to pick it up for recording. I know. Do you have you guys ever experienced another black person in the office who hasn't been with it? The bachelor I've been a white person going up to yellow person a different way. Equal. Defec- tuna stand up. So he can see you. Sorry. Seriously, employees. I miss you. It's. Just in. Just the joke, and they just will tend to me, but. But. Kurds with sometimes credited that. At the same time. He punches. Yeah. We don't wanna know quite find even. Right. No. Having. His white. Yeah. This decided that people Clough. Yeah. Sorry. I'm so not coming gauge. Yeah. Say Masha, this is an intention to see. I'm not to say that I have. Thinking time with people are loved very real ause from what I was excetera. So when they. Yeah. Not respond to do not feel like maybe your limiting your ability to relate of people thinking that do you think that because you putting comedies these people do not mean, no even to combine Orage by the same time. I can read a novel about somebody who's, you know, middle cross in Russia and relate to them in some ways, they might go through some things. And I'm just kind of y'all know how you feel. So I could have a conversation with that person. If I've met them because I know that I mean, there is kind of like the ship humanity when it comes to something that's not to say that racism important is. Yeah. But underlying thing so I think sometimes me personally as well. When I'm at work and stuff like that. I saw punching thing I'm just not gonna have anything in common. These people never had a conversation of and then one person surprises me in the least common wimp because my dog 'cause my friend. Immoral. People. Age is a big feature. When they do as well when these probably. No. Yeah. Racist factor. His age area a central. I'm saying. Thing. That. Yeah. Yeah. To. Say pay. I must hang out sometimes. I wanna go there. Yeah. I find that. Thank you. Thank you. I found the somebody else. I've I've found that. For example, this week. There is though is obviously this partner and like that woman stuff. And I was like, yes. You know, it's gonna be died. Like, she's, you know, mental me blow, blah. But. It wasn't a natural like another black woman, and there may be bit higher than you just expect them to take them onto your wing to protect you to shield you. But sometimes that's not how it site because it's a doggy Doug weld. And so you just have to. So sometimes I for me, I've had to understand that you know, what? Sometimes you don't end like some people just enter the workplace trying to be your friend regardless of of the race that you are. And also, I think race plays a part. But I think class is like one of the biggest things at walk because a lot of times I'm not myself because they're talking about skiing in the south of France every December, oh, it's going to be so different this year. And I'm like, I've never skied in my life. Like, I don't even kind of an ice skate properly. Every time I go always walk around the barriers. I mean, and so when all like when that conversation happens a lot I talked about this my goals when let's a group of black girls. And we're having our conversation about something black. I don't know what it is and hip hop or something crazy. A white person comes in all of a sudden we'll stop talking about what we're talking about two that we can be more inclusive. And so that they feel comfortable in conversation. But when I've entered that conversation in talking about war peace, and I have watched it and I'm Ben looking by blacks face. They don't I have not seen them try and change the conversation. So they can be inclusive. So this is the thing that I think a lot of companies don't stand you can get so many black people in by fatal feel a part of the company begging to leave and it's going to have so much drop house because to be diverse is to be able to be inclusive in that mentality means to go not just like higher up in needs to be everybody in in in whatever company, you're working in so that. Yeah. That's why I think is quite. We have a little hold on through to do. Muslim. Second clip, please. Courts. Kidney call Dane, man. How are you? Spreads. On. Those fun. We are headed here. Yeah. Here it just south. Came out of nowhere. We got a pretty good. Muster to six reckon weird. What I say say one down a couple of thousand ago. I mean, get on my high horse, but I'm telling you, I do not like the deer. I'm sick of it. They're taking over there like rats. They're destroying the eco system. I see a dead deer on the side of the road of the myself. That's a start. I don't even understand that. What I am Rachel for what you've done to at all like. Got that. Yeah. So doubt. How long is this thing? The sleigh. Four months. Four months. Dry. Get used to say that. Pleased. I'm sorry. Oh, yeah. I'm sorry. She's right. Exhausting. Tour. I impact before the tour. Mris office should takes appointments in that, right? Plus, I k turns out people up here. Just as messed up in the city's Jeremy Rosal brother areas stories. Yeah. This have he's studying medicine. We just like a little now. Cool. Pretty emma. I'm a traveler, and I can't help but I keep bringing souvenirs back. It's such a privilege failed experience. Another person's culture. This might my dad's claim to fame was being a Jesse Owens qualifying round for the Berlin Olympics nineteen thirty six one's owns one from him. What mama. A moment. What mama at work. So there with perfect Aaron race bullshit. Black to comes along proven wrong front entire world. Kind of. Seal black mold down there. My mother loved her kitchens. So we keep a piece of her. Georgina. This is Chris is Rose's boyfriend. The garage goes under the Sankt now for the Peacedale stone. The field of play. The nearest house is across the lake. Total press. What? White family black servants total cliche wasn't ticket there while you didn't after blaming. We hired Georgina on Walter to health care for my parents died. I couldn't bear to let him go. Boy. The way looks. Yeah. Know. By the way, I would have voted for Obama for third term if I could best president my lifetime handstand. I agree. K liberalism. I want to. One of the first question of the room and just going on raise point where you know us like when you know complacent work can do join in. They don't change the compensation. I feel like if I won't talk to a group of of what people talking, and then they changed as compensation to something that they think the I would relate to and then start talking about bomber. I'll be equally as offense as if they did do you know what I mean? So. That's what I mean. Mm. Yeah. Because when like, I don't know why people join the conversation. I don't start talking about Stalin or like auditors somebody like I dunno. Somebody like white who I'm not settled that Trump. Okay. An example for the win win win your friends when someone comes onto it will be like a seamless. See somebody's uncomfortable living uncomfortable. See someone doesn't understand so one. I'll be also this is what we're talking about. And then I'll be like, oh, I've never been and then they'll start talking to. But then because they know that I'm standing cut me even about loving rappers come over. I I took my love and hip on. How do you explain it to them and say, I'm into the conversation? I will say I'm talking about love and hip hop. This have you seen like these TV dramas like Kim, Kim kadarshian, but with white people. Treasure. No. Lanta hokum position to the sayings say that I'm stuttered. You got enough to be like, this is what? The me overseas taking to his, you know. Screamed ISIS bizarre my opinion. That's a dumb compensation really could have been times less firms on is so weird 'cause I actually do this as well a to run. So when I started working out penguin, those people I was only guy dead haven't compensation and his interested. He said that crosses the wrinkles Gilda shoes. Choose telling me, I'm working wrong. And then. Not randomly, and she starts working about like, Jay Haas flimsy in. What is going to solve an I four K to the Smiths and Morrissey, I mean because I'm trying to trying to outdo her. I wanna. Exactly kind of just like I will point. Do we say these are the things that are coming to Voss? But then not distinct by race, John and it won't make any kind of miss. I to one of those things, I don't know. Well, I think needs to be important is that needs to be that dialogue. So that if you see somebody does not know what you're talking about. Explain it to them talks about a lot of the times. All you need is inclusion. Also, what do you think about this? I'll say, oh, I don't know. Oh, okay. Let me tell you. So it's very easy. Just it just don't have to do it because it's very easy. If it's a common thing, it's what you do around question. We have a Mike because that we can have it. All okay here. It's just basically around you guys were saying, and I find it very interesting, the anxiety and the preoccupation with including white people and whiteness, and I just it's just a very funny compensation to hear like if you you know, if you gravitate toward other black people why is there an itty about it? Why can you not be a punch ethic about unapologetic about that? And just go two ways. He something in common. Why do you really care about what up why people today care about that one day go in tools, the people that they gravitate towards and it might be at your exclusion? You know? So I just feel like it's not just a bit moot point. Like, I why do you think people can because one we are not a majority, sir. Just because I told you what what you're saying. But. I think people care because you are noticed one black woman amongst field of why faces with a way you go. You are seen. So I think the exiled comes from you thinking, or should would they think that I'm not being you know, so should enough because I'm only gravitating towards black people. You think it like even though for example, where I'm like have a resold foundation of black girls who I literally hang around with every single day. I have no business hanging out. Anybody else to why can leave and hang out with my friends? However, we have had that conversation of ood e think that maybe and then yet, but who cares as you say, but that conversation law people have it and a lot of times, you feel it, and it's just it's the confidence of getting to that stage of actually I can gravitate who I wanted. People don't have that confidence. Anything other just reached the stage with the moose environments where I just. K anymore because I've been so used to being the anyone even ambitiously when there are other people in those environments that Dennis early. Honestly, inviting or take thing so you just become quite like not reclusive. We just indifferent tool. Yeah. I just do you do that Giovinco? Question to have to stem. Not cool. Yeah. We can see. Think I think some of the combine? Are in or extremes who? Yeah, I think the clouds poisonings nothing that you have friends. Sale. So I think it's like a an obligation to make people feel comfortable with the head. Or or small walk on a response by Tom's of the previous seems to me is too scary scene in Ville because it's not word between funding scaring, a bunch of people went into talk to you because they've seen what? And who they wanna do is remind you that black of tool can choose about like, you know, where your camera initial enough the point it's not really about. It's not really about of picking Toby our into train station and Wackle a white guy said to me in this into doubly. That's that's the genome about like, how did you get head stage? I mean to you need help those are the things we're talking about think about. Starred in all was so why talk the dangerous and slippery slope. News gonna offend everyone. Every good reason Kalfa knees sick loonies puffy. Before in between funny and scared this. How'd you make people feel uncomfortable on the inside? Yeah. Someone say just the next. Two. Kinda shakes you up about you. Jacci rattled. That's really the point the import. Three. Yeah. All right. You play clip three. We have three. Thank you. The bass trumpet. Are impair somewhere finding. Give. Now can never find this. Can start the car. Anyone like t-? I'm good. We leave actually. Something wrong. His dog got really sick. So he has the vet first thing. Terry. Pro skis. Pros. Purpose. Chris. What? In life. What is your purpose? Right now. Finding those keys. Flesh of our own mortality borne with breeze. Rose. Given the sun will die someday. We are divine. Gods trapped in. Grows. Rose. Jeez. Careful. He's rose. You know, I can't get a case repair. This rose have right? Well, watch this. And I watched it the second time, I was like the passan who is actually the devil in this film is verse. She's a really great actress though, because the whole time I was like, no I thought coming when we remember just before the scene he's in the cupboard and seeing the photos of all the people that she's entrapped with her devil ISM. And so what I fold that? That's when I was like does not something right here with this. And is is switch because she's over to the end until he's broken as rows completely Beckham. Yeah them and that's been phenomenal. Just a question to ask actually regarded interracial relationships. Osteo if anybody's been in one have you ever felt trapped in the other person's culture you ever felt like you couldn't actually be who you are of your portal splendor kind of thing off that push to anyone. Anyone was to tell the truth. You know? About someone there. Mike is just as the mind. Okay. Fantastic here cursor. Council entrust, especially when you visit a country at the opening on Oaklawn into Hayes on it. Ame. No, where are you doing this because of the recording? Yeah. Philippine ago anthem Colombian and on pack to habits. Yeah. From the Philippines, and we're very affectionate. Lesson. American people, very affectionate, very. Yeah. Yeah. It was it was a total coach shelter me with the will. But the same Spanish. Yeah. Sense. This won't. So you can feel really place did you feel towards her family family? Yeah. It was a show because they'll be they'll be warmer. Yeah. About point. Did you? It wasn't just a family. It was just. Yeah. Yeah. You just people in town. Yeah. Maybe I mean when I was dead. I used to call me like nesting, which which meant like the the coal for Dr. I don't know. It was like. Oh, maybe. Could have been intimidation because they they've maybe before that they had to speak to me well too. But then I played should you? I guess impose Bill your culture and get woman was ordered or just accept how they are. Shied away from who I am believing was a thing. Has he was saying when you just when you have pasta bit really wanna dependable? Because, you know, the differences anymore as you said, you're looking to work on a human. Yeah. 'cause we will coaches have same experiences ups and downs. We relate to that. Yeah. So that when you when you when you meet people, and you can focus on when you can speak about those things does no of all your your wife or your major is hard to relate in that sense. Just like, I don't know. I think the hot chick comes from. I guess of the people's other people's ideas of you to a union because you can be so cool if someone by level, but I guess when you have families and cultures and people in town, and that imposing these ideals into you'll do different cultures that could be quite hard to do with as a couple. I guess. Yeah. I mean, I'll agree can extend. What you're saying? But. The best way for me was like he would you say that food is well like, for example, like my ex girlfriend. Ex-girlfriend's? She let she loves all offered and don's from the and that side of it. So she talks family about what she's to about. What would intrigue sense is? He. Vessel. That's able to push it up aerial mobile. This new. Yeah. That'd be with absorb which is. Became you. You guys came week where we will. Yeah. The list villa last clip. Four three. Okay. I I do wanna hear another perspective on the the about feeling trapped in another person's coach when data interracially. And nobody wanna share like that. Nobody wants to maybe you can. This room. Don't worry. The we got a question we got something at the back of the. Yeah. The fathers who. Just quickly because you're in about into relational relationships about. Like your own culture. Do you ever feel that you'll be in forced into your own culture? So for instance, I'm from Niger Ambrish bowl, my parents from Niger and sometimes like, my cousins tell you I like to embrace some parts of my coach, but not all of that. Because I believe that. I believe in this thing could blend culture now said in this day and age, you can have a blended culture. So I listen to all types of music limit myself. I like to try out new of different cultures, etc. So when my aunties and stuff see me, they call. Why don't you do this just manager gal when you get married? You're gonna do that. Really? Sometimes you can get trapped into your own culture, which is and the product of that is Trump in someone else into your culture because you already are so trapped into your culture, you're forcing someone else to be trapped into your culture. So I like sometimes it's not necessarily about into relational relationships. But also your relationship with yourself and your own culture as well. His you don't wanna be the person trapping someone else. So how do we stop that? In terms of. I mean, I love my culture. I love it. I love Nigerina love at a love about it. But there's just certain things within the culture where I'm just got. Yeah. You are going to have to leave that dog because I'm not with at compressing. It's probably to do with how you've experienced your coacher. Right. If there's parts that you've completely had a negative experience about go to Sean lose sides of you. I guess I don't know. I thrill that's probably one one aspect too. I mean, I think us being like. British. You know, we've had comfortable we have to accept like what what you're saying. Is that there's a melting of cultures. You have to be open. I mean, you can't be insolent being black pressure. I mean, it doesn't make any sense. 'cause you go to the ends. There's you know, people does does Bangladeshi. There's this on is gone is Nigerian this is Irish them joining English solo so many things you know, what I mean. So and you have to you, do you do take from those those certain things, do you know, what I mean like, and you do some even subconscious. I mean like it went I'm talking to someone in his like, if they they say, I'm gonna say all do for the Copan do I mean, it's like where did I get up from? Do you understand things? Like, you get you, you bracing, you take and you borrow in. Then you become brackish. Do you understand me? I think that a lot of things with regards to like conflicts of identity arise from. I mean. I can speak pass me. But it's not even that you are acting yourself. It's more soda. What your parents? And your care givers have told you to constrict yourself within and as much as you don't want to be insular. And there is like so many people around you. It can be very easy to be entrapped in one one way of thinking because that is what somebody has told you is the right way of living your life. And I think you can have so many different like the world is sort of different people. But how is it that we can only see one way, and we have say much like conflicts with other people who are different too often have differences. And so I think that one therapy girl idea. That you need to look inside yourself and sit down and think, okay. What do I like about this particular culture in this particular way of living? What I like about it, and is absolutely fine to pick and and put to rest other things and make something unique to you is healthy for you. Because. Otherwise, you just gonna kill yourself today. I mean, I think the bad thing about the Daf Berg identity is like your trading. This these two like tectonic plates in you're in the middle and they're shifting and if like you're losing your way, but I think there's also beauty in that only if you have the freedom if you have the freedom to pick and choose that, it's amazing, but you need to find freedom for yourself because you can't allow people to tell you that this is the right way, you have to accept this way of life. The good the bad the ugly. No, I'm good with just the good like ugly came come from somewhere else. Our that create if you have the freedom to I think it's important for you think of times to create that vice about about that dot is. Dot is very high kind of thing that when you take something that's good from a cultural. Conversely, I mean, the the opposite end of that thing things could could end up being battery anymore questions. We come to the end. Yes. Thank you so much come in. Thank somebody coming. Make sure you of scribe write your gear on our toons anyway costs where on every Monday.

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Truth And Movies: A British cinema special

Truth and Movies: A Little White Lies Podcast

51:20 min | 1 year ago

Truth And Movies: A British cinema special

"The truth and movies were committed to helping you discover more great films which is why we've teamed up with a b i find something and exclusive membership deal as it listen that's treason movies you get five pounds of years membership when he joined the b side by such festival august twenty nine teen years was amazing cinema just those two pounds joined today and you'll also enjoy party bucking the best by linden film festival in partnership with american express as well this free tickets the five south bank special members events discounts with their show on kfi class so whether you're canes explore the nineties these young cinema rebel season the golden age of mexican cinema or the upcoming monty python season now is the perfect time to join simply enter the code t amazon am at ww dot org dot uk slash member office today when a very special episode of treats and movies were diving into the little white lies list of one hundred mold breaking british movies they changed the highlights and insights mcdonald's industry x but coming up on trees in movies of what lies podcast welcome podcast listeners is michael leader here in the house chesting girls from a really great selection of guests today we have as the david jenkins later life fame we also have will file a film optimist and correct to the best women's cheese also prompted the buddies beneath and investigation into the flip side of british film and television will welcome the and also rohan what's film program manager at a discount so industry program and limit film festival around consultant industry veteran who's works on every stage of the soft making process pound uk film over the years running welcome hi so first of all we're gonna dive into the top one hundred shortly but first david tell us why we hit them from behind the less tosa thinking for this issue of the magazine we what we tend to have a film on the cover and within they print edition the editorial is kind of some directly about the film but some of inspired by what the film is doing or saying or what type of film is so you kind of a little cup launch on what direction you take it and the film we're gonna cover is called the souvenir by joined the hulk so this one's coming at the end of august and it does on us when combined in comeback and it's a kind of autobiographical film and john hogue is just someone who is she someone who makes the film's she wants to make and there's something inherit any interesting about and i think it goes asking this question about what is the british all house what would that look like do we have a tradition of film in the uk where we have directors who are able to have some semblance of freedom them and creativity and making what isn't of jerry bill for multiplexes also mass public consumption will quit films films that have very very small audience maybe it's just the political left off in the political left very reticent political right i think and it kind of took us on this journey of trying to look at who have been the real innovators i guess the films we included on the list and they end a just added his chronological lists the kind of covers over a century of film and we were trying to lift the things that will myself bumped off in many ways i think the the main criteria sparking of many way or is it kind of complete one off in his i'm right some directors people like pizza green away all their job and made tons of films that would have who worked on this list we also limited to one film director said we were trying to pick something with representative of past no cannons as well and yeah that was that was kind of how the list arise in like i think it's a mixture of of quiet skill things that we've kind of dug up and research and found a new fresh selves and so slightly more kind of mainstream crossover things the show you know new talent people willing to to to take existing fool mets in new directions so that's kind of where it comes from really so many teams in threads arising indie ready i mean we we've got the die strike since the last time we absolutely well what jumps out even listening films just sort of general summation i was really struck by in the past having looked kind of a space more kind of classic he taught for best on drew brees from lexus many those kind of tied to a device and melia and the most the context in which they say are in relation to each other that makes sense so you saying like get caught a number of michael cain films with commando they speak to each other within the context of that canon wires it will be interesting to me looking at this list is there's all these different context they spoke we don't necessarily talk to each other that much so you could almost get quite lost in this and i you know i've seen a reason why these films 'cause it's from seattle so sykes on a par at the fbi but you know i found my brain so fizzing with this box just by put these things together so i found that cossio tantalizing saying by looking at the last april and with that in mind in in many ways that lots of things so we jumped out that i have for don't tell me the incident this thing of like yeah whatever happened to the british shop they say when when it's still program now that you mentioned pizza green why and derrick johnson and then i'm pat saudi posters while you could include in the day off filmmakers who came of age in the nineteen nineties when and there were cross size of that kind of are they so that being this kind of more of a leftist more valley underground type of protests going through the nineteen seventies which was maybe kind of move radical in certain respects and unconnected to take the audience and then that i still being last night at that time gradually freely nice nice why things change new audiences change much maybe if flipping point between nearly actress and they're like i taste but boston you say that you know my my own she knows who died chaman and as i'm saying she where she i mean she might not preschool anyways appropriateness less that says somehow because he was on television some us you guys mexican such good speaker say i just kind of crossover and paul and who is responding well to the times in which he was working but do you have a particular anyway i remember as a k it's my friend's dad who was in the place previously and they all they he had a complete bullshit like runs say it's the the face his wife and his love a and i remember he had some recapitalize say but he you know he had some like five terrible news on the top shelf and his like so it's kind of some kind of sexy film or like this is like an i tell all saying this collision of like eroticism and being so addo so sophisticated it is well they sing sing to hover around that and i think the tight to be helped set of course there because it sounds kind of salacious and since ational lewis is a this is this film and then i kind of discovered prescreen on much light to weigh in america apartment it's money from k and someone put this program on in his seventies short sweet you is making almost in his spare time when he wasn't the central office of information i know i find that very inspiring 'cause i have no access their number one nothing and i just so many around the nation and telling these unusual stories with austin just stopped accomplish the things and he's he's similarly american george shot who seemed like incredible in the hague kids used by minimal maine's incredibly side very rich contacts and stories and for me that she is best friends i think that when it's like teaser class legit france i outcome in like they are much so is everybody instinct kind of joined these two universes together a guy by that point yeah there's some like tiny tastes maybe some nice these i guess like maybe orlando pie suddenly porto is another so because that was written about in vogue magazine so you've got this point right so much like sexy and stylish tomatoes kind of films which is quite a different times in the nineteen seventies and i almost one was a sense of style comparing the kind of came in almost made it more difficult for the filmmakers by getting coverage and things by other films then has to play to the level so i almost wonder whether that was just kind of really fascinating moment of course you have a contact also made it difficult path through other filmmakers to sustain that type of filmmaking and that's you know some of the people go big budgets and the context i feel like that's that's quite a law that greenway from those kind of an interesting pass each way of looking at stuff so so that was that's one thing that you know when he was much was set for three this lesson indifferent wise i got time to mention another film i said maybe come back come back they like what's your first film these the gyms happy this is a film that i discovered through as you're eating a piece in sight and sound which is connected to its recent reissue it's a film called night cleaners mold the night clean is is sometimes called made by the backstreet film collective tyson experiment documentary documentary from nineteen seventy five and it's kind of i guess riffing off like i think another thing about this list but we've kind of looked at and i guess it's meant to be a kind of current is how british film connects to european film as well i think there is meant to be so subtle i'm not saying this is kind of like anti brexit list of anything but i think the rudy is kind of on the current of how british film it's been inspired by year end the night clean is is something that feels very inspired by chris marker in johnny got a there's this amazing film about it is what it is about what it's about it's about clean is working in an office blog who will do shifts during the day in various jobs and then through the night when he office workers have left the building they will scrub the toilets and they'll clean the tables and they will essentially not sleep so they can provide for their families and the first half of the film is kind of focused on interviews and you see see these scenes of of cleaning it social on his very very kind of low great black and white film the kind of gives it almost kind of nightmarish hora vibe and then the second part of the film it kind of shift into two attempts spy feminists union groups to unionize the the night cleaners and they've conversations the cutter and it ends up being a film about these two worlds colliding of like political power and these working class shift workers who you know very kind of scraping by don't really have any interest in political empowerment and it ends up being a film about how could you make people interested in their own insults wide ramifications their own lies and their own professional success and it's fascinating as a film that you could spin see as a left wing film in is about the feminist movement and it's about unions and it's about how they worked but he's not politically is not a film the is kind of putting forward and agenda is not pro and con anything it's not like a kind of can trim where it's like this is you know this is what i believe and i'm gonna tell you that over and over again it's about the politics is about the kind of the tensions sion's between these two worlds and it's been amazing film and it has this kind of obvious that dictate where you've got these long blank opposes between the sequences you could see the ends of the reels and things like that like a lot of little kind of aesthetic choices being made maybe nudge this into a more kind of altea demain is a film that you think while the field so relevant and you know should be more famous in is wow we were getting a sense already depressive this list where we going next round well well i suppose initially just some thoughts on the left in general i think it's really really fascinating collection of films and i love the idea is you said david of positioning uk cinema within a wider european tradition and i love the fact is he said well you don't find find films like it cost her on that or i think there's one pound impressed by that but it's not it's creating this attentive cannon if british films have passed delighted to see there is a distinct from that door movies film i mean i have to say i find it proceed pendant lightly unwatchable thoughts in terms of the impact that someone like normally has had on no say much cinema cannon but suddenly on the way we think and talk about the cinematic cannon and suddenly the way we sort of writes about films and she established with that essay visual pressured narrative cinemark the very notion of a male gaze which went on sort of establish an e r e m five tile strain of feminist film criticism as i say i do find the film's tedious tedious and as it turns out when she sort of went to the tune of heroin series in the entire practice yeah it's west seeing interesting sort of cultural artifacts spots it's pretty tedious one give me give me the counter argument since about nineteen spanks instead they both have reputations of being difficult films and not clean his words so received way the farewell message by union why now is the sense of like who is this film for 'cause it's no that wasn't the campaigning film it something else i think so i think it is difficult i'm not gonna pretend it is and and one of the challenging but it's about as it has points were has taxed on the ends mid sentence and i know against some sweeping pans with this kind of extraordinary electronic music another pickup sentence so i was like well i think just at this time of the show who is seeping simply say like i almost feel like that from its best relax into a little bit because you know i was very intimidated by phone serie in the past and the film the because of this history because of the movies important so why he's happy when you watch so you feel like you should understand and you should have you know responses by i think this is about this less money these films if you kind of just take a deep press well maybe don't take a deep breath just relax and just allow them to be almost historical artifacts then you know many of them come experience in very different ways and night night clearances being completely rare price and you know it feels like a very mode and film as you saying i think really speaks to me like i guess that has all the fairway and critical thinking gangster but it's almost like a has so many more tech like he's beautifully show radio unusually shaw has led the drama gangster with a family in the end the husband he leaves and this attention around childcare and this music by forget his name from self machine but i understand where you're coming from but i it's i think that's the question of the reputations of these films yeah yeah it's a way of kind of uncompromising in intellect and ferry robyn something you you sort of sit down to watch on a on a national level it occupies important place in the canon but yeah it's written in challenging his own swings mean actually i'm gonna be slightly so she's unfulfilled sort of more more more recent welcomes going through the list and it was so interesting instead of pleasing to see as you as you start to get in the last fifteen years or so walk by really key british female directors tis so you get something like andrew ronald's ride road then ramsey's moves and cooler which is second feature joined a hoax unrelated they offered by bonafide cow movies dreams of life you know these sort of five british female tests who've gone onto now up pretty much almost five significant directions and something like red road which i watched in preparation for this is so confident such a confident debut reimagined cat and when the jury prize that while i was watching it i thinking what is interesting double bell sort of part of a mini season that might be with films like sarah dr asleep or more i'm gordon's fry see or even champions in the car is films about sort of women in the city be an voyeurism at a slightly kind of dangerous such a sex or something that spike lee sexual i think it's a really really really interesting film and she's tackles quite difficult psychological material now in a really really confident way and kate dickey is incredibly watchable screen presence i just say one interesting thing about andrew ronald is one of the conversations we had about this film was which one of those include because you have fish tank which is the kind of people saver and you go read road which is the kind of announcing the talent and why i made me think is most interesting of have films who's tyco mothering heights which which i i was kind of pushing for but there was pushback dot com or you're taking watering hole which which one would you my first instinct would be fish tank because that's my actually it's one of my favorite films ever and i think he's is so perfect he formed but i do you think when you thinking about films that announced the talent as so many films effect on the list do that either a day be or breakthrough film and also when you're thinking about positioning british cinema within the white european context there's something about retro really does feel quite european so i think right feels like the right choice i have to say i never time legal tone with withdrawing heights i really i really admire it will just go i mean i it's you know it's it's a film i really admire but i didn't quite connects when i left hail reasons to try and set a fire pushing i'm just very simply i just think it's really difficult and rudy radical and it's a film that is oversee made with a very unique vision on a very unique creative material and i think it's all the best luxury adaptation is a made like that i think maybe it's a book i have such such a connection to read it so many times and sometimes we have a text like that you have such a clear sense of how it should be if something does come along that's really radical interpretation of that it's it can be hard to sort of fit yourself around that and i think it's more do without and sort of my my relationship with that text and then then anything to do with have filmmaking over thinking it was almost like a dope and so we learn how to throw historical periods and a lot of it is like i remember that being that much meat is a very visceral and you've got some of those documents in red road is produced by blossom trees production company i went to the toilet very briefly about pie bouncy oppa which is positive eight a tradition that comes through of artistes what country crossing in steve mcqueen and joan owner in christie malloy and i think it was doing something so interesting in the way it's sort of harnessed her base in santa and a couple that with documentary and sort of creates this distancing effect to to make you sort of quiet to to ready sort of call into question the veracity of what you're seeing in terms of documentaries sort of truthfulness and it's something that's cow morally played with the little bit that crossover between fiction documentary in in dreams of a life and then something were saying coming through so strongly over the past couple of years if you think about films like kitschy greens costumes often hey overtime loss or something like that it's a really rich space at the moment i think that crossover between documentary in in fiction or even something like come nuts and blindness which is using using a sinking to archive in a really interesting way but i think in terms of being something that announces a really really sink innovation and someone who's doing something that's so resolutely in and how space and within a slightly more kind of european tradition i think that feels incredibly incredibly significant plus nationally really fascinating you said well the there is a tendency towards the stewards maybe it's more difficult throughout god experimental films there were also some very straight down the line enjoyable genre films head of of a tight but then you can tend to make any more going all the way back to the idea of coal fired of our guest disaster movie of of this trend literally melting and all the way up to riches stanley's hardware which is the best two thousand dedi adapt tation was so listen to that in eighty this film also the i wrote about any issue which sounds like somebody experimental thing but it's so immediately impressive and len lines of color boggs from nineteen seventy five which is a short short short animated film a piece of directtv animation where then like who's a with a new zealand boeing automates who would directories school in color on cellulite and then projects and it's this fizzing pulping seeing calypso soundtrack piece of music there is some dates and this is where some of the broader themes of the list come in sunday by john grayson's gpl film unit it's this i mean god piece of animation all the way up to the end west suddenly amongst the lines colors a pass slogans for the post office is competitive postel packaged prices is another filming the list cairo writes his we all the land which is kind of documentary that he made prior to all of the biggest breach new way films and that is a similar thing is like funded by ford motor company is kind of like social experiment film about this way of life itself not recording narrative so many of these filmmakers may we spoke about who have these great debut so craig calling card films like what so many years in tv in commercial film and music video store john think license electron hawk these people who had very different careers up until they announce themselves fully formed all figured out the tricks of the trade that's allowed them to resent that voice on film and this instinct someone like lanai experiments were saved us a classic from my current in anonymous filmmaking tradition and you as you say there is the sponsorship components but pop videos and music but as and other forms of no interest in that but i like so much no question and all that so very tentative thing to explore putting it into a different context somehow led by people must speak at the next level sleight of hand or just that doesn't mean he's not decide these things do exist and contacts and you know that it's possible for creativity and i'm so sick and and arenas when he said he had most took that once more threats films and what did you hear about this show is i mean i i watch how dr is not so long ago and that's a pretty extrordinary fail and learn that spice speedy right say thread i guess about why is delivering the truck transporting i think it's sambol gravel and colin things and these john trucks and the base you kind of have to do it within the sun times mind and you know i'm right captivated by touching mccarron as a kind of unusual folks will act and he's so visceral now and you know he he's evil and he is he like phrase what's his name to the floor and when you think that's a you know so that's conic shortly from i mean i guess so slightly sticking with the sort of more productive or provocation or like a sense of suggesting possibilities which is i'm nighthawks by ron pack and pull hallam from the very end of the nineteen seventies which is a film about i guy teacher asked i stay competitive school who is of keeping his shot himself the question becomes friends with a woman teach a and then serve shas information with a and then eventually the children this class gonna find out about it but the film kind of cross costs between his school life and then him grass against the kind of clubs in london showing this quite simple direct why so much picking up i think in some of the movies i'm writing would love the camera's fast i know just kind of showing the spice so there is this sense of he's looking at who i never so stuff i guess about maybe the sexual guys or maybe how him and sexism game in a seat in society but i instantly i mean i once did that was the first one of valley gay base from which he kind of isn't ready sebastian my dad german ten before and that's more of a they have a real taking some but not all of us in the sense of desperation it's about kind of everyday life of of gay men in british society and is very much explore now and it was developed understand from years of interviews with man and kind of working on how how to make that kind of fell and they price of one pack and for how long for hungry passed away earlier this year they had this massive campaign to raise money for it because i wasn't a british stretch to make this kind of films there ryan so they produced and directed says a whole backstory this film from about which i never i'd like to welcome a late but it's sort of has this fascinating journey and unloaded as i say sean locations as well i think the seventy five and starts just sort of gone by lots of stuff showing the streets of london and people like just driving down roads and being location one level that's the kind of costa making the film where you have higher studio or you know send the contemporary says the kind of easy way of making a film they resources that since then it's you couldn't make this kind of phones now in the sense you have you know they show seeing it location you have some money like how london is matt understood this change london in the seventies that she populist movements decline at least very different type of space of this other stuff creeps into the film when you look at it from the contemporary perspective says it's a very rich film and for me i meant script writer going on throughout without young so rebels is well sorry but at the same time no a fabulous disgust along so well these firms have these rich seen some ways into them and not you know that's problematic some fascinating i think it's so interesting to you talk about the film's particular vast here that's you know those off cannon films if the seventies is slightly my a blind spot me so it's ready fast may continue he took about that as a pretty good book about recommends regulators david david williams mentioned all about that how london onscreen lots of london in this last one jumps out few particularly well that's yeah pethick segway use almost eighteen me up took about a film code wonderland by michael winter bottom when you're making these lists there has to be some wiggle room so personal favorites in the air and this is a film that is is kind of meant a lot to me personally for a long time to sing sing originally at the deluxe cinema if you are i pay winter bottom is how they're kind of big career and he's done many you know he's one of these guys comedy pinned down some different things his documentary who does melodramas and comedies and this is one of i think it's just like seven feature and for meets easily is is the best thing you've ever done is the kind of story about three sisters living in london is setting is will it takes place in the late nineties and it just deals with these relationship problems family problems dynamics mundane stuff but but heightened to this level of melodrama it's extrordinary school by michael nine men who is one of the other things i guess you could kind of like segway onto quite so seamlessly from this talking about london on on film is like this film is kind of doubles is this city symphony is well like the way she's london it's just incredible is like it's the kind of london london this film there's a scene in the night bus but it's not like packaged all this kind of cuts away a free american audience there's very little less like establishing shot seeing you have all these these kind of beautiful skylines but they're very kind of quite ordinary in it kind of is the film is kind of presenting london is very much in the kind of manhattan and woody allen's manhattan is being this kind of extremely romantic location likely the romance to the city and being involved in in this of the common of city life there's also the film is about the contrast as well like she could be extremely i mean anything and you you could feel extremely alone being surrounded by people one of the most amazing things in it leading on from like talking about this idea of like shooting on the streets of london and how unique it feels now has so much is logistically difficult this character played by in hot he's kind of white boy dead be scalia died he's taking his son from a broken married said to football match on his day they go to crystal palace match and is she filmed i i'm not joe mansion that they're in the seats and you know there were shots of spectators initial the match and he goes out into the bar and i was just like oh missing tasr the seeing some it's like wow i i can't remember any any film that whereabout you've seen a football match where it feels like someone just been allowed just take a camry film it everything is so wrapped up in like rights and tv in images and that feels like a kind of stolen seen never before never thin skin and maybe i'm not saying those films that film inside ripple stadiums but i think it'll captures ethos of this film of like you know it's capturing the little kind of moments space in some places and buildings and interior and exterior of the east of like they kind of common but may feel kind of nineteen eighteen let's just points when he goes on a blind date and may student mckay and they know each other and then they realized that together and send this ball i think income and and you know i lift around that and so you and plus you know that price and that that happened this time they don't expect to meet so then you're like oh one place to another instead of yeah you got sense of this big london i'm not sure that cash and i think he sent the film and i think we see something you may be getting quite a film set so in in london end real and just on on location is like there's ridi real deep pass no connection between the makers and the and the and the and the landscape like like winter bottom knows all these places you've been to all these places he films why is very the field very familiar and i think the film almost is about that connection between like an autistic landscape you have the film itself is almost like the kind of icing on talk but it's like you know i just find that element of the film very moving like when wilson's wonderland the rue in fact i briefly want to mention district constricted burgundy 'em which is in fact probably one of my favorite films on on this whole list andy's such search as sort of perfect distillation of all of his slightly possess and kind of erotic mckee minded a preoccupations and i think in the way that it exposes very very specific snl relationship between these two women it manages to say something so universal about the way power structures what within relationships and the way people behave towards each other's in in in relationships and you know punish each other or shutdown and and i love the fact that within something that feels so specific it was able to do something that felt so so profound and points to something really a real human truth about the way we behave in relationships and i think king all of his body of work i think this is my favorite you talk about filmmaker who very much is coming from a european sensibility he's you know he couldn't be more you're in terms of shooting out that using actors from the consonants yeah he's living out that i feel hungry yeah we've only just scratched the surface of the top one hundred have plenty more films to look as if you did pick up a magazine which is on newsstands now we're gonna take a short break and i'm going to delve a little deeper in some of these teams so well let's talk quickly about the buddies beneath we've spoken about how this list is sort of alternative cannon looking good films telling you the woman's puts in in these lists that's exactly what you're doing in the buddies beneath you talking about i'm quoting from instruction here presenting important aspects earning completely mapped moving imaging landscape so please tell us more about that that gold that life go easy on yourself while i think by sending on television are enormous failed and the less there were just been torn about it's kind of providing pause into that and one of the things that i inched up somewhere doing as much i guess where you know everybody's working much from archive and we're discovering things and realize that lots of stuff hadn't even leasing a tool hadn't been seen for a long long time so initially the the sort of comes out the strand that we might have they find something called the flip side and we began to london this film primitive london which we buy stuff come across almost feel like the this'll crumbs that film sometimes leave when the life and and then you know they're not alone guy i'm innocent month maybe they haven't been released on dvd or vhs and you know certain types of films when they made they say space at that time the least traction after that point and say some room to london is this kind of mundo ask sensational documentary about learning from nine sixty five and it's an interesting one because it's so this cost between the kind of gray rundown london off the wall and then swinging london which is about to rob sorry we wanna see this film and we were predominant basically southbank and then free that we kind of start to uncover that these other links to all the films and start to think that point a loss of kind of will cohen unusual from hadn't really come out on dvd or playwright and say it ready fouts we talked earlier about other kind of greatest hundred based films that said that kind of discourse ready to dominate and at fellow in quite some time now and there's the conversations muslim fired by the woman having having now but it's something that fascinated officers the film dx liberty resonated the time they look who said that i haven't seen many films and tv programs in which is a good thing and that means something to discuss that you know that it's not well nine people and this is ray davies and the kings and i television ply that he made unquote style make headway he protected imagines himself as almost like a rational powering card to why he says mundane grice about and guy and what it means to left on the kings play songs in the television studios house so that kinda just disappear but it's oversee see right dives is a very well known for musician i think with the book we you know part of it was not signed the these films on is good as you said they all these other films about except by extending the map on shining the light on things and maybe get some attention we must pointing out that the chemical films like ten historically they would maybe got film restoration scott kind of lost caring attention that based on them not perpetuates the kind of visibility and the states this which they acquire wires on some time got the chairman said that's that's kind of approval urging the happens in the right place something we once it's a on pecker bags we stretch the field a bit further so by piece about this from felix by on the i'm rise which made three the bear fine nineteen seventy nine as crazy funny katie from serbian grosso in a you know some kind of steve dorsey in which was compromised possibilities and pays and the lies last these kind of hooks the guy win and again some point in time in other directions and yet this film pops because she died of breast cancer when she was faulty like i'm ratcheted up a while nine from what i've read about this from i couldn't tell you when it was lost grains that we haven't screen day it was on television jamie i sixers had a channel four with a big fan of has commission to make other films is a comeback handle on the prophet pleasure which has keep growing very fast rolls on screen and she was so you got free numbers you go crazy funny to see from serving grasso and keep growing old buddy may say that i think it's that sort of make breaching these connections and trying to show why a sense of what british film and television coach aid is kind of what's the goal and if i don't say some of these some light snow like oh that quite good or this is pretty good or it's about having the conversation and films and tv that might just be like a ten minute band that that's like amazing well maybe knowing amazing just really interesting and strains and we talk about whether we did this there is this kind of history much pre internet of list bucks why things are not map say you might buy that book about horror films north shore some entries i'm not i'm not you know those kind of kind arguably redundant now within ninety days the national historic lots of boxing themselves but you know we we look at the forty films i'm and tv programs with famous but she each paces about two three thousand words along with john silicon debt and radio impact these these connections such a testament to the role of film all kinds of philmont and that's because the tendency west cannons and great less top one hundred top one thousand zone is it feels like it's almost a closed book finished stories easily only films need to watch and even ways restorations anniversary leases on it feels like we know what films came out in nineteen sixty nine because we got solely fiftieth anniversary and he says but actually the amounts of films and tv confidence while the racing at that time you will not tolerate against the nets the jehovah's sifting through all these real that's a house in a warehouse somewhere by linden right yeah and i think tv in many why is the real undiscovered country because you know i guess also i'm pretty i love stuff has gone on chichi ben that so much stuff which makes the brace contacts distinct from elsewhere in the wild is the you know up until she she had basically three channels on television and will ever wishing electro cinema and that's like your potential menu a fail and so that's why these parents seventies when these kind of radical publications what happened they all kind of interesting because the bandwidth starting now it's like can you actually do and he's gonna say this stuff with in so many ways tv saudi undiscovered country british museums coach i know this guy must have since ational necessarily is fountains and things but that's all stuff and not systems reference but but that's hundred hundred other books over some of the vine more beyond that it's a really terrific book and so readable is well it's not you know it's nothing academical fusty sort of thing it's really exciting to discuss some of these weird and wonderful films and tv series there's there's a chapter on their own calling his official running duct tape unorthodox easier but making me think maybe on kevin willis dined ville yeah i think someone the pre freight i liked a lot of stuff we rise about even use some of the films in something and he that was the one who something i'm not sure i like daring but like that's that's maybe gone too far but there's this huge undiscovered country if the past but also the see these other undiscovered country of the future and that's really not spoil the cutting edge of what's coming up that's what you're working on and it feels that in this less what i love about this you put together david is you don't give short shrift recent films you go all the way up through mindless which was released earlier this year and it feels that the raise this new wave british forces and telling the five particular forces you to early road so could you say something about weber us and what we're looking at some of the future might look like i think says five women i i mentioned earlier you know you would no longer considered a cow morally in some inland ramsey andrew ronald is new talent stay on now at the forefront of those if they're sort of the most exciting names coming out to the uk and you could throw in also andrew hagan steve mcqueen but i think what is happening it was interesting to see lady macbeth on that list from two two thousand sixteen and i think that film moxie particular turning point or particular set of watershed moment around new talent in in in the uk you know they've always been exciting debuts coming out to be a case it announced new voices and you this list is is built on on so many of those names but i think lady macbeth is a film that was made on a very very small budget made through i am new talent development skiing supported by the bbc and and the fbi and it was probably the first of those kinds of films puffing dosing which just like three different a different talents game that's home cows they beat it they didn't sundance couple years back but lady macbeth to something that really announced a sort of new generation shouldn't british talent on the international stage and since then you've seen films like apostasy a based the leveling because i'm country and it feels like there's this wave of new names coming through the to really positioning themselves on positive sort of the global consciousness and i see their civil reasons that i think partly it's a little bit around wider changes in industry landscape at the moment do waves netflix and amazon in athens they sort of shifting platform debate and which means some of the public from disney uk focusing more on new new talent i think they issue of public funding is really interesting one and probably something you know i should mention the fact that i used to work at the bbc and so i'm fully fully paid up a fine if if the public funding system but we are incredibly lucky in the uk to have a system of public funding films which does not exist in every country must be doesn't exist in the states you know we have five bbc in film for predominantly and then of course will say screen scotland scotland wales the regional fund as as well as you know screen ireland northern ireland screen uk works very closely with his well and public fundus are able to support and champion a nut shouldn't you talent in a way that's entirely highly free of markets concerns and it means they're able to provide space when you talent contri new things couldn't possibly fail can develop that voices and really they they can provide a sort of incubator beta that in other countries you don't have that privilege privileges much and i think lady macbeth really does maka sort of change in somebody's policies from public confidence in terms of focusing on on new talent i i mean that's just a sort of a kind of finger in that mark and lady macbeth wasn't i said it hasn't been blown out to the policies or didn't mock a ten point but's it's the film that you could point to to go oh i said i'm starting to see that shift and then you roll with the punches council while you're presenting these these films to international festival program as well to the qualities they come to the uk film industry fool all the sudden qualities across characteristics i think i you know it certainly does send some international national festival circuit the proceeds cinema is and exciting space and the list of films that have been premiering at festivals in philadelphia and that's not even to mention of course they this sort of become more established names what's most exciting end program and find most exciting is that you know that was once a time when you might come to the uk to look for or expect to find you know special realism all period drama and that's not the case anymore i think a lost fifty films coming out at the moment not just in the uk actually sort of more more broadly feel really old said really distinctive a lot of muscle just playing with genre and quite an interesting way and i think that's partly to do with the fact that some existing hierarchy well in fact all of the existing hierarchies between film and television have broken down and i think the fall weather something gets to be a film rather than existing in a different medium you know rather than being being television is higher than ever and you know getting funding is harder getting distribution is hotter which means you're breathing courage is a very clear set of cinematic vision and often germans the place that you consider if you can explore that but i think it does mean let's see the sort of in the longest time i think the boss the kind of works at comes out fifty k the kind of films the get made will be higher and i and i think the longer time it'll mean a really sort of robots and quite exciting national cinema rafa i think it's a time when everyone sort of like a lot of uncertainty ever instead of disruption and no one's quite sure what the landscape look like next year let alone in five years time but i do think actually the sort of the competition for audience is competitions eyeballs will mean that will be a sort of a red button us around around what gets made it will be credibly exciting films will keep coming and they will absolutely absolutely and the kind of talent that's coming out to the uk it's it's really exciting and and also the kind of talent but still very much in grosse route stage the fire really really leaning into into that space with that regional talent scouts or the public fundus all looking towards developing new talent in in one way or another it it feels like a really really exciting you know you could do another bashing if this list in ten years time with a whole crop was really exciting films on that you better get working on it david keith tabulating any final comments for a loop is fascinating here's what we know what's currently happening in the british film industry in like you know i'm trying to think if people who exist even slightly outside of that kind of opens up public funding arena like one of my favorite directors a ban rivers he's kind of existed on the margins he's seventy six modular so long in in a relative term or dog years i think if you're throwing us filmmakers by cyber here's knowing the much oh well yeah i guess relative to the to the british film industry in the kind of traditional roots of of distribution in an exhibition he's like someone who i see is of flying the flag at you know he's films travel all over the wild his life is pretty much traveling with these films is going to festivals getting funding through festivals making films where he's going and he he did have been fully funding before some of his instincts emails between these difficult times and how is in his time as a kind of cinema corrupt saw so it's international film festival circuit and it's kind of nine in that context but then also has a gallery in sending two major international be saying so he he's pretty interesting innocent and i think it's film saying the uk now is this is astonishing there's so much stuff going on which is so it's a different kind of conversation but i sort of like the israeli where the courage to stuff is already happening in this country absolutely i mean it's you know i i would sort of fixing quite cleaning on on the set of public funding space but there is so much multi on that and then of course once you get tend to sort of off sniffing in each one goal vr or sort of more kind of walks it sort of crossing crazy boundaries it's really it's really exciting face and also you know going back to what you were saying earlier will about tv being such a such a rich base historically it's now a place where so many of all most interesting filmmakers west mean tv and toronto abramson andrew hey that sort of high rocky between the two medium says it has gone and i think it means the filmmakers conservative stretch himselves athens and that storytelling muscles in a way that feels ralian reinvigorating i suppose the broadening of the bandwidth you mentioned earlier will air in up until the early eighties you could have a handful tv channels and then you just want some of the cinema whereas now you have all these streaming platforms and it's creates it just a glut of content but it's also little micro nietzsche's where in this list we'd have also giving emissions short animation all buttoned up against each other because they may be own channel forward and eighties yeah whereas now you testicle have to be a way to be within the willfully office meeting in which they say when the previous film and tv coaches numerous pretty much that failed somehow more pressure to map the most going on now maybe this is where you can't understand the context for as well and they are and you know weaken received the most the publications what we what can be done by himself foxworth yeah mapping ready what's going on now it's very challenging thing that has been tendencies to think of certain types of will tend to film production three moving into the gallery and you know these kind of lines going but i feel like those lines the kind of being kind of rub down or dissolving again and inside she quite hard sometimes to place contacts a certain type of thing which is partly because of things like you choose wildly in between spices stuff is crossing in a way it's wasn't astonishing time unready mopping was what's happening is is a chinese exciting charleen it'll feel so for us but i think i agree i think that feels really unknowable in slightly yeah we said we kind of old nathan forward into space it feels completely new but they will say really really exciting sinophile days in waves anymore so it's just maybe when you buy sort of like this you know these books laugh so now it's like us and you know i guess we turned i sang about praise of greener when john certain audience like sinophile in this kind of light niece almost bs kind of thing and you show will identify with that someone has been that kind of person story by now i feel like it's no coats in a fairly i bet cynically is alive and well and the difficulty of mapping everything that's going on it's a lawsuit payments because i it's understood that it's like a powerful cultural form the impacts on alive and touches on sexual issues and there's like a politically relevant way of having a conversation so it's like a very i guess acquaintance in the flavors to productive and once you start making those connections by i find that that in itself it's kind of exciting exciting time he wants a potentially see overwhelming points end this podcast on you we start with just eight hundred films and now we have the entirety of his past present and future a strong tabulates some things feel although i'm not pointing at the film's witness list that rule viewable the role available and some medium or other and let you know maybe ten fifteen years ago maybe less and hoff would have been like outlast so as you say that so yeah there's an appetite and this this kind of very so antiquated notion of sinophile here is this like snow be kind of someone who enjoys films malden kind of light us and it's just it doesn't really exist anymore so you too can be a single file lettuce if you will so the boys beneath is out now in in good bookshops and it is already from the publisher stranger trots press will so when i'm in i'm in photos you come pick it up and rushed by sort of billions on rhone having people catch up with you and see what you're doing i'm on twitter at a rally would finally david anything from the good ship is what lies toy sign off oh no no no nothing wolfer me voices david but sankey round david well joining me today i michael leader and it's always this is gonna seven digital production

mcdonald david jenkins program manager michael consultant uk fifteen years five pounds ninety days five years ten minute two pounds one pound ten years fifty k
#TSP084 - Anjli Mohindra

The Two Shot Podcast

57:16 min | 1 year ago

#TSP084 - Anjli Mohindra

"How are you doing? I'm crepe Parkinson. You are listening to the to shop Paul casts yourself down public how nice how child? With this. I'm gonna tell you right now. I I. Is not Craig he's not so good this week. And as working so is fallen to me, the less ahead produced Griff to do the intro of the podcast. You don't mind and. Less. We Kana want thoroughly decent human being is. Ms pleasure to listen into that conversation for me. And we've had absolutely incredible things said was. Minuit reach so many people on a deeply personal level. The number of people have experienced loss on the same kind of post loss, trauma and effects that describes so so eloquently and deeply deeply comforted by an reassured by the find the even through similar things in his doing such amazing things on on screen and speak. Shouts kind of come in on prochet. Housekeeping, patriot badge people sorry, again, the budgies that we promised to those people kindly donate over five dollars a month. Of the spreadsheet. Terrible. Excel I and Craig C busy, and he's one obsession about jeez. So it is occurring. Don't worry. We're not stitching. Yup. It's not fire festival style. Ruse to again, hard and cash. They are on the way. And there will be with you at all you wanna say soon on the patriot note, we have a hundred fifty one people this was patron and Massi massillon get said, it's off the massive massive. Thanks have run those that. And it's now paying for train tickets to come down to London, let's say guilt Munster do do either. And then he should know is the background noise. And if few TSP's recently my Bill to his wondering garden outside bull, I'm going to buy some sexy new microphones with patriot money. And this new owns out by Coney, Nicole Austin, we use us the Mike phones on this podcast. Go buy some new us stealth with some of that money, and we'll be able to record in slightly noisy environments without you having to listen to noisy people's conversations about ground. So mossy shots all the patriot. People the that up in the bee doo either patriot dot com slash to shop part. If you want to help out financially with the podcast, if you do much pretty shade. Now, I swim this week. We have the fantastic enjoy minder. She's a wonderful light tip for. From not again, you police until in the bodyguard on BBC one all on itv's darker was getting busy hedge trimmer outside apologies. Yet, we met angelie in MS Myrtle spritual recording home in SoHo and out wonderful chat to it's about the thoroughly modern condition of straddling two cities, beloved Nutting and almost equally beloved London. So it's about growing living in Jimmy all kinds of interesting things. Anyway in my waffle. Appreciate it. If you've got this far three my podcasting debut. And yeah, I'll speech at the end nice will enjoy as crisis. That's why I got. So I right sometimes when you drive in and you let somebody out anew. And they're just completely stayed out often after come DongA why it's just that little thing. That's going to ruin the next. I'm just gonna waste ten minutes thinking about that now. Yeah. Or I was in pulling out of supermarkets today and give way things and this guy just came right close to me as I was. And he started shouting at. The give ways they're driving instructor. Don't five forty people like him. Market this won't when you did the survey of new way nastily command. Two though. That's that's what he's these people on the road. Come from the people. He shitty things. Like they've been taught by one dude on also suppose you've been driving around all day teaching people you're going to be on. I sometimes think about that. We know people do angry. Yeah. They have to take you on date day for you. There is a queue of people behind you. And they all getting retained bomb taking that full year. So that you can relax young driver did think that all that pen openside them that they can't release. Also, they may not they may not be happy in the job doing the true. Trae very, oh, we'll nine times out of ten, but hey, that's the ten minute process. Monday, say thank you. And it's gonna take a few minutes for me to like get myself, Alabama. Term about wasting my time angry annoyed about that. Star pay ten minutes turns in ten years. How are you? Really good. Yeah. Good. It's nice to be back in London. Even though it's been spending time in Nottingham which. My family go and him and seeing family I feel like I feel like I never really stopped wanting to live there. Even though I love London with all my heart. So it feels like whenever I have a downtime just peg over for couple of days. I do have got one foot in each and I'm not quite committed. It's been seven years of lived in London, ROY keys place here. But yeah, so go. Hey, quiet lot which grocery is a great people from the rear, you know, great people. And the go will is really a not still the people say that. Oh god. Yeah. Yeah. All no one particular friend of mine who would would be anywhere else. Yeah. Really wouldn't get together. And you know, what I think I'm starting to make peace with it. Like, why do I have to commit to one city on poly-amorous city relationship? Also, this you go through a time when you fail already want to be in London. What over to this? You know? Yeah. When these go buck. Yeah. Happens. You wanna run away from it? Yeah. Kevin do couldn't Trie or call. Or I to be slightly balanced. Fifty fifty. Yeah. For now who said who said you maybe they put pressure on myself gas, but. Flagellating yourself in it. So it was it lighten go. But. It's lovely a really like. Oh, really feel like I'm not actress. And when I go home, but I do feel mostly actress on Joan I'm here. I don't quite know what I mean by that. Except to have this feeling of like. Bit of liberation a thing when you're out of work in this city, and that might be a couple of weeks, it might be for more than that. It's just a constant reminder of the thing that you love you're not necessarily able to do because system. Great is having some great things happening expensive as well. Whereas one I'm home at this just divide there where I can just sort of switch off which off all of that. And just be a human being that. It's quite you know, I think as any big cities are I lived in New York for. How was that? I was working. You know, it was fine. But I was thinking all the time. I think it'd be quiet on forgive in city. Whereas I think London it's not as bad as diet, but it can be forgiving if he'd give yourself a hard time here, and there's all still around you. Potato into what we do aren't y'all. The mind. Busy, straight you call. Yeah. Do what you want to do. Yeah. Yeah. So in that respect it is. Yeah. There is loads going on here is a great city for that the repeal Ciccio. Yeah. I think day watch nay. Yeah. Quite a bit. Do you? We'll since I've moved out. Let's say I've fallen back in love with someone. Because I went through a time of of really being a love with that. I'm found it very difficult and everything was a struggle and everything maybe that's where I was personally with my own life at the time who I was. Since I moved out yet fallen back in love because a commend do the things I really love this or see some friends and then a bugaboo cough on the trying. Yeah. So get Diack signed. Nominee with us. Feel relocate of that putting the KOMO time. When you go. No. This. But not if I keep doing this blitz. Keep me here. Maybe maybe that's the maybe the health thing that you can keep jumping around. Yeah. Yeah. I found it really unsettling when I moved here because it was just a bit like noncommittal in every time. I leave the other. I'd have a pine in for the other one. But now it just feels that. Yeah. The daytime and the nighttime. It's all gravy. And when you do go back. Do you does it may think about your childhood? It does law, and though we moved around quite a log his my my dad was in the army and then worked for the army the rich. I think the job did the longest was bullshit manager. For the. So we spent most of his time posted at your well barracks in Nottingham, and then did a four years than in Germany when I was about nine your go to Joe LA we win we will win and spent four years. Is your cappuccino round time? Thank you very much. Thank you so much. Coffee break coffee radio. So whereabouts. Should you move over to Germany at the time? We did we meet to place called out where he's not forgive my life. I don't know, and I should be. But when I was thirteen and then kinda got into geography at school, but I I should check. I think west Germany. It was quite a sleepy town. And we really didn't like it. I in fact, I hate it. A hard kept having dreams where all my old school friends had German names, and they were all the same people. But just had different names into what I was saying. I was woman as Ben and Mark the twins. And you know, why why take me like what what what to me? Nine years old, and you don't route to massively just make him as at nine the par of not to the other side of hours. Yeah. And we went to a forces school where a lot of the children that went there haven't actually ever been to England were English from British families. But who just been posted from post to post all around Europe because quite a lot of basis that time so close down now. Yeah, I think it's massively hard because there was a British coacher, but not really one that I wanted with a very specific. Vibe and energy to those people and nyc resource pool for conversations that sometimes it was a bit like Ardo balance lift inaugurum until recently, and I was the only ethnic minority in my whole school. My sister is while primary and secondary which was really interesting because I think age it didn't really know that I belonged to anything that was author. But then to be the only other everybody is aware that your. Goes questions about race. I couldn't answer or into stunned, but didn't have a chip on my shoulder 'cause you day really as a kid. And I think kids would be a mean, I think they were just wondering why I look different so over curious aspire hugely. And I remember my mom would always me and we've like Indian parliament. Just nine MAC his lie. You ready? Try really hard to not be different strong for. Who's that? Look. I think then little protests begun in Mahar against all things Indian and alike would catch myself trying really hard demonstrate my Caucasian. Really I'd like that was acceptance to food. Yeah. And I I'd like trying research things that might come up as one my quiz. So that if they ever came up in conversation, I could my dad went Borden school here. He was born in the British colony in Kenya. And he's he has a similar thing that he hasn't. I think he's still very much feels like he identifies mostly as British than anything else. And imagine would have been like in the seventy eight seventy to go to boarding school. And have that thing. I just described only order, and he just he did say that schoolteachers will be like, oh, you don't want beef on dinner. Well, okay. Just have the 'tatoes. Then there was no sense of all you Hindu. Let's try and make that okay? Yeah. We talk about it very much a consensus. Does something that wanted water. If you go talk mother, I think I've had so many things that have how Newt me out vet like so many friends, foes Himalayas, and there's a thing going on in our in my industry that's light to be more inclusive, but my daddy's wit in the army until very late in late open to quite recently. And now he brings the post office, which I think if he'd said that to him when he was working in the army he would have been so for straight behind that what you want about. I'm not gonna wanna Cornish up because he's bridge. And now is kind of a glorified Cornish up to to most people. I think that was nothing. There was nobody go in RG feel blaze. Let's like bond over that. I think it's hard to come to tens of when it's become a habit for that many as special to filter canoe. Yeah. What do you do? And my mom is like that. She is done everything she worked in a court. She's where it is. I Bank manager. She doubled in a bit of like doing properties for the people. And she's just like an entrepreneur. She wanted to pope is also like we're gonna post office as well. She's just incredible that Super Bowl. There is no there's the meaning of note doesn't exist which is really for straighten is not already below obvious thing happened. Does it really does? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You trust me. And I haven't holiday and I've been waiting for my note for two and a half months and finally got calm believe it she wants to Wade in like, I think all moms day roller sleeves and make sure this real equal opportunities instilled in you from an early age for people what they're like can do. Yeah. To feel like I thought everybody, and then got to like, my early twenties and realize how lucky I was to have that fire that I don't think everybody does possess that that sort of like blind absolute blind, faith, that things will be okay. Do feel really fortunate to have that im- im- blood, but also on fortunate sometimes because I feel like sometimes they get it when somebody feels bit. Disenchanted wisdom in just feels a bit like things aren't possible. Bit pessimistic white be not I didn't out sometimes help just come on. Because you wanna ride yourself up. It's going to be right. You still like that? Now. Even even when things not chick Ligo. Because you know, we all take on knocks in life. Things starts chip away. Yeah. Console to the core. When rocket Kono. Yeah. Over visit better took of Walker on because I feel like in our industry, the most much cool things happen when you feel the way and then the most like heartbreaking things happen. You don't get things that you felt like you really deserve. And therefore, there's not really a formula. And there's not really a come do attitude that sees you through the whole way of so much. It's not in your control that I feel I in other areas of my life. Definitely I've got less viable there is no such thing as no because other areas your life. You've probably got more control over certain. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And that optimism will prevail Inc. I think. That's a healthy attitude. Aspirins? He's also like, you know, making a plan got really have a plan because thin niqab did map in your backpack. When he started. There's not really much control you have over it. And there's no it's not logical. So do you find that frustrating? Yeah. I think so I'm starting to see the beauty. And a I, you know, I mean. That's a lovely way of point. I just wanna save me about. Sometimes when you least try to control it something really amazing can happen. And catch you totally off guard. Should you think by? Not really really tie just releasing the control. I have an acceptance that we we don't have a controlled. Yeah. You get some back. Yeah. My. Does really good point? I've really wanted to meditate for years because it sounds like the most amazing thing and everyone always talks about it. And the don't know how how you say. I wish calling such an overactive mind sit down for twenty minutes, and after three just lose in my mind cause a can't control just be into and thinking of nothing, really hard. But so many Perla wisdom the day. And she was like you can meditate on a coffee or on a chocolate bar or on a person. And when you have a conversation and all is just like give it full attention. That's meditation. And it was all my God. Yeah. I guess he can't do it like and this really if you can do that. And not try to obsess about the things that happened. In addition to whatever, then then you just I think it makes you much more whole feel you'd feel so much more wholesome. I was soberly about transcendental meditation. I looked DR. We don't know. I don't really know. What about there were saying to watch you practice? As it. Maybe more than data practice. So forgive me kind of talking. Massar as day. Really? Yeah. But they're saying you can do anywhere. Somebody I could do on a pack train because the go within in themselves. Yeah, they can practice. Our and it just detached themselves, which kind of really healthy and fascinating just doesn't. I think it does. And I've heard about people like here's a guy who Dr Joe dispenser for come name in. He's not Manet taught is an American guy who fixed his spine? He I think I want to get this wrong. But I think he damaged it really civilian Asikin accident already a doctorate this point. So he knew what damage he had done when he saw the x-rays, and they were like, you're not going to walk. We can try get some of your motor functions going, but you ain't gonna walk and he's walking and doing these seminars because he he practiced trans and dental meditation type of meditation for so long that just tried to touch his mind from him and just connect with a greater source and mentally fixed zones buying awesome as Israeli inspiring. Because it's these scientists these on, you know, like, what some people would say is just some sort of hippy drippy kind of person in this stuff that no I forbid he can access but science, and I think that's. To go into this in should start podcast about meditation. Grefe or do you think? Grefe not in the. This. So as did you leave Germany left, Germany when I was. I think I went just fourteen nine and came by just after ten twelve so about four four years than to not to nothing Amir, but to nothing in your back to the same school. Yeah. Which was really weird. Which is why I think I quite like feeling like I'm always changing my surroundings a change school every four years. That's how it Turks in primary. Germany Germany twin of the secondary secondary to a secondary here with new people. So I feel like changes part of who I feel comfortable being which you saw Raleigh. Now. Consider what you do for job you go for. Know say to say new people fortune. Shoes. Like weird sense of ever-evolving identity way. You like who am I denote be somebody else in the few years grossing riddick's is man that you you're always yourself when you move to these people. Myself is I'm starting to realize that in a good way. I think if I feel like I want to be open and not really have a real real like a sense of values is really important, but sense of like selfish in I'm really liked. What is our way is yourself is it like fixed habits of behavior or is? It just like deny yourself that question alone. This. Yeah. I think this is quite a common thing with semesters. I've spoken to there's there's your values, and what you've been brought up to believe and things that make you happy in the things that make you angry. And then there's like. As a new like having this thing where you have to have some sort personality. But like, I think it's when people I think is doing press for jobs where people ask you about yourself. And I'm like, I don't know. I always feel like I can answer because we don't always. Yeah. The question. Also what what do you want? What do you want life? Really no to be on this. And I'm sure I've heard that question been us too. At American artists and they just reeled off for good too. And this is why I want this one. You just go while you save on the face of it. You've got to also. Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes I feel lost that questions us feel comfortable that Renault. What what what was it? You want me to say? Would you want to hear? The answer. Yeah. But first moving around for you you called reinvent yourself. Yeah. If you wanted to I just reim- reinvention, but it's like growth it's like trying not to settle on being. On limiting yourself and being close to learning things about becoming a different person -sarily just about expanding and like, self development and being open minded and learn as much as you can about things, and the thing the more you're environment changes the more you're forced to like be really reminded in not in a worthy way. But just to really understand different walks of life. And maybe even change things in the way that you live the way that you choose to bave burger inspired from the new people that lipoma not allow. Yeah. Used to suffer really badly from social anxiety. I think ever really really goes away. But you manage it point where you don't really hear south limiting this yet. It's a teenager. Dot has to really know. Don't don't really not. Maybe it was moving around where you felt like I felt like I couldn't really access things instantly vowed a bit like left our or lonely, and then that makes you ruminate on your own thoughts for ages you calling for them. Yeah. And then you start having this really big in a monologue. This constantly light telling you that you not great in not fun and funny and stupid things rare day, and then not stop she from being fun and funny and stops you enjoy in things that are fun and for people. So I think that like so desire for self growth comes from that. Because my boyfriend want said he's a copy of the may pose a bit more experienced in life. And this was when I was in my early twenty s he was like he do realize why your being heady and working out how people perceive in the things your say. And I can guarantee that every other person in this room is check in themselves for what's coming out of their miles trying to be funny and trying to be entertaining and interest in and oversight. Gosh, I shall liberate in and swimming shifted, and I started to go Jeters like a group grew room full of people. He were all feeling the Lober, maybe just lack gal my own way and stop trying to south moderate. I cannot she like strike conversations of people who look bit shy 'cause you can access thought if you saw byu. Yeah. And then you feel everybody feels a bit like the arch lay and feel social media is like an oft hard conversation, but social media's really given birth to a generation of people who feel really adequate. And really. I mean, I have kind of a better relationship with it. But I think I'm calling me. I'm going good knowing how to use it now on Twitter. Yeah. Mainly because of Instagram's out. Yeah. Pretty is. How you use it? Yeah. Throw out if you use the healthy way, new use it fear that could come back on your which is great for the fuel concerned about what reaction things are going to make a out. It's just a downward spiral to dispel. Yeah. And in looking inside his Alphand when whatnot because then you compare in club trust and compare it of why always great. Look look down at your own. Choose your Zora. Yeah. We. Didn't this move it around it? It's not your confidence. From going scored school and little bit. Yeah. I think so. But then it also gave me like. Gave me a sense of just trying to call out. 'sensitive fitting in wherever you go. No fittings, not the right term. He gave me a sense of like picking up conversations with people never Georgian anybody being really open minded billable all your different the people in school. But let's slide interrogate that be maze. I felt like a misfit definitely because of all that. But then I think the thing that came out of it, and it made me really really side is just how much I denied my identity in terms of racial background like just how much are striving to not be Asian of tool because of earlier experienced school where people were asking at she asked. If I was black by the twelve year old kid in the playground because they just never have honestly never ever experienced gerbil. Yeah. He's forces school wrong on for Cisco really baffling questions like that way. Like, no. But I also don't know how to help you there. Then leaving with the feeling of light on God. Like, I I am different to everybody here. And so I feel like in the past few years that misfit amaze like once to we'd allow what it is that made me feel like that in the first place. Now couldn't be more proud of my heritage and want to like tone for the past. Fifteen years many years how much denied away. I'm should. I mean, I think it's great. You think I'm alone there. I think a lot of people felt like that. But I think it's really great to be called the misfit. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's great thing to have great. Yeah. Because I've always felt about, but you know, oversleep whether you'll be scared to be the new golden. I'm proud. Yeah. It's great food to the question that used to make me Matisse co when someone goes cut drive guys way from not going you from from. Redick site 'cause I'm not make up for the past. However, many years. From this and my family confront acquired enjoy it now. And I enjoy them educate in possibly educating people who've never met somebody who Gino comes from a country that isn't this one racially house. We are the same values in likes the Beatles. So I- whereas you move from. We're on the subject as my parents Pajau bay enjoyable. Yeah. Yeah. And more moved over when she was eighty got married to my dad who had been living in England since he was three. And yet they're just like polar opposites, I think my dad is proud of his heritage. But he's just very British. Whereas my mom is very very like into with every sin as is everything from how to cook to like how to sing Indian songs. Beautiful voice. It's really like, and I wanna be I wanna get Zayed about that. Now, I want to draw out as much as I can. Your path. Yeah. Thank you. So where did you end up finishing school? We to packing. Nothing was going to be based now for a while. Yeah. That was that was when we realized that the Germany stem because by the time we laugh we actually wanted to really wanted to stay there. Yeah. By the school the resources about school, which just brilliant underscored trip. She could go on when you live in the middle era. You and just go into a form to come. You're going to like Spain for like snorkeling trips in light skin in the news. That's more common now at schools these days. Skiing and stuff. I have heard of it. Yeah. Yeah. I should've never had that when I was growing up. I think I went to a glass factory. I'd gateway glass fracture. That sounds cool. Your I blow glass through flight. Go ready ready? I'll today cheek grow. She wrote a bunch of kids. It was fucking. I prefer to go smoking this. Yeah. So how are you fading leaving school? I loved it. I really loved school and tonight, we're really missed having something night school now because not education DesRochers child. Yeah. Just hadn't have been people that you hang out with that. You wouldn't normally pick to hang out with as well really really liked that law. See I left school went college was about to go to Uni and then got a job as an actor. And that was like a fork in there think about that moment where if I haven't got that would I have continued to go to union delivery different pathway life. Do they are tuned surface view? I'm being in Germany and hearing about this place called television workshop and nothing and really wanted to guy really really wanted to guy 'cause it was like loads of improvise -ation based training that kind of happen. Then it was like really excited by that. I think my mom the can do women called from Germany to the man that run it then in Smith went is nothing we can do remotely over the phone. Improvise over the phone and mobiles, then we would have been calling on a line from Jimmy Maher. What she member? Yeah. So then students could could auditioned in thankfully, everyone's not in our family in. Yeah. And then workshop for you because I know and mazing. Yeah. Amazing amazing like I didn't go to drama school. So I don't know if it's similar there. But I really feel like we're shop is a part of me like a family not a badge of honor. And a one key way part of like who I feel? I am as a person even though I didn't really have a strong sense of self. I feel like a lot of my sense of south is workshop is a really brilliant place. I know at drama school a lot of my friends have said that there's a real competitive element drama school when everybody leaves. It's like, right. Who's she gonna get an agent now which wasn't like that at all workshops, like everybody, Ike roots reach the really really, and we're taught, by example, go toward dishes and be mates with people that you don't know and route fill the people all which is it's not an insular thing. It really isn't an as soon as you see people from which is a real sense of like, I almost like families. Really? Yeah. No. When you learn so much 'cause they all sources scales that from Ryan and talking about the yeah. Which, you know, most camera now than before the cameras would get whipped out when we had additions, but like the wasn't really cause a lot of playtime additions allow workshop Gagio alike, and they'll talk about shea meadow straight away and talk about how this low degree screen actors come from workshop, but I don't think that we went filmed on the art class car. Even remember really, but it wasn't really it wasn't a screen based training. It was really really rooted in truth. We didn't sit and do stunts laughs gay or your name is ner. There were level of that. And tried to learn about that since leaving workshop bit. Ian would just shout out. Don't believe you. Nimmo truth. What it is all about the day. Labor was driving for. Yeah. I mean, these are great bloke. Here's a ready. Yeah. Really great like just encouraged stuff in that is still kind of us now. And you don't even know what you get in then wasted on your childish brain. And then, you know, malate twenties now. Oh, yeah. He did say that you see the skills that is giving you there you might not use for a lengthy amount of time. And then it comes out go. Yeah. Yeah. That which I think is absolutely brilliant for training. Yeah. Definitely is too wide. We go into the works. When when I was thirty I think or twelve fifteen and then left a state as long as I couldn't they'd be about when you twenty one going still try to go back. It's just such a great place. No, I think that's another thing. That draws me about tonight is my workshop Powell's still best best friend. So that communities still there for rhetoric? One of my day risk friends now rooms workshop, so there's really. This certain safeties settled around the Yucai of a real sense of self identity. You know, what they are? And I've always thought about not like a thing about Manchester. Jeffey old. Yeah. So great days. Ready? Great, bruce. That's why. Because you know, we go off the road. Sometimes going talk to people in Manchester or Jeffrey the right? The right to go to another. Yeah. Different vibe. But course, nor the I using that word vibe I use law. Yeah. What is it? What is vibe energy energy to become self on the go walking? Why were saying all time? A bit ever comedians times you'll pick up on of the people's linga. Do that someone's like drop in word choir? Yes, sometimes do saying. I'm saying dude for awhile Orage. Your director is dude. And that's when you like no well over the line. Doing. And it just comes out and even think about it. Sometimes, you know, your brain don't remount. Yeah. You can come outside your body and go what did you say how? Yeah, impre. Yeah. Yeah. Here is it. You're trying to give yourself another all outweighs. How long we spend just going over lies of the we've sides people overrun. Run run is in about stuff load thing. Devils were there. Yeah. I've learnt to do less of it because it is always to time slot. What we're talking about? Right. The beginning about getting angry another drivers from. I've learned to not of those ten minutes now. Yeah. Of course, down about at least, you know, stop good, just, you know, take the foot of the pedal and just relax. I don't. Interesting one in that not the problem. Do yourself time day, just everything just everything nyc mainly auditions go home, and I over analyze the whole thing is just whack the devil. I'm getting I'm really trying hard. It's just below right? Get little script pop in a little square for the open square and took it in the ban on stick in a box. Where not think about it. But I think not create if thing isn't it like you always wanna get Barry making things. Closely loans, g find that your. Eckel used to go are used to be more to what I am. Again of just kind. To not waste time. Yeah. I do think is because I put it down to not living deer. This does the shift. I personally for me. Yeah. I don't think about. Certain things that I used to when I was off as much. Yeah. Temps offer walk in the countryside. Just forget about it. Healthier for me. With is just. You know, things spout control sometimes and his Greg because I normal the only one now, you know, anybody who's not like this. I feel that would give a hard time because we're looking everybody's highlights on Instagram that is their best moments or Gino, just like you go one thing stop. But having the the everybody is that is idealistic thing of like, everybody's really happy everybody who's working is really paying like why am I even worrying about not I feel like they're a had a couple of I don't now what the time period was. But when I look back on it was ridiculously small compared to how I felt last year between jobs and yet felt like I had a great year last year. But at the time didn't and a wasted those weeks or compliments of just like not working worrying about not working. We're not she should have been enjoying myself because around the corner as I do or do go on. Learn two miles. Yeah. Thing of switch in switching your mind off. It's an hour. Yeah. It lot. What you were saying about auditions your after auditioning newbie thinking about what to do, very odd. And I think that's what he might have found our land in why I think I found when I go home tonight is like it's so much easier. The fingers I've got that. I've got a nice train Royd, right? Is it pretty it is gets big. Big. China say about Linda after swim them. No, no, no disrespect to the people. But it is very. Is not. But I've got that time on the train. Yeah. I'll train back around. And I'll be thinking about the episodes that have recorded today, and I'll I'll have to fill them and go through people's stores and just get them out of looked kinda do take that time to be by myself. And I feel very lucky to have that time to process I think that's what it's about giving yourself that time. Any self the Hooker? Yeah, let's off the hook. So nice. I like that. And also get out your own ways. Another one. It's almost impossible today. But it's a nice thing to newest thing is a star in point. Yeah. Really? Yeah. Yeah. You were talking about you looking back on the ear, and he recalled actually retrospect I did have a good year. I didn't have a good year at the time. Yeah. Or especially in the bits inbetween will there that they're important? But it's what you really have to look after yourself yourself and charge batteries and something I think like as been acting with an agent for ten years, but I started doing it, I guess professionally workshop maybe about fifteen years ago, but it's lowly becomes because it's the most incredible thing in the world male of it more than anything. It becomes everything it becomes everything. Even if you have a couple of days just a couple of days, it takes off in between things like, and you've already like feeling shake as you all of your senses need, it is is not a drug because you're addicted to is the creativity that I. Really love just love Cray in on the camaraderie on set and all that jazz. Sure, sure, you probably feel similarly in a lot of artists do, but like you forget that there's got to be other stuff that have been not a plan bay. No, the has to be not like your saying, you cheating on your lefrak thing. You just you just find another things that you enjoy as much sometimes it's really important to stop. Do either for. Yeah. Kind of take stock. I always think I never wanted to feel. The I'm on some sort of constant convey about because then it ceases to become. Yeah. Walk what you wanted it to be when you were younger or when he was starting out on having that Real Madrid. Leroy, you don't want it to come on it to be on the fucking Tesco checkout. Checking in beep light because out the same. Yeah. Yeah. I think stopping as healthy, mentally physically. You know? Yeah. Do need to take our know some people that just don't take eco-tank holiday holiday. Get addicted to read books again books. Incredible lie. I've just read and kill amok in bed. Taken me this long and some friends at school founded like a bit anti-climatic. But I think it's because like it's so great that you don't realize how great it is until you're old enough to really appreciate. Dictates tibet. I was really. Think of right at night. Three days is quite fast for me. I'm just near miss. I missed scout the character narrow she is. An audiobook at the moment and rarely enjoying that. And I thought to myself I took myself out of it while I was listening to left night going. I'm really gonna miss them. Out to stop it and going I'm thinking, I'm gonna make sure tell loads people about it. So then they can feel what what I was going through. I love that the parent in. You was looking after the baby news, listen, this is stop seeing. Really? I'm jealous that the other people. Yeah. I have that with your Sherry line of GE. Whenever wasn't seen it. I'm like a con I feel like I wanna scratch them over because you're now going to get to enjoy all of that. And seeing more. Yeah. Am generous. What do you do in the quiet times? Because you know, you're saying ages ago about not been able to switch you mind off. Yeah. Do you find difficult in sort of quiet a dark times? Yeah. Definitely. I think ever I think he can muster. How you react to it by think that like instinctive reaction that your brain and body house of going? Why aren't we doing the thing that we really love doing where we stopped? I mean is low signal that goes off in your brain. Alert alert like creativity like sensory under load or whatever. So there's a couple of things that they were. I love pain terrible. I'm not nearly as good as field in his beautiful works around his right now, but about being there. Sean for your honesty, the hours pass they fly and this year got my boyfriend mom decorating baubles for Christmas tree with me about some baked Masha who. Both rely. Comedy scale war knows and by the end of it their tongues. I'm outside of their mouths paint all over themselves because it was so carried away to rein them in. It was I've only got sick leave me just show all of his love that sort of thing. But we just we just don't do as much of it as you get older. It's not not cool. Is it light thrifty stuff painting crafty stuff Lova? Lova? Visit and keep your mind busy that night of just signed up to be a Samaritans listener. So I'm gonna have my training for that soon. Which means you go and spend four to six hours a week just answering calls for this. Martin's helpline really excited about doing that what spot. Ready to give him bog like and feeling like just being reminded about how big and complex the world is and what what other things people are going through the just so much more bigger important than not gonna job just feeling like useful, and helpful and their and human because you can just start to feel like a performing monkey, Jamie. Do you feel I feel like I I feel like I'm going towards that. Sometimes not because I over so many jobs coming up is not not like that. But in. For more that that's all. I seemed like that's becomes my identity. I am Andrey actress and then a human being after that worshiper. The other way around. So you take control of the. Yeah. Feel like that's seven poor in really at powers meal. I can't wait to start that. Because. Sound globe? Every all dead just disappear tomorrow. Yeah. That's it. Then you'd still be still view. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Gilady actor or one. Then a part of you would. Yeah. The missing. Yeah. Yeah. Why I guess I just be performed for myself all Jimmy things stopped altogether. Completely. Do you ever feel you ever worry though, that it's all what if you all went away? Guess would you? What would you do? I'd go spare. Yeah. Tonight you love boat. Yeah. I is the creativity thing more than anything else. It's the story talent. And I'm realized that more and more when pick up a book, and I get sad when it's end in pay in bowl and never now. Because women my boyfriend. I wanna make stuff. So I wanna be connected to emotional stuff as well. And that's why I think that listening in comes from like feeling and listening and helping and surgery. Yeah, passion. Yeah. Sympathy empathy all that jazz. So I feel like if you can find the things that you get the boys from outwear, venue gravy. You've gotta talk about gravy vegetarian every ever Tarum. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a pass Qatari now. None of when I was eighteen and became a vegetarian if eat Fisher, piss take a -tarian because fishes Delana MOS. And now, I am one which shows how you can become you know, they hypocrite. I don't, you know, don't talk about jobs that much on this. Yeah. I know. Yeah. Great just wanted to. Talk about the the bodyguard because. That will say backlash. It wasn't about last. Was it what there was something happened towards the end of an about specifically about your character? Yeah. To do the papers. Yeah. Could you tell me though about? I think that. I think that the ending was so an expected for people. And also, I think that we live in a time right now where? Islamaphobia is so. Rife and there's just so much like. Avar news. Our media is just constantly like it. Feels to me looking for ways to. I didn't know to breed hatred around one particular religious background or one particular group of people. And and I feel like. We just needs to be a drive of stories that kind of shape a more positive narrative around those people, I think that. I think party God took why? Why love about jets frighten? His is all about truth, and it's all about what is going on right now. And I think that's what he captured and bodyguard, really brilliant Nager. Absolutely. And I think that whilst jets and die understood dot character. And she was three dimensional to the two of us. And she went like, she went from being this, nervous or of light terrified. Seemingly disempowered woman who was a porn as says in the script for somebody else's evil work. And and then you find out she's the person behind it that told a story of like how women can be just as powerful as men and actually we have an assumption that women on. Con act on things in that way. And be that intelligent and be that must've fall. But I think what people took offense to. And I totally understand. It is that you didn't understand. And I think that jet and I knew this current. We understood why she was doing what she did. Because she comes from God knows what's like we decided what happened to family, you know, for her to feel the way she does the anger rage. The need for like justification and comes from feeling victimized. And and to to me her family had been brutally treated, and that's that's where I sort of found that anger and rage in justification. But I think because it didn't get there wasn't the opportunity to explore that in the script because it was loads and loads of different characters. And it was what I loved about. Is it really went round the houses in tune something on its head? You know, you went for we as a nation all when God is it's the politics, the politician. She did it seem secretary Nobis. The please note this person. No, it stop person always people were Caucasian. And I think there's a real truth in that. I think there are. Attacks terrorism. It's not just as cut and dried as we think is there is a lot of other motives behind things. Like that in the funding comes from places that would shockers in some cases, and the thing that. I think that's what it explored. But I think and I understood this when people out that they like you understood why Lorraine critic. Character headstone. What she did you understood why? The the guy that tried to take out the home secretary. He did what he did. It seem people die on the ninth seen people be treated really badly when he served, but you didn't really there wasn't an Trump's to explore Nadia's family. I guess that might have helped to understand where where that rage came from him for martime tell the story really really don't you really don't. And it was I created a back story. And that was all there for me. But I suppose. Yeah. I didn't know I completely understood where people came from in that situation. And I think everybody constantly learning about how we can be better talent stories better people's understanding of where this comes from Juno. Absolutely. I can do my best to learn everything about it. Like do every other character? Yeah. I'm learning. I'm really learning. We all do. Lovely talk. And. Yeah. And the land. Yeah. I really did. And another episode is finished. Our Angela she's welding share. So you down through CPA self reflective and grounded and just a pleasure to be around. So thank you very much for coming on. Thanks put it we may do this. Instead of Craig animal. Always my voice isn't built for radio Craig's dulcet tones. Those is not really the word wholescale. About it for this week. Thank you very much for listening unthank-, your which always listening to all the other absurd. Since the beginning of never a chance to speak on this. I will express my great you'd hear nice one CLA. Podcast is presented. Find me. Craig Parkinson recorded produced by Thomas Griffin for splicing block on music opera. Live music is courtesy often than that.

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#TSP083 - Connor Swindells

The Two Shot Podcast

59:29 min | 1 year ago

#TSP083 - Connor Swindells

"How are you doing? I'm crepe Parkinson. You are listening to the to shop podcasts yourself down public marital child who's with this. I'm gonna tell you right now. How did? Well, good. I'm glad it's Thursday. So yes, it's Abbott Eighty-three of the podcast. Thank you so much for subscribing and download in very short intro this week two things. I want to say apologies. I to you. Why Craig what you polish is in for now? I'll tell you you'll buy jeez. It was supposed to be arriving to your house this week. I've been called away for work. I'm currently recording this in a hotel in London. I'm not their own to stuff all envelopes, but I'm gonna get into it next week. So just bear with. Thank you so much. Another thing this episode, right? I want to preface episode with a warning really. This is probably the most candid conversation, we've had on the podcast and Michael a few only. It's the actor Coniston dolls now in if you don't know the name, if you send education on that fluctuation of talking about we if your in adult place or feeding brittle just just because for this episode because we talk about things, I we talk about death. We talk about grief. We talk about loneliness. We talk about alcoholism. And you'll hear in the conversation. The sometimes where there isn't any words, which is that's a very very natural to to just pose. And just let what was said. So brave. So yet, look I it's incredible. I'm really pleased the Konica mon- fell the could be so candidate. So. Yeah. So you just if you don't the great place, maybe just why? Or maybe it might be comforted. I don't know. I just thought important to tell you some of the topics that we Cova about Khanna's past wary is right now on sofa chief for the future. So let's get down. So okay. This is not three of the show podcast. We call us win. Those see it end. You've had a medical for job, whether people's I've had a medical only light. An actual physical touch medical just when when you have to take the thing hundred do you know what I mean? Yeah. Maybe that maybe they like touch you body of never got him Bose. I will last medical. I went to said I said. It was like having these calls because I very ready needs to go to the doctors because you know, touch wood very radio anyone will these comedy show anything. It's just for these purposes could be really L I want. All right. So that then spout off my worry. That maybe I am. I've got. Yeah. The bulls. Please help me don't say things. The all sorts because the reason why went not talk about this. Because are we going now as well? So my grandfather on my mom saw died from bowel cancer, right? And then my mom died from cancer as well. When when I was seven so of and it's actually it's definitely got worse. With moderate success have been through a main worries got worse yet. Because now, I think that would be fucking that would be the perfect ending to the story is oldest great notoriety in and now it's like you're going to die. So it's definitely got worse. And I'd never been to the doctors about before. And I was kind of hoping that he would be like. Yeah. I understand why you're bit worried. You probably find the moment. I started describing to me was that you have every right to be worried. What did that do to your worried about spiral out? Control does cemented. Did you feel you? Oh, well, if he's saying I'm right to that. I should be worried. Well, the other thing is is like. The reason why he said, yeah. You have every right to be worried is because you know, two people in my family have died from it. At the same time. If had said, I think you find it probably would have walked down and gone that talk to share. I'm still going to. And he was basically like you don't need to worry. Because if anything does happen, if anything does change, you know that you'll get it checked out. And I think both my think both my grandfather. And my mother one of the main reasons why got them was because they're from a family of travelers and stuff like that. Where you just don't go to the doctor until you dead you deal with things you saw exactly man up. So and that's probably what got them whereas on the opposite. I've such horrendous anxiety and health anxiety that I can't the moment. I feel anything. I'm like I'm selling this is especially in. That's my main. It'd be like the perfect. That would just be perfect all the time. But of course, he's going to happen. Exactly. At this moment yet everything else going right tick tick, I feel very happy. And of course, I'm just about to get one of by this. I do think that which is annoying because when things happen you can't enjoy them cone enjoying the because you're always worried about what's around the corner. Or what you always like that? I think I think. Yeah. I think so it's definitely. It's definitely something struggle with the law in that the moment have any sort of success or Akon Akon enjoy it because I just think fuck. Doc. Something's going to happen in two minutes, which is going to end. They couldn't leave my house because I was like I just have to if I got a job, for instance. I'll be I just have to be safe until I've done the job. And then I'll be fine. This is about mortality. Probably I think so I definitely have some. A weird. Complex about an always have obesity because most mamas such an early age. I think that would outweigh kinda when she passed a seven six I think six or seven she was forty six. I think foresee. But yeah, I think that definitely. Has had a massive effect on me and every way. Growing up an anyone that's lost a parent knows that as well. In terms of relationships as well is definitely. What does it do to license to make you not want to enter into relationship because you fair it's gonna end definitely went through that. Yeah. And now, it's more like. All the I fear all the things that mime. And at toys back into her gang cancer as well. I'm just. Just driving over here. Then I had to. Wife because my mom. My dad tells the story that he was at home, and she or he was at work and she called him up, and she was like cancer. And then I get that fear of like going make that fucking same phone call to my girlfriend be light. What does that do feel day in day out is does it stole things? Does it stop things, of course, sometimes stops enjoyment of things, I think? Yeah. I mean. Is definitely an everyday thing. The idea with that. And then, but then Paul if me feels. Have GT to also educate people on it as well. And maybe do something in that regard. And maybe that's why mom died from it. And my grandfather died from it is so I or. Know so that I can help people go in through that or whatever tonight. Sunday positive way of. Visit in that. If I'm being brutally honest with myself. That's also may being or maybe if I talk about it with people that I won't get. So it's so fish as well, you know, what I mean that's about. Yeah. I mean, you know, if you didn't talk about your fate ins, your everyday failings, and they were all. Then why are they gonna go? Then you'd be worried. Well, they don't get anyway. So they're gonna turn. It's counts. Yeah. Yeah. It's noble. I think I think. I think general. Anxiety. Anyway, just doesn't help and we both know working in. This industry. How? On forgiving and just weird. Your life is go friends doing apply at the moment. Which is about to open the national. And I just think I could never in the state that I'm in right now, I could not get on that stage every night and do that. But then part of me will say think, so maybe that's just why need maybe I need not to be in my head so much because I just predominantly do film and TV. So what does that change when he stepped on side? Do you that it does? But that those those a foreign feud between I mean being on lucky I've got a gig at the moment, so regular occurring gigs. I. But then. I'll be I'll get such horrendous. Hell things just going on about this. Now get a we're about to start filming season, two sex education. The next couple of months and Paul of me is just like just make it through just survive for that six mall. Right. He's with just over make that and then I can die. I'll be you know, what? I mean. That's how crazy I guess. Yeah. I'll be lot of just make it. So that if I can just make those. Do you know what I mean? Well, I know what you mean. Thing. But you do you do say, you don't think about it? When you go on. Yeah. Yeah. And what can you do? Well, your everyday life to incorporate how you feel when they say, well, I think paulie going to doctors for a long time. Anyway. So I think that's definitely going to be my girlfriend just said you need to fucking go to the doctors and get looked at by is hereditary thing in my brain that both my mom and get it from that side of the family of just burying your head in the sand. That's why I was saying earlier, I think that's where it comes from is. That is that's what got them is they buried the head in the sand for too long. And then when they finally pulled out it was six months left or wherever. I think it's lucky they're on more aware of that than they are. And I'm definitely more. Aware of my mental health than both of both anyone on that side of the family is anyway. You think this is more a mental health situation than a physical health situ? I think so I think so. Yeah. Have you talked to anybody? I'm starting to go to therapy now. Before it gets any worse. I think. Stem. My agency you go is that really great. And that the most understanding people in the world. When it comes to things like this. They yeah. 'cause they're they're support. You've got like go friend family. Sometimes the people that you were with day in day out need to no way, you are within yourself because that. It sounds quite close. But that salad new and its representation of them as well. So be that with you. They are the best. There have been plenty of times where I've just been con. Akon do what you're asking me to do right now because I'm just crippled with wherever it's listening to joy when he did this when he did the first one what was that like a year ago that was that was a year ago? It was more or less year around was it year to around the year to the day GRA between around a year between both episodes. Yeah. That was a massive hope as well. To know to hear his struggles with mental health and in things, and do you got to ever point? Why you think it's just you? I mean, even prior to that I do because my brothers who are both. So double my age. Anyway, they don't know what it is. But they just don't they just don't get it. They just don't get to talk to them about this. So I don't know what the word is. I mean, they're working class men and their men as well. You know, what I mean, they that both labors, and they also they're a different generations, actually. Yeah. And a different upbringing to me grew up with my dad who was very in touch with his emotions often, my mom died. Whereas they grew up with my mom on that side of the family, which was over will be out of loop. Anyway, bay for them about their failings. It's not even that they don't want to talk about it. They just don't get it. They just like why would I be it doesn't crash? It doesn't compute with that. Just don't understand that like nothing to be depressed about while would be depressed. I think well, don't you have a wake-up morning and just feel slightly anxious about something, and they just it's not even it's not even that trying to deny it trying to hide it. They just don't get it. So that makes me feel line because I'm on the front of the litter. That's somehow the mentally weakest out of all three of us and the physically the weakest some skin. Don't even think coping culprit as mentally weak. I think the somethin-. Very strong to be able to knowledge that even though uconn completely put your finger on not connected. The circuits aren't connected, but the you know that something's wrong surely that strength. No. I think so I think Paul of me is also like because I used to be a boxer and Batman Ohs doing that. I didn't give a fuck about. All this. I didn't. I didn't. I thought invincible for one. Yeah. I had a weird. I had the opposite. Had this weird invincibility complex where I thought it was on touchable. When a hard as nails. And I would've never worried about any of this stuff back men. So of things want what what was the shift in that? What was the shift in my mind from that point to now that has now turned the opposite? I think partly because I don't exercise enough anyway, not breeds anxiety. I think for me being an athlete anyway. Coming from an epileptic background. We always sports. Yeah. Yeah. I think so. But not typical sports football rugby by boxed for a long time as a kid and right? So yeah, I think. That plays a big part in as well. And the fact that. I now do a job that doesn't require me to rain wash myself into thinking. I'm toughest now's whereas in boxing, you do. So I know so with both you got on this release. You know, you're in the Ringo. You're trying is and you feel viciously alive when you when you're fighting. So maybe that's what's missing. I don't want to replicate that in my life. I would rather. Now talk about feelings with people then have to get punched in the head to realize that. I know. So now, you do the job. I can't get punched in him alone. We kind of got mad cracks hopeful ones by fire extinguisher. So you know, your nose and you'll see doing the job. The majority time you sat around actually just thinking. Yeah. But. I definitely. I think it would be good speak. I would recommend therapy twenty one. Obviously, I think it's just. Hard for me to to. Because I'm quite so aware anyway of me as well as therapist just gonna tell me things, I'm already telling myself. But maybe that's just what I need those things to be. So of what was looking for from the doctor today for him to be like possibly. Yeah. Suppose if you don't be showing, then you never know. Exactly. And then it would just, you know, let's go back to childhood, Tori. No. Sorry, my friend. Oh, it's all. Where whereabouts develop in a few different areas around west Sussex, moved around a lot. When those kids why why are we moving around because of the so I lived in place Chailly, which is sort of near Burgess hill. From birth to around the age of six and I lived with my mum and my dad's. And I think they that they split up when I was about five I think, and then just live with my mom, and I didn't really know. I'm a data. My dad moved back in with his parents right in. In a plate in a village called Wes Chilton where Sussex, and he I think he had been made bankrupt at that time as well. And he was a manic depressive as well. So he he moved by in with his parents because he needed to be taken care of needed people around him. And I think that was one of the reasons why they split up in the first place because it was about my mom, and then she got diagnosed with cancer when I think I was six and then she had like six months, and then she was she was dead almost seven. And then I moved. My dad saw showed up thought you were going to live with me now. And he would you done on the mend at this point on the the road to. Definitely doing a lot. Barry was with his dad, and his mom and may were. That for him. They were supporting it were for him. I think it just gave him a structure that you didn't have. Before. I mean, I don't really know. I think I think I think suddenly being faced with a child that you have to take care of and the loss of your wife to things that one is ready by than the others. Like, you don't have time to sometimes you don't have time to grieve when faced another thing, I think ceases to become about him. Right. A child to look after exactly. So then I moved in with him and his parents, my grandparents in the country, and do you have a good relationship with the grandparents? Not really I mean, four months after I moved in them grandfather DOI's living with right? So then it was just the three of us. He died from he had a massive stroke because he was he was boozing and drinking, and he wasn't telling anyone that he was having mini strokes. Because he lied drinking his mind contain much. He's okay, another and it had in the sound. Yeah. Fault. And that Cohen. And then it was just the three of us. It was my grand may and my dad, and she was so of a she was my mom for longer than my mom was ready for about ten years before she died when I was seventeen and we had a vicious relationship as well. In her. We hated the ground that we walked on. Really? Yeah. She was what that stem from. I think. I think I think a lot of it was worry on her behalf. If I look back now, she was more terrified always going gonna end up in a bad way. But I wasn't really I wasn't really rebellious owes quite quite I wasn't. I wasn't really doing anything wrong. And I think that worry too. I think she thought or why is he not rebelling wise, you know, acting up in school because she couldn't gauge coming, and then it would come out in anger, and I was just a bit of shit anyway, back home like I didn't told him on room and stuff like that. But she would get overly angry over those things. And then we also, you know, your mom passed by the US Evan. No. You know, we're talking about. Now, yo seventeen it's ten years. It's not like you've been in and out therapy dating with the growing loss of moment. So. I suppose shortly. It's gonna come in somewhere that that. Yeah. I mean, I look back now. And I do think everything she did for me. She did only do to because she was trying to. Help you. Mike meet hopes. Yeah. It would be stupid of me not to think that until look back and thing, but we definitely had a very. Rough relationship with each other. And she was she had just lost her husband as well. So she with data with its so how was your relationship with your dad at this point? And how was he with it himself? He was definitely. Well, we will all widdly sort of taking care of each other in that my grandma's basically having to raise two kids again. Okay. Yeah. One of them was forty in his forties and one of them was six or seven. And then my dad's probably felt that he had a juicy to look after his mum who had just lost her husband. So I and his son. So he was distracted by that things. So of really got bad for my dad after that gone away by the time, why was old enough to take care of myself. And my grandmother post away he saw spiral down darker path as well because he didn't I guess he felt like he didn't have any structure anymore. There was no doubt. I say purpose. But well, no, I think you're right because he didn't have to take care of you because you were slowly starting to become a man looking at yourself his Momo's around anymore. So yeah, you're right. I think structure so fallaway so that role maybe eight it as well. Yeah. And he he's definitely been a big drinker his whole life a thing. That's quite that goes without saying say, and that only made things worse as well. And I lived with him until for a couple of years off to. My granddaughter till I was about nineteen and at that point things, and he went mind me saying this, but things were really bad in the household situation. It was so of like every other day was having an episode where he would be like crying and screaming and drunken stuff, and he has really bad. He broke his broke his back ten years ago, and he's got ridiculous chronic pain. So it's this weird sedation thing as well with painkillers and now Oklahoma, and that's never good. No help and his mental state say, yeah. And he lives in the middle of nowhere as well. So there's no one to talk to there's no one to. You know, and he's not ready big into that. Anyway, we did said before is quiet with his failings. Yeah. He's definitely. Definitely more emotional than the other side of the family. Let's say. Uber. Masculine and Uber macho can't cry you, call him show, any pain or fear or anything like that be a stereotypical, man. Man. Looks like my students. Yeah. The rif. Yeah. But. At the same time. I have my older brothers. Who were there for me as well? When they were the best. They were always they always took care of me if ever I needed anything all you know, they Ruwais is there for me. And I feel like that was so of my mum's lost wish take care, brother. And I always have been in the best. If it wasn't for milder, brother. Daniel definitely wouldn't be an actor. Now. He was the one that often I stopped books in he was sleeping on his Sofer and go into doing rehearsals for community fears additions and things like that rehearsing community fish. I then going to all dishes sleeping on his foot because couldn't afford to go from Moines to where the auditions were. Okay. Lisa that was probably for a year. I did that stepped on his cypher and east got three kids and a wife. So I love it to another. I just gone off now, but would go everywhere he said if I pull back to my dad we were living together things were for a rough. And I. We lived in a council flat in west Sussex where there's nothing. I was like I have to have to get out there. Yeah. Because each day I was there. I felt like I was dying to like half to this place. What is the quickest way? All I could make enough money and just dash out quickly as a kid up until this point. I hadn't really done any acting or anything what was school like this. Get on with it, you keeping your head down horrendously in school. Just because I thought because all the up until I was seventeen I was a boxer. So I didn't try and school whatsoever. Because I didn't think needed school to be a boxer because I always going to do is go did you boxing going to be a job wrote? I think I think I think always deluded enough to I look back on my there is no way and how I could have been a professional boxer about the time. I definitely thought. So. Yeah. Of course, you much younger at the time me being weirdly obsessive and extremist. I mean, the food or famine either all in or all out what is it? Good of your actor, then because the games I can. Yeah. But with. With that came the loss of any educational any sort of academics. I could have. Gross. So I left school didn't have shit to me. What did you think was the next step when you quit box one? My brother said to me you're gonna have to come up with us on the building site because that's what you're going to be able to do now. So I was doing that. And quickly realized I cannot I'm I can't do this. And they knew that as well. So that saw spurred me to find out what I need to figure out what I'm going to think maybe that was a lesson to you to common. Do what we do in them figure out. What it is you want to do because they secretly needed this. This wasn't the life. Yeah. I think so. Yeah. There was no. Because the money if anything all thing to do. Back to you saying about what you're you. Maybe what you think you'll wish was your brothers to look after you. It's quite things that they don't have any money. Anyway, so me and my dad we had no money when we were living together. We would run the electric like the electricity. The key thing you go down the local shop, and we had that. And we would run that into the emergency. Everything is every single weight because we just to get a little bit more money on the Mondays. So that our week rent boy when we didn't run into the emergency rights. You know what I mean, the emergency? Yeah. The case law on it would go onto the. Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, we were we were growing up. Dot now. I was surviving. I think I mean, I mean, so the financially I don't know faded kind of wary within himself is your benefits working as econ? He's. Yeah. He's on he's on benefits, and if ever heat, I think another if every needed money, I would always give him money. A big part is well if I thought if maybe become successful as an actor it will make him happy oversee. That's never the case. I thought the kids my success would be could fix, and it just doesn't it doesn't happen. Doesn't work like that. You said that you'll relationship to that time was. Quite fractious. How's you relationship now? Now you've distant. Oh, yes. So getting distance was definitely the best thing that could have done for both of us is the case on times if that situation work, and we don't speak oversee we don't we live everyday together for ten ten years. And now, we probably speak once a month or so. But that's definitely what works now. And he loves off who the acting and the success that I've been lucky enough to get. But he definitely. He's definitely struggled a lot is whole life. And that. Makes me feel bad as well. As you know what I mean? Sometimes I think you may feel guilty. I think so I think. I think it's something that I might have to pay for later on in life is maybe that's just your worry. Again. It's. That. When I this is maybe an stuck in my head too much. But we all sometimes we all we all over thing every day, but at the supermarket we're over thinking. I think that's what garnered me into being. I have to be thankful for all the shit that happened because if it hadn't happened, for instance, let's do have found cancer. If my mom hadn't got it. And she hadn't died from online not survive from Gannett. Yeah. Sometimes get out she hand if you prepared for it. And then maybe you can work with it. So maybe that will happen to maybe. That's but maybe if that hadn't happened, maybe I wouldn't survive it. But another problem is the stuff with my dad if that stuff hadn't happened. I wouldn't have had such a drive to be half. The get the fuck out this house. You won't be exactly. Yeah. So I can't I can't not talk about all that stuff. But. You're just being honest, though, you think your? Disrespecting in any way, or sucking off. I mean. Just catching Logan. I'm talking about the past right? And I definitely thought. All that shit. The happens surely. I could take that and put it into acting. And if I don't then all that stuff is only just pain, and it'd be wasted. Really? She got one at least I can transfer pain into something else. When did you think about it? Because you, you know, you put you on that build inside. When all this is not for me where when do the this moment, it's been purely box. Yeah. So what did the home into it? I mean, I done like a mandatory Jaama clauses at school like everyone to and the teachers would always be like this is what you're going to do. But I always felt that it wasn't. Honorable thing to do because I because all idealize my brothers so much you worked on building such as I really just going to go around and pretend to be someone else. That's not what those skin. Do you know what I mean to reject the idea? So I tried to be a boxer. I don't try to be an athlete instead. And it was always like I feel like I've had no saying it really always kind of creeping back to being pulled this gravitational. Yeah. And then the moment I made the switch was like this is what I'm going to do all the stars aligned. And it was just like constant fluidity for the first time in my life. Whereas everything else, I did it was because pushing a rock up a hill and the moment I start to do acting of pushing it down, and it just let it ro. How how does that fail within yourself without point if that was the first moaning life with things? Seem to be connected. What was also one of the first moments. Anyone ever told me from the moment? I did something. This is what you're like. I didn't walk into a boxing. Gym have some you know, squinty Eids boxing coach show across the floor. That guy's going to be a champion. It was never that. It was the opposite moss ago. My head kicked in every day for a year before it was any good at that. But then the moment I started acting. I think someone came up to me and said was this is this is what you do you could do this. And that was a big moment for me of you feel that was a possibility within yourself. I remember the guy that I spoke to a man named Michael to cruise became like a mentor to me as well. He was directing community play Don in Brighton at the time. And I remember thinking in my head. I'm going to go up and speak to him. And if he going to say, do you think are can be an actor? And if he gives a hint of any slither of I'm going to boycott them never doing every gun. But on the flip side of this is what you're going to do. And that was a and then I went I just went for it was. I had never done it before. I didn't know I was doing. So I thought maybe you have to go drama school when you have to do that and additions and think in. So then how did that make you feel to that to a brick wall? Tear about g feel oh that's the route that everybody goes down. Or certainly a lot of people down in. You're going down there. What were you going to do next? Well, he said to me before that he was not going to be a theater guy because when you act you got you've got like ten minutes, and then it's done and the went on if I do it a scene, for instance, like you better hope the camera's rolling because often it's probably going to leave again, if it's going to be ready taxing for me. But that's just because I don't have the skill set to be able to go into a place and come out of it. So it tends to be even on sex. Ed there was a day where? And that's like a drama is really meant to be crying during that film all that show. And there was a day where just lost my head completely and had to leave for forty five minutes and JJ one of the producers whose amazing was coming over from being winnowed going to do again, if you wanna if you want to say, no to this. We can just stop and you can we can call it. I am. We'll see what we've got and try and make something that's amazing that they were so suppose so supportive because you know, a lot of young and even especially your car, these he's never himself to override the end admits a lot stuff. So you're datum with. Yeah. Oh, you might see this person on the outside. But you can't see what's going on within. Yeah. And I knew that to myself if I don't go back in and do this then filed of of been beaten by myself effectively. So did you stopped me from doing my job? Yeah. Did go back in and we finished it. And it was great. But. One thing is maybe on just to psychotics do think. Sometimes maybe I'm not out for this. Maybe this isn't something meant to just because I call an emotion handle emotions sometimes. And Michael said that he said you you can't play because you can't up there every night and do this because you'll die. And I know that I myself as well, I don't have the emotional stability or the endurance to be able to replicate high emotion nine after night like amazing actors do well, you say that. But I know I think credible. Who on stage? Probably one of the Hazel. Bryan is one of the best class. I've seen because it costs them. What you believe that? He's going through this this pain right that for your eyes. But it costs him so much and Fanta do a full-week he's physically drained mentally spent. Yeah. There's there's nothing left in the tank. Yeah. And I spoke to a brilliant director about the thing is about him. If he could only do three shows week. It'd be amazing. We get somebody else to do the other four or whatever it is. So, you know. Don't think you're alone in the actually. Actor I'm talking about fifties. So you don't do full can long-time really knows. He's craft. You do see peop-. I see people on state. And I go that cost. You know? Yeah. Actually. Yeah. I'm not saying it has to cost everybody something when they get that want to see the blood all the time don't need to see the snow and the and the pain the twos for do not believe it. I don't think you're what turns that don't think you're alone. Yeah. Not don't think I don't think you should ever think of that. As as a weakness not to. A block on the stage main. Yeah, it's definitely. Especially my girlfriend. She does tons of fish went to Rolla she's trained. She's amazing. So. And she doesn't spoil to do those types of things. But then at the same time. There's of me the. And just go back again to what Michael said to me. He says, you know, you'll do film and TV and that will be where you find your flow. And he was right. And he got me in touch with his own agent at the time who was a small time, so smallish agent. How old are you at this point nineteen right? I went for a couple of dishes with her my cousin who's a costing directo. I've been begging her for probably year aiming for something and this. You know, she was like what the fuck you talking about you want to be an actor you boxer like, oh, she she she on begging her constant issues like this. How do I know? This isn't just something. Like, I see serious actors come in here. Yeah. Why am I going to let you just walk in and take this begged her better and begged her and eventually she saw me for something and told me on the spot. Okay. Your not going to get this part. But you're great. So I'm going to send the tape to a few agents. And I'm not going to tell them that we're related. Don't want it to be nepotism or anything like that. Yeah. So people are very quick to judge exactly as business and she didn't want her. She didn't wanna look like that causing treasuries. Join cousin and she also made it very clear that you probably won't hear anything back because it's like showcasing for drama, schools and stuff. So don't get your hopes up and within a week, Matt Hamilton Dow woods or within a couple of days at Email me and I met with them. And that was a clear a clear decision. It was the best one ever made in a Cup of a month. After being with them. I got two jobs, and then a year layer to leads in film and then a year last sex, Ed, so. That sort of the journey that I've been on really. You know what I mean? Yeah. From Michael telling me, you can do this and used to search, Michael. Yeah. We speak all the time. Yeah. He's been. He was I remember. This is this is. I was so poor at the time. He was this was when I met him was when I was really going through it with my dad in the home situation was really on the rocks, and I had very bad. I think the pression I would cry most nights main because I was like, this would you cry for a specific reason? Or would you don't? I'm only going to live here in this. I'm talking when I mean poor there's no carpet on the floor. And there's a mattress on the floor, and I know shitty. Wallpaper and stuff like real rough. That was just a shithole of time as well. Because we had moved out of my grandmother's massive house where there was a swimming pool. My grandfather built and all the stuff had been taken this two bedrooms that we were living within box the city in this. I mean, this metropolitan of cardboard boxes. Yeah. So it was like just it didn't feel like a home. And then this whole tension was going on with me and my dad, and I kind of didn't fill out any family about point. And you feel quite lost at our point. Oh, yeah. For sure. Boxing, and soy phone in a way. And that was probably the only thing that made me keep my head down for a long time. And now that go on that one best and discipline at gone gone completely. Now, I wanted to be an idea war meant to do. But just knew though was wanted to do it is going to do it. Somehow, you still feel passionate about it. No. I think I really to and fro that now there are times where Matt insana gonna kill me San. It's there are times where I do. I'm going to call them up and they lie on done. You know, you say that understand why you're saying it. But this things that crippled on doing this. And you know, God. Are we now the now ninety something episodes and? And the especially when I speak to certain actors even to spoke to musicians, and they've gone, you know, what my record sales shit, and the I feel after the best work. I can do that no radio is playing may. What's the point? What's the point and actors feel that was one more time? I think create if an artist of all sorts just feel like it one point because you know, that fire was so strong. When I started. And it called burn brightly all the time kind of and I feel guilty because it's come with. So of success is now, and it's that which makes me wanna. Sometimes pack it in because I think. Especially because acting for me is so. Don't know how to do it without really doing it. So. In emotional scenes. I did a film. A couple of years ago called versus which was about this. It was about foster kids that goes looking for his mum effectively. Offer they've been strange for over like ten eleven years. So sore felt to me of this is probably as close as I'm going to get to ever actually, seeing my mom again or saying the things I always wanted to say and in those scenes that were they were just so. Horrendously taxing for me. And I had no. Way of. Getting out easily like people just stupid. Let people would have to come over and cuddle remember did dishing Judy Hawkin. And she in not addition, I can even get to the end of the page 'cause I just broke down in tears, and everyone was around giving me a hug and stuff. And I just thought this is not what I meant account attorney conscious Thane this and you'll I'm not I don't have the. Wherever muscle is. I don't have it to other things about also made nuts. Release of some sort of your tapping in tip sort of your past grave, which is for you know. That's amazing. But it's also shit when you're doing scenes where you're not trying to do that, suddenly flooded tears and run out of set, and he'll broke. It's actually when I wasn't. It wasn't even required to just sort of happened. And that's when I think the con- do this anymore. I don't care about for can don't care enough to be able to to have to go through this all the time. And then it will solve I won't work for about a year. And then by the time about years everything I can to get now. Luckily enough or get a job. You just you know. Everything sort of breaks down with that specific job hundred percent goes in. But then you need that time off certificates and put yourself together. So the needs to be some control than the. And I think you know, as old that time that Eurasian has shorten right in between jobs in between bright does that mean because you you'll get more control over all the hidden times quicker. Both. I guess both. That surely a positive. Yeah. Yeah. And I think. And been girlfriend is she's definitely helped with that. And that she is an actor. And she sometimes I it's that that thing sometimes I'll catch myself slipping into that old thing of thinking, the I'm not doing an honorable job or because of my brothers, and what they do that they really work hard for that. That's coming into. Yeah. Well, there's also the fact that I can't handle my own emotions is coming in. And then all the other show of li-. Oh, now, you know. The phone hasn't rang. So now, maybe so then there's that on top of it as well. That's always going to be that, you know, the phone thing. That's just palm. Absolutely do. We can never control the other things. At least we can try and get a grip on at least. It's a healthy way forward within ourselves. My girlfriend. She could she's great theater actress, she has definitely taught me that. Oh, I've been blessed to work with such amazing people. I did a film with Peter Mullen when I was twenty oh, and he was and he we take each other all the time. And he's just he was the best mentor to me of being like, and he we saw have had similar situations with our dads growing up in condom sim- similar way. And I think he definitely and he really took me under his wing. And just is the first one to be like. Yeah. But you actually have to feel it made. You know what? I mean. Like you come fake it. You can't fake. It don't have to feel it and understands that you know, sometimes you can't help but feel it in certain situations. Because it is this weird thing where you replicating something that might have happened to you. And it's hard not to it's hard to detach from that something that's why I override and it can get out of control. If you say if you all break down, it's caught the was caught but you're still in a code bowl in the face position on the zone on your eyes out. That's not good for you. Alastair patriots. Well, you plays my dad's sex educator, locally my fucking best. It was a particular scene that me and him were doing together. Like, what was worse is the my my girlfriend is Amy in the show. Right. So the scene that's happening. What's taking place where from is about two hundred extras in the room, and she's kissing this lovely actor named Chris jank's, and I'm in the scene on watching this happen. And then the scene comes to a head with me telling my dad that I hate him affectively, which is out of the picture. So all start crying this thing with my dad, but all two hundred extras think I'm crying because I'm seeing girlfriend kissing. This lovely lovely, man. He's a lovely man. Yeah. He wouldn't hurt fly. And he's freaking out like what the fuck is going on. But this kid and now I've run out screaming and the crew ally gone on JJ's run after me mcgovern's run. After me, I'm citing Cardiff from the surgery bowl in my own live. But then Alastair he comes he came over. And he was like listened and he. He completed situation, and he was just reaffirmed reconfirming that like, you know, you don't have to this isn't rail right now, you know. You know, it's it's you have every right to feel those emotions, but you being an actress your what you're going to your lesson is going to be how to control yourself. Yeah. Which you don't have a grip on right now. And that's fine. Because you twenty two exactly no twenty two year olds do. Now, you're doing this weird thing where you sort of. I haven't done it before. So I'd also a lot twenty twos are all thrust into be like all these leads in this Ross if fucking dropping around the world, and everybody's dropping the cats, and it's like there's a lot of stuff that somebody who's been acting for twenty years when I was when I would never I would do that. Now, it's wanting to remain. But he obviously this is Jay Jay Z producer, obviously. He's created a very safe environment fuel to do that and to fail that. It's okay. Yeah. Which doesn't happen law. I mean, it doesn't, but it doesn't same time that would be places where people would be exploited. Yeah. It's definitely of how to be a safe environment for because that's all I was thinking of when I was watching. I was enjoying it. But I was watching as an actor go call these kids are no of the looked-after fish show. Will we get the best the best team around with making sure that everything's fine. Because is the most light fissile naked experienced, especially for the goes on it. But. Yeah. I mean, how'd you feel going forward? You think you'll? More control over yourself think that. Just not afraid to. Tackle my own problems. I'm just not afraid to. Not free to be. I think the difference between. I'm trying to say is that I feel like acting for me will always be this push pull like is with every actor. Yeah. And the. Shouldn't be so. What's the word? Like, I shouldn't think of myself as this imprint because that's what it boils down to is me being like, oh, I'm sorry. Much thing. That would you think you're just giving yourself a hard time about that? Because I I mean, you know, we've just been I've just I don't think I don't see that. It's all the any of you. Of course, I've just met yet. But I I don't think so I think that's probably giving yourself a bit more of a hard time than what you should to be honest. Maybe I just filled it sometimes I feel a bit. I definitely feel. Guilt on some way in some level. Because of this whole thing with my dad and then. I definitely don't read it. Maybe I'll never figure out. But the fact that my mom, I mean, any problem of ever experienced with my life can always be brought back to that moment where died and getting to terms with that that there's always gonna be this albatross flying over my head, which has hers pointing effectively coming to terms with that will never go was hard. And then dealing with that all the time is hot sell light June. I mean, turn to the fact that I'm never gonna get over that really, you know, because he's always going to be there watching over you really feel like I missed out on they'll be times where I'll be in groups of people that are talking shit about their mom or something like that. And I'm like, no fucking idea. I wish I could hide shit Tacoma. The course or will be hanging out with everyone's family, and I'm like, I don't really have this structure, and that can come across sometimes as OB sat in a group situation. And I'll just and I was talking about this today with a couple of friends. I'll just completely emotionally emotionally fat line. I just can't. And I'll be sat thinking I haven't spoken fucking twenty minutes. I need to be an icon, a mice. I compare come. Literally paralyze ahead. I'm like screaming. I need to say something right now. Because and I'm definite made on definitely a super sharp person has probably seen that wakes up. Just fucking more. Done. But nobody see I could send I can sense that shyness in you, totally from oven this conversation with you. Again. That's that's why you know. We'll we'll know those. Actors who are kind of making on that. That's the journey through. They are always there. I don't know. Insist don't give me this time. Yeah. So how'd you fail about moving forward and star in this other series? You're going gonna get more more a grip. I do I think it's just about. And sometimes I do stop giving myself time because I think to mice. I think. Because of the whole hard situation. I grew up with them to grow up super fucking quick and had to take care of myself very early on because I felt like couldn't and me and my dad not having any money and then living with him. There was always felt like I didn't have someone where if shit really went wrong couldn't call up my dad and be like died need twenty to get the bustle. Yeah. I just didn't even have that suicide caso always have to make sure I've got enough money if ever need it because there's no one that I can rely on to come and help me if I get in trouble not because many ones four, but because my dad's disabled the knee lives on benefits who has bad enough money from self. Take care of seventeen year old kid sixteen year old kit in the my brothers live really far away in a heartbeat. They'll give me money. But if it was midnight that be is that I think anyone that's been through that. Guess what? I mean when I say that it's just can be hard not knowing that you've. Got support if ever you needed it. And now appoint Ramli why have money now and of people around me, the love Maine care about me. So the thing about is. I don't now a fucking push away them because you lease. Yes. Constant push and pull of had done would you to leave now? So I'll just push your way away. Exactly. Yeah. And then I freak out the moment. Those people do leave or show any when someone challenges that cools might laugh than freak out. When by definitely, but then I'm like, that's just me up. I'm twenty two exactly need to stop treating lifelock. I'm forty five which is feels like a half done for a long time here just pasta being forced to grow to quit, right? Just speak about money. Do you? I have a different different. I think. Do you? Respect money. Now, if I catch myself on earn it yourself. Do. I mean, I caught myself today Moco from having a debate. And she said this thing of why do actors get paid more than other actors, and I said, well, if I was to get paid more than someone else is because deserve it. Did you get my fucking mum died. I deserve that money. Why? Okay. She went. Okay. Right. And then I saw defending that today. Grew up, you know, me and my dad we had no money grownup. So of course, I deserve that money. But then also poverty is like we should get paid the same. I mean, why Moyes this person not getting paid as much as this person? And why the boys can't pay more than the goes wherever it is. But then I think if someone was turn around and say, we're gonna pay you, blah, blah, blah, to do this film and everyone else, but you know, everyone else is going to get this much. My first instinct would be. Yeah. Roughtly fucking. The whole pie hole of the puck self Khanna. Thank you so much rumors. Sorry. The, you know, who don't do you enjoy what you think you come back on the series to me, all one absolutely nice woman Nike. And another episode is done, and there's not really much to say after that. I've listened. I wanna thank Connor for coming on. And being so candid, and honest and you for download and subscribe in and that's it. We will see you next week for episode eight four until then I've been Craig Parkinson as been producer graph. And this has been the to podcast you take yourself guy. Shop podcast is presented by me. Cry pockets of recorded produced by Thomas Griffin for splicing blocks on music opera. Live music is Kersey often than that goes.

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Getting Cast as a Foreign Actor in the UK With Zuzana Spacirova

"Diary of an Unemployed Actor"

37:16 min | 3 months ago

Getting Cast as a Foreign Actor in the UK With Zuzana Spacirova

"Feel good. I. Feel Fine. Welcome to diary of an unemployed actor with me Milo Denison. Each week I speak with up and coming actors, actresses, and filmmakers about the entertainment industry would discuss success failure in sheriff few tips to inspire those of you who have a passion for the creative arts. Today I will be speaking with actress Zuzana SPEC Ryava. Who is a wonderful london-based actress? Parsa way through ask her if she has any entertaining. Audition stories or bad auditioning stories, and she talks about one where she showed up late and at an with the addition and it's kind of funny because this week I had a very similar audition myself. So it was four A, it was a small small role in a short film it was. Only a few lines. So as did this self tape at home, which is pretty much what they always ask you to do now in went grade I think I'd nailed it sent it off. And of course, they call me for an in person audition grape the in person audition is north of London so I'm not gonNA explain the geographic London regions or areas to say I live in North West. London. This place was north of London but in order to get to it, I had to take a tube or underground line. To central London from there, take a trainer overground line to North. London. So all in all about an hour twenty hour and thirty minutes, not a huge deal. So happen might. Tube train get down to central Annan get onto the train going north literally within like two minutes of leaving the train station the train stops, and this is last week, which we were having a bit of a heat wave in London. So I know most people in most places, the world wouldn't consider this heat wave and I totally agree with them but we're not used to here in London which means they don't have any kind of air conditioning on trains or subway systems or anything like that. So. I'm stuck on this train with no air conditioning at all sweating terribly trying to get to the sedition. So text the producer and say, Hey, running late train stopped, which by the way something that happens a lot in London. The Mass Transit System is very unreliable here, but that's beside the point. So send that text message than the train starts moving in like great train started moving gelman slater stops moving again, eventually get out to where the destination is and I still got about fifteen minute walk from. The train stopped where the edition is being held. So I kinda haul ass to get to the place. So I arrive probably about a good thirty minutes late sweating exhausted, and since I'm late I pretty much go straight into the room and do the edition now the girls running, it were very nice and very great. So nothing against them there they're really professional and wonderful. But of course, going through all of this, my brain was literally fried I think I forgot the lines of the the piece. How, Shit, for the Lions as she says it to me I tried again forget the line again and so I grabbed the script start reading from the script and do the scene from script and eventually you know we do it once and and I see it comes back to me and she gives you some directions I do it again based on the different directions but the reality was is like I was not in the right mindset I. Just I wasn't there I wasn't I wasn't into character I wasn't. Doing it in actors know what I'm talking about. You know when you're in the right zone and you know when you're not and I definitely was not so suffice it to say. Left the dish him get on the train coming into London and the train was again late. So I'm stuck waiting to get on this train to get into. London finally into. London. Finally, get home hours after I left and I think. It's obvious by now that I didn't get the part haven't heard from them, and once again, no fault of theirs I wouldn't. I would question their sanity if they did cast on, me, cast me based on that audition. So that is my addition story of the week. Hope you found that somewhat entertaining and I hope you enjoy and find my discussion with Zuzana somewhat entertaining. Enjoy. This episode is sponsored by Anchor DOT FM if you haven't heard about anchor, it's the easiest way to make a podcast. In fact, it is what I use for this podcast. It is free it's easy and this Mitchell, our podcast services, such a spotify Google podcast and apple podcast. They do this for free. Some hosting platforms will charge you a monthly hosting fee and you have to distribute it. Yourself. Anchor has built in creation tools that allow you to record and Eddie your podcast right from your phone. Or computer providing you with everything you need to make a podcast recording interviewing editing and publishing. We don't do podcast for the money we do it because we enjoy making them money is nice and with anchor, you can make money from your podcast with no minimum listenership. Some services require over two thousand downloads per episode. Before you can monetize anchor, we'll let you generate ad revenue. If you are a smaller podcast like this one, download, the free anchor, APP or go to Anchor Dot FM to get started. Cool. All right. Well, let's get started. Then I question is what's Kinda got you into acting what made you want to be an actress come I guess I was. A young that's late night at eighteen sat say. Yes just kind of you know you can attract find place where you belong and I just couldn't quite figure it out always kind of went to always. Going in steady something interesting Joe. The idea was just kind of boring to me I was listening to do something more in. Different as date. And Then I joined small kind of community theater and everybody was just as weird as me. It was great. And I just felt like I belonged that. Enough to pretend to be anything else just could be myself, and then I can say to. That I don't can't GonNa is what I'm GonNa do did you study theatre in college and now? I, studied just. Regular I think is going to. University. We have. Yet. And then finished. Just. Oh, you can study Madison. The actress. To. Have you planned to make money if you're going to be an actress. You just Kinda. Why did you go through? And I kind of advice drums crew and I didn't get. They said No. By next year no. They said no by the district know. And it kind of gone through much of knows and nineteen twenty. You can you don't really have strobe leaving New South? I, didn't at least. Michigan case them. Out just tried to do something else. When blended origin was just to get a job. Something, House just have to surrounded by older people that walked out when Doing acting. And I was waitressing and being miserable and no being able to get any anywhere or else, and I was walking interview Joel Without Me Fest Three four years living in London, and then I kind of cited them negative show as as Until. Happy. In. So you were applying for drama schools in Sorry. Did you say Czechoslovakia's that we? Did they. Why? Why didn't they accept you for the schools like was it? It's did they give you reason multi don't usually give. Okay none of those things I guess. Any K people investor town comes to costing you Don Sutton. You'd have said look. Just kind of be Tola Loan. I mean not that you have to look like to get droughts yet, but you kind of need. Charging kind of the day notes foul. Is Industries. They're so small. Almost as very soon, enough space to. Have people maybe just look dysentery and I was very short and. had. Like an elegant Voss uk-us. I just didn't belong there told. Like. I feel. Thing I would be happy. With waiting walks. So is the fact that you got the knows over there that motivated you to come here and it actually worked out when he came over here. So is kind of. ENDED UP NEXT E. Did you go to school studied acting here then when you came here on yes. So you worked for a few years and then studied acting yeah. Yes I. Guess. We sat never. None. Try to take few small evening acting just to get into it and he was Oh, it was weird. It's just speaking it was. Sunday. Say Mines that. Somebody, else return it. I just couldn't. I just started like. Omitted And then that kind of I would tend drama school or year. And that really helped get my oceans and. She had the language. Did they teach you was stage acting that they focused on ORF among? Many drama schools in UK Lsu religious studying screen. Do folks say seems like an dot screen acting close refried news. So. onstage. Will your accent you have a very British sounding accent. So did you spend time working on that or would did I just pick that up just from living here? Just picks it up. Then there were two. Little things I did notice that doing. So I would always any British friends I have. Especially activists would make them listening to meet just A. Conversation. Just stop need had said something that wasn't. WAITS TO BE. OR A. Bogey she's been my t h beginning. Pronounce it eastern senior in ways the not set. This, you say this that. I she law you have to watch yourself. Actually. That's pretty good. Do you find then as you audition if they're looking for as you do do people sometimes call you out like traditions where you're playing a British character in lake. Your accent's not quite British enough. Yeah I've been kind of why do You really see I see. So. When that happens that she always you. Feel like. It doesn't say I can do you might. Say Anyway. And also I feel like the hey, don't cost. Foreign Passan who they can have just someone. Doing their own accent. which is backed by I. Complete the accent but then. is still cuts someone from. Much like Russian so that You'RE GONNA accent. So It's of do both ways or don't do it. That's my experiences well, because I can't do a very good British accent but also competing against when they're looking for somebody who an American accent competing against the British person that's also doing an American accent yet. Do you think you have a harder time finding roles then or defined that now that you've been here long enough and you and you've acclimated well enough it's yours as competitive as anybody else going earl. I feel. Still Than Rich Best. But. You can see that industry's changing you could see you need to have such an age bracket you told me to. Sin Song's. Stand you. Find that the lowered budget? They willing to kind of be. Under strict. It yeah. Exactly. Yeah. So they like the. You do see more especially, actually break. You see much more. People Gossip for your ear. Now. That's good. Yeah. As he's from. Mainland Europe. With. Talion French Ukrainian college and. So they'll they. Look like yeah. I could play someone. Eating to have had really good straight look at yourself and say, where do I look like? How a sound and then maybe will. Yeah that's good. That's important. I think especially for a lot of actors starting out they kind of think I can do anything and you need to be a bit more self aware and say we can't do everything. So focus on what you can kind of do best and of you know then maybe branch out a little bit. How did you find your first? ONSCREEN acting job. Just. A yourself screen. Time in bed we so critical of ourselves. And it does say each you just need to get you stood. Okay Yourself. And Be, this is not looking at era this much. Much. and I, feel like a now I actually do not enjoy it. I find that G. Mice. In a done Lonzo much. Okay this. Screaming. And just kind of. Things and money and take it to the Metro. I definitely becomes less scary as you go I just the to you to so earn your nights Ended find actually counselees. Accent. And actually morals. Today do the all. Trying. Go Out. Lights with. Helda. Even know though I, enjoy kitchen this right out from. Realistically speaking. Oh. Okay. So you Kinda gotta go the path that has more opportunity for you. You've worked on. Short films and feature films. Do you find there's a huge difference in between being onset between a short film and a feature film or is a pretty consistent? There is not much difference. I. I'm sure it. And That he'd. Just. Moved Land and. Anytime I need if each so it's Two. Days for week that's an you don-. Of. Short. Look good excursions to have to have meat raw. It's. Just this. Is just so many things you think. You know film ONC-. In March seen in. June. They. Just while they offer each other and you just need so clustered in it to. Increase needs to be in it so much in. So, well because I know how having spent. Concentra film. Just happened to me was when I realized. Then you will. I seen. This. Moot. I just came across started. which didn't make any sense. that. Okay Is Very well, it might be. Do you. Are you one of those actors that likes to watch the take in between scenes or D. preferred not to watch it and just wait and see it till it's actually complete. One of those didn't want to. Now And I can see that. Okay. This different way. Central g something you always come gross. Yeah. Hounded and camera citing very. Useful. At least two other Ucla like in the performance of like what you can do to tweak to make a little bit better and then go into the next with that. Yeah and also you can get emotions. Ten let's take an example of a film that Yorktown. So you work done call suppression which I think is coming out this next year, right? A BACK Exchange. All right. So how did you get cast in that? How tell me about the addition process for that film out actually I didn't know this. The only one I. Did notice. I remember for it's on WHATSAPP Romandie. About so worst and most independent films cal stat. And Fine for it. Straightaway. And You Looking. And spoke of the to look. He didn't actually won't be to which. You Trust me law. As it. Fresh me when her throat. What is now standard? But it's always the voices thing. What should you get it? Into a trip finally show me. Why because? You should have gone someone else. Bush. It's just. Going on. So it's like trying to get you know. How do you remember that little voice? How do you make go away? I think a lot of actors have that while there's the balance, there's the actors that they're brilliant. No matter how bad they are, and then you have the other actors that are the flipside of like terrible even though they're get I'm so sounds like year on the flip side where you really think that you're worse than you actually are so howdy. How do you feel you can get over that? Just trying to balance it out. No. Knowing issue. And you had the as exist to get you that and everybody needs. As nobody's. Inaugural shoot somebody is. Eighty times and scratchy time to when you read something because it's not going to be. Shakes. Read any te-ok nobody select. Help. Is, it's OK to steaks. And don't. Go again and then also. He do. In a healthy way. To the point to where it actually hurts the performance because you're so critical, how do you which process for memorizing lines? I practice that someone. Style. Find monologues state on that established one because. If I was from. And I. Say. If you listen to the outback two in if you don't delight accent. Pack keynote at of how Jewish? Even she said he's been lying to stay. The same thing just. So I tried to really listen. out where spy catches orange, mentally how am I? Am Cova and he know Dr. Congo want just. Miserable and then at the act that's not wait. Looks me. And how how you feel what you're trying to get. From this. Conversation from the US. And then Empower my kid which just. Basic I. Guess. It's Drops. It just works. Now makes sense. I'm curious because you mentioned spotlight at one point and I kind of have a hate hate relationship spotlight because. If you need an eight if you want an agent in London or people care so much about spotlight in, it's just a website in my opinion, a casting website, which is. You know Mandy or any other ones? do you find you get a decent amount of work from spotlight defined? It's worth being on there. No idea leaks. Since replies but. As he should have. Take seriously. It'll take you. To be on it. There is often. Known, single costing. Yeah and you have to pay to see what's it get. This. yet beyond go. Free or full-frontal costing I. Were they You got jobs through spotlight or was additions? Yes. I don't find very many. Of you can't see old. Classics Agent See that. Pencil H temple. I don't feel in the right agents. So far API like a need I h back. Folks on its lactic. Yeah it's hard. It's hard to find a good agent when you're starting out especially, I think more at a certain. You know stage in your career like it's great. If you're in a list celebrity, you know all the tops agents want to represent you. But. If you're not, it's you know the balance of finding an agent versus finding a good agent and it's the good agent. That's the key. That's an. Engaging substance. It's any need to just click. IT IS A. That takes go. Yeah, and it's just funny because they're like, are you on spotlight that doesn't necessarily mean you're a good actor it just means you're on a way that you managed to talk him into. Did you have a hard time getting on the sites in the first place or did they accept chill? His lip. Action Pretty quick create. drowsy. into. I don't. He. Felt. Oh. You like one of those things in. US Anti Eat. Still, so good land. Cycle Michael. Yeah do you have any audition horror stories like crazy additions that were like oh? My God that was weird or you walked out of there saying, I don't want that at all anything like that let's say shouldn't for. fell. and. I kinda neck Johnny. Catching. meaning. We'll see late. London. And Finally go fast freezing. On was. Horrible horrible speech. Sales. Magic. To my mother scrape. Right, there's no great. Room. Table. Which? I eat. And try his. My mom died my mom died. Range, try a convince yourself. Just I think it was quite late. Yet. You already cost. Would they will ted? A Minority. Any harm kind of. Movement in one of their phone. And also. which I was really upset A. And I think that when people don't give the time you come here no the lines if I was lane and I don't know anything. Funny. Come Pat. Units of your attention. Don't come this. Way. And they just don't. Always that's was I didn't have any kind of. Insult. So when you went in there, they told you, they already cast it nowadays in. Way Of. behaving. Interested actual. Then when you kind of realize. that. I'm so no right. Thing somebody. Happens to me via two wins. Very. It's okay when I'm already cost like Sean. Devising grosses of doing some in creating term struck. And he's just you have the group an your motive is Colorado. And it's for review and. Credit. And everybody who is just seems to. Read the next. I I need to know the people before and. Find out what was just very embarrassing. Stressful. Mexicans inside comfortably is delicious. It's just Austin as. Vice way of additioning. Yeah. I don't know if you've ever done up I was still. All any theater auditions I've done of either been doing a monologue or reading from the script with. Their voiding. Which I think is works because you're reading the characters in the play off each other and were in sound together only weird audition. I. Did like that was the effort theater school where they like they put you on the with other people in they're like you've just been born and now live aid I'm GonNa say Oh my God. Okay, just ask you to the callow or no. It's And grown up twenty year old woman of no being object. You wait houses helping. The night I know. By. To See, you have improvisation skills but I do. something. That would be. That if you just started breaking out laughing and being like two. Oh They sure. This is yet. Away month. This horrible replenishing is for film Scooper Jay and. As meant to kill someone in the scene where doing. Thank you passing. People play the character is. At the end Beguel is meant to kill. Passionate trying to kill the boyfriend and I read script wrong and it killed the boyfriend in. June. Those pretenders. That's well somebody got killed there you. No Gun just like. Did you. have. You ever been cast in something or gone for an audition and then afterwards decided not to do it for any reason of like you know what? Now that I know more about it I don't think it's the right project for me yet, I. I used to take over. After that we start. To build you see. In. Just. So that's Been floating needs to stop intellect. and. It took me a while realized I. Did you very in my? Old I took three. And especially way you just. And so much time. Sick. Lenny wise. Filming Week. Two weeks. And yet I did. About Oh. Will I mean? A. realized. That actually. If I was dating. This didn't. I, just talk myself I could. have. Anything to. One nuking. Attract. Side. If the Russians did when it comes filled and you'll see. Hayward. Crew to. and. I learned how to. Read My. Pain how I Doing that. Regretting. High. Trump yeah. It's actually going to be a good quality. And combat lighting that camera. Obama just makes even goods cramped or scrape. Aris wealthy. Yeah, especially, with him, I, mean because that. Essentially follows you for ever. You. Please nobody ever. In. How This. So, yeah. There's not. I quick ninety percent in less. Actually Asian crowd yeah. People about you didn't show it. To showroom. Just for. Doing something. Yeah. Well. Do you. You mentioned red flags. You look for those at during audition when you're talking to the director or I know sometimes you know after addition they might say do you have any questions for us do ask them any questions that kind of help give you an idea that's a good project he has to say It's the first nurture walked. Usually. I can't. mission. Tragic. Look. People. There is. And he hadn't is kind of. Like there. is a dark seems should. Good crew. And that's Just I'm. Just GonNa. Make. Yeah, the crew makes it such a huge difference in that. Don't think people realize because you've got to have the right people around you. At a a a director contact me about something wants and then he sent me is previous take a look at my previous project. You know 'cause like thinking that it might encourage me and I watched it was so bad I'm like I'm like I. Trust in working on anything. That you've done because this does not this does not sell it to be. Helpful yes. Just of don't cheat see. Any interesting thing in the special skills section of your CV that people would know about some unique skill the have that you. Why stock in children's yet? Jokes and So I do think I'm quite good. Packed. Creating characters theatrical. and. went to I still want to use not in in a way so i. would. Say. That's Just GonNa. Cry. Can can you juggle. Yeah, John. Well. there. Yeah Yeah. I remember I. I put once slacked. Nine. You should do more. Than I think we've been we'll. Always. Back in my mind. It's been something that wants to stop rousing. Cheer. Every. so I am the. Yeah I I doubt. Tracks led. To. Is it like a like a one person show or is it a? Yet no no like easy. Way To skin stop in Europe and see how how you actually get. Out. Your seat ideal. On and then we would. On. Two. have to. You know memorizing lines. You. Acting like I'm from what? I mean it's just Silly he's nasty. That's great. Do you have anything coming up that we should be on the lookout for suspicious coming out next year? We hope thing. I believe frequently. In short. Not, gotten back to Poland she a leak Sirius Channel slow you don't get like Ono. and. I initiating experience now we? Will See to not that. As well and hopefully like. Genie. TWEET IS IT COMING FRENCH LAST YEAR When eight Ro- Entrenched laws and Wisconsin area. Consult as quickly as. Returning. Waiting to see like when the sater's open and if they're going to have time time. Because it was meant to be got smoke the justice that they have he. and. So they go your. What was the play called? Okay. All right. Last question if people want to find you anywhere, where would they find you a social media website or whatever? So Yeah I have my signed signing. And Mine's grab. Each I will. Link to both of those in the show notes. So if anybody wants to track you down, they can click on those and if they're casting for the next great project. Will. Thank you. It was fantastic talking to you Zuzana. Fantastic talking to you. Thank you very much and enjoy.

London Zuzana US Anchor DOT FM Lions Annan Zuzana SPEC Milo Denison Eddie Joe Don Sutton producer Europe spotify Mitchell North West Wisconsin apple WHATSAPP Romandie
152. Late Night with Emma Thompson and Mindy Kaling

The Guilty Feminist

1:00:17 hr | 1 year ago

152. Late Night with Emma Thompson and Mindy Kaling

"Hollow guilty feminist this week show is different from usual. We recorded it before, and after a very special advanced screening of the new film, late night, written by Mindy Kaeling, and starring indicating and Emma Thompson. So firstly you're here, Emma Thompson, and may talking live at the picture, how central before the screening. And then you'll be able to hear me having a private one on one with Mindy Kaeling at a press junket in London. And then the final part of the episode will be more of me and Emma at the picture house after the film is over there might be one or two, very minus boilers, for the film, but nothing that's going to ruin your enjoyment of it. So if you'll soup spoiler a phobic, see the film, I and come back and listen to the rest of the episode, but otherwise dive right in, and you can see the film at a cinema near you from June. Seventh try and go opening weekend. And send a message to Hollywood that we love films written by women and driven by women. Now, own with this very exciting episode of the guilty feminist. I can't wait for you. Here. This one. I am a feminist bought. I am more excited to introduce this woman, then I would be to introduce, Gloria Steinem, if she were coming out to resurrect Emily Pankhurst, and Maya Angelou on this stage plays, welcome to the stage. The incredible only the legendary national treasure. Far. I think good. Anyway. I'll take it. So I am a feminist. But some years ago in my twenties, I was doing a play on film gold knuckle with Tim Roth who on my husband's in the audience tonight. So I was going gonna be kept how I say they see quite fancied actually, and there was a scene where I suddenly realized, I had to appear in a swimming costume, so I swim coach coachee Molin, obviously, hated my body immediately because that's what I did. That's what I've done actually every day since I was fourteen. I put it on an little Hugh. There was a bit of a. Happening and. Push them in, if I thought that dick, and then I thought, okay, I go into the shower of my dressing room, and I was claiming away with a razor, just get. Just. The time is ticking by find nothing happened except I've made nasty marks on my thighs. And then I thought, okay I can't all is Tim's released really hot. Oh, maybe I started charge if I have to go out with Epping forest between my legs, and then I went and looked at my costumes, and I found a pair of tweet trousers I put them on and I went downstairs, and I said to the director, I think my character would have a problem with swimming in just assuming that she's quite buttoned up and I'm going to do this scene in tweet charges. And then when I go back to the dressing, I realize, I had not taken the cap of the razor. Trunk. Does it truly delightful story? Did you do the seat in tweets rouses? Did you frankly? That's some Hollywood have done your part that they allowed that. No, no, no, no. They just didn't know who I wasn't. I was mentally today. In fact, it was I, I just think you appreciation eccentric. Maybe I've got one more. I'm a feminist part. I decided I was too pale just before I left the house. So I put on some fake ton. That's fast developing. So at the moment, I'm an oak. But like a polaroid. I will continue to develop at maybe by the end of the evening. Mahogany. I felt it should declared in case anyone noticed. At least we're rolling on it. It's fun for everyone now. So I am so excited to be here with Emma Thompson. Introducing this incredible film late night. Why Mindy Kaeling starring indicating and Emma Thompson? Now when I heard it was about a woman who had an American late night chat show and had had one for thirty years. I assumed it was science fiction, and that I'd be seeing marina Silva, jumpsuits with anti gravity boots. But when I watched it, it wasn't really such fiction, it was more like a sort of fantasy alternative reality. Like konda. There is a world, a parallel universe, where a woman could be a chat show host and have been for thirty years, and it can be this year. Is this a life, you think you could have had because you almost out, you won the period. You're the first period they invented the period, four year really did with it. I want it with Hugh Laurie. Stephen fry. Is when I asked you Laurie that he said he did win it. So that's mention new tool. Come up. He was like, yeah. I did want invented for me. So you won the very first period with some men and you went on. And you did comedy. Yeah. Did you stunned up? I did briefly. I did sketch comedy for years with Hyun Stephen, and Ben actually trying desperately to sort of occasionally right things and kind of shoulder the bit. I've written it. Oh, no. Sorry, I'll just try. I've written this owner notes Feinstein's Feinstein, does matter. It does matter. I'll just I'll put over here. And then I would rehearse the things I'd written in a corner, and they don't go because they weren't interested. So it was very difficult to wedge yourself in to anything. All feel confident enough to write any comedy. But I did do stand up. In fact, I spent my twenty fifth birthday doing stand up at the crew. It in warehouse. I got sick. So we now know it was such an extraordinary feeling except I knew that I would die of fright before the age of. Thirty if I carried on doing it, because it is very, very frightening. And I did stand up on Nelson's column when I was twenty four thousand adds to the fear in a way that unnecessary. You're absolutely right. It was a political rally. Yeah. I think you're watching in a fear of hypes there. And if you die on Nelson's column, it's just a long climbdown, isn't it? It's just like if you Don a comedy cover, you could just sort of out through the curtain out the back and off you go you're on your weight Nelson. It's just such a long climb down when everyone's funding. I wouldn't do that. Now, I don't understand how that could have happened, but it was a political rally, and they said up you go Emma, do you do some because all the stuff I did political rallies of political benefits and sometimes it went very well. And sometimes it didn't. But the comedy store was terrifying. That place and it was very, very blow key. I mean, stand up still pretty low-key here. I haven't noticed I. Yeah. No, it is still significantly blow key, but spaces like the guilty feminists and other spaces are changing. That that's right. And wintering in national tour at the moment, and we've Neri amount on the stage and we've had two houses of the fifteen hundred people and I have said he's an amazing. It's an amazing time that we can do this. Did you have a good experience? When you had your own sketch show, I did a sketch show in Engro onstage, which was pretty good. Actually, it was a bit of a struggle, but it was pretty good. And then I did an hour for channel four, where I wrote the script, and they accepted it, and then the glare on channel four said, Don stand this, and of course, why would he understand it? He'd never had a women talking about funny stuff before you know what I mean. It literally was like it's like a new language. It was like a new language back, then there wasn't there wasn't much there was Victoria, wood, and there was French and Saunders, and I was doing stuff that was, of course was feminist feminist, but it was interpreted in the most extraordinarily, but. Everyone felt so hard. It's man-hating. They said anyway. This guy ran channel four said I don't understand why this is funny. So I said, well, I'll do it for you, then. So did the whole show for him in his office. No, he said, okay, then you can make it. But it was like that. Then, and then I did a six hours, which would quite out, then they were very different and new, and the press were kind of extraordinary, Michael Palin came back from one of his long tools, and he read the independent and the guardian the independent said, this is an important bit of comedy by a young artist is trying to stretch the boundaries of comedy and trying to change the voice of comedy and the guardian said who the fuck gave this woman money to make this shit who there was so route with them, they were incredibly personal enrichment. Mike watched it and said, I six students is comedy show. Some of it's good some of it's bad. It's a comedy show. So it's a bit like this causes people because they go off and decide does not compute, and so I stopped doing comedy and I was still. Okay, so I better do drama. Then ability drama because they don't want me to be funny. That's interesting because that's the power structures at the time. Yeah. Just saying, you're not welcome in this space. This is not a female space getting into that space. Having said that I was helped by a male producer of comedy who helped women, and people of color with comedians, Humphry Berkeley, who also champion Desmond's which was one of the first sitcoms, that start anybody of color. So he was great. I mean, you know, there are great allies, as you come up, but is interesting about this. Because everyone comes out, actually. No, let's talk about this later. Yep. Great. Okay. So this is late night. It's about a late night. Chacha host. Starring Emma Thompson. It's written by indicating and also starring Mindy Kaeling, and you're going to enjoy it very much. It's a wonderful comedy. And I can't wait for you to see it. We'll see you later. See later. We'll see after. Hello. This is fully city ward. Sometimes co host of the guilty, feminists podcast that you're listening to right now. Hey, I just wanted to tell you, I'm in a play at the moment, I'm starring in a play called kill climate deniers. I know it's a lot hotted title. It's on at the pleasance theatre for all of June in London from the fourth of June, it stops, and what we're doing is, we're offering a little discount. Just for friends of the show, you can type in creative twelve and you can get a cheaper tickets for the first week it's telling really fast anyway, we just wanna fill it up, so please go to Pleasants dot co dot U K for those tickets or you can go to my Instagram page, and that will have the link and it's absolutely would, but you already follow me on Instagram onshore. Anyway, you're right. As that love you. Bye. This with this audience. Well, great. You. Can you? Besides you are the only second person on the guilty feminists to be not in front of an audience and have something trumped in the other one CDC calm in London, man L, first of all, I have to say it's so great to meet you need to tell you. I've watched every single episode of the Mindy project. I did. I did. I am delighted in surprised we were rolling. Now. I see happening right? I think we're rolling us every second of this. We made them this is gold. That's lawyers. You know, this out of the door happening, you know, trying to lock the door that it truly a bomb trying to try to win the door open. There's something going on here. Chris salvage acre, Sean, is doing some serious wedging their Chris, you're hurt at work. What is your and your money? We don't on impressive. Look at all these buttons. So yeah, I'm friends with Ed week sexually. We over together back in the day, great guy, and he dated my remain ones. So I sort of lived with at weeks for a bit on and off, and you have remained friends, though. They broke up. Yes. Absolutely. But this is not the plot if fuel movie. No. It's a love life of one of my co stars. That's more interesting to me all I know I know it's a little bit of psycho going on. Can I say, I enjoyed late night so much? And here I found it. So funny. Thank you. I will also say that the nations of about structural violence to women in comedy was so on the money I cried like it was tones of demon. Wow. And I sorta the screening room in SoHo at ten AM on a Monday morning. Just with two other people, I was sitting there. They were like looking at me like this because I was like. Like the how it was something that triggered that when your character was being brutalized by the system and being spoken to in certain ways, and modulation sent ways and being treated like she wasn't funny and Bruce lies, basically just triggered something deep in me as a woman in comedy, I didn't know I felt so traumatized that resonated with you. You feel your experiences have. Made you remember your experiences or that felt real to you on a cellular level. Wow. And he's still happy. I mean, I'm not happy that you have those experiences. But I am happy that it's resonating because you make these movies and it's not like there was a bundles of us or anyone else third to remember what it was, like to come up like that. So it is beyond gratifying to hear that, though. Of course, I'm sorry that you went through it. No, I was so surprised because I didn't know I always on you. You know, I've had some experiences, but I've also had wonderful happy Thompson comedy upstairs. The guilty. Paul Costes amazing to do. And I work with the incredible women. So it was such a surprise to me that it was deep down inside of me. Like, David, my vagina is in just a minute was just coming out on my face and it wasn't just like twos rolling down. I was like. I was like, looking at me, like nobody's dying in this movie. Why are you crying so hard? So I guess I want to ask you like how much of this is drawn from your experience. As a woman in comedy, and also women of color in comedy coming up being in writers rooms, I'm not asking you to name names. Either the experience of being the only woman in the only minority in a writer's room was is from my life. It is how it was. When I worked on the American version of the office that first year that being said the writers room on that show, which was Greg Daniels. Michael Sherwood, BG Novak board, not at all like the writers seen although they had a lot of the trappings of the writers you seen in the movie, but reason why the movie was something I felt I needed to write was that the two leads, I identified completely with both of them Emma's character who's been in comedy for a while. And, you know, a little complacent a little out of touch impatient. Huge grouch that is definitely how I was after one hundred seventeen episodes of my show. But it also vividly remembered the terror that you feel coming into this world where you don't look like anyone else that's been hired and everybody knows that you are the diversity higher in America. A diversity higher is a ton of phrases. Not. Yes. For. Somebody who's hired. Now to fill a quota to fill a quota. But in reality, I know from my friends, who work in America will women of color, and I have some very close friends who are working registrants on, they have to be so good to get into that room. So it's not like this, this low standard for women of color. It's feels like they have to be better than the white guys that into the room in the first place. But then there's this diversity, high thing hanging of the head Jared such a tricky thing because I oh, you know, at NBC where I was the diversity hired. My salary was paid, by the networks that it didn't take a hit financially on the show. So it was really successful in incentivizing people to hire minorities. The problem is everyone knows your diversity higher. And if you're the only person of color in the room, you feel a have to make it here without having any allies necessarily, and then also I represent if I have a bad day if one of the writers in the show has a bad day, one of the one of my. White male colleagues, you don't think okay, we'll that's Representative of all white men and how their talents. But when you do badly on a show like that you also feel down, you're, you're letting down a huge group of people, so it's terrifying to be a diversity higher, especially if you're only one of them, which is for a long, long time, there would just be one minority in a room, you're free that first year, and then if you're not good, then you're fired. So writing this turtle on my own, like fearful feelings that I had fourteen fifteen years ago when I first started out on the but it was it was really cathartic to write about it. I feel the same way on British comedy. Panel shows, you know, you go out and is generally only one woman yet, and they made a ruler had to be one woman. They've pretty much not as a maximum. You'll sitting that, and, you know, you know, you'll told us the woman staff Twitter for two days because people are getting are. And he's like you're carrying like your whole Genda reflecting a whole gender. So you've to be good because you'll proving that fifty one percent of the population is funny. It's like that's a law, it's able to carry it. Yeah. And, and so that experience really came out for me. Now, obviously, this film is kind of science fiction film, because it's about a woman on late night television, who has ruined show. I'm not clearly something for time will into the future yet still hasn't happened. It's twenty nineteen and you'll still more likely to have your own show. If you call Jimmy than if you're a woman that's true. Like if in fact, very good chance if you're Jimmy Jimmy Kimmel Jimmy Fallon. Yeah. Jimmy, Cody if you're born named James, you have a one in three likelihood that you'll go become a late night, talk show. It's, it's done a main major network. It's absurd me if I had a son, that's what I would adjust. Just just fingers crossed, what made you a much in a world in which women could be a late night chat show host. And how did that kind of like informed the whole piece? Honestly, it came from the fact that it didn't seem like me Mindy, killing was going to write a movie with a male lead of fifty eight year old white male lead in having this job. And then I thought, well, if I make it a woman, it's not going to be believable. And then I was thinking, well, no Lin Manuel. Miranda, just played Hamilton in the biggest theatre phenomenon we've ever had. I'm sure that if he can play Hamilton, we can imagine a woman talk shows, it's much smaller leap to make will like Star Trek though. They say Star Trek the original series, informed, a lot of the gadgets, we have because the gadget make is we're going. Oh, how would we do that? So similarly, I think you'll movie is going to inspire women being late night host. I hope so man, from your lips to God's ears because I think the casting Emma, I'm going to read the movie for Emma. I don't think there's anyone who has left the movie, whether they like it or don't like it. Who isn't like? Oh, I completely. By her be taught. Levi and that she got the job, you know, twenty eight years ago, thirty years ago, and that she's been doing it for so long, and she her whole demeanor, it seems as though. Honestly, when I watched her, I was like it felt like denied dapper this from a play that she did where she played a talk show host. You just feel so at ease. And we shot this movie in twenty five days, we didn't have any rehearsal, we had no money. So she just stepped into this role and you just knew Catherine was, and just did it, you know, with almost no direction, you'll both so good in a thank you. But she is so plausible as this really hard bitten, you can see she's been brutalized in her day. I'm Bill top. And she feels like that's the only way she knows how to be now, which, again, I recognize I think some of the emotion, I'm spilling when I was watching it was around the way, sometimes women treat all the women because of the structural bias, this absolutely preposterous. That be completely will I. Really resonate with Emma's character has this very flawed view of my success is enough that I've done enough for women. And people can see me. I'm the only woman female late night, talk show. That's enough. I don't have to do anything else and a lot of people feel that way. And I remember when I started my show, I thought it was so insurmountable. The amount of work in the things that I had against me to become a lead of eight sitcom on major network. I can't do anymore. I don't there's not enough time in the day. And of course, you know, I realized that, that's incorrect that isn't enough in less. We're making providing opportunities for other women other people of color as employers were, we're not really doing enough. But with I think really fun about the movie is, I think both characters with Emma's character end mine would identify as feminist. But we're completely different kinds of feminist. This is the kind of thing is intersectional feminism that is I find very interesting. They don't really sound very. So, I haven't talked about it, that much herbs of interviews of the movie, but it is a lot of what I thought it out. Good. Good. So is just thinking she said, intersectional feminism the greatest day of. Okay, gum, I'm talking to the right person then for my interests, completely completely a you, please wind down, what, what this is. So fun, though. I, I talked about Ed weeks's lovely for like a full third of mine knows about Ed. You don't you did not. Can I just quickly all skew? Do you have an I'm a feminist? But so the cold open about podcast feminist bought. So, for example, this is a true on feminist. But sometimes I found size about famous fictitious misogynist, don't rape. And I truly believe that if I met him I could make him hole in Healy's pain. Do you have anything acid? Do you have anything that you feel like is a, a paradox feminism like I'm a feminist Bob? I'm the feminist. But I love the movie master and commander the far side of the ocean. Is for any self-respecting feminist? It is a very strange movie. It is one of my favorite movies through no female characters. I don't think there's a single person of color in that movie, and I can love it. I don't know what to say. I'm telling you, I'm the same about charts. Affi-. It's the absolute best nary a woman in it, and oldest about posh Wightman coming my movies about English sailors, enduring pirate times. Russell Crowe and Jennifer Connelly's husband. Yup. Yup. I got there on the high seas there on the high thinking mom doing things and being violent. Yes, I hear that. And I'm next about like that movie is one of my favorite, I'd like to thank you, so much having adults in for supporting the movies and much every shit. She's so not like that. Cartoon real life. Thank you so much. Also, vicious internals Michelle shoot us this coastal when she got off because I. I wonder with everyone. Hello guilty feminist. I'm Sony in from the Nive tool. Yes, I'm on the road. Thank you so much to everybody's. Just come out the audience has been incredible all over the country. It's been such an amazing celebration. I'm so happy to see so many of you that, and now we have a big announcement we have paying the Royal, I would hold on the seventh of July somebody else noon to three pm now. We're doing it in an awesome is that people can get back to different places around the country because we know you like to be in bed by ten o'clock. We know what old you. So get tickets, no make weekend of it, the sixth of July nothing this pride, and the seven is devoid up Bush. 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But if you can afford a twenty five hundred thirty five hundred please by one of those leave the ten time once for those who can't afford them, we said, no, she gets to be forty nine in the plus possible seats he's going to be an absolute extravagant, but I just can't wait to tell you more about it, so please get tickets. Now. Do, don't wait. 'cause that's going, very, very phone also next Monday, the tenth June, which only shows the, the pulled cost recording. And we've got some very special guests getting. No and get tickets while you can activate eight fifty we will be in cell sauce, tickets very Danny gone. So get in. Wanted to come this one, they assistance, you we're doing the secret policeman's toll with Amnesty International. We have an incredible lineup and I can not exclusively to you, and Rachel bloom. It's going to put in and do a set. So get to get out there really aren't many left. You can get tickets for all of these guilty. Feminist don't come Olsen. 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And I was speaking at that rally, petits come along and support if you want to find out what the Celtics, I'm this will be checkout out socials now like the cost. Tomes. Really, really love this film. I loved it more. The second time and I cried more appropriate places which was good. And I love that you've managed to humanize this character who could have been a bit of a to debone star, and she's not, you can kind of see in her that she herself has been brutalized has found it hard coming up and has got to that point, which I think a lot of women of this generation in various industries feel like no one helped me and Zony wants supposed to the top for a woman. And if you start helping out the women, I it will be suspicious of you, because you're letting women in, and that's what they thought about you, when you got in, and Secondly, no one helped you and you can't go helping people. But you see that sort of stopped to crack in her relationship with Molly who's Mendis character when you watch it, what kind of responses do you have having made it? Okay likes to not for men, the road to any Joe. But particularly in comedy is. A motorway you know, there's an awful lot of lanes, and there's lots of different kinds of vehicles in this by there's lots of people in the mode, and they're all going in various directions and there's loads and loads of very good. Well, sign posted places to go and lots of roads and just tons of choice. And for women, there's a kind of mountain pass sort of gully, which is strewn with boulders and with lots of full sexists. And if you don't have someone someone that to say, I don't go down there, because there's a cliff edge, and you're just going to have to turn around and come back and carry on, I'm actually if we all just go together. We could shift this bold a slightly over, and it will just widen this bit, which will make it clear. That, that's the way you're supposed to go. That's what it's like for women everywhere in every walk of life, every job, and comedies, a particularly hard number because quite honestly, men, don't know how or why women are funny because they often don't here. Women being funny. And of course, I was ago people been saying, but of course, there was the old joke. You know how many feminists does it take to change a light bulb? That's not funny. That was the guy. But of course, if women didn't have a sense of humor, we wouldn't have survived, if we didn't have a says a few, we would all be dead. We would not have survived being female. That's the point. That's why we have a sense of humor and all very funny, because we needed it to defy so that I think is boy till to remember, we have a little valley place. We don't know quite what we need help. We need assistance. We need mentors. We need older women to say it's very important that Catherine makes that step, you know, that she changes. And that's what I think, is okay, about Mendis writing, yes, she doesn't change her counter Akhter, but you feel her come into the twenty first century and enjoy it and relax and think can I show on. Can I be collegiate with women? Can I be in a place where it's not all just white men? And I'm the only one and cannot be relief rather than something to be feared. Well, yeah, because he actually says, look, Hal, I've been using even the same cadences as these guys. And I remember I mean, not little piece of me doing stand up was me doing stunned, though on twenty three in. Yeah. In the big big Victoria. You remember the big Victoria would shirts and jackets and everything on all my standup was about sexually transmitted diseases com. Think why. Okay, I'll tell you, it's because an Australian boyfriend gave me her herpes, and I was completely obsessed with herpes which was around around the same time as Margaret Thatcher was in power, and they were kind of similar. Toxically difficult to get rid of. I'm very unhealthy. So that was my stuff. And I would go up to Maine in the orders, I would say, I'm going to do it now, I'm going to say. So how is your sexual hygiene because, of course, is to do with sexual hygiene, and I would go up to them quite close and say, do you wash it properly really is noting? But I mean really do you Ruutel around with the cotton, bud? Do you really get underneath, and, you know, work work into it, and then blokes just though, it'd be women next? I'm going to tell you. Coyame. For him this no need key can speak themselves. So that was my, my method was it was to terrorize man in the audience about sexual piji methods and sometimes it went done quite well. Then I had a good guy about Thrush. Yeah, we hit was, we all know in the olden days before you could just take one of those pill things you did treat by putting tampons in yoga and shoving them up because the yoga helps with the Candida the east infection, I don't know if you know about anyone telling you now and it's just very useful way. So anyway, my guy was while I sent my boyfriend out to get the yogurt thing, and he came with tropical fruit enough life. I'm not a big law thirty years ago, which just shows you nothing's changed. So that was my stunned up. So for the listeners of the podcast, there is a scene in the film, where Mendis character Molly is watching 'em is current to Catherine on a laptop like a YouTube clip. And that was really you. 'cause I thought how dumb or is that really you? And it looked so Victoria would the style. And I'm delighted that it actually really was was a will. I'm so going back to watch every single one of those clips did Mindy, right. This especially for you. Yeah. Yeah. She did. She did. And she was doing the Mindy project at the time was five years ago, I was told that she had written Johnny for me. I didn't really know much about her seeing a little bit. But I don't tell Ian I'm very lot, right? And in general, and ignorant and she came, and she was in her Mindy project outfit, which was quite out there, and I thought quite weird white ware, and she's written something for me and most things that have been written for me a kind of about, you know, the kind of all kill the gist. Joe graffiti teaches you know who discover love late in life, and then get dementia and very brave, and they don't they refuse to give up their identity. And, and it's all very moving. And every time I get one of those, I just read a seriously, just want to stop and kill myself. And so I get the script and I think maybe it won't be like that because she's wearing some very funky clothes, but you can't judge a book rights cover, and then I read it in forty-eight hours later, rowing my agent. So we have to do this. We absolutely have to me, this film, because this is the best gripped, I've heard in years. And she wrote one she was writing on the office, so she was writing all week at the office. And then for some reason, this young into woman wrote, slowly for me she lives in LA. She wrote just a couple of hours every Saturday for three years. I mean yeah it's not. But you can. Creepy. But amazing. And I can see how she wrote it wild working in the writer's room at the office, because she was very much in environment. She loves she said. Yeah, she was the diversity high, but she said she relates to both characters now because she's being the show runner of the Mindy project. She said, I've been that diversity higher of being the only woman of color in the room, the only person of color in the room, the only woman in the room, and I've also been the grouchy boss, who comes in and shouts it. Everyone gets furious and leaves but is the one of the interesting things about it was also the Piff unease that the entirely white male stall hats about molly's presence there as well? Because you could see at the beginning, they would just inherently suspicious and I feel a lot of men that only know now, it's like a lot of men. I know have said to me something along the lines of I'm one of the good ones. I'm not Harvey Weinstein, which is fed the note. But it's like they've been holding a book of donuts, the whole of their life. And I've got I've always offered them round of always offered the doughnuts around and someone's trying to take the doughnuts from me. And I don't know how to explain to them. The doughnuts were never yours. They would give into you and era. Now the doughnuts states being a box on the table. If there's twelve doughnuts, and twelve people. Everyone gets one you don't get to pick. I and I've seen men recoil from the and go, they among my donors, and I've always offered you a half. So it feels confronting am I understand it? It must be annoying to have, you know, thousands of years of white male supremacy to have been born five years, too late. That's really interesting. Yeah, I must be annoying. I'll get it again. It's just like what the fuck like decades of my life have gone by and the only people represented loops site. I think it's interesting to see how much Mindy allowed them to change as well. And to find joy in diversity, and I don't mean token diversity joy in working with Molly joy in seeing things differently. And there's one point where your current to says something along the lines of, I want you to work with her because I don't want everyone to think the same everyone else in this room thinks the same. And that was a really incredible moment, I think, in the film, because that's very rarely said, it's mostly, we need to versus because of representation, but actually it's sometimes it's about diversity of thought. Oh, goja. Yes. Absolutely. I mean, we also foreign language, don't we in many ways. An I've always had this rows all the time we've been Elton about comedy, whom I love on thinks very funny, and he would all q about punch lines and. And I would argue the comedy for me wasn't about punch lines. Okay. So my mom used to work in, Russell rooms, and she used to say whenever mine's daughter to tell a joke, she had a sinking feeling in her heart, because even if it wasn't funny, she was going to have to love, you know, and is it still? Here's a good one. Here's a good one and you go to my fucking how long is it gonna go, and then I'm going to have to? I'm that particular form of humor, I think is very muscular because it is starting something, and it builds builds builds to a punchline, which is like the nation and the female comedy is much more circular, and there's sort of lowest moments in lots of different places. But it never quite comes to an end when it tells you feel really satisfied. I think there is actually seriously, a connection between all the way in which are sexuality and are orgasmic function, works, and the way in which we laugh because, as you know, laughing proper laughing when you really really can't stop in the Tisza squeezing out from the corner of your eyes is better than sex. I think it is Bono. They didn't know whether it's a law for that. I think that's because we don't ever want to admit that anything is better than sakes because that makes his uncall- and somehow the I can admit that now because I'm sixty I mean obviously not with my husband in the room. So actually really haunt laughing very, very hard. It's not better than sex with my husband just wanted to make absolutely clear. Better than sex with all other people. Yes, the poll. Yeah. Oh, and to that point, my character has an affair with a younger mine. And I am a feminist bought if a man like him, you know, offered any kind of interesting things on my reaction would not be like sixty year old numbers. Oh, just get washed and come to my room. My reaction would be Ono dawning. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. That's not appropriate. I'm not no. I'm not in any condition and. No, no, no, no, no. Oh, no God. I can't even oh and then I stopped to think about it and become truly embarrassed in the pool now. That's not natural. You should be allowed to be pleased really should be 'cause I've been completely brain. Well, I think that's the structures around us. I'm a feminist. But John Lewis go, you still would. Dumbly. But I thought, what was interesting about this is John Lithgow had the women's part because the women's part, is normally the wife, she only appears to be a bit side and a bit distant player sonata and then be publicly humiliated. Told. Right. Tom, I stood off. You really not. So she gets to do, and this is the second film. I've seen you I saw you in Roma Stanley Tucci with very similarly. He just had to lull around in the background looking very miserable about your big career and then. Enough you so much from a distance. I mean you'll banking until nothing gets. I'm absolutely nothing on the quantity of mom, you can get to pine about you as well. This go to shake. That's easy student Rian. I mean not. So to those two who were able and willing to see good writing and support a woman, you're absolutely right. I mean, you know, I used to say I used to have a guy who's they'll have to zoom someone to play opposite me because I'm this age. But actually that has changed a bit. Although it is still very hard to get men to do those supporting roles it is. It's very hard because it's not as story we're not looking out there is. No. And I love that about this film, as well that, although there were all of these guys in the writer's room and they've got lots to do and never funny. In every witty, we're not looking out of there is we don't empathizing with them. We don't really care. What happens when they get fired? They just go off, and we don't see them again, which is normally, what happens usually our role additionally on role or we see somebody in the writer's room a bit marginalized, or whatever we see how they. React to Molly own how they react, Catherine and then that's it. We don't follow them home. We don't follow home, the man, you have a plotline with. If you've seen the film, you'll know what I mean who we would normally follow home, and we don't see him again. He just gets written out because he's not really relevant anymore. We are looking at this through your eyes. We're looking at it through molly's is with somewhat looking at it through your husband's is which is appropriate in this situation because their emotions there, but it's really your story. And that's what's magnificent about it for me. And I feel like it shouldn't be in two thousand nineteen exceptional to be looking through the eyes of a woman over fifty and the eyes of an Asian American woman over thirty five but it is remarkable. And what's so interesting about doing the publicity for it because I've been doing days and days and days, we do at junket which means that you talking lots of journalists went off to the other some from Europe. Some of all over the place. I'm what's fascinating is they immediately get. Well, it's so interesting. How many issues there are in this movie and there's the issue of ages him himself? What's interesting about it is, actually it's not their issues. They're just they'll send tick lives of these women. So it's just normal for us. It's not issues. It's just life. And that I think is what's so extraordinarily about that piece of writing is he don't really, we don't wake up and think I live in issue. No. Have any shoot I do. In fact, they've been an issue, a big fucking issue just say it's still remarkable that ninety nine times out of one hundred when you go to the cinema. You're looking at very nation experience, which a white straight, male life has quite neat because given its say in this country, half the population over half the population of female, and then of the male population some gay some trends, some men of color, some disabled, the actual white straight, male SIS non-disabled, life experiences quite niece, and it's great that, that minority is represented so frequently it's good to put minorities on the screen. But I'm just questioning whether we need asthma of that minority experience because it is presented as a majority experience. We have really good at looking through the eyes of white men. We very all very skilled at it. It. I remember I was watching two wonderful life at Christmas. With Susan Makoma. She was sitting crying and crying. And I thought it's so interesting because she just knows how to look through James to its eyes and feel for him. And for herself in that moment, she's really skilled at that. But Wightman will very rarely look through a black woman's is at Christmas. It's true though. And if he does, it'll be a black woman film. So it's sort of, like, oh, I'm watching an exotic piece of world cinema. All it's you'll still don't quite invited to sort of just inhabit and getting. It's like, oh, look at that other experience just because it's just so read, what I would say to all of the podcast listeners is please support is on opening weekend because that's what makes the difference between this kind of film, being made more frequently and for this to become normal, and for this to be something where people say, oh, we tried making a film with women who not twenty two and drinking the whole time because that's their certain sorts films, women allowed in. Yeah. Drinking and forty over patiently as a large group. Yeah. Too loud. Yeah. And shitting the yes, is called in public. Yeah. Going to India. I'm then having some kind of culturally appropriated life. Piffling. Allowed to do that, or a big in a sarong sex in India, as, as a as a spiritual experience. Yeah. If you wanted to not have the confidence to open a cupcake shop. Until you met a mom is a loser in every other way. Bumps had the key to the cupcake inside of you. And that's why you end up with him. That would be open to you, as long as you were also able to make him realize that he should be making handmade coffee tables. Those are the things that we can we can. But just I'm vicious women on screen charging around a not having time for anything outside. Don't be interested in anything else. You don't see it. Do you know women like that? Normally in films acute. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. You it's by ROY mumps that's the bad ending. That's the sort of like a man will come along and make you see what I loved about lists. Go is. When you'll count says, what I'd already friends children, you didn't. Exactly wanted this. You wanted a full and excellent career. And that's what you got out of the event essay now on the screen. I have either I'm especially in this form, which is a kind of straight up comedy. It's a comedy. It's not designed to be an art house movie. I mean it actually was going to be a studio picture, which is unusual because he's such a great script. And because Mindy house this form, it was going to be made by FOX two thousand and we had to postpone, because we had disease in my family, and then we had to postpone again, because Midi got pregnant, and inconvenient life things happened that nature. And in the end, we shot it lost year in New York in twenty five days for about seventeen dollars. And it was it was one of those passionate we wanted to make it and everyone wanted to make everyone nobody was being paid. But everyone was there, onset sixteen hours a day for twenty five days because they wanted to create this thing that we've never seen, and I know it's why if we never seen it, it's so sad. Isn't it? But it's great that it's there when was there. Well, no, we'll have late night, talk show. Maybe we will. Because when you imagine something like that Mendis mentioned her. Yes. And so I can Star Trek informed a lot of technology. We have now indeed it did it did. Because because people inventing things will watching Star Trek and going. Oh, well, how would you make that similarly is possible, that some television executives in America, watched this go to know what we could make this a reality, we could actually make this reality if they offered, you know that. Now, I would be the swirling around in their heads, and yet they offered you a chat show. Would you take it suddenly north? Every its grueling. And relentless was ruling relented, so he wants it late at night, which is just doesn't. I mean, I'm in bed, but about ten oh, no. I couldn't do. We've achieved the offering. They could screen it in the evening though. Gotten those, but I doubt this is off the record. If you want it to be just to stay in his kind of sonnets doesn't have to be on the podcast. You just did an episode of SNL. I did. Yes. Do you wanna talk about? I don't know. Yeah. It'd be fascinating, right? Excellent. Let's get in. Okay. Saturday Night Live. Yes. How was that? So it was really interesting because I think that, that's a very particular culture. Okay. First thing the Reuters room is very diverse. Not women lost people call a very diverse. The shed you'll is from the seventy s the shed you'll is from the days when they all were awful night because they were taking drugs and John Belushi would refuse to do any sketches written by women and Gilda Radner kind of go by because she was. Just accepted somehow her because she'd be ordinary because she was Gilda Radner, exactly. So so that shed you'll has persisted an I think it's way to brutal. I really do. An I indeed said that too lawn Michaels said, that's as well as Reuters. You know they're just worked better at night. I said it would try. Tried writing during the day because I've always found. That's how there's just this sense of. Oh, it's this Wild Thing that happens every week and I got there and all these young people, an I'm not young. They was so tired. They was so tired. That was the thing I took away was this exhaustion, the end of twenty and I thought I wonder if that's necessary. I wonder if it's possible to have a shed you'll that doesn't mean that everyone's so exhausted. They can barely move their lips until Saturday night when the adrenaline gets you going. And you, you know, I mean look, I enjoyed the weeks, I did I enjoyed being dragged around the stage by Donahue, just literally dragged me. And then you get dressed like a only and you get thrown on again. And you do on the sketch. Yeah. It was it was. It was. It was sedating because that world. Must have been impossible when you were woman twenty thirty years ago, it's been gang for forty forty years. So yeah, I very, very difficult than I imagined quite difficult now. But I am a polo tells the story in her book about pitching a sketch. They were doing a lot of spoof adverts and she pitched a sketch that was about sanitary, napkins and all the guys, we don't get we don't get it. And she was like, yeah, but half the population will get it. And often you have to ask, who's on your judging committee, and they did it, and it was a big hit. I'm paraphrasing this. Please look in the book, because this might all be wrong. But this is what I remember. And if it isn't what happened it is, what should have happened. So same. But I think often who is on your judging committee who decides what funny is. Oh, absolutely. Because well, I think the guilt feminist has demonstrated it that the experience of women gathers an enormous audience of women, sometimes male comedians asked me, they'll go see crew we. But like they're pissed off. I say women thirsty. Just what we've not been service, we go to the top, and is nothing then. Well, there's lots of jokes about cokes. Bulls is loads of jokes in male comedy about the genitalia. I've noticed over the years, I've noticed that. And I mean, no look fair enough. They're very funny. Again. You know you love you think you've learned to love you've learnt a off in the same ways you've learned that when somebody tells Joe, you can have to laugh at the end of it. Whether it's funny or not because otherwise, you'll hurt their feelings. I think there's definitely that that's partly off because we come back to do that. It's so hard for us. And that one of the things I loved about Catherine playing. Her was being able to tell read Scott's character to shut up, and it works, and he did shot up, and I don't feel bad about it because I couldn't do that in real life. I couldn't possibly do it. I'm pathologically polite. And I couldn't behave like that. It was like having a sort of strange holiday. Yes. It's like Hannah Gadsby saying when she's taken for a month, you know, she says. Oh, no, no, that's fine. That's just five minutes. Like relieve five minutes, I've just feeling like a high in the world. Yes. So there was a lovely twenty eight days that you did the the twentieth day. She says you use money five twenty five days, I'm giving you a luxury is extra three yes. Yeah. Those extra three would have really helped. Yeah. Luxuries twenty five days to just come into the room point to people say you're fired and the release from the politeness of the shoving it down the most of us live with all the time. We'll look, it's a really really successful film, and I found it very cathartic to watch very joyful. Very funny thing that dialogue, very, very, very witty. Sometimes you don't see American films that everyone's laughing about. And you've seen the trailer and the trailer got a three or four funny moments in it, and you watch it, and you'll disappointed by how little wit there, isn't it? And the is comes thick and fast. She's a really good writer, but I will just say again, if you don't go watch it on opening weekend and you don't tweet about it. If you don't hashtag late night movies at late night movie late night. It's just hashtag Nightline. Oh, yeah. Late night. I don't know any of this stuff. So are you going Facebook? It's four slash late. Night, film UK. If you're on Twitter at late night, film, UK, and on Instagram at late night, film UK, but also hashtag late night, film, and Tele real human. That's another thing you can do. I know shocking shocking, if you know, an individual who would like this. What's up them? And just say go on the opening weekend because honestly. If a film about two men in the what place doesn't do. Well, do you know what they determine that film didn't work? They don't say films about men in the workplace. Don't work. Cancel the other films about men in the workplace if a film about women in the workplace doesn't do. Well, do you know what they say, you've gotta have women being romantic, otherwise it won't sell? Honestly. They draw that conclusion so quickly and you then have to wait for a decade, so please, please, please. Please support it. If you want to see more stories like this onscreen I on board. Excellent guilty feminists listeners around the world wherever you are, if you're in the UK, it's June ninth that you'll booking. Tickets full seventh seventh don't do you not because you've, you've missed opening weekend, and you've taken about steer from me, and I will feel positive, I won't sleep. So you've got a book out June seventh or eight get a group of friends together and book out a whole group of seat. It's and go talk about afterwards. Okay. We are all committed to that. You've all seen it. But you could see it again because I think some of you didn't pay so. You didn't pay even if you buy a ticket, and give it to somebody else that would be really, really appreciated. It feels like too late in the day to say that, that was the deal. Now just route. But you know what? I mean. I did you enjoy it. Emerson anything else you want to say that you want to leave on the table that you came say that if you haven't said, no, I've just been listening to you and just been so admiring of what you're doing, which is actually direct positive action. You could remember that Mindy indicating road. This was a diversity higher. Absolutely was. That's why it's so important that we back diversity, either we by inclusion writers that thing that FRANZ has dormant recommended and that you do. What Deb's recommended I'm old and a bit apologetic. So I'm just sitting here going thoughts. Fantastic. That's absolutely exactly what we should be doing. So I'm learning in your wake in your wonderful wake. And let's do this again before too long. Let's do it again. If you're in the industry, start to make movies with different voices and television shows different voices if you'll not support support support finds them out recommend them to each other. Look them out. This is not the only story like this. They're out there. We need to make them popular because they only really can can this filmmakers adult hundred nine hundred not so we need to show them movies like this make money, please go and spread the word. Thank you so so much to everyone here at the pitch central. Thank you. Thank you. A huge huge, thank you to the wonderful, Emma Thompson. Late night on sail in her. You read it absolutely wonderful audience. Let's go and get smashed. We've been the guilty. Doc, being Deborah Francois. Thank you so much. Good night. You have been distinct guilty feminists with me, Denver process, white guess, Kojo's Dame, Emma Thompson. Very special guest, Mindy, Kaeling, recording engineer was Sean music was mall. College would use was Thompson Inskeep in the spontaneity shop, thanks to be toria half. An everyone of entertainment one and pitch how central as well as all of you listening. The more information about this and other episodes visit guilty. Feminists dot com and don't forget to go and see late night. Hey Casey, feminists. Hello. I'm Margaret cable and Smith on Jessica Foschi. You know, us off this coast during the middle of listening to. Yeah. We hit because we want to tell you about a play that we're both in cooled Brexit. Don't be put off by the name. No, it's no might the real Brits. No, it's actually really good. It knows what it is lost an hour and fifteen minutes, rather than a lifetime is until. And this face clever and funny, and it's quite feminist isn't it in the sense that we both of a with. States overthrew in bikinis. I go, I've been out a suit for it. And that's longtime trouser suits us once there were no Scutts yet. Is it good? It's more guilty than feminists say, feel quite sexy in trousers. No, I know it's not used to having any power followers comedians. Accidents a long time ago. I did a law degree. And I've had friends from university see the press pitches for this play and say the road, not take him. And I've lost you. And in a way, I'm basically this is his closest being in this place places. I'll ever get to make my mom happy career. Please come and watch it. Please come and support us. It's brilliant funny clever ever play. I'm this is a special forgetfulness listeners ought to get through any fifteen pounds with awful code Brexit, fifteen yet Goto king's head theatre dot com, the tickets. And we will all you drink software. That's a bit much that way guarantee. No, no guaranteed.

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135. Women in Charge on Film with Susan Wokoma and special guest Jennifer Sheridan

The Guilty Feminist

46:10 min | 1 year ago

135. Women in Charge on Film with Susan Wokoma and special guest Jennifer Sheridan

"I'm a feminist but coming here to the BIA fine tonight to talk about women in film. I've realized what a stop me directing a film apart from Pacino. Is taking ten million pounds from Sunday and coming back to them saying of got nothing that is my fear. I just chain you feel like you could take ten million pounds away. And then just come back and go, no, I've taken all of your money, and that would be the dream. I would have every night pre production on the despite says some video of some things at another someone talking this crossing a road movie out of it though. And that's key information that you need to know. By like got so much money so much. I don't know. Why would if someone's that he's all the money? Go make something I think what I turn up with like, maybe like a sunflower to sort of like with ring when he speed up, and it starts off grows. And then it just dies up. And then the fin. They'll be. And I would defend it. I what some bullshit spent money on your tight his Bill. Yes. It costs ten million pounds. Is fin. I want the movie to be called Finn. Brilliant incredible just to change the tone. I'm a feminist, but I'm very indebted to Nick Knowles of BBC DIY SOS fame for telling me as we are photo taken together, which was my best site. Oh, oh, you say, oh, you say, oh, he was right? It's my left. Hey, he was absolutely bang on. I had no idea we let you it. Basically, I won an award. And it was. Crazy had it's not what the award season. It was an art. Yes. West of England. Television size. The national Odia is Joe reward is present by Nick Knowles. If you don't always googled him, and he will going to have pictures taken. And we'll start you on the right side. What you went on the right side. Good solid. I didn't want my guitar. Anyone to me went left? Wow, bang on is better. So this will at myemma back. I sort of understand why he knows that. Because if you put up your own shelves. Yeah. You've got a sense of symmetry. Copy much, you save me every time you see picture me. And I'm looking. Knows. I'm a feminist. But when I went to the can film festival, I was standing behind these men in a Q and one of them said to the other they brought me a Russian prostitute. And she wasn't even as good looking as my wife, and I thought what's the point? True story. All I said was slightly passive aggressively to my friend, it sex worker, actually. It's not prostitutes. Thank you very much. What I should have said is punched in the face, but I've never met people as appalling as people at the Cannes film festival. I mean, it's another level. It's like their parodies of film people in film. Really extraordinary. I did find it a little bit curious the way they do photo calls, but you gotta be on a boat. So you've gone a boat. And then they bring you in the boat. You're stood it just feels very unnatural. But they put me on that boat. I will be odd that Bo get off the boat at all pose. No. Oh, yeah. No, it was just the people like one guy. Also, he five with Dr his script. That's not a brute then duck, dick, Dr lots. Thank you. Find a word you look for sex workers. Sorry. Your turn. I'm feminist. But when they cost mattress to play my little sister in the TV show. I was delighted that she was cute as about like me. There we go. It's very listen. It's murky when I'm in my first show, and they were like, this is your mom, and I was like thank God. Because if they bring someone who I would cost myself as below. Fuck you trying to say about me. I'm not. So you van comes into play. Okay. How noble you of the are? It's gonna cost you. What is you'll be like Kim? Oh, like wherever you think is important. I think being important. It's it's fun. Dick, Dr much script. I'm a feminist. But if I could have directed one famous film from history, it would be chariots of fire a movie exclusively about how Bush white guys feel albeit with exquisite cinematography. I do that film. It's about all the motivation to run. I just love it so much. I love everything about it. I find is that show heartfelt elegant film. But it's only about men. Posh white men. I'm a feminist. But when my mom told me that she the reason that the relationship of mine had ended was because on white should he agreed? How could that possibly end relation? She was right. Oh, no. No. No. No. It ended the relationship because he was a dick it. I say, hey, news amongst other things. Okay. Okay. I'm not the easiest gopher boyfriends. Suzy's boyfriend inside. Johny? She an easy girlfriend. She is easy. So so quick so quick. Live from the. Today to shop presents the guilty with those wife gets Susan. Special. Guests Jennifer Sheridan talking about women in judge. Phil. This is the guilty feminists the podcast in which we explore on noble goals is twenty th century feminists and the Apocrypha and insecurities which undermine them. I'm different says with me, Susan Macomer. A we're talking about women and charge on film. How have you been Stacey feminist guilty day? I've really feminists day. Ashley me will explain this later. Jennifer way cooking up some things I've seen already today. We'll talk about that land for hits the stage. But now, I've had an extremely feminist. I'm thrilled. I had a declutter in to help me declutter my bedroom. So that when I go my book tour, I know where everything is heard speaking about this in the green room. I didn't know that you could get people to do. And I've had so many friends who have said to me. Oh my God. I love sorting through things. It's my favorite thing. Why didn't you get me to do it? I would have done this a free. It's just some people. I know who like just alone my way in you. But I was like I can't make you after a certain point like a can't say, oh sure, why don't you come and go through my clothes and every single thing under my bed. Also, don't want them to say, I don't anyone. I'd really liked khloe who came, but I don't ever want to see her again does she cuts it? I'm not going to a party or anything. Because then she's gonna look at me. Like, I know we'll know between us, it'll I've seen your pants off for my mom was a cleaner and she worked in nyc different offices and M I five actually is a cleaner and what? Yeah. Oh, girl. Show cleaned. Yes. She was. Yes. It was Ruth. But when she would work in our offices should get like people who worked in the officers got good talent spur you so good at cleaning. A what are you coming clean my house? So she'll be okay. At every time, she came back from these people's houses, and these rich people all she did was how they were. Oh, they leave the Nikkatsu there. They leave their trials out there. Just for me to clean out the mom. You are. You are the cleaners. You create the clean you clean for cleaner. I will never bring anyone to on my. It is sort of do think that I do think the right thing to do is tidy arm. So the clean up of the I don't always do the right thing. But I do think that is the right thing about the decluttering is there to organize sort create new systems for you. So that it doesn't get into a bad state again. But I've already said to her this is what happened was we not into the upstairs, this isn't strictly about films feminism. But we we know Trump says, and then we had a big bedroom. But with no storage at all, and it's all going to be out of hand. So I ended up putting things in boxes under beds. It's that sort of thing that I now need a system because I'm going on tour with his book tour spoke, his book, whatever. So I want to be able to go all take this and this and not go where is that under a bed in a pile? What is this just go out of control? But what I did decide then today because you know, when you find old clothes in boxes, and then you start to try them on. And look a lot of just went look this is perfectly nice. But. There's a previous era. Yeah. It's just in time. It's from another time when I was less good. It reminds me of a lack of empowerment I have no desire to revisit with these red colognes now. So yep. They die out is is they might even have a nice designer label inside them. I don't care. I don't wanna go back there. You can't make me, but I pulled up jeans, and I just never which none of you have ever seen me in jeans. Do you know what never wear jeans? But I pulled out this parent. I've been looking they may or may not fit. We don't know because my weight goes up. I I just don't I don't know if they fail or not. So I put them on you know, sort of slightly like ooh like almost like buying a lottery ticket. I slept with him. Oh, they do fit. They do fit. But then I said to my declutter, I call anywhere jeans, and she went no that great. What are you talking about? And so I thought right minded cluster can't have more faith in my hips than I have because that's not feminist. It is the most cross thing anyone's ever say during that Margie. In my hips. Good. I have I was I see. So I thought I'm going to walk out of the house with the same faith mighty cutter has in my hips than I do. And so I just put a long jacket over now. But what do you think? What do you think? Do you think I can? Gene. Yeah. Chains of going to be honest. I feel to them. I just don't do. I think I'm the. Nice and causes. Well, oh, really. Yeah. Yeah. We can all go home. Now, I feel like we've picks. I'm a feminist. But that's all I needed. Such a day. We're talking about women in Charlottesville, and we can take that any way we like have you ever had a little inkling to direct or have you during and I've genuine all Suzy's Christian off sage because I wanted to hear onstage. Well, funny. They you should say that Debs because I'm actually gonna direct his calls. Rain dance have loads of different directors causes on going on a been onset since about seventeen years old. But I'm going to like an ABC directors. This is I lines. This is how it works thing. I'm really excited. I just wanted to I necessarily want to direct, but I just I need to know what's going on. I don't like being on set for the understanding. What is completely gone? I wanted do. I guess yes. I would never get would I guess. So after walk in their kid down the number of job. I think says you'd be an amazing director should go. Good. You've got experience. You've got great hall. You got great viewpoints. You've got very asked me blush in. However, you wish to identify. I think you'd be great those great yet. Yeah. I'm excited to hear. What happens? Are you? Ready to do some stuff at the mine show plays. Women in charge women in charge jar charge soccer slogan. Go power like Cleopatra coming out. Just like really that was mine like turning on crtv. And I saw these three living their lives that goes with braids in Manchester with a single mom, just like. Coughing zone, but backtra coming out ship as. And. I from those. But in in in these. Well, two million dollar corporation's kit on the door. But we've been in charge take. It's all yours was thinking last night about women being in charge. I thought okay before I continue. Let me just be very clear. I think it's great that women are in charges from sectors, and they should be in charge more. It goes without saying what saying however there were times when you look at job that needs to be done. And you just think. Do I think? Typically coverage over to author that case in point Brexit. So. Now, I hate when you stand up comedy people are, so Brexit, Brexit Brexit. We'll say bell, and we funny, and we go says everyone who vote for presidents UP zoo stupid funny because jokes on us. We have to go through it. It's don't happen. So as to be funny know isn't funny where we're gonna die. Upside the housing market will crush and will be able to afford a house. That's my plan. The joke is on us. Oh, okay. I don't want to call it Brexit. Let's call it. Call it the bad decision that happened that one time in two thousand sixteen let's call it that the bad decision of apple at one time in two thousand sixteen so that alleged pig fucker made it happen because he was roof Mulan put in this referendum. And then everyone's was yeah. She never quite like that referendum news. Rabat? And then that week that was like a wheat wherever it was. Oh, who's gonna lose going to this Brexit, even I- dodger fraudulent, but. To create this. Stay toilet is fucking Courtney. What's dollars college? Who could Chris is it better stay could buy fucking one car. Anyway, so either and there's a week. We all these little tweets may just came through the backward. All do it. I was like you you don't like me do because at the moment was looking to go cold. What do we do this woman? This woman who was your hope it's super this Ruben do this. And it really annoys me bid. You should have just stood to the side and benign clean this up. I'm looking I'm looking to use up and even with the US elections right owner what's gonna happen. Now that we have this. I'll tell you should step up Michelle Obama, Michelle Obama twenty twenty Michelle baba, I was like. She called even wear a dress showing her arms without somebody could. Ooh, monkey pushed helping the fire, and I know the her loan. She is retired. She's in joying life with a Bama on boats, and bts and cheese. Not taking fucking stress and taking the stress stress proud of. Progressive fucking. Fun fun. Michelle libra. Like I said before I do agree with. Thank you. Before I do I do actually agree with women can charge. I just think that you've got to be careful the self preservation, put your neck on the line. You've got to. You're not any good in charge of looking after yourself. I decided to take charge recently, deeply regretted. Someone to. There was always talk about love island few weeks ago. And that's to join in the CIA, which will almost link. So just saying, hey cars going goes other. Really, I don't watch. The reason why I watch love island is a very valid reason. I have experienced from his fourteen on a reality TV show before the term reality TV was really coined thing. And I had a great time at a lovely time. We went off to the Borneo jungle, and we would. Swinging around. Any what we'll take the push up Honus is she quite swinging around looking around, and I don't really love time, those friends, and does really well toughter, and I came home only one piece, and then when the show Ed as belly fucking in it, and it was a real shock. Oh, I felt like a really good student bills. I felt like I was funny. I was well those things they just wasn't included. And there was one segment that IT teacher said was really upset about. Which was they got us all to phone home. We've got to phone home families off to if you vote to parents enough ones. So it was this montage of of all the kids who'll up thirteen youngest oldest fifty eight or calling him in tears crying. Go-by busy is yo- you visit. And I wasn't shown for whatever reason. I just wasn't trained an eye to really read emotional conversation with Emily remember, no swearing. Swearing CBC. Somebody can show, but I felt like I was probably arising. So I said this. Oh, ooh. Oh my God. Did the race car out? There will do you got to do what racist? They also voices. They come different. And every was my God. Like, oh, go to trending on Twitter might go. This is a Twitter door is not a twist those of racist. Speaking isn't a twist on that's called life. That's fucking life for me. Like is not twist or online as well. I God how you gonna come back from this. Well, you're gonna say, and I really thought about look I feel like what I was trying to say was hijacked. People are not respecting my experience is not a case of like wanted to talk about it. It just outright rejected. What I was trying to get people to understand is that you might think that this person this black woman on TV being shown a fair amount. But what you have to understand is. Where is that? Come from like, are you just used to seeing the narratives of people of color on TV less than everybody else? And so that's why you think is acceptable. Just take it from me. Listen to me and how I live my life. Like, you do the when is edited out where you can't even say miss you to your family. Your everyone else has shown that fourteen. And that's saying something that's saying that that story is worth it. And anyway, so other friends who like we should right piece by piece like retaliate retaliate? And I thought about him. I did honestly think about then a friend of mine sent me this really powerful piece about how it's important to speak. Of course is important to take charges important to say, oh peace and lead your narrative. But particularly as an artist this is fitting because we are here in the beer fire will of the book club book club film Cup. Joey feminist film Cup fucking now. Said this which is a few words by Toni Morrison, which I'm going to end with. Racism was always a condom that sucked all the strength of the victim is the red flag that is danced before the head of the ball. Its purpose is only to distract to keep the bulls mind away from his power thought that her power and her energy keep it focused on anything. But her own business is hoped for consequences define black people as reaction to white presence. And I urge you to be careful for there is a deadly prison a prison that is a rected when one spends one's life fighting phantoms, concentrating on myths and explaining over and over to the conqueror your language your lifestyle your history your habits, and you don't have to do that anymore. You can go ahead and talk straight to me. Thank you very much. Can you go wild? So the wonderful Deborah front. I want to have a go at directing a scene, and I want it to be a beautiful classic film scene is the best directors. They have their own vision. So the short-term we saw from Jennifer earlier she'd written under record it. So I want to create this here with you. So could I have John replace? Rome. I've heard Rome com I've had horror, and I've heard Sifi just shouts the one you want three. People want Sifi. Okay. It's not my greatest genre. But I feel I can make it work. Okay. I'm not gonna ask. If this scene is going to be about wonder woman. It's going to be from a woman's point of view. Not that men on important. I've just seen everything they've ever thought. So. Seen of seen it seen. I want. Something new. Do we have any actors in the house brilliant, super what's your name? Connie. Okay. Connie, would you be willing to come up on stage brilliant? Okay. Connie, can you come up? Thank you. Wonderful. They we are. I'm so could I have a title for the film? Please. Oranges. Okay. Sifi called oranges. Okay. All right. This is my vision. It's one hundred years into the future because of global warming. There's no citrus at all. And in fact, we are at a point where the earth is in a very bad state in terms of food. I mean, the UK's long because of Brexit. We had we had four years of food delivered by the army, and then we run out. There was no trade deals, but the earth as a whole is now having problems supporting any kind of food. There's some women who stocked up, and they have come to this place in the outer Hebrides and they've got box of oranges at it's sort of something that they're guarding, and it sort of they know they're gonna run out. They know they're going to die. They're very young. They're very cute K. Adorable, but it's sort of become a metaphor for them. One of them is breastfeeding and the other one is deeply in love with her. They both sort of. No. But it's never really spoken about because survival has to be I right now could I please see that jumper that looks like a baby. Could I have that place? Super. Joe teamwork. Teamwork will done done. This is like a film set everyone's hands on dick. So you've taken the baby. So you are breastfeeding got names, Connie, Connie. Okay. I think I'm gonna keep the names Connie and Susan just because Takhar. Takhar really? Yeah. Waiting for the phone rang? Sorry, dick script. Suzy to agent the parts in oranges. What? The fuck is. Okay. All right. So I want just the feeling because I'm going to describe what the looks like the podcast and be because film just isn't about people chatting oversee it's about how things look so this is sort of Scottish wilderness. So I wanted to sort of be sort of. Yeah. Some people are just. Improvising. And I love what you're doing that. Some people are sort of doing this. There's sort of like a feel of the Heather in the hills. Yes, exactly. That noise. Brilliant wells on follow. You follow you. What's your name, and is in charge of sound? So if can I get anywhere, Mike, so you're going to guide the sound when I knew makes a sound. I want you to follow her. And then I might up sort of put down a k ready. Okay. We're in black and white says some heads and a light breeze. One lonely very thin bird searching for food. But. One one. Lonely. Very thin birds. Close up on the buds. The bird lands on something that used to be food. But now is it dies in desperation? We pan around to look up. It's a shed. And we come up close to a keyhole, and we go through the key hole in size to women and Shiva. The baby wails. Yeah. The baby Wales. Okay. So we see Susan's is just Susan's is we know that they're looking at the baby they're looking at the baby. And we see the baby's is looking at Susan and Susan's is looking at the baby. This is her family. It's all she has left. All her family have died in the famine. Kony looks at Susan. Susan looks at the baby. Looks at Susan. Susan looks at the baby got it. Sorry. There's a sort of triangle of love and hope. Okay. Kony? Now, there's only three lines in the scene. And I didn't know who says them I'm just going to offer them up. That's reliance one line is have you checked the oranges? I don't know what order they're in. Check the oranges one line is. You know, I love you and death won't change that. And one line is here. Okay. So the scene begins. Okay. We're going to take it for the top. And you know, who you're looking at. All right. Pam through the lot. Somebody says one of the lines. You know, I love you death to change that. Have you checked the orange? Then the sound of two hundred Hungary, Scottish, people descending. They've heard about the oranges. Thank you. Funny. Thank you. Thank you. Now, if I'm not giving money to rent orange. Yeah. I think it's a good thing. If I'm not giving money. Al guest today is an award-winning director and writer who was also edited. Some of your favorite television comedy shows, put your hands together, we're making Norris guilty feminists welcoming noises for the wonderful, Jennifer. Hello, jennifer. We saw your short film before it was really really good and the audience at home can see where. Oh, I didn't realize you were gonna show that one. It's really I can put it on the websites fine. I thought that was when I sent you another one. That's when we go. I sent you to one was seventy two seconds. And I thought that would be a winner. They'll love that. Because they'll be over like that. That's like it was it. Yeah. Yeah. Over comedy, by the way. Do you know what when I watched? This did think conc- how it sort of horrific. I don't know that it's a comedy. Describe as a horror comedy, she spent Mira. Yeah. So John I did wonder, but it's stunning. It's beautiful film. And we didn't want to see something seventy two six. This is the now see a proper film Yanks, walls and can the audience and watch this film. I'll put it on the website, Jennifer, director dot com and your was available which says I'm a little bit about the state of play. So Jennifer, director dot com, and they can go and see the film called the super recognizer the super recognizer. Yeah. So if you're listening at home just to recap, it's a film, that's in the genera of black mirror which most of you will have seen. It's about a man who can recognize lots and lots of faces and not sure real genuine thing that I don't think really comes across. I tried this set it up. I was like the metropolitan police up this recognition department in two thousand five which is totally true. But afterwards everyone's like that was a good idea. It was not real. These people you can see like recognize people. Yeah. Wow. I believe to today who believed that they were really people. Yeah. Just put cost. So yeah, we all believe I'm a bit face blind. I need to get diagnosed because I have got miles face blindness. That is I haven't faced by the way, one of my friends who I think is into night, she has face blindness and sodas her mom and they set next to each other at airport for an hour to home. But I need to meet people six to eight times before I can recognize them. And I struggled with it. And people often also they know me from the postal comedy or something like that. And I've met him once. So they think I'm going to know who they are. And I find it awful that I don't know. I live with struggle is say. When you still you worry about it. Okay. I mean, I'm oppressed. Suzie knowing with my mouth space. But anyway, the film is very very beautifully directed, and I feel it really has an authority will flare it's gorgeous put together your job is mostly editor. Yes. Yeah. I've been editing for eleven years. Yeah. Fema letters quite rare as well. Yes. Specially in comedy, which is where I found myself. How much do you think the editor has a say over the look and feel of the film or the television show? I would say they don't have much influence over the look because it's what you get given. I'd say they have some influence over the feel. They can have some infants of the field. But it really depends on how much freedom the director gives you an editor at the end of the day. They Trump you in terms of the decision making final decisions, I think when I think of films stylish, I often think it's the editing oiling cart. And I thought your film was very very stylish just all of the different points of view. And where we were looking at felt like we were there in it. I could sort of tell that you were an editor as well. As a director because it was very beautiful short. Thank. You why do you think it is apart from the patriarchy that's often? The entire power structure of the world. Why is it that there aren't more female Edison, directors is it simply the power structure, and that there's so much money at stake? And we're not trusted. I think it's looked to do that. But then I think that it's to do self confidence. Like, you said before is like when I started being an editor. I'd sort turn up to not sit down and like people come in. And they'd be like, oh, yeah. I'll have a coffee. No. I'm your editor of right? Okay. And aside I mean for like the first day until they will only she kind of knows what she's doing. So can relax now. She hasn't done about it. But the first low-budget feature I cur producer set behind me. And I was trying stuff out monument. Tree. I was just trying some stuff out and obviously didn't like it. Because at the end of the edit day him in the director came in without me what a done, but by that. One of the stuff that wasn't working at redone it. And so when I came in the morning, they were like, oh, we love it. We love what you've done with is great. And was seen it. I didn't. Sneakily watched it because I'm trusted you think that's the root of a lot of our confidence problems. And I've written about this in the famous book that the root of the word confidence is trust. Like if some of the confidence man, they're undermining your trust betrays confidence. Sometimes we trust ourselves. But we don't have the tribal confidence. We don't have the trust of our peers. Yeah. If you feel like, yeah, I trust myself to do this. But then you get the sense that the room doesn't trust year. All like, they're sort of looking at your work to check with their sitting looking over your shoulder, and then making that face it kind of road your confidence. And I think sometimes when people say why aren't more confident they're not taking into account tribal confidence is projected onto us. And so that's what's actually undermining. That's just only one of the amazing points in the guilty feminist book that you. I mean, in a way is your confidence worth fifteen pounds. That's what I'm. Searches. I because I don't work in TV for years, and I very rarely met female editors I know that that is something that you've left behind now your folks, directing, but how did you get into its well when I was at university so pretending to be a director. So I didn't know I would edit my talk with sequences in graphics and stuff. And then my lecture was like, oh, you can do that stuff. Yeah. Do that stuff top of YouTube? And then he said, oh, I know someone who's looking for job a graphic designer kind of thing. What for him? He also needed an editor. I can add it see I've almost have the opposite of what you're supposed to have as guilty feminist in the I've just been so overconfident for most my life of just said, yes, whenever someone said. Okay. Can you do that? And then of Google it. Actually, good friend of mine said because when I started writing I got given a commission to write pilot, and I'd have written anything, my friend. Abby said you've got to follow the green lights full agreement. So if someone says do you want to do you just go? Yeah. Do you learn on the job one? Yes. True. And there's nothing you can't YouTube is what I want you to doing. They are just saying yes to things and then they're working out on the Joel learn though of young tyrannous, exactly the only way. So you're now going into directing what have you director too? I've directed seven short films. Yeah. Right. About one year. That's a really good short film note. Like if you watch that you'd be like, yes, I'll trust that person direct feature. Yeah. I always find upsetting that women who you've got so much experience in editing. You already in the business. You already know what's going on you already made your living that way. And now you've directed seven short films. I'm sorry. I just don't I know. This is true men. Don't tend to wreck seven short for now. That is true. They don't that film should've got you more by now are you directing TV well. Of written a sky comedy show, which is director. Britain gems, directing. Yes, I got given the opportunity few about month ago. And they said, do you have any stories, and I was very clear I'd give this do you have any ideas for directors, and my list was just women just women Ray? I wasn't interested in any. It wasn't even conversation that we had discussed producer. He's really Burti go on discharge you hourly wanted to do. Yes. Good as an artist. Not relationship does his last name. But you peak of. Now, he's lovely is. Now, I gave him the list, and I didn't even say or won't female directors of. That's my list, go figure and general had been suggested to me by quite a few people, including Ben Taylor who have with tell you you've actually edited pilot. I did I was in it for a second. Oh, yeah. Here's it out. Listen has no your phone. Don't you take that? Like, I said moves director. Just early. As out of your own comedy shortly written. I mean, it's everything to play for now, you're director and directed seven shorts which is basically like direct feature. You're now directing a television show. What advice do you have for people listening to this podcast who would like to ranked what do you know that we should know? So Susan's doing a course soon in directing which really wanted to ranked. And I wrote a feature that was made last year. That's coming out soon. We'll be really soon it's called same mine name. But when I was on that set I thought I really wanted to ranked I loved working with Jerry in. Here's ABC's fantastic. And I want to work with Jay again. But I also would absolutely love to ranked. Yeah. What can we learn from you, Jen, I'm actually directing when I first feature next year year. Ninety. Can you talk about it too? Yet. It's written by stoke, oh from misfits model years earlier and its horror Rome com, which I'm really excited about, but my voice would be because the thing is becoming a director is hard. Even if you're a bloke world anew. It's still really hard. And basically you just have to take the knocks take all the festival rejections on the chin. I feel like a punch to the heart. But you get over it. It's fine. And just keep going never give up. Because basically, if it's what you think about when you're going to bed when you wake up in the morning world. Can you do it's not like you can go part this work in an ice cream truck through life. Great because you won't be happy. You just keep going and doing what you wanna do. And that's what I've done. That's not the only other of by the way, other jobs are available. It's yeah. I know. Onset. That's what I wanna know onset. How do you take charge? Share your vision know that you've got the technicals right or vice can you give us onset high? Really good people the nice to work with any dickhead suck off seen as you can or they see that we're not paying them. But you know, you meet them first, and you go on the dick, and they go numb not sure you can find you got the job, and then it's very collaborative I like to work collaboratively. And I think because my background is in editing. I like different voices. And I like to hear people's opinions. Even if the runners like to know if you should shoot that way. I'll be like, no, you place show your face, but good point. Yeah. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. But like, yeah. Just don't shoot people down. And but no what you want Bryan. And have a vision the time that, you know, you're in the right place is when someone comes to you with a crisis, and they go like this because the windows come in that way, and it's going wrong, and you go it's fine. We'll just be fun. And you seem super cool about it. And inside you're going. Because that smell by storyboarding completely differently to this. But you just kind of when you can roll with it. So even if you're on the inside what the set want to see is calm yet area. So you just go. Okay. Well, what are other options? That's what I would do when you said, it's fine. Well, she like this. I thought to myself what I would say is cinematographer what are other options here because this one's not available to us anymore. The way we still about it. That's really good point in that. You get the team that you trust was a team that you trust you were decent people. Then it's so easy to the best advice. I was given don't hire people surround yourself people where you think you're the cleverest person in the room keep learning from other people, and they to have a problem with the window, which I don't know about. But what the Democrats are those that took about then you can go, right? Okay. Cool. So what else can we do, and you can take it can be I prefer as opposed to you driving it. But I did believe the threat to the chip. And I think the best way of doing. From experience in so many different directors is that com- there can be punit. You cannot be the dirt and panicking. Once you do that you've lost everyone. Yeah. Doesn't work. Doesn't work shout directors. Fucking them guys. You know, you. Can you quickly? Tell us anything. You would like us to see what Susie? What's your project on sky? Also, the title of the moments called love the sinner, beautiful script, vice usual script by size. Oh, my. Yeah. That was it. She would for interviews. And I often does the job. Because that's the point all the comedy. I rise always say some this means something in you. Absolutely go back on the head and just so fucking prepared. And I was just were so sick of mediocrity and people coming in and not knowing what they're doing and just thinking I could win this. And you know, this is why matching for it. And it just was pretty fucking homework. Like, you just do that makes me calm down. And makes me give my script to you and go, right? I trust. I actually trust your judgment. I don't know. Of course. I'm not the smartest person in the room and just fantastic. And I think it's going to be pretty they're the only thing I will say is I've just heard the director of oranges available now. And she may want to consider because she is something that she is something I came heard. Anything? She wanted plug. We've made to go to your website to see the record is at the recognizer the super recognized super fast title the title. But that's actually what they're called. The Cousy recognizes that tool. I wish I could it fancy snitching 'cause I went to screening the other day, and this woman, she was like, oh, so that's just fancy snitching was like ledger. Why didn't call it fancy snitch in dommage change the name put it back into the festival matchy writing it as web series company in New York called? I look media. Pretty wonderful. We'll be called frenzy since then overload say. Okay. We're into that. Also, if you'd like to buy my book, I haven't mentioned it tonight. It's called guilty feminists. Available in Waterstones, and you can get it online arena shop Suzy where can we follow you? I'm around season underscore came onto if fancier. You know about me. It's true. You already follow Suzie don't pretend that you don't I just a big runner pros. And thank you for having us. Jennifer for Sheridan. Excellent for the savings. So. Guilty providence. Very special guest. You for sure report again today was grumpy, Liz fees. Music. Thanks to person, Phil McIntyre and everyone at the. What is this thing about this represents guilty? Thank you very much. That's show. I've been here tonight. Because Louis CK if you didn't hear last night turned up at a comedy set. And when he walked onto the stage, the audience gave him standing ovation, and then they were saying that sex allegations, blah, blah, blah, and may mountain quote tweeted that going they weren't Gatien's here admitted it how is an allegation is a fast. It's a factor. Gatien? Maybe I could coin factor. Gatien to gauge today Chicago. Man. It's ridiculous.

director Jennifer Sheridan Susan Macomer Brexit editor Connie Dick Nick Knowles Suzy Dr Phil McIntyre Suzie Cannes John I Pacino Finn producer
118. Women Fighting on Stage and Screen with Jessica Regan and special guest Jessica Hynes

The Guilty Feminist

00:0-1 sec | 2 years ago

118. Women Fighting on Stage and Screen with Jessica Regan and special guest Jessica Hynes

"I'm a feminist, but I'd snug men's rights activists in exchange for one week in Sofia. Vigorous body. The first half I was not on board, and then I was like, oh, she thing to be audit think I would want longer than a week because I think some people would be like some people would be like will, then you just got to one another week you're going to be disappointed. No, I think one week of experiencing it. But then I think if you look like severe Gara people talk to your body and they'd ever hear what you say and I suspect she struggles all the time to be heard. So I think I would like to do one week and I would get out a lot in that time. I would not be home at all. We're closed. I'd be walking down a high street in a bikini, and I would be stalking lots of voice and not happy to go back. I'm a feminist, but when I met the director of the play that I'm in, I told her that I read the script and love the part and had to do it once I'd reddish and that's not strictly true. I go to the poster and I saw this woman wearing a courses and boxing gloves, and it was the hottest thing I've ever seen. Be in that I have to be God, and luckily it is phenomenal. But that was the spark. I'm a feminist, but I'm going to away at the end of the month and somebody sort of jokingly who sought of knows basically, somebody offered to introduce me to Jon Hamm. Regular listeners of the podcast? No. And I said, no, I'm not. Shopping? No, I'm not looking my best at the moment. I'm overtired and behind him, I- grooming. I'm saving meeting him for when I look perfect. Them, I people understand they understand, but I'm the tradition. This thing ever heard. I'm not endorsing that message. I'm this. I just want to adopt I. You never get a second chance to make a first impression. Not that when I was young. Once you've made that first impression, then they sort of got this idea in the head of who you are, then you can deviate from that that you can be off just coming back from yoga. No, makeup short. They already know who you are may swiftly Ribaud sh. I would just say that. So often I look back at pictures of myself and I know in that picture, I thought I looked like she, I look at that picture and Tom, I looked really good and I think that's what would happen. I think he go to LA whatever you look like. And you look back at a picture from this may say, when I'm eighty. But obviously I will. But that's not what I'll be perusing the Instagram pitches. It'll be the following forty eight hours that I'll be. Let me don't meet John her. I don't want to. Now. A feminist, but I'm working with a really talented people at the moment doing this play. It's an opposite joy, and the assistant director is young lady called Jackie, and she's fantastic. She's so talented and accomplished. And one day she was really irritating me and I realized it was because she's young and as a whole life ahead of her. So. Bush's. Yeah. If she eighteen, she's not. But she looks at. She's like, oh my God. I always get. Need the girl. This past, she's very comfortable with me sharing this, what she'd like to meet John? Yeah, she, which is a coup girl. She's probably meeting him right now. Not second guessing yourself? No, I'm a premise. I nearly said, I'm supremacist now. The reason there's a raisin. You will understand. I'm a feminist, but the other day I sold a white supremacist attacking a white woman on the street was out front. The BBC in he shouting at her. The BBC hates white people. I mean famously the BBC has never featured a white person. I completely see his point I stepped in and defended the woman from the white supremacist and he started tacking me saying, we're just having a conversation. You're the one causing trouble anyway. You're an ugly bent. I know I then felt I'd got the heat of her and I withdrew, hey, then followed me on his bicycle. He had tread locks by the way that's important. Just get the picture keeping a solid, be on his bicycle and sheltered anyway, it wasn't her. I called ugly. It was you and just gave me like forty, five synonyms for ugly. He basically started shouting, your ugly yorker test your this. And I rang I was upset. I rang Susie coma who had to talk me down. So Suzie coamo. A black woman had to comfort me a white woman because of white supremacist had called me ugly. So I'm a feminist, but when I went to a book launch for a really good friend, you don't know her who has a book ice Sunday Times top seller, just as I know you don't are she. I was so proud to be there for that moment, you know, and stand with her in her life and see her having her moment. And the second her back was turned, I furiously went to the index to see. She'd mentioned me. Thanks so much as what you would you. Live from the. To shop presents. Why does Jessica Regan very special, but it's just talking about women on stage. That's. This is the guilty feminists. The podcast in which we explore on new goals. Twenty-first-century feminists in the Apocrypha and insecurities which undermine them. I'm Deborah Frances white with me as Jessica Regan, and we're talking about women finding on stage and screen. Everyone. This loads of evil, and they're lovely people say that sold up, get a ticket, but often people don't use their tickets as you can see, I some there are some seats available so for anybody's outside in the corridor to aegis shoutout. And if anyone comes in late, which they definitely will just start like good British feminists. We're very good at the British feminists. I mean, British people are gonna totting as it is feminists experts. We, I mean there's no better than a British feminist. In my opinion, we don't talk aren't into just say, uncle, fuck yourself. See Irish way. I am originally Australian. And. Well. Where we say exported them. So. In Australia was Iraq off, and that was not just something they invented for neighbors. That's a topic onscreen reference neighbors. Those that you remember the eighties slash nineteenth cinci let's give us a tour. If you remember the eighty s. Cheer if you went born yet. Oh, no, no. I'm just say the Irish thing, goof accuser. Thank you. No, I'm not interested. From. No, I am interested in people. I'm a feminist, but I'm not interested in people who are went board and the that is not right there. Avant Rable children. They weren't here in the listen. I love honorable children. I mean, all children not just ones. All children under Berlin away. If you know where to pinch them rhymes is London. Have you ever told scoot inches? Thick, very vulnerable. Previous students TV I can speak for herself. Do you know what I mean? Able to send up for themselves in certain schools, yes, London, no vulnerable children. And I like people who were born before the eighties, but I think if you don't remember the eighties, you shouldn't be able to drink. Do you see what I mean by that? That's my. That's my problem. I just think people who will born like people now who will born in two thousand can drink fishy. That's what I'm saying. I have an issue with it. You should have witnessed at least ten minutes of the twentieth century. You know, you have no business drinking driving. If you're born after nine, eleven, just no, no business voting for this Tinari of the suffrage sets and you were coming of age within it, like some kind of poem. What's happening you fulfilling if you were eighteen the fulfilling the promise of the suffrage. It's like a poem. Has anybody eighteen this year just. Oh. Dates. First of July, so you've already done it. Okay, we've missed it. Okay. No cake. Call off the cake. Call off the suffragette shaped cake. Tactics to have a suffragette shape cake because most of them are hunger strike now. Am I wrong. We're having a good time. All right. Suffragettes violent. They were very tedious. Clips about the Suffragettes punching people in the montage. Clips of cap woman. I can't imagine why bond girls beating each other up and none of the suffrage. It's interesting. Nobody in a long skirt actually. This is what happens if you make you feminist montages. Dicon edit because women can't use technology now and there's the rope. I mean, I think Tom knows where the rub is, and it's not there. So before we get into women fighting on stage and screen because you aren't doing play the moment you, I'm punching. Yes, ma'am. I'm doing a play Victorian, female boxers, which was a thing. Oh yes, it was underground. It was before boxing was regulated. So a lot went on. It's like when you see films that happened before censorship in the Hays code and their black and white, and you're like, whoa, how did they get away with us? It's a bit like was Oakland's of things happening in London with women fighting sometimes for titillation. But actually there was some really amazing lady Victorian boxers who were dedicated to it, our story, our play, it takes four women and how their lives intersect and what the boxing, how it empowers them, freeze them and all that. What character? My character is Matilda Blackwell and we'll from history. The votes there fictionalized versions, but they are drawn from real inspiration and research. This has been ten years in the making and physical, very longtime to tell this absolutely brilliant story by joy Wilkinson, who's here tonight, ladies and gentlemen, they're all really three dimensional characters. Mathilde is a business woman. She's fierce and she's the strongest female part that's ever come across my desk. Yeah, she's the strongest. Most fully realized quite surprised that women Victorian times box. What do you think true them to? It wasn't money was at fame, was it the desire to report their corset and scream at the sky? I think all of the above. I mean, all of the above firm wire podcast. Money fame and designed to rip off my Corson statement Scott, and I've done one of those things ripped off Mukasa. Yeah. I mean, I won't participate in spanks. Right. Why am I trying to trick people into thinking that I'm somehow smoother than I am? Desperately unhealthy feels you can fear circulation stopping. I'm worried like, I'll lose a leg. If I were shape wear, Doug it about shape wear is it's got to go somewhere. I'm so I find you roll. It just rolls up and then the shape the spanked start to wrote down, and then you get this sort of artificial role unto the breasts. And then this sort of run of elastic underneath. And I'm like, look, I mean, I'd rather just be the shape I am then pretend shape that somehow does not look human. Does Rosen places you didn't have before. I didn't have them before. People might think people know that my stomach is not concave. I think they've guessed that if anybody knows me, they've guessed it just from the way I've just by sheer glance. So suddenly if they see me out on a Saturday night, don't think they're fooled. Favor instead of shape where pleats always have a little place wants what I say comfortable roomy. It can breath, it can breathe and you can breathe. I should start a rain. Shouldn't I. Can we please have a wonderful feminist? Welcome for Denver. So why caught look at violence on the screen? Anything promises to be violent, anything that looks like someone might get funded? I got. I caught what should I have to look away my hands and sometimes even have to stick my fingers in my is so I can't hear it. And then generally, if I'm watching something with Tom, he will tap me on the shoulder and say, it's all right. It's gone. No Tom watches something. He watches John row of that I call punch face. So I'll say, oh, you're watching punch face. I'm going to go do something else because Tom watches those kinds of shows those kind of book sets Walking Dead, zombie, punish pace. The other kind of shows he likes sort of Gordon, Ramsay shouting people in kitchens. We refers to those lunch face. Even suspense. Anybody following anybody, my friend and I started to write a thriller. We were really enjoying writing. We'd better watch lots of thrillers because we're learn a lot from watching them. Both of us were so pathetic. Honestly, the whole of the time we were like, oh, oh, my go to. She's still stop on a. And I looked at her and I went, you know, we renting a film. We could never want. That is true. I could not watch my own thrilling. I'm so scared of watching violence generally. And I think it's because most of us spend our whole lives of voiding violence. So many of our confrontations in real life or even not confrontations out tiny status signals to each other ways of voiding violence, high status people. You know the people that you meet like this, they're saying, stay away from me on bind and low status. People saying, stay away from me. I'm not with biting. Every aggressive interaction is a way of avoiding a fight because on the savannah fights were expensive because they cost calories and caused injuries. So at the moment I have a cat and to small kittens, and there has been no physical contact, but quite a lot of status signals saying, fuck off you little bit a hissing walking around puffing out being like if you come over here. I'm gonna scratch your eyes out. Okay. You have come over here and I'm gonna go further away then make a big face again. That's what all interactions are that aren't actually punching that are in any kind of negative confrontational territory. It's amazing. We punch each the more really because we're sensually animals, but we punch each other very little. If you think about it day today, most of the time things like if she looks boyfriend again, gene, if she looks for again, I'll tell you what, I'll tell you what I'm going to lose it. I'm gonna lose if you for it again. I'm going to lose it. I'm gonna lose it. You better? Not look at my boyfriend again because I'm gonna lose it. I'm gonna lose it. All of that is a way to avoid a fight because if you really wanted to punch them, you wouldn't want them. Warning, someone tells the person you don't want to punch them, and that's why you're saying don't do this, or I will punch you. I have. I think only physically accosted someone twice in my life was ten years old, and I was at a camp for not way which children. It was just a holiday camp. It was just sort of day day place into in the holiday is that my mom sent us to, and this girl was like really horrible. And she looked at your plants a so messy. Did you do those yourself? Because they awful. And I said, no, my mother did them and she went, then your mother's boss, I'd freak. So I pushed off the swing. She felt quite heavily into some leaves. My sister backed me up. She never spoke to me again, but I clearly didn't learn will then be, I think I was bit scared of what I did because I haven't really accosted anyone again, as far as I can remember, except a couple of years ago in a club with men were so nasty and aggressive and entitled, and they were taking up all this space and they kept banging into us. And I was sort of saying, oh, I was here. I had a rebound backside, sort of it was a music, and I was sort of backed by war because I have particularly bad back. And so I was there somewhere. I kind of lean and it kept coming into my space and he kept coming as I said, sorry, kept saying, excuse me. Sorry. Could you just sorry. Sorry. Sorry. And eventually went, oh, sharp love. We were here first. He was not there. I, that's key. He was not there. I, you were early ruble who think you are. And so I kept his barrel over. I feel you shouldn't applaud that, but I understand what you do. I was with a guy, not Tom a guy. He likes going to music gigs a friend and afterwards he said, can you not do that again when you're with me? Because he won't punch you? He'll punch me which is a good point. But one reason I can feel I can do it now. So here's the thing in real life. We're always pretty much voiding confrontational voiding. Actual physical violence confrontations we have are usually to delay, or in fact put off forever anyone punching anyone that is why it is quite rare, but that's why we enjoy the catharsis of seeing it on stage or screen. That's why, because it would be fun right now in a way as much as I hate violence, I recommend could force myself to look at somebody punching Brett Kaverner in the face repeatedly. If I got to see off read. Slash june. Kill, Fred, incredibly slowly. I would watch it in slow motion. So there are times when the Casaus of what we can see on screen fills us with a hope for our own freedom, it fills us with an extra power that makes us feel like we can take up more space in the room and it lands the punch. So we don't have to thank you very much. Hallo guilty feminists. Please come enjoy me just Regan for big speeches workshops in London, October fourteenth, November eighteenth at the bunker theater thoughts, Tober fourteenth November eighteenth. At the bunker theater, we're gonna find our voice, build our confidence and take our space more dates to follow peyser going fast season. Our guest today is a writer actor and now film director, you will know her from spaced w one a. and Paddington to please get incredibly excited and make strawberry guilty feminist who knows us for the wonderful Jessica. So we thought to Jessica's. Enjoying it very much, very much. So just kind of I'm a big fan of yours. I'm such a big fan of Pugin since spaced, and I think that was a really interesting program in terms of sometimes it's it's sort of like, remember that kind of slow motion fight in the street and the fun that used to have with those kind of yomas. And now he you on making a film about the cool the fight? Yes. Well, I've always been interested in conflict Oviously being inspired by film, but also by comedy, but you wouldn't necessarily put the two things together, though. The fight is funny and warm. It's not actually a comedy per se, though it started out slightly more as a sort of comic idea. And then as I was left alone to evolve it in a way that is glorious when you do something, they just left me to it to a large extent. It kind of voted into something much more like a drama Audrey to the story. Well, I mean the inspiration for the film. Itself was conceived a film that I could make him folks in, which is where I live and act. But the specific idea came from going to boxing gym, which is actually featured in the film which is all the red walls, and it's an amazing box giant used to school, and it's this really ratty so of old on staircase and on Tuesdays and Thursday nights, you can go down for two pounds. You can box for an hour on, I started going because I wanted to start boxing because I wanted to channel few things, which is why boxing is fantastic. And I wasn't boxing per se. I was boxes sizing or box fitting, which is the sorta firms. You're not repulsing anyone. You're doing all the move that's doing then. And that's what I was doing in a group in class with music. So it's kind of fitness, but you get to put the gloves on the beginning in you spa with the women and you, it's brilliant exercise, but so you do get kind of Spar and punch, and you get to punch the punch bags. But then you also see some of the other women, particularly that time who were part of the kind of amateur boxing group who were doing the warm up and then actually getting in the ring what I was really amazed. That was because it was a women's night. I was just really inspired by the women who were doing it, and we're all ages and shapes and sizes, and all from different experiences. And I felt that was one thing that really did unifiers or which is that we all had something or someone or something that we wanted to, you know, and I was just inspired by the women who were in the group and how strongly at how strong some of the women really were. Some of the more professional boxers who were doing much boxing was so strong looking and just how inspiring and how great that was just to be even in the vicinity of that in just sort of started thinking upper story about a Borman who did this foxing because I'm inspired by fighting films and actually that what you're talking about when you see fighting on screens and you see a woman or someone you can identify with someone you can relate to doing what you wanna do it. So empowered. Remember that feeling very clearly watching Bill and thinking how it didn't matter that it wasn't real, that she wasn't really fooling. The fact that she was a woman and she was doing that was amazing. And that's, that's what I wanted to go for, and I wanted to create an love the John roll-over con rocky genre. I love the sort of that format, but to actually create something that women could relate to and get into and have that feeling when you leave the cinema where you think. Yeah, come on. Let's go. Let's go. There's something about because I've been doing this training for the play that I'm in and something about putting on the loves getting into those positions. Even, like you said, when you just sparring because we do have a montage, you cannot do a boxing, anything with an montage, the. Of our training and it is the most exhilarating, thrilling thing I've ever done on stage. How did you feel? Were you surprised to take you back when you go on an even learning? Some simple moves, you're like, whoa, it just your center shifts or something. I don't know. I mean, I feel like I've always been a fighter anyway, and I've always done different classes that were combat based. And again, I did that in space, the kind of food and I love through Jordan. Kung FU hustle was another one. There's some amazing female fighting in that as well. So I love that. So I kind of fancy myself a bit of bruiser so. But when I actually really started sort of training and I kind of love to even more feel it coming home almost well revealing partners. Yeah, I think it feels quite natural. I think it feels quite natural to be in our state and I enjoy the physical confidence that comes with and knowing that in that stance, your powerful school. I grew up in all the goes fought. The bells were really violent. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, very much. So. Yeah. Did you go to school in a women's prison? Yes, yes, I did. No, I didn't reside just I just went to just normal normal state school. There was a lot. There was a lot there was particularly, I don't know. I mean, I think I may be. I don't know if it was it wasn't muscle of structural violence between goals. Actual physical people in your round on like, get very, tended to try and avoid it. But the other friends were more confrontational. There were scraps at my school and one is really indelibly printed on my mind, remember where it was a bit of a David and Goliath situation. But I remember just being so compiled, I couldn't tear myself away when it was. I think we're not allowed to be aggressive and what I don't condone violence whatsoever. These girls at had an outlet, a boxing training, something like that. They wouldn't have been scrapping. Absolutely. Yeah. What are you hoping that women and men take away from it because we are expected to watch rookie. This is not just a film for women watch it. Men, please go watch menace specially, get tickets to buy tickets. Now, it's all coming up. They're not. What are you hoping that people will take from it? How are you hoping they're gonna feel or how does this story trae really, I really want people to feel strong. I want people to feel strong. You know, I want to feel strong. I want to encourage other people to feel strong. I think it's important. I think you know when I leave something feel somehow empowered or validated, I'm so grateful for those. So I hope that this does that there's a shot at the end. It's she's kind of got the silky because she goes back to kind of keep straying on the boxing, and it's this sort of lights gets in the ring, and it's so exactly it's so cliche, but I wanted. And I wanted that for kind of a mother, three. You know what's interesting about watching the trailer and if you're listening at home, I think we will be able to put a law or mother trailer. Listen, I don't want to say, okay, mother, I only four women, it doesn't matter, but that's an example. But when I am somewhat you say, because you know or wherever women have none. No, I don't feel for you do need to qualify that because of worried I, no, of course. No, no, no. But you're not leaving women without children are? I don't have children just doesn't have children part when women have children, they're often beatified and they're expected to only be nurture. So I do understand what you say it in this context didn't feel left out. I feel more that you're saying at specially somebody who's who has those gender norms pushed on them by society because you have to be strong. I feel like women have live in this sort of Timor's dichotomy where it's like, we're told to be a woman to be feminine. You know, you have to sort of embody these sort of spurious qualities of sort of weakness casino. And yet that seems to me in every single aspect of every single experience of every single woman I've ever met. There is no way you can be a woman and not be strong is impossible. We know I've found the stronger I get the more feminine I get because the more powder AM in the more and more good. I feel. You know, and that to me seems like, absolutely. You know, that seems like reality. One thing I thought about watching the trailer and if you're at home, you'll be able to get a link to the trainer. We'll set that up is that I feel like if a man had written and directed this, the fighting would be sexualize d- and the fighter would be sexualize and what I loved about watching it is that she's not wearing any makeup. There is no sort of overtone of Golan girl action to it. Now, listen, if you enjoy girl action boxer. I'm not suggesting there's anything wrong with gonna, go action boxing films, but I am suggesting that if a man had written directed that would almost of the Cecil b there and felt to me like you with a hero and this wasn't about a gaze on you. This was about your viewpoint, which was your character's viewpoint, which is really powerful. Did you think of that when you were watching it that you didn't want it to be kill Bill as much as you like that in a way? Absolutely. Absolutely. Of course, that was a brilliant thing about having the freedom to make it is that I didn't have to do that. It was able to be as raw and real as possible. And I, when we sparring in the ring, we only had one day we had such twelve days through the whole thing. We had one day in the twelve days to the wholesale days through the whole hell. I know what if I done with my life. What have I done the twelve days? Definitely not Meadville where we in the boxing ring and fantastic things. We got these real professional boxer so two boxes. Another Jessica who was a boxer who is proper professional boxer and so not a stunt boxer. So when we were doing the punching, you know it was just like punch me. So she was obviously, I was aware that it was coming when she's kind of punch me on the patch. He is punching me, and then she did actually on one of the take the fact that the take that we use my head was up higher than it should have been. And she did actually crack much even then she cracked cheekbone and I fell down and I was like, did we get it? We get it and they said, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then my sister who was part the team said, I could actually see on camera your head gear slightly starting to move from your face as my cheek, just like. But luckily in the film, I had a black eye on that side of my face anyway. So hey, every cloud. So that was so good. Every every writer director actors count has a has an engorged cheek. When you're doing it on stage when your box onstage clearly you couldn't take a real punch every night because it's a longer run. We do do we do this? Of course, it's actually coming hyundee. It's nose entirely. It looks like I said, but it courses provide a lot of protection. And because this is a scrappy or form of boxing, this contemporary boxing Hugo's understand like lower center of gravity, but they were like the kangaroo back then that was all being upright and holding your grind. So it's period, boxing, we're wonderful, wonderful fight director, Alison, Berg, but there's a lot of contact fights have got really stunning actress who is is so physical and fantastic. And one of the actors is James Baxter and feel Skinner, and they have really real fight. They are scraping they are going. I we have. These loves, we have protection were very safe, but you can't pull every punch. And I've a few contact punches like at it in here and and I throw a few what I was a little bit unnerved by is I do have one real like. Contact punch to the abdomen that I deliver with quite a kick ass line, and it's tesla long before she started to make mistakes rice. Pretty cool. Okay. It feels good. Shocked that I was looking forward to that contact punch anything? Yeah. Yeah, nobody just something empowering about it. We look into each of this is we're going to take each other on this journey before Feis. There's a lovely kind of sisterhood, and I totally know what you mean had the stronger you feel the more of a woman? I felt more basically in my body that this role has given the biggest cultural law that strong women fem Inc is absolutely opposite's true. That's entirely the of the play. This big scenes that were because Victorian thinking was that women had a finite of energy and motherhood was going to stop that energy. So they mustn't do arduous tasks. They mustn't do anything physical, they would agree with. I'm out of motherhood going to sap, tiny to sit here. But there's something in the guy's clearly where's this coming from? This need? I, I mean, it's a metaphor, can a physical manifestation of channeling yourself into action. So it's not sort of talking about channeling. All of that so reads, it's not it's words, it's these words. That's what I am. Could you look at you Queen and sounds it yourself. It yourself. Hala guilty feminists aids Debra briefly interrupting a podcast listening to say that I will be at the Liverpool film festival on the evening of the fourteenth showing my film, say my name a book tickets for the fourteenth Tober if you are in Liverpool, I believe there's a I afterwards, please come up and say, hi also on the fourteenth, there's the Chilton literature festival where I'm doing a podcast there as well guilty feminist, please come along to that. I think there might be so some tickets left. If you are in Cardiff it will be there the weekend of the twentieth of toba and get tickets. Now, if you would like to, I have also got a book at the moment called the guilty feminist. It's about my views on feminism and we are touring the guilty feminist show a lot more we're trying to. And we've heard your requests for that. Which to make the show bigger. We're doing more with help refugees and honesty, it's national, but our team is the same size. It still just me and Tom, we don't advertise ING in case of anything clashing with feminism. We don't also partry and we try to keep the podcast as a weekly thing and make sure we put a brand new episode every week including Christmas. If you could find the book that would really, really help with that with keeping the pocus going. It's available at more stations, other good book shops, Amazon, if you must, and if you can get it in hardback that would really help keep the podcast going. But it's also vegtable in audio book. Please get that if you'd like to read it to you and it's valuable able to. But also you have voted and read it. Could you please go to Amazon and leave a review because that will really help it sell. So if you could go to Don, Kirk k. and leave a review and make it five stalls. Thank you for the old days. Please. Just. So as an actor at drama school, you've trained to do stage combat, you do find yourself wondering how useful knowing how to use a broad sword is we do think on, I'm going to teach you something real quick. It's anybody know what a nap is not. This is the sound of performer makes to make the sign defect of a punch so that it's a non contact puncher hit. So something was coming for me. I would try and do this and signs like something, not necessarily a punch, but hopefully people would follow the fist moving away and look at the action. And by that scenario, the problem is stage combat is that you are told to never make contact, neither are contact punches, and there are a lot of contact quenches in our play. But when I had graduated from drama school, I learned to always not hurt someone not put them in danger to always pull the punch at the last minute. So when I was set upon by two men in Brixton in two thousand eight come with me on this, don't worry. It's going be alright when I was set upon by two men in Brixton coming home from a party one. Nice. It was actually the sauna come up with this point. Not that I'm rock and roll. I had had a Kip on the coach waiting for the sun to come. Let's Baylor I was a few doors away from my house and anything that dodgy happened to me in London. It's often happened close to my front door if way. I just saying anyway, I heard a voice saying, you got a cigarette. I said, no. And then he went, come on, give me a cigarette. And I said, no. And I was feeling kind of I dunno, I think I was so close to my door was feeling quite confident, you know, as what is this going to do? And he's. To push me into a hedge, somewhat. The twist was that white van pulled up and a door opened. I knew that moment I was going to die. And I also knew in that moment, I knew how to pull punches, not to throw them. So a sound came is of me that I can only describe as a sexual encounter between Aweil and several bears. Would you like to hear the sound. The sun became is of me, but imagine I'm trying to break the sign system module, not sort of make a wash. I made the sound and the man jumped back up -solutely terrified and shocked and confused. The van did a Hamburg turned. I'm without his Mace who was running Denver streets while I went wrong. Film, an adrenalin film fan, paraphrasing Forrest Gump. I was shaking so much the journal in at that point. I saw a couple of likes, go on a few people can hire. And in that moment exactly new, I was going to die. I knew I was going to live shaking. I entered my house and I thought, oh God, I should have a drink. I should is you're in shock. The only thing available was archers. So I sat with a peach naps. But what I realized in that very strange moment Brixton dawn into the night was that while drama school and stage combat had not prepared me to fro punches, it had given me projection like a mother of. These are necklaces from our new guilty feminist collection made by Steve Allee who's a Syrian refugee and the proceeds go to Hoffa's develops continuing education and half to his mother's project which helped. She is also refugee and her project helps female refugees get a trade because often been radio or something like that. And then they go to Turkey and they can't speak the language and that don't have the paperwork. So these are beautiful silver necklaces from our collection. Just already grabbing absolutely can't make one says guilty feminists. And the other one says women in Arabic. I don't know which you want, I think guess should always choose. Yeah. Okay. So I'm just wrapping Mina. Okay, so your guests, you can choose which one this is salute, beautiful who might, oh, that is the one I was going to give you. If you would like to buy one, you go to road hyphen from hyphen on. Don't you. I'm fully going cry right now. That's so beautiful. And Steve is such an amazing person, and that's all of it is the proper Silva and he's office. He was an architecture student, but he learned to be silversmith in the Kelly jungle. And he started using dials and electrical wiring and things like that. So he had I feel bad. I haven't brought one for everyone. I'm barrister, but you could never raise the price that might Greg Christmas presents. I should've kept them. We gifted it also self literally. Literally open and put it on stray away like mine definitely gift it. So there is peace around turning feelings into actions and not pulling up hunches anymore. And I've really not just having a strong body building your muscles, literally your physical muscles used doing box, start doing anything like that. It translates into the way you stand into the way you act into the way you interact with the world. And I think as a source of umbrella that covers everybody, no matter their ability or disability, it doesn't matter where you start or what you strengthen. It could be even working on your breathing to make yourself stronger, whatever it is that you can move move it and make it stronger. It's absolutely one hundred percent true. Physical strength translates into a motion strength, unmanned strength. So Jess, could you please tell us about your play? Where can we come and see it? Because I really do want to see box in corset. When and where are wonderful place called the sweet science of bruising and it's on its other playhouse, the first previews on the third of October, it closes on the twenty sixth of October. So you've got three weeks in October little over three weeks. Do please come down and feel empowered and moved the way where old feeling in the rehearsal room? It is just it's written by joy and it is joy, and it's very, very special on. Yeah, I'd love you. All we will be there. Jessica Hynes, where can we see your film? It's premiering at the film festival on the seventeenth of October a pitch how central in Piccadilly and there's two other showings within the festival. And then I think it's going to be distributed and hopefully out in the cinemas next year. But if you like the sound of it, the trailer is going to be out in the next couple of weeks and just feel like I can't even say hashtag about it because I know, no, I will say it for you. I'm out. I will say it if you'd like to say that you hashtag the fight movie. Tell us what you also that distributors can find. You know where there is an audience for it if you'd like, see it streaming hashtag, the fight movie and winds are going to be streaming and create demand for it because we do this movie to be saying there's so few movies written directed and starring women, and those that are have to be showing twelve days. So we need to support them. Also Rocha movie and have a cameo in it, and it's called same. My name and my friends who are in movies in Hollywood. Tell me that it's absolutely exceptional for women to write a script that actually gets into a movie that isn't about one woman slowly coming into her own in India or one slowly dying a red disease. Those are the things we're allowed to do screen all maybe fall in love with the man, but then it's half his story sort of thing. I'm this has jokes, it's has guns from me. I don't know how much to write guns, but I don't like you'd like to see it wherever you all have to say my movie and we'll try and bring it somewhere near you. It's actually going to be on the Liverpool film festival. You can buy tickets for that now and the card of international film festival, and you can buy tickets for that soon and hopefully at the fine can we showed it to be a fine. Has as the PF I guilty feminist film club, I'd very quickly like to plug best pick, which is the podcast deal with Thomson ski and John Dorney Thompson is the man behind the montage. We watch every single film that ever won best picture at the Oscars, and we discuss it at length and it's really fun. So if you enjoyed these delta tones, please tune in at if you'd like to see the montage that we showed at the beginning of the film club, go to the show notes and you'll be able to click on the link. I'm can book know already to see the fight at the the seventeenth nineteenth and twenty first, you can absolutely book. Get in now because this is going to go out live and then everyone's going to buy the ticket. So if you've come live by tickets tonight for the fight part of the London Film Festival, and while you're there, check out what else women are doing and go and buy things buy and buy tickets for what they're doing. It's really, it's really coaching for the whole podcast, and we've hit ten o'clock and my brain's gone. You said we'd be done. Also by my book. You have. Guests goes Jessica Reagan and our very special guest, Jessica recording engineer grungy list per up parts. Parts. For the today, show person at philmont tired. Everyone of the fires of you for this thing to more about this and other episodes. Was Shuli expert. I mean, I'm minister incorporated a slut drop into the. Oppose wrangling. Called. Never heard that before. It's called us electro. I've never heard that. I thought it looks like a sort of in it to work. I did not know are coming for me tonight Tonioli. Networking. I just didn't know if it's like a bam, straight back up. It's a, it's a slow Trump on. If it's like kind of a continuous motion that's already in use. Welcome. Never say you don't let about feminists guilty.

Tom boxing London John Dorney Thompson Jessica director Jessica Regan BBC Liverpool Jon Hamm Bill Instagram Denver stalking writer Gara Sofia amateur boxing LA Bush
143. International Women's Day 2019

The Guilty Feminist

00:0-1 sec | 1 year ago

143. International Women's Day 2019

"I'm a feminist. This week International Women's Day week. I'm went to many many vents and to one watched a lecture in which I was told that women's chances of being a see very low, which I knew. Because living in the world. But also something I didn't know that Crash Test Dummies generally mainl-, which means women's chances of being injured in a car accident higher because the seat belts not made for us. And when they do use female crush Test Dummies they tend to put them in the passenger seat because it's not like we're going to be driving. And my first thought was if comedy and all of this goes tits out for me. I kind of knew I wasn't going to be see, but it would have been nice to think I could have got a gig as a fucking crash test dummy. No. Mcfadden's? I'll go pissed off because I took a date to an England game when be stadium in the VIP box spent a lot of money on him and on my he took me to the park. Did he bring a picnic? No he did. I heard that was the last eight it was I started this face off to that. Never again. Seminary? But. Independent lady so independent. I could be in Destiny's Child. But I do feel like right now is a great time in my life for a sugar person into I don't need to gender. It doesn't need to be specific just sugar person. Just someone with money. Who wants to give it to me? Amazing. I'm feminized ball. When I get dressed up and leave. My house are puppets. He won't part the barbershop and older guys out. And I look at me. But he just to change have another day Maha. For the day. That would be my great dream home for the day. They look. Got a love stuff back on net. Flicks. But currently judging myself of about how bad I wanna bone. Snug great, quite Kim for the peon at the moment. And I don't know how to handle it. It's really settling and have to be careful like I'm beyond sexually frustrated sexually furious. Snug good can't even speak in low tones because the vibrations will travel down to clitoris. Scud to be careful with sex positive, and we're here for you. In the dressing room. If necessary. I'm a feminist Bont. I hosted the stylist remarkable women aborts on cheese day. Which was an amazing on met. So many amazing women, but the day before the body at been took three days three days and the day before I went in for my spray time and ofter I came out, and I phoned my friend, Susan coma. And I said to Susie you will never as a black woman. No, the indignity of stunting. Spreadeagled naked in front of a lady who then paints you with freezing cold spray pain, and then dries you with a reverse who've ahead. And she said that's right hunting, that's black privilege. To attendance on my ninety five to be a what go. Faded too long. Like ten seconds chick believes me shit. I'm back by. I thought you get perations. Guilty. Will be saying more of them the saving. He's so much came back. Welcome. Welcome welcome. Thank you so much for coming out and feeling every te'o of the Balkan top tier are you far away? Absolutely, okay. Now, we need to look off to those people. Everyone is coming off to those people because otherwise intersectional because those people you guys have from privilege right here right here. I can touch shave and will. Touch, but I will send energy on up to the Bank. Whoever catches it just Chit. Wow. I thought touched a lot of people. So it's. It's. Because as a professionally entertaining feminist, I am concert around from pillar to post tell you for Monday as a stop on that on Sunday afternoon when off to the taste pumps into review Mira for you, you just watching Russian dole. Not me. Oh, not me. No, I'm I'm telling you, it's national Women's Day. He used to be a day it has become a week, but it's called International Women's Day week. They know prepared to give us a whole week that like. We give the day that we have today. I'm telling you concert draw toes. I am exhausted. I don't know how men do it with fifty one weeks of the year. I'm grateful phony week on feel for them. Now. I can't it must be leering every week they have to get up go to a breakfast panel. And explain what it's like to be a man. Go to a lunch of ends. And explain how difficult these man because of women getting in the way. When evening events and form and homey of men who talk about how they need to help each other more onto it. No, that's presumably that's what they do. That's how they live. I've been thinking a lot about the joys of being women this week. And I we're way past that malls. And Venus all women are all men are. And I don't want to be reductive in any way. But I think there is one thing that I have noticed that is true of all women, I virtually ever met. I have never been to lunch with three other women and not had it turned into a coaching session. Lived in various different countries of the world. I've worked with deaf women of got friends with trans women. I've got friends who are old women. Young women goals. It doesn't seem to where two more women countered. That will be coaching session. Some will bring a problem. It could be a problem about Korea. Sex finance dating relationships friendship, and the others will spring into launched coaching coven. It's a genuine thrill for us. And if you I'm guessing a straight system, you don't experience this at the same level. I have heard I've done quite a lot of research anecdotal to be fair, but I have done anecdotal research. And I know it's not quite the same. So explain it to you. What you in this over the second row? Yes. Chris do you often find yourself in an accidental coaching circle? I wish I did. Okay. So Chris I'm going to explain how wonderful it is. Don't feel sorry for him. He's a white, man. He's fine. The second fine. He's not a putt cost getting attention from beautiful woman. What more does he wants are you enjoying this Krista? What you brother, I moved onto some other. Chris. What's also, Chris Orion was went to get you. Oh, Brian says film, say okay? So you'll get and you still don't really have the coaching cycle. More of my friends. Have it the my straight male friends have it? I've not found the right goal friends. I know I meant with men. No, no came in to incur choose. Okay. I'm bringing in. I'm starting up. A course. The coaching suckled basically goes like this. Someone will bring a problem, for example. I don't know. I'm seeing this guy. And he's like really into it and seem so attentive and then for couple of weeks and then for two weeks ago, really quiet, and he'll say is busy with work. And he'll hydro response. Then suddenly he'll pop up again, and he'll be really into it again. And it just goes hot and cold. And I don't know what to do and the coaching becames always with a series of questions. It's like women trained, therapists. We just shoots of -ly undestand the therapeutic process. We don't need to go through the coals questions and listening. Fuck st-, where did you meet him? Tenda? Has he introduced you to an if his friends, no? Can I see a picture of him? Do you have any voicemails? I can listen to now. Some of this does veer into private work. All women also slightly private -tective. I believe must women. A lot of women are probably detectives just give me if women you have struck the private detective. Great just give it as women if you have no desire for private detective moments. Just two women to women their shoes thousand people in this audience, then face to off we've on the questions listening, we share anecdotes from our own experience. We do not impose the conclusions on the one seeking the therapy. We meeting leave them there on the table for her to her inclusions. Well, I was dating him on once who would go between super hot. And then kind of ghosting me. And it turns out he had a second family and Stoke-on-Trent. Wanting glasgow. Well, I was dating woman and she had this hot and cold thing. And now, we're married and it turned out. She was just somebody who was very frightened of commitment. You know, it's possible. She did have another girlfriend looking back. So we put these things on the table. And then we allow the person seeking therapy to drill her own conclusions. She comes up with some feeling some sense shoe to feelings of how she's feeling and then we get into the park where we offer solutions and generally this variety on the table, a smorgasbord of solutions for her to choose from as his right and pro so someone will say book him book has number. It is toxic. You too good for this. He has gas lighting you suddenly feel important not important. What's going to be a long relationship with him? Why would you even put up with this you much? And then some people are the people who are about to applaud cheering of the ones who would give that advice. Some there's always someone who puts on the table. The suggestion of let's together, create and write a passive aggressive. Ulta mehta. We'll send it together. Now, what's up and wait for the response in real time? Gives a sheriff. That's when you go. Exciting the blocking the number. I mean, why be aggressive aggressive when you can be passive aggressive. It's so much fun. And there's always one who say I'm going to go into his work dressed up like a sandwich delivery. And find out exactly what's going on with. And that's the one that probably involve wake some kind of calls played. I'm there with my one of the private. I'm Chris Brown. I'm in the private detective crew, Chris, which what are you going? Sandwiches. Yeah. We want to know we wanna know what's going on with that guy. And then of course, there's the follow up session shingles, we will Shechem at the end of the non will win a we're gonna get together. And find out what happens we have to full of what's up group. We need to know. Right. You need to know. I don't want that ever left hanging. It's like watching like half of breaking bottles, something I am going to need to know what happens next, and that's just how normal. That's just absolutely regular for us. I've virtually never had it happened. But we've gone for lunch. No one's percent of the problem being notice solution suggested. And I kind of know that men don't do this because I've asked them which I have and I do talk mostly about sister men habit. Also, I don't want to exclude Chris and Ryan because you've said you also don't have the benefit of this. And I know this partly because men go off for hours, and I do think I'm not one of these Steven pinker people who goes, oh, let's always look for an evolution re biological reasons for why this might be a trend, but I do think on this occasion. It's something to do with hunting. Because menus to go off the savannah in one two and if they went off. Does they didn't talk much? We know that from together even just make gestures because chatty hunters dead hunters. I'm not as why? A husband or a boyfriend of someone here in the audience can go off and play golf with their best friend for seven hours and come back, and you can go house. John how's the devils? Come up. Four. There's nothing to you. What the fuck? How? Meanwhile, you had coffee with santia inside twenty five minutes you've found out the exact state of relationship. Whether there's any hope of reconciliation how the children feel about whether anyone else's moved onto a sexually with anyone else. If didn't come up. Didn't come on. The middle of I'm telling you this. My husband I'm going to name him Thompson scheme. He has no interest in gossip at all to appoint offensive. I mean, I tell him something that I'm like, I mean, what do you think? And why do you think why? But he will always say it's like a friend like a couple of something breaking up and all say, they'd be married for six years like what easing breaking up, and he'll be like, well, I'm sure they're they're reasons. Yes. Evidently to we must discuss. Try out. And he says he says like I'm sure if they want us to know, they'll tell us. It's just route. But I also know the lack of coaching circle because he went off to a polka gain poco and he went off to a poker game with some guys friends of friends, and they had had this long running poker game. And even how to lead aboard that they would get out polka night that said who was who'd won the most pulse or something. And he said oh on the leaderboard. There was a name, and it was unusual name. I think it's the man who married my drama coach from what I was drama camp years ago. I think he must go to that poker game. And I said and Moore's at him, and he went what do you mean? Did the guys did you you said to the other guys is he married to so? And so, and they didn't know they didn't know the name of his he's that they didn't know if he had a partner, they didn't know if he was married in a relationship or single. They didn't said how long have they been playing poker together. And you said a few years. Three. These people have had a weekly poker game where they all sit around together four hours. They don't know if this man lives under a bridge. In one bed flop with forty five mations. Is poly amorous has gays trait by they don't know anything about him. I do think wherever you want women could you this week or this month? Just gather cement together the way you got the women together and also them questions until they break. Are you ready for your first wonderful startup comedian? She is incredible. We've never had her on the feminists before. So I'm so excited because she's genuinely one of my favorite startup comedians working in the UK today, you may know her from Celescu Tai-ting. Mark wake. All the sitcom dumbed. But tonight, she is here with us at the guilty feminist put your hands together and make extrordinary welcoming International Women's Day, wait noises for the walkable. You know? We look. Good. I'm feminist everyday opportunity to catch kit. Making sure. Ubon? Fuck it in. Yeah. Job. Stop law might be web. You'd be on their face. Scott. I'm scanning. Two three before the audience. I'm on the knees. Really funny. Bedside. I do like ten Dicks by don't try to know God that way and try to trial puffy too. But only to try to myself in any way, 'cause I'm also John. Fool slip land on the dick. But I'm gonna fight for the job. You take the day job head take care. It's very good locate I'm away. I try and bed himself for men by exercising. Inside outside. Very much indoor part, I tried to walk out of a workout DVD's. I tried see one of them boss. The ten minutes down watch like a film. Been avatar that was found. I want to do good for you. Nice to have known. Now, I'm not the time in my life where my friends couple smart, and immolation shifts and lovey, cover and stuff. It makes you sick in my mouth. Like it. I'm bitam. I'm talking. This year, my friends some of that I'm pregnant I'm not cheating. Ooh. She clinic. We could clean a clean pick the pills. He planned. Even scary for me. How do we not dressed up the pregnancy? That's fucking scary. Every period. Let's see. I loved him. I know kids are spent myself too much. Keep the shit kids alive. Say that's the fucking in shape. And no. Got no kids shit drew a fly for cough. Flying. We do this shit that good shit on. To dig Johnny. Maybe we can do. Get the shit. Even my mom had kids. Kids. My mom was AT. But she had a child she with the runner in the Commonwealth Games. Yeah. In. Cream? She felt pregnant. While she was the Olympic trials with me. I'm blessed with my brother. Older brother, she pregnant with him quit running became a nuts. Never again. My brother Iliescu up to be a security. Imagine giving up your whole. Charity. The fucking shit on your peace of mind, kids security guns and Queen committee at the high when I'm gonna the next female any hit me. Two. It's to imagine. The kid and get Nuff you big baby and cracked his ship and soda feet to push push out the fear. I become too. London. But see my four shake. Fucking shit. As you could tell them single. I'm sorry. Now goes. Unhappy happy I'm clean out successful. I'm lonely. Not ever find yourself being so lonely. You apply to those PPI? Text message. You could free up tonight. Are you free? I'm about that's my friends that you them desperate friends in that too much to to my friend, Michelle showed me spot cards. So she knows it's going to be food in the fridge. John every time p Michelle. Yes, take dopey Michelle stats. That's I don't need. Now. I'm cool with my I'm cool with my awesomeness. Thank you. I don't need to be desperate for the dick. Okay. I catch too much. I'll tell you a fun catching story today's. So I without clock. And not why did the when you're single your friends, like worry goats club guy in the club? In a copy more finding the blackout island. One one. But but yet I let you go looking for that cat, and this is a true story. It's embarrassing. But because all friends and I go shame. I feel like telling you how you don't wanna hear my story. I'm gonna talk to my best. Five dollars onto my finger. And then all of us not to fit toss guy. You know, when you just the womb swells are because the chiefs science juice. It's filling up the word. In the love to ready to squeeze sponge. Ow. That's what happens in sire to sire to win. Filled up with the love Jews, looking not very sexy. John, let's be clear. LGBTQ fon hip, I'm strictly dick -ly. Bits get just for out that I would get it Moncef receive. I would do I would just anyway to. Two. Nineteen. We'll freaks anyway. So it's my juices twin enough. Yeah, I'm ready to Don. And think about me because I'm such an amazing 'cause I'm black now. To stereotype base to people we have. But these ones you can't say we can't we can't we don't ski. I want to say about this. I will get off scot-free. Okay. Cool. I'm going get this tension. I'm gonna stop people came. So I started to extreme. But the poppet. South coast town to the extreme Matete due to crazy, not watching me Britain's free to one. I didn't win. But look. Thank you think. So I thought to not right. The he like looks over to me before I was having to read spots. Manhole. What not he was interested? So he came over to me, and we had this instant instant chemistry, and I'm gonna fuck you so hot, and you know, when your wealth how well you are as condition it, and it's like a president for the guy the printed looking forward to ladies shit. No, you're so good looking food to the dick suck. And they're gonna have a great time. Is it just me? Really? See? Seacombe? Kumi Kumi the sake. Looking forward to give them to seek very happy about. He's very looking forward to that. Wait. Talking to take him to go back. Now, it's place eighty eighty for Powell. For the house ready to see Ali, and I'm looking for and I realized that he lives with parents. And it's just what who. Small again, it just went about a parade in the Noni con. I'm not sure if I can fuck him around the house. At least money mean. Parents might be a will let me let me take out. He goes to tidy broom talking. Fucking. I'm going to tie upsets, and he's than if you buy that. And he. I thought it's been for really really average looking guy kryptonite. Gotcha. The average base looking what about love him. Anyway. And I'm looking around the house being noisy and by hits. He's bookshelves of all books as read in. How did he is fuck, and I'm okay, you learn July, and then I find a book, the I have another the state book and this book with Tina Fey book, right? Both the wicked. That's great. So I picked up the book. And then I remember I had that book team by left it. Where did I leave? Pook was the last time. Underneath had that book. I was God's house. Did I leave out thinking opened the book and on the facts of the earth? I put my initials l hates book Israel. And I to every and that when my initials in the book. At this. The next two. Good comedy man in. If we adopted. Post-shave my family. Not the cat. He comes out 'cause I'm creaming. I'm like, your you double my book in your have we've had sex before. And. For you knew. Role play thing where we pretended straight into. To go. Let's say back on the fuck him again. Say on its face because I'm a feminist. And been about me, John. I mean, oh my goodness. I will double fuck you to I could. But that traumatize me, and it's it's a minute club. I feel so phone because I know how I would approach I'm very fluid. Assigned to keep your me. All my boyfriend in the puck. I what I what. And they call me. The win a guy like me interested with so I get all the time. And my name is London. That's why real name my parents, not create if. With child lines about my name and like Britain down the best free. And I will tell you that ChildLine number three in third. We have London was last name England. Shit basic. What do you wanna make the sexual one? I want to spend one night in London. I mean to it. John enough to. My favorite one London. Chef with Bush. Good. Women. Joining me for is the wonderful came up. The exceptional magnificent. Hello. Hello. Hello, succoured Safak. If you don't know is the executive director and co founder of level up a community for feminists to want to work together to end sexism. And if you. Joins level out from some of which she was global communications director. She has got an incredible seavy. And she is a trustee of the end violence against women coalition. Keenum off. Made up skirting a sexual offence in England Wales. Breakfast of someone taking a photo inside someone else's clothes with the consent. It was after puzzle experience which gave her a political drive and her book be the change will be published in some twenty nineteen. She just won a quality champion of the year at the star. That's remarkable women wall. Came up. Phenomenal comedian under regular here at the guilty feminist. Cool stuff for the community. I know it's intimidating. Find these people what if? Look you choose love teasha. We'll people want for exactly and the blazing and blaze today. If you listening at home. Kimber is wearing a blazer day. She's wearing the pink blazer just putting it all out there got outfits change into my friend. Thank you. So Carris alot Gina. Hello. Karras coast will tell us what level up doing at the moment on we doing. Well, somebody might be involved in all Facebook campaign, and he won. So we're currently. Currently talking Facebook for not doing enough to listen to women spending too much time listening to Al them's enough time listening to women who being harassed on the platform. So we've just published research found fifty seven percent of young women and one in three of all women foods he percent of women of color in the happened harassed on Facebook. So that stool king gross onto peixe persistent ex-boyfriends one of our members, Victoria, we took to meet Facebook this month, how the police report and domestic violence charity caseworker on Facebook, still wouldn't stop creepy ex-boyfriend from harassing. That's one of the things I'm gonna put it out there that I think forty percents sounds low. Because I don't know any women who haven't had some kind of aggressive message. I mean, perhaps there are some. I would think it's high the forty percent. Yeah. I think one of the things we really specific about the behavior. But we know that this is the tip of the iceberg. I think I'm sure won't say. Yeah. And using work like harassment, just like using like a piece or assault feels quite loaded. And I mean, I know that often it's how to admit you don't want to see yourself as victim. And one of the things we find communities until you can identifies victim. It's all twice a survivor. So I think it's worth saying that these people willing to say that being harassed. Yeah. We know that probably low- higher. And I think also somebody says to you even survey have you been harassed by an ex you might think I don't want my car to nose out or I'm I'm kind of into Nile about that. Or he loves me. Really? He's just got problems that kind of thing. So you might not wanna put that down on. Yeah. I think we've all had a friend who's described the situation been like, oh, but you know, he's he's having a tough time. He stressed at work. He has mental health problems. And you're like, oh, he's a dick say. Say say. I'm always on family. True that flags much is your to see when you already gone past. I feel like stuff is so complicated. And it's really great that you're doing this work. Like, thank you, man. The internet is of members we have fifty you can join up WWW we to we have fifty thousand members amazing feminist agendas from across the year. Anyone can join follow us on Instagram. Sign up by Email, and we win come pain. So to connect to the Facebook issue with just about I just checked with my colleague if we can announce this, but I'm going to do anyway. Changing the rules on how domestic violence deaths reported. So the media regulate to adopt new guidelines. I don't know if any of you read the newspapers, but to women in the UK killed every week by car and foam Aparna. So we lose two women every week the moment those crimes merges reported as crimes of passion. Partly just because of lazy court reporting. So you got to hey, the guy who killed his potent as story, but you actually get to the women's stories are all come painting. The women is about introducing guidelines on how John this report on women who killed so no more amazing helping. Check out the website. If I want to say is a campaign that's been spearheaded by our mazing stuff. Also, it's been spearheaded by male survivors of domestic violence, so Luke Reinhard to amazing brothers and on this much feminist me, very hard coal. These mum was killed by that dad, and they had to read headlines about what? Daddy was. Yes. That's a campaign that we've just one. So join us we win campaigns. Speaking of people wouldn't come pains, Gina Molsem. Hey now lost time you came on the show probably around a year ago, and you came on to talk about your ups skirt campaign. But at that point, you didn't know how long it was going to excited and eat. No have I know can you tell us the conclusion to this exciting. A love game say this out loud. It makes it real. Yes. That was year ago. I guess, and you kind of I people that gave it like a real platform and really activated young women to really get behind it and two weeks ago passed the lowest now going to be a sexual thing. Become official low. When when is it has been made officials? So the Queen signed the Queen has them took her while she couldn't find a pen. She couldn't fight about one of the ladies ministry of Justice sets a month take well because it's kind of when she finds a pad, which I believe is. I works. Yeah. Sorry, really say more informational this. So that we had to sign at all you went to the room when much stay Wolfson, go ahead. But they said, oh, she's often forgetful with pens. Yeah. Think it's just kind of two when she does it. When she finds the time and finds a pen. Maybe there's like Easter egg style thing going on in her home, and they're just pins around. Yeah. Whenever she finds wig change being made. Royal game. Yes, sounds great. Don't like what. Because I watched a lot of the chrome. So I really do. Monarch is Emma. Right. Trump. Hey. Pointing any fingers. So the Queen had fun pin and she did find a pet well on her majesty and she selling it. So is it today legal to do this so two weeks ago, she signed, and it's from the moment she now in acted into law as an act, and we have voice in English. Welsh lower is an actor will go all the way through conceptual for the next two months and within around two months. It will be you can't be usable and police we'll be trying to deal with it properly. And hopefully, what happened to me what happening to other people again. So the police now get training because a news piece of legislation. So they have to know what that is. Exactly. Interesting. Until the told me that's been the last two years of my life is seventy nine until someone tells me out. But yeah, yes, the doing all the training. Now, I've been trying to deal with police and been very sort site. Probably too involved actually, China help them onto sound and. Yeah, now, it's done. So. Wow. Really really exciting. Congratulations. I'm really sorry about your book be the change because you'll running from the perspective of somebody who was somebody. Who felt they replete cicle person who was going to go out and change just Latian. And you just did it from scratch. Exactly, I have no kind of low about ground. Nope. Let's just scrape on school, etc. By this teeth anyway. And I think that's the whole point of what I've done is the little change is incredibly important, but also just realizing that like any background working class any person can actually change. If you get the pool you do the right things, and you don't stop. So the book is kind of going through everything. I did I do go out change the little when I started like that's how I started. The company was good. But nothing came up his -ly. Isley? So I had to go. We gets lawyer, and I was. If it gets a lawyer, but most people would think afford lawyer, actually Latian. Yes, that's what I thought. I you see movies, and it's very expensive to I did research and found out that you can get those poor pro Bono. So if you have public interested the case, then low firms will tight your case on for free. Yeah. I met Ryan my lawyer who is now one of my closest friends and he'd Sud on for free. So is all these things that nobody tells you and you have to work out by doing it. And that's the book is just full of literally I did all of it just so someone else can do it too was part of you. I'm too young twenty. I'm not from their world. I'm not someone who sweeps into the house of Commons. Big intimidating rooms. Don't have a lawyer. I'm not going to get past buyers in your head and just keep going one step at a time. We'll how would I get over those big time every sage if that is kind of you know, all consuming entire fine. I mean, even when you walk into the house upon they have a massive Colorado after walk through and every inch of taking up by photos and paintings. Of just like seventy minutes aids. So media you just done. You know, it's really just go. If you pictures of women in pink. She's you'll wear. Yes. That's representation. But the thing is now you become the representation for lots of people who may feel. I'm not a seventy year old white on the safety, a, gene. Yeah. I mean hypoc do I on the on the also young white woman? So I'm kind of a second down from the people who feel comfortable in those. So I can't imagine what it would be like to go in like name. Call is good friend of mine, his f- GM campaign. And she said today, she refugee woman, I will speak, and I got this idea that people in power structures. Look at me and go, okay. We'll help her done. I'm going to have to help everyone. This woman can come in and try to help everyone. And that's kind of this stuff dean with moment. So hopefully, go someone helping people realize that they can go in for change because you just didn't stop just force it. That's why it's called for. Yeah. Do you get that feeding cowers that? I think would if we help we're gonna have to help everyone. Oh experience. Many people trying to help me. Books full of berry strident men vs on how we can run from this campaign. No, well, I mean, I think I definitely I worked in parliament for year. What's your life? I felt like almost like I was coming out in a rationalize that and it's just the wood panels, and this kind of Harry vibes, but not slither. Cool. And I grew up in Brixton and you'll from south loans. I grew up in social housing. I didn't grow up in the world like that like constantly out place. And I think the thing that I've learned to do is rely on sisterhood. So things go to and other women have been really great. And giving me also just no waiting permission of people to give you help. Just being like, I'm here. You feel uncomfortable about it. I feel slightly uncomfortable about it. But here we go. Outside much say, I get the feeding from euchema that Paul because you're from America. You don't have a great read on what stuff is no like. In a good way in a good way up because I felt like when I first came here, you not quite sure which you allowed through. So you just by up to Dole's and actually helps because you kind of see inclusion the Moyano about the places where you allow the doors. I'm not going to get a love it. I really don't know. What's happening? I don't know. Big deal was a little deal guilty feminist who is a barbeque kin. Just get to show up show out. Yeah. The must be so like even imagine the kind of it takes to have been a part of the system part of this government your entire life. And then to go up against it with bad ass is. I think we ought to know what next to you. Because you've done this. Now, this is become so much a huge part of your life. You've taken of your life. What are you going to do next after the but comes out, I'm very hard? I've just finished. This goes now. That's when would love it. But I am starting second company, which is education. So I'm pondering big music Bruns to make festivals and venues safe people on then I really want to do something about because the amount of perceived two years is just on believable again, white woman. So I really wanted to do comparing with social platforms them, take more accountability, more responsibility. And you know, it's a microcosm of society. You just put it on the victim to report. It's up tools to come show them what the problem is being active. So we're going to compete on that as well. Great. We're going to do it seems like Harris you have similar mission. Now with trolling and harassment that kind of thing. So that could be something you could team already been talking about sage of wind about gaming whiskey. Ming great just just just tonight. This is the my. I just want to say also as employees we will also talking about how difficult it is to trust. A really good looking men. Those kind of really appreciate the space because you can tackle near the big heart issues and the big hard. So how could we help Karras and Gina because just give us an here. If you feel like online abuse trolling is a concern for you as a woman. Give us if something puzzling. If it's something would like to address as a community of feminists. Okay. So we need to know how we can help. What is it that we could do guilty gonna we love to help? We wanna get involved. What can we do? Okay. First. And then we'll launch joint thing next. So we've petitional website WWW we signed the petition. But also, we're gonna go meet Facebook we were in the newspapers recently. So I think they're going to take the meeting. We're looking for people to come to the meetings and shed stories, I think it's also there's a work of just being on this with yourself about this stuff and not feeling shamed. Is definitely something that I've had to do the rest of the team today, but signed the petition is the first step and donate. If you can. Yes, I think we have a big thing online life where we on active by Sunday enough. So you might only report comment if it's to you. I think we should be all calling out stuff continually everyday when we see if we kinda like it's two lakes to be more of a not device onto and also just personally even how to help me. But just go out. Just giants go and shout people go and do that because he can do. Okay. Great. Just tell us a little bit about what we expect to read in your book when we definitely by it. I wonder what I can say I haven't actually talked about this. So don't feel. This to us. And if you'll publish say, no, always cut it out of the these guys won't tell anyone. Okay. Good. Yeah. I feel comforted by that. Okay. So there is everything from how to press release how to become invaluable to politicians. It's every novel. So it can be into school. You want to the community? I took about how social media campaign, which I'm telling all time, how is your privilege. Visit them how to handle high pressure meetings, sailors that full of practical advice and also Michelle of us. So it's from the beginning of a campaign to the end also the general themes that get you into to get you confidence up to start as well. Great. And so it's useful for anyone even if you don't have time to pops change a major confidence or energy any of those things if you've got two jobs and twelve children all of those things it's still going to be a useful. Because he just gives you motivation to be the she won't see in the world in some ways. It's even down to conceal spending. How many money every it's bottom off? It's great. Okay. And do you need money we need money. Okay. Level of where we donate. To level up. You can donate on the website. There's a button and the right Hon. Kona one third crowd funded right now is being paid because nine people up direct debit anything. You can helps into new office, thanks to people's habits. So this is carissa sfu time job. She's trying to make the world a better place for all of us. So if you had like, a pound a month or something like that that you could just eight to level up that you wouldn't notice give full pounds less to Starbucks and level up because. Do not let him. Gino, you'll book will be on preorder yet. Yes. Preloaded now, and you can get it June. The great so pre-order it for more Stearns or some of the independent bookshop if possible, and I'm if you're really lazy. But do remember they don't pay the tax when you do that yourself doing this for my own reasons, but then you have to if you pre ordered Obama's and you have to level two. All right. I feel like we are inspired to change the world from these two remarkable women. Congratulations so much on the style of ward and Karras I will be using all my influences status to make sure you get one next year. It's corrupt. I have no power whatsoever. But a little bit of influence, and I'll be using all of. All right. Thank you so much cowardice. Thank you so much Gina. Thank you so much came everybody cares. Incredible singer who is also the host of founder of the coca club, which she describes as a platform to showcase and celebrate performance of color Pillai's, put your hands together give big Kilty feminist International Women's Day. Welcome to the wonderful Sadie. Scott. Two. He just got. Hello Debra just wanted to say thank you to everyone who came on the people's March. It was amazing tomorrow with you. I'm thank you, everyone who came to the say, my name premia, so exciting to see we'll there now if you missed out we missed you. But they will be more screenings of the film each one including alive Cuna with me. So tonight, the first of April in Camden town, could you get there? Eight PM at the Odeon on the second of April. That's tuesday. I'll be Norwich with the film at the Odeon and on the seventh of appropriate the Birmingham Odeon on the sixteenth of April, the Oxford odium for more details and to go to guilty feminist dot com slash say. My name all one word. It would be absolutely amazing. See you that come up afterwards. And let's have a selfie or consign your book or your dog or your arm. What if you like and this one's not I'm Sal yet? But say. Save the date twenty eight pro in your diary now because we're doing another Galler screening at the Odeon less square knocks. It's going to be another incredible night with red carpet where you can have your photo taken. And some of the stars of the film talking about how he got it made afterwards the guilty feminist is going on tour in may now these shows won't be recorded for the podcast. So you'll have to be there. If you want to experience, it different shows will have different guests, and you can see the full list by going to guilty, feminist dot com. Hairs, a quick look at the lineups for the first week on the first of may in Halifax, I'll be joined on stage by Cindy, Alison, spittle and KEMA Bob with music from just Robinson off of the tally on the second of may in Birmingham. I'll be joined by Jenny Claire and so few juca with music from me for Queen and more comedians to be confirmed on the third of may in. How all be joined by Felicity ward. Cindy, Alison, Spital amuse. Again will be me for Queen on the full of mail being new causal without same lineup of comedians, Felicity ward, Cindy, Allison special, but this time just Robinson. We'll be on music on the fifth of Melby and sold at the Lowry with Cindy, Felicity board, Katie mall, grew and music from just Robinson some then is starting to sell out now. So please don't delay. If you want to take it all the dates and times, art guilty feminist dot com. These will be really into shows we're going to take the roof off it will be like being feminists church. Don't miss it. I'm speaking feminists church the play Amelia about Elizabeth feminist legend Amelia Bassano is still running at the voters theatre in London's West End. This is the most amazing production of the most amazing story. It's Larry's all the way through the final speech will rip you'll feminist hot out and as a special mothers and babies matinee on the twenty fourth of April. Let's give it some support and help it get a longer run. A national tour. Lastly, we still desperately volunteers and donations for help refugees in Calais and Dunkirk, please give whatever you can afford. And if you can spend some time most crucially, please consider going out as short mid or long term, volunteer checkout help refugees dog now, but the podcast. Please put your hands together and make extrordinary wonderful. We're her for the one. National Women's Day. What a great time. Oh, oh, love being celebrated. And you know, what the world is. Right. We only need one day. So deserve make the most of. Omega. I feel like we're like the best place to be on a WD, babe. Happy every day to you and happy belated to all of homeys at home. Yeah. Yeah. A moment of silence for them. Yeah. Yeah. Happy belated hell. Fucking cool. Is this like leave us to take a day that meant to like, celebrate empowered? Inspire women and use it to hold the most dope exclusive event of all. How do you read the guardian? You celebrate with. Coming coming for ya amid here. Mothers Kim above if you have met me than how from Texas, which is gross. You're. Is so gross. We're really good couple things bigotry racism beyond say. That's what we do. Those exploits. A head to kick of a bit of Schwammberger on International Women's Day by being controversial. But have to do it. I'm just going to deal with the consequences. Okay. I just hope that you guys himmy out because I know the subject is really close to your British hearts. Why the fuck does anyone care? What Lutheran has to say? Who made him in authority. Why is he in charge? Why don't you do have me? That's right. I don't care. I'll say I'll say the tough stuff. Was man's planning. What do we let him do? This just go into people's lives and ruin their since of selves, his super power is using like British politeness and witticisms to trick American people into omit in their dumb. It's not okay. I know I just don't ever want to meet him. Like like Kemah? Would you say the love comedy yet? Lewis love it. So happy to be doing it gonna give him all. That's interesting. Would you say that this low attendance is normal at this point in your career? I think if you give the audience a chance they'll built. Cuma? Would you say that a deep-seated since of inadequacy as lead you to expose yourself to strangers in this way Lewis? Alone. Just trying to do. Molest him is Bob, which is not comedy name is family names, real one. It's a whole gaggle above this bench. Is of we got twins Brandon. And Bradley sibling group were came a Colin and Kamala where like the KKK is worse. Nightmares? The control the less. Name bug is quite interesting because it's like the whitest first name is Mel. Oh, this is very unsettling. Only a few ways it could happen. But were you goes, I'm still, you know, webby upset of slavery. The trauma is only DNA is. It's not a big deal fill some tension in the room. I'm a swim in that. Does it have a dry backstage like to save some of this tension for the morning? Amazing can hear from the people of color in the room. Oh, man. There's some of us in here. Love you ac-. Glad that you were here and somehow not enough of this to absorb all of the awkwardness that was. By the word. Slavery doesn't every time. It's so good. I'm glad that people of color here. When I perform in of all audience, just it's really confusing. Just like is this an auction? It's wild times. I don't know. It's hard to tell to nineteen eighteen nineteen. Don't know. So the last time Bob is like super cool, though, you guys not tripping on it because I like to soon that master Bob was like chill guy. You know, like I like to shoot them. The who'd be the of dude, they'll be Galleria. Around his spits because he's into back. Oh, he's in the south. This is a real guy. Everybody gathered around now use think you've been working hard. Will guess what? I was like. Oh shit was about to go down. He's like I agree have the afternoon. Also, by the way, don't you did call me master rub it's master bomb. That's but this. Father. Semi like chemo. Cool clever. Funny enough to be making Joan slavery to whichever apply. It's a lot more hilarious than the truth. Okay. I don't know if you have a color wheel or like, how you like to see the world what you think about this hair color. I didn't as LGBT. Twitter passive. Having a great time in the world. I did a pan sexual which Miriam Webster the know it all she'll tell you. That means I opened to date anyone regardless of their gender their sexual orientation the presentation, if yes me I'll tell you that I did everyone SIS gendered straight white men. It's out of distaste to set of distrust. I don't want to be microbe grist sleep have the energy for it. And some of you guys are like cuma so much judgment. Have you even? Try to ginger firm Jonah. Mostly to see what male privilege was sexually transferable. I'll tell you Tipper rarely. Temp temporarily. So didn't is sure I did dentist bisexual, very similar. Miriam. Not expert on the book. I just live in the pages. And what's interesting about being actual, I feel like no one really wants to take by folks Yeary Asli. There's a lot of erasure of an it comes to be in a by person like people don't really see legit outside of the LGBT community. But I think sometimes the hate the hate can be even worse from within LGBTQ J elemental community. Sometimes within the community. People have the nerve to look down on you. Even while you're going down. This kind of like this. Thing is so exhausting Jesus as I've told you not strictly dick -ly. But at the moment, I do famous yet quite keen for the Pene. It's just a weird place to be and I think back to my lust fella encounter. You know, she's in the back of my memory like dream. It was such a interesting hot moment was with a Frenchman. Ooh. Yeah. I got to feel myself. Exotic says someone it was amazing. Top in in a way. It was like, oh, this is the so and he didn't speak English which I just like. Ooh. English privilege to. Amazing. What was crazy is? He kept using the same small group of words to describe everything. So juiced about it. Do me and wet. And he was like, oh this night is so special looking into your eyes is so special. Never learn another word. Special works for me. And what was so wild with as we were in the throes of passion. Even with limited vocabulary manage to say, can I? May I? Of which just is really a testament to the facts that English-speaking dudes must just be lazy. It's not that hard to do is. And you can put jam on it. May that recently Metaxis which was like I haven't been home in so long so long. I forgot that they don't get along with my mom. It was nice to be so nice to be reminded. There's a lot of love and relationship. There's a lot of just not a lot of liking. Okay. It's fun. I'm we're we were having dinner in their seat cave. And we're so close and jokey wins. She got the Bill and it was quite expensive. She told me I haven't had treat anyone like this in a long time. I feel like I'm on a date or something I were so close, and we're so jokey that I was able to say to her. I don't care how expensive it is. I'm not going folk you. And it's just like nice to be able to say that too. Really nice. So we're so close. But while I was home was always case about everything because they used to be like super hetero normal like things I could do with an eye shadow palette and appear spinach. Killing the game. And she misses her. She misses that person with the lung heaven the long dress and though. I'm just not that guy anymore. Can't do with it. Oh, she's always like, where's your makeup KEMA where your earrings her favorite? Where's your brow? I keep trying to tell them doing a science experiment about gravity. I like to be a braille creature just liked to do things so good probably trying to sweeten hips right now. I'm not offended, not offended. It's not a big deal. But my mom is really not cool. But luckily when we were hanging out. Meth favorite. How dare I I'm doing. I'm I'm digging homestead Deepa math favorite woman. Oh memos. Get listen. This is why women manana was she had my back manana is so sweet. And so lovely that. Once we out having dinner together, and she ordered a cherry coke and ordered a cherry coke. And when I looked that'd be good. You know what I mean? I looked at issues just staring at me with like Tuesday. And I was like manner you, okay? She was like, okay. More than okay, I'm great. Dave. Me. And my granddaughter having a night out on the town, drinking, Sherry cokes like the most adorable women. So my mom is like getting them at case. And being like, hey, put on a bra and then to my rescue. She said, hey, you let her enjoy those cute little nipples. Well, she has only going to get bigger. She's also super religious woman, which you mad respect matter. Specht believe what you want. She moved to a new church, which is like such a big deal such a big deal. And I was like do you love your new church it, and she was like, yes, I do love. It the spirit is really present in the build. And then that passed the past shoe his know how to lift the Lord's name on her and that band that band. They play that so good. They played music. So good and KEMA. Let me tell you. There's a saxophonists in that ban. A sex phone in the band KEMA. And I'll tell you plays that thing so good and Mickey Mona cream, you jeans. Oh, man. And it is because of women like her that I'm able to talk to you about creaming my jeans today. Oppose the removing of the only woman from British Frank notes leading to the Bank of England swift announcements that the image of Jane Austen would appear on the ten bound by twenty seventeen. Sculpture in parliament square. The statue of medicine force. That was unveiled for twenty eight. She has a book which was released yesterday. Invisible. Women data by to the world designed for men. It explains dangerous consequence of a world where for women the drugs that don't work and the calls don't fit put your hands together and make extrordinary guilty. Feminist welcoming noise, this wonderful Caroline, creative. If necessary. Puppyhood? Hoppy hood dog. Puffy? Oh that she just really loves a crowd and to be adored. So I think it's I relent. I'm from its, but I'm mis gendered Caroline creative for as dog backstage. Hold her. He pulled puppy shoes to slip the tone. My God the judgment, but it's actually very interesting because most people she do cool her he and in fact, one of the studies I found in the book is that most sit of animals mice stuffed animals, get referred to as male. And this one study where they looked at how much it would take to get people to refer to a stuffed animal loses. She and even referring to the stuff on Eliza. She beforehand didn't work they have to make it paying and spot Cleo and refer to it as she and give it a female name. And then finally, even then no people do it. Yeah. That's just so ingrained. So basically what I'm saying starting field out about? No, no, I think it's I knew Holly puppy. Sorry. The thing is going to instill. No, I'm so sorry. Two. On you Papi was a go. It was a genuine step of the tongue. She is so gorgeous. He's just as moist by the. She loves the so coward on. You've done amazing things for visibility for women. Guys, come out you'll bring. Very sweet dog. This is my life this book it visible women. I'm so excited about and I haven't read it all yet. But I've read some of it, and I've sort of skimmed through with such excitement and being riveted by certain parts. It's something you could read cover to cover. But then go back and always dip in and out of could you tell us a little bit about it. This is about exposing bias this world is designed all connected for men. So for example, medical research drugs that kind of thing could you tell us a little bit about how those tend to be biased towards man, basically, the vast majority of medical knowledge that we have is based on the mail buddy, female, humans female, animals and female cells rule excluded from drug trials and have been for very long. So the vast majority of drugs have been tested in women. And as a result women are much more have either struck reaction was many women have a cough tonight. Yeah. Yeah. No like was sort of sightsee theatrically proving system. Yeah. I mean, it is to stomach, and I mean, there are various reasons for that one of the main excuses that you got is just women to whom I know and so two we excuse. But that doesn't really work for cells cell doesn't have a period, but tesa. But even in cell studies ninety percent based on male cells. And I came across this study that just made me so angry because of how suggest it was about what we could have been missing out on. So they exposed male and female cells to eastern to see how they would react to fight off virus on the male cell was not able to use eastern was taken over by the virus the female sell. Yes eastern of the virus. Now, if with starting most of medical trials male, sells, you know, you have to think how many medications for women. Have we missed out on because they just didn't work on the male cells. And when you in with the fact that one of the number one adverse drug reactions that women get their minds. They said we've been have formal episode reactions than men one of the number one ones just off nausea is that the drug just didn't work you put those things together on. I just got furious. You would tell me about Vallat grow. So this to great stories about flat. Gra the? I'm sure the more. One. I did woke into that. Anyone story about biogra- getting Ludd by great story about black. Or maybe that's now. Let's let's not do that. I'll tell you backstage the wave Acker was discovered for those of an old male trial where they were actually trying to find new hot drug and just say that, you know, women would be more likely to die in the US and the following a heart attack since one thousand nine hundred and it's the number one killer of women, so you should be angry that this drug trial was done mainly men and still most drug trials done menu men. But anyway, so they did this drug trial, and it didn't really work hawk medication, but they know this happy side effect. And so the rest of history by grow went out, and they go to pace into it. And that was great in twenty thirteen a medical researcher looked into whether or not Varcoe would work the period pain and us, I'm sure a lot of people in this audience know, there aren't that many great medications period. Pain if near doesn't what fueled parsimony doesn't work for you screwed. There's nothing. Anyway. So he looked into this. It was initially, and it was a small scale study, and they found that compared to placebo this drug that is biogra- offered four hours of pain relief, title payment, nice side effects. Unfortunately, they ran out funding. So they weren't able to prove the hypothesis. So they applied for more funding, and they were checked it on the basis that this isn't a public health Berty. So hold on a minute. Sure. What is sick burn? Gender. So a wreck shin 's public public health public health priority. Sys- men, but when it comes to women period pain, subtly we've run out of fucking money. There are five times as many drug trials on rectal dysfunction as their own PMS. Of course, they're all of closer we stopped by that. Who runs the world's well Harley? Can you tell us about snow clearing? I think this is a really good example of why you should be collecting sex or sacrifice. It's like if you don't care that women are dying probably that's not hope fee, but you might cat that that you can save some money, which is what they discovered in Cusco you're in Sweden Sweden because you know, better than everyone. Doing gender audit. Again, Sweden bull that policies and someone apart in the meeting this joke, well, at least the gender people get involved in the snow clearing lull. Unfortunately for them. Of course, the people like how interesting let us look at the snow, caring speeco, and they realized that the order in which they were clearing. The roads was benefiting typical male female travel patterns, so men who like to do twice daily commute on the more likely to drive so much more simple way of traveling, and they tend to travel on the main roads women because of paid Cav responsibilities and also because they have less money tend to be more likely to use public transports. And do you think trip chaining? So that's you drop the kids off at school before you go to work pick the groceries up on the way home, maybe take an elderly relative to the doctor, so women's Trebilcock things more complicated. So they were clearing the major roads first and then clearing the pay. Moments and the local boards and say, well, let's just switch it up because you know, Costa any more money, and they figured it is easier to drive coffee three inches of snow done to push buggy awoke. And so they did that what they didn't expect to find our need to have to spend anymore. They actually saved money because what they discovered was that they were fall. You people being admitted into an e full falling over and hurting themselves in my condition. And it turns out that the cost that they saved of not having to patch up. All these women who are falling over in icy conditions. And I think it was like seventy percent of people and women having much worse injuries as well. With many many times over the winter road maintenance cost I think that's a great example of collecting sex aggregate data they'd been collecting who is being admitted to us. They might have why so many women fooling themselves. Maybe we should look into the snow caring thing, gender equality. Does know Ernie make life better for women to save money? So if you care about women dying may be care about saving money, just to I. I was I like to make those arguments because I want to appeal to the people in power keeping empower often to care about the same things we care about why they do it kid that they do it. I mean of tech tech is now off an architect ingwer wold. And then we're having to respond to it as much as it's being designed for us, especially as women, can you tell us more about what you talk about in the book. So the concern ready with the tech world is the tech world is so male dominated and all the evidence. We have shows that women are just less likely to forget that women exist, an a more like gender analysis that it's not just about forgetting exist. It's also, you know, knowing what women's needs a lot of this is not men being malicious. It's just they have different typical travel pats, for example, with called sky good, the men who design the smoke bearing schedule. Went doing it in the hope that would fall over and end up in hospital. They genuinely this is how everyone travels this is the best way to do some things. We don't know when my king. Exactly. And so I think in other really good example, this one from the tech world is the very famous screw up with apple when they introduced what they called a comprehensive health trucking out while you track. Copper take and mullet denim. I don't know what that is. But you know. But you couldn't track your period, it's not really comprehensive. If like fifty percent of the world have this thing like to track, and you can't truck it that's not necessarily life threatening. But it sort of is indicative of a mindset, and the problem is when you have a very male dominated workforce who are creating these things going to have power over us. And this is in the context of algorithms and the concern about algorithms is that they are becoming increasingly involved in our lives increasingly making decisions on all the Hof. But because they're being trained on incredibly male by status sets they making decisions that worse and gender equality and the actual concern as well as studies that have been done on this show that the machine learning because of the way the machines learn to make it more mold the way, they think it is. It actually makes it worse. And so you've got things like making decisions in job. Hiring scanning CV's, they are starting to be introduced into the medical world. And that is terrifying. Because we already have this huge problem of mail by Stater in medicine human doctors about enough. But if you're going to have algorithms and the other she with algorithms often protected as trade secrets, so we can't even look them to see whether the code is our accounting for the fact that that data is hype ac- male biased. But based on what we can see it certainly doesn't seem as they all. And again, this is partly because it's such a male dominated industry and the awareness. Just isn't that this is happening. So sort of going blind into this, potentially terrifying. Destroy in world, which is one of the reasons I wrote the book because I really want us to take stock and stop and think about what we're doing and try to. Don't try to do it. I'm just saying collect data women. It's no, it's it's. I'm reading about crowd funding to send this to all the MP's, including sexist ones stadium. Actress. It's a crowd one to own gofundme. If you do go on me invisible. Women it'll come up. Yeah. The idea is that they are going to send a copies every MP including cub, Alexa, which will have information based on that constituency. Really looking forward to the left of they send Davies and Christopher. Favorite? Yeah. So if people wanna share that that was you can buy copy in the foil. I'm a little run out tonight because they won't be one for everybody to more. You can get your bookstore. You can get aboard Stearns again, if you get it and ascend you have to offset that by public something into the crowd Funda, but get a copy and them with all this information for dinner parties way, you need it. Most. It's called invisible. Women. It's by count on credit Perez. You'll drink great. What Caroline a big round of applause for Carolina. I'll show have you had a good one. Because I'm too close. It's women's type wait for sold. Please welcome back to the sage safety. Evening everybody. I was here to not talk. But I just think representation is really important. So if anyone in audience who's attracted to me in your man, it's not gonna happen as I'm trying to say, basic. Happy we've been to everybody every time women. That is such a privilege to be here. You're gonna get it. Sort of. Once you. Thank you. Baxley exactly the big kitten enegy guy you need red slash women's league. Clint energy say. Kidding hit him. Yeah. Because I have to. I've tickets at every time I see them just like ours. Running run the house and climb. I always think those big Dicks should come. And take a look at what energy really looks like. Yeah. Yeah. I wonder big Dicks to come round my house. Yeah. And then talk about energy same takes too. Six to no. Phillies. Great moment to do it. Would you be opposed? My reality TV show the real cap. Moms of north London. Just say Mexico. Like health lifestyle. I see what you're going full. I see we think for.

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153. Being Too Much with Cal Wilson and Lizzie Marvelly

The Guilty Feminist

00:0-1 sec | 1 year ago

153. Being Too Much with Cal Wilson and Lizzie Marvelly

"I'm a feminist bought before you get to listen to the podcast this week. I just have to tell you about the most exciting thing. We are playing the Royal Albert Hall like the actual Royal, our whole five thousand seats on the seventh of July Sunday afternoon at three pm will be finished at five thirty pm in that. So people can get back to wherever they've come from and be in bed by ten because we know our audience. Now I've got some details. I'm excited to share. We're going to open with cell block Tango. I'm a feminist. But it is my desire to get together with my best guilty feminist buddies and saying he had it coming. We'll be changing the words don't worry. It'll be updated. That's with Kyrie Richard McLean. And Jade Adams, both incredible comedians from the show, ABC Kel, and we are going to have some incredible guilty feminist regulars doing that. And other parts of the show. Susan McComb will be there. Cindy v will be there, just foster Q will be there Felicity ward will be there spittle will be there. That's not all they'll be more. We've also got some incredible. Actors too. I can tell you about now a Hayley Atwell from agent Carter who's currently in the West End in rozema home is absolutely incredible. And 'Adua Ando, who you may know from doctor who, but also did the Richard the second, she was on the podcast, not very long ago. Absolutely incredible. Actors multiple confirmed. We're doing some really beautiful theatrical things as well as all of our amazing normal comedy. And I have a very exciting announcement. We've got a big international comedian, I'm not allowed to say who it is. But we are flying her, especially when I announced that I will. But I'm going to say get tickets now they'll be much more on the night. But the last thing I can currently announce if you didn't get to see Amelia, the amazing play about Amelie Alanya the renaissance poet. You will. I'm sure of heard the hype it was an absolutely extraordinary show. Now, the last speech delivered by Clare Perkins just absolutely brought the house down every. It just maybe not crying. And Claire is coming to deliver this speech at the Royal Albert Hall, it's going to be so massive is not one to be missed if you haven't seen the show you're going to get to see the crucial part of it that lifted us all up to the heavens and back. We're also announcing a new initiative for social change. It's something everyone can get involved in it, something that we are doing with lots of other exciting communities like the guilty. Feminists will all go to start holding hands and standing up to the far right to these outbreaks of homophobia that are so frightening standing for human rights and four compassion. We're now seeing the project at the alcohol so be there if at all possible at its birth now, they've allowed an Amnesty International ticket link to carry on in honor of secret policeman up. I think it's ending in the next twenty four hours. So if you go to our website or pinned tweet on Twitter, you'll be able to see this. Special offer for the Royal Albert Hall in honor of the secret policeman. If you put in the code guilt whole, you'll be able to get ten pounds off the ticket price just for today and tomorrow. But if you do that, could you, please donate, at least some of that ten quid to amnesty, all go and do something for Amnesty International, click on one of the links, right to a government, do something human rights in exchange for that ten pound discount off. We so excited to celebrate with as many as possible of you on the seventh of July at the Royal Albert Hall, few people, I've met have said that they thought the tickets were sold out absolutely not. You can still get tickets, but they will send out so get in. Now, we cannot wait to celebrate with you. And I'm so excited about Amelia all my God. It's so incredible. Let's go, there together. Hold hands start off a new initiative and see some of the best comedians actors in the world. It's going to be immense. And now the punk cost. I'm a feminist bought today. I'm bought to new pair of reading glasses and I was with my birth mother in the Shaw, and I said these ones with the big frames a good for when I'm on stage, and she said, yes, they could if you need to look like you know, things and I said, exactly. Do things in these cases. Correct. On the feminist. But if new Zealand Prime Minister Justin to Ogden asked me to be history at home wife on heaven apron on before she got two, gene. Say that when she's taught to being prime minister he's about seventy five. That it just passes naturally onto nave because we've turned into like a metro the new monarchy. Kind of type of the countries as well. And she just do it when they between prime ministers in Australia and dislike nip in there. That's Mullarkey over. We knew into nyc feminism. I don't see a point David. I, I but backstage, when we're coming up the stairs, I had to quickly check the name of descendant autumn because I keep always confusing. Her name with. Jamila djamil. Always do it. He activist. Actress from the good place. Author number and delightful, but I keep calls coming up to a jump I go to. Easily confused because New Zealand's a good place as well. So you like. Museveni's basically, the heaven of everywhere as places go at the moment in the world. It is. Everybody's number one nuclear bunko. Feminist. But after exit coined the phrase volume. Excuse me. Ten minutes episode I was on I made it t shit with boy are written on it. I didn't wear it's because it wasn't flattering. I'm a feminist bonds when the new constitution for the chrome television show was announced do you guys watch the Brown? Drama about the Roe v eight when the new custody was announced my friend, Richard sauntering tweeted, I'm not gonna like him Gillian Anderson as Margaret Thatcher is going to be an uphill one. Doc. Like a hope and. Same same. Not such a brilliant, turn of phrase, just imagine Richard all really essentially. Boy, that's going to be enough to lay. On the feminist. But after exit the fries boy of the mask, if you came in episode, I was made to teach it with that written on it to do that. I went to a craft shop to buy on, on littering because I was too embarrassed to go to a shirt printers, and ask them to print that full me. And also, we went to the character of the craft show jumbled up the listens. So that the elderly lady behind the counter would realize that's what I wanted to write. So I'm not writing. Boy, I won't Llosa. I really like. Big fan of buck. Jamaican country singer. Sounds like Yoda accepts. Yeah. He won't. He won't. Right way to characterize one stand, isn't it? Boyfriend material young phone. From the. Never. His. Took about. This is the guilty feminists, the podcast cost him which we explore goes is twenty th century feminist in the poker season insecurities, which undermine them. I mean, I was thinking in the dressing, we're we've now both got into the face of wearing glasses. Yes. And I'm overly large colorful, grouses frame. It's a certain fuck you to the world. Is that woman? And I moved into the states mentioned necklace as well. I haven't gone that fall yet. My statement is don't look at my neck. It is. And. This because. You hit tonight's way you just not. Yeah. You just like fuck it. I think what the social statement necklace oversized kind of ground says chunky had any of those things it basically says I've withdrawn from the race. In terms of you know what I mean? Like I'm not trying to hook up. That's what it says. Bus pass. I haven't withdrawn from the human race. Now decorate for pleasure. Like some kind of I feel like indigenous birds. But he's, I dress like a parrot in the laundry basket. Nauseam california. Live in a stray. Lena, like nicer foods when New Zealand a beautiful, the quiet the Brown, they to know trying to prove anything I sing beautifully, and then you get to a strike, and they're all drag queens did just amazing. But look beautiful my gosh, you're right. Actually, that's true. Starting butts queens, which I'm not complaining about. No, I love it. But if a report. So today, we were at the q theatre and Oakland and I am with Cal Wilson. King about being too much the idea of being too much as women cow on as a go. Have you ever felt like oh you too much on tried to tone down all the time like you to noisy too much of a fast or like I've deliberately dressed too much tonight. Say you always Driss, but yet often told see that make such a fuss away. You getting so upset about that ways to return to a state of being demure, and does and passive in a way because as soon as you're active as woman, and you're taking control of making decisions all of the words like bossy, and feisty come out, I was thinking, feisty is a word reserved for women opinions. Yes, it means cross, but manageable. That's. I it's not a compliment. No. But it's only used for women actually, no would be a compliment. If someone was comparing you to the Canadian singer Feist. But then also you'd be like original your but forestay, and look, I think that's what they ever main the, it's a bit. It's a bit. It's a bit like spry is only used for old people. Yes, if somebody said oh, you'll so spry today you'd think not elderly watched. I couldn't hey you. Also hit a baby learned that Bonnie is code for. Oh, you've got a Bonny baby. So I guess he's got leagues like hams. Yep. There's coatings but I feel like just guilty somebody if you've ever been made to feel too much and you felt, it's a gender thing you felt like if I were guy that say he doesn't suffer fools, if you've ever experienced that could you just go? If you haven't experienced that can you just got. Oh, okay. They were couple, but I don't really believe them because they went. That's come from somewhere. I'm not a euro resident moan. Have you ever felt too much? No interesting. It's interesting. Any other men in. Yup. Have you ever felt too much you have? Yup. You have. When did you feel too much? Yeah. Yes, the angel. Abriel has felt too much gold has gone on and on about. Oh, I enjoy Gabriel never shops up would be had to be the angel Gabriel because you've got to go and tell Mary that she's pregnant, she'd be like, why don't you tell me himself? Are you saying that the delivery of this? Holy and sacred message from unloaded savior was. In fact, the equivalent of a boy passing you a note in mass from another goal. My friend Jehovah. Really? He's already without. So knowing, and if retarded conceptualize hit being too much she so we can tell you might fuck off. Most of us would be Jewish. Sorry man who is the angel Gabriel with sidelined, how you felt too much? Why? Myself. No. Okay. So I need to the questions, fellow Christians. Are you single? Okay. So when you say you feel like you're literally in the wrong place, you say. Just always the place. Tickets MAs about how did that happen when he just tickets left? Sold out. Oh, well that's a lovely story. What he was going to go and it's just as birthday. Why? But you'd have felt that you'd be to mount times on another man said he felt it. How did you feel it? Because I. How? Also, when I ought about politics, particularly feminism people tend to react like that's been. So when you talk about feminism benthic, it's too much. Also get light suspect. So you're just trying to get is like. This is no way to come about whatever I said, she'll, you know, well, we appreciate you being an online. If you'll single you won't be by the time you need him now. Feminist is it's also tend to live. It's no. I shouldn't have said that because that's that's version of what I'm so sorry. I'm a feminist bump. Feminists. Hello. I'm cable and Smith on Jessica Foschi. You know, us off this coast during the middle of listening to. Yeah. We are hit because we want Sally about a play where both in cold Brexit. Don't be of by the main. No, it's the real Brett's. No, it's actually really good. It knows what it is laughs an hour and fifteen minutes, rather than a lifetime and. And. This race clever and funny, and it's quite feminist. Isn't it in the sense that we both we? We. States either of us are in bikinis. I've been allowed to suit for it and longtime. Trousers. There were no skirt is it. It's more guilty than feminists. I feel quite sexy and trousers. No, I know. It's just that we not used to having any power hours comedians and acts a long time ago. I did a law degree. And I've had friends from university see the press pitches for this plan say the road not taken away. I'm basically, this is close of being in this place closes all ever gets. Make my mom happy career. Please. Come on what chip plays common supports us. It's brilliant, funny clever clever play. I'm a special forgetfulness listeners to get fifteen pounds offer code Brexit, fifteen yet, though to king's head dot com. The tickets we will buy you drink software has bit much guaranteed. No, no guaranteed. My too much safe meant, so I'm gonna do foam. It's for you and it was like a China that I did just before I came out, and I'm going to recreate here, I was off to sin out of show in Amy's, cool, and as comedian singer insurance, and then the audience choose the comedian that they thought was best, not most not having gets on call. So I took this very seriously because I love show teams a lot, but I'm aware like, I'm not a professional singer on, like, you know, so am I really allowed to do this. I went and had singing lessons, incredibly incredibly seriously because I was about to when I, I did I was doing a little bit apologetically. I wasn't being too much. I was being not quite enough. And I found out the show chains you have to be more than you think you should be in order to be enough, and if anything less you're thinking all just signals the audience, you know, your professional, that's what you. Wanted to you want to be constantly going. I know I'm not western saying, so what you watching my fullness, thinking that I think I am because that I know that I'm no. And that's what you're doing physically coming on jetty. So it must be lessons that place where I was like, no, you have to be more more than you think you and was just coming from one of my penis, and my agent called me and said this maintain I'm just like a big deal to me. And I said, I am I'm actually going to be early unto. She said, you're only ten minutes, and I was like, number because it's five o'clock. She said, no, it's four o'clock. And I was oh, but because I've been doing a couple of hours of singing show, James, even though I was like, I would normally sort of scurrying. Oh. Oh, I've kept you waiting. Just couldn't so through the door, I was just like why don't we? I just felt like physicality was just fulsome sorry, take about it. But I just I kept you to run for five, and she said, oh, just. To just give me a chance to my emails. And I said, oh, it's always the minutes. Anyway. Let. If you've been to show tunes, you can say one sorry, but you don't mean. Did you just go five hundred ago? I thought it was too. Two six yet I, I really wanted to. So I really a lot about. And I found that my voice was a local resident, I had been of voice a half to keep singing up a half to keep doing so the so that I did for a musical. I don't know if you've heard, but Britain is leaving the European Union in a little something we call exits. Brexit. It's a shit show either to remain because I'm not being near. But even the people who've of leave did not vote for this. Our prime minister is much like yours a woman. I think that statements. Very much. I believe where the comparison is. I mean prime minister's very right wing for non was prime minister. She was secretary did everything she could to make the life of refugees very difficult to keep out even minus. So I decided, because she is power brokering Ondo deal to sing my musical soul. As to raise the money. These are right answer this. Sure. I'm just going to I'm just getting into now. And also, she's famous but wearing leopardskin shoes in a smart to feel about it. You think she's till the leopard herself? Okay. So on a feminist bought. But I have plunged a proportion not proportion offers women into policy through my policies of stereotype. Do. Rights. Are we ready, ready? Are we ready? You have to understand the way mine have. Is a time. Bye. This vinegar to job by. So I do. I do when I'm through then I'm through. You bet. Of. No. My. Grow says, if I draw to mind, but I was I have. Bye bye. Bye. My. Brexit mine. We've got to go. Take him. He was a fine. You. Hello to all of the American and Canadian funds. I have some exciting news for you. My movies, say my name is out on the fourteenth of June. It's in selected theaters across the country, and you can stream it no matter where you are. I'm sorry, you're going to have to wait a little bit longer for streaming. But if you are in America, Canada, it's your lucky day, there are screenings across America, and you can find out where those at say, my name movie don't call nut say, my name movie dot com. But if you are in Los Angeles to Lamley Santa Monica on the fourteenth of June, or arena, cine lounge in Hollywood on the fifteenth of June. Both screenings, we'll have Q and is off to them with Jay stone the director and Lisa Brenna, the lead actress, under the producer of the film. Please go along and support, please, please, please, please, please, if you don't support films made by women's genius assume that those films don't make money, so please. Please, please. Go out and support supports my name, stream it at home. Now, if you watch it over the opening weekend, which would really help us out, and it is a funny, charming delightful move you gonna love it. Then I'm going to do an Instagram live Q and A from my Instagram account. D. F. D. F. D B's Ed, I'm going to do that. Eight thirty pm New York time and eight thirty pm. Los Angeles time on Monday the seventeenth of June and I've done it at that time. So everyone who hasn't got to watch it over the weekend. Can watch it on Monday at seven pm whether you're on the east coast, all the west coast, give me a follow, and I'll be talking about the movie live. So I will see you. Eight thirty pm time in the night, thirty PM LA time. I don't know what that means. If you live in Kansas, but I guess you guys can figure it out. You're good at math. And now I'm gonna trail you a little bit of the episode that we did on say my name with Lisa and Jay. An episode will be coming out soon. Hesitate. So I really wanna talk about how this came to pulse. We discovered today, this weird bemused triangle of Hamilton the musical without, which they would be no movie. And I don't know if you know, all of this J he doesn't know that all of it, but I. I know you're not my I don't think you know, Lisa's pond. So it was probably about four years ago, when Hamilton premiered, on Broadway in New York, and I went to see it, and a huge depression, washed over me. I'd been an actress for many years, doing lots of little guest starring roles in lots of different TV shows, I've done some movies here and there, but just nothing was really happening that I had children. And then I turned forty can I just say that's very female pitching of your career you in the patriot which was a huge block boss, done you with the lead it up. You like if I had guy up here like up. So I was doing movies like once blockbusters, but I was fulfilled deep in my heart. That's what say bits of basis that guest pitch that again, I know, hey trade is really anti Britain. No, you're out of his people. Yeah. I was going to mention that because it's like the pretty coming the American revolution where over it. All right. Guys. Hey volts once. Listen all the way it's worked out. You're welcome to it. Could strike shake. I think what you would doing films on television. Good roles. Yeah. And then you had children. Yes. And then I turned forty and then everyone finds out your turn forty and then you get nothing except maybe you go for the role of the crying. Why for the best friend? But no more lead roles in stuff, unless you're like a huge, huge Sar. So anyway, so I see how Milton and this sadness comes over me because I was so blown away by it that I said, what am I doing with my life? I am so much more. I want to do and I decided then and there, I want to make my own thing. I need to do this for myself because I love what I do. And it's just been so unfulfilling. I was so amazed when I heard this from today, because this film certainly say my name would not have been made without Hamilton because. I was in New York with Thomson and ski my husband on the last week when the original cost was that I'd seen it before because a friend of mine had a friend in it. So I was like we never gonna see this original cost ever again. Unless we go like let's just kind of suck it up and find a way to get tickets. And like pay over the odds of whatever Tom was, like this is ridiculous. Like, why are we doing this and the only time you get tickets was a matinee night, and then we had to go straight to the airport, and make Jay's wife. We're old friends said, I'm gonna have to come with you and mind your suitcases at a cafe because you've got huge cases you won't take them into a broad by there's no room for those so she very kindly did that. And because of that, because of my desperate desire to see Hamilton before the cost changed on the way in the taxi make said Jay's looking for a script and it's just making conversation. And it's got this element this element this, I said that sounds like say my name and she said, yeah, but that's not available. I was like, oh, it's vailable. It's. The most vailable script. I mean, that's what it's mainly going for surveillance. She was like, well, he tried to make it. I said. Yeah, but it was optioned in a bunch of men of optioned it over ten years. And it's got me a lot of other work, but no one's actually made it. So Jay then said, yeah, I'd love to make that scripts that he sent it to Lisa if we hadn't gone to Thomas, I can't believe you spent this money on these tickets. And I was like, I know but if I had not, we wouldn't have got to make a movie. So see how right. I was. So, yeah, without live Hamilton. It's it's playing now. I didn't like it. That much. Today is an award winning columnist musician and activist. She's also the author of the book that if word growing up him in the smelter, please. The weather. Tell us about just a little bit about you because we national everyone knows you must be famous, but can you tell the school international list is a little bit about who you are. And what if what is absolutely? So when is away and as he said, I am a musician and a feminist activist and writer and I grew up in Tuscaloosa, do it, which is about two and a half hours out of Oakland have since moved to the big smoke, I got into very young. I was in this kind of weird position where I suddenly found myself being proposed on in the media, which was very trying to in Europe seventeen year old from Vegas. The after few use that I started to realize that the way that the media reports on young women, the voices that gives young women will, like doesn't give to young women as pretty fucked up. And so that's why I started writing things I do. That's why I thought that if the book my column and. That website called villainy. Stock home for young woman to the platform because I think. I think that I mean you guys must have amazing young woman, and you lives, right? Who knows amazing Cossio angle. Exactly. And I just I've been so lucky to go round schools amazing Tena inches here, New Zealand's. And I'm just always stunned. I just think my God. You know, when I was sixteen I was just too busy listening to overruns. Bobby Gould, ten worrying about why I felt like I was hideous. But that's what these incredible views and these amazing things to open to the world. And that's why I of rising making out just wanted to create a bit more space for these young women to just be a bit too much in the introduction of the book you actually saying you told you too much cow. Throws it out there with the efficiency of almost a bit mountain. Man. I'm a little bit excited about to be honest. John how now. On a C always feel told him. Well onto. Hey, Joe show. What? So this is this is what we start. Apple rating deeper. His. Needle. Didn't know interesting or I would have an I will not. But in the meantime, you go into the different it's fantastic. Bennett was has thrown you a new viewpoint in the streets of words would have been enough at your to stuck Mike in, too many, many, many was not. This is the thing that really start me rating it so you total story when I was taking my teacher told my parents that I needed to be brought down a paid. She from west already long suspected, I was too much too loud, too difficult to different my parents outraged, but I was shined, I was seen apart from the kids in environment to be other is about the worst thing you can be today. I'm going to speak at schools around the country goes going through the same thing. We listened to their frustrations. I wonder how tight before being a young woman who knows their mind is unremarkable. Have you even heard young man described as being knowing his mind? I wonder when strong women finally be celebrated in courage, rather down. Wrought here in literally just really made a. You said that you would process to the media when he was seventeen. Yes, I when I was about sixteen that tonight thought tour around singing around the country. One of my uncles was very, very famous Zealand say how Morrison and he took me around the country before when you're young. And they when I released my first record, I think I would have been an issue. The full eighteen years old. And there's just this very strange way that we would treat it as young women, the major and you'd be asked questions. Like, so the prime minister at the time was howling Klopp onto Helen her. We all love. And she had been texting during speech the Quyen was given an army the being on national television being interviewed by Henry. We also love. He's. His. Couldn't possibly say. And he asked me what I thought about prime minister, texting while the Quyen was giving a speech on one hand you kind of off your opinion, and they'd what are your opinion you go into the right opinion? And I just thought it was on the debt or it was Dolly magazine. Go close Cleo. We are, you know that you needed to say on the stars who needed to if this kind of blow job. And I've got a teenager. It was really speaking to me. And so you've become an ultra BT activist, and also Mario twist. Well, I'm just amount of his next bus. Okay. And you are now speaking on behalf of various groups that you belong to tribes. You've learned to and also wants that you feel you need to have four because there are power justices. How did you get beyond that point as young woman being told or a child being told by this teacher said to your parents? You two months. I think the context was when I was young. It's very understandable for people know my writing, particularly just a little bit bossy and just a little bit strident trophy. And I just had us doing things the things that I was doing would be labeled if our way showing leadership potential. I think I was just a bit hard to handle the classroom, disruptive. So that's why she, I say to my parents that I needed to be brought down a peak, and kind of put my proper place, which is. Quietest does and very peaceful is little girls matter of sugar and spice things, which is bullshit. How did your parents out? Fuming absolutely furious. I mean, being kisha with the teach it on kgo eight Bryce made to be Shrove. So. Felt but no released shame. I mean, I was probably I Don and I just felt like I was from everything about me was Rome, and I needed to fit into this kind of books what I was meant to be forgotten that feeling. And I think as women often we've all had that feeling at some point, and as we've been excellently too early, but I think that even more important. Well, I feel that as more for me, now, very privileged to be in this position to be able to have a voice in speak-out, and certainly, try hard not to speak four anybody because I can't speak for anyone other than myself, I like to be able to try some broom context, and some discussion and also most importantly, like with villainous with the website to create spice of women to be part of the conversation. Be leading the compensation putting views forward because being made to feel that you too much. Just credit to fight back against it as much as we can do you think the singing helped you have to take that stage and find a stillness of the pow, I'm gonna decide humid smoke, right? You never forget the name, Mr. year. Once that say those things like nine hit. The. He was the one that went as to meet you have a fairy unfortunate laugh. I was laughing juryman plus when we wake into any kind of from the states in income over Toby that was awful. But luckily, our new wasn't. You do. Nothing. Gonna say anything. Yeah. Mystery for me. He tortured me for a year and just constantly undermined me. I wasn't really particularly child that time I was about ten Walsum, somebody who was always. I mean I take before mine hair every. Insist to the poll not, but other than that, I mean, there wasn't about me that the Sota skiing retention and yet, the poll hasn't clubs. Like. This is geography. I remember I used to sometimes really sort of respect for pathetic way to something and discuss it. And he just wanted to squash that he really wants to scotch them. I think he was a good teacher. I sometimes think about him. He's names. Joining us still think he lives on the go coast in Australia. I anybody knows him and knows that he, he has really found happiness. And wants to tell me that would be great. This wonderfully chief in there. Taking reasons to pick keeps a happy person, the steps that you think got you from that feeling that shame at also be overly scrutinized as a teenager by the media because of singing to this place. Now where you feel you can brought to, and you are setting up a website for young women and girls what was the process either. Well, I took this weird kind of detour Winton became classical crossover artist for a few years. And that sexually kind of instrumental, they were two things that are really instrumental to as the Dana sixteen. I want a scholarship to go to a private school here in Oakland, which moving problem to King's College was like moving to fucking MAs, and was just the most baffling kind of experience, if I kings is kind of like Eaton and was originally boys school, and they started accepting girls, and yet twelve six actually. Nine thousand nine hundred people still say, always started accepting girls in the last five years, but no, it's been a long time and being that environment. It was the kind of place where Armand vividly my second day going into the dining hall theory, rules and nine for breakfast and seeing these boys holding up toast, and something on them looked over. And I realized that I would numbers in the boys had taken nine be veteran a number of teen. Holding them out as the girls will past ranking, how attractive upstate new were being in that kind of environment, very conservative least make protocol. But the boys if you into joked, that insult me bitch very engine. You know, we just use by lable without misogyny saying that kings accepted goes really excited. What? So. Yeah. Environment who is quite a conservative school, but I came out quite radicalized so that happened. Leeann I the kind this process artist and plus across any of you, actually. Listen to it. It's just kind of very pretty very nice sounding music. And I was created by my record label into this quite palatable, I suppose marketable commodity, that would flow around on stage is, you know, wearing these big poofy dresses and I love us. And I always always up before I was theory rightful that had those experiences. But what I realized when I kind of got to about twenty two and we were talking about making another classical crossover was it? I actually would rather have scooped. My idols out spoons. And I just for the. But I just realized that it was it wasn't who I was become this caricature of myself that was just very ineffective and kind of insipid it was a wake up call. And so from that point on woods really bathing this kind of deconstructing all of the conditioning and crap in very lucky to have some amazing Koss women around may some of the women, I spoke to my book, rebel and mobile amazing just Kaley legions, who I've been able to talk to grow under the guidance is very encouraged by the women in my life, the old women in my life door to just, you know, say what the fuck I think, and it was just Malusis theory when I started doing now. I also have legions of trolls on Twitter that this photo, my every move, and that's also a revolution of some kind of. Yes. Yeah. Problem for anybody who's the public now what do you make? No. I make music that. I write myself I it's interesting because it's an extent now you've really taken that voice. Yeah. Might it's really by Broughton road. Yeah. Absolutely. But what I have found at Mississippi, the last couple of years is that everything's very Chiyoda. I'm also a producer we make web series, documentaries and stuff in the book McCollum on the website, and that's open a bit much. So I haven't actually been to make much music recently. But I certainly hope to make the musical version of that. Yes. That effort the musical. I don't if you heard my. But I take it, we should cost you for the lead role in bed. I don't wanna be Libro really feisty cameo. Yeah. I'm thinking more to or company has one really big number that I can do carrot to fillet. So it doesn't really matter if I get pitchy, because people think positive before. Okay. Just one or two. So I come steal the show to the dressing room. I'm just brainstorming UB the lead ought to be in my show. We're on the late and steal the show and FOX. Is that what you said is not fucking note? And so. Women. Not no. I made I say metaphorically. Feel good issue. The book. I really like soy, much reason I hit with Megan tunes of feeling too much in what I really love to that. You you own your success. So like image over. Just like I did this fun. Let's go to say that she doesn't describe success away that we almost from good. Also, the boy suggest my okay. This. Does the voices to the animals? I know we definitely too little bit. Success. Not also that you to Hillary Burien illegal Hillary to go into the human rights commission into. It's probably to be taken seriously but blows my mind but I just loved honestly have funny that we're in so generous in telling those stories as well. Hit experiences in the year of being guest little what into to, like, I'm not the only one that's come off worse, the situation like it's really hot and that dislike universal role of women in the media. Yeah, yeah. The times, sit on a border title and my suggestion, and then a man his mind science producer lighter in literally known as one of light to own an older woman that I would give me a tip when you're in that situation. And you have something say you drop something on the timing when you glass, sorta, and we need to around to say, what keeps us pay you go. He's my idea because he. I should have to spill. To get men to listen to me. I feel like I mean I'm very happy to drop something I'm not spending. I just saved my head Mr.. Pick up my children now. Mr. Is this? Talking about being too much. I feel like we've already been to. I think fairness should invite being too much more often. And so without in mind, would you like to some comedy? Peaking on the only Campbell's. No really, I'm I was in the players of the ice in the seventies episodes of magnum PI and quite annoyed Rickman show. Earner brisbane. Also doom style prep. Written a book. I'm just book and my did loan and found the American men was quite taints about surviving the apocalypse, and he didn't think that was school-age children, so much this official that I thought who is much was Madonna I thought about how when Madonna arrived. Oh my goodness. She's not embarrassed about self, and she's she seems to be enjoying safes and met some little but offers like she the same sort of powerful and my barb at Madonna is that she hits continued to be Madonna, the whole time, even she's got older. She still Madonna. She still out there, flew to your own sexuality ends up painting process about that. She's got older that felt that she should just doing what every doesn't go invisible in fighting to the background and maybe get some more cats and just shut up. And she all she. All she should eighteen right. Should. Acting. Oh, she's put it away. Oh, she's eight. She's eight. About the Rolling Stones Jagger and Keith bridges after stike struggling, right? What pieces of all Bankin? Teats. She's always don't often spur attention. Just giving the pic that Mick Jagger children that I have been his bright brand. Just go away. Preventing women don't on holidays got prison. So you get one of the forgot to get your anything of your binding. Instead, his moose Sade angry. Jane. So he's thinking women. Street sorta think that women from fiction because I can do it or not. I'm trying to cover. It could sequence. Fairytales being some different if the women in the hit been too much, like not even just being a little much, but being like a lot much like a whole much big not as passive Cinderella, like five privacy. She was a drudge for his shit state sisters. Right. But one of Cinderella didn't go to the ball and teach she used that time load in the house to get stuff together. She leaves town, she starts to arm Cleveland company, and she's been successful because are incredible team of mice. And she has seen cleaning products as an amazing give it. And she just might flows of cash and mitre. She consoles with the stepsisters after she types them to guilty famous shar, and there'd be less. Being behind shits and that women don't need to compete, thanks to each other for the attention of a man. And then even bigger twist the prince comes to work for her because the country disassemble the monarchy. Personal proprio bullish here. Ability, Jen, who foot into a class delay time? Daytime, which is impractical and dangerous. And she turned him down, because what is on me boys? Son. His mother has introduced to blend to the Goodrich, and I put up. Sleet, snow more she's a beautiful young girl. She's wicked quite hot. She's gonna take Mira Mira. All the everyday in the mirror goes to you, and they won dying. Slow just gets a little bit too. And then it's her. And so the. Thing into sides to killed. Into the forest can't kill it. She's pretty. I mean it's good to have right rates Bill to mood someone, isn't it? And so he doesn't kill her, but the point that the mirror still on snow, and what could have done at say. No, no. She's did. But you still look right for a couple of days before things are really role. Too much. Does she ends up living with the Steven towards end actually still on poisons with an apple in snow falls into imports to the seventy two when I find in a car, like don't take it too. Puts you in a glass, coffin. Nice. Essentially instead of getting medical help you put in a Theriault. Listen. I mean. Literally pulled to. They asked him. He's actually Dr vacant of inspiration. She is in a row. Side to come inside. Mr. And she's in class in a prince and what do you do? When you find a woman in, in the forest you. You. You. Get help just came out, and then you weren't you still have to take a bit to the cosmic trip to slaughters problem with ROY and she wakes up and they the prince proposes to. It's quite cool. Isn't it being a few months? Keeping. Going when you marry you like to warning breath. Win statement is going to up legally amid tied into to ROY Mark, but instead she books Stephen twenty minute afforest. Hits Rachel abandon day at the behest of a wicked. Stepmother, what's what, what could stick mothers and fury tiles, or just one woman who keeps going around and marrying widows. She'd be on the front to the dining he'd like serious. Like in the be quite from the king. She normally even in my children, but she was just hawk. Ingraham. The woman living on a road in a coffee to might of gingerbread that she's pursued ably, designed and built yourself and then head so ingredient tuneup and state of the lynching as renowned biscuit architect, but she clearly is by not challenging, or her house, and she's doing. Supposed to be in grand to. Pan. This polite. Living on the leaky Muslim. Dr. The witch hasn't been trying to rice to be critically. I would have been up to doors each other skills, whose time is journal by the white, but no one. Ass. Greater with Martin, which being self sufficient, single women plan to our thorough, which never say that. Six. I'm gonna phone because she's notable. Who speaks? He is learning run born in Washington. She shine to fulfilling dates chain to throwing that looks down the road. In a society that believes she's intrinsically, upholding non would she's not young marriageable actually married. If Grisel hit made a bit more much. She would want us to mentor and chooses to jail, and Steve shipbuilding bread houses, which was mutually beneficial to the viper that China tool bike race pulled hall. Respondents. You. Being cute, but it stands to Britain case. About so h-have refused predisposed while couldn't really say who gives. Sixty six being improved women were a bit much and she likes me to the tiny shrew, which is the most problematic Shakespeare, which sort of all about gets thing humiliating her. And the yes, she wants to marry you, I was gonna re want kites gives Patrizio the flick gets zoology degree into Spacey's, angry mammal. So trees, the timing of the shrimp. So I'm on researching shrews. Interesting. Doing business. Samari knowing and grow throughout life, shoes, tape wind down, much more extreme because those. Buffoon. Shrews. Shrews. That's what I'm saying. To your toilet. I've come to the only tonight. To take idea with decisive, periods of seventy two thirty two days by often become the term. Giving. Shrews. Breath. Era from twelve months, many kids, imagine denies. Denies shrimp, number of respects. I'm like, most members some species of shrimps. Time just combination with you might be poison you. Not fit. What are the key strength from shrimping them, but it'd be potentially useful in the treatment of Krisha use in the treatment of new, muscular, diseases, grains, the shrew is a. The. The point distribute almost will guide but only nuclear Australia, New Zealand hip, no night of shrews, obviously, we have been through Zealand. When you pick. Species, fifty shrew is the former success from Bebel family, only the bro family, the family and the Kardashians. Variance story that would've been so different. If a woman had made so much much be Romeo, and Juliet. It's a great love story, but a grant, how story isn't one. We have both people die. That's good into luxury. Great luxury. Is one we you wanna beat a people because the other person makes you feel like you want to be the person the pace vision of yourself. You can be a great story when we you on the captain, the catch this, like when you need, and you go do you want some chocolate, and all you have to say, lore of the catch, and he knows the legal to move a Slayton catch. Gives the children from the French, we'd he tie speeder because you told them. And. Phone story is what the two three people or number of people respect and AVI familia. Nobody wants to anybody persons to interrupt to themselves. That you put into that is a lot story. Pippi bit more too much to mention Belkin gone. She said, she's on the belt initiative cheese. So you're eight. Great. She's a Taylor. What to do? You know. Cigarette my, she's what she what if I can. Bash also on it. She's on the bed with me. She's up too much larger on she's written plane in quill on around. She's trying to sell me, but she can't hold the plane Pallone up to go. Rustling in the bushes. And I got the hitch over. It's someone cooling Russell. Appears and he sees the modem. What will I three on my right now? But so what like three your window to the Juliet is the sun and Julia this Judy at the side much studio. Some IMAS ginger in Maine tone. Another son, he goes, no, no, no. You standing bitten four the standard sweet Juliet, poetry's lot. Compelled my boys to compare to the fiery lighter process guys within the regular Dino at each time. The heavenly body was the heavenly pointing hits to the east, and Juliet is the sun and Julia Rolls, Royce. She's like run. Some it's a seat Salat. To be disturbed accurate seats, just serve it. Matched to a trailer of the candle of. So dance be worried about prowlers was just climbing up the last like two shoes off fuck the chance man. Anyone really wants? And he's like turn to go through the hope line. Low story short. Listen secret Payson to the Freia. Mary him series. Misunderstandings dispatch ourselves at NASA, tragically romantically beautifully with the city of blame and poison in Juliet. Looks at sweet Romeo of out of fucking mind. Q and everything, but suicide, relay and thirteen not marrying anyone. She is also my cousin last week. So, you know exactly what I was the site has. Has. You'll meet resolutions apprently polling. And then she goes passion that set touching on the bottom. We should go to the froyo of told me. Give me the chips and the play ends with Romeo pleading with Judy to marry him again. And she swats about one eight. With the Lee Frank. I think we should be too much. I think we should be I would like sequel heroines who ought to match like we're gonna break through the ceiling of the glass, coffin. If you wanna abet on your balcony. A fucking bed. When you. Garrity notice those even being safe before, thank you. Hello guilty feminists. It's just Regan here from the speeches workshop Hugh might remember an episode last year cold women, fighting on stage and screen episode on Jessica Hynes talked about her brilliant film, the fight and I talked about a player, I was called the sweet signs of bruising looked at female underground Victorian boxing. I'm delighted to tell you that the sweet signs of freezing is back, and it's bigger and better than ever. It's on at the Wilson's musical the venue of our dreams running for the whole month of June. It is the fairest fabulous feminists play of my dreams. It has a female writer female director and a largely female cast. So if you would like to support feminine star anytime soon. Please do come along. It is a wonderful passionate. Beautiful cathartic play. I really think you'd enjoy. So ticket started twelve fifty. I'd love to see there. Thank you. Bye. Finish question. Could you please tell us about your website and how we can access twelve? Absolutely. So the website is villainous dot com style that to be I L, L A m eight is E dot com. And it's the target is really anyone basically northville to nobles radio women, and if anyone wants to contribute to the site, there's a little icon, that's a little pin Seoul, which you can just click up the site and the name out, and sit as submission and really, it's all about creating space than a platform for young women to take away, not exclusively to tip end to just put some stuff out there to the world and stand up, what they believe speak out in the last off without sounds absolutely credible. We will all be clicking on that link. And we will also be buying effort. Catchy priest a little bit about mobile. I have. I have. Children's book and it's George in the great bumster paid. Portland in Portland. Feel. People with bums people who know about. It's about a family, the mine character is going because it started as stories on my son in the mum is an advantage to pension. Suka Papa papers and she's got three daughters, Koepenick competent, paprika, people palatis Nathan. Pagis son pitcher in George. And to the small, polka, polka hidden unfortunate incident with his mum's shrink writing and he knows the size limit. Risks of isn't Baynton. She invades things kids tycoon, beaches pandemonium in sues at one point there five hundred bounce loosen the tail it sounds like a great set. I. It is this is this is generally, when things that are most, it's in the scholastic book club. Many of came other base wrestling, isn't it? It's amazing. I really love is put it in book club. And you get a free. That. What kind of sweet when you don't do the front of the? Impeach. Really? Seen. It cannot be sending out. Cindy to schools. Thing on the bomb that says you have to ask I squeeze it can say too. A time when ever be hearing from Kabul. Winters bombs at schools. I'm just telling watch out ninety with salts books gone back into sort of negative number. We will call this home. The thing that I'm really unprintable illustrated by freedom of that school. If she's concered Davis end even we were at my school. She was already brilliant, and it's so exciting to have written a book pictures. Well, if anybody has a child knows the child this book is for them. How was the say plus some? So by that when you buying effort and really screw up around. People who likes that effort, also Georgia, the great. Books about feminist botox. Must be. Before we, we've got a charity of the week hybrid. I'm from intimate Llosa's New Zealand. So intimate yours is basically the Bigelow had to say, but we also call Indo commonly. It's a truly nasty condition affecting more than one hundred twenty thousand New Zealanders and one in ten women worldwide. It can stop from against period, the symptoms include bed periods. Excruciating pain about symptoms pain with six infertility. It can also fit mental health. So we really need to talk about it more, because it means that can seriously affect our relationships partners in families. This probably not one person in this room hasn't been affected by, in some way, whether you know it or not, I the personally someone you know, even Marilyn Monroe head. It's been talked about recently that she had to put in her contracts that she wouldn't film when she was on her period, because the pain was so unbearable takes eight plus years to get a diagnosis and this country due to elective awareness. So to say that sinking eight years before you know what's happening with your body. And this. Little results, while for this female condition. So intimate trio New Zealand has fantastic Facebook page, and there's a donate button on met, or if you have some cash with you tonight, I'll have a bucket Ican puts money in, in dog, get zero government funding in this country. So your money would have a real impact towards supporting education in schools program to educate youth about Inova into support the many woman suffering. Thank you so much. As a nation. But it sounds like an amazing. And if you have anything to the bucket, it would be very much appreciated. If you in a strength be this is fit. Do people actually physically here? But if you think from a straight on too much show, gifted underachiever, if you also. The. As part of the tool because I've come. What are you doing, buddy leaving sound UP? This is gonna Lil. I think it should come accuses could you please? Email addresses. All right. I'm gonna do this. Owner guilty feminist. Around him stood around run dot com snaps than. Best of. Keep scratching my tune. Page signed up to a mailing list mouse to get notified a series of, you episodes, were least. Three to Jones, Rick view and subscribe, people find cost, you could also rate of shooting. Tipper if w on Instagram on D dogs, too, you said, I also book could become feminists. Company. Somebody's waving would you have to sign it. Okay. I'll come out. Okay. Okay. Mind. We want you on social media or thirty yet that you can find me at busy Mobley onto letting Facebook and Instagram and all of the villainous is the villainous. Okay. Great. We will look those up. You think? No. I'm kidding. Swear something can leave lex here, which may need. Yeah. You forget, it should be. I should be out of nation. No, what my second daughter is going to be. Just. Today. Hollywood. Everybody one last thing before you go. I'm the national and the guilty feminists have revived the legendary secret policeman comedy brand, and we doing shows across the UK, but also weekly truth to power, our Friday, three pm British time for now. We aren't going to ballitser human rights issue so follow at amnesty UK all go to amnesty dot org dot U K at that time, and you will find details about it. You're going to be able to really make a difference because we're all gonna get together at exactly the same time. 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116. Jealousy with Grace Petrie and special guest Sammy T Dobson

The Guilty Feminist

00:00 sec | 2 years ago

116. Jealousy with Grace Petrie and special guest Sammy T Dobson

"I am a feminist, but I saw a poster for film cold fees, the untameable Joan Crawford. And I thought I want to be the untameable Dipper Francis white, and I'm going to go further and say, I want men to try to tame me. So I can prove that I'm untameable. Not good reputation. Aimable. Yeah, yes. America's just chewing. Ends, isn't it? They get tamed. There's like a hoop involved. Trying to think of what tools you would use to tame Joan Crawford or indeed that's up anyway. What are you to one shit? Yeah, crikey. I'm a feminist, but last week I shouted I paid for your food. You have to let me hold you at my cat. And then immediately felt like I was not a feminist. Issue, male or female? Oh, he's male. Yeah. I was trying to tame him. The busted. I'm a feminist bought at the guilty feminist book launch party. David deal came up to me and said, oh, I've got your book, but I haven't read it yet. And I said, oh, you don't have to. And he said, no, I want to an I said, don't feel obliged. At my own book launch party for a book with feminist in the title. We're no David deal. You keep singing about football coming home. This little. Doc, I'm a feminist, but sometimes I let men in the music industry is seemed I know nothing about guitars because I find talking about guitars, relentlessly boring. I'm a feminist, but tonight backstage grace Petri looked at me and said, am I overdressed. And I know you look great and shrimp. I think I might be overdressed and I'm at no, no great. Show him. I think I'm overdressed and I looked down and went. I'm taking off my cardigan. Look a lot more dressed up. Then. I took her repeated questions about whether she was overdressed and decided I was very, very, underrated. I sit before you now feeling deeply under dressed, but she hadn't seen with the cardigan on. She hadn't seen her sparkley. This was and I feel when that was revealed. She changed her mind. But if I'd had a change of costume backstage, a definitely would have done. I just want to say. So I started in a suit a three p. suit. I know I've downgraded at law too. Smart cash. No, you wearing the standard Gareth Southgate now I. If you're listening at home Gareth Southgate fucking waistcoats off me. That's all I'm saying. I've been wearing waste goes for like three years. And admittedly I think they predate that as well. I'm a feminist, but when my sister in law decided to take the last name Petri, it made me feel like we were an advancing army and had conquered a country. And it was it was about phasing. Love that idea. I genuinely love that idea that the more women you can make Petri the mall, the Petri will be a feminist army. Yeah, bought, we're losing my sister, my sister. That's a bad thing. Say my sister's taking. You're not losing her? No, that should have been my feminist, isn't it? Yeah. No, no, no, you're not losing her. You're not losing her? She is. She's taking a man's name. I don't. I sometimes that we should take into linski though. I just never did it because I was just like this to someone else's name. It's really weird. It'd be like taking his trials or something like. Do I mean stealing is concave or something? I'm not stop my name like identity fraud. Yeah, taking these credit card. I didn't know. It just feels like that's not have done. I just wanna. I want to populate the world with p. trees, I think. Yeah, I know I do. I just didn't take is just felt like not me Bont. I've sort of regretted it since because Dolinsky such cool name and he's five generations. Go was polish and the women there. If he's linski they would be Slim's gone. So I've often lane awake at night thinking. I could be Deborah selene ska. That is cool, and I'll be like a bond a bad bond girl. Sure. Yeah, I'm a feminist bonds. Real Jim Moret era think. I mean, it wouldn't be Deborah. It'd be Minhaj Dolinsky, but. Still. Live from northern stage. With over protests bikes. Petri special Dopson hoping. This is the guilty feminists the pup costume which we explore on mobile goals is century feminists and the Apocrypha insecurities which undermine them. I'm Deborah Francaise Zam joined by grace, patriots talk about jealous. Say. I also grace if she'd co host a show with me. And she said, I'm not comedian. And I said, I know I'm reading cited about not because I'm not gonna lie. I've listened to Grace's albums so many times and I just wanted her to play more songs from it for me live and I was like, I just want to hear them. Basically what I think gracie's. No, do go on. I think grace is if Billy bronc, Hannah, Gadsby and Joni Mitchell were all one person. Oh, wow. I thought you were going to go down to three hole route. No, no love child. Okay. No, just no job. I breed. With a really weird accent. Not really. I've been listening to album and I've decided that my genre, I didn't know this before I listened to it, but my genera is angry songs about social Justice and sad songs about lesbian relationships, not working out. And I've gotten a lot of both. That's pretty much that's going. Yeah, I'm excited. I'm glad I know the answer to that now when people are trying to market me in the music industry, and then I is, is it folk punk? But I can be like, no, it's angry songs about social Justice and sad songs about lesbian relationships, not working out. There's loads of festivals for that, isn't it? I'm going to start a label and that's what it's going to be cool. You may be the only artist? No, actually you should check out tumbler. You and Roxanne from suffragette. Yes, absolutely. I'm really would like to a guilty feminist music able the cell, forget an EP people beyond seeing those songs. Make me feel ready for battle. I feel I, I love hip home grace, but there's not enough because a lot of women say to me, they feminists part is that they love hip hop and they end up in the morning, getting ready for war or work. Going to pitchers and the hose alike, Ohio. I shouldn't be saying this, why am I seeing in about bitches and hos? But they feel really, that's not empowered. They go, they feel okay. And this is my theory. The penultimate chapter of my book is called the dessert course, and it's all about why there's a hidden feminism in the things that we are drawn to that on the outside seem like it goes pleasure. So I've written about things like Brome comes and weddings and Bedia. And one of the things I've written about his hip hop, and I think we're not imagining ourselves as the bitches and the hoes we feeling what it's like to be that guy who so sure. And so in charge of the bitches and the hoes. Well, okay. That part is not right. But the just the central feeling of like, yeah, I'm just like not apologizing like no, yeah, taking up space? Yeah, the swagger. I mean, all the bitches. The host shelf should be content morning. We're going to talk about pitches, does. Little else so far. Please welcome to the sage Francis. Have you ever experienced this? Your friends said that if they were going to be in your neighborhood, they'd give you a text because they were going to have lunch maybe, but maybe not, you think, oh, maybe there's something will happen on Sunday and maybe it won't. And then you either sore on Facebook or found out from somebody they did have lunch, but somehow didn't text you. That's not just an experience happened to me. Right. Please. I'm getting need from others to feel some. Yeah, I get left out of stuff. Please skies. Okay. I mean, if it's never happened to you whatevs. Bitches. So. If somebody who's just heckled and hosts. Just give us a cheer few sore and hose, but held back. Including grace Petri whoever didn't. I love you. Have you ever lived with a man of any description? Could be a lover. A brother. A father. Anybody who that would have happened to all that has happened to and they've just been like, oh, well, they probably forgot to text me and you've thought, what do you mean? They forgot because you've spent five days thinking about the fact that you got left out of that brunch lunch situation and you now when you see those people next to like, hey, yeah, and you're trying to work it into the conversation or Kasuali like, did you have lunch, but secretly thinking, why do you hate me why you'd have to out you talking about me and why would you even do that? And you trying to casually bring it up, but not like you on your Roddick are weird and you're just like, just wondering if you ever did end up going brunch place and then just checking, see if they're gonna go. No, we never win or, yeah, we texted you, but we didn't. The text bounced because we were out of the rain. All I Sam said that you already had gone for brunch that day. Probably wouldn't. Wanna come some reasonable explanation. Now I am in the camp of people that will need a reasonable explanation. I'm afraid about this. My husband. I mean, I've often said it my husband is probably a black mirror app. There's a lot of evidence pointing in that direction. He just been like, I'm sure if they want me to be there. They'd ask. But like not huts just like fact, fact fact what's. But why are you not upset by this? I'm taking. And he's like, oh, see the, but all the time. That's not the fucking. The board. Oh, maybe they have something to discuss privately. That's horrifying. So my friend Fyona Thompson, and I are writing a book called super tribe and it's about the way people frying p- and it's about the way we connect. It's sort of slightly Malcolm glad Willie in type paradigm for looking at the world and. Somebody's just realized they forgotten to our someone to come to this show. And like shit, we said, if we were going, we would call her. We got the tickets and we never told she's probably at home prying because we tweeted that we were here. We Instagram'd look at us the whole gang at the guilty. Say. If you're listening at home, someone's run out in a panic. So rather than looking at men from malls women like shoes, which is not true. I some women like shoes some, no minute from malls, it's all nonsense. What we're looking at is traits and behaviors. And we've gone back to hunters and gatherers on the savannah more men, one hundred women, but he's this plenty of tribes way women hunted or men and women hunt together and likewise with the gather. But overall the trend men tended to hunt on women tended together. So there are all sorts of interesting things that you can look out. For example, fighting flight is more useful for hunters because hunters could often outrun something hunters tended to hunting very small groups gathering tended to gather in large groups because gatherers could protect each other gathering, had less body strengthen were to pregnant to run, which we were always to pregnant to run. We would stand together shoulder to shoulder and fight. And we know this because antropologist have studied uninterrupted hunter, gatherer tribes that. Exist to the twentieth century and some did exist today. So we started to look at these trends. The hunter tends to have a clear metric for success in a hunt. Did you come back with a wooly mammoth or not? A hunt is a failure. If you do not come back with a gazelle end of story, you can't catch a quarter of a gazelle. So it's a very clear metric for hunters. So if you come back from the hunt and you've got a gazelle and Jeff's a bit pissed off humps Stiller success. If you come back from the hunt, everyone had a wonderful time and everybody's happy. Noga Zell hunt. Failure gather is different gatherers have a much longer economy because you kind of have a small gather and you kind of gather of kind of dodgy berries that are bit dried out and gatherers because we have to fight shoulder to shoulder, need to look out for and look after each other. And if I'm in the third trimester of pregnancy and my water's actually breaking, I need you. You go and gather for me on the basis that guy that few before and will gather for you again. So it's very important for gather is in a way that's important for hunters to keep each other happy and chicken with each other and go, oh, you happy with me, or are you going to leave me out of this gather on you going to say, you're gonna mind my baby, but really you're going to leave it in a ditch for wolf tweet. So Catherine's need to be much much better at reading each other than hunters who can fight awfully and so- gatherers have a habit of checking in with each other to make sure they're definitely in the gang. And this is the reason why Fiona owner, and I have a cyst throughout research and guesses. That's what Malcolm glad we'll does come on. He just doesn't say that what he's doing. I'm a woman and together so I need to. So if you have thirty gatherers and hunters are off and some jackals circling and there's thirty gatherers and it's a no gather. So maybe there's only calories really for twenty eight. It's the strategy in the world. Let one gathering go to the jackals because otherwise they're gonna get us. All right. So sometimes you let one go to the jackals now. Here's the thing this time when the jackals are actually circling to have a meeting and decide who Jekyll bait is. You've always gonna know who jackal bait is. I'm actually anthropologists think that the main reason we learned to communicate is to gossip. So we could be like, Susan's not putting her money in the coffee, John. It's true. It's true. That's what they think. Now when you were at school, if you remember goals at school or you were a girl at school, do you remember how there was always one girl on the out, but that changed that position change. So you never knew if it was going to be you or someone else, and sometimes you just find yourself on the outs. And other times she'd be in the center of the group, generally decided upon by one, two, three cool goals and feels terrible. If suddenly everyone's not talking to you or the talking about you, it feels like the worst thing in the world. And there's reason for that. If you're on the savannah and you on jackal bait, you probably have five minutes to live. So when you're invited to brunch, it can feel like you have five fucking minutes to live. You get the feeling of what, what. Now the best way to make sure that your not jackal bait is to be on the committee who decides jackal bait is I'm, that's why there's lots of gossip of. She's like, she's like, she's not. Oh, and that can happen in any group of guy, there is not could be a mixed gender group of gatherers. But as a trend at school, I remember boys standing around two boys going fight, fight, fight, fight, fight, fight. I'm one boy would punch the other boy and the boy that was on the ground at the end lost the boy that was standing up one. And then it was decided that boy was stronger than this boy. And I remember that happening and I'm not saying there was no structural violence amongst boys. There probably wasn't. I'm sure there is bonds. I remember that happening and I don't remember that happening with goals. I remember us deciding collectively who was in the in who was on the out, to be honest, I wasn't really on the committee who decided who was out, but I remember that in smaller groups I probably wants, I probably wants deciding and there was gossiping. Discussion about those things. If you feel like Jacko bait, there are ways of getting over that and getting around them. And I talked to a lot of women who work in big firms about this doing my research and a lot of those women have said at work, I am a hunter. I am process I and people second. And in my social life, I'm a gathering. I'm like really worried about being left out. But at work when I get the promotion or get the big, whatever it is I get the big accounts. I don't know what a corporate people get accounts. The Jenkins account. I've got it. I've watched the good wife. I got the Jenkins account and women have said to me in my research for this, they've said it's the worst feeling in the world because I've done the hunt. I've got the gazelle I'm standing there and some guy will say something like, I don't deserve it or something snippy because he's jealous because he doesn't have the Zell and inside. I feel like a gatherer inside. I think, why doesn't he like me. All I did was try really hard, and I'm standing there with a big side of beef with blood all over me. But inside feeding, like please like my berries. And this is fascinating to me. This is absolutely fascinating to me, and I feel like this very much always wherever I go. I want to take my friends with me if my career is doing well at any point I want my friends around me. I mean, I've started a whole show called women. I love doing well please for the next woman. I love look at her gazelle tub berries because I can think of, frankly, nothing was I want. I want to be doing this that I'm doing, but it's quite exposing because I'm standing here in a light and I'm on mock the week now. And I'm like, my nightmare is to be standing there covered in blood next to a woolly mammoths on my own because then I definitely got five minutes to live because I'm covered in blood and I'm holding protein. I'm like, where. Wherever gather is because we got hang together because we got Kuwait. So I absolutely fear this. It's sort of like the opposite of jealousy. It's like, I desperately want the people around me to do well. And that feels like it's coming from a good place, but somewhere deep inside. I also know it's coming from place of not wanting to be alone. So I have a thing because I used to like genuinely my life was a bit ruined by someone not liking me and I couldn't sleep, and it would feel physically sick. So I've developed this thing through the jackal bait theory. That funeral Thompson, I've come up with for super tribe. I've developed a technique that really does work for me, and it goes like this. If somebody's short with me of with me with me somehow snippy or difficult or something like that, I do this. Firstly, I look around and I go all their many jackals here, and I literally go to the window. And I look outside. I live in Camden town in London, and I go, can I see any chuckles in the street jackals anything that's gonna eat me. Okay. Then I go. Secondly, have you been Detroit? Has the whole tribe left you, or do you have tribe? And I think about my family and my friends and my comedy tribe and my feminist tribe and all of those different tribes. And I think about all the people I have all the tribe that I have, and I think, no, I have tribe. So what's going on here? And then I think about this particular ration- ship of this person, I think. Okay, so this person has a problem with me and I think is it valid? Is that a valid problem? Have I done something to genuine upset them that I was accident. And if I have, oh, I should apologize. And I find it can make one warm apology and go did not upset you. I'm so sorry if it did and I don't have to keep going in the tribe. GMI Jacob, do you not like me? Do you not let my berries? Mine could be Jacobite and going to be. I don't want to be a bit. Sorry. I'm so sorry. No, but I'm really sorry. I don't have to do that. I just can go. I'm so sorry about that. I really didn't mean to let me and she she's fix it or if it's their problem, I think, no, I haven't done anything wrong. They're being jealous because of whatever situation they felt they deserved or entitled to something that they want, and they're just Pissy about their own issues. This has nothing to do with me in which case I can just go. It's not my problem. It's not my problem. I am not Jacko bait because your jealous of this little bit of success that I've had here. That is your problem and I can hunter up and what's so exciting about it is that now in my life if something's not going well, I think to myself, I think I'm being to hunter where I need to be more gathering or I think I'm being to gatherer usually where I need to be more hunter, and I start to say putting everyone else over the process and what needs to happen for me to move forward and for this to be great, or am I going hell bent for leather for this and somehow not listening to people, and I'm not taking that on board. And what this means is I've sort of cute it myself of this neurosis through looking at the model through this world, but also please, please never fucking leave me out of brunch. Hello. Hello is just for to queue here. Sometimes I host this Losch guilty feminist. That's where you might know this voice from I have my own podcast is all about eating called hoovering. So I'm just interrupting to tell you that I've got my first ever lied show live hoovering in Manchester with stars from Coronation Street bay cough on the smash hit podcast, all killer. No filler, naturally, they're all women brilliant ones that that that will be eating and laughing occasionally at the same time come and join us Saturday, six Octo ber at lunchtime, of course days go to Manchester podcast festival dot com. And if you use the secret code vacuum, you get fifty percent off. The one. Patron. Flu. Right. Okay. I'm gonna sing a couple of songs. And and this this is from it's an old song zero. Years and years ago, but I've kinda re recorded it for this with a new arrangement. And this is the one keast introduction to song that I have. It's true. So I wrote this song because when I was doing my English able, I was studying Shakespeare's Othello and I wrote a song about the play. Yes, I did water. Nope. Is anyone anyone familiar with the Celo. Shakespeare funds ought to be. Often hopping someone went. Fair enough. But it really stayed with me the story of Philo for years and years and years later I was in this relationship that I was very insecure about an we'll probably talk about on because temper said, you wanna come onto the show that's themed to do with jealousy. I said, wow, the chance to make myself look awful in front of the biggest platform ever play too. Sign me up. So this is cool. The Argo which is reference to a not to the. The power in the Disney film, a lot in. And you would be surprised how many times had to clarify that one St.. No, that a mile stunner be. Always trying to records in front of me. Doesn't needed. It is own on the stunned good every some of force your Jiansu. Succumb confront me. A myself. Your me. In your head. You lay. So. Silimo show every Toma hold heard selling me. I'm never gonna make the grade selling me. I'm stupid count is self deluded. If things go Ma, happy ends in may. Every time he calls it ends up pitiful. He stuns around. He doesn't help me out. So it's it. I'm just running out of time and she's heading for the crime. When let myself break my call with own sue hums, put a bullet in the head of the great room months of my life. The. Oh. The only one left to lie. Since I'm such, you still have the energy. Cepeda things I met. Every some eats like me in you. It's like you drown out the low going off inside of me. Nothing, sir, and seeing. Soling. In your. So. Lizzy sits on my shoulder every Tomo hold hurt, selling me. I'm never gonna make the grade selling me on stupid cards, self deluded. If a think Gama Hoppy and soon made every cools pitiful stunts their around. He doesn't help me out sold this some subs. Just running out of time. She's having crime wet. Pray with sue hums, but a bullet in the head of the great room of my life. Don't know the real. Would be the only one left law. He'll be the only one. It'll be the only. He knows the Ma own worst una me. Thank you. Another form of jealousy experience. A lot of the time is jealousy. I have for people who seem to know what the fuck they're doing. Is anybody with me. Just fucking hunting. Any song about imposter syndrome gimme shot. If you've ever suffered from impulses syndrome. Yeah. And I think we all have, I think so. I think the only people who have never felt like they were a bit unqualified, what they're doing. People like Donald Trump, who you just don't want in charge of anything. You want people to be sort of taking stock of whether or not. So anyway. One? No. When when I turned thirty, I was saying to my dad, I love my dad very much. He's really cool and Saint him at harm. I'm not sure don't feel ready to be thirty eight Leisa very grownup number still feel like I'm about sixteen my dad who's like sixty eight now was like, yeah, me too. Okay. So it is literally just fucking light one day. You feel like a grownup, isn't it? You know what I mean? I think if anyone here is younger, you want spoiler. If you're waiting for the day that you feel that you've got to figure it out just doesn't fucking all that happens is you reach the day when you stop waiting day. So song about that, and it's good. Nobody knows. I'm a fraud. Because until the frauds. And so my own gigs attend to feel like I'm like, this is not a massively contentious question. No shame here the give me a shout if you can see yourself a lefty. Cool. No shame but good. Just good in terms of how much you enjoy this. I am a lefty, but I'm also I'm quite shit lefty. And I know this because I've been told by better left on Twitter. Because that's the way the world fucking wax, isn't it? So it's also a song about not being left wing is everybody thinks choice over purchasing. He's supposed to be perfect. PM chooses often as you might expect. I only live tweet questions time for comedic effect. And on the feminist. I've never read Virginia Wolfe for any girls. So BreX. Nobody knows that I moved through. It's often been alleged the Armas hard left is can be, but my idea of itchy is an unknown brand of tea. Even Secchi loans. Every free pudding knows. I move. Cincy lot feel adored and I'll never anything a think you won't look lewd might not always be the truth, have three and nobody knows. Nobody knows that I move. Well, dressing, how do a find the often get missed by roughing novel funds who took me on the way on look. But I just buckman shirts. I've never read coming. Buddy knows that I moved from. When people cool me a musician that makes my poems perspire took great one, and I never go if I this cap. Oh, then you all see the liar pudding. Sincere. Good. Sell you anything think you. Not always the truth. They didn't have three. Nobody on the. Putting. Sometimes I get so scared that we're losing. I'm just so sure will never win. So not good for refusing. Well days life feels like a play that you have not rehearsed, but one thing's true. All of us sharing this universe is we could all be doing better and we could all be in worse. And everyone you know, feels like a fraud. Nate since you feel adored but never excelled in anything you'd think I want. I want to always be the trip three. Nobody knows that on the. Not always speeded. Schrief vide- do have three. Just Celts Cup spoke. Wait. His no pudding. Hollow guilty feminists. Debra here, I wanted to let you know that our own Greece Petri is on tour around the UK wonderful show, don't miss it. Go to grace, Petri dot com to find dates near you. Felicity ward is also talk, oh, to Felicity ward dot com to find out where she is and as always go to help refugees dot org to find out what they need just for secure an iron Kelly today, Monday and we are working with the women's center on. We'll have a podcast about it for you. When we get back, we are trying to get t shirts together with help refugees so that we can support them pleased on Email tweet an ask us when they will be ready. We don't know yet, but we will let you know when we do in the meantime, go to road hyphen from hyphen Damascus, dot co. Two u k to get one of our guilty feminist collections necklaces. They make Christmas presents if you'd like to see, say my name, we will be at the live. Film festival on towbar fourteenth. And we will be at the Cardiff international film festival in October as well. Check out both of those festivals to see when say my name is going on sale. It's screwball comedy that I wrote and have a cameo in produced by woman fiber strong woman in the lead. I think you're really going to enjoy it. If you would like to see it where you are hush, say my name movie and let us know and we will encourage distributors to bring it to you if you'd like to see my late nights to recall channel four show next week's news. If you don't like this week's news, let's try and change it in time for next week's news channel four and ask them when it will be on hashtag next week's news. I am also a contributor to the amazing pink protests. Book feminists don't wear pink and the lies. It's a five years collection of essays by various contemporary feminists, and I'm hosting an event for feminists. Don't wear pink with scarlet. Curtis on the third of October at the Lowry in Manchester, and I'm a contributor to another. Event on the fourth of October in London at the Rio cinema, please buy tickets for one of those. If you would like to, I would love to see you them. And finally, we don't sell advertising on this podcast. We don't offer Paci on and we don't have any other revenue really except for selling tickets to events. And we do it every week of the year. We never take a break and we would love your help and support and the best way you can do that is to buy my book, the guilty feminist. It is my view on contemporary feminism and how we can build a better world one that we all want to live in a try to include interviews to make it more intersectional. I hope you'll really enjoy the book if you would buy it in hardback would really help us keep the puck cost going. You can get it at Waterstones other good bookshops. See it's on sale. No straight here as well as code at UK if you're absolutely have to. But if you could get a copy, it's in hardback, it's about fifteen quit, and it would really, really help us. Keep the podcast going. Thank you so much, and we really appreciate it. We want to keep the content free and I hope that you find the book of great value. And now back to the podcast. Has anyone got feminist teasha I forgot to ask at the beginning of the front row. Anybody else putting wearing showed up. Just fine. Very good question. You could be silently those things, but it's multiple pleasant for the people around chief anybody else. What is that? What you're tissue says. On Wednesdays, we smash the patriots. Yes, I feel it should be on Mondays because that's the day. The cost comes out. Why is it Wednesdays egos. On Wednesdays, we wear pink. Right. My her. Oh, it's main goes. It's literally the gathering movie. Well, I can't believe I missed that. Well, I'm gonna make t shirt that says on Mondays, we must the patriarchy. Do we all going to start doing t shirts? Actually, we all just because we had them, but it was like a whole thing. Two things. One is keeping them and all the sizes like you'll gap which we're not. And Secondly, I just felt uncomfortable about putting feminism Latisha selling it. So we've made an arrangement with help refugees the way they do. Their t shirts is a SaaS print them to order an ace us handle all of the sizing and everything and the money. The profit goes to help refugees. So I'm like, we can do that. And that way we don't carry them and we don't profit from them, but everyone's still gets to have a t-shirt and kind of fill in the club so that you see someone else not shut. He like high five. Yeah. No, it's good. It just makes me feel quite bad about the fact that my own grace peachy shirts literally only profit me. That's that's fine. There's nothing with your tissue, say, grace Petri. They don't say that though. I think. And that's different from feminism as you go into somewhere like gap and they're like, feminists fun, and you're like. Who made that does feel to say? Well, yeah. And like talk of doing like Bob Dylan, t shirts, and do you know what I mean? Yeah. Which way? I just I'm not judging anyone else for doing. I'm a bit, but I'm not really. I just thought what's a nicer way of doing this. And also it came up Kosei Steve Allee. Who of, you know I've talked about in, he's on up land. He's a Syrian refugee and he learned to be a silversmith. He was an architect in or Arctic student. He likes me say no architect. It was an on student at the university of Damascus when the war broke out, and it was a kid will be killed situation. So he left when he got the jungle Hilo to be a silversmith. And he started off because there was no materials and he missed his. He would always have beautiful civil jury, and he left it with his mom. He said, the thing is I got in the dingy with my life but thought leave the jewelry. Because what if it drums. Janey will he did that? He was like, no. So he didn't have any jewelry. So he started using things like nails and things. You could find it a refugee camp, electrical wiring and stuff to make his own jewelry. And he learned from other people in the camp were silversmiths and he started this whole company. It's called road from Damascus. I came up with the title and. So I commissioned from him some necklaces. So they really made silver necklaces that say, guilty feminist and there's another design his doing for us as well. That's part of our guilt from his collection. That's right. We have a collection, it's the would woman Nara BIC. And so that's the sort of more if you're one of those people that doesn't like people knowing what I mean like you don't want to be too on the nose. You get the woman one, which is the secret one. And if you're just out now, I'm a guilty feminist. I'm proud of it. You get that one. Well, you get both different days, different feelings moods. But I also want is like closeted. A little bit, but I also want him to do one. You remember those woman who came on who was teaching people Chinese? Yeah, we will breaking down the Chinese symbol feminism, and one of the woods was Genda and I said, how that breakdown that she said the sun for gender is the birth of your heart. And I was like, isn't I know right? And I was just that beautiful for transgender people. The both you'll harness all the both of your body. So Steve can make that Nicklaus the both of your heart as gender. And I just think that's just so beautiful and half of the prophet will go to Steve's continuing education. So he can start doing a degree again and the other half will go to his mother's project. His mother is a refugee in Turkey, and she always took refugees in when Steve growing up because Syria had more refugees than anywhere coming in. And he always said his mother used to say, I would hope someone would do it for you. So he said to me one day, I don't know if you believe in commerce, identify but even comma. But that's what my mom always said to me. And so she's got a project in Turkey that helps women who are refugees get Croft because often they've had amazing jobs and careers and things, but then they turn up somewhere that speak the language that don't always have papers. So if they can do something like become a silversmith and sell those products, it's like a beautiful thing where they're keeping across alive and also they're able to sell something. So please go to it's road hyphen from hyphen Damascus, dot co dot UK. And you can see that the guilty feminists collection, which I hope will grow. I don't know what the name of that project is, but it'll be an Arabic and Turkish. It's more like her local project rather than being like a mini NGO or something like that. I say that was such a lovely of inquisitive in sensitive heckle neon. The other one we had aunt host. Pretty covering by then the spectrum that Hori I'd like to support this small grassroots project and Turkey. I'm going to need the website and. Today's guest is a comedian actor whose career started by could grove. Anthem deck started. It is PJ and Dunkin is how they used to be known. PJ compe-, Duncan, let's get ready to rumble will let's get ready to rumble right now because I'm next guest is a new cost, a local. Please put your hands together and make extrordinary Jordi were hearing noises for seventy. Me moms in. You're right. I'm gonna tell you some probably to intimate stuff about myself on the FEMA of jealousy whilst will plea Manulife and terrify, itchy, very coal. That will happen. I was a little bit stall the by saying, I was single for six years, and I don't mean no to six. It was. Twenty two to twenty. That's the twenty one. Single it did lead to the Google search. Can you get industry white finger from vibrator misuse. But it's all right now. 'cause I managed to Trump Amman a huge net and he conned escape. Big tip for anyone who feels like the do, need him out in the lives, an Alaskan one condensed history. What you need to do is right at Komen to money somehow by a house outright and then charge them no rent to live in it, and he's really got to want to leave that situation financially. He's got away that one for a while. I am living here, rent free, but I do know it's fine. I'll get on with it. So we've been together for phone off us, but it's great and it was really, really, I'm not bragging. I'm not bragging got boyfriend Bracken I. Prawit Trump's off. He just does. Dog. But it was nice because I was single for so long. I mean, not I was quite worried about this. You, you'll understand Jodi none as the worry terribly when I was sixteen and not pregnant or wedge shaped was sweating. Needed to greet. I some you're on to not works now. She thought I was vegetarian lesbian. It was very confusing. Time phenomena. But it was literally because I gotta take this real mom who didn't technically pay to be, and I was like, none other this boy friend isn't that nice, isn't that excitement? She loves him. Absolutely. Loves shows by some special chocolates. And I think she's so fun season. That's nice. None. I need remember that I will could to bitch. And hey, osteoperosis will just play into my hands. She'll crumble dosed in the wind. Gets his onto me. Problem of a little problem. You say it, it's dwells in me very soul. And so now the gates every thought a half is jealousy ferry jealous person. I'll give you an example of this. Recently. My partner was having a shit. An Italian, the mole, and this one. This one just seemed to take a little bit too long. And in fact, few minutes extra Taiba had convinced myself that what he was really doing was face timing and new woman. And the reason I couldn't hear anything through the dole while she was death. Any Huckabee and stay an extra woo to help with the workload secretly being doing sell at night to talk to death, bitch, FaceTime, claiming big, shake it whilst on all that. Poison. It's really hard like when I'm in front of lovely people. Like when I'm on stage when I'm doing comedy, I feel like I can just tell the truth under, say things every mouth, it's fine. It's like a safe space can just get away with it, upset some awful things on stage. All true. Terrible. But when I go home, that's when I have to stop pretending that's when the starts because I'll have to pretend not to be fully insane. I have to be like, okay, free isn't life wonderful. My mind isn't ricocheting off its own shell with Foltz of what you're doing with the wait a minute. I just love you. So he comes home from work and I'll be like, Hello. If you had a nice day. Would you like lovely roast chicken. And he'll say something like, look, actually, I've been with Sarah from. Because the last thing my Breen hood. Sarah. Sarah, that's the woman's name. Oh, Sarah, but I have to become a swollen face has to become the head of the swan. Just gliding peacefully. Not smile and Sarah, but me brain is very much the feet of the swan beneath the surface Jost gun ACA. Sarah who Sarah, she young she. Oh, she's not to NT's. That's. Oh, that's nice. It doesn't shave toes yet. What's that? She makes a cook potato. Just like, sit happy for you. Is lovely, say Reta. She helped nice hair. Does she have much underway Orissa era. Let's go for dinner together. I'm sure we'll be best friends. Go to come you. Okay. About rebuke custody and try hit very high. No shit cells. No. I'm going to do. I'm going to get my friend. My friend stop Buchen where you both work and I'm gonna give my friend jokes. Drugs to in Saratov handbag. Then I'm going to call the police and say, you know. Syra who works there? No flee hair much underwear where the beach. His dealing drugs to kids. And then when the Komen and drug out by lovely hair. Let's say. Would you like a rice pudding after. I'm gonna leave now and check upon by. Sabi talk that everybody. So join us towards Tournus tummy. So we've both declared a little bit about how we fade about Jetta say. You you have to know. We jealous child. I've really put the work in for this episode of the feminist podcast by being jealous from birth. It's a very unique situation, but who stay with us on this one. I'm an only child. What really. On me dot though needed competition because I didn't have siblings. So what? Hey, dates from me being a bout two years old was invent a sibling. An imaginary sibling was the same age as me who was better than everything. Really, and that's comedy. No, and my therapist will attest. Lovely new call. Did he say this child was real elsewhere? She seemed real to me was called Sean. If anyone called show and now ripple just deal with. So she was coached Sean. I'm so your dad said you SIS to show him would do she can ride a bike? Yeah, that came up. Sorry, that was just the for instance, I didn't mean to tricky. Trick owning fictional siblings. It used to incite me to hurt her what's wrong. So at go and try and could limb and he'd be like no econ because shuns here a lovely cuddle. So Jesus crooked. It's really nice to help out because you for a long time going. Oh, that was just to let you do. I'm Canadian. I notice on your ankle. If it's okay to say you have mom and dad's do tattooed on your own cool. From that. He was lovely. Is that what to show on touchy around co. My dad's just got Sean. That wouldn't surprise. Oh, oh, of again. But it was anything so go nine ten on his spelling test. He would look at it and go shown, got ten to the point where the day I got my level results would still going yet. I've been really ill in the lead up to my levels. I missed about three months of school hospitalized the lot. So I got three bays and had really wanted three as my dad looked. Results sheet went Shangaans three as an honest just felt the tears. Well, in my Eddie just meant as a joke because he knew how much it bothered me, but I was a co. She did. I now have a theory because I know you semi that you did have Sean and you killed him. We roll thinking, I, I'm the narrative, you have now, but she was always imagine, race Rita. Did you have how you Sean? Did you have siblings siblings? Yes. I'm the youngest. Four. I am just sickeningly spoiled. By my whole family and the best example, I could tell you about my life. Long relationship with Josie was when I was very small for young, I should say. It's never not funny. If you're listening at home Grace's, Sarah, small small, how totally you grace. I've never measured myself. I think I'd find a depressing experience. Could. Sorry, continue to provoke jealousy behind fine, sewing. Sorry, wake wanted anyways where it stems unavailable. Grades. Shawn's Toler than you do. If you if you listening at home, grace has had to go and give some. I'm five, nine, two, half and Sean, I know is only five, seven. The. No. So when I was little, I had this red bowl that would have my cereal in the morning and I was the only one four kids why anyone how to read bowl. Presumably because of the qualities I display in this story. But when we we went on holiday to France with our cousins, big family who's the same number siblings us already close up that we were staying in Jeet in France and our member, I was probably I think my memory is the I was this was before school. So I was like three or something, three or four. And I remember my parents being very specific about the woods near the Jeet. You couldn't go in them because there was snakes adas in the woods. If this is true, I think. And I was like, yeah, that's cool that it's been really impressed me about the in the woods. And then one day I came into the kitchen and my cousin was eating cereal. Gasps from the audience. I know what's coming. From my fucking red bowl. Inks from my red bowl and my own t. in ignorance of the rules of the right bowl has Sunday feeding. It's fine, and he was hitting the red bowl and didn't kick off at INSEE. Anything. Just walked out and kept it all inside. And then the moment that the red bowl was unattended. I took it into the snake infested woods. And buried it. Nice truth buried the bowl of being used by someone else. So there's no point. So could anymore no risk the snakes. Debra. Was like, if I die. This transgression will not stand. Have you written a song about this? No, yet go this whole concept albumin it to be raised. There is out as in the bowl. Yeah, yeah, serial killer. No, it is. It's chilling, isn't it? Yeah, it feels like something that would be like the intro, power graph on serial killers, Wikipedia patriots, to be honest, neither of you coming out, Greg childhood profiles, you jealous? No, I wasn't. My sister was four years older than me, and I desperately wanted her to love me and be friends with me. But you know, when someone's four years old and they cut four years clever and so I was always a bit like she was eight and I was four. She was twelve and I was, and I do remember. I mean, that's how time I didn't want to say. You know what I mean? If your twelve year old, but she's to invent games to ignite jealousy. So one was Bobby gymnastics. So I'll bobby's would have gymnastic tournaments, and hose would always win because she was the judge. And one Christmas, we got this really beach FU sort of like handmade Swedish Dole's house, which sounds like we would rich we want, but it was like a big deal that we go to. It came from our elf, but that's a different story. We had that we used to entertain anyway. We make policies. It was like a family thing, the the Davis notes, and then we would leave the note for the elf saying, we got a plan your party tonight. So tell your friends and we used to make out of tin foil and like little bits of mosh. Right. I was a whole bowl for the elves and then we'd wake up in the morning and the elves would have had a good time and wrecks the place left us. Thank you very much work time. It's your own elf pie. We will. I hate to break this to. I think I think it was out parents doing it, like leaving the notes in tiny writing and and messing up. The policy has the reason we went invited this. We would have been disappointed to see no elves. And I'm so glad he invented elves in mine, invented siblings, Mehta, well, sorry. Yes, yes. Now I do see now that seems. So I hate to tell you this. I am shown. Twist. So it was kind of a record deal that we got this lovely house, and it was the kind of thing my mother would would by how does sort of flip top very simple sort of Dole's and stuff. My sister invented a game, she would have the Dole's in the Dole's house, and I would have to cut in rails onto the onto the pedals of the piano. And that would be my house and the cotton reel Dole's just drew a face on Coton real spicy little cut rails, and the game was cold. Richmond, Pullman. Very, very gendered looking. Why wasn't it rich family, poll family. I don't know. It was called Richmond Poelman. She invented and the game win. Like this fancy dolls, house family would come over and say, would you like to come over the cotton? Reels would come out from unto the. Pedals of the piano go, and they would give. My reservoir of the house. It was lovely all the brooms. And then I'd say, can we come to your house and go? Yep. Come over and go, ooh. This is great. That was the full game, my sister and I still love about Richmond Poelman, but she was just older. I'm clearly notice ocean. Skinny Sates very closest. This game. Yeah, monks would have a fucking field David. I mean, seriously, that was because she was a child and she was just trying to me. That's more excusable though. My my dot went to extreme lengths to wine me up because he thought it was good for me and I had to call the police phones. Did you to Sean break-in. It was so defense step off night best. No, we were playing frustration. You know the boat game with the love that we call that trouble in Australia trouble. Hey. He kept getting sixes because he was Rubin's look, most tush on it. Now. It wasn't a pocketed one. It was the one on east face. It was faced on the carpet Ruben. He's looking most shell and the dice and everytime coming up sixes. Now I was getting more and more no heed. So he felt this was more and more brilliant to the point where I just simply had to call the police. Did you. Owners old, they didn't think I would know how, but I did get through an essay. It's not fair. My dad's using logic to win frustration. Did the officers come? My mom got the phone at one hundred went, I'm sorry. She told her the phone and she's only four dot is using much. Shoulder sort of thing at the pulse now, just to be clear. Yes. She much more successful comedian. As enough. So forgive him Dodd to an extent when you said that, honestly, I could feel the company issue isn't she? She's been on live at the Apollo. She's in comedy. I don't know. Just to be certainly can. If you're listening love your show and we love you. But my friend wicks shields and she is from nicer now. That's gonna be my new pundit at night. Cheat on me the most successful community. Oh my gosh, right. Well, that's what we didn't know. Think women on train to be more jealous. Do you? I mean a, you have been trained to be jealous specific, not just by the patriot keep up by your actual Patea. Very specific. I mean, that's almost too good example. I think men don't compare it as much as women. I think as soon as a woman does something, she's like the last woman who did it where so many men get to have goes at things. Yeah. Just notice when I did the week, some people would writing the directly comparing to another woman that they've seen on the show and they won't tell you that you'll better or worse than another woman in their opinion, but they not comparing it will the menu sitting next to do you know what I mean by that? Do you get compared to other women? Are you more likely to get compared to a female folk singer or an ubt folks is similar thing, but my pet hate is like the female something. Do you know what. Do you know what I mean? Like I get the female, Billy Braga Gallo on Reno. Nevada me the female. I did it only the female. Any said you right? Kinda Bill show. The Bill show. Pedigree to be only person if they were in a body swapping film a three way, what he's pink film and they just bought into a fortune cookie is the lightning struck. They all swap to one around and specific film we're talking about, isn't it? They were in freaky Friday. Let's just shade. It's a niche film. I will grow you because you miss mingles Lindsay Lohan points back now. I can only feel a man can be his own posting a sphere. Oh yeah. But if you'll riphil Joe, you must get compared to other female judges. If you were female research scientists, musket compared to the famous woman rather than just getting compared to other people in your field will. I think it's still the factor like manages the stunned it so much of the time. So like many of his gig where they were like, oh, we've got a month for the. Do you know what I mean? That's how well you the only. The only person in yet. I don't worry about it. I think if I haven't got a month for the Bill, I mean on the feminist feel any pressure to put him on the Bill, global pillage, grown-up land, which I do think we've had a very female heavy shows on a haven't booked guest in a little while. I know I'm in the minority and I know also I have an unconscious bias. Somebody said to me for show that I was booking. Can you book more guys? 'cause you're cooking. We want to appeal to men and women, and I was like, well, they never worry about that. It's the other way around, but. Okay, fine. They was suggesting some names who will white strike is, I'm sure very good. But I realized that I was kind of like, I don't really know these guys. Are they going to be funny? And I realized because I never see white straight men be funny because all of the shows I, I just in my head, I went gonna be funny. They gonna be talented, other going to be good, and I went, oh my God. I've got the opposite bias that all. Of the people who book comedy clubs have because they don't see women befuddle very offense. They like, and they saw one once and she was uncomfortable in the Bill because she was the only woman and she wasn't introduced properly and Bubba, or she just had an off night or she wasn't very good. And then they've made an assumption that all women are going to be that. And they've just already decided, and I just realized I was like, I've got the thing where I just it's not that I'm sure, white stripe. All funny, always just like an apologist. I just I just don't see any evidence of it. I don't. I haven't seen it. I haven't seen it, and I was there was a guy that just dumb thing with and I was like, he's good. No him. He's great. We can have him. And I was doing thing that they do, which is, I know women who's funny, we'll put her in. That'll be the funny one. And I did exactly that from white straight men. I'm in a climate and I've written about this in the book that guilt from his micro-climate where women do well just know when I've had. Own occasionally, I've seen it happen the audience polite, but the response, the response that you gave grace on that you gave Sammy in the you gave me you find out said, and now this guy, this is what happens. The audience go the noise so they'll go kids. But I see them sort of slightly stiffened and they just leaned Ford like, we'll hear you white man, but you better have something to say. See the going often make joke that goes a bit wrong or something, and they're sweaty, and they look like the woman on the panel of goes to a hundred us what it is just the Eastone from less than zero to you know what I mean? I just feel like a feminist. That sounds lovely. Hopping more often. Yeah, it's the texture of support that breeds and builds confidence. You've talked about being jealous, romantically semi, and you've talked about being jealous Kate. Do you feel that in a professional realm, do you feel like your pitched against women? There is a professional jealousy sometimes. Do you feel that thing of? I definitely do bait, and I think it subtly because my conditioned faced response to everything is jealousy, everything because of how I was broke. My gut reaction straightaway as jealous and then go pleased for you have to. It's the primal brain kicks in and does the jealousy and then the learned. Well, read nice person trying to be hostile. Nope, that is good for her. And we all pleased about and I am, but I only really feel I think it's because my best friend's comedians, I think if good cool. Seventy. Phony losses can be very pleased for their success because it doesn't affect my not sounds horrible, but might be true. But my very good friends comedians. If they're afforded an opportunity that I'm an think it is because it's rare for women. My instant reaction is why did she get didn't? And then after go, which is my mate, and I'm really happy for. I am genuinely happy, but it doesn't stop the beast. It just so go heights, pay precious, precious. I know exactly what you mean. And I think it's about I read trying to find this now by old Krisher Manca climates because you know what they make us think there's only one spot at the top for a woman. Yes, exactly. You help someone else. She'll get it and you blown and one, they keep that thing with his three or four women allowed on the telly or this three or four women allowed in these spots, whatever your industry is that how many female CEOs in your industry, how many that's what they do. They go, oh, there's anyone's. Am I hear women in the corporate world talking about this, how many women all there on the boat. Let's be honest. This twelve people on the board, one of them's woman. So if I start helping you what if you'll better than me and then you get the next time, a woman dies, and there's another one allowed on the board. You're going to get. So why am I helping you? So I'm bitter helping guys and making allies of men because they can do jobs for the boys. They can do scratch each other's backs. We have to stop that as women. We have to start scratching each other banks because that's how they do it. They all help each other out the letter. They invent the louder. They build another Landa together and they give each other legs up and women are going hold on. I couldn't possibly. It would be unfair for me to give another woman spot. People are gonna think that I'm helping women through or you're gonna get it and I'm not. We've got to stop that collectively. I'm not saying you feel you have to stop that grace. I know what you do. You don't help any women in folk. I fucking down. That's what I do. You should write a song about them, but it's, I mean, they literally have it's cold. The old boys club we need. We need a new old. Does clubs need a new network? New goes network? Yeah, honestly thought you said news, girls, network that outside website thought away from. Guilty. Does anyone have any questions they wanna throw about jealousy about feminism in general, where grace, Scott, waistcoat. Anything like that. You don't have kids every time. Maybe, but I don't pay most of my clothes. I suspect to all the questions going to be about Sean. Please can we not focus on tonight. All the hands of gone down. Hi, thanks for coming to the northeast. Thank you. We will be coming back. You'll the nicer toady, Evan, great. I was wondering if you have any tips or stories on dealing with jealousy when it's with your friends and kind of being jealous of the people who already close to you, and then they have successes and possibly in your actor neutral. Also, I love you. Is it goal Vidal who said it's not enough for me to exceed my friends fail. Think he also said every time a friend of mine, a little piece of dies, and I remember the day that he died, tweeting. Someone have won an Oscar. The way I see it is whenever friend of mine succeeds and this industry is so ostentatious when someone succeeds, you can't miss it. But what I was thinking is if it can happen for someone I know and hang out with and have coffee with, then it can happen for me. It makes it real to me. So I remember when fleabag got on television, it felt like, oh, televisions possible for women. It felt like what someone I know that I hang out with that. I've hung out with had drinks with Brown that made me believe again, because I started to think it's not really possible. It's for the people it's for men. It's not for me. So I think that's a great way to look at it and also ask them what things they did. If they've got something that you want off their advice, everyone loves to be an expert. It's the most complimentary thing you can do and state is raising you can do is to ask someone for advice to know what I mean. Like when Joey asked Rachel. My little sister was be in fashion, and she wants to talk to an expert and she went, oh, I guess I also wanna my bosses and he went, no, I won't talk to you and she went, oh my God. I'm the expert. I'm because we'd grown up with rate show seen her pouring the coffee and being lost full like a big moment for all of us. Grace. When Phoebe from friends exceed singing in the coffee shop to you feel a little piece if you come along. I feel very seen by. I was just going to say that. I think it's true about this industry that we're in. We're in slight different interests. He said that when someone succeeds it's various tastes. But I think that increasingly because of social media, it's like that for everyone. I think I had a funny thing where the last time I was single and I got over relationship. Sometimes you really focus on a relationship and then when it's over, you look up all of your friends have gone. And then there was someone who I wanted to make friends with. I kept seeing that she was posting all these great pictures on Facebook, and I was like, she's just having the best life ever the best time. And then we became really good friends. Now, she's one of my best friends and you know, she sits me the, she felt like she didn't really have any friends enlist before. And I think that that's quite an interesting. I'm really aware that like these days. As like, it's probably worse if you're in any way like in performance, but I think it's true like the internet makes us all into performers, and I think you're supposed to be like your brand. The all the time is how great everything's going. Do you know what I mean? You're like its first verse Ray and with drinking champagne and like selfie buy my first house, like an all this stuff. And I like make your real point of trying to tweet that, like I'm having like this shit day having the worst time because I think it is really like we can all get lost in. And I think that like something that I realized a few years ago, like January is anyone who is trying to be a musician. We'll tell you John raise the worst time because you are trying to get booked festivals. You're applying for festivals festivals. The Endel you're so focused on vegetables and you're sitting there waiting for the phone to ring. You've sent thousands and thousands of allegations festival's coming in all around you. Oh my God. Everyone is just waiting just hunt. The best thing confirmed don't tell you what it is yet, but best Kigoma life hashtag Conway for the summer. Oh. Something that I realized a few years ago and it's related to voice thing is it's so easy to look around at everyone be like everyone is doing better than me so easy. The easiest thing in the world, I think social media, excess specs so much, but what helps me is to think that like there's always someone thinking about you don't know it, but there's always someone somewhere in the cone of someone looking pice game. Fuck, she's got all. I think we're all in this like same nozzle together. It's like not to quit your lyrics back at you. But if that last saw, we say we could be doing better. We could be doing were found that a very poignant lyric because that's the truth and I will die that way. I will. All I could have done better on a could have done was all day. Oh, get up. I mean, if I'm able to get up, I think you did. Hi, I'm good. Yeah. What if I got to in the morning afternoon. And that day I'll could've done better. I could have done was when I accept that. I'm just so much happy. 'cause I just, oh, so today I'm doing as well as I can if I'd push to Honecker's better. But you know what look at what I did do, and it's a really nice thing to do some. Do you have some wise words to sum up to some of the whole thing? No, I'm not. I would say about that as all I think is if myself into a particularly doc Nesty coverage, oh, is if it's best my if I had something I was really happy about really pleased about. And some odd worked really hard for. I'd want her to be on my side. So if it's the other way around, I know she needs me to be her cheerleader. So I'll have to everything else to one side and go. I'm so happy for you. I support network and I am yo cheerleader. And this is brilliant because the last thing I'd want in the world is from ago can't tell some. She'll be really annoyed. So I think that's it's always I always try and flip it the other way around how would I feel if I was in that position and I think that's all you can do really and remember him gray said, is to somebody else you are in that position, somebody else wants what you have, and I think it's really easy. This friends of mine have had two kids and then like I'm off the grid like everyone's forgotten about me and I'm like, I know it feels that way. But also I tried to. Have children on. I couldn't say there were times when I will look at what you have and be like. That seems pretty amazing. So like whatever you have, not that I'm envying older view children by the way, neither ones. Most of them are horrible. And you all know if you have to, you know, which one's the harbor. Shown. And the hose. This is the bit where you make all the people, jealous grace patriot. Do you have anything to PLO? Oh, I'm playing in Newcastle at the end of October, and it has sold dismally. Say that say that nobody saying is fucking real. Any tickets left tonight. I refuse us about this. In the charade. It's real life man so much so. Well, some of them. The Cumberland homes on the twentieth tell you. What night is twenty. This is the best owning prepared for the love for the Cumberland. Uh-huh. It's nice to know, but wow, twenty eight. Toba you can get tickets at grace Petri call willy will be there. That shows. So it's always there. Eighteen capacity venue. To get in quickly because these other bitches and hos are going to get the tickets. We have said many times tonight. Oh, and also any record. It's queerest folk. I have some companies to flog outside, so I'm gonna be with the Waterstones type with the books. If you would like a book come there and grace will be next to me and we'll sign stuff, signed body points. If you prefer. I wish you would about consent before you. Before you lumbered me all I will sign buddy. Paul grace will judge. Shield, judge your body parts left breast better than right. Eight up ten slur, my character what's happening, right. They're semi. What would you like to plug also be stood at that table at the end? If you could just come and tell me hurtful things about show. That would really no rush mice. Where can we see? You will follow you that I'm on Instagram, some sunny tanks, a think my middle names Tinkerbell my initials rest. My damaged in many ways. On Twitter someting. So some ET Dobson I should have checked who I am before. We'll find you on. We can always put it in at the end. Okay, great. Yosemite Dopson onto it. I've got it. Ryan. Sammy t Dobson on Twitter. Great. And if you'd like to follow me, I'm Deborah FW on Twitter and I am also d- dubs with Zad on Instagram. I'm trying to post the more things now I made a film and it's called say my name and it's like there's all screwball comedies where the woman was the powerful halt. And she used to go around saying things like I can run a newspaper as well as the already amount. And I, I guess, as well as you are already mound, but guess me but don't, but don't. It's like that. And I thought, let's bring that Sean about, but it's contemporary. But the woman is the haunt of and she's the surprising one, and she's the one that knows how to get in and out of trouble on the guys kind of, you know, trying to navigate he's way with her. It's like a one night stand gone wrong. It's say, my name at the London independent film awards that just won best picture best actor actress. Just go into the Liverpool film festival international film festival. So I'm very excited distributors coming to look at it. If you would like to come to a cinema in Newcastle or wherever you are listening to this, if you say my name movie and say, hey, we'd like movie and we'd love to come hit. It was written by me, and I also have a cameo Anna. And it was picked up by female producer who was doing a Reese Witherspoon was sick of like the roles. She said, I'm playing moms and victims, and she was like, fuck this. I'm going to like an independent version of the spins doing and so she's also starring and she's great. Absolutely great. And I've just seen the final eight at I'm reading about also channel. Four asked me to make a satirical late night pilot for TV show called next week's news. And the idea of that is if we don't like this week's news, let's change it in time for next week's news. So we did a piece in the pilot about the nursing crisis, and we had an idea for how could fix it with the view as they haven't given us a date for the series yet, and people keep asking me about it. If you would like to see it channel four on Twitter and say, when will we see hashtag next week's news? And they will more likely pushed on the television if you ask them and they know there's an audience for it. Thank you so much. Can I just say you've been one of the best orders ever had? I just love you and I would play this audience every night. I would play this house every. So that keep coming out. Thank you for supporting the guilty. It's traditional that anybody who can and wants to stuns full. I will survive because this is how feminists church. I'm, it's like a him, don't think encouraged people want to. And then I feel I call 'cause normal to stall because with British. On this right. Can't never live without you. Know spent. Oh, so many. No, it's just thinking how you did me wrong, grew strong. What's with that? Sad. Look. Shoot, it Shays stupid luck. I shoot him to leave you. No, just one second. You'd be. What's you try me with get by anything. Being. As long as. God on nuts, live. Outgoing, give civil. The swing. Don't spend so many nights feeling. Sorry for myself. I used to cry. But no. And so you felt like Trump in expect made sippy free? No, I'm saving. What she want me with get by. Did he think. Did you think. God on my. God. Now there's an eight-minute instruments obeyed on the track. So what are they going. I think we should just. Gone to live gone. And now. Things. Guests go host patriot, especially don't. Music. Let's keep the spots shop. Repeat j. everyone on the state putting all of this thing about this and other say. Cise stay. Heard it in Newcastle. Only four hours, but that sounds that sounds like a hip hope. Does it classic. Okay. You get trigger wordings with life bitches. I thought you were going to. I thought she's piece of hip hope. You don't trigger wanting with life. You just get trouble. You just get strife. When things get dull, things get boring. No one's gotta gave you a content warning. When you need to come morning, but I went for people plaudits. It didn't make a lot of sets not an exciting that should always be the content morning, every issues. Every episode it'll sound time I want is my ringtone. Can you.

grace Petri fraud Sarah Sean patriots David Manchester Deborah Joan Crawford jackals Gareth Southgate Bracken I. Prawit Trump Fyona Thompson Dole London Jim Moret Steve Allee America
142. The Oratrix with Susan Wokoma and guests Adjoa Andoh, Morgan Lloyd Malcolm, Dr Farah Karim-Cooper

The Guilty Feminist

00:0-1 sec | 1 year ago

142. The Oratrix with Susan Wokoma and guests Adjoa Andoh, Morgan Lloyd Malcolm, Dr Farah Karim-Cooper

"I'm a feminist bought this week. I hosted the stylist remarkable women awards. And it was and I was so excited because I got to meet amazing women who were giving out awards receiving them including Annie Lennox. Who got the icon award? She was amazing. She came and talked about global feminism. She was absolutely incredible. And I met Fiona Shaw and Joji coma from I know, I know from killing as its national feminism giving it. It's so true. It's so true killing a and Fiona show. A so nice to me, and she was saying lovely things to me, and she was just like the best audience member of ever had because she sat right up the front and was laughing and saying to people she's really good in front of my face. And I've been a fan of hers ever since three men and a little lady. Oh my gosh. It's so good. She's so good in that. She's good. And then I talked to her and she said, she'd improvised a lot of the dialogues less forever. And Tom Selleck was just like you say, whatever your say funny. She said she was seventy Shakespeare's that year. This is veering off this now into Bartok, but. She said she does Shakespeare's that year, and she was just like in this absolute theatrical head space, and it was so fun because she just got to go off the leash and say mightier action. She upset brilliant. And there were people who we'd had on the guilty feminist like Toby he does the black ticket project. She wanted inspiration of women award and just absolutely amazing people Gina Martin who to the upscale campaign, and I was just sort of. I just felt so honored to be able to host their and be surrounded by feminism so much more than that. I cannot stop looking at the photos because the Styler Styler styled may and I got to woman. No, no, Blahnik shoes. Like, I was carry fracking Bradshaw. Oh, I got they didn't even they didn't even have still com. Somebody didn't hook and I got to wear Hugo Boss dress, which I can't forget the photos because I just looked so different in. I look like a different person. Like, it was a Hugo Boss stress. But I looked like it could be a model for next. A really look in that realm. I'm not making that up could be a size twelve to fourteen model for next question in not dress hundred percent, I now I changed into this white suit with Cape. I'm wearing the jacket off tonight with trousers and a constant repeat the photo some of the photos to be here in the Watson idea. Look at IT. Don't even care. I'm a feminist. But when I saw postive myself in show on I was completely convinced that they had photo shopped my belly's make until pop and I was convinced of upset you convince so I go in touch with the executives. Oh book, then he sent me picture of the original image. And yes my belly. But then I felt bad because I was like what is wrong with having a belly you stupid idiot. And then I felt bad because I call myself a stupid idiot that's inclusive language. That's no increase include language to be honest with you. I'm a feminist. Bart. One of the pictures are posted of myself. I also look like I've got a populate because I've just the way I'm standing at the stylist remarkable win awards identify mentioned, a hosted that but. I've posted it anyway because any Lennox smiling at me, oh, and that's the only one where she's actually looking at me because she came onto the stage. She did her thing. And then they wished her off the photos and put her into limousine. So I never got to have a photo like standing next to her hugging. We're best friends as was later in my writer, and so I am standing there. But I'm standing next to Keeley Hawes from the bodyguard, which I'm already excited about, but I'm sort of you know, when you realize you're being photographed and your bits dumpy bit slumpy. Don't even care any Lennox's looking right at me yet. Good like, she can see me with her eyes. I'm feminist, but I was recently in a restaurant in this with really rowdy all full group of men on a really rowdy all full stack. Do and I thought you know, what that looks talk. Love. I'm a feminist bonds when I come into spaces like we're in now, which is the Wanamaker theater and Shakespeare globe. I feel similarly I look back on like the Lord chamberlain's men Shakespeare's company, which under obviously only allowed men in and men had to pay all the female parts because women were not yet. A thing. I. I look back on that. And I feel the way you feel about that stagnant. Yeah. I think I'd love to have been in on that. I'd love to have been a playwright. I'd love to have been you know, sort of bursting into spaces and having all of the frankly, the massive confidence boost that must have come with being born to do things when other people were being born not to do things. It must have been a boost must not to be told as a child your the one who will go out to do things. Not you. It must have been massive ego boost and when they all got together and put their types on. There must have been a certain of robotic spark. There must have been a thrill creative thrilling citing sexual energy because creativity the sex very very close very closely. I find if you're doing one you don't need to do the other. If you're doing it can be too much. So I feel similarly I feel the whole world was that stagnate. Yeah. Up until about one hundred years ago, we came along. Yeah. And I feel now I feel now we the women and some men in this room, including non binary people who have come out to be here tonight. We are that doublet and hose wearing stagnant. Yes. My way take this space for tonight. We own the stage, we own all of these wooden bench seats with no box that quite what they're all sent check. They're also say. Saic already by not Centric, lower back pain. You're experiencing right now. If you caught walk the that is how they sell vintage is vintage Hain Trump. Ain't it and I'm a feminist spots. We are ready to solve the show. Nine from the south. Shakespeare's globe. We've made ever pro fights guests. Special. Goad? The tricks. Guilty feminists the podcast which weeks noble goals was twenty-first-century feminists and they hypocrisies and insecurities which undermine them. I'm Deborah Francis. White with me a Susan Macomer. And we are talking about the ARA tricks. So the ARA tricks is actually a word that Amelia Bassano Orlando Shittu names in her life because she was a woman. We're all just expected to leave one name at the door like coats and pick up another one on the way. I don't know why. But it's just the history of the world. Don't blame me blame the men that built this kind of theater and insisted on us changing our names, and we just think it's normal. It's not normal. Imagine. If someone might you change your first name. I'll go dog. I'm a feminist of mind is sub one baby change more. I it's Susan. That's bad season. Love your name. No, no, the isn or what would you prefer? Do. You know, what my little sister? She used to have a fake ID and on it. She put her name is shot today. And I'm not saying that I would want the name Sean tonight. But there was just something. This only about the choice that was like that's a choice in it. Susan does feel like a choice. It was like my mom to stumbled on it, but Chardonnays choice job. So we are talking about our tricks, which is the name that Amelia Lanier slash Bassano gave herself when she was arguing in court. And I think it was a word for a female orator. But it feels like our tricks. Do you know what I mean? Tricks. That's what I wish my first name was ARA. Tricks francis. White. Oh my God. But I wouldn't need the front. I just dropped the Francis. I just what fuck it. I'm dropping the white. I'm just aren't. Madonna. Why not our tricks? I am going to do a stunt up shackled aura tricks. Deborah Frances white Archer tricks. Yeah, it's good. Now that sell out it's already sold out. You a good at marketing. Spend a penny with enough she sold it out. The blink of an eye now Suzy I need to tell you this show. So we are at the Sam Wanamaker Shakespeare's globe theatre riot. The reason these Mike front-on amplified because they're not allowed to be. And also that needs to be because look at the acoustics just the ceiling is a Bethan. And there's no lights allowed no electric lights allowed. So it's candlelight only. And when these candles have burnt out the show is over. Okay. I'm a feminist. But I'm so glad that is kind to let because this is the most flattering lighting. Then decide. The reason we're at the sign want to make sure I mean, there's an accident. We've not accidentally stumbled into this space, not knowing what it was not knowing that we're not allowed to technology. I mean, you should have seen their faces when we brought these Mike skin. And they said can't you record the podcast the way they did in Elizabethan times. And I was like what like a pigeon takes the scroll to everybody all of the list. We've got too many listeners. Now, we've got too many listeners. So we've only been allowed these microphones on the condition that they don't work. Chris's out the back with his head in a box an illegal box that's full of technology and Hayes recording it all. So you will be able to hear your laugh, should you do them. But that's the only technology, but we're here to talk about two very magnificent shows both highly feminist and both spawned from the loins of the globe. Go really excited. Yeah. That's born from the little in the globe. But not the normal loins of the globe. Loins? No. Lady lawrence. That's right. My lines. My lines. My lady lady lines. That's going to come back. Song was originally an Isa-bey inside. The have to be sung by a in. Because you can not ten. Loots? The track was. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Featuring becky. No, featuring amyloid, Asano's husband Alfonso. Lonzo. He was a record of true story. True story. And a media is one of the carriages. We're going to be talking about tonight because she herself was massively Elizabethan when she wasn't being Jakobsen. That's right. She spun to areas. Did Shakespeare and make it into Jakobsen? He I think he kept telling me he just he dragged himself over that line was. Just didn't bother. He just died. Milania? She went the whole distance. She outlived him by twenty five years. 'cause I mean, she was just better in every way. I think that's not no. Show, you know. Shake copy his name when it so the cops do have his name this shit. Look, look there you go proof. Yeah. That's do. You think that was actually his yes? We'll just we'll on the side. No Shakespeare is also excellent. I know that's probably why thoughts on that the first one to say that. But I just want to say if we do to any mild ribbing of men here at the globe tonight is just a joke. Shakespeare, and if you're presumably this is where he haunts that. Because it's not exact location is roughly I think he's he's he's around night. I think he's poking his Ed through the window is like. Can I ask was roughly your first Elizabeth and pun of the night. Yes. Roughly. Susan Makoma is now going to give you some thoughts. And we'll give you some thoughts pros. Pros. Hi, guys. All right. Confession on I cannot stand. Shakespeare. Constan dim full disclosure. This was always case. I was always a husk of a human. So what happened before I can give a damn about? Shakespeare, I absolutely loved him. And I remember actually applying for national UCF when I was about thirteen and that's a youth company. Where you go every summer, and you do show you have a really good time. You had to prepare a kosco speech, and modern speech. And I picked Beth Beth, and I was like, yeah. I can be whoever I wanna be a compay anyone that I wanna be I'm gonna do MacBeth. I can do anything. I won God damn it. Full disclosure. We were starting at school. It was the only speech that I knew. Be lazy? It worked. I go in. So it's fine. See you later more with the story is that delusion is great anyway. So I love Shakespeare and had a really good time doing that did some Shakespeare theater we did much to do about nothing, which is fine. And that was great other absolute than that. And then I decided to take it seriously and go to drama school. Then I was told I was told lots of things we're told didn't have the right voice. I was told that I can breathe out my back because apparently that's what you meant to do to the breathe out your back. And I couldn't grow a checkoff bid say my life. Every time every time someone was doing some of Casco work. Everyone just had a bid. It was really as I oh God. I so quick to. Can do that. And then I got rumbled actually my Cosco text teacher what they do is. They all the teachers at the end of the year, they will sit around probably in a space like this. They sit around and they hold up a picture, and they go this one. And then they all give their thoughts on the actor in the year. They don't do the do and they will discuss you. And then you have one on one feedback at the end of the year, and my Cusco text teach came up to me. And she said, you know, what I feel like I failed you because the act to the the teachers described is not the actor in my clothes. And she asked me why. And I said, look, I don't feel very confident. I feel like you're 'cause his for people who can naturally get the rhythms of Shakespeare of the people of naturally, do lovely our people. He says a who can all breathe out the back somehow they got that memo. My mom didn't I was really on this, and it was actually quite an upsetting feedback session because I was admitting that I can do this. This thing the next year. We then go given the opportunity to do Shakespeare because that's what you need still can grow it. And I was going to pull the failure. And is being directed by the same teacher. So she said to me, she took me to one side, and we're going to do a little experiment. I'm going to ease off giving you technical notes. And I want you to approach the text how you would any character. So it's not. What the result was was the best failure that's ever been given. Full disclosure, the best failure that no one will ever see because as an in house production that twenty people saw one time in two thousand and nightside. You're just going to have to take my word for it. But it was a really successful thing. Of course, there was stuff that I needed to learn a with diction. So that you can be heard. There's no point me being on this stage in you not being able to hear me. But we both lands up from that. Which is you know, if you're connected to what you're talking about. Then hopefully, people get it right at the back then fast forward to just this Monday Cup days. Go direct to offered me a Shakespeare part, and I went to go meet him, and do you know? I don't know. Whether I can do this on very scared. I told him on my is told him that I cannot grow a cough bid, and you can get me breathing out with back, and he said, well, it's actually funny. I know someone who was in new year at drama school. You told me about the Fadia that no one will ever see. And how brilliant it was. And I have full belief that you can do this. So I will be doing my thirst Shakespeare par in London. Thank you, very very much. Our first guest today is an actor who is almost never for television screens. Now, you may know her because she has been a regular in casualty in regular in EastEnders. She's been in doctor who you can actually hear her on the guilty feminist audiobook, should you purchase it because she is playing the voice remarkably miraculously of every single person I interviewed. I'm reading the book and anytime, I'm interviewing talk to anyone else. She pops in with this. She's a master of different voices. She plays Susan Makoma in my book. And I thought she knew Susan because the voice was the same. It should. Yeah. I know what? Susan sounds like. And then tonight, inntroduced them. I was like I show, you know, her and she was like loop. I'm just really good advices. But she is hit tonight because she has co directed. The Richard the second here at the Sam Wanamaker theater at Shakespeare's globe in London and not only she co directed it. She is playing Richard the second this. Far as I know the first rich of the second with an old female cost and an old beim const. I know. The last time. I saw Richard a second. Kevin Spacey was in the role. It's quite a different production. It's the Richard a second. We need for this urgent time of Brexit on the septa dial. It's a remarkable show. Please welcome to the stage and make wonderful will who ING ground Ling extraordinary guilty feminists noises and welcome to the Mike at your Amdo. Obese women you see here. They the mothers grandmothers luffing supporters of all the members of our cost. All the members of stage management, fight direct voice coach design lighting design because he wants to have the women on whose shoulders we stand smiling down on us. So she go to Buckingham Palace. You might see Lord, blah, blah of England. Here you say lovely ladies of Huta. So. Yeah. So I came Michelle Terry the globe about something else and something else to work out. She said I've reached the second. It's the player by England. She said it'll be all over Brexit. I was like tasty. And she said director, and I was like you. And she said, how'd you said women of color? Right. Who's gonna pay Richard? I went. Direct to get who'd be good for that. And this Matt, and I know I will ask them onto co directed with because of just crazy so got my friendly net. Linton. Who's directed to play called sweat? That's just transferring the West End, and she's the new artist director of the Bursch twenty nine women of color. So did it between us, and I'm just going to do a little bit from Richard the second because it's tights and it survi- stock nights. And it's about just that thing of for me. People said, whoa. We all women of color. We were going to we're going to be mad remember Manley actor, and I said, no because checks writes in a heartbeat. He doesn't care about your melanin genitalia. He's writing about your heart. And we've all got that. Let's got nothing to do with your income bracket or your religion. It's an accident of birth. How we turn out and all the rest is just the bullshit. That's laid on us. Right. So who are you as a person? That's always the thing. What's your heart say, always cicles at the world puts on us value judgments? That's not our business. That's what the world does to us. But how do you respond to you sing with? What makes you laugh? Where'd you forget yourself because you're so happy with what you're doing? That's the stuff I'm interested in. And I actually think that's the stuff. Shakes is interested in this. Well, so this is Richard for God's sake. At a sit upon the ground and tell sad stories of the death of kings. How some of being deposed some slain in wall some haunted by the ghosts. They have deposed some poisoned by their wives some sleeping killed all murdered. For within the hollow crown that rounds, the mortal temples of king keeps death his court. And they're the antics sits Scoffing, his state and grinning at his pump. Allowing him breath little seen to Monica be feared and kill with looks in seizing him with self and vain conceit does if this flesh that walls about our life for bras impregnable. And humid, thus comes at the last and with a little pain bows through his castle, walls and farewell king. Covey oh heads not flesh and blood with solemn reverence. Throwaway respect tradition foam and ceremonious duty for you have but mistook me all this while. I live with bread like you. Seal want. Taste grief. Need friends? Subjected, thus how could you say to me? I am a king. Vedra bit nervous then. But the reason I wanted to do that is because I think what happens with Shakespeare people use him as a tool to beat of the people with active. You can't be in the Shakespeare club because it's not for the likes of you governor or you didn't go to the right school. You haven't been correctly educated. And I think that's bullshit. I think it's bullshit. And I think he makes no judgments about human beings. He just goes, we're all fucked up. You come with your baggage. And you make your own judgment about him. And the thing that drives me bonkers as a human being is being constantly judged for being a woman and being of color, and I think you don't know me, I might be a complete bastard or I might or might be really fantastic. But it's got nothing to do with my vagina on my skin. It's got to do with the content of my heart. And so I love that speech because at the end it's like Richard goes. I thought I was born a king because God said you will be the king. No, it's an accident of birth that you have to come out of that particular woman's body who was married to that particular man and gave that status is nothing to do with your character, aerial, skillset or what you love or what you're good at it. Just an accident of birth. And I would love to live in a world where we could get beyond judging somebody for this. What I call the fleshy over coat. I'm we could just live slow a life. That means you actually have to get to know someone knows. Someone you resonate with maybe resonate with them. But that's cool as other people that you'll both resonate with because the quality of our heart is what's of interest. And I think if we could find a way to live like that we would have such a mellow world about more peaceful world much more loving world a much more thoughtful and embraced world. So that's kinda why wanted to do this play as much as I wanted to go to, you know, women of color can do this stuff. It's not hard. It's not hard. Susan Shakespeare in your sleep might. And that's why I think things like what you guys doing here with the guilty feminist podcast is beautiful if encourages us to be whole cells, the whole of who we are as a human being and to fight against anything that restricts us from flourishing because that's what we're here for what's the point. Trying to. He pull of the Sam Wanamaker theater. Oh, the Shakespeare's globe theatre. Welcome. Deborah for his. I was chatting to somebody party. She's play Bryant. And I said, what do you do at the moment? Should I'm writing a play about this Elizabethan poet, no one's ever heard of her. But she's amazing. She was the first published pout. I I mean. In writing about it on your right to complain about a million new. Yeah. No. And I was like I have I have I did a short dissertation about an extended s I think let's be very clear. But I was obsessed with our university. And then I put her in the museum of curiosity on radio fool, and I wrote about her in my book, which was an out at that point. But I was writing about her in the book, and I said that to the playwright because obviously I didn't want to think I'd Nick idea. I just said I'm just so excited. I can't wait to see this play and a little bit of me also because already pitch like a comedy like a slightly. Black jury comedy radio play version of this sitcom version of this really two big American company that will wanting sitcoms so dirty pitch something. So I thought, oh, it's one of those ones where you know. I kind of didn't get there in time. But when I store it I was so happy I hadn't written it because I got to see it because you can't see things you've written properly. You can only sit in cringe through them going. It's not exactly a mentor. It's. Wrestling this week three that low enough the press line the whole plane, but not just for everyone. Cetera. That's your own experience in watching something you've written, but partly also because I never would have written anything as wonderful. It's so brilliantly brilliantly done. But what I was also I haven't written a play. And I think we need to put that out there right now. But I was asked to write an entry for the program. I made. So it away. I have written fish Shakespeare's globe. What is policies? What's he writing something projects? Pittsburgh. I would it be on the program. So I thought I would read you a truncated version, a Lanyo is my favorite historical guilty feminist and Elizabethan goal crush. She was a poet a class warrior and a champion of women, but she knew how to party and she really went the distance. She died neither virtuous nor young. It was set. She broke the record for a woman who had given both by living till Seventy-six. She wasn't giving us at the time. Just. Just if you gave us you chances of living along time went down because I hadn't really invented medicine. Just leeches. Apparently her closest rival died at fifty seven. Yeah. That's a big old. I'm sorry for her. I mean, I'm not cheated. Well, she medaled. She got silver pushing it is perspective Shakespeare contemporary died at fifty two and he hadn't given both to anybody. That wasn't especially young. Some critics say the million you had an affair with. Shakespeare. And that she was the lady he wrote about in his sonnets. But I don't care if that's true or not. Why do women always have to be defined by the most famous they've slept with. I wanted to be defined by Jon Hamm. Jon Stewart's Joan all about. Oh, man. I see him. I would have an important sexual relationship with before. I die. I want to talk about a million on her own merits. Did. She know Shakespeare for sure the population of London, then was around eighty six. And forty nine of those people what poets and playwrights because there was more funding for the arts under a bloodthirsty monarchy. Did they raise onto the current Tory? Governments. Did they get it on probably because things will really boring before the internet so people had to make their own entertainment, which usually consisted of word games on sexual intercourse. I'm pretty sure both mililani. I'm Shakespeare shocked loads of people. They just didn't go on about it because they both had all some careers. She was born and christened in some bolt off Bishopsgate in fifteen sixty nine now, it's in Liverpool street station. But then it was where I quote, foreign musicians and theatre folk lived thinks stoke Newington coffeehouses, fingerless, mittens and acoustic lutes her father about taste of Bassano hot talion musician died of being Elizabethan. When Amelia was seven and her English by the Margaret couldn't afford to keep all her children because she was on only twice the benefit single. Mothers are on under out Tory. Governments. So Milia was sent into service at a country house co Cookham owned by Susan boaty Countess of Kent Susan good name, by the way. Thank you. I'll call the shot and I shot. Was quite a Hebron inasmuch as she thought goals should be schooled and was educating her daughters. I like to think Amelia was so charming and witty when she brought in the tea and bums Susan's thought, she would be a good influence and upgraded Amelie to the position of student foster data. It was certainly there that she learned writing languages without that she could never have become a poet on his where all goes a bit love island. Amelia became a wag to Henry Carey, Lord, Huntington Henry's mom was the other Berlin go, and he was said to Henry the illegitimate son. She was eighteen he was sixty one. I'd like to hear what net has got to say about that. He was also Shakespeare's boss. He became the Lord Chamberlain of the Lord chamberlain's men wheels theater company. Henry gifted Amelia, forty pounds a year, and you could buy lots, of course, it's design roughs with them roughly. These Hello magazine is rubbing shoulders celebrities such as Queen Elizabeth the first Malo sa- Francis, Drake when she was twenty three she got knocked up which was one of the most ill amount of things you could do in the Cote. Henry dropped her like a pregnant brick. Hey was he was married almost seventy after all like many women before. And after her. She was ousted from old. It was glamorous. And he carried on like nothing happens. Hashtag may too. What's the base version of may matoco that we can? You went to rawley you should be ashamed. It should be fairly also. It was at this point. I like to think she realized how superficial the world of the court wasn't decided to follow her heart. Now since then I've seen the play to write this, obviously before the play go in the nights. But the play doesn't quite tell the same story Anta from Lanya. He was her age. In fact, he was her cousin but once removed, so relax. Also, a rockstar of his day. He played the most fun instrument. You can imagine the recorder. Yes. Like, the one you played at school, but back then that was the equivalent of the electric, Tom. I am. And she was with the groundlings mosh pit laughing with her friends. He does play such a lusty. Melody, very I would blow his record. Folks biggest gig was when he played at Elizabeth the first few years later think Elton John and candle in the wind. Seriously council in the win. She married him when she was pregnant with another man's child like many rock and roll Isla STA. And it was then that she started visiting therapist and astrology Simon Forman. She wanted to know whether house would ever make any money because he was busy spending all of hers Simon Forman funster. Of course, he exclusively sole female patients and wrote down in his notebooks. Whenever he hailing them. It wasn't Elizabethan slang. It was his own made up word for shanking. When she on a quote from his own diary when she would not highlight. He's to say like, oh, heilige Mary. Some after went home highly to the wife, January that's diary when she would heilige he called her a suck you bus, which is a nymph maniac. Demon and lesbian in his notebook. He was Giacobbe and troll. Pluess fucking shown we know about her because he kept terrific misogynistic records. He really did. It's amazing. That's mostly how I know about. When her husband died of being Jacob. I merely did lots of things to survive on support her son. She opened a school run a highway business. She opened sued men of business disputes and always one she defended has self in court and referred to herself as our attracts. Tend to bring back for myself. The most exciting job she took home in what was very much. A gig economy was writing she was the first Englishwoman to become a professional poet all the women had written for vanity. But she published for cash most famous poem was so feminist as to be blasphemous. She got away with it by claiming she dreamed the title, the divine dream defense was one used by women through the ages because no one could argue with Goto told you and you'll sleep. It's true. It's true. But I love the fact that she was only prepared to give credit for the name because most would say God gave me this poem in Adrain. Sheaves like he gave me the name. The rhymes old hers. It was cold Salvi day Rex Judeh Aurium, and this is wild. Stop blaming women for the full eve was seduced Adam knew better. And even if women did get kicked out of the garden of Eden. You men killed Jesus. The introduction to the poem contains this reckless glorious defensive women as also in respect pleased, Lord and savior Jesus Christ from the time of his conception till the hour of his death to be begotten of a woman born of a woman nourished of a woman 'obedient to a woman, and that he healed women pardons. Women comforted women. Yeah. Even when he was in his greatest agony and bloody sweat going to be crucified and also the last hour of his death took care to dispose of a woman off to his resurrection appeared first to a woman sent a woman to declare his most glorious resurrection to the rest of his disciples. So if you don't love women Jesus. Oldest when being the wrong religion was one of the leading causes of death. What woman I drink to Amelia often when I think of how much she'd enjoy the metoo movement. I very also at how much I'd love to have her as a guest on my podcast. I couldn't be more intrigued and excited to spend some time with her as the globe resurrects has spirit on a macho tear into being once more. She is the answer to the question. What would have happened to Shakespeare's sister? I'm Judy was wrong. She wouldn't have died in the Gaza from syphilis. She'd have been a magnificent successful, poet businesswoman. On personality, we just wouldn't ever learn about her in school tonight? We remember her vividly and the global make sure we never forget again. We have to Mogus are going to join one of our guests is the playwright and screenwriter who brought the story of to the globe. But the one I meant at the party. That's not how she a self. I now that show which when I saw it was like a felt to me like going to feminist, and I saw in the globe in the summer. And I thought well, it was a good thing has rave because it would have come off the cut and cool. And other guest is the head of higher education and research here at the globe. She's basically a human search engine. So please welcome to the stage. Playwright Mogo Noida Mao. Come and talk. Saying your name incorrectly. Precisely what I say. I'm just saying everyone here a right? Yes. Or sometimes I get for all which is kind of. Sounds a bit. Like, then you're in the Disney Latin. Okay. So this is a very exciting time for Shakespeare's globe. I think because there's a lot that is very traditional about the globe. When you come in the salting thing about it. And we have a lot of international listeners. So in case, you don't know the exciting thing about the globe is a complete reconstruction of Shakespeare's globe brick for brick measurement for measurement. And then the theater we're in now is an indoor space because otherwise for half the that'd be nothing on because it would be cold too cold. It's amazing space, but it would be very very easy to do very Torres de doublet and hose, quite irrelevant Shakespeare place, and of course, there's a certain amount of traditional work that goes on here because that is some of the appeal of the globe. But if that was all that it was than it would be irrelevant. And I think it would only play for tourists and eventually die. It would become the. Shakespeare in mouse, trap bicycling. And what's exciting is that the globe is doing not it's presenting relevant contemporary work in the form, especially if these two productions the ole female, Richard the second and also Amelia address already told a little bit about Richard the second could you tell us something about Amelia, and how this play came about what could people expect to see if they go? So Michelle Terry when she took on the artistic directorship here. She'd known of media Bassano for quite a while she known of her as the potential lady of the sonnets and all that kind of thing. And she knew that she would quite like to have her first season on the plays. Where immediate pops up? There's a lot of I think is actually the most used female name in his place or something like that. I think we've we were that one out, but she pops up a lot and she wanted to program those plays in her first season. But she also wanted to have a new play in the middle of it that she kind of hang season around about this woman because she. She rightly recognized that she hadn't had the light that she needed on her. And there were a lot of insights about clearly speculation because we don't know. But it's a brilliantly done in your play. That's perhaps some of the ideas. I mean a lot of Shakespeare's plays with such an easily. How did he know? But Italy her family were talion. Yeah. But also quite possibly north African Italians. And so she is played by three different black women at different stages of life and the way that you have speculated about their relationship is very clever that he got a lot of his ideas. A lot of understanding about women from her and a lot of understanding about these talion plots from her she keeps telling him things, and then seeing them in his place to be honest, whether or not all of that is entirely true. Almost certainly he Nick his ideas from women because he's on the standing of women women love playing his parts, and he hasn't lasted for nothing and mid-next from women all the time. So sometimes whether something is factual is not relevant. It's true. Whether it's factual history, folks. The great shift to change the FOX to give great to truce to is play fake news. I don't know. Feel fiction is something it's journalists just to be clear. Yeah. I mean, that's history has been written by white guys. So essentially, that's the perspective. We're getting on that. So he's perspective. We've had for a long time. And so when myself in Chelsea directed it. The research. We looked at it through our own eyes. We filled in gaps, and we found the stories that we were interested in about her, and we put her in her place, and we did kind of imagine this woman who I mean, let you said, you know, twenty people live in London at the time she would have hung out with him. She would have known him. They would have been contemporaries, she was clearly writing at that time and the Amelia speech in a fellow is so strongly feminist and clearly in our opinion from a woman's point of view. I just thought well, I'm putting that in the play. She, you know. He could very easily listen to her ranting one day about something that her husband or low carry has done and and he's put that in his play. And I don't think that that's too big a leap to make because we just don't know about so many women or any other kind of community that has just never been considered important enough to record a memory play. Because I feel that we feel in our bodies. We remember these things, and I think we need to stop reading between the lines if we're gonna learn about these people. About the pace. How many jokes there are in? It's a combination of sort of the heart of Shakespeare, the width of Blackadder and the feminism of my auntie taking. It's really a remarkable experience. But it gets me inside and lifted me up carried me on a way for some weeks after I'd seen it, which is what I should do. I feel similarly with Richard the second sometimes she'd go and see Shakespeare, and you do fall asleep Abid done. Yeah. I mean, I studied English Oxford, and I feel like. I mean, though, I studied English Oxford. So I feel like I should be really good at Shakespeare. And every time I go and see Shakespeare, I think yeah. Obviously, I like this because studied English love this this. This of Shakespeare. But sometimes you all thinking just like taking a snaky look at your phone in your bag. See how much longer you've got to sit through it because it's boring. But it is it is if it's done from. I'm sorry, just oh. Old doesn't make goods it's got to be lifted of the page. How do you do? Well, okay. So. I spent about five months, cutting, the text that's just sitting there causing a white mom. Leave nail scissors with. No, no, I spent time in the text because I wanted to do shin. That doesn't seem that you know, anything about the history of what you're watching. I wanted to version that was exciting. The frankly for this space didn't run longer in the first half twenty. You wanna sit longer on those benches from overland? She gets lost in your thinking. God. This is marvelous on show. It's marvelous. But basically my ass is nine eight pace. No matter how great the Shakespeare's Shakespeare himself say let me. He just been. Knicks pissed on the side. Everything was shocking, and they were buying doing everything. I mean why much action to keep every night? Cassettes, ally Facebook, slush EBay space. Yes. Yes. Voiced by. Yeah. Do you want my chicken of chicken for sale, I can rights to in the coda come at the mind that you own Jew? Come over. Shea blocks. Pretends. He doesn't. He does he just. So you. And you know, make it. I think from steak, but you have to not be reverential. This is a good banging story. Let's see what everybody thinks they doing. And who do you love who do you hate and all that stuff and don't go to funnel people like one word seven. Yeah. I feel the same about Shakespeare's. I do about the opera. It's hard for me to understand. Why it seen as elitist? If you look at the plot, especially in comic operas and Shakespeare, it's like an episode two and a half men. I saw it honestly or upset of Frazier where oh I was dressed as a boy. But you didn't know is just as. Coming people. Don, Kate is like fairies and shit. And then when you see people. Show up. There is I don't eat. Wasn't don't K? And now, they're don't don't case. There's a bad that comes. It's like that is hilarious. It's pretty, but it's when people's try and steal the joy out that you just think why your arms voter leaning back and saying most expensive Shakespeare is walking out with middle cross people in the interval saying. I thought her fairly was really quiet code. I thought I mean, it, you know, it wasn't what it was. Eight hundred lecture failure cross it was visceral affair. What you're saying that in the most intellectual does nothing about you haven't been visceral since you were coming out of the birth canal. Are you fucking serious? You don't get to judge what's fucking visceral mount. And then apparently I've ruined tonight at the. Why saying that now late bucks? All right. You hear the globe, you'll the higher education research heads. So you'll probably be trying to get young people in new people who wouldn't necessarily feel that they are entitled to come into a spice like this. How do you feel about these things? Well, I mean, I think Shakespeare be really surprised about all the reverence actually because that started in the eighteenth century when Shakespeare became sort of what I call bar defied, and he was sort of placed on this pedestal, and we have this image of him in this sort of puffy shirt and some attic with a quill, but that's not how play writing worked in the sixteenth century is really collaborative people getting their hands dirty. They were working in southern it was a place. Manufactured by Riffa. Very i'm. It was it was marshy and dirty. And it was yes, shaggy shocking. And it smelt and people would not as polite us we assume that, but it was a hugely creative. It was hugely creative and people work together. And as you say, the weren't huge amounts people living in London. But the population was increasing all the time. And what people don't tell you is that there were more than just white men in London there yet. We're gonna have to post showdown. So was this very creative space, but most of the people who were invited into the crater spice if all of the people will Whiteman. Yes, we don't know that. I mean, we know that boys between the ages of twelve and twenty one play the parts of women because women weren't allowed to perform onstage wasn't customary. But there was no law actually, preventing them. And there's a lot of trips second who said women could perform because first of all he thought he was twenty gay and one night. And there was an shed would break, and he had to wait because somebody playing probably feeder suddenly realized you hadn't shaved on. So I had stopped the play while the leading lady had a quick shave on a second. I'm sick of this shit women. Do it most of us shy. You cannot grow covy and Beit honk arrested skit outbid what you get you met a post. So at that time women, no not today. But you sound like on the Marshall stage. I mean in Europe women were acting on the commercial stages. They were performing their England. Was this weird anomaly? It's true that women he wants to choose to go to Europe to act as they used to leave go there. It's actually. Yeah. Someone was telling me they were writing a piece around this women would often leave and just go fuck this. I'm off to power as many of us may be doing quite sued. Also, I mean, they performed at court court masks, and there are lots of different kinds of performances. It wasn't just commercial performances in the theater companies and the guy's going out on tour. So women were performing. Yeah. Oh, that's very very friend. He's writing a book about that. So how do you get people to come into this space who may feel like I'm not unto the language? I'm not going to someone's going on this isn't for people. Like may. I mean Twitter. We actively wanted to do that with Richard the second partly because it's apply about England. And I have a real thing about people from the empire built this country as much as anybody who was from here this country, whether they want to come here on. So I want to say that generations that followed. This is your failure is well, this is your city, come and see it. So it means you have to put posters up where Brian PayPal live. You have to take a note taking? Just web, rob. To ring-fence ticket prices. So people on low incomes can come. You have to actively invite people who don't feel entitled to just come along to say. No you come as well. Now, you come you come because otherwise. Nope. Be that interested make before they never advertise to watch the buzzer. So important we do because Shakespeare time on his contemporaries, what basically television they were making television. They were the ones trying to entertain ordinary people and keep them in for binge-watch. It was much longer than if you've got to come out. And there was nothing else entertaining. There's nothing happened to get home. So people came out to hey, this story to be entertained. So we need to co create as kind of spice again G work with Taibbi at the black ticket project. She okay. So we bring touch Toby. Nice. She gets free tickets to young people and says this is a free ticket come with me to this place and brings people into the building who just feel on entitled to do. You know, what is so interesting about what type doing that? I thought about when I first got into 'cause I'm from south east we came on school trips. But the thing that was available to me was a company called c one four five which doesn't exist anymore where you could see a show for five quid. And that was the why that I I went to the West End. And so like, a big massive means I think the producers or something about the so many initiatives that actually did exist don't anymore. I remember the access. I once I realized where these places were I go, and so what hope is doing is absolutely tremendous because actually the government initiatives don't exist. One of the things are department does is put on large production of Shakespeare, play Romeo and Juliet right now, and it's free for. For students fourteen year olds to sixteen year olds and a family says well, come along. So it's on right now that's about access and getting people in the door. If you're listening to this take note that these things are available. What are the lowest price tickets? If you're just calling it as a punt doing a scheme for Richard second. Do you know somebody's wiping the hands? It may ten. You can get this very intimate. So wherever you're setting you will you ended up. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. You'll be I would see you wherever you care, and you can get a ticket for ten and if you can come down to London, I mean, this brilliant all over this country, this kind of what? But if you can come to London for a couple of days, you could actually see Amelia that has gone into the West End on Richard the second. So it'd be worth coming to you. So you could do it three. If you're a parent with a baby, and you desperate mania don't have anyone to mind that baby right now Morgan has made show that you can come on the twenty fourth of April. There is a matter that is specifically one where you can bring babies so check out their website and find out more details on the twenty ninth of March on part of criminal improvident, just really a nightmare to mystery at kings place, and I'll be performing there as a guest, and I really wanted to tell you that our lineups for the tower. Ready? If you go to our website, if you go to our Twitter page, there's a pin tweets if you go to guilty feminist page. You'll be able to say who is coming on the live tour coming around the country, which comedians and singers are coming to your talents. Exciting. And if there's a particular comedian, you're desperate say they might be. Control to see them go and check out our lineups. And finally help refugees are really really need of volunteers. If anybody who's thinking, oh, volunteer. I might be able to go out and look in the kitchen or help with the nation's distribute sleeping in tents or work on the info bass connect people with internet and legal information, all go and teach on the school bus anything like that. You can do. Help prevent is really really really need your help right now said, please could help refugees dot org and safe. There's anything you can do short or long term. Thank you so much. Do you think they will more women who were like Amelia that we don't know about happen to know a lot about Amelia absolutely believe that is true. And I think that media one of the reasons why I think she was amazing in really clever was she recognized that if she has published she would be remembered she'd stick around I'm disappointed when? Shea. Jio bringing back banging on about how to anyone who will listen for years and in interest, and you've brought back in such an remarkable way. But you actually show in the plate without any giving away any spoilers you show that wonderful collaborative night show of women and the way that Amelia connected with the women the things we know that she sets up a school diverse women, and she got shut down actually because she wouldn't. Ethics much about this. I must speak on her behalf and say the roof was leaking fix. So she said I'm going to. Yes. She said, well, all fix it and pay for take you out of the rent. And then he took it a co. Anyway, it got shut down. She never ever lost though in national and she represented herself. Which is she just incredible the tricks. But yeah, I think because she knew that in order to because nothing was kept. It was there was lots of paperwork going around all the messages and things being written and pamphlets and all these kinds of things, but they would never be kept line draws wipe with them or whatever. So she knew that she had to publish yourself. If she was going to stick around. I'm absolutely convinced. There are hundreds if not thousands of women out there who never got to publish and also all the other poems that she wrote plays on what else does she ride that? She never published one of the questions. I've had is always she is Shakespeare and the answer is well, I believe she is. But we will never know because actually the work that she made was not kept. And what else did she right? That was a stunning ABC full and probably even better than Shakespeare. We will never know. And how many other women out there are we missing. And is it historically accurate? What you pick to play about the maybe I should follow as well. 'cause y'all meant to know that far on. When she's working with all the women, and they're coming together as a collective is that something, you know, something you semis. So what we depict in the plays thing called a script, Tori, which is these places where you would go to get your things written there be men sitting there writing things, letters, and contracts and all these different things. And we went to the research said, do you think it's possible Amelia could have made one of these script, Tori, and with the women that she's taught sets with women, and they said there's zero evidence for it. But why not? We wherever the there's no evidence that she didn't. Yeah. There's no evidence. She didn't. And the thing is she was a time. When there was a lot of stuff going on with unions with women trying to get charted women trying to be recognized for their skills. I work skills. Cross people. They weren't being able to be chart, and they were riots going on in parliament's. They were fighting all these different things that were happening that we we have got a huge amount of knowledge about but she because she was educated. She was living in those women educated by women, and she was feisty. We know that because she was representing himself in court. I kind of feel like she would have been involved in all that kind of stuff and she would have been doing. And that's why I made about reading between the lines. We got to look at the facts that we got and go. Hey, she was great. She knew what she was doing. And she to seventy six did all of that. If you go and see this play, and I really hope you do. And I hope it toes, and I hope it toys internationally. I hope their other productions around the world it is remarkable pace expect something of a rock concert in its field. Don't take going to the said primly I saw it on the press night when it was at the globe. It's now in the West End. But there was so much kind of cheering throughout and almost like like church the only way describe it is like when you if you've ever been to all seen depicted a southern Baptist church in America. When people shout out things like preach despond Titus. It was a bit like that. I was surrounded by amazing black women who were just shouting. I here that sister. And I was like I've never been to the theater and Phelps. Entirely wrong. It felt just noble. It didn't feel like oh speaking it felt completely like the audience going into cheers. And at the end, it was crying because everyone stood up just everyone stood up, and they were just shouting and screaming sharing, and and it didn't feel like the theater it felt like a rock concert. But that's when you're telling joyful, and it's a story of joy and triumph and also sorrow and modernisation as all stories of women, but it felt like I was taken somewhere, and it felt like I was also sort of crying for myself as well. And the other women that I know enough in a sort of magnetic chain to Amelia, and it was actually when she sees her book published for the first time, and it was the same week that I just got my book published for the first time not held today. My hands, and I just I felt so connected to her and she pays my book as well. So if you go please go expecting an experience. And not a trip to the theater, and I would say the same about Richard the second come to be part of the space comic noise. We like noise. Anything else you would like to tell us at Joe about which the seconds anything. We should know where on stage on the night whispers to Brexit. I can't imagine what that's going to. I mean. I mean, I will be stopping myself in both is obviously. Throughout the performance. But. The actress who plays the Queen Leyla vase, you know, we've got actors from Pakistan from India, the design is Iraqi, rainy, one of the actors is Iranian we've got Africans West Indians and Chinese and Filipino and we've got people from everywhere, and you just want to go. Everybody comes on the state, and they just share the story, and it's conversation. And there is something about not much ical thing that is why you cried does something chemical that happens if it's done well between the audience and the people on stage, and you all go on that journey together. And we can't do it on stage without you, and you come watch the story without some we need each other for me. There is something about that's how we should be living our lives, and we've had people say about your queens remarkably feisty. I mean, the women, and he's usually very you. That's because. Where? Yeah. Things change when women get to be the architects often whip protein for diversity especially cholera brought in for diversity, and it sort of one sitting on the end being visible, but that's not the same as being the architect. And that's why we will see real change when we collectively get to create and collaborate get to change things together wherever your pow allies as Rennie Ettelaat says wherever your power lies invite people in not just to share your space on your space and include them on your terms, but invite them to be architects. Oh, man. Oh. Anything else you'd like to know as a higher education and research expert? What would you like us to know she wants to take away what I want you to take away is the story of London an England and Europe that's been told for the last four hundred five hundred years is kind of ally. Because there's been. Well, just there's been a huge huge amount of research being done now about the presence of people of color and women of color in and around the city skilled workers as well as people who were as as one of the book says elicit -ly brought into the country people of color arrive with Catherine of Aragon because of her Spain connection, and that has been erased from history. And so when you have people of color on stage performing Shakespeare that's ups slightly, right? Also, there's a possibility that Amelia was Jewish as well, some north African Jewish family. And so we want to celebrate that as well, particularly difficult time for Jewish people in this country for black people in this country and fight directors. Israeli. Of course, she has and the candle mica. Is telling us now, we've got to end the show could you please just tell us exactly where and when we can see your show, you can see Amelia at the vote of states on the strand, and I just wanna say it's OFI costs. But it's also famous creative team and backstage team. And that's really really quite. Yes. Can we say, Richard the seconds? You can say Richard the second. And they vary room. Site that someone to make play high on in rep with Edward the second where on till Easter Sunday, the twenty first of April, please come and say it and similar lay women of color backstage on stage playing the music everything looking peering down at your from the granny's. Yes, please please come along. And just can you point to your grandma plays entre? Tara. Laura. Have you got anything you'd like to? Yeah. We're having a women and power festival beginning may thirteenth to the eighteenth of may. So please come along for we've got wonderful, events, and panels and discussions, maybe it says thirteenth to the eighteenth right here. Many of the events taking place in the Sam Wanamaker playhouse. I'm Susan McCoy anything to plug. I'm sure that stuff tomorrow fourteenth much on TV cannot just say. Thank you so much to the globe unto the Sam Wanamaker. Thanks for having us. Can't. Thank you. Chris very difficult tonight. And always does brilliant job sound engineering. And I have a huge role for the wonderful. Doctor Fara Kareem Kupa. Doc, Frankenstein, if you will who breathe life back into my Elizabeth girl, crush Amelie Lanya more. Magnus insz Maost of the and creator of welds. I'm. She's too busy being busy successful race on. She hasn't done many guilty. But one of my favorite ever co-pilot says. Six. Very special. Today. Ever go for this. About this. I. We already another one happy. I've thought of another one right now. But I bet it writes it down because I will forget it. What was that thing? House face idea. Now, hold on. I'm sure face. I taste allowed at the globe. You know, if we're not. West west thing. Yeah.

Sam Wanamaker Shakespeare London Richard second Amelia Kent Susan England Queen Elizabeth Tom Selleck Toby Hugo Boss Michelle Terry Susan Makoma Mike front-on Keeley Hawes Annie Lennox Sam Wanamaker theater Fiona Shaw Styler Styler West End Lord chamberlain
144. International Migrants Day with Hari and Uma Kondabolu

The Guilty Feminist

55:46 min | 1 year ago

144. International Migrants Day with Hari and Uma Kondabolu

"Ha. We have the cost of Amelia, and we're having so much fun. Taking over the Waterville theater with fantastic. New. Thank you so much to everybody. That's already been the responses being credible with building something here, and we need to support. We're breaking convention just by being in the West End new play by living breathing woman. We have loads of jokes and the forgotten story of a kick ass feminist from four hundred years ago. It's like a hen party for the woke but change like this takes time, and we're not gonna run forever lightly. Miss. So you're going to go weeks to get organized and come and join us and show people that we damone will women's voices on stages, and if you've already come then come again, bring friend bring a teenager bring him on bringing home his mom bringing died in other negative in London. We have say Matt today performance or come for the weekend. We've got shows Monday to Saturday with two of the new shows and some great seats as little as twenty five pounds for more information. Visit WWW dot Amelia, the play dot com. I'm a feminist. But the best thing about co-hosting this episode of the guilty feminist with hurry kandebow blue is that if it sucks, everyone will blame the man. He's the first of its coast shore gag. And all of the other three has been great to this zero pressure on me tonight. I'm a feminist, but I ruined a woman's life once but enough about my mom. I'm a feminist. But the best thing about performing in this spectacular, Victoria whole here. In Geneva is the acoustics in the dressing room a created for opera sing warming up because it's Christmas. I did a full rendition on my own of Santa baby. And because my voice sounded so fine in the dressing room. I kind of went on a bit. But I felt bad about the lyrics 'cause they don't feminist. So I tried to change it. So I sort of lifted a bit. This is what I went full Santa baby close, the pay gap. From me us. Been awful good girl Santa baby so smash patriarchy two nights that data data data. We left it just made the Thames pay and patriarchy sound like you MRs fa-, Gino. I'm a feminist. But I don't like to call myself a feminist because I have earned it a male feminist could easily be a wolf in sheep's clothing or rather a dick in sheep's clothing. What I'm saying? I don't trust myself. I'm famous bumps. I love continental European sound engineers because. Early. It's night when the Swiss French engineer had to touch a battery pack for my headset. Mic to my brawl, he just unzipped dress with already put it on zip back home. We know about respect British my get so nervous doing this. They just end up wouldn't you bike? Please tell me that's the me to move because they've been doing this. It's friends on the television. I'm telling you. They just get nervous at the whole thing up saying used to it. I do all the time. It's my job. It's old. This is about just pope the thing brawl, let's get on with the book you'll making it seem sexual by the way that your hands shake and you'll breathing has deepened. You can't get a decent sound to put battery on your brawl in Britain nowhere nowhere, the British officials of. That's why we need to get more immigrants up to the UK to be sound engineers. That's right. My friends. I mean, you doesn't want to hear that. But it's the truth. I'm a feminist. But I still haven't seen beyond say's lemonade. However, I have pretended that I have seen it which brings me back to my previous point. I don't trust myself. Very very confessional. From the Victoria hole in Geneva, Switzerland for the United Nations, the spontaneity shop presents the guilty feminist with me, profound white guest co host Hari kondabolu and very special guest. Kandebow Lou talking about international migrants day. Now, we understand the binding will gig. How has no French I have a small amount. So we'll just do a bit of comedian interaction in French you speak any so I'll have to do mine in French studios in English. That was French you've already broken the messy beau coup. So you'll see words. Right. So you can say anything like, and then we'll just do in front show-me comeback in friendship. Okay. Whatever I have. So just anything. Oh, yeah. You know welcomes guilty feminist anything like that. Welcome to the guilty feminist. I've who to Coca-Cola light sip. Are you enjoying your time in Geneva? I've day plus on. Is there anything else you'd like to do perhaps get while you're in Geneva to vamp on sympathetic? So that was the French bit. I hope you enjoyed it. Let's see the most. Messy Bo Cooper? How was that? French people French-speakers. You are tonight. Then French people advertise debate and thank you. You. So we should begin the guilty. We're talking about migrants because you may have noticed this migrants day in the UN. The this is the first episode of the guilty feminists produced by the United Nations. I didn't see it coming any more than you. Did this episode is produced by the United Nations and the city of Geneva. Thank you. Thank you ever. Having heard of my podcast uninviting Mahia. Thank you for also inviting hurry here at the same time accidentally. So that he could also be sitting next to me those correct, correct? Food your for MRs Deborah friends. Why? Thank you, same Charles. If you have ever been an imigrants. Cheers. You've never left Switzerland with any intention of staying long that week anywhere else. Just one just one person. Don't perpetuate chair about though. He's like, no, I'm legally. No trouble. Because of that incident in nineteen seventy eight. Just shut out somewhere. You've lived. That is not the place you'll born. What was Geneva? Your name. A hint we've got one guys we've found name container where we. Canada. And you're all the way hit. So this is Canada to Switzerland. Can I just ask about Canada revive wall? Sit knowing. Wall sit knowing waking up every morning and thinking Justin Trudeau is in charge of me. He makes so my decisions in a way I have to obey JR. She is a little bit fifty shades of grey. That's what I'm asking enjoyable, obviously, just doesn't know you're doing this. But I see cruelly doing that a little bit. We'll stall still thinking about putting Canadian citizenship don't even bothering to live that just living that particular pharmacy. Great anybody's shots at another place. You've lived the of the place you. Canada you go where did you from Ukraine to Canada? And where do you live now? Geneva. You get around. Why did you move? Studying what you hit? Okay. It's very limited. You're prepared to share. Schooling because you really studying nothing working nowhere spoiled Davis data clear, what are you doing for what? You you spy. Amazing amazing. What do you do the? You to trade in the developing world. Will you the knots and always will be? Does anyone else goes intimidated by that she's just helping the developing world? What are you doing in the morning? Who have you have you helped struggling they should get on its feet from its knees? Because white people have ruined everything is that what is staring at me, Brian. It's like somebody had like, I'm almost talk to anyone to me. So you see? You French speaking. Okay. We in the politic. Tell me. I'm gonna give me any directions to a library. It's very limited. But I'll use what I've gone I'll take it for spin around the block anytime, and he's out of the house, someway, French-Speaking you'll direction. How old are you? I'm sorry. Ken to should be food. He's younger than me to is to. Okay. Sorry. Can I show? This week. Have you seen the graduate? He's too young. That's the point the main. That's. Oh, these young the graduate was I know, but in not feel Justin hall was like thirty bending was like thirty because that's the way Hollywood works. It's sexist. It's not fair you're eighteen now. And you're sitting there with you male privilege is absolutely fine. For me to make that joke. I've designed. It's. So I'm immigrants, but I am the kind of Magritte's that's the far right tabloids in Britain like because I'm white. And I my English is my first language and what I I got to England. I worked as a nanny, I'm basically Mary Poppins. She also had to be issues, and we know that she came in on a flying Brennan. I'm telling she was also much like me, the creation of a magic Australian woman, you need to know more about Mary Poppins to understand that. That's not my felt that she owes fail. For a toll. But I'm very aware that wherever I go, I have English language privilege. I think somebody that talking about what we talk about white privilege. We talk about male privilege, we took about straight privilege. We don't talk about English language privilege very much, but by can go to any yoga costs in the bodes pretty much. It's going to be an English saying is I can come out onto the stage in Geneva and talk just randomly talking hoping you'll understand the punch lines and good eighty percent of you do. Okay. We'll only ten percent on that one. It's a numbers game gang. It's a numbers game. But wherever you are you, speak English. The expectation is only all the person to understand. And you don't see that from UC English people all around the world or to speak is getting angry. When people don't understand them. You seem nice English-speakers. You'll see them in Geneva getting angry with people in restaurants going. I said I want to well dumb and not only the way too judging them because they're shouting out in English. And the white is like I don't have to speak this language, I live here. But Secondly, the judging you because you've feel welcome. It's two problems. It's too. But you see that you see Japanese people in London shouting at people in Japanese going, you don't speak Japanese the shit. They have a fair exportation that if they ever leave Japan, that's the end of them being understood they just have to work it out wherever they have to learn to speak the language. So I'm loving are you from Geneva. Yes. You born in Madrid. Oh. Okay. There's a mom like six down who's corrected him and said he doesn't mean bone him. He means working in now. I don't know if that's something credible. Moms planning. Amount of aid us may not or actually knows this do, you know, what do you think he means working? That's what you heard, but you said born into new account, so that's male privilege English-speaking Leitch wiper. Into one. I'm guessing you're you're Hartley note living in the country that you were born in where we on in Canada. It's so pub just trivial from Canada. I need to know mobile, but I don't have any more time. So if it will the Canadians would meet me in the ball off to the show and explain themselves. Really appreciate it. I. So our guest today is very special in keeping with the team. She is a migrant. She's also a physician and remarkable remarkable woman. So I would like to present to you with full disclosure from hurry. She she's she's my mother. The wonderful kandebow. Thank. All right might surprise people. But it was harder to Booker than I thought I thought it was a bit odd that she and she goes through her agent. I find it. I find it other. My father is our agent. Thank you so much for joining us. My pleasure. So tell us it's migrant stay. We're here at the UN who really drivers of human rights. Could you tell us? How was it? I being a migrant to America from India like what was that like a particularly a female migrant. Also, what were the traumatic circumstances that brought you to America my marriage. Like, you're leading the witness there. As an Indian woman he been the little bit educated. My parents said, I think this guy would be good for you. As a good old doubter. I said whatever you think is right for me is good because I know I can change him at some point. And I was angered inexperienced. I didn't know how the because it was at that time. What to change? Yes. Okay. You want fully full? Actual mother told you we find you can shave. And then you found out that I can speak to my mom. I was so confident I played snow match that I'm going to change him. So you went to he was in America at this point. Yes, you went to America. How'd you know, he came out of the reading it was arranged? Wow. So that's a lot of bravery. I think to get on everyday my comeback too late myself on my. And you had been adulterated do. Yes. How old are you twenty seven twenty seven year old Woking woman? Reducted you go your life going on GP. Yes, JP you do you live with office Dr and suddenly pick up in America park about fate talk about what was it like when you turned up to America and married, you know, you know, about it being educated and see a little bit and talk to people. I was pass Cape. But language is the main thing people are afraid of any a new place. But that's no problem to me. So I was starting leash. Could you already speak English ES? They'll some good full thought. Yes. Yes. It's a good thing. Berta showed up when they did. Because otherwise, I would have been a lot harder again. I'm sorry. I am not. I am. As you with a stray Liam, it doesn't make me feel better because the people who went to strata will wind. It's all part of colonialism is one saying just sorry for being white now. So you turned up. I'm were you able to continue to be a doctor in America. And I just saw my husband during the and it's months vast. I was wondering to get nice him or not hope. I don't vote to another man. So I told him on the phone wear the shirt I bought. And then immediately he left because he didn't have the Nova Gatien. So I just came. He wore the shirt. So I followed him home. Got to hope somebody else doesn't have the same show. Likely be. No. So I came with the right man yet. Yes. I went home, and then he has three his brother and two other guys. He was living with roommates and six o'clock came and everybody was looking at me woman is here maybe a food for us. You before this time of kosher, doctor, your doing your thing. And now, suddenly the expectation on you took a meal, I just never made four that because I was the dominant and studying and practicing and in India mothers cook and their help. So I never had to go. Make anything wasn't. You've told me it was never the expectation there, your expectation school and do studies which at the time was the bit of an anomaly, right? Mattia grumman. I know my change at my roles change and whole lots of I rented open the today, I found tomatoes and some money, and it's a man's home. I so I looked at it like a scientist. And rented made something opened I put this little bit. This leaky Brit that then made rice. And I was classed my finger and smiled actually and dad was tasting anything. I think because you around him. He's okay. Other guy sled like aiding, and I was tense and everybody says boy, you cook very good food. And we are lucky I said by I'm lucky today. And hope they don't ask me tomorrow. Like oh God. I have a one hit wonder. Yeah. Something else deputy south placing mount I never made the bad this. So far of I think it's my journey takes out. Maybe I'm just. Lack bay map something. So then you had children in America has what was that line going from being adult having children? I. We decided that I'm David south an age and start going to school work at one point. Because faster. I don't want my children to raise the baby setups bit one income where you can manage. So I think what my husband worked, and I taught them, and it was the best time in my life all days in my kids. At the time was a good kid. At that time. Yeah. So what age today? Stop disappointing. You. Poteen fifteen centers that I was hoping you would say like twenty eight twenty nine. When I look back. I think you're very site. But very manipulate you. Nice manipulation and loving manipulation. And I found for it being the faster mother. We've brought you to Geneva for. Tell me disappointing fourteen. Did mean say twenty years ago, but now? Now your cable just reconcile. Yes. Yes. But I came along and made humil-, great Cade. And how was it of being in America as woman from India? Did you experience was difficult? The weather was different was there was the women Americans welcoming. Yes. This is funny stuff. My husband is not very talkative, but some analysts he wants his not very information sharing. I I'm I run I saw snow. So I said let's go to Campbell. And we took a bus, and he's like we didn't have a car yet. And I vote shoes which I got from India. He didn't tell me it is cold, and it's snowy slippery. So I read shows no socks. I heard Saturday like this. We went to temple on my way, there just two blocks from temple one of the heels also. On my shoe? So I'm walking like this. It looked like I'm limping even then he doesn't have made take the shoes of with quite close. I'm still limpid. When I rendered. I'm the back. I think I had been swept up I wore and came next morning. My friend comes over its New York is cold chisel rarities your renter. I said what I said you need a code gloves shoes all bit. I said like, okay evening. He comes home. I said dude what is. Like me. And you didn't tell me I thought you knew like this. I said, I don't feel my feet. Do we think I? So next day. We went and bought whole coat and whatnot. And second thing. Like, I said, I don't like America. I'm washing clothes every week. Like, I didn't know that. He this guy didn't doesn't tell me their land don't have wash wash from. So every afternoon, I was never in my life and drying them outside in like in the backyard. So Finally, I met in live with an Indian disease after seven months, six months, and she's you're going right said bringing the and I'm trying it. I said lying we have laundromats. I said excuse me. What is that? Medika we don't wash like this. And she took me showed me how REM laundromat. Again, I said head what is this? He goes, I thought you liked it. Washing sheets everyday. So you have to hang them an washy we'd been dragging and putting and and he was not really showing the ropes of only men can comes back, and he doesn't know what? So was it actually of a migrants who hind to you and showed you the way my Gregory's? My neighbor I at that time not many women were around where we live. So whether any Americans that will welcoming to you or was it difficult. There was one lady from Argentina who's my neighbor. She became friends with me and have name is mary-anne. And so was actually another immigrant, and yeah, we've been down and she showed me around. What are the great things about immigrating? What about things I think, I don't see any bad things to be honest, miss except music. My family children are bought raised them to wherever you are. So how would be different if you've raised him in India probably wouldn't have been a comedian. That's the show. God my mom's quick, it's like she rehearsed. I mean, you told me a story about a there was a was an older white man that you met at the library first year. Yes, I was preparing for the test used to the library to become a doctor. Yeah. And then he was there and he used to see me because I still like from relate from India. And somehow he used to Mr. donate his name was and somehow remade reds, and he's eighty are more at that time, and we went to go to coffee, and he used to tell me his experiences in America. And how he was raised types of changed. And I used to tell him my stuff from back home, and you were born and he was passed off my first three four years of my life and one day. He never came. And I never saw him again. I still remember his kind face, and his kindness, and how we got along like an older man guiding young woman who is known occasionally, I still remember him and was tagged for his time with me kind of things the top two of like how difficult for it's not like teaching me anything by pow life is what we expect. And you'll do well being is nice, and you are bored and nice. Thanks, and it's nothing like he can teach me but lot loaned, but like from being nice to people is good. And then you can always depend on somebody who has experience. And that's when I realized retailer they know that people are people, no matter what color. They are only thing that matters to me is their sincere, honest, and is the. Affection for real are not I think you can sense it, but made me like it would friend him. And I met many people around which I- tribute and made France in life. It's interesting that you remember that mom though, who was kind. He stands out. We recently recorded an episode where somebody read some memoirs of her grandmother, and she'd actually survived the holocaust little girl, and she ended up going to Paris as a refugee the UK as a refugee where she had settled on family, and she remembered in her memoirs all of these people who'd been kind and some of the acts of kindness was so small it could be like somebody gave her some grad or someone else smiled at her own cards helped her gave her a lift or something like that. And her granddaughter Charlotte who was on the show said I would love to go back, and those people who were kind to my Nana when she was a little go. But I caught all I can do is kind now. Now to refugees who are in that same situation. And it's true. Whether you're a refugee, or whether you're another sort of immigrant, if you are pitching up somewhere knew somebody being kind somebody helping you out when you don't know what you're doing mean so much to you. There's a story about my Anshu when she was little, and she was very traumatized, and she wouldn't talk for like five years and this lady drove her to the library and told her to read all the books, and I was think we can't all be my Angelou. But we can all be the lady drives it'll go to the library. And that's what we should aspire to be. And your story, which is such a warm story. That's actually very haunting to me. And I think now the times where I feel with what's happening in America. And the way that it's winning the right and imigrants being demonized in such an extreme way. Do you feel what will happen America? Are you nervous about the way things are going? Yes. It's not easy. I fear for the kids who are growing up now. And it enter they don't know what they see the absorb and water the learning from that mass failed. Now it tickles from top to bottom. You look up to somebody who you see Redan television saying something they kill us. Ulis putting down somebody. You're not teaching the next generation the right thing. Lieber long refugees. And that's a different issue. You can't even respect migrants. Wall ready here in the country. That makes me feel more sad because these people out here. They have a right to expect. What other people are getting white black Brown? Whatever. Why had you separating and causing rift between the people I think that's one thing they need to address. About refugees. It's very very sad. It's a world problem. I think it's not just America. All it's. Global? Just picking somebody's not in view are people think that okay this country absorbs as we be okay. It's not just enough just taking them. Your healthy gate where they do. How to make them feel one of us? These about the things they need to think financially healthwise and motionlessly. That's a very rough pout from there to here not knowing where they're going. I think everybody just can think of help one person like in any way in the long run politicians. Of course, they need to make bigger plans and be foam, and when you have resources access at least partially. That's the hard part of a lot of what's been happening is the scapegoating for political reasons. I mean, I was just in Denmark and hearing stories about you know, children of immigrants. There's this idea to make sure they take classes about how to properly. Danish classes that