Youre real screwed up! Talk to me more about you.
Welcome to the misfit stars. podcast I'm Shannon Curtis and I'm Jamie Hill. Hi Hi everyone hi Shannon going over there. It's a okay over here. Do you know what what is special about. Today's podcast. It's episode fifty superstars podcast show. PODCAST is over the hill. You know what that means. What does that mean it means if this silver jubilee episode? It's our silver jubilee. What what does that mean? That's like fiftieth anniversary celebrations. The silver jubilee is it. I thought fifty was golden anniversary. Did you look it up or Google. It really quickly lately but maybe I screwed up. I could be wrong to. I don't know now we have. Hey Theory is the fiftieth year the golden or silver. Okay okay. I found this on the web. Fiftieth golden all Silva. Check it out by the way Jamie has his a series set to a South African the voice which is really the voice that we use all summer long when we're getting directions from place to place on tour and so we get to make fun of how how the South African Siri Voice mispronounces a lot of American words endless entertainment and not mispronounces lake. We're making fun of a South African accent accent mispronounces Lake misinterprets vowel combinations. In a way that no one who knows how to read the English language and any accent would do. Yeah but the other thing about the South African Siri voice that we learned. Is that one thing. She's really good at is pronouncing German words for some reason when we went to take our car into get service at a Volkswagen dealership up a while back. She directed us to the Volkswagen Dealership street-by-street directions and then when we turn onto the street for Volkswagen. She's she arriving. She says arrived at Vauxhall. Like turn into this. Like serious like goose stepping Nazi theory. That's what it's very eerie. We did you find out what the golden or silver anniversary so for anniversary is the golden one. Okay okay. But I'm now googling. What is a silver jubilee? Because that's important information. I've never heard the word jubilee. Silver Jubilee Twenty fifth anniversary of significant event. Oh sense senses has screwed that up. Does that at the first five minutes of this podcast APP Golden. It's the golden anniversary sort of weak bursary because it's not it's not annual weaker versus a week. Yeah W. E. A. K. of resolving parts. No we're doing great just all over the place. This is scintillating multiple ways. It's falling apart are people are taking. Notes are people driving off the road in their car because they're enthralled they can't believe you're listening to something this amazing anyway. Fifty does sound like a really impressive number though and I liked that also means that. We're just two weeks away from our actual first anniversary of the podcast but we took weeks weeks off so it could be right around now. Well no we've released the first episode on Thanksgiving Week last we did hear So how do we manage to take two weeks off and still have this be the fifty I I don't really know I don't know we'll work. We'll work it out. We'll figure it out before we reach our anniversary. People say you know what I think. People like the best about the misfit stars podcasts the rigorous seperation. It's this is clearly rigorously. We thought through prepared this. We're going to say about it right. We've got our facts straight. We gotTA figures yeah nothing straight actually cool and we do great. Hey so welcome. Oh Yeah Hi listeners. What's happening? Hey if you're a new listener first of all we're so sorry and also welcome. It's nice to have you Looks from our statistics like we might have had a couple of new listeners. Last forty cool. Thanks for joining us is everyone yes. It's uphill from here and thank you to our new supporters also Whenever we get a new supporter really warms the cockles of my heart? Sure the cockles. Dr Michael I don't know that's a weird word. Are they any night. Use that word but an expression actually a cockle. I'm not I'm not sure but I just would like I just chime in restaurant. Used that word plenty of anatomy glasses in college. There's no cockles. Biology degree negative. Because you knew about cosmos or not because they aren't a thing thank you to a new support you right whenever we do get a new support. The areas around our heart feel warmed. Yeah I mentioned the cockles somehow. My Gosh sure well. It doesn't mean a lot because what it means when when somebody becomes a supporter of this podcast. It means that they have had a little conversation with themselves. And they've said you know what this podcast is pretty cool and it brings some joy and insight into my life and I value it and some jubilee knowledge something useless potentially really incorrect knowledge anniversary markers people going home today. You know what I learned on the pod today honey. The fiftieth anniversary is a silver anniversary in spouses are like no no. That's not that's not right. It's cold Jamie. Said something about cockles and it was on a podcast. I think that means it has to be true. Yeah so so. Thank you those of you who have become supporters. Yeah thank you to those of you listening to this and somehow have arrived at the conclusion that you to want to become a supporter. Yeah if you want to do that. There's there's a real easy way to do that. You go to misfits stars dot com slash join and that is the page where you you can just very simple easily. Walk through the steps to become a supporting member of this podcast because this podcast is a member supported podcast meaning that you know a lot of the episodes are free for anyone to come. Listen to there's no ads. There's no ads but is made possible by the monthly contributions of our supporting members. And if you become one of those members a cool points for you automatically be you become one of our misfit stars one of our stars and it's this this you know I guess exclusive group of self celesial selecting exclusive both self selecting exclusive which is pretty cool. Yeah you can just become part of a secret exclusive society diety. What's not secret? It's told you about it sh- actually dukes and we'll have more subscribers and the support that we get it from our supporters. It actually matters we actually just got our monthly installment of that support. Just a couple of days ago comes at the beginning of the month every month. It ain't things that comes in and we're like Oh that's really helpful and you know what else comes in around the first of the month bill. That's IT works out great. So thank you so much to those of you who have thrown your support behind us. If if this podcast means something to you you enjoy it in your life you want to. You want to grab hold of this like you know other small way to support what Jamie and I are doing in the world vis-a-vis this podcast come on over. Become a star at misfit stars ars dot com slash. Join you know while you're on the computer doing misfits stars related stuff. Quick pop on over to apple podcasts. Or wherever you listen to this and leave a five star review rate and review. Oh Yeah Five. Stars Review Rate and review. That would actually be really helpful to us because when a podcast has a number of good reviews than that podcast hosting services algorithms algorithms like the itunes apple podcast algorithm or whatever it puts it higher in people's you might also like this suggestion lists. Yeah imagine if people who like the same stuff you like got shown Mrs Stars and be cool and then they could listen to. Maybe they'd be like you know aside from the misinformation about jubilees and it's actually pretty good. Thank you I haven't been married fifty years on earth. Would I know that. How would you yeah other than the pocket computer? I have access to the sum. Total of the world's China's such straight anyway. So that's right. Yeah so after the break. Today we have listener topic. We're GONNA take a second stab listeners. Right we we attempted to do this one last week. But we've kept the first part of our podcast very short today so that we will actually get to the listener after the break but are talking last week. We did our listener. Topics come from our supporting members from stars. They are the ones who get to suggest these listener topics and so if you become a member you can to sample that. You're listening to this. You're not yet a supporting member. But you've been listening to a few episodes like a fantasy enjoyable. That might keep doing it. Be I have something on my mind that I would actually love to hear Shannon and Jamie talk about yeah. You could suggest that if you're a supporting member I'm just saying MRS STARS DOT COM Slash Joint Karen who is a member. Did this suggested this topic. And it's on how we maintain social grace and open minds when we encounter someone of a different belief belief or value system. Do we always succeed at doing those things. Were not going to talk about. But we'll get to that the end at the at the second half of this episode today after the break so stay tuned for that in the meantime so what did we do this week. We did some stuff we did some stuff. Yeah we didn't happen in around the house it was. It was a cool week. We've really kind of like I feel like maybe crossed the transition period of coming home from tour getting used to being home now into like now. We're doing productive things at home things cool enjoying it. Yeah me too. I feel like the transition went well like I don't feel stressed out. I feel like I could be doing a better job at doing a little more reading a little bit less phone but stuff suspend interesting lately on online. You know well. I was at election That's right but Yeah we did a bunch of music stuff this week. First of all you have been working really hard at mixing a Janis. ACKMAN's records coming along. Great sounds good. It's starting to sound really cool And Combined Day of that with some mentoring of this new Sort of artist producer engineer. Friend friend that I have just. It's a really cool situation so I met this guy This guy's name is Julie and He's a lovely human being. I met him in the funniest of ways like we. We had a little pair of speakers that we weren't using. Yeah and so I put them on the Internet to sell yes and he replied that he would love to have him but he was the second person to reply right. They ended up going to the first person right because that's how you have to do that. But he was just super friendly and started a conversation. Yeah and then I am. He's like could be meet up for coffee and talk. I'd love to pick your brain about stuff once. He cut found out what I what I what I did. You know and so we met for coffee and hung out for like. I don't know two hours or something. It was a long hang. And he's just like justice. Really Neat like just smarts smarts superfast mind. I'm kind of like that too. I moved quickly. You may have you know and so like we covered a lot of ground and it was just really engaging in conversation toward the end of which he said. Would you mind if I came and just watched you work one day because I've literally never seen professional do this path. He's completely at least self taught and he's just been figuring stuff out right but he is so me twenty years ago. Yeah so like twenty years ago when I didn't have anything really but dreams and a little computer pewter and some ideas about production I would just read anything I could get my hands on right. And he's doing the exact same thing like now with access to the Internet. He can do it way better than I could. Twenty years ago but it wasn't like now he's reading manuals obsessively of gear. The key doesn't even own just to understand understand. How gear works late? He figures like he told me. I figure if I read about how ten different compressors work. All kind of how compression works. That's amazing which just brilliant right is hungry for information hungry. But you can't just you know he's an auto didactic and he's never had opportunities to sit with someone who actually knows what they're doing well and he's an artist who also writes writing music and like figuring out the production staff at what she sounds like also enjoys but working out the production Steph Jeff as a way as a means to record and produce his own music that he's making your which is that's so great. I mean seriously like setting up a situation intentionally only whereby you can be a self empowered artists who has like production control over their own work as a big deal eight lexical ideally. I wouldn't have a job. You know what I mean. Ideally like every artist would it. Just be so uptight. Every artist would be so up to speed as a producer engineer that they could just make their own stuff. I mean there is a value for an outside opinion and all of that and also for each person unlike. Some people just aren't interested in that kind of you know I I write songs and I can make my own like songwriting demos. But I don't have the level of interest in the process of like what makes a compressor work or all those those details. Although I see your protocol sessions I guess compressor and the KNOBS are not in the default place. Okay Sometimes I. You heard doing things. Sometimes I fiddle but I don't have. I don't have the passion to take Jake those things to the to the extent that you do you know and it sounds like jubilee actually does also have interest in that so yeah so but it's really cool that he's able to come over and like it was fun to be a fly on Wallace needs to you to discuss e Q.. And dynamic sin there was an. It was an interesting thing for me to do because what I really had to do is I had to when I'm working. I'm just sitting there working and I'm just doing stuff in an intuitive way and I really had to take it from one side of the brain to the other side of the brain okay. Here's an instinct. I'm having before I do the thing I have to explain the instinct and then the thing that I think I can do to satisfy fi this thing that I'm hearing right right and then go about doing it and it has to make your own process a little bit more rigorous if you have to say it out loud as you're doing it yeah you're checking your work so absolutely absolutely and also trying to explain it in a way that makes sense to someone who understands some stuff and is super smart. But for sure. Doesn't you know and understand a tenth of what I do because I've been doing it for so long long right you know But it was really rewarding too because also like he's super superstar superfast pick stuff up immediately like picks it up immediately in the way where the follow up question he asks makes it just transparently. Clear that he not only understood like at face value what I said but also implications of what is right and that's cool but that was rewarding. Oh it was great great. 'cause we yeah. We shared a meal with him too while he was here and got to know him some more and I I'm always interested in somebody who's making music who's like writing you you know like what's your motivation for writing. What is it that you have to say you know? And it became really clear that he that he writes from a place of I have to tell. Oh my story. He's got stuff. He's got stuff that he's experienced in his life into perspective that he wants to communicate through art making and that's me is like always the most compelling thing and we we talked about this at dinner to like you can be you know as talented as is anyone else on the planet more talented than anyone else on the planet you can. You know we've rehearsed you know you can learn all the engineering ins and outs you can all that kind of stuff. It doesn't matter a thing if you don't have something to say so true. It is the foundation of everything so it was fun to here like his story a little bit of it and I'm eager to hear more of the music that he's making if he's written like Jillian songs and lake close to sixty days recorded awarded. I mean again where he's just getting started. Yeah it's wild yeah And so he's in the process of compiling his what he considers to be his ten best. The ones again most proud out of and he's GONNA WE'RE GONNA get dropbox folder going together very see. See what it's about. I posted about this on facebook the day that he the day after he was here. So some of you who are listening. Who might have seen this on facebook of already seen this? But he mentioned something kind of like in passing as we were wrapping up the evening. That really struck me. And like I've been really thinking a lot about since then and I don't even sure I can't remember how our conversation with their but he said music loves loves everybody and that's what I want to be. That's why that's why I want to do this. And I just I yeah. I never really considered considered it from that perspective. But you know he prefaced it with one comment of contests realizes it and my listeners. Which is music doesn't choose who listens to right? That's right. Wow how deep. Yeah and you know I think about that in terms of like when I'm creating something you know I'm writing from my own perspective. My own experience variance. I'm getting it out. It's you know it is very meaningful impersonal to me in that way and then we've talked about this on the podcast before to like once you make a song and you put it into the world. It's doesn't belong to me anymore. And it belongs to whomever's listening and making it part of their lives or their world and I'd never really considered the idea That that's like that's like an act of love you know what's amazing is like. We've had the experience multiple times you and I were. We're you know apropos of your material. May Be at a house concert. You know someone will come up and be like I love this song Blah Blah Blah. Whatever the song is I just love so much that you wrote a song about x and the thing that they're like your song x is not at all what to you and therefore to me the song is about you know what I mean but like? They're not wrong to them. That's what the song long is about the song about right right right absolutely. It's really like it's sort of like an interesting metaphor for like it. Just how we exist in the world to right like like we talk a lot about on this podcast state. Being staying on our side of the street earned her personal personal relationships and those kind of just like healthy boundary living. But it's kind of similar right like I I would. I want to impose my own view or perspective on any any one of my songs on anyone else or do I want them to have the freedom to come to it as they are. You know as like that's that's what love is. Love is being able to come to something as you are and and so it. It just seems like sort of a beautiful lake umbrella metaphor for just existing in the world we offer ourselves we offer ourselves as authentically and in his true away as we can and then we let it go you know and and and it just seems like that's a neat metaphor for sort of how to live in a loving way toward the world. Absolutely our buddy. Jen commented on that post you made on facebook was like that should be your next t shirt. And you're very accurately relate. Man should be jubilees next absolutely. I would buy t shirt that says music loves. Everybody absolutely absolutely would get that teacher one day. Yeah seriously yeah I feel like this this conversation. Actually did you have to say about it. I like this conversation. Really kind of like dovetails very nicely into the experience we had yesterday. which is that? We drove down to Salem Oregon to install a kind of like a recording studio installed recording studio. It was more than just a music computer. That was that was the original goal but we can talk about how that goal all sort of balloon to blossomed into something bigger but we installed a recording studio in a center for Youth Transitional Facility for youth eighteen to twenty five life. Yeah and I feel like our conversation with about music and what it means. The world really dovetails nicely with that. So why did we go to Salem until they give people the background. Sure sure so So we went to sail because we have a very dear friend Shan Tae and Chan Tae has been Just a dear personal life now for like seven years we figured yeah yeah She attended a house concert and then went to another one that you're after that that was twenty two thousand thirteen and fourteen fifteen sixteen seventeen eighteen. Nineteen she has hosted has six in a row now. And just our relationship with her. It's just been so rewarding She's just got the coolest family The whole thing is great. They're just everyone is lovely and their friends are cool and wonderful people and the virus just always so need everyone so creative just great love it love it love it love and so chantal. Just got a new job this spring as the program director for host. It's been it's been there for like thirty something years. And their meantime and they do amazing work. They transitional services for kids in the position of being announced and kids not not meaning like children because these are people built their target population is Eighteen to twenty five. Yeah and so. We went there to do a gift of Music Concert Concert on our tour this summer and that is something we do. We've done for the last couple of years in our album fundraiser. where if someone buys is this level of support package for album fundraiser? We will go perform a concert for a group of people or in a place that wouldn't otherwise probably have access to To the concerts and so like for example. A transitional shelter for an has youth and it was an amazing experience The kids are so wonderful And you know I say kids because like they're technically adults but that eighteen to twenty five age and it's it's like yeah you can be tried as an adult but your frontal lobe isn't even baked until the very end of that age range also saying kids because literally any of them could actually be our children. Yeah that's really true. Yeah and and also lake. There was a really joyous sort of childlike old. Lake atmosphere. Not like an infantile kind of way but like all playful China It seemed like there was a lot of intentionally with them whether they would be be able to articulate this or not. I'm not sure but there was just so much play among all of that. And you know they've all been in such difficult situations. I mean a lot of them living on the streets. Yeah I think pretty much all living on the streets for at least a night or two before they found this place you know some of them still living on the streets but coming in for days every day services and then going back out to fend for themselves overnight you know oh my gosh. Yeah and so did this concert and there's this there's this one Really sweet kid and you should. You should pick up the conversation here and talk doc about how he's Shanghaied you after the concert. Yeah so we met a bunch of the kids before like we had built in time to meet and greet and gets no people before the concert and then we then we sat down for the concert itself and so I had met pretty much. Everyone you know that stayed for the concert beforehand This one particular kid will call them. S For this conversation. I mean we did. He did sign a release that we could use name for a photo. So it's on my facebook orange. Look Okay Yeah so but he sat you. Would you invited him to sit. Next is to you during the concert and so he did that. He's real shy real withdrawn and it just seemed like maybe he could use a buddy. Yeah and it was kind of a Loner Shanta and also had said also pointed out as being somebody who I was particularly interested in music so you had them sitting next to you and I notice that he was like looking at your mixer at times but honestly most of the time during the concert he was sitting with his eyes closed. Hands kind of like folded on his knees. And just taking it in like intentional absorbing the experience a really just Intentional kind of way and and then after the concert we were hanging hanging out somewhere and he comes up to me. He's like would you come with me for a minute back the art room and they have a room you know sort of as part of the facility to the end of the hall at the end up facility and it's they're like art slash music room and we've been in there earlier in the day we were going in. And he's like in this week. Showed me In the music room I should say they had A. They had a keyboard that people could play guitars. And then lots of art supplies and stuff people would do painting and all that kind of stuff so just a couple of Alexa hand drums. Minimal instrument music making instruments. kind of stuff. You could probably find at goodwill as probably confounded donate hodgepodge donated stuff. So but he he he brings us back there and he pulls out this This like a notepad like illegal had and he had written on it like four pages of lyrics meticulously written now this was not his first draft because there were no scribbles or like messy. It was like clearly lovingly written down. You know transcribed these four pages. And he's like these. This is a song that I that I wrote. And he had two pages that were labeled at the top with the letter s and he had two pages that were labeled at the top letter C. and he explained to me that you know in the song there's a there's a sub-conscious voice which is the ones with the S. and there's a conscious voice which is the played pages with the C. And I imagine that the that when this you know when the song is recorded that like the the conscious voices like over here in the headphones and the subconscious voice has like a treatment on it over here that sounds district to her right and left everyone but you right but he he had he had all thought out like how the song would go if it recorded as a recorded piece of music production ideas that he'd written down. Yeah and so he. He thought this all through but there was no way for him to execute that idea like he he had it all thought out and you know clearly outlined but no way to actually execute and so our wheels started turning. Yeah almost immediately after that and it wasn't that same day yeah it was so my my immediate thought was. This kid needs a music computer and so I said about AH trying to get them one and you know I got it for the facility but like I and you know I I told I told Channel this last night like I got it for the facility but I got it for him right now because really like I just remember how much music saved me when I was when I was transitioning out of being homeless. So you know It's all I wanted to do and I created an opportunity I was someone else was very generous and creating opportunity for me to make music musical fulltime part of my life that person it was Jaycee good and he was a club owner. Yeah he gave me a job. Doing live sound arguably didn't deserve a job doing laps out right and And he really believed in me and gave me an opportunity to to to start the thing that became where I am now right right Jay. Thanks J. UH-HUH I thank Jay every chance I get I have told him this. You know to his face. I have told him this On facebook. I've told this messages. I probably thanked him ten times. I'll probably thank him one hundred more you know But yeah I know I know the power that that being so passionate about something creative like that can have like in that sort sort of transition. I mean it's odd that I also have homeless homelessness in my story. Yeah you know but it's also I don't have homelessness in my story but music saved my life. Yeah in in that kind of way. Also you know like if I if I didn't have if I didn't have the opportunity ready to to work on to write songs and perform them in front of people and and figuring out how to scripture the resources to make my first as little recording. You Know I. It was essential to me in my in the most. Like fragile transitional part of my life. Also you know it was. It was a lifeline to be able to just create something to all those roiling stuff going on inside of me to have an outlet for for making it heard you know it was a little flag that you can plant a little piece of the Earth and say I'm here. This is who I am. Yeah yeah totally a big deal totally so so i. I did a facebook fundraiser. At one of my head now patented Lake side quests that you call them side quests Y- ah I ask you you would look a little back of the Napkin sort of Budget and you're like okay. If we can raise seven hundred bucks we could we. Could you know. Get the gear needed to make some record. Yeah I figured I could get like a used I mac. And maybe a crappy audio interface. I mean anything's better than what they have. Because they have nothing right right right and I figure they just use their on headphones and just like you know at least it would be something that they could just like noodle on yeah but People took to the story and went nuts. So you posted it on facebook where you did all this. This totally made just a single post on facebook about it like just Atlanta situation and and people long story short ended up contributing Like like a little bit over sixteen hundred bucks so which just made it a completely different vision that I was able to execute and so we really installed a little recording studio yesterday. we installed Some a pair of really nice Speakers Studio Speakers Really good used AMAC Really Clean Really Nice powerful A really good mid range audio interface. with a lot of good tactile like it was a a goal for me to everything. Be just like obvious to us an easy to figure out possible because there's going to be people using who don't know anything about it so I wanted to be one knob one funk. Yeah you know like you'd hold down this button impressed. Yes the sub menu. Thank God you know if you twist Inaba does a thing and there's a light associated period and that's great yeah audio interface for those of you who are not into music world is the thing that gets audio from the real world and did the computer. It's right vice versa. Convert sound into one zero us. Yeah and you know. Hopefully it sounds good while it's doing it and that's what you pay more or less for. They all do the same thing. But you can pay you know a hundred bucks or you can pay ten thousand dollars. It's just a question. And how good is this. Yeah and so we got but like they get better really quickly you know lake the sub two hundred dollar ones or kind of crap but then like anything above two hundred dollars much better so we do that and that's And then just a bunch of microphone stands and microphones in a really good cabling for everything. A pair of studio quality headphones. The same kind that you and I are wearing right now because that's what we use around our house because they're great yeah Not to mention the computer the computer and the computer and And then what else and cabling and just some odds and ends stuff you do cook it together and all that you know everything that you would need i. It's it's essentially a fully functioning little mini recording studio. I could make a good record on this absolutely absolutely next record on this. Set up if you had to. We have to record here by four PM every day. I'm kidding yeah but it's I mean it's amazing. You know like that that we were able to to give to them You know courtesy of our amazing community. This just it's a really good setup and then we spent yesterday like I spent the first hour like like setting it up and then spent the next thing. I don't know four five hours. Whatever it was like a longtime raining Our our our young friend in how to use everything he needs to know. Oh to run this system he tells he picks it up to your teaching how to roll cables. which is there's more to it than you think? You haven't done it before. And he was telling he till he got it like Doc. An expert by the day was done. You know it's great because we had a stack of like you get the cables out of the packaging and they're all sort of in the twist ties wherever they come in. But then it's like you've got to put the VELCRO APPS on him so there you have to have a vocal up attached to each cable so it just lives with it and that makes it easier to the whole thing and so it's like okay. Show them how to do the first one and then there were like nine more any any screwed up pretty badly but I made them do it again. Then he did okay but by the ninth when they were looking nice. Yeah it was great. Well that's what happened to your to Ray when you first got involved audio in here. Who is mentoring you first thing? I learned how to roll cable. That's it and he wouldn't let me touch the soundboard until I knew how to do cables right and that was like the second. Yeah I was just doing cables thought. We had to compress time frame a bit. But you know the first half hours rolling cable But yeah by the end of the day like he had walked him through like making a little test garage band session and he was like cruising around in it and doing stuff yeah and blowing blowing his own mind like on a every time you heard newshounds like his is with like. He's he plays his emotions close to his vest now. He's has had a lot of trauman in his young and I don't know that necessarily showing a lot of outward emotion. A lot of over to motion is the safest thing for him all the time. Necessarily but even within that frame he was he was enthusiastically. Visibly excited it was really really really sweet. If you WANNA see The picture of this young man that he signed. It's because like the. There's a client relationship kind of privacy sort of thing that places like this. Have to really be very careful about and so Chris permission to post his his picky he'd literally signed a release signed and dated a release saying that like we could post his picture which is super close so if you WANNA see his beautiful smiling face just go to my facebook book page facebook Dot Com Slash Hill Jim. That's H. I. L. L. J. A. M. and you'll see him. It was rewarding as heck yes and I imagine there will be some ongoing mentorship there. I hope so uh-huh and the when we met when we were there for the concert Couple of months ago was that a couple months ago and We met a bunch of other and kids there and a lot of them are musical leg. I heard one of them play a beautiful classical piano while we were there and Others were singing. You know. There's one kid had this really cool like almost like musical theatre type voice you know really like the very beautiful lilting. A lot of them have have music in them and I just I wish this hope that you know that. Maybe the the young friend that you trained yesterday. Might you know I. It sounds like he was eager to actually pass on what he learned to. Other people. The center you know it'll be it'll be interesting to see you you what they create and maybe they wouldn't be so interesting learning the engineering but maybe he could record that exactly exactly and lake help them make a little lake make recordings of themselves performing that they could carry around on their phone. Imagine how impairing that would be like. Here's me I'm an artist. I made this straight totally and the other thing And the you mentioned this in your facebook facebook post to and. I'm really glad that you said that. Because it's been on my mind you know Giving a gift like this you know. It's you know the people who who contributed those of you who in our community who contributed to the fundraising for this This gift of a recording studio. Thank you by the way goodness. You're amazing There's a big gift right. It's like all the staff who came in yesterday to see what we were up to in that room. We're like holy moly so you know it's a it's a really nice. You know thing I in in a place where people who come for services. There don't have a lot of Nice Nice things if any nice things in their lives. It's a it's a big deal but I feel like I've been thinking a lot about the notion that like a gift. Ah that it's just a gift. There's no expectation like so when I say I have wishes and hopes I do like I really hope the best for this and and Ah the same time you know. It's it's important to just it's important to just maintain a a an open handed nece about got it and and let it be whatever these folks want it to be in their lives. I need thing about it. Is that this. Computers Theaters Air Gapped Lake. It's not on the Internet right. That's I don't get wi fi at that room like that. Like the only way for that computer to get on the Internet is if Shanta goes down there with your phone and turns on on her hotspot connect right right which we had to do a couple of times to download a couple aspen drivers or whatever for the computer you know but like the kid. There's no way that they can't go back through and uses just to surf the Internet on the Internet right which is so creative machine and that's it that's it if they want to get files off at to enjoy like put on their phone or whatever are they literally have to put him on a like a USB drive drive to another computer yeah. That's great. It is great. Yeah Yeah so what a great day what was just one of those days that we left smiling and it was great feeling good so those of you who contributed to that effort. Thank you so much speaking of things that made us smile this week. Yeah just WANNA mentioned this quickly. Our dear friends Karma nate goes on a day trip as these are friends. People that we have here in Tacoma. We were introduced to them by our friends Brad and Kim loomis whom he loves dearly and they have become people who were superfund up here and they live in our town and they're great they're big supporters of independent music. They host house concerts on their own and have been for a long entendre. True Believers are wonderful They're smart they're funny. They're great and they offered to plan and surprises with a day trip to Saturday. Okay so like. We didn't even know we were going. All we knew is that we just had to show up at noon at their house and bring nothing and just planned to be all dressed in layers and here we go. Yeah it was it and they took us to the Washington coast to some favorite spots of. There's there and oh my gosh. It was a perfect day very few clouds in the sky. Sixty sixty degrees light breeze in the sun. Lucky we were spoiled. It's just it was picture. Perfect Autumn foliage everywhere sitting have been that Nice now the Washington coast on the second of November early November should be pissing down rain forty eight degrees so yeah it was great it was beautiful. It was thank you carbonate. If you're listening to this. It was a really fun day just to get to go to be at someone else's mercy don't let go and see things that spot that are meaningful. Unfold them that they enjoy. It was really neat. Dang we live in a beautiful state tomato sauce. Two Bald Eagles five away to locate. This is how magical our day was you all the day. The last spot that we visited on the coast it literally ended the visit ended with a Bald Eagle taking taking off and flying off into the frigging sunset over the ocean. I'm not kidding. You like all the national anthem played in my. We're all all saluting. I'm so glad that none of us actually saluted sitting there quietly respecting the troops in the eagles the Eagles Eagles. We'd actually my dad's from Philadelphia. So there's a tie in there. Eagles this is this is what going off the rails. Hey take a break and when we get back from the break. We'll tackle Scott's topics so back in a SEC Uh We're back back. Did you miss us. I missed us. I missed us. Yeah we have a listener topic from Scott Schreiber and Scott. Says I'd like to hear. How did you hear me spent my fingers I did? I did says I'd like to hear how Shannon and Jamie maintained social grace and open minds when they encounter someone of a different belief or value systems thinking that we do that got. That's the very charitable. We appreciate that a lot. Being on tour you must encounter many kinds of people side note. I know that Shannon had an interesting encounter at my house concert grimacing face. That's uh-huh face. We actually did spend a bit of a podcast over the summer. When we were doing our summer adventures podcasts Talking about that particular long story a real short Shannon got what's the word proselytized witness to these other of those pseudo pseudo aggressive kind of way. Never not uncomfortable yeah. There's no way that that happens is good totally the interesting question. I here's here's a sentence no one probably ever says yes. I'd love to hear about Jesus I don't know I'm just saying so Scott about maintaining social grace. So far was that Greece Open. Mind it we do. We encounter all different kinds of people and that was that became really obvious. When we first started touring nationally? You know like we got outside of like just what you know the West Coast. Jimmy started getting into other other regions of the country. Like there are all different stripes of people out there and we need a lot of different kinds of people so And I think that it's been really. It's been really good to to get to know folks with different backgrounds and different perspectives perspectives. Different belief systems and value systems. You know like I think that like the overarching thing for me personally has been that that you know regardless of what all what's attached to a person in all of those ways like what is it. What is it like to be in a room with them to share space with them? Are you able to be open to each other. And and gracious and loving toward each other like kid people do that and the answer is most of the time. Yeah Yeah and I think you know. It's that's a big asterisk though. which is that one or both of the people has to not get super personally invested in the interaction? What do you mean by that? Well like if you you know if if like say for example in that sort of you know being witnessed you situation like the problem. There was that in that situation. One person's super invested in and the other person is invested in you having a particular response right and that's that's what the whole interaction for them Kinda hinges upon where you can just exchange ideas and touch upon them if there's disagreement move on or probe them gently but move off when it's uncomfortable but if as long as there's like a sense of thing we're doing together other an unspoken understanding that we're probably not coming at this from the same place right but let's just see where we're each at and have a conversation about it and keep things cool wool rhino. I think it's one like it when when both people don't necessarily have that commitment. Let's keep things cool that unspoken thing go wrong absolutely we absolutely and it's it's unusual in a social setting where you're meeting people for the first time or you know them in a really casual way for someone to cross a boundary in that way. Yeah and to to to not respect your person hood and you're you're right to you know to have your own ideas says or thoughts about things your autonomy. Yeah Agency but there are. There are some people who are. I'm convinced that it's their job to convince other people to think like they do and you know I mean is it. Weird are one one hand. Is it weird unusual. Well there are things about about like there. Are Things about like how I how I see the world for instance that I do wish others more more people would think about the world in that way like in terms of like over the course of my life. I've learned a lot for instance. It's about how how I used to hold pretty bigoted views about LGBTQ people. For instance. I I was raised in a tradition. That taught me that that was wrong. And so I developed all these belief systems around the idea that that was wrong and an gratefully. I was given opportunities in my life to undo that thinking and to to change my mind. Yeah you know and so. That's that's an area where like I would like for those people who who don't see. LGBTQ people in their full humanity to think more like that. I would like to. I would like people to think for like me in that way if they don't already right so so it would be disingenuous to say that you know I don't I don't WanNa try to convince other people to think like me because there are some things that yeah I wish. I wish that I could influence people. Although is is it that you wish that you could influence them. Or is it that you wish that they would be influenced or would have some kind of a conversion experience like because you don't you don't just go around like spouting often like seeing who's on which side and right you don't you don't take a poll and people who are thinking wrong tried it. Can you know you don't proselytize. LGBTQ positively right right right. I get it I mean but in some way I do like I take the chance time every chance I get to talk on this podcast about my views about those kinds of. That's not directed at any one individual conversation like if if you're making somebody uncomfortable it's not personal right so I guess the point is that like I could encounter a person who has a different point of view about something and we can we. If we're both on board with with not trying to strong arm the other person into our own point of view then then we can share ideas and look for places of connection. If we're both interested in that that's easy easier to do. It's when one person has decided it's their job to convince Vince the other one to change their mind and they can get tricky. Yeah you know what's always super instantly. There's a there's a certain aspect respective this that where I feel like I can just detach and just like really get interested in someone else's point of view. which is it's a really specific niche subset? which is is a person who is a it's sort of endangered minority in one group having views that are in in a weird way kind of bigoted toward an endangered minority of another group? And here I'll give you an example K.. Right okay we have a we have a contingent of people people in our world In the Mid West we have a big huge redneck. Lesbian following and part of the redneck lesbian thing for a subset of with them is that they are super pro gun and blue lives matter and therefore like anti black lives matter and kind of pro cop anti-black in the shakes so you know and some of them living very proximity to Ferguson Missouri. Right right and so like a few years ago. That was like a really of the moment issue like it was is it was everyone in the country was talking about including us as we were on tour coming into these people's communities ten miles away from Ferguson and having these really wild conversations where in where Blake Blake Lesbians being being like all pro cop about the Ferguson thing. It's like the same people. Broadly writ who are are who have their thumb other boots on the next of black people. Also have your boots on your neck. Because you're a lesbian. Like right there should be solidarity here and it's just so interesting being to me too. Like hear them explain probably from their point of view even if they're not articulating it directly. Because I would never ask is probably directly but just like talking about why they feel the way they do about that from there you know. Sort of unspoken point of view is like Air Lesbian. It's like well that's so interesting to me and that's the kind of thing that I really genuinely just like. I could listen to them. Talk about that all daily you find it in one way reprehensible that's for sure one of the examples of a point of the point of view like you're talking about a minute ago. Wish you didn't have that point of view. I would like to see that changed in you but also like you have to understand that moment that if someone has a deeply believe that I'm not gonNA be the one to change it right. You know what I mean. So let's just want to listen and learn. Yeah Yeah Fair enough I think that's also illustrated an illustration of how I think we tend to I I mean we we do this as humans. We tend to simplify things as much as possible and put people in categories because then we can just file them away like okay that person is XYZ. You know and I think this is an illustration of the fact that people are way more complex than we give them credit for a lot of the time. So like you know your assumption going into the conversation that okay. The lesbian ought to be on the side of another marginalized population visa. The you know the focus and you know black lives matter protesters protesters and then they blow your mind cause they weren't well. Guess what there's room in the world for someone's maybe internalized turn analyzed white supremacist. Tendencies to override the the the solidarity with another marginalized community. They might be more white than they are gay right so humans are complex. And I think it's important to remember that like and I think that we're talking about the rich tapestry of human existence. This is part of that is a better for worse earnings and a lot of things. We're kind of veering off of the original topic. When I'm going here remedy status anyways like look? We listened to summer to a podcast about whiteness seeing white and and we started listening to the follow-up the next episode or the next season of that podcast called men and both those and other things that I've been reading stuff over the last few months have really started to reinforce his idea. Yeah for me that like the layers of society this sort of strata of society. You know where we divide each other up by race or sexuality or by you know gender that you know that that that what what boils would it boils down to for you know one group needing to keep another the group down. It's just about maintaining power. It's all about that. Racism is about power. Sexism is about power. Bigotry is about power. Xenophobia is about power it's all all goes back to power right insult you can. You can kind of understand how lake someone who has white supremacist. Tendencies or internalized racism. You know that that could trump you know solidarity because of you know of or a potential solidarity because they are sort of unspoken sub-conscious thought process is being like well. Yeah I I am Gay and and I get shit because of that but at least I'm not black right. That'd be worse today mean. Yeah yeah so I guess it's an important lesson in that. People are a lot more complex than we assume them to be. Sure you know so true. Yeah but I think you know the how to maintain social grace race for me going into different circumstances where we know. We're going to meet different kinds of people you know there are times times. There have been times when you know. I know that like like two two summers ago. We brought the show the space between on the road which was a show that that dealt adult pretty directly with divisions in our society based on race and and based on bigotry and things like that like racist communities well and so there were some nights where I knew going in I felt like I was going to. I was kind of going to battle a little bit you. I'm not sure that here's what those circumstances taught me which does relate to this topic that Scott brought up today about how to maintain an open minded and social grace you Kind of people have different belief systems with that taught me. Is that Lake Okay. I've been invited into this place to do this thing that I do. This is the record. Do put out this year. You know when we were booking these house concerts. The first single we had out in the world was a song called. Hello Don which was about like waking up to the idea that things are Ruvuma stuff right now. A new made a conversational video for that. People were forewarned not a mystery what we were going to be bringing in bringing on tour that year so so so you know going to those places places where I felt like we were kind of going to war. I are going into battle. We were invited to be there. I had created. This show had written these songs we had created the show together. Are we like at that point. All my my my only job was to show up and do me right like I. I was my job was to show up. Do the show that we came to do and the rest is out of my control right. The rest is up to them. And you know if I if I if I say that I believe that's the way to approach the world. You know I have to have to like live that through you know and so it became honestly like a a nightly practice of mind especially that summer when we brought that particular show on the road knowing that it was gonNA maybe rub some people in make. Some people may be pretty frigging reckon uncomfortable. Maybe some maybe uncomfortable. Sometimes I had to I. That's when I began my sort of nightly mantra of sitting down at the piano. And just saying it's my job to just offer myself and love these people and you know like an and so you know when when you approach the world in that way like that. That's it's all we can do right And we can hope for the best. Yeah and you know also like I think it's really important to like. Set the idea to that like that that maintaining social grace does not mean acquiescing or not pushing back share. You know what I mean like. Yes definitely the I've had to learn is how in situations like we're because we'll definitely just have people come up to us every once in a while and never it's not a a frequent thing but lake. Just start come up to us and starting inappropriate conversation. You know what I mean like Lake assume for whatever weird eared misguided reasons. Why on Earth would you assume this about? Either you or me that we'd be super into like some anti immigrant kind of talk right right. Oh you're from from California especially with you know like Oh you guys used to live in California emigrants. Aw Shit like why. Would you even think I'd be the person person to talk to you about that. But like that aside like okay. It's here now. We're talking about pray for my own self respect and like just my own integrity. I have to can't just be like. Yeah you know what I mean. Oh Yeah it's but it's also important not just to insult somebody somebody because that's not a productive thing you know and it's also not going to help me accomplish. My goal is changing their mind. Eventually I won't change their mind but you know what I will do if I push push back at them violently as I will show them to double down on and build another tiny candy coated protective layer of anger around that hateful feeling feeling. They're having what I really want to be. Soft and encourage softness in that person right away some of his heart and calcified layers right. You know and so you know asking probing questions and and Listening Lake and not just listening to rebut. We talked about. John is a week or so ago. Not Listening to respond but listening to learn now. Do I think I'm GONNA learn something useful from a racist or a bigot. No not necessarily but learning learning what their mindset yeah and the thought patterns or their life experience or whatever it might be that have led them to arrive at this place that they're at uh-huh Lake that's good to know about that instructive to me. If only sort of Jujitsu we kind of way right like knowing how things like that. Thanks and we're like building my own internal database of how people who think like that again. They're not like they're not a model list. Like there's a lot of different types of ways that people can think about stuff like this and just like learning some of the different different like other commonalities or things that people generally think were generally feel who hold these kinds of US travel the country. You know they watch Fox Fox News. That's absolutely be a lot of and what can you do. I mean that's if someone's watching propaganda they're sort of lost. You know what I mean. Yeah and and I don't know how we get them out of that. Let's shut down Fox News do that anyway. I didn't mean to interrupt you but you're right it can be it can be instructive that kind of an ear and I think we'll go ahead and by being a good and respectful listener but also in a respectful way pushing back. Yeah lots lots of you know. Doing yes and stuff you know that can that can be really helpful like as like asking people just like why do you. Why do you think that is why? How do you feel that way? Like really asking probing questions of the other person is not just like not trying to robuck but just trying to get them because sometimes the best rebuttal to To a factually inaccurate argument is just to let the other person play out for themselves right not to immediately rebuffed and then they defend and then you're both stuck but that'd be like interesting. Tell me why you think that. Do you feel that way. Yeah you know and just let them run the whole real out and maybe by the end of it will be like even even if not to me just internally lake. Yeah there were a couple of inconsistencies. Maybe that's maybe the best we can. You're absolutely right about the Russian that like those of us like so just having different. There's some things that we we can have different beliefs about the don't really matter right right right. Ford Chevy. I'm from Vermont. So let's let's let's not get crazy. Remind what are you supposed to be. Well I mean it depends where it's not like Vermont is Chevy Contra. Okay right but it's it's just like it's the kind of place where like if you're a four person your fricken four per se and screw Chevy but again this issues. That just doesn't really matter in the real world. Sure it's not harming anyone really to have an opinion one way or the other but there are clearly a lot of things. People have the strongly held beliefs about that that when those beliefs are acted upon in how they treat people how they vote how they interact in society can be detrimentally harmful to people and to particular populations and I think that in that regard you know we're we're way past the the live and let live right age of things with a lot of that stuff you know like the those of what I have learned about the structural racism in our society What what I've learned about the the the structural bigotry the the things that are woven into our culture the the sexism the You know things that are foundational to to this entire society in which we all exist. The areas in which I have privilege ledge with regard to those areas like it is my if I'm not if I'm not using my voice to speak up for what's right. In those ways that is me acquiescing to the status quo which is harmful for other people like we're in. We're in a position. Now where like those of us who who who can speak about and and offer those moments of reflection with others about their belief system if it's a belief system that is harmful. It's our responsibility to do that. I think that's right And we were. What is the the quote the Silence as always Yeah so that's that's where we're at and I think your point about how to sort of you know. Listen with genuine curiosity about where someone's point of view is coming in from and then asking probing questions to help them sort of identify getting a little deeper. Getting someone defensive never helps now and it will only serve to reinforce their views. So it's it's hard for me. Sometimes I have to say because I can get I can get pretty Dang mad you might say like Dang for example. That's that's steamy steamy right. I use curse words guilty about you. Bless your blessing. Now the crossroads you could say I feel really passionate. I think you know I think I have to when I when I dig a little bit a little bit deeper. I think some of my I can feel sometimes for people who have expressed bigoted racist or you name it. Beliefs beliefs about people in the world. I think that part of my rage when I I'm really honest about it may come from the notion that for a lot of those beliefs I used to buy into that belief system like an older version of me. Was the person saying you know that it's embarrassing to say it out loud. An older version of me was the person saying that homosexuality is sin. I mean that's and that's cut. It's embarrassing for me to say that you know like we. We've all harbored stupid somewhere on a spectrum team stupid and repugnant of using our in younger versions of our lives. It's the very rare person who hasn't save yourself some great thank you. I appreciate that by that. But it's important for me to acknowledge that I think that that might be the source of some of my rage. It's not necessarily righteous anger all the time it is some some part of it is a seed of me being really angry at myself for having held those us for as long as I did in my life. Yeah right right. We often see qualities and other people that we either having ourselves or have had an ourselves that we don't like we transfer our anger or our emotions about those things onto others. So I think it doesn't. It's an important thing for me to keep in check. You know in terms of my emotions about that stuff But if I can actually acknowledge that in the moment that also maybe Oh helps would help me to identify an empathetic way from where someone like. That's coming in. That's absolutely true. And that kind of gets back to what I was talking in terms of like like just like really hearing someone out on how they arrived at their belief system. You know 'cause like I think when you fully the more full you understand where someone's coming from and the more effectively you can maybe help guide them out of that place right yeah. Hopefully I wanted to add one more thing before we sum up is that if that's okay is that that part of part of of my journey has been to figure out how to actually actually stand up for myself and some of those circumstances because like my tendency with my co dependency is to is to shape shift in any conversation conversation with someone to make them feel like. I'm agreeing with them. That the Mike you're on their side like I'm on their side exactly like I'm super conflict averse and so I don't want to you. No I don't want to create any sort of feeling of rift with another person but it's been really really important for me in my own personal journey to figure out how to stand and firmly in who I am and and to be able to say confidently what I would I think. Even if it's not what the other person wants to hear that that moment you know. So like for instance in Scots example. When he said that he he remembered US having an experience with the guest at his show this summer and this person started off with questions about what is my? What is my spirituality and I thought at first maybe she was just genuinely curious? You know what that part of my life looks like and so I you know onto cool. Let's talk about it. You know I love talking about that stuff. Sure it became very clear over the course of our conversation that she had an agenda that she she really wanted to convince me to think about those things in the way that she thinks about those things. And it really bummed me out you know first of all because I thought we were going to have a conversation but I had to at a certain point when I realized what was happening I had to make a decision to sort of lake steel myself and be like okay I. It's not. I'm not being in true to myself if I just let her sink. That I'm in agreement with her or do do that that that conflict averse thing that I I can do really well. You know that it was important for me to figure out in the moment and it was like I was super tired at the end of this conversation because I was like my brain it was on overdrive trying to figure out how to remain true and say the things that were true for me while also allowing her to to be heard it was really hard you know and I. I don't think that we ended into place is certainly thinks she was happy with the conclusion of our conversation. But you know like I literally had to say to her like Ken. We just agree that each of us has found a path that's meaningful to each each ourselves. And Can I. Can I celebrate with you that you found some really works for you and can you offer me that. Also like I had to ask her to to You know respect that boundary and she she kind of did so insertive begrudging way and left deflated which I guess it worked out you know. I don't I doubt I'll see her again. You know but that's okay. That is all right. That's all right and I feel like deflated. It is appropriate there. I feel like that worked out the way that should have you know. Yeah so yes got Social the grace generally open minds. Maybe not as much over being A. Where's the thing right like open mind? Mine is not exactly maybe the perfect frame for this right because open mind sort of implies a general malleability and willingness to entertain and. There's a lot of stuff that I am not very malleable on nor willing to entertain shirk. I am at a place in my life where I don't feel at all like I've learned everything there is to learn that said. There's a certain set of core beliefs that that I feel pretty strongly about that. Don't feel like they're going to be changed by anybody around things generally in the social justice arena. Come at me with stuff about immigrants or raced I For Talking Shit about the poor or Class stuff or you know any any of the myriad ways in which we're terrible to one hundred segment each other out in the groups that we then try to oppress like I'm not going to change my mind about that stuff which means I don't have an open mind. You know right right now. If you want to make a well-considered argument to me about the virtues of like Penny Pasta versus Spaghetti listening holds the sauce inside the noodle go on my thing. But I'm willing to listen. Yes but we're we're comes where someone else's humanities involved. I don't averill open mind. Should have an open mind where someone else's humidity is being threatened. Yeah absolutely appropriate there at all. Yeah but a curiosity about about how someone has arrived at. Those views might isn't could be instructive. Maybe that's maybe that's more what it is. Wow Man you're real screwed up talk to you more about the social graces. We're good at that. So Scott I hope that was something along the lines of what you were asking asking about our rabbit trail certainly tickets. I people usually come in the big rations so hopefully it worked out. Yeah but thank you. Hopefully at least you enjoyed the discussion and you know what I would like to hear what you have to say Scott and other Stars in our group. We didn't mention this earlier but people who are supporting members of this podcast become members of our private facebook. Group you get invited you'll have to turn down the invite We'd be hanging but blue eyed love to have a conversation in the group about this topic of other people who are listening to have more to say. We certainly have not exhausted the topic so chime in let us know what you think What did we miss what you know? What do you have to say about it? Let's go right before we get wrong. Yeah I've definitely curious And if you want to become part of that group into not already part heard of that group do you miss fit stars dot com slash. Join and you become a supporting member. Here's the deal basically. It's this if you have five extra dollars per month and you like what we are doing in the world and you would like to support us in that small way we'd be really grateful for it so You can become supporting member of the podcast and by so doing become a small support to what we're doing and all the small business of Gorkha aggregated turn something much bigger than you do stuff with it like makes his podcast which you love right. You're still listening don't she. Lets let's you're still listening. You don't hate it or your hate listening to it or you don't know how to turn off your IPAD. Yeah yeah which said Yeah. Okay listening to podcast for our can't turn it off show Alexa for the love of God. You all thank you so much leads for listening today. we will