Power Project EP. 184 - Frank Tufano
The. Whenever you already. I'm ready ready, Freddie. Let's do this ready with the spaghetti. What's happening? I gotta I gotta work out already in today. I saw that that you you popped in pretty early today came in here and a little bit of cardio session and hit up some dead lifts and some bantam rose and some late curls. Just moving around, you know, trying to good we're got again, I might I might work out again. Because like, you know, my workouts are a little shorter. So actually they're lot shorter. Like might only be like twenty thirty minutes long. So when they're shorter it's kinda easier just to get him in because you're not thinking about your workout being so hard. And I think that's a huge problem that a lot of people make when they're thinking about a diet thinking about exercise. They're thinking about man, this is going to be, you know, have to go Kito or have to do carnivore. I have to be gin or they think that they have to do something so crazy, and it's like, we'll were you starting. Let's let's figure that out. If you're starting from the couch, then a wa- simple walkout side would be fantastic progress and to do that for a few days in a row that would be a really excellent place to start doesn't always have to be so hard, right? Just change the simple things, I know a lot of people that when they first start lifting. They start like programs like two and a half workouts or two hour, long workout. So I'm just like, hey, no, you're not going to stick to that. They work at like six or seven days a week just start slow. Well, we know a lot of people to that that exercise frequently and that don't have nearly the body that they want or the strength that they want and these same people will, you know, on a Friday Saturday night, they might go and let loose and then they're like, oh that's it back on Monday. When Monday comes around cardio in the morning fasted. And then I'm gonna hit the gym at night. And it's like dude you really like you're setting up a really rough schedule for yourself. That's okay. That you enjoyed yourself. That's fine. Everyone should everyone's got the right to good for you. And just, you know, don't let just like Jay Cutler said don't be fancy consistent grad away to be consistent with it. If you if you're able to do fasting. That's great. If we're able to throw in some cardio that's cool able to mix some lifting some cardio fasting. That's great. But it doesn't have to start out that way you have to start out with a big bang right away. You can kind of chip away at things you can work your way into things. That's kinda why excited talk to today's guests because it's like how do you end up down this rabbit hole? Like this. You know, how do you? We got another carnivore guy on the podcast today. And not only carnivore, but he's like eating raw meat, right? He's a he's a deep savage. Yeah. He's eating raw meat raw liver you ever done that for. No. What about sushi sushi? Yeah. I guess it's that have carpaccio sliced beef just pretty much. I think the same things we're all a restaurant in Lisa's carpaccio. That was the first time I had that. But yo- like my household. We cook our army. We all cook are meat. So yeah, this is a Steph different culture shock, and the only thing I've ever had just polka. Yeah. But no now that I think about it is kinda odd that like, you know, I'm cool with eating like fish, right? Raw fish. But the idea of eating absolute raw meat like raw is kind of odd. Right. Yeah. Just kind of those two together. I'm like never thought of weird too. 'cause like Ross steak doesn't sound that bad, but raw ground beef sounds hor horrifying discussing or or raw chicken can even watch Neidl Keith wrought chicken. I think he does like straight raw red meat. I mean, can you just like, you know, grab a bird and try to just eat it or like those and go go by the cow. Substrate up eat frequent tat tackle him. True. Carnivore? Have you had like raw liver and stuff like that? Like two straight up. Have you done that? I don't think I have there's there's a video of him like he has large raw liver. Just to eats the whole thing. Just like. I would like to eat something's hard just to say that. I did. That'd be pretty savage. Yeah. That's like a Mike Tyson saying, I wanna eat his heart. I want to eat his children. Did eat somebody's ear. Well, yeah, it's a it's interesting. I guess we'll get to the bottom of it. We'll try to figure out why the hell this guy's doing. All this. Yeah. Looks like he's good to go. So you wanna hit them up? Yeah. Let's do that, you know. It'd be easier just to be born Nigerian. It would definitely true. And you just have perfect skin, your, handsome and tall and strong. All that stuff right laugh and everybody else. Hey there. He is. How's it going Frank? What's going on or you gentleman? This guy's got perfect teeth. Perfect skin is this from eating raw meat. What are we going on here? Little bit of a little bit of Columbia. I'll leave it at that. What's what's going on with this diet? It looks looks pretty crazy to see you eating raw liver and stuff. How did you? How did you even get into something like this? I imagine you weren't doing this. When you were five years old right now. It's it's it's actually a pretty interesting story. I used to be really big into bodybuilding, fitness that whole thing. And I did it from when I was about thirteen to maybe twenty. And at some point, I said this isn't for me. I never really wanted to take it to professional level. Never had a large bone structure. I was always like five eight like one hundred fifty one hundred sixty pounds. Even when I was muscular figured it. Just wasn't for me. And after taking a drug called Accutane, which I didn't actually know it the time that kind of ruined my digestive system. I was eating three four five pounds of sweet potatoes a day and had no energies. I was like, okay. This isn't working for me. How can I figure out what? I should be doing. I literally started googling what the healthiest is came across a few different YouTube channels and ended up discovering a book on indigenous civilizations, it was called nutrition and physical degeneration and this dentist went around early nineteen hundreds and he noticed one thing that was consistent across every single diet of these native people that was the presence of certain animal foods, and particularly particularly ones that were along the lines of organ meats, and even though we're talking about organ meats, and things that people don't deem as approachable other nutrients that are more approachable like some of these groups of people had shellfish crab molluscs, clams. They had dairy products. They had eggs. It's not just, you know, biting piece of raw liver out of alive animal, and I said, okay. This makes sense and upon further inspecting these animal products they had an inherent fats. I. Vitamin content, and I can get into the actual availability of that stuff in a bit. But the other thing I was thinking was okay, I don't have energy eating carbohydrates. And if animal foods are the most nutritious foods, according to what I've read here than wouldn't it make sense to eat animal fat as my source of energy and putting it together in my head made sense because okay, well, animal foods have the highest amount of nutrients in their most available forms and animal fat can be used as an energy source and Kito service. And then I read another book called primal body prime and at the time which was about over six years ago. Now, I kind of paralleled Kito diet with a paleo diet and said, okay, I'm gonna do paleo Kito. But that pretty much means that I'm only eating meat and fat. So my theory behind not including vegetables and fruits that the modern forms of the fruits and vegetables in a lot of cases, and especially at certain times of the year. Weren't necessarily as high in nutrition as they used to be and at the time, I didn't actually know about the carnivore diet, and there was actually a form zero car, but the time that's what the diet was referred to. And I came across it and upon reading what that dia was just muscle meat, and no real guidelines to nutrients, no real guidelines to macro nutrient ratios, I didn't really think much of it. So you know, three or four years go by and I decided to make a YouTube channel. Because one of my goals was to convey, the importance of these nutrients to other people and how good I felt an even though I took that drug Accutane twice. I mean ruined my liver ruined my body. I'm sure there are so many people familiar with the drug and how bad it is. Even though I took that drug twice it still didn't fix my acne. The only thing that actually ends up fixing. My acne was going on this diet and roofing lot of foods and increasing the nutrients, but there's a lot of the three. Main things I used to explain aspects of my diet are one logical standpoint to the anthropological evidence of our ancestors and three the scientific one of you actually, looking at the nutrient content of foods and the mechanisms in the body, and we can observe that through nutrient databases or even mechanistic studies your eating large amounts of potatoes back in the day sound like you said you're eating like three or four pounds of potatoes. Every single day nowadays new any carbohydrates. No. Back. So over my six and a half years now on this diet. The only time I ever consumed carbohydrates was back in less. You're April two thousand eighteen I started experimenting completely raw most of the time. I consume maybe sixty seventy percent of my food is cooked nocco. Sorry, sixty seventy percent raw. And then the rest is cooked. And when I mean cooked, even though I'm just cooking eggs blue rare a lot of the time. But that one time I did try carbohydrates was on the raw primal diet. I had a little bit of raw Honey, and I tried incorporating some dairy products again, and that I mean, I've always had a dairy allergy when I was younger so that didn't really work out. So well as much as milk products from a local farm, raw high-quality grass-fed. Although there's definitely some things you have to be aware of if doing that the difference between like those dairy products directly from the farm and the dairy products that you buy on the shelf in the supermarket. That's definitely a discuss. To be had. So my reasoning for incorporating anything into your diet is either nutrient density or energy and the role that carbohydrates grains, play in my mind is when we look at certain indigenous groups in the recent few thousand years when agriculture started, and we started producing readily available forms of carbohydrates, they replaced wild plant foods as an energy source and every single one of these carbohydrate sources can be addressed on an individual basis in regards to its composition is preparation methods. What the pros and cons are obviously something like modern wheat, which is made from hard red winter wheat, it has forty eight chromosomes. It's hybridize it's much more inflammatory than an heirloom variety of wheat like corn wheat has twelve chromosomes. It's something our ancestors would have consumed. So not only do you have to look at the base food. You have to look also at the preparation of it, are you naturally fermented that sour dough bread and breaking down the anti nutrient content, or are you just? Throwing that bread in the oven as is with a yeast starter overnight. And then there's a course a bunch of different grains, have different preparations from oats to rice bunch of grains of cross all indigenous groups, but one thing I did want to touch on as a final in. This regard is the sheer variety of foods. These people consumed and the variety of preparation is absolutely absurd. Imagine this you go fishing in a river. And there's ten different types of fish in that river, and for each of those ten different types of fish. There's ten different species. So you might have six seven different types of trout in one river. So just the amount of animal foods that our ancestors. Consumed was incredible hundreds to thousands, let alone wild plant foods imagine walking into essentially a jungle and seeing just the sheer variety of foods used to eat that being said there are indigenous. Is that only eight like some of them? Maybe they only had Swiss cheese. Red cells definitely something important to note. But what's even crazier is one indigenous group might have prepared one food in one way, and another group would do it in a different way and the amount of different ways. They would do it. You know, imagine, you could take a fish. You can eat it raw. You can call it smoke it. You can hot smoke. It. You can foil it like under a an oven. You could bake it in fire, you could roasted over an open fire. There's dozens of different food preparations that these people practice because it was their job. Their job was viral in nature and their job was to prepare food, and you can imagine if you have limited food access in your environment. You're probably going to start doing some interesting things to either change the composition or to preserve it. And each of these things serve different purposes. One of the few people I've ever heard talk about switching up the type of meat that eat was Charles policemen. I don't know if you're aware of his work. But he he mentioned that he thought it was. Portent that you you don't just always eat cow. Don't always eating elk you, switch things up a bunch. And do you think that's important to to have a wide variety? You're not just eating cow meat all the time. I think a good answer to that question is. Yes, there was a sheer variety of meats in in. The indigenous groups bought the one consistent thing was the quality. So when you have access to different sources of meat, it helps to variety them because tha very them as you don't necessarily know the quality of the animal unless you raise it yourself. So if you buy Grespin meat from one place and Gretchen meat from another place. I have pictures on my Instagram of this grasp at beef that it looks orange. But I'm sure you've never seen something like that in a supermarket. So the quality of the food definitely ties in here. And when you're only eating one type of meat from one source. That's where you start to question. Okay. Is this the highest quality source of meat on eating the only scenario where I would say, it's okay to eat one source of food is if you're literally seeing what that animals eating in its in its life, essentially, of course, there's a realism that we have to have that's practical to life that we can't always beating the highest quality foods at all peers of. Time, but that doesn't necessarily justify going to like a restaurant having wings and soybean oil every night when I'm when I'm hearing what you're saying about like food, you eat it seems that whenever you're looking at these meets and you're looking at your food as far as you Tilleke. Yeah. And you're looking like a big micronutrient standpoint. So what's going give me the move new nutrients and yet, so I'm curious because whenever I see people go from like, pure carnivore or pure vegan. Right. And they just cut out also informs of food and a lot of individuals that do carnivore a lot of people feel much better than when they were eating all these carbohydrates. But then I see a lot of vegans that claimed that they're feeling much better eating. No meat. How how would you like let's say bring somebody to the other side. Would you even think that they should if they're feeling much better doing something totally opposite to the carnivore deal? Okay. So the carnivore diet achieves one thing inherently that's the removal of inflammatory foods. Okay. The vegan diet can do the same thing. So the reason I market myself to the carnivore died is because my diet is technically a carnivore diet. But what my diet achieves is the micronutrient density, and before really going into a discussion of the vegan versus a carnivore diet and actually like analyzing, okay? Vitamin a in its plant and animal form of vitamin k two and its plant and animal form what we can look at is. What happens to vegans after they go to three or four five six months on vegan diet. So b twelve deficiency is obviously something that you can't ignore every vegan needs to supplement be twelve. And for me the lodge. Perspective behind twelve doesn't make sense because you're literally falling a diet that you cannot follow when they didn't have the supplements even forty fifty years ago. That's one logical thing wrong with it. And I haven't done an incredible amount of research on this yet. But I'm not sure if b twelve blood levels are indicative of tissue levels as definitely something out be concerned about what b twelve is definitely associated with neuro cognitive problems in the long run. And the second thing is the iron. I haven't seen any proof that vegans would not be anemic in the long run. It's not an issue in some people and a one thing that shows that before this was people have different genes that regulate how will they assimilate vitamins from plants. That's why some people last a very long time on a vegan diet and some people fall apart in two months one other vitamin that's not really spoken about is vitamin d three. And I think vitamin d three is the best argument against the vegan diet because the skin itself synthesizes cholesterol to absorb vitamin d three. So. So if you don't have extra cholesterol in your body, you literally can't achieve certain levels of vitamin d three. So I would make an argument that from an ideal health perspective, it's physically impossible to get your three levels to that amount on a vegan diet. So those are just problems with a vegan diet in general. I mean, the, but another thing to consider is standard American diet is so poor that when people refer to stand American dieters as meters the macro nutrient ratios in a standard, American diet are thirty percent, animal foods and seventy percent plant foods. So these meters are they really meters. And what's even more? Interesting is vegans always talk about Blue's zones. These owns where people have unusually high life expectancy, but guess what the macaroni ratio of blue zones. Are it is the exact same as standard American diets when we actually look at what these blue zone people eat, they might eat seventy percent of their calories from grains, and thirty percents more or less and thirty percent from animal foods, but the food. Quality is the difference. They're not eating McDonalds. Burger they're not eating McDonald's, burgers, and what was my favorite show when I was a kid was the cookie crisp like that type of stock. So they're not eating that type of stuff. These people are drinking sheep milk straight from the goat in their backyard. These people are eating the highest quality cheese, the highest quality, grains. They're preparing them in certain ways, and there's definite pitfalls in the context of a standard American diet that we have to kind of brush aside, the problem with the vegan diet is we're missing those main nutrients, but there isn't and I always tell people this, you know, what? Whether it's five ten twenty thirty issue. Now, these vitamins there's gonna be a big emphasis on them because they are really the most important things in Uman function. And I'm sure you guys have heard about the importance of item indeed three in the recent past and how doctors are even subscribing vitamin d three in larger amounts. And there was a study that I post on my Twitter like every week the vitamin d three RDA was based on. Typical fallacy the four hundred. I you RDA was actually supposed to be nine thousand. I you. So there's definitely something to be said about the importance of these vitamins going under the rug. But the reason I'm saying this is because I can't even convince carnivore dieters to eat these nutrient dense foods, how am I supposed to convince a vegan to do it. It's very very difficult to turn people off what I like to do is. I like to present information and let people make the decision for themselves. And the of course, there's a lot of things that go into that. An unusual man of things that go into that. But if someone really wants to make a turning point what I always tell people is if you do something, and it doesn't work. You you may you might wanna think about doing it in general. That's when I take vitamin d three when you go out in the sun to the beach, you feel euphoric, right? You feel amazing after going to the beach when I eat foods like liver and salmon Roe when I eat certain high-vitamin animal foods, I feel like running through some drywall go I can go I can go. I've I work is used to work as a bartender. I still do and some times I would go like two or three nights without sleeping, and then I have to go down to Manhattan work ten or twelve hour shift, and I'd still be running circles around everyone else. So there's definitely something to be said about optimizing your energy levels. And how you feel on your diet is a vegan diet better than standard American diet. I think so in the con-, but it depends on what you're eating. And it depends on how you are to be twelve deficiencies and deficiencies I think in the short run it's better than what most people are doing and in regards, actually, I mean, I don't really want to discuss how to supplement an ideal vegan diet because there are literally. Certain things you cannot get and that's that's a bit off topic. But it's definitely something. I can go into seems like everyone needs to have some sort of nutritional plan, you know. And it seems like the biggest factor in all this is, you know, avoiding junk food, which is all the same stuff. We hear all the time. So potentially if you're on a vegan diet, you may be voiding some junk food, but there's ways of doing a vegan diet where you're not avoiding junk food. There's also Kito Akito diet where you could potentially be avoiding junk junk food, but there's also you could be doing a Kito diet and having some kind of dirty Kito foods in their things that have sugar alcohols in them and whatnot. But whatever the case is whether you're doing carnivore vegan Kito paleo, it's probably still a better decision than a standard American diet. It's still probably we're still probably eliminating some excess junk maybe some excess sugar excess processed foods. And we're probably ultimately limiting some calories. Do you think calories factor into any this at all when you start to really look at the different the different diets and things like that. Interesting to one interesting thing to look at in the context of calories is how your body assimilates nutrition from plant food versus animal foods, what people notice when they go on a Kito died or carnivore diet versus Egan by the volume of food that you need to consume versus the amount of food. You expel is is drastically different. So the caloric intake when increasing your plan food consumption. It can definitely go down. And I mean, there are arguments going either way there are people that go on Kito, diet and gain weight. There are people that go on a carnivore died in gain weight. There are people that go on a vegan diet and gain weight. One thing to note on the vegan diet is the high anti nutrient content of these foods because of things like five Tate's, which inhibit mineral absorption oscillates also inhibit mineral absorption, things like electons can cause leaky gut. What this essentially does is causes your body. Not to absorb the nutrients in the food. Your body loses its ability to digest the food. So there is a concern about certain anti. It's in certain grains, and legumes specifically on a vegan diet. I mean, this can be alleviated to some degree by fermentation. Of course, it can be made easier by choosing foods with less anti nutrients. I mean, like carbohydrate sources like sweet potatoes and plantains and maybe for mental oatmeal would be better choices than kidney beans. That's an example of that. Caloric restriction ties into fasting as well. I I think the overall reason that people consume excess calories and don't lose weight is the lack of nutrients in their diet, and that's affecting their hunger signals, but restricting calories and is definitely a way to become healthier. Even if you're eating doesn't really matter. What you eat is definitely an improvement and one way to go about this is whenever you put something in your body. It's always a net loss doesn't matter. How healthy the food. Is it doesn't matter. How good the food is for you. You're always doing something negative to your body. Because either way you're putting stress on your digestive system. You're putting stress on yourself to eat something. So whether you put something in your body or not it just a matter of arguing how negative it is liver. The act of writing the act of eating itself causes inflammation, period. Yes. That's I mean, that's a very loose statement. And it's it's it's it can be using a negative connotation in weird way. Because. Actually, we need to eat food. But this is where we assess the inflammatory response to the food whether it's just based on its inherent profile of nutrients anti nutrients, whether you have an allergy to it as well as the caloric density of the food. That's you know, we look at the food is it going to give you issues was the nutrient density, two things really just inflammation nutrients so looking at a food like liver or salmon Roe if you try to eat fish eggs, you wouldn't get past a quarter pound of them. That's because of the nutrient density of the food, and that's a lower caloric restriction. So you. You know, you can make arguments that if people were eating a nutrient dense diet and had proper station in proper appetite that they wouldn't be over consuming calories, and they wouldn't be stressing their digestive system in an artificial amount. This also ties into lean body mass and bodybuilding because when you have a higher lean body mass, your body requires more nutritional more sustenance. So your body will crave protein macronutrients more than that or micronutrient. So when I used to lift weights or like, you guys even if you guys Villier micronutrient requirements, you guys are gonna want way more protein than the average person just from that your body. Your muscles are literally telling you I need protein. I want to eat protein. That's not the same case with most people, but fasting is a whole like that's a big topic in itself with the Towfighi and the main benefits of Towfighi is people claim that and it's not a claim. This is what it does your body, essentially recycles. It sells and heals itself in Towfighi. But my argument behind a nutrient dense diet is that. At the processes that regulate. How sales are made gene expression and cell differentiation are directly correlated to the cell health in your body. So vitamin a and vitamin d three in particular are the precursors, gene expression. Gene expression turns on and off certain genes. This literally tells your body what sells it needs to make whether it's a stem cell or red blood cell or white blood cell. I don't want to know. I'm not a biochemist physiologist, I don't wanna go into this too much, but one anecdote I like to make is when I had terrible terrible cystic acne take weeks acne to heal. And then when I had this terrible like nickel-sized blemish on my face that blemish would take. Three four five six months ago way. I did a video on my YouTube of I had a cyst it exploded. And I all this is a little girls. I'm sorry guys. So anyway, the point is I heal my skin and literally three days I went from a cyst on my face to pretty much clear skin. And the way I did. This was I fasted I consumed a large amount of retinal from liver, vitamin A. And then I went in the sun for five six hours a day. So what happened was the first day kinda got inflamed? And then it popped the second day started healing third day formed into a scab and the third day the second day turned into a scab. And then the third day. It was pretty much completely healed in the blemish was almost gone. So our body essentially is like a plant, and you know, when people are growing or growing, something they don't blame the plants genetics on it, not growing, they blame the soil. They blame the nutrient was given they say it didn't get enough water. We kind of need to look at the same thing for. Humans. Genetics are determined by environment over a period of years and years and years. That was a bit of a ramble from the question of, you know. Do calories matter. But I think I touched on it on a few different ways. I think a lot of people would be curious especially looking into you. Don't eat any vegetables or anything like that. Right. Okay. Yeah. Cool. A lot of people would wonder 'cause I I saw video where you you mentioned how fiber isn't necessarily that important. How how like how would you explain that to individuals in terms of do you get fiber from outside sources, or is is now into you all now so in in regards to fibers association with any sort of health benefits, such as reducing cholesterol was your social with reducing cholesterol, more consistent bowel movements, reducing rates abou- gander. That's not actually demonstrated in studies. But to me five or does play a role in the health of the gut microbiome and building a diverse microbiome. And that ties into you know, the thousands of and hundreds of wild plant foods that indigenous people used to consume. Yeah. So having a certain gut back to your gut bacteria is essentially specific to your while in in the case of let's say like a mother has a baby and starts nursing her child. The mother is eating certain foods in her diet that are in a way introduce. To the child through the breast milk the environment than when the child grows up the child would eat the foods that are in the mothers environment, and this is kind of what determines our microbiome? So the role that fiber plays in the microbiome inherently being in those foods that they needed to eat survive. I think survival is a big over arching thing here. A lot of the foods. We used to eat were really because we didn't want to die from from caloric standpoint. But fi- five or from a mechanistic standpoint in the body. The only thing that's hypothetically beneficial is feeding some sort of positive gut bacteria. Then in an actual cases where people have digestive issues, especially things like diverticulitis as well as IBS reducing fiber actually improves their health. What about performance we're talking about like lifting weights, or at let's what are some of your thoughts on utilizing a carnivore diet for these things and also make some sense for somebody to add in some carbohydrates at some point. Or do you think people don't really need them? So I've had con- conversation with an exercise physiologist about this. And he claimed that carbohydrates are not beneficial in any way, whatsoever that Amine. In fact, I it would be better. But I am not necessarily that is not my method of thinking my method of thinking is your body needs to produce enzymes to digest food. Whether it's Pep's in for protein lie pays for fat, the starch digesting enzyme does. Well at your body can only digest a certain amount of each macro nutrient Eddie point in time. And when you're a high performance athlete, and you're consuming an unnatural amount of food in regards to what maybe your body frame of your genetics allow you to do, you know, obviously, someone like Thor those strongman guys is what I think of when I think of this. I'm thinking, okay. These guys have very very highly body mass that require an incredibly unrealistic amount of food. Now, what answer what would answer your question is? Can we actually figure out whether the body can absorb only fat? And protein faster than it can absorb the combination of fat protein and carbohydrates. Is there a bottleneck on the peps in production? The body is there bottleneck on these pro- as spoke protein, adjusting enzymes, amylase, carbohydrate, digesting enzymes is the body bottleneck in producing these enzymes as well as insulin or can the body actually produced just as much of these enzymes as it needs in the context of animal foods based diet. I think this is gonna be Anik going to be anecdotal. If you're not a super, high performance athlete. I really don't think this will make a difference once you achieve a certain amount of activity in muscle mass. Then you might notice if you consume carbohydrates, and you're on a carnivore diet, and you notice a performance increase. I think you're at that threshold where your digestive enzymes cannot keep up with just the protein and fat diet. That. Yeah. That that actually makes a lot of sense. And I think you know, bodybuilding purposes, I think some people talk about like getting a pump. And a lot of bodybuilding coaches will say that's critical, you know, in in your training, and then from powerlifting perspective or strongman perspective. It's my belief that it's just important have body weight on you. So this may be against what most people are looking for most people are a lot of people are looking to get smaller or lose lose bodies. Yeah. Lose weight, but for a power lifter, or for strongman athlete or even some MA athletes. It might be important for them to stay in a particular weight class. So therefore, they might need some of the carbohydrates, and like you said, I think is pretty accurate account of what you said, basically, the carbohydrates could be a fast acting energy source could help them potentially recover from workout some people are doing to workouts day. So how you gonna get the fat and protein to really kind of like shuttle into your system. Maybe it does make sense to have. Some fruit or some coconut water or something in between workouts? Whatever whatever carbohydrate source you choose. We'll probably be appropriate enough to kind of replenish, some of those stores and get you into that next workout get you kind of repaired from the previous workout. There's so many factors here. Because when you think about what your body needs to recover and perform, you know, you don't only need protein to repair the muscle tissue. You don't only fat for energy. There's also nutrients there's the electrolytes there's a lot of factors that go into this. And as I've been on one hand, I really do want to know what would happen if someone like, you know, Brian Shaw or have to Bjornson when on like, a high neutral carnivore diet. I mean a hundred percent they're losing a lot of weight. The question is how much strenght would they lose? And what the adjustment period would be. Unfortunately, I don't think that's something that. Out think it'd be possible to do that in the context of these people because it would just be to jet detrimental to their essentially professional career. But I love to see some more research being done on this in the future because you know, the the metabolism of protein and fat in energy is definitely something. That's not understood by a lot of people. Yeah. We're seeing it more and more with kind of endurance athletes, people that run people that do rowing and things like that. And we're getting really good accounts of of what these people are doing and the response that they're having it seems like it's a good one. But yeah, we don't know what it looks like, you know, from an NBA basketball player NFL football player, or, you know, high level strongman athlete. Yeah. Yeah. I've been consulting with a collegiate basketball player, and what we do for him is we increase the nutrient density, but we still keep some carbohydrates in the diet. So we essentially have a very high nutrient carnivore dia, but then he has things like sweet potatoes. High quality, grains, maybe some more dairy products. Maybe Honey occasionally just things for the carbohydrate metabolism in the body. What are some of your thoughts on this insieme from having a bodybuilding background and being someone that does jitsu and you lift I mean, you have a pretty pretty busy schedule, you know, with the amount of physical activity that you have have you explored any this? Have you tried just to only eat the like almost Kito and and just only eat meat. Yeah. No, I have like for for the past two weeks, or so, you know, started messing with much much lower carbohydrates. I haven't cut my carbs out. But having probably a minimum of fifty or sixty day, which is much lower than I usually have in the past of my background each and intake, and unlike like, Frank like, I mainly paid attention to my macro nature and intakes make sure that I've been like I have intake for enough food to fuel my workouts because a lot of days, I'll come here. Then I'll go to jitsu afterwards. An oddly enough I found like having much lower carbohydrates but much higher fats didn't really affect my energy levels that much. I did feel a little bit affect in the gym. But at least in terms of my cardio on the mats. It didn't affect me that much. But what I what I really I'm curious about is something I never paid much attention to in the past has been my quality of meats of heard about you guys talk about this and lot grass-fed versus you know, grain fed meets I never made attention to that. And I'm just wondering how how important that is in terms of like potential performance or quality of meat because personally like again, I just make sure that I'm eating enough food. Right. Macaroni genetic. I do take a few supplements here and there to make sure I get my three and natural, bro. I gotta take no subs. But like like my d three it's cetera. But I haven't paid attention to like meeting. Sure. My meat is grass-fed. I know Frank that you you've talked a lot about like oh grain fed meets her not good at all. How does that tie in does that tie into performance or any of that? Yeah. I'm smiling year because this is like this topic in general is what my main focus is. So one thing to look at is if you look at those indigenous groups and what they ate and you analyze the foods by amount and the micronutrient amounts. We can assume that those amounts of foods that they're eating and those micronutrient amounts or what the recommended dietary allowances should actually be and things like, you know, the human body can produce one hundred thousand you of vitamin d three in the sun, the higher retinal content of these foods. So we can assume that humans have a higher nutrient requirement than what we've been told. Now when we actually analyze the nutrient content of the food. There's one thing that determines the neutering. Content of the food. Specifically what the animal was raised on. The example and cows is and cows have very in ruminant digestion is very interesting. You know, a human would actually have to have five gallons of fluid in their stomach fermenting to be the equivalent, but an ingress when a cow goes in the field. It has an incredible sense of smell, it might think clover tastes like ice cream. It might think we grasp is a burger and the cow will actually go in the field and choose the grasses, and the whatever that they like the most and this is because the nutrient content of those grasses varies and vitamin A is actually mislabeled on food in plant foods. It's beta carotene, they can label it as vitamin for some reason the carotenes in this grass convert in the cows body into retinal in its tissue. So cows eating the platform, vitamin A and converting into the animal form of vitamin A. Same with vitamin k there's vitamin k one in grass and the cow converts vitamin. K two in its body. And this is through fermentation, the gut bacteria eats, the grass for man's turns into nutrients in the body. So if the cows being fed a crude soy's feed of like corn, whatever guy cooked corn cooked soy things like that. It's not going to have micronutrients. And this is the problem. Also with a lot of vegetables in modern diets. Monash inc. Soil as in. There's micro new. Toil that aren't necessary for the growth of the plant or the animal, and there's macro nutri. There's macro nutrients in the soil that are not necessary for the growth of the plant or the animal, and then there's micro nutrients, so I'm sorry, I'm confusing. These completely. Unique macronutrients for energy. This is what you need to grow a plant micronutrients can be deficient in plants and animals, and they will still grow. So these micronutrients for soil are N P K. Let me just wants potassium nitrogen. And I was the other one it's just general fertilizer. So it's nitrogen phosphorus and potassium. So you need nitrogen phosphorus and potassium to grow a plant. So essentially, if you grow corn with nitrogen, potassium and phosphorus, and then you feed that corn to a cow. It's not getting those micro nutrients in it, the same thing can be said about humans in general and how we are raised on low micronutrient foods. So basically, how the food was raised determines the nutrient content. So if the cow wasn't eating grass and might not have a high nutrient content and in the context of granted versus grass-fed. Yeah. I mean on paper grass-fed is going to have vitamins that great at isn't going to have the fatty acid profile is going to be better. But you have to consider the muscle isn't really where the nutrients are stored the nutrients in the animal are stored in the fat. That's why they're called fat soluble vitamins, they're not called proteins vitamins the muscle tissue stores. Minerals and elements, and if there's fat intertwined between the muscle tissue. There is nutrients in those fat in that fat. But if you take a grain fed steak with a ton of fat on it, and a lean grass fed steak the nutrient contents going to be insignificant because there's no fat on grass-fed steak. This is where in you know, when you're eating muscle meat, primarily you're not really looking at a nutrient dense source compared to the fat. And when you look at what our ancestors ate RA by and ground beef didn't exist because animals don't actually store fat in those parts. That's because of how we've bred cattle other factors fat in the animal is stored on the belly on the brisket on the short rib around the kidneys, those fatty parts of the animal around the organ tissues. That's where we would have had to obtain fat and calories in nature. So the whole grain fed versus grass-fed debate. In the context of eating a steak isn't nearly as relevant as it is in the over. Diet and the primary fats, I will vitamins that were concerned about getting. It's not really I mean, you know, we have vitamin a in the form of retinol probably the most under appreciated vitamin the most important vitamin that's going to be discovered. I think really in regards to people understanding that you need to get in large amounts of vitamin d three. Of course, we don't have to touch on that anymore by K two as a big one of K two ties into vitamin d three in calcium metabolism saw in order to absorb calcium in your body. You need vitamin d three. But in order to move calcium around tissue, you need vitamin k two things called matrix glob protein, M GP moves it binds to calcium ions in the body and moves them around and vitamin k two. Vitamin k two is the secret of a lot of these indigenous groups and some animal foods because vitamin k two is only present in high quality animal foods, and what we mean what we mean by this is if an animal is not grass-fed or race properly, the vitamin k to content will be lower. But what's more important about gay to is its presence in fermented foods? So although foods like egg yolks and liver have some vitamin k two when you for Matt to food. It increases the vitamin k do content, and the one thing that I can't get passed in my mind is that there's a really good book the indigenous foods of the south Sudan, the fat of the land all of these indigenous people, whether it's the eskimos or the Africans. They purposely rotted their meat, and I mean, in modern society, we eat things like cheese and ham and yogurt. We eat a lot of rotten foods all the time. And we don't really think twice about it. But these people would literally take fish leave them out in the sun for seven days and. The need it. And you might say, okay. That's the anthropological evidence. What's the logical evidence? Okay. Maybe a hundred years ago. We wouldn't have had refrigeration was the scientific evidence. The protein breaks down it becomes more digestible. Well, there's there's three enzymes in meat fat. Hydrolysed enzymes, prolific enzymes and the Gleich lick enzymes the fat hydrolysed enzymes for meant the fat. The pro Olympic enzymes from the protein and the Gleich lick enzymes when the animal dies, the lactic acid the glucose in the meat turns into lactic acid. That's why sometimes people think liver has carbs in it, but that's not actually true because the Gleich lick enzyme breaks down the glucose in the liver into lactic acid when the animal ties, so these enzymes for meant meet in a way that's more favorable to the microbiome. So not only are you breaking down the protein. You're getting the fat, and you're turning certain nutrients into vitamin k to essentially, so. There's definitely a role in Ignace groups of these vitamins, and there's definitely an importance of these vitamins in overall health. But this is something that is, you know, we know as president in their diets, it makes sense on paper value perspective that you can't really obtain these vitamins in any way from plan foods, and anecdotally speaking, you know, when these foods and a lot of my clients when they eat these foods, they notice a difference when you sit down and you eat certain foods, you notice immediately. How you feel? So definitely I mean, you know, some people like saying, I speak out my ass on people like saying, but I try to give I try to give as much information as physically possible if I can explain it in any way whatsoever. I do it. And I'm also open minded to the contrary. But again, it's it's one of those topics where people if people haven't heard about it, and they come across all this information about it from someone, and this is not something that like, I read a book and. I started this is you know, when I'm on the street. This is literally what I'm thinking about you know, when I'm driving in my car somewhere. This is what I think about I have ideas and things I read on every single day. This is an accumulation of like seven six seven years of doing this. And that all that information is accumulated into essentially a five minute blurb on why vitamins are important. So that's why I like to say as I said earlier present the information let people do the research on their own. But there's definitely a lot. A lot of lot of if I could talk for two hours just on vitamin a you know, there's so much to touch on. It's just absolutely insane. When you are talking about these different for mental foods, how do you personally have permitted food? You mentioned that you have trouble with dairy. I think, you know, rented food, you know, one way to get it is through like, you know, yogurt or Keefer or, but what are some other options? People can look into. So obvious. I mean, if you guys have realized I'm crazy yet. I have they call it. It's called Hymie. And this is what the indigenous groups used to call because it makes you high when you eat it and me can actually be inadvertently rotten. So if you bought like, I e Corre or salmon Roe in a store, you know, if it was salt it unfermented, and ate it would give you that similar feeling obviously cheat. So the two easiest access foods for K to our egg yolks and cheese. Egg yolks have vitamin k two in the form of MK four. That's the form that's president animal foods when they're not permitted. And then it turns into 'em k seven when it's for mental MK seven k two is the fermented form. And there's evidence that you kind of need seven as well. So cheese has high amounts of MK seven cheese is really kind of the best source of food that most people have access to unless you wanna start eating duck. Sliver goose liver. And that's because migratory birds have a very interesting function their metabolism where they store fat in their liver for the winter. So in these ducks fatten up there, also storing vitamin k two in their liver. That's why EMU oil is a very popular supplement product. The oil is has a high K to content it has benefits to it. But cheeses interesting because I guess we could talk about quality of dairy here. So the difference between the dairy on the supermarket shelf and a raw dairy product is. First of all, there's no inherent nutrient content to the dairy product if the animal wasn't on pastor. So we can kind of cross a little off when the dairy homogenized. Much larger fat particle, then she milk goat milk. So when you strength down this protein particle, it can get through the gut lining and be more inflammatory to people that have cosmic allergies. And you're also pasteurizing the milk, although that can kill bacteria that the farmer might, you know, bacteria and milk and concerns about bacteria are generally from poor cross contamination practices like they didn't clean the milking machines things like that. So although pasteurization does that reduces the nutrient content, and when you pasteurize food you while you're cooking it and a raw food for Mets naturally, a cooked food oxidises and rots and forms harmful bacteria. So if you have a raw piece of meat on the counter for a couple of hours, that's fine. But if you cook that piece of meat, and you lay it out. That's how people get sick so cheese in specific aces. It's made with the rennet of the animal and baby. Calves have run it in their stomach that curdle the milk into cheese. Essentially, it's pretty interesting. I would mean not to be cruel. But if you cut open baby cow, there would essentially be cheese in their stomach and the way that she's made you take this ideally, raw high-quality grasp and milk product. You add the rennet to it it forms cheese. And then you age it and that aging process ED's K two, and if people want to get a good source of two in their local supermarket. There's usually plenty of raw imported cheeses. A parmigiano reggiano is a DO p its designation protection, which means they can only make the milk from certain cows and certain areas, and it has to be made a certain way, and that parmigiano reggiano DOP guarantees essentially that it is a raw cow's milk cheese that it is a very high quality source of nutrition. So that's a very easily accessible what generally any raw imported cheeses are what people should look for in the supermarket. But since I am allergic to cheese. What I do is. I I will take any really animal meat animal fat, and I'll put it in a jar. And I'll pretty much. Let it for Mets. And guys. I really I am not crazy. Like a lot of this came across in a weird way. So one time I bought some beef that from a farm, and it smelled like parmesan cheese. And I was like and then like, I I didn't eat it. I just left it there. And then I smelled like rotten a dead body in my kitchen, the they later, and I was like what is is that the fat? So I go open the fat out. And it's like a comedy, you know, it's cheeses funky. It's rotten. It really is. So I tasted this beef fat. And I swear to God, it was it tasted exactly like promise on obviously the texture was different. But I was like that's really interest you from if you ferment fat even from an animal any animal developed similar flavors of the cheese and a good example of this is people that dry age stake almost all stay dry Asia. But you go to a state. Yes, you have a dry age stake. It's essentially rotten piece of meat. I mean, obviously, the fermentation processes way different. But. But that's definitely an interesting element of my diet that I haven't really Inc for most of my carnivore dietary history, just the importance of it is something focusing on now, mainly because of the food access thing, you know, for me to have rotten jars of meat and do that is completely crazy compared to to go into a store and buy cheese. That's for sure and vitamin k can you mentioning basically how it can help? I guess metabolize calcium or hope kind of move along calcium, but it can be really beneficial to your heart is that right? Yeah. Very important in blood health. But when I saw so immigrants the actual metabolism vitamin k in blood health. I know it reduces blood clotting. That's for sure I think I'm gonna look up the metabolism of that real quick. But one thing I do like to touch on immigra- arts to blood health is specifically omega three fatty acids. So there's a really interesting book called eskimo diet, and the one analogy I like to start this conversation with is if you cut an eskimos arm. It would take them eight to nine minutes for their blood to clot an American would take three to four minutes. That's and you might think, oh, that's a bad thing. They're going to know that's a testament to how smooth their blood flows. So what omega three fatty acid consumption does to the blood is. It changes the structure of the blood cells and makes the more pliable they can squeeze through arteries, better blood cells are actually much larger than a lot of the tiny arteries, not arteries about the tiny veins and vessels. They go through and they need to squeeze in flexible omega three improves the flexibility of this, it reduces the five bridge in in your blood. Which is it makes your blood flow quicker and. It's really just an overall ability to bind to calcium the not omega three k two's ability is really that binding to calcium and taking out the blood is reducing a lot of inflammatory stress. I radically the video I did yesterday was on calcium and showing how calcium deposits in kidneys. And the heart are really result of not getting enough vitamin k two and one overarching thing that I say a lot is the calcium RDA and idea that calcium build strong bones is one of the biggest mistakes of our generation calcium RJ being high is actually a consequence of not getting enough of these vitamins and our diet. I have not consumed any calcium in six and a half years and my blood levels of calcium right dead in the middle. It's like nine point four on a scale of eight point two ten point six. It's so interesting when once you start to eliminate a lot of foods from your diet. It's really crazy how the work starts really kind of men together. And and almost like fix it self you don't really lift anymore nowadays, you basically just run right? And what's the kind of reason behind that? Like, you know, we we love lifting, and we we we also understand like, you know, the way that we like to lift we might be beating ourselves up a little bit. And maybe it's not gonna help us necessarily live to a hundred do it for long Jimmy purposes, or why did you kinda switch things up? Yeah. I mean, there's definitely a lot. I've been having this conversation myself with the past few days, actually, because you know, I have a I obviously marketing myself from a health nutrition perspective is also a fitness aspect. And if I don't work out, I don't lift weights. I'm kind of missing some sort of clientele away. So on one hand I wanted to lift weights again for that purpose on the other hand, you know, I mean, I work as a bartender. I do my YouTube channel I have another. The job that I work on the side. Getting I can get in the gym for an hour to a day. That's not too much of an issue, but the extra eating I'm gonna lose lose three four hours of sleep a day. That's my personal reason. I've always had really bad stretch marks on my arms. And I know that sounds silly. But that that's never gonna go away. So that's not actually a good reason. Because regardless of muscle. I always have the best stretch marks. I think what my small bone frame right now. I'm I'm like five nine hundred forty pounds for me. I have very small. I'm sure you guys familiar with the term small joints. I'm sure you could explain a better than other people. I have really small joint. So when I have sixteen seventeen in arms that's not like on on you guys. Like, you're probably like eighteen nineteen twenty twenty one inches. You guys are gigantic. If I when I have sixteen seventeen inch arms, I look really really big at least for my bone frame. And I actually did a physique competition back in two thousand five. Fifteen. I mean on my own I looked okay. But if you put me next those guys you'd be like, what does that guy doing on the state, so the bone frame, even if I did if I lifted weights, and I kept lifting weights my peak muscle tone for my frame is only going to be one hundred eighty one hundred ninety pounds max max, so with my small bone frame and how I looked like a like it's way too. Muscular part of that ties into. Fitting into my suits. That was honestly like a reason like I don't fit like I could retail all my sous. What then what if I don't wanna lift weights? Again, a lot of maintenance things regarding the actual physical reasons about why lifting weights might be detrimental. The only concern is to me you need to consume excess calories to put on muscle. And as we said earlier anything you eat is inherently inflammatory, that's one element to it. But there's so many benefits of lifting weights. It's hard to say that it's bad because when you go into Jim the people that are in shape or not on the treadmill. The people that are in shape or lifting the weights, and one fact that was really shocking to me. I I always knew muscle burned a lot of calories, but one pound of muscle burns fifty calories day. So if someone put. One or one and a half two year time span for natural. Was is going to increase a thousand fifteen hundred calories depending on the amount of muscle. They put on and that will literally help them lose all the way they need to lose. So there's another element to this is we are much less muscular, then a hundred gatherer, you know, these people would have been much more must go than we are now so getting into the gym and doing this weightlifting is a way to make up presenting Terry activity. If you stay, you know, if you're if I'm a bartender, and I'm moving around all day shaking up drinks doing this doing that. And I used to work as a personal trainer to. But the point is if you're active on your feet all day doing things building muscle inherently through endurance activity. You're going to have a decent lean body mass. What if you're sitting at a desk all day the only way for you to make up for that seven eight hour day of sedentary activity is for you to go in the gym and kill yourself for an hour. So I don't think there's any detriment to wait way training. Obviously if you're in the realm of you want to try to. Lift your house in like rip up some ply boards. That's a different conversation. Like I used to do that stuff. I mean, I I was never really that strong. I only maybe I benchpress like low three hundred and lifted like be in the low four hundreds after training for a couple of years. I was never in my brother's a bit more into the the powerlifting stuff himself. I think he Dallas in the five hundred. I don't know what his his numbers are part of your part of some triplets. Is that right? Oh, you know. This is this is so funny. I always forget to bring this up. But I being a triplet is a pretty unique thing. So we're all twenty-seven my brothers out. He he's an engineer works in aerospace. My sister, unfortunately is mentally disabled. So I do work with her and part of the reason that I do this whole nutrition thing is because I have a belief that, you know, nutritional deficiencies can cause things like that not to say that not to say that that was the reason my sister was I mean, the reason I mean that whole story about how my mother had kids, you know, they botched the C-section she ended up having to get like double kidney transplant that's a whole different story. So my sister isn't necessarily the reason, and my belief nutrient density is the reason but seeing modern medicine how we're living. Now how unhappy people are just even on the street. All of this stuff has been a driving factor in my message to just get people healthier in general. My thought is if someone's healthy if someone's energetic. That's part of the problem. You know, if we make sure everyone has a certain quality of life, you know, in regards to improving the world in itself. It's so much different. You know, I remember when I went one what did I do one day? I went into it just felt like everyone around me was on edge with size myself. Like, I went into a butcher shop. And I was like I'll just hold my house came in what's going on. Do you guys have? And he was like the guy was like freaking out, you know. And then I went then like, I'm driving my car, and these people act like lunatics, just the behavior that people per tray in general to me is so absolutely crazy. And I listen, I drive Manhattan. There's something wrong with say your New York. Yeah. No. There is something wrong with me. But there's like. A different level of anxiety. That people have that I haven't noticed in myself or healthy and reasonable people a good way to coined. This is a lot of people are emotionally driven. And that's part of the reason they also don't really care about their help too much. And if you can't if you can't fix yourself how you supposed to fix other things. I mean, of course, you know. I mean, they're nine was a nine percent of those people on this planet. Don't eat a healthy diet, and they're doing amazing things. But I just feel like out of context a lot of times when I when I go places and just seeing how how people act how unhealthy people are how unhappy people are. And that's hopefully, and I'm doing it. Well, so far improving people's lives in that regard. Have you ever seen Ghostbusters to? Listen, I I would I'm I haven't I've seen Ghostbusters when I haven't seen goes. So the second Ghostbusters takes place in New York City and underneath the city is all this pink slime, and as people are getting more on edge. And as people are getting more pissed off this pink slime is is rising up. And it's and it's mounting. And I think I think that the paying slime represents carbohydrate sugar and processed foods, and I really honestly feel that like this is bringing people to fucking boiling point. And I couldn't agree with you more on like the sanity of people like I walked through the airport, and I a lot of time just just in general this mile at people like every once in a while I have resting bitch face. But for the most part, I try to try to be I try to be pretty happy because I feel like if you if you smile, it kind of makes you feel happy on the inside and brings her brings your mood up and why not? Knowledge the person that's walking across from you. Or whatever what kinda give people a head nod or smile little bit people. Look at you like they just wanna punch right in the fuck and face. What's this guy's problem? Maybe needs get on the carnivore died. I don't know the I went to the UPS store earlier. And I saw this. I mean. Like this like maybe middle aged Asian lady walking out of the ups store. I walk into the ups store. I go out I go to the post office, and I see her the polls ovals like, oh, hey, what's going on? We both had the same idea. And she was like she was just she was looking at me with a death stare. And I was like, and then I went through. I was like, oh, no you would just ups. She was just a, hey, it wasn't even that just in a hazing future. She didn't even notice me. Right. I was there. And I noticed most people are in this Hayes of confusion, and is it the sugar carbohydrates the refined foods, of course. But I'd be curious to see if you increased if you if these people had a base amount of nutrients in their diet, that's probably part of it too. That's that's my main contribution. Before the show, we were actually talking about Romeo and eating raw meats, and you know, like, my family wouldn't f- with that like like straight up, you know, just like you cannot convince African family to eat like. But Andrew mentioned something funny that I never really thought about sushi, you know, and I. Yeah. You know, I eat raw fish. So what is this like adversity? It's like eating a raw a straight up Ross steak. Right. So yeah, this is a whole another big topic in itself, this is so for the indigenous example all indigenous groups eight cooked Ross, they ate all types of meat every indigenous group every single way raw, you know, every way logically speaking. On Anna scientific on a scientific basis. What happens when you cook meat is you're essentially you reduce the micronutrient content to some degree, the if you cook a steak well done which most people don't do. So the nutrient degradation isn't this aveer? If you cook a steak well done broil in the oven for an hour. You lose about fifty percent of the vitamins and twenty thirty percent of the other fats Ivo vitamins. Now, of course, if you cook a steak, rare that's not as big of an issue. But what you're doing by cooking the state because you're concentrating the calories. So you're sacrificing micronutrients, and you're increasing caloric density. This is very important for survival. Because. You know, when I tried the raw primal diet. I started craving meat. I started not meet I started craving cooked meat. I started craving salt. There's a caloric need and consuming only raw meat products. Like bottlenecks that caloric need in the diet. So when and if you're consuming, a carnivore diet, there's no indigenous group that was really they're very few that were completely carnivore. And even those that if an indigenous group had unlimited access to animal foods, they would still only eat eighty percent of their calories or so from animal food. So this means that okay? If you only need to eat, maybe thirty to forty percent of your calories from animal foods to get enough nutrition in the diet. It doesn't really matter. If you cook your meat and reduce the neutering, and by a certain amount because you're still getting the nutrients in, you know, does that make sense? So if you eat if you need to get a certain amount of nutrients and cooking, the food reduces the nutrients by half, why not just double the amount. That's what you can essentially do. So what you're doing is. You're getting more calories, but you're getting less micronutrients. I mean, there are some nutrients that you do like if you really cook a piece of meat long, vitamin c content loss and me does have vitamin c for anyone that doesn't know that. There's a couple of nutritional databases that do indicate that. And certain usually the water cycle vitamins are more prone to oxidation of vitamin d three is a bit more prone to oxidation heat as well. Now, the bacteria thing and the parasite thing is certainly certainly big one to talk about so salmonella and E coli salmonella occurs. Only in chicken, that's im- pretty important to note. Chickens, carry salmonella, I'm assuming it's because even though a lot of animals are kept in horrendous conditions, chickens or captain even worse conditions in E coli is present in. I mean, I'm sure more people get e-coli from Romain lettuce than they do from eating meat and there's a lot of recalls around, but this is all cross contamination. People don't realize that a lot of these very low paid workers literally have to use the bathroom in the fields. And sometimes that gets in people's vegetables. People don't realize what's going into you know, where the meat's go. What's going into that ground meat? I you know, I've never listened. I've been eating me. For six and a half seven years on this diet, and I've never been sick. Once from raw meat that being said, I've never eaten ground me from the supermarket raw. That is definitely a good way to get coli and another thing to touch on is the strains of these bacteria. So if aggressive animal has e-coli, the strain is different when you feed a cow grain you increase the acidity of their room in one of their stomachs. This makes the coli bacteria more resistant to acid normally e-coli that occurs aggress but animal is going to be killed in your digestive. Tract it won't be as harmful, but that acid resistant strain of e-coli that will wreak havoc on your digestive system. It's interesting how feeding these animals different foods affects their meat quality to since ruminants have different Justice system than chickens the omega three two mega six grain fed beef is far more favorable than the omega three to omega six in grand chicken. But things like chicken and pork are supposed to have essentially the same omega ratios as. Things like grass fed beef and wild caught fish. It's just to have those animals on that quality of passer is really cost prohibitive at this point. So the bacterial concerns have a lot to do with cross contamination and how we're raising our animals, you know, if you go out, and you hunted deer and you kill that deer. Granted it didn't have some sort of infection. All that meat is going to be free of any modern bacterial issues. So I if I need to touch more back to your I can, but the parasites or what scare people and on one of my raw meat eating days of video people are like, oh parasite has entered YouTube or something like they're making jokes that I'm going to get parasites, and as someone who's works in restaurants whose benefit Carter who's who's been cuts meat. I know what animals parasites in so parasites in ruminant animals. I mean has anyone if listen you guys listening right now, if you if you've seen a parasite interstate, please let me know because I've seen hundreds and hundreds and. Thousands of pounds of Eton. I have not I don't even wanna bring this up because it's not really a concern. But an animal can be infested with liver flukes, and these are I think it's like snails and marshlands carry these and then the couch the grass, and then they get liver flutes in their liver. But if a cow has liver flukes, it's not going to get past the butcher. They're gonna see the livers infected Lanham lls sick. It's not going to get the meat is not going to get past. I'm sure you could Google pigs have cancer, and you could see meet with cancer in it. And you could see stuff like that stuff. Does not get past the butcher, thankfully, the big concern. The only thing I have seen worms and parasites in is fish. And it's funny because people do eat sushi, but people will I'm sure I wonder how many people have oh, you're gonna get sick from eating raw steak, and then they go to have sushi the next day, and they don't realize that sushi is actually a lot easier to get sick from and. Yeah, I mean, if you freeze meet at a certain temperature, it will kill the parasite, but parasites in fish are very very normal especi-. In larger ocean fish, if I filleted openness, salmon, and I didn't find around warm in the belly or a nematode in the belly. I would be surprised the nematodes that occur the roundworms that occur. They're non segmented roundworms that occur in salmon aren't harmful to you means because they can't really borrow through the intestine they can cause stomach upset if they get through. But this is like if you get sold a piece of meat, and there's a worm in it, and it get it gets passed the butcher it gets passed your inspection. It's kind of your fault for not really looking at the meat carefully. Or and if you're not looking at me carefully and slicing it, then then you probably want to cook it a little bit to some degree, and the worms that are actually an issue. There are some segmented tapeworms, but those occur in freshwater fish. But salmon, do go upstream and rivers. So they can have tapeworms, but these tapeworms are much much much larger. So this ties into the Bush thing it's not going to get past the butcher, you know, when they cut open the salmon there's going to be so it's gonna. To be so infested that it's not the meat is not consumable. I mean, if you really want to get gross out anymore. You can watch parasite videos on YouTube, but a really good resource for this is the CDC center for disease control, you can type in any parasite any animal any disease, you're concerned about it will give you statistics on how frequently people get sick. It will give you the ticks on parasite occurrence on bacterial infection rates. What foods they come from? And you'll find that it's mostly plants. I didn't forget about trick noses as well as preowned diseases. So trick Enosis I think that's from feeding a lot of times from feeding animals garbage. But the main concern for trick noses is a wild game meat. So unless you're eating bear meat or wild boar meat. You shouldn't really worry about trick. Noses a pork used asterik Enosis because how how poorly we treat our animals. So if you're going to consume pork, unless you're raising the animal yourself, and you got animal tests for trick Enosis when you started it. I wouldn't start doing any report. But there are a lot of countries that. Consume raw pork and they raise animals specifically to consume raw. I mean same thing with chicken people eat, plenty of raw chicken about preowned diseases are really interesting because preowneds are mis folded proteins, and you can't kill these things you could he'd. You could throw. Substance in the environment. That does not go away. I mean, Joe Rogan had a podcast on this with an expert on diseases and chronic wasting disease endear, and these proteins essentially, these bronze folds tissue in your brain. And essentially makes holes in your brain now in the context of mad cow disease, and consuming it and having an issue. There has never been one case of mad cow disease in the United States all of the cases were from people who consume to meet in another country, and then they came over here. And we're diagnosed with the disease, I've heard many very shady stories about the origin of mad cow disease. What to my understanding they fed sheep that had scrappy, which is the form of mad cow and sheep, they fed sheet meal to cows. And then they developed the bovine form of it. I mean, you can also get a pre disease crucial the disease if you were like a brain surgeon. And then you look the scout. Apple. But when people think that they're going to get a pre entities from eating brain tissue, specifically of the animal. That's not true the preowneds occur in all the tissues of the animal, although they are more concentrated in the the brain and the spinal cord the preowneds or in the whole animal itself. So in regards to concerns about actually day-to-day physical concerns scrappy in. I think it's actually called scrapie. I'm an idiot today. It's called scrapie because what happens is the sheep starts scraping their bodies against the fence. So scrapie in sheep is non has not been shown to be transferable to Uman's bought as we said earlier with these sick animals, these things don't usually get past the butcher same. Then if I mean, if you cut open lamb skull, and there's holes in the lambs brain, it'd be don't eat it. Pork is actually immune to diseases. They have like a genetic immunity to priante interesting. I've I have not eaten I've eaten Cavs brain. What's also, interesting to note is mad cow disease cannot occur in an animal until it is pass three years of age because it developed over time in the animal. What other brains can you eat? I mean, obviously, you don't wanna go out and eat a deer that had chronic disease. You don't wanna eat their brain or something. I'm sure something might happen there. But the point is has hasn't actually been shown that you can even get pre-owned diseases from other animals outside of humans and cows. And the reason the calif- was transferable to Uman's is because it was a mutated form of BSE. And the reason you can get. I mean, you can get crucial the cubs from eating brain tissue. That has groups will the cops. And also, some people arm you to it in general. That's also you mentioned that you don't eat raw ground beef. So what's your favorite type of raw meat to eat? Yeah. I mean, I maybe I've actually gone to foods like twice in the past year end. Rog around me, that's on a rare occasion. That's the only time I've ever done. It. I go to Pennsylvania has some listen to Amos people. They're the shit, man. I sort of got these people raise the animals how they're supposed to be. I bought this ground veal the other day, and I this ground like what I was like Jesus Christ this veal. It was so amazing the fresh meat raised. How it's supposed to be. I just have local farmers. I ask them. Hey, what are the cheap off cuts? You guys have fatty stuff, and I just eat whatever. But you know, you might think a brisket or a short rib or something has to be cooked very long period of time to me. I could cook a brisk at media. I could cook a brisket medium rare slice it against the grain. I can still chew it. I mean, I might have to slice it a little smaller. And but. My favorite thing to eat from a taste perspective. The tastiest raw foods to me are obviously I mean, raw dairy is delicious raw cream raw raw milk, raw sheet milk, man. My one of my favorite most, delicious foods in the world. But Maguire foods, you can cut off of an animal. I really like the the bone marrow can be really tasty. But this ties back to indigenous people they literally had preferences for every part of the animal like they might have liked the lower leg bone marrow, raw the upper leg bone marrow. Cooked. They might have liked the the sheep had boiled and the caribou had roasted over fire, very specific food preferences. And when you start tasting these foods, and you notice what you like. Things taste different. You know, fat from one part of the animal taste different than other parts of the animal, but in regards to actual cuts of meat that most people are familiar with. Yeah. Of course, I love rebuy revise Alicia. If it's really fatty the fat on brisket has this very unique flavor to it the fat on the belly of the animal. Most people eat bacon has a very unique flavor to it. Every part of the animal has a flavor. I mean, that's the great thing about this diet when you eat you could taste if a steak is flank steak, if it's skirt steak if his New York strip filet Mignon, you can taste what part of the animal. The meat is from same thing with the fat same thing with the marrow. It's it's it's really interesting where should somebody start? You know, they'll say they're grossed out. They think you're disgusting. Eating raw stuff and eat raw brains and everything where should somebody start just to get some more nutrients in their diet period without having to beyond too crazy schedule. I wanted to be very clear that you don't have to eat raw food too. Healthy indigenous foods are sorry. Indigenous groups did eat both cooked raw fermented food. You can eat a completely cooked food diet. I mean, if you're looking every single thing too, well done the only thing I would be concerned about his maybe you want some vitamin C in your die from somewhere else. You don't have to eat raw products. If you're looking to source products. There's some excellent websites like eat wild dot com. Local harvest dot org where you can look into local farms and farmers markets and see what made you have accessible on a more on an easier, relatively speaking term. I literally can go to like all the supermarkets and local butchers in my area hall butchers will have lamb pretty much any part of I did a video where I tasted every single part of her all land that I slaughtered. There's meat that's easily accessible you just have to do a little bit of legwork. Okay. The the ShopRite have grass would by. Oh, ShopRite has whereby for nine dollars. A pound. It's pretty insane. Does hope I mean, whole foods is different sore. I can't afford to eat there myself. I'd probably probably go broke buying second foods, maybe you can do ground beef all foods, but you really have to look at it. We'll start from the easiest so explore your local options supermarkets, any any sort of wholesale store. Like, Costco, see what they have available for fish, local Asian markets are a godsend. These guys will have anything alive that you can imagine that you would eat. They have it there, and they will cut it for you. And I mean, even things these they have live kill Mark. It's like where I am in queens and Brooklyn of but the meat quality ties in here. Getting the hardest thing to do is to get a quality source of me, fresh and cheap. You could get frozen stuff. That's that makes it easier. And once you've export all those local options, then you can look into farmers markets and local farms, I literally call up forms, and I say, hey, how often do you abbatoir two abattoirs slaughterhouse? You could call these places up. They often do slaughter an animal. Can I buy X amount of meat per week? If you show people you're willing to spend money and develop these relationships than you can get these foods, obviously, no, I do consult a lot of people that don't want to do these things. So there is a way to do it. And like that I mentioned earlier raw grass-fed cheese. I mean, the problem with eggs is even if you're going to the supermarket and buying the best passionate omega, three eggs. They're still being fed predominantly grain feed, the grass and meat is not as fresh and good as it could be. So there is a slight sacrificing quality. If you do want easier access to food, but. I always liked to think there's to be something wrong with you to do what I do. No, I'm sorry. The resources for anyone that's interested. Eat wild dot com. Local harvest dot org. Real milk dot com is great for finding local milk sources. And then you can even just Google. I would just Google stuff in your area. Butcher abattoir farm. There's probably a ton of Facebook groups that I don't really mess with entry. You got any questions over there? She got buddy. No. Well, my question was exactly how do we get started? But the those the websites that you mentioned were great. So thank you for that one thing that I did want to ask. And we're talking about it earlier. You know, you mention indigenous people in our ancestors and whatnot, and I'm not trying to be combative or anything like that. But we were just to take like an AB comparison, and I'll just be super basic and simple with it. We are living longer now. So why is it referenced so much in something arguments? So I actually did a whole video on that the other day explaining that one thing off the bat. That's not actually that's not actually true statistic the lie the life expectancy now is not too far off of what we used to have the constituent here is the infant mortality rate. So there were groups of people who will literally have an infant or child mortality rate of fifteen twenty twenty five percent. But if you got past that young period of life, you would likely live to sixty five seventy seventy five, and if we look at life, I mean, we can look at blue zones in life expectancy by country and see what they can they consume general. But the main argument against that is the life expectancy the other thing I like to bring up. Okay. You could argue let's say these people did die at thirty five. Let's say some of them did because these people are surviving. How long do do we think any of us would last in the woods without modern rifles Ma? Equipment. The fact that these people were able to survive with a bow and arrow in the forest like like to me. That's the craziest thing general if these people can survive with a bow and arrow in the forest and procure calories in that way. It's completely amazing. And that ties back into if you go into a forest the only thing you'll be eating is animal foods because you didn't have your ancestors to tell you. This plant is good that plant is good. You know, what to eat? There's that element of these people were literally trying to survive they had very harsh lives, and even in these in these tribes where they were very skilled and adapted hunting, and they were able to your calories very easily. They went around killing each other. You know, if you Google Australian aborigines cannibals natives to Australia. There's some really really crazy stories that I could talk about on here about what these cannibals used to actually do and they had beliefs like eating the heart of your enemy would make you stronger eating their brain would make you smarter. And I mean, listen. The branches of an animal might have mega three fatty acids in it, but that doesn't necessarily mean you should go over your neighbor's house and have some twisted thoughts going on. But. To tie back to the their life expectancy, people don't realize in for mortality, people don't realize the elements of survival, and the I mean, the main thing is these there's no evidence of genital disease in these people. There's no evidence of diabetes as evidence of cancer. There's no evidence of chronic disease. And if you see what they looked like they're like per, they look like marble statues. They look like perfect physical specimens and a lot of these pictures. And and one interesting thing, I bring up is not to offend any people. Have you ever seen a picture of bald eskimo or a first national asking or a ball native American? These people didn't lose their hair either. That's one interesting thing. I'm yeah. It just it gets got me thinking, you know, looking pictures of native Americans looking picture of these indigenous people, you know, they all look the same in a way, they if you think of a species of people that are from a certain area, they kind of look a certain way, and whether or not they developed properly in that way is. Conducive to their environment that I answer that. Did you want me to touch on anything specifically on the life expectancy thing? No, that's that's just about it. And yeah, there's it's definitely it's kind of like the who's better Jordan LeBron. There's so many different variables there like it's it's impossible to AB comparison. But now, you I think you hit it right on the head, man. I think to like, you know, I think that were dying longer. What I said kind of before we got on the show like there's so many people are so sick, all it's it's upset and say all life expectancy is higher and people get excited about that stat. And it's like everybody's on like all these weird drugs. And I think I mean, I'm just I just go by what I see. I see a lot of people not feeling. Well, see a lot of people. Wheelchairs and just sickly and and just not doing well and having diabetes, and heart disease, and all these other things. So I think that the message is great, you know, if we can get people to be healthier. And I I like your message to because it's coming from a place of addition now. Yeah, it would be great to have everybody like wipe out processed foods from their diet. And it'd be awesome. If people could have the willpower that you have to ninety two carbohydrate for the last decade. But you know, we realized that that's not probably realistic. But can you start to get more meat in your diet? Can you start to explore? Maybe some of the things that you mentioned to get more nutrient dense foods of Ken people make some room for some dairy and more for mended foods. Yeah. Absolutely. Can absolutely. Can it's not hard to do anyone can kind of implement some of these things. And I think it's a great way to go about it is dish by subtraction. You keep adding convince people that they need to go on a walk or have some form of exercise convince people they need. To drink more water convince people that they need more sleep. They need to recover from their day, the need to recover from their workouts. And I think it's a good place to start. Definitely. And if if these types of foods are supported if people start and even the past years, you know, these big companies, whether it's McDonald's or processed food companies when they see people want healthy foods, they switch their marketing. They try to meet the demand. So if people want to be healthy and people want healthy foods, and they're complaining that oh it's too expensive to do. Well, that's that's a whole different story. Once we once we start becoming healthier start supporting these higher quality foods. That's when there becomes a drastic shift, and it becomes accepted as opposed to the opposite of the norm. Yeah. Should be seeing awesome. A fast food rotten meat places. The opening up around the country pretty quickly here. I think. It's funny that McDonald's cheeseburger. Although I McDonald's does sell essentially rotten milk on cheese. I mean, I think the actual cheese the cheese a McDonald's patties is actually completely fake. It's not legit. I think that's a funny thing. Like people say, you know, that you brought up the Ryan meet him Donald's. Well, technically speaking if that was if that was an aged burger and cheese. It's really my it's really about convention and perception to it's really interesting. Thank you so much for your time that repre- thank you so much. Where can people find you? Frank to final on YouTube. You guys can follow me on Twitter Instagram website. Frank dash afoul dot com as well. Appreciate it. Thanks again. Thank you guys. Okay. Take care. Very interesting eating all that raw raw food. Pretty cool. I think some things some things he said, I mean are are easy to adopt. I mean other than other than like diving in on some raw food. I mean, I think I mean, it's all stuff. We've we've talked about on this podcast before having some variety of meats. You know, we've talked before on the podcast about, you know, bone broth bone marrow liver. Our brain can eat some of those things can eat liver and heart and maybe not maybe maybe just don't dig it. Right. So don't make your life any harder than it really needs to be. But if you try something, and you like it, then maybe you found something that you can implement into your life. The biggest the biggest. Just getting over how unconventional it sounds. You're right. You know, like like we talked about fasting before like, you mentioned we thought it was the stupidest thing ever, we do it. Oh, it's pretty great. So just like again like just getting over L Rami that sounds bad like from as a kid. You just don't eat raw meat. Right. Right. So you just got to get over that. And maybe do some research. See what you can eat. Maybe give it a shots. You feel probably a lot of it's probably not that bad. Trying to think of like other than a restaurant where they've had some thinly cut beef. I don't think I've really tried a lot of like raw. Meet in that sense other than like, we said sushi. That's been about it. I haven't really at home. I haven't just randomly grabbed a piece I eat my food, pretty rare. But raw is a different ballgame is a little different. And what he said made some sense to like if you choose to cook, it, maybe you just need to little more of it in the same amount of nutrients because when you cook it, you're going to cook out some of the nutrients, so it's like, okay. That's I mean, a lot of what he said even though there was some things in there. That are crazy. And he least acknowledged that. Like most people aren't going to be able to follow and do exactly what he's doing. Yeah. I like what he said about, you know, eating basically twice as much because I know when I make a steak, rare it tastes so much better. But it kills my stomach again back to my ridiculous stomach. But when I cook it really, well, I it's easier to handle, but I'm also like damage kicked it a little bit too long. But then I don't wake up in the middle of the night with my stomach cramping the way, I did the other. Try to so bad. But what if you eat less of it, and it's cooked a little less. I could give that a go. Maybe try that. Yeah. I wonder if it's the fat content too. Because I know I got some some friends that I've put on diets before and like when I put him on a Kito Dodi their stomachs is they're dying. And I think it might have to do with just the maybe the overall amount. So maybe just try to eat try to eat like six ounces and just see what that does. Maybe I can't like keep up with the the demand of trying to break all that down in my stomach or so it'd be some people there's so many other things that factor into this. But some people's gallbladder doesn't like keep up with trying to digest that amount of fat. And so therefore, it could be, you know, making you sick or could be other influences. Well, but maybe just trying to eat a little bit less might my work. Yeah. My some good. But then I'm gonna wanna reach carbs. Yeah. I know carbs like other carbs, I know car. Beget carbs. Well, that's what I noticed when I've been fasting. I'm still doing it every day. It's still Levin it. But if I have something I don't know like I'll have potatoes or I'll have extra rice just because unlike tastes really good right now. The next day is really hard to get through that initial wave of hunger. So I I don't know if that's just me or if that's just the way it is. But it's been tough. I think I think a lot of problems get solved when you keep your stomach empty. I think that will continue to help you a lot. I think fasting can be can be great from that sense. And I think you know, what Frank was talking about with just eating less, and just, you know, the conventional American standard American diet versus some of the other types of diets people might go on the main factor, whether you're going vegan or carnivore which seem like total opposites maybe in both cases, you just are making healthier decisions. And maybe in both cases because you're on a quote, unquote, diet, your also choosing to eat less, and maybe the simple. The act of eating less can help make us healthier. And then also, you know, when we had marxists. And on the podcast. We've had other people on the podcast who talked about Kito genyk diets. And they talk about you know, your body's ability to switch over from being a sugar burning machine to a fat-burning machine. I think that some of these things are are misleading. And I think that in the absence of excess calories. I think the body works at self out and uses what's there as fuel? I think you're buys like pay. We got we got a little bit of sugar over here. And you're getting kind of tired, let's funnel that out to whoever needs it. And I think the body like, although it is it can be very confusing on how all all the stuff works. I think it's I think it's simply a lot of times just come down to you know, if you're if you're continually eating massive amounts of food. I think you're kinda Rican havoc on your system and causing a lot of problems. Yeah. And then my biggest concern, and you know, how we talked about it a couple of episodes ago about. Like fascinate doesn't make any sense to me. Like, I need to be eating way. More like this dumb, blah, blah. I haven't lost. Anyway at all. And I really only been eating one to two times a day and yesterday or Tuesday doing dead lifts trap bar dead lifts, but Markle's like let's go for a heavyset of six in to see what you can get like, you're probably still fill in strong from the meat and everything. So let's go go for it ended up pull in three hundred six times previous to that did three hundred once for a like all-time PR. So I don't know what that was all about. But it's I'm not losing strength. And I'm not losing weight, which was my biggest concern of all of this. So whatever the hell is happening. It seems to be working. I think fasting. Your body releases some hormone to help protect lean muscle. Mass body will lease them a hormones that will just help protect you in general. So I think it's you know, how long were you fasting that day fasting pretty long on that day. I don't know. Exactly. I just know. Also, I sure skip breakfast. And then I don't eat before one o'clock. So there's a good chance that was eighteen hours fast. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that that's kind of falls in line with most of the research that shows that you aren't going to really lose muscle mass. Now, you know, could you could you optimize your diet better towards gaining more muscle mass and towards by eating more. Frequently sure I'm sure he can write. But you know, from what I've seen in seem as been doing this for a little bit longer as well. And I think a lot of people are reporting kind of similar facts with fasting. That's great thinking it just six. Trying out because like like I mentioned shortly. I was doing it wasn't Kito because I'll still eating carbs panels eating less than about seventy grams of carbs day and still doing the same activity just to see like in the back. I was like I'm gonna feel tired. I won't have much energy. I felt fine. But I didn't feel at any less energy at all actually felt maybe a little bit better. So it's kind of odd. Because like when you look at a lot of like, let's say high intensity athletes, maybe athletes that do basketball soccer jujitsu. I would've expected to feel like no energy on the mats. Because that's what I hear from a lot of people that, you know, cut cut out there, carbs or weightless carbs. But I didn't feel any of that. So I think there's probably a large mental aspect to it. They're like, oh, modding carbs feeling tired. I think that a lot of that might not actually be true just might be literally mental. And you're pretty smart with all this stuff too. Because you've been doing it for a long time. So I'm sure that maybe when you look at it. You're like I'm gonna cut back on some carbs. But we more fat. I'm going to have. Yeah. I'm gonna have more meat. I'm going to eat more fat, right? And. I think that was Frank's point was like a lot of times if you're gonna eat carbs a lot. Maybe you're not getting the nutrients that you need. Maybe you eat a couple of French fries, or maybe you eat which you'd get like a little bit of like vitamin C and a little bit of vitamin a, and maybe some potassium and some sodium from that. But you're not going to get a whole lot more than that. But if you just simply eight more meat, you would get more nutrients you'd probably get a good amount of calories because you'd get more fat and you'd get more protein. So when you start to kind of break it down that way, you know, something like rice just is almost just carbohydrates. It doesn't really have a whole lot else in it doesn't mean that you can't eat rice. And doesn't mean that you shouldn't every rice. It just means that, you know, maybe maybe what we're looking at most of the time is not always the right thing. You know, we're always looking at the macro, and maybe we should be looking at the macro and the micro and piecing those together because maybe when when piece those together, maybe we have something that would work. Efficiently and work faster for us. So anyway. Some good stuff. It was. Yeah. I like that. He wasn't. He did say some crazy things and he does some even crazier convention unconventional. I'm thinking, you're good. With with words. But he wasn't you know, he said that he doesn't totally right off vegetables. And you know, he wasn't. So like, it wasn't like a religious thing for him. He's just like this is what's working. And this is why it works. You know, he kinda had a little bit of facts back everything up. He wasn't full-bore. Everyone should be eating meat. And you can also just you can utilize this knowledge for whatever you need, you know. So like vegetable somebody might say vegetables or kinda worthless. And like he pointed out vegetables can sometimes have anti nutrients, and they certainly don't have a lot of calories. Right. But now, let's talk about, you know, you're doing bodybuilding show or you're doing a physique show. And he want to lose a bunch of. Or let's say you wanna lose a bunch of weight. And let's say let's say you weigh three hundred pounds. You wanna lose weight well shit a three hundred pound person has probably over long period of time. Consumed a lot of food a large volume of food. So now, let's say, okay. You know, I want you to with every meal, I want you to have, you know, two big servings of vegetables because he want that person to feel satiated and you want them to get used to their food and you want over a period of time for to bring down their caloric intake. And that's where you can utilize vegetables to your advantage. And Furthermore, if you just like them, just eat them, you know, you don't need to make life that hard. I mean, if something is is messing up your sleep. If something is messing up your stomach if you're not feeling right then. Yeah. You need to reevaluate that. But in general, if you feel pretty good, and you like the foods that are in your diet, you're pretty happy with the results you're getting and I don't think there's a lot of reasons to really overly worry about the fights not against vegetables. If it's not against for fight against trying to trying to pull the reins and a little bit on these processed foods because those things we're gonna tend to overeat and more than likely those are going to be the things that. Give us the body that we don't want three just taking a little bit from everything. And just keeping it simple. I don't eat a lot. Don't eat a lot of sugar or a crazy amount of it. If you want to have a little bit here, and there and a lot of processed packaged foods, I've been staying away from that for a long time. Now, I just feel overall better and just add in what feels good you don't have to totally cut out carbs. If you feel better with carbs, but don't eat like, eight hundred grams pay liquid carbs. It's it's it can be very simple, but you can make it difficult if she a lot of unnecessary when used to eat more carbs, and even when you design diets for people what happens when the carbohydrate intake is really high. I would imagine that the fat content has to come down. Right. The fact there's a guy right now. John John Schafer. I think you've seen it before is really white black guy on Instagram. Right. He's eating like maybe four hundred he's white and black. That's why. But he looks white, but he's half black. That's why really white black. Anyway is in. Bagram name. It is Instagram. All it is is John. I think right now is eating like ninety grams of ninety or maybe hundred grams of today, but he's eating like an nexus of a four hundred ninety five hundred cards. Yeah. He does jitsu. Also, he's done shows. He's he's jacked. And this is like the Lena sees ever been, but the most food is ever been eating, and that's even a pretty reasonable amount of fat. A lot of times you hear even some of these high level bodybuilders that are big that are, you know, this guy probably weighs what two hundred pounds to ten to actually probably to ten to twelve. And the funny thing is is like right now, he's doing jitsu lifting. But what we were getting ready for his body building show think like a year ago year and a half ago Hughes eating like maybe his carbs are at two hundred and his fats down elect fifty sixty to get that lead eastern a lot of loans to cardio now. Obviously, he's doing much more work and for to actually feel that we're just eat a lot of. Food, but he's almost he's close to being show. Right met him before Barbara Reagan you've met him. Yeah. So I mean, if you were to right now like he'd be there in in six weeks, but like he's eating an insane amount of food. So it really just depends on the person, and like how much activity they have to feel their workouts? That's what I'm like. It's also a good idea. It's a good idea to get yourself used to eating more food is a good idea to get yourself used to eating less food. Right. I mean, if you were going to go back to bodybuilding, you might wanna think about like, you know, for lack of a better term. You might wanna think I'm gonna race up my metabolism. And I'm going to start to eat more often more frequently, and maybe you're gonna start to do today workouts, where you got a little bit of cardio in their little bit of pump sessions going on here and there, right? And so you might just switch stuff up just to throw your body like just throw a monkey wrench into it. And kinda see you know, how how you react to it. But you know, a lot of people that are trying to adhere. To a diet. They just try to always eat less and always eat less and always eat lessen the new start maybe with something like fasting, and then they're trying to fast, more and more and more and more all the time. And it's like well now, you might get to a point where you're going to start to rebound back from it. So we need to you need to kind of like an exit strategy out of these things like what what are the next couple steps gonna look like and what I shared with a group that I've been helping earlier today. I said there's gonna you need to have time for everything understand that you know, there's going to be period of time or you eat less and you'll continue to weigh less. And it's gonna be a point where your weight's stops your hundred eighty five pounds, and you're stuck there. And you wanna be one hundred sixty five or whatever you're gonna be stuck. We stuck there for a little while. It's okay to be stuck. And when you're stuck that's a good good time not to give up. But it's a good time to switch gears. A good time to say, okay, I fasted I made some progress a loss fifteen pounds. That was great. And I you know got. Of carbohydrates. I'm gonna bring fruit back in. I'm gonna bring I'm gonna bring a cheat meal back in once a week. I'm gonna burn right? Like just because you're playing the long game. You know, you don't there's no reason for you to weigh one sixty five tomorrow. And even if you die even if we could figure that out you're going to rebound back hard, and you won't be in the shape that you wanna be in anyway. So because we know that we're playing a long game it might take a year to get there. But that's fine. The longer that takes us to get there at the longer you're going to be able to stay there and the easier going to be. Anyway, that's all the time. We got today. Strengthens never week this week this never strength. Catchy. Guys later.