Don't Buy a House When You're Broke (Hour 1)
The headquarters of Ramsey solutions. It's the Dave Ramsey show. Were NAT is gone cash is king and the paid off mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I'm Dave Ramsey your host. This is your show America. Thank you for joining us. Open phones at triple eight eight to five five two two five that's triple eight eight to five five two two five you jump in. We'll talk about your life and your money Meghan starts off this hour in Minneapolis. Hi, meghan. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey show. Hi, dave. I'm excited to talk to you today. Better than I deserve. How can I help? Okay. So I just wanted to start off by saying, I am finishing babysat number two this month. And I couldn't be more thrilled. But I do have a bit of a different question for you today. So in order for us to be able to get to where we are with the hang off all debt. My husband's brother, this family moved into our house about six months ago, and we're currently sharing all over fences in the home. My question is the minimum of the five year plan for us. But when they go to move out, I feel or a believe that it's fair that they'd be incentivized. They're paying half our principal on our mortgage. How would you go about incentivizing them? They're gonna live with you for five years. Yeah. We don't want to knock through all right baby steps and live like no one else. So we can live like no one else later. Wow. I have to say out loud. I couldn't do that. But if you want if you want to it's your choice, I don't really have precedent for what would be fair to someone living in your house for five years and sharing your expenses. They're getting a deal are they not? I mean, like half rent what they would pay somewhere else. Right. Right. Okay. And they knew when they moved in that it was they knew when they moved in. It was your house. Right. I don't know that they need to be incentivized with half of your principal. They're just paying rent. I don't I don't incentivize a renter. That moves into a rental house with giving them a kickback for the principal. They're paying off because they're not paying off the prince blind him, I'm using their money to do it. But the income off the rental house, but this income they moved in because they lowered their expenses overall you allow them to because it lowers your expenses. Overall, one of your expenses happens to be your house. So no, I don't I don't think that's necessary. Again, it's hard for me to kick. Gret my brain around it because it's just not something I would do. But but but I'm not saying it's bad to do it. I'm just saying I wouldn't do it. But the. I'm not even sure I like my dog living in the house with me. But. Oh my gosh. And that's my dog. I'm kidding not much now. No. I would not incentivize them. I wouldn't do that. But if you want to it's okay, but you're asking my opinion. And I I think they're getting their deal by reduced expenses. Camille is in Atlanta. Hi, Camille, welcome to the Dave Ramsey show. Hi bays. Better than I deserve. What's up? Good. So my student loan will my private devote right now. And they offering a settlement at forty one forty eight thousand which is not what I have. I actually feel like a good a good number that gives him back is about twenty thousand anywhere from fifteen to twenty thousand. I still don't have that. So my question is my roommate, and I was longtime roommates we're looking to purchase a home next year. I've run keep going up here. And I make about ninety case a house. I have have money I paid the most of my bed phone once left other loans. And so my question is if I purchase a home of hurt you think it's a good idea to go into purchases home with the idea of paying it off. Once we sell it. Purchase a home with a roommate. Absolutely. Not not not because everything that can go wrong. Will we call them the dis? You're forming a partnership divorced default drug use disinterest. Disability death any of those things occur. The other one of you is screwed because you're attached at the hip with handcuffs called a home mortgage. And there's no easy way to get out of that very very bad. I did a buy a house with somebody. You're not married to so no, I would not recommend that. And you don't need to buy a house. Anyway, you got the student loan debt. You gotta clean up. I going to get the twenty K or forty eight. Why would you be buying a house? If you're too broke to clean up your. Yeah. My my goal was maybe parts of the house and then in five years, so it hope and in with the with the prayer that it it makes me money. And then that's that's a good one. With a house when you're broke. So now, let's let's get things in the right order. The right order is we need to clear up our debts. Build an emergency fund and save a down payment you make ninety thousand dollars a year. You can afford a house when you've gotten your debts cleared, and so what is the balance on this private student loan, the total balance that they say you total not what they're offering. At the moment because I'm in the forgiveness of the the interest rate program or whatever and it's been collections. But anyway, it's ninety six thousand and their own rose settle that for forty eight. Something like, yeah dollars. We'll settle for less more. No, it's a private student loan. It's not a federally insured student loan, right? These are the private even though the federals are about the same amount. But I just haven't gotten around figuring out with the best label you have another ninety thousand in student loan debt. That's federal hundred by this time. The in addition to the private, right? What is your degree in? See I sociology and you spent two hundred grand. It with all of the interest and everything and a years worth of graduate school. Yeah. Wow. Okay. News as you're making ninety. So that that's just gonna take you while to clean this up you need to rent as cheaply as you can possibly rent get on rice and beans. And I my one of my very first goals. How much do you own your car? Eighty eight thousand I'm going to be paying that off in the next six months. Okay. I want you to list all of your debts smallest to largest pay minimum payments on everything. But the little one attack the little one when you get to a twenty five thousand dollar number on that. Debt snowball, you save twenty five thousand and you offer it to the private student loans. If you can clear them, you're not gonna get settlements on the federal the federals. Federally insured, do not settle they will waive some late fees. Sometimes they'll wave some interest and other miscellaneous collections charges, but but they will not wave the principal because it's federally insured. The federal government is going to give them the principle of you don't. So they do not settle on that part. But yeah, you need to clean up. You got a lot. You got a ways to go. Here mean you made a pretty good size mass. And so get your car paid off. Let's work through the private student loans work through the federally insured. Loans, and this take you years, but you need to rent something cheapest possible, you definitely do not need to buy and you for sure don't need to buy with a partner with a roommate danger. Danger danger? Don't do it. Talked you out of that. If I did or not this is the Dave Ramsey show. If you own a business, you have to get it online in order to survive in today's marketplace, no exceptions. Now, there's a lot of ways to do that. But the Smart Choice is host gator hostgator web hosting is reliable, and they have twenty four seven live support and host gator has an easy to use drag and drop builder that comes free with your hosting plan. Plus Dave Ramsey listeners. Get up to sixty percent off their hosting packages. Now, that's a deal. Go to hostgator dot com and make sure to use the code, Dave and get this. Great offer host gator dot com, code Dave. January means a lot of people are making goals for their money right now. And there's a couple types of strategies that you need for your money for going to win you need to have offense. And you need to have defense. Just like a good football game. Offense is creating the budget building your -mergency fund paying off your debt. Most people forget about the defense though. And that's insurance now insurance most of us hate insurance. It just feels like I'm just throwing money out the window the car grabbing along interstate. Most people just don't, and but but we know we need it. Because man, if you don't have it when something happens Bom, you gotta mass. You don't have health insurance. You got a mess. Right car insurance wreck your it's on you got a mess and so on. So it's not there to make you wealthy, but insurances are transfer risk. It's there to protect your money. And you don't feel like you're getting any traction. And some of the insurance agents out there agree with me on the stuff. I teach some of them don't agree with me on what I teach. But that would be just the guys that are wrong. So let's start with some basics. You do need life insurance? If you have a family that depends on your income term life insurance, you do need health insurance. Every one needs health insurance outta got called today. He had fifty six thousand dollars in medical bills and his com-. I said why don't you have health insurance? I couldn't afford it. I said you couldn't afford to be without it cost. You fifty six thousand dollars. Yeah. I know that now. Yeah. That's the deal. So you need health insurance? Obviously you need auto insurance. Obviously, you need homeowners insurance which covers your home. Now, a lot of people rent and don't have renters insurance, your landlord does not have cannot have coverage on your stuff. They do not have an insurable interest. You have to cover a contents policy. When you're the tenant, and it's absolutely violence. Very inexpensive. You need to get that long term disability insurance. Everyone needs that and identity theft protection. And those that are over sixty need look at long term care insurance. So was some of these you can get your costs way down when you get your emergency fund fully funded. I carry a five thousand dollar deductible on my cars. Well, drive expensive cars that are nice and paid for. But that keeps my premiums way down some of you are carrying a two hundred and fifty dollar deductible on your car, if you'd raise that two thousand you'd see your premiums drop drum Matic -ly now when you do that if you go from to fifty two thousand you are picking up an extra seven hundred and fifty dollars in risk. And so if that cuts your premiums by seventy five dollars a year that means you have to drive for ten years and not have Iraq. Not likely depend on where you live, right. I know, but you're probably overdue. So the thing is, you know, people run into you run into people stuff happens. And so here's the thing. If you take a seven hundred fifty dollar extra risk though and save three hundred dollars a year. Well, that's like two years, and you get your money back. Right. So you need to do that. If you are starting to build some asset, you're heading towards everyday millionaire status. You starting to have some money you need look an umbrella policy. Couple of hundred bucks to three hundred bucks a year. You can get an extra million dollars in umbrella coverage for ability on your car homeowners insurance, and it's just two hundred fifty three hundred dollars a year in most areas, and it gets really really a good idea. I carry a ten million dollar. Umbrella policy on me because if I bump into somebody they grab their back and go God. Dave Ramsey hit. Me I'm cashing in. Right. And so I've got you know, I it's just the way it is out there people so deal. Now what you don't want to do is. The gimmick insurances. You wanna void accident insurance and accidental death insurance? Listen, if you die your dad. That's how that works. It doesn't matter. How you die. You can be walking across the parking lot and get hit by a car. You can be walking across the parking lot and have a heart attack. You're still dad both ways your family still needs to replace your income and the exact same amount, regardless of the cause of your death. You're not like double dead if you die by accident. And so I'll get twice as much of a day by accident. I'm more likely to die by accident. That statement says I think I'm beating the insurance company at their game. You're not if if insurance is cheap. It's because there's a very low likelihood of the thing occurring. Because they don't lose money. They know what they're doing. So you don't need twice as much insurance. When you die by an accident. You don't need cancer insurance. Big gimmick insurance lobby about cancer insurance. You have health insurance if covers cancer if it doesn't you need different health insurance. You don't need heart attack insurance because your health insurance covers heart attacks. You don't need kidney stone insurance because your health insurance covers kidney stones or it should. Okay. And to my knowledge, they're not offering kidney stone insurance. But it could happen. You never know. You don't need cell phone insurance. If you cannot afford to replace your cell phone, you shouldn't buy one. This is an inexpensive item. Seriously, comparatively speaking don't buy extended warranties and other kind of insurance they're all about the profit. Seventy five to eighty percent of what you pay for those extended warranties profit, just and marketing costs just they away from it. Absolutely. A bad idea. You don't need mortgage life insurance. The pays off your mortgage. If you die it's five times more expensive than term insurance. So if you have two hundred thousand dollar mortgage, go by two hundred thousand dollars term policy or by ten to twelve times, your income on you, which would pay off your house likely almost always. And so you need to have term insurance in place to do that. And I catch a lot of crap for this these days because there's such a craze over pets. I love pets. I love my dogs. I cry like a girl every time they die. I love my dogs. My Shitsu was in my lap in front of the fireplace. Drinking coffee with me this morning. He wondering coffee, I was but be a bad idea for that. I'll drink coffee, but yeah, I love him. I am not spending ten thousand dollars to keep a dog alive. It's a dog. Maybe that's old school. But you pet lovers. Thank I'm heartless. I'm Pat lover too. But it's a dog. Now, if you've got tens of millions of dollars in you want to spend ten thousand dollars keep dog live. That's fine. But I'm not doing it. I'm not spending ten thousand dollars to keep a Cadillac for sure. Cats just. Yeah. So whatever I mean, you don't need to spend money for chemo on your parakeet. Okay. I'm sorry. I know that hurt some of your feelings. I know some of you have gotten your lives twisted up about this stuff, but pet health insurance. I don't buy it. If you can't afford to spend a certain amount of money on the dog or the cat to keep it alive and keep it well-maintained. Then you shouldn't have a pet. And then you put any to put a limit on the value of this pets life, all your soon. So mean, I know it sounds so main, but I'm just like what's known as a grownup. And so I have to address these situations, and you guys got to decide you can decide and if you wanna spend a bazillion dollars to keep your puppy alive. Three more weeks. That's fine. You can do that. I ain't doing it. I love the puppies, and they go to puppy heaven. And it's all good life goes on. I've, you know, I've outlived a whole bunch of them by now had ten dogs in my life, so far, and I'll probably have about ten more for I'm gone. I love them, but I outlive them. And so you got to think about this stuff. So the aware the gimmick insurance is out there. But be sure you have good defense term insurance health insurance auto insurance. I'm long long-term disability insurance identity theft, maybe an umbrella policy you wanna get a five minute checkup. And make sure you've got the right coverage is done. It's really easy to do. All you just do as text checkup, the thirty three seven eighty nine text checkup thirty three seven eighty nine. In the lobby of Ramsey solutions. Coda and had here with us guys. How are you better than we deserve data yourself? Very cool is an Addy pronounce and where do you guys live? We live in Henderson, Texas. Oh, very cool. Welcome to Nashville and all the way here to do debt free screen. Yes, sir. How much have you paid off just short of fifty thousand forty nine thousand eight hundred and forty nine love it. How long did this take twenty three months? Good and your range of income during that we started at thirty four thousand went up to eighty back down to seventy what do y'all do for a living. And we're both teachers. Oh, good. Good for you, very cool. So what kind of debt is the fifty thousand? We had a credit card. Somebody had a credit card. We had a car loan and we had student loans. Okay. Very cool. How long have y'all been married to is? Okay. So you got married started this plan. Yes, sir. Tell me about that. Tell me about the journey what caused you to do this. Well, we took FPU as part of our pre-marriage counseling. Very best decision. We ever made super excited about it. And had he wants big on that. Yeah. I was not a band. My mom had told me about you. But I wasn't really on board. I thought I knew everything I was a teenager at the Tom. And so anyway that him, and we started talking about it and went to the class, and I joined on board. So we wouldn't go back to save our lives nail very cool. Good for you. So how old are you to twenty nine twenty five per? Okay. We'll congratulate you, sir. Very very cool. Big big, big accomplishment this marriage. Yes, sir. Very proud. Yeah. You should be. You should be very good. So what do you tell people the key to getting out of debt is? And the biggest thing for me is communication and budgeting planning and having that just knowing where your money's going. That's the thing for me patience. I don't have a whole lot of it. I'm the nerd I'm the saver. And we went from arguing about five dollars being spent. And so it tested my patience. I had to develop patients, and so that's one of the biggest things for me. Okay. So you got on the plan, you're working together. You're learning to communicate over this early in your marriage stuff. People don't do sometimes for decades. Yes. They're very very cool. Who's your biggest cheerleader? Probably my dad is probably the biggest one. He kinda got started on this. After my oldest brother brought to you probably five years ago. And we thought he was crazy little day. We know. But, but yeah, he's our biggest cheerleader, and then both of our parents are magnificent and have supportive the entire way. Very cool. Very good. You got family pushing. Good stuff. Very fun. We'll congratulations. You guys really well done. What was the craziest thing you did to get out of debt? Craziest thing we moved three different times. I drove a little hoop Dee and nineteen eighty seven Suzuki samurai. Oh my God. That's all I got more compliments on it than I believe in by Jaguar gets. It was fantastic. So drove that for a while to to save money, and we really enjoyed it. Yeah. What you pay for that? It's actually my parents. They owned it. My car told her one night, and and so they let me borrow it. And I drove it three years. Okay. All right. It's all tricked out. I just saw the picture of it. They said that I thought Lord what does Astor it's kind of cute. It is got a lot of couple nights. We enjoyed it. It was his blaster by one at about from us. But we'll sell it. So you handed it back to them. I did a little bit later on car for K. And then bought a truck for cash. I love it. Very good. Well, white ago you guys proud of you. Thank you. Thank you are amazing, fabulous stuff. All right. We've got a copy of Chris Hogan's every day millionaires for you. Because you're on the way to being everyday millionaires that your next step. So very very cool stuff. You got started really early your ages again what twenty five twenty nine. And so when you started this you're twenty three and twenty seven yes there. Wow. Very good. Good stuff. Well, congratulations, Dakota and Hattie. Longview, Texas Anderson Texas area fifty thousand dollars paid off in twenty three months making thirty four to eighty to seventy counted down. Let's hear a debt free scream one. Last thing we wanted to announce that we've been homeless in for a while. But we are pregnant expecting our first child in July. The whole the phone here. So your parents didn't know that they do small family knows. But most of our friends do not do. All right. Very cool. Live is good is again. Done. All right Dakota and had let's hear a debt free scream three two one. Where? Love it. Absolutely. Fabulous. It's so fun. But you can't do what they just did. It's impossible. See that they don't really exist. We just made them up there figment of our imagination and your imagination. We know this because you yahu finance is reporting that nearly twenty five percent of gen Xers millennials believe it's nearly impossible to pay off debt. It isn't surprising new information. The genetics millennials have hired that loads than other generations mortgages kids. Parents take care of student loans. More financial pressure than any other generation their new kid. This is reflected in a survey. The online lending division of SunTrust Bank. Wait a minute. Bank. Did a survey. The said, you're always going to be in debt. Thank you SunTrust. The survey says it's nearly impossible. Quote, unquote to pay off significant debt. I don't know if it's fifty thousand significant. If you're twenty three years old. I'd say that significant when I got married had he was twenty three. The go-to was twenty seven or twenty five and twenty nine. The paid fifty thousand dollars and twenty three months that's long way from. Nearly impossible. Nerdwallet kimberly. Palmer says there's definitely caused for concern looking at their finances the takeaways to motivate them to pay off debt, especially the high interest rate debt. It takes motivation does their steps to pay off debt faster. Thank you wallet predate that. But we're meeting millennials. Every day who don't think it's nearly impossible. There's a matter of fact, they not only don't think it they have proven that. It's not nearly impossible. Is it difficult to pay off fifty thousand dollars in debt in your first two years of marriage when you make seventy eighty thousand dollars a year. Yes, you sacrifice to do that. But you're living like no one else. So that later you can live and give like no one else. It's a pretty simple thing guys. Hope changes everything. And it is somehow a disease of the media. That it seems like they're the very things that they want to report on anything that says there is no hope. There's no hope it is nearly impossible says a survey from SunTrust Bank. It is nearly impossible says a survey from SunTrust Bank to get out of debt as a gen-xer millennial. And then I made to go to and a hat while there you go. Fifty thousand dollars paid off in twenty three months. But it's nearly you get the idea. I mean, this is just stupid, y'all. It's just. These young people are on fire like can do anything. They want to do once they believe that they can do it and this show and the Dave Ramsey team believes in your we're proud of you. We know you can do it. This is the Dave Ramsey show. Being with us. America. A leash is with us in Rochester, New York, highly SHA. How are you? How are you better than I deserve? What's up? I wanna thank you for the extra near speaking with me. But I have a sixteen year old and unfortunately, have not put money aside for college doing courage pudding college on hold until they're not pay for in cash. What do you suggest? Well, you're sixteen you said, I know my daughter's going sixteen just turned sixteen. Oh, I'm sorry. Your daughter is sixteen. Okay. I think you guys can make it. It just is going to be all about college choice, and it's going to be all about her working. So there's three or four things we do the most the biggest mistake that people make when they're in a situation. Like, this is they choose a college. The can't afford. And so she needs to go to in-state, and she may need to do her first year in a community college, very inexpensive and knock out some of the basics and just make sure that they're the she's taking classes that are transferable to the end state state institution. Okay. And going price that stuff out. Now. Once you've done all of that. Then you can start to set your goals and say, okay, how much extra work have? We all got to do. Because that's the second thing. She's going to be working a lot, and she's not going to be working a minimum wage Walker flopper job. She's gotta make more money than that. She's going to be nannying or waiting tables or. Walking dogs. I don't know what she's going to do. But she's going to be doing a lot of it between now and the time college starts and all the way through college. Which by the way is not child abuse. Most of us work while we were in college. Right. Okay. So if she's working, let's just pretend for second. I'll just make up something. Okay. She's driving for Uber. You drive for Uber. You can make fifteen hundred bucks a month. But you're driving almost every night. I'm not saying that's what she would do. But there's part time jobs out there like that that you can do, and if you can make fifteen hundred bucks a month that's eighteen thousand dollars a year. If tuition is nine thousand dollars, we can cover tuition and some of the other stuff, and you and her dad hopefully can chip in some you're getting on a budget. You'll be able to throw some at it as we're going along. But we gotta have a plan to make more than the cost of tuition and housing. Wow. Were in school and really to get the first year started before we get to school. We gotta have that first year our doing that whether it's community college or whatever is there a college university there in your town. Yes, there is right. Yeah. She may be living at home and go into that one. Cheaper. So the point is the point is you might not have the all cushy wonderful sweet with hearts around it and skittles in unicorns college experience I wanted to live on campus. Well, that's nice. But we're not talking about your college experience. We're talking about your education. We're trying to put some knowledge in your noodle. That's the main thing are you going to learn something and get a degree. And then all the other stuff is window dressing. And if you've got the money for window-dressing, that's fine. But if you don't have the money for window-dressing, most people spend more on the window dressing around the college experience than they do onto issue. They go round apartment with a skylight educ Uzi in racket ball court. And a free eighteen years old. They get a car with a car payment because I have to drive back and forth, and they eat out every night, and they joined sixty three different sororities and fraternities and clubs and crap. And there's nothing wrong with all that as long as you got the money. But if you finance all of that on your student loans, and you come out sixty thousand dollars student loan debt that you spent one hundred percent of that on the experience, that's just not wise. And that's what most people do in these situations. So I think you can do this. As a matter of fact, I'm sure you can do this. So thanks for calling in open phones at triple eight eight to five five two two five John is with us in Baltimore. Hey, john. How are you? Thank you my call. How are you better than I deserve? What's up? How can I help seeing? I'm at your phone your phone. Does it recently? Your phone is cutting out. You're gonna start again. Can you hear me, sir? Yes, sir. Okay. I have about one hundred thirty three thousand dollars in debt. It is a combination of tons of stuff. And the embarrassing thing about this whole thing is I make three hundred thousand dollars a year. I don't know like I just don't even know where to begin and about eight months ago. I started putting money away in Utah phones. And I'm down about percents. Now. My question is should I sell those to start paying that off? Yeah, they're in a retirement account down. Unfortunately, I I'm forty two years old, and I don't have a retirement account. So I'm just getting everything. So you've got a hundred thousand dollars in debt hundred what did you say a hundred thirty three one thirty three and once that on its credit cards, personal loans. Student loan a car everything how much of that's car. I would say about thirty five, and we're probably underwater if I try to sell it right now, and you're married. Yes. Kids. Two. Okay. Wonderful. So if you're ready to clean this up. We can do some pretty simple math here and say sixty five thousand a year out of three hundred thousand for two years in your debt free sixty five times to one thirty. But that what that means is you guys are gonna have to quit visiting the land of stupid around their y'all been spending money like airing congress. Pretty much. Yes. Yeah. You're gonna get on a written budget a detailed plan, you and your wife. We're gonna sit down and talk about it. We're not going out to eat or not going on vacation or free can get outta debt. But if you start chunking down sixty five thousand dollars a year out of three hundred you ought to build a do that really seriously. I mean, come on you be debt free in two years. And if you did more than that, you'd be faster than two years, but you need to be on beans and rice rice and beans and need to go to a radical change in your lifestyle, and on your view of money because right now, you're trying to earn your stupidity pretty much tried it for years. I couldn't do it. I don't know of anybody anybody that could. Would you take the twenty thousand that I have invested us mutual funds and sell that e even though it is a loss. Yes. Start applying to that. Yes. Immediately and any other money that I can get my hands on this not in retirement, and I'm gonna throw it at the debt, and I'm gonna listen debt smallest to largest we're going to get on the everydollar budget on a detail written plan with your spouse and get an attack mode, the fit the twenty thousand doesn't move the needle. But what it does do is? It gets you started. And it may shows your emotional commitment to a new process, but you gotta reach the point that you got to be sick and tired of being sick and tired. You started it because you're embarrassed embarrassed as good place to start disgusted should come from embarrassed. And disgusted. The next thing is you ought to just get pissed off and go. That's it. I am sick and tired of being sick and tired. I make too much money to be this broke. We're gonna change this thing. And when you. That moment inside of you. That's when the switch will flip and you'll be ready to rock and roll. I'll send you a copy of the book, the total money makeover the show you and your wife how to do this, and you tune need to sit down tonight start talking about this get on every dollar download the budget app. Get the thing started. You'd like you write down where your money should be going making three hundred grand you're gonna just blow up the floor. You're gonna go. Where's it all going? And you're gonna have this moment of disgust followed by some righteous anger. Not at yourself. I'm not trying to condemn you. We've all done stupid stuff, but you have to reach a point of disgust. That says that's beyond embarrassment. This is I'm not gonna live like this anymore. So hold on. I'll have Kelly pick-up. We'll send you a copy of the book the total money. Make over the help. You do it by the way, folks. The interesting thing is that's the formula for getting out of debt. You gotta get mad. The matter. You get at the situation the deeper. You will sacrifice the deeper you sacrifice. The faster you get out because sacrifice looks like working extra and spending less. We spend nothing 'cause we work all the time. That's what it looks. Like the matter. You get deeper you sacrifice the faster you get out. That is the formula. There's math in there. It works guys. It works. You can wander into that. But you can't wander out. This is the Dave Ramsey show. Hey, it's Kelly associate producer and phone screener for the Dave Ramsey show. This episode is over, but if you heard about a product or service didn't have a chance to write it down. Don't worry we list everything that is mentioned during this episode in the podcast show section. Thanks for listening. Money isn't the only thing we talk about around here. Get life changing it by on your career from my good friend and career expert in Kalman. Oh my Ken Coleman show. Seventy percent of Americans are going to work every Monday, and they don't want to be there. But for a myriad of reasons, they feel they have to be there that is our crusade. Subscribe to the Ken Coleman show wherever you listen to podcasts. Hey, it's James producer of the Dave Ramsey show. This episode is over but check the episode notes for links to products and services you've heard about during this episode. Thanks for listening.