219: The strange future for restaurants | Kimbal Musk
Welcome to the MY BUDDY GREENE. Podcast objects in walkup founder. And cosio of my buddy green and your host. Today's episode is brought to you by my buddy green and our incredible museum plus sleep product before this product. It took me hours to get to sleep and end up tossing turning than hitting the snooze on the alarm as woke up in the morning. Yes I slept but it really wasn't quality now with magnesium plus I fall asleep faster I stay sleep and I wake up rejuvenated and without an alarm clock. Look we all know when you don't sleep. It's pretty brutal. And it is terrible for your immunity in terrible for your health and yeah I slept but it wasn't quality sleep and now I never knew that sleeve could be so good. I hope you check out our pioneering sleep formula at my green dot com slash museum. That's buddy green dot com slash museum kimball. Boss is a chef. Restaurateur Philanthropist and real food entrepreneur his mission to pursue America. Were everyone has access to real. Food is mission. We can all get behind Europe by degreen. He's been named the Global Social Entrepreneur by the World Economic Forum and he's the CO founder and CEO of the kitchen restaurant. Group was by the way. Has One of my favorite restaurants called next door ever in Chicago or Denver. I always go. He's also the CO founder and Executive Chairman of two other incredible companies big green and square roots so in terms of the restaurants they source sustainably grown food. American farmers stimulating the local farm economy to the tune of millions a year his nonprofit big green bills permanent outdoor learning in classrooms and hundreds of underserve schools across America reaching over three hundred fifty thousand students every day. And then there's tackle able food companies swear reuss which build urban farms in climate controlled shipping containers with the mission to bring real food to people in cities around the world empowering next-gen Farmers Trini Coop List. On the board of Tesla and SPACEX quite simply. He's one of the most successful mission driven entrepreneurs in the world. Today was sure thinking out loud or asking alowed. He's along brother Kimball is an honor to have you here on the podcast. So welcome thank you so much. So let's star going way back when you broke your neck in a pretty serious snowboarding accident we were. You could have died and you're paralyzed for a number of days and you had a recovery that required you to stay red horizontal for two months so walk us through that injury and how it changed. Your Life Changed Your perspective. Yeah I mean it truly was Was the worst and best thing that ever happened to me. My life was a mixed between food and technology. I whipped in both areas but I love food and I was trained. Chef but technology is magnetism around technology. Because you you you can do something and reach the world really. Is something wonderful about it? Ned? Since it wasn't my love you know what I loved was food and I kind of one foot in checking on foot in food very frustrated with my life in many ways I probably would continue that way for a long time and I would I did. And as far south especially unhappy I was. I was not a happy person. And I'm people have a very heavy person and and I Ski Hill is actually on a children's run on an inner tube so it wasn't even on the snowboard. I wish it was a cooler story and it was an energy run. But you know for ten roles and I'm six foot four and This was the time of the surgery. Six hundred five so that was amazing. I love a nick and I was in hospital paralyzed. Which is is impossible to describe. It is It's this feeling of nothingness. You don't feel pain. You don't feel anything I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. It is just the most terrifying thing that the doctor was explaining to me. That was the way I had broken. My neck is very very unique. Way of breaking Break your neck different degrees and I had broken at zero degree angle. Which has never happens. And so he said that they can actually removes the Paralysis Adams. The blood out of his final was ruptured. This is like a quadriplegic situation and they went into the spinal column removed blind and For two months I had to be horizontal bed but of course able to walk now and function Yeah I mean it was. It was extraordinary in with breaking the neck was debt. Epiphany moment I think which most many people talk about where. Wow I'm GONNA change my life this I've now I have permission to change it known. Judge me I could go go train for the circus of I wanted to do and be like hey broke his neck. Whatever for me. It was food. And you know there's a lot of beauty and wondering and awesomeness about restaurants in creating the gathering place but it doesn't have the ego that you get from building these world changing technology companies. And you know when you almost die you your ego's just obliterating and so it was an opportunity to focus on food wasn't just restaurants Sweetie kids in food was that was really important to me was giving kids a connection to real food. My kids were time for and seven nine out four kids but the older ones were that age and it reading meant so much to me in an I already done work on. The side is philanthropist. Supporting School Gardens that I said Figure out how to scale school gardens. I'M GONNA figure out how scaled gathering place because we. We need connect with each other. We need to meet the love. The love of our life for the first time we need to go celebrated anniversary or take a friend for a birthday. That's what lasts all about you. Know what are we living for if if if not that and it kind of brings us to this crisis today. Which is about my worst nightmare. You know where we. We have to sit at home and not connect with each other. I'm just not designed for that at all. I really am struggling with. I'll be honest so there's a lot to unpack there And I'm going to go back. You mentioned passion or technology and Passion for food in your opinion. What are the similarities between those industries? and what are the differences and going from one to the other is not something you hear of every day. I'm curious you know you talk about similarities and differences and what can check learn from sued and vice versa? If anything IT'S A it's a great question and it is a question that that I think about a lot. Let me talk about what I hope will happen. Rather than maybe what is happening? What is what I hope will happen? Is that technology will come more and more into food in a way that it helps us to connect with people more and more easily more affordably. More excessively and at our restaurants working on The ability order from your iphone for example and that is not in any way meant to move hospitality removes a server. It just meant to be you know we've all been in restaurant all the time when you just WanNa order another round of drinks. Watch your iphone or the drinks. It's that easy you've been in a restaurant where you want to leave it and then you're waiting a little bit longer than you'd like to the check technology that easy things technology to solve and yet yet. We haven't been able to solve that and so what I'm doing now. Restaurants is building technology that enables that time on demand ordering from guests but with the intention that we spend more time connecting with friends with our friends in the restaurant. Maybe we order an extra drink because we have. We're having more fun than we have a bit more funding. We expected them. Start Happy Hour and all of a sudden. It's nine PM. I want technology to help us do that. And so so that's kind of where I hope it's going where where I think. The technology industry can learn from. Food is just as amazing power of connecting with each other That I that I I know I know many of my friends so the valley complained so much about how boring it is. There's just so little connection with with others But it's it but that's changing. There are more restaurants opening better restaurants shifts starting to realize you know. Their talents are appreciated. Their people are starting to be more social so I I do hope that there's a merging of the two over time and technology to me is really anything. A plate is. Technology table is technology. We invented those things at one point so eventually they will merge together and and if if what what results in is a more connected more beautiful world that I'm I'm on board so you mentioned accessibility. And you said your mission is to in America. Were everyone has access to to real food. So what does that America look like to you? What do you want to look like? And why is access to real food? Just been so hard you know. I think there had been a number of reasons. Real food is a physical that you trust to nourish your body. Who that you trust the farmer and that you trust nurse the planet? It's really not that complicated. But the problem with the industrial food system. Is You ship food from thousands of away you use flavor you harvest the product Info? It's ripe so you'll get lettuces or that don't taste very good Is Terrible for the environment. You don't even know who the farmer is can't trust the organic Organic certification especially outside of us in shipping enthused from as far away as China. I mean it's it that no one wins in this case and certainly not consumer an and not the earth the foreign so so the challenge with it is there's so many ways chat to tackle is what I what I've done at at the kitchen with our restaurants is we have. We have two two levels. We have a restaurant will kitchen. Which is high- higher. End Strong focus on supporting farmers that we know entrust very seasonal. We'd love the playing with the seasons and wherever in right now on a summer's on his own summer salad that is very basic region of Missouri and Aruba that with Tarragon and mints and Chives tossed in there. We're able to grow right here right now. In in all of those agrees can be grown in in April in Colorado's with a little shaved Palmerston's up and just not about and it's just one of them was delightful salads. You can imagine that's the kitchen does and it's like A. It's that some special seasonal food. The challenge is this a little more expensive than most people can handle and so we created next door which is really meant for twenty five to thirty five year olds more fun. The first thing you didn't order there's Margarita. You nothing to think too much about the food because when you're twenty five year you're thinking about Margarita and forty seven. I'm thinking about the Margarita in so an excellent that as you. Leave your the Margarita. First and then We're changing the menu. Imagine with the Cova crisis we really thinking hard about how to change the menu to match the future so in addition to ordering on your head blown which I think we'll be much safer for the guest really doing it for our staff staff. Inter customers a hundred times a day. Not Having to exchange credit cards with their social distancing technology can really help there but in the menu were also changing the Burgers so we're wrapping burgers and paper in the restaurant you know. That's not a normal thing for a restaurant like accounts to do. But we think that it's the right thing to do knowing how how you design a burger that that is still in that very affordable price point eight ninety five ninety five but with locally raised beef absolutely all real food and in a in a in a wrapped in paper so it's safe and delicious literally working on changing the menu as we speak What we're essential business of we actually get to use this time to innovate which is actually a little bit cool as well but so that's what we're doing in the restaurant side. Think about the next door has focused on the twenty five to thirty five year olds in the end the kitchen. More thirty five fifty five year old focus and then swear roots is our urban farming company. Which is about the age range. Eighteen to twenty five where young farmers get access to a shipping container. That is a leave cooler. Part of the five Acre farm that they run to one year and it's a full profit business but the purpose of it is to empower the next generation of young farmers. They only do it for a year and then they graduated. We set them up with a job in the industry after that usually farming sometimes in a package food or restaurants on the Gulf of the goal is to reach reach young adults eighteen to twenty five and then with big green. We are a nonprofit. We will in schools and we build earning gardens. Which are beautiful apple classrooms that teach kids ages four to eighteen science math entrepreneurship skills? English depending on the grade all of Antle at the end of highschool and that is in almost seven hundred schools around the country. We'RE IN CHICAGO MEMPHIS. Pittsburgh Eaten Annapolis Detroit Denver and Ellen. I love it Enzo personally I remember the first time my wife and I discovered it was the kitchen next door and the train station in Denver I did. We did exactly what you said. It started with a Margarita and then it just kept on just kept on going although we were you know. I'm forty five now so you know. I aged your restaurant a little bit at just out next. Always my favorite for sure because I I think I just WANNA chill out. I just want to relax and we loved it and you know what I love about the mission and what you're doing with the kitchen and big green and square roots. Novi take a step back. You know it's about about access but it's also about education you can have all the access in the world but if you don't know about why that choice is better choice. You're probably not gonNA make it and they go hand in hand. I love that approach about how you've come to a market where all the pieces have to come in you don't you don't just pop restaurant and say like okay. The Foods Amazing. And you're gonNA love it and so forth like education in critical whether it's with children whether it's with in the urban environment it you're you're dressing the whole ecosystem if you will or the system and that Liam Powerful. Yeah I love to Chicago's babies ample where we have square roots just on the on the Michigan side of the border and then we have Chicago kitchen as well as next door and then we have two hundred learning gardens city. And so we're we're having a wonderful impact on that city and I can't say enough good things about its recall. That has just been a not not only not only part of the mission and good to us as an organization is oftentimes you go into a city and they're welcoming over less welcoming. You surprised they. They're they're really believers in the mission really really want Chicago. To be the best city in the world Mayor Emanuel and now mayor lightfoot both leave in in in helping the under served in their inner cities to learn about real food the the guests in in the city of Chicago wants to eat real. They want they want to next to what they want. The kitchen attack the kitchen. Chicago's most successful restaurant. And that is a very disturbing They quote the shark tank of restaurants cities such orange he succeeded. And we're very proud that we we. We've been successful air. And then with with two hundred learning gardens where reached one hundred and thirty thousand kids every school day in Chicago teaching him science in English and math. And then as you get to high school. We teach them entrepreneurship skills to grow the food and sell to local restaurants and we organized that and it's phenomenal program while I've actually Parked myself in that Chicago restaurant on by one day turnaround visit jobs. My wife and I both on that we park there. Isn't it the most beautiful face in the city? It is just as the rest of the river you've got the sun streaming in and that building. That building was an unused restaurant space for two decades before we took it over and we just love with old buildings that that Modern Day Restaurant Tours And they're just truly beautiful. He's all buildings there. There is a magic to it. We even even remove the plaster in that restaurant in some of the others where we can. And you'll see the construction drawings that they wrote in in marker back in nineteen fourteen when they built the building and we leave that up so cool. That is quote. What look at everything you're trying to accomplish. Is Coal Looking at the whole system? And is we talk about access. I'm very curious. I'm sure this is maybe a fluid conversation as the world is changing so rapidly but before we go to code and how it's GonNa Change The restaurant world. I'm curious like what is the new thing about all three organizations. You know the kitchen. The kids next door while four big green square roots. Like what is what is the vision. Where do you want? Were you want them to be and say three to five years but is the ultimate vision? Yeah I don't think like I like to think fifty years out and say by the time I pass away as hope. I lived to a healthy ninety seven. That'd be nice. My grandmother lived to ninety eight so I can ask for ninety seven and I wanNA believe that. I've made impact how people connect together not just over food but food being Michael for it but I want a more connected world. I want more marriages throughout through our restaurants. I want more parties in connecting friends and and with when it comes to our learning gardens in schools. I want kids to grow up that with a true understanding. Of what real food. Is this still? Choose to eat other food. I mean I have a burger in our restaurants. I'm not judging a better but I but my kids the kids that we work with across all of our schools now over three hundred fifty thousand kids. They know what tomatoes they know what lettuces they know what it is and they can choose what eat or not but but at least they know what it is and then when it comes to our young farmers might vision in fifty years is we will have Graduated thousands of next generation farmers into the American food system and whether they build new farms whether to become the CEO of the next Google. They're gonNA come from this beautiful background and understanding what real it is. And they'll feed their employees better. They'll feed their kids veteran. Will they'll feed their community better and generally it's a happier world because of that ain't bad. Take me there so on that note you know how will restaurants change in a Kobe? Nineteen world like what? What can we expect? What is that dining experience? Look like yeah I mean. I couldn't be more sad about the this particular viruses is so cruel when it comes to the restaurant gathering place There are many restaurants like a fast casual restaurants fast food. They're probably fine but gathering together. Was your friends with your wife. Your husband with your kids Those are the very special memories that that revenge for appeared right now where that those memories are not being created it is. It's it's economically devastating of course and I feel for the entire industry. It is a tragedy for for the General Venous in well-being society that that that tragedy might long time to recover We take a long time to recover what I look at in China for example and watch very closely where they have virtually no cases all grown of anymore. The restaurants are forty percent full. There's still a lot of fear in those communities around whether they can come out they've also been culturally wired to remain at home order things online and Iron any issue with people ordering delivery or takeout from restaurants. I think we want to encourage them. But but it's not the same thing. It's not even close to the same thing of the vibe in the hospitality. The the smile on your face when you walk into on our restaurants it you feel the energy of people around you at that at that that is gonNA take a while to recover A. I honestly don't know how long it could be years but I'm in for my fifth year time line. Thank goodness is fifty years because if you said five I'd I'd be worried but I do think we'll be okay within five years and mostly because of vaccine will come at some point that My hope is that our governors in our mayors will will enable us to reopen with a mandated fifty percent. So what I would worry about is irresponsible reopenings. So a total carefree reopening. I think is a mistake but I don't think it's a good idea for us to keep our restaurants closed we should. We should enable them to be so that the cultural wiring enables us to go out to eat to safely and then let that bill very slowly over time. That would it if I was. That's what I would suggest and what I hope is. We have plan like that. What I'm learning about is a plan. Where there there's this like. Okay you can open now and we made up getting a spike beck in the virus in the up to close game and and I feel very fortunate to be in Colorado. We have a governor here. Who's doing Garett Bolles? Who's WHO's being very thoughtful He's he's reopened the state but now county-by-county are we gonna be reopening based on the actual data in state. I'm it feels healthy. Feels like a good path. But I honestly I think we'd be lucky if we end up with fifty percent of the gathering place restaurants still around a year from now while this. I mean full service restaurants. So one theory. I am curious what your thoughts are a read a lot of opinion pieces on what's going to happen and so one interesting theory which. I read and I. I think makes potential senses. The middle is going to get really hurt. explains so like on one end to restaurants who are going to survive and thrive through this horrific time. You're going to have to do you. Killer takeout and the. That's cocktails everything. It's takeout scrubbing go. However when people are gonNA come back to restaurants because of social distance facing you're GonNa have to you have fewer tables and because there are fewer tables you're going to have to charge more so potentially it's going to be more expensive More premium to go out and eat a meal. And so you're going to have this sort of evaporation of the middle where there's going to be like on one hand take out and on the other hand. I'm in a restaurant. Used fifty tables now has ten and so because the economics you're GONNA have to charge a lot more through that experience. Yeah I haven't really thought about it that way. I think the the way I would probably say is is different is if you do fifty percent occupancy This is a very important point that people don't realize you can't take tables at restaurants because there's nowhere to put them magic thinking off the table out of every restaurant American women. Would we put them like? There's no way to put the so. That's that's not gonNA happen but what would probably happen is we might put plans on every second table so that those tables are in the restaurant and they just are not suitable and I think things like that are reasonable to expect but if you're creating a fifty percent capacity what I think is going to happen is landlords will have to charge fifty percent rams the banks will have to accept sixty percent payments from the landlords so the economic system there. That's a in a behind the restaurants moorlands. In the banks. Have stieg haircut. The restaurants will probably talking about how restaurants will probably be able to break even if percents But we missions gathering place so we are not gonNA close. We're going to open so we can't be the gathering place we're GonNa do it super safely. We're GONNA do navy order on your phone. So that keeps the guest safe and also more about the staff in this case in the gas. 'cause samples he so many guests per day. The number of staff in the restaurant would be reduced because we would see and then within a few weeks we should be able to see if this is causing a spike in infections. And I don't I don't mean it's GonNa take very long because that's like happens very quickly as we saw New York and other places. It doesn't take long understand impact. And so I think within say two weeks we can see the data and then we could move to a seventy five percent occupancy and maybe maybe some reduce safety proportions. We wouldn't need to wear masks. Maybe that but that would be decided by the health experts and then We might move to one hundred percent after that but not with the idea that we're in the clear we would be at one hundred six NC knowing that at any point we might need a drop back to seventy five percent of Obama fifty percent. What we need is a very thoughtful reopening strategy so that we don't close the game because if we're forced to close a gain that would be absolutely the the nail in the coffin and I don't even mean because restaurant tours would WANNA do wouldn't WanNa do at Orlando's wouldn't be flexible. Banks would be flexible. I mean that we would lose. Our Workers Office would be at that point convinced they should not be in the restaurant industry. They should find another industry. Wilkin and it'd be mass exodus from the front of business right now. People still expecting to come back to work and they still loved the restaurant industry and most people are because they love it. Not Because of the money and Were most cautious about that. So in our case we're not planning on changing pricing we're not planning on increasing pricing We are expecting everyone to be in a together. Meaning banks in the government and the and the landlords and be expecting guests to adhere to safety protocols We're requiring staff to do that But price point. We're not. We're not expecting to change in fact we're working hard to even lower prices because we think that people are going to be much to out. Sir. So I'm curious in a very uncertain world in what are you and I'm sure you have ups and downs like everyone especially being entrepreneur What are you most worried about? And what are you most excited about right now? Well when most worried about is the government because the payroll protection act needs to change to Support restaurants as you heard. Most of the money did not go to restaurants. Even the rest of the biggest employers in his payroll protection act is meant for payroll and most restaurants Especially the small ones will cut out at me unforgivable. So they they're changing. That are heavily will get restaurants supported the needs to change that the window when the heaped starts needs to win were allowed to reopen right now. The window starts on April Twentieth. Which is which is really stupid. Because we aren't allowed to hire people where we'd be breaking the law to hire so they gotta change that. I'm most worried about it because government terrifies me. It's the you know the famous frayed. What's the scariest sentence you could ever hear is? I'm from the government. I'm here to help. That's a good once so on very worried about the government. And how they're GONNA help that. They we do need their help The most optimistic about is when they connect with people over skype or zoom or Google hangouts. Everyone is talking about getting back. Gathering personally can't wait and wait fields the lot he eat again. I can't wait to go out and have a Margarita. They can't wait to take your friends out for a birthday party. They can't wait to take their their a life partner. Wives husband due to To a restaurant it can't wait to go to a concert. Venue gain Live music. They just can't wait to do so. I'm very optimistic. That once the under control. I think we have. We'll have a great opportunity to revive the the industry because people will be so they wanted so bad. I I'm just hopefully that. Will that will be happen sooner than later on? I just don't know when that will be so you mentioned earlier having a tough time like everyone else dealing with all this. I'm curious you know. What do you do when you have a bad day? You GO FOR IRAN. You know to go to recipe ago to drank like what's your what's your own routine. What do you do when you're like you know what I need a break? You know it's amazing so I play I play strategy games with my friends. So they're these games like chess but they're lumo complex jest but his chess is one of the Games. I play and it's amazing. How much it takes my brain away from the stress of the day. Because you into the game in your life to to focus on the game and People have play out pretty good saw. Don't win all the time I'll when maybe thirty or forty percents of the time and it's a great stress reliever for me to get my head out of this endless nauseating cycle of news if you if you do have some time today and you decide you want to check the news while you feel worse. After that. His misery Mike Microscope. Amplifies everything everything white about? And it's always been that way but it's much worse now so strategy it's been great any other really wonderful thing. I gotta say this Quarantine has done is is. I'm at home with my kids and so I had lunch with them. Every day We got these remote control airplanes. You know go out into distant field and slide him in his. And it's I would say for connecting to my kids. It's actually been quite Quite a gift. So you mentioned connecting the kids like a lot of people listening you have a famous family to say the least And what I have so much respect for so i. I was raised by a single mom and have so much respect for single moms. And you know. Your mom was a single mom and of curious. You know your mind and I'm sure a lot of people here reflecting right now You know what what did your. What did your mom do so right if you will you know raising you your brother? Eli On your sister. Tosca what what was her? What was her secret you know. My mother was is still an amazing role model so she wasn't quite a teacher in the standards that a very maternal. Lots of talk. Let me show you how to do. Things was more of a role model of. Hey Times are tough. That's not a reason to be happy. Life isn't fair all the time. That's not a reason to be unhappy very much. That sort of a a Com matter-of-fact matter-of-fact that view and cushy. She worked fourteen hours a day of river. Cheap he's still does to this day and so supported the family of what that will so that gave us an enormous amount of independence and we had a role model of someone that that worked very hard loved. What she did and her her phrase that I grew up with was to what you love the money will come a my mother was a Dietitian is not not a high paying job and she was a model as well which is actually very low paying job unless you get famous. She's gotten famous in the past few years but it took her until she was sixty nine to earn more than twenty thousand dollars a year in modeling. You know like it's just not a money maker but she loved it right in her died Was she was very successful with that. But in terms of generating money but the point is that you do what you love and my comments something that my mother has always has always shared with us and then something that I think is. Great is she. She's a good friend. You know so. It's not like there's a she. She never really tried hard to be the mother maternal mother she. She tried hard to be what she wants. She just naturally was a good friend. Even seven eight nine it was. It was a good friend Which was really Nice. So good listener. More like a supportive person support listener. You may maybe it has been to say so. The cheerleader killied friend. So you mentioned Shoes Dietitian. Now model was like a Curious like your mom is absolutely stunning. What what is she what is she? What is she eating? What is she doing? What's what's her her secret to Health and wellbeing. What is she doing so right? One hundred ten. We'll be doing our restaurants an answer. Big Green and splattering is my mother's philosophy of home at Coined by Michael Palin but my mother is is a has been since she was twenty twenty years old a real food advocate and her belief in eating simply in a way that you can consistently do it so she really is a believer in sued that matches your lifestyle. Not just not food. That is a trend of if you if your lifestyle. Is You go to go to office in a city. Any can you have to be there at eight? Am and you leave in full or you should. You should figure out a diet that works wealthy during the day. You you work at home you you actually need a lifestyle evidence better there and And it's really about mentioned into your lifestyle so that you aren't catching the next trump and thinking that's gonNa sold your your your diet. Bet But she she wrote a book in the ninth book feeding fantastic and it was all about really tracking what you eat understanding what you liked. Eat and it's a simple thing. If spader in breaking into a little table of days of the week in each hour of the day and every time he gets up thing just write down and at the end of the week. Do you watch what you've eaten and you say these are the things that I like to eat? Eat and so you can start to design food for your lifestyle that way it. Everyone is a little different. I love that one hundred percent agree. I if it doesn't fit the lifestyle you're not going to stick with it. It's GONNA come and go at one of my favorite lines around. Exercise is the best exercise. Is the one you actually do if you if you hate if you hate running you're never going to Rut? You're GONNA stop running so out what you like and build it in your life otherwise is gonna come and go yet. Exempting amid look the seven rules of attack to people seven habits of effective people and it has another great tip on eating and exercising. And it's basically it says. Think about our weekly basis. How many hours do you want to dedicate to eating with your family with yourself? How many hours do you WanNa dedicate to and then break it out across week? Don't think about a day by day because you can be so aren so but if you think of one week ahead. Oh Friday's going to be a little different to Saturday. Because I've got my kids at home on Saturday. I WANNA do brunch with them and I want to do yoga. Try and do the gym. You know it's it's really understanding your lifestyle and matching into that so locate your successful entrepreneur. Who's been Annapolis for twenty five plus years of juries if you could go back twenty five plus years to nineteen ninety five and give yourself advice when you any law started. Zip Two together. What advice would that be? What would you what advice would you give yourself pretty happy with the path that I took? I wanted to be an investment banker. South Super Weird but in the eighties. I was super excited by being an investment banker got into the top business school in Canada and and I got then I got the best internship in investment banking summer and wild. Did it suck? I do not want to be my life and all and so I had dropped all my finance forces and at the same business school because you can get out without changing but if you restart and so I started doing physics in plus electives and enjoying my university more a social experiment than a business school training I didn't enjoy so I think the the advice that I give myself would be. It's absolutely oh Kedah to change. What you're doing. I actually did do that. Did that often done alive. I went from technology the food and done that and I feel good about that but I would say there have been times when I've stuck in too long when not because I'd intrusive appearance is what makes the business. But but it's because I didn't love it and if you don't love it I I call doing startups. It's like chewing glass looking into the abyss is hard as hell is. So you better like glass. Sandwich Ephraim for me the rep the gathering place in restaurants man. I will chew glass to make sure that happens but building a social networking APP on your phone. It's not it's not man for me. I just can't wake up in the morning in and keep doing so that same note if you go back to nineteen ninety five. What advice would you give your brother back? You know. He's he's obviously the great for himself. feel I really feel empathy and I do things for the right reasons like because we really believed the world needs it and we've personally tortured ourselves. You know not other people. Don't jams up internally you can. It's torturing to do that but I think surrounding to do for for me at least than for my brother. We both do what we believe. And we hope I mean. My brother did cars rockets. Last in the world you'd ever make money on and know he's doing well. I mean that's that's that's an unusual thing you know. I I even with the nonprofit route because I really felt like that's success fascinating. We needed to learn about on school grounds. If you're a for profit the red tapes too high or with this making a nonprofit and I think that just doing what we love if you love it the world needs it and if they'll pay for it you've got yourself a amazing combination that that could guide you through entire life if you ever will read as if you just have to. They don't pay you for it. You have to have existing financial wealth which I happen to have this in providence nugget. But really you have to be able to be paid for what you're doing otherwise it's so. Everyone knows. He Llamas an entrepreneur. But what's something that we don't know about Ilan as a brother he loves to FACE STRATEGY GAMES OUR GETTING SUSAN's crisis. So he likes to play like that games great because they don't just teach you how to win teach you how lose and when you're going through the incredibly difficult crisis like this you're losing twenty times a day so you kinda need to take the edge a little bit and so teaching. Kids yourself yourself. How to deal with using his is actually also very populism. So he's he's a good sport when he loses he lose as long as it was a good game. Okay what was a bad game? Then then doesn't so how look for so many people. This is an opportunity for a reset. It's people are trying to find a silver lining I. It's also people dealing with you know unbelievably difficult circumstances and a lot of people are probably the question of you. Know what what do I WANNA do? And what is success? Really look like and I'm curious you know for you. Know how. How do you define success? What does success look like? And and what's your advice for? People asking that very question right now is trying to make sense of this but I do. I like to reset that is that is an unfortunate reality here which is is a reset of so many industries restaurants for sure there the eye of the storm but for many businesses. It's a reset and sometimes it's a good thing. I think in the case of restaurants two or three years from now we might look back at this and say wow that we said really set us up for understanding. Wh who who were better I think that for individuals. I I believe a reset is an opportunity for you. Change change of career if you think the wrong career. It's an opportunity to change your life if you WANNA set yourself. I always wanted to move to London after the bicycles on now many of them write that down. And maybe you should do that. You know like Like A it's when I broke my neck. It was a gift because it gave me so much permission to reset my life. And I I view any crisis like that and this one included as as an opportunity to give yourself permission to make a life change since you've always wanted to make a love and so last question any any closing advice for aspiring entrepreneurs right now who are looking to start a business or in the thick of it. Well I think that Be careful about starting in business right now because what the the nature of the beast is changing on a daily basis. So I would. If you have a good idea I would continue to think about it and work on it but you may want to give yourself a month or two before you dig in because because we want to get to a plateau of of the new normal and then I think it be lots of opportunity in what we know what that is if you are in the thick of it is a great churchill. Close if you find yourself in hell keep going up. I found myself coating that. Watch so most entrepreneurs right now are in hell? Just keep going. Well we'll close their keep going. Everyone keep going well kimball thank you so much for spending time with us and all the amazing work you're doing at the kitchen big green square roots and we all look forward to getting back and having a Margarita in a group bigger than one and it sounds rape out to everyone and anyone around me all thank you so much.