Construction Background, Broker and Developer Foreground with Ernie Facchine III
This is the new how podcast learning how to build businesses and real estate the age of technology art so today on the new podcast with ernie sheen of keller-williams uh-huh mainline ernie how you don't do great to be here appreciate the opportunity to come together so we want to hear a little bit about who you are. Obviously you're in the real estate realm. We want to hear a little bit about how you got started. It's always funded this. See how ironic trajectory into real estate is adenuga construction development background. I went to williamson college of trades so actually brought a little gift for yellow book gives you some idea of what that that schools about guys talk about finding qualified tradesmen and how difficult that really is in this school literally breeds them on trade. It's too old world school. We have to have scholarship. It's not state funded. You live there almost like a military school. Construction construction trades painting bricklaying carpentry have <hes> power plant. You have to cultural. I know missing one shouldn't so i went through the carpentry program which basically spits out as you could be superintendent. You could run your own business. Yes you can be project manager. You can do whatever you want so the carnegie programs one of the more sought out programs in there but it started way back into the nineties on these with an endowment from isaiah williamson eighteen ninety. I think it was and he put a million dollars away back then to open a school for underprivileged guys guys that need an opportunity in a break guys drafting here on the old drafting pictures with the t squares out and everything you guys can't see but ernie brought in this pretty sweet book. It's probably one one hundred pages but it has photos from what the late eighteen hundreds yeah so it's old campus and it's maintained by the students to maintain by the demise photo is can be like the photo of the episodes super full time sean and of course it will be a little biased but scholarship program so i would put that degree up against any degree my friends or anybody that i know it put me so far ahead without going backwards in debt and it put a lot of stuff fundamentally into my mind. Pay should operate. Hey should act. There are no days off williamsons monday through friday. You're going to place. You're going to work going to school. You learn learn your trade. You're going to launch and then they let you go five o'clock and then you get to do some stuff in your in bed by ten thirty so it's tough but the three years i was there. <hes> you've learned so much such a short period and then you come out working in the carpentry afterwards or so. I think that i was there <hes> but the way that they set you up is your so solid out that these big firms are grabbing you up so i was assistant superintendent in twenty years old on a massive project off of four twenty two in collegeville for smithkline with bovis lend lease and they do a lot of pharmaceutical and the nationwide and all that kind of stuff so great pay signing bonuses. I seven offers when i graduated from school. They're dying to get you so when you go to eh david career fair every year. When you go to this career fair it's jam packed you cannot move because of when i graduated two thousand and two there was seven of us literally seven and that's why they're so sought out and they know that you're gonna come out with the ethics and the workmanship and the caring and everything anything else and one of the biggest things i still carry today is time anxiety so if you're a minute late there fifteen minutes early today sarah's coming it's l. Mary sounds like i need five minutes in the parking lot because you've got you've lost the minute you go map on saturday and you have to work off and cut grass or whatever it is so you learn to respect not only your time but other people's time and i think that's super important especially in today's day. Can't i having times i've had meetings and you know things i was doing things for people and helping people create opportunities that wasn't getting anything showing op is ninety percent of it and it sets a bad tone from day one. I'm doing this to help. You and you can't find the time to get here in and when did the term real estate agent. Come into your mind. When did i did that. Everybody wants to fix and flip yeah. They wouldn't do that so i was learning the trade in my idea idea was learn a trade and then you can move to bind places implement places and places in that meantime bovis came in then gave a great salary and then i was you know twenty years old running coupla hundred guys in collegeville so i got a great opportunity integrate jump up there to start in the construction field and that's when i really started to learn construction so this taught me the basis and got me to the point where it created an opportunity but the next eight years years of hard work is what really led to real estate so i was there for a couple of years i got another opportunity to pair up with a local the departments in student housing military housing and that kind of stuff and i got some really crazy experience from that guy got the link right next to him. I mean you'd probably you have to thirty years in your career to probably be under this guy and somehow i was able to be directly under him so i got some crazy because of your work work ethic dog and help them do a lot of his person projects and then it onto something else and when that opportunity came to an end because i was traveling so so much for work and doing different things and that's at that point where i started to say maybe that real estate fix and flip things back to where i wanted to be start developing and stuff so i got my real l. state license to just really buying selling. What year was that when did you actually it's in two years now. So what are we saying to has nine till two thousand twelve is probably right where it was coming out of the downturn and again it was just for me to find my own stuff and some stuff and be able to get access to trend into all this different stuff and it kinda snowballed into what it is today so leading in the last ten years of the construction experience and the development element experience and all that stuff had jimmy such a head start and buying properties in its own properties that when i got real estate license i put two and two together and then e kind of carried right into where now i could really help with new construction and i can help with you know when i'm walking clients through and i see something crazy that i know is going to be an inspection report. You can go ahead those things off before we wasted thousand dollars of their time and you know what happened ability to kind of quote numbers and give people estimates on-site rather than say. Hey i have to defer. Let's get four contractors in here. I know people say oh. If i'm gonna fix bathrooms might be thirty grand or twenty are you have. I use a week and then you lose the house market so all the tools that you're putting together over all these years helped build kind of what your niches and i just had this conversation. It's a new agent starting out a couple of days ago really finding identifying and working that niche is what's so super important business because you can kind of get lost in the field of all these things that you can do so it's great to evolving growling. I think you should be evolving and growing but finding your niche. That's always your base that we can always go back to no matter what's going on. Some of the stuff that you're going to see and you're going to want to get involved in it. May not take you down the path that you want to go so really finding that niche and working that niche hitching grown and niches is what kind of helped me get towards that niche of you've been able to identify like repeat clients like like who would your ideal client to work for to sell houses for all right i mean i do autonomy construction and help with the new construction from from eight a you know from the initial stage stages of planning and going over the blueprints for for planning and contractors walking sites in identifying projects and places and running best best budget numbers on what's today's trends and what are the finishes che's all the way down to one more final punch lists and walk throughs and that kind of stuff and some of the value that can add to it is when we're walking through with with new clients and it's not built yet or it's barely built. We don't have to drive the builder away from whatever they're doing. I'm there. I know basically basically as well as they do. I'm reviewing the plans that they're reviewing the planet. I studied on you know and you help with upgrades sometimes to absolutely so not where the number of the upgrades you know the plan so you can help the builders do his thing he's building jump to pull off every five minutes to answer this question to that question and you can help them focus on their building. You're selling so you pretty much. Stick your niche from going from williamson's understand the carpentry how things go together and kind of formulated that as a real estate agent now you're able to just understand the actual process as opposed to just knowing that someone needs to put their signature on agreement of sale wharton. I mean if it's huge to to be able to identify ah especially when it doesn't exist what's going to be there. You know buying new construction is an experience and it can either be a really really good experience. There can be a really really bad experience for people. There's nothing worse than being at that settlement table and seeing the buyer upset or interior soon. It's supposed to be one of the happiest days their lives so oh to head off that before it gets to that point and be able to see things coming from a construction standpoint not the document part of the deal part the construction in standpoint so you can see if there's delays that are happening are things that aren't happening or hey if they're telling me that they want something and they're trying to envision their head and they're telling me about it and i you see things going together in the field and it's not going the way that i think that they're envisioning. We we can kind of come together before it gets to the point where it's not fixable or it's too much not cost cost effects. What are you what are you seeing clydes upgrading houses today like what like from the developers listening like. What can they expect that. Maybe clients are going to want to see an improvement on versus a builder basic. It's kitchens and bathrooms. I mean it same thing that's out resells normal houses always kitchens and bathrooms and the the trendier the batteries from seeing people. It's a mix. I mean some of the basic stuff that we're putting out the cabinets or great so we're not putting junk in there still good stuff but some people have in a vision of something a little bit grander and that's where i see the majority of the money going between that and you see some outdoor space this but the more money i think that that is going into these places just kitchens and bathrooms and then some people are are going a little crazy with basements stuff but man in cave or or the she sheds. I've seen those are big interest often and they're standing out there. You know it's so easy to get this information and you styles anymore. I think it's almost overwhelming at times for buying these things. Do you drive a lot of those conversations. When people say oh. I have no idea where i want to start with my bathroom but you know you come from that background. You can help always bunker. I mean we always talk and functioning function function and i can't tell you how many times we walk through in house that was built built fifteen eighteen years ago and they were these massive types. I mean it just came from home inspection. Before this massive jacuzzi tub base the tub is very small the guys very big loving they just do it and it it takes up so much space and typically dwindle over them so it's such a hard time to get a shower now and they have to go outside and close the window offer. You know change the window at the temporary or whatever it is to evolve this bathroom into something that functions she's better for today. Sure preach functionality functionality like oh. What what's your style is. It was one thing is to sink is a big showers as taliban a shower our top figure out how to make it work. What is you have a notebook in front of you to talk about some tech. You might be using to keep yourself organizer organizer or something that people can use. That's you know new. Technology is helping ernie operate at its peak performance. I'm using some the basic stuff that you know. The villagers others get so. I'm a huge home. Snap guy that comes a bright. It's super great. If you use correct it's one of the biggest tools you're going to be able to use in real estate and what what does that so zone snap is basically a bright product and it basically like an easy. M._l._s. apt at us on the air and you can pull up in a has yourselves disclosures on there and has anything anything pertinent to the to the project. It has previous photos. Turn photos has passed sale. Price has neighborhoods doc organizer in a way or like it is what it is and so so it gives out the the documents that are on bright today but it's really bright internet but it also has won the cool features that i like it to use it has like an aerial and it shows you the you know the plot plan so the property lines but then it shows you as a blue that walking walking around on the property so you can get a better idea of where we were in and what's going on. I just use it at inspection today. We're saying hey it worked in valley valley forge hills or whatever on the other side of phoenixville and he saying i don't know can i put a pool here i mean i don't know what's in the ground but i can show you kind of get you close to where the property lines so you. You can say this is great. This is not good it just one of those extra tools that really it's given to you for free. The people should be using it. They're not so it's a client function to you but internally used khodyo familiar with that so we bill pretty cool system info for my my own document staff autoresponder tax email so all my online leads come in. They're sending stuff you can text do you can call through it. You can do it. Everyone we want through it document center and then we have some internal documents anything like about it can be as basic as you want or you can bring on a coder from overseas to help you get a level. That's beyond people's comprehension. It was so so when i started i made a mistake so i grabbed two you of their preferred vendors and they said these guys are great. I didn't follow up if they were still great by the time i used them. The first people were absolutely horrible the second people boy. I thought we were handed to a lawsuit. What they told us was going to cost five thousand dollars. They sent me a bill for eighteen thousand and it still wasn't functioning so i went to this third third guy. I tend to stay away from people that have guru in their name just because if you have to tell me a little nervous about this guy is legitimately a guru and his name was on what these guys dave in days he did an hour. It was unbelievable for a fraction of the cost. He went back in and fix their stuff and was like i don't they did were they trying to make this as difficult as possible <hes> and he created this thing where when i upload the information and put the right information and i hit save steve creates internal documents for us one of them which would be like a key date latter an inputs all this information very pretty lulu my name and it can automatically be shipped to the lender can be shipped to the client can be shipped to the co-op agent. It's like that so it's almost like an artificial intelligent <hes> ah assistant scout you know having that monthly. I think that's something for people to just understand like that. Type of technology enables you to do what ten times more than you could right yeah yeah and it's it's softened its own believable. That was tedious for other people to do or do you literally take four minutes because if it kicks out of these beautiful ah documents and people look at them like this is great exactly what we need in happen so instantaneous that that people are surprised that it comes over so quick <hes> tom whatever you can do to leverage time i mean obviously everybody knows times most important thing the app so leveraging that time and making sure that you still have your hand on your finger on the pulse of your business and making sure that the things that you are putting in place are saving time not not wasting time so give me some projects. I guess maybe as some listening jab now or some upcoming stuff that if you can talk about it great if not i understand but what do you have in the pipeline that you're most excited about so low. Conshohocken is always so you know i grew up there so my circle of influence is great there and i have some good friends and some good builders and some some great say acquaintances in that neighborhood neighborhoods so did that great project with you guys in which st soup-to-nuts with you guys unbelievable time i still get like going own back there and checking those projects because they're just so much different than than what traditionally has been built in conshohocken and i think when you start to set that bar two different level canal you start to see everybody else doing things that you know we. You'll say we'll she's. Why don't we always do but there's a very very big project coming up in conshohocken. It's been a long time coming. These guys put a tunnel work into getting it to the point that it is today the names not fisher announced yet but it is very difficult thirty one houses single family single families twins and town home right off the spring mill <hes> dead smack seventh bring mill so he's all locations right near the train and everything and it's a massive project. I mean there's not too many lots that you're gonna find talking thirty thirty one anymore. It's dwindling. I have three asses within other builder that are coming up in running outside. North flaine cedar heights some single family houses of another building. It's working on a couple so new constructions is going to be strong and they're still doesn't matter to. I mean even in the city. We're seeing a high demand is on a lot of good product and in certain key areas and socially conshohocken just to me. It seems like such a stable and for one i think is good commuter your market to u for excellent again to the city i just i just see gotcha hocken staying strong and even downturn it. It's it stage draw. Why everything dipped like super heavy in conshohocken dipped a little but not not you know like a significant somebody's other markets so of course when when downturn happened so new construction obsolete absolutely and any project that you're buying if you're buying it at a crack number and putting the work into it. There should be some buffer there. If something does happen that you can you can get out of. These things. Things are going good. I mean the markets strong. Give me give me a little insight you. It is strong. But how long do you think we got. Everyone's always asking a question like i remember two years ago. In two years and i remember four years ago people like he'd be careful. We've been in this for six years now like other two years like now. Is it the same thing when you when i see these books come out and the books are coming out about you know <hes> now's the time you need to do this you need to do this and things are changing now and then three years go by and that never ever happened but people bought a million of those books and they're still doing things goodbye so i'm gonna take the biggest scares me election so little of course go down that road but i just think that there's so much confusion and understanding misunderstanding and everything else that's wrapped around our next election and i think it's gonna slow. It's going to slow things and people are going to have to. They're going to feel uncomfortable just because that's the nature of the elections anymore i think when they feel uncomfortable they show it and show it across the board and that's going to be consumer confidence and sure. I'm not saying that that's server session. I'm just saying that you know things things. In my mind you know things will will slow little bit around that time period and have to let the dust settle in and see what comes of it and i just saw an article that again even more political about social security and how it's got a forty two trillion dollar deficit the fuck are we going to do. There's another yes. I'm the mortgage crisis who knows maybe it's social security crisis that takes us down a notch in our stock market rally could be anything and i think that there are also closely tied together anymore. It's scary scary to see how we can be so stable but yet so uncomfortable at times and it's some of the craziest things things that i see that makes us uncomfortable and it reflects a me you see the stock market go and then you see the rates go and then you see the housing starts go racist. I dropped again it going to tell you it's crazy at the end of last year. You could have had this endless. You say hey look things are slowing. <hes> things were slowing down and people were saying you know this is good and <hes> i'm okay in a neutral market. I think right now you're an aggressive seller's ars market and people are getting beat out and i feel like the grim reaper seventeen times a week you know putting over asking offers and waving inspections and we're still losing all the things is that i tell him that typically we would win the we're still losing and it's not to say the wrong thing here but in a multiple bid situation relation. I always tell my clients. Just because you win doesn't win. You get the house because you're doing things you typically wouldn't do that would make make me a little bit nervous and i'm not even buying one of of the <hes> one of the things we're seeing from a design. Standpoint is the opportunity zones right. They're all over. Officers better areas to be in than others but they're they're they exist and they they have a real tax incentives around them so if that stays and there's no adjustment to it. I don't forsee a slowdown in that. Realm banks are we. I got an appraisal back like i knew it should come ended up point but i ended up getting almost one hundred percent financing on the project. We're about to start in in an opportunity zone right as a developer. I'm looking at that going. What's next get even close. Two hundred ninety ninety or eighty percent of the financing changes your opportunity everybody there's opportunity costs and when you have your money tied up in projects you're tied to things and when i talk to builders and i talked to different different people so i'm not just a builder guy so i did a lot of stuff of purchasing a lot of multifamily life family and i got to see the acquisition side of all that stuff and opportunity costs is one of the biggest things that i see people get tied up on new construction and we're bickering back about about four thousand dollars and i'm saying this. Is your guy like today. It's you're you're losing the four thousand dollars but you're gaining that opportunity to next project so so you may be tied up on this one and four thousand man of question you one hundred thousand because you're not able to move to the next one and somebody else scoops up that project. Now you're out so it's helping hoping everybody's see what the real opportunity is and sometimes it's. It's doing something you normally wouldn't do to get to the next level and say hey look we. We did well here if we get four thousand dollars less to be able to project and and be able to continue to grow at two thousand dollars that i would invest every day mindset thing. I feel like if you know certain people can think that way certain people and i think that's the i._p. Never older you're doing. You're touching so many different situations and and so many in different lives and opportunities and a lot of it. I always say to people it is. It's how you handle tally you project that that situation nation you know and and i'm gonna tell you how i started this business six years ago and today's completely different and there's a guy hi that every every once in a while and i'm not gonna mention his name but still apologize because i deals in a complete asshole and i still think about out that transaction and it lets me know that you're doing something right because when you think about it your stomach hurts right it was not it was not the way that you wanted to act and that's how i try to to preach to the people that i can touch and i have two great people that i work with major in larne in their part of my team and we we we try to interact the best that we can in these situations and tried to take our own emotions out of it and project things the way that they should be rather than how a lot of times they are so you mentioned six years or they honor team and i mean. Are you pursuing brokerage. It's like what's next for like you know. I heard you gotta be under real. Stay real estate team for two years to get your brokers or do a certain amount transactions like is is that on the horizon for you broker's license it was and it is and i think in this business you know if anybody's telling you that am not looking looking into something then that somebody that's growing i mean things are changing so quickly in this business so the brokerage thing for me is i always just like to be prepared here so there are some rumors or going around that if you have a big team <hes> at some point somebody on that team may have to have an associate brokers license. I don't know if that will ever come to affliction if it does. It's good job security more than anything. I mean look. There's only one or two percent people have the broker's license is a pain in the butt to get there. <hes> <hes> i i made a mistake i tied it in with something personal and a personal goal with professional goal and i wasn't ready for that personal goal goal and that slowed me to get to the professional goal and i learned a very big lesson internally and i i don't put too much out on facebook intermediate personally but when i come across something that that touched me a certain way to put that out there and that was one of the big things and i tied to the and i lost my dog couple years ago. I'm sorry to hear but you also want to feel like everyone goes through something like that on it. Just like yours you know he was six and it was thanksgiving and we lost them in. I tied that goal in that when i was i got my broker license. That would allow ourselves. Let's get new puppy and it just wasn't ready for the poppy and mentally and physically with the with allison that took me way too long to finish those classes is to get that license and it was because of a personal goal professional goal so i learned a very big lesson there and there's a couple of different sets of goals but i was a firm believer ever in the puppy whenever i wanted people kept saying what are you crazy. Just go get your great for tied together and i wasn't going to break that. It was down two days because i did put the deposit down and probably was coming. Fast is ready to be taken and if i didn't pass the role would have been broken and but luckily it all worked out and he's probably home tearing my stuff separation of church and state ration- of career and personal yeah. Sometimes they're like. It's harder are notre dame. Separation is key sometimes the different pillars yeah i mean people are motivated different. You know oh and and i i've always said there's nobody who's that's gonna be able to motivate me more than me. Anything i see on youtube or any quote i read on the the wall is not going to get me out of bed. If i don't get a bash motivate i'm you know it's very self motivated person <hes> sometimes to to to a fault <hes> <hes> so how would you attribute what you said to a new agent like someone else that's trying to the real i mean is it. You gotta self. Motivator is what's it look. I mean not everybody has to be a number one on you know so there's a lot of phenomenal number twos number three's in this business and there's such so many opportunities in so many different levels of things as you can do in real estate that generate revenue income you don't have to be the number one number two and being business and make a lot of money and how you take that money money outside of that real estate buying and selling and you can still make more than the person that's number one right right. You just need to be in the business and working on the business businesses and and be able to identify that opportunity to sales numbers are bullshit. I'm not a realtor. I'm not <hes> you know. I beg me to get my licence as you'll save money when you get your flips sharpens like when i hear some oh doing one hundred million in sales like i just go what the fuck faulk. There's some legitimate people that are doing one hundred million dollars in this business and now there are good portion that are saying that they're doing twenty one hundred ten. They should be against liquor stores. Would it means it's time and the problem robin that i always run into so some new construction builders. They pay their agent salary but they may have sold one hundred million dollars in real estate state. Your may have only made one hundred thousand dollars salary thing when you get into this thing some some businesses. Some businesses are referral so made sold twelve million dollars in real estate but if there were heavy referral and heavy realo business losing twenty to thirty maybe forty percent of that income so twelve million in two hours get you. I don't know three hundred thousand dollars in sales on average <hes> forty percent of that goes away so i think anything a number of people do so if we're going to put those numbers out there and you want to be accurate <hes> what are what are your thoughts you. You mentioned tech industries changing. You know there are now brochures editors paying agents sal raiders. You got red fin link broker listing robberies. I so what i'm gonna say standpoint. The code of ethics requires me to be open minded to all business practices assist within roles so and not every and every office practices that so you will see stuff on facebook and i'll i'll tell you in twitter when i go past it. I'm saying to myself man no. Why do i have to play nice in. These people don't want their saying that hey don't wait fifty percent scent of your or your money when we can do a fifty percent less but what are you doing for fifty percent less and on the buyer side when when when this company is representing the buyers and we're paying three percent or two and a half percent. They don't say hey wrong. Gonna take fifty percent that tune jeff bland to wipe the table that three percent because that's how they actually make their money they realize i mean look i think there's going to be disruptors in this business and they're gonna come and we're gonna do everything that they need to do to to stay relevant and i think that the people that stay relevant are the ones that thrived through downturns and back on the opposite side so as robbed disrupt innovate of a some more for the better for the worst. I look i think anybody that pushes his businesses. Always good so technology disruptor oh he's pushing business and pushing people to the next level and and i think that's super important because if not get stale and you get stagnant and that's what i've always said. Is there a couple of companies in this business that have no no problem sharing information and they wanna get you as much information as possible as long as possible and then there's some older school agents that this no fault to them but this is how they succeeded whole how long time ago they protected the information. They didn't want you to have it because that was their their pot of gold. If they have the information they controlled the market and news. There's things are changing technology now making it now and i think i am a firm believer in in for lack of better terms just kind of staying in your lane and so when when you see like zillow preferred agent on zillow leads from every once in a while i use filler i mean majority giardi my business ninety percent is referral circle in new construction. There's stuff in my give him out my team. I'd use them whatever it is but to tell me that you zillah wants to buy some ridiculous amount of houses and have a mortgage company. They may have mortgage company. It's a it's a publicly traded needed company like what happens when they buy these houses and they had the stockpile houses and they can't sell them in downturn two now. They take a thirty percent hit on the value of those homes. Does that kill the staffed after just wind. Keep your money out of the stock market. Does that change evaluation to the company because now the legitimate lost thirty percent of what they were holding in their holding nats an asset. They're great at generating leads and doing different things and they're evolving too <music> but i think when you try to do too much without the ability to sustain and not knowing when you can get yourself trying. That's the thing that's that's exactly your point. These are publicly traded companies have shareholders to ensure profit-driven so they can add another stream revenue by utilizing the same type of thing. I don't blame blame him but i agree. It's like it's going to shake some shit up for the people that are my <hes> solo shops people that are on your small teams. Like how do you start competing against the villa where everybody goes start. I feel like some sort of home search. I mean i it's there and you know a lot of times. What i see is is trend and so we get some stuff umbrella dot com to and i'm going to tell you the more i see a real of realtor dot com commercial on t._v. Okay so they go through phases and markets and that kind of thing you see more on roller calm and then when zillow ramps up in that market it goes up so people are seeing and they're sitting on their couches and chairs chairs in there sitting wherever and they have their phone next. Let me see the zillow. Commercial light goes off and let's go look at houses their thing they're setups are very pretty. They're very attractive very easy easy but they do things that i'm not allowed to do so. There's estimates are down to our so. I could never give you an opinion of value down onto a dollar because i'm not an appraiser. I don't understand why this website can. I mean it's it's exactly are they brokerage and if they if they are brokerage and they're giving you an assessment down to the dollar and then they're breaking rules so i always tell my people that look you know uber disrupted. The taxi acce- cabs and travelocity impacted your travel. I think for the better but on the other side of that cab rod or the other side advocation is still will the largest purchase of your life and that's your house so there's a different level of care and understanding in having a real estate agents. Not somebody just opened the door for you. This is a massive transaction and it happened happened so quick. You need somebody to say what i believe is actually going to happen. I think it's going to split consumer to developer. I think there's going to be two trajectories for how this real estate market. Forms is going to be what happens around the developer versus what happens around this zillow consumer sumer looking for a home in some area. They're moving to and i think it's going to be very different than how you tackle both yeah i mean when when zillow call me all the time and and at one point they were saying hey we're not gonna let you list new construction new construction division coming out so tell your builder if they want their stuff on our site that they need to call us set up a pay for for to be on sale and i said what are you talking about an listening it through happen. It was trent and you're trying to is going to automatically kick it to your site so you're telling me now that you're not going to allow this stuff to come through on their sites and they hadn't finally tweaked it and then i think it just kind of went away. I think they thought about and i said how are we going to do this like now. We're not gonna take those feeds leads from from the m._l._s. service and we're not gonna have agents and he's mad at us because some people are are happy new construction so now we're not going to allow them to list. New construction is always very fancy on these sites of doubt. There's new constructions aren't hitting on zillow. Are people going to be going to a different site so look. They're always read are- stoking that fire for that income stream. You know like you said i think there's a lot of ways that they can continue to do that without ultimately truly competing with agents it's unless they want to be a brokerage and look if they want to be a brokerage. It's no different than your redfin records superstrong on online leads in generating on reading and that kind of stuff in the system that they have is very pretty and very user friendly and it works and we all we all coexist if you if you think that zillow is going to be a one percent brokerage. I don't think that'll ever happen because it wouldn't make sense. I mean they put these big companies. They get so big that it's tough for them to move eh. It's tough for them to maneuver and and move around and that's why i see a lot of these smaller companies. They're very nimble. Quick very sleek and and that's why people are attracted to them because because they when that thing shifts they're able to shift the next day and there was huge. Huge last question will wrap up so how do you what do you predict in ten years from now. We're going to be transacting real estate such a tough question. I would have walked out before anything else. You know. Just call it a day. I'm a buyer ten years from now calling already am i how how do real estate being sold ten years from now. It's going to be very heavily technology driven. I think you're still going to the bodies. I think ten years from now the commission structure is going to be significantly different. <hes> i think as things become easier and things become you know more problem in technology is what it is. I think the consumer will will start to say what are we doing here. So i think what you're going to end up having is probably less agents <hes> <hes> and the agents that are still here and doing these heavy transactions. You can have more transactions last revenue so bigger teams more online stuff more online generations. Obviously the assistant piece is one that i think would probably go pretty quickly. I know you know in its infancy that i'm working with the pieces that i put together for that assistant steps that we can eliminate just by using the computer and putting some information into itself one of the things. I'm not. I'm not involved in is too cold calling i. I'm assuming that that that's gonna come to an end and i think those those are government shit going on around. I mean how would hope so. I mean they have always been believe it or not doing that. <hes> look there are people that make a lot a lot of money by doing it and and this thing and <hes> but i think that they also alienate a lot of people get reputation of doing different things but everybody again has their own niche in that niche works and and i'm gonna tell you either make phone calls every day on the phone. I would be an awful realtor. It'd be struggling to eat. I'll be back in the construction business. <hes> which i i miss you actually make some calls. I think things are we're going to be significantly different and the technologies is what drives everything and and i've i've seen some really really cool stuff recently in the last a few days from some really really cool brokerages and i don't know why they don't go to the tallest building and shouted they have these programs because i didn't even know that they had them how they were and how much they would help my business and what i do and my consumers my clients on their day to day real estate search so technology is is the thing and i think it's going to be significantly different. I don't know exactly how that shakes out but on who assumed that it's some point it's going to lead some some some. Some teams are going to get larger and you're gonna have to do more transactions to maintain the volume that you're doing but make sense your your overheads going to be different the key to all this overhead you know we we run very very lean. I mean my guys and that's on on purpose. We we watch what we watch. What we spend in its application for cheap is because that's that's the model that we want and win. Things do term and change. We're we're still okay yeah. It's not going to hurt us. You know we're going to do less obviously and things are going to be a little bit different but we're set up for it so we're not so far away from the business that we have to come back into it and you know we're still circling that wagon there. Wes westland last last last year. You know what's the takeaway that someone one liner from this up for just biggest lesson. You've learned between williamson college college to even before that to what's what's attribute to your success today as a realtor just adaptability that billion of evolution you know take i was one school for carpentry and i took our entry into project management from project management went into development development in to real estate so you're taking that evolution of whatever that goal was that you wanted to do you learn some different stuff and you've come overall. Well rounded per person in your field that that you know hopefully a couple people respect and you know in order for you to come to for some help. Everyone's awesome ernie. We appreciate you coming out. Thank you so much a ton of information here for the listeners nursing. Hopefully i can talk to the lights. Go we're going. We don't have the lights aren't even he's got slow. You know thank you so much looking forward to seeing what's next explorer and you're in the team fascinate luggage combining and go through it again for sure. Thank you so much for taking the time to listen to our podcast. We really hope you enjoyed it. <hes> if you wouldn't mind sharing this with someone who would mean the world to us you can reach out to us at the new podcast dot com. Thank you so much for listening and we really got a lot of value out of this episode that you're gonna put towards your business in real estate endeavors.