Chapter 4: Three Words


To get a look at the people in places we're talking about in this show and to find out how you can call or email in a tip. Visit our website down the hill. Podcast DOT com when you hear the clip down the hill. What does that do to? You makes me sick literally. Hate those words hate those words and Crazy three works can just really disrupt thirty minutes. That's all it will take to disrupt this case and everything we know about the information we're about to get. It's not a lot but it's the most police have ever released about what happened out there that day. It will make this murder case unique. We're about to get a brief glimpse into abby and Libya's final moments to imagine what they saw and what they felt that's different. That's what separates this one from all the others. What happened before and after that small look has hatched thousands of theories. One thing. Everyone can agree on though. Is the fact that on this day. February twenty-second two thousand seventeen thirty minutes. We'll set the tone for everything to come are also examining this snapchat photo. It was taken just before both girls disappeared the amount that the girls have been found not to a good end. We are investigating this as a trying. Seen we suspect foul play law enforcement is saying that one of the girls actually took video on her iphone. They say it was right before she was murdered. We have we have a still photograph. We have sound this person as it could be half the white males and Carroll County to the killer who may be in this room. We likely interview. We know that this is about power to you and you want to know what we know. One day you will. This is down the hill. The Delphi murders. We are back here at C. N. N. Center in the writer's room. I'm drew Ayden and I'm Barbara. Mcdonald's we want to say thanks to you folks for joining us as we kind of walked through the story line here of what happened in Delphi and what we know right now. Is that two girls Abigail Williams Thirteen and Liberty German. Fourteen have been murdered and we know they were walking on a bridge shortly before those murders and in the wake of that some photos have emerged. There's two snapchat photos Abbey on the bridge. And then one of the bridge itself and then there's two of a man grainy pictures of a man on the bridge. We don't know when that day. We don't really have any specifics. But he the pretty spooky wells and know that there is a search warrant that was served on a home just outside of town. It didn't seem to yield anything. There were no arrests. And then there's been no arrests anywhere else in town either so we're essentially at zero. It appears from an investigative standpoint but at the same time the story is growing in terms of interest across the country and beyond this is already the biggest news story in the State of Indiana. It is quickly growing as a national story and international story. People WanNa know who is the man in that picture on the bridge. What did he see? What does he know is he the guy who did this as we go through this journey together? We're trying to answer the the big questions. Who did this? What the Hell happened out there that day? And how hasn't this been solved yet? And in any case like this. There's inevitably moments in an investigation where things pick up speed and pick a momentum and as we move forward in the story. We're going to get those. Today is one of those days. We are going to begin to see some evidence. We're GonNa hear clip of audio. That is going to completely ratchet up the craziness factor on this story dialogue. We do have breaking news tonight. In the murderers of two teenagers in Indiana Liberty German and Abigail Williams went missing last week after going hiking their bodies were found the next day and for the past week. We have been looking at this image and image of a man officers. Call the prime suspect in the case and new tonight. We are hearing for the very first time. Three words muttered by an unknown man in the vicinity of those two girls on that day to day is when libs phone really takes center stage. We find out that not only did police find it. But there's evidence on that phone that she recorded for us the video that has become the jumping off point for a million theories. It's the centerpiece of this story. The X. factor that whenever I have told someone about this case they inevitably say. Oh that's the case of the girls on the bridge and the video of the guy and it's it's creepy to think of two girls being on a bridge and recording their killer. I think the natural next question after the discovery of this video is how much is on the phone. What else is on there? That can kind of connect the dots of what happened out there. And how much of it are they gonNa let us see and barb? When we sat down with Sergeant Kim Riley he actually told us about learning of that video. I myself learned within probably twenty four hours. I'm going to say something like that so sometime late in the afternoon or the next day. I'm not sure The exact time like I said it's been a couple years ago but I knew pretty early. What they had and we were trying to decide what we could do with it and what we wanted to do with it. I can't remember the exact date of when we released the photo. Maybe within the first two weeks I'm not sure actually. I think it was a little bit more than that because I was actually getting ready to go on a vacation like the first of March so this case was still to only two weeks old when I left right. I WANNA go back to the video for a moment Have you seen the whole video? Yes obviously without telling us the parts that you don't WanNA release. Can you tell us what that's like to watch that video? There was scary. I guess would be one way to put it just seeing Just seeing the feelings that we're going through the girls at the time I'm not going to say which one in particular but just knowing that I you know just knowing what they knew is is frightening for thirteen or fourteen year old girl to know and I just think just kind of went through my mind over and over again for a long time every now and then I'll I'll think about it but for the first six eight months I mean it was something I was going through for all the time I was always thinking about it. It was just very heart wrenching for an adult to deal with that alone. Thirteen and fourteen year old girl. It was scary. It was I felt so sad. There was nothing I could do. But that's that's the way it is now. Unfortunately we're not. There are kids all the time and sometimes bad things happen. I guess that's the only way I can explain it a few days into the investigation. Sheriff Tobe Lesin be also saw that video and understood immediately the importance of what they found. Do you recall when you found out that. There was a video that libby had taken. I get it may have been that same day or possibly the next day was again. Long after the initial information came in to us but The initially that was safeguarded very closely. Did you watch the video that early in the process as I recall woods I would say it was just a matter of days and when I say days maybe no more than a couple of days into it that I had the opportunity to review it and I know there's stuff in that video that you're not releasing publicly. Can you talk a little bit about that? Process of watching that video and what that was like early on like Minneapolis in our leadership roles and in many of commonsense them and the Mike. Patty and I've even talked about him but for Libby to have that mindset to to be able to do what she did In my mind I thought you know. She's she's helping here. She's she's telling us something and and obviously as time where long we've we've found out what she was telling us and so when. I first saw it. I guess knowing you know. She's at the age that she is at that point. I'm thinking based she sharp. I mean this is great. You know I you know. It's all Kudos to her for what she did there. I think it was definitely felt it to be a huge asset. And what you know. We we continue to do here and follow into and so and I still feel like at the end of the day so to say that it's still going to be a plus to have that on board when you heard the voice what went through your mind. My initial thought was that. Satan's voice himself I'm very spiritual man. So that was my exact thought that that's the devil himself speaking. Do you listen to people when you're walking around town when you're sitting in restaurants you listening for that voice all not so much during right now but yes in the beginning and again as we revisit as as more so my investigators than me but We Revisit Certain Aspects Yon and there are times that I will go back actually on my weekends and I'm at home sitting in my lazy boy. I've been known to start up that audio again. Listen to it and go stat. Eight days after they found the video and Libya's phone. Investigators held a news conference. That even now is one of the stories. Most critical moments there are public knowledge and Thomas introduced today. Couple folks department heads that are here. We have Delphi. Mayor Shane Evans Carroll County Prosecutor. Rob Is Kiro County. Sheriff TOBE LESSON. Be Delphi police. Chief Steve Mullen Indiana State Police Superintendent. Doug Carter Doug Carter. You've heard his voice throughout this podcast. He started every chapter. He's State Police Superintendent. He's the boss. He was raised in Indiana and has a degree in management and leadership and after eighteen years as a state trooper was elected twice a sheriff of Hamilton County Indiana. His Dad was a state trooper and his daughter is a police officer. Doug Carter is law enforcement twenty four seven. He's a passionate speaker and you may even think he's a little extra impersonal. Though in a way from cameras he is exactly the same. He's powerful and deliberate with his words and he's taking responsibility. Gore bad for whatever happens in this case and the public facing portion of that begins on February twenty. Second two thousand seventeen at this news conference words ten escape during these periods of times. And I've only had a couple of other situations in my lifetime when able to stand before you and say that. Why Libby Abby why Delphi why? Carol County why the region why the state and why even in the nation I say that because this is a classic example in a clear example that evil lives amongst us to the family of the community the region. The state as Lear Indiana state. Police I say I am so very sorry resources. It's unlikely that any of you will ever see nor will we ever see or experience again. The level of resources that are attached to this investigation to the media. My Gosh all I can say. Give you my sincere. Thanks see. This isn't like TV. There's a perception that this can be solved very quickly. Anything that we do can be solved very quickly. This is a testament that that it can't and we need you. We've needed you since last week. We need you today. We need you tomorrow and likely we'll need the media all across the nation so for simple guy like me to you. I say thank you to the People Dress. Funny like me. And those who represent the law enforcement profession please understand where human beings just like you extend anywhere in the nation with people standing behind me and I would suggest to you that every time something like this happens a little piece of dies as well but I also want you to understand how committed we are as as a collective one and we will continue. I've had an opportunity to speak to my boss. Governor Air Kokomo a couple different times about this situation and every time I do I see this. Look that comes over his face just like yours and this communities. And that's that's the unfortunate experience of experiencing evil not stopping the poster in front of you. Someone knows who this individual is. Someone knows who this individual is. Is it a family member? Is it a neighbor? His an acquaintance is an associate. Are Maybe that one guy that lives over at that one place that just kinda not right. Maybe it just jeans. Maybe it's his jacket or sweatshirt. Maybe it's a shirt tail. Maybe it's just posture. Maybe it's the right hand in his pocket you see even with technology. We need human intelligence in other words. We need you. I'm not suggesting that science that everything that we can do is science has been done because we are just getting started. Abby deserve US each and every person listening watching horsing this in some form we need you Libyan. Abby need you. Please do not rationalize tips away rationalize what you think. That might not be important away by thinking he would never do that to another human. Being or think I know doesn't matter let folks like the people that are standing behind me. Which such incredible passion and commitment and dedication to this profession make that determination tips are anonymous. Some minority talk about it. Because I don't WANNA get involved. Because they know the individual again maybe a family member probably family. No one will ever know. No one will ever know. There's no names on the planet better than than helping US facilitate this than the FBI and there's this entrenched in this as anybody. No one will know as poor as this picture is. Somebody knows if you're watching we'll find you who's next. I hate to ask you that question. I'd give my life to not have to but I know you've asked yourself that very question. We must recognize that you see. We're all the same. We're all human beings we must keep our resolve for Libyan abby for this community and frankly to ensure her that good trump's evil and it will hear quite hear more in just a minute about what we know. Do not discount the voice that you hear. We will stay committed with resolve. Their barely rarely exhibited with human behavior until this conclusion. Please be patient. Become our partners and communicate with us as often as you can. And now from very humble servant the symbols blessed guy on this planet to represent the profession that I represent to Abbey and libby. It's my hope. And my prayer. The experiencing God's promise of eternal peace. You would be hard pressed to find a law enforcement member anywhere. Who speaks with the passion? The tone and the focus of superintendent. Doug Carter of the Indiana state police. This guy is making it clear from here on out that the messaging from this investigation comes from one person and it's him and the optics of this presser. I think also feed into that because you have several men up there on the stage. They're all in their uniform with their badges. Carter is standing there at the podium with all of these men flanking him at the church is in it. Yes this is at the Delphi United Methodist Church. They needed a larger space. So Delphi doesn't have a lot of places re-invite the media in this was one of them and this is also when we begin to hear a bit of dialogue directly to the killer right. He speaks directly to the person responsible. We can speak all day long about the psychology of what he's trying to appeal to whether it's you know the guys sensibilities or sensitivities but he also says who's next. That's the first time we've gotten any inclination. That law enforcement has a feeling that? There's a possibility of a repeat offense here right earlier. There was some confusion over why they weren't telling people to be afraid now. They're asking who's next. It's a bit of a contradiction it is and it's a chilling question to now all of a sudden ripon during that. And you know we mentioned that this press conference was at the Church. He invokes religion to He. Does he talks about abby and Libyan eternal peace and this is a theme that we're going to see from Superintendent Carter throughout this story. Ah So everything begins with the Carter in this case and while he is establishing that dialogue you have to imagine that they are starting the process of putting a picture of a profile together. That's right that's the FBI's role they've been on scene since the beginning and this presser what we hear throughout it it does sound like they have begun that process of trying to figure out. What kind of person would have done this? What is the the psychology of that person? We're going to hear more of that. Hey everyone it's Dan simply safe home. Security is the highest level of security. You can have with. Police dispatch up to three hundred and fifty percent faster than a normal burglar alarm. With simply safe you get comprehensive protection for your home outdoor cameras and doorbells alert you to anyone approaching your home at entry. Motion and glass break. Sensors guard the inside. If there's a break in they use real video evidence to give police in eyewitness accounts of the crime plus simply safe protects your home from your water damage and carbon monoxide poisoning to and it's all monitored twenty four seven by live security professionals. 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Stresses Big one for me and better help gives me a place where I can talk to someone when I need to keep track of how I'm feeling you can connect privately with a counselor through text chat phone and video calls and get help on your own time at your own pace at affordable rates and if you happen not to click with the professional. You're working with you can opt for a new one at no additional charge. Better help is committed to finding the right person to give you the right. Help down the hill listeners. Get ten percent off their first month with Discount Code. D T H. That's better help dot com slash D T H. Why not get help? Better help dot com slash t t h partout sight. And sound the the down. The hell do you. Do you believe you know what hill that was that they went down right down there and is that a steep hill is at a walkable hill was pretty rough terrain. We're about to hear from the FBI as well and they are in this from the beginning helping to process evidence found at the scene and also helping to put together a profile of what kind of person might have done this the FBI's initial involvement in this case was sort of by happenstance and agent happened to be in town visiting family and decided to go and participate in the search for the girls. First night heard the call for volunteers and went out and so the FBI was certainly aware of what was going on very early. Nine days ago. we had an agent that was participating in the search for the missing victims. And from that moment until this morning we have stood shoulder to shoulder with our law enforcement partners here the FBI plays an important support role in this investigation joint investigation. And I'd like I'd like to community to to go back to the afternoon of February thirteenth Monday February thirteenth. And just think if you had an interaction with an individual who inexplicably cancelled an appointment that you had had together or An individual called into work sick and cancelled the out and out an important appointment or social engagement and at the time gave what would have been a plausible explanation myself own broker. I had a flat tire on my car. But in retrospect that excuse no longer holds water that may be that may be important. Just a note he's about to say may thirteenth. He clearly means February likely. So our behavioral indicators that this individual may have exhibited since the afternoon of May thirteenth did this individual travel unexpectedly. Did they change their appearance today? Shave their beard cut their hair change the color of their hair. The Superintendent mentioned the close at this individuals wearing in the photo. Did they did? They changed the way they dress. Did their behavior change their sleep. Pattern is different now. Did they start abusing a drugs or alcohol where whereas they would not have been anxious nervous? Irritable have they followed this case and the media's putting out With a with a sense. That is not normal. have they had ongoing discussions regarding Their their whereabouts on that afternoon or thereafter and so while Superintendent Carter starts a dialogue with the killer. This is more of an appeal to the killers friends and family because he probably does have friends and loved ones who may already be wondering. What's what's up what's going on and all of this while there are billboards going up all over the country states including I saw one here in Atlanta. There's a public service announcement that goes out to all of the Indiana radio outlets. I'm sorry. Tony Slocum Indiana State police at approximately twelve fifteen pm February fourteenth two thousand seventeen the bodies of Abigail Jay Williams. Thirteen and Liberty Rose Lynn German. Fourteen both from Delphi Indiana found in the wooded area near the Delphi historic trails. East to Delphi Indiana. Okay let's get back to the press conference at this time. I would like to invite Captain Day. Burston Chief Public Information Officer for Indiana State Police to the podium for the last seventeen minutes of this briefing authorities have been giving shape to the evidence that's been released normally oppressor like this is largely routine with a lot of procedural questions. There are rarely surprises. But when Dave Burston top spokesman with the Indiana state police comes to the microphone. There is a brand new headline. Thank you we do. Have some new information for you today. It's in the form of audio file from the cellphone. The Liberty German had with her at the time. We're not going to play everything that we have but liberty had the presence of mind to turn on video camera again. We're not going to be able to share everything with you but we are going to share this audio clip with you momentarily with the hope that somebody will recognize this voice. I want to be very clear that what you're about to hear is just four short words. Excuse me three words down the hill. You're going to hear this played four times. The audio quality is not superb. But there's enough there that somebody could recognize this person's voice and a Superintendent Carter said not to rationalize away if you hear this today and you think my God that sounds like fill in the blank. Call US. Make an anonymous tip. Tell us who you think. It is. Let us investigate it. If it's not the right person they'll just be out a little bit of time and they'll be weird they can go on and they'll never know that you call that you may tell us who the right person was and you could be the person that helps us to solve this horrible crime. Mica play the clip. Please play it one. More time burst in than puts together the sound with the photo of the man on the bridge. It's on an Easel in front of them. Next to two large photos of Abbey Libby the image that you see there of the suspect that came from liberties phone. I think many of you had speculated that before we weren't prepared to discuss the time we have more video we're not releasing it it's Germane to our investigation and it's important that we spread that person's voice far and wide for somebody that will recognize who that is and we'll call us and tell us I talked to a while back audio forensics expert about these words specifically and my question was what can someone who does what he does. Glean from hearing that you know. Is there an accent? Is there kind of a regional dialect? I mean it's tough because there's only three words and basically he said to me especially with a sample size this short. There's basically not a lot that you can get out of it and I think law enforcement knows that and that's why they loop it and play it three or four times so you are hearing. What sounds like a longer clip in theory but it is still just those three words that we have to work with at this point in the investigation and there is a tip line that the FBI takes over. There is a website. There's an email address that people can send in tips. There's a lot of different ways. That law enforcement are asking for the public to deliver that help that they've been begging for since this crime happened the other thing. That's important to note here. Is that Dave Burston. Who's kind of the chief spokesperson for the Indiana State Police? He says that they're not sharing everything. Obviously the question is how much more is there? Well it sounds like there's a pretty significant amount. What other stuff is on that phone and what they're going to tell us now also in the this press conference there is a QNA session. That happens right after and oftentimes. That's usually when the TV cameras sort of leave and go back to their regular programming but this one was kind of interesting there were a couple of wow moments. Let's start going through those sort of one at a time. Is there any specific information that says the person has local or far away? No could this be a stranger crime. That's a possibility this be somebody that knew that the girls are going to be there that time. That's a possibility. Nothing is off the table. The rest of these are tough to hear so we'll read them for you question. How long after Liberty Posted Social Media? Did this crime happened to the murders happened immediately. After or was there time for someone to see them on social media and then meet them Metro as as we know that they're going to be lots of questions that we specifically cannot answer because there are things that we do not want to tip our hand to the person responsible for this that kind of information. We're keeping close to ourselves. Is it reasonable to think that that's an area who wanna two things happen? That was a chance encounter. That's possible I don't think it's likely but it's possible or that person knew that they were going to be there. That's possible as well. Those are things that we're looking to question over here. Dave Burston is saying in that last question that it's possible the killer new. Those girls were out there. It was a moment that when we played this bag we all stopped and went. Wait a minute why at and so I reached out today Burston. He's no longer with the Indiana state. Police he retired in twenty nineteen and now is the chief communications officer for the Department of Corrections in Indiana so he still in the area but he reminded me. He is no longer part of this investigation. I asked him for some clarity on this statement. Did he mean to imply that? It's more likely that these girls were targeted. And that isn't what he's saying he's saying at this point in the investigation in February of two thousand seventeen. They are looking at all options. It basically comes down to what you'll hear. Investigators call target and target of opportunity. Those are two different things. Correct target being a PERP goes with the intention of killing a person by the name of whatever and then a target of opportunity. Being the person's goal is to commit a killing or murder coup. Those people are who they kill is irrelevant right. Perhaps he went there to commit this crime and then Abbey in libby stumbled upon him question based upon what you have it what other investigators have scene of this crime. Do you believe this individual has killed before? And what makes you believe he will do it again? There has been no indication right now that that this is part of a a serial Murderer if that's what your question is So As of the facts that we have collected at this point in time we have not tied to any other Known Homicides Barb. It is inevitable around such a high profile murder. It is inevitable that someone's going to ask the question. Is this a serial killer? It's important to note that while that question is obviously one of the first ones that's asked not every murder is at the hands of a serial killer however in this story the circumstances surrounding the murders because they are so different. It would lead you to believe that. Perhaps this was not the first time this was done. But that is certainly something that is looked at when you have a high profile murder like you said and the circumstances are different you look at other cases they obviously have not linked it to another homicide that they know of but Superintendent Carter Asks. Who's WHO's next worse. Central Logging Radio Show We. We have other information that we're not sharing and specific to your question Raphael. Keep in mind that they're likely the possibility of more than one person We're we're not saying that the person that the voice that you heard is the same as this person here. This is all very complicated very involved and as much as we would like to tell you everything. More importantly we want to solve the crime But again rest assured we're using our resources to put the person or persons murdered liberty German Abigail Williams into our jail here in Carroll County. That was a lot that just got delivered and the people of Delphi are now dealing with a very different story. Everything has changed for them. This is also where we start hearing multiple instances of them saying the person or persons always struck me interesting. Yeah so they don't say they're only looking for one person or they may be looking for Tube. They leave open up possibility that we're not sure how many people were dealing with yet law enforcement as a general rule. I think oftentimes has to hedge. Things has to leave the door open and they do that here. But sometimes that's not the case. Sometimes they save things for a specific reason. Unfortunately we are left to wonder. Is this hedging themselves? Is this a specific reason? Hey everybody it's Dan Semmoto Bitch and along with barb and drew I produce this show. There's a lot going on in the story but one thing we didn't want to lose in all of that is a sense of who abby libby were and we've been taking time out here and there to learn just that this chapter we have. Libya's grandfather Mike Patty talking a little bit about what kind of girl she was. She was a person who wanted to as much of a life as she could possibly get on the detri- everything do everything didn't matter what it was whether it's from rides at the carnival to her school project. She wanted to put as much into this. She possibly could to get as much out of it. Is You possibly could projects here at home? You know from Haroon wanting to paint at different colors. Redoing your desk which is one of the projects. She was right in the middle of When all this tragedy struck her desk sitting over here we've committed. That's going to be our next project. We're going to Redo her desk finish the project. She started that was just how she was. She was always had an iron or two in the fire. Showing law stuff going on all the time. We'll be hearing more about abby and Libby and other folks in Delphi in future for now though let's get back to the show part three. I knew she was smart. No idea that Wisconsin. I had no forewarning and I still have. I can't even like I. I have trouble saying those words. I can't hear it libs. Mom Carried Timmons remembers the first time she heard the audio but it was the first time I heard it was so like it wasn't cleaned up yet. That very first press conference. I don't know if anybody really remembers but that very first time the that recording was played couldn't really understand what he was saying and it was all like lake computerized sounding and then they were able to clean it up and suddenly it was D. T. H. And it was like what the Hell is he saying. Like Y and I remember thinking. That doesn't even sound like urgent. He's not yelling. He's so calm and still to this day as like so eerie sounding to me but it didn't recognize it didn't sound like anybody a nude and sound like anybody had ever heard before phrase. I never saw any heard anybody even used before. Like normally like in. Just go it. Wouldn't it didn't any sense? So that was weird. I still wish there's times I still wish I could hear more but I don't know how much more there is that I could handle hearing so I do. Try Not to think of what is actually going on. When he says those words Kerry Timmons can't say the words but Abbie's mom and a Williams is pulled in two directions about the release of the video the audio and the images every time. Something like that would happen. I would hold my breath because part of you wants this over and you hope you know who is in that picture in you. You hope you recognize that voice in the other part of you. Hope she don't because the idea that the person is most likely here or his lived here in somebody I may have crossed path was whether they knew who was or not or I knew them makes you ill and that is probably one of the hardest things to move through life on until this person is caught that every day. There's potential of them crossing your pass. Libya's friend Erica. Gibson is like a lot of people proud of Libya for capturing that evidence on her phone when you found out that she had actually taken a video of the guy. What did you think in my head? I was truly cheering. Her on. No one can do that. And that's You know that first hand evidence there that's the most important evidence because mean people can say they saw a guy. People can draw a sketch but I mean unless you have photographic memory like where you can remember. It's really hard and it's even hard for me to identify a person after I see them and I think that was amazing for her because she knew something was up. She knew she had to do something. Probably didn't have service so she thought of the next thing she could and I don't think a lot of people do think of that. She didn't know what was GONNA happen. I don't even know she knew. The guy was bad. Sometimes like we joke around abby when abby was out with her mom and she just take a photo and be like joking. Ravi Lake. That's your boyfriend or you know just joking around and so like it could. It started out as a joke like that and then some would next to each other or chatted or we did those jokes on the volleyball bus. Mostly like she'd take a photo and then she showed me. We never sent them but like it could've been something like that. I knowing them they're skits people. So like Abbie is like so goofy that she's like who pursued scares me and stuff like that and that's how she would act but I feel like it may of they thought maybe it would have been funny or something like that. I don't think they ever thought because they get scared but to me. It's like a joking scared so that guy must've really. I don't know scared them to Kelsey German. Libya's older sister feels the same way. I was really proud of my sister. I. I don't think that I knew the voice or the person that was in the video but watching the video. I was overwhelmed that my sister was able to do something like that and that she was able to know that something was going to happen. It was also very sad to know that she knew something was GonNa Happen. Like enough to take this video So so many emotions were hitting me once watching it that I don't really know exactly what I was feeling. I just know that I was just overwhelmed with so many emotions that I kind of. It was shocking to me like. I knew she was smart. I know she is smart and she does that kind of stuff all the time but it was crazy to think that she was able to know before something happened that she needed to do something. She's been called a hero for that. Yeah and she is but I definitely think both of them are. I don't think that one would have left the other so to me. Obvious my hero because she stayed with my sister and I love them both for that. Why Libby hit record on her phone. That's still unclear but carry. Libya's mom has her own thoughts. Do you think that libby took that video on purpose. Because she was concerned I think she got him in the video because she was concerned but I don't think that that was her initial purpose taking the video because it was my understanding that they were out there taking pictures and video anyway and like learning now with my my younger girls and snapchat and all this other video social media. They do that crap all the time. Even if they're just picking up a rock they're still taking a little video of it which I'm very thankful for but I didn't get it at the time so I think now looking back that she probably wasn't exactly videoing. I think she left it on and made sure it was recording. Because she knew something was not right. But I don't think that was the initial purpose. I could be completely wrong though. I haven't seen were hurt the entire video. Mike Patty. Libya's grandfather has his thoughts to and I've been asked a question is down that would have been living capturing that information in if things would've been different and girls wouldn't have been murdered. She would've came home and said look this. This guy was out here. Really Acting Weird a strange guy you know and with a shared I don. I know that's what she would have done. This real Weirdo out there. Of course we would have said no more trails. But that's why she would've captured that. No no doubt in my mind. She'll come home and said this Weirdo. Do you recognize anything in her video or the still that they've released unfortunately no. I wish I could. I wish I could recognize that voice or a rack my brain millions of times or thousands and thousands of times still even to this day. Something's GonNa trigger and say okay. Yeah I don't next time on down the hill. For months we had a plan for our fifth chapter. That was until one interview gave some brand new information about the crime scene. All I can say about the situation. Abby Libya's that there was a lot more physical evidence than that at the crime scene. It's probably not what you would imagine down. The Hill is written and produced by Robert McDonald. Dan Cemetery in me. Andrew Aydin with original music and scoring by Shuo. Sir Michael Dudley kaylene chassis are associate producers if you want to see the people places and things. We're talking about visit our website at down the hill. Podcasts DOT COM Cherry Soviets as h senior production manager. Brian Bell is senior director of programming and Tyler. Moody is the Vice President of the Warner Media podcast network. We want to say a special thanks to the people of Delphi in the members of law enforcement who are in charge of solving this crime and most important of all a big thanks to you. Of course we appreciate your listening.

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