The Hate U Give
Support for this NPR podcast and the following message come from wicks dot com. A web platform for creating your own professional website. Join over one hundred twenty five million people already using wicks to tell their stories, online goats at w. i. x dot com to create your website today. The hate. You give fines teenager. Star card are caught between two worlds at home in her neighborhood. Most of her neighbours are black, but at the rich up school, she goes to most of her friends, a white. The balance of those worlds is shattered. When her friend Khalil is killed by a white police officer, shooting Spurs star to reconcile two very different parts of her identity and to find an activist voice. I'm Stephen Thompson, and I'm Linda home. Today. We're talking about the powerful coming of age story the he gives so come right back. Support for this NPR podcast and the following message come from weeks dot com. A web platform for creating your own professional website with wicks, whether it's your first time, creating a website or you're a longtime pro, you can do it yourself shoes from hundreds of stunning templates or start from scratch with the dragon. Drop technology and powerful web features join over one hundred and twenty five million people already using wicks to create their own websites. Goats, w I x dot com to create yours today. So what will you create? Welcome back. You just met NPR music. Stephen Thompson, also with us in our third and fourth chair today are Eric Eddings and Brittany loose hosts of the podcast and ni- thanks for joining us. You guys. Thank you. Thank you. Hello, always good to have Erica Brittany, especially together. It's always a special treat. We should run down some of the talent that's involved in this. It's an adaptation of Angie Thomas's Waie novel, Amanda Stemberg plays star Russell, Hornsby, Regina hall play her parents and the director is George Tillman junior who's probably best known to a lot of folks as the director of barbershop and soul food ISA raise in it common, isn't it? Anthony Mackie, isn't it? Steven? You're the parent of a teenager. So before we go over to Brittany and Eric, I'm going to start with you. What did you think? Well, I love this movie and I appreciated, I think, above all else, just kind of across the board quality of the performances. I think Amandla Stenberg is extraordinarily in it capturing the way that a teenager can embody so many different personality types in one person. I think that performance is very subtle and nuanced. I think I could watch a spin off TV show that is just that characters family around the table bantering with each other in a way that I found extraordinarily warm and funny. This movie has to has to manage a lot of major tonal shifts. This movie has some comedic elements. This movie has intense dramatic elements. It is at its hard about a police shooting and about the relationship between the police and the community in this neighborhood. I have a couple of little quibbles here and there. I think the ending is to tidy. I could not get past the fact that her boyfriend is played by Archie from Riverdale. I mean, I mean that's making a statement or actually dates Archie. The name Mackey. I've seen forty five marvel movies. I feel like where Anthony Mackie is falcon, and here he's a heavy and I was like, oh yeah, that's a heavy. I've seen four episodes of Riverdale three years ago, and I'm like f. o. RT. All right. Eric, I saw you on Twitter talking about this movie. What did you think of this movie are really, really liked it. And honestly, I really didn't expect to like this movie had a lot of like bars to clear if I'm being honest in my opinion, I think for me, there was a big question of like, who is this movie? Four, you know, is this a? Is this a a PSA for why audiences? Is it actually speaking to black audiences? Is it going to be too serious as glorifying black violence? Is it like would is it actually doing? And those were all questions because I hadn't read the book that I had no real frame of reference for, but watching the film, I was really, really taken aback at just how strong those performances are. Like you said Stephen and a man list number in particular. I was like, wow, like Sears is she like really, really blew me away in addition to Russell Hornsby, I thought as the who played the father character, and I thought he was also just really, really excellent. So I could overlook kind of some of the more like. This is a teen movie elements of the plot? Yeah, because those performances were so strong and also think they, they walk the fine line of trying to kind of showcase and explain double consciousness in a way that you rarely see in a film. So even just like doing that, not horribly was it was really, really strong Mark in the pro category. Yeah, I agree because, and I had some of the same concerns about it that it was the the who is it for question, and I still left it thinking like maybe it had a little more to say to white audiences than black audiences that was going to seem new if that makes sense. But that doesn't mean it's not valuable. And I think they put enough in it that you get a rounded picture of this family that I think is maybe a little more sophisticated than just the straight up. Like when I'm at school act like this and when I'm at home, I act like this Britney. Would you think I enjoy? I enjoyed it. Overall, it's interesting that you. Said Stephen, that it was neat because like it felt to me like utter chaos, and then it kinda got wrapped up really quickly right. Thing. Yeah, but something I, I talked to a friend yesterday who had read the book and hadn't seen the movie and I was like, but what about all these things? She's like, oh, there's a whole chapter of the book, and it's just like that. And I remember thinking when I was watching that, like a lot of the events that happened toward the end of the film, which types a major plotlines and really sort of like in a really huge way in like a bunch of scenes back to back that really just show her two worlds climbing together. I can also see the way that like those scenes unfolded in a why novel would be like totally gripping something that I would be totally into. If I was a teenager and the movie overall was like, I wish that I could have seen a movie like that when I was a teen like definitely I would. I would agree with you when do that. Like there was probably more in that movie for like white audiences to walk away with that was going to be new, but I could also see how it would be like just a really effective film that helped teenagers feel seen ram. I remember going to see actually a mindless number who is incredible in this movie. Incredible. And like I have. A lot of issues with her casting because star in the focus specifically dark skinned girl and on the cover of the book like the cover art which was made by a black woman. Deborah Cartwright was a dark skinned girl, and so the casting of a man seemed really strange to me, and I will say you have a serious problem in your industry. If all among all young black talent, there's nobody who matches the physical profile a written characterized are, but a man lists Steinberg's performance was in. It really is very good is incredible. And I saw everything everything the teen movie she did. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I remember one with a friend of mine, like my best friend from college me and Eric's other friend Eamonn. And as soon as we saw a Mandla on screen, 'cause I'd never seen a teen movie with the black girl. As the protagonists, we both burst into tears within ninety second, you know, and I felt a similar look. I just love how much the film was about stars interior already. You rarely see that with adult black female roles. So to see it in the young girl was just really my blood. Yeah, I agree with you. There's another thing though. Oh, I do think that the for some reason every time I see common in a movie. How did you guys talk Komen Britney? And Eric, I wanna know how you guys is. I think Stephen it. I've talked about this before. How do you react to see in common in a movie like this? I see common. I've not just right the romantic comedy? Yes, Latifah, Paula Patton, and even though he is afoot to short to play professional athletes, especially that'd be a player. I thought this is fine. Yes, him playing a cop in a very pivotal scene in a film such as this. It was one of the things I was like yesterday, just got rid of. The scene of him, like explaining how police officers feel scared. Like I was like, I don't think I want this in the wasn't sure how to feel about that because I feel you bring common into the movie, and he brings this sense of of self appointed gravitas. I think in a sense, I feel like something is being upended by having him represent a counterpoint because you think of it that common is gonna come in and be this mouthpiece for what the director is trying to say. And so I felt like I felt like something was being subverted there, but I couldn't quite tell what it was. He just he really just didn't seem to know his place like his character actually wasn't as fleshed out as some of the other characters. Like to give that speech with higher the weight that it should be like they had a few other scenes where it was clear that there was a relationship here, and you know there was there was like a history in interior already, but like when it came time to deliver like comments, performance, just paled in comparison to almost all the other character actors in the movie. So it just like it lands flat win. There could have been a lot more, but they're also needed to be more from the writing. It wasn't all kinds. I agree. I also thought the scene was so misplaced. They were going to have seen because I, I definitely felt like there were certain points where the film was trying to. Check off certain viewpoint, Botha's arms beside characters, or even like establishing relationships really quickly. Like I remember the scene with calill and star in the car. It was incredible to see how quickly they were able to establish a relationship that felt meaningful was totally fleshed out within minutes a few minutes. I fell in love with Kalou in like in the span of watching that scene, and I'll Smith that is such a charismatic performance is incredible. I don't even know how he did it. And so I think common just basically like he had a strong baton passed in. A paragraph of text. Yeah, you know, common common. You know what I mean? Like an starring common himself. This is my serious face. I mean, it's so funny because I come into talking about this movie and there's so many great performances, and yet it's so easy to pick up the casting of Archie costing of common, but to come back to those performances, you mentioned l. j. Smith just now as Khalil he is shot so beautifully. He looks like an, he looks like an angel you so beautiful. And that is such a warm and charismatic performance. When we start talking about award season, we start representing for performances. We really don't wanna see overlooked. In addition to that Regina hall performance, which is which is magnificent. I think Russell Hornsby, Eric, you mentioned that I could not look away from him. That is such a stellar and nuanced. An interesting performance. He subtle when he needs to be subtle. He's big when he needs to be big. There's so much going on with that character. I just the central performances in this film. I just think are marvelous. Like I've rarely seen. Black dad portrayed that way. Yes, fail in terms of the writing the support from from the story. And so to have Russell Hornsby, go in there and just landed every single scene. He is believable. You feel where he is coming from, you understand the depth behind the emotion. You understand his motivations, like what he's trying to do even when you disagree with him about it was just really, really powerful and like that movie doesn't quite work. If a man loves Amberg doesn't land. If Russell Hornsby doesn't land Khalil doesn't land. They all did their job all my gosh. Even. I was just even thinking about, like what you said Stephen about how you'd watch like a sitcom based television show about this family sitting around the dinner table. I'm a Regina hall STAN every year. I'm like, this is Regina hall is about to take over. Take over. I'm ready every weekend. It's going to be Regina hall film out that role of the mother could have fallen flat been more underwritten every single scene. I remember feeling so like very aware of her motivation as a mother. She had more of a professional job than the father did, and like they're all these signals I think is far as where she was trying to send the kids to school, and she was always explaining what her motivation was in making certain choices for them. But it didn't come from a place of like which happens a lot. When there's class distance in black family dramas. It didn't come from a place a will. I want this and my brother lives in this kind of house. I need for my kids to go to this really good school so that they can make money and whatever. I got the sense that like she brought so much to the role as a mother, somebody who wanted the absolute best was absolutely on their kids side like every moment of the day and to see her Regina hall and Russell Hornsby together, it just really creating the foundation for that family was just so believable and so beautiful. I also really love the fact that he has this son who has a different mother. Yes, to me, it doesn't have the kind of obvious beats. There's tension, but the way that that character is integrated into the story. And also the blending of these families is so to me. So subtle in so many ways where the relationships are complicated, but they're all loving in a way that I thought was really cool. And I agree with Stephen that that family is really interesting. I found the sibling relationships in it really believable, and really the the fact that she kind of really relies as much on her brother as on her boyfriend in the end, I thought was really her brothers with more interesting characters. Staying about about boyfriend Archie. What he has to do in the end is just shut up after the end is just kind of be quiet and take the lead from her like he doesn't have to become the leader of anything when you see them saying. And when you talk about who is the audience for this movie, he is a surrogate for the white audience that needs to see this movie. Now it's true thought about like that for me, the thing that I was kind of exp- I would expect in a movie like this is too for there to be some scene at the end where he's like almost congratulated little bit for like getting it now and that kind of didn't happen, which which I appreciate. Although it seemed like it mostly didn't happen because of time. I. Wrapping plotlines. That would have been the thing that would have made it a problem for me, but like it just it's hard to come back from like a real legit. I don't see color monologue. That for me is when things went off the rails. Like when he said, I don't see color, and then she was like, but I'm black. And then he just like, I see you and then they kiss. I was like, wait. Wiz way we. Yeah. And we please, that was the only place where I thought failed young people to me, it's still sold the idea of like, love conquers, all our love makes it so that you can. You can see each other clearly and like I really wish that there had been a little bit more tension in their relationship that had played out that would have made it to me feel a little bit more realistic. I have never had the experience of dating interracially, but like having had friends, family members, lots of people close to me in my life who have. I think that like a big thing that I don't necessarily see enough of played-out is actually like the daily education misunderstandings on learning that plays out. And I felt like that was a little bit too neat for me and like I understood like they wanted to have some moments of romance and humor, whatever that makes sense. That's what you want in a teen movie. But I just felt like I wished they'd been a little bit more realistic with that one. I definitely felt like he was supposed to. L. look ignorant when he said I don't do color, and that was a good thing. I don't think that was supposed to be something that she would easily overlook, but I agree with you. What I would have preferred was to have that play out over a couple of scenes. That of kind of all in one thing. That's all he has to say, and it kind of undoes this ignorant thing he just spent. Yeah, because then he was also just then he was running through the streets? Yes, Fremont, yeah. This is one of the ways in which it's a little tidy is the sort of the quick resolution of him like figuring out that he has to sort of be involved in be with her, and he can't just kind of be like, I don't understand what this has to do with anything. The the story of her and her friend at school, her whiten friend at school data, some brutal stuff in some places. I thought it was really good that they showed a young white girl being terrible. Yeah, like not actually coming to her senses, not changing her mind. Not like, you know, having any sort of redemption ark. It was just like, she's terrible. She's gonna stay terrible, which for me was a lot closer to the reality of my high school, middle school elementary school experiences. It was nicely and people push back in the moment to life. The final scene I guess is like the end of their relationship. When it finally kinda hits a button was one that like the mainland sambergen and SARS character in the film was like was doing that work of kind of the pushback. You always wish you could say in the moment. Had tumbler when I was a teenager coming out. Exactly. In that final moment I thought that was that was really nice because you rarely just see NFL taken to that extreme, you know. But I mean, that's important. Those climaxes, those fights really do happen. And so it was strangely refreshing seeing that. Like in that spot, letting them actually go there. I can't believe I consistently underestimate how much it's going to affect me seeing a young black female character as a protagonist in like a teenage story. And I just hope to see more of that. It was so nice to be in stars head for two hours and fifteen minutes in a way that I can't say about like every character seen onscreen this year. So hopefully I can just see more of those types of stories being told and also anything really from the actors who who gave such amazing performances across the board in this film. I'm just like more work for everybody. More scripts more money. Yeah. All right. Tell us what you think about the hate. You give come and find us on Facebook at Facebook dot com. Slash p. c. h. h or tweet us at p. c. h. h you can follow Brittany at b. m.. Loose and you can find Eric at e, Eddings thanks. You guys so much for being with us to talk about this movie. Thank you. I love coming. And before we go, we wanna tell you about another podcast that we recommend you check out. I was listening to it this morning while taking the dog today care, it's called articles of interest. It's a special six part series about what we wear. So it's about clothes of all different kinds. It's produced by a longtime ninety. Nine percent invisible producer, Avery truffle, man. She he digs into how the design of clothing kind of affects you day to day. Even when you don't realize it, you learn all kinds of interesting things. She explains why children's clothes are so loud and decorated with weird things. Why genes are blue and of special interest me why women's clothes have no pockets boo-boo and how Hawaii helped to create casual Friday. And and you can hear it by subscribing to ninety nine percent invisible. You can do that in apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your podcast and. And you can learn more about it at articles of interest dot club. It's one of those internet addresses that kids have these days. All right. Well, that brings us to the end of our show. Thank you for listening. We'll be back here on Friday talking about the Ryan Gosling as Neil Armstrong. Astronaut movie. I man that you have a second before that, and you're so inclined fleas give us a review on apple podcasts to help more folks find the show. We will see you. All right. Back here on Friday. Support for this podcast and the following message come from internet essentials from Comcast, connecting more than six million low income people to low cost, high speed internet at home. So students are ready for homework class graduation and more now they're ready for anything.