Mason and Ireland HR 2: Did It Have To Happen?
A really big our Mason Ireland seventy SPN First of all the big news and Morales mentioned there Ireland. Not on the pre show call. He's just not going to let that go. John let that. He's the first person in my career that has questioned my work ethic no literally in my career. I know because I'm always working two three jobs. I'm always working right now. I'm doing the Lakers. And a at one point I was doing spectrum at one point I was doing the show and so yeah pretty much. All I do is sleep is I never sleep is is drive from one job to another but apparently it is not enough for the Great Chris Morales and by the way he says necessary to create a rift between Morales and I. It may never heal. He says now that I have to be on the calls. Chris you do not have to. It is not a requirement it is like letting the Fox into the Hen House. All he does is disrupt the calls but he's welcome. I doesn't have to I now. Feel about is the way Michael Jordan feels about Jerry Krause crumbs morale crumbs yes that's near nickname crumbs aright dumb on the Line Mobile. Horia laughing at you guys that's funny Haina Crumbs next time he sees Ramona's you're like me all you do is work. It's anyone ever questioned your work ethic. Just my punctuality for sure. That's have Greg Greg a little bit. Yeah I think you guys were both off and I was filling in with Brian Chemnitz. I think I was filling in for both you. I think we were doing the Mason and Ireland show then and then I remember like I. Greg just really wanted to talk about the show and I was like I don't know usually when I host with base and Ryland just kind of show up five minutes for the show and we do. It was offended by that if you were to talk and get their half hour early and have you know it's funny about that. Mobile is half the time Greg was producing our show. He was doing a little dance party hoedown for the dodgers and and he was taking time away from the show to do stuff like that so far from him to question. Your work ethic and in fact cranked out an article after the last dance that is posted today. And it's a good one. You pose a really interesting question. One that everybody's been debating did the ninety eight bowls. The one we saw the team we saw in the last dance. Did they have to be broken up? What have you found out? Well I talked to Jerry Ryan. Who's the owner of the Bulls? Then as well is now and I think he's really the only guy who could have changed history. I really I mean you know alternately. The owner is the person with the final word right and I think looking back on this. The only way that this thing could have stayed together if he would fire Jerry Krause but probably a long time ago like I don't think that at the end of the final season after they went six going to Michael Jordan going to Phil Jackson saying okay. Let's try which is what he did. He went to both of them said okay. Let's let's try to get everybody back. Let's do it. I don't think they could have salvage that late. I think you would have had to get rid of Krause. Probably after to eighty to comment I think the damage was so severe that he would have just had to choose between them. But that really. Isn't Jerry REINSDORF style? He's not the kind of guy he did. He kept telling Phil. Hey you know you in krause. You'RE GONNA win this one. You know like stop you stick up for Jerry a little bit. You know taking on him stuff eating it and then he would say to Jerry. Krause Day Stop. Stop. This was fills up antagonizing him. You know and like just were winning stop. His Cross didn't wasn't just that krause and Phil fell out. It was that Chris. He didn't have to keep writing on the bus with the team. Right keeps saying those those quotes in those comments me. He just kind of kept antagonizing the situation to you. Have something in your story Ramona. That I don't remember and I don't know if I buy it and I'm curious if young short Reinsdorf said to you quote the thing nobody wants to remember is during that year the lockout Michael screwing around with a cigar cutter and he cut his finger. He couldn't played that year. He had surgery and the finger. So even if we brought everybody back it wouldn't have made any sense. Do you think Jordan would not have played had they you know? It was a fifty game season. Could Jordan played no? He had that two surgeries on that finger. Ryan surface correct about that one. Now this is also a little butterfly effect. Okay because you know Jordan hurts his finger with like a cigar. I think he was at a golf tournament. And it was in January of that year so it was a pretty severe injury like you couldn't grip the ball and he couldn't two surgeries on it and he would never really see his finger now. It's still affects them right? I think he sliced attendant or something but he he wouldn't have been doing all that if he was gonna come back like he for all intensive purposes he had made it official yet that he was retiring but he was retired. So if ransomware would've gotten Phil. Scotty you know the rest of the guys back on one year deals for dino to try for seven. I think Michael's out there messing around with that cigar cutter either in January but yeah Ryan is correct in saying that he wouldn't have been able to play because there was a pretty severe injury. Yeah plus what's the timing of this Jordan was already gone by the time he cut his finger with. What is this would? This conversation was in July. Yeah this was in July so so Ryan. Surf goes to Jordan July third. He remembers the day instead of listen. Don't say anything now. I WanNa make you guys want six. You deserve the chance to defend your title. I'm going to try to keep it together. He tries to he tries to do one last. Hail Mary he'd done that the year before right and he let let's see how the lockout goes could be months. Baby changes mind. Now he goes to fill a like a little while later and Asan and Phil keeps saying no he says no no no but he never presented it to fill as all get rid of krause and filled. Never said Oh. I'll only come back if you get rid of Krause. I think because one. I think Phil was just done at that point. Let too much blood has been spilled and they'd already it really already said go said their goodbyes. Like the team itself it just it was it was over and I think filled knew that so. I think it was too late then but Ryan Jordan July. The finger injury doesn't happen until January okay. But there's a lockout in between like so so Michael if you read up on. The Michael doesn't retire right away. They actually hired Tim Floyd at the end of that July July twenty third or so so they make one last. Run it Phil Phil says no again then pin floyd. The lockout goes all the way into January and Michael actually could have stuck it to the Bulls and force them to keep to sign him to another one year. Deal or something and pay a bunch of money but he finally wants wants. It's obvious that you know Ryan isn't GonNa pull a rabbit out of the hat and get filled comeback. He just retired but he doesn't make it official that he's retiring again until after the lockout Ramona. Shelburne this Ramona. There was a part in in episode ten. That was fascinating to me and I think you probably caught it to the one thing you and I learned about Phil Jackson. When he was here is that he was brilliant at using the media as anybody I've ever seen. He knew how any public comment he made would be received in the locker room in the front office. He was very so when Phil when they were at Grant. Park celebrating the sixth title. Yup and Phil Mentioned Jerry. Krause as a thank you knowing that. They were feuding at that point. They weren't getting along. Phil knew exactly what happened new just by mentioning Jerry Krause. He would get booed vociferiously but everything Phil said was actually kind like he he goes. I also want to thank Jerry. Krause for giving me this opportunity. And then as soon as he says the words Series Cup Boo. So here's my question let was still trying to do Jerry. Krause a solid there and give them a thank you or was he sticking it to them either sticking to yeah I mean I think okay so this is the words Jerry. Reinsdorf used to describe why Phil Jackson like why Jerry Krause felt betrayed by Phil Jackson like what I understand. Why filled in like Jerry. You know he made it the eighty to comment and he's like shoved right door. He doesn't invite you've ever. He invites at the beginning of the seriously he invites. Tim Floyd to daughter's wedding but he doesn't invite fell. Remember that yes okay. So I understand that Phil side of it but I don't understand what Jerry having instill and Ryan Surf said Jerry. Krause was a lover scorned. He feel he loved Phil Jackson. He feels like he created Phil Jackson. He found him in the. Cba has found him in Puerto Rico right when he was remember that scene where he's shows up but he's dressed like a no hippie you know and he goes for his job interview like that like he feels like he found this goofy guy in the middle of Nowhere and plucked from Obscurity and trained him and brought him into the Bulls coach and gave him the opportunity of a lifetime. He felt like he was like his. You know his creation and Phil was disloyal and I said well how filled disloyal. What what what did he do and Ryan Surf? Answer was Jerry's mind fill needed. Choose him over. Mike Lynch got he should have protected him against Michael Guidance. Getting so upset with him right like you should have told them to knock it off and defended him. You think back on that part where the Sam Smith Book Comes Out Remember. Remember Krause calls fill into his office and who do you think that all these quotes and he tries to unmask the sources and stuff and who would have said this about me Blah Blah Blah. I mean kind of trying to get Phil. Jackson Chews Him and beyond management side as opposed to the players side and when he didn't do that when his loyalty was to his team and his players. And Not Jerry. That was kind of like a a wound to Deep Momo. Hang on hang on extra segment okay. I want to talk to you about baseball in the new rules and governor now saying maybe sports can Quebec First Week of June. Most hanging out with us and bottom of the hour. John Vladimir the our Casey Johnson's coming on the Johnson got some and he's got a lot of background on this stuff. Ramona'S TALKING ABOUT ABOUT JERRY. Krause and how that all ended in Chicago? So you're into that. Stay tuned for that so we got that coming up to Mason Ireland seventeen. Espn to take a minute. And we don't do this enough. I WANNA to take a minute to congratulate myself. I want our MLB. The show competition. On Friday night I beat Ireland. Four to one on Sean. Green walk off home run then. I beat George three to two on a Gary Sheffield Solo home run. I ended up going three zero and our mlb the show tournament and for the second time. In Video Games simulations I have gone three zero and won the championship if needed to pronounce that if the world were a video game mason would be king. Life is fantasy twenty four seven. Twenty mythical money on this. Did you win anything on? Why didn't we stop or I was four to one odds. Yeah I should have been. I did not bet on it but Somebody suggested Jonathan Watson who's one of our researchers I. He's a guy on twitter who digs up for us all the time. He doesn't for Youtube Momo. Yeah Yeah Yeah he suggested that when we play Madden NFL. Madden that John. You use an all time raiders team. I use an all time rams team incidental using all-time dolphins team. That's a great idea. Yeah that'd be a good way to do it. Yeah great idea. And we'll all get beat by Mason. So he can run his record to nine nine to know exactly. I'll do it pandemic. I'll do so moma. We're getting there now. First Week of June says Gavin. Newsom says are happening. Cuomo says Abbott in Texas. Everybody seems to be moving in that direction. And that means That baseball could be the first one out of the box and the rules are just unbelievable. They released the sixty seven page. No spitting sunflower seeds. They're going to sit in the stands so they're not all close together in the dugout. They will exchange lineup cards. A digitally which seems like no big deal to me once There's a ball hit on the ground enhanced by multiple players. They will go with the new ball. The incredible stuff is the testing stuff that they've put together now. There will be multiple temperature checks a day that there will be a test every week antibody tests. They'RE USING A lab and UTAH. They seem to have really laid out this in detail in order to get the game restarted or get the game a started in July. Well I hate to burst anybody's bubble. Okay don't please don't I might not Anita versus okay. I really think that this is all just politics. I think that they could have done this a month ago. Okay but I think that a month ago there was still this feeling amongst the general population. Like how can you justify ten thousand tests for baseball when we don't have enough testing for the general population so the thing that made me feel like okay? We're getting close sports or coming back. Or there's there's a pathway for it to things have happened the there has been enough testing to where in the city of Los Angeles remember a couple of weeks ago. The Mayor Mayor Garcetti announces anybody who wants to get testing can get tested. Did you get tested Momo? But I'm going to go this week. Actually Yeah We. We got tested in my mom and not Stepdad. Leo Got Tested so and we all were negative so we went out there this weekend. And how do we get together? Yeah I think I think that once they announced that that was like your first sign like okay testing widely available right. That's a big deal. I'm glad you saw your mom do by the way that's cool. Yeah it was really cool. It's really good But I think the other thing that's happened now is politically the governors who have taken a very hard line on you know maintaining shelter in place like the economy is really started to become effective in the the winds have started to change in the other direction. Where I think that instead of everybody's saying keep it close close close. There's a there's a pushback from the economy saying let's open it up. I think starting up sports is actually something to relieve some of that political pressure. I really do think it's all it's all shifted. One because testing has become politicized right. It's like everybody can get it. You're not taking it from anyone and to this is people need sports like just like look. How helpful psychologically. The last dance was for everybody you know. Espn over the next the next month showing great thirty for thirty every night just because people need something to get into else you know. So yeah I think this the next two weeks is the Lance Armstrong thirty for thirty then comes the Bruce Lee thirty three which was really awesome. That's called be water. It played at Sundance this year. And then the third one is the SOSA mcgwire for thirty which I think also is going to be great. So yeah we have these things and you know Bob Nightingale was last week. He said he thinks it's ninety ten that we've got baseball by the fourth of July and all the sudden you can start thinking about. He's if it all starts coming back. Think about what we've been doing for the last couple of months. We have been just talking about whatever we could possibly come up with all the sudden we get Major League baseball the NBA playoffs and the NFL. Season going at the same time it will be. I mean just for the trap. Yeah with everyone trapped at home with the ratings. Go through the roof. Oh it would be just ready. Okay so I keep coming back to this thing Michelle. Roberts said to me a couple of weeks ago she said I said how you for your players thinking evolves since before the the league shutdown right like leak shutdown go test positive everything shuts down. How is it evolve over the last six weeks people have gone from? I need to get home and get safe and keep my family safe to this world with the virus. We have to learn how to live in it. Okay and IT'S A. It's a feeling that all of us I think on some level or having which is we probably can't make our risk zero. We probably can't just stay safe little bubble forever We can probably mitigate that risk through real common sense type things through be really smart about it through getting tested and I have a neighbor who has a he's he's got he's immuno-compromised had had cancer it. He's still kind of battling it. Sure everyone in their household gets tested. Every week they go make an appointment. And they get tested. They stagger it so the wife gets tested. One week he gets tested. The next son gets tested the week after and they figure if any of them ever test positive they assume they probably all have been exposed but people can. You can start living your life this way right. It's I. I'm still kind of scared. I still stay at home right even even I'm still starting to think like well if we start getting tested more regularly if you're smart about your exposures if you lessen your risk as much as possibly follow things you're supposed to do you know there might be a way back to some level of interacting with the world again. I think that's where sports aren't to Momo. I keep going back to this. It's what you're allowed to do right versus what you're willing to do. That's likely like you're going to be allowed to go to A. Let's say a movie theater willing to go to a movie theater. You're allowed to go to a restaurant but are you willing to go to a restaurant. It's like it's GonNa come down to us taking charge of our own personal feelings about this and you don't tell your risk. We're willing to accept you. It's Wade Ramona is Mason. Normally is the first in on things. Like for example. He's going to be I in on driverless cars. He's going to be I in putting microchip in his head. It's GonNa be I in on drones. Have he'll have Amazon delivered? Drones you know Steph to his house through thrown Butler he would be I in on the drone Butler climb all. I'm very leery about the world being taken over by robots so I always let him do it and see the results. But the pandemic it's reversed right like if somebody said today all right all clear in California you can go to restaurants again. I'd go to a restaurant tomorrow night. Mason would not mason loves movie theaters. More than anybody. I know loves going to the movies. He says he won't go if they open movie theaters. This weekend I would totally go. Would you really yeah? Isn't that weird? We know what I think we're set. We're shaped by experience. Thought I'll tell you a story so I've got a friend who is about my age. Who had a Kobe related stroke Allah and that has made me really. I mean for lack of a better term gun shy. It's it's made me feel like it's it's not safe and it's GonNa take me longer to get through it maybe than other people because my experience has sort of shaped my view of that otherwise John. You're right I am generally the first guy although I put out a put out a poll. Interestingly because I said what are the odds that were actually at so-fi stadium on Sunday September the thirteenth for the opening of the NFL season cowboys and ramps? And here are the three choices and take take a guess on how it's gone. I said yes. No mask yes with mask or not going to happen. I would say the number one answer is not going to happen. Number to answer is yes with mass and number three is yes would no mass. Yes what percentage say not going to happen eight it I would say no not quite eighty maybe fifty five sixty nine percent not going to have only five percent. Yes with mask six percent. Yes no mass. Now I will say because I've been waiting so long. And so patiently and going to game at the Coliseum bought my personal seat license. Oh my season tickets. I would probably go with a mask I would. If it is available at play you would go. You would go to so so this goes right back to the original point you made. You would go so fi but you wouldn't go to a movie theater. It's what you're willing to do versus are. Hey Ramona we we gotta get to Casey Johnson. Give us a quick update. How is project Daniel go to sleep going at your house? Better good good better like we. You know what I did. Is We have a little bit different a routine I. I have one of his stuffed animals. We take the lion. Cave name is Mr Lyon Mr Lyon. Yeah Mr well his. He was Leo. But he we decide and Mr Lyon anyway so we have we have the the lion and we are kind of when you come in the room. We Kinda snuggle with Mr Lyon and I say Mr Lyons going to protect you when you go to sleep. Okay we're GONNA Miss Alliance can protect you. And he gets in there and he grabs onto a little bit more. I think he's getting it there. You go all right good but it's not like thirty five minutes a crying. It's just you know Christ for like a minute as we're leaving the room but then he's got his line good. Yeah all right happy. The Daniel has his line. Everybody go read Ramona's article in the bullets. Very good as usual moment shorter than usual. It is shorter. I finished the whole thing. I don't believe it twice that. Wait a minute so he wrote a sixteen hundred word article instead of thirty two hundred. Yeah Chris Morales is going to do a promo crossing your work ethic. It's coming all right Mama. Thanks a lot talk to you. Soon is coming up next. Casey Johnson from NBC sports. Chicago's got great perspective on exactly how. Why the Chicago Bulls of one thousand? Nine Hundred Ninety eight the championship bulls were broken up. That's coming up next for you. Five o'clock fast track to coming up at five o'clock of course mason and Ireland seventeen. Espn SEVENTEEN ESPN. What is going on? It is the day after the final two episodes of the last dance which has been just a phenomenal experience particularly when we are all kind of shut ins to be able to relive an incredible period sports history and to really marvel at one of the great athletes in the in all of sports history. And we've got a cool guest right now to talk about. Casey Johnson has been covering the Bulls pretty much from the beginning of what you saw last time at the last dance all the way through with all this other stuff and he's nice enough to join us now from NBC. Sports Chicago of Casey. How you holding up? I'm doing well. Thank you from young guys appreciate all appreciate you coming on up before we get into and you have some really interesting stuff on Jerry. Krause what is because you have a unique perspective on this is there was ten parts so we had ten hours of documentary on the Bulls in your opinion. Did they miss anything? I I feel like too much is Being paid attention and judging and stuff like that I look you know. They had Michael Jordan's cooperation. And when you get that and you get Michael Jordan sitting down for three interviews you go where that takes you so I mean maybe some guys get some short shrift like you know. Ron Harper told coup coach. Yeah probably they did. I guess what my Michael Jordan is the access with which the world the bullets world revolves. And you know he does we all he did not do interviews like this much anymore. he'd given that one ESPN. The magazine interviewed the Rice Hobson. And really since the two thousand nine all same Speech we hadn't seen really the real Michael Jordan so those interviews by was the most compelling and captivating documentary and in my opinion. You're you're obviously ride those out and take take take him when go. let's Let's talk about because last night. We saw the dynasty unraveled. Jerry Krause your story by the way today is fantastic. Jerry explains why the Bulls Dynasty unraveled in his own words. How did we get his own works? So I covered Jerry for six seasons when you were time. A twenty nine inch Chicago Tribune. He covered them for six seasons when I was there for the trip And when he left the ball it was difficult and emotional experience for him and I reached out to a few months after he left the DVD amenable actually interview. He was it was his first public comment. Since he left the Bulls. And you know our relationship just gotTa Change Day a trust a deeper trust developed. And then I'll no longer confident anymore. He returned in. Its I love with with baseball scouting so then just kind of a natural organically form Jerry just very fascinated and curious about the modern day he like to call it asks me about what's going on with the Koerbel. He didn't want to bother John. Paxson simply do a heart. That job was he saw friends but mostly reached out to me so You know he was a guy who just wanted someone to listen He liked telling stories and my job is to listen. That's what I do for a living so Our Relationship Forum from there and I got to know his family very well so family was very very very gracious in entrusting me with the writings. That you've put the paper in in two thousand eight USA call and read passages from On it's not finished and it's not published but it's you know to me. It's a slice of of history. So I was. I felt very fortunate. We're able to share those it. Nbc Sports Chicago Dot Com. And it's on the site now and you can read Jerry Krause zone words and and and after you read them. I HAVE TO ADMIT CASEY. You see this in a different light. You see these guys trying to take the emotion out of it. Krause Explains Player by player. Why he didn't bring these guys back and because you now can look back and see how these players did after he let them go it. You'd have to be. I mean you'd have to be an absolute hater to say that they didn't make the right decision. The problem is that in sports when they win and they had won six titles in eight years and three in a row. There's kind of this unwritten rule that you should get a chance to defend your title. Jordan talked about that last night. So here's a question that I know is just your opinion. You know what Krause thought you. Now know what Jordan thought if they bring those guys back as Michael suggested on one year contracts what happens in the ninety eight ninety nine season two bolts. Tough hypothetical me. Rabbi I'll stepping out questions or just the fun and you guys live this. I mean he had a theory that you should stay with the team. More than seven season. He did that in. La as well. you know and and he say nine in. Chicago just 'cause they kept winning championships Terry. And His crosses council's relationship period of the point picked phillies needed a break. So he he's gone on. Pippen was even more gone. He wanted to be paid. He'd been underpaid for a longtime by contract point And he was also tired of you. Jerry Krause had tried to trade them twice so he. He fell under appreciated but he was gone. You are asking you to play out the full hypothetical and everybody is back on a one year deal. Do they win? So the Knicks is the came out of the year so sure they could've got back particularly short she one aspect to it. They also need to plan B. Played hypothetically ankle suffered of thirty serious injury during lockout recites attendant with a cigar cutter. Does he not pick up a cigar cutter? If you know everybody's coming back there's another what if you know? It's like playing the station. Game the Spurs team. That won the title. That year was very good team You know never got Michael Jordan right so you know. He thinks he can will will things into existence and he often did. So you know that's his belief and I'll probably see to his judgment. I personally think the bull on the number championships. They weren't supposed to do you. Feel that the the documentary was 'cause you know the family and you've obviously read. His words. Do the documentary was fair to Jerry. Krause because he does come off like like the villain in this thing because it's accurate. I mean you know. It's not the filmmakers fault. They still and Michael. Scottie had difficult relationships with them. Look I was. I always whenever I was asked as played out over. Five weeks or published excerpts spike rows throughout the the running of the documentary. I always say we gotta wait to see how the whole narrative arc lake. And there's really touching scene where Scotty Pippin give a shout Jerry. Krause and acknowledges you know he's importance in his talent You know deep in episode ten and he was probably the biggest adversary when when Jerry pass away in two thousand seventeen. I was working for the Chicago Tribune that I wrote a really really long obituary and Michael Provided me of beautiful statement I'm Jerry Impact You know through students policy so I wasn't wrong. So it's it's fair you know. Jerry wasn't blameless alike with allergies or anoint him as a saint or something I mean he had some in here already complex issues. There's no getting around that but the to the hall of fame really good at his job and obviously you know. I think I would think and Mike doesn't give interviews suspect crunch anymore but I would love to ask Michael like houses you Jerry. Krause changed over. Here is not an executive role. It's not. It's not an easy job. And Jerry in my estimation was pretty darn good at it. Well I I. We're talking to Casey Johnson from NBC Sports Chicago and I encourage you to go on the NBC. Sports Chicago website and read this stuff that that Casey was able to get that Jerry crossroad before he died because it's really fascinating to read. I've told this story before Casey so I work with the Lakers. In when all the Phil and his people came West. I got to know all the all the people that was back there with him. You know them all to six or seven. People that that Phil came back with and the thing that they used to tell me about krause. Nobody disputed that statistically you can't challenges work. He's a hall of fame. Gm won six titles in eight years. He built that team. He drafted or traded for everybody but Jordan but his people skills were lacking to the point of when these guys were in the office in around and they saw Jerry Krause or they saw this car was there that they really dreaded seeing him. I wonder what that was like for you to cover in other words. You you have this guy who is extremely good at his job extremely successful but appeared to be very difficult to get along with as a person. How did you find that to cover so I yeah you can just that and I thought he? I had a brilliant line about that earlier is Manley. Charity was really good job but he just had trouble getting out of his own way right that that's that's to me the sound bite. The guy's perfectly and maybe a little bit more diplomatically. Right so but yeah. It's a great question what I would say. Is You know this is why. I don't WanNA solid relationship with Jerry changed considerably when I stopped covering we became friendly and he got very sentimental and wistful anesthesiologist. As he grew older he passed away when he was seventy seven. So you know I don't want like take what my memories of covering him more and they were difficult. I mean he was a hard guy to cover because he was not trusting of the media. I used to joke that. He had an uncanny ability to return every phone. Call Talk for ten minutes and not get you one thing that you could use. The newspaper it was it was truly an uncanny skill. He had but he was always professional To to to deal with you just you just didn't trust people and that's why he got the nickname The sleuth and you know Y- I understand that dynamic. I all those guys really well shipshape for Tex winter you know all those guys And you know but Jerry brought a lot of those guys into the NBA as well and we all. We all recognize that to our. Hey Listen Casey I just Retweeted your Your tweet a with the article. It really is a good reader. Puts a little bit of a different spin on On Jerry Krause's portrayal in the documentary and gives us some more kind of three dimensional view of who he was Both as a general manager and a person. Thanks a lot for coming on. We appreciate it man. I enjoyed the talk. Thank you guys he. Yeah that's it's fascinating to hear. See when you read crass breakdown how yet all his medical people in the room and he said okay. Let's talk about Luc Longley. Let's talk about Rodman. Let's talk about pippen and you hear what the doctors and the trainer said and this is on the piece that you just tweeted out. You can't call them crazy for breaking them up even though I think it was crazy to break them up because yeah right. It's like walking away from a blackjack table when you've won ten hands and row how much more you can go on the run. Yeah and it's a bet that because Jerry Reinsdorf. The owner talked about money. It's a bet that he clearly wasn't willing to make now willing to make All right coming up next the one thing that grabbed me out of that documentary that we haven't talked about and it's the idea of Michael Jordan's ability to always stay in the moment. Let's talk about that coming up. Next Mason Ireland fasttrack at five o'clock seventeen. Espn I seventy SPN. We got fasttrack coming up for you in just a couple of minutes You know one thing that jumped out at me from last night. I think it was. I actually to thanks. I had never heard the story of Steve Kerr's father at American University. In Beirut as told by Steve Kerr's mother which I thought was incredibly moving to get that back story of Steve Kerr and his life doing what he everything he could with the talent that he was given as he would acknowledge not the most talented guy in the world by the way. Steve is going to be on the show with us tomorrow but to hear that story told by his mother. I thought was incredibly powerful and moving. So I'll share a little bit of this tomorrow with Steve when when on the show but when I was at UCLA. Malcolm Kerr started there. Yes and the day he was assassinated All of a history major. Ucla all my classes that day throughout the syllabus and talked about Malcolm Kerr I got. I got a three or four. Our dissertation on what he was laughing. I felt like I knew him. Yup and I felt really bad for Steve and at the time I was just starting at U. OF A. Yup and and it's it's an incredible and I think that's why Steve is so politically active today. Yep He's He feels strongly about speaking out about when he thinks things are wrong. Or are you know he just? He knows that everything's connected so he'll be. I'm looking forward to having him on the show. Tomorrow Yeah me too the other the other line that jumped out at me was About Jordan how? Can you fear missing a shot that you haven't taken yet? The the idea of Jordan. I don't know who described him. As being present was it was phil that was describing that last night or was it somebody. Oh No it was that who is like the sports psychologist. Who Dr Todd Boyd? I think the the idea. That Jordan was always always in the moment an unafraid of what came next because he was already in the in the now of it. All I thought was really really incredible. Because that's something that Phil Preached One. Even once he got to the Lakers the idea of being present the idea of being in the now in the moment and not not thinking about what's next and not thinking about what's past but being right there in the moment I thought it was incredible and I thought it was also really in this now. You're getting to the hippie part of me right like Deepak. Chopra was on my podcast last week. The idea of everybody writing down their recollections of the team in their thoughts about the team in Jordan writing out a poem about his experience with that group of guys and then fill and all of them burning. All those recollections in a coffee can I thought was an incredibly moving in cool and very Phil Jackson feeling kind of thing to do. I know you don't like the word journey. But Phil Jackson does. He uses that word on. I know he doesn't matter of fact his book one of his books With the Lakers was called journey to a ring in his big thing was always. Nobody knows how this is going to end that while you're building something while you're on your way to whatever wherever it is you end up. You have to enjoy each day as it's happening. You have to enjoy the journey rather than worry about the destination. We'll have a destination in mind. But Phil was very I remember when I you know. He's great with books he used to. He used to like think out players in books and earn so one day. A second to a minute I said if I wanted to learn more about your whole zen philosophy I said what book would you give me? And he said there are two he said one is called Zen bodies in mind and then the second one really surprised me. It was the Zan of motorcycle maintenance. Oh no the of ZAN motorcycle maintenance. It's a fantastic book and I said well I'm not really into motorcycles and he said doesn't matter Yep I've never read it but he apparently he says it will explain a lot of things and I thought that he would recommend a book to somebody who's not into motorcycles Yeah it really had. It doesn't have very much to do with motorcycles. It's called Zen in the art of motorcycle maintenance. And it's written by Robert Per Stig and it's one of those books that if you are one of the and by the way I don't mind the word journey when Phil uses it when it's used by some fifteen year old girl on American idol. Okay because she hasn't had a journey she's fifteen. She's in high school but then in the art of motorcycle maintenance is is a great great read and it is one of those books. Along with Paolo Quail the alchemist and Siddhartha by Hermann has. They're like a series of books. That when you get into that sort of Zen mind and although I'm a stupid call myself a dirty word stupid fool on the radio. There's there's more on. There's more one on like you're on a journey. John and we talked about your journey on the podcast. We did together and eventually will change places and you'll interview me on the podcast. Which do it? There is great demand for But there's those those are some books that are really cool and I've been a part of ceremonies as recently as new years where we took our resolutions when I was at California hot springs with one of my Teacher Saul David. Raye and we. We wrote down our New Year's resolutions and then we dropped them into a fire and burn them to to resolve to follow them so I thought that was really really cool. All right fast-track time right. So no Lindsey today showing US right. She's taking a day off so it may give us more time to kick around some stuff. But we'll do it on next and I'M GONNA start in fast track with this clippers documentary on Qube. You haven't seen it. I've not seen it. Okay I've got a question for you coming up right off the top on fast track that. I think that I think you'll find really interesting. That's coming up cool and by the way I wanted to pass this along. Somebody Pass it along to me on email. You can email me. Venice Mesa gmail.com. We talked about how. If you google door `this red slipper a slipper will come up and hurricane. Oh have found another one. If you Google Thanos John. Do you know who thanasis. I do but I haven't seen any of those movies. He's the bad guy on the avengers. And in the avengers not spoiling anything the LEAD UP TO ENDGAME HIS SNAP. Thanos snap basically eliminates half of life on the planet. If you go to Google thanos she will see his hand and you can click there and it's really really cool. What happens so I wanted to pass that along coming up next for you is fast track? Mason in Ireland seven ten ESPN.