Episode 5: The Shifting Shape of Data
It's hard for me to speak to you. If I don't know who you are and I'm not gonNA speech you very personalized way not one hundred superstructure. Let's Talk Five G.. Welcome to five the podcast that breaks down five G. for marketers. This is episode five the shifting shape of data. I'm Jake Moskowitz. Since we began this podcast series. We've looked at a variety of new five G. enabled experiences devices devices and capabilities that will present marketers with a broad range of new opportunities and we've talked with experts about the new network characteristics that make five so different from previous mobile generations all of those things together. We'll have a momentous impact on marketing data. This is our data data episode. It's clear that in a five G. World we should expect lots of important changes in the field of marketing when we zero in an unjust the data alone all signed seemed to be pointing toward a few specific significant changes well technically. It's not a few it's five live. The first is the amount of marketing data when content and interaction become immediate with five G.. Consumers will engage more do more consume more Ericsson estimates mobile data use in the U._S. will triple in just the next three years plus as we discussed an episode to five G. Will Bring about an explosion of new devices most of which will be sensors that are providing constant flow of data into the cloud for entering an era in which the amount of data available will grow exponentially intially more data can be more useful and valuable but only if data vendors partners platforms and marketers create smart new five G. G. Ready data models models that shape massive amounts of data into impressively specific opportunities to meet customers at well defined stages of their journey journey that leads us to number two five G. will elevate the value of probabilistic data and today in marketing circles the term probabilistic is generally considered synonymous with week inaccurate and guesswork but in a five G. World the explosion explosion of consumer data is likely to redefine that perspective completely the better the data inputs the better the output of those models deterministic data likely to become secondary to vastly improve probabilistic data and here's the thing when it becomes highly accurate and highly actionable. We won't call it probabilistic anymore. We'll call it. The accuracy of location data from some vendors will improve dramatically the five G. uses higher frequencies which means more dense networks of towers or in other words more cell antennas so measuring where a device is between tween antennas will mean five G. Cellular location data will achieve a level of scale accuracy and precision never before possible it'll bust well beyond beyond the limitations of G._P._S. data such as lack of accuracy indoors or inability to know which floor of a building devices on or signal bouncing off of a crowded street of high rises. That's because cell tower data will supplement its current accuracy with far better precision the C._E._O. OF A._T. and T. he said it's he yes that five G. could track location down to the millimetre. Expect lots of new sources of targeting data as has the number of consumer touch points grows so too will the number of new data sources. We're not just talking about new APPS. We're talking about new devices many of which will will gradually or eventually connect directly to the five G. Network. This is a really important point it means appliance companies security companies insurance companies unease and many others will hold the keys to new valuable consumer insights and data and mobile carriers will transport a lot more data than ever before four because five G. means devices will send some data into the cellular network as compared to today when most peripheral devices use Wifi and Bluetooth to a user apply that information marketers will need to forge new relationships lean on new programmatic solutions and develop new data sourcing strategies marketers will access data differently better access to high quality data can help marketers connect with consumers on a more personal level in the right now world of five G.. Targeting decisions will be made in real time we tend to think of programmatic advertising as a real time process we even refer into inventory auctions as real time bidding but anyone who browse content in quote unquote real time today knows it takes three to four seconds for pages to Deloitte Five G. will reveal that real time has been a misnomer in the high latency world of four G. Some vendors will embrace five G. we by focusing more on real time A._I.. Algorithms building solutions around those algorithms and moving those solutions as close to the consumer as possible they will require at platforms to implement edge cloud computing infrastructure that shift to the edge will enable lower programmatic latency and that will enable Bulla true real time data driven decisions required to keep up with five G. will also enable more efficient and effective optimization it can be super interesting and exciting to speculate about marketing shifts and opportunities in the five G. Future but assure as there are changes ahead. Not all of them are positive here a few of the potential data specific downsides marketing leaders are going to need to update their marketing and advertising tax tax tech and We'll be plenty that don't expect to see a rise in data vendors poor quality data and misleading five G. Data claims whether they're in the home home wearables extended reality or beacons and sensors out in the world. All of the new five G. enabled devices and experiences will increase the amount of data data inputs accuracy and advanced data models forward thinking marketers are going to have to plan differently. I agree in fact I think are worth our salt as marketers. We're GONNA understand these new sources and new formats of data but then to your point just to significantly what to do with that data Michael Stich is the chief business officer at via mail wine are and I think that machine learning is one where we are entering into a new phase where we're anomaly looking back. We're looking forward and then we're not only <hes> sort of doing our own pattern recognition. We're also getting some machines to due pattern recognition alongside us and I think that's really exciting. I think that really just dramatically accelerates not only what we know <hes> but what we might know in perhaps not obvious ways that also help us with what might happen next so moving more towards predictive and prescriptive experiences in front of us. I it's super exciting for me as a marketer. There's a whole lot that could be done there but I would argue that it's going to become both an opportunity truly but increasingly an obligation to get out in front of it yeah. I'm lucky to be in a situation where I get to go around to agencies and talk about five G. and one one of the things that comes up is what to do about it like what should an agency be thinking about in terms of getting ready for five G. and that's one of the things we talk about is rethink who you work with and how those companies are built but their infrastructures are like and the companies that are A._I.. Forward that have access as to the best input data are the best at the data science to build algorithms based on those inputs and then have the technology edgy to put those algorithms at the front of the product so that the product is based on the decision making in those A._I.. Models those are the companies that are well well positioned to thrive in five G. Universe twelve foot and I think in general the advertising agency if for that matter I._T.. Services model is already <hes> in in a period of reinvention and I think that what you just described is a good set of reasons why it must I reinvent in. It's not only partnerships but it's also the kinds of services at marketers will <hes> desire and and and pay for <hes> in order for them to due to to move towards it but <hes> my opinion is there's already so much new experimentation around new models for for brands and advertisers in terms of what business they're in looking looking for new revenue streams and justice significantly so many new models on the agency side to try to think about new ways to monetize now. Let's think about what kinds kinds of capabilities five enables five G. enables very rich video communications five G. enables the ability to have very very flexible dynamic experiences as it relates to services to you and then five G. also provides a real accelerate to personalized experiences right right so so the content that you see is very uniquely tailored for you in in very relevant ways lawrence dearly is associate associate director of programmatic star Com worldwide in terms of the long term effects. I think data collection is pretty much going to be the biggest thing that is going interchange looking at behavioral patterns creating those models getting them into the platforms. I think we've seen the industry change a Woah over the past several years and the companies that are able to thrive are the ones that are able to respond to the changes in the industry very quickly clay and the agile and sort of create what marketers are looking for and make that available to them. I think the buy side is typically early the side of the industry that's catching up in terms of technology. I think that will change because all the data will be purchased through the buy side you know in the past I think with header tag and everything else you know the sell side is in dictating. The technology updates in the trends in the industry in the buy side has been struggling to catch up but I'm hoping to see the buy nightside sort of shine in this case in I'm hoping to see pupil hire the right data scientists in at this off the ground because when the network is plugged in like they should have this. It's ready to go since we are in the early days of five G. and it's GonNa be a roll out a ramp up. Let's talk for a moment about when does it matter when do we. We know that it's time for stark to to make significant investments. How much scale is enough to matter? That's an interesting question question. <hes> in our industry usually sort of wait around for there to be what we call a statistically significant data set <hes> I think five G. will will redefine the definition of a statistically significant data set you know what are the behavioral patterns that we're looking at for consumer. How many times times do they have to repeat a specific action in order for it to be significant? <hes> these are sort of the questions we have to answer before we can even create a model and then once we do that. We have to collect the data over a given period of time in that. We have to put it in the segment <unk>. D._S._P.'s so that people like me can buy it <hes> so that's a good question and again. I think it's a nut yet another other thing that five G. will sort of redefine for marketing you mentioned that five G. could redefine what the right sizes so. What what is it today? Say we have big data. Still I mean we have a lot of data and we have data scientists that have put it into segments in creative models huddles off of it but what I don't think we have is a set of data points that we're looking at <hes> I think we're maybe looking at one or two or three but you know we're not looking at a behavioral pattern over a longer period Evolved once five G. is part of the picture <hes> as five G. takes hold. Do you see it having an impact on how we view probabilistic versus deterministic yeah of course the probabilistic will definitely be characterized as you know the data sets that we're gonNA define through the five G. WE update right so we're going to be looking at the behavioral patterns of people in how they go about their day in how much time they spend at each place which place they go to where they commute and those sort of things while deterministic data will still be important probabilistic data will become much more valuable than it wasn't a pass and when we sort of looking at people's browsing patterns online we misuse the word deterministic and the AD industry we use. Is it only demean we didn't change it whereas the word is supposed to actually mean this data is true. Here's an example imagine down though too silly mobile game and it asks me to register my age and gender. Am I going to be honest. Are you honest in situations like these and yet if a marketers using data directly from a registration a distraction like this that data today is considered deterministic simply because it's unchanged from its source the fact that this data's registration data <hes> means. It's even more highly regarded in the AD industry. A deterministic designation doesn't require any proof so probabilistic isn't that much of a disadvantage wjr and it will only get better with five G.. Barb Keel Hoffer is associate director of data data architecture at spark foundry you being in data architecture. Do you think that five G. will make consumers have even higher expectations expectations of personalization and do think five G. will enable marketers to be more personalized. Yes it will definitely enable marketers to be more personalized <hes> if nothing else retargeting consistent tracking you know that's that's our big issue right now. Is it's hard for me to speak to you. If I don't know who you are and knocking to speak. He runs very personalized way. I'm not one hundred percent sure you know it. Just it looks it looks really off and I think I think when you're tracking somebody and you're using something very specifically specifically. I'm thinking like the facebook ads that have like they use your profile information. They say your name. You're you're from that. They might have picky things about you. It gives you the creeps if that's wrong. It's really good blake. Set you off and be on so one. It's creepy the you're using information but to it's so you really have to be very dead on to have work and work properly so I think that if there's the insurance there in that it is going to be accurate in good it will become more personalized into what level can become more personalized will increase reese as the consumer. I it's hard for me to step into their world. I know I like things that are more conceptually relevant to me. He but I'm also looking for it. Don't want my time wasted. My time is very precious and they all her time is very precious in this day and age except of course why why would you waste somebody's time with something that is completely off base to who they are and what they need in our lives. You know you might on the off chance be showing them something that they never even knew. They thought they wanted but the chances not actually is very thin. I think thank you know people are very grounded in who they are these days and we want to see things that reflect our lives and we need and if you have to see advertising facing. I think that you should want it to be very specific to who you are and if it's going to be creative and interesting you're you're being shown something very exciting if it's something that personally excites you that she's GonNa get you that much more jazz DOPP so my marketer under brain tells me that people should want this and want personalization. I don't know whether or not people realize it's happening with the awareness of data people are starting. There is open a lot more than I think are starting to <unk> out things in things out in a way that they've never done before so my hope is that you now as we become more personalized. People recognize that you don't feel creeped out by a feel a you know they feel good that the brand is trying to speak to CID admin trying to not waste their time and make sure that it sits there were all end feels authentic to who they are and if we're able to attract them appropriately can be unto they are. I think you know the scary part is is whether those giant Mrs where you're really trying to be very relevant and either you know your data's offer your environments off and it's Snot landing and I think that's almost the worst part. I think it's less taking win. It's really dot on yeah. It's funny before you went back to it. I was going to go back to that point you made because I think it's a really important point and and you started really talking my language when you said <hes> if I'm not really confident that the data's right I'm not GONNA do personalized marketing no matter what kind of technology I have have available to me. That's a really important point. The EMOTO Institute published an article a few months ago on exactly that point basically says we can talk about personalized marketing till the the cows come home because we have crossed vice databases and we have dynamic creative technology. We've dynamic copy and things like that but let's not forget the data <hes> you're you're personalizing based on like that stuff is wrong then. It's way worse to do personalized marketing than it is to do. Non Personalized Marketing Taylor agreed it just comes off is very false and like I said before if anything doesn't work in advertising it's being authentic. <hes> emotions authentic behaviors authentic creative authentic experiences these are what people are going for in their day to day lives and you miss the mark on my own it just like shows up so fast Saying they know it. They don't know it in a way that they're longing for that but when it's not antic to them. I think the you know error. They're engaged by it or they're tabled to engage with. It's much more interesting than them. So and personalization really does allow for all of those things if you can get right. It's clear that in a five G. World people and businesses will access data in ways they've never been able to before and that should raise new ethical considerations for advertisers answers and market researchers. The data may be available but should you use it. That's how is the big question and if it gets you know what your agency's he's perspective on it. What is also your Client Perspective on it. <hes> any any partnership utilizing their perspective on it in any of those could be the three different answers <hes> so whether you legally have the right to use or not sometimes. I you know any one of those partners stakeholders in Yasser now can completely change your way moving forward and so and I feel like that's constantly evolving <hes> as the market constantly of so we we've been in had conversations on specific targeting and beyond what's legal. What do we think we have moral rate to do and so some of those conversations now coming into play which is beyond you know legally Wrigley. We have the right to use this data. We know but shoot lease data so it's getting more and more complex on. I think that in those conversations are going to continue to have happen nowadays. The first question everyone's asking is do we do. We own this data. Yes not take a right to use the state. I guess now have people opted in yes now and so that's really first and foremost question beyond anything thing else that we're talking. Do we have the moral right to use this data to great question. That's the one that no one can answer or were you will get many many different opinions on it. Yeah it probably depends on the entity depends on the circumstances. The time probably changes over time John in what you're using it for you can have the same data segment or the same target and be using it for campaign acts and an seal authentic doc an and morally okay or you know beyond morally just you don't get x. about it and then you can have the same exact data used just for a completely different campaign and you just feel feel like you're exploiting people and I don't think anyone likes to have that feeling and so it's it's not even interesting data south. It's a context that it's really really nuanced. You know obviously there's a lot of talk about how millennials are so much more open and there's so much more willing to share share and stuff like that. I wonder how much of that is just simply a function of age and like as millennials get older and they get into mid career and stuff like that will they change their mind about all the stuff that they used to be so open about will or is it built into who they are art because they were raised in that way in that environment they will always have a different perspective. It's kind of interesting to me. Think about how it will all end up. It's possible well. I think part of it is now. It's so ingrained in our technology that you'd have to give up a lot of the personal comfort to have now and in our people people who have been born and raised with those comforts willing to give them up you know I. I know what it's like to review toffee. Who'd I live without about the Internet now probably not but I know what that was like. <hes> you know if you are growing up with a tablet in your hand from the age of three. I think it's a very different experience and you know if you think about even even post millennial kids you're being worn now that are going to be able to sell their their appliances what to do and be able to control everything without even moving. A finger will be built to give that up once. It's given to them knowing Wayne that there's a lot of train US kind of that. Every advantage were given we are giving something away a lot of the tax free for a reason often and you'd have to understand the trade offs now. I think that it's partially about being more open and were sharing and partially actually it's just about you know they don't WanNa give up on the good things just to have that level of privacy before we go five genes lots more data and mobile operators search engines and social networks becoming even smarter of course with all the a new digital consumer experiences more data accuracy and touch points five. G. Will have an impact on privacy to alison. Chef is a senior editor at exchanger. You really do need to think about the privacy implications of whatever you happen to be doing at the beginning because after that it's going to everything is going to speed it up. If you just jump in without thinking about how you might gather consent or the consent is even really the mechanism that you you need in a particular case it is going to be sort of difficult to disconnect in a world where everything everything can be connected to a really ask connection and not just at home and I mean the convenience of that and the ability to watch video wherever you are all the entertainment entertainment opportunities. It's I mean there are a lot of benefits for consumers but if you're gonNa do something cool you always have to look at the other side and say you know what <music> but when I when I flip this over and look at the underbelly of it a little bit is this is this GonNa Flies Kosher and that's definitely something to do with the the beginning on the next episode of Five Could Five G. Act as the privacy tipping point. We'll consumers get to have a lot got more control over how that data is used what they get in exchange for providing it to marketers. We're going to talk about the privacy initiatives advantages and concerns that emerging as we enter the five G. era tune in next time for engaging conversation with an expert in the privacy policies of over sixty countries. Thanks thanks for joining us. The five podcasts presented by Ericsson Emoto in the Moto Institute and Features Original Music by Dia phonic in the small town bounds. This episode was produced by Robert Adam capital. I'm Jay Moscow yeah.