TWiCH 491: SSD Encryption Sucks!
Coming up with this week in computer hardware, foldable smartphones. As his the encryption data SOX people a drops an epic server processor, ipad, pro updates in more all coming up next on twitch. That casts you love from people you trust. This is twit this week in computer hardware, episode four hundred ninety one quarter on November eighth twenty eight t SST encryption sucks. This episode of this week in computer hardware is brought to you by express VPN. Protect your online activity today for three extra months free with a one year package. Go to express VPN dot com slash twitch. And by on deck. Are you a small business owner in need of capital today on debt can help with over ten billion dollars in loans in an eight plus rating from the Better Business Bureau on deck is a lender you can trust is it on dot com slash twitch. To learn more and receive a free consultation with one of their US-based loan specialists. Well, hope nitwits this week in computer hardware, twits weekly show, bring you the most engaging most delightful most informative most nourishing Kasur even the body. Assed hardware news available in this and any unknown. Universe is be this universe in any unknown universe in any case. Babbling at the top of the show aside. I'm Patrick Norton joined by Mr. Allan Melvin Tano. How's it going? A little time lag. But we're good. Okay. We have we're going to talk about as decription the ipad pro Samsung sociable smartphone. Fifteen terabyte hard drives. And maybe even some console references today. But nothing. To body. I'm Markus with our body nece. I just had to put this in because I everytime. I look at it. I am filled with something that almost almost might feel like techno Las to Samsung's foldable smartphone. They call it the Infinity flex display, and boy that thing fascinates me. I don't know how else to say. It's. Connects on this. They're making it look like it's folding in such a way that that screen is like sheet of paper folding. Looks like it. I I suspect there is an opening in the radius of that of the housing of that thing near the near the the binding there screen is probably not literally folding itself in half. Like, what the crease, we don't know? And we won't know. And it's funny because there's another one you can kind of see over on the right side that virgin looked at earlier, but. Whatever. Four hundred twenty DPI seven point three inch basically four by three. It's four by two by three four point two by three that main display when it's open when they folded into chocolate bar mode. It drops down to a four point five eight inch diagonally measured. What they call. The cover display. Not the main display, it's I want to say three hundred twenty dots per inch, man. I'm really curious about this just just in it, given it so much media is consumed on phones. This just looks really interesting. You know, no info on pricing. No info on availability. We don't know how long it's gonna take to to kind of make this happen. But it's really interesting. Because I like tablets, and I like looking at bigger screens when I'm say watching Netflix while waiting for the airspace to be reopened over Las Vegas. And certainly a lot of you out there consumer tremendous amount of YouTube, and Netflix and Amazon prime and whatever else you like on a mobile screen, and that's really tempting to me to be able to look at things on a seven inch screen, but not have to deal with a lunch tray or trying to stuff a lunch tray into my pocket. I'm really curious what the end up with the size of that final phone that final foldable phone is is a centimeter thick as a twelve centimeters thick. They were getting into a lot of those details. But I think this is going to be the first of a bunch of devices like this. We see I'm curious if they're going to show up at sea. Yes. While the world congress. But it's. You know, it was legitimately playing it. We don't know if that's the final case that's the final design. But man, it looks good. And the other thing they were showing off was royals flexi pie. Which was the one that used cut us on the edge. There you see it on the right side of the screen right now. If you're watching the video where the screen was folding on the outside of the device, but I just I have nothing to say other than that. I don't usually get really excited about phone concepts. But this one I'm really curious to see in the real world. And what the pricing is like it's tempting that's not the Samsung. That's the royale you're looking at right now, if you're washing the video version of this just letting out. Yeah, I think the I think just the key to getting like we've had flexible, you know, quasi foldable screens for a while. The key is getting into something that can have enough door ability to wear your average. Average person is not going to somehow mess the screen. Right. You need to somehow enclose it, right? If you look at any any Sam our tone right now. Yeah. I mean, any average person's phone does not just have the screen just kind of flop out there. Like, it's inside something. Well, protected behind glass and aluminum and other things right? It's a very delicate in had it's hard. The screen itself is a very delicate object to can't just you know, manhandle the thing and it'll just stop working eventually, right? Despite how you see the hand model person, whoever, you know, flip flop being around a bear screen, you know, just sheet a paper looking Ola screen. You can't just do that like indefinitely. Can't just roll that up and stick it in your pocket and expected to still work once you've pulled it back out, right? Well, we'll get there. You know, you can expect it to whether or not, you know, engineering and physics and materials. Science still apply. We can make that assumption. I'd also like to point out for those of you who dealing with wins. It looks like we have another fired delivering tremendous melts ash into the bay area. So if I suddenly learned panic and say goodbye could be because the fires closer than I think it is. Speaking of fires to make one of the weirder. Transitions will make on this show. Hopefully this year. Let's talk about SSD hardware encryption which everybody's been. Well, you know, I'm selling it. And the the storage is soldered down on the motherboard just encrypt it before it goes. And that'll take care of everything. And the register does not want you to well. I'm just going to read the title that. I that I want Alan I'm going to just step back and let you talk about this, quote, solid state of fear euro boffins bust open SSD pit locker and Christian. It's really really dumb. And then if that doesn't bring the point home, quote security, experts frantically face palming at stupid design. Wow. Yeah. So so the register article is harping on Microsoft allot. The thing is though it's not completely Microsoft's fault. So the paper itself, which is Lincoln and near the beginning register article, very interesting, basically, they went through some different SSD's made by some made by crucial so made by Samsung, I'm not sure if they just had enough juice, juicy content to make a nice paper at that point and just stopped trying to do other SSD's or that those, you know, those two makers were the easiest to get into. But yeah, they were really frigging easy. These guys took these SSD's in some cases that kind of probed around and use this thing called the j tag header, which is like a way to debugged hardware. You know, this assumes you have physical access to the, but yeah, I mean, you're trying to get into encrypted SSD, you're going to have physical access, right? Well, these guys dumped the firmware from the drives analyzed that saw what made it tick did some reverse engineering, and in a lot of these cases, there were some very simple just I mean, one of the most easy cases was there was just a vendor specific command, which is just pure security through obscurity, right? It's you're just relying on the fact that nobody would know what this secret command is right? And if you ran this particular kind of. Yeah. And if you just happen to know what? This command was to send to the drive and you did. So then it would unlock another set of commands one of which would allow you to just like extract the block of cryptographic data from the drive. In other words, like the chunk of information that contains the things like the passwords or hashes that you would need to be able to reverse the passwords and and get access to the date and just unlock the drive. Yeah. I mean, just all around there were just all sorts of holes that these guys poked, and they just systematically went through they went through three different crucial SST's that went through four different Samsung SSD's, very common ones. Eight forty eight fifty egos the t three and the t five which I think are the the most damning of this whole thing is that Samsung T three five are external SSD's. Those are the ones that users are most likely to enable the encryption on because they don't want to someone coming across the drive and just being able to read it. Now granted if your average Joe came across us drive, they're probably still not able to read it. They still need to know what the password is. But if there's somebody who knows their way around some hardware like these guys do and have any sort of verse engineering experience, they're going to be able to figure out a way in right? It's almost like Jurassic Park. Right. Like life will find a way life always finds a way, you know, line from the movie, it's that's how security stuff tends to work. Right. Like, just ask the Steve Gibson. You know, there's. There's there's someone will find a way if there's if there's a way in that exists. It will be found at some point. It's just a matter of time and effort, basically, and in the case of a lot of these while, these drives are all conforming to some form of a OPEL standard and Opel's just the one of the standards, which you would the host would communicate with an SSD and enable or disable or, you know, enter your password for for encryption. They can claim to conform to that standard. But if the the way they've implemented is not secure. Night as well. It might as well, not exist. Right. And then the part of this that that windows comes into play on is that it's in relation to bit locker. So if you had an ST or hard disk connected to your system that did not support any of these cryptographic standards any like OPEL or any of those things where the drive tells the system. Hey, I can do this encryption thing. Right. If none of that's their windows will just do its own incursion. It'll have to use a CPU on more modern systems. There's like an AS two six engine inside like intellinet MDC fees. Like, there's there's commands it's celebrated, but there's still some sort of overhead all of your data has to pass through the CPU before you know, goes to and from the desk, it's a little bit extra work, which is the part of the reason you want the hardware to be able to do it. Right. It's way more ideal of just the take care of it. You give the. To your password at unlocks at good system, loses power is protected again, basically. But there's there's no mechanism to tell Microsoft or windows. Hey, I understand you could do this yourself. I don't want you to ask the drive if it can do it. And if the answer is yes, just let the drive to it. Like, I don't want you to trust the drive like when security usually the best thing is trust. No one. And in this case, you know, don't trust anything or trust his things as possible. Right. So Microsoft's default in this case has just been wealth to drive says it's OPEL compatible. Yeah. Sure do that that's great and an ideal world that should be the right answer. You should be able to trust it. But as this paper proves turns out, you know, these guys haven't been that great at implementing us, and I I wouldn't just, you know, voice caution towards a crucial or. Samsung hair like any of these guys, there's probably vulnerabilities. So we were talking about this on the podcast that Ken brought up a really good point like OPEL shouldn't just be like the standard that people follow. There should be some sort of a certification, right? There should be some sort of an independent body may probably including guys like this that that did this work. There should be somebody that can actually review in confidence the firmware or whatever. The software is that's on the SSD that's responsible for handling the crypto. What someone validate that stuff? What someone else look at your code in a manner a manner of which they're not going to redistribute your code right in where it's kept in confidence. But the release. Just trust wells, the I think they really should be doing, you know, they really should be some kind of auditing mechanism in place here. Just, you know, just to in a lot of cases, it's better for any company. Like if you're able to say, hey, ain't no independent guy. Like looked at this into the choir. Here. I just find a lot of companies when you suggest that perhaps they should have their products audited. Look at you like you're some sort of magic space weasel that just teleported into the middle of their office and took a magic space weasel dump in the middle of their desk. It's I find it unfortunate. I also find companies that believe in security through obscurity to be unfortunate. But look we've got some sort of, you know, ven diagram of of security errors being found on the storage on laptops. Not like, you store important information on a laptop you might actually want to remain secure, especially in the case of government employees organizations that are subject to district SPF. Josh. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Every you know, this it's worse than I thought it it could have been and given that and given that this papers out now, I really hope that everybody kind of steps up their game. And and fixes that problem and makes it so that you should be able to trust OPEL. Right. You should be able to trust. Dr that says that it can do encryption. And then when you flip that on it should work, and it should be it should be harder to get into. Then just a few security researchers poking around. You know, poking poking around the parts poking around the parts of the drive that are just acceptable. Generally, just like a tag koetter like almost every bit of computer hardware has some form of J tag header on it. It's always awkwardness. It's not even I'm okay with security, researchers poking around and finding things because some security researchers in pen testers are extraordinarily intelligent intelligent. It's fisk. Aided. What I have an issue with is. Somebody downloaded the service manual and through our secret commands. Yeah. Right. You know? Yeah. Like, you know, in some cases, there was just there was just like, I think they extracted. It was something like one of the commands or just like contained the Email address up one of the guys that worked at the company, and then all the no long string numbers is just like. Yeah. This is just this is just the way in right? Like this. If you do this, you know, potentially making it so easy that in the end once you've figured out, you might have had to use the J, tag and other kind of creative ways to to get to the point of figuring out the exploit. But then once you have it figured out. It's potentially so easy that it could just be run without any special tolls. Without just what the drive connected to a system. He could potentially hit it with these special commands that than unlock other commands, you can issue and just the drive just gives up the goods. It's just like oh you want. My you want my block of flash that contains all the security keys for the dry period. Go like, yeah. It's it's just. That's not good right at it's the same kind of thing that same kind of thing. That's gibson. When he comes across just this thing that was like a no brainer. Why were you guys doing it? This way, kind of thing you just it just kind of blows your mind. Like, you don't understand why? But you know, at the end of the day, some of these guys were just trying to get this thing implemented. Yeah. I mean, that's part of the issue is is a I'm in the process, you know, teaching the boys math and teaching the boys to double check, their answers and verify, you know, is something and to give yourself the time to do that is I think critical, and it's critical when you're doing math is an eleven year old, and it's critical when you're doing a hardware design. It's a critical when you're engineering Harbury implementations and all too often. It just doesn't get done. And the end result is exciting surprises that make you realize that you're secure devices, aren't and that's the kind of surprise I need. Yeah. And just just going through some of these. It was just it was to the point where the person or. Responsible for for doing the development work at that level. When this thing was being figured out somebody in the room had to ask that question, or it should have dawned on somebody, right? Like, well, we have this special. We have the special come in that just lets us into this and Petit couldn't they just then get this other information, and then reverse the password like point gets there. Right. It's just a feature that they had of the drive that they really should lock that down. It's similar to the kind of things you hear about with, you know, back doors into what's the Intel chipset level thing that was like ring minus to access to the hardware the Intel management engine back doors and whatnot. Where it was just the thing that not never thought anybody would try to access the thing that way, again, just relying on the obscurity of it. Oh, yeah. Just nobody would ever figure this out. Well, somebody figured out. Got to fix it. Yeah. I had pro course, shipping views or coming out. It's interesting to watch the reviews in part because a lot of the reviews or kind of divided on the you believe in the ipad pro future, and you can run your entire personal professional life off of IOS or you just want to delete expletive powerful ipad to consume media. And you don't particularly mind about the cost, you know, one of the crankier ones out there. I think is Neil as review up on the on the verge. And it's interesting because when you look at the we talked extensively about the pricing on these the ipad pros, you know, they sent him a model that was I was going to say, it's they completely maxed out nearly rights. Twelve point nine nine type head pro one terabyte of storage LT. The optional one hundred ninety nine dollars smart keyboard folio and the one hundred and thirty dollars apple pencil, which is two thousand two hundred twenty seven dollars total which is more than all, but one standard macbook pro configure. Ration-? So it's it's curious to watch some of these reviews because some of these models are pretty bad ass. But really it's still comes down to. Yes. These are faster than last year. If you're looking for the sub one thousand dollar models performance, I think is going to be in in some cases problematic because of IOS, you know, the USB C is not particularly advanced. We like to see it was there's a funny tweet. I caught from stems Tim Stevens. Just spitballing here. But it almost seems like apple doesn't really have its heart in the whole USB thing. Which is what he was reading a Federico vitucci who wrote that USB cable USB cable. It comes to the box of the IP pro cannot mirror. The ipad the expert on display it just charges. It. Which is a little, you know. All that money you have. And you know, all that money you spend on it. And they and they cheap out a couple of dollars cheaper version of a USB cable without the extra data lines that can handle enough bandwith to, you know, you know, to do the Mirroring to the display, so yeah, you know, it is a more expensive cable. Don't get me wrong. But it's a very expensive product like that should work. I'm sure there was some being counter somewhere inside apple was like well five percent of the people tops that by this are actually gonna hook it up to a display, and there were just like, well, then why ship this cable with with all of them. Right. And the assumption is probably just if you have the better display that you want to hook up external, you're just going to get the other cable. Yeah. But most people aren't gonna know that right? Apple sure a sack is an advertising it. It's someone had to find out after the fact when actually tried to hook it up. Yeah. It's kind of a doubting, right? You know, one of the challenges when when you're looking at the ipad pro because it really is. It's stunning. It's gorgeous displays gorgeous. I love the elimination of the home button L O the rounded corners on the screen. It is stupid snappy. And we'll get to that in a second. But you really have to figure out, you know, a lot of it comes down to whether or not you can do what you need to do in terms of IRS applications, and you know, for the people who can do everything they need to do this incredibly powerful. Do ipad pros probably super tempting if you're thinking about it as an alternative to a MAC book. Pro you may have difficulty accessing that power because of what apps are actually available in IOS. That's that's an interesting thing to look at. There's also a our second. I had a great walk through on the ipad. Pro x twelve system on a chip and one it was kind of like an aunt a not who we missed so much since he left a non tech and. I went to apple, but a non Shimpei, and Phil Schiller kind of walk people through the silicon and the lie that really stuck out from me. The the twelve x is a pretty big bump over the twelve. But you know, it's quote, we've got our own custom designed performance control over the let's us all eight cores on the twelve system on chip at the same time. So when you're running these heavily threaded workloads things, you might find in pro workflows appropriations, that's where you see up to ninety percent improvement over the eight ten x processor, which is the processor in a previous ipad pro. One. It's so cool to see a non resurfacing and to. It's pretty crazy. When you look at like at Keith Ben scores. And we we talked about this a little bit last week. But you know, if your applications and the IRS can access it, this is a fairly powerful, computer. Yeah. There's there's two thousand eighteen macbook pro model, that's more powerful. But the idea twenty thousand nine hundred pro- performs everything you can do with the twenty-seven in terms of all the benchmarks it is faster than a macbook. Pro it is faster than in two thousand sixteen MAC before two thousand seventeen MAC book. Pro it is, you know, their benchmarks put it maybe twenty twenty five thirty percent, not quite the thirty five percents single core performance, but it certainly considerably faster than twenty seventeen ipad. Pro it's pretty amazing to kind of look at this. There's a tremendous amount of GP performance in the H Welbeck's processor. Like to see whether or not vendors are going to figure out a way to bend that towards celebrating things like, you know, Photoshop style photo editing applications, you know, and it's crazy. You know, they are in an admittedly Xbox One s class cheapie new, pardon me. And it is crazy to realize that. Yes, it is, you know, as they claim like an Xbox One s class g pew that's still way behind what's available, for example on windows desktop, or laptop it again, this is a tablet, and this is a tablet that does not seem to be compromised in performance, despite the fact that it doesn't have a fan, which is something we're not used to seeing on a lot of the fan Lewis super thin Intel designs, you know. It's it's pretty interesting stuff. If you're kind of curious one of the lines is kind of gets repeated into his own apple didn't really wanna get into detail on that. Which is not a particular surprise. If you've been reading about any stories with apple over the. Last twenty years, but you know. This is you know. It would be nicer if it was as fast as the Xbox One acts, which is four carry and much more powerful. You know, I'm really kinda curious to see how this works overtime. What people do with it? You know, it's. You know, it's it's fascinating accomplishment from apple and I wanna see the applications that are in there. You know, that are available kind of take full advantage of what it's available in the processing power and the ipad. Pro I think they'll have to in order to replace the, you know, the MAC book pros. You know, the, you know. I I'm curious. I'm I just want to say that I really curious to see whether or not the the software environment is gonna kind of fully take advantage of what's available inside of the ipad. Pro. You know, the machine learning the neural network the GP performance. There's some really interesting stuff. You know, there's a lot of raw computing power inside of this. And it's not cheap. If you need a keyboard. The keyboard adults two hundred bucks, a maybe one hundred seventy bucks for doing the smaller of the two twenty thousand nine peppers. But I'm really kind of curious to see where they go with the feature set. They have stuffed inside of this seven animator processor, this incredible piece custom silicon and I'll just stop there. Otherwise, I'll just be repeating myself over and over again, it's a really interesting product the specs are pretty fascinating, the performance is really intriguing now whether or not that I know I o s is going to deliver. Something is some more of the performance is available in it back OS ten I think is kind of the next step on the next Lucien for the ipad. Pro it's going to be January replacement for everybody that might be normally looking at an ipad air. So. Yep. Is an interesting trend interesting trend generally speaking lately with these with you tend to get more compute power than like the software needs to catch up almost. Yeah. Right. Like, you've got these video GPU's Dr Tannock series. They've got you know, extra silicon can do extra machine learning related things that kind of not a lot is taking advantage of right? Like, there's there's some parts of it. There's other parts that are meant for Ray tracing. Also, not fully taken advantage of now, you've got this other neural net. You know, the video side just doing it more for to try to, you know, do better tricks graphically like normal related handling of the output make more pleasing or effectively equivalent to something that would need more horsepower to get the same result. And you've got all this negative this neural hardware engine stuff. Like extra silicon in all these apple products that? It's like it's like you're were we've swung really far on one side of the chicken and egg problem. It's a really good way. Right. Right. Like, you know, you're you're getting you're getting this extra hardware into the hands of lots of folks, whether they need or not it's just it's just there. Right. And at some point in the future, presumably, developers would take more and more advantage of that. Because you'd have that extra hardware in more and more of the marketplace are just more more of the users potential users. So yeah, it's really interesting amendment to see where that all goes in the coming year to three but for now, we've just got, hey, there's a sector hardware, and this thing, and yeah, it's an incremental upgrade otherwise. But look at all this neural engine thing that we may we're barely showing in sort of a demo fashion right now. But you know, maybe way more might bleed to way more powerful compute related things in the future. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. It's it's got a lot of tweets around this. 'cause I tweeted about this earlier, and one of the things that I always thirteen at C Muratti tweeted out like, I always I always thirteen going to be a big deal on ipad had put USB there for a reason. You know, it's I'm and we also another great, you know, tweet from at Rory where it's like, it's the USB plague. You know, it's still wasn't cable. You never know. What's going on? There are three distinct flavors, which one would does what's you know, USCC charge only USB data speeds only know USB data support USB with USB three data sport spec- thunderbolt, three sports. And it's true. It's a messy spec on the irritating days, especially if you can't read the little tiny things that may or may not be printed next to next to the port on your portable device. Let's turn while I'm in Twitter a point out that at J J G R nine says, quote, they revealed the photograph the foldable phone in the dark and supposedly you can see the gap between screens and the light close up. Also, apparently foldable is no word so much spell checking so much emotional trauma. Zaps speaking computer part where is brought to you by express VPN which running on a desktop, right? Over actually a laptop right over here. None desktop because you know, I don't always like to share everything with my eyes p just because I don't stealthy that way. And if you travel out of your cafe or a hotel using public wifi. You are goodness help you in McCarron airport right now, Los Angeles, I should say the Las Vegas airport. What was the one of the first airports all three wife? I I've been running VPN in that airport pretty much ever since forever and friends of mine who are in the computer security, like don't do that. Like, I got a VPN. They're like, okay. You know, a hack with right, though, how can just kinda sip through your packets take a look at what's going on the wire shark on to other things, you know, they may be trying to steal passwords. Credit card numbers personal details. Just anything they can grab their grubby little hands on at some of those grubby little hackers are pen testing friends by but I it's really simple to protect my online activity from spies and hackers and basically not share what I'm doing with my eyes. Be I've been using express VPN ease use apps run in the background on your computer, your phone, your tablet, one click to turn on or off that makes it pretty obvious. Whether it's on or off the security demise your internet browsing. They encrypt your data and hide your public IP address. That's kind of the whole point of a VPN virtual private network you from your laptop your desktop connect to express VPN servers and everything in between there. They just see a wall of encrypted packets. And that's allows you to safely serve on. Public wifi? No, having your data stolen. It's the number one VPN service. Rated by tech radar comes to the thirty day money back guarantee, and it's cheap this level of security is cheap less than seven bucks, a the people. And you know, if you want to do something like take a look at Canadian curling sites that are geo blocked from the United States, you can pretend to be in Canada or any of the number of other countries. So you can take a look at what's going on there. Protect your online activity today and find out how you can get three extra months free with one year package at express VPN dot com slash twitch. That's xpress. VPN dot com slash twitch for three extra months free with a one year package. Visit express VPN dot com slash twitch. To learn more insecure. Your packets people you're responsible for your safety on the internet and VPN's a nice way to do it. And thanks to express the PIN dot com slash twitch for their supports of this week in computer hardware. You turn around and there's a fifteen terabyte hard drive. Are you excited? Mr malvano. I mean, I'm excited for hard drives in general. I'm not excited personally. Because this is a this fifteen terabytes. Yes. But it's relying on what's called singled magnetic recording specis meant for really meant for data center type places not just in the respect of. Oh, it's a super durable hard disk meant for data center. You could totally use it in your home. Nass. No, this is host managed SM are which means that you basically need special software or yourself were on the host or the server needs to be coded to take advantage of this particular writing method. So whenever you're doing a rights to an SM are hard disk it needs to be more sequential. Right. You can't just write things to random places on one of these it really doesn't like it. And the performance would would really not be that great. But as long as you're writing sequentially, you can store, you know, per the press release and stuff they were saying, you know. Ninety five percent. More data roughly on SM marvez, your standard like perpendicular, recording drives that you can do random things on just fine. So where the standard drives fall right now from Western Digital is a twelve terabytes. So if you want like, a regular style hard disk that you know, that's the highest they go I think it has to be an enterprise drive though, right now, I don't think they make twelve terabyte red or anything like that. So. Yeah. I mean, good specs just usually these drives are like, lower power style drives. But these particular ones the h c six twenty ultra star is a seventy two hundred pm Dr implying that you know, he'd get faster sequential and faster seek times because west time waiting on the the data to circle around the disk and make it to the the read head. And. Yeah, I mean, we're we're talking on the podcast last night. There's probably one of the last two drives we're going to see or less like major announcements we should see before we start seeing some form of what's called mamber, which is microwave assisted recording coming out of Western Digital since they briefed us on that like a year back, and it was supposed to be air quotes coming soon not here yet. But they're probably just still trying to develop the the media to be able to take advantage of being able to write to smaller and smaller areas on the desk. But the whole shingling thing is it's literally just like your roof shingles on your house right there sort of overlapped on each other. That's what the name is for. It's you as it turns out, you can you can read from a narrower track. Then you can write to when you right? There's just this limit where it's it's the the magnetic manipulation of the domains on the on the Potter's it just it's wider than we can read currently. So take advantage of that. You're just kinda like lay the tracks slightly overlapping slightly slightly. Usually there has to be a gap between them. So you go from that to just well, don't worry about the gap. Turns out that's about twenty five percent worth won't be hold. That's how you get your difference in in the capacity. So few few take out that twenty five percent worth of a gap and sort of turned it into actually overlapping slightly. Then all you have to do when you come back later on to read it as just kind of shifted a little bit to one side. So that, you know, you're, you know, you're reading the track the earlier one not the one that's intentionally slightly overlapping it from you know, the next circle around the desk. So. Pretty simple concept that just requires more care because you can't just then insert data into the middle of that. Because now you're going to risk overlapping something from the other side, and now serves nothing left in the middle or very, you know, just a really thin sliver of data left in the center there for you to read. So you know, that would just throw a wrench in the works and just wasn't work properly. Yeah. Yeah. Good stuff. Good to see the capacities going up. Eventually, it just means that there will eventually be thirteen or they're probably going to skip thirteen because I notice they kind of did right notice. There's a there's a twelve terabyte regular Dr. There's a fourteen there was a fourteen terabyte. Now, there's fifteen terabytes. So they're doing the elevator button trick nobody wants to release a thirteen terabyte hard disk. As it turns out, you're trusting your date on this thing. Maybe not don't go with a superstitious unlucky number with the size that capacity. Oh, my goodness in the ever continuing saga of blockchain the future in you. Ibm Seagate's have teamed up to tackle hard-drive fakes with block China. That's Nikila de writing up at coin dot com. Short version is essentially they're going to log IBM Seagate are gonna log Seagate who's drives on the IBM blockchain platform and the goal is to keep counterfeits data centers are in pretty much the entire supply chain. I thought was kind of fun because you know, we're not talking about banana coin here. But we're talking about an actual company with an actual product trying to secure an actual supply chain bigger news. Probably in the enterprises week, fifteen turbine ultra stars aside is AMD showing off his into based epic Rome server processor. Which is particularly cruel because until tease the forty eight core Zeon on Tuesday, and then AMD just a couple of days later. There will actually the next day AMD shows off a sixty four core. Second John epoch server processor, which if you can do basic math has lots more cores than the Intel part. So it does. And. Yeah. Even though we even though we have no confirmation on this at all. But I would imagine some improvements there to the fabric that kinda ties all those course together. Because now they this is another generation of this and kind of one of the downsides to the current generation AMD parts with many many cores and having a Infinity fabric tying them altogether has been basically higher latency, right? There's there's more hops that the information has to make within the package of the of the CPU. And that's just the way to some highly seasonal agencies, generally a bad thing. When you're waiting on information. It's kind of like stalled the CPU and has nothing to do. And until the the new information comes in. So I'm guessing. That they've made some improvements there. I have nothing to back that up. But I would just I would be shocked if they if they didn't because that was really kind of like the that was the main achilles heel of the current platform improve that you're going to improve a lot of other things are just naturally gonna go faster. You know as a as a result of that. Yeah. So one would definitely help. And also, hey, like that's a pretty small process know that they're on. Yeah. Yeah. They say seven nanometer. Both on seven nanometer in one episode. Yeah. But where's? But then, where's where's until what the seven nanometer like what the heck or at least ten or? Yeah. So. They got catching up to do. I guess I like cats. I don't know until a habit of doing this leapfrogging thing. Right. They're like they're like a big machine Mikhail move, slowly sometimes. But then when they do make the move it's like this big swift just swath of a move. Sometimes just kind of like you see my pain express takes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is my pay expression is my reactions to you're still enduring hope that Intel's going to leapfrog everything it's a possibility. I'm not holding my breath unless they start. I don't I don't think it's going to happen. Like in the near term under saying, if you go my history, the kind of you know, they get they they get it handed to them for years. And then all of a sudden somehow there in the lead again on like everything, and then, you know, everybody else kind of leapfrogs them again. And it's just this give and take kind of back and forth thing if you're kind of curious. I'm just I'm just glad you know, competitions. Good. Right. So if AMD's eventually gonna be wiping the floor with them with processors on smaller nodes, and hopefully higher yields and all these other things then that just means that the prices are going to go down overall and computes going get cheaper. And just better for you. And me, right. Yeah. It doesn't matter. Yeah. I was going to say there's an interesting when you start looking at where chip design is going in the future. There's nice article by Tom Simon nights of wire to keep pace with Moore's law. Chip makers turn to chip Litz. And that last year's epic processor head Ford ship-lifts, essentially four components kind of combined on the die. And this this last round was eight and. It's interesting when you're looking at the whole idea of advancing advancing the performance. You know, things are tough, and and this article heavily quotes. Mark paper masters, the CTO at AMD, and it's a really interesting. Look, these chip Litz where you know to keep it simple, quote, says wired something like high-tech, LEGO blocks, unquote. And I think you know, certainly AMD's obviously moved in that direction Intel seems to be moving in that direction. More low end on a Cero a somewhat less less expensive end. Right. Where they where they combine the Intel CPU aimed GPU. It's really kinda curious to watch. How every time we think that the advancement. You know, we, you know, maybe this is maybe this is the the leap that until will come out of nowhere. They'll figure out a way to create chips. They want using you know, chip blitz. But it does it makes as long as you can interconnect them in a way, that's a fish int-. And and performance writing. You know, then it makes a world of sense. Because now, I mean, you again, you look at that AMD part, and you've got eight processing, you know, small chips on there. Right. And then you've got something in the middle of the ties it all together and deals with memory control and things like that. Which is actually not even on the seven nanometer process. I think that's still fourteen but all those outer those outer eight dies on there. Those are all doing all of you know, that's what constitutes your sixty four cores there. They're all kind of mixed in there. So if you think about it, just you're just trying to make something that has sixty four cores what one of the odds that all sixty four cores are going to be perfect right out of the you know, right out right on the wafer. They're probably not going to be you know. And so it only makes sense if you as you're trying to go higher and higher core counts. You kind of need the to divide the dies up a little bit. So that you're kind of spreading out. Okay. Now, you have only got so many transistors here of what you got failure. And if you have a failure, and there's a bad die. So be it. It didn't take. Sixty three other CPU cores with it right in the process. Because that's you know, that's that's the realism of it. If you tried to make sixty four core chip, and it was all on one die. All it. Takes us something bad on one of them. And now, it's not a sixty four courtship anymore. Now, you have to sell it as something with fewer unite to flip some fuses on the on the, you know, the core programming of that die and turn it into something that has less cores on it. And then you're not able to sell that as part with the maximum number on there. Yeah. It just makes it just makes more sense, especially it makes it way more flexible for AMD moving forward to because they're already kind of doing this with thread ripper and rising and whatnot. But like if you have like this universal chip Berlet kind of core package thing, then you can make a four core system. You can make an eight core system. Right. You could just okay. Well, we'll just make different interpose reboard there and just have a different different configuration. And we'll use fewer of these of these smaller chips on there, and we'll just make all the different kinds. And then we only have to focus our effort on the design of that one particular kind of die. Right. And and put put all your eggs in that basket and make that thing is optimized as you possibly can. And then you're getting that benefit, regardless of which form, you're putting it all. And it's just a matter of can you connect them in those different ways to work in a server, and they'll go all the way down to like a desktop and mobile. The demand for power keeps moving forward. Chip vendors figure out ways to make it happen. Yeah. Actually, I'm really curious to Intel does with this because they seem to they've certainly embraced the basic concept. I'm kind of curious if we're going to do something to get around there. Stymied attempts to drop the fourteen data meters. It's exciting. And it's interesting to watch. Cepsa this week in computer hardware, brought to you by on deck on deck is one hundred percent committed to small business owners with fast, easy, tailored financing. Your time is valuable right and money is also valuable and getting money should not be along dramatic toward up. Terrible. Just long experience right with on deck. They're trying to get you funding in his fast. It's twenty four hours term loans up to a half million dollars lines of credit up to one hundred thousand dollars, none of which require business collateral. The application process is simple. You can apply online or by phone. 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H we wanna thank on deck for the support of this weekend. Computer hardware? Goodness. Like, the idea that loans are getting less traumatic. I also like the idea. I'm we what am I saying? This is one of his best friends moved the best friend doesn't do Email does texting. And suddenly after years of denying my by son of phone of his own because all the other kids have one. So I do the ipads to to my old iphone? We do we do Android phone in anti visions of eleven year old child up until four AM mine crafting and playing all toes adventure. So I was I ducked into tar Jay biscuit before midnight as I often do because they're open and very little else is around here and found a knock ya thirty three ten which ladies and gentlemen looks a lot like the Nacchio's of our youth. And also just because I'm a meat old, man. The. Having my son learned how to text using t- nine. I think will encourage a certain amount of discipline and the brevity in his text messages, but it's a phone that does text messaging. I believe it has snake on it. There's a particularly awful two megapixel camera. That reminds me a lot of the very first Nacchio camera phone that Leo showed on the screen savers about eight thousand years ago. They are colorful, and they're pretty slick the Amazon reviews on these really funny. There's a lot of one star reviews. I think in part because a people couldn't get the color they want and be it's not a dual sim device. Most of the international versions of these compact will Simms, and if you're thinking about like, oh, I'm going to co a cello or I'm going to burning man. And it just I I'm terrified for my thousand dollar flagship phone. This is a pretty you know this. This is a pretty easy substitution the battery life is pretty phenomenal. Because it's not doing much, you know, the battery like my son's getting a couple of days out of it before you recharge, its micro USB, not USB see. But it's also fairly inexpensive. It's not a Nanno SIMS. He might eat an Anna Cima dapper, if you're currently running a flagship, and you want to stuff your want to stuff your sim card into this. But there's Nick a timeless classic of over. There was but I was surprised if you're looking for a cheap temporary phone sixty bucks is about as cheap as you're going to get and, you know, you're not going to have to worry about a a Android invitation of questionable functionality, and and even more questionable security, but and it's fun. It feels good in the hands. Gotta replaceable battery just the thing if needed cheap phone, and you can deal with the emotional trauma of not having Android are IOS, which for some of you would be pretty traumatic. Just don't expect to take a lot of great photos with it. Just because we just want to point out that non apple watches are still available fossil sport. They've got a new basically debut in a new smart watch their sport smartwatch with aware. Thirty one hundred chip on the where operating system so Android wearables, not dead. And so run of the Snapdragon thirty one hundred chip six different colors in forty one millimeter forty three millimeter sizes, and I think they actually have straps long enough to fit my wrist, which is always the giant question, Mark, but integrated heart rate, sensor three hundred million power batteries that are claiming all day battery life NFC GPS kind of very curious to see how it works, right? Spotify new light built in but it's nice to see more activity in the Android side Twitter feed five dollars. Online or at your local fossil retail location in your favorite mall. Watches though, it's not. It's tempting it. It's it's you know it. My problem is still that so many of these a lot of the smart watches. Don't have a strap that will actually reach all the way around my wrist comfortably in the in the unequivocally random notes ten is now available on all windows. Ten P C's. You can download it from the Microsoft store just wanted to leave that out there because I actually have been I've been using the neck years or be. The thing makes me laugh so hard, you know, the the whole idea that net gear actually, integrated what they call the orbit voice, which is one of their wifi routers for or be mesh system, but it's gonna Harmon cardon design speaker inside of it, and it works with Amazon ale ES, a I apologize for saying the alias a word out loud before not the best speaker of heard but pretty phenomenal. And you know, for the fact that it's built into essentially a router. And it is living in the garage. And I gotta say it is rather bumped up the performance of the internet in the garage since I was normally just using WI fi from the neck your orbi in the back of the house. Although the fact the net year or be in the back of my house could reach like, you know, twenty five yards and several layers of sheet rock in construction material and still get decent. Speeds is still pretty impressive to me. But AOL say just popping up everywhere kits. Yeah. On windows. I wonder what the compatible device has to be for it to use the wake command like if you just can you just have a PC with a microphone on it. And just some some PC's will actually laptops, a played around with will actually respond to alien say commands while the lid is closed you can send them up. So the Scooby and always listening mode. Yeah. Yeah. Should you? Find that concept attractive. I'm in find terrifying. But you know, I work with a lot of security professionals. So the paranoia it gets amped. PC per dot com. Ladies and gentlemen. Alan Tana's home base on the internet. The home of most of his work any anything coming up. You guys can tease just record a another mailbag video. So we try to do these mailbag videos every week, and, you know, people didn't questions and one of us will grab the list and try to go down there. And usually I try to grab the list, if it's you know, storage Centric group of questions, you know, but try to get some interaction going there other than that, you know, we're still still making the doughnuts, can you know, review and CPS and g views, and I'm reviewing SSD's trying to think of what's coming up still working on the crucial P one piece ran into a couple of snags that I've been working with them on to try to recreate a possible bugged, but it was only on the smallest capacity of the drive. Probably because my test is just kind of being a little bit too hard on it. Sure. Macaque tests you being my test was being mean, I can blame it on my test. Sorry, it just you know, it'd be up for several hours in a row and. We'll see anyway. And that was that's a p wants one of those Q Elsie. As as with an see cash tries to hide the the poor right performance of rock ULC is curiously only goes like fifty per second rights. It's like USB drives peak. But the idea is that you have a bunch of LCD to try to mask all that. You don't have to you know, average person never sees that solar speed. Yeah. I mean, you know, it's if you're just using it like a regular person and not beaten up like me, it'll be just fine. You know? And those drives are the pricing is pretty good on them as you could find him as the thing. Same kind of deal with the Intel sex sixty p which is like the sister SSD to that p one. They announced it price looked good. Then you just couldn't find anywhere. So I guess I guess that's your choice you either get too good to be true pricing that you can't find or. The pricing is higher and you can't find it. Yeah. So much to look forward to store story of story of the St. life. I guess well, I don't know. It's a good time to us as a lot of good SSD's luggage pricing on that. And they do seem to right after we talked about the BP X pro last week. It went on sale for like another fifty bucks off of those prices. Oh, wow. Yeah. Like, the the one terabyte was like an even two hundred bucks. I think and and along those lines basically it was like twenty cents a gig. If not nineteen cents a gig sale-pricing, even further undercutting the equivalent nine sixty Yvo from Samsung, which the beef. Yikes pro actually, it was like beating in in a a good few areas of our test, suite. So definitely we're taking a look at if the sales now, it's still going. I wouldn't be surprised if it goes on sale again because you know, it's it's about it's that time of year. Right. Coming up on all the cyber the cyber 's in the Mondays and Fridays, and I'm just laughing up a minimum is on right now. And and their their standards at three assist you drive. The what they call the super boot to their one hundred twenty eight or one hundred twenty gigabyte drive is twenty three dollars. Yeah. Yeah. I mean that was just meant to be a budget. Just hey, I just want to boot from from an SSD, right? How how low can I go as far as price goes? Yeah. I mean, that's that's a really low price now granted small capacity, but to get any SSD at all for that price. Pretty that's like thumb drive pricing. And it's backed up to to fifty nine dollars ninety nine cents for the one terabyte version. Okay. Yeah. But it was a good few days there. I think it was like an even two hundred it was like right after the last which I think that went to which I was like was like dang it. But, you know, look out for it to happen again, if they did it just now, I'm sure they do it again around all the, you know, all the crazies ELS. And if you don't need envy, me, I mean, you know, you're looking at the the standard one terabytes, you know, m dot to PCI express like three point zero selling for two hundred twenty bucks for one terabyte of storage on the dot to stick. Two to SATA. Yeah. You gotta be careful. What those make sure your motherboard is compatible. Always make sure your motherboard is compatible. Because some of the newer ones are getting to the point where they don't even care about linking the satellites through any sort of multiplexing capability or just, you know, the mother were makers, it's it's to the point where the dot to Sata's becoming the rarity and everything is just envy. Emmy EPCO express man, the crucial AmEx five hundred the five hundred gigabyte version of selling for eighty two bucks. Eighty three bucks. The one terabyte version is a hundred and fifty five dollars as at the end not to form factor. No, that's that's right. Your doors? Yeah. Two and a half inch still going to be phenomenally fast. Yeah. I mean, you know, it's it's still a going to be good responsive thing. Yes envy. Emmy, you know, those SSD's faster straight line speed. There's more convenience. You don't have to hook up cables. You're just it directly on your motherboard as long as you have the sought for it. But on the flip side, you can get those Saturday devices for for you know, for cheaper. If you're willing to deal with the the little bit of cable management and just having a place to mounted on your system. Heck, it's SSD. Don't even really have to mount it like for the longest might had trauma of running a single Sadah cable. Well, you know. Kennan? I did that build like a week and a half or two weeks ago that micro IT X build and everything just barely fit in that system. A we were thinking goodness that there was an SDS part of that Bill because by the time, we got to the end you're not even know where we would have put like Ken had said. Yeah. Just leave plug in the ad power cable into the power supply. Just so that we don't have to try to worry about plugging it in later, and it ended up being this huge pain in the butt of this extra cable that we had to try to find a place to tuck in to some nook and cranny along with the other cables for the system because it was just such a tight build. But yeah, I mean, you know, most average Joes just had like a your regular old case. I mean, heck my PC case from my desktop system down here is like a, you know, an older unle- aluminum case from probably over a decade ago. Like, no for standard standard size case, probably just a single stock as these nothing. Make you also the picture of a case they'll make him very happy. Just some enormous case Patrick would have like some enormous. You know? But I do have one of those cases that the one I used for the monster, which I'm replacing the motherboard inside of which is a nightmare. Because literally there's I wanna say seven optical drives inside of that system. Because of course, the, you know, the the SATA ports on the new board just moved enough to make everything not fit. Of course. Of course. Of course that works. Then a show crucial the one terabyte three nand VM API to us SD two hundred twenty bucks, which one which model. CT one thousand p one s s the eight. Yeah. That's that's the p one I was just talking about. Oh, good. Good. Budgets. Actually, sell some Abba. Especially if you're just doing a regular PC stuff like, you know, put it in a laptop. I mean, yes, the straight QC speed if he were somehow able to exhaust the cash it will go slow, but what drives like the P one do is the more space. You have on the drive. It does dynamic the amount of cash is not a fixed size. It just doesn't dynamic thing. So if you had a p one with a one terabyte you're looking at. Right. If it was empty, you'd have a couple of hundred gig worth of SLC because it just puts it all in as Elsie mode or most of it. Because there's just all this extra space, and then as you fill it it has to start taking away SLC and converting it into QC. And you know, just so it has room to store the the bulk data, but as long as you keep some breathing room on those drives you'll have plenty of cash available. I think it I think it will always have at least like five gay or something like that. You know? So you need to has what the prices on like four terabyte esus these are coming down. But let's not go down the rat hole. Because there's still, you know. For chair by is still paper entire PC. But yeah, I it's still expensive. I mean, even if the cost per gig is is cheap. If you if you start multiplying by four thousand, you know, it's still money. Money doesn't funny habit of adding up after time. Letting gentlemen, s Mr. Alvin Tano PC per dot com. You can find his work on stores and all the other things at PC per dot com. I'm Patrick Dorton. You can find the over a t e k t h I n g that's texting dot com. The weekly show a is, Shannon. And of course, I get deep into the home theater. Audio experience with Mr Robert Heron, you can find that over at av ESE, L dot com and hope to see there in the future. And as always you can tweet at valve, Anton or at Patrick Norton. If you got a tech question for us that you want us to answer on twitch or any of the other things we we talk about. But right now like he talked to us about hardware Melvin Tano or at Patrick Norton or the place to do it. Seriously. Thanks so much for joining us. If you've never been here before we go to Twitter dot TV slash TWA, C H when I say been here. I mean, listen to the podcast before. But if you go to Twitter dot TV slash twitch. You'll find Oliver older episodes information on how to subscribe organise listened to him right there, Syria. Asli? Thanks for being here. Lady gentlemen, we do this for you. Let us know what you want to talk about. We'll do our best to point the show and that direction with that. I'm Patrick, and I'm Allentown catch you next week on twitch.