Kevin Thompson: The Hands We Shake and the Money We Make
The welcome to the influence or networking secrets podcast. This is the gathering place of radically generous entrepreneurs where you learned to master the three M'S of servant leadership in business, and in life are interviews with the world's most successful leaders and entrepreneurs will help you become a magnetic source of guidance wisdom and accountability. You'll become a magnanimous source of generosity fellowship and coaching and you'll become a marketable source of entrepreneurship, small business and social innovation. This episode is sponsored by the book business beyond business. Get your free copy today by going to the Paul S Edwards dot com and signing up for our mailing list or text, the letters are GE two six six eight six six. Now let's begin. Here's your host Paul Edwards. Radically generous entrepreneurs, we have a master, in our midst from just up the road in the other Arlington, not DC and not Texas. But right here in Washington, it's a privilege to welcome. Kevin Thompson to the influence or networking secrets podcasts, Kevin. Thanks so much for joining us. My pleasure. Paul happy to be here. Great to have you with us. And there's a funny little back story here for the because this is actually the first time Kevin and I have ever spoken to each other apart from instant messengers. And we got acquainted through rob Kaas Berg. I'm in his bestseller publishing mastermind. And he told me to start paying attention to what you're up to. So that's, that's how I suddenly appeared out of the woodwork. One day started commenting on your stuff. Rob is a great guy. I love raw Robert, but he's, he's doing great stuff over their bestseller. Publishing to offer for sure. Yeah. It's, it's been wonderful for my book in for learning all the PR stuff that I'm learning now so terrific. Another another shameless plug for others, which both you and I are really good at doing and. What I wanted to. I wanted to give you a little bit of a overview of what we're gonna talk about here Kevin because I've, I've covered this topic before with other guests, but I believe in attacking topic from several different angles. Okay. And then whoever's listening will have suddenly, it'll suddenly catch catch fire with them, and they'll be able to replicate. It. So I called this the hands we shake in the money we make. And I read recently, I was going through a book by Daniel Lapin, rabbi Daniel Lapin called the business secrets in the bible. And he said that in ancient Jewish culture, the handshake symbolizes, how much more dynamic, and powerful, we are when there's more than one of us involved when there's at least one other person involves in. So all of a sudden as I was preparing for this, I thought about, you know, you and I are both heavy on building relationships establishing rapport with people, you know, just dumping value into their lives and all that. I want to hear just if you could start with a little bit about your background, and how that exploded your business, and how you came to use it so effectively to spike growth for others. Sure interesting. You talk about handshaking pretty much. I mean at this point, I've worked to get on over six hundred different collaborative and strategic partnerships and all. All, but two of them were done on nothing more than a conversation and a handshake and a lot of times it was virtual handshake, because we weren't even I in doing, you know, having that conversation was the detail, and, and the only reason even I two of my partners over the years. Have they just wanted me to sign an agreement and all that, Mike? Okay. If that makes you more comfortable, fine. But everything else is just been done on a hint checked. And, you know, my, my introduction to the business world and the marketing world if you if you will was was Joe, polish all the way back in nineteen ninety seven when it's time I owned a cleaning and restoration business here in Washington state. I actually lived in Marysville. The time. I worked up prior to that. I worked for seven years as a commercial fisherman in Alaska to save up money to be able to start a business of my net and cleaning restoration was the business that I got into because I had met this guy in Seattle and from the outside looking in his his life, his business look pretty darn good. And I'm like, well, gosh, if that guy went so cannot, and so that, that was, you know what it was nothing more than that. I like to say that I had these Wafi aspirational goals, I wanted to change my community. What it wasn't. I decided I make a buck. Yeah. And, and within the first year of being in that business. I opened the doors on business ninety six within the first year I had gone through about two hundred thousand dollars that I'd save up and I still was not showing a profit. And what's interesting is when I quit fishing in Alaska to start my business. I was married at the time to my wife, she was less than the Asiatic. In fact, she told me she like Kevin, you're just a blue collar guy, you know, the first thing about writing a business and, and you just need to keep fishing in Alaska. And I was like, Nope, I'm gonna do this in when I insisted a long story short, she opt for divorce left me. Oh, wow. But about a year later thinking to myself, gosh, maybe she was right. Maybe I don't have what? In so right. I saw a trade Assad trait magazine for the industry, and there was this article nearby. This guy, Joe, polish and, and what he was sharing an article really resident he offered this free reports like all this phone number goddess rated part red suit that it was about twenty four page report invested in his system dot Joe's. How data join us is coaching group for cleaning industry in all that he helped me turn that business around and over the next three years, that's exactly what we did. And so, I'll to say that, you know, then I, I ended up creating this little website as an extension of that business, probably one of the ugliest websites, that was ever on the internet called get mold solutions. And I decided when I first found out about the internet. I, I was like gosh, wouldn't it be cool if I could use the internet and use technology to not just have a local business, but to be able to have some sort of an impact be on rand local area. Would it be? I can have a nationwide or even a worldwide packed. And that's what that website allowed me to do. And it was really excited. We started building a subscriber list of people from around the country and around the world talking about mold of all. And, but we got that website where it was produced in an additional about twelve thousand dollars a month for for the company. Joe was like, Kevin, why don't you come down here? This was in two thousand three's. Why don't you come down here and share at the annual event, Sean everybody what you're doing with your website? And I was that sounds like and that was the beginning of my very first strategic partnership, and it just happened. So organically as Joe was, I kept your cool step with that website. People here would really appreciate here. I got all these big common. So he had an audience. So people I had knowledge and information insight he thought they would benefit from, and he's much come down share. And I was like, okay, and now when you do he's, I'd be sure, and take the time to document what you do. And how you knew it had put into a course because there's going to be a certain percentage of the people here that, once they hear from you, they're going to want more help from you, and you want to be prepared to offer that to. I came prepared with that an MBA completely honest. I, I, I was so Doug nervous for my dot they're it'd get ready to take that stage. Like, I'm all this stuff going through my head. What if I let John, what if they don't like relapse here? I've never done this before. But in the end, it was a great experience. And, and we ended up some thirty five thousand dollars worth of that coach was just like yeah. That's what I said, why that's a whole lot more revenue than I make in a day in my cleaning restoration. No kidding. Yeah. And, and you know that I didn't even realize what I didn't even understand the west right where the impact of what we just done. I mean this was just two guys. You know, me Joe, I, I love Joe and just had so much respect. Neckbrace brand re offered to have come down. I was white. I just help Joe added height, you knew this. That'd be great. And that was, it was nothing more than that. But afterwards, you know, looking back from that experience I was looking at what we did there by combining our efforts in our resources look at what we were able to do to get that was kind of my entrance into this whole idea of strategic, partnering had just unfolded, so organically, that I was, you know, I wanna do a lot more of that. And here it is all these years later in a lot of water under the bridge, and a whole lot of relationships Reiter. We spent a pretty cool time along the way so well, because look at the power that, that, that, that introduction. Right. You know, Joe has the audience he introduces you audience respects entrust? The host in here comes the guest so automatically that scribes a certain degree of credit to the guest, the guest presents useful information that the audience. Wants to know and bingo success. It's, it's, it's, it's tantamount to like a you know, a well run advertising campaign. Exactly. They return. Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of like, what you shared with rob you in our mutual friend, rob who just at some point suggestion to you. Hey, you should follow cabinet. Check him out. And because you trust raw, you're like, okay, I respect, rob. I trust rod, and he would waste my time. And so I'm gonna go check out this covering just because somebody you trust. And so have that trust then gives transferred to us and over that in a huge thing that is a huge thing. And of course, by the same token, I it's something that we was looking for a week, we never want to abuse either. You know, we want your mind goes, I know like with Joe. I mean, I'm sure I wanted to provide value to his audience that I wanted to I wanted to do right by Joe is well, you know. Well, so from like, what you said there and. That sort of segues into what I was gonna ask you next which has to do with so from my personal experience. I use this principle extensively in a crowded crowded field. I was in the insurance business for several years. And for me, this whole separate category of building relationships and offering expertise in an area where I didn't actually hold the title but I had the knowledge was away of totally distinguishing myself from my competitors. You know, here in Olympia, Washington, there's got to be at least five hundred different places. You could buy insurance from, you know, when you came at the internet, all the different major carriers that you recognize and then all the brokers, and all that kind of thing. And then, so, so what I did the put me in a class by myself. One of the things I did was teaching courses to entrepreneurs and, and sales people on how to build relationships, not how to, you know how to ensure properly against an accident, right? Is this has this worked similarly for you? Because the way I see the way I perceive you now is more like a you're almost like in a consulting role, but I can't I can't say for sure I, I'd like to hear in other words, what exactly nowadays now that you've built off of that nowadays. What is it really that you're doing what's the business model there? And how does that are you in a class by yourself? Are you still needing to distinguish yourself from others? So we got two different business models. Now. A couple of years ago. So I've been I've been doing the strategic partnerships for well over a decade now and that course that I originally created back in two thousand three we updated on how many times over over the ten twelve year period, but we ended up over little Rebekah my, we sat ended up selling over sixteen million dollars worth of that course and the ongoing coaching that went along with that. And so for longtime that that was my whole business. And, and then I ended up at some point you know what it was Bill Harris. He was one of my partners that in two thousand thirteen to fourteen him, and I were having a conversation Bill and I had done a lot sweep the very first partnership, human. I ever did was so successful and he was the first one where I ever got connect with, who had a business that was so much bigger than. And, and people had told me, not having you'll, you'll never get intention of a guy like Bill, just sipping because you're not playing on the same business lakeville. And he he had a company called center point research institute and had been established in in. I get what people were saying there, because like this JV world is joint venture world, this, you know, that there is a lot of that kind of stuff that goes that you do have to have businesses of similar size in audiences of similar signs in order to make it work because lifetimes there pro, it's opera you, you promote be kind of thing. And if somebody has a much bigger business much bigger audience. Well, then it, it just doesn't work so, well, but thing is, is when we figure out how weak could be observance to them said now that, that whole thing doesn't matter. And I never really liked those conversations. Anyway, about this scratch my back. I'll scratch your back thing because the customer, an end user gets lost in that kind of a discussion. It's always been about how can we how can we do something great together that will ultimately serve the people that get served through as doing what we're gonna do to get? So, you know, by by doing this kind of thing. I just ended up building a whole lot of relationships with a whole lot of mazing entrepreneurs over there. Somebody many of them, I never parted with never did anything with a Bill was one of those guys that I just really connected with. We got to partner together just amazing day that we create a lot of revenue together, and he was the one that suggests the Kennedys that you're right. You are absolutely brilliant at creating relationships with people, and you do it in a way that I've never seen anybody else do a you're just you've just got this natural gift at doing this, and you should start helping other entrepreneurs by showing them how to do that. And so that's what started be going down this path. And of course, my first knee-jerk reaction res-, like, well, I don't know how to teach this, this kind of do it. And I, I didn't think about, like, well, how do you doing? I just I just do it. I just like talking with entrepreneurs but once built put the bug in my ear now. I started looking at well what do you do? You know, and the way I looked at it was like, if you're going to get your best friend, how to do is what would you tell him to do what would you tell first second third? What what do you do? And I just really had to analyze that. And so we started I kind of helping entrepreneurs that way, Allenstein now having this thing called the relationship accelerator network where we can help entrepreneurs, what their business by by making the right kind of connections for them. And then I do consulting with clients soon. As far as helping them not just build relationships, but us strategic partnering and be intentional about it in their biz, because like you mentioned before is when we're doing advertising marketing and going out to prospects who, who don't know, us from Adam, you know, there's that trust building process and you know every every. Every business has it that they have that trust really process that could take, you know, a month or two eight, depending on what's going on the sale cycle might take a year, ten years and whenever that sales cycle is, but when you are able to like you said, get an endorsed introduction from somebody who has already created pressed with their people, and now that trust it's carried over the will now that cycle about sale cycle, or that trust building site. Now it goes for my best. This is. And that's what I help people with. That's all I help you with his shortly. That trust building in sales cycle. So you're, you're so one of the things and there's probably several components of this. But one of the things that I've learned from a couple of mentors of mine is you're basically offering speed. Yes, big be forget to the results, much faster. What would or what would our Ganic take you potentially year to do? You can shrink that down to month or so. Yeah, I get it. I'll go back to the example of rob again. You know. And I don't remember exactly how you me if you just sent me a friend request on Facebook, but, you know, it's very interesting by anybody I have ever got connect with, if they came to me, you, have you came to me, and said, you're, hey, you don't know me, but we have a mutual friend in rob Cosby, and he told me that I should have a conversation radio. The reshi. Talking. It's no each other rug display. I'm all about that now because we have this mutual friend, and you're telling me, the rob said, we should talk. We're guess what? Now, I don't, I don't have to know who you are the fact that we have this mutual friend that I have a lot of respect for that. I know you have a lot of respect for will now the doors wide open for us to have conversation. We don't even need to know each other. And not only that I'm excited to get two million just because we have this, awesome mutual friend, that we both respect. No. That's the that's the hands you shake. And then some somewhere down the line, you get the money you make. That's right. That's right. Yeah. I like it. I like it. Okay. So I'm I've got show notes linking to your website. I want people to come and check you out, but you made a statement I really like this. I wanted to read it back to you. And then ask you a question about it. On, on the what is it maximum maximum shoot? I've all of a sudden I'm having a mental block maximum results dot com. Right response, maximum and response. The response dot com. Yep. Maximum dash response. Yes, you said, relational capital is far more valuable than financial capital and relational capital leads directly to financial capital. Just the same point, we were just making their with rob. I have a slightly different way of wording it, I say, monetize your magnetism, right. And I talked about talked a lot about this in the first chapter in my book. You shared some stories here. What's, what's a recent example, maybe that you could talk about where? From, from the kind of report that you, you, you have built up with so many different people. Now you in almost leads straight into. The monetization side of it. I'll give you a perfect example, because it just happened last month. I met a gentleman online, on Facebook as named Chris, Chris lob. We have some mutual friends on Facebook and stuff. I've been kind of following him a little bit. And I might just like I really, really liked this guy like stuff. He's put now and I'm like, I like to get to know him a little bit. And so sending a message and to say you know what Chris, I'm working on some goal staff, and I really appreciate being able to share it with you, because I appreciate your, your thoughts, and we up making time to talk. And I was actually getting ready to put on an event here in Washington state. I I'm not a friend of mine who's got a sixty five foot boat down at Seattle and he called me a couple of months ago that Kennedy's summertime his common man, and we hosted a big party on his boat, a couple of years ago, and he's like I wanna make the boat available. Let's get some cool, people together at invite him down at so, so I've been trying to put an event together. And so I was like thicker as. Mike. You invite Chris to this thing. Talk to him about it and stuff. And he's can't I'd love to come in that thing. But you know what? I'm getting ready to go to Hawaii. And plus he he lives down in uh South America. So not, not necessarily easy to get to Seattle. Thanks. What do you studies like man? Thanks so much for me, if they for the invite, and we ended up soccer to stop and just do the course that conversation he was like, heaven. I need to get you in front of my people. We need to do a training. Are you open to do it, something like that? And then you, you serve entrepreneurs I wide open to do that. And so within two weeks, we, we hosted a training for his faults, and Chris put put a couple of promo paces, not to let everybody know about it. We did this face behind for his fogs. And in, in that scenario, it was kind of a Cuban eight Chris was like your western puts precious together, and I'll ask questions. And I told him, I said, you know, you know, your audience really rouse, office questions together, and if you feel I should add anything else that we should discuss different kind of free flow it, and, and we'll do a training and just give guys some value in. And so we did that. And we even had some technical glitches because I say. South America, and he had some internet challenges the day we did that. But we still and in the end, I ended up picking up a client and a client value. I mean I it's when I'm doing client work. I mean it's, it's worthwhile for me for no doubt about it. So that was that was a big win. And, and that's just an example. Once again, the whole thing, just came about organically. We were just getting to know each other, and he was captured, would you be willing to do this? Like, sure that's right. I on the I love doing. I love talk and help them out and, and so, you know, just completely happened organically. I won't say that everything happens that way. But lot of times, I pretty intentional about this stuff. I mean I like I said I I love doing what I do. And of course, haven't experienced like that was Chris on. I mean I I love doing this. I want to do more of that stuff. And so people know when they ask you what, what are you, what are you working on I let them know about stuff like that. So that they desire, oh, maybe we should talk about doing something to. I remember that boats story. In fact, I remember commenting on it because I saw you posted about it on Facebook. Can you can you refresh my memory on what the what the whole idea there with the boat was because I was thinking about trying something like that down here in Olympia with the we have a yacht club here as well. Gotcha. Gotcha. Well, so okay, I'll tell you, I hosted an event at my home right here couple years ago. And we actually did too of a back to back a wanted, August one in September of that year. And, and I was just reaching accident entre preneurs that I knew that I really wanted to. What by because I'm like, yeah. I'm just like okay who I my whole purpose was digging get together some really awesome entrepreneurs who are doing great things and just get him in the same room. So they can meet each other and get to know each other in my theory is if you get the right, people that business is gonna come out of that. Soon. And, and so one of my friends that I invited was this guy. Jeff and Jeff runs a real estate company and he's a local here to be in Arlington and, and Jeff, Kevin. If you're invite be I in and he told me that, you know what he's like my friend, Michael, yet, you need to talk with Michael, because he would be a really great set for this. I only thing is I think he's in Bali right now. But let me connect you guys on Facebook and is open the door for you guys to have a conversation, and Michael, and I ended up talking about how me about a month later and on the day that we spoke. I mean just getting to know him a little bit. And once again, we had this mutual French in Jeff also us, just had all this respect an aberration for. And so it just opened the door wide for us to have a conversation. And I spoke with him. I don't know for about forty forty five minutes. And, and he's like, Kevin, if you're invite me he's like, I'm ended. I'm why I'm definitely invite you might love to have you join us. And and Michael is an Amazon salary. He runs a successful Amazon a business back that I won't talk about numbers. But he, he runs a very successful office. We hung up. He was telling me he's like he's like, my, my biggest concern cabin is honestly he's a I just don't know how I'm going to be able to contribute to the rest of the folks there. And in my comment was Michael, you know, the, the fact that, that's your biggest concern. It speaks volumes about who you are, and others can let you know, right now, you can let that go, you don't have to worry about it. You when you're here, it will unfold ill unfold perfectly and just let it go and just come here and just, just be in the moment. Stop. And he was like, okay fair enough. I agree with you on that. And you end up calling me two days late. And he's had cabbie thing. I've been thinking about this for two days and I know you know, you're you're up there in Arlington, and I'm down here in Seattle. And I don't know for the work if you think your folks would like or what have you, if you can figure out how to work in the event is at, but I got this sixty five foot boat down here. And, and in if you think your folks from like you can fit it in I'd like to off. For that up. You know, because August is a great time of year, and it's beautiful Seattle here, and I'd like to offer bought a week, this common hanging out here, the day, I could take everybody cruising around Seattle and stuff. And, and you know what's interesting is might my initial nature response. In a way, I would probably use to respond in the past would kind of, like, you know, like you're investing your time, and your finances, accommodate you don't you don't need to do that. And the worst thing that I could done for him because he had spent two days thinking about how can I contribute? And that's what he came up with. No. I just accepted that remind man that is awesome Baso, which let's figure out how to make this happen. And so we did he we had everybody when they flew in, they just just went down to Ballard. We got hung out there for all all the day in prison that he is the next or not that Amy came from my husband, we spent the next two days of Mike is here. So now might go, he loves doing it. He he loves hosting groups of entrepreneurs on his box. A kevin. If you know anybody that has a great group of entrepreneurs because I dislike hanging out with entrepreneurs man, he's by boat available to them. And, and he's I you just let them know about is. I don't want anything. I don't want anything for it. He's like, I'll make an available on how Trina well and, and they just come in and use the boat and I get a hang out and many that's his motivation for that. Yeah. Yes. And now he called money to do. Another 'nother thing on the boat. And my okay figure out how to do this. Let's doing. Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm it makes me curious. Because like like I said, we've got the yacht club down here and I know enough people here in business in Olympia, that I, I know somebody who knows somebody who's who owns one of them. Okay. Anyway, I, I can conspire with you about that later. But, but I just thought you know that gave me an idea that I never thought about doing doing a networking. I kind of a an opportunity, a gathering of entrepreneurs in that context, mostly because, you know this, the weather is, is not normally conducive to it. But if you do it in August. It's a great time. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. One of the thing you said, I'm glad you brought this up. I, I wanted to include a question about it, and I nearly forgot. But you've spurred my memory you mentioned the I read in your on your website that you used to have a lot more difficulty. Accepting generosity from people, you are totally good at giving it, but it coming in the other direction was like you were taken aback by whatever. Let's talk a little bit about that. What, what, what, what was the mindset shift for you? There. I'll tell you hit out this this half. That, that mindset shift took place, I can remember this vividly in two thousand twelve I, I was down in Texas visiting a good friend of my Jesse. And we, we started digging into this topic pretty dang and he starts asking me is that kept. He's like your when you get to somebody else who really appreciates it. How does that make you feel house us man Jesse has there's no better feeling in the world? And I love that field. And he's like, do you realize though, by you not openly, receiving from others? You are depriving them from that feeling that you just told me was the best feeling in the world. Now. Yeah. Well, I had never looked at it that way before as I was always like, oh, I don't want to bother people. I don't want to inconvenience them, you know, and even when people would ask me what can I do to help you I'm good. I'm good because bother you know, or God forbid that I would ask anybody for anything that I want. I would never do. But, but with Jesse and I started having this conversation. It really shifted my whole way of thinking and any went on, you know we start we said he's he's carries it. You know he's giving him a saving. It's kinda like breathing. You know. And if I were to ask you, what do you prefer better, breathing in reading out? And if you were to accidentally give me an answer, I would tell you great try doing only that for a while and see how far you get. Yeah. Yeah. It depends on what part of the breathing cycle, I'm in. But I prefer the other one. Yeah, that's right. That's right. And he's gotta do both. You gotta get good at both. He's your already great at giving. He's at. But you've gotta get just as good at receiving his well, it'll allowing other people to do for you and, and, and even asking and proactively asking for what you would because everybody around you Kevin. They know who you are. They already know who you are. I mean he's know anytime I talk with anybody, and your name comes up, he's like nobody ever says. Anything back about you? Everybody loves you because you have always been this giving generous guy who just wants to help other people, and he's like so that being the case and everybody already knows who you are is okay. To ask for what you want to, because you have built up all of this stored relationship capital and you don't even realize it, and you got all these people that are surrounding you that would gladly help you, if they just knew how, but you know what they don't know how because you even tell him why has you don't wanna bother them because you don't want to inconvenience them. And you're depriving every single one about from the feeling that you just told me was the best feeling in the world. He's, I start giving that let them have that fear led them have that feeling an experience that too, because you love it. They love it, too. And so that was a huge mindset show. Let me let me ask you a question about that kept 'cause 'cause one of the things that is troubling for me. I'm the same way. Right. But my, my client avatar, I call them the radically generous entrepreneur, and that's a projection of myself into the marketplace say, who identifies with that, right. Now, I'm I'm I would be a little bit may even more specific because people do nice things for me from time to time and I'm quite open to it. I'm you know I'll I'll I'll push it away at first. But if you know if, if they say something, like, don't hurt my feelings, and I'll be like, okay. Well, thank you. I can I can do that. Just more the social custom there. But what really? What I find really difficult is the ask in. It's not because I'm like I feel greedy or like I'm taking advantage of someone. It's just half the time. I'm not even sure what to ask for okay? You know, I'm like, like, if I knew I couldn't even tell you what if somebody asked me, what do you want me to do for you? I'm like I couldn't even tell you, I, I don't even know what, what I want you to do for me. I'm just I'm just happy to, you know to have the opportunity to be friends with you and, and all that. But I'm like, you know, I am. An and then, you know, but the problem with that, that is, that's all very nice, but the problem is, then you go home. And you face all of the difficulties of becoming an entrepreneur and getting a business going and learn in getting your name out there and all that, and you think I got to do it all myself. You know, that's the irony of, of being. So in, in such a haze often very often that, I, I don't even. I don't even know what to ask for so anyway, I just thought be curious to hear your thoughts on that. Yeah. So you and I can totally understand where you're coming from on that, Paul. Because you went with Jesse and I would I haven't that conversation two thousand twelve I was kind of in the same spot. You know, why do I ask for, you know, and, and so we need to get some clarity around what we want, and that's I will let you know, from talking with solo video preneurs over the years, that is the one big thing that pretty much every entrepeneurship is lacking is, is real clarity on what the heck they want, you know, where they wanna go all of that stuff. And until we have that how can we? How can we get it in? Yeah. So give you what one of the intentions were. I was talking with my daughter few weeks ago and stuff. And, and we were talking about how she was telling me Kevin you should start a podcast. Now my like I don't know if I want to do that, and she goes, why wouldn't you want to do that? She goes you love talking with entrepreneurs. Right. And I'm like, yeah. She goes, why wouldn't you wanna do a podcast. You're just gonna let you have more conversations only eight. Now she just going to record his all. And I'm like, you know, now that you think about it. And so now, I'm just like, okay, I do want to do a podcast. But, you know, whether I do apart caster, not what I knew I wanted to do is, I'm going to start interviewing so cool. Entrepreneurs and so I've done that. And as soon as I set the intention of I wanna do this now said, I mean, I remember the first conversation that came up a few weeks ago, the day after I had that conversation with Caitlyn I was talking with my friend Jeff hates. And we were we were just having a con. Mercedes catching up on some stuff, and I was like my gosh, Jeff I need to interview you and in the end, I was at the way that you are using strategic partnerships in your business is absolutely amazing as our just talk with you about that getting records the week and share with other people. And so if so, I haven't interviewed Jeff yet, but that's where the counter for next week, but I interviewed three other entrepreneurs on this subject of strategic partnering than the unique ways that they're using them in their business. And I've also been finding myself. I mean, I have I think, in my whole lifetime. I've been on maybe eight to ten podcasts in the last couple of weeks. I've been on like eight in the last couple of weeks. Yeah. Because I it it wasn't there. Now, is it helping me get in front of our people show? It's doing now but also the, the active just doing this, now having a conversation with new all. This is like so stimulating for me. I just robbed talking with other entrepreneurs. And so if it was nothing more than that, I'm, I'm, I'm liking. I'm wondering this stuff. And so, and what you'll see along the way is that because we're recording it, what we're doing is we're, it's like lighting. You know, it's like, lighting a thousand candles with one flame. Yeah. Right. And so we're going to spread other people get the eavesdrop on this, and then they begin it begins to circulate in their consciousness, in, I if you start the podcast governor, tell you this, you'll be, maybe you won't. I don't I don't know. I'm always shocked. The people come up and say, I've been listening to your podcast. And I just want to say you that's a fantastic show. I love I learned so much from it. And I'm like you listen. I'm sh- I never you never know who's listening, unless they tell you. And so you're walked through the crowd of people I go to church on the weekends. When people occasional person comes up and says, I've been listening to your podcasts. And I'm like, you know, I could be standing in a crowd full of people who listen to me. And I don't know it, you know. So it's, it's, it's magic that way. That's cool. That's cool. Yeah. Yeah. There was another. This was one of the thing I wanted to ask you about. So we both have that radically generous spirit. But you said this in an I kind of understand what you mean. But I'd like to hear you expound on a little bit. You say you wanna match that spirit with the right people, and that's where the magic begins to happen. I talk about it in chapter six my book. I talk about curing relationships, you know, choosing an picking and choosing the right. So let's just talk a little bit about what's your criteria for doing that. When you when you make a decision to invest or not to invest, whether it's time money. You know, talent whatever what's, what sort of governs your criteria there. So, you know, there's really only two things and yeah, there's a lot of people take about client avatar my friend Lennon partner. He he's really and teaching how to identify your ideal client habits, and he's got a process really in depth and I, I was. Fat joking with him not too long ago when we were talking has that, you know what? This is really cool. That what all he doesn't, I, I'm just one of these simple guys. You know, I always just looked at two things. Are they an entrepreneur who's doing really cool stuff through there is? I don't give a rip what their businesses. I don't care whether they run a man, my friend, Darrell runs a manufacturing business. I've got friends that are run run ad agencies. I've got friends that run speaking bureaus. What have okay what their business is? But, you know, they, they've got to a level where they're established that, you know, the and they also have a track record of getting great results for their clients. And then on the other side of the coin it goes back to this, this giving generous peace. You know, are they giving generous person who's, who's default position is that they just lead with a helping hand. That's just who they are in effect. That was the criterion when I when I hit those initial events at my home a couple of years ago. That's what I looked at is that when. I was looking at I who do you want to invite while that's that's who it was. It was people who, who had, you know, bright, businesses and a good track record of getting results for clients as well as they're just giving generous lead with a helping hand people. And I knew if you got people of that, caliber entrepreneurs of that caliber, who were that way you get them together in a room and magic is going to happen. And I, I don't wanna get like to wamu with this, because I've been tons of mastermind groups over the years, and I, I been in the sum for really long term. And I've been part of this one that I you know, it's always a great experience goer there. And the members of that group are just amazing entrepreneurs and the format of the group, just because of the win it starts in the attendees, share best practices in the goal of that is I, hey, I'm going to share which really working in my. Business. So that if you decide you want us this, your business that ill that's the whole goal. Maybe this can help you to. And so as a real that format just leads to talking about best practices. But what I wanted to do was because my belief is, is way. Don't get what we need when we. The setting isn't as good for getting what we really need win. The focus is on best practice, and we're and we're all having conversations. This is all the great stuff that's going on in our bits here. We really get the help that we need is by talking about where the fits hit the shape where things are not knowing. Well, and where we chain open up a little bit and talk about Maxine stuff because I witnessed when that has happened. And when you are surrounded in a in a space where people who were just giving generous lead with a helping hand kind of people when they hear from you. And when they are entre preneurs of that caliber, who are awhile of fide to offer insight because they're dealing with the same kind of stuff they too have connections in their own mind that depending on what your share they, they might say. Oh, I need to connect you with my friend so-and-so and. That kind of stuff. It's not all this thing. It's not for everybody because you know what if you cannot openly talk about where you're having challenges. Your that makes you uncomfortable than this probably for you. And that's why you can just Ackerman how great everything isn't just no way. But we know is entrepreneurs things aren't always great and his greatest. Things are we've got real challenges were dealing with as well. And some people don't wanna talk about that, because they're concerned about what people make in a what would people think of me if I talked about that. What would they think about me if I said that, like I dealing with this, and, and I've just got this point my own life where I don't care what people think about what people say if they're if they wanna be around meeting invite if not, that's totally fine to and stuff, but, you know, but by being able to be opened a candidate talk about this. We're going to get the help that we need for people who qualified to give us that how so I love the rebellion. That's that's. The I call it the quiet revolution against posing. That's come out in the last couple years. We've just at least at least among everybody, you know, the funny thing is Kevin you and I are, are, are daily in contact conversation observation listening, seeking from dynamic entrepreneurs and leaders. And so, for us, this is a language that both of speak fluently or two near fluency, right vulnerability being opened in sharing what your weaknesses are in? I'm always curious, you know, again, there's an end there's this great big world out there who aren't doing that supposedly, I you know, I'm never sure how far this is gone. But what I do love is, is getting to be part of it because in so many circumstances. I've been able to do exactly that just come and say, you know, quite honestly I I'm I'm stuck in a in a problem right now. And I, I don't know how to get out of it and. It's helped me in a couple of ways one has been the example you provide there of if I'm telling a fellow radically generous entrepreneur about that. I get all kinds of help all kinds of reframing all kinds of suggestions. You know, possibilities different ways of, of approaching things and all that the other thing is, if I'm not dealing with somebody like that. If I'm dealing with somebody who you know, this is a bit of a funny thing, if I'm dealing with somebody who just wants my money, right, this pushy sales person, and you tell them, I'm sorry. I'm I'm, I'm broke. I don't have any money. They leave you alone. So it's, it's, it's wonderful. It works on everybody. It's, it's the it's not pretty right. It is. It doesn't involve taking the rest of the people will judge you. But I for one have always said, you know, I I'd rather people judge me poorly for who I am. Absolutely judge me. Well for who I am not. Yes. Yes. Anyway, that's what that made me think of. But, but great answer there. So you've you've been very generous, you've got this tool we're going to we're going to linked to in the show notes called the relationship capital scorecard. I took it, by the way. I got an eighty six so I have a little bit. I have some room for improvement there, but eighty six out of one hundred I feel good. I got a b plus on, Kevin's tests. I, I wanted to ask you. I mean, do you actually can you actually use this scorecard in helping if you form a strategic partnership is that something that you build into the process? There are people are receptive to it, and they actually use it to identify in grow towards being a better version of themselves. Yes. Yes. Because once once people have used that scorecard on the small how long did it take you to do that? I mean just a few minutes. Right. Yeah. Because in a lot of the categories, I'm like, I, I wrote a book on this stuff, you know, so I'm I it's, it's, it's one of those things where it's it, it wasn't too difficult for me to make up my mind about several questions. Anyway, that's, that's how it is for most people that have ever done that and taking that, you know, that test for themselves is just it's just a few minute, processes audits, because it's pretty intuitive and nowhere. It's sometimes they don't like bidding, where they're not. But, but it's pretty they know where they are on, on each of those eight feels step may know right where they sit. And but I'll tell you that is such a powerful to, and I cannot take full credit for that, Dan Sullivan of strategic coach helped me develop that tool because I was looking for a tool because I provide tools and resources for my clients on that, that help them expand kind like this thing we were talking about giving and receiving, you know, and, and I, I hope on that day there's a lot of different ways. And it's, it's, it's all tailored to the claim. But that scorecard kind of gives you a picture of where you're at and sees where you need to work on 'em whether somebody ever shares their results with me or not is really irrelevant. Because the goal is to, like, let people see where they're at. But once I if I you know what? Happen is people will take that, that us that scorecard, and they'll, they'll end up reaching out to me and want to have a conversation around, and, you know, because, you know, whether they feel like they need. Okay. I'm at this point, and really wherever we are odd NAT we, there's doubt you're gonna you're gonna max out on the score. Anybody is maybe somebody, I, I haven't had the half yet but, but wherever somebody is, there's always approved. And, and so, and if they feel that they want to improve than lifetimes, people will end up having a conversation with me around that kind of thing. And depending on wet, they share some people are an open book that just like Kevin. Here's rhyme at this, this is what I see. This is the problem habit in all of this kind of stuff and it's just a tour is all about. It's, but it it's a pretty badly too, as far as even like. People playing out where their act and just being able to like you know what this makes sense. And now that I've got these areas defined. Now I've got clarity, this makes sense. And maybe they got handled on their own. They're like, okay, I'm going to start making adjustments CD's areas. Now they go back thirty days later and restore themselves. And they find out that, like, well, look at what happened here, and they've also seen manifest either life, you'd never relationships in recover stations, and what's going on their business than I now all of a sudden, they're business are growing. My just take it off. They started getting more clients. Whatever. No. Another guest. I've recently had Luciano Del Monte. So good guy, you should know him. He said, they're clear, sign of entropy. Is that relationships begin to get superficial, and the and you start valuing people more in terms of the dollar and cents figure? But you made this this, this other video, I watched on your website, everybody should go check it out. You came up with these five best questions to spur engagement when you do, like webinars and events, and they steer people the way I interpreted as what you're doing. There is you're getting people to focus on the benefit if you ask them, do you want to do you want to increase your income, and then you follow up that question with, why do you want to increase it? And what would be the benefit of increasing? It gets them to stop thinking about the dollars and cents and start thinking about the people in their lives, who they could spend that money on. Right. And if you if you. To get if you were to ask me, those questions, for example, and I start thinking, well now, you know, if my son wants to travel lit little league baseball team because he's getting really good at it. I can, you know, I can afford to do it. And I'm I have the freedom in structure to go and do it. So, yeah. That's a great reason. You know, but that's a reason that is so intimate to me, as opposed to just having the money in the Bank. That I I, I was like he's on when I was reading that I was like he's onto something there. And I'm thinking. A we should encourage entrepreneurs to when they are thinking about how they can serve the marketplace identify some of those things some of those broad categories like if I can I can focus on instead of what I'm going to get out of it focus on what that person, I'm going to serve can do with the value. I impart to them for the people in the friends and the relationships in their lives that they love. I think I think you don't even have to worry about the return on investment. But of course that's easier said than done. So I wanted to throw that back to you and say, you know how do we? How do we encourage entrepreneurs to think about that? What would you what would you do if you were golfing in that category? Well, it's all about asking the right questions. Dan, Solomon go back because Dan has been had such a profound impact on my life. Over the years. Dan is brilliant, and that's why I liked being around him this because he makes me think, in a way that I would didn't use to end. He does that by asking really powerful questions. And, and when we ask the right kind of questions of people, especially if entrepreneurs, it gets them thinking, what it does in the process of doing that. It helps get them more clarity on why am I doing what I'm doing? Where do I want to go from here? You know what am I really trying to accomplish? Do I really want to serve all of this kind of stuff and you on the surface, you know, they went that might be talking about it. Well, I wanna make more business in our wanna make more revenue by business. I want more clients. You know, that's just surface level stuff. Why do you want more clients? Why do you want more revenue? You know. Well, you know. Okay. I got kids get ready to go to college in a few years, and I want to be able to send them to a really nice school, or might my wife and I are looking at getting the second home down in Arizona. So that in the wintertime, we can go down there and we consumer time be up here. And, and just to have the best of both worlds. I wanna do this. I wanna I, I spoke with a few months ago that she she felt bad because she she's an attorney and she only works five days a month in her practice. He's got systems that people in place in allow that and she was feeling guilty because they light and go into Hawaii, and she goes but I still gotta be in my office for at least five days a month. Now I can make those five consecutive days. But you don't let up she goes, I wanna be in Hawaii. I wanna be there for free month's strikes and she. Was I so what I need to do is I to figure out how I cannot even have those five days a month, but yet at the same time she was, I said, she was just feeling while who am I to be completed because I only wear it five days worth by. But, but you know what there's no shame in what you want is what you want if you want to be on the infant, three minutes straight in Hawaii than it is what it is. You don't have to apologize for that. That's just what you want to do. So let's figure out how to make that happen. Yeah. Validating the an honest desire. Yes, the desire, only becomes an issue when, when you get out of proportion in irrationally, you know, fixated on it just having it, and, and using your intelligence to be able to figure out a way to actually make that happen. I mean, that's just I, I realize, you know, telling us to people living eight hundred years ago is not even in their imagination. But it's the world we live in right in the and there's nothing wrong with it. So I appreciate that. As as you were talking. I was thinking about something I used to talk about. I did this kind of unwittingly in, in an insurance, I would talk to people about carrying what they call an umbrella policy. And it was one of the easiest things in the world for me to sell not only because it was not very expensive most of the time. But also because I could it was one policy. I could always frame it in the category of if you know, it's very unlikely that this scenario will happen, right? It's very it's, it's statistically unlikely you will be taken to court and sued for personal damages, you know, to the very max of your ability to pay. But in the event that it does. Right. And I'm talking mainly to an entrepreneur, as my target client, I would say in the event that it does. What would you rather do go and spend your days in court fighting it off or continue working on your business while your insurance company handles? It you know. And, and, and it was a no brainer to them. Yeah. Like oh, yeah. No. I'd I'd really. Yeah. Sure. I'd rather go to court. I don't even like meeting with my attorney. I wanna go. I wanna go spend my days in court. Yeah. Obviously. So I said, then then we don't even we were just going to throw that on there. You know it's not even it's not even worth deliberating, whether it's worth your investment, or not, those put it on there and set it. And forget it so yeah. Yeah. So what's this, this whole thing, I just had a brief story come to mind, Kevin to sorta to circle back around this, and that, and I wanna get your take on it about were about focusing on when you're when you're talking to that client focusing on what is important to them, but beyond the surface level, and this kind of goes the, the it's the same story, but it's in reverse rather than approaching it from the point of view the sales person a few years back. I did my, I did my first stint as the may as the emcee for the miss Lewis county pageant, which is part of the Miss America program, and there was a it was strikingly beautiful young girl there who competed and she saying, just incredibly, and it was my first time ever. I didn't know anything about the judging process. So I said, I don't know how she doesn't win with that performance. I said to myself. So the pageant went on. And when it was over not only did she not win. She didn't even place in the top top three and I could I could read the disappointment all over her face and. We went after the pageant was over and they crowned the new winner. Everybody went downstairs to the gym of the school, and there's a big after gathering in everybody's taking pictures and all that. And I walked up to this, this, this girl who was by now had should, you know, should dried her face and all that. And she was doing her best, but I could you know, I knew she wasn't too. She was feeling the heat from that one. And I just said to her. I, I don't know how you didn't win that. I said, there's, if, if I had been on that panel, there's no way, there wouldn't have been one vote for you. And is she is she had this expression on her face? I could read it in her is that was that was exactly what she needed to hear. So a few weeks go by and I opened up Facebook one day and I've got an instant message from that young lady's grandmother, who has since become a good friend of mine, and she just couldn't think me enough for having. So I guess word got out. That I'd said that, you know, through the family back channels, and she just couldn't thank me enough. Took me to coffee and then a couple of weeks after that I'm getting another message saying, can you come and help us, we need an insurance quote for the building that we're that we own down here in Lewis county and so. That, that to me was like a microcosm story of the exactly that same principle. You know, when you are as an entrepreneur, as a human being is in any, any relational sense when you take care of the people and the relationships that matter. There goes my clock, the background noise when you take care of the people and relationships that matter to another person. I'm going to let this chime and then I'll start that point over again. And I'll plug plug the phone, so it doesn't ring again, I usually do that, before before I do something like this. So oh, yeah. No it. That's funny happened in my last interview to we had last minute interruption, the clock started chiming and the other the guests doorbell rang it was funny. Anyway, when you take care of the people in relationships that are important to a person, that's all the sales, they need. You know. And, and I had done that inadvertently just by giving an encouraging word to this young lady word got back to her grandmother. Next thing you know, she's, I'm I've got to be line straight to the front of the line when they have a need for what I offer in the marketplace. So anyway, I wanted to get your take on that. Yeah, yeah, you're totally right. When you, you just, you know, I mean, yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was so interesting about that story while is that you just had empathy for this girl, you know. That's all you, did you just felt for her and, and you just just just a quick comment was so impactful for her obviously, because she shared with family members. And then you get a call from her grandma and all that stuff. And so, she's obviously talking with others in her life about how much it meant to her. And you know, there's this term, but I, I don't know that I coined it. But it's, you know, active appreciation, you know, because gratitude, you know, to be grateful for something implies that someone had to do something good for us her something good had to happen to us, or for us in order for us to be grateful. And we can't always control that, but appreciation in empathy. On the other hand, are something that we're always in complete control NAN, and I can tell you, there is not a person on the face of this planet that gets enough appreciation or empathy either for that met and, and just letting people know that we genuinely appreciate that mean like you in that situation just like, wow, I can't believe that you, if I would have been there, you would have got at least one boat from me, just like saying that in just like no letting somebody. Know that we care about them, and it can go so far. And, and you know, and it doesn't matter how successful somebody isn't doesn't matter helping a business, they run. It doesn't matter who the heck they are. They don't get enough appreciation. And when we showed genuine active appreciation towards people, and it's in it's not it's not with, you know, expecting to get anything return later. You know, tightening church. I mean a lot of churches teach tightening. But a lot of people have this thing of, like, well, if I tie, then I'll get back and, you know, that's not why. Not why you give it's not a give get that you give gifts. And it just comes back, and it comes back in multiples. It comes back to throw that you don't give to get you give to get your just do that. Like you just share the experience and I can't tell you, I haven't so many experiences like that in my life where things came about that. I gave here but came back over here. It just just and some do more of that, you know, do more and show appreciation, I make an I make a conscious effort to every single day. I'm showing appreciation to somebody, you know, because it all comes in all comes back now for the first time, I ever did this, it was two thousand twelve minutes, Saint meeting with Jesse when we got to talk about that concept to vacuum appreciation, and I started sending out some text messages to some people in my life. And I just looked to my phone. I looked at my phone and I was looking at some people in my office went down. I really like covenant send out a message and I just let her know that you're Cinemax saying, do you know what? I really appreciate you because and I just let her know, a single reason that I had so much appreciation for and within a couple of hours. She gets back to me on. Oh my gosh. Kevin you made me cry. That is exact I needed that. So today, I love the catch up with you went can we can? Yup. Lid to business or anything. Right. But we have well you know what? Waiting for that. I was waiting for that because I know I know how this works, right? You it's not. It's not it didn't lead. Oh, hold on a minute. It didn't lead to business between her and I, but she was I, I would love to have a conversation as I just wanna talk with you. And, and I, I am know what she had gone. Right. But I think that's absolutely has had a conversation in will we had that conversation. She she just shared about some stuff, she was known soon. Kevin, that was so great to get your message at max ride as exactly what I needed and might so that we can talk. And then she left making a connection for me that Diddley this, you know. And so, you know, in this whole thing like you just again. But look at that example, right there. You know, unsure you could give countless more examples, just like that yet. That's exactly. In fact, on in, in my book, I, I tell people I use the phrase not for profit is for profit. And the whole point of it is not to not to go and join a border, volunteer, an organization with the expectation of making money directly from it. But with the full confidence that if you genuinely and in a now shit, what's the word. I'm looking for in a benign in a totally sincere way, if you serve in help that organization, expect the law, what goes around comes around to come in and blindside, you, and I've been sitting there in my office, you know, back in the insurance days, working on fundraising for local pageants. Surfer association of the US army, and my phone rings my office to pick it up Hella, and it's soda I got referred to you by so, and so, and I need a quote, for my insurance, you know, it's, it's passive outbound marketing, that I'm not even thinking about let alone executing or spending money on, right? People are just doing it for me. And that's why. I call it recruiting your own unpaid Salesforce. Yeah. Good seven. It's, it's been fantastic. Having this conversation with you on influence or networking secrets. If people, we've got links and the show notes, but I'm always like to hear it from you as well. If somebody's driving or anything like that. If people wanna learn more about you see a little bit about what you do. What's the best place? We could send them. Yeah. They can go to partnership playbook dot com. And that, that our relationship capital scorecards that you and I were talking about. They can I get that there. There's, there's right down though, it does require an update and I don't know how some people say they oh, he's just trying to build an Email list and whatever, you know, if you went to relationship capital car without getting on my Email list. That's totally cool to you. Can hit me up on Facebook or whatever I'm happy to share it with you don't have to get on my Email. Give me your name to be able to get it. Yes. And I run on Facebook at Kevin, the connector is, is a Facebook and in. So but yeah, I mean I, I love to share that relationship caporal scorecard with you, because that will be a very valuable to other Mike in about three minutes, it alleged right where you're standing eight different areas of a relationship building in your rights and for most entrepreneurs, especially if you are a gimme generous personality is kind of the co. Or who you are? I will tell you that you're just like I was you are surrounded by people, you built up, so much relationship capital already with people who would be glad to help you that you just don't even realize it's even better. I don't like to use the word capitalized, but, you know, to, to start tapping into not, not, not just to create more revenue to get where clients all of that kind of stuff that will certainly happen. But just to even further those relationships that you already have and start sharing with them. You're letting them have more of the experience of giving just just like you experience, you know, that when you have that experience of give me to somebody who really appreciates it. How good that makes you feel that other people have the same experience. And so, yeah, so we're they hip capitals for our risk. Relate partnership playbook, is where you'll get you can get the relationship capitals for Carter, you can hit me up on Facebook. And if you're entrepeneurship who you know, some of this resonated with you, and he had like a conversation, you're, you're like, I think it might be unhappy might be worth compensation. I wide open the having conversations with ultra preneurs, who are doing great things, and who are just giving generous people so. Yes. Yes. Well, thanks so much again. Kevin for joining us, and we'd look forward to having you back again soon on influence or networking secrets and until next time. My pleasure. This episode is sponsored by business beyond business. The international bestseller by entrepreneur coach. Paul Edwards if you're tired of stress and anxiety from the rat, race and life being all about the Benjamins. You're not alone. Do you wanna go from struggle and scarcity to success and significance? If so business beyond business teaches you how using the mindset and qualities of the radically generous entrepreneur, I claim Ted ex speaker? Ron Carucci calls it a masterful blend of self-discovery, faith honesty and advice about amplifying our impact in the world bestselling author, STAN Miller ads. I wish Paul had written this book twenty years ago available on Amazon starting at nine ninety nine business beyond business is free for listeners like you just go to the Paul S Edwards dot com and subscribe to our mailing list or you. Text the letters are GE to the number six six eight six six.