Instant reaction: Golden Tate is a New York Giant

Automatic TRANSCRIPT

Everybody type tell editor-in-chief of the verge. I has podcast every week called the verge Hass my friends, Paul Miller, indeed or bone. We've got a rotating cast of characters from our entire site, which is about technology, how it impacts culture, and how that is all a big cycle that causes us to have a wide variety of feelings that you can listen to every Friday we've done over three hundred episodes in six years since has been around. But you only need to listen to one the latest one to get caught up on everything. In tech news virtuous is on apple podcasts. Spotify everywhere else. You listen to podcasts. Check it out. I'm musical adjusts. Nate Sloan I'm songwriter. Charlie harding. We're the hosts of switched on pop the podcast where Charlie and I breakdown pop hits to reveal how the music works. And why it matters. It's our job to help you find those hob moments within the music, whether you're a pop fanatic or skeptic, a teenager or an octogenarian non musician or professional composer every music lover. Will discover something you're opening in switched on pop. Yeah. And we think you'll have a lot of fun with us because you're going to get to hear from amazing guest musicians song writers producers and journalists. Listen to switched on pop. Every week starting in March on the apple podcast app or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone just want to let you know, this podcast was finished recording before the giants signed Marcus, golden, the edge rusher, formerly of Zona. It's a one year deal makes a lot of sense you worked with James better is Wiggins way back for an injury. So each should be pretty good fit this podcast. Just talks about golden Tate his contract his impact to the giants offense. And what that's going to mean for the giants plan going forward. So hope you enjoy. Hello, welcome to you did big blue view podcast. I am Dan zoo to join tear by Chris hub. And we have some news. The giants who have been mostly not very active on the free agent market in the opening days heating up to this. They're only big signing was Anton buffet, of course, there were the couple of trades that you might have heard about but on Thursday, they signed wide receiver. Golden Tate spent the last half of last year with the Philadelphia Eagles was with the Detroit Lions before that Seattle Seahawks before that. So he is a fairly big signing per Adam Schefter the contract. Terms are four years thirty seven and a half million dollars, including twenty three million fully guaranteed what she would be meeting of this. I kind of have no idea this is one of those signings which have become. Some fairly commonplace for the giants that it makes sense in a vacuum. But it is also confusing. That is yet we'll have to wait for the exact structure of the contract to come out. But that's a lot of years in a lot of guaranteed money for a receiver who is going to be thirty one when the season starts. Yeah. And I it's a good point there. Because during the combine with Dave Gettleman was speaking to the media when he was talking about land in Collins. But just overall roster building he said you have fifty three roster spots and a certain amount of cap space. You can't look at every move in a vacuum. But it feels consistently like the things Gettleman has done have been in a vacuum. This is the thing where you can look at it and be like, well, the giants don't have receivers at someone needs to catch the ball. Golden Tate was the best available. Sure, go out and get him. But yet if you look at it in the overall plan of wondering what the giants are doing if they were rebuilding its signing a thirty one year-old mostly Salat receiver to a four year deal with a lot of guaranteed money isn't exactly the way the most teams would be trying to rebuild it brings up a lot of questions and trying to figure out exactly what tastes role is at how he is going to fit in the offense at thirty one years old. He's not in the physical prime of his career anymore. You're going to be paying for the decline seasons of we'll get into whether that has already happened or not this signing brings up a whole bunch of questions that I'm not sure if we have the answers to right now. No, I mean, why don't we start with the obvious one sterling shepherd the giants slot receiver who has been one of the best slot receivers. Basically since he entered the league and led all slot receivers in touchdowns as a rookie. You know, what is his role? We'd know he is better. He can play outside. He did that a fair bit at Oklahoma. He did it a little bit more last year. Especially after Odell got hurt. Are they now looking at him as primarily wide receiver? Are they going to maybe do what we were begging them to do for weeks on end in motion. Evan Ingram or saquon Barkley out too wide receiver and then maybe play shepherd in Tate at at dual slots get so many questions. Yeah. It it's a big question. Especially with the defy with shepherd who is better in the slot. We've talked about how he does have the versatility to play on the inside and outside. I wrote this week. I'm big view looking at the options at wide receiver later. I put up. A split of shepherd with and without Beckham in twenty eighteen and he struggled a little bit. And actually a lot of bit with with Beckham not playing at when he was used on the outside more often. So that was one of the concerns a with the Beckham trade is what the giants were going to do. They're now the concern is the Sheppard and Tate have a very similar skill sets. They're better in the slot that both can play outside. So if you want maybe there is that versatility there. But you kind of have to wonder if there's a balance that can be found to make that work out better. It's not like putting him with Odell Beckham who could play the slot. But he was so good on the outside of one of the best receivers in the league that you moving them around was really more of a match up advantage of just getting those different looks with Tate and shepherd. It's probably more about trying to figure out where you can get the best from each of them. And then you have to wonder if. Shepherd is just on the trade block. He's on the last year of his rookie deal wonder if Shepard is going to be on the block, and possibly the moved and the giants will have to figure out what to do as a number two receiver opposite Tate just because of how much their skill sessions overlap. Yeah. And you know, this we had heard during the season that the New England Patriots were in hot pursuit of Beckham. And that they wanted to for them. So they can get him relatively cheaply. Even if they had to move a first round pick for it. This was back before he got his contract and just have him on the last year of his deal. That's one of the inefficiencies the patriots love to exploit and they do happen to have three third round picks this year, or at least right now. I honestly can't say I would be terribly surprised to read that sterling shepherd is traded. And traded to the patriots because he also fits their offense. Perfectly a tough detailed route runner with good hands in run after the catch ability. Yeah. Tom Brady loves those. Yes. So it does raise a couple of questions in what the offense is going to look like Tate is not really a receiver who's been known the lately, especially to be a downfield thread think he can have that ability. But he's mostly been someone who has done most of his work out of the slot in shallow routes and he's a great yards after the catch receiver. But and when you would just go through what his average depth of target was this year, he had three games with an A dot over ten. So he's doing most of his work fewer than ten yards down the field. A so that's something you got to take a look at it. In wonder how that's going to go into the offense. And then do you look at just the grand scheme of the money, so Schefter reported that twice? Three million of that contract is fully guaranteed. We said that's a lot of money that is right now the ninth highest total guarantee for a wide receiver. So that is owed. Oh Beckham is one might Evans de'andre Hopkins who Jones Jarvis Landry semi walk ins AJ green Corey Davis. And then now golden Tate, so while his average annual salary if you want to look at that is only a little above nine that total guarantee is a lot. So if Tate starts to decline quickly the giants might not really have in easy out beforehand. Again, we don't have the structure of the contract right now. But that amount of guaranteed money to thirty one year old wide receiver is that's a lot to give up so Pugh back the curtain a little bit. We had a podcast that we had recorded earlier. It's kind of not really applicable now with some of the things we talked about after the signing and would have. One of the things I brought up is if the giants will have to pay a premium to get some players to come in now. And it kinda seems like that is what happened with Tate paying that much guaranteed is a lot of money to pay the golden even if you considered him the number one receiver on the market. I'm and then you look at just the overall plan of what happens here. So this per Nick, according I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing his last name right of over the cap, he does great work with the compensatory picks on east kind of the only person who really knows the formula is usually pretty spot on at Tate's contracts. The eagles are going to add a fourth round twenty twenty pick with the Tate signing from losing Tate. And again, we're still early in the off season. So a lot of this is fluid and the giant by signing. Tate would lose the fifth rounder. They could have had with Jim on Brown signing in Atlanta. So when you look. Get that too. If the giants were fully rebuilding, and they were going to be looking at those complex like some people said, they would that is obviously not the case here because of the potential giving the eagles of fourth-rounder and taking away a fifth rounder for themselves in the twenty twenty draft. So this isn't really a long view type of signing either. No. And getting back to the idea of the giants might paying him guaranteed money to get worse. The part, I think that worries me the most about this signing, and I don't think I have been deceptive in my criticism of Dave Gettleman, and I'm not going to write this signing off as it will be bad. But I have to say I do have concerns. It could be good because Tate's ability to run after the catch should should anyway mesh well with what Pat Shurmur likes to do on offense. You know, get the ball to playmakers in space. But last year football outsiders had Tate rated as the second worst receiver in football by their DAR metric, which is defense adjusted yards above replacement. He was a negative one thirty four four. Just some reference John Ross was a negative ninety six. Tate's Devi away. And he struggled in Philadelphia and Philadelphia had difficulties just fitting him in just to kind of steal a point you made before we started recording. But it was a good once I'm using it. But even before tape went to Philadelphia, he had a negative twenty two point three D V away in Detroit, and he had already kind of taken a step back from where he was just the four years before that. So I do have to worry about whether or not he's going to be a vial receiver for very long. Yeah. So last year a mum all vied receivers an integral between Detroit and Philadelphia Tate. Head denied the most targets of any receiver from the slot. That also includes tight ends because Travis Kelsey Zakar. It's on the list looking at so Tate had ninety two targets from the slot. Only sixty receptions, that's not a very high rate on. On slut targets at six hundred seventy two receiving yards. Three hundred twenty eight of them came through the air three hundred thirty two yards after the catch. Oh, almost exactly fifty fifty there. He's a kind of a broken tackle machine. He had sixteen broken tackles a witch. So this is crazy so per sports in phila- solutions using leaderboards right now Tate had sixteen broken tackles on receptions from the slot last year number two had six. So I mean in terms of the giants offense he's going to fit in that regard of getting thrown the ball and having to break a crapload of tackles before can gain any yards. That was what saquon Barkley had to do last year. So there's part of Tate's game that works. And there is positive. I like take as a player how he fits with the giants just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Of course is he's going to have that low A dot and be that slot option. And that might make things easier you manning possibly that makes things easier for the next quarterback if that's a rookie this year or if that's a rookie in twenty twenty. It's not a terrible piece to have. But looking at the whole thing in context, it is a very weird piece at his age and at that price to put into what this offense currently is. Yeah. This is move that could be good. It could work out. Very well, especially if tape returns to his twenty seventeen form when he was a top twenty top thirty receiver. But this is a move that does carry some risk of being basically, another Jonathan Stewart type signing where they're paying for past production than in this case paying at least it looks right now like a fair amount for awhile. Yeah. I don't want to say it's Stewart signing because the LBC's not a running back, but obviously significantly more money than was given to Stewart. But I don't know. I think one thing also before this becomes a narrative that gets thrown out there of a Tate being a good veteran presence for the locker room. I'm sure this is something that's going to be put out by someone at some point. I have nothing against Tate as a person he's been a very fun player to watch in his career. But he's he's done some civil brations. There's a gift I've shared a very frequently of him doing like a WWE spinning wheel kick to end juiston Deo when he scored a touchdown who one time in a game like literally kicked him in the face going across the goal line. And then there's this story about him and Percy Harbin the week before Seattle was in the Super Bowl, they got into a physical altercation. So it just. Just going to that thing. And again, I'm not saying Tate is a bad person. But for the giants now getting rid of Odell Beckham because he was a distraction and then signing golden tape is a real weird look to me. Yeah. You know, it's not necessarily bad. It's just potentially weird supposedly there's a plan at work, which was something. We had asked about in the podcast that now never happened. Yeah. Let's let's get into that now which shift into that because the Tate signing kind of sort of answers a question. But also leaves a lot of things about what the giants plan is like do the giants think they're gonna compete in twenty nineteen like it's that the plan. Well, Dave Gettleman did say they could compete while building the roster. So I'm not sure how much we can take him at his word at anything. But. That does seem to be land. Yeah. It it. Again, feels like the half rebuild half, a build a competitor. Which doesn't work you got to pick a lane. And the giants have not been able to do that since gentleman was hired. So I think one other thing that is the fallout here. Do you think with Tate and now a veteran wide receiver signed does it make more likely for them to draft a quarterback in the first round this year because before this I didn't really see the point because there just wasn't a structure in the receiving core or the whole structure of an offense and how far away it looked like the giants are which I still think they are a little far away. But if the giants they adding someone like Tate is what's going to make this offense better. Are they more likely to draft a quarterback this year? On our original podcast before the giant sign. Teat? We both agreed that they probably be best served by building up the ecosystem into which a young quarterback would enter. So they could actually have success right away. Personally. I thought maybe they would be at least decently served to take a lottery pick this year. Like a jerk stood him or Brett Rypien if they happen to be there in the middle round third fourth fifth, whatever I think this does kind of bring quarterback back into the conversation. I'm not sure it totally ever left, especially outside of the worst case. At least for us scenario of the giants using the seventeenth overall pick on Daniel Jones after going best player available at number six. But again, as we are before the giants were in heavy attendance at Oklahoma, Pat, Shurmur and Chris marrow were standing, right. Behind Kyla Murray in further throwing portion of his workout. Maybe maybe that is back on the table. So. It's interesting because I think the way the giants offense is structured right now. I it's more of a Dwayne Haskins offense than a collar Murray offense. I think very has just great deep. Accuracy, the rocket arm and everything that birdie does but Haskins does have a great arm has really pretty good deep. Accuracy, just didn't use. It a lot that Ohio State. Offense was very based around the shallow drags and crossers and things. So they're replicating that type of style. So I wonder if Haskins this is possibly a hint toward Haskins. I'm not sure I don't know if we want to take too much away from that. But this kind of starts setting up like the Ohio State offense was set up last year. Get the ball to Paris Campbell shore, and let him just do his thing. Yeah. There were a lot of that. Atalaya state Haskins has the ability to throw deeper, but just a lot of what he did was in in the short and intermediate area. So I it's something worth trying to figure out I guess as as we look further into what the giants are going to do this signing, I guess was kind of rumored but mostly came out of nowhere. And I think it it still a raises more questions about what the overall plan is then answers, definitely especially with the contract because I'll just say I jumped right on writing are announced post for it. And I did not see the the terms. So I was basically operating under the assumption that it was probably a one year like maybe five million dollar deal. Just a bridge to get them to twenty twenty not spend too much keep most of their cap room. You may. Maybe role as much as they can over to next year. But then I see, you know, four years that much guaranteed that took me completely by surprise. Yeah. And it's going to come down a lot to structure it can be a super expensive two year deal. It can be a slightly expensive three-year deal. It's probably not going to end up being the four year deal. But there's there's a lot of money there. And even with the structure, it's still a quite an interesting deal would the giants to put on their books. But this is now the first I guess major move of whatever the plan is we still don't really know. I don't think this gave us a very clear view into what the plan is. So we'll continue to monitor. If we get any more hints is this. This is a very strange signing to me. But we will continue to dive into the deal. Wants more details come out we'll continue to monitor the rest of the deals as free agency continues. We're going to end this show here. So you can get this podcast wherever you find your podcast appraise rate and review if you have not that helped us out greatly. 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