24. Believing We Can Win with Melina Abdullah
Hey It's Sharla wanted to let you know about a dope pod casts Spanish. I keep presents. It's a show hosted by a bunch of hilarious lat next comedians where they break down the latest trends issues. Issues and general weirdness in the community. Oh and they always end with an Improv. skit Spanish aqui presents. Just release some bonus. Episodes available exclusively on stitcher premium. Liam when you become a premium listener you'll get ad free podcasts. Access to all the exclusive content on stitcher like bonus episodes archives early releases. And more more. And you'll be supporting all your favorite cereal shows including ours so go check out. stitcher premium at STITCHER PREMIUM DOT COM and. Use The code secret for a free month trial. Thanks I'm Lavar Burton and I'm back with another season of my podcast. Lavar Burton reads. I'm reading stories by the best and brightest writing minds out there authors. Like Neil Gaiman and Ken Liu in K. Jemison and you get to experience a whole story thirty to forty forty five minutes so join me for Lavar. Burton reads subscribed today just tap the picture on your screen or search Lavar Burton and asked me to your favorites. And I don't ever want to die alone like I don't WanNa die. Just be left there and so yeah and so we go and we core libation and sometimes we're literally standing on their blood so it's important that we understand like Malcolm says that you cannot. I have capitalism without racism. You're not banking black. That means you're putting your money in banks that actually profit from our oppression. But most of the time I just believe we can win. I just you know and I think it's don't happen even in my lifetime. I'll I'm not doing it just for my kids. I'm doing it for us right now. This is the secret lives of black women. I'm in I'M SHARLA and I'm Laurin and today we're talking about black liberation and social activism yes. I'm so excited it for us to talk about. This topic is something deeply passionate about. I can't believe that this is just getting to this. We were going to get to leading up to it. It's a slow burn lauren. You talk about this kind of thing a lot and I always feel like you are more articulate in speaking about your age than I am. I've you experienced feelings like this of being oppressed in What what have been your experiences with activism or just feeling thing like oppressed in this country? I mean you know I have very I don't i. I don't think that I am very very articulated in my rage on my beach about my thoughts on this because I'm not. I have not studied and not a scholar but a half participated in you know a lot of like a protest. I wish that I was far more involved in you. Know Protests and liberation ration- movements on a daily basis But I do. I don't know for me I feel like I'm doing the bare minimum for or something that I am so deeply passionate about and just frustrated about as a black woman that exist in this world that exists in this industry I feel like we both work in entertainment industry and for me. It's like I just feel that like I'm like how do I even like articulate articulate off my anger and rage in that like the black experience is not adequately shown an shown through like a lens and a gaze of Whiteness. And how do we overcome that too. Like free ourselves thousand exists in the system and we work in a system that that is literally its function you know that since a freedom to like be a black person and go out in the world and just do what did you fucking want. Do what feels good and not have like the gaze of the Lens of like how this is perceived like I feel so trapped and I just wanted to be free and it makes me meet angry. Yeah my frustration is always. How do you gain freedom without completely tearing bring it down because if the only way to gain freedom is to is to operate within a racist structure then is it real freedom? What it is you have to tear down the thing that I you know? We live our lives and is the function of our lives in order to I think create this base of like liberation. But how do we do that. When we're so tied to the function of capitalism? I still like nice things. The way that this system is is built in order for you to have nice things someone is not. Yeah and it's like you have to be willing to give up those trappings in order to create a space so that everyone can can exist and thrive and well. The thing about America is that its co opted nice things as something that is only a function of capitalism. When it's it's not like like everyone can enjoy nice things and what? How much is enough? That's a question I've been asking myself a lot. It's like America is a kind of place that makes me feel like a lot is not enough and this to me is where the the degradation of society really lies. Where like we are looking to have everything? We're looking to have. What celebrities have? We're looking to have this ideal life. That is absolutely unrealistic and not real oh and bat shit crazy because in order for it to exist at least in the way that it exists in America it does rely on someone being stomped on and once you hit that Bar Are that bars the not enough right so the concept of enough is a fallacy. If it's constantly moving right you know and Hollywood is the place place for never feeling fulfilled. Even if you have everything is the kind of place where it's the kind of place where it's like this is this is. This is the frustrating thing about the place that we word is that being black is then co opted to feed a white liberal need of feeling like of their guilt. Feeling like I felt bad. Let's let's let's properties black voices but let's take all the things that make them true and unique away from them so that it's a black boys but but it's a black voice that is still palatable to a white audience. Yeah then what is the point but even when it's painful even when it's hard to watch and it's still calls outweigh people. Oh it's still like made by white people which makes me feel often painful. How it's painful? How painful because it showcasing our trauma where where the celebration of like our joy of triumphs told through like black people and black lands and their own voice own black people not just making money you for white people and at the discretion of white people? You know this is like this is the frustration that I have is that it in the paradigm of this system in which we exist in order to reach that level of success. You're always going to hit that barometer. Wear where your success lies is determined by like money right by money and it's just like it is it's frustrating. It's frustrating when it makes me think think of through my own Like through my own lens of just like work right now and I'm you know well. We have the perfect gusts to talk about this. Today's guests is doctor. Melina Abdellah. She is a recognized expert on race gender class and social movements. She was among the original group of organizers convenient to form black lives matter and continues to serve as the Los Angeles chapter leader. She's also professor and chair Pan. African studies at the California State University Los Angeles she's from Oakland and has written several books chapters and articles on subjects ranging from the coalition building to women as smothering. I WanNa talk to her about so so many things for so I mean less. Let's get started closer it started. Let's talk to Dr Molina. I want to start with saying that. I love that you've got on your your Oakland Black Panther shirts and you're you're you're from Oakland and I wanna start with just learning a little bit more about you and how you got involved in political activist activist movements particularly around like black liberation sure. Well I'm from Oakland born in the seventies even though I'm twenty nine so don't let them out full you uh-huh but Oakland in the seventies you basically were born into movement right. So I'm the Panther cub generation. My parents weren't panthers but they you did contribute to a lot of the survivor programs. That's what Oakland was the like in the seventies and so there is no moment I often Ask Ask my students like when did they step into activism and some people asked me the same question you asked me but there is no moments I was kind of born into it and remember being on the picket lines at three and four years old with my dad was a carpenter And involved in the Union. So I've always been active I I think the moment of kind of being formally kind of entrenched movement really came with the birth of black lives matter but I had always been active leading up to that. What happened when black lives matter started that got you entrenched? Well I I was never what people would call a joiner right so I was always involved in demonstrations and protests but I was kind of like an anonymous face Most of us are like. Yeah Yeah so I'M GONNA come to every protest. I'm going to speak up. I'm GonNa you know I really believed moved in kind of liberation work in the classroom. I did a lot of community. Organizing on campuses A lot around ethnic studies did a lot of work even in high school who I remember protesting and we started. Pick it outside there. But that's not like a being a member of an organization And so what happened. Spend with black lives matter as it was really kind of just birthed organically and so a lot of us in Los Angeles especially poured out into the streets after Zimmerman was acquitted in the murder of Trayvon Martin and we demonstrated for you know days and then finally I got a text that originated originated with Patrisse cullors who I was in a Black community organizers collective with And it came through a Black Independent journalist listening time to seize way Chimurenga and it said Meet at nine PM. Saint ELMO's village. which is this black artists community here and so so I went but again it just felt very organic and I went in? I had had my students and other mamas in the streets with me and we all about fifteen of US went into that meeting and we didn't know that it was going to be what we pledged that night in the middle of the night in the moonlight Because they know most villages kind of built like an African village is to build a movement not a moment and we. It sounded great and we were committed to that but we didn't know we were kind of giving birth to this global movement to become you know kind Donovan. Internationally known movement right it was after the not after the death of Trayvon Martin with it kind of had it caught on. It didn't catch on until after the murder of Mike Brown in Ferguson I remember when Black lives matter was starting to grow as a movement one of the frustrations that I had was watching white organizations. Not speak up and link arms and say yeah black lives matter it was almost like I mean to me. It was like a slur almost like for white people say black lives matter black lead. They like jump on Blue Lives Matter Al and I'm just like just say black lives matter right. It's fear of centering. The black experience and saying that like like what is wrong with saying black. Like I feel like we encroach a lot of things under diversity. PSE instead of saying black. And what's the fear of being like. It's black black lives matter there. Were not saying that like no one else lives matter but fuck and we sent her ourselves and whenever we send our cells as a people arms you know this is this is the secret lives of black on this show. This is a space filled. Serve it but that is one of the things that frustrated me so much even in this movement even in a time of so much pain which is often the case. Still you've to censor yourself and is this very political word. Just just the word itself right political right and I mean it's also you know a form when we talk about white supremacy. It's really important that we understand that white supremacy is tethered to anti blackness right and so as we talk about racism in the way that racism plays out in this country everything begins with the dehumanisation of black people full. And so they want to talk about. You know these kind of broad terms. It's why they try to force US under this people of Color umbrella which you know there is a place for solidarity right but we have to be able to talk about the specific ways in which black people are oppressed right so so when we started talking about black lives matter and saying black lives matter it was offensive to not only white people but other people of color were Langley. Will you know you know. It's not just black. People Killed by beliefs. No it's not but it's mostly lost it's mostly and so we need you to remember the police come from slave catchers who put targets on black people's backs right and so if we think about that if we start in and it's not a a threat to anybody else now if you work with if you work to liberate Black People One's black people get free. Everybody gets right. And so it's in their best interest to do that unless they're wedded to the system of white supremacy and I mean that just makes me think of so many things that are being wedded to this white supremacy in this whole idea like a seat at the table and who gets to see WHO's proximity to whiteness even as this blanket term people of color were who has a closer proximity to whiteness. And when you use use those blanket terms it force people not to check their own anti blackness and when they don't check their anti blackness then the system just keeps heaps keeps thriving. Because it's like it's A. It's a distraction from being like. Well we cannot look at this we can. We can blanket it. We can say things are better right. You know we're all because I do believe in solidarity but I do believe in like a movement for Black Liberation and I think you know when we don't stolley focus on that we just we put a cover so that the system of white supremacy can still continue to thrive people think that were progressing forward and really. Nothing's happening right. I'm GonNa give you a real clear illustration of what you're saying so yesterday I went to the attorney. Ernie General's office to meet with some senior folks the California Attorney General's name have year but said and I went with the mother of a brother named David Joe Cya Lawson in who was killed by a white supremacist way up in northern California in a place called Humboldt County he was stabbed to death and Because it's a small town. It's fairly isolated. The white supremacist killer named Kyle Zoellner was protected by really every institution in that town primarily the district attorney who Made sure that she represented him instead of the victim. In the case David Joseph Lawson who was a nineteen year old black male honor student at Humboldt State University so I went with his mom to meet with the staff of the attorney. General's Office these senior staff staff members. who were both white one of the the policy director was a white woman and she had on her black suit and she had on ethnic ethnic right they like to use that term and ethnic necklace? Right which just means not European but some had some beads on it right and so we're sitting there and the first thing that they say is I'm sorry I can't help you with your case. So they took months and then said basically. They're not going to do anything being to intervene in this case and we could get into. How fucked up this cases like this boy who did everything right not that you should have to be perfect it right but they give us idea of the perfect victim right and you know this is the perfect victim and nobody's fighting for him except black people and what is said is basically that There's no sense in calling being on a system to represent the interests of black people that they have not done that they haven't ever done it and and then she holds up. This white policy director holds up and says so I said well this is white supremacy because if the victim had been white and the killer had been black he'd be locked up right now and she said. I take offense to that because heavier but said is the first first Hispanic Attorney General so when we talk about the idea of anti blackness and the problem with this overarching people people of color umbrella. I think that encapsulates it in some way by electing a quote unquote hope vere beset is offended by the fact that this white woman called Him Hispanic which is an oppressive term in and of itself right but the idea that the token ization of US quote Unquote Hispanic Attorney. General meets means something for black. Liberation is hugely problematic. I love that you are bringing up the the system system which is something that Lauren. I talk a lot about and one of the things that I talk. I've talked about on this podcast. Before is the idea that the only way that I think people are going to have any kind of liberation is if we have some sort of financial power you you know like the more like I really believe in educating like financial education for black people building black wealth because that is the system that we are in even learn tonight. We're having a conversation about Can we be a system from within or do we have to destroy like you. You tweeted did about. You tweeted a video of Angela. Davis talking about capitalism is okay if I play the video sure and I feel that if we're going to talk about told the total liberation of black people we I have to liberate ourselves from the material conditions of our Russian Russian and the material conditions of oppression are no jobs a bad jobs. Unemployment bad housing bad medical care and all of the kinds of things. That will be eradicated under socialism. I I believe in socialism. I believe it is a way for for it is. It is one of the few avenues we have to structurally change America in a good way for all people but in particular alert to really to really bring about any kind of sense of reparations for for what this country has done to to black people. Can you speak on on your beliefs about socialism more. I don't know how to phrase this question but can you do you like an economic ended for. Yeah yeah so I absolutely agree that we are never going to get free under a capitalist system. I don't believe in replacing white capitalism but listen with black capitalism I think though that it's important that we understand power of Collective you've resources if we think about and I think even From our arrival here in this country right if you think about black mutual aid societies the original purposes of blacks fraternities and Sororities The role of black churches the AME church in particular. It was about pooling black resources so that we could collectively benefit from them and so in black lives matter and twenty fourteen. We launched something something called black. XMAS recognizing the role that white capitalism plays in the oppression and the state violence experienced by black people. And what brought it on was a murder of John Crawford inside a Walmart store right and people will remember. This was in Beaverton Ohio. He picked up Walmart merchandise dice which was like a BB gun right and he was just walking around the store talking on the phone like everybody else was doing Walmart. I imagine. I've never been in a walmart. Good for you. But he's walking around Walmart. Someone calls police on him. They murder him in a span of seconds and we can Ohio an open carry state it is an open carry state and it wasn't even a gun yes right. So there's that and so you know this happens but then you also think about the murder of your vet Henderson and Oakland who was accused of shoplifting at home depot pro police are called on her for shoplifting. Killer in the parking lot you think about here in Los Angeles two black men back to back being killed in twenty twenty four hour fitness. They were both Jim members and they made the non black workers uncomfortable with their presence. Twenty four hour fitness. It doesn't change their policy or even issue an apology and then twenty eighteen they kill Albert Ramone Dorsey. So there's this role that corporations play in the murder black people and you know of course we could also take that back to Chattel slavery in the ways in which people have been killed. So it's important that we understand hand like Malcolm says that you cannot have capitalism without racist and so there has to be an economic agenda for black people so in two thousand fourteen we started. It's something called Black ex-miss where at least for this period from what they call black Friday two January first. We want black people and all people to be intentional intentional. About where their dollars go. So we ask everybody to divest every single penny from white capitalism right so don't spend spend money at Walmart for sure. You should never spend money at Walmart. But don't spend money with the white corporations that actually profit from from black oppression instead we have kind of a three point program build black so don't be consumers if you don't have to instead of buying me something donate donate to blank and you can write in which organization and there's everything from organizations like mind. Black lives matter to the Fernando Pulham Center which offers was free arts and music programs for black kids and Lamar Park right thing about what we call building black. Investing those dollars in black led organizations and then the the second thing is buying black and so this is what you're asking about buying black is important and it's important that when we think about black black businesses that we also support black businesses. That do something for black community. So it's not just about lining the pockets of black entrepreneurs it's also about a consciousness that we have among kind of black business owners where they're also working to contribute to black community. So John Books Right opening up the bookstore and having readings and discussions with black authors who were well-known like Tennessee coats but also not well known like unpublished published or self published authors. So that's by black. And then finally the third point point is banking black and we got a lot of heat when we pushed the bank. Thank Black Movement. Because they were like it's capitalism it's black capitalism that you're pushing we talked with you know all of our mentors and and one of the things that we adopted which is actually a black power. Principle is survival pending revolution. which you're going to do with your money? You don't have cash cash stuffed under your managers if you're not banking black. That means you are putting your money in banks that actually really profit from our oppression bank of America Wells Fargo Citibank All of these big banks chase. They made eight money off the slave trade right. They also finance things like the Dakota access pipeline like private prisons. So you're we're actually giving them the capital to oppress us. Why not give your money to one United Bank which actually sets up trust funds for the children of those those killed by police not saying that it's perfect but it's a better system so anyway that's a long answer to an economic agenda? We believe that the ultimate answer the answer to this is really dismantling capitalism and thinking thinking about what Kwami to ray and others Talked about With which is African scientific socialism right so not Some people are Marxists Right We believe that you can have spirituality. The in socialism spirituality and socialism are actually Really they go to get do. Yeah well we really WanNa talk more about the personal aspect of your socialism and activism and will do that After this break this episode is brought to you by children of virtue in vengeance. The instant Number One New York Times bestseller seller and stunning sequel to Tomi Ademi's novel children of blood and bone. These books have taken the world by storm. Entertainment weekly calls it a phenomenon. Non and Tommy is already being compared to Mega Author J. K.. Rowling The New York Times says Tommy poses thought provoking questions about race class and authority. This sweeping fantasy series is described as Black Panther with magic bringing both black lives matter and black girl magic into fictional west African world inspired by Tony's Nigerian Rian routes if you haven't read children of blood and bone and children virtue in vengeance yet now is the time Evans says there the next big thing in literature and film. That's right a movie is already in development with Lucasfilm and it's sure to be the next blockbuster hit join the phenomenon. See why everyone is talking about children. Virtue in vengeance. Read it now new show alert and it's from some of our friends. It's called Sundstrom hosted by IGLOO and Alesia Garza I John and Alesia are two leading activists in America and the show is all about how women help each other stay joyful and powerful amidst the chaos of life today which let's just say we all need ate a little bit of that each week. They talked to their friends and Xiros about their. Inspirations their squads they're guilty pleasures and what it means to fight and win subscribe to Sun Storm Wherever you're listening right now. This episode is brought to you by children of virtue in vengeance. The instant Number One New York Times bestseller and stunning sequel to Tomi. Eddie Amis novel children of blood and bone this sweeping fantasy series is described as Black Panther with magic bringing both black lives matter and black girl magic into the fictional channel West African world inspired. By Tony's Nigerian roots join the phenomenon and read it now and we're back. Lauren really has a question she wants to ask you. I mean I have one which is something that I struggle with a lot is. How do you maintain a sense of hope and change when we look at the systems and the power structures that are belt to keep us down right and they seem at times insurmountable right and it's just like what do you do personally to keep the fight going within yourself and being like this this possible like maybe I won't see Black Liberation Liberation in my lifetime but maybe my kids will so there's moments very few and far between where it doesn't seem like we can win you know? Oh but most of the time. I just believe we can win. I just you know and I think it's GonNa Happen in my lifetime. I'm not doing it just for my kids kids. I'm doing it for us right now. Like I think that We don't spend enough time focusing on the victories. Right and and thinking about like okay so black lives matter you asked about it right so we come out into the streets for a couple of days. We get in a circle in a black artists community ready and then all of a sudden a year later. It's like a global movement. That shit is a victory. Do you remember and twenty thirteen when we could not say black right when we talked about this when you said black people would go all this racists. Yeah right now where expected to be able to say a black agenda is right and if we don't do that then you're really kind of a sellout right so we have all of these victories. What gives me the greatest open? Then I'll get to a a few practices that I have. Are you watching these kids like the kids. I mean like twenty one and under I mean like fifteen and they believe anything is possible and may call people out and they fully expect people to respond to them. They they like holy on Kastrati. Hit Me Castro right. I wasn't even up on him and they were like my daughter was like Mama. You gotta pay attention to what he's saying. So I started paying attention attention like Houlihan sitting up. He got his opening quote on his website is by Audrey. I'm GonNa following him I think. He's I actually. I think he's under overlooked. And under what is it exposed right you know like I'm. I'm personally very frustrated with the attention that Buddha judges getting especially with his record and his lack of information about the black community I I have a lot of frustrations with what the white gay organizations in their lack of support for black people and black black lives because I feel like I watched black people and Black Organization stand up for gay lives all the time and when I'm talking about this particular particular talking about like white gay male right like they ex- they only take help but they don't give it and I feel like Buddha judges example of this and it's really frustrating to watch and you watch them ignore any race Black Queer and Trans folks. You're absolutely really right into white. Gay Agenda White Really. A white male gay agenda does not privileges in being white males like the gay part is just an afterthought afterthought and that's why they're being elevated and I'm just like but what about the black people that got you here that got you to be able to be out like this and you ignore them and Arabia townhall shit. They had that they called. What did they call it? Quality Quality townhall. No it was like on CNN it was like the equality townhall but it was about just like a single axis framework on Lgbtq right and so they didn't even have a black trans woman had to stand up and say what about Black Trans Women but also the concept of equality how did that become you know meaning LGBTQ and not racism and sexism. Classism right. We'll to me this white supremacist. The function whites producing it's the function rights per that's even embedded in like the feminist movement because the separation of being like but you can be your black. They're black women too. Yeah right so how do you. You can't take race out of the system equation and think that things are going to be okay if you have a whole group and you remove black people from it with in what they're doing is they're taking the oppressions that they can. They can hide frankly and he did Georgieva. Yes co-opting them and ignoring and erasing the black people that made that put these issues in the forefront inside the main thing on that that's like the one thing that's removing you from experiencing the full onslaught of white supremacy that you can benefit from So it's like how can I just like you know. Move Myself More to get that full experience. And it's not caring about other people that are right victims of it right Ron Stanley But I would love to. I want your steps of so. Yeah the kids. Give me hope the kids. You know the the audacity of sand presidential candidates respond to our issues the identity of saying. Yeah this is a a forum on and gun violence and we want to talk about how police violence is gun. Violence Right The the willingness. So if you think about I'm watching Tim. My daughter right in the space so she my two daughters are co founders of the Black Lives Matter Youth Vanguard right so my oldest is really entrenched changed in this whole what is their generations. The Jeonju I think so she's really entrenched in this whole agency organizing right so these Parkland kids find found March for our lives and most of them are white in affluent and the kids challenged him. But here's the difference between their generation in Mine and yours right is a white kids responded. The the white kids were like you know what you right so you watch like David Hogg Right. WHO has every white male privilege in the world? Now Pledge He's never going to get on stage without a black woman right and so this generation and I'm not saying he's perfect but I know the white kids. When I was in highschool you would never do shit like right? I love the audacity of these kids. So these kids when you say how do you keep yourself going. I watch them because they believe anything is possible. And it's going to happen tomorrow right. The other thing that I do like in the moments which Char- few and far between for me is you know we don't talk about it enough. I think is black people but I have a spiritual practice and I think that Eh. You know there's some good stuff about solidarity but I think what happened. Beginning with my generation is kind of I'm almost a shaming of our indigenous practices. Right where black people thought it was You know unintelligent it to say Hallelujah right like do you know how we ended. Colonialism on the continent is through our spiritual practice. So you know we shouldn't do is let them do us into thinking. We don't need to pray that we shouldn't talk to our ancestors that we should act like you know the whispers that I hear now I must say on crazy to white folks. I'm sure but that's okay But in the shower I hear my ancestors my guy talking to me and telling me to do this do do that. And it's clear I know what it is right and so part of what gets me through is hearing that and saying this is the voice of like one of the things we need to think about even especially with black lives matter when we go out we try to go out as soon as someone is killed and we pour libation for that person person right because their bodies are stolen but their spirits are present right and we don't want them like even if you just think thinking about yourself personally. I don't ever want to die alone like I don't WanNa die and just be left there and so yeah and so we go and we pour libation and sometimes we're literally standing on their blood. So how can you not have a spiritual practice doug to have the we've talked about some heavy things I WanNa know what's the lighter side of your life. I laugh every fucking day. The why are you laughing at right now. I have three kids. Oh they're funny. They're areas so my youngest is a boy he's he's fourth grade. He had a girlfriend in the first and second grade and now they're broken. Larry is because I said whatever happened to her her and he said she's in a different classroom. Long distance relationships everybody knows is a long distance. Relationship would never work shit so yeah so my my kids be having me rolling. Watch stand up comedy almost every day. I like that. What's his name rail? Yeah Yeah oury Regal Yeah Lil rel. Yeah so I just watched his stand up. That was hilarious. And I've been make fun of the stand up like why are black black people who were not from La calling it in crenshaw instead of on crenshaw like I don't understand what in crenshaw what are you in that doesn't make sense it doesn't make sense at all. I don't know if that's like a like a grammar thing. I don't know if it's just like nonentity it's ongoing they keep calling it in crenshaw. I think they come cringe place. Not a Surrey. I think when Nipsy got killed I see and we started talking talking about in the crenshaw district. Then they started thinking it means. You're supposed to say well. So if you're saying in crenshaw gotcha wrong. We like to every episode asking our guest. What is your secret to life to thriving to being you? That's a hard ask question. My secret grid is one of my secrets is submission to the will of God And working to honor honor my ancestors and make my momma proud beautiful beautiful absolutely beautiful. What a pleasure it's been to have you allante? Thank you so much for coming and speaking with US thank you thank you thank you so laurie learning I just talked to Dr Molina Abdulah. I've been saying Abdellah time like someone who can't read But this is not about a I lack of an a pronunciation ability. This is about one of the dopers interviews. We've possibly ever had these getting better and better I. You know I'm Blessed I'm so in awe of black woman I'm just GonNa work that. They do their their presence in June. I mean I'm I'm just feeling really like impacted. Yes I her. Her words of hope like I'm going to be honest today like a really rough day day for me and my feeling like is there. Is there a way out or up out of this shit and I I feel so much better I feel I have more hope through this conversation and it was just like a reminder for me that when I lose my sense of hope or that things can change they win and Anita I always remember to keep that to keep that in mind. I really loved a lot of the things she said but one of the great thing she said was her secret. I loved her secret I left. That's my word. Yeah I totally stole. Stole your thing where you're like. I always here because it's usually the most impactful thing you know. 'cause that's the point of that question. And you know and submission right is is interesting to me because the word itself implies this weakness I think but what I've learned over the years especially As you know learn ideal with so much anxiety. I'm a very anxious person and so much of the training that I've gotten from meditation is is a is a sort of submission. It is a sort of acceptance ends. Admission and acceptance are not the same thing but I think they're cousins cousins and for me. Her whole words spoke to me as a person person who does have a deep spiritual practice like I pray in the morning I pray at night and her whole thing of submission to the will of God and working to hear my ancestors are lake two big things that I try to focus on my life so it was just like remember to like when I feel when you feel like you can't just get through just to get still and let them talk to you and listen and like let my ancestors be like my guides. I don't know if I've ever talked about this on the part before. And if I have forgive give me guys but one of the conversations that we had you know that fateful meeting that reuniting that we had when we had dinner we talked about working together. Her one of the things I was in a very dark place says usual as a black woman in the world. Dark place I was like doc feeling very like I. Just I'm at my wit's end I don't know how to get to the next level and one of the things that you said to me was does stand on the shoulders of the ancestors. He said something like that. Like like like you're not alone you you reminded me that. I've come so so far and that was one of the things that I loved that Dr Abdulah talked about was. Let's think about the great things we've done and how far we've come how far we've come. How far we come like the fact that we exist like when you think of just you as a black purses and chattel over for me as a black American Chattel slavery and the things that my ancestors head to persevere through so that I can sit did here in brea is like how how dare have the audacity to sit in feel hopeless? Yeah and my this conversation. N- The remembrance of you know Matt People Who Send Me Signs all the time is just a reminder to be lake nothing will defeat you because you are guided. Absolutely you know. Well yes I word of the week. you know you know what it it is. It's the mission I think right now are the world is calling on us to to give. That's that's why give of our time give our energy give of our resources and I. I've been kind of ignoring that call for a little while you you know and I think this this is a great time to recommit myself to to submit to the collective to the greater sense of. We're all in this together to the call to stand up and speak out as it seems like black men constantly are but hey if that's what I'm here for do it. Yes our cup runneth over our cubs turning over and hope this pod helps your cup. Yeah Fill Your Cup House. Fill fill fill your cup in. Hopefully this is giving you some inspiration to like not let not let motherfuckers get you down fighting writing and be informed and grow is something that I am just internally thankful feel blessed for the community ready of women yeah make sure to check out black XMAS DOT ORG as mentioned by Dr Abdulah and maybe considered switching to a black bank There's so many things to do and just thank you guys so much and we will talk to you soon thank you. That's a Rafferty's on season two. We are on hiatus but we will be back so soon and in the meantime where can people find us they can follow us at the NFL VW on Instagram and twitter. So do it do it. States checking out those things for post and updates about our triumphant return learn and and we can't wait to talk to you soon we are your hosts Charlotte Morriston and Lauren. Domino the secret lives of black woman is is a production. Stitcher our producer. Is Stephanie Kariuki. Our editor is John Palmer. The show is recorded and mixed by Andy. Kristen's special thanks to our chief. Content sent officers Chris Bannon and Brendan Byrne who made our theme music. Make sure you follow us on instagram twitter at the S. L. B. W.. See you later.