Ep. 487: Lincolnian Projections


Yeah. Ladies and Gentlemen Hello again welcome back to don't worry about the government. My name is Chris November. Now it is Wednesday evening October Twenty, eighth twenty twenty. We are just a few days away from election day and before we get started, let me remind you all once again please go and vote and in many states now it is imperative that you go and do so in person or deliver your ballots in person do not allow the male to be the vehicle for which your vote gets returned because. This year quite frankly There is a real chance that it might not get counted and wouldn't want that to happen to you and you wouldn't know until after the fact, after fact, do you ever know with me on the show today is Lindsay Duke Lindsay Duke. If, a vote is voted but encountered does anyone now I think that's called like a hanging Chad or something. There's like a job that could make and I'm just not actually functioning as a human enough at the moment to really be clever and I'm sorry I'm just going to be here to let you down. Okay all right. Well, if a true false in the forest, we will move along with a show. So we've got a number of different things I want to talk about here on this episode, this is just kind of talk soup episode of stuff that is happening around the election here Soup it is. There's some interesting stuff here how about this I I know I have this in one order. Let's jumble the order a little bit because lent's fairly quick. We learned today the identity of Lodestar. Anonymous This is miles Taylor if that's not a household name. That's okay. Probably means that CNN or MSNBC is not on in your household a lot. But if you watch either of those two networks, you have seen miles Taylor around in recent weeks here he's doing the trump rehabilitation tour thing and just to remind everyone miles Taylor was the Department of Homeland Security's Chief of staff in February twenty, nine hundred actually was elevated to that position. So he had a relatively high position of power in the Department of Homeland Security Wall Dhs was doing and Was beginning to do I was gonNA say was doing. It sounds like in the past tense. It is still very much ongoing but was beginning to do very horrible things down the border to the people that they were detaining and he published this I am a secret guy in the White House said, I am trying to stop the bad things from happening. Well, very much doing bad things. You gotTa love that right secret identity where you're like in a position to do good and you don't. But you talk about how much he wished he could. It's fun I mean he's been calling himself a whistle blower right and. Did. He. Bowl whistle. I mean, what did the anonymous editorial bowl whistle on? There's bad still emptying in the White, house? You know what's funny to me is. I had to remember what the anonymous book thing was. because. I was like wait anonymous. Group the hacking group. That's how crazy this year's been that I. Forgot about that particular scandal. Because it's like you have never trump version of anonymous that you also have left. And they're two different things. Never trump out of is getting. Left out of this has been. So here's my other thing on miles. Taylor though. So I get the, he's a whistleblower I don't want. Legal reprisal on him well, I'll take that back. He's of He's in a great area of whistle blowing to me because it's like what did he both the whistle on, and that is important if you're going to call yourself a whistle blower, but I'd still want him to be covered under whistle blower protections. But here's the other thing in choosing to remain anonymous well into this year and he was asked about it by Anderson Cooper and other people who still denying that he was an anonymous people inside the administration I'm not saying they're good people. Are Mother people were getting wrongfully accused of being anonymous in need trump which hunt to try to find out who anonymous Woo Hoo. We can't have that. Yeah I'm not I. I'm not saying these poor people but I'm saying if you're going to try to go like miles, Taylor's this hero throwing people under the bus by throwing up the smoke. Clear he's not. Yeah. No. I don't I don't know Victoria Coats. If you're willing to work inside the administration, I'm assuming that you're not a great person but Victoria coats did face correo reprisals from colleagues who thought that she might be the author because the trump administration's culture is so toxic in paranoid that like everyone wants to find the most so we can please Mr Trump. Yeah. No, it's. Not a cruel thing that he knows and just. So tired of all of these people who they desperately want you to know that they're trying in that. They understand that he's a big bad man but nope, can't actually go on the record. Jeff. Bolton What's the chief of staff that always oh John Kelly John Kelly. Kept low-profile just, Gimenez. Off. Cow into this little man that youth. Especially People Mattis Madison's spell because Mattis was run out of the administration and okay I kind of get if you get into the depth of madness, Maddison's departure from the Obama administration was not exactly smooth. It was dicey enough that when he got fired by Obama's team, he actually burned a whole bunch of his records so. He pissed off. They did not see eye to eye on this stuff but then again, matters also has now served inside of the trump administration and knows full well, just how trump is and was telling the troops that it when he was still inside the administration where the hell's even. But I'll tell you I'll tell you off the record. especially. That losers, suckers, background information you know where? It was probably John Kelly or mattis that made those comments. And they just won't these she the new jared Kushner stuff not just seeing bill. Bob Woodward Bob Woodward today back after. Choosing choose selectively released portions of some of the recorded conversations that might have been very important about the public health crisis. He's back with more selected releases. The most dangerous people around the president are over competent idiot jd bright because that has a way sometimes getting past his defense mechanism because if you're overconfident then sometimes you know on a topic where he doesn't have other people around to kind of validate it, then he can sometime say, okay, let's go with that. So that's kind of. I think if you look at the evolution over time, we've gotten rid of a lot of the overconfident idiots and now he's got a lot more thoughtful people who kind of know their place and know what to do. Really damning stuff would have been great to know about months ago really hard to reconcile that methodology with the methodology that he used inside the Nixon administration when when you've got the store, you actually get out with the story Woodward here on the other had the story and chose to sit on it for eight nine months. Yeah. I, don't know what he thinks he's doing. I mean I I can understand the greed of at all but there are certain people I think where their legacy is supposed to supposedly matter more to them. And he always struck me as one of those people that enjoys the clout. You know he's he knows. He's Bob. Woodward. He gets, he gets About every president. You know whether or not they like it and the stories I've heard you know I always thought of him as more of someone on par with like Michael Isikoff, who is someone who gets to cover all these administrations ten to write a book. That's really kind of like critical 'cause they always talk about the Woodward Book and the Woodward Book would usually be kind of like probing an in depth but. In this case it's almost like he went in to write the sequel to fear. And fear is a good example of where the Woodward Book. Method of getting stuff writing a book. It's not really nothing in there's really per se a story. Maybe some of it would have helped them. All were investigation that that's maybe a fair criticism of fear. But. If you're talking about this book and then you went in and did the. Woodward Book Treatment. But was actually sitting on a very important story for the public that was a life indepth story in a way that. George Stephanopoulos. Nations through the Clinton administration in. Nineteen. ninety-two is never going to result in a body cast of hundred thousand dead right right Just. Love that. It's It's just. I'm at a loss for words frankly at the last couple of weeks of stories and I woke up to trump scandals this morning. There I can't even imagine at this point. What he may or may not have on record that he could release right now our choosing not to. And I don't even know if it matters at this point, it probably could still a little bit but voting is happening, but the covert thing is never not going to Piss me off. I bet you would word sitting on something involving rigging the election Our I just get that out on Monday. God. I gotTA. Be. Chris. I. It's IT'S GONNA happen regardless whether or not. Books already better he would. She's trying to do sales. We don't care about your book such guy. I did it episode. Shatti. He's really mad about not complete. Schipol booth that Bob Woodward did here and it's just that polite media. and. Even the you know reliable sources, the Brian stelter program that's supposed to hold the media to account like no one's actually you know people are very mad Bob Woodward instead of the much more pointed. Bob Woodward. Did something here that was like an actual life or death thing in in that trolley car problem he chose the five people and not the one people. One person whatever it's worth reminding. Hey Dude. You could have. This miles guy and Bob Woodward, you could have that's the summary. The Miles Taylor? That guy? Who knows how much stuff he was sitting on with regards to the actual structure of the Department of Homeland Security's child separation policy the child attention policy I mean he was probably privy to a lot of information here and so while he's been allowed to go on this. I've seen the light slash. I've liked to work again in the next decade Anthony. Yeah and he's got one joke. He's got exactly one joke. The the unit of time. We need to talk about a group that I've talked about in passing and admit. I what I was assessing the temporal overton window on this group I. Kind of thought that they were less big of a deal than it turns out. They are the Lincoln Project. They're a pretty big deal little bed in the democratic. Party. For those of you who are not familiar with the Lincoln project is by prominent never-trumpers but never trumpers in this case can be more precisely defined as people like Rick Wilson Steve Schmidt George Conway run says Lo Jennifer Horn read gallon. Mike did not really familiar with Mike Madrid. But they started off ripples. Probably the biggest that you've seen he's got a high level quitter presence. He's also a guy who's pretty good when it comes to doing late night television Steve Schmidt tries. I think he's less good at it on George. Conway's got a pretty high level twitter presence. They have during the course of this election really over the last two years here through the Muller on probe and going into this election built a brand that is far larger than leftist podcasts and I'll give you some figures on how much money left his podcast or making here in just a minute is kind of like big big fish versus bigger fish here and even groups like crooked media. They now boast a bigger following the GOP's main account on twitter and the main accounts of groups like crooked media on twitter, and they hit two million downloads in October on Apple. Oh Man Yeah that thing was going to bite us in the ASS. Wasn't it? Look. I. Would Look. This is how I feel. Like. Lincoln Project Okay. I would love for Republicans. To Go. To. Go back to being a party where we were debating tax policy. where it's not literally life-or-death. Depending on what you think about you know cash and how that affects life death that can be debated but you know how? Whether or not certain people deserve rights. Why is that part of the Republican Platform? These days of? Gays can be married and things like that. I am so tired of. That sort of issue I would not mind if there was a calmer. P. Peaceful Republican Party that just really hated taxes and. You know seems like the Libertarians were they just don't want anything in their business at least I at understand. that. I understand not wanting the government to control as much. It's not my beliefs. It's not how I think a government can be run especially in today's Day and age, and I don't think you can run government like a business either which is popular saying some of these people but. So there's part of me. That's like I would not mind if the Lincoln project inherited the earth sort of saying with. A lot of this but. I also know that these are the kind of people that are putting themselves in a position where they are gearing up to literally do that to inherit the earth if trump loses to be the place where some can go. when they're tired of Fox News Or. their favorite. Really far right person who is now sounding just kind of silly to them. For some reason, they need a calmer republican presence and that will be weaponized. And they're using money from Democrats. To do it because Democrats, have really bought in on the support of the Lincoln Project I get it. I read tweet some of the ideas, but my my saying has thought process has been this whole time. The enemy of my enemy will be my enemy once again. After the election if you if you guys. come for human rights. And despicable things like supporting some of these. Justices and all sorts of things we've seen them hint at. Even if they haven't completely said it out loud I'm sorry you're just I'm not going to. Pretend, like you're not dangerous and they have. been. Brilliant. And so they are brilliant. In how they are handling things and they may be able to do this whole Republican thing better. than the tea party tried qn on people tried or Trump even tried. So we need to take them very seriously and engage them as such. That was a long way of saying. Yeah. The Lincoln, project man how? The Lincoln Project. Is An interesting interesting relationship when when I look at them because I think on one hand. The Lincoln. Project. Addressed a very real deficit in the Democratic Party, which was their messaging sucks. They have been very bad messaging and those of us who are old enough to remember the last decade twenty through twenty twenty and that's going to be where a little bit of the generational divide between the kids who are in college now and people who are in our age cohort of the thirties year to feel a little bit of that difference there democratic messaging used to suck and for a long time Democrats and progressives have one of the democratic. Party to have a little bit more. Heft behind their messaging a little bit more spine a little bit more force behind their messaging something about a Charles Schumer, speech just doesn't get our liberal blood fired up and ready to go. Home. But that's always bothered me about credit messaging is that they won't say the quiet part out loud which is what the Republicans do. And I'm so tired of it like Lech If. If you if you're Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer and you genuinely don't think that everyone should have a living wage and we need green new deal and everyone should have a universal health care. Then you need to say that out loud because I'm pretty sure you do believe that those things should happen but you're just scared to work for them and I'm so tired of your your fear because it's crushing us just just go for it. We Mitch McConnell constantly just saying everything I love it. He's going to do it might sound crazy to your point. Nancy Pelosi calls a dismissively the green dream and it's other one of two things right Her own shadow she believes in this thing, but is only timid and then people who are supporters of the Democratic Party or would be supporters of the Democratic Party look and see a leadership figure that is scared for own. And scared to say the thing that she really believes really exhibit her convictions, which is weakness or even worse she actually believes that. Other one is not a desirable outcome and I think what the Lincoln project has been pretty good at is putting a lot of force into the messaging a lot of the ads like so there is the part where they're stealing material from the Internet I mean it's the Internet especially when you WanNa talk about twitter people copy pasta on twitter all day. So it's like Fuck Jerry aren't they? Yeah. Bringing in fucked brings it up to a different level and so like when they do stuff like that I, think that's bullshit. fucked jerry just go watch a couple of the documentaries made about. Fuck. Yeah they are very smart Marketing Company there smart marketing. Company but there are Smart Marketing Company would come to stealing matere. Yes. They're very good criminals. So. When they do stuff like that, I can't applaud but at the same time. Putting up the billboard in New York City. Of. Jared Anda Vonda, and getting that to make national TV rounds. Gain that to go viral on twitter, what they're exhibiting is a real. For for advertising marketing and messaging and what I had really underestimated is how much this is connecting to the democratic electorate writ large and so I think there is something in in our progressive and even. If I'm in the progressive bubble over here, and there's like the bubble over here, there's something that all of us have been missing about the Lincoln projects, messaging and the energy that they're throwing down and I've been trying to really think about what it is. The Lincoln project is bringing a sue the airwaves into thoughts. Or to the energy of the party that has been absent from left media and the biggest thing I can come up with is the disposition and the disparity of the disposition between what was happening with the Muller probe from people like Lincoln project who are following it intimately and really Kinda staying in beat in lock with. Democratic voters were on that and we're allowed the democratic base was on that, and then conversely with the chop o trap houses, the Michael Tracy's on the dirtbag left sphere red scare part of the world with air pretending like it was an illusion which is like man, all these Democrats are so stupid. They don't. They don't even realize what's going on here. This is all Russia Gate it's all hoax and the Lincoln project. Was Finding a way to actually pace with the heartbeat whereas over here you've got something that's like an off beat rhythm. And that's I think a big part of it. I mean there's like there's there's real divide here right now if I had to choose one of the two I, probably choose the leftist folic. As Lincoln, projects little let the Lincoln Project. These guys are Iraq war salesman. I am old enough to of not lost sight on the fact that the Iraq war is bad and we talk about the badness of what trump donald trump has done this year and I've been measuring it in the context of the Iraq war. The conceit there's at the Iraq war is a deeply immoral act. A trump's doing sexy worse than that. But these people were selling that. Shit and roof bulletin you don't have to go back that far to see some pretty despicable comments. This guy I don't think. So changed man, this guy just has changed brands. ooh, that's a that's a good line there you you made yourself a little like that phrase there I think. It's interesting. I know a Lotta people especially. A very vocal people on the left who want to write off every Republican. And I think they usually don't have Republicans in their family than make it just so easy to do that. So Yeah I. You know the other part of it is is that in watching interviews this week on TV of different voters like I saw this one woman for Maine. You Begin to see the people who the Lincoln project might deeply appeal to like this woman, the ultimate manager I do a Maine accent but I've been to Maine, I have spoken to mainers who have a Maine accent and this woman had like almost main of made accents and she was also the most main of main dispositions which she's like, Oh, I don't really care about party I can't even do it. It's like turning into Minnesota. Don't really care about party I just vote for whoever I liked the most and I can't do it anymore at the Republican Party they've just lost their way among. Right and she's in her late fifties early sixties she's never listen to Chapo but the League project people have something to say you know if she was someone who tuned into a podcast. Lincoln projects connected with her I mean what you need to do is packaged negatively and I soft way. which is what I think. Lincoln project is doing. It's very it's. Interesting how they? especially, the really dire stuff like. They've been putting out ads this week about people dying from covid and having to say goodbye to their mom. know over the the phone. And they it's like a dramatization steph heard happened. But you're seeing like a one minute clip of these two daughters trying to talk to their mom over the phone and say goodbye to her it's so grim and morbid, but it's theatrical and gets you right in the gut like they. They know their demo and they're doing it very well, go on watch some of the Lincoln project stuff and contrasted to what the official up Democratic National Campaign Committee is doing and it is. As our punchy and the Lincoln project is giving them a messaging heft that the Democrats have not had it strong. Think there's a fear I think they are completely is like in fear of any sort of negative messaging. And I get why sort of but I also just think you could instead of being negative, you could be fierce if you don't want to be you know like tell trump ran in twenty. Though country is going to shit at another and you obviously don't want to be another Obama I. Guess because it seems a little too naive at this. You can't go hope and change when people really feeling that they're feeling the world sucks. What we're GonNa do like you could just go super FDR on the problem you know. nothing to fear. But fear itself and a kick things s there isn't alternative to negatively in it's not necessarily positively it's just. Ring then action and results and. truth to power even when it's your own power. You know call yourself out on occasion. and. That's what I think. Lincoln project is really good at is is a lot of that is definitely speaking truth to power. They don't give a show. Part of the reason I think they've been able to make headway. One is that the Democratic Party leadership is naturally much closer to the Lincoln project guys and much more familiar with the Lincoln project guys, and if done cocktail circuit with the League project guys all the swampy swamp stuff. then. They would be with progressive podcasts I mean even the. Even the crooked media guys they are kind of on the outside looking in in comparison to rick wills interesting. No. Look at morning Joe who goes on Morning Joe more the crooked media guys or the Lincoln? Project? Guys. It Steve Schmidt it's rick. Wilson and they're on all the time. That is where democratic leadership is the even the crooked media guys are on the outside it's interesting. I think. People the puck is kind of different things I think crooked is is like we're going to be unabashedly. Liberal and Democratic and. Just not. Try to play the even if some of these people we used to work for. Facts, are facts, i. that's why I like them. Then there's like extremely far left people who are. So, far left. They don't realize. They're big. Box. Down at their hands and see the fared little just binary code hands and they're not actually humans. Show so To put a little. Finer points you have. No No. But like I, I'm in the crooked media camp where it's like you have the push, the Democratic Party camp where like the idea and really the kind of. The show is the job Ao. See Push Warren push the Democratic Party even Sanders Sanders course the Democratic Party type person. And then you have a reject the democratic. Party. Reject electoralism sort of branding of podcasts out there. People still there's not as many. Now, this time around I'm to their credit selling acceleration ISM but people who are selling acceleration in acceleration ISM in 2016 sixteen, you have that divide. And what I think the last episode when I was talking with Josh Johnson from the daily show unless episode we talked about. When you're changing systems like when we talk about like systemic problems and changing systems or how systems arise they arise in quiet ways and they arise and if you want to change a system or build a system you do so quietly versus loudly because loudly. With vision and a lot of cases, dominant systems get built up. In extreme quiet and usually under the guise of friendship. So in the case of the Lincoln project rather than rejecting the American flag and saying Oh Erica's not so great and the Democratic Party is not so great. And you know basically being like bitter medicine. Like some podcasts are the Lincoln project kind of went the other way around where they're like. A proud progressive tradition that even includes Republicans in Abraham Lincoln, and here's the American flag and we love America and trump's really bad and he is corrupt and like they're basically, yes anding reflecting back a lot of what the democratic electorate not the progressive base this is more right. This is broader than just the progressive democratic electorate generally believes the Lincoln project was way way way better at muring that back and the establishment Right. down. MSNBC, and who they were worn a book on their morning programs and other high profile shows was way more comfortable with that I. Mean do think about how much of a fixture Wilson was everything from Rachel? Maddow. Show to morning Joe, he got every single thing on MSNBC. So if you're watching that Democrats watch MSNBC. You're seeing the Lincoln project guys and you Kinda like them. Kind of say stuff. You like that recall Wilson, kind of funny yeah. I mean. I get it. I? It's hard I. think especially if you if you're someone like me who's in Texas, my entire life. So I've been surrounded by Republicans, my entire life and essentially thought I was Republican for a large portion of my life because that's what you are your default. Your default Republican in Texas. You just you kinda missed his calm conversations about like pam these fucking nuts, right. This is this is it's also keyed up and over dramatic and exhausting, and there's conspiracy theory groped thrown in now and people are tired and in lockdown where nothing's making sense and they don't have any money and all these people suck and you're just like you just. Oh man at least there's some people on the other side of that casino that it's bullshit to. You know there's a I hadn't even thought about that. There's a regionality thing here too. So the crooked guys and law that leftist podcast they all come from the coast. Largely, the New York and northeast area but maybe California too. I was born in the northeast but I have lived in the South West and the south for two thirds of my life at this point. There's just a very different speed at which we talk about things and think about things. I mean you know right down to guns pistols like the idea of having a pistol if you were out in rural Texas or you're out in rural Arizona or whatever people just have a gun. It's There's just a different way of thinking about some of the stuff that the conversations are different the word choices or difference. It's Y'all instead of US guys. Right down to simple stuff like that. This is why I've been so persistent in my support of the. Democratic Party investing in Texas specifically. because. I. Think it is not only the largest state that you could use electoral literally but I think that we are purplish enough especially nowadays where. If you invested here and actually made the like reached out to the politics more here. You would get a hell of a lot of independence and weak Republicans to back you because. We just need Some investment were always looked over this giant state and you've written us off because for Texas and you just don't want to. Okay cool. It's Kinda like how they've written off the entire south. If you keep writing off the entire south because of the civil war you're just you're you're. Really. Even further in, you have to start making investments in the places that you can't win because it will be worth it because the next generation. is they're they're literally turning eighteen as we speak and they're not hardcore Republican unless you leave them alone unless you abandon them. At. The only people that I know in that sort of age range range that have any sort of republican leanings. Are really disconnected political. Dudes you know they're in their twenties just want to work on their trucks. They don't have a huge investment in that. You can get people like that if you start. Having these conversations and even those guys you know they're not. Super, they don't hate people they. There's there's like wiggle room with some of these some of these people in terms of the really extreme stuff. I think having a campaign in Texas. Would help Democrats refined and expanded their national messaging you need to start. Let's Fly over states and things like that. Study Ann Richards Study Willie Nelson. There are democratic figures Jim hightower. There are democratic figures in the state that are case studies and you can figure out how message. I think we've. Kinda like the coastal elites thing. I'm thinking you know the south coast. Could be people forget about that to Houston off gotta you gotTa. Entire Gulf coast. We don't want to go down to Houston, but he's Entire Gulf coast you could invest in and I know that this look. I'm not here to say that civil war. Didn't go the way it should. Even, if you think that's what. We want what's happening. No I'm teasing. But you know I think there's still a lot I. See it every day on twitter I saw today of just someone completely spitting on the idea of Texas turning blue this election I'm like it's not about if he wins if Biden Winds Texas, it's about if you can lift up the entire state and get more Democrats in some of these offices by having his name at the top and you supporting him and you get the engagement up, you're GONNA have you might have a blue Texas House and that's to give. Make redistricting. In the next election huge like you're going to get three more districts. maybe we should have the house be blue for that because that'll be important. Yeah. Instead of like being straight lean red if it's a lean red battleground state that actually has down ballot implications, those votes are coming from somewhere. So for example, in my home district here, my representative is calling allred. He is a first term. Democratic congressman so that demographic needle move is enough to get Cohen allred into the House of Representatives displace a Republican. Member of the House and now collins up for reelection again, this time shout out to. Get Him. Yes I'm just GonNa talk about I. Think this is really it's simple to understand here I just want to finish this thought like why did this happen in Texas? So if you go back to the recession in two, thousand, eight, Obama takes office, the country starts to recover but one state is recovering faster than all the rest. Texas and this guy this governor Rick Perry. Kind of people like him that I had a little thing going here. Rick Perry was touting this thing called the Texas miracle and what was the Texas miracle the Texas miracle was that Texas had very low state income tax and very low corporate taxes and it was very attractive to businesses that were downsizing. Presume impre- The work at home era, and they were not trying to get rid of the office places. At this point, they're just trying to find a way to make a cheaper office and so what they're able to do is come out to Texas get a lot more real estate way lower taxes way lower income taxes and slowly but surely from the East Coast and the West Coast income, all these people. From California and New York in Virginia and Florida, and they move into Texas and guess what they don't just magically convert to being Republican when they moved to Texas would they bring in? Is All of their values and their sensibilities and they arrived at Texas? They're like Holy Shit I thought this is going to be like king of the hill, but it's like a thousand times worse. It's nowhere near as fun. We're all going to be like Hey Hill I. Wish. And then they decide that they want to vote and they do and then skip ahead here you arrive at the point where Texas is picking people like Ted Cruz on the Republican side. That's kind of a whole different thing about the Republicans need to drift rightward in primaries. But after picking Ted Cruz Bell rourke almost bumps the guy off in amid responsible for half of the good things that happened in Texas that election because of the down ballot support just having his aim at the top of the ticket had. He gets mocked. Republicans and the conservative media have put a lot of energy and by the way, some of those aforementioned podcasts have put a lot of energy into mocking work and I'm not sitting here and going to tell you that everything better. Does is way cool and like sometimes he's squares bill sometimes he's a little bit of a torp but his impact for the democratic. Party, and thus for the nation on by displacing a Republican stronghold down ballot is measurable. He has done meaningful stuff and frankly if the Democrats and put a little bit more air behind him. Post the Cruise Ron, they'd be in better field position. The. Like his sanding who and Castro like not actually putting more energy into that guy and more juice into that guy big. It's I think that's exactly what I'm talking about is. You see people who are major change bringers and a lot of flyover countries. Have Stacey Abrams who thankfully is making solid traction and has had the skepticism of Beto but he? There's always a sort of like looking down on him. I get it. He's got his antics, but the DUDE has produced results. You guys need to start thinking in these ways and Invest in some of these people that actually are helicase matic like Jamie Harrison. Very charming man I, wish that guy would. I know I had decided. I spent I spent so much energy. I never signed up more I never gave them a dime but. I had to put a tournament. Stop I can't help you I. Don't know. You know we don't know them ten bucks and I. Said Good Luck Man. This tend to stop this stop. The find these people who are actually garnering attention and start investing in those states. Even if you don't think you can win them now because you are pulling up the whole state Oh, my God, why is it such rocket science and why do you keep looking down on us just be this is my this is my joke about the southern thing is like You keep looking down all bunch of Hicks and I'm sorry. But half of people in Austin right now are there because Silicon Valley moved to? Austin. So we can't be too stupid Dallas is the fifth largest media market like if you want to understand Texas. Texas is a microcosm of America in a lot same thing that's happening with Carolina whose cities Yup. South Carolina's to big blue cities, lots of rural spaces and you to kind of tell those two things up. But like we have all of the hallmarks of a battleground state and I don't let Florida where you have big cities and then you have the rural parts up north or you had to kind of account for those people going out and voting. Texas and it I mean, what's more interesting is that this was the stronghold for the Republican strategy. This is the Republicans California and they have lost it and it's not like they have a chance. The Republicans have a chance of California anytime soon and. It's just what I, what I see with a lot of states like north. Carolina is this. Purple Tipping Point. We still don't know how it's going to go in this election, but you hear the same stories. Of North Carolina about how the demographics have shifted and that's what's making competitive Georgia you're gonna get up in the next ten years to flip. You're going to get North Carolina to not just flip but stay flipped you're going to get Texas in the next ten years if not this election which knock on wood, it's very bizarre. I don't think it's going to I mean I'm not a betting person so I'm not going to say but Ted Cruz is on the ballot in twenty twenty four and I feel like twenty. That point, it will strongly be a battleground interesting. And the the dog I hope the Democrats don't screw the Pooch and who they nominate against cruise this next time around because they needed to rockstar not beto I'm not. Only. Senate, I think. They need to nominate like who he and Castro and they need to build up the machine around that guy, and he needs to run against Ted. Cruz. And like. Because there's no way you can accuse who he had. Castro being like fake the same where they tried to do with Robert Francis Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. You need to start picking. That's another thing is. You've got stars on the bench some of you guys need to go home. It's Like from Hamilton, you can go. Sit on under your own vine and fig tree at home and just chill it's time for you to chill and retire and. You need to start investing Julio Castro in the Jamie Harrison. Stacey. Abrams the people out of like Arizona new certain finding like the Mark Kelly's were. It's they're just very enigmatic characters start putting some invent. Marchelli, in Theresa. Greenfield. I don't know. I mean both of them are. Remarkably. Strong candidate. I've been really impressed by both. Of you it's terrific an ashtray taste. Good. Yeah, no Kelly Kelly's awesome. No, and also a very pick. I've really impressed by people who are wasting their energy on people who shouldn't be even in the House and Senate in the next race as start putting them on their teams giving them stops making them come up with crazy awesome plans like the bench is incredible if you want it to be. I can't wait to vote for her I don't know if it's GonNa be next selection or she's talking about running for Senate. Can't I'm going to be giving money no I'm going to be building her brand. I'm protective especially after what was done to Elizabeth Warren I am very active of my progressive female presidential candidates and Senate candidates and I will be even more of a bulldog going forward. Yeah. I think that's what I. Is what I'm trying to say at some point is that There are very few actual. Truly. Red. Red States. It's not as much as you think, there's places like Utah, which are very conservative but Montana. But Utah's also kind of gettable and kind of weird with now. Because of its Mormon base they are not people who like this fiery hatred that trump's spouse I mean that's why Mitt Romney is the way he is he dances on the line about supporting certain things and not supporting because there is a culture of like. What does it humbleness or or not being addicted other while you know the the ostentatious quality of Donald Trump is basically. Incomplete tension with the way Mormons personal conduct standards. Go Mormons, even though a lot of them are very wealthy on cases like they've been pretty good wealth creation, it's Considered to be pretty much. Taboo. Like kind of socially unacceptable, just awkward to be like I'm a hot dog like that's not a Mormon sensibility it's just not who are. that. Mormons are all about being humble and seven. So the energy that trump has been throwing off that's just been. So Contra to them. That's really only held at bay by like Republicans pushing fear buttons talking about T- talking about leftism socialism and godless Marxism taking over the Democratic Party and stuff like that. I mean, that's I get whether. They have to push. I understand the certain, the the religious values that pushed them into conservative politics in theory, and that's what I'm trying to get at more is that there's a lot of these places where. People are aren't like we see on twitter and Cuban on. Its, they don't. They barely keep up with politics and. I don't know if they're racist or homophobes or I don't but I'll tell you what like if the Democrats are has over a white person I'm not sending I'm going to sit here and make determinations about those things. It's not my job. Democrats recruited me A, love in. UTAH. She would probably win if she said I'm joined the Democratic Party. because. She could run as an independent and like maybe caucus the Democrats or something like that to angus king sort of Gimmick. But she could basically say I. I've not going to be with the Democrat. Party do my own thing here. But kind of tacitly be with them and say that she got rejected by trump and speak to those fears. You remember what trump said Mia love showed me no love and then she on. Yeah. So I mean just just changed the game changes the game. Get people like. that. We get so many Republicans elected. spitballing ideas. Ear. Expanding out the map especially in the House I, see no reason not to do it. You know I think it's actually kind of an obvious play and Utah. Montana. To your point there are a lot of big box block. He states especially further west on the map that we assume or read, and we assume because they look big on the map that they're big. But they're actually a lot are often not very heavy population and therefore a lot more easy to win because you're only flipping. Fifty thousand votes seventy thousand votes it seems like a big lift in it's not. Looking at you Dakota's Heidi heitkamp comes from the DAKOTAS. So. there. There are examples of these type of candidates that have appeal all over the country. I want to another topic though rule quickly pencil orbit they have a cope outbreak and right now it's like does my pets have A bill bar still some kind of questions in the air about him having Cova. The White House. said one, they're not going to try to contain the spread of covid nineteen across the country anymore markets love that they're having a real cool time with that right now. But they're also doing that inside of the White House they have basically said they're not going to be really trying to do any contact tracing or anything like that when it comes to the Cova nineteen outbreak that's happening in the White House and in the vice president's or Yeah Chris. That's not good. Yup. Each one of them has the potential to infect up to three people which will then. Emphatic talk people at a time so Once again, like I mentioned on the last time I was on your show, it's an exponential disease. so It doesn't affect. One to one affects. One two three. So your one-two-three to three turns into. I don't know what's the mathematics. Nine. And then twenty, seven and then Eighty one. Math maybe eventually don't make me go eighty-one. There's lots of digits stuff there. I. Could get up to four digits. And eventually you're responsible for fifty one thousand people. Nine. Yeah, nine nine. So. It's bad and trump's closing out the campaign here with a death tour across the country I show. Show going into Wisconsin of all places you know. Some people would said Wisconsin you're pretty much fucked and the covert outbreaks really bad there. So you might get another people might get. It was like fuck that I'm going to Wisconsin Gretchen Whitmer. She's the worst locker up. My God. Oh. Happened we need to talk about another thing to. Talk about all the things Chris No. Okay. So obviously, he continues to stoke the flames, Gretchen? WHITMER and I've talked about being worried about political violence and I continue to be really worried about political violence I trump is encouraging it. These right wing militia groups are planning for life after trump this is real. These people have guns they trained with these guns they fetish is using these guns and they think about these guns. And, it's the difference. Between it it's one thing to be a gun owner in a rural part of the woods like or like a rural part of the country where you might need to have a pistol the scare off a bear you know whatever you might go hunting if you're up in Alaska, these people in Michigan. Yeah. They do some hunting, but they also just do some shooting and that as. A very different mindset those type of people who buy guns with the explicit mindset of one day maybe having used on person and that is different than someone who's buying hunting when it earnestly may never occurred to the person who buys the hunting rifle on a series level that one day you're GonNa pointed at you beat because like you bought the seat to go hunting book like What this rifle was four. So yeah. It's a very different mindset and trump has really read that up and then to add fuel to the fire at another rally, he was joking about people shooting Joe Biden three weeks after he's elected, which is weird self-defeating, even worse and much more encouraging people to. Use Political violence against, the Democrats I will never understand this man I will never understand how he got elected or how he's been a president for four years and not put. Behind bars or in a small wooden box where he can't hurt anyone. It's staggering to me. We've seen a assassination we've seen two assassination attempts. In the past ten years on. We had Mark Kelly is running the hallmark of Gabby giffords Gifford and then was scalise. Yes Steve Squeezed, and that was the congressional ballpark shooting where that person. was a Bernie Sanders supporter but was there to just shoot everyone he possibly could and. If I. Put it this way if Bernie Sanders supporter could get to that point. Imagine we're a disgruntled one term this screwed over overboard Danny type of person could who's actually got a lot more training with automatic weapons and look the only reason we haven't had more mass shootings. This share is because we have nowhere to go. It's been so peaceful in that sort of regard we've seen like. We've only seen a few. To you also the only time there is a place to go is when there's protests like police brutality protests, which naturally draw out right wingers to come out there and play hero, and you know be a Rittenhouse and then exactly rittenhouse shows up and gets to shoot a couple people and then gets like a million dollars on his. Go Fund me or Patriot and worse. Whatever he's got now, all sides of Ben There though I'm glad you brought that up because. You had the militia groups show up in. Michigan. State House protesting the cope mass bands back in March because it was all a giant hoax how's that working out for you guys but then you have written house doing what he did getting media treatment where he was not roundly rejected by right wing media and even like the more civil right wing media, they're finding ways to go. It was kind of a defense thing you see. And then also they create a gofundme me for the guy and they reward him with cash and more importantly, they reward him with cash they send a message to everyone else that were rewarding with cash, and if you do this, we got back go and do it. There's an army of us out here and it's not illegal for us to fund your legal defense. So in a way, they've found a loophole for hiring hitmen they are picking up where Timothy McVeigh liftoff. Yes. I, brought up how the Oklahoma City bombing should be much more of an inflection point in the way that we discuss twenty twenty politics in it is whereas we're still so much in the shadow of nine eleven. exactly that whole story if you are not a if you're a young a youth, one of the youths go. Maybe, go listen to the last podcast on the left coverage of Oklahoma City. It'll. It'll at least entertain union get a good history of it at the same time because it'll. It'll put you in the mindset of where we're at now. That the only reason that that militia presence died down in the nineties, you know the Ruby Ridge stuff and the Waco things are really ramping them up and making them get to like we're GONNA make these little cities and communities where it's you know white power everywhere The only reason that died down is because the shame that Timothy McVeigh brought onto those movements when he blew up that building, not just pulled that building but murdered the children in that building. That's where they lost any sort of it hurt their and it didn't recover until Obama. Yeah. It didn't recover until Obama and now it's picking up steam again. The one, two punch of Obama, and then trump who spent his entire he spent his entire. Tenure, prior to running for president, running against Obama and really fueling the flames of that and bringing up the where's the birth certificate stuff and all the stuff that is absolute red meat for these types of groups, and then throughout the course of his administration, I mean everything to equivocating on the proud boy stand back and stand by. Trump has really primed the pump for this and there is a tendency to use the term lone wolf and describe these actors as Lone Wolves and I think it's really important that much. In the way we understand police brutality to not be the actions of one bad officer, the Guy Crushing George Floyd. But instead the byproduct of a culture, a system that promotes this not always intentionally sometimes it's that there is a system that has been kind of built up or there are things that effectively nudge us in one direction or another nudge these types of personalities in one direction or another, but it's very much a system. That has read them up and you can look at what trump's done. The ways encourage people the way you seen the funny stuff and you're starting to see the makings of a system where a person gets radicalized goes. All right. There's a bad person in the Democratic Party and I can go and take them out whether it's Bernie, Sanders Elizabeth Warren Job Biden. It doesn't matter Gretchen Whitmer. And by the way in seeing this, go fund me thing they now see part of a system that suggests. Financial reward or financial support on the back end of this, and also the promise of friendship in this system has been erected. It's not an explicit system. There isn't one person who built it wasn't even built in coordination concert was one other system nonetheless, it's a lone wolves system. Right. And what happens is we forget fat. You know even people like supposed- Lone Wolf Timothy McVeigh. He not only had helped but we have. Extremely, convincing evidence that he had an entire network that. helped that situation in the FBI simply not Nichols for sure we'll Terry Nichols and there's also evidence that the F. B. I wanted a simple case to put him away and they decided not to go after some other people. So. Even these so called Lone Wolves. You know. There's always something there. I would be interested to know It's just. You know for forgetting in this, who is there's also the people who what's the guy, the bill. A group. Not blocks with the Beale They hate bureau of Land Management Bundy. Yes. The bundy. I taught. Yeah. Greatest hits you know. Known what you see and you see it systems the way the government responded to them with such kid gloves and how they it like completely tolerated the takeover of the bureau of land management in the wildlife shelter and everything like that that helped to create a system I. Don't think people are upset about that at the time liberals of course were rife. We upset about that. But I don't think the precision was put onto it as to what the real problem was there, which is that it's fine to be judicious and not try to do a law enforcement action that results in dead people. We're encouraging net. We clap when you do that however in this situation. If you at some point, take a stronger hand to it. It sends the message that in the future this is how you can expect this lar- to play out for you. If you've got enough weapons and the way Redo to have this play out this way versus let's say like anyone of the number of incidences across the country that we've seen involving. African. Americans is for you'd have really dope guns and take a position, and if you do that the government's like probably at least listen to you negotiate with you the the messaging here and the nudging, and the incentivizing is creating a very, very, very dark system quietly, but it's profound. It's the RITTENHOUSE system. and IT'S A. Complete double, standard, of course that. Beyond. The. Double Standards Part of the system. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. We're GONNA Politely Arrest These these fine gentlemen who have taken over this building. But when we knock over that one guy, the unarmed guy in New York and he's a seventy five year old man now as permanent brain damage will probably never fully recover from the injuries he occurred from the NYPD. That's fun. It is what it is. Yep Yep Yep. Yep Yep and it's always God. We could go down and entire path with this because it's so irritating I guess I'm just one of those Democrats that's. Just snowflake enough that US being snowflakes pisses me off. Like I think that you can put so much power and ferocity behind your words and actions as a Democrat I genuinely think it's possible. I don't understand why some people it's not. It's a failure of imagination and. It's a real I run into a defeatist mentality from people sometimes and and what? I. Attributed to is. People will see me criticize Nancy Pelosi I think that's a you know kind of a common one or Chuck Schumer and their approach that I find to be weak ineffectual Feinstein. For example, let's just say I don't know some people think she's ineffectual. Just. Maybe but you have these people and I, think it is. Entirely possible for them to have done better and I think it is. But for a failure of imagination, for example, when it comes to amy, conybeare it that you go we'll Feinstein did about as good as you possibly could. That back to the way that she mishandled the the Christine Blasi Ford information that she got in California back with Cavanaugh this guy's now on the Supreme Court and by doing that allowed the Republicans to brand. This is all Michael Avenue and I have nothing to do with Blasi Ford just. That sort of ineffectual leadership you can criticize it and you can say that it's possible to do better and it's a failure imagination. Here's the difference with Republicans. They never fail to imagine they come up with creative reasons to do whatever the hell they want to do. At what they're doing right now in Pennsylvania looking out there trying to take Bush versus Gore, which was said by the Supreme Court to not be used as precedent going forward. They're now trying to retroactively turned into precedent if I suggested that to the Democrats or democratic listeners are more Democrats supporting listeners. told me a month ago. Oh, come on Chris. It's Kinda outlandish. That's silly. Don't they're going to do everything but but the Republicans don't have that little impulse and you know what they do they just do it and then it's done and then what you thought was impossible possible because it's happening. And lots of people can rant and Rave unbounded on twitter and we can melt as the snowflakes that we are, but it's done did and then you do so then you have to go do. So I've been thinking about like this court situation and. I mean I'm still fighting uphill with some people about the idea that you gotta do something about the Supreme Court that the six three thing. Your secret plan as those warning for the last couple of years in the show here is not surprising to any listeners but I will point it out because I was very worried about this. This is played out worse than I could have imagined but this is the thing that I thought was very real and why this election matter I've been thinking about how do you go ahead and fix the Supreme Court and I decided this week to actually go and as Ron Paul would suggest use the constitution and I went in refreshed myself on article three and Article Three Is pretty straight ahead when it's talking about what the Supreme Court is and it's pretty pretty bleak and pretty open basically says there's going to be a thing called the Supreme Court and the Supreme Court is going to have a person named the chief justice, which could be just as simple as understanding the way we have like a local court right you you've got a local court. You've got a judge only we wouldn't call that judge judge. In this case, we'd call him chief justice make sense it really could have been conceived in thought of as just a one judge system. Well when the first Congress convenes, they are drafting loss and doing important laws and the reason I want to mention the first congress here is the first congress is comprised of the drafters and signatories of the Constitution and so we're going to try to. Interpret and understand constitutional law here the first Congress and how they go about interpreting the constitution's extra probably pretty useful because like if it was a really massive deviation have expected someone in the first Congress to maybe bring that up at some point or you know that wouldn't affect the John APPs kicking around at this Congress Jay's vaccines in this congress. May were kind of good at that. Yeah. Right. Right. Right. Like James Vazza would be like, Whoa, come on. That's not that's not right. So there's an entire musical about this. They come up with the Judiciary Act of seven, hundred, eighty nine. So that's being drafted. The constitutions ratified in seventeen eighty, seven, I congress convened. So you think about that first term. This is being worked out and they pass it in seventeen, eighty nine. That establishes that there's going to be a Supreme Court with multiple justices that you have to have four to have. More or less calls for six, but leaves open to Congress entirely how many number of justices you're gonNA put on there. Even the whole idea of expanding adding justices or removing justices strictly speaking all of its constitutional because the only thing that is required in the constitution is the presence of a Supreme Court and the presence of H chief justice. So what I want to start with here when we talk about constitutionality is that Congress Has the power to define what the Supreme Court is, and this also makes a little bit more sense if you want this back to checks and balances. So you got the system, go the president you've got Congress and you've got the judiciary but process of elimination here. Let's just start with the president the president. If you understand. COM model cannot make loss that's the whole point. The whole point is that Congress has the ability to make laws so congress. The president also can't make courts he can pick justices or she can pick justices they can establish. Nominations but even that all has to go where back to Congress. So then the other projects and balances, the judiciary judiciary can't be a check on itself. So if the president's out of the loop and the judiciary's necessarily out of the loop wers most the power, if not all the power lay. Right here back in Congress Congress gets to set the rules for the courts and has pretty broad authority to do that. and. So if they WANNA pass laws and and defined the courts they can and they should. So all this is just setup what am discussing is not only well within the realm of the politics of the possible it is as firmly routed in the constitution as anything Brett Cavanaugh in his fever dreams come up with as he's drinking Schlitz Malt liquor in the middle of the night in drafting up ways to steal the election. So what should happen with the Supreme Court? I think I. Slit small cavenaugh and also handmaiden Amy Cova Barrett probably need to not be on the court. So what needs to happen? You could impeach them. That is one way of doing this. There's also a providing that judges will serve on courts in times of good behavior good behavior being interpreted to also include like if a judge shoot somebody like they can't be on the court anymore you know they've got to stand trial judge judge if they're in prison. So. There's kind of a way of figuring out what they meant by good behavior here. That's one way of doing. If maybe we figured out where Bret Kavanagh's baseball tickets got paid off, maybe that could be salacious. That might be a reasonable breadth from the court here but we can even skip all that and just say you know the Congress can expensive. Why can't the Congress Taketh away and to add more precedent to this congress did take it away when when no KRISTA. It's probably one hundred years ago. Now did they do that? Chris Twenty Sixteen? Oh yeah plot twist. Like Congress is doing this and no one was like Oh, that's unconstitutional. Would have been interesting if Obama had challenged that actually would help their argument right now but I think the argument is strictly speaking no, it's completely constitutional. Congress has the ability to remove justices it's not just not seating another justice it. Wasn't the Scalia seat that's only in terms of real estate and stuff. In principle there were eight justice on the Supreme Court that point in the Congress chose elected to expand the court and they also in choosing to not replace the person seat chose to reduce the size of the Corp Congress has the ability to add and subtract, and so I think on number justices, we've generally established enormous probably better than even numbers of justices I think that's right. Seven is a good number it's still respects. The way. The balance of the court was about a decade ago, which was a little bit right of center however was seven justices and the ability to replace stuff. The court can change a little bit faster with the times and also now Brett cavenaugh and amy conybeare. Gone. You remove them. I also think other changes here. The confirmation process needs to be moved from the Senate, which is not representative at all and so like when Mitch McConnell and now the Democrats make this really weird argument that we need to let the people have a voice. If that was gonNA, you know mean anything at all one you would listen to the popular vote. So like two thousand sixteen who won the popular vote or you listen to the actual people's House. In Congress, which is the House of Representatives right now, you're listening to the patricians house and the Senate is never going to be representative of the demography of the country. It's only by accident right now it's like sort of close. Or we'll. Be. Pretty close but. This should be done by the House of. Representatives. So think it's another big change. I. Think the court system, another thing that was established and the judiciary act of seventeen, eighty nine is that. The court system can be defined by Congress. who were at the map is the map is doing for a change. It hasn't been changed in a long time and I think we need to add circuit courts and then we also need to end lifetime appointments and reduce it down to one twenty year term. So that is my big fix Emma history lesson and my lecture about. Let, people tell you that this is not constitutional. This is core packing and most importantly fixing the courts does not necessarily require adding more just as you could also remove them. There are lots of ways to I. Don't want to use the phrase skin the cat because I'm a friend of all all felines but there are lots of different ways to get on this horse. Good Job Chris. You have done a great book report and I, I love your summary of mice and men. No You made some really good points. Here's my question. So okay because I didn't do the research that you did and I will not because like I said, I'm just trying to get through. The day. Let alone the next week. For one thing you say remove. Amy Kohn conybeare and Brick Kevin how but does that mean? Who points at them and says those those two in particular we? They're gone we're phasing out the seats based on recent. See I on first off. So is that something where the Congress the Senate in particular would have to convene Congress passed a law and the courts can't protect it. All they can do is interpret constitutionality and article three section one. Word has nothing achieve? Justice. Yeah There is the Republicans. Don't have a great defense here. They'd be looking at subsequent congresses and what I'm making here is an originalist arguments. Cry I. Am now an originalist and that makes me have a certain happen and respectability that I've long commanded but have been denied. Okay. So you are proposing a law. That's what you're saying. Yes. I'm saying I'm sitting here wondering what the mechanism is. It's Just keep just. Ask Bill. So I'm just do I would totally support this bill. I think I on the other side of the spectrum where I think we should have like fifty nine judges. And we should have like a massive supreme court. Let's chop it up. Why do you think more judges would lead to more lucidity and clarity. I think it would move things faster because you can flip those. Those seats, quicker I think people are going to go in and out quicker, which is gonNA keep a like a law of averages kind of thing going on I like circuit court level. I. Don't know that I liked it at the Supreme Court. No, it's not sexy. It's not cool I. Like the avengers squad up there at the top or just the nine, just chilling with their robes on making the decisions but I do like the idea of there being some sort of representative of the population size and so the last time. It got to nine apparently when we were like thirty, two million. I don't know I could be making that fact up. But I think that's the stat that I saw was that we have thirty two million people. When they made it nine justices and if we made it representative of the population size or something like that, like we do the representatives and even the Senate in some ways It would be interesting that. You would have. That Would have a major diversity of opinion, and it would probably still come down to the margins but I don't think that that is a bad thing. If there more opinions I, I don't know. I'm not. I'm not saying it's a great idea I'm saying it's something I would be down for if someone. I think it's an interesting subject of discussion and debate I don't know that there's like a clear right answer. But I'm a big FAN OF A. Judge's thing that's fine with me to. Look I want to get the court de-politicized I want to have a mechanism that ensures that turnover is happening at a more steady rate that's with the time. So that's why you have the twenty year terms but then also the seven judges means you're actually moving the dynamics of the court along and bigger ways every time you turn over judges but you're also voiding another problem that I see which is that national justice is too big for any one person like you would never want to leave all the nations laws interpretations up to John Roberts or really anyone. Even Sonia Sotomayor I, like her I'm bagging soda or but it's it's bigger than any one person and I think in order to have legitimacy that Abroa- spectrum of people think is legitimate you need to have that diffused across a enough people so like it does actually require a group lift but I also worry that if you had the group get too big, then essentially the Republicans are GonNa, come in there and go like. Football, now, we need to have our football team and they're gonNA have their football team play football. That's kind of what I'm wondering about in terms of term limits I support term limits in theory, and then I always panic when I start seeing. The ramifications of some of them because then you are able to predict when that that justice is going to be forced to retire so. Does that not politicize that seat even more. Because if I know that in twenty, twenty four. You. Know Justice Roberts is forced to step down. Her Ray for me now but it once again puts it back I mean it. You should have end up with that problem regardless right like we're we're stuck in that problem these seats or political anyways. Yeah. There's always just a mystery that we trump has gotten three by the sheer. Mitch McConnell. there's nothing to say that he should have and just the fact that you know. We lost our BG and an Justice Kennedy decided to retire. Whatever that was about. So we can only speculate we can only speculate there. You don't want father's love their sons though that's a real trend of this election. Yeah. Fathers and sons the sins of the fathers is really the theme here isn't Sohn's. Okay. So you've told me how to remove them. What was your second point after how how you remove a justice was so you just pass a law. I mean you know know what was your second point besides expanding the court like how to expand the court you? Oh so then you'd move the confirmation process to the House of Representatives. So the representatives. What is in the constitution that stops that from happening now? Is there any warning? Me Thou actually I think it just says Congress oppose I don't even necessarily know how is it in the hands of the Senate right now Let me check I. Want said that's the judiciary. Article Three section one I can read this for the class here if everyone one, please do yeah three section one. Constitutional Law. The Judicial Power of the United States shall be vested in one Supreme Court Indian such inferior courts as the Congress may from time to time, Ordain and establish. So this opens it up to Congress. So literally could be the Senate or it could be the representatives strictures constitutional interpretation. So then then it would go back to the judiciary act of seventeen eighty nine where it was established that that'd be done by the Senate but like also remember that back in those days, the Senate was appointed everyone in the Senate was not voted on directly that they were all done by appointment so I if we want to say that people have a voice in this. The only way for the people to have that voice is for this to be in the House of Representatives or for it to your respect the popular vote, and then then the minority like if you wanted to go that route but. So anyway. So if there's reading article three section one, hi I'll read it with a little more fire, the judicial power of the United. States. She'll be bested in one Supreme Court and in such inferior courts as the Congress may from time to Time Ordain and establish the judges. Both of the supreme and inferior courts show hold their offices during good behavior and shall, at stated times receive for their services. A compensation would shall not be diminished during their continuance of office. That's it. That's the whole ballgame. And you say that the. The judiciary act of seventeen eighty nine mentions the senate. Yes, especially. Yeah and then since then Congress has been defining how many justices, how many circuit courts all the contours of the court system are determined by Congress? So you're talking about changing. I'm talking about changing. Yeah. Yeah. In terms of constitutionality of someone, told you any of this stuff unconstitutional it that's just simply bunk. Honestly I probably You could probably. Leave it up to Congress if both houses. Had to approve the person I honestly wouldn't mind that at all. I might make things more difficult but. At least you'd have. You'd literally have Congress I would be fine with that. No. Okay. Here's the thing I. Don't have a problem with it being hard to. Get a justice under the supreme, court. Of all the things that were bad about Merrick Garland. The fact that there are such roablocks obstruct someone in theory that conceptual theory for making onto the Supreme Court I actually don't have a problem with that. The the issue with Maher, Garland is. Why the Republicans are doing that and to what end they were doing that. Yeah, and if you think about it. There is no were a whole country that just loves her checks and balances that's been put into our heads since grade school where it's in the textbook and Highlighted Inc, you know but there is no check on the Senate being. the only people who can approve. This judge. No and you get a breakdown in the process. I mean, even to that point, you kind of goes against what the founders are thinking about with the interplay between the House and the Senate with the Senate being the cooling plate or whatever. Like whereas the house in that, we're where the people in that and I think that does matter when we're talking about the judges so I just wanted toss it out there i. think it's important because like clearly the Republicans have a lot of strategy in the coming years that's going to be driven through the court up to and including what they're trying to do right now with the election on the they're gonNA have a chance at all of winning this election, they're going to be doing it through the court system. I know when that's what scares me. because. I don't know why don't we have good enough nerds on our side when it comes to like. The fine. The fine. Details of the. I'm just saying there's people out there who who manipulate you know Mitch McConnell is very good at manipulating the rules of the Senate. Where's Chuck Schumer's guy to help him figure out what he can be doing as the my the minority ruler to gum up the works or and if he has that person, why isn't he listening to that person? I just never understood sitting back and doing nothing when your opponent does so much. It's creating a black hole. In. It's annoying it's completely asymmetric warfare i. mean you just don't want to do I. Don't know I don't know I'm not a constitutional law scholar surprise surprise here. The difference is, I, see a project that needs to be undertaken and I'm passionate about the project and I actually tried to like lay chain to advance the ball in that project. Bread Kavanagh is not a good jurist. Neither is Amy Conybeare and It's a huge stark contrast between John Roberts. WHO's a pretty smart Guy Sam. Alito who's an evil genius? Neal. Gorsuch who's actually a really really smart guy this by saying these people are smart people. It's not I agree with them. But like these are smart people with credible resumes who are like legitimate jurists you have to agree with everything they say I don't. But they have a level of credibility that Brett Cavanaugh an Emmy Coney Barrett simply do not. Break Cavanaugh was a guy. who was a partisan hack amy conybeare it got. A. Padded Stat of three years on a bench starting during the trump term just so they could warmer up enough to try to make this not look completely illegitimate which does. Have hasn't ever tried a case thing is incredible to me. She's got nothing. Jurist, she's a lightweight she. She's an absolute lightweight and I'm saying that compared to her peers on the court in her own party. Like Brett Cavanaugh and amy conybeare combined are not the person in terms of qualifications as Neal gorsuch. It's just it's a vast disparity. That's the other reason why I favor reducing the court down to seven. Expanding the court doesn't solve the fact or doesn't solve the problem that Brad Kavanagh in Amy Conybeare have no business being on this court neal gorsuch like his arrival was illegitimate but like he's actually a supreme court level human being. Brett cavenaugh and amy conybeare or not. Oh, man I still get. So nausea to thinking about cavenaugh. he's a, he's a bad guy. Is there anything else we should hit here before bouts anything else on your mind anything else? So many things on my mind like, why do you? Why do you have a have a whole rally in Nebraska in the middle of fields where people have walked three miles to their car and? Why is Why is Texas not requiring masks of the pulling places and then they are but they're not but they are but they're not, why is I don't know. What is happening to Martinsburg. Where he just and Jack from twitter like they just look completely crazy people in their. Interviews today with Congress. I. Don't know there's lots of things on my mind that's going to do it for this episode of don't worry about the government. My name is Christopher Brennan. You can find me at C. H. R. I s. n. v. e. m. v. are. The shows twitter account is at Dwa TGI homepage. Don't worry. Dot. TV on I tunes on Stitcher on spotify Lizzy Juke working people find you. You can find what is left of my mental state at L. I. N. D. S. A. Y. Underscores Zero, zero, seven on twitter. that's Lindsey underscored double o seven because I'm a secret agent apparently. Just, trying to get through. The. Times. Yeah. Yes that's me. Don't worry about the government is a listener supported podcasts. That means you a buck show is all we ask Kate for a buck show guess what you get you get all the background music to don't worry about the government you get bonus episodes. But now we're as star releasing these zoom call. 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