The Scho Bro Show, Part 1: Was the Steelers loss to Cincinnati the worst in team history?
Pittsburgh steeler fans. Welcome to another episode of this. Go bro show. This is your. I guess i should say. Host co editor of behind steel. Dave scofield with me as always in our nice somber mood is my big brother rich. Rich how are you this evening. Don't okay. I thought i would just take a moment here and oh yeah it's funny i wanted station is doing right now. Yeah the panic button. Most people if if they weren't on the panic button before monday. Night there on the panic button now. Yeah well. it's funny. We we wanted to start it off for a nice quiet somber note. We want to do our best. Mike tomlin impersonation because that you know that's kinda it's too right now. You're like what what. Why i just don't know what to think anymore. Because steeler fans here we go. You don't expect the team to react the same way as the fan base. What was our show last week but this didn't have anything to do with the bengals. It was about the steelers and we talked about coach. Tom indeed even highlight any of the bengals. They kept the focus on the steelers. And what they needed to do out. Did you read the the staff predictions article. I know you. You didn't hear the questions if you read it after you may because there was another one added later by one deputy editor michael beck jeff changes or not but i've read it just was just think words. I think it was. It was three words. It was the bengals snake. And i think said thirty seven to nothing was his prediction. But that's how we as the fan base. That's how we all felt going into this game. It wasn't about the bengals. it was about the steelers. I mean they were on their third quarterback they're running back was out the only semblance of an offense or anything that they had the last time the steelers played them was joe burrow. And he's done for the season so it was just like yeah. This is more about the steelers doing their thing. Well if they took that attitude. That was definitely the wrong way to go. You have to admit that it was. This bengals team was fired up and ready to play and the pittsburgh steelers. I would say they weren't ready for it. But i can't say that i just wanna say i think ben rothlisberger was it ready for it. I'm sorry to lay this on the feet of the steelers franchise future hall of fame quarterback but my goodness when you really go back and look at it and break it down. There are still so many things that could have gone right for this team. They pro- probably not going to cover but they would have at least one the game but ouch i mean i think i had to adjust adjusted because i tweeted out. I mentioned this. The post game show. I tweeted out at halftime. What ben had done in the first half and here they had their stats wrong for that fumble by juju and then they took away ten more yards from yet like what nineteen yards passing in the first half then he had a twelve yard sacks seven net yards passing in the half. It was just rich. Your turn that was one of the worst hats of offensive football. I have seen from the steelers and that is a big deal. Why because you don't. You don't remember as much but i remember the games in the eighties i had to live through cliffs. Doubt mark malone lovey brewster malone was torius for putting up halves a foot at least a half sometimes whole games. That looked like that the other night the only reason could maybe worse is because the steelers right now. There's just they have a future hall of fame quarterback they have talented players in the skill positions way. More than the steelers had offensively in the eighties. I mean the eighties was receivers wise. You got a little bit of the tail. End of john stalwarts career and louis lips. I feel so bad for lewis lips. That guy was a fantastic receiver and he played on. Horrible horrible steeler team. Yes he did you know. It was rough to watch the other night. Kyle got up. And when benn through the interception kyle got up and said i've seen enough. I'm going to bed. When i got a text from our sister which which. I called her out on that today told her that you go on dory next after game show. Yeah but she was right. I couldn't turn it off. I needed to keep doing my thing. And i'm like the injury now. Oh i wanted to go to bed angry kyle. Did i wanted to go to bed at the same time. Kyle did but was like knee-jerk so i kept on it and just that that was just down right ugly offensive football in the first half for the steelers. Yeah i mean we'll we'll we'll spend plenty of time talking about ben rothlisberger here but at least when a mention the topic of the show and that is was this game on monday night this loss to the cincinnati bengals was it. The worst loss in pittsburgh steelers history. Now you're probably saying well you know it's one loss you know they're eleven and three of i have my numbers behind it for. This is a question we're going to think about. We're going to dwell on a little bit and then we're going to break down a little bit more but let's let's not go all doom and gloom. Give me one good thing you sort of this game money. Now i'm going to force you to be positive because i had to force myself. There's there's places to be very positive okay. First of all. Benny snell had decent game running. The football is he did what i all from benny snell and why he had a decent game was he. He was there to play. He was running the football with heart. He was bringing the pain people trying to tackle him. He was refusing to stop and getting every inch. he could get. That guy would love to over one hundred yards just so i could celebrate it even more but that guy came and showed a lot of heart and played really hard the other night. I gotta give him props. Yes and you'll be getting a break down. If not tomorrow i've already done the stats part jeffries. Going to be doing the film part you're steelers vertex It all depends on when it comes together and what are schedule. Looks like whether or not to you know it'll be tomorrow or or on. What is tomorrow. Tomorrow's wednesday or thursday. My goodness i don't even know what day it is or when we quit where we haven't played on a sunday for well we well. The steelers played sunday night last week. So that was even that meal. Yeah yeah so anyway but are what the vertex is going to be about. Was the running game and was this at least a glimpse into something. That could be a bit of running it now. You brought up a. It wasn't a super just a regular comment. I didn't get to see it all right. It was oh steeler fans were allowed to mention the name mark malone well. I work balloon in a negative context. Yes and talk about some of the worst play. I've seen for the steelers. I've saw some pretty bad games from mark balloon but those were also some pretty bad steeler teams as well. And that's why i liked your title for the show. Was this the worst loss in steelers history or whatever. Because i was sort i have seen other. Steeler game haven't watched through the eighties. I have seen other really really bad steelers games but those were from really bad. Steelers teams like a game. Like that doesn't surprise you from a team that finishes the season six and ten. Yes that game surprises. You know what we saw last night surprises me from a team coming into that game at eleven and to yes. Yes and that's why we're going to break that down here. That's why it was terrible now. A couple of things about the running game that if you if you read the vertex article i'm gonna give you a little bit of a little bit of a preview and someone brought up in the live chat think it was the same person you brought their comments before they didn't they didn't even try to get the running game going early. You realize that in the first quarter of gaillard's had six offensive drives one of which on the first one that was a fumble technically they call it a running play. I'm throwing it out as a running play. If you don't count that as a running play it no six offensive drives. Do you know how many rushing attempts to steelers had the first quarter many to one of which was mcfarland. Mcfarland are not benny snell. The the i. I got a pretty early on like like sex and it was carried. One one rush for five yards. They had seven rushing yards in the first quarter onto attempts. They were the steelers. Were already down ten to nothing before they had their third rushing attempt to the game. Now it's funny in a normal circumstance you're like the steelers can't run the ball. Why are even. Why are we wasting downs with him. Running the ball. You've at least got to give it a shot. And they didn't give it a shot to later. So jefferies going to break down the film to say did. Was there more success running the ball simply because the steelers were down by so much and they were willing to give up the run where they doing other things differently or was it just benny snell going out there to play hard. I'm kind of waiting to see exactly what i said. Jeffrey up with these you guys would love how we do. These vertex articles. We come up with an idea. I tell them. Hey give me an idea of what you wanna do. Film wise and i'll do the stats. So then he gives me idea. I'd be the stats. He takes stats to see where it makes sense. He doesn't know we don't know what our points into. We're both done. Like i have no idea what is gonna what points. Jeffrey does when he smarts. He doesn't know what it's going to be into after we get there. It's it's really great. It's a lot of fun. We let it go where the information takes us. So here's long you're talking about your guys you know what a hold off because i want to talk about a little bit more jeffries article. Today that was breaking down. Ben rothlisberger in the game is i. I wanna talk a little more about that. If you haven't read that article from jeffrey. Look at he he picked actually a couple of plays he picked replays. I actually noticed watching the game. And i thought was very interesting because it was show showing some stuffing. We'll get into that more later. Yeah but another thing that was that was really interesting. The steelers if you count the kneel down at the end they had fifteen drives fifteen drives. Don't count that the just call it. Fourteen fourteen on fourteen drives only three drives had more than one rushing attempt. I think there was if you count the neil that well no because that would count as a rushing attempt. You know say that. I think there was five drives. Didn't even have a rushing attempt so kind of crazy stuff that even though it seemed like they got the run game going they were using it and what was even worse as they were in a situation to got themselves in a situation where it would have been great to have a good running game going for him a lot of these other games and they didn't they were in a situation where good running game didn't help them. I mean they scored their last touchdown and they were using the run but and along with the short passes and it was working and they and they got into the touchdown zone shutouts. Brian anthony davis but it took more than half of the time that was left in the game in the fourth quarter. When when they did that so it was one of those things and now another thing. Turn around the defense and people like oh the defense. They gave up one drive. That went over four yards. One drive the entire game that went over forty yards thinking. They are bradford's bringing it tonight. Like i keep putting stuff up here. He said i think we got. I i to toronto and it was near both drive that ended with ben rothlisberger perception. That's the only first downs that they got in the first half which got one back far enough. And then the tooks core for penalty so that even that drive that touchdown only twenty was. I think it was a twenty four yard drive. It was less than twenty five thirty certainty. Eight eight. i was running those numbers earlier. But i've run so many numbers today. They're jumbling together in my head. That's what was going on the defense. I mean and jeffrey. We'll probably also break this down. Some point one of the things that he he mentioned to the staff last night in our slack channel during the game was this defense is doing all of this trying to completely cover for not having inside linebackers. I know. I mean he's like they are missing their inside linebackers so bad and it was very apparent on the one long drives Because the other thing that was crazy about about last night's the bengals did not have a pass attempt in the fourth quarter. Yes i knew that too. They completed a pass for ten yards to aj green right before the end of the third quarter. That was the one where mark is. Alan got hurt because geoffrey had asked me this today. He's like he's doing the snap counts. Articles said wait a second. Marcus allen got hurt. How could you play one hundred percent of the snaps on defense. Well he got hurt the next play. Tj wa jumps off side. and. I want be upset about that real quick after after this. He jones upside the clock. Still running they get to the end of the quarter without. He gets to come back in so he doesn't miss way and they never passed the ball again the rest of the game now. There was a question that was brought up. I can answer it now. Or maybe i should save it for stat. Now go ahead and answer it now. Is there so why do they might do this instead. Gig due to. who knows. Why do they sometimes blow him dead and sometimes they don't you have an answer for trump defensive. You'll probably give me one. And then i'll give you the other one. Okay so you know. We saw the one where what's the. What are the navy guy of you. Know doesn't matter whatever. The quarterback for them got bad because the flag he wanted the free play. Okay but you couldn't run the fleet free play. Why because after an it may have been a. Ta watt one was where tj what jumps in and his jumping back but his guy doesn't just point at tj. What he he brings up his. He moves so at that point in time they have to blow it. The i was trying to explain this on twitter last night. I thought you were going to do the most people realize and that is that if they're unabated of quarterback but they're going to get a free shot they blow. They're not gonna let that happen. That's the most people realize but go. Why don't you get the free place. Sometimes ben doesn't get the free play. It's because if the defense comes across the defense also has time to get back before the snap back. My wineman are are trained to react to it because if they react that that kills the play at. It's on the defense. So if the if the offensive tackle would not have moved or and it wasn't a lot earlier it was barely early but he moved early but the reason but it's not called on him because the reason he moved was because of the defense sorted. And you can't you can't let that play doh because the offense tackle moved early unless you're the the at the time i think it was still seeing diego chargers in two thousand eighteen at honestly if you use why you've seen that a lot this year they have on this show leading where they are letting the tackles move a fraction allot and it bothers me. 'cause it's it's technically illegal move that they're allowing to happen because it gives the offense of an advantage and we all know that the nfl wants more points. Yeah so that's that's what they frustrate and honestly holding we know the whole. It's not that they don't they're like well. I've seared because look at when they're calling holding. They are calling offensive holding on run place. Or hey if the quarterback scrambles those who just times they call holding if the pocket holds up for the quarterback even if he steps forward in the pocket hold. All you want doesn't matter. We're teaching what was literally picked up and thrown down and it was not called saw stefan to it. The past got away and he turns it the referees. Just go off. Because he was blatantly held and they didn't call it. Because they want to see this quarterbacks being able to sit in there and do what they wanna do and giving you all this offense. They don't care if the linemen half to hold the defenders in order because they don't wanna see sacks they wanna see completions that's what the nfl wants anyway. And of course every. I worry that i hope that doesn't happen in football. The way happened in baseball. Okay and that and what's happened in baseball. is you know. They came back back into baseball and suddenly the big thing. Is you know chicks. Dig the long ball right now. Runs yeah and it has made baseball board. I did not watch one pitch of baseball. This entire including the postseason. I always watch play baseball. But i didn't this year. I watched a little bit. But still i watched a couple of games where i was just like. This is painful to sit around watch. Well i don't want to talk about baseball. We go clinton before we get into what. I really want to dive into this question. I was going give my case for it. Anything else you wanna say about. Let let's slips didn't make give enough time and dip into the ben rothlisberger topic. Okay okay start joe okay. This this game was totally big. Ben and i'm starting to wonder if some of the now you could talk the week before about the drops from the receivers but as offensive started to go down. I'm starting to see things that make me. Think more and more that this is ben and teams have done their homework and they have picked up on his tendencies and he is not making an adjustment on it. He needs to okay. I can talk about a couple of different plays. That and i know jeffrey brought them up. And i thought the same exact thing on the one and it was on that. I think it was. What's like second to. He tried to throw quick to dante and it got deflected. He was darn lucky. It got deflected because it would have been intercepted Okay ben when away from the play that was called on his own because of what he was reading from the defense he saw a quarterback playing eight nine yards off. Okay so he thought it would just stand up quick thirty deontay big four or five yards. Get the i doubt with. The bengals did was. They brought pressure from the corner off. The the the defense is right side. The steelers left side. Let's the corner. The plane that was supposed to be run was to be a wide receiver screen to juju out in front of juju on this play was donald and big al. If you watch this play. Take place if ben were to throwing the ball into the blitz down the way the play was designed would have been a touchdown because they were two guys. Between juju smith schuster the end zone and two blockers out in front ready to just demolish them in donald and big al on to a safety in a corner. It was going to happen with the bengals did was they showed that they baited been into this they showed i think i do. Think back off ben figures he's got soft coverage but on the snap of the ball. The linebacker on that side sprints to a spot figure network deontay was going to catch the ball and if that ball gets through and doesn't get tipped he's right there stepping in front of the in his in his intercept at the ball. You're bringing up a really good point. Because i've always said like with the steelers play. The browns. the first time and people were like oh baker. Mayfield dinged up with could be case keenum brian. Anthony davis guy. I'm like i hope it's not because the steelers no the defense fitzpatrick and right off the bat. They know how to trick baker mayfield into into doing what they want him to do now. Baker might be better than that. Now he might have evolved this season. But you know who who. I would say regressed into that out. There is one benjamin talbot burger. They know if you give him this. Look he's going to try to do this. So let's give him the look and jump on what we know he's gonna do yes. I mean. they're like why. I'm going to back this. Why in the world is ben throwing into triple coverage. Because it's just like. I'm pretty sure it was kevin was it. Kevin might have been jeffrey. They both do such a great job of breakdown. Sometimes i get their stuff mixed up the talked about the horrible terrible. No good rpo. I think it was jeffrey that when the steelers were doing the run pass option. Ben rothlisberger doesn't run the option based on what happens during the play. He only does it based on pre snap. Read so near doing pre-snap. He predetermines if he's going to run pass so therefore teams would then say well. Let's show him this because we know he will read it this way and he'll decide on this will cover it the that's what they're doing all the passes. Now they're staying. Oh there in this formation. We know ben's going to go to this we. Let's show him this so that way we can jump on that. That's what i'm seeing. And the you said and i think that sums up everything that's going on in the second one was the which actually was the first one that i saw. Jeffrey brought up and pointed out was the juju smith. Schuster fumble play when the steelers go to that formation team says have learned that he loves to throw the drag route to juju. And isn't that break. We're claypool was running wide open for the first down guy that caused a fumble was the guy who was to be covering chase claypool but because of the formation they do what they like to throw to juju. As soon as ben planted he left chase. Claypool ran it. Juju juju catches the ball. He likes him up. Causes the fumble. That would wasn't thrilled. Juju fumbled it. But it wasn't even guy gardner juju because the fumble fumble was the guy that was garden claypool but he knew he could break off a claypool and come after juju because in that formation ben prefers to the drag route. It seems like ben. Roethlisberger is trusting. Go ahead if he holds that ball that much longer and sees that guy doing that. Nice little pass down the middle to to chase claypool. And he's probably still running now. I sing it. I really don't i think is making up his mind what he's doing based on pre snap and prime example this. I know we got super channel and get to it here on the second. Prime example of this was there was the play it was the was it the fourth it might have been the fourth and ten play at at the end of the yes. They're out there. The bengals call timeout. the bengals. the steelers really even hold on what much they might have a little bit. they'd break come back to the line. The exact same formation. The referee has blown the blown to play in the. There's no one standing in the way the bengals are all kind of huddled and standing around the steelers. Could've snap the ball right then with them not paying one bit of attention and run the play. But that's not ben roethlisberger. He specifically wants to see what the defense is going to do to dissect it's because he thinks he can break it down and that's always been the case for bed or most often been the case for ben but teams know that he's not adjusting to what they're doing it in during play it's all based on the pre snap so therefore they are show they. They're showing one thing pre-snap getting him to decide that. That's going to be where i'm gonna need to go. And he's not adjusting on the fly. And that's and it's because it's quick timing thing because it's so quick timing. He's making the decision before the ball was in his hand. That's what he's doing. The digital wehrley ring is before the ball was in his hand and therefore the defense knows if we show this. They're going to do this so we're going to stop it. And the the bengals. Why not sell out to it like the guy how many taylor chase claypool run wide open. Because they knew. That's not what. Ben was gonna look based always. I saw at least three. And i mean that you're thinking all you have to do is hit a one time there's a touchdown but the they would rather take them. They were to ten in one coming into the game. They're gonna take the take the chance. Why not take a chance to see her. Do it worked until ben does this adjusted to it. Oh never showed that he did so therefore because he's been the old dog they're gonna take advantage of the dog mentality here. I got get this before luge up. I got you think you stevo five dollars tip jar. Thank you very much steve. We didn't understand as to why the defense didn't commit to the run when they see family couldn't throw the ball down the field. That is a great question. That is a great question rich. What are your thoughts on it. My thoughts are we were. We wanted to but we didn't have the inside linebackers. That could make it happen. I think you're right. I think they got exposed of not having the inside linebackers. I still think. Even though he got a sack he basically cleaned it up as finley. Tried to try to break the pocket and couldn't steph onto it was kind of a disappearing and disappearing last night. I mean i put him in our x factor article. I picked him is the x factor needing to step up after not being seen the week before and he didn't. So here's wasn't when it didn't play well Marcus allen. I'm sorry having to play the middle linebacker bit undersized and that would have been a totally different game if you had a every williamson lined up with vince way. Yeah army or even. I what or even every williamson with robert spelane bush. You know what i'm saying. I mean yeah. I mean that's just. That's the hindered their dealt i played. I hope i didn't miss a super chatham between the one you clicked on this one. I don't think he did okay. It's admits mrs mr steelers. Five dollars at the tip jar. Thank you very much which is funny. Because last night we got we we had a guy gets on. We had a ninety nine dollar ninety nine dollars. Ninety nine cents super chat show to mrs mr steelers. I think they'd put so many ten dollars. Timpson passed it. Thank you very much for that. They said just thinking. Do you guys think the fear of getting hurt is what is truly motivating ben. Not extending plays read post nap. I don't know if it's being hurt or feed knows the kate knows the limitations of his own offensive line. I think that's what it is. He doesn't want to get hit. He wants to avoid getting hit as much as possible because he knows he needs to stay healthy but he also realizes that his line is he. He knows what he can count on them four and what. He can't count on them. For exactly. Exactly i would. I think he could count on them a little longer than he does. Yeah just me. Also he responded. There was another one in. Jeffrey brown's and when i looked at it i was like what the heck is he doing. Ben rothlisberger burgers sat back there in. It might have been on in that last four. Play drive yeah. Sits back and shotgun takes the snap and proceeded to drop seven steps from shotgun then ends up pressure. We'll of course you're going to be pressure because when you drop that deep you've given the end the angle on tackle. Yeah exactly they broke it down. One time we're finley made a mistake. They're like oh man. Of course he got sacked on this one because he he. He faded back into the pass. Rush coming around the edge you. That's why they say step into the pocket. That's why they're called ed rushers. They're coming around the edge. What's the lineman's job to them. Out wide from someone who used to play left tackle before they move right tackle because are running back. Good run left Was sorry. that's the job whenever you were passed protecting your job wasn't the not let the guy pass you. Your job was to drive him so far why he couldn't come back and make a plan. So that was it so yeah. There's a lot of stuff to break down there with big ben. I think that really sums it up is that and that's what teams are you going to continue to do. So if the steelers can identify this is the problem and say ben. Actually look and see what the players are doing. You're smart enough. You've been doing this enough time. Don't just go off how they're lined up because guess what they're doing. They're showing you one thing. They're doing something else and do you know who does that. Also the pittsburgh steelers defense k. That's what is gonna answers because they know that you're going to trust your read more than you're you're you're you're stationary read more than what's happening in motion on the field teams are starting to copy us so they can stop us. Yeah so that's very interesting so now here's now if you wanna talk about a way turnaround quit. We've talked during the streak about. What does it take to get. It turned around. If it's really if it's really down to just offensively one player fared stuff out that could be for next. We'll see that's the thing and so many people were like it's time for me. Trust me i was a big mason rudolph fan especially pretty two thousand and nineteen and i would have been like. Maybe something can do if you look at. What mason rudolph the in two thousand nine hundred. You know what he did. He didn't read defenses of what they were doing. And they were tricking him into making throws and he was afraid to throw the ball. And you know in you know inside the numbers because of what the defense is doing and things like that and the he wasn't getting the rink asking him to read half the field they were asking him to read the field rather than right field. So it's not like bringing mason rudolph in is going to be that much better so the thing is maybe a different. You know. it's funny because it's not a mason. Rudolph couldn't be a decent quarterback. I don't know that he can't in the system you know. Is it a system thing. Don't know if it's a system thing. I don't know if you have to have the right quarterback in order to do it. And ben just can't anymore i don't know all i know is that it almost feels like what what happened with. Dick lebeau defense. It was so great for so long until they had to offense offenses had to break it down figured out the tendencies at exploited them. That's what happened with defense. That's why offenses defenses in the nfl. In today's game they have to constantly evolve. And that's why hearing coach tomlin say we just need to keep doing what we do but do it better. That's not working. That's not what thirty one other teams or. Maybe i should. Maybe maybe some of them are. Maybe i should say that's not what the top tier teams in the nfl were doing. They are making making adjustments. Making adjustments making adjustments. Because that's the game and if you're not going to do that you have a problem. We've gotta take a break here. If we we still haven't even. I stopped even made my case because we had so much talk about. We really got some good discussion there. We're gonna make the case that this was the worst loss in steelers history. At least i'm gonna make that case so if you're on audio side go ahead and flip on over to part to if you're with us on youtube if you're with us on facebook give us a few seconds and we'll be right back.