7. Catherine Hardwicke
The history of horror. Uncut is a shudder original podcast, download the shutter app or visit shutter dot com and enter the code shudder, pod to start your free two week trial. That's promo code. S. H. U. D. D. E. R. P. O. D. I'm sure curator Sam Zimmerman. This is the history of horror uncut and essential audio companion to ally. Rots history of horror ally. Ross history of horror is a seven episode docu series, threatening the volition, immortality of the Sean RIA, and all its terrorists within these are the full candidate interviews, most of which can only be found in heard right here in this podcast. You'll hear how John shape these filmmakers authors makeup maestros. You'll hear the personal unbridled appreciation that only comes from those who know how special our can be welcome to a more intimate mystery horror. The history of our uncut is built with the full raw interviews conducted in production for LA roths history of horror in some cases, ally, leads the talk itself in others, deeply knowledgeable producer. Kurt sangha steps in so today Kurtz can introduce you to Catherine Hardwick. This is a versatile thoughtful, filmmaker, she took on an adaptation that everyone underestimated and then helped create a fever pitch polarizing phenomenon in twilight, Catherine Hardwick is not a genre director. And the reason I say that is because she can't really be pegged down to one type of movie rate, she broke out with thirteen adolescent, psycho drama about a troubled teen, then she made skating by pick lords of dog town. And then, of course, twilight, what she brought to all is this intimate searching, I this indie sensibility and that connected deeply with fans of the first twilight. This brought the comparatively small first film in the series to a worldwide box office success over three hundred ninety million dollars. And then several several several sequels here, the curious open Hardwick talks, her own brushes with John RA. And vampire tales the production development casting of twilight what she brought to the film. And of course, she talks twilight impact. And sometimes the interesting lack thereof in the industry here now is, Catherine Hardwick. Listen up goals. Hey. Tell me your. I'm Katherine Hardwick. I'm director did twilight. That's why I'm here. I guess, so were you actually at all interested in vampires or anything like that, before you came involved with the series? Well, I think you know, as a kid, we love the idea of vampire, you know, and just being terrified and scared and somebody that was like your blood, and, you know, especially if they're handsome in his ambi-, aren't very hot. So we don't really fan his office about zombies. But the empires are pretty cool, and I'd always been intrigued by them. And then I guess I got the book and I read it, and I thought, wow, this is a totally different approach, you know, Stephanie Myers wrote something that just drew you in made. You feel like that. Crazy giddy intoxicating feeling of being in love for the first time. And I thought I wonder if I can capture that on film. And one thing I thought was really cool about it is, I'd seen a lot of empire MU. Cbs interview with the vampire and all kinds of things where you are in these, like scary dark streets in London, or Paris, but I'd never seen vampires in like the Pacific northwest in a forest and I love I love forest I love moss, and I love big trees, and I thought. Wow. That is so fun to see these vampires in the trees. A little, what's the plot roughly speaking twilight. Well, the thing that's kind of cool about twilight is you have an ordinary girl, the moves to this small town in Washington. She has to live with her dad for a while. She hadn't seen him in a while. She feels like a MS fit awkward, and I say of school, she basically is attracted to this amazing and strange man in a strange kid, that's Edward, and she gradually and he's very attracted to her, and she doesn't understand why, and he's got this mysterious group of brothers and sisters that we start to find out there's something very mysterious about him, but it's very grounded like you feel like you're an ordinary high school, and it's an ordinary girl. And that's what's kind of cool about it, this could happen to me. This could exist in the real world that, that could could be a vampire. I think so this whole, you know, you get drawn deeper into this world. Also seemed more like their wealthier than were aristocrats physically so versus Bella, who's, you know, from war over dad's a cop. Right. Right. So they're a sophisticated vampires are sophisticated, of course, you know, she falls in love with Edward who's been alive for one hundred twelve years or something. So he's, you know, more educated about music and everything. So there's that attractive feeling the one line that everybody loves how old are you seventeen? Well, how long have you been seventeen o? While visualize. That first of all, what was. You know, sometimes without obtains, the film crew were directors of nothing to do with the writer of the source material, re you actually touch with Stephanie during this process. How yes I was in touch with Stephanie Myers, she's wonderful. And she had at that exact time that we were making the movie she was writing a believed the third book, she was writing another book called the host, and she was on promotion. And she has three kids, so she was very busy, that she was able to come to the set a couple of times and bring your family. And we thought it was going to be so nice when she came to visit it set the beach in Oregon, and that was the stormy as most violent rainy day ever, but she's a trooper in. She also had input, you know, like I would send her pictures of people, I was imagining casting, so that she could feel good about that. And she, she liked the script. She liked the way we kind of. Elaborated on in a way made it more cinematic, you know, because in the book you're just re you're in the head space of bell, the hold on his very internal. But, you know, I wanted to make that visual and exciting. So we did this whole treetop sequins and other things that aren't in the book, but they were kind of the spirit of the book. Shifts her doesn't, so your son her. She's pretty much always there. There's a couple CUDA as to the nomadic vampires, but mostly, we're with Bella was the casting process like. Oh, is really fun chain of events. But I went and saw an earliest greenie of into the wild. And I saw Kristen Stewart in that scene in the trailer with a meal Hirsch, and she just embodied like the essence of longing and desire, but in a subtle and powerful way I thought I've really want her to be village. She should be. And so I've got a so much. Let me fly out to Pittsburgh, while she was doing another movie there. And I brought another actor with me, and we just improvised for like six hours and ran around the park and chase pigeons and did all kinds of scenes and stuff. And a like she's got to be Bella. And I think she really brought a lot of depth to that character. And then who in the world is going to be the most handsome man in the world and look seventeen years old, envy, soulful and a great actor. That was a difficult search to find rob patents. He had been in a one of the Harry Potters and but that had been like. Five years before. So he kind of changed, and you know, had a wondering pathway. And when I talked to him on the phone in London, because I couldn't find anyone here, all the cute guys looked kind of, like cute guys next door. And I wanted that ethereal quality or that special sort of timeless quality. So I talked to meant like why don't you come out here? We don't have any money to fly you out. But why don't you come out and audition with Kristen so on his own dime? He flew out and he stayed on his agents couch, he came over. He had black bangs. He was a little bit heavier than if the bar for awhile and he didn't really look like the rob that we know and love now but we had like five different guys might top five. Guys came over to my house, and then Kristen did scenes with each of them, even on my bed, the kissing scene, and all and at the end Kristen and I were like, it's gotta be rob. And then he went onto like whole training program did hair eyebrows. And you know. I just got really physical because he knew this vampire was going to be physical, play baseball and fighting everything. Interesting dynamic between them to, and then also first part of that, as well as the sole built-in kind of thing of her in him wanting her basically wants him. And he seems to want her, but doesn't want to touch her. Rich some ways does that Perkin back to a lot of complicated nation. He has, I think it doesn't mean you know, he had a he was worried. You know this Mel of her blood, what he wants to kill what he killer when he'd be able to control himself. You know, that's something I think people throw what can I control myself? How far do I go with my desires? What should I do feelings of guilt? You know, and her own desire to be with some person that she knew was very dangerous to her. You know, so just balancing that out the bad boy, kind of thing fantasy, I think it was so interesting because they had that great chemistry at my house, you could tell that they were magnetized toward each other than they both fascinated with each. Other, which I think strongly translated on screen, you know, but Kristen was under eighteen. So I remember right after the dishes, I said to rob in our country is illegal to have sex with a seventeen year old girl. So watch it. And I wanted all the female actors to say at one tell the male actors to say it another that didn't really work out, too. Well. Sentence Brit list of their fourteen or something. I think it is. And I was like, that's not our age here. Have you seen? I mean vampires were talking about this little early in the green room, but they're pretty very flexible metaphor in use them that haven't used many other many things over the years. But how do you use fielder used in twelve well, that was kind of interesting. Stephanie meyer. She had a dream about this, vampire, that when the vampire was out in the sunlight, instead of, you know, withering into the opposite almost glowed in glittered, sparkle, the, you know, so that was the basis of her book, and she just she started writing the book and wrote a very quickly after that dream. So she invented her own kind of empire. Now, those rules had to be explained to the audience. So she has, you know, we have a scene, where Edward is explaining things to her. She's asking the questions when he questions. I got to know about this. We find out that they're vegetarian vampires there. The Cullen family is trying. Very hard not to kill. Humans. Are, you know, use any human blood they go for animals? So they're not really vegetarian. But, but we did make Bill a vegetarian in the movie. That was my little edition. The other thing was, I think seeing these this flexibility, like they were breaking the stereotype, and he it's plain to her. You know how all the mist you've heard. That's not really true for us. Those kind of fun discovery of, of what kind of vampires they were what their internal struggles were. Woman approaching this material being a female director did that that change based with gills interpreted because I think you're, you're the only woman who directed won the twilight, right? I know I know was kind of interesting because what I was not an attractive property. It was optioned at paramount, and then they put it into turnaround, and no other studio wanted to make it because they said a story with a female, you know, lead is not gonna make any money and the most money we ever made before on something like this was sisterhood of the traveling pants, you know, that made like twenty nine million dollars or something on a fee a girls book. So this won't make much. So nobody believed in it at all. And I guess that's how I got the. Because, like I, I felt passionate about that I could make this kind of beautiful, and intoxicating movie that would be really interesting to women and just connect us back to that. I love and I had done the movie thirteen where I had Evan, Rachel would, you know, is in every scene in, you really feel that movie through her point of view. I wanted to do that to really feel, what Bill is feeling the whole time and make it grounded in a way you know, he has it's a metaphor for that. I love, but it did feel very real. Kristen made it really real. And she's in almost every shot, you know, it's all how she's feeling. Thirteen was much more of a horror film, the twilight. Yes. Yes, people thought that thirteen was a horror movie for parents, because it's terrifying. When you see Evan, Rachel wood is so awesome on a big screen like eighty high screaming at her mother turning our mother, it is terrifying. Also, there's obviously big, you know, twilights of big a romantic fantasy too. So I know if it'd be the horror, people, I talked to kind of scoff at twilight, basically, because it doesn't seem like a real, vampire to how do you feel well, I think there's room for all kinds of empire. I think we went really for capturing the book the feeling of the book and that feeling of that kinda crazy. I love dangerous. I love. So, you know, I don't really like labels or I don't care about labels. I mean you know, whatever anyone can embrace it or. Or not embrace it for whatever they want, you know, symbolic me think I don't want to, you know constrain the stuff to gender. However read, I did you think it helped actually being a female director, taking on this kind of material will be given something that connect help to connect to its intended audience the meals? I think so I'm always attracted to material that has a female lead. I mean I just am because that's what I you know, that's my experience. That's my life. That's what I bring to it. So I want to try to explore women's feelings the feelings of girls and get back to those emotions that we felt and bring those stories to the world, I did do one really cool movie that I love lords dog town. There was a more male that I really connected to the creativity of these scrappy kids from the wrong side of the tracks that made are out of you know, broken concrete. You know, but I think that as a woman. I feel my twilights quite different from the other ones, you know, the first twilight has my. You know, it's really you feel, what Bill is feeling in the movie. I think and you feel what Edwards feeling to, you know, this push pull between the two of them. Or more, like action pictures. They after after ours was success as the first one was very successful. They gave a lot more money and a lot more visual effects, and a lot more stunts. And so got a little bit more spectacular spectacle instead of personal. Big franchises. The first film is almost always the best. Will we got to make it a I kind of under the radar more like an indie film? You know, nobody expected it to make much money. And I was told like I kept telling the producers like there's a lot of fans online, seem to really like this. We wanna make the fans happy is it that might just be four hundred girls in Salt Lake City logging about unlike own things so cuts you for hundred million dollars later. So it it had a bigger reach than anybody ever expected. So then with that comes higher expectations more money, more people, you know, standing over the filmmakers. And I got to make it in a much more independent way. Looking like the vertical rank whatever the brunt tomatoes Iraqis with that kind of thing in the first one is that rates about twice as high as the other ones, so. Right. I didn't even know that. That's cool. Hey, this cool on a might make a t-shirt within. Yeah. When did you know that it was a for instance? When I see it with a mass audience out of their okay? I'll in Austin, Texas at the Alamo draft house. Unlike the sneak preview night before, and I think I walked in there and I saw that they had done a theme thing where they had blood dreams and everybody's all address vampires and stuff. And then these girl, I just made a surprise appearance and these girls rush up to me, and they started hugging me. I mean, I'm not even in the move this art hugging me, and then one of them fainted, like in my arms, I'm like, wow. This is pretty intense for these fans. Fainting screaming? And then, of course, we had done a few sneak previews are sneak appearances in London. And actually, in Rome before that, where we kinda got mobbed Kristen Robin is at a bookstore signing. So you start realizing okay, this is going to be crazy but that first week in of twilight, you know, we would do those little talks, the ark light and people on the first weekend on Saturday him up, say I've already seen it seven times. It only open that Thursday night at midnight, I guess they had just been every single screening. Pretty cool because also done some crazy things like a best tour to all the locations where we had two buses of people that paid to go to all the locations in me, narrating it, and it was hilarious. I would ask people in the best little bizarre lines. Little tiny trivia, does anybody know who says burrito, my friend in the movie, and everybody knew exactly who it was. So people really watch that movie a left, it is kind of fun. Because usually you build in all those layers of detail as director you care about every detail of language and hair. And you know, every little strange thing that everybody's wearing and most people don't notice that they just feel the overall movie. But in this case, the fans noticed every down to the tiniest detail a one earner. There's a joke ill. Maybe some of these said that, basically, we went to see the twilight movies, just basically to experience, what Beatle mania was, like, yes. My eardrums were almost blown out at the premier in the night before I thought I wonder if anybody's sleeping out for the premiere of like anyone's already lining up and I went over there with my little video camera. My friend was driving the car and it Westwood it was like two blocks of tent camp. And I'm just like filming with my camera there. I couldn't believe that people were lining up. People recognize me somehow through the camera started yelling at me. I ended up signing over fifteen hundred autographs pillowcases that night they fourth. It's so cool because, you know, I love it that it actually brought people from all around the world. There were people from almost every continent in that line that came to see the premiere and they all had new friends, you know, from all over the world, that's cool. Whatever makes people have fun and feel connected to a group. You know, I think it's great growing favorites of what vampires rude supposed to reference. Blue. Well, I grew up in a little tiny hick town in south Texas, right on the Mexican border, and it wasn't a big movie town. We mostly had couple Clint, Eastwood movies would occasionally play there in mostly Spanish language films. So I wasn't a big movie. But I did see, like, I remember one of those like, Disney animated is Queen you being terrified and screaming it running out of the theater, so I like to be scared like everybody else, and I loved evil. Dead two with the flying eyeball. That was when I was older, of course, the classics like Rosemary's baby, you know, and just leaning into the frame and just a psychological terror. I would love that kind of thing. Salems locked or something like that. Well, I did read all the end rice. I guess that hit me at the right time. So I just devoured all the interview with the vampire and everything to see idea that they could be living among us, which is the same, you know, twilight they could really be here. Somebody you, you could be a vampire, you know, that's kind of exciting. That's actually talk a little bit more about that. Because that's another fan. We're shoes. Writing and did her own spin them hires. Yes. Different than would come before. So and those books so about how old were you when he first? Can't really member. But I do know that I was intrigued, I love them. I did devour all of them, you know, it was just such a fun, escape and imagination. And of course, she just gets a day hill and gruesome. And you know outrageous. You gotta love it, sexy fun. Oh, yeah. Except for the Tom Cruise blonde, not good. But the rest of it Yemi is delicious. When you were making Twitter prepping for twilight or kind of digital influences where he looking at her while you're giant from your, your notebook seem to have. Well, actually, I was looking more at things like planet earth because I really wanted the environment to be a character. So I love planet earth as I went into the rain forest and things like that not rainforest but misty forest and also, I did actually go just take a lot of photographs myself in Oregon, because my some of my family lives there, and I was really interested in creating this fog and misty atmosphere, which is interesting. That's why Stephanie Myers said it in forks, Washington, set the whole novel there. She'd never even been there, but she Google, what's the most overcast place in the United States that has the least amount of sun year round that this is where her vampires would move to so they can walk around in cognitive without sparkling. So that was one of our big things is just creating this beautiful feeling of like everything is blue, we never could have the sun coming out and just. Creating this fog layer to create an atmosphere and that was very consistent for the whole film. Edward team. Jacob. Let's see. Well, I definitely think that vampires are lot, sexier than where wolves personally, you know, vampires, they're just swath, and cool, and fabulous. So I had to admit he met where. You were so much factor in the first film. Right. But I do really like one thing that the it was because I really love, you know, the native American culture that we kind of got to dive into got to meet people that tribes push. We went and did a cast a wide net where we went to everywhere to try to find people as authentic as possible for those roles as a good challenge because there's not a lot of acting gigs for native Americans so there is not a lot of people that have had much experience doing that. So you know, that's what was one of our challenges to really outreach in bring people in from the communities. Baby, sexier interests, you about where wills, yeah. Just a shape Shifter, I think that notion of that a person that you think that, you know, or could shape shift and change on you obviously a metaphor for everybody that we work with and talk to and that we love, our family members as I change is their character changes. And I think that's a pretty cool part of mythology of aware wolf. And we do see people. We've seen it lately in the whole me to and all that, where you have a person that seems very charming or very, you know, sophisticated in cultured, and then in the privacy of their own hotel room, they can shift into monster. You know, that's pretty interesting. And as a woman, you're worried at all times, like if you are on a date or whatever and the guys seems really cool. And you say, no, I'm not into the I don't want to go that far. Are they going to be a gentleman? Are they gonna? Turn into a monster. I think that's kind of interesting. And those where and some of those monsters that we've been reading about they are very hairy and they kind look like where else in. Johner film, sometimes for people to break in and speaking of diversity, and all that, just the clearly difficult for female directors or get a foothold. This was twilight away into that, of course, even after that, though. I know you had some problems, right? Well, for example, twilight was Dirk first one is draped by one, and then they hired men to direct all the other ones. They didn't give another woman at chance. And then the hunger games only came because twilight was successful. You could have a young female all five hunger. Games drafted by men. Both divergence were directed by men. They did not get anybody else a chance, even though they've books were written by women. The lead characters were women. And ours was super successful and led to everything nobody else got that chance. So suddenly, you had another group of, you know, four guys twilight five. Movies that are all those men could rack up big successful, you know things on their scorecard. So they could get hard for another big movie, and another big budget movie, another one. So they're like that far ahead of all those women, that could've directed those films, it is, impressing, it is frustrating as hell we need more chances. I mean I prove it. I could make something for almost from very little money, make a fortune, and not just me. I mean, there's a lot of other women that given that chance would have done. Great too frustrating time to change. But still, even with all the noises being made about it. We still get man's Blaine by do's at this. Everything you know, it's still a struggle and us just as tough no matter what I thought after twilight, which made so much money than I would have a lot more opportunities on Bill. I thought I was going to get you know what I heard about male directors when their movies made many other studio gave him a car or something like that. Then I went in the next Monday after all the big successful weaken 69-million opening weekend. And I got a mini cupcake. I mean I could have had to, but I only wanted one or not just a car about a three picture deal. How about what movie do you wanna make next or you know how can we support you at all? No. It was different argument about budgets over the next film. Right. Well, the next film, say, you know, they gave them much bigger budgets, and everything lot, more special effects, too many maybe. Talk a little about the characters in the film, son. What interests you about them? So, for instance, I starting with the Bella, that's so what did you see in her that she wanted to bring out? Well, I think definitely as as definitely rotor. She's a very relatable character as we know for a fact, millions of women all ages from eleven year old girls to eighty five year old women could relate to Bella for some reason she really Stephanie Myers tap that universal cord of just desire longing. Wanting to be seen wanting to be noticed wanting to connect with somebody else, you know, was somebody that you love wanting to experience love and be loved, and be appreciated for yourself. You know, so that a universal yearning and longing. I think was very important. And I think that Kristin was able to tap into that. And. In some ways, Bella is a bit of as cypher. You know, she didn't have a lot of interest written in the book, like, you know, for me, I grew up, you know, drawing every day building little miniature things, and all that, and just devouring this kind of oaken doing this kind of art project in, you know, building a lot of stuff as a kid, I always built things, but I think that Bella didn't have those things for me to grab onto, and she was more like a purse seeker searching for what she wanted to do. And what her love would be, you know, in what, what her her future would be. So there's that was a good challenge. You know, the other characters maybe, for example, the vampires had a richer history because I'd been alive for a hundred years, and you could actually get into what artifacts might have had where they might have lived in what cultural things they cared about. I mean, a rob hat Anderson would write a letters. In character to his father slash mentor, you know, Peter fetch Anneli Dr Cullen in where they would talk about the internal struggles. The existential issues, they were dealing with fighting their very nature, you know, and how to be a good vampire a vegetarian vampire to coexist in this world, you know in manage their own desires and their own physicality. Real jerk basically I as shield to keep her away in a so. Yeah. Edward does have to try to keep her at arm's length, but he can't really control his feelings. And he tries to find a way. Seems to have the opposite effect on her. Yeah. Yeah. Mari though, harder. We have those drug all the more, we want things. A little code wherever there, the chemistry class, it's a close up of her, and she gives him this look through done. That's very well acted. So she really like as this. Alright they're so fascinated in Tron into an crystal was very adamant. She said, I feel I can do this movie with Robert Pattinson. I feel it. I feel that connection with him, then you'd better hire. And Taylor comes off. You know, plays really walnut film, too. So. Obviously becomes more of a big thing. Right. And he was only he was only fifteen you know, and he had done some other cool movies. But I think he really put his heart and soul into it. And I had a meet with some of the, you know, native Americans from the tribe, best be with talked to them trying to light dig himself as deep as he could into an understanding of that culture that he was supposed to be from. So that was a good challenge. Usually on the movies. I've done. I had done before that lords of dog, tan, and thirteen we had just a deep dive into the reality of the lives of the people. So our research myself in the actors were very grounded in very real, and living, the moment and training to be skateboarders and training v. Surfers and hanging out with Nikki Reed in her mom. In this case, we tried to find some real vampires to hang out. Actually, it did go online and found people that claim to be real. But that didn't prove to us well, with villas relationship with her weather, and twilight, like a way to make up for the relationship of the mother daughter and thirteen. Yes. In some, that's kinda fun says Sarah Clarke played her mom, and in preparing for the movie, we did a lot of improv because I like to do rehearsals in improv. So we did a lot of improv that weren't even in the film. But we had improv with her, and her mom like the moment, her mom had to tell her look. I'm in love with this guy. I think it'd be cool. If you go live with your father for a while. Like, how did she feel when her mother said that two or so we acted out that scene? And we, we live that scene so that could be in Christians bloodstream, when she did scenes with her. Mom, we did scenes with her, and her father improvising like when she was eleven years old, and he took her to Disneyland. It was an awkward time they hadn't seen each other in six months. How do you re- bond? With your dad. How do you reconnect just moving in there? So we tried to create like, really grounded relationships by improving all those scenes before we did the scenes that are actually in the movie. A warlike than her mother seems like in that her father is at man of almost zero words Jess. Right. Exactly. Is is. And I love that father, daughter relationship. I love Billie Burke. He brought a lot to that character. He was a lot of fun because he's not your typical share of cop. He's just got a lot of quirks and personalities. And so full, he's a rockstar himself. Seen any other current vampire films. Lesser, right. One in the Swedish version, and the American version. I thought those were fantastic. I really love those to which are other ones that I should have seen. Great. I love thought they were fantastic. Yeah. Happening in that. So it's one of those things that kind of waxes and wanes seems, but those were great too because like ours was in Pacific northwest in, like foggy mossy treat, and that's in the snow like another place that we haven't really felt it you know felt the vampire is I love it. I think vampires should go to every climate and Arctic vampires. Yes. Good. Yeah. Very gruesome. Yeah. Yes. Very different than. Not me fuller, extreme. Yeah. Talking about people. Vampire seemed to have this Ugalde, and how they're characterize that you have like them more monsters, vampire than you have romantic, vampire. And I think those twilight in thirty days of night, CD most extreme examples on par. Yeah. Totally stream from thirty days of nights, and twilight. It could not get me a male female thing was, I think a lot of women love whore in love all that gore. And I think that's great in a lot of guys don't love all that. So it's really to taste, you know, I don't know if the gender thing for me, I'm not that big on all the gore. I'm pretty squeamish like I vomit. When I see, like rose things sometimes. So for me, I think I just connected to the character of this girl in the book, you know. And I really thought it was a fantastic challenge to create that emotional intoxication of I love. That's actually what made me want to do the move. I thought I love can I show that on screen, can I make people as crazy about a cinematic version of the as the book made people crazy in. Yeah. I think we did make them pretty. But I don't think that would have happened if it wasn't a vampire, you know, like if Edward was just a normal good looking dude, that played basketball, or skateboarders something I don't think it would have gotten people into that kind of frenzied emotional, high stakes the stakes are so high. If this person might kill you so that can with you up into that, forbidden love, you know, brag about horror genre films, general, is a particularly the horror genre. It seems to lend to give it south over to opera and offer. Attic, yeah. So looking at twilight that was kind of makes perfect sense. If you look at it as a certain kind of opera, right? And we did try to make the sets with that unity, that is appreciation for nature to such gorgeous locations. We had all that we shot in Portland, Oregon. And then it was all like around Portland, Oregon in the Columbia River. Go. Gorge, you know, and, and these incredibly old forest and I feel sort of perhaps that people now go on tours there and they've preserved, you know, that area where we shot the meadow and different things. And people go visit it there's little plaques all over. You can go on toward see, but it's cool. It's getting a lot of people out into nature and loving it. You know that was one of my goals, too. You know. The color palette of it, because it's predominantly cold and blue even those like this movie about, you know, romance, and I live, which would seem to be more of a warmer feeling. So it's a color palette is very misty blue silvers even all the Cullens vampires clothing, all the colors of Arctic wolves silvers whites, blues greys, blacks, and at first Bill has a little bit warmer towns that she wears a little bit of Browns. And if she gets drawn into the Collins world she goes into all the blues, too, we did not allow any yellows reds oranges. You'll never see that color in the movie. Everything is a very controlled palate. One person stewardess like seems paler than any of them have partners. Exactly. That's why she was the perfect person to be converted and turned into. Now that was not my choice. I want to say something about that. I wanted to change a lot of the Cullens into diverse casting. I thought that Alice in my mind when I read her character in the book I thought she had to be, you know, Asian, she just seemed like she was amazing that just how I saw and I wanted a lot more diversity there. The Stephanie really only let me have diversity in the nomadic vampires, and in other friends at school because I think she had seen it in her dream in a certain way. And she just didn't wanna deviate too much from that. But so that was good challenge to, you know, we have African American, vampire, etiquette theology who is one of the nomadic vampires and at first, there was an uproar when he was cast. And then I said, wait, if you actually, you know, supposed to be pills skin, there's gonna super so they actually if you read the book, it said it's skin is the color of an olive and I said in their black olives and the. Oh, he put that. He tweeted that out, and then everybody embraced. Really good. He's one of the more sympathetic the quota, Nevada. Yeah, exactly. He's great. He's a lot of fun. Was it difficult or fun, or both to shoot with fight scenes saver fund sheet, the fight scenes, because contrary to popular belief that people might not think women liked to direct action or see action. We do like to direct action, and it's fun. And a lot of those scenes were not in the book that big fight scene happen off camera. I'm like hell. No. That's not going to be off camera. I want to see it. I wanna have a bad ass fire want to try to think of Steph, I haven't seen before I came up with an idea. Let's let him so forceful in strong, and he's so passionate with a crash the floorboards and do all this stuff and I said, I want to do the fight scene. First day one, I wanted to get the hardest thing over with. I and I also wanted to do it first because when they have time to rehearse and be coordinating with second unit and all this. Stunt people. So we said that thing of and I mean, that was a bless except for in the book it was written to being ballet studio with all mirrors. And we did every wall is mirrored. So I thought maybe I can be onset and hide in, like a mirrored silver cave. So I won't get shot. I tried every technique basically, you know. No, that did not work. So that was tricky to get out of the shots in when it was a fully three sixty mirrored environment. But that was a lot of fun. I loved the baseball sequence was an absolute blast in a way we were out of the Columbia, River gorge in the distance, you can see three different spectacular waterfalls in this gorgeous river. And then we had the baseball sequence, you know, where we're having how vampires play baseball, how do you imagine doing that? The Superfund most of the actress didn't even know how to play regular baseball. So they had to be taught how to bat hit run fast in, we create all these cool rigs when the nomad. Vampires came. We made this magic carpet of plexiglass sheets pulled on winches that they would move that a special name were covered with leaves the plexiglass. So we got to come up with a lot of crazy cool stuff. But the weather did not cooperate MSA. Whenever. Pacific northwest. Think every the charts. Okay, it's overcast, but it's not overcast all day, the sun might pop out. But if the sun comes out your vampires have to sparkle and that costs, a lot of money in CGI. So you'd have to wait till the clouds come over. We were literally doing cloudy chance is literally cloud. Whatever a seances trying to sprinkle, the clouds anything to get the clouds. So we had a lot head to have a lot of tricky stuff like if the sun did come out than we had to go into this rain cave, and make rain. And if it was raining, we couldn't shoot out in the open because the makeup would rent him. So it was like a mild nightmare for the to schedule it, maybe, but that, that was kind of fun. We'll take the challenges trolley rivers appointee teeth. Right. So now they didn't have pointing teeth, they didn't have things. No fangs. They were I, maybe they would have sanded him down into fit in better to high school. How was the Berkeley skin? Well, I've learned to minimize is that in because I was worried like an adult male sparkling could be a little scary. So I had the least amount of sparkling in the movie possible. But I'll aimed at that for us. So we just worked on techniques that would be subtle in his Mulas dick is could be, you know, that iridescent shimmer you know, I was a tricky part. Toilet, a feminist film his twilight feminist film. Yeah. I would say so in a way because we do show, the, the whole movie is from Bellas point of view. But could she have been less passive or more of a bad ass beyond, maybe, but that is the character arc through the whole series of books where she finds her strength? So in the first one, she didn't get to be quite as much of a bad asset. She does by the end. Criticisms of the book and one of which obviously a lot of this is all stuff, that's actually, in the books as opposed to, you know what you personally to like, again, the sense, the book serve reverses, we shade sexual roles, which is that they those eager to have premarital sex in the man keep saying, no. If the same time, it does that also reinforces idea that young men sexuality is dangerous of young women must be protected from. I interesting does it reinforce the that young men sexuality is dangerous and women should be protected from God didn't even know that was a thing to reinforce because it seems more like people are nervous about young women's sexuality, and they're scared if a woman is openly sexual or interested in sex. That's more feared more taboo in our society is men sexuality dangerous. Well, we know it is dangerous because of what's happened lately, we find when men do turn into predators. It can be really destructive actually not just to that one person that spirited, but to the whole world, the destruction that we've seen, you know, on a global level and on a deep cultural level that kinda metality. So I don't think that twilight fits into any of the categories at all. Those part of words appealed of level is. Basically, he is keys like aware that there's this dangerous sexuality within us trying to spend to suppress it. But it's like tearing apart. That's dramatizing, right. And that Edward is deeply moral character. And he is a very conscious of being, you know, a soulful conscious being. I think that is one of his appeals that you women feel like oh I could trust this person. He loves her so much obviously, it's a fastest. Then you're going to have the most handsome, beautiful amazing guy in the world. That's madly in love with you. And we'll take care of you and protect you against anybody else. Else's trying to harm you on a gripe fantasy. That's why I literally was in Vancouver, one day scouting for another. Maybe in a van load of women Salmi recognize me on the street. And these were very attractive, like thirty five year old women in a upscale van, they traveled all the way from Florida, just to go to the place. Is the hotel that Robin stayed in that hotel one night, they jumped out and swarm me, they'd written their own self published books about their twilight addictions. They had pocket-size Edwards. They were driving cross country with, you know, and these were good looking great looking women with hot husbands, and everything. But they just told me all about their obsessions. They made their husbands. They would one of them, the husband had to get the same car that Edward had an and he had to be called his name was, Sean. She called him, Sean word, you know, very strange. People trying to create this fantasy of the perfect man. It's amazing. Redaction figure channels Edward action figures, and then they've found how to take selfies, you know, so that they would look the same scale as them in the shots in a was pretty cool. Pretty scary. People lost their jobs over Edward obsessions. One of them brought a cutout of Edward into the dental office where they had the staff meeting, and then she refuse to have Edward, leave even though her boss said, he's not a person in only staff is supposed to be in this meeting. She wouldn't take Edward cutout out. She lost her job. So clearly filling some. And there are Edward pillowcases and beach tells. And all of this is basically, explain because in reality real, ma'am, just suck. Hey, I heard that a lot of guys teenagers went to their hair dressers all across the country and try to get the Edward hairstyle after this. I don't think that real men set, but they don't have hair stylist. And, you know, screenwriters and directors telling how and wardrobe stylist and all that, you know, we do a lot of work to create the allusions in movies, everybody seeking perfection. A doomed was exactly also are cinematographer, Elliot Davis did a beautiful job lighting Bella and Edward immune. If you look every frame is kind of a piece of art. I think you know, and we don't walk around with all those lights every day. Rely. One one thing that was very interesting to me when I started working on twilight was when you start diving into the history of vampires. And you realize that so many cultures had a vampire, like creature or myth that people really seem to have this need to create an idea of people would always be searching for immortality. So some out was very common that if you could drink human blood, you could be immortal, or you could look more beautiful or so. There was this great fear, and it's in so many historical references and everything. So many drawings of the vampire mythology all over the world, China, Germany, of course everywhere. So I thought that was fascinating. I wanted to layer that into the movie, the only way we really could do that a little bit was UC Bella when she starts to get suspicious who, who is guy what's going on. I don't understand. She's trying. To put the pieces together that she goes on her computer and starts searching for the history of vampires. And so you see a little taste of that, you know, as she's trying to understand. And then finally, there's at really cool climatic scene. You know, in the forest you know, she's going to confront him. She's finally got the courage to confront him. And he asked her to say the word out loud. You know what is, what is it that you think I am? She finally says, you know, vampire, so it's kind of I kind of loved all that leading up to that. And all the beautiful old drawings. Weird would cuts of people that were accused of vampires and Transylvanian too. So fascinating that recorded history of vampires. Pulled you into the thraw. Yeah, it kind of drew me in, because I was just every day, of course, everybody is searching for the miracle anti-aging, serums and creams and all this stuff. And you know what can I eat to superfoods, and all we're all trying to make ourselves into superhuman or into superstars. And, and, you know, the idea of drinking blood human blood does that create that bee pollen of rhinoceros horns, you know, this is eternal quiz. At many humans have had their history to be more beautiful to live longer not to age, you know, and the idea that a vampire doesn't age that this kid can look gorgeous. He's seventeen. How long have you been seventeen you know, over one hundred years, I've been seventeen he's always going to look like that. So Bella is desperate in the later books to change because she doesn't want to be super old with the seventeen year old boy. I friend. That's not a good look. 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