Billy Corgan and Dave Lagana - Notsam Wrestling 267
This week we're looking at this year's stark aid. Bray Wyatt has a new championship. Bout plus billy Corgan and Dave Laguna from the NWEA are on the show. This is not sam wrestling. Land is introducing. Sing your host from New York. Here is Sam rumors. Welcome hope everybody had a good Thanksgiving course. We last spoke on Thanksgiving but hope everybody had a good Thanksgiving weekend. Eight a lot of Turkey. Got Your Black Friday deals. Maybe you started decorating the House for the holidays but now it's back to work. I know the Monday after Thanksgiving giving weekend is always tough however the nice thing about any of you that are either working or in school is. Let's be honest. Nothing gets done between now. How and New Year's it's December? We're here star cade last night smackdown on Friday. We'll get to all of it. We'll have a state of wrestling this week. We'll get to all of that. Don't forget you can email in for the state of wrestling at not sam wrestling gmail.com. We'll get to your questions speaking of stuff that you can do in. The podcast isn't on the new youtube age is up and running. I spent a Lotta time. This thanksgiving weekend getting the not sam wrestling. You do page together. Of course we've been really really successful for the last several years The Not Sam Youtube page but I felt like what the amount of content that is being created for it and the amount of content in my brain that I think we can create for it. It started to feel very very cluttered. It also started to feel like they were you know there was content on the page that was for two different fan bases right and some people don't want any wrestling. Some people want all wrestling doing some people want both so what. I've decided to do all of the wrestling content. If you listen to this podcast twice a week at YouTube dot com slash. Not Sam make the change. All of the wrestling content is going to youtube dot com slash. Not Sam wrestling. 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Not Sam wrestling are going to be huge places for it as well as this year. PODCAST and the Sirius. XM radio show. And everything else that I've got going on in my little. Not Sam Universe verse. Speaking of of of the universe the wrestling universes forever expanding and I hear from a few of you from time to time on twitter. That say you know you do this very. WWe heavy podcast. It's always been very. WWe heavy podcast of WWE's what I've always been a fan of. WWE's what I watched so you know that's right cover. The last thing I'm GonNa do is watch a thirty second youtube clip of a new Japan show and sit there and tell you what happened at the new Japan. Show mm some kind of expert. Now I'M GONNA share my opinions on the stuff that I actually watch and enjoy but I also think that there is value in talking talking about the wrestling world as a whole and that's why I interview people like Luke Hawks who I had on last week and this week billy corgan and Dave Logan now I've been acquaintances. I would say friends friendly with Dave and especially Dave for a while now just because since the the NWEA kind of reformed under the Billy Corgan. Dave Logan banner so billy Corgan and Dave Logan met in. TNA Dave Logan who was a member of the creative team and Billy Corgan was an investor in TNA that was looking to buy the entire company obviously things went sour but the two of them hit it off respected each other in terms of their wrestling brains Raines And decided to start this thing. So what billy did was he bought the NWEA catalogue and Ip. And when I say catalog I don't don't mean video. I mean more the trademarks the Intellectual property of the belt the just the NWEA. As a name. Billy Billy Corgan was able to purchase it because people laughed at him at the time because it really wasn't looked at as something that had a lot of value and what they did. And we've had had nick aldus on the show a couple of times really like having nick on But Nick they start. Nick won the Nwea Championship and what they basically did was they had nick go show to show independent shows everywhere that he could go and defend the NWEA title so the end of you wasn't actually a promotion promotion anymore. It was just this body right so I think that the year or two that they did that because it was so different and because Nick Alba's presented it so well it brought a lot of is brought out of curiosity back to what was going on with the end of you eight also brought a lot of integrity back to the title. No I mean it helped the codes challenged and won the NWEA championship. I think it all in and nick appeared on on ring of honor and nicotine nicotine everywhere for a period of time. But what Billy Corgan who billy Corrigan's one of my favorite stories. Because there are so many the people that are not wrestling fans that I interact with that they go. I've heard that billy corgan is a wrestling fan. Is that true because they from the smashing pumpkins and I'm like a wrestling fan. Billy Corgan is a die hard. Billy corgan bleeds this stuff like the rest of us so much so that he found himself in the position that he's in and decided to by the end of UA create something new in wrestling and that's what they're doing nwea power is so nwea power for those of you. That haven't seen it. I've brought it up once or twice here on the podcast. I know a lot of you. Have they talked about it a lot in the discord room. That's exclusive for our Patriot members as well as on twitter and stuff like that. I always hear you guys talking about watching it so I know a lot of you are but NWEA power power is basically a return to studio wrestling. It's it's really great. Because it's this throwback to sort of late seventies early as eighty TV studio NWEA wrestling. But it's done with stars of today and maybe a couple of star you haven't seen in a while and it's done in a way that that is somewhat tongue in cheek in there is some irony to it but it still takes seriously what's going on it takes The product takes itself seriously while still finding the humor in the fact that in two thousand nineteen. They're doing this. TV studio wrestling. I I think it's great. I think it's different. I love what I love whether it's in wrestling whether it's in film whether it's in music everywhere I love when I can tell. That creator of a product has a vision. I loved it in technology. Twi loved apple for so long. Because you you feel you could see you could taste steve jobs vision when you got these apple products and you can good filmmaker as you're watching the film you can see what the filmmakers vision and successful or not you can at least see that he had a vision here because there's so many people that create things with no vision doing either for the sake of creating it or because they're there you know trying to capitalize on a trend or trying to make a quick buck or whatever it is you can always tell the difference and billy corgan and Dave Levante on Dave Laguna have a very clear precise thought through vision. And they're sticking to it and it's succeeding and and it's been really really great so far I will tell you that. This interview took place a couple of days before the episode air where Jim Cornet Ornette made his Ethiopian. KFC joke obviously. If this interview happened after that I would have talked to Dave and billy about how something like that happens. It being taped show how to somebody not catch that earlier and you know and and and and everything every every question that there is because you said there you go. We'll of course Jim Cornet should've known better. But it being taped show of course it should never have made the air and I don't know but I didn't get a chance to ask those questions because this interview took place like it might have been the day of that episode airing. I think it was the morning of of that episode airing so we don't tackle that topic because it wasn't a topic at the time of this conversation but we tackle just it's about everything else. We talked about the fact that they're moving to pay per view. We talk about what's going on with their youtube channel. We talk about the the vision for making money behind it. Everything you've ever wanted to know as well as what went into picking the stars of Twenty Thousand Teens. Nwea the legacy the whole thing. It's a really interesting conversation with two guys in wrestling who I really like talking to. Dave Laguna Billy Corgan together on not Sam. AM wrestling the not sam wrestling interview. I'm really happy to be doing this in studio the minds. The creative minds lines everything really behind what the NWEA is in two thousand nineteen and really over the last. I guess two years three years something something like that. Yeah Billy Corgan Dave Logan together and I mean I is this our first caller. We've never done. I talked to Sam like do you want us both breath and sound a dirty and I thought we would all right. Why don't you usually do 'em together like do you? Shy Away from where we're just not in the same place very often. I so you know if if I'm doing an interview he's usually in studio or vice versa and we try to kind of Split. The difference that makes sense spread You can hit the most ground that you guys have it to be so happy with what's gone on with power because it feels like one of these things that just let's put it on Youtube and see if it works and I mean if you look look at the week to week numbers. They're amazing if you look at the fan reaction both from fans and from people within wrassling everybody everybody is just like fallen in love with the show feels like it's been a real pleasure and a and a revelation. Because you know you you can you can guess ask what you have but until you see real numbers real real response you don't really know We're really proud that we trusted our talent to be in that situation because has You know it is a situation because of the live audience and the nature of how things go these days with social media where you can totally fall on your face. We had. We had to calculate that there are going to be those moments is that just don't work on but we're willing to take that chance and I think tha wentz talent saw the crowd reaction in the vibe in the studio to what we were doing You can almost see. They're they're light. Start to go on like Oh this is kind of fun. This is different and then by the second day the talent was completely invested. And I think the shows have gotten better because you see the talent to buy in and And we're about to enter another taping cycle. You have to pay per view on December fourteenth tapings on the fifteen sixteen December and so We're looking for because now we feel like we. We kind of know what we have. And and I think the talent Alad will come in even with the More excited attitude. Because I think they they're going to have a better idea what they WANNA do in that environment it's It's rare that you get people to show up without really knowing what they're getting into. Even the people that bought tickets to our first show. They didn't know what they're getting into and we had said something defective. We don't even know what's going to happen. There are a lot of situations like the question question. Mark the audience reaction to the question. Mark was a one eight. We had no idea inside the the guys had figured out that the match on this week show completely completely redone in the fly to work with what the audience was doing and we couldn't stop that if we wanted to even if we wanted to try and manipulate it we just couldn't with little things to do in the promos live. Obviously the way they used to be done leaves you with moments. Where Eli Drake doing this Promo and the fans are chanting question? Mark and when he takes a pause to see what. They're chanting chanting in realizes that question mark is saying how am I head. I'm watching I'M GONNA go. How's it going to deal with this? 'cause they're like kind of doing this fun thing but he's trying to get this message across his ability to go question mark into exclamation and then get them on. His side was like yeah. This is one of those lost arts of wrestling of really on the fly. Making the audience go on the journey that you intend for them to go on the shows. Closer to Saturday night live the than pro wrestling show. As far as we can lay out Improv type environment and then what happens ends up happening and it's we just go with it and we're always tweaking the show when it's done. I think it was the second episode We had that interview interview with Camille and Nick and the Click Bait stuff and you know after after we looked at the first cut. It just doesn't work. What's reorder everything? We shot new scenes. And you know it's it's a living breathing thing I mean the show usually gets done about eleven. AM on Tuesday You know with gardening together to where it needs to be. It's it's really. It's unlike anything I've done in. Nineteen years subduing wrestling. And there's nothing like it on television. The Internet as far as the way it's being produced. Yeah how How important were the numbers? Were their expectations. Dictation for numbers because I think people also this perception of a lot of what you guys are doing especially because you're kind of the the the figurehead behind this thing. Billy people feel like well. Billy Corgan is this you know successful Rockstar. So he can ingest invest this money into this wrestling hobby and if it works then great if not. He's having a Lark. Is that well. That's that's a lot of money for alarm. Let me let me tell you. Let me tell you you know I think I've been working on the professional side of professional wrestling now going on about seven or eight years Invested a lot of time which you know if if you want to put a dollar value to my I time I mean do that math alone just you know just the meetings the the plane flights the phone calls Let me do stuff like this interview. While you're we're here to do music I mean people say where do you find time to resting and it's like it's on top of my musical life And I have a very very busy life and I'm also a parent so I love it. I love the business and planet being successful in the business And the people I talked to behind the scenes you know You know I talked to some of the biggest companies. He's in the world now if I get that phone call because I mea- You know I'm on that phone call to figure out how to create a business model that there'd be attracted to it's not because they just WanNa talk to me right. I don't WanNa waste these people's time and they certainly don't want to waste my time so I think that that that narrative of like you know the somebody playing being in the sandbox of wrestling. I think that's quickly rooted and most notable thing I'd point to his I'm not on the product you know you don't see my face every five seconds. I'm not out there cutting promos. Almost I don't even want to be on the product. I can help it because I really wanted to be talent Now this is this is you know. Look I love I love the NWEA. I love the the opportunity that presents but it is a business and we plan on being very successful in it and you know we talk about a twenty year plan. So we're very excited about the numbers we've had because has it's better than we could have hoped And it's not just that you know there. There are raw numbers you know. Everybody can point to but You know my The PUMPKINS put album in two thousand seven. That went gold. You know sold over five hundred thousand copies in an environment works hard to sell five hundred thousand copies but people in the record. So how what. What good were the numbers you know? the good news is that people really really like the NWEA power product and And we think it'll as it gets better we'll attract a bigger audience and we're very much geared towards a more mainstream audience because that's where we see the real growth those laps fans those people are not in the resting bubble fouling everything that somebody's tweeting There's a huge huge audience out there that wants classic professional wrestling done in the modern style. And we plan going after that at that segment and bring them back to the table because it's a strong economy but it's not as strong as it should or could be. Yeah it's interesting that you say that because I've watched when I've watched the show I watch it on my laptop my phone or whatever and my wife kind of walk in the room and she's not a wrestling fan an at all but she's married to have some other some other place to go so there can be something else thing eh but obviously she's more familiar with this world than just about anyone who could ever say that they're not a fan and just in hearing and she wasn't watching it at all but just just in hearing and as she walked by she was hearing the promos and she was like well. That sounds different. It was almost like and she didn't want to say because you want to be disrespectful folded anybody but her reaction was. Oh I guess that's what they're supposed to sound like you know and I think that I think that real quick people figure out when watching. Yeah sorry to jump in on this but I feel like I have been saying it for years but you know. UFC effectively took the classic rusting Promo from a model and they brought it into the modern world. And how are they able to to add real fuel to it. Well the promos at least allegedly were real bright right. It was a real fight and there were real consequences. Of course once I saw about forty you have see fights where the guys were hugging at the NFL viciously cutting each other up and promos. I started realizing the guys had figured out that by working Conor McGregor being a great example by working they could sell more tickets more power to them. Everything is professional wrestling as we in the rain. Especially when you literally earlier watching UFC. And you're hearing superstar Billy Graham or you're hearing the rock. Yeah I bless God bless but what I what I felt was that the wrestling business as a whole was slow to adapt adapt to the new pace. That you have see it set right and I think by bringing it back to that kind of unscripted in your face. Hey Maybe I'm going to stumble over my words but there's real emotion behind it. That will sell this better than if I give this perfectly delivered soliloquy which somebody's not buying in the fourteenth row because it just sounds like somebody else wrote it not the person talking So I I'm all about it. I mean people ask How much of our promos her scripted and the answer is they're not? We literally just talents bullet points and say go out and say whatever you want to say and in most cases there's not even a time limit. Just go out there and just cut your Promo and if you're on a row keep going right don't there's n- like just go the perfect example. Is Tim Storm on the first show. Tim's that uncle you just really hope does well. You know there was a great tweet tweet. Somebody said Tim's the father I never had that. I don't WanNa disappoint and you know that first Promo he starts to quote Eminem in a way that just like what and he's so so likeable and the people love him that it's just it comes across and that's you know we. We told him. Hey this is what we're looking for. And he just did it and like I said our show could be twelve minutes or could be fifty nine minutes and fifty nine seconds. We're not bound by anything. And I think that's really the cool part if something comes out of the show it's out of the show because it's not good for the pace or the character you know we don't have to hit three hours. We don't have two hours and I think that allows our towns too just to feel free to go. How hard is it to find this line between Wean the kitsch of doing all school thing and almost the humor value in it and creating something that people are taking seriously fantastic question I would say we're entering a world where there really is no line anymore We have a president that cuts promos. you know I I watch You know quote Unquote Real Sports. And they're cutting wrestling promos. I watch Very very very talented people in the wrestling business cut very very serious promos and then I look on their social media and they're hugging backstage because they went to do something that was really admirable. LEICA A charity event. Or something so are we supposed to believe the not believe than believe or not believe. Are we supposed to always live in the universe. I I think Hollywood isn't a good example of they. They gave up that ghost long ago. There was a time between the nineteen teens. In the nineteen fifties were Hollywood stars. Ars were really protected. They since they were always kafe eight mode right they they were. They made sure they didn't look or do anything. That was out of character with what the public wanted to believe because it was good for business and then of course. They lost control of the narrative. With the coming of the modern of a media You know tabloid the National Inquirer stuff like that. So I think we're in a world now where I guess I would say it and it's not a dodge of the question. I just say if you believe that you believe it and if you don't you don't and it's really more on the talents to make you believe I used to. I used to meet people in airports in the nineties. That would be disappointed because I like basketball because they wanted me to be in some kind of goth sad state all the time because that was the character that they believed moved into the music and I always would kind of Bristle at that like. Why can't I also be a human being who's who's funny and dumb and silly and jerk you know like a human beings? Things are very complex individuals. I think entertainment tends to dumb things down. I would lean towards more sophistication so yeah. There are times when I watch our programming. We're like we're right on the line line of what is this. Yes and I think that's a and I and I'm not taking it as critique but I'm saying that's a criticism worth considering like where is the line You know we we turn to each other during this tapings and we said this is like a weird combination of springer and Georgia Championship. Live or something like we're entering some sort of new territory three and I don't think I don't think we have enough data to say what is what isn't isn't working. But I can tell you and I don't mean this criticism of other people's products. I have have a hard time as arresting fan in in in twenty nineteen believing that the same people that I saw on social media hugging backstage are now in some massive blood feud MHM So either there's gotta be some contrivance that I buy into that takes me on a particular journey and humorous part of that journey then fine. But there's gotta be some contrivance livens that doesn't ask me completely suspend disbelief when the chance of me doing that because they're acting ability isn't that great and they don't have the contrivance a major motion picture CGI thing happening around them and they can shoot lightning out of the ends of their fingers. Or something I just feel like it's I. I'm I'm not answering the question. What what I'm saying? The world is so amorphous. I don't think we have those answers yet. yeah I mean I think that you watch and they get does a good job because that's something that was watching for is A. There's plenty of tongue in cheek stuff whether it's in the ads you know or or whatever it is but then when you start getting the story part part of it whether it's in the promos or in the matches themselves and the commentators and everything you fall into the story so you you're not in that tongue-in-cheek world anymore and then I start to look at it differently and I look at Lake The nickel this commercial for the video game and I go. Yeah like this is obviously funny and completely tongue in cheek. But it's it's still the same character that I believe in so like somehow I'm in this kind of weird vortex where this thing I can acknowledge is like okay. This is irony but it's the character still. Yeah I would say look let's see. Let's use an example of of Michael Jordan or Lebron Lebron James Can. I believe that they're they're they're able to do charity. Can I believe that there are killer on the basketball court when the when the when the you know when they when they blow the first whistle to start are at the game Can I can. I believe that they're capable of being. He'll and a baby face depending on the situation. Can they be serious when they need to be serious and can they be silly when they need to be silly. You know the fact that Peyton manning did funny commercials did that take away from his ability to win a super bowl You know what I'm saying like I think we live in a different world now where you have to. I guess what I would say is if you believe in the person navigating the the car of the personality whether it's worked worked or not Are you willing to take that journey and I would say the rough edges around like did the girl really shoot the Dragon. Out of the sky. And Game of thrones will. That's that's that's gets into like the idea of like. Are you a marketing. Are you willing to believe something. which is patently not real? Does it make sense. Yeah it's like yeah it's like where where where whereas your line of mark them because there was even that moment in the that Camille Knicks down the second show him and I turned to him. It was like I don't even know what we're looking at like. It's so like here's the is going. Why isn't she talking? We know she can talk. Yeah so now it leaves a lot more questions and I think the upside for us as we leave a lot up to the audiences interpretation the end of last last week show was half a fix of something that didn't work constricted down-time wise to make it feel important. But then I looked at the youtube numbers. We had a giant giant spike of people. Going back to watch that one moment trying to figure it out a mistake or something that we didn't love ended up becoming something that people were very curious on and it moves forward awards so it's unlike anything else where in my time and WBZ every moment is decided from you. Lift your left hand here. You put your right foot here. It's it's laid out. There's we find moments and if it doesn't work we take it out or we expand upon it or we just go with it and I think that's where it allows this universe to feel completely different. Yeah it's really nice the The storytelling retelling mechanism. I think allows that more with you guys than just about anything else in the sense that you can like you said you can do. Two days of tapings that will cover six weeks or whatever's GonNa cover and then kind of take that footage and if you wanNA tell a different story with the new originally intended you Kinda can or if you have a moment like you had where this this is a mistake in the fans are thinking it's this thing you can now go. Okay let's let's Kinda follow that wave. Let's let's go with them. How often do you see yourself doing that? I think it just depends on obviously You know these shows were constructed in a bubble and until we walked in the room until the room was built in. We both walked the room and we had an idea of what it would look like but in I was there from the the moon was emptied a completely until he showed up in that documentary. We did we kind of start to feel it and like when he walked in and then like then when talents walked in there was a discussion on music. Nick even up until five minutes before nick and Tim went out they were wondering. Do we have music. And we're like he he was very steadfast. He's like no just try. It and that awkwardness became came part of the thing and then nobody thinks about it now and I think it's great. I think the same thing with the ring announcements where it's not that like ring announcer voice. It's because it takes you those little details tales that do take you back. What focuses on the talent? It's really a very raw performance of them and I think as a talent you want that and for us. It's what we can offer for. We cannot offer the same money that Tony Kahn invents offer. We can't offer the same exposure that this network of that does but we can offer a chance to really be a fully formed and all all the people on the show are here for a reason and they're not somewhere else for a different reason. In those those thoughts collide neuron goes. Oh why isn't that. He can Eddie Kingston been on. TV for ten years. Yes and then but you see his talent. There's nobody who can talk like him and the same with Eli Nick and James Storm and everybody. It's like it's such a full roster of guys that should be other places uses but here it works very well. Was it your idea for homicide to wear the NWEA. I think there was obviously brilliant. It's completely brilliant. How did you pick the talent when you guys started because you know we've all had conversations about what? NWEA was when you guys started it. And it was really I tim storm. Obviously but nick aldus going showed a show downtown and just kind of representing the brand when you guys go okay. We're GONNA DO TV tapings. We're GONNA start to build this into a promotion and you do see people that you're familiar with. I mean obviously being on the East Coast Eddie Kingston Homicide Thunder Rosa but then to see. Trevor Murdoch pop to see you know Sando pop up again to see these guys is that I wasn't sure if they were even still around doing stuff. What was the process of picking? Who's going to be on these shows where we take kind of a you know we call it like the Bella check? Patriots Approach It's more of a team concept. Can you put these pieces together. So they're complementary so everybody benefits it's You know if we were to top heavy and you had such a four level talents and everybody else was basically there to sell for the level talents. I don't I think that's a product worth watching So my thought is is and I you know. Cutting I'm paraphrasing the Patriots idea. You WanNa find those talents in the market that are undervalued undervalued and by presenting them at their top value. The natural reaction of fan watching is like. Oh this is kind of interesting. This is this. There's more here than I thought and I they have that reaction and I'm sitting there and I've helped put it together right trevor. Murdoch who I was a fan of when he was in the. Wwe David called me and said what do you think about using my said absolutely really love is size definitely can work. What's he been doing lately? And we we talked about that as soon as you see him on the television. It's like there it is. Yeah there's that experience there's there's there's a reason he got over when he was over. You know it's right there in front of you You know we we. Don't you know because we respect trevor's position in in the business we're not asking to jump through forty five hoops and prove anything to us. He doesn't have to prevent this. He's there because we already believe in them Yeah we neck and I went to Harley race's funeral and he was there I I pulled him aside after I said what are you doing like what are you. Don't like what he's like work here and as A. Why aren't you wrestling? Does the business passing buys no. It hasn't said come to Atlanta. Goes where we even do it. So I don't know figure it out as an agent you'll just I've known them literally from WBZ. He was the one of the first guys I worked out of outside of the wwe and he just cares is a great trainer and and it's his details and when you look at his matches he has such details to what he does and the matchy has with Nick. Tonight is just unbelievable. Unbelievable piece of business is the best way to describe it. And there's a place in the market for this for us and where it goes. That's the best part of this has been our literary our journey since we escaped. TNA Like a plot from escape from New York it You know it allowed us. We we have no they were just kind of where I would say. We're building this plane as we fly using duct tape spitting bubblegum and sometimes a hole inside of the plane. And we just gotTa we'll we'll put Josephus the whole and see what happens you know. It's it's it's unlike anything and I think that's why it works. We'll get back to billy corgan and gun just a minute but you know when tragedy strikes I I wanna make sure that the people who are there to represent me that claim to have my best interest at heart get me. And that's why I'm excited about Morgan and Morgan Morgan and Morgan Morgan. They'll tell you not to tap out to the insurance company after a car crash or another injury. Morgan and Morgan are the personal injury law firm. That's for the people. Not The powerful there are family owned firm that never represents insurance companies or corporations. Morgan Morgan will grapple the biggest baddest heels heels. So you can recover in time for the next pay per view. I swear the promising all of this on average people who hire an attorney after a crash. Recover over three times more than those. Who Don't with five hundred attorneys in offices in Florida New York and across America? Morgan and Morgan can get you the compensation and you deserve. If you've been injured in a car crash slip and fall or on the job. They might just be able to help. Morgan morgans helped thousands of people recover cover billions of dollars. Best of all hiring them is one hundred percent free unless you win. You know I I sit there and and I've had minor car accidents bus. Hit me going onto the west side highway in a bus was turning on and it hit me in a flat tire and scratch my car to go and get pay all kinds of money to get the car fixed up. The insurance company really. Wasn't there for me like I thought they would be the bus company. Certainly wasn't there for me at all. I wish that I had somebody that knows. How to talk in wrestling jargon and also knows the the laws and insurance and the way to get compensation? two-way Morgan and Morgan does at that time. But now you do and if you want to get involved with them they'll we'll give you a free case review. All you have to visit for the people dot com forward slash. Not Sam or dial pound law on your cell phone. That's pound five two nine four. The people dot com forward slash. Not Sam for a free no obligation consultation. There's only one Morgan and Morgan when you guys did it your grand escape. TNA Did you do it together with this in mind not necessarily all this but just sort sort of like. Let's kind of lead this and see or were you both just two individuals going to definitely separate because his reason for leaving was You know he had Invested one point eight million dollars To lovely southern southern lady who Was We call it. Game of thrones. He was working six sides to keep yourself in play I. I was watching as an employee when they literally they fired him. The day after the cubs won the world series and he was at the game I called him and said I think you just got fired They sent a mass mass emails. Like Boy or any of that and so I got a phone call a four hours after from my boss saying They they WANNA know what you plan to do. Aw I said I'm employees have done nothing wrong. I plan on being here and so I talked to him the next day and I said well this is what I'm thinking and and I went to John Gabor ex house and along with Matt Conway was my writing partner and I said I'm probably leaving. And just let him know because he's the only person that he and I really trusted trusted there the whole time and he's like well. Listen my wife's having a baby in six weeks I can't leave yet. I said that's fine. I'm just letting you know we're going. I go to quit To My boss at the time John Gabor at Texture Matt Conway. My wife just went to labor like literally six weeks early and he's like like two weeks as well that was the signing to leave. Yeah so you know. It was my decision I I gave up a six figure salary for no guarantee. We didn't start doing anything until thirty days in January and we didn't start at the end of June but it was decision to not sit in negative energy and that company is right very bad negative energy. Yeah it was kind of a situation where it was so I really hope someday. Somebody writes a book about that company. Because I it would make it would make a case study in sociopathic behavior earlier and bad business which you know and and certainly my head should be examined for trying to buy the company about but that said Ed But that said when we came out of that situation I think both was kind of took a deep breath and said okay. Well we obviously have a desire. We've seen enough energy in the and remember. This is all before all the elite stuff and all this right like particularly with the holidays and the deletion series. We saw that there was kind of a new voice voice in wrestling. That that wanted to be heard We saw enough energy for the things that we did get over in That there was a new type of wrestling fan out there that wanted something slightly different so we started there. We at least had that empirical information and then we sat there and said okay. Do we want even do something and if we did what would it look like Nick And we just kind of you know we rotated around ideas and eventually settled on the idea that maybe buying an August brand like the NWF would be a good place to start Because you know in essence the the story is already within it and then once we got into all that and we had to start untangling all the massive problems that were left from what was the Nwea away and then of course then we had to turn to the marketplace and talk to people like you and sort of explain what we are trying to do and because it didn't necessarily fall into the year we're running shows and and you know we're on the network you never heard of and all that stuff people would kind of look at us not saying you but people look at us like don't really understand how that's GonNa work because it wasn't the conventional conventional wisdom. It wasn't the thing that anybody had done before. I got a lot of you know you know. The rest of the bubble has its way of talking Not Nestle with a unified voice but you kind of get a message. The message which I got from it in the beginning was will. If you're not going to blow money were not that interested. In essence blowing money equals activity. Yeah and I'm like but I just came from a situation situation. Is Somebody blowing money and you see where that went right In back to the teenage thing for a second think of the amount of money TNA actually spent through the years I don't know how much they spent his accompany. Couple of hundred million You know for a for a brand name. They kept trying to change but would never pull the trigger They had incredible opportunities to actually move forward in the market and see blow themselves up every time they would actually get some traction. So you know the idea that you that's blowing money equals pulls Some sort of success You know so we kind of had a weather that first storm of like what is it. What was it is? Do you think that the wrestling bubble thinks that blowing money any is success. Or do you think there's something about the wrestling bobble that says oh there's money over here if I can get behind this. Maybe they can have some of it. I think it's a bit Ab- Oh yeah It's proof of concept separate. You know. Well you're not serious unless you're blowing money and if you're if you're not blowing money than you must not be serious We realized that You know that marketing was gonna be the key If you remember there were podcasts. That came out today that we announced that that I bought the NWEA brand name would he by by way. Let me interject the brand. Dan was so worthless on the open market. The wwe didn't even want it and they could. They could have had it for a song and just thrown it in their in their integrated and they're storehouse of of of brand names that they own that they don't do anything right. They could have got it with. They had talked to Bruce tharp about buying the Houston Library that we have license on and they decided wasn't even worth as a throw in on. This library decided not even to buy right so it could have just been by the name. Throw the title in the warehouse down. Yeah and You it's been a lot of hard work and it's been us you know. Our team has been very small. And we if you if you see my DMZ amount of people that are looking for work at. I I have the same people. Email me every time we make an announcement and then I don't hear from them like Billy says untold there. There's money and you know a lot of our a lot of people who are on our our show believe in us I would say ninety eight percent of the people that we booked on the show never asked about the money. The one when we booked him it wasn't about the money was about the opportunity you but we communicated that to them and they understood that this is a real chance to do something completely different and you know if we would have booked a four thousand seat arena and paper bird it and and done just what everybody else did. I don't think it would have the impact and as much as its retro. He said to me last week on last week's show the show feels like it's instagram. Where you're literally segment by segment going through? And it's designed that way as as retro a disease we live in a communication world where people watch things thirty seconds to ninety seconds to two minutes at the time and only our main event is longer than a normal segment. You know. What's great is the little details that there's no dead space between transitions nations that the transition hits as last word is still being said? Sorry to interrupt giant literally because he sends me he sends me a rough cut of the show and then I give my. I will literally right him. That on the time code and go get out a second earlier segment. I want the show to move so fast. That's what it feels like a like a you know whatever the what was that offense the The hurry up. Hurry up Ou- fan so we're like we're like the hurry up offense wrestling but never at the. It never hurts the story you know. It's like the Russo crashed. TV like it's not that and you know. Everyone has their opinion on Vince. Vince did a lot of very good unique things in the nineties. And I think the format does always need to evolve here. We took a format from the sixties seventies and eighties. And everyone's like oh it's an old school format. Yeah but it's run at a twenty twenty pace. Go Go back and watch an old Georgia championship wrestling and watch the pace of that show. Everybody thinks it's wretched you'll learn about five minutes. It ain't that I would say thirty. Seventy percent of those old shows. Those were garbage. Cable was the C.. Show you it was about the you know the syndicated show and that was just an afterthought show so taking a format and in a in a communication platform. Youtube is an afterthought for ninety percent of wrestling companies. Right it's it's we'll just put that on youtube the worse when I was at w w was take everything off Youtube and because a lot of big companies viacom all fought this this this wave that were going and were early late to this this format you know there are a lot of very talented. Youtubers are making a lot of money and our growth on the platform. I gave him some predictions of numbers as we keep growing. I mean we we do. Every episodes over two hundred thousand views. We have a hundred and fifty thousand subscribers. An average channel like Peter MacKinnon. WHO's a really great photographer? The is three point. Four four million followers subscribers his videos do three hundred thousand. Yeah so we're figuring out like we're getting people to come don't even aren't even you to people and you know as we grow and you get in front of more people. I think the show. We'll continue to grow and it's really interesting. It's funny as I think that the number one platform for a cord cutters that have you know. Internet live television television instead of cable is Youtube. TV So it gets to the point where you start to really blur that line of like what really makes this youtube thing and not a TV visha this kind of question but it but it will be interesting to see if we can find ourselves in a place where we don't need a network To support us if we can create a A If you remember when Tina I started with jared. They're running the pay per view model. Yes which I was interested in just from a consumer point of view was like whatever three bucks to watch an episode or whatever and I would watch a lot of them because I I wanted to support the idea that they were trying to do something different as far as the marketplace. So I think we're in that same position where we might be in a situation where we can continue to grow the Nwea be able to do live shows and not actually have to serve any particular master as far as the network would go I talked to somebody quite powerful recently. WHOSE NAME I won't drop but You know they were talking about whether I wanted to be on a network and I said yeah but I don't WanNa give up all the all the freedom that I have you know I I loved the freedom that I have and and they joked and said yeah what you would be nice to get that check and I said yeah well you know. I don't see anybody throwing around that kind of money. Even you know from what what we know about the Tony Kahn delay. He's heavily invested in his side of the deal with Turner. And that's what most of the deals that are available out there as you gotta come in with some serious risk capital or some serious cash because networks just aren't going to write those checks anymore because they'd rather they'd rather have a show that they have total control over and total peon rights writes wrestling's always a bit of a weird thing for network. Because like who are we in business with and you've got all these independent talents and this construct of the input independent contractor so Y- yeah I mean when I when I've done network deals all they care about is their Ip because what they want to be able to do is turn to their boss and and and explain to them how they're going to make money off all the mugs and the t shirts and all that type of so not having complete control on Ip and streaming rights and Yes that's why that's why anybody entering the market including Tony. Kahn is GonNa Learn the one thing. That Vince McMahon figured out thirty five years ago. Where if you don't have enough brand social brand leverage in the marketplace you cannot control the marketplace? Vince is is controlled. It all these years. Yeah and Whether it's a w whether it's the NWEA whether it's you know You Know Sam Roberts wrestling were all going to have to figure out how to create a new economy because that that network economy is very very difficult to navigate if you don't have the history and the leverage and the cash flow that Vince does well. I mean it's very very clear to me and I think you guys figured out early by you. Know doing ten pounds of gold on Youtube and figuring out a way to you know okay. We're GONNA have this champion that we send from show to show but the narrative is going to be through these youtube videos that anybody can watch their short enough that you can watch them whenever you want and I mean it goes back to what we're doing here like yeah I work at serious various but I'm also pretty well aware of the podcast industry and the amount of people that are not sitting there going like oh I just need to get a radio show because they figured out that you could do a podcast and do whatever you want and if it's good and basically You know outside of being offensive pretty much. Say Whatever say whatever you want if you can get an audience you and your even moving past the ad sales model of these people that are making huge livings on services like Patriot and stuff like that where it is completely under even just merch. Yeah Yeah exactly we built the this is the worst selling commercials on our show now and like high spots is the first I real sort of vendor that. They made a commitment of six weeks of commercials that we produced for them. It wasn't like just send US commercials right now. They want to be in our world and more or people coming forward so think that's interesting about people supporting this and it's it's interesting. You know people talk about the A. WWe Wore the real war is the streaming services because about three or four years ago Pirating was way down when net flicks was like the only place to get content and pirating starting to go up because his more contacts silo behind behind these walls with apple having their service which number wise is not Disney plus or Disney has ten million subscribers in the first week apple plus has three hundred thousand their apple You Know Amazon. You have all these places. Fighting Youtube is the only free place to really go and get content. And I think the market it always decides where they're gonNA WATCH GUSTAF FOR US. This is the best place was. We are growing an audience. Nick and Camille were at the big event this past weekend And the amount of energy that they both both communicated to us was ten to twenty times bigger than an appearance they had had pre power and we pushed it on our show with a commercial. But it's interesting to have people come up and just just every day after the show like the Hash Tag. It's just it's insane. How people are watching the show? It's not if you don't watch it on Tuesday like aws on a Wednesday. It's that's when you watch it and it's weird. How people watching this on their time? Yeah I mean I don't WanNa blow smoke and if it wasn't sure edged wouldn't bring it up but I was kind of taken aback because because you know when I do the wrestling podcast. There's plenty of stuff that I don't talk about their so much wrestling. You can't talk about everything. I was really surprised at at the amount of people that were like. When you can talk about power when you can talk about power when you're talking about power this blessing yes? This is a thing. Keep keep on. What do you when you talk about the you know figuring out the NWEA right when you first come on board and you and you start to fix everything I and start to you? Know put the investment investment back in the brand so people take the brand seriously. What do you consider the lineage of current NWEA? How much responsibility do you take peak for what came before you? Are you charging about in in the in the in the in the in the recent years or the or the or like say you know the beginning of the decline in the eighties. I mean when you guys say this is this is Nwea power what what does the NWEA in your head is it. Everything thing we've known the ups the downs every or it's Oh yeah absolutely and I would point to my own musical life as an example of that. It's it's it's amazing to me. How many people celebrate periods in my musical life that I was told the time? We're the worst because the people that identified identified with those periods weather. Because they liked what I was doing or because they saw something in it or they even appreciated that I was fighting through that period because it was a tough period for me. It's amazing how they if it's there period they don't care that there was another period. That was bigger so there are there. Are Those people that are you know. They're their connection. Then W eight didn't start in nineteen seventy eight it's started in nineteen ninety eight And I think I think trying to respect all of that and and sort of celebrate more the survival of the brand you know anything that survives in this world past seventy years is pretty wild. I mean how many brands could you think of. Ah that you don't know the name of like Sara Lee are Disney or you know would GM motors or whatever you know what. I mean that. There's something that that you cannot mess swith when you're talking about seventy plus years of brand. Just the endurance becomes part of the story. Well and we. We talked to everybody and we both grew up with it and power to me is the last what you remember. Strongest when the NWEA was strongest. It's that nineteen eighty five eighty six turner. TBS 605 show rats. That's you know we leaned into that because it's one the audience is still there and I was ten to fifteen years old when that show was big. I'm now in my forties so I may bring my kid to that. My Dad and my grandfather took me to the end of you. I saw dusty Rhodes Ric flair and Philadelphia and I watched the 605 show so for us. It was identifying art. Where's the gap and you know there's a lot of discussion of laps fans and there's variances of like when WCW closed those people? Stop watching. They they they. They didn't go watch them too because that wasn't their home team they were the Atlanta Falcons. They just they lived and died with their home team. And you know there are plenty of people you know at the peak of the wrestling ordinary ten million people watching urging weekly basis. But you have to think there were another five to ten million on top of that that that came in and out and so it's really unique of what's out there and so our bet was a dollar to dollar. You know we EH. We run amazingly lean. We don't have an office. We don't have this. We don't have that. We don't have a chief marketing officer. We do it all because as we scale this product what is I mean. We're we're so much closer than people think to being a very scalable product and you know I ran the numbers for him on power. We're maybe six months away from from really being profitable with this show on our own without having to take an investment from anybody and it may be even faster than that so it's really interesting to watch this grow just just on us because we've been told no everywhere else we've been and I otherwise we do something else young he. He sold four hundred thousand tickets last last year for the smashing pumpkins and he can do anything else. He cares about the guys feeling now. I feel it that this show is everything we want it to be and I think fans resonate nate with. Wow this is something I never knew I really needed again. And I think that's why it works if the exciting part I think we'll be as if we can continue to grow and and scale up You know and so for example if we found ourselves in the opportunity where we were able to run a bigger program like dynamite or something like that what how would we innovate debate in that space. we don't have those discussions yet because we're you know we're far away away but We do feel strongly that when we're given the right opportunities we will be able to create our own unique brand in the space in those are most of the discussions that we have is is that you know it's like it's like arguing about cookies. You know When I was a kid if anybody remember famous Amos Amos I love famous Amos cookies so I wrote famous Amos and he sent me personally a bag of cookies and I got a letter back and forth? I lost the letter. Somewhere along the way but You know it. It's like arguing about what who's got the best hamburgers gus but cuckoo's wrestling's a vast universe and there's for everybody So yeah we don't see his countered anything we've just seen in addition to I think the market will continue to grow. I think the entertainment business which obviously been part part of for over thirty years. I've been told repeatedly over the last seven eight years that wrestling has no growth repeatedly repeatedly and you know as somebody who's just filed the industry that's insane but that that also shows you that just because we live in this bubble they don't live in that bubble so their perspective on wrestling from the outside so it takes things like the ww going on on Fox for them to go they read variety and they go. Oh something's happening you know I had a conversation with somebody Over wwe. That was talking about people when they were making a push to be talked about for the Whatever the TV awards emmys? Yeah and I mean this was within the last couple of years somebody at the EMMYS AMIS or or somebody in that space when you do a live show every week and you're just like how they gave millions of people keeping watch and and transplant trans every week number one on on twitter and it's been twenty years but that's what I'm saying is sometimes we in the business get low. We don't realize that the mainstream stream world continues to to basically not care and wwe more than anybody has created that narrative that that resting can survive live and thrive in the bigger ecosystem. John Cena being in movies the rock being the number one movie star in the world. There is a crossover marketing ability. But we're still a long way away from being accepted as a mainstream entertainment option. So I'm not saying we have work to do. I'm not trying to be raw raw when I'm trying to say is is. There are a lot of people out there that I don't like wrestling right. So let's set them aside but there's a lot of people out there that don't even know if they'd like resting because they're just not exposed to it because culturally. It's presented it to them as something archaic It doesn't get the modern advantage that other other sports endeavors do and as as the as more and more people cut the cord The networks in particular reason realizing they did live event television to keep those viewers staying on broadcast television. Which is why I've said all those people blend the meetings over the last eight years that people will come back to wrestling on mainstream television because its destination TV and that will never change? Yeah so into. The fire is a three weeks in change. I guess so way more or less. What is the field gonNA be like for that show? Is it going to feel like A pay per view live version of what we see on. TV In the studio is GonNa feel more like we'll have a we'll have a different sort of entrance Sasso. The guys will come down from the state From the stairs. You know. We'll have entrance music. Pay Per view. Right you know they'll be longer matches And it'll it's still will have a lot of the elements that people like with power. There were still like we won't have a backstage set. Where guys cut promos? And you know it's still gonNA be the same room but I think I think the audience will be part of the the real story and I you know I went to e C. W and that's what I call the heyday. Ninety five ninety six where that room became. You wanted to go for the room not the matches and I think we've built into sell. I think we sold three hundred and six tickets for the first two days. This time we sold seven hundred and fifty for three and it's all based. We haven't announced one match days of of of events. People are now into into it and it's you know mostly from Atlanta but people are travelling in so that pay per view is kind of this convergence of all these people that have watched it and it's only going to grow so I think we're really excited for this event. I and I think we prove a crock up. Seventy we know how to put on events. We've done that's the easy part for us. It's it's all the other stuff that we have to figure out business wise to make it work but this is this is the easy part for. I think the challenge will be An I feel responsible If I'm speaking to someone who will buy the pay per view I feel responsible that if you like. NWEA power the pay per view has to feel like it's another gear up That the live event aspect of it that we will be available alive that the the talent will know that they're being seen live that warts whatever happens is what's going to go out over the air and I think that live audience will be heavily invested in representing presenting what they want the world to know about the NWEA because there's a sort of hardcore element that's emerged already And I think it's it's it's it's going it'd be on all of us. You know to present something. So if you're 'cause look on paper it sounds a little bit strange. You're going to have a live pay per view event. But not in some place that you know a curtained-off doc arena with you. Know thirty five hundred people a certain way and we are capable of drawing with a Lotta people. It'll be that hothouse effect is does that translate up to a paper of a bigger pay per view. Feel like a big blow off feel so I think that'll be on us to see whether or not we can prove that. Well I think the live aspect is helpful to because obviously you know were six or seven weeks removed from the taping and the fact that people are still like there are spoilers on it. But it's it's weird the show has it's almost spoiler proof even if you read it doesn't feel like you you know what's going on and so I have a live event and then I think we'll have growth from it and and honestly that for us to pay like seems like why aren't you running a bigger building. What's a cost thing to set up cost so for us if the pay per view works? Yeah we'll look into it but for us it's a it's a chance to kind of get across the red and black line of where we are as a company and and I think people supporting us we had a large amount of pre orders The first day and it's like you're pre ordering a pay per view three to four weeks from now you know the money sucks. It's just just interesting. How people are supporting us? And I think it's because we've been sort of authentic in in how we've reached for it. We haven't made grandiose claims we're not we're not in any kind of war we're we're literally take hate bringing something back that that people loved yet. I think that's a responsibility. We take just as if billy bought toys R. US and was gonNA open up a kitschy toy store because that people we'll have an attachment to these things that we grew up with sears. One day we'll be a brand that people bring back in another way. Yeah it's it's a slightly divergent point but I think when worth exploring in this context you know I would have these discussions with with Dixie Carter in particularly in and John Gabbert you know. Let's call it the in the shadow of WWe WWe problem Tina was forever in the shadow. Deputy so me as being part of creative and you know I was allegedly an executive You know I would would make these arguments like why. Can't we present these programs in a different in a different way. Why do we have to be? WWE light well. If people don't see the pyro they don't see this or that they don't think it's legitimate and I'd like and I would say things like yeah. I've been to a lot of concerts where there was no production. It was great concert or I've been to plays these were. Obviously they'd spent nothing on the sets but I was engaged with the narrative. Like why can't we try to break this thing down and rebuild it some other direction so that when people look at our product in in this case it was. Tna they go you know. There's something different happening here. You take people on a different journey that comes from being a diy musician that came out of the end of the punk Alternative Alternative Goth scene or whatever they just could not wrap their heads around it as like if it doesn't look big therefore it's not big in there and I kept saying but we don't have that kind of production budget so people unconsciously recognizing that you're the B. Program right because it's a smaller version of what's going on over there. Yeah so in that sense if we if So here's here's the thing on paper. If we present a world class roster you know wrestling balls out You know You know to the best of their ability eighty in a longer style pay per view match type of setting in hothouse setting with only three hundred and fifty people in the building in a small room. Will that create something that you on the other end is a consumer Sam will go. I'm enjoying this because it's giving me some sort of it's sort of a different feeling is yeah I da. It's not wrestlemainia. But it's different and it's cool because it's this. That's those are bets that most people are not willing to make in the marketplace because they find safety and commonality where my entire higher artistic life has been. I don't find any safety in common alley. Every time I've ever stood in the line that everybody else's stood in. They told me you're not. You're not this enough. You know your teeth or crooked or what are you know what I mean like you need to be. If you WANNA be in this world you need you need to be more like everyone else. So my whole philosophy was generated like well. If you're going to kick me out of your little world I'm GonNa do it my my way right and And so it'll be interesting whether our way will translate and you know the feedback post pay-per-view will be like okay. That's a worthy endeavor or will look each other and say that was a good effort and now we know we're going to have to run more of a traditional pay per view model because it just doesn't translate bigger field while guys. I'm glad we did this. Make you super for super glad we did this. I hope by now everybody has has seen what. NWEA's doing over in the NWEA YouTube channel. W powers of course Tuesdays at six o five pm mm-hmm and it's a great. It's a great show. It's an easy watch it flies by you find yourself like I was ready to kind of scroll through and just like hit the and there's like there's no spot we don't screw going back to your let you wanna a reporter said. I didn't even pick up my phone and it's my job to pick up my phone and take notes like like that was just. It was the nicest compliment he has this show. This is the show we want to watch. And it's it's built for an audience that is not being served served in a in a in a grandiose wrestlemanias in front of seventy thousand people eighty three thousand at metlife. I was there but like like okay. We can't do that. So what can we do. And that's what we created the show for and I think we're just so happy that people are liking it and the fact that a new person finds it every day is great for us yes. That's that's the trajectory will you guys are awesome. Thank you so much Dave thank you. It's now time for this week's state of wrestling. Welcome to the the state of wrestling. Now we are going to have a bridge state of wrestling this week because the Billy Corgan interview is a nice lengthy one But thanks again. Two Billion Dave for being a part of that interview explaining kind of you know everything we need to know about the NWEA. I liked it. They're acknowledging the entire her lineage of the brand it would have been pretty easy for them to watch that clean you know how. Like when a when a reboot comes in like Halloween. When when they did the a Halloween reboot? I guess it was but the Halloween movie that came out last year and they basically said look how lean is a franchise is. This made a ton of mistakes as far as movies. Go so what we're GONNA do is. We're going to say the first one counted because the first ones in masterpiece and this is the sequel so Halloween two season of the witch. You can keep. Because it doesn't apply to the franchise. Halloween two four five there. There might be a six H Two o resurrection the RAF Zombie remakes. None of those ever happened. We're taking all that out of the legacy and we're creating a brand new one. which I I don't have a problem with you? Know Billiards said well what we're doing is we're taking the NWEA Detaille Day and once they merged. WCW were cutting it off there and so it's it's it's the NWEA pre world championship wrestling. And then now it's it's now I'd say okay. If that's the way you want to do it it's your business. That's the way you want to do it. But there is something respectable about the fact that they're as they said presenting it warts and all all and. I think that it actually goes to the branding of what the whole mission statement of the company is that you know we're acknowledging thing. The we were a dead brand where acknowledging how far behind we were and and we're building this thing back up and I think the purpose of NWEA in two thousand nineteen is to reclaim wrestling history. A lot of people knew it growing up and Dan. In order to do that they've got to reclaim the history of the NWEA. And I think that's what they're doing. I'm very interesting seeing what they do on pay per view. The stuff they've been doing on Youtube has been great. You know with the exception exception of a couple minor. Ill advised commentary statements. Everything else has been great. So I'm abby for their success success and I hope they continue to have success Speaking of wrestling throughout the world wrestle kate was happening this weekend and I really only keeping up with it because because wwe front row in the not sam wrestling discord room that you can have access to any any tier The Not Sam Wrestling Patriot. Page if you WANNA be a not Sam. She'll go to Patriot dot com slash. Not Sam wrestling for less than a dollar week. You can get the show early. You you can get ad free you can get bonus shows and you can get access to the discord room so go ahead and sign up and join us in the discord rumor talking all the time and wwe w front row is was giving his take on everything that was happening wrestle. Kate and it looks like a really good time shows all weekend convention panels I feel like it's one of those things where I I wish that somebody I wish there were people there that could turn it into an even bigger deal bill. I'm sure in the area everybody's aware of it but I feel like it should be one of those things that a lot more people are talking about because it looked like an absolute blast. And when you look at all the people were there Oh my God. It looks amazing. I did hear the Sandman had some not quite politically. Correct things to say about 'em when I politically correct such a dumb phrase but it had had some stupid things. I'll say to say to some of the women that were main eventing one of the shows at Russell. Kate which it's like you know. The the same in literally had a t shirt that said politically incorrect and proud of it like the fact that the San Man in two thousand nineteen is not quite up to speed with where we are. You know so. I wouldn't be terribly shocked by that. But when we talk about tradition when we talk about traditional wrestling in the history of it that existed outside. WWe Of course star cade. That's when you're talking about star cast it gets its name from MM stockade resume gets its name from Stark Aid Star. Cade went down last night at the time of the release of this podcast. At the time of this taping we have have not yet seen it right because taping it a couple of hours before stark eight actually happens but it's a wwe network special which is a big difference from a pay per view and even bigger difference from an international pay per view. I think A. WWe networks special. It's pretty much. What we saw? Last year would star cade. It's it's a similar to the farewelled of the shield special that they did after they said goodbye to dean. Ambrose one hundred times on television and to me. There's some of the funniest shows on the network I feel like it's such a throwback to depending on where you grew up and you can still find you could find footage of this all over. WWE Network but depending on where you grew up a lot of the house shows were actually aired on arena owned cable channels channels. So like I think the Boston Garden how shows on a local Boston cable channel. You could watch them. The Madison Square Garden House shows on the MSG meshed network. You could watch them. If you're outside of New York you didn't have access to them which is why. WWE was still able to present main event. Caliber pay per view. Caliber matches. natch is because they knew that they were only playing them for a very very limited audience and then it wouldn't kind of kill business as it were But that has sort of obviously there is no such thing as local broadcasts anymore even if they tried to air something just on a local cable channel somebody would just tape it and put it on Youtube. The results would certainly be all over the Internet within seconds of them happening they'd be on twitter. Gifts would immediately exist. I don't think you get a better gift than keithly. Throwing Adam Cole over the railing. But you'd still get gifts as the point so the closest we've got is the fact that every now and then. WWe puts what's on these Specialty how shows on the WWE network. I wish they would put the holiday shows. They do a Madison Square Garden every year. On right right around the twenty six the twenty seventh of December. WWe traditionally does a house show at Madison Square Garden. A lot of times in the afternoon and those are just superfund shows. You know they're probably probably not that dissimilar from other how shows that are circulating but still there superfund shows and I think I think I don't know what the finances are. Obviously that's going to be the difference maker but as a fan man. I would love it if there were more how show specials aired on the WWE network. Now this is going to be either sixty or ninety minute special just like the shields thing was probably a sixty minute special if I had to guess I haven't looked it up. But they're not airing the entire show so the people in attendance at stockade they will see an entire house. Show we watching on the network. We'll see just a small portion of this show presented just for US I. The lineup is was advertised as Kevin L. in getting rick flair in the Kevin Owen show fatal four way tag match for the women's Championship. Kabuki Warriors Sasha banks and Bailey Alexa Bliss and Nicky Cross Charlotte Arlit and Becky Lynch and then Russa versus Bobby Lashley in a last man standing match now since most of you. I'm sure have already seen this. Maybe it doesn't make sense to do predictions or anything right now but I think I think it would be cool to take the tag titles off the Kabuki warriors especially if it's fatal four way rules. I don't know if it's elimination if it's not elimination and it's just the first person to get a pin. You could have becky in Charlotte win the women's tag titles without pinning. I would have Becky Pin Bailey and have Charlotte Becky win the tag titles at Star Cast. What this is GonNa do is? It's the same thing they would do it every now and then you know. I remember like Summer Slam Shawn Michaels and diesel easel showed up with the tag championships because they just want him from the head. shrinkers at a house. Show what this does is it makes it so that people get excited for live events. 'cause they go out. Anything can happen at title. Ken Change and when you show up on raw tonight and have Charlotte and Becky as the tag team. Champions Women's tag champions then you can you will have people going like I got to see this on the wwe network now. I take it a step further and I would have a The KABUKI win the tag titles back from Charlotte and Becky on Monday night raw. Tonight I would have probably Oscar get another pin over over becky lynch I mean you could have Oscar Pin Charlotte but having Katie Pin Charlotte or becky would be huge for her. But that's what I would ask a pin becky to win the tag titles back tonight on raw so you it's not like it was a long term thing because you're sitting there going. Why would you wait Charlotte and Becky in tag when you could have two big Solo stars totally but I'm interested in seeing that tag title Change Happen People Go? Oh my God you gotTA I. Don't watch star cade have titles change back on raw and then go to TLC and do some kind of maybe a tables ladders chairs tag team match agi between the Kabuki Warriors in Charlotte and Becky. You wouldn't wanNA see. TLC match with the four of those ladies. I would have to tear the house down. So that's what I'd like to see from that match and then the third match or third segment on the show there's been advertised is Russa versus bobby. Lashley last man standing I would imagine. Imagine that there's gotta be some kind of Schmaltz there because the idea that you have now spent like eight or nine weeks of TV. This was happening before the draft. So you're literally all your entire autumn. It's snowing today in New York. So your entire autumn was spent spent building a rivalry between rousseff and bobby Lashley. You got restraining orders. You've got rousseff kicking the set down. You Got Lana celebrating sex bursaries. Let me see it was the seven-week sex versity that was like two weeks ago. So there's rivalries pride been going on about nine years to finally had the Bobby Lashley rousseff match on a network. Special is really strange to me that if we're buying the fact that this has been an effective storyline and we WANNA see and people want to see this match happen that you would have. It happened on a network special instead of and that you really just advertise it on twitter the day before. Hey by the way. This is the last match happening that you'll be able to see on the network cool but I would have thought there'd be some kind of bill to this. No okay all right. Let's watch it then. I mean I'll be watching it. I'm assuming it's going to have some kind of Sh- MAS tastic ending and we're going to be left with the culmination happening at TLC in in some kind of stipulation match hopefully helpfully but yeah so it's an exciting time. The networks are always exciting. I always have a good time just a great way to spend a Sunday night. You know you mean great way to spend a Sunday night as far as smackdown went this week There were a couple of things I thought. Roman reigns look amazing. I've gotten to this place with Roman reigns it's similar to John Cena when people boo John Cena leaner for so long that they eventually just looked at him and they were like you know what you're the man and I'm probably going to keep doing you just because it's supposed to but I don't really feel it like I kind of want Roman reigns to win every match. I just want him to beat everybody. I'm just I've become. I've I've this. Incarnation of Roman reigns is great and I get upset when he gets stuck with the people able and dog outfits and things like that but this week on smackdown like I just thought it was great. I thought the realization that Roman had when when Bobbi rude who bobby rude. I don't know what happened. But in the last few months it feels like they've finally realized the value. That bobby rude has because some people I did see some people were like. Oh well of course bobby route is going to get buried. He's wrestling the biggest guy in the company he didn't get buried. It was a very competitive match. which was a long match? Bobby Rude Put a lot out there. He got a lot of offense in and eventually really he went down to Roman reigns as everybody should. But I- Bobby Rude looked great and I thought what whatever whatever's happened in the last a few months ever since he started teaming with Dolph Ziegler that made people realize like. Oh bobby rude is really somebody worth investing in Kudos to them. Because it's a whole new bobby rude. There's a period of time where bobby rude was just in the bunch trying to get the twenty four seven championship and that wasn't that long ago so this is a major major upgrade the the realization. And I'm still by the way I think Barron Corbin's court would be a lot better with Kofi and Roman turning Heel than with Bobby Rudolph Ziegler Bribe Rudolph Ziegler fine but if it were a bad Guy Roman reigns and a bad guy Kofi lovie Kingston with Darin Corbin. It would be the biggest thing in wrestling the biggest thing in wrestling but the realization on Roman reigns his face When he looked at Bobby Rude and realized you just tried to literally murder me? He looked at the chair. He looked at the Serie. Looked at Bobby. He said you'd literally tried to Cave My skull in just now. Do you understand what I have to do. This spear through the guardrail guardrail looked vicious. And then the tipping over of the table or the table doesn't break and it actually looks like something. That's Super Sturdy. Dangerous and the whole thing. I wish they'd left the table off of Corey Graves and Michael for the entire show that would have been the real reminder of the kind of destruction that Roman reigns 'cause now there would be the logical question. Why didn't somebody just tip it back over on the other side? It didn't break but maybe they'd say this table is so heavy that in order to lift it. You have to be Superman now. Let's go to this. Footage of Roman reigns lifting this table. But I mean I thought Roman I thought it was a great great moment for Roman reigns. I thought survivor survivor series. Going into smackdown Roman reigns is in a good place now before. I don't know and there have been rumors that they're going to do a dog. Collar holler match between Roman reigns Barron Corbin based on the big dog thing. The Baron Corbin is making fun of him with look. The music hasn't worked for me the guy in the dog mascot Outfit doesn't work for me but a dog collar match works for me. You know I think people are associating it with the wrong stuff. But they've been great dog collar matches you know. I'm I'm not. I'm not mad at seeing Roman reigns and Barry Corbin. Can I mean they're going to have a match. Obviously so they're going to have a match. Let's make different. Put a couple of dog collars on them put a chain in between them. Watch the viciousness. Watch these two men be other with chains until one is so welded up that he can't respond in and the others able to touch all four corner posts. I'm not against it. I always liked strat. Matches dog collar matches all that stuff. Goodbye me so I'm not mad at them. Here's something else I'm not mad at. I am not mad at Bray. Wyatt's new championship. The fiend Bray Wyatt debuted a new championship championship another item in his repertoire. That was designed by horror movie icon. Tom Savini it's got the the mask ask stretched across the front. What would be played? But there's no place on this thing it's all kind of leather and rubber and what looks to be literally literally flesh stretched across this thing. The mask is stretched across with leather straps. Up On top and bottom saying he'll he'll hurt hurt on the side of the straps it says. Let me in It fastens like about not with Velcro or snaps. It's just it's like nothing thing we've ever seen before but the fiend is like nothing we've ever seen before I think it's very important to note that when Bray wide doing the firefly funhouse. He's still got that blue new universal smackdown title which to me is better than the red version. So they're not doing away with that but it is ridiculous that the fiend Bray Wyatt who who cares about nothing but creating hell on earth is walking out with a company created championship campionships championships. Don't matter to the fiend. The fiend is not fighting to keep a championship. The fiend is fighting to destroy and to frighten and he's destroyed the title and created something. Frightening with it. I don't know Oh you know yet. Ugly it's ugly. The fiend is ugly. It does nothing to diminish the history of the championship. It has nothing to do with that. The person who wins and you know and you say we'll eventually somebody will beat the fiend will when somebody does beat the fiend. There's nothing nothing stopping them from having the Universal Championship at Ringside. Let's say Daniel Bryan Beats Fien which you won't but let's say Daniel. Brian does beat the fiend. He doesn't have to hold up the fiends title at the end he could look at it. Throw it down and hold up universal title again. If anything thing the fact that the fiends title is such a monstrosity it goes to the storyline. That the fiend is holding the entire company hostage that the fiend has has the Universal Championship kidnapped that he is procured. That title any is stopped stopped the division in its tracks and now the whole thing has become something that it was never intended to be a monstrosity this. This is my way of saying that if any of you are really loyal fans to the podcast and WANNA spend the sixty five hundred dollars on that championship for me. I wouldn't I wouldn't bat an eye. You can buy a replica of the newly debuted fiend championship tidal on. WWe Shop. However I think every the one is being designed by Tom Savini? I don't think that there's a difference between the replica. And the one that they use on TV because the only way you can order and by the way supposed to ship by December twentieth not guaranteed Christmas delivery unfortunately cost six thousand five hundred dollars plus tax. I did put it in my cart and look at the checkout you get free shipping on it which is nice but it comes to just over seven grand if you want to have the fiends new title. That's where I'm going to know though there are some you replica. APPLIC- about collectors before the really rare item was like the Daniel Bryan title. That was a- At first you could only get it events or whatever it was and now if you go to like The the the shops that they set up the superstores they set up for Summer Slam wrestlemainia or whatever they have for like three or four thousand dollars they have TV quality replicas available but this is by far the most expensive ww produced replica title. So of any of you are really who you say you. Who are the champions of replica? Belt collections replica championship title collections. Better have fien title in there. I'm all for it man and you know there was a lot of talk that you know that the fiend was going to be debut in a new face to the firefly funhouse and obviously obviously that new phase. I'm assuming is the face that's on the title People thought I was live. Morgan I said this on Thursday there should never be another human member of the firefly funhouse never it should be a puppet or a championship or some item. That can also have Bray Wyatt's voice with some kind of audio filter over it. No more people should be joining the firefly funhouse because firefly fun house is not as stable. There are no rules on the firefly funhouse US Bray Wyatt the firefly funhouse and the fiend are like nothing that we have ever seen in. WWe before and now oh he's got a championship. That is nothing like we've ever seen in the WWE. Before and I love it. Hey thanks for being with us. Is this week. I'm not saying wrestling. Don't forget to get those questions in not Sam Wrestling at g mail DOT COM. We will see you on Thursday for another episode of Thursday. Not that Sam Thursday. Don't forget to subscribe to our podcast. Wherever you get podcasts? Leave us a review on itunes and subscribe to the Youtube Channel YouTube dot com slash. Not Not Sam wrestling see you Thursday. Thanks for listening. Follow at not say on twitter Instagram facebook and Youtube Rate Review Subscribe. This has been no sam wrestling uh-huh.