Episode 13: Food Freedom with Whitney Catalano, RDN
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And go on our Instagram post in lever wellish because she's going to save the world in Kosovo. But anyway, we just really wanted to get into it. We just wanted to really get into this really important episode. We are so excited for this guest, not just because of the season finale, but we have been looking forward to this episode all season. Like I am the most excited for it. And yet, that's it for our season. We're going to take a hard hiatus the summer, we're working on a lot of exciting things in the background so many Soad's. But hopefully Minnie's odes again in the fall and new season next spring. So. Just if you ever miss us, go back and listen to some old up Assode 's, and you can always leave us a review hit us up on Instagram Twitter Facebook Email, like just send us a note if you ever have any questions or anything and we'll chat. So without further ado, here's the interview with the Whitney cut Alonzo. Right. So high everybody welcome back from the break. We're here with Whitney cut, Alano, who is already end, who is an intuitive eating dietitian. Helping women recover from binge eating make peace with their bodies break free from their inner bully in create space for the things that truly matter. So thank you for joining us today. Am excited. Yes. So are we happy to have you can kind of start getting into what you do today from your if you could just tell us a little bit about your relationship with your food in your body, growing up in if that affected the work that you do now made you wanna do it? And definitely. So when I was younger, I think I was drawn to emotional eating at an early age because, you know, trauma and things like that. So. I was dawn to emotional eating, which I have found out later that it's just kind of one of the things that kids, learn to do is just go to food, because kids, don't know, necessarily to talk about it or aren't giving the tools to talk about these things. And so, you know, food becomes one of the various ways that we learned to cope. And that was definitely mine. And I think also genetically hunt had a bunch of things at play. So around six seventh grade, I started putting on more weight than my friends around me, and I was always bigger than my friends not to say that I was ever marginalized by any means, but I definitely looked different. And didn't I don't know if I necessarily noticed like it was one of those things where in second grade. The boy that I liked told me I looked pregnant, but I did internalize it. I was just like in second grade. And I didn't understand how someone could be pregnant, and second grade. I just didn't get it. I didn't know what that meant. But then all. All of these things have sort of surfaced over the years of micro. That was yeah. Like here finally, connecting all these dots. But anyway, so I kind of got to this point where all of my hormones kicked in or whatever, happens in middle school where you just become horribly self aware of yourself and just like. Deeply like stuck in your own perspective. I went on my first diet, I told my mom, I looked around and I was like I don't look like everyone else. I don't understand what's going on. And I want to look like everyone else. And so my mom was like, oh, my gosh. And I always tell the story that she, she said that this one thing that sticks out so much to me, which was, oh, you're done. I've been waiting for you to come to us about this. And I was like. Yeah. Sounds good. So that kind of started, you know, I did Jenny Craig did Weight Watchers, I did all of the diets Jenny Craig was definitely, you know, it's always like the first diet is the most successful Jenny Craig was definitely like the successful one for me. But didn't learn how to eat didn't, you know, know anything other than like eat by meals, and I'm going to be skinny, and it was like obsessed focused. And then, of course, I gained all the way back. Plus some looked in the mirror one day and I was like, oh my gosh. When did that happen? You know, try to bunch of different other diets, and then eventually quote unquote, at the time, what I thought was like learning about nutrition in, like my senior of high school. I was like, I'm finally learning how to eat, I'm finally doing all these things like, wow, I'm really, you know, whatever. But I didn't what I didn't realize that time was that what I was learning was obsessive dieting and restricting. That's disguised as health so that like. Really snowballed. When I went to college, I, especially my freshman year of college, I had to wear a dress for thing, and I had to buy the dress like six months in advance and my mom was like, do not outgrow this dress. And so, I was like, counting emotion. Yeah, exactly, like its first year, you know, everyone talks about the freshman fifteen or whatever which I hate. But that was like where my kind of disordered eating like, really dug deep like it really like sunk its feed in for years. I struggled with that. And just, you know, the sort of obsessive relationship food, and I went, and I studied nutrition college, and I thought you know, I'm gonna be able to get this under control to learn everything I need to. And I'm gonna understand because then I started struggling with binge eating as might happen when you're obsessively restricting. So I was like, oh, I mean, I get my eating under control. It's gonna be awesome. Like this is going to be great. I'm gonna learn about nutrition avenue. Help other people with us. And then it just got worse and worse and worse. And I never felt good about myself, and, you know, it kinda -fected all other areas in my life. So finally, you know, the past few years, have been sort of this healing process for me where I. You know, reprogram relationship with food and relief field, myself and understood truly what I was a part of and started researching the movement and learning about intuitive eating and getting, you know, various certifications in teaching and things like that. And it just all kind of clicked into place when I decided to do that. It's like, oh, this is what I'm supposed to be helping other people with not all the basic nutrition stuff that you're supposed to do when you first get your credentials that never really clicked with me at an Phil good telling people what a healthy plate was because I feel like we all know that that's not the issue. So I once I figured that out it really, you know, it just clicked into place. It made a lot of sensory. And now ever since it's and so rewarding. And just it's shaped everything for me. Yeah. Awesome French, narrowing all of that with us. Do you have any follow ups currently I feel like that brings us to our next question about, like southeast? So, yeah. Before that, I would just like I just like I work in, like Kyun occasions, I just like knowing leg where people the messages that they get and how it metamorphasized their brain. So when you were saying that you were oh, I'm like, finally after Jenny Craig learning nutrition in the net went into obsessive dieting. Where do you think or like where were you reading about, like the so called nutrition? I don't know. I remember I did this weird smoothie diet where like they give you a meal plan. And then they, you make a smoothie for two meals than you kind of like weaned off that. And that's where I, I started to learn, like that's what I thought health was, so, and I was so impressionable. I was like sixteen or seventeen. You know. And so that's something where I was like, okay, we'll healthy must being you have one smoothie a day, and two meals. But when I'm really dieting, I do Tuesday these day and one, you know, but now looking back, I'm horrified, but that I was growing up, you know, and like sixteen like that's not how it's just. Yeah. So, you know, various diets, I found online definitely all online, I couldn't tell you what the social media culture looked like at that point, because it's so hard to remember that everything was on Facebook and, and things like that. Like it was so different than it is now. But all online. And then when like you kind of switched and you realized that instead of that you didn't want to do the typical nutrition work that people do in your credentials and you wanna help people like were you was it just kind of internal like a moment that this isn't right? Or did you when was that switch for you or like not when but leg what do you think that came from? So I had already started going on my own healing process. But I hadn't really. Fully done the deep dive into the research. And I just kind of it was happening naturally in, I started my business a couple years ago and I had to pick a direction. So the first year and a half or my business was kind of a mess of I will help anyone who wants to be helped by me. I didn't understand how to run a business yet. I didn't understand what it meant to, like, pick a niche and have a target market and stuff. I got and have a specialty I thought you know, specialties like no one's gonna hire me. I have to specialize in everything. So then I heard of business coach and she forced me to pick a specialty and do that. While be studying that, and so I was kind of weighing a few different things that I wanted to do, whether it's like functional medicine or whatever, and I just found myself continuously going back in reading more about intuitive eating more about binge Eating Recovery, and just listening to podcasts constantly, and, and I was already doing that work in my own life. So I was like, oh, this is I feel like I had to experiment with some. Other directions before I would come back, mealy, duh, I'm do the thing that I'm already doing in my own life. Nothing that I actively studying my free time like that's what I want to help other people with. So it took me a second definitely to make that decision. But once I did, I was like, okay lightbulb. Yeah. Like for on like entrepreneurs that even aren't in this space in just people figuring out what they wanna do with their life. It's they're searching and searching, but it's usually something that's been there all along. Yeah, exactly. We're also definitely not taught that we can like manifest and RAF it even off of the ways that we help in heal ourselves, especially what that's really, not something that's ingrained into our mind. That's so true. And it's interesting to me that I will get some people in my Dion on Instagram and being like, why can't believe you're charging any money for this? You should be teaching about healing for free, and I'm like your perspective on healing is very messed up. And I it's like that's not my problem. And I'm so sorry that that's what you've been taught about healing that this isn't something, you know, 'cause I I've always gone to therapy. I've always paid for therapy. I invest in people to like help me get my head, right? Yeah. So. Yeah learning how to monetize that in my own business definitely took some. I had to come around to that, but now it's now it feels better, but it you're right. It took some time to wrap my head around that. Absolutely. I can imagine it. Did. If people pay for a doctor, they don't see a problem with paying for that. Yeah. They see a problem for you. Medical professional. So how do you think? What you described in which is what so many people go through with problems with obsessing in eating movement. How do you think it affects other parts of our lives, such as self esteem, or even confidence when she in the professional world like how do you think it trickles? How do you see that trickling into other things? Yeah. So that's actually probably my favorite part about what I do. Obviously, I like all this work. I liked the healing part of it. But one of the most interesting things is watching, how people change their lives throughout the time that we worked together, and that sounds really gimmicky, but it actually is true. I have a lot of clients who end up changing careers or leaving their partners or you know, dating for the first time after kind of swearing off dating or just, you know making all these big life changes. Because they essentially what dieting and especially obsessive dieting in this. That's rooted in hitting your body in wanting to constantly fix and change it. You're you've got this daily message coming in that's telling you. You're not good enough. You'll be good enough one day, if you know, it's like conditional worth, you're going to be good enough. If you lose X amount of pounds or like if you eat a certain way, and if you have one thing that doesn't fit whatever is good or clean, or whatever, you're, you're worthless. You're done like you're bad people, always say, like I'm so bad. I've been so bad that really weighs on you that, that gets in your head and that sinks deep, and it's really hard to unlearn that voice in those messages. And so once they do start to learn unlearn those messages, and unlearn the way that they've talked themselves for so many years, they start to realize, like, Wow, I've actually been accepting a lot less than I deserve for a lot of my life. Because I was waiting until I was x y and z in order to deserve more. And maybe I deserve those things right now and maybe worth isn't conditional but it's been here this entire time. And I just wasn't advocating for myself. I wasn't standing up for myself. I was hiding because of p people are gonna judge me afraid that, you know, I was going to expose myself some sort of fraud, because I've been struggling so much internally are I've been failing to lose weight. I've have been failing to control my body or whatever it is. So that is like really fascinating to me, because I think it really extends everywhere to like dating your careers. Putting yourself up for promotions. Like starting a business or being successful. I think there's also this part of it, too, where when you're constantly obsessed about dieting there is no room for other thoughts like that. All you think about all the time. So that's like. Really time consuming. And we gotta get rid of that. Love that. You said, conditional worth still thinking about I know I wrote that down as something that's come up in, like no in social work at all Carly leg that alive. I've, I haven't. I mean, I've thought about. The context of that idea. But I've never really put it towards those youthfully said. Awesome great. Well. In the what you said about. Dieting, just taking up your entire energy like that. I was like wondering if that relates to what you said the beginning about people like starting to improve other parts of their live one day. Once they start like working with you, because they have more energy to focus on other parts of their life because they're not putting all this energy into into dieting and trying to control their bodies slowly. They're not no longer, you know, stepping on the scale in the morning. Maybe they woke up in a good mood. But then the minute they get on the scale it ruins the entire day, and any motivation. And it's like, oh, why didn't get the numbers to move so I clearly failed at this. I'm failing whatever I'm doing isn't working. So there must be something wrong with me. And if there's something wrong with you, then how are you supposed to be able to, like, do all the other things in your life? If you feel like you're failing at this one fundamental thing that. Especially on Instagram and like all these social media platforms seem, so easy people like, oh, I just I lost weight, and I'm magically cured all these things, just like okay. Well, first of all, so harmful second of all, that's not true, not the full story. And I have very I have a lot of issues like before. And after pictures. I don't know if I follow them anymore, but I followed throw while this page called fit girls guide. Oh, yeah, yeah, I'm sure you've maybe heard of them, or that they've anad is popped up. And I commented once and I was like, if you could possibly insinuate that the picture on the left is just as beautiful as the picture on the right. That would make me feel a lot more comfortable in my body to make changes or to do whatever I wanna do, but don't post pictures, that looked like my body insinuate that they're less than. Yeah. So that's a huge thing for me as well. Yeah. And it always comes with this rhetoric to this narrative, that's like, I not only did they lose the way, but the weight loss is the reason why they are so much better change there by nine out or not like all of these things. Well, guess what happens on the weight comes back? First of all, you lose all of that. So and then second of all your implying that it's not possible to. And you know, this is the most important point that it's not possible to experience these things in that before picture to have that before body and to have the life that you want, and that is just not true set. Yeah. Buried yet. They always start off with the girl on the left. She was said, I don't know. She was so lost. I hated myself. I was so. Yup. Always is that we the formula. Yeah. And that is, like the if you heard of the show sensational knows that sin. Insatiable insatiable, they, I watch one episode and got annoyed. A lot of people have that problem with the show. I watched the whole season but a lot of people were like saying, like, why did oh. So you're showing that like, because she got a injury couldn't eat. Solid food for a couple months now, like in she lost weight now or she's getting anything she needed, right? Then at the end of the season, it does like kind of show struggles but yeah, there was still a lot of problems with that show. But that like reminded me of what we were talking about totally. Yeah. That idea of the revenge body almost her who she revenge body just. That means but I don't. It's like it's probably easier, not to know that means on put it out gonna put it out there. The worst who. So when you. So what do you? Ideally. What would you what do you want your clients walkaway with after you work with them? Yeah. So that's a good question because that's something I'm in a new business coaching I always have a business coach at any given time but I'm in a new program right now. That's helping me really define, you know, I offer one program because I've been doing this type of coaching for a while. But now I'm trying to relate, get it condensed and really effective on, and so my program right now is the sort of sixteen weeks to jump start food freedom program, and essentially, because I mean, there's no way that I can sell healing in, like four months that just doesn't it doesn't happen. The healing does not stop after four months. You don't just go through, however many weeks of counseling or whatever coaching, and all of a sudden I'm fixed like never have to think about it again. Awesome. Because we live in this coal. Culture that is just like even if you make huge progress in that form. On's like we live in this culture, that is just constantly reminding you that you probably need to be on a diet, if you're not, and that is so like, it's, it's going to be daily thing that you've got to deal with. So I do now is the sixteen weeks is giving you the foundation. So it's providing all the tools. I've identified the things that I teach all of my clients and the sort of steps that we go through together. And we put all these tools to practice in different increments along the way and get the really like solid, foundational work like the research, and, and the things that you need to know in order to understand why this stuff works and why it matters. And why you know depot all those arguments like one losing weight for health. It's like okay, but, you know, you can actually just be healthy by folks on your health, and that's it. You don't need to lose weight to be healthy. And so we do all of that work. And then, basically, I teach people how to look at their lives and identified. What? What's working, what's not working and to be able to make changes on their own? So that when things issues inevitably come up, maybe they. Have a child one day. And so then you're dealing with, like, the body image issues that come along with that. Or maybe, you know, with aging, like naturally things are going to come up, or whatever I teach them how to have all the tools, and be able to come back to everything that they learned with me so that they can help themselves going forward, and they don't have to then get a second person if they want to, they can, you know, if you need a little support therapy, or whatever it is. But it's like you don't have to keep coming back to me, your keep coming back to other intuitive eating dietitian, every time something comes up. That is a problem like I've, I've given you the tools, and we worked together to find tune them to make sure that you really like rewire the way that you approach these kinds of things. What are some major, I have philosophies, but like on entre are just things that you want to, like, ingrain in your clients, and that you like lead or principles that you lead your practice by? Yeah. I mean, I think for starters like nothing you're never failing. You know, there's never just because you might take a step back or just because you might feel like you have fallen back into, like, really aggressive diet thoughts, 'cause there will be days where you wake up, and you're like, I'm free. I'm free. My religious amazing. I feel so good. Like none or not. You wake up the next day, and you're like, oh, my gosh. It's all back. Now, I wanna die at what happened I failed or maybe, you know, have a binge or something where you actually end up restricting or whatever it is. So I always say that there is no such thing as failing in food freedom, and that every everything that you consider to be failing as an opportunity to learn from it and to strengthen, and, you know, deepen your commitment, and deepen your roots in what you're doing, and that's really think essential to being able to get through those. Days is understanding, like I will learn something from this. But for a lot of people, including myself, you can't -essarily learn anything in the moment, you can identify the problem. But you can't learn it until you've kind of taking a step back. So you've got to just identify the problem in sitting it like, okay. Well, I'm sitting here I'm going to wait for this to pass like today's probably gonna suck. That's okay. Like, you know be gentle on yourself. And then once you start to give yourself a little distance. You can see what it is. You're trying to learn and make adjustments. They're definitely not linear. No, not at all. I Lagarde first thing that we'd go to in a moment of pain is to book and I do to get out of this. But sitting in it in acknowledging it is very is very hard. But it's helpful we're feeling. And that's actually how disordered eating. Ding and died like being obsessive dicta dieting comes to be just in the same way that we emotionally. It's like you feel pain, and then you want to get out about pain as quickly as possible. And so we do things like restrict food or start any diet or whatever it is. That's distracting ourselves from whatever the pain is. And we get stuck in a cycle of, like I don't wanna feel my feeling. So I've got to keep trying to fix my body because that'll fix my feelings. And it's like you can't escape negative feelings. Even if you try like there's no, they're always going to happen like this is life. And so you have to learn to sit in it, and to not try to solve it a media but to actually let go of control and just let it. Let it play out and to heal to release it and learn how to work through those feelings to what? I'm willing you're the process. Like did you have to go through to get certified to do what you do? Can be of a process. Yeah. Will so just become a registered dietitian. It's like I ended up being five years undergrad, and then you do twelve hundred hours which ends up being, you know, nine ish, ten months of clinical rotations, so working in hospitals in food service, and you know, hospital kitchens and community programs and things like that. So you're doing kind of the rounds that other medical professionals have to do as well. And then you sit for registration exams and that parts expensive as well. The whole thing is just really expensive. It's really hard to get into. But once you get through all of that, then you have this sort of ominous task of figuring out what you wanna do with your credentials, the kind of don't prepare you for all. But at the same time you prepare for it's very weird. It's very weird. But the day passed my exam. I remember I just cry. And I was like, what do I do? Well. This is what I've been doing for, you know, close to seven years now, what, what do where do I get like I don't understand what I'm supposed to do with my life. So. Yeah. That whole process is very interesting. In terms of doing what I do like, what I specialize in. I mean I just started reading everything. There's plenty of certification courses online, and, you know, very baseline certification courses that I've done. But my personal approach is that I didn't want to use a cookie cutter approach that other programs at us because there hasn't been a program that I've found where you can get certified to become like a, you know, a coach or whatever in that specific way of doing things that was aligned with how I wanted to help people like there was always aspects that were missing because when you're reproducing program for other people, learn like there's gonna be assets that are missing. How goes so for me. I've just read I mean my bookshelf is stacked and just read everything I could on the subject and immersed myself in it completely, and then just started working with people in, like seeing what works and what didn't work and it my. My style of coaching in my style of helping people has really formed along the way, there's just kind of, like patients. And you know, talking yourself out of that. What's it called? When you imposters into him. Can relate a lot of that. I'm good. That's really took, like a careful approach. He didn't wanna rush into anything and you wanted to make your practice around. What's authentically what you believe, in what you think will help people so that you can so that your business can be like, you know, really authentically you. Yeah. Right. Do you enemy asking how this stuff because you both mentioned sort of various different things. But how this stuff sort of shows up in your life and how you navigate it. Yeah. This is his. We had like a private conversation about this, like a couple months ago Whitney Anna. And then you close throw you know one of my best friends Carly. So, you know, but I've known Carlise like a few years, but I really haven't started talking about how it's really affected me until recently because I didn't like I was so deep into it. I didn't even realize that it was affecting me until, like a couple months ago. And I even like just had a follow up with might under chronology st-. And she was like so what are we? So do we want to talk about dieting? I have I've hypothyroidism, so I on on I read meds and stuff, and I was issues like because when we first had the first appointment like in April that you were doing mostly plant-based, but then we recommended like doing some other forms of like protein and stuff with less fillers. And then last time in like junior like doing paleo, and I was like I am realizing all of lot of that was not healthy for me. And so I'm just trying to like eat more intuitively in, but also leg still nourishing and she was like, love that love that for you. But like let's talk about drinking your calories. But yeah, basically, like like kind of similar to your what you said. Dieting at since like I became self aware because I related to what you said about like being. You know, bigger than my friends, and I don't think anyone called me pregnant, but there definitely were bullying moments and even though like looking back at pictures. I really wasn't. But I was always like, oh, I was always just like I'm just chubbier in, like my friend, I have to close friends middle school, and they would be like, oh, mile, my mom tells me to eat more, and I need to put on more away, because they were just so like naturally, thin, and I was like, well, I need to lose weight. And I think I have vivid memory me saying that, and I was in, like, probably like fifth grade or less, and then from there, and then my mom was always like away, watchers or whatever. Just so that was constantly, and she would always have like smart ones, and special k just around the house that Liga hundred calories snacks out forgot about special K had those all the time. Bars at cereal. And that was always there. And this, my family is like, hypertension, and diabetes, and just like bigger, bodies and generals runs in my family, and I was always athletic. But yes, senior year of high school. I really really went from like I wasn't really like thinking about what I ate. I had like a little bit of a break like freshman junior year, but then senior year what just happened, but I just strength went straight into disordered eating in lost so much weight. And then just college naturally, just from, like living, my life gained some back. But then realized that the siren was, like probably a problem for me out. Get tested men. Then. Yeah. Here I am now realizing all of those problems things that I did not realize problematic in just trying to heal from that. And being more mindful is really stopped dieting, like two months ago. Dieting up until then, like did this intense like cleanse thing a year ago thought I was going to reset legged really was. So recent. Shaath amazing Hugh months ago is so recent, so that's huge. I'm I'm happy for you. Men was neat. I have kind of. So I start my mom has struggled with eating disorders for the majority. I wanna say mostly since I was born like, maybe after her pregnancy. And so I've been an so her, and my mom is a gorgeous woman in her whole my whole life. She's been saying, oh, this, this, this went I lose weight. When I lose weight, just putting off for happiness in being raised by that mindset, I've slipped into moments like that I've slipped date years like that, where I, I have, I'm a big girl, I always have been, and I've been like bullied for it per se I also wouldn't say that I've been marginalized for it. But there have been days, and, like I said years in months, where I have felt uncomfortable in my own skin and wanting to change myself. And now I'm kind of just in and I have been for while in this constant back and forth where I almost feel like my body has to be like a social Justice symbol that two. Yup. By body this way. And I have to love it, and I have to represent an entire community where I lose weight and just. Yup. Sperry secretaries to extremes lately. I've actually been in a pretty healthy balance like middle. But for the most part, it's like very caught between these two extremes sweet Mike. My body is very special and different, and I want to look this way, and I deserve to take a lot of space kid going to I will. I will be happier when I lose weight flakes the way my mom thinks. And so, yeah. Eating is obviously a huge part of that. I personally haven't really done many diets, but I have had issues with, like a lot of issues of binge eating. And there was so many times where it's like this is the last time I'm going to do this. Yup. I relate to that. Absolutely. And I definitely I'm just learning about balance and learning to forgive myself and be super gentle with myself. So all of it all ties together like movement, while nece eating. Like, who I am as a creator, I think it all ties together, and that's something, I'm also working on is like, connecting the dots and so, yeah, I feel like that kind of summarizes where I'm at. But right now, I think I'm in a pretty healthy place. I'm learning I'm, I'm a late bloomer when it comes to cooking, some learning earning Nikki is amazing. I'm a bit for her. I feel I. And just trying to take little things of the people around me for myself will definitely be a healthy thing in my life. So, yeah, that's kind of where that, that is so interesting what you said about feeling like, you know, stuck between the polar opposites of on one hand you have to lose weight. And then on the other hand, you keep your body, exactly how it is in, like you have be this pinnacle of social Justice, or whatever, like, and I think that is something that I find really interesting in the body positive community, like the true body, positive community, not like, but the skills on thing like I'm body positive, but like, you know, so. It is really interesting because the, the responsibility. Right. Is falling on you regardless. Yes. And you're already have to deal with, like, so much being in a bigger body, like I would argue that what you have to deal with kind of like goes along with the bigger your body is like the more issues, you have to deliver necessity. And then if you decide like okay, I'm going to reject diet culture and get out of it, because at the end of the day, all of this is rooted in the fact that, like, we don't really have control over bodies. And if you try to lose weight, it's just coming back and like. Our bodies are just uncontrollable. They're wild. And but it's interesting because I always see this, and I always feel so bad, and I'm just like the sucks that you either the responsibility is on you to either like quote unquote, change your body, or their sponsors on you to be this, like social Justice warrior. And what if you don't wanna be like the Representative for all like curvy girls out there? You know what if you don't wanna be that person, you shouldn't have to be in the same thing with race and gender? Like when celebrities come out with certain things about themselves like they'll take a stance and be like, you know, I am taking this stance because I this way or because of my race or because of whatever then they become this sort of talking head for the entire movement. And it's like well you're already dealing with marginalization to begin with. Yeah. Your celebrity. But like you're already dealing with marginalization to begin with probably online, bullying all this stuff. But like now you have to also be the spokesperson for like an entire movement like that is so much. Much responsibility. So, yeah, that's not a few for you. Like that's get it. And I'm like, and then there's also moments where I'm in a place of south love. And I'm like, is this coming from a place of my body? Also being fetish is Asian right now. The girls are so in and like, but only like a certain kind of the girl. So sometimes unlike do I really love myself like I finish ising myself, who is it a bad thing to fetish is yourself, writing because of you, right true? Your own fetish, I. That's a great question, though. It's. And with the about the pressure to be like a social Justice icon. That is an interesting conversation in the true in the body, positive community, because the ideal like you love she's all fat. And they had that whole episode. I think there was a little upset about, like fat, IMP imposters. But like, oh, what happens if leg they lose weight LEGO? Yeah, like Roxanne get an her getting the weight loss surgery that obtained. Yeah. So they are that come out as, as a as an icon is as a social Justice statement, or just or like oh, traitor, fat trader. That's right. That's what the son was like argue a traitor for losing. Because there's also conversations in the in the community about this right now, at your thoughts about, like, it's okay to want to change your body, if it's like for the right reasons like what do you think about those conversations? Like people are like, either. Are they? I'm not anti weight loss. Like some people are saying it's tough. I one of the things that I always tell people when they're kind of, like, you know, some of the anti Dieter intuitive eating or health, every size like messages online consumer, it'll extreme. And so one of the things I always tell people is like, you know, my job as a practitioner is like number one. Do no harm. So if there is a if I'm working on with the client, and they have certain fitness goals, but they're not able to achieve those fitness polls without sinking back into disordered mindsets. That I'm gonna strongly recommend that they not do that, until they really have their foundation under them. If I'm working with a client, and they have certain fitness goals, but exercise was never really a part of this whole thing. And it's not about, you know, weight loss or shrinking all the stuff is just about, like getting stronger, and then things happen as a byproduct, and they don't obsessively glorified or anything, then we kind of learn to walk that line in coaching of, like how, what is that identified that line like when is it unhealthy for you? When is it obsessive when is on realistic and getting in the way of your life? And when is it just wanting to, you know, maybe get stronger in some, you know, there's there is a line for every individual. But these are the kind of things that I don't like to talk about on Instagram necessarily, because it's so hard to communicate that nuance way, that people are going to understand if they have no foundation. Like if someone is coming to my page for the first time and see me trying to like articulate this weird nuance in it like I don't wanna do harm. And also don't wanna make anyone feel like they have to do any of these things because at the end of the day, it's like body at time, you can do whatever you want with your body, and it's not for me to decide what you do with your body. I'm just trying to show you that, like, maybe what you've been doing is not only obsessive but it's, it's getting in the way of your life, and that there is another option. You don't I think the big problem here is that people are told by doctors like you have to lose weight order to achieve XYZ and your health. And that's where this whole, be skinny to be healthy message. Originates and I'm just kind of like that's not the only option. You know. Like actually couldn't do a lot worse for your health, because you're restricting and you're, you know, it's just like all these things, I'm not gonna get into all these things can happen. When you're trying to lose weight. So it's like what if you if you really care about health, you know, focus on health part of it, but also ask yourself this is really about health because now that sounds like there's so many lazy enough to like be in a good mindset in leg, yet, talking about it on, like a public platform, lick social media that you're trying to use to build your business at Ardy is can be like, so heated. It can be like polarizing to like make state than like that. If yet people come in see that for the first time. Yeah, it's just tricky. But that that's a good take on it. Yeah. Yeah. That's all it's very nuanced. So. It really like case by case basis, which is the whole thing with intuitive rights, just like whatever works for your body. But yeah. Staffan people out on a pick fights with me because I, I call out there, you know, disordered eating rituals, and they freak out about it and, and, and also I'm kind of unpacking things that are I'm talking about things that you have believed since your kid, especially like the three of us, we all have moms who were raised in die culture as well. And so they didn't you know they were trying to do their best. But like it's not their fault. Yeah. But those messages, and so, you know, I see that more often than not. So when you learn it from your mom, too, it's like, well, but this stuff like, I, but I know that this is the right way. That's like, okay, but, you know, it just makes people very angry sometimes so I always like okay that they're being called out. But that is there. Just like being defensive confronting parts like jar parts of your life in mind is not as can. It's it can react like an angry emotion just because it's like healing. His messy. Yeah. Yeah. On if someone isn't ready for that, and they see my page, it can be very triggering. 'cause they're like, no, my diet isn't as order, like my intermittent. Fasting isn't you know order like, well you. Talk about later. So the whole other thing I have, I think covered a lot. This was great. This was a great conversation. Yeah. Love this will thank you for coming on. Make you earlier time. Of course, I. Worse. Yeah. You mentioned your tours, but there's anything else, any of few other things if you want to plug anything in the, of course, things will be in the show notes. But here's your time to promote anything you want. So as you know, I have a patriots confiming on Instagram at trust your body project, and then I have a patriot and I pay only Facebook group and so that I just started that recently, and it's been really exciting right now, we're doing ten weeks of intuitive eating, and it's only three dollars to join as of right now, you can join the Facebook group and just be a part of a community that is awesome, in my opinion. I love my Facebook group so much ever this dislike so down to do the hard work, and like -ticipant each other, and I keep it very safe space numbers. No, you know, extreme diet talk or anything like that. So it's, it's. Really, really fun. I like that. So if you wanna join me on that differently checkout, my Instagram or my patriot on and. The not my website is Whitney dot com. Everything will be linked below. And I think that's all I wanna have a podcast by the time. It used this airing March, right? It's yeah. It's definitely gonna be around that time line. Yeah. So, so this is airing March, and my podcast will be out by then. I have a lot of really interesting interviews lined up with different professionals. So it's the trust your body project podcast. Really excited about that. We'll be subscribing will thank you so much for having me on. It was so such a good conversation. It was. Thank you for coming on. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Please check out all of that stuff and it'll be on the notes. Listen to trust your body project podcast. And we will have another to another little announcement or add. And then that's it. So thanks. Thanks guys for listening thinking. So that's it. That is our show, everybody. Now, the annoying time where I remind you of everything. First and foremost, we cannot continue to grow. If you do not leave us a review on apple podcasts. That's the main review source in that is how we get in those charts. And Honey, that's capitalism. 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