Rock Candy Ep. 106: Tricky - Actual Murder
Hey Yeah this speech is my recital. I think it's very vital to arrive. That's right on time. It's tricky is the town it's tricky to rock overrun to Rutta around. That's right on time. It's Okay. It's tricky tricky. We're not talking about Randy. And now we are at all like this has nothing to do with Rod DMC. This is the SOG tricky. It's just because we probably both have this song stuck in her head for the last week. What do you think yes? I have had this song stuck in my head a lot because it's an earworm. It is an earworm of song but also I kind of WanNa learn all the lyrics so we can do that Kariuki now. Oh yeah no I mean I already. I got him so I mean there on screen so yeah but I don't know like the cadence of Oh. Yeah Yeah now listen to it all week. We'll be good for Kariuki. I say this is a. This is a solid karaoke hit. Yeah and we're not talking about it not at all. Let's just snip. That right in the bud. Yeah no doing it not going to happen. Welcome candy where we don't talk about run DMC not today not yet not yet. Not Today eventually. Oh Yeah we'll get there. They'll get the rock turned rock trained Freeman Rock treatment. No free referring to something. I would say we're not. Words are great for us. I am Maggie and I'm taken to drink sorry I'm Ashley and we're hosts and we are bringing you sweet treats from the world's music every week. Yeah and this week we're going obscure I I don't WanNa see obscure but I guess obscure kind of but also he's been around for a very long time. He is insanely influential. And you probably don't even know who he is. Yeah which is unfortunate again. I think we're just tapping into more for black history month of these artists that are super important to the world of music and very influential. And you just don't know. Oh my God like rap. Wouldn't be what it is today. If it wasn't for this artist ELECTRONICA wouldn't be what it is today. If it was not better or worse it depends on how you look at it. Yeah yeah either way either way is what it is you can definitely think this dude for it. Yeah Yeah today. We are talking about the musical artist. Tricky hence the song in the beginning gas and heads maybe some confusion maybe some have when they see the title of this. Are they just going to spend an hour and a half talking about the song? Turkey we probably could but no. I feel like there's not that much set song. It's just a fucking jam. Yeah but yes so. We are talking about this artist. Tricky you might be wondering who he is for some of you. If I say massive attack maybe that will jog something up for you. He was definitely heavily involved in the beginnings of band. That group also another incredibly influential band. That only really gets talked about in vary like obscure listrik holes and Shit like that. Yeah and then people will remain at our heard from fi but then again a lot of our UK and listeners and European listeners are probably hearing us say tricky and massive attack thinking. Yeah no I know who that is. I'm not an idiot but Americans are dumb they already it's and they don't really look into this show. We don't get as much music as we should over here. Yeah we get a lot of garbage hold on a garbage hold on a boat rock still still on my part rock over here for some reason he still really into venture seven belts so seven. Yeah my favorite band. There's so memorable terrible guys. Seven folderol good bad. You're such a hot topic band but LENA LATE. Two thousands hot topic bands like the the bad the real bad topic hot topic years. Yeah Yeah we talk about that topic here. When hot topic discovered the nightmare before Christmas? That's when everything just went fucking downhill and years after the movie comes out there like Hey Jamie see this week makes so much money off of this. We've really straight off topic hot topic. We paid hot right about hot topic. Yeah please talk about tricky because fuck hot topic and we should definitely talk about the beer drinker. Hit US harder than we thought. I don't know actually four percent. It's hitting me harder than I thought it would. I had half an a snickers ice cream bar before we started drinking breakfast for you know that was lunch. Okay so this week. We are drinking from single cut boo. Smith's Boozman looseness. There would be a great like just a really great title for a brewery. That does all Halloween themed boost Smith. Spoo- Smith Saul. Yeah let's you know what we're done guys neck podcast where we're going to start a buoy. Don't you take that idea? That's all the copyrights we also you so fast. Always this is recorded. We HAVE PROOF. We have proof. You stole it from US. Anyway. We're drinking. Shyness is nice which is a tart. It's fine it's honestly like most single cut assign stuff we've had. It's just fine. This is fine. It's not particularly tart but it's not overwhelmingly. Ip a what we did have a very inland discussion before according about what it really tastes like and it really reminiscent of a flavor of when you use half of the frozen concentrate can you don't use the full can because you're trying to save money which they use the same amount of water in which is really watered down or feel like probably a lot of the younger folk that listen to us probably don't know what the concentrate is. They make frozen concentrate anymore. I don't really see it very much at all. I remember going to the grocery store and there are cases upon cases a fruit. Concentrate that you would make Wella's Walsh's was the jam it was so I'm no get out. Get out get the fuck out of here no it. That was the cheap way to make orange juice juice as you got the concentrating dollars. Fifty cents fifty cents a dollar. Whatever for a little can of frozen concentrate our for four. I think there are like twenty five cents. There were only ones you guys know. Do you remember he wants to go? Get the like the little clear powders. Really Twenty ten cents. I think yeah they were like ten cents lower lake ten for a dollar usually Gillis. Wow we're not. We're not interesting to stay on. This tastes like very watered-down Orange juice concentrate. Yes you would get frozen in a tube. Yes I had to kind of stretch with this one. Like as far as building with it but China's nice you will soon discover that due to tricky shyness as a person it helped him cultivate the artists. He became yeah. I kind of feel like we're this cut. We're getting into some deep cuts with our beer choices. I mean arguably that's a single cut does anyway in before I really get into it. I would like to cite my source. Most of everything. I'm giving you guys I found. Actually it's nice. Tricky is very interview. -able he likes to talk so it was easy to find interviews but also. I read his biography. Hell is round the corner and this was co written with Andrew. Perry so he did have a little help. But I'm really want to highly suggest this biography to anyone. Listening Eighty is really interesting. He's a great writer He writes like he's talking to you. Which is something I enjoy. He has a crazy interesting story and there are some things that I wanted to get into. But I just didn't have the time so please pick up this book if you ever see it yet I really WanNa read it. Yeah there's some really good stories their stuff with David Bowie in there that I wasn't able to so that could be more stories for episode on Weird Shit David Bowie did our eventual spinoff podcast. Weird Shit though. We did basically yeah. We basically his life. Yeah but yeah he Because you know. British artists recognize Yeah it helps. I guess now is the time I'm going to get into the story of two Ricki Hall Radi before I do get started though on the life of tricky. I want to give a little background into the musical genre known as trip hop because really he's one of the fathers of the Stranraer. Please tell me more. I feel like you don't tell me more trip hop is not easy to describe. I just tried to do it the other night. And it's very hard it is it is a blending of hip hop and Electronica in hints of Jazz are Embi House soul psychedelic kind of a little bit of everything. There is a very experimental element to it with in its music as well as the visuals overall all experimental. It's style of music that maybe not everyone is familiar with but its influence reaches throughout most genres of all the music. We hear today after this episode. If you go back and listen to artists like gorillas back Madonna Bjork radiohead Queens. The Stone Age Janet Jackson even the Flaming Lips. Oh yeah our favorite favorite but you can hear hints of trip hop in. Yeah absolutely them. I don't listen to electronic so maybe I'm far off base here but I feel like trip hop is the most easily digestible of the sub genres. I'll say in house can be most commercialized yet. And they're the ones that are most commercialized. That artists like Madonna and stuff like that will seek out people that have experienced in those genres. Yeah and bring them in and put that kind of influence into their music so that the masses will hear it. All of those musicians can thank the trip. Hop Movement of the Ninety S for pushing the envelope of sound and tricky was at the forefront. Whether or not he meant to be this isn't what I would call a classic underdog story. It may just be a story of being incredibly lucky throughout your life and tricky is actually the first to admit that but luck are not his ingenuity. Artistry cannot be denied. Tricky was born Adrian. Nicholas Matthews Thaws on January twenty seventh nineteen sixty eight. That's such a generic name but like so many with so many names right age. I don't know Adrian's Kinda Fun. That's a good name Adrian. He is the son of Roy. Thaws a Jamaican man and maxine Quaye. Who was Anglo Guyanese? So her family mixed Guyanese in English British. I should Throughout his childhood being mixed rate race would play a big part in Turkey becoming who he is today while wouldn't be inclined to say either. His parents had a musical influence on him. They both had some artistry in their backgrounds. Roy worked on the studio seventeen sound system with his father is one of the best known in England at the time and nicknamed Tarzan. The high priest Yep Okay. Meanwhile maxine was a bit of a poet. Something tricky wouldn't discover until he was older. No the reason this information was not common knowledge to him was because maxine had committed suicide when just four years old. Oh that's awful. And he says the first member he can recall is seeing her in her coffin. Oh Fuck Yeah. It wouldn't be a stretch to say this will affect his outlook for the rest of his life and attributes to the dark themes a lot of his music takes on. I would save one of your earliest memories is seeing your mom in a coffin during her funeral. Yes that would affect you for the rest of your life. I'm pretty sure anyone who does know. Tricky is music can hear that and say that explains a lot now a lot. I always thought there is a bit of darkness to him and his music. Oh even though ELECTRICA is supposed to be. You know something you can dance to I always associated him with portishead. Yeah Oh yeah because said has this melancholy sound and I feel the same way about Turkey's music. Yeah honestly I guess you could say like the big three is tricky massive attack points is aside or Porta. Shed portishead portishead. Yes yes. I'm really bad with pronunciations. I love Florida's dead though. They're fantastic. I have to say I haven't heard a ton of portishead. I've definitely heard more massive attack. I've heard far more portishead tack by the way. If you're like who are massive attack and portishead you know what just look up. The song teardrop. Yeah no it. Everyone knows it. Yeah that song that you're going to hear it and you're like it's that electronic song that everybody knows yes 'cause once you play it. Everyone's like oh of the song. His Father Roy left the scene not long after that. He didn't get along with along with maxine family. It was at the point where her uncle was threatening to kill him when he got out of prison. Wait the uncle was imprisoned. The uncle was in prison and he was like get out of prison. I'M GONNA fucking kill you pretty much. Jesus way what is Turkey's dad do so I think he was just one of those dads that was kind of lofty. I don't think he was a bad person. And he got along with them pretty okay. But after maxine died a lot of them blamed him for her death. Okay sounds like true? Crime series stirring up the you know. He didn't care enough but he actually found her so great and then also intricacies book. He does talk about reasons why his mother might have killed herself because she was a very bright happy person. It's always about heavy people to do it but yeah. She apparently was diagnosed with epilepsy. Okay and it was hard. There was tricky and he had a younger sister and he thinks that it was very hard on her to have two kids that she could barely take care of because she had fucking epilepsy. Yeah so I think it was a matter of get kind of spiraling into this. You're better off without me. Kind of thing. Yeah and you're going to discover as I go throughout the story. Mental illness does run through. Turkey's DNA got his family tree for sure After his mother's death tricky went to live with his grandmother. He has a large family and many of them engage in some sort of criminal behavior. Oh from theft to actual murder his actual. She will murder murder murder. I stabbed a man killed him actual murder. I've been a meeting to talk to you about that about your actual murder might WanNa get. Outta here for a while. Kill tried in this kind of fire I killed a guy with a Trident. Talk to you about your actual. His uncle's have especially run the gamut of crime than most of the stories in the book that he tells are crazy. Uncles man. Crazy on fucking crazy oglala. Uncle uncle uncle and they're all just committing cry uncle and cry. You want them to make a movie called uncles on the run on goes on the run. Get outta here wings stupid. Mullets get out of here. Where are you fantastic? Mullets tricky is from an area of Bristol called Knowle West a town with a large population of lower income working class families. That kind of scene crime was a way of life for most living there and it was almost inevitable that one should expect to spend some time in prison if you grew up in old west now. Tricky isn't an aggressive type of person so the likelihood of him getting into violence was pretty low but he was still a product of his environment when he was a teenager. He was getting into trouble with the police for truancy in loitering late at night. Just kind of petty. Little things is truancy not going to school. You're gonNA say something so much worse than like going to school. I mean it's just like skipping school. If like a police officer sees you at ten thirty in the morning on a Thursday when there's clearly schools like hey so what the fuck are you doing name? I thought I told you what because this is my United Kingdom of whatever it is his United Kingdom or whatever he was Liam Lynch in the shootout no less he was well then it progressed into breaking and entering he started to go from like these petty little things to be a little. Bit Harder Yeah. He ran with a crowd that would be on the lookout for any homes where no one was there. And then they would rob the place but like occupied. Yeah yeah yeah like someone vacation they would notice all the lights are off and it's six o'clock at night and they're like nobody's home right now. Cool we should still from them all right. Let's do that. I think that's how you still don't know. So he wasn't murdering people he was doing actual murder. He resigned doing actual. Who's doing actual robbing not actual murder? But what landed him behind bars? Some small skill money loitering or money laundering. Oh so he was alone shirk to no not even a loan shark. He and his friends would forge fifty quid notes and then use them at convenience stores so they could get the change. Yeah that's this was before they had those color changing pens Gotcha like the seventies eighties. Tricky wasn't one hundred percent. Sure exactly what went down. But it seems to him that his friend got caught in snitched on him as well. Oh thanks Frendo. Snitch is get stitches. Do except tricky. When do that this landed him two months in the youth wing of the prison and seeing how he was only seventeen at the time? Yeah that makes sense. Yeah even though. It sounds like a pretty short sentence. It was enough to get tricky scared straight ensuring he would not involve himself in the criminal life again could yeah like want one of the few people that scared straight worked for. So where was this misfit kid to turn to for self expression an outlet from day to day life where to go music of course? Oh Yup that's how you go. Kids just do music. Yeah do the music. Don't do. Don't forget fifty quid notes. You're going to get caught so quick or actual murder. Just play music. Mortar people with your sweet sounds on your guitar. 'cause that's not actual murder that's just music growing up. Tricky listen to a lot of reggae and Billie Holiday Inn Marvin Gaye and all that like when he would visit his dad then he was in his mid teens and he slowly gravitated to prince buster as well as we bands like the four skins. That's a great name man. Yeah you can you some of you might see where I'm going with this or his musical tastes for gravitating to because we all have that band right. The ban we discover and it changes everything. It gets deep in our core. We carry that with us for the rest of our lives. I'll I'm so I'm so intrigued. And for tricky. Who is it? That band was the specials. Oh okay I figured you would make some kind of Scott comment Scott. I don't know enough about the specials to make fun of them but like Scott but Scott. I WON'T DAN BY SKOP. You'll skank by sky will always buy the thing about the specials is that they were one of the first bands that he was exposed to where he saw people of. Color and whites playing together. That is one thing. I do have to commend Scott for the really transcended the racial barrier when it came to inclusion. Yeah they don't give a fuck. Yeah it's like if you can play a fucking instrument then yeah you're going to be in this band. I don't even know what you play. You know what you don't even have to play if you ask on stage and hyper Chad. Eight men that's I see. Defense Scott Donna hype his lost on me but pick your pick it up. Pick it up again to the row. We're picking up a sky but you can pick up change in a mosh pit to know you can almost what's going on. You're taking your life in your hands. Dropped all them quarters in your pocket. Does I say goodbye. Somebody else got that Shit but if you drop all those coins and a Skop it they're going to pick them up remake. Oh you draft all these. You have change of course. Sky's the perfect music for being. Excuse me stuff nicest Scoppetta my life. I mean pits and Scott. Scott Peterson escaped rented a circle. This is wonderful that's hilarious. It's wonderful so sweet it is. We like it but like yeah wake were saying this whole breaking down of any racial barriers. Eight really spoke to tricky. Because it's very much what is life is no less is predominantly white right but oh it is. It is okay yes. It's still lower class but only white lower class but then he would visit his father in Saint Paul's and it was predominantly black lower class. Either way yellow poor okay. What field was this close to Bristol? Okay this is all in England and don't forget his family's mixed as well so there was this element of never really knowing where he belonged. He would be stopped by the police for being black but then called out by his black friends for acting to weigh in so he just never knew my lifelong identity crisis. Yeah and here's the thing shouldn't fuck it matter. Yeah he's a fucking person. Yeah more or less story. Reese doesn't fucking matter. Yeah you're fucking person. Thank you for coming in my tedtalk. So needless to say seeing these guys come together on stage spoke to tricky on a whole new level. But not just that what they were singing about getting chased on the street. Stay OUT LATE. At clubs. Were exactly the types of activities that he was getting up to. At the time I listened more and more tricky began to feel that this was something he could do to not Scott in particular but have some sort of involvement in creating music. These guys were self taught and just living their passion. So why couldn't he? Yeah so going. To shows became life for tricky. He and a friend began squatting in different locations selling weed to make enough cash for train or a bus to get to the next place in check out another group. These carefree Halcyon days of late. Teenage years would be formative to creating the musician we now know is tricky while squatting with some friends who were members of a low key sound system. He told them to do some wraps off the cuff new skeptical at first but after a few verses many saw talent that was clearly lying dormant in so weird to me that people can just find this talent one day. It's like oh I'm just gonNA try wrapping right and they're really good at it. Yeah what's that like? I have nothing like that. That'd probably something just no-one said Ashley do this thing. And you're like doing your shit. I don't have enough fantastically great talents. That will allow me to use that as my career is what I'm trying to say. Also I don't think many people can do that as A. Yeah I wish I could again but this is the whole point of the story with tricky is. Just lock yeah. He's a lucky piece of Schick. He just ran with these people who are trying it out and he was sitting there and they said hey sing along to this and he did and it worked a chance for exposure came with childhood friend. Miles Johnson Aka deejay Milo of the sound system group. The Wild Bunch. They had tricky. Come wrap with them at live shows and this is where he developed his very distinct spec saying style saying wreck sang. I'll expect SPEC saying like you know like the German. Yeah but it's singing yes. Brecht means to speak s brick. Spec sang speaking. This was not sort some sort of conscious choice either. This is where I get into our beer. Tricky softly sings spoken. Voice is a direct result of. How very shy. He is when performing usually closes his eyes and projects just enough to be heard but this would be something that we will still see being used by artists today. I mean think about it like a lot of indie. Pop is very softly sings spoken. Yeah so in. Now it's the new thing the the asm our thing is like be really close to Mike but be really really low. And some really calmly. Yeah Yeah and even I guess again better or quote unquote. Mumble rap is very much like that. That's just a dumb affectation well because they're all just really shy. No Yeah you're just fraternity for Shuki. It's like legit. It's an actual thing like I'm quite shah. I don't know how to sing much louder than this. That's my British choice. That was very good. You've been working on it and I have been working. Sit in the mirror and I'm like I'm British now. He not only adopted his style but also his name around this time to at one point while rapping with the group the fresh for a DJ called him tricky kid and it stuck eventually morphing into tricky. A big thing with tricky is. He's a bit of a loner. Uh-huh kind of comes and goes in and out very wafting into group Aloof. He's aloof fish in the sense that he was not always around. You know he'll do something with a group and he'll just go off and do his own thing or go to a new squad or go check out of band so pupil will be like. What's that tricky kid? Getting up to is tricky like a slang word for not always there or whatever I think Lucy like I think it's more of a slang for just like you know he's always getting into something not even necessarily trouble but like he's that kid. That just shows up. Gotcha here we all have that person who just like you'll be out and then just that person shows up in their in your group for the night but then you won't see them again for months. Yeah that's exactly who? Tricky is. All right just show up for a night and you have a great time and then you just won't see him again cool but that's just who. He is tricky was never considered to be a member of the wild bunch. More of a collaborator. That's due in part to his age. Making him just not really notice or care where he could go with them. He's still like nineteen twenty everyone else's more in their twenty s He's still kind of a kid. This create they created a few singles but tricky never join them in the studio. He was still being a bit of a drifter. Like I mentioned before. Just going from squat squat so that was another reason why he just never joined with a group 'cause he was always kind of doing his own thing. Yeah by the late eighties. The wild bunch dissolved when three of the members Robert Three D del Najah Grant Daddy G Marshall and Andrew Mushroom vowles formed. A new group called massive attack. Oh so massive attack or an offshoot of the wild bunch okay but also mushroom vowles Ideas last names vowels. Oh Hey maybe I'm saying okay. So so the members of massive attack our three D. Daddy G in mushroom are maybe mush. Mush is like but it started off as mushroom announce okay because they thought his mushroom val mushroom vowles was his name like there is a story behind that and we do not have enough time for it. Now there's actually no story behind it unfortunately someday maybe we'll do the massive attack story because I think they have some interesting. They seem interesting. Yeah maybe or maybe not for the right reasons and they've been around for a long fucking time as we see the early eighties. They will probably a year or so later. Three D and tricky ran into each other at pub and from their real. Friendship blossomed tricky. Yeah they're fans tricky was asked to come on board to work with massive attack at the time he still wasn't seeing music's anything more than more than a hobby so they worked out to where he would get paid out for being a musician with the group not an actual member okay so he was still working with them doing a lot with them but he wasn't a full-fledged member he wouldn't be listed as a member of massive attack right but he was credited to helping them with some songs. Okay here's a little fun side no So they're manager is Cameron McVey. And he is the husband to Neneh Cherry. Oh and she's significantly helped to back their albums they gave gave the money. She guessed it on a few other trash. This is probably around the same time. The Buffalo stance blew up. It is yeah yes so Neneh Cherry had a big hand and all this will no shit for her right good for good for them. Yes get good for everybody invoked in the situation yeah honestly. Y'All are lucky tricky. We contribute to three tracks on their debut. Lp Blue Lines most notably was daydreaming. The first single off the record while only hit number eighty one in the UK charts. It was still enough to help. Get them some real notoriety just to give you guys idea there. Sound all play a little sample. Bruce below zero up against move trick is performing taking his photo Nicholas. There it's had touchy like Cocoa Ski Mountain. Free is the needle is moving food. A child was with most expensive on the absolute acoustics Notre Pharmaceuticals for the body suitable stick with Lakewood request to link with troubling star of Sunshine. Laws caused potential. Like they you can still hear his English accent. Oh Yeah but you hear his type of sing song or sing speaking Where it's just like he's kind of thing in. He's definitely wrapping but he's doing like it's melodic and yet not melodic. It's yeah he really melodic yet monotone. Yeah in a weird way. Yeah Yeah and but at the time that this came out it was really the first of its kind. Or at the beginning of this whole forefront of the style so yeah I mean arguably with track like this. He helped massive attack get their name on the business side of music was absolutely no interest to tricky talking with studio exacts interviews even making music videos it was just so tedious to shore. He didn't give a shit he just wanted to make music. Yeah he just seems like the kind of guy that only cares about the music. His blinders are on one hundred percent. It's just the music everything else can fuck right off. Yeah yeah that's how he always feels about that stuff. He just wants the creation process. He doesn't care about this. I commend him for that. But at the same time if you want to have any sort of successful music career you kind of have to do that. Yeah you gotTa play the game playing the game and I can see playing it to a certain extent but also kind of making it very well known that you just are going to say fuck off to everybody. Oh yeah that does. That's also playing the game too. Yeah because you're still giving people something to write about. Yeah he's not rude about it. Yeah he's actually just very matter of fact. Yeah I'll get I'll get all that stuff. So yeah he's still just liked hanging out with friends and family going to check out soundsystem groups and reggae shows. Smoke some spliff in the end. It was kind of a good thing that he did all that. Because that's how he met Martina Topley bird as he was leaving his cousins place. He heard a girl singing to herself and he was so caught up in it. He actually stopped her and started to talk with her. He finally got around to asking if she saying when she said she did. He insisted on bringing her back to the studio. That's a little bit creepy. Well I guess maybe not for the eighties and early nineties. I mean it was so creepy. Just not as blatantly creepy. Yeah Erica. So yeah maybe he's he's seems a bit of a small man stake I take. It could go either way like if he wasn't genuine about it. It could definitely go into that. Have you ever modeled kind of way? Oh you're right you know any rainbow t t whenever till you. You could be a model. Here's my card. You should come up to me. I mean. At least she was singing. So that's something. It's only somewhat creepy together. They worked on a few tracks but the main takeaway from the session was the track aftermath. Feeling like he had something really great. He brought the track of massive attack for their next album however they had no real interest in it telling him to focus more on writing for the group. It wasn't long after this that tricky decided to leave massive attack. I Yeah I was Gonna say that's exactly what you don't say to tricky. Yeah I'm GonNa do what I WANNA do. It was a group that he didn't really feel that he had a part in it. I mean arguably he didn't ray and perhaps it was time for him to just try his own approach in this book gets into so much more detail that I can't get into here. There are little snippets and stories of just his interactions with massive attack. That gave him the feeling of being an outsider in this group and influenced him more and more into saying. I like working with these guys. I like making music but but it's time to go before it gets worse. Yes exactly yeah. He took a single cut directly from the tape and pressed it to a few hundred vinyl copies. It was such a success that he garnered the attention of Chris. Blackwell of island records and he wanted to sign tricky immediately. So here we go and we have another story of. Somebody's like I'm just going to do this myself. And he just really successful with it. It's also pretty interesting that he just he just had this one song and released it and this was the eighties. Yeah so he released just point. It's the early nineties. I apologize so he released just one song in the early nineties before the Internet before. Napster before any of that shit before file sharing before you sound cloud just this one song somehow made it to a guy at a major record label. Yup and then he was like all right. I'M GONNA sign this guy based on this one song yet. You're easy was that impressed with him. This crazy I mean. Maybe he did his homework. Vanity worked with massive attack as well but still so. That's probably some first class marketing. Or just some real dumb luck I think in a again I think. Tricky is the first to admit this his life is a lot of dumb luck. Yeah as far as music goes. Yeah other than music. I wouldn't say he had dumb luck. Bad Luck Yeah. Well you got to balance it out. So you know he's GonNa get signed to a record deal but is he gonNa be successful on his own. Oh we'll find out after the commercial break we'll be right back okay. And we're back know by now that we've diagnosed some weird noises in your house must. Yeah it's it's cold it's winter season. Will critters are everywhere? A LOT OF FREELOADERS. Life is a little chaotic. Sleek stealing your Wifi and all those fuckers password protected going in your fridge ceiling your Diet Cokes. I duNno Diet Cokes. Still Jenny Craig. Vail motherfucker get drunk skunks in your basement. Oh Oh that's so cute cute guys. We're weird anyway now that you do the story at Hand Menagerie in here. Let us return so now. Tricky has gone from Aloof Kid to self produce solo artist At this point it's been a couple years since he's worked with Martina but he knew she needed to come back and work with him on the full album. The sound of her sweet and sultry voice complimented his soft wraps perfectly soft rap softwares. That's what I was calling saw. Frappes frappes the process for creating his debut. Lp came easily to tricky once. He realized all he had to do was create. He spent hours with producer. Mark Saunders working through vinyls to put together all of his samples And seeing as how he had no previous musical background tricky was met with a lot of pushback when he was making his music. Marcus trying to clean up some of the tracks changing the notes and he would tell tricky. These don't work together. Musically a lot of people would give them push back to be like. This isn't how music theory works and tricky would say I don't give a shit. This is how I hear it. We're going to do it this way. They would butt heads for a bit and tricky would eventually get his way. Well Yeah I mean. He's the artist and he said this is how I hear it. This is how we're doing it. Yeah I only put the sit here because I want us to start using this phrase but in the book Mark Saunders gets referred to as quote a proper donut proper Dona Dona. That is the nicest ways insulting somebody I have ever heard right. I want a sister using. He's a proper doughnut. Proper and donut are not insulting words but together. It's like this is crazy. He's a proper doughnut. That is a that is for sure a pearl clutching kind of insult. Yes and I love it. I'm here for. He's a pitch be proper doughnut. That's all sausage to me proper donut. Yes and playing the insulted sausage. I like that all of these. Have something to do with food. Yeah I'll definitely have two hoots great but I mean even so tricky does thank him for all the hard work he put into the album because without it wouldn't be the element ended up. Yeah had some other influences well like public enemy and even smashing pumpkins both are sampled in tracks on this album. Martinez was really big into the grunge scene. So that's her introduction for tricky to bands like Pearl Jam Addiction in. Sounds fine. It's the time but you definitely hear. A lot of the public enemy influence in his cover of a public enemy song called black steel. Very Minute Aghazadeh Zorzi sweat. How Bin Laden then a contemplated plan on fugit but did he call it black steel because it sounds like he used steel drums in it. No it's actually cover of A. Oh Yeah it's a cover of a public enemy's black steel our of chaos okay and it's actually very interesting tracks it's all about you know the recruitment during the Vietnam War in the letter saying you gotta go fight now the draft all that Shit. Maybe he made the conscious choice of using steel drums. Definitely sounds like sealed definitely has a very nineties feel not in a bad way it really feels ninety two brings me back to the mid nineties one hundred percent yeah. Martinez vocals were done almost completely in one take. She claimed it was all totally instinctive. Tricky lyrics really stepped up here hitting dark yet. Meaningful themes of death and paranoia the male dread of intimacy drug abuse in cultural decline. Wow that was a lot to shove into one song. All the whole album the okay entire album. It's just. He really hit on a lot of these issues. The final product came out in nineteen ninety-five. It was named Maxine Quaye. But it's all one word. Maximum kway okay is after his late mother. Tricky attributes her death in influence on him as to why he writes in a more Feminine Style and why his lyrics tend towards more darkly realistic yet. Sometimes hold onto a little glimmer of hope But usually it's pretty sad and dark and Glen. Yeah yeah grim neck limb. The thing that threw off many was the album's booklet which featured tricky and Martina dressed in old fashioned wedding outfits but Gender Bent Tricky wore the wedding dress and Martina more the suit and tricky had been known to wear women's dresses on occasion. But it's not from any desire to cross dress Actually pretty interesting. It's starting in his teens. As a way to get attention and push the envelope so to speak you right which is why a lot of people wanNA dudes in their teens where Lady's dresses transgender or they're not crossdressing across. They wanted. Just you know. I don't know I don't hate that. Yeah it was like you're comfortable enough in your own fucking skin to say our dress. Who gives a shit like more like? Why does this make you feel uncomfortable because clearly? I'm not uncovering you shouldn't be uncomfortable by this. But you are so why. So I don't know I think that's something to applaud. That's fine but he also said that it was a way to go against the Macho man culture that's pushed onto the male gender. He thinks all mentioned have to wear a dress at least once in their lives so they can begin to breakdown. That unhealthy concept of you know Macho Man. I'm a big tough guy. Yeah he feels. He did stay in either an interview in the book. I don't remember which about he feels that. There's a sense of insurance. That comes along with that as well you know of. I need to be this big tough guy. You're you're really closing yourself off to other ideas by doing that. Yeah and so also. Dresses weren't really invented specifically for women because historically men wore dresses or skirts or whatever to even more them into fucking battle. So fuck off guys. It's okay guys. You can wear a dress. I kind of agree with the every man should have to run address for a day kind of hot. Yeah awfully kilts likings room and got guys like it's okay like I think. Nothing is sexier than a man. Who's like I'll put on address and some makeup? I don't give a shit because also utilize some nice strong tree trunk thighs peeking out from under. You take a look at them games. Do A twirl for me. But I mean there's nothing sexier than a guy who is not afraid of gender bending and doesn't take him so seriously humor address. Yeah like fuck you have fun. Who Cares I like just like a man sometime? So why don't enjoy dressing like a woman? It's right yeah so I agree with his statement on this. I think everyone should just have to spend a day in the other gender shoes. Yeah or even just like fuck it. Break down the walls. And who gives a shit what you're wearing but back to the ultimate self Maxine Quaye went on to become one of the most influential albums of Arjun Ration- Every music publication hails it as a masterpiece with lyrics and sound woven together to near perfection. It has been put alongside massive attack's blue lines and portis heads dummy as game changers in the electronic world an Oggi's of trip hop and Jeff again. I said like the main three right there. Yeah this is kind of like a a solid foundation for what was to come with electronic and trip hop everything exactly. It really changed music. Yeah Maxine Quaye. Wasn't the only product of collaboration between. Tricky Martina working together on the debut. They began romantic relationship that resulted in a prager. Nancy Pre Gannon aunt. Did she have starch masks? She had so many stars asks who one month. After the album's release their daughter Meena. Maisy was born. The couple didn't last long though that they would still co-parenting champs even if it did result in a lot of arguments on the road they had Meena and brought her along with them and tried. I mean they really did. They meet they gave it the good old college try. They try to give her as fun. A childhood as they could and with a successful album comes the fame the fame that tricky categorically was with yes he was interested in making new sounds in turning hip hop on its head but being flashy rich. Just wasn't something he was going after. Yeah in an ideal world for tricky he would just make music releasing get some money to survive and keep making music but because of his rising popularity he found less and less time for actually making music and I assume he was a lot more popular a lot more in the public eye in the UK in Europe and very much. So I guess around this time he was getting a little bit of exposure in the US. But not not as much as fat boy slim or fuck in Moby fucking moby at least appreciate fat boy slim yet. We can have the conversation some other type of funding there because like moby But yeah I I guess for some people even for people who know tricky. It would be a little bit difficult to understand like wait. What fame like who is right. Who was trying to tail him in stock him in the leg. Bees in his face all the time trying to get you know a good story it was definitely very UK based yeah. He has plenty of stories about being on billboards over there and people seeing him and seeing the billboard right next to him and being like oh. Wow you're famous yet. I guess you should In terms of famous should parallel him to movie. Then you know what I mean for better just in terms of just can't music credibility all just in terms of fame blake imagine. He's getting the same amount of fame in the UK. In Europe that Moby is in America. Right that's fair right. Yeah definitely. She's drawing parallels to write. Your hair allows not comparison. You bring up a good point. I feel like a lot of. Us listeners are thinking tricky. I don't really think he goes. Yeah but he doesn't have an influence over here yet he does even if you don't see even if it's not in your face yeah. I get into it. But they're the he definitely had an influence on certain artists certain movies and all the Shit. He was asked about touring he was humanly against it. When he toured with massive attack he hated it. He found going on stage with a couple of turntables to be a really hollow experience. Also not very conducive to somebody. Who's making music like? He is exactly. I don't think he's a very genuine artist and feels like any sort of shortcut. Is Misleading. Yeah and it's also much more difficult. I think for a DJ tour than it is for Rochman Detour. Yeah it's not organic. It's not something you can just go. And do. I have the time to press buttons on a computer and just queuing up a track that already exists right and I assume that most of their shows are one offs. They're not it's not. They're not touring they're just doing guest spot. You're doing clubs. You're not doing a monster right. That's what I'm yeah well. His manager suggested why not try it with a band and even though tricky was initially thinking the idea was a little crazy he gave it a shot and he actually ended up loving it. That's interesting right. This made him one of the first electronic acts to go out there with a live band and keeping up with his simplistic nature he specifically did not want anyone who looked cool instead he wanted quote old Chubby dudes ban was just these old Chubby dudes. That's hilarious what anyone who looks cool or hipsters or anything he just wanted guys is in the Biz for awhile. Didn't want any anybody wearing Jane goes on his stage. Thank God he's like Dad Jeans and flannel please. Yeah No pook shows no. Jank owes no crazy spiky hair. Don't none of that. I just want Nice Fro. No t shirts that say can't sleep. Clowns will eat me. Nothing like that. No hot topic over here now. He'll audit like nine out of every ten stories we cover success in the music Biz also mentioned uptake and alcohol and drugs. Oh really yeah. Turns out life on the road tarred. Hey we're still going strong with no heroin are we are? We still gonNA keep that going. Tricky was already a bit of a stoner. Okay now he was drinking more and taking pills and doing cocaine to get past the exhaust okay. So we're at coke but good news. No no way no way as you say. In addition to not being a big fan of the fame he hated the popularity. His music garnered. This is rug into some of the. Us stuff And went from being this strange. Different sound to becoming mainstream heared other artists copying his sound. He heard ads for movies with soundtracks. It sounded like his music talks about going to see a quinton. He went to see Pulp Fiction okay. And the ADS before Pulp Fiction. Were USING MUSIC. That sounded insanely similar to his in the trailers and he was so annoyed with us. Sounds about right. This was his because he's not gaining that success in the US but but article brother sure are chemical well. It's like even American artists American filmmakers. They're getting that popular. It's what immediately off of his fucking music chemical brothers was pretty huge in the US at that time. So it chemical brothers honestly. I respect the chemical brothers a lot more than I respect other boats leanest other than can moby guys mopey is legit bottom of the barrel. He's awful were sky as a person. He's awful Oh I do hate episode on Moby would love to do a hate episode mobile. Let's do that. Let's just born at. How bonus episode like if you like Moby told us into our boat we episode can be called the get the hate out series. Oh my God just like fucking rail against these pieces shit. Allow me to give you all my hate on moby. Yeah anyway this played a big part in the creation of a sophomore release so all of this frustration. He felt that he came out with songs. Like those on maxine clay. It wouldn't be different anymore and he would be stuck. Tricky was also in a rare position of power with his record label even though he had released maxine quaye through island records. He didn't have proper contract. How did that how mark was a proper donut? Maybe that's why he's like your proper Dona. I'm not signing a copper track. No proper donuts don't get proper contracts. So when they went to create one he told his manager that it needed to state that for any reason. Island doesn't WANNA release one of his albums. Hey could take it to any label he wanted. Yeah and now that he was so successful they would be foolish to say anything. But yes kinda. Yeah all of this contributed to the sound here on the nineteen ninety six album. Nearly God. The title came from an interview. He did where he was asked what it felt like to be God. Well nearly God Okay Interviewers. I think it was at emi cheese. Of course it's enemy and this album is definitely experimental. There's less structure but still has this feeling of a carefully crafted piece of work. It heavily relies on its many guest singers including an obvious return of Martina But we also see the Terry Hall Neneh Cherry and Bjork as a few standard. Oh and once again. A Little Romance bloomed in the studio when tricky began to Bjork for several months. I can only imagine how that courtship Wentz well in the end he wasn't in a good place to be in relationship and even your called him out on that she would tell him. You're Kinda dark you know you're not seeming like you're on an emotional state for relationship and it's Kinda sweet. I guess in two thousand thirteen. It was early twenty tens. He was being interviewed and he came out and said I'm really sorry to Bjork. I was with her and I was not good for her. I was negative. I mean I wasn't. He just left one day. He ghosted Hugh. I think he was living with her. And just left. Okay yeah that's not good no but he also admits to fully being and saying like she was right. I was not in a good place. I was a bad person. I think she's a lovely person and I hope she's happy and I'm so sorry. First of all good for Bjork furred calling him out on his bullshit BURIC VOID. Call him out on his bullshit though potatoes. Sweet way are you. Very Tiny. Voice gets tricky. Tricky I feel like there's a lot of aggression. I don't know why it is the cutest little league. Because she has such a huge singing voice that in real life. She's very quiet. Unless there's a reporter interface and then she fucking handle on them. If you look up the space ghost episode where Bjork Thom Yorke on it working time. You're you're you're at is an odd couple. Tv show waiting to heighten. So good is the funniest shit and Bjork does have a very soft. Lovely Voice Yeah. She's very sweet. She is unless you get a reporter interface and then she goes ham. Yeah I can't wait to do a bjork episode. It's going to be so. Yeah that's kind of more than one for sure definitely. Yeah it's nice that both. Yes she called about and he understood. Yeah I DID WRONG. Yes how humans should work. You should realize the sheet. You did wrong and even years later. You should fucking apologies. Hey that's great. That's how you guys and not just meter but also grow from it. You become a better person from it. I think he did. I think he one hundred percent did because island wouldn't let him release two albums in one year he called himself the pseudonym nearly God so it's actually hard to find this album interesting spotify because they're like here's how this album nearly God but no using yet still. The album was received with generally positive reviews. Nothing like his debut but they were still here for what tricky was creating and right like. I said two albums in one year. I'm well aware. His debut came out ninety five so in two years nearly ninety six. Nearly God came out so you released and then three albums in two years. Yes the other album that he released under his own name was called pre millennium tension and while it straight a bit from the first album trip hop sound it was in the opposite direction of nearly God so both of them strayed but in completely different ways it doesn't have the experimental atmosphere as its counterpart. This is a bit more aggressive and driving and while some viewed it to be a little too dark and CLAUSTROPHOBIC. Critics overall felt as good about the record as they did with nearly God so neither of them really match the debut but still pretty good pretty good up by the ninety s. Tricky moved to the. Us The obvious move being of course New York City. Yeah there. He gained opportunities to work with American artists. Like puff daddy or royalty he worked so king king PD pinkie. He works with him on a remix of biggies hypnotize. Which yeah okay that checks? He also worked with routines. Raza on a few own nice. That is a collaboration. I am fucking here for exactly. He was still working. In releasing new albums and touring around the thing about Turkey's music. Is that it really speaks to a lot of people because he writes about life experiences. It can range from things like watching a girl. Just brush her hair behind her ear to what he saw one time when he was doing. Peyote oh but he does talk about how he's thinking about. How big and how rich and famous. He is or his grower strippers. He's just like yeah. It was on the street so this girl brush her hair behind her head and it made me think about all these things and he like goes off And that's what's really universal about. His music is that most people can hear it and relate to it. Yeah I honestly can't really to Going to strip clubs Going to strip clubs in your lake. You know or your money to throw around money in Spiegel Mansion. That has fountains actually. And you're good at wrapping. I can't relate to that you have some kind of talent that you can live off of. It makes money I care to that. I don't know what that is. No as you continue along. His lyrics could hit a dark place likely due to his declining mental health at the time. Oh with exhaustion and depression crawling in also. He started calling record companies in his songs accusing them of benefiting from the murders of rappers and suicides of rockers. I mean he's not wrong. No He's not no. He's not saying some hard truths. Hello my name is tricky welcome. My tedtalk called hard truths I only evaded record exacts. Here thanks tricky. The depression was hitting a dangerous low and he finally went to a doctor to get checked out to see if maybe there is some kind of physical issue and actually turned out there was he was diagnosed with Candida or just call it good old-fashioned east infection except in his stomach yikes because he couldn't have the East affection that you all might have gone to. Yeah no you can't you can't have these dude after reading about him talking about Candida. Do I have candy stomach all. Yeah but there can be an overgrowth of it and that's really bad. It was his anti gestion. It's bad for your mental state. Oh no there is a difference. Okay so there is a disease where it's called brewers disease or our where you have to too much of something you know. I don't remember too much something in your stomach. So if you ingest carbohydrates your stomach term mayor and turns it into alcohol and you get drunk from eating carbs. Yeah that's not what he had. I kind of want that disease so I will stop eating carbs or you'll eat them when you need to only when I need to and then I don't have to drink beer. It'd be Great Beers. Also Beers fucking delicious. Yeah see CALICO. That shit can't so what sorry. Sorry but it is Myers beer so good. It's not our fault now I blame the craft. Brewers the booties so what ended up happening is tricky. Changed his diet entirely. No more sugars are carbs. Detox himself all the way and noticed a big change in his mood and physically overall and then I read this like maybe I should do this. Yeah you know what I mean it helps. It probably does but it's also a diet that's not for everybody. True true true as hard. That wasn't the only big change in his life. After Chris Blackwell left island records it was sold to Def jam records which is now a part of Hasbro okay. We talked about that. One ordeal talk about that now. I remember can get a to pocket configure anyway. This ended up being a smooth merger for tricky. They wanted him to make more marketable to the American hip hop scene music. And like that's really not of any interest to tricky. Yeah no don't tell tricky what to do don't he couldn't do it. He's not so he left. He left the label and he ended up On a punk label in Europe called anti records in America he ended up on Hollywood records. Okay she still owned by Disney so we could still have a tricky. I can figure marketing. God help us in two thousand one released his most commercially accessible album blowback. It's pretty mainstream. I say mainstream but it's definitely if I was gonNA tell you to go to an my probably tell you to go to blowback easily accessible and easily absorbed. Yeah he started have Martina unless unless tracks not because he didn't want to work with her anymore but just as a result of trying new things now that he was out in. La On this mainstream label. He ended up working with some pretty well known artists like Red Hot Chili Peppers Cyndi lauper. Okay Ed Kowalczyk of live a woolly who've Alanis Morissette. Okay actually ended up kind of being friends on. That's nice yeah. Blake went to a party together. They stay together through the keeps cool. She's cool yeah cool. That's pretty cool. I feel like they'd be done to hang out with each other. Yeah smoke a couple splits. Laugh about some shit like it's funny because Atlanta's Morissette is if you just if you only know her for her music you're Kinda like she's probably really boring and was just like Komen drinks tea and watches a really boring show. No she likes to fuck in party like smoke pot and all that shit so I want to hang out with laws I would totally hang out with more set and she can dance right. Oh she can denounce wants to many of Turkey's die. Hard fans predictably disliked this album. And Look I'm not GonNa take that away from them. There are some gems on this album like the track excess row. Good but then there's a cover of Nirvana's something in the way and I'm going to say it's not great. Oh Yeah you sent that to me was Not that great. I'm just gonNA tell you to go check out for yourselves kids. 'cause it's for a very specific group of people and I am not in that group. I just don't think that it works for something. In the way it took a song that was infused with a whole lot of meaning and a whole lot of emotion and kind of just made it weird. Yeah yeah an empty mobile after two thousand three release of vulnerable tricky. Would almost absent. Mindedly take a bit of a break from making records instead. He got into the film world for a minute. No it started with being asked to work on soundtracks for Jerry. Bruckheimer Wes. Yup. He did some songs for the CSI soundtrack and a couple other films. What's right that would be something? He would have like a hard no he knew he moved to. La for a bit and just was kind of like all right. I guess this is La Culture. So I should do it yet. I think for a while. And he even says in his book like he just Kinda felt. It's easy to fall into that alley culture when you're out there. I suppose yeah from there. He fell into a few acting roles. Nothing too big just a few. Notables like playing right arm in the film the Fifth Element and having a part in the tool music video for parable Parabola parable in Parabola. Sure I do if I looked at you. You would recommend appropriately. Yes thank you. Tools had have you heard about the FIBIA DOT? Uc crosses the whole litter? Al is album is leg based on the New Zealand. What do you know what the she's living off? I know that's a mean but that has literally happened to me. It's her life on at least a couple of occasions so it's ashes. Life guys perhaps his brief moments in front of the camera which he deemed boring bullshit. You just again like tricky. Doesn't like that Shit. Yeah it's really boring. Them inspired him to do a movie of his own called Brown punk. It's filmed almost like the show that office but it's not a comedy like it's filmed in the in the same vein of like a documentary style. People talking to the camera right right That's he compares. It's that but it's not funny. Yeah it's supposed to be like a documentary of his own life but it's kind of blurred lines of the truce okay. I don't know I haven't had never been released. I don't think okay. Thank you can see some clips on Youtube. But that's a yeah. In addition to the film he also started his own. Small label called Brown punk where he helps produce smaller artists. After moving to Paris in two thousand eight it was brought to tricky is attention that he hadn't released an album five years genuinely. I know thought that had to change. And it did with the record knowle west boy and it was here that we see on a track called council estate finally Solo and really singing not doing his usual soft spoken lyrics. Oh all right you see remember with even his His singing is more like barked lyrics. Right not really seeing it. Yeah I mean he doesn't ever sing. Sing saying yeah things things saying he just but still. That's that doesn't even sound like him for hot second. Yeah because it's just so dot com and softly spoken. Yeah just sounds angry and gave it to you know works. It does it. All just came from the fact that like he ended up having to work with less and less of a band and he didn't have anything to hide behind. Yeah but it was the track school gates. That was a catalyst for change to come in. Turkey's life after releasing a video for an old high school girlfriend heard it and she knew she needed to talk to him why she got a hold of his sister. Who called him right before a show to tell him what she was told that he had another daughter. Oh Yeah Oh that's why her name is Marie and tricky. It always suspected he might be the father. The timing was just a little too perfect but he never pursued it and the mother never told him before he should've taken her on. Mauri did the Turkey you are. The father told you I told you well. That's great though. I do like being a dad. He's just calmly like. Oh that's wonderful. I really wanted to be quite nice. I'm glad to be her father. I think that'd be lovely wonderful. Can let's go home now. Let's go home all right. We'll have chattan learn about you a little bit more Monas- private that's probably exactly what the reaction was leased. Exciting episode of Maurice Eddie Nicest episode more to ever Air Okay. Yeah he was like seventeen or something when they boned or they're dating and she got pregnant soon after and like he just. Kinda do because that was his thing done for everything in life pretty much trickier a one and done kind of guy. Well I did it. I'm done now. I'M GONNA go and we'll go. I'M GONNA. I hid out. This is your daughter. Well Shit then I hit Al once once they got the total proof with DNA tests. They began to build a relationship. Good yeah so I mean. He has a pretty decent relationship with Marie. Dmz He's a good dude. He's not a bad dune he really isn't like a really good dude. He does like some dumb shit when he was a kid and like a balloon up to it. Exactly every instance of somebody calling him out or like he's like you're right. I was an asshole. Yeah or like oh I have a kid okay. I'm going to be a dad now. Cool do what I can. Shit in the late auto reunion occurred with tricky massive attack time. He'll most wounds and they worked on music again in two thousand sixteen. They released the album ritual spirit. Which was the first to see trick at since Nineteen Ninety-four? Wow you up. But in two thousand twelve he had the once in a lifetime opportunity to perform with beyond saying on stage at the Glastonbury festival wound. But let this go to show. How very shy. Tricky is and how he never really gotten over it when he got on stage with one of the most famous popstars in the world in front of over two hundred thousand people. Tricky just froze. He missed his verse and finish the Song. Without uttering a word in his Mike O. And he's just a nice dude is like I can't be in front of all these fucking people afterwards. He would blamed technical difficulties to avoid total embarrassment however he does say that the onset was gracious about the whole thing actually a really normal person. She didn't ask for a special trailer. She said the same dressing room that everyone else had and it was really nice to Donald. Fucking worry about it. I don't care. We had fun like she danced on him for a second. You saw Jay Z. And he's like I'm not going to do anything. Women don't look at me and gold but also you can't say shit shut the fuck up honestly and probably not. Yeah Yeah. Tricky may not have gotten an ego over his success but he probably should have gotten a tax guy. Jesus he just gets like google rope of like every musician thing. Oh Yeah Not Musician Story. His aloofness does him no favours. Yeah not also doesn't favors. It's weird again like I said. He's very lucky and music. Very unlucky in life because by two thousand ten he discovered that he owed over five hundred thousand dollars in unpaid taxes on both sides of the Atlantic. Honestly that's not a whole lot comparatively. You're putting some people you would sink. He also had a former manager of suing him for unpaid wages. Oh yeah so. He has a lot going on here and you would think like most famous musicians should be nothing right. Well no this was no easy fix of okay. Let's just work hard and pay this off. He had moved around so much of it on so many levels that it was hard to tell exactly how he was gonNA fix each issue. Because it's hard to tell like where they started where they ended. Yeah he also didn't notice how he spent money he never learned to drive so we had a lot of car services he did drugs he would just go out and spend money and yes he is successful but he is not that success so and again didn't realize that he didn't have his he's like oh taxes he's not good with money clearly didn't have any and neither were any of the people that he hired to manage his money. I don't know who was managing as money if anybody wants at all exactly just when he was about to give up on everything and move back in with his family in Bristol this close to two when he just turned into a millennial clock struck twelve the carriage turned into a Pumpkin and he became a millennial. Oh this is what we do if somebody's going to move back. I don't need this fame as fine. A German record manager named Horst Vinyl Mueller from K seven records. It's an exclamation point. In front of K Seven Kevin Records. He approached him to work on a new album and to help him with his finances and it was no easy trick. Tricky was still making music and putting out albums and even started another label called false idols. Here released an album of the same name around that time. Okay solid. I'm GonNa tell you right now if you're going to listen to a tricky album. I really like false idols. Great but even with releases and tours. He was not seeing an end to his debt so they decided to take away a majority of his live band like I said he was slowly and slowly taking away little pieces of his set. So daddy this resulted in some experimentation with an album called skilled mechanics pretty stripped down effort and it was produced a bit hurriedly overall. It's tricky least favorite album But overall this experience helped in every aspect from learning how to be such good businessmen to even a better performer. Such good businessman. He's much better businessman now than he was before with them with a minimal band. There is nothing to hide behind and so we had no choice but to work on his confidence. And it's all been for the better trickiest music. Creation process has changed becoming more thoughtful and not so rushed. He's been touring successfully gaining more and more fans and retroactive praise. For albums that may not have been recognized for their potential at first overall tricky. Never let the fame get the better of him as a person he just wants to be treated with respect like any other normal human he understands how hard life can be and so he can fund the beauty in everyday life which makes his music so relatable Even at fifty two. I think he still has a lot to offer and will continue to shape music for a long time and deserves to get his do. It's kind of crazy that he's fifty two. I know he don't look fifty two boiler good You know what they say. I do know what they say. And it's true however like trickiest book. I am ending this on a very sad note. Oh so buckle up. Oh God yeah what happens so maybe not everyone realizes this and I did address this earlier in the episode but mental illness is genetic uh-huh it can easily run the lines of your family's DNA in this case. Tricky IS MOTHER. Maxine had it. He himself was certainly showing symptoms and so is his daughter. Macy just this past may twenty. Nineteen maisy tragically took her own life this understandably absolutely rocked tricky and Martinez worlds as well as many others. Maisy was a budding musician. Herself she was a member of the south London. Collective called four into read the last chapter of Tricky Book. It is simply a page that he clearly wrote after like. I think he finished the book. And then this happened again. Added the Sin Rape. Before it was published the second slash chapter is so sweet and positive and he talks about like how he's come from so much and how he's been really lucky and then the last actual chapter is just a page. It's just about how maisy took her life. He doesn't know how to process it. He's lost people. But this is just one yeah and ends on such a bleak and sad and it's sad because you do see how much he's gone through and how much he's progressed and celebrated and done so well throughout it and then he ends on this note in. I think a lot of people can relate to that of seeing like this loss in your life wondering. Can you recover from it? We don't know he's still made a little music but this is this is the one. This is the loss that rip rip at his heartbreak. It is to lose your child to sue US. Like he started his book losing his mother to suicide and he ends his book losing his daughter to suicide. And it's crazy and sad and I feel my heart goes out to and Martina and all the people in their lives. Because that's such issues so young. And she her own artist making her own path and heard a little bit of the 4:04 collective they put out a song that was written by her and called blindspot. I highly just looking up. It's a very good song. She clearly is touting was talented. And it's a shame on so many levels to lose her but that's how powerful mental illnesses is that somebody who is young and has their entire life ahead of them and is doing creative and important things and they know they're doing creative and important things that mental illness is still so powerful that it overtakes everything else right now. That's the tragedy and as and say it every time if you guys are feeling lost or like you don't matter you do and reach out and get help because this is what happens in aftermath is that there are people left behind and it rips our lives apart. Yeah losing you is worse than you thinking that you don't need to be here. Yeah well. That was a bummer. Note to leave in on. You're welcome. I hope really hoping this is going to be positive at the end. Sorry no it's not your fault. Say but he's volume as fall. It's you know look out for each other. Look yourself you matter so yeah I think that's the point. I really want to bring home with. That is whether you think so. We're not you do in fact matter to at least one person and that is worth getting help. Yeah for definitely get help. Think you need it. There's no shame in that. Take a pill if you need to see a therapist if you need to do you need to do you know. Shimano CBD oil. I don't know what you need to do. Just straight up fucking pot all the time. That's fine add. Figure it out like whatever you need to keep yourself here do it. And just not heroin. Oh Yeah just. Don't do heroin. Heroin GonNA keep you here. It's not it's fast tracking straight to not here heroines. A fast track to not here but like I was saying especially because of all this. Listen to Turkey's music. It's so good and you're going to hear so much influence in a specially when you listen Ma. Anything just listened to Maxine Quaye. Yeah eighties such a great album. He is so talented Martinez amazingly talented and is really the foundation of you. Know everything you listen to. Now if you listen to now from fucking dub step bullshit to scroll ix or whoever the Falke is and like Ariana Grande Day or whatever honestly it really is the foundation for all of the modern pop that we listen to now and even the Rock dwayne Johnson the loves tricky probably shun listening to Turkey. 'cause I'm saying it way. The Rock Johnson listens to tricky. He probably does honestly if you want to be like the rock the rocky no scrub scrub at all while all right so thank you guys so much for listening China when it here because we hit rock bottom. We're done we're over this. Thank you for listening. We love you and appreciate you. If you guys want to has passed you guys Wanna go ahead and scoot over to www rocky podcasts dot com. That's our website. You can leave comments on the episodes Email that'd be cool to follow the links to all our social media facebook. Instagram and twitter assailed. Yeah Yeah and listen to us there. That'd be great l. So if you just want to follow our network Pantheon podcast network. Great Place to listen to any type of music podcast. You want here. We got it all. Covered in good stuff is happening. 'cause stuff is happening. We're getting bigger rain. Better go follow it now. Yeah and you want to do more for us. You can go to our patriots and Patriots Dot Com Slash. Caney podcasts and you can give us money and we will give you cool things in return including a bonus episode every month coming up next week coming out next week. Times can be good one always good ones. They're always good honestly pretty hammered at that point. Yeah because we record them after we do the actual episodes four beers deep so twelve sheets in. Yeah thanks So yeah go there and give stuff will give you things in return. Yeah exchange equal exchange the barter system. It's great it works totally storks and next week we got one more episode to wrap up black history month with. Oh Yes oh it's GONNA be. It's going to be so much fun this is i. You all know you all know in. Y'All love and it's going to be honest fire. Here's your head guys next episode fire going. Beyond fire. Yeah thank you wait then well very good. So we'll see you next week. Held in Barney on Ashley Party on Maggie and Party on crazy kids out there. 'cause it's tricky. Tricky tricky dicky. Hey this is Brad page from the. I'm in love with that song. Podcast inviting you to join me. As we explore a different Song. Each episode discovering. What makes these songs great the performances arrangements and the production tricks techniques are all part of creating those magic moments to turn a good song into a great one on this podcast? We take a deep dive into each song listening to all those nuances that came together to make it a great song. Our journey takes us across the musical map from the Beatles and the stones to aretha Franklin and Tom Petty. Kiss the cars todd rundgren and Roxy Music from bad finger to Al Green. Stevie wonder David Bowie from Aerosmith to the zombies. We listen to it all on the. I'm in love with that song. Todd you may be unfamiliar with some of these songs and some of them. You've probably heard a hundred times but I bet if we listen closely we can discover something new so join me on the. I'm in love with that Song podcast and let's listen together because I think you're GonNa let to songs too.