Hour 4: Jon Wilner & Brett McMurphy
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Most of it emanating with the big ten we had the commissioner of the Mac on earlier Jon Steinbrecher who was one of the WHO was the first? TO ANNOUNCE IT, they're shutting down John always great to have you on. Talk. Thank you for making time I know. As, we watch this move across the country I it's just Frightening with all the confusion and uncertainty. So let's start. With the PAC twelve, it has been a tumultuous eight or nine days and and that's not even talking about whether they'll play football or not. It has not. So they announced their schedule on July thirty first, and then that weekend their players went public with the manifesto. In which at least a dozen, we don't know exactly how many basically threaten to boycott if demands warm made. And then last week they met with Commissioner Scott and I think that didn't go as well as players they thought, and now here we are with after the Mac. Shutting Down Pac twelve is on the brink of shutting down the ten days of felt like about one hundred days. So. I, know it's easy to lump the conferences together. I mean we do that just for fun. We don't really know as much as you do but what do you know right now in relation to where the PAC twelve is and ultimately, what are they going to do? well I I know that they are not going to do anything today. There are presidents chancellors are supposed to meet tomorrow and is expected that they're going to make a decision on the season I suppose that they could. Delay you know and I'm sure that what the big ten does this evening or tomorrow morning we'll have an impact on the PAC twelve thinking. I. Don't think the PAC twelve wants to be the first I think they'd probably rather have some cover from the big ten. But you know we'll see this a very fluid situation get twelve presents together. You never know what's going to happen but I'm pretty confident that they'll be nothing from the from the pack twelve until tomorrow. And John Everyone seemingly has a different view we've heard from the not officially, but people that cover the SEC and the ACC and both conferences seemed to be full speed ahead full speed, but they're moving ahead. What would tip the Balance Out West? Well I think that right now, it looks pretty much like the PAC twelve is going to shut down same with the ten and I think what has changed is and you know espn just reported this afternoon about growing concern about myocarditis the inflammation of the heart that has been documented in several athletes in the big ten, this summer and in a few other athletes and I think that data is probably going to be what kind of pushes the. PAC twelve over to canceling the season you know I've been wondering what has changed in the last week or two, and I think that the the evidence of this heart condition have have really made an impact on the thinking of the President I can't really see a way forward at this point for the PAC twelve you know maybe they pause maybe they delay a final decision for a week or two, but it's awfully hard to see how they're gonNA end up taking the field. On Mar myocarditis. It it seems like at least the big ten maybe others have discovered A. Number of their players suffering from this I mean it's just so fascinating. How, and I'm not saying this cynically but the interpretations of medicine. Seem- seemingly vary from one part of the country to the other. They do there's no doubt about that and I you know. I think you need to put yourself kind of in the mind of a university president here right if you're already. So you're in charge of this entire campus billions dollars campus and athletics is important but it's it's a piece of the whole equation and you're already skittish about playing and about sending an amateur athletes out in amid pandemic and them getting sick or or worse, and how it looks and then here comes. an issue that you can. You know even though that. myocarditis. They've known about it for a long time. The medical community has now it is affecting athletes. That are currently on your rosters. It makes it much more personal. And I think it probably is is of the final Straw here for at least two of the conferences. John I. Know you're out there but but I'm really curious just over your thoughts on the broad spectrum of college athletics because you have friends and sources all across the country and I, it's it's just such a it's been such a bizarre weekend. Just listening to the death knell of college football, and then today we we see the pushback. Especially, in certain parts of the country, the big ten coaches, a presidents in the south. I know what you said about the two, the two main leagues we're talking about the big ten in the pack twelve but but do you do you? Do you really see a way forward for the other three? Boy Awfully tough to think three play and to not, and to that are not playing saying we're not doing it because of evidence of a heart condition that really kind of backs that justification kind of backs the other three into a corner in my opinion you know I don't know that there had been reason until this point. I thought the SEC was make was. Being smart and waiting and waiting as long as it possibly could Greg Sankey has been talking about that. Now for four months don't make decisions you have to. But I just think that the evidence that surfaced with with heart condition has has changed the dynamic a little bit and is GonNa make it a lot harder for those other three conferences to to move forward. Yeah. It almost seems like you have to argue against the evidence which. which totally which can be done but you're you're you're walking down a very slippery slope if you do. You're walking down the super and don't let's not forget that they're probably going to calculate liability here. You know they know about this and maybe some of the schools have had athletes this summer that have had this condition and you're still sending kids out there knowing that there's that is a huge liability concern horrendous deke's university presidents are like the most risk averse group. There is right and You know I think that this this is gonNA. Be It and and it's very difficult to argue when you're talking about got. A heart, condition? I'm curious what you what you think Jonah just in terms of of all the reactions, you've covered the sport a long time to be to Leeann, newspaper columnist I think a healthy dose of cynicism comes with the territory at least. I know it happened to me and I'm sure it happens the most. But I mean, do you do you think that people other than nodding their head going? I'm sorry to hear that I'm glad to hear that that that's a college presidents or paying much attention to what the young players are saying or even the coaches today like Ryan Day in Jim Harbaugh. I think they are and someone told me earlier today that you know that the the reaction, the public reaction from from coaches and players in the big ten has has certainly given the the president's you know something to think about. But ultimately I just I don't see how anything is going to stop it at this point you know. What I hear most about college football these days Paul is just people are just sat there disappointed at how the whole last four or five months have unfolded. The way everybody has kinda gone Fractured situation no no plan. No coordinated plan for health and safety. No coordinated plan for messaging. You know the big ten in the SEC. have. Benefited for thirty something years since the Supreme Court decision. They've benefited from not having a commissioner and from there basically one of the show right but I think that these last six months, the fact that there is no central authority has really hurt the sport. How would evaluate everything? You've seen so far just in terms of the way. Forget Mark Amer I. Don't think we need to waste a lot of time on that conversation, but but the other five, the five commissioners. Larry Scott has been widely criticised. Kevin Warren seems to be an enigma in that. He is doing things a little bit on his own, and then you have the other three one's retiring. Wonder Yeah. You know I think Larry Scott I. Think the PAC twelve has done a good job for these last five months being on message being smart with things It is interesting because he's coming in the middle of a pandemic and he's got. You know he doesn't have emotional. Ties he's deep emotional ties to the sport like the like you know for bowls being. Sankey, do they are you know they're experienced there decades in college football makes them a little bit different from slum, the other two and then you have to add in university politics. You know varying degrees of academic missions on campus you. In this case, you've gotta add state politics on top of the whole calculation. So you know I think I was surprised that the big ten went out ahead of everybody in terms of going to the non conference schedule. But otherwise, you know it kind of makes sense the way everybody's gone about it based on their own constituents I just wish. There had been some kind of unified unified voice on messaging and protocols. I. Think that would have alleviated a lot of angst that everyone has felt in disappointment a Lotta people feel. Again John before you go just go over the timetable here in terms of the pack twelve when when do you think we will will know or they may pause and not give an absolute decision here shortly. Well I think a lot will depend on what the big ten does. Tonight tomorrow morning. I. Think they're voting tonight I think the big ten votes to to cut shut down the season I think the PAC twelve will do the same thing if the if the big ten to basically pause to re evaluate and there is time to do that, I, mean they can push everybody can push the season back and and not start training camp till. Real late, August if they want. If the big ten pauses I think the PAC twelve will probably pause and I also would not be shocked If there is some kind of joint statement from those two conferences just saying we're not playing and here's why and a kind of a show of unity. They do feel a certain connection partly because of the Rose Bowl history and partly because of the shared academic missions that a lot of the schools have so I would not be shocked if there's a joint statement. John if they did that, it would be the first collaboration we've seen in this five-month tail so. For that we would be grateful as much as we would hate to see a thank you for coming on. Always great to hear your inside and we will be talking to you very very soon John Wilner from the mercury. News. Great to have you on. Thank you Tom Paul, Take Care Wow. The best source for information on the West Coast John, joining us from out. West. We will take a break get your reaction more guest calm or. News. In the weeds we are coming back. After this, you're listening to the Paul Finebaum show podcast. 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Continue here and a DAB is up next in Toledo thanks and good afternoon to you. Thanks Hi Paul. I I WANNA densify myself as a longtime college football fan and a medical researcher since nineteen, seventy nine and I want to offer my perspective as a as a researcher. I started my career as a hospital researcher and I can say that medical solutions are not always correct or predictable There were times when there was an issue with a patient and the whether it was diagnosis or treatment of that patient and the medical literature and research at the time provided totally conflicting solutions We don't know everything about covert. There have been misstep so far and testing and treatment. So I I'm really skeptical about people making decisions on this tenuous data decisions that are affecting so many lives beyond just the college athletes but. The communities and and who are GONNA be suffering because it's closed down. But basically what what you've heard already is in sources have indicated that the big ten has reacted to five cases five posts. Cova, cases with. US So I don't know why. I, mean you you understand I mean we're we're not talking about. A run of the mill medical medical experts here but right as you know. People reactive data in different ways. They do and and you know scientific people know that there's always a control group and and my concern is if we shutdown college football across the board, then where's the control group? How are we going to know what would have happened? Had, we continued with College Football just my perspective. Thanks for taking my thank you very much and I. Think there are two sides of that coin as there always are. there's a medical side that dimension and then the liability side. and. The liability sides a little bit easier to figure out it's Scott is up next in. San. Diego Hey. Scott. Hi Paul how are you doing? Well, thank you. Thank you for calling. They show I don't Miss. You heard the I just saw that the mountain West Fan that they're postponing right the their season as well but. You know one of the things I haven't heard a lot of talk about is and I'm looking at a more of a liability perspective too. I'm GonNa Attorney and that's kind of what I do but. The colleges already have liability related to this from the fact that they've done students on campus right now and they're practicing so. I haven't heard a lot of talk about that, and then the other thing is. If the. Major conferences a one or two of the major conferences cancel. I don't see how the other conferences go forward. Well, let me give you this. Let me give you the legal case here Let's let's say to do and I think they will. And then you're in one of the other three and and you have a serious situation wh. What what's your argument? My argument if I was asked to. Say You. You wonder that you're you're SEC ACC or big twelve and you have a serious situation that comes out from liability standpoint How do you defend that? I think that's going to be really tough. I don't know how you do it. I mean maybe a point to the experts you tried to say that there was An assumption of the risk that you know everybody knew it was dangerous and they chose to play but. You know the bottom line is these lawsuits are are done years later in. The plaintiff they're going to be saying look, you have these other two conferences. capital because they didn't feel it was safe. Even if the real reason was something else you know the MAC is being in its because. Just, let me say one thing. We had the MAC commissioner on and he said he he looked at medical experts and they said. It's unequivocal. You can't go on So I mean he would be my first witness wasn't he? Yeah he would but you know then. That's GONNA be nothing unequivocal this no one had absolute facts and anybody says that now is full of it because right now I don't think the doctors or anyone knows exactly what's going to happen or why so. but my I can tell you it makes it a lot more difficult for this year. I'm curious Gotham legal have had those conversations go I would assume every I know every conference has legal counsel. Every university has a general counsel You know those conversations have already taken place. Oh Yeah Yeah and and what we don't know is. What is their insurance company San. Many people are already been sick and you know what is the what? What has happened Muir so we don't have an information that they do. So we're only speculating with half the information. So I think that's what makes this fascinating but also kind of Kyrie and I can tell you it's closed and it's gotta be because I listen to your show all day and there's great argument. On both sides as far as you know, they're safer on campus they got better medical care You know they're young maybe whisker or last. But Two years from now if there's a loss okay. Everything is they're gonNA look at all events. Well, it was all about money and you're GONNA have enough built battle argument that so. I tell you I wouldn't wanNA. Be, position it's. It's It's tough. Not to prompt anything don't even think about but but Plaintiff of law is quite a cottage industry and and covert is we're we're in the embryos stages but as you look ahead how how big of a draw just going to be. I think it's GonNa be huge. I've already seen art I. It's not my area on the planet. I do more corporate and transactional work. I've already seen articles you know circulating around the law firm about. krona virus remaking employment law. You know because of all the employees that are being forced to work or they're saying they don't have a safe environment, etc. so you're gonNA see lawsuits in my opinion for years and it's GonNa be a not just in the sports world but employment world. Insurance you name it it's going to be. It's going to be a mess and and the problem is they're trying to make decisions. Now they don't know how this is going to turn out. You know maybe if the government got a little more proactive and and gave some safe havens like they tried to do on that poultry factory it make decisions easier but I don't know how feasible that is even. Sky Great. Insight. Thank you for sharing that. We really appreciate it graveyard. Thank you. Great it's really interesting to listen to keep up the good work. Thank you. Scott come back soon, legal expert, and you heard a medical expert right before that just just from. The Great Great audience of the Finebaum Show, we'll take a break mortem and we hope You'll stick around. You're listening to the Paul Finebaum show podcast. Napa know. This month nap has got all kinds of motor oil deals that can save you some serious cash like five courtyard of NAPA full synthetic motor oil for just sixteen, Forty nine with savings like that. You may start feeling like VIP. Don't let it go to your head. These oil deals are for everyone quality parts, helpful people. That's Napa how. Know How generous states pricing sales price it's not include applicable taxes recycled these offerings eight, thirty, one twenty. For, businesses around the world today isn't a restart. It's a rethink. That's why they're partnering with IBM to Change How they from supply chains customer service. Let's put smart to work visit IBM DOT com slash smart to learn more. And we walk back. We are trying to provide as much information as we can during one of the craziest periods in college football history with some of the very best people in the industry and one of them. Our next guest he has been Murphy who has broken so many stories lately, I can't even remember them all, but I know he has. The list is long including the mountain west, the sunbelt breadth We'll. We'll talk about all of that. Thank for joining. US, really appreciate it. Thank you Paul. Good to join you anytime. You've got your your your your finger on the pulse of the College football world and six thirty three eastern time. How would you describe it right now? Confusing but You know I, think as I've. Said to you on a number of occasions I think ultimately. While I think, a lot of these conferences waiting till the last minute to do something. I think that ultimately the president's we'll have a hard time taking that risk whether that happens tomorrow with the big ten. The PAC twelve when that happens in a couple more weeks with the ACC big twelve and sec think eventually that's where we're GONNA end up. Because again, if there are issues down the road. With the the League's that dupleix. They'RE GONNA get. They're going to get sued back to kingdom come because the argument will be well, all these other conferences didn't play because of the health and safety reasons you guys had the same information they did, but you went ahead and played, and so I think ultimately ultimately, that's what the president's will do I. Don't think they WanNa make that decision I just think they have to. Then quite honestly privately behind the scenes, it's because of liability reasons. Bread. I'm not saying things were going along swimmingly. They were not but we went through a rollout last week of all the conferences giving us their schedules. The SEC had quite a presentation here on Friday night no, it was exciting. It was something to talk about other than coded. And Started with the Mac and then it just snowballed. That has changed the minds of so many in the industry. Paul I think it's the the medical advice to the receiving is that it's it's unknown. The long term impacts of covert some some football players that have had some health issues. Excuse me hard issues that Indiana and Houston and I think that's really hit home. for these presidents again, you know we could have a debate and we won't. You know there's obviously various. Various. degrees. Of how serious this thing is. So I'm not trying to get into that argument I'm just saying that these medical advisers are letting these these commissioners no about. These potential long term impacts that they don't know right now, the same with you know twenty years ago we didn't know the long term impact that concussions and I've heard that comparison a lot and so I think that's why you're seeing you know the Max shut it down the mountain west You know as you said, I reported a little bit earlier today they have shut it down old? Dominion which is a member of conference USA you know I. reported that they are not playing even though we don't know a conference USA we'll do. So again I think they're all they all have the same information. Are Reacting to differently. but also I, think, you know like Greg Thank you and I'm sure you talked about it. What he tweeted earlier we you know patience is the best thing you know I agree and I have no issue with that I guess other people just feel like why delay the inevitable and as far as announcing the conference schedules. When you know you're going to be canceling the League I guess the best analogy that I've heard offered up was it's Kinda. Like the band on the titanic. Bread I wonder how much elsa involves the political climate of where these leagues are I don't need to tell you that what I'm talking about because you live in the south where let's be honest it's viewed differently than it is in other parts of the country. Got Is and I think that's that's a big reason y. You Know I. Think you look at certain leagues and they may be Dwayne their decisions and you know yeah I'm not surprisingly politics gets involved with with college athletics. I just wonder though if it's too little too late. you know I I know a lot of people are frustrated that it's gotten at this. Certainly, you know I think the players should be commended how they're trying to rally and have this even play. Certainly a lot of high profile head coaches also have lended that support. I think the problem is, is that the? There's no commissioner in college football is you know so there was no concerned effort by one person to get this done. Each of the ten conference commissioners were doing their own thing and that's why we are where we are, which ultimately I think results and not much football in the fall. I bring that up. Today I mean if you if you were just sitting around with nothing else to do. And watch twitter you. You saw some of the most remarkable. Pieces that I've seen maybe since the realignment land rush of about ten years ago where there was there was speculation that the BRASSICA was going to come down to the big twelve Ohio states coming to the SEC and not to get into contracts and fifty, two, hundred, million dollar. Payouts for violating those contracts. But but. Does any of that really matter today would people are saying I'm not I'm not talking about the players I'm talking about the coaches. And athletic directors across the board who have. We had hundred year check on earlier. They're all saying what fans want to hear them say but. Do. Their words really have any residents. Yeah No, I agree factly what you're saying it you know, Scott Woodward lsu athletic director sent out a statement and a little bit ago that you know that they wanna try to play and they WANNA. Do Do do it safely and we won't compromise health and safety I agree with that but policy not to minimize this but the put kind of a better. A better comparison is. Remember Sec media days when people used to argue about or you're gonNA play eight games or nine games in the coaches get up there and say how they wanted to play this number that number and ultimately it didn't matter what the president's want is what matters and so ultimately even though a lot of coaches have come out. And and saying we WANNA play we. WanNa go ahead and go forward with this. Ultimately, the university presidents next are on the line if something goes wrong. Not The head coach, not the offensive coordinator not star quarterback, and so they are so concerned about these liability issues down the road. When the players you know the as already said, the student athletes don't have to sign a waiver. So it's basically Cya in. That's why the president's ultimately. There will not be a college football season or the president's to blame in this. I I don't know I mean that's something you know we could do our at twelve thirty for thirty on. Who exactly is to blame for this? I don't know it's everyone's pointing to the person to the right in there all sitting in a big circle. Let me go quickly through this? With the power five, I know that you've reported about a number of the other. Conferences and they're still a few that haven't been heard from many big ten. I'll just go through quickly. I'm interested in your e your your thoughts on where they are. Then we'll hear something big ten starting Do you expect something within the next couple of hours or days? Next twenty-four hours? I. Think it's pretty obvious. They're gonNA shut down and Kevin warn it's been very open about the fact that they may not play football in the fall me. Probably you've talked to a number of of people throughout college athletics and people will share stuff with you privately. But the fact that he's out publicly saying, we might not have football season I think it's pretty evident that that's the direction they're going, and literally the five minutes after the big ten makes that announcement I would expect the PAC twelve to follow and step like they do with most everything else, and so now you're down to four up to I. Guess. four weeks that will not be playing and then after that. I think the big twelve ACC have a decision to make I think the other group of five will fall by the wayside after the big ten announcement. And then I think it's going to be the SCC and maybe the big twelve and or ACC. That will be the last ones to to make a decision. Of those three I'm asking you really hard question here. Where where which one of those is likely to to follow the Big Ten and PAC twelve I would it be the big twelve or the or the? ACC. I think the ACC but again, that's just that's just A. You know speculative guess. but I think you know again they're they're presidents the line of thinking within the president. So those those conferences conferences seem to be more alike. and. So I would think the ACC would likely fall in line which then you know Notre Dame would be the answer to a great trivia. Question you know. And TCU, who spent longer in their respectively. Or, TCU, in. The Big East. And if that third one goes You would not expect I presume the other to be able to hold on much longer. Now. Paul I. Just I. Think Again I want cards football to be played. So I know so many people think well, you reporting all this this news you're hoping we don't have a season forget that I want to as a fan as a reporter I want us to have a season. I just again thinking how the president's think If you have two options in your scenario, one is to play the season. Nothing bad happens. Everything goes as planned. You went whoever wants to conference wins another National Championship, the sec you hear the SEC chant. Until the end of time, the other side is you go ahead and play and something bad happens. You have outbreaks shut down your program, your your campus whatever happens God forbid. If, there's a fatality down the road with the family member or player coach or something, and then all of that equity that the SEC is built up over. So many years as the best football conference in America is down the drain because they will be viewed as the conference that decided to go ahead and play for the money. And endanger their student athletes and so what side of that coin do you WanNa be on do you? WanNa take the odds that nothing's GonNa go wrong and play the season out and go ahead or do you want to Reluctantly take the safe side and say look we tried we tried retried when we sit this out. Great stuff as always Brett mcmurphy somebody you absolutely need to keep up with to keep to find out what's happening in the world of college football bread. Thank you appreciate you coming on as always. We'll talk soon. Thank. You Paul? Sobering to say the least we are officially out of time for this program, we appreciate all of you for being apart some really interesting guests today will See You right here tomorrow. Listening to the Paul Finebaum, show podcast, the Paul Finebaum show ears weekdays on the SEC network beginning at three eastern.