Remote Onboarding a Modern Workforce with David Secunda #29
The thing about the biggest picture of on boarding lasting all the way through. Let's just say the first ninety days of somebody's employment. And so a lot of times folks end the idea of on boarding after their orientation and then folks are just often running but to continue a long tail of check ins of expectation management of creating small projects. That are going to create success outcomes and creating longer term goals for thirty sixty ninety day marks having a a a lot of focus on building relationships with co workers at building relationships with their managers and again. This is one of the things that you have to double down on in virtual world. Because they're that much harder clock into. Hey ellen de cost with your haste nick day. Ceo and founder of jj a recruitment specialist hr recruiters tuning into the hate. Your ellen de podcast will help you discover strategic growth concepts leadership development strategies and the values and behaviors that dr organizational change and success together. Let's empower our work focuses. Diversify thanking at achieves significant takeoff exact. Hello and welcome back to the hr ellen de podcast not liked to invite you all to meet david sukandar who joys today he. Ceo and founder of work. And you're gonna like this because his company with hr tech startup is a company that provides you with the opportunities hr leaders to onboard any new employees one hundred percent remotely. Now david is. Ceo of the company breeze also founded many successful companies. Before this in fact he's raised over twenty six million dollars in capital in growing profitable organizations with hundreds of employees and satisfied customers worldwide. He's also recognized leader in the outdoor industry. We're going to talk a little bit about that during the course of the podcast what. I'd like to be really welcome into the shire and let david tally. All about the future of work and how you can start onboard dorm new employees one hundred percent remotely lisa staging sit back. Relax and enjoy the hr de podcast with david seconda. David how you feeling today. Doing great nick fantastic. We're going to go straight into the questions because this is something that my listeners. I know we're going to be keen to hear all about. We're in a midst of pandemic where everyone is adjusting to working from home practices. People want to know more how this can work and what the future world looks like so. Let me ask you a question. One dave demonstrating what is remote on boarding about. And why would it still be a best practice after. This pandemic off dakota nineteen sure. Yeah so let me just back up. A little bit from that Just to kind of provide a little bit of framing of even Cut how i feel about talking about the subject in. And i only say that because it's it's kind of with mixed emotion that i'm talking to so many people right now about remote and a mixed emotion because i founded the company six years ago with a focus on those employers that had remote workforce or distributed workforce's they didn't necessarily have hr professionals in satellite offices and the like and it was really born out of the pain points of the last company. I started that was hiring. Hundreds of people in a very short period of time and it was in a regulated industry. Where getting it right when we were doing all the bits and pieces was highly consequential and so we rolled this forward and and it was really focused on that sort of a of an industry. Vertical or horizontal. I guess i would call it. And then i find myself today doing interview after interview brought on by the pandemic in really finding that what we've built in the expertise gained has has come to service in this in this new area in a very unexpected way. So the you know. I am uplifted. Have the opportunity to share all learning with people. But i am really sad and that it is due to such a a health crisis that we're in that is that is kind of driving this This focus in this area. Then you know as you said nick. We're not going back like these changes that are taking place in the hr landscape. They are the types of things where some of the changes will will return to normal see that we previously knew but many of these things are are here to stay for the long run and And so i think the challenge for hr professionals overall is to look at this. This ecosystem of changes. That are occurring right now and then be very discerning deliberate in those that you you choose to incorporate going on to the future so coming all the way back as well to the question of what is remote on boarding it is a general term that so many people throw around and You know when we're talking about today. I'm gonna focus mostly on that which is called the tactical on boarding piece that once you decide to hire someone until they come walking into work or start their first zoom meeting that space between those two points all his tactical things that need to get done. There's also an aspect of that we can talk about which i'll just say is let's call it cultural on boarding which occurs at the same time but then as they come through that process than they would start cut of the learning or the orientation process at the tail end of it. So when you're talking about that on boarding at remote onboarding. I would say that of the many many things that people talk about out there you know focusing on the security add the trust in all of those of things. The two things that come to mind that are really important. i think for listeners to to contemplate when when moving to or recreating a remote onboarding solution of their employees is first of all a solution that is completely remote. It destroys the whole concept. If you're ninety five percent remote on boarding but then somebody has come in to provide a photo. Id or a signature in front of someone or something like that so the the last few percentage points are usually the most difficult. But you wanna look for some sort of a system whether using something like work right something off the shelf or creating your own. That really gets you hundred percent of the way they are attending can do this on their own time from their own home a really as they prefer and then the other piece is that you really need to find a solution that the employees can use completely from their smartphone. And this is the the the. I wouldn't even call it a trend just the truth of the matter that we're seeing out there We have over six hundred thousand employees that have done their on boarding through work. Bright in seventy percent of them have interacted exclusively from their smartphones. It is just the tool of choice overall and You know it's it's not your employees necessarily going to have a laptop fax machine or a scanner. But they're most likely to have a smartphone to be able to use it so those are the the two things are and then the final party of questions like it here to stay absolutely. It's here to stay in what we're hearing from. Our new customers are existing folks who are operating folks all over the world right now is. They're they're bringing on folks who they're not necessarily working in their office. Is that there via valuating as hr professionals. What really needs to happen in person in what can be done through the leveraging of technology and this tactical on boarding piece is certainly one. They're finding not only can be done through technology but workers prefer it that way. They prefer to do this on their own time from the instead of coming in their first day. Sitting in a fluorescent lit office you know going through a stack of paperwork with somebody. That's a terrible first day experience employees. Prefer it. it is truly a health safety issue. Now in the last thing i'll say about it is that. Hr professionals are finding that they or we got into this profession because we love working with people. That's what it's all about. And the tactical pieces of paperwork is something that just pulls you away from that. And so as hr professionals find remote solutions that allow employees to interact with this kind of administrative layer on their own in a way that they prefer it also creates more time for the hr professional to have those interactions at this point on zoom call or potentially in person that you really can't leverage technology debt to undertake so long winded answer but the few different aspects therefore you nuts as a cruiser which i am working space. This is something. I wish should come across a little bit earlier. Because we've been faced with huge challenges as a recruitment firm here trying to on board people remotely during the pandemic particularly at the height of the real lockdown close s. I mean. I can think of one head of. Hr that we placed in a huge global pharma company. Where she was she had about thirty two people reporting in hadn't met any of them and it was a real challenge trying to get laptop center. Set out trying to get security protocols in place and neither we which i hate to admit but it's true we're ready in other words the client we're talking about a huge business as well so i think it's really interesting because i get i get come across loads of different types of hr technology that are impacting. The market all seems do different things but your technology really stood out for me. Because i've personally even though i'm not an hr professional model cooter. I've been faced with some of the challenges. The all software actually solves. But i've come across these challenges as a result of the unfortunate pandemic that we all face the minute but obviously you must have been ahead of the curve. Hey because you were able to identify some of these challenges way before the pandemic to get this even off the ground. So what was it that really inspired you to create work in the first place and what kind of challenges were behind that inspiration. Yeah well you know as a charity was really coming from the trenches in this last company. That i started. I was experiencing the challenge in that case of hiring contingent workforce so a workforce that was part time or seasonal or temporary or contract workers. And i found that most of the other solutions out. There were really focused on much more of a traditional employees. Somebody who came in one time stayed with the company for many years and my employees Potentially hiring them two or three times in a single year for different engagements and it was just such a different sort of solution. I was looking for so. I talked to my colleagues and i found that are pain points. Were very very similar. And so initially brought four companies together and we customer funded the first solution. We all put in some dollars. We built an alpha product. We ran a thousand employees through it. We went through three regulatory audits and it performed extremely well. Everyone else felt the same and felt like it was just a huge step forward So at that point. I jumped from the ceo of that other company onto founding ceo. Over here in hop taken forward since testing them as hopefully people picked it up manager. David bell mentioned again. You not afraid of talent but you've got a real adventure spirit with some of the other work involved in what to find out a minute. Someone who spotted this challenge early on. Benny created what which is great. I would love to know in just a moment some in a way you think that the future of the industry going what trends we should start to see nature landscape. But before we do. Because i'm a huge outbound adventurous myself. I love getting out there doing adventure races and mountain. I'll tell you a little bit about how you manage to marry your your technical wizardry if you like and see over some very very successful firms of twenty six million dollars in capital with your adventurous side because you have a huge role to play in them in american camps and leading outbound activity centers and things and tell us a little bit more about that. I have a big smile face just even responding to that question because you know i feel like Especially when a when a mentoring young companies young professionals often people are asking about kind of what is the quote unquote of air quotes. Right now the right path to pursue and. I have just always been an advocate of pursuing the path of passion and that passion. A tends to create. At least for me. I think for many people Incredible work products but more importantly incredible engagement in lift. And i think that if you're working in areas that you're engaged you're lifted you're working in your unique ability. The success kind of naturally follows. It's less about setting out to bill that accompany of a certain size and more. You know seeing what the needs are in seeing what the the personal journey looks like it. Kind of following that forward so i feel really blessed to be able to have taken this path. That seemed circuitous. I spent a lot of time in the outdoor industry. And then i was working adventure capitalism in i was doing tech startups and they seem so unrelated and now over time when i when i'm able to look back it feels like that it took a long time for some of these circles to reconnect but But they all have you know people who have met in and projects that have started they all have come full circle to really make gut says in the in the longer view of life so i still have this passion for the outdoors pandemic even leading a tech company here has offered a great opportunity because mike mike grown adult children's have been home and a beginning out in the outdoors with a got out a multi pitch climb with by younger daughter. This last weekend in have spent a lot of time in the mountains My wife in mike adult kids again. So it certainly cannot lifelong passion that tends to have such relevance in entrepreneurial journey as well now from testing grace grace reloaded of peace table. I'm gonna ask one more question. Because i took last week or first four days off work since the pandemic began has been on an hr professionals out there working around the clock sometimes working home. You do even more hours because you laptops always accessible and sometimes it can be difficult to switch off but i found genuinely the last four days i took off and went into more in the uk which is area of natural beauty. Went world swimming. We went paddleboarding down dr all these ventures things and i find it just gives you a huge clarity of thought clears the mind really good for mental health. I wonder if of connectivities that you've been doing whether i guess you can give some example. Maybe an example of way. Have some of your ideas come from some activity than the events in clermont county. Thought they'd be able to work together. Ever been an. You've come up with a great idea. That's been relevant light. Worked like you've been out. Maybe pitching a climb. You're going to know what would work and i absolutely. Yeah yeah. I mean. I think a couple things i've seen come from my time in the outdoors I actually spent a lotta time in the in the u. k. Used to work for outward bound ullswater way back in the day instead of much time around the region there as well but You know the two things that. I get from my time in the outdoors and i'll just listeners. Say that this is a i think important to think about. Metaphorically what is your time in the outdoors may be physically in the outdoors. It may be doing something physical indoors. It might be meditation. It might be something else. But what is this area that you find solace but for me. The two things that i get one is clarity and so every morning i try and get out for a hike bike. Climb run something like that and it really does provide clarity spot in in the projects that are at hand and often those synapses connect in. I'm able to figure out something or something something through that. That is more difficult. If i'm sitting in front of a computer screen and the other one is inspiration. And when i think about the bigger adventures of had across my life they truly have been foundational in who i am and where i am on my entrepreneurial journey and you know one point just as an example just looking all the way back to when i was sixteen years old i had i was introduced to climbing opportunity to work with an instructor in yosemite this incredible National parks in california in the united states. And i remember you know. Being a a a pretty young kid at that point being the first time in yosemite and he bringing the into brought me into yosemite valley and This monolith of rock el capitan stood before us and i was literally in awe. And so dave you know come on. Let's go to sit in the meadow below el capitan and we sat down and then he started to point out. The climbers up on on l. cap. And i was even more amazed by the scale and that the scope of not only adventure but just the denver that they were on and as we were sitting there. A couple of climbers came by us. That were clearly Coming off of l. cap and he him in a conversation he said hey over you guys on and they said we run the knows the screwed straight up the middle and He said how do you go and he goes. Well you know it didn't. It didn't really go as planned in. We ended up bailing off after about three days. It just kinda got boring. You know it just like it was really repetitive. We decided to head on down and he kind of nodded his head. He said yep you have syria and they continue to engage for molin than they walked on and then we sat there in silence ramona and then he looked at me for second. He goes dave at some point. You're going to be on that slab of rock. You know and i think it'll be sooner before later he goes. There's gonna be a thousand reasons to turn around and be one reason to continue up to the top and that is your commitment in. Just remember that when you're on that and in the moment it didn't really sink in you know i kind of heard it filed away somewhere in my mind but and half years later sure enough. I was on that climb. I was you know a day and a half up. A storm moved in and i was like what time to bail off and almost like a cheer on my shoulder. I heard his voice. Say there's only one reason to continue and that is your commitment and we doubled down. We hunkered down through the storm. We continued onto the top. I look back to that. Experience often as inspiration my entrepreneurial journey because it is truly about commitment that is the thing that that determines so often if a company makes it or fails it is truly just the commitment of the team around the table so yet again the two things i find in the outdoors is clarity and inspiration encourage all of you to find whatever it is in your life that gives you those two things. I want them town. Gala went off piece. I love that story. Really bring back privet back. What all right. We'll talk about outdoors forever. And i'll lose elise melissa something. I'm passionate about talking about the hr technological landscape them. You were able to see some of the challenges early doors until tells what people might experience but by developing work which obviously gives entrepreneurs promotes on boarding software for clients. What china's do you think we got to see going forward that. Nhl what should we stop. Predicting is going to happen in the future. Yeah so you know. Hr professionals are in a tough spot Because in general and in. I i hope your listeners. Find this to be kind of ring true for them. There's two very different things that are asked from all of us. As hr professionals one thing is to be conservative and reliable Because we want you know as a company companies wanna count on. Hr and know that everything is ticked tied in in place and and kind of in some ways risk averse but on the flip side the the c. suite and leadership in companies are looking for hr to be strategic and forward in focused on roi return on investment and and and willing to in some ways. Take some risk and those two things are very much in juxtaposition with each other. And so when i talked to. Hr professionals often. They feel that push pull both directions. And so i would say when we're talking about trends in we'll talk about a couple of 'em seeing there. I do think that as hr professionals the thing to think about is how do you incorporate both of those into your work that That commitment to stability and security of data when you think about all the trust that your workers are placing you to safeguard their data and information. That is a high level of trust in a great responsibility. But you also to the balance that with the with the need to be thinking kind of from a top down view and take into account new trends and directions and decide deliberately what to incorporate into your hr field. I think the key that is to be able to communicate to comprehend and then communicate the potential risks and rewards of following new trends early versus late to when you see them coming on and decide with your leadership team which are the right things to lean into. And so that's a different. It's a different formula for for each company. Just depending on how conservative or risk oriented. You are all sorts of things between a as far as trends that we're seeing. There's of course a lot that that people are talking about. Artificial intelligence is one of them and artificial intelligence is something for example that we built in to a latest feature release from from work bright which allows when employees are uploading documents such as at a passport or identification card. We use a. I do a couple things. One is to extract all the data into it off of it into the system so that the worker doesn't have to cheat in the information but the others to run about twenty different fraud invalidity check so it's looking at the watermark and the hologram and all of those sorts of things to determine if if those identification sir valid. That's a great thing to think about as an hr manager of a good use of a. I because it's doing something that you could do. You could become an expert in education and knowing all the nuances of fake in real wide. But that's probably not where you want to spend your time know really Most hr professionals wanna be were strategic and more people oriented than down in the weeds of really a having to to to understand the nuances of a fraudulent identification for example. So when thinking about something artificial intelligence. And i hear many. Hr professionals expressed severe trepidation. They're like oh gosh is gonna take my job and i would say relax. No a is not going to take your job. Ideally it's going to take away the parts that you hate about your job and that's the place to look for solutions that incorporate ai to to remove those things that are at the bottom of your list of things that you find the least enjoyable like target those two to leverage and then hold onto with a very tight grasp of those things that are in your unique ability those things that you have an incredible level of expertise A thirst for continued learning. But most important those things give you more energy than they take. Those are things not to to look for technology to automate but to really hold onto for your personal development and for your company's best use of who you are so hey i certainly one of the things being talked a lot about in the industry and i encourage folks to kind of be discerning in choosing those things that can be best used for that up another one that i'll just say personally evangelist for And this might be a little bit shocking to some. But it's the elimination of the form. And i don't just mean the elimination of paper. But i mean the elimination of the form and hr professionals. We all have tried this romantic relationship with the form. It's kind of our our currency in the hr profession. It's like fill this out and give it back to me you know and and that's gonna Cut our teeth odd and yet when we think about what. Our jobs are as as professionals. It's really to make sure we know the person that we're talking to is. Who they say they are to collect a bunch of information from them and to have them say that this information is true and then to take that information and put it in different places in payroll or to government systems or things like that in this idea form is is still really just an abstraction. It's a way that we like to look at the data but in the long run i would say it's going to be less and less comment that were dependent on rendering things on warm or saving them as a pdf. And it's really going to be more About what information needs to move from place to place and that's going to release a lot more efficiency in our systems fantastic say not connected that any better. I heartily agree on me i think. Hr professionals need some of that tall. Some of the tasks to be automated so they can spend more time in delivering strategic value. And i think i think if you surmise that perfectly. I think one thing i would add is is. Hr professionals can really add value because they come contextualized problems. Let this that assistance. Do automated tasks of as you say identifying. What are some things black hawaii. And really the these. The human brain power to contextualized populist to value. And i think is going to be a revolutionary in a good way for the hr professional. Because it's it's screaming out for that overworked anyway so they can free up some time to really spoke us. Their efforts are more segic. Toss in moving forward. I think it's going to be real positive topic you some way. They must better than it's got. Ask the question. Coley agree quite relevant in our markets over here in the uk. There's a lot of conversation about the gig economy at the moment. We've got thirty five legislation which has been delayed by year but it certainly been a hot topic pre pandemic. How do you think the gig economy is going to reshape. The modern workforce while i mean that is such a It's a broad question. You know and the gig economy. It's not only going to it. It it already has in the gig. Economy again is something. Broadly conceived as those folks who I would say anyone who doesn't have that. Traditional single employer long-term work relationship. It's those who are working on an app based Sort of a company but those are also employees who are working as contractors and choosing to kind of create their own gigs or say so in the united states right. Now about forty percent of employment is contingent and so it's a little bit broader than gig. It's not just at base but part time seasonal contract temporary all folks fall into that. That's a huge huge part of the economy. And really the shaping that is happening here is you know you just gotta step back and look at the macro landscape. Which is that. People are choosing to create their livelihood in many different ways and the gig. Economy helps facilitate that in a big way because it allows Let's say the speaking specifically around app based solutions It enables employees to a worker to spin up a short term engagement to fill a gap and to really deliver that on demand to themselves into their family as economies are concerned and when we talk to workers who are non traditional in the past the largest stress the had is knowing what comes next If they're working seasonal jobs you know figuring out what the next seasonal job is and by the you know the gig economy coming up in its popularity and it's accessibility. It gives almost an immediate gap filler for folks who don't find themselves immediately engaged have tomorrow or the next week or the next month available in one plug into something so from a worker facing side. It's it's a revolution that folks are not going back from. It might not be that people stay forever in the gig economy but it is gonna be the punctuation mark. it'll be the comma between careers or the space between Other longer engagements that that people turn to more and more fluidly and frequently from an employer side by this were the huge opportunity exists in you know in two thousand and eight. In the united states we had such incredible economic downturn and there were so many fulltime workers who lost their jobs in in general what we saw was employers did not hire back up after the economic collapse of two thousand eight all of the same fulltime workers as they had before they were looking for greater flexibility and so they back filled with a with a contingent in gig workforce in many of those cases and that was really where we start to see the gig economy start to start to take off all and those employers that have used this tool to its greatest benefit. Those are the ones who are on the cutting edge of this right now and really what that means. Is you know when you look at the potential hiring a full-time worker versus a contract worker. A gig worker in allows you to much for specifically go after the skill set that you are looking for and to have a lower level of commitment when working with a gig or a contingent worker so instead of hiring a generalist who can do a bunch of things. Let's use it Weird analogy building a house hiring somebody who can build the whole house. You're able to hire somebody who can just do framing and just do plumbing and just the electric And then throttled them up in throttle down when you need. Don't need them. And the companies that learn to work in that ecosystem. Well those are the ones that have incredible success Because those are the ones that are able to align their cost structure it very much with the demand on the other side of their business and traditionally a fulltime workforce is something. That's very difficult to throttle up in down. So that's just say you're talking about it for a few minutes but a few of the changes are advantages. I see both sides of that definitely makes sense. I think we're seeing the same trend for my perspective as a recruiter in this space in the south west by says well you know. They used to be not long ago. A few years back everyone was into these integrated packages that everything is all in one solutions. It right now. I think there's been a real change of heart people looking for best in class software. That all kind of integrates with each other and that's been a shift. It's a bit like that house. And i gave before while the have and especially its absence reporting all specialist ramon on boarding toilet all these different bits that feed into one integrated solution as opposed to something that does choice do everything and be to use the phrase in the uk. Oh jack of all trades master of none which happens. We're seeing a big shift in outside. Have you ever asked yourself. How can any recruiter understand my h- hr recruitment challenges. Please don't give up on your hiring challenges just yet terret. jj h- hr recruitment. We appreciate the difficulties associated with attracting recruiting and retaining top human resources talent. We also understand just how closely a higher can be. Jj hr recruitment with light to partner with you to help you overcome your hiring challenges contacted today on a one seven two seven eight hundred three seven seven or visit jj recruitment dot com to find out more. One thing that i'd like to ask you presumably. This is something you've had to consider in developing of your software and a it because only a few weeks ago. We saw a huge ransomware attack on garment which is probably brand. That's close to my heart. Probably broncos yours outdoor orange and it's one of those brands you don't expect to get hit because they're so big you know behemoth brands. You always going to be protected. But i think when it comes to hr when it comes to recruitment why do as well and pay a louis things things like security and privacy are areas which we sometimes see other departments are looking after because it's a difficult thing. Look after we leave it with we it with some but as we start bringing in all these different solutions i do think that security and privacy has become more of an element that hr freshly start considering right now. So i'm not snow. Your your view on on how you see. Security privacy evolving within human resources absolutely. Well it is that we must wear and it is one that all of us need to kind of understand more thoroughly so that we can you know in a smart manner make decisions that are protecting that that safeguarding of information. That workers have presented to us so it is. It is of our responsibility to to learn the basics about security so that we understand the landscape that were you know that we're operating within when we look at employers that are creating remote onboarding solutions in again. People are doing a lot of different things. They're often creating their own homegrown solutions. Initially what we see companies do when faced with an immediate need to remote onboarding is a just do on boarding via email so they email pedia ormes. They ask employees to download them. Fill them out in e mail them back. And i i i had folks for being scrappy and looking for immediate solutions on how to get the job dot and that's really what it comes down to but i highly encourage folks to to turn away from e As an acceptable solution because of its security vulnerabilities. And as we all know you sent email unless you're delivered about it that email is is kept in your sent email box when the employee fills this form out with all of their sensitive information all their bank account information And then sends it back to you. It lives in their sent. Mail and those then become vulnerabilities that email account is hacked in the future on an individual level like you as an individual. Hr manager if your email you know username. And password is access seventy gets in and they do a search in your sent may help for direct deposit in all of your employees direct deposit forms. Come up on that is just. It's unfortunately not a secure choice overall so Can be something people move to pinch. But that's just like the base layer of really kind of think about the long term consequences of that so when you are thinking about security in the system whether again you're looking to create something on your own or you something like work bride or another solution out there. You really do want to be asking the security questions to understand kind of how they are safeguarding. The information if their gdp are compliant if they're sock to compliant the types of things that will allow you to best assess this solutions. And and really you know when i when i said that we need to kind of learn the basics about security we can't cyber security experts it really is understanding kind of what are the certifications out. There what is appropriate for the size and type of company that i'm working with as well as the type of information that the company has so just to give you one example of as hr professional trying to use the right tool for the right job if you're choosing an ats. An applicant tracking system. Security might be less important because the data that is in at. Ats typically doesn't include financial information in sensitive information. It's more pre employment information in some interview questions whereas if you're choosing an on boarding solution where employees are submitting again all of this financial information. Your security bar should be materially higher on that so again it just kind of understanding have landscape works and trying to ask the right questions not perfect. I've actually helped me scribbling away. You making a note. I need to check my sent items and clear that down unclear. Skin is on that right after the laser enough time for me to clear that dan would be the only one i wanna. I wanna bring it back full circle. Let's go back to remote and decentralized teams because his myself even my business. jj recruitment we've now got people working from home. It's been adjustment for me. Just leaders out there. That are trying to get used to the new ways of working. How would you recommend organizations go about building and supporting a successful remote will decentralize team. Yeah boy again. A multifaceted question overall. So the i'll talk about the things just kind of for my professional knowledge as well as for my direct experience over the last several months the last four employees higher here work bright. We have recruited interviewed hired on boarded oriented and the begun working in and none of us have at any of them. And so it's certainly the case that this is true with many many employers out there overall as far as best there are a lot of different things to think about. So first of all you know on boarding. I know it's what we do in and At work right. And it's certainly one of the motivators for the call here but from an employer and employee perspective. I almost want on boarding to disappear. I want the friction to be removed so that it is easy for that employee to get done And it is something that is a well oiled machine for the employer that they don't have to worry about it because there are so many other aspects of having this remote workforce that do require extra elbow grease so i would just say. Make sure you have a great technical on boarding system of something like work right or otherwise and then the things to really think about this on boarding process are those things that made you a great employer a great. Hr person in a real world situation so go back and think about those experiences you've had as hr professional or as a recruiter that you found were the best practices those things that you saw an employee. A worker laid up with delight. You saw them inspired by learning about the vision of a company or uplifted because they had a human connection in they were. They were meeting a colleague that they could tell was going to be a friend or they were open hearted when sharing their background with other employees. Whatever it may be you gotta look back across your personal experience and think about those things that you know. Make a great human resource experience. And when i say Human resource experience. I'm thinking about not only hiring somebody but retaining that person going forward and then think about how to create those in a digital world and double down on them. Double down on them There there is no exact answer for folks but what we're seeing is that managing remote workforce's requires additional communication above. And beyond. what you would have. It requires in increased level on cultural onboarding. Those deliberate efforts you make to connect employees with each other and to connect them with management and leadership and then it demands in ongoing focus on checking in and mental. Health of your workforce and. This is something that i would say. By and large companies are falling down on the. They're they're hiring people. They're they're taking their traditional in office organization in moving it online but then they're not checking in enough going forward. They're not continually assessing. The emotional mental health of their employees and pandemic is hard on people. You know we all know that we're all moving through this and it's it's probably going to be here for a bit longer and so i'm thinking about specifically those employees on both ends of the spectrum. Some that might be living alone and really are socially isolated and typically they would be in a physical work office for their social connection and they aren't getting that think about checking in with them also think about workers with a large family and lots of kids at home that they're struggling to provide a home schooling or online educational support. And they don't have a a private workspace or anything like that. They're also struggling. So in general. I would say the theme is think about what you've done well in the past what's worked. Recreate that in the digital world and then turn up the volume fantastic. You've helped me. That seem to be all these multifaceted questions. The media balls my next one already. Which is what are some of the challenges cubans he prepared for. But i think we've covered up. We've covered that brilliantly. So i'm gonna finish this with this last question because it's something close to my heart. I know stephanie. Close to the professionals out there that keen to attract new talent that brands but also to retain it you mentioned retention in that last answer there so finish david. What's your views on. How can and with remote working in mind. How can they can use remote technology to increase retention to improve job satisfaction and also to improve the attraction for a brand. Yeah absolutely so we already know that. A good onboarding technology is a positive new were experience like in in serving workin and focus. Group work me learned the they prefer it because again. They don't enjoy in general coming in that first day of work and having their first experience being either left alone or one one in room and going through a ream of paper so by moving this experience something that they could do on their own time. It's certainly creates a more positive experience at the very start and each one of these little experiences when hiring a new employee is very much about whether they're going to stay around for the long run each experience that you put together as a building block of them learning about the whole picture of your company and an overall what it looks like now. The thing that i will say is a key. And i'm sure you know this nick from your recruiting background as well as far as retention in a position is concerned is alignment of expectations. We learned this over and over so the more incoming workers understand and are aligned with the expectations of the position of the company. And they understand what that position is gonna look like the more likely. They are to make a deliberate decision and stay around for the long run now sometimes. This creates a smaller funnel of applicants but doing filtering them out at the front end instead of in their first month two or three work when their then learning about these things so one of the most important things is to be very transparent especially in this remote world be extra transparent about what the work is gonna look like. We encourage you to put together in especially in the remote world a day in the life for particular job where you're interviewing another employee. Who has that position. Or you're putting together just a video of you talking about very transparently what that position is gonna look like on a daily basis and often. I've seen companies try and obv- escape or hide some of the negative aspects of the work. Where some of the more difficult aspects of the work and. I would advocate for being very clear on what those are as well as the best parts. The job up to help people Decide early if this is the right fit for them so that early transparency using whatever tools you have is kind of a a good indicator for employees sticking around for the long run. The other thing is to think about this broad period of on boarding in again. I was talking about the tactical on boarding. When i talk about work right but think about the biggest picture of on boarding lasting all the way through. Let's just say the first ninety days of somebody's employment and so a lot of times folks end the idea of on boarding after their organization and then folks are just often running but to continue a long tail of check ins of expectation management of creating small projects that are going to create success outcomes and creating longer term goals for thirty sixty ninety day marks having a a lot of focus on building relationships with co workers at building relationships with their managers and again. This is one of the things that you have to double down on in a virtual world. Because they're that much harder so something that we've done here for example with deploys in a physical office on those first days or weeks somebody walks around. They meet other employees. They don't have that opportunity in virtual world is much so we facilitate that we create these morning coffees with a new employees to. They have an opportunity to meet every single person in the company so for their first few weeks. They'll have a scheduled time. It just fifteen minutes. Each morning will the will their meet two or three other employees zoom room. They'll all have coffee and will give them one question different question every day to answer as a conversation starter so again just kind of thinking about those things that naturally occur in moving those Digital world fantastic while you've given us so many insights. David thank you so much for joining me. David sickened of course found work. Right if you're interested in one hundred percent remote diesel boarding software streamlines and digitises be honest. The traditional paper heavy cumbersome process of on boarding new employees then i highly recommend go and visit his website which is www dot worked like dot com. David i could speak to you all day. I think by the age of outdoor activities. Thanks for joining me today. Eight to be polka speed an absolute pleasure other any other links. You'd like me to highlight list as well. I think that at work dot com. We have a great blog with remote work recommendations there as well so we're checking out fantastic links linked in profile as well if we want to find out more so thanks again and of course if you are listening to the podcast and you find yourself needing to recruit some top. Hr talent and please give me a call. I'm c. and a here. Jj recruitment you can reach me at nick at j. Recruitment dot com. You'll also find my contact details in the episode notes. Otherwise i'd like to say to you all the cough to your cells and each other. Thanks again for joining me today. We bring you a new episode of at indeed focused. Really take care of yourself and each other all the best. Thank you so much for tuning into hr led podcast with your host nick day ceo of jt recruitment specialist hr recruits. If you need any help with the current hate shaw ellen de vacancy then. Please get in touch with nick. Antecedent all contact details can be found yesterday in the meantime to make sure you never miss a future episode me. Subscribe to the show through any of your favorite posthumous till next time.