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I think you need to vote on that I I. I was actually just googling him in the first things that come up are deeply concerning for those of you that are why maitree mom's house fans. He's the tried out guy and I went and visited his home and it was quite enlightening and bring cameras and we'll check it out Tried out you got to see the real thing Also set setup. You don't want a doctor DOT TV streaming show every week where you can interact and we send out a blast me go live with that and it's been pretty cool interesting show on multiple platforms zone. Whatever you're watching it and we will be there on those afternoons where we do those shows for a couple of hours? It's my privilege to welcome Dr. Venus Nichelino back to the show. Welcome DR V. Thank you for having me and you you said. That's how eloquently. I have a lot of people choke over all the vowels Ravioli. And that name bordering on Hawaiian all right. I mean I like it. I'll take it continents and they made that exactly down kept the V.. In the Noor and those are very very powerful continents. Yes so how his marriage boot camp going It's going We actually have our Finale I believe next next Friday. Thank you thank you for that. Thank you thank you for that. So yeah it's it's it's going I mean it's it was an interesting season as as you know. I always say that you and I live in the same house but you live in the house I live in the garage. You do the more fun stuff and maybe even slightly more legitimate but hey can help your marriage. A- sure you have plenty we do we do for sure for sure. So yeah that's good I. It's been a it's been. How many seasons so the show has been on the air for thirteen seasons? Which is insane I think about it? I have done a housecall with doing addiction. House spell rainy intervention on somebody half of them yes actually a lot I know and then the way reality works. is they carefully. Hide that when you deal with it or or offer later. Whenever it's part of the story are well? You had said it so eloquently the last time I was here which was The production of those shows and what the doctors are on their to-do are consistently running In opposite directions so I find that really stuck with me because I couldn't really figure out what exactly is it. That at times causes me to feel like incredibly uncomfortable uncomfortable. It's so uncomfortable. Yeah yeah because they are undermining. You're you're there because obviously you know people love to see conflict. Navy is boring boring boring to being healthy as boring so I feel healing you on that in a in a very real TV show scripted. Show unreal. I heard of it so I assigned Gary some viewing you. I'm assigning I knew. Just the first episode. You'll have to watch one episode and you'll get a feel for it right away. Yeah and you will be able to recognize many of your staff on that. They're actually actually people represented on the show from your staff heard. I heard that that is the case. It's very even though it's scripted. It's true it's very accurate. Exactly goes a little over the top but but the the basics of it are quite accurate. Yeah yeah so I I always remembered that are our goals are running an opposite direction action right and and you couldn't and that can be okay to appoint right you can just you gotta put certain lines in the sand for the production team and then you and then you on the other hand have to have faith in them that they know how to create things that people wanNA walk. It's across purposes. But but if you don't get is whatever you're trying into would you ever hope to get out get out anyway. So you have to figure out a way to navigate it where you can keep it safe. Do what you need to do them. I am not totally damage your patients and still get maybe they want and even now you bring up a good point about addiction. oftentimes we don't show that I know I. It's I find that fascinating that it's really a topic that people want to stay. Stay away from me come help you yes. I'll just be a Scottish swing swing by just or even do a little lecture about addiction or something and respond to that and then you can go deal with with them once they start spinning seeing them so down for that anything like that thrill. Dr Drew Happy to do it. By the way you can find Dr vs website. It talked to do the number two D. R. V. Doctor and then Dr Underscore V. Underscore tweet is the twitter handle. Is that a new twitter handle. No that's the same but I'm so so impressed with your ability to sail because I don't know people are like what are your interests. I have no clue. Wait cursor fucking awesome. Thanks man so. So what's what's ahead for you. What do you think we're thinking about well? I I love the fact that you're brainstorming coming on the show but what I WANNA do is with my book. The word ice okay. The one Gary was in New York City the Ninety Second Street y Yeah Presentation Yeah it was so let me tell you what would have happened. So Gary Listening. Thank you So what ends up happening is I asked drew to do me a solid and come and talk with me or interview me at the ninety. Second Second Street Y.. Thinking that like I had the main stage like this is Harper Collins were dealing with like a real publishing company so drew says. Oh Oh yes. Of course the Great God. It's going to be so amazing. I'm proud to sing. I'm like thinking about what I'm going to say I'm thinking about it throughout the the I just wanted to go so well I've lay all the way out to New York City drew. Thank God there. we get there and we are in I swear to God the tiniest little classroom and there were people packed. It is eight was a classroom. I got the early show children in that classroom. Four orange blossom things just restate drew from the bottom of my heart. I love you because you made me feel. You helped me feel so good. Good guardless was happening around us vet so I just I would just a weird. They stuck in that low road. Fuck it anyway. It was so beautiful. I remember you were talking to A woman in the front row started crying. It was so powerful so beautiful so So bad advice how to survive and thrive in Asia. Bullshit that I would love to make that into a TV show of all the bags almost could be a moving all the bachelor dykes script. That's true but it also could be almost like I don't know if anybody watches doctors anymore but a better doctors where like you're talking about all the better base you get but then you're like dozen apple a day really keep the doctor away. You know that kind of go through some of the stuff that you talked about a a lot of interesting stuff in an advice. Well now. We'll give all the way we'll give it always but so for example there's one chapter called. You can't love anyone until until you love yourself. What a crock? Shit like and people repeat this horn over and over and by the way I just want to point out why. I think it's important that we stop saying this kind of BS. Because look there was at one point where we thought the world was flat so we revolved our allies run a flat world. We thought bloodletting would help people we thought lobotomies were good. Exactly there's this idea that theories matter how we think and how our worldview is affected by theories matter so if you believe you can't love anyone until you love yourself it's going to affect affect how you see yourself and how you see other people. So the book sets out to scientifically and biologically inform warn. People are these statements true and if they're not true why are they not true and what is really the good advice to that so without giving too much away of the book a little more because there's so many great in there so another one. I don't talk about this one that much I'm I'm I'm I'm glad of the opportunity. Honesty is the best policy. Is We Li- Fifty two times a day so while it might be the best policy. It's not the real policy rain. It's not the honest policy and little little tiny polite light lies make the world go round. You know what I mean just like if I were to tell them. It's great or even like your grandmother. Who gives you that fuzzy sweater every Christmas? You know this is so ugly. I can't stand that like you would never do. That was courtesy. So there's there's a difference between these polite polite. Let's say I don't even like the word lies. I don't even like the word white lies but there's just there's something about helping the world go around the courtesy sort of Greece for the wheel rain and I talk in the book. How people love to hide behind being truthful? I mean it's the worst. I'm just being honest. No you're not it'll be because I'm on it. Yeah no that's actually not true. Just mean you know what I mean. So and that that distance is like oceans apart between being mean and being honest right So people hide behind that so so that's one of my. It's later in the a book but it's a chapter that added because I heard someone saying during all this political stuff timing honesty's the best policy right. Oh ooh take that one down. But I'm working on a second book about all the better base you get with sex. Oh my God the control right so fun. Yeah so fun. I mean that just is an endless supply of endless so yes so so oh my goal would be to have bad advice you know well. And we debunk all this bullshit. You know not we construct the show that thing about this. The shelby people the guests like like real people coming in and talking about the method. We could do man on the street. We do P. Guests coming on on we could have celebrities. It could be me you and maybe one day fired a little bit like give bad advice and people have to call out with the bad advice is what's the worst advice you ever. I'm curious what what POPs in my head is in nineteen eighty four or almost eighty five. I was an intern Doing medical rotations. And I was doing radio one autoweek and I was doing what I thought was community service because the AIDS epidemic was underway. Okay we were just starting to call it AIDS. It was going grids when I started my training and I was dealing with people dying every day just just constantly dying dying nothing we could do and no one was talking to young people about it. I just I I was shocked. I was like we know that you do. You know what they're doing. You got to tell you about what the risks are and so I just did it doing community service once a week. Well they're the newspaper article about him and my residency director found out about it and win freak the fuck out I remember. He called me in his office and yet the article in the La sometimes played out on his desk and he was sitting down and standing up and screaming and pounding. He was spitting on me. He was so upset from across this. Y You you've got to put the content. You're too young to remember this period of history. Young people weren't having sex for as low as I see. Okay you'll talk to young taboo due to young people crazy thank you. They weren't having sex condoms. Were behind the counter with the hypertensive beds. Right you'd have to ask the pharmacist bring Out Your Trojans the term safe sex coin yell just conversation about this at all. I love how you say. I'm too young I will forever thank you for that compliment. Two years away from fifty. Thank you remember this. You are because because it was really on at that time we'd had the sexual revolution the adult who assumed it was just for them. Never imagined a lesson to get married have sex and some people still believe by the way. Some parents are living in complete denial. It's not as bad is was trust me so anyway he was screaming. Something wrong with you. How could you do something like this? What's the matter with you? It's a matter with you. What's the matter with you stop or else was sort of thing and I thought Oh my God my judgment is off this is maybe there's something wrong with me and I gotTa Stop Residency Position and he called me back like a week later and he goes? Look I I just I just wanted to get this advice you're gonNA ruin your career. This is going to ruin your career. Do you understand so you need to stop this. I'm trying to save you from ruining your career. Worst fucking advice to anybody's twenty four years old maybe twenty five years old any twenty five year old should should not be speaking to. If you're my anybody over fifty twenty five dollars should not to be too because now when it comes to career advice because we you can see things when you're in early mid twentieth century the those of us that have moved on. We can't see it we don't see it. It's actually really true. There's a saying and I forget what language but it's basically says that revolutions are started by the young so there's a there's a kind of a adum wisdom that goes along with being in your twenties the energy and then there's a vision. You're seeing things looking from your adolescence into the world as opposed to down from. They don't take any advice from me or drew so we'll listen so when my kids started I just bite my tons figure it out right figured right but that was a deep learning lesson for me about young people and jested this bad advice and you took it for a while I stopped you stopped and I even consulted with attorneys and stuff. What my position should be stuff and I stopped them? Something's wrong with me Six months later it within these things were moving very fast back than you ever really known. This remembered it but within six months all of a sudden there was this tremendous uprising arising from within the medical community. We must be talking about this. Doctors have to talk about the HIV. It's Gug. Everybody is talking about vindicated. Not Not yet not yet so I went. I tiptoed back on the air quietly. Didn't let him articles or anything. I just started doing it again one week and just would do if I was on call or something. I'm GonNa do it I because I just thought it was the right thing to do fast. Forward three years the same residency director. Who made me his chief resident the the three years later maybe essentially ran his program? Three years later came up to me about six months before that moving into that position and said hey still doing that radio show. Oh like like lick. Our conversation never happened and he goes tell you what I'll do it now just you. I'll be the one now. It's fine. I'm ready I'm ready. I thought you fucked foreign my moment give you found your mom moments sure and so I just thought Oh my God. You're you're you're bad. Advice is so legitimate. Not legitimate much much lighter much lighter relationship but that's where the really bad advice usually was more about body hair which is always like weird advice. I suppose what part of the Party and how much hair we're losing. You get right down to it. So Yeah I had a girlfriend Tommy that okay sorry way yeah exactly that this is early twenty s the way to avoid having sex on a first date is that you don't shave your legs or your vaginal area. The sounds like mom. I don't know if he can say Pussy on here. WHATEVER MOM is trying to delegate? It wasn't my mom. Yeah so she was like that's a way to avoid it so you so you'll feel like shame. I suppose from north. I think I think the idea is that will slow the guy down now. I think it's about an show you down like you don't WanNa be freshly groomed. You WanNa be smooth Lou. The presumption is one of two things. Women can't control themselves right right or men are visible creatures so there it was like who is now my husband on the first date. I don't think you to myself. Oh my God. I'm there's no way like I didn't wax I'm a mess. WH- like what's going to happen here and it didn't matter of course not we fucked on I e we don't fucking ever since it didn't matter it didn't matter he's underway it's underway. That was the worst advice. There could have been a wild animal. Could've sprung out. They would it gives her the raccoon. Were good yeah which is which is why your new book will be interesting. Fun knows how many crazy things most people get exactly goes back to what you were talking about really with your bad advice about sex. Sure a afraid need to talk about sex. Fill puritanical society that but it it dovetails into biology biological operation and people just can't get their head around the fact that their biological and so they still kind of magical thinking about biology and so they love folk tales and folk wisdom and folk whatever and so they they'd prefer that to you just basic biological studies major. I find deeply disturbing the ruin event. Could you say it's religion that's it that's all that's all in there right so morality religion and ethics human behavior and guilt. You get right down to it Symphonia for how did we get into this topic. But I'M GONNA go. which is that when you think about the history of the human being throughout human history history until about fifty years ago think about that? The entirety of the human experience throughout history until fifty years ago sex meant and pregnancy pregnancy meant death at least thirty percent of the time. If it didn't mean pregnancy and death it meant an S. T. D. and pelvic inflammatory clamato disease meant death Infection meant death. There was nothing that you'd get your anyway. Nothing nothing so everything about sex and you're a inherent and you know the power that drive and you know of this child gets going with it di- Not only we're GONNA have a child that our hands her for eighteen years this woman but this growth could dive scary scary gotta make it seem. Just him and weird. We'll give it weird names venereal disease as did name. We're we're the were they come up with that Venal Venal what's that venereal. Because we only in the modern era I started calling it sexually transmitted disease. So these are I really believe. That's where a lot of weird stuff that we have. Culturally is take care kits because we didn't know how to shape their behavior throughout much of history And the things that resulted from improper shaping of the behavior and we're really really dangerous. Yeah for most of human history got a loved one. You Mann's blamed things to me. You're so sexy thank you Venus. Which means I I knew that was then? I knew that was going to happen. I was hoping that he forgot about it. Dan at Gerry. He's always on it. Gary does not forget us me of not listening the Astros. Are you listening always listening. So that's I can't wait to get that book that's GonNa be good fun Are you gonNa like you like call together you and Emily Morris show. I'm going on her show next month actual gate when you go on. Ask for advice. Yeah Yeah exactly exactly so. That'll be fun to write And I I I loved the creative process of actually actually writing I'm able to my daughter right now. Oh do tell. It's about consent for young adolescents. Apparently it's great need huge need and We are trying to pull consent away from the medical legal jargon and out of the Hostel Camp Jargon and into into how do you just have empathic relations with good boundaries and though yourself and listen to the person and guess what if you do you'll be you'll make good choices you're good consent Sort of building it up that one thing. You're not drunk yet. There's no consent when you're I I. Would you know. I'm sorta hard core on that. Maybe maybe a glass Sawai but beyond that. I'm not sure we're talking about consent anymore. Because we're altered Seattle altered. It's like no. That's Yeah Yep you don't know that thou like like making it making it less hostile. Gather it's more relational. It's a lot of the stuff I look at. Yes it's exactly what it'd be relational in about healthy relations nations and less about on pest because yeah because so much of the literature authors. I'm pissed and we've kind of moved past that. I don't want to say that I do not. It was quote me on that. I'm not saying the this isn't necessarily a need and an important conversation but to remain just in these pissed zones not necessarily moving forward. Yeah it needed to be loud mid needed h fall in needed that and now it's like okay. How can we really deal with this issue? And it's GonNa stay angry for a long time because I'll tell you what I used to go around. I don't think I talked about any of this. And we were Nice. Second Street Y.. But I used to go around and give talks colleges and I was just always challenging the hookup culture thing because there was all this data that showed women were very unhappy unhappy with it that they perceive their social choices in college. Life throughout the land as random. Hook up Friends with benefits. It's or There was one o- or a boyfriend girlfriend That's it those your three choices. Nothing else and they were very unsatisfied with all all the choices but the organizing experience was hooking up and so I said well of hooking up so an end the one piece of data that was omnipresent was when somebody engaged in a random hook up there always loaded one hundred percent So my question the audience would always be. That's the organizing experience of your college college life. Why don't you fucked up to man? Why do you have to fight up gary wine? College fucked up to go to a hookah. Random hookup confidence. Do you mean another other words for that. That's what I always hear. Things like this but inhibited produce rings. I'd turn yeah. It's really really want to do this. But Man Matt a tall order. I can hurt somebody hurt myself. I could is anxiety reject anxious. There's also the social factor that we just talking about a random hookup. God like thank. You would be seen for women as well so so. That's God's whatever so the men but they do not worry. They're concerned was this is a taller. Makes me anxious and I'll l. call ups helps me deal so I would always give to give them to talk first and then we'll go okay. Ladies you've heard the men all of them what are you. What are you drinking for? Silence silence not a hand. Goes up now. The hand goes up eventually and goes beer goggles right. Okay got it on your good luck. Burger got it but still room with silence and inevitably right in the front third audiences always distribute themselves in really interesting way. It's always the front third there in the center of the room. Always any sense Gary I guess what I would hear grow would always have very coyly go. I don't know if it'd be the first thing but I would. To of DOC review was saying earlier about how you can be perceived. That's a bit of a get a job. You get a little bit of that sometimes. Sometimes get some women going. Oh I can blame the the blame of Vigo. Did I hear that he the guys they need something to blame some white. Why do you have been blamed something against silence? They don't WanNa talk. They're all ashamed. And and then we'll go goes. I make sure I drink so when this thing happens. I don't have any feelings every room I've ever spoken to throughout the country. That comes at me within about three minutes of asking the women in the room they answer is that's devastating. That's sad it is. Yeah and I'd be pissed if I woke up from that now which I think what's happening right. So they're like what I've been putting up with putting up essentially with rape because I at my of course their past. Yeah of course and so. I didn't know I used to try to bring it out and we could. Do you know what would be better. And then the same same. So I'd I'd go guys this familiar there now. The guys go silent like this is stunning information and I go so ladies. What could we if we had a clean slate? I could create a social order. That was to your liking what would I do. I just have infant powers. I can do it now and again. Silence then one hand goes up our wished guy with just sit and listen to talk with me talking to a Saxon you talking about always and then the chorus would come in. Yes they would assume. Listen listen to talk and exchange and I would just point out to them I go yes. We used to call that a date. It's called date so you would like to date. You would like to uh-huh and I go. How about you split a meal crazy? Talk Crazy and then I would point out to them all this. Fm I research that shows that males ails you. Can you activate appetite appetite of desire with visual imagery. They want what they say doesn't work that way with about eighty nine women women. You activate appetite appetites desires with intimate conversation. Well I just want to tell you that there is an amazing book that you would love. And it's by Dr Wednesday today Martin and it's called untrue and it it debunks all of this shitty research done on Really Gender relations about what women want about what men want One of those is that Men Are not as monogamous is women which is not true actually women want want novelty. Yes women wind Too many one partner in need of repair like marriage is an institution made by Chinaman forming it works for men and historically true. I'm not sure that's true that's true. Well that's apologised Lionel Tiger Woods who is a famous mischaracterize anthropologists would say no. That's that's to keep you around to provide while they need the safety of child rearing phenomenon. He's a man it's vulnerability ability but marriage ultimately is an institution made by men for men for men to the extent that men were charged. That necessarily true yes so so on. Every quality of life measure men's Quality Blake when they're married goes up they have more sex in their single counterparts They get paid more more They're just happier. They live longer for women. It's the exact opposite so I think today some of the issues that is challenging alleging in twenty twenty soon to be is how do we make marriage appealing for women. Because I can't tell you drew. How many times? I hear a woman tell me that she's working full-time she's doing the laundry. She's taking care of the kids. She's doing the shopping she's doing everything of America should be doing that letter. Settle Too. Well I mean there are when you're living with someone. There needs to be the point that I'm getting at. Is that under the house. There is still huge. Ism Man that sexism where and I noticed it. I live in incredibly liberal house. Okay my my. My husband is amazing but I took notice that over the Thanksgiving holiday. Everyone who had a vagina was in the kitchen. No dicks were there. All the Vaginas were there and that too and I live in home. We're it's incredibly. You know I talk about this kind of thing all the time so my husband's husband's very aware would it have been uncomfortable for the women in the kitchen of a male suddenly join them. I think they would appreciate it. I don't think men know that and women even find men very sexy. who were who are taking part in household chores? And that's been shown a lot so I question question a lot of the research that has been done on women and men because most of that research is done by men so is functional right data. So I think that that you would love this book. It's called untroubled Wednesday Martin. She scored the functional. MRI data which is just some just numbers. It says no men or women men and women on the team that are that are evaluating the numbers of course But it absolutely mirrored. What I saw in every single room in every single part of the country for years and years and I think that's because women are conditioned that in order to have sex they have to feel emotional about it they have to? They'd been conditioned but it needs to be intimate. I don't necessarily early. No if that's actually true. I think it's conditioning so I mean you hear it when you talk to him privately and you're their private stories Sometimes sometimes they just want to have sex. They don't want to have a conversation they don't WanNa Talk Ra. They actually turned into what we perceived as masculine qualities so. I just think it's interesting around different different times. If in some different different around different people yeah for sure sure anyway if I find that ah the research. The newer research fascinating in terms of gender. And what what is true. And what isn't true Panella Now speak about grew two thousand before good Courses powerful antioxidant. It may be useful disease prevention aging bad habits. All things were grew to Thailand levels decrease leaving US exposed glucose. Wellness is an innovative supplement containing good thion but vitamin C. and zinc as well. He's been largely ignored as an important supplement. It's all designed to raise the final levels and boost your immune system and hopefully improve overall. Health Glucose is a unique liquid. Formula is four hundred milligrams of Glutathione Plus Vitamin C.. Zinc as I mentioned. Here's what I want. I want you to do. I want you to go to glue. DOSE DOT COM jail. UTA does dot com slash Dr Drew Dr. Jerry W use Promo Code. Dr Drew Five and one more time. 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When I'm working out I mean it's a perfect time to her when I'm driving? I mean I I like double dual tasking until it makes great. Use my time things like well Sapienze a brief history of humankind thinking fast and slow Dang Oh countable Katamon I mean these are great books and they are complicated. They take a long time to read but not with blankets and right now. Blankets has a special offer for just our audience go to blankets dot com slash drew to start your seven day trial and get twenty five percent off blankets premium membership. That is blinking spelled B. L. I. N. K. I S. NOT BLEAKEST DOT com slash. True to get that twenty five percent off and seven day free trial bleakest dot com slash drew. Do it now and it's still. It's still for the most part the same data just being reinterpreted which is fine which is good so we've got to do a book on that. Well it's already been written. You should read. It was a bunch of the. There's a ton of them because I'm booker. met with my daughter it and she's a gender everything. Fender fat feminists seven. We're reading all kinds of stuff And the gender zone and Most of the science that I have found that she's throwing me as the universally the definition the reason we should have certain interpretations of the the data most of the science is very bad It's I'm looking for good science. Oh great yeah so we'll find it. Good there's a podcast I will listen to me. I think it's called in court not enquiring minds. And she did she's really a great scientist. Enquiring interim folks thoughts conscious. She's unbelievable crowds rationally. Speaking Rashly. Speaking and she's she's a she's a well trained scientist and she's constantly constantly like wait. A minute these. These positions are built on bad signs on CD bunking staff so rashly. Speaking is a very good episode of good podcast interested in that stuff. Yeah I love podcast crazy and they only really listen to yours. That's GonNa the answer I don't really. I don't watch any television and so I do like listening to things because I feel like it's it's more imaginative But I'm a big reader. I love reading I have over ten thousand books. Crest historian now is a lot just got done reading this book that I absolutely loved Amazon. No you it's so good and then I am now. I'm reading out such a strange name. But it's about raising boys and boys and they're teenagers and let me see what else. What are you learning? Have you ever read the omnivores dilemma. Thank you I have that. It's one of my favorite books of all time. I read it it probably every year go. Well that's cool. Is that Michael Pollen. Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah. I love his stuff. He's fantastic. Did you read his loosen stuff. I'm reading that now. I have to put it down though it's not for me. It doesn't feel like a easy breezy. Read like it isn't a take on the beach. You you have to really take a good two hours at a time. Like I'm going to read this book. Jerry eight hundred degrees in here. Could you help us again with the with the temperature. Thank you You have a Michael's great writer integrate and he and he. He asks the right questions in that in that particular book and Yeah I'm not sure he has a full lead you to drive your own conclusions. uh-huh which is smart because the data just against silly with we are so behind so many scientific pursuits in particular comes to certain chemicals. Undecided were evil for a long time. Yeah Yeah so I I love to read. I don't really watch a lot of television. I don't really I think that's that's Oh let me tell you I just got done reading. Fugitive pieces which is fiction and it is a meeting with an old book you have to. You just have to read. I want to give it away but it reads is like poetry. It is beautiful and I usually don't breed fiction. I usually such a non fiction reader sort of information seeker But at this is beautiful. Ms Really be petrified away to it. My mother in law. Who passed away? I found it in my drawer. She you had a note and it was like Oh my God. Wow that's amazing about lake. Sure giving you a message from the army. Well not one of those. I don't think like that but it felt missile beautiful to to open the book and read that. Wow like she gave me like such a gift and it's such a beautiful book so anyway fugitive pieces if it for for for your for your fiction Gary. That's coming out is sending me all these links. Looks like they made a movie out of that one. A unreal movie. God a big one but in two thousand seven. He don't do people actually go out and seek information anymore or do you feel like they do in podcasting worlds. I feel it's a sort of how they they like getting a little passively. I think we're not art. Good readers anymore for the most part Yeah Brennan to become a good reader hallway. Kid Well I love reading. I'm a big reader. I mean and you know unlike like medical school when you get a PhD. You're really you're really stamina on reading and writing at the end of the day that's really what it is So I've always been I've always I'd love to read Even in my blue collar Shitty neighborhood I grew up in Delaware County which is which is On the west edge of Philly. So we were right on the border of sixty-nine Street which is the city And then the Shitty subs after that. But I want to tell you. It's the best place on earth. It is the best place on earth. I cannot tell you so unique and it's so interesting that being third educational pursuits really reportedly exactly. We're never part of that exactly but I just take. My mom introduced me to books because she was a huge reader. And that's all just caught on trivial. I met my husband in New York. City it's not not romantic. It's I was getting my master's degree New York University up. When my undergrad there was there and so it isn't romantic? It isn't like sexy it isn't anything so this is. We met in a bar where that used to be the meeting and dating places for human beings we we met in a bar and You know he tells a story very differently than I do. He says and then I I I just saw her from across across the room and I knew that she would be my life. I just knew it that I was gonNA spend the resume with our men experience that phenomenon on like ten to one over women. Okay so that is true. 'cause I tell the story this way I looked across the room and I said I'm GONNA I can't wait to fuck him. This is going to be amazing. Think we tell the story very differently For for men I talked to another anthropologist who had studied this and she said because she was studying love at first sight and she felt men way more than women have experienced that and she said but really what she's finding is that it was lust at first sight. That worked out that it goes down to the memory. So you're you're actually. Maybe you had the same experience Roy Moore honest about it. Can't fuck his brains out. This is going to be great. Yeah so that's how how we met and You know it was. It's it's interesting because I always described when you meet someone like let's say you're in an airport and I have a red suitcase and that other person red suitcase and you're like Oh my God you have a case taste whiskey. I on this plane together. We would fly somewhere and so you then get into a relationship and you're flying you know wherever you're going across the world and then you're just a nation happens and you open. Put up the luggage and begin to take out all of your baggage and all different. When it's all you know what I mean so I always say that like I? I feel like my husband and my baggage Mesh. You know what I mean like twenty. He would kill me for this. Yeah he's the counter. No Twenty seven twenty two twenty three and so I would argue that scripts people say you know the similar script Yup similar is that you expect marriage similar likes similar to be married. I never wanted to be married or have kids. They were the two best decisions I I never made. He made them. He is a great family. Person and key makes good family choices. I just didn't want to be. I just never saw that for myself after mm-hmm yes yes I was like. Why can't we just live like Goldie Hawn and Kurt Russell like? Why can't we do that? He said well when you have kids. It's a little bit different and Blah Blah Blah. None of that matters. I just sort of was afraid that maybe wouldn't be a good way for a good mother mother the end of the day. I was scared of I think that I watched my parents are still married but they were children when and they got married and my mother never went to high school My father's an auto mechanic they had been married for over fifty something years So Oh like it's well. Actually we see Lord Sicilian fiddler on the roof so I watched them grow up like my mother was sixteen sixteen and a half when she had me like fifteen when she had my sister. So it's a lot so I kind of looked at this and I'm like oh I don't want to have that Matt and I just didn't feel confident in the my my parent's relationship did not look happy to me. So you married then you die. Sort third hour you get married many get unhappy. That's the four motion the life look at how how did you. How did you overcome that? I had a shocking experience at the altar where I was like. Oh my God this is exactly where I want to be this fucking by the said anything bad about this relationship or marriage. Generally this is precisely where I wanna be and then we indicates pretty quick and that's just suggests that we were. We were overnight. You kind of have a little bit of this Gary Ya. We became parents but we were a weird thing. Where I was at the alternate was like fuck? That's Dr drew outstanding. Did their wedding brilliant. You ask for it. I couldn't believe. Have you actually done it. I was like Holy Shit. He we were in the kids quick to. He's so nice really is do you have trouble saying no. Oh Oh yeah yeah I would have said no to say no I thought about how guilty and came back stopping ever seen no however it manifest different kind of time horizons to it. I was at the newer craigslist. Tell you why I liked it because you took care of everything for me. Tribe tried. Yeah so it made it. He made it very easy. That was nice and and it was funny and fun to get to know his family and what they were looking at stuff and think about it. So it's as far as good. You also mentioned something. The last time I was here about codependency and really loved what you said that people love. It is co dependent which is true but I think I was probably talking about enmesh not a measurement so much as fusion That that real intense love a fusion. Right you lose your bowed or you lose your body boundaries you lose your emotional boundaries with that other person but to be able to do hit and still be yourself and be able to move in and out of it lexa bleed easily That's where it becomes the difference between health and not health some people the boundaries stabler. Stabler it all the time. That's very common And that's that's where the co-dependency becomes. Would you describe yourself thought I because he knows Judy Likud officiating. What's getting better at saying? No you getting better when you get older guesses just like kids really. I agree with you just older. And you're like you almost don't have the emotional. You can't please everybody what it's I'm just laughing at myself thinking about. Why one of the things that makes it easier for me is I have have? I had an insane memory when I was throughout my life. Like like like I can remember might the the furniture my room and I was on the wall when I was under two years of age and it was just I just had this crazy memberthon. That's kind of faded so I can say no and not keep thinking about Forget that is true because I would be this. I'm this well. I'm getting better at not ruminating over things as much where I did before Trauma in your because usually that's what set your story off. Yes it does not rehearsing things and you who grew up in trauma to similar you know my mother was a traumatic traumatizing and in what way like emotionally emotionally abusive yelling yelling yelling. I would say that I had never heard yelling like that until I spent time in the locked unit of the psychiatric Patrick Hospital as a as a caretaker. I would occasionally hear people yelling like that. No that's that's suffering from something but my dad was a physician and covered hovered and made sure it didn't get out or who knows what the hell they were doing. Whatever that that generation of physicians had been bad boundaries horrible boundaries? They took it on family members. They didn't they just terrible. My husband's father Was Dr Richard Johnson and he he is one of the I guess I don't like the word founding because it's not doesn't make sense but virology discovered the field of virology in its lobby rule. No Hopkins Soya and he was there sitting chair. I think we're like thirty years or something like that and that is very true. So so what you're saying very similar about they're sort of this bellboy built in a way. Yeah grandiosity in Jerusalem. I remember this and I I I witnessed. We reported this back in those days A physician come do take care of his daughter in a hospital pulling insisting under her pelvic exam himself. Okay because he wouldn't dare have another person toucher. Yeah that wasn't that's kind of crazy. Yeah I just do for sure Tarver seventies yeah so. Are You saying that your dad had this happening that he not yet boundaries because he would take care of family and stuff like that but but he was taking care of my mother in some way and keeping her glued together. It's not good codependent. It's good penalty. Yeah then that too and And then I would you know for sure if he knew what I was absorbed. He wasn't aware that or hobby. Never got exposed to what I what I was supposed to always and my sister thinks I'm just an evil person for being mean my mom for talking for in the other other than glowing way I absorbed all time you can have. You can have complex. Thought could have more than one feeling. You can love someone very mature. Sure memories to in whatever it was that was my experience and so it was like I said I remember the that kind of screaming and yelling that I'd never overseen except in a psychiatric hospital interesting. Do you think that's why you got into the field you're GONNA do. Well I think the it's it's hard to say but in the Adolescent I got interested in adolescent health. Which is what love line was all about because when I was in college at Nineteen I started having panic attacks? Ax and depression really daily panic attacks and I was mismanaged completely for a couple of years and it was suffering and that because there was there was no adolescent health. Didn't exist then there was no experts in the field. No nothing I I remember. I went down to the collegiate as small college New England. I went down to the health center. Something's wrong with me and the doctor looks at me. Some old retired physician was giving his time to the college. You know a couple of days a week looks goes to get your shit together. Take walks in the woods. Just take long walks. I was like if that that would do it. I of course I do that. He can my shit together happily. I I was disabled with panic and depression. Totally mismanage and I thought I'd never want anybody else to through that in their adolescence. They're should be there's there's and clearly even as a LS myself nineteen years old. I could see their unique needs that just nobody was there to me. I love to hear stories about people who get into their field. We're really and they're able to be honest about themselves. You know this happened to me. I want to make sure it doesn't happen again. Like it and I the the psyche getting involved. This addiction medicine was a total fluke and even the psychiatric stuff was kind of a flu. I've just moonlighting during our medical residency and just got more interested in it. I wouldn't say it had the same kind of Dr That adolescent thing did that then really was like I don't everybody goes through that anymore. They there's got to be and the field developed. I thought I want to be part of that. That's an that's an amazing story. I've never heard that before that one before from you know saying listen to your podcast. All the time just never heard that one shooter so and so so anything like that for you I I fell at a very early age. I was this given the flag to problem solve and I think that I grew family. Yes so I think that I Someone the hero someone gives you a flag and you can either take it or not. I don't know but there's different roles that people are calls. I mean families no it it was all done with straight line. We also hero to the family. Come I think that you know the name Venus so so like going back to the name. We've come full circle so we have like. Victoria's the oldest Catherine Danielle Matthew and I'm the second oldest and Venus so in a way it it kind of sets up that you have to be doing something. Why are you on your phone? You're not even listening. I am listening to you because somebody takes me. I'm interviewing yields. Somebody texted W I had to respond fucked up listeners. Just want you to know that. He's on this about him all the time every day. But if I look at my phone he has a Shit Fatso also really oil. While we're going to ship it but I'll call you on it Do you want to hear. The story is okay so at the end of the day I just would. We would sit on the stoop all of our houses connected because we lived in a row homes and it would listen to the women talk about these problems as if they were unsolvable they would talk about these issues and I remember this very young age. I must've been four or five years old. When I was laying? Condom from just relational problems. Money problems but it wasn't and I was obviously as I got got older. I was able to be like. Oh this isn't about that. This is about this but I I never really said anything I just was like these. Problems are solvable. We can solve scar cool and silver. I am and that's really how I got into it like this. This is we can do this. You know and I I really do believe in. I don't think people need more psychologists I think people need more community and friends with you and I and we have you. Did you have come along at a time. When the the cognitive revolution has occurred too so you can can help them solve their problems as community in France They don't need psychologist so I I think that that was my early lesson in like okay. What what am I gonNa do with my life and so I started doing that as a very young age and probably badly and so I decided to do it as a as an older adult? Come to me with Steph too and I think about it in college particular but I I was not the right person. That'd be a good listener. Always well that's and that's what. I think that that is what the job well listen to me anyway. But I that's sometimes is all it takes to solve. A problem is is to be fully lear and lists. We talked about this before it. You know we talked about it than I. Second Street Y.. which is it's fully president? Aware listening with your whole body. uh-huh I remember. I was kind of talking. Well we were talking about porridges die where he talks about how you sent me the article or Gary Hart artem. Here's your ears will adjust jess to the person you love. It's it's the obstacles it's the tiny bones in your ear have to muscles. Attached them in the muscle will adjust so he can get the tone on the property of say. Mom It will tune into Lyrica Tuning in sort of a mechanism and it's connected to our vegas nerve and our nerve is the main outflow from our heart Interest it's fascinating. Your body is this gigantic instrument and we have all these huge plexus of nerves in our gut and our chest and abdomen that we don't know what they're processing they don't know how they they work but we do know a lot of information's coming back And so when you get a feeling a gut feeling or my heart hurts. That's really happening. Yeah that's what that's for feelings feelings come from your body and they are processed in your brain and they are reflected and things in your brain but the real experiences in your body and you can listen with your body. I mean in our Western society eighty. We always sort of chop off our heads from us. Audio cards. Error is is is but you should know that. Now they really the conversation conversation is about the embedded brain. No thank you for man's planning again great band. I'm saying my field data bust your balls. I recognized yeah. But but but that in the in the field of the the the move it's moved to the embedded brain and in the brain is not just embedded in a body. Right right it's embedded with a spinal cord it's better body the body's embedded in a environment and better than a society in an interpersonal context. And so this embedded nece it they take heidegger to his whole. Philosophy was about being in the world that they were sort of a fundamental inability inextricably of being and being in the world. You're born into the world. He called throwing this. You're thrown into the world. You're not floating inspe- even that's being in an environment and You cannot extract the person from the environment in a meaningful way fully. The complexity is amazing. Right you really think yes. Yes we usually don't think about in terms it's now now now Gary you've sat through how many Sean Carroll interviews at at least two or three yeah do you understand why did that his stuff and really interest me as the next layer on this so we're talking about existing as beings in the world in space time in Sean tells the episodes those went win finished talking. is talking about the fact that there's something more fundamental than space in time our space time And that we're all part of were probably more emergent properties of some wave function. That is mine. TASTIC HOT FOR I. Listen I listen to Sean Sean. Carroll he's a Caltech professor and I got his podcast which is called mindscape and I dragged me. Okay let's have at it. So what numbers. Three eighty nine and four zero three and there may be another one coming out soon. Arizona's email them to Dr. Very all. Right listen you said at all I love you I love you love you this except what accepted I accept. EMC ACC access. I accepted except for Dad. Except for you're looking at your phone all the time I get enough of that home. Trust me but here we are so privileged again. Thank you thank you for the New York trip. I really the enjoyed that whole experience. Yeah it was great and even the whole challenge of the classroom and stuff like that everything about it was fun and good and I think and I think ever in that room had an experience. Yeah and I thought that was Kinda cool. Thank you for saying yes anytime. You don't say no Judicata tatum. Marriage and divorce or time. Travel to turn All right but again always a privilege. Checkout marriage would camp reality stars have new episodes Friday at nine on we TV and follow Dr Trevi at d. r. underscored the Tweet and Nausea Mine for Colin Times topics. Follow the show on twitter at Dr Drew. podcast gassed. That's D. R. D. R. E. W. podcast music through. Today's episode can be found on the swing and sounds of the document. PODCAST now available on itunes and while there don't forget to rate the show the Dr Drew. PODCAST is a Corolla digital production and is produced by Chris. Locks on and Gary Smith for more information go to Dr After Drew Dot Com all conversation information exchange during the participation in the doctor of your podcast is intended for educational and entertainment purposes. Only do not confuse this treatment or medical advice or direction. Nothing on these podcasts supplement or supersede the relationship interruption of your medical hair tapers although Dr drew is a licensed physician with specialty certifications by the American Board of Internal Medicine. The American Board of Addiction Medicine is not functioning as a physician in this environment. The same applies to any professionals who may appear on the or Dr Dot Com.