Ally why are you walking us out into the woods. Did you make a raccoon Harem again. No I do not believe ah look we just need to go a little farther into this grove here and Voila. Oh Hey guys. Oh Hey best friend what what. What are you guys doing out here? I had a GPS tracker installed in your hip two days after we met what it's not important but what are are you doing out here. Oh me I'm nothing. Nothing and why are you trying to how to shovel behind your back right now. I could see it. Oh this yup this some Nashoba. Yeah that's the motor Musashi workout. It's all the rage now in that whole back there. Nothing I don't know what Hol- what are you talking about. Let's just go back to studio. We can still go back right now. I get it. It's this week. We're doing Jimmy Hoffa so barren body out here something like a bit to go with Jimmy. That's cool that's cool. Can I touch it touch that. I would also like to touch the by the body that is it guys that is exactly. There's actually nothing in the whole week. We should just go back. Let's just go back what he go back to. What is this sticking out? This looks like an essay. An essay on Fatty arbuckle. Koos August. Though what is that all about Bette are bug zero talking really weird. Were you burying a citation needed script out here about fatty Freddie arbuckle. Maybe I don't know why it doesn't look bad eight. This is funny jokes on page two good story. I I don't know y you're the second half. Oh boy okay I get it now all right let me see that how bad could be. Wow Oh you guys wanna how many Berea barons the whole right here No that's that's us. That's saying Columbine Oh right. Oh God what about that. You're running on a space out here. We need a new spot new. Yeah still think we should have done terri. Schiavo he not having that conversation again Hello and welcome to citation needed the podcast where we choose a subject. Read a single article about it on Wikipedia. And pretend we're experts because this is the Internet and that's how it works now. I'm alive Bosnich. And I'll be uniting. This five-man workforce but I'll needs muscle and some brains. First step two guys who should probably start paying protection money to themselves. No and Tom Tom. Yeah but as learnt when I became self employed. I'm cheap I'm not saying that I'm self destructing but I am saying that I have only myself I self to blame so and also joining us tonight. Two guys old enough to played stick ball with our subject Noah and seesaw. I'll tell you HOFFA's batting average. We're playing stickball was local to ninety nine. Normally I would push back on the old thing but yeah I I must be getting all this fucking with my memory. Didn't you already introduce introduce me. Everybody is a person who is also here heath me welcome to the show. Thank you great. Now he cares when he's on the opening skit. It's all right. Take a moment. Thank our patrons. This is a beautiful little. Oh podcast you got here and it sure would be terrible if something happened to it. Luckily of an accent neighborhood over dot com slash sedation. Russian pod is kind of terrible tragedy would never take place so if you'd like to learn how to join the ranks. It'd be sure to check granted the other way. Tell US Tom. What person place thing concept phenomenon or event will we be talking about today? Well thank you to our patron box. Some not allowed near the end zone of giant stadium. Actually suits me just fine. I didn't WanNa go anyway but today we'll be talking about union leader Jimmy Hoffa who nc so you read between the lines. Are you ready to sell up the river literally any price talking skit. I I don't even care to huma. Hoffa Jimmy Hoffa was an American labor union leader when that actually meant something now it means that you're probably late on your mortgage. Yeah he was the president of the International Brotherhood of teamsters which is the truckers union and my dad teamster for several decades could not say this guy's name without calling him a crook he also went missing in one thousand nine hundred ninety five. They declared him dead seven years later but they've never found the remains and there were no convictions in the disappearance it just like Osama bin Laden and JFK. Interesting not at all like no yeah unrelated those people we shots I penciled dammit cancelled episode a hole in the forest take aac three. Jimmy was born in Brazil. Indiana Worst Carnival disappoint a AH fell one can use the bathroom. It was born on February fourteenth nineteen thirteen Valentine's baseball his his dad John Hoffa died. When Jimmy was seven from lung disease and the rest of the family moved to Detroit win? Hoffa was eleven. He quit school at fourteen years old and worked manual labor. Jobs like painting fulltime jean-mrs Apple Tree Shoe would be terrible if someone would paint your house when you at least you know what. This doesn't make any sense. I gotta get the new. y'All remember when people move to Detroit fifties. Yeah they're giving a stipend for that. They've been trying to get back. We have water now. You can drink on bottled some here. Hoffa moved on from painting houses to working in a grocery store chain when he was a teen. He became involved with the Union and organized labor. Around this time the job he was working page. Shitty wages had shittier working conditions and not a ton of job security so think professional snow podcast there with a boss done. That has nobody to blame but himself for his as best does covered. Works didn't do that. That especially since the workers wanted to unionize and Hoffa took the union leadership naturally Hoffa became inspired to work as a union organizer after a run in with an abusive forman when Jimmy stood up to him. The other employees were impressed by him so he moved on from that job and became became an organizer with the teamsters in Detroit local to ninety nine back when threatening people effectively was a valid line. Item on your resume. I I live in the wrong era. How about I fucking kill you? As a negotiation tactic that is sadly underused in today's Labour agree. Now it's fucking starve you and it's used by the other team and I don't mean you're fired and you're GonNa Starve. Congratulations you work at Walmart. Now you are below low the poverty. You made it to starvation cheeses a few years later. While working with non unionized laundry workers on their strike. He meets his soon to be wife. Josephine they married six months later. In September of Nineteen thirty six they go on to have two kids a daughter Barbara and a son James and I wanNA just quote wikipedia. Pedia here so you can hear the house price quote. The HOFFA's paid six thousand eight hundred dollars in one thousand nine hundred eighty nine for modest home in northwest Detroit. The family later owned a simple simple summer. Lakefront cottage in Orion Township Michigan North of Detroit. His son by the way thirty plus years after Jimmy is removed as the teamsters teamsters union president takes over the position. He's been the president since nineteen ninety. Nine yes true fact about that House in Detroit. It's actually worth less now than it was seven. Grandma gives you everything. North of I ninety in in the thirties the forties the teamsters grew pretty significantly in both numbers and power in one thousand nine hundred eighty when they were founded they had seventy five thousand members. There was a push push by Hoffa and other union leaders to consolidate other trucker unions with T- with the teamsters that made their membership grow to one hundred seventy thousand in nineteen thirty six and four hundred twenty thousand in one thousand nine hundred eighty nine and it was over a million by nineteen fifty one off one a bunch. A contract disputes using quickie strikes quickie strikes. We're only one side is happy about the outcome that checks get term and the Secondary Boycotts which leveraged other related industries to pressure Asher to put pressure on another to get them to cave to the demands of the Union would be like a grocery store strike to help get rights for farm laborers. It's hard to wrap your head around it but back then workers actually cared about other workers also since the teamsters were connected to a ton of professions since they delivered raw materials. Finish this project is that are they. Would they use to become the most powerful union in the country right That's why Amazon workers each their own P. Bucket now on everything and hey fun. Fact that secondary boycotts thing literally illegal now. So yeah if you're in a union don't like root too hard for a second bucket per a person shall. We can't even get everyone in the same room to decide that people shouldn't go bankrupt or die if they get sick I try to convince people to take time off of work to strike. Because their neighbors are striking is Utopian dreamscapes. We will never see again something. which I just said about the nineteen seventies seventies and the mob had its dirty hands in the pie to the truckers union were totally in bed with the Mafia? So this means that Hoffa in order to get and maintain power in the unions had to deal with mafia bosses quote he had to make accommodations and arrangements with many gangsters. Beginning getting in the Detroit area organized crime influence over the I bt would expand as the union itself crew and quote okay but Nowadays Union leaders have to get in bed with unsavory unsavory characters like US Congress Giambi two hours so even though Hoffa was a teamster n a union organizer Eiser. He never worked as a truck driver. Or a doc and that's how management works though and that's why it's better in nineteen forty six. In December. Jimmy Hoffa became the president of the Detroit. Local to ninety nine Hoffa received a draft letter for World War Two and he quote obtained a deferment deferment from military service in World War Two by successfully making a case for his union leadership skills being more valuable to the nation by keeping freight running smoothly to to assist the war effort end quote shortly thereafter. He became the head of the Michigan. teamsters dear Uncle Sam. These kneecaps ain't gonNA break themselves. I'M GONNA go ahead and pass La Jim I love it. The actual deferment was based on. I'm too important to get shot in. What does it say about the rest of you? I wear that shirt whenever I walk around Chicago useful. Nineteen fifty two. Jimmy Hoffa was elected national vice president of the teamsters that year the president of the I. B. T. Daniel Tobin was stepping down after forty five years on the job Daniels successor. Assessor Dave back was having some real difficulties securing all the support he needed to take over. And how a smoothed over any issues and exchange Hoffa got the number two spot okay. There's one one hundred percent chance after that. He just looked around the room. Like who doesn't love a solid number two poop joke trump said that this week the fifteen time five years later back was appearing before the US Senate Select Committee on Improper Opera activities in Labor or management field. He was questioned by Robert. F Kennedy a name that will appear later in the story about a missing three hundred and twenty two thousand dollars. There's from union treasury and he pleaded the Fifth Amendment meaning he refused to answer possibly incriminating questions. He pleaded the fifth one hundred and forty times. And I have. I have no idea what the over under pleading the fifth in his Senate questioning is but it seems hi how do they get all the way I two hundred and forty okay. Yeah I know I took the fifth one hundred thirty nine times in a row just now but No I'm totally. We're GONNA answer some of these questions. Just keep going go ahead. I feel like you're lying totally not lying. No I'm going to answer. Feels like I'm going to stop one hundred fortieth fortieth question and you're gonNA take no totes going to answer Doley. Just it's not gonNA be a joke. So where did you amendment. Okay okay in your face. We're GONNA murder you but we're GONNA murder you. Oh anyway at the big the Guy bt convention that year the Guy who was now under indictment got voted out and Hoffa was voted in as president of the teamsters back would be convicted of fraud fraud and get thirty months on release. He got his fifty thousand dollars a year pension from the teamsters and invested in parking. Lots dying ninety nine a millionaire. Can I just say parking lot. Union strong got a pension from the union that he was convicted of fraud. Again wrong Area HAFA created national master freight agreement. which is the terms of the contract for the Union truckers and trucking companies and? It was a huge piece of his legacy and Wikipedia. Says it could be the most important thing he did in his life. He also expanded the Union by unionizing over the road truck drivers into the teamster. Wait wait wait. Where were the existing teams under the road? This Gu quilting under the Road Schreker. I love it. He also tried to bring in airline workers but he did not have the success he had with over the road. Truck drivers all right well so far. It's just the charming tale of a legitimate businessman. Who looks out for the Little Guy? So I'm going to go get some cozy hot cocoa while we take a little break for something we call apropos of nothing and hi. I'm Tom and I'm no you know we've had a lot of funnier and citation needed today. About Jimmy Hoffa but there's also important lessons we think the modern worker could learn iron for instance. Do you know that instead of going through the long and often fruitless process of a wrongful termination lawsuit you can just break your bosses legs. And it's true through websites like glassdoor great way to encourage openness about salary in the workplace setting your bosses car on fire. It really is because while the robot is coming to take your job never needs a bathroom break also won't kill your boss and leave him in a river unions sometimes as you gotta murder I hi I'm heath minute and I'm alive. Bosnia guy stole are opening you. We Miss Different names. If you missed our live shows in New York faulk in you know not I was going to say what I was GonNa say is that we'll be putting up the full videos of the shows on Patriots Dot Com one show per month over the next four months and then then we will kill no yup not again. Not What I was GONNA say. Just wait until I've finished cool however we will be leaving each video up for just one month so there's never been a better time to sign up to be a patron at Patriot dot com slash citation pod not to mention patrons get access to our patron only Minnesota our suggestion inbox and much much more. That's right so if you want to see those videos and support the show sign up at patriotair dot com slash citation pot and if we don't get two hundred patrons by next week we've quit the show. No no no. We don't or do we don't look uh-huh and were back when we left off Jimmy Hoffa law-abiding citizen doing his best. What he had the Italian eye clarity next to overrun so half at that time? He was doing some Amazing Union inning. He was also under investigation and appealing fraud and jury tampering charges. This this is about fifteen years into him. Being President of teamsters and at this point they make Frank Fitzsimmons his vice president. And this I guess is the first time they name Amo. Vp is a direct successor. For that. I guess there was just a vote but they assumed he was going to go to jail and they needed someone there. That could just take over and keep the kickbacks rolling in great and that was our current events news break back. I wish if only we could replace ours with a long dead semi professional mobster. They was having all this trouble with the law. JFK was president. He don't interest in there. It is anyway Eddie. JFK appointed his little brother Robert. We mentioned him earlier as attorney. General interesting thank you For me me. And my family is not nepotism if the president does it down you'll use it later. RFK was supposedly supposedly pissed. He couldn't nail down Hoffa and other union bosses years earlier and he had an ax to grind so he came after Hoffa with guns. Blazing teamsters teamsters parade for Jimmy. Hoffa in Dallas is too obvious stave off these convictions. Convictions for a long time. He was initially investigated in earnest in one thousand nine hundred seven and it would take seven years for him to be finally convicted of a crime. It would be ten before he served any time. He was eventually convicted of attempted. Bribery of grandeur. How is that even a thing like obstructing justice? Yup Yup OPPA was also convicted of fraud in nineteen sixty four this was for improper use of the teamster pension fund quote Hoffa had illegally arranged several large pension fund loans to leading organized crime figures and quote. They were good for thirteen years in prison. Tried to appeal these sentences for three years and was unsuccessful. Damn thirteen years. You can get more time for very obviously not killing a lady in Texas. Yeah so just before. He enters prison the contingency vice president Frank Fitzsimmons takeover now. The reason he was chosen by half in in the first place is that he seemed really loyal to Jimmy. He owed pretty much all of his success to Hoffa. He was local to him as well and huff had gone to great lengths to consolidate date power as the president of the union run it unilaterally but once fit simmons was appointed as president. He started to undo the work that Jimmy Dunn and he relinquished. Relinquish some of that control that the president had. Jeez you caught a prison. One time everything falls apart around story. He undid everything he had done. What did you like disorganized? The worker give back a couple of snow. Okay you're presenting that like a joke which means you're not super up to speed on what unions have been doing so maybe you should pick somebody who's one of WHO's major qualifications was. He was nearby look at him. Rock seventy five years after go into jail. HOFFA had his sentence commuted to time served and he had to stay out of union leadership leadership for a decade. The Guy Responsible President Richard Nixon interesting Hoffa also got his pension of one point. Seven million dollars is a lump sum like he was some kind of a lot of winter I guess was there really was this was an unprecedented payout by the way and just two random facts here the I. B. T. had always endorsed Democrats however the teamsters endorsed Nixon in the last election. Interesting you you. He thinks I'm crazy as the next guy and the next guy is heat but an innocent was behind anything that I don't know about is a bridge too uh-huh and even though Hafa had his sentence commuted. He was still pissed that he couldn't play union games so he started suing the Nixon Administration nation. To get this overturn. That doesn't work though. Yeah maybe because he was suing them for not ignoring the law and now he's also so running into adversity in the union itself as most of the people in it had stopped supporting him he really only still held sway over the local union where he got his start. Detroit local to ninety nine. I know it does seem like you lose some support after going to jail for basically stealing from the people you were hired to represent I mean it seems like that's not a lock doc. We know trump sure is opening in his bid to get back into power. HOFFA tried to make a deal with the mafia one of the local. You leaders and made Guy Anthony. Provenzano was approached to endorse Hoffa. This meeting did not go well quote. Provenzano refused to listen and threaten Hoffa by saying that he would pull out his guts and kidnap his granddaughters. and quote. Ed as you can imagine Hoffa did not take this so well. He retaliated by cooperating rating with investigators and against his Mafia opponents asshole. I'M GONNA go hang out with Robert F Kennedy where it's always safe no matter what and Narcan you gonNA say like. That's so fucking weird threat once you pull out my guts. I have to tell you it's really selfish care so much about Mike Grandkids. I hate to give you notes on Air Bro. You're doing that shit in the wrong. July thirtieth nineteen seventy-five Hafa Autho was supposed to meet up with local mob. Boss Anthony Jack Loney and the guy that threatened to make sausage out of them Anthony Provenzano. He went to the local restaurant called the Red Fox to meet him. He's trying to hide a gun in the toilet tank but seventy five just shooting in the only man. I'm good take flush for his wife at two fifteen and another colleague at three thirty complaining that these these two were late. This was the last time anyone spoke to Hoffa. Well the last time anyone can prove anyway. Spontaneous combustion exact. Ah that night. He doesn't return home and they find his car unlocked at the restaurant. It's six PM. The following day Hoffa is reported missing the investigation really really doesn't go anywhere they did a DNA test in two thousand one on a hair that came from a car of a family friend and found a positive match but the guy denied that Hoffa ever been in the car and FBI. The I agent in one thousand nine hundred fourteen years after Hoffa went missing. Had this to say quote. I'm comfortable I know who did it. But it's never going to be prosecuted because we would have to to divulge informants and confidential sources and quote. Just check her emails. That's awesome. I'm a little confused like isn't that. What the informants are four like an academic exercise so there's been a ton of heath level speculation I think his and I'm GonNa include some of these from the wikipedia? Sorry did you say heath level I was a conspiracy theorist way before preempt awesome Noah level speculation as in like maybe it was that guy who said he was going to rip out his guts paragraphs of my money's on that the typical Noah always blame people for the threats day. May I told you once that restraining order expires get dual recently. Certainly the film. The Irishman was released to Netflix. Or as I like to call a two thousand one a mob hit a time. Odyssey started watching it just before thanksgiving. I'M GONNA finish sometime in March anyway. That movies based on a book called. I heard you paint houses in that book and in the film. They make the ascertain that professional killer that the professional that was close to Jimmy Hoffa Frank Sharon was responsible for killing Hoffa supposedly shot Jimmy in the back of that two times and the body was cremated. The evidence here is just non existent. Okay Hey are you calling. Martin Scorsese a liar guy. Who wrote the book that Martin Base the movie off of because Martin ever has an original fucking idea? Ah Blood bloodstains from that mob. House did not match. Jimmy's blood type so different. I was plugged in the back of the noggin close. So hey we just saved you four hours of the movie version of GRANDPA talking about so if I see another old man. Eight serial from zero to shoot myself fits was the big big big story so I can have eleven thousand thousand dollars. Split up among your eighty four grandchildren. Richard Cook Linski the notorious Mafia hitman. ICEMAN ICEMAN said HOFFA's body was putting a fifty five gallon drum and set on fire for a half an hour or so. The newsroom was welded shut buried. You didn't junkyard. And the drum was supposedly later dug up But a they put it not sure what they're talking about the body or the whole drama and then they smashed it. They put it in a car and they smashed into the compressor and the ship that that Japan for scrap and then we put in a rocket ship shot the entire body and they burned it for thirty men. Trying to seal into there followed a very strict recipe. Well we sous vide it in this guy xactly right so mythbusters did Jimmy Jimmy Hoffa special where they scan the ground at giants stadium with a radar to see if there were human remains under it and this was confirmed later when they tore down the stadium and look physically underneath and despite all that idiots from New Jersey still make dig here signs take them to the the new real and there can proud of it to the top Reverend's Quality Oak Tag Agam crushing this Joe CBS. I couldn't think of an acronym but I'm sure but isn't that the wrong sadie. Not right like I feel like did get dude died in Detroit. Maybe his body is somewhere in the Greater Detroit area. No but don't hate on this New Jersey's entire tourism economies clearly based on dead body to work. What else do they have? Here's another complete sleep misquote. Police took samples from the ground under a suburban Detroit driveway at least during the day after continuing after a person reported reported having witnessed the burial of body there around the time of Hoffa's nineteen seventy-five disappearance tests by Michigan State University anthropologist. This found no evidence of human remains. I love this guy. He's like he sees the damn body being buried these address. Nothing and then later that could be hop might might WANNA check also look mythbusters out a metal detector and some guy at Michigan state grabbed of dirt spontaneous combustion in another gangster said. They basically played the shell. Game with HOFFA's corpse. Tony's really said that he was buried in a shallow grave and they had planned to move him around bit but those plans deteriorated like a corpse in a shallow grave. He said that the location of the grave was near a field near the restaurant where Hoffa went missing in two thousand thirteen. Police dug up the area that he indicated and found nothing but the case remains open well to be fair. If the area indicated was just Detroit -TROIT's in general the police would have otherwise decoys the finally Michael Frenzy The New York mob boss claim to know. Oh where Hoffa was in an interview with a Youtube Channel. He said that he knew who the killer was to. His claim is that the commission the five mafia bosses in New York. Doc controlled organized crime across the country ordered it. He said quote. I can tell you the bodies very wet Kennedy and and the shooter is still alive today but currently in prison okay boomer okay but why would all those mobsters go to jail Douai for asking Jimmy the Sphinx Komeito wherever the fuck that is we could get answers answer to this shit. That isn't in the form of a fucking riddle the FBI did release a pretty obvious statement in the form of fifty six page memo in the Detroit. Free Press side note. Is there a page limit at which memo is no longer think novella. They don't speculate late on any of the information or facts regarding the disappearance itself but do speculate on the motive in it. They claim quote Hoffa was murdered at the behest of organized. Crime Crime figures who regarded his efforts to regain power within the teamsters as a threat to their control of the Union's pension fund end quote also murderers bad double space doubles as of Orange. We're the I think. The main main gist of this is that there were certain people who knew what happened to Hoffa and where the corpse was but they never said anything about it to anyone or if they did they were already recognized liars in so no one believed him so hard to find an honest mob murderer. These yeah can't trust them they should unionize. The one thing that isn't mentioned in the article is but it's pretty evident is the shit that this guy and other corrupt union officials pulled fueled Union Nyan distrust in the United Conservatives on both sides of the aisle back then latched onto the crop narrative and use this to discredit unions and help weaken them significantly. Only I know there are a lot of other factors involved in the decline of unions. But this cluster fuck should not be overlooked. Yeah if only unions had been perfect. I'm sure Jeff bezos would happily pay fifteen dollars an hour. I listened to ceaseless whole sentence so I'll young bad good guys are worse than bad bad assist. And if you had to summarize what you've learned in one sentence easel what would it be. My Dad was right. He was a goddamn chrome. and Are you ready for the quiz. So let's do this all right seesaw. Which of the following is the most valuable union benefit? We all still enjoy a the existence of weekends and thus the proliferation of workplace Monday jokes be a elimination of child labour. So Oh your children have more time home watching youtube videos of grown men playing fortnight see unions in large part responsible for healthcare being a private sector benefit secured through work or D.. Second Thought Fucking uh-huh definitely now I'm GonNa go with I'M GONNA go with B.. I'm a huge fan. I think we should be watching it. I'm such a fan of these so you got it all right. I got a good one for you. See so what cool line did the mobster that killed. Jimmy Hoffa say right before he Paul to trigger. Hey Osterloh teamsters mother be austell AVISTA smothered truck see. Here's here's looking for you or D- I'm GonNa Make Ya you also good. They're missing the fact that he was killed by the Jewish mob so how far Nettie La that is correct. That was secret. They all right one more for you seasonal. Why are you afraid of talk? You're part of the conspiracy and you're being paid off by a big rig. Your Dad clearly killed Jimmy. Hoffa really helped with the sword based parts parts of that murder. Deal about seventy five. I'm too and I'm like whacking his ankle with a little red. Go with all the above it. It was it was specifically. Just your dad killed because you only had to hack it his legs with so oh yeah. Ceaseless Dad did kill Jimmy spread out there like the LoC dead and it doesn't matter he's dead. You can't fuck imprison Asha Shit. Yeah I mean you can. I mean we already have their box. So he wins he wins. Next week. I'm going to pick Woah all right well for topsy. So Noah and Noah I've not back next week and by then Noah we'll be an expert on something else but you know and then he will be hiding an underground bunker from nicotine Lewis know who'll be honest search for flesh to rent and you can check out Thomas's those new city tour of Chicago another popcorn shop. And if you'd like to keep the show going you can make a patriot dot com slash citation pot or for leave us a five star review everywhere you can and if you'd like to get in touch with US check out past episode connect with us on social media or check the show notes be sure to check out citation pod dot dot com and remember. There's no better union negotiation than when you've kidnapped someone's daughter You're right see so burning them as a much better idea. Are you sure. There's a lot of good essays in here. I mean we got Jeffrey APP. No Sandy Hook absolutely not a weight ZIP lining put it in the fire okay.