NFL Network analyst Daniel Jeremiah
everybody. This is Richard dick sports media podcast might be terri- Mellon. I guess this week if you're an NFL fan concern me national draft really doesn't mean any introduction. Daniel Jeremiah has been with the NFL network since twenty twelve is per straffed. Was twenty thirteen prior to that. He was a scout from NFL teams Kooning the eagles the Browns and the ravens and the reason I wanted to have him on. And I think he's going to be an interesting guest is and Daniel, and I have ops you talked before, but his his role sort of changes a little bit in the post. Mike Mayock Yere, given the prominence of the draft Rennell network programming, and given I think Daniels sort of new prominence now at the NFL network, and he had prominence before and Daniel Jeremiah joins us on the sports media podcast. It's you're in California Daniels. Good morning to you. Hey, thanks for having me on. So I wanna start here before we get to may axe departure, and how that might impact you. I think people are fascinated by the NFL draft and many things about it. But here's something that for my audience in particular. I think they'd be really curious about let's just sort of pick a random day three weeks before the NFL draft can you as detailed as you can take me through your what your day might be starting specific like what time you get up. And then what time you go to sleep and everything happens in between. Sure. Sure. You know, if we're going about three weeks out of the pro days will be over if it's a day where I'm up at the network for pass the draft. It would be it would be different. But I'll run your day if I was at home. Okay. I'll get up at I'll get up at six thirty. I will we our kids go to different schools. So we have four kids. And my son goes to school cross town about twenty minutes away. So I'll take him to school. We'll leave about seven ten get him to school. I'll get home back home about eight at that point in time. I usually get some get some coffee, and then I go into my office. And then I'll start watching tape video. I guess it's old habit for scouts. We still say take even everybody knows. It's not tape. But we'll start watching video of players at that point in time. And that will be interrupted by some phone calls. Maybe some text messages with with friends in the NFL in personnel departments where we could be talking about players. And who you're watching? You know, why do you like this guy? I don't like him that way, you know, these are friends that I've had going back, you know, twelve pleasures. So that's kind of sprinkled throughout the day. I try hopefully, go to watch my wife, and then and then get a little bit more done. And then next picking up the kids. School. And that kind of that'll take care of know family stuff between going to track meets and soccer practice, pick up the kids, and we try and get dinner together. And then once the kids go down that about eight, you know, from that point on I'll go back into my office and try and get another two or three hours of of work done. And then you get up and do it all over again. How different will that be? Let's say for a pro day where you would in Sierra cly. I guess it's a big pro day, you might be on site at that pro day. Yeah. So I'm gonna go. This is something that'll be a little bit new this year during during the time scouted, obviously went to zillionaire pro days. But I haven't been to many since I went over to the media because that was kind of Mike steel Mike would go out to the pro days. I was in the studio five days a week for pass the draft. And you know, Mike would file reports are talk backs, and he would be on the show from remote location at those days. So this year. I'm gonna get out to about six of them. So I'll go to Oklahoma to see Kyle Murray. Ohio State, Alabama, Duke and Missouri have quarterbacks all be there in state. So I'll get a chance to get out to more this year. So that'll be something. That's that's new for me. But new old I guess new in this in this role, but reflects that for my scouting days, and when you're at a pro day Daniel is it how do I sort of phrases are what you are looking for with the sort of the process be the same as if you were working for the eagles or the ravens in terms of your, you know, your actual scouting for the NFL network for your mock draft. Yeah. I mean, I try and function. And I think this is something that Mike a great job of in was really really excellent in this area to me. You wanna look at what we do is work for the NFL network has the kind of unofficial thirty third team. So you're building draft orders. If you're one of the thirty two teams, you have the same questions that you wanna get answered when you go to a pro date now, the differences, obviously, the teams have more access to to be inside the program and inside the buildings, but I still have a lot of relationships and friendships from my scouting days with with these colleges. So using those relationships try and get the best information, I could possibly get to go along with, you know, trying to answer some of the physical questions or concerns you might have about a player getting a chance to go to the pro day watching them move around watch him run watch them interact with their teammates. It's the same gathering process as you would have when you were when you were with the team. Okay. So Mike Mayock has been I think it's you know, it's fair to say the face of the NFL network may be rich Eisen is facing. You know, what those two guys fight it out at least it's twenty sixteen but they were the co faces of the NFL network and Mike the face of the NFL draft. And as I've written many times and said, Mike Mayock to me is the best. He's the best television draft analyst I've ever seen have great admiration for how he approached the job his work ethic, and for me, at least as of you're he revolutionized the experience in and I appreciate it that that's a long sort of filibuster. Daniel to ask you a couple of questions on Mike's departure first off Howard. How has Mike's departure changed your day to day or week to week if at all? Yeah. It's a little bit different. You know, the the good news is two things. Number one. Is I got a chance to have a front row seat for six years to watch how bike handled that role, and what went into the preparation for that role? And he was always very open with me in terms of his process. So that that was helpful number one. And then and number two, I get Seamount, you know, say similar about a work. I'm still watching the same out of players that hasn't changed. My tape study all that I would do to get ready for the draft on that standpoint. To know the players that didn't change for me. What changed for me is? Now, you get to these events the combine or you know, the senior bowl the all star games. I should say the combine. And in the draft is there's other elements that that that Mike would would be involved with in terms of putting together. More highlight tapes, Exo tapes breakdown tapes, and so, you know, we have a wonderful staff in place led by Ben fennel on the east coast films. Who does a great job of coordinating that? So I didn't have to worry so much about putting those types of tapes together. But now it was, you know, Charlie, you're could it kind of set everything up for me and showed me, you know, how this process works on that end. And so I've been sitting const. Communication with Ben on. Hey, look. I just saw watching this player. I just saw this play. Can we make sure we put something together? So we can you know, Kyle Murray. For example, we you know, one of the big concerns with him as with his size Howdy protect themself. So as it was going along the okay, look, he's he's getting out of bounds. He sliding he's turning his shoulder. He's protecting himself. So I would just take my phone video screen as I'm watching these individual plays. I'd be texting back and forth with Ben fennel, and he would build a tape force that we could show to to let the viewers know, you know, how he would be in this type of situation. So those types of things that might have been doing I hadn't had to previously. That was new for me. How is Mike departure changed? How you think the NFL network receive you, and specifically, you know, have you been told that you are you're now the lead whatever whatever it means. It means anything you're the Lee draft analyst for the network, the I mean, it was just, you know, something that been talked about. Maybe previously. We look I always like being the backup quarterback. You're always preparing yourself in case the starter gets hurt. Or if this the starter moves another team, you wanna be ready to step in. And so even from when I started it was like Mike is the best Mike is phenomenal. You know, Mike not do forever. So you need to be preparing yourself to eventually be able to step into that role. So it's something I've been working towards and and then when Mike left, you know, look, it was we're all said see might go because as great at what he does and and B's wonderful team. But there's also an opportunity that was you know, that existed. So that was that was to me to get out think it was ever said, hey, you know, you're the you're the guy or your lead this or that it was just, hey, you've got an opportunity now make the most of it. So that's the way I approached it feel any pressure in that, you know, I think people again NFL fans know who you are. They certainly are familiar with your analysis. But that's gonna probably Daniel get exponentially bigger. Just given how much even the NFL networks going to push your mock drafts. No, I don't think. So, you know, look. It doesn't matter who you are you a mock draft you're gonna get so much blowback and criticism of social media. If you haven't callous yourself at this point time, I'd be surprised. So I don't feel any more pressure. I have too much fun Richard to to let the pressure kinda body. It's it's I love it. I I love watching players talking about players. I love talking about team building. It's something that you know, somebody was asking me about the combine. And you know, how you're gonna protest. I said these are the same conversations we're gonna have on air or the same conversations I had for eight years in the stands sitting with my scouting buddies. I said they just kind of throw Mike on you now. So it's still fun. And I I have too much fun to to worry about you know, opinions or pressure that that might be out there. It's just we're talking with ball. It's not rocket science. Nobody's living her dying here. I it's a blast. For me. Let's talk about what the sort of the schedule is Daniel in terms of mock drafts where as we tape this. We're taping this on Thursday, March seventh. How many new versions of a mock draft? Will you do prior to the draft itself done? I just did my second one the other day. So that just came out this week. So in years past it's very sometimes I think I've done as many as maybe eight this year. It's not quite as many. So it'll be this is my second one. I believe I have one more, and then I will do one, you know, Mike did his his his final mock draft of the day before the draft. And it was they put that into a little bit of a show. So I believe the plan that would be my my fourth and final one. So it's a, you know, people can't get enough of them. You know, the as the traffic as nothing to do in my opinion, whose names on it. If there's a mock draft that exist people eat it up, and they'd love it. So I know I know we with network and as media group, you know, have my four, but you'll have Bucky Brooks. It'll be putting them out Lancer line puts him out. Chase good bread. Him out or ask wealth. We have. I mean, it's a we have a ton of that get put out there. So people can get their their appetite met there for all these mock drafts. Do you do enjoy it? Do you? Enjoy the process the actual process of compiling list, putting it out there, and knowing that people are going to treat this the way some treat the apart. Yeah. Well, or treat it the way some treat the Magna Carta or the declaration of independence. You know, I always I always enjoy my favorite part is ranking players. So my favorite exercise in the whole process is updating my top fifty list, which I tell people my top fifty list is is done with my eyes. My mock draft is done with my ears. So that's why I don't take offence. If people get upset or you don't like picking a mock draft, this is based off kinda what I'm hearing and talking to people around the league what I think might happen, not necessarily what I would do but early on man that was a that was new to me going into the media, and and put my first mock draft out, and I remember going on Twitter and be like, wow, it's going to go my mentioned, and if people are excited about this real happy with what I was able to give their team that I realized quickly that that is not how that works. You will you the negative folks will will jump on a hurry. So that was an eye opener. But now I have fun to the point where. L text with buddies and stuff some of the best replies. I get. All right. So here's really what I want to ask. Daniel is this is just fantastically. Interesting to me, television wise, so Mike Mayock is going to be the one of the point people for picking the Oakland Raiders draft this year, and there are significant team in the draft with multiple high round picks. Are you going to feel pressure Daniel to be predisposed to favoring who Mike likes in the draft? It's funny. We've had this conversation and might not even not even though. So we talked early on right? When he got the job. And we we we always talk about players one of the things Mike, and I would be texting and calling each other from you know, the end of the NFL season to the week of the draft. Because we're both cramming all these players jam and watching all this tape, and we see somebody that we get excited about it. So real, you know, we'll text back and forth. And hey, you need to watch this game. I didn't like it, Mike. Well, you know, what games did you watch? And I like this just a contract dialogue between us. And so he gets the raiders job. And we're talking on the phone, and we started talking about players like we always did. And he knows I would never burn would never, you know, put anything out there about who. They like don't like. But he was so we get to the kind of the end he goes now, just you know. Hey, don't ever connected me these guys, and I went come on, Mike. I'm not going to do like that. And then I started thinking about it. Media should back off my communication with Mike because this could be a fun game knowing him as well as I do to just being able to guess what he's going to do. And he can't get mad at me because he wouldn't have totally. But it would it would just be a very educated guess that for spending so much time with him over the years, where what what you would tell you know, this in front of me, look it up as I'm talking where are the raiders initially drafting what's the seven or something like that? I'm trying to remember where where are they they've got three first round. Yeah. Three first round picks starting with four four. And then they go into the twenties they believe twenty four twenty seven so three. And then they've got a couple of twos. They've a boatload of pick. Okay. So at least at number four right now, you're trying to get in that ahead of Mike Mayock who is mic MAC and a take it number four as I talked to you on March seventh understanding that if you're wrong not holding into this. Look, I would think you know, we even did a talk back right after get hired. I was in that day. So we did a. Doc back with him for total access, and maybe aftermath any was show and film that work in one of the first question. You know, what is a raider? Look like, you know, teams around league teams I've worked for and you talked to anybody who say, okay, we know what a raven player is this is what a Steeler is. It your vision. What is the Oakland raider? What is it looked like any said and typical, you know, Mike's voice of big tough physical. With. And so I'm sitting there looking at, you know, at pick number four and Nick Bosa from Ohio State of some Barack Yetlis action took place eat fell there. I think they would run that in and then Quinton Williams from from Alabama's another one who I think plays the way that Mike appreciates. So those would be too that if somehow they were to get there, and we'll see what happens if Tyler Murray goes number one. Maybe it pushes one of those two guys down to them. You the things that might tell me when I talked him over the years. Daniel was that he loved to go to as many different NFL team offices as he could prior to the draft the abbey had really good relationships with, you know, whether it would be GM's GM's, positional coaches, and he found that that was among if not the best way to really get a sense of thinking about how the droplet would go at the same time. Of course, these guys would ask Mike wanting new because Mike had seen things that they had. Not seen. What how would you describe your relationship with the different team offices end like Mike, do you travel to different team complex over whatever it is from January to April every couple of weeks? Look, we we have you've been in this at the small small community. In the personnel department. Mike it worked really hard to, cultivate, a lot of relationships. You know, I from my time in the league and even in this role. I've new friends I've got old friends. So I've got contacts and most of these buildings and some some really close context. Now, the only on differences, you know, Mike with Microsoft on the road and go out there and visit with those teams I I'm going to be doing most of that work over the phone. That's something. I've always done. I've always felt comfortable with that anything that I've been able to need I've been able to get and I can have that phone commerce, and then twelve and I can be at my daughter's track meek at at three o'clock. So it allows me to kinda keep my balance that I need I used to ask this question of Michael. And it's always interesting to get his perspective as well as your bosses in the people at ESPN the same thing. But do you do you see ESPN on draft day as a competitor? And then specifically, do you view Mel kiper and Todd mcshay? During that broadcast as a competitor. You know, it's interesting. You always wanna always your competitive, and you want to do the best you can. But I don't really look at them that way and part of it is because I've known him forever. I mean, one of the first things I remember in college. And I know you've heard the story million times about my relationship with Chris Mortensen. But I would go to the draft when I was in college and answer more phones. And I was just you know, I was all in on on the draft. And that's where I wanted to do what I want to be involved in Mel treating me like gold Mel put me in his in his draft guide. My my senior coming out. I remember seeing him and he goes to see the guy the draft guide and I haven't seen yet. Mel any you pulls one out of his bag and shows me, I was like I was like maybe second collasped quarterback at Appalachian state got me and got me in his guide. So it needs a he can still remember everything about about. My college career is is unimpressive as it was. So mel's always been good to me. And then tired of somebody that I knew when I was scouting got know him. Well, and and at work good buddies, and we were just talking with each other the other day. So I I'm all about is much interest. We can drive into the traff. That's great for everybody. So and I get asked all the time. Even you know, you see these different websites popping up, and there's a there's a dedicated website out there now like draft network. You know, that Miller does his thing and people what do you think about all these guys that are kind of these these independent start independent? Some of them get picked up a draft unless I'm like, I hope we get a million more, whatever drives more interest and social media and and gets people talking buzzing about the draft. That's great for everybody. That's why you can go to Philadelphia and have a couple of hundred thousand people, you know, walking around outside and and being in being involved in live draft event that it's become so the more the merrier for me. Did you a free? Genton FA or a late round pick. Okay. I was not an his draft. He's nice. But he's not crazy. Gotcha. All right. So the reference Chris Mortenson, and it will go over this quickly because they're going to be some people who don't know this, but your father, David Jeremiah is the senior pastor at shadow mountain community church is that still his church. Okay. Very well known pastor if Google Daniel's father is very prominent in that world, he had a relationship with Chris Mortenson. I'm not drab they were either friends or or sort of became friendly based on faith and Chris Mortenson, correct annual helped your media career get started right out of college. How did he do that? What is that story? You're he when I was in college. He knew real quick the backstory there. So the Super Bowl between the Packers. And the Broncos San Diego was out there covering that Super Bowl. He listened to my father on the raid. So for years, and so we went to my dads church to meet him. And then my dad invited him once after shirt, that's where I bet Chris the next day. He in kinda new in talking to me knew that I was interested in broadcasting the next day. He was going to interview interview Reggie White for a one on one. And he asked if I wanted to go with him, then I'm here. I'm like. Yeah. Absolutely. So end up going with him their Reggie White. And and then we Morton struck up a friendship during that point in time. And then while isn't college he would have me come to the draft interest phones at that point time, I met Jay Rothman who was producing the draft ESPN. And then he was doing college football at that time. And so, hey, I'm doing the Orange Bowl which the national championship game. Again. I'm still in college. And he said if you can get down here, you know, you can be an intern runner. So I paid my own way to Miami and picked up sandwiches for everybody the for the for and then I go through graduate college. And then. At the Sunday night football job to produce that and he reached out to me and asked if I wanted to be a spotter for Sunday night football. So that's what I did for two years sending on football with a spotter up at the booth who who responded for two Rico, and that was that was Mike that was no that was Mike Patrick allowed. Joe seismic palment wire might do that. How about that? And then and then I was also the second year I was in g producer. So all the Phoenix. You would see, you know, the shots the opening shots and all that I want around with a couple of camera guys. And and and it was just make sure that they could get into where they needed to get into shoot that stuff coming out of break. So I did that the second year and then through that process. We were doing a game with the ravens in Iran in my brother's college teammate in the press box was a scout for the Baltimore Ravens and just a chance meeting. And then he said, hey, we have a we're gonna have an opening in our scouting department. Do you think you'd ever be interested in that? And I had not taught anything about scouting. And well, it sounds like a pretty good pretty good deal. So anyways, that's what led me getting an interview. And that's what led them getting involved in the scouting what? The Baltimore Ravens. Interesting. I went ask if I can't a couple of questions about your faith in relation to sports. It's an interesting topic to me so first off how do you weigh sharing your faith publicly with the sports world, which it many times directs people to do the opposite on either religion or politics. I'm not I'm not I'm definitely not in your face about it on social media at all what I have been able to do is to kind of use the platform that I have to get opportunities to go speak at schools to go, speak at churches, different things like that. It's create some opportunities in that world forming. So that's the way I've I've approached it. I know people have different thoughts on how you how you integrate that. Obviously huge part of my life with each part of who I am. But I I've tried not to take the approach of just being, you know, beaten, the overhead and being Oltra aggressive with it. I just hey, you know, where I stand. If people ask me, I tell him. And and it's opened up some some cool doors for me to be able to speak and do some different things away from sport as the as the son of a pastor is in challenge. When people come at you on social media, not to respond. Well, I mean, I think it's helpful because one of the things growing up. I always knew if I got you know, if I did something dumb while I was growing up if I was in high school, if if I would got in trouble, it, not only would it got me, you know, in trouble at my school or kicked out of my school. Because of who my dad was I would it would have been on the news. You know? So that was always an extra motivator something stupid. And there's still always that that thought that look at you like to think you would never do something because you don't wanna bring shame on yourself and your family your immediate family. But then you add extra layer of medicine, really bears. My dad if I was a jerk on here. So I just feel like it's an extra safety net. And would you just so sort of I so we formally have it or listeners have it? Would you classify yourself as a Baptist or or if not how would you? What what would you say? You're religious. Yeah. No. I grew up in the it was a Baptist church. But then they dropped that affiliate. Nation, and I don't I don't get all hung up into that. In terms of you know, the word Christian. You know, people ask me what what's your faith? I never say on the Baptist. I say, I'm Chris you. Gotcha. Okay. Your father in addition, obviously what he does. Now, he was the chaplain for the San Diego clippers right when they played in San Diego as an NBA franchise. And also. Yeah. And he also from what I read lead chapel services for NFL teams when they were in town to play the chargers. So in your youth. Did you did you have experiences as young person just intermingling with either the clippers or NFL teams given your father's relationship to pro sports? Yeah. Absolutely. You know, my my dad was a chaplain for San Diego clippers. My brother was the ball. Boy. For the clippers my. Yeah. My brother was the ball with the other ballboy was we grew up with Giles fun. I don't know if you remember them, but Brian Johnson played for the Indian pirate. Good hit or Ryan. And my brother were. Yeah. Yeah. Brian. My brother were the two ballboys. And then after the games, we would wait, you know, my dad became really close friends with swint later that was playing for those clipper teams in swin had been doing loans, you know, back up at UCLA, and we're still first round pick but him and Bill Walton. But he's but after the games, I can remember somebody earliest memories games, we'd be waiting there. My dad would be talking to whoever in and me and all won't kids with would be shooting hoops out there while Bill had his feet in in a bucket of ice trying to I. We'd be out there shooting hoops little kids. So those those are fun memories. And then swin ended up going to the Waco. So we would go up there and see him a couple of times doing that. And then football, you know, doing the football chapels that I can remember we were huge cowboy fans growing up. You know, we follow the show we had to it was the chargers and the Cowboys. And so the Cowboys would always put a chargers in preseason. So my dad would always do their chapel. And I can remember being at the team breakfast. They let you come to the team breakfast, and me and my brother had both. Brought our our Tony Dorsett football cards and Tony Dorsett was two tables away. And we just kept doing you. Go do it. No, no. No. No. You go do it. And we just sat there we'd needed one of the courage to go get twenty four sets autograph. But we always told people he just ate breakfast tables away. Yeah. As a yeah. I remember it seems like the Cowboys were on every Monday night football game. Indoor set was always was always. Starring when you said you shot baskets with the. Walton sons that would be Luke Adam Nate, Chris those Walton's, I don't. Yeah. I don't even remember which ones they were. Because I ended up playing playing against them in high school, summer, retirements and stuff. They just kept coming and some of them you had you had some nephews who played as well. But yeah, they were there seem like there was a wall in high school basketball, San Diego for twelve straight years. Now, obviously Bill is of course, a prominent ESPN broadcaster. And maybe one of the most unique broadcasters. We have ever seen in you know, in multiple generations. Did you have any experiences or one on ones with Bill when you were a kid anything memorable? Why can remember playing in a plan like an tournament? And and I, you know, he knew who I was a little bit just because of his my dad or swin, and and I play this you turn it, and I probably was eleven or twelve some around there. And after the game was over. He was there, you know, as soon as someone's playing in the tournament, and then he came up to me. He gave me he gave me the phone number. And you need to go down and play. There's a place called a unique Jim and invaluable apart down San Diego. Which was you know, one of the better open gym runs in the city. And he said he'd come down with they're playing basketball gym. And here's my number. You call me I live not far away from there. I can meet you down there. And I remember just thinking like that was that was the most bizarre interaction this the wall won't phone number. I'm a little I'm a little kid, but he was it was definitely memorable. I love the any kind of interact with Bill Walton when he was playing at San Diego. Just always kinda fascinating to me. All right. A couple more here. When you how do, you know one of the topics that comes up every year Nobby teach really really in the news right now, just given Charley Casserly comments profootballtalk Mike Florio commenting, and this sort of happens every time in the silly season. Do you have any thoughts Daniel on the quoting of anonymous scouts, you talk to obviously a lot of scouts. You were a scout yourself, you have talk to GM's, etc. But it's you know, as someone who sort of reading this as a sort of a reader not connected in that world. It's always hard to discern. Like, what is real? And what may be being said to play with draft positions to play with people's perception for reasons for altering motives, and I just wonder again someone who's in that world. How do you view? The anonymous scout quotes that we end up always seeing from it seems like February to April. Sure, you know, one of the things just to be totally honest tied wurley on when I got NFL network and media group, one of the things that that I started was I did this thing called ask five where I would ask five personnel executives could be polish scouting director pro, you know, director director player personnel general manager, whoever, but I would pull five guys, and they wouldn't put their names on. It was definitely anonymous. But I never to me. It was who would you rather? Have you know, who you're aged green who's gonna big who's going to be the, you know, the big riser while blah, and it was never a never wanted to get anything about guys off the field, or you know, anyone go negative. I guess the way I would say it. And I thought it was helpful information. I thought it was interesting to see kind of what the what some people in the league snapshot, they give you there and. And people go why don't they go on the record? Well, if you go on the they're gonna get fired. These guys aren't supposed to be talking to the media. So that's why. But I always found I usually would do that during the fall because I thought you could get some useful information once once NFL even ends then draft season begins, and that is that is, you know, lying season at that point in time. So I was always skeptical of information that you would get on players or, you know, stock rising falling once you got into the course. And so I at that point time, I would usually stop doing that stuff. So look, Charlie Charlie definitely got the information. He's not making it up. You know, Charlie's is a professional and rather than information talking to a couple different teams. My whole thing on that one. Specifically was look if if Josh Rosen being shocked, which was mentioned, you know, Charlie mentioned that the Josh Rosen was Boone shop if he's being shopped then Kyla Murray as the only. Interview that he needed to and that was the one with the Zona cardinals. So that to me was bigger story to come out of that was man this kid's going to be the first overall pick. That's not very leave one last thing on sort of a sort of the whole draft narrative that comes in this is again, just your how you view this and others probably will view it differently. But however, you determine Daniel like the word makeup or off. It's such a non sometimes nonsensical code words. But off the field issues, if someone has criminality in their in their past or current if if you've been told that a player has whatever kind of issues at a university, how do you you may not reveal that obviously to the public if you were told that in confidence, but how does that kind of how does that make up impact your evaluation, and does it or can't it? Move people up and down. I remember talking to Mike wants and one of the things that he he took this really seriously one of the things he really never got over was he believed that he did not trust his instincts on Johnny Manziel in terms of sort of Manziel off the field versus on the field. And he allow this is his paraphrasing. But I'm right here. He allowed he sort of he bought into what maybe pro Mansell people were telling him about his play and that superseded maybe Mike's hesitancy natural hesitancy about what he believed Menzel might not be able to handle as a quarterback. And he he felt in his opinion. He Missa valuated him totally. And I wonder in similar situations. Just how does how does all that stuff impact your evaluation and wouldn't have dramatic impact? In terms of moving somebody up or down. Absolutely. You know, one of the things that that any evaluator in the NFL will tell you important. I had a good fortunate learning under Ozzie Newsome and Phil savage. Is you always have to go back and study your own mistakes. I call it your hits in your MRs like you need to constantly go back three four years and go through your list. I keep an excel sheet for every draft at how I have players rated. And I have my comments on you know, to the to the right of the column there, and so I go back through, and it's pretty simple, you know, go back through and and and look at what they've accomplished and I will either give them a green yellow or red green. I feel like I got this player right in terms of my evaluation in where I slaughtered him yellow. Is you know, it's okay. It's not the best. It's not the worst. I was in the ballpark in a red is a whiff, and so when you go back through, and you just then you just sort it, and you go back and read all your comments that you had at the time. On those players you missed Richard. You'd be shocked at how many times, you know. Some of the off the field concerns have factored into why this player didn't achieve what his physical abilities, which should have. So I've become and you get a little bit older may become a little bit more conservative in focusing on the war of some of these players not getting amored with the ceiling and to me. That's why like like there's a perfect example TJ Hopkinson in this year's draft. I with high then he's not book. He's he ran okay. What he has good production. Not not doesn't blow your doors off with his production. But he's he's strong. He's one of the best run blockers. You catches everything that comes his way. And I've been told leadership character all that stuff is off the charts. So I have a meme is my my fifth overall player right now. Now, he might be the twenty second pick in the draft. But I know exactly what I'm buying with him. And and I'll. And I'll go in that direction over somebody else might have a little more upside, but I've got to take into account all the other stuff. So I never go. I'll never go public. If I hear a guy, you know, some stuff that hasn't been reported publicly. I'm not a reporter. I'm not looking to to get that information out there in the public. But yes, I can move guy down my list, you know, based off some things that I hear, and I talked to a buddy with another day about a specific player and said, you know, look I liked him on tape. He's good player. Man. He did not he didn't work out well to combine it didn't even wait he'd really trained for some of the things you saw field. And he said what's funny say that because we had him in our interview room, and we asked him to great his practice habits on a letter scale and gave himself seat. See that's not. That's not good. And be that smart. You know, you might as well why in that case? But just there's little tiny little pieces of information that you kind of gather just trying to put the puzzle together. All right final two, and these will be more draft specific as in a general sense Daniel as best as you can how would you evaluate this class in terms of talent, maybe a potential starters versus last year? And why who I think you just start with a highlight of the draft in that is defensive line? It's it's as good of a defensive line group in terms of not only top tier players, but depth all the way throughout since. I start scouting in two thousand three. So that to me is the is the cream of the crop of this year's draft last one of them, and you're gonna you're gonna have a lot of options. So that that is a great group ofensive, line wise. I think it's really good. I don't think there's a, you know, Joe Thomas. That John Ogden any type of premier premiere player at the position. But there is a lot of depth. You know, quarterback wise, it's it's kind of a wild card year. I don't think a favorably to last year. So you've got to really intriguing players in Tyler orient Dwayne households. They're both warning your starters. So you've got Kyla Murray? People look at the size a little bit of a concern. You look at Wayne Haskins the mobility is a concern. So they aren't just clean clean prospects. But those are the two best at the physician in my opinion and then to me running backs underwhelming corners underwhelming. So I think if you look at the classes, a whole you say you love what you see on the defensive line the offense with big man's draft tight salad. But for the for the most skill positions. Just not quite as a top tier heavy as we've seen in recent years. And then the last one. And just I think the listeners just would be interested. Just in terms of you educating us. How much does the the scouting combine and people getting a chance to you know, measure Cuyler Murray, the amount of sort of measure Cuyler Murray, measurement stuff on Twitter that day was just a crazy crazy town. You know, obviously teams talking to him people seeing him like how much of that is is of real value of determining what it seems to sort of someone like me who's an NFL watcher and just sort of reads all this stuff like he solidified himself as a top three top one guy that week. I don't know where he was before. But I guess my question for you is is like is that like what happened like Ken how you measure can't how you interview can the whole football world like being there for a week. Like does that solidify guy as the number one or was he may be number one beforehand? And and this is just sort of story in news and fodder because that's what people. Due at the scouting. Combine. I think there's a chance he could have been the one before the combine. But there was so much variance in in. What was expected from her size? You know, I I had heard, you know, during the year there was talk. He's one hundred eighty three pounds well to me more so than the height that that would have been tough tough to get over. Just there's to be very difficult to survive at that position at one hundred eighty three pounds, so two hundred seven pounds. That's a significant difference in that can have a major impact on where you would stack somebody like that. So that to me the measurement absolutely mattered. And I tell people that the forty and people like to laugh, you know, you're running shorts move the corner position. You know speed is is a big deal. And when you watch the tape watch college, surly, see them, all get tested and challenged vertically. You don't know you think he can run, but he hadn't played an explosive receiver all year long or pointing an off coverage. The whole time. So that's a question that really does get answered at the combine when they run. So that's where that wholesome real value. And you know, you mentioned the interviews what what has a greater impact anything else in Indianapolis is the medical. So once they, you know, once you get your medical grade, I've been in the draft rooms where you have you love a player on the people at the school tell you he's okay physically. But the doctor comes in and says, no he did not pass our physical. That's it. There's no discussion. He's off the board. It's over we always say, look, let's let the coaches coach scout scouts and let the doctors the doctors, you don't know more than them. So when they tell you this guy is a major risk, and he's failed the physical. That's a wrap. Daniel Jeremiah is the NFL networks sitcom, the Lee draft analyst of seeking catch other guys. They're Bucky Brooks standard as a podcast with him. And it's gonna be fascinating too. To see all Daniel's work over the next couple of weeks. Given now that Mike Mayock is the general manager of the Oakland Raiders, you're gonna see Daniel a ton on both the NFL network and online and NFL dot com and his his podcast as well. You wanna give a shout out to your podcast Daniel, given that you are a podcast here. Yeah. On that line on that note. I I wanna move this fix podcast promo before rich gutty rich Eisen show promo where if you were betting Vegas. You lost a lot of money on that one or may revise and has a podcast move, the sticks Daniel, Jeremiah and Bucky Brooks that is the official pockets. Listen Daniel, I'm happy for your success. I've been wanting to have you on this podcast for a while. We are we're going to be inundated with Daniel Jeremiah over the next couple of weeks and best of luck as you prep for the draft having talked to your bosses there and Charlie Euch and Seth Markman and all the PIN equivalent to. It is a public doesn't know how much work goes into it. How many people are behind the scenes, it's a massive undertaking. And and so I wish you the best of luck within thanks so much for coming on today on the sports media podcast. I appreciate it meant one. Last thing. I want to give a things publicly to Jackie Android, who's kind of my been my researcher through this process and guys like Jack that that make the whole thing go, and and he's a stud. So it's to give him a little of is. He is he LA based or somewhere else based as he based at the NFL network headquarters or somewhere else. Yeah. He's a he's an LA. So you know, I sent him a little projects that have me intrigued in turns around and gets them. Right back to me. So that's what you know. My mike. I chance to end up front chances. Stand up front rich does. But guys like Jack are the ones that can't make the whole thing. Go. Yeah. I mean anyone who's in a front facing position? Whether it's whether it's podcasting whether it's television, whether it's radio knows full well that you are honestly nothing without a good production help or good producers. So those glad you shot that guy out and talk to more Quincy. Oh, get that guy. Arrays? Daniel you've got some juice now that may gone, let's make that happen. Call up a phone, you take your jet. I appreciate that. Daniel. Thanks so much. I'm sure I'll be talking along the way. Right. Thanks, Richard take care. All right back in the studio. My thanks Daniel, Jeremiah who again is become you know, the face of the AFL networks NFL draft coverage with Mike Mayock now with the Oakland Raiders, I bring producer Terence Terence. You're telling me that you you have done work with the NFL network. I don't know if you had ever worked with Daniel Jeremiah before, but you are if nothing else you're familiar with that network. Correct. I worked for good morning football for. A little over a year at as it was getting going, and it's it's awesome to hear him shout out the production help because just being having been on the other side of of the camera and helping out on the back end. It's good to hear because there's so much work that goes into cutting up clips and finding the right clips to align with what, you know, a talent or a person on air would say, so it's it's awesome to hear Daniel shout out the producers, he has because I just know how much work goes into it on the back end hearing that guy give shout out in his position is pretty awesome. Do you? Are you surprised that? Maybe you're not surprised but good morning football has become such a hit among hardcore football fans. The, you know, the the the numbers themselves, the aggregate numbers of yours may not be massive. But that show has done such a great job of getting good publicity for the NFL network and just coming off both for its cast. And for the network is. Smart and it's a big win. Again. Even though the show is getting, you know, four hundred five hundred million years. It's just it's like a very good product at the NFL network has and I wonder if you when you work there, if you sort of saw that happening or was it a surprise to even someone work there? No, you'd see a common. I think it's a it's a real testament eight of the folks by the Cameron and all the folks that I worked with her. I know on the back end that certainly worked their butts off of that show. But you gotta give the credit to the the folks on air. Nate is a great great great voice. Peter brings his own blend of insider info Kyle has the kind of fan voicing k brings everything together and runs the the fantasy stuff, and they just have such good chemistry that people find that people are always willing to find things where they feel like they could be a part of the conversation. I feel like and that show even as it worked its kinks out right away. You could tell right away that they had a chemistry on air. That was something that people were going to find because it takes something like that show, especially on a more niche. Network like NFL network people need to hear about it from their buddy or hear about someone on Twitter. That's going to say, hey, you should watch this show. So I think you could see that building slowly and smartly and almost helped that maybe the the viewership wasn't as high right away. 'cause you get to work the kinks out on a three hour live morning show. Yep. Yeah. I major inter interrupt you there. Yeah. Totally well said and you're right. You're like you sort of like can figure it out you can figure it out on the fly. Without let's say like get up situation where the so many eyeballs on you that every misstep you have gets gets written about and chemistry. You're Sorley totally dead on that is just the one thing that you hope for as a producer. But you never really know. It does hit when it hits. It's great. Would that show? You could see it coming right away. I mean, they're all so talented individually with with kind of the corners. They own me talking about the hosts, obviously, but together, they just have a very very good vibe. And it's it's it's fun to see it be successful having been there kind of as it was getting going in and shadow tall them. And all the hard work. They do because they're they're still friends of mine. I really really really really really really respect what they do. This is like an NFL network PR. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Karen? Thank you. Daniel Jeremiah, previous guests of this podcast one right before this John O ran and Chatfield with a media roundtable, we talk about the Jason Witten. What's going to happen with Monday night football as well as just commend does David Ross Alex Rodriguez working for teams as well as broadcasters. What that means? I n eagle and Sarah coup stock. The nets broadcast team together on his podcast prior to that. And then just go down the list from Mark fana- Rwasa, Shannon, speak. Jeff Gluck with Jamila on Kevin Harlan, Laura Rutledge, Tom, Verduci, checkout, K tab, Djamil hill. Renee, young just go down the list on the sports media. With Richard is podcast. If you like this stuff, please leave this with you for janitor. Meyer for Terrence for everybody. Cadence thirteen this is Richard. I will see again on this more media with Richard Dutch pockets.