Morning Joe 8/24/20
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The American people remember Ronald Reagan. Was seventy-seven when he left office would be seventy eight entering office and you have said yourself that you are a transition candidate. Does that mean a one term president? What does that? mean. So you're leaving open the possibility you'll serve eight years. I WANNA turn to the blistering attacks. We've seen from president trump just this week alone on your mental fitness whether you're up for the job. His campaign is called you diminished. And I'm curious how you respond to that watch me Mr President Watch. Me Look at as both. What we say what we do what we control. We know what kind of shape we're in come on this look I. Think it's a legitimate question to ask anybody over seventy years old whether or not they're fit and they're ready but I just know I can say the American people. It's a legitimate question to ask anybody watch me. Good morning and welcome to morning. Joe It's Monday August twenty four th with us we have host of MSNBC's politics nation and president of the National Action Network. Reverend. Al Sharpton also NBC News Capitol Hill Correspondent and the host of K. CDC ON MSNBC Casey. Hunt we've got White House reporter for the Associated Press Jonathan, will Mir, and columnist, and associate editor for The Washington Post. David Ignatius and Willie have the morning off. David. I just want to start with you really quickly this morning you wrote a striking column last week about just an absolute bombshell of report that the Republican Senate Intel Committee put out. And perhaps it was because of the convention perhaps people just want don't want to talk about Russia anymore because they're so tired of it, but it is extraordinary because all of the questions that we had. So many of the. Let me just say. So many of the questions that we had that went unanswered by the Mullahs report were actually answered by Republicans including. Wait. Why didn't trump? Why. Weren't there charges? Why didn't molar push for charges against Don Jr. and Jared Kushner a lot of people have been asking that question we've found out the Republicans had sent a criminal referral for those two. So a lot of unanswered questions by Muller. That we're actually touched upon by Rubio's committee. Joe Was a devastating report. Deserves to be read much more widely than it's been. It's important first of all, because as you said, this is a committee that's led by Republicans, this is not a democratic hit job as a partisan fight. This is an attempt has taken almost four years to go through the facts of Donald Trump's. Campaigns dealings with Russia and it's overwhelming the evidence in in particular about the former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort in his dealings with the person who was identified flat out in the report as a Russian intelligence officer who feeds over time more and more information to Manafort who elicits from manafort information that's valuable to Russia who tries it every turn to to do? Russia's business through this trump campaign conduit. There are other Russian intelligence cutouts, people that the Russians had used their named the specific details of what they did are all contained in this in this report. When I finished reading it I felt this as you. As you suggested earlier, this is what we needed from Muller. We needed a clear statement of what the Russians have been trying to do with the campaign never could never came the Muller version was very hard to Parse, and we needed this in the impeachment process. We need something much more wide ranging the gut to the basics of how people have tried with some success to manipulate the administration just finally. Joe. The. The most devastating piece of the Senate Intelligence Committee report written by Republicans authorized by Republicans was the allegation that Russian manipulation through Manafort and others in the trump circle continued after the election they tried to spread a false narrative in you've heard it from Donald Trump that the real problem here wasn't Russian meddling it was meddling from Ukraine, how many times have we heard that and it's stated here in black and white? This was a Russian intelligence deception. Run by intelligence officers and we fell for it. And our remarkable that so many Senate Republicans had been warned about that from the Intel community and yet around the time of impeachment a lot of Republicans on Capitol Hill were spewing Vladimir Putin's propaganda even though they've been warned against it from trump's own Intel Committee we'll get. To that throughout the show. But why don't we see where this race or president is framed up? As Donald trump goes into the orange see this week new polling shows the Joe Biden continues to have a wide lead over president trump nationally by ten point lead over trump fifty, two to forty, two percent and the latest CBS YouGov poll. Now, that was for the most part unchanged since before the election before the democratic, convention. But you did see some tightening. Around Joe, by the support seem to be much stronger for buying, they're also other polls on the hills of the DNC regarding favorability numbers in the latest ABC. News Ipsos full president trump's favorability sits at thirty two percent sixty, two percent have an unfavorable impression of the President Joe Biden's favorability is up five points from the previous week now at forty, five percent and forty percent unfavorable we're going to get some polling. In just a minute but Casey hot that really that. Really tells quite a difference between two, thousand, sixteen in two, thousand twenty where you had Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton both fairly unpopular sitting in the low to mid thirties here you have Joe Biden About a dozen points higher on a favorability rating and you talk to people inside the campaigns they tell you. That the biggest difference how negative politics has gotten but the biggest difference between this year and four years ago is. When you pull the people who don't like either candidate for years ago at broke disproportionately towards Donald Trump this year those people and it's a good number are breaking disproportionately towards Joe Biden. And this is something Democrats don't necessarily like to talk about because it reminds them of Hillary Clinton's loss and that was really a low point for so many people in the party, many of whom are now working for Joe Biden but that's really the big difference here. Joe Biden went into this race with a different perception from voters across the country, and there are a lot of reasons for that some of which have to do with Hillary Clinton but many of which have to do with the attributes that Joe Biden brings the. Person He has been in our public life for the last fifty years the tragedies that he has endured in his private life that many people in the public life have shared with him but I think you referenced that that number in this CBS YouGov poll that shows that essentially the number of people who said I'm supporting Joe Biden because he's not donald trump dropped a little bit and the number of people who said I'm supporting Joe Biden because I like Joe Biden ticked upward in a pretty significant way which seems to show. We'll see if it holds over the course of the next couple of months heading into the election but it seems to show that they succeeded with what they set out to do with their convention, which was to make a positive argument to say, Hey, you should get out and support this guy because of who he is not only because you want to oppose the sitting president we know Democrats are motivated to do that but for anyone that is still sitting on the fence making Matt positive argument in favor of Joe Biden could. Potentially, make a critical difference, and this has also been where the trump campaign has failed. They have tried to get something to stick to him a negative attack that gone after his son they've tried other tactics they try to tie him to China so far nothing is really working, and if that state continues through, I think that that is that is potentially going to be the difference here. Now, one thing we are seeing Joe, we played a little bit of that David Muir interview ABC News interview at the top of the show. Biden former vice president Joe Biden. said that he would lock down the country again, if that's what public health officials are saying, and that is something I'm told we should watch for this week at the Republican National Convention Republicans are seizing that holding onto it. Thinking that that may be an argument that could win for that. Now, of course, that's making a bet that Americans want the economy to open potentially over the objection of Public Health Officials I. GUESS WE'RE GONNA have to be the judge of whether whether that's the wise thing, but that is something to look out for. All right and so new battleground state polling is come out showing Joe Biden holding at least seven point lead over Donald trump in every battleground state he's ahead the falling the polling firm Redfield in Wilton. A British firm shows that Michigan Biden holds a twelve point lead fifty to thirty eight percent and Wisconsin a ten point lead forty, nine to thirty nine percent in Arizona a nine point lead forty, seven percent to thirty eight percent in Florida an eight point lead forty, nine percent to forty one percent and Pennsylvania a seven point lead forty, eight to forty, one percent and North Carolina. The president is statistically tied with Joe Biden but up two points and up four points cents July. Reverend Al.. Obviously. We're expecting these swing states to be awfully tight. That would that show Joe Biden a fairly comfortably in Mo-, swing states but. I would. I would guess you'd expect most of those states go down to the wire this November. There's no doubt that the race will tighten for several reasons probably go back and forth several times I think that the campaigns of Boll candidates must really watch where the concerns of people are, where are we in the pandemic? Where are we in terms of some of the social questions like policing and like gun control and I think the ones they read it and handled it correctly will be the ones that will drive there turn out and we'll have the hand on the pulse of where the country is when we entering this RNC starting tonight, it appears that the president is tone deaf because he's playing to an audience as not their suburban housewives are moving toward the urban center. He's playing to having people that weighed guns. A couple of guns had black live matter marches who were marching peacefully being speakers contracting met with a Colin Powell Governor Casick Republicans are spoken the Democratic Convention I. Think His Tone Dep is frightening for the Republicans and if he doesn't catch up I, think even though to race may tighten it gives the edge of the Democrats. You know it is. It is really surprising the tone that he's taking this. Convention is the same town. He's been taking over the past four years. He he's playing to his base, his most boil down version of his base, the base that he spoke to the inauguration and when he was talking about American carnage the he spoke to and Charlottesville when he was trying to split the difference despite white his sad and pathetic apologists say. About what he said it Charlottesville David Duke was praising it and said, this is why we voted for Donald. Trump. This is why we'RE GOING TO GET SUPPORT DONALD TRUMP? After Charlottesville. And you can carry that all the way through to this convention You just look at the numbers and again it's baffling. Not only to me but I know it's baffling to a lot of sitting Republican members of the House and the Senate who don't understand. Why this president continues to do what he does, and in this case and the issue that matters the most Americans, this year why didn't he listen to his doctors? Why didn't you listen to his scientists what Joe Biden was telling him to do at the end of January? It's what a lot of Republicans on the hill were begging him to do listen to your doctors. Listen to your scientists he refused to do that then. He's refusing to do that now and it is. It is funny that. There are people around him, who thought that his March to Saint John's Church on. June the I was a good political move. Now it's it's these same people who obviously just don't understand politics want to see so Joe Biden saying he would listen to his doctors and scientists that's going to be the bloody flag you're waving. During the RNC. Lots of luck with that and speaking of ignoring your scientists and your doctors and the wisest people around you. The trump administration has granted emergency authorization for the use of convalescent Plasma Cova nineteen initially, the FDA held off on the move after top government officials including Dr Anthony Fauci and Francis Collins raise concerns data from the clinical trials were too weak to support widespread application of the treatment remember that. Dr was concerned about with hydrochloric even an emergency authorization doesn't require the same amount of evidence as the FDA approved but according to Bloomberg News researchers fear the FDA's decision to issue an emergency waiver just in time for the RNC by the way, we'll make it harder to get patients into clinical trial trials and get a clear picture of whether and how convalescent plasma actually works to treat covid nineteen. So for the clinical trials haven't proven whether plasma can help patients battle the coronavirus are not there were some there have been some studies that show it may on the margins Dr Foul other doctors said, we need more information meanwhile. And I think this is what's so important. As we talk about what he's doing with plaza. This is what's so important as we move forward regarding vaccines because. Millions and millions of Americans are going to. Be Following whether they believe a vaccine treatment has been rushed or not in the New York. Times is reporting that trump aides met with congressional leaders last month and told them that the administration may approve a corona virus vaccine before the November election to people briefed on the discussion till the Times at does administration officials said a vaccine would probably get emergency approval before the end of phase three clinical trials in the US perhaps. As early as late September, a White House spokeswoman did not immediately respond to requests from the time for comment. Let's bring in right now NBC News Medical Contributor Dr Gupta and Dr I'll get to you in one moment. Jonathan on Mir you've been telling me and. You've been hearing. About. Everybody around the White House has been hearing that the president is desperate he's flat. For a vaccine. To be put out to the American people as his October surprise. So. With you actually. are. Telling us that for quite some time I would guess you're not surprised by this news that White House officials have already been rushing down to the hill saying, Hey, don't worry. Don't worry we're going to Russia vaccine and maybe even get it out by the end of September. The president is adviser to put a lot of eggs in this basket. We've been saying this for a while they. There is a real hope to have some sort of vaccine approval probably not distribute necessarily because that takes some time but some sort of approval before before the election thinking that could be sort of a last minute game changer that could really bolster his election. Chances and I think that's why we've seen that sort of talk and speculation while there's some concern about this approval about the blood plasma yesterday. I was in the White House briefing room when the president came out and made the announcement. This is something that just a week before you said doctors urged him to to cautions slowed down. We're not sure we're ready yet certainly the. Convalescent blood plasma treatment has shown encouraging signs, Mayo. Clinic study that suggests that it could be helpful but it's far from a sure thing and it was characterized yesterday as as more of a positive development rather than that flat out breakthrough, which is how the president himself was portraying it and I think we should how he portrayed it. It's part of the story here this was. Not something that would just put out an FDA press release something came a day after the president took to twitter accused members of the FDA of slow walking the approval of of Therapeutics of Coronavirus Therapeutics for political reasons an allegations from trump advisors of the health experts and members of the so-called Deep State Toledo get president trump or at least move too slowly for his liking. This was forced push through. He was able to make the announcement himself from the White House briefing room yesterday, and the timing of course raises eyebrows on the eve of the Republican convention a convention. But he goes into down as we just went through the polls down with some by some significant margins and a lot of these battleground states and he's trying to change momentum here he is trying to appear all four nights of the. Convention. His aides or making the bet that that's what he wants it simply that Donald Trump certainly believes himself at the answer to any sort of public relations. Crisis is simply more Donald Trump, and now he goes into it with bad stories with distraction swirling and I know we'll get to later the leaked audio from his sister the sudden resignation of senior adviser Kellyanne. Conway there's a lot of distractions right now around the president, but he is betting this this corona virus therapeutic blood plasma treatment is a good sign heading into the conventions and yes absolutely they're telling lawmakers they're telling allies they do believe they'll have some sort of vaccine announcement before the election that could be what salvage Donald Trump's chances. Now. Well those two issues regarding Kellyanne. The family personal matters there won't touch on those doctors Scott Gottlieb. Dr Foul cheesy. The president czar on. Testing. All of them. Had said doctor that. They needed to move past hydrochloric when. The medical community as a whole, the scientific community as a whole said. Time to move past hydroxy caloric when the president. Still. Is clinging to this for whatever reason. You now look and see he's ignoring very vice again. On on convalescent plasma again, it may work. It may be a significant breakthrough down the road, but we don't have the studies yet and I am worried that. People saying the president doing this with this sort of government by. In time for the C- and what he said in the past about disinfectants, what he said in the past about So many other things about this magically going away in April. That when it's time to roll out, vaccine Americans are rightly going to be skeptical that they can't trust the president that it is safe for them, their children and their parents. Won't joke a good morning to suit? The, the biggest concern I had from. Yesterday was FDA Commissioner of Dr Steven. Han taking the data that we don't have publicly and saying that there's a thirty five percent survival benefit from compass. Plaza Listen Joe I've been giving this as my colleagues to patients since the beginning of March that way widely available drugs. The notion that this therapy is now more prevalent more accessible. Now, after this emergency use authorization is just not true maybe incrementally. So to your point mayoclinic dated other data suggests that there's Probably, a marginal benefit and this is not harmful, but is this a miracle cure as the is this saving thirty-five? Every one hundred lives a statistic that the commissioner kept repeating yesterday. The answer is no there is no evidence of that and he has miss billing it. He is misrepresenting the reality of the data here and that's really key because number one and. John Dr Doctor. Help me if you will I from what I saw from that study and I just briefly looked at it and tell me maybe you can correct me but it looked like we were talking about the difference between. Eight percent. Dying and eleven percent dying in some cases nine percent and twelve and A. Two or three percentage. difference of course, if you give somebody. Two or three percentage points I think everybody will take that. But that was just one study Dr Falcone and others want to see more studies. So why would the FDA commissioner come out a couple of days after Donald? Trump accused him of being in the deep state and solely is reputation by painting this as a Miracle Cure when we really don't know yet. Great Question Joe and you're right I think you're right in. Your viewers out there plasma in the first three days after somebody gets admitted we think there's maybe eight. Three out of every one, hundred individuals survive as a result of getting that plasma at thirty days. Maybe that number comes up to five. That's what we see from this analysis for Mayo, which is a large analysis. Why the FDA. Mr decided to do what he did. Let's we're all we're all line to see what's happening. We're worried about the of the FDA these decisions that get made because the president is tipping his. Hat got as deeply concerned because we need the FDA to look at the data look at the evidence and do rate and based on randomized control trials. Somebody gets the drug somebody gets therapy. Another person does not any compare the two and Joe, you mentioned this earlier. The deepest concern here is that we're not be able to effectively bring scientific clarity to this issue. 'cause I don't know a patient or member is gonNA say. Give me the placebo or sign me up for that study because now they see the president saying we're going to give emergency use authorization for something that has not been sufficiently studied to date. Are Dr Gupta thank you so much for being with us. We really do appreciate it and David Ignatius reminds me of well what Ross do that wrote about this weekend, and also at Masha Gessen has said that the Donald Trump instead of. Instead of actually governing getting bills passed. Using. The Constitution As roadmap to get things done. Hill. Do the sort of not even governed by Fiat but government by gesture he'll do something he'll make a big announcement. And it will never turn out to be as big as we thought, of course A. Use One example after another example after another example, about emergency funding to build the wall and emergency funding to do this and emergency orders to do that. But here. We have a making announcement on the eve of our NC again that his scientists and doctors don't want him to make but it is once again government by gesture all just make an announcement and people will believe I'm doing something big. Joe I refer to this at the beginning of the trump presidency is the iron whim. These statements that would seemingly come out of nowhere but with such ferocity. Trumpet is still waiting for a miracle to deal with this pandemic greatest, quite public health prices of our lifetimes. He doesn't have a plan. He doesn't have a systematic idea the latest. Bright object shining in front of his eyes is the convalescent plasma treatment. And as Dr, Gupta and others have said that there's some promising aspects to it. My fear is that by politicizing the public health process. The many Americans who already are suspect suspicious of medicine. You know a lot of people don't want to take vaccines and a Lotta people who who don't want to use the therapies that are available. Now they don't trust doctors they don't trust. Big. Institutions of authority. He just feeds that narrative and one of the scariest things you can think of is, let's say sometime next year we do have vaccine that works but a lot of people won't take it because they don't trust the scientific establishment because that mistrust has been cultivated by president trump over months and now years and I think that in some ways could be the biggest damage that his presidency does that he he doesn't simply delay our response to the pandemic. He makes it impossible for people to feel confident and comfortable about the vaccines therapies that could actually turn the corner. So I, think that's the hidden danger of what he's doing now. And I'm hearing it from one person after another one friend after another asking me when I talk about the possibility of of is saying well, let's so we get us a vaccine one person after another says well, are you going to take it? Are you your family take it? You're right there is that skepticism and so much of it has to do with the way even among trump's supporters. The way the president has handled himself since last March on this and Jonathan Amir I I'm curious we are going into a week. that. We're Donald Trump is going to be showcasing his accomplishments of the past four years where he's going to be trying to draw a distinction between himself and Joe Biden. He's behind the staff's behind. They know he's behind, they know he needs a big week. To at least cut down a little bit. On some of those leads at Joe Biden has right now what's the game plan? What should we all expect? Version I, just WANNA mention to David's point the president himself as a private citizen express some skepticism vaccines as well. So that's another element here is. What we have a nation facing us and certainly the erosion of trust in terms of the RNC it begins tonight it will largely be based here in Washington other is component. During the day in Charlotte Charlotte was going to be the original host site of the RNC the president yanked out of north, Carolina. Due to a feud with the governor there he wasn't able to get the convention he wanted to packed halls and such moved to Jacksonville. The Jacksonville part of course of course got cancelled as well. One piece did remain some of the business, the roll call that will be today this afternoon. In North Carolina there. Certainly speculation cameos by the president of Vice. President there, and then tonight in Primetime back in DC as you can see the rundown on your schedule, Donald trump junior and former ambassador. Haley or among the headliners this evening the First Lady's tomorrow Vice President Wednesday, the president of the courses Thursday. But we are told to expect the president to play a role every night, and that includes his major address Thursday night behind me from the South Lawn of the White House in terms of. The. President keeps saying his aides are trying to suggest that it will be a positive message this week they'll fill tout the president's accomplishments. Sure. But also his vision going forward division mind you that he's had real trouble outlining he's had real difficulty sort of explaining what a second term would look like what is policy agenda would be, and it's also hard to justify this picture of optimistic convention week considering it comes on the heels of the president for weeks. Now, turning extraordinarily dark apocalyptic language about the state of America's cities those controlled by democratic governors anyway suggesting that the Joe. Biden is a puppet of the radical left who hates what America stands for. We'll tear down all of its statutes and that that that that we're looking at a bleak future if the Democrats come into be and then so he is for a president who has from the American carnage speech on has always really tread in dark territory a pivot to a bright optimistic message. This week seems shall we say will surprise to behold if he's manages to pull that off highly unlikely just as unlikely Jonathan is Boston Red Sox fans celebrate celebrating anything this year I mean you know We go ahead by one run and I think it's two thousand and four again, only to have our hearts crushed and the end. You and I for a moment yesterday Joe we had dreams of October glory, and now we look at the standings and realize wait we're I think we're nine and twenty and one of the worst records in the League and extremely frustrated at everyone who is employed by Red Sox. I put Whitney Houston on my Sonos one moment in time I was dancing around and. Then we lost the orioles again by the way when our of best tweet early morning tweets has to go to Jake Sheridan. Who says from today in one thousand, nine, hundred, seventy, two in Berkeley the grateful dead with a great intro by Bill Graham from Marin county good time music. For good time people and of course, all those kids that were at the grateful dead concerts they were just looking for a good time. Just good clean fun in time. But Bill Graham. Holy Cow I need to get on here we need to segment just on bill? Graham. Still Ahead on Morning Joe I know we're not talking about the preacher still had on morning joe our next guest says, don't believe the story that President Trump will tell at the Republican convention Steve Rattner joins us with his latest piece on the economic recovery that isn't but first, let's go to Bill Karen's. He's gotTA. Check on storms impacting the Gulf coast and some good news pertaining to one of them bill. Read his these two storms we're developing that. This was going to be the first time. I, guess since the eighteen hundreds of two storms in the Gulf coast at the same time, but things are breaking up a bit. Yeah for Marco. So that's the great news over finally some good news and twenty twenty, right so marco overnight is getting shared apart. It's not going to be a big event for Louisiana or Florida, we're going to have some isolated problems with some storm surge some maybe isolated flash flooding I. don't even expect a lot of power outages forecast Hurricane Center a very weak decoupled storms that immediately turns our focus to Laura because Laura is going to be right behind this one and Laura's now just south of Cuba still sixty five mile per hour winds. and. This one has a chance to become a powerful storm as we go throughout Tuesday, and then Wednesday right now the hurricane center thinks could be a hundred and five miles per hour maximum sustained winds somewhere between Houston new New Orleans pinpointing right along the Beaumont port. Arthur Area Lake Charles also could get hit hard by this storm, and again, this would be Wednesday night landfall. Our European computer model takes the storm strengthened at rapidly during the day tomorrow, and then takes it right into the Texas Louisiana border area around port, Arthur too late Charles again. About sixty hours out the average errors about one hundred miles. So that's why we're still saying anywhere from. Two New Orleans still be preparing for the potential for a major hurricane to head your way because this does have that potential to rapidly intensify tomorrow. So he'll Marco's not being a big deal today Laura at least has the potential to be a significant hurricane with bass evacuations starting as early as tomorrow. So keep that in mind if you're along the northern Gulf coast and of course, with all the cove implications in evacuations you can imagine. How problematic all that could be. So we'll continue to update you that as we go throughout the morning and throughout the next couple of days as we watched the tropics eating up, you're watching morning Joe, we'll be right back I'm at home all the time right now and whether you're working from home or working on your fitness, you want what you're listening to be what you're listening to not what your downstairs neighbor is listening to Steven. Everyone needs a great pair of wireless ear buds. But before you go dropping hundreds of dollars on a pair, you need to check out the wireless ear buds from. Ray Con. Con earbud started about half the price of any other premium wireless ear buds on the market and they sound incredible. Their newest model, the everyday e twenty-five ear buds are the best ones yet six hours of playtime seamless Bluetooth, pairing more base and a more compact designed to gives you a nice noise isolating fit I got a pair and they are so comfortable I take calls on them I listen to our podcast on them. They basically almost never leave my ears. Now's the time to get the latest and greatest from Ray on get fifteen percent off your order at by recon dot com slash NBC news that's by RECON DOT com slash NBC News for fifteen percent off RECON wireless ear buds. On Dot com slash NBC News. Tremaine. Lee Host of into America a podcast from MSNBC join me as we go into the roots of inequality and economic injustice and racial injustice, and then when you add health is a health injustice into what's at stake people are going to be voting not for person. But for stability and into what comes next into America a podcast about who we are as Americans and who we went to become new episodes every Monday Wednesday and Thursday subscribe now. Hey let's bring in former treasury official and morning Joe Economic Analysts Steve Rattner. Who ahead of denied start to the Republican National Convention has a pre bottle of sorts to the economic message that the White House is going to be pushing in Steve before you go through the. Just want to ask you about this. Economic recovery and. Again, I. I I've. Sooner the economy recovers the better. There are a lot of people suffering out there. Looking what's going on and I have the same sort of feeling I had leading up to September fifteenth two, thousand and eight and I kept reading about credit default swaps and I kept reading about all of these financial instruments that I didn't understand. Well, it doesn't seem to make sense. that. They can spread the risk around that much and it doesn't end up costing somebody. There's never a free lunch just like. The trillions and trillions of dollars of debt were accumulating. Now, we're going to have to pay for, but this is what I don't get so. Right now tenants. Can't be evicted and I understand why very humane rational thing to do during this time this once in a lifetime event we're having. But. Then the landlord, they can't make their payments and you hear of these big whether it's the gap or Victoria's secret or. Other major stores. Brooks. Brothers that are filing bankruptcy or they can't make their payments on their New York stores. So they're not making those payments. All right. Fine. The landlord though whoever the landlord is. Getting, that money and the larger property holder and the larger company in the firm set of invested aren't getting their money and at the end the banks when everybody defaults aren't going to get their money I'm just curious. Is that why you had Berkshire hathaway Warren Buffett Divest from all of his bank stocks and are we looking at a situation that ultimately when this? All? Ends up it all all of this flows uphill to the banks, and then downhill the people who are trying to get money out. Of ATM's I'm. Not Trying to. Be. A pessimist here. But I just don't see a good ending to all of this. Joe. I don't think you're trying to be a pessimist but you but you have to think about all these things because they did happen just about twelve years ago and it's possible they could happen again. So I on the question of people paying their rents and things like that. The evidence that's going on out there is that office tenants are pretty much mostly paying their rent people who live in multifamily apartment buildings and things like that are paying a surprisingly large amount of their ran the real. Problem, which you alluded to is with retailer retailing was on its way downhill before all this and has become a disaster and many many of those retailers aren't paying their rent, and so you will see foreclosures of buildings a by lenders you you do see going on in the in the derivatives market, a lot of trading of stuff at sometimes at very low levels because of this fear but the banks have a different problem. The banks problem is fact that they really can't make money zero interest rates because. There's only so much you can You can charge people to borrow and you really making nothing on the percent pay nothing on the deposit. So what we call their interest margins are being squeezed short answer. This show is that I think we did learn a lot from oh eight. Oh, nine and I do think that. We are watching very carefully all the factors you talk about because they could explode but so far the increase in number of bankruptcies of fifty, two percent year over year for example, has been orderly and has been managed by the financial system. Well. All. Right. We'll talk more about this later. But first, let's get to your charts and walk us through the state of the economy as you see it as opposed to how Donald Trump sees it. Hey, guys, Willie geist here this week on the Sunday sit down podcast I get together with country superstar. Tim. McGraw to talk about his latest album here on earth and much more get it now for free wherever download your podcasts. Sure. We're going to hear a lot I'm sure this week from Donald Trump about how great it was before the virus. Great it has been. We'll be after the virus passes, but that's not really what the evidence shows. Let's start with the earlier period, which is I'm which is the first three years in office, and obviously jobs were probably the thing that's most of the minds of Americans, and so we can see here that on the gray side of that chart is Obama's period where he created two hundred, twenty, four, thousand jobs a month during his last three years. So comparable period to to Donald Trump Donald trump created one, hundred, eighty, two, thousand jobs during that same three year or history or period and. What's the net of all that the net of all that is that there one point, five, million fewer jobs created under trump than under Obama during the same three year periods. Last three years of Obama I three years of trump. If you WANNA talk about economic growth, you can also see a mixed picture trump's claims. He had the greatest economy ever. He was actually seventh out of his eleven predecessors in terms of GDP growth. GDP growth was very similar to what it was under Obama over these periods, and in fact, on trump GDP growth fell each year during his three years so that was before the virus. Now, let's talk about the virus trump told us. We were going to have a v-shaped recovery. We were going to bounce back almost instantly, and that's not quite what we're seeing out there. So this shows you the monthly job report that we get from the Bureau of Labor Statistics and you can see the massive drop off in jobs during the shutdown. We all knew that that was happening and exist, and then you can see we started recover two point seven, million jobs in May four point, eight, million jobs in June but then in July, the number of jobs created. Dropped off to one point, eight million. So a much slower recovery, and again in the box there you can see the scorecard we lost twenty two point, two, million jobs. We've regained nine point, three, million jobs, and that's only forty two percent of what we lost with the number of jobs being added each month slowing down now, the shutdown, the need to have to shutdown again, I think has taken a significant toll on the pace of the economic recovery. The economy has certainly bounced off the bottom but if you look at this chart us to take one example of what's going on out. is a chart of revenues. Received by small business, and you can see the bottom back into spring that happens to be right around the time that the stimulus packages were enacted and you can see that spending to these small businesses rose steadily sharply steadily into July that little bump in the middle of the fourth of July. plateaued and it's even turning down a little bit. So as we sit here, today small businesses revenue is down nineteen point one percent relative to where it was at the beginning at the beginning of the year, and again, we have other data to show similar factors for example, foot traffic in stores, restaurant reservations, things like that. All paint a picture of an economy that is not in any v-shaped recovery that is recovering slowly and has a very, very long way to go to get back to where it was even as early as the beginning of this year. I remember Scott Gottlieb on our show. Of probably April saying we really needed a downturn in the summer to rest and prepare for the fall certainly businesses needed that badly. because. So, many small business owners are suffering and working class Americans are taking a disproportionate hit here. Even the apple stock may be going up it. Certainly, there is such a disconnect between Wall Street and main street right now perhaps his greatest ever been David Ignatius whether it's Steve and has the next question David. Steve, your charts, her reality check as as always I wanna ask you a following on what show was saying about the hidden dimension of what's going on and that's the danger the inequality in the distribution of income and wealth in the United States. Already a big problem argue ipe part of the reason that Donald Trump has such strong support angry people feel they were left at, is that going to get worse as we go deeper into this? Pandemic caused procession and partial recovery. David yes. There's no question that we're going through right now purely on economic terms as exacerbated, all the problems we have of income inequality of people toward the bottom not doing well, if you look at So if you look at job loss figures during this recovery, so-called recovery is way disproportionately focused on people with college degrees at the upper end had lost the fewest number of jobs whereas people the bottom people without a high school diploma even have lost the most number of jobs. You can see the industries that are most affected just about it. This way, for example, things like travel hospitality restaurants all of those have many many workers at the lower end of the wage scale lost their jobs and who knows when or if they're gonNA come back. So here question is right on the this. This so-called recovery is definitely having disproportionate. On, different people and and unfortunately the worst impacts on people of Color Women people toward the lower and of the income scale. and See following up on. David's Question I. One of my concerns also has to do with the fact that the stock market may be going up because apple stock is going up and facebook is going up and Microsoft and other companies like that Amazon or going up but you also have some companies going up on the promise that. Post pandemic they're going to be able to continue to downsize as far as employees. It reminds me of Richard of what Richard Haass said that this pandemic is not going to bend history. It's not going to change US three. It's going to accelerate history and I fear that we've seen it halfway through the pandemic that millions of jobs that have gone away. In this pandemic probably aren't coming back because major corporations have figured out how to get by with less and making more money on Wall Street because. They're cutting to the bone. Right, every conversation I have with a CO or business person investment person in the course of our work I hear the same thing I hear CEO saying I, don't need the same I've learned from this pandemic that I don't need the same number of people when I come back because I had before I've I've heard a lot from CEO's about cutting back on Capitol expenditures which, of course also means not bringing people back to actually go ahead with those projects and so yes, there's no doubt that business is going to use this. As a moment to rethink their their cost structures, number employees they have, and of course, we also know if that last ten or twenty percent of the economy is going to come back anytime soon when theaters going to open one or sporting events going to allow spectators when people really start traveling either for business or pleasure the way they did before and so yes all of this I think is going to have a long-term effect on employment and we're going to see high unemployment for good while several years at least ahead of us. All Right Steve Rattner, sobering news, but thank you so much for being with us. and. What Steve said about hearing from CEO's I've heard the same thing they're talking about. Cutting back. This pandemic has shown them. They can get by with fewer workers, few fewer capital expenditures. and. This income disparity that we had was economic crisis of our time even before the pandemic. Whoever wins this November is going to be dealing with us. In fact, we're going to be dealing with this as a country for the next twenty years. Hey, it's Chris. Hayes this week on my podcast why is this happening? I'll be talking with Ryan thumb about the Chinese government's ongoing ethnic cleansing of its minority. You can make people submit, but it's very difficult to make them think differently, there's bound to be a large percentage of this million or so people who they determine to be irredeemable and I'm worried about what happens you know the German? Concentration camps it was something like four or five years before the majority of the population them was Jewish and it was eight or nine years before they were connected to a program mass killing. So the reason I bring that up is goals can change especially when you're looking at such a massive system that has no appeal system, no regulation, no oversight, and we've already seen that the rest of the world's reaction to this has been rather slow. That's this week on why is this happening search for wisest happening wherever you listening right now and subscribe.