03-10-20 The time limit on accountability
Welcome to native America. Calling from Studio Forty Nine Albuquerque. I'm Tara Gatewood. The South Dakota legislature once again struck down a proposal to extend the statute of limitations on child. Sex Abuse Cases. Abuse survivors are among those pushing every year to remove the time limits on filing suit against organizations like the Catholic Church. Their efforts are so far unsuccessful. Coming up we'll hear about what's behind a push in what some other states are doing. We live right after national made of news. This is National Native News Amazon. Tonia Gonzales representatives from law enforcement agencies throughout New Mexico recently gathered in Albuquerque for a task force meeting on missing murdered indigenous women. Captain Aaron. Total Lena with the Gallup Police Department says it's key for law enforcement to be involved. I've been just under twenty years of law enforcement so we've come a long way from what used to be reported a longtime ago as far as the the stigma of YOU GOTTA. Wait twenty four hours. You're not a family member. Can't take the information so now the importance of that in what we're coming into the transition of that. I think it's awesome that what we're able to do now. Total Lena says jurisdiction challenges are of concern especially in border towns. Such as Gallup in our area we are surrounded by the Navajo reservation the Zuni reservation. We also are right there by the state line of Arizona and New Mexico so a lot of people come to our area Mike I said it's a place where people come to shop in. That's where the rat so they're going to want to report but then they were actually missing out of our area. We're still gonNA take that report so I think that's something that's really changed. The eleven member task forces collaborating with tribal governments law enforcement and the US Justice Department to identify barriers and improve the reporting and investigation of cases. The Task Force was established by New Mexico's governor last year and is expected to report findings to the legislature by November twenty twenty the Alaska legislature has passed a bill to establish march twelfth as Ashley Johnson Bar Day. The ten year old from cots you went missing in September two thousand eighteen and was later found sexually assaulted and murdered her case impacted communities across the state and led to calls for more to be done to address sexual assault and violence. The bill passed the House Monday. It's intended not to only remember Ashley but to raise awareness about sex abuse and help individuals and communities heal. The bill passed the Senate last month and now heads to the governor. The new at circum polar council is raising concerns about possible impacts of the corona virus if it spreads to the North leaders say inuit communities in the Arctic or at high risk because of a lack of basic infrastructure including indoor plumbing. The Council represents people in Alaska Canada Greenland and Russia leaders are asking governments to assist enclosing infrastructure gaps and prioritize housing water and sewer and to acknowledge the challenges and Inuit communities when establishing a response and preparedness to the Krona Virus and other infectious diseases. An exhibit of indigenous art from Yale University's vast collection is curated by recent graduates Melinda to WHO spoke with Co Curator. Just absorbing about the exhibit. They poured over the thousands of pieces held by Yale's peabody museum and by other institutions on campus and winnowed their choices down to ninety three pieces. These include items such as pottery clothing and moccasins made from animal hides and beadwork a hide a mask from current British Columbia and paintings by contemporary artists. I think seeing the way in which this exhibit was able to bring so many people together in terms of not only the community bringing all these institutions together into a single space but also reaching outside so thinking how we met multiple times with the Mohegan nation how we reached out to tipo officers the tribal historic preservation officers across the United States to talk about our work. We formed relationships with the works themselves. The Exhibit Entitled Place Nations Generations Beings. Two Hundred Years of indigenous north. American art runs until June twenty first at the Yale University Art Gallery in New Haven Melinda to. Who's national native news and Antonio Gonzalez National Native News is produced by Kohana Broadcast Corporation with funding by the corporation for public broadcasting like the circle of life. There is an opportunity that comes around every ten years a chance to participate and let our voice be heard it. Lets others know who we are and where we are the twenty twenty cents? This will be our opportunity to shape our future for generations to COME SHAPE. Our Future start here. Learn more at twenty twenty cents Dot Gov paid for by the US Census Bureau native voice one the native American radio network. This is native America calling. I'm Tara gatewood before we get started. I WANNA point out today. Show covers the difficult topic of sex abuse which may trigger intense emotions for some people. If this topic you'd like to sit out we support your decision for almost ten years. A group of women in South Dakota are among those who pushed to change the state statute of limitations on civil liability for child sex abuse. They're all citizens of the Turtle Mountain Chippewa tribe and attended the saint. Paul's mission Indian School in Marty South Dakota in their testimony. They point out the difficulty. Many survivors face in publicly disclosing alleged abuse or hurdle that can take years or decades to overcome in February. The South Dakota legislature rejected the proposal. This year twenty nine states are considering changes for child sex abuse statute of limitations. So we want to hear from you. What do you think about limiting the time? Someone can sue in organization like the Catholic Church or the Boy Scouts of America. Phone lines are open. The number is one eight hundred nine nine. Six two eight four eight. That's one eight hundred nine nine native today. We're going to start off in Minneapolis. Minnesota with us today is Michelle. Define a echoes. She is an attorney and advocate for child. Sex Abuse Survivors from native American boarding schools in a CO founder of the organization. Nine little girls and Michelle is Turtle Mountain Chippewa. My pleasure to have her with us. Thank you for joining us. Michelle thank you for having me in so Michelle tell us about the law about the proposed legislation You fight for seems every year now right so each year we kind of do an evaluation to figure out what approach we wanna take in this last year what we did was Two prong approach was to eliminate a provision in the Child Sexual Abuse Statute that was passed in two thousand ten which limits It basically blocks any survivor over the age of forty from suing anyone other than their directly but direct perpetrator so The way that the courts interpreted that was to Say that the Child Sexual Abuse Statute is not applicable to organizations Such as the the Catholic Church in so what happened was The women who Our organization is named after nine sisters from One family who were our child sexual abuse survivors from Boarding School What we've done is Gone in and tried to figure out a way that we could overcome this provision that was enacted during the While. Their lawsuit was pending. And then also there's a a window of time that would revive their claims That we advocated for also this year so there was a two pronged approach in order to remove that provision That blocked anyone over the age of forty and also blocks a suits against organization as well as reviving the window to open up People are claims for people who may have been blocked in the past into Michelle. What is the argument? Why this case in in those behind it filled that you should be able to sue an organization so There's several different Reasons why and we had a great expert testimony from Archie Hamilton this year from child. Usa DOT ORG and With University of Pennsylvania and they have studies and statistics behind them that talk about how reviving these windows of time to allow for these to go. Forth helps identify a child predators that may have been protected by the organization or may have been previously hidden to the public So that children won't be abused in the future. So a large part of this is for prevention of child. Sexual abuse in the future It also shifts the cost of abuse from victims to predators and those that hit them rather than The victims having to sustain the cost of abuse themselves for health care for all the other Ramifications that they're abuse Took a toll on them for the other thing. Is that it Educate the public about the prevalence gives them the wear awareness For the harm that child sexual abuse does to the families and the communities at a The whole And then another thing that it does do is offers Healing and justice to survivors offers. Them Avenue what we've seen happen is that The Catholic Church has admitted that they had this abuse occurred and they have been releasing lists of credible abusers they call them. But what I am. Finding is that on these lists are not listing the abusers from the native American community and so made of American survivors are being left out of that process of You know transparency from the church and that kind of thing and so. I wanted to make people aware of that. I did an open letter to the Vatican this year. explaining to the pope that that native American people are being left out of this process and that we need to be a part of it and without being part of that process. There's only other resources to go through the court system and we know that this definitely weighs very heavy on survivors and even family members and I did want to share this number of before we move ahead. The next national sexual assault hotline is one eight hundred six five six hope or one eight hundred six five six four six seven three If there are folks you'd like to contact to talk more about maybe some of these things that have affected you personally and so with that Michelle There's a lot of work being done to make sure that Those who are survivors have the ability to tell their story. Have the ability to protect a future generations in. So gimme a little bit about Some of the things that have happened this year with this case and pushing forward in wanting to open up limitations so We continue to push forward in the South Dakota legislature But we've been partnering up with a lot of organizations that exist nationally as a resource for native American survivors as well as survivors of clergy abuse. That large and so we've gotten a great deal of support For the survivors network of those abused by priests goes by snap and a lot of other organizations that are doing great work with the statute of limitations and other states like New Jersey and New York Pennsylvania Montana So that is really Given us a lot of hope and optimism and strength to get us through These legislative sessions. Which can be pretty brutal For us as we're we're shot down each year with these changes to the Statute. Thank you for that. And I do want to let people know that we did reach out to the Catholic diocese of Sioux falls and invited them to be on the show. Today they declined due to scheduling conflicts in so Michelle. Explain how the limitation is two years after the abuse. How it's discovered. What does that mean? Well the way that the Child Sexual Abuse Statute is written. Is that When a child is abused they have three years from the date that the time that their injuries caused from the abuse And if they're under eighteen and not those three years would start clicking from the time that they turn eighteen. There's another provision in that statute that allows for people time for discovery. So if you If you don't realize you're injuries A lot of times repressed memories are at play and that the average age of Someone actually reporting there abuse We've found out is fifty two years of age So there's a that time delay So the discovery rule allows for that time delay For three years from the time you discover it now the part. That's the problem is that there's that forty year old blocked anybody over. The age of forty can't avail themselves to that discovery rule and then the way that the Supreme Court has interpreted the statute they cannot apply this to organizations and so in a way to get kind of get around What statute of limitations apply to organizations in these cases the Supreme Court has said that you need to look to the personal injury statute of limitations. Which is two years from the date of majority so the court alternately found that these survivors need to go back. But were they should have filed back. You know to two years after they turned eighteen So essentially all of the boarding school survivors And all the native American boarding school survivors out of luck at that point and pursuing their claims against the church abuse works. Is this unrealistic? Oh definitely so. What even the states on studies show that children do not report their abuse until much later than the statue of limitations allow and Particularly you know the studies that show that Y- they often don't report abuse until they're fifty two so if there's a block against Pursuing claims at forty. It doesn't the statue doesn't match what's happening reality in so there's gotta be some consideration there in in in dealing with this such a sensitive topic with from with all it's it's not something that's typically you know how the law would typically handle something I I don't think the laws equipped to handle something like this that it involves such complex family and in countless emotions and and all of those different aspects of so The laws just really don't are are inadequate for this in so this also is a conversation for any state what do current laws state in terms of limitations on protecting survivors of sexual abuse You can give us a call. Share your thoughts. Maybe you're also working on the similar issue in your own Neck of the woods and What are some of the hurdles or Are there people who are listening in our considerateness? you can give us a call. One eight hundred nine six two eight four eight is number And maybe you are even following this case very closely. What do you think about this where the survivors have for years? Come forward ask for the statue of Limitations to be lifted and are telling their story What do you think about that one? Eight hundred nine nine six two eight. Four eight is the number What LAWS DO NEED TO CHANGE TO PROTECT? Our Children. Phone lines are open. We look forward to your call if you WANNA spend the night under the stars in a desert in a historic in near the California redwoods but you also want to support native business. You're in luck. There are a number of alternatives to posh resorts in hotel chains. And they're run by native entrepreneurs will hear about them on the next native America calling support for this program. Provided by the American Indian Higher Education consortium the collective spirit and unifying voice of thirty seven tribal colleges and universities for over thirty years. A heck has worked to ensure that tribal sovereignty is recognised and respected and that tribal colleges and universities are included in this nation's higher education system information on a tribal college or university near you at A. H. E. C. Dot Org. This is native. America. Calling interrogate would from a set of Pueblo and we are talking about the statute of limitations on child. Sex Abuse Cases Today. How long after the alleged abuse happens do you think survivors should be able to sue to determine an organization's accountability. The Boy Scouts of America the Catholic Church and the Church of Jesus Christ of latter-day Saints have all had child sex abuse lawsuits against them. And if you'd like to weigh in on this conversation today call us at one. Eight hundred nine six two eight four eight with us on the line today. Is Michelle The funding eccles attorney With the nine little girls she is also Turtle Mountain Chippewa. My pleasure to have her here and show the case that we've been discussing. Why do you think the South Dakota legislators don't want to pass this law I think that At this point I had different theories throughout the years and And this year I talked during my testimony about what my true thoughts are at this point. I think where the the the church is extremely powerful and we felt that power each year after year and And seeing it at work with the legislators and And so it it's it's really the I think that the legislators are following suit with what they think that the church wants and it probably largely due to campaign no donations that are being offered to them in so when we think about all this if the lower to change what would it mean for survivors. So if we were able to get a lot to change this would allow them to pursue claims in court that they haven't been able to have moved forward so this only gives them the opportunity to have their claims heard to allow their voices to be heard about what occurred to them. What abuse occurred and How organizations and how abusers abused their trust and as children and violated the law And it's up to them to they have the burden of proof Once they do get that access to the courthouse So merely what this does is give them an opportunity to be heard. Thank you for that and folks if you'd like to talk with. Michelle gives us a call. One eight hundred nine six two eight four eight is the number also want to bring in a voice joining us today out of Anchorage Alaska we have. Lc Boudreau and she is a child six abuse survivor and Elsie is Yupik Eskimo. She grew up in the village of Saint. Mary's it's our pleasure to have her here to share her story. Elsie thank you for joining us for another native America. Calling thank you and thank you and Elsie. I really appreciate you having the courage to be here with us to share your story and let's start there the question that I asked Michelle about the ability You know to to have these laws protecting survivors for you. Elsie the ability to be heard. Tell me about the power of that. Well I think there's so much power in that Just even as a sexual abuse survivor to be able to find your voice and to speak your truth takes a lot of courage and then on the receiving end having people believe you Does something in terms of healing that allows you to move from blaming yourself and That victimize victimize mind and heart and spirit Took place where you know that you did nothing wrong that you know. And and that's the wish for all survivors is to get to the place where they know in their mind and their heart and their spirits that they did nothing wrong. That would happen to them was not their fault and So the there's just a lot of healing in that and and you think about you know the generations of people that have gone through boarding school and the holding back of Or prohibit prescribing people from using the APP. This avenue to to speak their truth is Is more harmful and in the long run into Elsie when we talk about increasing the statute of limitations. Where do things currently stand in Alaska? What is the statute of limitations? Both criminal and civil you know I. I don't want to be the expert on this. Except I do know that in Alaska there are no statute of limitations on when it comes to child sexual abuse. That law changed And when when I went through the process and It was difficult to ascertain whether or not the law was retro. Active meaning Those p the people that I like myself who were coming forward. It wasn't clear as a lavas written as to whether or not it would apply to us After the changing law so that makes sense in Elsie. When you hear about other states in the big push going on in South Dakota what do you think about these efforts to reform statue of limitations? I think it's really really important Especially being that you know as just the nature of child sexual abuse and how secrecy keeps it so There's so much power behind secrecy. At some you know I always say Silence is deafening. When it comes to child sexual abuse and and for people that have gone through. This need to have an avenue where they feel That they can speak their truth and that there would be people on the other side that would believe them and so I think it's so important. You know it you know like you here as children. You know like Even even myself like I didn't even know the words sexual abuse and if you even as an adult I was in college and was asked if I had been sexually abused and I lifted my counselor and I said no like in my mind at that point. I didn't equate what happened to me. As sexual abuse because it wasn't violent And the person that abused me was a priest and so I looked at it as something that You know Even years later like just understanding how that has affected me like it takes a long time and I think for many survivors to get to that place where they understand The nature of the abuse. And how how it has impacted them takes time so Allowing for the statute of limitations to be lifted would give more people the opportunity to speak their truth into. He'll I agree elsie. I really appreciate you sharing your story and You know to hear that this is something that you have endured in. Your life weighs heavy on on me and hearing this in. I'm raises concerns too. I think to a lot of people especially in our tribal communities where often we hear. Our children are the target were year. That story of our parents are those You know who have come before us. And they're sharing the stories and Elsie. Sometimes this gets a loss when we start talking about these kind of issues that When it gets into the law or people are trying to break away from the statute of limitations. There are survivors who have to come forward and share their story. And how heavy is it to have to do something like that in a public space But but I know a lot of times you do that so that other people will not have to endure what you did but share because this is an easy to do Elsie. Well you know I appreciate the question and I think you know. Just looking back on my life and You know like it's been since two thousand three that I came forward. You know and like the four that time I would never ever ever even imagine speaking publicly about this and You know having gone through the process and having spoken my truth and and having people Believe me and I've gotten it's almost like my voice has gotten stronger and I can I you know I often say like even the media has been like an extension of my voice and you think about the little like being a little kid you know and how their voices are You know when when they're when they've dealt with child sexual abuse almost like their voices fragile. You know their spirit is fragile and Getting to a place where you feel contained and loved and held So it's almost like when you speak your truth your and you have someone believe you. It's almost like you're being held and And and I think that's really important you know Having that sense so that you know that you're not alone and what happened to you was not your fault fault and that You have a right as a child to be loved to be Safe to Not have to you know deal with the actions of the adults that are there to protect you and and when when you think about the boarding school and and I think about the nine little girls You know I I. I've had the the honor of meeting them and talking to them and I I'm really Ungrateful for them for having for taking this on and You know I think about them and think about how how much The experience that they've gone through has affected their lives in a way that No one can take that back. You know So I don't know if I'm answering your question. You definitely your and I think you know. Maybe you're even speaking directly to people who are dealing with this today In I wanNA share another hotline with you the child help. Usa National Child Abuse Hotline is one eight hundred four. A child Also the national sexual assault hotline one. Eight hundred six five six hope If they're folks at You want to talk further about this and You know just hearing some of this and knowing that there are people who are wanting to give more avenues to survivors Eight to be able to tell their story as well as seek justice for those who have created harm to them What are your thoughts and your hearing stories about wanting to change his statute of limitations. Do you think they should even exist? One eight hundred nine six two four eight is the number Elsie. Thank you very much I want to go to a caller. We have limit in eastern Washington joining us today. Thank you for calling in go ahead. You're on here thank you. Yeah I never understood why there was even a statute of limitations. I was pressured into sex at fifteen by an extended family member and I think that I Sexual intercourse at least twice. He he wanted me to give him oral sex and pressured me into doing that and In nineteen sixty eight I thought okay. This is You know I'm cool. And maybe it's okay but I really didn't want it and I have to say I'm sixty eight now and it really messed with my understanding of my relationship with NASA I subsequently Never told anybody. I was ashamed. Embarrassed I didn't want to be a victim either and You know 'cause I was mature grown-up right anyway I didn't realize later how bad that was. And I realized that subsequently my attitude toward men was okay. I just roll over for men and I'm pray and then I felt like pray like I was always pray I was very pretty and sexy and stuff and I was just a prayer and it was funny men off and I never ever ever thought even in my twenty why is there a statute of limitations on this. It seems so weird to me I mean. Why would you like? It's going to like the victim or so-called whatever we were are like it ends. It doesn't it goes on forever so that never ever made sense to me. It's still and I thought you know. I'm glad someone's advocating for reducing or eliminating whatever eliminating statue of limitations on child-sex-abuse. Because we know now you know it's it's not something that someone should just be able to do again and again that's what it is. It is horrible Lynette. A thank you for calling in. Thank you for sharing. Your story is well in Micheli. Turn it back to you because you know as we heard from the net you know. Why does this even exist What are your thoughts anytime that we hear arguments against lifting a statute of limitations? What is it? We're really hearing Well it's interesting Because this year while we were in front of the House. Judiciary Committee Advocating for bill One of the former chairman of the committee Timothy. John said you know we really just want closure with our laws so there has to be a time limit and I thought well. That's ironic that he and legislators want closure you know. And that's why either they're voting against our bill is because they want closure And how ironic is that because so many survivors? All just they would love to have closure but but can't it can't even get their voices heard because of these blocks that are happening in the in the statutes and in the litigation So that's often one of the things that we hear is that you know. The defendant have to have their right and they have to have a time limit because they can't go back and defend these claims. That are so old and that kind of thing. So there's a lot of arguments that we here we call it the playbook because everybody On the opponent side have had similar arguments That I just don't think hold any water to the type of damage that we as a society occur every time. A child is abused any form on especially a child sexual abuse so I'm definitely with college. Dispatched limitations needs to be eliminated for this. Well thank you for that. Of course again. Thank you to You know the folks who have the courage to speak their truth in telling us about you know how this is affected them in you know when it comes down to what we're talking about. Today's we're talking about lies or talking about people are talking about survivors As well as that intersection with the law. Maybe this frustrates you. Maybe you have run into some of this And you want to share some thoughts In parents to what do you think about You know what? This discussion is In speaking of this Being something that you've had to confront You know to protect your child. We want to hear from you. Two phone lines are open. One eight hundred nine nine six two four eight is a number and what more work can be done. What more needs to open up To make sure that Those in our communities are safe their thoughts on this give us a call one eight hundred nine nine six two eight. Four eight is number We do look forward to your calls. If it feels more comfortable to call him anonymously can liked the circle of life. There is an opportunity that comes around. Every TEN YEARS. A chance to participate and lead our voice be heard it. Lets others know who we are and where we are? The twenty twenty census will be our opportunity to shape our future for generations to come shape. Our Future start here. Learn more at twenty. Twenty cents is dot Gov paid for by the US Census Bureau. Thank you for joining us today. Here on native America calling and they're still time if you want to join our conversation. One eight hundred nine nine six two eight. Four eight is the number With us on the line today. is A couple of folks including Michelle Defy any ECCLES. An attorney and advocate for child sex abuse survivors from the native American boarding schools And she is a CO founder of the Organization of nine. Little Girls. Also here joining us today. Adminis- Minneapolis Minnesota is Christine Dean. Dc McLean and she is executive director of National Native American Boarding School Healing Coalition and she is Turtle Mountain. Ojibway my pleasure to have her here with us as well and Christine. I'm I know you're doing work on on this issue as well And we also heard from a survivor in in. We'll continue to hear from them. Imagine as our goes in Christine just knowing what all of this means especially when the statute of limitations is a reason. Somebody doesn't get justice. What would you like to say We definitely support removing the statute of limitations I think this issue in particular focusing on the statute of limitations and the Access to justice highlights the larger issue at hand. Which is that Not only in cases of of sexual abuse at these federal Indian boarding schools or church run Indian boarding schools that we Haven't had access to justice but in large part Folks in Indian country have not had access to justice on on many issues. And so you know we have a I have mixed opinions myself personally about You know whether or not a lawsuit is really What what is needed when we look at Canada and the Truth and Reconciliation Commission that happened. You know granted you know. People have criticized some of the outcomes but that did Start as a result of a class action lawsuit four Residential School abuses. So there is that access to justice in that avenue but we know that it has to go beyond a legal court cases and And monetary reparations. What we're really getting is healing. What we're really trying to get at is the fact that we need acknowledgment from these institutions from our government. Who's this you know? This was the result of federal policy to take our children and put them in these institutions. Where they were abused and neglected So it's kind of a larger issue. Yes we want our survivors to be able to have access to justice and therefore the statute of limitations is is something that should be removed. We don't need that there. To protect these people who were the perpetrators and the abusers in fact we know for half we know for a fact that the Catholic Church Moved people around. They moved priests who were offenders. two different diocese and in fact. They moved them specifically to reservations when they became Offenders so we had higher concentration of these sexual offenders at Indian boarding schools and on our reservation. So yes they should be held accountable. Yes we should have justice but it needs to go beyond that in Christine. What do you think about the argument that this was in the past in? I'm sure you've heard some of that. Come UP IN COURT CASES ANYTHING TO SHARE. Oh Yeah we know for. We have both Anecdotal evidence as well as Empirical data that says You know that there are ongoing affects That you know whether it was in the past generations or in the past if somebody's life that it does continue to impact individuals families and communities Through through the trauma that they experienced in their lifetime or through intergenerational trauma which means that behaviors and trump trauma responses. Get passed down to people as well as The fact that you know some of these sex offenders are living in our communities. Which is one of the more harder and difficult issues to address is when it's you know it's in our community will thank you for being here with us today. I'm going to turn back to the phone lines. Were GONNA GO AHEAD? And Welcome in Regina. Who's on the line in Pine Ridge South Dakota to dinner on? Kfi Ally Regina thank you for calling. You're on air. Okay thank you very much. I went to school holy Rosary mission and I know that a lot of priests left the priesthood and I know of one that changed just made how many people how many priest who committed sexual offenses or molesting change their names when they left the priesthood. And could that be looked into by going to schools and finding out because there are a lot of victims? Who are still alive and I know some of some of them were already interviewed a long time ago back in the eighties or nineties when they first started trying to file and South Dakota rejected it so how many of them were former priest Morella Gina. Thank you for asking Christine any thoughts for Regina. Yeah that's a really good question. I do know of a website called Bishop Accountability Dot Org. It's An independent website That tracks abusers in in the Catholic Church and so that website You know has a whole database of priest who has Been Accused of abuse. And I don't know if it necessarily tracks name changes but I know there is a lot of information on that website. Thank you for that Regina. Thank you for calling we. Now go to mark in Pine Ridge South Dakota tuned in on. Kfi Ally Mark. Thank you for calling. You're on here. Thank you for taking my call My name is mark butter. Baroda retired Commissioned Officer in the Public Health Service I was a physician in the Indian Health Service for twenty years and spent fifteen years trying to get Patrick Weber removed from medical staff privileges. He was Raping Boys and his exam room in eight Oklahoma Browning Montana and for about twenty years in Pine Ridge South Dakota and finally he was arrested and convicted and his will spend the rest of his life in prison. But we were running into a lot of problems with the statute of limitations in terms of trying to get civil damages for His many victims and the government Is exceedingly hard to sue and the statute of limitations makes it even more difficult moreover There was an internal investigation of the Indian Health Service. That was just released Which is very damning and suggests that the cover up of Dr Webber for decades was done at the highest levels of the Indian Health Service however the Indian Health Service has chosen not to release the findings of that investigation. So even in an institution that Ostensibly there to serve native people There's much secrecy and much. Obstruction of efforts to get justice for the survivors of criminal like Patrick Weber and a lot of have been following that case too in mark. I'm your thoughts to those who who have yet to be able to speak their truth One of the things that was so emotional at the sentencing of Weber was the testimony of the brave Young men who were able to come forward and it was very emotional I broke down several times and I was I felt privileged that I had Stood up for them all those years. but I know there's more of them out there that have not come forward and those of us who are are concerned about these crimes will continue to seek justice for them because it validates them and and and gives them some chance of getting their lives back on track after What he did to them all right mark. Thank you for calling in We now go to Marlin in Fort Hall Idaho tuned in on Kyw. Su Marlin. Thank you for calling. You're on here. Thank you My name is Marlin Cisco and I was sixty two It was born and raised in Oklahoma Shan. But I've been All over the place Washington. Dc FOR THIRTY YEARS. Now there's been four hall but And I'm in recovery and I work with a lot of Recovering alcoholics fanatics over the years So one of the things I was molested I an older cousin. Starting from the age of about five until I was about eleven or twelve and He was six years older than me so It was the age difference. One of the things Difficulties is secrecy around family incest and the shame that it carries route difficult to talk about I can talk about it today. Only because I've been in therapy for at least twenty years And I had to go through a lot of phase two for healing I mean for a long time. I thought it was my fault. And that one of the difficulties of One of the callers talked about didn't know sexual Being sexually assaulted was a a term. And it's true for a lot of this who are victims of like we participate. So it's our choice and it's not violence against us so 'cause we chose it but my therapist took me out when they and had me look at a six year old sending next to twelve year old and he said who has choice and it changed my life that day. So the other part of this. I think everybody's I'm on the side of moving the specialist limitations and like the colors to agree that have to be more than just court cases and legal ramifications that has to therapy and I mean. That's what happened with me in a lot of times it. It takes a lifetime to heal to in a really appreciate you sharing your story. Marlin into Come to terms with this knows really heavy and a lot of times What ends up happening with the abuse. Our methods to try in quo The person who they've targeted from speaking in in learning more about The nine sisters case that there was some of that that was going on to and so Christina WanNa turn to you you know when we have this also being brought up in cases You know the the abuse it went on also sometimes includes others those that were in a row that that were also around Those who maybe were covering things up for the abuser. In you know are they ever targeted? Do we ever bring lawsuits against them Christine? Well so I not an attorney so I can't really speak to that What I do think when you talk about that though is how How there is a need for healing for all of us right so the Catholic Church in in the cases that we're talking about Specifically they should have done a better job of addressing the abuse in the abuser. Right what was going on with those people that they were abusing children and then you know taking that a step further and and when it comes to our communities and Our our own relatives abusing US absolutely. We need to look at the abuser and give them The support and the resources that they need for their own healing. That is the only way that we're going to move past this within our own communities will thank you for the Michelle any thoughts on that. I agree We it it's GonNa take a lot more Like you're saying and then just pursuing the statute of limitations because it just gets us in the door legislatively Are you know into litigation There's so much beyond that that we need for healing and I'm glad that there's so much being done. by NAB and Other organizations and I'm so proud of our survivors for having such courage to come forward and speak out which is really helping all of the other survivors around them to and also we're getting to a place where we can really get to prevention. So I'm I'm just happy with that. Things are moving forward And at the same time wish we could go farther and deeper faster you know with our effort in Christine. We've got a couple of minutes before we have to wrap up here in. Of course we're talking about adults here but even advice on how to spot win sexual abuse is happening Maybe even with children in our life any thoughts as we get ready to close out. I'm definitely not an expert I'm not a therapist or counselor but I would I would say just you know. Keep an eye on your children talk to them. Make sure that they Have other adults in their lives. That that you trust that they trust that they can talk to I know I was also sexually abused the child and you know didn't talk about it until I was in my thirties and in therapy and then I I still didn't WanNa tell my mother so So if it's your own children make sure that there's other people around them That they can talk to in in case they Are Not able to talk to you. Directly all right and Do WanNA share another resource. The darkness to light help line. is a place. Where if you're suspecting that child abuse happening You can call. They can help Req- to people in your area. It is one eight six six four light or one eight six six three six seven Light spelled out in so Michelle Any other thoughts as we get ready to conclude I think that We just if we can continue to work towards Our goal of prevention. And if there's anyone out there who would like to help In that or volunteer or just have some thoughts that you want to share the nine. Little girls is open to to that If the best place to reach us at facebook at the our facebook page which is the number nine and little girls and you can just send a facebook message and we'll get it there But I just want to encourage everyone and survivors and and people who may be aren't survivors. Don't quite understand. Listen to the conversations that survivors are having so that you get that full perspective and where people are coming from and what their needs are well. Thank you for that invokes rappaport. Our here again. If you'd like to reach out you can always find us to comments. At native America Calling Dot Com. Thank you to everybody that we heard from our Michelle define me ECCLES as well as Elsie Boudreau and Christine Dean. D.c MC leave. Thank you all for joining US sharing your expertise and of course our gratitude to all the folks who called in. I'm wishing on a lot of support in good thoughts to our survivors. Who had the courage to speak today and really appreciate Your Voice on these airwaves tomorrow? We're inviting you back for conversation about places to stay in need of America. I'm Tara Gatewood support by southwestern Indian Polytechnic Institutes Early Childhood Education Program Providing affordable pathway for the next generation of native teachers who will meet the unique educational needs of native students. Early Childhood Education. Associate's degrees an all inclusive program with mentorship for success in education in an intertribal learning community information and application at SL I dot. 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