Morning Joe 3/13/20
Anybody right now and yesterday anybody. That Megyn task is to test. We there there. They have to test anybody who wants a test can get a test. Is that consistent with what you know? It's not consistent right now. That's obviously the goal is to be able to get testing for everybody who wants to be able to get it and to be able to get it in multiple locations but that's not accurate right now. Stop seeing young. People should not say if you wanted to touch right now. A Republican senator would like the president to stop lying about a national crisis the top expert on diseases. Meanwhile is calling the government's response by its proper name. The system does not is not really geared to what we need right now. What you are asking for that is failing and adapting. It is a failing. Let's admit it the idea of anybody getting it easily. The way people in other countries are doing it. We're not set up for that. Do I think we should be yes? But we're not Dr Anthony. How she will be our guest this morning on morning. Joe Good Morning and welcome to morning Joe. It is Friday March thirteenth. And what a week. It's been Joe. The past twenty four hours has put the United States of America in a very different place very different places. Been a lot of cancellations. A lot of sports cancellations and and yeah it's very disconcerting. Local state of lot of Americans The local states of emergency. That's in place. I didn't want to touch on a few things. I was a terrible day on Wall Street but am starting to see recognition areas that there hasn't been recognition in the past. And that's a really good thing. Willie we we. We saw senator say no. You can't get tests right now if you need them. That's important that that the truth start being told like that. Dr Falcone said the same thing yesterday said it was a failing last night. Sean Hannity asked as our secretary as our win kin every American. Get a test if they WANNA test secretary as our refused to answer. The question is being asked Martha McCallum earlier in the evening on Fox News. It asks the question. What about ventilators? We have a shortage of ventilators. How are we going to fix that in the person that was her guest? Just spouted off trump talking points saying well. This is why Donald Trump's doing such a great. You know that was the talk from last week. It seems that there is an understanding. There is a series and this this pandemic is serious. At senior citizens are endangered that millions of lives are endangered. And if we get ahead of it if we do better than we've done over the past month we don't have to look like Italy. I saw that yesterday Willie actually in a very depressing day on many fronts. But I saw that as a silver lining without question without Question Society States Local Government. Schools are taking this seriously as possible and it serious as is necessary right now. We've talked about this for a week. Now that we have to sadly look past the President United States who in many ways has his own interest in mind. We saw that when he misstated three different things during his prime time address. He didn't talk about testing. We have new reporting that I know because going to get into a second that he wanted to slow down the testing a little bit or not introduce new testing because he worried that those big new numbers of cases might hurt his chances at reelection. The country is doing the right thing in spite of its president right now I gotta say that's another thing Sean Hannity. Of course you said a lot of things last night most things that he said. Last night I disagreed on he. He was bashing the media pretty much nonstop but but obviously it's a free country but he also talked about how this pandemic was serious and said it was legitimate. That people were concerned. That testing had not gotten out there. Yet I mean this is what a pandemic one thing. The president said the other night I really agreed on was. We're all in this together and I hope the president of the United States starts acting more like we're all in this together but if it if we can at least have the same set of facts to start from which is we are in the middle of global pandemic. This is frightening. This is a real danger door for senior citizens in our grandmothers or grandfathers mothers or fathers which certainly sounded like that last night on Fox News. There was no talking anymore as there had been on some shows about hoaxes and media hoaxes but if we if we can have a debate on how to best do that right. Is it bands? Coming in and out of this country is that this is Blah is long as we're debating the same facts and everybody is just interested in one thing and that is beating this pandemic. Yeah well that's a good step forward for us as a country and the prevailing prevailing question. that that really stands to be the number one question for the entire country right now is how is it possible? How is it possible that? In some cases desperate people cannot get still. Can't I have you know Willie? We've got a good friend. And he was exposed to corona virus and try desperately to get testing. Couldn't do it so that's say. Just send him home. And he's he's counting the days he's you know he's gotta be locked in lockdown for the next four days separated from his family because they don't have a test to tell him whether he's he's positive or not so he's going to be off of work for about four or five days and people who work for him are not going to be getting a paycheck. This is this is being repeated across the country in Ohio reports. Are they only have fifteen hundred at guy in the entire state of Ohio in California Gavin? Newsom said you basically sent me out copiers without eight. Yes you gave me test. Kits did you. Don't have the chemicals to actually make the test kits worth a damn well this. This is what we really need somebody in as our. It's not as their he needs to quit. He needs to go home. He needs to play tiddlywinks or wiffle ball or whatever as our does when he's at home and we need to get somebody in there who will answer these questions. When are we going to get the testing kits win will old elderly? Americans be able to go in and get a test win. They wanted test to know if they're safe or not. What doctor Crouch you said yesterday. And we'll ask him again shortly here on this show is. We're not set up for this and the question is why is the wealthiest country on the face of the earth? Not set up for this. And you're right. That's the protocol people are getting New York and in cities across the country. Don't come into an er. Don't go look for task because we just don't have them go home isolate yourself. Drink a lot of fluids. Taking Ibuprofen treated like you've got the flu and just stay away from other people. That's the best we can do right now and of course me he. Yesterday there were reports in early on the president and want the testing process to go forward because he didn't want to get the positives because he knew that if numbers went up it was going to be bad for his reelection campaign. I trust that we are well beyond that. I trust that we are beyond that. But if we are beyond that we need a federal official that works for Donald Trump's administration to step forward and give us a time line. When are we going to get the tests? How quickly will our mothers and Fathers Grandmothers and grandfathers get the test? When can our children who may be testing positive for the corona virus? When can they know whether they are not so? We don't have to self quarantine them and keep them away from their parents and grandparents. It's a lot of questions legitimate question. Let's give you a snapshot. Now of how much the rapidly spreading corona virus is disrupting almost every aspect of public life. Maryland Ohio Michigan and now Oregon have ordered schools to close statewide. Kentucky's governor has recommended closure stopping short of a mandate the cities of San Francisco and Houston have also closed schools. West Point has told cadets not to return from spring break on Monday there will be no school or mass for the archdiocese of Washington. Dc THE MORMON CHURCH HAS CANCELLED IT services worldwide in the sports world. Major League Baseball has delayed opening day while suspending spring training. The National Hockey League has paused it season. The NCWA has cancelled march madness. Nascar races will continue without spectators while formula. One has cancelled its season. Opener live nation and eighty g. The Nation's largest concert promoters have suspended all towards Broadway Carnegie Hall and the Met Opera. Have Gone Dark as new. York joins five other states in banning. Large Gatherings Disneyland Disneyworld Disney cruises and Universal Orlando theme parks have shutdown late night. Tv shows have suspended production. Jimmy Fallon Stephen Colbert and Seth Meyers. Hollywood has postponed the release. Dates to potential blockbusters the latest installment of fast and furious and Mulan in the race for the White House the president has halted his campaign rallies. While Sunday's debate between Joe Biden Bernie Sanders has been moved from Arizona to CNN's Washington studio to cut down on travel which brings us the stock market. And its worst one day drop since black Monday in one thousand nine hundred eighty seven exactly one month. After the Dow soared to an all-time market high by one measure for total stock market value gained under president. Trump is now gone. The day started with the Second Circuit. Breaker triggered this week after the S. and P. plunged more than seven percent just after just minutes after the opening bell causing a fifteen minute trading. Halt the Fed tried to ease investors as the markets began to slide by pumping one point five trillion dollars into short term funding markets. Over the next two days however the day continued on a decline the Dow plunging over twenty three hundred points drop of ten percent while the S&P and the Nasdaq both sank over nine percent. Let's bring in some of the best voices on this topic. Former treasury official and morning Joe Economic Analysts Steve Rattner an NBC news senior business correspondent and MSNBC anchor. Stephanie Rules Stephanie. You Look Stephanie. At the Fed did yesterday they've pumped one point five trillion dollars and the market kept collapsing. it was last week. I guess that the Fed cut rates a half point to also tried to stop slide. The slide continued investors. Are They not sending the message to the White House and the world that this is not a financial crisis? This is a health care crisis that is causing a financial crisis. Stop throwing money at the problem. It's not GonNa fix it. You've got to fix the healthcare crisis. I because all these markets crashing. That's the fever. That's the symptom of the underlying disease. That's absolutely right Joe. What the Fed did yesterday wasn't was different. From a rate. Cut The one point five. Trillion is really to keep lending going to make sure we don't run in to a banking or a funding issue but something to remember when you see the markets tank like this. It's because we're finally actually addressing this health crisis and in order to address it you basically have to put the whole country. We're putting our economy on pause or asking every American to sort of change almost every aspect of the way we live our lives and the sooner we do that the sooner we can get to the other side of this. I mean there is positive if he looked to China this morning. All forty two of the apple stores are reopening. You're seeing in South Korea. Those numbers start to go down. So the positive is now that we're actually assessing and addressing this risk at least from corporate America than the sooner we can do that and send everybody homesick until they get better then we can come back because fundamentally the economy is much better shape than it was in a wait and you said it exactly right. This is a health crisis turned into a financial crisis. That's very different from where we were no eight. But you know Steve Rattner. The problem is right now. We don't have testing. Americans can't get tested because we we have a president and a CDC that is botched this from the very beginning so until we get that testing until we know how widespread this pandemic is in the United States of America. We can't start figuring out when companies are going to come back online. We can't start figuring out when people are going to start filling into stadiums again. We can't figure out when they're going to start spending their money can't again can we know. Of course we can. I think you talked about a health price. Financial CRISIS IS ONE CRISIS. In between which is an economic crisis the financial crisis we're looking at is really a reflection of what's going on in the economy. This is very different than eight. Oh eight was a financial crisis fundamentally more or less healthy economy and financial crisis here. The economic crisis is that people have basically starting to stop work. There essentially economic activity is me just read off dropping at a dramatic pace and that is going to come at a huge cost to our economy. When I was on the show I think three or four days ago. It looked like there was maybe sixty five percent chance of recession. I think today it's well over ninety percent. The BANKS THE BANK. Economists are all taking down their forecasts very substantially J. P. Morgan is predicting negative growth in the first quarter of negative growth in the second quarter. You can't have this much of a succession of economic activity without having a major implication for the financial markets which obviously see recession. Have the markets overreacted? Or not or not. I think certainly part of what's going on in the financial markets reflect a lack of leadership at the top a lack of testing kits a president who goes on television to try to reassure the nation and the stock market immediately rolls over. There's really no sense in the in the Wall Street community that I live in. There's no sense that there's any leadership here he plan for how we're going to get out of this and that's why you see them on the market in this panic stage. Will it stay that way? I don't know it depends a lot on what happens in Washington and the last thing I would say. Is that when you have a recession which we will almost certainly have you need to react to that and you need to provide. This is where Washington has a job which is to provide support to the economy. And this time. They're talking about a bill and watching at the moment. Which is a completely inadequate bill to address the broader economic questions. It may address sick. Leave or this or that. It's not gonNA stop the recession. We need a major piece of legislation out of Washington and given the gridlock. That's been down there for four. Years is absolutely no sign of that happening. Yeah but inuit concerns me. Is that everybody's talking about and I watched CNBC YESTERDAY. And there are a lot of people on there talking about. We need the federal government to provide this stimulus plan. We need the federal government to provide this this plan to workers. I mean yes. We need to figure out how to provide economic relief but again. You're just putting a bandage on a much bigger problem. That's going to continue to fester until you take care of the underlying problem. We need somebody telling US why. We'RE NOT ABLE TO GET TEST KITS TO AMERICANS. Were not able to get accurate figures on how widespread this pandemic is. We're not able to predict where this pandemic is going to go in the coming months until we begin the testing consistently. And that's that's what is so frustrating to me right now is everybody's talking about putting together packages For Economic Relief. I the problems are going to continue until we take care of the medical issues underneath and bad starts with testing. Joe Joe actually sounds like the biggest investors in the market right. Now we're not talking about economic stimulus. The two things they are asking for are the number of tests of vaccine and simply. How many people here have you remember? Dow futures plummeted right onto the president spoke because the first thing he was talking about was how much better we've done than Europe. How many less than Europe remember it was people overseas? Who are waking up to that going. Sorry you have no idea how many people have who have it. You haven't even tested everyone. Yeah the markets are like the rest of us like people they want to know what the hell is going on where the end of this says. Let's also bring in Ian Bremmer. He's president and founder of Eurasia Group and Foreign Affairs columnist and editor at large for Time magazine. Good Morning I'm even talking and writing a lot about China Steph. Just mentioned that the forty two apple stores in China are opening again. Maybe that's some kind of a signal that progress is being made. What has China done? We know that they've hidden a lot of the numbers. We know there's corruption there. We know it's a different kind of society than we have here. What is China done to begin at least to get its arms around Corona Virus? That maybe we can learn from here. Well they mishandled this desperately at the beginning as you say but but since then the recognition that Xi Jinping had personal vulnerability in not reacting effectively corona virus led to an extraordinary amount of direct quarantine over seventy million people in the most severe quarantine surveillance state that we'd ever experienced in the history of the world as a consequence of that their new cases are now down to virtually nothing and a double digits on a daily basis compared to the total of almost one hundred thousand that we've heard and that's meant that their economy has started to restart. It is restarting more slowly than they would have liked precisely because they don't want further outbreaks. And that's going to have an economic implication the other thing I'd mentioned more broadly what's China doing is. They're responding with propaganda very effectively against the United States inside Chinese media the amount anti US propaganda you're seeing is immense compared to when we had the China deal with the United States when they were being much money based on what it obviously started there. So what's the anti us? Based on the Americans going out and saying well this is the Wuhan Flu. It's the China flu. You're seeing that from the Republicans you're seeing that from the trump administration for president trump himself and also with some of the talk of well. Now this is going to bring manufacturing back to the US the Chinese the official spokesperson of China yesterday came out and actually floated a conspiracy theory that this originally came from the American military in Europe while the Europeans are looking at the Americans. And saying how dare you announce our ally announce a travel ban of our citizens before you even tell us before you even quoted. They condemned uniformly. The Chinese should go into Italy a member of Belton road and said we're going to provide you with a lot of medical aid and you actually see the plane showing up so when we go to China and say things like we want you to help us with Wa in three and six months time. The Chinese have made immense ground. Final point here. Steve talked about how we're probably entering. Almost certainly an economic recession. Right now the of this is a geopolitical recession. We don't have the ability to respond according to fashion. We'VE HAD TO G zero summit so far emergency of the finance ministers central banks. They've come up both times and said they're monitoring the situation. There's no emergency G. Twenty. There's no summitry between trump and the other leaders that lack of political resilience is an immense problem for dealing with this globally going forward. You don't even have the ability here to come to some agreement as to what we would do let alone with the rest of the G. Twenty medical system is in dysfunction. And that's affecting the market no question. I just want to very quickly. Underscore one thing you said. China did respond effectively after botching. A little bit at the beginning but they did things that we cannot do in this country. I think they quarantine hundreds of millions of people. They got everybody cellphone data. They tracked every used their facial recognition technology they put. They put people on lockdown whether they liked it or not no process. They just did it. And that's something that we both don't have. The tools to do nor the political will to do is the restart. That's happening in China right now. We talked potemkin villages. There are potemkin companies. Where the local officials are very scared about not having any new cases so they'll set the electricity going they'll get the trucks going. They don't all have workers so again the startup and China's GonNa take some time. There's one point though. Remember what Joe is saying. We first started this two days ago. We had members of the of the media telling America. This a corona is a hoax. It's a conspiracy theory to president. Who saying you should go to work a week ago. So we're a far cry and that we at least have to acknowledge this and tell people what to do. Yes I understand that we are at the furthest other stream and as I said before. There's no doubt in my mind I can't quantify it. The some percentage of what's happened to the stock market is a lack of leadership. Confusion lies untruths being told at the top but meekest civil society. As we've said and state governments and local governments have filled the void at this point. We all make you hear time and time again. Steve said that some of this is on the president. Of course a lot of it is on the president right now because again what you here. Time and time again is is markets need transparency. They hate the unknown. As we've been saying this show for a week. The president should deliver the worst case scenario. And say this is how bad it can get and this is what we're going to do to try to prevent that from happening. Markets is Stephen Stephanie. And everybody else knows a lot better than me. Markets then can count that in can consider that can make their decisions and if they get the bad news then then they'll prepare for that and then the markets will slowly start moving up again. They have still not been given that. You have to ask the question why that's not happening when you go. Why are there still not enough test? Because some markets can't make calculations on when companies are going to be back up online until they know how widespread the viruses since this started since this started testing has been fundamental and for some reason even Dr Fouled. She says it's a complete failing you have to ask. Why at this point? Why are we in this situation joining? Hey everyone it's Tremaine Louis. Msnbc correspondent and host of the new podcast into America in our latest episode NBC National Reporter. Aaron Einhorn Hits to Lordstown Ohio one year after General Motors shuttered. The Chevy Cruz plant. Gm is born but there are other economic opportunities coming into the region. So how do people feel about their future? Nineteen ninety-seven there is almost ten thousand members or at General Motors from December Twenty Sixteen till when General Motors shuttered. Plant sixty percent of my business search for into America. Wherever you're listening now and subscribe. We just want to be treated fairly like a lot of shooting happening. I don't care what he says. He's not getting my hi. Everyone is mainly MSNBC correspondent and host of a new caucus into America featuring journalist of NBC News. It's a show about politics about policy and about the power. That both had shaping the lives of the American people. The roller coaster is not any easier to stomach now than it was two years ago. Each week we're going into America to tell voters stories. He's doing the best he can for the country. Because doesn't mean that we should use on might've you can find new episodes of into America and your feet every Thursday to subscribe search into America. Where you're listening right now. Joining us now from the White House. Nbc News correspondent Hans Nichols and senior writer at Politico and Co author of the playbook. Jake Sherman Hans will start with you. Are we getting any answers why? The president just tweeted seconds ago. All red tape is being cut. But he sees we blaming a lot of this on the Obama administration on their response to h one n one so. When I walked in this morning the lights were on upstairs. The White House. That's always indication that we could be hearing for the present late last night. He was blaming. Joe Biden this morning it seems more a general critique of the Obama Administration he is indicating these things that some magical solution may be happening with the FDA and that all red tape will be cut. They do have the ability to waive some regulation. So that's where the president is rhetorically this morning We still don't have any answers really on whether or not. The president's personal physician is going to order a test for him or you can get a test last night. We heard from Dr Raji saying it's all up to the president's personal physician because the president at least those in his inner circle have been exposed to those who tested positive for the virus skies. Well the the president has been. I mean you hearing one congressman after another one official after another. That is self quarantine. Tainting Governor Scott. Now Senator Scott from Florida has done that because he had contact with somebody who was a carrier the president where we saw the picture yesterday. I believe. Wasn't he next to somebody who who is a carrier as well. So you have United States senators that are self quarantining for an isolating themselves for having contact even less direct and the president has had several people. I'll yield my time to Stephen Stephanie. On what the market reaction would be. Should the president announce a self quarantine? But I suggest that it would be pretty dramatic messing all of this. They you know. The White House is clearly on political footing. Right they they. In some cases they treat it like a public health crisis and other times especially from the president. They're treating this as a political matter. The market react and the reaction to that across the board Would be substantial so. I'd imagine that's playing into their calculus on whether or not they are at least announcing if any internal tests on a vodka and or the president guys again. The question is though how much worse do the markets get if God forbid? The president had corona virus. Because he's had these I party contacts in these spreads it around to other people. I mean there's a reason people self quarantine and I do agree. I completely agree. You don't want the president doing that it would be. It would be tough on the markets bite. If if we're telling senators and congressmen and telling others as well as citizens to self quarantine under those circumstances a very worried about the president right now all right so jake Sherman. Congress obviously has power to try and help people who are suffering through this crisis. I would think they would not go home on their weeklong recess before getting it done. So what's going on? They're gonNA pass today a pretty sweeping bill. You guys alluded to it before. That's going to among other things institute. Free Corona virus testing around the country. It's going to make sure kids who are out of school get school lunches but denied as you guys. Also alluded to the sweeping package. That people might be expecting from Congress partially. Because they're going to have to do this in bites. I mean they're doing this against the backdrop of spreading crisis which they have no idea. How big is how broad. It is how how impactful beyond the markets are on global health. Just one quick thing. The President alluded to red tape being cut. We have some of those details in playbook this morning and the FDA is going to allow a public and private labs to begin testing in New York. They're putting someone in charge of testing a nationwide. They're allowing testing on private lab platform. So they are doing some things to cut back on the red tape but I make this point playbook this morning and I think it's important to keep in mind the rest of this year the next five six seven months Congress is going to be wrestling not only with the public. Health fallout from this but the economic fallout. And I think I in my conversations yesterday and the Capitol members of Congress believed that they're going to have to bail out airlines insurers hotels mortgage lenders student debt people with student loans. Who CAN'T PAY STUDENT LOANS? The expectation among senior members of Congress is that this is going to be a very costly broad and expansive endeavor Hans. Let's go back to the White House Speaker when you on a question. I still haven't really got an answer to. Maybe you can help me out here. We have the opportunity to get test kits a month ago from the World Health Organization. We would already be up and running would have all the data. We need to do as many tests South Korea's doing every day ten thousand every day. That's about all we've done in total why. Why did the White House say no to the World Health Organization Test Kits? Which would have alleviated all of these problems and we would know where we are. The markets would probably be thousands of points higher and Americans would have a grip on whether this is going to be a serious as many believe it is. The answer is probably somewhere between Hubris and the sort of the protocols that you have in place for testing Americans so you've heard over and over again. The president talking about how we are the best response. We have the best healthcare system. He's just contradicted himself this morning though and he seems to be attacking the CDC in this tweet. That just came out three minutes. Go let me read it to you real quickly for decades the CDC Gov looked at and studied it's testing system but did nothing about it But a pandemic would never happen. They hope he's going on to blame. President Obama guys. It can't be both the United States can't stand next to CDC officials and talk about how great America's healthcare is and talk about the response. And then wake up on a Friday morning after all this market turmoil and decide that the CDC is the culprit here so they're going to have to reconcile some of this rhetoric and we may get a chance to talk to the president later on today. He's got a meeting with industry executives at one thirty here at the White House skies. And and part of reconciling this question Joe. I just wonder it's safe to say that. The president has not been clear every step of the way on testing. That's actually generous on my part. Is it fair to ask like the Mullahs report like Ukraine? Where the White House worked to squash information to keep people from testifying to redact things to make sure the information is out there if this information about testing is threatening to trump's presidency. Is it fair to ask that? He is putting off the inevitable. Perhaps this administration put off something that was fundamental that could be in place that Dr Foul. She calls a failing complete failing. Is it possible this administration did that for political reasons? Wrote should look into it Npr actually had a report yesterday that there were political calculations. President want the numbers to go higher because the higher the krona virus numbers. The more would hurt him politically in the campaign. But you know I think most Americans right now that have loved ones that they're concerned about say let the politicians and let the historians worry about that in the future. I think Willie most Americans right now are concerned about what the White House is going to do now and I mean let's a we have heard this corona virus. This pandemic is dangerous. It's bad but it's not. It's not the killer pandemic that many have feared for a long time. There is the possibility I mean really. I think that maybe we can cut the red tape that took so long that caused these delays. We can cut the red tape and be better prepared for the next pandemic that comes along because there will be another pandemic coming in the next few years and it may be far more deadly than the corona virus where you can't just isolate people and it magically goes away. The President says the frustration. You here in some of the officials and the doctors voices that red tape probably should have been cut back in December and not. Now we're having to shut down our our society to prevent this from spreading further. Jake Sherman hurt Senator Lankford. We've heard other Republicans come out and say no no. The president is wrong about this. You can't get a test whenever you want it. We've seen Republicans. Do the responsible thing many of them Lindsey Graham and others and quarantine themselves. Are there any of those people? Because we've asked this question this now become moot over the last three years. Is there anybody around the president and tell them? Hey Stop Man. But are any of those people like Lindsey Graham those Republicans in Congress that you cover their close to the president who can prevail upon him and and tell them how serious this is and you know this morning continuing his. What about is what about Obama with the H One n one. What about Joe Biden? He was doing that again yesterday as well. That's not helpful right now. This is a serious moment in the country. Needs him to lead probably not Let's just be honest probably not. I mean Mark Meadows. Who's now his chief of staff has quite acute sense of the politics of this all. And maybe he'll prevail upon him that. This is an important instance. I think what's really useful to think about? Is how limited. The president's involvement is in actual things that might help the economy and this public health crisis. He's had next. He's not called the speaker of the House once he they've not spoken. Vice President Mike Pence it presumably is in charge of a kind of government wide effort to to combat this Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin. Who should have no involvement because these the secretary of the Treasury not? Hhs Secretary or anything like that is the one negotiating with Congress. Donald Trump is basically at this point of figurehead for better or worse In this instance. It's it's amazing to see that. He's just become a bystander. As the New York Times put it a a passenger in this car while the rest of the Administration. Does the actual work needed to govern? And and that's why there's a deal today. Because Nancy Pelosi and Steven mnuchin spoke eat times yesterday on the phone and policy could work with Mnuchin via she considers him an adult and won't speak to the president. Bush has next to no relationship with them. So no I don't think I don't think I think the president feels besieged. I think he feels under fire and he needs somebody to blame. Who Cares about what the Obama Administration did here? I mean he's been in charge of government for three years. And even the Obama Administration. Did he could undo so I just I don't really understand I don't understand it and I don't think many Republicans I speak to understand it a really care what he has to say about the Obama Ariz. See you're at the New York Times? Maggie Haberman Peter. Baker have a piece in the Times this morning saying the president has become a bystander to a crisis. Politico's Jake Sherman. Thank you very much still ahead on morning. Joe We'll talk more about the global impact of the spread of Corona virus. What the United States can learn from Italy after leaders put the entire country on lockdown. We'll have a live report from Rome. Plus as we mentioned we will talk directly to Dr Anthony. Fao Cheat a member of the White House. Corona virus taskforce and one of the leading infectious disease doctors in the world. You're watching morning Joe. We'll be right back. Hey Guys Willie geist here. This week on the Sunday. Sit down. Podcast I get together with one of the biggest artists in the history of music. Should Nyah Twain. Get our conversation now for free. Wherever you download your podcasts secretary. As our has not always given the president the worst case scenario of what could happen. My understanding is he did not push to do aggressive additional testing in recent weeks. And that's partly because more testing might have led to more cases being discovered of Corona virus outbreak and the president had made clear the lower the numbers on corona the better for the president better for his potential. Re-election this fall over one hundred and thirty two thousand cases at the corona virus and nearly five thousand deaths in one hundred and twenty three countries have now been recorded. France is closing all schools as it prepares for a quote Italian scenario where the death toll has surpassed thousand joining us from Rome. Nbc News Foreign Correspondent Matt Bradley Matt. What's the latest on the ability to respond there? It's a really difficult situation here. It's really stressing the health system. Here you know the health system in the north of Italy where this is really hit the hardest. It's quite sophisticated. Kind of belies. A lot of the stereotypes that this country didn't have a health system that was adequate enough to meet the challenge. The health system in the north in Lombardy where which Milan is. The capital was very prepared. It's one of the best in Europe. It ranks right up there with Germany or the UK and they're still really really struggling and we're now well into this. Massive nationwide lockdown in which the government of Italy has said that sixty million people across the country need to stay at home. And that's why you know it's almost noon here in the center of Rome. And if you listen you can't hear anything. It's totally silent and that's really surprising. For this city. It's chaotic dynamic city. And now it's on complete lockdown and know. It's a chilling really chilling scenario. We spoke with some people yesterday who were walking around who are getting fined by the police. I spoke with one gentleman. Who was the chef at a restaurant? He had just lost his job effectively that morning because he works in this restaurant that has been shut down all of the restaurants bars cafes. Most businesses have been told to stay closed so he went to his restaurant to try to rescue thousands of dollars worth of food to try to bring home. It was all going to go to waste and he decided to stop the street and snap a picture of how vacant street was. The police came up and they had some words for him. Here's what he told us. The police find me. How much did they find? Sixty euro will maybe eight. Zero depends on the Oscar my certification of what? I work wedding. Yeah you need to have a paper telling where you work where you're going Limitation of your freedom. It's ugly so this limitation of your freedom. I mean we here. We are able to walk around on the streets because we've gotten a permission slip from the police but for most people they have to stay at home you know. This gentleman was fine. A lot of people have been fined but the government has also said that. If you resist that you could face up to three months in jail now. We spoke with the Ministry of Interior. They said they haven't actually imprisoned anyone violating the lockdown. But I think that as this goes on as it goes on and on and on weeks and weeks we're going to start to see Italians Resist and then we could start seeing some real police action. The mood has changed in the last couple of days. And we've seen more angry confrontations between the public and the police guys so Matt Joe. Scarborough here we. We've seen pictures inside of a Italian hospitals emergency rooms and it looked like it looked like war zones. They were doctors having to basically perform triage decide which patients had the best chance of survival and leaving. Those who didn't to die. Has that situation eased up at all or are they still in a constant state of crisis? That situation is getting worse. And it's a warning for the rest of Europe. We're starting to hear actually this cases in Germany just spiked. You know a couple of days ago. We had heard the Germany beating the curve that they were the ones who were successful because they had gotten out in front of all of these cases will now. That doesn't seem like it's the case thing. Is that once? This virus insinuates itself in a small segment of the population. It really is very difficult to stop and here in Italy. We have this experiment with radical measures to try to control the spread of the virus. This huge unprecedented lockdown the worst since World War. Two and it's still viruses still spreading. So it's almost as best efforts to stop the spread of this virus. The most severe might not help if the medical system is already overstressed and if the virus has already spread to a certain level and that's what the mathematicians are modeling. It's going to be really hard to stop once. You already have a couple of cases and that's why president trump's effort to try to block travel into the. Us is unclear whether that's GONNA work because they're already are these cases virus cases in America. You can't necessarily stop what's coming. Guys Yep. Nbc's Matt Bradley in Rome. Thank you very much it and I just want. Underline things really quickly that are important for viewers to get out of what magic said the first one is of course that this virus is is extraordinarily difficult to contain even locked down the numbers continue to grow the emergency rooms continue to be in a state of chaos and as he said one of the best healthcare systems in Europe one of the best healthcare systems in the world also talked about mathematicians being able to model the spread of the virus. They have testing so they have mathematicians. Scientists healthcare officials that can actually do those models and predict. What's going to happen next? We don't have the testing of the United States. And the reason I keep repeating that this morning is because until we get testing until every American is able to get tested and instead of so few then. We're not going to be able to model where this is going next. And if we can't model where it may go next. We're not going to be able to bend that curve. Downward and protect senior citizens protect our loved ones. Protect those who are actually the most disadvantaged when it comes to healthcare really well put on another country hit particularly hard as Iran in fact satellite images suggest the regime. There is digging mass graves as long as a football field to handle the bodies of victims. You would think it couldn't get any uglier than that. But our next guest says the United States has had an even worse response than Iran. Joining us now. The director of the Harvard Global Health Institute Dr A. She's Shy. He is practicing physician and also professor of Medicine at Harvard. Medical School and says America's Corona response is quote unmitigated disaster that the administration has brought upon the population so doctor. Let's start right there. Given what you know about the data of how this virus moves and how the United States has responded what Phaser we in and where are we headed? Good morning so that it's very painful for me to use those words The federal response really just has been a fiasco We've had two months. I think Joe's been this point all morning. We've had two months ago ready. And we're the only major country in the world that cannot test people far more readily than we are South Korea doing more tests every day than America's doing has done all until today so so things really are a mess and the problem is we have fifteen hundred cases. Sixteen hundred cases. That's who we've identified my best guess and this is a gas because I don't know week or we're not doing testing my best. Guess is there are many thousands of Americans infected maybe ten thousand or more Americans infected And we can't really. We can identify who they are. We can't take care of them and we can't Testing based strategy to get ahead of this virus and so if Americans if your viewers are wondering why are schools shutting down Y Our sport events cancelled. It's basically because the federal response has been so poor that we're now stuck with these very extraordinary measures which we hope will help. I think they will help But boy are we behind the eight ball on this and I can't believe we're here One more quick thing you know the president's tweeting about the CDC the CDC is the best public health agency in the world period. We all around the world we looked the CDC. This is not the fault. The problem here is that the administration has been trying to downplay. It has not taken this disease seriously. A week ago the president was saying this is nothing you not much worse than the flu. While the rest of us were screaming that we are headed for a world of hurt and the public health people have been ignored. Dr Falcon has been ignored until recently. So we've got a real problem ahead of us. Dr Willie geist appreciate you being here this morning. I think the question most Americans from the outside who don't work in the world of medicine have is. Why can't we get these test out? This is the United States of America. We've got innovators by means of production. Industry things quickly. Where are the test? We got news that the Cleveland Clinic is rushing at. Its Own test now at twenty four hour test from the Mayo Clinic. For example these other entities are stepping into the void. Here but why can the United States not quickly produce these tests and get them to the hospitals? That need them so low A. T. almost two months ago W. H. O? The World Halter musician put out a test. Kit Sixty countries decided to take it. We decided we weren't gonNA use it. Joe TESCO okay fine. We wanted to develop our own. That's not that's not crazy. We've got a lot of capability But it's been one failure after another and and look. This is not about red tape. There's always red tape and everything and the whole point of leadership. It's a cut through the red tape not two months later but upfront and so now we're playing catch up. We have the most innovative most dynamic scientific community in the world. I think we have a phenomenal health system but our government has been impeded to that has not been helpful. The FDA has been stopping labs from producing the test until very very recently. Why why is that? I don't I have to tell you you're going to have to ask the administration. I am baffled by this. I've been talking to my friends at the at the FDA. They don't understand the decision making that's happening at the at the senior most levels It is really baffling why it is that the administration you know there are theories like while the president doesn't want to know how many cases are well you don't WanNa know doesn't stop the virus from spreading and the viruses continue to spread across communities in America and deciding that we just WanNa close our eyes and pray that like this will go away isn't a strategy. It's not GonNa dr where you were seeded right now. You're surrounded by some of the finest medical institutions in the world in Greater Boston. Yup and yet you go fifty miles west of where you're seated it. Mimics much of the country in terms of medical facilities in terms of places to go to seek treatment. What do we do about that? Let's talk about where I'm seated in Boston. Some of the best medical centers the Brigham Mass General these great academic centers if I develop symptoms corona virus today and. Let's say somebody who was at high risk if if the question is by called up my doctor today in Boston and said I need to be tested or my doctor thought. I needed to be tested. Can I get tested? The answer's almost surely not we have so few tests. That very very people are getting tested. get fifty miles out. It's so the doctor. Dr Joe Joe Scarborough your are. Are we making any progress? Have you heard an administrator? I mean I understand. They botched things. I understand it right. But I'm not hearing as our is or was asked last night when they're going to get test to people. He refused to answer the question. On Sean Hannity Show. Do you have any evidence that this White House is moving towards getting testing to Americans? So what the president promised several weeks ago? If you WANNA test you can get a test. We'll actually happen. Look Vice President pence a week ago. Ten days ago even remember now when has been promising a million tests are going when I talked to state health officials and when they're trying to make plans for what to do this week and next no one knows where those numbers are coming from. No one knows when those are going to be arriving. And everybody's now starting to build their own tests because there is no faith that the federal government is going to be able to deliver on the most basic thing that Iran and South Korea and Taiwan can deliver to its people are federal government continues. Not Do so. I think there's just a lack of faith that when the vice president says we're going to have a million tests. Now look if Dr Tony Foul G. Says we're going to have a million has believe him because she has more credibility than anybody else in American this issue but I the political leaders. It's hard because they've promised this to us and they're not delivering all right director of the Harvard Global Health Institute Dr A. She's Jaw. Thank you very much Very very hard to hear some of this. It is it is already here and it was hard for him to actually say it. He's headed hurting. Have to say that and and this is not like we see rattener. It's not like we lack the technology. We obviously may lack the will in the White House to get sick. Americans tested still. We lack the will in the White House. I think it's also a failure throughout the government in many ways you heard you heard the doctor talk about the. Who tests that? We decided not to take for whatever reasons we produce. The test didn't work and so on this is this is where we look this. Can you trace some of this back to the stock market? This is a lack of confidence in this government and his inability to even the simplest things like etta tests kit out and it really is quite remarkable and I think the responsibility really goes certainly starts at the top but I think it does. It does go fairly far down in our government in Joe. Just use the word we lacked the will also lacked the ability. And you might remember Steve Bannon. When the trump administration took the White House talking about deconstructing the federal government deconstructing the existing apparatus government. Do you think that this is partly maybe mostly what we're dealing with now? The deconstruction the destruction of government. That helps people you know. Actually I think you're GonNa find that our institutions is still pretty capable. I think there's a lot of resilience underneath the top of leadership in the US government. And I think that's why we eventually do get our act together because you've got states you've got mayors you've got corporations and they have the architectural work under a providence. We don't have trust in our leadership an absence. We really didn't want to have a crisis under this administration and we got lucky for over three years. Then get lucky this time but let's not forget that trump tried to cut the CDC in every budget that he is. I know unfortunately stopped but he was also tried to do so many things with so many strongmen leaders around the world. Think about the Russians. He was stopped. I mean the story of trump. How many times. He's made efforts to shoot himself in the foot. Both domestically and internationally right shoot. The country in the foot and was unable to because the institutions are actually surprisingly resilient and. I think that at the end of the day that will be the story when we look back on this despite all the pain. We're feeling right now. That will remember. I hope so. Ian Bremmer and Steve Rattner. Thank you both so much and coming up. We've seen a stark contrast between what president trump and what top health experts are saying about. The Corona virus will talk to infectious disease expert. Dr Anthony Fauci and as we go to break the global pandemic destroying clear contrast and how world powers are handling the crisis while the US government struggles to get its testing protocols in order other countries may have a built in advantage. Take the nation of Estonia for example. We recently spoke with that country's president. Who said well. There have been cases of corona virus in the nation the systems already in place or limiting group exposure but that is the other side Estonia Somewhat Kona proof in the sense that all our government services online. We don't go to government. Offices still apply for social services for drivers license or for other other things that you normally do. Our government can do this everything from afar for example. I have signed digitally from Turkey. Well Hey it's MSNBC's Chris as this week on my podcast wise's happening. I'll be talking with writer. Author Adam Higginbotham on his book midnight in Chernobyl ultimately what happened is they got used to doing these things that the regulations said that you should not do. But at the same time they were given these ridiculous deadlines that are given these extraordinary production quotas so something had to give on. This was typical throughout the Soviet workplace. And so they ended up doing these things that were dangerous. They were lulled into a false sense of security that they could get away with pushing this reactor round and it would kind of take any punishment and then one day you know turn round and bid them. That's this week. I'm why is this happening? Search wise is happening. Wherever you're listening right now and subscribe.