EP58 Satan, Merlin And The Millennium Falcon With Mark Rees
General ricardo style chandler podcast the shirley brice rattle local humanity the ocean they hey everybody welcome okay to episode fifty eight of the weird wacky. I'm wonderful stories podcast. Everybody but i love your voice terrible. What's happened to you. You've been learn job. Esau saw tonsillitis going on there. Oh you're funny. Aren't you as you'll probably here. We go young pricey with us today. I i'm not calling him pricey. I've got a kick under the table and the duck squeak tuhtaboi. We price for this today because i had to work so you're stuck with the young man today and prices here to oh yeah yeah sure so we got a thank you to make first of all and that is to kado who has left to start amazing intro thank very much. It's all in spanish as you can probably hear and i'm sure what he was actually saying. Shelley's amazing definitely makes this podcast. I'm glad to have him on your welcome to the show. I'm pretty sure that's what i said ed clearly i love you because you don't argue with me you mondays. You just agree. There's no point okay so if you want to send us an in show you can all you gotta. Do is recorded on your phone. You can do it with yourself. Just some friends get apart and go in a bit of fun with it and then mail it to mail at weird wonderful dot u._k. And we will put it on the start of the show for you. Thanks for that inspiring words. Bryce yeah no problem okay. We're gonna get roy onto our interview today. We've got a return guest with us. Today is mark reese the also so of ghosts of wales a victorian outcomes. We spoke to me while ago. He's an new book now and it's called the ages edge of curious wales and there's some fantastic tastic bits of information in there again whether from wales or whether you're from another part of the world doesn't really matter because you will find stuff that's really interested in here by this and it may want you come and visit our noyce vice greenland here and you can. Maybe pop in and see us as well. That'd be absolutely mazen. Fan meet up yeah exactly that would be a really good idea. She have a find me so be us in another two people people who listen actually you know what this is no word of a lie i looked at spotify fire because spotify just released a new app. They've taken the analytics app over the beat. The test in they've now made available to podcast us to attribute to look that properly over the last week. We've had thousands of listens on south thousands just in the last seven days so yeah i'm ready. You ready impressed with the analytics just on spotify so that's really cool anyway. Let's get on with the interview. Please welcome to the show author of the eighties out of curious swailes mockeries. Hello mark. Hello good morning. How you doing very good very good. Thank you sally nice to be back yeah. It's nice to have you back. We really enjoyed enjoyed the last time we spoke to you and we had some amazing feedback from listeners as well say. It's probably one of the most entertaining and interesting shows. I think that we've done definitely update with my favorite and i know i speak for balance when i say that as well thank you sally. It's not <hes> i don't set out to be a stand up comedian or any stories stories could die if the story is could make people laugh. That's even better. That's really good. You've taken a little bit of a deviation from the ghosts. They are still ghost in this new book new book being we in the eight hundred of curious wales yep. There are a lot of myths and legends that you talk about in there as well and a lot of historical information as well so a little bit of a change in short of theme but definitely i would appeal to our listeners in exactly the same way really as the ghost of wales that you did because even being a welsh myself south. I didn't realize that there was as much rich history and legend as there actually is an. You've definitely taught me a lot about wales that uh-huh hopefully yeah thank you. That's that's what i set out to do. Really is to you know there's no point four and people with the same old stuff to find new new quirky things to to to let people know about and and and as you mentioned it's a bunkers mix of things really which like in a way but it also makes it hard to explain. It's just as a crazy collection of way too wonderful things ready from the past go in some of the stories in the book. I love the fact that you're talking about king arthur and merlin inness and know that there's a lot to do with king author merlin in wales also komal in relation to the bosley apple you discussing the book and link with the island of avalon. Now we work quite closely. She was actually lake avalon entertainment right another poker show that we work with and i know that they would left noah bit more about this story. So can you just give a little bit of an introduction into the bodily apple store in hi got links in with king aspirin merlin yet bazi apple is a <hes>. It's a very unique. It's the only happy apple in the world of its kind which was found on on the island and the island is really is steeped in in our therion mythology and folklore and some say you know his his boat is sunk underneath breath. Another name for about the apple is actually millions apple because millen is set to be sleeping nearby dead in a state of rest because only we part of the stories of that author and moulana both out there sleeping in various places across wales waiting for our darkest hour. Let's come back to life and come back that can save us. Some people might say that's gonna be quite soon but it definitely wait into to help us but it was found on a tree which was growing up on the side side a house which would which i believe is still there and they've since sort of use this tree to to grow the middle of the apples and they send it off to an expert to to be analyzed analyzed the description. It was dr joe morgan who spoke to the bbc about it. She said again you know. It's the only variety in the world of its kind. The boldly striped wiped pink over cream rep and crowned. I haven't tasted the myself so i can't say just how nice they are. I i called like the idea. There's this unique foods which you get from wales which is grown in wales and it's also linked with the whole therion mythology again which which comes from the country the avalon into that any males avalon is partly to do with the name of the king arthur history way you know is the welsh kangol kid of britain's who who fought off the the saxon invaders even though nowadays it's pretty much been twisted where he's seen as the king kingland in some cases isn't he which which which is incorrect avalon if you translate it's sort of the welsh version of it was language version. It is the isle of the apple trees because apple is the welsh would with with an app. Instead of the atoll is the welsh word for apple. That's where it all sort of ties in with arthur again. Even though oh i did the welsh language that just surprise me a lot. I don't know any of that anymore didn't even learn welsh in. I didn't even know well awesome well. I didn't learn in school so it just goes to show doesn't it time to change and they are bringing the language back which is good so you'll have to excuse my pronunciation on some of these cawood. I'm the opposite because i was in welsh language education and i actually ended up mispronouncing english word soon. Let's v. is f- in welsh and things and so yes. You'll have to excuse me if the other way round. We'll we'll help. Each other is about some of the stories that you into may actually inspire people to visit wales. Have you contacted contraction dwells tourist board or anything about the book. I haven't but again i i really hope that's the case my my last book which isn't really that weird and wonderful at all was a book colder little book of welsh landmarks and it's one that it's it's ironic elite things turn out i. I wasn't that enthusiastic about writing about it because it's much more dry. Hey there's no there's no ghosts and weird stuffing really but it ended up being my best selling book based on you know an initial sales and that is one that people definitely will pick up and read eight and come and visit the this one in some cases might have the opposite effect if they read about the ghosts of mood was running around. They might think actually we'll take a detour not stop off at that place. Yes i hope as we mentioned king off. I think authors in wales should be really proud of this. This is a global global global creation which disney making copies about and it's from wales so these are things. I think we should shout about a lot and hopefully people will come and exploit without going the detail i mean there's things in there that tell you it's like mount everest and there's something which i do want to discuss later on we won't but there's even a military operation that it goes on which is absolutely fascinating and there's so many things that actually in some way wales has played a part in like i said it really did open my eyes so i think that will inspire. I people to come here as i tell you. One thing i did enjoy was you talk about one of the oldest houses in the country all the oldest house in the country and you mentioned the the at right at the end of the bed and breakfast and you can go and stay there and i was just aren't gonna find out what this place is. Yes yes the way they they date. These things the the the terminology was all double dutch to me to do quite a bit of a googling words are trying to work out what was going on but it's it's absolutely incredible. How you know a little piece award in a house can be used to determine you know and not just the decade maybe of the century to the actual year and not even just the year they can work out what season it was. They think it was actually in july of that year and it's just incredible how tall something wasn't it was the fourteen hundreds yes yes tell by headed added electric flexible. It's put it that way so getting onto some stories and some questions about them in regards to the cat eriksson murder stone yes. Could you briefly explain what a murder stone is. Let stones yeah. I mean this isn't something which is unique to wales and you can't find them. Dotted across england ended the u._k. I think they were stones which were put over the bodies of people which you know as as the name suggests mood but murdered and and the culprit the mood was never found always never tried for the crime. They serve two purposes. Really i mean if you look this stone. It's got in huge letters at talk murder. It's like a big newspaper headline at the top mood as you can't miss this and what that did is it almost served as a reminder to the criminal or the mood right who'd done it that look we might not have caught you in this life but and this is going back to a much more religious time but you will pay for what you've done you know when when the final judgment comes when when you pass over you know there's no escaping your crime forever and it also of course was a sort of a lasting memory to the person who had been murdered but yes it has a double meaning really of memory of the person who died but also to the criminal leaves like point a finger at them saying look what you've done and don't forget it because you know the the man upstairs. It's not going to forget this one right so it had quite religious connotations than that very much so yes. I mean these are going back to. It's not something we do nowadays. It's something that may maybe up towards the early twentieth century when wales was much much more christian country but but yes they'll quite tragic. Tragic gravestones really really which which serve as a reminder. I think quite nice the one in cat exton which included in the book if you popped cat exton which isn't isn't too far more i live. There are still flowers flowers on the grave. Now people remember this even though you know. Centuries might pass. It's something which is embedded in the community in a way while you know gruesome crime has happened and the locals sort of remember the in this case the lady's memory you mentioned that you do in talks the book at the moment yet while she used to be the most popular of the stories that you you talk about. When you're doing the rains i've kind of got this reputation as the ghost bloke the welsh ghost bloke and what i i find it it is that when i'm talking about this book i mean when i was. I mentioned the little book of welsh landmarks when i talk about that what it wherever i go. I ended up talking about ghosts so ghosts or key part of it. Another thing which i'm quite interested in myself at the moment is curious and encouraged objects things around wales and there's quite a few interesting ones within an hours drive where i live that i like to watch where possible rather than just talking about something in the past which you can't look at if i can stand next to the coolest object and pointed it and say this is the thing which is going to destroy your town of course up in bed. That's great you know and that there's a few examples around you like the <hes> the swansea dabble which is a statue in in swansea museum this cursed wall of talbot a on on the grounds of steel steelworks and there's back to mill in. There's millions aliens oaken kamaluddin and so things curious as the things i try and focus on that's what interests me at the moment but i think whatever i do. I'm always going to be you know the west coast postman so this new steeler in port talbot. What's the cursor by then relating to that wall. I actually had to do some electrical work on that site. Roy waller and yeah just interested in whether whether i brushed up against something i shouldn't have the good news is you're in very you say thank god i love this because this is as you mentioned for these these stories which are really out there than which people don't really know but but i grew up in potato but this is sort a story that i knew from friends and family members and things but it's actually i should. I should stress this. It's actually on the grounds of the steelworks which is private property so pleasing. If if you listen to this and you wanna look at it get permission first. You can't just walk onto the steelworks. I know from experience. I i was their admission to go there and even so when i took a photograph the this big security god just know at charging at me unwashed washed over my shoulder as i deleted the pictures until his boss arrived to say that it was okay for me to be yeah. That's it is security is tight here but this piece of the wall was once a part of mark and abby mark. Maybe i think a lot of people smelly with markham cost lamarque country park now but that that wants sprawled out over the grounds with the steelworks on now and up up the mountainside and there's loads of ghost stories and ghostly monks happenings connected with that side of it but on the steelworks land this one remain in piece of wall according to the folklore is where when dissolution of the monsters happened and and lost monks were kicked out of that property the lost monk to go it is said placed a curse on this wall and he said if this will add a foles this town will fall with it <hes> it wasn't called patel but at the time he said this town is going to fall when the last bit folds down and what what what is things really remarkable. Is that you that's a lovely story story but the mansel family who bought the land afterwards left that wall where they didn't knock it down and it's in quite a it's quite an awkward place nowadays because it passed into the the markham mm family and it got bought up by the steelworks and the steelworks gone through steel intolerant chorus nobis companies and they've left this wool then it's right outside one of the i'm not really up on steelwork in but it's outside of big plants where sparks and lovran steph hold fly out yes some kind of dangerous went on in there and there's a lot trucks trucks that go back and forth carrying the steel whatever material comes out of the back and forth along the road on this wall is right on that route and so what what has happened is. I think it was in the seventies. This wall studied wobbling slightly so rather than think. Well just just cleared the way it's it's. It's a pain anyway. They actually put buttresses like you might see on a church search up behind the wall to mick didn't fall down to keep it stable and then they had a couple of a mrs with the vans driving around so then they built this barrier around it. Just make doubly early shula that this doesn't come to pass and it's details like that that i love. It's not just the cursed wallets accused war that tara a major multibillion corporation operation that go their way to protect this this little piece of what is its talbot folklore really but it's little things like that which i think at a bit of magic magic to win the salvator places the have these things and so yeah the curse it was cast by this monk many many many years ago no tartar keep it safe with these barriers one interesting little bit and this is going back to ghosts slightly with which i picked up when i was visiting this site i was talking to the resident historian that michael graham and he he was saying that two men working late nights by the wall on some some crane type device noticed a ghostly white monk figure by the wall and as a result adult refused to do that job again and they were given other jobs in the in the work somewhere. I believe but what we noticed was that this monk. They soul was dressed in white. Now everyone is saying aim. This is the monk who cast the tourists going back to the old stories but that monk would have been wearing a brown habits like like -mongst at the time <hes> what he also discovered in his research afterwards is that this will be in so far away from the abbey itself would have been one of the farm buildings but the that they built and working the farms wouldn't have been the heart go. It'll pass monks. They would have been off praying monks do they had labor's who did all the manual work the the real work you could say for them and the labour others would dress in white ropes nice that go story for men who wouldn't have known anything about this has been sort of checked off the historical list and in some some way so our corroborates the story yes exactly yes yes although you could say that anyone who sees a ghost usually big white wobbly thing don't they but but yes yes. That's nice nice detail pitcher the snowman then your marshmallow man. It's just really the the idea that the curse actually cut through all of the red tape and bureaucracy that maybe town planning departments may have maybe i might build a new shed in my garden just curse yes it and when they told me permission. Just let them know this this on it. Maybe it will stand the test of time after all. It will say it's amazing. How these things these cursed objects you know from from an aesthetic point of view then they're not the prettiest looking to say this but it's just the cool story this although i'm sure your shed is lovely but it's just the cool stories which were attached to them. Take the spiders love it anyway going on from stories about ghosts in lease section on castle cock. You mentioned a spectrum cavalier yes yes. Could you give any more information on that. Well the cavalier. That's a bit of a footnote really who who is said to be visited the castle in search off aww i believe it's treasure money something which which he's left there but castel core is a fascinating place for go stories and things in general i'm part of it ties to the old castle which this one is built because this one is very much a fairytale folly type building which was built in the victorian times but there's been a castle on that site from long before all these stories trace back to when he was owned by evil bark who is now the the name of a rock levin county but back then he was very much a real man and and he was very worried about what would happen to his body and things when he died in the afterlife so we have to spend a belief slightly for the story but he he decided to have two of his guards transformed into stone eagles to watch over his body when he laid down underneath the castle after he died and that happened happened and when he died he was put to rest underneath the old cast of coke and the two stone eagles will place that watch him and lo and behold to silly burglars. I did decide to try and enter his rest in place steelers things and these eagles a said to have sprung to life some variations. It gets quite grizzly into the rep. The boob listed strides strides and leave a bloody mess everywhere but from that sort of old folkloric tale we get all these new new story springing up from it. Some say that maybe me these. These burglars are still roaming the place now. Maybe evil box still maybe the eagles are still there. I now we have this cavalier. Who's also sort of looking around looking for looking for whatever what is that he's left or lost their for an interesting really how the different stories can bring up all around just the original one. If i'm with a lot of places where you start with egos story and then it just spirals out of control well. I think people take things off in different tangents and chinese waste byzantium little bits to it but yeah no cast of coke i mean even without the ghost casco is fantastic place so each walk around in whoa in that place and and the ghost extra of magic to it's always quite comforting especially 'cause i work away coming home and then driving down the m four and seeing that on the right hand side loyd is further in wales a beautiful beautiful site beautiful building. Yeah i get the same feeling with what we were talking about martyrdom and the abbey because there's a little church up on on the side of the n._f._l. Where again spectrum monks set to be seen walking along the m four night. If you look at that part and i don't know if you saw the new store yesterday about in newport they've just put this gigantic whilst dragon on the side of the end for the so. I think anyone yes so next meet dr pozniak. We'll keep an while you cut missing huge dragon but i i like the visits the country and they come over the bridge. They're going to get dragons and they're gonna fairytale castles and they're gonna get ghost monks on all these things all the one stretch of road as they committed. I just a again. I suppose just shows the curiosities wrote the yeah definitely while we're talking about dragons. We can't talk about whales rarely without talking about the origin of the red dragon you talk about that in the book as well as some of the dragon is is you can trace it back a long way. I mean the story i chose to focus on the book is called a bunkers one really which is rather than going back the origins of the dragon. It's the last recorded sighting of dragon in wales. It's really difficult to explain excellent excellent interview. There was a period in the early twentieth century but not in ten. I think where some stamps were misprinted which they had the king's head on at the time we've got with queen set now oh but the king's head on at the time and they will misprinted with the red dragon on top and these things taken out of circulation but a few of them got out there one man who lived in the sketti area of swansea swazi disappeared one day on his way to the university and he was carrying a book now this book was set contain lots of old weird legends of wales at including stories about dragons but he he just disappeared off the face of youth on a few days later his wife received atlanta which had one of these weird misprinted stamps on it all of the king's head with the welsh dragged on top and and in that letter it was it just said look. Don't worry about your husband. He's fine and it was signed by this. Mysterious group called the natives of the welsh dragon and the also put husband's signature segments are on it just to prove that he was there and he was safe and that was back in those days the win- phones or mobiles or anything she just said wait and this man has mysteriously vanished. He's just turned up again. One day in bryn mill park nearby from scotty with no memory away heaping what had happened but all he knew that dragons were real so volt accounts ounce he'd seen a dragon wherever we beat this native group in wales had been keeping dragons hush hush and keeping them quiet somewhere in the country now this could a slightly tenuous link this could tie into the origins of the story because i mean if we believe there was such a person as king arthur. King arthur is said to have a dragon on his banner. Did it didn't look current. One land into a very famous lost native welsh principles had a golden dragon on on his band and really we can thank so it's it's the two family who of welsh origin even though they went on to beat some of the ruled england <unk> britain really did help to reduce the dragon then as as a as a standard image of wales yea i mean it was much later on that. We actually adapted at venice. The flag and it's become synonymous with the country now. Isn't it absolutely absolutely one of two countries in the world with dragon on its flag really told me something as well. Today there was a story in the book and that was a story of quite tragic story actually of i'm going to say this wrong breath galette. Is that right gal. Yes yes no. That's that's good. That's good. Thank you yeah china's by that because the demise of the dog gallard was tragic. Yes galette is galaxy. One word is the name of an actual place in snowdonia which is named after garrett's grave would be this welsh grave gala. This is the dogs named galax soap eighth galette. Let the two words be combined to make the name of the place and that is where the grave now is. If i tell you sort of the folklore side of it i for we tear it apart and spoil the story the story which is it's actually recorded on the grave so i do visit spirit gallatin read the story and seal about it but it goes back to king slow well in i believe don't quote me on that who went out hunting one day and he left his faithful hound galette at home to look after the baby while he was out and about and she came home from hunting to find that the place was just just a bloody mess and the child's caught overturned there was blood everywhere and he saw the dog sit in that with all over its face and it's feats paws rather than feet feet and he naturally jump to the conclusion that the dog had attacked his son and his heir as well. You know this is this is a royal man so he just took out. His sword lashed out of the dog. Kill the dog and that was that it discovered that well he he had a baby's crying to begin with this helped him with discovery and when he looked he found the baby was actually unharmed in the overturned cart what had happened. Is that a wolf at commend to the house while he was away and brave galette had fought and killed the wolf. It's saved the child's life by mistake. He then lost his own as a result when the prince came home so that is the the horrible horrible story which doglovers will hate but the good news as it's probably probably all rubbish so so that helps it's believed that it was invented by all people a pub landlord back in the the eighty nine th century to try and drum a bit more trade for the town and it worked because it's still working stay people still go there today to visit grave for dog which isn't underneath it. It doesn't henry mad at me if it's true or not it's a wonderful wonderful story and it's reflected in the aunt would and this is the grave and there's statues of galit's and there's various dog automated knickknacks. You can pick up a gallon as a result so i think that's a great part of it but yes the the town is named galata. I mean there are some who think that even the gallant in the name name of the place isn't even the dog they relates to a saint called calot which has been been mutated galette but yes that's the story and there are lots of stories like this all over europe of this sort of tragic tragic dog figure mistakenly killed by its own and this is probably the best example in wales that we have it in the section on the curse of brand you mentioned that there's quite a lot all of bees and wasps that can be seen fighting over one particular hill yes. Do you know of any natural explanation for that or is there none that you have encountered. I don't i'll be honest. The scientific side of it isn't something i dwell too much on but certainly i i've never come across any other armies of bees and wasps sort of meeting its own and fight into the death before so it sounds sounds like what clinton unusual i quite like that one as well actually sort of pop culture quickly but when i was writing this was before game of thrones at finished and there's the whole connection with bran iran who is a character in this in the show for those who don't watch it quite a prominent character who can be traced back to two welsh mythology again so part of me was just thinking. Wouldn't it be cool to get brad in your somewhere because he's he's on all the television screens at the moment and based on on welsh legend and the best brian story i could find was this bizarre story of. I should explain quickly where there's is a site where with the curious said to be an effect and people go there and just find bodies of dead bodies lying around the ball dead wasps line around where they've been fighting. I i haven't seen the myself so i don't know what what the truth is in that but there are newspaper reports out of this going on anything that kills loads of wasps is fine by me. Yes team be moving back to haunting quickly. I'm sorry steve back towards that. There are of course is discussed in the book and i love the story louis and the title of this particular story. The bedrock in splice struck me about this story. Is that involved a hardened. Well not hard. I started don't call it hot and a skeptic whose job was a solicitor so you would think following sort of the rule of law if you like and everything has to be written down and judged in a certain way and what have view and yet you've got this person who openly was a skeptic who encounters these things happen to their child and who is then converted to believe in trying to challenge by that story. Yes no need to apologize talking about ghost. That's my specialist subject. I guess now this is a story that the last time i spoke to you on the podcast i i was talking about the victorian ghosts and what what happened is as soon as i finish that i was on a roll and i went straight into research in edward ian ghosts of the next period afterwards woods which fingers crossed will be full book one day but in the meantime this is one of the stories that i loved which i found in my research and so i decided to put into into curious wales. It's a house in lambeth impotence on the main street in lampeter which i'm assuming is still the island worked at the specific house but maybe i shouldn't actually do this for someone living though doesn't want to hear the story but there's a house on the main street in lampeter and there was a buy ins of terrorized by what we know he'll poltergeist activity. I guess they probably wouldn't that terminology on it in the early twentieth century and it was his bed rocking at night and his father was getting annoyed at what he assumed was his boy mess make an abandoned noise at night and you know the old click around on the year as they would back then to stop him but one nine hundred just he just lost his time but his bed was banging away he couldn't sleep and so he physically grabbed the head of the bed to stop it and and that's pretty much the moment he switched from being a sceptic to be slightly something of a believer when he held the top of that bed and he could feel like an energy pulse eight inside it and he knew that the moment he said of leftovers grip slightly lettuce strength go that bad would be off again banging and shaking so that was the first sort of a nerve in moment he wasn't alone. There was a maid servants working in the house who who'd been long gone on ghost things certainly the one who looked for his son. I believe his name was tommy but looked after tommy. That'd be monin for a long time but things banging and moving and shaking this bad was not gonna stop and decided to move the ball downstairs into the living room to see if that did any good and it it just it just carried on so this goes pulled gust whatever whatever you wanna call it appear to be following the ball you're on the house rather than being confined to just the bed as these things do would spread around the community and by all accounts the bank was so loud you could stand outside the house and listen to these things going on and this is another one of these remarkable stories from back in the day where it is said that according to the newspaper it's as many as three hundred people were standing outside that house listening to the ghost banging away on the please set come and actually move people out of the way to get traffic to be able to drive down this road. Let's hope it was the ghost well. Maybe they would justa into three hundred people. It's gonna play hey either way they were entertains but it wasn't just the people outside who wanted what's the bad baggage some some religious people who popped along. I think this is the highest. Authority was the bishop of swansea who came down. They were all pretty much of the same opinion that this is something not of this world that was supernatural all these things on there were some attempts to communicate with some accounts from psychic time which i'm always slightly dubious about sort of taking face value but they claim that by using a series of taps knox and things they communicated with this ghost so they could ask questions in the bed and objects things banging reply but it's certainly something and you know heads had lampeter go in go in crazy and a one quite interesting sort of bit the end of the story in the presented the story. Is that one day one of the boys he it more than one son had. Some friends asked what this black lady was doing on the stairs which you can only go in the black lady. It was a ghost but this is a ghost which the maids <unk> had seen walking around the house beforehand and this'll outside witness he knew nothing about it came and then also so this ghosts too. They think that this thing might have been connected to a black lady also also in the house or maybe it was two separate grossly things but we don't know because it was over one hundred years go now well. I guess we could go back and explore nowadays and see if they're still there but yeah that's the story of the bedrock in spooky lampeter interested in those things still going on vacation today and this is what i say to a lot of the ghost groups and people that i speak to is that these he's a stories which have firsthand accounts and were reported in the press at the time was being genuine and so you know rather than fifty pounds to run around some house. Somebody said he is haunted. Actually if you go back to the source there are some fantastic places out that which which aren't being looked into right now and i think this would be a great opportunity for someone if assuming the current owners don't mind a bunch of ghostbusters tended up banging on there until these places are out that to be explored yeah you make a good point because i tend to see you know obviously we're on social media and we've got a lot of people that are from lots of different ghost groups that follow us that we follow and we try and keep abreast of what's going on and i don't mean any disrespect to any of the groups when i say this but but you tend to find that there's almost like a circuit you'll see one group will go to this other place. Tend another group will go to the same place and it kind of it makes me wonder whether really the ghosts. I decided to go shit another one less often. Should we all. You've got the other thing as well where by f._a. Ghost group for want one of a better word and investigation group go into one of these places and they detect something and then they run the cleansing ritual or whatever it is they do to try and put spirit for it to peace are they then ruining it for the next group that goes in if you like that paid their fifty crater nacional anything because all the gossip buggered off because they've been sent back to wherever they aka from seems funny to me like you said they would go to all of the places that seem to be hammered by these these organizations and not look into the investigation eventually find instincts. There are maybe lesser known but just as relevant exactly and like you said from a commercial point of view gatorade of the ghost is a terrible. Oh thank you should put a stop to that one. I would imagine a house in lamp to or you know even the fight and bees and wasps were brand is said to be buried there that places free it just turned up a free and have a look good luck to the commercial places but there are other places out there as well and i think the the the different i went on a tour of cornwall recently and visited the oldest all of the famous holy places of baden baden jalen in jamaica and in these places. They're making that into a hotel by the way bob michel believe they are. Yes they will show show me. The plan's actually looks absolutely fantastic. Tasmania is also creepy and i think these places absolutely fantastic but you have to remember the also commercial places and having ghosts is is good for business and certainly helps but i want to put them down. I absolutely love them and i'm planning on going back there soon. Yes it's it's suggesting alternatives to people at saying look. You don't need eight to raise a thousand pounds to go on a ghost investigation. You can do it for nothing. Just by finding these places out there which are the people are overlooking. Nothing social media's way fold as well because if you ask people they've got a whole entire sort of save got going on. You're gonna get inundated with people whether they are people that are just gonna pull the wool over people's eyes in which case. You're still going to investigate a. and find nothing or whether you're gonna find someone who's legitimately got an issue. Come up with some decent footage evidence. Whatever exactly yes yeah so jumping from the topic of ghosts too something. I suppose a bit more concrete and factual. I consider myself to be quite the star wars connoisseur. If you were yes yes i can see where this is going. I did not know that the life size version of the millennium falcon was actually assembled in wales. Yes yes the millennium. Falcon is welsh in that that respect yes. Physical falcon is welsh. Yes i think it was partly down to the millennium falcon the lifestyles thing life size but it's a big object and they had had to find a large enough empty space to assemble it and they had to have workers with the skills to actually make a big giant spaceship and luckily for wales will we landed ended the contract with what out of george lucas himself but with with lucasfilm's whoever it was to make in pembroke dock because there were these large empty hangers sitting there with lots of skilled people in in pembrokeshire and it was done behind locked doors but it was a very hush hush affair at the time nobody was allowed to know. I actually reports in the newspapers at the time of some secret u._f._o. Going on in pembroke dock in which which was kind of right it was a u._f._o. I guess but he was one four for a stall was film rather than anything he might find an area fifty one say the one downside inside of that story is when they finished build in the millennium falcon. They had to drive it to england rather than fly it but they everything. I guess it was a you. Oh they're not yes yes. I asked you this question when we did the last interview on the last show and i'm gonna ask you the same on this one because you came out with some entrusted information. That wasn't included in your book last time so i could ask you again. Walk shocked you most about the research that you've done into this book and what is is your favorite story. Favorite story is going to be the swansea dabble which i can. I can tell you quickly if he talked about the swansea dabbled. This is another one which partly kasit of nostalgia reasons. I remember from my childhood. It's another cursed object and it's one which again nicely links folklore with real life events but the statue statue. It's a three foot toll wooden statue of a battle so people sates can painted to look like a data. There are theories that it might be a greek or roman. God audie might be back as it might be because it's got the sort of the cloven hooves and stuff the hole in his head. It looks like the modern idea of dabbles. It's been cold. The swansea dattel now the folklore behind the the story is that church in the middle of swans equal saint mary's church and in the nineteenth century the tender went out to find an architect to to build this church and it was won by an ankle throughout the bloomfield. Who's a very respected english architect. He did the college of music london and either. He landed it and did a fantastic job yet yet. There was one architecture swazi who was very very annoyed about this possibly because he thought he could have done a better job and thought he should have had the work. Maybe just you know didn't want these. Architects come in and take jobs from me whatever it was but he was upset and he decided to get his revenge on the church for for spoon in him an and job so when a lot of buildings next to the church became available he bought up those buildings knock them down put his own buildings became known as brewery buildings and on that that building he plunked this car in the dental staring at the church and according to the prophecy which i'm going to paraphrase likes remember at the top of my head. He said my data is going to laugh and lia church burns to the ground so you built this building for the devil on inside my daddy's gonna watch your into the ground. That's the folklore behind it. Then the second world war came along and for three days in the early nineteen forties swansea city centre was was just pretty much wiped out with decimated and blitz and that is why so many ugly the building in swansea now all the rebuilding that went on in the sixties the church was one of the buildings that was wiped out but the building next week with the devil on was not an that dental did infact sit there iraq leslie some might say watching as this church burned to the ground as the bill that he was on avoided all of the bombing that was going on the planes above so that that is the the folklore and then the reality which came afterwards now swollen was was redeveloped after the war those buildings were replaced with shopping center and the devil went missing and it wasn't until the nineteen eighties somebody nobody said what happened to that to the devil and they put a little notice in the newspaper saying anyone know on its by some weird coincidence. Somebody was on holiday from germany who've grown up in swansea who remembered in the data and it seen it in a carriage in hera foot of all places they went off to harris picked up the davel wrote him back to swansea the f. some wrangling and some paperwork and things and now it's back in the city and ever since then it's been in the shopping center looking back over the church again and more recently sort of to keep keep it safe and to give it a liquor paint. I guess it's gone to swansea museum now. It's on permanent display so if anyone wants to go and see the devil or have self with the devil than sitting there in a in a glass case for anyone to go and see so that's that's pretty much favorite and i forgot what the other question was that was that was a shock to most when you're doing your research what really saw laptop and shocked did you one part of this book. Which isn't my counselor. Signatory is the more crime and punishment side of things. I had to include say ten percent of the book is about little grizzly stuff of which is you know as i said isn't my thing and one or two of the more let's say sort of serial killer type stories. I left out the book because i didn't want it to be that that doc but i did find find some horrible stories in the archives which i have looked and thought well it would fit but thanks but no thanks yeah. I'm gonna stick to the ones which slightly more not quite as dark as that take them. There was one story. I'd real trouble trying to work with this in the book. It's alpha love never dies and it's about you just find the correct name itself cajon price fifth baronet and sheriff of montgomery show now. This is a man who to say he was unlucky. In love is putting it mildly. He married three times and when his first wife died and his second wife died he had both of their bodies preserved and kept his bedroom with him so he was there with with these two bodies which he kept within permanently and then go to third wife who also died. I mean his luck must terrible three wives in a row who died the food wife objected objected to have in the dead bodies of the previous wife in the bedroom for for obvious reasons but when she died he then went down the route of trying to contact contact them from beyond the grave and he went looking for some of those celebrity psychics at the time and things and and it pretty much failed what one really is just out. There sort of taylor picked up on his second wife died. There was a holy man in the village who was pretty much on death's door and he said i'm paraphrasing against lightly but he said you know. I'm obviously i'm sorry or you're gonna die soon hundred and it's very bad news but shooter favor but when you're up there can you ever worried about wives and the second one especially and ask her to appear to me as a ghost and chat the ad for this this man the the concept of death was just just non existent. You know these people were still with him but that one like i said it's not the most gruesome one that i found but it's probably the most gruesome on that i include included is the man who kept the dead bodies in his bedroom pretty gruesome nasa and understanding new wife if she lets you keep your old one around you know in in the bedroom eight go destined or on that thing yeah but we're talking swansea devil bay you mentioned the will and i think they should bring us to the last question if that's okay and that is the story by operation mincemeat which aycell was just amazing and the fact that the chap the is spoken in this story is still the respect to pay to him today still just go over that for us yes. I'm trying to find his correct name. I'm so glad this is dead because it's nice and easy. Give me to find that. I've looked with it but yes. We'll operation mincemeat. Is i mean there's also the the name comes from the name of fell fell which came out in fifty sixty s i think about an operation during the second world war where the allies wanted to trick the nazis in to sort of focus in on the parts they will not go into try an attack attack and they wanted to get the noughties away from the bad guys i guess from away from sicily and so the plan they came up with was that they would get a dead body would look like an officer and they would plant documents on the body of this officer. Let the body floats off into spanish waters for the spanish to find and then knowing that the spanish were were neutral they they would pass these documents onto the germans the germans what was in them but then they would also pass them back to the british trying to keep everyone happy happy medium and in these documents it suggested that they were not going to be that was just a decoy and they were focusing on greece and south korea and the ploy worked drop this body into the water and off it went and the nazis then did not concentrate wait on sicily rather they focused on greece idea while the allies then went to sicily now that is the story which made into film this was all done with the full approval of churchill at the time ah eisenhower who went on to be the american president eisenhower but what a lot of people didn't realize because of the secrets act is that body that they used wasn't an officer sir but actually a very unfortunate welshman. This welshman was called to endure michael. His life was a mess. His father died very young. His mother died not that much longer rafter when he's maybe thirty and he found himself pretty much living as a tramp he might have been a drug addict by. I don't want to say that but he's certainly down on his luck and he went off to london as most people i do. I guess you know to see if he could find any work finds fortune and while there we don't know if it was an act of suicide or whether it was just a man who was sort of pushed to the edge by starvation that he he would eat anything but in one of the places he was sort of stay one of the bandon buildings he was staying breadcrumbs which will mixed with rat poison to kill the rights. Let's eat the crumbs and he died soon afterwards and as a result of that the the doctors examining the body found that because he died of rat poison and again i'm not really up all the gory scientific side of it but that would leave his body in such a way that it had the same effects as someone who might have drowned contain phosphorus. Didn't it yeah so that body would easily easily double up as as a drowned military person and that's pretty much what happened. He has signed off by church was dressed up in the uniform taken off and they don't even the water and off he went but nowadays holidays of course when this body was found by the spanish he was actually given a grave in spain which was dedicated to a fictional person that the are the fictional papers they put on him that was the body whether it was the his body but with the wrong name on the gravestone and so since then they've added a line at the bottom which says you know really blender michael and and i believe there's also some kind out of memorial now back back in his hometown while he's been added to the wool memorial but it's a horrible horrible story but in a way it's the truth has come out now to show that what what really went went on back during the second world war within the story as well you mentioned the fact that because obviously this chap had no family had not it was easy to use that body you ready with anyone put up any kind of fight for it and that it was released on condition that the identity would never actually be revealed and you mentioned that it was only in one thousand nine hundred ninety eight when of the papers were full disclosure that it actually came to light it was this wasserman so i thought that was absolutely fantastic. Tastic that you pay respects to clinton michael and the part that he wittingly or unwittingly this effort this whole war effort. Let's say it's it lucky. These things do get released. Eventually isn't it so we can't pay respects even even if it was unwittingly as he said a major war so it listen really thank you again for joining us and giving up saturday morning to speak to us. The book is fantastic for our listeners again the book as the head of curious wales. We've been speaking today with the offer reese. It's available way mark or bookshops. Standard line isn't as good bookshops and that includes online as well as good old fashioned physical bookshops which obviously my preference but yes just to situate apartment with shop and it's it's out there and yes thank you very much. I know last time you were on your shades your social media information as well also if our listeners want to get in touch with you could join us again. It's at reveal whales. Let's review wales and it's the same on twitter facebook group instagram the whole lot yes. If anyone wants to track down then please do brilliant. We'll thank you very much. Thank you again for joining us and we hope to speak to again in the future. Yes thank you very much. Thank you very much. Corral police speak to you about the next goes. Yeah definitely keep us. Yes all right brilliant. Thank you very much. Well bruce. That was your first interview well done. Yes thank q now. I really appreciate your stepping in to the breaches day. That's what that's the word in it stepping into the breach. I think so yeah stephanie into your britches. That's different. I really do appreciate you step in today for human yep helping because the last thing people want to listen to me. I'm sure that's not true. Everybody's is going to have to be sure to send in an email intel him now. Tell us how well bryce did. That'd be nice off mail at weird wacky wonderful dot k. and also you can have with anything that you want onto on that. If you want to send us any information anybody would like to talk to or any topics that you'd like us to cover on instagram. We are we at wacky. One full podcast on twitter. We are at the w._w._w. Podcast on the next episode. We'll be giving you information on how you can win. Signed copy of the haunted the auction book that we covered last episode those of arrived in the post now they're all looking pristine and new adorned with nick tyler's signature so listen for the next episode to find out how you can win a copy of his book signed by him lastly. Don't forget if you wanna send us. I intro senate to mail out we'd walk. You unfold dot com you can. We'll put you on the top of the show other than that. Thank you very much for spending time with us again today. We really do appreciate it and bryce. Whatever you do. Police do stay weird wacky wonderful just as good as uh-huh <music>.