238: Youre probably breathing wrong | Brian Mackenzie, human performance specialist
Welcome to the my Buddy Greene podcast, op, Jason, walkup founder and Cosio of my buddy, green and your host. Hey Everyone Jason here hope you're all doing well. Today's episode is brought to you by US and the product I. Am really loving right now as it's saving my sanity, are hemp multi plus product. It is a huge relief for me from everyday stress, and that stresses realized my wife and I are trying to run the company together at home while working from home without childcare and two little girls, so it is definitely stressful and what? I love about this formula for one. The hand is certified organic from the European Union highest standards in the world, and then you throw in potent botanical Rosemary Hobbs Black Cumin seed. It is amazing for the Endo cannabinoid system, the master system, which regulates everything from stressing Ziobro mood, and then vitamin D. one of my favorite vitamins. You throw that in which is great for immune, so this formula is definitely saving me right now. it takes the edge off helps me be a little less reactive, and that's that's definitely something I'm focused on at the moment with the little ones so I hope you check it out. Go to my buddy. Green dot com slash hemp. That's my green dot. com slash head. Thanks so much. Brian. Mackenzie is the best selling author of numerous books including one of my favorites titled Unplugged. I first met Brian as he spoke at our twenty seventeen revitalize event about the power of our breath. Since. Then I've been hoped on his instagram. As he is quite simply one of the best in the world, when it comes to harnessing the power of our respiratory system to accelerate end, raise both mental and physical performance, he's worked with world class, Olympic and professional athletes top executives, and he's also here to help those suffering from various chronic and pathological issues and today. We're going to go deep on the power of our breath. Brian Welcome so good to see you and hear Your Voice Jason Pleasure is all mine and I'm glad to be here so I've been thinking a lot about you. In the context of Covid nineteen and the importance of breath, work and breathing in a mask, which I just am not good at and and we'll. We'll segue to later. Of You know, so let's start with breath work and your passionate for breath, work and You know how you evolved from Crawford Endurance to. was a hot word right now I know. God nother conversation. But, but I think so. Many people tend to think that we think about like being fit we. We think about you know being physically fit. Okay Running Gym Yoga. Cross fit what hobby you now being mentally fit is entered into the conversation with the mental health crisis. People are meditating. They're practicing mindfulness. But. We're not really talking about our respiratory system, so you know why. Why breath work? For you and talk about your your passion for the power of the respiratory system. I think the easiest. Way To look at it is I saw an opportunity twenty years ago with with passion right like. I was like I had so many different jobs like I mean I I I was detailing actually swept floors for jetski place, and then I was like I detail cars with a friend was in the restaurant industry bus tables waited. Tables managed a restaurant like bubble. Blah, Blah. I took a class on exercise science, and its Spin my head in the opposite direction. It was the first time I really cared about. Like school in any capacity I got cs on purpose like I did enough school to just get by right. So I got an amored very early on with performance, but that forced me to understand biology. Now. I don't have a degree in biology so I don't find. Tune it down to that much, but I have a global pretty good understanding and have studied biology. For twenty years to some degree and I was first introduced to. Like. Just spinning things on their head or really going in pivotal opposite directions very early on in my career is somebody challenged what I was thinking about injury, and what I thought about that, and how I dealt with it and changed in one weekend, and so I was enamored with human movement in that. Just by changing the dynamic of what we do with movement, things would change. Move this along. To about seven years ago where somebody handed me a training mask. And I laughed because I had already been studying elevation for quite some time and trying to understand how we adapt to higher elevations, because I was involved in endurance sports and getting things adapted that way and I knew that the masked although the claim was. Training Mask. was about elevation I was like that doesn't change pressure, and so I knew that oxygen levels weren't really changing. But I put the mask on anyway when I put the mask on I, did this. I sat up. Where I was sitting and I sat up because I organize my spine so that my ribcage had access more access to my room. And in that split second, my entire world changed again because I understood that applying resistance against the diaphragm four forced my system to self organize in to do something so I entered into this world where I was just enamored with breathing at first because I was like. Wait a second I could just put an athlete in this or client. And I wouldn't have to yell at them about changing their position. Because they're just automatically like change position, so they can breathe. And so it it just it, it just started, spin me out, and then I started studying the physiology of of ventilation. And how that directly impacted respiration which refers to cellular respiration, right and then I got more involved in the neurobiological standpoint of things because I continued to get challenged on things, and it pushed me to go understand and learn more and then I i. just. I invested myself in this so much that I i. Played with varying methodologies, ideas I had a background in Yoga, although I never paid attention to the fact that at the foundation of the Yoga, all yoga practice is a breathing practice. So it's not only the oldest movement practice, but it's one of the oldest breath practices right. And what were they saying? They're in Sanskrit in. You know all of these things that were. Like kind of compounding into this world that I had existed in nobody. That I saw or or dealt with? was talking about this and I was like. Wait a second. We're missing something here. Like fundamentally like these yoga. People have been screaming this for like five thousand years like you follow your breath into position, and this is I'm like. Oh my God like it just started really like. Making more and more sense than than when I really started extrapolating things that are used maybe in yoga, or even in martial arts to some degree, because those like Tai Chi and. Martial arts also use BRA. Breath control it became. Very obvious that there was this thing that was impacting people that we weren't. We were very dysfunctional with. It makes sense because we're dysfunctional arm movement patterns, and so breathing became for me. The epicenter of everything everything about our life. Revolves around breathing whether we like that statement or not. and. It does because the deal was made two point five billion years ago for oxygen and multicellular organisms, organizing to use that and the only way that we are able to use that system. Ninety percent of our energy is convert is is used with oxygen right through a process called Beta, oxidation or aerobic metabolism. Gay. That is dealt with by the air that I move in and out of my lungs. I have no other way of doing that, and so my movement patterns have to organize such. My physiology has to match what is opt what I should be optimally doing, and then my neurobiological component of it is, it just so happens that. My respiration set my ventilation. Centers are all set up in the brain stem, so there potter. They're part of this automatic system that sends out signals and is right there, and we have control of that system, and it's only one we actually have control over. And so as we think about. Her physical health, our mental health. You'd say respiratory health. Is the greatest of all of them because it directly impacts your physical health and your mental health, and can make you better better fit Would you. Would you agree with that statement that if we're going to focus on one thing, it's like I used to say for example years ago, I would say hey, if you. If you don't have time, you'll have time for one practice. I suggest yoga. Yoga's the best of everything in my in my humble opinion years ago. What would you say something similar about focusing on respiratory health and breath work? Es to now. They're subtle like look. By the time the world catches up to this and they're starting to. Where we're going to move past it. 'cause there's there's something there's there's something more to it like breathing's not ventilation, and like our breathing is not. The answer is just a tool. Right. We're just so removed from what's out there. Meaning the wild. That, we call it nature. When we are nature. We we we forget that and we use it in our language. And that really separates us from really coming back home to what we really are, which is, we're a part of this entire ecosystem? And just because we built houses and buildings and things in cars, and all that doesn't mean we're not still connected, but the fact is. We're dysfunctional in that our lifestyles and we can all attest to this. That we've taken on. We sit too much. we decay convenience of food options the convenience of our lives. All of these things have consequences. I'm not saying they're bad. They just have consequences, and if we get wrapped up too much in that, things become dysfunctional, and so by and large. That's why more than eighty percent of the population we'd suggest has A. BREATHING PATTERN! So when we look at any sort of disease in research that has respiration or ventilation. Rate attached to it. You're going to always see double, if not triple the amount of ventilation rate that is going on with somebody and disease. So that intern eludes to the fact that this Dall- breathing. Is The answer okay? That is not what I'm saying. Breathing is a signal. And it's instantaneous. Whereas heart rate is Kinda late to the game, and we're very enamored with heart rate right like hearts great, but heart reached an intensity marker. It has nothing to do I mean how many of us are looking at our heart rate to to to garner calories, right and heart rate actually has nothing to do with your calorie burn. Nothing. So. Eighty percent of us aren't breathing properly. Roughly APP, so it begs the question that this is where it was. Where with you know. I brought up coveted a mass I'm like on June log I. Hate the mass like talk talk to. I gotTa talk the Mackenzie June article about this, and so, how I at the highest level our? What are we doing wrong? And then how should we be breathing just in a daily basis walking up and down the street then we can talk about like. Yeah, we. On fundamentally the easiest thing we can do and and look, there's there. This is what's frightening. So good friend of Mine James Master. Just put out a book breath. And the lost art, I. It's like the lost art of this of this. Thing that we missed right I. It's fantastic book, and in. He's done as much work as I have except from journalistic standpoint to a large degree, and there are so very few people, even in the medical world that are actually that actually truly understand this. It's frightening right, but the nose was designed with the respiratory system in mind. The mouth is a secondary system so fundamentally to answer your question. Let's start with understanding that difference. What I didn't say was. You can't breathe out of your mouth. But. I would I can confidently say. That at least eighty percent of your day, even your training. Should be through your nose only. And there is so much compounding research that is now alluding to this. It has in the past, but nobody's connecting the dots, but I mean if we. If we're doing Meta analysis on all this stuff, I could solidify what I'm talking about, but the fact is i. don't have the actual time to do that. We're working on a lot of this stuff, but it's so evident, and now I mean look the with the latest research especially on on the nose microbiome coming out, it's like look. I deal with people who have sinus issues and things in trouble dealing with this, but the reason we harp on. The idea of this is. The fundamental issue. Is What we what we believe is. How we handle co two. Because Co two is at the heart of why we breathe. We have a lot of dedication in the system to carbon dioxide, sensory their kachima receptors. On the brain stem, we have multiple regions that pick up carbon dioxide levels. By and large, most of those detection systems are from the a Arctic and the carotid. Arterial systems like not well the. Arteries right? So the karate kid and and a Arctic. Have these systems. That's important to understand because our arteries. Is Nutrients going out. Okay, so blood flow is going peripheral. This suggests from a brain perspective that our relationship has to be developed to this molecule. Because, it's prediction system. It's not actually what happened system. So as my brain detects carbon dioxide. I'm signaled to breathe. What's at the heart of why we take a breath carbon dioxide? What happens if I? Have you hold your breath too long? You go into a panic. Switch right. This is every single human being. Has this panic switch it? Just? It just means the like how tolerant we are to carbon. Dioxide tells us when that's going to happen in and we vary, but by and large, we are a society globally that is co, two intolerant, and we which which creates an a reactively so with inside the physiology it signals for me to breathe with inside the psychology. It also signals from me when to breathe, because when I have thought that crosses paths with things right and goes on. We'll when I. have an emotional response to a thought that triggers a mechanism that is very deep lying in the neurobiology and. Creates that relationship towards how I breathe? So it's an it's a mechanical, physiological and A. neurobiological. Issue so at the highest level. What's so bad about breathing through your mouth, and what's so good about breathing through your nose like? It up. You're in the elevator with someone and you're your. Don't breathe that way. This way here's why. Higher stress. You're going, so it's a signal or sympathetic tone instantaneously right so sympathetic tone, meanings, survival, mode, fight, flight, freeze, and in today's modern world. That means I'm right. You're wrong fight. Kerr light! Ghost I go stir I'm dissociate dissociates right. I Exit I don't know I just I don't even have shut down, and then you know being sheep like I just get in line and follow along, and like I don't have an opinion submissive to the whole thing, right, it's not. There is a bear around that. Right, although there are plenty of people who experience those in the wild, and do these things that is kind of where we're at within our world, and so when I breathe through my mouth, that is a signal for more sympathetic tone. And that is a signal that is set up in the brain stem right, and from a physiological standpoint I off load. Large amounts of carbon dioxide, so if I'm breathing through my mouth, if I offload carbon dioxide. I don't actually that is unnecessary, okay? Don't look at. This is like I'm doing some sort of you know. Maximum amount of push ups right now and I need to breathe through my mouth. There's a metabolic demand that's associated with that when there is no metabolic demand associated with needing to mouth breathe. Instantaneously switch my metabolic state over to more carbohydrate and more anaerobic process, which leans more towards sympathetic because the oxygen is no longer bioavailable when I offload excessive carbon dioxide. So when you're when you're breathing the news, you are more likely to activate the Paris the Paris empathetic nervous system, the relaxation response or you're just going to be in. A better less reactive more relaxed state. If you correct correct, you give your para sympathetic nervous system, the opportunity to come online, so the inhale is sympathetic nature. Right. That is sympathetic. The exhale becomes. Inhibition of sympathetic, which allows for that para, sympathetic tone to come on, but the it's that extension or longer exhale, it's also coupled with the fact that here's the difference between my inhale and exhale or inhales with nose and mouth. Right. Very fast with that mouth. Right. There's not a whole lot of difference in absorption rate doing either one. Okay when I do that now when exile. exhale with my nose. Here's one with my mouth. Oh. visit big difference. Massive difference. And that is where it is. Because the Yin Yang now comes into play. If I want to use oxygen. Through Beta oxidation or aerobic metabolism. I, have to have enough carbon dioxide present in the red blood cell in order to make it. For it to leave and to PERF- fuse the cell to be used with inside the Mitochondria. When we over breath, which is most of us are buying large. We don't give that an opportunity, so we leaned the stress side of things more here. Some people naturally do this. They just shut their mouths and mouth closed all the time like you're doing right now like you're you're? So self conscious. You know what I do own for you Brian like. With the mouth closed. Simplistic and that's unlike look so this is how easy breath practices to start. Let's first start at the foundation. Let's understand the difference between nose and mouth breathing. Be More aware of shutting your mouth throughout your day. You really want to take this to the next level all exercise all movement strategies anything. You're doing yoga cross fit I. don't care what you're doing. Shut your mouth for the next four weeks. joente allow yourself to go any further. Once you've done that then start to understand where the intensity factors play into that, but the fact is is that's where you can take that to a new level, and it's like now when I'm in situations that might get heighten I mean there's. There's a good damn reason why I'm when I talk. I start to turn on. Like I am offloading. There are there are consequences for what it is I'm doing? I get into a heightened arousal state right, and then when I stopped talking. I bring my breathing back down. So, it's as easy as just being conscious when when when you can be a of how you're breathing. If you notice hey breathing through the mouth, tight it up another seven forward, and just, and just as you go through your day, my breathing through my mouth, and my breathing through my nose, and if you notice okay, no big deal, let's bring it back to the news. Bring it you lying aid. Do I need to actually breathe through my my mouth right now and I think the biggest the biggest difference here beside co two tolerance is the fact that this is the greatest filter of air we have. This is the first line of defense for the immune system. This has very very few immune system. Plays with it, so you bring up two interesting points One is immune system at end, and then you can't talk about the immune system, not talking about Co vets, and so I'll start with the first one where we're where I started to think about you. Quite a bit was covid nineteen world gotta wear a mask and I hate I hate wearing the masks, but their new reality. and. I was struggling breathing like I. Just don't like this then. You were putting out some great stuff on your instagram about breathing through mask. So can you talk about? Why are people having challenges breathing through masks? And how should we breathe through, ask? Yeah. You know unfortunately for a lot of us. It's like coming to the gym for the first time and and wanting dead lifts four hundred pounds right. It's like hey, if we just start somewhere, it's going to have an effect there. There are some hacks that we can work on and talk about here, but. The reason, many of us are having a problem is because of being co two intolerant, because the mask like that training mass that I I put on. What those do is they? Trap Carbon Dioxide. So when I inhale air, there's twenty one percent oxygen most about. Oxygen comes back out when I exhale most of it. So it's not a lack of oxygen that's coming in becomes carbon dioxide. That's now mixing in the surface. There? It's really difficult. To create a toxic environment with a mask. With carbon dioxide, but This is a dose dependent thing. Meaning, if I am see, it very co two intolerant. I am going to probably be dealing with more of a toxic shock to co two. Then say me right. I've got doctors I got. I've got some people who fish finished up residency that I mentor I work with who have never expressed any problems with wearing masks, and they wear them all day long right then I hear about others who do and and you know I. Don't know what their daily practices like, but I can. I can validate that I don't have a problem wearing a mask. At all I don't like wearing it, but i. you know I I. Don't have a problem wearing it. It does seem to be constrictive, but the fact is that that's part of that system that's going on on the brain where the relationships developing towards what I'm doing, and this is where the intricacy of understanding psychology and neurobiology and physiology intersect is, and that's what we really are teaching people, and that's why I was suggestive of when people catch onto the breathing thing, we're gonNA move over, but the fact is. It's intersect, so let's get. Let's get down to the foundation of this and understand. If I have a problem, wearing a mask and I'm starting to have panic or I'm starting to have difficulty. The best thing you can do is get outside somewhere safe. Remove the mask. And take a few or many deep breaths through your nose. You will instantly come and calm back down. I mean there's a reason why we used to hand people paper bags when they were having panic attacks to to breathe in. Hey everybody! Thanks for tuning in. We're just GONNA take a quick little break to hear a word from our sponsor. This episode of the PODCAST is supported by Seymour meats and veggies, Seymour meats and veggies. Sausages combine humanely raised me with up to thirty five percent fresh vegetables, making it super easy to sneak more veggies into your family's meals and cut down on meat consumption without giving it up completely. I love that. 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Breathe through the nose. So on Covid. He. How could you not talk about how covert and and not mention immunity, yeah, and immune function, so let's talk about. Nasal breathing and the immune system. Yeah, Then the the nasal passages present the greatest opportunity. For Phil for filtering bacteria and virus. In the air. It deep the mouth has a couple the tonsils being part of that system, but there's a large amount of air. We breathe through the mouth that passes right through and goes into the lungs. This is why mouth breathing. At night and you're catching your mouth open. Your mouth is dry like drier air your lungs. Actually PR prefer high humid. Era Right so starting at the beginning. We have as many hair follicles inside of our nose as we do on our head. Yeah Wow, so that presents a very unique understanding of something that. Why would we have that many hair? They're that much hair, right? Well that is a Tau Particle. Grab on every single hair. That's in that knows. There is. A MUCUS COATING! And Mucus is is kind of like the honey badger of our, like Armenian system it's like it's like the most ofensive thing, and although it can be gross to a lot of people, the fact is, it's the most ofensive thing there is. And it instantaneously either collects and allows you to blow your nose. Pick your nose or get things out right. or And it also if there are if there are bacteria or viruses that it instantaneously. Launches a defense. Of many different T H, one T, H, two and Beta cells right like that are that are these long term memory cells that? Ten Years From now twenty years from now. They know what that was. That came in because it came in, and it's why you don't get the same virus or the same bug the same time again right so all of these things play an integral role through the mucus right, and so that mucus also can be. You would be very shocked as to how much mucus you actually swallow a day like. Like people who'd be just grossed out, but the fact is, it is a lot, and it's important process because that stomach in the stomach acid instantaneously kills things right so things either need to go out, or they need to be swallowed. They can't be inhaled into the lungs because there's there's not a whole lot of safe things in there, and so that's why it's like in a time of like. You know Kovin. What's going on right now? Respiratory Health is so important, and the fact in thing is. Is that the the covert virus the crown of it? The proteins hook onto these has gone to two cells with inside the membranes that line all of this stuff. Right inside the nose inside the airways inside the epithelial walls. All of these things and once that gets in there. If there's not a host of good mucus in there, you're. You're more prone to actually probably getting this thing. This is why a lot of people who mouth breeders. Sinusitis, Rhinitis. They. Get their constantly have immune system problems meaning people who get sick or get colds quite frequently. You know what I mean. these are all byproducts of things like that right, and that that's one of the biggest differences that people will experience is that their immune system completely changes? Even from an allergy standpoint, the amount of people that come back to me telling me about how they don't experience allergies. The way they used to or at all is shocking. While, so with regards to all the things in the nose. You also recently. Posted a study about the nasal microbiome. Yes, so talk to us about the we all. We love all things microbiome here in my buddy green, but the nasal acre vile was a new one for me. Yeah. and. It's new for me in that. It angers me to a slight degree because it's a DA. It's like. Of course. There's a microbiome in the nose. This is where everything's beginning like. This is where the Twenty Six thou- Twenty Thousand Times a day or more. I'm. Be inhaling primarily from. So I've got to have good bacteria here. What happened was is the group of researchers. This is just a recent study that came out I. Think the twenty ninth of May they finally released it. twenty twenty a group of researchers noticed there was a difference between family members in themselves and with Science Sinusitis Rhinitis common things that we see with inside culture, right people who deal with a lot of sinus issues. and. They decided to start taking a look at this and what they did was. They got a very simple. Bacteria, that is a healthy bacteria right? You'll in like yogurt. And they put it into a spray bottle. And they started administering it people who had the sinus issues. They also started taking samples of people who had sinus issues, and who did not have sinus issues. And they found in the two different samples of these people that the people who didn't have all of these sinus problems had a very healthy amount of bacteria that were good bacteria in the knows where the others did not. And this also leans into. That the amount of antibiotics and things that we go onto inevitably because they kill everything that were lacking the ability to like if I have a sinus infection. What do I have what happens I? Go on antibiotics and I shut to shut that down. What am I doing to get that bacteria backup, and that's why a lot of people will experience continued problems with that, but what the great hope is, and what they saw was with them when they administered the good bacteria with people that. That face they saw that the bacteria would start to clone, and it would start to grow, and then they would have to do it at you know after two or three days again, and then the, and they would have to continue this process to kind of re insert the bacteria into the nose and the sinuses, and that they actually have the. There's a lot of hope that we they think that we can change this and that is a Duh to me because I understand the got. To a large degree and supplying that with healthy bacteria, and what goes in my mouth? I love it so also. With regards to studies out there. You know we're talking about two, and in one of them's more about the macro and the others, the micro and on the macro level. You talk about the Framingham study which Ashley said Greater Lung Capacity Equals longer life. which I thought was fascinating. Because we're all taught, you know they're all. We're talking about telomeres and the microbiome, intermittent fasting and all the. I, twenty eight vials of blood every quarter, but no one's talking to me about traitor lung capacity. Yea. I mean I'm I'm aware. Of this. Without under without even looking at that study. and the reason were aware of this is based on the fact of how important. Oxygen, actually is to the system. So. Lai Lung Bassetti like so a lot of people did like kind of took. This study is like well. You know it's it's got to be more than just lung capacity, and it absolutely is more than lung capacity, but the fact of the matter is is my ability to move like what one of the things that I've worked Dr Andy Galvin. WHOSE CO author last book and a good friend of mine at CAL, state Fullerton has done work on. Is Studying. how you know where mortality rates like what what parameter sit around. Mortality Rates in one of those parameters is the Max if it drops below twenty two. You're pretty much you can. You can guess you. You're on the way out. You're about to go down. And that's a fairly low vio to level so lung capacity can be predictive in that understanding how mean con constantly moving air, and if I have more space inside the cage in order to do that now? A lot of people think that it's the lungs itself, and it is not the lungs the lungs. If we were to pull them out. and. Dice them open right just. Ju- dissection we could stretch those things across a field that's like the size of almost a football field there so elastic that ask the tissue. It doesn't actually contract or anything, but you need to give that space, and so this would also allude to the fact that exercise and movement are pretty important. Okay and something like yoga is perfectly fine as long as we're actually understanding. Graph mechanics and movement something that has been a big problem with inside the Yoga community, and and. If the same thing with inside the performance, world is understanding movement principles, and what's going on the fact is is the organization of that spine dictates. How well we actually going to use that diaphragm, we all use it, but it's it comes down to how well and so it's really getting to full. Capacity of that breath. and down to the end where were moving? Say An exercise that allows us to keep that ribcage, optimal and size, which means my lung capacity is staying optimal right so? Just because somebody exercises, though does not mean they're maximizing that and I have personally seen I mean. I can't tell you how many professionals even world champions I've worked with WHO are working off a very limited capacity. We're just great at suffering regardless of what that suffering is. While it, all sorts was breathing through the nose every day. You know what would, that's what I love about. This practice is doesn't matter. How great an athlete you are! You just start breathing through the nose to racked every day. And that's it and that's that this is that. Take back to where I ran into like why breathing became so important. That resistance breathing device. We don't actually need that. We have one. It's the nose and the reason I'm so enamored with this as I, am I am really were really focused on delivering biology back chewed human race in that we have missed a lot of opportunities to understand things that have been barked for a long time, even when we look back on native American indigenous cultures in this country. You will see if you do enough research. These people knew this they lived by it. They understood the civilized culture and what was going on there were there were some serious problems very early on why their teeth rotted more crooked why their mouth became black. They I mean they used to call civilized man the block mouth. They would be terrified. They wouldn't let their children if they came off brest after breastfeeding, they would close the mouth of the child instantaneously enforce it to breathe through its nose. they were in fear of this, they would sleep with their mouths closed at night. They would hunt with their mouths closed. They were quiet. They could last longer on like if you go look at the Comanche Indian. Nobody could could hold a candle to how far these people could go and drive over time, and they just in why how could they just do that? OFF OF EATING BUFFALO? That was their main staple, right? How do you do that? Just eating buffalo and it's well. They're using an energy system. That is has allowed them to do that. And then when you look at historians who documented they're like. Hey, look these people. Were doing this. They breathe this way. They didn't their. Their languages did not allow for a lot of words they look they allowed for potent words right and they didn't speak a whole lot. They spoke very intently when they spoke. Let's back there. Let's get back there. It's all there man. So on the subject of of being stressful environments and Studies, you actually were part of a a pretty cool study that involved a six week slow reading program for high school kids. Can you talk a little bit about that? Yeah? Yeah, we Guy Scott Russell came to us who's a teacher who was really adamant about doing a pilot study on high school kids in an administrative. What was the best sort of practice? He you know we felt could be administered to his students on For stress, you know I mean it's. It's all we were all where anxiety levels being really high and we had. A guy out of Andy Galvin's lab pressing spear, do his thesis any and we're trying to get into Irbe now on the connection between Co, two tolerance and anxiety we, we know something's there and so. This study was more was pushing more towards that where let's look at high school. Kids who are who are dealing with a lot more anxieties days administer a breeding protocol that we know they could get through, but his slow controlled breathing and based on all research. We understand slow control. Breathing's going to them the brain down. And let's see how this intervention can work towards anxiety and everybody responded the way we thought they were so this just set sets up and parlays for us to be able to bring something like this to. The surface and then go. Hey, here's what we really want to do like. Here's of really big study. We'd like to do so we got got the easy one out of the way we. We were well aware that all this was going to happen. We still WANNA learn. We Still WanNA critique the work and understand where it's where it doesn't work and where it does right. See took these kids stressed I'm guessing if you were to do all sorts of testing on them would indicate that and they and they essentially were able to turn it around all through breathing. Just just a five ten five done twelve times, and then so at with regards the different methods. You mentioned the five. Box breathing there. There's what what I love at I. Think I recommend so so often. The people who this is just like a new language that was an inhale for two xl for four in Helfer to hold xl for four inches. It's that simple for for people listening WanNa get started his have the exhale be greater than the inhale tracked, and that's how you that's how you actually allow that para sympathetic nervous system. Come on, and why is that well? Real simple go watch anybody or any animal when they fall asleep. Watch what happens. You're going to see. A shorter inhale exhale. You're gonNA, see a brief pause up top, and then you're gonNA. See a diminish where there's almost this big huge pause at the bottom. Right. It's not totally getting rid of all the air. It's just kinda midway through the exhale just pauses and stops. And that eludes to when we calm down. The breath goes from. A goes from kind of an equal in and out to and to a shorter, inhale longer exile, and so what I typically do is a three three in pause six out, and just on their count, and just follow that, and if that doesn't help well the. And this is where our work really went. Is. Understanding that different protocols effect, different people in different ways, and so if I had a group ten people, I gave them all box breathing, which would be like a five five five five right like five inhale five hold five five hold. I'm going to probably have a number of different responses to that protocol meaning not everybody's GonNa. Feel calm and less reactive and the act based on the fact that everybody Co, two tolerances different and the patterning because of how the neurobiology is set up is going to have an effect on our psychology. And so. That's why we established a breath calculator on our website. So that people could actually do a c. o two tolerance tests for free. Put in their co, two tolerance, and they can look seven different types of protocols and find which ones support which sort of direction they wanted to go while I'm excited. Take that task. We have to put that in the show notes for sure for sure so to close. Let's go to our own mortality and yes, Yvette, some pretty powerful experiences and have described death is the great equalizer if you will, which many of us feel more alive in the face of death, and you know from experience, new voluntarily went and swam with sharks and also are. You have this freak accident at a playground were. You almost left paralyzed and so. Would you mind is talking about both instances and in how you felt and. Ultimately came out on the other side of this. Sure you know I've. Always been kind of I wouldn't say extremist, but. I. Do like to go fast. But I I WANNA. I don't WanNa feel out of control when I'm going fast, but I do. And this is also a metaphor, right? I, I don't want to be out of control, but I do understand. That with every step of how much faster I go on teetering on the edge something. That is that is right there. and. You know. Everything in life has consequences. And it just so happens that the closer to that edge I get. The more alive I feel. But that just means I have to be more prepared. And so you know I got I got a I've had a number of opportunities in my life, because of the work that I decided to get involved in in the people who I decided to work with You know and one of those Dr Andrew. Human at Stanford. Medicine who contracted me to come in and help with study on fear. and I got to do that He and I are very close friends now. But. We. He asked me if I wanted to come down and get some video footage with them off the island. Guadeloupe for great white sharks and there was a tad. There were three tags. He was taking one another buddy of ours. who was a who's a good friend? Took one and he asked me if I wanted to tag to get out of the cage and swim with the sharks, and I instantly was like yes, and he said okay well you gotTa, get dive certified. You Got I was living in Oregon at the time, so I had to get dive certified in a lake. And Erin I did it and went down. We did this. We did this journey I I've already I've swam sharks and WII before you know not great whites. I swam sharks. I understood sharks. I understand wild animals to a large degree I understand that you know. They're curious just like we are. But if you know if we act like pray, we get treated like pray. and. If you step into the ear environment in in a way that they they aren't cool with. That's the consequence you know. There is a consequence for everything so getting out of a cage at forty feet down below the surface of the water with four or five great white sharks. You understand that. You know life can end like that and there's nothing anybody can do. There's just nothing anybody there can do about a great white shark. It is such a massive animal it is, so it's like a car, and with with with just razors and you know. Why would I want to do something like that? Because I wanted the experience, and I saw that there were guys who actually pioneered something, and understood it and created an idea on swimming with them so that they could get footage, so everybody could experience that because I realized not. Everybody's GONNA WANNA go get out of the cage, and that's perfectly fine like not. Everybody needs to go shark diving. Brian got the opportunity and he did it and what I got out of. It was that you know these are curious animals, and if you do not act like pray, you won't be treated like pray you know. They it's it's odd, but at forty feet below the surface. They don't know how to handle something. That isn't running away from them or freezing right, which is what pray us? And if you if they do come towards you and you go at them with a camera. They turn away because they're like what does that I? Don't I? Don't know anything in my environment. That does that. It's not a killer whale right so. It was a it was a great experience. It was it was a it was life changing experience that was where the work came in I had to control I'd learned really control my breathing specifically like we running data while we were there on everybody even people who were just staying in the cage but it was. It was so interesting just to be involved in this and. And see it happen and understand it and know that through breath control. I was able to manage a lot of situational stuff going on you know, and then the my my accident happened about a year later after that where I was just, and this is life. This is how it goes right. This is life is consequences and we don't know when those consequences are going to happen. And we behave the only creature that behaves as though it's just we're. We're were immortal to a large degree. And you know I've done that a lot, but you know just playing tag with my nephews on a jungle gym I went up ladder and got about eight feet up and didn't see a bar above that eight foot marker that was at about eleven feet. And so there's a gap right and I went up and I went to crossover something because my nephew is coming at me, but I went directly into a bar at the top of my head, which compressed my spinal cord and I dropped. Onto that ladder at about eight feet, and then flipped off the Badger backflip off the back from what they told me. And I landed on the ground. And woke up. and I was like Whoa like I just I was like what happened, but I remember. The stars I remember getting knocked out. And And I noticed I couldn't really breathe. And I then Kinda looked down. And my feet were crossed in one of my shoes off, and somehow my hands were laying across my body and I couldn't move anything, and so I instantly knew it I had probably broken my neck. in I, just kind of looked at. It is like well here we are. Not Oh. My God Oh my God Oh, my God and I think that's. That's kind of a testament to the work that I had been doing up until then. On. I didn't feel sorry for myself at the time. I don't know why. And I and I instantly went into okay I've got my nephew's three of them. My niece one of them, and then my sister and my ex wife at the time was there and I really wanted. Like I didn't want them to have to. Get, traumatized by what had just happened. Right and I mean I got kids? There I mean. I got eleven down. You know down to three and I. It was just like. Can you get you get Aaron Key, Kelly you can get them over here and then I just continued to breathe through in slow controlled breathing until the paramedics everybody arrived, and you know It turned out that I had compressed spinal cord I did not sever it. I, my arms. Kinda came back in about fifteen minutes. My hands and then about forty hours later, my legs started to come through on, and then about three days I was able to Kinda walk like Bambi on ice and then spent the you know next couple weeks before I had to go into emergency surgery to have a anterior. Dissect me. and to create space for my spinal cord because I had the options of no surgery or surgery and Did no surgery option was. You can't live your life the way that you have lived your life. The surgery option was I'M GONNA. Live my life the way I want to eat on A. I'm a proponent of Western medicine. It has its place in my life is here like I? Get my life the way it is because of that. You know I'm a big advocate of that. I'm also a big advocate of eastern thinking and indigenous cultures and things. We've missed to get back to our reality and I think both played a role in why and how I was able to. Get Back on the jungle gym per. Se I I. Don't have a fear of jungle gyms I. Don't have a fear of you know going out and and doing extreme things anymore. I felt like I dealt with what could have been a very traumatic instance very quickly. and I wanted dish I. I wanted to learn from that so much that I wanted to be able to understand it for other people, and so that's where my work even went. Deeper was to really understand the concussion aspect of things, and how I sped that process up, or what I believed, sped that process up on dealing with that, which was breath, control and exercise doing what I could so. Was All the process? But it was fun, and I turned it into a game instantaneously. I didn't feel sorry for self. I mean what could I do? There was nothing I could do about the current situation. What can I do I can change my attitude. I can change the way I'm looking at this. And I did both of those things and I think that's where we're missing opportunity with inside society right now. I love it will close there. Bryan. Thank you for all that you do I. Am so thankful for you and your work and I am so happy that you're alive and standing and walking and thriving, so thank you. I appreciate you guys to Jason I appreciate that man thank you.