Using Donor Screening Services

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Okay stacy this wentz for you. I had the interim executive director of a small nonprofit. What is the best. Way to approach gossiping. Complaining staff of four. Since i'm not going to be in this position for the long haul and wondering if there any limitations or boundaries to your interim role though some interim positions executive director positions or given kind of carp launch to do whatever needs to be done and others have really tight boundaries that the board puts on that position of of what can be or can't be done not wanting to upset the apple cart. So i guess my first question is wondering if that's been communicated in any way Just so you're kind of in alignment with what the board stinking. And and then i think assuming that you have the authority to address situations like this And just to kind of keep the ship running and trying to clean it up as best you can before the new executive director gets there. I'm thinking that a a meeting With with the team the sort Talk a little bit about you. Know change and changes uncomfortable. Sort of start with that. But then i would kind of lead it into. What do you think makes a good workplace in a good a good work better and and having that conversation and seeing what they say and then perhaps You know listing it outright like what are some of the core values that like we want in this chain period of change. What are the kind of the core values. We wanna uphold his like a healthy work culture. And i would i would brainstorm it with them and then i mean if you really want to be direct. I would then say. That's not being reflected right now in our behaviors. So so what are we going to do to change that or like are we gonna hold ourselves accountable to this so i i honestly think it needs to be a little bit of discussion instead. They're just coming down on kind of addressing that changes uncomfortable but also giving them a process to think through what kind of culture they wanna work in especially during this transition period and then getting agreement that everyone's going to hold each other accountable and of course then if they don't abide by that or the gossiping and the garbage you know the silliness continues then then you start going down. The hr path of verbal warnings and written warnings. And all that. But but i think i sort of addressing that elephant in the room is important. It makes me wonder if it's like the substitute teacher effect right. Because like does the interim part like how much does that bring to. It is it. Is it that. Because you're interim you feel like you don't necessarily have the authority to make any long term plans for these people and that you just want wanna get by and maybe maybe it's a little bit of just like i don't wanna i don't wanna rock the boat or get into nasty sticky situations because i'm not going to be here. That long feels like that might be a little piece of the question But but for staff of to be gossiping and completely career the gossiping in complaining about each other. They thought that many people. I don't know i mean it. Sounds like maybe they're just maybe they're just bad employees because because the you gotta wonder what the issue is like what are what's the why are they upset like is it. Are they complaining about how it used to be because that should be water under the bridge at this point right. That should be the the old. I'm the new. The old has gone. So i don't know why you're still complaining about that. That seems to be a waste of time. So maybe maybe we all just need to go have some cocktails. When that's a thing you're allowed to do again and just like hash it out and get it out of everybody's system and so we can have a fresh start. I would think that you would be if there is an interim position and not knowing how it happened. But i'm gonna guess a whiz If there's gossip. I mean like if it was a plan transition or something and an interim isn't intentional. Step in between leaders. That would be one thing and i think that that might be less filled with gossip but like if it was something where that a former and we don't know this but the former. Apd got lecco or something really you or just left Whatever happened in his interim got put in. I mean. I could see where there'd be gossip even though it's a small team but it'd be like oh god what's going on here. We lost our leader. Like who's this new person. Are we going to be on the chopping block. I mean i think it's probably filled with a lot of uncertainty not knowing the specific circumstance. So so really just addressing it which kind of goes back to that authority question. Like how much authority do have you been given the interim and do you want to take on. I mean i've seen organizations where they bring in an interim and truly that interim is there any kind of transition turnaround expert. To get things the ship righted make all those decisions cleanup bad staff. Clean up all the stuff. That's a mess to the new e coms and fresh and like without a big headache. So i don't know if it's that situation or if it's really just people feeling uncomfortable and thinking they can get away with it. But i definitely think it's gotta stop because good grief like that's just toxic and unhealthy and they need to be doing their work darn it seriously. But so that's a good point too about the that everybody's because there's a leadership. Transition people are feeling unsettled. Probably and and for this group that that feeling of being unsettled is is manifesting itself in in poor playbay viewers so so yeah so like i mean. I is as much as i pretend to be the opposite. I'm probably. I'm the big softie that's gonna let people come into my office and complained to me. All day. might not do anything about it. But but i'm i would definitely listen and see if i can figure out if there's some sort of common theme and if it is something to do with just the uncertainty of the viability organization like the left and they were doing such a great job and we don't know why and now we don't know if the organization is coming apart and we are all going to get fired and that's that's not a something that you should be able to address just by saying like the organization is it. We've got new leadership. We may have new leadership again in the four weeks or six months or whatever after the interim period is over. So it's up to us to make sure that we can fix all the stuff we can fix and then and then move on from there and let the past. Be the past on work. Nonprofit marketing tweet that a nonprofits presents nonprofit everything. The podcast about everything. Nonprofit with your host andy shirt and stacey wedding. Today's episode is sponsored by the hr collaborative the hr collaborative was formed to help build nonprofit strengths through improved human resources. It provides professional development opportunities networking and sharing of best practices on hr issues faced by nonprofit organizations. the collaborative meets bi monthly. Membership is free and open to anyone who works for a nonprofit and has hr responsibilities for more information or to attend upcoming meeting. Visit their website at www dot hr collaborative l. d. dot. Org check out the nonprofit everything show notes for more information talk everybody. Thank you for joining us. Another episode of nonprofit everything. I am really excited to share today's guest and all of his wisdom with you and welcome. Brad thank you. Thanks for having me. Yes we've got brad stiff and I've known brad for years. She's been just sort of a fundraising staple in our community Quite the expert on a variety of topics related to fund raising and sort of the strategy behind it Brad is a certified fundraising executive. So has that credential and also another credentials c. s. pg. What does that stand for. Brad that certified specialist in planned giving. That's something that is I don't know if it's an acronym that most people are familiar with so it basically is just the same thing as a cf but it's in planned giving. Okay okay great. Well i figured you know when. I see all these initials behind your name. I know that impressive and Brad has company philanthropy development associates. So brad i wanna give you just a moment before we kick off with a little bit of background on you and your company. Okay thank you Unexpected i've been here since one thousand nine hundred four. My wife and eye allison moved here. when we were expecting our first child prior to that we were consultants with one of the largest campaign consulting firms in the nation. And we were going from city to city directing major capital campaigns for organizations. But we didn't really want to drag a child around that way so we moved here in nineteen ninety four. I became the executive director of nevada ballot theater. And after five years there and taking that organization to Wonderful new heights. I decided to hang up my own. Shingle here in las vegas and Star consulting against so. We've been doing this for quite a long time. We've been lucky enough to work with some fantastic people Both here in southern nevada and all across the nation. We're trying to focus more on our own community now. You get to a point where you're like. I really just wanted to do stuff for my own. Now and said we focused primarily on major guests planned giving and capital campaigns planning studies in and so on although we well-versed in all those All of the fundraising avenues. We just have to focus on are are things that we do best. We like to do the most. I love it. I love it very wise and data. I'm sure all of those words plan giving major gifts. All of not stuff perked up the ears of our listeners. Because i know many have questions on it. And that's what leads us to today's conversation so we actually had someone someone share with us that they were really sort of grappling with the extent of the need of donor. Well screening so. Let me read you. They actual question and then let's have a conversation about it. So question is i'm on the board of an organization that has been around a while and has a very large donor database. The stock has recently paid to put it through a wealth screen and now the consultant wants them to put it through another screen to see which donors have an interest in our mission. Can't we just assume not are ready since they've made a donation to us or am i missing something. Okay i I guess we can answer the question. The individual that's asking. This is correct in their assumption that the organizations past donors have already in fact shown an interest at some level bigger small in their mission. But a couple of things. I'm hearing in the question. A couple of things could be going on. That might cause some confusion. So why don't we break up the question and examine what we're working with and what might be happening here sounds great. The individual says they have a very large donor database donor quote unquote. Just how large is the database will most search services cost anywhere from three cents to six cents record screen and the larger the batch being screened. Of course the lower they're going to charge you per record and the proposed cost in the question. Here is forty thousand dollars. So it's it's a big database. And if we divide that by three cents per record. We're talking about anywhere from a million to one point three million As far as the database or bats. That's going to be screened proposed to be screened. This is huge I want to work with this organization. I'm sure you do do actually let me let me ask you to pause for a minute broad so i'm to clarify for our listeners. I did not re. There was a piece of of this question. Parentheses that brad scene but then i forgot to read when i just mentioned this but did talk about. It's basically a forty thousand dollar cost. Which is where broad forty thousand dollars from so okay. I just wanted to clarify not. Let's let's move on. Brad got it. So yeah my ears perk up. When i say wow forty thousand okay. That's that's a huge database. And you can do some Reverse analytics are trying to figure out. Okay how big is this database. This is huge now. The second thing is the organization said that they've already screamed the database and we don't know if stat initial screen was the entire database or if it was just donors and i'm thinking it might just be donors why do i say that Consultant wants to put the entire database through another screening while the big reputable search firms. They know what they're doing and they're probably not going to make that kind of mistake where they have to screen the entire database against so. I'm thinking maybe just the donors that they already have that to. The organization were screened wealth screened. Which is what was said in question. Perhaps the other Portion is non donors so we have to ask ourselves. I did they screen the entire database on. I run if so that firm. That's handling all those. All that search should have conducted all the screening needed on. That i pass in. There should be no reason to do a second. Pass the the second thing i wanted to mention. What protect my ears again was the proposed second screening As it was indicated in the question is to see which honors have an interest in the organization's mission and so this is another reason why guessing the first green was for donors and wealth to find out who are the major donors in their big haystack. Where where's the needle. But a couple of needles in the haystack. That can bring them a lot of support and the second screening is probably the non donors And they're looking for affinity and propensity to give their organization. So i guess the answer overall is you might be missing something so i think the board member might need to ask. The question of the staff is there a segmentation that's been going on. And the first green was donors in the second screen is non donors strikes me as that infamous game of telephone right where each arson right that the message passes to it. There's a little detail that gets left out or added or whatever the case may be and so because this was a board member who asked this question. My sense is that that board member probably may not have all of the fax or Or even re recognized that. There's these different sort of types of screening layers of screening populations screen. Right so there. There could just be a this. Could just be as simple as asking a few clarifying questions. It sounds like but they were definitely Smack on when they were thinking. Okay if these are donors. Don't they already like us. Thirty shown us that they like us. And that's true The the reason you wanted to well screening for those donors is defined. Somebody's giving you a one hundred dollars a year for ten years You didn't know that. They made super large gifts to other organizations or they are a huge political donor which is a strong indicator of ability and propensity to give They have two or three homes One on the co something like that they. They have an aircraft that a plane or a yacht on a foundation board. All these things will pop up in the well screening and one of the more interesting ones here for us in some of our large Executives here in the gaming industry is who owns than ten percent of the public stock in their company. And those are all those wealth flags go up into. Wow i didn't know this person was in our midst. it sounds like I mean there's there's a whole lot of benefits from well screening as i. I'm hearing you speak about this so so do you think i mean. Obviously there's a cost to everything. So i'm sure some of our listeners are thinking at what point are they large enough or is the database large enough to to go through with with screening firm. That can help them Can you speak to any of that or some things for for our listeners. Think about as it relates to that. I've had with a lot of organizations on their research on their screening and one of the questions. I always get this question. Which search company or firm is the best and part of my answer to that is when can afford because there are some that are super expensive. and really large organizations with larger budgets are their their clients if you will and there are others that don't charge quite as much But you kind of get what you pay for but bottom line is if you can do some screening that the thing that costs the most is big batch screening. You're you have one hundred thousand records in their charging us success per record it gets pretty pricy You can have annual subscriptions to search firms where you can do one off your in your database and you want to screen one particular donor. You can have unlimited One time screening. So i can look up. Brad stiff than at five minutes later. I can look up stacey wedding and so on. It's the large batches that become really expensive so even if you're small their firms out there that can help you with the search capabilities. That's really helpful to know. And i think Can maybe ease people's minds. Who are always looking of course at the budget like we like we all do when our worlds at it it also. I'm curious to know from a standpoint of what you've seen brad. Does it make sense if let's say donor gave to your right. Hypothetically speaking many years ago. I don't i'm just going to say five years ago right But hasn't given again and this leads to probably much larger conversation of why but But i'm curious to know if they're sort of parameters or guidelines about who should be screens if you're spending the money to screen somebody. Does it make sense to do more. Recent donors who have shown a recent interests certainly. Does you got those. You better prospects. But i would include all the way back to five years after that year. Pretty much trading them as a non donor again and they need to be cultivated Just like any other first time donor would be especially if you haven't had a lot of Contact with them now. If you've had a lot of contact with them and they're they've been involved in one way or another and they haven't given a different thing. Yeah that that makes. There's so many variables and you know every time you peel back. Another layer of onion. I think you realize that none of this is quite just. Oh just do a donor screen right like there's there's questions to ask things to consider You know i. I wish it were always just a super simple idea. But but it shows why people like you are needed because people need a need you know some. Some context and some guidance around all of this and organizations may want to prioritize. they're they're screening batches and of course the people that are given to you longest without a break are sometimes the the best Donors for plan. Guess people that have shown loyalty. And perhaps they. They're not the wealthiest person on the block but they can make the question organization. So there's a lot of different reasons and i think that's the first thing you have to ask yourself before you enter into a screening With the firm is what am i trying to get out of this. Am i looking for major donors the hidden gems amongst my might donor database. Am i looking for those individuals who can possibly consider a plan gift. My organization and those are two different screens. Those are two different things. You're looking for you bring up a good question about what to ask. The people the wealth the well screening firms. Are there any other questions. That should be asked when when a nonprofit is going through that interview process of who to select well. I think it's really important to find out What integration. They have so by that. I mean can. I send you can export from my donor database. My crm can export that to the company. The company does its searches and they append that information that they find to those records and then is uploaded right back into my my crm. So it's sort of seamless or whether or not you're gonna have to separate records of that. You really want to go with something. That can integrate with whatever you're using the other question to ask is exactly. What are you going to provide me. What are you looking for. What are your outcomes of this again. You want to be able to for well screening. You wanna be looking for their capacity and their propensity to give those are the two main things so are they giving to other organizations like yours or are they giving large gifts to any other nonprofit organizations and what are their their holdings real estate and otherwise And do they own large amounts of stock The other thing that you'll find out you wanna find out from them is. Do you do a search that will reveal donors that are connected to commonly known as an inner circle of for a nonprofit. So for example. They'll come up with. Oh it got ten people in that last batch that went through the have some connection with one or more of your board members. And you might not even know that connectivity. So there's a connective Aspect to some of these searchers. Well that's super helpful. I hope everybody listening was writing those down and capturing those so if you're in the process out now we're in the future you know task i will share just on a personal note I am working with a client now. Who has really ramped up. Some of their expectations of board members around giving and we always know that can be a bit of a messy of transition for boards and uncomfortable transition but one of the things. They're embedding into their new. Process is having a wealth screening tool before they even go to recruits a new board member. Which shows that the level of priority that they're putting on this. Obviously i always encourage them to look beyond just the dollars because we know board board being a board member and a strong board member is more than just the money but if not as critically important. They're doing some of those one off searches. You mentioned brad so it just goes to show how versatile some of this can be a whether you're doing a big batch or just a handful. Yeah it's it's the bottom line on research is more information is better than less and if you can afford to do it in one form or another. Get all the information that you can. There are hospitals medical centers that use well screening on a daily basis simply to know who's in their facility at the moment that we may have overlooked. Have hundreds of beds sometimes thousands of beds in these medical centers and every every night the census has sent out to a well screened farm and by seven o'clock in the morning on the dod's desk is a list of the the hits if you will of high ability in high propensity don't patients so that's another part of the searching. You have arts organizations that want to know who's sitting in those seats and so after every performance you've got the same type of thing if they have enough information on who purchased the ticket so there's all sorts of different ways to look at this. Well i get excited. Hearing about the potential for having more information to make informed decisions so I'm a bit of a nerd though so self proclaimed nerd around this stuff so But you're speaking my language brad so I just want to thank you so much for giving your time sharing your expertise with our listeners. I think i walked away I i know. I walked away. Learning a few few things about well screening and also knowing. It doesn't have to just be large organizations. That was one thing that really resonated with me i think many Many non-profit sir even less than a million dollars in revenue that they're bringing in a year but they wonder if these tools are really just accessible them if they are the hospitals or large arts organizations and it sounds like from what you're saying not necessarily especially if they do a little bit more of the kind of one off select screening. Yeah that's true. Yep and i think that even the smaller stations you there is an upfront initial investment every year to be a subscriber for this service. But you can do it and you can know. Who's in your midst that's great. Any final thoughts are concluding remarks. Brad now just just find out as much as you can about the people that are connected with your organization and Prioritize that's what the research helps you do you've got a million people in your database. How are you going to prioritize. This is it you're gonna find out who's in there and who rises to the top. You only have so many hours every week to go out. There and cultivating solicit. Oh andy. i know you're gonna love this question. You know when. I start like that. You need to run for the hills expression okay. I am relatively new in the position. I'm wondering if you have any tips for combating imposter syndrome. And being comfortable in a role of authority laughter says it all news. Nope so now. To be perfectly candid. So i think this is something that i think. The reason that we're laughing is. Because i think sort of if you take sort of stereotypical gender like this is how as particular gender has conversations about feelings. Right from the stereotypical sam point. Like stacy's thinking that my opinion is going to be exactly what i said which i've never heard of this. I've i clearly hundred percent in control of all the situations. I'm in and and very comfortable in the role of authority at one hundred percent of the time because like why wouldn't i be right but i think it's i think the difference is that the like you're you're less likely to see i mean obviously i am just like over generalizing to the nth degree is that in general. You're going to see sort of your male colleagues are never going to say. I have imposter syndrome. They may have it inside. They may be feeling it internally but it's not something they're ever gonna say out loud because that you know that that would make them smaller what they say that would make them smaller and and for to give everybody a little bit by an inside peek to our world before we recorded this question. We were sort of bantering back and forth about it prior and i just i literally said andy. Have you ever felt imposter syndrome. Because i don't think. I know of one man and i'm sorry man i'm not. I'm not knocking you. I just don't think i've ever heard of a man ever ever even like remotely even hinting at imposter syndrome. I mean and i and yet his like every day. I could tell you at least one conversation. I had with a female in some hide of leadership position that is doubting herself or feeling like perhaps she does it and it's not just a gender thing but it's just interesting because i truly have this like kind of have this belief that men don't feel this way so i would love for any of any of our male listeners. Who deal with imposter syndrome. Please come back and check me on that because these let me know your hunan and he'll really just think it's like it's the external procession because i mean honestly you go into any any new role so when i got the job as cfo of three square. That was a completely new job for me. I'd never been cfo anywhere. I never worked at a food. Bank before I had never done like inventory. Things like dealing with tons and tons of products that are going to go out. The door to be donated was completely brand new world to me and the first so. I got the job strangely enough. Got the job. And the first thing i did was like freak out by lights. Twelve books on amazon. How to do the job. I just been hired to do so so while i might not have said to piers like i don't deserve this role. I don't think i'm capable of doing it. How did how. How did i fool them into hiring the right. Which is i think. Is that the definition if a- posture syndrome yet. So instead of doing that like i clearly internalized it all and went. Oh my god. I may be in over my head. Let's make sure. I don't drown right so i think it's just a matter of lake so so mine is just like a growing permanent ulcer and and more Blood pressure medicine than most people. Like maybe maybe that's sort of that internalizing of all of that stuff instead of like letting off the release file talking about it talking about right so now that we've talked. We've talked about that. It does exist in everybody or or most people So what do we think is do. We have advice. I like tip or two. But i would love to hear yours. You have to prove for someone. Should they get twelve books from amazon. Andy what i mean obviously have to any relevant opinion on this at all. Now that we've started this into a gender studies. Podcast i really so i think yeah. I don't think my opinion is worth two cents on this. I think my opinion is completely valueless on this question well so much for that so sorry to the person who wrote in with so yeah i was like. We're a lot of help for you. Aren't we Okay first of all. I do think though what we're saying. Andy is a little bit of. We need to normalize that. This is normal to feel this way like i and i think that's the first part of this because sometimes people think they are the only ones feeling this way or like that. Maybe they really aren't out for it because they don't hear other people expressed out or concern or you know whatever and so so as a result it feels like this huge like thing that only they're dealing with so i guess i mean the first thing i would wanna do for the person that wrote in with us is that it is normal people do experience it people obviously experience it in different ways The two pieces of advice that i will share that i just one that i think is great for someone in a nonprofit. Is that when you can get yourself out of your own out of focusing on yourself and your feelings so like actually getting into the work like touching the mission feeling the mission like mission work like if you have the opportunity in your nonprofit to get connected to the work. It's amazing how all this other images collect crap like fades away right mental stuff you get really reinvigorated and just like it takes mind yourself and and moves it toward the larger purpose of the organization. So i think any time. We can do that when we're facing something like this is one strategy to sorted at least relieve it And the other thing is that's a really concrete to all that i have learned through many years of different coaching. different mastermind. groups is sort of we have the power to change our mindset. So figuring out when you're aware that that thought is coming in your what can you replace it with and i'm not talking going from like super negative. Oh god why. Do i have this job like they were silly to hire me too. I'm wonderful and amazing. And i you know kicked out every day. I'm not talking like that extreme thing but like how can you sort of like replace that one cent like that one set of mental narrative with something new. That's like i've faced new things before. And i've gotten through it and here i am today like something that neutralizes it like doesn't put all of the just the the energy that kind of it's like something that turns into like a huge. It's like starts as a snowball and the next thing you know. It's an avalanche with your thoughts. You wanna kinda nip in the bud right when it's at the snowball stage right and sort of redirect those thoughts to something that has more of a neutral statement and something that's kind of factual like hey you know whatever like replace x with the something else. That feels a little bit more like i've accomplished of accomplished you know new things before and i've set foot new things before and yet others nerves at the beginning but guess what i'm smart figure out my way through it like whatever that is for you but like sort of trying to redirect because it's like it's not kinda that that thing that we feed it when we keep feeding the thought it just gets worse than it. It's i also think like you know another thing i just. I'm throwing this in there if you have like a group of really close colleagues or friends or even like they've got some groups that are like i know. There's one in southern nevada. That's kind of a southern nevada executive directors group And that tends to be female executive directors and they get together regularly and one of the things they do is support each other a lot about like through. Not only just kind of the ins and outs in technical pieces of their jobs but also things like this that everyone faces so if you have sort of a trusted small group of people to that you can dispute open. Share the stuff with it. It helps a ton. So there's my three strategies what do you think about those andy. I think those are great. And i think i especially liked that you brought it back to the sort of mental health aspect of it as well. Because you're right that can be incredibly destructive that that that that feeling that you're not you're not worth the role that you've been placed into or that you're incapable of doing it and that that puts you into some sort of spiral where it's very difficult to get out of. I think that's a really important thing to remember. It's one of those things that you have to sort of lake name. It and claim it is like. I'm feeling like this. And now that i've said it out loud now that i've said it it's okay to not feel like it anymore. It's like i've i've got to. I've got to acknowledge that this is something that's happening and i know that it's happening and so i'm going to be aware of that feeling so it doesn't sneak up on me and the other thing you said which was i think i think Like really critical. And i you know after you set on like well. Yeah i did. That was one of the things. I did like once i after i started at three square. So one of the things about cool things about being in a position of authority is that you're now in a position of authority like you are now just by virtue of whatever role you've been placed in given that to sort of use that you can use that currency elsewhere so as cfo three square. One of the first things i did was the smith center came online and the fort weather first things i did. When the smith center came online was called rick. Johnson who was the. Cfo this first cfo. This said hey rick. I'm andy i'm the. Cfo at three score at the food bank like tried to go get much like welcome. Welcome to town. I'd love to go have lunch with you and like in the back of my mind. I'm like maybe he's going to tell me how to do. My job right. Maybe maybe i could get some secret tips on the and and in those kinds of conversations you absolutely. Do you have somebody that you've now had lunch with that. You've had a conversation with an if you're not just if you're not a horrible person you know super self centered person and you're actually engaging and listening like then then they're willing to add some questions if you have you know stuff like hey i've been trying to figure this out. I wonder if you have an idea on it. And then and then you're right those those professional networks if other people that are in the same role as you and other places a lot of times. They are willing to talk. You know. they're willing to say. Here's what i found that works for me or this is the resource that i use to help you with this thing and sort of making that network of people that you now. Because you're because you're you d because you're a cfo because you're in this new role that you don't think you deserve like use that to connect with the other people that are already in that role because now you can't now it's totally degenerated legitimate to be you know. Cfo to cfo or edd or something like that. Our board member to board member. You've got that you've got that calling card now. We've reached the end of another episode of nonprofit everything. Thanks for joining us. Stacey and i really appreciate that you take the time to listen to the podcast. And we're always delighted when we check out How many listeners have and see that. it's a large number and that makes us so happy to see that That this is useful because we figured if it wasn't useful the number would get smaller and smaller and smaller. But it's not. It's actually getting bigger and we really. That makes us really happy so tells us we're doing good stuff but if there stuff we could do better if their questions you want answered if you have comments on the format comments on the music comments on the audio editing comments on anything at all send out to us or send us your questions and we are so excited to get those and really happy to see them. And and really geek out on doing all the research. Try to what the answers are. Or if we can't figure it out finding a guest expert that can so thanks again for joining us. We will see you in a couple of weeks in your mouth.

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