The Televerse #456- Spotlight on Mrs. America


he makes some money host reality. Show hello welcome to the tele versus will take By no Kirkpatrick and nobody got some TV to talk about this week. I'm very appreciative. Okay so yes. They're killing. Eve is finishing up season and yes insecure had a very strong season and no. I have not started either of them in. Yes. I'm very certain I will at least really really like insecure of those too. But you know what I did watch this week. I watch competitive flower arranging. So there's a lot of TV to talk about. There is yeah in. That's how the top of the barrel were giving is a flower. No it's not because it's bottom of the barrel it's because that is the content. I'm looking for right now. That's Ferron to also to be fair. Killing Kinda sucks this season so okay. I'm not feeling too bad about the choice then but no like I you know. There's there are reasons that my brain is going. Yeah just rewatch sense. Eight and Rewatch Limitless and put on some ultimate tag holy holy-moly and episodes of Holy Moly. Yes listeners. I'm breaking down bit by bit. There is what we're saying. There's going to be quite a bit of reality talk this week because that's where my brain is at so so we still have a lot of TV to talk about in a few weeks. We will get creative. But we're not there yet and We wanted to mention because I forgot last week. We heard from Vince over in twitter. Not Seasons until January. Twenty twenty one. That sounds like a good opportunity for us to bring back the DVD shelf and may ask just ever would end or life. I know I know shocking. Suggestions coming from me And obviously we've talked about before I'm a big fan of life so I would be down for that when we get there but I've actually never seen any everwood. I had seen a good amount of Everwood. We watched it on Sunday evenings when the WB would air reruns of their prime time programming be as lead INS to their primetime stuff. They did on Sunday. Sometimes US I've seen like a good bit of it So I'm bigly familiar with the show enough to know that like Chris. Pratt is really famous. Now in Gregory Smith went from being an actor to being director Which I think is probably the better choice. Not a comment on his talent. Just directing more fun So yeah but also may I suggest because the entire thing is now available on. Hbo Max the Big Bang Theory. All eleven seasons now now. Now it's important piece of history. No friends I I could deal with some friends but I'm putting my down on Big Bang theory despite very much enjoying certain aspects of that show because the show improves dramatically when they add to the cast with the like the female cohorts right. Yes of the family. And then it stagnates again. Detrimental improvement show comes it creepy stalker ish unacceptable behavior from amy. That is treated as adorable. Because it's coming from a woman and therefore like harassment is just cute guys so yeah no. I have no No interest in doing a Big Bang Theory. Watch despite again really liking the proposal seen across the glass was the song for Bernadette like I like. There's some stuff in that show that I really really appreciate a bunch of really talented actors there but no but we will be getting to a point here. We have discussed Vince about how we're going to approach things when we start running low on shows and Some sort of back and forth like I pick a show you pick a show kind of situation as likely where we are headed at some point. But I'm curious because like the the DVD chef has theoretically we watch a bunch of show. And I just don't have time for that anymore like I did previously when I was underemployed and trying to lake scrape together enough students and gigs to like make ends meet so fortunately Even in the current situation. I'm managing to be mostly employed level fruit with my violin which means significantly underpaid so therefore working way too many hours. So so that is. You don't have the time to watch a whole series in a week the way that I used to like. Yeah that one weekend. I watched thirty episodes of cheers. It was glorious such a good show but we will come up with solutions. We have ideas Any other shows that we should throw out there that you think we should we make to know I mean the jetsons is all on. Hbo Max now. So I feel like the jetsons is a possibility Do all the jetsons including the bad nineteen eighties animation style. It doesn't look nearly as good like these. These are the thoughts I have now see whereas I'm more like can we hunt down dinosaurs. Can we hunt down? Some dinosaurs is really hard to find. I think shame 'cause that's great. Yeah now it's going to be what's available streaming. Since libraries aren't available library razor certainly less available. I'm solicitors reach out and let us know what shows you want us to to like either? Let's say this focus on short run shows So miniseries I would be all for like a bunting. A bunch of like really eventful mini series. That I have never seen or should receive Merlan. No I never did see my home hand. I'd like to Revisit Merlin especially now that Samuel's like a total chick magnet and it still dog the Doug analyst metered but or shows that were like one and done or like two seasons but not that many episodes or kinds of shows where you can give us a list of ten episodes that we can watch and have like a good sense of the show. Something like that So we're we're saying is a lot of British comedies. Everyone where we're looking for is love British comedies. Very here for British comedy So we'll be we've been thinking about. We have ideas but we want to hear from you guys to of things that you would be excited. Us talking about So because the I mean the one that keeps coming up in my brain. 'cause I still feel like I didn't give it a good enough shot for Carl is detector wrists if feel like I need to give it another go but We've already talked about on the show so it wouldn't be for that would just be for my own conscience because I still feel bad about that. One news wise in the TV world unfortunately as interested but we were hoping against hope. Emergence was canceled but stumped. Tom Lives renewed so get ready to get stumped and season two whenever that is whenever. That is right no yeah. I'm very disappointed about emergence. Absolutely not surprised in any way shape or for Because we were literally the only three people watching that and I say three because I'm counting my partner in that So yeah but sometime very glad about and I'm hoping that they sort of recalibrate the show just a smidge. Yeah because they need to do something with their supporting cast. Answer what that's supporting cast is and how it interacts. But otherwise I'm very excited to keep on stumping and then of course what we did. The shadows was renewed for season three. And when I saw that news I was both relieved in very happy but also surprised that it hadn't been renewed sooner So that did because I felt like a no brainer and it feels like facts. Usually when they have a good show. They support Yeah but we've got Disney now that changes the calculus but yeah so anyways at least we know what in the shadows season three is coming Which will make the series a season finale of that. That is coming in just a couple of weeks. Here be a little less of a thing so at least we can look forward to a season. Three avoid in the US there was also a change to the Golden Globes eligibility rules that that popped up married or this week that I was fascinated by this was due to the man delorean because apparently they're their rules about who is eligible for best actor. Is You voice? Performance voice only performances are not eligible. Which is stupid but At least make it. Its own category. I guess but but what was strange to me. Is this notion that because you couldn't see his face that that meant it was voice only performance and the rule changes that because you actually do see his face. There's there are enough scenes where you see his face such episode of the season such that he is eligible. But it's like what did they think he's doing with his body 'cause his body is also acting. Yeah so here's my thing about. This is like a couple of different things. One there is the physicality aspect of it. That you're acting. You're doing a vocal performance. That is also acting mind. Larger problem with it is the confirmed aspect of the fact that Pascal. Just not onset for those episodes so does he only get to technically. Smith the finale where we know. He's at least onset for those scenes as opposed to win his it when a stuntman did all that physical work and in collaboration with Pascal. So that's really my problem with. It is the fact that we're drawing this really arbitrary line about his eligibility but not the eligibility of his his fellow actor basically who also just did whole episodes of the show and Pascal did not. So that's really kind of squishy for me because it draws a real line of we'll wait. How many episodes does Pascal have to be in for him to technically be eligible then How does this work And also it's the globe who the hell cares but if this were the NBA is. I'd be much more like up in arms about this but it's Globes but it's all kind of weird bullshit That I'm just I'm not here for it's just nonsense and voice acting should be recognized but this gets into like the larger discussion that everyone was having when the mandatory and came out last year of wait. Why would you hire Pascal to do this when he's just going to be under a helmet the entire time? It's like well because actors do more than just faces like you know that Atkins more than just face work. Well just knowing that he wasn't actually filming all of the scenes or episodes there's certain absence with that makes sense because they're very stunt heavy So I get that more and I'm sure that the the the notion of a character being a collaboration between the main actor and at least one stunt performer and these different things. That is nothing new that makes complete sense And I've been saying for ages. There should be a best stunts and Ben Performer award at the Emmys not the Oscars because significant thing. That is not so to me only gets its own dedicated separate awards like there's the producers guild award but guess what producers still get an Oscar if they win at the main awards So there so that's very interesting to me but also I feel. I feel vindicated by me like I don't see the performance coming through in aisles. Like sometimes I do sometimes see the performance coming through and sometimes I don't see any specificity to the movements now. I feel slightly less like on my own separate island about that knowing that sometimes it was the Pascal and sometimes it wasn't and I don't have the same expectations for a stunt performer. As I do for Patrick. Pascal cast for his acting obviously but also for his name because he is a respected actor and they gave some prestige to this show. That was you know helping launch the all Disney plus stuff so like a was like I knew it but I didn't but I'm going to save. I knew it. So yeah the notion that acting is only. The face is very strange. How are you going? It's only Timothy Alphonse voice in season two. Yeah we'll see we will see Ya anyways. That is our news for this week at the end of the show. We're GONNA be talking about. This is America which is finished up season. I think only seasonal food. Yes thank you at Hulu But untechnical Hulu sorry ethics on who? It's important distinction that everyone knows and cares about and certainly remembers. We're going to listen to Some some music from legends of tomorrow now as we had into because the whole thing as I was watching it I was like okay. Pause opened up my computer. Pull up the you know the streaming APP. We're going to be recording this audio because we will definitely be using the whole thing is too long so to use only part of it But yes I as soon as the started on legends. Like An. We're using this in the podcast because it is very good very good. So enjoy some Whatever part I use. I don't even know what the name of the song is Press Mr Parker's repressive repressive call to sack enjoys the music. We'll be right back after this and feelings bad feelings Mike you so mad you WANNA scream failings. Everyone sometimes. Is those feelings when you do. Just sing this song spark reiner. You're trying to help. Read Rests Rape Threes? I'll go back and read threats eights banner to bury my feelings. Then feel awful as lay the bad feelings maker so mad. You WanNA scream feelings. One sometimes. Has Those feelings when you do this song on those as the old age and you got flag. That was our. Mr Parker is called sack a song from this week's episode episode of legends of tomorrow this weekend. Tv In things with reality this week. And we're GONNA start with legendary. Which is the vogue in competition this competition show on? Hbo Max This Week. We had the MIR welcome to my house. Then we have. I caught up with a few episodes of the big flower fight was on Netflix flicks. Just a flower flower arranging and like sculpture. Kinda show Then we're GonNa talk about alternate tag and Holy Moly because after your recommendation. All I did check out Altima tag and I enjoyed the first two episodes and then of course had to compare contrast with Holy Moly. So that's coming in a little bit. Then we'll talk drag race in their reunion upset alone together. The move onto genre with merv. Marvel's agents of shield the new deal immediately followed by legends. Tomorrow the one where we're camped on TV and we'll round things out with the good fight. Finale the gang finds Jeff Epstein. Jeffrey essenes killer was so-called. The gang finds out who killed Jeffrey obscene out. Thank you and then just a bit about this season overall because we haven't talked as much about the season for a while but I is legendary on HBO. Max I've seen the I two of this The first two available So I've also seen the first episode. That has an elimination but I thought it was really smart of them to introduce the houses the format and everything without any elimination in the first episode. What did you think of this show? How familiar were you with vogue beforehand and You know was a a good move to launch with the start visual match Max so as a well educated white upper to middle class person who has almost a masters in media studies. I've seen Paris's burning right so I'm familiar with. I'm I'm familiar with the ballroom. Seen through the Lens of Paris's burner Which admittedly is dated in terms of just being from for late? Eighties and early nineties So but not enough. That I didn't go like I know who the House of Ninja is. I know who the House of Saint Laurenti is I know like the House of There was another house. I think it was the house of West. It's like maybe heard of But not through. Paris is burning. So I'm familiar enough with it in like that conceptualization of it that a lot of this was just like we're GonNa do introductions and I think that works okay I I should say. I only watched the first episode. I wish I wish I had watched that second episode so I could have actually seen like the competition aspect of this because the introductory episode of. Here's everyone knows GonNa get eliminated. But here's everyone here. Sort of a sampler of what our format is makes for really boring television Like it's kind of it's super weird mash up of like so you think you can dance and drag race and There was another comparison. The back of my rain though. I can't quite put my finger on now when I watched this yesterday but like it just never kind of like the first episode never comes together for me in any way shape or form that feels compelling or interesting as opposed to just little set pieces each now. There's no narrative basically And so just felt more like a chain of like almost like a short music videos for me rather than I have a sense of who these people are. I have sense of what this show is about. And that was just really sort of frustrating on like a premier level for me so I don't dislike it But like it's not a good intro. I think to the show to watch that first. Episode apart from this is a primer for all the folks. That don't know what this is. This is the best way to look at it and I think I should have just jumped to the second episode Which I think is what I should have done. But I didn't know that the first episode was going to be curious. What a houses. Here's the history evoking real fast Here's all of this stuff and I just want. But I I know all this appreciate you doing this quick legwork for me but I would like tickets at the competition now. Please and thank you. So we're the the dances than with the sequences of different houses. Performing wasn't enough for you. It really wasn't enough in a part of that was also. I don't like the way that they're edited chops. A lot of them depending on like the pace of the pace of it 'cause who is it that did Largely face covers was Gucci. I don't remember which house but I remember Sequence. Yeah and that's quences pace because of how they perform it. It's edited in a way that really emphasizes a lack of cuts in a slowness to it. Other folks were. There's a lot of action where there's a lot of movement they get. Cut a lot more to really emphasize that kind chaotic nature of the dance. And I think that's the larger problem with production side and that really takes me took me out of watching the performances so it was really difficult to focus on like the formats aspect of it and just focus on the passion aspect and watch on whomever has decided that they're going to be the judge that is going to be the angriest and the hardest to Whatchamacallit impress who I think is lot roach Is like okay? That's fine so all I do is focus on the fashion when I want on the entire presentation. I don't get to do that in that first episode so that was really frustrating for me. How did you feel about these two episodes? Because I've been talking for a few minutes I feel like I don't have enough to say because I only watched that first episode and it was fine. I liked it when you did too. I definitely did watching this While I was on the treadmill and I was like you know what I need to stop. I need to watch this so that I can pay attention. the editing like. You're saying that I could really see what they were doing okay. They're not messing around these very talented dancers. Okay I need to actually make sure I'm watching this and so I started it over and watched it in a less distracting environment. And I think that I mean I hear what you're saying especially if you were already familiar with the basics of ballroom which I mean obviously neither of us or anything approaching experts on that absolutely not. I really wanted him precisely. Not even a little bit but familiar with the terminology. A lot of the basic terminology and some of the different moves in just from seeing you know watching spurning or a drag race or not pos-. There's a bunch of small scenes the stuff Granted those are not actual. You know Paris's burning his documentary footage but you know the rest of that is much more manipulated choreographed presented for narratives purposes but Yeah there's a lot of hand holding this episode if you're new to the scene which is probably very good to make sure we get as wide audience as possible but it also can make it feel slow Can make you feel repetitive. Because they got nine houses eight houses to there's there's arguably too many houses see I would be more interested in like a smaller number of houses in a thing where you get points each week but don't get eliminated. Yes I think that's a much better radio in this and that You know but because that's not the case we're talk about this in a little bit more Guards to another show When you when you watch all of our interests each of these houses each house has five members in a lot of times. They're trying to interest each of those five member issues. It's too much to follow in. It's too much to give any meaningful amount of time to is just as exactly problems that they have on drag race at the beginning of the season. They're tried to interest thirteen queens. And this season right. They split it into two premiers into six and seven. You've got to actually get a sense of the personalities and the skill sets of these competitors. Because you were only trying to follow six or seven at a time. It was much much more successful so they have the same problem. Here I liked. I liked the performances. I enjoyed that one house. That was like you just said you. You said introduce that so. I introduced the house. I didn't know we were all going like. Wait to take everything to eleven teachers pets. Which is shows the lack of Maybe a lack of understanding of the competition from that one house compared to everybody else going all out with their introductions but Yeah I what I would have liked here. I enjoyed this within you did. I actually was compelled and use and watch the second episode right away because I could screening privilege What I liked was the performances and also liked a lot is our host a John. Wesley and I really liked leamy Maldonado. Who is a really famous and respected vote performer and so that they were great. And there's not nearly the kind of judging that I think this show would benefit from. And if they had at least one more person on the judging panel who has strong connections to the vogue ing world and could give some technique and like specific critiques. It would do do. What a world of benefit. Because while I enjoy the personalities that they're doing. I don't have any connection to Roach or mega mega stallion I really appreciate MILLAGE MEAL. But he you remember that controversy. That happened when she was announced. Yeah and they said well they start out saying she was going to host in judge and then there's no she's not hosting she's just one of the judges and then this actually this really respected vulgar is going to be are the MC. Well it has been this first episode but in the second episode it happens way more various ACLU like Jamila meal is definitely Is supposed to be the host. Because every time there's an announcement from the judges or like this person is eliminated or this person is is the winner. She always says it. She gives the description of the categories. She gives the it's like. Why are you doing that? You've got an emcee right here. Who's very good? Yeah let him be the MC and you'll be one of the judges. Yeah but that's not like there's a clear delineation she's got they also bring in guest judge starting in the second episode celebrity to be on the panel. So now there's five judges and only one of them who knows what they're talking about. And and the judging because there isn't judging really invest they just give some feedback. There are set but they can either they can either give them tens across the board or they can cut them and that's it so they would actually give them numbers so you can't get a sense of like that was good. That was like six. This is an eight and here now I will tell you why they got a ranking is just either yes or no it's a pass fail and then when when it's down to two then they pick who they looked better okay and so that's how they structure it and I think it's it's because they've got judges who can't tell you why something got a seven nominates and the dancers are talented enough and specific enough and interesting enough that I would much rather have like I've got my issues with. I think you can dance. But everyone on that panel. Even the person who ever each season is there to be the nice one they always come from performance background of some sort. There's not a lack of expertise. There's not a lack of expertise even if that isn't always playing even if they're playing it down and being very generic you know that the person knows what they're talking about and in this. It's a lot of reactions T to two things and not like you know basically. I just go like okay. What is said the only say okay? That's the person I'm actually GONNA believe. 'cause they know what they're talking about and these other people are entertaining but they are not in my opinion. They're not up to the challenge represented by the talent level of the dancers. And so I'm of two minds about it because I. I think it's great that this dance form is getting this platform because it's always frustrating me on so you think you can dance. Somebody comes out invokes house down and they'd never take them to the next level of the competition because the so you think you can ask just doesn't have that same respect for voting just very frustrating so I appreciate that. There's know this is a very good platform for a bunch of really talented dancers. But I wish they had done a better job with the structure and with their judging panel and I don't know why they didn't other than maybe budget. Yeah and I don't know like I have. I have so many questions about this. Show in terms of the production development cycle of it and what it was wrong because basically based on what you told me regarding Jamile It very much. Sounds like they WANNA do Padma from top chef and except for the fact that Padma knows what she's talking about it it'd be like if they have Padma on the panel but then they have someone else hosting all right writers like. It's very strange. If you're if you're on the fence I would say watch episode to Then we talk about it next week. You can still you know. I'll definitely watch the second episode and maybe the It should be out by the time. We recorded report So I'll try it all out space for that In between watching sad Irish people next week It's a show that will be talking about next week. Everyone oh I didn't realize the released both episodes. Okay cool then. I can not MISSI words. Yeah yeah the second episodes available already available it with the first episode on Wednesday when? Apo Max Rollout. Yeah I would appreciate someone with an affinity for provoking voting in the bar scene and all of that. I want to understand it better by watching the show. I want to be able to appreciate the dancers and what you know what they're able to do which is really neat and appreciate everything that else that goes into putting on shows which is featured in the second episode costuming and Choreography and laving and all that which is cool. But I also want to walk away knowing more about it and I don't feel like I am. That's fair more next week. Do you know more about flower arranging. Now some of the big flower fights one which is currently on Netflix's and a lot of people are talking about. Yeah no okay so this is. It's it's the most obvious. Great British bake off clone. So far where even though there's only one round but each episode has one sculpture that they're doing how dare I'm making it as a thing. I know that speaks to. Just how blatant they are with this with this. This one so much The the reason that I find the push play on this is that one of the host is Natasha Italia Dimitrio or Najah from what we channel exactly right. It's like Oh my God. I'm watching this. And she's delightful. But here's why okay. If you watch it I get it listeners. If you if I might I might go back and watch more of it to Is Very great to fall asleep. You wake up by the end in the see. The final results goal. Those are really cool. Like that's my level. But they commit one of the cardinal sins of reality competition shows in that they don't show us. Everyone sculptures every week a so in the second episode. You're still meeting teams. That competed in the first episode. But we never saw their finished sculpture. And you can't do that. That's not acceptable. And I think the reason is because they don't want it to be too scattered or maybe they didn't look regard so the only show the best and the worst but like if you if your show can't handle also the judge is not very good. They have one main judge and they bring in guest judge every week. So they're not. That's not a good idea. Ignore it he should not have more hosts than you have judges anyways So there's a there's a laudable attention to topics like sustainability. That's a big part of the first episode. So there's more awareness and more like trying to engage with different issues around Like landscaping sculpture in flowers. And everything like that In than I anticipated which I was really happy to see but you you cannot. If if you don't trust your judges to be able to explain why this one is good in this one is not. You've got a really big problem and don't say in your insects and Oh we're making a giant snail and then don't show me the giants snail and then expect me to be invested in the snail team in the second episode. When you decide you're going to spend more time with his father and son duo Yeah you don't you don't you can't do that. You can't do so. I have strong feelings about the big flower flower fight. Despite being Lee mildly invested. I like some of the teams quite a bit There's some there's some really obviously very talented people But there he had their amateur flower arrangers and the first amateurs but some of them clearly are not and so them are and it's very weird so sound like there's a competitive flower arranging circuit. That you can go pro in but like some of them are florist in. Some of them are like Party. Designed specialists and some of them are artists who also work in a flower shop. Like severi very different things. So yeah it's a mess okay. I'm sorry to hear that. Yeah what a waste of Natasha Demetrio. So she's again. She's delightful. She's very fun. Yeah let's talk about ultimate tag okay so you talked about this last week and I was intrigued so I watched it and it is real dumb you sweat. It's so stupid but it's also really fun. Has the people who are doing it for the most part have good energy and a good perspective and they're also really good like the. The taggers are insane. Obviously that's their job but the competitors are ridiculous like Olympic Competitive Track Star. And I like like. They're not messing around with who they found to do this and they st- most of them still get their butts kicked and yeah it's it's it's really fun it's a bit too. Repetitive yes for me especially like watching the first episode okay. I don't know how the Games work fair enough watching the second. I had not said this year's recording so I couldn't fast forward. I don't need you explain dodge tag to me again but I understand that if this is your first episode which is very possible. You would need that explain okay. I see the problem here but I need to be able to fast forward. Because there's way too much filler. Also the white brothers like you said are not very good show should have gone a holy moly route and gone for comedians instead of athletes jus- and it would be so much better if they had comedians. Yep well that's the thing is like With Holy Moly you have an actual. Sports caster paired with comedian and that makes a world of difference in terms of like the level of enjoyment. Here and the brothers were just very bad on television. And they're terrible commentators because this is a weird thing to provide commentary on and they're also not to my knowledge they're not actual like they don't do like a lot of play by play commentary type stuff and as someone who has watched like both holy moly but um which. Mccall it a battle the network stars which they've back and also marble racing recently of like if you just commit to the idea of doom telecasting sports commentary type stuff. You can make anything really interesting like the people van Corona Virus Lake sports announcing like once in the park or dogs eating food. Well Yeah if you can do. Yeah and so that lack of that here in ultimate tag is really weird and very noticeable like in the second episode for me after getting over the whole this is very silly and. I'm enjoying it and now I'm like there are so many flaws in this show that could be fixed with just a couple of different tweets and they would actually be pretty solid. Yeah the the people on the second episode man like there. Every in the first episode was very good. Yeah but the second episode was particularly strong. Like why did they start with this one his lake to him? I mean I love how the the backgrounds you want or not martial arts. You don't need the kind of speed for that. That's not going to help you though. They're all in saline in good shape. But like you need track people and you need people with agility. Yes that's like some sort of Procure liquor saying last week or if like the the basketball person in the first episode does pretty well. Because again you need to able to change directions and stuff Or or like the football players because again same thing you need to be able to to spin dodge Yeah it was it watching. This is what I also think about it which I think is an improvement over something like Ninja Warrior which I'm a big fan of within warrior is that The Nice thing about injured worry is that there are certain personalities get over the different seasons who come back a rear and we don't get that here but what you do get here. That is nice. Is that people aren't just eliminated once they're gone so that happened. You get a first round where he spent time with everybody and then you don't have an elimination for a little bit. So even if someone gets tagged they're still gonNA have another shot. You can invest more. You can like play along with them throughout the episode until the final showdown round. So that really helps. I also am enjoying some of the taggers more than the others who I feel like. Flair inflow are the best taggers. Probably I mean that's the thing about the taggers. Is that the ones that do her. Core like run free running or definitely like the best ones because they can just go over top in that. Have to go around. And that's the thing is like that's the courses are set up for you to go over top Kaz going lower not going like over. The obstacles is tagged. You're going to get tagged on but also like I really. I really appreciate like the person who is the iron giant. Oh has just immense amount of personality but also is great not buying into like the whole persona thing of just like. I'm going to be kind of cool. This is like audits very good. I appreciate you very much. I like that. You don't buy into your gimmick too much. Unlike the guy who's going whole hog his gimmick which I kinda kid with the tongues I told you the tongue because it makes you look younger like it's stop doing it but I also watched some of the youtube stuff and he is delightful on Youtube. Yeah Yeah I had fun with it. I also appreciate the they're actually legitimately strategy to the sounds and that you know if you watch it more of it a certain point you can appreciate that like your first watching. You're going. This is ridiculous by your second third fourth episode. You can develop very specific and detailed approaches how you feel the correct way to play as for example in the end. You don't try to dodge the taggers you just you. Just accept that you're GONNA get tagged you go as fast as you. If you managed to not get tagged think one person so far has managed to tag by one of the people at the end. Congratulations you're very impressive So like that element of is Pretty Fun and affiliate dump tag is the part where there's the most of strategy gut which is pretty neat but which is why like in the second soda was really disappointed that they did that. Whole this highlights reel of Dome Tag. Because I'm just like the. Don't test the most exciting one you can do you. Also why are you not putting time against in for dome take every single time you know? It's of like they haven't figured I don't think that they figured out there what their taggers are good at yet. Because like I don't know if you remember but like American. Gladiators some of those gladiators had like specialty events that they were always end. And you were just like off of that. Person is doomed because laser is doing the thing Yeah so that's sort of like the thing that I'm interested in seeing. They figure that out as has produced more episodes The only thing I think is worth mentioning is all the audience members with their obviously showed show produced signs of like all the all the tag like. You don't know who any of these people are just gave you these signs and told you to wave them around so you could maybe be on TV and that takes us to holy moly. Which of course is the same thing and I still don't care but I I think I can appreciate the things that only does very well. That tag ultimate And so while tag is much more high energy I THE HOLY. Moly is pacing the comedy of it. I can appreciate even more Having having watched ultimate tags so some of their some of them are just fun. Some of the different challenges are just fund. The one where they have to run the two point five seconds to run. Pass all the eight outhouses before the door opens knocks. Them into the drink is entertaining One one person almost beat it in she just kind of she was the second leg just a not even a second late to start if she had burst Raewyn Burst forward right when it She go she probably would have made it but No one of the people in the first episode with the windmills dislike eventually just like now and just dumped into the water instead as come daters loved it because of course she doesn't realize she's got to do a second one right and then she did do the second one so she took the ones drug penalty but she was. She wasn't going to take the two stroke penalty. So yes the some of the structure design of it is not all that compelling but they get a surprisingly effective hour-long comedic like event. Show out of it. Everything considered so yeah. I had some fun with those this week though. I don't know and I actually really enjoyed watching ultimate tag with my dad and that might be a reliable like not turning on the news. So let's turn on him instead. Kinda show so we'll see maybe need to set a like a dvr recording so you could skip ahead. That would make a big difference. It makes a huge difference. So yeah I'll do that next is drag race with alone together the reunion show and I read this up over Davy Club and most my biggest takeaway mostly my big thing. Was this really good. Yes they did a really really good job and yes All the queen's look great except for I mean come on come was having her. You can try a little harder but the like. I was so impressed by the editing. Both the video and the audio editing for this like however. They managed to film this like congratulations. Well done. I'm sure. They sent cameras and lighting rigs in everything Mike Packs to everybody. But just the there are jokes that went back and forth that seemingly had a no to a miniscule amount of lag and I'm not I still am not quite sure of how film this such that they were not talking over each other so much that they could actually hear responded. What people were saying I. I assumed that they just like muted. Everybody except the one or two people who are talking and they recorded them and then they could like cut it back in. They told people to react but then there are a few times where people would react to something that on the first one was being interviewed said and then somebody else responded that like so. I was really impressed Yes this is the standard reunion show. But I'm now rather excited for what the finale might be based on the production level of this reunion. Yeah I think that's the key takeaway because I've generally found the reunion episode to both be a reunion episode but also kind of boring Especially in a season where a lot of drama happened very early and was not even particularly good drama. So the fact that we have to rehash stuff between Adrian it's just like our sorry aiden no I don't care and as you and I have discussed elsewhere. It's been a year for these people. They're just passed it and we're all and other people are like no no like everyone's fine. It's okay let's move on So I think like the production aspect of this episode is what's more impressive about everything than like the narrative or the discussion of everything that happened on the season So Yeah No. Just the sound editing. Visual editing really chaining together good reaction shots and then reaction commentary. It's really well put together and like you. I'm very excited to see. What the finale that airs. Today as we record is GonNa look like on because I feel like it's GonNa look really really good. I hope that it looks really really good and I hope that ru looks really really good as opposed to what looks like in this episode. Yeah okay so going with the theme of like a Party. That one person did not follow through who who did not bridge. You didn't follow the brief. Yes some of the people didn't follow the free but it was so smart. It was so smart because it just gave it this intimate feel gave it a feel of like now people like relaxing and having Lake. You know happy hour together with their friends like it it. It let it feel more intimate which is appropriate for a reunion show. They know these are not going to have drama. You know they. They weren't giving US drama. Throughout the season. With the different set of cleans you would approached this differently with this said it was going to be very friendly very cordial and very like Amiable through the whole thing so having that kind of like possum popcorn and put your hair up in rollers you know. And we're just GONNA relax kind of thing we're reach or address up as avenues or scrooge but make it drag. Yeah Yeah and so with that. I was trying like the the the Hoodie rate was like. Okay get loungewear. I mean I you could gone for a row but whatever and then I was like is the mass supposed to be a face mask ultimately went with in my right up though. It's obviously not but and it was because we didn't want to do make up and because he didn't have a team there to do is make it for him he hasn't done own headed his own makeup for like high. Def CLOSE UP. Tv In a very long time And so unless you'RE GONNA try to get Raven there somehow and And quarantine them and like you know. He's got a whole team. Who does all that stuff for him? So I look forward to seeing what it's going to be for the finale and maybe just be like. I will do that. But only for the finale doing it for the reunion fair to like it just was such. It was more legiter. Yes it was a face mask. It was very very strange I don't I didn't get it but I thought the of queens mostly queens looked terrific. I feel like yeah. I think there was a clear winner though who is a clear winner. Who was the clear winner? Who Do you think? Jada obviosuly pillows great with the Pillow and disease. Yes J two one but everybody else was really good too. I've really liked widows. Look me in the palm shares while it's just like Oh Cuba great You're you're living your best life. Yeah this is. Awesome and and highly space was beats gorgeous. Yeah I did appreciate the shade of You came in thirteenth roof race. Twelve can we talk about those real quick because the reeds were excellent and some people have been like you know shading it because they were so obviously reading them. What do you think they do during the regular season they memorize them ahead of time? Like you know the on the spot own Nikki. You're just you're reading that offer for card right now or screen and you're hiding it very well but I also don't care because this is how this works and because they are actually very good reads. I had difficulties deciding who I thought was the best. Because there were several peop- yet they didn't do enough of them. They did not especially considering. There wasn't a library challenge this year. Yeah but I think it's because everybody got to do like to instead of having eight people you know so because we're all all twelve of them there but yet it just Yeah it I was glad that they did do a reading challenge at the were so good and the whole thing. I thought was fun and mostly it did what it needed to do. Which was cleared the air on a couple of things that hopefully British start getting death threats And then let them site people up for the finale. We'll see more on the finale next week now is over genre Marvel's agents of shield new deal and I had some difficulty remembering the specifics of the setup. Yeah apparently there was an unknown amount of time that it took to settle the stuff up and I don't remember exactly the deal with that but I mentioned we'll be told eventually the main takeaway for me was look. You look you time travel. Oh look agents of shield is GonNa do lessons of tomorrow because there are certain time period hot spots so they can travel to and they're gonNA go back and forth falling the crew guys. Get the bag is you've heard about the casting for the season. Yes I know nothing about this season. Tell you know. There's one guest star that it's very exciting. Oh No I know about that. Are you talking about Perkin? Yeah yeah no I. Know About Enver. I'm very excited for them to hop forward couple of decades down so we can hang out with Cash but mostly I'm like you WANNA do legends in your own shield away. I'm very here for. I'm okay with it. No the substitutes. I had the same thing of like I kind of forgot like what? The premise of the season was going to be I remember that they were very begum like the time. Travel stuff right at the end of season six with Gemma being like furry seasons because we can't tell you because we have a mystery about fits and also because the actors not available for most of the season reportedly So like all of that and working working through that but it is also just like Oh. We're just going to hang out in nineteen thirty one and do some weird stuff and we're going to have weird face stealing stuff. It's Kinda gross and creepy and I like it and also the coatings were terrible earlier. Slick yes Patton oswalt gets to play. I'm here for all of this so I really enjoyed it. Aside from and I'd say aside from but also at the same time in keeping with being legends tomorrow this season there. Fdr's terrible just legitimately bad on which is very tomorrow. So I'm I was generally pretty happy with all the Salinas and I liked all the jokes about Zeke. Just being like you don't get to file any patent is good Ripples not waves repulsed not ways that whole time stream idea concept of them being like this is how we're going to justify this Has That's good? I appreciate you getting valid away so all in all. I'm here for all of this. And I really had opening scene with Phil getting all those. Two Years of memories downloaded all at once was really Kinda gut wrenching to watch both from Carter X performance which I thought was really good in that scene to everyone else's like discomfort and frustration with watching all of that play out as well was also really really really good so I'm very onboard with this whole we're going to do legends in our own way and also here's everything you liked about this show and we're going to figure it out because this is our swan salt swansong season so. I'm very excited about it. The scene I wanted to make sure to mention is I appreciate Show that has done. I mean able bodied person. This is not my place to say but what seems like a very good jess with disability representation with Yoyo. I thought that they gave me 'cause there certain things that they gonNA have trouble with in the past and having such a diverse cast is gonNA cause problems for the visit already starts to in this first episode but having a having a woman walk around with robot arms is nothing you can do in the past And have without you know waves so them finally giving her like normal looking like flesh and bone looking hands. is a significant thing. And I really appreciate the way. They approached it and I also hope that when they end up back in the future she is back to her normal hands. Yes But I thought that I really appreciated that. They addressed that that they aren't GonNa just Kinda put her in gloves all season. Pretend it's not a thing you know And that they will. I imagine they will not be like the scene of her touching. Her face was absolutely beautiful. And it's something that I hadn't thought about with the show in its various forms of representation making Mac. The leader all this stuff that has done very well throughout its run. In general I hadn't thought about the disability representation which is such a able able bodied person like focused thing to not consider until I was at comic con one year at a representation panel and they talked about that and I was like. Oh yeah yeah that must be really powerful. People DUMB. Never thought about that okay. I'm working on it so I I thought it was very important that they gave that seen the the significance needed and absolutely is it's arguably like of like the quieter moments in the episode apart like it's and not ranking these till reactivate Phil Activation scene of the Ellen de and that is that both kind of propel this episode a lot and provide a really solid emotional core to it. Yeah definitely I'M. I'm looking forward to the season and two. We'll see what comes next. Let's go to our actual of tomorrow episode The one where we're trapped on TV and we love it consul so good even though like it's a rehash of a retread of a number of different episodes that they've already done in doom world. It's already has to figure out how to save Again but here's the thing. It still feels really fresh. It's really funny and it's still really toothsome in like a number of the emotional beats and when you can manage to do that while basically retreading ground that you've already done earlier in the show but do it better than both those other instances to certain extent like the time loop sorry episode still like top Tier Legends tomorrow for me but this is a much better like doom world's ask episode for number of reasons that will get into here But this episode just so so so so good. That Kinda can't get over it. There's one problem with his episode for me and the problem is not them saying so much as it is a me thing carbon also a little bit of them thing and it is when they go to the Mr Parker's neighborhood song. Yes because the last time we saw Mr Parker neighborhoods who was in Mr Parker's neighborhood but are good boy ray when raisin here other and they didn't and I was like damn you know it's a it's a weird thing because like I knew like I got excited but then my partner pointed out. No He's not in the trailer for this. They had someone else in Cardigan that's right. We're not going to get ray. It's really frustrating. I really wanted ray here There's no reason for him not to be here other than money in contracts because lots of people are there have no need to be there so no it's like we managed to get Ramona young back home for an episode of very effectively used and utilized in this episode as well Though arguably like all the weird supporting side characters from very storylines including Rory's family popping up towards the end and being an I'd hit that gross slack off the show March but no. I absolutely agree that like. It's very weird that it's not right. And it feels like a weird sort of sidebar. But they really want that sinister as Lee thing for that sequence you but that's not why it's not right. That's why it's not right now right so it's not rai- because then ray would have to be in the finale and the show moving forward and they wanted to write him off so that that's why it's not him. I said to deal with that as much as I would other. You know it was as much as would have made Oliver Legends Hearts. Go Peter Pat but aside from that separate element. I thought that they really nailed their different. Parodies was like alternate buds. Yes ended ultimate buds for friends. Which is just yeah was really really well done They've got Downton Abbey for High Castle Abbey which nailing both music for that is like. What's really key in that sequence? And they hit the Downton Abbey Score. They spit crushed. The score was exactly right. It's too perfect as someone who is listen to that soundtrack. Quite a bit. Because it's really good. It's like Oh no. That's that is all very correct. And the the star trip For our two captains for life with a crew that never dies because they're all interests he was just very good aside from the fact that I was just like. Where's Rory whereas Roy show whereas rory is he like professional wrestling and then to have be con- but movie cod not t? Ti Series Cod. Because she needs to do various hair. You need to the hair. And he's doing a different voice and just like show. That was worth you making me wait but also just like nailing Mulun stuff like see. I don't think they mailed that I think that was the weak point of that. I think that the Romulo in costumes of really really good and off appropriate enough and I like the head. I like the prosthetic work in that. Yeah I think they didn't do a good enough job of differentiating the characters. Oh I think that's fair yet and that might fit but then it was too hard to track. There wasn't enough specificity to individual characters and there wasn't enough specificity to their ship and everything Filling time it didn't feel that did not feel as organic to star Trek as the other stuff felt organic to Downton and two friends over her so that was a part of why the Star Trek one wasn't as effective for me. I thought everything with every everything with the captains was great i. I loved their kiss at the end. It was like they managed to do like a whip around sweet someone into a dip thing. That wasn't a dip soon. Could be equal partners in the kiss which is like I can't. I can't think of a time I've seen that On my shows it's always one of the characters is in like a more dominant in a more submissive positioning and so two to not do that. Felt very a pointed in empowering in such an awesome way yes so cool not to mention. I'm sure you know all the fun you can have with all the slashers out there. The flankers just like blanket. You hit the slash layers. And then there's like they're gay people in O s parody Just it's It's very good and yeah it's an kitty. Lots of Shattner impressionist. It was fun. I've seen better known significantly better but she didn't want to Overdo it which I appreciate because it's really easy to Overdo a impression L. I see I thought it was overdue. Okay well also if you're gonNA overdo a ham that's the hand to overdue. Yeah that's true that's true. I also I really liked. I really liked the the spark of it all to and we cannot finish cutting this without mentioning Constantine's hair. That was my favorite part of all the downton stuff. I like that. It just steadily starts taking on color to Just it's it's very good And I really just appreciate it also like we should take a moment to like really getting to like taller. Like she's been this season but then to really try that in this episode on of like the vocal work that she's been doing to differentiate sorry sorry And like how those differences play. It's just it's really. It's really good and like they should never let her leave. This show. Well is the thing is I kind of them to keep both of the night and also rod which they can't do? The ship is already too full. Yes so I you know I have a feeling one of his Ariz going to die in the next episode but I would really like them to just like I want them to be on the show but if they can't be on the show I want Astra to go off into the sunset. Yes and I want to point Allenby Rod to go off into the sunset and and Zari. One point can stay on the show Because let's let's be honest. We need someone we need anyone. TO TO BE INTER INTERACTING WITH NATE. And then. Just. Stop Popeye for visit sometime. Like a look how immediately clear eva was with with is a good plenty forgot she's Yeah the the pinning this episode on Zara. One point after only having seen her in to brief moment like one brief moment at the very beginning that video and the stat one scene was our to point out was very smart and you know. Talla ashes up for the performance. She does really great really great job in there's enough weight there then to all the to all the interactions because we've been missing her and also she missing all the other characters that it really makes sense with her and with the cheese limbo propels everything else and it gives such a powerful wait to these interactions that it balances all of the silliness so it just was really smartly put together. Yeah No. It's great and there's just so many like it's mostly Chewy is Scott all that good sort of Legends Self Win King Management. Like the idea of nate auditioning for Arrow posed as Oliver Queen for the fake Crossover Bakken. Hey World Just like I love your show. I love you very much Please get this finale in just really nail it For me if there's like a sticking point apart from what US already numerate. It's that Charlie doesn't get a lot of play. This episode and that lack of an emotional arc for her is kind of a problem given the premise of the whole thing So that's kind of a problem for me especially given how Charlie as a character who's been kind of like really squishy as an even more so the fact that she's been arguably supposed to be very central to this season's arc and has not been is a kind of a stumbling block for me that they still don't know what to do this character. Even though they're basing the entire season around Charlie and they kind of went. Yeah when this episode. It's a problem with the season overall. Young and it's a real big problem because I don't buy this. I don't buy that are Charlie. Comes up with this idea and this is her solution that she's okay with that If they had given her more agency texting in front of the shoemaker about this episode was airing if they had given Charlie more agency in chasing down the loom yes and making it more her idea and so therefore she felt the sense of guilt over getting her friend skill over like all that then I could absolutely by this more cowering like this is the best solution. I could come up with kind of response but they didn't do that. She had to be like you know twist her arm into it so like they they have. They've bungled her arc. This season Often because it's a rare thing for them to do but it really is disappointing The they weren't able to to manage that trajectory better. And really right to this point. Because then I'm sure she's GonNa have a redeeming thing in the finale and they're going to. They're always win. It's a matter of how many people have to die. So you know I. I think I think this could have been even better. Give us a few weeks but I really really liked it. It was very good. It's very it's hard to get caught up on those negatives but in that particular instance I feel like the episode brings into stark contrast of everything else in this is really good. Here's like this big glaring negative thing that you don't realize until you go. Oh wait none of this works Yeah it would have been better if they had like fixed that. Yeah well our last episode for the weekend. Tv is the good fight. Finale in this is. We've had several finale so far that attended espinel but for the most part. Most of them have worked. Yes this one. Not so much. The gang discovers killed Jeffrey. Epstein is the finale. Yes there's a bit of a cliffhanger with the fate of the firm that's not usually the kind of cliffhanger that the show ends on so it's GonNa be a it feels like a last turn. It doesn't feel like finale It'll be interesting to see what happens at the start of the next season. I assume it's already renewed. It is renewed for a fifth season. Yes okay so. Let's start with the Jeffrey. I've seen of it all and then let's go and then let's go to everything else. So what did you think of the case of the week and how they handled it? Did you like the eventual reveal at the end? So I was really concerned about them doing the Jeffrey Epstein thing after the premiere the Pillar Clinton dream thing because I didn't think that worked particularly well because the Harvey Weinstein of all just didn't come together in a way that I really made sense for me and I also just didn't like the general politics of it so that was like barriers. This works much better. I think I think the whole idea of wanting to- void falling into conspiracy trap and then immediately falling into one How easy that is dramatizing. How easy that is. I think is really really compelling really really interesting to demonstrate just you want things to make sense and you're going to latch onto something that helps you make sense and all a lot of this is real like bill bars. Dad Actually did write a book. That was this book. And it's just like your mind kind of leaks things out of your ear when you think about that And so all of that in Washington. Just slowly build into this own little conspiracy. That aren't covered the truth. A air quotes eight. Truth I think is just really really interesting and then to just wrap it all into large citizen Kane referenced at the halfway through them really drive at home Down to like seeing it out from like this idea of. I've really wanted to make him his own hearst castle. Which is what Xanadu and citizen Kane is supposed to be based on all of this stuff and it's all throughout from bud and just all of this stuff and then just ending with citizen Kane referencing than going. No no wait. This led the sleds. A red herring. We've got the real Rosebud in the parasite cavern and this is like. Oh you I So I really actually really joined the case of the week. I like how they present it. I liked the whole layer of it. It's just really good. And I think like pinning six eighteen into this to a certain degree to kind of like give a fanatic button to the season. Even if it doesn't work as finale I can still works as a thematic finale for them Even if it doesn't work as good plot finale Since they were really gearing up for that in episode aid which is why. All the Julia stuff in this episode is actually from episode eight. The head shot for a few days in that. That was all they were. GonNa get so all the Julius episode That they worked in so that they could have some sort of a cliffhanger to carry them through to season pride. I but I really really liked it. I like the weirdness I liked the show ending on a Dick joke Just all of this. I think this shows so can weird kate so I really liked it. I thought it was good. I thoroughly enjoyed it. How did you feel about it? I think I really liked the kiss the week. It was funny. It was ridiculous. And how do you avoid conspiracy theories figures like I've seen? Yeah exactly. That's the problem if it's if you end up completely separated divorced from conspiracy theories or things that sound like conspiracy theories in engaging with the facts because of what his life was so like. Yeah Yeah I think a just. They had the right balance with that in this episode. I thought and they did a good job having characters back away from and embrace that In equal measure at various various points and taking characters who are usually more reserved and letting them be the ones to to bring up those issues. I thought worked out so yeah it was fun. Ridiculous knows fund the larger stuff with the season. I did not know that they Julia stuff was from the next episode. That make sense But it was good that they put it in. I'm glad they were able to incorporate it here and Yeah We'll see what happens with that But the tensions with the firm makes sense the Talk about the some of the casting news for next year but The the stuff of the for made sense. There are some larger issues or questions. I have about the season that I don't know whether they would have been resolved with the final. Three episodes were or not Very confused but the Hugh Dancy Steph. Yes Other than join dancing and being you know appreciating him being on TV. And you know. I don't know that I by the character in. I don't know that I by his interactions with a lot of the cast. So in the military episode was fun. Military Court is always a hoot on these shows but yeah a soldier this episode and I look forward to what's GONNA come next. There are some casting talk radio and the first customer to talk about. Is Donna Lynne? Champlin as the cheerleader. Which I'm I'm Saturday. Burned THAT CASTING. 'cause now she can't be on a recurring role but also. I never would have thought that and it is Gloria's yet no. It's like I immediately went into small sporty and went best cameo right here. This is it. No one's going to do dispenser just because it comes out of nowhere and it's just like all right. I know she's don't a lot of Broadway work but I feel like she's here because the kings love crazy ex girlfriend that is my head cannon is that they love crazy ex girlfriend. Yeah she's very very good. And how memorable and I was like mid text to Alson. When I was like Kate. She's not awake yet. You're up stupid early. Stop you're GonNa talk to her later today at when we talk about Lucifer. Just wait five hours. Yeah so listeners. She used behind them the good fight so I unfortunately we can't we can't share Nelson reaction but Yeah it was delightful and very good and Yay look forward to Alston's thoughts when she gets there but the other thing we have to talk about is that Dylan does not meals show next year and I think about a instagram live stories. Saying cush jumbo may not be the next year either Ryan so breaking it. All Down Lindos departure announced back in February before the show even premiered because he is going to headline a ABC drama called homes kitchen that he was very very excited about very interested in So and his contract was also up at the end of the season anyway And he was very very excited about this show. Harlem's kitchen and they even like try to figure out of the production overlap could be avoided wasn't going to be so he opted to do this pilot. The door is going to be for him to come back with the pilot picked up on and who the hell knows given the everything that all our right now but his departure is not apparently based on any animosity about him being on the good fight because apparently he really really enjoys doing the show So it's got nothing to do with the show in any way shape or form. It's just this other project came along that he was going to be the lead of and he was very very excited about folk doing it so it has absolutely nothing to do with his unhappiness with the good fight or anything like those because he really likes being on the show. Apparently so that's really good on and the doors open for him to come back if you come back basically so that's really good as well. Because I don't like the idea of the show without him yet. He feels like unnecessary counterpoint. To Bransky. Yeah No. He's in the site dynamics of the. Yeah Joe he's very necessary. I feel like that character is very necessary Then the cush jumbo apparently announced on instagram live thing that she's not coming back But because live. I can't find it anywhere anymore and none of the trains are reporting about it either to end. I don't know that there's been any official confirmation about this and I'm very confused if like I assume. Everyone's contract was up for this after four seasons Just given the nature of streaming show the fact that maybe they just didn't expected to do more than that but also all of these people are like in-demand folks which is another reason to not tie them up for too long aside from Baranowski who I think just loves playing Diane Lockhart. And why wouldn't you because she's a fabulous character But I don't know so like I have been able to find anything. Jimbo's not been talking about it on her twitter feed the like she's been doing a lot of work to like talk about the hamlet that she's doing which I'm fury desperately want to see and all the stuff I don't have anything about the good fight so it's kind of weird situation of. She's apparently leaving but we don't know so I don't know I yeah it's bad optics. For the shows we unite have discussed that all the people of color seem to be leaving their show or quitting their show being off their show their leads even rose leslie except Rose Leslie and also just Bartha and like there. It's just a weird sort of situation for the show that's constantly retooling itself to a certain degree but it recharges itself in weird ways in terms of casting Just to let Audra McDonald goes. I just don't do it. You have to keep her. You have to keep your McDonald's and you have to keep Christine Bransky and you shouldn't have to keep the Orlando but I appreciate the fact that this project can along. You really wanted to do it. And his contract. Yeah so I'm more. Invested in Lake in Kosovo's performance than I am in most of the things in the show even those stranded in another show this season much to her detriment to the fact of like. She has a kid does she. Does she kid if we never see the kid? Does the exist pizza gain? Yeah maybe they can ever win at Twenty Million Dollar Candy Poker. And then she retired to to go to choose of family friends and sleep instead of work and fitness. Yeah so am very hesitant about. I mean I mean for the show it. Yeah I was not hesitant about Rose Leslie. Because the show didn't know what to do with character with Maya not hesitant about Losing Bartha though he was fun on the show because the main Lucas Lucas. The main character that in that little quarter things but Both if they're losing both of those performers right at the same time lets can be rough. Yeah they have a plot reason that they can do it because they need to cut twenty percent of your budget right and that little scene with the check marks and I thought that was actually really great little way to visualize that. Yeah no it was a really good way of visualizing it and then it's so weird that in a show and with these creators and this franchise where I and again should be like at the forefront and then like the whole thing of Larry Cat screwing them over by putting Diana to Pro Bono to lower billable hours and thus preventing them from being able to buy themselves out should be like the ultimate sort of like Gut Punch. But then it's like no guys Jeffrey Epstein stuff and it's just it shows like we're the kings priorities are now that I just like they're going full weird As opposed to like hitting the fan type stuff which is what that should feel like and yet it's not the main thrust. It feels really satisfying unlike a narrative level. But it's not what you remember about the episode until you start like ticking through it. Yeah yeah well. Any other thoughts on the season I mean it's hard to say because of how truncated the season ended up being in a way that other truncated seasons were not So hits I think it's arguably maybe there his season just because a being shorter but also kind of lacked focus. I think that memo six eighteen just wasn't quite able to give them but maybe it all would have also snapped into focus by the end. Probably maybe but like you said argued Nancy's character just. I don't know what it what it what dances character. Dozen the show as much as I enjoy his kind of Weirdo performance on it. It doesn't it doesn't Gel with a lot of the other stuff that's happening so I think that had they had their full season maybe things would have felt better but as it is of focus for me that I was really sort of interested in watching but at the same time the idea of the good fight doing sort of a conspiracy thriller season complete with a really bad car chase in episode six. Just I like this show so much in its very much on my wavelength that I can't be too upset but I definitely think this is probably the weakest season season one But it's also. Their weakest season in dislike reach ruled. Post trump kind of worldview season base- hurted really tapping into season two. So that's kind of how I feel about. It is like this is the weakest version of what this show is now. But it's also the weakest version of the show. Overall I think is not barring like what they were trying to do season one. How how did you feel about it? I like it more than you do. Okay or maybe maybe an accurate thing is that when I think of this season I will think of the firm politics I will think of some of these different storylines and I will think of Six eighteen won't think about. I won't think about microdosing. Think about the Maya and her stupid family stuff and I also think about my my Like breaking bad POPs for life. Yeah like there's a lot of things I won't think about And I will think of Sarah deal talking about plants. Will you think are Jeffrey? Epstein's Dick now. I is brought out of there. Yeah that's okay. That's okay I will think about them into that tiny like like torture hole and being like. Don't go in there because you don't know who's hiding in this island you're going to die. Have you ever seen a horror movie? You'RE GONNA die so kept waiting from Orissa to say. How do you not in person? It's on Hulu now. I loved her the costuming for her. 'cause that Dowse was definitely given to her to give it an Indiana Jones. Feel as grace So Yeah No. I like this season more than you did. But he definitely was hampered by being truncated with those last three episodes. They very easily could have done. What could have tied things together? Quite a bit and In a in a particularly compelling way so we'll see what happens next season but for now what your TV There is a cancer. There's a correct answer. And it's a two way tie between legend. Spur the good fight from the correct answer. Yes is indeed legends of tomorrow. I like to good effect in La but for me. It's you know it's not. It's no legends of tomorrow. The one where we are trapped on TV episodes head citizen Kane references. What more do you Walk Palmer? But we all want on that bittersweet note We'll we'll take a break listen to a trailer and Quebec to talk about Mrs America. Women are like teabags. You don't know their strength until they get into hot long her. We need to talk about the threat of the Women's Liberation Movement. So let me be clear. I am not against women working outside the home their choice. What I am against is a small elitist group putting down homemakers. They want to create a sex neutral society. Which will mean that women are going to find themselves with two full time jobs? So you need to tell your senators you want them to vote no on this equal rights amendment so we can have a country that we are proud to leave our daughters. His house was no idea what it's like to have to work to survive. They're scared damaged family life. How much time do we get people to up to change? Our women do not want to sacrifice their present villages for seven phony equality with men. I think we should focus. Could you take notes rose? You probably have the best penmanship. Oh of course. Why should women? Except this picture of a half-life they truly believed that men and women is saying it's not enough for them to have the right to work. We want equal pay for equal work. You tell me that's liberation. Which is Liberation Liberations in the home? You are not really a housewife. You our full time. Lobbyists run around this country with your cause have raised six. Children can keep me going God if he did want me to. We need to truly equality. We are here to move history more. That was the trailer for Mrs America. Which is on fx on. Hulu and just finished up. It's nine episode season. This is a I. Don't know what they're calling it but it is a one and done. It should not continue on here. Because this is a season telling the story of the fight for the era to be ratified and just specific politics around the women's Lib Movement and the fight for the IRA and against the era very much centered on Phyllis schlafly but on many prominent women of the time And starring Cate Blanchett. Phyllis Schlafly as well as a bunch of other really talented famous people. So what did you think of Mrs America and you know? How do you feel like it handled? It's one it's like. The rough format is like each of these women. Get a spotlight episode While we are falling all of them through this time and do you feel like that sort of short story. Approach was the official or ended up kind of shedding shuttling villa larger narratives. So I think that like first couple episodes. I wasn't like super on board with it. Felt like a little cold not cold but I felt a little distant from it and I couldn't quite figure out why But as I watched like five episodes in a row up at last week. That'll away like this is really very very very good apart from like the firm's levels because hey turns out on the Cape Land Rose Byrne Dabo Elizabeth Banks Sarah Paulson Tracey. Ullman. Jeanne tripplehorn Margo Martindale and also. I really want to emphasize Melanie Linski. All really good actress turns out who who would have thought that you hire all these people but not only from acting perspective because the show's ridiculously while acted That on a on a narrative level. I think this is a really great look at the perils and problems of building coalitions. And how you do that in the ways in which you do that and the compromise you have to do that given your perspective on how that works and who you want to include in who isn't included and I think that watching all of that plays out Across all these episodes and then watching those also play out in these like short story focused episodes which I think is a really good way of describing a particularly like on Houston Is just like Gut Punch of a beautiful little weird episode? That has also really kinda thorny but it's really good anyway I think generally at all really really works well and I don't really feel a like focusing on anyone detracts from anything because their perspectives inform. Such how everything else works that. It just makes sense for me to do it like that and I think it also allows these actors to get moments to shine like you put you you get a little bit banks to play Gene ruckle house and Joel Markel House and then she just kind fades out and then she gets an episode. You're just like Oh this is why you thanks for this So all of this. I think works really really well. I ended up really really liking this and counter to a number of like reviews that came out at the beginning of this. Don't think that this is the schlafly apologised show. I don't think the show wants you to root for her. I don't think the show wants you to feel compelled by her. I think that the show very much wants you to see her as a victim especially by and especially with the reference that they make the end of the show to another fellow not another from but to another to a film as opposed to. This is not a ten hour movie. really positions her as a victim. That was both wanting to do very to kind of the same thing. That all the time issues railing against kind of wanted to do the same position but did it in a way. That doesn't work because she ends up stole trapped within the confines of the very thing that she wanted to champion. So this apologist thing. I think you can view Herve borderline as an anti hero but she stolen an antagonistic force. That is also victim She just wanted to be one almost but not not her specifically because she wanted to be Secretary of Defense God. Damnit yes she wanted to be one of the good ones. Yeah and the notion that this is This is promoting her is ridiculous to me and even from the earliest episodes. It just feels like it's very clear to me early on how the show feels about her. And and I think it's it's aware of her capabilities. It's aware of how canny and smart she was and how she was able to achieve everything that she did and it did not what did not back away from that. It did not sugarcoat that to pretend that that wasn't the case just because what she stood for was doing her best to make sure that women were not allowed not promised equal rights in the constitution. Yeah so like that. Her goal is not what most people I feel. Confident saying that most people watching it would agree with doesn't change the fact that she was incredibly smart and incredibly underestimated. He'll the notion that underdog story but the underdog guys and they are coming from a place of They're coming from a place of feeling maligned. And and underappreciated and not seen in part not invited into the coalition five coalition And so it's a cautionary tale the same time. So yes. There's there's a lot that this is doing My besides all the excellent performances Little Social Network. She doesn't get nearly enough to do but is terrific. Of course in her few was also by the nature of the politics on the fringe of it because of what she wants to do which the other thing like. It's very purposeful but yeah no performances flow Kennedy's great. Yeah and then. Antifreeze is really good. It's mid Andrea. Vado IS OF COURSE. Always enjoy seeing her up. She got a little more to do here then she the good fight to season little bit more. There's there's a bunch of really terrific performances throughout but for me the takeaway is I'm I got my eye on W Waller who is the creator and who's credits as a writer. Previously our commander in chief only episode Desperate Housewives Eli Stone Madman and halt and catch fire and something called American Odyssey which apparently need to look because if you say oh yeah one of the writers from Madman Eli Stone desperate hospice and holding catch fire is doing a show about the IRA. I say I will watch the so. Yeah I am. She's also a playwright but I'm very excited for whatever whenever comes next because I think it's a really smart way to handle this complicated and interesting material. I feel like getting most of the attention. But can we also give some attention to Rose Byrne because as Gloria Steinem? I mean I feel like a lot of people are under familiar with Phyllis Schlafly and hopefully that will change that. Thanks to this. But it Steinem is is the opposite issue where she is such a viewed figure that and we're very familiar with Rose Byrne but you put her in that hair glasses and I just. I felt like I was watching the fella watching Steinem and the The the again if what feels like for someone who's not an expert on this topic or this this period of history feels like I'm very clear eyed view of her and her strengths and weaknesses and of just the handling of the women's Lib Movement by a group of well-intentioned mostly straight white women. At the is is something for the well-intentioned straight white women in the audience. Like myself to really take in and really consider and I thought I thought it was important. Equalizing force if you only had some like Wechat Schlafly aunt with Sarah Paulson as her right hand. Woman and Melanie Linski as Rosemary. And you didn't have that. Same kind of charisma strength on the other side. It wouldn't work but it. It does because of these wonderful performances does in like the various ways in which they counterpoint. Like this idea of like coalition building in feeling excluded from coalitions is just ends up being really central and so how that all plays out across this and how that gets complicated within both groups whether it's like in. Phyllis Fred Brinda and mark which I think is a really solid episode that demonstrates very sort of issues of what we expect from one another let alone our partners and when our politics get in the way of her personal lives in a weird way How that interplay with everyone and then how that can shut us down I think it's really and I feel like I'm running in circles because like it's just really good. It's really good island the segments of the production elements. 'cause you're I thought that the obviously the costuming inherits very very draws your attention but I thought that I actually was really compelled and drafted at the score. I love the use of the Beethoven for the theme song. I was rocking out. Every time they came up. The title sequence is GonNa be on my list some of the best titles from this year in just the attention and the care to constructing in make Making feel of the period but not in the period where it's really well. Yeah and I get what you're saying about like that. Because they avoid a kind of desire to make everything look a little grungy And part of that's avoided by like not doing a lot of like location shooting in terms of like being outside It'd be very difficult So there's a lot of set work but like the house feels very much exactly what that how should look like given their status and everything So I think all of that works really well One of the things about the I think is worth mentioning and I can't take credit for this Emily Vanda wrote about this over a little bit and how they use our expectations of camera movement to drive home. Certain like thematic things so like a lot of the stuff with Schlafly group is staged really sort of like with single camera. Setups in terms of the camera does not move a lot. There's cuts as opposed to camera movement whereas with Steinem and the are a group. There's a lot of like fluid camera movement. There's fewer cuts because the cameras very mobile in those sequences and all of this like conveys this idea of momentum versus stagnancy. And that's something I didn't notice but then after I read Emily's piece like I was watching for it and I was just like Oh shit. They didn't put a lot of work into this in terms of like figuring out how to like even provided really subtle visual language to both of these groups that then when you get to something like Houston blows up in terms of how that gets deployed and to what ends. Yeah let's talk about Houston of it because I think I'm the person who likes the show who didn't really care for Houston. Rails loves it and I think some of it. I guess pulses pulses performances. Really good but that character did not work for me as well. Some of the others because this wasn't amalgam character who they kind of used to be everyone else and It's like they couldn't find someone who had broken from the. Stop your a movement by the end to be that person so they made up of to to raise these questions like. Oh but aren't you lying? Don't care about that And it feels kind of convenient and it's like well. We need to show her getting disillusioned. So let's do that in this way and I decide had trouble buying into it. It didn't feel as grounded as some of the others if it felt if the most like you are watching a show TV show of the various journeys you went on with the characters and I think your point about that is exactly right like because she's inauguration and because Alice's inauguration and because of what they want to like really propel forward so to very accent SOC Schlafly. His antagonistic vibe is really driven home by the end. I feel like is also really what they WANNA do like kind curb that no no. This is not an endorsement is why that's there but I do agree that this episode more than the other ones feels like you're watching a show but everybody else seems to have liked it and I know that you liked it too so but like end. It's okay though because I think like your criticisms that so really valid and I think that that episode is both really delightful and interesting but it is hamstrung by a number of that you've just completely laid out Which is why. It's such a thorny weird little episode in this show But I also feel like those those little issues probably make it a little better than these other episodes because those other episodes have that kind of Polish sense to them in this one feels a little more rag doll and I don't necessarily agree show Wyoming or ending up with a rag doll of an episode like this Because Alice herself is both a rag doll character because she stitched together from a number of people but she's also ends up being sort of the rag doll of like the movement On her side of things so that it works. But it's yeah I think it works but I really very much interesting where you're coming from with. I don't think it's like the the perfect episode for this show because there are a number very perfect kind of episodes for this show. But it's definitely I think the most interesting of the episodes just on a like this is a very different approach to how we're going to tell the story. I think that's part of the reason. Why a lot of people onto well? I do think that while it feels more like. I'm telling the story than a lot of the other scenes in approaches there are definitely people who went to the women's conference and took a pill that they thought they knew what it was and it wasn't and went on a trip and had electees experience to. That's definitely a thing that was happening at this time as well so while it's not like it happens at conferences and conventions to this day. Yeah yeah so like yeah that that is a valid story worth telling in this like more presumed sort of approach to how they're going to tell the story so I'm one of the things that I thought was really interesting watching. I guess my final thought as we as we wrap up here is the It was really compelling to see some of these different moments with treated with just enough hindsight so a moment. Like in the finale all of the the group the Committee version the commission. Thank you Resigning in solidarity with with Bala and in the. It's it's treated very much as hell. Esl moments but then as the viewer you know okay and also not because of this necessarily. But it didn't help with turn out you carters GONNA lose. Reelection Reagan's GonNa come in and things are going to get worse and I thought that there was good awareness of the difficulties around these different choices in while moments earlier in the season. Hit that a little too. I mentioned when we talk about the premier all these discussions of Elvis just a right right-wing radical from Illinois and. I'm just sitting here like Jimmy. Who's running congressional seat? And Yeah anyways I try to be that specific on politics most of the time but yeah anyway that felt like a bit of a more of a siren as opposed to a more balanced approach. I felt that as the show went on. They did a good job of of making putting you in the shoes. These characters so that you can understand what they're coming from why they're making the decisions they're making feel like the right decisions for that character while also giving that space so that you can appreciate the ways that this is either the right choice a difficult but correct choice or the wrong choice but understandable one. Yeah no absolutely I fully about. Did you have any other thoughts on on the season or you know moments are performances wanted to shout? We've mentioned any of the guys. Oh no but like Marsden's really really good sliders. Rain slattery's grade But cower those guys worth mentioning Adam Brody as Fagin Casto who basically just has our an episode more or less Is really good in that episode. I will say that like I was completely stunned and was not expecting bobby. Kinda VOLLEY TO SHOW UP. And then he shows up as the talk show host in that episode Why but also why not So watching him just do that was just really really fun I don't don't think I have really anything else on a performance level. This was very very good and I encourage you to check this out. Well because married to Oh is he? I didn't know that explains it. Also because he's very good but yeah but yeah. I didn't know that so yeah but I I would definitely recommend this to anyone who is up for. We'll looking for any of a number of things shows with really fun like period piece tropes and the as far as like stakes in like Kind of a slice of history shows excellent performers performance driven shows Or just Awards BAIT YOU WANNA be up in the words bay. It's it's a really. It's a really good show. I thought it it's Handled a nuanced topic pretty well and hopefully it'll be a cautionary tale against dismissing figures like schlafly in underestimating voices If not be resume you have in the bag. Supporting your coalition because your policies are theoretically better for them to not take those groups for granted. anyways it. You're right. It will be anyways on that jury note if you show notes seek posted this episode over the telephone dot. Org leaves comment unless no ease out of the weeks. Tv You can like our page on facebook and start up a conversation there. You can email US tillerson. Jimoh DOT COM. You can Find us in Apple. Podcast with an h Chaptered feed an MP three unsheltered feed. We appreciate ratings and reviews there and you can also find us over in stitcher and we'd also appreciate readings interviews there and of course. We're both on twitter. I am at the television knoll. You'RE AT NOEL OR K. Thanks for great discussion. Kate thank you and thank you for listening back next week with Tele verse.

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