Full Court Press NBA Podcast - Episode 139 -The NBA landscape after July free agency and trades

Automatic TRANSCRIPT

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Lady comes doesn't make sense but you're the parents and they're the kids you're going to start telling them that now too good news is it's easy to bundle home and auto through progressive and save on your car insurance and there's your opening to remind them who pays the bills around here Progressive Casualty Insurance Company affiliates and other insurers discount not available in all states or situations full court press podcast has been a bit of a break Greg and I were supposed to start off season series this week my fault. We did not say that extra day. I chose to stay at Summer League Dane. There are two guys I did. I really really wanted to get to see donate now because it's all a mush in my head right now but I I we were joking before we started up about how everybody who does podcast that goes to some really I think I hear we're talking about. How Awful Summer League is? I don't know I I enjoyed it but there is a kind of physical toll I'll agree with our peers kind of on that point. <hes> you know what most days ten games a day not ten sequential but five in each you know in gem and those go back and forth but I was having so much fun to save an extra day but have you recovered physically from and I think it's important to like understand what the physical toll is. It's like the food at the stadium is absolute trash so you're not putting anything good in your body even if you're being responsible at night and then like you said it's like ten games. You're you know you're in a different time zone. I mean for me I I. I know that's a kind of like for me. Is You know you go to the Games and then you know most nights go to dinner afterwards and that's that's ten o'clock and even if you avoid the people you know trying to get you to go play blackjack with them after dinner. You know you're still you're still going to bed at twelve. One o'clock which on my body clock is as I live in the central time zone. You know that's like two three A._M.. And then I don't know it. Just there's a cumulative effect to all of it. That is like different that has nothing to do. I'd like drinking and staying up all night. It's it's the I think it's all of it and for me. It's I always take a I was take a full day off like three or four days in and just stay at my hotel for the whole day and like bright or something or watch the movie sit by the pool like I if you're staying as long as you normally do like it requires a serious like pace yeah. I tried to do one of those state hotel days last year and all took the ruin that was turned. The game on the broadcast was so god awful. It's so sometimes I think that those who were attending aren't adding to the equation that we don't have to watch the horrible broadcasts so instead that others don't get to go and also did you find the one food vendor that the switched out this year and had quote healthy food options all right yeah back equally terrible like my day was the wrong color reminded me of elementary school kind of stuff and we're not tied. This is funny initially right now. I think we're about to do like a several recap. I know we have nothing exactly but all healthy not fried. That's all it meant. The officers were terrible. They should do like a reality T._v.. Show I'm not into reality T._v.. At all so I don't know if I know my knowledge is like fifteen years dated or not just surviving Thomas and mack for eight days on their food. I mean like a doctor like check. You is Warren after and see how far downhill it's go and then to your comment as long as responsible at night what says responsible at night like Vegas Day exactly it's kind of kind of weird through slow way okay but we are going to talk about this post free to see in a lot of trades as well mixed in landscape Greg did a quick <hes> episode. I think the day the moratorium was lifted that we just hit on kind of really big things. This is before Qui- was even decided to where he was going so we're just gonNA take a huddle view of the landscape of the League. We're not gonNA like do raids of a returns action et Cetera et Cetera. Well we WANNA do is just talk about. Who's the best team now? or how many contenders are there some of those kinds of things so we'll dive in on that so first question for you Dane in each conference in either conference. Is there a clear single best team in your opinion okay now. You're catch me off guard is there. Is there a clear. He's doing the skipped. How many contenders okay no I can answer that? That's not exactly like a college math. Yeah I think so I think you have to say the clippers works and I wouldn't have actually said that a week ago until I had the time to like sit back after summer league and go through what the clippers roster actually looks like top to bottom and I mean in that that's what it's about to me is being able to the clippers you can go down like ten or eleven guys deep where you feel comfortable with not only playing them in a regular season rotation but you could see them being helpful or at least not hurtful pieces in a postseason rotation so I think you I think you have to. I think you have to put them at that place in the in the Eastern Conference. No I think we we're going to need to learn what this Philadelphia team is to to be able to like. LET THEM USURP MILWAUKEE. Are you talking about this. Are you thinking about this rather from a regular season winning the conference in that like most wind standpoint. Are you thinking about it from a going to the finals wchs standpoint yeah. I'm thinking of it right now. Towards the beginning season as there are clear best team in each conference in Syria answering the executive. I thought because even I was reminding myself as one of the things we're talking about are are there teams that right now aren't contenders but with the right movement season could shift them into the group right to that in a moment but at the same reaction you did so the Clippers Samir the best team in the West did a similar analysis to you as I try to eight nine ten deep and kind of see where teams maybe have caused by equal talent in the top two spot there so on their team. What is their depth look like in those sorts of things? The clippers would be the only thing that may be scratching my head. A little bit was how they're going to staff the four <hes> position the cross the season <hes> just because they're so talented and everything at every other position makes so much sense what they're doing but they bought into Michael Green and then always can shift up but probably are not gonna WanNa do a Lotta than regular season just because of the being in the kind of load matters he's wanted. Heartless is been a really up and down played last few seasons. He's been good at times just unplayable times but when you look at you know how they bring Lou Williams things in Herald off the bench and Shaimaa was so good for them last year and the broaden mcgruder you know it's just have more they have as much talent as anyone in my opinion right there with the Lakers with Lebron in a D and where the Golden Golden State typically we is when when they're healthy but just the debt jumps out at you every position not just a matter sometimes you can get to eight nine ten players but four of us players play the same position. The Clippers did well to go Elise D._V._D.'s position mission and again for me staffing the position just just where does the consistency come from <hes> anything like well they they. They only have thirteen guys on the roster right now so I don't know if there's still maybe thinking about adding there <hes> i. I didn't see an obvious I didn't do a deep analysis to this current cap skied but <hes> you know we won't talk about how the teams can add even if they don't have any cap space center but they couldn't be looking to add but also I think they're counting on themselves sells being a really strong buyout team for players around February March time frame. I guess yeah and I think that they take a wait and see approach and see what does does the bigger neat emerge somewhere else on the roster Australia. Maybe there's an injury or what have you but that's the only thing I see kind of going into the post. I think they're totally five for the postseason is can they cover the four and five in the in a way not only is fully playable rotation players that don't get played off the floor and a postseason postseason contexts and also just the fit the fit and their front court the foreign five all around is a little bit weird because because the four in the East I came up with the same answer. There's not one single team. That's better than the other teams I go quickly. Weekly I put Philadelphia Milwaukee kind of ahead of everybody else and the Philadelphia Team is really interesting in that they they look like just sheer death from a defense at like you don't WanNa play that this team defensively offensively and then just how much of Horford secures the defensive anchor spot should embiid mistime with you know the the the higher than normal likelihood for injury it just just how how big is this body's not built for one hundred games. It's just not in the way Horford's is he's a little undersized that tends to work out for workload so long as he stays healthy but <hes> I'm so sounds like we had the the similar answers there so next question is how many legitimate contenders there are. I guess we should take a minute and define. What's a legitimate contender? Is it a team that has a path to the conference finals and this this kind of mathematically Kinda has a shot. If things break right or is a team that's just good enough to win for playoff series and so I just what I looked at was. Can I see path for this team as constructed to get to be competitive in the finals was way. I answered it I don't I don't know if you've thought about it a different way before jumping Tori answers so so I think it's super important to define this and particularly the season when we no longer have into the season with the team that has a fifty plus percent chance of winning it. It's you know that threshold has to change and not I mean this is more just mathematical. I mean I think think about it from a statistical standpoint like what what threshold what preseason odds do you need to give a team to say that they are a contender to win the championship so that's a that's an interesting number and I just kind of thinking in my head before as what you know what what do you put that number at like twenty percent something like that and I went back and I looked at the the past champions from the past ten years and you can you can from Vegas Historical Vegas preseason odds you can look at what the raptors odds were winning the championship last year and it was plus eighteen fifty which is a five percent chance of winning the championship and that's kind of like like low end over the past ten years. It's it's actually them. Dallas and Golden State's first championship or all right about in that that five percent threshold house like Oh man what does that mean. I need to open this up all the way to five percent because then because then if you do that or and if you look at this season sides we get down to like Boston and I was like that to me when you start throwing in Boston and Denver as a contender that just feels kind of irresponsible just to to use your words like can I see a path to Boston winning the championship or Denver. No I don't I can't I can't say that so I think you have to kind of boost. The threshold up to like ten percent is is the way is the way I put it in. If we look at if we look at this season's odds from from Vegas that has five teams of over ten percent chance as the clippers twenty to the Lakers seventeen the bucks also seventeen the rockets eleven and the seventy sixers ten. I would say those five for me for sure contenders. Did you expand your list further beyond that I did but it was. The is where I struggled for sure was with Denver Boston. That's where I struggled but I'll start with. I don't have Houston on the list right now so I just think the routes were constructed. They may prove me wrong. Hardens a great player and rest can be dominant even slot is as game is right now. He could still be very dominant starters in every. Every like every period of this outline which she did they try too hard. Did they not try hard enough like Houston came up in every single as you look at the League from a larger perspective as we're trying to do they are this `nigma where you're you're trying to figure them out from from every single so I think it's it's interesting you put them there for me. I do I do have them in in this contender ben but I hear kind of where it come from continue so I ended up putting Denver in Boston on the list but my concern with Denver's as they don't have a lot of experience they did better last year than I expected. In their first playoff run. <hes> people may recall the kind of our narrative are kind of you that are take on it was they look very unsure about themselves against the Spurs their first playoff series as a group so but they kind of figured out game three is that they were the better team so let's win the series even though they got down to one and then you know against Portland and it was like Portland had all this playoff experience especially built into their leaders have had been in real environments those sorts of things it kinda ended up making a difference. Even though we've talked about that on paper Denver was much better constructed to really win that series you know but it just really came down to experience an execution so before I go through seven teams from five to seven after my fourteenth I'm back through the exercise of who are really being my list but I put you on my list. Does I think I didn't hear them Vegas lists they I think I think this is a me thing because you know right away after they made the Conley Trade I mean in your list of M._B._A.. Columnists you know they they wrote about the the trade and I mean the narrative in every single one of those was Utah's themselves a western conference favorite and or at least a contender you know and obviously the comedy trade happens before the collide trade and I think that moves the needle in a direction but for me my answer is no and that's because I think if you're looking at the teams that have the best chance at winning the championship. I think a handful of them are the majority of them are still in the west and that's both the L._A.. Teams I'M GONNA put Houston in there and I think I think the warriors I you have have to you have to leave them in there if they can hang around and if Blake and come back and be one hundred percent by the playoffs I think they're in that conversation and then if you want US oh Denver in there which I I it's just there's there's a lot of teams there and I struggled to see this N._B._A.. Finals ceiling for for Utah which is which is a little different than Toronto last year you could paint an N._B._A.. Finals ceiling for them because you can go. It wasn't ridiculous to say we'll Toronto could have the best player in the playoffs now. That wasn't that wasn't out of the question. Then that ended up happening they did have the best player in the playoffs and the won the championship like that's never going to be the case for UTAH. Their case is more Dallas the year that they beat the heat twenty twenty eleven and I I wonder it's just kind of my belief that in this N._B._A.. That type of team I don't know I think what this doubling up on stars we have it's that such a glass ceiling for a team. That's constructed like Utah to go through. Are they going to be fun. Am I going to enjoy watching them or are they gonNA play aesthetically pleasing basketball school one hundred percent but can I put them into contenders been with even like a team with the walkie who I think is sort of towards the bottom of that. No I for me for me. I can't because I think the odds are noticeably less than ten percent that Utah Utah wins the championship yeah in one of the reasons I I talked myself into it was they've struggled with the whole Goo bear favors kind of fit for awhile in that the narrative that played itself out more on offense on defense but I still contend that really gets exposed in the postseason the pick and roll coverage at times total and I just love edition of Davis. He brings something different at the position defensively that Rudy can't handle that the favorites never could and this is where I get my congressman Glenn. Are you really going to put them on or off the list because Ed Davis Trust me I tell myself about numerous times but but you know I struggled struggle with them as well but I just believe in their culture I believe in my calling leaving Quin Snyder and I just liked that Quin Snyder has more options now at the foreign the five even Jeff Green can be very impactful player when he's in the situation is this really asked to do kind of small ball five things for small stretches and they just had really none of that to date but I will say is that if you look at the last number of years teams to elevate themselves are teams is that started from a place of being good and then at the wing which which is one of the reasons I almost talk myself out of being unless they added at the point guard is basically so for example when clive went to their onto the deeper the wing they stayed eight almost the same as the one that you have a team that says that the one five they added kind of material pieces one and five then they went from being good to being serious team even Katie when he went to golden state put them on a whole `nother level because he plays on the wing so that's one of the reasons why I'm not really sure what to make Utah but I tend to take more of a mindset of well. I'm not going to put a limit on them until I kind of see a reason for there to be limited and to that point I don't even have we'll medicine like Keller in to to what I just said but I don't really have the warriors on this list right. Now I think they're roster. Construction is so awful and they are so lacking in in real talent beyond the very very top of that Rosser and I also think the absence is a claes increased so much workload for staff. That's not really going to talk about I guess unless they're just okay with winning forty six or seven forty seven games and the regular season and just you know using all of the deep playoff experience that they have to to make a run unassuming yet the presume clay would be healthy at that point and that they've probably done something you know material in the buyout market as well. It's all a fourteenth from the West Clippers Jazz Nuggets Lakers blazers fans. We met at me but we'll talk about nine please. You're not finals contenders. That's not you're not dropping that. Take their true yeah. I'm just let me just because the field is wide open and what we often do. This phantom is different than analysis. If Blazers Fan you do see the path for the first time in a long time to hey. Maybe there is a path because there's not a super dominant team in the in the West. There's aw say I was I expected to be a little down on the Lakers before I did my analysis once I looked at the roster like this is a much Rosser was last year now. Throwing Anthony Davis on roster's going to do that but even like the other positions they didn't drop lance and rockaway engine. You know you know all those guys that went on your contracts last year so they I was more impressed with what the Lakers did <hes> but but no but if I'm in fandom and it's like okay well the clippers are not a team. That's been a perennial better than by team for three plus years. They neither leakers so that's why I say I tried to acknowledge that <music>. I'm not being critical of fandom. Blazers fans are like critical phantom either. I just think Portland has like the seventh best odds of winning the West right so yeah so how can how can you have the seventh best odds of winning the West N._B._A.. Finals contender. I just that doesn't that doesn't Jive in my head. We see where I had the I have six I mean I don't know six. Still I am kind of tied I I I think the spurs are kind of right there if if they get some guys healthy and that's about where I have the warriors right now but let's anyway to answer the question. I don't feel great about the answer. It's a hard question but hopefully that makes good content but I have clippers jazz. Nuggets Lakers will way better about the to L._A.. Teams than those other two teams but a stronger path return Denver then I do for others that some might put in a group of that on on the eastern conference side Milwaukee in Philadelphia and Boston. They're just because I think that sort of there's an addition by subtraction with Kyrie moving on freeing up the other guys to Kinda be more of their natural cells. I'm worried about them. Without losing. Both Horford and Baynes makes we curious like well. How was the center brisk demand? They have cancer and tease and then young guys that you know that Hey Robert Williams looked great in Vegas but I'm not sitting here. Say That second third round of the playoffs. That's that's the guy you're going to be able to turn to you but just in terms of me looking at Brad Stevens with this group. I don't there's a lot of explicit reason why can't say there's I mean there is a path for them. Getting back post both Milwaukee in Philly I mean they're just close enough and if they can get back to the kind of pre curry culture etcetera etcetera then. I just think that there's about so that's seven is not perfect. I certainly would take four teams and kind of put them like half a tier above. That's the two <music> L._A.. Teams Welcome Philadelphia and then kind of like Tier Below Utah Denver in Boston there for me but it's an imperfect answer. I'd also great about but that's how I saw it. So it sounds like you have a smaller yet. It's well. I guess it's only one smaller because I'm at we we agree the four for sure's together. Both of us are two in the west both the L._A.. Teams the two in the East Milwaukee in Philadelphia and then and then that's where it becomes a question remark and I have Houston and Golden State as my other two contenders in in the west and I struggled to add other teams beyond that because at some point this critical mass of you can only have so many contenders in on conference. I I kind of believe if we're drawing if you're drawing a ten percent threshold and so it's it's not zero percent chance it's not a one percent chance that Utah or Denver make it. It's higher than that or win it but it's to me it's noticeably Laurentien side so I have him out of there so so one question so you're feeling good about Houston toy more about that. I okay it's it's the it's the belief that they can over the course member the term that Brett Brown used when I think it was on the low post us like we too we need to lay on the plane before the before the season before the season comes to a close and I think what we learned is they never really did that. That was a product of training for Jimmy partway through the season getting Harris at the deadline and an injuries they just weren't and and it's hard to land the plane when won't sit down buckles pickles F._A.. Frowned on that I I don't know I think I think Houston has all eighty two games to land the plane and there's so so obvious we don't even need to go into there's such fair knocks on Russ and and reason to to question you know how much he can drive winning given what we've seen him be able to you know not the ways we've seen him to be inefficient. My my assumption is you're going to see a lot more efficient Russ. I don't think they'll allow him or they will convince him to be a more efficient player and that's part of that's part of landing the plane and then when he just put had had the five guys out there of you have Gordon at Gordon in that mix Tucker and Capella. I think if you have five pretty good players move I've learned from the Houston team. The past couple of years is the specific importance of positions. This is something they seem uniquely qualified to handle. Are there a bunch of question marks with that team. Find the whole staff. Everything Kinda seems chaotic. Maybe paid too much Russell Westbrook Yada Yada Yada but we that Houston team two years sixty five win Houston team what was so good and how different. How different is this like why why can't Houston be back towards that level of that team and if you're close to that level then you're definitely contender particularly in this league? Now Golden State isn't Golden State anymore yeah for me I. I can't even visualize how Russ in hardened played at this point in their career. When things are for Russia's instinct it's played a thousand miles an hour and is instinct when things are going wrong play ten thousand miles an hour where harden wants to dribble well fifty-six shacklock possession so I just I just can't see that meshing but Antoni is is really good at take but in the interest of kind of not putting a limit on them if someone's going to figure that out you know Dantonio is one of the few coaches are probably going to kind of figure that out and then in an okay see especially in the Post Katie era did seem like they struggled to kind of get rest to embrace things? Is that your analytics retelling you or things that I don't want to say just in it's more than that but just possessions etcetera and entrusting the people around you and it could be just the fact that the background that rose has with harden from their time together no K._C.. And having a lot of accessible for this team was really expected to have it does it does that still kind of something that will allow us to buy in to use your language to a role that he needs to buy in to four of this work but but just kind of my instinct is like is going to want to play a thousand miles an hour that it's not always hard looking to do and even though you can talk about where Russes in his grave versus Chris Paul is career crispy a little bit older being uh-huh more skilled in a way in terms of moving the basketball and playing Haiku basketball. I never talk about what's being low. I Q because he's not he's just really trust his instincts and and in his reinforced because when he's been dominated when he just kind of let's go and let's US instincts take over that been in the past on what he's still is but that type of dominant player because he's so fast and has so much force worse attacking the rim but I I just need to see yeah but before I can can really feel like they're so <hes> yeah. It's just it's the high end potential at the end of the day when you're talking about when you're talking recommended team being a contender and winning the championship you're looking at their best set of outcomes and in with Houston their best set of outcomes is is that Russell makes adjustments and there are a team that is more talented than the majority the majority of the League James Harden Reasserts himself as the best if not one of the best players for for this next given season and I think that's possible and the compare pair contrast. I'll make is not them to to the clippers or the Lakers because they have they have even better one two punch their I I'm looking at that compared to Nikolay Yokich and Jamal Murray or Mike Conley Lee and Rudy Gobert and that which is which is what are our disagreement is here and I go. I'm looking at the top talent to that group and in a playoff series believing more in the top talent if if they can make the coaching element of at work. Have I seen it no do I have more belief that Quin Snyder is going to get complete buy in from all the Utah Jazz Yeah does that have high N._B._A.. Finals potential not a lot is is what I would say for them and for one last quick question we'll take a break <hes> sooner than an outline call horror but just so you're not surprised there but did the Lakers coaching situation yeah factor into how you saw ah them I mean it's like I really liked the roster that are remembered who there you how they're coaching. Staff is constructed. I was like Oh boy that doesn't make me feel great well okay but but this question was is. Are they contenders. It wasn't correct are are we ranking the best our ranking teams in the league their contender the question the question comes our day the most likely team to win. No they're not because of that because you have more belief in doc rivers the Philadelphia or Not Philadelphia the clippers culture and the depth of that team. That's what makes the clippers the more likely team to win the championship but the Lakers are in the conversation and that's that's all this question is asking and to me. They're just as much as I got to see it type of team too and the the tricky thing we know about Lebron teams is we don't see it that much during the regular season so there's going to be this lingering doubt all year because Lebron he just will like he'll he'll he'll have some splashy games and he'll probably show up when they play he'll probably show for that first game at Oracle and the preseason and be like yeah. We're putting put my stamp on this game. I'M GONNA put my stamp on twelve other games. During the regular season. We're GonNa know what the Lakers are and how the coaching staff is with their players in their bench. I don't know I really don't think we'll know that until next April it's GonNa they're going to be they're going to be ambiguous for. They're going to be ambiguous all year. Yeah it is interesting just looking at this eighteen see the history of the clippers and how now from a Front Office to coaching roster. I mean they are really really good shape and obviously there's been plenty of drama about the Lakers for an office situation. Strategic was the process that they've used to get where they are kind of the same with with with coaching situation but when you have the Ron you always have a chance until he's shows he's not Lebron. He's that that Lebron okay. We'll take our first ad break and come back and we're talking about. Maybe kind of the next tier of teams are are there any teams that with one transaction or two in the middle of the season whether the deadline or during the buyout market that could move up into this group yes or no we'll get back from our break in dive in there so we're back one thing I was going to mention before we dive in. It's funny I was you and I I put together like a really high level at this by the way listeners and then day was like then I need that because I you know I have a full day tomorrow so I was like okay through something real quick. It's like sitting at home last night and I was looking at twitter. During the commercial the my wife and I are watching told Sarah look at this. I showed her a few tweets and I was like you know what this is what I said this is Dane preparing for our podcast. See The threshold question is interesting to me. I it really is it's like we need to. We need to change the way we think about what contenders are and I'm wrestling with myself. You have much more open than I do. It's it's that was me like wrestling with the okay. Come on you. GotTa open it up to more than five five teams but we didn't even really get into this. It's like Boston No. I don't think Boston's GonNa win the championship like at some point it's like percentages be damned Kemba Walker and his kanter and like the corpse of Gordon Hayward are not going to win the championship so it's like I kept I kept trying to extend it and then shrink it down so that was that was me going through that in public on twitter yeah I was find with a much of the Boston situation but yeah that the foreign the five for them as visualizing that being like a team that can go deeper date for some reason. I felt like they for some reason for long. Maybe a week for now. I'll look back and go what was I thinking but so the next question is are there a group of teams that with a transaction two at the most not like overhauling their whole roster of the way the like Philadelphian the clippers did with a single trade last year sort of think about last year the raptors when they added Marcus all thought that really improved their chances because they were much better equipped to face embiid in the series and those those sorts of moves for shot here because my my lists filled Phil probably a little longer than yours but <hes> so what were your thoughts on teams that aren't in that first group but with a move or two you know realistic one or two not going and trading for some crazy you know player. That's incredibly unlikely to be true for WHO's on that list for you date. It's short. I couldn't even add some of the teams you have on there like Denver and Utah I struggled to find pass for that to like making it were couldn't necessarily see them going and getting like a real needle mover piece and I think this deadline just in general or is going to be. It's going to be underwhelming because there's so few few players that we know we know next agency class stinks so that means typically the players who are traded the deadline right like they're expiring contracts. Those those are the most frequent so it's like. It's like hard to grab people and be like like oh well this guy so-and-so's GonNa be ready to move on from at the deadline. There's just not a lot of them and so I struggle to find like a piece or something for for Denver Utah. Maybe that's me just being out in them. I've a weird team. I have one team and it's weird that I put onto the list and it's Miami and I just know their picks are tied up in a weird way. That's GonNa make it hard for them to make trades but they've seven guys on ten million or more dollar salaries that not all of them totally stink where you could you could convince yourself. It's like Kelly clinic way makes fourteen and he's like a nine million dollar player so like put them in the trade. It's not like this huge negative asset. Ah Is there. Is there a world I guess my question to you that they do end up doing getting beal and wall from Washington and then Flip Wall for Chris Paul. Is that even possible I don't l.. Maybe maybe that's too large of a leap but if you have if you have Jimmy Butler Bradley Beal and Chris Paul and those guys all have as if you have like what Butler did last year bill do what he did last year and you have Chris Paul do it. He did two years ago and there's a synergy there like day jump up into the Eastern Conference conversation for me which I limit at Milwaukee in Philadelphia. I don't know their this team. That's like way down. They feel like they're finalized. Now is like two percent so the way beyond the threshold. Could they jump into at least like the the Denver Utah Boston pool like yeah I could. I could see that I am I am. I totally off on Miami there. No I don't think so. I think that when you have Pat Riley there that he he tends to be able to kind of make things happen. The other personality can't make happen. I think we have to ask ourselves. How good is Miami? I'm down Hassan. Whiteside is anyone so against. I acknowledge the process of addition by subtraction like I just think kyri being out of Boston's GonNa create such levity there. That's going to be some lift from that. Talk about how optimistic that makes us about the team but in that when Greg and I talked about John whiteside going to Portland we were like I was like that blew my mind you know because just what the Portland culture is in his son. Whiteside just doesn't communicate is not really invested in the Games he's end but then Greg was like well. You know what how's everybody feeling about. Merkich you know how pouty he wasn't Denver and how out of shape he wasn't Denver went to Portland and Terry's thoughts kind of got figured out a way now I know I think Hassan whiteside totally different enigma the problem with all four but gray was like at least gives the chance those sorts of things but okay say to that though Vanterpool was there and just because I've gotten to know him a little bit now that he's in Minnesota and just talking to some people who know him. He was like such a personality whisperer there as I understand it from dame to C._J.. To nurk to like a lot of those guys and so I I mean that's saying the Stotts isn't a good coach and can't do that or the rest of their staff but I think a big reason. They got a lot out of their their personalities. They're made the Mesh better with I think Vanterpool was very he was like their defensive coordinator. Guy Was a huge part of that now he's in Minnesota and we've talked a a little about it but I really do believe in the impact of especially the assistance moving on a camera the coach's name right now. Let's look it up but two years ago there was a port assistant from Denver to New Orleans Denver to New Orleans and it was interesting. Maybe Steve Finch Chris Finch. He's Gershon this guy he ended the wolves had job yeah also we've talked a year ago. When Utah Kinda got off to a slow start that Donna Mitchell got to a slow START THAT EAGER COSCO from Utah to the Phoenix and I don't go through every single real with I do and whether it's a to assist transition or like I think philly Miss Lloyd Pierce last year you know I think he's one of the better defensive coaches in the league? <hes> it's I do think you. I think that's like for example if you listen to the E._S._p._N.. And other national outlets talk about and write off these things this is something that I rarely hear come up but I think it's such a big part of how the the the odds chains across the landscape that really really no one really has appreciation for so that could that could be right well we. We'll see but I do think that's that's an important thing for example Milwaukee. Taylor Jenkins went to be the head coach in Memphis and we'll talk about the guy who kept everything organized while for Bud that was his right hand man of course butts never gonNA say no. Don't go take this every head coach that has since this is they're invested in are going to want to see them have those opportunities but having seen that firsthand lanta tailored unions kept everything organized it. If you don't think organization is a major part of how bud gets results he gets its. That's GONNA be wild. Oh Yeah we said we're not going to go through everyone Jeff dezelic leaving Houston last year we saw the impact of that at the beginning of the year and on and he's he's in he's in New Orleans and then shoot what was I had another one but I'm drawing a blank but I I'm with you it it it it does it does make a difference. I think that's just underrated across the league well one that almost happened was <hes> he's yeah he's like moved into a consultant role. Oh true yeah. He's not an organisation nation yeah. That's that's the big thing is also weird. What what to put a pin in this time but it's so strange hell sixers assistance has gotten jobs? Now about us has got the job and those those this warriors assistance aren't getting like any shy. It's just kind of kind of weird to me apart from Luke who was already kind of a Laker or Laker family that kind of stood out but you know I mean Collins and Brown right. That's basically would it be yeah. It seems like I might be busy one but I guess that would be the whoever replaces out on the front row this year would be that really really green could be could be but it's just strange to me that there's been doing <hes> so my list. I had Houston there. I have the warriors there. I think it's I. I don't if you're not gonNA put the warriors on that list. I think it's fair to say one daily good fundamental ad in there. That's how close they are. Put the Spurs. They're just because I'm really impressed with what they have now. The topic of the roster always makes you scratch your head but the their ability to bring along like Derek whyte to be really really good <hes> and I believe walkers really GonNa help them this season <hes> and then they always you know <music> solid <hes> a buyout team but what's strange is I have a team on this list that most listeners probably scratching their heads why they have come up yet and that three is Brooklyn so doesn't either vestment Brooklyn is a contender now there have stephen as being debatable for being the best team in the conference are relevant conversation at all I've only had this is the argument for it. Katie comes back yeah well. I don't think eighty because back this year but they they were a good team last year. They won forty two gates they were they were a slightly above average team but see you don't give them any credit for how well they played in the second half. I mean I don't know credit but so I've just been looking into. I wrote this big thing this week because like the wolves literally brought in like a bunch of their <hes> their off the public personas now like on the wolves bench us in Brooklyn their scouting staff like Rosa's took a bunch of those guys. I've been looking into Brooklyn. It's like I don't know I think we got a little excited. Maybe you didn't because you're like much more focused on this. We got a little more excited about Brooklyn dancing around on the sidelines and like being fun than they were like actually really really good and and then you bring in Kyrenia Kyrie's and upgrade over John Russell even if he's a head case but contender status like what what about that team I'd lay out the path for me. I guess I think they lost Liberte last year and sustained and he came back and played well him taking another step. I think is a is a thing I think greg and I talked about the fact that I scratch go ahead for two years while I kept bringing us off the bench and it turned out to be brilliant because now they bring in Korean. You're not doing this weird thing of taking the guy that you were relying on your best player for the last two years and taking putting him and kind of b-roll. I think he's really going to help the culture kind kinda hold that together in a way that Boston didn't really allow Al Horford to kind of keep that culture together what's wreaking came in but you know they adding Guy Garrett Temple. I the reason I didn't have them on one of the more above this. Why do you you bring India Andre Jordan when you already have an emerging Jared Allen and I've always been concerned about journal and not being physical enough but man when I saw him what he's turned his body is to even since last season I summer league I was always playing but but of course it has been a negative players? The last two years not been a helpful player in terms of winning basketball is that just because he was in non winning environments these things back yeah I think so and so there's enough there. Thank you think that there's there's some top talent. That's worthwhile. There's some solid I mean they have is there are solid role players guys like Joe Harris and Garrett Temple et Cetera and so I just think there's enough there I mean even you didn't even bring up your boy Tory and prints well. We'll try to talk about the positives here now. He he's a fantastic shooter but will I mean I wrote. I wrote yes. He's he's the beat you if you check his catching shoot numbers numbers and eliminate kyri will eliminate his dribbling catches shoot. He's one of the ten if not the best five players League from the three one and catch shoot so I'll elite shooter for sure and now maybe a lot of people don't know that but he has struggled on defense. We'll see you kitty Akerson get out but didn't quite put him on the list but Toronto I mean N- it's so hard to know what's left. You know it's so hard to know Oh. What's that like what will Pascal Siachen be this year what will get soul do in a contract year and he's not even been there for full season? Despite having won the championship how substantial is a balk at this point what Kyle lowry be in this post Hawaiian Post. You know there's so many like interesting questions like we'll step into a bigger role from start to finish you know we're talking about making a move right as the most yes so. It's like like so then they're they're trading like one of lowery Kasallje Baca for an upgrade is or like Oh gee and the draft pick to bring in somebody that you plan to have more than one year. I do think so much of their moves. It's a deadline will be based on how they start like if they get off to a really good start and kind of are projected to be like a top four seed they might look. I mean they did last year. Messiah has been as creative as any G._M.. The last three years it's hard for me to identify that guy in the league. That's going to be the person that you get but you know they have the books to be creative like we talked about. I was saying earlier how there's like very few teams have guys on expiring this here like they're. They're the raptors three well. They have lower is a free agent Carr's salsa free agent bacchus a free agent Siaka free agent and leads the free agent right and and they're a mix of that plus young guys teams will be presumably sit in you know <hes> and to my recollection they I think they were the first one traffic in the quite that that seems right. Looks like I'm looking at your boy. Jeff Segel's page. They have all their first. Oh they do okay. I was thinking more than one I out. How did they still how do they get quiet without having to send out in that trade oriented OBI yeah? That's that's when you okay when you're people championship so that's okay next question did any teams overdo it in the form of going all in for this year with the warriors being undermanned that kind of the league big seeming wide open and let's let's consider and give teams credit for the fact that when they a lot most of these were making their critical since they did not know that both Kelly and Paul George will be in L._A.. So the so the League's he seemed more opened when they were actually facing these decisions so I wanna Kinda. Give them credit for you know for that your thoughts on that anybody overdoing. Did you say Utah. Did you say you overdid it and you're answering. I'm going to order. I haven't is listening to the word duty yet. No okay well I ask you. Are you going to say Utah overdid it. I didn't have my list but now that you ask a question. It makes me wonder like if I just skipped over them for some reason they did give up a lot to get an older player. That's on a different timeline. Donovan Mitchell isn't even bears like you said like the Colli thing they they did it before the thing like so this is we can draft obviously before right. I don't think they did the only the only team team I put down as overdoing it is which is weird because I was the one defending Houston and like the idea of Ross in them this talking about where I have Houston in everyone of my bullet points here. I think that's that's the strongest argument you can make for team who overdid it was like okay called at and I mean who who more apt to Overdo it. When Golden State gets shot in the foot you know their their arch nemesis for the past two years in the Western Conference Houston they overdid it? I mean they paid to first for us and to pick swaps OPS and RUSS MAKES GONNA make like forty million dollars a year. It doesn't sound we're at all I have on the list. They went in like three seconds for me but evaluating this team's Rosser and this landscape is a different thing that considering <music> all the capital they gave up to bring in. Yes you know with the question marks in terms of fit and all that so that's that doesn't sound weird. I don't think you defend that at all. I put Brooklyn on the list so in Greg and I we were talking to what they did. One thing one thing lesson I asked him I was interested. Answer was so they built up this really good positive culture where guys buy into their roles they make a sacrifices they occurred the role players to be quote stars in their roles et Cetera all the kind of things and Kitty accident and Sean marks in my mind deserve a lot of credit for that but let you bring in T._d.. Who couldn't even be happy winning championships year Angolan state or unsatisfied or whether I don't know if it words in his mouth and I hate all the Katie bashing? That's not what I'm doing at all but when you bring in like that big of a superstar just like it's it's a bit not bringing in the Bra and you're just putting on a certain amount of control of how things are going to go and so but when you bring in Kyri N. k. d. like to massive cultural. You know gravity creators there. I think there's there's a risk that potentially they just went to big instead of kind of maybe finding a more organic type but the interesting thing is that we talked about Utah possibly being the team but you know Dennis Lindsey by all the things I've heard has said we got to get more creative to build a more roster. That's more talented at the top. Especially and Utah has been one of those teams that struggled to compete in free agency in fact you know the built up Gordon Hayward to an all star level and then lost him for nothing and we have to say to Brooklyn. They've never been a really relevant team. <HES> and free agency they had to make a one of the worst traits at history to get top talent there air when they moved <hes> get Cagey Paul Pierce as much as Paul Pierce didn't want to go through go through that and such did work out for them but you know every team has a different kind of calculus on you know. Can we do this organically and callaway Golden State did was a very organic approach to building up toward a championship status and not gold state never saw them as being a team that could just go find the the peace at rounds them out in three agency so they built through the drafting through player development and Katie chose them more than they chose Katie in that way but Brooklyn seem like they're on a nice organic path and you bring in in my mind two of the players right now that are cut up mid career. Maybe a a little past mid career depending how you view that <hes> but that have so much re rigidity too how they see their basketball situation in my view so that was one more on the culture side that Brooklyn list. Increasing the you know what I was what I was looking at it and I think the argument that it wasn't too much is because it was legitimately a multi-year play and you can say three or play Katie inquiry boats signed four year deals with player options in the fourth year so let's call that three years for the both of them with Lebron in a d you have the Brown has two years left you have A._D.. Who has one now how you could say that that ends up being you can assume eighty ends up signing the four plus one next year whatever it is so maybe it's more but still that's three and three for Kyrie and Katie? That's a lot that's a big window. You have there whereas the clippers I mean they mortgaged everything for two of Colli and to have P._G.. So there is some value particularly in this player movement M._B._A.. Were in right now to have these guys locked up long long long term and I know it's just like a thought exercise. I run a lot of the time with the timberwolves and Carl towns who like no player option. No nothing is is five more years in the league. I mean not guaranteed on the team but under a contract for five more years which is an asset in that they're on the team or that. You can trade them like you got to kind of. Look at those those guaranteed years as your as your currency as G._M.. How many years do you have as with stars and Brooklyn has six <music> with those guys you want? It subtract lop off because Katie is not playing this year sure but I think there's a bigger play going on here in Brooklyn whereas both of the L. A. Teams feel very immediate U._S.. Totally yes and so that's my that's more justifiable for me yeah yeah I had to kind of clearly other lenses when I say when I look at through the Katie and Chirons I'm really big on Bang in and cultural fit and all those sorts of things and you know I look at what we did to that last season Boston's and it kind of blew the whole plan up to degree so it's just through that Lens is like Greg I talked about is Kenny Atkinson going to be the coach three years from now if if this doesn't go really well you know and when you when you requested maybe not that's like okay you already creating more than two. What is this path of okay? Did you have anything else on that. One or you move on you know basically I just said like Denver and Philadelphia Yeah. They made Denver the they got Jeremy Grant but that wasn't I mean they didn't like overpay or anything for that. He's a good player multiple years. I've done his deal. He's going to help us. It was like they had more of the normal progression do I love to. I love Jamal Murray getting a five one seventy extension right now no but that's just that's kind of the nature for a are you A. Have you been really good on your rookie contract Yep. You're getting a Max like that. Just a pig or whatever yeah you know so so I get I get Denver and then Philadelphia like what are you GonNa do. You're going to like well. Actually we're going to downshift back into a really long play with embiid and Simmons. I know so you go. You know you do the Horford and Richardson. I mean you do that move and so I get that I can't. I can't say they like they hit the gas to art and so I don't I don't know I don't I don't really have another team. The only team I feel pretty confident in that they did too much Houston yeah same then on the Philadelphia side in terms of doing too much thinking about being aggressive adding on the Philadelphia side. It was really kind of weird to C. J._J.. Radic leave so quickly the worst money right correct and I mean it seems like at least made an effort to say we're going to try to find a way to make it work because man when their offense would grind down to a halt especially before Jimmy was there but even at times when Jimmy was there rettig would keep that offense moving along just to keep them in games coming off of screens and knocking down shots and his ability to play you know with a lot of tempo. I wonder sure I wonder if he was really locked. In on a multi year deal for this and Philadelphia like Philadelphia would know better than anyone else would if like what is he now thirty three three or four sounds right like that. Maybe it's time that he kinda like turns down into a player that you're not wanting to pay fifteen to twenty million dollars to 'cause i. I wish I had it in front of me. I wonder what the most they could offered him for. One year was <hes> that that probably would have been worth it if it was like eighteen or something and I bet you he takes that rather than to twenty-six eighteen is shows right so one hundred eighty five percent of whatever he's making last year last year twelve yeah so that sounds that sounds about right what New Orleans gave him on an average value just didn't seem so strong enough in the worry about it and then after this season they had this full bird rights. Now is capital is there but sometimes people forget that saw like the bird rights making completely free on your captured until he signs that contract attract but I it was more of letting him go and not really replacing him in any way shape or form to create more shooting back on that Rosser that was so it was both sides of that to me was not finding like how do they Ellington get to team gene the significantly less relevance you know guys like that who can just knockdown shots and play that role. Even if you're minutes they got to be the most active deadline by out team in the League because I think Philadelphia is going to be good but to me they have like multiple needs in up one obviously of aren't saying shooting but they could use it just like a pick and roll point guard or just like a real point guard like to be able to like come optum entropy another option other than other than Simmons. There and I think it's pretty important if they are going to be a contender it's they probably you know find a way to get Kyle Korver and find a way to get. I don't know point guard who's available probably better than that I mean I don't know the one I wrote down was like D._J.. Augustine he's like expire. I don't know does that caliber like which I would say is a step above love Lynn visibly guy you feel good about as a backup point guard and they can kinda microwave something for a little bit more yeah. It'll be interesting to see how much they eh to buy his handle in the pick and roll this year. That's not ever really been things done even though he seems to have the kind of on paper skill set to do that <hes> this one really quickly. I had nobody on my list. We'll let you anybody like plainly not aggressive enough. Given how why the League is open or anybody on the other side they just didn't do. They could've done a lot more than I told you I got. I had Houston Everyone Gotcha. Okay I mean I just made the why why they like. They did too much but they could have done even more right like if at some point I think they tried they. I think they looked at that's probably the Capella Gordon and Tucker trying to flip so I think that I think you're probably right and with I think Bobby Mark said it was like forty. percent of the League is like frozen until December fifteenth to be able to trade for so they're in the spot where it's like slim pickings to be able to work together some sort sorta trade to get a third piece but it would have been advantageous for them as back to my plane landing metaphor that wasn't even my metaphor like they want to have their their group together as soon as possible like make if you're going to go get somebody and you're GonNa Flip Capello or Gordon or whoever for them or a combination of like dude on December fifteenth when you can because for sure especially because you need rest of buy in yes so I if you're not optimized I knew for the first six weeks of the season either fix that aced out right right and my one other one was Milwaukee. It's a good that's a good call. I think there's still there's still six million below. The tax like feels like like they're also like a team where there's a million different things going on and I'm like okay. Brogden and snow was traded for like I don't I need to go back and look at like the order of operations of everything but like come on Milwaukee like why are you in the tax be in the tax just just do it like do more they. They're the you're the eastern conference rate so I think you can make an argument for them to have found some mm sort of other path where they were a little more aggressive brogden got paid a lot. I get that but it feels like there was more there to have been done and maybe maybe they're a deadline team too but again I think the deadline market is crappy so yeah but we're all agree with you there on my list. I was like Oh that really sounds correct is that they seem just focus on bringing back as much as they could as most getting better. It seems like right okay. Let's take our last breaks day. I'll have a quick conversation on on with all of this movements can on the other end of the League which team that's not relevant from this season in terms of contending or likely playoff <hes> qualification et cetera and that three or three to five year timeframe who'd we see being positioned to potentially send in a in a really meaningful way so we'll be right back with that discussion okay. I have two tiers here. I'll go first here. I think the the PELICANS teams on this. I sounds like maybe your list longer than mine but I'm curious. You have let me hit my first so I think the Pelicans with everything they got eighty trade how well they did in in this year's draft to add more even more draft assets removing the way they did in the draft. It's funny that you know the team. You cover the team that I help right more piece of hoops or basically basically in a bidding war to move to a new New Orleans pick that they had from L._A.. Took well pass a moratorium for all that to get ironed out but I think you have to put on the top of that list and nobody else is really nobody. I Know Oklahoma Oklahoma. City has the draft capital similar. Go forward draft capital that the Pelicans have I haven't looked at it one side by side if I look at it side by side and I know the Pelicans still have more but they both have seemed like in the way ahead of everybody else and then you know Lion Williamson Kilos Andrew Walker in Jackson Hayes and nothing as is the perfect process a long way to come in some areas play but they just have so much there and then the next year I have I afford teams. That's five so I've Atlanta and with Atlanta's way I'm describing is cameron. It's kind of their swing player. In terms of if he really hits and his eighty percent player people thought he was before work that awful season Duke that's really going to move them into where they now have a fully-fledged core rather than kind of where they were last season was everybody's like Oh if they can just add one more player on Trae John Collins. Not You know a little higher than probably aww you'll have John Collins. I think Memphis did really really well. I mean when you look at how committed they were to the Britain Guy Grind for just even like eighteen months ago. MEMPHIS has really kind of recalibrated their whole approach the next season or to you know of course Jaren Jackson Junior there and I'm a little concerned about how high ruin is on Jami Mirant as an M._B._a.. Point Guard. He's a fun player. No doubt about that but people like Oh Mike Conley we out John Marini no slow down a little bit. You Know Jones in that so there you go representing the Minneapolis there <hes> but I think it's just really impressive what what Memphis has done to kind of shift out of Seoul Conley in any other veteran body we can get after that okay see I think with all the draft capital they have from Houston and the possibility for us to really slip if this doesn't stick in his last swing for use and maybe it's not a yes got it into lasting right normal life cycles yeah this feels like the last thing so that could really work out well for okay see I can't remember what protections as they have there but I don't think that they're like profound protections and then I threw Minnesota on here just because a Karl Anthony towns <hes> be a legitimate of front office now see I don't know what to make Ryan Saunders as coach but they seem to really believe in him but at least he's bringing kind of a fresh mental approach and strategic approach to how to deploy talent and I think that that's going to and we seems crazy. Easy but when you look at what tells us numbers in the swords career this as they get to the next level is like fricking scary and I you know I I don't know I don't know anything about how they really against this new version of their leadership. I don't know but I just think that you know when I hear Rosa's talking. I'm relying a lot of your coverage there. In Your podcasting your articles I've been consuming since he's come on board. It just seems like he's very committed to being very thoughtful and deliberative but not lazy and slow on how to approach getting this roster to the next level so those are those are Pelicans and in their kind of their own class and then fourteen Atlanta Memphis okay see the and Minnesota so the one that I have kind of in that group that you don't have this at all and I don't feel great about this. Actually kind of like I have three question marks next next to them is Dallas. How do you feel about Dallas three years? From now I just so the the reason I don't have Dallas here and they have obviously Luca Danni as he was the first big word last year and I don't feel badly about etel was rookie. Years provides eight PORZINGAS. I don't know what it is. I just there's so many questions I haven't seen him play really into years and then the other part of I didn't put them here here is that they've never really been operated as a strategic franchise. It's like every year. They have a one year plan instead of being a team. That's operating a two three four. The right number of years is Mark Cuban takes a run at whatever free agent is available well every summer and they all kind of clear the roster they have to they have so much rosser turnover year that I just don't know if they're capable of functioning on a strategic level which is something that you have to do in order to consider you a team. That's N._F._l.. Three to five year window to do something on purpose to because I think that's really ascending so that's why question about it but I'll let you share. No I mean I put him on there. Because I mean three to five years from now I think very likely that you have Luca and kristaps on the team and and that in and of itself is like I was talking to somebody about the Atlanta Hawks when you know when I was in in Vegas Summer League and they're just like kind of sexy team right now it's like Oh man like so fun and they've got these young guys and all this optionality for the future and what the person said to me was is like yet they don't have. They don't have like a guy and he any you know I was talking about this in the context of the temperature like you take the timberwolves future over the hawks because because you got cat and you gotta mocked up long-term and he's like it's great to have the flexibility and have young players who are interesting in this and that but when you don't feel with any sort of certainty that you have a guy who's definitely going to be one of your two or three stars that you need. You're just inherently further away and some with Atlanta's is on my list because I think there's a path for them to get their Dallas. It's it's pretty easy to say you know three years from now they're going to have to stars and and that you know that puts you in what will be like twenty two and crafts twenty six or something I don't know like young stars and then the reason I think I had the question. Marks is an again just like looking at their books right now. There's a lot of other money on there and they gave they gave Dwight Powell this deal that extends for the next four years you have dhillon right. WHO's fine accents for the next three Mexico who I think that's a good deal but that you know that extends out there Seth Curry four years during Vinnie Smith three years I mean it just kind of like adds up and I guess where I'm at right now three years before were there my best guess would be that for Dallas to truly become like a champion champion? They're going to need to have a third guy on top of kristaps Luca and the path to getting there is going to it's going to require like patients in the sense that you're GonNa have to jump at the right time and to your point with the like they haven't really illustrated like good discernment and that historically an in that way. I think that that clouds things for them but given what this list is of the other teams that we have on here that include Lewd teams that have question marks. I mean Minnesota's on the list like if medicine is on the list I think Dell should be on the list. I put it like that the the kyw Luca and kristaps cat I think that's I think think that's reasonable again. I just WANNA see some strategic planning evident there and then we'll close out there. I think what you heard from whoever you were talking about -Lanta is probably a consensus is that they're lacking the guy but everything I'm hearing from Atlanta. is they know they're going to have to add that top. Piece three they're trader free agency and when I say trade like a guy like forcing himself without like this year ago but I think they believe they're building a brand and the culture and really pop really popular head coach in Pierce Cross leaks. I think that they know that trane. John can't be V.. Two best players probably can't be the two best players on a leading contender and they keep you in the second third but I think that they believe that they are going to be able to attract a really really talented player. Don't know who that is now. The IT might not be a guy who even sends the next year or two. We don't even know who that person is yet but yeah no I I'm within. I I see that to to for Atlanta. I think it's just it's baking in the ambiguity to that where it's like shoot three years went by in now we've paid paid for trae young. We've paid for Collins herders up for an extension and it's like well remember when remember when we had like sixty five million dollars worth of expiring contracts and everything there's just there's just like a there's an end of the road out there for Atlanta that is so much darker than this green pasture. We're looking at right now. They belong on this list in my opinion but I I don't know Atlanta's in a better place member of the timber wolves with like Levin in cat and wiggins like back. It's it's not all that different than then right and like look what happened granted. They didn't well. I was GONNA say it didn't manage it well but the Butler trade no brainer at the time that was that was Atlanta's move as moves gonNA make you don't know that that sometimes you can get the star or the really good player whatever you WanNa call. Jimmy and it's not as helpful as as you think it might be so there's just there's value even in teams who are building in having a guy and and that's you know that's part of this calculation and I think the other team that's really interesting in that similar vein kind of unprecedented is okay see with what they haven't draft capital. I mean this is this is the most draft capital a team has ever had so if you're saying prestige it's it's it's really interesting to think about you. Go like well. What what do we do? Do we try and buy right now to try and buy Devon Booker. There's like a hint of him being like maybe he's going to leave in a year and a half like we try and get in on this next summer like do just overpay up because again using Atlanta as an example remember how much capital they had of course you know like the past eighteen months or the question Russian so much of a draft late this year yeah Castro for De'andre Hunt and rented show. It's just yeah can can okay see cash it in for a known commodity. Can they go get their Luca or their kristaps and that that's going to be. I think that's fascinating okay see close. I think travelers sling cast in those draft has because he knows two years from now. We're still primarily building through the draft. Were off plan as lead to be adding like ready players that are ready to help us win right now. So I you know slink you know by all analysis overpaid and I know that everyone kind out of it knowledgeable. You have to overpay to move up. That's kind of how it works but I also think that slang has again like I said hints at them flipping to another level of sense of urgency knowing that okay we're one year away from extending John to your way from having to extend trae this. This is our window. We can really do it after we get both those guys on the on the books that has to be in the middle of that happening. I think you're you're exactly right on that so quickly dame plug <hes> any recent or soon to come work and then we'll let our listeners yeah I mean I it's it's been a a weird. It's been weird offseason for the timberwolves but a lot of a lot of change so that's what I was doing in. You're you took in a lot more basketball than I did there and for me it was more trying to get to know some of the players and the coaches coaches and the this this new regime there so I kinda this week wrote a piece on you know who as we're kind of talking about now the wolves are in their in this phase that is passed where Atlanta is now and it's time to choose an identity that is going to be what they are for the next three to five years like they belong in this list that we're talking about but you got to choose what three to five years looks like now and so I think that's that's an interesting calculus for Minnesota and and it's kind of cool to me or interesting thought exercise at least of how they're doing it and they're really segmenting things up or they're like we have an offensive coordinator. It's Pablo Perez Yoni. We have a defensive coordinator. It's David Vanterpool and we're going to do things very David Vanterpool ways which is like Portland and we're going to do. We're going to do offensive things very much that Brooklyn team that we were just talking about how fun and they had this culture and everything there and then the front office they're going to be like Houston and Daryl Morey because that's where Rosa's comes from so it's it's totally new identity coming together in Minnesota around one really good player one possibly poisonous enigma in Andrew wiggins and then a couple of interesting young pieces like you know Jerry Culver and Josh Akagi and and the rest of them so yeah that that's that's what I have on them and then I also have my basically just timberwolves podcast with just the day more going to be a podcast and you can you can obviously check that out wherever you get podcast if you WanNa if you WanNa Timber Wolves centric view on the League and at the V._A.. I'll do my plug. I'll do my plug on the farthest day. Did anyone that Summer League in the first few days tell you that Minnesota was prime for deep turn running so so who was the person it was me it was me you know why I told you they were you know you we we got together. You texted me but when they were already in there they're run okay. The reason they were good that was a good basketball ascalon team and you you do that because you have an eye for that but I knew before the tournament because those dudes have all been at the facility playing together the entire summer and it's like rather than a rag tag bunch of guys who just show up in LAS VEGAS in July. It was these dudes who I've been like. That's why they went to the championship in subway which doesn't matter I acknowledged that but the temperatures had a team of basically non M._B._A.. Players in the championship in the semi-finals of non M._B._A.. Players outside of debates diop and there were still one of the best summer league teams and that was a product of continuity and good coaching. They actually ran like an offensive and defensive systems so yeah things I don't know if you if you shine bright enough of a light things are looking up for the generals franchise. My plug is I didn't the benefit of having seen all the work that they were doing before some relief and I saw them play one or two games said they're going to make a deep run. Guy Smacked your hawks and now one game right they did the hawks have had an awful team but Amari spell yes <hes> but the the Pacers had the worst team there because Atlanta beat the belly twenty but anyway we'll we'll go back there so <hes> at Willow Glen at Lawton Willas Greg we starting our season the series next week so we'll start to bring those two teams a week. Thanks for talking through this landscape would be interesting and it's always so dates for us. Thanks for listening and we back soon. Thanks this is stacey on under motorcycle. This is stacey off her motorcycle. Does this have sucralose Senate on her motorcycle. Motorcycle pronounced at Sarah Not Excetera uh on now you're better on your bike with basic policy starting seventy dollars a year quote today at Progressive Dot Com Progressive Casualty Insurance Angle bringing physical ability available in all states hi. It's Jamie progressive's.

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