The Chris and Joe Show: Projecting the Giants Second Round Pick
podcast listeners. We are amazing avenue. The espy nation New York mets site. I'm Chris McShane and every week Brian Salvator and I discussed the current state of the mets Automated Avenue audio the show. We try to look at the mets from a somewhat logical point of view and not get too deep into panic city. We also answer your emails give weekly music recommendations and try not to get too frustrated with the team. You can find the show on Apple podcasts on stitcher on spotify wherever you get your podcasts. And let's go. Mets Womack to the Kristen. Joe Show presentative. Isp nation and big move you. I'm Jodie Leone joined by Chris bomb and we are giving you more. Nfl draft content as we're getting very very close to the very first pick of the twenty twenty NFL draft. We'll get to see commissioner goodell in his home in his basement announcing the picks the very odd setting. But it's not gonNA change the excitement that we will be getting from what happens during the NFL draft. Today's episode. We're GONNA be talking about guys that could slide into the early second round range where the giants will be picking with their second round pick as well as various scenarios for the giants depending on who they take with the fourth overall pick. How Things Affect Them. They take certain guys. What does that mean that they'll be looking at early on in the second and how things can really shape out so Chris. In terms of guys that can slide into this early second round. There's a ton of really talented first-round graded players that could slip a little bit. Because there's these late risers that are shooting up draft boards. That might not really have that first round town or first round grade but because of necessity or just even the slightest thing of of good interviews. Those guys can surpass others and very good players can be found at this point in time so Chris I think that one of the bigger groups that seems might be sliding is the is the linebacker group. Now probably won't be that many of them but someone like Patrick Queen or Kenneth. Murray could still be on the board very early. Yeah it seems like with Queen. Marie also throws back on into the mix there. I wouldn't be surprised to see any of them. Come off the board starting. I don't know maybe somewhere round twentieth overall but I also wouldn't be surprised to see them sitting there for the giants at thirty sixth overall. It kind of seems it works out every year that we have out about fifteen really solid first round grades on players and then there's probably a group of about forty players every year. It happens that basically. I DASH second round grades. Just guys where it really depends on. What team is picking Weyer? They're all kind of lumped together and they could be first. Rounders could be early. Second Rounders and there isn't a whole lot of difference between the value in those places and that I think is where you start to see. Guys had their their draft stock. Be really fluid. Where you're all of a sudden have got. You never expected to be there at the top of the second round or you have a guy you just. We're not expecting get drafted at the bottom of the first round. And I think that can be a spot to get really good value where you could get a Patrick Queen or a Kenneth Murray who could be your who could be your starting inside linebacker for ten years. You could get Zack Blonde. Who could be just a great Swiss army knife for your defense or maybe even Jerry Chin who could be a a poor man's version of Isaiah Simmons or grant delpit who if you're getting the twenty eighteen version of delpit. You might be getting a top five caliber player back at thirty sixth the other thing that makes the early part of the second round really interesting and also advantageous for the giants for having a high pick is. We've seen in the past teams. That are really desperate to fill a need that once. They're guy that they want to get taken. They will straight reach for a player. We saw that happen with the Houston Texans when they took Titus Howard. He had a pretty decent season but still went a lot higher than most people expected. You pointed out Jeremy Chin who has been a bit more talked about lately as a late first round prospect. He could still be available early on in the second he could be available the whole second round making him in play for that giants pick but the other thing that. I just kind of thought of here is that there's a possibility someone like grant delpit. Who is extremely talented? Who did not get to fully benefit from having a pro day getting to meet with general managers and coaches and Scouts in person and having those in person visits that something like that is just enough to to slowly slide down draft boards just a little bit to the point where he could be available early on in the second round. It's Kinda like with not for the same reasons but it's Kinda like with what happened with Landon Collins. A few years ago that he seemed like he was gonNA be a late first. First Round prospect even a mid first round prospect ends up going with the first pick in the second round is the giants traded up to make a move and go grab him so it seems like delpit it probably not a ton of likelihood of it happening but it seems like it could find his way sliding just a hair enough to put him in the early second round opportunity. Yeah that's kind of what we're seeing happening on the Big Blue View Community. Mock draft is time and again. I keep suggesting Danielle we. We really should have dealt in in our top five players available and time and again the votes just keep going elsewhere so something like that. Where teams look like. Oh that's a good player but we need a player at position x what we need linemen. We need an edge player. We need a a receiver and you know he just keeps being the bridesmaid and keeps Slo- slowly falling back pick by pick. That's something you could really see happening. Especially as the value of safeties seems to be very fluid in recent years. At sometimes you see teams almost Value them at all but then there are other years you see teams really show a lot of interest in adding safety so delpit and Chin with his versatility and coming from a small school. Those guys that are going to be very interesting to watch and honestly I'll be. I'll be rooting for a slide from delicate. Because if he's on the board at that first pick in the second round I would be completely content with a trade up like they did a few years ago to get Landon Collins in getting an extremely talented guy like grant. Del Pit another player. That seems like there's a slight chance he could also slide if not a greater chance in some of these other players that we mentioned. Is you turn gross mottos edge rusher from PENN STATE? It just seems like with the way things are shaping out with other position groups that gross mottos could have enough of a slide out of that first round being in early second round prospect now. He's he's talented enough to go in the first round but with like I said various other position groups being of need and being pushed up to the priority in the first round he seems like a guy because of his position and also where he's at he could he could slide his way out. And maybe another edge rusher slash defensive lineman that falls into this possible. Signing situation is also a they play positions that generally have a high value for teams yet. You see it in the contracts handed out of free agency. Guys who can rush the specifically off of the edge are valuable always have been pretty much always will be and particularly gross maddow's. He has really rare measurable. He is pretty much the archetype for a especially four three edge player Esa He doesn't have the athleticism. We thought he did but for three four team. He is going to carry a lot of value. But you also see those guys kind of slowly sliding back now. I don't know if that is because of you. Know just the perception of them kind of around the draft media at large or if it's just the depth of the offensive tackle and wide receiver classes where there are just so many good players that you kind of can't justify putting them behind guys like EPA Essen Gross Mattos. They might slide through no fault of their own just that there are a lot of good players at other physicians. Speaking of other good players at other positions. How ABOUT POSITION GROUP? That has a lot of good players at it specifically that being the Receiver Group. It seems like there's GonNa be some really talented dudes that are first round prospects that going to end up going in the second the third the fourth round like we've talked about numerous times and I think that what's going to end up happening towards the second. Half of the first round is that teams that are in play for a receiver. Might say themselves well. Why don't we go get somebody out another position? That's not going to be available later because. Hey maybe we can't get a guy. Like low viscous Chenault or brandon. Yuck later on in the second round we can still get a really talented guy. So teams are going to be banking on that depth to help them out leading to a pretty mind boggling slide for some talented dudes in in the guys that we were kind of thinking of here is the viscous Chenault Braniac Jalen Raider and Denzel mims. All those guys have talent. Some teams might even value all of them as first round receivers but because of how things are really shaped out with this this extremely deep receiver class. It's GonNa. It could hurt some of them. Yeah you just take those four players and add either Jerry Judy CD lamb or henry rugs just any one of those three and you have. What would be good top five pretty much any other year and this is kind of the bottom part of the top ten we keep saying it. We say it almost every show. The depth of of the talent in this receiver. Class is just ridiculous. I'm almost afraid to bring the position up because I know we could go on for a half hour about them but suffice to say there will be very good receivers available when the giants draft in at the top of the second thing. I think that makes it a little bit interesting is we can't say whether or not there will be these receivers there at the bottom of the third when they come back around again or say when the giants pit comes back around again. I think we do have to keep an eye on the possibility that there are twenty receivers taken in the first fifty or sixty picks or maybe even twenty taken in the first seventy picks there. Are that many good receivers where there is a very good chance that whenever team picks a receiver will be the best player on their board. The final group of guys that we considered here was offensive tackles and offensive linemen in. It's not so much that they're gonNA slide but it's some guys might leap leapfrog into the first round leaving the other players in this group available early on in the second and this second tier of offense of line prospects is not really up to that first round grade. Maybe not all of them. But there's there's potential for them like I said for them to go in the first round and others still be available on the board. The ones we kinda talked about Josh Jones could slide his way out a little bit. Lucas neon could also find himself early on in the Second Austin Jackson from USC. And then the one that we were talking about before. The show is Isaiah Wilson. It seems like there is a ton of steam for Isaiah Wilson to continue to move up. And maybe he doesn't move up into the first round like some people are projecting. He could go very very early on in the second round despite him not really having that much support early on and I'm specifically referencing Isaiah Wilson's draft stock to what I heard Daniel Jeremiah. Talk about during move the sticks and and on his podcast saying that. There's a lot of people that think. That Isaiah Wilson could be a late first round prospect An even a very off chance that maybe he goes before. Andrew Thomas but that's very very small but still besides the point. Wilson could be one of the biggest risers we see in this year's draft. Yeah I would say Wilson based on what is on tape seeing him rise. That much would surprise to me especially to see him. Go above Andrew Thomas. I think there is a good chance of having a player who has starting ability at offensive. Tackle there for the giants at thirty six. Whether it's Josh Jones. Lucas Neang Austin Jackson. Personally I like as Cleveland. He needs more play strength. He needs to spend some time in the weight room but just athletically. He is a lot like Lane Johnson end. That's kind of athletic profile. You're you feel comfortable. Betting on there will well. I don't I shouldn't say there will be guys there because if you think back to the twenty thirteen draft the Dallas cowboys traded back to thirty. I believe targeting Justin pugh yet because they were sure he was going to be there. Well that didn't exactly happen in. We saw a huge run on offensive lineman. So you can't say that they're absolutely will be guys there. But it's likely that one of these guys Jones Neang Jackson Wilson Cleveland. One of them will likely be there and maybe even several of them will likely be there for the giants at the top of the second if they still need to draft offensive lineman next. We're going to discuss possible scenarios for the giants early on in the second round. Once they're pick comes around based on what they do in the first round what could be their counter. We're GONNA talk about that next but before we get to it. We're going to take a short commercial break. It seems like right now. There's a couple major scenarios that could happen for the giants with their fourth overall. Pick well if they do go through. Where does that leave them with the second round? What are they going to be doing as their next move in bringing in players to the New York giants? Well the first and obvious scenario that we've pitched multiple times in that we keep seeing and mock drafts from experts all over the place from big sources saying the Isaiah Simmons pick up fourth overall. Well if this happens whereas it leaves the giants early on the second round and we talked about the fact that it seems like the best possible move for them is that if they go. Isaiah Simmons that means they're banking on in hoping that there's going to be offensive line options available right at that spot at thirty six so that would be one of these tackles. We talked about Isaiah Wilson. Josh owns Lucas. Neang Austin Jackson or does this put them in the spot where they should take a player like Cezar we's if he doesn't get drafted very late in the first round it seems like offensive line makes the most sense if they take simmons it really does because unless the giants feel a lot more strongly about Cameron Fleming than we do. They don't have a starting right tackle and they even if they do think that Fleming can be a patch on the position. Kind of like Mike remers was last year. They don't really have a right tackle for the future. They also has some serious questions. I think at center. Obviously we're pulling John Alipio to get healthy and be able to compete at training camp. Because he does have ruptured Achilles. And that's not. That's not a small injury but even if a labile is healthy the the giants need an upgrade their they need a natural starting center so. I don't think they could go wrong between getting a right tackle for the future or getting a starting center personally. Just based on how. We have our position grouping kind of played out. I would look to the right tackle with either Lucas. Neang as Wilson Prints Taken Ohio. One of those guys who can step in and hopefully locked down the right side if not right away then definitely starting in year two but if they happen to come away with Ruis. I don't think we can really complain about that. Although potentially getting that right tackle in them may be having a guy like tyler abiotic or Loyd cushenberry be there at ninety nine overall that could be extra ideal the other scenario that were really starting to see too is taking an offensive tackle over. Isaiah Simmons taking someone like Tristan. Worth's G DRIK wills maybe even MCI Becton with that fourth overall pick. Well if you're taking tackle. Where does that leave the giants with the counter? Measure for them. There is that they'd be banking on good defensive talent being available someone like grant. Del Pit like we talked about. Maybe he slides into position for the giants. Take him maybe one of the linebackers. We talked about Patrick. Queen Kenneth Murray Zach Bond. One of those guys could very well be on the board in even edge prospects like deter gross mottos. I it seems like there's a lot more chances. One of these defensive playmakers falls than offensive linemen though that does kind of seem to be the the two options for the giants if they go defense with their first pick likely Isaiah Simmons but who knows a coup or young might fall probably not but they might then they go off line in the second if the giants go offensive line in the first than they almost have to address the defense with their second pick and yet just based on looking at draft boards of trying to get redone guys draft stock. It does seem like they'll have either linebackers or that heavy second third tier of edge rushers to choose from you know. Maybe you're gross maddow's maybe Julian Okwara or maybe linebacker. Like Kenneth Murray Patrick Queen. I think maybe their best hope will be Zach born but I would kind of be surprised particularly surprised if he happens to fall just because of Hell Versatile. He is how good he is. How many rolls? He can fill. There is probably the outside chance that they could get Jeremy Chen or grant delpit because the giants do have that whole free safety end Chin can serve a lot of the same roles that Wilson Not Isaiah Wilson. That is as Simmons too. Many Isaiah's that Isaiah Simmons could if they had picked him in the first round the final scenario that is an option but not as likely just because of the difficulties. The T. A. Teams will be dealing with having a virtual draft setting is the giants trading back. And we we've all rooted for it. We've all talked about it and saying that the giants should orchestrate some type of a trade back and how far and it's really too difficult to speculate where those were those trade back scenarios could lie and in how far back the giants could move if they only move back pick. Well then Isaiah Simmons. Any of those guys are still but if they move somewhere towards the middle of the first round will that opens up the door for taking a receiver but ultimately what it would give them is multiple second round picks most likely it would give them an additional second round. Pick additional draft capital. Maybe even in the first-round those types of things will then. Where would that really impact the giants and where would that open the door for for various other position groups to work their way in yet? If the giants have trade back I imagine one of their picks almost has to be a wide receiver. Just because as we said in the first half pretty much whenever a team picks after the first few picks a wide receiver is going to be the best player on their board. And as much as we've talked about the giants needs on offensive line and their needs on defense. Wide Receiver is a need to. They need depth that position but they also need a starter. They need a true number one guy. They have sterling shepard who is creating separation but he's a slot guy and not to diminish that slot guys can have a tremendous impact. Just look at Victor Cruz. A couple years back in two thousand eleven or sterling shepherd his rookie year. They need a guy opposite area. Slate in a guy who can command double teams who can tilt the field who can force a defense to declares intentions and really help the offense. Create that room underneath four. Evan Ingram Floor Sterling Shepherd and four saquon. Barkley to work. Yup I think one of the big problems with the giants defense but the giants offense over the last couple of years has been. They haven't really created room for themselves. It's been too easy for defenses to play downhill and just crowd the line of scrimmage which was where pretty much all of their place. We're going anyway. So I think just given their need and the depth at the position wide receiver becomes a possibility giants trade back and then also we have both of the other positions. We mentioned oftens of line and some position on the defense especially if the giants get two second-round picks are. I will that is going to be at for our speculation in predictions for various scenarios in the second round for the New York. Giants were pretty much a week away here for the NFL draft. And we're getting very very close so now's your last chance to get in your NFL draft questions. Send them to us on twitter at Joe. Deleo or at Raptor M. K. Is You can also send them into our facebook page. You can directly on her instagram page at big underscore blu underscore view any other. Last questions you have send them on into us in. We have one more mailbag show before the draft. So don't expect us to answer any more questions after that. Make sure you get them in now. For the last final mailbag rape before the draft. Also be sure to follow the big blue view twitter at big blue view and also reading subscribed wherever you are listening to us. Check around also for next week where we're going to be doing our final offensive and defensive reviews and then obviously wants to grab starts will be giving you a of context. Hi I'm Brian. And I'm one of the hosts of the Amazing Avenue Network of podcasts. Each weekday we bring you a different podcast. That covers the New York mets from a different perspective every Monday. You Hear Me Steve. Along with Ken. Lucas on from complex to Queens will discuss the mets minor league system. Every Tuesday an unforgettable. Join me rebel. They look back on the career of less heralded. Myth Hi. I'm Alison along with Maggie and Linda. I host a pot of their own each week. We look at all things. Mets and social issues in baseball. 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