How to Manage Toxins, Heavy Metals, and Allergies with Dr. Vivian Chen
Yeah. There's just such a disconnect between what's published and known in the science, literature, and what doctors practice? Welcome to the generation v podcast, the podcast, dedicated to the young conscious generation of Egan's who are looking to make mental physical and spiritual gains. My name is Neiman. Delgado. Professional bodybuilder engineer and vegan lifestyle advocate each week. I'll be sharing inspiring individuals who will help you unlock your limitless potential and become the healthiest version of yourself from the inside out. Welcome back to generation be brought to you by vegan, fitness dot com. It's no surprise that. We live in a very toxic world from polluted water to be PA's PCB's, heavy metals, artificial, preservatives, plastics pesticides, these toxins around us can end do negatively effect every part of the body. Luckily, we're born with several detoxification systems, like the liver kidneys, intestines lungs emphatic, system and skin. However, whenever these systems are compromised impurities aren't properly filtered and the body is adversely affected and can even lead to allergies diseases and death. On today's episode, Dr Vivian Chen joins us to let us know what measures we can take to thrive in such a toxic environment. Vivian is a doctor who practice in the UK for fourteen years before moving to California. She is board certified in internal medicine and family practice in the UK and also holds post graduate certification in diabetes care and skin surgery. She is also certified as an integrative health practitioner and used nutrition and other lifestyle factors to reverse her husband's hypertension, her kids, allergies. Her own heavy metal toxicity. And now help clients he'll using integrative modalities through her company plateful health. She is a passionate health, advocate, and is the medical advisor to plant based news. Vivian also wanted me to remind you that before you implement any changes that you learn here on this podcast. Please always check with your doctor first if you like this episode, please leave a rating and review on itunes shared on social media and visit begin fitness dot com. To join our Email list to receive more evidence based nutrition for. Physical performance. What's up guys? Welcome back to generation v IM super pleased to have Dr Vivian Chen on the podcast today. How are you doing Dr Chen? I'm doing very well. Thank you my. I'm super glad to have you here. I am a very excited to have met you first of all we actually met at the switch for good conference. Right. The athlete summit. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Back in. Likewise. When was that was that I think it was Tembo man September two thousand eighteen. Yes. Anti flies. When you're having fun. But yeah, this is that's where we met. And I was I was really intrigued by your story. And some of the things that you were saying for those you don't know Switzer good is like a it's almost an anti dairy campaign that is completely push forward by doctors and athletes, particularly and we've had dot C Bausch on the show. She's talked about it. And if you're not with it, definitely go check it out. It's a really awesome campaign that provides tons of you know, evidence based information from both, athletes and doctors. So that's where we met. And I heard you speak on stage about a few topics. And I was like, Wow, I've got to have you on the show and discuss those in further detail so before we get into that though. I would love to just get to know you a little bit more because we haven't had the opportunity to talk much so and my audience may not be familiar with you yet. But they will be just a moment. So why don't you just tell us a little bit more about yourself, and where you grew up and then. How you got into practicing medicine, right? Okay. So I grew up in Taiwan. And when I was the teen years old my family moved to England because my dad's job transferred him them. So I moved from Taiwan when I was thirteen not speaking would of English to England where. You know, schooling, everything was in English. And that was that was a tough time in my life. But from very young age. I always knew I wanted to be a doctor, and it's probably because I was good at sciences, and I was just fascinated with human biology, but also an going to sound a little bit corny. But I think that old doctor's going to profession wanting to help people and an I feel that from you as well knee. My that you you you kinda just have this innate want to to help people and reduce human suffering. So that kind of drove me to pursue the the medical school route. Now, I went to medical school in London, and I absolutely loved every single minute. I was immersed in a science, and you know, followed the traditional conventional medical teaching. And then when I graduated medical school in England is five years. So you go into medical school when you're eighteen and you'll you graduate when you're twenty three I took an extra year out to do a degree neuroscience as well because I just love kind of exploring the details of the brain. So I graduated six years later kind of just ready to to be a doctor and do what I always dreamt of doing. And for the first few years, I practiced in a hospital. So I was an intern assed. And so I don't lot with medical emergencies like heart attacks and strokes, and that of my job was really rewarding. So I think the western medical paradigm works really well for acute medical situations. But the longer I practiced and the more kind of day today outpatient clinic patients, I saw I start to to not feel so rewarded by my job because I was dealing a lot with chronic diseases. And as a lot of statistics show three out of every four healthcare dollars now spent on chronic disease. So as doctors, we aren't dealing much more now with chronic diseases than acute. Illnesses. And I started to feel like what I was told. I middle school wasn't really equipping me with a very satisfactory way to help my patients because I was prescribing a pill for every ill. So every symptom that they had I was told from medical school as a pill for that those pills usually came with side effects. So they would come back to me. And so for example, a patient with diabetes who I would see from diagnosis after about five to ten years they'll be on five or more medications or maybe even injection. So I started to really kind of think is really the best way that we should be helping patients prescribing moment -cations and right around the same time. I had my daughter. And you may have heard a story which good. But basically when she was eight weeks old she was hospitalized because she just refused to feed. I'm just shortening. The story began a more show how much store details. You know? You can go you can go into the details. I wanted to know. And I think our would definitely like to know as well. Especially those that are mothers that you know. Okay. Yeah. So, you know, as a physician I thought I had figured out with pregnancy. And you know, having a baby. When you know, I prepared myself to breastfeed, I read up old literature, and how to breastfeed and lined up, you know, lactation, nurses, and people who can help me because I knew as of is this show, and I saw a lot of mothers struggling to breastfeed. So I lined up all the help that I could GAM, but she from about three weeks. She's not to to not breastfeed, probably she would conflict, John, and then come off and looked like she was in pain, she would cry and then just turn her head. And you know, I just didn't know why she was doing that. And then you know, the lactation says were saying, oh, maybe it's to do with the lodge. Try this try that. So I tried practically everything on the sun. But she continued to get worse. So I took her to my doctor who diagnosed with reflux, they put her on reflux medication at first it was just one. And then when it didn't work they increase the does. And then added in a second one and things got worse. Actually, even though she was on medication to the point where she actually stopped feeding and she got so dehydrated that she has she had to be chewed fed in hospital. So they passed a what's known as a nasal gastric tube, a cheap that goes through your nose straight into your stomach, and they fed her that way now. You can imagine the kind of. I don't even know what the word to use his. How destroy a mother would feel and especially a mom who wanted to go into medicine become adults to help people who then couldn't even help her own daughter. That I think is the epitome and moment. Everything kind of turned upside down for me. And I instead of kind of believing everything I was told at medical school and just not not doubting the medical paradigm. I practiced in I really stepped back and thaw, hang on a minute. Why is nobody able to help my daughter, including me, not to brag, I actually graduated second in my clause of at medical school. So it's not like I had lack of knowledge I was very knowledgeable in the western medical paradigm. So. That was kind of turning point at which an combined with my feeling of not being so rewarded from my job anymore all of that combined together then made me look into a different kind of way of practicing. So just to follow up on story on my daughter's. I actually had to do my own research and through my research, I realized that she actually has symptoms consistent with a dairy allergy. So it's an allergy to cow's milk protein. So not lactose the protein in milk. And usually that's either casing all way. So she was actually breastfed getting the cow's milk protein through my breast milk because I was eating dairy at the time. And then her got. Was reacting to the protein and becoming inflamed. So the every time she drank my milk. It was causing her severe pain. And that's why she turned away and stopped feeding. So once we realized that in the situation was so dire that I actually didn't have time. And actually, it was in the right frame of mind to think about things like, you know, dairy elimination which I now kind of recommend to mothers who might be experiencing the same problem with children. But at the time. I was just kind of told by the doctors, let's switch to a hypoallergenic formula. So that formula is free of dairy protein. So basically within a week or two she's knotted feeding by herself and so going from so I thought point had to give up price breastfeeding and go to bottle feeding with the formula, and she went from kind of turning away from my breast and looking like she was paying just by looking at food to actually holding the bottle and feeding us off. So so that was another thing that was not taught to me medical school because I didn't know that of defeating can be a symptom of dairy allergy. And then I stopped to to kind of ask myself. Why was not why was I not taught that medical school? I know we know. Law about allergies, but mainly the kind of itchy IT NFL lactic reaction where you know, you'll throw swells up and you'll lip swell up and your. Risk of star series medical complications. But actually the more research. I did the more. I realize that this this kind of iceberg of people who actually allergic or intolerant to foods that. We just simply not taught to recognize that group of people at medical school. And that's why none of we soul. Many many doctors Ford vice and none of them was able to suggest dairy elegy as a possibility for her. And even myself, I didn't consider that until I did. Adele. Yeah. My own research into scientific papers. And this is actually the white going back all the way to nineteen sixties and seventies documenting all of this. So it, you know, there's another kind of moment of. Okay. So what else have I not been taught at medical school that I now need to educate myself on. That's such a powerful like powerful story. I can only imagine the helplessness that you felt you know with the newborn child and just. Yeah. Her inability to feed, and and how that must have made you feel and just especially like you like you said being a doctor and being medically trained to be able to handle these types of things just kind of left you with your hands in the air. Like, I don't know. What to do? That's yeah. That's such a profound kind of lesson or I guess trigger for you to start exploring other things like you mentioned. So where did where did you find this literature? I mean, you said it was a valuable did you just start digging through different medical journals and kind of trying to diagnose her symptoms by process of elimination had how does that work? So as a doctor you have access to old medical journals online. So you kind of just have to go to pop med which actually everyone's go. Access to. So if you just go to pop met on Google than type in keyword that you wanted research like so at the time, I used things aversion to feed not feeding in infants and then things will pop up that's kind of linked to those symptoms. And then, you know, these papers that really old were pop up, and when you read is kind of just mind blowing because the symptoms, and and then at the same time, I discovered things like rheumatoid arthritis and other medical conditions may be caused by dairy allergy as one and again, none of that was talked to or not to me anyway in the medical school, I attended and that was in, you know, nine two thousand so. Twenty two years later these scientific papers documenting these conditions still didn't make its way into medical textbooks, which is kind of mind blowing and actually. When I was practicing as I so I did internal Mets some focus for three years before I switched to family practice, and when I was a called eulogy intern. That was when the China, the China study was published and. I you know, we were so sent stunting patients, and they were still kind of going home or eating burgers in hospital in the recovery ward. So it's kind of like hold on a minute. What does just such a disconnect between what's? Published known in disci- literature, and what doctors practice, and that's kind of what prompted me to go different direction. Yeah. I completely agree. I think I've had I've had multiple doctors on the show, obviously. But I think it was Dr Khan that said like, you know, like the western kind of paradigm of medicine is like they treat lung cancer in the in the surgery room. But it's like they're selling cigarettes, you know, in the lobby, you know, it's the same thing for for the cardiology department. You know, it's like the these people that are suffering from heart disease. They serve the food. That's killing them in the cafeteria in the hospital. You know, there is a huge disconnect there and not to say that it's the doctor's fault, and maybe the systems fault. But I think that should be definitely taken like, I don't know. Some changes have to be made. I think that the conversation is now happening within. The medical community with things like em and all these coalition of doctors that are getting behind and teaching more about integrative medicine and kind of the lifestyle changes that aren't so. I guess apparent to us like Mike, you said like this dairy allergy that your daughter had. I mean, how many people suffer from from dairy allergy the figure is extremely inaccurate. Because if you don't recognize it, you can't diagnose it, right? So I think that there in lies the problem that we don't actually know and just from kind of anecdotal inexperience I think is a lot more than what is estimated in the scientific literature, which is anywhere between to ten percent of the population. So you see that wide? Variation depends on how you diagnose it. And the problem with food allergies is that there is no gold standard right now. So what they use is a skin prick tests all a blood test which looks for antibodies, but those antibodies picked up on the IT type. Which is associated with an F Alexis. So the more serious kind of reaction, but not the delayed type reaction, which is what my daughter had. So she didn't have the lips Wellings. She didn't have any rash. She she hadn't no outward typical symptoms of an acute allergic reaction. That's why nobody thought of that. But she had the delay type reaction where the bodies so is different class of antibody. And usually kind of itchy g or g a. But those can cause inflammation in target organs, for example in her. It was in hukou it and cause inflammation there too. And then, you know, you get the symptoms like pain, indigestion or inspe- children. It could be diarrhea. So there's a a very rare condition e o e so yes on a isn't a affiliate is of giant is where and that's kind of quite an extreme manifestation of this delay type of allergy. Can you? So is the definition of allergy something that produces antibodies in your in your system, and what is the difference between an allergy and intolerance? Right. So and yes, exactly like you said, so the allergy usually involves antibodies so the immune system is activated. So it could be delayed or acute, but an intolerance is usually due to the body not being to break down a food protein. So for example, lactose lactose intolerance, that's an intolerance because you don't have the enzyme to break down lactose in your body. So that could also be a intolerance could be due to poor digestion. So you know, you could be intolerant to Sutton proteins because your body lacks the ability to to break those down. So intolerant symptoms usually tend to be a bit mild up. But it doesn't mean that econ- KO's. In effect your daily life. So a lot of people have blow teen they have fatigue. Those kind of, you know, mild us in terms, but it really can have impact your quality of life at the same time for from your experience or maybe from the literature out there. How many people in the population is estimated to have like a lactose intolerance. Very between populations. So it depends on your kind of your ancestry. So for me, so I'm Asian Chinese and for us. It's kind of between ninety two joint ninety five percent lactose intolerant. Yeah. So and then vocations is Loa. I think the figures around twenty twenty five percent for African-Americans between fifty to sixty percent. So it really depends on what your ancestors ate and your genetic makeup. So I mean, I mean, it's pretty safe to say that a large number of individuals out here that are consuming dairy products are intolerant. And or allergic to maybe not to have such a cute symptom know showing the allergy, but a lot of people are probably consuming, dairy or lactose and have these allergies and intolerances and our experience in these cry. Onic symptoms of the Teague inflammation. And they don't even know it. That's right. Yeah. Nuts. Absolutely my experience. So after I kind of came to the realization that does this kind of delayed reaction, and there is so much. Intolerance of food in. In my patient population. I started recommend things like, you know, dairy elimination elimination of highly allergenic foods from patients who are coming to me previously. I would be saying, well, I don't know was wrong with you excluded. So many serious conditions. It's probably just you have stress in your life. Or, you know, I don't really know. What's going on? Let's label as irresistible bow. You know? So after that, I started to really. You know, really be able to help my patients because just recommending elimination of dairy has helped so many of my patients with bowel symptoms acne fatigue. It really like I personally think that dairy intolerance is a bigger problem than talked about in. Medical in the medical world. So I think that just you know, if you have a mystery symptom where doctors con help you then looking at whether you could have a food sensitivity may be good place to start. What are what are some of the most common allergenic foods? I mean, I know you mentioned dairies on people have an intolerance to weet, which I guess from my understanding could be due to the like the the life of say. Yeah. Glide procedure the roundup or the pesticides that they use because I've heard of people having intolerances to wheat in America, but not necessarily in Europe. So what are some of the most common, I guess symptoms and causes of these food? Intolerances allergies was the top ones all dairy egg seafood in adults knots and the top top one in children is milk. So. And. The more I practice when I first qualified. I didn't I never ever heard of allergy to rice. Okay. So my first patient who came to me and said they're reacting to rise. I was going to like no you making. It's not documented there's no way anyone can be allergic to rise. But you know, it's now very well documented and used with seeing this so many patients developing new allergies in adult hood, which is something that I didn't used to see either. And I think that comes down to the fact that all got function is compromised. So that area is compromised because of the way we're living like you mentioned earlier life assays a big factor in producing intestinal permeability. And when you have a gutless leaky, then these food proteins, which usually is kept out of the the body the immune system because of the got Baria would is now being seen by you'll immune system and demeans kind of light. Hey, doesn't new thing. I've never seen it. Before. And if it decides, I don't like it. Let's attack it then you you develop symptoms of allergies, or it could even be, you know, intolerance symptom. So it's I think more and more. We're seeing I mean definitely the allergy epidemic has gone up drastic phenomenally in the last ten years. And we're now seeing food allergies in adults as well. And two more and more different foods. So sometimes I run a food sensitivities test and somebody could be allergic to twenty to thirty different foods or there have antibodies. And that's because the immune system is saying foods informs eight didn't used to see you know, years ago. So so is that like a fog map tests, or is that that's no it's actually a finger prick test that they can do at home. But I mean, it's not I'm going to say that it's the most accurate thing the world, but is a good place to start. If you have someone who seems to be reacting to everything just to give an idea. So it meshes to itchy g antibodies to food proteins. So once you get report back, then you go to correlate that with clinical symptoms. So it's not it's not definite is not diagnostic, but it can help. Okay. So I mean, we talk a little. Bit. We talked a little bit about how you know, some of these maybe hidden toxins or components of the food that we're consuming can cause these allergies or intolerances and have these kind of systematic. Effects on our body like chronic fatigue, chronic inflammation, things of that nature. I mean, what types of products that? We may not be aware of contained similar toxins that we're using on a daily basis that we can kind of take a closer look at maybe make alternative swaps or just eliminate usage altogether. Well, I I think unfortunately, and sadly, it's almost everything that we use from personal cap products to things like protein powders. So. Glide for saying, I think is is is in our water is in the rain water. Now, some studies have shown that seventy percent of the samples of rain water taken contains glyphosate because is water soluble. So if somebody spring it's running off into the rivers, and that's collected into the seas. If I Rades becomes rainwater, and it can come down. Anyway. So I think it's difficult to escape from chemicals. In this world. And I'm glad to see that as there is definitely grassroot movements occurring that would people trying to do the right thing and stop and trying to bring. Much more regenerative farming back. But I think what we can do is to make sure that we eating as clean as possible without becoming new robotic about it and just kind of making sure that all bodies detoxification system, is optimal. So that if we do consume, these toxins all heavy metals or pesticides that we can Dettori Sify, and it's not building up in in our bodies and causing problems. How how soon after eliminating these sources of toxins or allergens desire body kind of restabilize itself or heal itself? Okay. So so different foot different chemicals. So with allergens it cannot happen very quickly. So as we saw with my daughter, she recovered very quickly because the gut barrier can reject. Great between three seven days, you get a new lining. So if we definitely saw that with her symptoms went away after about seven to ten days. So with allergens when you remove it. And that's why a lot of physicians might Brett commend elimination of certain foods for up to three weeks just to see whether you get an improvement your symptoms, and I will say is that a lot of people living with those chronic symptoms. Don't realize how good they can feel until they have, you know, removed the allergens and see a difference in that out energy levels. So. You can definitely see an improvement in symptoms very quickly that with allergens now the stories right different. When you thinking about. Say heavy metals, especially heavy metals and other pollutants like PCB dioxins. Those all kind of persistent organic chemicals that linga in our environment. And they accumulate in our bodies so heavy metals PCB's knock since they like being stored in body tissues they bind to proteins. So for example, lead likes going to bone Macri likes going to fire wide and brain. So they hide in different parts of our bodies. And actually the way our body uses to protect major organs from damage. So, you know, we don't want so much lead circulating around in the blood. So when it enters our body, the body kind of says, hey, let's just hide it in a bone. So that we don't have to deal with it. So I'm talking about the access let that you can't talks Feis at that store by a body because the body has to do something. With it. So heavy metals actually, you may not see symptoms for a long time until the level builds up significantly enough to affect body functions. And then glide. I think that DAL some studies showing that you know, if you use binding agents or detective IDE your body the levels come full quickly. But I'm not really sure on the exact kind of statistic there. Yeah. And you mentioned heavy metals. I know that there are several products that we consume normally that could potentially have higher amounts of these heavy metals, and like you said accumulate in our body tissue and have different types of thyroid. Like, you mentioned, I think I think a lot of people actually have thyroid issues and don't necessarily know that is coming from the food they consume they think maybe a hormonal thing, but it could be coming from a different maybe unaware like a source that you might be aware of but coming back to the heavy metals. I know that you talk about heavy metals and its importance in how to reduce our consumption of them. Are you familiar with the clean label project and the protein powder, particularly because I think this is relevant to a lot of my listeners that consume large amounts of protein powder? You know, pretty dependent on these these powders, but don't necessarily know where they're coming from. And what kind of certifications their brand might be. You know, adhering to as far as like the levels of heavy metals that are contained in these products and whether or not they're getting high quality protein powder or not. So could you do you know where most of the protein powders come from? I I mean to my understanding a lot of it comes from China. And the reason why a lot of these are contaminated is because of the water supply, and maybe the soil supply that some of the crops grown in or as particularly referring to to plant based protein powders that have been shown to have higher levels of like, arsenic, cadmium and lead in particular. So can you can you discuss that a little bit more familiar with that? Yeah show. Yeah. So definitely something that was a concern when it first came out, and particularly the fact that they found a plump based proteins to contain. I think something like twice as much as. Wait for come away protein. And I think a lot of that as you said is down to where it comes from. And also how the protein is extracted. So mine standing is that the plump protein powders a lot more closer to disor. So there's a lot less processing. So if there's any kind of heavy metals in the plants itself, it's going to show up more in the protein powders. But also when you consider the comparison between plant proteins and way, well way I is a water soluble protein, so I'm guessing during the extraction process. And and particularly if we're talking about heavy metals, which are Aliko phillix, they like staying in fat that may be why you see that kind of you know, such a big distinction between the plant based proteins and. The way that you know, maybe during the extraction process. The heavy metals are not included in the protein itself because his what solely will, but they didn't test for other things that could be so stated with way protein, for example, the hormones and other contaminates. So I think that that study just you know, if someone was to kind of just look at us study and go, hey, I'm just gonna go way protein because it's cleaner. I don't think that's a very that would be a very accurate. Assumption to make just based on this study and heavy metals actually very difficult to avoid because is ubiquitous I- environment. So cadmium comes from fuel. So call exhaust has caught cadmium. And if you have plants the kind of Afam that's next to motorway that the crops there will contain more cadmium. Than compared to a farm. That's you know, further away from a motorway, I think you guys called at highway here. So and also lead in let it Pattro. So a lot of countries still use lead petrol, and that will be in the soil or lead lead based paints in that's being used in countries where it can lead into the soil and be present. So yes, it's very much to do with where you'll protein is source from and the extraction process, but I would say if you're eating food you're exposed to heavy metals. So I think it's better to kind of think about how we talk Safai bodies from heavy metals rather than kind of really I mean, obviously, be careful where you saw you buy your your protein from. And like you said, you know, make sure. Sure, the company is reputable and complying with the regulations, and and some companies have started to test of heavy metals now to but I've come across a couple of companies that say that they tasked him when I asked them fall our Bruce. Yeah. The test report, they they report the detecting in milligrams, and it's kind of lie. It can't be milligrams. If you Jeff. Right. Exactly. So I think that's another way companies are trying to get around that that problem. They say, oh, no we test, and it's is non detectable at milligram level. But you know, you shouldn't be ingesting anything that has you know, milligrams of head metals. So yeah, I think that if you have to obviously, an an I the reason why I like, I love your work so much is that I think you if you focus on a whole foods plant based approach to nutrition and getting most of your nutri nutrient requirement from whole foods they do need to use a protein powder. Make sure that you research accompanied reputable, you know, make sure that they test for heavy metals and just try to get as clean product as you can. Yeah, I think that goes to most of the supplement companies in general not necessarily just protein powders. Exactly. Most people just assume that if it's on the market, it's been tested. It's been safe. It's been approved which is completely not the case. So that's why like you said, I'm always more inclined to recommend people to eat whole food plant base. Because if when you're eating foods more to their natural state, you can obviously reap the benefits, but the chances of it being less, processed in all of these other introduction of heavy metals toxins are far less whenever you eat these these foods and in their most natural state, exactly. But would you say that that is kind of like the most effective way of detoxifying yourself like eating foods that are high in antioxidants, or what is what are some of the? The ways of detoxifying these heavy metals that can somehow I guess Leach them out of our tissues and dispose of them. Yeah. So yeah, absolutely sticking to a diet. That's close to the as possible. I think minimize your exposure to chemicals and toxins in the first place. So that you know, if you if you think of an analogy as above top. If we're putting in less, chemicals and talks ins than we have less to get rid off. So that's I think always the first place to start an a whole foods plant based diet in my opinion contains the lease toxins and chemicals. Now, if you can go off his lead us better, I know not everybody can afford that. But, you know, making sure that at least with the using the WG dotty dozen list, making sure if you can to by the the dirty dozen foods organic that would significantly reduce your pesticide load. Now. Also in terms of Dettori vacation does so many. I mean, we we built to deduct fight naturally. So, you know, the detox is that you see that being touted online, you know, where you drink. You know, ten hope he's a day. And then you just sitting on the toilets route the day, thus not really does not really maximizing your body's natural detoxification system. That's optimizing maybe one way, which is, you know, getting rid of toxins through the gut. But you know, pooping all the time may not be such a good idea for you. If you're getting rid of ill important electrolytes, you might not be absorbing vital nutrients, so we have built into us the natural detoxification system, which is sweating and studies have shown that sweat contains. Macree glasses say the heavy metal. Even PCB dachshund. So sweating is a great way to detox fi your liver is the major kind of detox organ in the body it it's constantly performing so many functions to to generate glucose to Bill protein to detects fi-, and is probably the organ that. We we just take for granted. And we really need to look after our livers that's kind of in Chinese medicine that is kind of the basis your God and your liver is the basis to health. So you need healthy liver to deduct fi and kidneys is another way that we deduct spy, so, you know, making sure you're hydrated that so important, especially in your industry, where you know, you need adequate hydration to get rid of even things like lactic acid that's building up. So I w-. Would say making sure that you optimizing your liver your kidneys, sweating every day by exercising. Those are great ways to make sure that your optimizing your detox mechanisms do, you know, kind of which plant foods contain like the most optimal micronutrients that help detoxify or help promote like liver health that we could kind of include more of or maybe promote kidney health as well. Yeah. So. This hopes that can come from come promote liver and kidney health. So for the liver. Things like milk Thistle dandelions brewed, you know, if if you take those t- that can help support your liver, and if your liver is really congested, sometimes physicians might recommend supplementing with milks this old and lying to support your liver. And but in terms of foods and in terms of a heavy metal removal coriander is one of my favorites. So sorry, I think you guys call it salon. So salon tro, actually binds to heavy metals and can help remove from your your from your body. So people who eat fish actually fish contains of mercury and I say to them if you can take some. Salang at the same time easing fish. You could maybe reduce the absorption of Macri because it will bind to the Macree in your intestine and help to eliminate so salon tro is great parsley is really great for kidney health. So it helps the kidney talks fi. Of the chemicals and heavy metals. And the liver has to detox pathways. So getting a little bit technical his oh, stop me. It's not sounding like flooring does phase one phase two. So phase one kind of breaks down the chemicals into the inactive form. Well, actually converts it so that face to makes it what soluble so that your body can get get rid of it. So you need to optimize both face one inveighs to and the dark leafy green vegetables are really good because they provide the beat men's needed for liver detoxification. So you'll often see, you know, these detox diets contain green juices, and it's it's because of that reason that. The green leafy contain deflates, and the beat befits men's that will help us detects via one of the the ways we talk spice through methylation. So you may have heard of, you know, things like M T H F. Aw, jeans. That's quite a lot of people talking about that now. So that kind of governs methylated, which is one of the ways your liver uses to detach fi that's incredibly useful. So if you're listening out there, be sure to get some of those herbs, and maybe we can list those in the show notes 'cause show. Yeah. I've I've also taken milk Thistle as well. I knew it was kind of more for liver support just kind of out of like, I don't know insurance or whatever. But it is that safe to take on a daily basis, or is that kind of only recommended if you think that you are in a highly toxic environment. I think that if you making it as a t and you just kind of drinking a Cup a day. I don't. Really, I, you know, I think there's always talks tea with too much of anything 'cause we work in a home your stasis where it's always a use shape curve. Right. Wet too little is not good too much is not good. So in in terms of supplementation will be a little bit more careful and just kind of be guided with practitioner, but if you making danton Lyon brute or milk Thistle t-, and that's what I do. I don't think I don't really see a problem with that doctor. So maybe like once a week kind of thing. Yeah. So yeah. Maybe a couple of times a week, and you know, sometimes actually make the tea and the made my smoothly with the with the teas blended up with tea, and you know, if you take some. So is not just a Danda deadline route where you can take Dende ally greens that helps deliver detects Faez while grim, and how about I know that you mentioned organic versus not organic and the amount of pesticide in the non organic versus organic do you recommend? I mean, washing your vegetables with a certain type of of wash before you consume them does that help all with removing some of these pesticides or bounds? So, unfortunately, a lot of the compounds is kind of built in to the vegetable or the fruit itself. So washing studies show that Washington doesn't really get rid of it. But I think that if you what I think Dr Greg O has video showing that if you kind of make a wash with apple cider vinegar and baking soda you can remove more than if it's just with water alone. So I think I can definitely you. If you have to buy conventionally farmed that may be a good way to kind of reduce the the chemical content. So so apple cider vinegar, and what was the other ingredient and baking soda making soda, and we can link up that I can find that video we can link in the show notes as well. And the thing, and I think we early will talking about heavy metals and one of the most common questions, I get is with rice off neck. I don't know whether you've come across that yesterday for your career discussed the importance of maybe soaking our food, or maybe how to rinse rice properly and all these things to eliminate that risk of ingesting those heavy metals. Yeah. So I think to start off with making sure that you buy the type of rise that's going to be shown to contain less. Awesome. Because probably a good place to start so California. This the I think the Lotus brand is has lower off neck content. So that's probably a good place to start. And then that they have shown that Brown rice contains more arsenic than white. But when you compare the absorption, the absorption of Osmanovic from Brown rises lower than white rice because as you digesting it the Austin actually stays in the husk, and you kind of poop it out rather than absorb it. So so I still eat Brown rice. But the way I cook it is I wash it couple of times. And then I will cook it with a water to rice ratio of about six to one. So you traditionally the way we I, you know, Chinese people cook rice will recoup it in a right? Ice cook a new measured evac same exact amount of water where ones it's cooked. It's kind of perfectly fluffy and has no access water. But now, I'm telling everyone to cook it kind of a different way because the Ossining actually comes out into the cooking water during the cooking process. So if you cook it with a launch water to rice ratio, the asna actually comes out, and then you actually want to throw that waterway drain your rice. And then you can put it back into the pan and kind of fluff it up whatever you want to do with it or just eat it. And that can reach us the alternate content quite significantly I believing rice or cook rice wrong the whole time. Do you cook it like with the exact amount of just leave? Yeah. Yeah. In my mind is normally to one like two parts water one part rice to drain. Yeah. Definitely not six to one. Yeah. So I think that you know, you go to be kind of practical about it and pragmatic view, you're going to eat out. You know, whatever how however they cooked to you. Right. But it's kind of to do with how much exposure you've call and other foods, you're eating eating a lot of you know, luckily for us, we're hopeful palm bay. So we don't eat chicken, which is another big source of off necks, they feed chicken feed contains off neck because if fattened the chicken up, so if you eat, chicken and eggs. You're going to expose yourself to a lot more as Nick than if you just eating rice. So I think you go to the overall diet, and you know, I wouldn't be overly obsessed with it. I just try to reduce exposure, why can without being kind of becoming neurotic and just obsessing abou- Ono this has to margin. I is isn't a Connie dine. Then you can you might develop other problems. That's very good point talking about the relativity of the levels of heavy metals at your consuming versus other things that may that may have much much higher amounts. But they don't get the same kind of exposure that exact something like the clean label project has done. It basically said that plant proteins have are like seventy five percent of plant proteins tested positive for for lead. And they contain like much higher amounts of cadmium, lead, arsenic, again, it's because naturally the soil and the things in which these cry. Are grown the that's a natural component of soil or these medals. Right. So of course, it's going to be more heavily concentrated in these products. But that could be a very small amount relatively to other foods at your consuming. Yeah. Maybe on the protein powder scale it it ranks higher. But things like you mentioned like the amount of chicken people are eating that could contain much higher levels of of heavy metal the plant protein powder would be insignificant compared to those amounts even being like if you mentioned like what is it? The the the nitro means or any you five G C hetero, cyclic means or whatever they're called. I always get mixed up with the names even being exposed to meet and things that are cooked their absorbed through your skin. So you don't even have to ingest it through through orally you can just be in the vicinity of barbecue. Or maybe a restaurant. That's cooking. Quite frequently. And you can still be exposed to these these these exactly as a means that are highly carcinogen exactly, and we are inhaling heavy metals on a time because you know, if you live in an urban area, you'll inhaling museum from colleagues ause this, you know, leading Ed does this heavy metals into SO thing, we just go to be pragmatic, and we also have to look take everything into context and look at the human body because we all we all designed to talks fine. Get rid of a lot of these chemicals. If we make sure that we're not loading an overloading, I'll bodies and taking a whole pump based is probably the best way to make sure that your overall chemical exposure and heavy metal exposure as low because you know, we're getting rid of seafood, which is a big source of heavy metals, dioxins PC. B's and plastics. And we're getting rid of eggs chicken, you know, me which all contain all of these chemicals. I I would say that all if you hold aplomb as you actually starting with a fairly clean still slate. Now, the may be talks button Bill top from years before you know, when you were eating indefinitely for me. I'm not saying Yunos, I used to eat that dia, which I thought was healthy, you know, and cheese as a lot of aluminum in ever example. So I think slowly though, and and I don't know whether you've noticed not. Might apologies. Getting rid of these toxins. Slow Lezo damore years. I've become the gun the better I've been feeling and almost like with every year. I'm getting more energy. A you. Do you feel that too? Of course, I feel this is this is exactly why promote the plant based diet reply a hate diet lifestyle plant based lifestyle. To two people through my social channels is because I just want people to feel as good as I feel. I feel mostly all the time. And I know how I felt whenever I was even vegetarian and I felt good compared to how I felt immediately after eliminating dairy Ned the gastrointestinal discomforts that I was constantly feeling whenever I was eating cheese and drinking way protein shakes compared to cut that out and not only physically, but like mentally as well, it was like a huge just a huge difference in the general overall like normal feeling, and that's why I tell people it's like just try to cut it out for three weeks like three weeks. I feel like is enough time for your body to adapt and kind of detoxify and allow yourself to reach a new level of baseline just general feeling you know, and you can see that you've been living your entire life at this lower this low. Our baseline, and you can elevate that once you cut these things out of your diet, you feel better overall more energy, you can sleep better just every every single bodily process just becomes enhanced. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. And that's exactly what I experienced myself is I was living in that brain fog, and just, you know, drinking three or four cups of coffee and thinking that that's just normal. But that's actually not normal. You can feel a little more my talented, and you know, nowadays, I don't even need to drink coffee to to wake up in the morning. I just I just wake up, and I would drink a green tea because I like the taste and the health benefits associated with it. But I'm not dependent on it for the caffeine. I I love that. And I love the the kind of tips that you told us throughout this entire podcast about how to kind of identify which foods may contain these toxins, but also just the general tip of of. I'm just choosing to eat more plant based while reduce your risk of exposure. And could greatly affect just your general well-being immediately and again in the future as well. Which is why I always try to stress that. Yes, you know, you might see short term results by doubting plant based diet. But the the real results are experienced long-term. You know, when you're sixty years old, and you're not experiencing the same kind of health issues that your your peers may be simply by choosing to change what you ate whenever you are in your younger years. Exactly. Because food food is information taught jeans, right? They tell which genes to be switched on in the field of epigenetics where you cannot should switch on and off your genes. We know that genes don't Detaille dictate your futures. So what is what you doing every day like you lifestyle? That's actually switching on and off, gene. So even if inherited genes that predispose. Due to halt disease. You can rectify that. And that's and that's why I've kind of renewed my passion in medicine, I really was becoming so disillusion and thinking hold on a minute. This is not rewarding for me anymore. I don't want to just prescribe pills and just be kind of like a sales agent for the pharmaceutical company any wall, I want to actually, you know, delve deep into why people getting sick in the first place in most of the time. It's it's lifestyle. You know, what that putting at the end of the folk it's how little much exercise that doing. It's how stressful alive de leading an and what a thinking ahead, and whether the kind of interacting with with friends and socializing all of those factors actually dictate your health allot more than your genes. And I'm so grateful now, the I've kind of come out of the conventional model and be able to realize that these factors we can modify and an in a way, it's so empowering, right. It's it's so I don't know like patients used to come to me, and they don't look excited when I give them a treatment because it's gonna lie. Oh, also in I'll be telling them. Yeah. You've got diabetes, and you probably going to have it for live. But actually, that's not true. If it's not true. And we've you know, lots of studies have shown that. That you can you know, you may not be up to reverse diabetes, completely if you've had it for a long time, but in in early stages, you can definitely you can definitely reverser and if not reverse it completely you can reduce the amount of medicine that you're going to need to take. Yeah. And I think you kind of touched on this just now about talking about how the. You know, the traditional style of medicine is is symptom symptom based you treat symptoms you don't necessarily address the big the root issue, which is almost like putting a bandaid on a broken arm and by using more integrative lifestyle changes. Then you almost you relinquish the control from the doctor to to the patient. Right. And you that feeling of having control of of deciding whether or not you wanna feed or nurture this disease or destroy it just by lifestyle changes is very powerful. So I think that's that's really powerful that you mentioned that. Yes, exactly. I think you know, having that power back. So that, you know, relying on doctors to make you actually stopped us. We have a winner. He'll you know, we don't make people. But a you as the patient yoga make yourself at a wages hit to kind of guide you along the way and hopefully. With lifestyle factors. The actually addressed of route coals rather than you know, just band-aiding with more and more drugs. Now, you said you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink it. Why? Exactly. Yeah. Now, the they all like, I I don't know about you. But there are a lot of people who tried vegan diet and all who whole on base. And they say, oh, they feel really tired, and they kind of go back to eating meat. So I think the important thing is that make sure that if you're going to transition to Hofu plump as diet that is a well planned one that you know, you all supplementing because they all. Nutrients that you cannot get on a whole plant based diet that if you ensuring that all your micronutrients, are optimal. Then you absolutely thrive. Everyone will thrive on Hofu plant based diet. I love that. And it is a lifestyle change, it's not necessarily a short term diet. So it is important to do your research and kind of understand fully what you're getting into. And that is why I think a lot of people just don't stick with it because they're not really addressing the needs of what a diet or what like nutritionally what they need and understanding where those sources come from. And to me, that's the fun part. But for most for some people it becomes overwhelming. So that's why always, you know. I'm not a very binary when I promote veganism is not necessarily one or nothing. It is. Yes, more. So how you transition into doing it in a manner in which will be successful for you for your long term success to ease into it. If you have to do, you know weekly or monthly elimination of a certain product than by all means. That's that's totally fine. Don't let anybody any vegan or any anybody. Tell you that. That's not a valid or. You know, a good approach. Absolutely. And I think that that's that's a great way because even on a kind of biological and physiological level. We know that the gut microbiome of Plum based people people on a whole plump as dia is very different to that of people who eat meat, so and you know, there's a lot of scientific literature now showing that what what's on your plate doesn't actually translate to. What's circulating around in your body? In terms of nutrition law, actually depends on what bacteria you've got in your got that's digesting that food. And then that got the backup bacteria's actually making the nutrients that we need from the food that we feed so we actually feeding bacteria when we eat and they're making nutrients for us. So if you have a different microbiome and the microbiome. For example, heavy meat diet. And you suddenly go one hundred percent plump bays. You probably you know, you may not feel grateful while because firstly the bacteria that is needed to generate those nutrients that you need might not be as it takes time for the macrobiotic to adopt. And also, you know, you this going from a high meat dia to a whole plant based diet. Usually means there's a lot more fiber. And a lot of people do react to that. So. I think so I think listening to your body and actually acknowledging that and not just not giving up in the first week or two thinking on Awam having so many symptoms. It's not for me. You know, I think just understanding and knowing that you Microsoft by going to change for the better and the symptoms usually do go away. And if you'll making show your supplementing, you know, you you will thrive I love that. I love the conversation of microbiome and kind of understanding how this bacteria kind of has interplay with every like, so many bodily functions and how you can learn how to, cultivate, and basically create that environment that healthy environment within yourself to help process, these foods, and and basically just optimize your internal ecosystem. Because I remember talking to Dr Angie, and Dr b which his episode is going to be out, but before this, but they even talk about how you can you can do like fecal transplants or even like microbiome transplants where they they transplanted like rats microbiomes from an unhealthy rat to a healthy rat, and it immediately experienced weight loss and like. These other types of things just because you were able to process the food that you are jesting after switching or having a healthy, gut microbiome. So if you're constantly cultivating this this good healthy bacteria, then you're going to optimize. How you absorb nutrients. How you process things your your hormone optimization everything as opposed to kind of feeding this. Or or nurturing this unhealthy microbiome where you're constantly feeding it inflammatory foods and food that inhibit your processes? So that it also is just a testament to to to the plants it self in the power plant. So if you don't get anything out of his episode, just eat more plants and not only will it prevent you from exposure to heavy metals in certain toxins, but it can also help, cultivate, a healthy microbiome. And then it's kind of comes full circle to because it's got bacteria that help us detoxify lot of those chemicals and got bacterias involved in metabolism as you alluded to. So the heavy metals the client assays, this bacteria that breaks down life assay. So making sure you'll microbiome is optimized is I think it's absolute and we're going to see I think a big powered I'm shift in. How medicine is Don because there is so much research. Coming out of you know, what the microbiome does for us that you know. I I think that people are trying to. Link certain species with such an health outcomes, but it's going to be a very complicated area for sure, but I think that the general direction is that, you know, the more diverse upon foods you eat the better your microbiome. That's what we know. For now for sure. Exactly. And I think we're just getting to the end of our of our conversation. And Dr Chan I just wanted to thank you so much for coming on and sharing your knowledge. And I I learned so much on this episode. And I know that everybody else has learned so much. Where can we find you? Where can we get in contact with you? If anybody has further questions, so I have a website. It's WWW dot plateful health P L A, T, F, U L health dot com. I'm also on Instagram and my handle there is a plateful dot health and through my website. You can contact me or just DM E ON Instagram. Awesome. Thank you so much. So if you're listening be sure to follow her she does post really great information lifestyle, integrative changes that you can kind of implement right after reading her post. I knew I've done it sometimes too. So be sure to not be sure to give her a follow. And thank you so much again for being on on generation v and for those that are listening. If you want to revisit the show notes Bashir to go to vegan, fitness dot com slash generation v to see this episode show, notes and many more. Thank you. Thank you. My. Hey, guys. Thank you so much for listening to the generation v podcast. I hope you enjoy it. And I really appreciate you taking the time out of your day and making an effort dilemma, happier and healthier life. If there was anything mentioned in this episode that you want to. Revisit you can find in the show notes over at vegan, fitness dot com. While you're there, if you join the mailing list, you will also get exclusive discounts, free workouts, and vegan recipes you can also follow me at Instagram where also post recipes, motivation and daily workouts. And of course, I would love it. And really appreciate it. If you left me a positive review on IT tunes. But most importantly, I really ask you guys to share this with one or two friends that would really get something out of this particular episode. Thank you so much.