Space Jam with James Newman
Hey, everybody get up this time. The slam. Got a real jambo down, welcome to the Space Jam as James the day at the Space Jam. What. Those little pip squeak stress turned super casts there. The pup pod, Sturt suffering. Fuck attach their palm. God wasn't barris. I said it was giving Mira saying I did and I committed, and that's all that matters was good. The mash up was great. It was great professional. It was enjoyable. No, no, you did great. I'll tell you something right off the bat. I found out recently and this is gonna. This is going to weigh heavily on my performance for the entirety of this episode. Okay, sure. I found out I'm not gonna name names friend of mine when in for big time, Hollywood general Meden at a big time animation company, and they offhandedly referenced our podcast. What in the meeting? And she texted me and said like, hey, it's going around and I was like, I'm furious. Why am I not being cast in all of those cartoon shows? Now you're you're, you're putting your marker. Now I'm seeing if you're listening to this podcast and your animation world heavyweight. Storm into an office and say, I just heard a man, do three different looney tunes characters perfectly well, those jobs though, that's like you have to die exit one of those gigs. Right? Like if you're Daffy tape. The context on this. I'm going to get into it so hard. Also, I did a bad job, but all those characters. My name's Griffin. I'm Davidson. This is blank check with Griffin, David. It is podcast from Agassi's retro massive success early on their careers, and guess there's a blank checks, make whatever cushy pro pressure project shea once for Cratia pressure project. And sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they jam beanie. Sure. But this is what we do sometimes in between miniseries a little pallet cleanser, we, we offer a little sherbert to the audience and a thing we've been doing this in the last year, the family choices you brought your brother Joey. Simpson, I brought my sister Romley Newman. Then we had the siblings unite drew Radha to episode that was rated one of indie wires. Best podcast of the year. That's true. And that is when my brother came to me, I rate. And said, see, I'm out of brother, right? So everyone is out of siblings? Yes. We're now done. This is the end and only child and only child. Yeah, get my dad on. Yeah, I swear twenty nineteen Roberts gonna make an appearance, Robert's choice. Well, now now we got him in on the graphic design front. I think he's got some skin in the game, but but our guest today comes to me and he goes, first of all, Romley cannot appear on the show third time before appear once yes. Secondly, if I get on the show, you're gonna hit single digits on the indie wireless te. And that was the challenge thrown. Right, right. We're gonna jump. He wore out chart, right? So I guess someone who's been talked about in the show from the very beginning. True because so much the shows about the context of one. We saw these movies too, and this is someone who I saw most movies with for the first ten or twelve years of my life. Why are you mentioning this? Why am I mentioning this is because you guys are context contact shirt shirt and our guests, longtime brother of mine. James Newman. AK James, e when I tell the stories, I often call you James because that was of the time period and you haven't gone James in probably fifteen years now I ever went by Jamesy Jamesy a lot around the hall Jamesy. I wasn't the one. I don't wanna make it sound like I was the one leading that charge. What's the difference between you? Two. Three years. Okay. Sure. I think our parents called you Jamesy allots I feel like when our mother like filled out forms for you, it would always be James with an I at the end. Like she kind of. I know he just, I think she always from my memory. It was always James. I. Which felt very, that was her kinda euro touch maybe. And then there was also the thing of changing your middle name. My yeah, James, middle name got changed when he was like five because my mom decides she liked another middle team better. Don't you have like a couple of minutes, like twenty seven middle names and James two twenty seven, right? James had one and then five years later she was like, this was my backup name for James and then made it his new middle name and then use it as a nickname most, which is my real middle name is Myron. Okay. Named after a dead relative right. Right. I think that's the subtext there. I think my middle name got a little Jewish. I think it's fine. I was changed Milo which is a little Milo minor binder right from the phantom toll. I think that was really into the phantom tollbooth when I was reading it. My mom was always like, I almost name James that. And then suddenly it became James. Milo Newman. And there was like this, this rewriting of history, but you kept your initial. It wasn't. I think that's why she was able to do the sort of like Indiana Jones, you know, idle swap. Yeah. Thinking maybe that Milo was somehow short for Myron. Right here. I didn't know right technically for Michael, but like not really. Our mother likes rewriting history and pretending that never happened. So that was one of her moves where I think she kept the story kind of so that you could think like, oh, maybe Milo is just a new version of my middle name as opposed to a new name and tirelessly. But when we were growing up, our father worked a lot. And so like weekends were very much time with the boys. Right. I feel like with your dad. Yes, right. It was like, okay. Perception was that he was working a lot. I don't know if my memory is he would work all day. He would come home and he'd be really stressed out. He would take full. We'd like every morning time with him. And then when he came home, he'd be so stressed out. And then he would like have a mug of wine with ice cubes in it, and then very quickly retired with the couch to watch political TV. Interesting. Like the news? Yes. Right. But the weekends were like, that was the time where it's like you take them out. Right. We did a lot of we did a lot of stuff to the three of us didn't allow. Right. And I was the big movie kid. And you were really into sports? Yeah. Our dad worked in their industry and kind of resented, and he loves sports, which was what he wanted to be working in. So he had like a foot in each and I feel like our weekends were always sort of as oscillating between like, okay, here's a sports thing that grips lesson to, here's a movie that James lesson movies more than I like sports sample weekend might be. We go to the all star sports cafe in Times Square. And then. We go see move, right. I'm gonna get a little, you know, and sure not land Griffin could eat the chicken fingers. Trying to get a balance of thing. We both played like little league like weekend stuff. You did soccer for a lot longer, but it was like, oh, we're both playing lowly baseball. The maybe we get to go the comic bookstore afterwards. Yes, it was always like sort of like a peace accord that had to be weighed on the weekends. She balanced, but this movie became like a huge life. Feel like this movie is a big formative thing in our relationship because this was one of the first times I remember something feeling totally equal in and of itself. That's the idea here. Picking the film were discussing this was like your favorite movie for a number of years? Yeah, I think just the whole thing, the movie, the soundtrack, right? I mean, that's this is like the most effective piece of branding and the history of studio filmmaking. And famously this movie made a billion dollars merchandising. That's crazy, which is crazy for one film and not a franchise, but it was just like Warner Brothers at this point to franchise. That was the thing I was saying Warner Brothers was following the Disney example and trying to like hyper monetize the looney tunes in the way that Disney had with everything. And this was like peak WBZ store, which was a place also go out if we were trying to counter weekends. Right? So that like the looney tunes, this is when they start to be on t shirts and you have like hip hop bugs and all that was big kid to get the sort of like long t shirt wanted the jackets. Remember the like with like I wanna Marvin the Martian, Jim, Jackie. Marvin is Marvin the Martian, the coolest we had the Mon, yes, we had a Marvin mog. That was a big thing was like, I would get like boring dad's stuff for my dad for his birthday with looney tunes on it. So I'd be like, here's a stapler in Silvester or I think that was a letter opener. He had the Marvin mug. There were like all those kinds of thing. Ben I should mention is wearing a denim jacket that is only missing the looney tunes WB store, ROY -tory, but otherwise looks seen him turn around so I don't know defensive on something barnyard Dawg you could go deep cut interest. I'm pure Mugsy purist, Marvin baby are task love. Tat obvious. Has your favorite too? Yeah, good for I feel him he makes a mess you were also he's aggressive but not mean I was gonna say somewhat TASR. Like as a child, you were very like, you had a lot of energy and you were very physical. True? And you always were sort of like, did. The joke I make is that when you were like child, if there was like something boring going on, you would start playing sports against an imaginary opponents like you like this move or some or or babysitters? Right. I mean, yes, there was someone to play against you would play against and you had like ballet. Did you have the game? Yes, I did any other. I mean, I play a lot of MBA Jim. Let's just why I'm Jay NBA live. You. Remember Michael Jordan was not an MBA live to nor an MBA jam. Right? Yeah. No, he would not license. He held out, yes. He was in. We had the Space Jam computer game that was mostly like an MBA jam cloned. But then in the half times or in between quarters, there were many games where you played his way night and you would play that. And then I'd wait for the way night and I go, okay, Hammy the keyboard. And then it would be like Wayne Knight trying to find Michael secret stuff or whatever. It's really cute. Yeah, but that was available on dos, right? It was a dusk game, and it was pretty much just a straight NBA jam type thing. That's a big big part of the except with cartoon care. Right. That's a big part of the merchandising. I think to Michael Jordan was so the most merchandised athlete of the nineties, right? And the looney tunes were so merchandise that it was like, we're going to put them together and this is just money, this paints money. The surprise here though is probably the soundtrack, right? This is like the Garden State of sports mood. This soundtrack, you know, I mean, we can. Look up the charts, but. Yeah, this I feel like this is probably one of the ten best selling of the nineties, truly. Right. No, don't be crazy. Went six times platinum, which is pretty good. Yeah, nowhere near. I mean, there are a lot of diamond albums Oko Fugger top two. I feel shame with huge. Yes, huge album was huge. It was huge, but I feel like for you guys, it was like seismic. It was like definitive. I understand. I get great because we were talking last night, David, you and I and preparation for this episode. We were seeing bad times at the l. Roya which we both agree pretty good time at room. Decent fun time little little long, but like an enjoyable enough time at the El royale and you're like, it's weird. James like space, sham that much because he must have hated Jordan. I, I asked if James and I can ask James directly now was a Knicks fan because I was talking about how much I hated Michael Jordan. When I was a kid. Because I was a die hard Knicks fan and he was that my he was the monster. I hated him. We run into him every year in the playoffs and he would destroy the Nancy Meyers of his time. I was in Knicks fans still am, but I was four years old when this movie came out. I understand. I think when you're that age and you're a sports fan, it's just you're not, you're not hating? No, I I had had because I was ten when this movie came out and I had had like probably watch started watching the Nixon lengthy early nineties, like three or four, solid years of like Jordan, just leading like, you know, like I never. I always obviously like I knew he was good. I wasn't out there saying like Michael Jordan overrated. Look at the numbers. I was just, I just couldn't stand him. And so I would. Instead why? What what I was saying was when LeBron Kim around sharing the next decade? Yeah, I was like, I'm not missing out on this guy. I want to enjoy exactly. I can't. Spend another. This is the NBA is my sport. I can't spend another generation hating. It's best player. I mean, you were young at the time and Jordan was like superman where it was just exciting to see a guy. I mean, he was Jordan to my mind is only comparable to Ali in my Americans premium. Yeah. I'm trying to think of anyone who is LeBron my argument is I don't care about sports and I cared about Michael Jordan at the time because it felt like a seismic cultural event when he was at the top of his game and LeBron is like, everyone knows that guy's cool and he's good at basketball. Yeah, I mean, it's hard. It's hard to compare to because you know to that point, like when I was four, you know, I'm a big sports fan, but I I wasn't like looking like, oh, well, like Jordan actually, like shooting the three. Not that good. Yeah, he was a superhero, right, right. And so it's like the perspective on the Broncos so much different. The air thing was one of the best pieces of branding of all time because it literally made him seem the world. Meta human this movie is playing off, but the other thing is the fact. That he was the first guy to license himself like crazy spokesman for thousand things. It was like, even if you didn't watch sports or like me and you sat in the background and asked when the game was going to be over, he was so omnipresent and there weren't other athletes doing that as much. There was no cynicism when I turn on TV. Now I see a bunch of spokes people who I don't know, and someone in the room is like, oh, that guy's like the fifth most successful like defensive player in the NBA and I'm like, I don't know, don't you know he's the spokesman for Coca Cola Oeser of endorsement thing. Right? Well, the as more important now? Yes. Well, like Jordan helped bring that along right where it's now right kind of seismic. But the other thing is you have traditionally always been. I wanna say contrarian, but you never love the dominant player the dominant team. The the thing I say like define your personality when you were younger is like when you were in middle school going to school in New York City, you were like a kid who wear red socks shirts, and hats all the time I learned to to hate the Yankees. Everybody loved the. You know, I mean, if you consider yourself a real sports fan, like it's easy at that age to be like, oh, that thing that everyone thinks is good, right? You know, I got news for you, but you always liked underdogs. He likes off the beaten path. Your favorite team in any franchise and the history of sports is the Tennessee volunteers, right? Like you've never been the superstar guy, but Jordan at this age, like you used to stick your tongue out all the time because you want to be like Michael Jordan still do right. It's like a learn habit. It's like a Ryan goslings, like Brooklyn accent thing. You try to affect that now you can't drop. I can't. I was, you know, taking notes for this when you concentrate, you stick your tongue, right? Yeah. And that was like it was that he was the the guy, you know, he's the guy and for me, you know, our mother is very overprotective in terms of what we could watch, and she thought all current day cartoon shows in the early nineties too violent and cynical, I mean, yeah. So most of what she let me watch were loony tunes cartoons, which are the most. Violent and cynical things ever made they are. They're also yeah, they're, they're like shooting someone in the face and going thinking deserve that. Yeah, but I watched them all the time because that was all Cartoon Network had so like Bugs Bunny was kinda my Michael Jordan, and I was like a weird kid who would mimic all of bugs Bunny's behaviors like there's I might have told this story on episode, but there was, we kidding me. They're one of the racist Bugs Bunny shorts that they don't show any more. Where a bunch of really uncomfortable African tribesmen characters try to cook him alive or there's a bit where they lure him into the big altern ECOWAS they're like, oh, it's a bath. Sure. And he does this whole routine busier bath routine. I would have to. I would only get into the bath replicating, I would have new awful out the window been like, look, we got another kid like this one will work out here is John. Even if that was more abnormal, replicating the behavior of our adults who were Bugs Bunny and Michael Jordan, right? Except yours was you couldn't take a bath without being pugs putting a racist, correct. Nine was a successful American male judging. I've written some bad ass as okay to you from the presence. So this game ninety six. Yes. You're saying you were for I was breath. What month did this movie? Just Obama member. So I was, you know, it was getting. Five, seven going on eight Koi storied come out year before and had been my. That was your movie. You really? I like the cinema now. Right. Always a movie Kip, but it was just like, oh, I own this now, and I feel like there was the run up to the. I remember we still shared a bedroom at this point in time, and you had the Space Jam poster on the wall months before the movie came out. I knew it was in like a Sports Illustrated for kids or whatever, and you put it up and you just point to it and go like, that's gonna be mine. Let's go, we're ready. You were saying you didn't remember seeing theaters, but we one hundred percent? I didn't. I think my my my memory is just watching the VHS, but I'm, I'm sure we did. Where did you see it? I want to say we saw at the Lincoln square. Maybe I can't vividly. I think it was maybe the Lincoln square, but it it was like a big big deal. And then it was like a six month frenzy of just buying anything Space Jam related. They had us. They had us on the clothes and the action figures for this movie between basketball and racism. There's a lover in a movie about slavery. Let's admit this is. About. I'm blinking. We end slavery assure right. Well, indentured they literally say sleep. Well, they can say when they wanted to smart incorrect myself, Elmer Fudd says, swaffer. He does sell us into swaffer, I guess. So it's very, we'll talk about the just gonna, say the action figures of this film. It was like you'd get a basketball player and a looney toon. Larry, like we get the parents of by for only split the packaging. You know there was like something of this was a breaking of the bread for two kids who usually like different things. Yeah, I saw this film at the Barbican cinema, which was an a theater in London. Okay. So you're on holiday? No, you're not doing the bit again. You're correct or not seeing the bit because we have retired. It's up in the rafters long which earns jersey. So I just wanna say you were on holiday, and I hope you agree with that. You're just doing the big. I'm not doing the bit. You are bits retired bit was that you would say I was on vacation if I brought up England, that was a core part of the bit. You're just doing it which is saying holiday, it's different. It's not part of the retired bit. Then have to give you a yellow car. Yeah, it's enough enough already. I think we'll find a new angle on it, but yeah, holidays, Jesus Christ. Okay, David, you, you seem like something's troubling. What do you mind speaking on that? I've just been thinking about talks base. It's this online therapy company. Let's see message a license therapist from anywhere at any time. It's just really been weighing on me how all you need is a computer with an internet connection. The talks base mobile app to improve your mental health, even if you've had trouble making time for it in the past. Interesting. Can you expand on that? Well, so if you can't imagine like fitting therapy into your life, like, you know, obviously, rather than having to go to an office to make appointments. Cut out time in your schedule for with talk space. You just have to send you therapist a message. You can get something off your chest whenever you need to. You can talk about everyday challenges at work. Talk about life. There's no extra commutes, no leaving the offices, no judgments, and it's just about venting. Your innermost thoughts or. Whatever you wanna talk about and what is Joanna think of this. I mean, we've talked about it and number sheet. She picks their practical everyday strategies for stress management of living, happier life that like having therapists can help you with and talk space just like connects you somewhat to talk to right away rather than having to carve out a specific hour in the week to go and see them at an office. And do you feel like when you're talking to talk face professionals, you wish that you had a promo code? Well, the talks platform has two thousand more than two thousand license. Their fish who are experiencing addressing life challenges that we all face. So to match with perfect therapist for a fraction of the price of traditional therapy, you just go to talk space dot com slash check and you use the code check to get forty five dollars off your first month and show your support for the show that's check promo code check, talks base dot com slash check. And do you think this has anything to do with a sense of sexual inadequacy? Certainly, I mean, that's topic number one. Cool. That's our time. I saw the barbecue would do like children's screenings every Saturday, and I would go every Saturday, no matter what like sometimes they'd have a new movie. I guess if there was no new movie, they just show like the railway children. This shows the classic movie and I saw this movie. I thought it was good. That was kind of that for me. Yeah. It probably didn't see it again for like ten years. I saw this movie on VHS for the first time on a porch. Those about to say yesterday and on her port, I, it was a porch wasn't really heated. So I remember being kind of a cool autumn afternoon fall porch, but it was the TV like the more she didn't like put the beaches in porch. Video, Jerome house. There's a TV on the porch to horse, your home? No, this is my friend. Tim's house him. Oh, we got into real trouble obvious shots. When I had a friend, we'd like play super Nintendo and Ben had a friendly like rob groceries or whatever. Stiffen to your spokes flew off your American terrorists. Who are we talking about? No, I don't want to say we're not good terms. More interesting. What happened when did you in Tim break apart what? Eight? We got two big fight. Okay. Last year or right after the port. Isn't high school. Okay. Were you like dude, like it's fucked up that you watch movies on a poor, go into about a girl. The Ben Hawes Lee serves about Lola bunny. They clearly store you're setting. This happened right after watching them. No, Lola bunnies. A girl is some subtle references that you can sort of figure it out. I've seen the movie ten times now, and I think I finally figured it out, but other girl, there's so much to her character outside of her gender that sometimes you forget even you, you start not seeing gender. Is this the first gender fluid. This is the first cartoon character? Yeah. How many female looney tunes are. They're very few of the classic any because Tweety is male. I've always thinks that tweeds female voice, not in terms of prominent characters, and this is why Lewis create. There's like granny who owns Silvester in Tweety. I know I meant win granny's in this. You're like, did they literally just. Sort of thing like we kinda need somewhere like yet in. There's witch Hazel who's a sometimes antagonist to Bugs Bunny. I mean, there are no core characters who are female. There were other like petunia pig. They would sometimes introduce porkies girlfriend who is just mostly as a marketing thing, so they could have characters to put on female merchandise. If we had a female, you're thinking of daisy duck. I feel like in the Disney of damn. Yeah, because the Disney would always have the the Minnie mouse. Daisy duck. Right? Like the sort of the female petunia was kind of the daisy of the world below isn't truce for this because when you go to the Warner Brothers store, it'd be a lot of pink Tweety shit because they were like, that's the closest thing we have to a female so low. They were like, we need a girl character, shake my head. Here's the pitch. She's a girl. What's the rest of the pitch? Dad's wanna fuck her because she's the most sexualize is insistent that everyone like drops their jaw. I know she's like Jessica rabbit. Right? But that movie the joke. Is that she's very sexy, right? And also that movie is a little more grown up than this. I mean, no offense Space Jam, but it's not that most grown up movie in the world. Not the most closers. Probably the most closer, my dinner with Andre, all right Space Jam. So we all saw in theaters except for Ben who saw it on a on a porch when a man he would later porch. Jim. Pulling over a girl which loaded bunny not confirmed unconfirmed. Yeah. So this starts with what was. I mean crooked from your favorite scene. I remember you rewinding the opening scene over and over and over again with his dad. It's an important scene. It isn't important scene. Well, it's it is. His motto was be like, Mike, the film starts with basically the message. You know you go back take couple of shots, right? It was an early version of the secret, you know, if you, if you call what you're gonna do in the future and you hit right. Buckets get some shots. The dad played by Paul Walker supervisor in the first two, fast and furious Tom berry. He's like, what. Zillion thing. It was good to see him to he. He's very young and fit in this move. Yes, he he, he's interesting going going, sir. No is pretty veer all and you know, he's got a great scene in like an early west wing. He, you know, he'll pop TV show and just kinda kill a scene. I watch too fast recently, and I was like, why isn't this guy in all the fast and furious movies like he? He's so good as the like, here's the mission, you know, right, right, right. But this film which important context, this movie is like trying to offer a narrative around the death of Michael Jordan's father, Michael Jordan's retirement from basketball into minor league baseball in his return to the NBA like this movies like we're going to come up with a clear alibi that everyone can agree on and this narrative print. The legend describe this is what you'll tell your children. Michael Jordan who, as we know is he's from north. Carolina Wallington. He went to school. You went to the university of North Carolina. The famous legend that he didn't make his high school basketball born in Brooklyn, but yet, right because in his hall of fame speech, he was like, fuck that guy. He like read a laundry list of never wrong him, but isn't it just that he didn't make varsity as a fresh, maybe. So, I mean, he was just forced to. Kids, his age. Is too short as a sophomore. Then he became the star of the junior team, but it was on a team, but his narrative I think was like that rejection probably fueled his mania. I mean, when we were kids, he was just seen as like he was the best. He was a killer Asan. This is the whole thing here too, because part of that alibi they try to provide for Michael Jordan is not just that he was playing, but it was basically he became suburban, right? They're pulling the mini van up to the nice little colonial house. Right? And the kids are running out and none of the kids even know who Michael Jordan is. Right. I mean, the kids are like, oh, it's like, you know, it's Jeffrey's dad, right? Yeah. Right. And the other element to that slacks that the the flat front? Yeah. Dog again, the dogs running out a real statement of intent to open with the with the dad because it's like you're sitting there and as children. We weren't thinking this. But if you watch movies and adult, you're like, this is crazy that they're bringing his dad. Into this film? No. Is reasonably head, right? Right recently died. He was, I wanna get set James Jordan. He was killed in nineteen Ninety-three. So a few years ago he was shot to death by carjackers, like I believe was the official diagnosis of what had happened and then right after that pretty much Michael Jordan retired from basketball right now, winning three championships in a row. The circumstances of his death were always kind of weird. And what has come to light later is Michael Jordan had serious gambling problems for a number of years. All right. And we're going to leave it right. You know the other thing is that perhaps he was encouraged to step away long running MBA conspiracy theory pro. Like, you know, the people like Bill Simmons. We'll talk about right, David Stern, the Commissioner told him, like all this gambling shit. It's gonna come to light like you are essentially banned from the NBA for a couple of years to clean up your. Rose for us because we have our brightest star tarnish. And so he goes off to play baseball, but his the owner of the bulls never cancelled his contract like he was. He was still a bowl sort of minor league, so it's still kind of put mine on because he was bad. Right. Okay. But let's talk around, but this is sort of in because one thing that's immediately clear about the movie is they're, they're gonna shit on Michael Jordan's baseball. They're writing everyone laughing running. The catcher is telling him what pitches are coming. I mean, they meant like. I couldn't get catch up to that one. One of the things die laughing at as a kid was the bit where he gets back into the dugout and all the guys telling him how good his strikeout was. When you fail, you make film. I wish I could feel like you might know ESPN produced documentary about Michael Jordan playing baseball in which it is posited that Michael Jordan actually. Displayed a fair bit of promise as he was a, you're absolutely right. He played baseball and hit home runs baseball. It's true. He was horrible. It was not even. I mean, I don't know. I mean, my impression is that he was not even like some hotshot baseball prospect out of high school. I know not. So I mean, because a lot of air was his dad had always wanted him to play a lot of athletes. We'll get drafted to play baseball at high school and gopro another sport. And maybe you know, they'll sort of flirt with baseball later in life or something like that. That was not the case here. I mean, he was basically saying this extraordinary athleticism that I have in the strive. Could that translate boat Jackson? Was he before. Right around then he was before, but it was. Yeah, just I mean I went to always said the Brown would have been a good running back or whatever. Like you know, he he's probably got the by for football, something signing back. Maybe not running back but wasn't sure it wasn't a hit on him. Also, the strike zone was tough with him because he was so tall, that's that's the that perspective. It sort of crazy because he, Michael Jordan on a basketball court doesn't seem that long as part of his appeal. He's shooting right. But he you're right. I don't wanna show 'em too much. I mean the numbers numbers hundred AA. He hadn't played baseball in two hundred three homers and fifty one Rb blitz too because the narrative is that he started hitting a lot better towards the end of thing. So, yeah, you know, maybe he would have figured it out, but he was also like thirty one. This is what is trying to do. I know this laughing hysterically because I'm sitting here silently. I just think. I just wonder how that conversation went when they were developing this movie where they were like, are we allowed to just kind of make fun of the baseball thing or not? He obviously said, have that right off offer my theory s. Okay. So we all agree without drawing larger conclusions that he was at a time where his image was in danger, right? No, no, no, no. I'm saying in terms of and terms of the stuff that didn't become public that there was seniors to personal life that could have. Okay. So so in a sense he in retrospect, twenty years later but have ceased to become no exact my that we all know. But his career would have been five one. No, but in nineteen ninety-five, Michael Jordan releases the greatest press release in the history of press release. Two words. I'm back literally the whole world belts down with happiness. All they wanted was for him to be back. And like when he came back, it was like, it was so huge. Everyone was still worshipping at the feet of Michael Jordan and you let me off her my hypothesis which doesn't a gate what you just said. I mean, it was yes. Go on, okay, gambling. Stuff swirling around, right. They go, hey, maybe step away for a little bit. Uh-huh. So much of his image is based in him as a spokesperson that he can't totally disappear off the grid for a little time. So it's like, right, so it's like let me move to a different sport running, stay in the news cycle be discussed in this kind of way. Try to get my life back together, a little more clean it up. So I come back to basketball when I come back to basketball, people are going to be twice as excited as when I was previously planned possible that you know also I would like to just I'm not saying this is accurate, but to put out the narrative. The most generous narrative possible, Michael Jordan. This is someone who you know, did not have was successful as a player, but did not have a lot of postseason success early on in his career. They never beat the pistons, right? He is a fanatic. Of course, doesn't sleep at that time. I say Tom Marrs. Yeah. The bad boys. Say, man, Rodman was definitely on was grant grant. Yes, grants? Yes. No Grant Hill that was great. Yes. Shirt. The finding finally, right in ninety one breaks through the pistons. Finally, he, he gets the mountaintop wins the title we all know this. David. I can just keep winning titles and then his dad dies, and it's just like, you know what? Maybe he knows all this is one possible. Maybe it goes along. If I if I keep going now I'm not going to be able to hit my level because at up just competing with yourself, he do time say his dad's murder was part of it. And then later I have a little bit of gambling can give you go on competing with yourself and you competing with history? Yes, he's got to be a ten all the time. There's a canny bit of brand management here in terms of making sure he retains his value. Is it maybe took Coby Bryan about six months after he possibly raped a woman back in ads and yes, you'd be top then he is was not Michael Jordan as much as he close enough. Emulated, Michael Jordan. He was not Michael Jordan. I think the big thing was they didn't even want things getting out. I think he, I think he saved a haircut, no pun intended, Mckee, saved any so. Crumbled. I mean, he was famous for their so many stories, and there's about to be this ESPN serve OJ Simpson in the style of the OJ. Simpson thing like ten hour documentary about Gordon, I imagine is going to apparently has full access to him and we'll maybe delve a little more into this stuff with Hitler. My second one hours just on the Hitler mustache. Yeah, but like NBA players, play cards all the time, especially on the planes. They like to play cards. And if you play cards with him, he would just be like mercilus like there was just no friendliness. He just wanted to annihilate every it for, you know, in the context of this film, he's also famous for having ruin Muggsy Bogues jump shot once calling him a midget as was about to shoot and muggy and wanna shoot baseball. The bidding. These nice. Done shooting that scared me so much. I'm not gonna get in that position, but that's why it was kind of amazing that the time the reputation was like Michael Jordan, I'd buy underwear from Sweden. Easiest part of that tiny important point to be made? He is. He's probably the last athlete where there would not be a simultaneous counter narrative. Oh, I heard from someone who that was not out. That's the only reason I offer my hypothesis because I think there's no way he could've lost everything, but he was so at the top in terms of, as you said, competing with himself, if he steps away, he make sure that the excitement only grows when he comes back rather than just having a couple of seasons where he is plateauing towing top. It worked Tim growing and the other good for his yes to take that Steph away. And then come back. Everyone was just like, oh my God, he's bad. Thank God. Like, you know, he had started getting spotted at casinos which is when like they were he famously spotted at casinos for like important? Yeah, not not even. I think it was like a playoff game and their stories. Now that people tell where they're like, I once one million and a half dollars for him from him on the golf course. Like he would like make bets per poll, but he's he's very wealthy. He's one of the wealthiest people alive who's quite wealthy. The other thing I was gonna say, though is I think part of the pitch of this movie is okay. So now he's back Michael's bigger than ever. Ever. We wanna make a movie to explain that whole time periods sell it as part of this family man. Why did he leave the NBA because he loved his dad's so much, and he made a problem. He wanted to buy minivan and he was back home and he was with the kids and all of that. It was all about the family, right? It was all about the fam- but the other part is the first thirty minutes of this movie are really focused on the baseball in the Jordan. It's all Jordan. I forgot how much it is just sort of like of the Aira studio sports comedy before the looney tunes come in where it's like, let's make major league with him failing, but he's an underdog and it's kind of sweeten uplifting, right? So that because he looked like a shitty baseball player because he was the most dominant NBA player of all time when he showed up in baseball, and he was pretty good. It looked good. He was we already it was. It was impressive. He wasn't good, could play baseball. My point of minor though if they make the movie charges like, oh, it's like nice and sweet that he tried to play bass mail. He tried really hard. It sells it as he never had a dip. He was always the. I even when he wasn't dominated on a league, he was the best guy. And can I say something? I think if you shut this movie off thirty minutes in you say, what movies are you gonna make nice. I think he's really good, Greece thirty pointing at me with you. Good. I think he's good movie. Some people like when LeBron just announce that he's making space, do I saw some snarky tweets along the lines of like, well, he's definitely a better actor Michael Jordan. Now, I think I agree with that because LeBron was very good in trainwreck like he definitely legitimate good AC. He's obviously got. But like I do feel like Michael Jordan's reputation in this movie is that he is stiffer bad or what you know, kind of. I think it flips it when he's acting with pizza, impossible. Officially ninety six. What was it like? You know, we'll talk actors who have bellyflopped as hard doing these types of like movies like that. Like you watch the first Garfield movie and no one knows how to touch Garfield shit like that. And that's all professional actors. I think when he doesn't want to play off, but he doesn't so many commercials at this time and Joe pick who extensively directed this movie was his main commercial guy. Yeah, he's in zone. He understands he knows his brand. He was understated to in the first thirty minutes. He was funny, but understated. And the other thing is he looked amazing. He looks fucking handsome, name a movie stones, seeing what he looks youthful. Looks youthful ever photographed. He's Morley Dietrich telling you as a good looking guy, and he looks really good, and they played data scene where he's eating fast food in the hotel night. He is shirtless. Yeah, that they know he is. I'll say this about Michael Jordan. He's one of those people that is so famous that when you see him, it's partly you're like, this is good looking guys and shape bureaus, just kind of like Michael Jordan, looking at bugs running at the same really stand Natori profile. Literate lists literal. It's almost like if you're in a relationship with someone for a long time, it's not the same as when you first raw that's Michael. First time I heard someone say Michael Jordan was handsome. Athlete asked one of the reasons he was so big was he was just like a perfectly symmetrical man. Would you say that Michael Jackson, Michael Jordan, who is the more famous person at this time? China, Jordan Jordan, right? His peak Jackson? Yeah. I think at this time you would probably say Jordan just because Jackson was on the down swing. Yeah. Trying to say like big of a world superstar, was he? He was such a world superstar. He was the way the NBA you know, marketed itself around the. Popular and any other countries up until he became a guy. Okay much. I was gonna say you were saying how famous he wasn't and his profile was famous and all of that. The craziest flex of Jordan's power was the Michael Jordan Cologne, which at the time everyone thought was a joke sold so fucking well and the logo for that bottle was his head from front on and at and you recognized it. It was just a bald head with ears and neck and you're like, that's Michael Jordan's head. It wasn't even improved the bridge of his nose or anything like it was insane how much the iconography of his person was ingrained in. This is also this is not as big as the Cologne, but also today's earlier point for a guy who spent his entire crew kicking the shit out of the Knicks just open a steakhouse in New York. I want that guy sticks slot in Grand Central and central. Yeah, I mean, and he did kick the show the next. He did whatever. Man we, you know, John Starks dunked on him. And that's like one of the greatest moments in my entire. Life, of course, I know, and I was Michael Jordan, retires. The Knicks go to the finals. The Knicks go to the finals, but then we lose fucking rockets. And that was like the most devastating moment of my toughly. And then the Knicks these days, they're, they're horrible. Let's lick Griffin this. So I think we can say in unison, sure, they're, they're very bad, but they are committing at least to being bad recruiting men, lowly dress code at a moderate page, giving me that line before, but at least it seems like. Supposedly, but we're still home allegedly. But you know, lunatic owns us. The Knicks are hoping they can get enough good young players and they can keep their owner enough just sort of playing music at city winery. They can attract an established star to come play with their young. We actually talk. I I have this theory Jim. So I think that everyone in the NBA just does what the Broncos like LeBron sets the pattern every single time. So when builds his super team, people become into super teams, right? Everyone's into super my favorite. He goes back to Cleveland and there's that whole narrative of all, maybe should, you know, should people go back to their hometowns? They're the hometown narrative. We saw now these Lakers the new narrative in my opinion is like, you need to rebuild the solid gold franchises at the turn. This third, that's why Durant and Irving all being attached to the net turn this thirty degrees. I agree. Let's I would. I would say it as I think LeBron gives everyone else permission to do what they already want to do. So they don't. He does the things that people. He's gonna get hammered for doing this and he does it. And now everyone's like, well, yeah, I feel like if someone liked to rent Irving goes to the next to be Durant would be it would be implausible because the Knicks are back could never say, and they're horribly run, but he could give that argument of like, look, the Knicks are so important of the NBA I wanna I wanna be the guy who makes them good again. Can I say this people by that? He will never use to bike mostly agree with you. I actually don't think it's implausible. I think we're so ashamed of ourselves. I think we just feel really bad about ourselves and we think they're not actually going to come also like it's like if say, kyri came, he'll just like get injured and. His limbs will be splattered. Yeah, it's better than it was true. It's on the Knicks right now. It's definitely, but it was so rock bottom, MC training burn Yanni. That was that was my rock bottom with. I will just finish this. There is there's a dumb narrative mostly forward by the smokeless sports press in New York. You can't rebuild in New York fans won't do it. Now, of course they'll do their obsessive, and if you give them any sort of hope, they love it right lovers seen as a disappointment that box office when you look at the actual production costs pretty good, pretty. What are we talking about. Yeah, no, definitely on culture. So I, I think pretty good domestic sports comedy. You got Joe pick who was like the dominant commercial director of his time. Joe Pinto who like one, the DIGI, a lifetime achievement award a year ago, never made another feature hated made one movie before this. Really. What was it? Let me find the name of it. Letting. Richard Dreyfuss Teri Garr when was that? Nineteen? Eighty nine. Okay. So sometime between it's a light comedy about a guy again, blur who experiences day where he wins, every bet he places and then he met Michael Jordan big movie liked that movie. Yeah, it was a good movie. Teach me. All right. So Joe pick right, directed all the Jordan commercials. When other basketball players started going into sponsorship, I in rewatching the movie for this podcast. I chose to watch with commentary which I'd never done before. And the commentary for this movie is insane really is it by picker? This is early days DVD when I think they're still experimenting. Okay. The commentary is Bugs Bunny and Daffy duck, but also also Billy west and Bradley Baker who played the voices of bunny and duck in this movie. But also they're like, ask, sometimes this guy. Oh, pick has going to come in and say something. It's cleared. They recorded a counter track with Pitta and he didn't have enough to say to fill up the entire movie, which is only seventy one minutes long movie. So then they recorded west and Baker doing bits as the characters, and that also didn't sustain itself. They kind kinda just social actors host it and every once in a while they literally do creek. Hey, it's Joe pick again, and then he offers a fact and they act like he's walking in and out of the studio for the commentary to get into. Really, you're telling me the Foley work on this Turkey. Sounds like me doing dumb fucking bit, and he comes in and just. Let me. Hello. Hello. It's me deaf. You talkin great. Sure. Commentary sued for copyright infringement. It's me full Vetter a very different thing. Oh, it's Marvin the Martian arm. Here's what are you guys here to talk about him. You're you're here to talk about the wellness brand for men that helps with sexual performance issue. I have a wreck pile. All right. Well, fuck. So you know the twenty five percent of new cases are guys under forty or ducks over seventy five or emotions. I don't know if I can do. Come on Sam. Fine. 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So the commentaries insane and Joe pick when he occasionally walks in, we'll talk about how he's best friends with every basketball player in the movie because he worked with all of them previously. And at the very beginning commentary, he goes, people ask me. So you directed this movie and I say parts of it weird because he didn't wreck the animation. Oh, okay. And also I think I've been reading took over this interesting. The first thirty minutes definitely feel like they're directed by a commercial director because it has that thing where like every single shot is the most dynamic shot imaginable. Like a lot of candidate angles and like extreme wide lens. Close ups. Okay. Like it looks like a commercial. It's very, yeah. It's very colorful colorful and been scenes liquor saying, like returning to his home, like the dog and stuff that just feels like MTV video shit or like you're about to be sold a board game or some and a lot of snappy comedy, like everyone. He talks to his someday player who's like rare into go the guys in the dugout way night obviously, as a ringer, and we talk about that for a second. Yeah. Do you think way night addition for this or is that an offer? I, that's a situation because you have to at this point, Wayne Knight was running the table on the nineties. Yeah, because he's he's a job. Job. Then he's on Seinfeld end mad about not mad about you. Third rock from the sun. He's on both of them at the same time. Third Rockstarts this year ninety six. But yes, he's huge. They wrote like want think Wayne night into his. This is in. I mean, he is known number two on the call sheet. No doubt. No question, right. 'cause he's third build in the movie behind Jordan and bunny Bunny's first billed in the opening credits in the poster, it was swapped. Nobody was folks money, Michael Jordan, both funny is top billed, which is in my opinion. Weird. Yeah, two reasons. One, Michael Jordan, very famous and a real person. I think towards number one of the credits then because I know. And number two Jordan's and more of the movie. Like that's the real beef. I have with it. There's another argument for Jordan being I build was, is that he's natural person? I mentioned that yes, very famous real person going for, but also like books doesn't come in for a while, and this is a short movie. This very short movie. It's not a long movie, quite sure. It's a one reel movie. Like if it was a real sports movie hoosiers they would play a lot of games. They would sack it for. Not only is this short movie, but there is an hour of setup. Right, right. So then there's the first hour you'd like this might be like a two and a half hour movie. Right. Really. They're gonna practice. They're going to be like, I want this. I'm the one. I'm the one who's literally timed it from the moment when they finish introducing the players, the big game to win. It's halftime is five minutes, five minutes elapse in the first half of the because honestly, the monsters are kind of dramatically ERC because they're just. Monsters that crush you it like it's like they're not that interesting to watch if they're just beating these line up our podcast better than I mean, let's be honest. The monsters are dramatically nerds. Yeah, there's a great line, but they're just dominant. And so it's like the only once they figure out how to beat them the movies over. So like the game is mostly a series of like blackout gags of them getting beaten? Well, I was gonna say, isn't it interesting that they had to go steal NBA players, talent, just so that they could beat the shit at a looney tunes. They play basketball. They do not by about all, they just crushed hits. Why couldn't they just go get the talent of, you know, business perfect. WWE wrestlers just hire other players, watches bugs hires, Mike, but why not have them play basketball? You see, like, you don't know, and you don't know which this movie is failures as a basketball movie in terms of there's a lot of fundamentals. Somebody else I noticed to Michael Jordan playing basketball on this moving mediocre that looked like sixty percent at most eight you because just the way he. Was cutting the way he was dribbling was not an intense cut to the real footage of him at the end. And he's planning, you're like, oh yeah, Michael Jordan credits, yes, I'm pulling it up right now. The thing I want to say is that in this great opening credits. Point. Yes. This was filmed in a summer in between seasons, right? This was right after the season. He had come back into late. Yes, he comes back in nineteen ninety. Second building opened credits for. I'm going backwards. Michael Jordan. That's so weird. Why did I think of the poster has at Flynn? That's why? Well, that's how it should be because Bugs Bunny doesn't give them a screen time in this movie. Great. So that's good. Yes. So why is Bugs Bunny force Bill on the poster then? I mean, look, he had a better track record if the box office at that point in time. So better agents, Mike Ovitz, there's, there's the forgotten end of ninety five season where Jordan comes back and they lose to the magic like they don't even make the right and they were hoping they could use just at the end of the season to get to the championship and they don't, right. Joe hia parents had a big complex where he was like, I need to really come back hard. This season proved people. I haven't lost a step. So he agrees to do this movie that on a very tight schedule, which is one of the reasons they wrote in the other basketball players we stolen the power from. So they had other live action actors they could cut to once he's in looney tune world. He would only shoot until lunch. They built the sound stage which has a green screen space, right? They. Had actors who were not the voice actors who sort of were improv actors who play the parts against him, and they had really big stunk guys play them on stars, but it wasn't real basketball. Right. It was choreographed, right? Exactly. But they also largely occur to wasn't real bad. Right. I just wanna clear. I'm always the basketball film two game regular game, right? They played them on stars right. Right. But the crazy thing is part of Michael Jordan's negotiation was they had to build a full proper regulation NBA court on the Warner Brothers back lawn juicing because he needed to use any downtime to practice right. Patches and he would go to the gym at Lund. Is that the court? We see? No. Okay. No, the court you see in the movie is one hundred percent CGI weird anytime he's on the court. It's him in a much smaller CGI space with actors. They built a full court that was never utilized on camera that was his contractual demands so that he could play ball and be ready for the season, not miss a step. So he would only work a couple hours a day. Good for him. But the other thing was any other actors who are working on movies at the Warner Brothers. Lot at summer were like, this is my chance to play basketball against Michael Jordan. So like famous like George Clooney played against him when they were doing Batman and Robin, you just murder you. I think he wouldn't be like, oh, let me take George. He was he kind of, but that was like the thing was like, oh my God, I get my chance to say that like Jordan dumped on me, you know? And that's part of what is going on with. I assume, with the casting this film to Murray says, I want to be there. Part was not written into the script. I should. Hey, my Intel and all this is is please don't draft directive. Ivan Reitman produced by Joe magic. His main partner. This one was produced by Reitman and Reitman was really kind of a key creative force behind this movie once they had the idea because it was their head on his fingerprints all over, yes. There had been a commercial with Bugs Bunny and Michael Jordan. That was a Super Bowl ad. I believe that did really well. And then they were like, oh, fuck. Let's just make a movie out of that the nineties right. And so that they were like we should make it actually funny, let's get Ivan Reitman. He's like the top comedy guy right now, and they were sort of instrumental in overseeing all of it. I bought a year before this had started doing a routine where I do an impression of the guy who pitches spacious good, which got me into the Montreal, just relax festival in a very weird turn of events because I was not qualified to get. In other words, I hadn't done that much work and I wasn't performing regulate any theaters or any of that. But that routine end up being kind of my entry into the industry, which then led to nine months later me getting cast in-draughts, which I would say was a straight line in terms of me running off the momentum of having gotten into that festival. I was doing stand up routines while filming draft because I wasn't working every day, became a sports based entertained for about two years. Right. But that was like my money bit. I would try to get up and do unpaid featured spots at the comedy clubs in Cleveland while we're draft day. Okay. And one day Joe magic producer comes to set leave set early to come see me do my act, which at the end ended with space shame as a closer and I was like, oh, fuck. He's in the audience. He's going to be insulted by this because the bit was dude on a week. Long. Cocaine bender thinks he's about the stupidest city in the one of a mental breakdown. And he just starts screaming and ripping his clothes off and saying that he can get the movie produced by the next Monday. And it's just like super consciousness meltdown stuff. And he kept me afterwards and he went know, Griffin, I, I produce Space Jam. Yeah, I know. And he was like, I know the guy who pitched the movie and I was like, yeah, and he went pretty. And I went out to drink with him for two and a half hours and just pumped him. And one of the things he told me was Murray was not written into the script addle. Okay. They wanted the movie to be funnier. Sure. They had way night, which is the reason why the way night character was created, which makes me just falling. Big comedic type of the time. Okay. We want a little more comedy in here, right men, obviously, very good friends with Bill Murray. Free collaborator. He knows that Murray is obsessed with while he loves the bowl, Chicago. Up until this point. And he says, look, Jordan lakes, golf, you love golf. We're going to do a golf scene Newcomb. You improvise do whatever you want to do some ship, right? It addition to gambling golf, also, big part of a lot of the more like, yes, thirty six holes before a game for sixteen in the first half his wrist is sore, runs out in the second half figures. That's so they say, hey, Marie, you can come. You can provide for day, do whatever the fuck you want. They end up getting a lot of usable stuff, which is why the golf sequences so long because he has like four or five good bits. And also Larry Bird is there, which is he's friends with Jordan and pick ahead worked with. It was like this correlation of feel about birds performance unbelievable. I think it's good to I do. I think it's really good. He's sort of like he's sort of playing into his image as well, which is sort of like the stiff, like the kind of like a little bit of. I do not want to be here. And Murray's. Great. Yes, movie which is like one of our big family jokes that we'd quote all the time Marie keeps on pitching to everyone MBA's going through a crisis players dropping left and right. You're going to need new talent from exciting and unexpected places and every ongoing Bill, it's not gonna happen, right? He thinks he's going to get drafted, and Michael rejects him, and he goes, is this? Because I'm white and Jordan coast? No, no Larry's white. And he goes Michael Larry's not white. Leary's clear. It's a good line. It's great. No scripted dialogue, no role for this film. They shot that the end of the film, the way they were going to beat them on stars was roadrunner, which is why roadrunner never take the entire. Yeah, they were like they need some special thing to push them over the edge, which in a lot of way makes more sense than what happens because the monster is a massive, massive lead beating the shit out of the tunes and then stop beating the shed to kind of to score a little secret. I feel for this very reason. You cannot account track the game in this a couple of baskets tied down sixty, but but you know, roadrunner lease like, all right, we you sit your at halftime. You're on the white board how you know, how do we match up with them. Let's get robot problem though. No hands does lack hand. I guess he uses wings beak or whatever. Yeah, could run to another spot on the court. Flip the ball averted, right? Monsters are big and fish. That was like one advantage. What have if they had like clear and they didn't wanna bring speedy Gonzales back because he was sensitive, which is why I kicked him out of the studio media leaks. I don't want that on my sensitive word for it sensitive subject. And at the last minute they were like, oh, fuck, you know what we should do. We should just have Bill Murray comeback, which is why road runner has almost no presence in the movie because he was designed to be saved for the end. They call them up. They were like, can you come tomorrow? Which is why Murray has joke where they're like, how did you. Get here and he's like, producer Franny called me up and had a Teamster come drop me off here. They like the story, the crazies element of production. This movie was trying to get him jersey overnight because the only physical jerseys they had were the ones for Jordan, Jordan, and he's Murray. I mean, I don't know his height, right different. I would say a different height than my probably the joke is that he's number twenty two right? That he's only one less he's, you know what? He six two. Much shorter than he's not that much of this is weird, Chevy Chase, six, four, six one. Those guys tall. So fun fact difference in height between Bill Murray and Michael Jordan. So if they were matched up is equal to the difference in height basically between you and Muggsy. Bogues and Muggsy Bogues played in the NBA if you were guarding Muggsy Bogues the line would be significant height advantage for Griffin. That was our mother liked Muggsy Bogues because he was player. This is so why don't we talk for a second about the other guys because. In a way. I mean, mugs books was not one of the best players in the NBA, but the thing that cassette was in terms of designing the cartoon monsters. They wanted the greatest diversity of physical types. So it was supposed to be. We'll have a couple big, famous guys, you know, a tall guy, stocky guy this and that, but they knew they wanted a little guy and they wanted a big guy. So Mugsy was obvious because the shortest. Shortest tallest people believe know who they hired George Murison. Right. Who's the same? Hi Sean Brent. And what happened is George? Marivan went on vacation. Okay. And they like mirrors on. He just like, goes back to remain whatever until. Was like, I don't know. I think he went back. There was another war there or something. Literally what he says in the commentary that's insensitive. Insensitive. He's literally says to. Wars and Romania Josie may. He is Romanian, I believe. So I could name is spill. Yeah, I can look them up, but it was literally, no one could get a hold your George Mears on a week before filming. They were like, who else has tall and got Bradley, which is why Shawn Bradley is an occupancy in this movie. Yeah. Well, so right. So the team that they suck the town from is books. Charles Barkley. Larry Johnson, Patrick Ewing Sean badly to centers to power forwards? Yes. In a tiny point. Definitely something I picked up on, and but they use this to turn into giant monsters. It's not like the monsters resemble the people at all. Not at all. Like big job is to beat the show people. They picked Muggsy Bogues small. Did you guys pick up on the fact that the monsters they start out small there learn looks at that point to be fair, right? They're very tiny in. You're like, I'm not timid them, but then they got the talent they do. They just talent. They get big. I have to say like that transformation, you're into those getting. Because when they're small, you almost turn off the movie and walk off the porch. Oh, I honestly, I was like, I'm I, I love Michael, but I don't wanna watch the rest of this. Hold on. Hold on. We'll fight years later from now. Can I try to as quickly as possible state the the logic of this movie going? Looney tunes exists in a real world that somehow also televised to our world. Of our planet. It's at the core of the earth and kids are watching looney tunes live apparently, right? It's like, right, whatever they're up to actually what is happening at that time. The only reason Michael Jordan has retired from basketball because he's a great man who loves his family, right? Yeah. And he's dad always wanted to be a baseball player, I guess k. meanwhile, out in space and alien veto who cannot stop smoking cigars. Right is seeing plummeting sales of his famous artist or swag hammer, right? He's like alien, Michael Eisner, who's like, we're not hip work. Sucks can and I want you might know the aliens or morons because it's like more on mountain on. Sorry, the plants called more more mountain. The aliens are called nerd luck because they're little nerds. They are a little nerds, but they're also dumb, right? But the the alien race is not the morons. Okay. I don't know what race, swag, hammers Ray. They doesn't seem related to the nerd Lux they're different, right? It's weird how little we know about camera considering that he becomes one of the most beloved characters in the history of animation. But so I can receive this kid mocking. The park is like, fuck this. We need a new attraction. They accidentally sit on a remote control, show the looney tunes, and he's like, that's it. We're going to capture them from the center of the earth to make them attractions here so that our tenants will go up nerd, looks burrow into earth. Everyone sees a spaceship fly overhead, doesn't freak the fuck out Burrows into the centre with Ray guns, and they're like, we're holding you hostage. You have to come with us. Loons makeup a bullshit excuse that they can't be kidnapped in less. They are beaten in a game, right? They choose basketball because the nerd Lux are short and have no arms. Then the nurse looks steal ability, right? Magic basketball and their new Alex Mack powers turn into puddles, right? Which sends the NBA into chaos. Yeah. 'cause they don't know how to play anymore, right? Putting some sort of over stadium interject for one when I play, this is a reach, but. Did you find it interesting that a basically what looks like a virus invades five random NBA players, and they immediately go to the form in Los Angeles where the CDC has basically shutdowns like fumigating it, right. Like what? Five years after a few hundred Johnson had h. Okay. Not a single player on the Lakers whose. Because it's it's a Nick Barker on the Suns at that point, right? A couple of Hornets Barclay on the sun's two horns. And. Yeah, no, it does feel very tedious. I don't believe that they would. They're showing the Lakers Lakers team. Coach Bradley was on the nets. He goes. It was a lot of diva trite. Thank you. He is good. This isn't that scene. I know that other guys facing, I'm not sure, but, but I know that seems a little weird to me. It feels very weird. It's also weird that they really deal with the fallout of it as if there's a virus. I know the affecting basketball anyone's movie being right. It's weird that they go to the forum. Yeah, I get what you're saying. Right. But that's where they pick to fumigate. First trillionth piece of plotting is because Michael Jordan has retired from basketball. They don't steal his talent. Ahmad Rashad Del Harris rate. Yes. I know it's weird part of the. And people like he might not have talent you got you still got it. He thought he was a baseball player. It's funny Dany aims some of the some of the best players. So the looney tunes have to steal Michael Jordan who agrees to abandon his family and his professional obligation for no reason having no skin in the game because his kids like the looney tunes sure hind of, yeah, he, he, he essentially promises to take their place near the end of the movie, which will why I know he didn't really have to do that. They cut to a cartoon nightmare sequence where Michael Jordan's literally inchanged doing autographs correlation, please. This movie comes out in ninety six, I believe in a one, Michael Jordan tentatively agrees to go to North Korea to see Kim Jong Hoon and backs out of fear of being kidnapped and enslaved essentially by the Korean leader who was obsessed with the bull. Right? And that's when Rodman starts going over North Korea, right? Yeah. Who essentially want if in a world where he could not Michael Jordan, it was for it would have been right. He would have taken place. That is fascinating to one. Do you think Kim Jong on saw Space Jam and he was like funding strategy is. But do you think he saw this movie and was like, well, there's a blueprint for I get him here. Probably, yeah, it's smokes cigars. Open park Davis. Character also gets a massage during the game. Did you? Yes. To Dan counsel, Patricia Heaton fat about seen, especially weird that she's not sitting in the middle. Now before it's pre middle. No. Call her shot. Yeah, but that's like a, you know, it's like a weird freaked out by the nerd Lexcen trenchcoat which is played off like he some sort of weird masturbating flasher like, right, that is this guy is doing weird and in a trench coat. Their lumps moving around and all of that. They steal all their. It's funny when they lose their talent, they also show how they can't. Like I just really like Patrick Ewing is really good. Spent. How did you feel that about patch them? Questioning Patrick Younes versatility. Great seen adult moment is kid move? Yes, it is also not only is just that the question, just the idea of afraid. Ian analyst is an adult even though I think when you're a kid, you do that as your image of shrink is like a sort of bearded guy with German share, and there's a big and Charles Barkley jokes about dating, Madonna, guess let's he gets very defensive about his mother so Barclays, very good, miss. He's funny guy, right? So like charismatic, I wanna be NBA players to get single Carling, and they give them more to do zone seen, seem they. They used them a little guy. I find that actually emotionally affecting where he plays St Paul. The kid is excellent. That scene goes on. Get outta here. The park. Such a big Mark van because he will. He was in the west, the Nixon FDA him as much. I just loved him like. Excuse me, Sir. Charles. But just to answer your initial. I think they use Patrick for that scene because Patrick just has such a good reaction face. Yeah, like his like he just as good at for owing his brow. It's such a big forehead and like arc and in pick had worked with so much that he knew how to get like funny those to make them comfortable. But even when you're watching the montage on TV and Shawn Bradley doing that weird like staccato walk. How to drink anymore. I would say a movie that stretches, you know, basically like three setups out real real. I would say this is one that could have been longer. Yeah, I would have liked to seen more purely funny stuff is basketball players don't have to play bass. Always funny missing the passer, whatever it's their face therapist and the doctor's like all that starkly in church. Yeah. Yeah. Promise never day Madonna. And then I don't know what's happening with the looney tunes. It goes deep into Luton's thing. So I don't like the looney. I don't hate them, but like I watch looney tunes when I was a k. but I never was like an obsessive about the grass comedians of all time. But it's just like when they're doing looney tunes stuff in, I think even when I was a kid I was just like, right now they looney tunes stuff. But according to you, this is bad. Looney tune of stuff seems a couple of weird factors. I mean, on one hand, the people directing animation clearly were big fans. All the background characters. They put in our like deep cuts and they're certain visual gags like when the scoreboard is like it's tough to watch. Ain't it folks right? Things like that feel very much classic, right? Yeah. But the weird thing is Warner Brothers had like in house, people who usually did the voices for these things and they weren't producing that many new cartoons. They weren't doing new features or any of that, but they put him in commercials and shit, right Mel Blanc famously used to do every single male looney toon voice cruise. He was the great voice over artist of all time, and he did all of them right. And when he died, which was late eighties, I wanna say it was always scattered of like this guy does to this guy does three. Yes, euros. For this movie all the regular guys home over all of guys assume they were gonna get the roles and because Ivan Reitman was coming in and their thumbs up each other on the home over comes in and was like, no, we'll cast funny people. Okay. So they suddenly throat everyone who had done the voices normally and just addition like everyone. Okay. And so it's like Billy west Bradley Baker and all these people who hadn't played the looney tunes before, but their voice actors, right. And they do the voices well, but also they hadn't really lived in those characters and they were like just improvise a bunch of shit. The script doesn't matter improvise a bunch of shit. Right? So there's a lot of the scripted jokes looney tunes have are improvised by very cynical voice actors, which are why they're so many meta jokes about the industry. There's that argument they have about them not getting a cut of the licensing, right? There's the thing we're Daffy like kisses the Warner Brothers branding on his address. They like like shit on Disney jer. There's a lot of like. Inside baseball, like a Hollywood stuff that kind of fucking socks that was just like voice actors riffing. And in that contract, they're like, yeah, I'm surprised that kept all of this in and also just putting them in like putting refund with like a head band and having them be like a cool baller feels like those dumb, fuck and sweatshirts where it's like, here's TASR with criss cross backwards jeans, you know. But kids liked it argue though that Daffy his bits are really good. He kills in this movie. He kills it and they just understand the Daffy bottom of the totem pole thing right the bit. When he comes out audience, promptly stops cheer. That's is rate right? Look, stuff like that is fun. But then you also have lake when he dress up like Rodman. Some of that shit is dumb and Lola is the worst. Lola is like one of the grossest Crassus, like we don't understand women. This is targeted marketing characters of all time. Her characterization. She comes in everyone acts like they. Wanna fucker. They give her a Luga is right. Then they say, doll. And then his doll makes her so angry. She dunks well, they also make they seem very proud of the fact that after all that like they didn't think she could play right, she can this real. We are woman is good at basketball and she's tough. I feel like she was doesn't come up again. She's there. There's the moment. We're bugs almost dies and she gets a motion because apparently they're in love. He saves her overwrite. He saves right. And then right, almost gets crushed in the process does get crushed, almost dies. That's when they play for you. I will the love theme from shrimp. Yeah. Monica? Yes, yes, it's should he? Should he character? Yeah, it's shitty character anyway. After that. They play the monsters. Yeah, the game. Like there's like anything else. The game, last ten minutes. There's no training montage. The closest they get is the scene where they have to clean up the court. Right? But like every sports spit-shine. Yeah. Yeah. They spit a bunch David. They're all like, oh, we are clean this up and then task spins around fresh, like all those jokes are very, like, here's Billy west on a bunch of coke riffing ship. You know what the voice actor for foghorn not very, not good. Not a good there was like, I love foghorn and like there was not a lot of good stuff. One could say I'd better in this very episode. John him does a Bill farmer. Oh, who's not a bad voice over influence that does Silvester. Yeah. And you semi-state. But first half the game takes five minutes. It's literally just a series of lack out gags of them getting seventy. Because he's a mustache, then the hair goes all the way around is is well, it's when he has the hat off to render him because he ideas that his face is mostly obscured in shadow under. There's like hair. It just keeps going. I rose with links. One's eyebrows, do not link James's giving this a real furrowed sorta. You could say he's almost linking his eyebrows and frustration ranking at them, but you don't link your eyebrows to your damn mustache yells looks kind of like gossamer famous Lewington's monster gossamer hair monster, Goss ocher, right? Yes. Yes, right. Okay. Gossamer is the big red thing. Yeah. Yeah, Craig, Eric, look up Google seventy Sam without hat. It looks bad. You don't wanna see, you won't like it. I mean, doesn't he take hat off in this movie? Does he? There's the weird Pulp Fiction reference where he in Elmer Fudd, suddenly become Vincent gills and shoot one of them. Monsters teeth out of his head. I guess he just has more hair. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Got it. That the Pulp Fiction thing is we're right, but that's like the hot movie from the the kids sucks from me. No, it's definitely something referencing commercial campaigns and re brand loyalty and all of that, but it was them trying to boost these characters. So why is more of a referee? He's a looney toon. Yes, see my now you. You might be going to deep. It's like, why. Why. Say might not on your door days. A bit of a conflict of interest because he is a looney toon, but also they're playing against aliens. So you could see how they be like, you know, you don't wanna fight against your guys. He's unbiased, right? Yeah, he's home bias. Nerd looks cousins. What's the? Yeah. The first half they get crushed the second half, they beat him. He gives a big speech. They all fall asleep. Then they find Michael secret stuff winning has put a bunch of water into a bottle, taped it up and then is able to suplex a bunch of muscles. Right, right, right. So then they all come back and they're, they're good, right, but it's just water. He tells them he make an I remember as a kid, that speech being a lot more it's. But it's like total throw, throw. Get. Into making fun of the hoosiers thing of right. Like within you all along, it's not really like that right away and Daffy is just like, yeah, but any more. Right. Like the joke, it's a weird sportsman be where you don't have any sort of training montage, and the game is almost kind of a relevant till crucial moment is that Murray has to take the place of fucking someone else. Everyone else way night's been crushed, turn to balloon every all the. It's visually very creepy. Tweet isn't an iron lung Biki. Buzzard is wrapped up head to Toews or we all know these characters, but that's when they set up the idea. How did you do that to Wayne Knight? It's cartoon lamb baby. Anything can happen, which then becomes the the do sex mecca. But none of this, none of them. Yeah. Keeps them. He does the cool thing with his arm. He's cool. Yeah. Well, the other, the other proven, describe it more James. Murray comes out of nowhere. Sure. You're expecting like, wow, he's going out. He's good. He's gonna. He's to do something right then sits down. So let's do a given. Go get the ball chess, pass back to Jordan. That's it. He does have the great country. He's just bodies. There's no, I thought maybe he'd have a pla- you know, Tricia like it is great when he's running down his his strategy that he doesn't know any of their names. And he goes, I give it to the duck. Gives it to the bunny. He gives it to the girl buddy, take it to the hoop you dominant. Why isn't there to nounce her character. There is the two mice. Well, they're not. They don't make any impact on me. I feel like a good sports movie. You want a nice announcer foghorn Fugger made that thing saying. Also were tied, it'd be sure you know whatever it is. Yeah, right. Yeah, no, the the mice. The bid is just that they have like, yeah, pip squeak wages. And then they like clear that throats and sound like whoever I'm sorry, I don't mean to stop the podcast, but I've been watching you do all these voices and it's like amazing. It's almost like if you were a big time animation studio executive, right? Someone who produces I dunno, primetime cartoon shows your and you've told other people in meetings that you listen to podcasts. Maybe it starts like look through the fucking the pitch packets. I mean, well, yeah, I'm sorry. I know. I, I would say to that, what we were talking about at the beginning of the positive, this was sort of a compromise movie for us. I think also spent a lot of time when I was young, hoping that at some point, the dam would break would be like, you know what's kinda cool sports. The way to chance. Right. And I, this was. What happened and get excited. I might have, yes, something my brother might be like, and but the problem is that we go see this and he's good. And he's just, I loved it. My brother, but exactly the, it's never too much. Looney tunes to actually have to. You don't have to go deep on the sports, right? But that was always that they would be like, I mean, I remember that excitement you would have and it would like work what it was like, oh, shack is in a movie, right? Like shock. But then. Watching. Let's just watch the game because it was always like a grip. Have you seen checks teammate to like this? Have you seen this genie. Lived in a bright and that problem. This is the thing with me and my brother to get my brother into like maybe you'd collect cards like all the periphery of sports, right? If you ever just like, let's just sit down and watch this game, right? Yes, no, he didn't. You were big like baseball, basketball card guy. And then I was big into collect cards, but I would click cards that you couldn't trade with anyone because no one cared about the full set of the small soldiers cards. That's great. Now you just have them all. There was no Connor small. So I, I have baseball cards actually. That was my thing. I was baseball card cards for some reason didn't hold his baseball cards are the best. And that's the classic you know, and there's so many baseball players too. So you could really just my dad. Let us unwrap those you use even do that. Maybe rich and the thing. I mean there was one member that baseball card store would go to a lot that was on like McDougal. Yes, that was it was like poker onto and some other, right. This was even before polka mom, literally, they only sold sports cards. It was like get a pack because then I'll like the of trade and opening when I was in my really deep shoplifting face, I would steal basketball cards all the time. Okay. And me, and my friend had this whole system where we would just get a whole box and I would distract the guy that I put it in my pants and walk out and then resell the hawks, and he got a Paul Pierce rookie card damn time FOX in your pants. All right. Yeah, it's, I mean, does a big kid. You're lucky Ben that you already have had a reputation for having a famously square crowd. Walkout just feel like. He would never caught us got if I always owned a fucking sports card store. Any ten year old twelve year old walks in just be like my eyes are on this kid until they leave the store. I would just assume they were all shuffling human Bart Simpson, Leslie, fucking Edward furlong over here. Yeah. Well, I like I did like Cosby baseball card guy, but jam that was, you know, I played that all the time. Yeah. And we've talked about this, but that was like the big sort of Berlin Wall coming down in our family was like, we have separate bedrooms now, and we finally won the video game system war and you've gotten in sixty four Oeser. Yeah, that was turning with. And that was a big thing with all the stuff like our moss into wasn't as big a deal fear right. We weren't allowed the Genesis. This any s we'd go over to other people then that's that's a problem as apparent win. Because what ends up happening is your kids lined up picking their friends based on who has what Cisco, for sure. That's not good at all. No, it's true because those are usually the kids. The parents are just like, yeah, just play video games per ten hours order pizza. And then you just like, come out and you're just like drinking my mom. So let me go and you you as well into the video game section. We couldn't look at the the. It was like, no caffeine. No video. Like all these things were like just completely forbidden. It was like sort of a years. Long bath mean famously went, our parents announced that they were going to have a third child. We thought like family meeting. This is gonna be the video game system talk. We've very much we got and sixty four. It's new on the market. We're getting that of the PlayStation. That's the only thing we have to know which system or we by my parents had a love, hate relationship with video games. They would take it away from me sometimes because I would smash the control to Agra Agra speaking of that, you know, again, we were very much parented together and it would be like certainly peaks and valleys in that regard. And so we were both don't skip over? No, no, no, we're, we're going to go into ballot different parents ten years later. It's, but so for me and Griff like an, you know, being the younger sibling you, you always want some level of approval and also just let's do this together. Yeah. So like we wanted the system, we both. Wanted the system. That was great. We got the system. Yeah, but then you get the system and of course we won't play any of the same games. Right. And did you wanna play like sports games to play any game. I would play those other games, but for the most part. If I had the time to myself, I really want to put, but let me finish so. Okay, you know, we, we had an incident where we were on a beanbag in I, I don't know if we're in the same room then if it was just my room that would have been your if the system it was for the Nintendo was on a little cart TV on a cart. It maybe I don't know, and Canadian screen some. Yeah. Yeah, it was like a quarter of the size of us at the time. Yeah. And and Griff was playing on the bean bag. And I, I think I had my recollections I had come in and said. Can I play soon? And he said something very close to being this level of blues, brothers, two thousand and sixty four game a real. I remember that game. He says something like twenty minutes, twenty minutes. So I go do whatever you want to get to a save point, some French bread, pizza, whatever we do and then come back twenty minutes later. I'm like, it's time for me to use the game. And Griffin. I don't know what he said, but it was a little like. Twenty more minutes, twenty disrespectful, Tom. And I, I pushed him at the on the crown of his head. Punch them on the top of his head. You'd had enough out enough. I didn't know that was not where you're supposed to punch someone if you're trying to hurt them, punch them like right here, sort of like the epicenter of the brain human but real. And so I immediately on in tremendous pain, but I'm also in tremendous trouble because they just punched my brother in the head. And so we're big puncher you, you almost became a professional boxer. This was in the book or you have, we. A little bit. My recollection of are fighting are fighting was we didn't always get along are fighting was Griff. I would make fun of you. You're stupid. You're and I would, and I would. It was only verbal and you were only of my fighting style would always be like a tackle and a pin. Yeah, Renan like getting ready to punch. And then I remember one time I pin Griffin down and I was ready to punch them, and I just ended up slapping him in the year, you know? So I could never go was a big one. That was a big. No, couldn't go all the way, but then this was a time away. Yeah. Of watching blues brothers, two thousand game plan also a game. The came out two years after the release famously back in the mood for proposal. So. So, and I'm riding and pinks. Just found. Fractured your hand. Well, okay, so I'm in a lot of trouble and I'm going to my parents. You don't know how much this hurts rains plan, Vic, James. This is. Terrible could not do that. You know? I think I think I think we were sleeping in the same room because what happened is, I think I was. Sentenced out of the room little like sleeping bag right next to the bed and my parents room Griff had the room to your separate rooms. That point, I would argue. Our parents floor. I believe that. Okay. Okay. On a blanket on my Pence for and I was just the whole night, just like with a shattered growth plate. In my hand, completely broken, hit a, Catherine, begging. My parents. Enough, you're you're not you're in trouble. You're not getting out of the Birkin hand was blamed on me, not because I route him up because my head was too hard. That was a line at the time you if your head wasn't so hard, I wouldn't broken my hand. We fund raised off that. Yeah. Yeah, right. Yeah. Could be, you can be hard headed hard headed. Certainly. What a story. What a story Mark. We have anything else you've got to save at the movie. I mean, there's kind of traffic moment at the. It's weird that they win the game. And that only then are the monsters told like you can just beat the shit out of Danny devito. Get rid of it right. Well, I think that's another thing is like this movie is not about anything. No, right? It's about brand. Nothing. It's. That even even that alone is the closest movie comes to sending any sort of message barely a message, it's not eating. No, it's just it's about to let's make tunes cool for this generation, and let's make Michael Jordan as a person. Say one of the interesting things. One of the interesting experience I had, we watching this film after watching it probably thirty times from childhood nine that came with the coin. Remember the coin? Yes, I do. Was remembering the movie in a specific way as remember a lot of moves. You haven't seen a while as a collection of Beaumont's. Right, right, right. I remember this scene. Remember them doing this or that, and you go back with them like that and you just sort of -ssume that there's others connective tissue, be plying. This one has. No, I'm not. I remembered every second film collection of moments. It's a series of commercial. Yeah, there's something there's so many other thing with might makes right beat up Danny devito and they do now. It's time to get the talent back and they're like, do we have to just like, yeah, they could just beat the shot him. I still monsters. Yeah. So to flip the message on the pretty right away to harp on this, but the fact that Michael Jordan chooses to stake his life after he's already left his family without warning. I mean, there's the scene where bugs and Daffy have to go back into the real world to read a retrieve his boxers, North Carolina? Yes. Yes. Is that real or day just make that up? I think they made that real well. Can we say that that might be the only admission in the entire film of gambling addiction. Right? He had to gamble has it's real real thing. Yes, it is big, but they have to go get the shorts. And then the kids have to reassure or bugs and Daffy to reassure the kids at their dad is all right, and you're right. He just left her. They not worried about them. Yeah, we don't Theresa Randle another thing when the when the spaceship. Yeah, also interesting that they used cartoon spaceship in the minor league. Yes. 'cause I guess part of the reason that the film sort of make sense, like when you go under, then you're looney tune, you can stretch, right. But if you come back up your your back on the us, a cartoons Bishop landed on the baseball and the wife play. I believe I can fly just starts clapping. Dan walks out of a spaceship, a cool. He made it in time for the game, right. No, he wasn't going to be at right because you imagine conversation the next morning. The kids go look, mom, we know you've been crying for four nights straight while, you know, everything's fine bugs and Daffy came to us at three o'clock in the morning and told us the dad's just helping them. Don't worry. He's risked his life betting himself into slave. No, they don't. They imply that the kids keep it from her. There's a moment where they go out. I don't know three. Also something that the kid is bad at sports, which feels like it's gonna pay off later in the movie gets off the minivan. There's just not enough time in this extremely ruby movie payoff. There are so many setups of the dog is scary. The kid is sad, right? Well, it feels completely like a movie that was made by directed by two different people, different people, Eric Goldberg. Did the animation. Joe pick essentially did live action was sort of overseeing everything. And the movie was pitched only as, hey, this is a smart way to revive. You'll Michael Jordan. Wanna do this, and he's one of the most famous people alive. It did feel like it was gonna lead to do another movies and it just never did. He gives basketball Vicky wanted to. Can we talk about the possibility of remaking this movie? I mean, there was the announcement nast week, Ryan Kugler is on board as a producer Terence Nance current show. Runner of random acts of flying on HBO is direct. And and LeBron doing it. That's one of the reasons he moved to LA is to be able to finish it almost immediately after you're going to film it next next summer, supposedly? Yes. So I don't know what the fuck that movie is. And I always said this where the weird thing about remaking Space Jam is than the only reason looney tunes are in it is because they were in the original Space Jam because kids today, I don't think care about looney. There's another. There's another point as someone who was so excited for Space Jam because Michael Jordan was in right basketball. I, I remember being kid and if there was a movie. I mean, if there was a movie where an athlete appeared in the movie for three seconds, I was going to see it. I watched the sixth man. Thousand thousand shack being in good burger seen over no Lou chips when I was enough to watch it in blue chips, which is like a dark movie about like as bad, drunken, Nick, Nolte. Right. And then. Kids are watching because they're like shacks in this movie, and he is in. But it's, it's that provides a good amount of sports porn. Sure. This movie provides a great amount of sports poor, right? And that's just not like when I was at, I would do anything I didn't have. You didn't have a computer. Have you to watch as much footage of LeBron James right on the computer. Now, as I die, watch fifteen years through now that entire appeals basically lost for a sequel. There were two sure basketball players and two athletes period who made movies in the nineties and was shack who was a nominally because how big he was and also that he liked wrapping and video games and all this other shit, Michael Jordan who was the most famous athlete on the planet. But nowadays, like I didn't know who carry Irving was before drew came out. You didn't know about the commercials, like is this comedian? I don't know about. I didn't know about the commercial. I knew some of the older people because that was VERA where I would have run. Reggie Miller or whatever. What Lisa Leslie, right? Like I knew those people did you see? I did not know careering I never heard of it was such a novelty that it was like a an athlete starring in a movie, where's LeBron's already done? Several different commercial campaigns has been in trainwreck is in funnier die videos. A phony Jayme Space Jam came out in era where you and I would go to a cafe with Riley shitty food just so I could sit next to a picture. Shack, shoot his size twenty two. I wanna eat these fingers. Very look at shoot. I mean, that was just it was just a totally different experience being a sportsman thing about Space Jam to is it's a movie that exists only for people who are nostalgic for the movie when they were children got takes two against that one. I think it's it is a movie for the WB to maybe finally make one last played, bring the toons looney tunes back in difficulty it since Luna's back in action. They have had some sort of Lincoln's cartoon on the air some series, and none of them have really worked. They keep on trying and non work. Exactly. So maybe this is the hill, Mary, maybe this will do it, but to to any NBA fem it, there's so much invested in LeBrun versus Jordan now that it's almost essential that he makes Basie up too because everything he does is now in comparison to Jordan. So it's like, well, where where's his Space Jam though? He never made a Space Jam yet. So now we need to see how he does Space Jam so that we can stack it up to the base Jim. Jim, he'd literally has to do space. Version, his family comedy? Absolutely not. I mean, I like had like a call with a Warner Brothers executive year ago where it was like they wanna make shorts like even before this was officially green lit but was enacted development. I think someone else was supposed to produce directed at the time. It's just Lynn was a little while they were like sending out the fucking beacon to comedy writers being like we need to write looney tunes theatrical shorts that have LeBron them. There was also some concept for Tiger Woods. Starring Space Jam with Tiger Woods was at the height of his. So the legacy of this movie comes out does well domestically, but makes a billion dollars merchandising in the soundtrack is big and all that they meet go. What's the next one and like years they kept on going like, is it race jam? They wrote a pitch that was him. And Jeff Gordon was like the Tiger Woods version. There was spy jam, which. Was Jackie Chan is a spy with the looney tunes. Sure. Like the premise just take someone who's good at something else with the looney tunes live action. Weird the gyms the word though, because Jim refers to voting, right? Yeah, but that was always there. Spy jam got announced, go home. Tiger Woods thing would have made a lot of sense. After he crashed his car after sleeping with every Denny's weight doing similar, I act. Looney tunes back in action a movie. I love that. We will hopefully cover Sunday, I'll show we will, which was their attempt to do like, okay, this is like a proper live action. Looney tunes movie, has all the elements of the aborted versions in so like Brennan Frazier's father in the film is Timothy, Dalton playing JAMES BOND, so they could use all the spice stuff they developed. Interesting. Just right. They were just like polling racist, the looney tunes in it for no fucking. Is this movie good. I was saying to Ben like half of it rules and half of it is like we spend money on this. We have to put it in there somehow. And then that movie bomb so hard that they're just like, fuck it. Let's try Luton's babies. Let's try show where they live in an apartment together. This has been the last fifteen CM problem moments have right where they're like, well, we still got this brand. Yeah, surely there's a way to make it stick and they're just kind of throwing shit out it makes sense because you you already have this platform that people will will be excited to see Space Jam to PD loves Space. Jam one. They'll go see it. So if you if you sort of get them back into the looney tunes that the other thing is Space Jam. One was a horrible platform for the lunatic. Terrible. Right. Tryst. Yes, it didn't hope them as characters. It helped them as I can agree for a couple years after Birch. Right. But I think like the thing, it's the same thing with them up at some looney tunes that people don't realize how much it was about those creative teams that it wasn't just. Yeah, rectors and the designs of them. But it was like Chuck Jones. And Michael Maltese, and it was Jim Henson and his writers, you know, like Jerry Jones and all these people, and they've never reestablished a creative sort of brain trust proper. Now, I think there's enough nostalgia. I mean, LeBron James is always talked about how much he loves Space Jam. His certainly obsessed with Michael Jordan wears number twenty three like, but once again, his connection to the characters deviate we're, I mean, he is in a way. Obsessed with Michael Jordan. But I also think he's been very careful at times which is a little bit why I'm surprised he wants to do this so bad. He's shooting broach the legacy stuff until recent, right, right. He's very careful about when to sort of also very clearly as an athlete, very different from Michael Jordan. Player totally different, right. But in terms of. Talent. If I was fucking LeBron James is acting manager, I be like, let's get a pitch for a movie with you in SpongeBob. I wouldn't be make spice jam too. Be like, I'll say, say, say, spice, Jim could be good, Brian. Food food trouser? Oh, yeah, sure. Chef, right, right. Can direct it would come back for that. Busy, doesn't it make more sense if you go like, oh, the premises, it's LeBron with the transformers of the ninja turtles or who's about being in the same universes, Michael Jordan, that gets everything a little more exciting Kugler fuckin- roles. Terence Nance is really cool. Maybe they'll do something weirder with the sequel, but it's our thing. Well, yeah, the movie could be really good. Right. In part because it doesn't resemble at all Space, Jam one, nothing. Into. No one's going to be like you better have seen where this happens. That's legendary. Doing in this film on not seeing. The nerve blocks. Doing taking women to bone town. No one will say the word nerd luck God, I will. Yeah, you will protest. You'll be to cover it. We all have to come back together to cover Space Jam too. If it happened, assuming it does we, they've staked out a release date. They have. Yeah. And they are planning to shoot it next summer. They know they have a limited window of his availability gotta do in the summer Kugler. I think guarantees the movie gets made though he was sort of the missing element. I mean, he and he's got a bunk, Jack literal and they've been paving the room. As I said, this call about the fucking looney tunes shorts was a year and a half two years ago, like I don't know if they're still doing that, but their thing was like we're gonna start putting Braun with the looney tunes to get people used to the idea already did exactly what you would need to do to make this movie good, which is fine the emotional through line in the rocky movies, but right, turn it into your own movie, right and hire, like a really visually interesting direct. Do you think Jordan's in it? I came in. He's a bummer to see Michael Jordan, right. Do you agree that was bad enough part of that is also Michael Jordan. In addition to be one of the most beautiful men of all time is one of the worst dress man of all time. Worse. See my looks like an alcoholic dad. The other thing is like his is always bloodshot, right? Like he always looks bleary eyed. He looks. Yeah. Yeah, he's just he's a little fuller, hit a messy, divorce, and some water weight on his. His basketball team is terribly a very bad owner, horrible. And he's like the exact owner. You don't want where he's like, the team has staked out this, like we're gonna draft, this guy, right? Don't all and he liked barges. And he's like, no, no draft. You know, he'd back me down. We were playing there. Well, he drafts a ton of North Carolina players. Dress, a lot of players who are in the NCAA tournament and go deep into the end which is, you know, two weeks before he ended up. Flipping Celtics famously offered four draft picks for the nights. Turns them down, which is insane, noodle city, raff, Frank, Kaminsky KOMO is fine. Who is. The most, that guy, he's a guy. I would say if I had this, oh, boy, I I like the Hornets because I like the colors but of an underdog team like they were good when I was a kid. I've always liked to steal on the movie. They are the least Vero team. They're not the worst team in the NBA, but there's no sex appeal to that team over. No agreed. Some merchandise, spotlight. I got drunk and bought twenty seven Space Jam mugs off of EBay, five years ago. Why? Because we used to own so much Space. Jam merchandise that I went on EBay and was trying to remember what we used to own when I was drunk after I had done this bit successfully for the first time, and someone was selling a lot of twenty six mugs that were just a ceramic bust of Michael Jordan's head that didn't look like Michael Jordan is identical. You would drink out of his skull. Sure. And I just thought the image was so funny of this EBay picture of a dude's garage or had a perfect cube of just stacked mugs. Right? Why did he buy this many? Why. Has it been sitting on this long? Maybe he stole it like Ben. Did he put it in his pants had a cube crotch. I put in a low ball, offer a huff five comedy points. Thank you. I was your offer five county. I'll give you five whole comedy points at this point. I'm not making much money, right? I'm not successful in any way Hct thinking. And I think the guy was asking for like two hundred dollars and I was like a lot of money. I'm going to low ball hundred dollars, which is not a hundred dollars I had and he accepted it within one section. He was like what someone said, yes, that visiting on these for twenty years. So then this very angry UPS guy shows up at my door with the heaviest box of all time. It's twenty seven ceramic mommy's like this is something good, right? And you open it and it's twenty. Yes, that I didn't know what to do with. So for like two years, that was the only president I gave to people, and it was sort of like the closest in my life birthday graduate. I think I got one. I only never gave anyone more than one. Right? Yeah, it was the deal was everyone gets one and I have one left. And it's how I will propose to my wife. Great. Merchant Sophian Hawkin gotten gauge that was my gift to them at their wedding. They were like, we finally got them and they lived with me when I had these things delivered. That was my big gift for awhile. Griffin is hoping. Who told us on my mom. Like a while ago, I had friend who was dating someone who is a mutual friend of Griffin's by didn't know Griffin yet. And one day I was like you wanna hand. She's like, I have to go to like Applebee's in Harlem. 'cause like my boyfriend's friend decided to have his birthday there. And I was like, oh, why? And she's like, I don't know. He likes Applebee's funny or he just thinks it's funny in February. By the way it's freezing cold. I may have told the story of the camera and I was just like, okay, whatever. Let's hang out tomorrow. And so we hang out the next house that Applebee's thing. She was like, it was horrible. We had to like, wait to. We waited an hour and a half outdoors in the cold. It was literally snowing, and then ordered a case a burger at couldn't finish it. It's a burger where the buzzer case. And so before I knew this stretch, she never said his name. I knew the story of this idiot, who did this? You met me. You met me, you were like this, you this. Of course, I did. This was a really life bit heavy period. That was also in addition to maybe we say movie after like part of the deal of being able to ESPN zone or all star sports cafe is basically Griffin being like all go. If the food is fucking terrible. They have the most frozen. I love that. You know, chicken nugget, right burger, you know, mozzarella no effort. Diet is based around the fact that I didn't like food growing, right? So I only want to go to restaurants that had toys and us. My food tastes became based around what's the most chemically tasting insane mutant food possible is this up seventeen hours we're doing. We're doing fine. We're about two hours according for a while because there was a long digression about your Jean jacket. David. If I know one thing about you. So your context, if I know two things about you is you love money. I do a bit, but you talk about it? Yes, money's on my mind. Right. And we got sponsors on this show and they sell products in your products are good, but they cost me money. I wanna make money, right, right. This is you're talking about our friends robinhood our good friends. Maybe our best friends, Robin Hood there that's an investing up to buy and sell stocks or crypto currencies options. ETF as all commission free, what they're striving to do is to make financial services work for everyone. Not just the well, actually, it's an app on your phone. It's so easy. You know, you set it up and like it's all very clear and you can Ican bind stocks and such. It's I mean, look, it's simple and intuitive. It's a non intimidating way for stock market newcomers to invest the first time. A trick confident little charts for like a stock going up and down. I don't know if you know this, but the stocks go up and down and. Like I'm scared of money. I'm the opposite of you. I, it terrifies me. I treat money like a Guler goblin. I run away shivering because I feel like I don't know it. I don't. I don't know how to deal with it, but it's very easy to use doing kind of. Yeah. 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Robinhood just going, here's a stock to get you started free money. So yeah, Robin Hood, checked out robinhood dot com. And you can get trading right away. Yeah. This episode sponsored by money. Okay. Let's box scam. Yes, there's millions ninety domestic ninety domestic exactly. Big Benach who thirty worldwide crazy for a movie about basketball, but at this point in the nineties, right? Like you know, basketball's becoming a little more of a global brand. Michael Jordan, big-name funny, big name title. Number one. So this November fifteenth, nineteen. Ninety-six number one of the box offices Space Jam open. So twenty seven. It's a year to the date after Toy Story. Horrible multiplier. Yeah, right, huge. Especially if our children's huge opening number two, we discussed it before. It's got a great score. It's an, it's a revenge thriller payback. No close ransom, right? Which Mel Gibson one word revenge. Listen the ransoms for and I'm gonna feel like a hero. If you ransom James. Now I've never seen it either. I just love that Trump Howard good mean theme from ransom number three, new this week. It's like sort of a sort of remain tick drama de romantic comedy. I guess with like a huge star who rarely makes movies. At times she direct near has to face. She's it's hard before you such. She really makes it. That was like her last pretty much directed, right. I think she then she has the guilt trip in the Falker and those are the only other movies after that. I guess there nothing. I guess it's the guilt trip in the two authors. Babs number four, great movie. Oh my God. I love this movie. We were just talking about this director heist movie. It's a heist movie with such a good movie director, you love. No, don't love the director kind of mix director, but we were talking about them, but I love this movie. This is my favorite of his. We're talking about it in relation to six hundred ten time at the Royal. And maybe seven. Six or seven? Yeah. No, it's a heist sort of too good to really good sequences at the hour AL. That's what I call that. Like a pretty decent set pieces and Soviet ROY, five throughout the entire Runtime at the l. rail. Good actor showcase at the El Rey. Al mostly Cynthia Revoz going to have a really good career at the El royale with this moving, it's nineteen ninety six really like it. What's the cast like big actor. It's an ensemble piece like many, a heist movie four ladies. Oh, it set it off. Set it on right? Which you look, Greg, gravy Latifah, Jada Pinkett Smith, a FOX, Kimberly, Elise, great movie number five. Oh, another great movie that I really wanna do on this podcast. Two months now. Now you can go right to hell. The second film by this very blank check director who's only made like five movies. Interesting. Saw this and theaters was huge for me. I've seen it so many times to my favorite of his movies. Wow. So good weekend. Well, director and actors. No, no. It's an adaptation, huge star, massive start the beginning of his success like not Jim Carey. Ninety six beginning of his success real like visual to. Yeah, visuals really pop hyper visual movie from director whose real blank check is only made about five films, massive star, but kind of the beginning of their career is all good clues Will Smith picture good guesses, right? Male star. Female co-star who's not as big. Although at the time she was hot. She's still big the time. She was brand new under new like well, regarded teen star teen star. And how old is the leader team? Probably he's maybe the twenty one at this point and then he and then he goes on to have a really big still big today. Still bankable very much so much. So. One of the few movie stars. One of the few movies. I'm genuinely perplexed. I know I love stumper and had either them come from TV before she did. She's TV star. She was a TV. He, I guess he wasn't TV. Yeah. But like I mean, you know, it gets famous in the movies. I'll give you already in Oscar nominee. Oh, so hitting early osc, what was it? A Capri in order to Capri. Oh, okay. Rents which was a regular growing pains. But I mean, you know, oh, it's William Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet. Good call. Good call. Yeah. Yep. Means of, yeah, I watched that movie. It's age Tomaso well, it's real easy. It's so good. It's kind of April wave. Yes, yet one hundred percent, nineties Venice beach, sort of like, you know, Radiohead soundtrack like, yeah, so good. What else you got in there sleepers sleepers movie. Yeah. Epic about child molestation. Busta seriously, I wife club. Yeah. Ghosts in the darkness. Homer and the Douglas? Yes. Okay. Michael Collins, I rish independence when Liam Niessen was boring independence day because playing, right. Okay. Crazy, crazy crazy. What time, what time? What a place we love it, the movies. We love him. Dumb movies, the movies that's a callback to something like that eight weeks. Yeah. Yeah, I gotta find that clip. So pump up the jams, hope it up. Oh, we got to get a credit to you. Our Blanke who remix theme song for us. Yeah, their name is go on masked Manta. Hey, thank you so much for that. That was really, really cool. We're going to record them. Don't say that. Don't like I was gonna forget otherwise. Okay, we'll beat it out then. So it's a mystery, and it sounds more exciting than it actually was any final thoughts, James. Pondering. We didn't get to. This feels like the the beginning of movies being designed as like, this can't not work, right. It's an just that idea of like movies as intellectual property. You know, product is brand revival as sort of like stuffing as much as you can. Yeah, yeah. But also, but again, such a lack of like, I feel like it's very hard to make a movie like this now without the director of the writer coming in Saint like, what's a little listen there. Let's get this. This is just a again as purely commercial product right now. They try and trick you buy like hiring, you know, more legitimate artists, but there's also people leaning on the Bill. Go forget to include all this stuff, but I wondered, did we like this movie more when we were young for that exact reason was bite-size little like, yeah, high energy cartoon movie. Now, again, my recollection being so much different, but my loving this movie, no born parts understand, forget parts that didn't actually exist when you watch this movie now you're right. This is barely a movie. I mean, walking out with our mom. We were both like over the moon about it. What do you think she was like? It's just like a commercial Mr. criticism. Wrong with a great Pixar movies, but due to many directors want kids to be like adults in that they are sure you know that that they're going to the movies and they wanna. But on the other hand, this is a movie and I'm all for like movies that are just like hotel Transylvania movies, where it's just like, this is just fun. This is just fun for kids like not trying to even begin to emulate the pay of Pixar, whatever. But this is a movie where no one involved had genuine, like sort of emotional creative aspirations. You know, and like I feel like even other movies that are like like, you look at like Roger, Corman movies or whatever he's like tournament. But the director is like Copeland. He's trying something this movie is everyone just being like, we know exactly what we're doing. Like cell the fuck hamburgers, you know, sell sell the band-aid, sell it all. It's a weird film in that way. It kind of opens the door to, I think, studios being like, oh, do we would make any effort? What if we just don't give a shit. What I'm trying to think of an analog though, like there's nothing quite like Space Jam. No, no, the movie. I weirdly think as close as the Space Jam is from Justin to Kelly. Yeah, right. But no one even gives a shit about right, right. The weird thing it has going for it is the mash up quality, which also was very unusual at the time, not the live action a nation, but the idea of brands were very pure at the time like they wouldn't even make Freddie versus Jason and the fact that it's like two different things together fell for situations like alien vs predator. Right. Those were always like. MandA clash of brand, right? And video games will never make a movie. That's too messy for a movie. What's your mashups okay. When I ended with this dream mashups please, you go first? Yeah, because I have to think, yeah. Well, no. What I loved was x. men versus Capcom the that brand videogames they became moral versus cath- go and that was huge for me. I mean, I think I pitched this before in the podcast, but nights Dante g. h. t. of Rodin thirty. Okay. A bunch of older men who have to team up to save Diane lane. We got Hugh Grant Dickey gear, John cusak all the men who have romance, Diane lane. Post forty are the knights of Rodin thirty. That's my mash up a mechanism dogs, which of course is the big mashing of the while. Becker universe obits not about hot dogs and David dog. Well, that's the sequel. Okay. Dogs. But dogs hogs is of course the wild hogs boys end up pulling up into the driveway of the old dogs. Boys and boys. Boys and dogs will be dogs, and you can't teach an old hog new tricks. Dog talks. Yeah, I don't know. There's a my mashups Ben. You got any. Yeah. Beverly hillbillies. Okay. Meets the Jetson. It's weird that he started with Beverly hillbillies always got a joke communities like. Like, okay, I got one. I got one right here. Then I go for you. Beverly hill, Billy's family of Eddie. Murphy's the clumps all get rich, suddenly moved to Beverly Hills and all become cops under the tutelage of actual fully. They know how the fancy appliances work hotel for dogs. But it's a cruise holders for dogs, cruise for dogs. Dogs. The wild hogs in the old dogs build hotel at a dog. It's the three eleven cruise. Hotel for Ha's hogs James. Just just. Finished with basketball sucks your Knicks fan. So do you care domestic college care do find college should just be more. It was. They're just gonna do a stereo by all means, keep talking. Well, what's okay. So so what is tattoo pretty soon? What is your favorite basketball based movie ever seen review subscribers hoosiers. Yeah. Trying to think what else is blue chip. Montgomery. The kids. When I miss things it's well. I mean, the kids. Mike, getting there that horrible Kevin Durant. Hundred struck. I've never seen go to public. I'm bald Hawes. This is the number available as Mr. right with common. Oh, yeah, that that one is is called just right. Just right. Yes. That's up there. Go to blanket dot com for some real nerdy week. Good. Yeah. And it's always I cannot believe I allowed us to talk about basketball is a great mother. Basketball is very good. It's not like the best basketball movie, but it's terrific movie. And I think it is about like next week. Yes. Episode about the new Bradley Cooper film stars boards starting and ending our Bradley Cooper mini series unless he decides to make another movie, of course, then we resume well, yeah, but they'll be catching later, but no, you Hoosier text from Romley saying, how was James. So clearly the competition rages on. Oh, did the as always. Yeah. You guys in extra time now overtime? No, I knew what I was saying. It was a different reference that you didn't get Michael Jordan. Your favorite basketball player? No. Shack shack checking shack is the most like Birch indictable. Right? He's the most living, Merck. Did you see that real sports segment about Shaq's merch empire? Yes, yes, I did. I was just if you want the beef history recently about him versus Tim Duncan, David Robinson where he literally made something up in his. Like I was a kid. I asked him because he grew up in San Antonio and I asked him for an autograph knee blew me off. Right? And everyone was like since Dave Roberts. Shock is. Issues for child because he acts also like a really happy. I mean, it's sort of. I don't know anyway. Certainly we can discuss the long standing rumor that stern banned him because of gambling and all that stuff. But like right, you don't want to say like the mafia killed Mr.. Jordan. You wanna just throw that out there. All right. Are you guys feeling good? I'm trying to find this one. Are you ready? Come on slam. Monitor. I want to jam. No one said anything about my great check the ninety. It is. It's a great jacket like the red too, though, like on fashioned often, I just said, I liked it. Well, I need the colors. Yeah, I said that to. All right, good. It's good what you get. I bought it upstate, it looks heavy. Like like I like the jacket actually. Don't know if I would go with such a bright red under that. I'll just say, I don't know if it's a bad way to go. Just you just. With a fucking. I don't know. I really liked the jacket, but it's sort of a recording. Nice, Dolor color. And you have redshirt exploding sits off blue and it works with the black pants and the white. It's just trust existed, perspective, earth tones. I don't like purples purpose. James per start off on the wrong. Michael Jordan, the first billionaire NBA history player history. Obviously, he's, he's the third richest African American live. Well, it's Oprah. It's a guy whose name I didn't recognize, and then it's Michael Jordan. He owns the Charlotte Hornets. They are now. You know what you should do. You should do the line where Daffy says. Twelve guy can't even get wet around here. Yeah, that one is fucked. Why. Robert Smith, that's the richest African American there we go. Nobody. He, he and Oprah now he's, he's, he's got like a billion right now. Oh, yes. Oh yes. Yeah. Well, he, he owns a an NBA team. Robert Smith. Third, he does own an NBA team, but I, I actually, what did they say is worth or one point one, four billion worth more than that because she could sell the team alone for. Yeah, he might not own it outright. He doesn't, but also the brand. And I mean, that's the brand is I feel like that that's a lot of it. What team was the center Patrick Ewing? No, no. He was on the Mavericks. Sean, Brad, it's so fucking offensive. He's in this, I guess. It makes me so mad. The concerts is really good and you guys are gonna like it, four hall of famers Sean. I mean, I don't know if mugs a hall. I have thoughts on that. I'm going to do this be really embarrassing. And we've been at the end, the episode. At the end, the argument that okay. Elites special person right. Basketball, do it on Mike. All right. All right. We're gonna talk about basketball, believe me. Okay. Ready.