#45 Steven Duby
I will make the executive podcast. It's been awhile since I've since I've done it. That's man is parody. Love doing these podcasts. So I'm hanging out Stephen Dooby Idaho boy. Yeah I've known Steven for Man. It's been a long time. It's maybe like ten or eleven years old. I would say a bit longer than that. I was probably seven. Maybe yeah so we Go Way back and watch you go through the levels and get to work with that now is also is. I know it's. It's not an easy thing to to Rodeo. And to get their job so excited to talk about the day. Yeah thank you I appreciate that. Let's a little background on. You grew up in. Idaho was kind of worried man. I'm from called I went to called the radio every year. Nampa it's about like every other kid. I grew up rope and I mean from the time I was to open. That was what we did it. So you think that's been something that's always been on like in your heart or whatever you wanna you know your desire to rope professionally to compete do that. Yeah I think so. I mean we always wonder Oh. I've got two older brothers and they wrote better than me. Grownups always had somebody look up to and then it was just like this is what you WanNa do. But it was fun. You know we had fun doing it. And then all of a sudden it was kind of like and I could actually do that and not have to work you know seemed like a pretty good option and it has been so far thankfully so when you get to that spot said not have to work a job. It's is probably the hardest choice at lifestyle you could choose because there's no guarantees in it and there's all these major expenses expenses and your you know your whole cash flow and livelihood is depending on you winning and was that something the first dose of that realize. Hey this is I still WanNa do it through that point. I I I wrote all year long. Two years ago with Devon Arnold and as much amateur radio on I did up there in northwestern Steph. Nothing can prepare you for that for all year and even when you're winning e can be and doing good and it still feels like you don't have enough money it's crazy But but doing that with him and he was real positive. Guy Is real good guy to be around. I think my first year Every week it seemed like you win something. And you still think man. I don't know what I'm GonNa do if I don't win something but I think I think that that part has been great for me because it lets me rely more on the Lord than than on anything else. I think that that's why I really WANNA keep open because it lets me do that. A lot of faith in what you're doing and just know. Hey there's not a clear path is not for everyone. That has a job like you. You can work through it. You know what your expenses what. Your bills are going to be a pretty good idea and road. You know that that first year with you and You guys had a really good year. I mean it was a top twenty. Finish no Landed at thirty something but We had a lot of chances. I mean if a couple of things just go differently we could've made it real easy We want a lot together and yeah it was. It was pretty pretty amazing first year to be able to do that. Good things not a lot not not probably you didn't really get into a lot of the bigger rodeos anyways so. I mean it's tough to to have a good year and not have much from the winner. You guys. I mean I remember watching Spanish in a few runs you made there was there was runs in there. That man these guys for their on eater and it was. It's cool to Kinda see that because that was that was rookie year right or did you The year before was my rookie year. I bought my card and and the Arab Pendleton was myrick year. Cool and we'll get to the US a pretty cool win as well but at that point throughout the summer. You're like figuring out okay. We're we're winning. We're in its see kind of get a taste of it. I can make the. Nfl are and and make money Rodeo on a do I really WANNA do. Do you put a goal system in place. Or how do you have how you try to manage that and it says you know? I've never really wrote now. Goals or done anything like that. I WanNa make the NFL and do all that it'd be it'd be awesome. That's definitely the goal but I don't really I don't really do that I mean. I've got goals that I wanna do but for me I just want to catch a steer. Do My job everywhere. I go and that seems more like to me if I do that. Then I'm GonNa end up where the Lord wants me rather than doing what I want to do. You know goals. I don't know never really been a big deal to me I could probably do better at that. That's probably what I need to do. A little bit better as is set some clear defined goals but I I never really done. That is so it's just more or less. Hey this is what I'm GONNA do. I'M GONNA work at it as much as possible and just and live in. The moment is feel. Yeah yeah a lot of that and I like that idea that too because if you think about enjoying it's there's so much travel so many. Rovan so many ups and downs. If you're just every time I talked to you you're just happy to be there and that has nothing really like I'm taking away from it the other day it was Texas Open. I met a lot of money but I'm here. I'm having a good time and this is what I wanna do and I think understanding that like. Hey this is. I'm exactly where I'm supposed to be doing exactly supposed to be doing. And that's that's good enough exactly. Yeah there's a lot of stuff that if you were focused on how good you're doing. He could miss so much throughout the year. We'll get to deal to places we get to see I think about it. We're watching the bachelor the other night actually kind of a little bit nervous to admit that but They're having the these bachelor viewing parties. And there's forty five people watching the bachelor together and I told my girlfriend. She said what are they doing? I said that's what normal people do that. Don't spend thousands every week under open and it's just crazy you know I'm in Texas. I'm from Idaho. Most people don't ever go to many states. I've been to and see what I've seen. You can miss a lot of stuff and look back and realize man that was. That was pretty cool but I think it's pretty cool to be able to to notice how great it is while you're doing it you know right right so what do you love the most about Rodeo. Well let's let's keep it throwaway. Will you love the most about ready? That's really hard. I I like her open. It's just so fun to me and just watching it even even as fun like at the F. I I probably shouldn't watch. I should just stick with my ron and be and do that like Billy Jack. He talks about doing that a lot. But it's just so fun to me to watch that I can't do that. I got to watch it and The RODEO on superfund getting to see all the different places and stuff that that I grew up looking at the results and looking at this and on the fast lane or pay cash right here were caldwell second steer. It's pretty cool to just get to see all those places right. The one thing. That's so unique is and how the more Royal Goto become. Take it for granted but you get the new set up so the different environments. What it's like from estes part two two. Cheyenne the penalty. All these different situations. You know what it takes to be competitive. It's it's fun as well as I mean there are places like S.'s. Jumped out of my mind but it's one of those beautiful you go to the mountains there and get experience. There's people that are paying thousands of dollars to go on vacation where you pretty much can live in a vacation. It's got its ups and downs. Yeah for sure. What about the? I know you talked about the goal setting. That's not something there but the practice has been some of the bigger things that you learn from practicing on the last few years. It's kind of helped you take your heading to the next next level. I've never really had a lot of horses so I've pretty much always had to head orces on my life and I've had a lot of different ones throughout but I've never really had more than two so for me practice in figuring out how to be able to keep my horse work and but still get good runs and good practice has been a tough deal Like getting ready for the American Semis. We know we gotta go over there and more than likely we're going to have to be some kind of short four to make it back and so being able to go practice being short for but then have more still working good without being able to go practice horse and not care about what he's doing and just bring over the gates and duck and you know so. I'm on my good one practice in that and I probably ran eight or ten and and being able to figure out when he feels the right amount of just barely free enough so he's still going to duck a little bit radio or he's too much just being able to figure that out has changed a lot of stuff for me. Because I don't feel like I really rope that much better than I do. Two three years ago. She just figuring out the horsemanship part of it has has changed a lot of stuff right and so have like a love this. Because it's something I work on all the time and I feel like I'm probably the opposite to a fall. I want more of my courses where it almost takes away that that real fast shot. And that's something I think you degrade is go. You go real fast and can't can do it consistently so not say heat. That horse moving was things that it's helped you that writing or is there a mindset that you kind of have each rod or feel that you get out of the hoarser. What's what is that for you. I grew up doing that going fast. And and I wish I would learn the other way first and then figured out and do that because I need to catch more but Your horses got to run. But they can't run too much and figuring out that inbetween has been tough for me but you gotTa ride. I think my horses run anyway so like my horse. They just want to run so I think if I ride the first jump on. Leave the corner then. I really don't have to kick him after that they're gonNA run until I thrill and especially my own horse. He just I mean anybody could get on that horse and fast. Every time he just so easy So I don't really think that it's me it's just. I'm just so blessed to have that horse. He's been amazing for me. I bought him in two thousand sixteen listened to be four years. I bought him two weeks before Pendleton to before Palca penalty yet. It is so two weeks. Well I wanted the year after that. Okay that's right another kid right road that horses though two weeks after I bought him and his partner up to leg to win it on these are these are horse horses Pendleton to. They've got to have a pretty good feel to them. Today's stay Pretty Upright McGrath's you don't really want to drop it news shoulder so I mean it's not a real common thing that you see ahead horse can go as fast as he can go to real controlled his feet and I think that's I mean it just Kinda goes to show you that you gotta head horses a winner really put them in different situations and then they put the craft spot to to do to do. We need to do. Yeah for sure. Is that the best one you've ever owned by far I on another one actually right now that that might be a better horse than him but just not for me. You know. She's a she's a great horse and I went a lot on her. But for some reason that grown is just. He's just easy to win on. You know he's he's not as good. He's a little bit Efron. Indies doesn't hit his but very good but he scores and he faces and he just runs every time you know he ain't GonNa win at a future at all but he's just easy so I think that probably be the best source all ever own so I I think this is something I learned at a young age and I was really lucky. I had ahead horse. He'll horse that we're both really good. The head was probably pretty flashy but he was a bigger horse big sorrow and he really taught me a lot about how to rotor up and he would make may get relief on my healers. He'd run enough and do things. Well enough they're kind of like let me learn where to throw and how to set the run up and kind of Tommy how it went sensually and I think the hill was the same way. She was real free and easy to catch on. Didn't have a big stop. I I always. I really felt like a house caught the short steeler. I always finish on the source and I think a lot of people get hung up on flash in all these moves and these horses that can really run and then just drag it and do all these things but they really take for granted the horses that are easy and and not flashy. But they're like they do everything but nothing major really really special or flashy and they're just easy to win on and that's what I see on that course observe touch her and I'll see you go two or three coils and just blast to steer and then go catch another steer by the very next day. And and what do you think about that on those horses like flash compared to easy to well? Yeah I I completely agree with you. I think ahead worse has got to be easy. The the horses that win everything horses year. All the time The only one that I think is super flashes Schmitz black like and he just looks easy to but he's just black and he and he's got a great move but other than that. Chad's horse Klay Chien's Riley's they're all amazing horses but they're not flashy you know they don't drag leg and Chad's does sometimes but he doesn't make him do it at the Rodeos. 'cause I think that that takes too long. They just need to route and get out in front of the steering face and if they're easy. Un way more on their flashy especially at the radios at the jackpots is a little different deal. But at the radios. It's a huge deal. The just have one. That's easy to catch on until the Griffin. So what's best man? That's so hard that's hard. You could be one that you could get on which it would be. It would be really hard to pick chats. Horses is looks like he'd just be the easiest one to get on without ever him because he scores Super Easy Coltish mitts horse. Looks like he scores. Good deal The other horses are are awesome. Mike Riley sources is amazing horse but he looks a little bit different discourse sometimes and he always scores good for Riley. But I duNNo. Seems like he'd be a little bit tough for me to just get on him without ever being on him before Man Everybody's got a good horse though. Everybody does my my personal. I love rather source. I know he's a little different in the box but when it really jumped out to me. We'd video the broadcast last year. And that's yes so long and he put it on a he had A. I don't know few what he would have won but he had a chance to win. Yes he would he would want it. And I think Jeremy He's germ butane slip alive or something groped lost summer rope legs and that was closer to be set up to to do good and then you go to a few weeks later. Whatever month or two later and he went horses. Bfi that he's lights out and then later on that winter he's riding with Thomas and I think a horse it can do. That is amazing. Some of the headquarters is out there but I think that would over into headquarters is a lot like yours. They have run but they know how to to get it out of him and when to use it and went to not into to kind of be flat easy. That's cool these horses. They're they're getting freaking. They can do so many things but there they can read capital and read the different situations and mets making ads. That Wa- places. Yeah for sure. I think they have to read the cow. That's that's probably the biggest thing for me. That's why struggled a little bit on my marriage because sometimes show just overrun steered just a little bit But they have to run as hard as they can and and never overrun the steer. And IT'S AMAZING. The horses now I agree. Yeah I mean what they really ought to to pass lock on us. There's a lot of deaths what's been the hardest moment and you're a Rodeo career. So far we we did real good last Summer Jason. Than I through through the fourth through. While winter spring summer we did good all the way through the fourth and then right after the fourth we add to terrible weeks. You're out bad. Both of us seem like if he caught. I broke the barrier. And if I got out good the steered fall down or something stupid like that would happen. and then seemed like we were just starting to get things turned around. We want a little bit Ogden in Spanish and things started going good for us and then it seemed like every steer we wrote Jason. Get flagged now for crossfire and it wasn't and it seemed like man and that just that. I think that really killed our summer. A lot is Seem like every time we had a good run they'd flag him out and I don't know why that happened but I think that was the hardest thing to get through and then two years in jail. I've been a little bit of a long shot but it Ellensburg. I had a chance to make enough are still if I do really good. And the first year I missed the best here just high low had missed him and ELLENSBURG and that was like okay. I'm not making it anymore. That was that was the one that was like Yep I'm not GonNa make it and then last year I las Murrow same type steer just loped off to the right lost. Mario and we still had a little bit of a chance last year. But it was like we need to win twelve thousand Pendleton or were out. And that's been really hard though is is figuring out how to stay positive without without being too optimistic because like. I know I'm not GonNa make it but I still gotTA BE POSITIVE. That's the hardest part for me is figuring out how to be upset at yourself without being negative. You know about telling yourself you know you're enough or whatever it is exactly so the first time you set steer announce. Berg do you have. Do you remember what you're thinking kind of act like right after that like maybe when you're calling up or however it is yeah? I remember who I was. I was more upset at myself just for miss and we went five two on the hardest shown in steer in the first round which is a great great. Yeah we we I was lay and somehow cotton horse duct and Evan heal them. Unbelievable kind of MRS wraps a little bit to win. Maybe when they're out on the the worst steer in the Bin and then we come back on a good one finally excited we drew good steer no walks go nail the barrier him in the back of the head and it's almost like. I can't believe that I missed like I cannot believe I just did that and then I went and sat in my trailer for about thirty minutes and I'm sitting there just Kinda Salkin and this is what I love about Rodeo more than Jackpot and I'm sitting there soaking and then I realize man if I don't leave right now I'm not going to make it to filer so it's like I gotta I got unsaddled mowers and pity party and and get back on the road and drive so I can win something but It was just it just kind of takes the wind out of you know it's like man. I'm out here. Spent seventy thousand all summer to do this and then I just missed the best. Steer you a chance. You know a chance that you if basically you could say. That was the beginning of the years. Hey I got. I got a great opportunity. Were good on my first one. If I win out strong but you could say I got the low for the second round Ellsberg to be the top probably two or three calls. Yep You'd probably take that opportunity where a lot of people would I mean you better situation? But it's Dan close expensive for never may make the final set and all right so the next year do you. Same scenario is close enough and kind of have something go wrong. Do you try to do this. And I try to work on my mindset after good and bad rodeos and I can use it as a reference part this last year like okay. This is kind of. We're kind of down this. This is how acted this is my reactions to it. Do you look at it the same way or how. How do you kind of go about it? Says Yeah I look at it similar to that. I finally figured out that You know reopen and that is is all amazing but it ain't what life's about and so it's a lot easier for me now to not get upset about it but like last year. I missed and I was I was actually in the exact same situation while waller before that we win the first round draw Lope around the second one I third over his head and It's easier for me because I've I've kinda figured out that you know there's one hundred people that real good and there's only thirty something to have a chance to make the finals it at Walla Walla Knowns Berg so for me you go all year long to have a chance to make it and and I'm I'm still get upset at myself from messing up but at the end of the year if I have a chance to make it. That's what I'm that's what years about is giving yourself chance a chance to do it so I messed up one steer. I could sit here and think all the time about man to just cut down one. That would've changed but or not broke the barrier Sheridan a month for that and won the same amount of money that I did on that one that I'm thinking about you know so there's a lot of the year that plays into get into that part that So it's easier for me to not get upset about one steer anymore even though it seems like you know I was telling Jason is just the other day here up leg to make it back to the American. Like we've caught eight to get to this point. He happened to mess one. Like you know if that was a Cooley city it could happen just as easy. It just happened to be this one like he can't get upset about messing up one. Steer you know well I think too were Rodion. Become become a lot of people may not understand this or I don't know if this is correct way to look at it but these rodeos it's like the run is you've got to be so aggressive and so fast that I could go back to this cross fires. Each one of those cross fires probably for two to five thousand dollars maybe some of them six or seven or eight thousand and when you add one or two of those back in its mean you might go to ten rodeos and connect on three or four. If you're doing really good you know if they're headers and if I mean that's the whole team Maxim one out and yeah drawn and goodness steer to win something up and that's a that's a hell of a week ten ten thousand or more. Yeah and you're like man we're murdering but when you take one or two of those little things like steer fallen down flat out for Crossfire. It's like all of a sudden. We just got our feedback as any talk about being able to a understand like the situation this is. We've got these mistakes but really it's not our fault which is Kinda. GotTa keep playing to our run. And you know you gotta hadn't happened in the right places and that's where you get those big breaks and kind of be ready to win and so let's let's talk about it because you know it blew up on social media pretty good and I was like man. I seen it the next day. I can't believe how hard on this flagger from San Antonio and I was a lot. That were out PHIL FOR LAST YEAR. Phillips for hours in that slack and it was eighty or ninety team Rodeo. We're firsthand teams to go. I make a run for a fourth or fifth album. I make a run. I'M NOT GONNA win anything hundred zero four eight you guys go four three four three and a handful teams later and it's a great run and give blood for crossfire and is one of those where you usually know. Correct call of all the cowboys are like no way. And that's one of those that it was everyone I mean even be there. I knew I was going to be kind of close check. I was like man I if I went something. They don't feel that and I think that most teams would agree that it was. It was very poor call. It does happen but you guys had a few of them so kind of word. Back San Antonio you've made it through the first few sets. Let's explain how San Antone works? Guess right it's everyone runs three years. Yup and then they bring back the top four people out of that set so he gets eighteen three nights right or is it. Ten Ten ten teams for three nights in the top four money winning teams advance onto the semi-finals. And that's where you guys are at seventy five. Yes and you're going to get ten teams again and the top is talk for top five top five events yet and now the money double so it's paying five thousand twenty two rounds and go ahead. Yeah we we ran the first one and didn't do any good so it it come back second one. We were We were third out the first night. So we're the third last team to go and We knew when we had to when we knew when we went we had to win. I dust negkes went four flat. And somebody else Charlie and Luke and Patrick went four flat too so we knew when we went we had went first to make it back to the to the finals and We had to beat four flat. So you know we had the best year. He just high loped off to the right perfect pattern made a great run. Everything felt good Healed them faced. Usually you know when when you make around you can kind of feel like man. I need to look at the flag hair. We might get flagged out and he pulls back get get the flag and I'm turning off. I'm about to start wave my hat because I'd been three one time before that Jason had never been three before and and how and then we were three five. Three five yeah and then for some reason. I'm just about turn off. And I'm like he just flagged this out. I couldn't believe it. It was like one of them like I don't really he did And Man I turn my horse and wanted to ride over there and I'm like no. I better not do that. I'll just get fine lose more money so I start dried out. Like gotta go talk to him. No I turned back and forth three times and then finally just wrote out and There's well Jeff and Wurley wouldn't have made it back and if we would have got the flag and Wurley more upset about the call than we were you know. There's ten teams or nine teams. Watch that and they all knew that it was the wrong. Call right now though. That's just the way it goes to. Flagger is the only one that gets decision and his decisions final. So you know I wasn't really upset at him After after a little while I did get that way because he. He admitted that he made the wrong call. And he was in the wrong spot and couldn't see the steer So if you can't see steer we should always get the flag but It's just the rule is too confusing. We gotTA figure out a way to either make the rule better or make it easier on the judge right now. Well a fast income. I don't know if anyone follows the group he'll shots but there's a lot of guys that are getting across our they're posting runs and they ask about it and there's some that are just blake crossfire like dude. This isn't even close where we why debuted has this question and I think where it gets really tough and man I I feel for the flyers and you wish there was a little better way to improve call because the steers they keep running. So you've had a good steer knew he had checked off a little bit when you head. And he's stepping off to the right suit. He kind of pushing on it and he hits kind of gives a little bit slow. Hedera pits in tears heels. Yep I've seen again flagged after crossfire one other time and I thought it was terrible. Terrible call and yours. I didn't think was close. But what kills me about it is? There's another judge at the bottom of the area. Then they can fly people out four or tell them no time if they have a bad hick and then there's a very judge right there who can make calls and the fact that the three guys can't get together and make the right call after after they had admitted that because that's what they said was it was not the correct call and that's where is rough for me and I am. I don't blame the judges but you just wish head you know at the end of the day. Just make it right exactly and And that's that's one thing about the the whole Rodeo situation. That's that's tough. Is you see a lot of guys that get revised and different options in time you guys. They've always like well. We don't get one steer doesn't perform and will the judge is going to have to draw a line at that point and like we'll steer qualifiers this Kaffir and so it's tough and I get. You gotta be able to draw the line but when it's a situation like that that is the top three biggest radio of the year top four now with how county if it gives you guys amazing situation to come back into the files to win. San Antonio with an extra five thousand which might be the difference. I mean our pays but I imagine it's pretty close to that yet and so it's like you just took that away from you guys and then I'm we're not really here to complain about the situation but you know what I thought was the coolest thing is you'd run your first one. Too Song drove whatever. Twelve fourteen hours to San Antonio road those years and flew back to Tucson. Yup Fly that to run your second one. You guys are no good on your first one. Have I mean I would say is hard as kick is a guy that receive? Is that one s right there. You know not only do you have to be faster than for never have done it. One of the bigger radius do it and then taken away by back call you have every right to be upset in into kind of get into a swamp or whatever you WANNA call it Yep and you guys come back and talk about your mindset to soften a second. Yeah you know for me. I mean it sucked but The money would have been nice but it's pretty easy to just well sucks but you know. I'll be taking care of Lord Take Care of me so I never even thought anything different of it And my partner did neither. If you see the video Tucson I think he throws faster there than San Antone We had just an average deer and he ended up being being better than what we thought he was going to be. And we made a really good run steer with good Jason healed them super fast. My horse almost fell down stepped on her left front and got a real bad. Finish but Ah We end up winning the second round over there we split and it was really nice though to come back. I ready to run after that and win. Something felt really good world and I think there is an I like to talk about it. Is You know we talk about building on our robot so you know I can have worst case scenario happened to and I can come back and still compete the next day and and to be that tough mentally is something that you're always. GonNa have that and I think that makes it too. In my opinion I don't know if you miss a few steers or whatever can happen and you know why were we can get through. Is that how feel so you? Yeah I think so a clay trying I guarantee you if we went over there to his house and tied his rope and not where he couldn't catch steer and then told him. I'm going to beat you. He's GonNa find a way to win. You know so. I think that guy's got it right. It don't matter he may be hasn't caught for ten years and he'll still tell you right right to your face. I'm going to be today. And and then he'll do it and I think you guys got to be like that it no matter what happened yesterday whether you want first or not he you just gotTa Act like you one I every time you know. Just that's how that's you back in the box. That's how you feel. Is You know every time that I wrote when I so? Why not do it again right here you know. Well Yeah just believe in yourself at that level and and how do it and sometimes we got to be able to do it in. It's not they're like hey mean it's not like you're play. China Have Twenty. And so you've got to. You've got to develop it within yourself and has that kind of code through faith and understanding. What do you think that's Kinda come from? I think I think the faith is really made that easier for me The harder part then even finding the the confidence for me is being a good person but still having the confidence because it's easy to you know be arrogant or whatever they say it would be real easy to do that when you're winning But I think the guy just wants to be a good person all the time whether winning or losing siding I think the faith has really made it easy for me because You know I can trust him when when he wants to win. I'm GonNa win and I'm going to get to where he wants me to be whether that's a world title or whether that's changing people's lives just by reopen or whatever he wants but so it's just a lot easier for me to trust you know where he's putting me and and then that gives me confidence because you know right where. I'm at so I mean powder I'm Twenty two twenty two. I would say that this is very uncommon to see someone that is really really strong. Spiritually like you are because it seems like the younger kids they get to a pretty advanced level and they get kind of arrogant or really like policing themselves but very rarely you hear someone say had. I just want to be a good person and and do right each day. Did you start to develop that that aspect or faith or I mean. I don't know if that's the way always kind of been you know I grew up like that But I never really believed it growing up. I knew I knew there was God and all that but I never really really lived for him and I went through that I went through where I thought I was super super good in high school and I never got any better from time. I was thirteen until I was eighteen. I wrote the same because I thought I was good. And then and I was at that point. I wrote better than there's me. And Jeff Lynne again and I'd hold it roped good and then all of a sudden it's like man Jeff Ropes way better than me and I've gotten a lot a lot stronger the last couple of years. I've been blessed with some really good friends that that really believe and they can help me do that and I think Rodeo no has made it so much easier for me because of how hard it is and I don't have any money like I never grew up with a lot of money. We were always taking care but I never had the money. Just go buy a new horseshoe whatever and and I think that that has helped me more than anything is the only reason. I'm making it out here because the Lord helps me. He wants me to be doing this. Obviously there'd be no way I could afford to be doing it And it's not even win all the time but sometimes you know my grandparents. There'll be doing good and they'll send me some money or something like that and and Just just figuring out and learning that no matter what I'm going to be taken care of has helped me to grow so much spiritually and And I'm just so thankful so having I think that's really important understand and kind of cool. See I feel like this happens to me. But there's time you like man it's rough and may be struggling whatever but if you continue to do the right things and opportunity presents itself and it's just like or a win present itself but if you just continue to do the same thing every day just be consistent and just stay with what what you love to do. Opportunities just continue to happen like Whether it's a horse all of a sudden gets really good or comes comes into your view life or whatever it may be but I think that's where it gets really fun and that's it almost helps build the faith on on toddler that I just continue to do it. I know that the right things will continue to happen and and kind of go down this journey. So what about these big moments was pendleton? The ZENDA I really really big steer that Iran was at the biggest one. You've gone at that point in your life. Yeah for sure for sure. I don't think I've ever really been in another situation like that. Even since I've ransom big steers but not not like that one in before that. I mean I've only ever won two saddles everyone thin and I roped to be a few years and I was clean on four one time. The fifth one was pretty nerve wracking but even Hamilton wasn't that bad. Because I was eleventh call. You know it wasn't like I was high call back and just shaking. I was eleven then had a slow steer and really thought that I didn't have a chance to win anything because everybody was good. That you're the the top six. Were like all Radio. Guys Rawal all in F R teams. You know So it was like you know it was pretty amazing to win it. That's the biggest thing I've ever won for sure but it wasn't like I was in a pressure situation or anything you know you saying so that I mean that's cool because usually I came back to a few of the bigger short rounds like Ellensburg Ellsberg and Cheyenne and stuff like that. And I've I've been like one of those lower calls when we come back to the that's the true situation where you just got to be smart. Okay I got the steer if he strong each maybe make a good run. If he's real good you just kind of use your steer. You can usually win money. But you're at that point. You're just trying to get money out of the Rodeo. But when when you get those top few calls now winning the Rodeo is in play and I think that's where Kinda he had. His expectations are really think about it. But coming from eleventh callback I got this good steer. Just go use them. I mean penalty and different to where you're running down the hill and gauging out new and if you get a good start it's I on a good steer it's it makes for a good situation and yeah and so that is kind of how it it just went. He just yeah and just made the run. And then when you read out maybe that's probably GonNa win third or fourth. What are you thinking? Yeah well I think maybe ran the three worst steers there that year. My first one flew and we were nine. The second one went to the right is she's so scary over there. And then the third one Jason Stewart. Stop me before I got over there. He's K. catch. Just catch your eleventh. You're GonNa win something if you catch. And he was a terrible steer but he was the best one. I could have drawn because he came laughed. I laughed to everybody standing there so I couldn't have. I couldn't have thrown at him. I think if he went straight I probably would've reached missed or something but he was slow and came left side swing over him to get my horse. Move over and we come. We finished on the track and we went five seven. We didn't even we didn't go four. We didn't do anything crazy and The first team broke the barrier and the next team missed. And so then I'm thinking like and that's go. I need to win something to make the circuit finals. You know cool. We're going to win a couple of thousand. Maybe when the short round hopefully and and you know do good and then about seventh call. I'm like man. Nobody's sky yet then. Six Mrs V. I think the horse jumped the barrier and he broke it or something and then and then I'm like okay fourth. Call now I think it was. I think it was Buki Gurin and I go Gabe Boop bodice card just for penalty. He's going to win something and he did. Great and Chase Hampton source slip when he healed me. Lage Up. It's like I wouldn't fourth now. I'm GonNa win fourth penalty that's cool. I'm going to win three or four thousand now and then Chad steer Chad had my second one in. He ran straight to the letter. Bucker straight right and he went nine clean and he's winning second. I'm like holy crap. We're GonNa win third now then. It was the miners in Brady up leg. I think his horse. Kinda slept or something to you. And it's like no way gotta chance no way we're eleventh and Jason. Just hold me. He's just so pumped and then Jake Stanley was high. Call three years in a row and his partners horse. Shorted them right. It's a thrill but they had to be eight. He kicks goes to heal them again. They're still going to beat me and he does it again and kicks up healed him. We went it was just unbelievable like At I mean it's crazy that the only thing that was the Lord for sure because there's no way all those guys mess up any other reason but it's it was amazing. That's pretty cool. I I didn't know come from so far now. We shouldn't have even made the short round really I was. I was almost seventeen seconds on the first two. Sixteen eight I think and usually like Shyam tenders steers you. Just don't make by futures. You don't have the chance like something has got to happen in the run. A you've got to blast Amer just whatever you new job perfectly even had a chance and really must time. Don't even get a chance. Yeah I mean you've obviously back in the box for a lot of money and a lot of these rodeos are. I mean the other day where you come back semis and you know you got to make something happen. It's a big moment. Do you find yourself getting nervous. Or how do you handle that aspect of Ito nerves or are definitely everybody gets them. I mean For me I like now. I've Kinda figured out that the the nervousness and stuff is just is just a little bit of a lack of faith and in thinking that I mess up. That's a bad thing which it is. You know it ain't doing good but but if I mess up it's GonNa work out in the end and and doing that realizing that has helped me out a lot but I get nervous is just. It's almost a good thing like at least you're you know you're feeling something. It's kind of exhilarating at all. I don't mind it at all you kind of embrace. Like yeah you a good way to look just knowing that. Hey there's very few things get me this. Rela remedy this excited about moment like this. Just take it in and just kind of enjoy that. Yeah Yeah I mean. How great is that were? This is our job. Our job makes us this excited. That's awesome. We could be a little cubicle. Yeah now get that ever. Yeah really like a whole life getting that and here it is. I mean every day. Get me you're going to Houston days. Yep just just was at the Americans three over there at the American bellwethers. Pretty thank you. I love that is that is that something that you've studied or like the mental side of things or is that kind of naturally comes that way I've studied quite a bit of it Like there's a really good book. The inner game of golf and and he talks a lot about Your subconsciousness playing a big role in it and then the mind gym. I don't know if you've ever listened to the mind gym but I've listened to a lot of that stuff. I mean. We have lots of time to listen to stuff when we're driving so I listened to a lot of stuff like that but I don't know I never really I've never really done good in short rounds jackpots. And stuff like that. But I I could have a lot of reasons to have a Lotta doubt in and get nervous and get scared and stuff but I don't know it just it just something that has come come to me lately. That has really worked out. Doubt me like that so you just kind of said something that you've got from studying this. Is You know not having success but still knowing like this is my job today. This is what to do. And you just stay focused on and you don't really worry about how you done in the past or you know things could go wrong kind of focus on your job or that is that you've got a big for sure for sure. Yeah I'm not. I want much jackpot and and nothing like that. But they don't really matter you know The money's great but it's fine so understanding that how how compete in out of no yourself is probably the most important thing to to creating mental consistency. And I think there's a lot to be learned from books and stuff like that but it's also understand him. Why are probably different than everyone else? And there's going to be certain ways it helps me and surveys. It doesn't know like hey how had get yourself to that at that spot. We think staying in the moment. It's Pretty. It's pretty good too sums it up pretty quickly as far as yeah have mentally. Be Be ready if you're in the moment you're focused on what you need to do really. That's that's your mental consistency. I would say yeah. I really liked that. I talk about that. A lot too myself is just live in the moment. Right this one right here not what happened. Not what could happen in the future? Just enjoy what's happening right now. Is that something you practice into? Like you really focus on the mental side of things. Yeah I don't get that much only to my two good horses. I don't get the practice that often So it's it's pretty easy in the practice pin for me. I like to have fun and I liked to enjoy it but I like to just be focused on what I want to get accomplished while having fun and and so it's easy to just focus on just doing this just rope. So that's something we're just the two horses in limited practice is what's your mindset of like. Hey I can be good enough. I am prepared or can improve on what I need to with limited practice. You have any ways of getting the most out of your practice with that. Yeah I've been working lately on. Catch the place in the first-round okay. This is the second steer we have to be six eight to be winning something. And that's what I've been working on lately because I've I've always done good at at being aggressive but I've come to come to realize that the Jackpot and thing I haven't done very good jackpot in because I don't have a horse that I can go practice out on and not only just loops because I've had lots. That can get lots of loops on every day but not one that runs. That's actually realistic Jackpot practicing. Also I think that that's why a lot of people do better than me at the jackpots. 'cause they have those horses they could practice it on but for the Rodeo type deal you know. I've got two good horses that I can practice do on that on all the time and Make Ten fifteen twenty runs a week on them doing that and so it kind of helps me. I think at the radio because that's the only run I make. I don't I don't make that long seven Nice Jackpot run? I'd just make Nice. Aggressive runs all the time. But you know it does hurt me Jackpot for sure but taking to the rodeos. It's like you have a really clear picture in your mind. What year capable of working on it and you have this feel because it's like you said you can get on a horse. It might not have that same feel and really what was getting out of your practice. Getting out of example. If you get cold that just come loving through there and you can count. Go turn steer. That really doesn't give you the feel of making Rodeo runner even and so making those and having a real picture how to how to make A. That's I think that's pretty solid way. I like that. Yeah Yeah I think if the guy is having a little bit of trouble with his swing or Split Horns or or popping it off or something like that. I think it's a good thing to get loops in a lot of them but like for me. I've kind of found the swing that I like and and I can do that consistently so getting the loops in all the time. I can do that on the dummy you know just understanding your resources was available and making the most out of it that pertains to competition. I think that's a that's a big deal now. What about your brother? I mean you get like you said he got two brothers and really rope well and I voted with. Your brothers are the last two years this is the second year now year. Seven pretty fundraising with your brother. It's been really fun. I grew up with my other brother Taylor and we wrote for a long time together and then he just didn't want to do it as much me. So he's stays home and ropes more at home and jackpots and stuff and then Then I up to them for a year and then Jason and I started dropping. And that's been it's been super fun of the highs are a little bit higher when you win with family. I could see that being real fun especially for him. He's Kinda gotten his family started and he's he's got a lot a lot on so to kind of do that and be successful. GotTa be really fun. But what about the communication you guys ever get into it because it's different when you're really comfortable with someone you cross the line without realizing it? Yeah it was something you gotta be aware of. I think it is We have we haven't had those problems that much But I agree with you you can. You can get pretty comfortable and be talking about something and not realize how much you offended them. And then when it's blood man fights get bad sometimes but him and I. We don't really fight that much. We get along pretty good And you know we have different ideas about some stuff but I just hold my tongue and let him think what he likes and He ropes good. So you know sometimes you gotta treat it like a partnership and not just family. His family gets tough sometimes. Well I think that's that's the big thing is we all see things differently. We can see around and get something out of it and it's going to feel different. Everyone so to be able to communicate to each other into build a team like is seven southend. I know him pretty well and I would say that guy. He's very positive like you said earlier but I think he probably was a good one to to really Rodeo with because he seems like you could probably talk through what's going on and get better as it. Is that something you learned from Amer? Where did you kind of start developing Yeah I think him and I did that a lot. I'm always always always got videos and watched them broken down stuff but I think I think him and I kind of started doing that for me. Because I never really Rodeo to make a living side I just wrote to Ira with and and We didn't practice that much. We didn't talk that much about it. And then you know you're out here losing money all the time. If you're not getting better it it makes you start building the run pretty fast which him and I didn't really practice that much together either but at least driving all the time together and stuff you know you have a lot of time to talk about it and think about what they want different what you do better or what what you think. He could do better to help you You know you want stare straight or right or left her stuff like that. Little things Jason and I. We don't really talk that much about it He kinda he likes to ride high so the steers stay always in the left lied. And that's just how he likes it. Which is fine with me. Most of the time some very few places. I'll tell them. Hey don't do not bring him left. Make sure they stay straight right but I grew up with him though. So you know. I know what how he's GonNa Rope. I GOT TO WATCH HIM FOR YEARS. Rodeo on and stuff at home before I started doing it so I kind of know what he's GonNa do all the time right. I think that's It's a big thing has happened that good. Msu with harder ship and the when it's blood like being able to separate the roping away from the family yep adds a whole different Degree to to the RODEO. So that's kind of cool to see if you watch the miners and they've got for a long time really never. I've never heard of anything like that. Like with those guys can stay together. They match their horses up really well and it just seems like I'm sure that they get into it but really they've they've done a great job. You guys are up less years and be successful. You know to win together. That's really fun. To to said is probably even better ones family. So Yeah Yeah. I think anybody rope with if you spend too much time with them. It's hard anybody is spent much time with anybody. Gets you always get the fighting? But more the miners even more impressive to me that their family. But there's no other odio team that joke that long together. Yeah it's it's like longs by far. Yeah -cations out but it's I think maybe Riley's got eleven and they've all been with Brady Brady made it one more time than Riley. And did they miss the finals a couple of times? Yeah and I think they missed it. Maybe once or twice but but that's not much that's the thing is to go from a bad year and then to continue to move forward as a team as good as it's impressive that they've been able to do you. Watch guys make the finals every year together and finish top ten and it's not good enough. They wanted to do something different. It's you'll see some teams like they couldn't lose for two or three years then they might have a top five top ten finish in their done. Yeah Wow yeah it's pretty. They're pretty quick to pull the plug. And that's it's different for everybody so You know you've learned a lot blaster for your Rodeo. I mean there's been a ton of experiences for some of these younger. That's wanting to give one piece of advice something that you've really learned in that. They should really consider if they're going to start Rodeo on TV. I think if you WanNa Rodeo I think the biggest thing you could do is he got to be honest with where you're at you know you got to be able to sit down and say okay. I am actually good enough. Mean you have to be positive but you have to realize if you're not getting enough but if you're going to do it you need to do it. You need to go all in and you can't work on the side. You can't do that. We can train some more stuff like that. But when when it's ready time you need to have three to three ED courses and and be ready to Rodeo and then I think the biggest mistake that people make which me saying this you know I ever made the finals and nothing but I think the biggest mistake is saying well. Let's radio the Cheyenne and see what happens. And I think if you want to make it any Rodeo from Odessa until the last weekend go to Stephenville go to whatever your last week and looks like but I think you need to do it clear till the end because if you just say well let's just let's just go to. Cheyenne and see if we're winning while you're just setting yourself up failure you're giving yourself that option for an out if you You Know Jake Stanley told him one time. And I don't recommend this but he said get a credit card and is your ended up as high as you can and then you realize and I gotta start winning but you know kind of that mentality of of. There's no other option for me. I'm doing this so it's either figured out or or do something different because I got to get better at this but it ain't. I'm not quitting so if I'm not good enough it's either me or my horses so either. I'm going to get better. I'm GONNA get better horses but this is what I'm doing you know. I think I think going all in on it is the best way and then three or four years in. If it's not working out then you can reevaluate but Going halfway on anything doesn't work. What do you think about accountability? And how you look at your job. Do you feel that? You're really trying to be accountable or something that you focused owner. Do you see a lot of I. Guess what the root of this question is. There's a lot of excuses so gropers make there's a lot. How do you feel about that? I think I think you guys got to realize how how to say the truth without being negative about it because you know like at San Antonio are first steering the SAM is I was upset about because Eight of the stairs were in a far steers from last year and then two were had three numbers and hadn't been aware of them and the first two I was third out I do split the gates and ran and the start was right behind him and then the third one dropped his head like he was going to go up to my broke the barrier by seventeen feet or something and You know I was upset about that. And and what I was upset about was the fact that they just added the steers on and and they had been anywhere I should have done a better job for sure. And that's the place where you gotTa know. I could have done a lot better but this is not. This is not how it should be. This is not right and being able to to be honest without without saying man I just felt like we didn't have a chance because steer just sucked. Well he wasn't a bad steer by any means it? Just you know how do you how do you know what he's GonNa do when the barriers that Short I could've seen more. I could have done a better job. And then you know that would have put us in a better spot If we even if we did get flagged out on the second one it didn't matter but Or you know steer drags or stuff like that. I mean you go work to strip and she ended a rope and lack number ten open. That's the funnest thing because you get to listen to all those guys and guys telling their partner Mammo. Somebody called me right as I wanted to throw my loop or something like that but you gotta be honest because like. I said you gotta be honest tiresome man. I'm I'm actually not good enough because I could sit here all day and say man if I just had Chad's horses I just don't have any money if I if I had more money I could. I could buy better horses and then I'd make it. I wrote as good as everybody else. Well you know like I'll tell you right now. I don't jackpot as good as everybody else. And that's not not me being negative. That's just me being honest with with where I'm at The accountability is is huge. You have to be able to to say man. I'm sorry I messed up. Not wasn't showed steer left. I would or you know you know exactly what I'm saying. But you gotta be you gotta be able to be accountable and say when you messed up but you have to be honest with yourself too because there is times when you you know like at San Antonio could've done a lot better but how do you know that So yeah I think complete ownership of what you do is so important because that at the end of the day the end of the year. You can look back in like okay. I was good this year and I made a few mistakes and I can do a little bit better. I'll get ready to go yet. But it means so then that way we get where you want to go. It's all Yugoslav because I got lucky here. The this happened and so I was prepared. I was ready. I made correct decisions. I made the adjustments needed to make and and I think that's man. I struggle with it but I feel like I do a pretty good job. I I go to a fault like if I don't if we're not winning doing good it's because I wrote good enough. Yeah and that's how I say there are times I'll be. I'll miss that. I'm art myself. I'll be I suck into ending. No you gotta be able to eliminate those thoughts and realistically look at the situation like hey. I miss a steer this barrier. He kind of hesitated or idea. And just like okay. My game plan going in and just didn't do my job exactly two and Into understand that I think you so much further so so much faster because when you go practice you like. Hey this I tried to Sean. It's not working. I need to feel add this to my video game I need. I need to be able to catch that second tier or I need to go to go real fast when when I'd be to whatever it may be but you get that ownership and what you're doing man that's when you can develop that. I think it's because the guys that I look up to Klay China. I think that guy he's he's GonNa talk some crap and he's going to let you know but when you ask him if he did good or bad he owns up to get legally one hundred percent and in my opinion is probably the greatest of all time. I looked up to jake. Barnes reading number one and Jake is the same way. It's complete ocean those guys when they don't do good they tell you. I did not do my job period and I look back. I mean I'm probably wasn't a big fan of them as I am now and had been the last few years. But is cody right about that guy. And you look at these. Great athletes that competitiveness that they had and ownership that was one of the biggest things that they had is they they wanted control over the whole thing and maybe sometimes to a fall when they would control it put that they wanted it to be all that and I think that at the end of the day is is huge. Yeah I would agree with you. Let's talk scenarios because I think this is one thing as a Rodeo header that you have to understand and there's all these radios are tournament style. You know you're advancing and you get a guys ten guys and there's all these situations where you might have to just catch or you might have to continue to make a run and everyone's mindset is a little bit different so I Kinda WanNa get yours on this. Let's Talk San Antone I you go. You're going to get ten guys essentially each night and so if you're one of the last teams out you're trying to put money together in those first few rounds so you kind of do you have like. I feel like for me as a header. Have a couple of different. Kinda GOTTA catch. That's pretty safe then. You have your normal run that you'd like you're trying to make all year long and that's it's as fast as you can go but when you throw throw it feels like a catch like I. Usually I feel like I can catch and then I have one more press as hard as I can at the barrier or I try to get a swing off pretty fast and and it's they're usually out there away and it's it's a little lower percentage is is that kind of is. Do you have that type of rounds or what? What do you look at you look at your? I agree I I don't really look at them in that way but it is. It is the same way like I make the same run everywhere. Just get a nice start. Try not to try not to be late but don't just break the barrier. You're like be just close enough to be within range and and go to the steer to calls Away be aggressive. But I'm not gonNA miss every time I drown first year. I think I think you're GonNa win something on the first year every time if he can't And then yeah. And then there's the other round like fifty fifty. GonNa get a swing off in the box and I'm either gonNA catch I or probably not cash a and then and then. Yeah it's it's I mean everybody should be able to to pull the rope down to steer takes over there backing be seven if you have to you I think I think the best patterns the top five headers have that run. That's like I'm not missing for sure. Their catch is five eight. I think that's what they do a little better than me right now. But I'm with you. I have about three three rents that I do really well When I just plan on doing that and so these rodeos that are like the tournament style bracket. I don't know exactly the creek way to call it. But like San Antonio it sets it up to where those first couple rounds. You're generally going to make that that run that you can catch but it's still pretty fast. And then that way when you draw real good steer you win first or second when you draw them stronger steers you get paid and so you can kind of add that money up and get an advance and then like we talked earlier. The the second one is the runway. Kinda gotta go pretty fast like he did at San Antonio and you gotta be three. You got to win I and when you connect it's it's great and it's usually getting paid right there where it needs to the scenario that I'm curious about is like this year at San Antonio happens a lot is like the American the other day. We're going ten guys and four or five teams have win and usually they those first few teams you start off with your own. That's fast you know you is. That is that kind of where you would be in them. First handful teams. Yeah if I'm in the first The first couple teams. I'm thinking I need to. I need to go aggressive. But not swing in the box and throw it at the barrier like an aggressive At San Antonio Safe I was in in the finals in the first four teams and aggressive for two four three would have been what I was going for. And then if everything set upright for my partner we can before flat and if everything did set up right we could be forced to whatever but basically I agree with you because you make it. It's on the other guys to beat you and use your steer used your horse and if everything goes together you can still win the Rodeo but as you get deeper into that those situations there's like this year it was. It was kind of soft for the first four or five teams. Those guys did make the rub for whatever reason and then it's a stack lineup of guys. No matter where you're at. Do you ever lay up in that situation and take the money and go. Just try to win a check. Or how do you look at those photos like that? I think If I was if there was four three teams after me where I could guarantee. Winning fourth Then that's where guys got to think about. You gotta catch but you WanNa you WANNA give yourself a chance to win something if those other guys messer you don't WanNa make it. Where is safety up? And then all they have to just safety up and beat me so. I think still you know if you're not the second to last email at that point you need to just still be Because to make it there it was super easy to be four three the whole Rodeo. You know four four. Four three was an easy random. Make over there because a barrier was short and steers were. Nice So I think he's still got to do that. Especially knowing that destination visas at the end because even if you come over the gates nego three nine. He's still going to tend to steer faster than he'll so it's all up toward his partner. Wants to do so. I think it's not. It's not the right time to try to be three but you don't WanNa take seven swings and go be six either right. You're trying to Max out the amount of money that you can win. Were lowering the risk. Yes is there any scenarios where you try to get off of the box and win the Rodeo right there And maybe if I had done good say Denver and had ten thousand one act Denver or something like that and I had a nice sixteen eighteen in already one five or seven San Antonio I could I can totally stand behind getting too often the box and try to be three five or three Especially knowing what steer was but my catch percentage is just so much better if I if I pull my wrote down get one as my horse leaves one at the barrier and and put it on before for that. I think my percentages would be way smarter to do that and it would be the cockpit and and not riding my horses good and if I had the perfect dear. I think I would probably still do that. But I think percents away better to just before for and and hope that I win third for sure and then you know four four. You got a good chance to move up second. While that's what's so crazy about roping and right now so it was San Antonio the first five or six or I five or six teams. There wasn't really that fast of a run made and then all of a sudden there to forty six and four three and four something like it got fast and it all happened in the last four or five teams and it's where he makes panel of like you got to be a header and heeler. There can make multiple runs but kind of know the situation. And that's what's really become a unique about these winter. Rodeos and Yvette shy in that format stuff you you kinda gotTa have a run that he almost got to have a feel for the Romania. And then your rod had nowhere place it and where to take calculated risks with. I think I think those tournament radios. Unless you're right at the end. I think you just have to try to make the fast because you have to try to win first and then hope that somebody else doesn't be an if they do you. Don't give twice because I mean you have to win. I like Fort Worth only two steers over there. You had to win first or second verse night realistically have a chance to make it back unless everybody just messed up secondly but even San Antone. I fear I'm going to try to win. I every time because I've got two more after it to to win money on if I mess up that you know and just play the percentages you just kind of if you could connect twice your have a great Rodeo once you still probably make back. Yeah even over there Max. Sure would he want a pile of money? He turned three stairs. He turned three in but you know his set. He knew where he was at. He would act first to messed up. He knew okay. If I win this night I can make it back. You want it tells back in. The Semis wins first. One night makes the short round goes forth flat in the short run when second radio wins. Twenty thousand or something. I will tell you when thinking about Matt Sherwood is there's money a lot of it. You're not getting much away from him. I think he is quoted the best headers around when there's money he just how to win but and owns the most. He's a catchy guy to you. So if he's going at deers like that. That was kind of my point if he caught three steers over there. It's because he was going out on because if he's trying to catch he's not missing but you know if he plays it that way then. It makes sense Chad. He went he went out. I wonder he had a real bad stairs in my set and cop I one and one it. It was fell apart the second day I went four to five five five two or something I I come back and go to on the second one thinking man. That was awesome. We're GONNA win it here and then Chad already. One thousand five hundred four nine win and fourth. He goes through nine just too often the box and over the gates like so. That's how those guys play it so That's kind of what I what I look at is is how those guys do it. And and it's real similar to what I thought about it too. You're just trying to Max your run out and the amount of dollars you can win. This isn't Chad. He's when you win around over there. And that the first set the first sets of San Antonio basically anywhere you're guaranteed you're almost always guaranteed a spot back yet and so now he's at first pays whatever twenty what is twenty. Five hundred rounds are going to pay rather out. I think it's twenty five to fifty seven fifty. Maybe grab and there's a big difference between first and fourth. So he's going to try to make the run the one sport I and and make those and get a big amount of money out of this Rodeo and and I think that's where translates to understand that there's only gonna be about four or five radio all year that really have that situation where you can put a big amount of money together and it's usually first or second yup and you know those deals. They're kind of. They're the playoff format whether it's data that shootout. You know. That's those are the two best checks and buy a bigger amount than a normal like ten money Rodeo. One right yeah. There's even a couple of Rodeos that that are like that to ten months. Like cody and San Juan San. Juan is a little different. Because there's only thirty teams but I play it the same way. I think pays nine thousand something to win it. You can pretty much catch US dear. Make a nice run. You'RE GONNA win a couple of thousand but manhind thousand win. I is guy was tasked to go up. Go out and try to win first or second. Yeah I mean if it takes seventy thousand to make the. Nfl Are you getting? You can get one seven to the way there once. Tear up with sixty four more steers to run or whatever it is ready to go to and I think that's that's The situations that Rhode Islander. They're getting to be pretty complex between. I mean there's always seemed like it was a one header two header with an average or tuna short. And you Kinda have the runs the unit that you need to act like Livingston. Cody you know. You GOTTA GO. Max One out said something and then you get those those rodeos whereas tuna shore It's a little bit different deal where you can kind of have steer. That's a little off but like you said earlier you if you catch that. I want to get paid in the first round. Yeah and it's because a lot of those times of the two Hetero like Spanish or something like that it's you really don't get a lay up and just go catch the second one so if you had one any money in the first round and then you're in a situation where I need to make a pretty good run but it's really hard to place in the second round your life. Okay you only have the average money to go and it's usually not as good because those teams that did place I held are going through our average as well. And so you're behind all those guys and it's like you're coming from ten or twelve or fifteen callback trying to win something. And so that's why it's like you've got to have a run that can get in those top four five six eight money's in the first round that's consistent enough to to keep your keep your money to get. Yeah for sure. I don't just go hat the first one but the first round is always ten times easier in the second one so if a if you can go for six why wouldn't you try you know. So that's what I think if shot to radio like Spanish which you just have to go so fast all of them Spanish anyways every year but even a a different Ogden. It's not as tough in the rounds. Usually every couple of years it is but you got the first one and you win something or you lay up at the first one you go six and you take yourself out of one chance to win something by doing that. So then he come back to the second one and he stopped placing around to try to win average money. And Yeah if you can go for eight on the first one and win something then you can come back on the second one and say okay. Well I can. I can still go for eight and I can win third in the average because somebody's always gonna be fricking stupid fast or I can I can go catch us one and win. Or you know you can evaluate where you're out from there but if you don't try to win something on the first one then you're always. I mean the second one turns into basically one header that hopefully you can win something in the average if you catch him. I I think that's a big thing to to reopen nowadays is having a run and knowing where to make and where to to risk and where to to press and where to not and man. I do I agree with you. I think that that run. That's like it's almost the same as a fifteen sixty team one header Rodeo. The you know you're going to be pretty aggressive. It's just not dirty dirty tough but if you can make that run if it feels like that's a little higher percentage where you get that one good horse and you. Kinda yeah pretty aggressive and I think that's that's where it gets when those start connecting you can really add up the wins and and get some bigger hits into. Yeah I think I think we said about making your own. All Year is is the deal because he started Odessa. And the box short mysterious or closer to your faster on year. Run then you get out in the summer and and my point though is that Chad does the same thing. All year long he makes same round Riley. Every everybody goes to very good goes to the steer. He never reaches. You never doesn't think stupid. T wait everywhere he goes. He hits the barrier pretty good and he reaches every sphere and he knows he's going to do. He does sixty five years year and it pays off for him I think I've gotten into that before in the middle of summer thinking man. Why being so aggressive everybody else's just catching play try. It makes it look so easy instead of just sticking to my game plan do what I do on every single steer it's GonNa pay off somewhere But you know you ever run like Riley. He knows I'm not GONNA win. I Lot I'm going to win. A lot of chicks t wade goes the other way. I'M GONNA win first and second a lot when I place he got to pick what you WANNA deal before you start and not try to change it throughout the year. That's what's hard is Is Stick to your plan all the time but if you do that then you're way better off. I think that's a that's a really strong point. T wait he tells me It's hard to not try to win one of those day money's when they're paying four thousand two they're just right there and he can do it and that's his mindset all year and he's going to win just like you said a lot of first seconds. Chad has around and both of those guys are usually at the. Nfl are really close to it. And in both great at staying with their I think that's you're exactly right. You can get in a lot of trouble and I think that's where suburbs can really go bad when you get watching a caleb triggers or someone like that that can or duston. Agassi's it's really. They're just so much game. And you're like man these guys stuck and I'm straight back. I need to press Yup. I need to do that and it just completely tastes you out of your element and you're playing their game out your yeah well. It's easy to do when it's going right. You know it's easy for me to make Myron all the time but be in Rodeo and more you realize now you know Riley Chad. They're more conservative over the summer. And there's a lot of times where they catch and they don't win anything but then all that a defect Dustin. He'll go for a week and not catch us. Dear you know but at the next one he still does the same thing. T- way does the same thing he was telling me yesterday and Matt they won thirteen. Eight hundred sixteen thousand something over the fourth. And then they made their run and they were catching. They weren't doing good. They didn't win. Nothing clear until Idaho Falls Preston all that week. They want nothing for a whole month. Basically three and a half weeks as a first week artists from first week and they're doing the same thing just it just wasn't in it wasn't working. They changed nothing and they won. Fourteen thousand that week oppressed in I know falls hieber. Great falls all them. They went fourteen grandmothers week. That's where it's so important to watch these veteran guys like Matt great example. I mean he's not going to press the panic button he's just gonNa stay with it and he knows get just seemed the other day as Intel said he tried to go real fast missed a couple and then he goes and catches and I think he was one of the first guys a at San Antonio is a real good example when he went it. It might have been pretty open. I think might have been just like a five. And he still he takes. He makes it rough that wins. It's guaranteed really good money and it is flipped around too. I think they split. Yeah there's still four flat and everything really come together for him but it was like it was perfect heading in that situation and I think that's where you get those veteran guys and you can really alert law from them as they they stay consistent to what they do all year for it just like you said Odessa to Stephenville. Yeah Yeah and they know they know the places like. I'd never been estes park before last year. And that's just part of being young and not being the places but we were in maybe the fourth perf and the slack was still after us but you know forty teams have gone when we and it was so easy so easy like we'd have been. I think we'd have been Jason up lagging. We'd been maybe five one or or four nine or something. We'd have been winning second after forty teams. If you're one of the second usually win at something and I just didn't know it seemed like easy but I can figure out why nobody caught you know waft slack. I think maybe four eight and one nothing like those guys know from Star and some of them guys in my purse. That that her old veterans that know what they're doing and they were bombing and I couldn't figure out why like what did they do it. Why are they being stupid like that? Well they know they know where they're at. They knew the estes always ends up. Like that Places that are that are that way. Just turn out that way and nil so typically to like S.'s. A really good example. Because it's it has one hundred teams usually right around there and there's a half an upstairs and that pretty fresh I run so the starts now very true and if you can hit the barrier you can have a role in blast one but it is so hard to do it when one steer might start and the next one and they're just really inconsistent and you don't know and that's not a lot of money he's won. That first job was soon as a severe storm leaving true they are they get after them. And that's that's part of. It is like at Estes. If you take a run earlier in the week you know you know you're going to have to be super aggressive to win something and it's going to be hard but you get a late round. Probably a casper. And you'll know what it takes to make it back over there casper steers you're doing and if you can. If you know what type of run it takes to win. That's that's where it Kinda comes together. So Yeah we. We've been going for a while. I do have one last question because it just happened last night. Calgary and so there's mixed emotions because this is so frustrating about the PR. Is that in this last year too. There's a lot of good things happening. Espec- lead with TV and cat was being. We've got all these opportunities. How exciting is that to be? Were know you ever watch the radio's on TV. And there's a lot of marketing opportunities that are looks like it's in present themselves for capitalists but there's the rain or the pro tour and it's supposed to be a certain amount of dollars attitude. Toria and they let a few radio slob less added money and I'm pretty sure the rules. It's said this way but we're going to let things go. So these really is can still be there. Okay and then. Calgary never had teamed up before as far as I know Added any event. But I do know that fifty thousand five hundred what pays fifty than twenty five hundred hundred one hundred hundred thousand twenty five eight. Twenty five maybe. Yeah so yeah. It's a big gap in in the final. Four that shootout but a huge huge change could make your whole year round up and and to my knowledge or do you know much about how much is added. Yes so I don't know the exact dollar mountain the other events but I know the team roping. They added thirty five thousand and then with the five hundred dollar fees which I don't know about fees in the other events but I would almost bet they don't pay fees With the five hundred dollar fees. There's going to be fifty thousand total. So that's a good Rodeo. But it ain't compared to what the rest of the Rodeo is and Yeah Garrett Tanaz. These post really nailed it on facebook It's an amazing Rodeo. And it's awesome to have the team roping but for it to be approved if the Rodeo has a short round which are doing in the team roping asked to equal money for it to be a PR SIERRA TO YOU and they're not doing that and And that's wrong to just break the rules but also I see it from both sides because you gotta start somewhere you know I. I think that they're on the right track of. You gotTa have the Rodeo. They gotTA have open before they're just GonNa added in that all that money. They got to have it. I but It seems more to me. Like the just wants their six percent of that. Rodeo than they care about making it better for the cowboys I get that same same feeling to the Kelsey chases the other day. I did a podcast about breaker rippin. It would you know what do you think it takes the car and I just was curious but answer the question. If they didn't give you the same amount of added money as all the other events. Would you still want to do that? And she said yes but I love as far as she said yes if they could show me a pathway how get all the other events yeah and as such a strong answer? I feel I really feel now. The T. V. Because like okay. Here's Calgary if you said all right we're going to have is at ten percent of what the other events getting probably it's probably pretty close to ten percent so they're getting all the investigating ninety percent money which sounds really bad but there's not groping there so you got now you at least at t. v. but okay three years from now it'll be equal money because this is the roadmap to that. We're going to start this year next year and to go here we're going to have a little bit more of fees change whatever they wanna do but it just seems like okay. We're going to test it out this way and make pure see Rilya but there's really no guarantees and man. That's that's one thing for a professional radio station. It sure seems like we're there's rules that are changed pretty quickly and it's I don't know if it's true or not. I get what I think's GonNa look bad for us. Is that that money counts. Now Calgary is GonNa Count for the Kaffir open and stuff so the calf roper is. Get Two hundred dollars this year and there's going to be somebody at the finals with over two hundred thousand one. I don't know how much I'm sure. All of the hundred doesn't count but still even fifty councillors one more person that gets into the finals for sure because of that and then at one hundred fifteenth place is going to have. Dang near hunted thousand one and then the team opens. GonNa be seventy and IT'S GONNA make us look look pretty bad first place in the gaffer opens can have probably close two hundred and the team roping can have about one twenty. Well that's Manda is opens a whole kind words because as a really really good point it takes away spot far essentially when you give fifty thousand dollars. He's pretty much made the far. And that's something that's pretty big but also you got to thinking. Oh I don't know the exact number but it's over. Half of the membership thinks over half the members of the team members. And you're not letting them you're not making it mandatory. That will run through the same about money. It's kind of odd that I understand. That team of it is not as entertaining and as a rough stop prevent. Or even I think regular opens probably entertains anything but there are some some things you could make that argument at crab team doesn't look the best and end up and you gotta go a lot faster and so the miss. There's quite a few more misses than pets. But what it takes to make a good run. There's a lot that goes into it and so for for Rutgers Thunder fans outer seven. That's kind of tough. But from the Rodeo Association perspective manage sure seems like. Wouldn't you WANNA keep fifty percents of your members really happy? Yeah so other the balance there but I do talking about because hopefully we'll fire some some change and the sports going that way I really do. I agree I think it's going correctly right now. I agree. I think the cowboys channels can do a lot US You know before everybody wanted to know. How did they all look through results? Everybody from home when now we go three on one at the Semis in. Everybody watched it. And I'm a before I even got out of the Arena. Could turn my phone back on. I had fifteen messages from people at home. You know good job so so happy for you and I think I think that's going to take us a long ways. I agree and world. I think what it's GonNa do to is going to get them. All Rolling on your crossfire rules and things like that. I'm telling you. I Want San Antonio I wants a first few rounds a little bit of the roping and but that night I think goes to the pre-open Mike. Survey that you get flagged for us and the next morning on facebook I'm talking groups like it was bad at it. Reminded me of the Saints Football Fan. Saints Rams call the the passive the no call ago. Yep I think it was not to go super bowl but the the game before but probably the worst call. Nfl History Guy. It reminded me of that. You know I was waiting for there to be means of a and it's book. It creates a lot of buzz when you put it out there on that scale and so it I think in change. It's it's getting enforce. It's going to force them to make changes to Rodeo a little faster. Hey there's twenty cowboys at South Tonight. Fans that may not really understood what was going on. Aren't diehards but you get the whole. Yeah industry watching run. And they're like. Hey this guy. Now now you've got to make moves and I think that's where channels doing great. I'm really excited about those things. Because it's it's hopefully next year we'll be situation where those kind of things can be corrected. Yep I hope so or even before that so well man we cover a lot. Today's or anything else. You WanNA cover on podcast. Not that I can think of. I really appreciate it. Thank you very much as yeah. Thanks for having me.