#368 - Asif Kapadia
Finally on the podcast, this week, we chats, the hand of God, drugs football, you know, all the major food groups with Diego Maradona director, Asif, Kapadia kind of bad cop movie looking for some killer. And then they go to the hotel room and everything's stuck up on the wall. Joining that's my brain all that. And more on the movie podcast that started training for a ten k run again. And frankly, guys is not enjoying it. Hey, here's an idea instead of running ten thousand meters. One time one, run one meter ten thousand times so much easier take that on board the pod. I'm Chris, you. It's welcome to the empire podcast, this week, I'm joined by not one not two, but three three call leagues of such lethal cunning. Well, actually speaking, one isn't colleague, was my boss, your boss, be your colleague, Terry white, what do you think about that? I'm gonna vote. We've got wind. We've known each other awhile. Now we've become over the years acquaintances rocky times difficult. Beginnings, some may say. From that, from that barren ground has come the shoots of, of, of friendship. I think so I think we went from mild dislike to hated you. Hey, did you say? Full blown, but now look at this, but can't, but can't Bramson to you is kind of boss, an underling ever be colleagues because there's always that relationship. I know that you can fire me at anytime and, you know, I will probably be ignored come in the next day. Anyway, Georgian Seinfeld. Still to the empire empire hasn't even been publishing. Empty room with a single quarter. Dripping down. Wonderful times enough about Boris Johnson coming leader. Oh, no. Oh, no. Anyway. No politics in this podcast. Helena harra? How are you? I'm very well. Thank you. Good. Good. Known each other for a long time can call leagues. Befriends Chris over the known you I've come to regard you as someone. I'm. That's great. Yeah. You know, I was thinking about your ten thousand times running a meter a really good idea. But maybe if you do those ten thousand meter runs say on the same day I think it could you could be on something. I don't see how pulse possibly work. What string the ten thousand just run one mater, and then immediately run ten thousand times, and then another mater also and then repeat? How you say meter keep saying, meter meter meter looks very sexy today on Jalan says, meter, can you say lovely way, hashtag meter can you can you say that can you can you sexual harassment isn't it? Looks beautiful today. Your objective fine her. Yeah, don't object way. You muster brains beauty? She says meter. I don't know what's happened anyway. But I think Terry and Helen now, and I didn't which is. And I didn't which is. It's been going that way. Jim, we let means that leaves me in you James Dyer is also here, the podcast which is nice. I guess we might as well pair up. We've known each other longtime too long so much. Absolutely all would say can colleagues ever become friends. No, thanks to you. He's still for the poker game. All right. Okay. All right. So it is time now for a question on the book has now we've always friendships Terry's case, maybe something a little bit more. I'm intrigued with this. I wanna see what this develops over the over the podcast less ever have a question from a reader, showy great or listener. Even because this is one cast. Clark eighty-five Steve said based on twenty five year old Justin Bieber challenging fifty six year old Tom Cruise this week to a fight. Did you see that basically he wants to fight Tom Cruise in an octagon why? Because it's very unclear is really hard to say. But presumably, he wants to be killed by Tom Cruise. I'm getting when you've of all star challenging his critics boxing matches. Yeah. I forget, he fol critic didn't they think it is critic. I don't remember who it was. I think he won because he is quite good at books. Yeah. Yeah. Better. Boxing might say them making films. But sure very much. So. Indeed. So anyway, Steve harks question is what movie star who is thirty one years older than you, would you challenge to a fight. Now thought this question was dangerous because basically means we all have to reveal what year. But, but I did look it up. And I have to say Tom Selleck. You're going down my friends. I'll he would absolutely destroy. You see one years between you and Tom Selleck no other goal. I know. Let's go on their only one of us can grow moustaches. Well, what's happened with that? I would have thought you closer in age, how dare you would this type place around the dinner table and blue bloods, no be in an octagon fun. Because in this case, I think he'd enlist the help of that irritating, grandad grandad the worst cartoon history television. You on the head with something while you grant that would distract me because I'd be I'd be focused so much kicking the shit out of the Granddad, Celik would come in and just like blindsided like the philosopher after drastic park I lever, Celik, he's pounced upon me on the kitchen table. An and it goes no weird direction meth on. But, you know, all good I'm definitely not going to do the maths and work work out, who's thirty one years older than me. But I will say the best and most definitive answer to this came from Brent Spiner aka data who challenged Angela lansbury. Only for Dick Van Dyke to step in and defend Angela lands breeze honor by offering to fight on her behalf at which point Brent Spiner back down which point Dick Van Dyke. Colton Brent spineless more light. Yeah. And Brent refused rather, politely to make any jokes, take fun, dykes name, which was probably wise and they ended up making up and it was beautiful. But it is generally the best thing that's happened on Twitter in about five years. Let me just crunch on this, so Brent Spiner. Yep. Was happy to fight eighty something year old woman. I think she's actually nineteen ninety seven year old woman, but when Dick Van Dyke steps in he turns tail and runs that is correct. Cowardice. I have. Okay. Some you'll Jackson. Jackson, too. I mean seriously. Who would you have your money on? I think it's a really difficult thing. You're ferrell. You are wearing a beret very well right now. Like so you're are going on. She's a better match for people might expect do you know what I mean? Because he also wears a Barry. Well, this is a very sexual podcast. Profane. We both swear out them. Yeah. Yeah. Laugh I challenge some you'll Jackson to a beret-wearing swear. Oh my God. For once you get the blood list, once you get that sort of, you know. Yeah. James, our fingers, a lot of compliments phone around here today. So you are looking ferry old. You're looking at me. On their there. Who would you fight someone thirty one years older than me? I'd have to say, Bradley Cooper. Well. James was child higher. A long time ago in a galaxy far far away, which makes us who quite complicated. I'm going to find you someone you're gonna find me a person to find I'm gonna find you a an actor to fight are here we go. Here we go. You should fight. Donny defeated. Defeats defeat. Oh, can defeat the veto possibly not trophy. I think you'd have me you bought my ankle bite. Your ankles quick, headbutted the balls in wins. He's scrappy absolutely site of sorry. I'm just like running. Yeah. Slash fiction. Sorted for the next week or so. While he'd run between your legs. And, you know, bite the Naasi all AB all up in your grill, he'd go full penguin, he toppled you like Gulliver. Then climb. Who came stand? Kick you in the jewel of the Nile, that's for sure. So there you go. The veto fighting James Dyer in the car park of Morrison's next week and. Time now anytime any you gonna kick him over window. The word for that member. We learned to live defenestrate. Letting Terry it was. Well done Terry well done. Horseman TV podcast last week using the time. I am big pentameter, which then had to explain wasn't fucking words. I am big pentameter. It was you being a Belen and talking about I am. TV podcast. That was the problem. Yeah, this is a recurring theme, by the way, if you're a screenwriter near listening, dicara name. Bic pentameter is a great one because you can have a car to come in and go, I am BIC pen, Tomar. See. Shakespeare related comedy. Have one of your characters be called BIC pentameter guy. Comes in goes, I am BIC pen damage her labs have party because that's what he says, his country's okay? Big Ben damage error. If you wanna have your question right out in the podcast, as Steve Clarke found to his cost you can get in touch fire a number of methods where on Twitter, as at empire magazine use hashtag, and propulsion. Or you can Facebook as well where we're Zine or you can Email us podcast at empire online dot com. Use subject heading BIC pentameter, or chances are we won't see it. Anyway. Should we move on to this? Movie news. Can we talk about that TV news as well? I mean. Well, we must believe there is some sort of podcast, that is already existing daycare, tell me about it. Chris. Basic bingers. Really good guys. Check out. No. It's the pilot TV podcast, James and my understanding is that it's a favorable every week and it features, you, Terry whites, my boss slash colleagues slash friend Boyd Hilton, one of my favorite journalists named after a hotel, Jane. Right. Sounds very good. Sounds essential even. Yeah. With Steve TraveLodge of. And of course, Brian premier. Yeah. All good. So that's available every Monday. I'll give you some fucking news. So there's a TV series, the Vilna than legendary is has, has announced that he's going to be involved in a spinoff TV series about the Benicio Sirat sisterhood. Oh, yes. This is very cool. Yeah. This cool, it is cool. Allow James D coolant now. Explaining Helen juden blame everyone do it enough. This is the sisterhood of, you know, think nuns, but kind of Machiavellian a lot more like JAMES BOND jenex. Yeah. Very into you jenex on a particular scale, so they are working towards creating a particular future. And making sure particular people are born in particular times, and they use every tool at their disposal, including their own reproductive organs to make sure that, that happens, except, of course when they choose not to everything goes a bit squishy with the God, emperor of June and everything else. So they're literally manipulating the fate of the universe. Sometimes by having sex with people, sometimes killing people sometimes by all sorts of different means field. Tom jabbar. Helen, you just described the conservative party. No. But they're very competent the Benegas era, and they know what's happening, and they plan, so willing. So it's very, very new politics. Indeed. My only concern about this is this is an entirely female sisterhood, and there are no women currently announced in the production team, which is Elizabeth concerning. You know, you've got villanovan in charge and he's great. But at the same time, like a little bit more female input might school June, the sisterhood and yet, the sisterhood is not involved -actly. Yes, nothing. So my understanding is that Rebecca Ferguson's lady, Jessica, right? He's one of the Benny genzer indeed. So she's kind of screw things up having a son, when she sold have a daughter. Right. Timothy Shamma aka more Deeb. I'm about with this down. Do we think that Rebecca Ferguson is going to turn up in this television program as well? I wouldn't even issued a movie star. Wouldn't expect her to play major role but we know the mother superior casting right from the film, which was shot ramping, Charlotte Rampling. So I'm imagine short rambling would play more for will. But it could well be that it's a particular off of sisters particular mission that we see. So that might not be the case who knows or desk to dream June. The sisterhood of the traveling pants will be coming to a streaming service soon. But this is cool, right? Actually drill into this a little bit deeper because this is what they wanted to do with the dark tower initially before the completely where they had initially announced it with Ron, how're it was going to be director, as it was going to be three movies with two TV shows to bridge, those movies, that have Bardem would actually be in those TV shows as well as roll into Shane before he moved on and Ron Howard moved on, and it all went terribly, terribly wrong, and also Netflix this week, if announced that they have a show runner on their grand plans for the narnia series as well. The comic narnia series and as the co writer. Of cocoa, Matthew Aldrich. And he's gonna come on oversee the whole thing, and that's going to be TV shows films lead into other whole interconnecting narrative. Do you think this is a future in a we're way? And also the fact that Phil move is directing. This is interesting me, he's not just doing the film or films. And then just pass it off to some June dude to do you know a junior junior. So he's, he's doing himself. And I think that's interesting for the first episode, but he's also and then he'll be locking down to visual template for four dollars. I mean, obviously marvel or doing it with our Disney. Plus GM says, well much more, I think closely tied the universe than what we've seen from them before. So, yeah, it does seem like it's a brave new dawn away to get your cinema audience to watch your TV shows voice, versa. I think is a big part of as well. And also to use the characters that you have the aren't quite cinematic enough. Maybe for the big big, big screen, but I go workout. Right. Because I think I see the benefit for streaming and potato feel nerve, who as you say consent. The whole ten play and can make sure that the quality when it meets over to that is of high of cinema, because that's we know from some of the marvel shows what they lacked was the same quality as the cinematic universe supposed to meet really working. I what still belongs on a cinema screen, and what belongs on TV screen because while people are, you know, we took this a lot on empire and pilot while people moving between those things far easier, people consuming them with much more, too. They all still different experiences than there are still things that formal see to pay new fifteen quitting seen them big in scale and scope and, and an epic honest in screen and then something slightly different on TV. I think you still need some kind of differentiation between the two so that people understand why they're watching it whether watching as well. Yeah, I grew them, but this potentially intriguing I would just, you know, giving the an order entirely of women, I would like to see some more women in there. Oh, you'll get, you know. The conservative party. Yeah. Very excited about that. And there was also some video game adaptation news this week or over the course of the last week as well. The division Tom Clancy's the division was changed controller be Boris to tears about aliens is gonna become a movie on net flicks. With Jake Jalen hall, and Jessica Chastain attached and David Leach gonna be written as well. Netflix of snapped it up, which is kinda surprised me that no major studio would go near that property with that caliber of talent attached us exciting. Is that exciting JIMBO? I mean, if it involves them running around, areas, killing brainless soldiers never ending grind for better loot than yes. I'm sure you're not a fun game passing the game bored me rigid. I haven't played the division too, because the division one may be lose the will to live, but it's, it's a particular honor of game. So it's which requires great investments of time for many ways. Let loan I reward. So I I'm not okay. So let me play devil's advocate here my. Theory for longtime has been that you can make great movie based on video game. If you don't make video game I if an if you pay no attention to any. Like crank is a great video game movie. It's just not based on video. So maybe if they just ignore the video game apart from baby, the title, then it can work is just a name recognition thing, because there's no real need to based on the difference, because it's a slightly sort of miscellaneous future post, apocalyptic landscape, you need to basil manifest. So do that. Do that indeed. And also be uncharted movie is creeping closer has now dates and that date is December. Eighteenth twenty twenty and this one's going to start Thome Holland. The noted historian, who is going to step up the plate and play young. Is it definitely that Tom Holland high? And let me just take a quick look here. No sorry, Tom Hallman, the director of chance, play and night is gonna step up the plate and play a young Nathan Drake, which is a bit of a stretch. Are you? No. Is it the other one? Okay. Okay. See the footballer. No. The guy fix James roof. No. Tom holland. The guy place Spiderman. He's going to be young Nathan Drake in the uncharted movie which is out December. Eighteenth twenty twenty directed by Dan Trachtenberg director of ten Cloverfield lane. Now. You won't be surprised. No, I haven't played this game but my understanding, JIMBO is that Nathan Drake is a really grizzled Indiana Jones type in his forty two. So this is going to be a prequel little Tom Holland playing young Drake. I wanna see Nathan Fillion paying older. Nathan Drake for that is what was ordained. And that is what we deserve. Here's the thing. Nathan Fillion is cliche boring casting, for that role. He's excellent. Because the right casting for twenty years, Kyle motherfucking Chandler. He's handsome little bit like him easy grounds going on. He's got the manliness. Clear is full. He's not really a Nathan Drake for me. He's not quite as roguish. Yeah. He can be roguish pretty good. King of the monsters. He wasn't roguish. He was pissed off. He was solid, solid pay someone told us this week that the house, he is in the beginning of the kingdom, monsters is also Tony Stark's house in avengers endgame. And Helen you found this out didn't you can rent it on Airbnb hundred dollars a night. I think we should go much was it before it was in one hundred dollars eight hundred dollars night. I'm thinking, live show. I'm thinking us for Jane select audience face, you'll select crowd funded you have to pay for flights and accommodation as well as the, you know, the stuff. But if we can raise to the numbers here crush crush with half a million dollars now and the end of July, I think we can make this a reality. And then we combine adventures game some more, we haven't on that enough. We haven't really discussed that we should talk about the Puerto portals portals, portals, portals portals, but yeah, Colin Chan he's, he's right, there, guys. Is Nathan drag culture. Those guys should be a much bigger star than is agreed. And here's my thing. A few weeks ago, people were, were Pooh, poohing me whenever I was raising idea of Nicole plans superman. Now it's all people can talk about. I walk and lead the building, I could hear people. And I think the same thing is going to happen with culture. Nathan Drake degree the same thing will absolutely happen as what happened when you suggested Nicole superman. Nothing. Yes. Absolutely nothing. All right. Any other news? Terry news. News day Michaela. James looks really excited already so Mindy Kaeling, she's of information promotion for late nights, and was talking specifically about MS marvel and the Kamala Khan incarnations of been full in the comic book series, two of which Carol Denver's who've which would Kamala and miss of Noah's been in kind of production marvel on enough for maybe the best part for decades. So when we did the Cup to mobile story earlier this year, they talked about how the had been various moguls and development. This is obviously a very specific warned the first Muslim hero. And caylin basically said she wrung mobile and said, I really, really would like to do it. And I will be involved in whatever way, it takes to make this happen and said the sensually they sounded very receptive. That means into actually getting into development I do not know. They came to her. And then she made the offer of doing anything, basically to make this happen. But maybe I'm maybe misreading Matt one of, but no, it's, it's the Cummings are so popular these, these cell way more than your doctor, Strange's, New Orleans, the galaxy and she's just a phenomenal character. She's really good. She says volume, see in young and excited as Spiderman, but she has a whole other raft of issues and questions in her life, different very, very different powers. She's had some really cool funny storyline. She hung out with a teenager low key. It's a long story for a while, which is really funny, but, like she's a different set of problems in a different type challenges. I think she I know that, you know, many Kelly was speculating about the Disney plus service in the service. I wonder on the big screen genuinely don't want them to be scared of this, because she the comics are so good. And so big, I think they have a real opportunity here to her on the big screen in the same way that they may doctor strange into thing in the same with the made gardens. The galaxy into thing, MS marvel should be. A big screen thing. And I really don't see that he could be really important Paul the next phase. And there's no, we don't see any natural reason it would go on Disney. Plus, I mean, unless they really wanted a piece of hair. Oh content. Give it some kind of big marketing. The get go by I think is absolutely. Disney plus and Kevin Vikings. This week revealed the I kind of behind the scenes, or I busy concept art, concept art from, from the lewke show, which had a marquee for jaws in the background. So it does look he's going to be bumbling his way through human history as has been said before. So that's going to be interested all been kind of spinning off from the bigger franchises. And that is missing that don't think I am. But it's like look iwon division Falkand winter soldier scarlet, which he mentioned that one and hawkeye's gonna get his own show, as well. So I'm not sure they're going to maybe will debut, some new characters on the on the Disney service, but Kamala Khan is a great way to go. Very good playable character on marvel puzzle quest, girl, re stars very good. She can attack the team all at once and when she does so your team gets a energy boost as well. So that's a good character. Little tip there. Please do not play a puzzle quest. Chris, too deeply. I am looking to join a new alliance. Guild in while the warcraft anyone wants to cut me. Join Lance marvel pose a question. Hit me up. My username on the game is palled empire. That is my username is. Polled. So. Jensen dragons. Don't candy crush with character. Oh character James described the best thing. Game. Any better is if you're in club ended up somehow as a playable character. In this game. I'd be very happy. He do you know the black Adam has a director, that's exciting. Well, Helen, I will tell you, thank you for asking it is John may call. It Sarah who, of course, is the director of. Well, he's working with Dwayne Johnson on jungle cruise and black Adam in case you don't know what it is. This is possibly the longest in development movie, and the DC you, it's been a development long before any of the movies that they've made in the last few years. And this is black Adam is the arch nemesis, a mirror image of Zam, but he can't actually good any song to find out what he's listening to the power. He's lacking. And this was mooted long before the movie was in development. I think they were kind of see how that one went. But now they are going to have a blackout him because jomie, Sarah, who's directed toward Johnson on junk accrues, which is out next year is looking like he's going to direct this movie as well. Director, also of four movies with leeann Leeson can you name them? The flights. No kidding. In-flight. There is a Red Eye. Okay. Okay. Number one. Okay. All about transports all transport. The one where he played two commuter, commuter. Okay. That's okay. No, no one is from a few years ago is the one. We're big Liam kind of loses his mind little bit. He has a knee. Oh, Diane Kruger, correct. Yes. Unknown, which is at amazing were big limb and Aidan Quinn you can't use thing. This thing is going to give it away. And then the last one came out of fear years ago. Big limb and Mike. Good friend, Joel Kinman. They're the running all nights. That's the one to there we go. So John McCall gerege decent para fans director, of course, also of goal to living the dream. So you have put goods like fine. I mean, the rock has been attached to this for ever. So let's just do it. And get move on with our lives. Yes. Absolutely. It might be great. Couple of things before we move on sheriff Spice Girls it back. They they're playing Wembley stadium. Tonight's, it's according to be somewhere else. They're back the touring twenty four from touring. But they're back in a new animated movie that permit animators gonna make and all five are going to be involved. So posh baby scary spicy, dozy de biggie mickan in Spice Girls, funny, because that was the working title of June. Spencer's. It's interesting that Victoria, the posh is involved because she. Pretty much involved. Just explain this apparently, that's always the thing because remain for Hof least along to there, too. That's. The Victoria, did not want to be involved in new spy skills activity, because she's a multimillionaire, and has their own fashion line and is very serious fashion person is not the best singer. Sorry. Can hear Mel c is a Felton singer? Right. She, she's a range of at least an octave say can. Can. Let's chase Victoria, being involved, somehow has become a witch kind of indicator of quality, I think potentially extra quarter inch to quote book so great. What is the name for books? She's written a book, she'd never read a book. She has written a move. I'm okay. She's going to his books and he's. Yes, she so she, she called a brick something that extra quarter inch which is about just the perfectionist fashion just with that little extra thing, that's where the autobiography cold. Okay. Okay. All right. Hedwig. You don't sleep China dropped. Ooh. This is exciting. I have of yet to sit. In fact, because it has dropped world. We've been in recording this podcast. But apparently it is in many ways these success at this time, cubic movie, which I had not seen coming up hap- shoulda them shining sequel insead into shining. Shocker sequel to cube Ricky shining, which obviously distinguishes heavily from Qinglin Shiming and kings involved in this film, and king famously heights, the cubic film. So is interesting that they are rattling. These two wells like a great big tax is it does seem to be as much a sequel to the Kubrick film, as the king book. You're, you're absolutely. We really not book secret, reply one, and that would have been more in keeping boy, I'm really excited about this. I have seen the true yet but in my Flanagan I trust. I think this could be absolutely blinding. So. Yep. There we go. And then just to really, really quick bits Kevin Hart is in the market to remake, Scrooge, d-. Well, look. I mean. You know, every generation gets Christmas Carol. Unfortunately, the last one got the Robert Zemeckis animated film, which wasn't great. But even though my inclination is no. Don't touch cruised? It's perfect. Pretty close. Yeah, it's pretty great. But I just feel like maybe I should be generous. And allow someone else to consider the possibility of maybe remaking, even though it's perfect. I think this would be good role for Kevin Hart. I think he could do great things with actually. Yeah. But also like. Good bits in that, that were just pure Bill Murray and, you know, it is it is the most Murray of Murray. I love Scrooges, Florus film. And in fact, very quickly finally, before we talk about the most important movie news, the week of his Steven Spielberg is going to write something for Jeffrey. Katzenberg is launching this new, I can't get my head around what it as a words available, but it's called or even how you pronounce it. But it's called queer BI or cli- be see, that's the thing like pick a word people know how to pronounce Geoffrey. You think you would know how it's a abbreviation of quick bites so it's now Quimby Q I b I so quick by Quimby whatever it is. No, lots of famous, people are going to be writing stuff and directing stuff and producing stuff for this platform. Paul fig is attached to develop shows for this platform. I assume people be able to watch their phone Don. Cheadle is attached to show as well emerged this week Steven Spielberg is going to write a series of horror shorts for this, which is very, very cool because he hasn't written anything since two thousand one with a artificial intelligence but before that was really close encounters and poltergeist as well. So exciting stuff, and they probably to be short chapters ten twelve short. Chapters seven to ten minutes. Each Spielberg's written six, th us far bit busy at the moment on west side story then Indy five to do as well. But you agree, wants them after dark apparently this. Right. Says you'll find registers that the sun has set. And that's when you are able to unlock the content and watch it. But you must be able to set vent that, right? Put my aunt onto the McQuillan won't be won't be licensed by St. work. You'll know when dusk is in the time that you're in. Chains o'clock on your phone whenever I used to play when the Star Wars games on my phone and your life through planet over time you would just go in just change your phone or was a candy crush. It was candy crush was just changed the Likud your phone, and then it would think it was like eight hours later, and so all your lives replenished, and I should try this remarkable puzzle you have too much free time. How do you weekends Terry? What do you do? What do you do? Terry watching sanely grim and violent television shows or films brim supermarket? Right. Leifer mine. If anyone wants to come pay speaking, insanely violent can we talk about Quentin, Tarantino? We can because he talks this week to us in vikes about his punts for Star Trek are rated swearing Star Trek and a half to say I'm I'm trying to digest this, and I'm having having a little bit of trouble. So obviously we've had swearing in Star Trek. Yeah. Most notably recently in discovery, they've even dialed it back there, because they kind of did it, and it was a bit like feels weird, and I feel like they've kind of just a mother fucking stunt or a steady. Go, where no mother fucker has gone before. I just don't know if we need it, and I'm, you know, I'm trying to be open minded to the possibility of very different kind of Star Trek. And then I don't. I'm kidding. I'm I love this. I was just been cast nine this week. And it's still so fucking good. But I just I I'm trying to be open to this possibility of an r rated swear Star Trek and on, I am I'm trying to wants it. And I don't want to, but he's Quentin Tarantino an zooming. It'll be good and I'm wrong and everything else. So I just wish he'd stop and not do that. I'm curious as to how you feel. You cannot have too much, everyone should be making Star Trek. I want to channel this just fucking starts. You've just proven my point. I love swearing. I love Star Trek. What's not putting these two great things together in one glorious concoction, it's very Star Trek, as cokes, wall, L great. I know the fucking hall. Dinning counter. It far point like Picard drops a mayor right there. I, I know this an I just I feel like it shouldn't be your intention. It shouldn't be like, if feels more like winter, Tina, imposing himself on Star Trek, and maybe that's completely unfair and wrong. And I hope to be proven on Farren Roman this, but it feels weird to me, and I don't feel like we need that. Discovery recently has more flex in Star Trek. I think than maybe than maybe thought because traditional starter had a very distinct woman fuzziness tour. And I think and there's something comforting about that. And I've always worried about maybe like discovery went on, I think it brought more and more of that back, and I think more and more of that work, I felt like a moved away from the swearing actually, and it moved towards relationships. I'm fascinated by this because, you know, we turn to, you know, has said repeatedly lent, he's gonna make ten films as director. I mean technically once on time in Hollywood is ten film because if you spit kill Bill into two anyway, it's a whole kind of worms, but the next film, to this will be his tenth and final film, if he sticks to his word, and frankly, I don't think he will. But you never know his wife box yourself in. What if he makes he's gonna Tarantino? He's gonna Soderbergh all over the place. I'm retired. Absolutely absolutely. You know, he's like though he like. It's classic tarintino go, you're gonna make ten film then be plenty minded make to yourself like. He makes his tenth film an an one day. He's walking along and gets an amazing Davis, eleventh film and it's burning inside and he can't do it because he said, what he said just gonna make it Quinton. No one's counting, except you, who I could do you make single film. Arguably break it into all make eight films and put it all together. In one film, Allah, you know, death pref- kill bell. You make. Don't run a ten K once a meter ten thousand times. Yeah. Yeah. On film. That's like ten films. Well, I'm on board with this. I think it's good. And I want to know what they call a quarter Pounder with cheese on Setia five. So, you know, it depends if you've got your universal translator switches from imperial to metric, of course on. Hey. Make it. So, so if I'm correct. This news came out of a mysterious publication that was published this week. Right, hotel film. Yeah. I believe. Yes. Helen, thank key. New issue of empire came out today. Recording day and Tarantino. I'm once upon a time in Hollywood is cover beautiful lovely smarts. Excellent for Nick assembly in, when in the edit return t no also spoke to Brad Pitt. Spoke smuggle Roby spoke to Lynn Caprio. We have the full incredible story. The making of this film also Tarantini words empire thirty director this issue. So we put your Rita questions to him and he tackled them gamely and also we have Rodriguez, and Kevin Smith giving us tribute to the film is, I have say a fucking amazing issue. We've got our ES three in the. Midsummer. We went to New York and hung out with him. You've got Jimmy for. For. I think it's pretty much the few, he did it can with Alex free. We have Agnes voter obviously her final film issue. I just feel months after she died. And we tracked on most of her closest collaborators took her spirit on her verve and filmmaking brilliance. And this issue comes with pilots enough about the magazine that comes free with pilots v. Let's talk about the main event and we went on set of stranger things for the third series things. Strangest things and we have James dyas epic, biblical battle star. Oh, yes. Oh my God. It's the best thing in the issue. And we have the best of some shows. So I is I have say I know I get paid to say this, but also genuinely is the best most compelling. Excite in exclusive packs package of empire and pilot an is now on new stones pretty much everywhere. An evil news agents, and digitally as well. It is an absolute belter. What's your favorite pick, Chris, I interviewed Jim mind gold. Nice obviously, my section the award winning mainly awards bestowed bestowed upon it myself. The war when in review is terrier belter, isn't it? Well, it is begin with the story. And all sorts of stuff is great things in Rome. Parliament is in there. Sam Elliott Helen you spoke to him or you heard, you heard his voice rumble out of the speaker. Almost indistinguishable sexy rumble just coming through the phone, and then, and then occasionally, like a phrase with sort of float the surface anyway, point is, it's a great magazines. And you should pick them up grind mmediately a newsagent empire pilot what a team. And speaking of gray magazines, it is time to have a word from this week sponsor because we're always delighted to have the economists sponsored the podcast in this week is no exception of you don't ready subscribe to the economist, wealth friends, I'm here to tell you that you're missing out big time. Economists is your one stop shop your indispensable guide to economics politics, entertainment, and the world around us. And it has been so who over a hundred and seventy years, yes, I looked up the day, Google, this, the very first issue of the economist win sale in September eighteen forty three women that's court at seven. Oh, no. Lear eighteen forty three but it remains as final an essential as it ever was. 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Zero seven zero and thanks once again to the economists for sponsoring the show. All right. So now does time for this week's guest Asoka Patty is one of our finest directors. And he's able to flit nicely between feature length narrative movies like the warrior his first movie an alley Nina, which came at recently, but also he has carved at this new career for himself was a documentarian almost by accident. He made Senna a few years ago, the story of air Senna, then followed it up more recently with, with Amy amazing, the story of the, the late great tragic, Amy wine house. And now this week, he completes the trilogy of sorts with Diego Maradonna, which focuses on a very specific time in the tumultuous life of well, Diego Maradonna, one of the greatest footballers of all time as body popped into this favorite booth last week. I had a good old natter with him about well, lots of stuff football. Yes. Obviously films. Yes, Liverpool football club. Yes, we're both supporters. Do we start there? Yes. Was the Madrid at the final also? Yes. But once you get past us stuff is really fascinating interview. So do please enjoying up the reds, the Leonard to be joined on the cast by the director of data Maradona as Kapadia. How are you, sir? I'm good. Thanks, having me. Thanks for being here, especially since you had a fairly lengthy journey. You're in Madrid on Saturday night. So, what's, what's your been like so to get to Madrid? I was in London doing press, I went to Milan Milan to Bari that was a festival in Bari whenever showing Amy. And then I went from Bari to Rome, nitty miss my connecting flight which landed after my flight to Madrid was taken off to Madrid fan of to say was there for the game. The game was awful, but doesn't matter because we won an away home, those named plane and pilot for some reason we had to drive to Valencia came home evidence. Yes. That was just a typical weekend in the life. Of a Liverpool fan, stroke film director. Yeah. The weekend before I was in Ken is just mad. It's been absolutely insane. So have you had time to touch the ground yet? Have you time to decompress? Well, yeah. Because as soon as you get on a tube your back. You're back in any of this happened the dream, and I felt like that it's morning, actually. But also, it's worrying Camden, said this place brings back memories, because, you know, I used to live around here did a lot of work around here. The Amy stories all the streets in the film in the footage. So just coming back here brings back a lot of memories, as well, just very, very quickly before we talk about the film. I have asked by Saturday nights as a fellow red is a fellow massive read, someone who had a ticket somebody who's in the grounds. I'm not jealous Asif. I'm totally an utterly fine with you being there. Let's touch me. I was in Istanbul as we call it draw. I mean that's pretty incredible. That I was in Kiev. For me. This is all part of the payback of suffering so much of being there. And seeing that way, the we lost last year, traveling and watching team and being at final and losing an finally game on we we school in first minute. And it's so odd to be a head and actually kind of feel like we're no in trouble. We've been here have learned their experienced they know how to slow the game lost league bright point an we're in Champions League final, and we win it and identity were ever really in trouble. And the this it's a columnist the football this year. The countless under any pretty much any, any situation we've, we've and it didn't run out of energy sixty minutes in the difference. They were like getting late goal. So I think the foot was changed the plays of matured. An all just comes from expensive being in a final leasing coming back, the hosts scored start whatever from scratch. They young that grow in together. He's so good appointee ever team. He's the man. I mean, that's the biggest thing for me. Best signing have the. Club. He is so brilliant, so, lovable. And you know every team wish they had him. Even the great. So. Fun, isn't it? We, we should probably talk about. Well, film. Welcome almost called Diego Maradona's. But it is interesting to you want. Do you want people with a with filmmakers, I want you with the documentarian Zaid? People wouldn't be fun. Right. Why didn't know all is, is I spent in my teens growing up on the safer watching spoil who knew that to feature from full of comment. I wish an awful. One guy, and watching football who need this could be a creator. It was never the plan was never the idea to France has done. I watched a lot of tour Francie from beginning to end. This is amazing cinematic spoil. There are no interesting stories. The tour de France. Greg LeMond after racing from month for three thousand kilometers, he won by eight seconds against Laura finger. It's a great story down. We'll that's interesting day, one day one day because football on the big screen has been something of a of a holy grail and Diego. Maradona is necessarily football film. It's about a footballer, but there are hopes there's a lot of football in many good, fulfill. Can't they give if a modest, you're being generous, if you say something escape to victory, it's pretty good, and otherwise? What else do we have? Then there are not that many. So it is a really tough not to crack generally put that football particular was that uppermost in your mind. When you when you started to take the challenge on or was it I was aware of it. No, I was thinking. I mean it's character, you know, my job is to find really interesting characters so it's Senate was an amazing character wasn't because I always really important foam at one he happened to express himself, Viacom, and the challenge they was don't care about Formula one. How can you make that interest? In people who don't care about calls can run many circles where you find the right carrot. Tell you care about anything emotion engaged by someone who's wearing a helmet driving hundred miles an hour. Amy was a different thing where she was a Londoner. She was a local girl. I remember thinking she was really fascinating. Because I just never understood why she was in such bad Wayne still performing Maradona kind of pre existed us films because I mean, I'm a full fan and I did I remember him in eighty two World Cup. I remember hearing this guy's mitzvah, the best player in the world. And then when he played, it was a bit of a disaster in Argentina, where that point, you know, we had the idea Argentina played dirty football in the eighties, and he'll send off and he wasn't really. All that. And we all have Brazilian eighteenth. So eighty two I just remember Brazil's EKO all of that eighty six comes around and he is undisputed. He is the best player in the world. He did everything on his own took an average team won the World Cup. And so when is project came around, I had a book in the late nineties when the student, which is about Jake life. And that book, I remember thinking, wow. What a life the things that he's done off the pitch on incredible. Wouldn't it be great one day to make a film about him so that I d came from a book in nineteen ninety eight hundred nine hundred nine wow, one of the things that struck me watching the film? I watched it last night. Is the sheer amount of incredible footage that you've got incredibly candid footage where did you get that? Where did you prepare footage from an and how do you even begin to assemble it into a narrative have read this book in tonight, ninety nine and two thousand twelve around the time in London Olympics, a producer, pull? Martin contacted me. Yes. Seen center light sentence. I think I've heard this is material that's part of the cameras out of private archive. Okay. That somewhere outside of Naples, I think I can get access to it. Would you be interested in making a film about him? I saw a little bit like a YouTube clip of about ten minutes of footage and for me at that point, it was just the wrong time. I I've just done if about Brazilian sporting hero, identify can go straight into Argentina's boats in heresy when away, but this idea was still kind of, in the back of my mind, and it was after we made Amy and after Amy had gone through a wood season, when my producer James garrison of a participant. Martin went off an excess footage and they came back and say, is what I said. It was hundreds of hours of footage shot about the later on when I investigated what happened was the ago when he was younger random Booker genius nineteen Eighty-one. He had his first agent it was a mate of his could hoagies as his spiel if you're interested in football, you should know he's probably the world's first super agent. He took the ako schoolmates kind of nuts, but mates Manera at school, and he was more educated and came from moment, across background, ak- was street, guy from familiar essentially, and he did him a deal to his first professional contract. Wave Argentina's genius. He got him to buckle genius. He did a biggest ever to get him to slow net. And he broke that deal to game to Napoli never heard of this guy. But he only had one client dagga 'Maradona. And he also had the foresight to say this kid is a star and we should make a movie about him. He should be big in America. He should be big all over the world. So I'm going to do hire two cameraman to just follow. The Maradona around on the pitch of the page have accessible areas this before clubs worried about media content. These guys could be on the standing on the on the side of the pitch behind the goal filming, but specifically just filming the show now this is a time when if obey talent mid eighties, it was one big wide high angle shop atop a. The worst version of what you saw in UEFA Cup just now we've Chelsea, that's only go right? That was how you watch football. And the reason we've got this amazing access because he's too cameramen were only failing the but his film was never made it started in one hundred one and it was incomplete and in a way we've finished in two thousand nineteen. So we manage to get a deal with the ego, and his lawyers and deal with the cameramen half. The footage was somewhere in outside of Naples. The other half, I later learned was being kept by his ex-wife Klaudia in a trunk in Buenos Aires. Okay. She and the goat are not getting along. Well, let's to set us, they're suing each of right now in America. I'm not I'm still going to get that material somehow. Give me an interview, I know you don't get along well, but you are upon his story. We've gotta talk to you. I did an interview, and then I said, can I see what if you go in the back room? She's one of his shirts trophies everything. And there was a trunk that hadn't been opened for thirty years, and in it, well, bunch of humanity tapes, this old video from the eighties and on those tapes are the footage stuff when he arrives at the stadium in the car walks out like gladiator go in all of that was on these tapes that were disintegrating. And I said to Klaudia. We're going to digitize this material for you, because you're gonna lose is going to be lost to history. Even if you don't give me the footage at I'm just going to digitize it at least as a copy of it. And then hopefully, you'll trust me long enough to do a deal with. So we can interview you and Gary copied material, and eventually took a year, but we were able to that's incredible. And that's the starting point, the film itself has quite a narrow focus as you say has the the World Cup the both World Cups eighty six World Cup in the ninety World Cup are part of a new focus very much on specific a specific period of his career, which is mainly the Napoli part of his career was something you knew going in that you wanted to do or what did you did you find that along the way? Now I I've really we've cost an wide as possible. So we did research, everything for money with a kid his family's background seventy eight World Cup which was high of military dictatorship. There's a lot of corruption is gonna Laura stories, a lot of awful stories about what was gain on June seventeenth workup and the point is the goes, even. The age seventeen eighteen they're considering him in Argentina, the best player in the world. He doesn't even get selected failure. The eighty two World Cup he plays. He gets sent off against Brazil for terrible. Foul in the groin. Region of a Brazilian red card misses the rest of the tournament, they get knocked out. So all of that was in a long cut. We always have these really long versions, but in the m is just too much. The story is huge goes on forever continues to stay he's doing something right now that could be in a movie. So you just gotta pick your choices. I wanted to make a movie that was a couple of hours long for the cinema didn't wanna to do as a series. I fell in that way. I felt it was a bit of a trilogy of movies made about is kind of amazing genius made for the cinema center. Amy diego. So we had to pick what's the hardest story. What's the biggest cycle of his life and the place where he became the best player in the world and the place where all of his problems started where he became a person suffering from addiction issues all happen in Naples, the most dramatic period of? Is life and the place where I guess the best footage that we had access to that we could visualize, therefore, make a movie was ordering Naples growing up. I remember once Maradona was in the World Cup. And now and again you see him in the TV, but TV football was never televised to the extent is, is he's so this, this film was incredible incredible. Just seeing this guy this artist at the peak of his powers things, you could do with the ball, the movement away. He would jink past players every tackle in this movie that he seems to ride is a career ending tackle. If it connects it was mind blowing these sort of the unreconstructed thuggery of the football back lamb was extraordinary to me. What was it like view, once you find that, that stuff absent agree? I think that's the shocking thing is when you see how brutal football was in the eighties. And he's in Italy, where have the toughest defences toughest. And yet he everyone's trying to break his legs. And so this idea the Evan obsessive. He might have touched the ball with his hand on Tigra. I already don't kick. The defenders are trying to kill him. And he's saying you are cheating on. I'm going to do whatever I can do to get my own back to you. And I think that, that's what's interesting about it. 'cause if you are real football fan, you know if you'll player falls over and gets the penalty, and he wasn't touch. You're not gonna complain. Right. But if at the time that the way football was so brutal he did have an injury in Bacelona where his career could have ended before anyone even heard of him really before. We'd become famous because Gorka chair did break his ankle. You know that's where he had to come back from that's to start title sequence. So it was happening all the time, and I agree. You know, it's the fact that football is brutal is the fat at pitches in a real state. The bulls were different and the big thing is in those days, you wouldn't even get foul if someone smashed into you and not sure Eva. Now you get a little touch. You know, you're gonna get free cake. Roll around. They get free freaky. It's possible to score fifty goes every year this year because no one can touch you in the. Maradona's time toughest league, there's ever been because all the best players in the world where in one league all teams he goes to a team that was nearly relegated the year before, and we've ain't three years wins the league champion in the toughest Lakewood best place in the world spread around. That's just doesn't happen. Now plays will only go to the richest team in every league. They're only gonna go to place with a guaranteed to be in the championship. It's different. It's different and Jimmy NAT time Argentinian jealous say to me, MRIs great. But what Missie will never do. He will never be England with what is one of the best of all time and at Hamble for years after they were at war. That's the thing he after the focus more. They played in a final. Everyone says if you were to sum up his career. That's the match. Yeah. It's not the final is not a semi finance, the court final against England team that humiliated them in a war. He then be in the way that Latins wanna win a game. Yeah. You want to beat them genius us when he beat them bitchy in that hurts still going on about. It strikes me that the, the film, you, you frame, much have this notion of duality of Diego. I think weiner's even a line to fighting Yego Maradonna in the title was something that went into this film knowing that you would there was a duality to tell you what you, learn when you taught me out. I have no idea what I'm doing going. Book. She's a first with Senna, and we've Amy I didn't go way and realizable research them what I do. I just start talking to people and I start looking at the footage and the story always comes out of why c why here, so I don't go in with any kind of idea preside here. So here I didn't have any idea the drama was going to be. I knew that as a lot of vents in his life on going to load a tricky situations, and it's literally during the interviews. I'm talking to people things not in said and I stopped making connections and links, and I'm in my mind the these films, the prices always like, you know, kind of bad cop movie looking for, like some killer. And then they go to the hotel room and everything stucco on the wall. Joining celebrate that's my brain. Okay. And I making these films. I'm just getting bits of paper not sticking up on a ball. I'm trying to make a connection. In, in my second third fourth language, speak in Spanish definitely does. But for Nandes Rini, who was the trainer. Her trainer brings him back from that leg break and says, he had away, I'm going to train, you, because you'll brilliant already. I'm going to train your mind, read this book, read this, I'm gonna teach you about this. I'm gonna teach about that for you to understand where you stand what you mean coach -ly to Argentina and two people in Nepal. Really interesting. So it was fantasy near any who I'd never heard of. But when you talk to you, he knew everything, and he knows Diego Maradona better than the Diego Maradona. He came up with this is the Guinness in Meriden and this one guy that's really sweet really nice really lovely spent more time with him. Then is a person. The ego mice, the kind of angry version, just Maradona who I wouldn't take a step wave, but Maradona being smart is. Yeah, that's cool. But if I was just Geico. I'd still be in the shantytown. Yes. Maradona go me out of that. And that's the thing. That's what I thought was interesting. An film soul built on this concept of you need these two sides of your personality schizophrenic, bipolar. Whatever is he has these. Size. Once you understand that you see Maradona doing anything off towards kind of makes sense, because I can meet him one day, and he's lovely and I meet in the next day, same guy, nothing's happened between us, and you can just see he's in a bad frame of mind. And what did I do you didn't do anything? He's just not the same person today, and the people I met would say they wish she could go back to that guy. He used to be almost got a spectrum the on one end and Maradona nearby. And he somewhere swings between students when I asked him about it, he would deny totally is that there's only one me we talking about. He's everyone around him kind of got the concept and agreed. And maybe it's a bit simplistic. When you making a movie, you have to kind of come up with the essence of how you can express his idea, what was evidence. He was forced into a situation. It was not like he had an on terrar- that made him do things. No one could make him do anything. He doesn't want. Do I'm never going to get him to go to can he wants to being? Last year during the World Cup. You know that great, reputable newspaper, the Daily Mail somehow came out with this idea that I had told him to act up junior World Cup because it was for a film, these. Like I'm going to make him. Do anything that that's him. And of course, both Senate an Amy in a horrible way you had something to hang your movie on as well. Which was tragedy on a full stop to both restore. He's that was a conscious decision. I knew that I was going to do this again. It had to be different to film that couldn't make it film, which, you know, sadly, tragically to wonderful human beings died young. So I was aware. That's one thing I knew that the reason to one he's alive. I can meet into to him. And, you know, whatever that changes when you've got a real person around and the other thing is he story keeps going he keeps creating drama, and it's going to be a difficult one to end is actually about growing up getting old and dealing with or not dealing with the mistakes, you've made in the past, and I guess I'm making it now as an older person when I made cinnamon, Amy thought, yeah. That was challenged was interested with. And because it's not like I said it tragic endings, but it's not knee ending here and his biographers and journalist, I met one of my questions would. Always be. So it is film end and it just laugh and let good luck we've written books him in the minute. We press send incentive publish a goal from these tomorrow to make lending relevant, just laughing and good luck. Do you have Google alerts, if he does something daft? Yeah. I mean not for that. But yeah, you do have about is married on. If you don't hear about someone tells you what you said, what's now, one of them was when we were trying to show him, the film, I was hoping we'd be nearly done a year away from finishing, but I was thinking it's time to show him the film because I have three interviews Diego, that was a contractual situation three time three hours and had used up to of them, and I was saving one up because I wanted to show him the film, I think maybe certain things in there. He may have an issue with all my say, you've got that wrong. It was like this. I'm okay. I'm gonna show you the film Il Somme. You might remember things differently material of himself as probably never seen. He's never sat down and watched those u Matic tapes. I have. So I was going to show in the film in his living room in Dubai, an interview. And in his people say, well, he's too by what was he gonna is, is up to Belarus, getting a map was better. Close it into by can we come to Belarus? And then he's off to Columbia, Columbia, backing go to Columbia, any other time, we can show you film. Well I'll be in Moscow for the World Cup. Why don't you come to Moscow? That's gonna be a good idea. And as we saw he wasn't going to be the best time to this particular. I can imagine. They also say just send us a link, I think I need to watch it with you. So then he was wearing going to be Optimus face it. I'm gonna be Argentina says. Okay. Fine with flying to Argentina still got a few interviews to do we books tickets two days before we fly to Argentina. I'm literally, I'm packing my bag, I get message from a mate, and Puerto Rico, have you seen a news. What's up? He's taking a job in Mexico in similar, which is where it's been for last year. Oh my God. So interview say so he stills into film. No, those interview, yes, that's, that's. Being indigomortgage on the land. So we will worried about a trailer. And in a train of how's he gonna react when the trailer comes has fine? Okay. Then the post it comes out, and we didn't think about it on the post three has full words title, the egg on it. And then if it says, rebel hero hustler God. Some Argentinian journalists went up today. Have you seen a poster looks great? Because you happen to quit of cold you. An translated, however, this person who's never seen the film eve, translated hustler into Spanish to the took great offense, the day off. The can comes that said, I do not like this film. I don't agree with that word. I'm not a thief. I never stole from anyone. That's wannabes Goto lines by. If you've ever looked him up. He will always say I never stole from anyone. I worked for. And he says, do not see this film. Kind of slight panic with all distributors. You can imagine the scene the movie he's talking about a word that's been translated to him. But what, what is out in tendons? I said, everyone's going to want to see the film, the minute, because just miss kind of understanding that when we said, we got this archive that somehow the film was the official version. Yes, if you seen the film, yes, it's kind of all in everything he did is in, you know, none of his teammates senior, how could I have given? One day one day, we'll sit down and watch. It. No extra. Three did has a failing in can of red carpet, and, you know, sitting credible experience. But when you're there, I was thinking, what a shame on his hair expenses love coming from the audience from it would have been amazing for him to have been there halfway through the film thinking. Thank god. He's crate who had the idea of showing it in for the first time in Ken of, of all the crazy places in the world to not the ending because standing visual, what is shame. I would be here if he was sitting next me watching for the first time in front of two thousand people in that cinema. So, so pun and had he been in for the first time he might not have been around for the innovation. He might have left before land, stormed out in a rage, something would have had something Lillard, but you would have. Would be. Over the last few years. I mean right from the beginning of your career. But specially with the last few years begin with Senate, you have juggled directing documentaries, but also direct TV in directing narrative features as well. How do you balance those two different sides, your career? Or do you see as two different sides? You career is because I really love shooting size really fun to be back on set and doing mine. Tons for for David fincher was amazing. It's partly to keep my sanity because it's not healthy to be editing for years on really isn't, it's a weird way to, to make movies. So to go away from that back to what was always my first love, which is being on a set we've accrue shooting at is having a script worrying about schedules in time in getting down. So I had a great time doing mind. Hunter did never Molina. I've done a bunch of stuff like that. I'm really wanna riot scraped I'm gonna go back to my fest, from the warrior, and find a story in findable can adapt in lot myself away and. Right. And it may be dockside producer. Maybe I do if I do it probably won't be doing a bio feeling is time to deal with state a word. We're in political summits. Do with environment. This book had an option on that I was working on, I'm not sure it's going to happen. But in my head centers, an action movie. Uh-huh. Amy's musical sends a gangster film mean streets. So I think the next one to this, I fi. But my version of that would be very, very interesting. I mean, the beginning of this movie feels like something out of the, an eighty thriller. Envy. Oh, noisy. You fall from grace. Professor pass across at Anfield next year as a capacity it's been a pleasure in Charlotte. Goodwin, thanks. All right. So that was Asif Kapadia, Terry white. Tell us about this movie Diego Maradona starring Diego Maradona as teeing, Donna as the cast is not extensive for this one. Chris, as you said. This is Asif Kapadia as the film in something of a trilogy, which began with Senna, and then we had both. I think revolution means of documentary filmmaking, this is slightly different. I have to say in terms of how he use footage. There is a lot and lots and lots of, and you're right. It really pivots narrative -ly around the kind of insane mania around him when he was at the height of his fame. So I on this kind of set piece of this car racing through the streets with. Screaming fans and it's this match chase on you. Get the sense of him being in the middle of this friends that you've really see for like musicians. Thrilla and is really much like, hey me, it's really about the price of success in the price of fame and the human cost of that. The thing is that this is really well known story on. He is, we should say the only subject to was still living when is made so and it covers, you know, women drugs fame, kind of despair the bit that for me was kind of missing a little bit while, say had new interviews with Maradona and they didn't really reveal very much. So I was really waiting for kind of this moment of self awareness around the price of fame. The offer drug is the things he's been through and having the sensor perspective to be able to look back home. What's gone? Do you think that's what it will? I will assure few is just still so in place of dealing with shifts that he'd not reached the end of it. We're able to kind of look back. It is interesting because I you know. You could argue certainly part of him dice movie. And there's really interesting thread in the film disgusted, little bit with Asif on any in the interview, where he kind of stumbled upon this idea of this dichotomy between this, this relationship between Diego, who is the sweet loving kid a grew up in Argentina and just happened to be, you know quite possibly the most talented player to the game Maradona, who is the persona. He creates and gradually I think that persona takes over and subsumes DA go. And you could argue that the offensive this movie, which, again further, we'll talk about don't wanna talk to, to deeply about them that perhaps Diego, no longer really exists at all. Maradona's all is eagle monster and that eagle monster would look back at this period and think why didn't do anything wrong. I was victim of circumstance victim of conspiracy. So maybe there's something in that maybe he doesn't maybe has moments John. In regret. But I don't know whether he would actually express them in a public forum. Now what you miss. Well, I missed wolves learning more about him as a man, but to what you heard just saying, actually, if that privates real, if that's what we want to call him, Paul him has existed in that way for a long time that may, maybe it was never gonna show you that do you know what I mean? Because they spoke to his ex wife as spokes people in his life. And you there was never for me. Real meat on the bones of Diego Maradona, the man, as opposed to Maradonna the footballing icon, but actually what you've just said, is really fastener in, because maybe that is a maybe that's the reveal that he is now just my Redonda, and what went before is what led to him because he looked the most of a statement and without saying too much devastating bays. When you see him now really? Then also, you get the sense of the pressure ratcheting up on him and chose in a way to live in this goldfish. Bowl and gone. Himself into the situation that he just couldn't extricate himself from an, it's from that point of view. It's a it's a tragedy as well. I thought I thought it was fantastic. Myself filmmaking craft is something else, Kapala. I mean, his editing skills off nominal. We knew this from Senator Amy, the pace and the rhythm, the narrative rhythm he puts in just three sheer intelligence of editing absolutely phenomenal. And maybe part of what I'm getting and I've say, I read this, and I still reviewed it really positively is I'm not a sports fan. And so some the over reliance I fell a little bit on game footage really kind of left me feeling a little bit on such fight on the narrative side of it. I mean these are quibbles because he's a brilliant, brilliant piece of filmmaking. And if you have any interest in him, the sportsman or if that pair of that, you know, that particular time in spore in the kind of eighteen and that decade of. Accessible, what was happening culturally with drugs and all of that. You can see how these things all came together into being the kind of perfect storm for what happens him. It's a fascinating when, you know, this is a this may be a bit of a glib comparison. But in the way that Kapadia made film, kind of reminded me in a way of how writers would features together anywhere. Yeah. I'm comparing herself in any way, shape or form to what acid does. But he he went in. He had no idea of the store he was going to tell until you went in found this hundreds, thousands of hours of footage, and then gradually began to find the here's a line here that spin off in this direction. That's very much way. I work when I'm writing the feature. I'm sure it's the same with you guys as well. But, you know, so it's an interesting just a creative process that when this movie fascinated me also bars. I was terrific on a very worthy successor thought to me and center, so four stars NVIDIA go Maradonna, and now we move onto men in black international and not obviously, obviously, but it means James Dyer is here to talk about it. Hello, james. Hi, yes. They let me review a comedy. Which is we can all agree was a really good idea. Hula dougal. You've Uniroyal exactly that this is about four coming, a full seven years of the men in black three and shed of both worlds myth Anta, mealy Jones, replaced instead by Thompson, and four himself. Chris hemsworth. In fact, not only did reunite Hemsworth with this with this Ragnar co-star loosen reunites him with this Ragnar accent 'cause he's playing a Brit. A Brit agent of the London men in black office. And tesla is rookie agent who gets conned to London to I mean, honestly does matter, there's this bunch of stuff against killed a weapon, honest, deploy is completely disposable, but they're really good fun. And I frequently found this film funny, I loved in it, you're shaking ads. This is the most Larrea thing I should never be allowed to review comedies because I hate will come find nothing funny. And yet, we came out of this, and I'm the only one found amusing when did you laugh? Two seats way from you on the inside. But I van Finally, I totaled. In. With the with the with the with the Chris Hemsworth being funny. The pace. Focus in this. I'm going to hit. Chris Hemsworth being forced argue. The Chris Hemsworth, who's afraid very funny, man. Brilliant is not. So in this film. No, I disagree. I felt this film and I said this interview if feels a little bit like a gag reel for full Ragnar. I think those two though I think he and you wash your mouth you take an incredible chemistry. They spoke of each other funny. I think Kamara Johnny was really funny as pony in this rice bowls, brilliant, as kind of sees a scenario thing. How are you? I had so much fun with film now. That's why gave it the full five stars. No, I k- this just about scrape to three but nevertheless, many black international. That's pretty fucking impressive, because this was a film, I think we all written off as terrible into these and some of this continue to. This to be absolute share. I thought this would be the most disposable film of the summer. And yet, and yet it is fun. Is non existent on Hemsworth, who is in case so Paris Matzek. He so naturally. He I mean, does the phone here, I'm gonna use it to dial something in like rate. He was in. He was in fully of. Strikes me in this movie. He's brilliant. He can for the best. Improve. It didn't work in this movie, and he strikes me as someone who was slightly left adrift, without a really good script Afghan gray script weird say these words, but f Gary gray, who I was made a lot of films. I like is not a comedy director. He doesn't have to light this tiny from an action Jon Barry's on Veld. He does you never saw any of his fossil furious, fellow a chase sequence in this, and I thought his is his Foshan furious, when not on display in that I forgot chasing the action set pieces as a whole quite disposable. And yet, I really enjoyed the company of the character, and the jokes. Are you? I know I came out and I don't understand how I've become kind of solve offender of this coma de laughed three times. I'm the the funniest thing that happened when I was watching this movie with something Helen did. Cannot repeat. Movie was coming to an end four times in this film. Yeah. I was choosing. Move it. So funny. I was number times. I laugh James is forty minutes a little longer than little law Kosonen felt films were around the ninety minute quite because he understands. The comedy gets less funny. The longer you go over ninety. Can get bold. Okay. But I was super boring. I think I might have been the in this entire room, enjoyable enjoyed. I think I'm trying to as where the pets new hates comedy, really likes people don't like it, and there's a weird inverse. You diverse thing happening, which means it's definitely not funny down. I don't know what happened. I it's possible. I've had my memorized. Interesting. I, I is in here. But and the PLO is super predictable if you if you can't see what's going on from about minute five, and there's something wrong with it has done the absurdity of this felt movies. Let's talk about this franchise very quickly. In terms of when we say men in black. We really mean men in black. Terrible worse than that. And this continues the downward trend except that it's the second vestment about film. It's your. Like. Yeah. So I like even if I call it the second best still. Officially the champion for this film. And I'm Bassi saying just about scrape three stone. Oh, you sound. Because I'm so surprised I had these nailed on somewhere between a one to like this trade us terrible. The idea of like, who the fought once on the minimum minimum movie, and it doesn't even have the stars in it. And I was playing in English. This is just a car crash waiting to happen. And then I went in I was like, oh, this characters are weird on likable. Hemsworth is unlikable in this movie. He's, he's lockable in the same way that Ragnar oke and indeed fat thaw in adventure games. Like I love that state. I think it's really funny movies, because thorn, we've built up this, this relationship years, and Henson's fantastic and his roles. And yeah he's. He's, he's acting really entitled annoying film cells via old annoying. A boy. Out is never annoying. This is the interesting thing whereas this guy. Excellent and, and is a fantastic clothing shop. Sure. But I'm not sure what that has. Oh, I. Oh, riffing put together. Because I was I was trying to hard to look for the exit while this movie was playing. No, I don't the chemistry that they had. And they had chemistry off the bloody chain off the charts. Even in the enthu-. Right. Nook nonexistent here. You wouldn't even know that they made a previous film together, Tessa Thompson. Chris disagree. Well, I think she's really trying to do something with the characters. I don't think she has anything to work within the scripts. I think the script scripts the fundamental. Actually, I think one of the big problems men many black halladay spirit an knowing kind of sense about, which men it was really the tone of it was, what made it really funny this to me itself, so earnestly places, and I was put like took their attempt to humor really seriously. And I was like that spirit in that playfulness and not knowing sense of what they're doing was just completely angle. This leaned into the goofy far more than the previous films have because you didn't have the strength difference between knowing on leaning into the gay Fey, wherever that means. Anyway. So Ed Solomon. Helen's just drew my attention towards this at Soleman the cocoa rider, I think of the first one, maybe the first one zone said in honor of the release of MENA black international brackets. I guess I just got my new men in black profit statement with shows it's still in the red. The fact they've made a fourth one confirms as I've always said that big studios are only in it for the art and clearly that art one over James Dyer, and gave it three stars three stars officially by men in black low three generous three which brings us onto the last film this week. Sometimes always never. I mean this is moving my scrabble. Helen, isn't it? It is not, not a movie about Scranton king. Yes. In a manner of speaking. It's a movie in fact about scrabble, but it's also movie about family and a father and son relationship. So it starts Bill Nye is Allen. And we meet Allan going on a journey with his son, Peter, who's played by some Riley. We're not quite clear, why they're going where the going I they stay overnight in a little hotel, where they meet, another couple who played by Tim mcnerney and Jenny actor. Oh, right. Yeah. And again, you not quite sure why they are there and I almost don't want to explain it because I feel like the less, you know, the better but it will play a friendly game of scrabble and it's essentially a story about this relationship between the father and the son the there's a there's a missing part of this early. There's a fragment missing from the family, it's sort of messed them up, and it's messed up their relationship and soon after this particular evening, Alan essentially invites himself to stay with Peter and his wife, who's played by Alice Lowe, and their son, Jack and starts trying to kind of I guess, maybe reconnect or build something you with them in this kind of new world that they're living in and it's a buys about these relationships. So when this film sit sticks with their relationships, I think is actually really good. It's written by front cultural boys who? Great. Right. And really moving British films before this and the railway man. What else did Danny Boyle's millions things that he's, he's a really good writer. I think that's all there. The director is Carl hunter who has written quite low of. Of work before short films and TV shows, I'm not sure if he's done many films before any kind of goes, for kind of Wah's Anderson, esque quirkiness, you know, sort of close ups in all dangles of objects that are pretty looking and weird almost not quite stop motion animated, but weird sort of angles on things in there are little bits of animated, and things like that, and it just doesn't need it, and I wish you'd kind of just trusted in his script and his cast, both of him are fantastic to just tell the story because I always every time one of these moments happens, it kind of threw me is on there are, there are elements of the script being kind of mannered and intentionally old. But when you add in the old way of filming as well, it just, it's it divorces you from the story instead of drawing you in, in any way. So I just find it really pointless, respects those. Flourishes, but apart from that I really did like the characters are really did, like the story, I think less, you know, about story going in the better. So I wouldn't even read too much about it. But I just think, yeah, I think he needs to trust himself as writer, because the family scenes, and that stuff is actually really way too much. Just don't think it needs the frippery around the edges. Sounds intriguing and we give this one three stars which is always in the podcast is recommendation, three stars end for sometimes always never. But is it a recommendation? Mena black international wanna really wanna know. Ames james. Yes. It's comedy gold. Three-star not why you laugh. Him and say if you will skin on the fence do not see this foam, ultimately this summer. What are your oceans for if you want blockbuster entertainment, Godzilla, dog Phoenix men in black? You speak is a man who does not pay to see movies. Stephon happens in the park, I'm going to see the Shakespeare. You mean big pun Thomas? He's back. I'm gonna see him in midsummer night's dream today. The ass it is. Is that what you're dressed sexy? Like, maybe. All right. Interesting fairy interested indeed, so to stars in from anti-black international. What else can you do you can see the women's World Cup NASA that's going on right now this football cricket World Cup as well? That's cricket nose creek. Men, men as it should be. Helen men leather winnow the sound of the bat from the ball. You know what? Florence Skyping runs. What's lever to fingers? The ball. The batches willow gods? Probably go. We should think ended a while ago should bring it. We should bring this to a natural end. Down put it down. Now, I will say before we go. There are a couple of specials to keep your eyes and ears peeled for our rock band sport, especially with director Dexter Fletcher is available right now. Our expert Dr Phoenix sports, special writer assignment, Kimber producer hutch Parker will be up. Just say Monday now I'm guessing, probably more likely are Kevin Smith interview special be up next week as well. But until we meet again until it a spacious occasion, it is good. Goodbye from my friend. My colleague my boss. My leader my my semi. What else what else have contractually advised to Terry white center? No tell you buy one, Chris. Okay. Yes. Legally binding. It is goodbye from Helena, harra. She's off to get some asna park or something like that. I'm not quite sure into the bridge, they'd actually, yes, the bridge theater. Okay. All right. Bye, bye and goodbye. From James Dyer protecting the earth from the scum of the universe is not from terrible. Yeah. Crucially nothing terrible. I'm so now I'm turned around. I'm all about the comedies now. They find Wayne t o personality any point. Anyway. Give from me. I'm off the takedown Tom Selleck, the key, the tash, you take the tash, you take down the Celik, tash controls, the Celik, if that doesn't work, I'll show him a raiders of the lost ark. Poster on what he's too busy crying about what might have been a kick the fucker out of a window your defenestrate Celik take that thanks for this name cenex week. I'm BIC pentameter by.