Episode 125: The Arizona Secular AA Conference
Visit Episode One hundred and twenty-five AA beyond belief The third by any Arizona secular a conference will be held on Saturday November ninth from nine thirty. Am to five five thirty PM at the twenty four. Th Street Conference Center in Phoenix in today's episode. I'll speak with Gary s from Phoenix. Area he'll tell us about the upcoming conference. It's all right. I'm here with Gary s from somewhere in Arizona. Where are you from Gary in Arizona Sun City West on Sensiti West? Okay Okay and you're here to give information about the upcoming secular. Aa Conference in Arizona. Would you give us a little a little bit of information. Mation about a first of all. Where is it and win as well? It's at nine thirty in the morning. Starting on November nine at the Twenty Fourth Street Conference Center in Phoenix Arizona. Is this the third conference that you've had yes. It is their biennial. So we alternate her name with the internationals. Okay would you like to give us a little history behind the conferences. I guess that you've been to all of them. I have indeed. Yes I I we had just moved to Arizona from the San Diego area just just prior to the twenty fifteen conference and so I was able to attend that one and actually it was one of our meeting conferences when we first arrived my wife tonight. Virtually all of the secular meetings were on the east side so when we live on the far west side so the first thing we did was initiated. A couple the meetings here on the west side and in that plugged into the community which is growing thankfully the twenty fifteen conference had four different panels and there was a speaker on on starting a waft meeting twenty seventeen we we did it again and our topic material was updating. We have a tendency to update for the upcoming internationals nationals. Because as I said we enter alternate with those and then we seventeen. We talked about the secular steps in how people work the steps in a secular environment. However Har- people sponsored and what is the role of connection in the recovery community in our guest speaker? That one was Joe Joseph Toronto our now. We're getting ready for this year's so we've kind of picked up a format format that we're using and that's that's kind of what we're doing. We have someone from the international or the upcoming international national and and a author from the secular community well with pat along with panels which in turn allow us to you know. They're kind of falling in place. It takes a little time to get a conference system setup but I think we're finally dialing Yeah you guys have done a really good job you know I imagine it is it is. It does take a lot of work to put one of these together and am glad to see that there are more of of these regional conferences happening. I mean the ones that I know of now are wanting the gateway conference that takes place in Washington state the Arizona's regional conference conference. And now the the Ontario Conference. We've got three. That I know of that are regional conferences. And it would it would be nice to see others. Come on I like the the regional conferences. Because they're more intimate and usually the locations are such that it's easier to you know interact with people and it's not like you're in in like one place all the time you're having a unique then you this time year. It looks really nice. I was looking at it online. You're using conference center in Phoenix next. Is that right correct. And in the past we've been using a public libraries which which are nice except there's there's a lot of peripheral horrific Noise and activity going on so this season I had the opportunity. We started a little earlier so I was able to actually walk fine. What is this Conference Center and charing the committee this year and it's have some experience in doing things like that original service structure of am? Ah so that's allowed me to kind of insert the fortunate things about that formatting that kind of formatting we've been able to bring online into into this so it seems to be working quite well. This House's center is relatively small. It's a big auditorium or anything like that. I I believe that room maxes out at about one. Hundred forty is but it's got kitchen facilities and things that not everything has had in the past. So that's that's helping. We know so. We just did something. Kansas City not too long ago we had JOE AC- come down for an anniversary celebration and we used a facility that Holds about a hundred people. Maybe and that was that worked out really well for us because we had we had less than one hundred people so there was plenty of room for for everybody every body so I you know you don't really need a huge place depending upon the size of the crab. What kind of crowd are you expecting this year? We've we've been getting just shy of a hundred in the past and so this year we've been shooting for one hundred twenty or so and you know that's always contingent registrations. Who hears about this? I think getting the word out is is one of the great challenges. Having come from the San Diego Area I was was able to plug into some of that community so I hope to see some of those folks and and our community here. Phoenix is growing but like most things things in the community. It's everything in a has a glacial pace things growth growth in a anything anything new in a in which there seems to be a tendency to resist new things so it takes time you know. It's pretty amazing Kerry. I'm just looking at the website of the the secular. Aa Groups in Arizona. And there's a lot of them a lot we like. Sap soon as soon as we hit town we started voted to on the west side. The free thinker meetings but they're very small and persevere and it's Sometimes during in summer particularly they're very small because the Phoenix area population changes dramatically in the season. Where I live this small community that I live has probably sixteen thousand people during the summer and more like thirty five thousand during the winter? We'll get that on off thing because a lot of a lot of Canadians. North people in snow country and has been there winter's here so so all of a sudden our our population goes and but during during the during the summer you know. There's we have a few meetings in Phoenix area that are actually quite large consistently and so it's it is indeed growing but like Azad during this for a few decades now and I've if watched other committees and sectors of the fellowship and whenever something new you know if you're if you're established after ten or fifteen fifteen years you make a good time so so it's a it's a real patients game but I do believe that the secular community dirtiest growing we are a microcosm of the macrocosm in terms of population. So if you look at the. US population what happens in the fellowship. visit reflection of that. That's right. We are reflection of the greater society. Aren't we absolutely if you look at this statistic as moving forward were there more and more secular people within the US just in general and consequently we will inevitably grow in the row so then it becomes a matter of finding each other and we are pretty well accepted now Within the greater community I think for the most part I know we certainly are Surrey. And I I bet you are in zone two but it's no big deal to have a AA meeting without the prayer in increasingly. It's it is indeed getting better. There's there are people who can't handle. The lack of formatting sometimes are the formatting that they are not accustomed to but but I know our intergroups for instance are supported when we want literature. Or we you know a day. They helped us with our insurance for the confidence and everything One of Arina groups and more and more we are accepted and you know when we had our even in Kansas City. It just happened like a few weeks ago. there were some people from just regular traditional. Aa Groups to that showed up. So it'd be Kinda Nice if you could draw some people from other groups to within the within the Phoenix area. That aren't necessarily thoroughly. Secular noticed. Actually one of our topics this year is dogma and ritual in secular a and another others tolerance within secular. Because we have they're all ages in general has has the tendency towards zealotry. Sometimes I was kinda around when when secular age just started in a and chew often we we we had people who were willing to bash the traditional community and and so that frightened people away. I think there's less and less you. You don't think a lot of people who were secular came in with perhaps bad attitude about the non secular communities. Ma Shaw took got the opportunity. They the shot. Yeah my theory behind that. Is You know they always say that. A new. Aa meeting is started from resentment. Started with a resentment at a coffee pot. And I and I think a lot of our secular meetings started out of resentment for a bad experience that someone had with another Aa meeting so they learned about a secular meeting and I and they started it and then the people that would come to it were people that were already already had an experience with Aa but maybe a negative one because they were atheists and they didn't feel welcomed they're at their home groups the former home groups so I think that in the beginning of these groups starting there was a lot of talk about what a was like for these people we we experienced that in Kansas City when we start our meeting way after about a year of meeting we had people from other. Aa Groups started coming to our meeting and they had to vent about their experience of of with these other groups But then what happened with us and I think this might be happening in other areas too is the people that had had that experience or pretty much done venting and the newer people that are coming in. We're finding people coming into our meetings that have never gone to a previously. They don't have an. They don't have a negative experience with a with a traditional group to complain about the only way they know is a secular a meeting they. I do believe that's very that's increasingly true. And because we get new people who are. I've never come to a because I heard about all all I heard was the God thing and all I could see was the God thing in. It's just not who I am. So they they see the word for instance free thinker or Nostitz Austin can and so they we are indeed their very first experience and so they don't have to go through that curve serve sober ninety and had people who would take their index finger pointed in my face and say get caught her die. I and my sponsor who was a guy and was very very tolerant. Mike belief system. I never once tried to prostate allies with me. He just Sake Zayd Gary. Some of us are sicker than others. And Debbie. Kinda shrug it off. Don't worry about these people any of room for you but I was very very very fortunate in that experience because had I gotten zealot Proselytizing Zealot I may. Well have just left. Let's go through. Let's go through the the The venue the new but rather Arnold the program what you've got going on. So the keynote speaker is Geoffrey Munn. Who's the author of staying sober without? God Yes Jeff. Jeffrey will be our keynote speaker. And then he'll he'll be speaking about his experience Orient as well as He's had the opportunity to interact with the community as well and we'll also great go from a Mile Washington. DC will be kind and talking to us about the upcoming next year's conference in DC and then in terms of the way we do as people check in in register and so we have a series of speakers and or panels. Finals kind of stagger. Those and we'll have panel discussions. This year's panels are dogma and ritual and secular A. Hey tell me about that do you know much about what that entails. Yes actually I. I believe what's going on there is that there's we're we're I think we're trying to resist become a dogmatic as some of the other meetings are traditional meetings. have become over the years where you have this reading this set patter and and so. I think we're trying to keep the doors open to new ideas because of the resistance to to dot and and sometimes it's it's like I'm. I'm grateful that I believe that. Nearly every meeting. The Phoenix area has has a different formatting on some level somewhere and with meeting journ which is what we do on the west side with the free thinker meetings. WE THANKS FOR COMING MEETING NEW JERSEY NEXT DOOR. Now turn your phone back on. And there are others others said that choose to end with the responsibility statement and and and the the the circling up process so many of us came into the fellowship and Si- nationally and not everybody's comfortable with that not everybody wants to hold hands. You know it's about about being open to that. My wife Rosa. You know we gotta traditional media just can't find a secular one and she will not join the circle at the end of those meetings. I will join in. I will remain silent in. That is just always been my way to show people people that you know. You don't really have to do this. She don't want it won't kick you out interesting how we can become easily Dogmatic and ritualistic Listrik It it can happen to any group. It doesn't have to be a it could be any organization that could could become that way. I sometimes think it would be great if we had you know more more secular literature that's conference approved but one problem with having a book that's approved is that people become dogmatic about that book. And so maybe he had a certain. It's maybe a certain respect. We're lucky that we can just pick and choose whatever book we might want to use it. We don't have to wait for the conference to give us a book and that night night reduce some of the dogma. Because I think a lot of the dogmatic comes from a in general is usually from the from from a love of our history. Maybe maybe you too much of a love for the history and the big buck becoming kind of strict about how we look at the big book. I think that's where a lot of the dogma comes from. I very much agree. You know the the Apotheosis Bill Wilson the put him on the pedestal and the first one hundred sixty four pages of the big bark. And you know that stuff's all is all nearly eight. Years is eighty years old and hopefully we've gone miss. You really follow his life he. He became increasingly open to change over time time because he saw I believe he saw that dogmatic devotion and wanted to resist. And so but I do believe Steve. You're right about well. If you have this book everybody's GonNa Follow the Book and whatever the book maybe and you can really get caught up in that. So we're trying find to address that in that panel and then and then we're having a panel on secular awareness raising secular awareness in a through. Service were Kerr Djing people to get involved more and more involved in service so so that people know that were there. I'll we'll go back to my first sponsor who actually was area delegate and he says well Gary in a you're GonNa find that ninety seven percent of the people take it credit the other three percent do the work getting a second group. There's less competition and that has been my experience. I spent twenty five years in general service and and getting people to sign up and do that aspect of recovery. It don't realize how much growth growth that offers so they are resistant to it. Because I think out of us were just resistant to commitment. I think it's great for people to to at least at least learn about it and go to an area assembly and get to meet these people who have dedicated their time to serving a a for twenty five years. I did not do that and I did not get. I never went to an area assembly and got involved with the any it with a service structure until we started our group Kansas City Five years ago now and so I've been attending area simply since that time and it's really transformed in my experience in a certain extent because It's really when I go to the assembly Or even my district if I go to meetings there that's really my only connection into the greater a outside of my group and when I'm like at an area simply for example we don't really talk about the spiritual Joel religious beliefs or anything. We're just talking about the work that we need to get done there. And I've met people who have gone to New York the delegates you young and we have a lot of the delegates still come back to our area simply to help us out and those people are really amazing. The amount of work that they put into Serving Okay A. and there's a lot of people that aren't even delegates. Do the same thing now. I'm one of those people that I go to the area assembly all the time I even chair committee but I can't say I do a whole lot of work I but I do like to be there for me. It's like it's like I said it's my connection to a outside of my own secular group and I d learn something I gain something from it but i. I do a lot of a lot of the real work that needs to be done. I'm afraid to say and I get that. But the fact is that you participate on on a level that allows that your time allows I mean. Many people spend two years in a typical copayment in general services. Two Years I I spent twenty five because I fell in love with that. They wouldn't let me I. I wouldn't let them kicked me out. I kept finding new jobs and served area level for a decade in. But what I think what we find out is there's a there's this whole nuts and bolts. We have that tradition as as a neat never be organized organized but anything that is international. Quite frankly needs to be organized. Yeah and we're pretty organized. Absolutely absolutely absolutely and there are nuts and bolts going. All the gears are turning in the background that we don't necessarily see a group level and that's where we're in that's where that service structured comes in and I believe that that teaches people patients it does and I think it's important for the secular groups to participate participate because it allows the other groups to get to know us when I when I started going to the assembly in western Missouri. I think that I was we were we. We're the first Secular AA group to ever attend an area Assembly Missouri. And when we when I first started going there we some people were suspicious. Support us in not quite sure where we are coming from. But now we're just old hat were just you know they were just part of the family. Now it's not it's it's nothing a Of A big deal and I think that if more secular groups did get involved with their area they would have the same experience we. It's basically learning that we have far for more in common than than not with with other members and so I think that's one of the real benefits from it and also if there's something that you want different in a hey the only way you're going to get that by letting your voice be heard at an area simply and through the General Services Conference the most beautiful thing about a in my opinion is the respect suspect that we have for the minority so that you can go and you can ask for something you can. You can state your case and you can ask for a vote and whatever and if you're the minority you get a chance to go back and be hurt again and and maybe changed some minds. And I've seen that happen so there's a lot of respect in a aaa for from the minority. More so than. I think anybody ever could have imagined if you if you weren't ever if you've never experienced that and being part of a minority orgy that's great because your voice you're going to be heard twice a more twice. Maybe one of our groups recently one of our secular groups I recently At the at the local assembly put in a motion to have a specific setting of I array to identify in meeting schedules. That we are indeed secular. Everybody politely listened and said we don't think so if that returns earns is not always ready to do the change that is proposed by but after after A. Here's it a number of times they go well. You know what this. We've talked about this enough times. Maybe it is. I was very. I was involved as an area person. During the era the that we were getting ready to do the fourth edition of the Big Book and we talked about it for seven or eight years before we actually made the decision to do it and and again. That's that glacial pace of change and it does that as a way of self defense. It make sure that we don't do rash thing and because if we do do rash things people die and because we're not You know we're not a social club. We're a lifesaver club. So it's it's a very. It's a very interesting mechanism that if you don't have patience it will teach you patients. uh-huh wanted or not who's going to be in that panel. Do you know how that's going to work the way we have. Panels is the person who suggests that particular panel typically ends up on it and then and then two other people from the community are sought out usually usually and this is consistent with all the panel choices people who are going to have some experience and also perhaps perhaps have a diverse experience such as age age within the fellowship years of doing service for instance service in this one branches of service that they participate in. What's your experience in general service what you're experiencing Route uh-huh uh-huh so that we get as much of a broad base knowledge as we can from the panel at are able to 'cause we open them up after after the panel speakers we open up for discussion and and this gives other people in the room the opportunity to participate as well. Well that's going to be a good one. Then the the next one on the list here is how to survive a conventional AA meeting. I happened to be the one of the people on that panel panel and it's because there are so many conventional meetings versus the meetings that are secular in nature. You can't always find a secular meeting. There's not necessarily one every night within reach if you need. You're going to meetings every day. And and so that means you're going to traditional leading and you're going to encounter people who our God centric and sometimes that can wear on us. I guess the the thing is to. How do you deal with that person who comes in? Put your finger in your face and says get got her die are are how do you deal with. The media. Nets just goes on and on on a topic that you can't identify with and so how do you get along with that instill not feel that you should reject day but maybe simply go to a different made. No that is important. Because they're you know a lot of areas There aren't a lot of secular. Maybe there aren't any sector. Aa meetings you know so an in a it's pretty much everywhere you know immature and and and and there is benefit from having a support system when you're stopping to drink so you're gonNA have people that are that are atheists agnostic free thinkers whatever attending these meetings where people want to conclude with the Lord's prayer. They WanNa talk about God and it would be helpful to For for someone to have a plan or some some way of coping with that because it can be difficult. It can be very difficult if you feel like you're not accepted you know. And because that's so important I think for us in our recovery is is to know that that were accepted in the in the community that we're trying to be part of leaks to be a safe place and and unfortunately the Er is what is the zealots have a tendency to be loud and that's true on both sides to you are the minority there the loudest the For both the atheist. Agnostics the zealot Sir loudest list and for the other furthermore religious people. It's zealots are the loudest absolutely end. And if you're fortunate you'll find for instance my first sponsor who said don't worry. Some of us are sicker than others. And and just say hey you know not all of us are trying to sell you this aspect of their belief system. We just want you to get sober and we want you to feel safe here in. And don't let them scare you away and but it nearly early I guess it was actually the first twenty years of my sobriety in some of which we were arguing for more secular recognition but I lost people Oh who came to me for sponsorship and simply said you know I just can't deal with this guy thing and they were gone and one of the things. I've used to try the emphasize when during the discussion of we need secular we need a secular base was the fact that when people leave because they can't tolerate a that that particular aspect. It's almost. It's like a death sentence because if we sent you away you go when you drink and you die and so very very important and and so. It's kind of like you. GotTa you gotta be able to have a little bit of the armor as it will when I first got involved in general services the the new delegate came to me and said we'll Gary Jeff Welcome to General Service Service and I was very and she said you know in general service you get the heart of a butterfly and the skin of a rhinoceros and the over my years. In general service I developed the skin I became the essence of renounce Rousey. But I have not sure about the butterfly. I bet but I'll tell you my skin by arms pretty thick and as I could tolerate off on staff but it because we are. We're very sensitive people and so it's it's it's important that we give people the ability to stay in that traditional meeting and and stay safe and feel okay and and not necessarily go back through his particular meeting because if you go around the corner there's another that'll be a good one to record and I hope that all of these are recorded but that one in particular will be good because it would help the person who is in Area where there aren't secular meetings and they in the only meetings they can attend our traditional ones so that panel would be helpful for those people I think I and A and we we are setting up to record and and and have it online so at because I do believe that that was a challenge like I say having lost cost to the other dog and you know one thing. That's that is helping combat that I think is having these podcasts. These websites the facebook groups on the online presence that we have So that people that are in areas where they don't have a secular secular meeting they they know that we're out there you know. And so they're emboldened. I think when when they go to traditional meeting because that's the only meeting they have in their town and if they have to sit through a reading of how it works they can more more likely tolerate it because they know they're not alone they know that there's a greater community out there of secular other people in alcoholics anonymous south. I could not agree more because if you stick it out and you stay what happens is is as you develop filters and so that when when you're in that meeting I'm a good. Orderly direction person is support. That stands for for me so if I if I just I've learned over the years to simply when when I started hearing the word people are talking about oil God. Does this guy that I said we'll good. Orderly Direction does this and good orderly direction. Does that answer agency to work very well. And that's just my tool but I but I believe we can all find filters that that allow us to Either Tony tune it out or or or you know. Put this word in in place because what it is that helps hopes dem stay as individuals. Yeah a lot of it is learning how to interpret in your own. Mind what you're hearing you know you're hearing them say something and what they're saying it's actually relatable if you just kinda put it in a different context. I have sponging many years. So I've had the opportunity to read quite a bit of geology allergy. Things just so that I can get what they're talking about and I have them do a second step I ask them to. I WanNa the page of just what it is. That's returning you to sanity. That has the power to do this. And because invariably that's where the God issue comes begins and start and so if I know that they are got people I it will. I won a page from you. Of what your. I don't want your dog. I don't want what your preacher tells you it is I won't you said is and over the years of the many many people people who are you know in the Christian community I have never once got to identical interpretations of what that really means and and I believe that's true in the secular community as well and so so if you could plug that in to that meeting that that is so very God centric that traditional God centric. Meeting comes much easier to sit through it. The last panel you've got here is tolerance within secular A. That's interesting that's that's where me that de that other kinds of zealot that seculars Elliott's I mean we we. We have people within the secular community who would like us to not even be a part of a and are willing to break entirely a. and so when somebody's uses even the word there is even the word spiritual they are resistant to that. And and that's that's okay for them to not be accepting in their own lives but it's if they if they often find it's okay to cross because they've heard then that's that's the kind of tolerance we're talking about is is is being able to love each other regardless yeah You know one thing that I've learned over the years of Participating in Secular secularly formatted a meetings and the greater Community internationally I guess is the huge diversity amongst us Just because one person is an atheist. theus doesn't mean that all atheists experience alcoholics anonymous the same as that atheist. I mean. We're all different. I mean there are atheists out out there who pray there are atheists you have a spiritual program. There are atheist. Who Won't have anything to do with spirituality are atheists who interpret the steps and there are those who think that interpreting? Thirty misteps are ridiculous. There's just a huge variety amongst us. Whether you're atheists agnostic free thinker. Whatever you are? There's a huge spectrum of how we experience experience our recovery. And that's that's true for us in our secular community and that's true with a as a whole and I think the problem is just because And you might one person might feel a certain way. They have a certain experience that they and they want to communicate that experience in their way. They I think that we have to allow other people to communicate that experience in their way. There's no rot right or wrong way to be a secular secular person alcoholics anonymous. There's many ways of experiencing when you say the words right and wrong. That is that right. There is the problem when we start identifying things as right and wrong versus useful or not useful for me as an individual And when we start labeling them as good and bad that is where the problem begins. And that's where intolerance has a tendency to rise and most of us have encountered that particularly in the secular secular community will run into it in a traditional reading and we have to be careful not to become that. Don't become the thing. That Eh that offense you. So learning how to allow people to have their own fingerprint. What helps me with tolerance is? I know that I've been in NASA for thirty one years now and my understanding of my experience in recovery in the way that I expressed that has changed any volved hold over the years. The what I believe and say and do now is different than what I was saying and doing a believing seven years ago. So it's like if I if I listened to somebody and they're coming from a point of view that I think that I just can't relate to or whatever am I I might not even agree with whatever it is who cares. That's what that this. This is where that person is today and I was. I was taught that you take what you want. Leave the rest but don't throw it out because five years from now you might be looking for it and and and it does work that way I if we don't if we don't grow any things that aren't moving are usually dead and and so my consciousness is not moving forward. Then where am I lost my own dog. And that's the great danger of intolerance. It's I think is it stifles growth in another person. Absolutely we can get caught in lockstep and we're the very we become the very anything that we are resistant to it is. It is really important. That's I think those are some great panels that you've got there you're also having lunch believe along the along with your her Registration comes all of these panels and speakers. And there's there's always literature available and I and it's literature. Some of it's a literature and Jeffrey spoke will be available. Then there's the the traditional we'll have the word caught coffee donuts per se in the morning and as the day goes on there will be beverages urges cold beverages along with as Coffee that still seems to be a main stay and An there'll be a lot as well so we added some hours this time because our this facility was able to allow us to to make it a little longer because we actually founded past ones that we had to cut off the discussion after the panels just in order to stay John Schedule. So this panel this this particular advantage from nine thirty until five thirty and that will allow us to have enough time after each panel for people to be heard and and to ask questions or bring their own insights because there will oh be they'll be they'll be at the might there there via the ability to get up to the Mike and and and have have your say so so that will allow us to have a greater exchange of ideas. Because that's what these are. All pout is is is here some ideas just because you're a panelist doesn't make you right. It just means that you're bringing your dear just bringing your experienced so the third the third biennial Arizona secular conference will be Saturday November the night off from nine thirty. AM to five thirty PM at the twenty four. Th Street Conference Center Eighteen. I'm forty one. North Twenty Fourth Street number ten Phoenix Arizona and you can still register at the website as e secular a dot Org registration us twenty five dollars online and you can do that up. Until what November four th yes at which point then After the fourth because we have to be able to plan how much food and things like that after the fourth You you still be able to come. And at the door for instance. The price goes up an extra five bucks. And that's that's the the need for. You need to know ahead of time. Carr's order food. Well if you come when you got up from the door we we have to have that cushion of food. But he gets the opportunity Turkey to eat for those who and there is a Po box that people can send checks and that's Po box. One six four three in surprise Arizona. Eight five three seven eight is it bar and in. That's for those who who are are not Internet connected but still want to attend a want to send a check or aren't comfortable doing pain online There's there's a bunch of ways to get to us and we WANNA make sure that s available to everyone and we hope everybody either. Here's this podcast comes in if you if you'RE GONNA go get to the website and register if you if you don't have time to do that registered I mean. That's okay to go to the store but his help. It's helpful to register advance absolutely book that flight today flying in and and if we need to look good on street and we'll get some more food for be glad to have that problem. That's the kind of problem. That's the kind problem we want will thank you gary very much for taking the time to let us know about this. Let's is there anything else that we didn't cover that you think we should mention before we finish what I can't say. Is that another two years down the road. There will be another of these. So if you're if this is too short notice for you make sure to stay connected to our the a a secular Arizona's secular A.. Dot Org so that you could see the next one that's GONNA come up in two years time and and have a little the greater planning period because we're all ready. You know at the end of this conference we will already be in the next chair in place and and you know the core of the committee will put in place that we can start the longer term aspects the planning a conference in. That'll still be going on in the background stuff doesn't we don't you. Don't start this week ahead of time. Well thanks again Gary Gary I appreciate the The you're you're taking the time to speak with us and let us know about this conference. Thank you very so very much for having the podcasts available eligible to us. I'm the substitute person today. Because the person you were scheduled for took a spill on a bicycle herder south and we're we're all hoping that she's feeling a little better today but she certainly wasn't up to on cast today you know I'm sure she'll be okay and and at the the conference. She is one of our very trusted servants and we look forward to recover. Well maybe we'll have her on after the conference and she can give us a post conference. Update Yeah Yeah. That's a great idea in this and that's another episode of eight beyond. I believe thank you so much for listening. Hey if you'd like to help out our site and podcast there's a couple of things you can do first of all over to I tunes and leave us a review. You hopefully a favorable one. You can also help out financially with either a recurring or one time. 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