Is the NFL becoming the NBA?


Go barnwell show. I'm Bill Barn while you're here. It's Friday September twenty thousand nineteen talk about the Thursday night game which I'm not gonNA lie. We're not gonNA talk a lot about that game. Because it was bad I talk more about the Jalen Ramsey situation. Get to a couple of game previews later on in the show joining me to do that. Ranch frequent attributed over to the show it is the athletics Jones Lindsay. How are you. I'm good del. How are you good. I am not excited. Talk about Thursday night game so very briefly before we move onto Jalen Ramsey discussion. was there anything to enjoy or take out of that game. I enjoyed Tom Brady's tweet. I would like I would like to live tweet more game. I would like to formerly requests that to make him available for basically any game. He's not playing and because look okay. He's he's just like the rest of us. The Games have been some of these games have been almost unwatchable because of penalties and they are up this year holding penalties especially are dramatically up i. I know you're calling Kevin. See for has very well documented this at ESPN but Y- Tom Brady's exactly right. I mean some of these Games are so difficult to watch because penalties are taking over so I I'm here for Tom. Brady's tweets and I agree with him and then Not GonNa lie I was actually I was speaking to a college class. yesterday evening during the first half of the game and nobody had our phones out and kind of at halftime or about halftime when the class wrapped up within some of the students pulled out their phones and said wait what and Tom Brady is tweeting. The game is really awful and then I certainly wasn't expecting seventeen to nothing there into the fourth quarter for for the job so look I'm all about I'm here for and here for Jalen Ramsey drama which we're going to get into here in a minute and I'm I'm ready for more Gardner Menchu Yeah. Let's make that make that happen. The Gardner Mixture Menchu era is fun which the Lake Bortles Arrow is not very fun even when he was doing well it was more like you know he was being dragged by his defense successful season the Gardner era still going to be about the defense but at least it's entertaining and I think it's so funny because you know the argument when Nick False got signed before the season when he got that big deal from the Jackson. It was really only the Jacksonville sheeting against themselves. The argument in some circles was oh well. They had to pay him so much because he it has to be a leader and so we have to pay him like a leader to give him the sort of credibility. Gardner minhsiu is not making a lot of money. He's a late round pick. He looks like a leader through through two weeks. I mean it looks like he's you know he's he looks like he fits naturally in that role in a way that late round pick typically does not fit in as a rookie yeah. I mean there are some guys who just have it. You know and yeah he's bounced around a little bit in college but I don't think there was any question that he was like the man and pullman last year and you know I think you have to kind of have an outsized personality to succeed while playing for Mike Leach and yeah I mean he just he just kind of have it and we'll see how sustainable sustainable his playing style. Is You know once teams that are maybe a little bit better equipped defensively. than the titans were last night once you know there's a little bit more film out there on him. You know if he comes down to Earth a little bit but yeah this is a fun story and and look it's making the jags interesting and there was literally nothing other than Jalen Ramsey fighting with Doug marrone that was interesting about this jags team until we got Gardner Menchu in his Jock strap and mustache and all of those sorts of things and now I just want to know if the good ed place can edit it and debut like next week so they gotta they gotta work that in because I'm going to be super disappointed if it's still more blake bortles jokes. I hope they haven't being able to replace a really sort of like over the top editing where it's like guys normal volume and then you know it's Gardner Menchu like like the volume is totally totally off relative to the rest of what he's saying I mean yeah like over the next six weeks Gardner Minhsiu and get these next week. It's a tough place to play for young quarterbacks back. Carolina's defense has been inconsistent and start the year the Saints Pass Defense has been inconsistent to start the year bengals just got ripped apart by the niners jets defense. I don't know who's going to be playing for the jets by week. Eight I mean it's not crazy to think that he could put together very reasonable stretch of games and ended up you know possibly competing for the AFC south which is still wide open here. I mean there's no great. AFC South and that's gonNA open up a really interesting question for Jacksonville because this is not a season ending injury for Nick foles. They expect that he's going to be back at some point later in the season and he's keeps playing like this. What do you what do you do well. I mean that's and and man pornog- Poles got a big contract and the chance to start again after everything he's been through and you know this. You know rookie with a mustache shoot wears. There's nothing but a jockstrap comes in in two weeks later takes his job. I mean that would be a hell of a story but Yeah God bless you Gardner and shoe for giving us a reason to watch the Jacksonville Jaguars like I might even I live in Denver. I might actually go to that game next week. There was no way that I was gonna go to Jags Broncos but now now am I go so I'll report back and let you guys know if I go and follow follow him around for a day yeah absolutely I mean I feel like this was. Maybe the perfect storm of of ugly football game where you had jags titans which is sort of like the punch line for Thursday night football which is maybe a little unfair unwarranted has been on Thursday night football a bunch but only one game per year in the rain so it's national game so everyone's watching Ching including Tom Brady as we saw and then Sean Hockey League's crew as Kevin Seaford pointed out. I think it's the most penalty friendly crew in the NFL so you AH as bad as it was and it certainly was not an especially watchable game. I do hope that that's sort of the peak whether it's driven by Tom Brady whether it's driven by just you know the league sort of naturally not pushing hard for holding penalties and it is clearly a point of contention and it's you know even even if they are valid penalties you can call holding pretty frequently and it still feels like you know it's not making the game better by having a ton of third and longs if you saw a lot of last no it just it just baffles me that the the NFL looks after to the most successful seasons they've had in terms of offense and ratings are back up and people are excited headed and there's all these new young quarterbacks that that the NFL looked and said you know what should we do to to to change this. Let's call holding every other plane because come on man like let's just give the people what they want and that's offense and this is just it's been really painful to watch so. I'm curious to see if this becomes like some of the other rule changes and points of emphasis that we've seen in other years where we get a ton of it the first month of the season and then they really kind of rain it back in as the season goes along. I I hope so because yes I know that they it's important to call penalties when they're the blatant penalties but like you said you can find holding every every play and some of these. Games have just I've been become very very difficult to watch and it changing the outcomes of games for things that are fairly ticky tacky at this point and I mean it's one thing if you have you know team sitting there and saying hey we're happy. These calls are being made. You have the best player possibly in the history of the sport saying you know I. I don't think this is good for the sport. You know I it's sort of the Eh when Lebron James tweets about stuff things happen you know like Tom. Brady as not use that that sort of platform really outside of making jokes and doing being the occasional bit on twitter or instagram but you know I can't remember Brady criticizing the league this way yes certainly not and not the official like this. I mean he's had plenty of things that he could gripe about with the NFL over the years I mean he wasn't even out there really complaining about trying to have any of the other rule changes. I mean I honestly this is the first real change. That's actually affected the offense. Everything else has been kind of to the benefit of quarterbacks in the past but yeah I mean it is it is Brian James. You're exactly right. That's probably the perfect comparison Lebron James speaking out about something and well. Let's see let's see if there's actually that has an impact in the league offices offensive having and if and if any other body any other quarterbacks follow his lead and high profile people because you know coaches are reluctant to speak out too much about penalties because they can get fined but if more guys like Tom Brady come out and talked about how this is really affecting the product on the field then you know maybe maybe you know by October the the competition committee or get on get on the phone with the the officiating crews and say hey. Let's say let's talk a little bit. Yeah that's going to happen you know whether it's this week or in the weeks to come talking about player power and talking about NBA NFL comparisons. Let's get to start with Jalen. Ramsey and I'll get to the Puerto Conversation about this but Jalen Allan Ramsay after last week's game requested a trade from the Jaguars he got into a disagreement certainly with head coach Doug marrone during the game he said it in the days afterwards that that kind of past like he wasn't that upset about that moment and what happened there but things that were said to him after the game by the the Jaguars Organization led him to request a trade which he says he did not leaked not WanNa get out. I I don't think I can you know decide what that happened in. I I don't know certainly wasn't linked to me but by whatever circumstance Jalen Ramsey now appears to be you know indiscretions and Jack Respiratory in discussions since for trading their star quarterback so do you think start with this. Do you think the Jaguars do end up trading Ramsey given what you know and give them sort of the tea leaves here. Yeah I mean I think it's really going to depend on what sort of offer they get. I think they're setting the bar very high and they have some kind of comparisons. Now I mean the dealers just gave up a first round draft. Pick for MINKA Fitzpatrick. Who is I think a very good young player. Even significantly younger than Jalen Ramsey is but not as good as doing doing Ramsey so I think you could that's kind of the baseline so you wouldn't accept anything less than what the the dolphins gotten exchanged from Patrick from the steelers first and then you look kind of on the flip side and you have seen a team get to first round draft picks for you know the best defensive player has position arguably with with the with the bears raiders trade last year for Khalil Mack so I think that's on the high side. I think it's unrealistic to expect that team is going to give up two first round draft picks right now at this point in the season but I think there are teams that are looking at Jalen Ramsey and saying yeah we want that guy on our team and if you're a team of Anita cornerback and you have some cap flexibility. I think he's worth it. I mean he's such a good player. It's just a matter of WHO's actually going to pull the trigger and give up A first-round pick and then maybe an additional no higher pick a first-round picking a player and if the Jaguars will actually go for that because you know if you're the jags like why why why do you move on from him right now. Competitive in your division looks like you I mean that division is going to be wide open. It's not a lost season at this point where you know. I get why the dolphins are doing it. The dolphins are completely rebuilding and moving on for the future and you're going to quite as much stock dropped capital as you can. If you're the JAGS trading away your best player and I don't think there's too much of argument that he is your best player. Sorry to all your gardener. Menchu fan club out there doing ramp is your best player. So what are you doing if you trade him away at this point. I mean waving white flag on the season I don't. I don't think that's the right message to send to the rest of your team by by trading him unless somebody calls and gives you I two. I two first round picks. Maybe you have to do it yeah. I don't WANNA run off them. In shoe stands to be clear if you're still listening thank you for not turning the podcast off in in terms of Jalen Ramsey to your point. This isn't the similar to the Judean cloudy situation because cloudy was holding out on a franchise tag and you know certainly could have then sat out the season the Texans would have had to franchise him at twenty percent of his previous rate next year and that would have been untenable wouldn't have wouldn't have created significant trade value so at some point the text said Hey. We're not resigning this guy. Let's just get the best offer weekend ended up being third round pick in a couple of linebackers Jalen Ramsey. He's still two years away from a franchise tag you mean he's making seventeen and a half million dollars over the next two years and then he gets franchise is that would be the point where he could really start holding out and it would actually have a significant impact so I mean the Jaguars hold a lot of the cards here. You know they have after the ability to sit there and say hey we don't we want to keep him. We want to compete for a playoff berth and we think that he's GonNa make us better and we don't have to make a trade yet. The only thing I can think of is the fear of maybe getting into the planning situation down the line where you say okay yeah. We're not signing this guy when extension he's not going to be a part of our team in the future. We just can't trust him to be that guy now. So if you do that then basically you're going to get the most value for him probably now as opposed to even next offseason or or or the offseason after that so I could see them. Maybe thinking about it from that perspective but to your point they have to get blown away trading him for a second round. Pick or a couple of second round picks. Six right. Now makes no sense there. There's absolutely no if you're the Jaguars wouldn't the thing that makes the most sense is figure out how to use him better defensively because I think that's what he's so angry about is the defensive scheme that he's in and coaching staff. That's not using him to the best of his abilities. So wouldn't that be a smarter organizational. Organizational move is to coach better to your best player strengths rather than continue to fight with him and then potentially trade him away for an unknown quantity. I just is what would make most sense to me but you know I'm not an NFL coach so married to my own defensive scheme that I won't adjust it interesting best player. I mean do you think bill check would be using Jalen. Ramsey has his own corner frequent amount of the time absolutely not go bell check. I don't think Wade Phillips. If would-be I mean I think there's a lot of really good defensive coaches who would look at Jane Jalen Ramsey and say your best and man coverage okay. Let's do coverage and not try to force one one of the best defensive players and football to do something that he's not the best at and not just as not good zone corner 'cause I think he can be a very good song corner but I think he sees how so he could make their defense better how he could play better individually and they're not doing it at this point so I think there is some middle ground here where decides should be able to come together and work this out and if these are strictly football reasons that he's unhappy but I don't have a ton of faith that the jags organizationally are going to be willing to you do that it. It does seem like you know. This is a battle between Jalen Ramsey. Tom Coughlin no yeah. I think so you know I think so. It's it's kind of coming out through Doug marrone. WHO's Kinda the middle man who have to be there to kind of be the the day-to-day. Guy Who's enforcing all of this stuff you know yeah I mean Tom. Tom Coughlin is the guy who's building the roster. Who's you know kind of setting this the tone for this team and all of the you know how they wanna play and all that stuff but yeah and Doug Marrone the bad guy here in the middle of it but at the same point like what you know from the top down. Why can't you make this work. I mean you drafted this guy into Dave Caldwell kind of crowning achievement here the draft pick. That's actually worked out suspending. Did this guy make it work. Yeah I mean it's the best first-round pick I should say Brian Bankok way might be his best pick but certainly best first Dr Jones. Is You know legitimately great football player and like unless you're getting an absolute salute premium to trade him you would figure that he you know you should do whatever it takes to get him back on the scientists and Antonio Brown situation where he's being disrupted from practice Akkas or he's doing you know obviously worse things being accused of sexual assault off the field like this is just a guy saying hey I wanna win and I think I can help us. I think an even better by using zing me in this role that I think I'm best fit for and I'm frustrated that on that being used in that role so yeah I I. I think absolutely this is a the Jaguars should resolve the situation internally internally but let's say the Jaguars do not resolve the situation internally. Where could you see Jalen Ramsey heading or what are some of the destinations that you think makes accents for Jalen Ramsey as far as that without getting to the compensation. Just in terms of you know a team that might might be looking at how the cornerback yeah I mean yeah I mean I think the first thing is you have to look and say okay one. Who's WHO's kind of in a win now mode and really need a quarterback and I think the most obvious answers right there right there are the chiefs the Eagles and the saints although the drew brees injury kind of throws the saints into question a little bit there because how much are you. Do you think you can win right now and a an elite cornerback and he can make you a super bowl contender there so you know. I think the chiefs for the team that's so intriguing is just a little unsure if if they would actually if they could actually pull it off given the investments that they've made elsewhere on the roster and what they would have to give up to get him but just in terms of like scheme team and fit and a team that is has legit super bowl aspirations. I would love to see him there. I'd love to see him the same secondary. Tire Matthew you know I I think they need him really bad but you know all the guys who are really plugged into the chiefs right now. Our our beat writer named Taylor you know the guys who are on the ground in Kansas City Day are kind of pump the brakes on on those connections right now just because I think of all these things that I just kind of mentioned they you know they're very heavily invested in Frank Clark. They've already paid tyreek hill and they're you're. GonNa have to bury in the not-too-distant future. give a insanely large record breaking contract. Patrick Mahomes so you know you can only play pay top of the market deal for so many guys and they're already there with several other guys so you know I think that makes a Lotta sense and I think the eagles also really intriguing you know they kind of one of their glaring and weaknesses on their roster right now where they don't have a lot of weaknesses on the roster at least before injuries became a factor last week. you know I'd love I'd love to see Jalen Ramsey in that a secondary there. I think they could really use him and I think that would make them the NFC favorite if they were to figure out a way to get him yeah. I think absolutely I mean the to make it makes total sense the chiefs there is that concern. I think you know maybe fans. Sometimes think about the the cap situation there's also the reality of just some some owners just don't have hundreds of millions of dollars to commit to straight up cops yeah and there's every team has a budget for not just you know refilling at your Austrian and finally the capital so just how much money you can spend on your roster in a given year so chiefs are obviously budgeting for Patrick mahomes extension. They know it's coming. It's going to come from this off season. It's going to be a extremely large number. They're not GonNa let Patrick Mahomes getaway obviously but it is another Joan. Ramsey's extension is going to be improbably forty million in guarantees you'd figure at the very least and that that's a lot of money for a achieved enough. Obviously you know the the franchises worth but just actually having that cash on the hand you know I. It's always something that teams have to think about it that way. So maybe forty million about the ravens as a potential landing I was I was going to bring up the Ravens to the eagles with taking over hosting your no. No no you're thinking on the same wavelength he goes quickly. The one thing I would say about the eagles is it makes total sense for them to make their the most active trade team in the league. They need help it cornerback Joan Ramsey as a franchise player. They love getting talent. The one thing I would say is they have not been an organization historically under high rise spent a lot of money at cornerback they they you know when you're deals typically draft picks. They really don't invest in that position. They sent a audits safety but not a cornerback so I wonder you know. Would they be willing to trade for Jalen Ramsey number one figure they're going to have to give me an extension or not. GonNa Trade for him and then let let him leave but do you trade for him and then change the way that you construct your roster. I it's a question. I'm not saying that. It's a bad idea. I just think it'd be different for the Eagles in terms of the Ravens though I I like the idea the ravens we'll talk about them a little bit after the break here. The Ravens have issues at cornerback they've already lost lost. Jimmy Smith for Awhile Haven Young. They're they're slot. Corner is out for the year there there are certainly questions and they're a team that has you know focused heavily on adding adding talented cornerback thirteen that historically you know whether it's first round picks whether it's free agency whether it's retaining their guys do love having valuable cornerback. Marlin Humphry radio most host star in this league not Jalen Ramsey level but maybe in that second tier very underrated guy and I wonder if you know this is the sort of trade the guy they want to go in for where they say okay. We have the possibility to get a hall of fame caliber cornerback for a decade. They love their draft capital under Kosta. We still haven't really seen a ton of how he's going to operate. You'd figure is going to be similar Ozzie newsome but this could be a trade where they say okay. We have a young quarterback in the Mark Jackson. We have a you you know a cheaper roster in some ways. We lost talent. During this off season. We bought Thomas but we lost a lot of players. were making good mining so maybe getting Jalen Ramsey is guy. We WanNA build around as sort of you know. The the next guy in that sort of hall of fame tier of Your Ray Lewis and your ed reads maybe Joe Ramsey could be the next guy a sort of in that procession for for the Ravens. Yeah I mean I just I love the fit and the potential and just kind of imagining this like New Legion of boom. No you pair Earl Thomas with a really really good corner and it's. It's so fun to think about and I wish I wish it could happen this week and happened before in an aero. Album Ravens are playing the chiefs this weekend. I think there were I would. I would most like to see him. I'd love to see him in Baltimore or Kansas the city those are my two ideal destinations but my my hesitation with the ravens is exactly what you said is that is how much they value their draft capital and it's just it's not and move that they were typically made giving up future first-round pick by the model that we're seeing working in the NFL right now when you've got that chief corner that chief quarterback quarterback and you achieve quarterback especially who think of good enough to get you to play out you do everything you can to build the rest of the roster around you. You make aggressive trades. You signed free reagents so I would love to see Arcot to do it. I'm just not sure if you've quite aggressive enough to to make it happen. I give you a team that has not been talked about a lot but I think makes in some sense at least to me. Yes what about the Dallas Cowboys this is eighteen passed on Jalen Ramsey to take zeke Elliott several years ago. They are very good to start together to another offense looks great. They are a team that is you know certainly would figure in Super Bowl contention attention to win and win a bunch of year. They have a decent secondary. You Know Anthony Brown Spain playing well. Byron Jones is obviously the top corner but a guy who's coming up for a contract this offseason and a guy who they have not signed to an extension yet. If I'm not mistaken yeah I'd rather have Jalen Ramsey than Byron Jones Tehran. That's my point so now not only do they have Byron Jones who they might not want sign them. I want to be the guy or they move on from. They make other deals obviously have a lot of contracts to handout. I'm less concerned about Jerry Jones paying out big money than just about any other any other owner in the league but if you're the Jaguars and your trading Jalen Ramsey well here's your chance to get Byron Jones who has the size to play in your scheme. They do prefer bigger stronger cornerback. Byron Jones's six one in one thousand nine nine. you know a guy who can play on the outside and your scheme who can take over Joan Ramsey where you're not telling your team hey were selling out and we're going to trade at our best player and get a couple of draft picks online. We have a guy who can make a difference for us now end. Maybe we pick I wonder if that could be a trade that might make sense for besides Gosh. It does make the way you lay it out right there. I do Meena kinds friend of your pod said the other day though like that story that show Jalen Ramsey last summer that he is still holding a pretty serious grudge against the Joneses for them not taking him in the draft when they took Zeki L. E. Instead and I dunno and I feel like a you know a contract with fifteen fifty million dollars of guarantees in it would probably make that grudge go away but I thought that'd be my one by one in concern there is that he would not want to play for them but that would probably be the first time in the history of the NFL who didn't want to go play for the cowboys. Guess money at least for me. I'm pretty petty I feel like thirty or forty million dollars in guaranteed money is something that makes me less petty one team the last Democrat we'll get to hear at least from my side the forty niners who'd makes some sense to me as well. They're there to know off to a great start on Richard Sherman's playing great on one side side of the field he he looks good this year as well their corners elsewhere not necessarily all that great and callow weatherspoon. Aucoin Williams struggled a bit just obviously we're all hoping he plays well well but you know. Injuries are ready giving him some trouble this year. you know. I wonder if they would sit there and say hey we have a shot at making in the playoffs here in the NFC west and we you know we we've gone through. The draft picks in years past we we. We've amassed the draft capital. We I've gone for guys you. You know what what if we can get a franchise difference maker at cornerback. What will that do to transform our defense yeah no. That's that's a really intriguing about two and we we know John Lynch's aggressive and I don't think he would be scared to make that sort of move and they're also not afraid to spend money so I don't think drop capital little or cash or cap considerations would be a huge huge concern there and as good as well as good as Richard Sherman has been playing so far this year he's a nearing nearing the end and they're doing it would be fantastic to kind of pair those guys together for the short term and then let Jalen Ramsey be your your your starter long-term there with a long term contract effort after Richard Sherman has done so sure I like. I like all of these options and I think what's so intriguing about this Jalen Ramsey speculation. Is that one if I had to bet right now. I bet they don't trade him that would be. I guess where my money would be if I were to gamble and that SORTA way but we have so many options. There's there's just that's what happens. When there's a player of his caliber who is who's kind of some all of a sudden available you you see how he could fit in so many different places which is why it's so maddening that the jags can't seem to make him that in their own scheme absolutely and we brought up. Richard Sherman and Richard Sherman is someone who's giving a quote about this. It's in recent weeks in recent days and talking about the sort of the new. How can I put it sort of the the the leverage players are exploiting in the NFL and and certainly no. There's you'd compare it to the NBA. You'd compare to sort of the the leverage top tier players have had moving around and and sort of creating opportunities for themselves and Richard Sherman is someone who has publicly spoken out many times about you know player having that ability to sort of create their own situations and create their own opportunities and it seems like it's becoming more of a conversation in the NFL fell now especially over the last couple months where you had Melvin Gordon Holding at Zeke Elliot Holding out so that got resolved the Antonio Brown situation where he forced his way out of Oakland and the Mega Fitzpatrick situation where he was frustrated in one and the trade ended up getting traded to Pittsburgh Do you think this is a more pressing issue issue now than it was in years past. What do you think the causes and do you think it's going to continue to keep happening. yes. I mean I think it is a real issue. I don't think it's just kind of a media created issue. I mean I think the fact that we all of the situations that you just rattled off. it used to be that you'd see just one of those type of situations where really the the only time you would ever see a player to exert any leverage was when they were franchise tag it was kind of that was their their holdout time and you know. I think I think owners concerned about it because it's happening a lot but I think this is also kind of a problem of their own creation and you know I've talked to a lot of did a lot of reporting this summer are about kind of some player issues and CD issues and for story that should be running soon at the athletic and the the rookie salary structure and the franchise tag doug the way that's used with multiple multiple chances use the franchise tag in the fifth year option and as part of that rookie salary structure. I mean it greatly reduces players his freedom of movement and especially for first picks and just about all these guys that we're talking about that are unhappy our first round picks and one there the really good players but two guys that they we know that there are ability to maximize their earning potential is is severely limited by the NFL rules and stuff. That's in that's ingrained in the and that teams can use the franchise tag on them not just once but they can use it twice in addition to that fifth year option so they're greatly restricted from actually hitting free agency and the only only kind of recourse that they have at this point is you know holding out demanding trades and I not I know I know fans. Don't let it you know fans. Always it seems almost it always seemed to side with ownership in these types of situations which always confuses me a little bit but you know. I understand Dan why they want to take some of this power back and tab a little bit more control over their prime years of their career and be able to capitalize and you know they they look at the NBA and they. Let's see how how guys are able to kind of dictate where they go. They're able to you know have more freedom of movement obviously they have guaranteed contracts which the NFL doesn't have have. I don't think that's a super realistic. That's going to become the norm at any point soon. It's not part of the CBA. Teams aren't giving guaranteed contracts. It's not something that the players are collectively bargaining in there and so I think that's really what the problem is so when when owners now are starting to see these stories coming out there. I think Dan Graziano wrote on on this week about you know how owners are going to consider some sort of penalties additional penalties for players that are holding out you know. I think what they've gotta do is in these next see being associations eliminate some of these things whether it's the fifth year option for these first round picks or the franchise tag. I can't see them actually getting rid of the franchise tag but it's all of these factors together that they've created the system where you know players are pushing back wanting to take a little bit more control of their careers now. Yeah I think absolutely the franchise tag. It'll be incredibly difficult to you. You know a get rid of that. I don't think that's about to happen anytime soon but you know that that reduces so much of the leverage players have at the top level and I think that's going to be what we see happening in the future. I think we may see more. You know sort of Julio Jones own style contracts from some teams where he got a sixty six million in his extension and sixty four million is guaranteed. you know I I I think you'll see more deals like that for the when you have a permissive owners the falcons are one of the more generous ownership groups in the league and top to your players where where where there's really no alternative where he would just say we have to have this guy on our roster and I think you'll see players at that tier continue to sort of exploiting their leverage whether it be a Jalen Ramsey requesting trade whether it be Oleo Jones spreading the holdout unless he gets a new deal two years away from free agency you know I think you'll see players to topple retire quicker because they make more money but I think it's going to influence at this point if the CBS is relatively similar just those top tier guys think something's going to have to change in the CBA for that the trickle down to sort of the more rank and file in the players Union yeah for sure and I think it would be interesting and I haven't seen this reporting done yet how be sort of hold outs are received by the NFL NFL membership at large the guys that are on minimum contracts and you know the guys that are bouncing from team to team and the fifty fifty third man on the roster. I A lot of those guys I think would probably be afraid to speak out about it but you know but I think it is one of those things that it kind of affects the entire the entire membership the entire League but but really it's the these top guys in the first round picks most affected and also have the most leverage to actually affect any change absolutely Let's I tend to break here. Let's talk about two of the week three games in a moment here on the bill Barnwell show. Can you feel it. Football season is upon us whether you're road tripping to the game or throwing around the Pigskin with your spouse you WanNa make the most of it so make the most of it with pennzoil synthetic motor oil. It's the first motor oil oil made from natural gas not crude oil. It gives you unbeatable engine protection. It's kind of like an offensive lineman for your engine. The proof is is in the pennzoil based on sequence for a test using. Sap Five W. Thirty all right back here on the barn while show I'm Bill Barnwell. ESPN joined again by the Athletics Lindsay Jones. Let's preview two of the more interesting games at least to me and we can review the NFL and and I think the big one obviously the one when people are most excited about is chiefs ravens to two teams we have the chiefs offense which continues look like a juggernaut going up against the Ravens who historically great defense look impressive the first two weeks of the year and have Lamar Jackson laying like an MVP candidate through two weeks so the most complete ravens team. Maybe we've seen in and while I have to admit though I have been wrong before I will be wrong again. I could be wrong here. I have kind of a hot. Take about this game before. It starts to have a hot day. Drop me needs planes coming out. I'm ready. Bring it. Bring on the hot take. I don't have enough enough of them. Typically I think to justify justify any drops in the heartache business but the thing I would say is this we're assuming the ravens defense is the Ravens defense we know from years past and at the very least. I'm skeptical that is the case. Evens lost a ton of talent during the fees. Cj Mostly Terrell suggs various myth Eric acquittal and granted they brought in Thomas. Thomas is a fantastic player. I love Roy Thomas but they've already lost haven young and brandon cart guard upbringing car. I mean Smith cornerback back young after the year Jimmy Smith out. I believe for this chiefs game as well and you look at how they've played this year weak one. They played the dolphins. I'm not sure the dolphins are legitimate. NFL team especially on the offensive side of the ball so I am very skeptical that that means very much in terms of evaluating the the Ravens Defense and then last week was twenty five or forty three forty nine. They moved the ball consistently up down the field and the ravens they just really struggled in the red zone own and I don't think the chiefs are going to have the same struggles in the red zone that Arizona did so to me. I see situation where I think we're heading into this game thinking. It's GonNa be greed offense versus defense on the Baltimore side. I don't know if that's going to be the case. Yeah I think that's I think those are legitimate concerns. I don't think that's super hot. Take I mean I think I think you gotta work on your hot takes rebel before before you're going to be a hot. Take master there but I I I think those are legitimate concerns and I think one thing that we can expect out of this game and expect out of the Ravens. Defense is at least stylistically what what they're gonNA do. I think they can take a lot from the success that they had against Patrick Mahomes last year. When both teams played in December went over time and you know. I think that I think we can we know what wink Martindale defensive coordinator what he wants to do and that's going to bring a lot of pressure. Try to hit Patrick Mahomes as much as possible just the the question is how effective than they can they be doing that and do they have. The personnel that here we here in week three is able to do what they were able to do. Last year when they had You you know the Darius Smith and Terrell suggs on the edges instead of new guys so you know I think I think stylistically we know what they're gonNA. Do I know I I know they know how to get after the cheese and how to attack Patra mccombs Patrick Mahomes. I'm just not sure like you said if they're going to be able to actually follow through with that and I thought it it was you know doing some reading this morning and Jesse back the Ravens beat writer for the I thought he went into the philosophy and he I thought he made a really good point where she said if this game was happening in January right now this was a playoff game like let's say that this is a divisional playoff game. He thinks that January the Ravens defense will probably be built and and ready to face the base the chiefs and to really get the chiefs a good game but here in week three. He's just not sure that they're together enough to do that yet and given given the injury situations that you mentioned so you know. I I would certainly pick the chiefs in this game but I am so excited to watch it. I mean I a lot of times. If I'm home on a Sunday I'll watch a lot on red zone own jump around but I think for those one o'clock games. It's GonNa be like strictly on that game and it's GonNa take a lot to prime away from Ravens chiefs and not early window. Yeah I think absolutely yeah. I think it's a really good point and last year they did a decent job against cheese which which it's all relative. It's a sliding scale. They have twenty ninety seven points. That game went to overtime that was actually the game where Robert Griffin came in for Lamar Jackson in overtime and then the Baltimore offense kind of stalled out once he got in in there but you know they were effective that she's had to score with fifty three seconds left to kind of tie the game and get the game into overtime to begin with. Ravens almost won the game without getting over time and I think it's just tough because I don't know what you do to stop this defense. If you don't have a great natural pass rush and you're not able to drop seven into coverage rush for the Ravens are one of the most blitz happy teams in the NFL there was second in the NFL blitz percentage last year second in the NFL and blitz percentage senators this year and Patrick Mahomes has the best QBR in the NFL since the start of twenty eighteen against the blitz. I mean it's you know you would figure that. It's GONNA A B him getting away from the blitz him finding a one on one option whether it's McCall harden whether it's to Marcus Robinson whether it is a Travis Kelsey whether it is Sammy Watkins Watkins and eventually there's going to be enough. Mitch Nashes that that he's GonNa make big plays and you know can the Ravens third and fourth and fifth if cornerbacks hold up in coverage against those guys if they're you know mashed up forty yards downfield with their speed I I I would be skeptical so I think it could be a game where it's it's you know a couple three more more three announcing you might expect from the chiefs but I think you're GonNa see the big place that we come to see as a hallmark the thing I wonder about on the flip side of this though and I I wonder what you think about this in terms of the Ravens sort of game plan on offense. You have more confidence. I think in Lamar Jackson than you had in years past after his start to the season but do you want to slow this game down and just try and hold on offense for as much as possible. Just run run run run run or do you trust that what if the game does turned into a shootout you have the weapons and he had the quarterback to keep up. Yeah I mean I. I think they'll feel confident. They have the quarterback. That's GONNA keep keep up. I still think that there's elements to the Ravens offense that we haven't seen yet. you know I think last week it was kind of really fun to you know week. One it was all about Lamar Jackson yes and as pastor we to got to kind of see him at in the ad back in the running the running elements. I still think that there's parts of this that we haven't seen yet parts of their evolution that maybe they've been saving for this game so I think that they have to be confident in him to kind of engage in a shootout. I don't know if that's misplaced confidence. I guess we'll find out but I think it's GonNa be a really good benchmark for where actually the ravens offenses where Lamar Jackson is in his development but I think they're going to score points you know I think they're gonna be able to take advantage of some. You know really big explosive plays I think Mark Brown is legit. I don't think this is kind of a flash. You know rookie flash. I think that they're just finding more more and more ways to use them and if there's any team that knows how deadly it is to have a really really fast wide receiver. It's the chiefs so you'd hope that they have been planning for that. Have some sort of defensive game plan for that but I'm I'm so excited. I hope it's a shootout. I I hope it goes over time you know with somebody who just fan of football and wants to see kind of the next the next generation of really good quarterbacks. I'M I. I hope it's a shootout and I hope Lamar Jackson can keep up yeah for sure the one thing about the chiefs offense. I did not get that I wanted to mention and I I wonder you think given that the chiefs are now. Downer fishers out four to six weeks. They have camera irving who was a bench to guard last year. Laying left tackle go for the time being their running game has been bad this year. Damian Williams twenty two carries for thirty four yards and he's injured shady McCoy Twenty one for one zero four looks good good but really mostly one or two big plays and he's been pretty inconsistent otherwise he's also one hundred percent at this point. Are you concerned about the chiefs running game. Do you think the Ravens may be just sort of play with six seven defensive backs and just dare chiefs to run the ball on them. I mean they play with six or even seven defensive backs isn't Patrick mahomes still just GonNa probably not sure if I'm just not sure if that would scare your him at all and if they find other ways to just whether it's using the running backs in the passing game a little bit more by another ways to exploit them but I'm not not overly concerned about the chiefs running game at this point. I mean I'd like to see them. Have the option of having a passing game I think or having a running game excuse me and you you know some of the points when they were when they were at their best last year and even when they're at their best with Alex Smith are it was when they had a kind of a functional running game and running back that you could rely on three downs and you know I think you know I- lots of people including myself have made the argument that the cream hunted not got himself into trouble and and not the chiefs cut him. I think would've won the super bowl last year. I think they were completely different team with a really good running back than they are right now so I do WanNa see them at least be functional well there but I'm not super worried about it right now and I think if there's any team in the league that can get by with a below below average mediocre running game. it's the chief. That's probably fair yeah. I think it's absolutely good point. Let's get to the OR DO WANNA. Make a pick in this game. I don't never ask two picks. I feel like I should do you feel like the chiefs are gonNA take it. I I do I think it's going to be high scoring. I'll go like thirty five twenty eight chief and hopefully coming down to the very end there absolutely. I hope it works out that way. I think is going to win but you know Mark Jackson. Surprise me this year. I didn't think he was capable of what we saw in week. One and I like Lamar Jackson so I I think there's I hope it's the game that you're that you are framing. It asks the think that'd be really fun. I think I think the arrowhead crowd is going to be yes really jacked up. This is their first home game since AFC championship game. You know good weather tailgating I think I think that the home the arrowhead crowd is going to give the she's just like an added out extra. Buddhist absolutely the other game I want to get to this week is a game between two teams. Seemingly seemingly heading in different directions we have San Francisco Forty niners off to a to winnow start finally looking like they're going to be delivering on the potential Angelique showing for years and the Pittsburgh steelers and I can't imagine there is a steelers fan could have expected this Owen to start Ben Rothlisberger out for the year Mason Rudolph making his first. NFL start against the niners this weekend so in watching Mason Rudolph play and I I think it's obviously too early to say anything about Mason Rudolph adjacent that first game you know he was fine. It wasn't like he was awful wasn't like he was fantastic. It was like wow there's there's there's Ben Rothlisberger part to this great the steelers but you know the interception was Dante increase fault which would certainly not not not Mason Rudolph all Dante Moncrieff creepiest not probably going to play this week might be done with the steelers after two weeks. He's been that bad but I I don't. I don't think that the steelers might drop off all that much was not playing better than sonnet better quarterback. Mason Rudolph but I think it seems like he has the infrastructure that a a young quarterback would need to succeed in you know fourteen expects to compete now. Yeah I mean I. I don't know you would think so so the way that's typically the if you looked at the steelers roster and the way that they're kind of strapped with their really good offensive line that got a decent running game. They've got a really good number. One wide receiver would think that'd be kind of the perfect situation for backup quarterback to to slide into but they've just been so dysfunctional and looks looks like they're not super. Well coached all of a sudden Their defense has been really bad surprisingly bad so yeah. I've got a lot of questions of how how they're gonNA do their special. You know having go to the West Coast and playing a nice defense. That's been really really really really good so it's certainly not an ideal situation for for Mason Rudolph to be making his I start so I don't know if they just looked so out of sorts and it's been really hard to watch. I think that the see this kind of decimation of uh-huh steelers team that I think we ought I don't know if anybody was saying oh they were super bowl contender going in this year but I think I think kind of those expectation that they should at least be an AFC north arthritis and potentially be a playoff team. Yeah I mean the thing that was strange about last. Week's game is that you saw what happened. They you know they were. I think pretty comfortably ahead of the seahawks and the first after that game I think they had to near defensive touchdowns. That nearly came back. I think was actually called back in the one came up short but they were out playing the seahawks in that game and then once Rudolf came in they did struggle more ended up losing the game. I don't know no if that was Mason Rudolph fault that was really the defensive side of the ball and the struggles hat in in terms of not being able to stop the the the seahawks and in third and long situations that they had thirteen sixteen and were about force upon they'll Russell Wilson scramble for fifteen yards and then the seahawks converting thirty four th and one and lock up the game. I mean you know maybe they got a field goal when the game maybe were sitting here saying. Mason Rudolph is Garner Minhsiu two point. Oh and he's you know Gaulish quarterbacks by the defense didn't stop. I mean they got an abort. They basically only got US toppling the Seahawks muffed snap and the loser recovered it so I I can't imagine the defense is going to be this battle season and part of it was that they played the Patriots in week one but they were the fifth worst defense. I believe by Ebay after two weeks and I you know there's just too much talent here for them to be this bad. No Yeah I mean absolutely and You you know I think they realized that and that's why we saw them. Go out and give up a first round draft pick to get makeup fitzpatrick. Who's going to kind of be allowed to just play safety for them interested to see how how integrated he hasn't to their game plan after having arrived there on Monday. I would expect that he should he should play a lot. I mean they need them to play a lot. You gave up a lot for him. so but yeah they they know this. There's this I found this today. from mark bully that they have eight former first round picks starting on their defense. That's incredible so you should be a lot better than they are and they need to start playing like they have eight. First draft picks on their defense yes and making his Patrick. You'd figure cure is gonNA fill in at free safety. Shun Davis is GONNA hit. ed hit injured reserve already. We're not going to but it'd be a straight swap. Their are you know Mika. Fitzpatrick played cornerback in time for the dolphins. Maybe his best role could be like a sort of you know tired matthew sort of hybrid role but it seems like the logical thing especially for a guy who doesn't necessarily know the fence yet is starting at free safety sort of play him in that role and then we'll see what the niners do in terms of its voiding its Patrick's inexperienced an experience because I mean watching that game last week against the the bengals when I saw more than anything is just eighteen that was so aggressive in terms of taking taking advantage of the Bengals over pursuit is the word I was thinking of received a lot of you know and and we know that with China what he wants to do an offense what what intrigues me about the niner's thing you brought up which is their defense which has been very good through two weeks and you know I. I wonder how much to them. Do you think you have to see before you start believing that they are. You know sort of a team sort of defense that they've been hoping they were going to become for years is is it. Are you good now. Does that be more weeks like I said a month like what is take for the niners to kind of be real in your eyes. Yeah I mean I. I think I already believe it. Yeah I saw them a couple of times in the preseason training camp both in Santa Clara and then when they were in Denver practicing in the Broncos and you just look at them and you're like okay. I I mean this is. I mean they're so up front. They're really athletic. my question about believing in that niners defense is. I just WanNa see if they can stay healthy yeah and you know. d- Ford has barely practiced at all. He's got this knee tendinitis but has kind of carried over from when he was in Kansas City and he didn't practice for much of the pre-season season. He's been kind of out of practice most of this week. They think he's going to be able to play but it's just gonNA constantly have to monitor and then you know Nick Bosa is just you know I think we're just always going to be talking about some sort of injury situation with him until he can prove that he can make it through entire games in weeks without coming out with some sort of injury so I think he made it through through the the bengals game. Okay has practice this week but you know I wanNA. I just WanNa see those guys healthy. Stay healthy for consecutive weeks. and that's that's really my only concern at this point before kind of like all in just especially with their front seven and their defensive line especially if you're defensive line is really good at can make up for some deficiencies agency elsewhere but they're just they're just so deep especially at tackle now the way they're able to rotate guys in and then they're just they're so tall and they're interest. They're just really fun to watch a friend so I'm there I just WanNa see them. Stay healthy on a week-to-week basis. Yeah I mean the athletes especially upfront or certainly there but to your point right I mean you look at at the snap counts for the Bengals game and granted you know they were blowing up the bengals. So maybe you set your guys little more but Nick Bosa played forty three percent of the defensive snaps. Defoe Lord Ward played thirty five percent of the defensive snaps and You wonder if that's GONNA rise. You know there are going to want to rotate their lineman. They're very deep front and you know the Eagles do this as a strange. They don't play their stars forty percent of the time they played them. Sixty sixty five percent of the time with the idea that when we get to January Fletcher Cox is GonNa play every snap like he's not GonNa play seventy ninety percent of the sanctuary waiting for the big moment to get him in there so I think absolutely nick is still playing through the high ankle sprain. Ford his knees a problem squad. What is a problem even if those guys play they. They're one of the rare teams. It seems like where I research on this. I haven't found any meaning behind behind when you have your bye week. Whether it's better to have it earlier late it makes no difference based on everything I've done but this is like a team where getting a bye week four which just by they're about to get might be good for them just to get those two guys you know sort of a week of rest and get them ready for. I was going to be a long. You know thirteen game stretch to end the season. Yeah I agree. Although I I just a high ankle and then knee tendinitis. I'm just afraid that those are things that they're just not going to ever be better. Take take months off and you know that's my. That's my fear for those two guys but hopefully they're young. They're healthy your resilient and they're able to you know get get back to the point that they can continue playing through it. That's my concern there and but I think the week four by is going to be good offensively as they are trying to adjust to life without Joe Staley really which I think that's it's been a really under reporter underrated injury this week just given all the other stuff. That's been going on in the league but you know you just don't replace a guy like Joe. Staley and they don't have a great kind of backup plan here. I think I'm not I'm not confident in what they're gonNA do their at left tackle. It's going to be just in school pronouncing his name I apologize but the rookies pronouncing school you're right okay good guests. I very rarely early to get my I guess right with Bronson players names but yeah rookie sex brand pick is going to be stepping in and then just alias just an institution. They're like you just don't replace. I like that with anybody and maybe they'll be active in the trade market. I don't think they're GONNA go out and get. Trent Williams from Washington given that Kyle Shanahan as the head coach of this team but you know certainly a big loss for a team that their offensive line finally looked like it was coming together. Western rich burke final expect the guy he was several years ago with the giants so you would hope that what they do find a solution there that either school or or were they end up playing a tackle and holding up but yeah. I mean this is going to be really interesting game. I think with the niners yes they cannot two or three you know start even given that the NFC west it's in good shape that certify that puts them in a really strong put in a really strong spot to end up with a wildcard down the line. Obviously it's only three games missed the playoffs starting three. You know it happens all the time but I mean just banking those three winds start. The year puts commits such good shape going forward yeah and I think this is an okay yeah. I mean I think the room where talk a lot about the steelers defense. I think the one that's GonNa do have the past Russians. There's GonNa be a big challenge for for Justin School in his first start but yeah you're right if they can get to three no that's huge and you know before we move on from that. I just one one more thing about Joe Staley as I went to the von Miller toss rush summit this summer and sat through like a several hours long film session where they were you know watching all these pass rushers going against offensive tackles around the league and I will say well a lot of the film session there. was you know kind of off the record in terms of the stuff that guys were saying about offensive tackle. I can say that the one guy hi who got the most kind of universal praise and respect from the guys in that room and those guys like Aaron Donald and Frank Clark von Miller was Joe Staley. I mean he was the guy who most guys talked about how they had so much trouble against them how much they respected him so this is a really significant loss here for the niners. This is not going from kind of just it's an average D- off an average offensive tackle to an undrafted rookie this is going from an all pro to a guy who who's even his college commission coach didn't have the best the best things to say about him this week. This is an historic from the athletic that I read this morning. that I just thought was really terrifying thing if you're a niner fan and this is from a Justin school specific position coach from from Vanderbilt and he said that school is quote not one hundred percent on his fundamental and he's not the greatest athlete in the world but he's going to give you everything. He's got to get the job done. He might get his tail kicked but it'll get his tail kick slowly to get the ball out. You know I don't it doesn't give me the best confidence that the best thing that your position coach has to say about you is that at least the the pain will happen slowly so he works already anything to be really interesting. His Dad is that his his father is the executive assistant director for intelligence with the FBI so yeah. That's super interesting so you know I think he's you know works. Really hard probably does a lot of research. has a father in high places who could probably get some really scary stuff done if you know if you needed to but probably not the best athlete to be facing Watt Pre for start yeah so let me ask you this. We'll finish up here. in terms of this game is more intriguing if the niners win and start three zero or is it more intriguing to you if the steelers win with Rudolph often kind of salvage. What's been a horrible start the year. Ooh you know I think the niners winning just because of the NFC west is so interesting right now where you have two other they're two and teams with the Rams and the seahawks so you know I think that race that division would be so interesting if all three of those teams or three and and what that's GonNa mean for the NFC. We but you know I wanna see a good showing for Mason Rudolph. I don't want this to be kind of a lopsided. Another team where quarterback is hurt and it takes their season. I think for the niners there's and you know and I know you. You've been on the niners bandwagon all off season. I think we talked about it back in June that you you were really high on their chances to make the playoffs so you know I imagine we wanna be proven right here. Well Lindsey some of the other teams. I said we're going to improve this year. Include the giants and the jets so I'm GonNa Take Doc I'M GONNA hope for a small victory where I can if I can get the niners lockdown and there'd be work on the giants jets in the months of common terms of teams that were expecting to improve that would be nice. I'll just say them thirty saying you think the niners are going to win this game. Oh Boy flipping the tables on you here. I think the steelers are GonNa win. This game all right other than ours are still. GonNa improve the steelers pulling up so they're six and a half point underdogs. I I don't know I. I just think that I think they absolutely need to win this game. I think the niners this is sort of like a house money game for them. I think before the year if he said hey you can start to start the year before you buy they would have been all in. They would have been super thrilled. sealers feels like this might be their season if they lose this game so. I think Mike Tomlin is going to have them ready and I think that they're gonNA be better. I think especially on the defensive side of the ball then they've been the first two weeks so I'm GonNa go the steelers steelers to cover but the niners to win that that's fine. We'll look we will not play the heartache. Drop that over the course the chauffeur offer this but Lindsay. If people check out what you write in also now also what you do in terms of podcasting work and they do that yes you can find find Oliver. Stuff are all of my stuff at the athletic you can find me on twitter at by Lindsey H Jones and yeah we've got a twice weekly podcast on the athletic where we you. Kinda go through our power rankings and then do some other rankings of fun things around the League and then I was on our new podcast called the lead this week talking all about the Antonio Brown situation an and kind of the league's with including the League League's history with dealing with players accused of violence against women in the personal conduct policy so yeah go download those check those without and yeah follow me on twitter by Lindsey H Jones Awesome Lizzie. Thank you so much. Thanks guys. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks so much to Lindsay. Jones and guys say be sure sure to check out the Adam Schefter. PODCAST WIKI talks with one of my favorite players former. NFL Receiver two time Superbowl Winner Torrey Smith on why deciding to retire now was the right decision. Torrey Smith one of the more thoughtful players in the NFL very smart guy definitely worth your time there and remember to subscribe to the Adam Schefter podcast and if you want slightly less a smart conversation also my show the barn will show wherever you get your podcast but thanks for listening more audio coming from US next week.

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