Kathy Dawson: Capitalizing on Current Employer Fails to Win Critical Hires
Advanced recruiting techniques lands the most desirable talent launch your company towards massive success. This is the higher power radio show with Rick Girard. Are you shocked at your offer was turned down while today we're discussing the reality of the current hiring landscape spoiler alert it's all true competitive and it's a candidate in employee's market to rent a teach you ways in which you can capitalize in the current market conditions and have your offers accepted. Ooh, love it. Today's quote, you can design create and build the most wonderful place in the world, but it takes people to make that dream a reality. Any idea who said that MS Cathy Dawson sounds like Walt Disney to me, super smart. The smartest guess ever they all know the answers. I'm Richard, welcome to the higher power radio show. Our mission is to provide proven tactical solutions to solve your company's most difficult hiring challenges. We share insights from top performing entrepreneurs and industry experts like our guest today, MS Cathy Dawson who's the CEO of Dawson Dawson Inc. Kathy is the firms nonprofit liaison. She's also a great chair dancer and oversees the executive it retained search, temporary and contract staffing, business development practices of the firm. What sets Kathy apart is an innate ability to develop long-term growth oriented strategies and to make. Lasting placements as it was her own firm. She's a well known speaker trainer in the industry as well as a highly sought after talent acquisition expert catch mixer, tested guests for today. Boy, couple type of my bad. So candy, welcome to the power radio show. Today's, thank you, Rick. I'm so excited to be here. I'm excited to have you. So here's we're gonna cover today. We're gonna talk about the current talent landscape, then we're going to tell you where your company's screwing up. While is great hires and we're gonna teach you how to take advantage of the current market to land great people. So let's dive right in. What is the current landscape? Let's talk a little bit about that. Well, let's see. What does the unemployment rate right now? I think most of us know that it's lower than it's been in seventeen years. Three point, nine two point nine in Orange County. So three point, nine nationwide. And so they say three percent of that is unemployed -able. So that's the landscape today point, nine percent of the people that are actually employable. Exactly. Right. So that's not a very good number for employers? No, it's not a very good at all. So you have a point, nine percent chance of finding a person through your own means? Yes. The other part of them, Orange County, you have like a minus point one. That's true. Very true. Part of the landscape is that fifty one percent of the people that are currently employed, guess where they what they're doing. They're looking for jobs on our dime as employers that great. Are, you know, we talk about engagement quite a bit employee engagement. And what's interesting is that when I throw statistic out a lot of times, employers are going to be like, not my company. Sure. Know fifty. One percent of your employees are probably looking. Yeah, yeah, I do the same thing. I'll be in a meeting and I'll say, just imagine half of the people here, whether they want to admit it or not are actively looking at opportunities when they come their way. That's a big number and we want to make sure we're protecting ourselves right, throw stick into this. Look Mr. CEO half your staff is looking right now. Well, it's probably higher for if you're a bad CEO. Exactly. I would say Otis him. So that's just the average. And then they say there's been six point, six million jobs and literally in the US they go on filled. That's a lot of jobs that go on filled. So we'll you think happens with that. We the people that are currently working have to absorb those jobs. Right? So it's a big challenge for companies to hire the right people in to make sure that they're giving themselves a fighting chance just out on talk about seventy. One percent of the population is disengaged in their current roles. Yes, indeed. So you have the disparity. Do you have another twenty percent that aren't looking, but they're also not giving optimum performance, right? That's absolutely right. Engaged in play is taking money like stealing from us. It's the same thing as I say, one hundred richest Rog. We could have and we will. I mean, lots of companies have that issue stuff more. All right. So now we know screen goes. Talking about where you missing the Mark. I see a few things as far as why companies are having a hard time hiring, and I hear this all the time. I can't find people. Hey chain while you're not looking at the right place. A great. So where do we look? He let me to answer that. You're going to give. So where do we look? Everywhere is the answer. Excellent. I love you. I knew I would anyway. Now you need to look everywhere and everywhere everybody else isn't looking. So what I usually recommend to my clients is that they take a look at where their workforce population the most successful the most productive or coming from, and then you try to duplicate that success. So it depends on what level you're hiring for, of course, but he for hiring you, manufacturing workers, light, industrial. You want to try to get to that workforce middle-management clerical secretarial, executive search all the same where they come from, where do they hang out? And then you know, posting ads doing those kinds of things are ways just to gather as much go wide versus deep. Right? I know it's painful cringe. I, I hate going wide. I agree. 'cause we have two different, you know, search methodologies. I mean, yes, for the masses. When you have scale, you have to do to just make Shin's sent shivers down my spine is starting to roll back in my head. Drool. Hunter self. Yes, because it's an awful lot of work that's not really necessary really know the quality of the candidate and where they hang out. Well, here's my point though. If we're at two point, nine percent unemployment rate, what are you get enough job boards or off posting postings or not. That's exactly right. So you're better off investment money into somebody to actually do that work to go out and gauge people slightly well to say nothing of what your real job is. Right. So a lot of times we engage with HR executives, and they're just so happy to have us because they have so much else to do and literally they're rated a good or bad if they hire the right people, but they aren't given enough time to do it. So you know, as being a recruiter for so many years, it takes a lot of time. It takes at least a week just to figure it out. One hundred percent that's forty hours. So when are they change the spec? How well that. Oh, yeah. Well, that that never happens. Another joke. That's an inside joke. Ninety percent of the time, so. True? Yeah. So it's so it's a problem because they're tasked with the job, they really don't have time to do, and they know that they're being rated on that. So did you have a partnership like us is something that they really look forward to? Because not only do we look for what they need, but we keep them in our minds at all times because there are clients. So they like that relationship. They like us digging deep and like, so he's having candidates ready at the helm when we know what they're looking for. So so finding people and finding out where to find them from is a mystery into all of itself. But the reality is taking successful, proven track, record people in your organization that have really succeeded is really the best way to back scale that wall and also use utilize your referral network. I mean, every person you have, it's working for the company that's should have two to three other people. And here's the thing. It's really important to look outside of the actual skills and look for transferable skills LES because now in this market, that's how you're going to get. The right person. Absolutely. And there's a lot of people that are in your organization that are in their butts are in the wrong seat. Exactly. Circuit him in the right side seat or replace him. Yeah. Bringing people in from the outside to do that is what is no more normal these days than it used to be as you do? I've been doing this for thirty six years. So back in the days when there weren't any computers is when I started by ten years, is that everything iron. Actually, I had like a windows ninety five. Four years. Oh my gosh. I remember when art receptions was the only one in our company that had a computer who is crazy, but technology has advanced a lot of things, but it's also made some recruiters very lazy. And so what happens is they post ads think they're going to get the higher and it doesn't work. So that's the challenge where we missing the Mark. We are missing the Mark on the candidate process and flow in my opinion. So most of my companies, I would say, ninety percent to not have a structure in place that I think is going to help them get through this tight marketplace. So what I mean by that is again, the running the ads, you know, on boarding people, I went to visit a company credit union company very large, and they were not on boarding. There are people in the right manner. They probably onboard ten people a month. They went to fifty a week and the way they did that was by not doing skill assessments before the interviewed the candidate. So it was a really quick fix, but it was something that they couldn't see from the outside from the inside. They need to see it from the outside. So the product was creates a lot of management problems that process that you do. You had hard and manage easy and innovate, be innovative. Don't stick with old processes. Like if you say, why are you doing this? And they say, 'cause we've always done it. You know, you're in the wrong place, right? So you have to figure that out and you have to help manage through that. So a lot of times this VP of HR or this hiring manager doesn't have the authority to change process. It's goes gotta go to the CEO. So this is what had to happen. It took him two months to get that approved, and now they're hang fifty a week to mazing so so that's a good thing. They're making good hires Perry. Yeah, very good thing because now they're making great hires. So they just changed one of their processes to make sure that they were doing the best they could for their company. We'll skills assessments in my opinion or are okay, but you don't wanna miss base your decision on that is correct. I agree with that bid own also assess transferable skills. That's where you have to start thinking about who this person isn't what it's about. That's right. All right. So if you're just joining us on the live stream or the podcast, you're listening to the higher power radio show. I'm your host, Rick, Gerard. And today our guest is Cathy Dawson and the CEO. Oh, of Dawson, and Dawson ink, and all right. Man. We're talking about the current hiring landscape and where companies are missing the Mark, and now we're going to talk about how we can take advantage of this disparity dramatically improve your hiring process. So if you're missing the Mark and people are turned down your offers in your surprise. I did the home alone together ready. Absolutely. I see that a lot, unfortunately. No, right. Then you really need to start with your mindset. I always go back to one of my favorite episodes of Seinfeld was George Costanza did everything the opposite of what he would normally do and then things started working out for them. I, if you've got a hiring process that isn't working, people are turning down, do the opposite of what you're doing right? I mean, it sounds silly, but he's going to work much better than what you're doing. It's definitely better than what you're doing, but there's probably a better way than that. Right. So changing it up his definitely the message there. I think changing the mindset needs to start there. Yeah, it's not about you. This whole pro hiring landscape in here. People complain about millennials and people want purpose and not. You know, it's it's more than just the money these days. So more about creating something that's going to benefit that person you're trying to hire. And if you can't connect the dots on those two things, you're gonna lose a higher every time. Absolutely. Because you can't. Can't. If you're smaller company, you can't be Damas on, right? You can't beat the big boys who had big wallets. It's just not gonna happen. You're not going to be pimco. How's that? Google? That's my big problem. Gobble Google levels every okay. I love coming up against Google. I've beat them quite a few times with them. I will teach you my. I know how to be Google. Eleven. Got him. Got your girl. That's right. But anything information that okay. Let's talk about really what this is about and it's really not about you. It's about positioning yourself in your company for that person. You're not that special as a company, not at all. So it's flip the script. We just said app it, let's let's flip the script on how we approach candidates. Why not take it from the perspective of we've got a person. Let's try and find out what's going to motivate this person before we start presenting things to them. Exactly. Yeah. So the psychology of recruiting is fascinating to me. I think that's why I'm still in the business for so long is because each recruit is so uniquely different and where they come from his different. So the way someone was raised the way that they've been treated along their path, whatever path that is makes a huge difference on how they respond to anybody that they exchange with day in and day out. I don't care if it's at the grocery store or if it's about a job. Right? And so you sit there and you look at, okay, I must make this person be accountable to me excited about this job. And really engaged. So what is it that motivates them? So often when I'm interviewing somebody else, say, what motivates you? I asked the question very directly and they'll tell me all kinds of business things, but really it's not about business, I think you mentioned that earlier about who they are. And so once I find out how bad their mother or their father treated them and how bad their last boss was and or the experiences they've had that have turned out to be negative or positive for them. I can then figure out what they need to be successful where they're at if they're high maintenance, low maintenance, if they are big contributor, lower contributor, maybe their research analysts. Maybe there are salesperson these factors that make them who they are today really make a difference of their success. We're going back to their current job. You need to find out what what's wrong in their current job, why they wanna leave with. Absolutely. And some of don't know they want to leave. That's no some massive candidate. Canada's don't know. They wanna leave until you have the conversation with them and then you start opening that wound. That's right. And and so that should be your goal of how you engage people is find out if there's an actual wound in what I find is there's three areas where most people are dissatisfied in their current roles, the growth, there's no growth potential. The content of the work or leadership. There's offshoots have things around there, but you can pretty much guess that one of those three are gonna come up, and then all you have to do is really explore it in as one of my old mentors. Peter left her wits us to say as soon as you open that wound, just stick your finger, open it up, even more. Yeah. See how you'll know not necessarily that, but just how deep that wound is l. i. saints at a scratch, or is it really a wound? Is it something that needs to be healed or are they okay with that? I was thinking you'd get him to leave quicker by reminding them of the things that they're not getting where they're at. You can't. I mean, yes, dot happenings. That's a result of that. That's what I see. I see that as being a really good technique. So it's just a. Once you gather that information now you know how to position your company that you know how to position a role, you connect those dots between what you offer and what they need to heal and boom. That's how big a go. There you go. That's the secret secret sauce. Weezer sold you a million dollars. Let's see. I've got thirty six. You got twenty six. So it's a lot of years. I don't advertise twenty six. Okay. You've got sixteen Zeca I'm twenty six. Let's just. All right. This boils back down here engagement in this is the point that you brought up earlier. So let's talk about how you feel that it's best to engage. I think one case find out if they're motivates make a change, which is what you just identified and dealt with. Then what you do is you find out what their motivators are and if this new company that you're recruiting for does have that to offer. You know, I'm sure you've done many searches where you've said, you know your great candidate, but you're not right for this client. Don't you just keep them close and if something else comes along and or in some cases, if they're really good, I tell my kinds that would need that kind of person that they even exist because you don't know. They exist either. I look further vision or whatever they desire, right? Yeah. And a lot of times if you present job tumor company to them, they're going to tailor that toward the opportunity because they always want what you don't have. Hey, yeah. And once you get not so good. Some cases, but if they give you accurate information up front before you present your opportunity to the job, then it becomes a fit right well, and you don't want them to be selling you. He want them to be telling you the truth. No, I want them to be selling me. Well, I don't want to sound me something that I don't. That's not going to be reality late. Them. I'm this. I'm debt for that client. You know, I've done that. I've done that one hundred mentality in salesperson versus a gatherer. Desperate housewife and tell us. Wait a minute, doesn't my friends. I know they're okay. I promise. Desperate housewife. Well, let's just say, I, I know a lot of that also I hadn't slept. There'd be on. I was thinking about the show that was on not the house dot com. Okay. Sure. I don't. I don't know the difference quite regularly. Okay. Well, that's smart. On your part, you do more work on recruiting. Then I have useless TV that entertains me because I have too much heady stuff during the day. I like to just relax have your daughter. So that's. I haven't watched TV and probably sayers. Flood of Disney films. I'm sure you do. Much fun here. Just a, you know, a great guy. So how do we get these candidate engaged? That's where we're at. So what you do is you follow a process. That's what we do, and we recommend that our clients do this as well. So the process that you know you map out what's best for you, you have it. You check it. You make sure that your team of recruiters that are working with you or doing that as well. And you bring them all together. And as you're managing the actual contact, not emails because we text me Email. We do all kinds of ways of communicating these days. Right? But what is the old fashioned and best way always the phone in person or in-person succinctly. Right? And it doesn't happen that often as most of our people will be able to tell so. All right. I believe in picking up that. A phone. That's true. And that's what everybody else did. Right? They're doing mass emails to two hundred people. Hoping somebody responds. Well, that's not going to engage that that that is the start of a transactional approach. That's right. Am that's what's going to end in. That's exactly right. So we do the opposite and we recommend our clients to the opposite in that is day, have a personal touch with that with that person on ongoing basis. And once I've identified that that candidate is a qualified candidate for their company, then they get a hiring person, higher above them a level. So you have a junior recruiter, usually on boarding and trying to get candidates in this is what you're recommending. Remind clients yet. My gardens do this based on a recommendation or chrome. So then they have the second person that comes in who's more like a junior, you and I, and that they're still quite capable and they give them the, oh, you've gotten this far. We're so excited and let me throw spoke to ghetto her. I turn for some reason. So what if you're a small company, let's say you're like a four or five person company or trying to build what's going to be the best way for. Them to approach it will they'll have to do it themselves. Of course. Let's let's back Home Depot right now. Okay, excellent yourself. Exactly. So basically you're in touch with that person in the beginning and you've qualify whether or not there, right? You already know what you're looking for you have. I usually have a five to ten page sort of box checking, sort of process, and it's like, do they have this? Do they have that? Do they have the old school? I know it is old school school. You're doing the same thing, but I'm fighting it every step away. Okay. I have a feeling featuring. Snow working, but I'm finding so anyway, you go through the basics and you make sure they're at least qualified. Then they go to a second level or that person takes the call again and says, all right, you've now made it to the next level. We'd like to see you in person and you make it like they've achieved something all along the way. Yes. And so what's happening everywhere else is the mass Email and they're simply saying, come in if you're interested, if you're not, we don't really care about you, and that's the tone of their voice. If they do make a phone call, usually it's an Email, right? And so then they come in. So here we are small, five person. They come in, you meet the person. I, you have them thought an application of some sort something that gives you a commitment from their part. Because again, you're psychologically moving him down to the row Lawrence anyway, do. But if they're small, they may not. They should don't mostly. But it's a good point. You wanna meet me at the Calcutta. Starbucks. That's always gonna, say the Starbucks on MacArthur. That's the popular play is we see everybody there. I know. Well, anyway, so you do that. You have them do something, you know that they have to work for, then you bring them in. And then once you meet with them, if you think they're qualified, then you, you're not the only person interviewing you have a group of people interview them, so you should always have group ever be one person because because you're getting biased information act eliminated by us. Right? And we all hire based on our past, we want to hire people that we hire. Hire you in a heartbeat because I like you. What if you don't do the job. The worst ever made. Yeah. Well, the point is, is that you do want a collaborative approach because you may miss something and then I never hire the first time they come. I always make them come back again. Even if they've met everybody that they were supposed to meet unless there's a flight involved or something like portent you're talking about, you have a process in place and it needs to be regimented and stuck to and religiously just driven home. Yes. And all your people in that are in the interview process need to be on board with it and be part of it in own it. Yes. And we have like in this criteria, you called old school. Basically if they don't, if done at eight out of ten, if there's ten, there's not eight out of ten. They don't get to the next level and it doesn't matter what high school or college or where where, what football team they like, doesn't know that matters. What matters is, what are they qualified to do in this job in this company and seventy five percent of the hiring decision in my opinion is based on culture, so you're checking Holzer here you're saying. I like to say, do the elevator test. What I mean by that notes, better test. If the get stuck and I'm with this candidate, am I going to be okay because if you don't want to be an elevator stuck for awhile with somebody don't hire him. Okay. Because the reality is you're going to have to deal with them day in day out. And if they don't communicate like you, they panic in a situation. They starting nervous or maybe they don't really care about it at all. They're very kickback. You know, surfer dude, kinda guy gal, then that's a different thing to you'll know if they're in the elevator and it gets stuck if you wanna have them on your team. And I use that quite a bit because it's a real simple sort of test, you know, eating a meal with them as kind of anything to do too, especially at higher level. You know how that goes. When you eat a meal, sometimes you, we've mailed together making bread. I was very impressed by your behavior there. I didn't see. I'm Tommy Raymond, it's that daughter you're trying to prove her? No, I'm trying to. I'm trying to ruin her. I want her to be completed attractive to males. Males. Gonna happen. Twenty eight and I gotta tell you every day challenge and it's so much fun to see them grow like that. The son who's thirty and oh my gosh, great, great staff, but they're millennial. So I've got my first hand experience of them. I love millennials. I. Millennial. I'm trying to identify with everything that I'm not. We're just about out of time for this week's episode of higher power, Cathy, thanks so much for your time investment today, and and I want to welcome you to the higher power radio community. Now, I'm sure that some of our listeners are going to want to use your services how they reach you. Yeah, everybody there so the richer, our website, of course, Dawson Dawson Inc dot com. D. a. w. s. o. n. with nothing in between the AWS o. n. i. NC. So WWW dot Dawson, Dawson Inc dot com. All right. Perfect. All right, I want to think are loosening audience for tuning into this week's episode of higher power. Quick, thanks to our team or engineer. Paul Roberts our producers, Andrew Ballen and Sean t rile. If you're listening to podcast, please subscribe rate and be review. We need your input and feedback to make amazing content for you. So please. Now we dance well, we're definitely admitted. Wow, that's like premature damn. Well, I was thinking maybe that was happening, but I was. You can join the higher power, any community at higher that's h. i. r. e. power POW ER, radio dot com. And you can find us on itunes, iheart, Stitcher tune in Spotify and YouTube under higher power. Radio follow me on Instagram at Rick Girard. One tune in next week. Our guest is going to be author and keynote speaker rocky Roman Ella. He's the founder and senior partner of three sixteen management services. LLC. I'm your host, rich, Gerard, and you have been listening to the higher power radio show a lot. Thank you for listening to higher power with Rick Girard on, oh, talk radio.