E9: Crossover Hits
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It just hasn't happened to us yet and on today's show we're discussing current affairs as usual and news as usual from the literary fiction world. And we're going to talk about crossover genres as well as our current reads. It has also come to my attention that a few episodes ago on the episode of literary fiction versus Genre Fiction. I came in pretty hot and came off pretty elitist about literary fiction It also seems like I clarify enough that my opinion is of course super subjective and just because I prefer one over another does not make it better or worse so I wanted to ensure that To do that here at the top of the episode and as a gesture of goodwill and hopefully to kind of undo that error this episodes topic will be crossover hits so to speak meaning. We're going to name. Some of our favorite literary genres literary genre are also other genres like. Why a romances her. And what else leave. I think we throw in a couple of Brandon's right. Just keep everyone on their toes. Yup elect that okay but before we get into that. Let's hear from one of our sponsors. This episode is sponsored by Flatiron. Books publisher of the Paris hours by Alex which one day in the city of light one night in search of Las Tiene Paris between the wars teens with artists writers musicians a glittering crucible of use but amidst the DASA and creativity of the city's most famous citizens full regular people reach searching for something they've lost told over the course of a single day in nineteen twenty seven. The parasol takes full ordinary. People who stories when told together are extraordinarily is the glorious city inhabits and that's the Paris House by Alex George. Alright so let's open. It was some news and current affairs. And I think defense when we wanted to talk about was An article on how authors find the characters. Speak and this is when you came across right Mary. Kay Yes so I found this one actually this morning and I think book right posted it independently of me finding it as well. So that makes that makes me feel good. That I have good taste is probably pretty solid But I thought it was interesting because The study from the Guardian says that sixty three percent of authors say they hear their characters speak while riding with sixty one percent reporting characters were capable of acting independently which and that's a quote directly from the From the article So I as a writer Find it that the characters will act independently. Yeah I that From being on the show I mean I definitely do here. My characters voices in my head and I'm wondering if because I'm right Mostly historical or non historical non fiction or nonfiction. It's not historical like their actual people. So I went in part of with this article says to is like. You're basically if you're if you're creating a character you're you're just you're creating the persona of a person that lives in your head which is. Pretty Normal Lake. I mean I don't know about you but I'll I'll put on an outfit and here my mother's voice in my head being like you need to put some color on your just here. I predict her reactions. And I think if you are if you have a really in depth character which hopefully you do You should be able to to kind of hear their reactions as well. But that just seems like odd. They're independent yeah. It's quite traditional I did you hear in creative. Writing Teaching in office talking about their stuff that they do have these characters meeting independently. I know the big one for me with the research. Doing his people are any blatant and things like that. Who Say oh they are almost like telling the story on behalf of the characters and they really are just kind of like a conduit for it. Yeah I totally buy that. And I know that on my part like my first book is about America's first female serial killer so in her voice came into my head. That was pretty disturbing for me off. A lot of the book is written from the perspective of other characters because that first of all is just like more authentic. She didn't have much of a voice in that in that time period but also because it a depending on your characters right like you don't want them in your head. I can imagine note with serial killers. Ooh She was. Yeah Act yeah and then just to kind of pack on like her leg not back on. Blake support what I was trying to say. One of the quotes from this article says that Internal Dialogue or inner speech is a phenomenon that people experience in many different ways with some people including the voices of people they know as part of their verbal thinking and I think that part of that is How impressionable you are. Or maybe even a part of empathy. I'm not I don't know the reasons why that's just like what the article say that. That's just me adding and then The article goes on to say whether or not. We're always aware that most of us are trying to anticipate what other people are going to say and do and in everyday interactions and for some of these writers. It might be the case that after a while their character start to feel independent because the writers develop the same kinds of personality models. They develop for real people and these were generating the same kinds of predictions. So that makes it sound a little bit less like a disorder and a little more of like you did your due diligence with creating these characters but I just thought that that was. The article is super interesting. Because I read the title and I was like. Oh my gosh. That's horrifying then. I read it and I was like no. This is re regular like I have this all the time so I don't know it's it's interesting because it's kind of trying to understand creativity and innovative particular kind of books in almost find the patterns that make these stories and these narratives happen But I think as well as about Putin's actually and that we are human we understand our conversation words we look for Hello and then you know you reply with. Oh Great Hello how are you? I'm fine thank you? We feel in. We Look City the call and response the thing that finishes off the thing that has been given us so in some senses. I think it's almost filling in those patterns just book by yourself because there's no one else hair when you riot it's like you've got to say the dock and angrily type it the laptop Zone and Yeah well When you said that it made me think of like so you know. I don't know if this has happened to but this happened to me a lot in like middle or high school where as soon as I left a conversation I would think of the perfect thing to say about worth and then it's the worst and then I was like well. That is not going to happen to me again so I would like play the conversation in my head so that next time. I will be ready and I did that. There were still do it but I was an only child so I mean I spent a lot of time with my own imagination. The worst part is when you get the perfect response about six months after the yes. I finally know what to say to this situation. Yeah or you realize like five years later that this person you had a crush on was actually hitting on. You just didn't know it at the time and this stupid like Brazil right you workshop that moment in your head and play it out and sometimes I think that that's how people in general developed the persona that they want to display to the world. You're kind of creating that character like this is how I wanna come across but yourself by buying ages interesting. Yeah sorry we're going on a slight tangent here so just forgive for a moment but What really stuck with me from what you've just said that is. I remember elected I went to and the guy so basically said how many us as in why are you know as a jeep a half? How many use a U A U too? So his point was how many different versions of yourself? Do you present the world on. How many different versions of? I don't know if your name is like Sarah Jones. How many different sirens does the well now? And it's all about. I T that you present and you show the versions of yourself to to someone I think. Oh totally I agree with that and we we kind of talked about that on our episode about literary nonfiction. Yeah so but I think I mean not only. I might have been checked. I can't remember now who said The the dullest actual person is more interesting than the most interesting character. So to think that you're writing about or yourself or you know creating a character. It's still only a fraction of what you would know of another person so we need to do what we can. I mean probably or or we'll just end up like thinking about it took about six months later we will have to do a follow up and just go. We figured it right. That's how long we need to workshop the conversation so I'm go and talk about your Your find of news all right. Yeah so The Comedy Women in Print Prize. Twenty twenty long list is out and this is funny. Women writing funny things. And it's a brilliant longlist. It features published an unpublished comic fiction. Graphic novels by women writers and I will include the link in the show notes courts deemed the of the long list for me were Queenie by Countess Kathy Williams. Which is it's one of those books that go on labeled as as a fleabag similar title which Kinda thanked love it. Yeah I mean I. I was a bit in Mississippi. Lee Back Really. Hit home for me so I kind of won't okay. These books to be understood in their own right but but Queenie's brilliant So I think post breakup life in London Took mental health to real world on sexual rights movements me tailgate. And he's really funny and small so it has a similar content. Yeah I think it's just young women. Living Messy honest lives. Well I can write solidarity of US Army many sensation. That's not many ways for people to understand not without popping the fleabag label that. Yeah and I think also people who publicize are like. Here's another popular thing. Where if you liked it. You'll probably like this well. Yeah it's it's the shorthand so go for Queen I think is is brilliant but has no. I've recommended Comex on head before because I think I really x-men ru intelligently fiction and Valiente valid form true fiction and everyone writes So I'M GONNA pick sensible footwear a girl's guide which is a graphic goto lesbian queer history between nineteen fifty twenty twenty by Kate. Charlesworth so good. It's a mammoth task to try and encapsulate that amount of history in Helmick and she does so brilliantly and so beautifully and so Kindly I think I really want more kindness in The stuff I read you know like where people realize that the mistakes they make mistakes all made I'll just part of being human innocence. So yeah since footwear. I recommend it so I love this title. It I I. I have a question because I have not read this but definitely want to and I'm just trying to into manage my expectations. I suppose Does it how. How much does the footwear play into it? Like an ethnography of shoes nine. It's like It's a pun in some senses. That the playing on. I don't know if the Expression translates into over America. But there's an idea that if you will comfy shoes You had a particular sexuality so I think he's playing on that and messing around with that and just saying actually. This is the history of the people that stand behind such a try and inappropriate expression and he has the story of what they had so it took on its UK history to Sakarov searches on things like the Section twenty-eight thing which hit my education I was never taught about Lesbian Queer history in any sense whatsoever because it was Illegal so it's remarkable to think how far we've come and yet how far we still have to go in many senses and yes yeah. Kate Chelsea just kind of encompasses all about in such a strong powerful brilliant and incredibly funny manner that. It's a book that I would give to you in Hopi. Okay I mean that does not deter me from wanting to read it even a little. I was just trying to conceptualize it in my head. Also I think that does transfer but it might that That phrase dose transfer but it might be a little bit less on the nose here because I was like I get that. It's a joke like a kind of I mean in this context but yeah thank you for clarifying for we. Also seventy years is such a long time. It's amazing amazing. Yeah you kind of think. Wow you've you've done this and even that even if you done it poorly to still do. It is a massive achievement in its own right but to deliver a book that is as good as their s and as truthful and as beautiful as this it. It's a great thing I'm excited for it excellent So are those to the ones that you hope when yeah I go but I think anything on the long list Israeli right. That's what that by some brilliant women writers and you know anywhere on there. You would not go wrong. We will as I say. Include the length. But we'll also give you the league t the twitter you can follow them and gain some more background information on the tiles and the rice and hopefully Gives a bit more open? Open world excited for that. Cool Fabio Alright. Shall we pull from it from us? Bonuses Oh yes up today show sponsored by Libro. Fm Lebron Feminazi. Pensions audiobooks directly from your favorite local indie bookstore at the same price as audible firmly membership. You can pick from over a hundred and fifty thousand audiobooks including New York Times bestsellers and some of the hottest new audiobook releases like such a fun age by Kylie read untamed by Glenn. Doyle wow no thank you. By Samantha Abbey and the Glass Hotel by Emily Sin John Mandell listeners of navel-gazing I says can get three of audio but membership for the price of one month that's Lieber Dot. Fm and then the code be our three. That's a capital b. a capital and then the number three to get three months of audiobooks for the price of one. So let's talk about some crossover hits It came to my attention. Was listing my favorite. Why books to talk to Louise about that. Well they're not why and that might be the reason why I don't mean like. I have no informed opinion about this because I didn't really understand what qualified a book as being part of that genre. So Lewis will you please define what a young adult genre book is all right. Yeah I felt really bad because I was just kind of going out all of that. Snow Young show glad you did because I mean how else would I learn well? Nobody told me so to fasting as that young out isn't a genre. It's a collection of books that came around essentially in a post World War. Two context if you think that teenagers clearly existed before this but they weren't ever quite understood in this way that we understood them after the war and a lot of this comes from the EU radicalism of Post World War Two publishing especially for Children Anfield. People were thinking that children were the people that are going to get them out of these problems. There were two old walls. Everything had gone wrong. the weld had been V. shaped and vastly imparted over several years Children it's it's a hackneyed phrase but children were the future The books that they were given by the adults that and we've only publishing and they were particularly intended to be a radical to move them towards a place where they could make the choices and to not repeat that which had come before. So then coming into the seventies and the eighties when all those kids who'd grown up in the postwar contacts who'd read those books we'd had things like Elvis rock and roll the Beatles the idea of a youth culture being really formed and then in the eighties. These people were kind of adults working in publishing and making the next generation step so to speak in able to find a young adult Kaman and this is where most of the big big initial book starts make themselves nine people at Robert Columbia. Judy blume So late eighties nineties Paula ago. People like that. These are stories that were concerned with young adult characters. Doing young adult things so not necessarily like a a child or an adult. It's not space in between right. Okay see listeners. Y'All are going to see real quick that I didn't know that the books that I listed are none of them qualify for that definition also I just referred to it as a genre and you real quick to be like no so yeah. Thank you for that. That's a common thing though. People can read young adults genre and say okay. It is Asia owner of books. And it's like well no it's no it's it's a type of fiction that can be represented in science fiction Historical any type of joyner can be considered as A. YOU'LL NEDAL book providing it has these kind of loose criteria of the usually a juvenile central character that he dealing with teenage you'll not concerns and they are recognizably different from children on from adults that are saying that messy in between right right so like the ones that I listed y'all were to kill a mocking bird. Not Why because she's a child in. It takes place in the thirties so immediately out. No for that sense In you know in one sense you could say that Karabakh Bird is young adult novel. But it's not because it's written from the adult perspective got so she looks back onto her childhood and reflects upon that so the young adult novel it clearly existed in some sense before we started referring to it. As the you know yes okay but I'm okay with Toco MOCKINGBIRD. It's because SCAR. Hamon reading of it so she is an adult she's reflecting and retelling the story and there is a really interesting article on book. Ride that will pop into the link as well into the links as well that talks specifically about whether to kill a mockingbird can be young and I think you how silk yeah I think asset and you'll know resonance for sure so I can see why you pull it in both technically. I would probably step back from saying it is a young adult novel because I I I just think it is okay I'll buy that. I have no frame of reference so it can be a good book and still not fit into that category. I forgot about Judy. Blume JACOB LAMB. God Love Judy Blume. She is legendary even life in many of my generation particularly from British school days. We were very confused with how the sandwich towels in the period thing worked night they will sanitary belts and we were like what is the what. How does that work right? It is man just for so long. They just acknowledge that that was a problem that needed a saw. A thing like Judy. Blume is revolutionary in Hawaii featuring the sort of thing in her books like the Victorians or something children just kind of magically shifted from about six years old to about nineteen and getting married and there was no in between right. You were a child and then you're a mom did not sit right pretty much. Look forward to that guy right right Okay so the others. I'm just GONNA go ahead and get these out of the way that's all right home and these are are accurately. Why a Phantom Tollbooth Nope? Mets child's fantasy all roll doll. I put an uncle remus but I don't think those are either. I think those are a totally different amazing problematic oral history and then I put in the wizard of is in. That's also not that's child child children's and fantasy right. Yeah so resell that led me to maybe the the conclusion that maybe I just did not have a young adulthood lake. It seems like I have no authority at all because I wasn't even aware of what why entailed I think in some sense we can solve. Say that this is also to read as he might have had But the readers that might have had a similar journey and that it's never too late to star reading these books. Because you have you know I am still working out the world massively and I'm like injured and to These books still have an immense cultural resonance and if you a one thing places to star we can provide those on my picks would be. I capture the castle by Dodie Smith who was the author of the Dalmatians and I capture the castle. It's possibly the most perfect young adult novel. You might read in some senses in that. It has an eccentric family. She the opening line is I write this sitting in the kitchen sink at it so beautifully an so vividly romantic an unreal. Strange that if you happen being towards these books before and if you're not sure where to begin then I capture the castle by Dodie. Smith is a perfect place to stop. Okay noted added to list. Let's read it. I would be very happy. Just everyone just reads. I capture the castle flight. The NEXT SIX WEEKS. I'll make my day okay. Great all right look club. I was thinking of as well was Some of their oath is the are Brillian and give you crazy. Wild big stories that kind of find the the edge of the universe and find the last city in it and push it open for you and say you can be part of this world so there the book that I would recommend again as as doing something like this as a book called life and exploded diagram and his by mail P who's now passed away but the books he wrote before this were stoning. They are almost own unclassifiable yet. Stay tell you everything about the world and what you can be within it and sir life exploded. Diagram is at one sense. It's loose story but one sense it's a history lesson and it's so strange and so big. It's it's it's a brilliant piece of writing. Sounds good integrate title? Yeah it's it's really great Do you think all right so I wanted to pick a couple of examples of authors from across the time period so coppola like a historical war and I wanted to pick someone really recent and present an is an article Juno Dawson who is a UK. You'll have writer a fierce talent. And she shifts across genre. She's done stuff Like a contemporary point. Horror type vied through to Mago and me which is a book about a relationship between a girl and her grandmother and her finding I actually. What's going on with her grandmother and why she is what she is And Junior Dawson is so skilled at hopping between these stories and yet telling the truth about teenage life in. It is complicated. But you are not alone in experiencing this you are with friends with people and the choices that you make are totally valid and you have the right to make them. She has a lovely I Youthful Life God Bossa sale agent youthful life. So if you can cut with like a grammy telling you this I really recommend. Yeah Junior Dawson's my final also big. Pick any of her work. But particularly I think Margaret Mead is one of the best. Okay I thought of one her. Okay so When I was why did. An AmeriCorps program tutoring kids who had mental illness and What that meant for me. I have a point until all this. I promise What that meant for me is like the kids who are like fourteen to eighteen. So young adults Just didn't trust adults because they didn't have any who are reliable in their lives and so I was supposed to tutor them in literacy so I brought in the outsiders by Esi Hinton and I said it down on the table and and I just thought of another one too that I read with them and I was trying to get this one kid to read it. And he's not into it and another kid of the older ones came by and he goes. Oh the outsiders this book go hard it was so resonant you know with them because it is. It's it's has to do with gangs. I mean granted like this is in the fifty so they look different than they do now but it was just like that quick endorsement of like a an older young adult made the kid. I was trying to read with. Yes okay. Let's do it so I thought about that one and then on a similar note because I'm wondering like maybe I didn't have a young adulthood and that's why I don't identify with that John in the past haven't in the past But would you tell holes who I would probably say? It's open children's but then again that's really like it. 'cause I work in the in the in the industry and it's a really picky thing and I do think at some point you have to kind of all right. Who is this book talking to? And who is this book resonating with but yeah? I'd probably say your new Godot. It's it's kind of because okay so I allow it okay. I was thinking like a as as it was recalling it. I was like what I think. I read that with a thirteen year old. So I'm not sure don't count. Yeah I mean I read it on my own as well but I didn't remember it as well as when I was reading it with him because Kind of looking back on it. I could hit. That novel is so tight. It's just comes back in Same with the outsiders is just. It's they're both very well done. And I think that they're both quote unquote literary as we loosely defined it in zero two And and I'm not saying that the ones that you picked weren't of course I just haven't read those and of course I trust your judgment over especially over mind but yeah I have some have some holes in my knowledge of course Oh and I just wanted to tell. Y'All listeners that I probably need the read harder challenge a lot more than I thought and By the way I've been using this spreadsheet the amazing tears I made which will link to which is kind of a reading log but it also tells you like what where you've been reading at like if you've been reading mostly Female or male or nine authors like. It's just a really cool way of seeing what basically what your comfort zone is and There's another toggle that goes to the heart harder or challenge that when I started this spreadsheet I was like well. I'm going to do this to just to see how you know if I am reading as diversely as I thought and I have completed eight out of the twenty four of the challenges which is of never been good at eight times table. That's a third rate propulsion. So I'm a little behind but I also have it Intentionally yet gone in and been like Fannie read from this thing but I mean the list is really cool and it's Specific in a way that I wouldn't think to look for is out of Asthma Comfort on so the school Okay should we move into a different eight crossover hit sub-genre? I don't even know how to say what I'm trying to say. Help me. Are Roy MOMS? Let's go to Roy okay. All right so you WanNa start or you want me to. I can take site. Yeah on Ooh where do you begin with because I think send me it begins in Two words and Eva Ibbotson. Can she is an offer. Didn't really from what I've been told and I've talked with. People has never really fully translated over to the. Us market as much as she did here. She was a Jewish family was Jewish and they moved over to the UK in the forties due to Obviously if the rise of Nazism and she attended a very avant-garde school I actually went to university At later so it was really look connection and she grew up to write these incredibly rich stories of eccentric artistic creative unusual people falling in love with each other even though one of them both at the might not be aware of that happening and she has bones and learn. She has t houses eccentric aunts An every inch of is suffused with heritage her Jewish heritage and also her rich Eisen detail. There's a lawyer in one of them that I will never forget. And she talks about how you won't character scratches the air of adult and she scratches him just in the precise part where a large dog keeps his soul and I just thought so beautiful to find that moment and she say right. It's just behind the air a big dog that you can just go. This is it. This is where you are precisely perfectly perfectly made so yeah Okay so I have a question that I probably should have asked earlier. But how do you define if something is a romance? Oh I thank you just run onto Kellerman you can have the straight of mills and Boon type romance where you know very much where when you pick it up. What you're getting into right where it's packaged innocent and monarch perhaps part of a series popsicles. So it's an rules about it. I know the Mills Boone. Books are very specifically designed and structured and have certain elements of out that has been asserted Amana Interesting yes so you can have kind of straight Piero Raymond but equally romances. Such on the part of human life is an end. It's everywhere so I love it when you find in places that you do expect so for me. The other book that I wanted to shout for this moment was a book called a Little Love Song by Michelle mcgann. It's technically you had And you should look for the UK version if you count it was republished in the US in a slightly different form cold not a swan and has an extra weird plot element twist just doesn't work. So that one's a double crossover hit. Yeah I Yeah so little of Song. It's the book that I read when I need my heart making whole essentially you know when you are broke and depressed and everything is awful. I I pick this book so it's a good one for right now bob actually. Yeah so once he finished doing. I capture the castle. Everyone would do a little love song and then just hit me up on twitter and we can talk about it until the cows come hype very happy. Wonderful your sounds so wholesome compared to the ones that we shared. Embraces contrasts. Okay so one that I wanted or one author that I felt. I didn't put it on the list but of course I don't know how I missed her but an iceman who is like She's amazing Yeah I like like the correspondences between her and Henry Miller I think best but I loved Rosalind Miles. Is Gwen Aveer trilogy? When I was in high school because it really tells the story of King Arthur early you know the whole yeah mythology which was obsessed with at the time and It does so where love and lust and attraction is really the motivations behind Behind all of it and I liked as well that it Acknowledged that there was something going on with Lancelot for Arthur Which is I like revisionist wise pretty apparent but at the time it would have been like an Easter Egg. Very few new than you knew. But it wasn't so I loved those Also I love and rice. They she is. I mean. I'm Hara person but totally tell that she's a romance writer. Even though she is most famous for her vampire series and that beauty series We re another retelling of the fairy tale of sleeping beauty. Our guys kind of genius honestly gets pretty doubt so I've never really grown on. Rice also suggest a good place to start I think it depends because it definitely even when she's Writing Romance of the Limited Cross section that I've read it definitely still has the element of horror in it. That is not really your jam. Maybe no but if it is maybe yes or or just you know give it a go and then if this is what I do with books where I'm on the fence like I didn't really like it but I know would like I give it to them so that's always a way to do it and you can support your booksellers at this precarious economic time as well thinking about buying any of these books. Go ahead on and do it. Y'All we are pro. Gotcha so so. Yuga the last join that we wanted to talk about. What Torah right? Yeah I know this is your specialty area. So do you want to hear is all sure? So I kind of defined her as loosely as I define literary meaning that one of its objectives. One of the main objectives is to scare you. So that's just I mean that's a very loose and of course anyone can have his own opinion about it so it's fine but for like with the beauty series with Anne Rice. It's definitely has the romantic element and it is supposed to make you a little uncomfortable. I think Ari so maybe. You're not like outright scare you where you need to put the book in the freezer when you go to bed but it should like you know. Make you a little bit spooked afterwards. So The the scariest book that I've ever read. I definitely would consider a literature. It's called the true confessions of a justified sinner by James. Hogg and I thought that it was going to be super dry because I think I read it in century literature and he's Scottish seventeenth century. I'm thinking off. Yes I'm a thousand and one we're all about sharing yeah So he he He's in Scotland in the seventeen. Hundreds actually not a seventeenth century. My bad so this is during a calvin EST protestantism in which Predestination really big factor. But there's a group of Of that denomination that believes you can tell or rather Reverend can tell you whether or not you are predestined to go to heaven and if you are I mean do whatever you want right. Because you're in so which I don't think is the message of the book but I do think it is a caution against that mentality especially for that time period because this is not spoiling anything happens in the first. I twenty pages of this book one. One of the teenagers comes of age and he has like a party and then his the reverend his stepfather decides that he is in the elect which is what they call it and that day after the next day after the party when he is capable of making his own adult decisions. Satan shows up reading the Bible. It's like Oh my God they get so it's so scary but it also has a deeper purpose of lake. Consider what you believe in. I think that's one of the messages that try to get across And I it was not dry at all like I thought it was going to be just because of that time period is is a is a layer of the English language. That is just typically really hard for me to access but it was so compelling so that one. Excuse me and then Geek love by Katherine Dunn Is Amazing. It's about How to paraphrase this listeners? If y'all have read this book you're probably like how she going to do this because so much in it. Essentially a family of sideshow workers decides that they want to have children who all have anomalous bodies so that they can have Basically a means of of earning money built into their existence so I know so. The mother and the mother and father do novelty acts. I think one of them is an acrobat. And the others Maybe a mermaid. I can't remember like it's a thing you can train yourself to do whereas the freakshow as it is called in the book Is a person with an anomalous body so like an extra limb or something that at the time period would not have been thought of medical so much as an omen so the family decides that that's what they're gonNa do and dose themselves with something that May that messes up their DNA so they had this family full of me. I don't WANNA say Disabled. Because they are able and other ways. But it's just it's it's a very complicated and it's told from one of the children's perspectives. So it's just it's real good. It's real good and real scary and it has circus element which is always a little spooky or at least unnerving inspe- antastic truly is and it took me and we were talking about like covers. It took me so long to read that book because the cover of the version that I kept seeing was just not very good like it. Didn't I mean I don't WanNa say not very good because it is of course? We'll design but it didn't depict what was happening in the book on the cover. Okay yeah and I know you're not supposed to judge a book on its cover. But we do we. Do we do but we do all right. So yeah those are my two big horror literary reads and of course beloved but I talk about that in this big given right right it is the best all right so the horror story. I was like I. I knew it was kind of jam. So I'm thinking okay. What can I bring to this? I'm kind of down. The Rue of the psychologically or n-nothing type of stuff love it siren. Yeah so A Children's Book Code Marianne Dreams by Catherine Stole and it's a couple of decades old now and it's about an ill girl who he's bedridden from her illness and as part of that her mom gives us from crayons to quit and the drawings that she makes she starts entering them in her dreams. And IT IS I. It's good it's really incredibly it. An incredibly or nerve an incredibly dog for what it is and when it was so unusual so yeah Marianne Rene's Sequel to the wasn't by any means is good so stay. Quit the first one and freaked out again. Come and tell me all about it because I am still thinking about that book. Yes add to cart. Not While I was on the call immediately afterward I will. Every now I've been like British children's and young out literature throws out these really unusual things that make any sense. They don't any show they don't for any criteria they just kind of also resolutely of themselves and I think Marianne Dreams is one of those books and it's incredibly well done awesome so yeah is it illustrative. Yes so the drawings that she does and the addition. I think it's the same throughout the addition. I had copies drawings. Come in and you could say like what she made on the pay and oh I don't know how anyone when they first radio and I came out ever true anything again. Just No. I'M GONNA get sucked into. I'm not having those crayons. I will stay the patron now because I think let's say la blank pages good so yeah the last one I thought of is its own a similar line which is black Narcissus Magadan. And there's a BBC adaptation of this. I think coming soon. So keep your eyes out for that. 'cause I'm really looking forward to what it is is it's a group of nuns are sent to establish a convent in India in the Himalayas Wa. And it doesn't go well. They're kind of affected by the area. That kind of affected by the things that happen certain of them find their commitment to their religion incredibly challenged and things go to a scary and unusual and complicated place and it's not necessarily Hara in you know ghouls and gremlins jumping out of the darkness at you. But it's more the things that lie in the back of your psyche. Finally making themselves known I cannot wait. Oh God I am so pumped for that. I love the book so it had me at none. I'm ready. Yeah and the film is by Amherst Powell by Powell and pressburger really iconic will will to mid century filmmakers armed the film. I recommend as well if you if you can't get out the book get yourself towards the film. It's beautifully done and eights go a lot in it. Think about Sam. I'm trying to be like as coy as I can. Without telling you ever sure. Yeah you don't want to give much but I think it's it's one of those books that you kind of think you understand it. And then he put it down anything now best so much more and I'm only yeah you just. That's how I was about the movie. The weight like in the grocery store like four days later just staring at the laundry detergent. That Man. It just keeps unfolding. I love it. I can't wait in his black. Narcissus of flour. Yeah Office Florida. It's black nod office but yeah the certain yellow. One plant sought my specialty. Either cool okay so yeah. I'm excited for this. No I We will come back to this kind of area in discussion the future. I think there's still a lot more tiles and a lot more things that we could have mentioned. I think. Yeah if you hit shown that we've missed owners that you'd like to talk about or things for the future that you want us to give you recommendations description on that. His were more than happy. Yeah we can do a deep dive into any of these or if we missed one We Love we love hearing from you all about what you want us to address and all that or just to tell us that you acted or will. I like less when you tell us that you don't but of course but don't want to know because trying to improve you've capture. The castle could spend. Yeah I'm excited for that one to have at least three that manning to my God. Oh so what are you reading now Louise so I recently sold my first book book. Which is which is kind of glorious and I congratulate as part of the I bought myself because I am nothing not brand. I bought myself some vintage picture. Books to celebrate and I picked the model line Treasury by Ludwig Baumann's and so today's if you've been seeing you post about that made me so pay that just so great If you don't know model line is a tiny girl who attends a Convent School in Paris. There are twelve little girls into alliance on the smallest of the mall is Madeline. It's adorable and she takes no grief she. She's just tough. And Small and feisty on the books are beautifully done. They were done by I think literally battlements was a New York reporter reporter for the New Yorker. Okay Yeah So. He's really strong beautiful eye for detail and so in this kind of eccentric story of these two this logo storming her way around Paris you get some classic sights and sounds of the images that she's around so you see like the eiffel tie you see like the. Oh chauncey Liza you see the other and it's just beautiful. Oh that's wonderful. Keep posting about it all right well. I'm so obsessed with them. Say can you tell us about your book on Shaw and it features nuns and burdens and convince and there is a with my work at the moment there really is of in a boarding school story and is out in autumn 2021. Wonderful so excited for you times. Yeah so what are you? What are you reading? Oh okay so I just started reading a manual for cleaning women by Lucia Berlin and it's another collection of short stories and I am really enjoying it so far because I can't remember if I've talked to about to you about it On here but I'm really fascinated with The way people go about jobs that I don't WANNA see their unappreciated. But like if you do them. Well then people don't really notice like cleaning people. Yeah you know So I'm really enjoying that A lot excellent. It's very cool. Yeah obscure and it was recommended on Carmen. Maria Machado's list in. Ah You know. I'm obsessed with her. I just been working my way through that list. Now have somewhere to add to but yeah. I'm really liking of o'clock. We're going to be so busy when we get like the libraries and bookshops. Oh yeah research reporters all right so yeah. I think that's okay. Oh sign this off. I thank you so much for listening. Thank you to our sponsors who make this possible listeners. Don't forget to subscribe to however you like to get your podcast Tell your friends about us and you can We would love if you left us a review because that helps other people find us. Where can they find you at specifically Lewis some find me At my website. Which is did you ever stop to think dot com. And I'm all set out. Shall I found on twitter? And then you're gonNA keep posting about Madeleine. Join me and I'm Mary Kay You can find me on Mary. Kay mcbrayer DOT COM but also on twitter at K. mcbrayer and Instagram at Mary. Kay mcbrayer so thank you again for listening and talk to you soon. I think next summer talking about doorstop basic awesome okay. We'll talk to you soon thanks thanks.