569 National Park Experiences; Northland; San Francisco Day Trips
Talk about a road trip quarter FOX and Matz exploring the borderline the US, and Canada from Atlantic to Pacific often had to look closely to tell which side you were on really. The only indication is that when you go through a town, there's Canadian flags flying onside and American flags flying on the other coming up. He tells us what he found along four thousand miles of the longest national border in the world. There's a lot. You can explore within a couple of hours of San Francisco, Kimberly, vodka shares some of her favorite day trips like the Santa Cruz beach. Boardwalk, it's so essentially California to me with the wooden boardwalk, and the old wooden roller coaster, and Becky Lomax reminds us why America's national parks are always worth another visit it's amazing to see the wildlife to watch wild animals out doing their Wild Thing. Let's get out there in the hour ahead. It's travel with Rick steves. We're heading for the border. Today's travel with Rick steves the Canadian border, whether been political streams recently. It's still the longest peaceful national border in the world. Porter FOX on that the borders, actually, not always. So we see toy dente fi, especially when it runs through lakes and rivers that keep flowing and changing, yet a trip along the border illustrate the Westwood pull of both nations, and what it means to have a good neighbor quarter FOX joined us for a closer look at the Northland in just a bit. We'll also check back with Kimberly, the volume of a hundred things to do in San Francisco before you die. We'll consider some of the great day trips you can enjoy within easy reach of the city. Let's open today's travel with Rick steves, looking at some of the memorable experiences, you can enjoy in America's national parks, writer and photographer. Becky Lomax is the daughter of a national park ranger. She was raised in mount Ranier and Olympic national parks. And now she lives next glacier, national park. She's written a detailed guide to all fifty nine of the USA national parks published by moon, Becky, welcome back. Thank you. You've written a book. It's a seven hundred page guide book covering. The national parks, let's just take a blitz around the country and talked about some of the most unforgettable experiences that you could have. And I'm just going to I've just was paging through your book. I'll just mentioned them and you can describe them for us, and we can kind of put our travel dreams into action here. You talk about watching the ice calve and glacier bay. Correct. Calving called. Yes. These are Tidewater glaciers, glaciers, come down and touch the water. Okay. And then as the glaciers pushing ice down it breaks off. That's the calving. Okay. And then you get these icebergs floating out there, the way to go. See them is via a cruise boat, so you take a cruise take a crew, and then you don't wanna get too close because when I was they made a big point of it. Don't be stupid and get too close with your little boat, because of freakishly big piece of ice can break. Create a little tidal wave. Exactly. You could be in the cold water. Exactly. And you can also there's kayak tours go up to see him and so forth. So. Bay and glacier, bay national. How about the famous one going Yellowstone in watching faithful? That's absolutely wonderful. Now, the old faith is it still faithful? Yeah. It's about ninety minutes. I'm heading in this winter. It's the best time to go. Because in summer, you'll be watching old faithful erupt with, you know, so thousand other people, you gotta wait ninety minutes went, yes. In winter you go in and you might be one of twenty people watching it. Yeah. I just in Iceland, and there's a place called geyser, and it's where the word geyser came from a fun. The guys are there goes every three or four minutes. Okay. And I got a chance to kind of study it and you don't want to blink because if you've waited, you know, if you waited for what eighty nine minutes and you pause or you look around and then more faithful goes, you gotta wait another eighty nine minutes. Right. So I learned at geyser in Iceland, that the water kind of billows up. Yes, and venit blows you look at the wall. And if it starts to build up, it's ready to burp. Yes. There's a little pre-action. That's have you noticed that? Oh, yeah. Faithful. Yeah. And it usually gets the crowd all ramped up with what's happening. It's happening. Kind of backs off a little bit and blows all you hear these laws go all the way round in your book. You talk about wildflowers in death valley that just looks beautiful. When death valley gets the right moisture that's when this will happen. Because people say, a common misperception is desert is just a, a vast nothingness with no Lance fans so much life high much. And when you get those right conditions all the sudden it's instant both hops. Okay. So wildflowers what month is that March, using their yes? You talked also about the longest cave system in the world. Crawling through that at mammoth, cave mammoth cave. Yes. Would do what is tours is a cluster phobic if you are. Right. So, but that, that would be one of the highlights in your bass, I've long dreamt about rafting down the Grand Canyon. And you spend that it's over two hundred miles long a lot of people raft a little bit of it. And then they have a quick exit other people do the whole thing, but that takes a lot of time, usually twenty one days if you do the full trip without a motor on the so you've got the idea to take three weeks to raft the whole thing, or you can boat, the whole thing with a motor. What's the pros and cons of doing it the traditional way without a motor or just motoring through? I would think yet to debate I wanna really raft and just do part of it. If I've only got a week or do I want to do the whole thing quickly with a motor? What are you doing with the motor? Those boats are really big. You'll hit the Rapids differently than you will with your in a small Dory, or a small raft. If you're into the thrills, you'll get much more bang for your buck on. The smaller. Okay. You're more intimate with total the Rapids. Yes. Is it more demanding physically is more dangerous? Is it lesson Joyal that way for some people? If you're, if you're tender foot, you might find it easier to take the motorboat. Exactly, you can still drag your toes in the water and have. Yeah. On you'll still see the beautiful cliffs and everything. One of the most beautiful things. You talk about in your guidebook is the rainforest in the whole river in the Olympic national park. Tell us a little bit about that experience. You know, it's a work of art over there. It really is. If got these ancient trees, beautiful cedars Maples, and they're all just dripping with Maas and ferns all over, and it's not a tropical rainforest, because most reinforcer tropical, this is one of the only temperate rainforest cracked, it looks like someplace where trolls and things should be Lord of the rings like that. And they do a great job of teaching. When you go, there, interpretive in the word all of Maas is a great one, you can go take that interpretive wok. So if you're interested in trees, of course, you wanna see the big ones in California, where would you go for your big tree? Thrills in California. Big tree, thrills would be in the redwoods, and seeing those would be sequoia and kings and the biggest. Three of all is acquire. And that's a very easy visit for anybody. That's basically a road trip, isn't it. Each just have short walks back to the trees. This is travel with Rick steves. We're talking with Becky Lomax. Her book is USA national parks, complete guide to all fifty nine parks, and we're just lifting through some of her favorite parks summer for favorite experiences. And one that I think you can just feel your enthusiasm for perks. When you read this book, hiking, the narrows insight with that looked so cool. Well, you gotta I want to get your feet wet. Yeah, we're boots. Or do you just get all you were tennis shoes? Just get your feet can get a little cut up on the rocks. So you're better off. If you can actually rent, some serious boots, not serious boots, but they're the river shoes made for walking really? And so basically, you're walking right up the water and the cliffs are right here. So the water is below your knees, generally along. Well, yeah can be you can make quite. Long or you can just go with you can do a couple months. Short turnaround combat in the same thing in Sicily. And it was an amazing experience different. That would be hike the narrows inside in. It's like in those old movies if you didn't want the bed guys following you. You cannot have tracks because you walk up the river exactly narrow is are the cliffs because it sounds just like a deer could jump from one to the other. You know, in some places those cliffs, do narrow in quite a couple meters across. Yes. And then you talk and this is great for looking at pre Columbian civilizations. You tour, the ancient cliff dwellings and Mesa Verde, those are amazing, totally amazing. Don't appreciate what was going on before Columbus discovered America, not just a few generation way before the fact that they survived and built their livelihood 's in these cliff palaces in the sides of cliffs, and they go down and climb in there and build. So a lot of people under appreciate. Pre-columbian. Civil-. Physicians and some of these parks are nothing but nature, but others are celebration of, of history. What are some other examples in the parks, where you can really celebrate the civilizations that were here before the arrival of Europeans? You know, a lot of the parks are trying to do more with bringing that to light. But I mentioned glacier, bay aren't there, prehistoric petroglyphs in southwest. Yeah. In several of the park's, they're like canyon lands. And arches they've got petroglyphs in highlight for anybody is watching fireflies eight great smokies national park there. That's just a certain period of time you got to be there, usually in June, and you got to get permit and they're called synchronous firefly's because they all light up at the same time. Oh, sounds so much fun. This is traveled Rick steves, or talking with Becky Lomax, about USA national parks. And that's the name of her book. You talk about something called Pirka texture, the great lodges in these parks, and one of my favorite national park experiences was in the paradise lodge at. Rear? Yes. And this is understand a work project during the great depression. Are there big fireplaces and this old school, Woody charm, great base to hike from are there, other park, lodges that become part of the joy of the experience? Yeah. Yellowstone's old faithful in glacier parks. Many glacier, hotel built by the railroad instead of a c c project. Yosemite has some nice places. Yes. The Alani there, you might be wise. And I'm sure in your book, you cover accommodations wise to make reservations in advance if you wanna stay in something other than forgettable motel you need to make reservations a year to thirteen months in advance for most. Is that right? Yes. Wow. Plant aheads talk also about eating because I find food tastes better. When you're in a park. But when you're spam and crackers on top of a mountain is gourmet like absolutely your favorite eating experience. What do you look forward to when you're hiking, and enjoying nature? You know, my favorite when I'm out hiking, and so forth. It's jerky and it's nuts rather than sitting down and eating some bail sandwich. I just liked being able to pop stuff in my mouth all day long. So you pack with that in mind, I do. And then chocolate. The I I'm sort of an picnic aficionado and I like to augment the experience by creating a great set. So I'm getting a bluff or a peak, and then I crack open whatever I've got. That's where you just marvel it. I didn't know crackers spam good. Taste an amazing. And that's the beautiful thing about nature, you get immersed in nature. New relies different things are, are more important than you realize, and different things are less important than you realize. This is travel with Rick steves. We've been talking with Becky Lomax. Her book is USA national parks, becky's. So clearly parks connect us with nature. And let's say you could use a friend who never been out of the city, somebody who never marveled at that mossy carpeting of trees, we talked about in the whole river valley and the Olympic national park, what national park experience. Would you share with this person's never been out of the city? I would want them to see vialed life to take them to something like Yellowstone or theater Roosevelt national park or. Everglades? It's amazing to watch wild animals out doing their Wild Thing, as and where we are the visitor. Exactly that kilo mex-, thanks so much for inspiring us to enjoy America's best idea the national parks. Thank you. You can hear our earlier national parks interview with Becky Lomax in our radio archives at Rick, steves dot com slash radio. She opens up program number five sixty from April twenty nineteen her website is Becky Lomax dot com. There's that wasn't miles of wilderness in a whole lot more, you can explore along the border between Canada and the United States Puerto pox reveals what he found next on travel with Rick. Steves. What lies over the US border in Canada, has never seemed, very foreign to me. Hi Emmerick Rick, I grew up loving view of the peace arch. When we drive up from Seattle, visit relatives in ban. Coober it celebrates the longest and friendliest border in the world porter FOX grew up at the other end of the border in Maine. He's recently explored the entire length of it to see what it tells us about our two nations porter describes what he calls America's forgotten border in his book Northland porter. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for having me. It is kind of forgotten border. I mean, forgotten in the sense that we sort of take it for granted. And nowadays, it's getting a little more attention as many people in our nation. Here are interested in tightening up border security, just how long is this border and is it actually the longest in the world? It sure is a few include the border up, Alaska's while it's close to fifty five hundred miles just the longest international. Border in the world. You know, even the lower forty-eight border contains the longest straight border in the world along the forty ninth parallel takes off from lake of the woods, and Minnesota ends up in Bellingham, Washington it's more than twice as long as our southern border and yet our southern border seems to get all the headlines and not only that it gets all of the funding from congress, and has many times more border agents close to nineteen thousand at this point compared to the northern borders just over two thousand two guard a line, that's, you know, well more than twice as long I would think part of that is just the economic reality Canadians have about the fame per capita income as we do here in the United States. Whereas there's a tenfold difference in average wealth, per person in the United States compared to south of the border, it's true. And there's a there's a lot more illegal immigrants trying to cross the border in the south, however much. Most of the entries come through ports of entry checkpoints hidden in vehicles, and with false documents and whatnot. What a lot of miles to protect either way on the north and the south when you're looking at the border in the north, you've traveled the whole thing. Can you actually see it? I know in the east, it's mostly water. Is it a physical border? What do you see when you see the border? I mean I call it the forgotten border because you, it's very hard to find the border in the north. I traveled most of it. And in the east a lot of it by canoe. It's in very remote parts of Maine state, New York for Mont New Hampshire than shoots across the Great Lakes for the five Great Lakes. And you know, in Maine any way, you know, spent weeks on those rivers, and they're literally are no monuments. There's no line. There's no signs that say, hey, don't cross here. The really the only indication is that when you go through a town, there's Canadian flags flying on. One side and American flags flying on the other. But for most of it, it just looks like a backcountry. River country woods you wrote about in Montana. There's the cut, which is a visible line of deforestation. Does that track the border? I it sure does. And it's it goes across the border. There's parts where it crosses the forty fifth through Vermont New Hampshire, New York, therefore, any forested section of the border has a twenty foot wide cut on it with foot wide cut twenty foot wide. Yeah, we're back in the eighteen hundreds these, these poor timber guy sent to go through with axes and chop down trees for close to fifteen hundred miles of forested border with that just like neighbors stakeout where their fence goes, so there's no question was there physically a canary from Washington DC to say, we need a twenty foot cut. So we know where the border is. That's exactly what it was the international border commission was developed, and they said, well to market through the forest this. What we're gonna do way back when they didn't even know where the border went serving techniques were very different. That was marked several times incorrectly several times. And even now the border strays up to nine hundred feet north or south of where. Vine original pay now. It is interesting. You mentioned a lot of the border in the east is waterways. The technical border will jig Jag depending on where how deep the water is because I guess the understanding is the deepest point in the lake or the river will be the border. Yeah, the deep watermark is officially the border and that's shifting constantly and lakes and rivers. And so that's partly why they don't market, but not marking it. And having it move makes it really difficult for fishermen freighters on the Great Lakes. And, and just people going out to recreationally, canoeing camping, you, you really don't know where you are half the time you're out there. There's lots of times somebody don't they don't know if they're in Canada or the United States. Now, you mentioned the longest straight line in the world along the forty-ninth parallel. That is quite remarkable to think of that lung of stretch words, just somebody said, that's the deal. Okay. You're Canada where America talk about the anomalies around there. I know north of Seattle, you've got point Roberts with just a, a little tip of land. Connected with Canada. But it happens to protrude south of the forty-ninth parallel, right? Yeah. Absolutely. And, you know, the street borders, very problematic. They're not many around the world. That's partly, why this one is so unique. It's not really a great idea to just kind of snap a chalk line across the map and say, all right. Here's where this goes. It's split native American tribes and half it. Splits towns and half mountain ranges in half. It's very problematic, where it splits, a watershed and half and rivers start in Canada flow into the US and go back into Canada with farms, all around, they're drawing from that stream and water rights extremely complicated and still fought over today. So, you know it was done in a very stressful time. And James Polk was president and they were trying to figure out Oregon territory and how to split it up after jointly living there for round hundred years. They finally said, listen, we have to finish this border here Polk was going for fifty four four. Eighty or fight, you might regard the slogan, fifty four. We'll gosh that's up near Alaska. Those that's the border that the US is fighting for an and British Canada was happy to say, okay, subtle on the forty-ninth and simultaneously, the Mexican border, you know, the war down, there was kind of raging, and it was just too much as this thing done. And there's towns that are split by the border, you mentioned towns in Maine that are in Maine and part in Quebec. There's towns that are split by the border. There's backyards that are split. There's a pulp factor in not a cake main that split in half. There's there talked about the tavern where you during prohibition, you could go in from America and you could sit in the back of the room and drink in Canada. There were taverns built on the border during prohibition for that purpose. They were taverns built on the river on a barge and they would float the barge over to the American shore, pick up people they'd floated back over to the Canadian shore they'd party on night. And then they go back and drop them off. Hours of the morning, we're traveling along the four thousand mile border between the lower forty-eight and Canada right now. And traveled Rick steves, our guest travel, writer, porter FOX on several trips. Over three years. Porter made his way from Maine, all the way to Washington state following the border. His book is called Northland a four thousand mile journey along America's forgotten border, and it tells visit ventures and the people he met along the way it's interesting that you talk about the border was ignoring tribal land. It was signaling water basins, and so on, and that can cause untold problems. It's remarkable. We've managed as long as we have without real conflict because of that, and my feeling when I travel is when you reach a border, it feels like a kind of no man's land between two tribes. And we don't really have that with our border Dewey. Yeah. I mean it's interesting when you get real close to that northern border. I did find a no-man's-land I found a place where American developers and. Businesses and whatnot kind of didn't see as much opportunity there because they had to stop at the border at a certain point and candidates, a little bit different ninety percent of the Canadian population lives within a hundred miles of their southern border. Ten percent of the American population lives with one hundred miles of the northern border and most of that is in Detroit in Bellingham, and other border cities. So it's very on the American side. Anyway, it kind of is a no man's land. And what I found who's interesting is covering lot of travel, I've kind of gone against the grain and tried to find places that people did not go and see what that's like I find a really unique experience. And this whole journey was like that. It was forgotten towns and forgotten, you know, million acre wildernesses that really saw very few people, and in Maine. And Minnesota's boundary waters glacier, national park. It was just these huge swath. House of wilderness and kind of old world living that America really had forgotten and had been left very pristine. Well, let's take this journey porter because it sounds fascinating and give us an overview started in Maine and went to Washington state. How'd you do the journey, I didn't separate trips and I started in west quality had in Maine, the easternmost point of the continental US, I took a canoe and went up the Saint Croix river which really marks kind of the first couple hundred miles of the US Canada border spent the night on these back country. Campsites sometimes in Canada. Sometimes in Maine, sometimes I didn't know where there's also no cell service on the border, so your maps don't work quite as so if you are traveling along the border, it sort of is no no-man's-land between two different countries. Self-services it truly is you, you lose service with your American provider and sometimes the Canadian provider picks up. Sometimes it doesn't, but I had no. Maps, I had no GPS that I through Maine and I grew up in Maine. And man, I never saw back country like this. I mean it was truly pitch. Black Dard no light pollution at night. No sound no people. Well, now you're in a six canoe and it's Tober right? And you. Very nice time to get started on a long journey. Not only did it get cold. There's a cold snap. When I took off, and it was early mid October and they got their first frost of the year, and it was a canoe lakes. Yeah. I'm in a canoe and starting to ice up. And while it was it just made everything a little bit more more intense. But after that, canoe trip I came back home and wrote up that section of the journey in the next next trip. I did. I took I was a passenger on a seven hundred forty foot freighter that left from Montreal and follow the border across for the Great Lakes and left me off and Thunder Bay up in on tarot couple of hundred miles north of Duluth, Minnesota freighter those a bulk or yes, it was carrying iron ore out. They have for travelers that they rented. Well, what they have is they have rooms for the crew. They had an owner's suite that I luckily was assigned to and. And they take passengers. The lakes are interesting ocean freighters actually will rent rooms, and you can purchase pointy four day passage, Indonesia. If you want because of security on the lake since nine eleven it's been very tight. They don't really do that. But they do have rooms for family for friends for owners investors. I told them about my project said, hey, that sounds interesting. We'd love to offer you passage and this was through the wait call the Sweetwater sees the body of lakes and canals water from river from New York, Pennsylvania, Ohio, into the Great Lakes. Exactly. And, and I was following the kind of adventures of Samuel de Champlain, who started near west quality head that's really where the first French outpost in the new world was. And then he went up the Saint Lawrence and found his way into the Great Lakes. Our guest on travel with Rick steves is porter fuck. He writes about his discoveries London friendliest border in the world in his book Northland. Four thousand mile journey along America's forgotten border. It's now out in paperback Puertas also, the editor of the online literary travel magazine called nowhere. His website is order, FOX dot com. What's it like to actually sale as sort of a trip through the Great Lakes? It is very slow. It's very long really feels like you're on an ocean. When you look out the bridge window, you can't see land anywhere. It's just all water all around you. I grew up sailing off the coast of Maine, I was used to that. But certainly not used to that in the middle of North America. It was truly stunning and it was really easy to see how Champlain would have thought that he had discovered the northwest passage to China that he was looking for it. Certainly looked like the shore of an ocean when you enter Lake Ontario, and the same for every other leg. But of course you know, at the edge of every lake he'd nailed down and tastes the water and realize. There was no salt in it. And it was watering TD Sweetwater sees so I can just see him going. Is it salty it? Oh, oh he's best. I'm sure. Okay. Well, you survived that. And then came the boundary waters between Minnesota's Northland's and on Tero and pretty close to Thunder Bay, the kind of beginning of the boundary waters starts of the pigeon river and goes up into northern Minnesota and a chain of lakes and rivers that goes right along the border all the way to lake of the woods and the beginning of the northern plains. I did the boundary waters canoe area, which is a million acre wilderness area, that was a keystone of the wilderness, act and the US and is one of the most pristine and, and most protected wildernesses in the US you can't take any kind of mechanized craft in there. You can't even take a paddle boat into these legs in rivers, you can't fly an airplane below three thousand feet over this region. It is extremely pristine lake country and deep deep for. Forest. And you wrote very interestingly euro, if you're not on the water, you're in the woods. Yeah, that's there's not much in between. And so we would paddle from one lake to the next, and then we would Portage put the canoe on our shoulders and mortgage into the next one, we had a terrific guide, who had been an Arctic explorer, and, and really knew the history of, of the area very well. And we just paddled along the border for as it was. It was really stunning. And that was kind of the end of the, the water section of the border, and of the first third of it, and from there, I hit the road to follow the across the northern plains. And as I was crossing them. I heard on the radio, but the standing rock protests and had read about the soon nation as this terrific Northland tribe for hundreds of years. And, and so the next section was really focused on that history. And, and this was the demonstrations against the Dakota Access pipeline. Right. He absolutely. Yeah. Near cannonball, North Dakota and some huge Indian reservations along the that border areas and they're yeah, many a dozen or split by the border from east to west when I was in Maine. I was on the past mcquarry reservation that split in half. I spoke to the Suez to the black feta spoke to the lumpy and. What are your memories from just travelling in the reservations? That's a lot of miles on the border. It's very destitute, and it's not very populated destitute, meaning very sad, economy's very poor, not spiritually, spiritually, incredibly rich, and powerful and very independent, and really hopeful the people that I spoke with and didn't like to be characterized as destitute at all said, well, this is, you know, this is kind of the reality of where we are. But they've really been delta. Bad hand by Washington D C for the last couple hundred years, literally having treaties and deals promised to them just pulled out from under their feet time. And again, in the same thing happened at standing rock, as far as the constitution goes, it was a legal. What happened in the oil companies, prevailed what I saw what my takeaway was was this incredible sense of hope and the way that they're spared just could not be defeated. They're not going to be knock. It's down by this terrible decision that the judge handed down they just kept going, and, and honestly splintered off to every corner of North America and are fighting this fight against the big oil companies other pipelines in the tar sands oil fields and coal ports out in the coast of Washington. And so that movement is really just begun which, you know, in the face of that defeated standing rock was actually a very inspiring moment, and again, diving into the history of it in and seeing this massive territory that the zoo nation, controlled really quite efficiently, and, well, it makes up today, one fifth of the continental United States and, and that was the territory that they you know at the time traded away for peace. That is very advanced tribe as were as were many tribes in North America, you know, major cities in the midwest and native American civilizations. But of course that doesn't make it. Into the history books. Fucks takes us into the prairies and mountains of the country, as he shadows, the forty nineth parallel, along US, two from Montana, to Washington state. That's just ahead on travel with Rick speed. Then we head south for some of the great day-trips, you can take within easy reach of San Francisco porter. Fox's our guest right now and travel with Steve porter. Details his adventures along the US Canadian border in his latest book Northland. He's also the editor of the online literary travel magazine called nowhere. His website is quarter, FOX dot com. So part of tickets down the final section of your journey the medicine line following US route two from Montana, all the way to Washington. Yeah. So the medicine line is, is the forty ninth parallel just shoot straight outs of the Pacific, and I drove that section and kind of wandered back and forth from the border down into the Great Plains. And then and to. Eventually through Idaho and eastern Washington and up into the cascades. And you know really that was one of my favorite parts of the trip. It was on the opposite side of the country from where I grew up, and to be able to recount, how these border surveyors, you know, spent years traipsing across the plains through the cascades, climbing mountains that had never been climbed by white man before, and marking them and reading about, again, the date of American history, there in the history of Oregon territory. And how you know, the British and Americans were living there in at the same time by agreement then, suddenly, that ends and even before them, how Russian America stretched down the coast from last good onto San Francisco too much of this territory. I mean it was just against so much history that really builds from the eastern side of the border straight across to the west every hundred miles you cross your cover. Dering twenty years in time, it did grow that way from east to west and so- traveling at that way. I got to sort of bring the story up to present time in those in that last thousand miles of the trip kind of takes you through history of the westward movement of the United States. It does. Yeah. It'd be good to do this trip from Maine to Washington rather than the other way because it's in chronological order. Exactly. And that's that's why I did the trip in that direction. And I was writing about the sixteen hundreds in the seventeen hundreds and, and Maine. And by the time I was out in Washington, I was writing about the twentieth century. And, and you finish at another Indian reservation, constant reminder that they were people here before that border was drawn and they're living on reservations, and let a cases now the lemme reservation what was the end to point of your for thousand mile journey like you know, it was very serendipitous when I was at standing rock the one night, there was a big presentation there. It was the lemme. Tribe, and that was the one night. They were there. They happen to be driving. Totem pole that they had carved on lung island. And they were driving it to a protest out east someone. And so I just happened to be there and I listen to them, and I was just in thrall d- with everything that they had to say and when I got out to Washington, and I kinda finish the trip I was heading down towards Seattle and I saw the sign for Lumley islands. And the lemme reservation guy got gotta go. And I went, and I just by chance picked up a hitchhiker that studied painting an art with one of the totem pole. It was just all very naturally. Good way to trip. And we got a cap up this interview, just very quickly. Where did you have a wildlife? Encounter. Where did you meet some interesting animal home? My gosh saw some bears running across the road. Northward main, I had probably on the canoe trip on the Saint Croix in Maine, where one point the middle of the night had autre run between my feet into the river, and they were beavers that were coming up a little Eddy, right next to the campsite, just watching me. They weren't afraid of me at all. It's like they'd never seen a person before. And then what kind of patriotism, did you find on either side? Did you notice flags on one side more than the other with the facilities tidier on one side than the other? How could you draw any conclusions about candidate in America in that regard? I son equal number of flags on both sides of the border in the closer to the border line. I got the, the more flags there were. Canadians are very proud of their side of the border and Americans are as well. They also get along very well and their businesses and families and church. Congregations are interlaced all the way across the northern border, and they always have been right from day, one, the northern border was never meant to be a hard border. It was never meant to have a wall or have, you know, military style checkpoints. There's been cooperation between these two countries since before these two countries even existed but can that free flow survive in a postman eleven world or has taken a hit, and does that hurt the communities? It's taken a big hit, and it has been inhibited, greatly to the tune of around thirty billion dollars a year for American and Canadian businesses and certainly for people and families and hospitals sitting on one side and their doctors live on the other side of the border. Our to our three hour delays at that border line that really are not catching many criminals early immigrants or smugglers, because they all go through the back country. It's really just slowing down and, and really hurting that kind of international relationship at tragedy. I mean as Europe involves fewer and fewer border formalities and people can connect and share and team up. And in the United States, we have to have this security after nine eleven and there's a reality, there's four thousand miles of potential community that now has you write about how in the old days there was over one hundred crossings that were unmanned at night. Absolutely. And, and I mean to this day Canada's our number two trading partner number one oil importer. I mean, it is an incredibly huge part of the US economy. And again, the people living on both sides of the border are incredibly connected, and the way that. Washington is shaping policy for this northern border. It is nothing more than pure ignorance, there unaware of what the local situation is there because they haven't studied it. They're mimicking what they do on the south and they're putting it into the north, and they're two completely different borders, that need completely different policies, maybe rather than catering to the fears of their constituents if they would take a couple of weeks and travel along that border, they'd have a better understanding. I think that's a great idea porter FOX. Thanks for sharing your experience in your book Northland four thousand mile journey along America's forgotten border happy travels. Thanks so much. You'll find links to Puerto FOX's Northland book and articles he's written about his adventures in the notes for this week show. It's at Rick, steves dot com slash radio. There's a series of guidebooks called one hundred things to do before you die covering, lots of different cities in the US, even smaller ones a few weeks ago. One of their local authors helped us explorer, San Francisco beyond the usual tourist haunts another thing, bay area locals like to do is to explore the beautiful scenery, and attractions, within easy reach of the city on a day-trip or weekend getaway Kimberly Levada returns to travel with Rick steves, look at some of the experiences, you can have within easy reach of San Francisco Kimberly, welcome back. Thank you for having me. I'm just going to list some day trips that we'd consider visiting from San Francisco and get your take on them when we're when we're looking to spice up our visit to that great city if you're in San Francisco, you always hear the word suss Alito. What about sausalito show is, is great because it's even less than a day trip you go there for coffee, you could go there for lunch. It's just about a fifteen minute sale across from the ferry building. I happen to live. Sauce, alito. Now I just moved from San Francisco. It's this lovely town with restaurants and galleries and cafes along the water and it's really wonderful, and you get a great view. So it's sort of trendy and it's got seafood restaurants. And it's got nice houseboats what four hundred houseboats and near saw sweeter. We've got the Muir woods, national monument. Tell us about that. They mere woods national monument is some of the oldest coastal redwoods he'll find and it's also a very easy trip, whether you're driving, or you could take the ferry to SaaS Alito, and then there is a bus that goes there if you are driving, you, you need to make a parking reservation. So they do limit the number of people that are in the park via this parking reservation, but completely worth it get there early before the tour buses arrive in it's it's impressive. These tall redwoods, and there are a few hiking trails through there, or you can just sit on a bench and take it all in understand this has been actually protected for more than one hundred years now in these triumphs redwoods and miles of trails through the forest through Kenyon. Yes. Quite beautiful nice. Now. That's to the north of San Francisco to the south on the coast. We have Half Moon bay. Yes. Half Moon bay my co author Jill Robinson actually lives in Half Moon bay. And she loves it down there. It's quaint little town, and there are kayak, companies and seafood. Restaurants, also, well known for its Mavericks, surf competition with a giant Ganic wave that role in during the winter, I believe, and yeah, and it's not very far from San Francisco, and it's also very easy day trip, or go down for lunch with you want to watch the surfers is that something that's all year long or just in certain seasons. I do believe people surf there all year long, but this particular competition Mavericks is a certain time of year and just for safety Albany say back a little bit. Never forget, I had a beautiful vacation, down there in a wonderful BNB. There's some great BNB's in Heff. Now for thinking about more seashore we've got point Reyes national seashore. That's north of San Francisco as well. People love to go out there for recreation. I mean, there are miles and miles of, it's a protected seashore, and miles and miles of trails to hike, and it's a great day, especially if you're active it's beautiful photographs and wanna sunny day. I think it's one of the places that can't be beat in the bay area. Konica lighthouse yeah. And the couple of small towns, you can stop in point Reyes station has a few little great places to stop for coffee or pack up your picnic. We always hear about this. Always hear about the Andrea's fault. You can actually see that point. Rhys. Oh can you. Gosh. That's, that's I don't. They didn't know that. Yeah. So there's less. Sort of a nature wonderland. They're definitely talk about Carmel by the sea. Well Carmel by this is going to be a little bit of a longer trip from San Francisco. But that's okay. And it's also a gorgeous drive. Of course, it's connected to Monterey BIA the famous seventeen mile drive and Pebble Beach. Everyone's heard of and Carmel by the sea is yes, charming little town. Fill of galleries and restaurants. Lots of hotels. Yeah. It's a great way to spend a day. And it's probably about two two and a half hour drive from San Francisco, these beach towns, the a lot of them have a colonial sorta heritage got the Carmo mission there, but then it's sort of a haunt of artists and surfers these days in karma, by the sales overs. Yes. Well, there's a lot of nature trails down there. And it does feel quite wild along the coast, especially as you start to head south towards Big Sur and whatnot. It does start to get pretty wild. We're exploring some of the fund day trips you can enjoy within easy reach of San Francisco with Kimberly. Levada. She's co author of one hundred things to do in San Francisco before you die Kimberly. Also received a gold medal from the society of American travel. Writers for her culinary travel book about the door dome region in France. It's called walnut wine and truffle growth for website is Kimberly, Lavoro dot com. Somebody's never been to San Francisco before they're tempted to go up to Napa Valley. It must be the number one destination. Tell us about nap Italian. Is it worth the trouble to go up there? And what are your tips to enjoy it? Absolutely. Recommend Napa Valley because it's not that far from the Golden Gate Bridge. It's about a forty five minute drive to the town of Napa, and something that I've seen having lived on an often San Francisco now since nineteen ninety the town of Napa itself used to be kind of drive through town, you sort of gas up and go, and then go, visit wineries. But Napa, the town is actually quite hopping now with restaurants in great hotels. They have the Napa Valley wine train, which if you don't feel like driving. They have various tours now that you can get on and off at different wineries. That's nice. So you can drink to your heart's content and frame. Yes. And then you have to eventually leave the train station next. But the but the train goes from winery to winery. Yeah, there are various tours. There's dinner tours. There's quick stop. It's three. It depends on what wineries you wanna stop at the higher higher priced wineries. For lack of a better description will cost more but it's a lovely experience. It's very orient-express, California style. And a lot of them serve a meal on there as well. So. Yeah. The valley line trains, doing a great job of mixing, it up allowing different. Whatever type of tour, you want you can experience and yeah, you don't have to drive and you know, where to go. Someone else's made those decisions for you know, I've done wine tasting and a lot of different areas, but have never done in Napa Valley. Just can you walk us through what, what's the process do you make a reservation? Does it cost money would kind of alternatives are there and what's it like to tour? Winery in Napa Valley. Those are all good questions, and it depends is the answer. So Napa Valley, a lot of the wineries are reservation only, but only because they wanna limit, you know, the amount of people, they want to be able to service you correctly, and they don't want to be overrun with people and not be able to help people. So most a lot of wineries will take reservations, some you can walk in, and there is often a tasting fee because they don't want people just come in and drink a bunch of wine and leave, but often that tasting fees is waived if you buy a bottle of wine, so it works out in everyone's favor. There are some great wineries. That you can go and spend a lovely day. I mean, alpha omega is one that comes to mind they have this gorgeous patio with fountains that you can just sit out there all day, if you want, which makes it very dangerous. Rick steves. We're talking with Kimberly lavar tone. She along with Joe Robinson code one hundred things to do in San Francisco before you die. And a lot of those things might be getting outta town in day-tripping Kimberly, when you go to the city by the bay, you might wanna spend some time on the bay, what are some options to get up there and enjoy San Francisco Bay. Oh, yes, you cannot come to San Francisco, not get out, so first of all, are, are fairies are great a lot of people do it anyway, because they wanna go to Alcatraz or SaaS Alito angel island. And so you're, you're already on the ferry, and it has great views of the skyline the Golden Gate Bridge over the red and white fleet and the blue and gold, fleet have highlight cruises like sunset, cruises, and cocktail cruises. There's the rocket boat ride. That's for the adrenaline thrill seekers who wanna go fast and speedboat there, even kayaks. I mean you. Can kayak on the bay. If you're, if you're strong and brave enough down by south beach, and AT and T park, there's a city kayak company. No you live in sausalito. And you mentioned. That's just a fifteen minute ferry ride away from very easy. And then when he gets us lead or there. Can you rent boats or on the bay from sausalito is that something you do from San Francisco? No, you could rent their kayak companies in SaaS Alito either as walks. Most people come and walk along the water. It's got a great view back to San Francisco, but share, you can get on kayaks. They're a lot of people rent bikes and bike over the bridge to, to SaaS Alito, if you can believe it. It's a long one, but it's fun. And it's you know, you see it all you rent the bike down in about fisherman's, wharf, and the need ride all the way over the bridge and down the hill into sausalito, and it's a great way to see a lot. Can you? Comeback by the very they used to do that way. But now they've made it easier these companies have parking and sausalito now and you leave your bike there and, and yeah, you can cab back. Uber back or take the ferry back. Very nice, now, a lot of people fly into Oakland and go straight into San Francisco. What would you do? Oakland. Is that worth aside trip from San Francisco? Oh, absolutely. And actually, I have an author of one hundred things to do in Oakland before you die, and she's covered it all she lives over there, but yeah, oaklands got a great booming restaurant. Z now I hear, they have a great Chinatown Bart is an easy ride over to Oakland from San Francisco. A lot of people go over and head to the Berkeley campus as well. Accessible by Bart? So it's a conomic Pollock sensible if you're like local writing on the Birch. That's cool. Yeah. And finally, what about the Senta cruise beach walk. So I think the Santa Cruz beach boardwalk is just something, it's so quintessentially California to me with the wooden boardwalk, and the old wooden roller coaster and arcade games. And they do summertime cinema on the sand and it's just a great, great retro. Feel to the place. A lot of surfing goes on down there, there's a surf museum down there, some great little hotels, retro motels that have been renovated, and it's a it's a great way to, to get a slice of old old, California. Sounds like a little bit like a B area, Venice Angeles. Yeah, that's a great way to describe it. Yeah. I like that. And you have your Santa Monica pier down there, same type of feel except, I think Santa Cruz is much older in a parade of people and unloving slices of life to yes, definitely. Yeah. It's quite nice down there. And the, the weather is often. A little bit nicer Francisco in the summer cruise beach. Boardwalk rape, Kimberly Nevado author, one hundred things to do in San Francisco before your, thanks a lot. Legal. He's. Travel with Rick steves police Rick steves Europe and Edmonds. Washington by Tim captain is a Kaplan Wilner and caz, maral, our website is managed by Andrew wait. And our theme music is by Jerry Frank, we get promotional support from Sheila Gurzo. We had studio health this week from the radio foundation in New York, and from sports, bioline USA in San Francisco, we had editing health this week from Sarah McCormick. There's more online at Rick steves dot com slash radio. Rick steves has spent a third of his adult life in Europe, researching and writing guidebooks Europe through the back door teaches the skills of small travel travel as a political act as meaning to the journey, and Rick steves bestselling country city and pocket guide books cover every corner of Europe. To learn more, visit the travel store at Rick steves dot com.